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#rockbox log for 2007-08-22

00:02:26 Join saratoga [0] (i=98039a9c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-4710d9a17262b79f)
00:02:34saratogadoes the gigabeat power off the USB port?
00:02:47saratogait seems like i'm wearing the battery down just copying files
00:03:10LloreanThe gigabeat even charges off USB
00:03:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:03:46 Quit jgarvey (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:06:16 Join polygonal [0] (i=97c4141b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-27fc452ad4ae9dfa)
00:07:54polygonalhow is logf supposed to work?
00:08:03polygonalI enabled logf in my ipod 60gb
00:08:15polygonal*ipod 60gb build
00:08:34polygonaland I got nothing in debug - logf dump
00:09:21polygonalthere is a logf.txt in /.rockbox, and I also noticed disk spin up when accessing debug -> logf dump
00:09:28peturheh... increasing the delay between touch detection and ADC reading improves stability a lot :)
00:09:59rasherpolygonal: debug -> logf dump dumps the entries of the logf buffer to /.rockbox/logf.txt
00:10:05polygonalbut the screen shows nothing... and logf.txt is not helpful since the text-viewer can't handle long text
00:10:23dionoeayour PC has a text viewer
00:10:58LloreanYou can't fix bugs on the player, so a logf build isn't much use without a PC anyway
00:10:59polygonaldionoea: yeah, but that defeat the purpose of viewing that on my dap
00:11:00 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
00:11:20polygonalsince I want to watch some dump realtime
00:11:23 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@83-70-167-8.b-ras1.prp.dublin.eircom.net)
00:11:35rasherpolygonal: What are you trying to accomplish?
00:11:42peturalso on the remote if rockbox supports it
00:11:44polygonalwithout plugging into my computer and plug it out to read the logf...
00:12:01ddaltonis anyone interested in commiting p7561? I think LinusN was going to do it. But from what I can tell it hasn't been commited.
00:12:44polygonalrasher: I'm trying to debug something I patched
00:12:52peturddalton: that's normal, just keep nagging ;)
00:13:16rasherI wonder how to translate "o'clock" into Danish
00:13:22barrywardellpetur: interesting. what did you change the delay to?
00:13:31polygonalpetur: ipod does not have a remote :(
00:13:52peturinitially 500, I'm moving it down to see what a good value is...
00:14:09ddaltonpetur: am I nagging to much? Are you interested in commiting it?
00:14:29peturbarrywardell: it still has occasional spikes which can be filtered
00:14:41ddaltonis it better to say 8 0 pm or 8 o'clock
00:15:11barrywardellpetur: it would be nice to instead use the adc status register to tell when it's ready
00:15:47peturddalton: there was a smiley behind it. I mean, this is a spare-time project for all of us, so we don always have the time. Nagging = keep us reminded...
00:16:01barrywardellpetur: there are also a few filter patches on the tracker if you haven't seen them yet
00:16:29ddaltonok so my question is is there any interest in commiting it?
00:16:41ddaltonthe patch file is only 3.5 kb
00:16:47ddaltonso it is very small
00:16:55peturbarrywardell: I haven't... do we know where adc status register is?
00:17:21 Join kk [0] (n=kkit@140.141.29.201)
00:17:33peturddalton: I'm busy right now with something else... relax a bit...
00:17:41ddaltonok
00:17:43rasherddalton: I'll have a look at it in a little while - it looks fairly simple
00:17:55 Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@westquad-188-46.reshall.umich.edu)
00:17:58ddaltonok thanks
00:17:59barrywardellpetur: we suspect it's ADC_STATUS, but that's just a guess by MrH
00:18:02ddaltonlet me know how you go
00:18:28peturbarrywardell: I'll try to find out
00:18:47barrywardellpetur: my re of the adc code might help: http://pastebin.ca/666199
00:18:49 Quit scorche (" rebooting...")
00:19:07rasherddalton: I will, if no one beats me to it. Fixing bugs in the Danish translation right now
00:19:28peturbarrywardell: nice
00:19:31ddaltonok so are you going to commit it once that is done?
00:19:47rasherddalton: Probably, yes
00:19:59peturddalton: relax man... no hurry ;)
00:21:13ddaltonPetur: ok
00:21:43ddaltonI didn't edit the Danish file. Was I meant to?
00:21:54ddaltonI can only talk english
00:22:00peturrofl
00:22:31villadelfiahttp://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=11978.0 <−− this guy could use dd for windows to solve the problem... (http://www.chrysocome.net/dd)
00:23:07rasherddalton: no, what I mean is that I'm currently doing something else before I will look at your patch
00:23:16ddaltonok
00:23:29barrywardellpetur: if you like, I can also send you an email exchange I had with MrH about the ADC
00:23:45 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-0-132.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)
00:23:51peturbarrywardell: sure
00:24:48barrywardellwhere should I send it to?
00:25:21 Join barrywardell_ [0] (n=barrywar@83-70-167-8.b-ras1.prp.dublin.eircom.net)
00:25:35 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:26:28peturbarrywardell_: my mail is in the wiki (http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PeterDHoye)
00:28:12 Quit krazykit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:29:47barrywardell_petur: sent :)
00:30:12peturand arrived... thanks
00:30:41peturwhoa... long mail
00:31:11 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
00:32:06rasherddalton: did you remove the voicing of seconds on purpose?
00:32:19peturrasher: yes
00:32:26peturit was discussed already
00:32:35rasherExcellent. Seems reasonable anyway.
00:33:46ddaltonyes id did is that ok?
00:33:52ddaltonyes I did is that ok?
00:34:05rasherSure, especially if you already discussed that.
00:34:25rasherI'm pretty much just making the code stay within 80 characters wide.
00:34:26 Join finux [0] (n=finux@p549553D5.dip.t-dialin.net)
00:34:38finuxWTF
00:34:45rasherEspecially the comments. I can understand that's not easy to keep track of if you're blind
00:35:20peturfinux?
00:38:29ddaltonsorry about the line width. I should of check that.
00:38:32finuxyeah
00:39:25ddaltonrasher: is there anything else wrong with it.
00:39:44 Join MySic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net)
00:40:43rasherddalton: not really, I'm just changing some comments so they hopefully make more sense (always helps to get someone else to read it)
00:41:13ddaltonok and then can it be commited? or does something else have to happen.
00:41:26 Part finux ("Verlassend")
00:41:48rasherThat's it
00:43:54rasherPity I don't have a target with RTC so I can test it
00:45:01 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:46:18 Quit ender` (" Washing your car to make it rain doesn't work.")
00:46:32 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat")
00:46:39ddaltonyou could test it on simulater couldn't you. Or doesn't voice work. But it does work.
00:47:10ddaltonif the time setting is set to 24 hour it will say the time as before but with out the settings.
00:47:37rasherI'll try testing it on the simulator
00:48:10barrywardell_just looking at the bugs with FS #7634. Is the cut/paste problem present in SVN or is it new?
00:48:14 Quit midkay ("Leaving")
00:48:20ddaltonotherwise if you can't then send me your diff file and I can test it on my h300.
00:48:47barrywardell_and any thoughts about the stkov? I have 66% ata/sd stack on my 8gb sansa + 4gb sdhc
00:50:09 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:52:24iambenbarrywardell_: nice work on that patch btw. i dont even have an sdhc card, or plans to buy one soon, but i'll sure sleep better knowing that i can use one when i run outta space =)
00:53:11ddaltonI see what you were saying about the line width.
00:53:41ddaltonit was apparently 111 colums wide one of the lines anyway. That's what my screenreader said.
00:54:33 Join Robin0800 [0] (n=Robin080@cpc3-brig8-0-0-cust132.brig.cable.ntl.com)
00:55:31rasherddalton: I fixed that, and committed just now.
00:55:45ddaltonok thanks
00:57:22peturoh, it's your first patch that gets committed... congratulations
00:57:37ddaltonthanks do I get my name in the credits?
00:57:42ddaltonjust joking
00:57:48peturit was added
00:57:55bluebrotherpetur: remove it again ;-)
00:58:05barrywardell_iamben: there's something nice about getting sdhc support before sandisk!
00:58:09 Quit My_Sic (No route to host)
00:58:24peturbluebrother: why, is there a typo in it? :p
00:58:32bluebrotherrotfl :)
00:59:19ddaltonbluebrother: were you talking to me?
00:59:28bluebrotherddalton: I was just joking
00:59:37ddaltono ok
00:59:52ddaltonbut do I just out of quriosity?
01:00
01:00:03ddaltonit doesn't worry me to much
01:00:05rasherbarrywardell_: Good work indeed. Very neat to have sdhc support when the e200 might not ever support it (someone on the sandisk mentioned something about a possible "plus" model)
01:00:12rasherddalton: I added your name to the credits, yes
01:00:19bluebrotherpetur twice fixed a typo I did and reintroduced unintentionally ...
01:01:00bluebrotherthe new current build page is really nice. Much cleaner for users :)
01:04:22 Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
01:05:47peturbarrywardell_: do I see it correctly that (in adc_h10.c) the adc conversion is started and values read immediatly?
01:07:49barrywardell_petur: yes, looks like it does. that doesn't seem right though
01:08:06peturok, working on it ;)
01:08:19barrywardell_i think we should wait till ADC_STATUS says it's ready
01:08:37peturthat's what I'm adding now
01:11:27barrywardell_I don't know why it's not there already
01:11:54*petur knows and removes battery to reset H10
01:17:08peturbarrywardell_: seems not working... was this tried before?
01:17:41 Quit obo ("bye")
01:17:51barrywardell_petur: possibly. I can't remember, but maybe that's why it's not in the current code
01:20:05 Quit jhulst ("Konversation terminated!")
01:24:37 Join sarixe [0] (n=sarixe@pool-68-239-217-158.nwrk.east.verizon.net)
01:24:47polygonalpetur: regarding your comment in my patch FS #7626 (viewing playlist problem when stopping), the playlist viewer does work when just stopped (i.e. there is still active resume), but when there is nothing to resume
01:25:22polygonalthat is, when you try "resume playback" from main menu and it tells you that "nothing to resume"
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01:25:38 Quit Robin0800 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:26:01polygonalyou cannot view a playlist via context menu either from file browser and from playlist catalog - the viewer will exit itself immediately
01:26:23polygonalso I think it's a bug... can you confirm it again? Thanks
01:26:27peturpolygonal: ok, so create a playlist file and then get the playlist cleared?
01:29:32 Quit polygonal ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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01:29:46peturpolygonal: ok, I think I managed to reproduce
01:30:44polygonal_petur: if you have time, can you have a look at my patch then?
01:30:52 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
01:31:13peturtime is indeed the keyword ;)
01:33:08polygonal_take your time then :) it's a really small bug fix...
01:33:27 Quit courtc (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
01:33:53peturI'll do it now and then shutdown myself ;)
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01:39:18peturpolygonal_: I'll need your real name in order to accept the patch (will test it first)
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01:41:46peturpolygonal_: patch fixes the issue ok
01:46:32 Quit barrywardell_ ()
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01:46:32 Quit polygonal_ ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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01:46:32peturpolygonal_: saw my response?
01:46:32 Part pixelma
01:46:32polygonal_sorry the web client keep trying to kick me out
01:46:32polygonal_yes, my name is already on credit file - I did the Chinese translation
01:46:32peturdon't backspace in it ;)
01:46:39peturah ok
01:51:01peturpolygonal_: committed
01:51:52 Quit bluebrother (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
01:53:39polygonal_petur: thanks
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02:00
02:03:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:08:02barrywardellcan someone with a regular sd card (not sdhc) please test FS #7634 and make sure it doesn't break anything?
02:08:46 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:09:17JdGordon_barrywardell: ok, ill put that on my sansa now
02:09:24barrywardellthanks
02:10:31 Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:10:32 Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net)
02:10:50peturhahah mpegplayer gives me a prefetch abort at C0EDBABE
02:12:02thegeekheheee
02:12:30JdGordon_damn geeks and their hex funnies :p
02:12:50*petur does shutdown on self
02:12:58 Quit petur ("Zzzzzz")
02:14:03JdGordon_barrywardell: the whole audiobuffer isnt being filled...?
02:14:44JdGordon_and i get init error (-119) in the disk debug screen for the msd card
02:15:32 Quit bdgraue (Remote closed the connection)
02:15:46barrywardellJdGordon_: looks like there's some more work to be done :(
02:16:15JdGordon_hmm... no.. cant reproduce it
02:16:54barrywardellthe init error, or the audiobuffer thing?
02:17:02barrywardellI can't see how the audiobuffer could be affected
02:17:06JdGordon_both
02:17:10JdGordon_commit it...
02:17:24LloreanI seem to recall someone else reporting a -119 on the first attempt
02:17:24JdGordon_its possible my didgey cards just played up
02:17:28JdGordon_seems fine now
02:18:14barrywardellok, committing
02:18:38*JdGordon_ starts looking fr cheapish 4gb micro's :p
02:18:41 Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
02:19:11JdGordonbut shower/uni/work first.. ttyl
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02:40:31 Join GRaTT [0] (i=gratty@d207-6-111-215.bchsia.telus.net)
02:41:40GRaTTThe custom splash patch now uses a plugin and menu item for autorock. No delay for non users.
02:42:02GRaTTallows for any plugin to autostart and a custom user splash screen
02:42:37GRaTTalso sets a config file when run with a bitmap parameter
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02:48:26GRaTTFS 7538 could it be commited
02:48:41LloreanGRaTT: Why have you added things like autorock that are unrelated to the boot splash?
02:48:44 Quit hcs ("Leaving.")
02:49:38GRaTTIt did not look like it was wanted as it was so I implemented it another way
02:49:57ddaltondoes the ID2P in this line make it voice? gui_syncsplash(HZ, ID2P(LANG_TAGCACHE_BUSY));
02:51:33LloreanGRaTT: But it looks like you've just taken over the autorock functionality, which kinda means that the autorock functionality can't be used for other things without breaking custom splashes, and vice versa
02:53:08GRaTTIt is really only an autorock menu option and a splash plugin
02:53:51 Quit ddalton ("I was using BOFHNet IRC version 1.2 by fmillion - get your copy today from http://www.the-bofh.com/bofhnet/irc !")
02:54:21LloreanYes, but 1) autorock isn't normally compiled in, 2) How do you use autorock AND a splash?
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02:55:26ddaltonwhere is the running time screen code?
02:55:33GRaTTwith the patch autorock is compiled. one must make choices. I prefered it in it's last implementation
02:56:01GRaTTThis way it is a little slower for the splash
02:56:14LloreanWell, you must make choices as you say
02:56:49LloreanBut I think this method is unlikely to be accepted
02:56:52GRaTTcustom splash seems to be wanted by users but not devs.
02:57:09GRaTTWhat method may be accepted.
02:57:47LloreanOne that doesn't slow down startup, preferably works with flashed Rockbox, and doesn't remove the ability to use an existing feature.
02:58:56GRaTTflashed rockbox was the only issue with the last implementation I think.
02:58:57LloreanDoesn't slow down startup for people not using a custom splash, rather
02:58:57LloreanOne of the big advantages of Rockbox is that on many players it boots faster.
02:59:31GRaTTI only have sansa to test with and the previous way was no slowdown on boot
02:59:59LloreanFlash based targets are not good to test this on.
03:00
03:00:59GRaTTI move the call for the logo to after the setting are read so is no slower, just appears for shorter time.
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03:02:02LloreanExplain that to the people who rejected it then.
03:02:11GRaTTunless a custom splash is used.
03:02:12LloreanBut it still needs to work on flashed targets.
03:04:14GRaTTNot much feedback on FS except what needed to be implemented, so I guess it is not desired.
03:06:12LloreanYou need to discuss it with the people who object to it, then.
03:06:40GRaTTWhat about FS7076 calendar. works great on sansa and is already committed for some targets.
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03:53:57ddaltonwho coded the running time screen
04:00
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04:03:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:34:49CorryIs there any good way to debug a Data Abort error?
05:35:29scorchethe memory address can be used with teh map file
05:35:41hcsCorry: when I've run across it it's always been an issue of alignment, what're you up to?
05:36:08CorryNothing, just built a new version, tried to play a file and it died....I havent been able to do any development for a while :(
05:36:36CorryI have tried several builds figuring something was up w/ my pc, same thing all the time but different addresses
05:36:58CorryI fear the worst for my ipod...
05:42:55LloreanWhich type of iPod?
05:43:56ddaltonI know noone is interested in p7639 because it adds another menu option. But is there anything wrong with the coding?
05:44:34CorryIpod video 30 GB
05:49:01ddaltonwhat is "teh map file"
05:49:02ddalton?
