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#rockbox log for 2002-11-01

00:28:48 Join BoD[] [0] (~BoD@m220.net81-65-35.noos.fr)
00:28:50BoD[]mblelop
00:29:24BoD[]how are you
00:38:55BoD[](or not)
00:42:12 Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@B45b6.pppool.de)
00:46:44 Quit edx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:54:41 Quit NiarkY ("leaving by all :)")
00:57:37 Quit langhaarrocker ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com)")
00:59:26 Quit vekar (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:00
01:08:15 Join T-Rex [0] (~digitalq@ip68-96-202-68.hr.hr.cox.net)
01:08:44>>>"seen" used by T-Rex (~digitalq@ip68-96-202-68.hr.hr.cox.net) [snoop prevented]
01:38:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:00
02:05:21BoD[]well
02:05:26BoD[]i go to bed .; see you bye
02:05:31 Quit BoD[] ("{[[[{[{{TCL enabled quit message}}]}]]]}")
02:21:21 Quit seb-away (Remote closed the connection)
02:21:22 Join seb-away [0] (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net)
02:21:46 Join s [0] (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net)
02:22:01 Quit s (Remote closed the connection)
02:39:05 Nick seb-away is now known as _seb_ (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net)
02:42:52 Join mecraw_ [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com)
03:00
03:11:30henrysunset'ello
03:38:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:44:25 Join TotMacher [0] (tot@p508DB393.dip.t-dialin.net)
04:00
04:05:25 Join tot [0] (tot@p508DAE21.dip.t-dialin.net)
04:05:25 Quit tot (Remote closed the connection)
04:05:25 Join tot [0] (tot@p508DAE21.dip.t-dialin.net)
04:22:07 Quit TotMacher (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:55:13 Quit startrekfan ("—I-n-v-i-s-i-o-n— 2.0 Build 2104")
05:00
05:12:05 Join lampshady [0] (~hhh@phnxdslgw17poolD207.phnx.uswest.net)
05:14:22 Quit lampshady (Client Quit)
05:19:00 Part T-Rex
05:38:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:00
06:04:06 Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-sleep (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net)
07:00
07:38:32***No seen item changed, no save performed.
08:00
08:19:51 Nick dw|gone is now known as dwihno (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE)
08:54:15 Join Bagder [241] (~daniel@as3-3-2.ras.s.bonet.se)
08:55:44memBagder: hi
08:56:08dwihnoYay! He has returned! Bagder is back!
08:56:18memYesterday I didn't have the time to look into the language problem but I hope that I can spend some time today
08:59:19BagderI don't think I dare to tell you what I did ;-)
09:00
09:01:09memTell me or dwihno or whom?
09:01:19dwihnoWell, it was Zagor who removed the snake game
09:01:31dwihnoThat was (imho) the biggest mistake in the RockBox history
09:01:49memWhy is the snake removed?
09:01:57dwihnodunno
09:02:04dwihnoPower abuse? :)
09:02:07Bagderbecause there was another snake game
09:02:54memAnd what is it that you don't dare to tell us?
09:03:17BagderI so goofed up trying to upgrade my libc
09:03:20dwihnoBagder: you can't really compare two snake games! :/ they are two unique individuals! :~~(
09:07:57dwihnoBagder: SO PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE put back snake0r! :)
09:07:59dwihnoI beg you!
09:08:01dwihnoPlease!
09:08:18Bagderwith loadable modules, there will be no limit
09:08:43*dwihno has no CVS acces
09:09:06dwihnoBagder: how big is your skattesats?
09:09:22Bagderone bazillion percent
09:10:14*dwihno spanks Bagder with a barbed icicle
09:12:28Bagderhey, we're swedes, we're taxed to death
09:16:00memdwihno: Are you in the entertainment business?
09:16:38dwihnoBagder: I agree, 33.52% is my skattesats :¨~(
09:16:53dwihnomem: well, I'm entertained at work, if that's what you mean :)
09:16:54BagderI wish I only paid 33.52 ;-]
09:17:05Schnueffmoin
09:17:16dwihnoBagder: you are one of those damned höginkomsttagare! :)
09:17:49Bagderyes, I shall be punished
09:18:01memdwihno: Your /whois says dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE and isn't Baldakinen the company that owns the large clubs in Stockholm, etc?
