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#rockbox log for 2007-06-07

00:00:14 Part rift_
00:00:55 Join Nico_P [0] (
00:00:58 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
00:01:41Dwylocdionoea: I also love the interface of jewels on the nano and video so please don’t change it. I have spent many hours playing while listening to my music it and it feels very intuitive.
00:02:53dionoeaDoesn't the scrollwheel bother you ? (I wasn't planing on changing it :p)
00:03:08LloreanThe scrollwheel doesn't do anything in Jewels, I thought...
00:03:18dionoeaIt moves in one of the directions
00:03:18*Llorean hasn't picked up his Nano in some time, though
00:03:22dionoealike the cursor keys
00:03:26DwylocNo i use the scrolllwheel and it works very well
00:03:35LloreanI always used the buttons, I guess.
00:05:00DwylocI use the buttons as well as the wheel. THe wheel to go left and right and the buttons to go up and down
00:07:03Dwylocdionoea: anyway I have just tested star on the nano and it still locks up strate after selecting play on the menu like before.
00:07:42dionoeaah ... I'll have a look tomorrow then. (Does it lockup in the sim too ?)
00:08:34Dwylocbut if you want to remove wheel support anyware could you remove it from brickmania as it makes it un playable on the nano ;)
00:08:38 Quit Tekrad ("[BX] It's not TV. It's BitchX.")
00:09:17DerPapstin jewels you can scrool through all jewels.
00:09:29dionoeaDwyloc: agreed
00:09:38DerPapstif you reach the end of one line it jumps in the next line.
00:09:48dionoeaTime to get some sleep. Good night.
00:09:53DerPapsti like this concept too
00:09:59DerPapstnight :)
00:10:07DwylocI don't thing star lockup on the sim but its been a long time since I tested (some time last year) so I may not be remebering right.
00:10:18Dwylocgood night
00:10:26DerPapstdoesn't lock up on ipod video sim here
00:10:35DerPapstnot tested on my ipod though
00:12:08DwylocDepPast: Yes I now about the scrolling through all jewels but I only use it on the same line.
00:12:45DwylocIt did not lockup on the video for me as I have played it quite a lot.
00:13:32 Join delorean90 [0] (
00:13:40 Quit paul_stead ()
00:13:53 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
00:14:30 Join Rob2222 [0] (
00:15:39delorean90llorean: if the OF surpasses rockbox battery life should i still run it on the OF till the battery dies just to be sure?
00:16:02LloreanWe KNOW that Rockbox gets less battery life than the OF
00:16:17LloreanWe're trying to determine if your battery is old enough that it's getting a decent amount less than it should, over all.
00:16:18 Quit linuxstb__ (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:16:34 Part TrueJournals
00:16:55delorean90oh ok i understad
00:25:46netmasta10btanyone know if the sansa fm can pick up aircraft ~131-138MHz ?
00:26:40 Quit secleinteer (Connection timed out)
00:26:57BagderI doubt it
00:27:11Bagderthe fm tuner chips often have a more narrow spectrum
00:29:27netmasta10btwould it be as easy as adding a 'aviation' region to the code and trying it let me know
00:30:55DerPapstgood night at all
00:31:00 Quit DerPapst ("So Long And Thanks For All The Fish!")
00:31:29 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:33:26 Part Llorean
00:33:53 Quit delorean90 ()
00:37:12 Quit petur ("zzz")
00:37:19jhMikeSnetmasta10bt: not a chance because it only tunes up to about 120MHz
00:39:41mpeccorinin1s: are you around?
00:41:04 Join Rob222241 [0] (
00:41:30 Quit ender` (" I remember being impressed with Ada because you could write an infinite loop without a faked up condition. The idea being th)
00:41:46 Quit ompaul ("Leaving")
00:43:07*pixelma finds an interesting bug in minesweeper - the info splash shows something like "You found 222 mines out of 43" (Video sim) :D
00:43:41 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:44:27*mpeccorini wonders if pixelma would take a look at his chessbox patch and get it commited. If she does, he might help with the bug in minesweeper :p
00:46:02 Join secleinteer [0] (
00:46:06linuxstb_DerPapst: (if you read the logs)
00:46:09 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
00:48:38 Join z35_1 [0] (
00:48:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:50:22Nico_Pany comments on the proposal in the WPS tokenizer forum thread about allowing semicolon followed by newline as a subline separator to make WPSs easier to read ?
00:50:38 Join Ikarus_ [0] (
00:50:49 Quit Ikarus (Remote closed the connection)
00:53:22pixelmampeccorini: well, I'm a bit carefull when it comes to comitting much code... Btw what player do you have?
00:53:35mpeccorinian iPod nano
00:53:47mpeccorinibut if the bug shows in the sim I can fix it anyway
00:54:39pixelmano, I asked because of a bugreport on chessbox which only was 100% valid as long as there was no menu...
00:55:25mpeccorinipixelma: I'm not sure if I understand. I added the menu to chessbox, is there a bug in that patch?
00:56:04pixelmayou couldn't restart in on the X5 or M5 but now you can through the menu. I asked the reporter if the menu does it or if he still wants to be able to restart it with a button but got no response
00:56:12 Quit z35 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:56:12 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:56:22pixelmajust wanted to know whether I can close it
00:56:48mpeccoriniI don't usually go through the bug reports, I was not aware
00:56:54mpeccoriniif you want I can fix it anyway
00:57:07pixelmano this bug is from before the menu
00:57:22pixelmathat would be something even I could do
00:57:42mpeccorinino reason for it not to work with the keymap, though. don't you think?
00:57:50pixelmaI'm just not sure if it's necessary
00:58:15mpeccoriniwhat do you mean by "even I could do"? are you not a developer?
00:58:41pixelmayes, there is a reason. On the X5/M5 there are only button combos with the power button possible (electrically)
00:59:24pixelmaI am a committer but wouldn't consider myself a developer - mostly doing graphics and manual stuff
00:59:43mpeccoriniaccording to the code you would have to press SELECT and PLAY simultaneously for the game to restart
00:59:51mpeccoriniI see
01:00:09mpeccoriniperhaps that would help the guy who posted the bug report
01:00:26mpeccoriniperhaps it's a manual bug, I'll check
01:01:18mpeccorinino, the manual is ok
01:01:20 Nick z35_1 is now known as z35 (
01:02:19pixelmano it's not - select+play is not possible on X5/M5...
01:02:47mpeccoriniohh, I had not understand what you meant by " there are only button combos with the power button possible (electrically) ". Do you want me to change the mapping to POWER + PLAY?
01:04:02pixelmano, button combos with power are dangerous IMO, I'd rather have something with long or short presses of a certain button (rec or play I think)
01:04:23dwarfyim watching u !
01:04:25pixelmaor just have it in the menu
01:04:33mpeccoriniI agree with you about combos with POWER, but I hate long presses
01:04:46mpeccoriniyep, probably we should just leave it in the menu
01:05:04pixelmabut I don't want to decide that because I don't use chessbox much
01:05:26pixelma(without an opinion of a chessbox user)
01:05:44mpeccoriniI do use it a lot, and to be honest, I've reseted games accidentaly more than once
01:06:01mpeccoriniI'll probably remove the reset game keymap from my version :p
01:06:23 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:07:06pixelmahehe... maybe I can throw that into discussion tomorrow again, since the reporter didn't answer. Now I got at least one opinion :)
01:07:25mpeccorinithrow into discussion with who?
01:08:03mpeccoriniby the way, I want the patch I talked to you about committed because I have a new patch waiting which will allow the user to configure everything from the menu and store the setup
01:08:14mpeccorinithat would allow us to remove the "change level" keymap too :p
01:09:03mpeccoriniwould the "big guys" spend time discussing so minor changes to chessbox?
01:10:08pixelmayou could always try - and in this case, closing of a bugreport would make them happy...
01:10:15 Quit obo ("bye")
01:11:12mpeccoriniin that case, I'll make sure I read the logs tomorrow just in case I can be of help
01:13:10 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@rockbox/administrator/Llorean)
01:13:20pixelmaWhat patch is it? Maybe I can point them to it
01:14:15 Join [1]mpeccorini [0] (
01:14:57[1]mpeccorinipixelma: 7174
01:15:55 Join Rob2222 [0] (
01:17:13*[1]mpeccorini would slap mpeccorini, but is not being violent today
01:17:46 Part [1]mpeccorini
01:18:04 Quit secleinteer (Remote closed the connection)
01:18:06Lloreanlinuxstb: Wouldn't it make sense if there were a "codec" image for WPSes, where it's a single image that is X wide, and Y tall, where Y is a multiple of the number of codecs, so it could automatically show the right codec image based on the codec enum, without using up the normal WPS images (though you'd still need the requisite space for the WPS)
01:18:08 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
01:18:24 Quit limbus (" Want to be different? HydraIRC -> <-")
01:18:25 Join [1]mpeccorini [0] (
01:18:36pixelmaah, what do you mean with "have the correct date set"? non-RTC targets coming to my mind..
01:20:57[1]mpeccorinipixelma: you're right, I didn't consider non-RTC targets !, I'll fix that
01:21:18[1]mpeccorinipixelma: I mean, the header of the game will store the date when the match was played
01:21:59[1]mpeccoriniI'll make it store ????.??.?? in non-RTC targets, that's what the PGN specification defines
01:22:50pixelmaI don't know how it works but non-RTC targets often use the date info of the build for things like that
01:23:25pixelmaLlorean: I had that thought a long time ago, something like the bitmap part system that's often used in plugins (I once counted number of bitmaps in the folder of the H300 iCatcher and it would have been 29 instead of 89 (with rwps) IIRC)
01:23:54linuxstbLlorean: Yes, I would like to see support for partial bitmaps - not just limited to codecs though.
01:24:50pixelmathat's what I meant too
01:25:55LloreanPartial bitmaps seems a bit complex without some extensive expansion of the WPS context.
01:26:03LloreanBut automated partial bitmaps for enums, much less so.
01:26:20LloreanBut that's just me, I don't know too much about it.
01:26:31LloreanI'm talking 'complex from the wps design side' btw.
01:27:14linuxstbDo all the enums have a fixed number of values?
01:27:25LloreanI believe all except for the volume enum
01:27:33 Join Rob222241 [0] (
01:27:52pixelmaand battery
01:28:11 Quit ducbian ("Leaving")
01:29:29LloreanThose could both be handled by a WPS tag that tells how many values to expect, then. Perhaps.
01:30:42Soapamiconn: OT, but if adobe reader FF plugin crashes often on you, try the free (as in beer) Foxit Reader.
01:30:44alienbiker99i keep getting an m68k-elf-gcc: no such file or directory error when i try to build. i have it installed, what should i do?
01:31:12 Quit mpeccorini (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:31:18linuxstbalienbiker99: Add it to your PATH.
01:31:24Soaphave you added the installed cross, NVM
01:32:36*amiconn proposed partial bitmap support a looong time ago...
01:33:03linuxstbamiconn: I know
01:33:15linuxstbNo-one's done it though...
01:33:39alienbiker99what is PATH?
01:33:44Lloreanamiconn: I think we all like the idea of it
01:34:06 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.)
01:34:12 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
01:34:25linuxstbalienbiker99: The variable that tells your shell where to look for programs
01:34:50linuxstbAre you in cygwin, vmware, ... something else?
01:36:03 Quit [1]mpeccorini (" HydraIRC -> <- \o/")
01:36:05jhMikeSLlorean: Then it's also time for symbolic enums to get rid of ordering dependencies in the core namely that of the codec order. I don't wish to see that dependency entrenched even further. :\
01:36:10 Quit Xerion (" ")
01:36:48linuxstbalienbiker99: Then see Step 4 here -
01:36:58alienbiker99ok thank you
01:37:46linuxstbjhMikeS: Why is that an issue? It's well-documented.
01:37:58*amiconn wonders whether he's the only one who fails to understand jhMikeS' last commit msg
01:38:04 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:38:59jhMikeSlinuxstb: what is? the dependency? should be gone imo
01:39:07jhMikeSamiconn: what part? :)
01:40:05amiconnThe message in general...
01:40:06jhMikeSamiconn: the code assumed that MPEG1 was available for recording on all targets because 44.1kHz would be there...on Sansa it's not the case
01:41:16amiconnThe sansa can't record at 44.1kHz?
01:41:29jhMikeSI'll try pushing the AS3514 clocking and see but the ADC runs no faster than 1/2 LRCK
01:41:30amiconnOr even 48 or 32.. ??
01:41:54amiconnOdd target, the sansa...
01:42:02jhMikeSThe LRCK is only supposed to go to 48kHz max but the ADC will be running 24 in that case
01:42:40 Join kkurbjun [0] (
01:42:47jhMikeSThe recording throws away half the samples since it receives every sample value twice because of that
01:43:53jhMikeSThe OF records files as 24kHz (48Khz but with sample duplication)
01:44:12linuxstbjhMikeS: That's what I'm asking - why is the ordering dependency in the list of codecs a problem worth inventing new WPS syntax to solve?
01:44:38amiconnDoes the sansa have line in?
01:45:22alienbiker99thanks linuxstb its working now =D
01:45:23jhMikeSamiconn: I don't know yet
01:45:23amiconnWouldn't make sense with such a severely crippled recording capability imho
01:45:43jhMikeSmaybe in the connector but I haven't looked into it
01:46:34jhMikeSlinuxstb: I think a minor addition would be enough to label the bitmaps...and we already did a reording to accomodate PCM in hw codec
01:46:54jhMikeS...which meant I had to fix a bunch of WPSs
01:48:10linuxstbI didn't think hwcodec supported PCM...
01:48:46pixelmait does, just not in the playback engine yet (wavplay plugin)
01:48:55jhMikeSI'm not sure but amiconn wanted there not to be a hole in the array there so WAV and AIFF were put together
01:49:33linuxstbpixelma: Yes, that's what I meant.
01:49:49linuxstbBut there wouldn't be a hole in hwcodec - the others would be #ifdef'd out.
01:50:48pixelmabut hopefully it'll be there one day - not being able to create playlists or even have volume control isn't that nice
01:51:25jhMikeSlinuxstb: Well, I'll have to look at the array before the BRP...but iirc there would have
01:52:08jhMikeSI was going to just reorder instead of fix the WPSs but amiconn protested :)
01:52:41 Quit entheh ("^~")
01:53:01amiconnlinuxstb: Sure, but that would make wps'es incompatible between hwcodec and swcodec
01:53:40jhMikeSamiconn: I have run the AS3514 at double or more clocking with good sound but I don't know how it will withstand that in general...perhaps it can be uncrippled :\
01:54:21jhMikeSamconn: ah, yes, that's right
01:54:22amiconnDepends on power consumption and whether it's running stable when clock doubled
01:54:37 Join Vampyr3 [0] (i=458fd59a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:54:45amiconnOn hwcodec we overclock the MAS when pitching up - up to 200%
01:55:23amiconnDoesn't cause any problems, even when leaving it running at 200% for hours
01:55:38jhMikeSWell, I was only running the DAC not the ADC so who knows but it seems to sound stable at least
01:55:49amiconn(and I misused this feature to generate 96kHz s/pdif signals for testing s/pdif recording on h1x0)
01:55:50 Join webguest76 [0] (i=458fd59a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:56:06 Join Rob2222 [0] (
01:56:12 Nick webguest76 is now known as IVampyr3I (i=458fd59a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:56:15amiconnPlayed an 48kHz mp3 pitched to 200%....
01:56:35IVampyr3Iany1 know how to convert video?
01:56:41jhMikeSIf I can push to 32kHz recording that's good for FM with just the right cutoff
01:56:53IVampyr3Ias in from av1 to mpeg and as well as to the nano's screen?
01:57:14 Join secleinteer [0] (
01:57:18amiconnYeah, for fm 32kHz would be okay... anything below that is only suitable for voice imo
01:57:53IVampyr3Ican any1 help me to convert an mpeg video to fit the ipod nano?
