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#rockbox log for 2006-06-09

00:00:40 Quit Poka64 ("XChat 2.6.1 - www.xchat.org")
00:00:47amiconnpetur: The call causing the panic with the irq disabled check is lcd_init() from main.c
00:01:01 Join rotator [0] (n=e@rockbox/developer/rotator)
00:01:19*amiconn wonders how lcd_init() can proceed when interrupts are disabled and it's using sleep() ...
00:02:00peturamiconn: my panicf() gives me a white display - on key is processed ok (reboots)
00:02:52amiconnI'm testing on h140 - my h340 is still open for more temperature checks
00:03:11 Join Poka64 [0] (i=peter@hd5e241c0.gavlegardarna.gavle.to)
00:03:25peturprobably the display stuff isn't init enough to display the text.
00:03:42amiconnI guess the reason for the panic is the same on h300, but the init doesn't run far enough to leave you with an usable display
00:03:49amiconnhehe
00:03:54peturwill find a way to enable the irq check later
00:04:12amiconnJust enable interrupts earlier - but still, this is a bug...
00:04:35peturI'll commit the panicf fix, gives me the feeling to have done something tonight :/
00:05:02amiconnThere is a set_irq_level(0) in main.c a few lines down from the lcd_init() call
00:05:32*amiconn still wonders how this can work
00:05:44amiconnHmm, no panic now
00:07:39 Quit midkay_ ("Leaving")
00:08:07 Quit matsl ("cu")
00:08:30 Quit jd_ (Connection timed out)
00:09:18peturindeed, no panic now :)
00:09:35peturkaboom
00:10:00peturthe moment I enter recording screen it panics
00:10:14peturwith text this time :)
00:10:17amiconnHmm, not here
00:10:31amiconnI guess you have your interrupt-disabled i2c in place?
00:10:57peturyeps, and gain is set when entering recording
00:10:59 Quit TCK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:11:52amiconnGah
00:12:03*amiconn got rockbox to freeze in the fm screen :(
00:13:18*petur was lazy and didn't add the extensive panic info of amiconn....
00:13:41amiconnHehe, I have even more info available now
00:14:04peturany reason irq is enabled so late in main.c?
00:14:08amiconn(a mini stackdump, since putting __builtin_return_address() into sleep() didn't work correctly for some reason)
00:14:20peturgive :)
00:16:42peturdamn, now my on-to-reboot-in-panic-screen doesn't work anymore :(
00:17:42rotator!! wiki spam alert, "HerohitoNakomode"
00:18:01*petur wonders how he caused the yellow build
00:18:05 Join |reezeh| [0] (n=reezeh@reezeh.gotadsl.co.uk)
00:18:30peturwhat the heck is synth.c anyway?
00:18:51Bagderobo's server has gone gcc 4.1
00:18:56petursome buildserver running a different compiler version?
00:19:01peturheh
00:19:06Bagderdebian unstable
00:19:29*amiconn is also running debian unstable
00:19:35amiconnNo gcc 4.1 yet though
00:19:43Bagderyou'll get it when you update ;-)
00:19:47peturkindly give my earned build points to odo please ;)
00:20:07BagderI expect our servers to take that leap soonish too
00:20:51*amiconn won't update too soon
00:21:05amiconnEvery time I update, something is bound to go wrong
00:22:14 Join ashridah [0] (i=ashridah@220-253-120-82.VIC.netspace.net.au)
00:22:29peturduh... the thread_switch with disabled irq I detected was in i2c because *I* disabled irq's... /me stupid!
00:23:26amiconnyes of course
00:23:35peturI'm such an idiot
00:24:03 Quit ender` (" Some people have one of those days. I've had one of those lives.")
00:24:12amiconnBuHmm. What puzzles me is that seems to be the only thread switch with disabled interrupts, yet it freezes rockbox
00:24:20amiconn-Bu
00:24:45amiconnDid you test with the remote plugged in?
00:24:55peturyes
00:25:07 Join Higgy____ [0] (n=not_eric@client-82-18-255-107.brhm.adsl.ntlworld.com)
00:25:14amiconnI didn't
00:25:20*amiconn silly as well
00:25:23oboawwww, only 4?
00:25:47peturbtw, the remote is a kind donation of whatboutbob
00:26:01amiconn...but I don't get panics with the remote plugged either
00:26:56petursame here :(
00:26:56 Join ydnar [0] (n=ydnar@cpe-67-10-187-94.houston.res.rr.com)
00:27:14peturso were sure now that isn't the cause
00:27:23peturs/were/we're
00:27:39amiconn...so while calling yield() with disabled interrupts seems to cause the freeze, your i2c thing is the only place that does this call, and my first theory *how* it happens doesn't hold
00:27:40sharpehmm...
00:27:54sharpehow could i tell which firmware belongs to which device...?
00:29:06 Quit TeaSea ("Leaving")
00:29:25peturamiconn: do we (you or me) commit the modified main.c (enable irq before lcd_init()) ?
00:30:16 Quit lodesi_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:30:19 Join lodesi_ [0] (n=moi@d02v-62-34-191-148.d4.club-internet.fr)
00:30:24amiconnI'm not sure why interrupts are enabled that late...
00:31:34*amiconn summons LinusN
00:31:47peturbad luck
00:31:51preglowhaha
00:31:54preglownot bloody likely
00:32:06*amiconn checks viewcvs
00:33:54*amiconn curses viewcvs
00:34:27sharpemmm...
00:35:33preglowbedtime
00:36:18*petur wonders if a recursive i2c_write could cause a lockup
00:36:34amiconnIt surely will
00:36:35 Join jd_ [0] (n=jd@wikipedia/Meanos)
00:36:46amiconni2c is mutex protected
00:37:08peturit is?
00:37:25 Quit darkless (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:37:30peturwhere?
00:38:16 Join damaki_ [0] (n=Chocolat@ALille-153-1-57-221.w86-196.abo.wanadoo.fr)
00:38:51peturkaboom
00:38:55peturagain...
00:39:04amiconnBlah. It _should_ be, but it seems i2c_begin() and i2c_end(9 are never called
00:39:23amiconn...enither from within i2c.c, nor from uda1380.c
00:39:26peturI added a recursive call check and got hit right away
00:39:32amiconns/enither/neither/
00:40:21amiconnBlah, ignore that
00:40:29amiconni2c.c isn't for coldfire
00:40:45peturi2c_coldfire.c
00:40:59amiconnyes
00:41:08amiconnKnew that earlier tonight :/
00:41:24peturand i2c_write is called during its sleep()
00:41:34 Part Paul_The_Nerd
00:41:45peturcausing it to lock waiting for the bus to be free probably
00:42:20peturnah, that one yields too
00:42:21amiconni2c-coldfire.c doesn't seem to have any protection against being called from 2 threads - and it yields.....
00:42:33peturnot good
00:42:40amiconnDefinitely
00:42:44amiconnhrmph
00:43:52peturadd the same mutex as i2c.c ? it yields if the mutex is locked I hope?
00:45:37amiconnmutex_lock() sleeps the caller until the mutex is unlocked by the previous lock holder
00:46:01amiconn..but we need 2 mutexes in i2c-coldfire.c
00:46:14amiconn..for each of the 2 controllers
00:46:28peturoh right
00:46:37peturforgotten all about that
00:48:02amiconnThe placement of set_irq_level(0) in main.c doesn't seem to have any special reason
00:48:29amiconnWhen it was introduced, there were only 2 calls before it, and later it was moved in front of one of them
00:48:48amiconn(but a bunch of others was introduced before & after this move)
00:48:56peturso no platform tests needed?
00:48:58 Quit mikearthur (Remote closed the connection)
00:49:37 Quit Kohlriba (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:49:41 Join Kohlrabi [0] (n=Kohlrabi@dslb-082-083-134-134.pools.arcor-ip.net)
00:50:00amiconnI'll do quick tests on archos and mini g2
00:50:32amiconnI don't expect to find problems though
00:51:43 Join mikearthur [0] (i=mike@82-41-205-190.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk)
00:52:16*petur compiles a mutex-protected i2c-coldfire.c
00:54:12 Quit damaki (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:54:17peturaaaaaaaaaaaargh
00:54:27Quarrymanargh?
00:54:45peturI hate this bug
00:55:05peturno more recursive panic but another freeze :(
00:55:20 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay)
00:56:07*petur bangs head on desk
00:56:57amiconnDon't sleep with interrupts disabled...
00:57:01 Quit gromit` ("Coyote finally caught me")
00:57:47zeespecially if you don't trust the person in the next room ;p
00:59:56amiconn..or if you have to get up early? ;)
01:00
01:00:51sharpewell, i've a generic tool that supposedly works for windows, linux, and osx, however; i do not know how i should label the firmwares...
01:01:02peturamiconn: what if I'd add an argument to the i2c_write call whether it can sleep or not?
01:01:18 Quit EbErT ()
01:03:56amiconnSounds ugly...
01:04:09amiconnThe mutex protection will still sleep
01:04:37amiconn...and it has to sleep (or yield), since otherwise a deadlock would be guaranteed
01:04:48peturso, keep the mutex but don't disable irq or remove the sleep altogether
01:05:52amiconnHmm.....
01:06:29 Join dj-fu [0] (n=deejay@202-169-207-90.worldnet.co.nz)
01:07:18amiconnAfaiu the mutex is necessary unless we can *guarantee* that that each of the i2c controller is always exclusively used by a single thread
01:07:23 Quit obo ("bye")
01:08:03peturyes
01:08:17amiconn...but if we use the mutex, we must not disable interrupts, because the mutex sleeps() while busy
01:08:45petursee my last remark: keep the mutex but don't disable irq or remove the sleep altogether
01:08:47amiconn..but that's exactly what we want to achieve - disable interrupts in order to avoid glitches
01:08:54amiconnWhich sleep?
01:09:05peturin i2c_write
01:09:26petursorry, yield
01:09:37amiconnYeah, then we wouldn't need the mutex as well, but we waste cpu cycles
01:09:52peturso do the bitbanged ones
01:10:05peturand afaik, they're used more
01:10:07amiconnYes, but they can't do better
01:10:55peturwho's using the i2c_write anyway? the uda and ... ?
01:11:23amiconnWell, in the iriver, one channel is exclusively hooked to the uda
01:11:43amiconn..and the other is exclusively hooked to the fm chip
01:12:05peturso not critical at all
01:12:06amiconn..but for the latter, we can't even use the i2c controller, but have to bitbang (!!)
01:12:18amiconnIriver forgot a simple pullup...
01:12:54amiconnStill, even the uda could be accessed by more than 1 thread
01:13:14peturis this the same for h1x0 and h3x0?
01:13:37peturthe uda isn't accessed a lot, is it?
01:14:27amiconnNot atm - that's probably why no one noticed a problem with the missing mutex
01:14:35*petur want's to get rid of the yields() in i2c_write
01:15:02amiconnBtw, I found no problem with the moved up set_irq_level(0); in main.c
01:15:36peturyou commit or me?
01:16:39peturhmmm... I need some sleep() myself
01:16:40 Quit midkay (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:16:59 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay)
01:17:02 Join Falco98 [0] (n=chatzill@cpe-024-088-106-250.sc.res.rr.com)
01:17:13Falco98hey all
01:17:49ritalinhi
01:18:01ritalinwelcome to #rockbox
01:18:08ritalincan i get you a bottled water
01:18:20 Quit midkay (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:18:20amiconnpetur: done
01:18:34peturok
01:19:01peturI'm off... I hope to have time again saturday :/
01:19:19Falco98heh
01:19:34Falco98anyone in here have any experience with WASTE networks?
