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#rockbox log for 2007-04-26

00:01:39 Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@24.244.160.233)
00:07:46 Quit Guile (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:08:27 Join Guile [0] (n=Guile@84.4.29.75)
00:08:59IRCGuest98I was having a look at the samsung dualcore 32-bit processor for the mobiles..
00:09:46Rob24what are some must have games for rock box ipod? i allready have doom so im not sure what else there is i should get
00:13:01 Quit elinenbe_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:13:20 Quit Redbreva ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]")
00:14:55 Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]")
00:14:55 Quit ender` (" Programming is like sex becuse: 1. One mistake and you have to support it for the rest of your life.")
00:16:24 Quit Rob24 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:16:35 Quit mutantpineapple (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:16:35 Quit mutantpi1eapple (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:21:39amiconnremote_main_backdrop sounds like a contradiction ;)
00:21:59Nico_P:)
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00:28:09 Quit ompaul ("keep on rocking^wircing")
00:35:26 Join Hammer89 [0] (n=soc_inte@host-24-149-166-187.patmedia.net)
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00:42:29 Join Hammer89 [0] (n=soc_inte@host-24-149-166-187.patmedia.net)
00:42:38Topyi just made an X5 build with enabled AGC - the histogram works perfectly, i'll do some tests with the AGC now
00:45:29 Join rotator [0] (n=e@rockbox/developer/rotator)
00:45:36 Quit Guile (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:48:05Topyworks.
00:48:11Topychoppy, yes, but works.
00:48:38Topyits not great, but its definately worth leaving enabled or at least it should be an option in the configuration tool
00:50:45IRCGuest98A Lot of similarities between the Samsung S3C2413 and Telechip TCC78x
00:50:50 Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
00:51:01Topyit acts strangely though, probably because its set up to work with a hx00 (more gain steps)
00:51:21Topyand it should be deactivated if source is set to mic
00:51:30Topy(only 2 gain settings)
00:53:32element_GHi everyone, At the moment I'm taking my first try at coding the bootloader for the gigabeat. I'm interested in getting the screen rotation patch to work, and I know this involves making a new bootloader. I know the idea is to have the bootloader load rockbox.gigabeat if no buttons are pressed on boot, and load rockbox_1.gigabeat if up is held during boot. I know the iPod has a mechanism that is something like this for the original
00:53:32element_Gt is a bootloader that loads the rotated firmware. http://paste.uni.cc/14821
00:54:31 Quit PaulJam (".")
00:56:20Topyjust tested AGC a little more
00:56:21Topyin fact
00:56:25Topyit works really quite well
00:56:49Topythe choppyness is not that much of a problem
01:00
01:00:01 Part Hammer89
01:02:06Topythe default "AGC max. gain" value was a non working far-out setting, pressing left once got me into reasonable range
01:02:24bawltdabastill no rockbox for iPod 80gb? :(
01:02:33Soapnot yet
01:02:41bawltdabai thought the controller issues were fixed?
01:03:12 Nick bawltdaba is now known as Bawitdaba (n=Sphinx@cpe-24-25-130-25.nycap.res.rr.com)
01:07:14 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
01:07:35 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
01:08:04 Join Soul-Slayer [0] (n=Jonno@89.240.238.253)
01:09:23Topywww.t44.org/x5agc.jpg
01:13:50pixelmawow... and I thought the peakmeters in the official build were big... but congrats. :)
01:14:10Soul-SlayerHey, currently on the H10, whilst on the WPS, the 'next' button does nothing... Would it be possible/easy to map it to view the current playlist? I usually navigate through my database to choose the songs, then it constructs the playlist, and if I press the back button to go on to the next song (by the same artist), it reconstructs the playlist, which takes longer to change track... Currently if I want to use the same playlist, I'd have to hold the 'ne
01:14:21Soul-SlayerWooooow I didn't realise how much I just wrote, sorry :$
01:14:56pearldiverelement_G i hope you'll get somewhere with that
01:15:20Topypixelma, i set them to 4x, i like big peakmeters :) besides, the space isnt used for anything else
01:15:37Topy(imho the peakmeters should be the first thing to see on the WRS, from any distance)
01:16:34***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:16:52Topyi will do some intense testing of the AGC on X5 tomorrow, but until now, i really cant see why it was deactivated
01:17:09Topysure, its not as elegant as on H100/H300, but its far from useless
01:17:26element_Gpearldiver i hope so too, I'm just stumped as to where to go from here
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01:36:33Topyok, plans for when i get the time to work myself into the rockbox code (and svn/linux/embedded coding while we're at it... *sigh*):
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01:58:22 Part element_G ("Kopete 0.12.4 : http://kopete.kde.org")
01:58:53 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
02:00
02:02:06IRCGuest98alright
02:02:11IRCGuest98bye guys...catch you tomorrow
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02:02:55 Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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02:16:31perldiverJdGordon here?
02:16:41JdGordonyeah
02:17:17perldiverthis small thing really bothers me hehe, viewer icons don't work in the tango set and i have no idea why
02:17:30perldiverall the config files seem to be in order
02:17:41JdGordonperldiver: does the .icons file have 'm' instead of '*' ?
02:17:45perldiveryeah
02:17:50perldiveri mean
02:17:51JdGordonso fix it :)
02:17:54perldiverit has "*"
02:18:06perldiverauthor removed "m" a while ago
02:19:01JdGordonhmm... im heading to uni now... ill have a look ina few hours when i get bacl
02:20:14perldiverit just displays icon number 16 from the main set
02:20:27perldiverwhich is happen to be a "bulb" and used for the System menu
02:24:45SoapI was curious about that myself, but hadn't digged in too far, as this was my first day with the fancy icons.
02:26:06Lloreanperldiver: There was a bug like that a while ago.
02:26:18perldiveraha
02:26:22LloreanIt used the "system menu" icon for all the build in filetypes.
02:26:28Lloreanbuilt in, rather
02:26:35perldiverhow come the other set works?
02:26:55LloreanWhich set isn't working?
02:27:11Soaptango
02:27:39LloreanAnd what's not working?
02:27:52perldiveri just explained :P
02:28:05Lloreanperldiver: I don't know what "it" means
02:28:22LloreanIs it all viewers, specific viewers, or what?
02:28:30LloreanAre MP3s given the proper icon, or no, etc?
02:29:08perldiverall the icons from the tango_viewers.20x16x16 don't work
02:29:15perldivericons from the main set work OK
02:29:33pixelmamaybe the viewer icon set has the wrong dimensions? (just throwing an idea out as I didn't look into that topic much so far)
02:30:12LloreanGimme a minute to play with it
02:30:28perldiverpixelma it was working properly before a few days ago
02:31:39Lloreanperldiver: It works for me
02:31:43Lloreanperldiver: Oh, wait, one sec
02:31:56*Llorean forgot to update the build from earlier
02:32:08LloreanWell, specifically, forgot to restart the player with the updated build
02:34:18 Quit Soul-Slayer (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
02:34:35pixelmaperldiver: where could I fand that icon set?
02:34:41pixelma*find
02:35:05perldiverhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IconSets
02:35:18perldiver1st one there
02:35:53perldiverEliSherer set works OK though and it has "m" instead of "*" btw
02:35:58 Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection)
02:36:35Lloreanperldiver: m vs * only matters for the non-viewer icons
02:37:42perldiverah
02:38:05Llorean* tells it to use them from the main file rather than the viewers file
02:41:31perldiverany luck?
02:42:05LloreanTesting some things
02:45:06LloreanThat's very strange.
02:45:23LloreanI have no clue, and my other iconset works fine
02:45:28LloreanThough it's much smaller
02:46:30LloreanClearly the .icons file is being parsed, but at the same time it seems to ignore it, or fail after.
02:48:29perldiveryep
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02:52:36 Join zorton [0] (i=zorton@unaffiliated/zorton)
02:53:19 Join capo [0] (n=itguy@c-24-13-108-5.hsd1.il.comcast.net)
02:53:51zortonis there a way to tell if i'm using the dual proc on my ipod nano?
02:54:00 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
02:54:48Lloreanzorton: Are you using an official build?
02:54:57zortonyep
02:55:05LloreanThen you're only using it for videos right now.
02:55:06zorton.cfg file created by rockbox r13005-070402
02:55:15zortonhaven't tried videos yet
02:55:20LloreanIt has some problems that make it unsafe (crashes) for normal use.
02:55:30zortonis there an advantage in terms of battery power to firing up the other processor?
02:55:32LloreanThat's a bit of an old build.
02:55:45LloreanIt's hard to tell until we can actually test it.
02:56:24zortoni'm looking at ipod from an ssh connection so i'm uncertain which build it is
02:56:35zortonis there a way to tell by looking at the files in ~/.rockbox?
02:57:34LloreanYou told me the .cfg file said that version.
02:57:39*zorton nods
02:57:51LloreanThat's the version from 23 days ago or so
02:58:02zortoni'm assuming it's created once and updated only when you change settings
02:58:10zortonI maynot have changed any settings since then :)
02:58:18zortonI guess I could just download the latest and be done with it
02:58:20LloreanIt's updated on shutdown.
02:58:39zortonok, then it's time to update
02:58:47zortonis there progress on the recording stuff on the nano?
02:59:10zortoni've recorded a bunch of clips but having no gain control means I have to push in more than I would like to
02:59:15LloreanNobody's really working on iPod recording right now
02:59:35zortonshame that
03:00
03:00:05zortonit's a very useful feature for me at anyrate
03:00:11LloreanWell, feel free to work on it
03:00:14Llorean:-P
03:00:17zortoni'm tempted :)
03:00:33zortonwhere has most of the work been lately
03:00:34zorton?
03:03:35LloreanIn all kinds of places.
03:03:39LloreanJust wherever people are interested
03:03:49zortoncool
03:04:06zortonI was really impressed when the recording stuff worked on the nano
03:04:22zortonquite a few nay sayers in the ipod linux forumn said it could never be done
03:05:45 Quit capo ()
03:06:21 Quit entheh ("^~")
03:13:08 Part zorton
03:16:37***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:29:50 Join JdG|uni [0] (i=82c20d69@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b6f1e3baa2b0a472)
03:30:05JdG|uniperldriver: around?
03:30:18JdG|unior aliask?
03:30:45perldiveryeah
03:31:04JdG|unido any of the tango icons work?
03:31:15perldiveryes, the main set
03:31:28perldiver[20:46] <Llorean> Clearly the .icons file is being parsed, but at the same time it seems to ignore it, or fail after.
03:31:50JdG|uniok, i dont know if this will fix it or not.. but the .cfg is wrong... the full path should be there
03:32:05 Join illriginal [0] (n=illrigin@c-66-229-128-235.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)
03:32:06JdG|univiewers iconset: tango_viewers.20x16x16.bmp
03:32:19JdG|unishould be /.rockbox/icons/....
03:32:34 Join Mr716 [0] (n=Mr716@ool-18ba2c7b.dyn.optonline.net)
03:33:02perldiverah
03:33:06perldiverlet me try
03:35:46LloreanJdG|uni: Tried the .cfg with the full path
03:35:55LloreanJdG|uni: Didn't mention it in here though, simply because it didn't fix it for me.
03:36:00perldiverah
03:36:03JdG|unibugger
03:36:11Lloreanperldiver: You should try it though
03:36:14LloreanJust in case I did something stupid
03:36:37perldiversame here
03:36:41perldiverdoesn't solve it
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03:38:17 Quit perldiver ("some games are better left unplayed")
03:39:10 Join MadCow [0] (n=chatzill@bas15-toronto12-1168013999.dsl.bell.ca)
03:39:46MadCowSoap you there?
03:39:58JdG|uniLlorean: can you try it in the sim and see if the line saying the .icons file was opened please?
03:42:21 Quit MadCow (Client Quit)
03:42:35JdG|uniLlorean: dont worry.. time to work, ill be home in 3 hours or so...
03:42:53 Quit JdG|uni ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
03:43:01 Join pearldiver [0] (n=say@cpe-72-225-231-80.nyc.res.rr.com)
03:46:18aliaskDamn, Just missed him
03:47:50Soapyoyoyo mad
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03:47:58Soapdidn't wait long
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03:53:13pearldiverwhat happened?
03:53:47aliaskWhat happened when?
03:57:25pearldiverwe were discussing tango set
03:58:01pearldiveri left for a few minutes
03:59:19pixelmapearldiver: you could read back in the logs ;)
03:59:47LloreanSoap: Princess Bride references? Think many people will get them?
04:00
04:00:05SoapI was going to ask scorche, I'll ask you.
04:00:14SoapIs that baiting? Should I drop that post?
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04:00:41MadCowSoap can you help me out with my Colinux problem?
04:00:46Soapthere you are.
04:01:24MadCowyep
04:01:29 Part pixelma
04:01:30SoapPM?
04:01:50LloreanSoap: I think I'll leave it, just because I enjoy it.
04:02:13MadCowwhat PM?
04:03:31 Join Topy [0] (n=Topy44@xdsl-81-173-182-198.netcologne.de)
04:04:04MadCowOK wait a sec i have to register my nick
04:04:23 Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:04:48Soapor we can join a #junkchannel
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04:08:02 Quit aliask ("uni-o'clock")
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04:51:50 Join Rob24 [0] (i=1839489d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-742bee57d6e6f25c)
04:52:40Rob24Know what would be a really sweet game for rock box? Dance Dance Revolution, like you dont have to worrie about having enough buttons all you need is like 4/5
04:53:05Soapjust have to worry about breaking buttons.
04:53:13Soap;)
04:53:27Rob24well if you dont need to PRESS the buttons
04:54:05Rob24it would be like it is in with the rom just touch the buttons and dont need to press then you wont breack anything (speaching about ipod)
04:55:20LloreanI believe Stepmania is GPL licensed. Feel free to start working on a port, though I expect it to not be very easy
04:55:52Rob24well, im a big fat newb that cant program so dont look at me
04:56:33LloreanWell it's in C++, so a _lot_ of work would probably need to be done
04:56:51Rob24and it would take some one that know how to prgrame to do it
04:57:03Soaptouch-sensitive buttons only exist on the ipods and gigabeats IIRC.
04:57:12LloreanSoap: And the H10
04:57:17LloreanThat silly strip
04:57:22Soapright
04:57:26Soaplike I said - ipods.
04:57:30LloreanHahaha
04:57:32Soap;)
04:58:26Rob24ipods for the win
04:58:51chrisjs169is it safe to have the battery charge (sansa) via Rockbox or should i just load the OF?
04:59:59Lloreanchrisjs169: It should be safe.
05:00
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05:00:22chrisjs169Llorean: ok, thanks
05:01:02SoapLlorean: FS 7033...The WPS line-height patch.
05:02:15 Quit Rob24 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
05:02:27LloreanSoap: What about it?
05:02:42SoapHow is the font (verticaly) oriented in the line? always centered?
05:02:58LloreanRight now, always centered.
05:03:07LloreanIt was originally justified to the top of the line
05:03:20LloreanAnd I believe the author said it'd be quite easy to justify to the bottom
05:04:08LloreanBut of course, it has that scrolling issue
05:04:11Soapjust curious.
05:04:22SoapI wasn't planning on using it, just thinking of how it /could/ be used.
