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#rockbox log for 2007-09-11

00:00:26krazykitMBaller20, depends on the program. there should be an option "burn from iso" or "burn from disc image" that would make you select the ISO itself
00:01:38 Quit tictoc (Remote closed the connection)
00:01:55MBaller20oh, i got it
00:02:49 Join tictoc [0] (i=tabac@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0xB9002659)
00:02:50 Quit Dwyloc ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:03:02 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
00:03:05markunany Australians looking for a cheap and new Gigabeats?
00:04:16MBaller20i'm pretty sure that is off-topic
00:05:29markunMBaller20: I hope I can get away with it :)
00:06:02scorcheMBaller20: developers are a bit immune to the guidelines..."one of the perks"
00:06:36scorcheit is mainly because they know when to draw the line between disruptive and not though
00:06:52markunbut mostly because we are jerks
00:07:03petur... and love beer :)
00:07:41MBaller20lol
00:07:57 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@c220-237-57-32.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au)
00:12:59 Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@86-41-121-118.b-ras2.lmk.limerick.eircom.net)
00:13:03 Join juxtap [0] (i=juxtap@unaffiliated/juxtap)
00:15:11 Quit Wiwie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:18:09 Quit davina ("xchat on Ubuntu 7.04")
00:19:18 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
00:20:19 Join RudMan [0] (n=RudMan@ool-182fb504.dyn.optonline.net)
00:20:33 Quit freqmod (Remote closed the connection)
00:24:59MBaller20hmmmm......
00:26:10 Quit ender` (" Whenever you cut your fingernails, you will find a need for them an hour later.")
00:28:20MBaller20" Whenever you cut your fingernails, you will find a need for them an hour later." Haha, that's good. Who wrote this?
00:28:52 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC")
00:29:52scorche...huh?
00:31:00MBaller20sorry if that sounded stupid. I was wondering how you get the phrases at the end of the line when you log out.
00:31:32krazykityou /set them in your client... read their docs how to do that
00:32:46 Quit funky ("leaving")
00:32:48MBaller20okay
00:34:22 Quit obo ("bye")
00:36:26chrisjs169MBaller20, yes, I was just a tester
00:38:39MBaller20is the development progressing
00:39:24chrisjs169it's changed from the copy I had (AFAIK) but JdGordon is the one you should ask about the development of it
00:40:11markunMBaller20: ender always has great messages when leaving
00:49:01 Quit MBaller20 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:53:26 Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend")
00:54:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:57:09 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:58:23wookey__in the files list I can;t see the directory 'music' on sansa280 unless I set 'show files' to all. Is that right? Seems to me that music is a supported type so it ought to be shown when this is set to 'supported'.
00:59:21 Part juxtap
01:00
01:00:29 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
01:00:35 Quit Rondom (Remote closed the connection)
01:00:57peturwookey__: maybe the directory is set to hidden?
01:01:23wookey__is that a feature of fat or of rockbox?
01:01:29peturfat
01:01:35wookey__it looked OK as a dir mounted under linux
01:01:41 Quit tictoc ("Leaving")
01:01:54wookey__and it was created by the sansa formware
01:01:58peturalthough rockbox will also hide directories starting with .
01:02:01wookey__I'll double-check
01:02:25peturlinux doesn't honor the hidden attribute of fat
01:02:41wookey__OK, so how do I check?
01:02:58peturon linux? no idea
01:03:05wookey__I only have linux :-)
01:03:59 Join FOAD_ [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
01:04:11wookey__I've thought of a couple of improvements already (stolen form the pure 'the bug' interface mostly) :-)
01:04:42wookey__like accelerating fast-forward with more than one speed step
01:04:59wookey__and playing a bit of audio whilst fast-forwarding (that ocuple be harder)
01:06:19peturfast forward already has acceleration
01:06:45peturplaying audio while fast forwarding is irritating
01:07:28 Join iamben [0] (n=ben@dpc67142179038.direcpc.com)
01:09:55wookey__petur: it has acceleration, but it seems to top out quite quickly
01:10:21wookey__for long tracks (radio programmes) it would be nice to go faster
01:10:49wookey__equaly without some audio it is hard to tell when you are (e.g. past the news and into the programme)
01:10:58peturno, unless the file is several hours. I've used it without problems on tracks of up to 90 minutes
01:11:37wookey__so when it says '2x, 3s' it keeps doubling in accel speed every 3 seconds how many times?
01:12:03wookey__there is no top speed?
01:12:11peturerr... where does it say that?
01:13:08wookey__general settings, ff/rewind, ff/rw accel
01:13:35peturoh, scrollwheel stuff? I only have buttons here and those work fine ;)
01:13:38wookey__or is there just one step to 'double speed'?
01:13:47wookey__no this is buttons
01:13:59wookey__the scrollwheel only seems to affect volume
01:14:32wookey__(being able to use scrollwheel for FF/RW would be very nice but I'm not sure how one might do that - maybe it is a feature here somewhere)
01:15:21wookey__I will use it some more, but I think the bug does it better, so there is room to improve
01:15:59peturoh I see, didn't even know we had a setting for ff/rew buttons... when I use it it keeps increasing step, at some point taking steps of several minutes *finds a big track and tries again*
01:16:37wookey__OK, that sounds like what I was expacting to happen
01:17:33wookey__right - yes, it does keep accelerating
01:17:37wookey__my mistake
01:17:43peturI got it as far as having the minutes count very fast
01:19:40 Quit petur ("Zzzzzz")
01:20:17 Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:20:18 Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (n=dok@dinah.blub.net)
01:24:24 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com)
01:27:40 Quit lazka (Remote closed the connection)
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01:28:35 Quit RudMan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:28:43 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
01:28:45 Join RudMan [0] (n=RudMan@ool-182fb504.dyn.optonline.net)
01:29:19 Join WalkGood [0] (i=WalkGood@adsl-225-163-30.mia.bellsouth.net)
01:31:37 Join davidgwrawson [0] (i=18eddffa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-acacc5040fc9dece)
01:31:45davidgwrawsonhey
01:31:54davidgwrawsonhey
01:31:57DBUGEnqueued KICK davidgwrawson
01:31:57davidgwrawsonhey
01:32:03davidgwrawsonhey
01:32:09davidgwrawsonguys
01:32:14davidgwrawsonGUYS
01:32:24davidgwrawsonWhat did I do?
01:33:16tictocno idea
01:33:22 Quit davidgwrawson (Client Quit)
01:34:07 Join webguest40 [0] (i=18eddffa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-6b9748a060013cbe)
01:34:19webguest40jh
01:34:22webguest40kjh'
01:34:25webguest40YO
01:34:27iambenplease gtfo
01:34:30webguest40WHAZZUP?
01:34:38iambeni beg you
01:34:39webguest40ok
01:34:46webguest40what's wrong?
01:35:02webguest40why do you want me gone?
01:35:24iambendo you need something?
01:35:31webguest40help
01:35:42webguest40this is rockbox, right
01:35:47ChrononDid you read the topic?
01:35:57 Quit Entasis (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:36:00webguest40im DavidGWRawson
01:36:18webguest40Chronon, I stole your animated gif
01:36:19scorcheplease read the link in the topic...you are spamming
01:36:27webguest40bye, then
01:36:29 Quit webguest40 (Client Quit)
01:37:20 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@host-194-46-251-39.dsl-ie.utvinternet.net)
01:37:36 Join Soap_ [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
01:43:02 Part WalkGood
01:48:35 Quit qweru ("moo")
01:49:44 Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:50:51 Join chris__ [0] (n=chris@CABLE-72-53-22-61.cia.com)
01:58:04 Quit billytwowilly (Success)
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02:00
02:00:09 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp256-160.adsl.forthnet.gr)
02:06:56 Quit Soap (Nick collision from services.)
02:07:00 Nick Soap_ is now known as Soap (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
02:07:28 Join Soap_ [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
02:11:16 Quit My_Sic (Connection reset by peer)
02:11:31 Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@70.53.156.245)
02:11:44Ebertwhat exactly does the tagnavi.config file do?
02:12:04 Join webguest98 [0] (i=4a469c81@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-53b95f6069bd483e)
02:12:23webguest98download links in e200rinstallation instructions don't work
02:12:43webguest98anybody know why
02:12:59krazykityes they do
02:13:12webguest98i clicked on them and nothing loaded
02:13:43krazykiti did too. they all download fine. maybe you have DNS issues?
02:14:03tictoce200? me too!
02:14:23LloreanEbert: It and the custom tagnavi define the menus you see in database mode
02:14:52 Quit Llorean (Remote closed the connection)
02:15:07krazykitwebguest98, can you resolve daniel.haxx.se?
02:15:10 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com)
02:15:29Ebertso they don't define the database of songs itself
02:15:55webguest98i clicked those links under e200rbootloader patching and nothing happened
02:16:06 Quit Llorean (Remote closed the connection)
02:16:22 Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@cpe-70-113-103-34.austin.res.rr.com)
02:17:21krazykitwebguest98, don't know what to tell you. the problem appears to be on your end
02:17:54 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
02:17:58webguest98the site works but the links that arn't working are http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/e200/BL_SD_boardSupportSD.rom
02:18:24webguest98aren't*
02:18:26krazykitdownloads just fine for me.
02:18:44webguest98is it because i'm using firefox?
02:18:51krazykitno
02:19:16webguest98should i right click it and hit save as
02:19:21krazykityes
02:19:35webguest98oh
02:19:41webguest98that was the problem
02:20:21krazykitthat's why i like to use wget.
02:21:58webguest98what should i put at the end of e200tool. .what?
02:22:05 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@207-172-204-33.c3-0.rdl-ubr4.trpr-rdl.pa.cable.rcn.com)
02:22:18krazykitnothing
02:22:21webguest98it saves as htm
02:22:29krazykitit shouldn't.
02:22:41webguest98what type of file should it be
02:22:45krazykitno type
02:23:23krazykittry opening an xterm and doing wget http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/e200tool/e200tool
02:23:36webguest98what is that
02:23:44 Part hcs
02:24:01krazykitwget is a tool to download stuff from the command line
02:24:07webguest98oh
02:24:10krazykitit's actually right there in the instructions
02:24:31webguest98i didn't even see it
02:24:39 Part toffe82
02:25:28 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c58-109-97-210.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au)
02:26:50 Quit preglow (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:28:56wookey__hmm, looks like sansa stock firmware makes 'music' dir hidden.
02:29:14wookey__I just un-hid it but then ran stock firmware and it disappeared again
02:29:31wookey__an option in the file menu to unhide a dir would be _really_ handy
02:29:39wookey__file context menu
02:30:45krazykitwookey__, it'll do that every time you boot into the stock firmware. i'd just make a different directory.
02:31:11wookey__'Music' just seems a rather good name :-)
02:31:25krazykiti like musik
02:31:42wookey__I am too old to enjoy that spelling :-)
02:31:56krazykitit's german >:(
02:32:06wookey__fair enough
02:32:39krazykiti agree that it's annoying, though. when USB support is finished, it won't be a problem anymore
02:32:43wookey__perhaps Audio/Music and Audio/Radio
02:32:59wookey__indeed - with USB fixed no need to ever go back into stock
02:33:44wookey__I'll try Songs and Radio
02:34:08krazykiti mean, you COULD always just use the database
02:35:04wookey__yes, it just seemed a bit daft that no actual music appeared in the files list
02:35:19wookey__as music is kind of the point of these gadgets
02:35:47webguest98i downloaded wget and finished the setup so how do i get the link to work now
02:37:23 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.)
02:37:29 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
02:37:36alienbiker99i cant wait for the sansa to get a usb stack
02:38:31krazykitwebguest98, "wget the_url_you_want_to_download"
02:38:54webguest98how do i do that?
02:39:08krazykittype it in, obviously
02:39:23webguest98.wget?
02:39:41krazykitno .
02:40:09webguest98do i still have to right click and hit save link as
02:40:12Chrononkrazykit, I'm guessing that webguest98 is not familiar with a command line.
02:40:16 Join kkurbjun [0] (n=kkurbjun@c-67-166-49-171.hsd1.co.comcast.net)
02:40:25krazykitapparently.
02:40:27webguest98no, i'm not
02:40:31krazykitwebguest98, wget is simply another way to download the file
02:41:01 Join advcomp2019_ [0] (n=advcomp2@66.172.231.192)
02:41:07 Quit advcomp2019 (Nick collision from services.)
02:41:12webguest98i'm just trying to figure out how to use this command line
02:41:17 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@66.172.231.192)
02:41:28krazykitwhat are you trying to do, precisely?
02:41:36 Quit HellDragon (Client Quit)
02:41:52webguest98download the files i need from the e200rbootloaderpatcher page
02:42:08 Quit Chronon ("Work --> Home")
02:42:11 Join HellDragon [0] (n=Nocebo@unaffiliated/helldragon)
02:42:40krazykitdo you have everything but e200tool then?
02:43:12webguest98i clicked save link as for the other two besides e200tool
02:44:22krazykityou can do that to e200tool as well, it turns out
02:44:23webguest98those downloaded onto my desktop
02:44:28krazykitjust delete .htm at the end
02:44:39webguest98but it downloads as a htm file
02:44:53krazykitdelete the file extension and it'll be fine
02:45:09krazykityou can then follow the instructions as written
02:46:00webguest98i understand that but there is no extension at the end, it just say e200tool, and asks if i want to save it
02:46:23 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
02:50:23webguest98there is no option to delete the file extension because the file extension is not shown
02:52:07 Quit Rincewind ("Cya")
02:53:04krazykitubuntu hides files extensions these days?
02:53:35webguest98i have to download them while using ubuntu?
02:53:45krazykitoh, no
02:53:49krazykiti just assumed you were using it
02:54:03webguest98no, i'm still using windows
02:54:04krazykitjust enable file extensions in windows
02:54:13webguest98how do i do that
02:54:31***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:54:41krazykiti don't know. i haven't used windows in a few years :D
02:54:44 Quit barrywardell ()
02:55:26webguest98you always use ubuntu?
02:56:14krazykitno, i much prefer debian, but that's offtopic.
02:56:41 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
02:56:58webguest98so maybe i should add something at the end of the save like .something
02:57:20webguest98e200tool.?
02:57:46Lloreane200tool is not a windows binary... downloading it in windows isn't going to do you much good anyway
02:58:11webguest98am i able to download it while using ubuntu
02:58:24webguest98i just finished making the livecd
02:58:43krazykitwebguest98, as long as you can connect to the internet in ubuntu.
02:59:01webguest98okay, i'll try
02:59:28 Quit BigMac (Remote closed the connection)
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03:00
03:00:13 Join DavidGWRawson [0] (i=18eddffa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-eed7238e1688539b)
03:00:24DavidGWRawsoncan I use this chatroom for help?
03:00:47LloreanHelp with Rockbox, yes, as long as you've checked the manual and wiki first
03:01:03DavidGWRawsonbetter do that first...
03:01:22 Join Cannoli [0] (n=Cannoli@dsl-207-112-87-76.tor.primus.ca)
03:01:42Cannolihey
03:02:06Cannolito install rockbox on a 5.5g do i have to be in linux like i had to be for ipodlinux installation?
03:02:27krazykitno, you can install through windows
03:02:31LloreanCannoli: Try reading the manual...
03:02:45 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=chatzill@ool-4351bd58.dyn.optonline.net)
03:03:06DavidGWRawsonI read everything.
03:03:07LambdaCalculus37Ahh, evening, everyone!
03:03:32webguest98i popped in the livecd and then the ubuntu window came up saying "starting browser or something". nothing happened after that
03:03:47Cannolithe video ipod one is the same for the 5.,5g?
03:03:49DavidGWRawsonOk, I hope you have a little information on the dualbooting problem on the Sansa e200r.
03:03:54LloreanCannoli: Yes.
03:03:56krazykitwebguest98, you have to boot from the CD
03:03:58Cannolikk ty
03:04:13 Quit Soap (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:04:20webguest98okay
03:04:26 Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
03:04:29LloreanDavidGWRawson: You never went through on the forums and said exactly what you did. Dual boot works fine for all of the developers who've tested it, so we can't give any more information: People with the problem have to figure it out.
03:04:37webguest98will i still be able to use windows while running this
03:04:52Lloreanwebguest98: You'll be able to come back to windows once you're done.
03:04:57Cannolioh wait, see im on linux right now and i have my ipod mounted at /dev/sdd and /dev/sdd2 cause i also have ipodlinux on it
03:05:04Cannoliwhich one is the "root" for my ipod?
03:05:09Cannoliwhich partition?
03:05:16LloreanCannoli: The fat32 one
03:05:24Cannolithe one with the itunes files?
03:05:30LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: Yes.
03:05:34LloreanYes, assuming it's not a mac-formatted iPod
03:05:49Cannolinope windows
03:05:58Cannoliand this shouldnt erase my files right?
03:06:16DavidGWRawsonAm I allowed to put links on here?
03:06:22 Join fergofrog [0] (i=cb8121fb@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-234bd53c99a33f1a)
03:06:43fergofrogDoes anyone know anything about theming?
03:07:12LloreanCannoli: It shouldn't erase anything as long as you don't click the "Install" icon once you're in Ubuntu
03:07:44LloreanDavidGWRawson: Only if they're relevant. There are posted guidelines you know... you could just read them.
03:08:11 Quit atsea- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:08:14Cannoligod those themes look soo hawt
03:08:22Cannolicant wait to have my ipod look like that :D
03:08:40DavidGWRawsonDid YOU read the rules?^^
03:08:46 Quit fergofrog (Client Quit)
03:08:49maxkelleyis FM radio default enabled for c200?
03:09:00 Quit BigMac (Remote closed the connection)
03:09:31 Join BigMac [0] (n=mike@c-71-234-95-131.hsd1.ct.comcast.net)
03:09:32LloreanDavidGWRawson: Is there some reason you asked me that?
03:09:49webguest98nothing loaded yet
03:10:15Lloreanmaxkelley: The c200 port is in an early state, I wouldn't be surprised if it's not functioning yet, but I doubt many of the developers here have even looked at the c200 port.
03:10:31LambdaCalculus37webguest98: Wait for it.
03:10:40LambdaCalculus37Live CDs take time to boot.
03:10:42maxkelleyI felt that, was just wondering if anyone knew if it was working or not.
03:10:54webguest98a k-meleon window came up so i guess it's working
03:11:08DavidGWRawsonOk, I'm currently uploading a very detailed video on the problem I'm having.
03:11:21LambdaCalculus37webguest98: A K-Meleon window?
03:11:24LambdaCalculus37Are you still in Windows?
03:11:29krazykitwebguest98, er, did you *reboot* your computer and boot from the cd?
03:11:37webguest98no
03:11:52LambdaCalculus37webguest98: Shut down, leave the CD in the drive, and REBOOT.
03:12:00LloreanDavidGWRawson: You've been asked repeatedly to document the exact process you went through to install. Did you do this?
03:12:03DavidGWRawsonHold C too!
03:12:11webguest98okay thanks
03:12:11DavidGWRawsonYes
03:12:11 Join atsea- [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-62b3a4ee9e64e8ce)
03:12:34webguest98hold c?
03:12:37DavidGWRawsonThrough the entire bootloader patching to the end of the problem!
03:12:58LambdaCalculus37webguest98: The key you have to hold depends on the PC you're using.
03:12:59krazykitwebguest98, ignore him, he doesn't know what he's talking about. you have to hit the key for the boot menu that your computer tells you at the beginning.
03:13:19DavidGWRawsonF12?
03:13:20LambdaCalculus37webguest98: Say for example, on a Dell, it would be F12.
03:13:20webguest98okay i'm doing it now, cya in a bit
03:13:35DavidGWRawsonSame on a Toshiba
03:13:48 Join RaRe [0] (n=Laffin_B@202-89-187-101.static.dsl.amnet.net.au)
03:14:18LambdaCalculus37Well, I found out some more about the innards of the Dell DJ.
03:14:18 Quit DavidGWRawson ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
03:14:34 Quit webguest98 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
03:14:37LambdaCalculus37Wiki page is looking a lot fuller: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DellDJPort
03:15:28LambdaCalculus37I've got it down to the PCB, hooked up to my laptop.
03:15:52LambdaCalculus37Removing the hard drive put me in some kind of Rescue Mode.
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03:19:54LambdaCalculus37Hard to navigate the menus without the scroll barrel or buttons.
03:22:06DavidRawsonWould it become a legal issue if I modified the rockbox source code and used it on my player?
03:22:38LloreanDavidRawson: Read the license terms, the intent of the GPL is to allow people to modify it.
03:22:49eigmaI think the GPL mainly restricts distribution
03:22:58LloreanThe GPL doesn't restrict distribution.
03:23:07LloreanThe GPL mandates distribution of everything if you distribute part.
03:23:12eigmas/restricts/regulates/
03:23:25LloreanEverything being "The source" and part being "The binary"
03:24:10LambdaCalculus37eigma: Maybe you should do some reading up: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GPL
03:24:11eigmaI just mean that if you keep your mods to yourself, you are not in infringement of the license
03:24:15DavidRawsonIt is fascinating how the device's companies give you the templates to help make rockbox work...
03:24:46LambdaCalculus37DavidRawson: What templates? Most of the work was done by reverse engineering.
03:24:46Lloreaneigma: If you keep them, or if you share them as long as you share everything rather than just the compiled version, you're fine too.
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03:25:32DavidRawsonReverse engineering? How is that possible? That would be alot of work to figure that out!
03:25:33DavidRawsonOr is it from scratch?
03:25:42eigmaah hell, I'm a developer, I know nothing about licenses
03:25:58DavidRawson^Bad word!
03:26:07LambdaCalculus37DavidRawson: NOW you're getting the idea!
03:26:31LloreanDavidRawson: An awful lot of hard work goes into it, which is why very new ports can take years to get from "Idea" to "working"
03:26:48LloreanAnd why it requires a very dedicated group of people who already own the player to make it happen.
03:27:07LambdaCalculus37Or one crazy hacker with plenty of free time. :)
03:27:13eigmaor one developer with no day job ;)
03:27:15eigmahehe
03:27:41LloreanStill takes that one crazy hacker a good amount of time
03:27:53LloreanMost of our recent ports have been "quick" because we knew something about the hardware already
03:28:11LambdaCalculus37And this Dell DJ may be on the opposite end of the spectrum.
03:28:21LambdaCalculus37Although I've found a decent amount of info so far.
03:28:37LloreanAnd quick still means "many months"
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03:29:03LloreanDatasheets are rarely 100% reliable, and there's always strange quirks, or one undocumented chip sitting between two documented parts, or whatever else.
03:29:08BiptoNt mean to interrupt but is it possible for the H3XX to record at higher sample rates like 48khz or with 24bit instead of 16?
03:29:12DavidRawsonWell, I'm only 16 so I don't know that much on how to code. I know that it is complex to figure out how devices work.
03:29:34LambdaCalculus37DavidRawson: Maybe you should try to get your hands dirty with a simpler language first?
03:30:08LloreanBiptoN: I'm pretty sure the maximum for it is 48/20, but it would require significant changes to how it's coded. And it might be 44/20 or 48/16. I'm not sure.
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03:33:51asdwhere should i extract the fonts pack?
03:34:03RudManin the root dir of the player
03:34:15asdkk
03:34:29BiptoNi see
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03:34:59LambdaCalculus37The wheel on this thing's filthy!
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03:35:01asdno folder was created
03:35:05asdafter the extraction
03:35:11asdis it hidden?