01:19:43Falco98i wanna try to get one o' thems going
01:20:28 Quit mikearthur (Remote closed the connection)
01:20:39 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay)
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01:21:35 Quit petur ("petur::sleep()")
01:24:44 Quit lee-qid__ ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com")
01:26:48rotatorFalco98: I've played around with WASTE a bit before
01:26:53rotatorit's kinda fun ;)
01:32:00 Quit dpro (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:36:00 Part tucoz ("Leaving")
01:43:09 Part pixelma
01:44:05 Quit Falco98 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:46:29 Join Cisalus [0] (i=Cisalus@cpe-74-67-194-156.twcny.res.rr.com)
01:46:47CisalusHas anyone here successfully gotten Rockbox to work on an iAudio X5?
01:47:01midkayum, everybody who has an x5? :)
01:47:17midkaywhat's the problem?
01:47:23Cisalus:( I'm a noob at the whole. Bootloading game?
01:47:41CisalusAnd I put the binary in the FIRMWARE folder, and extracted the other stuff to the directory..
01:47:52dj-fulewler.
01:47:55CisalusBut it won't start up with Rockbox, just starts up normal when I turn it on
01:47:58ritalinlollerskates
01:48:26CisalusDon't laugh too hard−− I seriously don't know what I'm doing at all. The X5 just definitely has the crappiest UI in the world.
01:49:44sharpeyay, my first semi-mean post on the forums.
01:49:55ritalincongrats
01:51:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:51:08sharpehmm.
01:51:21sharpei wonder, if i should even attempt the custom builds...
01:51:32ashridahwe'll make paul_the_nerd out of you yet
01:52:10sharpeer, the webapp, or the standalone builds to do so.
01:52:34dj-fuCisalus: are you folllowing the X5 installation wiki page?
01:53:15Cisalusdidn't know there was one.
01:53:44Cisalusi've been on
01:53:45Cisalushttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IaudioBoot
01:54:04amiconnmulticrappola
01:54:09*amiconn goes to bed
01:54:47ritalinnite
01:55:24sharpeahah, and it was a mean post in disguise.
01:55:51dj-fuCisalus: I think that's it, heh - sorry, I have a Nano :]
01:56:22Cisalushaha it's fine, thanks anyway. maybe someone else will know.
01:56:32sharpewell, i've an ipod video.
01:56:54dj-funano is so much better than video imho
01:57:02sharpe:)
01:57:09dj-fualthough, I'd rather a creative vison:m than either
01:57:14dj-fuit plays divx/xvid ootb
01:57:35dj-fusomeone just released a really nice WPS for Nano, it's like the winner
01:57:56dj-fuhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsIpodNano#Neeon_Nano_Black
02:00
02:06:04 Join JdGordon [0] (i=jonno@c211-28-95-208.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au)
02:07:00 Quit pauljam ("Ex-Chat")
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02:20:31 Quit Kohlrabi ("Hello my name is CoolClonk .")
02:21:04 Quit Cisalus ()
02:27:02sharpewow. my cygwin takes up 841mb.
02:28:33 Quit jd_ ()
02:29:09JdGordononly? mine was taking up much more than that..
02:29:35sharpe;)
02:33:26ritalinomg hi guys
02:37:54JdGordondoes any1 know how to rip a cd to a single ogg with a .cue file??
02:38:48earHertzsharpe: mine take s*GB, so there
02:38:56earHertz8GB
02:40:05sharpei feel special.
02:40:23earHertzsharpe: you look special too ;)
02:43:51sharpe...
02:45:33sharpedo we have a list of errors that may be reported by the bootloader?
02:46:16dj-fuJdGordon: I think there's an app that does it, I forget.
02:46:34dj-fuJdGordon: maybe convert .bin/.cue to iso with bin2iso and then mount it loopback and use a ripper tool
02:46:37sharpei know how you *could* do it, but it wouldn't play.
02:46:44sharpe:)
02:47:27 Quit Poka64 ("time for sleep, time for vengance")
02:56:35sharpei know what i'll work on.
03:00
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03:17:05sharpei'm going to work on the standalone tagcache builder, that no one who says they're going to make, seems to get around to it.
03:18:24sharpeeveryone seems to myseriously disappear...
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03:44:13sharpei'll save that for a rainy day!
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04:10:08earHertzanyone using kdevelop for rockbox coding?
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04:29:50DEBUGEOF from server (No route to host) (snapshot: netstuff.c line 545)
04:29:50***Cleanup
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04:36:39JdGordondoes any1 here know how the codec/playback stuff works?
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05:47:27EbErTquite here. anyone know how to get dircache going?
06:00
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06:16:36sharpeit's like... slight... insomnia.
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06:24:13sharpei wonder how much a person would be praised for enabling rockbox to use of the other core in the ipod processors...
06:24:26midkaylike so: "cool, thanks!"
06:24:36sharpeyeah, what i was thinking too.
06:25:10sharpe"just for that, you get a cookie!"
06:25:52sharpelittle do they know, someone actually ships a cookie in a hermetically sealed container.
06:26:13midkayhaha.
06:26:57sharpehowever it never reaches it's destination, as the sender never put the to address, as they never got one, and didn't put a return address.
06:27:07sharpeso it ends up at the bottom of a very large pile
06:27:13sharpeand then nuclear winter sets in
06:27:21midkayalright, too far.
06:27:24dj-fusharpe: I'd give you hot sex, if you did that.
06:27:27dj-futhe second core, thing
06:27:32sharpelol
06:27:48dj-fuPlease do :)
06:28:03dj-fuand battery optimisation, while you're at it
06:28:03sharpelike i know anything about it, but hell, i'll try!
06:28:20sharpelet me just get out the magic dust...
06:28:21midkay.. because sharpe wants hot sex.. from what i'd expect is a man... :E
06:28:37sharpeer, "cool, thanks!" would be acceptable really.
06:28:39midkayyou're awful eager to try for hot man sex.
06:28:40midkay:p
06:28:52dj-fuRighto. I can settle for cool thanks
06:29:08midkaynah, can't you tell, he WANTS the sex.
06:29:14midkayhe's just playing 'pretend'.
06:29:46sharpethat's... not... nice...
06:29:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:30:06midkayi'm trying to get you what you want, sharpe.
06:30:06midkay:(
06:30:33sharpei hate you midkay.
06:30:44midkay:DDDD
06:31:15sharpewhy does this not make any sense: "Intel first to ship dual core"
06:31:16sharpewell.
06:31:17sharpenever mind.
06:31:28sharpei thought it said core duo.
06:31:41sharpemaking me think, "well, they do manufacture the chip..."
06:32:32midkayhaha.
06:33:46ashridahsharpe: who on earth said that?
06:34:03sharpei was just reading the wikpedia article on multi-core.
06:34:15sharpeand it had a link to an article with that title
06:42:18sharpeso. yep.
06:45:19ashridahi suppose they could have been thinking about hyperthreading, which isn't dual-core, but morons sometimes think it is
06:45:59sharpebecause of things like... qvc... and hsn....
06:46:22sharpethey say "it's just like having two processors!"
06:50:41sharpei... get bored at times...
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06:58:24ashridahqvc? hsn?
06:58:53BHSPitLappy(both are shopping channels)
06:59:03BHSPitLappyhome shopping network and something else
07:00
07:00:37sharpeqvc stands for, "Quality, Value, Convenience."
07:04:34ashridahwhat's that got to do with multiprocessors?
07:05:22sharpethey generally sell computers advertised as having hyperthreading
07:06:22ashridahokay then
07:07:13sharpeyep.
07:10:01BHSPitLappyk
07:11:23sharpealright.
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07:18:57sharpewell, i'm going, night everyone.
07:19:31noletiLink to the USB-To-Go chip datasheet in The H300: http://www.semiconductors.philips.com/acrobat/datasheet/ISP1362-04.pdf
07:19:56noletiI saw a thread at misticriver looking for that pdf
07:20:19noletithere are detailed instructions on suspending the chip to save power
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08:15:33tge101how do you add mp3s with rockbox?
08:15:56tge101(on an ipod video)
08:16:24ashridahadd mp3s to the device? just copy them onto it
08:16:35ashridahstandard filesystem drag and drop
08:17:02tge101which folder?
08:17:10ashridahany folder.
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08:17:43tge101in the \.rockbox? or do i make a music folder?
08:17:58 Part JdGordon
08:17:59ashridahany folder off the root. i wouldn't put them in .rockbox
08:18:08ashridahrockbox can find music pretty much anywhere on the device
08:18:27tge101no shit?
08:18:33ashridahalthough you may need to trigger a tagcache update if that's what you're using. otherwise they'll just appear in the directory view
08:18:40ashridahit has no requirements for an itunes-like db
08:18:46dj-futhat's half the point of using it
08:18:53dj-funot needing a shitty app to put music on the device
08:19:04tge101whats the tagcahe thing all about?
08:19:15dj-futagcache reads ID3 tags and adds em to a database
08:19:24ashridahtge101: tagcache is basically rockbox's own ID3 tag database
08:19:25dj-fuallowing you to sort your music by artist, track, whatnot.
08:19:44ashridahhandy for ipod users who've used itunes in the past, since that munges the filenames
08:20:09dj-fuaye. it does. I raged so hard when it ruined my well organised and named collection
08:20:10tge101should it already be on there if i just got the new build the other day or do i have to do something separate for that?
08:20:11ashridahbut rockbox doesn't require it to function, it can just use the directory tree directly,
08:21:02ashridahyou need to force the construction of it, i think it's under general->playback or something. takes a while, since it's being created on the device itself.
08:22:21tge101sorry if i soudn like a dumbass, im real new to it
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08:22:49ashridahthat's cool.
08:23:09ashridahwe're usually happy to evangelise :)
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08:24:54tge101so, if i just make a new folder "Mp3s" in the root, i'm all set?
08:25:36ashridahsure
08:26:08tge101nice, thanks guys
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08:29:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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08:33:44MAASxRICKOK WTF
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08:40:03ashridah?
08:40:18MAASxRICKHI ASHRIDAY
08:40:27MAASxRICKHOW R U
08:41:13ashridahah, one of those. easily fixed.
08:42:20MAASxRICKWHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?
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08:43:30Mode"#rockbox +o Zagor " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
08:45:02markunMAASxRICK: turn of caps lock
08:45:36markunoff
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08:50:49MAASxRICKHAY UM HOW DO I DO THAT?
08:50:58MAASxRICKJUST A QWESTION U KNO
08:51:03B4gderugh
08:51:06B4gderplease loosen the caps
08:51:07MAASxRICKPLEASE GET BAK 2 ME
08:51:13B4gdernow
08:51:28Mode"#rockbox +o B4gder " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
08:51:29MAASxRICKHAY BADGAR DO YOU LIKE PIE OR STRUDDLE
08:51:34earHertzYOU DO IT IN lower case
08:51:34Kick(#Rockbox MAASxRICK :B4gder) by B4gder!n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder
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08:54:49earHertzBagder: hoe expensibe is a mutex on the ipod?
08:56:07B4gdernot very I believe
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08:57:58earHertzBagder: thanks.
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09:00
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09:52:32*preglow does some whistling
09:52:59B4gderI called UPS
09:53:01Mode"#rockbox -o Zagor " by Zagor (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
09:53:12B4gderthey "might" be able to _not_ arrive between 10-12
09:53:40B4gderas that happens to be about the only time nobody is around my house today
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09:54:47B4gderapparently, they care about the customers who pay the delivery and not so much for those who receive them
09:55:30peturups sucks.... have not had one good experience with them
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09:56:10peturand they charge insane amounts of money for customs handling
09:56:11XavierGrGood morning!
09:56:24XavierGrBagder: What are you waiting for?
09:56:44B4gdera secret package from Sunnyvale California
09:56:57peturshhhht!
09:57:00Zagoroooh, sikrit!
09:57:05XavierGrwow... secret? :P
09:57:19B4gderheh
09:57:40preglowhah
09:57:48preglownever dealt with ups
09:58:11XavierGrBagder: Does it has to do with rockbox
09:58:18B4gderoh yes
09:58:18XavierGr?
09:58:18*XavierGr drools
09:58:32XavierGrnice!