09:20:59 Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se)
09:21:06Bagdermorning Z
09:21:08 Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se)
09:21:09Zagorhi
09:22:40dwihnomem: did I authorize a /whois? ;D
09:22:54dwihnoThe not-so-white sheep is back
09:23:07dwihnoZagor "remover-of-snake" Zagorino
09:24:39Zagorsnake must die
09:27:30dwihno:(
09:27:36dwihnoJar-Jar Binks must die! :)
09:28:02Zagori predict snake will make a triumphant return as a .rock
09:29:55dwihno:D
09:30:04dwihnoAnd my GAME(tm) will be released :)
09:30:20Zagornah, that'll probably never happen ;)
09:30:27dwihno:-)
09:30:32dwihnoFoo on you, you damn bar! :)
09:33:46BagderZagor: Linus the man is up for an rblunch, and so I am
09:36:08dwihnorblunch?
09:36:17Bagderrockboxlunch
09:36:22dwihnoräkbox :)
09:36:38dwihnoand what's so special about those lunches? :)
09:36:50Bagderwe hit the "Curry Corner" and have an indian food time
09:38:33***No seen item changed, no save performed.
09:39:10dwihnocurry corner?
09:39:12dwihnosounds fishy
09:39:15dwihnoin a curry sense :)
09:42:34Zagorrblunch is cool, but no chicken for me
09:43:00Bagderno chicken!?
09:43:11Zagori'm making chicken tonight
09:43:15Bagderaha
09:43:31Bagderwell, you may be excused this time ;-)
09:43:36*Zagor welcomes everybody to the #kitchen channel
09:43:39Bagderbut don't make it a habbit!
09:43:48Zagorhobbit?
09:44:49dwihnoZagor has fallen for the chicken commericals
09:44:58dwihnoI bet you ate peasoup last night too, didn't you, Zagor? :)
09:47:59BagderZagor: linus said he might be a little late, but he'll call us when he's closing in
09:48:11Zagorok
09:48:53memBagder: Curry Corner is that in Vreten/Sumpan?
09:48:58Bagderyeps
09:49:26membin there, done that
09:49:28dwihnoan rblunch and you didn't even consider inviting me :(
09:50:10Bagderwe need to have these secret meetings to come up with all those evil conspiracies that we do
09:50:17memI would say that CC is one of the better Indian restaurants I've tried
09:53:16henrysunset'ello
09:54:49Zagorhola
09:56:43dwihnoBuongiorno! :D
09:58:28 Join Mine78 [0] (Pozzolo@62.211.161.242)
09:58:49Mine78goodmorning everybody !
09:58:58Mine78can I report a thing about rockbox 1.4 ?
09:59:58Mine78anyone there ?
10:00
10:00:07Bagderyes, plenty
10:00:17Mine78I have a problem
10:00:28Bagderso tell us, don't tell us that you itend to tell us
10:00:32Mine78I select "turn off backlight when charging" but th light still stays on
10:00:36Mine78:)
10:00:54Mine78Archos recorder hardware .128
10:01:15Mine781.28
10:01:31Mine78is it an already known bug ?
10:02:08Zagorisn' the option "turn ON backlight when charging"?
10:02:14Mine78yes it is
10:02:21Mine78I selcet NO
10:02:22Zagorso is it on or off
10:02:25Zagorok
10:02:32Mine78but light still stays ojn
10:02:54Zagorso you boot into rockbox and then plug in the charger?
10:03:00Bagderworks for me
10:03:01Schnueffwhat about the backlight time option, which value?
10:03:13Mine78no I simply plug the ac adapter
10:03:21Mine78after shutting down the recorder
10:03:25Bagderthen rockbox doesn't run
10:03:37Mine78time = 4sec
10:03:43Zagoryour option has no effect then, since that is controlled by archos
10:03:45Bagderit's the archos firmware you see
10:04:05Schnueffah
10:04:08Mine78so the light turn off only if the archos is already on ?
10:04:25Mine78I kmean when I plug the ac adapter
10:04:25Bagderrockbox only controls things if it runs
10:04:30Zagorthe rockbox code must be running for the rockbox settings to have effect
10:04:49Mine78So what I must do to solve this ?
10:04:56Bagderstart rockbox
10:05:01Zagorboot rockbox first, then plug in the ac cable
10:05:07Mine78Ok perfect !
10:05:09Mine78Thanks
10:05:17Mine78The revision 1.4 is really cool !
10:06:49BagderZagor: you notice a really crappy connection to contactor?
10:06:55Mine78One last thing: when I plug the usb cable and the ac adapter the archos is recharging or not ?
10:07:13ZagorBagder: it's a bit lagged but not to terrible
10:07:34ZagorMine78: it is
10:07:52ZagorMine78: rather, it is charging if you see the battery animation
10:08:28Mine78er.... u are right :-P
10:09:16henrysunsetno responces in the mailinglist to my UI ideas... hrm.
