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#rockbox log for 2004-01-21

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05:46:13 Join midknight2k3 [0] (zakk@ACC47C1D.ipt.aol.com)
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05:46:38midknight2k3hey dogger
05:48:17 Quit Hadaka (orwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
05:48:17NSplitorwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
05:53:19NHealorwell.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
05:53:19NJoinHadaka [0] (naked@aka.pp.htv.fi)
05:59:48elinenbehttp://www.archos.com/products/overview/gmini_220.html
05:59:59midknight2k3i know
06:00
06:00:01midknight2k3but wait
06:00:05midknight2k3want to see something neat
06:00:26midknight2k3wait
06:00:29midknight2k3PHOTO VIEWER?
06:01:14midknight2k3WOW archos did summat right for a change
06:04:00dwihno\o/
06:04:13midknight2k3thats pretty cool
06:04:26Dogger?
06:04:30Doggerav300 is way better
06:04:34Doggerand not much more money
06:04:37midknight2k3i know
06:04:39midknight2k3but its cool
06:04:40Doggergmini is only greyscale
06:04:42Doggereugh
06:04:50midknight2k3im getting one dont worry dogger
06:04:54midknight2k3but its still cool
06:04:58midknight2k3god they need some good coders
06:05:04midknight2k3their products rock
06:05:09midknight2k3but the firmware = teh suck
06:05:37dwihnoDoes the new gmini use some special kind of hard disk?
06:06:43midknight2k3yes
06:06:47midknight2k3like the Rio Karma
06:07:24dwihno1.8"
06:07:40dwihnoDamn I love hardware evolution! :D
06:07:54midknight2k3lol
06:08:15dwihnoNot that there is something "wrong" with 2.5"... :-)
06:08:42midknight2k3lol
06:08:53*midknight2k3 points at dwinho, 2.5" user
06:09:01dwihno:-)
06:09:15dwihnoI got 3 2.5" disks \o/
06:09:45dwihnoI always keep my screwdriver around, just in case I need to switch music collection
06:09:48dwihno;-)
06:09:57midknight2k3lol
06:10:34dwihnoI guess they use some special kind of battery... *sigh*
06:10:56midknight2k3yeah
06:11:34dwihnoWell, as long as you can replace them...
06:11:41midknight2k3you can't
06:12:02dwihnoNot even with the 220?
06:12:12dwihnoDogger: How is the battery performance on the AV units?
06:12:13midknight2k3nope its all proprietary
06:12:16midknight2k3yeah
06:12:17midknight2k3curious
06:12:51Doggerdwihno: variable
06:12:59DoggerI plan to fix mine soon
06:13:04dwihno"fix"? :)
06:13:10DoggerI have had a 320, and 2 340s
06:13:14Doggerthe first 2 were brill
06:13:20Doggerlasted 8 hours for mp3s,
06:13:25Doggerand about 4 for video
06:13:30dwihnohm
06:13:32Doggerthis one is much less
06:13:39DoggerI dont think the battery is making good contact
06:13:46DoggerI have ordered a spare battery for it as well
06:13:58dwihnoSo the batteries are somewhat replaceable...
06:14:08midknight2k3wha
06:14:14midknight2k3they give spares
06:14:14midknight2k3?
06:14:30dwihnoPerhaps for certain models.
06:15:16dwihnoDogger: where did you order the spare battery?
06:15:38midknight2k3archos i'd guess
06:16:32dwihnoHas there been any notes about Rockbox on the Gmini models?
06:16:39dwihno(in the mailing list)
06:16:40midknight2k3they are working on it
06:16:43midknight2k3hrm
06:16:46midknight2k3i need to speak to the devsx
06:16:48midknight2k3devs*
06:16:52midknight2k3specifically zagor
06:18:08dwihnoZagor rules \o/ :)
06:18:26Doggerhttp://store.l-f-l.com/cgi-bin/cp-app.cgi?rrc=N&pg=prod&ref=102511
06:18:31Doggerarchos av300 battery
06:18:36midknight2k3zagor rules
06:18:38midknight2k3track is a jerk
06:18:42midknight2k3za. gor. rules.
06:18:48midknight2k3track. isa. jerk.
06:18:50midknight2k3za. gor. rules.
06:18:51midknight2k3track. isa. jerk.
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06:24:56midknight2k3hi joshn
06:25:11joshNhi
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06:41:18dwihnoI wonder what Archos has against the open source movement.
06:41:37dwihnoIt's not like we're decreasing their profit...
06:42:07midknight2k3definitely not
06:42:29midknight2k3they are insulted to know the firmware they spent years coding and getting nowhere with is being replaced by a better one within weeks
06:42:43midknight2k3and the fact that the AVos team and ROCKbox team are much more fluent in C than their team
06:43:24dwihnoWell... They _ARE_ french ;-)
06:43:34midknight2k3its like
06:43:54dwihnoIf there only was some way to work together with the Archos devs'.
06:43:54midknight2k3" vid man(); "
06:43:57midknight2k3LOL
06:44:09midknight2k3ERROR: try not to use accents punk"
06:44:16midknight2k3oh did you hear bluechips error it was so funny
06:44:33midknight2k3"Error: settings_menu.c: 60: No error" or something like that
06:47:01dwihno(?) :)
06:47:27midknight2k3error compiling rockbox
06:47:30midknight2k3something like that
06:47:44midknight2k3Error: <file>: <line>: No error
06:50:28dwihnoneato :)
06:50:33dwihnoI love errors
06:50:39dwihnoI AM ERROR.
06:50:41midknight2k3esp "no error" errors
06:50:48dwihnoYou know which game I'm quoting? :)
06:50:56midknight2k3no
06:51:11dwihnoZelda 2.
06:51:15dwihnoNintendo 8-bit.
06:51:28midknight2k3wow
06:51:32midknight2k3how do i fix it
06:51:53dwihno"Fix"?
06:53:11midknight2k3tff
06:53:14midknight2k3dwinho is funny
06:53:17midknight2k3are you a coder?