09:58:34B4gderat least I think so
09:58:37preglowhaha
09:58:37B4gder;-)
09:58:49B4gderit doesn't say what it is or from who it comes
09:58:59preglowso they don't call you and ask around when they should come before planning their delivery routes?
09:59:03B4gderno
09:59:06preglowhah
09:59:07preglowexcellent
09:59:19B4gderthey just dropped a note "we were here at 10:15 - call us"
09:59:54preglowyes, people usually are home at 10:15
09:59:59B4gderyeah
10:00
10:00:00preglowi bet they drive around with full cars a lot
10:00:20Mikachui love electricians and that kind of people, "try to be home between 7am and 5pm"
10:00:23Mikachuyeah.. right
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10:07:50kerbis it normal that dircache claims to have indexed 3 times as many files as I have? :P
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10:23:45preglowperhaps you have three times as many files as you think!
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10:29:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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10:39:43preglowhm
10:40:03preglowi think the ipod scroll wheel handling proposal on the list is nice
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10:49:55earHertzpreglow: the one from TP Diffenbach?
10:54:14preglowyea
10:55:29preglowi proposed something pretty much exactly like that a while ago
10:55:31LinusNi managed to get ups to deliver to my work address
10:55:56LinusNbut the change of address had to be confirmed by the sender too
10:56:05B4gderhaha
10:56:13preglowallows good use of wheel acceleeration with no button flag messing
10:56:52Mikachui think the absolute value should also be provided somehow
10:56:58LinusNi tried to use rockbox on my ipod, and it feels a little sensitive on the controls
10:57:08preglowMikachu: indeed
10:57:13preglowLinusN: it is a wee bit
10:57:16MikachuLinusN: i changed the delta value from 4 to 10 in my build
10:57:27preglow10 is far too much, imho
10:57:34preglowbut it should be adjustable anyway
10:57:35LinusNthe lcd on the 5g is awesome
10:57:40preglowit is...
10:57:43earHertzodd, I use a delta od 2, and find it better
10:57:50Mikachuthe nano's wheel is smaller, maybe you need slightly different values
10:58:08preglowpoint being we need it configurable anyway
10:58:11Mikachui tend to not use the outer edge of the wheel either
10:58:19earHertzMikachu: i think absilurte and absolte delat shoukd vbe provided as well, but I expect that few clients will use them
10:58:19preglowwe should add a separate clickwheel entry
10:58:24preglowwhere you can adjust delta, and some day, beeping
10:58:56preglowwhat were you doing at the start of that sentence? :P
10:59:15earHertzpreglow: agreeing with Mikachu
11:00
11:00:13LinusNas suspected, marsdaddy has been away for a month, and nobody has the code
11:00:33LinusN(wma)
11:00:51preglowwe've got an early version of it
11:01:29B4gderas suspected indeed
11:01:44preglowhe'll come around
11:10:26LinusNit's fun too watch how slashdot discussions about rockbox always turn into debates about why apple dominates the market
11:10:30LinusNto
11:11:01B4gderyeah
11:11:10B4gderand very seldomly about anything Rockbox is
11:13:27 Quit BHSPitLappy (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:15:32preglowthat's how slashdot is
11:16:07preglowreading the comments in that place mostly makes me want to scream with rage
11:16:38preglowespecially when the regurgitation of the good old slashdot jokes start
11:16:53*amiconn thinks the lcd on the 5g is too big
11:16:58kerbI never manage to resist the temptation of reading the comments, and I go mad every time
11:16:59preglownonsense
11:17:32nudelyn2one can only wonder what the unfiltered slashdot comments look like. <shudder>
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11:19:21kerbI'm glad boingboing doesn't have comments
11:21:24Zagorwe should add a "rockbox in the news" section to the web site
11:21:44Genre9mp3Goddmorning all!
11:22:01markunkerb: I know what you mean, but now I put the threshold on 3 and mod down the 'funny' comments. it's a bit better to read.
11:22:02peturZagor: there is already
11:22:02kerbI've thought about replacing some of the images in the Rockbox wikipedia article, not the prettiest of themes :P
11:22:38Zagorpetur: where? i meant on the front page
11:22:48Zagorah, ArticlesAboutRockbox
11:22:49peturhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ArticlesAboutRockbox
11:22:59Genre9mp3So is this package that Bagder is waiting for, relates to SanDisk???
11:23:07Genre9mp3related
11:23:15peturshhht
11:23:21ZagorGenre9mp3: it's very siikriit! :-)
11:23:36Genre9mp3oh...sorry
11:23:53Genre9mp3I won't tell anyone...
11:34:30*petur wants his BOFH article
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12:17:09Papricammm
12:17:41Papricathe file browser or the wps use the plugin buffer?
12:19:13Paprica?
12:19:14Mikachuno, but the playlist viewer does
12:19:19Mikachui think
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12:21:43Papricaok thanks
12:25:25preglowyeah
12:25:31preglowthat's why tsr plugins can't use extra plugin buffer space
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12:37:03Genre9mp3petur: I know it's to early to ask such a question but I was wondering...is the ISP1362 chip capable of streaming data directly from a device than just transfer it (copy-paste) as the original FW only does?
12:37:37Genre9mp3I mean...is there a hardware limitation on this?
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12:50:49peturGenre9mp3: the usb driver from Philips I found supported even usb speakers :)
12:51:31peturso yes, we can do all types of usb transfers
12:52:10markunsweet
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12:52:32Genre9mp3wow! cool...I now wish the dock that comes with the player had a USBOTG port and not just the USB
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13:31:31webguest33are there any users here that live in or around Munich ?
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13:45:27dprowebguest33: vienna .. that's not exactly munich though ;) but I can almost reach out and touch it when I go to zurich (which I do fairly regularly)
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14:00
14:01:43peturdpro: [13:33] *** webguest33 left #rockbox []
14:05:47dpropetur: hmmmm
14:05:51*dpro needs coffee
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14:16:33Genre9mp3petur: I'm reading in te wiki about the USBOTG...What does this mean: " To be able to "mount" the USB device in the way MMC is mounted in Archos Ondio" ?
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14:22:14peturGenre9mp3: I think the removable storage comes available as a virtual directory in the root, but I'm not sure
14:23:05linuxstbYes - "mount" is a Unix term which means exactly that.
14:23:11kerbjust asking quickly, is it possible to start ipodlinux without repartitioning etc?
14:23:20linuxstb(but the virtual directory could be anywhere - not just the root)
14:23:28Genre9mp3Oh, that is actually what I had in mind when saying "streaming data directly"
14:24:12Genre9mp3This has to do with isochronus USB transfer mode, right?
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14:24:21linuxstbkerb: Quick answer is no. Unless you are installing on an HFS+ formatted ipod.
14:24:36kerblinuxstb: alright then
14:24:40linuxstbkerb: But haven't they got a new installer which will do that for you now?
14:25:11kerbI dunno, I can set it up just fine, I just didn't feel like copying 40 gigs over usb2 again :P
14:25:59linuxstbWhich ipod do you have?
14:26:00peturGenre9mp3: no. UMS is always bulk
14:26:07kerblinuxstb: 5g
14:26:34peturGenre9mp3: isochronous is used for audio/video, much like UDP in network
14:26:58linuxstbIf you never want to use the Apple firmware again (or use it, but never let it hibernate), you can install Linux in the firmware partition. But it's not the recommended way to install it.
14:27:21kerbNah, I think I'll just reset the whole ipod
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14:27:44kerbI've been having trouble with osx not wanting to mount it, and the ipod updater in windows not wanting to update, and itunes not finding it in windows etc
14:27:44Genre9mp3petur: And where we could use isochronus with a H300?
14:27:51amiconnGenre9mp3, petur: Generally it should be possible to access the data on an USB MSD directly via mounting.
14:28:19peturGenre9mp3: well to attach a webcam or usb speakers
14:28:32amiconnWhat's unclear yet is how fast these transfers actually are, and how much cpu power they suck
14:29:01Genre9mp3petur: Ok...now I understood the difference
14:29:04amiconnDepending on that, it might be impossible to play music directly from an USB disk
14:29:48peturthe Philips demo software for the isp1362 supports playing a wav file to usb speakers, so the chip can handle it...
14:29:54amiconnEnabling all these possibilities means quite some work apart from the USB stack
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14:30:20Genre9mp3amiconn:I was able to play directly MP3 from an external HDD using an old IBM laptop that had USB1.1
14:30:21peturyeah, we should get UMS supported first
14:30:39amiconnThe USB stack would need to present UMS devices in a way that resembles the ata.c api
14:31:06peturGenre9mp3: reading the file over USB or streaming the audio?
14:31:25amiconn..and the file system driver, while already supporting multivolume, would need to be extended a little further, in that it needs to access two different ata.c-like drivers
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14:31:54Genre9mp3petur: Just drag & drop an mp3 file to Winamp
14:32:28peturGenre9mp3: that's not streaming then, just using UMS to read the file
14:32:39amiconnThe latter could be done in defining a "meta ata driver" that looks like a multi-device ata driver for the file system, and accesses the real thing for device == 0, and UMS for device == 1
14:32:40petur( = bulk transfer)
14:33:09peturhey, I want acces to ALL cards of my multi-card reader
14:33:15petur:)
14:33:29amiconnYeah, then devices >= 1 would access UMS
14:33:37Genre9mp3petur:Well, yes...you just explained the difference...
14:33:49amiconn...but the number of volumes has a fixed (compile time limit)
14:33:56amiconnNote: volumes, not devices
14:34:06Genre9mp3The chip is incapable of USB2.0 USBOTG, right?
14:34:21amiconnUSBOTG *is* an USB 2.0 addition
14:34:31amiconn...but you probably mean high speed mode
14:34:40amiconn...which it isn't capable of
14:34:51Genre9mp3amiconn: Yes I meant high speed
14:34:55B4gderI love the full/high speed mess
14:35:03amiconnIt's not a mess
14:35:05B4gderit is
14:35:13B4gderits incomprehensible
14:35:20B4gderwhat the heck is full and what is high
14:35:21peturGenre9mp3: streaming (isochronous) would be your player's codec converting the mp3/whatever to a stream of audiobytes and the connected device just send them through a DAC
14:35:25amiconnIt's only that people don't use the terms in the way they're meant to be used
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14:35:32Paul_The_NerdTo me "high" means less than "full" anyway.
14:35:43Paul_The_NerdA high speed chase down the freeway doesn't mean the cars are going at full speed, just quickly.
14:35:53peturhahaha
14:36:05ashridahyeah, can't exactly go faster than full speed, or you wouldn't have been doing full speed
14:36:17Paul_The_NerdWell, USB2.0 can.
14:36:19Paul_The_NerdIt's special
14:36:23amiconnThen use the plain numbers
14:36:37Genre9mp3petur: Are there any USB Speakers in the market?
14:36:40amiconn1.5MBit/s, 12MBit/s and 480MBit/s
14:36:49amiconn(low/full/high)
14:36:52B4gderI prefer the numbers
14:37:01linuxstbI agree - "full" and "high" are meaningless. Numbers are more useful.
14:37:08B4gderjust that data sheets, software and companies use those odd terms
14:37:36*B4gder shakes fist
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14:37:53B4gderthat'll teach them!
14:37:55amiconnB4gder: Imho it's more confusing that people say "USB2.0" when they actually mean high speed (480Mbps)
14:38:15B4gderwell, I find that less frequent
14:38:17amiconnUSB2.0 is a protocol version, not a transfer speed
14:38:22Genre9mp3hehe: The bell rings for me I suppose! :)
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14:40:52Genre9mp3petur: Nevermind I googled for USB Speakers
14:41:39peturdon't know if we should support them, there's an audio output, remember?
14:41:52peturunless they have super good DAC's
14:42:09Genre9mp3So the chip can host at full/12MBit/s, right?
14:42:30peturyes
14:43:02peturbut you never fully get that speed (as with networking)
14:43:17linuxstbpetur: If it's technically possible, then why not? But it doesn't seem a high priority feature to me. UMS and digital camera protocols seem much more useful.