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05:53:27Lloreanddalton: the map file is the file that describes where things are in memory
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05:56:11ddaltonwhere is it
05:56:21Corryugh, I installed a build that prevents it from going into USB mode w/o a certain buttom pressed....and I can't figure out what button that is...I feel like a moron!
05:56:53ddaltonjust boot the apple fw and then connect it.
05:57:41Corrylol, is that what the patch is supposed to do?
05:57:48ddaltonwhat one?
05:58:02 Quit midgey ()
05:58:10ddaltonp7639?
05:58:58ddaltonCorry: were you talking to me?
05:59:08Corrywow.....found it....it was in plain sight
05:59:20Corrymenu button for those interested :)
05:59:22ddaltonCorry: what patch were you talking about?
05:59:37Corryhttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5744
06:00
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06:01:56Corryinteresting, I found an old build of rockbox I had....testing that now to see if I still get the data abort....
06:02:39Corryhmmm or maybe not so old...weird, its got cvs directories though....
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06:03:11Corrygot a different message though this time, "Codec Failure"
06:03:40***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:04:11Corrysame thing on 4 more files...codec failure...
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06:06:42Corrywell, I guess I'll try pulling the latest down from SVN and building with this computer which I know has the proper toolchain installed...
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06:29:15CorryHmmm, so my old rockbox.zip included a rockbox.ipod in the root, the new ones do not, is this something I missed?
06:30:21CorryDo I need a new bootloader?
06:30:41scorcheyes
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06:31:29Corrythanks. off to fix that...
06:31:40scorcheand make sure to delete the old rockbox.ipod when updating
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06:32:07Corryyeah, I figured once the new bootloader is on there, I should get rid of the old one...
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06:42:39Corrywow....not only did I need to delete the \rockbox.ipod I needed do delete .rockbox completly and unzip the fullzip....even though I told it to overwrite..
06:42:43Corryanyways, thanks for the help
06:42:55Corrynight everyone
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07:57:24ddaltonwho made the last update. (r14425?)
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08:11:02amiconnddalton: me.
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08:14:41Cormhi, could somebody please tell me how to completely remove rockbox from a H340?
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08:18:21ddaltonyes read the manual.
08:18:53ddaltonbut get an unpatch bootloader install it and remove the rockbox folder and rockbox.iriver file.
08:19:04ddaltonyou install it in the iriver firmware.
08:19:19ddaltonBut I am sure the manual will tell you how to do this.
08:20:35Cormthanks, as far as I know, all I have to do is delete the rockbox files, download a fresh unpatched firmware from the iriver site, load up iriver fw by pressing REC and play and then upgrade the firmware. Is that all? :)
08:20:45LinusNCorm: yes
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08:21:20ddaltonyes but if you remove the rockbox files you might be able to just press play. don't know.
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08:21:44ddaltonjust boot the iriver fw that is the main thing.
08:21:55Cormok thanks:)
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08:29:04*amiconn thinks that the 24 hour time announcement shouldn't say 'hours' and 'minutes'
08:29:32amiconnThat sounds odd. And it should also use 'o'clock' for the full hours
08:31:43ddaltonamiconn: do you want me to make a patch to do this?
08:34:08ddaltonamiconn: where it says + if (hour >= 12) in your commit to r14425 does this voice the time if it is > than 12 o'clock?
08:34:22amiconnsure
08:34:40amiconnIt behaves exactly the same as before, just with less code
08:34:44ddaltonwhat question were you answering?
08:34:53amiconnthe latter one
08:34:57ddaltonok so you have tested?
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08:36:35ddaltonwhat does + talk_id(pm ? VOICE_PM : VOICE_AM, true);
08:36:36ddaltondo
08:36:37ddalton?
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08:42:24amiconnddalton: It's a conditional expression. But the latest version doesn't have that any longer
08:42:57amiconnAnd I just committed the suggested changes for 24 hour announcement, plus some further changes for 12 hour
08:43:33ddaltonok so over all is the patch ok that got commited?
08:43:40ddaltonlet me just see your commit.
08:46:31ddaltonso 20 o'clock sounds good?
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08:47:20markunddalton: sounds terrible if you ask me
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08:47:47ddaltonamiconn: is that how it is voiced?
08:47:57ddaltonI think the same it doesn't sound right.
08:48:53amiconnAfaik it is correct to say that
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08:52:13amiconnhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24-hour_clock#The_24-hour_clock_in_spoken_English
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08:54:42ddaltonfor 14 hours would it say 14:00 
08:55:36ddaltonamiconn: did you read the page?
08:56:40LinusNddalton: as in "fourteen hundred", or "fourteen oh oh"?
08:57:06ddaltonwhat has changed in rev14427?
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08:57:16jbitin denmark people generally just say "fourteen" but i guess that's not correct
08:57:20ddaltonthe email hasn't come through yet. But I can svn up to it.
08:57:42ddaltonso 14 7?
08:57:51ddaltonfor 14 hours and 7 minutes?
08:57:52LinusN"Don't say 'hours' and 'minutes' in the 24 hour time announcement, and use 'o'clock' for full hours too. Some further simplification for 12 hour time announcement"
08:58:18ddaltonis that rev 14427? I thought that was rev14426
08:58:23amiconnThe current voicing is english centric anyway. Quite a number of places use wrong order/ wording for other languages
08:58:31LloreanSo "fourteen o'clock, fourteen oh-one, fouteen oh-two" etc
08:58:37amiconnIn order to fix that, we need a language specific code module
08:58:42jbiti think the danes i speak to don't know how to translate clocken or so
08:58:42LinusNi think i would like it to say "fourteen oh seven"
08:59:07B4gderme too
08:59:33jbitnod
08:59:55amiconnFor instance, the time is announced in German with 'Uhr' between the hours and minutes. At the full hour, the minutes are left out altogether
09:00
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09:02:36LinusNand in swedish, we mostly say nothing between the hours and the minutes, and leave out the minutes on full hours
09:02:56B4gderyeah, unless we wanna be very specific about it being 00 sharp
09:02:59LinusNbut sometimes we also say "och" between the hours and the minutes
09:03:32B4gderlike 14:00 spelled out means exactly 14:00, while just 14 is a bit more relaxed
09:03:40LinusNtrue
09:03:44amiconnThe idea of a language specific code module isn't new.
09:04:01amiconnFor instance, the number voicing order is also wrong for German
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09:04:24B4gderyeah, for a bunch of languages i'd guess
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09:04:27amiconnIn German, tens and ones are swapped (from 21 to 99)
09:04:44B4gderfrench is strange as well
09:04:45peturin Dutch we mostly say something between hours and minutes, not after
09:04:49amiconnYou say (translated) two-and-fourty for 42
09:04:50ddaltonis this right? http://pastebin.ca/raw/666548
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09:05:13markunpetur: I would say "14 uur 7" for example
09:05:16peturamiconn: same in Dutch
09:05:29peturmarkun: yes
09:05:43amiconnYeah, same as German
09:05:52amiconnJust uur->Uhr
09:05:56peturmarkun: I think Germans say the same
09:06:01*petur slow
09:06:28LinusNddalton: looks correct i think
09:06:36ddaltonI haven't tested the patch but is that right?
09:07:21LinusNddalton: i believe so
09:07:35LinusNdoes the original sansa firmware support sdhc?
09:07:53B4gdernope
09:08:01B4gderrockbox rocks harder ;-)
09:08:04LinusNk00l
09:08:12amiconnpetur: Do you also leave out 00 minutes in dutch?
09:08:20peturyes
09:08:42amiconnB4gder: It sure does. On Ondio, we support MMCs up to 4GB. OF only supports 1GB
09:08:50ddaltonok just if it is 14 hours and 7 minutes how would you like to voice it.
09:09:19amiconnddalton: The current way doesn't allow different methods per language
09:10:08ddaltonamiconn: so how should it be voiced. Your wiki page you told me about says 14 hundred. Is that correct?
09:10:24LinusNddalton: i'd like it to say "fourteen oh seven"
09:10:32ddaltonhow should 14 hours and 7 minutes be voiced?
09:10:34amiconnBoth 14 hundred and 14 o'clock would be correct according to wikipedia
09:10:46B4gderfourteen oh seven
09:10:57ddaltonso not 14 7?
09:11:16LinusNno
09:11:21ddaltonand while I am at it what about 12 hour should it say 2 07 or 2 7?
09:11:32B4gderoh seven is what the wikipedia article says as well
09:11:49ddaltonLinusN so 2 o 7?
09:11:57LinusNsounds correct
09:12:06B4gder12 hour clock is a mystery I can comment on ;-)
09:12:10B4gdercannot
09:12:19ddaltonok I will generate a patch should I put it in the tracker?
09:12:22JdGordonyou guys are all crazy... 14:07 would be 10 past 2
09:12:31ddaltonyeah
09:12:39JdGordonand 14:10 would be "3 min pas the las time you asked"
09:12:47LinusNJdGordon: you mean round off to nearest 10?
09:12:49ddaltonthat's right.
09:12:59JdGordonLinusN: prett much... we are lazy here
09:13:11JdGordonusualy round up to the nearst 5
09:13:15LinusNJdGordon: just don't try to catch a train using rockbox
09:13:29JdGordon:) wont make a difference here.. train are never on time
09:13:33LinusNhahaha
09:14:10LinusNso it should say "like 10 past 2 or something" instead? :-)
09:14:25JdGordonspot on
09:14:35JdGordoncept its quater past 5 here..
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09:16:49ddaltonLinusN there is only 0 in the lang file should I add a lang string for "o"
09:17:18B4gderthat'd be really bad for non-english...
09:17:37ddaltonSo JdGordon it is now 20 past 5 not 5 17?
09:17:52ddaltonso what should it be?
09:18:04LinusNddalton: yes, i think you should be able to add LANG_OH
09:18:06B4gderor perhaps not if it would be translated to something else than oh for other langauges
09:18:27JdGordonddalton: well.. i was being funny... but usually when someone tells you the time its not exact... but for voicing it shoud be
09:18:29LinusNB4gder: like nothing, for example
09:18:33ddaltondo you want to hear "8 07" or "8 o7" or "8 7"
09:18:36B4gderyeps
09:18:44B4gder"Toshiba just announced an 8GB microSDHC card "
09:18:44ddaltonyeah I know
09:18:48ddaltonI was joking.
09:19:12JdGordonB4gder: mmmm do they say when it goes on sale?
09:19:14LinusNin swedish, LANG_ZERO and LANG_OH would both be "noll"
09:19:24ddaltoneveryone happy with lang_o and it will say "o"?
09:19:32B4gderJdGordon: not really => http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/22/toshiba-announces-32gb-16gb-sdhc-cards/
09:19:35amiconnHmm, someone has a clever idea for where the language specific code could reside?
09:19:49LinusNddalton: i think it should be LANG_OH, and be set to "oh"
09:20:05amiconnThe problem is that it will probably also need some extra voice IDs, depending on the language
09:20:22JdGordonB4gder: 32gb full size.... i'd hate t lose it :p
09:20:29ddaltonsorry LinusN I didn't pick that up straight away with my screenreader.
09:20:30B4gderhehe
09:20:59ddaltonI can only talk english. What do I do about the other language files?
09:21:40B4gderddalton: you don't need to worry about them, the translators of each language does that
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09:23:12LinusNamiconn: i believe the language specific modules would be a new set of plugins
09:23:26LinusNlike the codecs
09:24:18JdGordoncant we have the talk similar to printf strings? just need to quickly parse it...
09:24:52LinusNJdGordon: that's an idea
09:24:52ddaltonok I am just going to test my patch then I will put it on the tracker.
09:26:31*JdGordon wishes we could have a system where parts of the core are loaded at boot depending on hat the user wants
09:26:39JdGordoni.e I have no use for voice, so whyload it?
09:26:50JdGordonand same with the fancy wps's
09:28:04B4gderI don't use voice, and my rockbox doesn't load any voice...
09:28:21ddaltonhey could someone using linux build my voice file for me. It will take me 45 minutes otherwise.
09:28:34ddaltonI have a patch that adds strings to english.lang
09:28:40LinusNJdGordon: there are such systems around, one of them is called "Windows", and people constantly complain about boot times
09:29:06JdGordonyeah.. but...
09:29:31LinusNand we really don't need to add more complexity in rockbox
09:29:39LinusNrather the opposite
09:29:43ddaltondoesn't matter I will do it later.
09:29:43B4gderamen
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09:47:06Obnautikusmy ipods loader is fuxd i dont have any backups
09:47:30scorchedefine "fuxd"
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09:47:50*B4gder checks webster for "fuxd"
09:47:54Obnautikusfound bootloader-ipod4g.ipod and ipod_mbr.bin from the download url
09:48:12scorchedid you not follow our instructions?
09:48:14linuxstbHave you read the install section in the manual?
09:48:33Obnautikusive been messing with ipodlinux/rockbox for a few yrs now
09:48:48Obnautikusi dont even want the orginal os
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09:49:11scorchewhat did you do?
09:49:26linuxstbI would suggest reading the manual, and also this page - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodPatcher
09:49:29NHealniven.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
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09:49:49Obnautikusu need an uncorupted mbr /firmware partition to use the patcher
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09:49:53GodEateralso http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodManualRestore
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09:50:30linuxstbObnautikus: What's your actual question?
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09:50:47GodEaterhe's broken his firmware partition, and needs to mend it. <−− my guess
09:51:49Obnautikuswhoah whats that ipsw file might help
09:52:13GodEaterit's apples firmware upgrade file
09:52:56linuxstbIt's a zip file containing an image of the firmware partition...
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09:54:27Obnautikusthat page is awesome
09:57:08Obnautikusthanx God
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09:58:07pondlifeweesplit
09:59:09 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c58-109-97-210.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au)
09:59:26ddaltonis there an error in lang.h? I only modified main_menu.c
09:59:29ddaltonand got errors.
09:59:34ddaltonI also modified english.lang
10:00
10:00:54 Join rasher [0] (n=rasher@62.79.64.148.adsl.hs.tiscali.dk)
10:01:39 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net)
10:03:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:07:32*petur spots a sansa e250 2GB on ebay for 53 euro (12 minutes left)
10:08:13linuxstbddalton: lang.h is generated automatically - from english.lang I think. So it's likely you made a mistake in english.lang
10:08:26ddaltonok I probably have.
10:09:29 Join ziroday [0] (n=ziroday@unaffiliated/ziroday)
10:10:16zirodayhi i was wondering what special tools you have to use to get a ipod nano to work with rockbox. I remember last time i did it i had to do something special with the kernel installation involoving a special package
10:10:30Obnautikusi think i i should grab my moms nano and install rockbox ;)
10:10:36GodEaterziroday: all the instructions you need are in the manual
10:10:44Obnautikusmy 4g is lame
10:10:54Obnautikusipods suck
10:10:54B4gderziroday: there are no "special tools" needed to install rockbox
10:11:01Obnautikusif it werent for rockbox/linux
10:11:03B4gderjust the rockbox ones
10:11:06Lloreanziroday: Are you sure you're not thinking of iPod Linux? None of our documentation even refers to the word "kernel" I believe.
10:11:18ddaltonjust the ipod patcher
10:11:20zirodayhmm okay thank you all
10:11:23zirodaythats it
10:11:25zirodayipod patcher
10:11:31ddaltonyes
10:11:36zirodaythanks
10:11:43ddaltonwhat os are you using?
10:11:50zirodayubuntu 7.04
10:11:52ddaltonI only know for windows.
10:12:10NJoinLinusN [0] (i=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN)
10:12:12scorcheziroday: just follow the instructions int he manual and you will be fine =)
10:12:27zirodayscorche: reading them now :)
10:13:16*GodEater wonders when we're going to be updating the manual to refer to rbutil
10:13:33B4gderyeah, that'll be a grand day
10:13:43*pondlife wonders when the frontpage will allow downloads of a prebuilt RBUtil
10:13:47 Join webguest33 [0] (i=c023110b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-34921405cfa9e56a)
10:13:59GodEaterwe want that on the front page ?
10:14:08pondlifeWell, pointed to
10:14:20pondlifeIt should IMHO be the first thing a n00b goes to, no?
10:14:48GodEaterafter they've gone to hell perhaps.... ;)
10:14:51pondlifeFrontpage > Install > Select OS > RBUtil running
10:15:04*scorche wonders where the manual fits in
10:15:08 Join Slasheri [0] (i=miipekk@xen.ihme.org)
10:15:09***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )'
10:15:22linuxstbscorche: We shouldn't need a manual...
10:15:48scorcheperhaps not for installing, but for other functions...
10:16:13pondlifeIt's useful for reference, but shouldn't be essential for general use.