10:10:21Bagderhenrysunset: I think we all fail to see the big advantage your system would introduce
10:11:02henrysunsetoh well
10:11:04henrysunseti see it
10:11:17henrysunsetbut if I can't convince anyone its of no use
10:11:53BagderI'm not saying its bad, I'm saying that I don't see the benefits
10:12:06Bagdercan you tell me in two sentences why your system is better than what we have now?
10:12:12henrysunsetin my job i am somewhere inbetween a ui person and a manager so i have more control of the process; here it's all about convincing dev-minded folks of intangible gains
10:12:18henrysunsetand i understand.
10:12:32henrysunseti'll try,,,
10:14:39henrysunsetthe system gives the user a clearer seperation of local (navigating this screen) vs global (navigating amogst screens); it adds a clear place for new features to fit in; and it makes it easier to complete basic tasks without looking at the screen at all.
10:15:02henrysunsetif that isn't enough then i rest my case i guess.
10:15:24Bagderwell
10:15:29henrysunsetthe biggest part i suppose is the ability to grow... i don't see how a playlist feature can fit onto the existing ui
10:15:36Bagderthis is open source, no one works on anything they don't want to
10:15:55henrysunsetyup; i understand that.
10:16:20henrysunsetand dev types liek to do things they can show off as "features"
10:16:32Zagorhenrysunset: playlist goes into the menu, just like recording and other things
10:16:36henrysunsetfeatures earn praise nto some intangible niceness
10:16:46Zagorhenrysunset: you're being unfair
10:17:01Bagderi disagree there henrysunset
10:17:02henrysunsetplaylist would be a 100% core thing for me; and it'd be hard to get to inside a menu
10:17:11henrysunsetyes
10:17:21henrysunsetsaying niceness is ignored isnt true
10:17:30Zagorchanging the UI is a major pain for our users. they already change once, from archos to our system. changing again must mean a real, tangible, improvement
10:17:37henrysunsetin all fairness it is still leaps and bounds better than archos software
10:18:06henrysunseti know that.
10:18:34PsycoXulZagor: sometimes i think you guys give too little credit to archos users
10:18:52PsycoXulZagor: of all the portable music players ever put on the market, i think the archos attracts the geekiest crowds
10:19:17henrysunsetwell; I tried. I know a evolved version of my ideas would be an improvement; but it may infact be too far into the game to make it worth it
10:19:38henrysunsetand how much better is definitely hard to say without having it in my hands to try
10:19:39Zagorok, i'll revise my statement: changing the UI is a major pain for me :-)
10:19:46Bagderpersonally, I see it as a bug report and a suggested fix, but I don't quite see the bug
10:19:47henrysunsetthat is totally fair.
10:20:16PsycoXulheh
10:20:29henrysunsetmaybe; when the scriptable UI is available i can prototype it and we'll see what peopel think then
10:20:47Zagoryeah, that would be interesting
10:20:52henrysunsetuntil then i'll just ride the wave of change and see where it goes
10:21:07BagderI guess that even some faked screen dumps with some example could help people see the beauty of it too
10:21:21henrysunset:-( too bad i can't code it myself
10:21:28henrysunseti will add some of them perhaps
10:21:38PsycoXulthe way i see it, the interface is likely to evolve through a combination of open discussion and plain old steadily expanding capabilities inherent in it's current development process
10:21:39henrysunsetbut i don't have a lot of time for it.
10:21:46PsycoXulinto whatever suits it's purposes best
10:22:24PsycoXuland so looking at the channel here now it looks like it's all going well
10:22:26henrysunsetpsyco: that's kinda why i fear that it will get kludgey; adding upon adding will eventually just lose the original simplicity... or atleast it could
10:22:46henrysunsetbut time will tell.
10:23:05henrysunsetthe OSS movement is certainly an interesting one
10:23:12PsycoXulhenrysunset: and if/when that happens, somebody'll probably take all their knowledge and experience getting to that point and apply it to at least a minor redesign
10:23:27Zagorhenrysunset: if things go painfully kludgey, we'll have an incitament to change. and so we will.
10:23:27henrysunsetyup.
10:23:54Bagderhm, bostream is all messed up
10:23:58henrysunsetunless development mided people just become blind to the kludginess
10:24:09ZagorBagder: booostream ;)
10:24:13Bagderyeah
10:24:21Bagder~26ms to my dns
10:24:26henrysunsetcuz you memorize the intricacies and the workarounds and dont see it anymore
10:24:27PsycoXulhenrysunset: thats what hordes of whiney users are good for
10:24:28Zagorhenrysunset: possible, but unlikely. we have very vocal users ;)
10:24:56henrysunsetone example in current UI that drives me mad... the f2/f3 menus stay stuck until you press f2/f3 again
10:25:11PsycoXuloh that reminds me
10:25:15henrysunsetlike f3 won't get you out of the f2 menu
10:25:27PsycoXuli need to upgrade my rockbox and see if there's still one annoying bit of UI behaviour in the latest
10:25:28henrysunsetand on won't take you to the explorer
10:25:32PsycoXuli haven't updated in a while
10:25:54dwihnoSome people call me space cowboy, some people call me the gangster of love. Some people call me "dwihn0r", whee wheew!
