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#rockbox log for 2004-05-12

00:15:22 Join midk [0] (mk@ACC2AE13.ipt.aol.com)
00:23:34***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:29:20 Quit AciD (""Linux ? Ya moins bien, mais c'est plus cher"")
00:33:33 Quit friday101 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:42:09 Quit mecraw__ ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com)")
00:51:35bluEchiPJust so it's in the logs, this is me being concerned in case you (Badger) did not get why I laughed earlier ....The name "baGDer" made me smile, and I thought I'd share - no offense intended :)
00:52:03midk...
00:52:09midkWiNS cracks me up
00:52:14midkLOLACS
00:53:31bluEchiPcan't resist those little psychological tricks everywhere :)
00:53:51midkO WiNS
00:53:55midkLOLACSSSSSSSSSSSSS
01:00
01:03:20midkhmm
01:03:24midk*furious
01:18:22bluEchiPfound lots of room for speed improvement in the line drawing algorithm
01:18:35bluEchiPand smaller code too!
01:18:53midkdrawline?
01:18:57bluEchiPyeah
01:19:06midkOMFG PINCH ME
01:19:09midkjk
01:21:09midkhmm well i think i'm going to add a statusbar to breakout bc
01:21:14bluEchiPand if you are only drawing 90 and 45 degree lines - it's a killer
01:21:23midkwe'll have to move down the top if i do
01:21:31bluEchiPwe?
01:21:33bluEchiPlol
01:21:35midki'll!
01:22:06bluEchiPif you coded it like i suggested, that will take a single line of code to ensure everything still works
01:22:15bluEchiPif not, then you have your work cut out
01:22:17midkoyes?
01:22:33midk*starts over
01:25:16bluEchiPthe lot?
01:26:08midkpretty much
01:26:14midki have to do a bit of work on it
01:26:21midki have to move the whole overlay down a row
01:26:26midkand everything else up one
01:26:31midkand add the statusbar
01:26:49bluEchiP#define TopLine 10+4
01:27:11midkwhy 10+4?
01:27:21bluEchiPwas at 10, now is 4 lower
01:27:40bluEchiP(10+4) actually
01:28:11midk4 lower... it's going to be 8 high
01:28:18bluEchiPTHAT TOO
01:28:20bluEchiPthat too
01:28:28midkwait then where did the 4 come from?
01:28:34bluEchiPWHATEVER
01:29:06midkum
01:29:09midkyessir
01:29:19bluEchiPsir - lol
01:29:29midkyes sir funny sir
01:29:35midkmidk assclown, sir
01:31:06midkso 10+8?
01:31:22bluEchiPno idea - only you knwo where from and where to
01:31:38midki don't know where the 10 came from originally
01:31:41midki think it should be just 10
01:31:45midk8 for the text
01:31:48midk2 for the line under it
01:31:53midkmake that 11.
01:31:56bluEchiPas you wish
01:32:01midkTY TY
01:32:04midkor 10
01:32:09midkso it hits the line?
01:32:13midkyou decide bc
01:32:17midki need you to decide for me
01:32:35midk11 so it bounces 1px away from the line, or 10 so it hits the line and bounces?
01:33:30bluEchiPdont worry - if its one line of code - you can correct it later if you want
01:33:40midkok i'll say 10
01:34:06midk#define BALL_MIN_Y 10 /* farthest up the ball can go */
01:34:08midk>_<
01:34:56bluEchiP#define Top 10 /* top of play area*/
01:35:08bluEchiPwhatever - the longer the variable, the more you have to type
01:35:13midkbut BALL_MIN_Y ties in well with my other stuff
01:35:19midk#define BALL_MAX_Y 55
01:35:20midk#define BALL_MAX_TALL_Y 55 /* farthest down the ball can go with tall paddle */
01:35:20midk#define BALL_MAX_SHORT_Y 56 /* farthest down the ball can go with short paddle */
01:35:20DBUGEnqueued KICK midk
01:35:20midk#define BALL_MIN_Y 10 /* farthest up the ball can go */
01:35:20midk#define BALL_MAX_X 105 /* farthest right the ball can go */
01:35:20***Alert Mode level 1
01:35:20midk#define BALL_MIN_X 1 /* farthest left the ball can go */
01:35:58bluEchiP#define bXmin (1)
01:36:28midkhmm
01:36:37bluEchiP#define bXmax (LCD_WIDTH-1-ballW)
01:36:37midkgood idea bc.
01:36:56bluEchiPmay not need -1
01:37:31midki like -1 OYES
01:37:37bluEchiPthen you have
01:37:37bluEchiPint bX, bY; /* ball X,Y */
01:37:46midkint ball_x = 34; /* ball start position (x) */
01:37:47midkint ball_y = 34; /* ball start position (y) */
01:37:56bluEchiPif (bX<bXmin) whatever
01:38:02midki'll make that bX and bY though
01:38:08bluEchiPwhatver you like
01:38:12midkjust a moment here
01:38:13bluEchiPi hate typing
01:38:17midklol
01:38:20midkyessir sir
01:39:26bluEchiPlove the way US call everyone "sir", outside of business it's quite the insult in the UK
01:39:35midkoh sorry
01:39:39bluEchiPnp
01:39:44midki think that's your way of saying "stop it"
01:39:45midklol
01:40:01bluEchiPmore of a "yeah right" or a "f you"
01:40:15midki was going to say that i swear
01:42:17bluEchiPhow many greyscales are really useable?
01:42:24bluEchiP...in a game
01:42:30midkup to 33
01:42:51amiconnbluEchiP: I'm currently looking at your starfield demo code.
01:42:56midkOH I LOVE IT
01:43:05midkAHEMFLYTHRUSPACEAAEEMMMMMMM
01:43:05bluEchiPerrrrr - it's just been vastly improved - but yes?
01:43:22midk*coughs to cover up that loud noise
01:44:18bluEchiPcomment on the confusing use of "int t;" will cause me to cringe for the second time tonight - LOL
01:44:22amiconnI wonder why you are using so many I8 / UI8.
01:44:35midki love ui32.
01:44:45amiconnThis is actually slower most of the time and generates more asm instructions than using UI32 / I32 on a 32bit machine like the SH
01:45:02bluEchiPhmm
01:45:07midkdid bc just get told?
01:45:10midkheh jk
01:45:16midkno keep ui32
01:45:17midki like it
01:45:21***Alert Mode OFF
01:45:54bluEchiPthat's handy to know - thanks
01:46:27bluEchiPnow you've got me wondering what to do about sprite data
01:47:22amiconnOf course you have to use byte width for byte data like sprites, but I recommend using int for coordinates
01:47:47bluEchiPyes,thanks - that show() routine would be a fair chunk faster with that knowledge me thinks
01:47:57amiconnSecond thing that puzzles me is your line algorithm - "else if (deltay)" with an comment saying /* horz */
01:48:21bluEchiPOUCH!
01:48:21amiconnShouldn't this read "else if (!deltay)" ?
01:48:32bluEchiPyes indeed - lol
01:48:42midkamiconn ooh
01:48:56bluEchiPdo you like the use of "int t" in the show() routine?
01:49:31amiconnAnd the last thing - you call these routines sprite routines, but imo they aren't, because they don't save the background.
01:50:10midkbad boy bc
01:50:31midkso amiconn
01:50:37midkif i move the overlay down 1 row
01:50:48midkanything that uses a gray function will have to be moved up basically?
01:51:01bluEchiPthree answers to that ...
01:51:10bluEchiP1. they're now called "bc" routines because I am about to jack in using the core rand() function which is FAR too costly for me
01:51:17bluEchiP2) they are very much in their infancy
01:51:55amiconnA final one - using rb->memset() in spr_CLS() would be very likely much faster than using a loop.
01:52:04bluEchiP3) the way I have it all mapped in my head atm, saving the background will not be relevant, as the sprites will exist on different layers
01:52:23amiconnmidk: yes
01:52:23bluEchiPblinding idea - THANK YOU
01:52:28midkbc lol
01:52:31midkty ami
01:53:03bluEchiPi presume memset lives in iram
01:53:12midkgah this is NOT good.
01:53:20midki may just use gray bitmaps for the numbers
01:53:36amiconnbluEchiP: Yes it does, and it is fully asm optimized :)
01:54:09amiconnmidk: I really consider adding font support to the framework.
01:54:27midki certainly can't move this up.
01:54:38midki suppose i'll use bitmaps then until font support is added
01:54:38bluEchiPmk: feel free to nick the starfield stuff
01:54:39midkthanks though
01:54:45midkheh ty
01:55:17amiconnFont support demands to change another thing in the framework first, namely gray_drawbitmap()
01:56:06bluEchiPmy god - it's in assembler - wow - cool
01:56:36amiconngray_drawbitmap() will be changed to use the same bitmap format as lcd_bitmap(), so you can use bmp2rb to make bitmaps for it as well.
01:56:56bluEchiPwhat is that format do you know?
01:56:58midkcalm down bc
01:57:01midkdo you know assembly?