14:43:42Genre9mp3Yes...and this "Mount" capability....
14:44:03peturthat's what linuxstb said :p
14:44:11amiconnThe mount capability itself is already there
14:44:32Genre9mp3The UMS thing?
14:44:34*amiconn loves multivolume+hotplug on Ondio :)
14:44:57amiconnNo, but the ability to dynamically mount/unmount additional filesystems
14:45:43Genre9mp3Also it would be cool if we could stream video via a WebCam, but would be this possible at full speed?
14:45:49linuxstbAre there any issues with the H300 providing power for USB devices?
14:47:12LinusNwell, only european models can do it
14:47:29peturand only 100mA probably
14:47:36LinusNprobably
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14:48:03linuxstbIs that enough for external hard drives?
14:48:10peturnope
14:48:37peturmaybe very small ones
14:50:40Genre9mp3I couldn't get my external 250GB HDD to work with the original FW...
14:50:52Genre9mp3But It was powered via AC
14:51:04Genre9mp3So is there a GB limitation?
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14:53:57pekujaby the way, is there any place you can still buy Archos Ondio players?
14:54:14pekujaI would really like to have a player with removable flash memory
14:54:44Genre9mp3Maybe there is a limitation on the chip on haow much data it can handle or something?
14:54:49Genre9mp3how
14:56:32peturthe chip itself doesn't care - it's very low level.... must be the driver in the iriver fw
14:58:05Genre9mp3Great, so I can hope that this could work with Rockbox...
14:58:34Genre9mp3Damn... I wish I was able somehow to help on that....
15:00
15:00:35*petur needs more time
15:01:13peturgood news is, I'm taking a portable from work home so my wife won't need the pc this weekend :)
15:01:49aliaskpetur: I'll do your eating and sleeping so you don't need to worry about that any more, and you can spend more time on rockbox :D
15:02:11Genre9mp3LOL
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15:03:22peturother good news is that I'm writing a usb driver for windowsCE (at work), so I'm learning a lot about usb :D
15:04:03aliaskIt's always good to get paid for stuff that you might be able to transfer into rockbox. I assume we'll need a USB Stack if we're going to get USB Host working.
15:08:17peturthere's Philips demo sofftware + sources in the wiki that should help us a bit. Seems to be able to do a lot of the lowlevel stuff for us.
15:09:25Paul_The_NerdWhat's the license on its sources though?
15:09:52Paul_The_NerdBefore Philips comes crashing down on us like AT&T.
15:09:52peturnot much... the comment says you can use them in your product
15:11:27amiconnGenre9mp3: The limitation is most probably in the retail firmware's driver
15:11:59amiconnThe actual usb msd protocol is scsi, running via usb bulk transfer
15:13:28amiconnI connected my H300 to lostlogic's ipod video at devcon. It worked, but iriver fw took ages to read the directory of the ipod disk...
15:14:47preglowwhat about copying speed?
15:14:58peturI'm going to need usbotg tonight to read files of a memcard, and I'm swearing already that I won't be able to read all cards I need because iriver only reads card1 of the multi-card-reader
15:14:58Genre9mp3amiconn: lostlogic's iPod is 30GB or 60GB?
15:21:14linuxstbGenre9mp3: I think it's 30GB.
15:24:34amiconn30GB
15:25:06amiconnpreglow: I didn't try to actually copy files, just browsed some dirs
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15:26:03amiconnI already used it for copying data from my digicam, and also from the Ondio
15:26:17amiconnIt takes ages...
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15:26:34preglowwhat speed are we talking?
15:26:58linuxstbOff-topic question - anyone have recommendations for a laptop with good cooling? My girlfriend's cheap no-name Celeron laptop is almost melting in London's 26 degree summer (and wasn't much better in winter...)
15:27:21amiconnThe iriver fw transfers via a buffer, alternating between read aqnd write
15:27:54amiconnlinuxstb: I think any major brand should be ok
15:28:02*amiconn has a sONY
15:28:25Paul_The_NerdI have an emachines laptop that's actually cool enough to rest on my lap for many hours without any problem
15:29:11linuxstbI have a similar problem with my Apple iBook, although it's not quite as bad as hers.
15:29:54kerbI've never found even a relatively cool laptop
15:30:01kerbI really burned myself on a Dell once
15:31:00Paul_The_Nerdkerb: Mine's been on for 48 hours now, and i can press my cheek against the bottom of it without any unpleasantness.
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15:31:48kerbPaul_The_Nerd: wow
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15:32:24Paul_The_NerdUnfortunately I'm probably going to have to replace it soon.
15:32:44Paul_The_NerdIt's been burning out power adapters at a rate of about 1 per 2 months.
15:32:52kerbmy ibook is actually rather cool now
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15:33:05kerbI can put my cheek to it, it isn't necessarily comfortable but it doesn't hurt
15:33:18kerband I've been using it at work all day, though no cpu activity worth mentioning
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15:36:08linuxstbamiconn: Which Sony do you have?
15:37:15linuxstbPaul_The_Nerd: Burning out power adapters doesn't seem a good recommendation... I'm not sure if emachines sell laptops in the UK anyway though.
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15:40:51Paul_The_NerdYeah, actually though it's in my estimation a design flaw in the power adapters. The original one it came with died, then the first 5 that were replaced from the retailer (Best Buy) were no-name brands that were exactly identical in manufacturing. I finally demanded another original emachines one from them. This one looks differently manufactured, and doesn't have what I suspect was the cause of the prior failures (a flexible por
15:41:14Paul_The_NerdEither way, I don't think my laptop is manufactured anymore, so if I do end up needing a replacement I'm going to have to shop around again.
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15:47:08fergieIs the ipod recharging issue already fixed?
15:47:49fergieThat it drains faster than it can charge?
15:48:56Paul_The_NerdFeature freeze for 3.0, no official iPod-only changes/work should really be going on at all, ideally.
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15:53:31fergieOK, I will wait then.
15:53:49ashridahPaul_The_Nerd: iirc, amiconn was looking into it last night.
15:53:57fergieThis is the make or break issue for many ipod users i think.
15:54:10Paul_The_NerdWell, it hasn't been released yet.
15:54:41ashridahit looks like it's not moving to >100mA on the usb port while charging (at least, that's the issue he was looking at, don't know if there's more
15:55:03amiconnlinuxstb: Sony PCG-Z1RMP (already more than 2 years old now)
15:55:20Paul_The_Nerdashridah: I've heard that said a few other times as well over the last month, by other people too I think.
15:55:49amiconnStill quite good performance
15:55:53Paul_The_NerdMy iPod Nano actually doesn't lose charge during playback while plugged into my laptop's USB port.
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15:56:24ashridahyeah, but nano's like the one that draws the least current to run, isn't it? :)
15:56:26spacesylPlop
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15:56:39fergieI have a 4G Ipod and it cetrainly has that issue.
15:56:59Paul_The_Nerdashridah: I would expect so, since there's no disk spinup
15:57:21kerbMy problem is usually that the disk spins up all the time
15:57:23amiconnMini is also okay
15:57:25fergieI wanted to switch th rockbox completely but i had to stop using it due to that charging issue
15:57:27ashridahfergie: apparently charging in disk mode works normally, or something
15:57:31kerbUsually thanks to dircache by what I can see
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15:58:02Paul_The_Nerdkerb: What are you saying exactly?
15:58:05fergieI know because then it doen't play
15:58:28Paul_The_Nerdfergie: Well, for the moment Rockbox users should be looking at this more as "testing" than "Software ready to be used fulltime." As I said, it's not released yet.
15:58:29kerbgot to go
15:58:40fergienp
16:00
16:01:10*Paul_The_Nerd loves it when someone hints at a problem, blames it on a specific feature, and disappears when prompted to actually explain what they mean.
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16:26:51Paul_The_Nerd3000...
16:27:46petur?
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16:28:17Paul_The_NerdI just posted my 3000th
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16:30:06***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:30:21peturcongrats ;)
16:31:10Paul_The_NerdHeh
16:31:22Paul_The_NerdI don't know if that's the proper response, or "You poor, sad little man"
16:31:52peturyour support effort is impressive, that's for sure
16:33:29Paul_The_NerdWell, no matter how good documentation gets, it can't beat someone saying "Now don't panic, we can fix this" when someone goes wrong.
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17:00:47caduhello guys! in my town i'm not being able to find any good pmp (UMS....ogg...flac) and discovered rockbox, but ....is it worthy to buy an iPod expecting to put rockbox on it and be happy?
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17:01:44ashridahrockbox is still very much in development on the ipods, but that said, a lot of stuff still works.
17:01:55Paul_The_Nerdcadu: Depends on your expectations. For now Rockbox is still in development on iPod, so has some bugs, but and of course, Rockbox doesn't play video, and I noticed you say you're looking for a PMP, and not just an audio player. You *can* use the retail firmware for Video, but that's non-UMS
17:02:06caduoh sorry
17:02:09cadubad term
17:02:12cadupmp (portable music player)
17:02:24Paul_The_NerdUsually "PMP" is Portable Media Player, in my experience. :)
17:02:24cadui want mp3 / ogg / flac and UMS, that and i'm happy
17:02:33cadui don't care for video, photos etc :)
17:02:39Paul_The_NerdWell, Rockbox on iPod should be plenty suitable for that.
17:02:49Paul_The_NerdThough I believe Rockbox on iAudioX5 does that job a little bit better at the moment.
17:02:53cadui live in japan but can you believe i can't find a good "geek oriented" music player here ? T__T
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17:03:36ryranhola all
17:04:13caduPaul_The_Nerd: any annoying issues? i wanna buy a music player in the next months and the only good choice here is the ipod (the others are usually creative locked players and those chinese no-branded small sticks) :(
17:04:31caduPaul_The_Nerd: then i see something claiming mp3 and ogg and flac on an ipod. dammit i want it :P
17:04:35Paul_The_Nerdcadu: Well, the primary question is: Do you intend to use an equalizer?
17:04:45caduPaul_The_Nerd: no. don't like it.
17:05:03Paul_The_NerdThen a 5G iPod should provide no major problems other than right now the battery life is poor in Rockbox.
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17:05:22caduPaul_The_Nerd: still has a lot of room for optimisation :) okayz
17:05:38caduif only i could find a iAudioX5(L) here.... aaaa
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17:06:04ryran(I can testify to what Paul says. just bought a 5g and am absolutely loving it.)
17:06:20Paul_The_Nerdcadu: Yeah. Definitely a lot of room to optimize yet, but other than that the 5G iPod port is overall fairly good.
17:06:52cadunice, any experiences on it ?
17:07:14caduPaul_The_Nerd: like....put on some 256kbit/320kbit mp3 and some Q5+ oggs on it and no big thing playing those?
17:07:23caduPaul_The_Nerd: coz dammit, you got me happy.
17:07:52Paul_The_NerdI listen to Q6 oggs on my Nano without problems
17:08:15Paul_The_NerdI've also tested the nano with up to... 8 or 9 if I recall
17:08:40Paul_The_NerdThe 5G has a little more difficulty driving the screen, but I believe 320kbps MP3 and Q6 or 7 Ogg have been reported to work fine on it.
17:09:02Paul_The_NerdI don't have a 5G, so I have no firsthand experience outside the Nano, for iPods at least.
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17:10:25ryranall my mp3s are lame -v2 encoded and I've had absolutely no skipping on my 60gig video (unless I'm trying to play games or do some other plugin type thing)
17:10:29ryranjust, fyi
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17:11:51caduryran: nice, how many hours of playback? +-5 ?
17:12:19Paul_The_Nerdcadu: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodRuntime
17:14:09caduat most 10 hours
17:14:13caduPaul_The_Nerd: thanks :)
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17:17:56ryrancadu: sorry was afk. I've only had my 5g two weeks now. have been meaning to do testing, but I haven't yet. =D
17:18:05ryranall I can say is that YES the battery is less
17:18:19cadu:)
17:18:54caduif i'm really going for an ipod ( no other choice ) i should find spare usb fem cables and some resistors to build myself an AA-battery usb charger :P
17:19:02ryranhah
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17:23:44caduthanks for the answers, guys.