10:16:37pondlifeThe manual should agree with the code, of course.
10:16:39NJoinJon-Kha [0] (i=jon-kha@80-248-247-190.cust.suomicom.fi)
10:16:53GodEaterit should still be required reading before question asking is necessary
10:17:30pondlifeOf course
10:17:43pondlifeBut questions shouldn't be required either :)
10:18:01linuxstbpondlife: I think we're dreaming though...
10:18:20GodEaterwelcome to Rockbox Utopia
10:18:23pondlifeYou've got to have a dream to aim for.
10:18:54GodEater"self actualisation"
10:20:40 Join Benoitb [0] (n=Benoitb@public1.alcasat.net)
10:20:59ddaltonwhere is the running time code?
10:21:09ddaltonfor the run time screen?
10:21:47 Join obo [0] (n=obo@rockbox/developer/obo)
10:24:27GodEaterI'm glad to see the "Tact and Diplomacy" post has generated some useful discussion. Should we perhaps look at working towards an actual set of guidelines now ?
10:24:55pondlifeGodEater: F**k no! ;)
10:25:04B4gderwanna see something depressing?
10:25:13*GodEater puts pondlife in the "Shoot noobs on site" camp
10:25:17GodEater*sight
10:25:18B4gdergoogle for "rockbox RobbyWilliams"
10:25:19GodEatersigh
10:25:33pondlifeGodEater: No, I like n00bs. But not tact.
10:25:53pondlifeB4gder: Haha
10:26:33B4gderthat reveals the greater plot of all those spam posts
10:26:55GodEaterB4gder: oh dear
10:27:41*petur wonders why B4gder googled for that - what were you looking for? :p
10:27:44 Quit GodEater (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:27:48B4gderI noticed we get hit quite a lot on those URLs
10:28:05B4gdernot the least from search engines
10:29:55linuxstbDid that page exist on the wiki?
10:30:08B4gderit did, a long time ago for a short while
10:30:29linuxstbOK, so before our new "ask on irc" authentication?
10:30:31peturin all possible spellingways I remember
10:30:35 Join GodEater [0] (n=bryan@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
10:30:44B4gderyeah, they came back non-stop as soon as we removed one the next appeared
10:34:50GodEateris it possible to ask google nicely to stop indexing them ?
10:35:22B4gderI don't think so, unless we add a rockbox.txt thing for them
10:35:26LinusNsounds like a quite futile operation
10:35:43linuxstbB4gder: robots.txt?
10:35:49pondliferockbox.txt?
10:36:08LinusNrobotbox.txt
10:36:16B4gderyes, robots.txt in the root is a standard to tell search engines what they're (not) allowed to search
10:36:46B4gderor index is perhaps a better word
10:36:48GodEateris there a huge list of those spam links?
10:37:10B4gderI don't think so, i just noticed this when I checked the current log flow
10:37:17Obnautikusrobots.txt in rockbox?
10:37:43linuxstbFor the database...
10:37:44GodEaterso the robots.txt might be worthwhile then
10:37:45B4gderObnautikus: do you fine search engine indexing a big problem on your rockbox target?
10:37:58Obnautikus?
10:38:03Obnautikuswell
10:38:09GodEaterB4gder: all those hits from yahoo on my iTunes dirs really annoy me :)
10:38:16Obnautikusas a matter of fact
10:38:24Obnautikuslawl
10:38:48Obnautikustheir indexing my illegal music downloads!
10:38:49*pondlife writes spamcache.c
10:39:05Obnautikusand giving them away as their own links!
10:39:16peturI'd rather NOT have that robots.txt on rockbox.org - google is quite usefull to search the site...
10:39:18Zagorgoogle only removes it when either nobody links to it (yeah, right) or the page returns 404
10:39:32Zagorhttp://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=64033&topic=8459
10:39:42pondlifeA 404 could be engineered, no?
10:39:46Zagoryes
10:39:59Obnautikusgotta admit i do like google, like when the gentoo wiki was down google had a mirror in cache
10:40:01B4gderwe give 302 currently
10:40:04Zagorinstead of the "no spam" page
10:40:31B4gdergrep -c "RobbyW" /var/log/apache2/rockbox-access_log
10:40:32B4gder117
10:41:01Zagoralmost as many as people downloading the player firmware ;)
10:41:01 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@83-71-71-77.b-ras1.prp.dublin.eircom.net)
10:41:09Obnautikusdid u see googles april fools this year?
10:41:09B4gder*g*
10:41:17Obnautikusthe internet toilet modem
10:41:30Obnautikusand offers of sending your email in hardcopy to your home
10:41:32 Join villadelfia [0] (i=villa@83.101.1.219)
10:42:29ZagorI bet that last one had a lot of people excited
10:42:43Zagor"can you fax me your home page?"
10:42:52LinusNalmost as exciting as a 300 page phone bill :-)
10:42:54Obnautikusdang my ipods on fire practicly
10:43:12Obnautikusdd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda2
10:43:15B4gderor a sofa with the simpsons family in plastic on...
10:43:19 Part Llorean
10:43:23Obnautikushate FAT32
10:43:27LinusNB4gder: hahahaaaa
10:43:38Obnautikuscan format and make a new FS but files will always stay latent
10:43:40Zagora cardboard sofa, no less
10:43:49ZagorObnautikus: ehh, what?
10:44:03dionoeaB4gder: google provide a webpage removal request tool (i don't know how it works though ... must be something like you submit a url and they check it manualy)
10:44:05Zagorfat32 is like a virus in your world?
10:44:09 Join barrywardell_ [0] (n=barrywar@83-71-71-77.b-ras1.prp.dublin.eircom.net)
10:44:21Obnautikuswell on linux it is
10:44:36 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:44:41linuxstbWorks fine for me...
10:44:44Zagoryou need more medication :)
10:44:49B4gderdionoea: it's not really a problem for us, I just find it depressing that there are roughly 170 links "out there" to this spam page we removed like a year ago
10:45:11Obnautikuswhat? is this a rockbox admin meeting im crashing?
10:45:17B4gderand google can't fix their pages...
10:45:19linuxstbObnautikus: It's #rockbox...
10:45:43Obnautikuswell i guess im gonna find nothing but developers
10:46:12scorcheObnautikus: reading the link in the topic might explain a few things
10:46:25 Quit webguest33 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
10:47:47Obnautikusmy bad
10:48:22B4gdervfat works fine on linux
10:50:39 Join daniel_dalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
10:51:10daniel_daltonsomeone took my nick name.
10:51:14daniel_daltonfor irc
10:51:25 Quit Benoitb (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
10:51:47scorcheyou likely just crashed and it hasnt quit yet
10:52:02daniel_daltonhow do I quit it?
10:52:14scorcheis ddalton registered?
10:52:42daniel_daltonI just typed my nickname in to a box when I did the setup.
10:53:01scorchethen all you can do is wait...it will quit soon
10:53:03 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@83-71-71-77.b-ras1.prp.dublin.eircom.net)
10:53:06daniel_daltonok
10:53:07 Quit barrywardell_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:53:14 Quit daniel_dalton (Client Quit)
10:53:23scorcheassuming the client isnt still...bah
10:53:42 Join danieldalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
10:53:53 Nick danieldalton is now known as DanielDalton (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
10:53:55scorcheassuming the client isnt still running
10:54:00amiconnJdGordon: The talk can't be like printf strings. Too many special rules per language. It would need to change order of digits for certain ranges, obey grammatical gender etc
10:54:18B4gderfreenode can take a darn long time to timeout idle/dead nicks
10:54:47DanielDaltonI rebooted my computer. But I did a reset with irc still running.
10:55:02JdGordonamiconn: well, I mean more like we can have a string and just parse it for the language..
10:55:14dionoeaDanielDalton: you need to wait a few minutes
10:55:15amiconn?
10:55:16B4gderDanielDalton: the problem is not in your end, but that the server still "occupies" the nick
10:55:30DanielDaltonis that why?
10:55:40B4gderyes, unless someone else is using it
10:55:49DanielDaltonso I should just waight?
10:55:53B4gderyes
10:55:59LinusNor register with the nick server
10:56:03JdGordone.g "%hr %min oclock" would speak the hour then minutes then oclock. or "%min %hr" etc
10:56:04scorcheunless you are registered (which you arent)
10:56:06LinusNthen you can use the "ghost" command
10:56:15B4gderLinusN: I think you need to use the nick to register, don't you?
10:56:24scorcheyou do
10:56:42LinusNyes
10:56:56LinusNi meant for future use
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10:57:26 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
10:57:31 Join webguest33 [0] (i=c023110b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-5af32052c150874e)
10:58:17 Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@tux.isd-internet.de)
10:58:35DerPapstmorning :P
10:59:56amiconnJdGordon: That wouldn't help
11:00
11:00:47JdGordonoh ok
11:01:19markunDerPapst: morning
11:03:01 Quit ddalton (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:03:01 Quit barrywardell_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:03:24DanielDaltonok once I have done my work I will create the patch I said I would before.
11:03:37DanielDaltonabout fixing the time up for LinusN
11:05:47dionoeaDanielDalton: looks like ddalton just quit
11:06:00 Nick DanielDalton is now known as ddalton (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
11:06:09ddaltonhey how could you tell?
11:06:26dionoeadon't you get join/quit messages in your IRC client?
11:06:43ddaltononly for the rockbox channel
11:06:53ddaltono yeah I see it
11:06:58dionoea:)
11:11:23DerPapstddalton: you should register your nick now. so next time you can simply kill it and don't have to wait until it times out.
11:11:52ddaltonhow?
11:12:06dionoeaquery NickServ
11:12:27ddaltonwhere do I type "query NickServ"
11:12:29dionoeaand then use "help register" or something like that and it'll explain how to do it
11:12:43dionoeain your client type : /query NickServ
11:12:44B4gdersee also http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
11:12:57pixelmahttp://freenode.net/faq.shtml#registering
11:14:58 Quit ddalton ("I was using BOFHNet IRC version 1.2 by fmillion - get your copy today from http://www.the-bofh.com/bofhnet/irc !")
11:15:03 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
11:15:19ddaltonhow do I check if it worked?
11:15:20amiconnJdGordon: Just imagine time announcement: english: "fourteen thirty one" -> german (with english words): "fourtheen clock one-and-thirty"
11:15:36ddaltonthe nick name thing?
11:15:39bluebrotherddalton: /whois yourself
11:16:11bluebrotherif the output has a line "is identified to services" you are identified
11:16:24ddaltonfine!!!!
11:17:05bluebrotherafter you registered you need to identify: /msg nickserv identify <password>
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11:17:50amiconn2 other examples: "five oh-six" -> "five clock six". "twenty one hundred" -> "twenty-one clock"
11:18:17jbittwenty-one o'clock
11:18:36amiconnNope. The latter is german with english words
11:18:40jbitahhhh :)
11:18:44jbitokay, missed that bit :)
11:18:49ddaltonok I think it worked.
11:18:56jbitin danish i think it's back to front, just in case it matters
11:19:01jbiti think it's like "clocken 21"
11:19:02bluebrotherddalton: yup, you show up as registered now :)
11:19:10ddaltonok good.
11:20:12jbit[11:20:11] <jbit> how do you say "5 o'clock" in danish?
11:20:14jbit[11:20:21] <Snapper> klokken fem
11:20:15jbit:)
11:20:25dionoeaddalton: that also means that you can now send private messages to other people on Freenode
11:20:26jbitjust incase it helps :)
11:20:38jbitsince it seems backwards
11:20:56ddaltonSo even if there not on #rockbox?
11:21:27amiconnLinusN: Hmm, a full set of new plugins.....
11:22:01amiconnGuess that'd work. Back in archos-only times I had the idea to put this code as position-independent code into the voice files
11:22:02dionoeaddalton: sure, NickServ is freenode wide, not limited to a channel
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11:22:36ddaltonwhat would it take to voice a plugin? Why can't you just include talk.h and start using the talk functions?
11:23:00amiconnThat would even work today with per-targetvoice files, but it would then break the sims
11:23:02Obnautikusok i got the rockbox loader installed and can boot rockbox(default) and AppleOS (wold switch) but how can i change/add whatever happened to the boot menu? maybe im thinking loader2?
11:23:20Obnautikushold switch*
11:23:34bluebrotherObnautikus: what do you want to change? The bootloader is intended to be non-graphical
11:23:35amiconnddalton: You must never include any core .h files from a plugin other than plugin.h
11:23:53Obnautikusi kinda wanted a boot menu
11:24:02jbitloader2 is graphical
11:24:13ddaltonamiconn Why not? What if I add talk functions to the plugin.h file.
11:24:29Obnautikusis there a way to change the default boot?
11:24:32ddaltonJust copy talk.c to plugin.c and talk.h to plugin.h
11:24:35bluebrotherif you really want a graphical menu you need to use Loader2
11:24:43amiconnYOu could add the talk functions to the plugin api, but you'll still be limited to the existing voice IDs
11:24:44jbitObnautikus: with loader2 there's a config file and such
11:24:46bluebrotherand no ... Rockbox is always default
11:24:49pondlifeddalton: You also need the voice thread running, and be extremely careful with IRAM use...
11:25:05Obnautikusok just askin before i tweak my moms nano
11:25:18Obnautikuspersonally all i want is rock on mine
11:25:18ddaltonamiconn what do you mean about the talk ids?
11:25:30amiconnThere are ideas to overcome this limitation, that's what the (currently unused) "user:" is for in the .lang files
11:25:34bluebrotherbut why change the default boot behaviour? If you boot AppleOS you need to manually reset anyway
11:25:47linuxstbObnautikus: The Rockbox bootloader is designed load Rockbox, with dual-boot being a secondary feature. As others have said, you can use loader2 if you want a more complex bootloader.
11:25:59Obnautikusgotcha
11:26:05ddaltonpondlife what is IRAM
11:26:16pondlifeAh, there's a question...
11:26:20ddaltonwhat is the voice thread
11:26:32ddaltonyeah I do have a question
11:26:35pondlifeNo easy answers to those.
11:26:57ddaltoncan you explain it in a couple of sentences?
11:27:05ddaltonor is it quite complicated.
11:27:17jbitiram is the r0x0rs :)
11:27:28bluebrotherIRAM is the internal ram of the processor. It's usually way faster but much smaller
11:27:48pondlifeComplicated. Basically we have a process running to actually produce the voice output. It uses somewhat arcane methods to run a second MP3 decoder, but has to share IRAM with the main audio codec...
11:27:49Obnautikusoh wait duh cant even install rockbox to the nano 2GB last i checked its a 2nd gen
11:27:52ddaltonso what will happen if I try to include talk.h?
11:28:01pondlifeIt'll probably compile, but not talk.
11:28:05pondlifeOr it'll crash.
11:28:11ddaltonwhy is that?
11:28:17linuxstbObnautikus: No - the 2nd gen Nanos are completely different hardware to the earlier ipods.
11:28:18pondlifeSee above!
11:28:35Obnautikusyea
11:28:41pondlifeCompilcated - you'll need to understand what makes Rockbox talk... and that means playback.c :/
11:28:52pondlife(Different on Archos targets, btw.)
11:28:52Obnautikusremember reading something about an encrypted bootload last time i checked
11:29:05Obnautikusamong other things
11:29:23pondlifeddalton: I've worked on playback.c occasionally, and I can't say for sure I understand the whole caboodle.
11:29:28ddaltonso if I copy talk.h to plugin.h and talk.c to plugin.c will I then be able to make it talk?
11:29:36pondlifeNo
11:29:44ddaltonwhy?
11:29:50pondlifeSee above, again
11:29:51bluebrotheryou can't simply copy a c file into another
11:29:59bluebrotherit will cause much headaches ...
11:30:04ddaltonusing talk_id in my plugins and adding strings to english.lang
11:30:13pondlifeddalton: You need to step back and understand the basic structure of Rockbox
11:30:34ddaltonok so could I just copy the main functions?
11:30:40pondlifeNo
11:30:43pondlifeDefinitely not
11:30:50pondlifeDon't copy anything
11:31:00ddaltonso what is so different about the plugins to rockbox then?
11:31:04pondlifeWe only want any one bit of code implemented in one place.
11:31:44pondlifeddalton: They need to use the plugin API. Other functions (like voice support) may not work for plugins.
11:31:58pondlifeIt will be implemented one day, but it's not trivial.
11:32:03ddaltonok another question If i write a talk function to talk an id from english.lang and put it in my plugin file for example battery_bench.c then would I be able to do this?
11:32:27pondlifeddalton: Why rewrite code that exists already?
11:32:43pondlifeThe problem isn't accessing the clip, it's actually speaking it.
11:32:48ddaltonok copy the talk function and make sure I get all the variables so it compiles.
