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#rockbox log for 2007-09-06

00:00:46 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
00:01:32ddaltonHow does the radio display numbers with a decimal? For example "87.9"? Doesn't rockbox only use ints?
00:02:32bluebrotherit uses two ints afaik: the part before the dot and the part afterwards.
00:02:45BigBambiSpeaking of compilers, running rockboxdev has given me a few problems. On kubuntu 64bit, all targets selected, there seems to be a gcc related problem, yet apt-get says gcc is the latest version. Could someone take a quick look for me? http://www.pastebin.ca/682995
00:02:59linuxstb_ddalton: or (x / 10) and (x % 10)
00:03:01bluebrotherand no, Rockbox doesn't only use ints: it uses fixed point calculatoins
00:03:06linuxstb_(where x = 879)
00:03:06ddaltonhow is the calculation done?
00:03:29bluebrotherthe frequency is stored in Hz internally. So you need to divide to get the displayed value anyway
00:04:26saratogaddalton: rockbox can't use floating point numbers, but it can still use decimal numbers (fixed point)
00:04:32BagderBigBambi: you have build-essential installed?
00:04:42BigBambiBagder: Will check, one mo
00:04:59preglowsaratoga: anything new about ffts?
00:05:24saratogapreglow: nothing new on the ffmpeg lists, though they have submitted some code for various other types of ffts
00:05:24BigBambiBagder: Hmmm, I thought so, but it appears not. Thanks for the help, sorry for the bother!
00:05:44Bagderno problemos
00:05:54ddaltonok I have written a little c program here. It asks the user for a number and then trys to work it out in a decimal. So if on the radio the frequency is 1019 what would be displayed?
00:06:35Bagderif that is 1019 Hz, just do the math
00:06:45Bagderyou want KHz? divide with 1000
00:06:55*bluebrother forgets a usb_find_devices() and wonders why no devices are found :/
00:06:59Bagderand the decimals with %1000 then
00:07:20BigBambiWell oddly enough, with build-essential, building works!
00:07:27*BigBambi slaps forehead, hard
00:07:28Bagder:-)
00:07:37DerPapstpoor forehead
00:07:48BigBambiHe had it coming for being stupid
00:08:40 Join forehead [0] (i=54307747@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e3e9fb0c9a2fa511)
00:08:45foreheadthat was uncalled for :/
00:08:50 Part forehead
00:09:07DerPapstheh
00:09:15BigBambiWe all forehead secretly loves it
00:09:34BigBambiinsert know somewhere in the sentance above
00:10:08DerPapsthehe
00:10:48 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@modemcable061.67-37-24.mc.videotron.ca)
00:14:49ddaltoncan someone tell me what needs to be done so when you enter 1019 it will print 101.9 I am just trying to work the calulation out. http://pastebin.ca/raw/683009
00:14:54 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:15:13*DerPapst is on a killing spree... stupid mosquitos
00:15:36Bagderddalton: x = i % 10;
00:15:50delYsidddalton: modulo 10 and loop!
00:15:53Bagderif y = i /10;
00:16:21delYsidddalton: with every mod you pull out one digit and divide by 10
00:16:33delYsidits really simple
00:17:20ddaltonit displays 101.1 for 1019
00:17:23ddaltonis that right?
00:17:44delYsidno
00:18:04ddaltonwhat is wrong now with it? I changed it to %10
00:18:05linuxstb_printf("%d.%d\n",i/10,i%10);
00:18:21delYsidprintf("%d.%d", i/10, i%10)
00:18:27delYsidheh
00:18:35delYsidlinuxstb_: you beat me to it :-)
00:18:37japclol
00:18:56linuxstb_delYsid: I even had a time to type \n
00:19:45delYsidlinuxstb_: and I saved one byte :-)
00:19:51bluebrotherwho of you did a typing class? ;-)
00:20:20linuxstb_ddalton: Is that working for you?
00:20:48ddaltonI wrote printf("\n%d.%d", i/10, i%100);
00:20:51ddaltonis that right?
00:21:00Bagderno
00:21:03ddaltonand it says 101.19 for 1019.
00:21:13japcddalton: % = modulo, the remaining of the integer division by something
00:21:16bluebrotherno: you need to take the same modulo as you divided
00:21:17japc10 !!
00:21:48japcint i/10 = 101 ; i % 10 = 9
00:21:51japcthus 101.9
00:22:05ddaltonyep thanks for all the help working as expected.
00:22:08ddaltongot to go
00:22:11 Quit ddalton ("leaving")
00:24:10 Join powr-toc [0] (n=user@84-51-129-124.rickmo645.adsl.metronet.co.uk)
00:24:21 Quit ender` (" Pets are better than children because: 11. If they get pregnant, you can sell their children.")
00:24:37linuxstb_Ah, seems the new 160GB drive is from Samsung - http://home.businesswire.com/portal/site/google/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20070820005213&newsLang=en
00:25:11powr-tocHey, I'm getting a Data abort error when I try and play an MP3 on my ipod video (30gb) with rockbox build 14616. Has anyone any ideas?
00:25:54 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.)
00:25:58 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
00:26:04linuxstb_Did you install the 60/80GB build?
00:26:21pixelmainstall a current build...
00:26:30Genre9mp3linuxstb: there's also a 120GB model from Samsung (announced 2 months ago)
00:26:39 Quit googlegoogle ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.6/2007072518]")
00:26:43powr-toclinuxstb_: no the 30gb build
00:27:01powr-tocpixelma: I got the same with r14623
00:27:07pixelmathe error you are probably getting was fixed in r14618/19
00:27:16Lloreanpowr-toc: Then why didn't you report that you were using 14623?
00:27:17BagderGenre9mp3: "ipod classic" has a 160GB disk
00:27:39LloreanBagder: I wish they were making ones usable in my older players though. =/
00:27:40 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@c220-237-57-32.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au)
00:27:46Bagderyeah
00:27:57powr-tocLlorean: because I tried that first, then found 14616 linked as the latest on http://www.rockbox.org/daily.shtml
00:28:02LloreanI guess my H1xx is going to be capped at 60 or 80
00:28:24Lloreanpowr-toc: Those are marked as "daily", while the current build is made every time the source changes.
00:28:32JdGordonmorning guys
00:28:38Lloreanpowr-toc: The latest is from build.rockbox.org
00:28:41powr-tocLlorean: ok..
00:28:48bluebrotherJdGordon: 'evening
00:28:55pixelmapowr-toc: and you are really sure you took the 30GB one?
00:29:03JdGordonI meant to ask last night.. where on the hidden partition is the bootloader that needs hacking on the e200?
00:29:12JdGordonor should i just do a dump and find it manually?
00:29:44 Quit O112358 ()
00:30:01powr-tocpixelma: I'll download and try again, but that's the one I think I grabbed...
00:30:07 Quit delYsid (Remote closed the connection)
00:31:00linuxstb_JdGordon: IIRC, it's at the very start of the partition - with a header starting PPBL
00:31:07 Quit bluebrother ("sleep")
00:31:33JdGordonlinuxstb_: ok, and sansapatcher doesnt move that at all right? I shouldnt have any problem getting this all going on my sansa?
00:31:36Bagderblock 2 iirc
00:31:36XavierGramiconn: I am sorry which part of the code are you referring to? It's been some time since I looked that part.
00:31:42BagderI wrote that info in the wiki
00:32:02linuxstb_JdGordon: No, sansapatcher only modifies the main firmware part of the partition.
00:32:06JdGordonits too early in the morning to be reading wikis :)
00:32:19JdGordonok great.. hopefully ill have some good news this arvo after uni
00:32:49powr-tocpixelma: I still get the same error with the new build... I'm trying to upgrade from a previous build.... Is removing the old .rockbox folder and copying the new one to the ipods root enough?
00:32:51linuxstb_JdGordon: Also, it would be worth writing a test app that dumps the partition table (sector 0) to disk, and ask scorche to run it on his E200R. I don't think we know for sure what it will look like.
00:33:10JdGordonyeah, I was going ot do that...
00:33:25JdGordonthe code is there #if 0'd out so thats no problem
00:33:26linuxstb_The E200R firmware appears to fake the MBR via USB...
00:34:42pixelmapowr-toc: you should really only need to unzip the build directly over the old one
00:35:27powr-tocpixelma: sure... I'm effectively doing that, but ensuring there are no old files there first.
00:35:53linuxstb_powr-toc: When do you get the data abort? Is it before the file starts playing, or afterwards?
00:36:21powr-toclinuxstb_: before
00:36:22 Join actionshrimp [0] (n=nn@86.158.13.55)
00:37:46linuxstb_powr-toc: And is this a new problem? i.e. have you played the same mp3 file with older versions of Rockbox?
00:37:59powr-toclinuxstb_: yes
00:38:18powr-toclinuxstb_: though I've not upgraded for quite some time
00:38:33pixelmahow old is your bootloader then?
00:39:38 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
00:39:46powr-tocpixelma: quite old.... probably about febuary this year... where do I get the new one, and how do I update it (on linux)
00:39:53 Part hcs
00:40:08linuxstb_Follow the instructions in the manual - upgrading the bootloader is the same as installing for the first time.
00:40:25powr-tocpixelma: this said, rockbox seems to boot ok... i.e. I can navigate the new menus etc
00:40:48 Quit Llorean (Remote closed the connection)
00:41:04linuxstb_powr-toc: pixelma is right - it's definitely a bootloader problem. The bootloader required updating in around March this year (I think..)
00:41:08 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com)
00:45:07powr-tocpixelma: linuxstb_: thanks guys.... it works fine now :) The new bootloader install process is way easier also :)
00:46:36pixelmanice :)
00:47:11linuxstb_Only one of us is a guy though...
00:47:14powr-tocany new features I should keep an eye out for?
00:47:42linuxstb_http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/MajorChanges
00:48:00Bagdershould be one or two
00:48:03powr-toclinuxstb_: hehe as soon as I typed that, I figured, I bet one of them's a girl :)
00:48:24pixelmanow... guess! ;)
00:49:02powr-tocpixelma: I'm guessing you're the girl... Sorry :)
00:49:32pixelmano problem :)
00:50:59 Quit midkay ("Leaving")
00:51:36***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:51:46DerPapstgood night all :)
00:52:01 Quit DerPapst ("So Long And Thanks For All The Fish!")
00:52:54 Quit JdGordon (Remote closed the connection)
00:54:39 Join RudMan [0] (n=RudMan@ool-182fb504.dyn.optonline.net)
00:56:09 Quit actionshrimp ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.01 :: www.XLhost.de )")
01:00
01:00:22 Quit spiorf_ ("Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)")
01:00:35 Join DMJC [0] (n=DMJC@122-49-135-34.ip.adam.com.au)
01:00:46DMJCok if I want to remove all trace of rockbox what do I do?
01:00:52DMJCipod 80gb
01:01:05DMJCdoes a factory reset in itunes accomplish that?
01:03:36japclinuxstb_: you possibly know this
01:03:44linuxstb_Yes, although if you're paranoid you may want to run a secure disk formatter (something that actually overwrites all the data).
01:04:04 Quit powr-toc (Remote closed the connection)
01:04:04japcis there any perl script to build/update the database on a iriver hp1x0 ?
01:04:24linuxstb_tools/songdb.pl _may_ work...
01:04:26japci have extra cpu cycles on the laptop to use for that
01:04:48japcand could use that after rsyncing my ~/mp3/ to My\ Music/
01:06:03japcwould rbutilqt do that?
01:06:15japchave my qt4 dev fscked and couldn't compile it
01:06:34krazykiti think there's a static binary available
01:06:39japchmm
01:06:44japcwhere ?
01:06:48krazykitor someone compiled one at some point
01:07:00linuxstb_On the RockboxUtilityQt wiki page
01:07:19japci bet someone compiled one at some point :)
01:07:47linuxstb_But no, rbutilqt doesn't build the database.
01:08:52japcok, so no need for it, rsync does what i want
01:09:33japcwill look at songdb, thanks
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01:14:29webguest37hi, could this be implemented: http://www.thehumorarchives.com/joke/Snackout :D :D :D
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02:00
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02:09:58pixelmaFebs: you forgot to make use of colours too (in the forums) ;)
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02:17:38Febspixelma: :)
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02:22:46yoyah56question, i have removed Rockbox from my Gigabeat reloaded all my music but it keeps saying that no files are found, what should i do?
02:23:08krazykitask somewhere else, since it has nothing to do with rockbox
02:23:25krazykithttp://www.mygigabeat.com/ has forums for that
02:24:22 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
02:25:27linuxstb_yoyah56: What keeps telling you "no files are found"? And is that the exact error message?
02:29:02yoyah56yea
02:31:17yoyah56well it says, "no file found" when i try to play a song
02:31:58linuxstb_What is "it" ? The original Toshiba firmware?
02:32:26yoyah56yea the original firmware
02:33:11RudManI'd remove all the music files from the device and then re-load them using the approved toshiba method
02:33:43linuxstb_Then I'm afraid I can't help. As krazykit said, you will be better of asking in a forum devoted to that firmware - most Rockbox users have never used Toshiba's firmware.
02:34:06linuxstb_(and it's also off-topic for this channel)
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02:34:45yoyah56ok, thanks
02:35:58 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:36:08rockois there a way
02:36:19rockoto download older versions of rockbox
02:36:25rockomy sistes going to kill me
02:37:58linuxstb_How old?
02:37:58 Quit yoyah56 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
02:38:57RudMansister or version or rockbox :)
02:40:02scorchelinuxstb_: bed, huh? ;)
02:40:09*linuxstb_ couldn't sleep
02:40:36linuxstb_RudMan: Whichever...
