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#rockbox log for 2008-04-24

00:00:12 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@resnet09.nat.lancs.ac.uk)
00:01:31 Quit davina ("GNU/Linux the free alternative to Windows")
00:02:03 Join cbr|w [0] (n=cbr@212.98.160.130)
00:04:39 Join Rincewind [0] (i=6bscqnci@nat-wh-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de)
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00:05:44 Join Mouser_X [0] (n=mouser_x@layl001.digis.net)
00:06:31peturmuch better now :)
00:13:59 Quit Rincewind ("bye")
00:15:46 Quit DerDome ("Leaving.")
00:18:32 Quit CyBergRind|w (Success)
00:26:23 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
00:26:30 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
00:32:46peturI was wondering, if the driver generates one (1) BUTTON_SCROLL_UP or BUTTON_SCROLL_DOWN event, does that scroll one item up/down?
00:33:30*pixelma wonders if she should prepare the new flashlight plugin for the Ondio backlight mod (officially)
00:34:03 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
00:34:10pixelmadoesn't hurt probably
00:34:21peturgo ahead ;)
00:35:13*petur wonders where his BUTTON_SCROLL events are going to :(
00:35:22pixelmait's only compiled in with HAVE_BACKLIGHT so it would only be another keymap definition
00:35:24*BigBambi quietly (and non-too seriously) grumbles about Rockbox using British English and a flashlight being called a torch in that,
00:36:35peturone possible addition could be to save the last used color
00:37:03*amiconn wonders why sansa recording doesn't offer agc
00:37:10 Quit freqmod_n (Remote closed the connection)
00:37:25*petur will use this plugin a lot next winter to find the lock on his bike
00:37:48peturamiconn: gain steps too big?
00:38:06amiconn1.5 dB ...
00:38:24petura bit big, yes
00:38:42amiconnI'd think that's ok
00:38:43pixelmaguess no-one bothered because you can't do high quality recording with it anyways?
00:39:08amiconnWell, I'd never use agc for high quality stuff anyway, however, for voice it would be useful
00:39:18peturshould we enable it for all targets with rec gain settings (except the silly 0/20db)
00:39:48*petur uses AGC_SAFETY for all his concert recordings and highly recommends it
00:40:22*amiconn doesn't record concerts
00:41:12amiconnI'd expect the built-in mic to produce complete crap at usual concert volume levels
00:42:45*bluebrother rearranges the bl installer uml
00:45:09*pixelma missed that the keymap definitions are only for targets with colour display
00:45:40peturah yes indeed they are, sorry
00:46:06 Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection)
00:46:25pixelmaso no problem here, sorry for the confusion :)
00:46:25 Join Shaid [0] (n=adam@dsl-202-45-112-116-static.VIC.netspace.net.au)
00:46:30 Quit knittl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:46:53amiconnpetur: There are certainly a few things missing for non-colour (and partially also colour) targets in flashlight.c
00:47:16peturbrightness setting?
00:47:28amiconnFor greyscale, it should also temporarily remove a backdrop and set the background to white
00:47:51*bluebrother wonders if we could force all people adding new plugins also writing a new manual entry
00:48:00bluebrotherbut I guess that's impossible
00:48:06pixelmabluebrother: good idea
00:48:07amiconnIt should probably also check the display inversion setting, and disable it, except for m:robe 100, where it should enable it
00:48:26pixelmabluebrother: would be nice at least
00:48:37amiconnYes, and set brightness to maximum where available
00:48:46bluebrotheryep.
00:48:47 Join Leperkawn [0] (n=chatzill@68-188-192-35.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com)
00:48:52peturamiconn: brightness is already set to max
00:48:59amiconnah ok
00:49:12peturI was thinking of having buttons inc/dec it
00:49:16bluebrotherimprove the torch by allowing to set the brightness?
00:49:27peturyes
00:49:32*bluebrother too slow at this time of day :o
00:49:42*petur just woke up
00:49:58bluebrotherwow ... what timezone you're in?