01:57:08bluEchiPlol - just a wee bit
01:57:13midkami: i'll use the drawgraymap
01:57:19midkprobably keep it actually
01:57:24midkTHATS A REALLY GOOD IDEA!
01:57:29midk*keeps idea for self
01:57:38midkit would match my splash screen font.
01:58:10 Join silencer_ [0] (~silencer@adsl.via.ecp.fr)
01:58:20amiconnmidk: gray_drawgraymap() will stay with it's current format, only gray_drawbitmap will change.
01:58:32midki'm going to use drawgraymap
01:58:35midkeasier and better
01:58:41midkmaybe i'll grayshade my font
01:58:44midkoyah oyah oyah.
01:59:20bluEchiPami - do you think that 33 shades are really visible in a game?
02:00
02:00:30amiconnImo the maximum of 33 shades is too slow for a game, I would only use 8..16. 33 shades is for image viewers or such.
02:00:41midki use 8
02:00:55bluEchiP8 and 16, not 9 and 17?
02:01:04midkdahaha.
02:01:19midkamiconn: did you say you were creating a jpg or bmp reader?
02:01:54 Quit silencer (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
02:02:00bluEchiPif you are, you may be delighted to know that ID3 specifies the standard image size as 64x64 (although supports anything)
02:02:05amiconnmidk: [IDC]Dragon is developing a jpeg viewer (which basically already works as he told me)
02:02:30midki want to see.
02:02:40amiconnNext thing I'm thinking of is (1) using draw modes to shorten the code a bit and (2) optimized drawing routines.
02:02:50midkthere's an album art id3 info tag
02:04:18bluEchiPami: how many "register int x"'s am i likely to get away with, and does it assign them from the top of the declaration list down ....do you know?
02:04:18amiconnmidk: The jpeg vewer cannot run in parallel to music playback, as it has to use the playback buffer
02:04:37midkaw
02:04:53bluEchiPblimey - i knew it was big - but i didn't know it was THAT bit
02:05:12 Join silencer [0] (~silencer@138.195.149.157)
02:05:29amiconnbluEchiP: I don't know about the assignment sequence - the gcc optimizer sometimes does very odd things.
02:06:43amiconnMost of the time you don't really need to explicitly require "register"
02:07:06amiconnAs long as you don't reference a variable's address and the scope of that variable is not too large, it will be put in a register.
02:07:38bluEchiPcool - i must say, i am mighty impressed with what our compiler does
02:08:01amiconnIf you want to know for sure which variable is registered and which is not, you have to disassemble the object module.
02:08:16bluEchiPyes, i must look into the assembly at some point
02:08:38bluEchiPi've not looked at it AT ALL yet :(
02:09:21amiconnThe odd thing with the gcc optimizer is - while being very clever at some spots, it does not do obvious optimizations in other spots.
02:10:05bluEchiPI suppose the guy who wrote it had to stop somewhere - but it is often annoying to find glaring omissions
02:11:15amiconnThe best example for that was the recording data transfer loop (before I optimized it). There I could see both behaviours close together.
02:11:36 Join george_4_man [0] (Joosa@ool-44c4728b.dyn.optonline.net)
02:12:02george_4_mancan anyone help me with cygwin please?
02:12:20 Join scott666_ [0] (~scott666@24.245.59.203)
02:12:37bluEchiPami: I've got a whole bunch of new optimisations for existing code ...I should submit them to you - you can claim the work and they will get included :)
02:13:10bluEchiPami: you might be interested to compare my mods to the bressenham algorithm
02:13:42bluEchiPgeorge_4_man: yes, but for the next 3 minutes I am making tea - queue up some questions while I am gone :)
02:14:02george_4_manokay
02:14:23george_4_mani tried to do a make, but sh-elf-gcc doesn't exist, where may i find that?
02:14:26amiconnbluEchiP: Yes, that is one thing I want to try (at first within the grayscale framework).
02:15:31amiconngeorge_4_man: See http://rockbox.haxx.se/docs/cygwin_sdk.html , especially step 3
02:15:48george_4_manyeah, i'm on that right now, i did everything
02:16:39amiconnHmm. You did install the sh-gcc and sh-binutils packages?
02:16:43george_4_manyeah
02:16:57george_4_mancould it have something to do with not being able to download the setup.ini?
02:17:10amiconnPerhaps you should look where in the cygwin dir structure the executables are located.
02:17:22george_4_manfor what?
02:17:24 Quit silencer_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:18:21amiconnTo know (1) if they are really there and (2) for knowing their path. Perhaps they are in a path that isn't included in the search path of the shell by default.
02:18:47george_4_manit's not in there
02:19:29 Join silencer_ [0] (~silencer@nino.via.ecp.fr)
02:19:29 Quit silencer (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
02:19:48midkback in 30 or less
02:20:07george_4_manah, i found it, thanks
02:20:10 Quit midk (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
02:20:30amiconngeorge_4_man: where?
02:20:53george_4_manopt/sh1
02:21:23amiconnSo next thing is to check your search path:
02:21:31george_4_mani just copied it to bin
02:21:38george_4_manis that a bad thing?
02:22:05bluEchiPgeorge_4_man: i can heartily reccomend the dev kit on my home page
02:22:25amiconnThat's another alternative, but I prefer to not put things that don't belong to genuine cygwin into /bin
02:23:04george_4_manso how do i change the search path?
02:23:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:24:49 Join midk [0] (mk@AC87045A.ipt.aol.com)
02:25:20amiconngeorge_4_man: One moment, have to take a look.
02:25:43george_4_mank thanks
02:39:46 Part george_4_man
02:42:05amiconnGrr, now he is gone. It took me quite a while to find it; there are definitely too many ways to do something in unix.
02:42:28scott666_heh
02:42:34 Nick scott666_ is now known as scott666 (~scott666@24.245.59.203)
02:43:00bluEchiPmaybe he got kicked and plans to return :)
02:43:46bluEchiPwell, *I'VE* implemented all your suggestions, so you ARE appreciated - actually, what is more appreicated is your proof reading my code for me :)
02:44:29amiconnDid you update starfield.c on the web already?
02:44:45bluEchiPtake me 10 seconds....
02:44:58bluEchiPactually, let me just check it still compiles
02:45:29bluEchiPdone
02:49:40amiconn(1) You can optimize the coordinate bounds checks by doing "if ( (unsigned) x >= LCD_WIDTH || (unsigned) y >= LCD_HEIGHT)"
02:49:45amiconn(That reminds me that I wanted to use that as well..)
02:50:14bluEchiPwhich line?
02:50:48amiconnE.g. in bc_plot()
02:50:53bluEchiPoh yes, very cool
02:50:59bluEchiP(found it as you said)
02:51:49 Join silencer [0] (~silencer@adsl.via.ecp.fr)
02:52:05bluEchiPthat's a real hoopy bit of thinking there :)
02:52:23bluEchiP(whoopy?)
02:53:06bluEchiP(as in "saz that hoopy Ford Prefect there's a cool frood who really knows where his towel is")
02:53:24 Quit midk (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
02:54:10amiconnbluEchiP: Dito in bc_line(), only that the condition(s) is/are reversed.
02:55:16bluEchiPi've also noticed that "abs(expression)" causes the expression to encoded thrice and calculated twice
02:55:48 Quit silencer_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:56:14 Join friday101 [0] (~why@pcp06796835pcs.bowie01.md.comcast.net)
02:56:19 Join silencer_ [0] (~silencer@nino.via.ecp.fr)
02:56:40friday101SOMEONE PLEASE FIX THE HEBREW FONT PROBLEM!
02:56:45friday101gooday!
02:56:48 Quit friday101 (Client Quit)
02:57:01scott666lol
02:57:11bluEchiPlol
02:57:34bluEchiPi'm sure there's a good jewish joke in that somewhere
02:57:40scott666drive-by feature requests
02:57:44bluEchiPlol
02:58:28bluEchiPi thought jews were stereo-typically supposed to be frugal with money not manners
02:58:44bluEchiP(best i could come up with at short notice)
02:59:13 Quit arspy87 ("Leaving")
02:59:50scott666yeah, i was trying to think of one
03:00
03:00:34 Quit silencer (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
03:01:34 Join midk [0] (mk@AC838038.ipt.aol.com)
03:01:42 Join silencer [0] (~silencer@nino.via.ecp.fr)
03:02:37amiconnbluEchiP: Apart from 3 locations in bc_line() where the optimized bounds check would be applicable, I didn't find more things.
03:02:58bluEchiPfantastic - thanks for your time :)
03:03:14bluEchiPI'm wondering if the abs can be optimised
03:03:58midkabs.
03:04:02midkhi bc and ami
03:04:17amiconnbluEchiP: I did not find an abs() in your code ?!
03:04:27bluEchiPin bc_line()
03:04:37bluEchiPdeltax and deltay
03:05:15 Quit silencer_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:06:17amiconnAh oops, you already tried to replace it.