10:25:59dwihno:-)
10:27:14henrysunsethey; here's a question... if you come up to a rockbox and for whatever reason cannot look at the screen. (say it's in your backpack). Is there any sequence of keypresses that will always advance the player to the next track?
10:27:14PsycoXulbut with what i've got on there now, (it's a player btw) if i press, for example, menu+plus to turn up the volume, then let go of plus and press stop wishing to turn on the keylock, it doesn't work.. i have to let go of menu, then press and hold it over again to hit stop and turn the keylock on
10:27:42ZagorPsycoXul: that's a bug. file it.
10:28:36Zagorhenrysunset: good point
10:28:53henrysunsetis that a somewhat convincing point?
10:29:02PsycoXulZagor: ok, well i haven't updated since before some (i think) fairly major changes to the button handling code (actualy the reason i haven't updated in a while), so that bug may have gotten trampled in the wheels of progress already.. if not, i'll file it
10:29:11henrysunsetthere is clearly no keysequence to answer that problem
10:29:53 Join kargatron [0] (~Vincent@ppp-isdn-639.ath.forthnet.gr)
10:30:17henrysunsetif you were to read thru my doc you would see that tapping f1 then tapping right will always go to the next track no matter the state
10:30:30PsycoXulhenrysunset: press next, wait... if next track doesn't begin, turn off keylock, press next
10:30:44henrysunsetwhat to turn off keylock?
10:30:51PsycoXuli dunno about on recorders
10:30:55PsycoXulon players it's menu+stop
10:30:56henrysunsetwhat if it's in the explorer?
10:31:24henrysunsetif it's in the explorer; you will just traverse deeper into the hierarchy
10:31:47PsycoXulwell then following my directions, you'd probably find yourself almost exactly where you were before pressing anything...
10:31:51PsycoXulheh
10:32:02PsycoXuljust 2 files further down the list
10:32:07PsycoXulor something
10:32:11henrysunsetyeah
10:32:17henrysunsetbut if it was in the backpak
10:32:20henrysunsetor you were driving
10:32:27henrysunsetit would be an impossible problem
10:33:06PsycoXulsuch is the downfall of screen toggle buttons
10:33:10henrysunsetno (sane) sequence of keypresses will always get the next track to play
10:33:26Zagorhenrysunset: one major point is the player. your system doesn't work at all for players.
10:33:37Zagorthey don't have F-keys
10:33:38henrysunseti think it will.
10:33:55henrysunsetwhat keys do the players have?
10:34:00henrysunseton of up down left right?
10:34:07PsycoXulplayers have on, menu, -, play, +, stop
10:34:08henrysunseter off
10:34:12ZagorON, MENU, PLAY, STOP, NEXT, PREV
10:34:28henrysunsethow does it turn off?
10:34:30PsycoXul-, play, +, and stop are all on one big round button and can't be pressed simultaneously (at least not easily)
10:34:37PsycoXulhenrysunset: holding stop
10:34:40henrysunsetyes i understand
10:34:53Zagorcomparison photo here: http://rockbox.haxx.se/devcon/show.cgi?img4083.jpg
10:34:54henrysunsetok so stop = off
10:35:28henrysunsetmay I have a moment to formulate a responce?
10:35:42Zagornaturally. we're in no hurry.
10:36:16PsycoXulwe can apparently have on+menu, menu+on, on+{-,play,+,stop}, menu+{-,play,+,stop}, on+menu+{-,play,+,stop}, um probably menu+on+{-,play,+,stop} and maybe even {-,play,+,stop}+blah etc
10:36:32henrysunsetgotcha
10:36:47henrysunsetso there are just these 2 models in terms of keys?