03:35:11LambdaCalculus37I have to clean the scroll barrel on the DJ for a minute.
03:35:12RudManthere shouldn't be one created
03:35:21RudManthere should be a fonts dir already
03:36:00asdyes but its inside the ./rockbox folder
03:36:02asdis that ok?
03:36:10RudManyes
03:36:12asdkk
03:36:27DavidRawsonADHDis it normal if my rockbox directory is .rockbox?
03:36:37RudManlook inside the ./rockbox/fonts and you will see all the new fonts
03:36:50DavidRawsonADHDwhy does it have to have the dot at the front?
03:37:16 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection)
03:37:27RudManor rather the /.rockbox/fonts dir
03:37:48krazykitDavidRawsonADHD, it's supposed to be .rockbox
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03:40:26DavidRawsonADHDWhy doesn't the midi plugin work? Do I need something?
03:40:41krazykityou need to read the wiki page about midi
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03:41:40LambdaCalculus37Mother of Eris... the stupid battery in the Dell DJ just went south on me.
03:42:00LambdaCalculus37One of the wires snapped out.
03:42:10asdok so the bootloader directly loaded rockbox
03:42:20asdhow cna i change it so that it gives me options on what to load?
03:42:28asdlike ipl or apple?
03:43:53LambdaCalculus37asd: You have to change the source and recompile.
03:44:52asdhow would i do that in linux?
03:44:56 Nick asd is now known as Cannoli (n=Cannoli@dsl-207-112-62-21.tor.primus.ca)
03:45:38LambdaCalculus37asd: Do you have a text editor?
03:46:13Cannoliyep
03:46:19Cannolikwrite, kate, etc
03:46:52LambdaCalculus37Actually, use Kate, since it features syntax highlighting and will suffice for this.
03:47:27LambdaCalculus37Now, we want to change the bootloader for an iPod, right?
03:48:03krazykiti thought ROLO could already do these things
03:48:14DavidRawsonADHDNot trying to be mean, but why don't you include everything that goes to the apps, such as the instruments for the midi plugin?
03:48:37krazykitDavidRawsonADHD, not everything is legally redistributable
03:48:43DavidRawsonADHDNevermind, I see.
03:48:53krazykitin fact, i don't think we know the liscense on the instruments compilation that's linked
03:49:09DavidRawsonADHDI see now...
03:50:05LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: You've got a LOT to learn about how Free Software works in general.
03:50:14LloreanNot to mention the MIDI plugin is also simply considered "incomplete"
03:50:16DavidRawsonADHDJust...sneak it in there....
03:50:26LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: NO.
03:50:29LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Never, EVER suggest infringing copyright in this channel again.
03:50:39DavidRawsonADHDSorry.
03:50:57LambdaCalculus37The GPL is a very strict line that we DO NOT cross here, on the forums, or ANYWHERE Rockbox-related.
03:51:02LloreanBut it'd also be pointless to make the download several times what it is now for a plugin that doesnt' work properly yet.
03:51:14LloreanLambdaCalculus37: It's not a GPL issue.
03:51:27LambdaCalculus37Llorean: Gotcha.
03:51:32LloreanAs they're not compiled in, much like themes and fonts, they don't need to be GPL licensed.
03:51:40LloreanThey just need to be under some license that lets us include them
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03:51:52LloreanBut even then, they'd need to go on the "Extras" page, they're far too large to include with every download
03:51:58LloreanEspecially since you only need to download them once.
03:52:03RudMandavid: next time you're in a food store, just sneak a 6 pack of beer out of the store....
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03:52:50DavidRawsonADHDSo I would just be better off cancelling the 20MB instrument patchset, right?
03:53:09LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: You can download them. We didn't say not to.
03:53:31krazykitjust don't be suprised if midi playback is poor
03:53:57eigmawhy not just transcode into an mp3 on a pc and upload the output?
03:54:10eigmait's not that big a deal, and there's not that many midis floating around
03:54:15LambdaCalculus37MIDI playback may exhibit some behavior like playing at nearly triple speed, the dreaded "Buffer Miss!" error, or very off-sounding instruments.
03:54:31Lloreaneigma: Well for one thing, midis are very much smaller than MP3s
03:54:51DavidRawsonADHDOk, then why is there even a midi player on there if it doesn't work?
03:55:04LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Because someone can finish it.
03:55:10eigmaLlorean: I can understand that argument for flash players, but even there there's at least a few hours' worth of MP3s
03:55:33DavidRawsonADHDWhat about swf players?
03:55:35Lloreaneigma: Yes but some people don't like having to hook their player up to their computer frequently to change around the music on it.
03:55:43LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Not swf, "flash" as in "flash memory"
03:56:07Lloreaneigma: By your argument, there's no reason to support anything but WAV on 80gb players.
03:56:07DavidRawsonADHDNo, I meant will SWF work on rockbox?
03:56:09eigmaLlorean: all right, sure
03:56:19LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: No.
03:56:26DavidRawsonADHDOk.
03:56:52DavidRawsonADHDIt would probably be almost impossible to make swf work, since it's all vector.
03:57:03DavidRawsonADHDAnd interaction would be hard.
03:57:08eigmahow does SWF on a monochrome 96x48 screen even make sense?
03:57:21DavidRawsonADHDColor screen.
03:57:22LambdaCalculus37eigma: Like this: It's doesn't.
03:57:32eigmaLambdaCalculus37: ahhhh, right
03:57:42LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: There are greyscale targets, you know.
03:58:01DavidRawsonADHDWhat's greyscale?
03:58:06DavidRawsonADHDBlack and white?
03:58:13iambenwhy would vector graphics be a problem?
03:58:16krazykitshades of grey...
03:58:17LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: Black and white is monochrome.
03:58:36LambdaCalculus37The Archos players can be called "black and white" if it weren't for those green backlights they feature.
03:58:40LambdaCalculus37:)
03:58:40DavidRawsonADHDiamben, it would have to draw the graphics
03:58:50Lloreaneigma: Do we have a 96x48 monochrome screen? Is there a new target I'm not aware of?
03:58:53iambenDavidRawsonADHD: yeah, so what?
03:59:00eigmaLlorean: I was exaggerating
03:59:08LambdaCalculus37iamben: Vector graphics take much more CPU power to render.
03:59:13eigmaI think my point stands, though
03:59:15Lloreaneigma: As it is, we don't have any screens restricted to monochrome
03:59:31Lloreaneigma: Even our one-bit displays can be finagled into giving I believe 33 shades of gray
03:59:46iambenLambdaCalculus37: tell that to the vectrex from 1980-something
03:59:55LambdaCalculus37Llorean: Yes, I do believe that's true.
04:00
04:00:02eigmaPWM on an LCD? impressive
04:00:10LambdaCalculus37iamben: Different type of vector graphics.
04:00:18DavidRawsonADHDWhat is the simplest device rockbox has ever been ported to?
04:00:28eigmayour face (oh burn)
04:00:36DavidRawsonADHDreally
04:00:43DavidRawsonADHDthat's pretty simple
04:00:43CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
04:00:43*Llorean sighs
04:00:59LambdaCalculus37iamben: Read all about it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_graphics
04:01:05DavidRawsonADHDhow do I install it to my face>
04:01:15LloreanLook, this is an on-topic channel
04:01:18iambenread? boooooo
04:01:41LambdaCalculus37iamben: How do you expect to learn without reading?
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04:01:50iambentv =)
04:01:56*LambdaCalculus37 sighs
04:01:59LambdaCalculus37Kids...
04:02:04maxkelleythese days.
04:02:16DavidRawsonADHDI isn't a kid!
04:02:25maxkelleywell.. what about mythbusters.. and the discovery channel... and the history channel.
04:02:40maxkelleyI learnded plenty of things from their!
04:02:42webguest96i booted ubuntu and chose start or intall ubuntu and then a baje screen came up and stayed like that. anyone know what im doing wrong
04:02:45LambdaCalculus37maxkelley: Oi. Topic. *snap snap*
04:03:00webguest96i used the livecd
04:03:04maxkelleyRight. Topic. Who wants to commit my port-critical patches?
04:03:12DavidRawsonADHDRockbox for TI calcualtors?
04:03:14maxkelleywebguest96: what color is baje?
04:03:27krazykitwebguest96, ask #ubuntu. once you get that working, come back
04:03:29maxkelleyDavidRawsonADHD: no, but a screen even smaller. c200.
04:03:33LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Rockbox is an MP3 player firmware.
04:03:46maxkelleyti calcs can play mp3's.. by a stretch.
04:03:57Lloreanmaxkelley: The smallest screen is the Jukebox Player, two rows of characters, no bitmap.
04:04:02maxkelleywow.
04:04:07Lloreanmaxkelley: Yeah, but they aren't MP3 players by design
04:04:12Lloreanmaxkelley: Yep, and we've got Tetris on it. ;)
04:04:16maxkelleyhehehehe.
04:04:17LloreanAnd a rotating 3D cube.
04:04:20maxkelleythat's fun.
04:04:31LambdaCalculus37maxkelley: And Snake.
04:04:40LloreanIt has a bank of a small number of custom characters, and they've been put to very good use
04:04:46LambdaCalculus37Llorean
04:04:50LambdaCalculus37Oops
04:04:51maxkelleyLlorean: next up, try mario :)
04:04:59DavidRawsonADHDMARIO!
04:05:05LloreanBut I think the smallest bitmap display is 112x64
04:05:23maxkelleyc200 isn't much farther away... 132x80
04:05:24LambdaCalculus37Llorean: The Archos Recorder, FM Recorder/V2, and Ondio, right?
04:05:44maxkelleyare those in production anymore?
04:05:48LloreanLambdaCalculus37: iPod Mini, I believe, too.
04:05:52DavidRawsonADHDDVD players play MP3s, and have updatable firmware.
04:06:00LambdaCalculus37Llorean: iPod mini uses 138x110.
04:06:05LloreanAh, right.
04:06:10LloreanSo just the Archoses.
04:06:24LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Rockbox is designed for things that are designed to be MP3 players.
04:06:26DavidRawsonADHDI like rusty spoons. I like to touch them.
04:06:26krazykitDavidRawsonADHD, rockbox is a replacement firmware for portable music players. not for dvd players, not for calculators, not for toasters. portable mp3 players.
04:06:38 Quit RaRe (Connection timed out)
04:06:47LambdaCalculus37I suppose someone's going to ask for a nuclear missile that runs Rockbox.
04:06:58DavidRawsonADHDFunny
04:06:59 Quit webguest96 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
04:07:00DavidRawsonADHDToasters. Funny :)
04:07:02 Quit jhulst (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:07:28DavidRawsonADHDHow about jets that run rockbox.
04:07:37LambdaCalculus37*FACEPALM*
04:07:38maxkelleyhehe... "Nuclear warfare.. cool plugin.. " "NO, THAT'S NOT A PLUG... BOOM!
04:07:46DavidRawsonADHDGo carts.
04:07:51DavidRawsonADHDDild...
04:07:52LambdaCalculus37Enough already!
04:08:03LambdaCalculus37Bloody hell!
04:08:04chrisjs169how is this on topic?
04:08:10krazykitit isn't remotely on topic.
04:08:13LloreanAlright, let's put this simply. Is anyone confused by the term "on-topic" or what it means?
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04:08:47webguest96where is the #ubuntu
04:08:48maxkelleyOn-topic = committing my rockbox patches. Channel name = #rockbox, patch target = rockbox.
04:08:52DavidRawsonADHDBush wants rockbox on his missles.
04:08:56maxkelleywebguest96: in #ubuntu, perhaps?
04:09:01eigmaLMAO
04:09:01DavidRawsonADHDOk on topic now.
04:09:01chrisjs169http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On-topic
04:09:25DavidRawsonADHDTheres a few bugs on missle rockbox though, said bush.
04:09:41LambdaCalculus37DavidRawsonADHD: No more ludicrous port ideas.
04:09:51webguest96where is that, is there a link
04:09:56LambdaCalculus37Now either get back on track or take off.
04:10:15*Llorean needs to find out if the c200's keymap is based on the e200s or the more generic Rockbox layout
04:10:24DavidRawsonADHDit is
04:10:26maxkelleylike how?
04:10:34maxkelleyit is based on the e200.
04:10:39LloreanThe key map?
04:10:44LloreanNot the physical buttons
04:10:44maxkelleyI believe that's how lowlight programmed it, yes.
04:10:47LloreanBut what each button does.
04:10:51*Llorean sighs.
04:11:02maxkelleyyes, the plugin keymap (which I made) is based on the e200.
04:11:13LloreanNot the plugin keymap, the Rockbox keymap.
04:11:17LloreanFor normal stuff, music playback
04:11:28LloreanFor example, does holding the "Select" button bring up the context menu, or does that have its own button?
04:11:36LambdaCalculus37Llorean: I could go look at it for a minute, if you'd like.
04:11:36maxkelleyyes.
04:11:43maxkelleyit brings up the context menu.
04:11:50LloreanSelect does?
04:11:58DavidRawsonADHDI think your called Milford Cubicle
04:12:01maxkelleyyes.
04:12:04LloreanAnd the button that opens the main menu, if you hold it, does it open a quick-menu?
04:12:10maxkelleyyes.
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04:12:22maxkelleywell, wait, what do you mean quick menu?
04:12:23LloreanAlright, to "Stop", do you hold down "Play/Pause" or is there as separate button that you tap for it?
04:12:31maxkelleyhold down play/pause
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04:12:34Lloreanmaxkelley: Quick menu is the "Shuffle" "Random" "File view" menu
04:12:48LloreanQuick 'screen' I guess I should say
04:13:15DavidRawsonADHDHOLY CRAP! THAT MIDI PLUGIN'S GOING CRAZY!!!
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04:13:17LloreanSounds like they're mostly the standard abstract Rockbox keymap.
04:13:19maxkelleythat's press+hold down.. like when you're playing a song, you mean?
04:13:43Lloreanmaxkelley: Should work in the filetree too.
04:14:06maxkelleymmm.
04:14:09*Llorean may have to look at the c200 keymap before too many people get used to it.
04:14:15DavidRawsonADHDdont use the midi plugin!!!!!!!
04:14:21*Llorean needs to get ahold of a c200
04:14:21DavidRawsonADHDITS GOING OUT OF CONTROL!
04:14:26LloreanDavidRawsonADHD: Shut up, please.
04:14:29krazykitDavidRawsonADHD, yes, that's what we said. please stop being disruptive
04:14:30maxkelleywhat is the point of pluginlib_actions.c
04:14:41DavidRawsonADHDit's a source file
04:14:47maxkelleyit was barely implemented in most plugins.
04:14:57LambdaCalculus37Llorean: I have access to a c240 through my brother.
04:15:04maxkelleyeach plugin had its own keymap for each player, which I had to add to each for the c200.
04:15:05LambdaCalculus37I could ask him to bring it over to me.
04:15:06chrisjs169DavidRawsonADHD, I think he means "why is that file needed?"
04:15:19maxkelleyas in, it's not implemented in any plugins
04:15:31Lloreanmaxkelley: The idea was to use the actions, where possible, but it was added later and a lot of plugins haven't been converted to it.
04:15:36DavidRawsonADHDim just going to leave.... i have no use here.....nobody wants me :(
04:15:40maxkelleysomeone should go through and implement it to all.
04:15:47maxkelleyI might be able to with some spare time.
04:15:53Llorean"someone should..." doesn't make a volunteer appear. :)
04:16:01maxkelleyI'll do it.. probably this weekend.
04:16:05LloreanIf you get the chance, I imagine it'd be welcome though
04:16:14maxkelleyalrighty.. good night, though.
04:16:18LloreanLambdaCalculus37: I'd rather sit down with one myself.
04:16:32LloreanI have a goal to try to reach a balance point between consistency with keymappings, and usability
04:16:34DavidRawsonADHDNobody here loves me....goodbye (gonna hang myself)
04:16:35LambdaCalculus37Llorean: No problem.
04:16:38LloreanThat recent Gigabeat change was part of it.
04:16:44 Quit DavidRawsonADHD ("CGI:IRC")
04:16:58chrisjs169DavidRawsonADHD - you're still off topic
04:17:03LloreanI have an outstanding patch for the e200 that I want to get someone to commit.
04:17:14krazykiti like that patch quite a lot
04:17:26LambdaCalculus37chrisjs169: At least he's out of our hair, so now we can concentrate again.
04:17:40LloreanI could commit it myself, but I don't want to commit a keymap change, saying "Mine is better than yours" and would rather someone else arbitrate.
04:17:50Cannolisrry abt tht
04:17:53Cannolimom called me away
04:18:11Cannoliso yea how can i make my bootloader so that i can choose which firmware to load up?
04:18:20chrisjs169LambdaCalculus37, agreed
04:18:33LloreanCannoli: The Rockbox bootloader already lets you choose by holding down a certain button.
04:19:08LambdaCalculus37maxkelley: Just to make sure, the c200 port doesn't have any plugins included yet, am I correct?
04:19:09Cannoliwht button is that?
04:19:52LambdaCalculus37Crap... segfault on the c200 sim.
04:20:04LloreanCannoli: I'd suggest reading the manual.
04:20:19LambdaCalculus37Entering System > Rockbox Info causes the sim to abort with segfault and a core dump.
04:20:52Mode"#rockbox +o Febs " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
04:21:01Mode"#rockbox -o Febs " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
04:21:27Cannolikk
04:24:25CannoliLlorean: ok so i read it but i know there is a way to make it so that a blue screen comes up when u tun on ur ipod and u can choose whether to load ipl, iboy, rockbox, etc
04:24:30Cannolihow can i get that to come up?
04:25:12LloreanThe Rockbox bootloader doesn't support any such menu
04:25:44Cannoliis there a boot loader that does?
04:25:54LloreanLoader2.5 from iPod Linux
04:26:05LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: You have to speak to the iPodLinux guys about Loader2.5
04:26:39Cannoliok
04:26:40Cannolity
04:26:59LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: Full words, please!
04:27:43Cannolisorry
04:27:45Cannoli:)
04:28:26LambdaCalculus37Cannoli; We do have a good amount of users who are either visually impaired or don't speak English, and may rely on screen reader software to get by.
04:28:35LambdaCalculus37Hearing something like "ty" will throw them off.
04:28:38eigmaLambdaCalculus37: apps/menus/main_menu.c:169 doesn't have IF_MV2 like all other fat_size() calls
04:28:48Cannoliah i see, never thought of it that way
04:29:04LambdaCalculus37eigma: Let me see.
04:30:43chrisjs169anyone have an Sansa handy?
04:30:57eigmaLambdaCalculus37: no; something fishy is going on; if HAVE_MULTIVOLUME is defined, that line would be the same with or without IF_MV2
04:30:59LambdaCalculus37chrisjs169: What model? e200, or c200?
04:31:18chrisjs169LambdaCalculus37, e200
04:31:24*chrisjs169 forgot about the c200
04:31:55LambdaCalculus37chrisjs169: Not until Xmas, but as for a c240... then yes. My brother's borrowing one to test Rockbox on it.
04:33:02chrisjs169LambdaCalculus37, ok
04:33:37LambdaCalculus37chrisjs169: Maybe I should get him to join up on IRC and the forums. Then he can report his findings to us!
04:33:58chrisjs169yeah
04:34:20LambdaCalculus37eigma: if (fat_isomounted(1))
04:34:37LambdaCalculus37Is that where you're looking at?
04:34:56LambdaCalculus37fat_size( 1, &size2, &free2 );
04:34:58krazykitchrisjs169, i've got an e200 handy
04:35:22LambdaCalculus37I have to step away for a moment.
04:35:41chrisjs169krazykit, can you test FS #7744 and FS #7743?
04:35:48krazykitsure
04:36:03chrisjs169I accidentally messed up the rockbox.mi4 file, so now Rockbox isn't booting, and the OF is freezing
04:37:05chrisjs169any way to disable the database refresh from recovery mode?
04:37:07eigmaLambdaCalculus37: yeah, gdb says that the "1" is being passed as a "char *size" argument; it looks like the definition of fat_size was done with HAVE_MULTIVOLUME UNdefined, but main_menu.c is being compiled with HAVE_MV defined
04:37:55LambdaCalculus37eigma: Just curious. What's your text editor of choice?
04:38:12Cannoliwhats a good wad game tahts fun to play?
04:39:14krazykitchrisjs169, can't reproduce 7744, trying the other now
04:40:15krazykitchrisjs169, 7743 does give me the panic, though
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04:40:40chrisjs169krazykit, ok, maybe 7744 is just soemthing with my sansa
04:40:49eigmaLambdaCalculus37: ummm.. Notepad2?
04:40:56chrisjs169ZOMG - the database refresh hasn't frozen!
04:41:00LambdaCalculus37eigma: XEmacs here.
04:41:18eigmaLambdaCalculus37: I don't get it.
04:41:23LambdaCalculus37Used the gdb on it... I see what you're talking about.
04:42:33krazykitoh boy, that made my gigabeat freeze, too
04:44:05LambdaCalculus37eigma: Windows? I'm only asking because I just want to know what kind of dev environment you have set up.
04:44:32Cannolithe .wad files for ipodlinux, would they work on rockbox too?
04:44:40eigmaLambdaCalculus37: yeah, I'm still a sucker for Windows GUIs.. I have my source tree shared over Samba from a Linux box sitting right next to my leg
04:44:56eigmaLambdaCalculus37: I do builds, etc, on the box
04:45:12eigmaLambdaCalculus37: I also use "grep -r" in Putty a lot.. but all editing is still in Notepad
04:45:27eigmashit, off-topic
04:45:39eigmaLambdaCalculus37: #rockbox-community?
04:45:46eigma*shoot
04:45:47LambdaCalculus37eigma: Not really. It's to ask about your development box.
04:48:41LambdaCalculus37eigma: I have XEmacs now displaying line numbers properly, so let's continue.
04:49:07eigmaok
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04:51:53LambdaCalculus37eigma: If you look above to line 166... does that look correct to you?
04:52:19eigmaLC: yeah, I think so; uisimulator/common/io.c:562 looks wrong, though
04:52:32LambdaCalculus37eigma: Opening file... stand by.
04:52:48eigmaevery other definition of fat_size has the multivolume ifdef
04:54:11LambdaCalculus37eigma: void fat_size(unsigned int* size, unsigned int* free)
04:54:30eigma./firmware/drivers/fat.c, for instance, has "void fat_size(IF_MV2(int volume,) unsigned long* size, unsigned long* free)"
04:54:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:54:42eigmaso the types are also wrong
04:55:13LambdaCalculus37eigma: Ahhh.
04:55:32eigmathough, on most machines (32-bits), that should be inconsequential
04:55:56LambdaCalculus37eigma: My machine is 32-bit.
04:56:04LambdaCalculus37eigma: Pentium 4, to be specific.
04:56:15eigmathe type difference shouldn't matter. the IF_MV2 bit should.
04:56:42LambdaCalculus37eigma: That's what has to be fixed, correct?
04:56:53eigmayeah, hold on, writing a fix
04:57:43eigmawhat's the right way to output a warning from io.?
04:57:45eigma*io.c?
04:58:16CannoliLambdaCalculus37: the themes taht are shown on rockbox themes.com are they alreayd included in rockbox?
04:58:28Cannolior do i have to download them seperatly?
04:58:54LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: We call that "priority interrupt".
04:59:03LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: You have to download them serperately.