05:04:40LloreanAnd if it's too complicated to be done elegantly (which it seems like it might be now), might as well stick with the viewports solution
05:04:55LloreanIt didn't really do anything viewports couldn't do, it just had the potential to not require viewports for some basic functions
05:06:37Soapa viewport per line of text multiplied times the number of viewports with text in them sounds like it could get large fast.
05:06:52LloreanYeah, in terms of buffer use at least.
05:10:53 Join NineTeen67Comet [0] (n=justin@114M20.oasis.mediatti.net)
05:11:49NineTeen67CometHi all .. I beleive my wife's Ipod is a Gen4 grey scale but I'm not sure .. is there a sure fire way to tell? It looks like the pic .. on http://www.rockbox.org/manual.shtml this page ..
05:12:14 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-145-105.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)
05:12:35Soapnote the buttons below the screen on the third generation ipods.
05:12:55NineTeen67CometNo buttons .. just the wheel and a screen ..
05:12:56Soapthe first and second generation ipods had four curved buttons surrounding the wheel.
05:13:01NineTeen67Comet20gig ..
05:13:16NineTeen67Cometnkay . it's a gotta be a 4th gen ..
05:13:42Soapthen it be a 4th, as it is the only greyscale - full size - ipod with buttons integrated into the wheel.
05:14:01NineTeen67Cometsecondly .. I have been looking for the Linux instructions .. in the firmware section the manual says to double click the .exe file, but that's not a good deal in *nix ..
05:14:57LloreanThe linux section of the manual shouldn't tell you to do that...
05:15:14NineTeen67CometOkay .. I'll look a little more .. I saw that, then the Mac OS part ..
05:15:47NineTeen67CometDoesn't look like there is a section for firmware in Linux just bootloader install ..
05:16:13*NineTeen67Comet kicks himself in the shin .. sorry .. see it I think ..
05:16:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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06:00
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06:18:21pearldiverso, any updates on the tango icon set problem?
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06:32:41snookumsHi all .. I just tossed rockbox on the wifes gen 4 greyscale ipod and it seems to be pretty good stuff. She would however like to toss all her music and start over. We use Rythembox (linux) or simply use the file browser to move all the files/directories out of iPod_Control-Music? then update database again?
06:34:20EbErTi wouldn't pick them outta ipodcontrol, they're all labeled funny
06:35:01EbErTif you aren't going to use itunes, just dump them in again, its easy to update the database
06:35:07snookumsWell I was going to just move them all over to the computer so she could load them all back up via rythembox .. they are all names F## ..
06:35:49snookumsthe database will find them no matter what directory I put them correct? I was going to make a Music directory and drop all her music in there for the database to find .. /root/Music type ..
06:36:04*snookums on the ipod
06:36:55Soapcorrect on the database question.
06:37:12Soapwhich is why you don't have to move them if you want to use the database.
06:37:13EbErTyeah, it will. but you dont have the music on her computer?
06:37:19snookumsThe way iTunes did it she didn't like, so she'd just assume toss all iTunes junk and do it her self with the file browser and or/rythembox ..
06:37:44EbErTi use itunes and rockbox, so i do what you're talking about
06:37:45snookumsShe's got them all on here too .. but she didn't know what she didn't have on her ipod so she wanted to start over ..
06:37:54SoapIf the files on the ipod are non-replaceable, you can simply rename them based upon tags, all the ID3 tags are intact. They are mearly renamed and placed into folders based upon their Track Number.
06:38:29snookumsokay . thanks guys .. she's set then .. I'll move all the songs off her ipod so she can start re-building it ..
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06:39:51snookumsoff to tinker .. thanks again .. just needed to know she wasn't out of luck on keeping the itunes goodies ..
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06:50:17 Quit jhulst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
07:00
07:00:25 Join Nev [0] (n=nevyn@202.180.127.118)
07:00:58NevHi - I have a very quick question - Does rockbox make it easier to transfer music to your mp3 player?
07:01:28LloreanEasier by my standards, yes
07:01:32LloreanNo stupid software to deal with
07:03:00NevSo if I were to install rockbox, - it's just a case of using it as a mass storage device under linux?
07:03:31LloreanYup
07:03:46NevLegendary. Thanks :)
07:09:16*JdGordon slaps aliask around with a large ? !
07:11:44 Quit rotator ()
07:12:32JdGordongood news everybody! I have tango icons almost fully working again
07:12:50JdGordonI honestly have no idea why its being wierd... but it seems some error checking code may be way off :p
07:13:05pearldiverahh
07:13:20pearldiverwhat happened?
07:13:30JdGordonive got it showing the mario icon for .mpg.. but its better than ?
07:13:42LloreanIt's supposed to show the mario icon
07:13:45LloreanAt least, I think it is
07:13:52pearldiverheh
07:14:00pearldiverno
07:14:10JdGordonfor .mog?
07:14:13JdGordonmpg even
07:14:13pearldiverits a film roll icon
07:14:31pearldiverauthor got it wrong
07:14:43 Quit Weiss (Remote closed the connection)
07:14:44Lloreanpearldiver: MPG is 4
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07:14:47Llorean4 is the mushroom
07:14:57JdGordonoh.. so its correct
07:15:02pearldivercheck the bmp
07:15:09LloreanYes, I did
07:15:14JdGordonhe .icons is wrong then
07:15:14LloreanThe 5th one, #4, is the mushroom
07:15:25LloreanYou start counting from 0, we're programmers, remember?
07:15:33aliaskYay for working icons. How come it was only the tango set?
07:15:35JdGordonwhy is a mushroom shown for movies?
07:15:37pearldiverfilm roll
07:15:41pearldiver:)
07:15:49JdGordonaliask: no idea... possibly because you use so few icons?
07:16:08aliaskI see
07:16:13JdGordonalthough, that doesnt make sense :p
07:16:22Lloreanpearldiver: Why do you keep insisting a film roll is supposed to show
07:16:24aliaskIn other news my xbox power supply is now outside my xbox :D
07:16:29pearldiverhe mad a mistake
07:16:40LloreanYeah, but right now, that's what the files say should display
07:16:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
07:16:50pearldiverhehe ok
07:16:54LloreanSo it'd confuse the issue to talk otherwise, for the moment. ;)
07:17:02JdGordonstill got a bug to sort out.. but then ill commit
07:18:20JdGordonbroke it aain :D
07:19:05JdGordonaliask: AH... i tihnk the problem is that icon #3 isnt used
07:19:16pearldiveroh
07:19:27aliaskWoops
07:20:39aliaskOh, I have got the .icons file wrong
07:21:05aliaskAll the video stuff should be 3, not 4...
07:21:14JdGordonim debugging with the zip from the wiki
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07:21:53aliaskJdGordon: That has the error as well
07:22:01corevettehow do i improve the speed for frozen bubbles?
07:22:15JdGordonaliask: yep, which is why the bug was found...
07:22:21aliaskcorevette: Practice :)
07:22:23JdGordoni cant see why my fixes are not working now though
07:22:37aliaskOh. Hooray for my mistake then :)
07:22:58 Quit Nev ("using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.3.12")
07:23:13corevetteor how do i improve the speed to rockboy games?
07:23:37aliaskcorevette: Basically, you can't. I'm going to take a wild guess and say you have an iPod. Maybe 5g?
07:23:51corevetteyes aliask
07:24:43aliaskOk. iPod's CPUs (the way we use them at the moment) aren't the best. Add to the fact that the 5g has a pretty big screen that has a slow driver, and you end up with slow rockboy and bubbles.
07:26:04aliaskPeople are working on the CPU issues, which will provide a bump in performance, but it's still not going to be amazing.
07:28:46EbErTya, i notied how slow the graphics were on the newest ipods- lame
07:29:07EbErTmy photo scrolls really smoothly compared to the new ones
07:29:27JdGordonfixed :)
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07:30:04alien8edwill rockbox let me play ogg vorbis on my ipod?
07:30:16EbErTuh ya
07:30:38aliaskJdGordon: Sweet
07:30:54aliaskI should probably update the .icons file shouldn't I?
07:30:55JdGordon... and in svn
07:31:01JdGordonyeah :)
07:31:07JdGordonbut that sort of mistake is safe now
07:31:54alien8edebert: thank you
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07:35:17pearldiverJdGordon thanks
07:35:20 Quit ptw419 ()
07:35:43*aliask is 90% sure the zip is fixed now
07:35:55aliaskNot used to the gnome archive manager
07:36:29JdGordonsif use gnome....
07:36:39aliaskIt's prettier than KDE
07:36:55aliaskOr at least it was at the time when I had to make the choice between the two
07:37:23JdGordongnome is prettier than kde???
07:37:49*scorche sticks to fluxbox or xfce
07:37:57aliaskYeah, the status bar thing (is||was) cluttered and stuff
07:38:18*JdGordon prefers xfce4
07:39:16JdGordonLlorean: have you seen 7078?
07:39:45JdGordoncool :) bugfix got a negative delta
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07:46:13amiconnJdGordon's fix reminds me of sth .... :\
07:46:44JdGordona good something or bad something?
07:47:04amiconnSomething that needs work....
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07:51:18JdGordonamiconn: is the bootbot code all in /firmware, and not /bootloader?
07:51:23JdGordonbootbox*
07:52:21amiconnThe part which is in bootloader/ for swcodec targets is in flash/bootbox/
07:52:56JdGordonok
07:53:24amiconnbootloader/ (and flash/bootloader/) are just the "app" part; both use the firmware lib for firmware functions
07:54:33JdGordonam I wrong in thinking a possible way of getting bootbox down is just removing the unused files in /firmware? or is there a better way?
07:54:58amiconn?
07:55:08amiconnUnused code isn't linked to it
07:56:42*JdGordon gotta run
07:56:50amiconnAnd for both bootloaders and bootbox, the firmware lib is compiled with -ffunction-sections -fdata-sections, and linking uses −−gc-sections
07:57:22amiconnSo even unused individual functions aren't linked in
08:00
08:02:58n17ikh|Lappyis there any work being done on the RCA lyra series? specifically the RD2780
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08:03:21steveoello anyone around?
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08:05:31steveostrange no one online =(
08:06:50n17ikh|LappyI scared them all off
08:07:44steveowhat can i use to convert .wma to .mp3?
08:08:05n17ikh|LappyI suggest foobar2000
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08:08:11n17ikh|Lappybut then that's me.
08:09:18n17ikh|Lappythen again, I'd say never convert lossy to lossy
08:09:20n17ikh|Lappy:/
08:09:34scorchetranscoding is bad
08:09:56n17ikh|Lappyunless it's transcoding lossless to lossless
08:10:07n17ikh|Lappyin which case it's mostly an exercise in futility >_>
08:10:23amiconnWell, if I'd had the choice between converting lossy to lossy or using the of for wma, I would choose the conversion
08:10:46steveorockbox plays .wma?
08:10:50amiconn(but keep the WMAs so I could use them when rockbox learns to play them)
08:11:12scorchewell, transcoding typically means lossy to lossy unless explicitly stated....and then it is typically just called a conversion
08:11:22n17ikh|Lappydoesn't look like it does, steveo
08:11:26n17ikh|Lappyprobably licensing issues
08:11:28scorchesteveo: no
08:12:00scorchen17ikh|Lappy: someone just has not sat down and coded it....the issue is that there is no current fixed-point implementation of it
08:12:09n17ikh|Lappyah
08:12:13scorchebut, that is one of our GSoC projects
08:12:18amiconnNot yet, that's why you need to transcode
08:12:19n17ikh|LappyGSoC?
08:12:27scorchegoogle summer of code
08:12:42n17ikh|Lappyohes
08:12:46amiconn(or use the of for playing them on the targets where the of supports wma)
08:13:14scorchebut regardless, Rockbox will never support DRM laden WMAs
08:13:43n17ikh|Lappyof course not
08:14:01n17ikh|Lappydrm pretty much fails at life
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08:14:08steveolappy ok got ur foobar
08:14:40n17ikh|Lappyjust load the songs up in it, right click, and convert em to some sort of mp3.
08:14:48n17ikh|Lappythough, when I think about it you might need lame.exe
08:15:01scorchei was just going to say..
08:15:24scorchebut if you can, please move this to PMs as it really doesnt have anything to do with rockbox
08:15:30 Quit alien8ed (Connection timed out)
08:15:52n17ikh|Lappywell, that's about as far as I was willing to go with it anyway
08:16:12n17ikh|Lappyas I'm going to bed.
08:16:22steveoyeah thats all i needed to know ill play around with it and see how it goes =)
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08:16:52n17ikh|Lappyoh, speaking of progress on rockbox
08:17:01steveowas jhmikes able to make the fastfarward\rewind for movies?
08:17:17n17ikh|Lappyis there somewhere I can view whether progress is being made on USB support for the iriver h10 series?
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08:18:05n17ikh|LappyI'd like to help if I could, as I own one and could help test at least.
08:18:27 Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007040314]")
08:18:27n17ikh|Lappyactually... is there usb support in any of the ports at all yet?
08:18:55scorchen17ikh|Lappy: well, there really isnt a place other than the log of this channel, but if testing is needed, we will call for it
08:19:17n17ikh|Lappyah.
08:19:18jhMikeSsteveo: yeah, you just whip that up in a day or two :P
08:19:48scorcheall non-PP devices support USB (if i am not forgetting any) besides the gigabeat
08:19:57n17ikh|Lappywell, it's a PP device
08:20:04scorcheyes it is
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08:20:09n17ikh|Lappy:/
08:20:15scorchethat is another GSoC project
08:20:20n17ikh|Lappywhy so it is
08:20:25scorcheso expect work on it during the summer
08:20:32amiconnscorche: The gigabeat supports usb and is not PP...
08:20:52scorcheamiconn: ah....i seem to remember something about the dock not being supported
08:20:54amiconnOnly the PP targets have soft USB as a device
08:20:54steveohehe mikes ya never know ya might be superman
08:21:30n17ikh|Lappyso I assume it requires writing a usb stack or driver of some sort that runs on the hardware then
08:21:47amiconnThe only non-PP targets I know of which need some work in the USB area are the iriver H300 and the iaudio X5, but that's USBOTG
08:21:50n17ikh|Lappyrockbox already has the handling of the filesystem built in?
08:22:02n17ikh|Lappyer, how's it work, rather
08:22:39n17ikh|Lappyrockbox accessing the filesystem at the same time usb is being used
08:22:47scorchea USB stack needs to be written, yes
08:22:47steveoi thought u guys said the quality drops? i cant tell any diffrence lol
08:23:03n17ikh|Lappyor does it go into a USB mode and then come out when you unplug the usb?
08:23:09scorcheamiconn: am i imagining things about the gigabeat's dock?
08:23:17n17ikh|Lappy(just out of curiosity)
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08:23:49amiconnscorche: I don't know about the dock, all I know is that the gigabeat uses a dedicated usb<->ata bridge for MSD
08:23:57scorcheah...alright
08:23:58amiconnI have no gigabeat and no plans to get one
08:24:23n17ikh|Lappyok, so the gigabeat does it in hardware. Does it prevent the firmware from having HDD access when the usb to ata bridge is doing so?
08:24:45jhMikeSsteveo: life is often the kryptonite
08:24:51amiconnIt's a modern but somewhat boring target... optimisation isn't really needed
08:25:01amiconnI'd rather want an iriver iFP7xx...