11:32:51ddaltonwould that work?
11:32:56pondlifeNo!
11:33:09*pondlife is getting fed up of repeating himself and will go away
11:33:43pondlifeddalton: You need to read up on how Rockbox actually makes the voice output. Then see if this can be added to the plugin API.
11:33:55ddaltonwhere can I find that out?
11:34:06pondlifeThe wiki? The source?
11:34:18Obnautikusrockbox can read txt's right?
11:34:23ddaltonwhere on the wiki I haven't seen anything to do with the voice
11:34:31pondlifeIt's not well-documented, but if you look into talk.c and playback.c..
11:35:00ddaltonok I will have a look. Is there any chance this is ever going to work?
11:35:27pondlifeYes, but it's not trivial.
11:35:32pondlifehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxMemoryLayout might be useful.
11:35:43ddaltonok thanks
11:35:58pondlifeAlthough it doesn't cover plugins - and I don't know where they are loaded.
11:35:59linuxstbObnautikus: Do you mean show the text onscreen or speak the text? It can do the former.
11:36:22ddaltonso how come we can display text in plugins?
11:36:41pondlifeBecause there are functions to do that in the plugin API.
11:36:44linuxstbddalton: It's not translated.
11:36:58pondlifeAnd it doesn't use much memory or multithreading.
11:37:01Obnautikusit cant open txt files so i can read em?
11:37:08ddaltonso if I right talk functions in the plugin api will this work? And if not why not?
11:37:11linuxstbObnautikus: I just said it could do that...
11:37:19Obnautikusoh
11:37:22Obnautikusthats tits
11:37:24Obnautikusthanx
11:37:36Obnautikusso i can read phrack on the crapper
11:37:42Obnautikus;)
11:38:06scorchethat is a bit offtopic...
11:38:16linuxstbReading IRC logs on the crapper?
11:38:35scorcheonly if they are #rockbox IRC logs =P
11:39:02bluebrotheroh, is there a reader.pl running on Rockbox? *g*
11:39:04Obnautikusphrack magazine
11:39:39pondlifeddalton: No, the API needs implementing too. The memory layout, use of IRAM and threading all need work. I've no idea how much (or little) work this is.
11:39:56ddaltonif I find a program written in c. Is it possible to port it to rockbox?
11:40:20 Join subson [0] (n=ju@82.67.68.29)
11:40:22GodEaterddalton: depends on the program
11:40:27bluebrotherscorche: how do you filter themes that require patches on the themes site?
11:40:39GodEaterddalton: if it requires oodles of other libraries, then you'd have to port those too
11:40:44scorchebluebrother: /patch
11:40:47ddaltonwhat sort of program would it have to be?
11:41:13bluebrotherhow does this work internally? I.e. how can I distinguish from rbutilqt.php?
11:41:18linuxstbOne that makes sense to run in Rockbox... i.e. small screen, few buttons, relatively limited CPU and RAM.
11:41:23bluebrotheror is it simply a different folder structure?
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11:41:49scorchebluebrother: it is completely separate...different upload script, etc...all in /patch
11:42:20scorchehit the submission page link on copy.rockbox-themes.org
11:42:40GodEaterddalton: for instance, attempting to port XChat to rockbox would be both a) very very difficult, and b) make very little sense
11:43:00pondlifelol
11:43:07amiconnpondlife: The api isn't the problem. Adding the necessary infrastructure to have talk ids for plugins is
11:43:22amiconnAnd plugins using IRAM must not use voice, like it is now
11:43:26pondlifeamiconn: That's what I was trying to point out.
11:43:36bluebrotherok, found a glitch by trying so ... if you are on /patch and click the submission link it tries to access /patch/submit.php which does not exist
11:43:37pondlifeIt's a bigger problem than ddalton thinks it is, I think.
11:43:55amiconnBut working on that infrastructure would be nice 'cause it then also allows to localise plugins
11:44:02pondlifeIndeed
11:44:09linuxstbWasn't someone working on talking sudoku? Has anyone seen any code for that?
11:44:52pondlifeBTW did anyone work out why mpegplayer doesn't work properly if voice is enabled? It makes calls to stop voice/grab IRAM etc...
11:45:15pondlifezxbox suffers from the same issue.
11:45:17scorchebluebrother: thanks...i have left most of the site to rot atm while focusing on making uploader.php do what i wish...i plan on calling the hoster tomorrow to see if they can compile PHP with a different configure option that i need...
11:45:51bluebrotherscorche: hmm, so there is "for any build" and "unofficial build". I'm failing to find some "only official build" category
11:46:14linuxstbbluebrother: That's "for any build"
11:46:15scorchethe whole sidebar is not decided upon either
11:46:42linuxstbbluebrother: As "only official build" doesn't really make sense - they should also work on unofficial builds.
11:46:46scorchebluebrother: why would a theme that works on an official build, not work on an unofficial one?
11:46:48bluebrotherthat also shows themes for unofficial builds −− see http://copy.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=176x132x16
11:46:55bluebrotheror is that simply not cleaned up yet?
11:47:15scorchethat will be deleted entirely upon debut
11:47:30bluebrotherah, ok. Then nothing to worry about for rbutil integration
11:47:36linuxstbscorche: So the plan is for the new site to start empty?
11:47:39scorcheit is just a direct copy from current rockbox-themes.org for now
11:48:20scorchelinuxstb: yes...and have those themes that are able to be transferred, resubmitted...it seemed the best way to do things
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11:49:02scorcherather than us going through each one, the authors/helpers will go through and fix errors and such (depending on if the themes were CC-SA'ed
11:49:12ieI like the feature implemented by http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7627
11:49:20ddaltonshould there be a new line at the end of english.lang?
11:49:38linuxstbscorche: Yes, I agree. Will the old site still be available?
11:49:57scorchefor a time to assist the helpers/authors
11:50:06scorcheas well, so we can pull information from it if needed
11:52:11ddaltonLinusN did you want the 24 hour time to say "14 hundred" or "14 hundred hours"
11:53:02GodEaterddalton: looks like there should be a newline at the end of english.lang
11:53:20ddaltonok thanks
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11:57:34ddaltonhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/24-hour_clock says that the time should be said as "14 hundred hours" in 24 hour format.
11:57:45ddaltonso that is how I will do the patch
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12:00
12:01:04ieddalton: the page contradicts itself: Contrary to popular belief, the use of the word "hours" at the end of the stated time is not standard in the U.S. military. The use of the 24-hour clock without the word "hours" is the standard for expressing time in the U.S. military.
12:02:25linuxstbI can't think how I would say "14:00" in English, apart from saying "2pm". But I would say "fourteen oh one"... "14 hundred" doesn't sound right...
12:03:20ieHow can two subsequent sentences state exactly the opposite of each other =:-O
12:03:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:03:57pondlife"14 hundred hours" is how I'd say it...fwiw
12:04:14pondlifeBut 2pm is more likely
12:04:26ddaltondoes anyone want to commit my time fix patch when I upload it in a few minutes. It speaks the 24 and 12 hour time properly like spoken about before.
12:04:39*pondlife realises he writes in 24 hour clock and speaks 12 hour
12:04:46*linuxstb too
12:05:14linuxstbAnother Rockbox option... ;)
12:05:23pondlifeNooo!
12:05:32DerPapstheh
12:06:08DerPapstsome day we'll break the 1000 settings line
12:06:37pondlifeI think I'd prefer a simple "fourteen zero" actually.
12:06:56pondlifeOr "fourteen o o"
12:07:09pondlifeLike "fourteen o one"
12:07:40pondlifeKISS, even if it's not pedantically correc.
12:07:41pondlifet
12:08:01bluebrotherthis whole clock thingy smells like l10n issues to me ...
12:08:14ddaltonwell the correct way is 14 hundred hours. This doesn't add anymore voice strings. Just "oh" when speaking 14 07"
12:08:19ddaltonor something like that
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12:08:50pondlifebluebrother: Absolutely. How's it handled in Chinese?
12:09:02peturrofl
12:09:20pondlifeThe code is getting over-Anglicised.
12:09:22ddaltonI will test and then upload it. I can't be bothered testing the voice file because that should work. It takes for ever on my pc.
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12:09:48bluebrotherI'm wondering if it makes sense to adjust one piece
12:10:25*pondlife thinks it unfortunate that we're talking about this so much whilst playback is still so borked, and looks forward to Nico_P's return.
12:10:44pondlife:)
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12:10:52ddaltonI was happy with how everything was spoken in rev14418 but now amiconn wants the time spoken differently.
12:11:37pondlifeWell, remember that Rockbox is not a democracy...'tis a triple-headed benign dictatorship.
12:11:41amiconnI do *not* want it different from how it is now *for english*
12:12:04amiconnHowever, I *do* want proper voicing for non-english languages
12:12:09ddaltonok but I am talking about what it was like for rev14418 you changed it right?
12:12:09amiconnThe idea itself is old
12:12:18ddaltonthat's ok it doesn't worry me
12:12:30ddaltonLinusN wants it to say oh.
12:12:46pondlifeI think it should just read out what ever is displayed on the LCD.
12:12:57pondlifeNo specialisms
12:12:59bluebrotherhmm. Should rbutil install the manual to the players root folder or to some "documentation" subfolder?
12:13:06amiconnddalton: I only added the 'o'clock' thing for 24 hour time. Other than that, I merely made the code more compact
12:13:08ddaltonfor english you wouldn't say 20 o'clock would you?
12:13:32markunfor people interested: I failed my GSoC student but he got some more time from google to try to finish it
12:13:48ddaltonyes that is good but didn't you make it say like 20 o'clock instead of 20 hours and 0 minutes? I can't remember.
12:13:52pondlifemarkun: I guess that's good news
12:14:10markunlet's hope he has some more time now
12:14:18amiconnddalton: I would, and the wikipedia article I linked to says that it's correct
12:14:29bluebrothermarkun: was it the tts project?
12:14:37ddaltondidn't it say 14 hundred hours?
12:14:46ddaltonnot 14 o'clock?
12:14:52ddaltondid yu see the table?
12:14:54amiconnBoth are allowed
12:15:00peturmarkun: I'm still waiting for mine to deliver something...
12:15:16*amiconn wondered whether ddalton actually read the paragraph I linked to
12:15:38ddaltonok well I will submit this but if you don't want it that is fine. I just know here in australia we say 20 hundred hours.
12:16:07ddaltonI read the table but not the rest of it.
12:16:08pondlifeFor l10n's sake, just have 20 zero.
12:16:26preglowhave anyone checked that rockbox does indeed rended he-aacv2 files correctly?
12:16:27pondlifeForget all the o'clocks and hundreds
12:16:30preglowrender...
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12:16:49ddaltonPondlife is right. We are talking about something that really isn't that important.
12:17:41ddaltonhow about leave it how it is. That way everyone is happy. Because as I said before it doesn't worry me.
12:17:51pondlifeGreat, now, about that new logo :)
12:18:56preglowsounds like hev2 doesn't work right to me
12:19:02scorchewhile we are at that, what color you think we should color the bikeshed? =P
12:19:17scorches/color the/paint the
12:19:23bluebrotherhmm ... dark green :D
12:19:41*scorche wonders how many people got that one
12:19:50bluebrother;-)
12:19:58*pondlife didn't
12:20:18scorchehttp://darkgreen.bikeshed.com/
12:20:38pondlifeParkinson's Law?
12:20:50scorcheyup
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12:21:22markunbluebrother: yes, the TTS project
12:21:35ddaltonhow would I make the info screen use the same format as the running time screen?
12:21:55ddaltonso display info as a list and you can scrol up and down through it.
12:22:15ddaltonIs there any progress with the tts and rockbox?
12:25:00pondlifepetur: You mentoring the USB project? Perhaps you could put a note on here: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=12293.msg92793;topicseen#msg92793
12:25:53preglowpetur: heard anything more from ac?
12:25:59peturno
12:26:10peturno response to mails as well (as usual)
12:26:51*petur wonders if ac uses some kind of PWM on his online life
12:27:29preglowhaha
12:27:31bluebrotherLOL
12:27:41preglowwell, did you get code out of him for the 20th?
12:27:57peturnope
12:27:59preglowthat's pretty nasty
12:28:06peturso in theory he fails....
12:28:09preglowindeed
12:28:10pondlifeOK, so 2 fails at least :/
12:28:20scorche=/
12:28:46peturI guess he doesn't understand he will not get money?
12:28:46pondlifeOr maybe Nico_P and TTSbox can both pass with extensions?
12:29:22preglownico_p has set up public repos
12:29:37preglowso you can at least watch his progress even if the code isn't in the rockbox tree yet
12:29:43pondlifeAh, so he can pass - even though not integrated (or compiling)
12:29:46preglowwith ac you're pretty much at the mercy of his whims
12:30:17*scorche remembers saying he would do something if the people ahead of him that got in failed...
12:30:36*pondlife reads lots of logs
12:30:42iepetur: PWM?
12:30:43pondlifeNo... what was it?
12:30:49pondlifescorche: ^
12:30:57scorchei cant remember =P
12:31:01peturIf ac manages to deliver something this week I'm willing to pass him, but most of his code (non low-level) doesn't even compile :/
12:31:01preglowie: pulse-width modulation, meaning you just switch it on or off, never something inbetween
12:31:27preglowpetur: i would pretty much demand to see something working given his behaviour, yes
12:31:30pondlifea binary existence
12:32:26pondlifeDidn't barrywardell help him out fixing up TX? If so, did he have a recent copy of the code?
12:32:32pondlifei.e. of ac's code?
12:32:42ieWhat kind of problems are there with power management on sansa? The wiki page says it's done but "not yet optimal"
12:33:08scorchesame thing with all PP devices
12:34:10preglowpondlife: so what? you can't just vanish and hope someone else deals with your mentor when the soc is over
12:34:38pondlifeI agree.
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12:34:46ddaltonok I am done with the time thing. If someone wants to see what I did it is p7641
12:34:47preglowat least not when the project is in such a limbo as ac's is
12:34:55peturpondlife: he said he got a serial device working and was working on UMS now (and it was getting better by the hour)
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12:35:13pondlifeBut you only have his word for that, right?
12:35:26peturpreglow: to be fair, he did mention a (recent) real-life issue
12:35:30peturpondlife: yups
12:35:41ddaltonHow can I remove all my changes from the rockbox source.
12:35:45ddaltonMy local copy.
12:35:46peturbut now... lunch
12:35:49pondlifeSo.. will you mentor me for Linux on a Zune next year... :)
12:35:55preglowpetur: then that's different
12:35:56bluebrotherddalton: svn revert -R
12:36:44pondlifeYes, be sensitive to real-life, but ultimately no working code = no pass
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12:37:40ddaltonit says "svn: Not enough arguments provided; try 'svn help' for more info " How do I fix this?
12:37:45iescorche: no info about how to control the chips?
12:37:51parafinddalton, svn revert -R .
12:37:55bluebrothertry svn revert -R .
12:38:00bluebrotherhmm, too slow :)
12:38:25scorcheie: not really...public at least
12:38:35ddaltonsame thing happens.
12:38:56The-CompilerHow can I access a MicroSD-card on a Sansa?
12:38:57markunI suggest we let our GSoC students do a little task to qualify so they at least have a dev environment setup and know something about the inner workings of rockbox
12:39:06markunfor next year
12:39:09pondlifeGood idea
12:39:53iescorche: ah, ok. Or, actually, not ok :-)
12:39:56ddaltondoes anyone know what I am doing wrong? I am doing this from the dir with apps and firmware and all of that in it.
12:40:25preglowmarkun: yeah, i agree we should have something to that effect
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12:41:18markun_it took my student a lot of time, just to setup
12:41:31markun_and after that he had virtually no time left
12:42:00markun_ffmpeg's gsoc is going quite well I think
12:42:10pondlifePeople underestimate how hard the actual integration-with-Rockbox part can be.
12:42:17markun_they also had such qualification tasks
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12:42:39bluebrothera lot of time to setup a rb dev environment?
12:43:12markunbluebrother: yes :(
12:43:22bluebrotherurgh :(
12:43:34pondlifeHmm, shouldn't take someone more than a day..
12:44:01markun_maybe he just didn't spend much time on it
12:44:20markun_or had to learn some unix basics to find his way around the wmware image
12:45:02*markun curses the ssh connection
12:45:56PaulJamHi, little question about the user interface on h300. now that the record button brings you to the record screen, shouldn't there be found another way to prevent an usb connection when inserting the usb cable? maybe holding the play button while inserting the usb cable.