01:58:14Llorean|Vampyr3|: See the PluginMpegplayer page in the wiki, and please be polite and don't repeat the same question in a short period of time
01:58:36kkurbjunhow to you tell twiki not to put those ? marks after text
01:58:40IVampyr3Ierr thanx and sorry i thought noone was paying attention
01:58:56kkurbjunand is there a way to make tables with equal spacing for each column
02:00:05 Quit Vampyr3 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
02:02:29 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:02:33linuxstbkkurbjun: I think you put an ! before the word to stop it being interpreted as a wikiword
02:03:17kkurbjunlinuxstb, thanks I'll try that
02:03:50pixelmag'night all
02:03:58 Quit Psilonaut (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:04:09 Part pixelma
02:04:20IVampyr3Inop it says VLC command not found =(
02:04:24Nico_PjhMikeS: labeled bitmaps would make the WPS syntax even more messy IMHO
02:04:44Nico_PI like the idea of one big bitmap array for codecs better
02:05:24linuxstbNico_P: That could be for any enum, not just codecs.
02:05:32Soapkkurbjun: the ? marks I assume are after WikiWords which don't have a page created to auto-link to.
02:05:45Nico_Plinuxstb: yes, of course
02:06:32Soapkkurbjun: Prefix words such as "TuneCast" with an explanation point, as in "!TuneCast" the ! won't show up in normal view, and it will prevent auto-linking of what the wiki assumes is a WikiWord.
02:07:01IVampyr3Iis any1 here using osx that can help me convert videos for my ipod nano? im having trouble witht he wiki page
02:07:02Soapand dang I didn't see linuxstb's answer.
02:07:11kkurbjunyep, the ! worked
02:07:40kkurbjundo you guys know if you can make tables format with equal column spaces?
02:08:00linuxstbIVampyr3I: You could try ffmpegx - but you would need to configure it yourself.
02:08:02kkurbjunequal width that is
02:08:27IVampyr3Idang im not good with configuring =(
02:08:38 Quit DanielW ("Leaving")
02:08:49Soapkkurbjun: can't you force it by making the column headings (first row) all the same size, and at maximum expected cell length?
02:08:53IVampyr3Ibut what do u mean by configuring? as in writing the file
02:09:02IVampyr3Ior as in witing the command
02:09:07amiconnkkurbjun: I don't think that's possible in twiki
02:09:19linuxstbIVampyr3I: As in telling ffmpeg what format the video needs to be
02:09:32amiconnAt least not without resorting to dirty tricks like using spacers or the good old 1-pixel gif
02:09:44IVampyr3Ioh so i wont need to enter the widht?
02:10:09kkurbjunamiconn, ok, I'll just deal with the way it is
02:10:13IVampyr3Ibecause the wiki page is kinda confusing =(
02:10:18 Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:10:27 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
02:11:08linuxstbIVampyr3I: It's a wiki - it relies on users to edit and improve it...
02:11:30IVampyr3Iye true
02:11:39 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
02:11:47IVampyr3Iwell in any case im downloading it now
02:12:07IVampyr3Iin any case rockbox is amazing =)
02:13:15jhMikeSNico_P: I thought my idea was a pretty clean extension :) basically a non-change...but I thought of something else too that could work
02:13:37Nico_Pwhat is it ?
02:14:20*Nico_P is waiting for windows to update in the VM and it's taking forever... :(
02:14:45jhMikeSThe WPS has it's own array that maps to the codec array...the WPS array never changes order but the codec order can change freely
02:16:08 Join Thundercloud_ [0] (n=thunderc@
02:16:32linuxstbWhat would that gain us?
02:18:06jhMikeSOrder independence but won't address that other problem where a codec gets added for both HW and SW and a hole in the array is not wanted but the hold will only be pointers anyway and not full data structures
02:19:15Soapkkurbjun: The wiki gods /have/ installed the tableplugin.
02:19:18Soapyou can do it.
02:20:07Soap&TABLE{ tableborder="1" columnwidths="25%,25%,25%,25%" }%
02:20:48Soapbefore your table will make (in this example) a border of 1 pixel, and force a 4 column table to equal-width columns of 25% of screen width.
02:21:01Soapyou can also use absolute pixel values instead of percents.
02:21:31linuxstbpercentages are nicer...
02:21:50saratogafinally found that wma decoder bug
02:21:57saratogathe last one in my files I hope
02:22:07linuxstbI thought you found it a while ago... Have you fixed it now?
02:22:21saratogaone of the butterfly ops overflows donig a regular addition
02:22:32saratoganot even a fixed multiply
02:22:57linuxstbBut not in the floating point version?
02:23:23saratogait barely overflows, highest I saw was 33000 or so
02:23:33saratogawhich is fine for 32 bit float
02:23:36Soapkkurbjun: last thing...
02:23:52kkurbjunsoap, great, thanks for that, I'll try it out
02:24:05linuxstbsaratoga: So does that mean the fixed-point code is generating correct output now?
02:24:22saratogai think it will once I decide how to fix this
02:24:52saratogayou think its a good solution to do the fft (onyl thing that needs a butterfly) in a different fixed format then the rest of the codec?
02:25:01saratoga17.15 wouldn't overflow
02:25:28saratogaor just change the whole codec to 17.15
02:25:39saratogaand accept that we'll have 1 less bit of precision
02:26:21linuxstbI can't help you with that.
02:26:24saratogahell, we should just require that people use replaygain with wma
02:26:32saratogathat would solve this overflow problem
02:26:45saratogawell, assuming you ran it before you encoded i guess
02:26:48linuxstbSlightly related though, have you see mplayer's selection of test/problem files?
02:26:58saratogano, will have a look though
02:27:20saratogai suppose my 1 128k file that only exercises about 2/3 of the codec's code paths isnt' the best way to determine how well it works
02:30:11IVampyr3Ilinuxstb can u reccoment something something like ffmpegx? for some reason its not mounting
02:31:30 Quit Nico_P ("bed time")
02:33:09 Part Llorean
02:33:46 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
02:35:00saratogalinuxstb: sorry missed that before, theres been a few bugs
02:39:00 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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02:39:45 Quit eloel (Client Quit)
02:40:11 Join eloel [0] (i=eloel@unaffiliated/eloel/x-23835602)
02:40:31eloelHow do i choose between the iPod 5thg and 5thg 64 MB?
02:40:50 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:42:40 Quit eloel (Client Quit)
02:47:09IVampyr3Ilinuxstb: its not working ffmpegx is not converting it at all
02:48:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:52:59IVampyr3Ican any1 help me with encoding a vid for my ipod from mac osx? the wiki page is a bit confusing
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02:59:24 Quit IVampyr3I ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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03:00:29jhMikeSJdGordon: You pinged earlier...what's up?
03:00:58JdGordonare you watching the sd patch task?
03:01:32jhMikeSTechnically but haven't really been reading anything
03:02:10JdGordonif yo get a chance, could you check the latest patch please? your recording commit broke ata-e200.c and I'm not sre if the snc I did is correct
03:02:11*jhMikeS doesn't have an SD card to check anything out
03:02:30jhMikeShow could it have broken it if I'm using my player?
03:02:34JdGordonfs 7134 to save you searching :)
03:02:50jhMikeSIs there a problem yielding in the driver?
03:03:03JdGordonno, i mean your commit broek the patch on that file
03:03:34Yannniwould anyone here happen to have the build from like a year ago when they fixed the battery problem on the h300
03:04:03Yannnicause i just updated a couple weeks ago from that build and now my battery life is like half as good
03:04:39jhMikeSonly thing that changed was the use of spinlock_lock/unlock and 1 priority_yield so just keep those
03:04:56XavierGrYanni: that can't be right
03:05:15JdGordonjhMikeS: ok, thats what I figured, so shhuold be ok
03:05:18XavierGrYanni: the bettery issue fixed long ago has nothing to do with recent updates
03:05:19jhMikeSoh and spinklock_init instead of mutex_init
03:05:34XavierGrYanni: are you sure that your battery isn't flacky after all these years?
03:05:45Yannniwell it drains completely every day now when i used to only drain to 50%
03:06:07XavierGrhmm have you checked if the disk spin options is set to off?
03:06:25Yannniwell it might be but it seem to happen after i updateed
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03:06:46XavierGractually ignore me I think that option is removed
03:07:00jhMikeSJdGordon: perhaps the awful tick task should be removed from that and use the GPIO IRQs to detect the card insertion
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03:07:49Yannniwell is there anyway to get that build
03:08:18XavierGrI am not sure there is
03:08:50XavierGrthe build table stores some old builds but not so long before
03:08:57webguest76can any1 help me convert a vid so i can play it on my ipod nano? the wiki page is a little too confusing to me
03:10:01JdGordonjhMikeS: yeah problably. I dont kow what else in ata-e200.c Toni fiddled with (I tihnk he redid a fair chunk of it thouogh), so best leave it to him
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03:11:37Yannnido alot of people here still use the h320 with no problems
03:12:01JdGordonmine works fine, apart from feeling much slower than my sansa.. and its battery being shot
03:12:05Soapaye, Yannni, no battery life issues when I'm "allowed" to play with the H3xx
03:12:16jhMikeSJdGordon: I'm sure he's sick my colliding with his stuff by now. :P
03:12:29JdGordonhaha I would think so
03:12:53Yannnijust makes me sad when i see it hit like 8% then turn itself off when i get home
03:13:08JdGordonjhMikeS: now we really just need usb working and no mroe need for of :)
03:13:08jhMikeSWell, you could apply the patch to a source before the recording addition, then perhaps do an svn up on that with the patch appied
03:13:18JdGordonthats what I did
03:13:30JdGordonwas much easier... but had 2 conflicts, hat I tinhk i did right
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03:13:56jhMikeSWhat's missing from USB anyway?
03:13:59JdGordon shows the conflcits aftr than
03:14:12JdGordona softaware stack r something?
03:15:39jhMikeS1) just keep the spinlock_init and currcard->initialize = true
03:16:31jhMikeS2) move priority_yield() to between sd_command and sd_check_timeout .. I think that should work
03:16:32JdGordonsd_wait_for_state has the other one...
03:16:37JdGordonbah, too slow :p
03:18:05JdGordonah, It looks like i did 2) wrong, thanks
03:18:18JdGordonthat hopfully expalins the crashes i've been getting
03:22:26Bootitan any1 help me convert a vid so i can use it on my ipod? the wiki page is confusing =(
03:25:09JdGordonjhMikeS: cheers, I put the priority_yield() in he wrong after the timeout which must have caused problems, working fine now
03:25:37JdGordonbreakfast time, then study, then figuring the IRQ stuff in my lunch break :)
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03:27:57jhMikeSJdGordon: just what the buttons do should work
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03:57:01Yannniwhats a good player to get that has rockbox support
03:57:22alienbiker99gigabeat f or x i think
03:57:44alienbiker99man i was trying to edit this patch with my no knowledge of coding and as expected, it didnt work
03:59:39JdGordonjhMikeS: (GPIOA_INT_STAT & 0x80) is correct for the irq right? (that is the port and bit the sd card triggeres)..
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04:03:32JdGordonhmm... forgot to reset the interupt... 3rd time lucky :)
04:04:37JdGordon:( no worky
04:04:56jhMikeSif that's the line it checks then yes
04:06:17jhMikeSyou have to set GPIOA_INT_LEVEL bit 7 level at firmware init and watch for the flip and then set the level to the opposite of the line status at each interrupt
04:06:52jhMikeSGPIOA_INT_EN |= 0x80 is also need to unmask the line
04:08:39jhMikeSwhere it enables the GPIOA line
04:11:32JdGordonah, ok, found it :)
04:14:15JdGordon:'( still no good
04:14:56jhMikeSAre you clearing the interrupt? GPIOA_INT_CLR = (1 << 7)?
04:15:21jhMikeSthe countdown thing won't work here btw
04:15:45JdGordonwoops, did a & instead of a |
04:15:54JdGordonyeah, i scra[[ed the whole countdown thing
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04:16:09JdGordonnot sure if that will cause problems or not though
04:16:52JdGordonI dont need to clear the interrupt before enabli it do I?
04:17:11jhMikeSyou should...just look at the button driver
04:17:42jhMikeSclear it, check the line status and set the interrupt level to the opposite at init
04:18:03jhMikeSor actually, clear it after setting the level...whatever works :P
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04:18:32JdGordonwoohoo... its working :D
04:19:04JdGordonwas working... caused some very wierd behavious though
04:20:51jhMikeSit'll obviously need to generate an insert notification after init to get the initial state at startup
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04:21:46JdGordonyeah, no thats not the problem, Im not insteerting untill rb is finished loading...
04:23:30JdGordonwhen the card is in the whole thin slows down, and eventually panics
04:24:42jhMikeSUmmm...probably not clearing the interrupt or setting the level correctly and it's flooding with them
04:25:58preglowguess who's drunk
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04:29:56*jhMikeS ?
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04:47:19JdGordonjhMikeS: what shouold the level be set to? doing a striaght copy from the buton driver bvisouly is wrong (, removign the ~ from the current_status = line causes it to do nothing :(
04:48:02jhMikeSto the opposite of the current line level since the interrupt occurs when the line is at the level set
04:48:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:50:09JdGordongrrr.. tha comment is wrong then... bit 8 is set if there is no card insterted...
04:50:14jhMikeSGPIOA_INT_LEV = (GPIOA_INT_LEV & 0x80) | (current_status ^ 0x80)
04:50:32jhMikeSnever mind what I just posted :P
04:50:38preglowyou're making my typing look good :))
04:50:38jhMikeSyou have it right
04:51:06jhMikeSbut do this: current_status = GPIOA_INPUT_VAL & 0x80
04:52:40JdGordonwoo hooo :D got it working
04:53:13JdGordonthere is a very slight delay when inserting it and <microSD> showing up in the tree.. but good enough
04:53:20JdGordoncheers jhMikeS
04:56:37jhMikeShey, are those SD cards pricey or pretty cheap? I can hardly fit enough music on the internal flash.
04:57:00preglowpretty cheap
04:57:01JdGordondirt cheap here
04:57:07JdGordon$18 for 1gb
05:03:34jhMikeSprobabaly should add the CPU_INT_EN = HI_MASK and CPU_HI_INT_EN = GPIO_MASK to any init routines that enable them too just to be sure or maybe to the system init routine since they won't appear without a GPIO unmasked anyway
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05:04:08Ihavethespeedhello, anyone here to help
05:07:43Soapask the question, Ihavethespeed, and someone will be much more likely to answer ;)
05:08:21IhavethespeedStkov sd
05:08:33Ihavethespeedwhat is that and why wont it go away?
05:09:17SoapI do not know - more info would be helpful, though.
05:09:50jhMikeSIhavethespeed: I think that's being worked on right now now
05:10:13Ihavethespeedit just appeared after i tried to apply a theme
05:10:27Ihavethespeedand no buttons will work, sansa e200
05:10:47jhMikeShow'd you apply a theme with no buttons working?
05:11:44jhMikeSif you're stuck on the panic screen, just hold power for about 10 to 15 seconds until it shuts off
05:12:06Ihavethespeedthe buttons stopped working when the error screen popped up
05:12:47Ihavethespeedoh sweet, thanks, i held the button down before, i guess just not long enough
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05:14:26Ihavethespeedsoooo, this might sound dumb, but is there a front end?
05:15:04Ihavethespeedi bought this sansa because i wanted to play flac files and rockbox said it could do it, but im not sure where to go from here
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05:20:29JdGordonIhavethespeed: was that panic with svn code?
05:20:42JdGordoni mean, the official build?
05:21:02Ihavethespeedyea, the latest build
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05:21:35Ihavethespeedhow do i put stuff on it
05:21:50*JdGordon goes to bump that sd stack
05:24:42JdGordonIhavethespeed: go into the OF (hld left while booting), make sure its usb mode is set to msc then connect the usb cable
05:24:51*jhMikeS thinks a single system thread should handle all these slow tasks like power, usb, sd card, etc.