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08:25:36scorchei would want a SWcodec device that accepts a 2.5" HD
08:25:40jhMikeSamiconn: au contraire...it just takes it to a new level and for video it is an interesting target
08:25:54*scorche is waiting for a good deal on ebay for an AV300
08:26:21amiconnYes, but then I'm not really interested in video on a mobile, except from the "it can be done" point of view
08:26:38amiconnAnd for the latter, it's more challenging if you have less resources...
08:26:45n17ikh|LappyI want a flash device with reasonable storage capacity
08:26:48 Quit qwedsa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
08:26:50n17ikh|Lappylike a 40gb flash player
08:27:11n17ikh|Lappyseeing as how far flash has dropped in price
08:27:15scorchen17ikh|Lappy: that would be nice as well, but extremely expensive
08:27:34n17ikh|Lappynot too bad
08:27:35steveoany australians around?
08:27:59n17ikh|Lappya 16gb usb flash drive is around $130 now, and that's probably a good deal more than the wholesale price of the chips
08:28:16scorchesteveo: it is typically much better to ask a question if you have one rather than asking a question such as that
08:28:32n17ikh|Lappyof course, that's $325 just for the price of the flash, at that price
08:28:45n17ikh|LappyI bet a 40gb 1.8" hard drive is rather cheaper.
08:28:56scorcheit isnt
08:29:19jhMikeSamiconn: it is one mobile that really makes it watchable not to mention the general capability if you like things like the various game and game sound emulators.
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08:30:01*jhMikeS rather likes a nice SPC now and then with all the fancy filtering
08:30:29steveowell i was wondering how much a gigabeat f40 costs at the shops in australia atm
08:30:43*scorche wonders why B4gder doesnt just type that name in the CGI:IRC login screen
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08:31:29 Part element_G ("Kopete 0.12.4 : http://kopete.kde.org")
08:32:26amiconnjhMikeS: My only real uses of rockbox are for listening to music and some simple games like jewels and solitaire every now and then
08:32:58amiconnThe only non-streaming music format I really want to see supported are (amiga) mods
08:33:43amiconnAnd 4-channel mods should be possible even on a 11MHz CPU. The original amiga CPU had only 7MHz...
08:33:58B4gder... but didn't use the CPU for the sounds
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08:34:28amiconnNo, as long as no mixing was required
08:34:36steveoi just use mine for movies\music\pics\(well games are on there but havnt played em yet hehe)
08:34:38amiconn8-channel mods did use the cpu though
08:35:20 Part kaaloo
08:36:45B4gderbut they could hardly mix 8 => 4 with a very good sample/bitrate on a 7mhz m68k, did they?
08:37:20crwli recall playing up to about 10-12 channel mods (with software mixing) on a 20 MHz 80386DX
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08:38:39jhMikeSamiconn: well, I hope the mpegplayer buffering will be readily moveable to the core since it will be much simpler and it's giving me more ideas about handling everything under the sun in a reasonable way
08:45:41 Quit elinenbe (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
08:49:30amiconnB4gder: I don't know the exact sample rate used by formats like OctaMED or Oktalyzer, but even S3Ms (with not too many channels) could be played on plain 68000 afair
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08:49:50amiconnAnd the 68000 had no mac unit unlike the SH...
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08:53:22steveowhen going through the files on my gigabeat f40 with rock box it somtimes freezes for like 4sec then jumps ahead (happens fairly often and its a bit annoying) anyway to stop it?
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08:54:06steveooh and how to change text colour?
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09:00
09:00:37 Quit Siku ("reboot")
09:00:40linuxstbsteveo: Your first problem just sounds like the wait for the disk to spin up. If you want to avoid that, you can enable the directory cache (I think it's something like Settings -> General Settings -> System -> Disk)
09:00:57linuxstbText colour can be changed under display settings.
09:04:11steveowhere under display? i c "browse fonts" "brows .wps files" "lcd settings" "show icons" "scrolling" "status-scrollbar" "peak meter" "defualt codepage"
09:04:28linuxstbI'm sure you can find it...
09:05:43steveolol ive searched every folder hehe couldnt see it there thats y i asked
09:06:11linuxstbIt's "Foreground Colour" in LCD Settings.
09:07:48steveono wonder lol
09:07:50steveoty
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09:16:45***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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09:36:19cropOn http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IconSets, i see that some one icon set has one column and the other has four. How should it be? Or does it work both ways?
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09:38:52NineTeen67CometEeek .. Restarted my iPod to try and refresh the database and .. I got a battery with a caution looking sign on it, then it went blank .. and that's that .. No USB, no boot, no nothing now .. just a grey screen on the old G4 .. help?
09:39:50NineTeen67CometBattery maybe? That quick? It usually runs on a stand in the car or in the house .. so that batt never really got worked I think ..
09:40:03peturcrop: where?
09:40:32croppetur: BuufNano 12x12x16
09:40:53cropBut on http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/CustomIcons it says it should be one column
09:41:08peturcrop: looks like 1 column to me
09:41:20peturin the zip files
09:42:11croppetur: ah, so it's only multicolumn on the wiki page? I haven't looked into the provided zip
09:42:35croppetur: btw, there is an update for the 'view playlist' patch
09:42:42peturthe 4 columns example is only to show how they look I think
09:44:42peturcrop: no time, sorry
09:46:49croppetur: no hurry. I'm also watching the progress of that patch since I had the same issue. Just wanted to let you know.
09:47:08 Part NineTeen67Comet
09:47:08peturcrop: what number was it?
09:49:38croppetur: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7078
09:58:50SliMMis there some sort of dynamic memory allocation function?
09:59:37B4gderis the time ripe for another round of malloc() tennis? ;-)
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09:59:50B4gderSliMM: nope
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10:00
10:00:24SliMMb4gder: damn..
10:00:24B4gderwell, you can make your own within a plugin/codec
10:00:39SliMMi don't know how :))
10:00:46B4gderand at startup various parts can "nick" parts of the audio buffer
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10:03:42intgr"The codec is heavily x86-centric with lots of x86 assembly to speed up parts of the code - particularly a neural network."
10:03:57intgrMonkey's uses a neural network during decompression?!
10:06:18peturyes, keep those headphones in your ears!
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10:09:45JdGordonre: fs7078, does anyone agree with me that adding a new string to say no playlist to view is a waste and "No Playlists" would work fine there?
10:10:12peturJdGordon: agreed
10:10:51JdGordonB4gder: is 7080 marked critical becasue you forgot to change the default?
10:11:59cropJdGordon: I'm not sure. No Playlists would better be used in playlist catalog. Do we also have "No playlist" (without an S)?
10:12:04B4gderI just changed the type
10:12:11B4gderI didn't see the "critical" part for some reason
10:12:27JdGordoncrop: well, i agree... but imo its not worth adding the string for this patch
10:12:36linuxstbintgr: I'm not sure which part of Monkey's audio uses a neural network, but it is definitely very CPU intensive - the gigabeat should be able to handle everything apart from "insane". But the other targets will struggle with just "fast".
10:12:41JdGordonB4gder: apparently the severity gets set t critical automatically...
10:12:52B4gderhow... nice
10:13:19B4gderi set it to medium now
10:14:04B4gderthat's one major thing the flyspray mails still lack => proper telling what changed
10:15:08 Join kubiix [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz)
10:18:53cropJdGordon: on a related note: when viewing a saved playlist, its name doesn't appear anywhere. Is it a feature or a bug? For on the fly list, we could use 'dynamic.' I.e. we could show the name that would be given when the playlist is (about to be) saved.
10:20:13JdGordonunless there is a string for dynamic playlist already i think its a waste...
10:20:17JdGordonPlaylist is fine
10:21:31scorchehrm...is there a special stick that i can use prod people to discuss things on my dev-ml thread?
10:22:04scorches/prod people to/to prod people into
10:22:09JdGordonscorche: its the +b stick
10:22:18JdGordonban everyone from irc and thats all thats left..
10:22:25scorchehah
10:22:40scorchei wouldnt mind if there was discussion about it here either ;)
10:23:53JdGordonwhich "it" shall we discuss?
10:24:06scorchewell, you, nothing ;)
10:24:13scorche(devcon-west discussion)
10:24:26scorchei hate having to make decisions with no feedback
10:24:36JdGordoni say vegas...
10:24:46scorcheare you going to come? =P
10:24:59JdGordonna.. i have a thing about going to america...
10:25:05JdGordontoo many americans :D
10:25:19scorchesad thing is, i see your point
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10:27:08webguest89hello, related to playlist, I have a question:
10:27:37jhMikeSJdGordon: hey, don't make go all the way over there to kick your ass :D
10:28:02scorchejhMikeS: your status on devcon-w?
10:28:11webguest89why I cannot edit an m3u without played it and saved it?
10:28:56webguest89I mean I open playlist and have all the tracks.... and if I remove and move tracks, the changes won't be changed
10:29:08webguest89is this intended or bug?
10:29:52webguest89I need to start the playlist and then make the changes on the fly and then save the current playlist (overwritting the previous one)
10:30:03webguest89things could be easier :)
10:32:30jhMikeSscorche: June 30th? Bad date really. That's the up north time.
10:32:43 Quit webguest84 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
10:32:51scorchehrm...
10:34:09scorchedefine "up north time"
10:34:54jhMikeSEveryone goes up to Leland for the 4th of July
10:35:06scorcheit isnt the 4th of july! =P
10:35:14scorchejust the 1st!
10:35:40jhMikeSyeah, but it's the days surrounding it too
10:35:47webguest89any thought?
10:37:34 Quit linuxstb ("Leaving")
10:38:13scorchejhMikeS: so no chance unless date is changed?
10:39:34cropwebguest89: isn't the playlist you've opened then the current playlist?
10:40:05jhMikeSprobably not June 30...no location set?...'less I missed a message
10:40:28scorchenot really, although we are leaning heavily towards vegas
10:40:41webguest89no, I mean in the file browser I just go to playlist and call context menu for show me the list, and then I edit it w/out played it, but the changes aren't saved ie: the moves delete...*
10:41:43webguest89is this behaviour wanted or this is a bug or something?
10:42:12cropwebguest89: I'm not sure what happens if you open a playlist via 'open with'. Is it a core feature of RB or a plugin?
10:44:40markunB4gder: wow, I got a mail back from Toshiba and they corrected the factual error on their site, pretty quick!
10:45:08B4gdernice
10:45:24jhMikeSmarkun: factual error?
10:45:51markunjhMikeS: the Gigabeat Australia website stated the Gigabeat X has an OLED screen
10:46:15markunwhich appeared in the wikipedia as one of the benefits of the X over the S
10:46:57markunI removed it from wikipedia and someone put it back
10:48:03jhMikeSaren't those just experimental atm?
10:48:16markunwhich are?
10:48:36steveomarkun u have gigabeat and live in australia?
10:48:39jhMikeSthe OLEDs
10:48:44scorcheOLEDs are used in quite a few devices now
10:48:55webguest89crop: core feature
10:48:56markunjhMikeS: the Gigabeat U and iriver clix2 have OLED screens I believe
10:49:04steveowhats a gigabeat say f40 cost in australia?
10:49:08markunsteveo: no, I don't live in Australia
10:49:15steveodamn lol'
10:49:39markunthey can be found on ebay for around 100 USD I think
10:50:25scorchejhMikeS: let me talk to febs and i will get back to you....that was really the only weekend that febs would be able to come for sure, so i will see...any other dates that would not be good for you?
10:50:31 Quit BeoWulf ("http://www.outpost-universe.net/")
10:50:35cropwebguest89: I assume only the current playlist can be saved. And if you just open a playlist without playing it it isn't the current one
10:50:54cropwebguest89: but it's only my assumption
10:51:21webguest89that is the point, you can sew it and move or remove tracks, but cannot save
10:51:24jhMikeSscorche: I'm thinking but I just don't know atm...it's not like things run on a regular schedule here, it really is per-job determined
10:51:28webguest89doesn't sounds to logical
10:52:16scorchejhMikeS: alright...a maybe is alright....if you can, can you please add yourself to the wiki page?
10:52:23markunwebguest89: doesn't sound logical to me either. How dow you open the playlist without playing it?
10:52:36SliMMhow do i set the colour in the grayscale lib?
10:52:49jhMikeSmarkun: well, they say you can make them with an inkjet printer on Wikipedia so maybe someday we can just print new DAPs and whatnot...sounds a bit nuts now though :)
10:52:59webguest89markun: bring up the context menu and go to playlis context and show playlist
10:53:05jhMikeSscorche: sure
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10:53:34markunwebguest89: even afters years of rockbox use I learn new things every day :)
10:53:54jhMikeSmarkun: I've read about similar things for electronic circuits in general
10:53:55webguest89hahaha :-)
10:54:06webguest89but pity changes canot be saved
10:54:30webguest89we can modify things and all, seems to be the hard part, and just for save; nothing :(
10:54:48markunwebguest89: use the source luke
10:55:05markun(source code)
10:55:32webguest89I don't have enough skills I think, plus I don't know the source code at all
10:55:34webguest89:(
10:55:49markunnon of us knew the source code before we started working on it
10:56:11webguest89who was the one made the rockbox playlist stuff?
10:56:23webguest89maybe he know how to do
10:56:47cropI think the first thing to look at is what "Save playlist" does, i.e. what playlist is saved. Or does the menu just lack the entry for save?
10:57:08markunwebguest89: many people have worked on rockbox playlist stuff: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/playlist.c?view=log
10:57:44webguest89crop save plalist only happen when the playlist is playing
10:58:45webguest89markun: wow, impressive !
10:58:56cropwebguest89: so there is not menu entry?
10:59:20webguest89crop: do you have any rockbox device for see it yourself? :)
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11:00:07cropwebguest89: not right now
11:00:10webguest89crop: the playlist menu when you select a m3u file, just contain the "show playlist" string
11:00:17cropwebguest89: otherwise I wouldn't ask
11:00:42webguest89and when you enter in it you have the playlist and all...like you are seeing the list during playback
11:01:08webguest89then you can edit it and all, but once you made your changes when you exit, nothing saved
11:01:41webguest89crop: tried simulators?
11:02:02amiconnhardeep is the main mr. playlist
11:02:23cropwebguest89: well, I think a playlist is never saved automatically. After editing, you have to call up the context menu and select 'Save' Do you have that 'save' entry?
11:02:24amiconnLast seen in here a month ago
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11:04:33webguest89crop: when don't have the save sting in this context
11:04:39webguest89that is the lack
11:04:48webguest89is hardeep here?
11:06:08jhMikeSthe first playlist revision looks a little simpler than it is now I think :P
11:06:56B4gderhehe
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11:07:15B4gderamen
11:07:17cropwebguest89: the next step would be to see why the entry isn't there. Just because it's not or because it wouldn't make sense there (i.e. we're not able to save a list not being played). But I have no time to do it now. This is a good chance for you to get taste of RB.
11:07:31jhMikeSfrom 4205 bytes to 104237 ... heh
11:08:09webguest89I don't know if this could be usufull for rockbox or just for me ???
11:08:31webguest89but imho have the possibility to edit any playlist could be fine
11:08:58*B4gder never edited a single playlist with Rockbox...
11:09:01webguest89crop: just need that someone code it, like always
11:09:25webguest89B4gder: but can you see the use, or do you think is usuless?
11:09:46B4gderi know people think of it a great feature
11:10:28webguest89I mean edit any playlist even isn't playing (thing that we don't have yet)
11:10:45JdGordonI tihnk it can edit playlists on disk
11:10:58B4gdergiven that we don't have it and I don't even think there's a ferature-request for it, i doubt it is a very large demand
11:11:12webguest89JdGordon: folowed the discussion?