03:06:22bluEchiPdeltax = abs(x2-x1)
03:06:22bluEchiPbecomes
03:06:22bluEchiP deltax = x2-x1; if (deltax<0) deltax = (~deltax)+1;
03:06:22DBUGEnqueued KICK bluEchiP
03:06:22bluEchiP??
03:06:52bluEchiPsorry - what is there atm is wrong
03:07:03amiconnUnfortunately, your "&= 0x7FFFF" can't work.
03:07:05bluEchiPi just stripped the sign - I didn't 2's it
03:07:34midkho to you too.
03:07:55amiconntoot
03:08:17bluEchiPwhat do you think to the above idea?
03:09:33amiconnAbout that: deltax = x2-x1; if (deltax<0) deltax = (~deltax)+1 ?
03:09:38bluEchiPyes
03:09:52midkis the rule, no c++ style comments?
03:10:00bluEchiPyes
03:10:11bluEchiPhandy for debugging though
03:10:11midkdah.
03:10:31 Join silencer_ [0] (~silencer@adsl.via.ecp.fr)
03:10:32amiconnI think this will generate almost the same code as simply using deltax = abs(x2-x1);
03:11:05bluEchiPit's that "almost" I'm counting on
03:11:50amiconnSince this is only called twice in your function, it should have a neglectible impact on performance.
03:12:04bluEchiPbut it IS in drawline()
03:12:14bluEchiPwhich is quite a popular graphical call
03:12:43amiconnIf you really want it fast, you'd have to use asm.
03:13:14midkamiconn: as bc was saying, usually the gray in my breakout paddle is sort of flickery −− any way to sort of smooth it out?
03:13:45bluEchiPyes, I supopse as have no plans to submit the code to Rockbox, I do not need to conform to their coding standards - hmmm
03:14:38amiconnYou can code your "if(deltax < 0) deltax = (~deltax)+1" with only 2 asm instructions...
03:15:01amiconnOops, 3 instructions of course
03:15:05bluEchiPlol
03:15:52amiconnmidk: As I did not see it yet, I can't tell for sure, maybe not.
03:16:31 Join Mylacc [0] (~Mylacc@63-174-114-63.uterr.blacksburg.ntc-com.net)
03:19:24 Quit silencer (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
03:21:57amiconnbluEchiP: deltax = x2 - x1; asm ("cmp/pz %0 \n bt 1f \n neg %0,%0 \n 1: \n" : "+r"(deltax) );
03:22:39CtcpIgnored 3 channel CTCP requests in 5 hours and 45 minutes at the last flood
03:22:39*bluEchiP stares at code until it makes sense
03:22:46amiconnOf course this is machine dependent, so to be surrounded with #ifndef SIMULATOR .. #endif
03:23:40MylaccWhat does Dir Buffer is full mean? I know it means that it wont display the directories but with is the max amount or how do i fix this?
03:23:48bluEchiPin the menu
03:24:53bluEchiPbut i'll be blown if I can find it
03:25:42bluEchiPgeneral->system->limits
03:26:14Mylaccok, found that
03:26:27Mylaccfirst is max files in dir
03:26:34Mylaccand the second is max playlist size
03:26:46Mylaccmy problem is max dirs
03:26:47Mylacci think
03:27:03Mylaccbecause there are only 3000 mp3s and my max files in dir is set to 4000
03:27:11Mylaccso that shouldnt be the problem
03:27:21bluEchiPhm - what version do you run?
03:27:42Mylacc2.2
03:27:46Mylaccv2 recorder
03:28:12bluEchiPami: can i replace the "\n"'s with real newlines for readable? - sorry, I never did get my ahead around this presentation of assembler
03:28:25bluEchiPMylacc: 2.2 - release or daily build?
03:28:30Mylaccrelease
03:28:50bluEchiPtry a daily build - cos it may have been found and fixed
03:29:06Mylaccok, thanks, will do
03:29:07amiconnMylacc: The default for max files in dir is 400. This shouldn't be set too high; it's sufficient to set this just above the maximum number of mp3s that you have _in one dir_
03:29:09bluEchiPproblem is all the devs use daily, so help on release stuff is difficult to obtain
03:29:46bluEchiPami: is there a doc somewhere that explains this asm format?
03:30:16amiconnbluEchiP: You can split the asm code string into several lines, but the \n's inside the string must remain.
03:30:24bluEchiPok - cheers
03:30:54amiconnYes, see http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-3.0.4/gcc_5.html#SEC68 , section 5.36
03:31:14midkbcbccc
03:31:30amiconnThis is how I write longer asm blocks in that format:
03:31:35amiconnasm(
03:31:58amiconn"cmp/pz %0 \n"
03:32:24amiconn"bt 1f \n"
03:32:37amiconn"neg %0,%0 \n"
03:32:48amiconn"1: \n"
03:33:01amiconn: /* outputs */
03:33:45amiconn./* %0, in & out */ "+r"(deltax)
03:33:50amiconn);
03:34:21amiconn(sorry the dot at the start of the second last line shouldn't be there)
03:34:37bluEchiPtanks
03:34:38bluEchiPthanks
03:34:54bluEchiPwhat is the "1:" ?
03:35:21Mylaccsorry, this might be a dumb question but did the file format chance? there is no .rockbox directory, only a rockbox-daily-20040511 directory
03:35:40bluEchiPdid you download source code or build?
03:35:55amiconnThe 1: is a local label (target for the bt instruction)
03:36:05Mylaccha
03:36:08Mylaccgood call, thanks
03:36:23bluEchiPoh! - so what's the "f" in "bt 1f" then ...forward reference?
03:36:49bluEchiPi had guessed that 1f was a hex value specifying the branch distance
03:37:01amiconnyup, 1f means "jump to the next "1" label you find in "f"orward direction.
03:37:07bluEchiPMylacc: lol ;)
03:38:14bluEchiPso "bt heref" would match with "here:" ???
03:38:32bluEchiPsorry, i must be sounding really thick right now
03:39:21amiconnno, because "here" wouldn't be a local label. To match "here:", you would have to use "bt here".
03:40:11amiconnThe asm above is explained quickly:
03:40:18 Join silencer [0] (~silencer@nino.via.ecp.fr)
03:41:04bluEchiPshould i presume asm( "code" : %0 : %1 : %2 : %3 );
03:41:09amiconn"+r"(deltax) specifies that deltax is both an input and output parameter, and it should be put in a register.
03:41:39amiconnAs this is the first parameter, that register will be referenced with %0 within the asm.
03:41:57bluEchiPunderstood
03:42:51 Quit silencer_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
03:42:57amiconnThe first instruction "cmp/pz %0" is "compare if %0 is _p_ositive or _z_ero.
03:43:01MylaccI have over 125 folder in one directory, is this causing the problem cause it's still happening
03:43:52amiconnIf yes, it sets the t condition flag, otherwise it resets it.
03:44:21bluEchiPyep - i'm pretty cool with the assembler, just not the inline thing
03:44:43amiconnOk then.
03:44:46bluEchiPcheers
03:45:26bluEchiPI must pull down the SH1 programmers docs and learn them all - but I used to write BIOSes for a living, so asm as a concept is well understood by a stray corner of my grey matter
03:45:44amiconnThe syntax within the asm() string is the same as for pure asm, except of the %0 thing.
03:46:16bluEchiPthat's cool - there seem to be lots of weird things to learn about what starts happening after the colons
03:46:23amiconnSH1 asm is not really hard to learn - since it is a risc machine, there aren't that many instruction.
03:46:42bluEchiPrisc - cool - my last disasm was for a risc chip
03:46:52amiconnI learned it in a few days.
03:47:19amiconnIf you really want to optimize, there are some pitfalls, though.
03:47:23bluEchiPwrote a documenting disassmebler for a series of RISC based CPUs
03:47:39bluEchiPMIPS-X core
03:48:03bluEchiPpitfalls?
03:48:25bluEchiParguments with gcc?
03:49:19amiconnNo, within the asm itself I mean. There are situations where an instruction sequence would cause a pipeline stall, which can be resolved by re-ordering.
03:50:02bluEchiPyou wanna try dealing with "delayed branching" - that's a mind blower
03:50:38amiconnYou have to - unconditional branches are always delayed branches with the sh.
03:51:06bluEchiPhow many delay slots?
03:51:12amiconnOne.
03:51:27bluEchiPthat's not too bad
03:51:51bluEchiPtwo slots really forces the abusive use of NOP
03:52:10amiconnAnother thing: Don't use a register you load from memory in one instruction within the next instruction.
03:52:58amiconnNext: Keep memory load/store instructions at longword boundaries (if executing from 32 bit memory, i.e. IRAM)
03:53:17amiconnThere are a few others.
03:53:18bluEchiPfully and completely understood
03:53:28bluEchiP(at a silicon level)
03:53:39bluEchiPthanks for the heads up
03:53:52bluEchiPyou can write some GREAT code if you try to though
03:54:11bluEchiPit's great for getting reference addresses to variables
03:55:27 Quit silencer (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:55:44amiconnHave a look at lcd.S as well as copy_read_data() and copy_write_data() in ata.c for some really tricky optimizations.