02:41:06krazykitrocko, yep. on the "current build" page, there's a link to archived daily builds
02:42:31linuxstb_scorche: Somehow I have a feeling Shane won't stop...
02:43:27 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@modemcable061.67-37-24.mc.videotron.ca)
02:44:08scorchelinuxstb_: one can hope...
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02:51:40***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:48:46 Join nowayx [0] (n=nowayx@71-38-205-207.albq.qwest.net)
03:49:12nowayxgood evening
03:49:44iambenhello
03:50:26nowayxi wrote a new game/plugin. What are the steps to have it on rockbox?
03:51:28FebsSubmit it to the Flyspray patch tracker.
03:51:50nowayxOk.. and from there? What happen? Patch it until it runs on all players?
03:52:31nowayxHmm I will wait for some feedback.
03:52:44FebsIf you want to get it accepted into Rockbox, then yes, it would almost certainly need to run on all supported players, or at least all that have hardware that support whatever your plugin is.
03:53:03FebsIt also needs to be submitted under a GPL-compatible license.
03:53:13nowayxOk, great.. I tested it for a few players (with lcd)
03:53:24nowayxYes, all my code is gpl :)
03:53:49nowayxeverything that i code... (if i'm out the clock)
03:54:04nowayxFebs, thanks
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04:00
04:09:45 Quit newbyx86 ()
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04:10:27 Join pwnzorrrr [0] (i=4a6e16a9@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f7c3d0d91f6cdab3)
04:10:32pwnzorrrrhey
04:10:38pwnzorrrrany one here?
04:10:51 Join DMJC [0] (n=DMJC@219-90-160-85.ip.adam.com.au)
04:10:57pwnzorrrrhellooooo
04:11:02krazykitpatience, dude.
04:11:06pwnzorrrri need help with rock box x.x
04:11:12pwnzorrrri got a new ipod nano
04:11:16krazykitit's typically best to simply ask the question
04:11:19pwnzorrrrut i dont know how to get rock box on it
04:11:31pwnzorrrrcan i hav sum help on how to get it?
04:11:35krazykitit's a 2g nano?
04:11:38pwnzorrrrits the 4 gig
04:11:47pwnzorrrrwell 3.6 to be exact :\
04:11:50krazykitno, i mean, is it the second generation?
04:11:57pwnzorrrroh
04:12:04pwnzorrrrits the kind that looks like the mini x.x
04:12:08pwnzorrrrits green :P
04:12:22pwnzorrrrits rounded and metealic looking
04:12:26pwnzorrrris that 2nd gen?
04:12:30pwnzorrrrx.x
04:12:53krazykithttp://ipodlinux.org/Image:NewIpodNano.jpg
04:12:55krazykitone of those?
04:13:07pwnzorrrryeah
04:13:15krazykitrockbox doesn't run on those.
04:13:19pwnzorrrrO
04:13:24pwnzorrrrNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
04:13:30pwnzorrrrwut about linux?
04:13:57pwnzorrrripod linux?
04:14:06krazykitnope.
04:14:09krazykitnot as far as i know
04:14:12pwnzorrrr("") (o_o) ("")
04:14:16pwnzorrrrYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY ><
04:14:42pwnzorrrr(")(-_-)(")
04:14:42krazykitplease stop being disruptive
04:14:56pwnzorrrrk but still its a bummer >.>
04:15:08 Join eigma [0] (i=ufyerke@CABLE-206-188-76-21.cia.com)
04:15:43pwnzorrrrsigh i must look this up
04:15:48pwnzorrrrwut gen is my ipod then?
04:15:56pwnzorrrrit would help me in my search
04:15:59krazykityour nano appears to be a second generation
04:16:05pwnzorrrrok
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04:17:23RudManyeah because the 3rd gen is short and fat
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04:38:58Febspwnzorrr: read this and start to follow it immediately: http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/IrcGuidelines
04:39:38krazykitFebs, he left a half hour ago...
04:39:57Febsyeah, I just realized I had scrolled up and wasn't at the bottom of the chat.
04:40:47 Quit Soap (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:42:02RudManmaybe there should be a "read to the end of the scroll back before you post" guideline
04:42:09RudManhehe
04:42:19 Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection)
04:42:37FebsThat's what I get for flipping back and forth between #rockbox and #rockbox-community.
04:43:02krazykittsk tsk.
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04:54:06rockoI put a new version of rockbox on my sisters ipod
04:54:11rockoit keeps data aborting
04:54:52FebsWhen was the last time you updated the bootloader?
04:56:14rockoa long time
04:56:16rockommm
04:56:23rockogood looks Febs
04:57:55FebsUpdate to the latest bootloader and it should solve your problem. You can now use Rockbox Utility for this: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WebHome?topic=RockboxUtilityQt
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05:02:53rockoit won't wok Febs :(
05:03:38rockoit says my bootloader is up to date
05:04:02FebsIn that case, what version of Rockbox did you put on the ipod?
05:04:11rockothe newest
05:04:18rockoI don't think the bootloader is up to date though
05:04:25rockoipod video 30g
05:04:54FebsWhat is the actual build version number. Look at System−−>Rockbox Info.
05:05:04RudManat what point does it say data aborting
05:05:39rockowhen I start to play a song
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05:06:06Febsrocko: first, check the version number as I described above.
05:06:19RudMandid you try initializing the database again?
05:06:58rockor14324-070814
05:07:14rockowhat does that mean RudMan
05:08:51Febsrocko: that is NOT "the newest" version. Install a current build.
05:10:47RudManhow bizarre...I just started the sim and there is no .rockbox dir below it
05:11:08krazykitdid you make install?
05:11:32RudManno, this is not on the dev image
05:11:39EnterUserNamehey all has there been anychangesd for battery life for sansa
05:11:47RudManit's like the .rockbox dir was deleted or moved
05:11:48EnterUserNameis it better than sansa's firmware?
05:11:54EnterUserNameim looking at a comparison
05:12:00RudManno - it is worse than the OF
05:12:03LloreanRudMan: Or you're in "supported" mode so you don't see the hidden folder?
05:12:07EnterUserNameoh ok
05:12:28krazykitEnterUserName, but the features of rockbox make it worth the battery life difference
05:13:16RudManllorean:no,no this has nothing to do with rockbox, this is a windows issue
05:13:27rockook I got r14624-070906
05:13:29LloreanRudMan: I thought you said you couldn't see it in the sim?
05:13:35rockosame problem with the errors.
05:13:44rockodata abort*
05:14:35rockoI don't think the bootloader is right
05:14:36RudManllorean: yeah, I couldn't see it in the sim but it's because the actual directory in windows is gone.....this is not a rockbox issue so I'll cease
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05:17:30rockowhen I go to use that rockbox utility
05:17:32rockoit says
05:17:53rocko"no ipod found"
05:18:07EnterUserNameis there usb deteciton yet on svn for sansa
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05:20:55RudManrocko: did you delete rockbox and restore the ipod bootloader back to the original?
05:21:41rockoI should delete the .rockbox ?
05:22:55Febsrocko: I thought you said that Rockbox Utility told you that you had the latest bootloader.
05:23:28rockoyeah it did
05:23:44Febsrocko: how could it do that if it didn't detect your ipod?
05:23:46Febsrocko: Turn your ipod off. Turn it back on and then hold the >>| button as it boots. What bootloader version is reported.
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05:27:16rockoit doesn't do anyting when I hold >>|
05:29:24FebsOK. do you know how to put your iPod in disk mode?
05:30:10rockolike when I plug it in?
05:30:30FebsYes.
05:30:34rockoyes
05:30:50FebsPut it in disk mode and then connect to your computer.
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05:42:15RudManI guess it killed his computer too
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06:11:01webguest45is there anyway to play a podcast under rockbox?
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07:12:57amiconnjhMikeS: How are you doing this??
07:13:45amiconn(I mean ghosting the old nick before entering the channel)
07:14:28scorchestarting irc, ghosting the nick, switching nicks, joining the channel?
07:15:22amiconnHmm, but that looks automatic...
07:15:44scorchecould be a script that does the same thing
07:16:15scorcheamiconn: just curious, but do those "next-gen" NiMH require the use of their own charger, or can regular chargers work as well?...many i saw "recommended" the use of their own charger, and i was wondering if it truely made a difference
07:16:48amiconnRegular NiMH charger is sufficient
07:17:04scorchealright...thanks
07:17:31amiconnBut it should be a good one.
07:18:04scorcheis this "good" measurable with a multimeter?
07:19:33amiconnhttp://www.ansmann.de/cms/consumroot/batteries/rechargeable/maxe.html "- No special charger required!"
07:19:57scorchesome i saw said it should, some disagreed depending ont he site and battery
07:20:10amiconnNo it's not.
07:21:03amiconnOne property of a good charger is that it handles single cells. Cheap chargers often charge cells in pairs, which is bad
07:22:31amiconnAnd its electronics should be able to fully charge the cells without overcharging. That requires proper monitoring.
07:28:56jhMikeSamiconn: just with a little Visual IRC script
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08:11:22Jangarithat data abort bug fixed yet?
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08:11:58LloreanJangari: Unfortunately, none of the developers with psychic powers are here right now. Which data abort specifically were you referring to?
08:12:09austriancoderiPod Touch... hmmmm
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08:13:29Jangaria few people had this issue with the build of.... the third, i think
08:13:35Jangarion a couple of different players
08:13:47Jangarian h10 and an ipod video 30GB
08:14:20Jangaridatabase initialisation would halt halfway through and show a 'data abort at 0042xxxx or something
08:14:30LloreanYes, that one is fixed.
08:14:35Jangarioh really?
08:14:38Jangarigroovy
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08:15:12LinusNLlorean: there?
08:15:23Jangarii just downloaded an older build and it worked brilliantly,
08:15:25ivan`do any of the psychic developers know if the 160gb uses the 5.5G chips?
08:15:45LloreanLinusN: Yes. If it's about my loss of temper earlier, I'm feeling pretty bad about it already.
08:16:00Lloreanivan`: As they're not out yet, there's not much information on 'em. :)
08:16:13ivan`thanks
08:16:16Jangarithey're bringing out 160 GB players?
08:16:27LloreanI would guess that they won't be, though.
08:16:56Jangarii suppose eventually, hard drive space will be such that you won't need compression,
08:17:13Jangarimm, sweet
08:17:16ivan`people will still compress anyway to fit in 20K tracks that they don't listen to
08:17:24Jangariwell, yeah
08:17:42LloreanWith flac you can maybe approximate to an average of 1/2 gb per CD, meaning 80cds already.
08:17:55ivan`flac is more like 300GB
08:17:56Jangarii have only 10GB of my 30 used, if it was uncompressed it'd be roughly 90-100GB
08:18:15Jangariwhy would a cd ever be more that 700MB?
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08:18:37Jangariit makes no sense to inflate the 44.1kHz 16bit PCM wav
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08:18:57ivan`703MB :)
08:19:15Galoisdvd-video audio is already 48000hz
08:19:23Galoisand it makes no sense to resample it to 44.1k
08:19:53Jangariis it?
08:19:56Jangarihmm,
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08:20:08Jangarii work with 24bit 96kHz
08:20:14Jangari1 GB per channel per hour
08:20:20Jangariroughly
08:20:32Jangarior maybe exactly, i can't remember
08:21:44GaloisYou have: 96000 * 24 bits / second
08:21:44GaloisYou want: gigabytes/hour
08:21:44Galois * 1.0368
08:22:14GodEatermasters of the build system: You might want to disable my build server for a few days - BT have once again managed to knock out my home broadband connection :(
08:22:53scorcheouch
08:23:23Jangarimm, no, it's slightly over an hour i think
08:23:35Jangarilike, an hour, 7 minutes
08:23:40Jangariby memory
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08:23:52Galoisas far as I'm concerned, storage remains inadequate until every CD ever made fits inside a drive with no moving parts
08:24:27Jangaribut i specify 1gb per hour per channel in the documentation, so stay on the safe side
08:29:19amiconngrr
08:29:37amiconnlinuxstb: The "Hang in USB screen" bug on ipod is not fixed
08:29:43*scorche kicks the forums
08:29:44*LinusN ph33rz the anger of amiconn
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08:50:33*GodEater reads the apple page on the new ipods. the Touch *starts* at $299 ?!?! Rip off city!
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08:52:03advcomp2019yea your right GodEater
08:52:18advcomp2019youre*
08:54:03Jangariyou're**
08:54:04B4gderyay, c200 work
08:54:22ivan`at that price just unlock an iphone
08:56:01GodEaterB4gder: don't know if you've read the logs or not - but my home broadband is on the fritz again so my build server is off the 'net for the forseeable
08:56:30B4gderok, it shouldn't matter much to the build system, it deals with server outages
08:56:51B4gderunless you're bothered with the ssh attempts?
08:57:04GodEaterdoesn't bother me a bit
08:57:08advcomp2019imo ipod are overpriced and at the same time under featured
08:57:12GodEaterjust thought I'd let you know
09:00
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09:09:23*petur gets seriously fed up with indian programmers... explaining it 3 times and still not getting through :(
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09:20:29woodensoulcan someone point me to where I can find out cygwin commands such a changing directories, etc?
09:21:35 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
09:21:53B4gderI guess that's any unix-like command line tutorial
09:23:38woodensouli didn't see anything like that in the "for developers" info on the rockbox site
09:23:55ddaltongoogle.com they are the same as linux. cd basically cygwin is a linux terminal for windows but can't run apps compiled for linux.
09:23:59ddaltoncd changes dir
09:24:21ddaltonIt wouldn't be on the rockbox site
09:24:23peturthe important thing to remember is that you need to use lots of spaces.. cd\xxx will not work
09:24:50woodensoulhow do you go back one directory?