06:53:39dwihnoWell, according to you, I'm a comedian ;)
06:53:48midknight2k3yes you are
06:53:50midknight2k3look at you
06:53:52midknight2k3zelda player
06:54:32dwihnoWell, I don't do coding for a living anymore. Now it's just a hobby of mine.
06:56:04midknight2k3yay
06:56:08midknight2k3is this correct code?
06:56:31midknight2k3if(dwinho=happy) midk_glad(); else midk_mad();
06:57:21 Quit joshN (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
06:57:55dwihnoheh
06:58:18midknight2k3?
06:58:41dwihnoThe compiler will probably warn you, but it's a correct statement
06:58:56midknight2k3why would it warn me?
06:59:02midknight2k3comparing variable to variable?
06:59:52midknight2k3or an implicit declaration
06:59:54midknight2k3whatever that means
07:00
07:01:27dwihnoIt isn't really a comparison.
07:01:42*midknight2k3 <dot dot dot>s
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07:04:35midknight2k3phat bloke
07:04:36midknight2k3is that you
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07:13:37midknight2k3nite
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13:17:35 Part dsg
13:37:16c0uttahey kurzhaarrocker, have you used bagder's strtok_r function before ?
13:37:38kurzhaarrockeryes, heavily
13:38:11c0uttaok. if i have a string "512;1;;75" i would expect:
13:38:14c0utta512
13:38:16c0utta1
13:38:22c0utta<blank>
13:38:23c0utta75
13:38:33c0uttausing ; as the delimeter
13:38:51kurzhaarrockerI'm not sure about the blank though...
13:39:05*kurzhaarrocker looks into acient code
13:39:07c0uttayeah, i'm getting:
13:39:12c0utta512
13:39:13c0utta1
13:39:15c0utta75
13:39:28c0uttait *sounds* like a bug to me
13:39:37c0uttamaybe it's by design tho..
13:40:04kurzhaarrockerThe thing is that you can specify multiple delimiter characters, which may occur in sequence. Think about whitespace as delimiter.
13:41:07kurzhaarrockerIf you wanted whitespace delimiter you'd want any sequence of tabs and spaces to be _one_ delimiter. So for that task strtok_r works as desired.
13:41:10c0uttai'll be parsing filenames so need whitespace
13:41:31c0uttai suppose tab would work in isolation
13:41:49*c0utta runs a test
13:44:08c0uttanope, tabs don't work in isolation
13:44:27kurzhaarrockersee at man strtok - the behaviour that multiple subsequent delimiters are used as one is defined there.
13:45:06c0uttaat man strtok ?
13:45:31kurzhaarrockerstrtok_r is just a special variant of strtok, the man page is the same
13:45:58kurzhaarrockerIn rockbox only strtok_r is implemented.
13:46:08c0uttaexcuse my ignorance, but what is the "man page" ?
13:46:49kurzhaarrockerthe online help. Type "man strtok" at the command line in linux / cygwin
13:47:19c0uttabash: man: command not found
13:47:39c0uttai don't have a full cygwin
13:47:43kurzhaarrocker:)
13:48:24kurzhaarrockerCan you receive dcc?
13:48:37c0uttadepends on file type
13:49:05kurzhaarrockerText only
13:49:19c0uttano problem
13:51:05kurzhaarrocker"Trying to establish file transfer"
13:51:14kurzhaarrockerDo you receive anything?
13:51:39kurzhaarrockerpong
13:52:06c0uttano, just a timeout
13:52:10c0uttaping of .01 though
13:52:16kurzhaarrocker:)
13:52:25c0uttatry again pls
13:53:04kurzhaarrocker2nd try on the run.
13:53:18kurzhaarrockerI could mail it, if I knew your adress..
13:53:31c0uttadon't worry - i'll work it out
13:53:49c0uttai used /0 in between delimiters
13:53:57c0utta512;1;\0;75
13:54:01c0uttabang!!
13:54:17kurzhaarrockerok
13:56:23kurzhaarrockerDepending on what you want to do \0 might not the best choice though.
13:57:27kurzhaarrockerThe end of strings is indicated by \0 -> eg. strlen("512;1;\0;75") should return 5
13:57:48c0uttano, it caused an error in XP
13:57:57c0uttajust a test to see what would happen
13:58:31c0uttastrtok considers the string s1 to consist of a sequence ofzero ormore
13:58:36c0utta text tokens separated by spans of one or more characters from the
13:58:41c0utta separator string s2
13:58:48c0utta"one or more" is my issue
14:00
14:00:29kurzhaarrockerThat's how the behaviour is defined (posix)-> its not a bug. I don't remember wether there is an similiar function that suits your needs better.
14:01:49c0uttai'll use a space to indicate no entry
14:01:55c0utta512;1; ;75
14:02:12c0uttaworks
14:03:45c0uttai nearly have my f2 patch working
14:04:08 Join cjnr11 [0] (nihzff@l02v-25-139.d1.club-internet.fr)
14:04:13kurzhaarrocker:) I need that to have quick access for recording
14:04:29c0uttayou'll be able to add it to f2 dynamically
14:04:52*kurzhaarrocker jumps up and down in joy
14:05:50c0uttawhere has recording gone in the current menu system ?
14:05:53c0uttai can't find it ?
14:06:34kurzhaarrockerThere's /Recording/start recording (menu structure)
14:07:07kurzhaarrockerCan you handle increase / decrease of values (eg. bass) in F2 too?
14:07:47c0uttaaha i'm using the sim
14:07:52c0uttano recording available
14:07:52kurzhaarrocker:)
14:08:26c0uttaregarding bass - what do you want to see ?
14:09:19c0uttayou'll be able to add the "Bass" menu to F2 dynamcially
14:09:43kurzhaarrockerI just imagine some user wants to have quick access to sound (or other) options. He might want to assign F2+left to increase bass and F2+right to decrease bass.