05:24:54JdGordonrockbox cant cnnect to usb yet.. you have to use the OF for usb
05:25:17JdGordonjhMikeS: the sd thread is the ata tread renamed
05:26:05JdGordonI'm not sure why it cant use the regular ata thread though
05:26:07jhMikeSah...yes, it is...:)
05:26:55jhMikeSstill, more condensation and not using tick tasks where interrupts could be used would be more efficient...for any target
05:27:48Ihavethespeedorigional frontend?
05:29:34Ihavethespeedsoooooo, the only way i can put stuff on it is through the sd card?
05:29:39jhMikeSOriginal Flotsam
05:29:53JdGordonIhavethespeed: re-read my above message...
05:30:40*jhMikeS wonders just how much has to be added for having USB ... an entire device stack? ... argh
05:32:15Ihavethespeedstill have no idea
05:32:23jhMikeS...and two devices have to be mountable on sansa
05:32:57JdGordonna, the msd card can be ignored in the first instance.... unless its no big deal to get it working
05:33:52*JdGordon wouldnt care if the mSD card couldnt attach to usb if it meant geting usb working faster
05:38:44JdGordonoh goody, build table is frozen again
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05:42:10jhMikeSI feel like it'll just come with it anyway...there has to be some low level handling of packets or something in hardware though...and there are more FIFOs in the PP5024
05:43:58jhMikeSFirst, the remaining screen melt must have the cause found and fixed
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05:49:31jhMikeSJdGordon: did you ever think to try the 16-bit I2S on a 502x based iPod? I can't see why it shouldn't work as well for that as the e200
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06:11:25Ihavethespeedhow do i view photos
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06:49:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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06:56:23jurrie_Ihavethespeed: still need help?
06:57:48jurrie_Simply use "Files" to browse your player's file system... select a supported formatted file (i.e. a jpeg) and the image viewer plugin should be started automatically
07:00:36JdGordonjhMikeS: sorry? whaA?
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07:41:42webguest08Does anyone know that new people cannot register for the forums? The activation email never comes
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07:58:27JdGordonanyone know how many lines are on the archos screens with the default font?
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08:01:05jhMikeSJdGordon: huh, wha? The e200 writes 16-bit L-R pairs directly in to the FIFO but the iPods are still shifting the 16-bit data to 32-bits but since it's now known what to do, I think iPods (at least 502x based) should use that too. It's half as many FIQs afterall for the same number of samples.
08:01:37scorcheJdGordon: 8
08:01:45*JdGordon is a software person...
08:01:53JdGordonno idea what your talking about :)
08:02:06JdGordonscorche: do any apart from the player have less than that?
08:02:25amiconnJdGordon: 8 lines without any bars, 7 with status bar, and 6 with status bar + button bar (recorders)
08:03:03scorcheJdGordon: that should be the min
08:03:04jhMikeSok...thought it could possibly help batt life though and I'd do it if I could test it there
08:03:11amiconnJdGordon: No, all the bitmap archoses have the same lcd
08:03:12scorchealthough, i dont know about the remotes
08:03:16JdGordonok, cool
08:05:58amiconnscorche: Which remotes
08:06:21JdGordonthe iriver lcd remote has 5 I think with default font
08:06:29scorcheamiconn: i was saying that i dont know much about the remotes, so there might be one out there with less lines
08:06:58*amiconn wonders why JdGordon is guessing instead of calculating
08:07:07amiconnAll the relevant data is known
08:07:18JdGordoncoz im lazy :D
08:08:01amiconnrockbox_default is 8 pixels high. The resolutions of all the lcds are in the device comparison chart, in the config-*.h files, and several other places
08:08:21*amiconn doesn't need to look them up at all - even for targets he doesn't have
08:08:39amiconnAnd the iriver remote also has 8 lines with the default font
08:08:51*JdGordon _was_ on his way to the device chart before the answers were given...
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08:14:19amiconnWhy is it imortant how many lines there are with the default font? All core screens should be adapted to work in a useful way with any font the user selects
08:14:40amiconn(within reasonable bounds)
08:15:13jhMikeSJdGordon: speaking of screen space, the keyboard and color picker were never updated to account for icon size
08:15:39JdGordonamiconn: yeah you right, I thought the rockbox info screen still used the default font... og hell
08:15:51JdGordonand jhMikeS, yeah, need t fix that
08:16:01amiconnHmm, speaking about that - I think there are more places with an info display, which could use the list widget for show the info
08:16:38JdGordonwhere else?
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08:17:03amiconnImho the list widget should have a read-only mode where you can scroll like normal but the cursor (bar or pointer) should be invisible make it obvious that there is nothing to select
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08:18:04JdGordonthat could be done fairly simply...
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08:18:37amiconnJdGordon: Several screens in debug come to mind. Those aren't important for the end user but hopefully using the list widget there would save some space
08:19:00JdGordonthey alrerady use the list if it was easy to convert them
08:21:44JdGordonamiconn: the hwinfo and database (and similar) screens? they could be converted, but its a bit of a PITA to do, and not worth the effort imo
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08:21:59amiconnView I/O ports, View battery (except the graph of course), View HW info, View disk info (MMC info on Ondio), View dircache info, View database info
08:22:26amiconnEspecially disk info is annoying and ugly
08:23:58JdGordonyeah, but how to we efficiently put that text into a list? a switch for each selection case?
08:24:11JdGordonin the get_text callback I mean....
08:24:13JdGordonnot really nice
08:24:59amiconnThere is a switch for each case atm
08:26:21amiconnOkay, this might not save much space then, but it should still be better readable than the current mess
08:26:49JdGordonoh, wow, that code sucks :D
08:26:54amiconnOn a related note, the cluster size should be removed from disk info since it doesn't belong there
08:26:59LinusNis it important that the debug code is readable?
08:27:12JdGordonmornig LinusN, care t kick the build server?
08:28:27amiconnUsing the list would also help to remove a couple if ifdefs and duplicated code in there (charcell / bitmap)
08:28:53JdGordonjhMikeS: just got a screen melt :(
08:29:18jhMikeSwith what? what I just did?
08:29:33JdGordonno, just regular scrolling did it
08:29:42JdGordonwith svn from a few hours ago
08:30:16jhMikeSoh, I just did something to stop it messing with the DMA transfer which really doesn't help appearance anyway
08:30:37JdGordonfirst one in a while also...
08:30:56jhMikeSyeah, the timing change alone didn't quite do it
08:33:03*jhMikeS can't see if the commit will be all green :(
08:33:35jhMikeSoh, guess it's running again :)
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08:41:51JdGordonbuilds died again?
08:41:58JdGordonno source zip...
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08:49:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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08:53:50JdGordonyep definatly fubar
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08:55:46GodEaterJdGordon: unless someone's recent commit has moved rockbox into the same level of complexity as say windows vista ? :)
08:56:15JdGordonit was jhMikeS....
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08:58:13amiconnlinuxstb: there?
08:58:35scorcheJdGordon: so quick to point the finger, eh? =P
08:58:55JdGordondeflecting the blame is what i do best :)
09:00:32*jhMikeS is a mirror for blame :)
09:01:27*B4gder volounters as skapegoat
09:02:21GodEateryou can blame me too if you like
09:02:46*scorche volunteers to do all the blaming
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09:08:07*B4gder tries to improve things by adding ServerAliveInterval=30 to the ssh client config for the build master
09:08:50B4gderthose ssh connections can somehow fail mysteriously without the master finding out
09:09:09B4gderso it sits there waiting forever on a connection that's gone
09:10:52*GodEater wonders if that might be his build server, since he can't seem to ssh into it this morning
09:10:59GodEaterin which case it really would be my fault :)
09:11:15B4gderwell, we had problems with that yday and I commented it out
09:11:26B4gderbut since we've had problems on several other hosts too
09:11:39B4gderit seems to be a bad build server period
09:11:59GodEaterI don't think it's my server per se, I think it's more my flakey ass connection
09:12:18B4gderyeah, and I would even go as far as saying that the ssh client is flawed
09:12:43B4gdersometimes when it hangs I do "netstat -tn" and check for the IP adress...
09:12:50B4gderand it isn't present...
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09:13:06B4gderyes, like that! ;-P
09:13:09 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
09:13:30GodEaterdamn web irc client going silly on me again
09:13:54peturGodEater: watch the log, you missed some important talk ;)
09:13:55B4gderhehe, it came just so well timed
09:14:06GodEaterI was watching the log
09:14:21GodEatermy "blasphemy" appeared in it, but not in the client =/
09:14:24GodEaterthat keeps happening
09:14:56GodEaterB4gder: you get 30 seconds or so to try something for me ?
09:17:07GodEatermental note to self, "reboot router before leaving for work - every morning"
09:17:27B4gderit seems our work with limbus' machine was worth the time, as it seems to stick on the top half of the servers build/speed wise
09:17:45GodEateryeah I noticed that
09:18:58*GodEater wonders if it's time to invest in a new box for home
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09:20:20B4gdernew boxes are fun!
09:20:33B4gderwell, apart from all the install work
09:21:34GodEaterI'm so out of touch with PC hardware - I've no idea what to buy
09:21:40GodEaterresearch time!
09:22:17B4gderyeah, I find it better to check that when its time to buy rather than try to keep up all the time is an athlon 64 X2 5800, and I'm quite happy with it
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09:23:21scorchemy processor has come down about 75% since i got it =(
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09:24:34*GodEater wonders about going core 2 duo
09:24:55B4gderthey're the best bang per mhz, possibly per buck too now
09:25:30scorcheaye..they outperform the amd equivs
09:25:39B4gderyes, per mhz
09:25:57B4gderwhen I bought my box, amd still outperformed intel for the same money
09:26:15scorcheyeah...after the recent amd price cuts
09:26:26scorchewell, not so recent anymore
09:27:25GodEaterany comments about "conroe" versus "allendale" ?
09:27:41*B4gder has no clue
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09:40:56scorcheGodEater: last mail was nice
09:41:49GodEateron the git list ?
09:42:22GodEaterI've not read it all the way through yet - it was a bit of an essay :)
09:43:26*GodEater goes off to do that now
09:47:45GodEaterhaving read it: basically we can use git to match our current model, but it'll take some work up front to set up the access control the way we want it
09:48:05scorcheyeah, but i cant imagine much
09:48:19B4gderwe don't have any fine-grained access control today anyway
09:48:33GodEateryou either have it or you don't ;)
09:48:34scorcheindeed...would be quite easy
09:49:14scorcheif we do it that way, i cant see much disadvantages with switching over to git
09:50:02GodEaterand we get a lot of advantages to go with it
09:50:10GodEaterI particularly like git-bisect
09:50:19scorchei havent gone into that yet
09:50:34scorchewhat advantages does that have over vanilla git?
09:50:47GodEaterit's part of vanilla git
09:51:06GodEaterit's a tool to let you track down obscure bugs
09:51:27GodEaterscenario : user reports a bug with symptoms "a"
09:52:02GodEateron checking back through your revisions, you find that it was present in a build from several hundred revisions ago
09:52:11GodEaterbut you're not sure which commit caused it
09:52:32*scorche hands GodEater a book on paragraphs =)
09:52:37GodEatergit-bisect basically allows you to track down the offending commit without having to look at each one of those hundreds of revisions
09:52:55GodEaterhehe - sorry - I tend to write a line at a time so you don't think I've fallen asleep :)
09:53:26scorchewell, you typically never have to do each revision...8 hops is typically enough
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09:54:29GodEaterindeed, git-bisect just makes it an easy process - you just identify a build which definitely didn't have the bug, and the most recent one which definitely did
09:54:54GodEaterand it checks out a revision somewhere in the middle, and asks you, (after you've built it) - did this contain the bug? it keeps tracks of your hops pretty much?
09:55:18GodEaterand depending on your answer, it works out which direction it needs to move through the revisions to narrow it down further
09:55:42GodEaterrepeat until bug is located
09:55:54*scorche just usually does it in his head, but that can be useful =P
09:56:05GodEateryeah, especially if you get interuppted
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10:12:09B4gderfor all swedish friends => check and a chance to endure a talk by me
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10:12:59JdGordonamiconn: you dont think having a list without the selection mark will make it wierd to view?
10:13:23JdGordon... especially if the list is longer than the screen, even though the scroll bar will be there
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10:23:25linuxstb_amiconn: I'm here now.
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10:49:06***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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10:52:10JdGordonhey Zagor
10:52:28JdGordonstill getting mime_magic errors when uploading files, so yeah, its ont fixed
10:52:37Zagorok, thanks
10:53:17JdGordonalso, can you make it so only devs can vote on tasks? could make that feature more usefull
10:56:15peturfrrr... any way to remove your vote again?
10:58:21peturZagor ^ ?
10:58:34Zagorpetur: no. I asked the devs, and they said "why would you want to do that?" :-)
10:59:01*petur learned not to click on links just like that
10:59:10B4gderI had petur's reaction too when I clicked on the vote once
10:59:17B4gderI thought I was gonna get some alternatives or something
10:59:28ZagorI tried to explain that people will test-vote on anything, but I'm not sure I convinced them. We'll see.
10:59:43Zagoryeah, I did that too
11:00:01*petur adds comment to task to explain he wanted to add a negative vote....
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11:00:56pondlifeIs there a vote regarding the REC button going down?
11:01:15B4gderthe votes aren't really useful at this point imo
11:02:08ZagorI think I can pretty easily restrict voting to devs, and with a better text on the vote link they might become useful.
11:02:38B4gderyes, and then we'd like to be able to sort based on votes too
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11:02:52Zagoron the other hand I don't really feel we've been missing a voting feature
11:02:59B4gderme neither
11:03:04pondlifeRockbox is not a democracy!
11:03:13pondlifeFrom the name down.... ;)
11:03:22XavierGrwhat the hell! Firefox is consuming 332 MB of memory and keep increasing!! :O
11:03:53scorchei have seen it get up to over 600, but it has gotten better lately
11:04:35XavierGrwell I have only 3 tabs open at the moment, and it isn't running for more than 1 hour
11:04:45XavierGrI just happen to browse a site with tons of images
11:04:47B4gderany devs use the svn-built source tarball?
11:05:08peturhere it is only a mere 45MB.... bloatware it has become....
11:06:08XavierGrwell I don't consider 45 MB bloatware, but seeing 330 MB taken (now 370 MB BTW) just in an hour is crazy.
11:06:12XavierGrserious memory leak
11:06:45pondlifeThey should avoid using malloc :)
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11:07:13B4gderyeps, just use a fixed-size 300MB array ;-)
11:07:16scorcheXavierGr: some extentions can cause a leak as well...they have gotten rid of most of the leaks in firefox itself by now
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11:10:11XavierGrscorche: that may be true but I don't feel confident enough (or willing to bother) to benchmark firefox memory usage with different extension patters... louzy programmers I guess (on firefox or the extensions)
11:10:17peturha... new strategy: make your app extremely extensible and then blame crashes and memleaks on the plugins :)
11:10:32XavierGrbut it is free and I like firefox so I mustn't complain :P
11:10:43pondlifeMoney back guarantee?
11:10:57XavierGrpondlife: indeed :)
11:11:23pondlifeAnyone object if I commit - voice settings update?...
11:12:22pondlifeIn particular, anyone who can build manuals reliably like to check out the manual patch.
11:12:39pondlifeCygwin just doesn't cut the mustard for manuals, I've concluded.
11:12:47*petur clicks the vote link for the fun of it
11:13:08B4gderpetur's become a voting machine!
11:13:20pondlifeWatch out for hanging chads.
11:13:35*pondlife votes for beer.
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11:16:10pondlifepixelma: A while back, were you trying to get the HTML manual building under Cygwin?
11:17:08pixelmayes, but I gave up... :\
11:17:12pondlifeMe too.
11:17:18pondlifeJust wondered...