00:50:07peturgmt+2
00:50:08amiconnpetur: But that doesn't help if e.g. the m:robe's lcd is black (because it's normally black - either we need to fill the whole lcd, or use the invert setting to make it "white" (i.e. red))
00:50:22peturamiconn: yes
00:50:27peturI'll have a lok
00:50:31petur*look
00:50:55*amiconn should start woring on screenshot/sim lcd colour unification
00:50:58amiconn*working
00:51:12amiconnThis will include simulation of 'invert'
00:51:25peturbluebrother: I'm usually more awake at night then during the day, even if I have a normal daytime job...
00:51:25bluebrotherpetur: I thought so, but I'm in the same TZ :o
00:52:13bluebrotheryou need to tell me how to manage a daytime job and still having energy hacking at nights ;-)
00:53:17petursleep from time to time ;)
00:53:42bluebrotherat work? Wouldn't work.
00:54:28peturI have somebody here at home who drags me to bed on some nights ;)
00:54:55peturmore like kicking really
00:55:06bluebrotherhehe ... maybe I'd need somebody for this?
00:55:45Hillshumget married
00:56:21bluebrotherI think "find a girl" comes first. And that's quite a heavy task ...
00:56:59LeperkawnI've heard they bite
00:57:11bluebrotherouch.
00:57:17 Part perrikwp
00:57:18Hillshumtrue
00:57:21Leperkawn-holds up wrist with bitemark-
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00:57:52*gevaerts decides to be careful
00:58:01 Quit desowin ("KVIrc 4.0.0 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/")
00:59:03peturamiconn: greyscale is for LCD_DEPTH > 1, right? then the plugin already clears backdrop and sets white background for those
00:59:41*bluebrother decides to go for sleep now (even without someone kicking)
00:59:52*petur kicks anyway
00:59:59*Hillshum kicks too
01:00
01:00:13 Quit bluebrother ("nite guys, I feel kicked :)")
01:00:19 Quit ender` (" error compiling committee.c: too many arguments to function")
01:00:41peturalways nice when ender leaves...
01:00:42 Join cendres [0] (n=ashes@modemcable123.78-80-70.mc.videotron.ca)
01:00:44amiconnpetur: hmrm, missed that...
01:01:21peturI'll add the invert though, good find...
01:01:21amiconnpetur: Is 'Whilte' a colour? ;)
01:01:22 Quit herrwaldo ("Konversation terminated!")
01:01:56amiconn(aka typo in line 170)
01:02:36*amiconn spots completely unnecessary usage of 'float' :(
01:02:39 Join csc` [0] (n=csc@archlinux/user/csc)
01:02:46*petur can't be bothered to check the patches in the tracker to find out who made the typo
01:02:49 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
01:03:23peturamiconn: yes
01:05:16 Quit ashes (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:05:58amiconnImho that should have been a commit blocker...
01:06:32peturreally?
01:06:35amiconnyes
01:07:17amiconnUsing 'float' on an embedded system without fpu needs *very* good reasoning, imho (e.g. a calculator needs it, obviously)
01:07:48peturit will get fixed faster once committed then if it sits and rots in the tracker
01:08:05peturand being a plugin I thought this was ok to do later
01:08:07amiconnAlthough it's not performance critical here, using float bloats the binary
01:08:39peturI wouldn't have committed it if it were in the core
01:08:45 Join ashes [0] (n=ashes@modemcable123.78-80-70.mc.videotron.ca)
01:09:28amiconnWell, large plugins are also not nice. They all add up in the .zip, for instance
01:10:09preglowas long as the intent is to fix it, i don't see a problem with commiting it
01:10:11amiconnAnother reason is that others often use existing plugins as examples
01:10:40*petur adds a TO DO comment
01:10:51preglowstrictly for plugins, of course, floats should never happen in the core
01:12:06amiconnThey also shouldn't appear in plugins except where strictly necessary, imho, e.g. becaus eof the example effect
01:12:44peturok ok... it's a work in progress, calm down
01:13:36*amiconn often reacts like this as he knows that 'intermediate' solutions tend to stay way longer than planned :/
01:14:16amiconnNot a rockbox specific phenomenon...