14:10:12dwihnoc0utta: tell me what you're up to.
14:10:33c0utta"up to" as in the current status ?
14:10:36c0uttaor in general ?
14:11:11c0uttasorry to confuse dwihno
14:11:18c0uttadwihno: i'm doing a patch for f2
14:11:22dwihnoWell, what are your plans, and how far have you gotten?
14:11:49c0uttafirstly, i've managed to keep the quickscreens
14:12:03c0uttaf2-left, f2-right, f2-down have not changed
14:12:16kurzhaarrockerc0utta I don't understand about the current status / general thing
14:12:46c0uttakurzhaarrocker: i know. i assume everyone's an aussie
14:13:08kurzhaarrockerc0utta: Are these f2-<other key> combos not assignable as well?
14:13:42c0uttaaccording to the docs, some keys are treated the same
14:13:52c0uttathe max we can have is 3
14:14:07kurzhaarrockeryes, eg f2 + up can't be detected.
14:14:29c0uttaanyway, when you press f2 and release you are presented with the F2 menu
14:14:43kurzhaarrockerjust as it is now?
14:14:59kurzhaarrockeroh, the new user menu I guess?
14:15:09c0uttakurzhaarrocker: yes
14:15:20c0uttathe f2 menu is read from a file
14:15:24kurzhaarrockerok
14:15:31c0uttathe one i was parsing with strtok_r
14:15:38kurzhaarrocker:)
14:16:12kurzhaarrockerCan I assign a user definable action to (e.g) f2+down?
14:16:19c0uttaso f2 is now dynamic based on the file contents
14:16:33c0uttakurzhaarrocker: not yet
14:16:52c0uttabut i'm working on it too. i'd like user definable quick-screens too
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14:17:23kurzhaarrockerimoh these user definable quickscreens are even more important than another menu.
14:17:48c0uttai agree. bagder and linus don't want quickscreens tho
14:18:30kurzhaarrockerNeither of them record a lot :)
14:19:18c0uttabut since i have been able to use quickscreens and still get an f2 menu i'm sure i'll convince them
14:19:35kurzhaarrockerI'll support you!
14:19:57c0uttaat the moment, the entries in F2 are menus based upon F1
14:20:33c0uttai currently have shuffle, backlight & volume in my F2 menu
14:20:56c0uttawhen you select them, they work the same as the shuffle, backlight & volume menus in F1
14:21:07c0uttaactually use the same code
14:22:11kurzhaarrockerHave you thought about extending these functionalities so that they can trigger other things too? Just think about the idea of increasing / decreasing sound setting values with button combos, too.
14:22:41c0uttai sure have
14:23:02c0uttamy test of "512;1;;75" was an example
14:23:07kurzhaarrockerok
14:23:32c0uttathis uses key 512 (f2), mapped to action 1 (volume), adjust to 75%
14:24:27c0uttayou could also have "512;1;;"
14:24:39c0uttathis would bring up the volume menu
14:25:05kurzhaarrockerDoes that blank trigger the volume menu?
14:25:11c0uttayes
14:25:45c0uttai just added the recording menu to my f2 menu by editing the file
14:25:56c0uttaare you jealous ?
14:26:08 Quit MT (Remote closed the connection)
14:26:22kurzhaarrockernot really, I patched my firmware to use F3+ down to start recording immediately :)
14:26:23 Join LinusN [200] (~linus@labb.contactor.se)
14:26:30kurzhaarrockerHi Linus!
14:27:58LinusNc0utta: i'm not against quick access, i'm against the quick-screens as they are today
14:28:14kurzhaarrockeryippieh!
14:29:26c0uttaLinusN: when you hold down F2 with my patch you still see the quickscreen
14:29:35c0uttarelease F2 and the F2 menu displays
14:29:59c0uttabut if you press left/right/down it does the quickscreen action
14:30:33kurzhaarrockerOr is the trouble about the string lengths in the quick screen?
14:30:52c0uttakurzhaarrocker: yes, that's very limiting
14:31:44c0uttalate here guys. gotta go to bed
14:31:53kurzhaarrockersleep tight
14:32:02c0uttahey linus, don't foget my patch :)
14:32:02c0uttafoget=forget
14:32:42LinusNthe problem with quick-screens are 1) that they are limited to only a few options and 2) the layout is a nightmare for translations
14:33:09LinusNand 3) they are hard-coded
14:33:22c0uttatrue
14:33:40c0uttabut, if we allow them to be user configurable 2
14:33:47c0utta2) will become a real problem
14:33:53kurzhaarrockerre 1) better than no options
14:33:53kurzhaarrockerre 2) so what
14:33:53kurzhaarrockerre 3) let c0outta change that
14:34:05c0uttalol
14:34:36c0uttacheers guys
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14:36:32kurzhaarrockerLinus: Do I understand that right that recorded data that is written do file starts at mp3buf_read ?
14:37:26LinusNyes and no
14:37:49LinusNthe recorded data starts after the xing tag
14:38:18dwihnoLinusN: Is the Xing tag complex?
14:38:35kurzhaarrockerok, but that tag is added after the recording position is calculated.
14:39:01LinusNdwihno: not really, what do you mean?
14:39:27LinusNkurzhaarrocker: yes, but the space is reserved in the file by advancing mp3buf_read
14:39:27dwihnoLinusN: Across several frames or such.
14:39:34dwihnoLinusN: Or is it just a special kind of frame?
14:39:36LinusNdwihno: no, it is a single mp3 frame
14:39:49dwihnoah
14:40:10*dwihno longs for christmas...
14:40:22LinusNkurzhaarrocker: what do you really want to know?
14:40:24dwihnoThe only time of year when coding is possible
14:40:42kurzhaarrockerLinusN may I dcc you a short patch on mpeg.c that shows you my prinicipial attempt to calculate the recording position? It doesn't work and I don't understand why. It should be understandable without applying it, reading is sufficiant.