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17:23:59webguest69hi
17:24:35ryranhey webguest69
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17:25:29webguest69I've just started coding a few plugins for rockbox...
17:26:06webguest69but I'm sort of a newbie
17:26:34ryransounds cool
17:26:41ryranyou looking for help or som'n?
17:26:46webguest69I wonder if someone could answer a few questions to give me a headstart
17:27:01webguest69hi ryan
17:27:31ryranheh.. wouldn't be me. I'm just a lowly user. :)
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17:28:01webguest69do you know anyone who could help me a bit?
17:28:40ryranna man. this is the place to be though.. people seem pretty chill here−−might take a little while for someone to respond
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17:30:06webguest69ohh, ok
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17:36:50Paul_The_NerdAnother thing to do is leave a message in the forums with your question, or post it to the development mailing list.
17:37:44Paul_The_NerdAs people in here come and go, with one of those you at least have the message/response possibility over a delayed time, so someone can read it when they wake up in the morning, or whatnot.
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18:07:36HCldoes anyone know how the latest cvs changes are put on the site? I can't seem to be able to figure the cvs log command out..
18:07:54Paul_The_NerdWhat do you mean?
18:08:05HCllike, you can see all the last changes that were made
18:08:17HClI'm trying to get a list of what was changed between yesterday and now on this other cvs
18:08:21HClbut I have *no* idea how
18:08:49Paul_The_NerdWouldn't that be something to search for either a man page about, or the CVS site?
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18:13:27HCldid
18:13:32HCleven asked in their channel
18:13:36HClcan't find it
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18:15:29Paul_The_NerdHCl: http://ximbiot.com/cvs/wiki/index.php?title=CVS−−Concurrent_Versions_System_v1.12.12.1:_History_browsing
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18:23:02redondosHello. I just installed rockbox to an iPod nano. Is it possible to boot the apple firmware or are they mutually exclusive?
18:23:18redondosBecause the manual says that id I want to boot the original firmware I should remove the rockbox.ipod directory.
18:23:25HClPaul_The_Nerd: doesn't work..
18:23:30redondosWhy can't I just choose which one to boot?
18:26:51ryranredondos: you can. you have to hold down the menu button when booting to boot into the original firmware
18:27:06Paul_The_NerdHCl: The link doesn't work, or the instructions do not? From what I understand that's the official CVS wiki manual.
18:27:29HClinstructions
18:27:46redondosryran: Great, thank you.
18:27:56Paul_The_NerdHCl: Well, that's what they say to do. I'd suggest just doing some further google research then.
18:28:01HClit spits out some weird list which in no way resembles any kind of last cvs commits done
18:28:07HClyea, that's why I asked here
18:28:10HClI'm desperate :/
18:28:18ryranredondos: keep in mind though that you really need to hold it down like.. *from the beginning* or it won't do it
18:28:51ryranredondos: then, to get back into rockbox, just to a reset by holding down menu + select for 5 seconds
18:28:52Paul_The_NerdHCl: You tried cvs log, as well as cvs history?
18:28:57HClyup
18:29:00HClcvs log sort of works
18:29:00HClbut
18:29:05HClI can't set a date before
18:29:10HCland it simply spits out all commits ever made
18:29:12Learhci: there's a script that pieces the log together, possibly from several cvs commands.
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18:29:30HClgot a link?
18:29:40Paul_The_NerdHCl: http://ximbiot.com/cvs/wiki/index.php?title=CVS−−Concurrent_Versions_System_v1.12.12.1:_Guide_to_CVS_commands#SEC159
18:29:51Paul_The_NerdIf you followed the links within the articles, it tells you how to set a range of links for the log command
18:29:56Paul_The_Nerddates rather, not links
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18:30:55HClI did
18:30:59HClit didn't appear to do anything
18:31:38Paul_The_NerdYou did it the same way they show in the examples?
18:31:53Paul_The_Nerdcvs log -S -d "2005/10/1<2005/10/3"
18:31:53HCllet me see
18:31:56HCloh
18:31:57HClno
18:32:00*Paul_The_Nerd sighs.
18:32:02HClthey said a comma separated list o-o
18:32:08HClin the help
18:32:26Paul_The_NerdSemicolon separated list.
18:32:31HClyea, that
18:32:36HClso that's what i did
18:32:56Learhci: see here: http://daniel.haxx.se/projects/recentcvs/
18:32:57Paul_The_NerdI assume you could do "2005/10/1<2005/10/3";"2005/10/5<2005/10/6"
18:33:14Paul_The_NerdThe ; is a separator of elements in the list, according to the wiki page
18:33:35HClyea, so i thought they wanted the first date and then the second date separated by a ;
18:33:39HCl*tries the < thing*
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18:34:28HClthanks :) that seems to work
18:35:24Paul_The_NerdAnyone with an archos around?
18:36:19Paul_The_NerdScratch that, I just realize it's something I can test in a sim.
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19:07:13DgentlyIs there anyone here who can give me some quick help with an Archos FMR ata issue?
19:07:37DgentlyI tried searching the wiki, and didn't come up with anything.
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19:13:42dunnoPaul_the_
19:13:56MikachuPaul_The_what?
19:14:02dunnoI hate it when it does that
19:14:18MikachuPaul_the_pet_pelican?
19:14:30dunnoI wanted to say, thank you paul_the nerd for helping me out
19:16:17dunnowhat does Brandon mean in the comments in this patch http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/2890
19:18:04Paul_The_NerdThe settings are saved as a binary lump, I guess he just didn't make a change that would tell it that lump is larger now? I really don't know for sure, just hazarding a guess.
19:18:54dunnodo I have to do anything specific to the patch when I apply it ?
19:19:55Papricahttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5522
19:20:02dunno20 minutes and counting for cygwin to "make" a build
19:20:59Paul_The_Nerddunno: Yeah, you'd want to adjust settings.c appropriately I think, but I don't know what sort of adjustment needs to be done.
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19:21:15Paul_The_Nerd20 minutes seems a bit long, though I guess it depends on your computer...
19:21:31dunno1.13 P111
19:21:51Paul_The_NerdAh, possibly understandable then.
19:22:09dunnoah well let it run, it took me long enough to get the darn thing to run, make the most of it
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19:22:18dunnoThanks for you help, much appreciated
19:22:32Paul_The_NerdI know it took me ~7 minutes on a Athlon64 3400+, cygwin is not exactly speedy
19:22:47Paul_The_NerdI know how frustrating some of this stuff can be. :)
19:23:30dunnosheez, I sometimes think that my so called "logical brain" is a big disadvantage with this stuff
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19:25:28Ish_nittihello everyone
19:25:42dunnoI wonder if lostlogi1 is lostlogic(Brandon)
19:25:49Ish_nittii am a new ipod video owner, and am looking to install Rockbox
19:26:00Ish_nittiim guessing this wont allow me to watch my video podcasts?
19:26:17Ish_nittii am aware of the dual boot option
19:26:21Paul_The_Nerddunno: If it's not, it's someone pretending to be him.
19:26:39Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: For your podcasts, you'll only be able to view them in the Apple firmware.
19:27:15dunnolostlogi1 hello there, are you Brandon :=)
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19:35:24RedBrevaHi, is mIRC working? Only just installed it, but no traffic in here, so not sure if it's just quiet, or i've got something wrong... :D
19:35:40ryranlol
19:35:45ryranit's just quiet
19:35:46ryran:)
19:35:54RedBreva:D Thanks
19:36:10ryran(I wondered the same thing when I first came in here yesterday)
19:36:13dunnoits that time of the evening in europe, lull before the storm
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19:36:37dunno19:36 CET, dinner time and family time
19:36:44RedBrevaplus Germany are playing on TV - World cup and all that
19:37:09Ish_nittiPaul_The_Nerd: so dual boot would be my best option?
19:37:46Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Your only one for video podcasts + rockbox for the moment
19:38:02sharpeIsh_nitti: yep.
19:40:26Ish_nittiNo one watches video podcats?
19:40:32Ish_nittithats absurd!
19:40:33Ish_nittilol
19:40:55RedBrevaI dont watch anysort of cats, pod or otherwise :D
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19:41:29ryranhaha
19:42:01Ish_nittiThey're rather informative
19:42:16Ish_nittiMight i suggest you look into it :)
19:42:23Paul_The_NerdWhat do you mean "No one watches" them?
19:42:23Ish_nittiEsp the technology related ones
19:42:40Ish_nittiYou said i was the only one for video on rockbox
19:42:49sharpeno, he said that's your one option. :)
19:42:53Ish_nittioh
19:42:54Paul_The_NerdNo, I said it was your only option. :-P
19:43:00Ish_nittiI apologize
19:43:19sharpe:D
19:45:18RedBrevaRocketboom on the PC every few days is as near to a video podcast that I get, but even that is too small to really enjoy
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19:50:59dunnoyay cygwin has finally completed a build, 55 minutes later
19:51:51Paul_The_NerdWow
19:52:05dunnoI think that there might be an issue somewhere
19:53:11dunnoI did full installs of cygwin from two different mirrors, wonder if this could have an effect on it
19:53:19Paul_The_NerdIn response to your last forum post: I don't think that should be a problem, as that's just where it stores things before it extracts and installs them.
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19:58:33dionoeahello
20:00
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20:02:37Ish_nittiWill installing rockbox format my ipods HD?
20:02:51Paul_The_NerdIf you have an HFS+ one, reformatting is necessary
20:02:55Paul_The_NerdIf you have a FAT32 one, it is now
20:02:56Ish_nittiI think i read somewhere that the ipodpatcher.exe need to format to update the firmware
20:02:58Paul_The_Nerdnot
20:03:04Ish_nittiahh gotcha
20:03:08Ish_nittiyeah its fat32
20:03:32Ish_nittithank you paul, you've been very helpfull :)
20:03:57Paul_The_NerdNo problem
20:04:49dunnonah that cygwin build didn't work, there is a big mess where theres supposed to be a zip file, back to the drawing board
20:05:06Paul_The_NerdBig mess?
20:05:18Paul_The_NerdAnd: I still think you should just use VMWare.
20:05:23dunnofiles all over the place
20:05:26Paul_The_NerdWell yeah
20:05:36Paul_The_NerdAfter running "Make" did you follow with "make fullzip"?
20:05:39dunnoI dont really want to install linux on my pc
20:05:52Paul_The_NerdVMWare isn't installing linux.
20:05:56ryranyeah dude
20:06:02sharpehence the, "Virtual Machine"
20:06:03dionoeacygwin should work fine :)
20:06:05Paul_The_NerdYou install a single program, VMWare player, and it basically runs a virtual computer.
20:06:12Paul_The_NerdThat fake computer runs Linux
20:06:14ryranI haven't tried cygwin but vmware worked superwell for me yesterday
20:06:32dunnoryan, i might be a dude to you, but i dont really like computers, no matter what flavour they are
20:06:33Paul_The_Nerddionoea: Cygwin takes twice as long to compile, and has far more potential complications while setting up.
20:06:45ryranhaha
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20:07:14dionoeaPaul_The_Nerd: but it takes less disk space :)
20:07:31ryranhaha
20:07:44sharpethat it does.
20:07:45ryranwell I suppose you have a choice then
20:08:01ryrankeep playing with cygwin and have it take longer, or try vmware
20:08:04Paul_The_Nerddunno: Anyway, did you do a "make fullzip" after the make?
20:08:05ryran;)
20:08:16Paul_The_Nerddunno: It doesn't create a .zip file until you run the second command.
20:08:45dunnoPaul dont remember, so I'll another make fullzip, this time
20:08:57Paul_The_Nerddunno: You can also do "make zip" if you're okay with it leaving out the fonts. But it's always "make" which creates all the files, then "make zip" or "make fullzip" which puts those files in a .zip to use.