03:56:37bluEchiPld r1,100[r2]
03:56:38bluEchiPld r3,r1
03:56:38bluEchiP...r3 = 100+r2
03:56:41amiconn(all 3 end up in IRAM, so rule #2 above applies. However, plugin code does not.)
03:57:13 Join silencer [0] (~silencer@138.195.149.157)
03:58:28amiconnOoops, copy_read_sectors() and copy_write_sectors() of course.
03:58:35MylaccOK, i reordered the folders to letters in the alphabet so i am assuming 125+ folder was the problem
03:59:06bluEchiPcan you report that to the mailing list pleae so it does not get forgotten about
03:59:16bluEchiP^^ @ Mylacc
03:59:30amiconnI should really get some sleep now.
03:59:42midkbc
03:59:43midkpm
03:59:44midk?
03:59:46bluEchiPamiconn: thank you for all your help - it is greatly appreciated
03:59:51midknite ami
03:59:59bluEchiPsleep good my friend
04:00
04:00:13amiconnnite
04:00:19 Part amiconn
04:00:39Mylaccok, will do
04:00:54Mylaccsubscribing first
04:00:54Mylacclol
04:03:57Mylaccok, once i get the address i will send it out, prolly tomorrow since i did a daily mailing
04:04:13Mylaccthanks for your help
04:04:14bluEchiPnice one dude
04:04:18bluEchiPyou're welcome
04:23:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:24:12 Join Strath__ [0] (aopen@216.165.135.240)
04:24:25 Nick Strath__ is now known as Strath (aopen@216.165.135.240)
04:24:29midkstrathy.
04:24:49Strathhey midi
04:25:01midkwhat's up?
04:25:28Strathjust getting back to work on that emulator code
04:25:44Strathfirst i've been in my office all day...
04:25:54midkhmm how's it coming?
04:26:38bluEchiPso, mk, you gonna name the challenge for the coding compo publicly?
04:26:52midkcoding compo?
04:27:02bluEchiPlol
04:27:23Strathnot too bad, getting the I/O implemented, figuring out the specific memory mapping of the device, etc... fun stuff :)
04:27:23midkwell sure
04:27:23midklet's see who can finish my breakout game first.
04:27:23midkgo for it!
04:27:25bluEchiPlol
04:27:31Strathdone
04:27:48Strathoh, wait... you meant writing it, not playing it?
04:28:09midkwriting
04:28:17midkyou must suck at breakout if you are done so soon
04:28:20midkPAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
04:28:23midkum yeah.
04:28:51Strathheh, never said i didn't :P
04:29:08midki never said you did
04:29:35bluEchiPmk, stop acting your age - lol
04:29:38Straththough had the thought never entered your mind that maybe i was running it on an emu at many times normal speed?!? hrm!?
04:29:42midkLOL bc
04:29:50midkbc stop acting like a baby
04:29:52midkoh you are one
04:29:54midkPAHAHAHAHA
04:29:54bluEchiPwahhh
04:29:55midkHAHAHAHAHAHA
04:29:58midkAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
04:30:04midk*coughs
04:30:09Strathchildren, children... please
04:30:12 Quit Mylacc ("«»«»« 7th SpaRRow v5.2 by SpinoC at http://jump.to/sparrow »«»")
04:30:14Strath;)
04:30:20midkchildren, BABY you meanm
04:30:22midkmean*
04:30:26midkADAGAAHAHAHAHA
04:30:31midkno the baby is bc btw.
04:31:06Strathya... yer all relativly babies....
04:31:12midkyou too then
04:31:21midkNO NOT FAIIIIIIIIR
04:31:25midkYOUUUUU TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
04:31:34Strath*snicker*
04:31:38bluEchiPhey Strath, back me up on this ...I've gotta try and save mk, 3000 lines of code ...when defining a font, use a 2d array and not loads of 1d arrays
04:32:03midk3000 lines of code?
04:32:31bluEchiP(3000 comedic exaggeration)
04:32:37Strathwhy not use a single 1d array for all of the data?
04:32:38midkok
04:32:42midkOOOOH
04:32:44midkbc just got told
04:32:47midkfor the fourth time!
04:32:50midkTODAY!
04:32:58bluEchiPand index the start of each char how?
04:33:02midkmust feel pretty crunchy
04:33:16bluEchiPmk: <shhhh> ...listen ...you may learn something
04:33:24midkbc you will
04:33:26midkthat's for sure
04:33:33midkyou need an upgrade
04:33:43Strathhell, all a 2d array is, is a 1d array with your programing language taking care of the details
04:34:06bluEchiPso why would you choose to do the math yourself rather then letting the compiler do it?
04:34:33Strathindex the start of each char through pointer arithmatic
04:34:52midkheh bc
04:34:57midki already said i'd do it your way
04:35:00bluEchiPwhy not let the compiler do it?
04:35:14midkAL. READY. SAID. that I. WOULD DO. IT. YOUR WAY.
04:35:15Strathmasakistic(sp)?
04:35:28Strath(really sp)
04:35:29bluEchiPlol
04:35:33Strath*grin*
04:35:36bluEchiPmasochistic (fwiw)
04:35:51Strathtnx
04:36:12Strathi just love playing devil's advocate
04:36:32bluEchiPso if you were trying to write readable code quickly, would you go with ....1) bit 1d array 2) lots of little 1d arrays 3) big 2d array
04:36:41bluEchiPI kinda noticed
04:36:43bluEchiPlol
04:37:01midkit's almost like somebody set bluechip's bool annoy to TRUE
04:37:07midkHAHAHHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
04:37:08Strathhell, my emu code uses a 3d array
04:37:28bluEchiPI'm trying to save mk a bunch of aggro, but he seems to think it's just "my way" rather than just a "good choice"
04:37:42Straththere is one declaration that is char[400][10]
04:37:54midkit's your way obviously, you won't stop bothering me about it even after i already said i'd do it that way
04:38:11midkit seems to me like you're trying to convince strath to take your side so i'll think it's an even better idea
04:38:34bluEchiPmk: <shhhh> ...listen
04:38:34Strathjust gotta be *more* right, :)
04:38:44*Strath is the same way
04:38:51bluEchiPStrath ...you are evil!
04:38:54bluEchiPLOL
04:38:56midkbc: nerd!
04:39:59bluEchiPmk: you might like to look up the term "devils advocate"
04:40:19Straththree hour debate at 2am about the relative similarities of the java VM and emulators in general....
04:40:20midkbc: you might want to look up the term "eat me"
04:40:53bluEchiPSorry dude, I'm striaght
04:41:03midkTWEEZERS WITH PADS
04:41:04Strathin the hallway of a dorm
04:41:17bluEchiPwith one sock on
04:41:20midkwait you just became straight?
04:41:31Strathanyway... use what feels right for the given task
04:42:23bluEchiPso you suggest that newbie-c-guy should use a 3d array for his font - that'll be fun code to read :)
04:42:40midkbc why overcomplicate it for me
04:43:08Strathif you understand a concept one way, don't use a less understood method just because it is said to be *more* right, the odds of producing buggy code shoot way up.
04:43:15bluEchiPstrath is the dude with all the cool coding ideas - i'm a K.I.S.S kinda guy
04:43:20midkcorrect.
04:44:00bluEchiPStrath: fair call ...mk: in which case i suggest you go back to the massive switch statement idea
04:44:13midkyou were just rooting for a 2d array
04:44:20midkdoes strath really have that much power over you?
04:44:56bluEchiPi like his style
04:45:04Strathi throw out "cool coding ideas" to expose alternate methods, then use the resulting concurence of those involved.
04:45:23bluEchiPhave you seen my Starfeld demo yet?
04:45:39midkbc: me?
04:45:47bluEchiPsorry, no, Strath
04:45:59Strathstating "trueisms" is fun :)
04:46:14Strathhrm?
04:46:34bluEchiPi spend two hours debating bresenhams optimisations tonight
04:46:37bluEchiPlol
04:46:49bluEchiPStrath: hvae you seen my Starfield "maxi demo"
04:46:56Strathnope
04:47:03bluEchiP(not quite a mega demo - lol)
04:47:14midkLOL
04:47:16Strathrockbox?
04:47:18bluEchiPthe rocks are not built fomr the latest source but...
04:47:19midki wanna see
04:47:30Strathif so, i don't have a compatible player
04:47:41bluEchiPhttp://homepage.ntlworld.com/cyborgsystems/Rockbox
04:47:42midklol strath
04:47:50midkhe was inferring that i should try it
04:47:55midkYou Don't Know BC
04:47:57bluEchiPits run on the sim too
04:48:30Strathwhich is why i'm working on reverse engineering the one i do have
04:49:14bluEchiP*it runs ....
04:49:31bluEchiPinfer = deduce ... imply = suggest
04:50:24Strathewe, macros.... :P
04:50:24midkin·fer
04:50:29midkTo hint; imply
04:52:07bluEchiPin US really? WOW ..."England & America; Two great nations seperated by one common language" <chruchill, i think>
04:52:20Strathsine tables... good
04:52:44midkbc did you get that definition?