11:19:14JdGordonB4gder: in overview you can see the most voted for tasks
11:19:27JdGordonand I tihk if the voting was restircted to devs, and was used it would be usefull
11:20:39B4gderthe votes are still a bit unclear to me
11:21:28B4gderin that overview it shows the votes are more for the general concept than for the specific patch/bugs that exist
11:21:46B4gderand I don't see a need for that kind of voting
11:22:09pondlifeWe don't really have time to work on things that other people want...
11:22:22JdGordonwell, I see it that is a request or patch has a fw votes then it means its posibly a good candidate to commit/work on?
11:22:36JdGordonpondlife: which is why i say devs only
11:22:58B4gderI don't think votes will cause any surprises
11:23:10B4gderwe already pretty much know what "they" want
11:23:46B4gderbut of course adding them for devs only probably won't hurt much either
11:23:48pondlifeYes, my point exactly... the demand is not the limiting factor.
11:26:35pondlifeIs there anyone here who could build a manual for me?
11:26:51pondlifeIncluding the manual patch from
11:27:24amiconnlinuxstb: Is the tatung elio PP5020, or is it PP5021 or higher?
11:28:17linuxstb_It's PP5020
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11:32:28rp-JdGordon did you see my last comment on the sd sansa patch?
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11:33:21JdGordonjust looking at it
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11:34:04*petur kicks JdGordon and points to his books...
11:34:11JdGordonthanks petur :)
11:34:24JdGordonrp whats the error on the BL?
11:34:35XavierGrpondlife: you want me to build you a manual?
11:35:01JdGordonand yeah, interesting bug you found there :(
11:35:02pondlifeXavierGr: Yes please, if you could just check that my patch doesn't break it.
11:35:31XavierGrok let me apply the patch
11:35:49pondlifeJust the voice_options_manual.patch.
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11:35:58pondlifeIf it builds, I'll commit it.
11:36:15pixelmapondlife: aren't you able to buils a pdf manual as well?
11:36:19rp-here is the build log:
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11:37:02pondlifeI did manage once, but not at the moment... and I don't have time to investigate :(
11:37:04rp-JdGordon: i'm sorry for finding the bug ;)
11:37:23JdGordonrp-: ah yes, the BL needs to be built without multi-volume and hotswap... but I want to eventually get it to be able to boot from rockbox.mi4 on the sdcard
11:37:32*JdGordon goes back to studying...
11:37:37pondliferp-: Never be sorry about finding bugs.
11:37:47pondlife(Well, unless you keep them to yourself.)
11:37:48pixelmapondlife: do you remember the error message? I'm guessing it's the unicode package though...
11:38:03pondlifeLots of them.. "LaTeX Error: \begin{description} on input line 44 ended by \e".. for example.
11:38:26rp-it was ironic
11:38:33pondlifepixelma: And it ends with make[2]: *** [rockbox-build.aux] Error make[1]: *** [manual-pdf] Error 2
11:39:01*amiconn wonders whether linuxstb will ever pick up his started-and-abandoned ports again :/
11:39:54JdGordonoh sure... he is allowed to abandon his ports.. but can the rest of us abandon the player... no fair :'(
11:39:59*JdGordon runs away
11:40:08scorcheone of these days, i am going to nab an AV300, but i keep missing them on ebay =(
11:41:36amiconnJdGordon: I don't think it will feel odd when the scrolling behaviour is also changed slightly
11:41:42pixelmapondlife: that doesn't sound like UTF-8 problem, must be something else - looks rather like errors in the tex file but if you get that on a svn checkout too...
11:42:26JdGordonamiconn: na, I tired it, i can send you the patch if you want. the threads list is very wierd... you move down and seemingly randomly it changes screens
11:43:14XavierGrpondlife: the patch seems broken :\
11:43:24XavierGrah no
11:43:26pondlifeHmm, it's hardly large
11:43:34XavierGrI didn't download the last version
11:43:44pondlifeHmm, there's only one version!
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11:43:56pondlifeThis is the "_manual" one, right?
11:44:13XavierGryeah I didnt' got that one
11:44:16XavierGrone moment please
11:44:25pondlifeThat's the only one you need. Not the others.
11:46:26amiconnJdGordon: That's what I mean with changed scrolling behaviour. It should always scroll when moving up/down, not only when the (invisible) cursor hits the bounbds
11:47:35JdGordonthat will complicate the list a bit.. but it could be done
11:47:51XavierGrpondlife: for which target do you want me to build the manual?
11:48:03pondlifeAny should do.
11:50:31XavierGrhmm I think I can't build manuals, I got a utf file not found error, strange though because I didn't have that error in the past
11:50:51pondlifeHmm, thanks for trying anyway.
11:51:06XavierGr"LaTeX Error: File `utf8x.def' not found."
11:51:22XavierGrafter I pressed enter to continue I got other errors
11:51:28pondlifeMe too.
11:51:37XavierGrthough I got a pdf in the end, but I don't know if it is okay
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11:53:27pondlifeAm I right in thinking we use the term "directory", not "folder"?
11:53:40pondlife"folder" is an MS-ism, right?
11:53:45XavierGryup, even without your patch I still get the same error
11:53:55linuxstbamiconn: I think it's unlikely that I'll continue with the Elio port (I was hoping some other Elio owners would show an interest). But the code does serve a useful purpose in SVN - the bootloader is a generic PP5020 build which should run on any hard-disk based PP5020 device - so it's useful if anyone wants to experiment with other PP5020 devices. But I could remove it from SVN if you think it's in the way.
11:53:56pondlifeMe too, and I get a PDF too.
11:54:33linuxstbamiconn: But I'm planning on seriously attempting the av300 port as soon as I'm done with Monkey's.
11:54:51pondlifeHmm, if I commit a manual mod - will I get to see red if it fails to build? Or will I just notice a lack of manuals after midnight?
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11:55:34linuxstbpondlife: Manuals aren't included in the current builds - so you'll just notice a missing manual tomorrow I think.
11:56:01pondlifeI feared as much.
11:56:02tucozpondlife, did you install the latex-ucs package?
11:56:19amiconnjhMikeS: are you around?
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11:57:15pondlifetucoz: I've not found that for Cygwin - any URL you could share?
11:57:16tucozthat enables unicode support. i guess that utf8x.def error is because you do not have latex-ucs installed
11:57:40tucozpondlife, hmm. i think bluebrother found a page with that
11:58:38pixelmapondlife it's in the ManualHowto page...
11:59:09pixelmapondlife: I could try your patch
11:59:51pondlifeYes please, if you could... it's just a paragraph or two in voice.tex.
12:00:01XavierGrah I don't have latex-ucs installed on my vmware debian
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12:00:43XavierGrI think I can test now
12:00:46XavierGrlet me see
12:01:18pixelmaI'll wait then
12:02:00XavierGrpondlife: I think it has errors :\
12:03:00pondlifeOK, I'll see if I can get my Cygwin working, unless you can spot a silly typo.
12:04:10pixelmaI believe it's missing some \end{descriptions} - let me see
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12:09:57XavierGrbah I can't build the html version of the manual
12:10:06XavierGrstupid dependencies... :(
12:11:09pixelmapondlife: yes, that fixed it. Should I attach a new patch in the tracker?
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12:12:54pixelmaXavierGr: IIRC the tex package for debian is now a different one... amiconn got it running
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12:14:46XavierGrpixelma: so is there one for debian to install, or it need to be modified?
12:15:29pixelmaI don't know more about it
12:15:51nlsamiconn: I posted a working patch for building coldefire builds with -Os if you are interested.
12:16:34JdGordonlatex-ucs - support for using UTF-8 input encoding in LaTeX documents <- thats not the one you want?
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12:16:58XavierGrJdGordon: yes that worked in order to build the pdf manual
12:17:10XavierGrbut now I get another error when I am trying to make manual-html
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12:18:11voltagexforgot to let you guys know I fixed the "fried" H340
12:18:20voltagexso I'm back with Rockbox which is nice.
12:18:28XavierGris there a wiki page listing all linux packages in order to compile rockbox?
12:18:36pondlifepixelma: Yes please
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12:18:59pondlifepixelma: Also, does the text make sense to you??
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12:19:33pixelmaheh... didn't read too much, yet :)
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12:19:55pondlifeI found it surprisingly hard to describe..!
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12:20:39webguest21Is there a different patchset rockbox can use? I like to listen to lots of midis, so this would be useful.
12:20:46DerPapstlinuxstb: thanks for compiling :D
12:22:13DerPapstwebguest21: dunno if they are any other patchsets available. maybe yo have to make one yourself.
12:23:00webguest21ok. i'll try..
12:23:09DerPapsti haven't gotten midi playback to work well on my iPod Video.
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12:29:34pixelmapondlife: so "use .talk clips" is now an extra option? At least this is how I understand it from reading the description, haven't tried the actual patch
12:30:21pondlifeYes. The main idea is to allow the user who might not have a full set of .talk clips (or who uses the database too) to configure the fallback to be spelt or numbered.
12:30:48pondlifePreviously it was hard-coded to fall back to numbered files, which was a bit uselsss in a big database query.
12:31:55pondlifeI did consider just using .talk clips if they were present, but that would result in disk spin-ups where dircache is not in use. (And maybe when it is too!)
12:32:05pondlifeSo thought config was safest.
12:34:10pondlifepixelma: I've updated - that's possibly clearer than the manual...
12:34:59pixelmahmm... trying to imagine what I would think when finding the option in the menu (especially that it takes priority over the other settings which are on the "same level" when looking at the menu)
12:35:55linuxstbDerPapst: You're welcome. I missed you by a few minutes last night...
12:36:02pixelmapondlife: or am I missing something?
12:36:09pondlifeI don't understand.
12:36:22pondlifeWhat would you want to achieve?
12:37:01pondlifeThe .talk clip takes priority if it exists and the option is enabled.
12:37:15pondlifeOtherwise it uses the spell/number option (if configured).
12:37:19pixelmait's about the menu structure - explaining it is hard... seems I failed
12:38:00pondlifeIndeed. I have had trouble explaining it too :(
12:38:04pixelma(or maybe it's only about the _imagined_ menu structure from reading the manual)
12:38:26pondlifeStructure? There are now 5 options, all side-by-side.
12:38:45pondlifeThe menu doesn't have any "priority"..
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12:41:32pondlifepixelma: OK for me to commit your work?
12:42:19DerPapstLinusN: yep :-D seen that in the log.
12:43:16pixelmayes, this is how I understood the manual but I can't imagine that I'd expect to set "use .talk clips" in one setting and then have to it set "spell" to define what happens when there's np .talk clip - if that makes sense :\
12:43:37pixelmapondlife: sure
12:44:04pondlifeOK. Well if you can think of better wording, let me know ..
12:45:27XavierGrI think that in oreder to make html manuals I will have to install the "tex4ht" package
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12:45:38XavierGrbut doing so it asks to remove my kernel!!
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12:45:46pondlifeXavierGr: That is not easy to find for Cygwin either!
12:45:48pixelmapondlife: it's not the wording (unless I misunderstand) - it's about setting it
12:46:19pondlifeWell, I'd hope if the wording is correct then it would be easily undestood.
12:46:22XavierGrso unless I upgrade to debian unstable I won't be able to build html manuals
12:46:53B4gdersurely debian testing is enough?
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12:47:14*nls gave up on building the html manual long ango...
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12:52:20pixelmaXavierGr: short info about it in the log from 5th of June, search for texlive or tex4ht
12:52:31XavierGrI think I solved my problem
12:52:46XavierGrapt-get install tex4ht then it will ask to remove the kernel
12:52:57XavierGryou say no and then apt-get -f install
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12:53:12XavierGrthen apt-get install tex4ht again
12:53:18XavierGrand hopefully that will fix it
12:53:33pondlifeI can now make a PDF manual, needed to do a meke clean I think.
12:54:35pixelmapondlife: I think I understand but I'd expect some kind of hierarchy in the setting, but then it's judged from reading about it only...
12:54:35XavierGrbut now I get other errors grrr. I will read the log
12:55:43pixelmaXavierGr: I'm not sure it'll help you - it's just a short info about it
12:55:53pondlifeThere was always a heirarchy - the .talk clip would fall back to numbering/spelling if it wasn't present.
12:56:01XavierGrwell I am going to install texlive too and see if that can work out
12:56:06pondlifeNow the user can choose what it falls back to.
12:57:49pixelmapondlife: what happens if I use .talk clips but have the other voice options set to off?
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13:00:22pondlifeIt will use .talk clips where present, but otherwise keep quiet
13:00:39pondlifeWhat would you expect?
13:03:35pixelmathat's what I'd expect from reading, yes. But I'm not sure if that's good - from just looking at the menu I'd not expect that what I set in the "voice menu" (and so on) has an influence on what is happening when there is no .talk clip present (when using that)
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13:04:13pixelma... that's so hard to explain ...
13:04:52*JdGordon votes to scrap 90% of the user settings...
13:04:53pondlifeLet's see if we get many confused users...?
13:04:56JdGordontoo hard to support
13:05:03JdGordonor just scrap the user support :D
13:05:17pondlifeEspecially the "scrolling" page ;p
13:05:18pixelmaeh... and not "menus" but filenames/directories
13:05:44pondlifeMenus means menus, it's nothing to do with the browser options.
13:05:52pixelmapondlife: well blind users could end up with no voice and wondering why...
13:06:12pondlifeBy default, voice menus is enabled
13:06:47pondlifeSo putting the .voice file in place should allow navigation to enable the browser options.
13:06:50pondlifeSame as before.
13:06:51pixelmapondlife: yeah, stupid typo... I know that it only has an influence on voiced filenames
13:07:20pixelma(.talk clips or not) - and directories of course - sigh
13:08:13pondlifeThe main confusion will be that users of .talk clips will now need to enable the option as a one-off. I'll post on the users ML....
13:11:02pixelmaand the other confusion could be that they get no voice feedback while browsing, no?
13:12:21pondlifeThat will be the case after upgrading.
13:12:27pondlifeThey will need to reconfigure.
13:13:03pondlifeMaybe there's a way to have it "upgrade" the settings?
13:13:17pondlifeJdGordon: Any ideas?
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13:13:31*JdGordon not following convo
13:13:46JdGordonwhats the prob?
13:14:02pondlifeI've changed the config settings.
13:14:48pondlifeExisting users would have something like "Voice dirs: hover". But "hover" is no longer an option, so I assume it will return the default option now?
13:15:29JdGordonwell... it shhuold
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13:16:12pondlifeSo, is there any way I can make it map to something else? Maybe keep the "hover" option in the file i/o code and remap it? But not allow the user to select it in the menu,
13:16:37JdGordonno, thats a bit nasty imo...
13:17:09pondlifeI agree. I'll post on the ML and people will have to reconfig. Voice menus will still be enabled, so it's should be possible.
13:17:26amiconnWhy not just fall back to the default?
13:17:27JdGordonwell, I guess we could add something like this, and limit it to 2 or 3 settings, but tha will kill load times
13:17:37amiconnYou can always put a warning in the commit msg
13:17:47pondlifeErm, too late!
13:18:17pondlifeI'll put a nice note on the user ML - that's where msny visually impaired users hang out.
13:18:28pondlifeI've updated the wiki and manual too.
13:20:33amiconnpondlife: .talk clips for files doesn't require spinups for each file. The file browser caches whether a file has an associated .talk clip as a special attribute
13:20:46pondlifeAh, so only for directories?
13:20:52pondlifeI could remove the file option?
13:21:03pondlifeLess options = good...
13:21:21amiconnI think the option should stay
13:21:34pondlifeIt's nice to have symmetry.
13:21:54pondlifeAny chance we could cache that info for directories too and scrap both options?
13:22:09amiconnHmm, now that I think of it, it could also cache this info for dirs
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13:22:30amiconnBut even with this caching, enabling .talk clips causes more disk activity
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13:22:47amiconn...because each file has to be checked whether a corresponding .talk clip exists
13:23:55nlsamiconn: well, dircache could help out
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13:24:32pixelmaI still don't like the fact that one has to know s/he has to set numbers/spell in a different option to define what happens when there is no .talk file present :\
13:25:03pondlifeWell how else to make it configurable? I could maintain the old "numbers" behaviour...
