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#rockbox log for 2006-05-25

00:00:25AghasterI have a friend who has an H10
00:00:37Aghasterunfortunately its not supported
00:02:46preglowwe'd love to support it
00:02:52preglowbut we need developers willing to do the port
00:03:24preglowa h10 is almost identical to an ipod mini internally, so it should be possible
00:05:14 Quit RedBreva ("Time for Tubby ByeBye")
00:05:32preglowbut anyway
00:05:34 Quit Paul_The_Nerd (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:05:38preglowi've gotta go
00:06:23Aghasterk
00:09:56 Quit TCK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:10:43 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:11:51 Quit SereR0KR ("XChat Aqua")
00:12:30 Quit obo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:13:05 Join dpassen1 [0] (n=dpassen1@cpe-24-168-110-99.si.res.rr.com)
00:13:51 Quit Xerion (" ")
00:14:59 Quit _Lucretia_ ("Leaving")
00:15:00 Quit Paul_The_Nerd (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:15:26 Quit ender` (" A bus station is where the bus stops. A train station is where the train stops. On my desk, I have a workstation.")
00:15:49 Join Xerion [0] (i=xerion@zarathul.student.utwente.nl)
00:15:59 Join _Lucretia_ [0] (n=munkee@62.56.121.41)
00:17:59sharpeahh, helium...
00:18:44 Join ashridah [0] (i=ashridah@220-253-122-164.VIC.netspace.net.au)
00:24:34 Quit jd_ ()
00:24:40 Join dsh-1 [0] (n=daishi@ool-45703854.dyn.optonline.net)
00:26:08 Nick dsh-1 is now known as Daishi (n=daishi@ool-45703854.dyn.optonline.net)
00:26:15 Join TCK [0] (i=TCK@81-178-248-201.dsl.pipex.com)
00:30:39RoriWhat earphones/headphones do you guys use?
00:31:45sharpethe ones that came with my ipod. ;)
00:31:53Rorieww
00:32:02 Quit tom__ (Remote closed the connection)
00:32:05sharpehey, they suit me perfectly.
00:32:31RoriI bought some Etymotic ER6's thinking they would sound better but they actually sound worse!
00:34:38RoriI have some Sennheiser PX100 over the ear types which sound great so I was looking for something as good for in ear isolation. After recieving the Etymotic's this morning I was so pissed that I went down to the local shop and paid more than I needed on a set of Sennheiser CX-300's. They are awesome! Piss all over the Etymotic's which cost twice as much
00:35:12sharpeheh
00:35:48 Join tom__ [0] (n=tom@84.12.163.202)
00:36:24RoriI am wondering if I can sell the Ety's on. Kinda difficult when I have stuck them in my ears. I could lie of course on Ebay
00:36:36crashdthey sell replacement plugs for them
00:36:58Rorifor what?
00:37:04crashdthe ety's
00:37:10crashdis you're talking about the ones i think
00:37:15Roriyeah
00:37:20crashdlike the sure e*c series, and the sony fontopias
00:37:31crashdyeah, you can get replacement plugs for them, so you could sell them on with a pair of replacement plugs
00:37:33Rorithey do them for the Senn's too
00:37:39crashdyeah
00:37:49Roriin fact the Sony and Senn are the same round rubbery bits
00:38:32Rorinah I only shoved them in once. cleaned them after and put them back in a sealable bag. they came like that no accessories off ebay in the first place
00:38:57 Join Genre9mp3 [0] (n=Yngwiejo@88.218.17.158)
00:39:02RoriI did not read the small print. my bad. they said in the auction they were earphones only
00:39:17sharpe:(
00:39:18Rorisuckered I was :)
00:39:30Roriif they sounded any good I'd say fine
00:39:30sharpemoney someone made :)
00:39:34Roribut they sound like poo
00:39:46sharpei'll be back later.
00:39:47Roriespecially since they sent the wrong one's
00:39:53Rorithey advertised er6i's
00:40:02RoriI have complained because they sent er6's
00:40:14Rorisee what they say
00:40:36Rorithe er6i's have better bass response so I read which is why I ordered them in the first place
00:40:46 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:40:51Roribut I have a feeling the Senn CX-300's still piss over them
00:41:08Rorithe sound is atrocious and I cannot see why some people like the Ety's
00:42:10Bagdersound is subjetive
00:42:13 Quit [TCK] (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:42:13Bagderthat's why
00:42:57Rorithey sound all middle and no depth and no BASS!
00:42:58 Join YouCeyE [0] (n=YouCeyE@unaffiliated/youceye)
00:43:05Bagderto you, sure
00:43:24RoriI tried pushing them in deep too
00:43:30Rorimade no diff
00:43:39Bagderso? some people may like it that way
00:43:54Rorimight work for classical who knows
00:43:55Bagderlistening simply is a personal experience
00:44:35RoriI never liked middle sounding. I like bass, treble and a fairly open but subdued middle
00:45:09 Part Paul_The_Nerd
00:46:27 Quit obo_ ("bye")
00:46:28midkayRori, not sure what you plan to do with them, but maybe you want to try running them on maximum volume for several hours or overnight.. i've heard about people doing that with similar headphones to break them in..
00:47:06midkayprobably worth a go if you're planning to return them.
00:47:29 Quit TCK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:47:39 Join Paul_The_Ner1 [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:48:52 Quit Sa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:51:25RoriNo I know the ER6's have weak bass. They were advertised by the seller as ER6i's
00:51:35RoriWhich have better bass response
00:51:59RoriI will wait and see what they say and if they won't refund or exchange I will use Paypal buyer protection
00:52:15 Quit Strath ("Client closed")
00:52:21tom__I'm same Rori, problem is my iRiver just makes a crap sound when you pump the bass up
00:52:27tom__and same with the treble
00:52:30tom__starts screeching
00:52:49RoriI actually turned the treble down full on the new Senn's
00:53:05RoriThey have very very crispy treble and lots of bass
00:53:15tom__how much are earphones anyway
00:53:19RoriOnce I turned the treble down they sound fantastic
00:53:22tom__I just use the ones that came with it
00:53:41Paul_The_Ner1Depends on the quality level you're looking for.
00:53:45RoriThe Senn's are about £30 online or 39 in the store
00:53:53MikachuPaul_The_Ner1: what happened to your nick change?
00:54:06tom__what's so good about them then Rori ?
00:54:08Paul_The_Ner1Mikachu: Apparently it didn't happen. Umm
00:54:12 Nick Paul_The_Ner1 is now known as Paul_the_Ner1 (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:54:14Rorithe one's that come with the player always fall out of my ears
00:54:19 Nick Paul_the_Ner1 is now known as Llorean (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:54:21LloreanThere
00:54:24RoriI needed the rubber bung trype
00:54:26Roritype
00:54:38LloreanI'm too lazy to ghost right now.
00:54:58Mikachujust type your password in the channel and i'm sure someone will do it for you :)
00:55:11LloreanThe sound quality on the CX-300s aint bad either, but then rumor is they're exactly the same as the Creative EP-630s. Since I haven't tried myself, I couldn't say.
00:55:24RoriNever heard of those
00:55:44LloreanThey're about 20 USD on average, maybe less
00:56:02RoriI just know the sound I like and since I have tinnitus maybe I am biased a certain way
00:56:04markunLlorean: I'm still not used to you and paul being the same person :)
00:56:17LloreanExact same plastic molding and design as the Senns, and sound _similar_, made in the same factory even, so the debate is whether they're identical or just similar
00:56:19Mikachumaybe you can break it in by being llorean_the_nerd for a few weeks
00:56:33LloreanHehehe
00:56:42Mikachuis that a spanish ll or just l like in llama?
00:56:49LloreanLlama
00:57:37 Nick Llorean is now known as Paul_The_Nerd (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
00:57:42Paul_The_NerdThere
00:59:51markuna friend told me another friend of his is also working on a rockbox port and never saw me here.. Too bad he didn't know his nick.
01:00
01:01:58Rorisomeone did a head to head of the Creative 630's to the Senn 300's
01:02:17Rorithey say the Senn's win hands down and the comparison is unrealistic
01:02:28Paul_The_NerdYou talking about the CNET article?
01:02:32Rorihttp://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2103852&postcount=312
01:02:42Paul_The_NerdIf you read more on Head-Fi, there are plenty others who dispute that
01:02:50Paul_The_NerdOh, sorry, ZDNet
01:03:05tom__How come when the bass hits it sort of cuts off most of the other music :\
01:03:13Paul_The_NerdBecause the earphones are bad
01:03:22tom__they're the sennheisers that come with it
01:03:28Paul_The_NerdYes
01:03:40Paul_The_NerdMX300s or MX400s. They cost about $8 if you buy them on their own.
01:03:53Paul_The_NerdThey're okay, better than the Apple iPod phones, but nothing to write home about.
01:04:00tom__:(
01:04:30sharpewahhh!
01:04:51scottderSony EX71's are ok too
01:05:00crashdyeah, i use the ex71's as everyday phones
01:05:13crashdthe problem there is the cable rubber insulation degrades easily
01:05:15scottderbit bass heavy, but otherwise not bad
01:05:28scottderI love my Koss KSC-35's
01:05:30crashdlooking to get some new ones soon tho
01:05:31Paul_The_NerdReally if you want good sound quality, you either need to spend quite a bit, or get actual headphones, rather than earbuds or IEMs.
01:05:34scottderbest $10 I ever spent
01:06:25RoriI am impressed with the CX300's thus far and I usually listen to my PX100's
01:06:40tom__you look like a twat walking around with headphones on though
01:06:45crashdi was thinking of the px100's
01:06:51Paul_The_NerdThe PX100s are nice.
01:06:52crashdbut yeah, what tom says, and also, they arent very good in noisy places
01:07:02Mikachuwhat's the m for? in ear macaroni?
01:07:02Roripx100's totally rock
01:07:17tom__You're all talking in codes! :p
01:07:19Roribut for noisey places the CX300's own
01:07:22tom__the SDX3345666 xD
01:07:35RoriNot quite as solid as the PX100's bass is but still great
01:08:41RoriUltimate ears foamies apparently fit the Senn cx300's
01:08:49RoriI might order their trial pack in that case
01:09:16tom__so is it time I keep bending my sennheisers and then say "oops they're broked" and get a new pair ? :p
01:09:52 Join Strath [0] (n=mike@dpc67143207026.direcpc.com)
01:10:23Roridepends on your ears
01:10:35Rorithe mx senn range use old ear shape and I hate those
01:10:51tom__the original ones hurt my ears
01:10:54Rorialways falling out and not delivering any bass. have to turn them to get into ear
01:11:10Roriget the cx300's you won't be disappointed
01:11:16tom__how much are they?
01:11:34Roriyou can get them for a little over £30
01:12:01tom__Jesus O_O
01:12:40Rorito me that is cheap considering the alternatives
01:13:36scottderJust about anything is better than stock apple buds...I can;t stand those things
01:14:06Paul_The_NerdI saw someone using them today
01:14:13Paul_The_NerdWith a non-Apple player
01:14:17Paul_The_NerdWhich meant it was by choice.
01:15:05Mikachuthey don't fall out of my ears, that's my only condition
01:15:06Genre9mp3Paul_The_Nerd: I'm wondering if this is worse than a regular iPod user...:)
01:17:25Genre9mp3I mean, what would you prefer....an iPod user OR a non-iPod user that chooses the iPod buds! :)
01:17:43tom__CX300s are Ipod? :\
01:17:56MikachuPaul_The_Nerd: are you sure they weren't just white?
01:18:03tom__oh, you said the stock apple buds :p
01:18:21Genre9mp3Yes...I was refering to the stock apple buds
01:18:36crashdemc clarion cx300's?
01:18:40crashdeurgh
01:18:43crashdwhat am i talking about
01:18:50tom__going say, I was gonna say no way am I getting these CX300 if they're even vaguely related to ipod! :p
01:18:54crashdthe senns
01:19:08Paul_The_NerdMikachu: The iPod buds have a pretty distinctive look to them. They may have been imitators, but they had the whole look.
01:19:37tom__the ipod ones are crap
01:24:33Genre9mp3Are the EP-630 considered as good earphones for their price range?
01:24:40Paul_The_NerdGenerally yes
01:24:45Paul_The_NerdWell, definitely for the price range
01:24:54Genre9mp3I found them for only 25 Eur.
01:24:55 Join gtkspert_ [0] (n=gtkspert@203-59-203-198.dyn.iinet.net.au)
01:24:57tom__i tell you what though, rockbox is a pain in the arse if you organise your tunes by release date and such
01:25:14tom__to get it to play all the tunes at random
01:25:18RoriSennheiser CX300's totally rock
01:25:25tom__Givf me some! :)
01:25:45tom__http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000E6G9RI/203-3413275-9642349?_encoding=UTF8
01:25:50Paul_The_Nerdtom__: Why's it so hard to play everything at random? Click on the music folder, choose "Insert Shuffled" under playlist, and you're done
01:26:32tom__Erm, I have Music/2006/Month/Date/ReleaseName/
01:26:39tom__and I want to play ALL within 2006
01:27:08Paul_The_NerdSo click and hold on 2006, choose Playlist, then INsert Shuffled
01:27:19Paul_The_NerdAs long as you have "Recursively insert directories" set to something other than "Off" you'l lbe fine
01:28:01tom__Well played that man, it works :D
01:28:04Genre9mp3Wow, just checked to the e-shop again....not available anymore...damn!
01:28:14Genre9mp3http://www.e-shop.gr/show_per.phtml?id=PER.500691
01:28:24Genre9mp3Of course, it's in greek...
01:28:39Genre9mp3you won't understand much...
01:28:47Paul_The_NerdHehehe
01:29:03Mikachu"looks like greek to me"
01:29:30Genre9mp3Mikachu: It is greek...
01:29:39Mikachui was joking
01:29:43Genre9mp3Also, I'm from Greece....
01:29:52Mikachuyes, i am aware of that
01:30:01 Quit ashridah ("gone")
01:30:12Genre9mp3And also I'm embarassed of another person that is from Greece, too...
01:30:27Genre9mp3And of course...I'm not talkin' about XavierGr
01:30:31Genre9mp3:)
01:30:39XavierGrhaha
01:30:39Mikachuthat romanos character?
01:30:46XavierGryes
01:30:47Genre9mp3yes....
01:30:58XavierGrnext time I see him here I will ask someone to ban him
01:31:34sharpeooh.
01:31:41sharpewhy?
01:31:47tom__what is "party mode"
01:32:03XavierGrsharpe: he sweared a dev in greek....
01:32:22sharpetom__: for when you're in a partying mood, of course...
01:32:24Mikachui'm not a dev, did he swear at someone else?
01:32:24preglowoh noes
01:32:46Genre9mp3and I cannot figure out why the hell did he do that...
01:32:53sharpe:'(
01:33:08XavierGrMikachu: I thought you were a dev ;)
01:33:12tom__no, really sharpe?
01:33:13Paul_The_Nerdtom__: It basically makes playback unstoppable. Clicking on songs queues them up rather than starting them immediately, and so on.
01:33:16Genre9mp3I got so angry when I was reading the logs...
01:33:20MikachuXavierGr: i just talk a lot
01:33:41sharpenobody thinks i'm a dev...
01:33:46tom__ah yes ta Paul_The_Nerd
01:33:50preglowyou don't talk enough, then!
01:34:04sharpei'm more random than anything though.
01:34:05Genre9mp3Blah blah blah...
01:34:07preglowpeople think i'm a dev to this day just because i never shutup
01:34:19sharpebut...
01:34:19Mikachuaren't you? :)
01:34:24XavierGrMikachu: I thought you have CVS access, don't you?
01:34:26Mikachuno
01:34:30Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: People mistake _me_ for a dev ALL the time. =/
01:34:32sharpehe's in the credits!
01:34:35preglowMikachu: well, yes, but...
01:34:37Mikachubut some of my patches have been comitted
01:34:57Paul_The_NerdIt's all a factor of talking alot and being able to pretend you know what you're talking about.
01:35:01sharpei think when everyone's away, and i'm the only one left to help, i may get mistaken for one...
01:35:09 Join Electroman [0] (n=electrom@c-71-227-107-34.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)
01:35:31sharpeanyway, as we were talking about the dual cores...
01:35:36sharpe:D
01:36:10preglowPaul_The_Nerd: sounds a lot like a guide for life, heh
01:36:23sharpeit works with most people...
01:36:26tom__Paul_The_Nerd, on the crossfade too, what is the delay and what is the duration?
01:36:59Paul_The_Nerdtom__: Unfortunatel, crossfade _always_ confuses me. But that one's explained rather well in the manual
01:37:19tom__Hmm i just searched it, on the wiki and nothing
01:37:30 Part Electroman
01:37:34Paul_The_NerdThe WikiManual?
01:37:46tom__yeah
01:37:52sharpeshouldn't you try the manual-manual?
01:38:00Paul_The_NerdI don't think the WikiManual has a crossfade entry
01:38:35Paul_The_NerdIt might, but I'm not getting good results when searching rockbox.org as a whole for crossfade. It's in the PDF manual though
01:38:49tom__yeah found it in the pdf manual
01:39:10Mikachuhttp://www.google.com/search?as_q=crossfade&num=30&hl=en&c2coff=1&btnG=Google+Search&as_epq=&as_oq=&as_eq=&lr=&as_ft=i&as_filetype=pdf&as_qdr=all&as_occt=any&as_dt=i&as_sitesearch=rockbox.org&as_rights=&safe=off
01:39:18sharpeoh god!
01:39:23sharpehuge url!
01:39:25sharpeit burns!