04:59:19Cannolisorry was that not allowed?
04:59:26Cannolisorry
04:59:34LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: You don't have to poke at someone directly.
04:59:41LambdaCalculus37You can make that a general question.
04:59:41Cannolioh ok
04:59:58LambdaCalculus37I was reading some code when you did that.
05:00
05:00:01Cannolisorry about that
05:00:59LambdaCalculus37Cannoli: Please try to read the IRC guidelines.
05:01:55LambdaCalculus37eigma: Line 704 in io.c shows a listing of errors.
05:07:12LambdaCalculus37My C skills are still a bit underdeveloped, so bear with me if I may stumble from time to time.
05:08:19eigmaLC: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7752
05:08:48eigmaI'm gonna run through all the builds on the page that I showed you, to make sure I didn't break the build. will know in about an hour.
05:08:52 Quit Rick (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
05:09:36LambdaCalculus37eigma: I may be signing off within the hour. I have to go to work early tomorrow.
05:09:43LambdaCalculus37eigma: What's your forum name?
05:09:49eigmaI have never posted in the forum :)
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05:09:55LambdaCalculus37eigma: EVER?
05:09:58eigmaEVAH
05:10:11eigmamy rb.org name is Catalin Patulea, as you can see in the ticket
05:10:30LambdaCalculus37eigma: Sign up for the forums. I get more of a chance to be on the forums than on IRC.
05:10:42LambdaCalculus37Or at least e-mail me with progress or whatnot.
05:10:56LambdaCalculus37My rb.org name is Robert Menes.
05:11:02eigmaum, there's a patch that fixes it in the ticket.. I was just asking that you try to apply it and see if it works for you too
05:11:21LambdaCalculus37eigma: I can do that.
05:11:24eigmathanks
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05:17:28LambdaCalculus37eigma: Which file to patch?
05:17:38eigmajust patch from your rb directory
05:17:52eigmarockbox$ patch -p0 < path-to-the-patch.diff
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05:19:20LambdaCalculus37eigma: Patched.
05:19:29LambdaCalculus37Now compiling sim build.
05:22:38LambdaCalculus37eigma: Success!!
05:22:44eigmanice
05:22:47LambdaCalculus37eigma: We have Rockbox Info!
05:23:43LambdaCalculus37eigma: Great job!
05:23:47eigmathanks
05:25:40LambdaCalculus37eigma: Nothing else seems to have broken.
05:26:07eigmaexcellent
05:28:15LambdaCalculus37eigma: Left you a comment.
05:28:52 Quit ptw419 ()
05:29:35eigmaLC: thanks
05:31:15eigmabrb
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05:32:59LambdaCalculus37eigma: I'm going to turn in for the night.
05:33:38LambdaCalculus37But do consider signing onto the forums. I'm there more ofen than I am on IRC.
05:33:59eigmaok
05:34:21LambdaCalculus37Take care, all!
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06:00
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06:38:18`VLhello, if ther are anybody!
06:38:29eigmathere are anybodies
06:38:44`VLdoes there exist some sort of txt reader in rockbox? (iriver h340)
06:38:52eigmaI don't know
06:39:07kkurbjun'VL, there is a text viewer
06:39:31kkurbjunyou just have to select a .txt file and it will open it up
06:39:45`VLok,let`s try...
06:40:57`VLhm...works =)... bad thing is that i can see theme background behind the text
06:41:21`VLcan rockbox show lyrics while playing?
06:42:38kkurbjunI think theres a patch for that, it's not in the main build
06:42:54kkurbjunI've never used it
06:43:56`VLrockbox matured a lot since i last viewed it...i really want to stay with it
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06:49:55kkurbjun'VL on the H320 it's pretty mature
06:50:07kkurbjunno more of those battery problems
06:52:09*`VL gone. testing in progress =). think `ill make 3 levels more in doom on the way to job
06:53:09kkurbjun:)
06:54:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:54:53homielowekkurbjun: Any breakthroughs on the MR:500?
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06:55:26 Quit Cannoli ("bai!")
06:55:44kkurbjunhuh, didn't want to wait
06:55:47eigmahehe
06:55:49eigmaimpatient man
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06:55:59homielowewoops
06:56:04kkurbjunyou're back!
06:56:06kkurbjun:)
06:56:37kkurbjuneigma's helping too - I have the lcd working at the moment in the bootloader.. not much overall, but a start
06:56:44homielowemacbooks are confusing after using a windows machine for 10 years
06:57:04homielowe:)
06:57:25kkurbjunit shows "rockbox boot loader Version ..."
06:58:31homielowe\o/
06:58:43eigmahaha, I just got what what smilie means
06:58:46eigma*what that
06:59:13kkurbjun:), is this on the mrobe forums?
07:00
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07:00:47homielowehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IrcTalk "little man'
07:01:59kkurbjunI meant the rockbox port.. I'd prefer to keep it here for now till there's actually something to show, unless it's already common knowledge
07:07:30kkurbjunhomielowe, you should register with nickserv if you're not already, you can't message individuals unless you are
07:07:41kkurbjunand if you are, you should identify yourself
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07:10:07eigmaall right, I'm off; good night
07:10:19kkurbjunnight, talk to you later
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07:10:40 Quit eigma ()
07:15:05homieloweim not sure how really,(nickserv) I suggested to the people at mrobe forums to keep it on rockbox.org/#rockbox
07:17:03kkurbjun"/msg NICKSERV help"
07:17:12kkurbjunit's the register command
07:17:23kkurbjunand then you have to use the identify command
07:19:07homieloweREGISTER
07:19:30kkurbjunsorry, you need to /msg NICKSERV register
07:19:41homieloweI'm figuring this out
07:19:47kkurbjunno worries
07:21:18kkurbjunhomielowe, what irc client are you using?
07:21:27homielowechatzilla
07:21:42kkurbjunhmm, I'm not familiar with that one
07:22:22kkurbjunthis might be a good place too:http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#userregistration
07:22:36homielowethere done
07:22:57kkurbjunyep, now it's set
07:23:43kkurbjunbut I'm off to sleep for now
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07:38:50Nick_BrackleyHow would one go about creating a diff/patch of two separate directories on a linux system eg. rockbox.orig and rockbox?
07:39:15scorchedid you use svn?
07:39:21scorcheto get the source, that is
07:39:27Nick_Brackleyyes
07:40:32scorchehttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SimpleGuideToCompiling#Producing_a_diff_of_your_changes
07:41:09Nick_Brackleythank you, i tried using diff but for some reason they would never compile
07:50:58 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
07:53:17 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
07:54:25Nick_Brackleyit seems this produces the same problem
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07:55:39Nick_Brackleyheres whats happening, i apply a patch (i can then compile it and it works no problems) but when i try to make a diff and then apply it to clean source, it will not compile
07:56:46Nick_Brackleydoes anyone have any ideas/need more information?
07:57:18LinusNis the clean source newer than the patched one?
07:57:30Nick_Brackleyno they are the exact same version
07:58:02Nick_Brackley(14667)
07:59:49LinusNhow do you do the diff?
08:00
08:00:00LinusNsvn diff > file
08:00:11Nick_Brackleysvn diff > my.patch
08:00:16Nick_Brackleyyes
08:00:41LinusNand then you apply it to the fresh source with patch -p0 < my.patch
08:01:23Nick_Brackleypatch −−binary -p0 < my.patch
08:01:24LinusNcould it be that the patch you applied in the first place created some new files?
08:01:54LinusNbecause new files aren't included in svn diff unless you add them to the repo
08:02:01Nick_Brackleyno i dont believe it does
08:02:09LinusNwhich patch is it?
08:02:41Nick_Brackleya version of the recordingenhancementspack that i have modified so that it will sync
08:02:51LinusNok
08:03:22Nick_Brackleyand that patch applies ok and compiles, but i want to make a clean diff of it
08:04:14Nick_Brackleyi have also tried the command "diff -u -r rockbox.orig rockbox > rep.patch"
08:04:22Nick_Brackleywith the same result
08:04:28LinusNwhere is the original patch?
08:04:54Nick_Brackleyi move it out of the directory after i have applied it
08:05:11LinusNi mean where on the web
08:05:14Nick_Brackleyor do you mean a location to download it?
08:05:21Nick_Brackleyone second
08:06:14Nick_Brackleyits on the rockbox forums which are currently giving me a "orry, SMF was unable to connect to the database. This may be caused by the server being busy. Please try again later." error
08:06:20Nick_Brackleysorry*
08:06:47LinusNi wonder why a patch is in the forum and not in flyspray
08:06:51LinusNnever mind
08:07:14LinusNcan you show me the error message?
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08:07:54Nick_Brackleyyes, just need to get it off my build machine
08:07:55LinusNi mean the compiler error of course
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08:10:55Nick_Brackleybugger
08:11:09Nick_Brackley"/bin/sh: line 2: /home/nick/Rockbox/20070911/rockbox/build/apps/features: No such file or directory
08:11:10Nick_BrackleyCC lang.c
08:11:12Nick_Brackleycat: /home/nick/Rockbox/20070911/rockbox/build/apps/features: No such file or directory
08:11:14Nick_BrackleyCC action.c
08:11:16Nick_BrackleyCC alarm_menu.c
08:11:17Nick_BrackleyCC abrepeat.c
08:11:19Nick_BrackleyCC bookmark.c
08:11:21Nick_BrackleyIn file included from bookmark.c:37:
08:11:22Nick_Brackleyrecorder/icons.h:30:25: rockboxlogo.h: No such file or directory
08:11:23Nick_Brackleyrecorder/icons.h:32:32: remote_rockboxlogo.h: No such file or directory
08:11:25Nick_Brackleymake[1]: *** [/home/nick/Rockbox/20070911/rockbox/build/apps/bookmark.o] Error 1
08:11:26Nick_Brackleymake: *** [build] Error 2"
08:12:39scorchenext time please use a pastebin
08:13:01Nick_Brackleyno problem, sorry
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08:13:56LinusNhave you tried to reconfigure and do "make clean"?
08:14:06Nick_Brackleyyes, many times
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08:15:51LinusNeven in the source tree that works?
08:16:37Nick_Brackleyyes
08:17:11LinusNcould you use pastebin and show me the entire output from the compile?
08:17:26Nick_Brackleyyes
08:20:45Nick_Brackleyhttp://pastebin.com/m7786cf48
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08:22:26LinusNsomething goes wrong when creating the "features" file
08:23:00LinusNcan you build a simulator?
08:23:10Nick_Brackleyyes, except the patch doesn't touch that file
08:23:16Nick_Brackleyi haven't tried
08:23:42LinusNthe features file is built using the native gcc compiler
08:23:56LinusNi wonder if that could be an issue
08:24:45LinusNbtw, did you really get the fresh source using svn?
08:24:50Nick_Brackleyi don't understand what you mean, rockbox will compile on my machine, so why would this patch be breaking that?
08:25:09*GodEater predicts lack of disk space
08:25:09 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
08:25:12Nick_Brackleyyes i always use svn
08:25:21Nick_Brackley32GB free
08:25:36LinusNNick_Brackley: can i see the patch?
08:25:42 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
08:25:42Nick_Brackleyyes
08:26:00*LinusN really dislikes the new frontpage svn history
08:26:02Nick_Brackleythe original that i modified or the output of the diff?
08:26:15LinusNthe output of the diff
08:26:18Nick_Brackleyok
08:26:46amiconnLinusN: Blame Zagor...
08:27:11LinusNi'll kill him when i see him :-)
08:27:52Nick_Brackleyhttp://pastebin.com/m43ae7c80
08:29:47scorcheLinusN: i havent seen a single person who disagrees wth that sentiment
08:30:43*GodEater is somewhat surprised that all the so-called web developers we have in our forums haven't made a single response to his thread yesterday. Guess we stick to doing it ourselves after all.
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08:30:49*Llorean wonders if the recent activity page should include forum activity, since it's including mailing list.
08:30:59*GodEater 's faith in humanity dwindles even more
08:32:44LinusNNick_Brackley: weird indeed, all the @@ are gone from the patch
08:33:45LinusNthe leading ones, that is
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08:59:09fergofrogHey, I need some help with some scripting issues
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08:59:23GodEaterfergofrog: what sort of scripting ?
08:59:36fergofrogTheme scripts
08:59:48GodEaterdo you mean WPS ?
09:00
09:00:06fergofrogYes and the .cfg that sits inside the theme folder
09:01:57fergofrog...
09:03:12GodEaterare you waiting for us to have omniscient insight into both what your question is, and the answer ?
09:05:30fergofrogI have made a Theme and the .cfg that goes with it and in it i have linked to the wps with: wps: /.rockbox/wps/Coverflow.wps but for some reason it is not loading up the wps for the now playing screen.
09:07:39GodEaterthat likely means there is an error in your wps
09:07:47fergofrogOK thankyou.
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09:07:57GodEaterif you run it under the sim with "-debugwps" it might help you figure out where it's broken
09:08:07GodEaterit will tell you which line it fails to load
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09:09:36 Join DiZe [0] (n=Some_Guy@ool-182c04fe.dyn.optonline.net)
09:10:06DiZeUmm... anyone care to help me out with this "rockbox"?
09:10:37GodEaterDiZe: what help do you need? (Be aware you're required to have read the manual first...)
09:10:39B4gderthis "rockbox" ? is that like almost the real Rockbox but not quite?
09:10:53GodEaterit's a doppelgangerbox
09:11:36DiZeJust a quick question... can it play videos? I see nowhere in the menu that says VIDEOS, cuz i have an ipod video
09:12:07GodEaterDiZe: the answer to that question is in the manual, and the wiki. The short answer is "yes" though
09:12:22GodEateryou will have noticed that there is no "Music" entry in the menu either
09:12:38*B4gder recommends the fine manual
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09:12:51DiZeHmmmmm ur right, but i had to make a seperate MUSIC folder in the ROOT because it wasnt playin some music files
09:12:55DiZeThanks
09:13:03B4gderno you didn
09:13:06B4gdert have to
09:13:23B4gderyou can and it might be a good idea, but you don't _have to_
09:13:46DiZehmmmm ok
09:14:03GodEateryou sound unconvinced
09:15:03DiZeI need the loader thing... that lets you choose between different OS's, any idea where i can get that at?
09:15:24markunanother gigabeat owner won over :) http://www.mygigabeat.com/forum/messages.cfm?threadid=BC264E8B-3048-2906-EAF7CE8EC4DE8A6B
09:16:35GodEaterDiZe: again, you don't *need* it - the Rockbox bootloader does that too
09:16:35B4gderI love a good hash in the url... .-)
09:17:13DiZeohhhhh
09:18:03markunDiZe: but it has no menu so you need to press a special key (should be in the manual)
09:18:33DiZefor the bootloader?
09:20:18B4gderhey... I see there's a possibility for Rockbox on Canon cameras! ;-) => http://scratchpad.wikia.com/wiki/CHDK
09:20:29B4gderARM based
09:20:59GodEaterdoes that mean we should undelete DavidGRawson's latest post (which I found in the Trash this morning)
09:21:55markunB4gder: I wouldn't mind changing my firmware, maybe a rockbox camera fork
09:22:55advcomp2019i have a canon camera
09:23:15Nick_Brackleyforums.rockbox.org down? or just me.....
09:23:58DiZeit takes long for it to load for me Nick
09:24:08B4gderyes, it is "just" dead slow
09:24:18Nick_Brackleyok thanks
09:24:22scorche'e just restin'!
09:24:47Nick_Brackleylol
09:24:48advcomp2019it back to normal now
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09:26:21DiZe"the rockbox bootloader, once installed, allows you to choose whether you want to run Rockbox or Apple's firmware whenever you turn the ipod on."
09:26:27DiZeIt sure doesnt do that for me
09:26:31DiZei must have done something wrong
09:26:41GodEaterDiZe: it most certainly does
09:26:47GodEaterdid you read how to choose ?
09:27:48DiZeNot really, i just read how to install rockbox followed eery step
09:27:52DiZeevery*
09:28:29 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
09:28:40GodEaterwell to boot into AppleOS, just flick the hold switch to "on" as *soon* as you see the apple logo appear (before the backlight turns on even)
09:29:53DiZe!!!
09:29:55DiZeit worked!
09:30:05*DiZe Sighs of relief
09:30:07DiZeThankz!
09:30:13DiZeU guys friggin rock :|
09:30:42Nick_Brackleyand the forums are slow (again :()
09:31:03GodEaterNick_Brackley: they always are at this time of morning
09:31:07 Join scorche|ltop [0] (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
09:31:09GodEaterfor reasons we don't fully comprehend
09:31:30Nick_Brackleylol ok
09:31:36DiZeThankz GodEater, im outta here
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09:31:53GodEaterhas anyone asked Jeff "Why do the forums suck at this time?" yet ? :)
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09:36:48B4gderyeah, one of these days we will need to get this fixed
09:39:28aliaskB4gder: Jon sticks by what he said about us having a flexible license
09:40:04aliaskWould including eSpeak require us to explicitly change to GPLv3, or could we just include it without doing anything?
09:40:22B4gderif we use their gplv3 version, we need to go v3 too
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09:41:19aliaskEven if what he says is true (that we have the v2 or later option)
09:41:36B4gderyes
09:42:00B4gdersince we cannot be v2 and ship binaries with v3 in it
09:42:08JdGordonsee, now if we moved the project to russia or china we wouldnt have to deal with this silly license nonesence
09:42:09B4gderthe "or later" just allows us to easier switch to v3
09:42:27ZaphielHej how to check what is new in rockobox on the main site in "Subversion"?
09:42:37ZaphielAfter web changes
09:42:44GodEaterZaphiel: wait till we shout at Zagor to fix it back again!
09:43:14ZaphielI can't look at thing that were earlier...
09:43:23aliaskWould we consider going to v3?
09:43:33Zaphielok :D
09:43:39B4gderaliask: that's indeed up for discussion
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09:44:22ZaphielYou could going to v3 after sansa gets USB connection....
09:44:24aliaskI feel like I should keep him in the loop, so I'll post back and say that if what he says is true then we'll have to have the v3 discussion
09:44:55aliaskZaphiel: Different v3 :) GPLv3 and Rockbox V3
09:45:16ZaphielYes I just realised... sorry
09:46:23B4gderThe thing with this gpl license is
09:46:35B4gderI would like to know what people actually think about the version
09:46:38GodEaterit's a political hot potato
09:46:52B4gderdid you contribute code to the gplv2 or to gpl any version ?
09:47:17GodEaterI assume you mean Rockbox code and not just code in general ;)
09:47:21B4gderI personally had not given enough focus on one little sentence in paragraph 9
09:47:29B4gderIf the Program does not specify a version number of
09:47:29B4gderthis License, you may choose any version ever published by the Free Software
09:47:29B4gderFoundation.
09:47:40B4gder"the Program" ?
09:47:45B4gderthe license says version 2
09:47:51B4gderisn't that in the program?
09:48:18JdGordonAll files in this archive are subject to the GNU General Public License.
09:48:18JdGordon * See the file COPYING in the source tree root for full license agreement.
09:48:22JdGordonis our usual header
09:48:29B4gderyes, and the license says v2
09:48:29JdGordonso he looks correct...
09:48:38B4gderso the program says v2
09:48:42B4gderor doesn't it?
09:48:54B4gderI've interpreted it that way before
09:49:07B4gderbut now I read it with his eyes and I can see how that is far from crystal clear
09:49:27zei'd say that changing the COPYING file to something different would be some sleight-of-hand and not quite legit
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09:49:38 Part Zaphiel
09:49:41zei.e. the file as it exists in archives with the source pointing to it
09:49:47zeindicates v2
09:49:48zethus v2
09:49:57B4gderthat's my thinking too
09:50:37B4gderit's not like we say "the GPL" or similar
09:50:49B4gderwe refer to a specific file, that says v2
09:50:59zeyeah
09:52:36GodEaterbloody legalese
09:52:49zei'm not sure that the "major feature" of v3 is gonna work as intended, and whether it does or not i'm also undecided as to whether or not it'd be a good thing
09:52:59zehowever, and this probably doesn't even matter, but
09:53:35zeif there's any of my code in rockbox at this point, i wouldn't be averse to whatever version gpl it ends up needing to go with
09:53:40zewhether thats sticking with 2 or migrating to 3
09:54:22GodEaterdo we have much code in Rockbox that's (C) of people that we have no contact with anymore ?
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09:54:39B4gderI don't think it is "much", but some I bet
09:54:39aliaskProbably plenty
09:54:44GodEaterand how do we handle things like Rockboy, where at least one of the devs that we know of is actually dead ?
09:54:54aliaskHCl :(
09:54:55B4gderand we probably have a lot of (c) lines that are plain wrong
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09:54:57ze(i used to be PsycoXul btw, and my contributions were minor and ancient history by now)
09:55:25hcsGodEater: I'd assume the rights passed to a family member.
09:55:39zeoh man
09:55:40GodEaterI would too - but do any of us know any of HCl's family ?
09:55:50zeinherited free-software copyrights
09:55:57zewhat a funky thing to have to deal with
09:56:00B4gderhis father posted in the forum just after hcl passed away
09:56:01GodEateras I recall, we didn't even know he'd died till some friend of his came in to tell us
09:56:16B4gderyeah
09:56:18JdGordonwe for sure have alot of (c) lines which are wrong
09:56:25markunGodEater: I could probably contact them, but I think they have enough problems of their own
09:56:29GodEaterwrong in what way ?
09:56:34JdGordonwrong person
09:56:39B4gderand wrong years
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09:56:48GodEatermarkun: that's another issue too - do we want to bug them over something so trivial (to them) ?
09:56:49JdGordondoes the year matter?
09:56:57B4gderit does somewhat
09:57:03B4gdersince copyright is based on the year
09:57:07 Nick DarkSaboteur is now known as darksaboteur (n=chatzill@75.73.87.203.static.nsw.chariot.net.au)
09:57:12B4gderI mean, in a distant future it matters
09:58:12B4gderwhoa, I climbed 10 steps on ohloh over night
09:58:19JdGordoncongrats
09:58:32B4gderrated #27 now
09:59:07petur(10) with two stars ;)
10:00
10:01:41aliaskI think the kudo system needs working out... I'm rated higher than pondlife...
10:02:00B4gderyes, the rating is weird
10:02:14*petur corrects it by giving kudos to pondlife
10:02:38petur... his first one actually
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10:27:46JdGordonjus reading GodEater's email... dont we have well over 200 contributors?
10:27:58JdGordonisnt trying to get everosones yes a futuile effort?
10:28:21aliaskI counted 320 in CREDITS
10:28:22pondlifeWell, at least one contributor is no longer with us :(
10:28:29aliaskPlus all the groups
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10:28:51ddaltonwho?
10:28:57B4gderJdGordon: feel free to voice your opinion/take on it then ;-)
10:29:00pondlifeHCl
10:29:29JdGordonyeah, and wont going v3 cause worse problems with the codecs?
10:29:32GodEaterDo people in the "Credits" file count as copyright holders ?
10:29:34JdGordonarnt they all v2?
10:29:34webmind:(
10:29:44B4gderGodEater: not really, no
10:29:52GodEaterI didn't think so
10:30:10B4gdercopyright holders are states so in the files, or may of course claim that they should be in the files
10:30:11LloreanGodEater: They snuck me into that file long before I'd written any code.
