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#rockbox log for 2007-12-27

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01:04:36JThundleyanyone have a favorite rwps for the x5?
01:04:47 Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend")
01:05:04JThundleymine so far is iCatcher, but I hate the stupid volume circle picture that gives you
01:05:33Mouser_XIf my PC were working, I'd be more likely to actually work on WPSs... And even compliling my own builds.
01:05:37JThundleynot only do you not get a volume number, but when you pause it spins in an animation so you can't tell what your volume is at
01:06:14JThundleywhat's wrong with your box?
01:06:19Mouser_XJThundley: I have a Gigabeat, and thus no screen on my remote.
01:06:49Mouser_XJThundley: It needs a new power supply. It's been off (as in, unplugged and no power) since early August.
01:07:01Mouser_XI'm on someone else's computer right now.
01:07:11Mouser_XAlso, this is off-topic, so I shall say no more.
01:07:37JThundleyhah, so strict around here. I admire it though
01:07:58Mouser_XJThundley: That's what #rockbox-community is for.
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01:23:35jhMikeSamiconn: I'm back.
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01:51:53khermanshey guys, i failed to mention that i am writing a small piece for Linux Journal on Rockbox
01:51:58khermans:-)
01:51:59 Quit hannesd ("Client suicide")
01:52:09khermansi am about to publish something, but wanted to get your input first
01:52:50khermanswould you like to review the article and give me some feedback?
01:53:08khermansits about using Rockbox to free your iPod
01:58:19***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:00
02:00:16JThundleycool, I read that
02:00:30JThundleyI don't use rockbox on an ipod, but I'd like to read your article
02:03:06khermansJThundley, ok i will make it available very soon
02:03:53khermansi will be onboard with LJ for all of 2008, and you should see my name in the magazine on page 6 if you have a recent issue (Security)
02:04:08khermans−−> Kristian Erik Hermansen
02:04:27khermansloved Rockbox, so had to write an article
02:04:29khermansalready donated $20 earlier today as well
02:10:18 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:14:05Lloreankhermans: If you want to get it reviewed by some key developers, you might try press@rockbox.org
02:14:58khermansLlorean, ok then i will send it tonight before i actually publish it
02:15:16khermansits a short but to the point article
02:18:05LloreanThanks. :)
02:23:29LloreanjhMikeS: Just a note, tests with 320x240 video encoded at the 100 value that ffmpeg suggests still is nearly instant, so at least for the gigabeat, I think anything a user wants will probably work well enough.
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02:41:23jhMikeSLlorean: Bagder gave me a PM and said some video he had that was an hour long was taking a long time to seek but I suspect the encoding since I have videos that long that seek instantly.
02:41:50jhMikeSfile about 1GB and there's no perceivable delay.
02:42:58LloreanjhMikeS: This one's about 2 hours long, 320x240, 670MB
02:43:07LloreanNo perceivable delay beyond the disk spin
02:43:11jhMikeSLlorean: These parameters that ffmpeg suggests are just whacky. I never enounter professional stuff that uses such long GOP.
02:43:46jhMikeSLlorean: My huge tester was a SVCD file straight up
02:51:49jhMikeSI suppose I'll put some limiting on video I-frame/GOP searches at some point just so sub-optimal videos aren't annoying
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03:00
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03:09:31XavierGrsorry if this is in the manual but how do you turn on an ipod video?
03:09:51XavierGrI just got one from a friend and installed rockbox on it
03:09:54jhMikeSstroke it gently? :p
03:10:05XavierGrbut now I don't know how to turn it on :\
03:10:46jhMikeSMy sister has one and I just pushed buttons at random and something worked
03:10:58 Quit animeloe ("Leaving")
03:11:34XavierGrnevermind I pressed menu-select for a long time but didn't restart
03:11:48XavierGreh, strange behaviour
03:11:59XavierGrit just booted on it self
03:12:17XavierGrit sees that menu does the trick
03:12:20XavierGrweird thing
03:12:25jhMikeSHer's isn't rockboxed though so I haven't been through other drills with it.
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03:25:11LloreanjhMikeS: I've arranged to borrow an iPod Video, so I'll compare that same video in the worst-case hardware later.
03:30:11jhMikeSLlorean: It works quickly on e200, H10 and 3g if GOPs are frequent enough.
03:31:01khermansthe draft article
03:31:03khermanshttp://www.kristian-hermansen.com/tmp/install-rockbox-ipod-ljarticle.txt
03:31:24khermansand script i threw together for one-click installation for common video ipods
03:31:24LloreanjhMikeS: Well, I'm trying to write new presets for WinFF, since ffmpeg's expected parameters have changed a bit, and there's a new version of WinFF and everything
03:31:25khermanshttp://www.kristian-hermansen.com/tmp/install-rockbox-ipod.sh
03:32:15jhMikeSLlorean: after using WinFF I'm seriously considering just doing my own. It's rather quirky in a bad way imo.
03:32:21LloreanYeah
03:32:39LloreanIt's far from perfect, but it's a lot less complicated than all these other all-in-one solutions with four million options.
03:33:19khermansLlorean, i found this method of installation to be painless, but rockbox manual installation can be done if the readers like
03:33:32khermanshope you guys have input on the article
03:33:42khermanstentative title is "OGG, FLAC, and more on your iPod!"
03:33:56Lloreankhermans: We don't recommend people use other methods of installation, since those often break if our method changes. We're moving people to the RBUtility, as it's mostly usable now
03:34:00khermanswill appear on LinuxJournal.com in 48 hours
03:34:11khermansLlorean, i figured as much
03:34:23khermansin the article, i mention that this only works for 30, 60. and 80 gb Ipods
03:34:33khermansand that it will simply work on those models
03:34:41khermansif they have something else, move to manual installation on the site
03:34:46Lloreankhermans: Does it distinguish between the 30gb build and the 60/80 gb build?
03:34:53khermansbut a full article on manual installation seemed a bit much
03:34:55khermansLlorean, no
03:35:12khermansLlorean, but i read in the shell variable
03:35:39khermanswhatever they type −− if it is 60/80 it is same function
03:35:39LloreanjhMikeS: If you do decide to do your own whatever, if it's usable it might be a good addition for RBUtil.
03:36:05khermansLlorean, do you have a simple automated installer, because although I may be able to futz around and install Rockbox, i think a lot of the LJ reader-base are quite naive
03:36:23LloreanOne significant annoyance I have with ffmpeg is that it doesn't have a a "maintain proportions" option of some sort. I really feel I should be able to set a maximum width and height, and let it scale the video to fit within them. Other than that, I'd be quite happy with RBUtil just offering a basic front end for it, with hard coded presets, and you just pick your player
03:36:37LloreanBut as it stands, for ffmpeg, you'd still have to pick the aspect ratio of your input file, or end up with weird looking output.
03:36:51Lloreankhermans: RBUtility is the automated installer
03:36:58Lloreankhermans: ipodpatcher is the more complicated method
03:37:07khermansLlorean, cant you just use -sameq ?
03:37:09LloreanRBUtility can, with many players, automatically detect the player and model.
03:37:21khermansLlorean, what are pros and cons?
03:37:28Lloreankhermans: -sameq affects the bitrate. Basically it just makes it use the lowest possible quantization value, and hope for the best.
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03:38:04Lloreankhermans: "Pros" are "Requires little or no technical knowledge." Cons are "If it can't automatically detect where your player is, you may actually find the manual install slightly easier"
03:38:06khermansLlorean, well i also noticed that no addons are automatically installed
03:38:11Llorean"Addons"?
03:38:20khermansLlorean, themes, games, etc
03:38:26LloreanGames are automatically installed
03:38:31LloreanAll the official plugins are there
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03:38:41khermansLlorean, oh let me check which plugins i pulled in
03:38:45LloreanRBUtility gives you the option to download themes, the font package, etc.
03:39:07khermansLlorean, fonts
03:39:19khermansahh interesting...
03:39:38LloreanThe manual installation process requires you to download fonts separately. They change so rarely, and are such a large percentage of the archive size that we don't feel every download needs to include them
03:40:31khermansLlorean, you include Doom in the automated instakller as an option?
03:40:35khermansi am about to test this one
03:40:46LloreanI don't know of the freedoom package is listed as an option, honestly
03:41:57khermans"Warning: Autodetection is unable to distinguish between the Ipod 30 GB and 60 GB / 80 GB models and defaults to the 30 GB model. This will usually work but you might want to check the detected value, especially if you experience problems with Rockbox."
03:42:11khermanswould have b0rked my 30gb i think
03:42:19khermansi mean, i have an 80gb
03:44:18khermansso is this link outdated? −−> http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodInstallationFromLinux
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03:45:14Lloreankhermans: No instructions should be followed except those in the manual
03:45:29Lloreankhermans: And there's no harm in installing a 30gb build to an 80gb iPod. It's the other way around that's problematic
03:49:49karimsalut
03:51:27khermanshrmm "unsuported install Method" in rbutil
03:51:34*khermans checks faq
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03:53:30khermansrbutil seems to hang on my IPOD
03:56:26khermansLlorean, is the svn version worth checking out and building of rbutil?
03:58:06LloreanProbably
03:58:10LloreanI think it might have a few fixes.
03:58:15LloreanSpecifically with the autodetection.
03:58:21***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:59:14khermansLlorean, hehe 50MB of qt dev files to go :-0
04:00
04:01:19khermansmake[1]: *** No rule to make target `rbspeex', needed by `rbutilqt'. Stop.
04:02:00LloreanHow much of the Rockbox source tree did you check out?
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04:02:20khermanssvn co svn://svn.rockbox.org/rockbox/trunk/rbutil rbutil
04:02:39LloreanI don't think that'll be enough, since you won't get the tools folder, I imagine.
04:02:43khermansqmake && make
04:02:43*Llorean isn't sure.
04:02:44khermanscompleted
04:03:08khermansLlorean, following this
04:03:08khermanshttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtility
04:03:17LloreanI personally haven't played with the utility yet. I know it's the recommended method, but I can't get over the old habit of doing everything manually
04:03:46LloreanI would imagine that page hasn't been updated by someone who knows how the dependency on the speex encoder for talk file generation works.
04:04:22LloreanOr perhaps rbspeexenc needs to be added to the checkout. I don't really know how SVN itself works, if it's folder based, or tag based somehow, or what
04:04:23khermansLlorean, i can just edit the Makefile of course
04:04:47Lloreankhermans: Well the issue is having the right files, more than telling it where they are. :)
04:05:42khermansill just checkout full TRUNK
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04:08:06khermansLlorean, k worked −− had to do full TRUNK co
04:09:11khermanssome hefty code!
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04:17:13saratogahas anyone else noticed that hitting back on the Sansa doesn't actually let you skip to the previous track?
04:17:25saratogaor is that only on my sansa
04:20:08khermansLlorean, SVN version works much better!
04:20:27khermansgot it built and installed here on Ubuntu Gutsy
04:20:41khermansrunning great and finishing up Rockbox tranfer
04:20:51Lloreankhermans: When it works, it works quite well. :)
04:20:53khermansthemes mysteriously failed though
04:21:03LloreanThe theme site is actually undergoing change
04:21:09khermansLlorean, ahh...
04:21:53LloreanThe site's been seeing way too much bandwidth usage.
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04:23:18khermansoh no, my ipod bricked :-(
04:24:16khermansjust messing with ya... :pP
04:24:31saratogawow blackhawk actually submitted a patch for his project
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04:34:15Lloreankhermans: Considering that it's for all practical purposes impossible to brick an iPod without either an official Apple update or tools not provided by the Rockbox project, I wasn't gonna believe you anyway. :-P
04:34:29Lloreansaratoga: Is it in a usable state at all or does it still contain like 40 other patches?
04:34:49khermansheh
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04:35:19saratogaLlorean: he appears to have removed the other patches
04:35:24LloreanGood to hear. :)
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04:35:27saratogathough his diff contains his build directory too I think
04:35:38saratogabut thats harmless enough aside from making the file size huge
04:35:41LloreanHehehe
04:35:42LloreanYeah
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04:43:28ddaltonhey can someone check the document I am about to read to make sure it is on arm which will help me with the e200 v2 port?