01:39:25*amiconn prefers automatic manuals ;)
01:39:31 Quit petur ("here today, gone tomorrow")
01:39:35sharpethat's an oxymoron, isn't it?
01:40:22sharpegod, i hate pencils with larger than .5mm graphite.
01:42:24tom__83% battery and 7hrs remaining O_o
01:42:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:43:07 Quit gtkspert (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:43:50tom__woah, that crossfade mix mode is owning :)
01:43:55tom__Like having a portable DJ! :)
01:44:45sharpehmm...
01:44:56sharpewhen should i get to work on the SIDE port?
01:45:11tom__only problem is, it's fuzzing and cutting out sound with too much bass
01:45:31tom__and my earphones are really uncomfortable
01:46:04sharpesometimes i keep my headphones in when i have my ipod turned off, for no reason.
01:46:10sharpeearbuds.
01:51:09 Quit Poka64 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:53:16sharpei feel like i'm ignored sometimes
01:54:31preglowi just don't feel like commenting your headphone habits
01:55:38sharpemeh.
01:55:58sharpeyou should. they're so important.
01:56:18Paul_The_NerdIf you want to feel validated I can start to intentionally ignore you, just so it's not paranoia.
01:56:49sharpenah, it's okay. i just figured out another point
01:58:41sharpeoh, and i promise to everyone i'll have something other than screenshots for the SIDE port by sometime this weekend.
02:00
02:02:17sharpeokay, i'm done with my daily ramblings. i'll be silent now.
02:07:06 Quit TeaSea ("Leaving")
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02:16:36 Quit anathema (Nick collision from services.)
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02:21:36 Quit Kohlrabi ("Fast alle Menschen sind Regenwürmer")
02:24:21 Join lostnihilist [0] (n=james@wireless-224-87.uchicago.edu)
02:25:32Paul_The_NerdSince it's so bloody quiet in here right now, anyone got a favorite portable video playing device (not like iPod Video, or Iaudio X5, but something that's designed as a portable media device, rather than DAP+Vid)?
02:26:55XavierGrsomething like DVP?
02:26:58Paul_The_NerdI'm thinking about something HD based to watch videos on, battery life no real issue, but image quality is.
02:27:17XavierGrlook the pmps iriver or archos is selling
02:27:18sharpewell, the only portable device i have that plays videos, is a dvd player, but, that's not really included there.
02:27:31Genre9mp3Like Cowon A2 or the iriver PMP...
02:27:55sharpewhat about a laptop? :)
02:27:58Genre9mp3I'm noty really interested in such devices..
02:28:22Mikachui know there are portable dvd players with builtin lcds...
02:28:33sharpeyep, tis the kind i have.
02:28:35Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: Laptop's too big
02:28:47Paul_The_NerdI considered the iRiver PMP and PMC, but both seem to have a LOT of complaints.
02:29:14hardeepIf you're into games as well, the PSP is pretty good for viewing movies (not HD based though)
02:29:22Genre9mp3Theres are also some Archos devices...
02:29:28Genre9mp3AV500..AV700...
02:29:29sharpedon't the memory sticks, cost a lot?
02:29:38hardeepnot so much nowadays
02:29:42sharpeah...
02:29:51Paul_The_Nerdhardeep: I have a lot of complaints about the PSP already, even without the storage issue.
02:30:39sharpehmm...
02:30:45Paul_The_NerdGenre9mp3: Those look interesting. And just about the right price too.
02:31:07sharpewhat about the gpx2 (?) or the gp32...
02:31:15Genre9mp3The AV700 is really big one...
02:31:17sharpealthough they're kind of expensive.
02:31:28sharpewell... not really.
02:31:44 Quit dpassen1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:31:57sharpebut i think they're supposed to get five hours of video playback...
02:31:58Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: Compared to the AV500 or 700, they're cheap. Again though, very limited memory
02:32:03sharpeyeah.
02:32:20Genre9mp3Oh...almost forgot the iStation V43...
02:32:47sharpewell, that cheapness could be made up in 1gb SD cards! :)
02:33:07Paul_The_NerdIt'd take an awful lot of 'em
02:33:12Paul_The_Nerd:-P
02:33:14sharpeheheh
02:33:19sharpei want to get one though...
02:33:31Paul_The_NerdI do want a GP2X or X2 or whatever the new one is.
02:33:43sharpegpx2 i think.
02:33:44Paul_The_NerdBut right now I need a video-dedicated device, that I'll probably be buying next month.
02:33:46sharpeor 2x...
02:35:02sharpeeh, i want one to play around with. i'd try to port rockbox, but i know i'd fail. it'd probably be not too much of use to do so either.
02:35:34Paul_The_NerdThe GPX2 supports SDL, you could probably just compile the sim for it. :-P
02:35:40sharpeheheh
02:36:05sharpeshhh, we just won't tell them how we got rockbox running on an x86...
02:36:31Mikachui don't suppose anyone's ported sdl to ipodlinux?
02:36:40sharpebecause. there are like, no toolchains for the x86 processors. 'cmon.
02:36:52sharpewouldn't that be somewhat pointless?
02:36:57Mikachuyeah who would want to compile x86 code in this day and age?
02:37:07 Quit Aghaster (Remote closed the connection)
02:37:11sharpei know, they're so out of date.
02:37:41Mikachunobody even remembers what the x stands for
02:37:45sharpewho uses that architecture anymore?
02:38:51sharpeyou know what'd be really time consuming and probably not much fun at all while working on it?
02:39:29Mikachuno what?
02:39:34sharpebuilding a processor out of transistors.
02:39:47Mikachui thought that was the classical approach
02:39:53Paul_The_NerdSomeone built a difference engine out of Legos. But then, that's just cool.
02:40:25sharpewell... it was... but not with modern transistors.
02:40:27Mikachubuild an x86 out of radio tubes
02:41:24sharpe4004 would probably be one of the easier processors to implement in transistors :D
02:41:43 Part pixelma
02:41:53sharpeonly need a few thousand for that...
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02:45:36sharpewow, i really cannot figure out what's wrong with the cpu emulation, as to why it's freezing, or, at least the screen is whenever an enemy is hit...
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03:08:41daurn|laptopyo
03:08:43Link9064Could anyone tell me what input a Jukebox Recorder 20 takes? I have an adaptor for this and a FM20, which are 6 and 9V
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03:26:50daurn|laptoplol
03:26:54daurn|laptopBHSPitLappy: go away
03:26:55daurn|laptopXD
03:27:02BHSPitLappyouch
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03:27:13BHSPitLappythat hurts
03:29:22daurn|laptopi'm sick of seeing your nick in the list
03:29:30daurn|laptopmake it start with Z or something
03:29:32daurn|laptop:P
03:29:48BHSPitLappyyou.
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03:36:49sharpe...
03:37:41Paul_The_Nerd:::
03:38:40sharpei think i'll set up eclipse to compile rockbox... for i have nothing better to do so.
03:38:49sharpe-so.
03:39:10Paul_The_NerdEclipse and I didn't end up getting along.
03:39:19sharpeheh
03:39:40Paul_The_NerdI tried using it for a few projects.
03:39:46BHSPitLappylots of people seem to dislike Eclipse completely
03:39:57Mikachui haven't even used it and i dislike it
03:40:02sharpewell, we'll see how it and i get along...
03:40:05Paul_The_NerdIn the end the only use I found for it was that it could do syntax highlighting well enough for PHP, and the preview window was okay for that.
03:40:06BHSPitLappyfor the most part, I think it's that a lot of people don't care for IDE's
03:40:16sharpei do.
03:40:26Mikachui like my gvim
03:40:41BHSPitLappyI like my... Kate?
03:40:42sharpeof course, i'm just injecting my opinion into a conversation i'm slightly involved in. :D
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03:40:52sharpeBHSPitLappy: ah?
03:41:09BHSPitLappysharpe: ha!
03:41:13sharpewoo!
03:41:21Paul_The_NerdThat's a solution. Dictate all code to another human, and let them deal with project management etc.
03:41:22BHSPitLappywhee!
03:41:30sharpeheh...
03:41:38BHSPitLappygreat idea, actually
03:41:40Paul_The_NerdThings can always be made more complex.
03:41:56BHSPitLappyPaul_The_Nerd: got a pencil? ;)
03:42:22sharpealthough, i have to say i do like the eclipse logo.
03:42:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:42:57BHSPitLappylol
03:43:11sharpeoh wow, it's not an installer. how unexpected.
03:43:29BHSPitLappyI like the idea of an IDE with tutorials built-in :P
03:43:32sharpeheh
03:43:43sharpeIDEWTBI?
03:43:53BHSPitLappyI think the term is, "ECLIPSE"
03:43:59sharpetrue.
03:46:38sharpewhat's the name of my SIDE port?
03:48:01sharpeah... anyone? :)
03:48:37Paul_The_NerdSIDErock sounds kinda like a mangled "sidewalk" which is kinda funny.
03:48:51sharpei thought about something akin to Spin
03:48:51Mikachuamiconn or preglow will kill you
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03:49:07sharpebecause we do need more plugins with some play on the name 'rockbox'
03:49:17Mikachuyou can call it boxcide
03:49:30sharpebut... where do you get space invaders out of that?
03:49:49Paul_The_NerdMikachu: I'm actually not a fan of all the RockXXXX or XXXXbox names either, but I like to suggest them just for Preglow 'n Amiconn's sake.
03:49:59Mikachuhehe
03:50:05sharpei think they sound kind of redundant...
03:50:28sharpeSpine ?
03:50:58Paul_The_NerdI don't even know what SIDE is.
03:51:03sharpeooh! sp could be for space, in for invaders, and e for emulator
03:51:07Mikachuspace invaders something emulator
03:51:14sharpespace invaders didactic emulator, i think
03:51:20Mikachui'll didact YOU
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03:51:27sharpeoh yeah?
03:51:27*Mikachu looks up didactic
03:51:36sharpesomething about teaching.
03:51:49Mikachuinstructive (especially excessively)
03:51:56Mikachuexcessively prone to instruct, even those who do not wish to be instructed
03:51:58sharpe:)
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03:52:06Paul_The_NerdSomeone told google to define didactic, didn't they?
03:52:08sharpeautodidactic is, a self taugh person...
03:52:15sharpetaught.
03:52:18Mikachubut didact isn't a verb :(
03:52:25sharpedidacticate?
03:52:33Mikachunope
03:52:37sharpeaww.
03:52:45sharpebut... would Spine Work?
03:52:49Mikachudidactyl is an animal with two digits
03:53:55Mikachunothing else starts with didact
03:54:02sharpenope...
03:54:13Mikachuexcept stuff like didactical and didacticism
03:54:45Paul_The_NerdSpine is fine by me.
03:55:11sharpeit has a hidden meaning, only the few of us will know. and the people who read logs. can't forget about them.
04:00
04:00:06Mikachuit'spine by me
04:00:13Paul_The_NerdUgh
04:00:25Mikachui'm aiming for the Bad Pun of the Year award
04:00:56sharpewe should give out awards in the name of rockbox.
04:01:05Paul_The_NerdWell, you got 7 months of potential puns to go before you'l lknow
04:01:29sharpethat's a lot of punnication.
04:02:46sharpe... it took me three tries to click the "extract" button... it's a huge button...
04:04:14Mikachunice
04:05:40Mikachubed time now, got to rest my spine
04:05:52sharpeg'night
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04:48:41earHertz+
04:48:56sharpei'm going to try to get eclipse working with rockbox.
04:49:03sharpein the next few minutes i have.
04:49:11earHertzold directions for that in teh documentation
04:49:21JdGordoneclipse?
04:49:25earHertzyah
04:49:28JdGordonhows the c64 coming sharpe ?
04:49:35DgentlyEvening ll
04:49:39sharpeold directions don't seem to work for me.
04:49:40Dgentlyall that is.
04:49:48sharpeconsider they're from 3 years ago.
04:50:00sharpeeh, the c64 is still the same as it's been...
04:50:00earHertzis the button handling in the main thread, or does it have its own thread?
04:50:15sharpe?
04:50:48sharpei'd assume... it's own thread.
04:54:04earHertzanyone know about the cpu speed on teh ipod?
04:55:11sharpewhat about it?
04:55:14JdGordon400mhz isnt it?
04:55:18sharpe75mhz...
04:55:57Paul_The_NerdWell, 30 unboosted, 75 boosted.
04:56:07sharpeor 24mhz...
04:56:11sharpe:)
04:56:15earHertzon my build it's 30. if I up it to 75, it's fast3r, but when I access the menu, the display becomes random characters
04:56:27Paul_The_NerdYou shouldn't up it manually
04:56:34daurn|laptop200?
04:56:35*JdGordon wonders where he got 400 from :p
04:56:43daurn|laptop*2
04:56:43daurn|laptop:P
04:56:47earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: is it safe to up it programmatically?
04:56:55Paul_The_NerdIt automatically boosts itself when decoding or plugins need to boost. The menus are sluggish right now, yes, but that's more a fault of lack of optimization than anything
04:57:14Paul_The_NerdThough it shouldn't cause your menus to scramble either way
04:57:22Paul_The_NerdWhat type of iPod do you have.
04:57:37Paul_The_NerdJdGordon: Isn't one of the other potential targets a 300 or 400mhz ARM core?
04:57:46JdGordonoh that could be why
04:58:27earHertzthe scrolling is sluggush −− if I move my finger quickly on teh scroll wheel, I generate keypresses to quickly for the code to use −− teh code is written to not emit more keys until the button queue is empty
04:58:38earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: I have a video ipod
04:58:52Paul_The_NerdearHertz: So, 5G. Do you compile your own build, or use the daily?
04:58:53earHertzer, s/to/too
04:58:59earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: my own build
04:59:09Paul_The_NerdWhat GCC version, out of curiosity?
04:59:15earHertzwith logf but not debug
05:00
05:00:26earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: arm-elf-gcc (GCC) 4.0.
05:00:30earHertzer, 4.0.2
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05:01:37daurn|laptopany chance of someone porting rockbox to the gmini 4**
05:01:38Paul_The_NerdearHertz: Nobody's ever reported the menus scrambling bug before.
05:01:52Paul_The_Nerddaurn|laptop: It's open source. Feel free.
05:01:53earHertzI should report it, I guess
05:02:12Paul_The_NerdearHertz: First be sure you can reproduce it with an actual build. It could be an artifact of the logf.
05:02:15Paul_The_NerdThough I don't know how
05:03:12sharpeg'night.
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05:03:22daurn|laptopPaul_The_Nerd: how bout some info on what to do free
05:03:23daurn|laptop:P
05:03:31daurn|laptopwithout the "free"
05:03:31daurn|laptop:S
05:03:47Paul_The_Nerddaurn|laptop: Like this? http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NewPort
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05:07:57daurn|laptopwell
05:08:02daurn|laptopthe device is known about
05:08:08daurn|laptopwe have the hardware addresses
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05:08:19daurn|laptopand pictures are already uploaded to various locations
05:09:00JdGordonsome dick dinged up my car a few days ago and i have a red line along my nice silver car :'( any1 know how to get it off without scrtahc the silver paintjob?
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05:24:24earHertzhmm, boosting the cpu on th ebutton code helps, but not enough
05:24:57Paul_The_NerdWhat about simply boosting it while the backlight is on?
05:25:34earHertzthat's almosgt the same thing; the code that reads teh keys turns on teh backlight
05:25:58earHertzexcept, I luimit the boost to when the finger is touching teh scroll wheel
05:26:16Paul_The_NerdWell, I thought you said simply manually increasing the CPU speed was enough earlier?
05:26:18earHertzonce the finger come sup, the boost is turned off
05:26:46earHertzit's better, but the queue still isn't consumed fast enough
05:28:01earHertzoh, on a related issue, I've experiemented with two forms of accelaerated scrolling
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05:29:00earHertzn form scrolls the list in bigger jumps after the scroll whell has been "turned" 360 degrees; for each "turn" up to five revs, the jump is increased
05:29:18earHertzfrom scroll by line to scroll by page, to scroll 1%, then 10%, then 25%
05:29:53Paul_The_NerdI don't even get through one page of elements with a full 360 degree rotation...
05:29:57earHertzI also have a version where the area initially touched sets teh scroll factor: upper left quadrent is by page, lower left by 10%, etc.
05:31:03earHertzYou'll fins that how far yiou get depends on now fast you move. Ironically, moving faster gets you LESS scrolling, because the queue isn't consumed and teh "keystrokes" are discarded
05:31:19Paul_The_NerdI know, but it also depends on font size and other things
05:31:28daurn|laptopPaul_The_Nerd: where to from now?
05:31:29earHertzyeah
05:31:32Paul_The_NerdA "number of rotations" based system is flawed since it will vary based on screen sizes.
05:31:38Paul_The_NerdHow bout something like this:
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05:31:47Paul_The_NerdNormal method is single element scrolls
05:32:10Paul_The_NerdTap on one half the wheel (left, right, top, or bottom half) then release and tap again to start scrolling by page.
05:32:23Paul_The_NerdTap on one half, then press the other half and start scrolling for 10%
05:32:31earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: my second mod does exactly that, except you don't have to tap
05:32:33Paul_The_NerdForget about 25%. That way it's less location dependent and more gesture
05:32:51earHertzwhere you begin teh scroll determines the scroll method
05:32:54Paul_The_NerdI don't like the concept of having to think about specifically where I touch the wheel, and think it might be better if it's _how)
05:33:23Paul_The_Nerddaurn|laptop: Look at existing rockbox bootloader code, and start working on a bootloader, as it somewhat says in the newport page.
05:33:55earHertzPaul_The_Nerd: if you wan't accurate scroll delta, by the way, see my patch: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5423
05:34:06Paul_The_NerdearHertz: A position dependent method is especially bad for blind users, users with the nano's terrible small wheel, or users trying to manipulate it while not looking.