12:46:21bluebrotherPaulJam: this has been discussed a couple of days ago
12:46:39bluebrotherbut I don't think there was a general consensus. I still like the idea to prevent usb mode if hold is enabled
12:46:46bluebrotherwould work also nicely for ipods
12:46:47PaulJamah ok, i'll search the logs
12:48:11markunif the TTS project fails I would still like to try my luck with porting espeak
12:48:29ddaltonWhere can I see the progress on the tts project?
12:49:44ddaltonmarkun: could I help out with the tts project or where can I find info on it?
12:50:01markunddalton: at the moment there is not much to help out with
12:50:18ddaltonso what is it going to be a plugin or something?
12:50:41markunddalton: I think a plugin would be a nice goal, after that maybe rockbox integration
12:51:14ddaltonmarkun: Would it start at start up?
12:51:51markunwhat exactly do you mean?
12:52:08ddaltonwell when you turn on the player would it start talking?
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13:00:16JdGordonbluebrother: I agree that hold is a better way to disable usb than rec...
13:00:32 Quit pill (Nick collision from services.)
13:00:34JdGordon.. and should be the standard for all targets
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13:01:16*scorche glares at qwx
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13:01:27qwxhi scorche
13:01:32scorchehi qwm
13:01:32qwxglares?
13:01:37qwxi keep forgetting what that means.
13:01:50qwxwhat's the nano bug status?
13:02:14scorcheare you affected?
13:02:16ieHas anybody seen this: http://www.warthman.com/projects-portalplayer-pp5001-ds.htm Could it be of any use for RB?
13:02:28qwxyes i am, scorche
13:02:34qwxusing a mid-july build.
13:02:59qwxi could play songs, but the glitches and speed variations were unbearable.
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13:03:02scorchei havent really been up on that bug...you would be best waiting for another to respond
13:03:03B4gderie: gosh!
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13:04:25ddaltonI was thinking about writing an alarm for rockbox. (To run on the h300) Should I write it as a plugin or can I just write it into rockbox?
13:05:18ieB4gder: what does that mean?
13:05:28GodEaterddalton: there is already an alarm feature in rockbox for targets with an RTC
13:05:47JdGordonGodEater: only on targets which have a wake-on-alarm ability
13:06:05peturie: what good does that link bring?
13:06:31GodEaterJdGordon: my mistake :)
13:06:41ddaltoncould I write one that only works if the player is on. Because there isn't one for the h300.
13:06:43GodEaterit doesn't bring any good at all as far as I can see
13:06:49B4gderie: it was an expression of surprise
13:06:53pondlifepetur: It proves they have internal documentation?
13:06:56JdGordonddalton: there is 2 plugin alarms in the tracker
13:07:02GodEaterit shows that someone wrote some documentation once
13:07:05peturpondlife: lol
13:07:26ddaltonso if I remove the #if from alarm.c will I be able to use it as long as I don't switch off my player?
13:07:27markun_ddalton: yes, TTS could be used that way, we'll have to experiment a bit with it I think
13:07:30ddaltonor ifs?
13:07:36iepetur: I thought the book advertised there could contain some data about the PP chips
13:07:51GodEaterie: they're not advertising the book
13:07:53pondlifeIt's not a book, just part of their CV
13:07:56GodEaterthey're advertising that they wrote it
13:08:07pondlifeMaybe we could ask them for a copy
13:08:09GodEaterit doesn't mean they're able to give it away
13:08:09pondlife;)
13:08:14GodEaterpondlife: hahahahahahaha
13:08:17peturmaybe we should try to contact somebody who works there?
13:08:25pondlifeAnyone got any blackmail?
13:08:43pondlifeon these guys...http://www.warthman.com/aboutus.htm
13:08:53XavierGrmarkun: it sounds to me very strange that a gsoc managed to not have a dev environment in just one day. Rockbox has many alternatives at it.
13:08:57ieGodEater: ah, that's the point! But were they asked? Or is it your assumption that they don't give it away?
13:09:08JdGordonpondlife: the beuaty about blackmail is it doesnt have to be true...
13:09:40*petur finds nobody working with warthman in his LinkedIn network :/
13:09:53XavierGrNot to mention the 4500 bucks that a student gets. That ammount of money would make me set up the dev-env even if I hadn't see a PC in my life before.
13:09:54GodEaterie: I don't see how they could give it away - it doesn't belong to them
13:10:02pondlifeMaybe MrW could help?
13:10:19pondlifeHe sits on a bench in Palo Alto I hear
13:10:41GodEateror MrJ ?
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13:11:46scorcheqwm: i believe Llorean has been on the forefront of that bug...see if you can talk to him
13:11:53markunXavierGr: well, I'm not 100% sure what was the problem
13:12:04qwmhehe, alright.
13:12:35B4gderie: feel free to ask
13:13:47ieB4gder: shouldn't we send them an official letter printed on RB paper with headings etc? :-)
13:13:55pondlifehaha
13:13:57peturhahahaha
13:14:08B4gderie: feel free to print one of those fist ;-)
13:14:27*petur puts ie back with his two feet on the ground
13:14:36pondlifeHmm, http://www.portalplayer.com/ is down? Have PP died?
13:14:48B4gderpondlife: they're owned by nvidia
13:14:50*pondlife doesn't read much tech news
13:15:44B4gder"for $357 million in an all-cash deal"
13:15:52B4gdernov 2006
13:15:55pondlifeDarn. http://www.warthman.com/employ.htm cuts off another route in.
13:16:03B4gderhaha
13:16:23pondlifeI was considering something...
13:16:28iepetur: you never know. Maybe the letter will be read by a secretary and she will be impressed by the official look and will send the book without knowing it's top secret
13:16:30B4gderI bet you could try getting employed by sandisk or ...
13:16:40*petur sends the hit team to free a position
13:17:02*scorche could use a job...broadcom offices are close by =P
13:17:08pondlifeSeems like you need to be in the right part of these companies, the docs are well secreted internally too I bet.
13:17:22B4gderpondlife: oh I'm sure, yes
13:17:41B4gderbut that won't be a problem for a suitably good spy!
13:18:22XavierGrok so let's say that theoritically someone has a leaked full spec-pdf of those. What's the Rockbox stance on it?
13:18:26*scorche holds up his lockpick set and laser microphone
13:18:47B4gderXavierGr: the official stance is complete denial ;-)
13:18:56XavierGrhehe
13:18:57peturand usage :)
13:19:24peturand watch the committers ML :)
13:19:30pondlifeMight be safer to officially not have a stance at all.
13:19:38XavierGrbut would you accept work from someone that is using it?
13:19:51B4gderlet me put it this way: in case there would be or has been "leaked" docs or sources, it won't be officially sanctioned or mentioned by Rockbox
13:19:56peturwe don't, there's lots of documents we do not have :p
13:20:12*scorche adds a bit of log scrubbing to B4gder's to-do list
13:21:46pondlifehttp://www.nvidia.com/page/pp_5024.html mentions a developer kit. Is that the NDAed-to-death one?
13:21:54preglowi'd imagine
13:22:05pondlifeAnyone asked them since November?
13:22:11B4gdertry asking them
13:22:23*pondlife asks
13:22:36B4gderthese companies are surprisingly difficult to get stuff from
13:23:03B4gdereven if you imply that you consider their hw for use
13:23:14pondlifehttp://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=38903
13:23:28pondlifeThat wasn't me by the way
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13:23:36ddaltonI found an alarm plugin for h300 in the tracker. I am just testing it now. But I don't know if it will compile.
13:23:47B4gderpondlife: great set of responses... :-[
13:23:54pondlifeIndeed
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13:28:52XavierGrpetur: (just making sure) did you see my response the other day?
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13:29:10peturyes, thanks for the info
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13:44:57tucozB4gder: B4gder+leaked+site%3Arockbox.org&btnG=Google+Search">http://www.google.com/search?source=ig&hl=en&q=B4gder+leaked+site%3Arockbox.org&btnG=Google+Search
13:45:16tucozsecond hit ;-)
13:45:18 Part ziroday
13:45:34B4gdergee, I seem to leak a lot ;-)
13:45:55tucozin response to: 13.19.51 # <B4gder> let me put it this way: in case there would be or has been "leaked" docs or sources, it won't be officially sanctioned or mentioned by Rockbox
13:45:57tucozhehe
13:46:14scorche[04:20:11] * scorche adds a bit of log scrubbing to B4gder's to-do list
13:46:15scorche=P
13:46:15B4gderwell that is still true
13:46:26B4gderI am not rockbox I am just a confused individual
13:46:26tucozyes. you are not rockbox. you are B4gder :D
13:46:29tucozhehe
13:47:21preglowyes, someone massage pp now they're under new management
13:47:28preglowthe one good attempt we had didn't even get answered
13:47:52tucozare the SoC projects in google's hands now?
13:47:55dionoeamassage ?
13:48:11preglowdionoea: everybody appreciates a good massage :>
13:48:16dionoea;)
13:48:29preglowtucoz: in what way, do you mean?
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13:49:05tucozpreglow: as in they are finished now? and up to google to decide if they are a success or not
13:49:24preglowit's up to each mentor to decide that
13:49:26GodEaterpreglow: I emailed them after nvidia bought them out too. That also fell into a black hole
13:49:29preglowgoogle just pays cash
13:49:54tucozpreglow: i see. i guess i am curious to see what the outcome was.
13:50:12XavierGrtucoz: we all are.
13:50:25parafinyou know, even black holes return some information :)
13:50:44scorchespatial anomaly might be a better term
13:50:48preglowoutcome so far is: working wma decoder, no text to speech, close-to-working usb support and mob stuff to be commited in the near future
13:51:50tucozso the wma is a success, usb and mob is a "success", and tts is failed then
13:51:57iewma decoder is much I'd say. So the SoC wasn't wasted time
13:52:47tucoz75% success ratio is not too bad.
13:53:00GodEateris TTS a complete failure then?
13:53:10scorcheisnt quite 75% i believe yet...
13:53:13 Quit gromit` (Remote closed the connection)
13:54:19tucozscorche: right. but if the mentors (petur, and Llorean) approves their students work it is 75%. or not?
13:54:36scorchethey havent been approved quite yet
13:54:59dionoeaapproval doesn't mean that the code gets in rockbox. ffmpeg approved a bunch of projects last year but only one (vc1 decoding) made it in svn AFAIK.
13:55:05B4gderI believe mr TTS has applied for an extension
13:55:16dionoea(well maybe it'd be different for rockbox ... lets hope :D)
13:55:31GodEaterB4gder: that's the last I heard too - didn't know if that had moved or not
13:55:36tucozdionoea: i was thinking in pure SoC terms.
13:55:39B4gderme neither
13:56:10scorcheyes, but approval also means that they completed their work to their mentor's satisfaction...i dont believe we have a 75% approval int hat regard (i could be wrong though)
13:57:31tucozscorche: i guess i just wait and see what the outcome is, when that time comes then.
13:57:37*scorche nods
13:58:38tucozamiconn should apply for viewports SoC project next summer ;)
13:58:56peturtucoz: evaluation deadline is august 31
13:59:05tucozpetur: ah. thanks
13:59:42peturbut Google says the evaluation should be based on the status of august 20
14:00
14:00:05tucozshould, but not have to?
14:00:24peturthat is their rule
14:00:47tucozi guess that is fair
14:03:51***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:04:39JdGordontucoz: well.. ideally viewports would be done before then...
14:05:08tucozJdGordon: yes. i agree. it was just a joke
14:07:38markunBagder: yes, the extension was granted
14:08:40B4gdermarkun: how much extra time?
14:08:50markunnot sure :)
14:08:58markunlet me check the mails again
14:09:48markun"I want to make it clear to you that you will need to deliver code regularly according to whatever schedule you and Marcoen determine to be reasonable."
14:09:58markunwe didn't determine anything so far
14:20:43peturmarkun: so is he failed or is that delayed as well?
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14:22:25parafinhm
14:22:44parafinmenu and play buttons doesn't work in debug menu
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14:26:41parafinwill rockbox see folders and files with '?' or '\' in their name?
14:26:56GodEater"\" is a path seperator
14:27:25parafinwell, not in unix
14:27:30petur"?" is a wildcard char
14:27:45parafinyeah, but that isn't the problem
14:27:58parafinwell, i guess i simply should try :)
14:28:06B4gderI believe both are illegal in fat file names
14:28:27peturI think so too
14:28:28parafini think filesystem doesn't care how file is called
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14:28:40B4gderthe fat spec cares
14:28:42parafinit's os who has problems with it
14:28:47B4gderno
14:29:02B4gderfat is a filesystem as specified in a spec
14:29:13B4gderit defined what is legal or not
14:29:22B4gderdefines
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14:29:32kk" * / : < > ? \ |
14:29:40kkthese are the illegal characters
14:29:42parafinthis spec is old, so is fs
14:29:55GodEaterso ?
14:29:55B4gderso?
14:29:58kkthe spec is also ludicrously well supported across operating systems.
14:30:02GodEaterthat echo again....
14:30:15B4gderthe wheel is old too
14:30:19parafinwell, anyway, does rockbox has problems with this characters?
14:30:22 Nick kk is now known as krazykit (n=kkit@140.141.29.162)
14:30:23pondlifehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IriverPort says that the SWCODEC architecture is 60% complete. I assume it's safe to change that to "Done"?
14:30:35scorchewhy would rockbox want to violate the specs?
14:30:56GodEaterB4gder: I have this great new design for a wheel
14:30:57B4gderparafin: rockbox tries to adhere to the fat spec
14:31:15parafinscorche, it would be me, who will violate it
14:31:18scorcheGodEater: triangle?...i thought of it, but real world tests arent so great
14:31:34GodEaterscorche: no - square - I've not got to prototyping it yet though
14:31:52scorcheyou always were a square sort
14:32:15GodEaterparafin: what we're trying to say is - Rockbox sticks to the FAT spec (mostly), and so therefore files with those characters in their names will not work
14:32:33scorchethere is no reason to change this
14:32:43B4gderthey might work if they already exist
14:33:03B4gderbut that would be more or less by coincidence
14:33:04parafinGodEater, that's bad news :/
14:33:26B4gderparafin: using those letters in file names on fat is a bad idea to start with
14:33:37pondlifeIgnoring the spec is bad news
14:33:54pondlifeUnless you don't mind losing those files at some point
14:34:20parafini'm not asking rockbox to ignore specs, i ask for not minding others to do so
14:34:30GodEaterI'm not even sure how you'd create such files
14:34:37GodEatermy linux box refuses to do so
14:34:46parafinman mount ;)
14:34:52scorchethis isnt like a law where you bend the rules, or it is fine as long as no one is harmed...these are specs
14:35:20scorchewhy do you even want this?
14:35:47parafinthere is a rule in programming - 'Be liberal with input, strict with output'
14:36:05B4gderparafin: there's another rule in programming: do things right from the start
14:36:05parafincause i have such files in my collection
14:36:12pondlifeAlways validate input from untrusted sources
14:36:13ieI'm sorry for maybe asking a stupid question but hasn't the ipod's (and sansa's) FW been decompiled and analysed as to get the info about how the chips should be controlled?
14:36:24Zagorie: not fully, no
14:36:42GodEaterthe analysis part is a pretty huge task
14:36:51scorcheGodEater: i think we should use those malloc pitchforks for a new purpose?
14:36:55B4gderie: they have but they are huge and that's a very tiresome, hard and time-consuming work
14:37:07krazykitparafin, then you should run them through something like tag and rename (windows) or ex falso (on *nix)
14:37:25krazykiti know the latter can rename to be safe with FAT, and i'd bet the former can too
14:37:32pondlifeOr run them through CHKDSK on Windows :)
14:37:33parafinkrazykit, well i probably would unless it's possible to avoid it
14:37:43krazykityeah, it's pretty much not.
14:38:21ieBut I think those specific sections that handle power etc aren't that huge. And IIRC there were even tools that convert asm to c code. The c code looks horrible of course (so it might be better to read the raw asm) but still...
14:38:37B4gderie: eh, no those tools don't exist
14:38:44B4gderand we don't have a power issue per se
14:38:50parafinbtw, which is maximum length of filename in fat?
14:38:54GodEaterie: also - those sections may be small - but how do you find them ?
14:38:55ieBTW: is decompiling the OF legal (and is asking this legal?)
14:38:59GodEaterparafin: 254 iirc
14:39:13B4gderie: reverse engineering is completely legal in most parts of the world, yes
14:39:15pondlifeand that's a pathname limit, not a filename
14:39:26parafinomg
14:39:28scorcheie: depends on a lot of things including where you live
14:39:29GodEaterpondlife: ah - indeed
14:39:42scorcheparafin: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vfat
14:40:33ieB4gder: are you serious (about non existing tools)? I've seen one for intel asm. That was about 10 or more years ago though...