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04:50:33pikhqsaratoga: Hmm. I'm not seeing that behavior on my Sansa.
04:50:59*pikhq just set up Rockbox yesterday, though; maybe you have an older build?
04:51:01saratogapikhq: when I'm playing a file, I hit back and it skips to the start
04:51:18pikhqHmm.
04:51:21saratogano matter how fast i jam it down again, it doesn't play the previous track, just keeps reseting the current one
04:51:29saratogadoesn't happen for you?
04:51:36Lloreansaratoga: What format?
04:51:37pikhqOh. . .
04:51:39pikhqHmm.
04:51:43saratogamp3
04:51:56pikhqMine goes to the start, and if I hit back again, it goes back a song.
04:52:05pikhqAlso on MP3.
04:52:55pikhq("The Else", by They Might Be Giants, downloaded from eMusic, if it matters)
04:53:46saratogajust updated and it seems to work normally
04:53:53saratogamust have been a quirk with that one build
04:53:58pikhqOdd.
04:54:01saratogathanks for the heads up
04:54:05LloreanIt's frustrating when that happens
04:54:26LloreanYou never know if it's a bug that'll come back and needs fixing, or something more or less random and bad luck
04:56:34khermansLlorean, hainv gTuring problems I see?
04:57:07khermansprovability of software is impossible :-)
05:00
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05:06:03ddaltonhas anyone here got a sansa e200?
05:06:12*pikhq raises his hand
05:06:23ddaltonwhat model? v1 or 2?
05:06:26pikhqv1
05:06:44pikhqI gather that you're wanting someone to help you test a v2 port?
05:06:53ddaltonoh ok. sorry I should have said v2. I am trying to work out the recovery mode. has anyone done this yet?
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05:10:10ddaltonok does anyone know where the unbrick wiki sansa e200 rockbox page is?
05:11:18psycho_maniachttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200Unbrick
05:11:28psycho_maniactook 10 seconds to find
05:11:36ddaltonyeah ok.
05:14:01saratogathere may not be a recovery mode on the V2 sansas, lots of players just have an emergency USB mode (Ipod) and that seems to work better
05:15:50ddaltonsaratoga: a guy in the forums reckons switching hold on then holding menu down while plugging in the usb cable gets you into disk mode. or actually recovery mode...
05:18:02ddaltonsaratoga: wait I'll look for a link.
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05:20:31ddaltonanyone seen this? Is it true? or is it someone in the forums not knowning what they are talking about? http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13961.msg109030
05:20:48ddaltonknowing
05:21:30ddaltonwell he can't press the right keys on his keyboard. I needed to use braille to read his message. Couldn't understand it with speech.
05:23:53ddaltonsaratoga: Did you see the message I posted?
05:24:01ddaltonbagder: around?
05:26:30ddaltonmy findings make sense to me, however, I would like to confirm them somewhere.
05:27:20saratogaddalton: do you have a v2?
05:27:38ddaltonyes but I am blind and can't read the screen at the minute.
05:27:50saratogaof course, i forgot that would be a problem
05:27:51ddaltonI need to get scanners and stuff set up for the port and haven't yet done so.
05:28:58ddaltonsaratoga: If I get the v2 into disk mode is there a chance of bricking by just putting it into disc mode?
05:29:08ddaltonif not how do I get back out of disk mode?
05:30:00saratogai think if you put it into recovery mode you can just reboot it
05:30:24ddaltonoh so it won't break? and to reboot is that just a long press of menu?
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05:40:02ddaltondoes that mean my ip was reset?
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05:48:20khermanseven after encoding to m4a using faac and the -w option to make an MPEG4 container −− still not playing on Rockbox
05:49:11LloreanWhat AAC profile are they encoded as?
05:49:46khermansLlorean, profile?
05:49:57khermansi just did −−> faac -b 32 -w foo.wav foo.m4a
05:49:57LloreanAAC has several profiles.
05:50:02LloreanHE, LTP, LE, etc.
05:50:05Lloreaner LC, not LE
05:50:26khermans01.m4a: ISO Media, MPEG v4 system, version 2
05:50:30khermansfile reports that
05:50:35LloreanThat doesn't tell what profile.
05:50:41khermanshow can i tell then?
05:50:51LloreanI don't know
05:50:53khermansmplayer -identify ?
05:51:12khermansOpening audio decoder: [faad] AAC (MPEG2/4 Advanced Audio Coding)
05:51:25khermansAUDIO: 44100 Hz, 2 ch, s16le, 31.9 kbit/2.26% (ratio: 3985->176400)
05:51:34khermanslooks like LE ?
05:51:37khermanss16le
05:51:40LloreanNo, it doesn't
05:51:41psycho_maniacIm just curious. Do the files work on your computer?
05:51:45LloreanThat's just the output stream type
05:51:47khermansSelected audio codec: [faad] afm: faad (FAAD AAC (MPEG-2/MPEG-4 Audio) decoder)
05:52:02LloreanThat still doesn't tell the profile
05:52:05khermansISO: File Type Major Brand: ISO/IEC 14496-1 (MPEG-4 system) v2
05:52:23LloreanLook, pasting everything in here won't help
05:52:28LloreanJust google up some method of identifying
05:52:44khermansi didnt know if you knew the info for that
05:52:50LloreanI know some people were getting LTP AACs out of Faac, or claiming to, and at a ridiculously low bitrate like that it might default to it
05:53:17LloreanI already said I don't know how to identify it. Unless something says clearly "Profile:" or "XX-AAC" I'm unlikely to know
05:54:19LloreanWhy not try using a realistic bitrate. 96kbps or so?
05:54:36khermansLlorean, well its audiobook
05:54:40LloreanThen use speex
05:54:48khermansLlorean, i did −− bugs remember :-)
05:54:54khermans@ 16000 khz
05:55:09LloreanAre you sure it's a bug, and not simply an artifact of the low bitrate?
05:55:19LloreanDo you honestly expect something not tuned for speech to actually have better sounding audio at that bitrate?
05:55:20khermanshowever, the quality sounded pretty good for OGG/Vorbis 32kbps mono
05:55:47khermansLlorean, i would think that by tuning the freq specifier that wouldn't matter
05:55:59khermansi can cut off signals above 8khz
05:56:00LloreanThe frequency specifier?
05:56:03khermansyes
05:56:13LloreanYou mean a highpass filter?
05:56:16 Quit fasmaie (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
05:56:21khermansLlorean, right
05:56:24LloreanOr lowpass filter rather
05:56:41khermansi can remove the highs that are out of voice range
05:56:45khermansthats a big savings
05:57:04LloreanYeah, but that doesn't make the codec any better at encoding speech.
05:57:24khermansLlorean, i would have to agree
05:57:46LloreanYou should experiment further with speech, I can get perfectly acceptable output out of it in Rockbox.
05:57:59khermansLlorean, what setting are you using ?
05:58:01LloreanErr, speex
05:58:07LloreanDon't remember, I encoded them nearly a year ago
05:58:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:58:26khermans32khz stereo?
05:58:34khermansi tried 16khz mon but didnt fly
05:58:40khermanssome bugs
05:58:44LloreanNo, it was 16khz mono
05:58:57khermansyou did the same and saw no problems?
05:59:03khermansand you used sppexenc ?
05:59:24khermans8bit or 16bit frames?
05:59:25LloreanYeah
05:59:30khermansfrom WAV
05:59:34Llorean16 bit
05:59:39khermanshrmm, i used 8bit
05:59:46khermans-b option from sox
05:59:47LloreanWhy?
06:00
06:00:05khermansthey sounded fine in the output WAV
06:00:08LloreanIf you're willing to go up to 32kbps in AAC, do a 32kbps Speex
06:00:22khermansthats essentially what i did
06:00:38khermansbut perhaps some other option i chose was casuing issues
06:00:48khermansi know i did −−vad
06:00:53khermansand −−vbr
06:01:09khermanswhich could be partly the cause i suppose
06:01:26LloreanThe only parameters I used were the one for wideband, and the one for quality, if I recall
06:01:35LloreanThe input was already a 16-bit mono wav.
06:02:04khermansLlorean, you chose quality over a VBR specifier?
06:02:09khermanshrmm ill try that instead
06:02:28khermansi was under the impression that VBR was superior, unless you were streaming
06:02:43khermansbecause then some high data blocks would snag CPU
06:02:51khermansand cause latency
06:03:04Lloreankhermans: The codec is intended for you to pick a quality.
06:03:05khermansit was noted in the docs too
06:03:17LloreanJust like vorbis.
06:03:28khermansdefault is 8
06:03:33khermansi set -b 32
06:03:37LloreanI think I used 6, but I really cant remember.
06:03:40LloreanDon't set a bitrate.
06:03:43khermansnever?
06:03:46LloreanNever.
06:03:51khermansLlorean, oh really?
06:03:55LloreanYou're forcing it into a box you don't need to.
06:04:00khermansLlorean, does the encoder autodetect?
06:04:05khermanshow can it know!??
06:04:08LloreanThat's what quality is.
06:04:17khermanslol
06:04:27LloreanIt'll pick bitrates as it goes appropriate for encoding those samples at that relative quality
06:04:29khermansi guess i never looked at it that way
06:04:36LloreanIf your file ends up too big, try a lower quality setting.
06:04:44khermansvery interesting
06:04:49khermansthis could be the cause of all my issues
06:04:57khermansand this would go for any codec?
06:05:17LloreanNot necessarily
06:05:21khermansi mean, back in the lame days, literally, i dont remember quality settings
06:05:26LloreanBut vorbis/speex especially
06:05:32khermansi remember setting either my CBR or VBR
06:05:34Lloreanlame has always had things like preset-standard
06:05:55khermansLlorean, very good to know though
06:06:20LloreanSetting a bitrate is only really useful if you have a target final file size.
06:06:28khermansLlorean, so i assume that this quality setting encodes and compares the output wav form to the input wave form to see how decrepit it is
06:06:48khermansso, for .8 would signify 80% retention of original wve form?
06:06:54LloreanIt'll pretty much always get inferior results overall because the encoder will be allocating bits based on an attempt to hit a target filesize, rather than attempting to hit a target quality for each frame.
06:06:56khermansis this correct?
06:06:58LloreanNo
06:07:05LloreanThe numbers don't really represent anything absolute
06:07:12LloreanIt's just like the 1 to 10 on a volume knob.
06:07:21LloreanThey just mean "worse" or "better"
06:07:26khermansLlorean, usually it is linear :-)
06:07:39khermansLlorean, well i am no dummy,. just to this
06:07:42LloreanLinear, but they don't represent the original loudness in any way, just the range of your system.
06:07:53Llorean10 on your speakers may be considerably louder than the song was played.
06:09:00LloreanSpeex is unlikely to ever reproduce 100% accurately the original wavform, it's the nature of lossy compression: it discards things.
06:09:07khermansi have written visual detection algorithms and variations on gaussian filtering and canny/sobel edge detection
06:09:38khermansof course, i understand the lossy issue
06:09:45khermansif I wanted something losless, i would use flac
06:10:05LloreanIndeed
06:10:40LloreanBut really, the speex files I still have sound fine, except a couple where I had to do a lossy->lossy transcode, and there's already some artifacts
06:11:46khermansLlorean, well actually this particular sample is from lossy (mp3) original
06:12:09khermansi guess that gives the encoder a significant disadvantage
06:12:43ddaltonhey do I have any chance at getting the docs from ams for the AS3525?
06:12:48Lloreankhermans: A very significant one.
06:13:26 Quit iamben (Connection reset by peer)
06:13:34Lloreanddalton: I thought that the docs for that were already available. That's the SoC in the v2 sansas, right?
06:14:44ddaltonyeah. but is bagder allowed to let me view them?
06:15:14ddaltonwhat is "SoC"?
06:15:19LloreanSystem on a Chip
06:15:21 Quit ender` (" I love deadlines. I especially like the whooshing sound they make as they go flying by. -- Douglas Adams")
06:16:06ddaltonyeah. ok thanks. so is bagder allowed to show me them?
06:16:53LloreanI don't know.
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06:19:45ddaltonok well if he can't give me a copy I found a form to get the docs.
06:19:48ddaltonor data sheet.
06:20:00ddaltonis that what we want "data sheet"?