14:41:32LinusNsure
15:00
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15:18:52kurzhaarrockermidknight2k3: see? I've cut my hair and now you've got your 'mid' for your self again!
15:19:00midknight2k3hi
15:19:02midknight2k3hey! yay
15:19:05midknight2k3hey linus
15:19:18LinusNmidknight2k3: shame on you, you forced him to cut his hair!
15:19:23midknight2k3aww
15:19:26midknight2k3sorry
15:20:03kurzhaarrockerI'm not the same person anymore since that!
15:20:18midknight2k3grow it back! i'm sorry!
15:21:24kurzhaarrockerThat means I'll need _lots_ of guano...
15:21:52midknight2k3http://google.com/search?q=guano+for+sale
15:22:58kurzhaarrockerBat guano? I thought that guano was produced by sea birds only.
15:23:20midknight2k3bats most definitely
15:23:42midknight2k3LinusN: I've done yet another radio patch :D
15:24:32midknight2k3it's not yet complete but i plan on finishing it ... today I guess you'd call it. but that of course means i'll end up working on my etch a sketch plugin and get nowhere, and push release dates back a few days :-\
15:25:11LinusNmidknight2k3: what's the patch about?
15:25:56midknight2k3I moved a couple things, changed a couple langs, added a "Browse Stored Presets" in FM menu and <am in the process of> adding a ticker bar to show where you are
15:26:38LinusNlike an analog dial?
15:27:02midknight2k3like if i were at 104.7
15:27:04midknight2k3:
15:27:04midknight2k3 |
15:27:05midknight2k3|−−−−−−−−−−−−−−-|
15:27:05DBUGEnqueued KICK midknight2k3
15:27:05midknight2k387 94 102 107
15:27:11LinusNwould be cool to use my 7-seg display for the frequency :-)
15:28:50midknight2k3lol
15:28:56midknight2k3where would the peak meter go?
15:29:00midknight2k3i fixed a nasty bug too
15:29:05LinusNoh?
15:29:11kurzhaarrockerIn peak meter?
15:29:23midknight2k3yeah
15:29:39midknight2k3"Prerecording 00" is hiding behind the meter if the prerecording is off
15:29:55midknight2k3every button press will make it appear and disappear about a fifth of a second
15:30:10midknight2k3i moved the peak meter and cleared the rect if we aren't prerecording
15:30:15midknight2k3i just don't display it at all.
15:30:20midknight2k3unless we are prerecording
15:30:48kurzhaarrockerThat concerns the fm machine only?
15:30:55midknight2k3yes
15:31:33CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
15:31:33*kurzhaarrocker is relieved
15:32:31midknight2k3it's not that bad
15:32:31midknight2k3just ugly
15:33:27*midknight2k3 knows linusn is off to try it
15:34:09midknight2k3linus, would you like to see my work in progress?
15:34:43midknight2k3too bad for dcc. i can just email it
15:34:46midknight2k3crap
15:34:47midknight2k3i cant'
15:34:49midknight2k3gotta go
15:34:54midknight2k3bye all
15:34:56midknight2k3well i can
15:38:23midknight2k3i sent it and the lang goes in apps/langs, radio.c in apps/recorder
15:38:41midknight2k3you may wish to fix the ticker before i do
15:38:49midknight2k3if you desire, email me please :)
15:38:49midknight2k3bye
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18:45:33gzre
18:51:14gzmy first rockbox-compile - and it works :)
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19:01:58gzphew in-silicon scheduler...never saw anyhting like it
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19:54:09gzi should find a new menue "create directory" right below "info" in the main menue, shouldn't i? Well i dont
19:55:30Zagorthat was committed today, and is therefore only available in the bleeding edge build
19:57:11elinenbeZagor: where is the "delete directory" option... I say you get working on rmdir() <grin>
19:57:24Zagorhehe
19:57:49Zagoractually rmdir doesn't exist. removing a dir is no different from removing a file.
19:57:59Zagor(except checking that it's empty first)
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20:00:12elinenbeZagor: well rm -rf dir
20:00:27elinenbeZagor: how hard would it be to implement that in rockbox?
20:00:35gzZagor, ok i thought it's in the daily build already
20:01:19Zagorelinenbe: not hard at all
20:01:57elinenbeZagor: how much would you be willing to do it for $$$ ?
20:02:12Zagorhaha
20:02:16elinenbeZagor: I have a crisp $1 bill with your name on it...
20:02:23Zagorneed it that bad?
20:02:45elinenbeZagor: yeah...
20:03:04elinenbehas anyone check out musicbrainz.org
20:03:46elinenbeI think it would be wild to create a database with that program that will load your songs onto the rockbox, and then you can browse by ID3 database... maybe I will try something like that.
20:04:02Zagoryeah, sounds like a good idea
20:04:03elinenbehttp://www.archos.com/products/overview/gmini_220.html : browse by file or ID3
20:04:17elinenbethat actually looks pretty good!
20:04:28Zagorin fact, one idea is to put the whole freedb database on disk and use that
20:05:09elinenbethat's an idea!
20:06:04Zagori think one of the car mp3 players do that
20:06:20Zagorso archos has gone the 1.8" disk route too, finally
20:06:56elinenbeZagor: if you look at the webpage I just sent, and you check out the ARCLibrary portion... it seems like you could get the EXACT same result with a program that just creates playlists and folders based on ID3 tags... then you just change the default folder icons for that "folder" to an "artsists","albums",etc. icons.
20:07:34elinenbeZagor: I think it is the sony car player with a CD player and hard drive in it... that way you do not have to type in all the names on a car player!
20:07:43Zagoryeah. someone made such a script already.
20:07:47elinenbeZagor: however, I think it rips the music to ATRAC
20:07:58elinenbeI'll have to look for that...
20:08:11Zagorno, the one i'm thinking about wasn't a sony. never mind though.
20:08:47elinenbepossibly pioneer then? however, they probably uses the gracenote CDDB database and paid for it instead of the FREE freedb!