09:24:52ddaltonI just type cd rockbox and it takes me to my rockbox dir
09:25:17*ddalton Continues reading his c book!
09:25:44woodensoulcd .. goes back one i see
09:26:28ddaltonyes and you can also type cd dir1/dir2 so if you have a dir1 in the dir your in and then in that dir2 you will end up in dir2
09:26:36ddaltonif that makes any sence
09:26:52woodensoulyes, thanks
09:27:19ddaltonand a good thing to know is how to run scripts or apps so executables
09:28:11woodensoulalso, if i wanted to change the keymap for the gigabeat back to the way it used to be in the WPS, is the only source file i need to change keymap-gigabeat.c?
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09:31:12fm2There seems to be a short (about 0.5 secs) delay on Sansa between a button press and backlight going on. Is it just me or do you also experience this?
09:31:23woodensouli also experience this
09:32:22woodensoulMy e280 is brand new and i haven't been getting a full battery reading even after fully charging the unit. Is this a known problem? Also, should I not charge via Rockbox?
09:34:10B4gderthe battery level isn't perfected for the sansa afaik
09:34:22B4gderand people report that the OF charges faster than rockbox on the sansa
09:34:27GodEaterslightly OT, but does anyone know what setting −−as-needed in LDFLAGS does ?
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09:35:46woodensoulWell the thing that confused me is that it did seem to be more accurate the first time I charged it. But now it isn't.
09:36:02B4gderGodEater: it seems to detail what libs that are actually needed...
09:36:20B4gderor rather, which libs to mark as needed as normall all given are
09:36:30GodEaterah ok
09:36:53*B4gder just reads "man ld" - never used this option myself
09:37:15woodensoulwhich text editor do you guys use for editing/creating source files?
09:37:23B4gderemacs!
09:37:25austriancoderB4gder: as i was @AMS they told whats the best to charge over usb... will look into this issue if I have enought time
09:37:32*B4gder never misses an opportunity
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09:39:43fm2I'm not talking about battery, my concern is the delay before the backlight turns on. In the OF, it tirns on immediately. So this must be a RB "artefact".
09:39:53GodEaterB4gder: which flavour, Gnu, or X ?
09:40:03B4gdergnu
09:40:15GodEaterI always preferred X for some reason
09:40:31B4gderI come from a time long before the X one existed ;-)
09:40:34GodEaterprobably because you could load a wallpaper into the text buffer, or some pointless rubbish like that
09:40:38GodEater:)
09:40:47*B4gder recalls Lucid emacs...
09:40:58*GodEater recalls cutting his emacs teeth on JOVE
09:40:59fm2Bagder: −− 19.3.6 or 20.x? −− 20.x? −− Ah you bastard! :-)
09:41:30B4gderI'm on 22.1.1 at home
09:41:46*GodEater tends to use vi more these days though, as it's the only editor pretty much guaranteed to be installed on a unix box
09:42:52B4gderemacs is just one of the first packages I install on any system I'm on
09:42:53fm2B4gder: there was an old joke about two talking about what editors they use. vi user would be shot btw. But in the end one used 19.3.x and the other 20.x. And that was not good :-)
09:43:04B4gderhehe
09:43:23GodEaterB4gder: I'd install it if I had rights on most of the systems I log in to - sadly I don't
09:43:27B4gdereditor flame wars are the best!
09:43:33GodEatermost of them I don't even have a home directory
09:45:47woodensoulI'm trying to build from the latest source, and I'm getting errors. How can I make sure that the directory is complety in sync with the current source?
09:45:58B4gderwoodensoul: svn update!
09:46:05woodensouli did just do that
09:46:14B4gderthen you're in sync until someone commits
09:46:26woodensouli typed svn co svn://svn.rockbox.org/rockbox/trunk rockbox
09:46:32woodensoulthe error i'm getting is...
09:46:40GodEaterpastebin!!!
09:47:06woodensoulpastebin?
09:47:39B4gderstep 2- type pastebin in google's search field
09:47:48woodensoulplayback.c:2747: error: syntax error before '<<' token
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09:47:56B4gderwoodensoul: that's a bad patch applied
09:48:07B4gderor rather a conflict on update
09:48:14B4gdermost probably
09:48:34B4gderremove the patch and try again
09:49:01woodensoulif there is a patch in the directory, it's automatically applied?
09:49:20B4gdersvn update merges the repo's changes with your local changes
09:49:32B4gderand now they collided
09:50:43fm2So what about backlight the delay? It doesn't exist on H120. Is it a Sansa LCD driver specific issue?
09:50:49woodensoulfirst i svn updated, then i made a change in the gigabeat-keymap.c and now i'm trying to build and i get a bunch of errors regarding playback.c
09:51:11B4gderwoodensoul: and you have no patch applied?
09:51:23B4gderthen please pastbin your full error
09:51:27B4gderpastebin
09:52:00woodensouli'm learning how to do that
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09:54:13linuxstbwoodensoul: You could type "svn revert -R ." to remove any changes that have been made locally to your files. That will remove any patches you've applied in the past.
09:55:00woodensoulfrom which location (directory) should i type that?
09:55:20ddaltonyour source tree
09:55:20Zagorhave we been flooded with port requests for the new ipods yet?
09:55:38GodEaterif by "flooded" you mean one forum thread
09:55:40GodEaterthen yes :)
09:55:43B4gderZagor: yessir
09:55:49scorchebefore they were even announced as well
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09:55:56Zagorhaha
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09:56:26woodensouli'll try that linuxstb
09:56:31ZagorI guess those requests came with a hefty pile of tech docs, right? ;)
09:56:47GodEaterZagor: several hundred kilos worth yes
09:57:01GodEaterin fact, the code will practically write itself
09:57:01linuxstbwoodensoul: Another useful command is "svn status" - that will tell you which files have been locally modified (indicated by an M)
09:57:10Zagorsuch as: "cool screen", "nifty touch-doodaas" and "awesome itunes"
09:57:24GodEateryeah all that
09:57:29Zagor"now get cracking"
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09:57:49morrijrZagor: why are you still talking - isn't it done already?
09:58:03B4gderhe just needs a new logo
09:58:05B4gder:-)
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09:58:17 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
09:58:18morrijrZagor: (kidding)
09:58:20Zagoranyone got a suggestion?
09:58:38woodensoulsvn revert -R doesn't work
09:58:47woodensoulsays not enough arguments
09:58:50austriancodersvn revert -R ./
09:58:58ddaltonit doesn't work here either. Did you check out from svn
09:59:31linuxstbwoodensoul: Re-read the command I suggested...
09:59:36woodensoulOK, that changed some source files. I will try building again.
09:59:59ddaltonwhat was the command? Sorry can't find it
10:00
10:00:17linuxstbAlmost what austriancoder typed - "svn revert -R ."
10:00:44ddaltonis the . part of it?
10:00:50woodensouli typed svn revert -R ./ and it worked
10:01:05woodensoulsvn status gives me a list of files, but no M designation
10:01:11GodEaterddalton: yes - it's the current directory
10:01:11ddaltonits working thanks.
10:02:05linuxstbwoodensoul: Yes, "svn status" shouldn't show any modified files after you type svn revert...
10:03:00woodensoulthen possibly not all the files were reverted?
10:03:13woodensoulthere is a question mark next to the files listed by svn status
10:03:29GodEaterwoodensoul: no, ALL the files were reverted, that's why there's no M next to any of them
10:03:36B4gderwoodensoul: those are files not controlled by svn
10:03:48B4gder"svn -q status" hides those
10:03:58woodensoulthey are all either .exe or .orig files
10:04:34linuxstbYes, as B4gder said, those are new files you've created which are not part of SVN. The ? means svn doesn't know those files.
10:05:06woodensoulI see.
10:05:20linuxstbYou can delete them if you wish, or just leave them - they shouldn't cause any harm.
10:05:20 Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@CABLE-72-53-22-61.cia.com)
10:05:48morrijrapart from the chip port issues, do folks see the lack of buttons/controls to be a problem for rockbox? It'll be a totally different type of interface won't it?
10:06:14linuxstbYou're talking about the ipod touch?
10:06:16morrijry
10:06:30B4gderI don't consider that a real problem
10:06:34Zagorme neither
10:06:34B4gderjust a challange
10:06:35pixelmaGodEater: I believe the "tvg" in the forum had problems with later revisions of rockbox and posted in this nano thread too...
10:06:38morrijr:)
10:06:46Zagorwe discussed this about a week ago
10:06:49linuxstbYes, that's just a programming problem which is solvable...
10:06:59GodEaterpixelma: I know - I'm just getting fed up of his whining
10:07:08linuxstbThe encryption and completely new hardware is the problem...
10:07:31GodEaterand the lack of docs
10:07:56linuxstband the roads, and education, and wine, and ...
10:08:11GodEaterkids these days
10:08:19morrijrZagor: must have missed that conversation; sorry
10:08:20GodEaterall this were fields etc etc
10:08:28Lloreanpixelma: It's still pointless to report bugs that happen in a 500 revision old version, even if he's unwilling to update to the current version. Odds are decent his partition was corrupted by the main Nano bug, or he's experiencing the main Nano bug in a lesser form, anyway
10:08:41Zagormorrijr: come to think of it, it was probably several weeks ago. never mind.
10:11:08linuxstbB4gder: Do you think it's worth adding the new ipod models as unsupported on the front page? I'm not sure - the list is growing longer than the supported list now...
10:11:35B4gderhm, let's wait and see
10:11:48B4gderit'll be a bit annoying with a long list of unsupported ones
10:12:56linuxstbMaybe change what is in brackets to "2nd Gen Nano and later ipods are not supported" ?
10:13:00scorchelinuxstb: i wouldnt think so...the unsupported list is to avoid confusion, and as long as they call the new ipod "classic", we shouldnt worry...although nano 3rd gen might be added
10:13:03peturremove the unsupported list and just write "if your model is not in the list, it is not supported"
10:13:34Zagorscorche: actually, many people will likely think "classic" means it's an older model and thus supported...
10:13:48B4gderyes, we should perhaps make it clear that *only* the mentioned models are support and all others are not
10:13:52Zagorbut I think we should move that whole section to a wiki page and make a big nice chart with images and all
10:14:01B4gderyes
10:14:15B4gderalso because for some reason people don't look for this kind of info on the front page
10:14:24Zagorexactly
10:14:24B4gderthey need a different page for it
10:14:25peturwith bright green and red indications
10:14:42LloreanZagor: We already have a nice big chart with pictures... builds.rockbox.org. Maybe just some clear text saying "Only these players are supported"?
10:14:54Lloreanbuild.
10:15:08B4gderthe build one isn't as explicit
10:15:16B4gderlike there's no e200R on it
10:15:17Zagorunfortunately I don't think it's clear enough...
10:15:20B4gdernor x5l x5v etc
10:17:24LloreanWe could make that page more explicit too then.
10:17:32linuxstbI have to say that I like the "Quick Links" table on http://ipodlinux.org home page...
10:17:33LloreanFor one thing, so people aren't uncertain what to download
10:18:22Zagorlinuxstb: yeah our front page is a bit cluttered
10:18:52woodensoulI deleted my entire rockbox directory and check out the source again. The build seems to be going fine now.
10:19:32woodensoulIf I want to change the gigabeat WPS keymap to what it used to be. Do I need to change any source files other than gigabeat-keymap.c?
10:19:50ZagorIPL says about the iPod Touch: "Will probably not be supported because homebrew software is already possible." anyone know what they mean with that?
10:19:55 Join obo [0] (n=obo@rockbox/developer/obo)
10:20:05ivan`it means that apple won
10:20:06Zagorhere: http://ipodlinux.org/Project_Status
10:20:24LloreanZagor: I imagine they expect the same hacks as work on the iPhone to work on it.
10:20:31linuxstbI asssume home-brew is possible on the iphone, so they're guessing the touch will be the same... But I know nothing about the iphone...
10:20:41B4gderipl isn't exactly jumping to new targets very often anyway
10:20:56Zagorso they won't support it because ... it's possible? makes no sense.
10:21:08B4gderipl is not like rockbox
10:21:15B4gderthey don't do a music player firmware repalcement
10:21:35linuxstbI think the IPL devs see it as a supplement to the Apple firmware, rather than a genuine replacement.
10:21:35B4gderthey make a platform to run custom applications on
10:21:53B4gderand if the OF can run custom applications, there's no point in using ipl
10:21:54*linuxstb looks towards the IPL devs lurking here...
10:22:17ZagorB4gder: fair point
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10:23:59GodEaterthis is essentially the same as the Rockbox "port" to that motorola phone then
10:24:09GodEaterso if someone can get SDL running on the new touch
10:24:11Zagorgosh, their latest code is from may???
10:24:14GodEaterthen you can have "Rockbox" there too
10:24:16*Zagor stops looking there
10:24:51B4gderZagor: i believe ipl is much more distributed so there are activities on other areas that are more recent
10:25:11linuxstbPlus their svn server has been unavailable for a few months...
10:25:15Zagorp2p development :)
10:25:18B4gderoh
10:25:37Zagorlinuxstb: yeah and the link to download source contains the last svn revision - from may
10:25:41linuxstbI believe they're in the process of finding and migrating to a new server.
10:26:15linuxstbBut yes, even with an svn server, development seems to be very widely distributed - the opposite to Rockbox.
10:28:03*linuxstb googles and finds lots of download links for third-party iphone apps, but no technical details...
10:29:32Zagorcan you write macosx apps without actually owning/using macosx?
10:30:23linuxstbIt just uses gcc, so you should be able to setup a cross-compiling environment.
10:31:16 Quit scorche (Connection timed out)
10:31:16Zagorwhat about the libraries? part of their GUI is proprietary, isn't it?