20:10:00dunnohaha, was typing irc in the cygwin window, thanks for that tip about the fonts, will try it
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20:24:36dunnomy cugwin installation is unwell, I type make zip and it returns "find: apps; no such file or directory", *sigh*, i'll reinstall, cygwin ans see what happens
20:25:23Paul_The_NerdI still suggest VMWare. It's much simpler to install and use.
20:26:05dunnothanks paul i'll look into that next, just seems a pity to come so far and have to abandon it
20:26:46dunnolater
20:26:49 Part dunno
20:26:50Paul_The_NerdYeah, but sometimes it costs more to fix something than to just buy a new one. ;)
20:26:52Paul_The_NerdDarn
20:28:16Ish_nittiHeh, well my ipod is trashed
20:28:47Paul_The_NerdOh?
20:28:52Ish_nittii used the bootloader-color-nondefualt.bin instead of the video bootloader
20:29:02sharpe...
20:29:03Paul_The_Nerdipodpatcher -w N bootpartition.bin
20:29:11Ish_nittiyeah i did that
20:29:18Ish_nittioh wait
20:29:20Ish_nittiwithout the -w
20:29:25Paul_The_NerdYeah
20:29:30Paul_The_NerdYou did it with the -r to extract it
20:29:35Paul_The_Nerd-w writes it back, restoring the original
20:29:44Paul_The_NerdTo undo what you've done.
20:29:55sharpei still have to get around to writing that tutorial on updating the apple firmware.
20:29:55Ish_nittithis is what i did
20:29:56Ish_nittiipodpatcher -w N rockboot.bin
20:30:09sharpedid you put the number of your ipod in for N ?
20:30:10Ish_nittishould that be the bootloader?
20:30:12Ish_nittiyes
20:30:13***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:30:17Paul_The_NerdYes, but you used the wrong bootloader
20:30:17sharpeokay. making sure.
20:30:21Paul_The_NerdAnd I just told you how to undo it.
20:30:44Ish_nittiso i should put the booloader-color-nondefualt.bin instead of rockboot.bin right?
20:30:49Paul_The_NerdNo.
20:31:00Paul_The_Nerdnotice it says "color" not "video"
20:31:05Ish_nittiyes
20:31:12Ish_nittibut i needed that dual boot function
20:31:18Ish_nittii guess it wont be doable.
20:31:26Paul_The_NerdStop
20:31:35sharpehammer time!
20:31:42Paul_The_Nerd1) The official bootloader does dual boot. The one you tried to use defaults to Apple instead of Rockbox is all
20:31:58Paul_The_Nerd2) Why did you think using software for a different iPod would work? Why would we label which one they were for if it didn't matter?
20:32:07Ish_nittiTrue
20:32:15Ish_nittiI was unaware i could still dual boot
20:32:24Ish_nittiwith the proper firmware
20:32:28Paul_The_Nerd3) Just boot your ipod into disk mode (menu+select held to reboot, then hold select+play to go into disk mode), then do the command I told you to restore the original apple firmware partition.
20:32:35Paul_The_NerdThen follow the instructions PROPERLY this time.
20:32:40 Quit Psilonaut ()
20:32:47Paul_The_NerdYour iPod's fine
20:32:54Paul_The_NerdAnd your music should still be fine even
20:33:30Ish_nittiYeah i know its fine, i was just saying i crapped it :)
20:33:36Paul_The_NerdYou do end up sending rockboot.bin over, because it's what you get when you merge the bootloader with the apple firmware, but you *need* to create it with the proper bootloader bin file.
20:33:43Ish_nittiWell in disk mode it just says "Ok to disconnect"
20:33:47Ish_nittiyet its not connected to the USB
20:33:55Paul_The_NerdSo plug in the USB
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21:20:41Ish_nittiInteresting
21:20:47Ish_nittiOk i get the blue bootup post screen
21:20:59Ish_nittibut i keep getting the -1 error, even tho i completed setup.
21:21:55sharpeIsh_nitti: are you sure the rockbox.ipod and /.rockbox folder are in the root of your ipod's drive?
21:22:07Ish_nittiby top-level (root) they mean outside of all the folders?
21:22:09Ish_nittiyeah im pretty sure
21:22:14Ish_nittiim double checking right now
21:22:35Ish_nittiF:\.rockbox\
21:22:44Ish_nittiF:\rockbox.iaudio is in there also
21:22:51Ish_nittishould it be in the iPod_control folder?
21:22:57Ish_nittiim pretty sure F:\ is the root
21:23:24sharpe...
21:23:30sharpewhy do you have rockbox.iaudio?
21:23:39Ish_nittiit came with the .zip
21:23:42sharpe....
21:23:47sharpeyou downloaded the wrong zip then.
21:23:51Ish_nittihttp://www.rockbox.org/daily.shtml
21:24:01Ish_nittioh shiz, you know what i did
21:24:13Ish_nittiit the iAudioX5 looks like a video ipod
21:24:14sharpedownloaded the wrong zip?
21:24:14Ish_nittilol
21:25:29Ish_nittiwow do i feel stupid.
21:26:17Ish_nittilooks good
21:26:24Ish_nittivery basic menu :) love it
21:26:32Ish_nittinow to choose some decent themes.
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21:33:37Paul_The_NerdHmm... DAP with 10 band EQ. Sounds like ours needs an upgrade. :-P
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21:36:05Genre9mp3Paul_The_Nerd: Which DAP has a 10 band EQ?
21:36:39sharpewe need a sixty band EQ!
21:36:52 Part raybert
21:37:14Genre9mp3Paul_The_Nerd: Is it also Parametric? :-P
21:38:58Paul_The_NerdGenre9mp3: Actually, I can't tell if it's an "EQ" that has presets, and just displays 10 bands of peakmeters, or an actual one. It's some new korean player that's pretty crappy with ONLY MP3, AVI, JPEG, and TXT supported. I kinda find it hard to believe that they mean 10 band EQ in the same way we would.
21:40:00pekujawill that be fixed for the release version?
21:40:12Paul_The_NerdWhat?
21:40:17pekujaoops
21:40:27pekujasorry, I had my window scrolled up
21:40:40Paul_The_NerdSo, what were you asking about?
21:41:00Ish_nittiwhat is the purpose of the rockbox-2.5-install.exe?
21:41:00pekujahang on a second, I'll scroll back and check if that was discussed
21:41:14Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: It's the previous release version?
21:41:43Ish_nittithis page
21:41:43Ish_nittihttp://www.rockbox.org/download/
21:41:51Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Every now and then an official release happens, which has to meet a certain standard of bug-free-ness, and those are kept around so people who don't care so much about living on the edge have a stable one to use.
21:42:15Paul_The_Nerd2.5 was the last official release, which included all Archos targets.
21:42:37Ish_nittiWhat is archos? another brand of mp3 player?
21:42:40Ish_nittiive never heard of it
21:42:47Paul_The_NerdYes.
21:42:52Ish_nittigotcha
21:43:00Paul_The_NerdThe 3.0 release is the next one, which may or may not happen soon, and encompasses the Archoses and irivers. The iPods aren't to be released for a while yet.
21:43:16Ish_nittinice
21:43:31pekujaok, well what I wanted to ask is that with the problem that sometimes a plugin can hog all the CPU by not yeilding, so will plugins that don't be included in the release version or will those be fixed or taken out of the release version?
21:43:38Ish_nittiwell i booted into a stock rockbox, how do i get to my music now?
21:43:46Ish_nittiim thinking i have to create a playlist
21:43:52Ish_nittior just read the freakin pdf manual
21:43:53Ish_nittilol
21:44:00Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: If you have music hidden by iTunes, try reading the TagCache wiki page.
21:44:10Ish_nittiok
21:44:18Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: Which plugin are you thinking of?
21:44:26pekujanot any one in particular
21:44:29Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: I haven't experienced that problem on my H100 at all.
21:44:33pekujaok
21:44:35Paul_The_NerdDo you know any plugins that don't yield?
21:44:36pekujaI have a H300
21:45:01pekujayeah, I did have a problem with at least one... let me check
21:45:27pekujabut anyways, the particular plugin wasn't really my point, but I was wondering if that will be tested somewhat
21:45:47Paul_The_NerdWell, we depend on people to actually *report* bugs.
21:45:48pekujaI mean at least to check that all plugins yeild at least a bit
21:45:57Paul_The_NerdSo, if you want it to get fixed, it'd be nice if you figured out which one it is.
21:46:07pekujahmm
21:46:15pekujaI guess that's one way of looking at it
21:46:48Ish_nittiSo it looks like i need to force a tagcache update
21:46:54Paul_The_NerdWell, I mean, if I don't have this problem at all, clearly I can't find it.
21:47:05Paul_The_NerdIf you're experiencing it, you sorta are the only person who knows exactly how it happens.
21:47:17pekujawell yeah, but I mean is that a sort of thing that gets checked before release or whatever?
21:47:32Paul_The_NerdFor release we try to fix as many reported bugs as possible.
21:47:40pekujaI mean if I was making a software release like that, I wouldn't want to ship buggy plugins with it since it's pretty easy to check if it's buggy or not
21:47:49Paul_The_NerdHow is it "easy?"
21:48:10Paul_The_NerdThere are over 20 plugins, 10 formats of supported music, and problems that may only occur at certain bitrates or under certain listening conditions.
21:48:18pekujawell of course
21:48:19Ish_nittiI agree
21:48:26Paul_The_NerdSo, how is it easy exactly?
21:48:34pekujabut I guess some problems might appear with any, if the plugin never yeilds, right?
21:48:45Paul_The_NerdHave you checked in the code that it never yields?
21:48:56Paul_The_NerdOr are you just assuming that it does?
21:49:14pekujaI'm not assuming anything. I'm not talking about a particular plugin.
21:49:25pekujaI'm just wondering if the developers tend to check if all the plugins yeild or not.
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21:49:52pekujabecause if I understand correctly, not yeilding would pretty much guarantee that it will hog the CPU
21:50:01Paul_The_NerdPretty much, yes.
21:50:07Paul_The_NerdIt'd be *quite* noticeable if it didn't yield.
21:50:33Paul_The_NerdAnd if people reported bugs, we'd then know about it.
21:50:57Paul_The_NerdIt's not like a developer can sit down and audit all the plugin code to make sure yields are used properly.
21:51:01pekujawell of course, but I mean you must do some testing of your own?
21:51:07Paul_The_NerdLike what kind?
21:51:07pekujawell
21:51:18Paul_The_NerdIt's an open source project.
21:51:25Paul_The_NerdWhy don't you contribute and do some testing and provide feedback?
21:51:25pekujathat doesn't mean you can't test it
21:51:38Paul_The_NerdBut it means that you *can*
21:51:55Paul_The_NerdIt's a concern of yours. We haven't received bug reports on the plugins, so the assumption is that they're working.
21:52:20Paul_The_NerdI mean honestly, compared to playback code the plugins are a very minor thing anyway.
21:52:24pekujaso you just write the code and assume it works?
21:52:35pekujawell yeah, that's exactly why it's important that they don't mess the playback up
21:52:39pekujabut I do get your point
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21:52:46Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: Why aren't you testing them?
21:53:00Paul_The_NerdThe code isn't just written and assumed it works.
21:53:01Genre9mp3Hehe...I like the basic focus of this conversation...
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21:53:16Paul_The_NerdA plugin gets in by being written, several people trying it, finding it works, agreeing that it meets quality standards, and including it.
21:53:18pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, I'm testing right now.
21:53:25Paul_The_NerdThere's no assumption that it works
21:53:30Paul_The_NerdIt's tested when it gets included
21:53:38pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, And yeah, I was only asking whether you conduct testing before a release, or do you count on bug reports.