13:25:15pondlifeBut it seems more sensible to make it fully configurable.
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13:25:34pondlifeI agree the transition may prove a little unpleasant.
13:25:43pondlifeBut the end product is more logical.
13:25:56*pondlife needs petur's book of Sentences..
13:27:12amiconnnls: On archos?
13:27:33nlsamiconn: hmm, no not for archos...
13:29:25XavierGrwell I have to say that firefox now (without reboot) dropped to 50MB of memory usage after leaving it alone for some time (about an hour I think)
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13:30:02pixelmapondlife: what I also wanted to tell you but was carried away with the general discussion... one tiny tiny thing about the description in the manual... I don't like the sentence starting with ".talk clips"
13:30:26JdGordonXavierGr: you had lots of tabs open?
13:31:30XavierGrno, not at all
13:31:49JdGordonok then...
13:31:51XavierGrJdGordon: 3 tabs open at the time which It hit 400MB and 3 tabs open now
13:32:10XavierGrthe difference was that I was browsing a webpage with a massive ammount of images
13:32:40XavierGrso I could see from the task manager that memory usage was increasing as firefox was struggling to show all these images
13:33:19pixelmaXavierGr: the 400MB seem to be fixed - I got 2 instances open currently, both with a lot of tabs)
13:34:24pondlifepixelma: Feel free to reword it... I couldn't find a clearer way to put it... I agree with you though!
13:34:39*amiconn has 25 tabs open, and firefox needs just a little more than 80MB ram
13:35:04XavierGrpixelma: what do you mean seem to be fixed? I am sure I have the latest firefox version, though yes I agree that my case might not be a memory leak
13:35:20pixelmapondlife: just put a "The" at the beginning? I just don't like it starting with a dot
13:36:10peturyou can configure the caching alot through about:config
13:36:27peturthere was an article on /. recently I think
13:36:46JdGordonamiconn: ah, your right, forcing the list to always move if selection is hidden works fine
13:37:49pixelmaXavierGr: no I meant that it takes the same amount of memory here even though I have more tabs open - but that doesn't seem to be right provided what amiconn said...
13:38:23XavierGryay after 80 mb of packages I managed to build an html manual (though still it nags about a mutlirow file?)
13:38:50XavierGrfor the record: in order to manage to build html manual you may need texlive and/or tex4ht
13:39:15pondlifepixelma: Which sentence starts with .talk ? I can't see it...
13:40:08pondlifeAh, I see it.
13:40:17pixelma2nd sentence under "Use directory .talk clips" - it... ok
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13:42:37JdGordonamiconn: shuold it be allowed to wrap?
13:44:19amiconniMHO IT SHOULDN'T
13:44:28pondlifeOw, my ears
13:44:42amiconndamn caps lock
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13:45:21pixelmapondlife: are you working on the wording still?
13:45:36pondlifeYes, well about to commit...
13:45:54pondlifeSuggestions? Or shall I commit and let you pick it up?
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13:46:22JdGordonamiconn: ok, it works fine as long as the list is always started at item 0...
13:46:30JdGordonotherwise it goes a bit funny..
13:47:05pixelmamaybe there should be a sentence in the "Voice directories" sections to point out that the setting there is important what happens when using .talk clips?
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13:47:38pixelmapondlife: and "Voice filenames"
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13:48:21amiconnpondlife: Hmm, I think the option can't be removed even when ignoring the disk accesses
13:48:43amiconn..because it may be that you don't want to hear the .talk clips even if they exist
13:48:49pixelmaobviously I'm not good at putting that in words today...
13:48:50pondlifeIt also can save loading the voice file into memory.
13:49:07pondlifepixelma: It's ok, I thnk I understand... ;)
13:51:08pixelmathanks for your understanding... ;)
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14:02:29JdGordonok, who has a better name for the function which stops the selection line/cursor from showing that "gui_synclist_hide_selection" which is obviously very bad?
14:02:57pondlifeWhat does it do again?
14:03:16pondlifeHide Selection seems reasonable...
14:03:26*JdGordon adds _marker to above function and commits
14:03:51*pondlife loves extra _'s... :/
14:05:08*JdGordon loves them in the target tree...
14:05:21JdGordonbacklight_on(), _backlight_on(), __backlight_on() :D
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14:07:23 Quit philsen (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:07:24pondlifeJdGordon: Good job we don't mix C and C++ here ;)
14:07:41JdGordonah, but we could....
14:07:46JdGordonthink of the possibilites!
14:07:47pixelmayeah, like linuxstb, linuxstb_, linuxstb__ :P
14:08:07*JdGordon votes to port rockbox to C# to get more developers joiing!
14:08:07*B4gder giggles
14:08:20B4gderthey'll joing all right
14:08:29markunJdGordon: I read in some forum that you need C# anyway for embeded development :)
14:08:47markun(zune-linux forum of course)
14:09:07JdGordonare all our fonts monospaced? (is that the right word?)
14:09:29JdGordonall letters the same width
14:09:33markunJdGordon: they are not all fixed with no
14:09:34B4gderno, they're not
14:09:39markunwhat made you think that?
14:09:47JdGordonwishful tihking
14:10:08markundangerous thinking
14:10:29*JdGordon wonders how many spaces to add on the second line of the partition item... without the selection shown its hrd t see which is which
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14:11:47JdGordon3 it is then...
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14:17:24pondlifepixelma: Updated voice options text in the SVN manual now FWIW.
14:17:39amiconnJdGordon: Why 2 lines?
14:17:57JdGordon2 lines where?
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14:22:28DBUGEnqueued KICK amiconn
14:22:29***Alert Mode level 1
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14:22:47JdGordonwrong window?
14:23:24amiconnNo, clipboard mistake
14:24:50CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
14:24:50*JdGordon balmes red delta on amiconn... it was his idea :D
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14:32:30***Alert Mode OFF
14:33:57*JdGordon still wonders what amiconn was talking about 2 lines...?
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14:34:39amiconnThe partition items...
14:36:11JdGordonbecause thats the way it always was.. the first line is P# S:<something> the next is T:<type?> <size>
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14:53:53linuxstbnls: Thanks for fixing FILES...
14:54:36pixelmapondlife: there is a typo in your last manual commit "conttols" but I also expected something like a note to explain that when using .talk clips and a clip is not present, it falls back to what is set in "Voice directories/filename", because I think that's important (sorry if that wasn't clear in my last comment)
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15:18:26JdGordonwhats the general feeling about changing letters in fonts?
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15:23:47nlslinuxstb: np, it's very easily forgotten...
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15:26:15nlsB4gder: is there any (good) reason why we can't just tar a regular svn checkout?
15:27:04JdGordonthe .svn folders?
15:27:06B4gderI guess we can, but we want to exclude some stuff and get a proper name etc
15:27:30B4gderthe script is meant to work for everyone even with builds etc present
15:29:04nlsB4gder: aha, ok, well, it's just a minor annoyance, with it being forgotten, and breaking the tarballs (which almost no-one uses anyway so it often goes undetected for a long time)
15:29:16*nls can not type coherently
15:30:42LloreanOut of curiosity, with all the problems the tarball seems to crop up here and there, and the fact that a linux-like environment is needed to compile (meaning usually ready access to SVN), why do we have the tarball? Is there a specific reason, or is it a general "keep everyone's options open" kinda thing?
15:31:03linuxstbI think some people have firewall problems with svn
15:31:20B4gderyeah, some people can't get it from svn
15:31:36LloreanAh, okay
15:31:42B4gderthat's really the only reason I think is valid
15:32:00LloreanYeah, that's a good one.
15:32:01JdGordonB4gder: you have web stats for each file dont you? is the tarball actualy download that often?
15:32:08linuxstbnls: I wouldn't agree that forgotten FILES changes go undetected for a long time - people seem to quickly appear to complain about build problems.
15:32:21B4gderI don't have stats for the site just yet
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15:33:56nlslinuxstb: maybe I haven't been paying attention :-)
15:34:10linuxstbI've fixed it quite a few times myself in the past..
15:35:35*JdGordon is guilty of forgetting that file a few times...
15:37:08haemmywhich compiler is used for compiling the Ipod Video source?
15:37:21nlshaemmy: arm-elf-gcc
15:37:46nls4.0.3 iirc or maybe 4.0.4
15:37:54B4gderand the answer to the next question is tools/ ;-)
15:38:24haemmywhich question? ^^
15:38:30LloreanUsually the next question is "Where do I get arm-elf-gcc"
15:39:32haemmy here?
15:39:46intgrUse GNUARM.
15:40:21B4gderI advice against all prebuilt packages except those we provide on
15:41:00haemmyare there any for win too?
15:41:07B4gderfor cygwin, yes
15:41:13linuxstbhaemmy: You also need more than just gcc to build Rockbox - it requires a unix-like shell environment (bash, Perl, Make etc)
15:41:22haemmyok ^^
15:41:43haemmythen i put that plan away for a while
15:41:56haemmyuntil i have machine with linux running
15:42:08intgrCygwin works reasonably well.
15:42:14B4gderthere's also a vmware image
15:42:36intgrOr coLinux.
15:42:54haemmyah was just intersted, but its not so important
15:43:34B4gdercome on, you know only weaklings run prebuilt rockbox binaries! ;-P
15:44:32*Llorean looks at his players running prebuilt binaries and holds back a sob.
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15:49:02amiconnJdGordon: Hopefully converting the mentioned debug screen will save a bit. It's not much increase for the new list feature
15:49:29amiconnAlso, this hiding should be used for other readonly lists as well (like the id3 viewer and rockbox info)
15:49:30JdGordonright, but finding the time to do the conversion isnt easy....
15:49:34JdGordonseen as how boring it is :D
15:50:33pondlifeNot as boring as updating the manual's voice section... :(
15:50:47*JdGordon flatly refuses to work on the manual...
15:51:05JdGordonalthough, i think you all rejoice over that :D think of al the typo cmmit that would bring
15:51:18nlsthe manual i loads of fun, until latex starts messing with the whitespace, arg!
15:52:23*Llorean has found "building the manual" is one of the things he hasn't yet worked out how to do on Ubuntu
15:53:04nlsLlorean: there is a patch in the tracker that makes it build with dash
15:53:24nlsor you can link SH to bash
15:53:35LloreanAh, that's it then?
15:54:06nlsLlorean: well, you need a couple of packages too of course
15:54:24*ender` can't run the prebuilt binaries because they lack some patches :)
15:54:52Lloreannls: I've got the right packages.
15:54:52JdGordonamiconn: I just tested the id3 viewer with the selection marker hiden, I dont know if I like it...
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15:55:00Lloreannls: I just didn't realize about the dash thing
15:55:08 Part LinusN
15:55:29JdGordonbesides the fac that there seems to be a bug with moving up and down which only affects multi-line lists
15:55:29amiconnJdGordon: In fact I don't like the 2-line list item thing, marker hidden or not
15:55:40JdGordonI agree
15:55:43JdGordonbut they work
15:56:36nlsLlorean: FS #6919 has the patch
15:56:42JdGordonwell... umm...
15:56:51amiconnThey work, but they're confusing
15:56:54JdGordonthey are better than having an entire screen scrolling
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15:58:03JdGordonI tried getting it to only show the first line of items which arent selected once, but failed miserably...
15:58:06Lloreannls: I think I'll go the other way, I don't like having patches in my tree, for fear of accidentally committing them when I'm just fixing a typo or clarifying a step somewhere
15:58:12JdGordondon know if that would make them any better though
15:59:10amiconnWhy not just put the info on one line, e.g. in the id3 viewer
15:59:16amiconnArtist: blah
15:59:22amiconnAlbum: blubb
15:59:30amiconnInstead of using 4 lines...
15:59:50pondlifeI agree - it has to scroll quite often anyway.
15:59:56B4gderthat album is great!
15:59:58amiconnMight require some horizontal scrolling on small screens...
16:00:10JdGordonlots of horizontal scrolling...
16:00:29*pondlife uses big fonts, so is probably overused to horizontal scrolling
16:01:07JdGordoneven with small fonts, the sansa screen (and nano) issnt wide enough for a mildly long name
16:01:26pondlifeApropos nothing much, I wish the ID3 viewer just skipped blank fields rather than including them as "No info".
16:01:35markunB4gder: blubb?
16:01:47JdGordonpondlife: not so easy though :(
16:01:52pondlifemarkun: It's a great album, you should hear it
16:01:54*linuxstb prefers blah's self-titled debut album
16:02:12JdGordonis that the one with the blorf single?
16:02:28pondlifeJdGordon: As it is, there's plenty of vertical scrolling involved to use the ID3 viewer...
16:02:56*JdGordon prefers vertical then horizontal
16:03:13pondlifeHorizontal happens without any button pressing....
16:03:39pondlifeIt's not a biggie, but I'd like to try it the other way maybe..
16:04:13*JdGordon prays to the lcd gods for a rotatable lcd driver...
16:04:30Lloreannls: Know what to do about utf8x.def? I don't recall running into this one when I first set up latex for the old, old vmware image I used to work with
16:05:23nlsLlorean: do you have the latex-ucs package installed?
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16:06:42Lloreannls: Probably not.
16:06:55LloreanAlright, that fixed it.
16:08:12Lloreannls: Thanks, that was it.
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16:10:49markunpondlife: it just took me a while to realise about which 'great album' he was talking :)
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16:17:16Nico_Pnls: about the bash/dash thing... why not just call bash directly instead of sh ?
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16:18:01nlsNico_P: I have no idea, haven't had a look at any of the manual build scripts myself
16:18:23B4gderbecause it isn't a bash requirement
16:18:29B4gderit is a non-dash requirement
16:18:52B4gderI would feel bad to restrict us more than necessary
16:19:16Nico_Pok I see
16:19:48B4gderwe should all just flame ubuntu and then we'll feel better ;-)
16:19:54pondlifepixelma: OK, my *final* manual update is now committed... please let ther be no more typos!
16:19:57LloreanIt's an easy fix, and apparently Ubuntu users are likely to run into the same problem with myriad other scripts anyway.
16:20:08Nico_PB4gder: I'm using kubuntu so no flaming for me :)
16:20:21B4gderNico_P: that's not using dash by default then?
16:20:33Nico_Pactually it is
16:20:34B4gderafaiu, they changed to dash rather recently
16:21:02Nico_Pany idea of the reason for that ?
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16:22:45B4gderBug #61463 in ubuntu requests a revert => rejected
16:23:27B4gderbasically saying all scripts that break due to this are bad and should be fixed
16:23:30B4gdernot the other way around
16:23:52Nico_Pthat's not entirely false
16:24:02B4gderfrom their viewpoint, sure
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16:24:15B4gderit just depends on what you claim is the right way
16:24:41LloreanHonestly, you'd expect a stricter distro to do something like that. Isn't Ubuntu's focus on "The user just sees it working, without having to know how or why"?
16:24:44Nico_Pwell having scripts that are independant of the shell is always better, isn't it ?
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16:24:50B4gderit seems they changed because dash is smaller and runs faster
16:25:13B4gderNico_P: sure, but in this case I'm not at all sure dash is right
16:25:19LloreanScripts exploding at innocent Dell users doesn't seem to be a good way to build up Linux's usability image.
16:25:24Shaidis dash open source?
16:25:40Nico_PSo we change dash :D
16:26:12Nico_Pwhy correct the script when you can easily correct the shell !
16:28:38B4gderyes, that's assuming they agree with you it being a fault in the first place
16:28:55B4gderI would expect they don't
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16:30:56B4gderhere's some very cool info:
16:31:06B4gderUntil IEEE Std 1003.1 2004 Edition, the spec said that POSIX compliant implementations of the shell "need not" support options.
16:31:16B4gderIt appears that the ash developers decided to *not* support options to echo, while the bash developers decided to *allow* options to echo, for whatever reason.