10:32:18linuxstbYes, that would be a problem... Their development environment (xcode) is available for download from their site, so maybe you could extract everything needed from there.
10:32:22linuxstbWhy do you ask?
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10:33:24Zagorjust curious about this apps-for-iphone/ipod thing.
10:33:56Zagormy main thought being that if you can't write apps for it without owning a mac, I'd still prefer linux on it
10:34:23linuxstbOr the "hack" would be porting the SDK to linux, rather than linux to the device...
10:34:47Zagoryeah. could get tricky with copyright issues though.
10:36:46linuxstbYes.
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10:46:21woodensoulWell, I've answered my own question. The only change I made was in gigabeat-keymap.c. Now to learn how to patch. Thanks guys.
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10:51:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:53:45 Part fm2
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10:55:04Jeffrey_Lhi
10:55:26Jeffrey_Lrockbox puts ipod to shame
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10:56:18ZagorJeffrey_L: we know :)
10:57:09Jeffrey_Lone feature which i really like/love is the sleep timer
11:00
11:01:56Jeffrey_Lhows the battery life on a 80g video anyway? rockbox.org says 5-7 hours
11:02:34ddaltongot one to try?
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11:03:30ddaltonyou use svn diff to creat a diff or patch -panumber filname
11:03:37ddaltonto apply one
11:04:18Jeffrey_L@@
11:04:39ddaltonwhat is @@
11:06:14ddaltonwhy don't we use // comments in rockbox?
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11:08:52Jeffrey_Lwhere can i browse for rockbox plugins?
11:08:53pondlifeHi all, back after a blown PSU
11:09:27ddaltonmaybe in "plugins" from the main menu!
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11:11:20Jeffrey_Lrockbox is so metal
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11:13:19linuxstb_Jdgordon: Hi. Could you make the latest version of your stripped-down version of e200tool available? I'm trying to persuade someone to try and get it working on Windows...
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11:26:37delYsidheh, amazon.de is pushing the price up for sansa e280, in the last week the price went up about 40 EUR.
11:26:53delYsidfrom 155 to now 192
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11:43:38mikae1hi
11:44:02mikae1anybody know anything about the hardware of the new ipod/ipod nano?
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11:45:45LinusNnope, but my guess is that it isn't portalplayer
11:48:10mikae1mmm... which will make it harder to port?
11:48:40bluebrotherassuming it's a chip without public available documentation, most likely yes.
11:49:05advcomp2019one thing i did read is that the new nano can do videos
11:49:37LinusNi also expect the new ipod to be a lot better protected, with signed binaries etc
11:49:42mikae1my bet is either get one of these and hope there'll be a rockbox release or modding a 2g mini. 16 gb flash and new battery.
11:49:58mikae1i think i'll go for the latter then.
11:50:17ddaltonhow many gb is it? and when is it going to be released?
11:50:22ddaltonhow much ram?
11:50:24ddaltonas well
11:51:57GodEaterwe've no reason to believe that apple will make running other code on their new ipods any easier than they have on the 2G Nano
11:52:10GodEaterand currently that's pretty near impossible
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11:52:40GodEaterso "hoping" for a rockbox release on it is like hoping you'll win the lottery. Pretty bloody unlikely to happen.
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11:56:09mikae1hmm ok
11:56:17mikae1it was so hard on the nano 2g
11:56:28mikae1why didn't they try harder with the 5.5g ipod?
11:56:50LinusNbecause it's the same platform as 5G
11:57:17LinusNthe 2G is a completely new hardware platform woth new cpu etc
11:57:37GodEaterapple have pretty much ditched PortalPlayer as their hardware supplier now
11:58:53ddaltonso is this the 6th gen or something?
11:59:06GodEaterthe ipod "classic" would count as a 6G yes
11:59:16scorche`yes
11:59:24GodEaterthe ipod touch is pretty much a brand new product
11:59:37GodEateralthough you could argue it's the iPhone without the phone too
11:59:38scorche`i would say so
11:59:56GodEaterI like the sound of 160GB
12:00
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12:00:06 Nick scorche` is now known as scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
12:00:06*scorche already has 160 in a DAP
12:00:46GodEaterarchos presumably though
12:00:51*scorche nods
12:01:08GodEaterapparently the 80GB version of the classic is even thinner than the current 5.5G 30GB
12:01:10GodEaterwhich is quite impressive
12:01:25scorcheFLAC and a decent line out would be nice though...hence why i have been watching AV300 auctions
12:01:53scorchesingle platter?....i hate speculating though
12:01:58mikae1flac support, yes
12:02:00GodEaterI guess it has to be
12:02:06mikae1why the f*** should it be so hard
12:02:12mikae1oh, we've got alac
12:02:19GodEatermikae1: because they choose to make it so ?
12:02:20scorchemikae1: well, there are reasons for that with the archos units..
12:02:21mikae1you can't use flac
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12:03:03mikae1scorce: are there reasons for that with the ipod?
12:03:09*GodEater is currently hunting to find pics from the first dissections
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12:03:17scorcherockbox supports flac just fine on the ipods...
12:03:31scorcheGodEater: sounds like my job after the nanos came out
12:03:31GodEateron those ipods we support anyway ;)
12:03:36sasukeehi, how do you manage podcasts with rockbox?
12:03:45scorchesasukee: anyway you like
12:03:48mikae1scorche: it did
12:03:57mikae1scorche: but not most likely on the 6g
12:03:59scorchenot past tense...
12:04:10sasukeeso u just sync a podcast folder
12:04:26scorchethat still doesnt change that to past tense...
12:05:11mikae1has anybody replaced the battery in a mini?
12:05:22mikae1if so, what battery did you go for?
12:05:39mikae1also, does the mini 2g version of rockbox play flac?
12:05:42GodEaterjust because there's a new ipod does not mean we suddenly don't support flac on the models we already run on
12:06:03scorcheall SWcodec devices run flac...
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12:06:58 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
12:07:27ddaltonso what are the specks for it?
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12:08:14GodEaterddalton: no-one knows yet
12:08:20mikae1GodEater: that wasn't what i meant. i wondered if the mini has ever been able to play flac.
12:08:27scorchewell, plenty know that, im sure
12:08:28mikae1but i guess the question is yes then :)
12:08:44scorcheall SWcodec devices run flac...
12:08:59mikae1ok
12:09:03ddaltonwhat its not out yet?
12:09:18GodEaterddalton: what's not out yet ?
12:09:27ddaltonthe new ipod
12:10:09GodEaterddalton: yes it's out - but apple never tell you what the specs are beyond what the disc space is
12:10:23ddaltonwhat's the disk space?
12:10:25ddaltonhow big?
12:10:27GodEaterddalton: so to know what processor it uses and such like, someone has to take one apart
12:10:50GodEaterddalton: if you mean the replacement for the ipod video, then it's coming in 80GB and 160GB varieties
12:11:10ddaltonThat's right. I know I was talking to a company about there word processing code and they wouldn't give me any info.
12:11:11GodEaterthey boast 40 hours of music playback too - which is pretty impressive
12:11:23ddaltonits secret
12:11:45ddaltonwhat and $800?
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12:11:58GodEaterwhich $ do you mean ? US, or AU ?
12:11:58ddaltonthe last one was expencive when it first came out.
12:12:06ddaltonany
12:12:08ddaltonau
12:12:47GodEaterthe 80GB is 249 USD
12:12:47bluebrotherI bet USD −− whose referring to AUD except australians? ;-)
12:13:01GodEaterI think ddalton is from AU
12:13:07ddaltonyes
12:13:25GodEaterhence why I asked :)
12:13:28bluebrothernice country. Unfortunately quite far away from europe
12:13:29ddaltonfor the new one?
12:13:39ddaltonyeah where are you
12:13:47bluebrotherme? Germany.
12:13:54ddaltonoh ok
12:13:56GodEater349 USD for the 160GB one
12:14:05ddaltonnot to bad.
12:14:11amiconnpondlife: Already checked the latest improvements for sapi voice building?
12:14:17GodEaterI guess we'll get ripped off in the UK though
12:14:25bluebrotherI've been to australia once and really liked it. Too bad travelling takes that much time (and money)
12:14:34ddaltonwouldn't carry it around in my pocket.
12:15:13GodEater249 GBP for the 160GB here
12:15:21GodEaterso yes, we're getting ripped off
12:15:28scorchewhats new?
12:15:32GodEaternothing
12:15:48ddaltonI don't understand why you would pay $350 AU for a 8 gb nano. When you can get a slightly bigger player in size for $280 or something with 20 gb hdd
12:16:14GodEaterddalton: I don't like using an HDD based device when I go running
12:16:34ddaltonbluebrother: where did you go?
12:17:26ddaltonyeah but maybe then something with smaller flash like 1 gb. Really if your going for a run you don't really need 10000 songs on it.
12:17:48GodEaterddalton: true :)
12:18:09GodEaterddalton: especially the paltry distances I run
12:18:23ddaltonwhat's wrong with a hdd player when running? Does it bounce the hdd out of posision?
12:18:31ddaltonor something
12:18:39GodEaterddalton: kind of - it can cause the heads in the disk to skip
12:18:57pondlifeamiconn: Not yet, just in the process of rebuilding my PC after a blown PSU and damaged motherboard. Luckily all else seems unharmed.
12:19:00ddaltonflash seems expencive or is it just the small size of the player
12:19:17GodEaterddalton: a combination of both I would imagine
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12:20:23ddaltonactually used my friends nano for 2 minutes and got anoyed by the touchy click wheel. The fourth gen click wheel was pretty good I have to admit.
12:20:24ddaltonwith rockbox
12:20:57scorchewell, the nanos have a smaller wheel as well
12:21:16*ddalton wants to get that ipod working! 20 gb
12:21:56ddaltonwell I skipped menus and stuff and it just wasn't what I liked. I am sure I would get use to it but I wouldn't buy a nano.
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12:24:14*GodEater fights with bascule in the New Ports forum
12:24:52GodEateryay - now in the top five posters!
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12:28:45GodEaterscorche: you locked it again :(
12:29:02scorcheheh...it auto-did that, as i posted mine when it was in a locked state
12:29:21scorchei would rather see it made a new, proper thread though...i might start it myself
12:29:58GodEaterI just really want to see the scans if the original poster (or someone else) gets round to doing it
12:30:00scorcheGodEater: and get in #rockbox-after-dark, chump
12:30:11GodEaterhe did say "if you want any information just ask"
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12:32:26mikae1does anybody know an american online shop which sells cheap flash cards
12:32:40mikae1the only one i know is newegg
12:32:49mikae1i'm not an american resident
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12:33:45DefineByteA couple of days ago a guy on here said that none of his tags showed up in Rockbox. He said his mp3 files used combined ID3v1/2 tags. I suggested converting all tags to ID3v2. This fixed the problem. Now, the question is, is this by design ,a bug or a one off aberration (maybe to do with the program he used to tag the files) that mp3s with combined v1 and v2 tags don't show up in Rockbox?
12:33:52linuxstbmikae1: That's way off-topic for this channel, but I would just use one of the price-comparison websites. Or join #rockbox-community
12:34:23linuxstbDefineByte: Rockbox reads both tags, and has a setting to give preference to one over the other.
12:34:40DefineBytehmm, rockbox-community? is that an offtopic rockbox irc channel then? not heard of that.
12:34:49linuxstbRead the topic...
12:35:06DefineBytehe was getting no tags at all though. it seemed strange
12:35:31 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
12:35:35DefineBytemaybe all the tags were corrupt and just re-writing them fixed it.
12:36:03DefineBytehow long has that channel been around then? 8)
12:36:14pixelmaGodEater: the pure number of posts doesn't tell anything... ;)
12:36:34scorche-ChanServ- Registered: 32 weeks 1 day (10h 56m 53s) ago
12:36:48linuxstbGodEater: And you should exclude all posts that consist solely of a link to the NewPorts wiki page...
12:37:09linuxstb(if only we had more control over the forums, we could script that...)
12:37:58GodEaterlinuxstb: hehe - I said similar to Llorean, only about not counting posts saying "re-read the posting guidelines"
12:38:25linuxstbSo Llorean's count would be down to double-figures?
12:38:29scorcheGodEater: but then you would be down to 23 posts...
12:38:38GodEaterscorche: if that
12:38:46scorcheand saratoga would be way above you ;)
12:38:56GodEaterprobably
12:39:06GodEaterI should quit with the "yeah, what he said" posts too probably
12:39:26DefineByteyeah
12:39:30scorcheor the "im special too!" posts ;)
12:39:44*GodEater looks down at his big shoes
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12:44:07jbr-loverhi all
12:45:13jbr-loverI have a problem concerning my DC connector. follwoing situation..
12:45:36linuxstbI assume you have an Archos Jukebox Recorder?
12:45:53linuxstbIf so, which version? If not, which device?
12:46:10jbr-loverI am blind, and therefore requested a repair facility near me to solder the DC connector, cause it fell into the device.
12:46:22jbr-loversorry.. Recorder V1
12:46:24jbr-lover20 GB
12:46:39*linuxstb pings LinusN and amiconn in case they can help
12:47:31jbr-loverthe guys at repair said, impossible without a spare part, but they were unable to locate spare connectors. the man explained to me that the plus pole is inside, while the rest of the connector could be gotten out. but the plus is broken, and they say it cannot be resoldered...
12:51:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:51:57jbr-loverthanks, I will hang in here. other then that, no problem with rockbox or the jukebox, has always wororked fine. and it is super that menu items can be made to speak.
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12:57:19amiconneurgh
12:57:38amiconnThe usb stack code is in need of a big code police raid
12:58:13Jdgordonsend in the SWAT team!
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12:58:55zirodaywhat is more stable in rbutil the current or archived build?