14:40:46B4gderie: I am dead serious on that
14:41:03B4gderthere are disassembly tools that are fine yes
14:41:14B4gderthere are no tools that make even bad C code from that
14:41:43B4gderfeel free to prove me wrong
14:41:47B4gderI'd be delighted
14:42:00pondlifeawful C maybe.. :)
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14:42:22ieB4gder: ok, I assume that C code wouldn't be of any use. But the asm tools draw frames around the sequential parts of code etc.
14:42:24parafinok, problem resolves itself - linux indeed refuses to write such files to vfat
14:42:26GodEaterC from the pits of hell
14:42:31B4gderand for intel asm, it might've worked for ancient intel asm
14:42:36GodEaterparafin: hah - told you so!
14:43:02B4gderie: IDA pro is mighty powerful disassembly tool, you should try it
14:43:03ieB4gder: well, I can write such a tool (asm->C) in no time. It will produce the following code: asm{...} :-)))
14:43:07Zagorparafin: where did you create those files?
14:43:19pondlifeGodEater: Imagine the use of goto !
14:43:31pondlifeAwful terrible C..
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14:43:36parafinZagor, well, any linux filesystem doesn't have such restrictions
14:43:46scorcheB4gder: http://boomerang.sourceforge.net/cando.html
14:43:48B4gderfvat is a linux filesystem too ;-)
14:43:58parafinZagor, there is only two symbols you can't use - \0 and /
14:44:00Zagorparafin: oh, I though you said you had a fat32 system with them on?
14:44:14parafinZagor, no, i tried right now :)
14:44:16Zagorok
14:44:34*krazykit thinks parafin means "ext3" as the "linux filesystem"
14:44:44parafinB4gder, then ntfs is too, following your logic
14:44:53B4gderscorche: I doubt that works very good in real-world
14:44:56parafinkrazykit, jfs, xfs, reiserfs, reiser4, ext*
14:45:03scorcheB4gder: i know...just proving a point
14:45:05B4gderparafin: of course, they are filesystems not operating systems
14:45:31parafinB4gder, well, then i would call them posix filesystems
14:45:33B4gderbut ntfs doesn't even have a public spec afaik, so that's a little different
14:45:44B4gderposix?
14:45:51B4gderthey're hardly posix all of them?
14:46:04scorcheB4gder: http://boomerang.sourceforge.net/cando.php?hidemenu has a real world example, but im sure it was pruned quite nicely...
14:46:22B4gderscorche: yeah, I was looking at that
14:46:28krazykitregardless, no implementation of vfat is gonna let you put in those illegal characters in filenames.
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14:47:09ieB4gder: is there a free windows tool for disassembling ARM asm? And how would I run it (what should be the input)?
14:47:19GodEaterie: GNU objdump
14:47:22ieThis might be a chance for me to learn ARM asm.
14:47:38scorcheobjdump in vmware?
14:47:42B4gderie: objdump is free free free, and IDA pro exists in a free trial version
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14:47:49ieGodEater: does it run under cygwin?
14:47:56GodEaterie: should do
14:47:57parafinB4gder, well, posix requires filesystem to make difference between lower and upper case characters, which fat and ntfs can't do
14:48:10B4gderie: either one takes the raw binary as input
14:48:10parafinfor example
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14:49:31parafinwell, i now have problem on my hands
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14:49:35B4gderparafin: ok, out of all the filesystems that allow ? and \ in the filenames, every single one on linux allow ? and \ in the file names
14:49:42GodEaterntfs does support case sensitivity
14:49:43B4gderthere
14:49:46GodEaterit's the OS which doesn't
14:50:06*B4gder lost track of the point of this discussion
14:50:23ieB4gder: and that binary is the .mi4 file?
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14:50:45B4gderie: no, you'd rather get a decrypted version...
14:50:54B4gderuse mi4code for that
14:50:56parafinwell, there is no point now, there is now only problem for me to resolve
14:51:32GodEaterparafin: well use Tag and Rename as krazykit suggested...
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14:52:05parafini don't like this idea, i'd rather write fuse wrapper above vfat filesystem
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14:52:51ieB4gder: so the disassembler should be given the output of mi4code as its input?
14:53:01GodEaterbrb
14:53:10B4gderie: yeah
14:53:19B4gderit takes whatever you throw at it
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14:53:40B4gderbut if you wanna disassemble the sansa firmware, the decryped mi4 makes sense
14:53:48B4gderor the bl.com file if you want the bootloader code
14:54:04B4gderbl.rom even
14:54:30B4gderwatch out for thumb mode instructions
14:54:36B4gderat least in the bl
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14:56:50ieB4gder: are there other processors that use the same asm as the PP? I've found some references to disasm but they don't say explicitly that they handle ARM
14:57:21B4gderARM is ARM
14:57:31B4gderit is *widely* used all over
14:57:48GodEaterfor instance the processor in the Gigabeat F/X is ARM, but not PP
14:57:58B4gderbasically all phones and most daps these days are ARM based
14:58:14B4gderand pdas
14:58:23petur(xscale)
14:58:32B4gderyeah, but xscale is arm-based
14:58:49peturyes
14:58:59barrywardellwe have an arm disassembler in svn too
14:59:15B4gderright, I forgot about that one!
14:59:16barrywardellit should compile for windows, linux and macosx
14:59:38barrywardellit's a bit of an improvement on the gnu version
15:00
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15:03:38ieWhere would you assume the power mgmt code to sit? In the bootloader (as well)? I think the bl is smaller and hence would be easier to analyse
15:03:55B4gderwhat power management?
15:04:22B4gderI doubt the boot loader does any power management
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15:08:41ieB4gder: I mean itialise some registers etc. Or is that all done in the "main" FW? I know you can't say for sure but your opinion?
15:08:59B4gderI think some are inited in the BL and some in the firmware
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15:10:23ieB4gder: ok
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15:28:48barrywardellpetur: such a simple change makes the scrollpad much better!
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15:29:53peturbarrywardell: I think the enabling needed some settling ;)
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15:45:39*Febs wonders whether there is any thread in the "New Ports" forum where the second post is something other than a link to the "New Ports" wiki page.
15:46:47krazykitthe sansa e200r thread :P
15:47:48rasherI'm thinking of adding TTS-correction to the voice building. Any ideas how to go about doing it? I'm thinking of making the voice script look for a file called "ttscorrection-$language" in the build dir, perhaps?
15:48:25B4gderlanguange and probably tts engine too
15:49:06B4gderlike festival and espeak probably need different tweaks
15:49:30markunyou can also submit patches to espeak and festival :)
15:50:23B4gder... and end up needing different tweaks for different TTS engine _versions_ as well ;-)
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15:51:39markun:)
15:54:05n1salso the latest released version of festival is from 2003 so we'll probably have to wait for a while until it's usable by regular users...
15:55:01rasherso ttscorrection-$language-$ttsengine?
15:55:26rasherI'll ignore the comment about versions
15:56:04B4gderI'm not sure,but perhaps a ttscorrection-$language could be checked first and then ttscorrection-$language-$tts
15:56:25B4gderlike if there's a general language trick for all engines
15:56:41rasherMaybe we should include these files in svn?
15:56:44B4gderanyway, these are just minor ideas that can be changed
15:57:23rasherThere's no reason to have everyone come up with their own corrections
15:57:26B4gderyes, they should be in svn
15:58:57rasherI'm starting to think that these scripts should be rewritten in perl..
15:59:13rasherProblem is, I'm not very good with perl, so somebody else will probably have to do it
15:59:24pregloweverything should be rewritten in perl
16:00
16:01:46rasherI mean, I can do this in shell, but it'll end up being unbearably slow in cygwin, and perl is better suited to text-manipulation anyway.
16:02:19B4gderrasher: a perfect opportunity to learn perl! ;-)
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16:03:51bluebrotherttscorrection?
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16:04:06rasherbluebrother: to spell things out phonetically
16:04:15rasherbluebrother: so it sounds "right" in that particular tts engine
16:04:23bluebrotherah
16:04:30rasherA lot of search&replace on the voice-strings, basically
16:04:56 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
16:04:59*bluebrother wonders if portable installation makes sense for other OS than windows ...
16:05:30pondliferasher: As in MakeVoices.vbs, right?
16:05:38rasherpondlife: yeah
16:05:48pondlifeAn all-perl solution would be great.
16:06:08rasherI think I'll have a go at it
16:06:26ronnie56I've had rock box for a while and i can't seen to figure out how to rename my tracks so they aren't long file names, the ID3 tags can't be edited
16:06:36rasherbut I'm not happy about it
16:07:12rasherMeaning that I dread the rewrite. I realise that it's probably necessary
16:07:18rasherOr at least a very, very good idea
16:07:55pondlifeWell, I don't even know shell, but I managed to hack through it :)
16:08:16bluebrotherronnie56: you can't change the id3 tags on the player
16:09:20bluebrotherthere are various tools for doing that on the pc.
16:11:11rasherI like how all the "Tutorials" on perldoc basically assumes you're already a perl master and just want to read up on a specific area.
16:12:09B4gderwell, you've done shell programming so going to perl shouldn't be very difficult I would say
16:12:52 Quit ie ("CGI:IRC")
16:12:53rasherI've done perl before, it's just that I don't feel at home with it, so I thought I'd read a bit up on it. I've mostly been trying in the blind previously
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16:21:33Aveamiconn: you had some idea about the nano problems earlier but you didnt test it, the idea still floating around?
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17:27:27larsemilso i installed it and it works fine but the soundquality does not sound perfect...
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17:32:34rasherlarsemil: Please elaborate
17:32:55rasherlarsemil: Which target, what is the problem with the sound quality?
17:34:19*DerPapst wispers "bos"
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17:37:55 Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net)
17:41:02DefineByteanyone know how feasible it would be to create a text overlay over plugins?
17:41:24DefineBytei'm thinking games etc. full screen plugins
17:51:08 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear)
17:52:13DefineBytecan you display anything over fullscreen plugins?
17:52:38 Join sarixe [0] (n=sarixe@pool-68-239-217-158.nwrk.east.verizon.net)
17:59:56n1sDefineByte: plugins take full control of the UI and can do what they want...
18:00
18:00:21DefineByteah well, that's a shame
18:00:35n1swhat did you have in mind?
18:00:40DefineBytei wanted to write something that could show the currectly playing song over a plugin
18:01:43n1sDefineByte: you could probably just code it so that the plugin does it's own displaying... probably put most of the code in the plugin lib for easy re-use too...
18:02:12n1sie the plugin could ask rockbox for metadata of the current song and display it
18:02:29DefineByteokay, yeah. i'll look into that. thanks.
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18:02:55saratogayou could probably add some sort of overlay function to the API
18:03:14saratogabut i don't know if anyone would seriously consider allowing that to be committed to svn
18:03:24DefineBytewhy not?
18:03:31amiconnsaratoga: That would be rather difficult. Plugins run *in*the UI thread, i.e. they are the UI while they're running
18:03:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:03:53n1ssaratoga: I think that would cause all sorts of problems with stuff like grayscale lib, mpegplayer and doom
18:04:18amiconnBut making metadata accessible from plugins would be an option
18:04:25 Quit petur ("work->home")
18:04:30DefineBytemaybe you could allow the plugin etc to forbid overlays
18:04:33*amiconn wonders what that would be good for though
18:05:04DefineBytei'm thinking of a popup on song change telling me the artist/title when the song changes
18:05:31n1sI think that it is simpler to make the plugins themselves handle it
18:05:31DefineBytei'd use it while playing solitaire xD
18:05:46DefineByteyeah, probably
18:06:09 Quit DerPapst ("work->home")
18:06:12n1spossibly you could make a global setting in rockbox that the plugins check so it could be disabled globally
18:06:26DefineBytethat was the plan.
18:06:55saratogai was thinking something that simply watched for updates to the frame buffer (or whatever rockbox uses) and then overwrites set pixels
18:07:02saratogasomewhat like hardware overlay on modern PCs
18:07:13saratogapresumably working in the display driver
18:07:19saratogano idea how slow that'd be though
18:08:21amiconnI wouldn't like to have song display in plugins. The displays are smal enough...
18:08:42n1ssaratoga: some plugins do their own drawing (like the ones I mentioned before) and IMO plugin-only functionality belongs in the plugin lib and not in the core
18:09:01amiconnAll plugins do their own drawing. There are no back buffers
18:09:36rasheramiconn: a pop-up would be reasonable, depending on the plugin of course
18:09:38n1samiconn: I meant that some do not use the regular API with lcd_update etc...
18:09:42DefineBytethere's plenty of room for a popup on iPods though. probably gigabeats too.
18:10:14amiconnn1s: Yeah. Those plugins cannot show popups. Period. No way around that
18:10:36n1samiconn: ah, ok
18:10:41DefineBytei was going for a 'my first rockbox patch kinda thing. sounds like it would be a bit too involved. xD
18:11:34n1sAlso IMHO this sounds a bit like feature creep, don't know if others agree though...
18:12:05DefineByteon targets without an lcd remote it would be quite useful (imo)
18:13:35DefineByteit could be used for other things too like showing early low battery warnings etc
18:13:52DefineBytebut still, if it's not really that simple...
18:13:56amiconnThe LCD remote is also under plugin control during plugin execution
18:14:08DefineByteo
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18:14:26DefineByteany plugins use that?
18:14:51DefineBytecouldn't you only give a plugin control of it if requested?
18:14:58amiconnVery few. Menus are displayed on the remote though as many plugins now use the core menu api
18:15:07amiconnThere is only one GUI thread
18:15:19DefineBytei see
18:16:45amiconnI once had the idea that there could be two, but that would introduce a lot more complexity than it's worth
18:16:55DefineBytecould you extend the plugin api to allow external control i.e. tell the plugin what to display?
18:17:14amiconnTwo GUIs would inherently allow to enter two contradicting functions
18:18:13amiconnDefineByte: Again, there is *one* GUI thread, and the plugin *is* that GUI while it is running. What other instance should tell it what to do?
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18:18:36DefineBytethe playback thread?
18:18:45DefineBytedunno.
18:18:48DefineByte:)
18:22:31DefineByteplugin_notify(str txt, int display) then it's up to the plugin what to do with it.
18:22:57DefineBytei'm saying this with no knowledge of rockbox mind. x)
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18:34:43DefineBytewell that went down like a lead balloon. i guess i'll forget it. :)
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18:38:43preglowjhMikeS: what's the big pcm update patch do?
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18:43:32*n1s gets the beer out of the fridge and leaves, bye :-)
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18:45:11jhMikeSpreglow: rearranges the api and properly sychronizes calls with the DMA. Has an eye towards running PCM on whichever core starts it as well. Also fixes a bug with r12 (by using r10 and r11 for the saved regs).
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18:47:27preglowbug?
18:47:56jhMikeSpreglow: it also unifies all duplicate code so the only difference is the hardware part. that applies to sim as well.
18:48:27jhMikeSpreglow: yes, bug. seems gcc isn't so good about r12 in the c code called by fiq.
18:50:10preglowwow, what are the odds of that going unnoticed?
18:51:28preglowhmm
18:51:44preglowwhy would that matter, btw? afaik, i only call one piece of c code in that asm block
18:51:51preglowand then i stack everything
18:51:54jhMikeSI didn't notice it until actually doing the coding. Of course, I can't be _sure_ it's that for all players.
18:52:26jhMikeSbecause it's after recording (which uses C only)
18:53:17preglowoh, recording
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18:55:35preglowyeah, i didn't think about recording at all when doing that asm
18:55:57preglowand there's got to be a better place for those initial fiq constant loads than crt, i wonder why the hell i put them there
18:55:58jhMikeSthe pcm patch scrunches the asm code down a bit too
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18:56:58jhMikeSmaybe because the processor exception modes are setup there? :P
18:57:25preglowprobably, at least i've commented what happens
18:57:30preglowanywho, how's the dual core stuff going?
18:58:10*jhMikeS thinks it's really time to commit this even if a lone H10 had some glitch. an e200 or anything else runs all day with the updates.
18:58:41preglowthe sooner the better
18:59:38jhMikeSI think it just brings up some problems with the particular ports themselves. There's no problems in the lock mechanisms since the testing would dealock it or panicf in a heartbeat.
19:00
19:01:33*preglow wishes people would take more care to use the same coding style as the file they're editing
19:01:44preglowi hate this mishmash of styles that result
19:02:26jhMikeSI'm also not sure which scheduler features should always be present. It adds semaphores, recursive mutexes (this simplifies other tasks), events, creating threads in suspended state and blocking queues can mix blocking types without restriction.