05:34:22earHertzYes, you're right
05:34:49Paul_The_NerdThat's why I was suggesting the gesture method. There's always an opposite half relative to where you first touch it, and you only need to know where you touched relative, not absolutely. :)
05:35:25earHertzGood point
05:36:20earHertzultimately, what I want is to tie method to the speed of teh scrolling. with my patch, I think I can make that happen
05:36:52earHertzthere's also an existing patch by chris russel that does that, but it's ha,pered by the bug that my patch fixes
05:37:00Paul_The_NerdGotcha
05:37:31earHertzwit the bug, it's very very hard to get a high scroll delta, because the original posotion is reset (incorrectly, I think) if teh queue is not emty
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05:38:49Paul_The_NerdIf I recall there queue was cleared so that it would never continue scrolling after you lifted your finger from the wheel.
05:39:06earHertzwell, not quite
05:39:18earHertzthe key isn't actually discard, it's never posted
05:39:37earHertzdoing a queue_clear when teh finger lifts also works
05:39:44Paul_The_NerdAh
05:39:50*earHertz has tried several things
05:40:34earHertzalso, making teh scroll threshold three works fine; the cvs code uses a threashold of five
05:41:17dwihnoIs the wheel excessivly sensitive, or is it just me btw?
05:41:39dwihno(compared to the stock fw, that is)
05:41:40earHertzdwihno: what kind of ipod?
05:41:47dwihnoearHertz: 5g
05:41:49Paul_The_NerdWell, it'll be nice to see some improvements in the scrolling. There probably hasn't been much looking at it. Feature freeze now, and before that more major things than UI woes, y'know? Hehehe.
05:42:23earHertz5g has 96 absolute scroll positions. the cvs code generates a key if teh abs( delta) > 4
05:42:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:42:50dwihnohm
05:42:59 Part scottder
05:43:11earHertzdwihno: experiment with chnaging that threshold. for me, using three works better
05:43:17daurn|laptopPaul_The_Nerd: for the bootlodaer, do you mean to make one that is flashed to firmware?
05:43:19daurn|laptopor what?
05:43:35earHertzor, actually, two: abs( delat) > 2
05:43:38dwihnoearHertz: 3? that will just make it more sensitive.. or will it?
05:43:43earHertzyes
05:43:54earHertzif you find it too sensitive, make it 7
05:43:58Paul_The_Nerddaurn|laptop: Depends on your device. iPods have a bootloader built in that loads code from disk, so we just had to place ours in the right place on disk. iRivers don't, so we had to flash ours on it.
05:44:08dwihnoearHertz: it's those things that should be configurable :D
05:44:17earHertzdwihno: I was just about to say that
05:44:30daurn|laptopits an archos
05:44:36daurn|laptopand i belie it has a firmware chip
05:44:38earHertzwill you be kind either to make that happen?
05:44:56daurn|laptopi have details on y main comp
05:45:01daurn|laptopwhich is being used atm
05:45:07daurn|laptopy = my
05:45:17dwihnoearHertz: I am not authorized to do such things :)
05:45:20Paul_The_Nerddaurn|laptop: Well, as that page says, most of the work needs to be done by you, or someone else with the device and enough interest to do the work.
05:45:28earHertzdwihno: write a patch, submiy it
05:45:49*earHertz hates writing UI code
05:45:53daurn|laptopall the devs with the device are working on medios
05:46:04daurn|laptop - which works through an avi exploit
05:46:12dwihnoearHertz: I haven't committed a patch in, like, ages :)
05:46:22earHertzgwet to worjk
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06:00
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06:05:40daurn|laptopwoot
06:05:43daurn|laptopi think i did it
06:05:50daurn|laptopjust added boot options
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06:05:55daurn|laptopand changed my root pw
06:06:10daurn|laptoparg
06:06:13daurn|laptopwrong chan
06:06:17daurn|laptoplol
06:06:51Doomedlol
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06:11:11Doomedahhhh i like the optimized builds but i like having the up-to-date cvs
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06:24:20daurn|laptoplol
06:24:27daurn|laptopi like out-of-date builds
06:25:07BHSPitLappydaurn|laptop: don't I know you from another network
06:25:15BHSPitLappytoc2rta or something
06:25:20daurn|laptopvgirc
06:25:21daurn|laptopi think
06:25:23BHSPitLappyk
06:25:32Doomedpsp
06:25:41BHSPitLappywasn't sure since you're not there now...
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06:26:58 Part Dgently
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06:54:40baapshello
06:54:54baapsI'm getting an error on the final step of installing rockbox on my ipod photo
06:55:01baaps[ERR] File is too large for firmware partition, aborting.
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06:58:02Apostle^recently i've had to reinstall rockbox and i'm having a problem any ideas?
06:58:12Apostle^i should probably mention the problem..
06:58:25JdGordonthat might help..
06:58:47Apostle^dd if=/dev/sda of=mbr.bin count=1 works fine resulting in a 512byte file but, dd if=/dev/sda1 of=bootpartition.bin goes on forever
06:59:16Apostle^hmm, never mind that problem seems to have cleared up
06:59:17Apostle^odd..
06:59:34JdGordon dd if=/dev/sda1 shouldnt that be dd if=/dev/sda ?
06:59:43*JdGordon doesnt have an ipod
06:59:50Apostle^i got it working
07:00
07:00:01Apostle^i was under the impression it was going to stop at 10mb
07:00:02Apostle^i was wrong
07:00:31Apostle^in the guide they should put ./ before the ipod_fw -o apple_os.bin -e 0 bootpartition.bin command since novices might not know that :-)
07:00:52JdGordonits a wiki... you can change it yourself if u tihnk it needs changing..
07:01:22Apostle^i'll add the ./ part
07:04:21JdGordonhow do i get .mov's working in linux? ive got xine and w32codecs installed fine..
07:04:54GaloisI think I wrote that part. The reason I didn't write ./ is because I did not want to presume that ipod_fw is in the current directory
07:05:50Galoisnever mind, the truth is I just borrowed from the bootloader page and the bootloader page had no ./
07:05:56daurn|laptopso add ./pathtodir/ipod_fw -o apple_os.bin -e 0 bootpartition.bin
07:05:56GaloisJdGordon: mplayer will do it
07:05:57daurn|laptop:P
07:06:21Galoisit's linux, one should assume that the user knows how paths work
07:06:23GaloisIMO
07:06:35JdGordonGalois: mplayer just closes as soon as it trys to play the mov
07:06:38Apostle^arg, whats error -1 mean again i remember getting it before
07:06:56Galoisright, well, mplayer is buggy
07:07:05Galoisbut if it weren't for that bug, mplayer would do it
07:07:43JdGordonxine says unsupported audio codec and asks if it should play anyway, clicking yes closes it also
07:08:08Apostle^arg, whats error -1 mean again i remember getting it before
07:08:22 Quit Mikachu (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
07:12:04Apostle^anyone?
07:15:56 Quit baaps (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
07:16:04Apostle^;-(
07:24:03Apostle^figured it out
07:24:03Apostle^lol
07:24:23 Part JdGordon
07:28:10Apostle^can you delete a dir from within rockbox?
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07:30:41Apostle^hmm it seems i install rockbox on the ipod
07:30:45Apostle^it gets FAT file system errors
07:30:52Apostle^but the apple firmware works fine
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07:42:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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08:00
08:00:29 Join Zendefera [0] (n=zendyman@ip68-7-163-21.sd.sd.cox.net)
08:01:20Zendeferahey, I just bought a ipod video 30gb , and followed the instructions, and it still boots into the apple os. one thing I noticed is that the bootpartition.bin is not 112mb, its like 80 mb, whats up?
08:02:13jncoh hum
08:02:26jncyou probably skipped a step or two
08:02:31jncusing linux or wintel?
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08:06:40Zendeferawindows
08:07:01Zendeferalets see, I what is there before getting the bootpartition.bin
08:08:45JdGordonby the file size diff im gonna guess u forgot to patch it with rockbox?
08:10:16Zendeferano, I just bought the ipod video just like 2 hours ago, I downloaded the ipodpatcher.exe, and ipod_fw.exe, and the bootloader-video.bin. I found out the drive number for it, then I did ipodpatcher -r 1 bootpartition.bin, the filesize was like 80mb, but the info on the website says it should be 112
08:10:58JdGordondont u run ipodpatcher twice?
08:11:13*JdGordon doesnt have a ipod.. flying blind here
08:15:01Zendeferabrb
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08:21:51Zendeferaany ipod video users in here?
08:22:02PresenceI'm a 60gig video user.
08:22:54Zendeferagreat
08:23:01Zendeferahow big was your fw?
08:23:22Zendeferawhen I do ipodpatcher -r 1 bootpartition.bin I get about a 80mb file, but the instructions says I should get about a 112mb
08:23:27Presencelemme check...
08:23:55Zendeferathanks
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08:27:04Presence04/24/2006 09:02 PM 115,121,664 bootpartition.bin
08:27:21Presencethats my "retail" bootpartition
08:27:38Zendeferawierd.
08:27:51ZendeferaI just bought a video 30gb, and I am only getting a 80mb file.
08:28:02Zendeferaany ideas?
08:28:06PresenceBeats the heck outta me. :Z^/
08:28:10Zendeferadamn
08:28:25Zendeferayou followed the instructions on the website?
08:28:37PresenceYep, to the letter.
08:28:46Zendeferathe ipod video manual doesn't have any instructions for installing the bootloader
08:29:01Zendeferaso damned wierd.
08:29:12Zendeferaand there is only one ipodpatcher for all ipods right?
08:29:23PresenceI did it from the wiki's instructions... I was scared at first, but really, it shouldn't matter at all in the end.
08:29:55PresenceI figure I'll never "go back", and if I *do* have to go back, I'll just do Apple's own "make it an ipod again" program.
08:30:01Zendeferado you have the url for the instructions you used?
08:30:19Zendeferabec maybe mine are screwed up
08:30:28EbErThow do you install the alternate bootloader for photo ipods that auto boots the regular os?
08:30:28Presencegrabbing it now.
08:30:38Zendeferathanks
08:30:49Presencehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodInstallation
08:31:23EbErTi tried just typing in it instead of the regular one
08:31:35EbErTreplacing the regular ipod bootimage
08:32:02PresenceYou know, the next step after "read existing apple firmware" is:
08:32:03Presence ipod_fw -o apple_os.bin -e 0 bootpartition.bin
08:32:12Presenceif it works, then there shouldn't be any concern.
08:32:20EbErTFor not so enthusiastic iPod Photo/Color owners, MarcusBrito created a boot loader that inverts the way rockbox works: it will load the original firmeware by default, and only load Rockbox if the user keeps MENU pressed while booting. You can get this bootloader here.
08:32:27EbErTthat part.
08:32:48Presencemaking that 5 meg apple_os.bin
08:33:24PresenceEbert, apparently those 4thGen owners on the forums are frustrated by constant problems getting their ipods to boot, I'm not suprised.
08:33:50Presence04/24/2006 09:05 PM 6,455,420 apple_os.bin
08:34:01Zendeferaok.
08:34:07EbErTi just wanted to try this instead, i got the regular one to work no problem presence
08:34:07ZendeferaI am retrying everything.
08:34:36Zendeferaits just wierd how the ipodpatcher -r n bootpartition.bin command got a 80mb file instead of a 112mb file.
08:34:59Presencewell, thats the size of a Nano image... :^/
08:35:12Zendeferayeah I know, but I bought a ipod video 30gb.
08:35:32Presenceheh
08:35:47Presencewhy not a 60Gig?
08:36:10EbErTe) Create the new Rockbox-enabled image file containing the Rockbox Bootloader
08:36:27Zendeferadidn't have enough for the difference.
08:36:31EbErTipod_fw -g color -o rockboot.bin -i apple_os.bin bootloader-color.bin
08:37:05EbErTinstead of bootloader-color, its called bootloader-color_nodefault.bin (something like that). i typed that in instead, but didn't work
08:37:36PresenceDo you HAVE the "nodefault" file in your folder?
08:37:48EbErTyes, all in same folder
08:37:53Presencebeats me.
08:38:21Zendeferayup
08:38:25EbErTdo you have to delete things and redo all the code to change the bootloader?
08:39:56EbErTi kinda retyped everything. went the same until the bootloader install part
08:40:13EbErTguess i'll delete all the rockbox stuff and try again
08:40:23Zendeferaany developers in here?
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08:42:54PresenceI think you can push through the 80meg-vs-115meg thing and keep going.
08:43:14Presenceif you tank the booter, you can totalyl just use Apple's restore gizmo to put everything back to stock again.
08:44:56Zendeferawhere do I get apples restore prog?
08:45:02Zendeferaits on apple.com?
08:45:10EbErTthe ipodupdater
08:45:24EbErTyou should already have it
08:45:35EbErTif not, on apple.com
08:46:18Zendeferaok, could it be that I have a brand new ipod with out any new updates? and thats why my bootpartition.bin is only 80mb?
08:47:04EbErTmaybe. always good to update it to most recent before messing with things
08:47:26PresenceZende, I did my rockbox install immediatly after opening the ipod's box... didn't even boot it into Apple or attach it to iTunes.
08:47:47EbErTheh, geek :)
08:47:57Zendeferahmm.
08:48:00Zendeferafucking wierd.
08:48:03Presencehttp://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=60983
08:48:08Presencegoogle for "apple ipod restore"
08:48:11Presenceheh :)
08:48:24EbErTi say just try to go all the way through first
08:48:27EbErTsee if it works
08:48:39Presencei agree.. just balls out do it.
08:48:56EbErTanyone tried the nodefault bootloader?
08:49:09Presenceremember, all the rockbox bootloader wants is that 5 megs of whatever guts it takes to make the retail OS "go". Rockbox takes over the rest of the bootloader.
08:49:31Presenceand if you hose your ipod, you won't even bother with the "original" 80 meg file anyways, you'll use Apple's "restore" program anyways.
08:50:22PresenceEbert, why would you WANT to go to Retail ever? I mean, Maaaaaybe for video, but ugh. I've booted into retail only once, just to *see* if video was worth the effort of reencoding videos for such a small screen. it wasn't.
08:50:54Zendeferawell my problem is I installed the bootloader, but It didn'ttake. it just booted directly into the apple software.
08:51:00Zendeferashould the ipod be off when I am doing this?
08:51:03EbErTpresence, i can't get the id3 tags to work
08:51:14PresenceZend, wow! hahaha, thats kinda a cool little bug. :)
08:51:20EbErTand it likes to shut off and boot back up on its own
08:51:35PresenceThe ipod can't be "off" when you connect it as a drive letter to your computer... it goes into USB disc mode.
08:51:51Zendeferaok, I'm blind, so I can't see the screen.
08:51:54EbErTand sometimes starts playing on its own.
08:51:56Zendeferaso I am on the drive hehe.
08:52:03Presence"shut off and boot back up on its own" <−− maybe thats the sleep timer or the auto-power-off of Rockbox?
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08:52:17Zendeferawell I am gong to reload again.
08:52:18Zendeferabrb
08:52:27EbErTbut mainly my gripe is id3 tags. one or two must be corrupt. hangs up after a while when forcing cache
08:52:48EbErTwhich it would tell me which file it had a problem with
08:52:56PresenceHuh. Dunno anything about tagCache... I <3 my file directory structure.
08:53:01 Quit Acksaw (Client Quit)
08:53:19EbErThow do you have it?
08:53:28EbErTlots of playlists?
08:53:46PresenceR:\music a-f\artist\album\01 - trackname.mp3
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08:54:03EbErTcool
08:54:07PresenceR:\music g-l\artist\album\01 - trackname.mp3
08:54:08Presenceetc etc
08:54:11EbErThow many songs on your ipod?
08:54:15Presenceshit, beats me.
08:54:22Presence35 gigs-ish.
08:54:27EbErTguestimate
08:54:31EbErTah, same here
08:55:24ACK54Wyo
08:55:38PresenceOMGZ YO HAX TEH PL4N3T
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08:57:24Zendeferapresence hey, how big is your rockboot.bin?
08:58:18Presence442 Folders, 4,450 files, 25.2 gigs.
08:58:32Presencechecking...
08:58:40Zendeferathanks
08:58:49Presence04/24/2006 09:06 PM 11,769,856 rockboot.bin
08:59:01Zendeferaok, thats how big mine is.
08:59:08Zendeferagood so far.
09:00
09:00:40Presencekay, this is utterly ignorant, but Zende, how do you read lines in IRC sooo fast if yer, like uh, blind?
09:01:26ACK54Wsixth sense
09:01:34Zendeferawoohoo
09:01:39Zendeferagot the firmware working correctly
09:01:42PresenceI mean, the only thing i know about like "blind computing" is the touchie thing the dude in the movie "Sneakers" did that made a bunch of noise and he waved his fingers over it like a harp.
09:02:15Zendeferamy computer reads them to me.
09:02:22Zendeferaever use the speech software for rockbox?
09:02:24 Join TeaSea [0] (n=Thunderc@lonsdale.nat.lancs.ac.uk)
09:02:37Zendeferaenable speech sometime, on it and see how it rids stuff to you, thats how I read stuff.
09:02:40PresenceYikes, it must be Extremely annoying when dipshits type in elite speak then, huh?
09:02:57EbErTwhen letters are typed on the screen, the screen turns into raised braille
09:03:10Zendefera:) at times, but It doesn't boher me, I can usually understand it, because when it gets to garbidge, it'll read it letter by letter.
09:03:27Zendeferaand I can use a invisible cursor, and review the screen, and go over things letter by letter.