12:59:22 Quit austriancoder (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
12:59:24bluebrotherarchived builds are simply build once a day.
12:59:36bluebrotherwhile the current build is done upon every code change.
12:59:46bluebrotherusually you should just be able using the current build
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13:00:34zirodaybluebrother: ok but before i was having issues with playback and was told it was a bug that was being worked on. i was just wondering what was more stable thanks :)
13:00:48bluebrotherwell, current build is newer.
13:00:59zirodayill use that thanks
13:02:13linuxstbamiconn: What's the problem with the usb stack code? I already raided it once..
13:02:47amiconnCamelCase variables + hungarian notation
13:03:06linuxstbHmm, I didn't notice those.
13:03:24amiconnCheck the latest commit's diff...
13:03:46GodEateryuk
13:03:52linuxstbYes, I've just looked... Although maybe they're taken from some other project, in which case it might make sense to keep them. austriancoder?
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13:04:51austriancoderamiconn: there is no coding style document for such a case
13:04:53austriancodersorry
13:05:15bluebrotherisn't "iProduct" and similar also the way it's written in the specs? Doesn't it make more sense to keep that way?
13:05:35linuxstbaustriancoder: "Variables and function names should be all lower case."
13:05:45B4gderalso, there are multiple long lines and brace-on-first-for-function-declaration
13:06:26linuxstbB4gder: The brace-on-first-for-function-declaration is missing from CONTRIBUTING though...
13:06:39GodEaterstill...
13:07:32austriancodersoo.. maybe i have something on my eyes.. but can you point me to a "wrong" formated part in my code?
13:08:09Zagorevery variable that isn't all lower case?
13:08:27linuxstbWhat amiconn just said - the iHungarianNotation names in the structs you modified in your latest commit
13:08:34*B4gder commits a CONTRIBUTING change
13:08:59austriancoderlinuxstb: ahhh.. this is so written in the usb2.0 chapter 9 doc
13:09:34linuxstbaustriancoder: That's what I was asking you - if the names are taken from elsewhere.
13:09:53linuxstbIMO that's a good reason for an exception....
13:10:00austriancoderlinuxstb: they are taken from elsewhere
13:10:11*linuxstb isn't in charge though...
13:12:20amiconnB4gder: That reminds me - should we stick to those conventions for files which aren't C (as far as possible)?
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13:13:09B4gderI don't have any strong opinion since C is the primary language we use
13:13:10linuxstbamiconn: Are you thinking of the VB code?
13:13:18amiconnyes
13:13:29linuxstbI looked at that yesterday, and thought the same...
13:13:55amiconnThe vbscript sticks to the indent-by-4 and line length conventions, but not to the variable names
13:13:57B4gderit isn't stricly necessary that the C rules are the best suitable for other languages
13:14:15linuxstbI think it would make sense to do what VB programmers normally do (for better or for worse)...
13:14:26preglowworse...
13:14:43amiconn(even though vb isn't format free and wrapping a line needs a continuation character - the _ )
13:21:44Zagorjbr-lover: the guy could be right, the connector might be discontinued. one solution would be to use another dc-connector connected with wiring. then you'd get it ugly hanging on the outside, but at least it'd work.
13:22:31Zagorjbr-lover: another option is to search for an old broken archos to strip that part from
13:22:54scorchehrm...wasnt that just a general jack?
13:23:24Zagoryeah. but it's board-mounted. an maybe the pins on currently available ports don't match the board. I don't know.
13:23:35scorchegreen wire
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13:24:14Zagorscorche: ?
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13:25:51scorchelooks pretty general to me...and one could likely re wire a bit if it doesnt fit quite right
13:26:28Zagoryeah, but then it wouldn't sit firm and would be more difficult to connect. hence my suggestion to simply move it outside.
13:27:06scorchehttp://www.connactivity.com/~eaw/archos_apart/
13:27:28scorchestill seems to be there on digikey
13:28:36Zagorexcellent.
13:28:57Zagorjbr-lover: the part you want is called PJ-007 and is made by CUI INC
13:29:19Zagorjbr-lover: available here http://www.digikey.com/scripts/US/DKSUS.dll?KeywordSearch?MPart=PJ-007
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13:33:05n1sDoes anyone understand FS #7713 ?
13:34:09Zagorhaha, nice verbose report. and it's a ... patch?
13:34:33 Quit The-Compiler (Remote closed the connection)
13:37:22jbr-loverum thanks, have to scroll around a little. to see the msgs. you are great!!!
13:37:33jbr-lovera bit hard with screen readers...
13:37:39ZagorI can imagine
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13:37:51*petur reads http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/09/06/tosh_previews_next_gen_hdd/ and falls over
13:41:17scorchewow
13:41:50scorche240GB dual platter 1.8...
13:43:13*n1s is still a little shocked that they're actually selling players with 160GB 1.8" drives... but this is absurd
13:45:57jbr-loverOK, will just have to look somewhere in europe to get this connector in Germany, since I am an enduser,
13:46:14jbr-loverbut thanks a bunch!!!
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14:02:00linuxstbscorche: Those Toshiba drives seem a long way into the future though - IIUC, they haven't even announced the product, just the technology. Samsung have 160GB in shops today...
14:02:25 Quit ziroday ("Leaving.")
14:02:30scorchelinuxstb: aye...they say 2009 in the article
14:03:15scorcheas well, it says toshiba have 160GB 1.8 as well
14:03:27linuxstbCompetition is always good...
14:03:28scorche"including, we believe, the 160GB hard drive found in the new iPod Classic."
14:03:51linuxstbI guess we'll get an answer soon when the first dissections are published.
14:03:56scorcheindeed
14:04:11B4gderany known rockbox dev going for one of these ?
14:05:16linuxstbI haven't heard anyone mention it.
14:05:20scorcheif they still encrypt it...
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14:09:21linuxstbB4gder: MrH has never shown any interest in ipods?
14:09:50B4gdernope
14:10:14linuxstbSeems no-one with a clue ever does. I wonder why....
14:10:50n1slinuxstbsomeone in the ipodlinux project must have had a clue, at some point in time :-)
14:11:12n1sinsert sapces and colons where appropriate
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14:12:25Dark_ApostropheHello. Does anyone have any advice for what mp3 player I should buy? I want one with at least 10gb of storage space...
14:12:36Dark_ApostrophePreferably one that isn't terribly expensive, since I'm saving up to buy a car
14:12:41B4gdersee BuyersGuide in the wiki
14:13:51Dark_ApostropheIs the iAudio X5L any good?
14:14:15B4gderit is fine
14:14:28B4gderbut not easy to find, nor very cheap
14:14:32Dark_ApostropheDamn.
14:14:44Dark_ApostropheI live in Norway - finding stuff here isn't exactly a walk in the park.
14:14:49linuxstbDo you want flash-based or a hard disk?
14:15:15Dark_ApostropheIf there are any that have ridiculously large flash drives, that's ok, but I'll probably need a drive
14:15:27Dark_ApostropheI also want to be able to watch TV episodes on it
14:15:31Dark_ApostropheIf that's possible
14:15:52B4gdersounds like a gigabeat
14:15:59linuxstbThe Rockbox device with the best video support (in Rockbox) will be the Gigabeat F.
14:16:03Dark_Apostrophearen't those microsoft's?
14:16:18linuxstbNo, Toshiba, but Toshiba also made the initial Zunes.
14:16:35B4gderToshiba is kind of in bed with Microsoft all over
14:16:49linuxstbThe Gigabeat F ran Linux as it's original firmware though..
14:16:51 Quit spiorf_ (Remote closed the connection)
14:17:00Dark_ApostropheSo are these any new?
14:17:06B4gderno
14:17:08Dark_ApostropheDamn.'
14:17:22B4gderstill manufactured models that run rockbox are rare
14:17:23linuxstbNo, but extremely good value used. Around USD $100 for a 40GB.
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14:17:38Dark_ApostropheAny Creative ones though?
14:17:41B4gderno
14:17:45Dark_ApostropheThey seem to pump out new players all the time
14:17:46Dark_Apostrophedamn
14:17:49B4gdernot a single one in fact
14:17:51 Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend")
14:18:08Dark_ApostropheDamnit
14:18:15Dark_ApostropheMy current one is a Creative Zen Touch
14:18:26Dark_ApostropheA big old black/white beast
14:18:49Dark_ApostropheBut it does work well and is very rugged (I've dropped it on asfalt multiple times without it even stopping playback)
14:19:24B4gderbut it lacks rockbox...
14:19:53Dark_ApostropheIndeed.
14:20:13Dark_ApostropheI found a relatively cheap one that has a lot of storage: archos 404
14:20:21Dark_ApostropheBut damn, the thing seems huge
14:20:25*n1s have been searching for gigabeats on the net that are available in Sweden, no luck so far...
14:20:40n1sof the F or maybe S models
14:20:57B4gderrockbox doesn't run on the archos 404
14:21:08Dark_ApostropheDamnit
14:21:25Dark_ApostropheArchos 604 then?
14:21:37Dark_ApostropheI'm using this list of players:
14:21:37B4gderno
14:21:37Dark_Apostrophehttp://prisguide.hardware.no/vis_kategori.php?cat_id=20&manufacturer_id%5B%5D=&techinfo_compare%5B125%5D=select&techinfo_value%5B125%5D%5B%5D=&techinfo_compare%5B1206%5D=checkbox&techinfo_value%5B1206%5D%5B%5D=&techinfo_compare%5B1205%5D=select&techinfo_value%5B1205%5D%5B%5D=&techinfo_compare%5B1659%5D=gt&techinfo_value%5B1659%5D=10&techinfo_compare%5B1565%5D=checkbox&techinfo_value%5B1565%5D%5B%5D=&techinfo_compare%5B3871%
14:21:37Dark_Apostrophe5D=bool&techinfo_value%5B3871%5D=&sortering=min_price&ppp=25&submit=S%F8k
14:21:38scorcheyou can see what rockbox runs on on the front page
14:21:38advcomp2019Dark_Apostrophe, do they have the sansa over there
14:21:46Dark_ApostropheOoh crap, that's one gigantic link
14:21:50Dark_ApostropheHold on, I'll use tinyurl
14:21:55scorchedont bother
14:21:57amiconnSomebody pls make an ata 50pin -> zif adapter :/
14:22:06Dark_Apostrophehttp://tinyurl.com/2wl6ls
14:22:09B4gderDark_Apostrophe: BuyersGuide
14:22:18n1samiconn: going for a 160GB upgrade? ;-)
14:22:19Dark_ApostropheI know, but I use that to find players that can be bought in Norway
14:22:29Dark_ApostropheAre any of those on that list compatible?
14:22:49B4gderDark_Apostrophe: compare with our front page
14:22:56B4gderwe don't have to spoon feed this to you
14:22:59advcomp2019Dark_Apostrophe, do you have the sansas
14:23:06Dark_ApostropheB4gder: Sorry...
14:23:13linuxstbDark_Apostrophe: I think you need to make a choice: 1) New Sansa E200 (8GB flash plus expandable via microSD), relatively small LCD; 2) Used Gigabeat F - large capacity, large screen, good video playback in Rockbox; 3) ipod video (using Apple's firmware for video playback); 4) Don't run rockbox.
14:23:16Dark_Apostropheadvcomp2019: Yeah, but their storage is quite limited :(
14:23:40Dark_ApostropheOption 2 seems like the only half-decent one
14:23:41advcomp2019they are not limited with rockbox
14:23:48Dark_ApostropheBut finding gigabeats isn't easy
14:24:53advcomp2019rockbox on an e200 has microsdhc
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14:25:30amiconnn1s: At least I want that option. It's also interesting to be able to go 80GB single platter (e.g. my X5, or maybe pixelma's M5L)
14:25:32B4gderbut an e280 with a 4GB microsdhc probably gonna be cheap either
14:25:38B4gdereh, not
14:25:56*Dark_Apostrophe buggars off to ebay to find gigabeats
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14:26:49linuxstbDark_Apostrophe: Remember that Rockbox only works on the F and X series gigabeats at the moment. Although a port to the S series is being worked on.
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14:26:58Dark_ApostropheOkay
14:27:30Dark_ApostropheWeird
14:27:40Dark_ApostropheThe only thing on ebay are leather cases for the gigabeats
14:27:44Dark_ApostropheNot the gigabeats themselves
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14:28:37_m4yh3mhm...anyone an idea why my ipod video 80gb crash when i initial the database with about 16gb mp3?
14:28:58 Quit spiorf_ (Client Quit)
14:29:10n1s_m4yh3m: are you using a current build
14:29:16_m4yh3myeah
14:29:22n1sfrom today?
14:29:31_m4yh3mand tryed also a "final"
14:29:47_m4yh3mehm
14:29:49_m4yh3mdaily
14:30:06n1stry with the _current_ build
14:30:08advcomp2019Dark_Apostrophe, btw why do you want to run rockbox to play only TV episodes
14:30:31Dark_ApostropheI want it primarily as an mp3/ogg player
14:30:41Dark_Apostrophebut occasionally, I'd want to be able to watch TV episodes too
14:31:14_m4yh3matm im running r14616-070905
14:31:30linuxstbThat's the build before the fix was made...
14:31:36advcomp2019the cowon d2 might be the way even tho it does not have rockbox yet
14:32:06linuxstb_m4yh3m: The current build is r14627
14:32:11Dark_ApostropheThe Cowon A2 isn't supported?
14:32:15Dark_ApostropheI found one in Norway...
14:32:30_m4yh3mhm..
14:32:36_m4yh3mor should i try r14625-070906 ?
14:32:38linuxstbDark_Apostrophe No, just the X5/X5L/X5V and M5/M5L
14:32:45Dark_ApostropheDamn..