16:31:30B4gderThe standard was changed in 2004 to specify that echo "shall not" accept options, leaving bash in a state not only of non-compliance, but also with a long list of shell scripts that depended on the echo command being able to accept options.
16:32:00 Quit stevemcc (Client Quit)
16:32:01Zagorhow do you perform echo -n without options?
16:32:17B4gder"It is not possible to use echo portably across all POSIX systems unless both -n (as the first argument) and escape sequences are omitted."
16:32:30B4gderthat's from the acutal standard text
16:32:41Zagorvery weird decision indeed
16:32:43B4gderthe last quote I mean
16:32:58Nico_Pyeah, strange
16:33:07Nico_Pso dash is actually right
16:33:15Zagorso all shell scripts written in the last, what, 15 years? should be rewritten. yeah, great idea.
16:33:19Nico_Psomebody want to fix the makefile ?
16:33:32*Nico_P got to go
16:33:40linuxstbWhat about using printf instead?
16:34:31B4gdercontains the heated debate
16:34:54B4gderprintf could work
16:35:09linuxstbI've just tested, and the problem striing - "\newline" can be displayed with printf "\\\newline" in both dash and bash.
16:35:42linuxstb(I mean \newcommand)
16:35:44Zagoryeah printf seems to work in most shells.
16:35:54ZagorI didn't even know it existed as a shell command :-)
16:35:59B4gderit's not part of the shell is it?
16:36:10B4gderit's a separate command
16:36:12Zagorah, that's why
16:36:17Zagoreven better
16:36:28pondlifeBlimey, even Cygwin supports it...
16:37:10Zagorit is built-in in bash though
16:37:19Zagor(at least according to the man page)
16:37:58linuxstbAccording to the dash manpage, it's optional to build-in printf
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16:42:59B4gderprintf in POSIX
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16:44:46linuxstbI've just added a patch to FS #6919 to use printf - any Ubuntu users around to test it?
16:48:03Lloreanlinuxstb: Will in just a minute
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16:49:55Lloreanlinuxstb: Seems to work, about to skim the pdf
16:50:02LloreanWow, dash is quite a bit faster, too
16:51:13LloreanIt didn't copy the .pdf file out of the /manual folder in my build folder, I *think* it used to do that, didn't it?
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16:51:50LloreanAnd I think the error at the end is different from the error at the end I used to get. Heh.
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16:54:01XavierGrLlorean: can you build html manuals?
16:54:32himmelstrutz22does ipod nano 8gb work well with rockbox?
16:54:44nlshimmelstrutz22: it doesn't work at all
16:54:45GodEaterhimmelstrutz22: it doesn't work at all
16:54:52GodEaterthere's an echo as usual
16:54:53LloreanXavierGr: What's the command for that?
16:55:07himmelstrutz22oh, damn.
16:55:18himmelstrutz22will it work in the future?
16:55:29XavierGrLlorean: make manual-html
16:55:30Lloreanhimmelstrutz22: If someone who has one figures out how to get unsigned code running on it.
16:55:38LloreanXavierGr: Ah, I tried html, and html-manual
16:55:44XavierGrheh :P
16:55:52XavierGryeah I tried that too then looked the makefile
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16:56:39himmelstrutz22ok. well. could someone please recommend a good +8gb portable player that works well with rockbox? I can't be without ogg vorbis, but one thing that I can be with out is video/photo/big ass display.
16:57:35GodEaterhimmelstrutz22: how about looking at the front page of, and picking one from the list of supported players there ?
16:57:39LloreanXavierGr: manual-html seems to work fine
16:58:10XavierGrdo you have texlive or tex4ht installed?
16:58:25 Quit aliask (Remote closed the connection)
16:58:30XavierGryeah that's probably it
16:58:42himmelstrutz22godeater: I thinking about asking a human for a direct recommendation.... but of course I could look at the list at the homepage.
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16:59:10himmelstrutz22but its a jungle out there, and I would need a machete to get by.
16:59:12markunhimmelstrutz22: maybe one of the iaudios?
16:59:13XavierGrwell i had major problems building html manuals and texlive and/or tex4ht did the job (although it still nags me about a missing file)
16:59:21GodEaterhimmelstrutz22: oddly enough, the page at was *written* by humans
16:59:30GodEateramazing I know.
16:59:35himmelstrutz22godeater: no way!
16:59:40LloreanXavierGr: I thought tex4ht was considered 'required'
16:59:51himmelstrutz22markun: thanks
17:00:02XavierGrLlorean: yeah, maybe I didnt know about it until now
17:00:04GodEateranother dusty corner of the wiki I didn't know about there markun ;)
17:00:05himmelstrutz22thats what I needed
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17:00:46LloreanXavierGr: I just remember that when going through the packages picking what to install, I remember "Right, I need tex4ht"
17:00:58LloreanSo someone apparently said it within my hearing at some point. :)
17:01:06GodEaterlinuxstb: I've been trampled in the rush of people responding to the London social meet thread. So where do you want to go for a beer? :)
17:01:17Lloreanlinuxstb: Did you see my responses re the patch?
17:01:36jac0bis there a plan to implement the SD-card function into the sansa build?
17:01:45XavierGrLlorean: is there a package with all the required packages? because when I was making the VMware enviroment I didn't install that one
17:01:50linuxstbGodEater: :) I should reply in the forum - try and show it's not just you...
17:01:59XavierGr(I dont know if it is included in the new image)
17:02:05LloreanXavierGr: I believe it's tetex-base, tetex-extra, latex-ucs and tex4ht
17:02:06markunhimmelstrutz22: look at the amazing runtime of the M5L
17:02:12XavierGrLlorean: package = wiki page (sorry)
17:02:20linuxstbLlorean: Yes, I read the logs. So it seems OK to commit?
17:02:21LloreanXavierGr: I don't believe there's a wiki page, at least I couldn't find one.
17:02:37himmelstrutz22markun: my eyes just dropped.
17:02:45Lloreanlinuxstb: As far as I can tell. Works perfectly, cuts the pdf manual build time significantly (using dash rather than bash does, at least).
17:03:01Nico_P"/bin/sh: Syntax error: "(" unexpected"
17:03:04LloreanThere's still a few error: 2s at the end of the build, but if I recall that's somewhat normal anyway. The manual itself seems fine.
17:03:20Nico_Pthat's what I get when I try to build the manual with the patch
17:03:35pixelmayes, tex4ht is what's needed fot the html manual and I'm unable to install it manually on cygwin (no prebuilt package available) :\
17:03:37LloreanNico_P: But do you have a manual pdf in the /manual folder?
17:03:43Nico_Poh yes I do have it
17:03:56XavierGrno errors for me with texlive and tex4ht installed (except that I have to press enter once in a while because it nags about a mutlirow file missing)
17:04:12himmelstrutz22what's the difference between iAudio M5 and iAudio M5L? just size?
17:04:19himmelstrutz22(and prize?)
17:04:23LloreanWell, I *thought* the errors were normal. It's just as likely I'm wrong.
17:04:34Lloreanhimmelstrutz22: M5L has a much larger battery
17:05:05XavierGrI don't know for sure I will try to search more for it when I come back from work
17:05:17pixelmahimmelstrutz22: the L is for "larger battery" but therefore can only fit a single platter drive - 20GB
17:05:43GodEaterthe H1x0 is missing off that page
17:05:53GodEaterI know they're hard to find, but we should include it...
17:05:58himmelstrutz22pix/llorean: ok. seem to be the player for me. 40 gb is too much today. thanks!
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17:06:21Lloreanpixelma: Should be upgradeable to 40 these days, and 50 soon, I imagine.
17:06:54pixelmahimmelstrutz22: I could only find a store on (mp3 direct) who sells them
17:07:18pixelmaLlorean: sure, but that's not what they come with
17:07:31himmelstrutz22pixelma: oh damn. typical.
17:08:19pixelmafor example the X5L comes in 2 "sizes" 20GB and 30GB
17:09:13pixelmaLlorean: the stock M5L is only available with a 20GB drive
17:09:14markunhimmelstrutz22: a Gigabeat F40 can be found online for around USD 100, but I don't know if it is the right player for you
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17:09:58markunit works very well with rockbox, but has no recording or radio
17:10:22pixelmahimmelstrutz22: I bought mine from there, the ship to germany but only accept paypal
17:10:32markunit is very fast and has a nice screen, but you stated you don't care much for that
17:11:04pixelmadownside: the charger that comes with it has UK plugs
17:12:21himmelstrutz22*: I will try something that exists in store today, here in norway! =) my old iriver just got smashed so I need a new one right away! =)
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17:13:53bloodskinso rockbox cant play videos that youve transfered with itunes?
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17:14:18bloodskinive been looking for about 4 hours for some kind of info on it, and have gotten mixed signals
17:14:31LloreanIt cannot.
17:14:33bloodskin(rockbox for the ipod video that is)
17:14:35LloreanNo official documentation claims it can.
17:14:40bloodskinok, thanks
17:14:47LloreanWhere do you feel you're getting mixed signals from, specifically?
17:15:08bloodskini read somewhere that there was a plugin but i couldnt find it
17:15:47LloreanDid you try looking in the manual?
17:15:49markunbloodskin: there is a video plugin
17:15:55markunbut for a different format
17:16:08bloodskinavi mpg?
17:17:52bloodskini see. its built in
17:18:13GodEaterwow - someone who gets it straight away!
17:18:39bloodskinwhere can i download it?
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17:19:44bloodskinis there any way i can give back to the community?
17:19:54GodEaterpaypal ?
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17:20:16GodEaterusually a heartfelt thank you is well received too :)
17:20:22markunbloodskin: do you know how to program or write documentation?
17:20:39bloodskinim leaning visual basic ATM
17:20:59bloodskini could build a rockbox mirc script
17:21:22bloodskinlike, have it themed like roxkbox, and have an auto updater
17:21:23*GodEater suspects it'll be a while before rockbox sports a VB Runtime Engine
17:21:44desowinbloodskin: I have no idea how you would do this
17:21:45bloodskinand such
17:22:00bloodskineasy. themes are easy
17:22:21bloodskinthe updater would just check the DB for the latest build and log the current build you have
17:22:23*GodEater wonders if he can write a hald rule to autoupdate his DAPs when they get plugged in
17:22:25Slasherii hope there will be never anything like basic in rockbox
17:22:53markunbloodskin: another thing you can do is just use rockbox and report problems or come up with suggestions on how to improve it
17:23:08bloodskinall ive built in vb so far is a WMP controller that launches a we radio station
17:23:20bloodskinand has links to the site and a mirc launcher
17:23:35desowinwell, rockbox is coded in c
17:23:41bloodskini see
17:23:51GodEaterand assembler
17:23:58desowinand it's rather impossible to run VB code on music players
17:24:04markundesowin: I'm sure I'm not the only one who stated with basic
17:24:24markunlearned programming I mean
17:25:06desowinbasic was bundled in 8bit computers
17:25:09bloodskinhave you guys seen the new patent by apple
17:25:21pondlifeHere's a barmy idea... Supposing Rockbox could have a compressor built in... would it be possible to have a realtime expander? If so, would it be able to undo the overcompression of badly mastered music?
17:25:29bloodskinthe one where the scroll wheel is on the screen and the back is a touch screen thing
17:26:05desowinsuch patents are crazy
17:26:37bloodskinit would be cool if they brought it to life
17:26:42*GodEater started with ZX81 basic
17:26:58*bloodskin started with mirc scripting. WHUT
17:27:16*amiconn started the same way as GodEater
17:27:24*pondlife too
17:27:40*markun with gwbasic on a 286
17:27:40pondlifeAh, actually I had access to a Commodore PET about '79...
17:27:53*linuxstb skipped the zx81 and started with vic-20 basic
17:28:00pondlifeBut it was ZX81 that I really coded on.
17:28:00*GodEater saw a PET once. Never got to use it though.
17:28:27*GodEater went from ZX81 to an Acorn BBC Model B
17:28:41*markun feels young :)
17:28:43*linuxstb couldn't afford a BBC Model B, he only had an Electron
17:29:04amiconnzx81 basic -> zx spectrum (and KC85) basic (and later asm as well)
17:29:32pondlifeZX81 -> Spectrum -> BBC B -> IBM AT...
17:29:52GodEaterzx81 -> BBC B -> Atari ST -> 486
17:30:08himmelstrutz22would it be stupid to buy a ipod nano 8gb? does it work well with debian/linux? even that it doesn't work with rockbox.......
17:30:10amiconnBagder: r u there?
17:30:21GodEaterodd move from spectrum to bbc b there.
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17:30:44desowinhimmelstrutz22: I would sugest sansa e280, but it's just my opinion
17:30:44*amiconn moved from spectrum to amiga (500 first, later 4000)
17:31:17*GodEater got to play with an Archimedes at school
17:31:19himmelstrutz22desowin: I've heard those displays get damaged easily..........
17:31:20markunhimmelstrutz22: "I can't be without ogg vorbis" :)
17:31:21linuxstbvic-20 -> BBC Electron -> Tatung Einstein -> 8086 PC clone -> Amiga 1200 -> 486 -> ...
17:31:32himmelstrutz22markun: well... damn, I need one today! =/
17:31:45bloodskini dont think the new nanos work with anything. they are encrupted like a mo fo
17:32:00markuncan you buy the sansa's in norway?
17:32:08himmelstrutz22yes, I believe so.
17:32:20himmelstrutz22but I haven't heard anything good about them.
17:32:31himmelstrutz22except that rockbox supports it.
17:32:41markundid you hear bad things about them?
17:33:03himmelstrutz22I just read a review, that was very negative.
17:33:07bloodskinthe old nanos are real fragile. drop them once and you get a line thats about 15 pixels going through the middle of your screen
17:33:30markunhimmelstrutz22: do you have a link?
17:33:30bloodskinmy gf did it twice
17:33:40bloodskinhers and her dads
17:33:50linuxstbhimmelstrutz22: Negative of the software, or negative of the hardware?
17:33:51himmelstrutz22do I sell my soul to the devil if I buy a ipod? I have never had one before.
17:34:01himmelstrutz22markun: its in swedish, still want it?
17:34:16markunwill be good to practice :)
17:34:48linuxstbhimmelstrutz22: If you want to use Rockbox, there are better devices than ipods to run it on.
17:34:50himmelstrutz22........and its only a user review...... well, hold on.
17:35:02bloodskinwmv is unsupported, correct?
17:35:02himmelstrutz22linux: I understand.
17:35:09desowinhimmelstrutz22: no, but if you're not using mac os nor windows, then Apple doesn't care about iPod users
17:35:46bloodskindesowin, use wine
17:36:07himmelstrutz22 <−−- sansa
17:36:11desowiniTunes doesn't handle iPod connection under wine
17:36:19markunhimmelstrutz22: maybe the Trekstor Vibez is something to consider for as well
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17:36:35bloodskindo you need to transfer stuff? if so use winamp
17:36:40bloodskinor something
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17:36:59bloodskinthere has to be a way to use your ipod with linux
17:37:12desowinyes, there is
17:37:31desowinbut IMO Apple should care about it, and not hope to someone reverse engineer their iTunesDB
17:37:31himmelstrutz22markun: does it work with rockbox then?
17:37:48bloodskinvalid point
17:37:56markunno, but these guys seem to love it:
17:38:06markunand it supports ogg vorbis
17:38:18bloodskinwmv is unsupported, correct?
17:38:40markunbloodskin: unsupported by what?
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17:39:20bloodskinfor the ipod video
17:39:21markunbloodskin: rockbox only has the mpegplayer, but you can transcode your wmv files
17:39:43bloodskini read somewhere that it has an avi player too
17:39:44bloodskini think
17:39:52markungreat, but it's not true
17:40:05himmelstrutz22bah. god. I think I will drop these mp3players....... for some days. there's just too many to choose from. I will go back to my old 80's cassette portable! that's real freedome. no firmware at all.