10:30:16GodEaterme too
10:30:24B4gderbut lots of CREDITS people do not have copyrights of any files
10:30:34GodEaterI thought not
10:30:47JdGordonB4gder: oh? I thought everyone who ever contributed code was needed to change the lincese
10:30:57B4gderno, just copyright holders
10:31:01B4gder"just"
10:31:02pondlifeI don't think I do. Is it the creator of a particular file who holds copyright?
10:31:14GodEaterpondlife: should be yes
10:31:14linuxstbSo are we not accepting section 9 of the GPL?
10:31:29JdGordonthen there is the other rpoblem on when you add your name or change your name from the (c) line
10:31:40B4gderlinuxstb: I wouldn't say that it is without discsussion at least
10:31:46webmindafaik the person who wrote the code hold the copyright no ?
10:31:56B4gderwebmind: correct
10:32:09webmindso that can be multiple persons per file
10:32:12pondlifeBut the original code may well have been completely rewritten in some places.
10:32:19B4gderbut changing someone else's code doesn't change the copyright owner
10:32:59B4gderpondlife: yes, and that's of course the tricky part to detect and make so that the original author has no copyright left but instead is "taken over" by the new person
10:33:04B4gderetc
10:33:15*petur wonders why GodEater is called ʎɹq when looking at the mail archive
10:33:22pondlifeOK, If I were to split the voice stuff from playback.c into a new file (say playback_voice.c), who would I put as the (c) holder?
10:33:27GodEaterbecause the list archive isn't UTF-8
10:33:37aliaskNo lambda :(
10:33:41*B4gder whistles
10:33:55*B4gder may be the one writing some parts of hypermail...
10:34:05webmindGodEater, I've got contacts to HCl's family ?
10:34:21GodEaterwebmind: so has markun - he says not to bug them at the moment
10:34:30webmindyes, understandable
10:34:34linuxstbpondlife: Check the svn logs, and if it's not clear who did the initial implementation, use the same (C) holder as playback.c Or maybe it's an adaption of the hwcodec voice code, in which case, you could use that (C) holder.... (clear, isn't it...)
10:35:10pondlifelinuxstb: Yes, you get my point. I'd go for Slasheri in this case as he holds (c) in playback.c.
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10:35:23LloreanWhat happens if you add code to a file, though?
10:36:08pondlifeNo (c) is given for that (at the moment).
10:36:13B4gderLlorean: you can add yourself as copyright owner, if you consider the addition significant enough
10:36:22LloreanI mean, if you add a few new functions to gwps-common, completely composed of new code, but don't change any of the other ones?
10:36:24B4gderbut in general we've not done that very much
10:36:26JdGordongrepping the sources for Copyright shows a funny one...
10:36:33JdGordonCopyright(C) 2001 Apple Computer, Inc.−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−−-
10:36:34LloreanClearly the old functions belong to the old copyright holder, and the new ones to you.
10:36:59pondlifeThe per-file distinction is arbitrary and unhelpful, of course.
10:37:04LloreanSo, for Rockbox, do we have "anyone who's held copyright on a file, unless all their code has since been removed"?
10:37:04linuxstbJdGordon: ;) That's a string scramble writes into a firmware image it creates...
10:37:11JdGordonyeah
10:37:21JdGordontickles my funny bone though :p
10:37:39pondlifeI think the CREDITS file would be the best thing to use, if we should try to change anythin.
10:37:40pondlifeg
10:38:02linuxstbLlorean: IMO (reading section 9 of the GPL), we already have permission to use any version of the GPL.
10:38:13Lloreanlinuxstb: Since we didn't specify one?
10:38:20webmindwe've got code from apple ?
10:38:29webmindthat is rockbox :)
10:38:35pondlifeNope, we pretend to make code from Apple
10:38:38scorche|ltopwhat about all of the other GPLv2 items in rockbox?
10:38:40Lloreanwebmind: No, it's part of a text string added to an output file for Apple's benefit.
10:38:41webmind)
10:38:53linuxstbLlorean: Yes. Either the code doesn't specificy a version, or (all the imported GPL code) specify v2 or later.
10:38:57Lloreanscorche|ltop: Investigation so far suggests everything v2 we've incorporated was actually v2 or later.
10:39:08Lloreanlinuxstb: Well then we're fairly in the clear.
10:39:09scorche|ltophrm...
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10:40:08LloreanAssuming we leave it as is, we can distribute the binary under the v3 terms, but if someone checks out all the code and removes the espeak code, they can distribute under v2 (assuming espeak were added)?
10:40:19LloreanOr do we have to change all the notices to v3 if espeak were added?
10:41:03linuxstbWe could choose to do either. IMO the former makes sense.
10:41:27LloreanThe former is more comfortable to me, I just wasn't sure it was "clean"
10:42:18JdGordonwere we only planning on using espeak in a plugin?
10:42:21LloreanI'm not really comfortable enough with my knowledge of v3 and its ramifications to yet think it's a good idea to pin everything down to it for the future, y'know?
10:44:23pondlifeWhy add restrictions unless there's an obvious benefit?
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10:44:53pondlifeJdGordon: Maybe as a TSR plugin, but it's needed from the core, ultimately.
10:46:11linuxstbpondlife: What do you mean? (re: restrictions)
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10:50:24aliaskCould we make a TTS "codec"?
10:50:39B4gderplay text files
10:50:44LloreanSounds like a good idea.
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10:51:04LloreanBut I'm kinda a fan of allowing viewer plugins to be called from playlists anyway (when manually created)
10:51:09aliaskAnd we could just feed a string to it that we want it to voice
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10:53:55B4gderwell, codecs work somewhat differently that viewers
10:54:06B4gderwith a codec TTS we can have crossfade etc
10:54:21B4gderstart reading the book while the previous song fades out
10:54:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:54:48B4gdercan't do that with viewers
10:54:58JdGordon.. yet!
10:55:19B4gderpatch pending? ;-)
10:56:05LinusNtts should definitely be a codec imho
10:56:37LloreanFine then. I still think viewers in playlists would be nice.
10:56:45B4gder;-)
10:56:55LloreanOnly if it's a hand-written playlist, or they add the file with Insert (individually, not a folder of files)
10:56:57B4gderit would
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10:57:42ddaltonIf we can only run one plugin maybe espeak should be part of the core.
10:57:52ddaltononce it is working correctly
10:58:02Lloreanddalton: As they suggested, Codec would probably be the ideal.
11:00
11:03:14markunLlorean: too bad we can't use mbrola
11:04:45LloreanIt would be nice...
11:04:54JdGordonwell.. fsf.org sucks... I cant find any obvious links for people to ask them questions
11:06:10JdGordonlicensing@fsf.org seems to be the only relevant email...
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11:07:55GodEaterafter some work with grep, sort, cut, uniq and a bit of vi magic, I have 164 copyright holders
11:08:02GodEatersome of which are organisations
11:08:49GodEaterhttp://pastebin.ca/691613
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11:11:38 Quit newbyx86 (Connection timed out)
11:11:47DefineByteI was thinking (feel free to shoot me), has flyspray been considered to allow people to contribute to rockbox's website design?
11:12:33GodEaterDefineByte: you mean put their code there ?
11:12:37GodEatersure, I don't see why not
11:12:38DefineByteyes
11:13:02DefineBytethen, if anyone comes up with an 'improvement' they code post code their
11:13:15DefineBytethere/
11:13:47bluebrotheras far as I could see the website wasn't subject for contribution until recently.
11:14:10bluebrothersome people discussed new designs in the forums, but I never noticed someone trying to submit actual code...
11:14:42GodEaterbluebrother: no-one has either
11:14:43JdGordoni think there is a website catergory for FS
11:14:55JdGordonCSIRO?
11:15:33DefineByteonce a main design is decided on it would be nice if people could submit tweaks
11:15:42DefineBytecode-wise/
11:16:04pixelmaLlorean, maxkelley: reading the logs, I don't see a point in the pluginlibactions system - because of the great variety of controls in the existing plugins which call for different solutions depending on keypad. E.g. the generic "fire" key for Ondio is currently defined as "up" there because the first plugin to be converted to actions was bubbles - it makes sense in this plugin but not in others... :\
11:17:30Lloreanpixelma: I don't think it's going to be useful for all plugins, but if it were adapted well it could be useful for say, "All application style plugins" or some such
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11:20:05pixelmahmm... maybe there, but IMO not in the games category
11:20:19LloreanDefinitely not in the games one. :)
11:20:23LloreanFar too much variation.
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11:21:03DefineBytecould users set their own controls?
11:21:11DefineBytein a standard way/
11:21:22bluebrothernooo ...
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11:21:53DefineByteany reason? how many games /don't/ let you set controls
11:21:59preglowmy horse for a shell that doesn't always bloody get rebooted
11:22:01DefineByte?
11:22:06DefineByte:)
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11:23:32Lloreanbluebrother: I think he just meant for games.
11:23:47LloreanFor most games it doesn't really make sense (Tetris, Frozen Bubbles, Jewels) with a few limited exceptions within those games.
11:23:50DefineBytenot for apps, no
11:23:58DefineBytethat would be silly x)
11:24:22bluebrotherah.
11:24:23DefineBytei'm thiking for the more complex ones, for sure
11:24:29DefineByten/
11:24:43bluebrotherwho plays that complex games seriously anyway? ;)
11:24:53DefineByteeveryone seems to come up with a different way to play doom
11:25:14DefineBytei dunno. i only play solitaire :D
11:25:21ddaltonthere was an email on the dev list about making rockbox be under the gpl v3. Is this correct? what is the differences. Also if there is copy right issues and all the copy right holders have to be happy then what will happen with the rock boy developer's code? The email mentioned this as well.
11:25:37bluebrotherGodEater: what's SFLC?
11:25:38ddaltonsince he is no longer with us
11:25:45B4gderddalton: for the differences, see gplv3.fsf.org
11:25:51GodEaterbluebrother: ask bagder :)
11:26:00B4gderbluebrother: software freedom law center
11:26:01 Quit scorche (Connection timed out)
11:26:06bluebrotherah :)
11:26:26B4gderthey're a team of lawyers and similar, for open source/free software projects
11:28:18*GodEater laments his suddenly miserably low ohloh rank
11:28:31*ddalton will read it later.
11:28:46ddaltonso what will happen with his code?
11:29:15GodEaterddalton: we don't know
11:29:43ddaltonwho posted the orriginal question?
11:29:46B4gderhttp://www.twit.tv/floss13
11:29:58B4gderEben Moglen interview, on gplv3 and sflc etc
11:30:07GodEaterddalton: which original question ?
11:33:25ddaltonthe one on the dev list about moving to v3
11:34:04GodEaterddalton: that would be me
11:34:19ddaltonok did you see the reply?
11:34:30GodEaterI saw Daniel's yes
11:35:22ddaltonhe was talking about something like if you say under the gpl licence it is under v3 as well but let me get the whole mail hang on
11:35:36GodEaterI know exactly what he said
11:35:48B4gderddalton: we already discussed that exact topic here
11:36:00B4gderI just wanted to spell it out for everyone
11:36:09 Join seablue [0] (n=s@0x535c1344.banxx3.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk)
11:36:16B4gderand see what others have to say
11:36:57GodEaterddalton: the crux of the issue is that the current Rockbox licensing *is* open to interpretation - and so we want to know how those who have contributed already interpret it themselves
11:37:03ddaltonhe says "Our source headers do note state any specific GPL version, nor do they say "v2 or later". " so how can someone tell it under v2?
11:37:04ddaltonit is
11:37:51ddaltonand what about this quote? "If the Program does not specify a version number of this
11:37:54GodEaterbecause we say it is in our COPYING file
11:37:58LloreanOur COPYING file states that it (the copying file itself) is version 2.
11:38:03ddaltonhere is the end of it
11:38:04ddalton License, you may choose any version ever published by the Free Software Foundation."
11:38:15LloreanBut in a different section, it says that if the program itself doesn't specify, it may be distributed under any version
11:38:16GodEaterddalton: we ALL already know what the email says - you don't need to keep pasting it
11:38:30LloreanSo the question is, since we point people to the copying file, is that "The program stating it's under v2" or "The program doesn't state"
11:38:36ddaltonwhich the following quote says: The COPYING file says explicitly on line 2 that it is the GPLv2 (and for your information, this is how I've interpreted our license situation).
11:38:54B4gderddalton: what exactly are you trying to say?
11:39:19GodEaterhe seems to be keen to just keep pasting in your email Bagder ;)
11:40:12ddaltonyeah I know but what does this mean especially the line "If the Program does not specify a version number of this License, you may choose any version ever published by the Free Software
11:40:34ddaltonso could we just say "Under the gpl licence"? Or have I got this completely wrong.
11:40:46GodEaterddalton: we're trying to decide what constitutes "The Program"
11:41:08ddaltonwouldn't that be rockbox?
11:41:15ddaltonfor each target
11:41:23GodEaterddalton: does the COPYING file form part of the program or not ?
11:41:38Lloreanddalton: We're trying to figure out exactly what we've *already* said, since it seems to be a matter of debate.
11:41:40ddaltondoes it?
11:41:49GodEaterddalton: that's what I'm asking you
11:42:01wookey__:-)
11:42:04Lloreanddalton: That's the most important question. Someone needs to figure out if the COPYING file speaks for the program or not.
11:42:14ddaltonWhat is the coppying file where is it located?
11:42:21B4gderin docs/COPYING
11:42:22GodEaterddalton: it's in the source tree
11:42:35ddaltonI got it
11:42:57ddaltonwell first if we are under v2 is it still the " GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE"
11:43:11wookey__So do I understand you've been distributing rockbox under 'the gpl' (no version specified), but including a copy of GPLv2 in the sources?
11:43:18 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:43:23GodEaterwookey__: kind of :)
11:43:38GodEaterwookey__: all our source files reference COPYING as where to find the license
11:43:51wookey__GodEater: as they should
11:43:53GodEaterwookey__: but they don't specify the license version themselves, only COPYING does that
11:44:13wookey__OK. that sounds a n awful lot like 'GPL current or later' to me
11:44:19 Quit XavierGr_ (Remote closed the connection)
11:44:29B4gderyeah, I'm leaning towards that too
11:44:31ddaltonso I haven't read the page on v3 yet but what is wrong with going to v3. Don't we just want to be able to distribute the source and the compiled version of rb and be able to share code?
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11:44:36wookey__(You can only distribute v2 licence text until there is a newer one available)
11:44:37GodEaterwookey__: that's the question we're trying to find the answer to. Does everyone with a (C) in the code believe it though
11:44:46B4gderddalton: that's not what we discuss yet though
11:44:58wookey__Indeed. I see 6 repeats in your list so I make it 162 :-)
11:45:09GodEaterwookey__: yes - "uniq" let me down it seems
11:45:28zeGodEater: did you sort first?
11:45:28wookey__one of which is 'kernel developers' which could be a sticking point :-)
11:45:28zeheh
11:45:31GodEaterI spotted them after I pasted it but couldn't be bothered to fix it
11:45:31ddaltonso could we have espeak under the v3 licence and you need to download it from another site to get it installed? and the core and the rest can be under v2?
11:45:33GodEaterze: yes I did
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11:45:38zeoh ok
11:45:48GodEaterddalton: no
11:46:01GodEaterze: uniq doesn't like non-ascii chars it seems
11:46:04wookey__I'd certainly say that v3 is a good thing and unless anyone objects violently you should make moves in that direction. Sounds like you are already
11:46:09GodEaterit broke on a LOT of the swedish names :)
11:46:12Lloreanddalton: That can't work. Rockbox is linked in such a way that all the code has to be compatibly licensed, including plugins. Whoever distributed espeak would be violating the GPL.
11:46:26ddaltonok thought so is that because anything to do with rockbox needs to be under the same licence?
11:46:31wookey__It could be quite relevant as you are a great target for tivoising on some device or other
11:46:33 Quit daurnimator ("Cyas later...")
11:46:40ddaltonok you answered my question
11:46:42B4gderand why would that be bad?
11:46:47*B4gder sticks out his chin
11:46:48GodEaterwookey__: some of us feel that tivoisation isn't a bad thing
11:46:53*GodEater joins B4gder
11:46:55*Llorean doesn't mind TIVO-ising too much in Rockbox's case.
11:47:05B4gderlunch
11:47:12wookey__OK, fair enough.
11:47:12LloreanIt's not like we don't already have to figure out a way around signatures to get our code running.
11:47:26LloreanA TIVO-ised target is just a port that starts at 90% done instead of zero.
11:47:43GodEaterLlorean: what a great way of looking at it :)
11:47:55ddaltonso do we have to somehow get espeak under v2? or go to v3 our selves?
11:48:08wookey__Except if tivoisation is done properly then the user can;t update his code - isn;t that bad?
11:48:09GodEaterddalton: we could take the last version of espeak that was released under v2
11:48:11LloreanIn fact keeping Rockbox GPLv2 and encouraging TIVO-isation might work nicely. :-P
11:48:20GodEateror we can go v3 ourselves, and use their latest code
11:48:22Lloreanwookey__: If the user can't update his code, they can't install official updates either.
11:48:55ddaltonso where not interested in new features and stuff? Or would we rewrite them our selves?
11:49:01ddaltonwe
11:49:10ddaltonwe're
11:49:25wookey__Llorean: so the idea is that is manufactureres used rockbox then users could get updtaed via the manufacturer
11:49:34GodEaterddalton: we *are* interested in new features, that's why this has come up
11:49:38ddaltonso what is wrong with v3.
11:49:48GodEaterddalton: READ the differences
11:50:00ddaltonok sorry...
11:50:05peturGodEater: why did you have the REP posted to the tracker? It has to be rejected there because it exists of too many different patches...
11:50:10Lloreanwookey__: The idea is that manufacturers can use Rockbox, manufacturers have to share the code with us, we bypass the signature and let users install our version of Rockbox
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11:50:30ddaltoncould you tell me the main ones?
11:50:43Lloreanwookey__: Exactly like we overcome preventions on other players, only in this case the manufacturer gives us all the hardware drivers, so all we have to do is figure out how to load code, rather than having to do that *then* write drivers.
11:50:53GodEaterpetur: I don't see why that matters ?
11:50:53wookey__Llorean: OK. I understood 'bypassing the signature' to be non-trivial
11:50:59LloreanIt is non-trivial
11:51:02LloreanVERY non-trivial
11:51:07LloreanBut we have to do it with nearly every new port anyway
11:51:19wookey__yes, I thought it was supposed to be imporssible, but apparently not
11:51:21wookey__respect :-)
11:51:30LloreanIt's just the first step, later steps can be equally hard, but a TIVO-ised target pretty much takes care of all later steps anyway
11:51:43LloreanMany signatures are difficult-to-impossible.
11:51:57LloreanBut whether it's Rockbox or Proprietary Crap 01 behind that signature doesn't make it any more or less impossible.
11:52:07wookey__OK. so you don;t actually like signed/closed firmware but you would like widespread adoption of rockbox
11:52:12GodEaterpetur: surely the code should be kept there, as it *is* a patch, regardless of whether it's rejected or not. It's the best place for it until someone can do the work on splitting it into seperate patches.
11:52:18LloreanMeanwhile if we ever *do* get past it, having Rockbox behind it makes everything else sooooo much easier.
11:52:22GodEaterunless our policy on not posting patches in the forums has changed.
11:52:45Lloreanwookey__: Exactly. "Rockbox 100% free > Rockbox + Signature > Proprietary + Signature"
11:52:56LloreanSo I'd rather a mix of #1 and #2 than a mix of #1 and #3
11:52:57wookey__Llorean: seems a sensibile position to me, so you may want to stick with v2
11:53:06peturGodEater: the REP is a bit of a problem child, it consists of various patches from the tracker and elsewhere... ah well...
11:53:09GodEaterwookey__: ideally yes
11:53:19GodEaterpetur: well if you have a better suggestion then I'm open to it
11:53:30GodEaterbut I thought Llorean was dead against people posting patches in the forums
11:53:44LloreanREP is an exception
11:53:51LloreanI kinda silently grandfather claused it when I reorganized
11:53:59GodEaterI shall go take back what I said then
11:54:10GodEaterand apologise to the chap I made post in the tracker then
11:54:14LloreanIt irks me every time I spot it, but I don't want to cause an uproar by stuffing it in the unsupported builds section and bringing down the hammer.
11:54:29LloreanI really, really, REALLY want it in the tracker, split up into individual patches, and committed as applicable though
11:54:30LloreanBADLY
11:54:35peturyes
11:55:20peturI'm looking at REC redesign so some of it can go into the code more easily, and then it can be dropped as special case
11:55:33wookey__Personally I'd go for v3 and force manufactureres to go the whole hog if they want the benefits of rockbox, but then I've contributed zero code to this proj so far, so my opinion is of little interest :-)
11:56:07wookey__Have any manfacturers shown any interest in it yet?
11:56:18Lloreanwookey__: The problem is, if they have to go whole hog, most of them will opt out. We still are an order of magnitude more advanced, functionality wise, than just about any proprietary software, and a lot of our things are at least relatively trivial.
11:56:47aliaskwookey__: Sort of... Sandisk sent two e200s to us to work with, but nothing more
11:56:49LloreanThe fact that so few of these features (true gapless, for example) show up in proprietary software (or haven't until recently) shows that they know they can get by fine without it.
11:56:58GodEaterwookey__: sandisk did once - and then backed off again
11:56:58wookey__I suppose they get into problems with proprietary codecs they want to add
11:58:25GodEatermore to do with DRM I'd imagine
11:58:37wookey__GodEater: that's what I meant really
11:58:41DefineBytegood thing drm is dying then
11:59:05LloreanDRM wouldn't even have to be a problem if it took a page from things like public key encryption.
11:59:19wookey__DefineByte: is it? I was really hoping it would, but itunes success makes me wonder if the world is too dumb
11:59:37Lloreanwookey__: you may have noticed iTunes is beginning the slippery slope of offering DRM free music...
11:59:39GodEaterwookey__: did you not notice iTunes start selling non-DRM tracks ?
11:59:40DefineBytea lot of record labels seem to be testing the drm-free waters
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11:59:55GodEaterwookey__: or have you been buried in sand for the last year ? :)
11:59:58wookey__I didn;t no, I';ve never used it :-)
12:00
12:00:10DefineBytenor have i but i know :)
12:00:21wookey__I'm now to this whole 'music on the computer thing', having owned a player for exactly 3 days
12:00:34wookey__new
12:00:36GodEaterhow on earth did you end up in here so fast then ?
12:00:46DefineBytegood work man.
12:01:14wookey__I only buy kit that can be free-softwared
12:01:20*petur needed almost half a year to discover rockbox
12:01:29wookey__so I knew I wanted rockbox and chose a player accordingly
12:01:35wookey__(with some great helpfrom this channel)
12:01:47*GodEater needed much longer than that
12:02:10wookey__Sadly, not everyone thinks that way yet :-)
12:02:16DefineBytei've only ever owned a rockbox DAP but it took me a while to find out it existed
12:03:04*Llorean accidentally bought his DAP specifically for Rockbox
12:03:27LloreanI read two articles the same day, one on Rockbox for the Archoses, and one on the iRiver iHP-100 series. When I was at the store, the two merged in my mind.
12:03:40LloreanRockbox on the H100 didn't happen for some time though, so I re-discovered Rockbox a while later.
12:04:35DefineBytei hung off buying a DAP because none of them did what I wanted then 'ooo, Rockbox looks neat'.
12:04:41wookey__thanx for filling me in on your licencing thoughts - it's an area that interest me. I must go an ddo some work today...