11:11:30scorchewebguest89: you can always use the text editor ;)
11:11:34webguest89B4gder: I don't like much fill feature request
11:11:36*JdGordon hasnt
11:11:37B4gderbut I'm not shooting it down, it just is outside of what I care about
11:11:46LinusNthere is a bug in the playlist editor, it can't save the playlist currently in use
11:12:01webguest89scorche: indeed, but hard when you want to move plenty tracks removes...
11:13:03webguest89easier with the playlist viewer
11:13:47cropIMHO editing a playlist should sit in a plugin and not in the core
11:14:21webguest89LinusN: you can save current playlist here, but canot save your changes when the playlist isn't playing
11:14:44webguest89crop: imho playlist viwer like we have now is the better way
11:14:57webguest89it just lak of save changes
11:15:10webguest89you can edit it and all, but not save
11:15:19B4gderwebguest89: you wouldn't see much difference if it were a plugin or not
11:15:21SliMMhow do i make a plugin a viewer?
11:15:47webguest89thing B4gder: more HD access no?
11:16:00B4gdermore?
11:16:07B4gdera playlist will require loads of it anyway
11:16:13webguest89indeed
11:16:31webguest89but that will take a bit more time with plugin no? (time in ms)
11:16:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:16:49peturSliMM: put it in the viewers dir and add it to viewers.config
11:17:02webguest89I'm thiniking to properties... tha use plugin
11:17:16SliMMpetur: i want it in the viewers dir after the make
11:17:17webguest89no direct infos, need to wait the disc to spin
11:17:30SliMMjust like jpeg.rock or other viewers
11:17:40webguest89but time for me to resume paid works :)
11:17:46webguest89ba bye all
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11:20:04SliMMpetur: any idea?
11:24:52amiconnSliMM: petur already answered your question...
11:25:20amiconnJust add it to viewers.config, the build system takes care of the rest
11:25:46SliMMthat's it :)
11:26:08cropAnd how about factoring out playlist editor (for 'external' playlist) to a plugin?
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11:26:51nevynI've been going through the installation instructions - they tell me to install the fonts package but don'et tell me how.
11:27:14nevyn(sorry for the typo's - I can't see what I'm typing.)
11:28:04nevynquit
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11:28:24JdGordonthat was odd :p
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11:30:38markunnevyn: in case you can read the logs: just unzip this file to your player: http://download.rockbox.org/daily/fonts/rockbox-fonts.zip
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11:33:01nevynthat's better... I can see what I'm typing.
11:33:07nevynIs anyone around?
11:33:12markunnevyn: just unzip this file to your player: http://download.rockbox.org/daily/fonts/rockbox-fonts.zip
11:33:33nevynjust to the root dir?
11:33:59cropnevyn: yes
11:34:16cropnevyn: the zip file has the right folders inside
11:34:36nevynThanks.... was kind of looking blankly at the instructions...
11:35:04cropmarkun: have you looked at the nimbus patches?
11:36:07pondlifehttp://build.rockbox.org/cvsmod/chlog-20070425T120203Z.html - has it been discovered what caused it to use 13259-13259..?
11:36:45markuncrop: oops, still not :)
11:37:04croppondlife: bagder's hand passes over build server? :-)
11:37:08nevynexit
11:37:11pondlife:)
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11:41:15SliMMwhy do i get this error:
11:42:04SliMM\/home/user/rockbox/build_ipod/apps/plugins/gifview.o: In function `loadgif':
11:42:06SliMMgifview.c:(.text+0xf40): undefined reference to `memcpy'
11:42:30SliMMwithout the backslash
11:43:19cropSliMM: because the linker doesn't see memcpy?
11:44:07SliMMyes, yes, but i didn't get that error on sim build
11:44:22SliMMthere is no #ifdef SIMULATOR
11:44:41SliMMi also see no memcpy
11:44:56petursim uses pc implementation of memcpy, on target you only have what's available
11:45:02SliMMmemcpy isn't called anywhere
11:45:12peturisn't it part of the plugin api?
11:45:45cropSliMM: it should be called as api->memcpy(...)
11:45:48linuxstbgcc will be using memcpy to initialise a variable.
11:46:04linuxstbSo you need to give it an implementation - just a small wrapper function calling rb->memcpy()
11:46:31SliMMlinuxstb: i don't get it
11:46:52linuxstbgcc will be adding a call to memcpy on your behalf.
11:47:00linuxstbmemcpy doesn't exist, hence the problem.
11:47:24croplinuxstb: that sound weird to me too
11:47:35SliMMso i should declare a void memcpy();?
11:48:25croplinuxstb: gcc uses memcpy to initialsi vars? memcpy is not a part of C, how can this ever be?
11:48:26linuxstbNo, you shoulddefine "void *memcpy(void *dest, const void *src, size_t n) { rb->memcpy(dest,src,n); }"
11:50:17linuxstbBTW, that should be ... { return rb->memcpy(dest,src,n); }
11:50:47intgrcrop: memcpy is definitely defined by all C standards. :)
11:51:29cropintgr: it's part of the C standard library but not of the language itselb. So I can' beleive gcc adds calls to it
11:52:12amiconncrop: Gcc does use memcpy internally for variable initialisation and struct copying
11:52:36SliMMhttp://www.adobe.com/products/flashplayer_sdk/
11:53:20amiconnWhen an application is compiled with -ffreestanding, like rockbox, memcpy and a few other memory functions must be provided by the application
11:53:28SliMMthanks
11:53:28amiconnThis is documented behaviour of gcc
11:53:58SliMMbut why other plugins didn't get this error?
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11:54:10amiconnThey don't use memcpy...
11:54:20linuxstbI think some of them do - you'll see similar memcpy implementations.
11:54:25amiconn...or if they do, they have it defined like linuxstb told
11:54:37cropamiconn: thanks for clarification. So each plugin that uses some static vars must define memcpy?
11:54:51amiconnNo, only if gcc actually tries to use memcpy
11:55:12SliMMamiconn: when does it try to use memcpy?
11:55:24cropamiconn: and for is it used for? To initialise vars? Which ones? Static?
11:55:42intgrVariables on stack that are initialized from static data.
11:55:51amiconnSliMM: You'll notice when getting erros...
11:55:52intgrI presume.
11:55:56SliMMand by the way, i think a small flash player would work on gigabeat
11:56:06SliMMamiconn: lol, ok
11:56:16amiconnReally, it can't be predicted
11:56:18linuxstbSliMM: Does a GPL-compatible flash player exist?
11:56:35amiconnThere are cases where gcc uses memcpy on coldfire but not on SH, for the same C code
11:56:38cropamiconn: ok, good to know!
11:56:53SliMMdon't know, i'm reading about the open source flash player here http://www.adobe.com/products/flashplayer_sdk/
11:57:39linuxstbSliMM: That doesn't look open source...
11:57:41markunthere are some I think: http://www.gnu.org/software/gnash/
11:57:53peturSliMM: that one is 1) commercial 2) has a per-unit license fee
11:58:15intgrHere's an example: http://rafb.net/p/rnmuWI33.html
11:58:16SliMMpetur: i see now
11:59:04intgr(The memmove() is there just to fool the compiler into initializing it as non-const)
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12:07:40amiconncrop: http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-4.0.4/gcc/Standards.html#Standards Check the paragraph starting "Most of the compiler support routines..." near the bottom
12:12:58cropamiconn: thanks.
12:14:29 Quit SliMM (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
12:15:20cropI see a weird / dangerous code in playlist_viewer.c, func playlist_viewer_ex. There is a var declared as bool ret. An later in a {} block, another var int ret is declared. And in one {} block even both are used (not factually but by intention).
12:17:05B4gder-Wshadow anyone? ;-)
12:18:58B4gderwow
12:19:04B4gderthat causes a flood of warnings
12:19:53cropB4gder: he-he. It's not just shadow, they are bot used! As in int ret = ... and two lines below: ret = true. Which is ok C wise but I'm sure not what the author wanted
12:20:19cropB4gder: shadow, when used properly, does no harm
12:20:23B4gderwell, by warning on shadows such stuff is normally avoided
12:21:48JdGordoncrop: your right thats naughty... but in this case it looks safe
12:21:56JdGordonin its current form anyway
12:22:19JdGordonhmm... maybe not
12:22:32JdGordonif (ret < 0)
12:22:33JdGordon {
12:22:33JdGordon ret = true;
12:22:33DBUGEnqueued KICK JdGordon
12:22:33JdGordon goto exit;
12:22:33JdGordon }
12:22:37JdGordonWTF? thats so wrong!
12:22:47B4gder!
12:23:08linuxstbWhat does "svn blame" say? :)
12:23:30B4gderyeah, let's get name!
12:23:33B4gder;-]
12:23:36B4gdera name even
12:23:51peturdrum roll....
12:23:54JdGordonhardeep
12:24:05JdGordonor kevin
12:24:20B4gderdarn, nobody who's present
12:24:27B4gderno fun in public taunting then
12:24:38pondlifeHah, it's logged...
12:26:03B4gder-Wshadow causes 3929 warnings ;-)
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12:27:12JdGordonB4gder: maybe put that compile log onto the dev ml so we can think about fixing them?
12:30:24pixelmaB4gder: btw. I was a bit surprised that a commit to the wps folder triggered a rebuild. IIRC that wasn't the case with cvs
12:30:55B4gdertools/svnupcheck.pl controls that
12:31:15B4gderif it speaks, a rebuild triggers
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12:31:53B4gderand yes, no mentioning of wps in there
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12:41:57XavierGrclear
12:41:59XavierGroops
12:43:34steveook guys and girls how much u think a 6ft guy should weigh?
12:45:21linuxstbsteveo: Are you in the right channel?
12:45:48steveohehe well no one was talking so i asked a random question
12:45:53B4gderare you asking how many rockbox targets you should have? ;-)
12:46:23SoapI think that answer is on the front page.
12:49:35cropJdGordon: hehe, in this particular case, if (ret < 0) ret=true will even work since <0 and true are the same when viewd as bool. But it's not a nice code
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12:53:09cropJdGordon: interesting bin size deltas from your last commit: some go up and some go down!
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12:55:36[steveo]/msg nickserv set hide email on
12:55:39[steveo]woops
12:55:46preglowkudos
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13:00
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13:02:41Topy44i did not get any answer yesterday, so again:
13:02:45Topy44www.t44.org/x5weirdnoise.zip
13:03:04Topy44i suspect this noise is created by harddisk access due to ground problems
13:03:20Topy44can anyone confirm that? is anyone else getting this type of noise
13:03:31Topy44recorded with an X5L with external mics
13:03:38preglowsounds like hd access
13:03:40Topy44first the original recording, then normalized
13:03:56preglowmight not even be ground problems
13:04:04preglowthe hd emits pretty strong stuff
13:04:16Topy44hm yes
13:04:30preglowthat's the cons of recording with something that pretty much sits on top of a hard disk
13:04:32Topy44i wonder if there is SOME way of getting rid of that noise, its seriously annoying
13:04:47preglowthe only way i see if it is the disk, is recording with a higher external gain
13:04:51preglowmic amp or some such
13:04:56preglowto utilise all the headroom you have
13:05:16Topy44yes, i was recording at very low gain as i could not access the recorder during concerts
13:05:23Topy44so i had to guess the gain setting
13:05:36Topy44now with AGC working on the X5, that will be less of a problem
13:05:37preglowbut i don't know how loud the hd usually is on x5
13:05:43preglowon h120, i can hear the hd too, when recording
13:05:57Topy44hm...
13:05:59preglowvery silent, but i can hear it
13:06:02Topy44i must open up the x5 at some point
13:06:09Topy44and see if there is room for any mods
13:06:19Topy44for example shielding between harddisk and PCB
13:06:25preglowon the bright side, you shouldn't get the noise too often
13:06:30preglowdepends what format you record to, of course
13:06:46Topy44uncompressed wave usually
13:07:08Topy44i need maximum battery capacity, the question is what uses more: compressing the data or accessing the harddisk more often
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13:07:21preglowand a good question it is
13:07:34B4gderdo 10 recordings with each and tell us the outcome!
13:07:50preglowbut with that noise, i'd go for wavpack anyway
13:07:56preglowbetter quality recordings > battery time
13:08:18Topy44that might be a good idea, i need to do some long recordings anyway to try to localize the FAT-corruption bug i had the first time...
13:08:45Topy44preglow, well, if i miss half the festival because of empty batteries it wont do much good :)
13:09:22Topy44i seem to get the noise pretty often... do you know how much the X5 will buffer before writing to disk?
13:09:26croppreglow: will there be HD artifacts if an external mic or line is is used?
13:09:38Topy44crop, i AM using an external mic with a preamp
13:09:45Topy44heres my setup:
13:09:51preglowcrop: sure
13:09:54linuxstbTopy44: The X5 has 16MB RAM, so I'm guessing it will write about 13MB-14MB at a time.
13:09:55preglowcrop: but less than with internal mic, ig uess
13:09:57Topy44www.t44.org/x5equipment.jpg
13:10:27Topy44well, the internal mic will get actual noise from the harddisk, all i'm getting with the external mic is electrical interference
13:10:33croppreglow: how does the signal from the HD gets into the sound? Are the two circuits connected?
13:10:46preglowcrop: everything in a dap is connected
13:10:51Topy44the internal mic is very sensitive and not decoupled from the unit, so it directly records the vibrations of the hd
13:10:55preglowcrop: but with a hd, you get some pretty strong em radation too
13:11:06preglowradiation, yes
13:11:25Topy44i will open up my x5 and try adding shielding, and meaby some filtering caps on the hd power lines
13:11:37Topy44meaby adding a ferrite around its data cable aswell
13:11:41Topy44something like that
13:11:44preglowworth a shot
13:11:53Topy44(IF i can fit it, i guess its gonna be VERY tight inside the unit
13:11:54Topy44)
13:11:55preglowthe power line probably already has caps, though
13:12:01preglowand you don't really need to filter a battery that much
13:12:11preglowbut anywho, always worth a shot
13:12:34Topy44i really like the x5, and i mainly use it for recording, but with that noise... thats not much fun
13:12:48preglowyou could try getting something else
13:12:53preglownever got that loud noise with h1x0
13:13:00Topy44well, the problem is:
13:13:01preglowit's audible, but not that bad
13:13:06Topy44i just bought the x5 a few weeks ago
13:13:08Topy44brand new
13:13:09Topy44but
13:13:15Topy44i let it drop the first day :)
13:13:16Topy44:(
13:13:22Topy44so it got a ugly scratch
13:13:29Topy44so i couldnt sell it at the price i paid
13:13:43preglowheh
13:13:45amiconnYou can't fit ferrite around the data cable
13:13:49amiconnAbsolutely no room
13:13:53preglowwell, having two rockbox capable devices is surely never a bad idea :)
13:13:57Topy44yeah, expected that
13:14:14Topy44preglow, i seriously blew my budget with my recording equipment as it is already :)
13:14:41preglowwell, at least that can be reused :)
13:15:08Topy44no, i'll stick to my x5 for the moment
13:16:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:16:59Soaphow can shielding work when there isn't a "true
13:17:06Soap" earth to ground it to?
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13:18:33preglowyou don't need actual ground, do you?