20:09:33elinenbeit angers me that I donated time and energy to the gracenote cddb (before it was gracenote and owned by Roxio) and then you had to pay for it... they are charging for other peoples work.
20:09:46Zagoryeah
20:11:15Zagorthere's a nice screen on that new gmini
20:13:29elinenbeyeah there is... I would go out a buy a new player in a second if any of them still supported standard rechargable batteries though.
20:14:10elinenbethe digital camera industry has that known... about 50% of the point and shoot cameras are AA rechargables and another 50% are proprietary
20:18:37Zagoryeah. i'm fearing the music player business will dump AAs completely. how many minidisc players use AAs, for instance?
20:24:21elinenbethis is nice: http://www.nextway.co.kr/products/new_150d.asp
20:24:39elinenbeexcept what is the deal with these 1.5 gb players?
20:24:52Zagorexactly. way too small
20:25:31Zagorthey exist because someone (hitachi?) recently released a new kind of very-small harddrive with sizes up to 4gig.
20:26:38elinenbeI know... but with a 20 and 40gb hard drive so small already (ipod) is there really any need to go way smaller.
20:27:03elinenbeI would love a device with an ipod size drive but larger screen and AA batteries (with rockbox of course) :D
20:29:22Zagorpersonally i've outgrown the 1.8" disks :-( i need >40gig to carry my collection. and i don't see me going back to "selective carrying" either.
20:29:54elinenbeactually I would like a archos with 2x2.5" disks...
20:30:08elinenbepacked tightly against each other with 4 AA's
20:30:10Zagorhehe, it'd be rather heavy though
20:30:40Zagornow 2 x 1.8", *that'd* be a killer (at least to your wallet ;)
20:31:30elinenbethad be nice... what about the disk in the Rio Karma −− what size is that?
20:32:21Zagori don't know. iirc it's too small for the standard 1.8" disks, but i'm probably wrong.
20:32:25elinenbe20gb in this: http://www.riovolution.com/images/devices/gallery/karmagut-07.jpg
20:32:30elinenbeit is not the standard 1.8"
20:32:51elinenbeof course a 2.5" 80gigger has more capacity in smaller space
20:32:55Zagordefinitely not. nice oen
20:32:57Zagorone
20:33:14Zagorhitachi makes all kinds of form factors these days!
20:33:16elinenbehttp://www.riovolution.com/images/devices/gallery/nitruscompare.jpg
20:33:37elinenbethe gallery is here: http://www.riovolution.com/gallery.php
20:34:52Zagordamn fuzzy images :(
20:35:06Zagorbut i see they are using the portalplayer chip
20:35:39gzhmm....
20:36:16gzwhat about getting the MAS 3509 or 3529, extracting the firmware-rom and reuse it for our mas? Seems like it's the same core using the same features
20:36:31gznow thats probably the reason why they don't want those infos to be spread
20:37:02Zagorgz: i would guess the rom on those is much larger than the ram on our chips
20:37:17elinenbeZagor: what ever happened with the info BlueChip got?
20:37:51gzZagor: might be. but as long as the AAC codec is below 4k-words we could separate & use it stand-alone
20:38:05Zagorit doesn't matter, we have plenty of info from that hungarian site now
20:38:21Zagorgz: go ahead :)
20:38:23gzat least the 35x9f ram-size still is 4kWords
20:38:44gzwell i'm pretty impressed. an in-sillicon scheduler and tons of other special features... phew!
20:39:16gzsad i couldnt find the mas c-compiler, but at least the simulator does assembling
20:39:17elinenbeZagor: what is the hungarian site?
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20:39:48elinenbeZagor: also, what was someone on the mailing list talking about when they mentioned a "Icon Driven Interface"?
20:39:49gzbtw you maybe shouldn't ALL leech from that site. in case the notify the traffic it might have not-nice effects
20:40:15Zagorgz: we've got it mirrored now
20:40:38Zagorelinenbe: a hungarian (i think) dsp class, using the MAS as material.
20:40:45Zagorhttp://krt.neobee.net/PNRS/DSPkurs/DSP_kurs.html
20:41:08elinenbeah nice.. do you think anything will come out of it?
20:41:09gzand the mas got a full-featured DMA interface. maybe it could even trigger the ata-chip itself? HAven't read it throughly, tho, probably isn't possible. but at last the polling wouldn't be needed anymore
20:41:43Zagorelinenbe: yeah, it's got enough info to write mas code. afaik bluechip is looking at it.
20:41:45gzit's locoated in novodi sad
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20:41:52gzer novi sad
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20:42:36gzit's in .yu
20:42:47elinenbedoes anyone know about and "Icon Driven Interface"?
20:43:05gzelinenbe, no
20:43:16trackI think the LCD on the archos is a bit small for an icon interface anyway
20:43:28Zagorgz: ok
20:43:35gzit's in serbia actually
20:43:46gzlooks like those guys did the c-compiler for the mas
20:43:47Zagorelinenbe: dwihno did a test a while back
20:44:02gzand some other research: http://csdl.computer.org/comp/proceedings/euromicro/2000/0780/02/07802224abs.htm
20:44:18Zagordwihno.ajbrec.ajz">http://rockbox.haxx.se/test/dwihno.ajbrec.ajz (regular recorder)
20:44:51Zagorgz: password protected :)
20:45:07elinenbeI'll check it out..
20:45:19gzsure that's quite usual - sadly. but at least you can read what it's about. and it doesn't really matter for our task, does it?
20:45:28gzwe have to code asm anyhow
20:45:48trackElinenbe I saw your comment referring to the atadore font
20:45:55elinenbeyeah?
20:46:08elinenbeI agree with Zagor though... we need a fixed font for the system font.
20:46:10trackwell, I agree with you. its easier to read than the sys font
20:46:28Zagorthen load the atadore font
20:46:30trackI can't see how much bigger it is than the sysfont, its just a bold version of it
20:46:34gzbut having read the overview.pdf i'm quite optimistic the mas does have some good power reservers
20:46:52 Join Guest [0] (~jirc@host81-128-160-153.in-addr.btopenworld.com)
20:47:50trackHi Guest
20:47:57elinenbeZagor: I quite like the icon interface... it could be nicer done though...