17:40:25markunalthough we could pretty easy support avi playback, as long as it contains mpeg2 with mp3
17:41:26amiconnmpeg1 too, and mp1/mp2 audio
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17:42:53bloodskinwhere the hell is my mechanic?
17:43:07bloodskinhe was supposed to be here 2 hours ago
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17:45:28markunbloodskin: with "avi player" you mean one which supports the xvid/divx codecs I assume?
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17:47:45bloodskini guess. it just said avi/mpg playback
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17:51:00bloodskini should have uploaded my mirc to my site
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18:21:22pixelmahmm... there is a bugreport about not being able to restart chessbox on X5 with a button press (it's right, the chosen button combos doesn't work) - but now one can restart through the new menu which has the restart option. I asked the reported if that'll do for him or whether he still wants to be able to restart with a button press but got no response. Does anyone have an opinion about it?
18:22:15pixelma*reporter too
18:23:00peturI'd close it as fixed with the note on how to restart...
18:23:35mpeccorinipetur: this morning? it was open last night
18:24:00*petur re-reads what he wrote
18:24:41*pixelma doesn't understand too
18:25:20mpeccorinipetur: I think this is another bug report
18:25:29mpeccoriniFS #7116
18:25:29peturs/I'd/I would
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18:25:58mpeccoriniohh, sorry, I'm still learning english :p
18:26:39pixelmaok.. have to look into a correction of the manual then :)
18:26:52mpeccorinipixelma: as I told you yesterday, I would even take the key mapping away from other targets
18:27:08mpeccoriniit does happen that you restart the game by accident
18:27:21mpeccoriniand as you can imagine, that can be pretty annoying
18:29:01pixelmayeah, I know. Any news on the other patch (regarding non-RTC targets)?
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18:32:57mpeccoriniI have it done in a couple minutes
18:33:09mpeccorinis/I/I'll :p
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18:49:14***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:50:23mpeccorinipixelma: are you around?
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18:53:11mpeccoriniare you going to change the manual so the key mapping is not shown in X5/M5?
18:53:19mpeccoriniI have a patch for the manual too :p
18:53:33mpeccoriniplease let me know if you change it so I sync the patch
18:54:05mpeccoriniI posted the fix for non-RTC targets BTW
18:54:14mpeccorinithanks for pointing that out
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19:54:29*amiconn wonders how the license libffmpegflac, libmusepack, libspeex, libwavpack and tremor are under is called. Same for the license of libalac
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19:55:56peturregarding licenses: according to we are not 100% GPL ( )
19:56:25petur1 file LGPL and 38 BSD
19:57:39amiconnIn fact these numbers can't be correct
19:57:48x1jmpwhich targets would be affected by the configurable REC-Button?
19:58:26amiconnThere is more than one LGPL file, since the ffmpeg flac code is all lgpl
19:58:31Lloreanx1jmp: H1xx, H3xx, Sansa e200, I believe
20:00:02x1jmpand how can I check with pluginlib_actions if this button was pressed?
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20:02:44x1jmpor what would be a good solution to access buttons that aren't available on all targets with the action system?
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20:12:44zanexx297Hey guys, just downloaded Rockbox about 3 hours ago.Im using an iPod 80GB 5.5G,I downloaded the latest build.The problem is that it is now frozen and doesn't respond to anything I do
20:14:51zanexx297I just wanted to report this,and ask for help as I've even tried plugging it back into my PC to regain control,and that didn't even work
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20:16:39zanexx297I'll be right back
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20:20:10zanexx297I'm back
20:22:36zanexx297Guys any suggestions on how to get control of my iPod back?
20:23:35zanexx297Ummmm, is anyone listening (or should I say reading)?
20:26:16x1jmpI don't own an Ipod but you might find an answer there
20:27:38zanexx297Thanks man but the normal reset button doesnt work if you load rockbox,I know this because ive already tried
20:28:15LloreanMenu+Select works pretty much no matter what.
20:30:03zanexx297Llorean normally you would be right but at the moment its not working, looks like im gonna have to wait till it runs flat! :(
20:30:28Lloreanzanexx297: Have you tried the official method of doing it?
20:30:37LloreanTurning hold on, then off, then holding them down for ~15 seconds?
20:32:42zanexx297nope, doesnt work.Not even plugging it into pc changes its state
20:33:21LloreanPlugging into a PC can't change its state if it's frozen.
20:33:32LloreanBut Rockbox can't prevent the reset combination from working, the real one.
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20:33:51LloreanWhich means odds are you're not doing it right, often your fingers wiggling a little bit (enough to cause a scroll) can prevent it from working.
20:34:13zanexx297i just dropped it and it works again(i dropped it :( it works :) )
20:34:40LloreanWell that suggests it was a hardware thing that was wrong with it, then.
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20:37:13zanexx297btw i have reset it many times before and i know how to do it, but thanks anyway
20:39:09LloreanMany people have said that in here, but then upon trying it a few more times, find it works. So I have to say that.
20:39:40LloreanMost people don't even know that you *have* to do the hold on/off thing for it to work properly, because most times just holding Menu+Select will do t.
20:40:24zanexx297i know they hold thing i mean it does stand in your ipod manuel and iv had my pod since christmas
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20:40:34zanexx297anyway man thanks so much for the help
20:40:39zanexx297i gotta run now
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20:44:01mpeccoriniguys: is there a "complete" implementation for
20:44:17mpeccorini... implementation of malloc for plugins?
20:44:53mpeccoriniI'm using a couple simple functions borrowed from dict.c, but it doesn't have the means to deallocate memory
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20:56:28Nico_Pmpeccorini: I think doom has a malloc
20:56:41mpeccoriniok, thanks, I'll take a look at it
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20:58:29pixelmabut doom doesn't run on all targets - in opposite to chessbox, don't know if that's important...
20:59:19*mpeccorini needs to remember to take other targets into account all the time
20:59:52Nico_Ppixelma: the malloc code probably works on all targets
21:00:06Nico_Pmpeccorini: are you sure you need a malloc though ?
21:00:29mpeccoriniyes, I think I do
21:00:37mpeccoriniI use it for two purposes
21:01:09mpeccorini1. Load the list of games from a file. A single file can have between 1 and a couple thousand games
21:01:39mpeccorini2. Keep the history of a match. A match can have between 8 or 10 and almost 100 moves
21:02:27 Part Llorean
21:02:48mpeccorinithe list of games is used when running as a viewer so it's not needed if you're playing against the chess engine
21:03:18mpeccorinithe chess engine on it's side, has a table of moves where it analyzes what move it should do
21:03:40pixelmajust so you can imagine it a bit better... chessbox (in its current state) needs a bit more memory, so that it only works on the Archos targets when music is stopped...
21:03:56mpeccoriniif I make the list of games an array I would be limiting the memory it can use to analyze moves and it could play poorly
21:04:22Nico_Pok I see
21:04:38mpeccorinipixelma: to be honest, I think I could fix that
21:05:06mpeccorinithe guy who wrote the plugin made the table I mentioned a fixed array because there was no malloc
21:05:42 Quit Buschel ()
21:06:08 Join sexten [0] (
21:06:11 Join johnzorn [0] (
21:07:06sextenhello. I was just wondering if there is any way to get Rockbox to use the iTunes-ratings? (I know the ratins is stored in a separate database-file).
21:07:11johnzornhi, is there an easy way to find out if my ipod video is the normal one or the 64mb one?
21:08:12 Join DerPapst [0] (
21:09:14DerPapstsexten: rockbox doesn't support the iTunesDB file
21:09:41DerPapstjohnzorn: 60GB and 80GB ipods have 64MB ram
21:09:56johnzornok thanks
21:10:23DerPapstbtw.. do we already know for sure if the 5.5G 30GB iPod has 32MB or 64MB?
21:10:29sextenyeah, but is there no way to convert the iTunesDB-file to something Rockbox can read as "score"?
21:11:15 Join GodEater [0] (
21:11:36sextenand where is the Rockbox-ratings/scores stored?
21:11:41DerPapstsexten: not unless you write it. here is a good documentation of the iTUnesDB file (when the server is up again)
21:11:50 Join TrueJournals [0] (
21:12:06DerPapstor you wait long enough
21:12:14sextenif I had the time/knowledge I would give it a try at least:) but I'm no expert at computers/databases:(
21:13:09DerPapstrockbox is using its own database format. don't know where the rating is saved
21:13:22The-CompilerI've an idea with the image-tags in iCatcher: You can include this "button" where the codec is displayed in the backdrop, and can display the codec as text.
21:13:42sextenDerPapst: ok. thanks for your help:) I guess this matter have been discussed before?
21:13:45The-Compilerby the way: what's the difference beetween iCatcher and UniCatcher?
21:15:08DerPapstsexten: not that i know of (but i'm not often here though)
21:15:32sextenoh, ok. guess it's just me that is SO dependant of the rating-system, hehe
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21:18:24 Join Llorean [0] (
21:21:33sextenDerPapst: do you know if iPodLinux have some kind of support for the iTunes rating system?
21:22:47DerPapstsexten: look what i'Ve found :-D
21:23:01DerPapstdunno if it's that what you want tough
21:23:44DerPapstno. afaik podzilla0 doesn't care about ratings. but i can be wrong.
21:24:09sextenyeah I've seen that one but I doubt it includes ratings, but I will give it a shot. thank you:)
21:26:21sextenheh, my DB-file is 16MB
21:33:26sextenyeah, it doesn't convert the ratings
21:36:55sextenI found an iTunes Rating Importer script for Amarok though
21:37:13 Quit Rondom (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:37:24XavierGrwhat would you suggest for Rockbox compiling usage, debian stable or unstable?
21:37:58LloreanI think Stable had problems because of the age of some of the tools.
21:38:49amiconnstable should be okay now (since March)
21:39:01amiconnBut I would use testing for normal purposes
21:39:06 Join lids [0] (i=lds@gateway/tor/x-0456a81af75fc081)
21:39:08XavierGrwell stable was a problem at the time I picked it
21:39:13XavierGrbut then I didn't know about it
21:39:14amiconnIf you want cutting edge, use unstable
21:41:25 Join mirak [0] (
21:41:27amiconnBut then be prepared to run into some version and dependency conflicts every now and then
21:41:55*amiconn runs unstable on amd64, and testing on all x86 installations
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21:46:18 Quit Llorean ("Leaving.")
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21:58:39 Quit mpeccorini (" HydraIRC -> <- Organize your IRC")
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22:14:32 Part TrueJournals
22:17:01 Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
22:21:46 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
22:33:13 Quit Xerion (" ")
22:37:16 Join Uffish [0] (n=uffish@
22:38:02UffishHey. I updated my rockbox recently and some WPSs stopped working (I'm getting the default WPS instead). I also heard something about a "new WPS parser". Where can I find out more about that?
22:38:20 Join Flaffl21|Matt [0] (
22:38:25Flaffl21|MattHai guyz
22:38:32Flaffl21|MattWell, I have a Zune, and i put rockbox on it
22:38:37Flaffl21|Mattnow it is truly fucked up
22:39:05*petur falls off his chair
22:39:19peturyou should have put zune-linux on it
22:39:33peturrockbox doesn't work on zune
22:39:33Flaffl21|MattMY ZUNE IS RUINED
22:39:44Flaffl21|MattWHICH I GOT OFF OF EBAY FOR 500 $
22:39:54Flaffl21|Mattoff of ebay!
22:39:54peturstop shouting
22:39:57Flaffl21|Mattlast week!
22:40:02Flaffl21|Matti'm crying
22:40:04Flaffl21|Mattnot shouting
22:40:08Flaffl21|Mattyou don't even understand me
22:40:23peturyes, but you screwed up, not we
22:40:26Flaffl21|Mattyes you did
22:40:30Flaffl21|MattHELP ME
22:40:36Flaffl21|Mattmy life is ruined
22:40:39Flaffl21|Mattthanks to your assholeness
22:40:43peturwe do not support zune at all
22:41:05 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
22:41:07Flaffl21|Mattwell i dont support your family
22:41:12Flaffl21|Mattin darfur
22:41:30*petur summons channel op with big boot
22:41:39 Nick Flaffl21|Matt is now known as HelpMeMyZuneRuin (
22:41:49HelpMeMyZuneRuinhai gize
22:41:55HelpMeMyZuneRuinhelp me with my zune
22:42:01HelpMeMyZuneRuinI put rockbox on it
22:42:04HelpMeMyZuneRuinas i told you earlier
22:42:14HelpMeMyZuneRuinand the thing just gets stuck at the apple logo
22:42:26UffishMatt, the guy just said they don't support Zune. What are you asking for?
22:42:28peturzune has no apple logo
22:42:33HelpMeMyZuneRuinyes it does
22:42:37HelpMeMyZuneRuinare you blind
22:42:40pixelmaamiconn, scorche?
22:42:40HelpMeMyZuneRuinyou fuck
22:42:44HelpMeMyZuneRuinyou miserable piece of living fuck
22:42:48HelpMeMyZuneRuingo get some lasik surgery
22:42:53HelpMeMyZuneRuinfor your fuck existence of eyes
22:43:00HelpMeMyZuneRuinps <3
22:43:19HelpMeMyZuneRuinpetour can i cut your medula oblongata
22:43:29 Nick HelpMeMyZuneRuin is now known as petour (
22:43:35petourhi gize
22:43:43petourzune has no apple logo and i take everything as serious shit
22:43:49petourwow zune zunezune no help4u
22:44:10*petour slaps petour around a bit with a large trout
22:44:11petourk petur
22:44:16petoury ur haxin ma naem
22:44:21*petour slaps petour around a bit with a large trout
22:44:28 Nick petour is now known as puter (
22:44:32UffishSo, nobody knows anything about the supposedly new WPS parser which makes some WPSs stop working?
22:44:41 Nick puter is now known as Offish (
22:44:42Offishi r gay
22:45:01 Nick Offish is now known as pewter (
22:45:06peturUffish: did you see if the wps has been updated in the wiki?
22:45:08pewtertheres a pewter city
22:45:14Mode"#rockbox +o amiconn " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
22:45:17pewterpyoodur siddy
22:45:19LloreanUffish: It doesn't make them stop working. They were broken beforehand, just in more subtle ways. Now they have to be syntactically correct.
22:45:35 Nick pewter is now known as LIorean (
22:45:37LIoreani have no life
22:45:38LloreanUffish: All you need to do to fix them is visit the CustomWPS wiki page, and figure out where the errors are in the WPSes that don't work.
22:45:43UffishLiorean: what changed? what should I look for? I don't mind fixing it myself but there's no documentation.
22:45:45LIoreani wish i had friends
22:45:46LIoreanand a girlfriend
22:45:50LIoreanto talk about rockbox with
22:45:54LIoreanand a weiner i could see
22:46:01Mode"#rockbox +o Bagder " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
22:46:09LIoreanWHICH ONE IS IT
22:46:10LIoreanCAN YOU DO IT
22:46:19Mode"#rockbox +b *!* " by amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
22:46:27Kick(#rockbox LIorean :Bagder) by Bagder!n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder
22:46:38UffishDIAF, asshole.
22:46:47Uffishdamn that guy was annoying.
22:47:06Mode"#rockbox -o Bagder " by Bagder (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder)
22:47:20Mode"#rockbox -o amiconn " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
22:47:30*petur thanks Bagder
22:48:02UffishLIorean: can you describe the changes? the CustomWPS page hasn't changed in years and it seems my WPS is syntactically correct. I'm using EscapePod-AA btw, if that helps anyone.
22:48:31*pixelma thanks teamwork ;)
22:48:36peturdesowin: around?
22:49:20LloreanUffish: The ONLY changes were instead of ignoring bad WPSes, it doesn't load them.
22:49:21***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:49:25peturthat qtscrob patch you gave me is bad, I had to remove it again to be able to scrobble more than 10 tracks
22:49:25LloreanUffish: The syntax itself didn't change.