04:53:57bluEchiPi have a sin table generator if you ever need one quickly
04:54:17midkk, avoid it
04:54:18midknice work btw
04:54:21Strathwhy for your string constants, did you use #define's rather than char* ?
04:55:16Strathlol /* what good C program would be lacking an int i ? */
04:55:35Strathvery useful comment :)
04:56:00midkbc
04:56:27midkyou messed up
04:56:37midkit's not homepage.ntlworld.com/rockbox
04:56:52midkits homepage.ntlworld.com/cyborgsystems/rockbox
04:56:55bluEchiPwhy the #define ...ummmmmmm, nope, can't come up with a reason ....luck of the draw I guess - lol
04:57:02Strathheh
04:57:22Strathya... been there :)
04:57:28midkhttp://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=infer&r=67
04:57:31midk#4
04:57:53bluEchiPas it is only referenced once, it shouldn't make any difference
04:58:51Strathand as dictionaries are based on common usage, it is people like you who caused #4 to be added ;P
04:59:09bluEchiPWell, it would seem that American is taking over as the new global language
04:59:36bluEchiPsadly i've never found a free English dictionary on the net
04:59:37Straththat is so depressing
05:00
05:00:03midkhmm bc
05:00:12midkdoes your starfield use grayscale?
05:00:29Strathwhy can't the world standardize on one of the nice asian languages?
05:01:56bluEchiPyay- cantonese - never be stuck for the "right" word again - LOL :)
05:02:12midkbc?
05:02:50Strath*grin*
05:02:59bluEchiPno mk, the distinct lack of "grey_" will back that up ...I very much doubt it is fast enough for all the crap I'm doing
05:03:21midkok did you see what i said about that error you made in your scroller?
05:04:38bluEchiPno
05:05:04midk19:56:37 | <midk> it's not homepage.ntlworld.com/rockbox
05:05:04midk19:56:52 | <midk> its homepage.ntlworld.com/cyborgsystems/rockbox
05:05:34bluEchiPD'OH
05:05:38bluEchiPcheers - fixed
05:05:59midk:)
05:07:07Strathinteresting: http://energy21.freeservers.com/as01.htm
05:07:13mike18ok smartie pants's
05:08:07mike18i tried making playlists and i just updated my rockbox version and the playlists dont save right or something > when i load them it says "end of song file" and when i load em in winamp theres nothing
05:08:11mike18what is wrong?
05:08:51Straththe file is empty?
05:08:58midklo
05:09:00midkl
05:09:09midkwow nice job strath
05:09:24Strathglad i could help ;)
05:09:36midkhaha
05:09:41mike18you're not very smart
05:09:43mike18:)
05:09:48mike18smartass more like it
05:10:12midkHAHA
05:10:34bluEchiPafaik - rockox does not write to the play list - check it both before and after use :)
05:11:18mike18ok i made them in winamp and loaded them from the mp3 player then saved em as a playslist to the mp3 player and emptiness
05:12:28bluEchiPsorry, i dont follow that sequence of events :(
05:14:25bluEchiP1. make playlist - 2. cehck with notepad 3. put on jukebox 4. use jukebox 5. opne list in notepad
05:16:14midkok bc
05:16:24midkcan you tell me about this 2d array?
05:16:48bluEchiPlook at my font file
05:17:31midkunsigned long/
05:17:49midkothelo.c right?
05:17:57bluEchiPno font9x9.h
05:18:20midkui32.
05:18:39 Join Ka___ [0] (~tkirk@65.216.194.2)
05:18:57midkla'y!
05:19:01midkka'y!
05:20:23bluEchiPjelly
05:20:34midkLOL
05:20:39 Quit c0utta (niven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
05:20:39NSplitniven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
05:20:39 Quit mbr (niven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
05:20:39 Quit Ka__ (niven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
05:21:53midkbc does it work the same for the drawgraymap format?
05:22:23bluEchiPyou would need to calculate the value differently
05:22:31midkright
05:22:33midki think
05:22:41bluEchiPbut the concept is still sound
05:22:48bluEchiPvalueS
05:22:52midkcan you help.
05:23:15NHealniven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
05:23:15NJoinc0utta [0] (~c0utta@125.cust38.nsw.dsl.ozemail.com.au)
05:23:23NJoinmbr [0] (~mb@stz-softwaretechnik.com)
05:23:43bluEchiPif you get everything but the numbers done, yes
05:24:12midkso fill in my font junk then ui32 my way out of irc?
05:24:56bluEchiPno idea
05:25:10midkk
05:25:13midkUI32
05:27:59bluEchiPi suggest when you draw each char you use a different keystroke for each greyscale
05:28:15midkdifferent keystroke?
05:28:22midk*watching movie
05:28:24midk"what now?"
05:28:26midklol
05:30:35bluEchiPok l8rz dude - enjoy the film
05:30:41midkno wait
05:30:43midkno no no
05:30:59midki always watch film whilst i code
05:34:02midkthis format can be used in the array right
05:34:02midkstatic unsigned char font_r[] = {
05:34:02midk 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, /* |#####| */
05:34:02DBUGEnqueued KICK midk
05:34:02midk 0, 255, 255, 255, 0, /* |# #| */
05:34:02midk 0, 255, 255, 255, 0, /* |# #| */
05:34:02***Alert Mode level 1
05:34:02***Alert Mode level 2
05:34:02midk 0, 255, 255, 255, 0, /* |# #| */
05:34:04midk 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, /* |#####| */
05:34:06midk 0, 255, 0, 255, 255, /* |# # | */
05:34:08midk 0, 255, 255, 0, 255, /* |# # | */
05:34:10midk 0, 255, 255, 255, 0, /* |# #| */
05:34:12midk};
05:40:15bluEchiPif you're only using black and white - use the same format that is there already
05:40:38bluEchiPit will reduce your code size by 87.5%
05:40:42midkLMAO
05:40:48midkno its just not gray shaded yet
05:41:16bluEchiPdo you plan to use more than 16 shades?
05:41:28midkno
05:41:29midki use 8
05:41:50bluEchiPdo it as nibbles
05:41:56bluEchiPsave 50%
05:41:57midknibbles.
05:41:59midk?
05:42:02bluEchiP4 bits
05:42:07midkdot dot dots
05:44:03***Alert Mode OFF
05:53:17bluEchiPbye all
05:53:21 Part bluEchiP
05:56:34 Part scott666
06:00
06:03:02 Join wake [0] (~wake@HSE-Kitchener-ppp194434.sympatico.ca)
06:03:30midkhi wake
06:04:00wakehello
06:11:13 Join minh [0] (~jirc@dyn-83-154-127-158.ppp.tiscali.fr)
06:12:08minhhi there
06:12:39midkhi
06:13:13minhi just flashed my Archos !
06:13:22midkcool
06:13:23minhcongratulations !!
06:13:51minhvery good job you have done
06:14:40 Quit wake ("leaving")
06:14:47midki only contributed a plugin and a few minor patches
06:14:51midkbut i'm sure the devs appreciated
06:14:56midkaprreciate it*
06:14:59midkgah you know what i mean
06:15:00midk:)
06:15:04midkworking on a breakout plugin right now
06:15:15minhis anybody talk french in your team ?
06:15:22minhyes anyway
06:15:31minhit must be a lot of work
06:16:09minhwhat is the brek out plug in ?
06:16:10midkit is
06:16:15midkbreakout. it's a game
06:16:20midkbounce a ball off a paddle and hit the blocks
06:16:29minhah yes !
06:17:44minhi'm working with remoted difital cameras on blimps
06:18:12midkoh cool!
06:18:28minhand i hoped for a connection solution between yhe archos and the cam
06:18:40minhbut i read is not possile
06:18:43midkcan't happen
06:18:45minhpossible
06:19:17minhyo
06:20:17minhso we lookinf on a micro pc solution from Via
06:21:19midkcool
06:21:23midki'd like to see that
06:21:44minhme too ;-)
06:22:06minhit's a lot of work in perspective...
06:23:18minhhave fun in programming your game, and again very good job guys !
06:23:27midkthanks!
06:23:29minhciao see you
06:23:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:24:01 Quit minh ("Leaving")
06:36:45 Join Ka__ [0] (~tkirk@65.216.194.2)
06:40:57midkka
06:43:20 Quit Ka___ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
06:59:46 Join bluEchiP [0] (~bluechip@cpc3-colc1-3-0-cust61.colc.cable.ntl.com)
06:59:46 Quit Nibbler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
07:00
07:01:09midkbcbc
07:01:15midkso much for "Sleep time"
07:01:15midklol
07:01:47midkhmm i sort of got my font down
07:01:56bluEchiP05.53.17 # <bluEchiP> bye all
07:01:56bluEchiP05.53.21 Part bluEchiP
07:02:05midknow i have to move it into one of those 2d guys right
07:02:16midkyou pm'ed me 3 hours ago saying something about bedtime
07:02:33bluEchiPif you want me to look at what you have and pass comment - i will
07:02:41midkyay
07:02:53midkcan i dcc you the source?