13:18:51preglowjust wire it to - or something
13:18:55preglownot an expert, though
13:19:11preglowhave to be careful if doing that, though :>
13:20:06SoapI'm not an expert - I was as much curious on technique.
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13:44:29intgrAre there any MP3 players that boot straight off USB? Because I think mine does that during firmware update.
13:45:31Overandintgr: boot off of USB?
13:46:47intgrYeah.
13:46:48intgrBecause it appears to be loading something onto the device in "recovery mode" before you can actually flash the ROM.
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14:11:38B4gder"boot" as in blindly use the PC as a device is unlikely
14:12:02B4gderdoing some funny sending over data is more likely
14:13:00B4gderlike the sansa's manufacture mode
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14:19:15JdGordonwarning: declaration of ‘write’ shadows a global declaration <- scary warning!
14:20:09B4gderour code have that all over the place
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14:25:03intgrB4gder: What kind of scrambling do companies actually use for their firmware?
14:25:41B4gderfrom nothing, over just a checksum added, to XOR/ADD tricks to hard encryptions with digital signatures
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14:26:50intgrHow much of the latter?
14:27:19B4gderthe most modern players seem to use the hardest encryptions/signatures
14:27:31B4gderzune/gigabeat S, ipod nano 2nd gen are hard
14:27:37intgrMine is at least 4 years old.
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14:28:27B4gdersandisk sansas use TEA encryption with a DSA signature
14:28:48B4gderluckily, with a few mistakes(?) done
14:29:09intgrHeh, yeah, that's what you get for security through obscurity. :)
14:29:51B4gderI wouldn't call TEA+DSA "security through obscurity"
14:30:03linuxstbBut wasn't the bootloader unencrypted for the Sansa? i.e. giving you both the algorithm and the key...
14:30:06intgrTEA and DSA theirselves aren't obscure; the implementation is.
14:30:45intgrthemselves*
14:30:49B4gderyes, the bootloader was/is unencrypted so they kind of showed their cards
14:30:58intgrHehe.
14:31:19intgrHmm, actually I can find plain ASCII strings in the .bin files of mine. Should try changing them.
14:31:28amiconnlinuxstb: If there wouldn't be unencrypted code together with the unencrypted key, the unit couldn't boot...
14:32:16linuxstbamiconn: I'm talking about the copy of the bootloader which is on the disk prior to flashing.
14:32:25linuxstbOn the 2nd gen Nano for example, that's encrypted.
14:32:34B4gderthey could've left the unencrypted stuff on a flash
14:32:39B4gderwhich makes things harder
14:32:47amiconnSo there should always be a way to break encrypted firmware. How hard it is depends on how hard the manufacturer tries to protect this unencrypted stuff
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14:32:59B4gdernot really
14:33:11B4gderthe zune has built-in encryption
14:33:14amiconnIf it's in the flash, you need to unsolder the flash and read it out
14:33:14B4gderand keys
14:33:29B4gderas burnt fuses
14:33:31amiconnThat'll get hard if the flash is epoxied to the board
14:33:42intgrWith some chips you can lock the flash ROM, e.g. make the ROM unreadable.
14:33:46amiconn...and even hard if it's internal to the cpu
14:34:01intgrWell, most chips I would presume.
14:34:34amiconnintgr: The cpu does have to read the flash at some point, meaning it is possible to unlock. And standard flash roms aren't locked
14:34:49B4gderintgr: the chips are normally external so the CPU needs to read them
14:34:53B4gdersomehow
14:35:45intgramiconn: Some chips only have embedded ROM that can be protected from being read by anything else than the chip itself.
14:36:14intgrBut anyway, got to go.
14:37:09amiconnYes, sure, see 7 lines above
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14:46:29cropI asked this before but got no answer. In some files, the copyright note was changed (after a significant change on the file). Is this legal?
14:46:58markuncrop: I think normally you would just add a copyright
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14:48:31JdGordonwould be so nice if we could just assign (c) on all files to rockbox.org or something.. so we dont have to worry about it
14:50:33B4gdercrop: yes it is
14:50:42B4gderJdGordon: it would take some effort to do that
14:53:44CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
14:53:44*B4gder is in the core team in Subversion and I get to see what it takes to make a full non-profit company with everything
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15:19:13cropB4gder: but can you do it just so? Or do you have to get the permission from the original copyright holder?
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15:21:48linuxstbcrop: Do you have an example of such a commit? Was any of the original code left?
15:22:40B4gderwell, if you add enough content of your own, or perhaps merge two files into one, I'd say that is the natural thing to do
15:23:13linuxstbBut I wouldn't expect the original author to now not have any copyright claim to that file.
15:23:30B4gderit'll be a combined work
15:23:32linuxstbOr, more clearly, I would expect the original author to still have some copyright claim.
15:23:41B4gderyes, of his/her parts
15:24:04linuxstbBut I think crop is saying that there's been commits where the original author's name has been replaced by the new author.
15:24:37B4gderoh
15:24:43croplinuxstb: exactly
15:25:05B4gderthat has happened because 1) the original copyright text was wrong 2) the contents has no longer anything left from the original author
15:25:05cropThat's what I didn't like
15:25:21B4gderthe (1) case has happened numerous times in rockbox
15:25:57B4gderor 3) an evil commit
15:26:12cropB4gder: I think at least one line of code was retained. So the original author should still be mentioned
15:26:38B4gderyes, I think there should be little reasons not to keep the original author almost no matter what we do
15:26:50cropB4gder: I found it to be 3)
15:27:17markunso which commit are we talking about?
15:28:44cropCan't remember exactly. But I have a name in my head. But don't like to tell it (here).
15:29:05markunwell, PM B4gder about it or something
15:29:18cropDo all the files have to bear a copyright note? Some bdf files don't
15:29:20LinusNwe take these matters seriously
15:30:58*JdGordon thinks he may have done a naughty (c) commit or two at the begninig of is days
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15:38:11cropCode police notified ;-)
15:41:04JdGordonyou'll never take me alive!@!!
15:41:21linuxstbJdGordon: What makes you think they want to?
15:41:34JdGordonhmm.. good point
15:41:37JdGordon:'(
15:41:39linuxstb;)
15:41:48croplinuxstb: he-he
15:45:37markunJdGordon: hey, maybe it's not even you (is it me?)
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15:48:55cropIs it possible to query SVN for commits that changed lines with certain numbers? Then we could easily find such commits
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15:49:30dionoeacrop: you can use svn blame filename
15:49:42dionoeaand it'll tell you who last modified a line and in which commit
15:49:57dionoeaAFAIK it doesn't show deleted stuff though
15:50:24B4gderright, it shows the currently existing lines and in what rev they were changed and by whom
15:51:19cropWe could use SVN xxx | grep (c). But what should stand instead xxx?
15:51:43markunlog?
15:51:55markunno, I guess not
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15:53:14cropmarkun: diff to the initial version?
15:54:08linuxstbYou could do "svn annotate file", see what revision the (C) line was last modified, and see if that differs from the first revision of the file.
15:54:09cropmarkun: and then grep
15:56:35JdGordoncant we just say all files are (c) all the people in the credits file?
15:57:30croplinuxstb: what does svn annotate do?
15:57:46B4gderblame and annotate is the same
15:58:00linuxstbannotate is friendlier though...
15:58:09linuxstbIs there an "svn praise" ?
15:58:18amiconnAfaik there is
15:58:25cropJdGordon: I think no since the copyright is not shared (or gained) by the simple fact of contribution (even to that file)
15:58:29linuxstbThose crazy subversion people...
15:58:39B4gderblame (praise, annotate, ann)
15:58:46amiconnIt's also an alias for annotate
15:59:23B4gderperhaps we should just make it rule that we never remove copyright names
15:59:41LinusNthat's perhaps the easiest
15:59:52B4gderand that you're free to add your own if you think you've done a large contribution to a file
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16:00:49cropB4gder: yes, that sounds sensible
16:01:03amiconnB4gder: It's still unclear what to do if you invent new files with large portions of code from other files
16:01:10B4gdertrue
16:01:16amiconn...e.g. when splitting stuff for target tree
16:01:21LinusNamiconn: then you should add the names from those files
16:01:32cropamiconn: keep the names
16:01:36B4gderyes, to be consistent you should add the names from those files
16:01:46cropamiconn: and add yours
16:01:59B4gderwell, if you want to
16:02:07amiconnIf it's mainly just a split, I just took the copyright lines from the old files
16:03:15cropamiconn: IMHO it's up to you to add your name. If you don't like the don't but IMO you have all rights in that case since we have a new 'copyright entity'
16:04:10amiconn(e.g. the sh1 adc split)
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16:07:38markunWhat is the copyright used for? To ask for permission to do things with the code which are not covered by the license?
16:07:50LinusNyes
16:08:17Topy44i just opened up my X5L, and in fact, there is plenty of space in it for modding stuff
16:08:38Topy44at least its not nearly as packed as i expected it
16:10:42JdGordon... but that doesnt make sense... because the person at the top of the page only did the initial work, lots of people hold copyright to the file
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16:11:00markunJdGordon: what doesn't make sense?
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16:11:26JdGordon"To ask for permission to do things with the code which are not covered by the license?" being the reason for the (c) message
16:11:26markunto only assign it to a few people and not all?
16:11:31PzIs it possible to make a custom rockbox splash screen?
16:12:09markunJdGordon: well, maybe he can just use the code written by the copyright holders then and has to remove the other commits :)
16:12:13PzAlso.. my rockbox doesn't look anything like this http://www.alwaysbeta.com/wp-content/uploads/smcbride/rockbox/ipod_0.jpg
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16:12:28amiconnJdGordon: tot eh? ;)
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16:12:46markunPz: and do you want it to look like that?
16:12:51Topy44i just removed the harddisk with the stuck-on second battery
16:12:56Topy44really weird construction
16:13:07Topy44and:
16:13:14Pzmarkun, yes... currently, mine is just a greyish, text only deal
16:13:23markunwell, that's the default
16:13:32Topy44there is NO shielding AT ALL between harddisk and PCB!
16:13:47markunTopy44: maybe the hdd case is the shield?
16:13:55*JdGordon heading tot eh bed.. cyaz
16:14:00markunJdGordon: good night
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16:14:26Pzmarkun, do you know where i can get it to be like that? is that a theme or something?
16:14:29Topy44markun, certainly, to a degree...
16:14:47markunPz: yes, those are themes, let me look up a link for you.
16:14:54Pzmarkun, dank je
16:14:59Pz:P
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16:15:03markunPz: geen dank :)
16:15:08Topy44the X5L really IS a strange construction... with the 2 indipendant batterys, one being 3x the size of the other...
16:15:16Topy44and just stuck onto the harddisk
16:15:19markunPz: but lets continue in english
16:15:33markunPz: here are some http://www.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=320x240x16
16:15:38Pzty
16:15:47Pzmy left button doesnt work on my ipod anymore :(
16:15:54markunfor some you may need to use an unofficial build
16:16:16amiconnTopy44: Yes, the L models have a secondary battery that's just wired in parallel. The smaller one is the only battery of the non-L models
16:16:24Topy44amiconn, i know
16:16:39amiconnThis does apply to all the coldfire based hdd players from cowon, i.e. iAudio M3, M5 and X5
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16:17:21Topy44there is enough space in the unit that it might be possible to place a ferrite around the datacable - if i could find one exactly the right size
16:17:28Topy44not sure if it would help anything though :)
16:17:30Pzmarkun, oh, i cant use those.. i am on a nano
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16:17:50markunhttp://www.rockbox-themes.org/
16:17:58markunthere are also nano themes
16:18:10Pzty
16:20:56Topy44i wonder which part is the DAC... wiring in shielded cables from line in to dac would probably help
16:21:31markunTopy44: what are you trying to fix?
16:21:51markunsome noise during playback/recording?
16:21:51Topy44markun: www.t44.org/x5weirdnoise.zip
16:21:56Topy44during recording, yes
16:22:03Topy44caused by harddisk access probably
16:22:57Pzmarkun, is there a way to make it so that i can press another button to go back instead of rewind? i can use the touch feature, just not the click feature for rewind
16:24:07Topy44markun, got any suggestions?
16:24:29linuxstbPz: You can change the source, but Rockbox has enough problems with lack of buttons on the ipod already, it won't be easy to make do with one less... But see apps/keymaps/keymap-ipod.c
16:24:31markunTopy44: no, sorry
16:24:55Pzlinuxstb, :( n/m
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16:26:30Topy44hm!
16:26:33Topy44i wonder...
16:26:50Topy44if i would exchange positions of the secondary battery and the harddisk
16:27:00Topy44the battery would be between the harddisk and the pcb
16:27:04Topy44that might help
16:27:24Topy44the data cable looks long enough, should still fit in
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16:32:46Pzhmm, which versions include rockboy?
16:33:26Topy44fits in!
16:34:14Topy44now, lets do some testing...
16:35:13Pzit doesn't list .gb files in the file viewer
16:36:31linuxstbWhat do you have the "show files" setting set to? Also, are you using the "current build" of Rockbox - rockboy was only added for the Nano recently.
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16:37:37intgrDoes anyone have a 68k binutils lying around?
16:39:01Topy44so, i just successfully modded my x5 - now lets check if it helps anything :)
16:39:38linuxstbintgr: Why not just build it from source? The CrossCompiler wiki page tells you how.
16:40:08intgrBecause I don't have Cygwin installed here and I don't even know if I'm going to need it.
16:40:21intgrAnd I'm anxious to know whether it decompiles. :)
16:40:25linuxstbSo what do you have?
16:40:43intgrTwo .bin files I'd like disassembled.
16:40:56linuxstbI mean in terms of environment...
16:41:17intgrAh, just the output of an 'objdump -rld'
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16:46:23Topy44hm...
16:46:34Topy44when i am recording, i use an external mic preamp
16:46:50Topy44with seperate gain and output controls
16:47:01Topy44now, what gain should i set the X5 to?
16:48:36Topy44as my goal is to record with as much headroom and dynamic range, and as little noise as possible
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16:49:45Topy44hm, the x5 IS pretty noisy really...
16:53:00Topy44hmm, meaby i'm mistaken, but it seems turning around harddisk and battery INCREASED the noise...
16:55:33Topy44no, it didnt
16:55:36Topy44its just still the same
16:55:44Topy44and i am now sure that its from the harddisk
16:55:56Topy44and its also audible during playback, but only if set to VERY high levels
16:57:32Topy44a really flat ferrite might really help
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17:02:29amiconnTopy44: If the noise is induced due to bad grounding instead of bad shielding you're out of luck. Changing that would require changing the wiring on the pcb, which isn't possible
17:02:49Topy44thats what i'm afraid of
17:03:02Topy44i am currently recording ONLY the noise, at maximum gain
17:03:19Topy44to look at the characteristics of it a little closer
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17:03:41Topy44it appears about every 10,5 mb
17:04:06Topy44there is some basic hiss aswell, but thats not as disturbing
17:04:43Topy44uuuh
17:04:57Topy44there is an even higher frequency noise as soon the supack is connected
17:05:25Topy44and very faint mains humm when the power supply is connected
17:06:06Topy44my custom made cable does not make any noise
17:06:24Topy44hm... some more ideas.
17:07:22 Quit yoho (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:11:20Topy44hm...
17:11:36Topy44the noise is very regular and has a distinct pattern... it might be possible to filter it
17:11:53Topy44it really looks like digital noise to me actually...
