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#rockbox log for 2008-01-03

00:00:00 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection)
00:00:39kugelso you can hear it without music playing? just fill the ram and the noise appears?
00:00:53 Join MethoS- [0] (
00:01:29conandoyes exactly
00:02:13conandothere is some noise already appearing with the bootloader.. but with the picflow process it's especially noticable since there's a distinct "chirp" sound with every album cover that's read ;)
00:02:14 Quit Buschel ()
00:02:45pixelmawell... then don't use it :P
00:02:48 Join stripwax [0] (
00:02:57 Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection)
00:03:11kugelI think I hear something
00:03:19kugelbut pretty high frequency
00:03:20conandopixelma: lol :)
00:03:31conandokugel: yeah it's quite high...
00:03:52mokkurkalveI have issues with the e280 keys. Are these well known/reported? 1) <menu+right> with random folder change active more often than not result in a) nothing at all or b) turning off the player than skipping to a new (random) album (folder). 2) Fast skipping back two-three or more tracks with <left> freezes the player.
00:03:52conandoperhaps i shouldn't have cleared my ears a few months ago ;)
00:04:16 Join JayG [0] (n=458fa016@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:04:21kugelWell, even though I have a tinnitus, I could hear it
00:06:06 Join MethoS- [0] (
00:07:26 Quit JayG (Client Quit)
00:07:31 Join JayG [0] (n=458fa016@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:07:49 Quit kretender (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:07:49 Quit GodEater ("ZZzzzZzZZZzz")
00:08:19 Quit JayG (Client Quit)
00:09:38 Join Jay_G [0] (n=458fa016@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:12:49*stripwax reads this morning's khermans
00:14:00lostlogicdid we ever get an answer about the buffer and codecs and stuff?
00:14:20stripwaxbillenium - discussion (to and fro) in this morning's irc logs regarding this article
00:14:52*amiconn now has a working lcd_grey_phase_blit() on archos, h1x0, m5 and greyscale ipods :)
00:15:06amiconnThat is, on all supported greyscale targets
00:15:06 Quit Jay_G ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:15:34stripwaxgrey_phase ?
00:16:10lostlogicis that increasing levels of grey by changing pixels or something else?
00:16:19 Join Jay_G [0] (n=458fa016@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:17:44amiconnThis function outputs one frame of the temporally dithered greyscale image. It will be called periodically from the new greyscale library's timer isr
00:18:36 Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
00:18:41stripwaxneat. why did grey lib need changing?
00:19:37amiconnUnlike the old library which used precomputed frames (which are slow to update, need more ram and offer less shades), the new function computes the pattern dynamically
00:20:31amiconn33 shades (max) -> 129 shades, ram usage cut in half, no graininess with changing content, and faster updates
00:21:19 Quit Jay_G ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:21:28stripwaxSo obvious dumb question: how did you make on-the-fly temporal dithering faster than blitting precomputed dithered frames?
00:21:30amiconnOf course there is a tradeoff (somewhat higher cpu usage in the isr), but the advantages outweigh that tradeoff by far imho
00:21:58amiconnstripwax: The blitting isn't faster of course. What is faster is *changing* the displayed contents
00:22:32stripwaxah, right
00:22:38amiconnDid you ever try mpegplayer on h1x0 or m5, or doom on a greyscale ipod
00:22:59stripwax:) actually, no. I did try doom on h120 though.
00:23:00conandowill it work on my archos player too? :-D
00:23:02LloreanSo, will we be getting updated fire/plasma plugins?
00:23:38amiconnThe former is sloo-oow (grayscale lib only manages ~8fps fullscreen), the latter isn't slow, but is so grainy (because of the many updates) that you can't recognise much
00:24:02amiconnThe 8fps are for coldfire as that wasn't clear enough...
00:24:37amiconnArchos only manages ~4fps fullscreen with the old grayscale lib. iPod (mini G2) manages >25fps, but then it's grainy
00:26:10amiconnLlorean: Sure. Every plugin that currently uses the grayscale lib will be ported to the greyscale lib once this lib is there.
00:26:40 Quit lassesdatamaskin (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:26:44amiconnFinally the grayscale lib will be removed, and then lcd_blit() can be removed for everything but archos bitmap targets (video.rock still needs it)
00:26:48stripwaxsoap/(Buschel) - ok, I'm with you now: disabling wps by leaving the rockbox Main Menu up I too get ~16hrs with the pp power patch (with hold enabled). Doesn't seem like enabling/disabling hold makes a big deal of difference.
00:27:16soapmade less than 1 minute difference for me.
00:27:21stripwaxodd ..
00:27:36JdGordon|wwhy shuold having hold on make any difference?
00:27:49soaphe bound scrollwheel poweroff to the hold switch
00:27:58amiconnJdGordon: Because the patch disables the opto controller when hold is enabled
00:28:03stripwaxas does Apple f/w I believe
00:28:07JdGordon|wah righto
00:28:28stripwaxbut perhaps the dev_en isn't working right now for 5g, only 4g?
00:28:37soapDefault WPS with peakmeters severely impacted runtime, icatcher barely did
00:28:37amiconnObviously the opto controller doesn't need much power
00:28:52amiconnsoap: How severe?
00:28:58stripwaxamiconn : - 3hrs for me
00:29:01soapI'll have to look at the wikipage
00:29:55scorche|wis this using the device_enable register?
00:30:09soap16 hours no WPS / 12 hours with peakmeters / 15.25 hours with icatcher.
00:30:25stripwaxscorche: - yes:
00:30:39scorche|wyeah...i went through the entire register...not really any notable difference
00:30:50soapand that 15.25 hour measurement appears to be an incompletely charged battery.
00:32:49stripwaxCan't remember if I said this before, but for fun I entered Diag mode on my 5g on a fully charged battery, switched to the LCD test, turned off the backlight, and left it like that to see how long it lasted. Just over 12hrs. So if we're looking for power saving tips I'm guessing we're not going to find them by r/e the diag code.
00:34:02amiconnscorche: USB does, according to that patch
00:34:28 Nick billenium is now known as Bam2550 (
00:34:52soapmassive improvement
00:35:03 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay)
00:35:24scorche|wamiconn: sorry...let me rephrase...disabling everything that didnt break something didnt make a bit of difference
00:35:32 Nick Bam2550 is now known as Billenium (
00:35:53amiconnThe patch doesn't break usb. It disables/enables dynamically
00:36:03 Quit barrywardell ()
00:36:18 Part hachi
00:36:25*scorche|w will have to go home and look at his chart
00:36:33saratoga211I measured a couple ma savings with USB off on the 5024
00:36:46saratoga211to this day i run with it off on my sansa
00:39:51*Nico_P is sorry to have missed the buffer talk... was on the phone
00:40:47saratoga211i'm still curious about the audio codecs, do we actually buffer them or does a codec get loaded when its needed?
00:41:59Nico_Pthe codecs are buffered
00:42:35 Quit saratoga211 ("CGI:IRC")
00:42:43 Quit bertrik ("bye")
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00:47:10kugelcodecs are buffered? didn't know
00:47:34amiconnWell, they need to
00:47:58amiconnWhat good would it be to buffer multiple audio tracks, only to spin up the disk for loading a codec?
00:48:16amiconn-> wasted battery power
00:48:18 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:48:33 Join Thundercloud [0] (
00:49:48kugelI never think of hdd targets
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00:51:00 Quit ender` (" In the beginning, there was nothing. And God said, 'Let there be Light.' And there was still nothing, but you could see a bi)
00:51:05kugelSo, was there any consensus about the buffer stuff now?
00:51:45 Quit obo ("bye")
00:51:51*kugel still thinks that most of the time the RAM can be used better for plugins (if needed) for flash targets
00:51:53Lloreankugel: A decision hardly needs to be made now. It was just general idea tossing about.
00:52:35LloreanI think there's only two plugins that could use extra RAM right now anyway.
00:53:13kugelMore than enough :)
00:53:44 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
00:53:47*pixelma is still annoyed be the generalisation in "flash targets"....
00:54:05Lloreanpixelma: Kugel has a habit of forgetting that any other players beyond his exists, from the sound of it. ;)
00:54:09*linuxstb holds his logik dax and stands next to pixelma ;)
00:54:20*linuxstb waits for amiconn's comment... ;)
00:54:42JdGordon|whey linuxstb, did you look at the patch i attached?
00:54:50*Nico_P did
00:55:05kugelWhy? In general, flash targets don't benefit that much (in contrast to hdd targets) from prebuffering stuff, do they?
00:55:30JdGordon|wkugel: they are winging because not all flash targets have 32+mb ram
00:55:31LloreanI don't think the jpeg viewer is a good reason to expand plugin memory one-sidedly. And that leaves pictureflow, which on flash targets could stream the album covers from the disk anyway, so *also* doesn't need more RAM on the subset of flash based targets that do have more RAM to be freed up.
00:56:07JdGordon|wNico_P: any comments?
00:56:27soapWhy do (current) manufactures spend the (considerable) money putting 32+ megs of RAM on flash players if it does not have tangible benefit?
00:56:49soapI can't speak to the technical reason - but no company would waste such money.
00:56:51pixelmakugel: there is at least on flash target (with Rockbox fully working) that has less than 2MB RAM which can be used, every cut in that is sometimes noticable with a certain voice file stops working for example... :\
00:57:02 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
00:57:02saratogathey probably can't find fast <32MB SDRAMs anymore
00:58:00Nico_PJdGordon|w: I tried it on the Gigabeat sim and the popup didn't cover anything... but I like the idea
00:58:15Nico_PI just wonder how it could be handled globally in rockbox
00:58:29JdGordon|whow do you mean?
00:58:55saratogai think some of the new sandisk players even have 64MB, again probably because thats whats available at the speed/power grades they need
00:59:19Nico_PJdGordon|w: well IIUC you'd have to handle all the possible screens from within the "WM"
00:59:41amiconnsoap: (1) The large ram might even be cheaper than a smaller one, considering mass production and quantities
00:59:45JdGordon|wnot completly, but yeah
01:00:06amiconn(2) if the flash player is derived from a hdd player, they save one step in redesign
01:00:07Nico_PJdGordon|w: would that require big changes, or is it already how things work?
01:02:00JdGordon|wNico_P: there is a fair bit of work to get to a workable point... but once the wps and lists are done there wont be any different code to change screens... instead of (eg..) the wps calling the pitch screen and it using the whole screen, pitch screen would add its window and the WM would tell it which vp to draw into
01:02:06 Quit conando (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:03:48Nico_PI'm not very familiar with the implications of viewports yet... is the WM approach required to make the WPS be drawn under e.g. the pitch screen or can that already be done without the WM approach?
01:03:57 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:04:14***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:05:42JdGordon|win theory it could be done without vp, but that means its the wps forcing the redraw, vp makes it work because it could be any screen along side the wps, not just the ones the wps knows about
01:05:56 Quit scorche|w ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
01:07:04linuxstbWhat do you mean by "along side the wps" ? Isn't the WPS full-screen?
01:07:14JdGordon|wit doesnt have to be
01:08:15JdGordon|wits one of those scary features which can be put in for the ppl that like pretty...
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01:09:14amiconnWell, wps isn't always fullscreen even in svn. The status bar can be enabled
01:09:26JdGordon|w+ button bar
01:09:37amiconnThat too
01:10:02 Join Jay_G [0] (
01:10:03linuxstbYes, but I can't see a desire to leave a permanent hole in the WPS for other screens to draw into.
01:10:11LloreanI like the idea of being able to define a "slice" of the WPS to use as status bar.
01:10:14Lloreanlinuxstb: You don't have to.
01:10:27Lloreanlinuxstb: Look at WPSes that look *very* different in the absence of album art, no hole
01:10:42LloreanYou'd just need a conditional tag for "overlayed" or something
01:10:43JdGordon|wbassically, if we do this we have heaps more flexiblity than if we stay with the currnet flat system
01:10:55amiconnAh, no. WPS has no button bar
01:10:57 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:11:17JdGordon|wamiconn: it doesnt? ok, but it _could_
01:11:20amiconnAnd now that I enabled the button bar for a quick test, I noticed that it's buggy in the main menu...
01:11:58JdGordon|wlinuxstb: also, is there a lcd_update_viewport() function? instead of having to call update_rect?
01:12:26linuxstbHave you looked at the patch? ;)
01:12:40JdGordon|wmust have missed it then :p
01:12:44Jay_GIs it Possible to Display Default Image for Album Art in WPS script?
01:12:44Jay_GWhen no album art is present, is there a way to display a default .bmp image? Testing for album art is straight-forward, but the If<Then|Else> query isn't sufficient. Here's what I've found:
01:12:44DBUGEnqueued KICK Jay_G
01:12:48Jay_GThis seems to work, except that preloading NoArt.bmp keeps album art from showing (when it's present). So, the NoArt.bmp image is always displayed.
01:12:54linuxstbJdGordon|w: I think I added it with v4
01:12:57Jay_GI don't know if there's a possibility for this to work or not. I've tried various permutations of these statements, leaving out coordinates, etc. with no luck.
01:13:00Jay_GThere are two problems -
01:13:02Jay_G 1) The Rockbox Manual does not say how an image that has not been preloaded can have an Image ID. In this statement, I simply used 'V' without having assigned it earlier in the script.