07:03:13bluEchiPpresume so
07:04:09 Join LinusN [200] (~linus@labb.contactor.se)
07:04:18midkhi linusn
07:05:29bluEchiPlinus, you guys interested in so optimisations for your bressenhams?
07:10:27bluEchiPis that the whole font?
07:10:47midkso far
07:10:52midki'm adding more as we speak
07:10:56midkwell i've halted
07:11:06midkbut when we finish setting it up i can add to it right
07:18:28bluEchiPREMIND ME HOW MANY shades you are using (hex mode)
07:18:42midk8 shades
07:22:16midkooo
07:22:30bluEchiPif you just do the pictures as shown in the example, you will never need to type n the numbers
07:23:43LinusNbluEchiP: i'm all ears
07:23:48midkohh
07:23:56LinusN(cool demo btw :-)
07:24:14bluEchiPthanks - with ami's help it's been optimised another great chunk
07:25:05midkso bluechip i can insert them in there like you did with your 9x9 font file?
07:25:50bluEchiPdrawline: the use of "abs" is debateable, I finally settled on
07:25:50bluEchiPdeltax = x2 - x1; asm ("cmp/pz %0 \n bt 1f \n neg %0,%0 \n 1: \n" : "+r"(deltax) );
07:25:50bluEchiPbut it is worth considering that the (x2-x1) is compiled three times and executed twice
07:26:35bluEchiPx & y are unrequired vars - smaller and quicker to use x1 and y1 as the counters
07:27:42bluEchiPif numpixels is defined last you can use
07:27:42bluEchiPnumpixels = (++deltax);
07:27:42bluEchiPsaving you the cost of doing the numpixels++ at the end
07:28:25bluEchiPif you assign "d" after "dinc1" you do not need to do the *2 twice ...this CANNOT be <<1 because of negative numbers, so is quite costly
07:29:17bluEchiPxinc2 and yinc2 are always set to 1, this can be done ONCE where "numpixels++" is currently
07:29:28bluEchiPinstead of twice
07:30:06bluEchiPif (d<0) might be efficiiently replaced with if(d&0x8000)
07:30:37bluEchiP...and the same in clearline
07:31:44LinusNis d a short?
07:32:03bluEchiPeverything is int
07:32:17LinusNthen d&0x8000 won't work
07:32:18bluEchiPwhoops
07:32:30bluEchiP0x80000000
07:32:35LinusN:-)
07:33:39midkyay!!!
07:33:46midki reduced flicker of gray pixels in my plugin
07:33:50midk*dances
07:34:16bluEchiPhow?
07:34:31midkonly redraw gray when needed
07:34:33midk:D
07:34:46bluEchiPoh yes, that will make a tonne of difference :)
07:34:53midknow it actually looks decent
07:35:13midkif that was sarcasm there, it shouldn't have been :)
07:35:21midkit really does it look nice now
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07:36:39midkbc no target still?
07:36:49bluEchiPeh?
07:36:53bluEchiPoh
07:36:55midkno target handy?
07:37:11bluEchiPbit busy right now
07:37:17midk'sok
07:37:19midktime for bed
07:37:20midknite all
07:37:25 Quit midk ()
07:37:25bluEchiPnite
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08:00
08:02:40 Join Luna [0] (jirc@66.236.25.44.ptr.us.xo.net)
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08:05:24LunaARGOSY USB 2.0 POCKET DRIVE ALUMINUM 2.5" EXTERNAL ENCLOUSRE W/ TOSHIBA 60.0GB 4200RPM 2MB NOTEBOOK HARD DISK DRIVE
08:05:38Lunahttp://www.pcmicrostore.com/PartDetail.aspx?q=b:1182;c:36116;p:10501409
08:05:50 Join adi|home [0] (~adi|home@as5300-9.216-194-23-136.nyc.ny.metconnect.net)
08:06:04Lunane1 care to post this deal to mail list ?
08:06:24Lunaout
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08:16:03bluEchiPLinusN: how expensive is a double?
08:18:12LinusNexpensive?
08:18:29bluEchiPt states
08:18:53bluEchiPor whatever they call a time unit nowdays - lol
08:19:46bluEchiP(aX+c)%m works more effectively as a fraction
08:19:47LinusNit depends on the operations performed on it, but i'd say it's pretty expensive
08:20:12LinusNlots of shifting and masking going on
08:20:42bluEchiPit would be a single div and a mul back up again
08:21:04LinusNyes, if you used fixed point in your own format
08:21:30bluEchiPyes, that might be a better idea
08:21:38bluEchiPthanks
08:22:33LinusNalso remember that you have to link with the floating point library, wasting valuable plugin memory space
08:22:59bluEchiPohh - hadn't considered that at all - thank you :)
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08:36:34bluEchiPthat's me done for today - byeeeeee
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09:32:01dwihnoWelcome back, Dr. Felzing.
09:32:04dwihno\o/
09:33:19LinusN:-)
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15:46:32elinenbeJPEG viewer!!!! NICE!!!!
15:46:34elinenbeWOO!
15:46:35elinenbe:)
15:46:39elinenbeWOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
15:56:32limbusare you allright ?
16:00
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17:29:18elinenbeI'm okay.
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20:12:34 Join RavenWorks [0] (RavenWorks@modemcable240.220-201-24.mc.videotron.ca)
20:12:49RavenWorksHey, anyone in?
20:14:13RavenWorksany difference between the Recorder and RecorderV2, other than uglitude?
20:18:15 Join M0RiNF3N [0] (M0RiNF3N@81.86.92.109)
20:18:25RavenWorksHeya..
20:18:28M0RiNF3Nhello
20:18:42RavenWorksI'm going to buy an Archos recorder...
20:18:50RavenWorksd'you know what the difference between the normal and the V2 is..?
20:18:51M0RiNF3Nreally
20:19:21M0RiNF3Nthe normal looks pretty chunky
20:19:42RavenWorksYeah, I noticed.
20:19:50RavenWorksIs that it, though, just a case redesign?
20:20:27M0RiNF3Ndunno, i guess if your gonna install rockbox then there wont be any difference in the interface
20:22:26M0RiNF3Nits funny, i figured there would be more difference myself but as far as I can tell your right, only a facelift
20:23:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:25:52RavenWorksKnow any good places to buy them?
20:25:56RavenWorksThe Archos site doesn't ship to Canada
20:26:50M0RiNF3Ni would have thought ebay was the best, they come up pretty cheap on there
20:27:23RavenWorksYeah, but what if I get a busted one..
20:27:56M0RiNF3Nwhat makes you think that would happen?
20:29:14RavenWorksWhat makes you think it wouldn't?
20:29:22RavenWorksnot to sound paranoid or anything :P
20:31:35M0RiNF3NI've bought heaps of stuff on ebay and I've never had any trouble. I've had plenty of stuff shipped internationally as well and I've had no problems whatsoever
20:31:50M0RiNF3Nthats what makes me think it wouldn't :P
20:32:19RavenWorksYeah, but I've got no backup plan if it turns out to have a bad battery or something..
20:32:56RavenWorksI've been warned to stay away from the FM Recorder, would you agree with that?
20:33:10RavenWorksI'm sorry, I'm nuts about spending money on stuff like this. X)
20:34:05M0RiNF3Nisn't the fm recorder just the 128Mb flash recorder?
20:34:25RavenWorkshttp://store.yahoo.com/softbyweb/arjufmrep50.html
20:34:31RavenWorksIt's a recorder, with an FM reciever too.
20:34:46RavenWorksbut I've been told the battery life sucks and the buttons are frail.
20:37:10M0RiNF3Ndunno, I'm not really that bothered about having an FM radio so I haven't looked into it
20:40:56RavenWorksThing is it's cheaper than the Recorder.
20:42:32M0RiNF3Ndunno, battery life is important to me, i still reckon ebay is the way to go, you can get brand new product with warranty and if all else fails ebay/paypal will guarantee you wont lose out
20:42:57RavenWorksI guess.
20:43:02RavenWorksWith Warranty...?
20:45:07M0RiNF3Nsure, look around, there are heaps of great deals to be had on ebay, check peoples ratings, buyers comments etc, if you think something is not right then don't buy, but believe me there is a whole world of bargains out there to be had
20:48:49RavenWorksArright.
20:48:55RavenWorksI'll look into it, thanks..
20:48:58M0RiNF3Nnp
20:48:58RavenWorksGTG.
20:49:02M0RiNF3Nme too
20:49:03RavenWorksTake care.
20:49:05 Part M0RiNF3N
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21:00
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21:17:53elinenbeamiconn: you here?
21:18:11amiconnYes I am.
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21:27:37elinenbeamiconn: any work on your minesweeper?
21:27:55elinenbeI saw that Jorg committed what looks to be the beginning of a jpeg viewer...
21:27:57elinenbethat's nice!
21:28:40amiconnStill nothing concerning minesweeper...