12:04:54 Join linuxstb [0] (i=d556da1b@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
12:05:34markunlinuxstb: could this be your code? http://lists.mplayerhq.hu/pipermail/ffmpeg-devel/2007-September/035230.html
12:05:52markunif so, I wonder if you are still the copyright holder
12:08:27linuxstbI noticed a very early version of that patch had removed my (C)... I'll need to check this patch.
12:09:56 Quit phalax ("Bye... Folding.")
12:10:17linuxstbWell, it now says " * Copyright (c) 2007 Benjamin Zores <ben@geexbox.org> based upon libdemac from Dave Chapman."
12:11:32 Quit barrywardell ()
12:11:33GodEatercheeky moneky
12:11:35GodEaterer
12:11:36GodEatermonkey
12:11:39GodEaterand pun intended too
12:11:41GodEater:)
12:12:31linuxstbAnd it's not just me - the range coding code is taken from another (GPL'd) implementation, and the (C) holder in that code has been wiped completely....
12:14:42GodEatersue sue sue
12:15:45linuxstbWell, a polite email will probably do....
12:18:38GodEaterput my (C) back in or I'll hunt you down like a dog
12:19:57bluebrotherwas the original code LGPL? at least ape.c is LGPL ...
12:20:00*JdGordon back
12:20:05JdGordondid i miss anything non gpl related?
12:20:34linuxstbbluebrother: No...
12:21:01bluebrotherI don't think GPL allows to relicense using LGPL, does it?
12:21:18linuxstbDefinitely not.
12:21:51bluebrotherso this looks like more than simply a stripped (c) to me :/
12:22:47JdGordonanyone fancy making a script to go through the svn log and find every change to the (c) notices?
12:23:28peturall these different copyrights are the death of open source - they hinder moving forward at the same pace as closed source
12:24:12linuxstbpetur: It's inevitable - different people have different views of what open source means, so they choose different licenses....
12:24:44peturit's a big mess, that's what it is
12:24:44bluebrotherif those people would at least respect the license of other projects ... :(
12:24:56bluebrotherit is.
12:25:03bluebrotherbut it could be worse ;-)
12:25:35JdGordonlinuxstb: (if you can remeber) can you tell me the just of sansapatcher? what it does at the higher level?
12:25:48*bluebrother out for lunch
12:26:32 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
12:26:48 Join linuxstb [0] (i=d556da1b@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
12:27:00JdGordonyou didnt have to quit if you didnt want to answer :p
12:27:46scorche`linuxstb: PM
12:27:59 Nick scorche` is now known as scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
12:28:36linuxstbJdGordon: An accidental ALT+LEFT in cgi::irc disconnected me...
12:29:06JdGordonsure... sure :D
12:29:20maxkelleyi can't stand web irc clients.
12:29:34maxkelleyconsole only, thank you :)
12:30:07*petur is so happy he found out he could use port 8000 and go through the firewall at work
12:30:18linuxstbsansapatcher modifies the firmware partition. The firmware partition contains two images - a bootloader (which we don't touch), and the main firmware image (mi4 format). sansapatcher moves the main firmware image further down the firmware partition (so the RB bootloader can load it), and inserts the RB bootloader mi4 image in its place.
12:30:25JdGordonlinuxstb: how much of sansapatcher do you think would be able to be copied stright into e200rpatcher? is it just the io files which need reimlementing? (and the UI of course)
12:30:47pondliferasher: Do you think we should delete all of the outdated Windows section from http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/VoiceBuilding perhaps? I can't see this being resurrected now.
12:31:05pondlifeIt would still be in the wiki history, of course.
12:32:18linuxstbJdGordon: sansapatcher.c should be easy to port into your app - just replace the open/seek/read/write calls to ata_read_sectors and ata_write_sectors.
12:33:07JdGordonlinuxstb: is the encryption stuff needed?
12:33:09 Join SZGY [0] (n=b-cas@adsl-5984027e.monradsl.monornet.hu)
12:33:21linuxstbJdGordon: Start by looking at main.c, and what functions that needs for the "add bootloader" function, and then copy/modify those functions from sansapatcher.c
12:33:24SZGYHi
12:33:32pixelmabluebrother: got a manual question - I picked up work on the split editor chapter again and want to have a screenshot with a arrows and text layer above (similar to the player's drawings). The only way to do this is to use the "includegraphics" macro and try out until I find the right size or can you think of a more elegant way?
12:33:56maxkelleypixelma: my patches are on flyspray.
12:34:03maxkelleylemme get you the number, one sec.
12:34:17linuxstbJdGordon: I'm not sure. IIRC, sansapatcher decrypts the main firmware mi4 as it moves it, but I don't think that's required - the RB bootloader can also decrypt. But making sansapatcher do it would be preferable, to speed up booting.
12:34:34pixelmabluebrother: well, "above" in the sense of an overlay...
12:35:25JdGordonlinuxstb: ok ta, my idiot friends are making me watch the soccer, so ill work on my laptop (no netwrok :( ) but ill be back with more questions eventually :)
12:35:50maxkelleypixelma: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7749?pagenum=32 (look at the comments for the full patch)
12:36:19SZGYI'd like to ask a small question about the Sansa e200 series. About the FM radio, namely.
12:36:45maxkelleyDon't ask to ask, just ask :)
12:36:57SZGYWith rockbox, is it possible to tune into stations that have even decimals?
12:37:49maxkelleyI'm off to school, cheers.
12:37:51GodEaterSZGY: just ask
12:37:56pixelmamaxkelley: ok, will look into it and probably go on step by step
12:37:57 Quit ddalton ("leaving")
12:37:59GodEateroops
12:37:59markunGodEater: he asked :)
12:38:01 Join ddalton [0] (n=daniel@203-214-50-20.dyn.iinet.net.au)
12:38:06SZGYhmm, this question may not be entirely correct... lemme give you an example instead.. for example, is it possible to tune to 96.4MHz?
12:38:07GodEaterscroll buffer's fault :(
12:38:10maxkelleypixelma: thanks :)
12:38:20ddaltonyes it should be
12:38:24pondlifeSZGY: Yes, should be. I don't know the Sansa though
12:38:35maxkelleyoop, actually, I got ready 20 minutes before I should have been.
12:38:42pondlifeMost stations (here) are not on exact MHz boundaries ;)
12:38:58ddalton101.9 works here.
12:38:59maxkelleypixelma: are you familiar with which graphics you have to tweak at all?
12:39:03ddaltonif that helps
12:39:16SZGYThe FM enabled Sansa is not available in Europe. I suspect it's because US stations always have an odd number after the decimal point.
12:39:40pixelmamaxkelley: it can take a while to adapt all - I think I'll find out in the sim
12:39:59maxkelleypixelma: I have a list of ones that need tweaking, if you'd like.
12:40:09B4gderSZGY: wrong, there are FM-enabled sansa in europe
12:40:14B4gdersansas
12:40:26B4gderas was even recently discussed on the rockbox users list
12:40:41SZGYreally? I thought the official page said "not available in Europe"
12:41:03B4gderstores in europe sell them, that's all I know
12:41:48SZGYwell, yeah.. they sell them here too, but those are probably grey imports
12:42:14B4gderperhaps, but that doesn't change the fact that they are available and sold
12:42:14SZGYI'd only like to know whether it's worth spending the extra money on.
12:42:20pixelmamaxkelley: if you don't excluded them in SOURCES, I will probably see when compiling fails...
12:42:34pixelmaer... didn't exclude
12:42:57SZGYif the tuner hardware cannot be programmed to tune into stations that end in even numbers then it's not really useful...
12:43:12GodEaterSZGY: amazon.co.uk sells the radio version - I doubt that's a grey import very much indeed
12:43:30B4gderit can tune in to even numbers in Rockbox at least
12:43:37maxkelleypixelma: I actually included lines for the c200 in sources :)
12:43:46SZGYah thanks, that's all I wanted to know :)
12:43:51LloreanSZGY: On my Sansa it allows .05 frequency adjustments
12:43:53maxkelleythey all compile, it's just a matter of which actually work on the screen :)
12:44:04SZGYLlorean: ah cool
12:44:24maxkelleyok, school.. bbl.
12:44:32SZGYI'll get the radio version then I guess
12:47:44DefineBytecan the radio in Rockbox auto-tune?
12:49:15LloreanDefineByte: We can scan frequencies, but how well that works varies from player to player I believe
12:49:52DefineBytethanks. the sansa is getting very tempting to me.
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12:54:42JdGordonhey barrywardell
12:54:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:54:47JdGordonyour on osx right?
12:54:48barrywardellhey
12:54:52barrywardellyes
12:54:57barrywardellintel osx
12:55:04JdGordondo you know if libusb works fine on it?
12:55:23JdGordon.. or would you be able to test the e200rpatcher with your sansa and make sure it works?
12:55:28barrywardellI think so. I've used e200tool before
12:55:34barrywardellI'll test it, sure
12:55:38barrywardellinstructions?
12:55:47JdGordonits a bit of a pita to do
12:56:35JdGordoncompile for the e200, but instead of bootloader, do Installer, then copy the bootloader/bootloader.bin into rbuitl/e200rpatcher and run make there
12:56:37barrywardellthat's ok, i have some spare time now
12:56:52DefineByteAs a test i modified english.lang to display 'Show Metadata' instead of 'Show ID3 Info' I run the sim and when I play a music file I get an error saying _temp_codec0.dll is not a valid Windows image. Any ideas?
12:57:00JdGordonthen put the sansa in manufac mode and run e200rpatcher
12:57:20JdGordonit wont write anything to the sansa unless you have the r firmware om
12:57:26barrywardellcompile for e200, not e200r?
12:57:56JdGordoneither, doesnt matter
12:57:57 Quit ddalton ("leaving")
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12:58:07ddaltondid it say that before?
12:58:24LloreanDefineByte: Did you install with "make install" or did you try extracting a build for a player?
12:58:37barrywardellok, not didn't see that before
12:58:40DefineByteextracting
12:59:12ddaltonwhat is the error again?
12:59:27barrywardellhmmm. compiling fails
12:59:38barrywardelllibusb isn't installed on my mac
12:59:50barrywardellI think I had to use darwinports to install it last time
13:00
13:01:13Buscheljdgordon: just saw you're online. regarding the scroll-acceleration for iPODs: are there any iPODs wihch do not use button-wheelclick?
13:01:22DefineByte'the application or DLL c:rockbox\devbla...\archos\_temp_codec0.dll is not a valid Windows image. please check this against your installation diskette (diskette? chuckles))
13:01:25linuxstbbarrywardell: Could libusb be linked statically with e200rpatcher on the Mac?
13:01:34JdGordonBuschel: yeah, dunno which though
13:01:41*JdGordon will be back later
13:01:53LloreanDefineByte: Extracting can't work.
13:01:54barrywardelllinuxstb: I'll try. I've just installed it now...
13:01:55DefineBytethat should be c:\rockbox, obviously
13:02:07LloreanDefineByte: The binaries are compiled for the player, you can't use them in windows. You ahve to compile a windows sim.
13:02:28DefineByteoh, thanks. >.<
13:03:08amiconnBuschel: yes. button-clickwheel is used by 4th gen (greyscale & colour), mini 2nd gen, nano and video
13:03:35amiconnmini 1st gen has its own driver, and 1st..3rd gen also have a different driver
13:05:44*amiconn needed a full year until he discovered rockbox - for his 1st dap
13:06:01DefineBytethe pain
13:06:35*B4gder was involved in the project that later became Rockbox for months before he got a DAP...
13:06:36Buschelamiconn: so I shall not enable it for config-ipod1g2g, -ipod3g and -ipodmini. all other are valid?
13:07:10amiconnAll others are valid, yes. I'd want to see it implemented for all ipods though if it works well
13:07:23*Buschel bought an iPOD just for rockboxing it to have mpc-playback :o)
13:07:25linuxstbbarrywardell: This mailing list thread shows someone successfully statically linking libusb - http://lists.apple.com/archives/Unix-porting/2004/Aug/msg00031.html
13:07:48amiconnThe other 10 targets I got espcially for rockbox hacking...
13:08:09Buschelamiconn: at least it works fine on video and nano
13:08:43DefineByteI got a DAP only because Rockbox supported crossfeed and ReplayGain.
13:09:05preglowcrossfade, you mean?
13:09:21amiconnHehe, 2 features I don't use at all
13:09:38DefineByteno, crossfeed
13:09:41barrywardellJdGordon: here's the result: http://pastebin.ca/691748
13:09:50B4gderI got involved because the hitmen said they'd break my knee caps if I didn't
13:09:55preglowi almost never use crossfeed either, and i bloody coded it
13:10:04DefineByte^^
13:10:05markunpreglow: I use it all the time :)
13:10:17DefineBytei find a lot of tracks unlistenable without it
13:10:19markunactually I could use it in mpegplayer as well
13:10:20preglowi don't listen to too much music that would benefit from it these days
13:10:22barrywardelllinuxstb: thanks.
13:10:28preglowthat'll turn around soon anyway
13:10:28markunDefineByte: same here
13:10:52preglowreplaygain i've almost never used
13:11:10markunI use replaygain for all my music
13:11:11preglowmy reason for going rockbox at all was because of codecs and gapless playback
13:11:21preglowbut rockbox didn't even work on h120 when i joined in...
13:11:35preglowoh, and being able to code dsp stuff :>
13:11:49DefineByteah, I forgot gapless. yeah, that's essential too
13:12:06*B4gder recalls the mails on the mailing list saying we couldn't port rockbox to swcodec because of how it works...
13:12:13barrywardelllinuxstb: does my result look ok? it doesn't seem good to me
13:12:20markunI remember how HCl was the first one after LinusN to try the rockbox bootloader for the H120 :)
13:12:24scorcheanyone who has ever used the archos OF knows why i would go to rockbox...
13:12:29B4gderhehe
13:12:33B4gdera dying breed that
13:13:15*webmind started with rockbox because he had an archos
13:13:23markuntoday I read about someone loving his Gigabeat, but without rockbox because it was too ugly :)
13:13:31preglowi was somewhere from the second to the fourth in line with flashing
13:13:35webmindI might have actually bought the archos because of rockbox, I know I did with my ipod nano
13:14:08*Llorean can't imagine valuing "pretty" so much as to stick with the Gigabeat firmware for it.
13:15:10scorchesadly, my dad still prefers the archos OF...
13:15:30markunLlorean: indeed, crazy people..
13:16:38amiconnscorche: weird.
13:16:45markunLlorean: maybe we should add blinking dots to the WPS screen to make him happy
13:17:56scorcheamiconn: i brought his reasoning up before...with large, unorganized folders of music, it seems it takes in excess of 2-3 seconds between songs (it is likely the disk just spinning up), but the OF doesnt seem to do that, so he stays with that
13:17:59JdGordonbarrywardell: nuts, I guess the sansa didnt start the uploaded app also?
13:18:11scorchethat is, skipping songs
13:18:41DefineBytethe wps already has blinking dots
13:19:04DefineByteoptionally/
13:19:15amiconnSkipping songs does definitely have a delay in the OF as well.
13:19:25amiconn...because of the spinup
13:19:54Lloreanamiconn: Maybe the OF reserves some buffer for the start of the next song, even if the current doesn't fit the buffer?
13:19:56amiconnAnd the OF is sooo ciumbersome to use I'd never go back. Adjusting volume needs a dozes clicks through the menu...
13:20:03*Llorean has never used it.
13:20:04scorchehe has shown me, and it seems to be much less...hold on...i think i have his device right here
13:20:10scorcheamiconn: aye, but that is us...not him
13:20:20amiconnLlorean: Reserve extra buffer from a total of 2MB?? Certainly not
13:20:33amiconnOF doesn't even have proper resume
13:20:40Lloreanamiconn: 3-5 seconds of audio can't take up too much, and OFs have done crazier things.
13:20:55*Llorean cries at how often his disk spins on the Gigabeat S.
13:21:14LloreanI'm beginning to think I can't look in its direction without triggering a spinup for something.
13:21:47GodEateryour S arrived already ?
13:22:16LloreanYeah, got it a while ago
13:22:51amiconnLlorean: That would be 70..120KB with typical 192kpbs mp3.
13:23:38amiconnAnd the OF runs from ram
13:23:52linuxstbbarrywardell: Were you root?
13:23:57B4gderI remember people doing measurements on how often the archos OF spins up, and thus an estimated ram buffer size
13:23:57 Quit safetydan ("Ex-Chat")
13:24:06B4gderbut I can't remember any numbers
13:25:14GodEaterLlorean: and what do you think of it besides the disk spinning up too often ? :)
13:26:18barrywardellJdGordon: how can I tell? nothing appears on my sansa's lcd
13:26:18scorcheLlorean: does it lag on menu transitions a bit?...i seem to remember aliask's doing that before i sent it to him
13:26:21LloreanThe controls are somewhat... difficult
13:26:31Lloreanscorche: At times, I think it coincides with a spinup
13:26:33*Llorean will brb
13:27:54linuxstbbarrywardell: Also, you could add some debugging info to the while() loop to see how much (if any) data gets transferred.
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13:29:29JdGordonbarrywardell: then nothing happened, at least you got further than windows
13:29:32SZGYwell, thank you for your help.. see ya later
13:30:17 Quit SZGY ()
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13:38:11tictocthe music folder occasionally disappears
13:38:38tictocit goes hidden, i mean
13:39:18Lloreantictoc: If you're on a Sansa, the original firmware does this when you boot it
13:39:54tictoci am on the sansa, thanks for the info
13:40:58B4gderso just rename it and stop using the OF ;-)
13:41:24tictocsweet
13:42:35linuxstbbarrywardell_: Did you see my questions?
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14:00
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14:15:30bluebrotherpixelma: a way to do such kind of overlay would be to create a tricks file −− check xfig's export options
14:16:01bluebrotherbut I haven't worked with that myself so my knowledge is limited. I know it's possible −− you enter the text as "special" in xfig and export to two files
14:16:10bluebrotherand then the text itself gets rendered by latex
14:24:35pixelmahmm... not sure if this is what I'm looking for, will google around a bit.
14:25:12Buschelhmm how to get an "" displayed via .lang-file?
14:25:54B4gderutf8-encoded
14:27:26Buschelok, got it
14:31:54pixelmabluebrother: basically it should just be a screenshot with lines and text at the side like in the player's drawings
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14:53:52GodEaterBuschel: has your patch for the ipod scrollwheel got much more that needs doing to it ?
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14:54:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:55:45GodEaterFebs, I commented on that silly NeoGeo emu request again
14:56:16idnarNeo Geo emulator? bwahahaha
14:56:38B4gderyeah, ain't that something? ;-)
14:57:10*petur wonders how long before the first xbox or PS emu request comes in
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14:57:18B4gderwii!
14:57:45hcsSomeone needs to yell "WE DINNAE HAVE THE POWER!"
14:58:07B4gderhcs: and the response then is... "but I hear the ipod has TWO CPUS!!!!1!!!" ;-)
14:58:15GodEaterhcs: I already did - apparently the ipod is more than powerful enough
14:58:32B4gderand then some mumbo about neogeo running on a 12mhz 68000
14:58:38*linuxstb mentions the gigabeats...
14:58:50GodEaterlinuxstb: probably still not up to it
14:58:51B4gder"display 4,096 colors and 380 individual sprites onscreen simultaneously, while the onboard Yamaha 2610 sound chip gave the system 15 channels of sound with seven channels reserved specifically for digital sound effects."
14:59:07B4gdergigabeat that
14:59:16GodEaterthe code which came with the feature request is for the PSP - which iiuc is still faster than a gigabeat
14:59:27gammywait what.
14:59:29GodEaterperhaps the gigabeat S
14:59:29hcsGodEater: oh, with the accent and everything?
14:59:39GodEaterhcs: damn! that's what I failed to do!
14:59:44gammyGodEater: rockbox? psp? Hurr?
14:59:52LloreanGodEater: No, the PSP is a mere 333, only barely faster (not counting being engineered for gaming)
15:00
15:00:11GodEaterLlorean: faster is still faster :)
15:00:15LloreanYeah
15:00:18GodEatereven if only by 33Mhz
15:00:25GodEaterplus it has enough buttons
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15:00:30*jbit wonders when MHz measured performance
15:00:31GodEaterwhich the iPod REALLY doesn't
15:00:33LloreanBut honestly, I get the impression a lot of PSP "apps" don't see too much in the way of hardcore optimization.
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15:00:46gammyThey don't.
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15:01:00gammyMost programs are just pieces of code cut and pasted from examples.
15:01:04Lloreanjbit: When it's the only basis of comparison you have without actual benchmarks.
15:01:24GodEaterI don't even know what the PSP's architecture is
15:01:32jbitLlorean: even then it's still rubbish :)
15:01:39jbitit's a mips64 complete with fpu and vfpu
15:01:40LloreanA voice in my head is saying the PSP is ARM.
15:01:44GodEaterjbit: you have a better comparison ?
15:01:45gammyMIPS R4000 I think
15:01:52GodEaterI had a feeling it was MIPS too
15:02:04LloreanAlright then
15:02:04markungammy: copy&paste rules :)
15:02:22gammymarkun: Heh
15:02:33gammyIt's very hard to contact PSP devvers
15:02:34B4gder"32-bit MIPS32 R4k-based CPU, a Floating Point Unit, and a Vector Floating Point Unit."
15:02:34jbitGodEater: getting offtopic ish, but if i don't have an accurate comparison i wouldn't make statements like "only barely faster"
15:02:37jbit:)
15:02:42gammymost "authors" don't know what they've done.
15:02:57gammyand the forums are just flooded with 12-year olds who want free games.
15:03:06GodEatergigabeat? fpu ?
15:03:11B4gder"Additionally, there is a processor block known as "Media Engine" that contains another 32-bit MIPS32 R4k-base CPU, hardware for multimedia decoding (such as H.264), "
15:03:23B4gdersounds like a good machine to emulate...
15:03:28B4gder*g*
15:03:37B4gder(quotes from wikipedia btw)
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15:03:47GodEaterB4gder: yeah, why emulate a NeoGeo, why not just emulate a PSP ? :)
15:04:01LloreanThen once the PSP is emulated, we can just run all those emulators it's already got
15:04:04GodEaterbecause then someone's already written the NeoGeo emulator
15:04:05GodEater:)
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15:04:11GodEaterLlorean beat me to it!
15:05:31*GodEater can't possibly understand how brarei managed to get banned in the iPL forums
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15:09:59markunGodEater: who's that?
15:10:26 Quit hcs ("Leaving.")
15:11:39GodEaterthe guy who keeps telling us in both feature requests, and in the forums, about how powerful the iPod is, and how it's suitable for all sorts of things we tell him it isn't suited for
15:11:58GodEatersee the NeoGeo discussion above
15:13:40GodEaterhe's also fairly rude
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15:17:13*amiconn doesn't really understand what's so silly about a neogeo emulator request
15:18:29GodEateramiconn: the controls for a start ?
15:18:42GodEaterfour directions plus four action buttons
15:19:14linuxstbThe Gigabeat F has that, and the S has even more buttons...
15:19:32amiconnIrivers also have that
15:19:46GodEaterthe request was for an ipod though
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15:20:57LloreanThe request was specific about it being for the iPod 5G.
15:21:10LloreanThe Gigabeat has more buttons than nearly any game system if you include the remote.