01:13:05Jay_G 2) Using %x in the If<Then|Else> query creates a problem, in that it requires x & Y coordinates. The next statement (%Cl...) then needs to provide coordinates for album art. Even though the coordinates are the same, this may be causing a conflict.
01:13:09Jay_GIs it possible to test for a negative in the If<Then|Else> query? If so, testing for the lack of album art could be my last statement. Maybe this just isn't possible at present. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated.
01:13:21JdGordon|wlinuxstb: that could be the other reason I missed it
01:14:09linuxstbJay_G: Just make the default image part of the background image for your WPS.
01:14:35LloreanIt's better to include it in the backdrop anyway. One less file loaded, and less total WPS buffer used up
01:15:15JdGordon|wlinuxstb: oh, is there a way to disable the background image for a viewport?
01:15:33Jay_GThanks. That's a great idea. However, it would be nice to be able to change the default image from time to time.
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01:16:07linuxstbJdGordon|w: No, but there could be if needed.
01:16:15JdGordon|wI think it will be
01:18:04JdGordon|wim heading home, if anyone has any comments on that patch let me know.. i dont want to code the thing into the core and then have arguments on it....
01:18:08 Quit JdGordon|w ("CGI:IRC")
01:19:19Lloreanlinuxstb: Probably could be useful, for "Splash"-type things in plugins, etc.
01:21:36 Part pixelma
01:21:48kugelDid JdGordon mean, that he's just about to commit vp?
01:23:08 Quit Alonea ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox]")
01:23:14CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
01:23:14*linuxstb checks his computer for intruders
01:23:48LloreanHe meant he's working on an extension to the viewports idea, and would like comments on it from core developers now, before he's spent hours on it and people are saying "We don't want this in the core, shoo"
01:24:18Lloreankugel: If you're really interested in keeping up with development, you should pay attention to the mailing lists too, so you don't have to constantly ask "Huh? What does he mean?" type questions.
01:24:49soapJay_G, there is a hierarchy of places the WPS code looks for album art. If you can always place a "default" cover.bmp in the root directory of your music.
01:24:49kugelIt sounded like he is
01:25:12kugelbesides, he mentioned in the tracker, that he wants to commit it asap (next view days)
01:25:14soapIt will first try in the album's folder, then start looking down the tree.
01:25:55Lloreankugel: He said he doesn't want to code the thing into the core. Viewports can't go anywhere *but* the core. A little logic applied suggests then that he can't be talking about viewports, since we've said we want that for a long, long time.
01:27:33Jay_Gsoap - I wasn't aware of that. I'll give that a shot. Thanks.
01:27:58soapthe specific hierarchy is covered in the AlbumArt wiki page.
01:28:14soapthe manual is not the last word on such details.
01:28:34kugelLlorean: maling lists is a good idea, I should read them more often
01:29:05Lloreansoap: That should probably be documented in the manual. Unlike the cover.WxH.bmp name, the places it looks, and the other names, are likely to stay, right?
01:29:53soapYes, now that I honestly think about it - that is "end-user" information, not "WPS creator" info.
01:30:05Jay_Gsoap - yes, I've been all over the web finding tips and workarounds.
01:30:55Nico_Pkugel: I think you're confusing JdGordon and linuxstb
01:31:07soapJay_G, that's cool - but you don't need to stray much past the wiki, and you should confirm anything you learn about Rockbox from anywhere but
01:31:34kugelNico_P: Lol, yea, you're right.
01:31:47soapThere is a lot of misinformation out there., and you can surely trust anything you read on or - but few other places.
01:32:08kugel>_< so much names
01:34:26saratogais the apps/recorder folder only for the archos recorder?
01:35:34Jay_Gsoap - Most of my answers came from But, I started off with Kugel's build - modifying the KratoJet theme. I couldn't find documentation on some of the statements, so had to go elsewhere.
01:37:12Nico_Psaratoga: it used to be, but not anymore... it has derived to things for targets with bitmap displays and recording
01:37:18linuxstbJay_G: Presumably unofficial tags?
01:38:19Jay_Glinusstb - Yes, unofficial. Although I didn't know that at the time. Took me a while to figure that out.
01:38:39 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
01:38:59karashataJay_G: as far as I know, the patches that were applied to the build should list what tags they add to the WPS code and their uses, you can find the patches on the tracker
01:38:59Lloreansaratoga: Is something stopping the charging patch for sansa from being committed?
01:39:24 Quit waldo ("Konversation terminated!")
01:39:25saratogaLlorean: personally I don't think so
01:39:31karashataJay_G: something that *might* help you save some time and effort later
01:39:57saratogabut i never got a reply to my last question on the tracker
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01:40:27kugelJay_G: I even made the patch list "clickable", so it's one step to find out what tags might only exist in my build
01:40:31saratogai see no reason we couldn't just pick a conservative current limit (and thermal limit if we have access to the probe) and commit
01:40:32 Quit Rincewind ("bye")
01:40:40Jay_Gkarashata - Thanks. Yes it will.
01:41:04karashataJay_G: no problem
01:41:58Lloreansaratoga: As long as you err on the side of conservative, I don't really see a problem with it (in my personal opinion) either.
01:42:27saratogai doubt the PP hardware will actually let you overheat the battery anyway, even if you try to force it
01:42:39Jay_GKugel - Ha. Yes, it wasn't your fault. I was looking on for answers for a loooong time before I realized there were unofficial tags being used in the KratoJet theme. Beginners blues, I guess.
01:44:22saratogaregarding JPEG + resizing in core, looking at the rockbox jpeg decoder, theres already a primitive resize by powers of 2 option built in
01:44:32Nico_Psaratoga, Llorean: which patch is it?
01:44:51saratogawe could combine that with the bilinear scaling patch to quite efficienctly resize jpeg images
01:45:38saratogaNico_P: 8363
01:46:53saratogainterestingly, in the case of large jpeg art, resizing probably becomes faster and needs less RAM the larger the jpeg's resolution
01:47:14Nico_Phow come?
01:47:37saratogabecause the higher the resolution, the fewer the DCT coefficicents you need
01:48:13saratogaif you can be sure that you'll never need to resize by less then a factor of 8 in each dimension, you don't even need to do an iDCT, you can just compute the average value and use that
01:50:47Nico_Pbut if you always resize to 1/8, a smaller pic will be faster, right?
01:51:44saratogayes I think so
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02:01:31webguest90Is there any way to call a plugin from a menu?
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02:09:58scorcheis not one his traits?
02:13:13*JdGordon back
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02:27:20linuxstbJdGordon: My initial reaction to your patch is that it's too early. There are still lots of other, more fundamental, things to do with viewports, such as adapting the list widget (and others, such as the quickscreen) to draw to viewports I also think we first need to agree/design how this new "full-theming" will work (i.e. how does the theme designer specify all this?), and what capabilities we
02:27:23linuxstbwant to add to Rockbox to support it, before we start arguing about the mechanics.
02:29:56JdGordonthats sort-of why im jumping in early..
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02:33:21linuxstbWhat do you mean?
02:34:06JdGordoni dunno... im agreeing with you except it being too early
02:35:21linuxstbThen you're not agreeing with me ;) But I need to sleep now, goodnight.
02:35:27 Part linuxstb
02:35:39JdGordonstupid timezone
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03:04:08RogerBaconanyone noticed this project about the archos 605 and 705 ? :
03:04:15***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:05:07krazykitRogerBacon, it was posted in the NewPorts forum.
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05:35:04MigLopezHi all
05:35:23MigLopezAnyone around here?
05:36:26MigLopezAnyone around here that can answer a few questions?
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06:12:24cjbHi! Which devices support video playback in rockbox? (with the mpegplayer plugin, it looks like?)
06:13:17krazykitcjb, most of the players
06:13:35krazykitthere's a list of features supported, let me find it for you
06:13:58psycho_maniacfor each player? yes i was thinking of that page but i cant think of it.
06:14:40cjbhuh, the gigabeat looks pretty good
06:14:59LloreanIt's the most recommended one for video playback
06:15:11cjbgreat. do lots of people have it, then?
06:15:28psycho_maniacI had one I loved it and am planning on getting another
06:15:37LloreanNo way to really know how many people have it.
06:16:39krazykityou could pretty much pick any of the targets and be pretty happy with it.
06:16:48LloreanNot for video.
06:17:50cjbSounds like I should investigate and plan on getting one, then. Thanks very much!
06:18:08krazykitoh, i guess the h300 and ipods aren't really all that great in that respect
06:18:24LloreanThe iPod Nano is good. The Photo is probably acceptable.
06:18:43LloreanThe iPod video is right out for the time being. And the Sansa c200's screen is just flat out too small
06:18:55cjboh, there are several models of gigabeat [GFXPSVUT]
06:19:08cjbis there one in particular that rockbox likes?
06:19:09LloreanF and X are the only two we run on.
06:19:20*scorche waves at cjb
06:19:33LloreanWith the F being slightly better supported, as the X is "as far as we know identical" internally, but sometimes seems to behave differently.
06:19:41cjbGreat. Oh, I see, there are wiki pages on this.
06:20:39LycoLococjb: I've got a gigabeat and love hte video playback
06:20:46LycoLocoGigabeat F40S
06:22:18psycho_maniacWhat does the S mean in F40S ?
06:22:47LycoLocowhich is such a silly designator when you're talking about model numbers
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06:26:57Lynn_anyone there?
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06:27:28Lynn_hey I have a quick question
06:27:38Lynn_anyone have the sansa e280?
06:27:47scorcheLycoLoco: if you ahve a question, go ahead and ask it
06:28:06scorcheLynn_: that was directed at you :)
06:28:08LycoLocoLynn_: I believe that krazykit does
06:28:12Lynn_ahh thanks.
06:28:20Lynn_well does it take forever to build the database?
06:28:26Lynn_if you have it full of mp3's?
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06:28:40scorchethere is a definite end
06:28:50Lynn_first time running rockbox
06:29:11Lynn_where does it look for the music?
06:29:27scorcheeverywhere on the device
06:29:39Lynn_and is there a way to connect to winxp with rockbox running
06:29:47Lynn_to upload or download music?
06:29:47scorchenot at the moment
06:29:59Lynn_so you have to do it in the original mode.
06:30:15Lynn_turn it off start it with the usb on then disconnect usb and reconnect?
06:30:25Lynn_that's the only way I have been able to do it.
06:30:51scorcheyou can also boot into the original firmware and connect the device through USB
06:30:59Lloreanscorche: Everywhere but folders containing a file named database.ignore
06:31:15LloreanAnd subfolders of those, I *think*
06:31:18Lynn_how do you boot in the original firmware
06:31:35Lynn_oh no all my music is in subfolders under music folder
06:31:52Lynn_should it take hours for it to build the database?
06:32:00Lynn_its found something like 16?
06:32:03Lynn_what does that mean
06:32:06Lynn_16 folders?
06:32:14Lynn_or 16 tracks? or what
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06:33:19Lynn_thanks for your information. I am very new to rockbox but it looks awesome.
06:33:33Lynn_is there a way to change the themes with the sansa?
06:33:42krazykitLynn_, that's covered in the manual
06:33:48Lynn_oh sorry.
06:33:56Lynn_I was reading over it now
06:34:12Lynn_i have installed all the theams but it does not allow me to choose them
06:34:29Lynn_I do but its like it does not activate them
06:34:49Lynn_oh yeah I did the automatic installation is that a bad thing?
06:34:52Lynn_it seemed to work fine
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06:39:13Lynn_sorry if I bored you all... just playing around with rockbox.
06:39:34Lynn_trying to find a better source of an mp3 player capable of playing some flac files.
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07:03:12Lynn_i would also like to provide a mirror for the site... what would I do?
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07:19:15cjbLycoLoco: Any idea which of the supported Gigabeats are actually on sale in the US?
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07:20:17LycoLococjb: I think you'll have a hard time finding one new
07:20:24LycoLocobut I bought mine from eBay slightly used, and it's wonderful
07:20:38krazykitcjb, amazon and ebay are probably your best sources
07:20:47cjbRighto, thanks.
07:20:54LycoLocoLynn_: that's what we're all lookin for :)
07:21:03cjbno support for any models other than F, X, S, right?
07:21:21krazykitS isn't supported yet
07:21:29cjboh, yes.
07:21:46cjbhmph. I'd rather be closer to 2G than 40G. :)
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07:22:52Mouser_Xlinuxstb: (For the logs) With the current implementation of veiwports, would I be able to have the current playlist show up in the WPS, and still be able to use all the play control features? If not, how hard would it be to get that working? Or might it be possible later? I'd probably use the veiwports for this the most, since I'd like to see farther ahead than 1 song.
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07:26:21Mouser_Xlinuxstb: If you couldn't tell, I don't have reliable internet access (I've only got a Wii for now), so I most likely won't see your anser on IRC. Maybe on the flyspray?
07:26:44scorcheMouser_X: there are the logs...
07:27:15scorcheif he can see your question in the logs, cant you see his reply in the logs? :)
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07:31:01Mouser_Xscorche: The only device that I have at this time that can access the internet is a Wii. Frankly, it's a pain to use for IRC. As for the logs, the Wii has no method of searching the logs, and I don't have time to read them. Also, at the rate this is going, it will most likely auto-quit after I send this message.