14:33:09linuxstb_m4yh3m: Why are you refusing to install the "current build" ?
14:33:33_m4yh3mhm.i dont, gonna try, sec
14:33:34advcomp2019how much are the d2s in norway
14:33:51advcomp2019to what you want to spend
14:35:17Dark_Apostropheadvcomp2019: I don't know.. but does it matter, if they're not rockbox compatible?
14:35:51scorcheit matters because this is a rockbox channel..anything else is offtopic
14:36:13B4gderDark_Apostrophe: is it really that hard to read the list on the rockbox.org front page?
14:36:24B4gderI am genuinely curious
14:36:44Dark_Apostrophehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/BuyersGuide <−−- I looked here :/
14:37:04B4gderyes, and on the front page is the complete list of all models rockbox supports
14:37:44Dark_ApostropheOkay... looking now
14:37:49advcomp2019lets go to #rockbox-community Dark_Apostrophe to talk easier
14:37:58 Part Dark_Apostrophe (" 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0")
14:38:42*B4gder interprets that as no, it isn't hard but I'm a lazy person
14:39:45advcomp2019he went to the over channel
14:39:56advcomp2019other*
14:40:02B4gderyes, so my question wasn't answered
14:40:11B4gdernever mind
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14:43:55_m4yh3mhm... - looks like its workin now, thx @ linuxstb & n1s
14:44:01Kupopop16-18 hours on my iriver h140!?
14:44:09KupopopI'd be lucky to get 6
14:44:21B4gderthen your battery is run down
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14:44:26Kupopopmaybe its because I use a lot of ogg
14:44:46scorcheugh...i cant believe that e200R thread has gone to 6 pages...
14:45:29n1sKupopop: you should get a lot better battery time with that player even if playing back only ogg
14:45:46n1sunless it is only 500kbps 96kHz files
14:46:01Kupopopits quite old, I think I bought it in 2004
14:46:09Kupopopmaybe the battery is knackered
14:46:25Kupopopthere is a rockbox plugin which tests battery isn't there?
14:46:46n1sI get something like 12 hours on my h320 with q4 oggs, I got it for christmas 2004
14:46:58n1sKupopop: yeps, battery_bench
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15:03:15Genre9mp3linuxstb: The new iPod classic 160GB might have a Toshiba disk after all... see here: http://www.engadget.com/2007/09/06/toshiba-announces-ipod-classic-sized-80gb-and-160gb-1-8-inch-dis/
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15:03:55linuxstbGenre9mp3: Yes, scorche mentioned that earlier...
15:04:12Genre9mp3ah... didn't notice
15:04:25linuxstbI suppose they could even be using a mixture of the two...
15:06:52Genre9mp3good news is that this one can fit to irivers... (?)
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15:12:43B4gderlow_light: good work on the c200 front!
15:12:45linuxstbGenre9mp3: IIUC, "CE-ATA" is a new 18-pin connector, not the 50-pin the irivers have.
15:13:19B4gderlow_light: you good with the recent key additions to mi4code and mi4.c ?
15:15:02Genre9mp3linuxstb: oh... that's very dissapointing then...
15:16:29peturhmmm toshiba does 3600rpm, samsung does 4200rpm
15:17:40low_lightB4gder: thanks...and the new key works.
15:17:50B4gdergoodie
15:23:07low_lightI'm not sure why the OF doesn't load from the rockbox bootloader even with the right key
15:23:23B4gderinit issue?
15:23:33B4gderor at what point does it fail?
15:26:16low_lightThe rockbox bootloader appears to successfully exit
15:26:41linuxstbHow is it loading the OF? From an OF.bin file?
15:26:59low_lightOF.mi4
15:27:10linuxstbAnd it's being decrypted correctly?
15:27:12low_lightI think I tried OF.bin with the same result
15:27:30linuxstbSo what exactly happens?
15:28:06low_lightlast message printed is "c200_106 key used" then nothing
15:29:40B4gdertime to sprinkle with printf()s...
15:31:01linuxstbAnd as B4gder said, it could be an init problem - so you could try disabling things in the bootloader, like LCD and button inits...
15:31:26low_lightafter that it should either print "Can't load /System/OF.mi4" or return (void*)loadbuffer
15:32:06linuxstbYou should at least confirm it's getting to the return statement.
15:32:52amiconnOuch, CE-ATA can't even be used with an adapter in irivers :(
15:33:06amiconnIf they would be ZIF, an adapter would be possible...
15:34:55linuxstbThe Samsung drives are ZIF though, but you probably knew that...
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15:52:16kugeldoes microSD and LCD backlight work on the c200, are all buttons working. is there a clock (i dont know if in the OF of the c200 is one). And how is the soundquality, comparable to the OF?
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15:52:54Jdgordondoes anyone other than low_light in the channel have a c200?
15:54:11agm3ntyes
15:55:20low_lightkugel: (1) I don't have a microSD to try, (2) backlight works, (3) buttons work (although the keymap probably needs work), (4) there's a clock
15:55:20kugelits just, that im gonna write a news on www.rockbox-lounge.com about the c200 port, but the infos the SVN comment gives are barely enough
15:55:32kugelthanks
15:55:43B4gderI would assume the sound quality to be very similar to the e200
15:56:58low_lightkugel: there's still work to be done, particularly getting dual-boot to work because you still need the OF to get files on the device
15:57:30kugeli know
15:57:59linuxstbDoes the C200 also have 32MB of RAM?
15:58:36low_lightlinuxstb: yes...afaik
15:59:06kugelare there allready any tests about the battery life on a rockboxed c200?
16:00
16:00:16linuxstbHas anyone apart from low_light installed Rockbox on a c200 yet?
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16:00:59low_lightkugel: no
16:02:24low_lightlinuxstb: I believe I have the only one
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16:11:48Jdgordondoes anyone here have a e200r?
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16:13:21pixelmaadvcomp2019, I believe. (and scorche)
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16:13:38Jdgordonadvcomp2019: you round?
16:14:06B4gderthe sansa m200 isn't mi4 based and probably not PP
16:14:23*B4gder got the upgrade file and peeks
16:14:46B4gder"Telechips MTP V0.1"
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16:15:03JdgordonB4gder: how important do you think a dump of that partition from a non rockboxed e200r would be?
16:15:13Jdgordons/that/the hidden
16:15:18B4gderJdgordon: not terribly
16:15:29Agm3nthow to install rockbox on c200?
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16:15:48B4gderJdgordon: since the layout is the same as the vanilla ones and we already have the BL extracted
16:15:50Jdgordonok, the I wont bother puting a call out on the mailing lists for a guienea pig :p
16:15:55linuxstbJdgordon: I think you need a dump of the partition table (MBR) though - to see what it actually looks like.
16:16:02B4gderah yes
16:16:21linuxstbSomehow you need to locate the start of the firmware partition...
16:16:29 Quit _m4yh3m ("dreaming in digital - living in realtime - thinking in binary - talking in IP ::--:: Welcome to our world")
16:17:05Jdgordonthe mbr is the first few sectors or something isnt it?
16:17:20linuxstbThe very first sector - 512 bytes.
16:21:39low_lightlinuxstb: regarding the ram on the c200...according to the image here http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaC200Port the ram is Infineon HYB18L256160BF
16:22:14low_lightthe product brief (http://www.tranzistoare.ro/datasheets/700/237595_DS.pdf) says its "256 Mb"
16:22:25linuxstbOK, so the standard 32MB then.
16:22:51linuxstbI just wondered, as I can't remember how the bootloader is using RAM - it could be trying to use something in the 2nd 16MB region.
16:23:09 Quit kubiixaka (Connection timed out)
16:23:22Jdgordonis there an app which can turn the mbr.bin into something simple to view? or do I need to find the format somewhere?
16:23:34linuxstbRockbox can...
16:23:43linuxstbJust display the partinfo information in your app...
16:24:23low_lightlinuxstb: what do I need to get sansapatcher to work on the c200?
16:24:52linuxstblow_light: Firstly, is there a second, firmware partition on the disk?
16:25:35low_lightyes (Rockbox sees 2 partitions)
16:25:48linuxstbAre you using Linux?
16:27:22low_lightNot at the moment...I'm going to try to boot a livecd later and image the drive with dd
16:28:59linuxstbIt's going to be a little work to get sansapatcher working with the c200. It's based on ipodpatcher, which supports installing different bootloaders to different devices, but that functionality wasn't included in sansapatcher.
16:29:55linuxstbSo it will require a bit of copying and pasting to add that to sansapatcher as well.
16:30:35linuxstbYou'll then need to work out how the firmware partition differs from an E200, and modify it appropriately.
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16:32:58Jdgordonhey Shane_e250r
16:33:14Jdgordonplease say you have a linux box...?
16:33:20Shane_e250rok jdgordon hear i am
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16:33:29Shane_e250r....
16:33:34Shane_e250rno
16:33:47Jdgordonbah, ok, dont worry then
16:33:48Shane_e250rif i had i would all ready have rockbox
16:33:53Shane_e250rok
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16:36:43Shane_e250rhello jdgordon?
16:37:07Jdgordon... i need someone with linux and an e200r
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16:38:49linuxstbJdgordon: Do you have access to a Windows box?
16:38:54Jdgordonyeah
16:39:36linuxstbMaybe it could be the time to try and get your stripped-down e200tool working there - so you can get some testers. I would expect most e200r owners with Linux abilities to already have patched...
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16:40:15Jdgordonyeah probably... wont have time til the weekend though
16:40:37Jdgordonputting a email on the -dev ml just in case someone hasnt converted yet
16:40:40linuxstbIs your latest e200tool available somewhere? Maybe someone else could give it a go?
16:40:57Jdgordonwill be in a minute
16:41:09 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
16:41:28Shane_e250rhow to you get linux it's it freeware?
16:42:29linuxstbShane_e250r: You could start reading here - there is _lots_ of info about Linux on the web. And yes, it's free in all meanings of the word.
16:43:36linuxstbBy "here", I meant here - http://www.linux.org/
16:44:06linuxstbFollow the "Linux 101" link in the top-right corner.
16:45:26XavierGramiconn: about autoghosting: my irc client has an option to autoconnect on disconnect and perform a list of commands (server dependant if you like) where I just identify and always ghost my nick.
16:47:00XavierGrof course when I connect for the first time, I get the "You cannot ghost yourself" in the status window, but that is not a concern at all
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16:48:12DarkStylisthi anyone experienced with mp3 players that wont browse and get past welcome screen?
16:48:47linuxstbThis is a channel about the Rockbox software...
16:50:06DarkStylistyea but i gotta fix it in order to install rockbox
16:50:28linuxstbWhich player is it?
16:50:41DarkStylistsandisk
16:50:49linuxstbWhich sandisk player is it?
16:51:18DarkStyliste220
16:51:42linuxstbThen you could try the methods here - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200Unbrick
16:51:54DarkStylistit stays at welcome at its original os and the drive says insert disk
16:52:01***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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16:52:11DarkStylistthx
16:52:16B4gder220?
16:52:28B4gderreally?
16:53:14linuxstbB4gder: Is the e220 special?
16:53:24B4gderI'm not aware of any e220 model
16:53:30DarkStyliste200 sorry
16:53:32B4gdere250 is the 2GB one
16:53:36Jdgordonif the 2gb moel is the e250.. whats the e220?
16:53:38DarkStylistmistyped
16:53:48Jdgordondamn their un-intuitiver model numbering
16:54:12DarkStylisteasy guys i misstyped the model.
16:54:29linuxstbDarkStylist: A single letter or digit can make a big difference...
16:54:54linuxstbBut if it's part of the e200 series, then the page I linked you to may help.
16:57:25B4gderJdgordon: I don't think a rockbox install will ruin the mbr dump you want
16:57:41Jdgordonmaybe not... but just in case...
16:58:22Jdgordonanyway... 1am, bed time
16:58:28 Quit Jdgordon ("Konversation terminated!")
16:58:38B4gdergoing home time
16:58:40 Quit B4gder ("It is time to say MOOO")
17:00
17:00:47Shane_e250rso all i have to do is install linux and follow the instution?
17:01:40 Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
17:02:11Shane_e250rall can i have linux and run windows at the same time?
17:02:17Shane_e250r*all so
17:02:39n1sShane_e250r: yes, but this is getting off topic for this channel
17:02:47DarkStylistyes with vmware
17:03:18DarkStylistor some other virtual machine
17:05:16Shane_e250rsorry im tring to get rockbox on my e250r
17:06:18linuxstbDarkStylist: In this situation, it seems vmware isn't suitable.
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17:10:56DarkStylisti thought vmware had usb support
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17:14:29lazkaShane_e250r: or use a linux live cd.
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17:19:25linuxstbDarkStylist: Yes, but the two people that have tested it with vmware couldn't get it to work - something to do with conflicts between Windows and vmware http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200Unbrick
17:19:26jbr-loverbut thanks a bunch!!!hi all, am still here.
17:19:38linuxstbOops, didn't mean to repaste that link...
17:19:47jbr-loverhave a question to those who know the inner parts of the Recorder 20 V1...
17:20:22jbr-loverthe connector, is it a black thing with three little pins like sticking out of it, one looking through the device turned towards the right?
17:20:40jbr-loverif so, Archos may still have one on stock!
17:20:52amiconnXavierGr: Thanks, I never tried ghosting myself. Thought that I would kick myself this way...
17:21:18DarkStylistbtw rockbox support the sigmatel stfm1000?
17:22:08*amiconn added the /ns ghost line to the appropraite "command profile" in Hydra
17:23:43DarkStylistanother mp3player i cant get to life
17:24:25Shane_e250rif i bought a track from real could that be played in rockbox?
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17:26:03 Quit jonuts ()
17:26:22linuxstbShane_e250r: No.