10:36:58henrysunsetand the player has less creen
10:37:03henrysunset*screen
10:37:08henrysunsetok; brb
10:37:11PsycoXulnot just less screen, but also less capable
10:37:22PsycoXulit's not bitmap
10:37:42Zagorright, only these two models
10:38:05Zagoryou should probably know about the remote control too. not that it changes much
10:38:21 Join Triple-z [0] (~Mp3@212.116.168.55)
10:38:25Zagorhttp://rockbox.haxx.se/internals/remote.jpg
10:38:35Zagorthe same remote for both models
10:39:30Zagorthe two small circular buttons on the remote is vol+ and vol-
10:40:55 Quit Mine78 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:42:09 Quit Bagder ("http://daniel.haxx.se")
10:43:08henrysunsetoh
10:43:14henrysunsetanother question
10:43:30henrysunsetdoes the player have the f2/f3 quickmenus in some other way
10:43:35henrysunsetor must they use preferences?
10:44:05Zagorthey must use preferences
10:44:08henrysunsetok
10:44:27henrysunsetwell i actually was gonna give them quickmenus too
10:44:28 Quit PsycoXul ("reboot.")
10:44:49henrysunsetbut if they don't "need" them it would be less complex to avoid them.
10:45:20Zagorthey're difficult to make due to the limited display on the players
10:45:33henrysunsetso i see.
10:45:40henrysunsetcouldn't it be done iconically?
10:45:53henrysunsetor does that screen not really support icons either?
10:46:13Zagorit does, to some extent. we can redefine 4 characters. 5x7 pixels...
10:46:21henrysunsetonly 4
10:46:23henrysunsetsheesh
10:46:23henrysunsetok
10:46:39Zagor4 on the old display model, 8 on the more recent (more common)
10:46:48henrysunsetk
10:46:52henrysunsetwierdness
10:47:03henrysunsetso go for lowest common denominator i guess
10:47:47Zagoreither that, or if we can dynamically fallback to an uglier display for the older units. i'd guess 75-90% of players use the new display.
10:47:54henrysunsetyeah
10:47:56henrysunsetk
10:50:29 Join PsycoXul [0] (psyco@adsl-63-205-41-79.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net)
11:00
11:02:01 Quit Synthe (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:02:03 Join Synthe` [0] (Synthe@galt.synthe.net)
11:08:34PsycoXulok i must say
11:08:53PsycoXulthe scrolling text viewer patch on the patch tracker ROCKS
11:09:27Triple-zwitch one?
11:09:53PsycoXulit's like perfect, except it's a little outdated with respect to icons, and it'd be nice if you could access the menu from it
11:10:18PsycoXulTriple-z: huh? there's only one i think... heh
11:10:19 Quit Synthe` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:11:30PsycoXul617976scroll text files* 2002-10-03 01:56nobodynobody
11:11:32PsycoXulthat
11:12:02PsycoXulanother odd thing is that, while the backlight timeout works while the text is scrolling
11:12:06PsycoXulit stays on while it's "paused"
11:12:13Zagorhaha
11:12:20PsycoXulit seems to me like if it should do any such thing, it should be the exact opposite
11:12:40PsycoXulit would be a nice option to have it stay on while scrolling, anyways
11:13:25PsycoXulbut this is finaly something usable for reading all these books i've got in text on here
11:14:19PsycoXulactualy i like the one that lets you scroll around the file manualy [the default one now i guess] for some other kinds of text files
11:14:22PsycoXulbut this is better for books
11:14:45 Join Synthe [0] (Synthe@galt.synthe.net)
11:14:50PsycoXuli'd like to see them as quick-switchable modes so you can use either depending on the file you're looking at
11:15:02 Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Bdd1e.pppool.de)
11:17:28PsycoXuli'll have to try that .rockbox browsing patch next
11:17:59PsycoXulbut this setup'll get me through the weekend
11:31:57PsycoXulok bug report on that menu+key thing filed, 631986
11:38:34***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:38:55langhaarrocker&%*!!! I left my USB cable at the office. Could anybody be so kind as to mail me his one? :)
11:40:25PsycoXuli just can't wait for the playlist building/editing so i can finaly get back to my standard way of listening to music, just on the go... the whole reason i wanted an archos, and have yet to be able to do since i got it last xmas hehe
11:41:55langhaarrockerAnd I can't wait for a user friendly way for recording - without having to move the recorded files back and forth to keep the hd error free.
11:42:03henrysunsetyeah playlists would be excellent
11:42:25PsycoXulit just has to be able to add 1. single files, 2. whole directories, 3. whole directories traversing subdirectories, 4. whole disk, and preferably also multiple simultaneous selections of each for addition and removal, and all without any retarded sluggishness like holding any buttons for any period of time longer than it takes you to press a 2nd button and let them go
11:42:51henrysunseti have a neat idea for making and editing playlists but i'm gonna hold off on explaining it for no
11:43:05henrysunset3 is what i want especially badly
11:43:37kargatronso what are your concrete examples? just curious.
11:43:43PsycoXulwell on players, 3 is an accidental "feature" of the stock firmware
11:43:55PsycoXulwell actualy it's sortof a cross between 3 and 4...