09:04:00Zendeferawell I have a braille terminal, but its not plugged in right now, because I hear faster than I can read with my fingers, and I don't have to get my fingers off the kb to red the braille.
09:04:14EbErTya, i was just kidding :)
09:04:15Presencewhoa, see, thats freaking cool... its a whole subset of interface thats utterly alien to me.
09:05:12EbErTits cool that you are probably more technologically advanced than i am. people can learn all different ways
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09:06:56Zendefera:P I am a computer science major, and almost done.
09:07:06Presencedude, that implies you can code.
09:07:11Zendeferaspecialize in communications development
09:07:16Zendeferayup.
09:07:31linuxstb_Zendefera: 80MB is correct for the 30GB Video - the wiki was wrong.
09:07:34Presencedear god, you actually have to "listen" to each line of code?
09:07:38Zendeferac/c++ php java vb .net most .net langs actually and some others :)
09:07:39Presenceperl must be like pure HELL
09:07:58Zendeferalinuxstd ok, that should be updated
09:07:59Presenceno, scratch perl, Debugging must be pure hell!
09:08:11Zendeferanah, its not to bad.
09:08:11linuxstb_Zendefera: It is.
09:08:28ZendeferaI memorize most of my code. so wheen I see debug errors, I know usually the area where the code is located.
09:08:59Presence> This should create a file in the current folder called bootpartition.bin (approximately 40MB for the iPod 4G and Color/Photo, 80MB for the Nano and 30GB Video, and 112MB for the 60GB Video)
09:09:09Zendeferaok, I see it now :) oops, has it beenlike that?
09:09:09Presencewow, that seriously was updated in the last 10 minutes. :)
09:09:39Zendeferaok, just making sure I just didn't misread the file.
09:10:08Presencewhen I used to write perl, I'd get a few k lines in, and forget what I wrote earlier, scroll up, and be like, "who pasted this trash in here?!! NO WAY is this me!"
09:10:09Presenceheh
09:10:16Zendeferato pay for school and living, I am a web developer.
09:10:40Zendeferaphp/sql/java/javascript/html/xml :)
09:10:49Zendeferathems are my tools.
09:11:06Zendeferaeventually once I get sometime, I am going to try and contribute to rockbox.
09:11:10Presenceyou clearly freaking rock.
09:11:24ZendeferaI need to sit down and learn the code structure.
09:11:30Presenceto be able to listen to code, remember it, and edit. And not go apeshit being impatient.
09:11:34Zendeferathanks, but its hard work.
09:11:47ZendeferaI love comp sci.
09:12:05Presenceyou clearly are a freak.
09:13:15Zendefera:)
09:13:23ZendeferaI know. geek to the letter.
09:13:57Zendeferabut the world needs geeks like us :)
09:14:01Zendefera:)
09:14:34EbErTya, help with rockbox! and not with those silly plugin games, the actual os
09:15:07Zendeferagames mean nothing to me :)
09:15:33Zendeferaaccessability, and stuff are important to me, but os features and fixes are important as well.
09:16:10Presenceso the album-art patch isn't a high priority, eh? :)
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09:16:27EbErTnot a high priority for me either
09:16:28 Join Logicwax [0] (i=Logicwax@cpe-24-193-242-168.ucwphilly.res.rr.com)
09:16:51EbErTi don't wanna look at the screen much, other than to find the song i want
09:16:55Logicwaxhey, got a quick question...i put rockbox on my ipod photo....how do i mount it as a drive again in windows?
09:17:00EbErTdurn id3 tags!
09:17:20linuxstb_Logicwax: The same way as you have always done - just plug it in.
09:17:25Logicwaxyeah...
09:17:26Logicwaxnot workin
09:17:27PresenceLogicwax, just plug yer ipod into the computer's USB port, it will automatically go into disk mode.
09:17:32Logicwaxit doesnt
09:17:37Logicwaxwell, im using firewire...does that matter?
09:17:49linuxstb_Yes - Rockbox doesn't detect firewire.
09:17:56Logicwaxah! well then
09:18:04Logicwaxand does rockbox make use of the peizo clicker?
09:18:09linuxstb_You need to go into disk mode manually - reboot your ipod, and hold SELECT+PLAY
09:19:17Presencelogicwax, no, the piezo speaker doesn't have a driver in rockbox, so it remains silent for now.
09:19:23Logicwaxah, ok
09:19:39linuxstb_There's a patch on the patch tracker for it though.
09:19:53Logicwaxoh...so you can patch it to click?
09:19:56linuxstb_I expect it will be committed some time after 3.0 is released.
09:20:39 Quit dpro (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:21:01Logicwaxneat..so its already workin eh?
09:22:08linuxstb_I've never tried it. The click was the first thing I disabled when I used the Apple firmware.
09:22:09PresenceI can't wait for the "feature flood" after the freeze is lifted.
09:22:25PresenceMmmmm, needless features make ipod glow with bloat.
09:22:46Logicwaxwhat about booting apple firmware? whats the button shortcut for that
09:22:52 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:23:21Presencelogicwax: right immediatly after powering the ipod on, during the apple logo, hold down "menu" until the Retail OS loads.
09:23:28linuxstb_MENU. But it's troublesome to presss - you need to press it very early as Rockbox is booting - just before the Apple logo appears and keep it held.
09:24:29Logicwaxah got it
09:24:38Logicwaxthanks for puttin up with my n00bness
09:26:32Logicwaxhrmm...skips like hell
09:26:46Presencewhat does?
09:27:08Logicwaxmusic...if im showing the themed screen
09:27:14Logicwaxif i goto a text menu, its fine
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09:27:40linuxstb_Logicwax: That's the fault of the "peakmeter" in the default While Playing Screen (WPS). Try choosing a different WPS.
09:28:21linuxstb_"boxes" should work - select it from Browse Themes in the main menu.
09:28:37Logicwaxso...is there seeking in rockbox?
09:28:46PresenceI don't wanna be "like that", but as much as I dig the "Ajant Orange" theme, the animated dude graphic actually reduces battery life.
09:28:56Logicwaxlike in apple's....u hit the button...then you can seek
09:28:56PresenceI endeed up removing it from the .wps.
09:30:03linuxstb_Logicwax: Just hold down the NEXT or PREV button to seek.
09:30:32Logicwaxyeah...i mean the kinda seak where you use the wheel though
09:30:35EbErTi've found a lot of .wps files that skip or make load times long
09:30:38Logicwaxthat at all possible?
09:30:51EbErTwhen is 2.0 coming out?
09:31:20EbErTseek through one song, or the list of songs
09:31:40Presencethe retail Apple OS uses the wheel to seek in a song and not volume??
09:31:44linuxstb_EbErT: 2.0 came out a couple of years ago... 3.0 is due by the 29th.
09:31:45EbErTdon't press middle button like in retail
09:31:52PresenceI so have no idea how Retail OS works.. :^/
09:31:54EbErTthat's what i mean, thx
09:32:30EbErTu press middle button, then rotate on wheel like you are turning the volume
09:32:45PresenceooOOOOooooh, wow, trippy.
09:32:49Logicwaxyeah....i wanna seek like on the apple one...where you can use the wheel to spin to the end of a song
09:33:08EbErTkinda annoying, cuz it goes back to volume control after what seems like too short a period
09:33:25EbErTand you can blast yourself
09:33:40Presencehaha
09:34:36EbErTwish i could be so reliant on rockbox os as u guys are
09:34:46EbErTbut its not stable enough for me for some reason
09:35:47linuxstb_EbErT: No-one is claiming it's perfectly stable... It's still a newborn baby in Rockbox terms.
09:35:59EbErTyes, i konw
09:36:19PresenceI'm sure the 4thGen issues will be ironed out after the 3.0 freeze and people start poking around more.
09:36:29EbErTsomeone have the id3 cache tell you what files it has trouble with, or skip them
09:37:03EbErTso all 4g's are having the most problems?
09:37:10Logicwaxohhh..i can browse nfo files
09:37:12Logicwaxneat!
09:37:20linuxstb_EbRrT: I added a feature request to the tagcache page to do just that this morning - log the progress so you can see the troublesome files.
09:37:46EbErThow do i do that?
09:38:15EbErTit sometimes gives me a data abort code
09:38:52linuxstb_You can't - I just requested it....
09:39:05EbErToh, i get it
09:39:30Presenceheh
09:39:32EbErTthought u were telling me to do something. good that you added that request, many thx
09:40:07Logicwaxdamn...even on default this shit is skipppppy
09:40:36EbErTat least i didn't have that problem heh
09:40:43Presencewhat kind of file are you playing?
09:40:52Logicwaxmp3
09:40:54EbErTyou mess with the equalizers?
09:40:56Logicwaxlame 3.90 -APS
09:40:57Logicwaxnope
09:41:12Logicwaxits skipping when it tries gapless to next track
09:42:09Presencefor shits, and I really shouldn't be offering this since I don't know the consequences:
09:42:23Presencego into the debug menu and up the cpu boosting.
09:42:30Presencelike make it "1" so its always boosted
09:42:39Presencethen see if it yer skipping still.
09:42:50EbErTthat's kinda like working around the problem
09:42:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:43:02Presencewell, yeah...
09:43:05Presenceand it kills batteries.
09:43:16Presencebut damn if it ain't a neat thing to tickle.
09:43:45Logicwaxwhat menu that in again?
09:43:57Presenceaw, I gotta find out.. one sec.
09:44:04Logicwaxii saw it before..
09:44:05Logicwaxhrmm
09:44:28Presencedamn, don't have VNC up on my cygwin ui-simulator box.
09:44:43Presenceyer gonna make me get up now. :^/
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09:44:48EbErTlinuxstb_ - i tried making playlists with all the files on the ipod, as it was going through them, it told me which files' id3 tags it couldn't handle. deleted those, and the id3 force cache went farther threw, but still hung
09:44:56EbErTthat's the best i can think to do.
09:45:15Logicwaxah found ti
09:45:16Logicwax*it
09:45:47EbErTdon't do that, he's crazy man :D
09:46:14Logicwaxso lower number is faster cpu?
09:46:24Logicwaxmine was at 2 by default
09:46:29Logicwaxwhich is 72,000,000
09:48:08Presencebeats me.. I was guessing that "0" was non-boosted, "1" was auto-mode, "2" was always-boosted
09:48:40Logicwaxah
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09:48:56linuxstb_No - it's a boost counter.
09:49:26linuxstb_i.e. different parts of Rockbox increment and decrement the counter depending on whether they want to boost the CPU. Whenever the count is at 1 or more, Rockbox boosts the CPU.
09:49:48Presenceaaaah
09:49:50Logicwaxnot even the boxes theme works w/o skipping....damn
09:49:53linuxstb_So if you manually increment the boost counter, it will always be at 1 or more.
09:49:54Logicwaxcus i like that one
09:50:17Presenceso its more of a view-only area, altering the value doesn't change the boost?
09:51:00Presenceoh, nevermind, I get it.
09:51:00Presenceokay
09:51:23Logicwaxdamn, this plays flac? fuck i thought that was the part of rockbox that still skipped
09:51:25Logicwaxholy shit
09:51:31Logicwaxdo OGG's play good now too?
09:51:31linuxstb_Logicwax: It _will_ work, but at the moment, hardly any effort has gone into optimisation on the ipod. Currently everything is working too slowly.
09:51:53linuxstb_Logicwax: At the moment, vorbis decodes more efficiently than MP3 on the ipods.
09:52:05linuxstb_So you'll experience less (or no) skips.
09:52:12Logicwaxyea? so OGG is working 100% now?
09:52:27linuxstb_It always has...
09:52:53Logicwaxi thought OGG and FLAC weren't working 100% cus it required too much cpu
09:53:03linuxstb_I use FLAC, which is one of Rockbox's fastest decoders.
09:53:15linuxstb_I have no problems even with the peakmeter enabled when playing FLAC.
09:53:30Logicwaxyea? man! im listening to TOOL in FLAC on my ipod....fuck yeah
09:53:52Logicwaxinteresting how mp3 is the slower then them
09:54:44linuxstb_Mathematically, FLAC is a lot simpler than MP3 and vorbis. So that's not a surprise. MP3 should be faster than vorbis, but on the ipods the vorbis decoder has more optimisation.
09:56:59Logicwaxcan rockbox do apples AAC?
09:57:55linuxstb_Yes, but that's even slower than MP3. My only AAC file (128kbps) works, but I think it struggles with higher bitrates.
09:59:12Logicwaxim just so happy FLAC and OGG work 100%
10:00
10:00:13linuxstb_BTW, who told you that FLAC and Ogg needed too much CPU?
10:00:29Logicwaxlast i read on the ipodlinux project some months ago
10:00:37Logicwaxbut ive been so busy with school i havent looked in a bit
10:00:51Logicwaxand rockbox _is_ linux-based, right?
10:01:36 Quit Rori (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
10:01:46linuxstb_No.
10:02:35linuxstb_Rockbox was written from scratch. The ipod port uses some very low-level driver code from the ipodlinux project, but that's all.
10:03:48Logicwaxah
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10:05:27jchillerupHave rockbox implemented fairkeys/hymn so it can decrypt apple-aac on the fly
10:05:31jchillerupHas*
10:06:18linuxstb_No, and I doubt it ever will. I don't think any Rockbox developer wants to help promote the use of DRM.
10:06:57amiconnmorning all
10:07:06*ashridah gets out his quantum-computer attachment for his iriver
10:07:07linuxstb_Good morning.
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10:07:11*amiconn just started a runtime test on mini g2
10:07:14{EDF}SShi again
10:07:29amiconnlinuxstb_: Didn't you try to run the flac decoder on archos?
10:07:40{EDF}SSHas anyone made nethack for rockbox? :P
10:07:51linuxstb_amiconn: Yes.
10:07:52ashridah{EDF}SS: no, surprisingly.
10:08:03linuxstb_I should still have a patch somewhere...
10:08:11JdGordonlinuxstb_: well getting drm working wouldnt really be promoting drm.. more freeing the poor sods that pay for it
10:08:14amiconnlinuxstb_: Do you remember what speed you got?
10:08:18{EDF}SSashridah it'd be nice to have, but probably difficult to play :)
10:08:18ashridah{EDF}SS: doing things would be a pain tho, with the limited number of keys.
10:08:23amiconnThis was with the C version, correct?
10:08:43jchilleruplinuxstb_, It's definitely not promoting DRM
10:08:44linuxstb_I can't remember, but it should be in the logs.
10:08:51jchillerupIt's removing it so that it can be played
10:09:00ashridah{EDF}SS: well, it's turn based, so perhaps not.
10:09:08linuxstb_jchillerup: Just use hymn on your PC to remove it...
10:09:12ashridahjust need an efficient menu for the different keys
10:09:22jchillerupWell, yeah, but it could be nice on the ipod
10:09:31Zendeferalinuxstd you know anything aout the voice features of rockbox?
10:09:33{EDF}SSheh well I'll leave that up to the ingenious folks that invented Rockbox :)
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10:10:14linuxstb_jchillerup: Then feel free to implement it. But I'm pretty sure I speak for all the devs when I say that DRM is not wanted in Rockbox.
10:10:22jchillerupOK.
10:10:28{EDF}SShaha DRM who would want that?
10:10:45jchillerupI would want a tool that strips the DRM of AAC files....
10:10:48Zendeferawhat I am wondering, how dificult would it be able to add a speack option to directories and files, so it actually reads the dirs and files, so instead of spell="j a c k s m i t h - ..." it'll say jack smith dash
10:11:02{EDF}SSon yeah, to REMOVE DRM would be nice
10:11:06linuxstb_amiconn: I made the patch on 24th March, so that will be the day to search the logs.
10:11:11jchillerupThat's what I mean, {EDF}SS
10:11:23Zendeferalikeit reads the menus
10:11:40JdGordonare the players even fast enough to rip the drm and play it otf?
10:11:50linuxstb_jchillerup: Removing DRM is something you should do on your PC as soon as you buy a track.
10:11:53jchillerupI don't know.. But I know there is no FPU
10:12:03Zendeferadrm blows :)
10:12:07jchilleruplinuxstb_, Well, yes
10:12:44amiconnHmm, 2 frames per second... :(
10:12:48jchillerupbut when people convert from itunes-controlled ipods to rockbox-freed ipods, they probably won't understand why none of their songs will play
10:13:01jchillerupAnd that is because of DRM
10:13:12GaloisIMO people need to be made aware of the DRM issue rather than hiding it from them
10:13:14jchillerupIt could start by stripping the DRM, and *then* play the track
10:13:37jchillerupGalois, you could make it so that it says "Stripping DRM, please wait."
10:13:39Zendeferagalois :) long time no see my friend.
10:13:43markunjchillerup: or displaying a message that it cannot playback a file with DRM
10:13:55jchillerupYes, and what would the newbies say?
10:13:59Zendeferaso any familier with the voice code?
10:13:59JdGordonalthough adding riping to rockbox would lead it to some pretty merky waters
10:14:03jchillerupThey'll say that Rockbox sucks
10:14:07markunso?
10:14:10jchillerup... when it's in fact themselves..
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10:15:02Galoisin that case we can display an informative message telling them why Apple is responsible for the suckage and not Rockbox
10:15:11JdGordonhaha
10:15:14jchillerupHehe
10:15:17Galoisbut right now it's not an issue, most rockbox users are smart enough to know what DRM means
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10:15:24jchillerupOkay
10:15:34JdGordonGalois: i beg to differ
10:15:47Galoisfairplay/hymn is not a long term solution. Apple's drm will get better.
10:15:54jchillerupYes.