20:48:13Zagoryeah, that was just a mock-up
20:48:34elinenbeit could be nice like a nokia though...
20:48:36Zagorwe need a graphics artist :)
20:48:46elinenbeZagor: and it would be nice in grayscale :D
20:48:50Zagorhehe
20:49:06trackWould a greyscale icon interface be possible?
20:49:13Zagoryes
20:49:40trackit must put some strain on the LCD, constantly flashing the pixels to achieve greyscale
20:49:52elinenbean LCD is DESIGNED FOR THAT!
20:49:53Zagorsomeone could try playing with antialiased fonts for starters
20:49:53elinenbeug!
20:50:03elinenbeZagor: now, that would be a nice feature...
20:50:09tracki think the screen resolution is too low Zagor
20:50:12trackfor antialiasing
20:50:16Zagornope
20:50:26track112x64 pixels?
20:50:47Zagorantialiasing has nothing to do with screen size
20:50:51trackoh ox
20:50:53trackok
20:51:07trackI know antialiasing is smoothing out the jaggies on fonts and the like
20:51:52Zagoryes
20:52:08trackI just wondered how it would be achieveable on the archos
20:52:12tracksince you say its possible
20:52:45gzoops the simulator doesnt assemble. sadly. good for debugging but it doesnt feature a binary output
20:53:07trackI read in the paper today MPs are taking Apple on about the iPod
20:53:18Zagorgz: we need to write an assembler anyway
20:54:06gzZagor yep, i know. shit, i'd love to start right away playing with it. but i don't have the time at the moment anyhow
20:54:34Zagorso much code, so little time :)
20:54:38tracklol
20:54:45tracku have the knowledge Zagor
20:54:50track:)
20:55:17gzyeah. never coded a dsp before. i really am impressed of the mas! I just had a short look on some other generic one, but this one is way more powerfull
20:55:37trackGz are you saying DSPs effects are possible on the MAS?
20:55:49gztrack, the mas is a DSP
20:56:05tracki mean effects like hall, stadium and the like
20:56:16gzdsp=digital signal processor. You can do really many things with it
20:56:21tracksorry I mis-understood what you said
20:56:24gzif you are able to programm it properly
20:56:35trackI always thought the mas was a hard-coded chip
20:56:39gzand if it got enough memory/power etc.
20:56:43tracknot some sort of flash eeprom chip
20:57:00gztrack, mostly. the mpeg-code is in rom but there is a download-code-to-ram feature
20:57:07trackoh right
20:57:24gzbut still not an easy task to do cool stuff with it
20:57:30trackyea
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20:57:42trackmy archos is well old
20:57:54trackits chassis had a dent in it plus a few scratches
20:58:40*gz away
20:58:43trackJust put a brand new set of 2100mAh batteries in it but Im not getting much improved playback time
20:59:03trackand thats with backlight off, disk spindown 3 seconds, and disk poweroff on
21:00
21:00:12trackWhat does disk-poweroff actually do when activated?
21:01:18trackThe revamped menu structure is much better now Zagor
21:01:20trackless cluttered
21:06:25Zagordisk poweroff physically cuts power to the disk after spindown.
21:06:41Zagorit draws less power then, but in return it takes a bit longer to spin up
21:07:07trackahh ok
21:07:14trackthanks dude
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21:07:36track;-)
21:09:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:13:30trackHow accurate would you say the battery meter is in the daily builds?
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21:16:13Zagorhard to say
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21:17:34trackwell its reference to the 2100maH batteries I installed
21:17:57trackI charged them up to 100% as shown on the battery meter but they wern't much better than the old 1800mAh cells
21:18:41trackthey went down to 20% after 7 hours use
21:19:32trackDoes anyone know a good font designer program that can make the .fnt files?
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21:32:15trackHas anyone seen the iPod Mini?
21:33:16Zagorsure
21:33:35trackSeriously Zagor, it only has a 4 gigger drive, but it comes in a choice of colours
21:33:42Zagori know
21:33:55trackbut it still has the battery stigma attached though
21:34:46trackIm wondering what other makes of Jukebox store their firmware on the HD rather than in a flash chip
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21:41:43trackyea zagor he said his lcd went funny after playing long video clips
21:42:26trackperhaps it was just a co-incident
21:42:33Zagorprobably it simply got warm from the harddisk spinning constantly
21:42:46trackyea
21:42:55Zagorwhen the display gets warm, it becomes faster and then looks different
21:42:59trackyea i know
21:43:01trackmine does that
21:43:08trackwhen it cools it gets back to normal
21:43:34trackis there a possibility of an icon GUI?
21:44:03Zagorwe covered this 10 minutes ago
21:44:14trackyea i know, but wondered if it was still feasible
21:44:16 Join joshN [0] (joshN@204.251.225.17)
21:44:23trackjust looking at the archos's small LCD
21:44:30trackthe icons would have to be pretty small
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21:49:05 Nick edx{sportz} is now known as edx{shower} (edx@pD9EAA47D.dip.t-dialin.net)
21:49:14trackHi scott666
21:49:44scott666hey
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21:50:54track:)
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21:57:15 Join prelude [0] (~prez@209.88.139.179)
21:57:17preludehey
21:57:23trackhey prelude
21:57:40preludeanyone know how much the sound quality differs from a archos fm recorder 20 to say an apple ipod?
21:58:21trackwell I have heard the ipod sound doesn't have as much bass or fullness
21:58:54trackeven my old Creative Labs Nomad sounded tinny compared to the archos
21:59:02preludetinny?
21:59:48trackwell the Nomad didn't go as loud, plus the sound was a lot thinner compared to the Archos's
22:00
22:00:06preludeoh
22:00:13preludecool
22:00:16trackThe Ipods also scratch easily
22:00:28preludewell the archos break easily dont they?