11:44:08kargatroni certainly see wanting #3, etc, but for your "top ten/twenty" wanted recursive dirs, you can make playlists, right?
11:44:09PsycoXulyou use the function to add a whole directory to the playlist, and it adds it and every file on the disk after it
11:44:30kargatronare you talking artist dirs, genre dirs?
11:44:32henrysunsetpsyco; go to the folder u want to add; press pay; t asks you if u wanna add that folder or that folder recursively
11:44:37henrysunseter press play
11:45:09PsycoXulhenrysunset: well on players play goes into the folder, so something like on+play would be more like it
11:45:15henrysunsetit shoudl handle shortcuts too; that could be helpful hack since we don't have a database for searching
11:45:33henrysunsetpsyco; p'haps
11:45:54PsycoXulhenrysunset: i'd prefer it just do what i tell it to and not ask me anything too
11:45:56henrysunsetwhat about handling addign the folder recursively or not?
11:46:07PsycoXulhaving to press keys twice for each addition is too slow for me
11:46:14PsycoXuli'd rather seperate combo's
11:46:24langhaarrockerI want a quick way for adding the currently playing file to a selectable playlist
11:46:28henrysunsetbut it requires memorizing an obscure command
11:46:42PsycoXulpersonaly i build a giant playlist of whatever strikes my mood, listen to it, then scrap it and build a new one
11:46:42henrysunsetthat could be a feature of the player view
11:46:50henrysunsetyeah i hear ya
11:47:00henrysunsetalso removing stuff from the plalist is important
11:47:05PsycoXulyeah
11:47:19henrysunsetmaybe even a way to select a bunch of files and add or remove them
11:47:31henrysunsetsorta lik shift+up/down on a PC
11:47:47langhaarrockerwe need mouse support
11:47:48henrysunsetanyway
11:47:50henrysunsetto bed w/ me
11:47:53henrysunsetoh...
11:47:54PsycoXulanother idea i've got is something like holding on and then pressing plus/minus (on players anyways) selects/deselects multiple files
11:48:01kargatronis ON-RIGHT, ON-LEFT currenytly used? those could be add/delete, maybe
11:48:18PsycoXuland then pressing play on those could add them all or whatever
11:48:34Zagorstop talking, start coding :)
11:48:43PsycoXulkargatron: players currently have no combo's in the browser afaik, just in the WPS
11:48:43henrysunsetP.S.. i revised the ui doc i workin on to add the controls for the Player hardware as wel as the recorder. interestingly; the player seems to show more improvement than the recorder.
11:49:00henrysunsetagain http://ghettohardware.com/rockbox if interested
11:49:04langhaarrockerZagor: I'll have servaral hours on train today. :)
11:49:22kargatronZagor, that sounds dangerous - i wouldn't necessarily want someone to code something most people didn't find reasonable, all else being equal
11:49:39Zagorlanghaarrocker: hehe, good. the write code is good enough to do playlist creation
11:50:03henrysunsetwhat can't the write code do; big files?
11:50:17Zagorlong filenames
11:50:18henrysunsetto bed w/ me
11:50:27Zagornight
11:50:33PsycoXulme too
11:50:48PsycoXuli just gotta say rockbox rocks, and the future looks bright and exciting
11:51:05langhaarrockerZagor: I currently prefer working on key schemes. Seems there are enough people who crave for playlists so that I intend to relax on that topic.
11:51:29Zagorlanghaarrocker: ok
11:52:34PsycoXuli'll be back sunday...
11:52:36PsycoXulnight
11:52:52langhaarrockerZagor: But there's one thing I might split off and 'release' earlier: configurable ready fx screens without key schemes.
11:53:34Zagorhow will you do that without key schemes?
11:54:36langhaarrockerBasically I reused a command table that contains function pointers from key schemes for fn screens. I simply can hardcode these things for a while.
11:57:24Zagorok
11:57:51langhaarrockerApart from the usb screen - Is screen.c used in the player at all?
12:00
12:01:27dwihnoTrevlig helg på er!
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12:01:54langhaarrockerI think it might be a good idea to move the fn screens functionality to the apps/recorder directory.
12:01:56Zagorlanghaarrocker: no
12:02:04Zagorbut it could be, in the future
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12:13:10ZagorBagder: any word from linus yet?
12:13:20Bagdernope
12:15:55Zagordisk writing works quite well now. the test case is pretty thorough
12:16:16Zagori just need to add mkdir and remove
12:16:23Zagorand long names, of course
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12:24:40BagderZagor: Linus says 12:50 at the usual place
12:24:47Zagorok
12:41:10Bagderlunch
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13:08:08 Join faethor [0] (faethor@host213-122-79-144.in-addr.btopenworld.com)
13:08:34faethorhi guys..