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07:39:53LloreanMouser_X: Can't yet, won't be easy as it stands, and "what play control features"?
07:40:46LloreanWith jdgordon's work it might become possible to show the Playlist over the WPS, in a sub-window. But Viewports doesn't automatically create extra buttons on your player, so you'll probably just end up with the old controls you had when viewing the playlist by way of the old menu system.
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07:41:42LloreanShowing the playlist as a WPS element, without having any control over the list (Basically, Next Track, Next+1, Next+2, Next+3 for example) would be non-viewports anyway. Just a job for new tags.
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08:16:39ptw419does rb support something like : char * blah = new char[10];
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08:19:23JdGordonptw419: new is c++
08:19:53ptw419ugh, i forget.., and i realized that a couple of seconds ago
08:20:10ptw419i think i figured it out though
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08:50:34*GodEater places a bet on the second bit of tumbleweed on the right
09:02:28ptw419whats the function to allow a certain amt of time to pass?
09:03:18ptw419hopefully i finish the nifty little tool soon ;)
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09:08:20JdGordonfucking cats
09:08:29JdGordonmaking heaps of noise next door...
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09:11:53GodEaterptw419: which "nifty little tool" are you working on ? What will it do ? :)
09:17:01ptw419trying to make the S bootloader allow you to pick which rockbox file you choose to load
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09:19:12ptw419it should allow for easier dev work on the rb kernel, and with a little bit of work even boot of the OF(which i don't think is necessary)
09:20:03GodEaterhell no :)
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09:49:46amiconnptw419: Sounds quite unnecessary. The only thing the rockbox bootloader should do is boot rockbox, as fast and secure as possible. It should output no text by default, and boot rockbox straight away.
09:50:19Lloreanamiconn: Right now though, they need a way to choose the binary, since transfers are mtp only, and filenames are obfuscated.
09:50:48amiconnI'm not sure I understand why
09:51:08LloreanSend multiple over, and test each of them, in one sitting?
09:52:13amiconnWhy is that different than an ums target, apart from the obfuscated filenames?
09:53:23LloreanWell, then they'd have to get RoLo working, rather than letting you pick a binary during the boot stage?
09:53:33*Llorean isn't really sure....
09:54:18amiconnWell, you transfer a rockbox build, and reboot to test it. You need to do that on all targets
09:55:00LloreanYeah, but RoLo allows you to transfer several builds, then reboot into each sequentially to try out different values.
09:55:01GodEateramiconn: there are a number of issues with the S though
09:55:15LloreanAnd my understanding is that the MTP deleting or overwriting of files is somewhat problematic
09:55:18GodEateramiconn: for example, using libmtp, you have to unplug it and plug it back in again after each mtp command
09:55:21GodEateror it doesn't work
09:55:39LloreanSince you don't set the filename, you have to go to some measures to make sure that your Rockbox binary is in the right location for the bootloader to spot it, right?
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09:55:45GodEaterand yes - deleting files over mtp is pain, you can't send the filename, you have to look up the ID it was assigned when it was written to disk
09:55:58GodEaterand since finding THAT out is ALSO an mtp command, you've yet another plug/unplug cycle to go through
09:56:26LloreanSo basically, it's hacking Rockbox to try to avoid the horror that is libmtp?
09:56:33GodEaterpretty much
09:56:47GodEaterour alternative would be of course to fix limbtp to behave nicer with the S
09:56:56GodEaterbut we're not libmtp hackers :)
09:57:38*amiconn thinks that if libmtp is such a pain, work should focus on one of 2 things. Either (1) fix libmtp to not require plug/unplug for each cycle, or (2) try to get the rockbox usb stack into the bootloader, and get ums working
09:57:42GodEaterof course, once we have a proper USB stack on it, then this problem will go away too - but it's kind of a catch-22 situation at the moment
09:57:55amiconnThe gigabeat S uses the i.MX31, right?
09:59:28GodEaterbut since Zagor hasn't got the usb stack doing file transfers yet, I think ptw419's method is the quickest way forward for us currently. Of course once we have rockbox in a "release" state on the S, then we can take these things out of the bootloader again. This is purely while development continues on it.
10:00:21amiconnWell, especially since Zagor didn't manage to get ums working yet, it would be very interesting to try it on a real i.MX31
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10:00:58GodEaterhe'd need an S to try it on though wouldn't he ?
10:01:00amiconnThe PP usb controller is said to be compatible to the i.MX31's, but we can't be sure until we get it working
10:01:17GodEateror I guess one of us as guinea pigs, although I'm not sure how much use we'd be as debuggers for it.
10:01:24amiconnAnd it would help to narrow down whether it's a bug in the stack or a difference in the controller
10:01:40GodEateras I understand it though, don't we need working interrupts for his stack to work ?
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10:09:30WeaponXi was just wondering, does running flac files use more battery than running mp3 files?
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10:10:31LloreanWeaponX: If your player has a disk, it needs to spin the disk more often, and that takes more battery.
10:10:54WeaponXoh ok
10:11:30WeaponXand is it possible to have rockbox just check for updated files everytime the ipod is restarted instead of going through my entire music collection
10:11:54GodEaterWeaponX: yes, this is covered in the manual under the database section
10:12:15WeaponXalrighty, i will check it our. thank you
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10:22:54WeaponXdoes lowering the brightness on rockbox help the battery to last like it does on the ipodos?
10:23:14GodEaterI don't believe anyone's done any testing on that really
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10:23:33WeaponXhmm ok
10:23:39WeaponXi would think it would because it turns down the led behind the screen
10:24:08GodEateryes, but the only way to acheive that is to do some complicated stuff in software
10:24:29GodEatersince I don't believe the lcd hardware in the ipod does brightness natively
10:24:43amiconnDefine 'the' ipod
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10:25:10amiconnThe Video and Nano *do* have brightness control in hardware, and rockbox uses it
10:25:27WeaponXits an ipod video 5.5g 80gb
10:25:33GodEateroh well - there you go then
10:25:42GodEaterso yes, it probably will help your battery life somewhat
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10:29:30*amiconn wonders where GodEater were during the last weeks ;)
10:29:59GodEatermy pc blew up
10:30:00*amiconn committed hardware brightness control for Video+Nano back on 12 Nov 2007
10:30:12GodEateroh - that long ago
10:30:16GodEaterhmm - I have no excuse then
10:31:13peturI wanted to send you to the corner but you were already there :p
10:33:22amiconnPresumably the 4th Gen (both color and greyscale) also have hardware brightness control (even more fine-grained than the Nano/Video), but that needs research by a dev having such a target
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11:19:55GodEaterI thought eigma was going to send his "Gentlemen, we have SOUND!" email last night ?
11:20:03LloreanWhat target has sound?
11:20:13LloreanAaah, neat
11:20:22GodEaterI can't see it on the list though
11:20:27GodEaterI could have sworn he said he'd sent it
11:20:48hcsGentlemen, you've got MAIL!
11:21:59LloreanI haven't seen it.
11:22:20GodEatermaybe he's not subscribed to the list
11:22:22GodEaterand it got bounced
11:29:36*GodEater notes that linuxstb's original "Gentlemen" email for the ipod didn't include what song was played first.
11:31:05GodEaterlatest svn + viewports patch won't build for the gigabeat F
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11:50:14GodEateranyone else playing with the patch at all ?
11:53:11*pondlife isn't
11:53:14BigBambiGodEater: You need v4.2
11:53:23*petur would love to but has zero spare time :(
11:53:25BigBambiWhich linuxstb hasn't yet put on flyspray
11:53:38BigBambiIf you check the logs he posted a link to his site yesterday
11:53:41pondlifeBut I do like amiconn+pixelma's Tower.. 2.3kg of pure Rockbox
11:53:44GodEaterah ok
11:53:54BigBambiGodEater: It works very nicely though
11:54:01pixelmapondlife: not exactly (yet)
11:54:20pixelmabecause of the M3
11:54:30BigBambiGodEater: I had a play and adapted cabie v2 to it (plus some personal changes) just to see how it works
11:54:37pondlifeHmm, that's not valid then (yet) ;)
11:54:42pixelmapondlife: but glad you like it ;)
11:55:06pondlifeI particularly like the inclusion of foundations.
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11:55:18GodEaterBigBambi: are you sure it's in the logs from yesterday ?
11:55:35BigBambiGodEater: No, day before :)
11:56:12GodEaterI'll put it on flyspray myself - it'll save him doing it ;)
11:57:02pixelmapondlife: yes, that came in very handy :)
11:58:19BigBambiGodEater: It is exactly the same as v4.1 with a fix to compile on gigabeat
12:01:04GodEatermuch better
12:02:07GodEaterflyspray now has it too
12:02:39BigBambiIt really works very nicely
12:02:54GodEaterI'm trying to think of something to do with it ;)
12:03:20BigBambiYeah, that is part of the problem
12:03:49BigBambiI did a theme that didn't really need it (I just used to to have arbitrary line spacings) as a proof of concept type thing
12:04:11BigBambiBut I'm not very creative
12:05:27GodEaterI guess what would really show it off is a wps which has two columns of data on it
12:05:51BigBambiYes, which makes it a bit harder on a portrait screen
12:06:19BigBambiWhich lends itself much more to a line based approach anyway
12:06:32GodEateryeah, I was just thinking that
12:06:36*GodEater eyes his ipod...
12:06:44pondlifeI'd think the status bar would be a good thing to viewport...
12:07:02GodEaterI think most people agreed with that
12:07:04pixelmaIpod Classic style? eurgh...
12:07:35GodEaterhmm - my hedkandi theme has been deleted from the wiki :(
12:08:29GodEaterpixelma: you're the artist - you knock us up a good wps to show off the current viewports status ;)
12:08:37markundid anyone try JdGordon's test plugin?
12:09:32GodEaternot so far
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12:14:03GodEateractually, just having a viewport in the middle of the screen to limit scrolling would do
12:14:15GodEaterso you can have some sort od decorative border
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12:43:14Jetonis there any possibility to include in the Album Art query so that it can search for more than cover.bmp or Artist -Track.bmp. For example Sansa OF uses Folder.jpg, therefore in Rockbox it can be Folder.bmp
12:43:41JetonThis would eliminate the need for renaming, you would only need to convert the files to .bmp/
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12:55:43*GodEater hacks the Theme X Glow wps to use a Viewport in the middle
12:55:58GodEaterit seems the "main" viewport though ignores the currently selected foreground colour
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13:00:32GodEateryeah - if you change the fg colour - the elements of the wps which should be affected by it aren't
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13:08:07conandoBadger (or anyone else ;o) .. could you perhaps roughly hint me in the direction to how i would code scheduling the selected song in picture flow for playing? (immediately afterwards the plugin would quit so playing could start)
13:09:55GodEaterI'm not sure that's possible
13:10:03GodEaterat least, I can't think of a way of doing it
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13:10:32GodEaterI don't think the current plugin architecture allows you to do what you want
13:10:54soapany of the older WPSs which relied on both margins of the Scrolling Margins patch would be prime candidates for viewport conversion.
13:12:42conandoGodEater: hm ok :( .. Badger yesterday said it should be possible ;) so i hoped there would be a way to achieve that
13:15:51GodEaterconando: in that case you're better off getting advice from Bagder, since I've no clue how to do it.
13:16:21GodEatersoap: the quick hack I did to "Theme X Glow" works very well with confining the track information to the box in the middle of the screen
13:16:39GodEaterapart from, as outlined above, the little issue with the foreground colour of the fullscreen viewport not changing
13:17:12conandoGodEater: ok, thanks anyway.. i'll wait for him to clue me in ;)
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13:29:53pickerJeton: yes, I'd also find it usefull if the AA would also be searched in ../<folder-name>.bmp
13:30:43pickerBut as the wiki says (, only ../albumtitle .bmp is used.
13:31:50pickerI'd place ../folder-name.bmp between 4 and 5 (as in the wiki). What do other people or developers here think?
13:34:59pickerIt's a bit unlogical now: for the file, the file name is used, but for the album, the album title (and not the folder name) is used. IMHO folder name could be used as well (after album-title.bmp hasn't been found)
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13:53:54bwanannacan one upgrade rockbox simply by coping the .rockbox from the newest to the same folder on the ipod for instance
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13:54:16GodEaterthat is in fact the recommended method
13:54:27bwanannai was hoping so but wasn't sure
13:54:30GodEateralthough we'd substitute "copy from zip file" with "extract"
13:58:48GodEaterwhy does albumart.[ch] live in apps/recorder ?
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14:03:17GodEaterhey linuxstb :)
14:03:26linuxstbGood afternoon.
14:03:44GodEaterI added the 4.2 diff to flyspray for you. Hope you don't mind.
14:04:34linuxstbNo problem - the next patch is taking much longer than I thought.
14:05:24GodEaterwhat's going into it ?
14:05:42linuxstbI also read in the logs about your problem with the colours of the main viewport in the WPS. I'll look at that.
14:06:08linuxstbNothing special - just implementing viewports in more lcd drivers (there are 7 to do...)
14:07:17GodEaterI've not checked for similar behaviour with the bg_color - all the WPS's I've tried have had backdrops
14:07:35pixelmais the information in wikipedia right that "aluminium" is the British spelling?