19:03:09krazykitooooh, the sansa is nice
19:03:36jhMikeSpreglow: If the style doesn't match mine, I just change the whole file ;)
19:04:07preglowas long as the style in question is not completely insane and uses whitespace in a sane manner, i'll just use whatever it is
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19:05:21jhMikeSit's usually the insane stuff I need to change just to get through it and understand it. besides, editing the style actually makes me read the code and I absorb it doing that.
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19:09:46*jhMikeS just knows he's gonna get it for 1) allegedly being the cause of glitching up some players and 2) a big red line on the delta table
19:13:19jhMikeSI don't think the reason for any of the glitches will ever be investigated and fixed without the code in place but it's not like an H10 for instance doesn't have random weirdness.
19:14:12peturanything that needs testing on H10 or are you guys covered ;)
19:14:25jhMikeSpetur: ummm...you have one now?
19:14:51peturyes, 5GB pure
19:15:42jhMikeSpetur: how bout a patch that enables dual core use of kernel objects and keeps cores independent?
19:15:52petursure
19:16:15jhMikeShuge...BRP-size stuff :)
19:16:33jhMikeSpure?
19:16:38peturI've got dinner coming up soon but that won't take long
19:16:46peturpure = without FM radio
19:16:56jhMikeSah
19:17:00peturwhich I learned after I bought it :(
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19:17:27jhMikeSI'll stick it up on my wiki page where an older version already resides
19:17:36peturok
19:18:38 Quit petur ("switching...")
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19:19:56jhMikeSI've got the panics turned off right now but those are easy to enable for stringent checks
19:20:51peturready when you are ;)
19:21:13jhMikeSmaking a patch ... not quite BRP size. only 200KB :)
19:22:13rasherBRP?
19:22:27jhMikeSBig Recording Patch
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19:22:46jhMikeShttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/viewfile/Main/MichaelSevakis?rev=1;filename=huge-scheduler-patch.diff
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19:23:33peturbuilding...
19:24:09WGCI uploaded some JPEGs to my Sansa and I don't even see them in Rockbox, what am I doing wrong?
19:24:14jhMikeSI rebuilt recently for single targets but not dual...hopefully it's ok
19:24:49jhMikeSpetur: full update with that one too
19:25:01petureh?
19:25:01*Nico_P sees talk about GSoC code submission earlier today...
19:25:12Nico_Pwe don't upload the code till the 31st
19:25:15rasherWGC: Is your filebrowser settings set to show only music perhaps? Or maybe you're browing using the Database, which also shows only music?
19:25:24WGCI'm using files
19:25:25Nico_Pand we onl do so if we have positive final evaluations
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19:26:07jhMikeSpetur: you need to replace codecs and all
19:26:11rasherWGC: what is your Settings > General Settings > File View > Show Files setting?
19:26:39peturjhMikeS: I always do... running on target now btw
19:27:00WGCJust music, heh
19:27:09peturjhMikeS: seems to work
19:27:16peturdinner now, brb
19:27:21 Quit WGC (Client Quit)
19:28:05jhMikeSpetur: when you get back, try mpegplayer, and then playback and whatever else in any combo.
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19:28:42PhalangeesI have a quick question.
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19:29:34PhalangeesI want to try and do some coding for rockbox but I really don't know where to start.
19:29:40 Nick chrisjs169 is now known as chrisjs169|afk (n=jack@unaffiliated/chrisjs169)
19:29:57PhalangeesIs there documentation of the functions and stuff like that?
19:30:31chrisjs169|afkI don't think there's any documentation of the functions in the wiki or anything, but there may be some info in the source code
19:30:38jhMikeSPhalangees: pick some small area that is interesting and work hard. I never read any docs...just code.
19:30:51rasherPhalangees: there is some documentation of the plugin api in docs/PLUGIN_API , and documentation of the Graphics API on the GraphicsAPI wikipage
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19:31:17PhalangeesThanks. I'll look at that.
19:31:28chrisjs169sorry people about the multiple nick changes - i needed to change the pass for |afk
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19:34:26 Quit sarixe ("Peace")
19:36:49preglowjhMikeS: if it seems to work almost everywhere, go commit it
19:36:57preglowjhMikeS: the bug won't be fixed until someone complains anyway :>
19:37:42jhMikeShehe ... PP5020 is the demon, so if petur clears it, I will
19:38:34jhMikeSI guess I can go to optimize for size or whatever later
19:39:08barrywardelljhMikeS: what's the H10 bug? anything you want me to test?
19:40:03jhMikeSone person had a problem when letting the disk spin down and then starting playback (hanging at splash) unless the CPU frequency was left at max
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19:41:23jhMikeSbarrywardell: just try it doing normal stuff and hopefully it won't glitch too bad
19:41:36barrywardellok. testing now...
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19:54:37*jhMikeS wonders if he should find comfort in the lack of reporting :-)
19:55:02barrywardelljhMikeS: haven't experienced any problems yet :0
19:55:05barrywardell:)
19:56:23srf21cis anyone here familiar with the "Data abort" and "undefined instruction" errors that seem to be rampant for some people when using the latest current build for ipod nano 1st gen?
19:56:24jhMikeSwell, wouldn't ya know . heh...bout time
19:57:04srf21cI've been dealing with these for a few months now. Originally thought it was due to overheating (I live in the desert) but after searcing the rockbox website, it appears others are having the same problem as well.
19:57:05jhMikeSsrf21c: I'm familiar with the meaning those exceptions, not all possible causes
19:57:12rashersrf21c: It's probably this bug: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7510 Llorean seems to be following it closely
19:57:41rasherHrm, not if it's been a problem for a few months. Ignore me then.
19:58:00srf21cthank you, I will check that bug tracker link out. Been really frustrating, especially when I am depending on my ipod for entertainment during long drives across the desert.
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19:58:45srf21cso far I have not harmed my ipod in anger. so far. ;)
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20:00
20:00:18*jhMikeS wonders if lazy removal of queue waiters could have spurred problems in the past. that way of doing things is history.
20:00:20srf21cLooks like the workaround for now is to try using a build of 14003 or earlier.
20:00:34*petur back
20:01:43barrywardelljhMikeS: I can't get it to it to hang. no problems on my h10
20:03:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:04:55 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:05:00jhMikeSbarrywardell: Great! I guess look for giant commit coming up soon.
20:05:14peturugh... hanging here
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20:05:25PhalangeesI added a plugin to the sources file but it still doesn't show up. Do I have to add it somewhere else as well?
20:05:35jhMikeSpetur: how?
20:06:08peturpowered up waited a bit (disk spin down as you mentioned) and then pressed play
20:06:14peturwill try again
20:06:19parafinPhalangees, CATEGORIES
20:06:28Phalangeesparafin: Thanks!
20:06:31jhMikeSdoes adding boost before trying playback fix it?
20:07:28peturaargh, can't reproduce
20:08:37peturtoying around mpegplayer now
20:10:18*amiconn still thinks the scheduler is already more complicated than it should be :|
20:10:34 Quit schNibbler (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
20:10:41jhMikeSit's not complicated enough. it makes everything else more complicated that uses it.
20:10:50 Part srf21c
20:11:36peturand another freeze in mpegplayer (inside menu) - retrying
20:11:45amiconnThe old scheduler I could understand. The current one - umm, sorry :(
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20:13:08*barrywardell just got a freeze in the mpegplayer menu too
20:13:09jhMikeSI suppose I understand because I really desire to work on it otherwise probably not either.
20:13:22peturbarrywardell: it is very reproducable
20:13:38jhMikeSdo give the recipe.
20:13:43Slasherii think the new code is more straightforward than the old one
20:14:19*jhMikeS doesn't really understand code x unless he desires to work on it in general
20:14:23barrywardellpetur: indeed. 2 out of 3 times so far
20:14:29Slasheriindeed
20:14:29Domonokyperhaps it would be nice to have a wiki page aubou the scheduler ? :-)
20:14:41peturjhMikeS: start mpegplayer and while playing, go to the menu and walk around there a bit
20:14:47barrywardelljhMikeS: 1) start mpegplayer, 2) go to menu, 3) freeze
20:14:49SlasheriDomonoky: there is, RockboxKernel
20:15:00Slasheribut that is not entirely up-to-date
20:15:09jhMikeSOn e200 I can't do it.
20:15:31amiconnjhMikeS: I think that we should really try and stay KISS
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20:16:09preglowthere's nothing KISS about dual core
20:16:14 Part bricas
20:16:14Slasheriamiconn: the complexity could be in the scheduler or in the application level
20:16:20jhMikeSThings should never be more simple than they have to be
20:16:52amiconnThe problem with several modules atm is that nobody really understands them as long as he isn't either the author of most lines of code in there, or dives into the code for weeks
20:16:54jhMikeSI'd rather have an involved kernel that makes things easier for everything else over it really
20:17:04Slasheriand operating system should hide complexity from app level
20:17:28amiconnAnd I suspect that many of the current glitches wouldn't exist if those modules were comprehensible
20:17:44rasherAny perl people around who could tell me how to execute external programs and feed them something on stdin?
20:18:16amiconnThe most prominent examples are the scheduler and playback.c
20:18:29Slasheriamiconn: btw, the kernel code is quite well commented
20:19:23jhMikeSpetur, barrywardell: do you think an mpegplayer glitch should stop progress towards what is way overdue?
20:20:01peturjhMikeS: I can't reproduce that crash in mpegplayer with current SVN
20:20:40barrywardelljhMikeS: mpegplayer, maybe not. but if it affects other things...
20:21:17Slasherirasher: open F, "|-", "program"; print F "something\n";
20:21:20Slasherirasher: IIRC
20:21:20jhMikeSwhat doesn't? not like clocking work didn't cause problems.
20:22:09rasherSlasheri: interesting, thanks
20:22:34peturjhMikeS: mpegplayer crashing surely proves there's someting going very wrong... imo, mpegplayer is the real dualcore test, no?
20:23:01peturdoes it work stable on other targets besides H10?
20:23:14jhMikeSmaybe. it really doesn't depend on kernel objects at all for synchronization though.
20:23:52peturyou saying it's a bug in mpegplayer?
20:23:56jhMikeSpetur: basically anything not pp5020 I get no reports. e200 plays all day long
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20:25:18barrywardellhas it been tested on other pp5020 targets?
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20:26:03jhMikeSpetur: My feeling is yes. The cache handling is a major point for all pp targets as well but that's a separate issue and this will likely change some stuff around a bit there.
20:27:00jhMikeSbarrywardell: not this implementation. I guess an ipod color/photo test wouldn't hurt.
20:27:22peturwell I'm no mpegplayer user and this patch only seems to cause the freeze when going in the menu - not a spot where you have to be a lot
20:27:55barrywardellpetur: did you not get a freeze when starting playback as well?
20:28:05peturah yes, true
20:30:03jhMikeSplayback is really unstable and timing sensitive. one yield in the wrong place or time can knock it over.
20:31:02 Quit obo ("bye")
20:32:50 Quit _jz ("Coyote finally caught me")
20:34:03jhMikeSah, I guess we stay at square one even though the only thing that gives trouble is a pp5020. odd that nothing else should complain.
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20:37:13barrywardelli think tests on other pp5020's would be informative
20:39:01 Quit chrisjs169 (Connection timed out)
20:39:08*amiconn test-builds
20:39:29amiconnFour targets for now
20:39:32jhMikeSThe real cause of the trouble needs to be addressed. My informed hunch is that it lives outside kernel or threads itself. The patch uses no method not already employed in SVN.
20:39:42 Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:40:46peturthe crash in mpegplayer menu might be a good hint to find something...
20:41:14*rasher curses perl
20:41:40parafinperl rules, you just don't know how to cook it
20:42:11rasherIt's being all cryptic at me. Like mangling commandline options to programs I'm making it run.
20:42:14peturI'd cook it long enough untill it disintegrates completely ;)
20:42:55parafinrasher, perl cookbook is nice book about perl for practical uses
20:43:06*parafin uses it right now
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20:43:45*amiconn isn't sure whether he likes perl or not
20:44:07Phalangeeswhat's the fastest way to get the lcd height? rb->lcd_height ??
20:44:11jhMikeSpetur: possibly. I'm so dumb I didn't update my copy with my bin :P
20:44:24amiconnIt's very powerful, but it also makes it easy to write scripts that even youself don't understand anymore just one week later
20:44:45preglowamiconn: then you write perl code like a pig
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20:45:01*jhMikeS thinks perl and he would get along in that case
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20:46:34rasherLooks like I'll have to poke at the IPC module
20:47:27 Quit freqmod (Remote closed the connection)
20:48:03*jhMikeS wonders if linuxstb will volunteer more ipod color tests
20:50:18low_lightamiconn: looks like DEV_TIMING1 might be set wrong on pp5022c...
20:50:18amiconnHmm, quite some binsize+ :(
20:50:24low_lightamiconn: the sansa c200 has a pp5022c. Here's how it sets the timing: http://rafb.net/p/zBA7VO16.html
20:50:26dionoeaPhalangees: LCD_HEIGHT
20:50:42Phalangeesdionoea: Thanks a bunch.
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20:51:11preglowwhat uses the pp5022c?
20:51:18low_lightnano
20:51:20amiconnlow_light: You mean not touch other bits than 0..3 and 8..1?
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20:51:37amiconnThe current way of handling in rb is from the apple fw
20:52:09amiconnOther PP502x original firmwares seem to do this masking (e.g. H10). Apple does not
20:52:24low_lightI mean the value...0x505 vs 0x808
20:52:51jhMikeSall I've seen from sansa OF is 0x1010
20:54:15low_lightthat's in there too...it's set during the sd init
20:54:39amiconnlow_light: Then it might even be device specific. E.g. the H10 bootloader sets 0x1515
20:54:57amiconnThat would be 0x0505 taking the mask into account
20:55:00jhMikeSit's call DEV_TIMING1 and noone knows what it does?
20:55:09amiconnBut apple sets 0x0808 for 80MHz
20:55:25amiconn...and 0x0303 for 24 and 30MHz
20:55:47amiconnThese slight differences don't seem to matter
20:55:47jhMikeSlow_light: I suspect that shouldn't even be in that file. :\
20:55:57low_lightamiconn: in the nano?
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20:56:06amiconnlow_light: In all PP502x ipods
20:56:34*jhMikeS wonders if it actually could be ata related
20:57:31amiconnThe nano crashes?
20:58:11amiconnI'm almost sure the nano crashes are ata related, but I have no nano to verify this theory
20:58:35preglowhow would i go about verifying it?
20:59:12amiconnPoking around with the ata timing regs, comparing what the OF does etc
20:59:14*jhMikeS wonders if fixing the reg would change the dual core patch behavior re: disk
20:59:22amiconnjhMikeS: Almost instant crash on H10
20:59:35amiconnJust going to the menu and pressing Down 2 times
21:00
21:00:17jhMikeSvery strange how H10 is acting then and various results from various devices
21:00:20amiconnReset, reboot -> same thing
21:00:29amiconnI have voice enabled of course
21:01:05jhMikeSI haven't really tested there but of course do more verifying of that stuff myself
21:01:29 Quit barrywardell ()
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21:02:11amiconnNow it even hangs on boot before showing the rockbox logo...
21:03:13amiconnIt just freezes with the disk spinning. No data abort or sth like that
21:03:42amiconnErm, and it doesn't even build for recorder
21:03:43jhMikeSwhat gives with 5020 then? how can other chips not have trouble with the very same code?
21:03:55amiconn"region IRAM is full"
21:03:56 Join agm3nt [0] (i=gh@nat.n3t.pl)
21:04:40jhMikeShmmm...builds for player though
21:05:00amiconnYes, sure. Player has more spare IRAM than recorder
21:05:25bluebrotherDomonoky, obo: any idea if it's possible to distinguish if I'm building against a static Qt or not in the project file?
21:05:45amiconnipod 1g2g doesn't build either
21:05:51jhMikeSis SVN really that close to the limit it can't handle a few more vars?
21:05:56amiconn"thread.c:182: error: conflicting types for 'core_sleep'"
21:06:08amiconnSH1 has 4KB of iram
21:06:20amiconnThat's used up apart from <100 bytes iirc
21:06:26jhMikeSIt's not like I got to that late stage of build verification for everything
21:07:52amiconnWell, you asked for testers, and I presume you want to see that committed
21:09:13jhMikeSyes...and thanks. it's obvious that even if I acquire an H10, it doesn't represent them all.
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21:10:54amiconnOn PP5022 (mini G2) it seems to work, but mpegplayer also glitches
21:11:16jhMikeSthe main difference is that the use of swp(b) in tight spinlock loops becomes very common
21:11:19amiconnIt doesn't crash, but after going to the menu and returning, the greylevels are all wrong (way too light)
21:12:11amiconnOoops
21:12:22jhMikeSwhat?