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17:12:38 Part ctaf
17:13:49Topy44its made up of blocks of about 40ms, in groups of 10 blocks, with 15ms pauses in between
17:14:06 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
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17:14:46Topy44and the noise is REALLY high frequency, every sample has a completely different value, so its basicly 44khz noise... but its not uniform, so you can hear lower frequency stuff going on
17:16:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:17:54Topy44www.t44.org/x5-justnoise.zip
17:18:05Topy44normalize it to hear it, or just zoom in to look at it
17:19:01 Quit Arathis (Client Quit)
17:20:12Topy44hm!
17:20:43PzAnyone know why .gb files don't show up in file viewer?
17:21:53linuxstbPz: Last time you asked, I said: What do you have the "show files" setting set to? Also, are you using the "current build" of Rockbox - rockboy was only added for the Nano recently.
17:22:16PzYes, I am using the current build. Let me check on the show files
17:23:22Pzsupported
17:24:00Topy44[17:02] <amiconn> Topy44: If the noise is induced due to bad grounding instead of bad shielding you're out of luck. Changing that would require changing the wiring on the pcb, which isn't possible
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17:24:14Topy44yes, i think its a ground problem
17:24:24markunPz: set it to 'all' as a work around
17:24:33Topy44i will now open the x5 again, and put the harddisk as far from the unit as the cable allows
17:24:38linuxstbmarkun: "supported" doesn't work?
17:24:41Topy44and start it up
17:24:50Pzok, i changed it to 'all' and clicked on it, but it had no effect
17:24:56markunlinuxstb: well, he had it on supported and they didn't show up, right?
17:24:59Topy44if the noise stays the same, its definately caused by ground problems, not shielding
17:25:32linuxstbPz: Do you have rockboy.rock in .rockbox/viewers/ ? And do you have a line for .gb files in .rockbox/viewers.config ?
17:25:32PzThis is the firmware I am using: http://download.rockbox.org/daily/ipodnano/rockbox-ipodnano.zip
17:26:59PzYes, I have a rockboy.rock, gb,viewers/rockboy,6 gbc,viewers/rockboy,6
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17:27:33linuxstbThen it should be working... If you do a long-press on select when selecting a .gb file, can you choose "open with" and then rockboy?
17:28:40Pzreturned error
17:29:57linuxstbI've no idea then... Do you have music playing?
17:29:58 Quit Topy44 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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17:30:37Topy44argh, disconnect
17:30:38Topy44anyway:
17:30:43Topy44confirmed: its a ground problem
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17:33:07Pzwhoops
17:33:14Pzwas a gba game.. didnt notice
17:34:34markunthose will probably never run on an ipod nano
17:37:01Topy44i just connected the 20gb harddisk of another mp3 player i have
17:37:13Topy44lets see if the volume or length of the noise changes
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17:38:25Pzhmm, are there any homebrew plugins out there?
17:38:46Topy44btw, that other player is another player that would be nice supporting... its a portalplayer based chinese model sold in germany under the "medion" brand
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17:39:03Topy44its quite common, and its OF sucks A LOT
17:40:49Topy44the original model is "HannStar K MV-7" as marked on the PCB, its sold here as "medion MD95200" or "md220" (it has two different model names on the box and on the unit...
17:40:50Topy44)
17:41:03linuxstbmarkun: I noticed you said "ipod nano", and not Rockbox... Do you have plans?
17:41:27Pzwant foken met de markun is en zelfmoordpogin
17:41:29Pz:D
17:41:52markunlinuxstb: not really :) I just thought the portalplayer wouldn't be powerful enough
17:42:23markunPz: I didn't realise it was you. Did you change your nick is is my memory just very bad?
17:42:39Topy44oh, and there is a 100% firmware compatible model called "md440", only the controls are slightly different (a zen-like touch-"bar" instead of an ipod like touch-"wheel")
17:42:55Pzmarkun, changed my nick :P
17:43:09Pzmarkun, well, got disconnected and this was my default nick
17:44:34markunlinuxstb: I don't understand this http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_12_2/roku-m1000-media-player-5-2005.html
17:44:52markun"In all cases, the lossless file is decompressed on the computer and transmitted as LPCM to the M1000."
17:45:21markunthey have a 400MHz Blackfin and think it's better to decode the files on a separate server?
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17:46:47Lloreanmarkun: It sounds like the device doesn't do the decoding, so that it can support more formats.
17:47:02LloreanThat way they don't have to be bothered with supporting them, just demand the computer do it.
17:47:36linuxstbIsn't part of the soundbridge open source? I don't know if that's the server software, or the firmware though...
17:48:06Lloreanlinuxstb: It says it can play with Windows Media Connect, for WMA lossless
17:48:19Topy44*sigh* no change...
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17:48:36LloreanSo somewhere along the way it can talk to proprietary software.
17:48:58PzDoes ipod have a built in microphone?
17:49:02LloreanNo
17:49:27PzOh, you have to hook one up to get the voice stuff working?
17:49:37linuxstbApple would make you buy the lcd separately if they could get away with it...
17:50:38Topy44well, they DO sell the ipod shuffle... :)
17:50:40Lloreanlinuxstb: Don't say that, or they'll start offering upgrade kits for make the Shuffle into a Nano-equivalent.r
17:50:44Soul-SlayerI'm considering buying a new DAP, and now I'm so accustomed to Rockbox I'm more interested in getting one that supports it... Does anyone know which target would be best to run Rockbox stably, largish colour screen and large capacity?
17:50:45Topy44ok, no lcd available for it...
17:50:59LloreanSoul-Slayer: Gigabeat F or X series
17:51:34Soul-SlayerThank you, I'll look into them
17:52:57Soul-SlayerWhat is the difference between the F and X series?
17:54:08 Quit Pz (Remote closed the connection)
17:55:10LloreanWhat they look like.
17:55:21linuxstbSoul-Slayer: The X is very hard to find, so it's probably irrelevent...
17:55:31LloreanThe X has a slightly larger screen, though the same number of pixels, and a slightly smaller case
17:55:37LloreanIt also *might* have a slightly smaller battery
17:55:38Soul-SlayerFair enough - The F seems to be pretty elusive right now too, lol.
17:55:58linuxstbThere were a large number on ebay last time I checked (a few days ago).
17:56:12LloreanEveryone who bought one for $99 just so they could sell it for $150
17:56:13Soul-SlayerI trust the number following the F/X refers to it's capacity?
17:56:20LloreanYup
17:56:40linuxstbNote that if you're looking to upgrade the disk in the future, the F10/20 have smaller cases than the F40/60
17:56:55Soul-SlayerSo all of them are supported with Rockbox? I'm not going to run into a problem like the 80gb ipod?
17:57:00LloreanNope
17:57:07LloreanAs in "no you won't run into a problem"
17:57:10LloreanSince you asked two questions.
17:57:11Soul-SlayerGreat, okay
17:57:17Soul-SlayerTrue, sorry, lol.
17:57:32LloreanThe 80gb iPod is more or less a special case.
17:57:34markunSoul-Slayer: don't buy the Gigabeat S by mistake
17:57:53markunit might be supported in future, but it isn't right now
17:58:00Soul-SlayerOkay, thank you
17:58:20Soul-SlayerI remember a while back people were praising the H3XX, has the Gigabeat overtaken that now?
17:58:35Soul-SlayerOr is it a question of preference?
17:58:44LloreanIt's a matter of what you want from a device
17:58:50LloreanYou listed a large color screen and high capacity
17:59:10 Quit datachild (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:59:11linuxstbThe Gigabeat has a much faster processor, so is capable of more things - e.g. video playback, playing games like rockboy and pacbox at the same time as listening to music.
17:59:17markunSoul-Slayer: the Gigabeat doesn't have recording or FM radio
17:59:27Soul-SlayerYes, that's important, I currently have a 6gb H10, which has neither of those.
17:59:28LloreanThe Gigabeat also has twice the display area (in pixels) of the H300
17:59:35Soul-SlayerThat's fine, I have my H10 for recording and radio
17:59:49Soul-SlayerInteresting.
18:00
18:00:07Topy44PHEW! i just thought i lost a screw
18:00:38Soul-SlayerWhat about chances of 'bricking' a player whilst putting rockbox on? Do either players require flashing?
18:01:15linuxstbThe h300 requires flashing, but afaik, no-one has ever bricked one with Rockbox.
18:01:30LloreanWith the Gigabeat, they're fairly safe. If you do something wrong, they're recoverable, though it requires opening them and disconnecting the disk as a step, but you shouldn't ever get to that point
18:01:44LloreanAs long as you follow the instructions it's just a file copy
18:01:57Soul-SlayerOkay, great :)
18:02:07*Topy44 likes his basicly un-brickable x5 :)
18:02:10Soul-SlayerTime to hunt ebay for F series Gigabeats then :p.
18:03:02Soul-SlayerOh yes, one more issue, battery life
18:03:04linuxstbSoul-Slayer: I think around $100 USD is the going rate for an F40.
18:03:20linuxstbI think it's around 15-16h
18:03:39Soul-SlayerGreat :p I'm used to getting like 4 hours on my H10
18:04:38Soul-SlayerSo that would be around £50? That's very cheap :o
18:05:29Soul-SlayerOh wow, you were right, ebay is swarmed with F40s, lol
18:06:25linuxstbA US store was selling them new for $99 a couple of weeks ago...
18:06:42Topy44so, my x5 and md220 are back in one bit again
18:07:06Soul-SlayerI'll check a few electrical stores aswell as ebay then
18:07:51linuxstbThey sold out in about 24 hours.
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18:08:43Soul-SlayerYouch... That popular?
18:09:59LloreanWell the price before then was US130-180 for a new one
18:10:08LloreanSo 99 was pretty good
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18:23:27Topy44umh... is there a propper carrying bag for the X5L?
18:23:37Topy44one that has a hole for the subpack connector
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18:33:14nikkydHi all .. I wanna know if I will be able to pass lock an ATA HDD by atapwd ?
18:33:25 Join vertic23 [0] (n=email@dslb-084-057-236-110.pools.arcor-ip.net)
18:33:25 Nick vertic23 is now known as _vertic23 (n=email@dslb-084-057-236-110.pools.arcor-ip.net)
18:33:25 Nick _vertic23 is now known as vertic23 (n=email@dslb-084-057-236-110.pools.arcor-ip.net)
18:33:35nikkydIs it possible?
18:33:38vertic23hi
18:33:42nikkydHI
18:33:59vertic23I am looking for new headphones - my broke today
18:34:09nikkydIs it possible to passlock an ATA HDD by atapswd?
18:34:22vertic23anyone got a suggestion?
18:34:33Topy44vertic23, koss the plug
18:34:43Topy44(NOT "the spark", the new version, they suck)
18:34:56Topy44and mod them (close the vent holes with glue or tape)
18:34:58vertic23http://www.amazon.de/Koss-Audio-Video-Eletronics-156407/dp/B00001P4XA
18:35:07LloreanThis channel isn't really appropriate for headphones discussion
18:35:13LloreanTry perhaps the Head-fi forums.
18:35:17vertic23thanks Llorean for telling
18:35:27nikkydPlease help me ?
18:35:38Lloreannikkyd: Nobody knows.
18:35:45LloreanAt least, nobody here right now
18:35:46Topy44vertic23, for the price, they are the best you can get. if you want something better, you will have to spend a LOT more money
18:36:00Topy44but unmodded, they sound terribly muddy
18:36:00vertic23can't believe that :P
18:36:02LloreanIt's an old tool, and you're asking if it can be used for a purpose other than what it's used for in relation to Rockbox.
18:36:10vertic23well my Sony that broke were about 25
18:36:14LloreanTopy44: As I said, this is not an appropriate channel
18:36:15vertic23or was it 50?
18:36:16LloreanPlease take it to PMs
18:36:18nikkydWhy .. so .. afterall it is there on your pass?
18:36:24Topy44Llorean, sorry
18:36:25nikkyd:O
18:36:28vertic23Llorean you got a better channel?
18:36:33nikkydI am really taken aback
18:36:41Lloreanvertic23: This is #Rockbox, it's for discussion of the Rockbox firmware.
18:36:45 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
18:36:55nikkydIs there any new tool to do these?
18:37:02Lloreannikkyd: That page was last modified 4 years ago
18:37:06nikkyd:O
18:37:08Lloreannikkyd: And that tool is for removing a password.
18:37:17nikkydIS there any new tool ... yes..
18:37:26nikkydI wanna assign pass
18:37:27nikkydSo?
18:37:34LloreanSo, your question has nothing to do with Rockobx
18:37:46vertic23exactly - please leave nikkyd
18:37:49nikkydI want to pass protect an ATA HDD ... but can you please help me .. please ..
18:37:53vertic23no!
18:37:54nikkydOkey
18:37:57vertic23this is rockbox chat
18:37:59nikkyd:(
18:38:02vertic23don't you get it?
18:38:03nikkydBYeee
18:38:08vertic23faster!
18:38:10nikkydYeah ... okey
18:38:13nikkyd:D
18:38:15nikkydHa ha
18:38:16Lloreanvertic23: Seriously, lighten up
18:38:17nikkydFuny
18:38:19vertic23still there
18:38:22nikkydFaster .. :P
18:38:24nikkyd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
18:38:29nikkydThats not a good manner
18:38:31nikkydlol
18:38:33vertic23indeed
18:38:39nikkydlofl
18:38:41vertic23we don't talk about rockbox - pls stfu
18:38:43Topy44(moments where this channels could use operators...)
18:38:49Topy44-s
18:39:02nikkydHa ha .. okey guys and gals
18:39:06nikkydHave a nice time
18:39:07nikkydByeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
18:39:17nikkydN00b w00t
18:39:25nikkydHA hah
18:39:29nikkydlol
18:39:33vertic23stfu
18:39:41nikkydw00tty n00bs
18:40:15nikkydla la
18:40:35nikkydfew w00tty n00bs here .. lol .. they even dont know good manners .. lol
18:40:44Lloreannikkyd: Clearly you're one of them
18:40:48nikkyd:P
18:40:53nikkydHa ha .. not realy
18:40:55nikkydYou know why
18:40:56Lloreannikkyd: You neither read the channel guidelines nor seem to respect them
18:41:06nikkydWAo .. bao to all of you
18:41:09nikkyd:P
18:41:14nikkydRESPECT .. lol
18:41:44nikkydwell .... have a nice time and dont need to wave the sword of administration .. lol
18:41:45nikkydHa ha ha
18:41:50nikkydbyeeeeeeeee n00bs
18:41:55nikkyd:P
18:42:14Topy44hm... i have an idea for a workaround for my harddisk access noise problem... rockbox COULD try to do the writes during peaks where the noise would be inaudible
18:42:25 Quit nikkyd ("ChatZilla 0.9.78 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]")
18:42:31Topy44that would be a lot of work for such a speciality feature though :)
18:42:55LloreanTopy44: Is there noise on line-in recordings?
18:42:58Topy44yes
18:43:03Topy44during hd write
18:43:33 Part Llorean
18:43:50Topy44i took apart my x5 and did a lot of testing, its clearly not coming from bad shielding, probably its due to bad grounding or meaby the signal line is simply going to close the data lines on the pcb...
18:44:06Topy44but since you are not here i dont know why exactly i'm telling you this.