10:15:58jchillerupBut so will fairplay/hymn
10:16:00Galoiswhy do you think they switched to intel chips? performance is a smoke screen
10:16:01JdGordonsome of the ppl coming in here asking for ipod help arnt the sharpest of tacks...
10:16:10GaloisTPM is going to be a reality very soon
10:16:10amiconn15..25% realtime
10:16:30linuxstb_amiconn: Shorten is even faster than FLAC, but I don't think I got as far as testing it.
10:16:52amiconnShorten also uses lcd_decode, correct?
10:17:02amiconnBah, lpc_decode of course
10:17:07markun:)
10:17:12linuxstb_I can't remember...
10:17:26linuxstb_I don't think it uses exactly the same function as flac though.
10:17:32Zendeferalinuxstd, how did the voice code?
10:17:38Zendeferaerrm
10:17:46Zendeferawho did the voice code I meant
10:17:52linuxstb_Not me.
10:18:11Zendeferais there away to find out who did it?
10:18:13linuxstb_But various people have contributed I think.
10:18:29linuxstb_CVS logs.
10:18:34Zendeferaok, thanks.
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10:21:50JdGordonashridah: i got 3 tix to the soccer tonight free.. wanna come?
10:22:12JdGordonhttp://members.optusnet.com.au/jdgordy/BLK12_R1.JPG
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10:22:23ashridahJdGordon: nah. not a soccer fan
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10:22:34JdGordonlook @ the pic
10:22:36ashridahbesides, major assignment due RSN :(
10:22:38Logicwaxsorry got disconneted
10:22:45Logicwaxso...is it possible to have it sleep?
10:22:51Logicwaxor does rockbox always have to reboot
10:23:06amiconnhmm...
10:23:17JdGordonmy friend sent that threough msn
10:23:21*JdGordon thought it was funny
10:23:38amiconnlinuxstb_: Do I remember correctly that flac was content at 22MHz on iriver?
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10:23:40linuxstb_amiconn: Would implementing FLAC in the MAS be at all possible? Is there any documentation available at all?
10:24:05amiconnThere's some leaked documentation about the dsp core
10:24:07ashridahheh
10:24:17amiconnWhat's unknown is how to use the interfaces
10:24:40linuxstb_I'm not 100% sure about 22MHz. It definitely worked lower than the default, but I can't remember how low.
10:24:40Logicwaxcus everytime i hold down play...it actuallly shuts completely off...and when i turn it back on, its like booting
10:24:43Logicwaxso thats why i asked
10:24:57amiconnAlso, mas dsp assembler is rather nightmarish
10:25:13linuxstb_Are the opcodes part of that leaked documentation?
10:25:21amiconn(1) it's a harvard architecture, with 1x code and 2x data memory
10:25:52amiconn(2) You have to keep an eye on the number of cycles an instruction takes, and sync the pipeline yourself
10:26:24amiconnIf you read a register too early, the result of the previous instruction might not yet be there...
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10:27:10dj-fuHIGHFIVE ROCKBOX
10:27:22dj-fuwho do I have to kill around here to get the freezing period stopped
10:27:27dj-fuI want some new features gaw damnit!
10:27:29Presencefather time.
10:28:07linuxstb_Logicwax: No, there is no sleep mode in Rockbox. It may happen, but we prefer to do things to make boot time as quick as possible. If you remove the Apple firmware from your ipod, you'll significantly increase boot-up time.
10:28:30Presencewhoa, I didn't know the apple firmware could be completely removed.
10:28:34Presencethats hot.
10:28:45dj-fumm, you just build the firmware image without splicing the apple one into it
10:28:45dj-fuafaik
10:28:58dj-fustill good to keep a backup lying around so you can dd it back in case of mass failure
10:29:06linuxstb_Almost - you create a tiny (512 byte) dummy file and use that instead of apple_os.bin
10:29:38Presencewow.
10:29:58dj-fusex, no?
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10:30:19amiconnlinuxstb_: pm..
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10:42:12Jungti1234yahoo
10:42:16Jungti1234hello all
10:43:10{EDF}SShi
10:43:45Jungti1234TORX T6 fits to E10.
10:44:27Jungti1234wow... very small :)
10:45:14Zendeferawhen playing on the ipod video, what do I hit to stop playing a song?
10:45:30 Quit muesli|delhi ("ich will Khe!!!")
10:46:13{EDF}SShold play/pause
10:46:31Zendeferathe switch?
10:46:50{EDF}SSplay/pause is a switch?
10:47:01Zendeferaok.
10:47:12Zendeferaand where on the touch wheel is stop?
10:47:24{EDF}SS[04:51] <{EDF}SS> hold play/pause
10:47:50ZendeferaI'm sorry
10:48:05{EDF}SSnp
10:48:07ZendeferaI'm blind, where is that, is that the top or bottum of the wheel?
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10:48:26{edf}ssisn't the bottom of the wheel a play/pause button?
10:48:47Zendeferaok. I wwasn't sure.
10:48:48Zendeferathanks
10:48:57{edf}sswtf....
10:49:04{edf}ssgnite all
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11:00
11:09:29Jungti1234afffff
11:09:45Jungti1234anyone have U10?
11:10:59markunJungti1234: perhaps you can ask in iriverfans.com
11:11:47Jungti1234Can there get answer fast?
11:11:54markunDon't know
11:12:06Jungti1234hmm
11:12:18markunBut they opened up a U10: http://www.iriverfans.com/Article_Show.asp?ArticleID=404
11:12:25Jungti1234Chinese isn't here?
11:12:55markunAsk him: http://www.iriverfans.com/UserInfo.asp?UserID=1
11:13:13markunYou can try to mail or MSN him
11:13:51Jungti1234damn
11:14:05Jungti1234My internet status is bad now.
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11:42:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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12:06:05Jungti1234hmm
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12:13:07Jungti1234wait..
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12:26:32Jungti1234ahhh.......
12:29:09peturjungti1234?
12:29:32markunpetur: he's trying to open his iriver E10
12:29:38peturheh
12:32:03Jungti1234help.......... :'(
12:35:59*petur hands Jungti1234 his box of torx screwdrivers
12:36:13Jungti1234nono
12:36:21Jungti1234I have driver.
12:36:25peturgood
12:36:41Jungti1234I drew out all screws.
12:36:50Jungti1234But, it doesn't open.
12:37:04petursome clips?
12:37:09Jungti1234I tried to open it using telephone card.
12:37:25Jungti1234it broke! hahaha
12:37:31peturbe carefull ;)
12:37:41Jungti1234hm
12:42:35markunpetur: are planning to work on a usb stack soon?
12:42:48peturnot soon no
12:43:04peturfirst need to access the chip
12:43:42peturI hope LinusN gets the time to figure out all the connections on the h3x0, we still miss a lot of them
12:44:27peturI'm writing an eeprom driver now in order to fix the retailos config corruption
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12:48:39romanpresshi, i have a question concerning colors on rockbox.
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12:49:41dj-fuo rly?
12:50:05romanpressit seems i have changed the foreground and background color to black... now the ipod is just black... how can i change this colors on my computer?
12:50:54peturreset your settings by putting hold on while rockbox starts
12:51:34romanpressis hold the middlebutton on the ipod? (sorry stupid question)
12:51:51peturwouldn't know, don't have an ipoo
12:51:58petur:P
12:52:22amiconnpetur: I suggest to wait for Linus finding out more about the hardware. If the eeprom really isn't i2c controlled, (1) there's at least one missing signal line and (2) I doubt that the signal lines are really hooked up in parallel to the pcf50606 i2c
12:52:47peturamiconn: I'm sure the wiki is wrong
12:53:51dj-furomanpress, toggle the 'hold' switch it's at the top,
12:53:52peturthere's no indication that it's an spi device, so I'm working from the fact it's an 24c02 (i2c)
12:53:54Jungti1234ahhhh damn!!
12:54:44peturamiconn: I can use the pcf50606 functions to access it if it is on the same bus, so test code should be easy
12:55:16amiconnpetur: Hah, IriverH3XXHardwareComponents even says it's a 24C02, only the datasheets page lists a 25C02 ...
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12:55:40peturI already changed the components page
12:56:33peturI had a good look at the pcb pictures but it's hard to figure out what it really is
12:56:58peturI think it either says ISSI or LSSI 402 or A02
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13:02:15Jungti1234hmm.. http://cafefiles.naver.net/data15/2006/5/18/173/DSCN2751.jpg
13:02:36romanpressi slided back to the original firmware on my ipodnano. when i shut down by pressing play 5sec, it starts on the restart back there, but i want to start with rockboc. how?
13:02:41Jungti1234I drew out all that 4 screws.
13:06:42Jungti1234I gave up...
13:07:01Jungti1234I will try it again on weekend.
13:07:47romanpressi'm back on rockbox...
13:09:02amiconnpetur: The small images clearly show "C02-3Z" in the 2nd row. The 3 means 2.5..5.5V, the Z just stands for TSSOP
13:09:08romanpressit works by toggle hold... the colors are back... thanks
13:09:12 Part romanpress
13:09:53peturamiconn: but I looked at the 2 big images from lostlogic at the top
13:10:00markunperhaps we shouldn't allow the text and background colours to be the same..
13:10:26peturmarkun: been discussed before, somebody should just do it...
13:10:33amiconnWhat's irritating is that the 24Cxx datasheet always have an A affixed to the code, while the 25Cxx datasheet hasn't
13:10:42amiconnmarkun: We don't...
13:11:18peturamiconn: on lostlogic's pics it is either A02 or 402
13:11:40peturI think it's 402 (they ommitted the C ?)
13:12:50amiconnHmm, looks like 402...
13:13:09*amiconn wonders why the small pics then show C02...
13:13:34amiconnMaybe there are several hardware revisions with different eeproms?
13:13:48peturthey can change chips during production if functionality is identical
13:13:49*amiconn hopes that this isn't the case
13:15:41amiconnI mean that there might be pcb versions with the 24c02 and others with the 25c02...
13:17:12peturI can't beleive they'd do that
13:17:21amiconnWhy?
13:18:07amiconnThe archos player exists in 3 different hardware revisions. The latest even has a different lcd with different charset
13:18:10peturswitching between spi and i2c? have a way to detect hw revision in firmware...
13:18:24peturtoo much trouble, no gain
13:18:33amiconnThe recorder has several details differing between versions
13:19:05amiconnMaybe an old chip becomes unavailable?
13:19:19petur24c02 is *very* common
13:19:19amiconnThat's what archos did in the Ondio - btw a rather weird thing
13:19:49peturissi is not the only offering this, and afaik they're all pin-compatible
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13:20:19amiconnThey designed an el backlight circuit around the Sipex SP4403. Even though they left out the actual components from the retail version, they maintained the feature on the board
13:20:20peturI already used that chip 10 years ago
13:20:54amiconnWhen Sipex withdrew from the el driver market, they redesigned the circuit for the NPC SM8141BV
13:22:25peturI can believe that case, but for the 24c02 I see no reason. And if the rest is i2c, why start using spi?
13:22:42peturunless they started with spi of course
13:22:55peturthat would have been a design mistake
13:23:22amiconnNot the first one, and not the only one to be seen in our targets...
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13:32:41JdGordonaussie aussie aussie!!!
13:32:53JdGordonOY OY OY!!
13:32:58JdGordonaussie aussie aussie!!!
13:35:01*dj-fu ponders
13:35:08dj-fudo you have the right channel, JdGordon ?
13:35:24JdGordonbah..
13:35:34JdGordonaus beat greece 1-0 :D
13:35:41dj-fuoh, sweet.
13:35:42dj-fugrats aus.
13:36:48 Quit Jungti1234 ()
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13:38:00peturJdGordon: beat them in what? making noise? That's obvious :p
13:38:13JdGordonsoccer
13:38:28peturso what?
13:38:32JdGordonexcatly..
13:38:36JdGordonwe dont play soccer here
13:38:48JdGordonbut its the last game before the world cup..
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13:42:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:44:00markunWouldn't it make more sense to check for CONFIG_CPU == SH7034 in firmware/driver/serial.c?
13:47:43peturbah, another nmi.... bbl
13:48:54JdGordoncheers
13:48:59JdGordonwrong window :p
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13:54:12Genre9mp3JdGordon: I'm not surprised that you beaten us...
13:56:44ashridahwe did? whoa
13:56:50ashridahi'm surprised that we did :)
13:57:04ashridahhow was the game?
13:57:10JdGordonnot a bad crowd.. 95000.. record for aussie soccer..
13:57:13JdGordonmeh, boring :D
13:57:49Genre9mp3hehe....Too many greeks line in the Aus... ;)
13:57:54Genre9mp3line = live
13:58:16JdGordonthey said melbourne has the largest greek community outside of greece.. or something liek that!
13:58:31Genre9mp3yes...it's true...
14:00
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14:08:53O11Hi!
14:09:04 Nick O11 is now known as Super (n=52236176@labb.contactor.se)
14:10:21SuperI was wondering if anyone could tell me about rockbox builds for the h300
14:10:33 Join Mikachu [0] (i=Mikachu@kr-lun-154-152-233-83.3.cust.bredband2.com)
14:10:52SuperI have 1.29k firmware but I'm not sure how you check what version of rockbox you have..
14:12:10SuperCould anyone tell me?
14:12:20JdGordongoto menu > info > version
14:12:56SuperSo it's that really long number that you don't even get a chance to read because it goes on to the credits after a second or two?
14:13:06 Quit dj-fu (Remote closed the connection)
14:13:42SuperI just want to find out if there is a newer version of rockbox that I could install for my player and what is updated on it..
14:13:45 Join dj-fu [0] (n=deejay@202-89-151-29.ubs.qsi.net.nz)
14:15:17SuperHow would I find out?
14:16:29SuperAnybody know?
14:16:40JdGordonthere is an updated version almost every day...
14:16:50JdGordonso unless u updated it yesterday there is a newer version
14:17:28Superhow would I know what's been added since my version?
14:17:36SuperI want to be able to appreciate it =P
14:17:39JdGordonrockbox.org has a changelog
14:18:56markunJdGordon: which one are you talking about?
14:19:06JdGordon?
14:19:25JdGordonim talking about the cvs changelog..
14:19:41markunThis one? http://www.rockbox.org/since25.html
14:19:46JdGordonno
14:20:04JdGordonRecent CVS activity
14:20:10 Quit damaki (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:20:15Superdoesn't really tell you much though does it?
14:20:24Superit only goes back less than a week
14:20:36JdGordonthen look at the link markun pasted
14:22:26Superdoesn't work
14:23:57amiconnIf you go to the daily builds page, then click on "Source Archive" -> "old", you'll find a table with the last 30 days worth of source. One table column links to the changelog of each day
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14:25:04zblachhi
14:25:29zblachbrowsed the FAQ, but there's a bit of info I haven't been able to find.
14:26:06zblachif I were to install rockbox on an iPod video, what video formats would be supported?
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14:29:32SuperIs there a newer version of the korean firmware?
14:29:42SuperI can't seem to find the h300 firmware thread..
14:29:55theli_uazblach, none
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14:30:44JdGordonSuper: u want the iriver firwmare changes or rockbox changes?
14:31:01markunzblach: you would have to boot back into the original firmware to playback your videos
14:35:01Superi want the rockbox changes
14:35:11Superbut I think i've found them now..
14:35:40Superi was just also curious if there was a new version of the official korean iriver firmwear.. just though might as well have it..
14:36:06petur1.29 is the last one
14:36:14JdGordonisnt there a 1.30?
14:36:29peturthere's an 1.30eu but that one removes video playback
14:36:48Genre9mp3the last Korean version is 1.29
14:38:45Superoh, ok
14:39:25 Quit midkay (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:39:27Superany particular updates to the rockbox since about half a year ago? =P
14:39:28zblachmarkun: seriously"?
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14:39:46zblachthat's a bit of a minus
14:40:03preglowvideo isn't a priority for us
14:40:21markunzblach: if it's too much of a problem maybe rockbox isn't for you
14:40:32preglowespecially not considering the massive amount of work required to make it work
14:41:12*amiconn just discovered another bug in talk.c while testing his updated show_info() :-(
14:41:13Superto update my rockbox do i just have to extract the daily build to my root?
14:41:41zblachmarkun: it's great for my ipod mini, don't get me wrong. i was just curious about video
14:42:00zblachno video support for a video product seems a little weird. that's all
14:42:38amiconnThe ipod video isn't a video product imho
14:42:48amiconnIt's a dap with additional video capability
14:42:58zblachdap?
14:42:59markunzblach: noone has figured out how to use the chip that decodes the video
14:43:08preglowzblach: digital audio player
14:43:42zblachinteresting. didn't know that.
14:43:54zblachthat makes watching mkv a bit out of the question then.
14:43:59preglowhaha
14:44:11preglowthe apple os doesn't support mkv either, no?
14:44:16preglowwould surprise me greatly
14:44:32tom__Anyone got the DOOM plugin working?
14:44:39preglowlots of people have
14:44:46tom__where do you put the base.wad
14:44:53preglow/games/doom, afaik
14:44:56preglowit's all in the wiki page
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14:47:33JdGordonis the freeze ending monday?
14:48:02XavierGrprobably
14:48:08JdGordonwoohoo :D
14:48:22markunJdGordon: depends on how much everyone has worked on rockbox before monday I guess
14:48:59JdGordonis there anything not audio/remote related that needs fixing that is relativly simple but boring that i can do?
14:49:09*JdGordon finished all my assignments for the semster :D
14:49:15XavierGrmarkun: they said they will release no matter what or...?
14:50:14XavierGrAlso the lang files must be updated.
14:50:38XavierGrI will sit today and update the greel.lang
14:51:09XavierGra mail on the ml & dev-ml lists should be assembled to let the translators know.