21:29:57amiconn...was busy improving the grayscale framework, and doing the optimized lcd driver
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22:03:18 Join NukNuk [0] (NukNuk@217.93.7.3)
22:03:58NukNukhowdy
22:04:10lImbusho
22:04:15NukNukyou know something about the crative jukebox hack?
22:04:15NukNuk:/
22:04:21NukNuki mean rockbox is awesome
22:04:51bluEchiPredchair are the people to speak to about creative kit
22:05:01lImbusehh, I use it, and I plan to participate iin development, i train ;-)
22:05:18NukNukwell where to find them :)
22:06:29NukNukim looking for backuping tools
22:06:33 Join scott666 [0] (~scott666@c-24-245-59-203.mn.client2.attbi.com)
22:06:46bluEchiPnomadness.net
22:06:57NukNukdidnt find any
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22:12:50 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (~idc-drago@pD9FF8044.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:13:10amiconnHi Jörg
22:13:19 Join cjnr11 [0] (dfd@bobillot-5-82-224-193-23.fbx.proxad.net)
22:13:21[IDC]DragonHi Jens
22:13:25 Part cjnr11
22:13:33[IDC]DragonJPEG viewer is "ready"
22:14:28amiconnSo you really should release it:
22:14:29amiconn[15:46:57] <elinenbe> JPEG viewer!!!! NICE!!!!
22:14:29amiconn[15:46:59] <elinenbe> WOO!
22:14:29DBUGEnqueued KICK amiconn
22:14:29amiconn[15:47:00] <elinenbe> :)
22:14:29amiconn[15:47:04] <elinenbe> WOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
22:14:29***Alert Mode level 1
22:14:29amiconn[
22:14:42[IDC]Dragonseen that
22:14:45NukNukdeutsche hier?=
22:14:52[IDC]Dragonno ;-)
22:14:57NukNukgibts auch sone mod szene für die jukeboxes?
22:15:08NukNuk[IDC]Dragon dein host verrät dich :D
22:15:18[IDC]Dragonwhat kind of mod?
22:15:25[IDC]DragonI did many mods
22:15:55[IDC]Dragon(we try to stick with english so the others have a chance)
22:16:01NukNukwell
22:16:09[IDC]Dragonand be glad the swedish do so as well
22:16:11NukNukhow do you modify
22:16:13NukNukthe software
22:16:33[IDC]Dragonwith an editor?
22:16:47NukNukwell thats true
22:16:57NukNukbut where to get the files from
22:17:01NukNukcant extract the exe
22:17:43[IDC]Dragonyou know http://rockbox.haxx.se, do you?
22:18:06amiconn[IDC]Dragon: I try to modify my gray_drawbitmap() function to use the same format as lcd_bitmap(), so you can use bmp2rb-made bitmaps.
22:18:12NukNukim talking about creative jukebox softawre
22:18:26[IDC]Dragonwrong group
22:18:39lImbuscreative != archos
22:19:10[IDC]Dragonamiconn: well, I don't need that
22:19:11NukNukthats the fxxn point :P
22:19:18NukNukwhere to find ppl
22:19:27NukNukthat why im asking for the nomad scene
22:19:32lImbuscertainly not here
22:19:39NukNukwell who knows
22:20:22[IDC]Dragonamiconn: one thing prevents me from committing:
22:20:29amiconnYes, but I will need that for incorporating font support. The fonts do also use the internal bitmap format of rockbox if I am right.
22:20:46amiconnHowever, the format description in lcd-recorder.c seems to be wrong (or I don't get it)
22:20:48[IDC]Dragoncurrently, I can only view jpgs which are at least display size
22:21:10scott666NukNuk: someone was here for a while asking for info on how to crack one of the nomad players, you could look in the logs
22:21:23NukNukwhich logs :D
22:21:28NukNukah hmm
22:21:30scott666the IRC logs
22:21:34NukNukwell
22:21:38NukNuki joined 10 minutes ago
22:21:46scott666theres a search box on the rockbox website, use that
22:22:12elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: how is the jpeg viewer coming?
22:22:31NukNukat least i dont want to crack it
22:22:40[IDC]Dragonelinenbe: see above
22:22:41elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: it would be wonderful to view jpeg mage tags in ID3v2 tags...
22:22:42NukNukyou can show me some pics of your mp3 players?
22:22:48elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: I saw that.
22:24:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:24:30***Alert Mode OFF
22:24:44NukNuklol they called the creative jukebox a lesser product
22:24:46NukNuk*laughs*
22:25:21NukNuk[IDC]Dragon what mp3 you have
22:26:08[IDC]DragonNukNuk: you mean what player hardware?
22:26:15NukNukuhm
22:26:16NukNukyeah
22:26:45[IDC]DragonI have what people here would call a Recoder 20 V1
22:27:09amiconnWth is a re-coder ;)
22:27:19[IDC]Dragonwith 60 GB disk, larger RAM+Flash
22:27:28NukNukso its modified?
22:27:40[IDC]DragonRecorder, sorry
22:27:44NukNukram O_o
22:27:51NukNukwith how do you get some ram in there
22:28:07[IDC]Dragonwith a soldering iron ;-)
22:28:09NukNukerr
22:28:24NukNukyoure from eastern germany?
22:28:35[IDC]Dragonno
22:28:40[IDC]DragonJens is
22:28:44NukNukwell
22:28:52NukNukfrom the south then
22:29:00[IDC]Dragon(amiconn)
22:29:13[IDC]Dragonstill cold
22:30:10NukNuki wonder if its possible to play the archos software on my creative :P
22:30:50[IDC]Dragonmaybe, if you port it ;-)
22:30:59NukNukport?
22:31:04lImbusyou mean the rockbox-software. the archos-ware is crap
22:31:14NukNukwell it looks nice
22:31:37amiconn[IDC]Dragon: The format description in lcd-recorder.c probably _is_ wrong, will see in a few minutes.
22:31:37[IDC]Dragonporting = adapting the code to a new environment
22:32:11lImbusto new hardware, of course
22:33:12NukNukhttp://www.archos.com/products/overview/pict_gmini_220/screen1.png
22:33:18NukNukhttp://www.archos.com/products/overview/pict_gmini_220/screen2.png
22:33:20NukNuknice
22:34:03Strathyup
22:34:45lImbusI don't think rockbox is running on gemini-devices at this time
22:34:47Strathand the gmini series still hasn't reached it's full potencial
22:34:56Strathgetting there
22:35:41NukNukthe xtra hasnt reached his potencial
22:35:44NukNuktoo
22:35:47Strathunpacker: done, disassembler: done, emulator: in progress,
22:36:43[IDC]DragonStrath: excellent work!
22:37:12lImbusrespect
22:37:20Straththanks :)
22:37:28NukNukwork work work
22:37:52Strathbah... it's fun fun fun :)
22:38:14[IDC]DragonI'd like the new Gmini as the next platform for Rockbox
22:38:42[IDC]Dragonit will have an ARM CPU, much better
22:38:46Straththe entire gmini series uses the same basic hardware
22:38:52Strath?
22:39:20Straththe "new gmini" use an ARM core???
22:39:28[IDC]Dragonyes
22:39:50Strathcause the 120, 220, and SP use a CalmRISC16 core
22:39:52[IDC]Dragondon't know when, however
22:39:58[IDC]DragonI know
22:40:12Strathwell... grrr...
22:40:37Strathwhere did you see/hear this?
22:41:22Stratha marketing guy? or an engineer?
22:42:30amiconnGrr, I still don't get this dreaded bitmap format.
22:42:41Strathyes, i know the av3xx series uses an ARM core, but from what i've seen, the CalmRISC is the better
22:42:54Strathwhy is that?
22:43:08amiconnNow I have at least a part of the rockbox logo on screen, but it is mirrored and downwards...
22:43:38Strathi realize the samsung's documentation does have a lot of errors....
22:44:08StrathFUCK THAT
22:44:49StrathDRM, no god damn way *i'll* let that fly
22:45:26Strath(that explative outburst wasn't directed at you :) )
22:46:27amiconnAhh, *much* better now....
22:46:41Strathsorry, just so damn sick of these companies trying to shove all this DRM crud on us
22:47:37Strath?
22:48:14 Join KickIn [0] (KickIn@192.220.39-62.rev.gaoland.net)
22:48:22KickInhi
22:48:34Strathwha?
22:48:54Strathi am?
22:49:09KickInI'm new to RockBox, and I have a little question to ask...
22:49:20KickInCan I ask it to anyone?
22:49:46lImbusgive it a try
22:49:58KickInMy name is Pierre-Andre from FRANCE, 27, Computer engineer
22:50:07KickInSo my little question:
22:50:34KickInI just can't flash the firmware in my recoder v2
22:51:07KickInWhen using the link given in the pdf, it won't load the rockbox....
22:51:32KickInI want to know how to make a .bin from the actual Rockbox daily tarball...
22:52:01NukNukbrb
22:52:03 Part NukNuk
22:52:08KickInI ha ve tried with descramble and ucl of the included rockbox.ucl, but it won't work...
22:52:36lImbusmhmm, I'm not so known to flashing, as my rockbox doesn't allow either
22:52:38KickInRockbox daily tarball work well whe launching with ROLO
22:53:25lImbusbut your hardware allows flashing, you checked that ?