14:08:24GodEaterpixelma: yep
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14:09:32ptw419<amiconn> ptw419: Sounds quite unnecessary. The only thing the rockbox bootloader should do is boot rockbox, as fast and secure as possible. It should output no text by default, and boot rockbox straight away.
14:09:50pixelmaGodEater: thanks, just found a (?) nice typo in the Nano manual...
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14:10:26ptw419for usability, thats true, but as a dev tool, I think it would be very useful at this point, due to all the trouble it takes to reload another rb file as explained by GodEater
14:11:12ptw419my next goal was to probably try to integrate the current usb stack w/ the S build
14:11:57ptw419but that also depends on what is done, and what is required. also, I didn't know aboutl rolo, but i might look into that as well
14:12:10GodEaterwhich reminds me - I never found out if the usb stack requires working interrupts or not :)
14:13:04markunlinuxstb: are you duplicating a lot of code when implementing viewports for all the lcd drivers?
14:13:10ptw419I was wanting to see how far into rb could go w/out interrupts
14:14:45ptw419as far as deleting files on the S using libmtp, I found that only deleting them in Windows works :\
14:15:22GodEaterptw419: I managed to get it work - but you have to use the file's id number
14:15:29GodEaterptw419: you can't just use the filename for some reason
14:16:15GodEateralso, there appear to be two files present which, should you delete them, the OF just replaces again straight away
14:16:16CasainhoBagder: are you there?
14:17:10ptw419I was wondering how the OF "maps" the files actually on the hd in sequential number, and the filenames listed through mtp
14:17:42bwanannaexcellent, it upgraded properly
14:17:45ptw419b/c if you del a file using remove from the bootloader, it still shows in the mtp file listing
14:17:49bwanannathanks for the great software folks
14:18:31GodEaterptw419: that's curious indeed
14:18:41ptw419and if you try to open it after deletion, it doesn't open, which makes me suspect there is some type of relational db or something similar(my thoughts point to the .edb files)
14:19:10GodEaterisn't .edb some sort of access database ?
14:19:21ptw419GodEater: exchange
14:19:23GodEaterI seem to recall that's what the early versions of Microsoft Exchange used
14:19:48GodEaterMicrosoft: "let's implement an enterprise email solution using ACCESS!!!"
14:19:50ptw419if we can manage to figure that out, I think we have an excellent way to interface w/ the files on the hd
14:20:13GodEaterBillG: "It can't turn out worse than Lotus Notes. Go for it."
14:20:38ptw419good ol' bill
14:21:06GodEaterI bet it was because someone cooked it up in VBA one lunch time
14:21:11GodEateranyway - back on topic ;)
14:24:05ptw419i never learned vb. too difficult
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14:24:48Crash91Guys im thinking of making a contender for DefaultWPS
14:25:13Crash91need to know a few things from all you RB users
14:25:51Crash91#1 What is the most preferable font/font size to use? (one which is readable and clear)
14:26:44Crash91#2 What is the preferred volume/battery meter type? Would nice and simple graphical ones with text ones beside them be ok?
14:26:58GodEaterCrash91: the answer to 1) is different on every target
14:27:23Crash91GodEater: True, different dpi im guessing?
14:27:35GodEaterwell - different resolutions certainly
14:28:07GodEateralso you don't really need to ask 2) - that's why it's a competition. If you come up with something people like, then it'll get votes...
14:28:28Crash91ok, #3 then
14:29:11Crash91GodEater: I was thinking of taking what everyone wants and making a perfect WPS
14:29:48GodEaterthere's no such thing
14:29:54GodEatereveryone wants something different
14:30:11GodEaterif we already knew what a perfect WPS looked like - we wouldn't be having a competition would we ?
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14:30:50Crash91Are high contrast colours more preferable (i.e. Black and White) or something more subtle, like grey on black?
14:31:06Crash91(im not just talking monochrome here)
14:31:25Crash91GodEater: Well, not a perfect one, but at least one that appeals to the widest range of people
14:31:28GodEaterwhy don't you just submit a design to the thread, and see what people think ?
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14:31:47Crash91GodEater: I for one dislike Cabbie, thats why im doing it
14:31:59Crash91GodEater: ok , im gonna do that now :)
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14:32:30*Crash91 reboots into windows to use PS (i cant get used to the gimp!)
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14:35:05GodEaterah crap - ptw419 left :(
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14:48:36GodEaterneat - there's an MTP based FUSE filesystem :)
14:55:51linuxstbmarkun: Well, the LCD drivers are already extremely similar to each other, so in that respect you could say I'm duplicating code (i.e. the diffs are almost identical). But it's not duplication in terms of code that can be factored out.
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15:10:04markunlinuxstb: that's unfortunate
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15:16:01amiconnlinuxstb: LCD drivers are similar because of what they do, but as you said, it'd be very difficult to impossible to find simply duplicated code to factor out
15:16:48amiconnThe different pixel formats each offer different optimisation strategies - which need to be used for optimal performance
15:17:17linuxstbI agree, I've been trying to see ways to nicely factor out code, and can't...
15:17:27amiconnAnd sometimes simple duplication is easier than going through hoops to avoid it. The asm part of the h1x0 and m5 lcd drivers is an example...
15:19:07amiconnIt could be moved 2 dir levels up and use #if/#else for separation, but I'm not sure this would be a good idea (the difference is that the H1x0 uses a GPIO bit to switch the A0 bit of the LCD controller, while the M5 uses a real cpu address bit)
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15:35:45Nico_Pamiconn: do you know whether the USB stack requires working interrupts?
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15:36:45*Nico_P bbs
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15:39:46amiconnI don't know
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15:41:56peturI guess a polling version would be possible
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15:58:06Nico_Phmm I guess we'll have to ask Zagor when he comes by... I'll give fixing libmtp a go
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16:29:26Nico_PGodEater: using gnomad2 works for me and makes things a little less painful
16:35:30linuxstbGodEater: When you get chance, can you test if viewports-v5.diff (just added to flyspray) fixes your problem?
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16:45:20amiconnThe libmtp website lists the gigabeat S as supported, so I wonder why it's so quirky...
16:47:30Nico_Pit seems to not like the ptp session closing very much
16:50:24*amiconn also didn't know that microsoft wants mtp to become an official standard
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17:14:09*GodEater prods at linuxstb
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17:19:44CasainhoThe main purpose of the protocol is to transfer media files and associated metadata to/from devices, with optional additional support for remote control of the device, reading and setting of device parameters such as special DRM-related device parameters for restricted content.
17:20:24Casainhothats why a Free/Open hardware player for future must be made!!!
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17:30:11*jhMikeS needs to know what keys would be best used for ff and rw for mpegplayer on mr500 and c200 or whether to just commit and let that be chosen later
17:31:48pixelmac200 - left/right I would say...
17:33:43jhMikeSpixelma: ok, thanks
17:33:57markunjhMikeS: will seeking speed up like it does with audio?
17:35:03jhMikeSmarkun: I nicked the basic procedure from the WPS for the WVS so that it even uses the user's preferences
17:35:43markunbecause it was a pain to seek through a 1.5 hour video last weekend ;)
17:35:50pixelmajhMikeS: didn't check if that's already defined but can't you just use the same buttons as defined for the WPS?
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17:36:21pixelma(re. mr500)
17:36:38jhMikeSpixelma: in mpegplayer no mappings were on those keys anyway for either player.
17:37:14jhMikeSso in short probably the best thing to just go ahead
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17:38:36 Quit Mathiasdm (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) WPS mappings exist but I guess it has BUTTON_RC_REW/FF (commented out)
17:39:58pixelmaif I remember correctly the button mapping in mpegplayer wasn't the most intuitive on the c200 (I always have to try out which button calls the menu) so it could need a little tweaking later anyway...
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17:41:21*GodEater prods at linuxstb some more
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17:48:46GodEaterI see someone else has found the telechips info and kindly supplied us with links to it all in the forums
17:48:54GodEatershould we leave the links there
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17:54:26markunGodEater: I was wondering about that as well..
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17:57:42dongsrockbox spam
17:57:46dongslast post
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17:59:58GodEatermarkun: I think I'll just leave it for Llorean or LinusN/Bagder to worry about
18:00:57BigBambidongs: FFS!
18:06:13dongsk bbl
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18:20:16Nico_Phas anyone ever tried using lint/splint on the rockbox code?
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18:23:46Nico_PjhMikeS: congrats :)
18:24:23jhMikeSNico_P: thanks. that one was a long time coming. :)
18:24:45Nico_Pit's going to make a lot of people very happy
18:25:13scorche|wwhile viewing screen :)
18:25:33*jhMikeS thought "While Video Screen" but that works too
18:27:47BuscheljhMikeS: you did some of the work in the frequency scaling of PP502x?
18:29:30jhMikeSBuschel: A few pieces to stabilize things.
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18:31:26Buscheljh: perfect. that's where I have problems with... in fs#8379 i tried to use 24MHz without PLL −− as I want to check the influence of PLL regarding current consumption. when I do so the ipod hangs up after about 1 1/2 hours. maybe you could take a look at it and have some ideas?
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18:33:50jhMikeSBuschel: LCD bridge stuff gave trouble on H10
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18:35:14*bwananna throws Tyroazard a life vest
18:35:34TyroazardAt least there's someone here
18:35:48TyroazardMight as well dump my query and wait.
18:36:07TyroazardUh, I have a iPod Video 30GB, I've installed rockbox
18:36:12BuscheljhMikeS: when using 24MHz without PLL?
18:36:26BigBambiTyroazard: As you will know from having read the guidelines, always just ask
18:36:53TyroazardAnd when I try to play a song, it gives undefined instruction at 0016B030 (0)
18:37:08BigBambiTyroazard: Which build, when is the bootloader from
18:37:11TyroazardYeah, I was typing, rather, recreating the problem
18:37:33TyroazardI just downloaded the Rockbox Ultility from the website
18:37:38TyroazardAnd ran full install
18:37:50BigBambiTyroazard: And are you sure you are using the correct iPod video build
18:38:19krazykitBigBambi, i believe RBUtil installs the 30GB build on all 5th gen iPods
18:38:28BigBambikrazykit: Ah
18:38:40TyroazardUhm. There's two more problems
18:38:48TyroazardI can't turn the thing off.
18:38:56TyroazardIt goes Shutting down and then reboots
18:38:56jhMikeSBuschel: I never tried that. The main problems were 1) using timer interrupts on COP 2) changing the LCD bridge clock when switching 3) Having both cores running during the frequency switch (othercore must be stopped a short time).
18:39:05BigBambiTyroazard: To be sure, could you download the latest current build for 30 Gb iPod Video from the website and install it
18:39:09TyroazardAnd I can't connect it to the computer
18:39:39BigBambiTyroazard: Rockbox doesn't currently have a USB mode, reboot to the Apple firmware or emergency disk mode to connect to computer
18:40:03BigBambiTyroazard: Have you read the manual?
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18:40:27BigBambiTyroazard: And how are you trying to shut down?
18:40:39TyroazardPressing the Play/Pause button
18:40:46BigBambiTyroazard: Odd
18:41:07BigBambiCan you try installing the current build please?
18:41:56TyroazardI'm trying my luck at reinstalling
18:42:00TyroazardI've got it connected
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18:42:40BigBambiTyroazard: If you have the same problems, could you try the manual installation instructions rather than rbutil?
18:42:42Nico_PjhMikeS: the WVS is awesome! :)
18:42:51*BigBambi goes to svn up
18:42:55Buscheljhmikes: saratoga tries to do some current measurements with these changes. if there is a reasonable amount of current we may save, disabling PLL for normal clock gets quite interesting... as i said, on my 5G it playback runs for about 1.5h, then the unit freezes.
18:42:59TyroazardI'll try the manual installation
18:43:23BigBambiTyroazard: Thanks
18:43:54BigBambiwhile viewing screen i guess
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18:44:14linuxstbGodEater_: You were prodding eariler?
18:44:15jhMikeSBuschel: In my experience clocking seems to be a big factor in locking for PP.
18:44:33GodEater_linuxstb: 0 bytes in patch v5 :)
18:44:40linuxstbGodEater_: You sure?
18:44:44jhMikeSNico_P: thanks. any other info that should be there?
18:44:55markunjhMikeS: does it work on the players with rotated screens?
18:44:59Buscheljhmikes: i can guess... that's why i hoped for some good ideas out of your experience :)
18:45:12jhMikeSmarkun: yes. it has rotated font drawing.
18:45:17GodEater_linuxstb: it was earlier - it appears to be full now :)
18:45:27linuxstbGodEater_: A miracle ;)
18:45:29Nico_PjhMikeS: maybe the remaining time
18:45:48amiconnI hope the ui elements are only shown when doing operations
18:45:59Nico_Pbut I don't really care, I like it very much like it is
18:46:02Nico_Pamiconn: of course
18:46:19jhMikeSamiconn: It's a popup when you press button and hides after 4s
18:46:41markunamiconn: since when do you watch videos? :P
18:46:51*jhMikeS has to fix his idiotic red...:p
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18:47:33*BigBambi gives jhMikeS a hearty slap on the back
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18:47:38TyroazardGot new installation in
18:47:42BigBambiI agree, WVS is awesome
18:47:49BigBambiTyroazard: cool, any improvement
18:47:57TyroazardBut shutting down the iPod still doesn't work
18:48:02TyroazardIt still goes Shutting Down
18:48:05TyroazardAnd then reboots
18:48:58BigBambiDo you get the undefined instruction any more?