13:10:24kargatronherro
13:10:36faethor;D
13:13:31faethorjust thought I'd pop in to congratulate Zagor on getting the FAT writing almost done... but he ain't here...
13:13:56kargatroni think he's good ad skimming scrollbacks
13:14:17faethorcan't wait to record through line-in with no screen update noise.... that's bloody annoying...
13:15:55faethorcan anyone tell me how levels are in Sokoban... :D... getting tough now at level 63..
13:16:13kargatroni've never actually tried recording. :) just use my ajbr for listening
13:17:44memI have two questions: How do I display the peak meter? and Can I try the recording function in the daily builds or not?
13:18:47memfaethor: I think Zagor will be back in less than an hour, he left 30 minutes ago or something
13:19:27faethorI'm after recording sounds to use in ym sampler.... I was really disappointed when I found that annoying screen update noise that occurs with the Archos FW also comes through on recording from line-in...
13:19:41faethoralthough not with the internal mic or SP/DIF
13:20:34kargatronmem, meter is %pm in wps config
13:20:34memHow to try recording? Which keys to press?
13:20:54kargatronnot aware that recording is available in recording, but maybe i missed something?
13:20:57memkargatron: Okay, I haven't looked into the wps-config yet
13:21:12kargatronwps conf rocks
13:21:42kargatronnever understood why people ever want bitrate/freq in their wps. :)
13:22:09kargatronbut i'm sure others wouldn't know why i want genre. teto
13:22:14faethorI do, probably coz I'm a bit of an audio geek
13:23:58kargatronas i am a musical context/classification geek.
13:24:42kargatronas such, i'm really starting to miss having Year available
13:26:06faethorI gotta say though I find the file display limit a bit frusttrating, All my mp3s are properly named and I just use folders for genre (less hassle when driving)... the 400 file limit doesn't apply coz the filenames are usually pretty long, e.g "Queens of the Stone Age-Songs for the Deaf-08-go with the flow.mp3" so the folder list buffer runs out at about 270 files ...
13:26:42faethorupdating playlists when just copying a few new tunes to a folder is a hassle
13:26:47kargatronack. couldn't deal with that no matter how unique my names were
13:26:57kargatroni want my folders.
13:27:07kargatrongenre/artist/album
13:27:15kargatronteto again!
13:29:47faethoryeah, but say you just wanna randomly play all your rock tracks you gotta have an up to date playlist for that, this is just extra maintainance when u add/remove files. Maybe I'm just lazy...
13:29:58faethorho hum
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13:32:25faethor_ukflippin dial-up suks too... :D
13:32:34faethor_ukjust kicked me off
13:33:03memkargatron: /me just created the first wps-config :-)
13:33:23memI did remove the album line and then could I see the peek meter
13:33:30mempeak even
13:33:49kargatronwith %pm on line 8, you can toggle it on/off with your status bar on/off
13:34:23faethor_ukor you could use 5x7 font, which give u 8 lines on screen...
13:34:26kargatronhttp://forums.funmp3players.com/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=5813&forum_id=8&Topic_Title=Your+Favorite+WPS+Setting&forum_title=General+%2D+Jukebox+Player%2FRecorder&M=False&S=True
13:34:32kargatronsome examples there
13:34:45kargatronyikes, 5x7, have a magnifying glass overlay? :)
13:35:00kargatronuwe_prop's as small as I can handle
13:35:15faethor_uktrue.. I use UWE_PROP meself
13:35:57memkargatron: So smart, to just switch off the status bar
13:36:14faethor_uk%d1
13:36:14faethor_uk%s%fn
13:36:14faethor_ukTime: %pc/%pt
13:36:14DBUGEnqueued KICK faethor_uk
13:36:14faethor_uk%fbkbit%fv %ffHz
13:36:14faethor_uk%pb
13:36:14***Alert Mode level 1
13:36:14DBUGEnqueued KICK faethor
13:36:14faethor_ukTrack %pp of %pe
13:36:16faethor_ukFile Size: %fsKb
13:36:18faethor_uk%pm
13:36:27CtcpIgnored 2 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
13:36:27*mem realized that you can change wps-config while you're playing a song too
13:37:08faethor_uk* reaching new levels of geekosity
13:37:11kargatronnow, filesize, THAT's abstruse info. :)
13:37:43faethor_ukI know.. :D
13:38:00kargatroni do want to see someone beat my line length for: %?iy<%iy />%?ig<%ig/%?d3<%?d4<%d4:>%d3/%d2>>
13:38:02kargatron:)
13:38:36***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:40:07faethor_ukI dont use ID3 tags coz I can't be bothered updatign the 80 or so percent of my 10000+ files with don't have descent ID3 info.. so I fill up the screen with Hz n shit
13:41:12faethor_ukagain, call me lazy........