14:51:27pixelmabtw, XavierGr: have you fixed the minesweeper plugin for Ondio?
14:51:30XavierGryes
14:51:49XavierGrhttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5422
14:52:02pixelmawhen will it be commited, or did I miss something?
14:52:22pixelmaoh, thx - I will test it
14:52:26XavierGrwell until a dev has free time and feels like it...
14:52:36*XavierGr fingers markun! :D
14:53:07XavierGrpixelma: it was one liner BTW
14:53:08markun:)
14:53:19amiconnpixelma: You need to compile yourself to test the patch...
14:53:41pixelmathat's something i cannot do yet
14:53:48JdGordonhttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5305 <- is it FLAC that u cant seek through it without actually readin the whole track up the the point u want?
14:53:56daurn|laptopyo
14:53:59daurn|laptopsup all
14:56:00tom__ok, DOOM on my iRiver owns, thanks whoever came up with that :p
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14:58:22daurn|laptoplol
14:58:26daurn|laptopdoom is on everything
15:00
15:01:17tom__what about this 'rockboy'
15:01:29tom__is that just an emulator?
15:01:38JdGordonyup
15:01:44JdGordonu need to find the roms
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15:01:51daurn|laptopisn't it a pokemon or something?
15:01:52daurn|laptop:P
15:02:29Mikachuoh, not talking about me
15:04:14tom__so what do you do, just execute the ROM file?
15:04:48daurn|laptoplol
15:04:54daurn|laptopMikachu
15:04:55daurn|laptopXD
15:06:09daurn|laptopanyway
15:06:18daurn|laptopany1 here got an archos gmini 40*
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15:09:52daurn|laptopis there anotehr rockbox channel anywhere?
15:10:10tom__this rockboy run slow for anyone else?
15:10:38ashridahit's not running at 100% realtime, no.
15:10:49tom__ah
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15:11:00ashridahwork on it stopped a while back
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15:11:48tom__:( was a cool idea too
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15:20:16webguest94la
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15:25:46*petur wonders what's wrong with http://www.rockbox.org/since25.html
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15:32:51JdGordonpetur: they've been complaining about problems with viewcvs or something.. prob related
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15:49:52amiconnGah, red sims
15:50:09JdGordonbloody roadrunner records... one of thier sampler cds is in wma.. all the others are mp3.. stupid ppl
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15:54:55amiconnmarkun: The patch you committed contains C99 style declarations...
15:55:07amiconn(and the button wait is unnecessarily complex)
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16:00
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16:05:55markunamiconn: when is a declaration C99 style?
16:08:09amiconnC99 allows mixing declarations and code. Earlier standards do not.
16:09:19amiconnHmm, the contributing document doesn't state that we want declarations before code...
16:10:39 Join theli_ [0] (n=theli@pension-icom.intercom.net.ua)
16:10:46amiconnIt's one of those conventions just floating around...
16:13:37lostlogicmmm, earth quake in stockholm, swedes have fun?
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16:15:42pixelmajust read that too
16:16:58darkless_well, I didn't feel it here in Copenhagen, couldn't have been that much... Then again, Stockholm is several hundred kms away
16:16:59markunamiconn: can you comment on this: http://130.89.160.166/rockbox/minesweeper.diff
16:17:19amiconnCheck my latest commit...
16:17:53markunah, thanks :)
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16:18:56pixelmathey say that it was right about 2 on Richter scale
16:19:53amiconnAlmost unnoticeable then...
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16:21:39*petur is so clumsy he can't even access an eeprom :(
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16:22:14peturno time now, have to check this later...
16:23:02DgentlyCan I pester you guys with an FMR hard drive question?
16:27:10DgentlyI have an old FM recorder, that's had a Hitachi 80gig in it for a couple years, no problems.
16:27:32DgentlyI just swapped it out for a Samsung 120gig, and I'm getting all kinds of ata errors.
16:28:12DgentlyI'm assuming I need to rip it out and put a different brand in. Anyone know what brand of 120gig is good?
16:28:26DgentlyOr if I can do anything to fix the errors?
16:30:33DgentlySometimes it boots fine, sometimes it'll boot, but not show anything in the file list, sometimes it just panics with an ata -32 error.
16:32:47tom__how'd you turn in the fade LCD option on? :)
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16:36:25krypticmindhey guys
16:39:27amiconnDgently: I'd think there's either a battery contact problem (quite common on archos, there are some documents regarding the fmr on the rockbox site),
16:39:58amiconnor perhaps the disk is in the wrong mode. Perhaps it's set to cable select?
16:41:10amiconnGenerally, all standard 2.5" hard drives should work in the archos. Only some Toshiba OEM drives are reported to have problems, which iirc can also be fixed by some wiring
16:41:50amiconnDisks >128GB (or >136GB in harddisk manufacturer terms) will only be detected & used as 128GB
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16:51:41DgentlyThat's what I was hoping.
16:51:58DgentlyI'll rip it apart again, and check the connections.
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16:55:28FebsBluebrother, where can I find the list of all of the platforms and the macros that we are using for them (e.g., IRIVER_H100_PAD, etc.)?
16:55:44bluebrotherFebs, in the platform directory
16:56:29FebsThanks. Second question: can LaTeX do indexing? I assume so, but how difficult is it to set up? It would be great to have an index in the manual.
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16:56:55bluebrotherit's pretty easy but it needs to be done through the whole text.
16:57:06baaps[ERR] File is too large for firmware partition, aborting.
16:57:11baapsI kep getting this error
16:57:39bluebrotherit's like if theres anything I want to have in the index I add a macro (\index? I need to look it up, haven't used this for long)
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16:57:56DgentlyThanks for the advice.
16:58:17bluebrotherthen add a \makeindex at the page where the index should be generated, but latex needs to run makeidx manually.
16:58:32bluebrotherI already thought about adding an index myself.
16:58:51FebsMaybe that's something we could target for 3.1!
16:58:54bluebrotherbut I won't have time looking into it deeper until next month.
16:58:59bluebrothersure.
16:59:48FebsFor \opt, should we be using IRIVER_H100_PAD or iriver1xx? Is IRIVER_H100_PAD for general use or only in the context of button configures? (Sorry if these are pretty basic questions.)
16:59:50bluebrotherimo some of the platform specific stuff is a bit clumsy, I'd like to have a better solution for 3.1
17:00
17:00:48bluebrotherFebs, I haven't introduced those so I'm not sure how this was intended. I guess it would be the best to use the PAD stuff when referring to the keyboard and h1xx when referring to the device itself.
17:01:22bluebrotherbut I'd like it better to be mostly complete independent from the device itself and only have capabilities, like HAVE_RECORDING
17:02:06FebsAgreed. It would be useful to have categories such as "IPOD," "IRIVER," etc. for things like the manual that are platform specific, but don't vary much from model to model on a particular platform.
17:02:15Febsmanual/installation instructions
17:04:37FebsUsing \opt{IPOD} would be easier than \opt{ipod4g,ipodcolor,ipodnano,ipodmini,ipodvideo}. Also easier to update it, for example, support for 3g is added.
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17:06:45tucozFebs, we could add that. I have thought of it myself some time ago
17:08:18FebsI think that we should. Again using 3g as an example, it will be a nightmare to have to update every single \opt that references the different ipod platforms.
17:08:22tucozregarding the key-macros. I think it's a pita to use them. However, they were added to mimic the way the rockbox-source works. I would want to have a simpler way of defining key-tables, but I can not think of a another way this coult be done.
17:11:23tucozit's a moot-point. Now we can define the keys for several players by using their shared pad (IPOD_4G_PAD). If another player gets added with the same pad, it's only the platform.tex that needs the define
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17:12:17tucozBut for several of the older players, this is not the case. I don't think we'll ever add another player with a IRIVER_H100_PAD for instance.
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17:22:41Febstucoz, I must admit, I am not at all familiar with how the button definitions work. But is there a way to define buttons by function, and then have LaTeX insert the appropriate button based on the platform?
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17:23:02FOAD_Hey.
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17:23:17Febs(without using the PAD conditional, I mean)
17:23:24tucozFebs, sure.
17:23:40tucozbut then the outcome would be unpredictable
17:23:58FebsI'm not sure that I follow.
17:24:06tucozhave a look in the platform files to see how the keys are defined
17:24:31*Febs goes looking ...
17:24:59tucozthe opts are a common denominator. It is not certain that a target with SWCODEC has the ButtonStop defined
17:27:18tucozThe only keys that are in common for all the targets are left and right
17:27:57tucozeven if we could
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17:29:13FebsOK, bear with me if I am being dense here, but why can't we define the buttons the same way we define, for example, \playertype? I'll give you an example:
17:29:15tucoz, in theory add IRIVER to the optable commands and use this for the keytables, it is not probable that this will work on the next iriver target
17:30:04tucozfor now, both h100 and h300 share the same keys but with different naming. However, this is not likely with a newer iriver target.
17:31:17FebsOK, I understand that, but why can't we define buttons without using the \opt, in the same manner that we define, \playertype, or \dap? So for example:
17:31:50FebsH100: \newcommand{\ButtonUp}{Up}
17:31:59tucozI get it. But it is not possible, because all the players do not share the same keys.
17:32:09Febsipodnane: \newcommand{\ButtonUp}{Scroll Up}
17:32:15Febsnane\nano
17:33:48tucozthink of the archoses for instance. Those have F1, F2 etc. Those keys are not available for the other targets
17:34:17daurn|laptoptucuz: you have a 40*?
17:34:38FebsI guess that the difference is that you are thinking in terms of buttons. I am thinking that we define buttons in terms of functions. For example, all platforms have a button that invokes the main menu, right?
17:34:39tucozdaurn|laptop, what is that?
17:35:11daurn|laptoparchos
17:35:22FebsCouldn't we define \ButtonMainMenu in each platform, and then use that instead of a complicated /opt?
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17:35:51FebsIt wouldn't matter that the button that called the main menu is the AB button on iriver, the "menu" button on ipod, etc.
17:36:04tucozFebs, I see. Hmm. That might be an option. But, we would still have to opt the key tables as the number of keys differ
17:36:16daurnimatoreg, ipod has 4 buttons + hold + scroller
17:36:31tucozdaurnimator, I do not have an archos.
17:36:43daurnimatorarchos gmini 40* has dpad(4 buttons), play, stop, F1,F2,F3,go & back
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17:38:21Febstucoz, perhaps, but to use another example, if we defined, say \ButtonVolumeUp, I think it would make thinks much easier. The button mapping table entry would be something "Volume up\\ButtonVolumeUp"
17:38:52tucozFebs, right. I understand what you mean.
17:38:58tom__what's the default battery capacity?
17:39:04tucoztom__, what player?
17:39:08tom__h300
17:39:28FebsSuppose a new platform, with dedicated volume buttons, was ported to Rockbox. We'd just define \newcommand{\ButtonVolumeUp}{Volume Up} in the platform file and no changes would be necessary elsewhere in the manual.
17:39:34tucozdon't know. it's 1300mAh for the h1xx
17:39:47peturI think it's 1400mAh
17:39:50Hansmaulwurf1300
17:39:55Hansmaulwurfon H120
17:40:00FebsI think that H100 and H300 use the same battery.
17:40:36tucozbut that would make the platform-files really dense. The same keys are used for numerous things. Think of the plugins.
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17:42:07tucozI understand what you mean, but I am not sure if that would work.
17:42:31FebsTrue, but with the current method, all of the rest of the manual is really dense. Let's say we got to a point where Rockbox suppored 100 platforms. Someone adds a new function. It could take 1 minute to write the text to document the function, and 3 days to do all the \opt statements.
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17:43:46tucozYou are right about that. The key-tables are a pain these days. But, I am not sure how a separation by feature would simplify it in the long run.
17:44:21tucozWhat would happen if a player had a lot of keys, or if a player had something like 3 keys
17:45:13 Part Dgently
17:45:59FebsWhy would that make a difference? Take the extreme example, where every function in Rockbox had a separate, specific button assign to it. The platform file for that platform would still be the same as the 3 button platform.
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17:46:59tucozSo, you mean we should define a macro for all the functions? It might work, but I am not convinced
17:47:01FebsGranted, my theory makes sense if there are a finite, reasonable number of functions to map buttons to.
17:47:14tucozI think I agree more now than 5 minutes ago
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17:48:28tucozHmm. the functions would be move up/down/left/right, enter menu, select, play, volume up/down ...
17:48:41Hansmaulwurfand hold?
17:48:53FebsJust thinking out loud of the functions we would need to define: MenuUp, MenuDown, Left, Right, VolumeUp, VolumeDown, Select, Play, Stop, Menu, QuickMenu,
17:49:07bluebrotherRecord
17:49:13Febsgrrr. latency. was typing that while tucoz typed his list.
17:49:17tucozhehe
17:49:40tucozrecord is accessed from a menu
17:49:53bluebrotherI'd also vote for Back and Forward.
17:50:13bluebrotheryes, but the iriver has a recording button which starts recording.
17:50:29tucozoh. Didn't know that was mapped to that yet :)
17:50:45bluebrotherlike Play, but like "PlayRecord" ;-)
17:50:46Hansmaulwurfbluebrother: but only in the iriver firmware
17:50:57Hansmaulwurfon rockbox, nothing happens when u press the recording button
17:51:04bluebrotherHansmaulwurf, I used it some days ago with rockbox.
17:51:17bluebrotherlet me check again ...
17:51:27FebsRecord does nothing in the WPS. It DOES do something in the record screen.
17:51:42tucozFebs, I am too tired to think. What would happen to the plugins? Will that still be an opt-hell?
17:51:49Hansmaulwurfjust installed the latest bleeding edge bluebrother, nothing happens with the recording button (at least when i am in the WPS)
17:52:15bluebrotherI used it in the recording screen ;-)
17:52:18Hansmaulwurfah ok
17:52:26Hansmaulwurfyou should have said that ;)
17:52:31bluebrotherbut strangely the status bar still displays the stop sign.
17:53:57krypticmindhum, the UI simulator doesn't do iPods, right?
17:54:00Febstucoz, I don't know. I haven't focused on the Plugin chapter of the manual at all, and the only plugin I really use is Jewels.
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17:54:34krypticmindscratch my last
17:54:34bluebrotherbtw, is recording draining much more power than playing? I had the impression my battery was running out way faster
17:55:34peturthe disk will spinn every 3 minutes
17:55:59peturas recording wav fills the buffer quickly
17:56:08tucozWe should force the plugin writers to write a .tex document before we accept the plugin to cvs
17:56:09peturno idea if we're boosting
17:56:22bluebrotherhmm, ok, this is way more often than when playing.
17:56:37bluebrotheriirc the hdd is the main power eater, isn't it?
17:57:01peturit is
17:57:08Febstucoz, my gut feeling is that even if we had to still use opt-hell for plugins, my suggestion would still be more efficient for the bulk of the manual.
17:57:26FebsBut let me think about it a bit further and maybe try to map out all of the functions we would need.
17:58:02tucozas it is now. The plugin chapter feels like the bulk of the manual. All plugins have a key-table and it's a bit hard to complete those...
17:58:21FebsLet me take a look at it and maybe I can come up with a sort of proof of concept.
17:58:30tucozFebs, sounds great.
17:59:10bluebrotherwouldn't it be possible to add a generic section which would mention the basic (direction, select) keys that are used in all plugins and only mention keys that are different?
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18:03:10qwm:>
18:03:13qwmhey.
18:03:22qwmhow long does it take to recharge the nano? :P
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19:37:19tucozwhat is wrong with viewcvs? I get a python traceback when clicking on the files Febs added. http://www.rockbox.org/viewcvs.cgi/manual/getting_started/ipod_install.tex
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19:38:40ender`i don't see ipod_install.tex in there
19:39:21tucozender`, the files are added to cvs though
19:40:24tucozFebs, why do you have the executable flag set to the files you commited?
19:40:29ender`well, viewcvs doesn't see them
19:41:36tucozviewcvs should see them as I got them when I cvs up'ed
19:41:59FebsI didn't, unless it's set by default. But I thought that you had to use the -kb flag for that (which I definitely did not do).
19:42:33tucozFebs, ok. I don't know why they are set. Maybe your editor does that for you.
19:43:07preglowcygwin does it by default
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19:43:29tucozI see. Wonder why
19:43:47preglowit's retarded
19:43:52tucozhehe
19:44:28Mikachubad umask?
19:44:43rconancould be
19:45:06rconanthe umask on my FAT partitions gives everyting +x
19:45:11rconanbut i like it like that
19:45:17tucoznot that it matters, but is it possible to change file permissons in cvs?
19:46:02bluebrotherumask on FAT? Is fat capable of storing a x flag?
19:46:58rconanthe umask is a flag on the mount which gives everything certain permissions for the duration of the mount
19:47:22rconani have it give everthing 755 or 775 i think
19:49:44Mikachubluebrother: for fat, the umask is given to mount and applies to all files
19:49:58Mikachu(in linux)
19:50:25Mikachui write faster than i read, sorry :)
19:52:16markunlinuxstb: we're running our own code without linux on the gigabeat now!
19:54:04tucozmarkun, congratulations
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19:54:36linuxstb_markun: About time... :)
19:54:46markun:)
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19:54:53markunYeah yeah..
19:55:29linuxstb_Is the next step getting the Rockbox bootloader working?
19:55:43markunSoon the nice part can start. We only need to figure out how to enter USB mode.
19:55:53markunYes, I was working on the bootloader today
19:56:12rconancan anyone explain why i get the following error trying to compile a cross gcc ?