22:54:16KickInYes, as seen in the pdf, if it gives informations in the debug harware info page, then it must be flashabel
22:54:27 Join TheDude2 [0] (Dudewin32@jkhouse2.jvlnet.com)
22:54:40lImbusyup, that's it, I can't help you more than this :-/
22:54:58KickInThanks anyway...
22:55:15lImbuspas de problemes
22:55:29KickIn;)
22:56:04[IDC]DragonKickIn: why do you want to make a .bin?
22:56:43KickInBecause I felt like the zip I have downloaded isn't a good one.
22:56:48 Join NukNuk [0] (NukNuk@pD9E76F3B.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:57:00KickInSo I wanted to make a new .bin from the actual tarball..
22:57:04KickInIs it so stupid?
22:57:38[IDC]Dragonyou don't need to.
22:57:51KickInThe firmware version I downloaded, doesn't launch RockBox when starting the device.
22:58:03KickInThe tarball one does.
22:58:17KickInOk, so how do I procced?
22:58:17[IDC]Dragonslowly, what have you downloaded?
22:59:08KickIn2 things in fact. First, I wanted to try RockBox, so I downloaded the dail tarball, extract it and put it on the JBR
22:59:56[IDC]Dragonthe tarball is the source code!?
23:00
23:00:17KickInAs I found it great, I tried to flash my device so I downloaded another package from the link included in the manual
23:00:46 Join moonaddict [0] (8f5a4ebfff@213.129.253.62)
23:00:52KickInSorry, the daily build...
23:00:54[IDC]Dragonfrom my webspace, I guess.
23:01:45KickInI can search tlink if you want..
23:02:26 Part moonaddict ("(Read error: Connection reset by peer)")
23:02:27KickInI have a modem (no ADSL wher I live :( )
23:03:07lImbusthat's why you need a lot of goos music on your rockbox ,-)
23:03:16lImbuss/goos/good
23:03:32KickInSo it was this link : http://joerg.hohensohn.bei.t-online.de/archos/flash/flash_rec.zip
23:03:38KickInYes...
23:03:56[IDC]Dragonok, my file then.
23:04:10[IDC]Dragonthe link is for a cecorder, not a V2
23:04:21KickInok sorry...
23:04:37[IDC]Dragontry the link without the filename, to see the directory
23:05:04KickInOk, I have done it
23:05:21KickInflash_v2.zip?
23:06:48KickInIs it flash_v2.zip?
23:07:22KickInI will try this.
23:08:37[IDC]Dragonyes
23:09:35KickInThanks, and sorry for the stupid question...
23:10:25 Quit jkerman (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:11:57[IDC]Dragonnp
23:15:05lImbusbtw: why do f2 and f3 menues not go away anymore after having pushed for several seconds ?
23:18:28elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: did you know someone is already busy working on the gmini firmware?
23:18:50Strathheh
23:18:56Strathi think he does
23:19:10[IDC]Dragonyes
23:19:34elinenbeStrath: why are you laughing?
23:19:42elinenbeit is you?
23:19:55Strathcause i'm the one working on it
23:19:56[IDC]Dragonbecause we've been talking about it before.
23:20:56KickInThanks it work perfectly....
23:20:58Strathyes, Strath == http://www.donat.org/michael/archos
23:21:03KickInI'm happy...
23:21:20[IDC]DragonKickIn: good!
23:24:40Strathbbi10
23:25:31KickInJust another question before doing mistakes...
23:26:18elinenbeStrath: that is what I was talking about.... good luck with it.
23:26:32KickInWhen firmware is flashed, I can remove the ajbrec.ajz, as it isn't usefull anymore or am I wrong?
23:26:51elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: how are you going to go about larger jpegs?
23:26:58[IDC]DragonKickIn: you can remove it
23:27:05elinenbescroll or resize or just not show them...
23:27:12KickInThanks...
23:27:19[IDC]Dragonbut you may keek ip for the F1+On start
23:27:25[IDC]Dragonkeep it
23:27:41[IDC]Dragonelinenbe: scoll and resize
23:27:59[IDC]Dragon(you can zoom)
23:28:32elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: oh wow! what size photos can it support? This sounds really exciting.
23:28:45elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: of course everything you do is really exciting!
23:29:21[IDC]Dragonthe max. size depends on your RAM
23:30:10[IDC]DragonI have 8MB, allowing to view the pics of my 4 megapixel digicam directly
23:30:26[IDC]Dragon(but it's awfully slow with such big files)
23:31:11amiconn[IDC]Dragon: You do only decode the jpeg to gray, tossing the colour information, right?
23:32:05 Join Nibbler [0] (nibbler@port-212-202-78-119.dynamic.qsc.de)
23:32:17[IDC]Dragonamiconn: yes.
23:32:46[IDC]Dragonand while doing so, I can scale down by power-of-two up to 1:8
23:32:59[IDC]Dragonby doing a smaller IDCT
23:34:04amiconnWhat code size do you get when compiling? Does the code fit completely into the plugin buffer?
23:34:43[IDC]Dragonyes, but getting close to the max
23:35:11[IDC]Dragonbut I could remove major parts or your template
23:35:17elinenbe[IDC]Dragon: I was just wondering how loading the firmware directly from flash was going? Instead of loading into the RAM buffer?
23:35:44elinenbeIf you are even working on that anymore −− as we are closely approaching the 200k limit.
23:35:52[IDC]Dragonelinenbe; didn't pusue that any more
23:36:13[IDC]Dragonit was working, but had bugs
23:36:37[IDC]Dragonnow the window is closing, rockbox growing too big
23:37:24[IDC]Dragonbecause it has to fit behind the Archos ucl as _uncompressed_, in the flash
23:37:32elinenbeah....
23:37:54elinenbejust get rid of the archos ucl... it is unnecessary except for developers
23:38:26[IDC]DragonIt's necessary for everybody who ever flashed a wrong/bad ucl
23:38:44elinenbeyeah −− that's true...
23:38:47elinenbebut screw them!
23:39:01[IDC]Dragonwe could replace it with a small .ajz loader, however
23:39:15[IDC]Dragonand USB-enabler
23:40:23elinenbeI think that is what will happen.
23:40:27Strathelinenbe: archos isn't so bad, ya gotta give 'em props for thier hardware designs
23:43:02elinenbeStrath: I think the design is pretty bad... like the controls on the gmini
23:43:22elinenbewhy not 4 seperate buttons instead of the 2 rocker switches...
23:44:11Strathwell, the internals anyway... and compared to other manufacturers.... archos shows a lot of care in the designs
23:44:33elinenbethe internals are nice, and I had a gmini for a few days and the screen is nice
23:44:38Strathya.. but a quick mod should be able to fix it...
23:44:42elinenbebut I really enjoy AA batteries...
23:45:19Strathyou mean the not quite 'AA' batteries...
23:45:29elinenbeI think it would be great to get a company to produce a player that is developer designed... 4 AA batteries, BIG grayscale screen, standard laptop hard drive
23:45:46elinenbeStrath: I like the AA batteries in the recorder v1
23:45:51elinenbethat is what I have.
23:46:02bluEchiPHi guys - does anyone have any suggestions on how to improve x = i >>16
23:46:03Strathhrm.. ok..
23:46:08[IDC]Dragon2 AA cells would be enough for me
23:46:15Strathheh
23:47:10elinenbe2 AA cells is about 6-8 hours of playtime
23:47:33amiconnbluEchiP: If both x and i are declared as unsigned, this is already the optimum
23:47:57Strath2x2 AA's better
23:48:07bluEchiPhey ami, thanks ...while you're there - do you have a link for the SH1 programmers ref please?
23:48:50elinenbeStrath: that is what it currently has... 2x2 AAs
23:49:12elinenbehttp://www.thomas-distributing.com/new-products.htm 2400mAh batteries! wow!
23:49:16Strathguessed as much
23:51:33amiconnbluEchiP: http://rockbox.haxx.se/docs/datasheets.html , Hitachi SH-1 Programming Manual r4.0 is what you want.
23:52:54bluEchiPbrilliant - thanks
23:53:51elinenbeStrath: how far have you come with the gmini?
23:54:11elinenbeStrath: anything working yet? Also, what is the battery life with the battery fully charged?
23:54:22Strathmy emu opperates for just under 2 million steps before bombing out
23:54:31bluEchiPcongrats :)
23:55:09Strathi can't attest to battery life, as i almost never run it off just the batteries
23:55:31elinenbeStrath: that is huge... wouldn't 2 million steps almost be the full boot and more?
23:56:11Strathfull boot, and beginning to opperate
23:56:43Strathnone of the DSP opcodes are implemented yet
23:57:36Strathbut the current hang up is some dumb bug that shouldn't be taking this long to fix :)
23:58:04NukNukdoes someone has the video of the execution of the american soldier?
23:58:46 Join AciD [0] (~gni@82.67.133.87)
23:58:51 Quit AciD (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))

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