18:49:10scorche|wTyroazard: when are you releasing the button?
18:49:45TyroazardThe undefined instruction's gone away
18:49:53TyroazardOh nevermind
18:49:56Tyroazardit's back.
18:50:12TyroazardThere also was a Data Abort
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18:50:28BigBambiAnd you just installed the official bootloader with ipodpatcher?
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18:51:08GodEater_has anyone familiar with MoB paid any attention to the forum post from a few 80GB iPod owners about sound glitches ?
18:51:16*amiconn is starting to *hate* his provider :(
18:51:20TyroazardSo now it goes
18:51:20BigBambiTyroazard: Could you copy the contents of rockbox-info.txt (or similar) from your .rockbox folder to
18:53:07conandois the WVS only in SVN currently or already in the latest build?
18:53:23 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
18:53:31 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
18:53:40BigBambiconando: both
18:53:47GodEater_conando: the latest build is always what's in svn
18:53:52BigBambiThe current build is built or svn commit
18:54:11conandoah.. cool... didn't know that
18:54:28GodEater_our build system is magic ;)
18:54:37conandoi thought it's simply scheduled daily :) yeah yeah.. sorry i always underestimate
18:54:39BigBambiThat's why the current build changes many times a day - it is on vn commit
18:54:39amiconnjhMikeS: I also wonders how it works on greyscale targets
18:54:41jhMikeSthere's still some quirks occasionally which I have to get to
18:54:47TyroazardHow would I get the thing to go into disk mode again?
18:54:51TyroazardIt's stopped working
18:54:54jhMikeSamiconn: I cheated a bit but it does work
18:54:56markunjhMikeS: a really nice job man!
18:55:05BigBambiTyroazard: Either boot to the OF
18:55:16*conando rushes for his sansa
18:55:17BigBambiHow to dual boot is in the manual
18:55:26GodEater_conando: there is a daily build too - which is only built once a day - but we never really recommend anyone use it
18:55:37 Quit Tyroazard ()
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18:55:56BigBambiTyroazard: Or boot to emergency disk mode (which should be in the manual too)
18:56:28conandoah ok.. btw how long does a clean build take on a "standard" pc (roughly)? i guess it's not thaaaat long is it?
18:56:36jhMikeSamiconn: what it really needs is that graylib can fully specify the overlay rectangle when running
18:56:46conando(still haven't my own build environment up)
18:56:49BigBambiTyroazard: The main reason I'm not just telling you is there are two many targets to remember all the keys for, but also you will find people here are happy to help, but expect you to have read the documentation :)
18:56:56TyroazardWhere is the manual?
18:56:58amiconnThe raylib will be replaced by the greylib soon(ish)
18:57:05GodEater_conando: about 2 minutes
18:57:06TyroazardI've read the one on the website
18:57:12TyroazardBut I'm not sure if that's it
18:57:13BigBambiTyroazard: There is a link called manual on every page of
18:57:20amiconnI am thinking about text output (and other drawing functions) in unbuffered mode as well
18:57:28 Join bertrik [0] (
18:57:32TyroazardThis it?
18:57:32TyroazardThe Rockbox Manual
18:57:32DBUGEnqueued KICK Tyroazard
18:57:32TyroazardIpod Video
18:57:36BigBambiTyroazard: yep
18:57:44conandoGodEater_: aaah that's nice :)
18:57:47BigBambiIt tells you how to dual boot
18:58:24 Quit xushi (Connection reset by peer)
18:58:36jhMikeSamiconn: I thought there wouldn't be buffered/unbuffer distinction any longer
18:58:58BigBambiEmergency disk mode on ipod video is (I think) menu + select to reboot then (not sure here) either select or menu + play for diskmode
18:59:10conandoi'm more used to projects where a clean build took 2h instead of 2min.. what a relieve
18:59:15BigBambiBut as I say, you are better looking up the keys for yourself
18:59:43GodEater_menu+select to reboot, *immediately* followed by select+play for disk mode
18:59:50TyroazardThere we go
18:59:55GodEater_but I'd just flick the hold switch to "on" after the reboot
18:59:57GodEater_and go into the OF
19:00:02GodEater_the disk transfers are faster then
19:00:12BigBambiGodEater_: Yeah, that was my first suggestion
19:00:31BigBambiBut I couldn't remember the keys for that either, hence my suggestion to read the manual :)
19:00:53 Join Lynx [0] (
19:00:54GodEater_being an ipod owner, I remember that one quite easily ;)
19:01:13BigBambii bet
19:01:18 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
19:01:27 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
19:01:31conandopoor amiconn
19:02:10BigBambiTyroazard: You are using the wrong ipod video build
19:02:21BigBambiYou are using one for 60/80 Gb
19:02:30BigBambiNot 30 Gb
19:02:45TyroazardI thought it was 60GB by itself
19:02:48TyroazardAnd then 30/80
19:02:55TyroazardWith the 60 discontinued.
19:03:04BigBambiIf you check the current build page, it is quite clear
19:03:24GodEater_the 30GB only has 32MB of memory - that's the difference Tyroazard
19:03:26TyroazardWell I suppose that explains it.
19:03:27BigBambiThe place you downloaded the build for during the manual install
19:03:35GodEater_you're trying to use more memory in your ipod than is available
19:03:40GodEater_which is why it keeps crashing ;)
19:03:43amiconnjhMikeS: I first thought I could ditch buffered mode... but that won't work for certain applications
19:03:46 Join Mathiasdm2 [0] (
19:03:46 Quit Mathiasdm2 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:03:54TyroazardI'mma going to reinstall with correct build then
19:03:58 Join JdGordon|w [0] (n=836b0048@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
19:04:00TyroazardMy mom's going to kill me ._.
19:04:03GodEater_it should work fine after that
19:04:07Tyroazard2AM here
19:04:13TyroazardAnd I promised to go to sleep at 11PM
19:04:19GodEater_Nico_P: you still here ?
19:04:23BigBambiTyroazard: You haven't damaged anything
19:04:24amiconnIn some applications, a frame needs several drawing operations before it should be shown
19:04:29BigBambiTyroazard: Oh, I see :)
19:04:33TyroazardDo I need to reinstall bootloader?
19:04:39amiconnIf it is shown 'live', there would be flicker
19:04:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:04:45GodEater_Nico_P: do you have any thoughts on the choopy sound on the 80GB ipod when it's buffering ?
19:04:47BigBambiTyroazard: No
19:04:54amiconnAn example is cube.rock (on mono targets)
19:05:20amiconnBut for applications like mpegplayer, text output in unbuffered mode should be ok
19:05:35Nico_PGodEater_: I don't remember which task it was on, but someone reported the problem started with some ATA changes for the ipods
19:05:49GodEater_wonder who did those then
19:05:53CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
19:05:53*GodEater_ peers at amiconn
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19:06:10TyroazardI suppose I should get to sleep then
19:06:10Nico_Pthey probably highlight possible improvements in the buffering code though
19:06:18TyroazardBefore my mom kills me in my sleep ._.
19:06:34GodEater_if you don't go to sleep - she can't kill you in your sleep
19:06:37GodEater_cos you're awake :)
19:06:37TyroazardOh wait, she can't kill me in my sleep if I'm not sleeping
19:06:51GodEater_thanks Nico
19:07:53TyroazardDamn it. My perfect grammar is gone.
19:07:58GodEater_Nico_P: btw - I had another question earlier today which you're the man to answer :)
19:07:59TyroazardThose idiots at #drlchat.
19:08:07Tyroazard(Not on this server, mind you)
19:08:09BigBambiTyroazard: This is an on-topic logged channel
19:08:13amiconnMeh. That WVS commit will cause a conflict with my current greyscale work (plugin api) :(
19:08:17GodEater_Nico_P: why are albumart.[ch] in apps/recorder ?
19:08:19 Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend")
19:08:24Nico_Pamiconn: any thoughts on the possibility that r15444 could have made sluggishness appear in the buffering?
19:08:39TyroazardAlright then, I'll just finish off the install and test for issues
19:08:44TyroazardThanks #rockbox
19:08:51BigBambino probs
19:08:54Nico_PGodEater_: because the things in there are meant for targets with bitmap screens or recording capabilities
19:09:19GodEater_I'd never have guessed that
19:09:27GodEater_thanks for enlightening me :)
19:09:46Nico_Pthese folders really need to be renamed
19:11:09TyroazardOh hey, turning off works
19:11:38TyroazardAnd playback works
19:11:50TyroazardEverything's working normally, I guess that solves it
19:11:50 Quit lee-qid (Success)
19:11:55TyroazardHappy new year
19:12:33GodEater_ah 15444 was indeed amiconn's work :)
19:12:46TyroazardOh yes, Can I watch movies?
19:12:52TyroazardIf so, which formats?
19:12:53 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
19:12:55GodEater_Tyroazard: read the manual :)
19:12:56TyroazardAnd where do I put them?
19:12:59GodEater_really - we mean it now
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19:13:21 Quit jnakiaihm (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:13:40BigBambiTyroazard: There is no point in spending time writing a manual to just type it out again for everyone who can't be bothered to read the manual.
19:13:50GodEater_amiconn: did you see Nico's question re: 15444 and FS8260 ?
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19:14:04BigBambiTyroazard: If you have questions the manual doesn't answer, please feel free to ask them
19:14:43 Join lee-qid [0] (
19:14:50TyroazardWell, I'm looking at the manual's section for file formats and video doesn't seem to be covered.
19:14:54 Quit Mathiasdm (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:15:21BigBambiTyroazard: Check out MPEG Player in the plugins
19:15:29BigBambiAlso the PluginMpegplayer in the wiki
19:15:54LambdaCalculus37Hey everyone!
19:16:14rasherjhMikeS: nice, although the keys should be flipped on targets that flip the video
19:16:28conandojhMikeS: great work!!!
19:16:33TyroazardOkay, that covered, where do I put the mpegs?
19:16:43TyroazardJust in the drive?
19:16:49LambdaCalculus37Tyroazard: Anywhere you want. Make a folder for them.
19:16:55conandolooks and works great (on my sansa)
19:16:59TyroazardOkay, thanks
19:17:03 Quit Lynx_ (Connection timed out)
19:17:03TyroazardI guess that's it
19:17:04 Nick Lynx is now known as Lynx_ (
19:17:52conandorasher: that's what i thought too... the keys should always be flipped when the video is flipped too
19:18:30TyroazardThank you again, Happy new year, Merry Christmas
19:19:02LambdaCalculus37Tyroazard: A little late for Christmas... unless you celebrate Three Kings Day. :)
19:19:18TyroazardI don't celebrate anything altogether
19:19:51conandoi guess it's more of a geek-that-spent-the-whole-holiday-season-with-his-new-gadget christmas greeting ;)
19:20:29LambdaCalculus37rasher: FS #8366 - the Tagalog lang file appears completed.
19:20:38TyroazardI spent my Christmas with my present to myself
19:20:41LambdaCalculus37Don't know if you had a chance to look at it.
19:20:42 Join pepie34 [0] (
19:20:59TyroazardAn X360, in case you're wondering. My mom hates me for buying it
19:21:04TyroazardAnd now I really have to go
19:21:04 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
19:21:07TyroazardBye now
19:21:12 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
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19:24:20Nico_PI guess the mpegplayer change warrants a MajorChanges entry
19:27:04conandoyes :)
19:27:18 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
19:27:26 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
19:27:49*GodEater_ wonders what on earth is going on with amiconn's connection
19:27:53 Join JdGordon|wrk [0] (n=836b0048@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
19:27:56conandoamiconn what kind of conn probs you have?
19:28:51LambdaCalculus37Hopefully it'll last long enough for him to reply.
19:29:23conando..and for him to read anything ;)
19:29:32amiconnDSL disconnects-reconnects-disconnects-reconnects...
19:29:44amiconnconando: Fortunately there are the logs...
19:29:58conandoamiconn: perhaps you're in need of a new dsl modem?
19:29:59 Join thegeek [0] (
19:30:29amiconnThis router (with integrated modem) is fairly new, and very stable
19:30:33jhMikeSrasher: only e200 was giving me reservations since the keys are marked. gigabeat already does it. what other targets flip the video?
19:31:02jhMikeSconando: thanks much
19:31:31cjbheh, Gigabeats are proving hard to buy.
19:31:41 Quit JdGordon|w ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
19:31:57GodEater_worth the trouble though
19:32:01GodEater_they're a fine RB target
19:32:34 Quit bwananna ("thanks poeple")
19:32:39 Part pepie34 ("Ex-Chat")
19:33:16Nico_PJdGordon|wrk: how much work were you able to do on the mrobe500 without interrupts?
19:33:36JdGordon|wrkcant remember...