21:12:24amiconnGot a data abort in the scroll settings on mini G2
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21:15:20jhMikeSok, I'll eat my words and look for a stupid mistake somewhere :P
21:16:03 Quit hcs ("Leaving.")
21:16:04amiconnThat was after using mpegplayer. Maybe it's a related problem (stack?)
21:17:04 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:17:12amiconnThe grayscale mangling only happens after entering one of the options in the mpegplayer, not by just calling up the menu
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21:17:47amiconnPlop - crash repeated. Browsing the core menu after using mpegplayer
21:18:06amiconnOr rather, after entering a setting in the mpegplayer menu
21:18:15jhMikeSmenus and mpegplayer ... hmmm
21:18:15amiconnSame address, even
21:18:19jhMikeSwhich?
21:18:24amiconn0x00171c0 (0)
21:18:37jhMikeSon CPU then
21:18:46amiconnMissed a leading zero...
21:19:04*amiconn checks .map
21:19:41amiconnThat's in talk.o
21:21:10amiconn...in queue_clip(), near the end
21:21:18jhMikeSyes, mpegplayer screws up royally with voice around
21:21:42jhMikeSI'm watching a nice green blob video after enabling voice
21:22:13amiconnThat's in spite of mpegplayer is (supposedly) disabling voice while running?
21:23:17jhMikeSyeah? and exactly where does it do that?
21:23:19amiconnSomething seems to be wrong with swcodec voice in general, even on single core
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21:25:00jhMikeSI don't see mpegplayer disabling voice at all
21:26:01 Quit sarixe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:26:08jhMikeScare to check anything with the voice out of the way?
21:26:10amiconnWell, someone said it does
21:27:33 Quit Phalangees ("Ex-Chat")
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21:27:54jhMikeSrecording uses talk_disable_menus(). mpegplayer makes no reference to anything talk that I can see now and it didn't when I did work on it.
21:28:49*amiconn wonders why he has a bunch of .i and .s files in apps/plugins/mpegplayer
21:29:14jhMikeSoops, I left −−save-temps in there :P
21:29:40webguest14Hey, if the patch FS #7627 really does what it claims to do I'd vote for it to be included into RB. Ok, my vote doesn't count much but it could point some devs to the patch
21:29:40jhMikeSThis is hardly a cleaned up patch. Very much a working copy.
21:29:57*amiconn used −−save-temps once
21:30:04amiconnNever again... :(
21:30:21preglow−−save-temps is nice
21:30:29jhMikeSfind -name "*\.[is]" -exec rm {} \;
21:30:43amiconnThat would also delete .S files
21:30:51amiconn(on cygwin anyway)
21:31:20amiconnAnd that's what's so annoying about −−save-temps. It writes into the source tree
21:31:21jhMikeSbugger
21:31:57jhMikeScan't set the temp dir in gcc?
21:32:38amiconnHmm, looks like it doesn't match .S
21:32:44obobluebrother: I don't know of any way of detecting that
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21:32:51amiconnOdd, I would have expected it to....
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21:33:00parafinamiconn, why?
21:33:11parafinamiconn, -name search is case-sensitive
21:33:14amiconnFS is case insensitive...
21:33:20parafinwell
21:33:36parafinwhen you read names - is returns right case
21:34:06amiconnYes, it's case-preserving, but not case-sensitive
21:34:24parafinwell, find doesn't know, that FS is so stupid
21:34:29preglowwell, yeah, but the gnu tools are case sensitive
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21:34:40preglowand they should be
21:35:10parafinanyway , there is -iname if you want to delete assembly files as well :)
21:35:24 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.6/2007072518]")
21:35:35rasherGod I hate programs that lie to me in their −−help output.
21:35:40amiconnHmm, there's a start.s in gdb/
21:35:44rasherToday's offender: festival_client
21:36:18rasherIt claims to be able to output into a file, but the switch has no effect.
21:36:35rasherSo I get riff data on my terminal. Which is annoying.
21:36:49preglowhahah
21:37:18jhMikeSamiconn: yeah, it gets that one every time
21:40:21jhMikeSpetur: no voice file is present on your H10?
21:41:19peturnot that I know, it's a pretty plain install, I just have it a few days anyway
21:42:28peturhmmm voice menus is set to yes, is that the default?
21:42:42jhMikeSyes
21:43:07peturno voice file present btw...
21:43:59jhMikeSthen it shouldn't have a voice thread at all...hmmm
21:45:51amiconneh?
21:46:12amiconnWith that patch, the "Loading..." splash when loading plugins is voiced twice
21:48:45jhMikeSI _think_ had that on e200 with just SVN though...I seem to remember making that verification. Will do again.
21:49:57amiconnI observed that on mini G2 and ipod Video
21:49:58jhMikeSOne thing about mpegplayer is that it calls menu code on the audio thread and not the main
21:50:14amiconn...not using mpegplayer
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21:51:04jhMikeSI was just commenting about that fact
21:54:17 Quit desowin ("use linux")
21:55:10jhMikeSthe alloc pointer are also not NOCACHE...
21:56:32 Part Domonoky
21:59:18amiconnCalling menu code from another thread than main is bad if you ask me
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22:00
22:00:30ronnie56I ahve just removed rockbox from my gigabeat and now it wont work
22:00:47krazykitronnie56, did you restore the old bootloader?
22:01:09krazykitthe old FWIMG01.dat
22:01:16jhMikeSamiconn: there's also sharing of graylib data across cores and _gray_info sure isn't NOCACHE
22:02:06ronnie56where would i find it?
22:02:14ronnie56oh
22:02:17krazykityou were told to back it up in the install instructions
22:03:41ronnie56shoot! what do i do if i lost it
22:03:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:05:29rasherpreglow: even better, the "−−otype" which sets the output type (riff, au, etc) only works if I set −−output. Yet the −−output still doesn't make it output to a file.
22:05:35 Quit barrywardell ()
22:05:47krazykitronnie56, you could search the forums in hope that someone uploaded it, or wait an hour til i get home
22:06:18jhMikeSI'm leaning towards caching issues from start to finish here
22:06:58 Quit Siku ()
22:08:04ronnie56i'll search the forums and if i don't find it, i'll be back on in an hour to talk with you
22:08:55amiconnmpegplayer has a lot of issues when voice is enabled. Some even happen when there was no voice enabled when starting the plugin
22:09:04amiconns/enabled/playing/
22:09:52amiconnPlaying the widescreen version of elephantsdream works on Video. Entering a setting (voice enabled) and then leaving the menu makes mpegplayer quit after a short audible glitch
22:10:15jhMikeSIt seems a flush on one core and then an invalidate on another core could corrupt data for both cores if the cached regions overlap. hmm
22:10:40amiconnAnd playing the fullscreen version shows the infamous green block right from the start, even though file & directory voicing was disabled
22:10:55 Quit chrisjs169 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:11:03ronnie56Krazykit, I have found it
22:11:30amiconnAll with your patch atm
22:11:44*amiconn already rebuilt without it for H10
22:11:52amiconnNow the H10 is usable again...
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22:12:26amiconnjhMikeS: Hmm, maybe cache handling is also different between 5020 and 5022?
22:12:27*jhMikeS needs ideas as to _why_ that would happen
22:13:49jhMikeSit could be though the routines in the sansa fw actually match the modification I have in that patch
22:13:49 Quit ronnie56 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:14:38jhMikeSI added the loops to read back the lines after invalidating from 0x10000000 to 0x10002000. it's the same routine as in ipod_init_cache
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22:17:53*jhMikeS isn't sure how to deal with the overlap stuff that a test plugin clearly shows exists.
22:18:02 Part agm3nt
22:18:07 Quit HellDragon (Client Quit)
22:23:49*preglow crosses himself and wishes for docs
22:25:03jhMikeS /preglow has plenty of company
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22:27:17jhMikeSamiconn: my snooping showed cache flags being set differently depending on the core that is current. I gotta find that again.
22:27:24low_lightjhMikeS: from what I've seen in the of bootloaders, CACHE_CTL = 7
22:27:43low_lightafter init, that is
22:29:05low_lightThe sansa c200 also has different magic numbers for f000f040 & f000f044
22:29:43jhMikeSI spotted that one as well. we also set CACHE_CTL = 1 :\
22:30:44amiconnrrrrr
22:30:45jhMikeSah, yes, c200. it applies to e200 it seems
22:32:51low_lightjhMikeS: here's from a pp5020 http://rafb.net/p/eb5c1O60.html
22:33:50jhMikeShow long is the instruction prefech if that is known?
22:37:38jhMikeShmmm...it bics 0x6 ... hmmm
22:37:57***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )'
22:39:44amiconnlow_light: The second routine looks really odd
22:39:53amiconn<<= 17 and then checking for positive....
22:42:01 Quit Buschel_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:43:01 Quit ghost` (Client Quit)
22:46:31low_lightjhMikeS: instruction prefech? How would I tell?
22:47:01 Quit RaRe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:47:18jhMikeSI don't know how you'd tell that.
22:47:58larsemilis there a web interface for 2.4?
22:48:03jhMikeSdoes this disassembler remove the "S" when renaming to LSL?
22:49:35rasherlarsemil: I don't see how that makes any sort of sense
22:49:44pixelmalarsemil: what? Are you sure you posted in the right channel?
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22:52:31low_lightjhMikeS: I'm pretty sure it's thumb code
22:53:03 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
22:53:04 Quit davina (Remote closed the connection)
22:53:05jhMikeSok, I haven't really dealt with that yet
22:53:17low_lightjhMikeS: pretty much the same code in the c200 (pp5022c): http://rafb.net/p/3SBbdu51.html
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22:54:27jbitis the uart itnerface known for the pp5022?
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22:55:28polygonalIs there anyone here whose expertise includes the Menu API? I saw that JdGordon is not here... :(
22:55:57polygonalI read the wiki page but still need help with the callback function
22:56:11PhalangeesWhat is the difference between rb->get_button(false) and rb->get_button(true)?
22:56:18 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:56:30BagderPhalangees: the waiting or not for getting a key
22:56:52PhalangeesBadger: Thanks. But why does the hard drive continuously spin with false?
22:57:04Bagderit shouldn't
22:57:17PhalangeesBadger: I'll keep testing it out. Thanks for your help
22:58:46 Join agm3nt [0] (i=gh@nat.n3t.pl)
22:59:28 Quit merbanan ("Leaving")
22:59:47rasherAnother (hopefully) quick perl question: There are functions to rename, delete, symlink etc. But not to copy? How do I copy a file with perl?
22:59:55 Join HellDragon [0] (n=Nocebo@unaffiliated/helldragon)
22:59:59Bagdersystem("cp file1 file2");
23:00
23:00:09rasherew
23:00:24BagderI bet there are some functions somehow as well
23:01:03Bagderuse File::Copy;
23:01:07Bagdercopy("file1","file2");
23:01:10Bagderapparently
23:01:33rasherYup, just found that as well
23:02:10 Part agm3nt
23:02:59 Quit BHSPitLappy (Connection timed out)
23:05:01polygonalA quick question about the linux dev enviroment: is there a way to execute a set of bash commands without typing them one by one everything (I'm kinda spoiled by the Windows batch file for commandline)
23:05:20polygonal*everything/everytime
23:05:23oxygen77seperate cmde with ;
23:05:25parafinwrite a script
23:05:36parafinor yes, write them in one line
23:05:48 Join BHSPitLappy [0] (n=steve-o@129.120.244.118)
23:05:56polygonalah! that's easy : )
23:06:00zepolygonal: batch files got nothing on bash
23:06:02polygonalthanks
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23:06:20 Join RaRe [0] (n=Laffin_B@202-89-187-101.static.dsl.amnet.net.au)
23:06:31zethere's conditionals too, this && that to execute that if this returns success, this || that to execute that if this returns failure
23:07:04parafinthere is powerfull pipes also and output redirection
23:07:11BjerrkHi. Rockboy does the "blank screen" thing on my iPod Video (30 Gig). On the wiki, it says that i'm supposed to toggle "Full screen" in the options menu once to make it behave normally, but there is no such option. What to do? :-)
23:07:13Bagder"spoiled by the Windows batch file" made my chuckle...
23:07:13zegood for dependant chains of commands, like make && make install
23:07:21zeso make install won't run unless make succeeds
23:07:56zeit can go multiple too, cd /somewhere && file Makefile && make && make install
23:08:29zeaborts the remaining commands at any failure port
23:08:37zes/port/point/
23:09:05jhMikeSlow_light: perhaps the routine in SVN which does show up in e200 fw is really the routine for use with a device controller and not one for coherency.
23:09:06rasherActually, batch files have &&, || and pipes as well. Where it lacks is mostly in the program flow department.
23:09:28polygonalze: thanks; Bagder: I'm a spoiled child by Windows generally since I never used any other OS beside it : )
23:09:30obobluebrother: you could do something like http://www.pastebin.ca/667262 and then call qmake -config static
23:09:41zerasher: batch files still use GOTO? :P
23:09:56Bagderpolygonal: I'm not holding it against you ;-) as long as you're happy that's fine
23:10:01parafinrasher, well, because of that almost nobody use these features and don't know about them
23:10:02Bjerrknoone knows about the blank rockboy screen thing?
23:10:04polygonalyeah I use pipes and stuffs in windows commandline as well, just can't find a batch file equivelant in my quick google search
23:10:06rasherWhoa. Voice-file generation is FAST now, using perl.
23:10:32Bagderpolygonal: use curl ;-)
23:10:40Bagderoh
23:10:46*Bagder misunderstood
23:10:51*Bagder goes to corner
23:11:11*Bagder whistles in the corner
23:11:13zeBagder: don't feel bad, i still dunno what his last line meant
23:12:15bluebrotherobo: cool, will try that −− that's something like I looked for
23:12:38polygonalsorrrrry :p I'm not good at writing meaningful statements in IRC channel
23:14:51rasherBagder: do you have numbers for how long voice building takes now?
23:15:03polygonaloff to debug now since the build is eventually finished...
23:15:11Bagderrasher: lemme check...
23:16:11Bagderrasher: roughly 11 minutes
23:16:18rasherBagder: for all voices?
23:16:21Bagderyes
23:16:52rasherNot bad, but then most of that is spent on the first run, so it's hard to gauge how long it really takes
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23:17:28Bagdertrue
23:17:48Bagderthe first is the player so it's not really covering up the majority of the phrases
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23:18:55Bagderrasher: http://pastie.textmate.org/90141
23:19:02rasherfor some reason I think festival got slower though. Can't quite figure out why
23:19:06Bagderthe script starts at 06:32
23:19:41rasherespeak and flite are very snappy though
23:20:06Bagderone of these days I'll setup the script to build with them too
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23:20:26BagderI also plan to make the voices into zip files using the full exact path
23:20:38polygonalI don't get it, if I exit a submenu, shouldn't I get back to the parent menu and get MENUEXIT action for the parent menu at some point? I'm confused...
23:20:49rasherAh, maybe not. I just build a h120 voice in just under 2 minutes. On my not terribly impressing XP2400
23:21:20rasherBuilding it again takes less than a second
23:22:04Bagder!
23:22:07rashernow to graft my perl horrors into the build system instead of the shell scripts of doom
23:22:46rasherThe biggest speedup should be on cygwin, which won't have to launch a million instances of sed, echo and so on
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23:23:38Bagderyes, they'll owe you at least one beer each after this! ;-)
23:25:59Phalangeesis there an easy way to make a circle or oval like lcd_fillcirc(xpos,ypos,width,height)
23:26:14PhalangeesOr do you need to construct it out of rectangles?
23:26:24Bagdermake it out of dots or lines
23:26:33PhalangeesOk, that's what I figured.
23:26:46Bagderthere's a clock plugin that draws a circle
23:26:54PhalangeesWhen you make a rectangle, is the xpos and ypos the center, or the top left corner?
23:27:02Bagdertop left
23:27:05Phalangeesok Thanks!!
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23:51:10amiconnBagder: The harddrive will of course continue to spin if a plugin just repeatedly uses button_get(false). No yield - no ata thread which could put the drive to sleep
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23:51:42Bagderwell yes, but that wasn't what he said happened
23:52:03Bagderor at least I didn't interpret it like that
23:53:09*ender` yawns
23:53:40amiconnWell, that's the first thing that came to mind when thinking about that question...
23:56:15larsemilso i get bad soundquality in rockbox with ipod 4th gen. the bass sounds hmm.. blury
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23:58:40kyuubisealhow do u install it
23:58:57kyuubisealrockbox

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