22:00:58trackmine has never broken
22:01:06trackand that is from 3 years of solid use eveyday
22:01:09trackeveryday
22:01:11preludenice
22:01:14preludeyou got a 20 gig one?
22:01:42trackno, the older 10 gigger
22:01:48trackwith the irritating USB1.1 port
22:02:22 Nick edx{shower} is now known as edx{eatz} (edx@pD9EAA47D.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:02:46tracktakes forever to download 4gb worth of music to it in one go
22:03:48 Quit oxygen77 ("ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/7]")
22:08:24scott666if you get one get a v1 recorder
22:08:44trackI have a V1 recorder
22:08:48trackits a recorder 10
22:09:22scott666i have an FMR, which needs a visit from dr. soldering iron
22:09:32trackthose FMRs were never on sale for long
22:09:41trackWhat is the FM reception like?
22:09:52scott666terrible
22:10:01scott666at least when i tried to use it
22:10:03trackoh
22:10:06scott666i dont listen to the radio much anyway
22:10:09trackperhaps u was in a crappy signal ara
22:10:10trackarea
22:11:31trackWhat is the difference between the FMR and the V2 apart from no radio?
22:11:55scott666none
22:12:06scott666except for the text on the body
22:12:09trackoh ok
22:12:25trackalright what is the difference between the recorder 20 and the V2
22:12:43scott666the batteries and the case
22:12:46trackah
22:12:57scott666also digital I/O is someohow crippled on the FMR
22:13:01trackyea
22:13:06scott666theres no i...or o
22:13:09scott666something
22:13:18trackWho knows the SCMS hack on the normal Recorders?
22:14:24Zagoryou don't need it with rockbox
22:14:47trackso with Rockbox you can use the digital I/O without SCMS restrictions?
22:15:00Zagoryes
22:15:01 Join _aLF [0] (~alexandre@mutualite-3-82-67-66-128.fbx.proxad.net)
22:15:04trackcool
22:15:14trackPerhaps thats why Archos don't use Rockbox, because it lacks SCMS
22:15:21trackthey don't want to be sued by the RIAA or the like
22:15:37Zagornot likely
22:16:04trackwell thats my theory anyway. But Even Archos know how much better rockbox is than the archos f/w Zagor.
22:16:21scott666#rockbox
22:16:50trackWhatever happened to Joquams' interface?
22:16:51tracklol
22:17:26trackthe only good bit was it was the first to have an inverted video line
22:19:48 Quit track ()
22:20:21 Join track [0] (track@ACBE9153.ipt.aol.com)
22:20:47trackoops accidently got disconnected
22:21:08trackPrelude u still there?
22:21:12preludewhat up
22:21:23trackdid u get ur usb issue sorted?
22:21:33preludenope the hard drive is dead for sure
22:21:55tracksorry 2 hear that
22:22:09trackcant' understand how the hd would suddenly conk out
22:22:20preludewell it wasnt brand new
22:22:31trackHow old was it then?
22:22:36preludei didnt lose any money though
22:22:37preludenot sure
22:22:44preludethe credit card company did a charge back
22:22:50tracklol thats good then
22:22:59trackits not the money its also the inconvience
22:24:59trackso what device are u using now?
22:25:08preludenone
22:25:40trackwell i may change my player in the future
22:25:46tracki'd consider selling u mine
22:26:05trackbut I don't want to miss out on rockbox
22:26:12trackso im in a bit of a catch-22
22:26:21preludenah no offense but i dont want an older one
22:26:27trackno probs
22:26:46trackIf u have an email address I'll take a shot of it and send u a pic of it
22:26:51preludeif i cant get a cheap replacement for this one ill just trash it and get an iRiver probably
22:26:56preludehawk@phused.net
22:27:09trackok thanks
22:27:13tracklet me find my digicam
22:27:17 Join top_bloke [0] (~ekolb_pot@209.109.245.54)
22:27:22trackHi Topbloke
22:27:33top_blokehi
22:27:48top_blokeyou unbanned?
22:27:58tracklets not go there
22:28:03top_blokelol ok
22:28:04trackim on my very best behaviour now
22:28:08top_blokewow
22:28:14preludeso rockbox only works on archos right?
22:28:19trackFor the time being yes
22:28:22top_blokeno neo
22:28:30top_blokeor does it
22:28:30preludewhats so great about rockbox?
22:28:34trackIt depends what else Zagor has in mind, after all rockbox is his project
22:28:36top_blokeit owns.
22:30:13trackprelude im taking a shot of the archos now
22:30:20preludek
22:30:30top_blokeoh yea i got a digital camera
22:30:46trackIve got a pic but its slightly blurred prelude
22:30:49top_blokeit takes 2100 AAs but i have no charger
22:31:01top_blokecould i charge em in the archos?
22:31:05trackyea you could
22:31:11top_blokebut only 2
22:31:17trackno u need 4
22:31:21trackshouldn't mix batteries
22:31:23top_blokeoh
22:31:25top_blokeok
22:31:41top_bloketheyre Ni-MH
22:32:12top_blokeplus i couldnt get the batts out of the archos when i tried
22:32:35tracksending
22:32:38tracksending
22:32:58trackok prelude its sent
22:35:39trackZagor do u plan to work on the Gmini in the future?
22:39:22 Nick edx{eatz} is now known as edx{hw} (edx@pD9EAA47D.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:43:06 Quit methangas (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- IRC has never been so cool")
22:45:30preludetrack looks like u got a crack on the lcd
22:46:23trackthats just a reflection
22:46:26trackthere is no crack on the LCD
22:47:44 Join oxygen77 [0] (~Chris@pauguste-7-82-66-87-78.fbx.proxad.net)
22:47:44preludeah
22:49:11tracki think that reflection was caused by the camera's flash
22:50:58trackyea that pic was a bit rushed prelude
22:51:06preludenp
22:51:09Zagortrack: i don't know about the gmini. it depends on who volunteers information and code.