06:20:40ddaltonand it asks for the company. is that just rockbox in our case?
06:21:07LloreanRockbox isn't a company
06:21:10ddaltonah yep he got the data sheat...
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06:21:59ddaltonanyone here own a sansa v2 e200?
06:32:19ddaltonLlorean: I know. so what do we say in that field?
06:32:34LloreanI don't know
06:32:52LloreanBut I wouldn't put "Rockbox" unless you're willing to accept any responsibility if they come back with questions about how we intend to use it, etc.
06:33:01*ddalton Checks if its required.
06:33:08LloreanBasically, unless you plan to try to act as a representative for the whole project.
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06:43:16ddaltonok I'll ask some other devs. I want to do this port but want to get as many docs as I can...
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06:49:14saratogaddalton: until you've got a way to update the firmware on teh V2s, having the datasheet probably won't help a whole lot
06:49:40saratogaits just going to tell you how to initialize things, how dma works, interupts, etc, and thats not going to be much use until you can actually upload code
06:50:10saratogaLlorean: whenever someone complains about faac in rockbox we should just tell them to stop using faac
06:50:30saratogaits literally worse then every other lossy codec we support in rockbox
06:50:54saratogatheres no reason to ever use it
06:52:22Lloreansaratoga: Is there any other linux-native AAC encoder?
06:52:36saratogai don't know
06:52:40LloreanHeh
06:52:46saratogaprobably not
06:52:50LloreanOur decoder is problematic enough anyway
06:52:57saratogatheres hardly any aac encoders actually, let alone good ones
06:53:05LloreanThe codec's *huge*, has problems with long file, and every now and then we find more broken metadata parsing
06:53:30saratogareally the answer to problems with faac encoded files is "use vorbis"
06:53:36LloreanHahaha
06:53:43pikhqI'll second that.
06:53:56*pikhq is of the opinion that only Vorbis and Flac should be used anyways, so. . .
06:54:21LloreanI encoded AC3->Faac earlier for a video, and it didn't sound noticeably bad, but I have tin ears anyway.
06:55:16saratogai sat down and read the ac3 format spec a while back
06:55:22saratogatheres a format i can really hate
06:55:38saratogaits like they sat down and asked "how can i make something so much worse then mp3"
06:55:48LloreanHahaha
06:56:30LloreanWell, both the DVD format, and now I'm thinking High Definition video disk formats as well, are crazy I think.
06:56:33 Quit psycho_maniac (" enter funny comment here.")
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06:57:21LloreanI fear I'll never understand why you'd include both uncompressed and lossy compressed soundtracks on the same disk if the standard *requires* that the player be able to handle the uncompressed one.
06:57:50saratogaisn't the uncompressed only 2 channel most of the time?
06:58:02LloreanNo
06:58:10LloreanPCM 5.1 on the disks I own that have it
06:58:24saratogathat is really odd
06:58:24LloreanI think there's also a lossless format they have to support. Dolby TrueHD, iirc, is losslessly compressed.
06:58:39saratogathis is HD-DVD/Bluray?
06:58:42LloreanYep
06:58:48saratogaoh ok
06:59:00LloreanJust silly formats.
06:59:09pikhqI think I know why: encourage people to spend more money because large movies get shoved into 2 discs.
06:59:31ddaltonhow did we do the h300 port with out a recovery mode?
06:59:32pikhqRather than, say, 1 disc for several movies.
06:59:47pikhq(seriously: 6 channel lossy, lossless, *and* uncompressed?!?)
06:59:57saratogathat or maybe to justify those expensive new smaller wavelength lasers
07:00
07:00:21Lloreanddalton: Special hardware to recover bricked players
07:00:30pikhqI'd say having a high-quality HD signal could be used to justify that if they didn't *waste* it.
07:00:39LloreanThe Lossless isn't mandatory, apparently
07:00:54pikhqHonestly? One lossless stream, one very high-quality video stream.
07:00:58LloreanFor Bluray, 100% optional. For HDDVD, the player MUST be able to decode the lossless, but it's only required to decode the primary 2 channels, not all of it
07:01:01saratoganon mandatory formats make no sense
07:01:07LloreanAgreed
07:01:33ddaltonLlorean: ah. So if I find a disk mode and run the worse bit of code I could think off it bricks it completely then can I restore it and get it working again since it has a recovery mode?
07:01:53Lloreanddalton: Not necessarily
07:02:00saratogaassuming you don't corrupt the NAND flash you'll generally be ok
07:02:01ddaltonwhy?
07:02:02Lloreanddalton: Depending on the player, you could accidentally remove the disk mode
07:02:27saratogayou can certainly brick a sansa if you screw up the flash memory though, since music and the bootloader are all on the chip
07:02:29ddaltonoh. but isn't the disk mode and the fw different? separate?
07:02:40LloreanNot always
07:02:57Lloreansaratoga: There's always that preboot mode, right?
07:03:01LloreanOn the e200 regular?
07:05:03saratogai assume thats in the same chip too, unless theres some ROM in the pp5024 itself
07:05:29LloreanWell, it's called "preboot" so it might be.
07:05:42LloreanIf I recall correctly it identifies itself with a completely different device ID
07:06:27 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
07:08:39 Part toffe82
07:16:02saratogastupid question about c: if I declare an array in a header file, and then include that header into two seperate c files, does it create two seperate copies of that array or is the compiler smart enough to know there should be one copy shared between the two files
07:18:13hcsIn the header the array should be marked with extern, so that files you include it from know what type it is. The actual definition of the array should actually be in a .c file somewhere.
07:18:45hcsOne instance is the definition, the other is the declaration, I can never remember which is which.
07:19:43saratogathats what i was thinking, but if i declare the array as an extern in the c file, the codec segfaults trying to access it
07:20:42hcscould you maybe pastebin the relevant snippits?
07:20:43saratogathough surprisingly the linker gives no errors
07:23:25saratogahere you go:
07:23:25saratogahttp://pastebin.ca/833432
07:25:20hcsother way around, the extern float pow_10_to_yover16[] should go in the .h, and the const float pow_10_to_yover16[] in either wma.c or wmadec.c
07:26:18hcsI think you just have a local float * in decode_exp_vlc
07:27:06saratogaextern goes where you're using the variable, not where you actually allocate space for it i think
07:27:14ddaltondo you need to go into recovery mode to update the of on the e200?
07:27:26Lloreanddalton: No
07:27:27saratogaddalton: you don't have to but its one way to do it
07:28:05ddaltonoh. so why is it so hard to find how to put the v2 into recovery mode? surely this isn't secret info like data sheats...
07:28:40ddaltonI believe its hold on plug in your sansa while holding menu on the v2 and rec on the v1. but this is from a guy in the forums and I am not sure how true that is...
07:29:12ddaltonhe was talking about holding menu for the v2 he didn't mention the v1. I found the v1 stuff on wiki.
07:29:53hcssaratoga: The compiler is confused, otherwise it would be complaining that your extern float * declaration isn't const
07:29:58ddaltonsaratoga: do you have a v2?
07:30:40saratogaddalton: no v1
07:30:51ddaltonoh
07:31:00ddaltondo any devs have a v2?
07:31:07saratogahcs: so you're saying I should put an extern in front of the actual table in the h file ?
07:31:19hcsthe table shouldn't be in the .h file
07:31:28saratogawell thats ffmpeg's call not mine
07:31:35saratogaso i can't do much about it
07:31:59ddaltonare the v2 sansas still been manufactured?
07:32:09hcssaratoga: does wmadec.c include wmadata.h?
07:33:38saratogahcs: no, i tried that to make sure and it does generate an error
07:33:50saratogai'm wondering if not using a const is enough to screw up the compiler
07:35:19pikhqddalton: I honestly don't know, except to say that I got my v1 just yesterday for Christmas.
07:36:31Lloreanddalton: As far as we know, the v2 are still being manufactured and sold. Since they're fairly new I can't imagine they've already stopped
07:36:36hcssaratoga: How does the ffmpeg source reference this?
07:37:09hcssaratoga: I'd suggest renaming wmadata.h to wmadata.c and making a wmadata.h with the appropriate externs.
07:37:27 Join webguest42 [0] (n=4a80d408@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e6e3fef0918b4c4b)
07:38:15webguest42need help with c250 installation
07:38:34pikhqLlorean: It would also seem odd for a recently obtained e200 to be v1 with the v2 still out.
07:39:13webguest42I can install everything but the sansa patch will not recognize my player. How can I get Rockbox up and running?
07:39:29scorchepikhq: getting rid of surplus...
07:39:35Lloreanpikhq: It seems that many stores are working through v1 stocks still, possibly because Sandisk isn't marketing them as separate products
07:39:52pikhqFair enough.
07:42:59hcssaratoga: if you include that wmadata.h in its current form in both wma.c and wmadec.c you'll get errors when they're linked
07:43:46webguest42This v2 that you are talking about, does that mean that we can't use Rockbox at all or is there some work around if you can install part of the components?
07:44:12scorcherockbox does not work on the v2
07:46:34ddaltonwebguest42: I am trying to work on a port. But I can't find a page on its recovery mode anywhere. do you have a e200 v2?
07:47:11ddaltonscorche: I know thats why I want to work on the port.
07:47:14webguest42I have a c250 the 2 gig model.
07:47:25ddaltonv2?
07:48:33webguest42What do you recommend that I do? Should I keep and wait for a possible work or return it?
07:48:54ddaltonscorche: is it v2?
07:49:02ddaltonoops wrong person.
07:49:22ddaltonwebguest42: that last message was for you. Is it v2?
07:49:26 Join hacker [0] (n=4a413ea7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b1c9640011776e68)
07:49:37hackerHello
07:50:18hackerhello
07:50:28 Quit hacker (Client Quit)
07:50:29 Join CIA [0] (n=4a413ea7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-08cf67e1d60e1172)
07:50:30webguest42Yes, it is c250 2 gig v2.
07:50:33ddaltonand if it is does the e200 and c200 both use the same technique for getting into disk mode?
07:50:41hcsCIA/hacker: hello
07:50:46ddaltone200 and c200 v1...
07:50:58 Quit CIA (Client Quit)
07:51:02 Join Yurivilca [0] (i=Yurivilc@h147.138.134.98.ip.windstream.net)
07:51:03 Join CIA [0] (n=4a413ea7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-5acbd4aa2b594228)
07:51:10CIAhey guys
07:51:37CIAWhos admin here
07:51:47saratogahcs: adding the const was enough to fix it
07:51:50Yurivilcahttp://digg.com/2008_us_elections/Mike_Huckabee_If_you_vote_for_me_you_live_if_you_don_t
07:51:52YurivilcaCheck out Mike Huckabee's latest psychotic utterance!
07:52:08saratogano
07:52:13saratogaalso, get out
07:52:30CIAI have a vuln to report to the admin
07:52:34scorcheYurivilca: that is offtopic for this channel...as a side note, many if not most people in here are not even from the US...
07:52:47CIAscripting hole in the reader.pl
07:52:49webguest42The way that I got into disk mode (found this in sandisk forums) was to have the player on, move the hold button to on, press and hold the rewind button while plugging in the usb connecter.
07:52:54 Part Yurivilca ("Leaving")
07:52:58hcssaratoga: odd, though I guess I can see why. still, I really don't like that arrangement
07:53:18webguest42my computer then recognizes but tells me it is a sansa c240.
07:53:25ddaltonah. could you check if that is the case for e200? That may help me with my port...
07:53:54CIA<script>for (;;);</script>
07:54:00CIAYo
07:54:21CIA______________________________________________________________________________________________
07:54:24CIAAttention
07:55:01scorcheCIA: we heard you...no need to be like that...
07:55:22CIA<table border=1><tr><td>hello</td></tr></table>
07:55:26CIAis the admin here
07:55:28CIAi need email
07:55:30saratogai guess you could file an entry in the bug tracker
07:55:36webguest42ddalton: are you asking me to check the e200? I only have the c250.
07:56:03scorcheCIA: you can just say whatever it is here, and we can tell them to have a look at the logs when he comes around
07:56:24scorchewell, how serious is this "vuln"?