18:44:06Topy44:)
18:45:14vertic23I am interested
18:45:20vertic23beacause I have a X5V
18:45:45Topy44aah
18:45:47Topy44well:
18:46:03Topy44i took the x5 apart and did a LOT of testing around... and nothing influenced the noise
18:46:15Topy44could you do me a favor?
18:46:30vertic23...first tell
18:46:32vertic23then I decide hehe
18:46:33Topy44start rockbox, set to uncompressed wave
18:46:37Topy44go into recording mode
18:46:40vertic23ok
18:46:54Topy44set gain to maximum
18:47:06Topy44(set source to line in before of course)
18:47:18Topy44record until the file is at least about 12mb
18:47:41Topy44that should take quite exactly one minute
18:47:57Topy44it buffers about 10-11mb before writing
18:48:03vertic2320 db?`
18:48:05vertic23gain
18:48:38Topy44uh?
18:48:43Topy44i cant go above 12db
18:48:51Topy44did you set source to line in?
18:48:54vertic23nop
18:48:56vertic23now+
18:49:10pixelmathat's the internal mic gain setting...
18:49:14vertic23volume?
18:49:18Topy44doesnt matter
18:49:41vertic23do I need to plug some line-in in?
18:49:43vertic23:P
18:49:48vertic23or just record
18:49:50Topy44nope, just record silence
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18:50:07vertic23ok I am on the way
18:50:11Topy44ok
18:50:56Topy44did you set it to uncompressed? mp3 or similar will take forever to fill up the buffer :)
18:51:02vertic23hehe
18:51:06vertic23I saw the hdd writings
18:51:11Topy44ah ok :)
18:51:12vertic23there was noise
18:51:20vertic23at about 10 mb
18:51:23Topy44exactly
18:51:29Topy44do you have a wave editor?
18:51:32vertic23yes
18:51:45Topy44could you just cut out the noisy part and send it to me?
18:52:11Topy44it has to be an uncompressed wave though, mp3 would probably just silence it out
18:52:28Topy44but it should compress fine with zip or rar
18:53:15Topy44i want to compare it to the noise my x5l recorded, especially the exact volume of it... i wonder if there are big variations between units or if its always the same
18:53:20vertic23hmm
18:53:29vertic23I don't see any peaks in my waveeditor
18:53:30Topy44the first would mean that it might be possible to improve
18:53:37Topy44you wouldnt, they are to faint
18:53:44vertic23lol...
18:53:54vertic23but it was like at the beginning some "szzSHHSZzmmm"
18:53:54 Quit lowlight ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
18:54:02vertic23I can send you that
18:54:14Topy44at the beginning? no, it should be at 10mb
18:54:25Topy44if you dont mind, just send me the whole file
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18:55:04Topy44(zip it or so before)
18:55:44vertic23oh, lol... 15 mb compressed to 3
18:55:56 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
18:55:58vertic23Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )
18:56:06vertic23ah ok.. right - but DCC may work ^^
18:56:07Topy44yes, dcc wont work
18:56:09Topy44ah ok
18:56:11Topy44try
18:56:14vertic23I don't know hehe
18:56:15 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
18:56:20vertic23doesnot seem to work though hehe
18:56:22pixelmaI bet that was the sound of the hd spinning up since he recorded from internal mic (most probably)
18:56:23vertic23I am triying
18:57:08Topy44try http://uldl.t44.org/
18:59:55 Quit Guile (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:00
19:02:20Topy44still thinking... it might be possible to do something like... "if average signal strength was above X db for the last X ms, and write buffer is more then X mb full, write out NOW"
19:02:35Topy44so if possible, it would move writes into loud parts
19:03:12vertic23http://uldl.t44.org/dl.php?id=77972999
19:03:18Topy44thanks
19:04:15vertic23hmm if you are able to code this - without having to much cpu % etc.
19:05:41Topy44i might try it
19:06:24Topy44so, just analysed your recording... its basicly the same as mine... even though it has slightly different characteristics, meaby you have a different HD model in yours or something
19:06:28 Quit Soul-Slayer ("Leaving.")
19:06:38Topy44but its exactly the same volume
19:06:38Topy44SO
19:06:45Topy44i'd guess its the same on all units.
19:06:54Topy44(bleh)
19:07:08Topy44ok, we'll have to get around it with software
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19:07:42vertic23hehe
19:07:56vertic23this actually really sucks indeed
19:07:59vertic23I never thought about it
19:08:08vertic23have you tried it with the original firmware already?
19:08:10vertic23same thing?
19:10:10Topy44yes
19:10:14Topy44its a hardware problem
19:10:33Topy44i just hadnt noticed it with the OF because it obviously writes much less often
19:10:38Topy44(because it records mp3 only)
19:11:08vertic23...what about mp3 though?
19:11:14Topy44hm?
19:11:17vertic23I mean.. the audiophile always want BEST quality
19:11:29vertic23btw ...can you edit the presets?
19:11:38Topy44what are you talking about?
19:11:41vertic23like -V0 −−new-preset
19:11:47vertic23lame
19:12:03vertic23I think that mp3 would be enough - am I wrong?
19:12:05Topy44i dont understand what you are trying to tell me :)
19:12:10Topy44no its not
19:12:19Topy44since i am using it to record live material
19:12:25Topy44which is heavily treated afterwards
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19:12:32vertic23treated?
19:12:33vertic23like how
19:12:35 Quit GodEater__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:12:39vertic23edited?
19:12:41Topy44so the mp3 artifacts get much more present
19:12:48vertic23okay
19:12:52Topy44edited, yes, but a lot of eq-ing and so on
19:13:11vertic23ok, I understand you
19:13:13Topy44dynamic treatment, normalisazion, ...
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19:13:27Topy44mp3 works by leaving out stuff you dont usually hear anyway
19:13:34Topy44but if you amplify and twist around the signal
19:13:35vertic23yeah
19:13:42vertic23I gotcha
19:13:52Topy44you get to hear the parts that the mp3 encoder considered "neglectable"
19:14:13vertic23but... in case you only want to "rip" a cd
19:14:26vertic23mp3 is "ok", right?
19:14:41Topy44then, of course, recording directly to mp3 is fine, even though the internal encoder is probably not the same quality as a properly set up lameenc
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19:14:42vertic23I mean.. you plugin a CD-Player - record ...
19:14:50Topy44but why would you do that?
19:14:52vertic23it is not lame used?
19:14:57vertic23is it possible to use lame though?
19:15:08amiconnnope
19:15:25vertic23should be
19:15:45amiconnlame is a very high quality encoder not suitable for realtime operation
19:16:00Topy44its faster, easier and better quality to rip a cd on the computer and transfer the finished mp3s to the player, there wouldnt be many occasions where you'd actually want to record from a cd to your x5...
19:16:11amiconnrockbox' mp3 encoder is based on the shine encoder
19:16:21Topy44the cpu of the x5 and most other targets wouldnt be anywhere fast enough for lame probably
19:16:28amiconncorrect
19:16:28Topy44+near
19:16:33vertic23true
19:16:45vertic23maybe in some years then
19:16:48Topy44still, for most people, the quality is good enough
19:16:48vertic23:P
19:16:53vertic23okay
19:17:01***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:17:07Topy44in some years, we wont be using mp3, we'll all just use lossless compression formats...
19:17:12amiconnMy estimation is that lame -preset standard would take 10..20x the playtime of the encoded file on the x5 cpu
19:17:19vertic23true
19:17:21Topy44since we all carry around DAPs with 4tb memory :)
19:17:25amiconnI.e. encoding a 3 minute track would take 30..60 minutes
19:17:26vertic23indeed
19:17:44vertic23would suck :P
19:17:51vertic23could use my laptop then
19:18:01Topy44umh, you are missing the point
19:18:08 Quit bospaadje ("great minds run in great circles")
19:18:27Topy44ah, sorry, I am missing the point, i thought you were talking about my vision of 4tb DAPs :)
19:18:37vertic23hehe
19:18:51vertic23tell me more about those DAPs
19:18:55vertic23how do they look
19:19:09vertic23do they have a chip with rockbox maybe?
19:19:26Topy44probably they are implanted into your brain stem.
19:19:44Topy44and use your brain for storage
19:19:51vertic23like in that movie
19:19:52vertic23right?
19:19:57vertic23with keanur reaves
19:21:35Topy44you loose control over your left arm and the ability to do additions in your head, but hey, who needs that if you can have a DAP playing music directly OUT of your memory INTO your memory! :)
19:22:06vertic23hmm
19:22:21Topy44ANYWAY, lets get a little more serious.
19:22:26vertic23there is a superfluent "transfer" imho
19:22:32vertic23hehe
19:22:45Topy44i'll start reading myself into the rockbox code tonight
19:22:49vertic23ok
19:23:07Topy44and will see if its doable without to much trouble to sync hd writes to audio peaks...
19:23:21vertic23alright
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19:34:33myrkxcan anyone help with some rockbox install problems?
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19:40:14Topy44what platform?
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19:41:58myrkxiPod video 30gig
19:43:25myrkxit talks, but seems to be saying a different menu than the one I'm on
19:44:10myrkxinitial menu just says time and exit till you switch menus
19:46:01Topy44sry, i dont know about any non-cowon players :)
19:46:15Topy44EEH, SORRY i meant *remembers channel rules* :)
19:46:34myrkxok, thanks anyway, trying to set it up for a blind user
19:46:36Lloreanmyrkx: This usually means you're using an outdated voice file.
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19:47:12myrkxI downloaded the Reed file from the Rockbox site
19:47:38LloreanThe one dates 06 Feb 2006?
19:47:48myrkxlet me check
19:47:54LloreanOr the 07 Mar 07?
19:48:04LloreanBoth of those are outdated anyway
19:48:40Topy44hm... are the voice files "generated" with some speech engine or did a real person record them?
19:48:52LloreanThey can be created either way
19:48:59Topy44i ment the available ones
19:49:10LloreanDepends on what people post to that page.
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19:49:14myrkxso, can I just put another one in the languages folder to fix it?
19:49:25Lloreanmyrkx: If you can find an up to date one, yeah
19:49:35Topy44because i happen to know a girl who has done voice computer recordings professionally
19:49:54Topy44(as in, she records stuff to be used in telephone computers and such stuff)
19:50:03myrkxLlorean: should be one on the rockbox site?
19:50:04Topy44she has a very clear, pleasant voice
19:50:12Topy44so i could probably do such recordings
19:50:14Lloreanmyrkx: Only if someone has posted a recent one.
19:50:28Topy44(i have a little audio homestudio)
19:51:42myrkxLlorean: April 7, 2007 is there
19:52:42Lloreanmyrkx: Try it and see, it should be better at least
19:54:13myrkxLlorean: thanks
20:00
20:06:42Nico_PLear ?
20:06:49Topy44hm... alright... audition CAN clean out the noise quite effectively, but it also gets rid of some brilliance
20:07:19Topy44so, i'd need a way to detect the noisy parts automaticly...
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20:07:32Topy44oh well, whatever
20:10:22Topy44funny, the x5 actually records less noisy and better quality then my soundcard :)
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20:13:35myrkxLlorean: that worked, thanks a lot :)
20:15:01Topy44now starting to use the x5 to transfer my old MDs to the computer
20:15:22Topy44(i have like 130 MDs full of live recordings here that need to be transfered...)
20:17:25 Quit bospaadje ("great minds run in great circles")
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20:20:12Topy44i am thinking to cut off the plug from the x5 power supply and fixing a subpack connector directly to it
20:20:17Topy44same thing for a usb cable
20:20:24Topy44so i would not need to use the subpack anymore at all
20:20:39Topy44but i could not use for example line out and power supply at once anymore
20:22:21Topy44ah btw, noone answered yet:
20:22:38Topy44what should i set the input gain of the x5 to when recording with an external preamp?
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20:22:55Topy44since i am regulating the input signal from the preamp
20:23:00Topy440db?
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20:23:49Topy44i have a strange problem with that, if i turn up the preamp output (not its gain!) as far that i get close to optimum gain on the x5 i get a lot of distortion... could it be that 0db really isnt 0db?
20:24:12Topy44i have the feeling i am overdriving the input stage of the x5 very easily
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20:25:04Topy44how exactly does the gain control on the x5 work? is it REAL gain? as in, is it really the amount the input signal gets attenuated or boosted BEFORE the dac?
20:25:33Topy44or meaby it never boosts, only attenuates, so the max gain setting is actually 0db?
20:30:55pixelmaNico_P: minor quirk with the rwps backdrop support: when I load a main wps separately the backdrop of the rwps gets cleared - not a big problem as it works again when loading the rwps again afterwards
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20:31:50Nico_Ppixelma: OK, I'll have a look
20:32:07myrkxhow do you stop a song without losing the menu voice?
20:32:57LloreanYou should have menu voices if you actually stop the song, rather than pause it, I believe
20:36:33pixelmaNico_P: btw. setting the remote backlight to stay always "on" works here in the sim
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20:39:16myrkxLlorean: so which button stops it? none that I can find, just pause
20:40:36Lloreanmyrkx: What player do you have?
20:41:00LloreanAh, iPod, (scrolled up)\
20:41:06LloreanHold down Play/Pause for 2 seconds or so
20:41:09LloreanNot too long or it shuts off
20:44:42Learnico_p: yes
20:45:23Nico_PLear: have you seen my forum post ?
20:45:40LearProbably not the latest one... One sec.
20:46:10LearWell, the file is played at 44 kHz...
20:46:46LearAnd Foobar says the same; the file is upsampled by the decoder, after all.
20:46:53Nico_Pok
20:47:06Nico_Pand about your PM: I don't even know what SBR files are
20:47:52LearThe file you sent is one. A way to make AAC sound better at low bitrates.
20:48:04LloreanIt's part of what's commonly called HE-AAC
20:48:16Nico_Pwell it does play realtim on the gigabeat
20:48:55LearSuch files are not realtime on an H140...
20:51:12myrkxis there any way to have the song titles read, rather than spelled, without having to make an individual wav file for each?
20:51:22LloreanNot at this time, no.
20:51:28LloreanThere is no text-to-speech engine in Rockbox.
20:51:45LloreanBut they'd be individual mp3 files for each, not wav files
20:52:00myrkxwe are trying to set these up for blind children in quantity
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20:55:33myrkxI wonder if we could get Freedomscientific to integrate a voice synthesiser?
20:56:18LloreanRight now there are a few people working on real text to speech.
20:56:26myrkxcool
20:56:56 Quit vertic23 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:57:18LloreanBut considering the fact that Freedomscientific _sells_ their software, I find it rather unlikely they'd want to get involved.
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20:58:21myrkxnever hurts to ask, but if you are working on it, why worry :)
20:58:48LloreanI'm not working on it, and there's no guarantee either of the people who are will finish it, though there are high hopes
20:59:07LloreanBut Rockbox is under the GPL license, meaning any text to speech support would have to be released under it as well
20:59:20myrkxabsolutely
20:59:48Hammer89does anyone know how to set the a-b points for the a-b repeat function in rockbox on the sansa e200?
21:00
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21:07:40 Join Rob24 [0] (i=1839489d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-888a9e00f86d8051)
21:09:09Rob24Some time when i play roms on my ipod 5th gen video, some roms r slow and slugish and some arnt, is there any way to finx this?
21:10:20LloreanBuy a faster MP3 player.
21:10:49Rob24..is there a free way to fix this?
21:11:01LloreanDo you know ARM assembly?