22:49:46LloreanUffish: The most common are conditionals that haven't been closed with a >
22:49:50desowinpetur: thanks
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22:50:16pixelmaUffish: most of the times it's unclosed conditionals or | that are used as characters which have to be escaped now - also album art tags make it fail on non album art builds
22:50:26zylcheGuys, .aac files should be able to play in rockbox, right?
22:50:48peturzylche: yes
22:51:00UffishLlorean/pixelma: thanks. My build has album art since other album art WPSs work, but I'll check the conditionals and the pipes.
22:51:03zylcheI've been trying some, but they don't seem to work
22:51:14UffishSo the loading of the default WPS is by design now?
22:51:20Lloreanzylche: How were they created?
22:51:37LloreanUffish: If the WPS is invalid, it falls back to the default rather than displaying a possibly broken WPS, yes.
22:51:38zylcheWouldn't know, I'll try and get the codec info
22:52:01UffishLlorean: thanks. now if only there was a WPS syntax highlighter... :)
22:52:40peturisn't there a wps parser debug option?
22:52:43saratogazylche: .aac is a raw aac stream
22:52:51saratogai don't know if rockbox can parse those
22:52:57saratogathey're not commonly used
22:53:05Lloreanpetur: With the UI sim, yes, you can have it give debug output
22:53:16LloreanI think you can also compile a standalone WPS verifier now, maybe?
22:53:18zylcheAhh, *looks up a way to mass convert*
22:53:32pixelmaUffish: if you are able to run a sim, you can start it with the −−debugwps flag (IIRC) and it'll give you some debug info
22:53:40 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
22:53:42saratogazylche: I believe foobar can put them into mp4
22:53:53saratogaif not, try some other mepg4 utility like mp4box or whatever
22:54:05zylcheArr, thar be a problem there. Linux
22:54:47saratogaeither use wine, or one of the open source mp4 utilties then
22:57:56jgarveyI'm running an Archos Fm Recorder, that frequent (1-3 times per day), locks up. It's running the June 06, 2007 build. The error message that is reported is that it can't access the playlist. I can hear disk retrys. Going into the menus and trying to look at the files will also fail after the error. Powering down, and then up again, and it all works fine. It seems to happen independently of the battery level. Any ideas what's happenin
22:58:24 Join TrueJournals [0] (
22:59:39amiconnjgarvey: Either one of the 2 battery cells doesn't have proper contact anymore (common problem on fmrs afaik), or the disk is going bad
23:01:01jgarveyamiconn: I loaded rockbox immediately after getting it. I've replaced the battery (and wouldn't the battery monitor indicate something), and it's been this way since I got it.
23:01:07Nico_PUffish: ther$
23:01:20Nico_PUffish, Llorean: there is a tool to check the WPS
23:01:22amiconnNo, the battery monitor wouldn't show it
23:01:30amiconnThe 2 cells are connected in parallel
23:01:43UffishNico_P: where/what?
23:01:45amiconnIf one doesn't have proper contact, 2 things happen
23:01:52 Join entheh [0] (
23:02:11Nico_Pzylche: there are several programs that can create an MP4 from your AAC file : MP4Box and mpeg4ip are the first that come to my mind
23:02:14amiconn(1) runtime is reduced to about 50% of the usual value - but only if the contact problem is permanent
23:02:35*DerPapst has missed all the fun :-D
23:02:40Nico_PUffish: you can use the sim as pixelma said, or you can build the checkwps program that's in the tools dir of the source
23:03:18jgarveyamiconn: I've been running it about 10 hours so far today, and the battery monitor is at 45 right now.
23:03:28amiconn(2) Since one cell has to power the whole thing, voltage might be unstable during high power requirements (i.e. disk spinup), which might cause effects like the one you observed
23:03:36UffishNico_P: thanks, but I'm trying to solve this without getting the source (plain lazy). The sim won't work since this is an album art build. I'm also on linux if that matters.
23:03:46UffishI'll just check it by hand I guess.
23:04:00Nico_PUffish: you can send it to me if you want
23:04:08zylcheChecking dir2ogg and soundkonverter currently
23:04:22amiconn10 hours doesn't sound like one cell is permanently disconnected. Note that I don't have an fmr myself so I can't tell for sure
23:04:34amiconnWhat's the hdd type?
23:04:35Nico_PUffish: also what you can do is comment out the AA tags and try your WPS in the sim
23:04:43Uffishoh, good idea.
23:05:05Uffishbut then I'd have to comment out any scrolling margins and the like... and it's possible the problem is there.
23:05:10jgarveyamiconn: It's 20GB, but I have no idea about further details.... is there a way to get it from the rockbox menus?
23:05:12amiconn(Info->Debug-View disk info)
23:05:29UffishAnyway, how hard can it be? It's half a screen of code, I've dealt with worse things :)
23:05:37*amiconn somehow expects Hitachi
23:05:43Nico_PUffish: oh yes if there are scrolling margins too then it might be harder to find the problem... you'd need a sim with those patches
23:06:09UffishI doubt I can get one for linux and I don't want to build anything from source. I'll do it manually.
23:06:22Nico_PUffish: look for spaces in conditionals, like "%?it <"
23:06:34Nico_Por unclosed conditionals
23:06:41Uffishyeah, I got that tip before :)
23:07:10Uffishspaces are allowed INSIDE conditionals though, right? Like %it< look! a space! |noSpaceOnThisOne>
23:07:17jgarveyamiconn: my disk is a Hitachi DK23DA-20
23:07:43Nico_PUffish: yes. it's just that the syntax must be respected to the letter
23:07:43amiconnExactly the type I expected
23:08:04amiconnThe Hitachi DK23DA series is a known problematic one
23:08:05Nico_PI know the new parser can be a bit annoying because it's very strict, but it's for the better
23:08:25jgarveyamiconn: problematic how?
23:08:46*jgarvey thinks duh it gliches
23:08:54zylcherockbox /can/ play ogg, right? [triple-checking]
23:09:13amiconnIf something isn't perfect, like voltage fluctuating a bit much, this disk simply stops responding
23:09:24Uffish(woohoo! I'm also answering questions! this is like so web2.0 and shit!)
23:09:33amiconn...unlike others, which just wait until conditions are okay, and then continue
23:10:00jgarveyamiconn: ok, that sounds right.
23:10:12Nico_Pzylche: but I think you should try muxing your aac in an mp4... no transcoding is always a much better option
23:10:25amiconnRockbox retries the request in this case, but sometimes the disk simply doesn't want to talk to rockbox again at all
23:10:52Uffish(some disks are such assholes)
23:10:58saratogaI'm just wondernig where the heck someone gets raw aac streams from
23:11:35UffishI'm off. Thankyou to everybody who helped me, and goodbye.
23:11:36jgarveyamiconn: so the solution would be a new disk... two questions: Recomended replacement disk? and How do I format the new disk (vfat?) to put for the new system?
23:11:44amiconnjgarvey: If everything else is okay (like batteries + battery contacts), your only option to make your fmr behave would be to change the hdd
23:11:47 Part Uffish
23:12:21amiconnYou need a standard 2.5" notebook hdd (standard 44-pin parallel ata, not sata)
23:13:30 Quit davina_ (Remote closed the connection)
23:14:08amiconnYou can put up to 120GB in with standard rockbox. For larger ones you either can't use everything above 128GB (or 136GB as the hdd manufacturers calculate), or need to build rockbox yourself and then use the rest of the disk as a second partition with some trickery
23:14:43jgarveyamiconn: 40 GB would probably hold all the music I own.
23:14:45chrisjs169i know there's a patch for album art and all, but is there one for 'integrated' album art (integrated into the music file)
23:15:16amiconnFormatting up to 32GB can be done with any system. Partitions larger than that can't be formatted as fat32 with windows xp, so you need a different method. There are several.
23:15:30 Join Rob2222 [0] (
23:15:58amiconn(1) Use win 2K or win 98 (needs drivers). (2) Use a tool on win xp like swissknife or h2format
23:16:06amiconn(3) use linux
23:16:10jgarveyamiconn: I a linux bigot
23:16:19zylcheYay, it's converting!
23:16:26*jgarvey can't type straight today
23:16:28zylche8th time lucky
23:17:37jgarveyamiconn: So, get a nice 40GB 2.5" ata drive, format on linux with fat32, copy what's on the existing drive over, and swap drives, right?
23:18:09amiconnYou can even format it in the recorder
23:18:28chrisjs169am i getting confused, or did the devs find a way to get sdhc to work with the Sansa?
23:19:13Bagderis sdhc even for microsd?
23:19:18saratogachrisjs169: my understanding is that no SDHC microsd cards are available at the moment, but that it might be possible
23:19:28amiconnIt's just a protocol thing
23:19:50 Join sticky-note [0] (i=5382f95a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:19:54Bagderyes, but why ask about it if there are no card
23:20:06amiconnI would expect that it's possible to support sdhc, but I don't know whether our driver already does that
23:20:10sticky-notehello you all
23:20:14Lloreansaratoga: I've seen pictures of what are supposedly MicroSDHC cards, as in "These aren't on sale yet but coming soon" pictures.
23:20:28LloreanWith all the usual Sandisk paint on them
23:20:31jgarveyamiconn: Ok, backup the files on my Archos to my laptop, swap in a nice 40 GB drive, format the drive as fat32, restore my files, right?
23:20:52amiconn8GB MMCs are supposed to be coming soon for almost a year now :(
23:21:21jgarveyamiconn: So the assumption here is that the archos flash provides USB access.
23:21:25amiconnjgarvey: Yes. This way you don't need extra adapters or such
23:21:51amiconnThe archos flash does provide usb access. YOu can also run rockbox from flash if you want
23:22:06amiconn(which also provides usb access of course)
23:22:09sticky-notei have a q: can rocketbox support multilanguage?
23:22:23jgarveyamiconn: very cool. One last question. You've avoided suggesting a drive. How do a avoid buying a drive with a gotcha like my Hitachi?
23:22:26Bagdersticky-note: what's multilanguage?
23:22:34jgarveyamiconn: is there a list somewhere?
23:22:55amiconnThe Hitachi DK23DA is the only known bad series
23:23:05jgarveyamiconn: ah that makes it simple.
23:23:07sticky-notei mean that i can see ID3 in other language than english
23:23:18amiconnI have such a thing lying around here (from my Studio 10)
23:23:23Bagdersticky-note: yes you can
23:23:30sticky-notelike hebrew or arabic or cerilic atc
23:23:38jgarveyamiconn: thank you very much!
23:23:42sticky-notehow can it be
23:24:00sticky-notei need to download rocketbox in my language?
23:24:23sticky-noteand one more thing
23:24:44saratogais there some elegant way to see if adding 2 integers will overflow short of doing it at a higher precision and checking the result?
23:25:17sticky-noterocketbox doesnt fuck the original system of my mp3 player>?
23:25:31 Quit sticky-note ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:25:39LloreanRockbox isn't in the habit of having carnal relations with anything.
23:25:50LloreanBut yes, properly installed, it's reversible.
23:27:05Bagdersaratoga: in assembly you often get a condition flag set when operations "overflow", but in plain C I can't think of a quick and easy way
23:27:50*amiconn finally notices saratoga around
23:28:17amiconnsaratoga: If you change the fixedpoint format to 17.15, what would be the impact on final output?
23:28:24LloreanCouldn't you just compare the result to either of the two values added together, and see if it's less than them? (I don't know anything about this sort of operation, I'm applying untested logic)
23:28:40amiconnThe final output is used as 16 bit samples, isn't it?
23:28:43 Join sticky-note [0] (i=5382f95a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:28:55saratogaamiconn: I put it back afterwards
23:29:09sticky-notehey you all again
23:29:23saratogaso the output gets converted after the imdct, but it didn't work too well anyway
23:29:34sticky-notei have another q: is the rocketbox rehearsable?
23:29:43saratogafixed some of the problems, but I still got half of the problem samples or so overflowing
23:29:49amiconnThe important thing with fixedpoint conversions is, as I understand it, to use the precision you need, which isn't always the possible maximum
23:30:31amiconnSo if 17.15 (or 18.14) yields sufficient precision, why use more?
23:30:39saratogayes, i think the real problem is that the decoder isn't makeing use of precision correctly, because the fp version never exceeds 2^15 for any sample
23:30:43 Quit rp- ()
23:31:10amiconnSometimes it also makes sense to use different formats for different variables
23:31:19saratogathats what i'm thinking about
23:31:43saratogait seems like i must be not using the available range efficiently at some stage to get such rounding problems
23:31:44Bagdersticky-note: it is called "Rockbox" nothing else. what is "rehearsable2 ?
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23:32:46 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:33:12saratogaamiconn: are you familar with any fixed point codecs?
23:33:32 Join lids_ [0] (i=lds@gateway/tor/x-f15fe66ab3f95e20)
23:34:19amiconnI'm not really familiar with any codes.
23:34:23 Quit sticky-note ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:34:45amiconnI had a look at some parts of codecs, like flac (namely the lpc decoder)
23:34:58 Join sticky-note [0] (i=5382f95a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:35:02amiconnBut I also did some fixed point work, e.g. in mandelbrot
23:35:08 Nick sticky-note is now known as guest294800 (i=5382f95a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:35:58amiconnI also tried to get my head around the rice decoder in flac...
23:36:09guest294800rehearsable i mean that i can delete it wont causes any damage to my mp3
23:36:19saratogai'm mostly wondering if they play around with the precision at times
23:36:42saratogai guess MS probably designed this codec with fixed point in mind, so it seems like theres probably some solution to this that makes it all work in 32 bits
23:36:59amiconnI think so too
23:37:05Bagderguest294800: I'd call that reversable... but yes, Rockbox can be removed again. We don't give any guarantees of course.
23:37:24guest294800 i c
23:37:28guest29480010x anyway
23:37:55 Join Robin0800 [0] (
23:38:13 Quit guest294800 (Client Quit)
23:38:15amiconnThose el cheapo players available nearly everywhere usually play mp3 and wma, and I don't think these cheap chips (often sigmatel) can handle floating point
23:38:25 Join Thundercloud__ [0] (n=thunderc@
23:40:54 Quit pearldiver (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:42:08 Join Xerion [0] (
23:42:39saratogaamiconn: theres actually commercial decoders which work on 24x24 bit mul units some DSPs have
23:42:44saratogano idea how that works though
23:47:36 Quit petur ("zzzz")
23:47:41 Join perldiver [0] (
23:48:51 Join webguest71 [0] (i=cfbc4151@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:49:09webguest71Can anyone help me install Rockbox on a Toshiba Gigabeat F10?
23:49:48saratogawebguest71: did it the other day
23:49:55saratogajust follow the instructions in the manual
23:50:00saratogatakes about 2 minutes
23:50:24webguest71Where do I extract the files to? There's only 'My Music' and 'Pictures.'
23:50:54webguest71When I go to 'Toshiba Gigabeat' from My Computer, that is.
23:51:01saratogawebguest71: you have to show hidden files
23:51:05saratogai believe this is in the manual
23:52:09 Quit ompaul ("sleep well")
23:53:54webguest71How do I make those show up?
23:54:04 Quit Robin0800 (" Try HydraIRC -> <-")
23:55:36saratogatools > options
23:55:40saratogasomewhere in there
23:55:56DerPapstif anyone is interested.. there is a bug in xobox. If you've selected 75% as difficulty you have to remove 76% of this black thingy.
23:56:07DerPapstin xobox.c line 788
23:56:17DerPapstit should be:
23:56:17DerPapstif (percentage_cache > difficulty) {
23:56:24DerPapst*it is
23:56:34DerPapstand it should be: if (percentage_cache >= difficulty) {
23:57:47saratogaDerPapst: might as well submit a patch if yo'ure fixed it
23:57:52*DerPapst thinks that making a bug report for that is a bit overkill ;)
23:58:34DerPapstsaratoga: i should make a patch for that tiny change?
23:58:42DerPapsti can do so....
23:58:46LloreanI'll fix it.
23:58:53DerPapstthanks :)

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