07:56:49pikhq<script lang="tcl">apply {{x} {{*}$x $x}} {apply {{x} {{*}$x $x}}}</script>
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07:58:05hcssaratoga: the const doesn't fix the issue, you may just be getting lucky
07:58:28***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
07:59:34ddaltonwhat should the drive be called in windows when I connect my sansa in disk mode/ (recovery mode)
07:59:44CIAwell let them know this
08:00
08:00:35CIAher eis aexample
08:00:35CIAhttp://www.rockbox.org/irc/reader.pl?date=%22%3E%3Cscript%3Ewindow.location=%22http://www.cia.gov%22%3C/script%3E
08:02:18webguest42mine is called sansa c240 and it used the "O" drive which is the next letter open for me.
08:02:18CIAdate= evil code
08:02:19scorcheah...just a redirect...
08:02:19 Quit webguest89 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
08:02:22hcssaratoga: I have a small test running here that causes the segfault, but it goes away when I use extern const float bob[] instead of extern const float * bob in code doing the referencing.
08:02:37scorcheoh...you meant for...
08:03:08hcssaratoga: indicating that it is a very fine balance of how gcc is handling it
08:03:09CIAno point is u can inject anything
08:03:23scorcheyes...i got that...it is late >_>
08:04:23*pikhq wonders how in the world the difference between float bob[] and float *bob is at all relevant. Surely they'd be compiled as the same thing?!?
08:04:34CIAher eis a better one
08:04:35CIAhttp://www.rockbox.org/irc/reader.pl?date=%22%3E%3Cscript%20src=http://members.lycos.co.uk/ag3nt2007/xss/XSS2.js%3E%3C/script%3E
08:04:46pikhqQuite a subtle thing, apparently.
08:05:09hcswhat's so subtle about a script in the url?
08:05:33CIAcoder error .. u can do alot woth it
08:05:42CIAget burp proxy and so on
08:05:46hcspikhq: I completely misunderstood your comment.
08:05:49pikhqThe float bob[] != float *bob bit.
08:05:51pikhqAh.
08:05:53webguest42If I return the c250 v2, what should I get instead?
08:06:08 Join ddalton_ [0] (n=ddalton@124-168-58-243.dyn.iinet.net.au)
08:06:24CIAanyways i got to go
08:06:25CIAbye
08:06:33CIAHope admin cheks logs
08:07:18webguest42ddalton: Did I lose you?
08:07:44ddalton_ok so by default does your sansa come up with as a drive letter when you connect it normally?
08:07:59CIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
08:08:02 Quit ddalton (Nick collision from services.)
08:08:06 Nick ddalton_ is now known as ddalton (n=ddalton@124-168-58-243.dyn.iinet.net.au)
08:08:08scorcheCIA: ...
08:08:24CIA<out?>
08:08:36CIAjust something to grab ther attention
08:08:43scorchenot needed
08:08:48CIA: )
08:09:01 Part CIA
08:09:01scorchenot to mention very annoying and against the guidelines of this channel..
08:09:52webguest42When I connect normally, it comes up in My Computer as an Audio Device but has no drive letter connected to it?
08:10:08ddaltonwho had the v2 c200 before?
08:10:44hcspikhq: I don't think there should be any difference. Maybe an alignment thing. Yep, with bob[] the address is aligned.
08:10:48ddaltonwebguest42: ah. I think I am making progress. so can you do something for me?
08:10:53hcs0x12 vs. 0x13
08:11:04webguest42I'll try?
08:11:22pikhqhcs: Quite odd. Not used to having address *alignment* matter.
08:11:28webguest42oops, sorry about that. I'll try (no question).
08:11:35pikhqGranted, I'm coddled by my x86_64 environment.
08:11:47ddaltonwebguest42: Thx. BTW can you prefix your messages to me with a "dalton" or "ddalton:" it just makes it slightly easier to follow with a screenreader. ok; Do this.
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08:11:53ddaltonOne connect the player normally.
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08:12:18webguest42ddalton: FYI, I'm not a developer but fairly techy so I'll try whatever.
08:12:42hcspikhq: I'm testing this on x86, where I don't think alignment is needed for floats?
08:12:55ddaltonwebguest42: ok so is it connected normally? Just so it says sansa whatever in my computer?
08:13:23webguest42yes.
08:13:38hcspikhq: Even if it is, I'd expect the fault to be handled by the OS. I think it's a matter of one version putting the address exactly where the linker expects it.
08:13:41ddaltonwebguest42: ok now open up my computer/sansa whatever.
08:13:48webguest42ddalton: yes
08:13:48ddaltonand tell me what directories you see.
08:14:30webguest42ddalton: Data folder and Media folder
08:15:57hcspikhq: yeah, the pointer is completely invalid
08:16:10pikhqo.o
08:16:22ddaltonwebguest42: one moment.
08:16:54*pikhq goes off to pray to the K&R Gods, and demand to know why they must be cruel to us mere mortals
08:17:36khermanspikhq, NULL ptr derefs got you down?
08:17:45khermansheh
08:18:04ddaltonwebguest42: Did you connect with the hold switch on or off?
08:18:09pikhqSuch *obscure* bits of the C language tend to irritate me.
08:18:54pikhq(I mean seriously. . . type float[] != type float*? My brain hurts.)
08:19:28webguest42ddalton: hold switch was off
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08:20:41ddaltonok now please double click your media folder...
08:20:45ddaltonwebguest42
08:21:18saratogapikhq: i've noticed that [] * often have different meanings to the compiler
08:21:23ddaltonsorry about the delay. blindness doesn't help telling if hold is on or off. :-)
08:21:36saratogaprobably because [] tells it that theres a 1D array, while * doesn't specify
08:21:48hcssaratoga, pikhq: demo http://pastebin.ca/833455
08:21:49pikhqsaratoga: It's making a Brainfuck programmer's brain hurt. That is a bad sign.
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08:22:32hcsI can't figure out what's up...
08:23:10ddaltonok looks like im in the normal sansa... now webguest42, can you tell me what folders/files you see in the root of the sansa when you connect in disk mode?
08:23:28webguest42ddalton: Music folder, Photo folder, Playlists folder, Record folder
08:23:44ddaltonyep ok. so is that in the standard mode?
08:23:55pikhqBad example code.
08:24:04pikhqYou're printing two pointers there.
08:24:14webguest42ddalton: yes that is standard mode, give me a sec to reconnect in disk mode
08:24:14hcsotherwise it'll segfault on one
08:26:05pikhqI seriously don't get how the array is segfaulting for me.
08:26:30hcspikhq: 'cause there's an invalid pointer in the pointer version
08:26:34pikhqErm.
08:26:58pikhqI'm *remarkably* confused.
08:27:19pikhqBut they are treated differently. Go figure.
08:27:24webguest42ddalton: now I have −− audible folder, music folder, photo folder, record folder, .rockbox folder and the following files −− DID.bin, MTABLE.SYS, RES_INFO.SYS, SYS_CONF.SYS and version.sdk
08:27:24ddaltonwebguest42: Sorry I would usually do this in linux but its harder to tell what is going on... I guess it isn't. But I am forced to shutdown my win box every time I want to disconnect my sansa since my screenreader can't find the safely remove hardware thing. or most times...
08:27:50pikhqPerhaps your extern declarations should match the type of the variable? :p
08:28:09hcspikhq: Since the linking is just based on names, yeah, I think the declarations should match exactly.
08:29:11webguest42ddalton: I do not use the safely remove hardware. It works just fine disconnecting the USB cable.
08:29:26hcswebguest42: good luck with that
08:29:52ddaltonI know. But I have always used umount. but I don't know I do that for mp3 players but not drives like usb thumb drives...
08:30:50*pikhq always does an umount. Having to umount -f sometime later is not fun; especially if the filesystem is somehow borked on the USB mass storage device. . .
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08:32:06saratogaddalton: unless you've written something its safe to pull the plug, in Windows at least
08:33:40webguest42ddalton: I don't mean to sound ungrateful. But I am in the US on Eastern time and it is 2:32 am. Do we have much more to try at this point or do you want to plan to meet here at another time?
08:39:26ddaltonwebguest42: Ok; Well I was just trying to get mine into disk mode since that is the first step to a port. Then atleast we could start a wiki page with a recovery mode for the e200 and c200.
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08:39:47ddaltonjust one question before you go. What do you see in the drive when it is connected in recovery mode?
08:40:32webguest42ddalton: now I have −− audible folder, music folder, photo folder, record folder, .rockbox folder and the following files −− DID.bin, MTABLE.SYS, RES_INFO.SYS, SYS_CONF.SYS and version.sdk
08:41:16ddaltonwebguest42: ok good. and what does your sansa screen say? I can't check mine. I am visually impared. Did I tell you that?
08:41:33ddaltonwhat does it say when connected in recovery mode?
08:42:38webguest42So am I but under my current lighting conditions I can read it (hence the reason I may return it if Rockbox won't work). Any time it is connected to the computer−−in either mode−−it simply says connecting
08:43:38ddaltonwebguest42: ah ok. I am totally blind so can't even read normal letters... but ok good. And are you 100% sure this is disk mode?
08:43:54 Part Llorean
08:44:42webguest42Well, it comes up as an actual drive mode which is different from having no drive letter so I am assuming that it is in disk mode.
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08:46:14ddaltonwebguest42: ok. I will try and confirm with some other developers. I thought there should be a mi4 file there. But perhaps I can ask what people see on the v1s. Thank you very much for all your help though. I really appreciate it. Hopefully this has made some progress on the port. If I was you though I would probably swap it for a v1. They are pretty hard to find though.
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08:46:45webguest42ddalton: sorry, I meant to say as an actual drive with a letter and I am assuming this is drive mode since I was able to perform the first steps of installing Rockbox.
08:47:28ddaltonah ok. well as I said I want to be sure it is disk mode before I start writing wiki pages and stuff...
08:47:35webguest42Are you talking about the rockbox.mi4 file?
08:48:03webguest42That file is in the .rockbox folder and not the root.
08:48:40ddaltonwebguest42: no. I thought there was one for the of. but I could be wrong. I also heard something about a 16 mb partition.
08:49:35 Quit Soap_ (Client Quit)
08:49:58webguest42ddalton: I say the information that referenced the partition but I did not follow those directions for getting into disk mode.
08:50:42webguest42I was a little leary of that incase it really messed something up and I needed to return the player.
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08:50:51ddaltonwebguest42: ok. well I read to hold menu down while inserting the cable to get into disk mode.
08:51:04ddaltoncould you quickly try something for me since you can read your screen?
08:51:12webguest42Do you have any suggestions for a different player since the v1 are so hard to find?
08:51:23webguest42ddalton: yes
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08:52:22ddaltonwebguest42: Ok well first -turn off the player -switch hold on -hold down menu and insert the cable -Keep it down until you see something about a 16 mb partition
08:52:33ddaltonif you don't see it after say 15 seconds just let go of menu.
08:53:13ddaltonand a player to get. Well you may be able to get one of ebay. I think my port is going to take a while though. and perhaps a player of ebay since the other plays aren't sold either...
08:53:57ddalton*off
08:54:11webguest42hold on
08:54:36ddaltonk
08:54:48advcomp2019ddalton, and webguest42, the v2s do not use the mi4 files like the v1s
08:55:27ddaltonadvcomp2019: oh. where did you see this? on bagder's website?
08:56:16advcomp2019ddalton, yea.. i looks like bin files
08:56:38ddaltonadvcomp2019: do you have a v2?
08:56:40webguest42No. This brings it up in standard mode and not in disk mode and never says anything about the 16 mb partion
08:57:35ddaltonok then. well I don't know what else to try. I really need to find a proper disk mode. maybe the one you said before is the correct one. I'll check with bagder and let you know if I have any luck.
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08:57:54advcomp2019ddalton, no.. i am just reading Bagder's site
08:58:00ddaltonBut since I am going to be working on the v2 I suggest you return your player and get a supported one. Thanks for the help though.
08:58:44ddaltonadvcomp2019: do you reckon tech support or something at sandisk would tell me this?
08:59:16ddaltonsorry I'll be working on the e200 v2.
08:59:21ddaltonthat's what I meant.
08:59:29webguest42Thanks for trying. I really thought I had done my research before asking for this for Christmas. Now I have to return it and don't know what to get.