19:56:13rconanhttp://pastebin.com/737547
19:56:42Redbreva_What would be the syntax on this line to say H100 or iPod... ? #elif CONFIG_KEYPAD == IRIVER_H100_PAD
19:57:19linuxstb_rconan: What command did you type to generate that message?
19:57:28rconanmake
19:57:48rconanim wondering why its looking for arm-elf-gcc when thats what im compiling?
19:57:50linuxstb_Can you paste your "configure" line?
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19:58:07rconan../../gcc-4.1.1/configure −−target=arm-elf −−prefix=/usr/local/arm-tools −−enable-languages=c
19:58:16rconani know gcc-4.1.1 is dodgy
19:58:19rconanthats why im trying
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19:59:01linuxstb_I would try googling to see if it's a known issue with 4.1.1 for arm.
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19:59:09rconanok
19:59:15Mikachuand what does config.log say?
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19:59:50linuxstb_Redbreva_: #elif (CONFIG_KEYPAD==IRIVER_H100_PAD) || (CONFIG_KEYPAD==IPOD_4G_PAD)
19:59:57linuxstb_(brackets are optional...)
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20:00:06Redbreva_Thanks :)
20:00:47rconanill paste my config.log in #rockbox.flood ?
20:00:51linuxstb_IPOD_4G_PAD is used by every ipod apart from the 3G - I'm sure you can guess the name for the 3g's pad...
20:01:04Mikachuor... in the same place as before?
20:01:33Redbreva_Uhmmmm,, IPOD_3G_PAD by any chance... :D
20:01:36rconanok ill pastebin it
20:02:52Redbreva_if || = OR does | = AND ?
20:03:00rconanhttp://pastebin.com/737569
20:03:04rconantheres no info in there at all
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20:03:56bluebrotherhave you tried running it from the configure directory?
20:04:08rconanrunning what from the configure directory /
20:04:09rconan?
20:04:17bluebrotherRedbreva_, || equals or, and is &&
20:04:39bluebrotherrunning configure
20:05:06markunlinuxstb_: the scrambled bit at the top should have been the rockbox logo ;) http://130.89.160.166/Gigabeat/logo_test1.jpg
20:05:25rconanim not running configure im running make
20:05:41rconanand gcc is definately supposed to build outside of the source directory
20:05:45linuxstb_markun: Promising though...
20:06:07bluebrotheryes, but line 21 looks strange to me −− maybe configure does something wrong?
20:06:59Redbreva_bluebrother: Thanks for that, so what does (BUTTON_F1 | BUTTON_LEFT) mean?
20:07:07rconani just remembered that the first time i ran configure i forgot the −−enable-lang section so im gonna try again doing that from a clean build dir
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20:09:29bluebrotherRedbreva_, IIRC || was or-ing the result of a test and | was or-ing the given values bit-wise. Shouldn't make any difference in the line you're given.
20:11:20Redbreva_no, the 2nd line was a button assignment statement, so does that mean F1 OR LEFT key will work?
20:11:46Redbreva_that is EITHER button will do tha same action?
20:12:25MikachuRedbreva_: what is the full line? is it a switch(button) type thing?
20:12:50Redbreva_#define MINESWP_LEFT (BUTTON_F1 | BUTTON_LEFT)
20:13:01Mikachuthat would mean you press both
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20:13:48bluebrotherthe buttons are represented by bitmasks, aren't they?
20:13:54Redbreva_so it's F1 + LEFT = move left?
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20:13:59Mikachuyes
20:15:56bluebrotherok, now I got the point.
20:16:20Redbreva_Confused slightly... #define MINESWP_LEFT (BUTTON_SELECT | BUTTON_LEFT) for the Ipod, but the ipod sim LEFT moves left, select & left does nothing
20:17:05Mikachuthen MINESWP_LEFT is probably not used for moving left on ipods
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20:18:20linuxstb_It looks like MINESWP_LEFT isn't used to move left on any target - BUTTON_LEFT is used directly...
20:18:22Paul_The_NerdYeah, check the actual movement code. Maybe someone just used BUTTON_LEFT and BUTTON_RIGHT. Those are defined for all targets, so it might not even trigger a warning/error.
20:18:39Paul_The_NerdOr someone could actually check AND say something, two seconds before me.
20:18:56Paul_The_Nerdlinuxstb_: What arm-elf-gcc do you use, if I may ask?
20:19:24linuxstb_4.0.2 - the same as the main server. I saw your questions to Bagder yesterday in the logs.
20:19:46Redbreva_yep, there is a CASE for BUTTON_LEFT and for MINESWP_LEFT, with differing code
20:21:26Redbreva_Thanks folks, slightly less confused now...
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20:23:17Paul_The_Nerdlinuxstb_: It seemed worth pursuing just because there are a few people who've said they've never encountered the issue (you included), and so far they all compile their own builds.
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20:58:07rconanok I've still got that gcc compile error
20:58:26rconanhttp://pastebin.com/737547
20:58:40rconanconfig.log:
20:58:41rconanhttp://pastebin.com/737569
20:59:33Paul_The_NerdIt looks like you're missing gmp.h
20:59:46rconanwhere would that come from then?
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21:00:49rconanshould gmp.h be in my toolchain or on the host ?
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21:03:27Paul_The_NerdI don't know. Just reading the config.log
21:05:01rconanok i didnt have gmp.h on my system
21:05:43rconanor rather not in my active directories
21:06:14rconantheres a copy in my glibc source so maybe i should have installed a libc for the toolchain
21:06:25rconani thought that was done after the compiler though
21:06:43linuxstbIn Debian, there's a /usr/include/gmp.h in libgmp3-dev. But maybe that's different...
21:07:07rconanive installed that
21:07:14oboI also have that message about a missing gmp.h from a sucessful 4.0.3 arm compile
21:07:15rconanthe compile still fails
21:07:33rconando i need to reconfigure after installing that file
21:07:36linuxstbI've only compiled up to 4.0.2, and I didn't have gmp.h
21:07:43linuxstbrconan: Yes, I expect so.
21:07:53rconancant hurst i suppose
21:08:16rconanin the configure command theres a :
21:08:17rconanchecking for correct version of gmp.h... yes
21:08:19rconanline
21:08:22rconanso thats promising
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21:10:00amiconnrconan: The problem with gcc 4.1.x is that libssp doesn't like to be crosscompiled
21:10:21rconanis there an option to compile without libssp
21:10:28amiconnYou can build arm-elf-gcc 4.1.x if you add the option −−disable-libssp to configure
21:10:51amiconnThere's a reason why we recommend certain gcc versions....
21:11:55amiconnChossing a higher revision (e.g. 4.0.4 instead of 4.0.3) usually doesn't cause problems. Chossing a different version often does
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21:12:56rconanbut if no-one ever tried using the higher version then no progress would be made
21:13:58amiconnof course
21:14:15amiconn4.1.x was already tried though
21:16:15preglowi use arm-elf-gcc
21:16:16preglowehh
21:16:16preglow4.1
21:16:26amiconnI know
21:16:43rconanwhat are the problems with it except for the libssp thing?
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21:21:20preglowsome warnings
21:21:23preglownothing much
21:21:24preglowworks fine for me
21:22:11amiconnA few more warnings iirc
21:22:22preglowyup
21:22:25preglowa ton in the case of doom
21:22:30preglowabout type-punned pointers
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21:42:14linuxstbI'm thinking about how best to change the "Severity" rating of the outstanding 3.0 bugs to try and prioritise them. My thoughts are to use "Critical" only for bugs which we would delay 3.0 to fix, "High" for bugs which affect the core music playback features of Rockbox, but we wouldn't delay 3.0 for them, "Medium" would be any other core features, and "Low" would be for any bugs in plugins.
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21:44:27Paul_The_NerdI agree
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21:50:47linuxstbAny objections before I start changing all the bug reports? preglow? amiconn?
21:57:30preglownopes
21:57:36pregloware we still gonna release 3.0 for h3x0?
21:58:04preglowi'm afraid i won't have any time for coding until after the weekend anyway :/
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21:58:47peturreleasing something that's not 100% stable is bad for the rockbox image (imho)
21:58:58Paul_The_NerdMy vote is against releasing for H300 until the battery issue is fixed.
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21:59:06peturthat too
21:59:08lowlightFYI...logf build fails because of 2 #if (ROCKBOX_HAS_LOGF == 1) in playback.c (lines 2802 & 2840)
21:59:33lowlightshould be #ifdef's
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22:00:07amiconnHmm, the scheme sounds reasonable. However, then there is no distintion between crash bugs and less severe bug
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22:00:31amiconns
22:00:32baapsI keep getting this error
22:00:33baaps[ERR] File is too large for firmware partition, aborting.
22:00:49Mikachuif they aren't considered critical enough to delay the 3.0 release, they shouldn't be in the 'due for 3.0' group at all
22:01:16Paul_The_Nerdbaaps: Are you compiling a patched or unpatched build? Are you using the exact compiler versions recommended in the wiki?
22:03:02linuxstbbaaps: Which ipod?
22:03:30Paul_The_Nerdbaaps: Ignore me, I misread what you asked.
22:05:27linuxstbMikachu: IMO, there is a difference between being "due" in 3.0 and "must" be in 3.0.
22:06:06Paul_The_NerdHow many crash bugs are there out there right now (discounting all the varied iPod ones)
22:06:17linuxstbThat's what I'm trying to work out...
22:07:34Paul_The_NerdI think I've heard of a data abort or two under non-reproduceable circumstances, but that's about it for iRivers as far as I've seen lately. I saw some talk about the H300 freezing alot over at MR, but I think that's the experimental build.
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22:09:37baapsipod color
22:09:38baaps4g
22:09:45preglowdata abort on iriver???
22:10:08Paul_The_Nerdpreglow: I've seen one or two mentions of it somewhere, relating to tagcache use. At least I _think_ it was iRiver.
22:10:20preglowiriver doesn't have data abort
22:10:22linuxstbbaaps: How big are the following files: apple_os.bin, bootpartition.bin and rockboot.bin ?
22:10:28Paul_The_Nerdpreglow: Then I'm wrong. Simple as that. :)
22:10:56*petur receives flyspray mails....
22:12:26amiconnHmm, runtime test on mini g2 turned out almost the same as the last one :(
22:13:50amiconnSomething causes more additional power drain than the gain in libmad saves, compared to my old test
22:13:58*amiconn has a suspicion
22:14:55 Join Zendefera [0] (n=zendyman@ip68-7-163-21.sd.sd.cox.net)
22:15:33Zendeferahas there beenany work done in getting the clicker comming through when moving around the click wheel on an ipod either through the headphones or internal ipod speaker?
22:16:28linuxstbZendefera: There's a patch on the patch tracker.
22:17:02Zendeferalinuxstd heres a stupid question these are code patches right?
22:17:22Zendefera:) you know what don't answer that, its stupid I already know the answer.
22:18:53preglowamiconn: what'd that be
22:19:02preglowamiconn: you sure the gain in libmad would be measurable anyway?
22:19:34amiconnNot sure about the latter
22:19:41preglowme neither
22:20:01amiconnlostlogic removed the boost-while-rebuffer at some point during his rework
22:20:11preglowindeed he did
22:20:17preglowcpu should be boosted during buffer, imho
22:20:26amiconnThat makes the disk spin longer, *especially* when the codec uses a lot of power
22:20:39 Part Prot
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22:20:58amiconnSomeone measured ata speed on ipod boosted vs. unboosted meanwhile?
22:21:01preglowhahaha
22:21:01preglowprot
22:21:17linuxstbOK, I think I've categorised everything playback related as "high", everything else in the core as "medium" and plugin bugs as "low". Now, what bugs do we consider release-critical?
22:21:29preglowamiconn: don't thiunk so
22:21:51*amiconn should do that soonish
22:22:20*preglow laments the lack of data sheets again
22:22:41amiconnpreglow: Thinking about dma?
22:22:44preglowyes
22:22:53preglownot only for ata
22:23:00*amiconn also wanted to test ata dma on coldfire
22:23:26preglowlet's hope scrotumplayer starts playing nice by releasing datasheets to get revenge on apple :>
22:23:41amiconn?
22:23:43sharpeyay! second nosebleed of the day! woo!
22:25:36peturgrrr, I didn't know I was subscribed to all those tracker entries...
22:26:44EbErThow about freezing bugs for 4g ipod linuxstb
22:27:09 Part Prot
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22:27:27EbErTa feature where u could play "same songs from this artist" using id3 tags would be super neat
22:27:44EbErTwhen in any display mode
22:27:52linuxstbEbErT: What are you asking about the freezing bugs?
22:28:21EbErTjust saying they should and probably are a high priority
22:28:32linuxstbYes, but not until after the 3.0 release.
22:28:45linuxstb- the 3.0 release doesn't include the ipods.
22:28:50EbErTreally?
22:28:57lostlogicamiconn: I thought we were going to boost during ATA anyway soon?
22:29:00EbErThmm
22:29:01linuxstbYes - ipods are scheduled for 3.1 in November.
22:29:26EbErThm, long way away
22:29:48EbErTshouldn't they be working harder to catch up ipods to where the other players are at
22:29:54Paul_The_NerdEbErT: Well, the iRivers haven't even been officially released yet, and they've been in development a LOT longer and are much further along. Do you really think the iPod version is almost "done"?
22:29:54EbErTand then go from there
22:29:56linuxstbYes, but virtually all bug fixes for the iriver targets are also bug fixes for the ipods.
22:30:08EbErTno, not at all paul
22:30:17linuxstbIt's just ipod-specific issues that are being ignored for a few weeks.
22:30:24lowlightlinuxstb: I've got a bug you can fix now...logf enabled builds fail: playback.c lines 2802, 2840 (see my comment earlier)
22:30:27Paul_The_NerdEbErT: So it'd be a little hard for them to be part of the release in a week, ne?
22:30:55EbErTne?
22:31:03Paul_The_NerdI dunno where I picked that one up.
22:31:05MikachuPaul_The_Nerd: turning japanese?
22:31:14 Join qwm [0] (n=qwm@h147n2fls32o1010.telia.com)
22:31:23Paul_The_NerdMikachu: I had a half-japanese girlfriend for two years. That must've been it.
22:31:27Mikachuhehe
22:31:33EbErThm, it seems to be freezing more now that releases i put on a couple weeks ago
22:32:02*amiconn points EbErT to the channel topic ;-)
22:32:05amiconnscnr
22:32:19Paul_The_NerdHehehe
22:32:45EbErTya ya
22:32:57Paul_The_NerdEbErT: Unfortunately nobody's been able to isolate what actually _causes_ the freeze. All we've got is that setting the CPU frequency permanently to 75mhz seems to prevent it for most people.
22:32:58EbErTsomeone should spank whoever made the updates
22:33:05EbErTu'll have to spank lotsa ppl tho
22:33:31EbErT75 mhz as opposed to what?
22:33:33linuxstbEbErT: If you can find exactly which build was the first to not work, I'm sure that would help track down the problem.
22:34:06MikachuEbErT: 75 and 23
22:34:08Mikachuiirc
22:34:14Paul_The_Nerd75, 30, 24
22:34:18Mikachuclose
22:34:18Paul_The_Nerd30 is the normal.
22:34:24linuxstblowlight: I'll have a look now.
22:34:35EbErTisn't that dangerous? could overheat?
22:35:01Mikachuunderclocking rarely causes overheating
22:35:09EbErTbb, i'll find which one i was using
22:35:13Paul_The_NerdEbErT: Naaah. Before we had CPU speed switching working properly, I ran mine for a full charge to empty at 75 without problem. They're rated for higher than that (I think the lowest are rated to 80)
22:37:04Paul_The_NerdMost people only knew that CPU speed switching went in because their menus got "sluggish" after, since the processor wasn't quite running fast enough for them at 30.
22:38:55sharpei say we implement four speeds, instead of three.
22:40:04 Quit Redbreva_ ("using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.11")
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22:44:59linuxstblowlight: logf build works fine for me....
22:45:11 Join Ribs [0] (n=ribs@riblet.plus.com)
22:46:12linuxstbThat "#if (ROCKBOX_HAS_LOGF == 1)" isn't the conventional way to write it, but afaik, it's legal.
22:48:07Mikachumaybe whoever wrote it wanted it to error if it wasn't defined
22:48:40lowlightlinuxstb: I was building for the h120 sim with logf enabled and it wouldn't build as is
22:49:14linuxstbI thought the pre-processor replaced undefined identifiers with "0" in expressions?
22:49:35linuxstblowlight: Just trying that combination now.
22:50:02davidc__linuxstb: nope, it [should] throw an undefined
22:51:50linuxstbBut in a normal Rockbox build, ROCKBOX_HAS_LOGF is undefined and the pre-processor doesn't complain about "#if (ROCKBOX_HAS_LOGF == 1)"
22:51:51 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp120-63.adsl.forthnet.gr)
22:52:02EbErT17, the last digits in a build that didn't freeze much
22:52:30linuxstblowlight: A h120 sim with logf enabled builds fine for me as well.
22:53:23Paul_The_NerdDoes this page load for everyone else? http://www.rockbox.org/since25.html
22:53:25EbErTbah, hold on, need to use the computer i downloaded them on heh
22:53:36EbErTno
22:53:40Paul_The_NerdOkay
22:53:54linuxstbPaul_The_Nerd: It's been broken for a few days - around the same time viewcvs started acting strangely.
22:53:55Paul_The_NerdMy ISP's been doing crazy things lately, so I have a hard time telling what's their fault, and what's actually gone wrong.
22:53:59EbErThow do i get to cpu switching?
22:54:20Paul_The_NerdLike, lately, a few URLS go to 127.0.0.1, and I verified that wherever the problem is, it's outside of my LAN.
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22:54:29Paul_The_NerdEbErT: What do you mean?