21:11:10Rob24no
21:11:20LloreanThen no, not for you, until someone else optimizes the code.
21:11:27Rob24ic kk
21:14:16 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
21:16:14Rob24Is there any way to get a form of dance dance revolution on rock box?
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21:16:26dionoeathat'd be fun
21:16:30 Part norbusan
21:16:31Rob24very
21:16:47dionoeadoes any open source version of the game exist?
21:16:57Rob24but like there are dance dance revolution games for gbc but on the ipod they r so sluggish
21:17:04***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:17:12Rob24well is there a way to change ste mania?
21:17:21Rob24*step
21:17:30dionoeamania?
21:17:45EbErTheh, that would work with the scroll wheel pretty well
21:17:46Rob24http://www.stepmania.com/
21:17:51Rob24yah
21:18:33dionoeado they have key sequence definitions on that website ?
21:18:41Rob24imagin zepher on challange at your finder tips
21:18:48Rob24Maybe
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21:19:34Rob24like in step mania you can change the keys maybe there is way to change it without having it loaded
21:19:41dionoeahum, sounds like it could kind of work ( http://www.stepmania.com/wiki/Create_and_Share ). I'll see what those .sm look like
21:19:51Rob24but the 4 arrows keys r the dfault set up
21:19:58luiz_flsbye
21:20:24 Quit luiz_fls ("CyberScript - A diferena entre uma loira burra e uma inteligente que a inteligente usa CyberScript. (www.cybers")
21:23:10dionoeaHum, should be easy to load those .sm files using a rockbox plugin. I might give it a try.
21:23:56Rob24well if any one can get step mani working with ipod i would apreachiatit if you could email me at robertlaliberte24@ hotmail.com because right now i got to go to work, so c yah guys later
21:24:13Rob24bye
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21:34:52darkbutterflyany body use a sansa e200 with rockbox
21:36:45mutantpineappleis the rockboy plugin at all usable on an x5?
21:38:02 Part toffe82
21:44:21linuxstbAny ARM gurus around to tell me what I've done wrong here? http://www.pastebin.ca/459934 (the C code I'm trying to write in assembler is in the #else)
21:44:57 Join arj [0] (n=arj@213.237.55.231.adsl.abc.worldonline.dk)
21:45:41arjI get data abort when trying to play music using the latest nightly snapshot on my ipod nano 1g
21:46:07arjis that a know problem?
21:46:10arj+n
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21:49:57 Join Reno [0] (i=cf3fdb02@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f1d8f3214b73b846)
21:50:30Renohey guy's i'm back and i got a question.
21:50:42Renocan i out coputer games on rockbox?
21:51:01Renoand....can i make the nubers on the calculator bigger?
21:51:09mutantpineappleif the computer game is doom :p
21:51:19pixelmaarj: how old was the build you used before?
21:51:33Renoisthe build? what do u mean?
21:51:49arjabout two months
21:52:00arjI tried a build about a month ago with the same problem
21:52:07arjperhaps older
21:52:13Renooh nevermind...
21:52:30Renoso can imake the numbers on the rockbox calculator bigger?
21:52:54pixelmaarj: there was a change recently to the bootloader - you have to update the bootloader too
21:53:13arjok thx
21:54:07 Quit Reno (Client Quit)
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21:54:46Renosoorr i logged of by accident...
21:54:58arjwee
21:55:01arjworks now
21:55:04arjthanks a ot pixelma
21:55:08Learlinuxstb: not an arm guru, but the array offsets doesn't match up to me...
21:55:16Renoso can i make the nubers for thr=e rockbox calculator bigger?
21:55:31arjnice new boot logo :-)
21:55:33pixelmayou're welcome
21:56:07LearBut then I don't know the difference of ldmdb and ldmia. :)
21:56:43Renocan anybody please help me if their not busy and if i can make them bigger?
21:57:09linuxstbLear: "db" is decrement before, and "ia" is increment after. Which I understand to mean that it would decrement the source register by 16, then do the read from memory.
21:57:22peturReno: not easily...
21:57:34Renooh...but can i do that?
21:57:49LearAh, like -(ax)/(ay)+ on coldfire...
21:57:54linuxstbLear: So (in theory), r3 contains x[-3], r4 contains x[-2]. r5 contains x[-1] and r6 contains x[0]
21:58:02linuxstbLear: I don't know Coldfire at all.
21:58:39Renoif i can make them bigger i would appreciate it if you could tell me how to do that?
21:58:49Reno; )
21:58:51peturReno: you'd need the ability to load two fonts (iirc there's a patch for that)
21:59:15Renooh really where can i get that patch?
21:59:26peturand I don't know how well that patch works with plugins as it was made for wps I think
21:59:30darkbutterflyany body wana do a Ubuntu theme for Rockbox sansa
21:59:35Learlinuxstb: btw, you know where I can find a good arm reference? Could be fun to have, but I haven't found anything good yet...
21:59:51Renoi guess it's worth a try though!
21:59:54Reno: )
21:59:54mutantpineappleubuntu theme??
22:00
22:00:05mutantpineappleoh no...
22:00:07linuxstbLear: I think I need one myself... All I've got is the ARM quick reference guide which has a summary of all the instructions.
22:00:25LearYep, found that one...
22:00:26darkbutterflylol
22:00:26peturReno: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4733
22:00:34Renook thank you.
22:01:23darkbutterflyhow soon for a total workable Rockbox on the Sansa e200
22:01:41Renooh i almost forgot.....is there a way i can copy the rockbox manual to my ipod and read it there that way i dont have to print it out or read it on my pc???? : )
22:01:44linuxstbdarkbutterfly: People work on it as a hobby in their spare time, so it's impossible to say.
22:01:46mutantpineapplethe only way you could make rockbox look like ubuntu is by porting beryl to it
22:02:16arj:D
22:02:24peturReno: no, but you'r free to port an html engine to rockbox ;)
22:02:44linuxstbYou could always make Ubuntu look like Rockbox...
22:02:59darkbutterflyright no prob
22:03:06Renooh okay thank you anyway's!
22:03:10darkbutterflywish I could program
22:03:16*petur looks at his xubuntu in a VM and shakes head
22:04:01Learlinuxstb: tried "x + 1" as %1?
22:04:15preglowLear, linuxstb: the arm arm doc is good
22:04:20preglowbut i assume you have that too
22:05:14Renoif i want to know how to use that oatch deos it tell me how to use it in the manual???? what part is it? is it in the plugins part?
22:05:40linuxstbpreglow: I did have it, but can't find it now...
22:05:49preglowhttp://www.altera.com/literature/third-party/ddi0100e_arm_arm.pdf
22:06:48peturReno: I feel this will be a bit over your head... start reading here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DocsIndex#For_Developers
22:07:46 Quit Reno ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:08:07linuxstbLear: Ah, x-1 worked...
22:08:16 Join web-taz [0] (n=taz@p5081890a.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
22:08:28Lear-? Not +?
22:08:45XavierGrlol petur you scared him with that link! :P
22:09:13peturhehe - I think it was nothing for him anyway
22:09:34XavierGr[22:49] <Reno> can i out coputer games on rockbox? <- that phrase concludes everything :)
22:11:31*mutantpineapple still wonders if outting coputer games on rockbox is possible :|
22:11:57 Join fm2 [0] (i=95e13c3c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e3b77c1c91fad3a5)
22:12:14preglowwe ask ourselves the very same question every day ://
22:12:38fm2markun: here?
22:12:40preglow< preglow> anyone fixed being able to out coputer games yet?
22:12:44preglow< petur> i don't know!!!!!11
22:13:12peturfrrrrr
22:13:57*Bagder giggles
22:14:28 Quit darkbutterfly ("Ex-Chat")
22:15:31fm2Hm... I seem to never cross markun
22:16:04linuxstbLear: Sorry, yes x+1
22:16:17mutantpineapplemaybe we should port cygwin to rockbox as well?
22:16:45Bagdermutantpineapple: first port wine so that we have something to run cygwin on
22:16:47mutantpineappleso it would be rockbox running windows running linux
22:17:10Bagdercygwin is not linux
22:17:12preglowdon't forget that rockbox IS linux
22:17:16preglowit's just another distro
22:17:26BagderI can see preglow is in that special mood today ;-)
22:17:46 Quit z35_1 (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
22:17:49*petur suspects beer is to balme
22:17:55peturblame even
22:17:59*preglow flings pies at people
22:18:10preglowi was planning on having one, actually
22:18:11mutantpineappleit isn't linux... i don't see rms hding behind anything
22:18:13preglowbut discovered i have none :/
22:18:21 Part arj
22:18:29mutantpineapplenormally he's under the coats
22:18:33preglow< rms> it's gnu/rockbox, goddamnit!
22:18:39mutantpineapple:D
22:18:40Bagderhaha
22:19:45mutantpineappleis there a gnubuntu yet?
22:21:20mutantpineapplethere seems to be every other possible "derivative"
22:21:54mutantpineapplei say "derivative" but the only actual difference is the packages installed by default and the included wallpaper
22:22:11 Part fm2 ("Again no markun here. Damn!..")
22:22:23preglowthere's the distro with the name that sounds like "nuisance" which only bundles free-free stuff
22:22:28Nico_Pmutantpineapple: if you mean a totally free ubuntu, there is gnewsense
22:22:28preglowand that's ubuntu derivated
22:22:37preglowthat
22:22:40mutantpineapplewow...
22:22:49Nico_Pand the next release will have a totally free version
22:23:02mutantpineapplewell i guess now that ubuntu christian edition has hit the shelves, we now have absolute saturation
22:23:49Nico_Pwhy not rockbuntu ? :)
22:24:08Nico_Pwith rockbox yellow as a wallpaper
22:24:30preglowahh, yes, the stock ubuntu is totally unsuited to christians, so this is a good initiative
22:24:46preglowwhat with the satanic wallpapers and startup jingle performed by darkthrone
22:24:49*petur mutters beeruntu
22:24:56mutantpineappleand doom running at 160x120
22:25:14mutantpineapplepreglow: not a fish sticker in sight
22:26:18mutantpineappleand the fsck has been renamed f*ck so as to avoid offending
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22:27:47preglowhahahah
22:28:39preglowwell, at least ubuntu satanic edition seems to have its followers too
22:28:42preglowso at least there is balance
22:29:05*mutantpineapple googles
22:29:11mutantpineapplehaha, fiery spawn...
22:31:37preglowUbuntu Surly Satan
22:31:47preglowUbuntu Jolly Jesus
22:31:53preglowthese might still end up as official releases!
22:32:07preglownow, for dish-wahsing
22:32:09mutantpineappleyou can imagine the flame wars
22:32:12preglowwashing too
22:32:12mutantpineappleenjoy
22:32:43Nico_Ppixelma: I fixed the bug you reported earlier about RWPS backdrops
22:32:44preglowas a rule i don't, but there's always hope
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22:48:30miner49erhello
22:50:02 Quit myrkx ()
22:51:53Nico_Pminer49er: hi
22:52:57pixelmaNico_P: nice, thanks :)
22:53:20 Quit amiconn (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
22:53:20 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
22:53:40Nico_Ppixelma: I can't leave this sort of bug in the code, even though quite minor :)
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22:55:22*amiconn wonders whether we need to introduce HAVE_LCD one day...
22:55:55Nico_Pamiconn: for the iAudio player that only has a remote ?
22:56:07Nico_Pthe M3, is that it ?
22:56:53amiconnyes, that's the one. But perhaps not even the one that needs such a define, if we make the remote the main display for it
22:57:26miner49erCan anyone tell me how to run the buildzip.pl script please? I haven't dissected the script itself yet...
22:57:31amiconnBut there might be others without any lcd (e.g. the shuffle - I know the 1st gen shuffle isn't supported by gcc or other open source compilers)
22:57:38linuxstbminer49er: Just type "make zip"
22:57:49preglowneither the second gen
22:57:52miner49eroh right, cheers
22:57:54preglowthey're both 56k based, afaik
22:58:14preglowrockbox would need to be pretty stripped down for such a player
22:58:19linuxstbSomeone said the other day that the 2nd gen Shuffle has the same ARM chip as the 2nd gen Nano.
22:58:27amiconnNico_P: I am just wondering because of the #if defined(HAVE_REMOTE_LCD) && (LCD_REMOTE_DEPTH > 1) stuff
22:58:27preglowreally now
22:58:41amiconnIt's not symmetric to the checks for main lcd
22:58:46Nico_Pamiconn: I can hardly imagine how rockbox would be usable on a device without a display
22:58:56amiconnVoice UI?
22:59:02linuxstbpreglow: If that's true, then I'm sure it has the same encryption...
22:59:04Nico_Pwhy not
22:59:13amiconnAnd some beeps...
22:59:37Nico_Pamiconn: yeah... btw, how do you find that define ? appropriate ? bloated ?
22:59:51amiconnIt's required
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23:00
23:00:28amiconnYou can't just use #if LCD_REMOTE_DEPTH > 2 because of -wundef
23:02:07amiconn(and the full thing is clearer albeit longish)
23:02:53Nico_Pyeah I was afraid people would find it a bit long but couldn't find a simpler wat to put it
23:03:20Nico_Pmaybe we could replace it by something like HAVE_BACKDROPS ?
23:05:01*Nico_P is studying java for an exam tomorrow :'(
23:05:07preglowjava ://
23:06:42Nico_PI quite like OOP, but I think I prefer .NET over java... never tried C++
23:07:12Nico_PI used to enjoy programming in VB .NET when I was a bit younger :)
23:07:40preglowoop is ok
23:07:46preglowjava is annoying, though
23:07:49preglowc# beats it nicely
23:07:59preglowc++ is annoying too, but better than java
23:08:58peturc++ code can be nice - depends on the programmer. some people manage to make a mess of it ;)
23:09:55Nico_PWhen I get the time I'd like to learn a bit of Qt and KDE programming, that must be quite fun
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23:13:49miner49erhow can I determine the length of a file with the rockbox API?
23:15:52 Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out)
23:17:09***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:17:23miner49er never mind
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23:30:33*davina is away: folding proteins and sleeping
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23:36:46miner49erAnyone any idea why the plugin I've built complains about being the wrong model? It builds but it's 0k in length
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23:41:19*ender` yawns
23:41:49miner49eroh, like that is it?
23:42:31miner49erforget it
23:43:39miner49erfigured it out...stoopid me duur
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23:52:24Rob24how would you go about putting step mania onto rock box?
23:52:41hihohelp! can someone tell me how to turn off power on an ipod? (stock FW)
23:53:21MrSomeoneHold down the play/pause button for a few seconds
23:53:31Rob24hold down center button and menue for like 10 seconds
23:53:37Rob24no wiat tahts restart
23:54:48amiconnThe of cannot be shut down afaik (don't have that anymore on my only ipod)
23:55:34Rob24say what?
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23:56:52Rob24how would one go about makking step mania advalible for rock box?
23:57:03Topy44haha
23:57:09Topy44umh...no? :)
23:57:36Topy44well, i guess on devices with 4 buttons for directions it might work
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23:58:01Topy44of course, the idea of interpreting the stepmenia files directly is interesting
23:58:19Rob24... How would i go about making step mania advalible for rock bock "IPOD" eddition
23:58:47Topy44what might be very cool is a new rhythm game for ipods and other "scroll wheel" devices
23:58:56Topy44para para paradise like

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