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17:27:27Shane_e250rhello?
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17:30:04n1sDarkStylist: is it on the list of supported players on the frontpage?
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17:31:56DarkStylistits a soundchip
17:32:30DarkStylistim thinking of making one custom rockbox
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17:34:50low_lightlinuxstb: ok, I have a disk image of my sansa c250
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17:40:39preglow http://www.icst.net/dsgdownload/Digital_Sound_Generation_1.pdf
17:40:48preglowok, i did not intend to do that
17:41:04preglowbut you will just have to live with it
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17:44:45Shane_e250rHello?
17:45:31Shane_e250ri have a sansa D.a.p has anyone tried to put rockbox on it?
17:47:02Robin0800tried to use large icons on a wps and ran into some buffer limit what is this hard limit?
17:47:47Robin0800Shane_e250r,
17:48:21Robin0800Shane_e250r, does it say the 250r is supported?
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17:50:06Shane_e250ryes i'm not talking the sansa e250 im talking the original dap http://www.sandisk.com/Products/Catalog(1072)-SanDisk_Digital_Audio_Players.aspx
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17:58:44Shane_e250rhello?
17:59:51linuxstbhello?
17:59:55eigmahello?
18:00
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18:12:13GnelikSansa 250 Data abort at 00045f80 playing any mp3 yesterday night build can someone confirm
18:12:15Gnelik?
18:12:42linuxstbUpdate to a current build and try again.
18:12:50linuxstbI mean _the_ current build.
18:13:12*Gnelik went upgrading
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18:30:15 Quit barrywardell ()
18:30:41Justcameronhey people
18:31:08JustcameronI'm looking for a way to make scrolling through lists of files faster on rockbox on my ipod photo
18:31:28Justcameronwhen scrolling through large lists in the ipod firmware, it accellerates as you scroll - can rockbox do this?
18:31:58linuxstbNo, no-one has implemented that on ipods yet.
18:33:03 Quit obo ("bye")
18:34:05Justcameronlinuxstb: okay, ty. I found that "better wheel support" is listed here - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodStatus#General_tasks
18:34:19Justcameronfor now, I will put files into more sub-directories
18:34:26Justcameronthanks for your assistance linuxstb
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18:41:59Robin0800Justcameron,i'm sure their is a patch for this
18:42:16JustcameronRobin0800: oh?
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18:47:58Robin0800Justcameron,found it scrollwheel acceleration FS# 5594
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18:50:01DarkStylistjust a question
18:51:00DarkStylistwhich unit performs best with rockbox?
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18:51:40Robin0800DarkStylist,define 'best'?
18:52:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:52:48DarkStylistperforms best with gameboy most stable etc
18:53:16BigBambiIn terms of most stable, of SWCodec, it'd be iRiver (not H10), iAudio and Gigabeat
18:53:23BigBambii.e. not PortalPlayer
18:53:43BigBambiFor speed, Gigabeat, for recording H100.... depens what you want to do
18:54:00BigBambiHave a look at the BuyersGuide wiki page
18:54:13DarkStylistwhere at?
18:54:18BigBambithe wiki
18:54:22BigBambiwww.rockbox.org
18:54:22DarkStylistsure
18:54:54DarkStylistrecording like recording live concerts in cd quality wav?
18:55:34Justcameronso um... if I want to incorporate that patch, I'd have to download the source, patch it, then compile it?
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18:57:15EnterUserNameHey whats the usb stack? Is that allowing usb connections? if so does the latest cvs have access to use usb on the sansa?
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19:00
19:00:55Robin0800Justcameron,or use an unsaported build check the forum
19:01:08JustcameronRobin0800: yeah, looking, thanks :)
19:01:09EnterUserNameDo everyone post unsupported builds
19:01:15BigBambiDarkStylist: Yes, or WavPack or MP3
19:01:21EnterUserNameI created a build myself late august and i didnt know if i should post it
19:02:00BigBambiThe H100 series has line in and line out and optical in and optical out and internal mike all built in without needing a subpack. If you want to do recording it has the most inputs/outputs etc
19:02:19Robin0800EnterUserName,only a link in that forum section
19:02:29BigBambiEnterUserName: Only if you want to
19:02:37BigBambiMany people build and don't publish
19:02:57BigBambiIf you plan to do it on a regular basis and think people will appreciate it, sure go ahead
19:03:01EnterUserNameSo I'd have to place the build on my own server and people download it from my server?
19:03:25BigBambiYoul'd have to put it somewhere accessible, yes
19:03:40EnterUserNameok thank u
19:03:47BigBambino probs
19:04:12EnterUserNameIts alot of work to make your own builds though especially if the patches dont match up :)
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19:05:35Robin0800EnterUserName,its hard to keep them up to date as the rockbox code chanes/improves
19:06:21EnterUserNameRobin0800: I understand the reason :)
19:06:36EnterUserNameAnd its not hard to find the rejects. Just time consuming :)
19:07:50Robin0800EnterUserName,and by that time perhaps it's changed again
19:08:41EnterUserNameYup. I get it. Cuz people constantly commiting changes cuz your working on svn.
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19:58:01Chairman_WowAnyone know what's the current situation with nano 2nd gen? I know it's not officially supported but are there any hacks to get it working?
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20:00
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20:03:13Nico_PChairman_Wow: there has been no breakthrough
20:03:50Chairman_WowNico_P: Ah well, you can't have everything thanks for the info.
20:03:53advcomp2019did someone say my name
20:04:16Chairman_WowIf they did it was a bit of a mouthful.
20:05:25advcomp2019<pixelma> advcomp2019, I believe. (and scorche) <Jdgordon> advcomp2019: you round? <−− it was back a little bit
20:06:25advcomp2019back later tho
20:07:00Chairman_WowOh, sorry advcomp2019, I thought you were joking about the "say my name bit". Nico_P: thanks for the reply.
20:07:18Nico_PChairman_Wow: you're welcome
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20:23:06advcomp2019you asked for me earlier
20:23:14advcomp2019pixelma
20:24:04pixelmaI just wanted to mention you as JdGordon was looking for an e200r owner
20:24:29advcomp2019o ok
20:25:09pixelmahope I remembered correctly that you have one
20:25:30advcomp2019yea i have an e200r
20:27:05pixelmamaybe you can answer him per mail, see http://www.rockbox.org/mail/archive/rockbox-dev-archive-2007-09/0012.shtml - or if he's around later
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20:32:45advcomp2019i might talk to him later plus i am going to be busy for a while pixelma
20:32:53Agm3nthow to build bootloader for c200?
20:33:22linuxstbHave you set up a Rockbox development environment?
20:33:32Agm3ntyes
20:33:43linuxstbAnd you've checked out the source code from SVN?
20:34:09Agm3nti have subversion
20:34:24linuxstbThen see the UsingSVN wiki page and download the Rockbox source.
20:34:38EnterUserNameI dont think it shows how to find the bootloader there..
20:34:43Agm3ntI build rockbox.zip
20:34:45EnterUserNamejust the rockbox.zip
20:34:56Agm3ntyes
20:35:06linuxstbIt's all the same source - I haven't got to the bootloader stage yet....
20:35:19linuxstbAgm3nt: So you have the source on your computer?
20:35:22EnterUserNameYa where does it put the sanspatcher?
20:35:41Agm3ntyes i have source
20:35:57linuxstbThen create a new build directory (e.g. mkdir build-boot) and then cd into it.
20:36:21linuxstbThen you run ../tools/configure, select the c200, then b for bootloader, then "make"
20:36:29EnterUserNameahh
20:36:38linuxstbThat should give you a .mi4 file you can install on your c200.
20:37:03linuxstb(assuming low_light has checked all the required changes into SVN - I haven't been following his commits)
20:38:37EnterUserNamei get a bootloader.bin
20:38:57linuxstbamiconn, jhMikeS: I don't know if you've noticed, but the IPL PP5020 wiki page was updated a couple of weeks ago with some new info.
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20:41:45DarkSKallhello
20:41:58DarkSKallcan someone help me with my gigabeat?
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20:42:27 Join low_light [0] (i=c730180b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1ea7a1736c602495)
20:42:32linuxstbDarkSKall: Ask your question - no-one knows yet if they can help...
20:42:36Agm3ntlinuxstb: i copy firmware.mi4 but it not upgrade
20:42:55linuxstbAgm3nt: The expert's just arrived...
20:43:32 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com)
20:43:33DarkSKallMy gigabeat shows the error 0000010 when i power on , i had rockbox on it ,the last thing i did was charging the battery
20:43:37 Join eigma [0] (i=tlzumt@CABLE-206-188-76-21.cia.com)
20:43:50low_lightwith the c200 you need to to build and install the Normal build first (so you can use the orig firmware's usb)
20:43:52DarkSKalli tried the surgery solution but the hard drive does not show up
20:44:39low_lightthen build the rockbox bootloader (firmware.mi4)
20:45:41low_lightto install the rockbox bootloader, you use the recovery mode: device off, switch hold on, press and hold rec while inserting usb
20:45:53advcomp2019tell Bagder i was going to do the same thing in the that forum that he posted in
20:46:55low_lightcopy the firmware.mi4 and disconnect. it should update.
20:47:17low_lightI'll update the wiki when I get time.
20:48:16linuxstblow_light: I thought a normal firmware upgrade (on the E200) was just to copy it to the FAT32 partition in normal UMS mode?
20:48:21low_lightThe only way to get usb access to the device (to add music or update rockbox) is to put the orig firmware back
20:51:11 Part DarkStylist
20:51:34DarkSKallNobody can help me?
20:52:06***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:52:16 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
20:52:23low_lightlinuxstb: on the H10 and mrobe the OF is in the System directory so you can copy it directly...not so on the c200...I don't know about the e200
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20:52:41eigmafrom what I've seen, there are two types of USB support in devices: dedicated hardware (firmware just flips a switch and suddenly the HDD is handed over to some kind of USB MSD controller) and software (the firmware bridges between the HDD and the USB MSD standard). which does Rockbox support, and how well?
20:53:08eigmaI suppose the former is trivial to support once you know where the switch is.
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20:53:38linuxstblow_light: Have you seen this thread (especially the last post on this page) ? http://forums.sandisk.com/sansa/board/message?board.id=c200&message.id=546
20:54:03HeNry2kOohas anything having trouble with dual booting with their E200R?
20:54:09HeNry2kOo*anyone
20:54:43Agm3ntlow_light: not work http://pastebin.ca/684392
20:55:07linuxstbeigma: You're right - the devices Rockbox supports have both kinds of USB. The hardware USB is well-supported and works perfectly. Software USB doesn't work at all (but is in development).
20:55:50eigmalinuxstb: I see. thanks.
20:56:49linuxstbWhere Rockbox doesn't have USB connectivity, you need to use the original firmware. On some devices (e.g. ipods), Rockbox detects a USB connection and automatically starts the disk mode of the original firmware. On others you have to start the OF manually.
20:57:18eigmaI see. that's still a nice fallback (automatically starting the firmware)
20:58:04 Quit Gnelik ("Пока")
20:59:54HeNry2kOoanyone here with a rockboxed E200R?
21:00
21:00:49low_lightAgm3nt: firmware.mi4...that's the rockbox bootloader
21:01:37 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
21:03:32Agm3ntlow_light: i put it but it not upgade in screen i see LUN0 locked
21:03:56linuxstbHeNry2kOo: What kind of problems are you having booting the OF? Has it ever worked?
21:04:11low_lightAgm3nt: unmount & disconnect
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21:08:40Agm3ntlow_light: Can't load rockbox.mi4. File too big
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21:14:26delYsidhmm, on my e280, I just selected recording from the menu, and now it hangs there and I can not stop it anymore.
21:14:39delYsidAny hints? Pressing the off button for long doesnt help at all
21:14:55 Join bluebrother [0] (i=WgWMjFIN@nat-wh-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de)
21:15:46pixelmathought holding the power button for about 10 (maybe a bit more) seconds would always turn the Sansa off
21:16:15delYsidah, thanks.
21:16:22delYsidI didnt know about the 10 seconds.
21:16:39delYsidso recording is broken?
21:17:26 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat")
21:19:12low_lightAgm3nt: what's the mi4 size displayed on the screen?
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21:20:15Agm3ntlow_light: its 38167449
21:20:37pixelmadelYsid: I don't have a Sansa, on my player (M5) it works fine
21:21:27low_lightAgm3nt: and what's the size of rockbox.mi4
21:21:51 Quit HeNry2kOo ()
21:22:11Agm3ntlow_light: its mi4 size
21:24:12low_lightAgm3nt: I'm confused...the rockbox.mi4 file should be about 400 kB
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21:25:04Agm3ntlow_light: in rockbox.zip have 411 KB
21:27:24Agm3ntlow_light: to restore to OF copy only firmware.mi4??
21:27:34low_lightLet's review...you booted the orig sansa firmware, unzip rockbox.zip onto the device, turned off the device, restarted in recovery mode (hold+rec+usb), copied the rockbox firmware.mi4, and disconnected
21:27:56Agm3ntlow_light: right
21:28:35Agm3ntlow_light: yes
21:29:25low_lightyes, go back to recovery mode and copy over the orig firmware.mi4
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21:30:50Agm3nthow to unpack *.7z file in linux??
21:31:24 Quit Buschel ()
21:31:24bluebrotherusing "7z"
21:31:26 Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:31:28low_lightyou need p7zip
21:31:45bluebrother7z x archive.7z
21:32:04Agm3ntthanks
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21:38:42amiconnlinuxstb: The exception vector remapping sounds interesting. It could make ram remapping superfluous
21:39:44 Part Redbreva
21:40:12linuxstbcourtc made the wiki changes (he's lurking here now...)