08:59:48advcomp2019ddalton, do not know
09:00
09:00:24ddaltonWell take a look on ebay. perhaps look at e200s. and ask the seller what the fw version is.
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09:00:40ddaltonif it starts with 03 its a v2 if it starts with 01 its a v1.
09:00:45ddaltonor maybe no 0 not sure...
09:00:52JdGordonwebguest42: you got a e200 v2? what capacity?
09:01:08ddaltonJdGordon: hey.
09:01:17webguest42jdgordon: no a c250 v2 2 gig
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09:02:00ddaltonJdGordon: Do you have a sansa v2?
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09:02:12JdGordonwebguest42: i have a slighty damaged e250 which im looking to get rid of if you possibly want to do some sort of swap?
09:02:16JdGordonddalton: hi, no v1
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09:02:30JdGordonv2 are the telechips ones yeah?
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09:02:59ddaltonJdGordon: ok. I am looking to port rockbox to my e200. what do you reckon? worth a shot?
09:03:07advcomp2019JdGordon, the v2 are ams
09:03:34JdGordonah, we got the docs for them... /me would love to try another port
09:04:16ddaltonJdGordon: I have started working on it. First I am looking for a recovery mode. I have been talking to aliask about it too...
09:04:48JdGordonthe more ports the better... if you find the recovery mode thats a big step
09:04:56saratogaJdGordon: theres someone in the forums every day asking about the V2, so you could probably swap pretty easily
09:05:41webguest42Thanks for the help, both of you. But I've now it the 3 AM mark and I really, really need to go to bed. I may consider the Zen Stone then. Do any of you know if it has resume feature? Or if you can delete directly from player?
09:06:25amiconnJdGordon: more ports == better is correct, provided those ports actually advance...
09:06:32JdGordonddalton: recovery mode apparently is "turn on hold, hold rec and plug it and dont release rec untill its seen as a hard disk byt the computer"
09:06:32ddaltonJdGordon: I got a v2 e200 for christmas. I have looked all day. But as you probably guessed blindness hasn't helped me when looking at the screen. some guy in the forums said how to get into recovery mode but that didn't work. Could I perhaps ask sansa for this info?
09:07:03JdGordonamiconn: yeah, true
09:07:19*JdGordon goes to buzz eigima about the dsp
09:07:25amiconnNot much seems to happen on the mr500 port. And then there are linuxstb's "let's start a port and abandon it" ones...
09:07:46ddaltonJdGordon: yes for the v1... But holding rewind while inserting the cable with hold on shows up as a hard disk. with autable and stuff on it. is this disk mode?
09:07:47webguest42bye
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09:08:30DerDomegood morning :-)
09:08:36JdGordonamiconn: yeah, waiting for time to play with the mr500.. but there are older more stagnant ports
09:08:52*amiconn will *not* add the M3 to the build system until he actually starts working on it
09:09:15JdGordonyou forget.. rockbox runs fine on the mr500... just no audio
09:09:44JdGordonwhich is the same state the sansas and ipods were at when they were added..
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09:09:45amiconnJdGordon: Yeah, Tatung Elio, AV300 and Logikdax come to mind... (the last one being the most advanced of the 3)
09:09:51DerDomesomebody here who can give me wiki write permisson on rockbox.org?
09:09:52eigmahi amiconn
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09:10:20saratogaas long as these abandoned ports are going into the target tree and not cluttering up the rest of svn, i don't see a whole lot of harm
09:10:29JdGordonim tinhking more the ifp which hasnt had anything happen in ages.... since i have been around even possibly
09:11:11JdGordonwould be nice to move more of the archos code into target tree... clean it up a bit
09:11:13amiconnAh yes, that one too
09:11:21ddaltonJdGordon: when your e200 v1 is in recovery mode what are some directories you see?
09:11:37JdGordonnone of the top of my head...
09:11:54*JdGordon never understood why the sim build is enabled for ifp
09:12:42DerDomenone here who can give permisson to write? i would like to upload my edited theme ;-)
09:12:54JdGordonbah, whats your nick?
09:13:01amiconnWell, afaik the iFP port is more advanced than the others I mentioned
09:13:02saratogaDominiqueBellenger ?
09:13:06DerDomeits dominiquebellenger
09:13:09DerDomeright
09:13:10DerDome:)
09:13:54saratogaok added
09:14:17amiconnAs in, it actually plays music (not all codecs are working yet). But there is noo bootloader yet, and I don't know how rockbox is actually loaded
09:14:24ddaltonJdGordon: I might have found the recovery mode for the v2 but am not sure.
09:14:27amiconnI guess some exploit in the OF...
09:14:46JdGordonwasnt the OF hacked so it runs wma files instead of loading them as audio?
09:14:54*JdGordon seems to recall something along those lines
09:15:42DerDomethank you :-) so you may check out the ipod 5g themes in a few minutes, if you want to... pen&paper extended :D
09:17:47ddaltonjdgordon: $ ls /dev/sda
09:17:52ddaltonoutput is not even sda1
09:18:01ddaltondoes that mean there aren't any partitions?
09:18:11ddaltonshouldn't it say /dev/sda1 /dev/sda2 etc?
09:18:39ddaltonhere is what I get:
09:18:49ddalton/dev/sda
09:19:24ddaltonI issued the command ls /dev/sda** is that correct?
09:19:36JdGordononly one *
09:19:58JdGordonbut thats useless if its not mounted
09:20:25JdGordon$dmesg | tail
09:21:43ddaltonoh only one partition with one *
09:22:25JdGordonno.. its regex... * means anything
09:22:52ddaltonoh sdb exists too. but I can't mount it...
09:23:20ddaltonhow do I check how big /media/sandisk is? so I can see how big the partition I mounted is?
09:23:33JdGordondf -h
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09:38:06eigmaddalton: fdisk -l /dev/sda
09:38:15eigma(ell)
09:40:23ddaltonJdGordon: still here?
09:40:30ddaltonno.
09:42:38ddaltonanyone here with a sansa e200 v1?
09:44:37saratogasure
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09:46:14ddaltonsaratoga: you got one?
09:47:40saratogayes
09:47:44saratogaddalton: yes
09:48:08ddaltonsaratoga: can you try this for me? 1. Connect and mount the sansa in recovery mode.
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09:49:57saratogaddalton: unfortunately i'm not running the Sandisk bootloader so I don't have a recovery mode
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09:50:24ddaltonsaratoga: Oh so with rockbox bootloader there is no recovery mode?
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09:51:14saratogaddalton: if you remove the Sandisk one as I did you lose recovery mode, however very few people realize you can do this, so most people have recovery mode
09:51:51ddaltonoh I see.
09:52:16ddaltonif I show you the directories and files I have on my recovery disk can you tell me if it sounds like a recovery disk? saratoga?
09:52:30saratogaddalton: i'm not sure whats actually in recovery mode
09:53:17ddaltonok so me telling you what I have won't help. ok.
09:53:36advcomp2019saratoga and ddalton, on my e280r v1, there is only a version.txt file
09:53:37ddaltonanyone here using a v1?
09:53:44ddaltonsansa e200?
09:53:53ddaltonor sansa e200 with rockbox.
09:54:54ddaltonadvcomp2019: so does this look like a recovery mode?
09:55:00ddaltonAUDIBLE MUSIC RECORD SYS_CONF.SYS VIDEO
09:55:00ddaltonMTABLE.SYS PHOTO RES_INFO.SYS version.sdk
09:55:12advcomp2019ddalton, nope
09:55:42ddaltonadvcomp2019: what does cat version.txt say for you?
09:55:42saratogaddalton: if you're seeing the music folder, you're in UMS/MSC mode
09:56:26ddaltonoh and when I am in the other mode the one when you just plug the cable in it has no version.sdk or whatever I said...
09:57:00advcomp2019ddalton, in that text file, only the info of the sansa firmware basically
09:57:22ddaltonok. should I mail sansa and ask them?
09:58:20advcomp2019ddalton, i do not know if they will tell you if there is a recovery mode
09:58:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:58:56ddaltonis it worth a try? I thought that info isn't really that secret like HW info?
10:00
10:00:33advcomp2019ddalton, you can try but never know tho
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10:06:38ddaltonok I have a telephone number I can ring. But I'll have to call tomorrow. to late for them now. but should I mention rockbox when I ask about a disk mode?
10:06:50Shaidprobably not a good idea
10:09:29ddaltonok so if I say "could you tell me the keys to press to activate recovery mode" and they say "Why do you want recover mode?" what should I tell them?
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10:24:52DerDomeyou should say nothing but "because it does not work anymore and i have to get it"
10:25:06DerDometo work
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10:27:22ddaltonDerDome: well they will probably tell me to send it in or a different way to update the fw...
10:28:24DerDomea friend of mine couldn't get her (ipod) to work without recovery because of an REALLY empty battery ;)
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10:28:40DerDomenormally they don't ask why you want to know that
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10:29:11DerDomei hope you checked google for that request you have? :D
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10:39:16ddaltonDerDome: What you don't think I have googled for this?
10:39:56ddaltonI just don't want to say anything that may stuff up the rockbox port. someone else may want to port a sansa...
10:40:26ddaltonso I want to make sure I don't say anything I shouldn't...
10:41:08DerDomesometimes the easiest solutions aren't seen ;)
10:41:30ddaltonyep well if you see it. let me know. I googled for 3 hours and found nothing.
10:41:54DerDomei don't think that, i just wanted to check all easier ways
10:42:11ddaltonok
10:42:21DerDomeno assault :P
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12:54:34doshey, somebody is working on ZEN ports of rockbox?
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12:54:43Bagdersee the forums
12:55:10BagderI've not see any of those guys on IRC
12:55:12Bagderseen
12:56:01DerDomesomebody here who knows something abount the broken bmp-resize-patch and a coming up new one?
12:56:51doson forums are only few informations about it and its very spreaded
12:57:08Bagderdos: yes, but that's the current situation
12:57:19dosor maybe i'm searching on wrong place
12:57:55Bagderhttp://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=3320.0
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14:48:41nuahi, can anyone tell me where I can checkout the latest source-code, seems a dumb question I know... but I just can't see it on the site
14:50:00DerDomesvn co svn://svn.rockbox.org/rockbox/trunk rockbox
14:50:50hcsnua: found here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UsingSVN
14:51:17DerDomejust paste my command posted above and you'll get the latest sourcecode
14:51:28nuaok great, thanks DerDome
14:51:32DerDomenp
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14:52:02DerDomeehm...i don't know if it works on windows!
14:52:22DerDomeit's just c&p from my .bash_hostory ;)
14:52:22linuxstbYou'll need an svn (subversion) client.
14:52:27nuaI want to build it with the album art plugin, presumably I just download the patch from the tracker on rockbox.org and apply then build? Or will I need any other dependencies?
14:52:33nuaIts ok, I'm on linux
14:52:47DerDomeyou can use the latest prebuild version
14:52:56DerDomeit works with album art
14:52:59moosnua: albumart is now in svn
14:53:07nuaahh great
14:53:30DerDomeand don't try the bmp resize patch...it's broken
14:53:34nuabut, it doesn't seem to work :S I have a bmp file in the folder with my album but its not displaying in the latest build
14:53:53nuadoes the bmp have to be a specific size then?
14:54:03DerDomewhat build do you have?
14:54:12nuaone sec...
14:54:39nuar15975
14:54:47nuahmm, actually that seems old
14:55:10DerDomei got 15971
14:55:14DerDomeand it works
14:55:53DerDomei've got a file named cover.bmp in each folder
14:56:04nuathat's odd... I have cover.bmp in each folder too
14:56:05DerDomesize is 100x100 max
14:56:10nuaahhh, that might be it
14:56:14nua:D
14:56:27DerDomeif the size is too big it didn't work for me either
14:56:44nuar15975 is head, so I can't be more up to date it turns out
14:56:56nuaok, I'll get re-scaling
14:57:02pixelmaDerDome: that's not true about the size...