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15:21:24B4gdereither way, I doubt neogeo can be emulated nicely on any of the targets
15:21:51B4gderthere are three cpus, and an advanced graphic chipset
15:23:43*Febs wonders why so many people focuses on porting games to the iPod rather than porting Rockbox to a game system.
15:24:07B4gderbecause these guys are talkers
15:24:20B4gderthey don't do, they just talk about what others can do
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15:36:55amiconnB4gder: I'd say it depends. In fact I would think uae could be ported to rockbox, and it has similar requirements as the neogeo
15:37:11amiconn(for emulating an A500, that is)
15:38:24 Nick newby is now known as newbyx86 (n=newby@ip68-7-12-123.sd.sd.cox.net)
15:41:20linuxstbamiconn: On which targets?
15:42:10amiconnColdfire targets and gigabeat
15:45:08barrywardelllinuxstb, JdGordon: sorry. got distracted by real life
15:45:15JdGordonhey
15:45:20barrywardellI added debug printf's
15:45:21JdGordongood timing, just got back from the casino
15:45:25barrywardellbut now it works!
15:45:31barrywardellupload complete
15:45:39JdGordondoes the sansa do anything though?
15:45:44barrywardellyup
15:45:47JdGordonawesome
15:45:55barrywardellUnknown bootloader... aborted
15:46:03JdGordongood :)
15:46:11JdGordon.. unless youve got the r firmware on it
15:46:18barrywardellnope, regular e200
15:46:31linuxstbDoes it work if you remove the debugs?
15:46:39barrywardelli'll try now
15:47:11barrywardellyes
15:47:26barrywardellI think I might just have not waited long enough for manufacturing mode to start
15:52:16 Quit CaptainSquid ("Miranda IM!")
15:52:50JdGordonok cool... so we just need someone with a clue and windows :p
15:53:07*JdGordon prods amiconn to please please make a statr on viewports...
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15:55:59linuxstbbarrywardell: Did you compile statically?
15:56:13barrywardellno, I'm trying to figure out how to do that now...
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16:00
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16:13:41JdGordonfor anyone that cares... I probably wont be around untill saturday night my time, so if someone feels inclinded to porting the sansapatcher to something the installer can run feel free :)
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16:15:20fdxHi
16:16:55fdxcan i apply rockbox to my s1mp4 (iPod clone)?
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16:17:13JdGordonis it listed on the frontpage?
16:17:21GodEaterfdx - no you can't
16:17:50fdxhmm
16:18:14fdxbut it's a target, isn't it?
16:18:18GodEaterno it's not
16:18:27GodEaterfdx: http://www.s1mp3.org/en/ <−− this might be of interest
16:18:34fdxok
16:18:35fdxthx
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16:19:42GodEaterfdx: out of interest, what makes you think it's a target we support ?
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16:22:43fdxGodEater: Sorry, I don't understand, because I'm German. I thought that s1mp3 is a target because the firmware is easily to hack or edit.
16:23:45B4gderfdx: easy yes, fun no
16:23:56fdxwhy?
16:24:18B4gderunderpowered, weird architecture with little memory
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16:24:33B4gderand no gcc
16:24:35GodEaterB4gder: sounds like something amiconn would like then :)
16:24:46GodEaterah - though the lack of gcc is big minus
16:25:51fdxB4gder: that's right. i saw the informations of hardware
16:26:24fdxhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S1_MP3_Player
16:26:35B4gderyeps, this is not a new topic for us
16:26:55pondlifeGodEater: What did you do to upset Ohloh? http://www.ohloh.net/kudo_ranks?h=8066 is rather scary.
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16:27:49GodEaterpondlife: I think it's because I'm not a commiter
16:27:54GodEaterthis is the theory anyway
16:28:03ashridahhey. the sansa sandisk player that's mentioned on http://www.zazz.com.au/ is the e250. how related is that to the e200 that rockbox supports?
16:28:13pondlifeGodEater: Looks like a bug to me...
16:28:21GodEaterpondlife: perhaps
16:28:34GodEaterashridah: e250 is an e200 series, so yes, it's rockboxable
16:28:47ashridahhm. might order myself one
16:28:49pondlifeMoving down 51556 places in one day...
16:28:54fdxat least my firmware looks like iPod firmware
16:29:03ashridahjust not sure if it'll arrive in time for me to fly out to america :S
16:29:16GodEaterpondlife: I just need to convince B4gder to give me commit access - do some work on the manuals, and I'll get it all back again. I'm convinced ;)
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16:31:13fdxcya
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16:32:18JdGordonbed time, cya in a few days
16:32:23 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
16:33:20GodEater<fdx> at least my firmware looks like iPod firmware <−− was this supposed to upset us, or was he just stating a fact ?
16:33:52GodEaterpondlife: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/lincolnshire/6988927.stm
16:34:06ashridahGodEater: it sounds patent infringing
16:34:35GodEaterashridah: like companies in china care...
16:37:21pondlifeMmm, Little Chef...
16:41:19 Quit B4gder ("It is time to say MOOO")
16:41:35ashridahpersonally, i don't really see what's so great about ipod's appearance. the only thing it has going for it are nice fonts. the rest is pretty crappy
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16:48:16fdx<GodEater> <fdx> at least my firmware looks like iPod firmware <−− was this supposed to upset us, or was he just stating a fact ? <<=== I don't want to upset you.
16:48:59fdxI like the style of iPod
16:50:53BuscheljhMikeS: you're here?
16:51:51 Quit fdx ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
16:52:51jhMikeSyeah. are you going to be around? I have to go pick up a cabinet and should be back in an hour or two.
16:54:29Buschelgood. I'll be there. Just a short idea ragrding your last post: The accumulators are nullified after timeout. So, changing context will lead to nullification of summed up wheelticks. Either we could just nullify the ticks on all other button events.
16:54:42*linuxstb wonders what fdx meant by "my firmware".
16:54:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:55:44ashridahah well
16:55:58ashridahif any rockbox people in/near australia wants a sansa e250. i suggest they hit up zazz now
16:56:00barrywardelllinuxstb: hmm. it looks like it's not possible/easy to statically link:http://developer.apple.com/qa/qa2001/qa1118.html
16:56:20ashridahshipping outside australia is likely towind up more expensive than retail tho
16:57:25linuxstbbarrywardell: But that shouldn't stop linking statically with a non-Apple library?
16:58:04linuxstbbarrywardell: BTW, do you know a command similar to the Linux ldd to find all libraries required by an executable?
16:58:34barrywardellyeah, there must be a way
16:58:46barrywardellotool -L appname
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16:59:13linuxstbWhich version of libusb are you working with?
17:00
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17:01:31barrywardell0.1.4.4.4
17:01:40barrywardellthe version that macports installs
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17:03:31linuxstbYou didn't try downloading the source, and doing the usual ./configure && make ?
17:04:10barrywardellexactly what I'm doing now :)
17:06:01linuxstbI don't have access to my Mac at the moment, but doing it on Linux gives me a libusb.a
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17:10:21barrywardellI have a libusb.a, but it doesn't work
17:10:28barrywardellI still et Undefined symbols
17:15:57linuxstbHow are you compiling?
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17:18:17barrywardelljust added the directories to LIBS and running gmake
17:20:12linuxstbThis worked on Linux - gcc -Wall -W -o e200rpatcher e200rpatcher.c bootimg.c -I. libusb.a
17:20:23linuxstb(copying usb.h and libusb.a into the e200rpatcher directory)
17:23:51barrywardellthat gives me loads more undefined symbols
17:24:04linuxstbThat exact command?
17:24:10barrywardellyes
17:24:35barrywardellhttp://pastebin.ca/692101
17:24:45barrywardellit looks like system stuff
17:24:58linuxstbAh, you probably need a -framework option...
17:25:21linuxstbI _think_ it's something like -framework iokit and -framework coreservices
17:26:33barrywardellyup, that worked :)
17:26:52linuxstb;)
17:27:23barrywardellsuccess, it works with my sansa too
17:28:09barrywardellthis was the command I used: gcc -framework iokit -framework coreservices -Wall -W -o e200rpatcher e200rpatcher.c bootimg.c -I. libusb.a
17:28:29linuxstbNow build a universal binary...
17:28:59barrywardellI have to build libusb for ppc first...
17:29:09linuxstbYou have an intel Mac?
17:29:16barrywardellyes
17:29:24barrywardellbut have access to a ppc one too
17:29:30linuxstbI have a PPC one...
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17:31:09linuxstbNow all we need is a Windows hacker to get libusb (or native usb) working there...
17:31:41linuxstbAlthough from what little I've read, it seems Windows doesn't allow apps to do direct USB communication without going through a driver. I could be wrong though...
17:32:11barrywardellcan you make a ppc binary? I don't have a ppc mac handy right now
17:32:17Domonokythe win32 port of libusb doesnt work ?
17:32:20JimmieGood day sirs. I am considering using Rockbox on my iPod mini, but I'd like to know if the songs that I already have on my iPod (on the original firmware i might add) will play properly, or if I will need to re-upload them to a different folder? (I'm asking because iplinux had real problems playing tunes that were compatable with the iPod firmware...)
17:32:34linuxstbbarrywardell: No, my iBook is at home (and I'm not).
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17:32:51th30hello
17:32:59linuxstbbarrywardell: But there's no rush - at least we know we can build e200rpatcher when the time comes to release it.
17:33:08th30is there anyone who can help me with a video problem?
17:33:39DomonokyJimmie: if the files are not DRM protected, rockbox will play them..
17:33:40barrywardelllinuxstb: ok. I'll make the compiled version available for anyone that needs it
17:33:40linuxstbJimmie: As long as they are not encrypted (i.e. bought from the ITMS), they should play in Rockbox.
17:33:48JimmieLovely!
17:34:07JimmieAlso, while I'm here, does using rockbox impact battery life at all? :o
17:34:17JimmieLike, more than the original firmware >_>
17:34:25JimmieOtherwise I'll have to do some tests ^^
17:35:01linuxstbUnfortunately yes, on most other devices, Rockbox uses less power than the original firmware, but on the newer ipods (including mini), it uses significantly more.
17:35:21Jimmieah
17:35:37th30why can i not play videos on my nano?
17:35:44Jimmieoh well, i'll give it a shot
17:36:13Jimmieth30 i believe the ipod linux guys were working on something that woudld play videos for all iPod types (even mini/1st gen iPods)
17:36:14linuxstbth30: Have you read the PluginMpegplayer wiki page and followed the instructions there to convert them? Can you play the Elephants Dream sample video?
17:36:29JimmieNot really been paying attention to them though
17:36:43th30i will try
17:36:44th30thanks
17:36:46th30brb
17:39:01barrywardelllinuxstb: barrywardell.net/assets/files/e200rpatcher-i386">http://barrywardell.net/assets/files/e200rpatcher-i386
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17:41:42linuxstbThanks. Which version of libusb was that?
17:42:19th30btw what program do you use to open wps files?
17:42:29linuxstbSo we should be able to at least incorporate this into rbutilqt for the Linux and Mac versions.
17:42:57linuxstbth30: Your favourite text editor. e.g. notepad if that's all you have.
17:43:45*linuxstb goes home
17:44:01barrywardellversion 0.1.12
17:44:03 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
17:44:20barrywardelland here's the change I had to make to the makefile:http://pastebin.ca/692130
17:44:37 Quit petur ("...now sports...")
17:44:45barrywardellwith usb.h and libusb.a in the e200rpatcher dir
17:44:53*barrywardell leaves too
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17:54:19 Join syn4pse [0] (n=syn4pse@cpe-075-176-155-093.sc.res.rr.com)
17:55:54syn4pseIs it possible to change the FONT_UI size to 6pt? I'm trying to get to 80 columns and I only have 52.
17:56:52n1ssyn4pse: you can use a smaller font
17:58:30syn4psehow could I call that from my_plugin.c? it looks like I might have to use 5pt. ugh.
17:59:14syn4psesorry for the lame question. I have been scouring the net for the answer but I can't find it for some reason.
17:59:39n1ssyn4pse: my bet is no the font_load() function :-)
17:59:47n1ss/no/on
18:00
18:00:43syn4pseokay :D thanks! so, are there any 5pt fonts? I'm pretty new at this, and banging around with c++.
18:01:12syn4pselike a true_type? would that be a rb->font_load?
18:01:59syn4psei've been porting an ncurses program and it's been a nightmare. but I have stuff on screen now.
18:02:02n1ssyn4pse: plugin.h lists all functions in the plugin api with the arguments that they take
18:02:06*pixelma tries to imagine a plugin with 80 columns of characters on the 112 pixel wide archos displays...
18:02:18syn4pseyeah, tell me about it.
18:02:40n1ssyn4pse: Tiny-Prop-5 is probably the only 5p font we have
18:02:47syn4pseI have an ipod video. it's going to be barely legible.
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18:04:30n1spixelma: now that's a challenge :-)
18:04:48syn4psethank you very much for your help!
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18:06:01pixelmasyn4pse: what shall your program do? Can't you make it scroll horiontally?
18:06:41pixelma*horizontally
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18:08:49syn4psepixelma: i'm trying to emulate a 80x2 terminal ncurses window. I'm very close on the ncurses part. The window size is my problem. It's mostly graphical, | and / and _ characters.
18:10:16syn4psenow, i'm thinking that a radical change is necessary, like splitting the visible window into two parts (one is the maze, one is the map) and flipping the view on a button press.
18:10:40syn4pse80x2 = 80x24
18:11:28syn4pse5pt is going to be so super-tiny
18:13:23syn4pseseriously, thanks for listening. I guess that's what I'll do. Too bad that I'm really just learning c++ and pointers still are tough for me.
18:13:42syn4pseI need the practice. see you all later...
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18:21:08*bluebrother wonders why nobody pointed out that c++ is not the same as c ...
18:22:13 Quit obo ("bye")
18:22:46pixelmabecause he already left when I wanted to tell...
18:24:11pixelmabluebrother: looks like xfig could do the trick, now I only have to find out how to work with it (and how to use it under cygwin :\ )
18:24:11bluebrother;-)
18:24:37bluebrotherpixelma: I thought about it a bit −− might give troubles for the html manual :/
18:25:27 Quit GodEater (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:25:33pixelmaah, ok. Back to the have it in the png plan then?
18:25:47bluebrotherI don't know a better solution for now.
18:26:40bluebrotherbut you could try using xfig −− maybe htlatex is smart enough to handle it correctly. I just doubt it.
18:28:15pixelmaand the "includegraphics" makro is my only chance? It's just that it looks like a "dirty" solution if the basis is a screenshot.
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18:29:01bluebrotherincludegraphics just includes an image −− see the documentation of the graphicx package
18:29:23pixelmaI know
18:34:39pixelmabut "screenshot" obviously doesn't work because the explained version is bigger than the usual screenshot
18:36:57Chrononpixelma, bluebrother: mind if I ask why you're discussing \includegraphics?
18:39:06bluebrotherChronon: not at all
18:39:29bluebrotherpixelma wants to add descriptions to a screenshot similar to the device button description.
18:39:40pixelmaChronon: I'm working on the split editor chapter for the manual and want to use a screenshot (usual screenshot size) but with arrows and text that explains it
18:40:05Chronontext overlaid on the screenshot or a caption?
18:40:12bluebrotherit's possible to overlay an image with text, but I don't think that would work with the html version of the manual
18:42:20pixelmathe old manual (2.4 I believe) used a screenshot that had "1", "2", "3" and so on in it - but that's not very visible and I thought having it similar to the button description would be better
18:43:57`VLhello. after installing rockbox on my h340 i have a liitle problem: backlight don`t turn off while charging. Now i`m looking at light 'Complete' word on player in cradle... what can i do?
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18:47:40Chrononpixelma: You mean having the text embedded in the image?
18:47:41n1s`VL: there's a "Backlight timeout while plugged" (ore somesuch) setting
18:47:47 Quit jaczehack ("CGI:IRC")
18:48:06`VLn1s: thank`s, i`ll search...
18:48:12 Quit Siltaar ("Aurevoir - www.fdn.fr/~sdescarp")
18:48:25`VLthinking about `s .. ;-)
18:49:44`VLn1s: i have it set to 10s.. ;-(
18:49:47*bluebrother notices stray backticks
18:49:56 Quit Chronon ("Oops. Have to go do some lab stuff.")
18:51:34n1s`VL: what does it display on screen?
18:51:50`VLcharging...
18:52:09n1s`VL: that's the OF nothing to do with rockbox
18:52:26`VLn1s: ok, but...
18:52:42n1seither start rockbox before inserting the charger plug or start the iriver OF and change the setting in there
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18:52:58pixelmahmm... pity, just when I wanted to answer Chronon
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18:53:56*bluebrother has an idea about the frontpage ... let's see if that works
18:54:27*linuxstb gets the feeling Zagor is hiding.... ;)
18:54:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:55:29*bluebrother wonders if there already were responses regarding the redesign announcement in the forums
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18:56:01preglowthe sponsor thing should have the same widths as the rest of the page
18:56:13preglowor at least not bigger than the two tables above it
18:56:37bluebrotherI think we could have all the information that is currently on the frontpage with some additional javascript
18:56:38jhMikeSpreglow: where's that vinyl amp? I also got ahold of that nice synth pdf. I think I saved it...I hope.
18:56:49linuxstbbluebrother: Doesn't sound accessible...
18:57:12bluebrotherwell, for accessibility the javascript could just show everything by default
18:57:31bluebrother(I did some web design before and tested with links / lynx ;-)
18:58:39preglowjhMikeS: can't make it work properly
18:58:46jhMikeSno? what's it doing?
18:58:50preglowjhMikeS: whatever i do, i end up with more bass than i need and less treble than i need
18:59:12preglowjhMikeS: tried recording on the device and applying the filter in matlab, same shit, i almost suspect the mic input is somehow to blame
18:59:20 Quit tictoc (Remote closed the connection)
18:59:22preglowit all sounds stellar through my amps vinyl input
18:59:48jhMikeSit sounds like that even if just doing a feedthrough?
19:00
19:00:11`VLn1s: how do i charge player with rockbox? i have hold always connected to usb: in original i turned player off and put it to hold - it started to charge(normal, not usb). in rockbox player connects to usb even in bootloader... does it charge while working? (not usb charge)
19:00:53preglowjhMikeS: no idea, just tried using recording
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19:01:45n1s`VL: you can charge while rockbox is running and I _think_ it charges while in bootloader usb mode but LinusN should know for sure, you could just start rockbox before connecting usb though
19:01:48preglowi found a paper and tried the filter that used, but couldn't even bloody make it work
19:01:54preglowthis all points to me being a retard
19:02:00jhMikeSyeah, I mean just recording without any software filters involved. shouldn't make any difference just playing it back
19:02:28jhMikeSoh c'mon. I don't believe that.
19:02:43preglowanyway, i've looked at the filter i currently use, and looks just peachy
19:02:53preglowseems to be within specs of what an riaa filter should look like
19:03:28`VLn1s: thanks. that would be nice to see some sort of icon in rockbox, that indicates 'charger connected'. or this one exists?
19:04:00n1s`VL: the battery in the statusbar animates while charging
19:04:15jhMikeSlike this ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIAA_equalization
19:04:23`VLn1s: does it depends on theme?
19:04:51n1s`VL: themes can turn off the statusbar, yes
19:06:35`VLn1s: and i understand about 1st question: while installing rockbox, i destroyed all settings of original firmware... so it didn`t turn of. sorry.
19:06:38 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
19:07:03linuxstbbluebrother: Personally, I don't like sites that hide/show content via javascript. I would prefer it to just all be on the page and I can use the scrollbar.
19:07:24preglowjhMikeS: aye, just the inverse
19:09:44GodEater_linuxstb: if all the content is displayed by default, then you're not going to lose that
19:09:58GodEater_and you don't have to care if it can be hidden or not
19:10:53linuxstbGodEater_: Then I'll be happy, but what's the point?
19:11:21GodEater_linuxstb: the point is our users can hide bits they neither like nor understand
19:11:22bluebrotherlinuxstb: well, I'm looking for a way to have all information on the front page but without getting it too crowded. Do you have a better idea?
19:11:39linuxstbYes, not put everything on the front page...
19:11:44bluebrotheralso, we could set a cookie with the current user selection ...
19:11:58GodEater_a la iGoogle
19:12:39preglowjhMikeS: i think this is pretty much where it's at http://www.pvv.org/~thomj/rockbox/phono.c
19:13:06bluebrotheranother option would be of course to show one line only for every "item" (i.e. svn log, etc) like "last svn commit at <time> by <who>" and put the old table to a separate page.
19:13:31bluebrotherthe question is: what information do we want to have on the front page? Currently it's really crowded imo.
19:14:14linuxstbIMO, the mail and wiki tables aren't needed. I don't read the mail via website (I have an email client...) and the recent changes on the wiki aren't that interesting (and already available elsewhere).
19:14:32bluebrotheryep, I agree.
19:14:51linuxstbSo the news and svn could revert to how they were presented before...
19:15:27bluebrotherputting the sponsors to the bottom of the page is also nice −− it makes more room for the svn log if you're on a small monitor
19:15:52linuxstbI use a small monitor (an ibook), and never found that a problem though.
19:16:14bluebrotherwell, it's not a problem. It's just nicer ;)
19:16:35GodEater_wonder if the sponsors will feel that way
19:16:40jhMikeSpreglow: ah, so the high-cut is the filter used on the recording end
19:16:58GodEater_though I suspect at least one of them won't care at all
19:17:57jhMikeSor, no the article says low frequencies are reduced
19:23:36Buschelback for good :)
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19:26:36jhMikeSpreglow: know of any good fixed point routines to raise a value to a fractional power between 1 and 3 or so?
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19:27:20preglowjhMikeS: nope
19:27:34preglowjhMikeS: if you by high-cut filter mean "riaa deemphasis filter", then yes
19:28:01preglowit doesn't just high-cut, it also boosts bass quite a bit
19:29:27preglowalso, anyone seen any info on the new ipod innards yet?
19:29:28*jhMikeS 's first search re: fixed point fracional power brings up a patent for it. :\
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19:30:31preglowjhMikeS: what do you want it for? scrollwheel accel stuff?
19:31:01n1swow, our Tremor codec actually plays floor0 files which neither totem nor rythmbox like
19:32:02preglown1s: i have no idea why they don't
19:32:09preglowthey're completely within spec
19:32:12jhMikeSpreglow: yeah, to have a variable magnitude ... and as a handy tool
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19:34:52BuscheljhMikeS: could you read my last comment before leaving? regarding the resetting of the wheelclick accumulation?
19:35:01preglowjhMikeS: i'd probably just use a lut to not spend ages on it
19:35:06linuxstbpreglow: Just the ifixit.com photos, which I think you've seen. The new ipods just have similar apple-branded chips to the 2nd Gen Nano. The CPUs have "ARM" written on them and have similar (but slightly different) reference numbers to the 2nd gen Nano.
19:35:28preglowlinuxstb: i'll pretty much just take that as confirmation nothing uses pp, then
19:36:07jhMikeSluts are so.....boooring
19:36:51linuxstbpreglow: Yes... Also, the specs (video playback and very long battery life) point to them not being PP.
19:37:22jhMikeSluts with some kind of non-linear interpolation are perhaps half-interesting though
19:40:59 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC")
19:42:29GodEater_heh - that licensing email seems to be the biggest activity on the dev list there's been in ages
19:43:42*GodEater_ wonders if Febs will wade in with his "don't take this as legal advice" hat on
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19:43:54preglowis it a pretty hat?