19:34:07JdGordon|wrknot much... we had a polling touch screen driver for a short time
19:34:38conandoamiconn: ah ok... i recently had to replace my (fairly new) router with integr. dsl modem because of regular disconnects after a bandwith upgrade
19:35:19amiconnGodEater, Nico_P: If the glitches started with r15444, it's a sign that the swcodec buffering doesn't properly calculate the low watermark, but uses some fixed, and slightly too low, watermark
19:35:39rasherjhMikeS: using the marked buttons on the e200 feels awful
19:35:42amiconnHdd poweroff causes a slightly higher spinup time
19:36:02Nico_Pamiconn: makes sense... GodEater_: are you able to test this?
19:37:19jhMikeSrasher: so you think they should just all be rotated regardless?
19:37:35rasherjhMikeS: If you ask me, yes
19:39:19GodEater_Nico_P: I'm still getting a build env. setup here
19:40:25DerPapstuse an official build? *cough* :-P
19:40:48GodEater_sorry - I thought the question was "can I test changing the watermark"
19:40:55GodEater_which will be tricky in an official build
19:41:01Nico_PGodEater_: that was the question
19:41:08GodEater_in that case see above ;)
19:41:26DerPapstmaybe i missunderstood. i though you should for now justs verify that it skips for you too.
19:41:34Nico_Pyeah, what kind of difficulties are you running into?
19:42:03GodEater_it skips for me :)
19:42:05Nico_PThe question actually meant "does it skip for you too and if so, could you try changing the watermark?"
19:42:07GodEater_when buffering is happening
19:42:44Nico_PGodEater_: I can build somthing for you if it's easier
19:42:53GodEater_once the disk has finished spinning it's okay again
19:43:01GodEater_I'm building now - it seems to be ok
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19:43:30LambdaCalculus37Hi jhulst!
19:43:30 Join Mathiasdm [0] (
19:44:59GodEater_Nico_P: where do I need to make the change ?
19:45:32DerPapstmmhh.. my ipod video 80GB build is from 24.12.2007 (r15971). I haven't noticed any skips while listning for music for ~5hours
19:45:51LambdaCalculus37Trying to get pics of the mainboard of the Dell DJ...
19:46:01LambdaCalculus37My camera phone keeps blurring them. >:(
19:46:21GodEater_that's why we suggest scanners
19:46:35DerPapstor decent cameras :-P
19:46:38BigBambiDerPapst: Please use as up-to-date buld before reporting a non-problem :)
19:46:50LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: My scanner at home is in its grave, and I haven't got one at work.
19:46:58Nico_PGodEater_: change the defines in buffering.c and maybae playback.c
19:47:17DerPapstBigBambi: i'm always to lazy to connect my players to update rockbox/music ^^
19:47:18LambdaCalculus37DerPapst: Nokia 5300 phone that can snap up to 1280x1024.
19:47:26Nico_PI don't remember what is their exact role but I think the ones in buffering.c will probably be a good start
19:47:36BigBambiDerPapst: :)
19:47:57GodEater_Nico_P: I'll start there then
19:48:51DerPapstLambdaCalculus37: it's not always resolution. noisy and unsharp images can be produced by any camera with a decent resolution but a crappy ccd and optics :-P
19:48:55GodEater_DEFAULT_WATERMARK ?
19:48:59GodEater_or CRITICAL ?
19:49:23LambdaCalculus37DerPapst: Yes, that's true.
19:49:33amiconnGodEater, Nico_P: I'm not sure whether it's still the case, but I never understood why swcodec use(d|s) fixed watermarks
19:49:40GodEater_it's 1024*512 at the moment
19:49:43GodEater_what do you suggest ?
19:50:13LambdaCalculus37I have a decent view of some of the markings on the board.
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19:50:18Nico_PGodEater_: try 1024*1024. and you might need to make the change in playback.c too now that I look more closely
19:50:34 Quit bertrik ("bye")
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19:50:50Nico_Pamiconn: it is still the case, and I'd love to find a better way
19:50:51amiconnThe fairly old hwcodec playback engine calculates the watermark dynamically, using bitrate, spinup time, and a safety factor
19:51:03amiconnIt does so for years...
19:51:03 Join Rincewind [0] (
19:51:12Nico_PI'll have a look when I finish supper :)
19:51:12GodEater_AUDIO_DEFAULT_WATERMARK in playback.c yes ?
19:51:17LambdaCalculus37Hey there Rincewind!
19:51:50Nico_PGodEater_: I'm off but I'll sure check the result when I come back
19:52:00GodEater_later ;)
19:52:05amiconnThe ata driver measures spinup time anyway. I case there is no measured value yet, it uses a safe value
19:52:06LambdaCalculus37No idea how to remove the LCD from the mainboard.
19:52:08*GodEater_ types "make zip"
19:52:17LambdaCalculus37Looks like it's attached with a small "plate" underneath.
19:53:28amiconnAll that said, I wonder why an ipod mini skips, while other targets don't
19:54:05amiconnThe mini's microdrive spins up blazingly fast (~500 ms) compared to other hdds (2..3 s)
19:54:28GodEater_amiconn: my 5.5G is suffering the same thing
19:54:36GodEater_I've just not chimed in on the FS ticket yet
19:56:24amiconnThen something else must be wrong
19:57:19GodEater_you don't think it's the watermark now ?
19:57:19Slasheriskipping when the song starts?
19:57:25amiconnPractically all hdd targets have hdd poweroff nowadays. I didn't observe such skipping on H1x0 (my recently most-used swcodec target) or other swcodec targets
19:57:39GodEater_Slasheri: yes
19:57:43Slasherithat's because the configurable pre-chunk option was removed
19:58:22Slasherinow playback engine tries to pre-buffer too less of data for some codecs
19:58:46*JdGordon|wrk prods Slasheri to look at the hotswap+dircache patch
19:58:52amiconnNot with mp3, and not with flac either.
19:58:58*JdGordon|wrk brb
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19:59:03GodEater_mp3 is what I'm having the issue with
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20:01:00GodEater_I'm not even sure I have any other formats to test with
20:01:33Slasheriand crossfade totally crashes the player
20:01:34 Join obo [0] (n=obo@rockbox/developer/obo)
20:01:48Slasheriit's unfortunate to see the playback engine has gone that buggy..
20:02:05LambdaCalculus37Testing Q5 Vorbis on my 5.5G... no issues.
20:02:47LambdaCalculus37Anyone want me to look at the debug info on my iPod?
20:02:55 Quit Alonea ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox]")
20:03:04*GodEater_ wonders if AA might have something to do with it too
20:03:14GodEater_although I'm sure I've had the problem in folders without any present too
20:03:23 Join JdGordon|w [0] (n=836b0048@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
20:03:32LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: I'm using Cabbie 2.0 with AA, and the music is Q5 Vorbis.
20:04:26GodEater_still getting it, even with those changes Nico just suggested
20:04:40LambdaCalculus37Rockbox Info: Buffer reads 27.504MB
20:04:51*amiconn isn't aware of any major playback bugs
20:05:31LambdaCalculus37Although I'm getting boosts at roughly 1.5 sec intervals.
20:05:53 Quit JdGordon|w (Client Quit)
20:06:00GodEater_buffer is 61ish MB here
20:06:09amiconnOf course I use neither aa nor crossfade (or any other audio fade), nor eq, nor replaygain or other stuff of that kind
20:06:19GodEater_so I'm guessing your 5.5G is a 30GB right LambdaCalculus37?
20:06:27LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: That's right.
20:06:28GodEater_I don't use X-fade either
20:06:29Slasheriamiconn: sometimes songs also cut-out too early
20:06:32GodEater_or any of those other things
20:06:33LambdaCalculus37Me neither.
20:06:38GodEater_only AA at the moment
20:06:49GodEater_and I only installed that to look at picture flow =/
20:06:50LambdaCalculus37I have AA, no EQ, and no replaygain or anything.
20:07:07LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: Me too. I wanted to see it in action.
20:07:23GodEater_I think I have crossfeed on though
20:07:27*GodEater_ goes to checkl
20:07:34amiconnJust plain playback with treble/bass (which is hw on my preferred targets), and a wps without any bitmaps (but with peakmeters)
20:08:11GodEater_yes - crossfeed here
20:08:18GodEater_and the same wps as LambdaCalculus37
20:08:18LambdaCalculus37I have Crossfeed on, and adjusted the treble/bass myself.
20:08:54amiconnOh, no crossfeed either, but I do use variable stereo width when using earphones
20:09:48GodEater_interesting. Now I've picked a new folder to play, it's been completely buffered - but I've got no sound, and no progress bar movement
20:10:58LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: Did you stop playback first and then select the new one, or just jump straight to it?
20:11:01GodEater_yep - doesn't matter what I do now - I'm not getting any playback at all
20:11:05GodEater_stopped first
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20:11:46LambdaCalculus37Strange... I usually get that behavior if I load a new file while another one is playing.
20:12:00GodEater_where's your FS ticket ? :)
20:12:14LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: Didn't make one yet. :)
20:12:29GodEater_right. I've reset. Playback started with no glitches this time.
20:12:39LambdaCalculus37The only ticket I'm concentrating on right now is FS #8366.
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20:13:13GodEater_switched to another folder (this time without stopping) and started a new track
20:13:20GodEater_playback has glitched three times so far
20:13:30LambdaCalculus37GodEater_: What did it do?
20:13:32GodEater_and now the disc has stopped spinning it's fine
20:13:42 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
20:13:50 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
20:13:53GodEater_it cuts out for about half a second
20:14:02LambdaCalculus37I get that too sometimes.
20:14:05GodEater_and does that for about 5 or 6 seconds total
20:14:13LambdaCalculus37It's hard to predict the behavior of that on my end.
20:14:14GodEater_then it settles down
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20:14:53GodEater_same behaviour again on switching to yet another folder
20:15:02LambdaCalculus37FLAC files are very, very well behaved on my iPod.
20:15:04GodEater_although only one glitch this time
20:15:09LambdaCalculus37Hang on a second...
20:15:18LambdaCalculus37Let me get out my 4G iPod...
20:15:32LambdaCalculus37I want to see if it does this on that model as well.
20:15:49GodEater_switched again, and no glitch at all this time
20:16:48 Quit japc (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:16:59 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
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20:17:28GodEater_hmm - can't get it to do it again now
20:17:33GodEater_Nonpoint sound fine :)
20:17:45LambdaCalculus37Okay... switched to 4G iPod color.
20:17:50GodEater_you've got water on your copper amiconn
20:17:56LambdaCalculus37Playing a Q8 FLAC.
20:18:10LambdaCalculus37Buffer: 28.172MB
20:18:32LambdaCalculus37CPU boost every 1.5 seconds.
20:18:54LambdaCalculus37Boost ratio seems to be averaging 30%
20:18:55GodEater_I'd forgotten how much I like this tune :)
20:19:46*GodEater_ powers off and on again
20:19:54LambdaCalculus37Switched to a Q5 Vorbis and no glitch.
20:20:15LambdaCalculus37My 4G iPod's also using Cabbie 2.0 and AA.
20:20:56GodEater_git it again once on another folder change
20:21:36LambdaCalculus37Wow GodEater_, your iPod's being mean to you. :P
20:21:54GodEater_Slasheri: is dircache updated on every boot ?
20:22:23SlasheriGodEater_: yep, except flashed iriver H120/140
20:22:46GodEater_well I was about to suggest it might have been the update fighting with the buffering
20:22:56GodEater_but apparently dircache isn't even on on my ipod!
20:23:08*GodEater_ can't remember when/why he turned it off though
20:23:12Slasheriit shouldn't because scheduler puts it on lower priority
20:23:28amiconnDoes it glitch at the beginning of buerring, or anytime while rebuffering?
20:23:48GodEater_just at the beginning for me
20:24:14amiconnIs your ipod's hdd fragmented?
20:24:15Slasherithat started to happen when the chunksize configuration was removed..
20:24:21GodEater_most of my music folders *almost* fit entirely into the buffer
20:24:21Slasherii experience that too quite often
20:24:28 Quit Rincewind ("bye")
20:24:32GodEater_so it doesn't rebuffer much once you've started playing a folder back
20:24:46GodEater_I doubt it's fragmented at all - though I've not checked
20:24:51GodEater_I don't delete stuff off it much
20:24:54*amiconn has virtually no folder that would fit at once into the buffer
20:24:54GodEater_if at all
20:25:06Slasherithe chunksize was configured right for that reason in the history, so i don't wonder at all
20:25:09amiconnNot even on a 64MB target
20:25:34GodEater_you and your big music files :)
20:25:56*GodEater_ turns dircache back on to see if makes any difference
20:26:25GodEater_Properties of Rammstein/Mutter : size 61MB
20:26:56 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
20:27:05 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
20:27:05GodEater_poor amiconn :(
20:27:30amiconnFor flac, even a single track often doesn't fit completely into the buffer
20:28:00*amiconn has several flac files which are >100MB
20:28:13*GodEater_ goes to eat dinner
20:28:22LloreanjhMikeS: Seeking doesn't work for me. Or rather, pause, then seek, then unpause, and I get exactly one new frame, then it sits there. Not frozen, but not rendering any more video, just playing audio. I can seek again, and again get one new frame.
20:28:23 Join Arathis [0] (
20:29:03BigBambiLlorean: Which target? It worked brilliantly on gigabeat for me
20:29:11LloreanBigBambi: Did you try Pause, Seek, Unpause?
20:29:20BigBambiLlorean: No, will do now
20:29:29LambdaCalculus37amiconn: Listening to a Q8 FLAC file that's 28MB in size.