14:57:14 Part jharu
14:57:20DerDomei said it did not work for _me_ ;-)
14:57:24*moos is using 140*140 on his gigabeat :)
14:57:26pixelmathe size depends on the wps you're using
14:57:33DerDomei adjusted the size to 100x100 and it worked
14:57:43DerDomeok, might be
14:58:07DerDomein my wps i use c100|c100
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14:58:39DerDomebut somewhere i read about it does not work if the size extends the screensize ofyour player
14:58:55DerDomeso with 100x100 you are safe ^^
14:58:58nuais there any way of moving the database menu option to the top instead o the file-browser?
14:59:05moosdepending on the player...
14:59:40moosnua: you have an option for this, but I advise you to check manual first
14:59:41kugelnua: sure
14:59:46DerDomei think most players should have a minimum of 100x100 px?
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15:00
15:00:02kugelnua: edit root_menu.h
15:00:04kugel.c
15:00:33DerDomethat's quite a good tip, thanks
15:02:05nuaok cool, thanks... I'll take a look
15:03:21DerDomenua: what is your syntax for loading the album art in the wps?
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15:04:20DerDomeit is the %Cl and %C tag
15:05:24nuahaha, well I'm currently trying to pick a theme :) ...resizing to 100x100 seems to make album art work in themes that support it now
15:05:35*linuxstb has some working viewports code - http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/viewport1.html
15:05:50linuxstb(a screenshot of my test plugin)
15:05:59mooslinuxstb: wee ! \o/
15:06:08nuaI can't find a theme I really like, guess I'll just have to make one
15:06:18kugellinuxstb: great stuff!
15:06:56Nico_Plinuxstb: great news :)
15:07:49DerDome*ad* nua: take my edited pen&paper *ad*
15:08:19nuaI love the pen&paper theme, but there is no album art... unless thats what you've editied :D
15:08:25DerDome:)
15:08:30DerDomethat'it
15:08:34nuasend send send
15:08:34DerDomeand next song
15:08:52DerDomeyou can get it here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsIpod5g
15:09:03DerDomebottom of page ;)
15:10:08DerDomecan somebody tell me how to get the mainmenu centered?
15:11:00nualooks cool DerDome
15:11:17DerDomelooks like the original i hope :)
15:11:40DerDomewas a pain getting gimp to work like i wanted ^^
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15:29:57Casainhohello :-)
15:30:12DerDomewelcome :D
15:31:54 Quit xushi ()
15:32:45CasainhoI would like to get help in a e-mail that I sould send
15:32:51Casainhoabout Rockbox player
15:33:10CasainhoI got attention form a company that sells online electronic kits...
15:33:17Casainhohttp://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=6751.msg109059#msg109059
15:33:21Casainhopelase help :-)
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15:37:48idangazithey folks: is the new usb-charging functionality mentioned on the front page implemented for the sansa-e200 players?
15:38:01idangazit(and if yes −− is it what I would get with the "current" build)?
15:38:37idangazitand regardless −− thank you so much for this lovely piece of software... :)
15:39:37DerDomei don't know what you mean with "new usb-charging functionality" but it sounds interesting. what is it capable of?
15:39:55linuxstbusb charging...
15:40:12idangazitDerDome: check out the front page of rockbox.org
15:40:27idangazitmentions that the new usb stack supports usb charging
15:40:32DerDomeok, then it does not sound interesting for me, because i'm ipod user ;)
15:40:44idangazitwhich I assume means that it correctly asks the host to supply the full 500mA over USB
15:40:58idangazitversus previously where it would stick with default 100mA
15:41:32 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
15:41:41DerDomethe news is from 2007-11-23
15:41:56DerDomeshouldn't it be implemented in todays build?
15:42:10DerDomei think i would try :)
15:42:24idangazitDerDome: I'm completely new to rockbox, I just (today) got my new sansa and am about to load rb on it
15:43:04kugelyou might be unlucky
15:43:13DerDomejust do it and enjoy it. i'm quite new too and absolutely fascinated (spelled correctly?!)
15:43:17kugelnewer sansas aren't supported in most cases
15:43:31jharuas a sansa user i advice you to get the kugel one and follow instruction on loadin
15:43:41jharuthe rbx
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15:44:22idangazithmm, I have a non-v2 sanse e260
15:44:30kugelsounds good
15:44:41idangazitdoes this count as "newer sansa"? if so −− does this mean I have to get a non-mainline build?
15:44:48idangaziti.e. the "kugel" build? :)
15:44:53kugelno
15:45:00jharuyep, same as mine idangazit ;)
15:45:05kugelit's just that the v2 are not supported
15:45:07 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection)
15:45:14idangazitnah, I got the $55 woot special
15:45:21idangazitrefurb non-v2 e260
15:45:33idangazitI just live abroad so it took a while to get here
15:45:36jharu<kugel> it's just that the v2 are not supported<−− for now
15:45:55idangazitI saw the status page on that while digging through the docs −− yep
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15:46:09idangazityay! *excited*
15:46:13jharuidangazit: where exactly?
15:46:20DerDomekugel: do you know how i can get the main menu to be displayed in the center of the screen?
15:46:22idangazitjharu: do I live?
15:46:32idangazitjharu: Tel Aviv, actually
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15:46:58idangazitjharu: moved here a while back, my company's R&D is out here
15:47:04kugelDerDome: there's a patch which allows you to free the menus a bit
15:47:08jharu-_-.... israel?
15:47:21idangazitjharu: the one and only
15:47:28DerDomeso i can take a look, thank you
15:48:33jharuidangazit: as long as you follow the manual on how to install, its fine to use rbx on sansa w/o bein bricked. ;)
15:49:09idangazitjharu: yeah, I'm reading the whole procedure now to make sure there's nothing I missed, that's also why I popped in here to ask about the charging thing
15:49:23idangazitso basically with the current build I should be able to charge the sansa over USB?
15:49:50idangazitI saw that there's some interest in discharge data, I'll figure out how to do that if benchmarks will be helpful
15:49:53jharuafaik, you cant charge on rbx...
15:50:01jharuyou must use of
15:50:21idangazitjharu: ah, so the news thing on the frontpage doesn't apply to sansas?
15:50:40jharuyes, but for now
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15:51:13idangaziteh, I can live with that
15:51:14jharudevs here are doin all they can to support usb.
15:51:32idangazitjharu: I appreciate that −− not criticising :)
15:51:49jharuits fine :)
15:52:11idangazitit seems pretty easy to boot into OF so it's not such a big deal, really
15:52:54jharuanyways, i advise you to switch to msc and stay there. (unless you like subscription music)
15:53:06idangazitI like my music Free
15:53:12idangazit:)
15:53:29jharup2p guy huh (limewire?)
15:53:43idangazitugh, no
15:54:02idangazitarchive.org
15:54:15*jharu says ooops XD
15:54:20idangaziteven among p2p there are better ways to steal from music labels :)
15:54:34idangazitbut that's not really on topic for this channel
15:54:43jharuyep!
15:55:08idangazitI do however have stuff in m4a, which was the original reason I came looking for rockbox
15:55:17idangazitsilla sandisk, not supporting aac
15:55:23idangazits/silla/silly
15:55:47 Part J-23
15:55:50jharuaac IS for ipod, ya know...
15:56:01hcsaac is for everyone
15:56:06idangazitaac is for everyone
15:56:15idangazitfairplay / drm'ed aac is for ipod
15:56:32idangazits/aac/mp3
15:56:35idangazits/aac/ogg
15:56:46idangazitaac is just a standardized format
15:56:46jharu?????
15:57:04DerDomethat's right
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15:57:09kugelidangazit: Don't listen to jharu! you can charge your battery over USB very well
15:57:10idangazitperhaps better to say 'vorbis' than ogg
15:57:25idangazitkugel: woo! that's nice :)
15:57:31hcsThere seems to be a common misconception that the first A in AAC is for "Apple".
15:57:38idangazitadvanced audio coding
15:57:39jharuegg XD
15:57:41idangazitA A C
15:58:06jharuegg vorbis
15:58:08kugelI like aac
15:58:09idangazitkissing cousin to AVC, Advanced Video Coding, aka h264, aka mpeg-4 part 10
15:58:10kugeland I use it
15:58:21bjorn`egg orbit
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15:59:18idangazitI'm no professional sound guru but aac "works fine" for me :)
15:59:24kugelidangazit: You can not only charge with rockbox, you can also listen to music and stuff while charging
15:59:36idangazitkugel: yeah, just read that entry in the faq
15:59:47idangazitholding down select btn when insert usb cable
15:59:56jharuwell, im no music buff. i just like to hear my songs on the coolest unsupported build there is!!!! casserole.. i mean kugel build
16:00
16:00:11idangazithey, don't knock the kugel
16:00:15idangazitkugel's are tasty
16:00:23idangazitesp. with raisins and cinammon
16:00:26idangazitit's no casserole
16:00:41DerDomedon't hassel the hoff :D
16:00:46idangazittake it from somebody with a rich eastern-european family history :)
16:01:10jharu? kugel: you mean there IS usb support for chargin now? thot there still some issues?
16:01:28kugeljharu: I think you shouldn'T advertise unsupported builds here
16:02:01jharukugel: im askin for all includin official
16:02:20jharuidangazit: wiki says its casserole though...
16:02:37idangazitjharu: the wiki has never tasted both :)
16:02:47kugelkugel is a German word in this case people
16:03:03jharuyiddish...
16:03:14idangazityiddish is a pidgin most often based on german
16:03:25desowinmy nicks seems to be owned by some drugs though :P
16:03:33idangazitbut basically rooted in the local language
16:03:44idangazitpolish yiddish, german yiddish, etc
16:03:51*jharu tries to google himself...
16:04:06desowinbut before I started 'getting-googleable' the result didn't show even two results :P
16:04:11dospolish? i'm from poland :P
16:04:35dosxD
16:04:52dosbut it's offtopic i think...
16:05:04jharuseems like im a tribe of some sort... :(
16:05:06idangazityeah ok, enough bother, sorry about the extra chatter :)
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16:05:24idangazitwant to finish reading the install guide and I don't want to miss anything, bbiab
16:05:37jharuoogabooga scorche|w
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16:07:24*scorche|w has no comment
16:07:59jharu-_-'..........
16:18:16idangazitalas, rb utility does not identify my sansa
16:18:28idangazitbut in its credit I am running vista on this machine
16:18:42idangazitwhich isn't supported, will check out manual install next
16:20:09 Quit bertrik (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:20:11jharuforgot to say manual is much better than auto install, idangazit
16:20:33idangazitjharu: yeah, but even manual isn't a bear
16:20:44 Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend")
16:21:21kugeljust download sansapatcher, run it, and extract the build on your sansa
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16:21:43jharubear?
16:22:24idangazitjharu: means it's not bad
16:22:30idangazitsomething is a bear == something is bad
16:23:18jharu???? bear==not bad but example bear==bad?
16:23:44idangazitjharu: I said it's "not a bear"
16:23:48idangazitmeaning not bad :)
16:23:51idangazitnevermind
16:23:55idangazitit's really not important
16:24:05idangazitkugel: yeah, that's what I'm doing, but reading the instructions some more
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16:32:30idangazitgrr, sansapatcher doesn't identify the player, and I'm sure I'm in MSC mode
16:32:49idangazittrying to figure this one out
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16:33:37jharuwhat os are you using idangazit?
16:33:45idangazitjharu: vista
16:34:06jharucrap! vista has issues with removables...
16:34:18idangazityeah, so I figured
16:34:19jharuespecially sansas...
16:34:32idangazitit seems to work just fine re: transferring data / music
16:34:35jharuanyone there who owns an xp?
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16:34:56idangazitmeh, starting to bug coworkers is no good, worst case I can try at home on xp
16:35:00jharuoogabooga dos!
16:35:08idangazitor my computer; ubuntu
16:35:35jharusorry no can do on linux... widows user here...
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16:36:33jharuidangazit: is it recognized in vista as removable drive
16:36:35jharu?
16:36:42idangazitjharu: figured it out
16:36:50idangazitsansa updater software is responsible
16:36:55idangazituninstalled and sansapatcher works great
16:37:25jharugood for you fellow sansa user! XD
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16:44:17idangazitkugel: how do I go about adding an entry to the faq or manual?
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16:45:40kugelidangazit: which faq
16:45:43kugel?
16:45:46idangazitthe sansa faq
16:45:59jharuwhy?