21:53:39Paul_The_NerdBut there's no audit to see if yields are being used correctly or anything
21:53:56Paul_The_NerdTesting is usually done before a plugin is included
21:54:01pekujayeah
21:54:02 Part yeahx
21:54:02Paul_The_NerdIt would be remiss to wait until a release cycle to test them
21:54:11pekujawell I guess that answers my question
21:54:17pekujaof course it would
21:54:18Paul_The_NerdAnd it's not like the yields are going to mysteriously vanish from the code.
21:54:31pekujabut it might be a good idea to check at the release cycle too
21:54:39Paul_The_NerdFor what? Vanishing yields?
21:54:50pekujaor are the plugins not modified at all after they're included?
21:54:50Paul_The_NerdAnd what test conditions?
21:55:15Paul_The_NerdYes, but as has been said, there are hundreds, possibly thousands, of test conditions
21:55:31Paul_The_NerdThe obvious ones WILL be noticed, the non-obvious ones have to be depended on widespread use to be noticed.
21:55:49Paul_The_NerdSo, under what conditions do you recommend testing occur?
21:56:39pekujamaybe my question was too obvious
21:56:56Paul_The_NerdWhat *exactly* are you proposing?
21:57:11pekujaI'm not proposing anything. I asked a question.
21:57:15Paul_The_NerdYou started off by citing a specific problem (a plugin not yielding).
21:57:16pekujaI think I know the answer now.
21:57:34Paul_The_NerdYou seem to think there should be some testing process.
21:57:39pekujayeah, or moreso the fact that a plugin might stop audio playback
21:57:41Paul_The_NerdBut you also don't seem to know what it should be.
21:57:56Paul_The_NerdAnd you've hypothesized a bug that as far as you know doesn't actually exist.
21:58:38pekujawell I do know that I got my audio playback to stop at one point by running a plugin
21:58:42 Quit Genre9mp3 ()
21:58:43pekujaso I know there are problems
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21:59:27Paul_The_NerdSkip, or stop?
21:59:28Ish_nittihrm
21:59:33Ish_nittii have to install some patches
22:00
22:00:10Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Patches require compiling your own build.
22:00:11pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, well I'm testing now, and I found that pacbox and metronome completely stop the audio playback, but I guess that's intentional?
22:00:22pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, it'd be nice if there was a warning about that though
22:00:29sharpepekuja: it's intentional.
22:00:51Paul_The_NerdSo, no bug yet.
22:01:29pekujawell there kind of is
22:01:38sharpeand what would that be?
22:01:54pekujawell it stops the audio playback without user request
22:02:12Paul_The_NerdThe user requested to run a plugin with audio.
22:02:13pekujait's not obvious that something called "pacbox" stops audio playback
22:02:24pekujawell yeah, but he might not know that
22:02:28pekujalike I didn't
22:02:32Paul_The_NerdThen he didn't read the manual
22:02:37Paul_The_NerdWhich describes what the plugins are.
22:02:41pekujahm...
22:02:43Paul_The_NerdPacbox is a PacMan emulator.
22:02:58pekujadoes it tell that pacbox stops audio playback?
22:03:01Paul_The_Nerd"The user didn't read the manual" is not a bug.
22:03:03Paul_The_NerdPacMan has sound.
22:03:21Ish_nittilooks like the author for this theme already compiled it with the patches
22:03:22Ish_nittihttp://solutions-i.org/julius/rockbox/
22:03:28Paul_The_NerdDoom also stops audio playback.
22:03:47Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Yes, it may be slightly out of date, but it should work.
22:03:57pekujaI'll have to read the manual I guess, but does the manual tell that plugins with sound stop any other audio playback?
22:04:03Ish_nittiso i guess ill grab rockbox-jbuild-20060523-ipodvideo.tar.gz, do i just untar over the existing files on my pod?
22:04:36Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: How would you hear sound if they don't? Though it probably doesn't say it explicitly, it seems like common sense to me. If you don't feel it is, file a correction to the patch tracker.
22:04:56Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Put it on just like you did the rockbox.zip you used before.
22:06:06pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, well, it might either not play the sound if something was playing, or ask the user if they want to stop the playback or whatever
22:06:19pekujabut, a quote from the manual:
22:06:31pekuja"Music will carry on playing whilst plugins are being run."
22:07:01Paul_The_NerdSo file a correction in the patch tracker if you think it needs to be changed.
22:07:07Paul_The_NerdAs I said before.
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22:07:45Paul_The_NerdIt's the way it is because the person who wrote it was okay with it. It doesn't mean it's perfect. You think it needs to be adjusted, then do so.
22:09:40sharpei believe they also stop playback because they've to iram... not quite sure if i remember correctly.
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22:10:31Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: I think the only one without sound that stops playback is the JPEG viewer, which has a note telling the user that it will.
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22:12:06pekujabatterytest also seems to stop playback
22:12:28Paul_The_Nerdbatterytest is supposed to be removed, I believe.
22:12:40pekujahm, I think I don't even have a jpeg viewer here. is it new?
22:13:00Paul_The_NerdIt's a viewer-style plugin
22:13:02Paul_The_NerdYou just click on jpegs
22:13:15Paul_The_NerdIt's been in since before H300 support was added
22:14:13linuxstb_sharpe: Yes, that's why pacbox stops playback - it needs IRAM and all the CPU in order to get realtime emulation. Other plugins may stop playback to get access to the extra memory, and others have sound themselves.
22:14:23pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, what's it called?
22:14:39sharpeScore! I get one right again.
22:14:56Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: jpeg.rock
22:15:05pekujahm, I don't think I have it here
22:15:13Paul_The_NerdIt doesn't show up in the plugin list
22:15:14Paul_The_NerdI told you
22:15:19linuxstb_It's in .rockbox/viewers/ (not rocks/)
22:15:19Paul_The_NerdIt's a viewer-style plugin
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22:15:25xerxes1358Hello
22:15:38*Ish_nitti is away: lunchtimebitches
22:15:48sharpei fought the washing machine and i won.
22:15:52xerxes1358can rockbox have a file structure ? i.e. Can I have folders in folders that in turn contain audio files ?
22:16:02pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, when did you tell me that?
22:16:02xerxes1358note that folder in folder is important
22:16:05sharpexerxes1358:yes
22:16:16sharpexerxes1358: rockbox works as a filebrowser.
22:16:22xerxes1358cool
22:16:27Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: The next line after you said "Is it new?" says it's viewer-style
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22:16:29xerxes1358and can this also be done for video files ?
22:16:39Paul_The_NerdNo
22:16:40sharpexerxes1358: rockbox does not support video
22:16:49xerxes1358oh
22:16:59pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, oh, I get it now
22:17:10pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, I didn't understand what you meant by viewer-style at first
22:17:35pekujabut hey, I have an actual bug here, running the "fire" plugin makes the music skip
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22:18:05pekujawith a 160kbps cbr mp3
22:18:19pekujaI'll see if I have some lower bitrate stuff here to test
22:18:31Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: Viewers are described in the manual as well, by the way.
22:19:24pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, ok
22:19:56pekujaPaul_The_Nerd, I still would not assume anyone to know what a "viewer" is though, since it's not at all important to know that if you just want to use them
22:20:27Paul_The_NerdYes, and?
22:20:28pekujaok, the fire plugin is a bastard, it makes my 64kbps cbr mp3 skip too
22:20:46pekujayes, and I didn't know the concept of "viewer"
22:20:47Paul_The_Nerdpekuja: What do you mean by "would not assume?"
22:21:14Paul_The_NerdYes, but you had established that you had read, or were reading, the manual
22:21:24Paul_The_NerdSo I knew you were fully capable of at least accessing the information, if not already possessing the knowledge.
22:21:29pekujait's a long manual
22:21:39Paul_The_NerdIt's also _the_ manual, so users should read it.
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22:54:00Ish_nittihow do i boot into the original apple firmware?
22:54:16sharpehold menu before the bootloader loads.
22:54:21Ish_nittii tried holding menu
22:54:24Ish_nittiyeah that didnt work
22:54:26Ish_nittiill try again
22:54:29sharpekeep trying
22:54:47sharpejust turn it off, and hold menu to turn it on, and keep holding it.
22:54:56Ish_nittiahh ok
22:54:58Ish_nittilet me try that
22:55:23sharpebe sure you do not move your finger either.
22:56:13Ish_nittithere we go
22:56:53Ish_nittineeded to get to my video podcasts :)
22:56:55Ish_nittidamn i love rockbox
22:57:07sharpeand rockbox loves you back
22:57:11Ish_nittitotally customizable
22:57:13Ish_nittiits insane
23:00
23:01:23BHSPitMonkey_when rockbox plays the mp4s, I can switch completely :P
23:01:33Ish_nittiaka video?
23:01:44BHSPitMonkey_mmhmm
23:01:54Ish_nittii dont mind switching firmware to watch my video
23:02:15Ish_nittimost of them are long, so im already sitting down for a long period of time. taking 5 mins to reboot is nothing.
23:02:34Ish_nittii just like the robust options for my music that rockbox brings to the table
23:03:06 Quit [TCK] (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:03:20 Quit slarti (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:04:32 Join slarti [0] (i=slarti@gentoo/developer/slarti)
23:05:01 Quit akaidiota (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:05:44 Join Rondom_ [0] (n=Rondom@mrbg-d9b953f1.pool.mediaWays.net)
23:06:06 Quit Rondom (Nick collision from services.)
23:06:10 Nick Rondom_ is now known as Rondom (n=Rondom@mrbg-d9b953f1.pool.mediaWays.net)
23:06:20Ish_nittii have a question
23:06:38Ish_nittihow did the theme designers get screenshots of their theme in progress?
23:06:47Ish_nittiplugin?
23:07:10sharpethere is a build in screendump functionality
23:07:13linuxstb_http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/ScreenDump
23:07:25Ish_nittiwow
23:07:30 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-66-68-93-2.austin.res.rr.com)
23:07:33Ish_nittiwb paul
23:07:52Paul_The_NerdThankee. Just had to get stuff done without worrying as to whether someone might ask me a question while I'm gone. :)
23:08:11sharpethat's why i'm here, to fill in :D
23:08:28Ish_nittisharpe knows whats up
23:08:32Paul_The_NerdHehehe
23:08:42Ish_nittii was just saying how great rockbox was
23:08:46 Quit redondos (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:08:56Ish_nittiand how i didnt mind switching over to the original os to watch my vids
23:09:03sharpewell, i am in the 'Rockbox Expert' position on the forums. :D
23:09:13Ish_nittiahh yes, there are forums as well
23:09:16Paul_The_NerdYeah, well one day Rockbox will certainly have video. It's just, y'know, not likely soon. :)
23:09:23Ish_nittiYeah
23:09:25Paul_The_NerdOh yes indeed, there are very definitely forums.
23:09:50sharpepaul, you've never told of the person you have the inexplicable urge to ban.
23:09:55Ish_nittiHave you or the original coders of rockbox recieved anything from apple reguarding your os?
23:10:10Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: As I said, it's a secret.
23:10:17sharpe:)
23:10:25BagderIsh_nitti: we received exactly this much: −−-><−−-
23:10:36*Ish_nitti is back after 54m: lunchtimebitches
23:10:37sharpeactually a bit less than that, didn't we?
23:10:39Ish_nittigrr script
23:10:43Ish_nittisorry for the spam
23:11:07*Bagder curses ups
23:11:39Ish_nittii would put money on apple using some of your stuff on a "newer re-vamped" ipod interface
23:11:46Paul_The_NerdBagder: Missed you again?
23:11:47Ish_nittisame thing M$ did with xbox
23:12:04BagderPaul_The_Nerd: I haven't heard from nor seen them during the whole day
23:12:07Ish_nittipeople modded their xbox to do a lot of stuff that is now standard in the xbox 360
23:12:14Paul_The_NerdBagder: That is terrible.
23:12:24Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: Apple has filed a patent for a feature remarkably similar to the VoiceUI
23:12:41Paul_The_NerdNot identical, but similar
23:12:42Ish_nittiInteresting
23:12:44BagderI guess I target tuesday now, as then I'll be home for a few hours during the morning
23:13:05*Bagder sighs
23:13:07 Join redondos [0] (n=redondos@190.48.27.53)
23:13:23*Paul_The_Nerd is dying of curiosity
23:13:30sharpeyay cirtus fruits
23:13:39redondosHello. After installing Rockbox on an iPod Nano and booting it, I don't see any music. Is there something else I need to do?