22:51:16trackoh ok. I was just curios
22:51:18trackCurious
22:51:39trackI think it uses a flash chip like the Multimedia and the AV3xx
22:51:55 Quit cjnr11 ()
22:52:57 Quit oxygen77 ("ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/7]")
22:54:34trackdoes Adiamas still work on Rockbox?
22:55:03trackhaven't seem around for ages
22:55:09Zagori don't know. haven't heard from him in a while.
22:55:34trackWell u must be in close contact with him
22:56:58trackI like to flash my archos but im way too afraid to do it
22:57:06top_blokeya me too
22:57:27trackif it goes wrong your archos is dead since the Archos ROM firmware is flashed over
22:57:49top_blokebut theres the back up?
22:57:52Zagorafaik *nobody* has failed
22:58:09trackIm not sure if my Recorder is flashable since its an early recorder 10
22:59:09top_blokecheck the menu
22:59:24trackok let me turn my Archos on
22:59:24top_blokei think in debug
22:59:33 Nick edx{hw} is now known as edx (edx@pD9EAA47D.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:59:52trackok im on the Menu screen
23:00
23:00:00top_blokedebug
23:00:02top_blokeand uh
23:00:18trackok im in debug
23:00:20top_blokeHW info?
23:00:27top_blokei dont know what its called really
23:00:44top_blokejust go to all of em :)
23:00:52trackOh yea Zagor apologies I see what you mean about the Atadore font and the system font
23:03:24tracksuch as in the system debug menus
23:03:54top_blokeu know USB dont work in the debug menus
23:04:12top_blokeit doesnt do anything when plugged in
23:04:36trackI think its designed to do that
23:04:37Zagorthe debug menus have more slack than the rest of the code. after all, they're debug menus... :)
23:04:51top_blokeyeah it says keep out right on it
23:04:54tracklol
23:05:15trackZagor I thought the USB was "hardware controlled" so even on the Debug menus the USB would take over if the cable was plugged in
23:05:40top_blokenah cause rockbox has its own usb
23:06:04Zagoryou're both wrong :)
23:06:11trackZagor! Im right!
23:06:13track:)
23:06:35Zagorusb is handled by hardware, but we have to make sure we don't access the disk while usb is connected. and rockbox naturally controls the display
23:06:55top_blokeoh
23:06:57trackoh ok Zagor
23:07:01trackyou are the top man
23:07:02track;-)
23:07:28top_blokebut you could ignore it if u want to right
23:07:55trackI must admit the normal Recorders are certainly not photogenic
23:08:05top_blokecause the archos didnt show up on the pc when in debug
23:08:43trackI mean they look like breeze blocks on the Archos website, but they are much smaller in real life
23:09:11top_blokearchos is pretty big
23:09:18top_blokecompared to new mp3 players
23:09:22trackyea
23:09:24Zagortop_bloke: yeah, we sort of have an usb on/off switch that we must trigger before it will work
23:09:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:09:31trackThey claim their new Gmini 220 is smaller than a floppy
23:09:33top_blokeok cool
23:10:01top_blokemy bro has a zen and he was shocked how heavy my archos is
23:10:11trackyet it packs a 20 gigger drive
23:10:31trackBut at least the rubber corners make the Archos more rugged
23:10:41top_blokelolol
23:10:51top_blokehe THREW his zen against the wall
23:10:59track:O!
23:10:59trackand?
23:11:06top_blokecause the headphones were dying out on 1 side
23:11:12top_blokeleft a DENT in the wall
23:11:15top_blokeand it works fine
23:11:19top_blokehes nuts
23:11:24tracklol
23:11:31top_blokegod
23:11:33tracku do that with an ipod it will smash into bits
23:11:50top_blokei wouldnt think a zen would survive it
23:12:04tracknah ipods are a waste of money
23:12:19top_bloketheyre sleek
23:12:23top_blokeand so is the zen
23:12:46trackThe normal Recorder is stylish in its own way
23:12:56top_blokeehhhh
23:13:28MTif you get mugged tho, you cant fight anyone off with a zen or an ipod
23:13:35tracki agree MT
23:13:36MTan archos you can do some serious damage with tho
23:13:38trackyea
23:13:38top_blokelol
23:13:49top_blokebut then it'd be broken :(
23:14:00MTthe reason you cant drop an archos is it might break the flooring slabs
23:14:05trackIve noticed the Player never gets a mention anymore :(
23:14:06top_blokelolol
23:14:33top_blokeyeah the archos weighs like a pound
23:14:35trackno-one likes the poor old Player :-(
23:14:49top_bloke:(
23:15:17trackThey still sell it on the website though
23:15:22trackZagor do you like the Player?
23:15:26top_blokearchos website?
23:15:39trackyea on the Archos webby
23:15:58top_blokei would have thought they forgot about it
23:16:13trackthey still sell it
23:16:16top_blokethey dont make it anymore right
23:16:26trackIve noticed that Rockbox is the only website that doesn't start with www
23:16:27MThmm, advancedmp3players have the xclef back in stock
23:16:34tracki.e not www.rockbox.haxx.se
23:16:37trackjust rockbox.haxx.se
23:16:41MTmy website doesnt start with www
23:16:43MTlots dont
23:16:46top_blokeu can put www
23:16:46trackoh
23:16:49top_blokecant u
23:16:51trackthats new to me
23:16:51MTimages.google.com doesnt
23:17:11top_blokei thought these days www is optional
23:17:24trackmaybe it is
23:17:52MTits neither
23:18:03trackoh ok
23:18:16trackI must admit 2x11 character cells is just useless
23:18:27MTa webserver can listen to any ip, regardless of what domain names that ip has assigned to it
23:19:42trackThe Play button on my Recorder is rather wonky
23:33:27trackHi Webmind
23:40:32 Quit track ()
23:42:45 Nick edx is now known as edx{code} (edx@pD9EAA47D.dip.t-dialin.net)

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