16:45:59idangazitI just discovered that sansapatcher is blocked by installed sansaupdater
16:46:06idangazitand it's not in the faq
16:46:27idangazitthe symptom is that sansapatcher / rb utility says "no sansa found" even if I give it the right model / drive letter
16:46:45idangazitI uninstalled sansaupdater utility and sanapatcher works fine
16:46:54DerDomeyou have to register and to be given the admission to write into the wiki:)
16:47:09idangazitI know for sure that I am in MSC mode both times, it's definitely sansaupdater's fault
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16:47:19jharuhmmmm...... doesnt seem to do that on xp...
16:47:29idangazitDerDome: hmm, how about I write the faq entry and email to somebody who has commit access?
16:48:08jharuidangazit: yours might just be an isolated case though...
16:48:27DerDomeperhabs it is an vista-issue?
16:48:31idangazitit may be
16:48:41idangazitbut even if it is −− it's a useful tip, I suspect
16:48:44idangazitand not written anywhere
16:48:48DerDomeidangazit: i dont know, i'm a newby as well ;)
16:48:54jharui use xp so i dont know...
16:48:56idangazit"if you have trouble, try uninstalling sansaupdater"
16:49:23kugelidangazit: for the manual, you need to edit the source code of rockbox, since the manual is part if ot
16:49:27kugelof it*
16:49:29jharutry askin bagder (if he will respond that is...)
16:49:33idangazitkugel: d'oh
16:49:41idangazithow about the faq?
16:49:57kugelfor the wiki pages you write access, like it has beed said
16:50:12kugel+need
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16:50:52idangazitkugel: I don't know / think I will have more to contribute past this tip
16:51:02idangazitwhat's the most sensible vehicle for getting this into the faq?
16:51:10idangazitI don't mind writing it and sending to somebody else to post
16:51:11DerDomeperhaps you'll build a wps or something
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16:51:29kugelyou need to register first
16:51:29idangazitDerDome: when I get to that point in time I'll register for write access
16:51:35kugelafter that you ask a dev for write access
16:51:58DerDomehere in this channel :)
16:52:03kugelyea
16:52:37jharutalk about hierarcy ;D
16:52:42 Quit dos (Connection timed out)
16:52:44idangazitdoes it make sense to do this whole process for one edit?
16:52:49jharuhierarchy
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16:52:55DerDomeyou'll get to this point. there are few wps and i think you will edit one at least ^^
16:53:17DerDomeit is not a big thing to register
16:53:22DerDome2minute-job
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16:54:11idangazitk
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16:54:26jharuspeakin of which, ive been doin some wps myself. is there a way to make text bigger when you point at it?
16:55:00DerDome"point at it" with which device you can point at text?
16:55:20jharui mean scroll at it...
16:55:25jharusansa
16:55:25DerDomeah you mean the currently selected menuitem i.e.
16:55:34jharuyes...
16:55:55idangazitok, so who here is a dev?
16:56:09idangazitI have a registered account, would like to add an entry to the sansa faq
16:56:27jharutry bagder...
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16:57:12jharuor pixelma.
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16:58:21jharuDerDome: any ideas how?
16:58:34DerDome?
16:58:38DerDomewho is dev?
16:58:54scorche|wmany people in here are devs...
16:58:57jharudev== developer
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16:59:04desowinidangazit: you mean wiki? if so just tell your name
16:59:13idangazitdesowin: IdanGazit
16:59:16jharulike scorche|w!!!
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16:59:38idangazitdesowin: you want to add it or are you giving me write access?
16:59:50idangazit(or 'c, none of the above')
17:00
17:00:04desowinwrite access...anyone who has write access can give it further though
17:00:28DerDomeoh, that's good to know :-)
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17:00:45idangazitin all honestly I don't think I will be adding more after this −− but I think the tip would help others, it would have helped me
17:01:03jharuyeah...
17:01:34desowinidangazit: do it
17:02:01desowin(I mean you have write access now)
17:02:10idangazitdesowin: thanks :)
17:02:24desowindon't abuse your power though :P
17:02:32jharuthat makes idangazit a dev! ;D
17:02:52bertrikwiki write access i suppose
17:03:00jharuwith great power comes great responibility... ripoff!!!
17:03:09jharuXD
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17:03:54idangazitdesowin: I don't plan on it
17:04:06idangazitunless you mean wham-bam-edit-thank-you-ma'am is abuse
17:04:16idangazit;)
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17:10:53idangazithey, it works
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17:11:03idangazitgo go gadget googlebot
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17:36:47denesHi! Can I add an other target to the other targets wiki page? Although rockbox will probably won't be ported to this target, mostly because of very little ram, but there still is an effort to make an opensource firmware for it.
17:37:23denesit's the perception digital/mymusixx pd-205 ( http://web.interware.hu/rudas/dbalatoni/pd205.html )
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17:40:05idangazitsee y'all later
17:40:07idangazitthanks for the help!
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18:30:58digitalloWhen I try to run make for the simulated e200r I get the message "No rule to make target 'UI-e200r.bmp', needed by '/home/user/rockbox/build-dir/UI256.bmp'. The e200 works correctly.
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18:34:35rasherdigitallo: afaik there's no difference between the e200 and the e200r sim.
18:36:27digitalloSounds good. Then I'll just use the e200 sim. The only difference between them is the rhapsody mode in the original firmware, so that would make sense.
18:36:35lostlogicdigitallo: use the e200 target.
18:36:49lostlogice200r is for bootloader and e200r-e200 conversion only
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18:40:38digitalloAhhh, ok. Thanks a lot for the info.
18:41:00lostlogicwe should document that somehwo, because I made the error too when I went to install on my e200r.
18:41:36rasherMaybe just whine and moan in configure if the user selects the e200r target for anything but bootloader?
18:41:41digitalloIf there was a hint on the configure screen, that would have been good enough for me.
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19:04:30amiconnWhy is there a separate e200r target at all?
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19:05:13rasheramiconn: for the bootloader
19:05:29rasher(apparently)
19:05:33amiconnWhy not have a unified bootloader?
19:07:18nuadoes anyone know if the album art is automatically detected when in the format cover.100x100.bmp or does it need to be specified in the WPS theme? My iPod is currently trying to show cover.bmp instead, which is a much bigger file and doesn't display properly...
19:07:53rashernua: I think the theory is that cover.100x100.bmp should be used if the wps asks for a 100x100 cover.
19:08:19nuarasher: so I need to know the exact size being requested by my theme I guess
19:08:37rashernua: Yeah, pretty much
19:09:09DerDome^afkbut you can easily take a look in your wps and examine the size it wants
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19:10:16*Buschel does some further experiments on 5G power consumption
19:12:18Buschelwouldn't it be a good idea to disable DEV_OPTO (=scrollwheel device) when hold button is active? as well as disabling DEV_USB and 0x8 (DEV_EN) as long as usb wasn't detected via GPIO?
19:12:38nuaDerDome: so your pen&paper AA theme uses 100x100?
19:13:19DerDome^afk100x100 or less
19:13:39nuaright, so I'm using your theme, and in each folder I have cover.100x100.bmp
19:13:43nuaand no luck :(
19:14:29DerDome^afkhm. just like me...
19:14:43DerDome^afksame size, same theme...
19:15:16nuahmm, do you also have a file called cover.bmp as well as cover.100x100.bmp?
19:15:40DerDome^afkyes. in every folder
19:15:49DerDome^afkbecause i just had 130x130
19:16:02DerDome^afkand had to convert for good display as 100x100
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19:18:38nuaStill not working... this is annoying
19:19:06nuasorry to be a bore, but could you give me an 'ls' of one of your album directories?
19:19:16nuajust to check
19:19:24DerDome^afk1sec
19:19:32DerDome^afkplug everything together ;)
19:21:22nuabtw, I wrote a little python & bash script to generate thumbnails for all my cover art and then sync all music with my pc, let me know if anyone wants it and I'll clean it up and hand it over :)
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19:22:18DerDome^afksounds nice, perhaps somethiing for the forums?
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19:22:53nuain fact, I've just realised! thats what didn't work hahaha.... I forgot to pass the right size, so the filename is cover.100x100.bmp but the size is different
19:22:59nuaDoh!
19:23:08nuaI'll fix that and see what happens :)
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19:23:56Tydusplease help my sansa just got bricked by rockbox...
19:24:18faemirnua: when you say thumbnails - does it make a secondary file that is 100 x 100 instead of resizing your nice big album art?
19:24:49nuayeah it converts my big jpg cover to a seperate bmp file
19:25:14nuaso in my album folders I have cover.jpg, cover.100x100.bmp etc
19:25:35nuaso I can still view the big pics on my ipod using rockbox jpeg viewer
19:25:37nua:D
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19:32:28_stink_i just installed rockbox on an iPod mini 2G. when I try to get back to the apple firmware by setting the hold button just after rebooting, it seems to enter an endless reboot loop. if I unset the hold button, it eventually reboots into rockbox. any suggestions on how to get back to the apple firmware?
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20:02:16animeloe_got tinydns working
20:02:27animeloe_have tarballs for those who want it working on their mips routers
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20:34:39LloreanjhMikeS: Question: Do your mpegplayer fixes affect the various error messages people occasionally report about missing some start thing?
20:34:55*Llorean wonders why he felt the need to precede his question with "Question:"
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20:56:12Synx_hmIs mpeg playback in a good usable state, or should i stick with the stock ipod 5.5g firmware to watch videos and use rockbox for music?
20:56:27Synx_hmim a bit worried about battery life and video performance/syncing
21:00
21:00:34 Join m0f0x [0] (n=m0f0x@189-47-33-135.dsl.telesp.net.br)
21:01:46LloreanOn the iPod Video, performance is better in the original firmware, because we don't know how to use the special hardware for it yet so everything's done on the CPU
21:02:30Synx_hmgot ya
21:02:34Synx_hmthink ill do video that way
21:04:23 Join x-spec-t [0] (n=nwheeler@ubuntu/member/spec)
21:04:35 Quit Spec (No route to host)
21:05:24LloreanOn most of the Rockbox players video works great
21:05:47LloreanBut the combination of "large" screen, and slow processor makes the iPod Video rather unsuited for video playback unless you can use the Broadcom chip, which we can't.
21:05:50 Nick x-spec-t is now known as Spec (n=nwheeler@ubuntu/member/spec)
21:07:18Synx_hmcool
21:09:57 Part J-23
21:10:54Synx_hmpoop think i killed the ipod firmware
21:11:13Synx_hmknow of any recovery/update tools that wont kill rockbox
21:11:40Synx_hmactually im a tool, i had hold on haha
21:11:50DerDomehehe good one :-D
21:11:56Synx_hmya hehe
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21:58:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:00
22:01:09 Join reprise [0] (n=epitaph@S010600179ace43ca.vs.shawcable.net)
22:01:34repriseok i dont really understand what generation my ipod is, but can i run rockbox on a 160GB ipod?
22:02:22reprisei would really love to just be able to do a drag and drop dump onto the hard disk and not have to bother with itunes at all
22:02:26Soapno - That would be the iPod Classic
22:02:26 Join courtc_ [0] (n=court@c-24-99-230-218.hsd1.ga.comcast.net)
22:02:30reprisedamnit
22:02:41reprisei was counting on you guys =(
22:02:55DefineByteBlame Apple.
22:02:57 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:03:06Soaplook into the iTunes replacements - such as sharepod / gtkpod / etc. You won't get true drag-and-drop, but you will get something closer than iTunes.
22:03:09repriseoh they made some new encryption of their shitty system?
22:03:15 Quit Daishi (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:03:18reprisei need the space
22:04:09repriseagh so now i have to transcode everything to mp3 or alac
22:04:15reprisehmmm maybe ogg
22:04:26DerDomeencryption is cracked afaik
22:04:56DerDomecan "classic" handle ogg? gen5 cannot
22:05:09reprisethats what im wondering
22:05:14reprisei guess prolly not eh
22:05:20scorche|wsure it can....just not with the original firmware
22:05:22DerDometry amarok
22:05:25DerDomefor managing
22:05:27aliaskDerDome: The firmware encryption?
22:05:34scorche|wthe "encryption" on the database was cracked...not the encryption on the firmware
22:05:38reprisewhat other firmware can i use on a classic?