20:29:39LloreanBigBambi: But true, it's working now
20:29:50LloreanjhMikeS: Not 100% reproduceable it seems. =/
20:30:13BigBambiLlorean: pause, seek, unpause was fine too
20:30:33BigBambiBut I have hardly used it - I'll see if I can break it :)
20:30:34jhMikeSLlorean: hmmm...I've done pause seek unpause and it does work. I have had that as a glitch and plan on auditing things after commit anyway.
20:30:35LloreanBigBambi: Yeah, it's fine for me now, after stopping and quitting mpegplayer and coming back. So now I need to figure out how to actually start the situation.
20:31:51amiconnLambdaCalculus37: All my flacs are -q8. But for my favourite music, flac doesn't compress very well. Many files are >1000kbps, i.e. 70% of uncompressed size, or more
20:31:55jhMikeSactually, there's a couple glitches I've only seen on gigabeat and no other. you might have the frame jump down and then up again while playing.
20:32:20LloreanIs this new?
20:32:27*Llorean hasn't seen something like that yet.
20:32:32LambdaCalculus37MPEG Pause, Seek, Unpause works fine on my iPod video.
20:32:32*BigBambi neither
20:32:38LambdaCalculus37Testing it now.
20:32:54LloreanNow we just need to be rid of that start menu, and move its contents into the main menu.
20:32:54LambdaCalculus37Does take a moment to unpause, though.
20:33:03BigBambiLlorean: I agree totally
20:33:15LloreanLambdaCalculus37: I believe that'll depend on how long the seek takes.
20:33:16BigBambiI turned off start menu and was disappointed to still get a resume menu
20:33:20 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
20:33:23jhMikeSit's when the WVS disappears but no other player ever did it nor does it really make sense. it's all on the "to look into" list.
20:34:03 Quit Buschel ()
20:34:27LambdaCalculus37Llorean: Trying another run... Pause, seek ahead 31 seconds, unpause.
20:34:51LambdaCalculus37It jumped to the right location before I unpaused. :)
20:35:08LambdaCalculus37Using Elephants Dream to test, by the way.
20:35:10LloreanYeah, I can't get it to do it any more, already. :(
20:35:25LambdaCalculus37Llorean: Which target?
20:35:38BigBambiI haven't managed to make it do it
20:35:47LambdaCalculus37Any of your other devices work well with this?
20:35:55LloreanI'm away from all my other devices.
20:36:13BigBambiAnd mine is a H140 :)
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20:36:24 Quit moos (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:36:51LloreanjhMikeS: Ah well, if I figure out a way to consistently reproduce this, I'll let you know.
20:36:51LambdaCalculus37Llorean: I'll try it on my 4G iPod color.
20:37:01jhMikeSLlorean: I have to run out for a bit but see if you can get a recipe for anything or make discover anything else. It's a tricky deal with when/when not to resync video which you want to avoid if possible.
20:38:24jhMikeSI'll probably have the video thread keep up-to-date records of the last frame decoded. I'm pretty sure that's a factor.
20:38:49Nico_PSlasheri: could you ellaborate on how you think the chunksize is causing the sluggishness?
20:39:14LloreanjhMikeS: Well the interesting thing is that when it was glitching, it'd decode the first frame after the seek, and nothing else (from the look of it)
20:40:00SlasheriNico_P: well, not actually the chunksize itself but there isn't a minimum length of data to be loaded in buffer before starting decoding?
20:40:34Slasheriok, then that is the issue most likely
20:40:49Slasheripreviously chunksize also guaranteed the minimum buffer size
20:41:18Nico_Pand the chunksize was configurable?
20:41:25Slasherifrom codecs, yes
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20:42:11 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
20:42:14GodEater_linuxstb: are you here ?
20:42:19 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
20:42:24Nico_PIt's probably possible to get something similar working based on bitrate
20:42:26LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: Congrats on the hard work... the new WVS is great!
20:42:38Nico_Psimilar to what amiconn was suggesting for the watermark
20:42:55jhMikeSLamdaCalculus37: thanks
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20:43:32linuxstbGodEater_: Yep
20:43:47GodEater_v5 doesn't build for me
20:44:08Slasheriyes, that would be necessary. at start buffer contains too little of data, and all cpu is given to the codec -> buffer runs empty
20:44:39linuxstbGodEater_: I know, you didn't reply to my reply...
20:44:50jhMikeSLlorean: it's not keeping keeping timestamp records (in PTS units) of the last frame so the answer to the query about whether sync is needed may be wrong.
20:44:55GodEater_ah - I must have missed it
20:44:59Nico_PSlasheri: are you familiar with the recent playback code changes?
20:45:05GodEater_what did you ask ?
20:45:23linuxstbWhether it complained about getback/foreground ?
20:45:31GodEater_yes - both :)
20:45:34SlasheriNico_P: well, not very familiar. i just know some of the principles but never looked the code very closely
20:45:38GodEater_in gwps-common.c
20:45:49LambdaCalculus37jhMikeS: Pause, seek, unpause works very well on my 4G iPod color.
20:45:53linuxstbGodEater_Then just add an underscore after get - it should have been get_foreground/get_background.
20:46:22Slasherii have thought about re-writing the pcmbuf part of the code if i have some time
20:46:25linuxstbI'm going to upload a new patch soon, I'm just finishing/debugging the charcell version.
20:46:57GodEater_perfect - thats building now
20:48:35Nico_PJdGordon|w: ping
20:49:53*jhMikeS wants to do preemptive threads for any audio rework so low latency mixing is possible. another use of them is for graylib or other normally interrupt-driven realtime tasks that might also be time-consuming so that other things don't get blocked out for long periods.
20:50:56JdGordon|wNico_P: hey
20:51:23SlasherijhMikeS: hmm, maybe that could work if strictly restricted for a very few threads
20:51:29Nico_Phi! got a small question for you
20:51:46Nico_PJdGordon|w: how much work were you able to do on the mrobe500 without interrupts?
20:51:47Slasherii have thought about integrated mixing for the pcmbuf too
20:52:21*amiconn runs away screaming
20:52:57JdGordon|wNico_P: you missed my answer before :) i cant remember... but not much..we had the lcd and a polling touchpad driver. no ata
20:53:24Nico_Poh I'm sorry
20:53:45JdGordon|w:) its cool
20:55:10Nico_Pthen I guess we won't get very far on the S without getting them to work :(
20:55:54GodEater_so stop giving jhMikeS other things to do, and get him to make them work ;)
20:56:25jhMikeSSlasheri: It would be exacly like COP threads and such threads with proper code could run on any processor.
20:56:43SlasherijhMikeS: indeed
20:57:06JdGordon|wNico_P: get some dissasembly and some hot coffeee going then :D
20:57:20Nico_Phehe :)
20:57:21jhMikeSI suppose cooperative thread would just run as a single thread with "contexts"
20:57:26Nico_Pnot enough time unfortunately
20:58:13DerPapstWhile Viewing Screen :-P
20:58:20LambdaCalculus37JdGordon|w: For Mpegplayer.
20:58:23LloreanJdGordon|w: The letters O and D must've been broken on his keyboard.
20:58:24jhMikeS1) While Video Screen 2) While Viewing Screen <= pick one :)
20:58:29LloreanjhMikeS: OSD. :-P
20:58:54*jhMikeS just went for the compement to WPS
20:58:58JdGordon|wyeah, rename the wvs and wps to osd
20:59:05amiconnOff Screen Display? On Screen Display??
20:59:13LloreanOn Screen Display
20:59:24LloreanSeems to be the common term for "Doodads that get in the way of my video" :)
20:59:27amiconnReally, I can't imagine how something could be displayed off screen ;P
20:59:40*jhMikeS already thought about having a full-time one on remotes
20:59:44JdGordon|woff the main screen it could
21:00:06LambdaCalculus37jhMikes: That would be brilliant for the LCD remote targets. :)
21:00:07amiconnBut it isn't called OMSD ;)
21:00:12GodEater_linuxstb: foreground is fixed
21:00:16pixelmawatch a second movie on the remote? :P
21:00:23linuxstbWhile Versatile Screen?
21:00:35 Quit stewsleep ()
21:00:44JdGordon|wWhich Viewing Surface?
21:00:48LambdaCalculus37On MPEG Screen Display? ;)
21:00:58amiconnOff Main Screen Display
21:01:01linuxstbGodEater_: Does that mean background isn't, or have you not tested that?
21:02:01 Quit Alonea ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox]")
21:02:15GodEater_linuxstb: I've not tested it - I have no WPSs without a backdrop
21:02:37*jhMikeS has to go grocery shopping now (girlfriend says so :)
21:02:38*LambdaCalculus37 will be back in a moment
21:03:44DerPapstjhMikeS: have fun ;-)
21:04:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:05:48JdGordon|wmarkun: hey, you had a look at my patch?
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21:09:18 Nick kugel_ is now known as kugel (
21:14:33*GodEater_ reads the FontSystemProposal page with interest
21:15:03 Join Jay_G [0] (
21:18:58linuxstb12,000 lines of code is "small" ? ;)
21:19:02LloreanGodEater_: Yes?
21:19:03JdGordon|wGodEater: going by the date of that article i wouldnt put much faith in it...
21:19:15GodEater_do you have an opinion on the telechips links in the forums currently ?
21:19:17JdGordon|wlinuxstb: half the size of playback.c!
21:19:39linuxstb"wc -l font.c" -> 569
21:19:43GodEater_JdGordon|w I don't put any faith in it at all - I just found it an interesting read. I don't remember seeing it discussed here at the time it was written
21:20:20JdGordon|wthats the first ive seen of it also
21:20:34JdGordon|wuse of malloc doesnt sound very promising either
21:20:47LloreanGodEater_: I don't think I should do anything about it unless someone higher up tells me to.
21:20:56GodEater_it's a shame the writer didn't rock up here and chat about it
21:21:08JdGordon|wchecked the logs from then?
21:21:11GodEater_Llorean: that was my opinion too. You were my higher up :)
21:21:13*jott reminds he started some work on anti-aliased font integration
21:23:51Nico_Pjott: did you announce it here?
21:24:11JdGordon|wGodEater: "Ability to use BDF fonts directly, no more obscure homebrew font format" thats not an advantage.... the homebrew format is binary (iirc), so faster to load, bdf is text
21:24:44GodEater_I liked his "gigabytes of memory and 16 core cpu DAPS" of the future :)
21:25:19*JdGordon|w bbs
21:25:40jottthe current font format could be improved by introducing bearing and advance values i suppose.
21:26:23*Nico_P is off
21:28:02amiconnjott: Forget antialiased fonts, or any other stuff that needs alpha transparency. It will be way too slow on anything except the gigabeats, let alone the increased ram usage and font sizes
21:28:39amiconnjhMikeS: Interestingly enough, I didn't get conflicts in plugin.[ch]
21:28:39jottamiconn: it's not really slower
21:29:22 Quit waldo (Remote closed the connection)
21:30:03jottamiconn: the ram usage is increased by less than 2-4 times of the current one - so basically all regular fonts will fit perfectly in MAX_FONT_SIZE on color targets
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21:30:55amiconnI simply cannot believe it's not slower
21:31:44jottamiconn: given i need 1 multiplication (as in 2 clock cycles) for about 10-20% of the pixels?!
21:32:10amiconnOne multiplication needs more than that
21:32:19pixelmaI still doubt that antialiased fonts look better in an average Rockbox font size - if I look at what full blown graphic programs produce at small font sizes...
21:32:32 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:32:33pixelma^on PC
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21:32:49jottpixelma: it's personal taste. because YOU don't like it does not mean do not look better to someone else.
21:33:02amiconnAnd you don't just need one multiplication, as you need to read the old pixel value first
21:33:36amiconn...decompose it into colour components, apply transparency to each component, recombine, and rewrite
21:34:14jottamiconn: done efficiently this is not critical..
21:34:35amiconnWriting all-alpha pixels is way slower than writing simple pixels, roughly by a factor of 10 (at least)
21:34:57 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
21:35:15pixelmajott: maybe but is it worth the complication?
21:35:20jottamiconn: well on the ipod my raw render core ist faster than the 1-bit code in rockbox..
21:35:59amiconnThe 1-bit code in rockbox for 16 bit lcd isn't optimal, as it has some more than questionable optimisation
21:37:18amiconnAnd check the size of unifont before commenting on ram usage...
21:37:50jottamiconn: i know. this font is loaded into font cache anyway and not into ram.
21:38:37amiconnThe font cache is in ram of course... and for anti-aliased fonts, it would need to become larger
21:38:54jottamiconn: depending on how many glyphs need to be cached. indeed.
21:39:12jottbut there is no need to increase the value for regular usage i would propose.
21:39:45amiconnI doubt that
21:40:22amiconnBtw, a multiplication on arm needs up to 5 cycles (depending on operands)
21:41:21jotti still can't see what the problem of integrating this would be.
21:42:38jottgiven 1) it's not really slower 2) it's not mandatory to use aa fonts 3) there are very few changes needed
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21:43:00 Join webguest61 [0] (n=561be028@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
21:43:11amiconnI can't believe it's not slower until the opposite is proven. On all affected targets.
21:43:23webguest61hello and good evening.