19:44:05GodEater_it's sparkly
19:44:19GodEater_he has to make sure he doesn't set things on fire with it
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19:44:34jhMikeSchewy or crunchy?
19:44:59FebsI literally was just sitting here wondering whether I should post my $.02, but then realized that would buy you about two and half seconds of my time.
19:45:07Febs:)
19:45:17GodEater_so a couple of thousand dollars then ? :)
19:45:35*GodEater_ goes looking for his wallet
19:45:45linuxstbFebs: How much time does a t-shirt and a mug get us?
19:45:59FebsI don't know, since I never seem to be able to get one!
19:46:04GodEater_plus I'll let you win at arm wrestling
19:47:59FebsI still need to read most of the mailing list thread, but from a practical perspective, I agree that assigning copyrights to an individual is a bad idea for the reasons Godeater already noted.
19:48:22preglowoh yes
19:48:30GodEater_Febs must have seen the Rockbox hitlist, so he knows who's getting it next
19:48:43*GodEater_ looks over his hsoulder
19:48:48GodEater_*shoulder
19:48:58FebsYes, but DavidGWRawson doesn't have any Rockbox copyrights ...
19:49:46preglowi think making some org have copyright would be simplest by far
19:49:47preglowthat's for sure
19:50:08preglowif we let individuals retain copyright, we'll never be able to change a license without gargantuan effort
19:50:26preglowalso, possibly a ton of bother
19:50:44GodEater_Febs: you know where he lives already? I'm impressed :)
19:51:34GodEater_so all we need now is to figure out which organisation to use
19:51:38GodEater_and get them to pay attention
19:52:54 Quit indro (Remote closed the connection)
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19:55:35*GodEater_ had forgotten how slowly lawyers read
19:55:43*pixelma gets the impression that GodEater_ looks at the world upside down :P
19:56:05GodEater_pixelma: just that one time early this morning :)
19:56:31GodEater_then I looked at how it appeared in the mailing list archive and realised it didn't look as cool as I thought
19:56:38GodEater_=/
19:56:52pixelmahehe
19:58:02FebsSorry, I'm actually quite tied up today with Real Work.
19:58:41 Quit nicktastic ("Leaving")
19:59:11GodEater_Febs: this "Real Work" - you're reading that slowly too I'm guessing ;)
20:00
20:00:44FebsOne issue to think about when we talk about assigning copyrights to a third-party is what happens if the assignor wants to use the work that is the subject of the copyright same work in a non-GPL compatible manner?
20:01:14GodEater_Febs: tough titties ?
20:01:38GodEater_I mean, if you're planning on that - presumably you won't hand over the (C) in the first place
20:01:56bluebrothercan't you just dual-license it?
20:02:15Febsbluebrother: if you are the copyright holder, yes. If you assign your copyright to someone else, though, how would you do that?
20:02:32GodEater_you wouldn't be able to
20:02:42GodEater_not without the agreement of the (c) holding org.
20:02:52FebsExactly my point.
20:03:06bluebrotherhmm.
20:04:57 Quit pixelma (" bbl")
20:05:25GodEater_linuxstb ?
20:05:36Domonokywow, we have a chinese translation for rbutil in the tracker.. :-)
20:05:44GodEater_sweet!
20:06:01bluebrotheryep ... I already looked at it ;)
20:06:18bluebrotherand it made me make some improvements to rbutil ;)
20:06:20GodEater_what's still to be done with rbutil ?
20:06:43bluebrotherI'd like to improve autodetection
20:06:53GodEater_what does it not do currently ?
20:07:10Domonokybluebrother: libusb, we will need it for e200r support anyway...
20:07:30bluebrotherDomonoky: yes, but my idea was to have autodetection working without libusb on windows
20:07:53bluebrotheron linux I think we safely can assume libusb to be present. Or link it statically to the binary
20:08:06bluebrotheron windows libusb only works with some driver installed :(
20:08:32bluebrotherGodEater_: well, backing up the old installation would be nice. And support for plugins ;-)
20:09:10bluebrotherthe basic functionality itself is complete. Loads of testing is needed though. From reports I have the suspicion that there is something strange with sansapatcher integration.
20:09:18 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@dhcp-892b9bdd.ucd.ie)
20:09:35GodEater_plugins for rbutil you mean, as opposed to rockbox plugins ?
20:09:41bluebrotheryes
20:09:44 Join Oreo`Cookie [0] (n=Some_Guy@ool-182c04fe.dyn.optonline.net)
20:09:52Oreo`CookieAnyone care to help?
20:09:56bluebrotherfor scrobbler sibmission f.e.
20:09:59Redbrevasome indication that it is working, and it's finished when autodetecting??
20:10:04GodEater_bluebrother: ah I see
20:10:52GodEater_Oreo`Cookie: wrong question. Just state your problem.
20:11:10GodEater_no-one ever reads those ircguidelines
20:11:28GodEater_we should +m the channel, and only +v people when they can confirm they've read them
20:11:41Oreo`CookieHehe... ummm is there any patch available to make the GB and GBC games run faster on the rockboy? They run HORRIBLE, and the sound is horrible too
20:12:00GodEater_Oreo`Cookie: none that I'm aware of
20:12:20GodEater_any and all patches are in the tracker though - you're free to search it
20:12:36Redbrevaalso bootloader installation from Rbutilqt+Vista Ipod Patcher is still the only way that works (and that has to run as Admin)
20:12:41Oreo`CookieK thanks
20:12:56GodEater_vista is still funny about it's direct hardware access
20:13:02GodEater_I found that out when I tried out RC1
20:13:13GodEater_there's something you can do to get round it - but I forget what
20:13:18GodEater_it was last November
20:13:19GodEater_:(
20:14:13RedbrevaI trued runing rbutil with admin rights but it still fails to find any ipods when attempting bootloader install - even tho' auto detect works
20:14:56GodEater_that would likely be a symtom of that issue
20:15:11GodEater_I think some searching of MS's knowledge base is in order
20:15:35RedbrevaRunning ipodpatcher itself with admin rights works OK
20:16:12GodEater_that may be because it's a console app
20:16:14GodEater_I'm not sure
20:16:19GodEater_I'd still search MS :)
20:16:43GodEater_or even the forums
20:16:56GodEater_I seem to recall the same issue popping up a very long time ago with ipodpatcher too
20:17:00GodEater_and someone posting the solution
20:18:44linuxstbbluebrother: Did you read the logs from this afternoon? barrywardell and I managed to statically link libusb for both Mac OS X and Linux, so that just leaves Windows to sort out...
20:19:00linuxstbGodEater_: Why the ? ?
20:19:13GodEater_linuxstb: wondered if you were here
20:19:24bluebrotherlinuxstb: I think a dynamic dependency to libusb is ok at least on linux
20:19:33GodEater_I just wanted to check - scorche is sending you the S's, and then we're going to meet up somewhere correct ?
20:19:59linuxstbbluebrother: Yes, but looking at it, libusb is in fact very small and simple - I think it's fine to link statically.
20:20:02bluebrotherthe nmajor issue is that libusb requires you to install a driver on windows, especially for detection
20:20:43bluebrotherfor e200r installation I guess we'll need to require the user to install the driver
20:21:26linuxstbFrom everything I've read, it seems any kind of USB activity will require a driver on Windows. Is that your interpretation?
20:21:43linuxstbGodEater_: I thought he was sending them to you...
20:21:53 Quit tictoc (Remote closed the connection)
20:21:59linuxstbGodEater_: Or rather, your friendly porter...
20:21:59GodEater_linuxstb: now I'm confused :)
20:22:08bluebrotheryes. Enumersting the IDs will work without using the windows api
20:22:18GodEater_I guess we check with scorche when he wakes up then
20:22:40 Quit Frazz ("Leaving")
20:22:42 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear)
20:22:45Oreo`CookieAnyone got to create their own theme yet? I think its pretty hard
20:22:56bluebrotherwhich is the point: I want to require the driver only when really needed
20:23:10linuxstbOreo`Cookie: Given the number of themes on rockbox-themes.org and the wiki, at least a few people have...
20:23:12 Join tictoc [0] (i=tabac@gateway/gpg-tor/key-0xB9002659)
20:23:21bluebrothermaybe we can distunguish between e200 and e200r based on usb pid?
20:23:25GodEater_Oreo`Cookie: there are guides in the wiki too
20:23:42linuxstbbluebrother: They have different partition layouts - sansapatcher won't recognise an e200r.
20:23:42GodEater_bluebrother: how about based on the lack of two partitions ?
20:23:51linuxstbGodEater_: Good idea.
20:24:11GodEater_more or less what you said though ;)
20:27:09*bluebrother thinks a short introduction dialog upon first startup would be helpful
20:27:25GodEater_"Welcome to RBUtil, the app that hoses your DAP"
20:27:28amiconnbluebrother: On windows we need the driver, but we could make rbutil preinstall it (i.e. put the .inf in c:\windows\inf, pre-linked to the e200r's pid)
20:27:30GodEater_it even rhymes
20:27:58*GodEater_ needs dinner
20:28:11bluebrotherI'm not sure if I like this approach. Currently rbutil doesn't need an installation at all
20:28:26amiconnYou don't need to install rbutil itself
20:28:36bluebrotherbut once we provide an installer we could do this.
20:29:15amiconnIf it detects a sansa, it could preinstall the driver, and then tell the user to switch the sansa to manufacturer mode and reconnect
20:29:30amiconnIiuc, the sansa has a different pid in manufacturer mode than in normal mode
20:29:47 Join low_light [0] (i=c730180b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-2fd16ddf123c9876)
20:29:48bluebrotheryep. I would just have displayed an error message telling the user that he needs to install a driver
20:29:57linuxstbamiconn: All this needs a windows user with a clue and a Sansa. No-one has even succeeded getting e200rpatcher working yet...
20:30:28amiconnI have no sansa, and I don't want one either. AT least not an e200(r)
20:30:52amiconnIf the C200 came in 4GB or 8GB, that would be more tempting
20:30:54 Join MySic [0] (n=MySic@bas3-montreal28-1279373002.dsl.bell.ca)
20:31:04bluebrothermy idea for autodetection was to detect the player based on USB ids first. Then use other methods to verify that / rule out id collisions / detect mount point
20:31:24*bluebrother played around with an e200 today and doesn't like the buttons
20:31:30bluebrotherso no reason to buy one
20:31:36 Join freqmod [0] (n=freqmod@m072g.studby.ntnu.no)
20:32:00barrywardellamiconn: it does have a microsd slot...
20:32:29amiconnI know. A full-size sd slot would have been more interesting...
20:32:53Oreo`Cookiemicro SD's suk!
20:33:15Oreo`Cookiethey're like 60 bucks when the normal sized ones r like 25 bucks
20:33:18bluebrotherI don't see why microSD should suck. It's just damned small
20:34:16amiconnA full-size sd slot would also take MMCs, and I already have some, even a 4GB one
20:34:45 Join eXe`- [0] (n=lrl@ip153.219.reserved.ish.de)
20:34:45 Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
20:35:11linuxstbJdGordon: (for the logs) This page for a windows app using libusb - it could give some clues. It suggests running testlibusb.exe after installing the driver to test it's installed correctly. http://cexx.org/dakota/sucr.htm
20:36:44eXe`-hey, its impossible to open images to me. there are some default images on my sansa e250 but cant open them... some tips?
20:37:02linuxstbWhat kind of files are they?
20:37:04bluebrotherare the images jpg?
20:37:24eXe`-umm
20:37:28eXe`-i guess, yeah
20:37:54linuxstbAre any messages displayed when you select them in the Rockbox file browser?
20:38:00eXe`-nope
20:38:14eXe`-i see them listed in the browser
20:38:28eXe`-but when i try to open them nothing happens
20:39:09 Join ian_hawdon [0] (n=ian@host86-131-235-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com)
20:39:42eXe`-ok
20:39:43eXe`-no
20:39:47eXe`-they are bmps
20:40:01eXe`-so i guess this is the problem, right?
20:40:11linuxstbYes, Rockbox doesn't have a bmp viewer.
20:40:16jhMikeSBuschel: weren't you goings to ask/say something earlier? I wasn't being rude but simply assuming you'd just say.
20:40:56 Join low_light [0] (i=187b2f62@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f3d6a685f4c68798)
20:40:57eXe`-but there is something like a albumart plugin or something which supports bmps or not?
20:41:06The_CompilerLittle OT: What does "in a nutshell" mean? (I'm Swiss)
20:41:07linuxstbeXe`-: You may be able to open them in rockpaint though. Hold down select on the file (to bring up the context menu), then select "open with" and rockpaint.
20:41:35The_CompilereXe`-: But only if they aren't bigger as your screen
20:41:40BuscheljhMikeS: no prob, had enough to do with our baby.. he was crying all time :/
20:41:50 Join webguest85 [0] (i=d40168e6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-10499eec3222d8c5)
20:42:19 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection)
20:42:20 Quit webguest85 (Client Quit)
20:42:20 Join Chronon [0] (i=Chronon@d23-104.uoregon.edu)
20:42:22BuscheljhMikeS: i just asked whether you've read my comment (in IRC) just before you were leaving?
20:42:37eXe`-The_Compiler these are the default pics which were on the player, so i guess they are in the right format :o
20:43:01ian_hawdon@ The_Compiler In a nutshell means, to put what you're trying to say in a simpler form (like a summery of something that has been said)
20:43:11low_lightI have a question...the c200 loads the firmware to 0x14000000. Since there's only 32MB is that address just aliased to 0x10000000?
20:43:23The_Compilerian_hawdon: thanks
20:43:27preglowlow_light: sounds logical
20:43:37linuxstblow_light: Possibly. Or maybe RAM has been remapped?
20:44:26 Quit My_Sic (Connection timed out)
20:44:30*linuxstb can't think why it would be remapped there though...
20:44:47eXe`-linuxstb when i open the images with rockpaint it says "undefined instruction" and the player hangs :O
20:45:24*linuxstb shrugs
20:45:48low_lightlinuxstb: not in the bootloader (it's executed from 0x10600000)
20:46:34preglowram addresses do alias for ipods
20:46:41preglowso i guess they do so for sansa c too
20:47:00barrywardelli think that's the case for all pp
20:47:00 Nick The_Compiler is now known as The-Compiler (n=florian@72.54.76.83.cust.bluewin.ch)
20:47:08preglowno surprises
20:47:10jhMikeSBuschel: saw it after I posted another after getting back :) hrm
20:47:14 Quit MySic (Client Quit)
20:47:21barrywardellthere was a theory that you could access memory without caching that way
20:47:41linuxstbThis may explain the odd results I had when trying a quick hack to detect 32MB/64MB ipods (in apps/main.c, so Rockbox could tell the user they've installed the wrong build).
20:47:47barrywardellso the uncached address would be the normal address + memsize
20:48:27linuxstbOn my PP5020, writing to an address in the 2nd 32MB of RAM failed, but on my 32MB ipod video, it worked. So it could be that the RAM was aliased on the PP5021, but not PP5020.
20:48:45low_lighthmm. there's some cache clearing & init done before and after loading the firmware to 0x14000000
20:48:56amiconnI bet that this has to do with the various bits in the lower half of the MMAP* registers
20:49:07 Join eigma [0] (n=eigma@me4233-pc01.labs.sce.carleton.ca)
20:49:42jhMikeSdoes this aliasing perhaps have anything to do with different DAPs using a generic setup rather than ones used by OF?
20:50:24barrywardelli think it was dan_a that did some testing on the whole aliasing thing in the past (on sansa)
20:50:41amiconnBtw, 0x14000000 is MEMBASE + 2*MEMSIZE
20:51:14 Join atsea- [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-7676f57ec52ff4db)
20:51:15barrywardelli think you can add any multiple of memsize
20:51:57 Quit eigma (Client Quit)
20:52:40amiconnbarrywardell: I'm sure that it can't be an arbitrary multiple
20:52:53*jhMikeS will look into that stuff for H10 once it arrives. probably not a good thing to create memory range aliases
20:53:02amiconnOtherwise the RAM would be aliased all over
20:53:04 Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.)
20:53:06 Join XavierGr_ [0] (n=xavier@ppp13-44.adsl.forthnet.gr)
20:53:31amiconnlow_light: Did you check what the MMAP* registers are set to?
20:53:33barrywardellamiconn: maybe not arbitrary multiple, but some multiples are allowed afaik
20:53:49amiconnMaybe two register pairs map the sdram to 2 different locations?
20:54:19low_lightdepends on memsize. There can be 64 MB.
20:54:44preglowamiconn: i think probably the aliasing comes from some kind of mask bits in the mmap regs
20:54:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:55:11barrywardelllinuxstb: gtg now, but my attempts at a universal binary faild. I couldn't get libusb to build cross-compiled for ppc
20:55:28 Quit barrywardell ()
20:56:00jhMikeSamiconn: did you find out what DEV_TIMING1 does or just name it that? what effect does it seem to have if so?
20:56:15amiconnI just named it that
20:56:51low_lightamiconn: on the device or disassembly? (either way I can't check now).
20:57:00linuxstbbarrywardell: I've got a libusb-ppc.a if you want it...
20:58:09Oreo`Cookieu guys sound like technicians of some sort xD
20:58:20linuxstbI've been looking at the "aupd" image a little in the last few days (now that ipodpatcher can en/descrypt it) - it's not just an image of the flash, it's an application which does the flashing (with the data to flash embedded in it).
20:58:24amiconnjhMikeS: My first thought was that it might have to do with ram timing, but then changing it should changing execution speed from sdram when caches are disabled
20:58:47amiconnMy tests didn't show such change
20:58:48amiconns
20:59:27 Join stevenm [0] (n=stevenm@129.2.201.229)
20:59:43GodEater_Oreo`Cookie: this is where most of Rockbox development happens. Rockbox users are welcome - but their in a minority ;)
20:59:48stevenmHello. How can I debug a plugin running on the Simulator using GDB ?
20:59:48GodEater_s/their/they're
20:59:57jhMikeSI tried setting it to see it did anything setting it to something like 0804 instead. I guess I haven't tried anything with the core control regs and the various delays that can be done.
21:00
21:00:00Oreo`Cookiei think EVERYONE should use it
21:00:01Oreo`Cookieit rocks
21:00:11Oreo`CookieIt solved my IPOD freezing problem
21:00:35GodEater_stevenm: have you used gdb before ?
21:00:52stevenmGodEater_, very vaguely
21:01:01amiconnOreo`Cookie: Guess why it's called *rock*box ;) (scnr)
21:01:03GodEater_I'd suggest reading up on it then
21:01:26GodEater_stevenm: or use a nice GUI for gdb, like "ddd" ;)
21:01:45stevenmGodEater_, I mean... simulator has a ton of SDL stuff. I just want a breakpoint at the beginning of my plugin and a watchpoint on a variable
21:02:07amiconnstevenm: Yes, that's possible
21:02:40GodEater_stevenm: my personal preference then would be for ddd - but I think I'm in a minority of one ;)
21:02:47stevenmamiconn, problem is, plugin crashes shortly after loading. it is hard to catch it after it's been loaded but before it crashed
21:02:49 Part ian_hawdon
21:03:55stevenmbut getting ddd now, thanks
21:03:59jhMikeShmmm...COP/COP control could be a loop-less udelay if the usec EC works
21:04:03amiconnstevenm: Load the sim with gdb. Set a breakpoint to the desired <soucefile>.c:<lineno>. Since this file isn't loaded yet, gdb will ask whether this is part of a dynamic libary loaded later. Answer 'yes'
21:04:18stevenmamiconn, aaaah thanks
21:04:26amiconnThen start the sim, and start your plugin. gdb will catch the breakpoint
21:04:27 Join Zero-Coo|_ [0] (n=atsingis@83.168.9.130)
21:04:38Zero-Coo|_hey guys
21:04:45Zero-Coo|_can anyone help me ?
21:04:56GodEater_Zero-Coo|_: without knowing what with - it's hard to say
21:05:06amiconnjhMikeS: You mean the clock skipping feature?
21:05:06Zero-Coo|_ok listen man
21:05:18Zero-Coo|_i want to install rockbox to my ipod
21:05:22linuxstbjhMikeS: I don't know how this compares with what you're doing with the cache, but it's a function I found in my ipod's firmware (the flash-update aupd image) - http://pastebin.ca/692420
21:05:24Zero-Coo|_i think is g1
21:05:32jhMikeSamiconn: yeah and accoring to IPL it works with the usec counter too
21:05:32*ender` yawns
21:05:33Oreo`CookieThats the easiest thing EVERRRR
21:05:37Zero-Coo|_what i must download and how i must install them
21:05:57amiconnjhMikeS: Yes, saw that. msec and sec events are also available
21:06:18GodEater_Zero-Coo|_: your ipod is a genuine 1st generation ipod ? Not a mini, or a nano ?
21:06:27Zero-Coo|_it's a nano
21:06:48Zero-Coo|_nano 2gb and i think first gen.
21:06:48GodEater_Zero-Coo|_: in that case start off by downloading the manual
21:07:03Zero-Coo|_yeah but some files are missing from the web
21:07:03GodEater_and then read the installation section
21:07:08GodEater_which ones ?
21:07:16Zero-Coo|_something with bootloader
21:07:21 Quit indro (Remote closed the connection)
21:07:26Zero-Coo|_i was searching for tutorial
21:07:27 Join indro [0] (i=indro@212.103.66.234)
21:07:31linuxstbZero-Coo|_: Exactly which link doesn't work?
21:07:34jhMikeSamiconn: only thing is I never observed effects with anything but the cycle counter and 0x7fffffff just slept for 256 cycles
21:07:36Zero-Coo|_maybe the directory changed
21:07:41Zero-Coo|_i will check man .. ty
21:07:42GodEater_Zero-Coo|_: the manual is all you need
21:07:47Zero-Coo|_oki man
21:07:49Zero-Coo|_thnx
21:07:52GodEater_it contains all the links to the right things
21:07:54linuxstbZero-Coo|_: Nothing has changed for about a year...
21:08:04Zero-Coo|_:)
21:08:17preglowwhat, we've been invited to the google mentor summit?
21:08:21stevenmit's the strangest thing. I get a segfault on a simple function call with like, a = f(b, c);
21:08:22GodEater_did anyone else know there was a FSF Europe ?
21:08:25 Quit Zero-Coo|_ (Client Quit)
21:08:45amiconnjhMikeS: Of course.
21:08:52linuxstbstevenm: Which function?
21:08:58GodEater_stevenm: and which plugin ?
21:09:01stevenmlinuxstb, something inside the midi plugin
21:09:11 Quit Genre9mp3 ()
21:09:12stevenmsynth.c, getSample(cpShifted+1, wf)
21:09:28jhMikeSlinuxstb: now that's yet another variation. the sansa OF is loaded with various cache maintence functions - one I can't make heads or tails of for sure but it appears to be a range flush/invalidate.
21:09:32stevenmruns fine on target, but with certain songs, crashes the sim. trying to hunt down why
21:09:48amiconnIf you set 0x7fffffff, all event types are activated (sysclk, usec, msec and sec). And sysclk will of course trigger first
21:10:07amiconnOnly the low 8 bits set the count
21:10:17*bluebrother curses his internet connection
21:10:18GodEater_preglow: where's the summit? And will there be beer ? :)
21:10:31amiconnSo if you set that to 0xff, it will trigger after 256 sysclks
21:10:50jhMikeSamiconn: interesting thing that setting that returned 0x7fffff00 after it finished
21:11:12amiconnI'd expect that as well...