22:54:33Zendeferaso I can't compile rockbox with gcc 4.1.0?
22:54:41EbErToh, change the cpu speed
22:54:45Zendeferaor has that changed since the writting of that documentation.
22:54:55Paul_The_NerdZendefera: You _can_ but it's not guaranteed to work.
22:55:01EbErTu can just use ebert :)
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22:55:14Paul_The_NerdEbErT: You can change it in the debug menu. And I just use Eb and the tab key.
22:55:58lowlightlinuxstb: I get "playback.c:2802:23: operator '==' has no left operand"
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22:56:01Aghasterhi
22:56:14Zendeferahi
22:56:28sharpei'm going to try again to get eclipse working with rockbox.
22:56:30preglowPaul_The_Nerd: depends on the platform, i use gcc 4.1 for arm all the time, and have been for months
22:56:49 Quit baaps (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:57:08Paul_The_Nerdpreglow: All I said is we can't guarantee it'll work. Not that it won't. :)
22:57:26lowlightlinuxstb: I should mention I'm trying this using cygwin right now (if that would matter)
22:57:32AghasterDoes anybody else run rockbox on his ipod in here?
22:57:50linuxstblowlight: gcc −−version ?
22:58:01 Join Loco [0] (i=lobowill@h195.190.39.162.ip.alltel.net)
22:58:26lowlightlinuxstb: gcc (GCC) 3.4.4 (cygming special) (gdc 0.12, using dmd 0.125)
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22:58:36linuxstbAghaster: I run Rockbox on someone else's ipod...
22:58:46sharpei run rockbox on my ipod...
22:58:51Paul_The_NerdAghaster: There are several of us using Rockbox-on-iPod
22:58:54AghasterI noticed that when i plugged my ipod on its dock, the ipod loads rockbox but says "cleared"
22:58:56ZendeferaI got rockbox on my ipod video 30g
22:59:05Paul_The_NerdAghaster: Is the hold switch on?
22:59:11Aghasteryes
22:59:15sharpeyou have the hold switch enabled while booting.
22:59:21davidc__linuxstb: huh - just tested it - throws an error here.. must be some flag or something :/
22:59:29Paul_The_NerdAghaster: Booting with the hold switch on clears settings. It's intentional.
22:59:32Aghasterok
22:59:34davidc__linuxstb: er, just throws a warning - not an error
22:59:34Aghasteri didnt know
22:59:51linuxstb"The -Wundef option causes GCC to warn whenever it encounters an identifier which is not a macro in an #if."
23:00
23:00:24davidc__maybe stick a #ifdef before
23:00:25Aghasterand i just wanted to know, maybe its just an impression, but i feel my ipod responsivity is not _so_ good on rockbox on my ipod. sometimes i doesn't get the message right away and i have to press again
23:00:41EbErTlinuxstb: ipodcolor- 20060517 did not freeze
23:00:57linuxstbEbErT: Does 20060518 ?
23:01:41Paul_The_NerdThe problem's been around since at least April...
23:01:41EbErTi do not know unfortunately, skipped some and the latest freezes
23:02:03EbErTya, it froze, but usually when accessing lots of things at once
23:02:16EbErTnot just sitting playing songs
23:02:18linuxstbdavidc__, lowlight I'll just go ahead and change it to a simple #ifdef. But my understanding of this page is that it's legal, so I'm not sure why lowlight's gcc is complaining: http://developer.apple.com/documentation/DeveloperTools/gcc-4.0.1/cpp/If.html#If
23:02:32Paul_The_NerdEbErT: Then "did not freeze" isn't really a valid description, is it?
23:02:46Paul_The_NerdEbErT: It's a very hard bug to track down, so very accurate statements are sorta essential.
23:02:51EbErTno
23:03:09EbErTya, i know. i can't really help because that build i showed you was the first i used
23:03:15EbErTand it did freeze some
23:03:27Aghasterhttp://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=4346.0 uh, what a dumbass wrote that
23:03:37 Quit Presence (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:04:14linuxstbAghaster: It's OK, LinusN has given him a refund.
23:04:24 Join lostnihilist [0] (n=james@c-67-175-244-14.hsd1.il.comcast.net)
23:04:25Aghasterlol, ok
23:05:31Bagderour money-back guarantee wins again
23:07:21Mikachuhe gives people with nicks ending in "chu" a bad name :(
23:09:07BagderPaul_The_Nerd: congrats on the finally becoming admin on the forums!
23:09:17linuxstblowlight: OK, I've committed it - mainly to be consistent with the rest of Rockbox. I still don't understand why your gcc complains.
23:09:22petur\o/
23:09:41EbErTcodec uses 90% stack usage
23:09:55Bagderlinuxstb: it should
23:10:03Paul_The_NerdBagder: Thank you. :)
23:10:44Paul_The_NerdI was confused for a little bit because something didn't quite look right when I was reading a thread, then I realized my post had these little _blue_ starts instead of yellow ones. I was quite lost for a moment.
23:11:12BagderPaul_The_Nerd: I guess it means Jeff finally caught up with his inqueue ;-)
23:11:14linuxstbBagder: But why "playback.c:2802:23: operator '==' has no left operand" when building a logf-enabled build?
23:11:25 Quit Hansmaulwurf ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 3.81 :: www.XLhost.de )")
23:11:35XavierGrhehe Congrats Paul! \o/
23:11:45Bagderlinuxstb: because ROCKBOX_HAS_LOGF is blank
23:11:58Bagder#if ( == 1)
23:12:11linuxstbNo, it's "1" - at least in my autoconf.h
23:12:43Bagderright, it should rather fail when _not_ building logf
23:13:01Bagderthen it sounds like a case when autoconf.h is not included properly
23:13:03linuxstbWhen it's undefined, it's 0 - at least that's my understanding.
23:13:20tucozPaul_The_Nerd, only 2594 post to become a moderator. And you lost the status as Hero Member. Was it worth it? ;-)
23:13:21Bagderlinuxstb: no, it isn't defined as 0
23:13:23linuxstbOtherwise, we would all be complaining about those lines.
23:13:39Bagdergcc can thus treat undefined variables as 0 in #if lines
23:13:47Paul_The_Nerdtucoz: I dunno. There's a few things I have to figure out yet.
23:13:47Bagders/thus/though
23:13:52linuxstbYes, that's what I mean.
23:14:04tucozPaul_The_Nerd, what I should say is. Congratulations
23:14:27Bagder-Wundef
23:14:27Bagder Warn if an undefined identifier is evaluated in an #if directive.
23:14:40Paul_The_Nerdtucoz: Well, hopefully I can help keep things a little more organized there.
23:15:06 Join jakub31337 [0] (i=jakub@31337.pl)
23:15:18tucozSo far I've read a lot of pro-answers with your name attached to them. So, I guess that will go just fine.
23:15:28BagderI think the #ifdef way is the proper way anyway
23:15:59jakub31337why rockbox on my ipod is working ony in version from CVS-060516 - GRAY 4G
23:16:08jakub31337other versions hold on boot
23:16:59jakub31337i have only logo backlight is running but thats all ;>
23:17:07Paul_The_NerdI was also contemplating another "membergroup" or whatever they're called. I've noticed a few people (Febs particularly, but there are others) who pretty consistently report with good answers, clearly spoken, and so on, and was wondering if it'd be okay with the folk around here to maybe create a group with standard permissions, but a specific grouping for users who are regularly helpful and knowledgeable about the project? I'm n
23:17:26Paul_The_Nerdjakub31337: It freezes with the Rockbox logo displaying?
23:17:34jakub31337yes
23:17:46linuxstbPaul_The_Nerd: What kind of extra permissions would those users get (or need) ?
23:17:54jakub31337rockbox + number of version and backlight
23:18:16Paul_The_Nerdlinuxstb: I don't think they'd need any extra permissions. Just a different thing than the regular posts-dependent status on the left.
23:18:23jakub31337and i can only reboot
23:18:25jakub31337:/
23:18:45linuxstbPaul_The_Nerd: Ah, you just mean a fancy job title, rather than any power? :)
23:19:00jakub31337but on version CVS-060516 everything is good
23:19:36jakub31337newer doesnt work
23:20:18linuxstbBagder: Do you know why the since25.html file is missing?
23:20:23 Join ashridah [0] (i=ashridah@220-253-121-65.VIC.netspace.net.au)
23:20:30Paul_The_Nerdlinuxstb: Basically yes. Just a way to help people have confidence in the answers they get, and such. A way to show that "This person in most cases knows what he's talking about." You know, for devs, the people who work on the manual, and the people who just try to be helpful.
23:20:53jakub31337Paul_The_Nerd: you know what i can do with this?
23:20:54Bagderlinuxstb: no, but I'd guess its related to the other cvs issues seen lately
23:20:58jakub31337can i debug?
23:20:58lowlightlinuxstb: Ok, thanks. I was enabling it to try to track down this ffwd bug for large flacs.
23:21:04jakub31337or sth
23:21:29Paul_The_Nerdjakub31337: It's a known issue, but we are unable to determine the cause so far. Unfortunately it's turned out to be quite difficult to track down, and has worsened lately.
23:22:05 Quit jd_ ()
23:22:39jakub31337so bad :/
23:22:42linuxstbjakub31337: Can you just confirm that you've tried 20060517 after 1) Deleting your old .rockbox and rockbox,ipod files before installing the new build; and 2) Turning on the hold switch as it boots to reset the settings.
23:23:30Bagderok, since25.html works again
23:23:45linuxstbBagder: Thanks. Now I can see what changed between the 16th and 17th...
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23:25:25Bagdergoodie
23:25:49linuxstbNothing at all suspicious happened on the 16th though...
23:25:53amiconnlinuxstb: You could have seen this before
23:26:17amiconnhttp://www.rockbox.org/dl.cgi?bin=source has this nice little changelog links
23:26:33linuxstbAh yes, forgot about those...
23:26:49linuxstbStill, I only had to wait about 2 minutes for Bagder to fix it.
23:27:21EbErThasn't frozen yet with the higher cpu speed
23:27:56amiconnThe only change that could influence ipod is this tiny dircache fix... but that sounds very unlikely
23:28:05jakub31337linuxstb: you say ipod files you are thinking all data on disc?
23:28:25 Part lowlight
23:28:28linuxstbjakub31337: No, I just meant your ".rockbox" folder and the "rockbox.ipod" file.
23:28:43amiconnHmm, otoh that might be a reason why I don't get any freezes - I never use dircache
23:28:56peturh3x0 eeprom is configured at addres 1
23:29:01jakub31337linuxstb: ok, i will try
23:30:48EbErTyou don't get freezes on your ipod, amiconn
23:31:12EbErTi dunno what dircache does. how do you turn it off?
23:31:14Paul_The_NerdEbErT: Most of the devs don't. Or all of them. That's what makes it so hard to find. ;-)
23:31:30Paul_The_NerdEbErT: It's actually something you have to turn on.
23:32:03EbErTdo all of you overdrive your ipod cpu too :)
23:32:17Paul_The_NerdMine's a Nano, which doesn't suffer from the freezing bug.
23:32:33davidc__just for the record - us over @ iPL seem to work fine up to 90mhz
23:32:41davidc__we haven't run all the models up that high though
23:32:44jakub31337linuxstb: ok i think that 20060517 is working
23:32:46Paul_The_Nerddavidc__: It wasn't until we clocked _down_ the CPU that it showed up.
23:32:49davidc__and we do notice increased heat @ the back
23:33:03davidc__Paul_The_Nerd: hrm - you sure you're doing the clock speed changing right?
23:33:20davidc__you might be doing something funky clocking wise which is causing interrupts to drop or something...
23:33:24Paul_The_Nerddavidc__: The person who wrote it is fairly confident, but I can't say anything in the matter.
23:33:31davidc__does it occur at the lower speed? or at transitions?
23:33:43Paul_The_NerdHaven't tracked that down yet.
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23:34:08Paul_The_NerdI suspect at lower speed, but there's nothing _solid_ I believe that says this is true.
23:34:58davidc__hrm... maybe you're not hitting a necessary interrupt timing or something?
23:35:01Paul_The_NerdThe problem is (and no offense to them) that the bug reports are entirely from users, and most of them don't seem too interested in anything but "How do I use it without it freezing" and it's a bit hard to get them to try again and watch what's happening when ti freezes.
23:35:15davidc__Paul_The_Nerd: heh, we suffer just the same ;)
23:35:51Paul_The_NerdI'm training them, slowly. They're getting better.
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23:36:33amiconndavidc__: The product brief for the pp5020 says it's specced 80MHz, so I wouldn't run it at 90. I have a mini g2, and the pp5022 is specced 100MHz
23:36:43amiconnI ran it successfully at 96MHz
23:36:50zblachhrm
23:37:02zblachappears that rockbox doesn't work with the iPod Hi-Fi system either
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23:37:45Paul_The_Nerdzblach: So I've been told
23:37:54zblachdrat. so i hadn't been told.
23:38:49davidc__Paul_The_Nerd: heh, maybe you guys don't get our class of users.. they're untrainable
23:39:15davidc__amiconn: eh, it did run that fast though ;)
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23:41:41zblachso it's either gapless-playback or good sound. hrm.
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23:42:25Paul_The_NerdI heard the iPod HiFi really wasn't worth the money compared to systems you could get for the same price and just hook the 'pod up to a line in
23:42:26 Quit tom__ ("Leaving")
23:42:44zblachPaul_The_Nerd: gifts are free
23:43:08Paul_The_NerdAaaaah
23:43:14***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:43:29tim66anyone here know why battery life is so poor when on the recording screen but not recording?
23:43:43tim66i'm using an iriver h140 btw
23:44:46Paul_The_NerdHow much worse?
23:45:35tim66i can play mp3 or ogg for a lot longer. i was using the iriver as a headphone amp, monitoring the line-in
23:45:42 Quit Ribs ("Leaving")
23:46:16Paul_The_NerdHow does it compare to doing the same thing in iRiver firmware?
23:46:37tim66no idea, yet. I'll give that a go tomorrow
23:46:58Paul_The_NerdIt's really hard to call something poor until you have something to compare it to. :-P
23:47:56tim66just seems poor that I can monitor for less time than I can play from disk. it feels wrong, don't you think?
23:48:05zblachPaul_The_Nerd: if you can, could you explain to me why there would be any difficulty with the ipod hifi? is the plug remapped?
23:49:35Paul_The_Nerdzblach: Does the HiFi have buttons on it for next-track, etc, or is it all handled by the clickwheel?
23:49:47davidc__Paul_The_Nerd: clickwheel, iirc
23:49:48Paul_The_Nerdtim66: Depends. More hardware is active in that case.
23:49:56davidc__zblach: most likely you need to send some kind of enable down the dock port
23:50:07davidc__the apple photo connector needs an enable to turn on its SMPS
23:50:09Zendeferahey guys, I am building all of the devel tools to be able to compile rockbox. I have a ipod, so my target platform is arm, so for binutils, for my ./configure command I set my −−target=arm ?
23:50:23tim66paul_the_nerd: apart from the disk ;-)
23:50:33BagderZendefera: arm-elf, as documented
23:50:50Paul_The_Nerdtim66: The disk is spun up once every half hour while playing ogg. :-P
23:50:52Zendeferaoh, thanks. I didn't see the -elf. thanks
23:51:42tim66paul_the_nerd: and the CPU is running much harder on ogg too. monitoring should be a fairly idle task, apart from the peak meter??
23:52:16 Quit akaidiot (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:52:18Paul_The_Nerdtim66: I honestly don't know what the code is doing. As I said, check it in the iRiver firmware. Maybe it's just an aspect of the whole.
23:52:39 Join tom__ [0] (n=tom@84.12.163.202)
23:53:07linuxstbdavidc__: Am I right in thinking there is no serial port driver for the PP502x ipods in IPL?
23:53:22davidc__linuxstb: eh, there is, but we can't get the damn thing to work
23:53:39Paul_The_Nerdtim66: It's also possible that say, the CPU is permanently boosted in the recording screen so that peakmeter performance can be as good as possible, or something.
23:54:01davidc__the pp chips have a really funky method of routing the serial signal to the pins - its multiplexed with a bunch of stuff we think
23:54:18davidc__we think we've missed some enable somewhere
23:54:43tim66paul_the_nerd: I'll give the iriver firmware a shot while I'm at work tomorrow. It's been a long time since I used it, hope i can remember how !!
23:55:03 Quit TCK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:55:43davidc__linuxstb: btw- aegray found a very promising lead on that video out stuff - you might want to hang around the chan tonight - we're gonna try and hack some code together for it
23:55:48tim66paul_the_nerd: i wish I could get to the debug menus without 'closing' the recording screen
23:55:52linuxstbdavidc__: OK. Good to know that at least some work has been done.
23:55:53 Quit RedBreva ("Time for Tubby ByeBye")
23:56:12linuxstbdavidc__: Which channel? You seem to have many nowadays...
23:56:16Paul_The_Nerdtim66: You could just check the source to see what's going on.
23:56:30linuxstbI'm definitely interested in the video-out functionality.
23:56:55davidc__linuxstb: probably -dev -which we created to deal with the huge influxes of n00bs interfering with dev work in the main chan
23:57:05zblach"some kind of enable down the dock port"?
23:57:14linuxstbdavidc__: OK, thanks. I'll lurk in both anyway.
23:57:26davidc__linuxstb: anyhow - that'll be in 4 or 5 hours - gotta finish work first
23:57:43linuxstbI'll probably be asleep then (European time...)
23:58:51davidc__linuxstb: ah, well I'll msg you if we get anything interesting
23:59:01davidc__linuxstb: its gonna be Photo / Color only

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