21:43:23amiconnGraphics slowdown, more ram usage, hence less ram for playback -> less battery runtime. And bloated distribution archives
21:43:42webguest61is there anyone perhaps here who could help a rookie with a Sandisk E280?
21:43:49linuxstbjott: What format do you store the fonts in?
21:43:51 Join IntoTheVo [0] (
21:43:55jottamiconn: no. there is no more ram usage. the ram usage for font is fixed.
21:44:01 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
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21:44:21pixelmawebguest61: just ask...
21:44:28jottlinuxstb: basically rockbox fnt
21:44:51linuxstbjott: Have you tested with a non-ascii font (and strings)?
21:44:55webguest61pixelma thanks. I have installed rockbox from my mac, and it seem to run ok. however, on connecting it to the mac, it would not mount
21:45:14 Nick IntoTheVo is now known as N2TheVoid (
21:45:28webguest61So I restarted the sandisk while holding the left button, to restart it with the original softwar
21:45:29linuxstbwebguest61: You need to start the Sansa firmware for it to connect - Rockbox doesn't have USB support.
21:45:32webguest61then it did mount
21:45:47webguest61well, I then uninstalled the rockbox
21:45:55webguest61and now it won't mount at all!
21:45:58N2TheVoidIs there any firmware available for the Creative Zen Vision M ?
21:46:08jottlinuxstb: yes. but not to a full extend yet (as in "full unicode test-case")
21:46:25linuxstbjott: What target have you been testing on?
21:46:26webguest61is it possible that there are some remnant files from rockbox left?
21:46:38jottlinuxstb: ipod and sansa for now..
21:46:47linuxstbWhich ipod? HD or flash?
21:46:49webguest61when ever I disconnect it from the mac, it performs a system restart
21:46:49jottlinuxstb: still lcd16bit code only
21:46:56jottlinuxstb: hd
21:49:22 Quit webguest61 ("CGI:IRC")
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21:49:33LambdaCalculus37N2TheVoid: No.
21:49:39 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:50:32webguest61Sorry if I lost an answer with my sandisk problem here, my internet connection has reset itself (seem to have reset problems today...)
21:51:41LambdaCalculus37Time to start going home. See everyone later!
21:51:53N2TheVoidLambdaCalculus37: Thanks
21:52:03 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC")
21:52:20N2TheVoidAnyone if there is any other firmwares available for it. I am primarily looking for flac support
21:53:02krazykitN2TheVoid, there are none
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21:55:34N2TheVoidthat sucks
21:55:58N2TheVoidThanks for the info peeps
21:56:03N2TheVoidand happy new year
21:56:14 Quit N2TheVoid ()
21:59:52 Part webguest61
22:02:18 Quit GodEater_ ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby")
22:03:02*stripwax reads about Godeater's buffering-on-startup-skipping problem, that he also experiences
22:03:44 Join GodEater_ [50] (n=bryan@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
22:04:42 Quit stripwax (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:05:10 Join |NSA| [0] (
22:05:15|NSA|what does WVS stand for/
22:05:25 Join stinke [0] (
22:05:37GodEater_While Viewing Screen
22:06:37|NSA|do you know if the ff/rwd thing that was just commited is useable or should i wait a while?
22:06:58scorche|wtry it and see...
22:07:35GodEater_why do people ask those questions ?
22:07:41GodEater_how hard is it to try it out and see ?
22:07:48GodEater_and what have you lost if it isn't to your liking anyway ?
22:07:59BigBambiAnd it is very useable
22:08:07DerPapstmaybe the dap will explode? no one knows... :-P
22:08:25GodEater_well that's why we have a disclaimer :)
22:08:37GodEater_it may murder your granny and set fire to your dog too
22:08:59DerPapst"Caution: MPEGPlayer might make your dap go BOOM"
22:10:56 Join linuxstb [0] (
22:13:21linuxstbjott: Do you have patch for your font rendering? is now 404
22:13:54conandobtw. .. i upgraded from (some) yesterdays build to the current one and the picture flow plugin now starts it's "AA show" with an album named "<untagged>" although i have no untagged music files in the database...
22:13:57 Join Alonea [0] (n=chatzill@
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22:14:12jottlinuxstb: yes, it's nearly finished. and there are a few places that need some consideration.
22:14:52linuxstbjott: Am I right in remembering it needs some Qt GUI application to generate the font files?
22:15:15jottlinuxstb: no i ported it to raw c/freetype
22:16:42linuxstbDo you have any benchmarks showing exactly how speed compares to the current mono rendering?
22:16:49jottand i guess i need some additional optimization as the core part is slower than the raw renderer.
22:17:40 Quit Febs (Success)
22:17:42|NSA|pl we;; if anyone else asks, the new ff/rwd in mpegplayer is pretty nice and works great
22:18:10conandoyes, mpegplayer finally matured :)
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22:23:34darkslategreyi have a question
22:23:41stripwaxjust ask it
22:24:23darkslategreyumm i downloaded the .zip for the 1g nano but when i try to unzip with winZip it says "no files to unzip"
22:24:31linuxstbjhMikeS: Do you have any more plans for mpegplayer?
22:24:39darkslategreyand when i try w/ 7-zip it says "cannot access as an archive"
22:25:04stripwaxdarkslategrey - it sounds like you have downloaded a corrupted archive. which download link did you use?
22:25:08bertrikI guess the zip file somehow got corrupted during download
22:25:44GodEater_linuxstb: don't encourage him - he has interrupts on the gigabeast to make work :)
22:25:56darkslategreyit's the one when you go to current build. i've downloaded it three times, the same exact error messages appear
22:26:05darkslategreyi can try to get it somewhere else i guess...
22:26:39GodEater_darkslategrey: I just downloaded it to test - it's fine here
22:26:48GodEater_darkslategrey: clear your browser cache, and try again
22:26:59conandodarkslategrey: how big is the file you downloaded (on your harddisk, in bytes)?
22:27:12stripwaxsame for me, works fine here..
22:27:30darkslategreyhang on i sent it to recycle bin
22:28:02darkslategreylolz, sorry i'm dumb i had an unzipped copy in the recycle bin for some reason
22:28:04darkslategreythx everyone
22:29:35darkslategreyi think what happened was i downloaded it a while ago and decided to install it later, then forgot about it and deleted it off my desktop with a bunch of other junk by accident
22:30:29GodEater_how long is "a while ago" ?
22:30:30stripwaxyou might want to try downloading a more recent version anyway - how old was a 'while ago'?
22:30:48darkslategreycouple of weeks
22:31:02GodEater_yeah, I'd get today's again if I were you
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22:31:25darkslategreyok, downloaded it and it's unzipping as i type
22:33:34darkslategreywhen downloading the rockbox utility i get version 1.0.2 right?
22:34:34 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox 3.0b3pre/2007123005]")
22:37:37GodEater_why are you downloading both the zip AND the utility ?
22:37:38 Join stripwax_ [0] (
22:37:57GodEater_rockbox utility handles doing the download for you automatically
22:38:56darkslategreywell the utility didn't work anyway, keeps giving me a vareity of http errors
22:39:02darkslategreyso i'm trying a manual install
22:39:40stripwax_what did the http errors say? perhaps, it's related to the corrupted download you got when trying manually
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22:43:14darkslategreyi don't remember and the manual install worked
22:43:57darkslategreyoddly i downloaded the fonts pack w/ the utility and it worked
22:48:24rasherlinuxstb: firmware/export/lcd.h:32:20: error: #if with no expression
22:48:47 Join fliegenderfrosch [0] (
22:49:13linuxstbrasher; Oops, I thought I had included that fix in the patch, but I didn't... v6.1 coming to flyspray in a few moments.
22:49:36fliegenderfroschdoes anyone know if it's possible to upgrade the harddisk of an iaudio x5 20gb to say 60gb?
22:50:19 Part Lynn_
22:51:12linuxstbrasher: New version uploaded. Or you can just fix firmware/export/lcd.h manually - change "#if HAVE_LCD_BITMAP" to #ifdef
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22:52:47 Quit petur ("here today, gone tomorrow")
22:53:29fliegenderfroschGodEater_, thanks, i'll have a look at it
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22:55:39fliegenderfroschso am I right that I just need to look for a 1.8" 50pin drive not thicker than 5mm?
22:55:59fliegenderfroschor does this mean there are only 30gb drives available?
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22:56:15 Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:56:38stripwax_fliegenderfrosch - well, there's 40gb on that page ..
22:57:08stripwax_e.g. gigabeat f41 has one.
22:57:37fliegenderfroschsorry, I didn't really see the lower part of this page
22:57:57stripwax_but it might be that nobody has tried >30gb on iaudio x5, however −− but it "ought to work" .
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23:14:45JohnnyMnemonicwhat is the license of the rockbox themes?
23:15:21JohnnyMnemonici'm planning a Java ME mediaplayer thingy... and the themes for the Gigabeats are 240x320... perfoectooooo
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23:15:27BigBambiJohnnyMnemonic: The included ones, or other places?
23:15:33JohnnyMnemonichmm... i prematurely pressed enter...
23:15:47JohnnyMnemonicthe ones on the WpsGallery
23:16:06BigBambiUnless explicitly licenced, you need to contact the author and find out
23:16:16JohnnyMnemonicit looks like a simple format to implement
23:16:20BigBambiAnd get them to release in a suitable licence
23:16:46JohnnyMnemonicwhat about the format... is rockbox gpl?
23:17:07BigBambiRockbox is, but the themes on the wiki are not necisserrily
23:17:18*BigBambi apologises for that spelling
23:17:30BigBambiIt was terrible
23:17:39JohnnyMnemonicno.. but if i implement rockbox's skinning-implementation... do i need to gpl my app?
23:17:55JohnnyMnemonici'm not well versed in software licensing ;)
23:18:28BigBambiNot sure
23:18:33BigBambiMe neither :)
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23:19:18JohnnyMnemonicwell.. its in the planning stages yet anyway... i just thought the Wps format looked very easy to implement...
23:20:47 Quit zicho ("Leaving")
23:20:47stripwax_JohnnyMnemonic - if you're going to use the rockbox wps code as a basis for your skinning implementation, then your app would need to be gpl'd. If you're just going to use 'the same format' of skinning then gpl would be optional. several of the themes are released under creative commons licenses
23:21:03 Join zicho [0] (
23:21:07linuxstbJohnnyMnemonic: WPSs are just data, so they can be under any license you wish. If you write code that links with Rockbox, your code must be GPL (or something compatible with it).
23:22:18JohnnyMnemonicok... i won't be basing anything on the rockbox code. the code would be pure Java ME. but it will probably be rockbox-ish :) that's what i'm aiming for atleast :)
23:23:02 Quit darkslategrey ("ChatZilla 0.9.79 [Firefox]")
23:23:27linuxstbJohnnyMnemonic: I'm not sure what you mean... What are you planning to do?
23:23:32BigBambiSo, for my own curiosity - you could write your own code under any licence to interpret the same WPS tags, as long as you don't use the rockbox parsing code (in which case it would have to be GPL)?
23:24:16JohnnyMnemonicmake a better mediaplayer for cellphones... most new cellphones allow access to the Java ME multimedia api. which gives access to the mp3 decoder hardware, making it possible to make media-applications...
23:24:31JohnnyMnemonicBigBambi: i think you got it...
23:24:39BigBambiJohnnyMnemonic: Have you seen the rockbox motorola port?
23:24:46BigBambiI say port
23:24:49BigBambiHack :)
23:25:55BigBambiOne mo
23:26:57JohnnyMnemonicfound it ;)
23:27:25JohnnyMnemonicvery interresting, but running C code on a closed source cellphone would not be very easy
23:27:42JohnnyMnemonican most cellphones only allow Java ME applications
23:27:45BigBambiWell that is a port of the sim, which uses sdl
23:27:55JohnnyMnemonicthe exceptions are smartphones...
23:27:59BigBambiJohnnyMnemonic: Well, good luck
23:28:03linuxstbJohnnyMnemonic: I think your life would be easier if you GPL'd your app - then you could just do a trivial conversion of the Rockbox wps routines to Java. Unless you want to try and make money from your project...
23:29:12JohnnyMnemoniclinuxstb: i'm probably going to opensource it with gpl anyway. maybe just not at once. there may be possible to get some money on it, seeing as most cellphone media-player capabilities are barely usable, at best. ;)
23:30:08stripwax_[off topic but, ar
23:30:34JohnnyMnemonici guess as long as the Wps format is not patented in anyway i will be on the safe side legally at least...
23:30:42stripwax_[off topic but:] are there really no existing skinnable j2me media player apps out there already? not that choice is bad
23:30:55JohnnyMnemonicwe'll see... like i said... it's just a idea
23:31:06JohnnyMnemonicstripwax_: are there any at all? skinnable or not?
23:31:07*rasher coughs and points at the topic
23:31:22JohnnyMnemonic*refuse to be social*
23:31:42scorche|wwe arent saying that...we are just saying do it in a different place ;)
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23:34:18JohnnyMnemonichehe... i actually got my answer. thanks guys... it's bedtime in Norway now :)
23:35:45stripwax_Anyone had any thoughts on my sliding_puzzle or pacbox+cop_audio patches? or could suggest anything that needs adding to them before they can be committed?
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