21:40:35 Quit woodensoul ()
21:40:52amiconnThe cpu controller stuff extends on what jhMikeS figured out
21:47:29bluebrotherLlorean: when I browse to a thread in the forums that has the "new" icon attached, is it possible to directly jump to the new posts?
21:48:30pixelmaclick on the "new" icon?
21:48:38bluebrotheroh, does that work?
21:48:48pixelmaworks here
21:48:52bluebrotherah, cool :)
21:48:55bluebrotherthanks
21:49:09*Agm3nt have works rockbox on c200
21:50:06preglowexception vector remap?
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21:50:26DarkSkallHello
21:50:33chrisjs169Hello
21:53:43DarkSkallI got a problem with my gigabeat , error 10 , I tried the surgery solution ,but it doesnt work at all ,someone know how to solve this?
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22:00
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22:10:06LloreanjhMikeS, Bagder: You guys around?
22:11:31 Quit ompaul ("take it easy")
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22:18:44BobShieldQuick question - been going through list archives but haven't found anything recent - does rockbox support wma?
22:18:52linuxstb_Yes
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22:26:37MyAdlerIs it normal that whenever i plug in my iriver to the usb on my computer and turn it on it tells me that "one of the usb devices on this computer has malfunctioned"?
22:27:04DefineBytei get that on my ipod sometimes
22:27:07linuxstb_Which iriver?
22:27:14DefineBytewhen i haven't booted first
22:27:15 Quit clocks ("Leaving")
22:27:24MyAdlerh10.....
22:27:33MyAdler20gig
22:27:38MyAdlerblue...
22:27:58linuxstb_Yes, there is a known problem (on lots of targets) when booting with the USB cable attached.
22:28:23 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat")
22:28:36MyAdleri dont think it ever recognises it.....no matter when i connect....
22:28:55linuxstb_Are you holding the required button (I forget what, maybe power) when inserting USB?
22:29:21MyAdlermaybe not......anyone know what that button may be?
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22:29:46 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
22:30:03linuxstb_The manual should describe it. (I hope...)
22:30:21MyAdlerill go take a look...
22:31:29delYsidam I right that the .talk and _dirname.talk generation does only work with vbs currently?
22:34:31*n1s thinks it's interesting that most threads requesting some weird UI feature get so heated once someone comes with an argument against adding it...
22:35:30bluebrotherdelYsid: Rockbox Utility can create .talk-clips
22:35:40bluebrotherthough I neither implemented nor tested it ...
22:35:44MyAdleri cant find anything to do with connecting the player to usb.... besides for when it explains how to install rockbox...
22:35:58delYsidbluebrother: thats the qt thing, right?
22:36:06bluebrotheryes.
22:36:17delYsidhmm, sad, so I cant use that either.
22:36:29delYsidwill have to write my own script then
22:36:37LloreandelYsid: Your computer can't run it, or the accessibility features in QT don't meet your standards?
22:37:00delYsidLlorean: on linux (which is what I use) Qt is not accessible at all, so I cant use it...
22:37:33LloreandelYsid: QT4 certainly claims to be, at least
22:37:34n1sMyAdler: is your h10 a MTP version?
22:37:47delYsidLlorean: it claims to, thats the problem.
22:37:57MyAdleryoure gonna have to tell me how should know that....?
22:38:13LloreandelYsid: Well, are you saying the functionality doesn't work at all?
22:38:17LloreanIt just does nothing?
22:38:27delYsidLlorean: correct.
22:38:41bluebrotherwell, some of the kde guys seem to work on a Qt-ATK bridge
22:39:09n1sMyAdler: did you have to do the UMS trick to install rockbox
22:39:14delYsidbluebrother: I am very involved with the accessibility stack on linux, I know it will at least take 6 months or more.
22:39:18MyAdleryes i do
22:39:19LloreandelYsid: I seem to recall people having some success with it, so I'm tempted to think it's more likely something not configured properly. Have you gone to QT support channels and sought more information on this?
22:39:26bluebrotherunfortunately that web page seems to be down.
22:39:32delYsidthey are discussing this since *years* and nothing usable emerged yet.
22:39:41bluebrotherah. And what's the current status?
22:39:53bluebrotheris there any web site giving an overview?
22:40:10delYsidLlorean: please believe me, it does not work. I am really quite involved with a11y on linux.
22:40:50delYsidbluebrother: the AT-SPI/ATK uses corba, and Qt/KDE does not want to use this, that is the status since about 3 years now.
22:40:52LloreandelYsid: Well that's the thing, I've heard people claim it's worked for them.
22:40:56delYsidbut they keep claiming they support it.
22:41:04LloreandelYsid: So claiming that it is completely unfunctioning seems to be going a bit too far, to me.
22:41:16bluebrotherI googled around a bit the last days and as far as I found Qt wants to use dbus.
22:41:17n1sMyAdler: then you should hold down a button when connecting the USB while in rockbox, I guess it's the select button
22:41:18LloreandelYsid: Or are you saying "It doesn't function with my system"?
22:42:12delYsidLlorean: no, the problem is Qt implements an API since Qt4, but there is no screen reader (a program that can use the API) yet.
22:42:18delYsidso it is effectively not working at all.
22:42:46delYsidjust believe me, I really know what I am talking here.
22:43:03delYsidanyway, I'll write myself a script that does it.
22:43:08Bagderon linux that is
22:43:19Bagdersince clearly it speaks on windows
22:43:39bluebrotheryou might want to look into adding the command line interface to rbutil ;-)
22:43:42Bagderjust wanted to clarify
22:43:48delYsidwell, maybe, I dont use windows.
22:44:00bluebrotherwhich is somewhat planned but needs quite some work
22:44:06Bagderstill, saying "qt4 isn't accessible" isn't completely true
22:44:22Bagdersince it is qt4 on linux that has the problems
22:44:24delYsidBagder: you sound like a trolltech guy :-)
22:44:44MyAdlergreat thanx, seems to have worked
22:44:45LloreandelYsid: My googling suggests at least Orca claims to support AT-SPI?
22:44:45BagderI consider the fact that many people don't use linux
22:44:59delYsidBagder: that, doesnt help me :-)
22:45:05Bagderindeed not
22:45:10BagderI just clarify your statements
22:45:34 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat")
22:46:00delYsidLlorean: yes, Orca supports AT-SPI, but Qt has no bridge to AT-SPI yet
22:46:32LloreandelYsid: QT4 claims to. Is the documentation incorrect?
22:46:44delYsidLlorean: yes, the documentation is incorrect.
22:46:50bluebrotherby what means?
22:46:56delYsidI was baffled as well when I read that.
22:46:59delYsidits just a lie
22:47:05bluebrotherI read about two different approaches AT-SPI
22:47:13delYsidif you ask the KDE people, they will confirm it, but they will be reluctant about it :-)
22:47:45delYsidanyway, thanks for your info.
22:47:51LloreandelYsid: What about Gnome people?
22:48:07delYsidLlorean: GTK2 is accessible via orca since about 2 years now.
22:48:26delYsidGTK2, openoffice and java use AT-SPI
22:48:43delYsidbut Qt does not want to use CORBA, so they implemented an API without a bridge to anything on linux.
22:48:57bluebrotherso what is Qt using? The docs claim it's AT-SPI
22:49:11delYsidbluebrother: yes, I know, and that is false!!!
22:49:30bluebrotherbut what are they using if it's not AT-SPI?
22:49:39delYsidnothing :-)
22:49:40bluebrotherI read about two approaches at AT-SPI ...
22:49:52delYsidits a really crazy situation
22:49:54bluebrotherwell, there is code around so it needs to be at least more than nothing.
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22:50:23delYsidwell, the API is there, but it doesnt go anywhere.
22:50:40delYsidI guess they claim compatibility because they want to have some positive PR, dunno, really.
22:51:04delYsidI was confused as well when I read the QT4 a11y docs.
22:51:34delYsidbut the guys working on it confirmed to me that it isnt there yet.
22:51:55delYsidI actually know them, I am involved in a11y development on linux, going to conferences and all that.
22:52:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:52:13bluebrotherand how's the state with KDE4?
22:52:34bluebrotherI read they want to have it accessible at least.
22:52:49 Quit Fraser (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:53:13delYsidwanting is not the same as doing....
22:53:23delYsidgnome has its act together since several years now.
22:53:27delYsidand KDE is only claiming stuff.
22:53:38bluebrotherthat doesn't imply they have something working in their current development tree.
22:53:39delYsidbelieve me, I rely on accessibility to actually work with my computer.
22:54:20BagderdelYsid: we believe you, we just try to get some further info from you than the repeated "it doesn't work" mantra
22:54:26delYsidanyway, gotta get some sleep.
22:54:26bluebrother... and you really sound pretty much frustrated about kde / qt in terms of accessibility
22:54:37 Quit BigMac_ ("Konversation terminated!")
22:54:38delYsidbluebrother: yes, I am.
22:54:45bluebrotherand only telling us that "it doesn't work" doesn't help clarifying the situation nor improving it
22:54:46Lloreanbluebrother: Is our RBUtil compiled with accessibility functions (or non-working ones) enabled?
22:54:55bluebrotherLlorean: yes, at least on windows.
22:55:26Lloreanbluebrother: I'm just curious if "doesn't work" means "extremely limited" or "nothing at all" or "error messages" or what.
22:55:44LloreanWhich means a linux test.
22:55:55delYsidLlorean: on linux, currently, "nothing at all", at least from an end-user perspective.
22:56:13bluebrotherI haven't done test on linux, but information about screen readers on linux are really hard to find.
22:56:26bluebrotherat least if you're not familiar with that "scene"
22:56:37delYsidthere is only orca really on linux
22:56:51delYsidand I know that code, I patched it in the past, and there is no Qt support at all in orca.
22:57:06Lloreanbluebrother: I was just curious if the functionality is "enabled" in the linux binary on the wiki page
22:57:19delYsidand as long as Qt provides no AT-SPI bridge, that means nothing works.
22:57:32bluebrotherLlorean: the functionality is provided by a Qt plugin which needs to be compiled in when build statically.
22:57:48delYsidLlorean: ideally, an app should not have to care, the accessibility part is enabled in the toolkit, not app-specific
22:57:52bluebrotherI had the impression that there's something fishy about this on the linux binary but I haven't investigated yet.
22:57:58*bluebrother found an interesting web page: http://labs.trolltech.com/page/Projects/Accessibility/QDBusBridge
22:58:02LloreandelYsid: Yes, but we provide a static binary I think
22:58:26delYsidLlorean: i see.
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22:58:37delYsidbluebrother: dbus, yes, but there is no screen reader for dbus yet.
22:59:09delYsidanyway, bye... and thanks.
22:59:10bluebrotherwell, fine. I'm currently trying to find out what's available at all
22:59:12Lloreanbluebrother: Something fishy about the linux version? Also how would I know if the plugin has been compiled in?
22:59:46bluebrotherand it seems like there is no general overview or good start point around. Or nobody is willing to point me to it. Dunno.
23:00
23:00:19bluebrotherLlorean: if the plugin isn't compiled in it won't be accessible. Users not interested in that wouldn't notice a difference.
23:03:37 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:03:45bluebrotherhmm, interesting: http://developer.kde.org/documentation/library/cvs-api/kdelibs-apidocs/interfaces/kspeech/html/index.html
23:05:33 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
23:06:06LloreanAs I said, I'm almost positive I've had someone tell me they had a QT program speaking, though I don't know what hoops they may have gone through
23:06:36bluebrothermaybe I should go and compile KDE4. After reading some pages it really looks like they have something working.
23:08:26LloreanOrca seems a bit unstable here.
23:08:53LloreanBut then I've been having some weird instability with anything GTK+ right now
23:09:05bluebrotherit was heavily unstable when I tried it some days ago. Frequent crashes after closing a gtk application
23:09:08 Part n1s
23:09:34LloreanThat's what I get.
23:10:12 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat")
23:10:30LloreanDoing Google research, every time I see QT4 being problematic for accessibility it's under KDE.
23:11:26bluebrotherwell, KDE3 doesn't have support for screen readers and KDE4 isn't released yet
23:11:35billytwowillyany devs in the Edmonton/Alberta/Canada area? If so, interested in spending a bit of non warranty voiding quality time with my new ipod nano once it arrives/
23:12:11Lloreanbillytwowilly: Installing Rockbox is warranty voiding...
23:12:38billytwowillyI was thinking trying to get some info out of it to see how hard a rockbox port would be.
23:12:48MyAdlerhow would anyone know that rockbox was installed....
23:12:52billytwowillynot actually installing rockbox.
23:13:30bluebrotherreading through list archives with loads of top-posts isn't fun :/
23:14:01Lloreanbillytwowilly: Well any useful information requires opening it up, again warranty voiding.
23:15:20billytwowillyheh. then no dice. Oh well, I tried.
23:15:32Bagderand of course checking the firmware upgrade files
23:15:36Bagderetc
23:16:10bluebrotherLlorean: also quite interesting in terms of at-spi: http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/accessibility/orca-dbus/README?revision=588808&view=markup
23:17:56Lloreanbluebrother: That's also a year old. =/ Doesn't look very good.
23:18:22bluebrotherwell, it's in the playgound of kde. Maybe they moved on ...
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23:26:16krazykit\
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23:29:54bluebrotherhttp://www.linux-foundation.org/en/AT-SPI_on_D-Bus
23:30:21bluebrothersounds to me like there is just a big change underway and that hinders KDE / Qt from supporting the existing techniques.
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23:33:04einhirnGood evening. I finally made it back to do some coding.
23:33:37Lloreanbluebrother: It does sound to me that Qt isn't *really* the culprit though. Not in the strictest sense.
23:35:18bluebrotherI agree.
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