13:42:02kargatronwell, you can use conditionals, get the ID3 when it's there, ignore when not
13:42:03faethor_ukanyone think that cross-fading could be possible with rockbox..... works well with winamp
13:42:17kargatronalready considered and rejected:
13:42:28kargatroncrossfading needs two decoders, jb has only one
13:42:33kargatroniirc
13:42:34faethor_ukahh
13:42:49kargatronhardware decoder, not soft
13:42:56faethor_uksure
13:43:01kargatronalso why ogg can't be handled
13:43:18kargatron(hardware limitation)
13:43:51memkargatron: Couldn't Ogg be supported if someone knew howto download new software to the DSP?
13:44:26kargatronnot enough mem, afaik
13:44:36memIsn't it a generic DSP but we lack of documentation
13:44:39kargatronogg evidently requires lots of mem just for lookup tables or something
13:44:44kargatronsee the faq, all in there
13:44:48memI am enough :-)
13:46:15***Alert Mode OFF
13:46:30memOkay, Ogg maybe need to much mem. But .wav could be supported if we knew howto download "pass-through" code to the DSP, isn't that right at least?
13:47:22kargatronunfortunately, i'm only passing on meta-knowledge. not a techie, jb-wise
13:47:33kargatronthought faq addressed wav too
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14:08:56 Nick Zagor|lunch is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se)
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14:13:33faethor_ukcongats on getting the FAT writing done Zagor.... any estimates on when us loyal Rockbox users will have some noise-free line-in recording? As my sampler needs some new HQ sounds...
14:16:09faethor_uk:(
14:16:37faethor_ukxO
14:24:25Zagor:-)
14:24:48Zagorwell linus has pretty much finalized recording, so it should not be very long
14:25:43HesWhoa! Excellent news.
14:26:14faethor_ukcool as large cool thing... cheers
14:26:40Zagorcan't say anything about the noise issue though. we'll just have to see.
14:26:44HesI got myself a new toy (double/upright bass) so I've been a bit too busy to hack on rockbox lately.
14:27:15 Quit tot ()
14:27:49Zagordouble/upright bass? what's that?
14:28:23Hesdouble bass, or upright bass... think of the biggest violin that is standing upright
14:28:28Hescontrabass
14:28:33Zagorah, ok
14:28:48Zagordo you play?
14:29:01Hesapparently yes. 8-)
14:29:10Zagorheh
14:29:26HesBeen playing electric bass quite a lot before, and even more guitar... and a little piano & violing ages ago
14:29:29kargatronbut *what* do you play?
14:29:32Zagori saw some rap group yesterday consisting of a drummer, a bass player and a rapper. looked cool.
14:29:35faethor_ukI assumed It'd be pretty noise free as it's the same annoying screen update noise that is present in the Archos fireware when playing... this is not present when recording from the internal mic or SP/DIF, only the line-in.
14:29:39Hesso it was pretty easy to start off
14:30:11Zagorfaethor_uk: well, we can hope
14:31:06faethor_uksure... well done on rockbox anyhoo... I'm off.. byee
14:31:17Zagorbye
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15:11:16 Join TotMacher [0] (tot@ip115.rsidus.riege.de)
15:26:41elinenbe2Happy Nov. 1st!!
15:26:48Zagor:-)
15:27:12elinenbe2hey, question here. If linux chrashed hard, is there anywhere you can look at a log file to see what was going on?
15:27:29Zagornot until next boot
15:27:36elinenbe2well, that is what I mean/
15:27:47elinenbe2it crashed hard. I can't do anything on the machine as it is!
15:28:11Zagorreboot and check /var/log/*
15:28:18elinenbe2cool
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16:26:03Zagorremove() added
16:26:15elinenbenice :)
16:26:29elinenbenow I really will be able to delete all my shizz...
16:27:05elinenbeZagor: Is LinusN checking out your progress? Maybe he can put his recording code into action!
16:27:51Zagorhe is informed. unfortunately, he is a bit occupied with private stuff right now.
16:28:03elinenbehe has babies!
16:28:10Zagorexactly
16:28:48kargatrongads, some priorities, people? sometimes people forget what's important in life. Rockbox!
16:28:59Zagorhehe
16:34:57Zagorgotta go
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17:09:09memIt's time to finish up and start the weekend! See you all next week!
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