22:05:43LloreanDerDome: The database encryption is bypassed, not the firmware encryption
22:05:46aliaskreprise: None at the moment.
22:05:49DerDomekk
22:06:07reprisewell i guess no ogg then scorche!
22:06:13DerDomecan amarok handle the new generation?
22:06:15repriseill look into amarok derdome
22:06:22repriseack i hope so
22:06:32 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:06:32DerDomesec
22:06:33reprisethis computer's my mom's and i dont wanna screw with her itunes
22:06:34aliaskYep, it can
22:06:48 Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@p54B16215.dip.t-dialin.net)
22:06:55repriseill probably get foobar's ipod component to handle it when i get home
22:06:55DerDomeso i don't have to throw a look :D
22:07:33repriseoh well, at least ill get long battery life
22:07:35 Quit courtc (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:08:02DerDomei loved the applesoftware for that
22:08:04repriseanyone know if theres a way to output digitally, or unamped?
22:08:23Lloreanreprise: This isn't the appropriate place for asking questions about hardware we don't support
22:08:27 Nick parafin is now known as parafin|away (i=parafin@paraf.in)
22:08:28reprisemy cans need a fat amp
22:08:50repriseuhh we were having a conversation Llorean, is this a help-only channel?
22:08:59LloreanThis is #Rockbox
22:09:08LloreanIt's an on-topic channel for Rockbox support an development
22:09:20reprisewell i apologize
22:09:29LloreanThat's why it tells you to read the guidelines before speaking in the topic.
22:09:53scorche|wand in a private message sent to you upon joining
22:10:10reprisei'm gonna go cut off my hands
22:10:35reprisethanks for you help though guys
22:11:37DerDome:)
22:12:54repriseis ipod classic firmware in development?
22:13:19scorche|wi dont knwo of anyone working on it
22:16:00DerDomewikipedia says no - but it's notrockbox' wiki :)
22:16:35Zagor"development" is the wrong word. what needs to be done it to crack or circumvent the encryption
22:20:15 Quit bertrik ("bye")
22:21:02DerDomereprise: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodStatus
22:21:41scorche|wZagor: i havent checked the logs to see, but did you catch the comment from a really annoying person about your IRC log perl script?
22:22:06 Quit waldo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:22:11DerDomehehe
22:22:26Zagorscorche|w: no, when was that?
22:22:46scorche|wjust look around the logs for a ton of spam....let me check :)
22:23:08Zagoroh lovely...
22:23:52LloreanBasically, it looks like you can pass it a string for the date that'll cause it to redirect you to any URL
22:24:14scorche|wwell, you can do other things, but that was one such example
22:24:41scorche|wZagor: http://www.rockbox.org/irc/reader.pl?date=20071227#07:59:44
22:24:43LloreanI thought the other things were mostly, "redirect users to pages where the other things are done to them"?
22:25:50rasherLooks like it's "execute javascript through an url"
22:26:22LloreanAh
22:27:52scorche|wseemed something like that, but i was too tired last night to look closely =/
22:31:00 Join hellogoodbye [0] (n=chatzill@c-69-138-211-94.hsd1.md.comcast.net)
22:31:12hellogoodbyehey guys i need some help
22:31:22hellogoodbyei just got a 30gb ipod video
22:31:27rasherAh, it's just because of the way the "Invalid filename" page gets printed.
22:31:32hellogoodbyeinstalled rockbox
22:31:35hellogoodbyeits all good
22:31:48hellogoodbyebut when i plug it in, windows doesnt recognize it
22:32:07hellogoodbyei have to unplug it and switch back to the apple OS to put my music on it
22:32:12hellogoodbyewhat can i do?
22:32:13rasherhellogoodbye: that's because there's no real usb support in Rockbox. Reboot to the Apple OS.
22:32:18hellogoodbyeugh
22:32:33hellogoodbyereally?
22:32:45hellogoodbyemy old nano worker with rockbox and USB directly
22:32:46DerDomeshouldn't it reboot into recoverymode automatically?
22:32:53Lloreanhellogoodbye: No, it didn't.
22:32:59LloreanIt just rebooted into disk mode
22:33:14hellogoodbyealright then
22:33:30hellogoodbyeit doesnt reboot automatically, what can i do?
22:33:55scorche|wreboot manually
22:34:12 Join waldo [0] (n=waldo@ip-81-11-221-97.dsl.scarlet.be)
22:34:21DerDomedoes it only reboot automatically with linux OS?
22:34:26hellogoodbyei mean how can i get it to reboot manually?
22:34:36DerDomebecause mine does
22:34:37SoapMenu+Select
22:34:49hellogoodbyei mean automatically, sorry
22:34:59SoapDerDome, that isn't a function of Linux vs Windows,
22:35:33 Nick Synx_hm is now known as Synx_afk (n=synx@ip68-3-144-232.ph.ph.cox.net)
22:35:43hellogoodbyehow can i get it to reboot automatically?
22:35:48DerDomeso then i'm lucky?
22:36:51hellogoodbye?
22:39:05Soaphellogoodbye, you probably can't. Just reboot manually for now. A working USB stack will come around eventually.
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22:39:18hellogoodbyealright then, thanks
22:39:29DerDomewhich version of rockbox do you run?
22:39:39hellogoodbyemost recent build, today's
22:39:54DerDomehm. then i'm lucky ;)
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22:45:09 Join Akula [0] (n=522024a6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e5973af53ab2fcf9)
22:52:50AkulaHi. Can anybody give me a bit of help here: I'm about to install RockBox on a sandisk e280v1, Do I need to set it to MSC or MTP mode first?
22:53:02Bagdermsc
22:53:31AkulaThanks
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22:58:25Zagorscorche|w: thanks for the notice. redirect ability disabled.
23:00
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23:01:44ddaltonBagder: Still here?
23:01:56Bagderyeps
23:02:23scorche|wZagor: dont thank me...thank our spammy friend :)
23:02:34ddaltonBagder: When I email sandisk to find the recovery mode (The stuff on the net didn't work) and there wasn't really much info what should I tell them?
23:02:52ddaltonlike why I need it.
23:03:18Zagorscorche|w: annoying guy...
23:03:19Bagderddalton: tell them the truth in your first mail, then make something up in your next if they don't answer! ;-)
23:04:31 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@84-51-130-71.judith186.adsl.metronet.co.uk)
23:04:51ddaltonok two different answers from two different people... :-) so say I want to know for porting an open source firmware called "rockbox" and if that doesn't work should I just say my player has completely crashed the computer won't recognise it and I need to get into recovery mode to fix it?
23:04:52 Join linuxstb [0] (n=chatzill@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
23:05:59Bagderddalton: the sandisk guys know about Rockbox already so when you tell them it is for this reason, I think it'll either help or prevent you from getting help!
23:06:19ddaltonBagder: isn't it the same guy that answers them? what will he do when he says me sending the same question just with another reason?
23:06:41Bagderuse another address or ask someone else to send the second mail perhaps
23:06:59ddaltonoh ok. sure.
23:07:24Bagderhere's a little neat quote from my sandisk contact: "In our meetings last week with Europe Distis they all knew of you/rockbox.org."
23:07:30ddaltonand you know how you got the data sheats. Are you allowed to show me them or do I need to get my own? I understand this is quite protected information.
23:07:56 Quit waldo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:08:41Bagder(quote from last year of course, not recent)
23:09:04ddaltonok.
23:09:05Bagderddalton: I can make the data sheet available to you, sure.
23:09:12AkulaI'm having a problem with my e280 installation. I've downloaded the Rockbox Utility, and clicked on "Complete Installation", and it tells me that there is no e280 connected.
23:09:37scorche|wAkula: when did you get your sansa?...it might be a v2
23:09:48ddaltonBagder: Thx. so what do I need to do keep it to myself?
23:10:02scorche|wBagder: did they say anything further? =)
23:10:03Bagderddalton: exactly
23:10:10AkulaNope, i'm pretty sure its a v1. The little writing on the back says: "e280", not "e280v2". So its a v1, as far as I know.
23:10:18Bagderscorche|w: nope, I haven't got any response to my recent email
23:10:31ddaltonBagder: ok. How are you going to get them to me then?
23:10:37scorche|wbah....sounded like a fun story
23:10:50advcomp2019Akula, what firmware version do you have
23:10:53Bagderddalton: details in PM coming up...
23:11:52AkulaI'm not sure. Pretty recent, I would imagine, as it was an Xmas present
23:12:12advcomp2019Akula, look in setting then info
23:12:16BagderAkula: I believe the "complete installation" for sansa isn't rock solid
23:12:41Bagderthe first time I tried rbutil (just a few weeks ago) it failed miserably on my sansaa
23:13:17 Quit uwe_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:13:47Akulaokay, should I try the "small installation"? - also, the sansa is refreshing the database, could be a few minutes before I get the firmware version
23:14:11linuxstbAkula: Does the box advertise "Audible" support?
23:14:11Akulaah, okay, its good. I have the verison 01.02.18E
23:14:33advcomp2019Akula, that is a v1 good
23:14:36BagderAkula: or try doing the bootloader install first and then the actual rockbox one
23:14:40ddaltonBagder: ok. so when I ask for help from another dev I have to be careful what I say?
23:15:22Bagderddalton: no, you can say just about everything, just don't send around the document
23:15:35Akulabootloader install? I'm a bit of a newbie with all these terms, sorry ;-)
23:15:44ddaltonBagder: ok.
23:16:10scorche|wAkula: use the "manual installation" in the manual
23:16:20AkulaAh, okay.
23:16:21 Quit pikhq (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:16:41ddaltonBagder: so are you going to pm me the info? my irc client doesn't automatically alert me of pms when I am in the #rockbox window. Perhaps its a screenreader issue...
23:17:04Bagderddalton: oh, yeah I already PMed you
23:17:35scorche|wBagder: you arent identified
23:17:40Bagderoh
23:17:47Bagdersilly me
23:18:29Bagderthanks scorche|w
23:19:22 Join peppot [0] (n=odd@53dbdfba.umea.cust.skycom.se)
23:19:36peppotdouble entries in database: rebuild of db to fix?
23:21:00scorche|wpeppot: that *typically* comes from a "trash/recyclebin/etc" hidden folder on the device that your computer's OS makes
23:22:03peppotyes, could be. but I've never deleted this album on my ipod, and I only copy via rhythmbox/apple firmware copying mode
23:22:11peppot(i.e. no manual copying)
23:22:33scorche|wyou could place both copies in a playlist together and see the file path for each
23:22:55 Quit DerDome ("Leaving.")
23:23:18peppotah. is there a way to see the path in the GUI?
23:23:42peppot(I have only a usb-less terminal here)
23:23:54LloreanYou could open the playlist in the text viewer
23:25:18peppotawesome
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23:25:49peppotquick rundown of open etc?
23:27:46peppototherwise documentation for applications is in the manual?
23:28:31LloreanThere's an open with option in the context menu, and yes, it's pretty much covered in the manual
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23:30:31AkulaOkay, im doing the manual install on my e280. The instructions on the wiki tell me that I need to be logged in as an administrator; how do I check that I am?
23:31:31peppotscorche|w: it lists the same path for duplicate files
23:32:10scorche|wthen try deleting all of the *.tcd files and rebuild
23:33:16Akulaokay, dont worry, i've done it. Rockbox bootloader installed correctly. Moment of truth, about to unplug the sansa and see if it works...
23:33:30peppotscorche|w: aight
23:35:28peppotscorche|w: I deleted the .tcds and entered Database> and now it's working: "Building database... 4882 found"...
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23:36:20Akulawoo! my sansa e280 now has rockbox installed and working. A big thanks to you guys!
23:36:54 Quit DefineByte ("Bye all")
23:37:05peppotI'm surprised it could determine how many files there were so quickly...?
23:37:35Bagderthe turbo button is always pressed in rockbox ;-P
23:37:42peppot=)
23:37:50peppothm
23:37:55peppotthere's absolutely no disk activity...
23:38:11peppotoh well, I'll let it sit for a while
23:38:16peppotneed to get some sleep
23:38:29peppotthanks for the help scorche|w, Llorean
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23:55:14 Quit ender` (" A computer program will always do what you tell it to, and seldom what you want it to.")
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23:58:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"

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