21:11:37preglowGodEater_: can't remember, but the beer would fall into place on its own accord
21:11:39preglowat least for me...
21:11:45GodEater_:)
21:11:49amiconnLoopless udelay() will save a bit of power...
21:11:56GodEater_I just wondered if it was provided free or not ;)
21:12:08amiconn...but keep the "classic" implementation for PP5002
21:12:14preglowi'm from norway, it probably is practically free for me even if they charge
21:12:42 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
21:12:42GodEater_preglow: good point
21:13:09jhMikeSI set many other combos and never got a result that produced a delay and sansa OF always set cop to 0x80000a00 and cpu to 0x80000500 when they sleep the cores...not sure what to make of that. maybe pp5022c doesn't work the same way.
21:14:33amiconnThe disadvantage of a loopless udelay() is that it only handles up to 256 usec
21:14:51 Join Genre9mp3 [0] (n=yngwiejo@athedsl-268297.home.otenet.gr)
21:14:52stevenmGodEater_, do you know how to get ddd to set a breakpoint in a source file of a plugin that hasn't been loaded yet?
21:15:05amiconnMore are possible, but require a loop again
21:15:08jhMikeSWell, it could loops, just not madly
21:15:14*Oreo`Cookie GASPS
21:15:32Oreo`CookieRockBox... cant play videos?! O_O
21:15:36*amiconn thinks that this would be a nice little optimisation for PP502x
21:15:50GodEater_stevenm: not off the top of my head - I don't even have it installed on this workstation at the moment
21:16:27jhMikeSIt must allow interrupts as well. If an EC is pending without bit 31 set, they do not get serviced
21:16:30GodEater_it should accept gdb commands too though
21:16:41GodEater_given that it's only a wrapper for gdb
21:17:01linuxstbOreo`Cookie: Huh?
21:17:29amiconnjhMikeS: Hmm, an interrupt would then mess up the delay...
21:17:45Oreo`CookieI cant seem to play videos on my IPOD VIDEO with rockbox
21:17:51Oreo`Cookiei dont even see the files
21:18:00amiconnBut maybe the counter is preserved if it's interrupted before reaching zero?
21:18:00bluebrotherOreo`Cookie: check http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/PluginMpegplayer
21:18:04linuxstbOreo`Cookie: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginMpegplayer (pay close attention to the introduction)
21:18:24Oreo`Cookiek got it thankz
21:20:53*maxkelley returns to the scene of the crime.
21:22:16low_lighthi maxkelley
21:23:24low_lightI'll have to look at your patches sometime...to the plugins actually run ok?
21:23:25jhMikeSamiconn: I don't know. Perhaps a loop will be needed just to see if it's done. It would be enough code I'm sure it should stay inlined to avoid bloat. A call is hardly much of a concern on ARM.
21:24:14preglowanyone know on what legal ground we are with regards to patents?
21:24:18maxkelleylow_light: yeah, they all run, pretty much.
21:24:20preglowaac/mp3/etc
21:24:34maxkelleyexcept for maybe doom.. do you have the flyspray FS#?
21:24:55maxkelleyIt's 7749, in case you don't.
21:25:04*jhMikeS really wants to know about the HW synchonization objects. The sansa OF doesn't appear to contain a single swp(b) instruction.
21:25:07maxkelleyuse the one in my first comment.
21:25:44preglowjhMikeS: now that sounds interesting
21:25:53maxkelleylow_light: I haven't yet modified any of the bmps, but pixelma sounded like he was interested in doing that.
21:26:15preglowmaxkelley: pixelma is a "she"
21:26:19low_lights/he/she/g
21:26:26maxkelleyoh, I didn't know that.
21:26:33preglowyou do now :D
21:26:43preglowi'm sure she won't have your head for the mistake
21:26:43maxkelleyin that case, that she was interested in doing that.
21:27:04maxkelleythat's pretty cool.. I've only known one other female coder (that I know, not saying that they don't exist)
21:27:14maxkelleyno, 2.
21:27:20maxkelleyanyhow..
21:28:13preglowi don't think i actually know any female coders :/
21:28:33maxkelleylow_light: This weekend, I'm going to work on converting all the plugins to use the pluginlib_actions.h files for keymaps, instead of individual keymap sections for each player in each plugin file.
21:28:57jhMikeSpreglow: there's a UNI paper on a hardware non-blocking synchronization implementation that sounds suspiciously like Portal Player's patent regarding the hardware semaphores.
21:29:01low_lightI'll try to have a have a look later. I'm more focused on figuring out what's going wrong with loading the orig firmware.
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21:29:31maxkelleylow_light: I thought that was just a problem I was having :)
21:30:00maxkelleyI knew it happens on the e200r, but I wasn't aware it was widespread on the c200.
21:30:54low_lightno. it doesn't work. well, rockbox loads it, but it just freezes (as you have seen)
21:31:35Oreo`CookieI heard that if you hold the menu button while ipod is chargin, u go to the rockbox main menu
21:31:37Oreo`Cookiedoesnt work :|
21:31:56preglowkeep menu pressed while inserting the usb cable
21:32:07low_lightgtg
21:32:10 Part low_light
21:32:13Oreo`Cookieohhh ok
21:32:17Oreo`Cookiethankz
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21:32:45GaloisI've had problems with that recently. Sometimes it works when you insert the usb cable, but then a few seconds or minutes later it spontaneously reboots into disk mode.
21:33:15Galoisthere were never any problems before. they started about 2-3 months ago.
21:33:17jhMikeSpreglow: I just wonder if it's a rather limited thing and only suited to a small bit of code or a few resources or something. Stuff I read only dealt with having a small number of objects.
21:33:18GodEater_Galois: recently ?
21:33:28GodEater_Galois: that was fixed about a week ago
21:34:06Galoisthere was also a nano playback bug from r13990 or something, did that get fixed?
21:34:19GodEater_Galois: no - since no dev has a buggy nano
21:34:34Oreo`Cookieworked for me just fine
21:34:35Galoisright, so I'm still stuck on r13990 for that reason :/
21:35:00preglowjhMikeS: don't think i've ever had anything to do with but instruction level locking mechanisms, so no idea
21:35:12Oreo`CookieIpod = Greatest invention ever?
21:35:26GodEater_Galois: I'm just saying that particular bug is now fixed
21:35:33Galoisgood to know, thanks
21:36:15preglowOreo`Cookie: well, no...
21:36:23GodEater_Oreo`Cookie: definitely not
21:36:27preglowi think the plough rates slightly higher with most people
21:36:29preglowperhaps also the wheel
21:36:31GodEater_I'd go with the wheel
21:36:39Oreo`Cookiethe wheel?
21:36:42Oreo`Cookielol
21:36:46Oreo`Cookiewow
21:37:20jhMikeSpreglow: I'm just commenting on stuff. You did ask "how do you figure this stuff out?" Well...lots of BS talking and thinking has a way of converging on a solution. :)
21:38:02preglowbs, thinking and cigarettes
21:38:07preglowsounds like a good movie
21:38:31Buschelcigarettes are a good idea now...
21:38:32jhMikeSyeah, lots of cigarettes. should rockbox fund those? they're sure important.
21:39:00GodEater_someone can take my share. Yuck
21:40:24preglowcigarettes never helps me having ideas
21:40:36preglowthough i know of people who say they do
21:40:45preglowperhaps i need to move further away from the computer while having them...
21:42:18 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
21:45:04*bluebrother wonders if usb ids should go to the devices configuration file or not
21:45:05jhMikeSpreglow: by far the majority of ideas for me come at that time. it's really odd. and yeah. distance from the problem.
21:45:09bluebrotherI guess they should
21:45:38preglowjhMikeS: i've got a musician friend who has tons of ideas when having a smoke, heh
21:47:04preglowso it seems to work for lots of people
21:47:05jhMikeSbeer on the other hand helps when I don't want to get any ideas :P which is sometimes good.
21:47:15preglowhaha
21:47:23preglowbeer kills what little ability i have to concentrate
21:51:29Oreo`CookieYessss i got the video to play
21:51:31Oreo`Cookieawesome
21:53:34 Quit hcs (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
21:54:57maxkelleyhey aqualung!
21:55:08Eberthas anyone reported on the gigabeat f series "recharge battery" when holding power button to boot up?
21:55:33GodEater_Ebert: only when the battery needs recharging
21:55:52Eberti get it randomly, when battery not out of charge
21:55:52 Nick Oreo`Cookie is now known as Oreo||AWAY|| (n=Some_Guy@ool-182c04fe.dyn.optonline.net)
21:57:15Ebertthought it might be part of the "50% power management" status on the player
21:58:00preglowamiconn: didn't you have a look at the codec makefile problem?
21:58:10linuxstbbluebrother: Thinking about it, why do we need the rbutil.ini file at all?
21:58:19amiconnpreglow: No, why?
21:58:33 Quit stevenm ("Connection reset by beer")
21:58:33amiconnBtw, did you check my libmad fix on amd64? :)
21:58:38preglowamiconn: just wondering, but it seems my recollection is a bit off, then
21:58:50preglowamiconn: nope, i noticed it, but haven't tried it yet
21:59:25bluebrotherlinuxstb: to not have the device settings hard coded. It's build into the binary though ...
21:59:32amiconnThere's still a crash condition in the sim on amd64 - track changes or skips whithout changing the codec
21:59:43preglowamiconn: yeah, i know, i never managed to debug that either
21:59:47amiconnIt seems to be a symbol table problem, but I'm not sure
21:59:49linuxstbbluebrother: What's built into the binary?
21:59:56bluebrotherthe rbutil.ini file
22:00
22:00:08bluebrotherbut you can update it by putting it into the binary folder.
22:00:09amiconnThe libmad fix was actually quite simple, as I thought
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22:00:49linuxstbbluebrother: IIUC, the only need to update rbutil is if 1) URLs change; or 2) we add new targets. I can't see why 1) would change (they are our URLs), and 2) will almost certainly require new programming in rbutil.
22:01:28amiconnThe largest part was the datatype length issue in bit.c; plus 2 negated unsigned ints in synth.c
22:02:29bluebrotherlinuxstb: that's right. We could simply remove the fallback to an external rbutil.ini file
22:02:48bluebrotherbut using the ini file for a QSetting object makes some things quite nice.
22:03:16 Quit Genre9mp4 (Client Quit)
22:03:51preglowamiconn: in synth.c? i thought the problems came only after the bit.c commit
22:04:27 Quit tchan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:04:37amiconnhttp://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=14636
22:05:25preglowyes, lookie there...
22:05:47 Join argh [0] (n=yngwiejo@athedsl-114208.home.otenet.gr)
22:06:14amiconnpreglow: The codec makefile actually has 2 problems. (1) it doesn't relink codecs for target if *only* a codec lib changed. (2) It *always* relinks codecs for the sim
22:07:11amiconn(2) Is most probably due to codec_crt0.o being deleted after linking, so it's rebuilt every time. But why for sim but not for target - I don't know...
22:07:15linuxstbI assume there would be no objections to stripping out the old x11/win32 sim sections in the Makefiles?
22:07:16 Quit Pro (Remote closed the connection)
22:07:20 Quit argh (Client Quit)
22:07:28linuxstb(would simplify them...)
22:07:50Bagderkill them!
22:07:53 Join Genre9mp4 [0] (n=yngwiejo@athedsl-114208.home.otenet.gr)
22:08:02preglowlinuxstb: go!
22:08:08preglowBagder: have we had any mentor summit invitations?
22:08:27BagderI don't even know what that is
22:08:33 Join lazka [0] (n=lazka@85-126-38-85.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at)
22:08:48linuxstbDid students get a chance to feedback to google on the mentoring organisations?
22:08:53preglowgoogle has some kind of mentor gettogether
22:09:03preglowand we're invited in some way
22:09:31preglowBagder: anyway, we're supposed to be mailed an invite
22:09:48BagderI've certainly not gotten any
22:10:06Bagderand I think I'm still listed as the main gsoc admin for rockbox
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22:12:45preglowBagder: *shrug*
22:13:15preglowi doubt too many of us are willing to pay for that kind of a trip anyway, Llorean is the only one based in the us
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22:14:01Bagderyeah
22:14:07 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.6/2007072518]")
22:14:21Bagderit'll cost a fortune for most of us
22:14:26preglowindeed
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22:15:09bluebrotherpixelma: around?
22:15:30pixelmayes
22:15:42bluebrothercan you check the usb ids of the m5 for me?
22:16:19pixelmaif you tell me where I can find them (errm... Windows XP here)
22:17:03pixelmaor maybe someone else can
22:18:21 Quit davina (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:18:58bluebrotherhmpf. Seems my net connection is broken
22:19:12bluebrotherah, no. It's just really heavy lag.
22:19:28 Quit Buschel ()
22:19:32bluebrothercheck http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DeviceDetection −− the usbids tool displays them
22:19:36preglowpixelma: btw, been wondering about this for a while, why does the nano usb plug graphic have a dot pattern for shadow instead of a solid gray colour? :>
22:19:45einhirnGood evening for everyone in CET and the like ;)
22:20:01bluebrotherwow. 3 minutes lag :(
22:20:25pixelmapreglow: to imitate transparency - so it doesn't look weird on a black background
22:20:42preglowpixelma: so our bitmaps have a transparent colour?
22:20:51pixelmasemi-transparency that is
22:21:19preglowthat good old glaring pink one? :P
22:21:27pixelmayes
22:21:35preglowokies, didn't know that
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22:21:52Bagderchroma key, as they call it...
22:21:58einhirnI have verified what I wrote in the patch tracker #7747 - the replaygain settings aren't applied on boot up.
22:22:08bluebrotherif someone with x5v around, I would also be interested if that uses the same USB id as the X5
22:23:58 Quit Domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:23:59jhMikeSpreglow: magenta? more commonly known as 0xff00ff? :P
22:24:02preglowwe need alpha channel support!!!! :PPP
22:24:18preglowjhMikeS: probably, all i know is i hate it with a passion
22:24:19jhMikeSpreglow: I promise on that one
22:24:34Bagderthere was some funky patch flying around with alpha toying
22:24:40einhirnThe problem seems not with the loading of config files, because the settings are applied then - maybe settings from RTC-RAM or maybe the MAS-Reset in "mp3_init" (used in apps/main.c, defined in firmware/mp3_playback.c)
22:24:53preglowopen source needs more gui people
22:25:20maxkelleyyeah
22:25:23Bagderbluebrother: I think it is a pretty safe bet until someone can report back on it
22:25:24jhMikeSI do gui stuff
22:25:50jhMikeSgot sick of it and went to hardware stuff and other stuff not gui stuff
22:25:50preglowjhMikeS: i get a feeling you do most stuff, heh
22:26:14jhMikeSthat sounds perverted when you put it that way :( ;)
22:26:21Bagderhahah
22:27:24preglownothing like good old-fashioned double entendre
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22:30:18pixelmabluebrother: I'm not sure if there's a difference (though I can imagine it) - but I can only test the side USB port until the weekend probably since I don't have a subpack, will update the wiki with that info in a minute though
22:32:10bluebrothergreat, thanks
22:32:20pixelma(it is a standard USB port, not OTG, and should be valid if one wants to install Rockbox)
22:32:37 Quit desowin ("use linux")
22:32:47bluebrotherby detecting the side ports we could also tell the user if he needs to use a different port :)
22:32:55jhMikeSheh. "subpack" conjures pretty images too. /me goes back to work
22:33:45linuxstbbluebrother: I wonder if rbutil could detect devices in MTP mode...
22:34:30bluebrotheraccording to the DeviceDetection wiki page some players show different usb ids in MTP mode, so it could use that information
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22:36:58*jhMikeS wonders about the CACHE_*_BASE registers
22:37:14eigmajhMikeS: I heard you're getting an m:robe 500i!
22:38:04 Quit XavierGr (Remote closed the connection)
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22:38:40jhMikeSeigma: did you or someone send me one? I'm looking forward to it but this is the first I've been told. :)
22:38:54eigmayikes, I must have the wrong person
22:39:42eigmaah, confused you with jdGordon
22:39:54jhMikeShaha
22:40:20jhMikeShe's on the opposite side of the planet almost
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22:44:46preglowdo any of the gigabeats have a tv output? :>
22:45:03krazykitthe S might, in the OF
22:45:11alienbiker99it does
22:45:27krazykitpretty sure the V does as well
22:45:41*n1s wonders if it is at all possible to find a gigabeat s on this side of the pond...
22:45:55preglowi'm starting to itch for something i can just connect to a tv and have play some movies
22:45:55eigman1s: thanks for committing my patch :)
22:45:57krazykitn1s, the european side?
22:46:17n1seigma: np, committing good patches is easy :-)
22:46:21n1skrazykit: yup
22:46:58krazykiti'm sure you can find someone on this side to send it to you
22:48:36Bagdertalk nicely to scorche about it... :-)
22:48:55scorcheheh
22:49:33n1sscorche: :-)
22:50:16scorchespeaking of, linuxstb: GodEater_: i hadnt chosen which one of you to send the box to (or even if it would be cheaper that way)
22:51:48n1sscorche: I'm interested in one if it isn't too much trouble :-)
22:52:30scorchen1s: mind coming into #rockbox-community? (tis where i do my business ;)
22:54:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:55:53 Quit Febs (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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22:58:33*bluebrother just detected h120 based on usb id :)
22:58:34einhirnOk, I fixed the "Replaygain Settings not loaded on boot" issue and saved nearly 200 Bytes firmware image size in the process ;)
22:59:02*Bagder offers einhirn a shiny "byte saver" badge to wear
22:59:26einhirnBadger: thanks *g*
23:00
23:02:43 Join sofianbabai [0] (n=sof@gar31-1-82-66-75-34.fbx.proxad.net)
23:03:37einhirnBagder: thanks for the badge - otoh I didn't keep track of how many bytes the replaygain support added to the firmware image *g*
23:03:44sofianbabaiHELLO
23:04:29sofianbabaicould we find here m. linus nielsen sometimes ? :)
23:04:48linuxstbYes, m. linus is here sometimes.
23:04:50 Quit atsea- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:05:02Bagderm as in master I take it?
23:05:25Bagdermaster linus at times are here
23:06:01sofianbabailinuxstb: cuz i has accepted my patch (i have submitted the last time we talk), and he comments on it and give me instructions i didn't understand lol
23:06:10sofianbabaii'm relly new in submitting patch
23:06:20sofianbabaiand dunno what to do now with it lol
23:06:23*bluebrother wonders whats so funny about this ...
23:07:38linuxstbWhat instructions did he give you?
23:07:51sofianbabaican someone telles me what exactly contains a .diff file we make for submission on the tracker ?
23:08:29bluebrothera diff contains differences between files. It's generated by the tool "diff"
23:08:48bluebrotherusually you diff against svn, which makes it as easy as running "svn diff <files>"
23:09:48 Quit eigma (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:09:51sofianbabaibluebrother: and how a dev could tell me what to change and what to do just seeing a diff file. i can try to copy his comment in here
23:10:09linuxstbsofianbabai: Have you tried opening up a .diff file in a text editor and looking at it?
23:10:13Bagdersofianbabai: the diff output shows the differences you made
23:10:42Bagderand btw http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WorkingWithPatches has lots of info on this topic
23:11:24sofianbabai"that patch contains plenty of change a part from the missing strings. I will only appply the language file changes. please submit a new patch with the rest of the missing changesthe missing
23:11:40Bagdersofianbabai: and what is unclear in that message?
23:11:43sofianbabaiwhoops
23:11:54sofianbabaiits aproximately that :)
23:12:19bluebrotherdo you have the FS number?
23:12:21sofianbabailinuxstb: no i haven't tried to open it
23:12:28linuxstbsofianbabai: Your .diff file contained differences for lots of different files, not just francais.lang
23:12:34linuxstbbluebrother: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7742
23:12:40sofianbabaibluebrother: 7742
23:12:45bluebrotherthanks.
23:13:16sofianbabailinuxstb: ok!
23:13:21linuxstbsofianbabai: If you change lots of files, but only want to submit your changes for one file, type "svn diff apps/lang/francais.lang > lan_fr.diff"
23:13:21 Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@38.98.196.75)
23:13:23bluebrotherah. As I said: if you only made changes to francais.lang, just "svn diff apps/langs/francais.lang"
23:13:35bluebrotherthis will only include changes to that file
23:13:36sofianbabaiso how do i publish the changes only for the given file ?
23:14:30bluebrotherjust diff that single file and pipe it to a new file.
23:14:43bluebrotherlinuxstb gave you the complete command line
23:14:56sofianbabaibluebrother, linuxstb: thanks for the clear explanation, i understand now
23:18:03pixelmaChronon: around now? It sounded to me when discussing, that you had an idea how I can achieve this screenshot with overlay?
23:18:36sofianbabaiand last question (sory): when the change are accepted by the masters, what would i have to do to make the changes visible for others?
23:19:38n1ssofianbabai: nothing, whoever accepts the patch will commit it to the svn repo for all to see and download
23:20:07Chrononpixelma: Not with true overlay. I was just thinking you could fake it by embedding the desired text into the image. This seems more amenable to the TeX −−> HTML converter.
23:20:29sofianbabaiok, i'll try to look and see how are made those diff files. thank you really for the nice help.
23:20:42ChrononBut I'm not exactly sure about the screenshot you're trying to improve
23:20:56pixelmayes, that's what I thought too. But I hoped that someone has a "cleaner" solution
23:22:33Chrononpixelma: I'm not very familiar with the Tex4Ht converter that gets used here. I know some of these translators can be pretty finicky.
23:24:02bluebrotherI never saw a latex to html converter that wasn't picky at all ;)
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23:24:29Chrononbluebrother: me either!
23:26:13bluebrothercan someone confirm that "H300 MTP" entry at DeviceDetecion and possibly tell what it is? I suspect this being the OTG port
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23:31:09linuxstbbluebrother: I'm guessing it could be the US (DRM) firmware?
23:32:43bluebrotherpossibly
23:35:06linuxstbAre the 1st/2nd gen ipods firewire only? (i.e. no usb)
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23:35:15bluebrotherI think so
23:35:31pixelmame too
23:35:35n1sbluebrother: I think so to, the port is labeled "media" on us h300 models and I am pretty certain it's MTP
23:35:40 Join eigma [0] (n=eigma@CABLE-206-188-76-21.cia.com)
23:35:59 Quit eigma (Client Quit)
23:36:13linuxstbBut all other ipods have firewire as well (apart from the Nano and Video), so a user may not be using USB...
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23:51:37sofianbabailol again, a question on diff files lol . on the fs, if we want to download a patch in order to compile it in a new build, where do i put the downloaded diff file in order to be taken in account by the compile process?
23:51:56Bagderhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WorkingWithPatches
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23:52:11bluebrotherlol, I'm still wondering, lol, what's, lol, so funny, lol, about diffs. Lol.
23:52:21 Quit Chronon ("Back to work.")
23:52:22sofianbabaiclear, straightforward! :) i'll look at it thx :)
23:52:44 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
23:53:41sofianbabainothing funny :) just want to learn a bit in order to avoid disturb next time with stupid questions :)
23:54:35 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-0-132.hsd1.mi.comcast.net)
23:55:47 Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@h69.100.29.71.ip.alltel.net)

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