23:14:02Paul_The_Nerdredondos: If the music was copied over by iTunes, iTunes hid it. See the TagCache wiki page.
23:14:02sharpeeither copy the music to your ipod in a folder-like structure, or use tagcache
23:14:47redondosI would like to share the music between the Apple OS, iPodLinux and Rockbox. I'll see if tagcache lets me do that. Thank you.
23:15:08Ish_nittiI would put the music in the root folder.
23:15:19Paul_The_NerdEveryone *always* wants to use their music in the Apple OS.
23:15:27Ish_nittiI dont have exp with iPodLinux, but im sure it can view files in root just like Rockbox
23:15:28sharpeit's like iTunes is the bully kid on the playground
23:15:30redondosIsh_nitti: But the Apple OS and ipodlinux won't be able to read it, or will they?
23:15:35sharpehe hides other kids things...
23:15:40Ish_nittihahaha
23:15:43Paul_The_NerdWhy would you want to play your music in iPodLinux?
23:16:01redondosPaul_The_Nerd: All right, nevermind about ipl. Let's say I only want it on apple and rockbox.
23:16:07Paul_The_NerdTagCache is fine for that
23:16:11redondosCool.
23:16:11sharpeTagcache is your best bet
23:16:13redondosThank you.
23:16:17redondosIs it a rockbox addon?
23:16:19 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:16:21Ish_nittiI dont like tagcache
23:16:22Paul_The_NerdIt's built in
23:16:28Paul_The_NerdRead the wiki page called TagCache at rockbox.org
23:16:33Ish_nittiim going to pull my mp3's to their own folders when i get home
23:16:35sharpei don't use tagcache
23:16:43sharpebut that's just me
23:16:46Ish_nittiyeah
23:16:49Paul_The_NerdI don't mind tagcache, but only because I use it differently
23:16:55 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=5343d4aa@labb.contactor.se)
23:16:55Ish_nittiim using it for now becuase im at work, and my mp3's are at home.
23:17:01Paul_The_NerdFor example, song title includes the word "Zelda" or some such.
23:17:21Paul_The_NerdThen when I sync over ocremix tunes, or add to them, I can always have a dynamic "All songs from Zelda Games" remix
23:17:43Paul_The_NerdIt's more of a set of self-generating-playlists than a Media Database for me. :)
23:17:52sharpepaul, you have a zelda game songs remix?
23:17:53Ish_nittinice
23:18:11redondosIsh_nitti: Can that be done? With what player device?
23:18:20Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: I have the first 1250 OCRemixes, if I recall.
23:18:30sharpeno clue what that is, but okay!
23:18:31Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: Which include many Zelda songs
23:18:43Paul_The_NerdOCRemixes.org is a bunch of mp3s of remixes of videogame songs.
23:18:47sharpeah.
23:18:55Paul_The_NerdMany of which are actually good
23:19:00Paul_The_NerdSome of which are terrifying instead.
23:19:09Paul_The_NerdLike the "Hillbilly" genre remix of the Bubble Bobble theme.
23:19:10redondosIs an item called 'Music' supposed to appear on the main rockbox screen after enabling tagcache and letting it scan my files?
23:19:20Paul_The_Nerdredondos: Read the whole page.
23:19:29redondosReboot, ok.
23:19:34redondosThanks.
23:19:38sharpelol
23:20:03redondosIs there a way to reboot *from rockbox* without hitting the key combination that produces a reboot on my device?
23:20:11sharpehold play
23:20:11Paul_The_NerdHold Play/Pause to shut down
23:20:12amiconnBagder: UPS (and other parcel services) are annoying here too. They only deliver Monday thru Friday, and during the day - where most people aren't at home.
23:20:17 Join Cillian [0] (n=cillian@host86-132-143-169.range86-132.btcentralplus.com)
23:20:20sharpethen press menu or select to boot
23:20:23redondosty
23:20:23Cillianwhere do I install teh patchset for midi?
23:20:36Paul_The_NerdCillian: Extract it preserving folders into .rockbox
23:20:39Cillianok
23:20:43redondos"Commiting tagcache" -> yay
23:20:48Paul_The_NerdIt creates a folder named patchset (or patches) if I recall... in /.rockbox/
23:20:53Cillianpatchset
23:21:05Paul_The_NerdIt really only works halfway decent on the iRivers.
23:21:19redondosI still don't see where to browse my music from.
23:21:29Paul_The_Nerdamiconn: One of the parcel services here doesn't even deliver to my door. They drop it off at the apartment complex's office, and don't notify me, so I have to watch the tracking number.
23:21:31Ish_nittiadd a playlist
23:21:32Ish_nittithats what i did
23:21:43Ish_nittiit will create root.m3u
23:21:47Paul_The_Nerdredondos: It also tells you how to change the file view to ID3 database there.
23:21:48Cillianmidi seems to be working, but it's REALLY fast
23:21:55Paul_The_Nerdredondos: You need to read the whole page, as I said
23:21:56Cillianand lots of "Buffer miss"
23:22:01redondosPaul_The_Nerd: Sawrry :/
23:22:02Paul_The_NerdCillian: Ipod of some sort?
23:22:10Cillianyep, video
23:22:20amiconnPaul_The_Nerd: ugh...
23:22:25redondosSort of works :D
23:22:28Paul_The_NerdYeah, resampling issue for the double speed thing, slow processor for the buffer misses, if I understand.
23:22:38CillianOk, 2 secs
23:23:00Cillian"FINISHED PLAYING" and it seems to have locked up
23:23:09Paul_The_NerdWell that's lovely.
23:23:52Cillian:)
23:24:09CillianJust upped the cpu frequency
23:24:13Cillianlets see what that does
23:24:24Paul_The_NerdThe midi player should boost on its own
23:24:25CillianStill double speed and messed up buffer
23:24:40CillianOk, forget midi
23:24:41Cillian:)
23:24:43Paul_The_NerdThere should never be any cause to manually boost.
23:24:53amiconnThe only useful alternative here is DHL, which (1) also deliver Saturday and (2) if they cannot deliver, drop a note put the parcel at the nearest post office where you can pick it up.
23:25:05amiconn(during opening hours, of course, which also include Saturday)
23:25:12Paul_The_NerdMIDI seems to suffer from drive-by-itis, where someone fixes some aspect of it to suit their needs, then lets it sit until someone else drive-by-fixes something
23:25:22*linuxstb_ works from home so has no delivery problems...
23:25:29CillianThe buffers aren't too bad, anything I can do about the double speed?
23:25:41linuxstb_Fix the audio driver.
23:25:48Cillian...
23:25:51amiconnFor companies, UPS & friends are ok...
23:25:56Bagderit is slightly annoying that the shipment from US to Sweden took no time, and now it'll take many days just to get them to give the package to me
23:26:30linuxstb_Cillian: IIUC, the problem is that the midi player plays back at 22.050KHz, but the ipod audio driver only supports 44.1KHz at the moment.
23:26:49CillianOokay
23:28:40 Join TCK [0] (i=TCK@81-178-117-240.dsl.pipex.com)
23:29:10Cillianwouldn't it be easier to port the midi program to 44.1?
23:29:43hardeepBagder: Do they offer you an option to pick it up yourself? That's what I do when my times don't match UPS's.
23:29:44linuxstb_The audio driver needs completing anyway.
23:30:09redondosDo themes for other devices work on an iPod nano?
23:30:17Bagderhardeep: I think they do, but I have yet to call them and get the details
23:30:19Paul_The_Nerdredondos: Nope, nothing else has the same size screen.
23:30:36sharpeups delivered my package to the wrong house the last time...
23:30:39redondosPaul_The_Nerd: All right, thanks.
23:30:40Ish_nittiyou could create your own nano theme
23:31:00Paul_The_NerdIsh_nitti: That's what I did! :)
23:31:03redondosWhen I'm viewing the ?now playing? screen, what's the fastest way of looking at the current playlist?
23:31:05Ish_nitti:)
23:31:25Paul_The_Nerdredondos: Hold Select (not just tap), then choose that option from the list, if I recall
23:31:53redondosgreat
23:31:57Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: I almost always get my UPS packages 1 day early. With the exception of one that got delayed because of a hurricane.
23:32:04sharpeheh
23:32:08Paul_The_NerdIt was merely on time.
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23:32:39sharpeyes, mine was delivered to the house in front of mine, when house numbers are clearly visible
23:33:11dunnoany dev, what does brandom mean in the comments of this patch, http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/2890 , and what do i need to do to install it please
23:34:51linuxstb_dunno: You mean " WARNING: THIS PATCH CHANGES CONFIG_BLOCK_VERSION" ?
23:35:21dprodunno: it means patches will be sorted numerically ? and you should backup your config before using a firmware with this patch ?
23:35:28Paul_The_Nerdlinuxstb_: The comment about it not updating settings I guess?
23:35:33dunnono this comment Shoot, I forgot to increase the used bits counter in the
23:35:55 Join Poka64 [0] (i=peter@hd5e241c0.gavlegardarna.gavle.to)
23:36:37dunnothe comments down in the comments box :-)
23:37:32dunnoShoot, I forgot to increase the used bits counter in the settings.c file. If this gets applied, do that too.
23:37:54dunnobrandons comments in the comments box for that patch
23:38:30linuxstb_I think he's just referring to the "current sum of bits" comment in the code. So as Brandon said, it's only important if the patch is committed to CVS. You can ignore it.
23:38:44dunnothank you
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23:45:57dunnowith vmware, can i apply moroe than 1 patch before compiling, or do I have to do one patch and repeat the process
23:46:12Paul_The_NerdYou can always apply as many patches as you want before compiling.
23:46:21dunnothanks
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23:46:25Bagderas long as they don't conflict with each other
23:46:27Paul_The_NerdAs long as one patch doesn't break another one.
23:47:41amiconngrrr
23:47:56*amiconn cannot find petur's preliminary isp1362 driver patch
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23:48:08dunnohmm, its impossible to know if there's going to be a conflict, so I guess its a case of fingers crossed ?
23:48:21Bagderdunno: patch −−dry-run
23:48:34dunnok
23:49:03redondosWhere can I get xobox from?
23:49:36redondosThe page on the wiki doesn't say -> http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginXobox
23:50:23Bagdergoogle says here: http://plugbox.rockbox-lounge.com/xobox.htm
23:50:58Paul_The_NerdI think that plugins shouldn't be included in the plugin index if they're not in CVS
23:51:07Paul_The_NerdMaybe a.. like... UnnoficialPluginIndex...
23:51:08redondosI see, ok, thanks.
23:51:10BagderI agree
23:51:13redondosYeah, that would be good.
23:51:17Paul_The_NerdUnofficial even
23:51:21 Join Silent_Lu [0] (n=kvirc@S01060014bf1d200d.wp.shawcable.net)
23:51:30Bagderor at least a big note on the page saying its not included
23:51:59Paul_The_NerdIn BIG red letters
23:52:03Paul_The_NerdAnd a link to where it's available.
23:52:16*redondos would like it.
23:52:42 Quit MarcoPolo (Remote closed the connection)
23:53:38dunnothe −−p0- <= is that a zero or a "O"
23:53:46Paul_The_NerdZero
23:55:56dunnoits mind boggling, its taken me 12 hours to get to the −−p0- cmd in vmware, after that cygwin abort, and still no patches, luckily I'm on leave
23:56:55amiconnxobox is in cvs...
23:56:57linuxstb_redondos: Xobox is in CVS...
23:57:06linuxstb_damn, too slow again.
23:57:16amiconnIs there an echo in here? ;)
23:58:54 Quit Paul_The_Nerd ("Leaving.")
23:58:57sharpeonly if the echo addresses said person...

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