01:16:34 Join cendres_ [0] (n=ashes@modemcable123.78-80-70.mc.videotron.ca)
01:16:38amiconnCheck flashlight.rock size for H300, and compare e.g. to dict.rock and stats.rock (which are of similar complexity...)
01:16:59pixelmaspeaking of something rotting in the tracker... (though I had one added comment yesterday, thanks BigBambi :) )
01:16:59peturyeeeees I got the point
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01:21:15pixelmaI'd welcome if some more people with c200s could try out FS #8824 and comment on (would be thankful for new ideas, regarding some unsolved issues and inconsistencies)
01:23:11***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:27:10*gevaerts can't really try this out now.
01:28:01gevaertsI use my c250 mostly for usb testing these days, which means I can't keep files on it for a long time, which means I don't use it for playing...
01:28:45*amiconn now realises what he forgot
01:29:03 Quit ashes (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:29:04amiconnShould have built with usb support for my c240
01:29:29pixelmaheh, and you asked yesterday about "all the forgetting" :P
01:29:57amiconnThis was the first build for my own c200...
01:30:43*gevaerts is curious how the c240 wil behave with this torture device amiconn calls a hub
01:30:56amiconnWell, you said NEC is ok
01:31:04amiconnDid you find a similar hub?
01:31:33gevaertsI have two at work with the same VID/PID
01:31:49 Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection)
01:32:27gevaertsThey don't seem to cause problems with my c250. I havne't tried my ipod yet (will try tomorrow)
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01:33:39gevaertsBut there are still issues : USB is supposed to work with a device behind 5 hubs. I got lots of resets with ony 3 (but it still worked). I forgot to test that with the OF though
01:34:04*gevaerts packs his ipod and his c250 so he can test a bit more tomorrow
01:34:12jerichokbhi guys, i think i've got myself into a bit of a muddle with my ipod nano
01:34:20amiconnSometimes usb seems to behave a bit strange if you even try to get near the allowed cable lengths
01:34:41jerichokbrockbox seems to think i've got every song on my ipod 4 times over
01:35:02Hillshumgevaerts: but USB won't power all 5 hubs, they need their own
01:35:08 Quit vedlith (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:35:18amiconnI know of the following setup: (root hub) -- 4.5m -- (repeater) -- 5.0m -- (4-port hub) -- 2 printers
01:35:48gevaertsHillshum: of course. Finding enough power sockets is the biggest challenge for those tests ;)
01:35:54amiconnSometimes the PC just doesn't want to communicate with either printer. Unplugging and replugging the whole setup (at the root hub) makes it work again
01:36:15 Join Seldaek [0] (n=seld@crom.seld.ch)
01:36:20jerichokbmy database info looks like this: initialised: Yes , DB Ready: No , RAM Cache: No , RAM: 0/0 B , Progress: -1% (4497 entries), Curfile: --- , Commit Step: 0 , Commit Delayed : no
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01:37:05pixelmajerichokb: did you try a complete "initialize now" or just updated?
01:37:29Seldaekhowdy, my iHP120's HDD just died on me after a few years of good service.. any idea what's the closest match to that in the new stuff ? the iAudio X5's I think are pretty similar (although newer/better), but I'm not sure about the rest..
01:38:05*amiconn thinks the H120 is better than the iaudios (except in size)
01:38:06peturbah, the mrobe-100 sim doesn't simulate lcd invert
01:38:39amiconnpetur: Check 50 minutes back in the log...
01:38:46gevaertsSeldaek: you could replace the HD
01:38:50jerichokbi initilised it the first time, then ran into problems when i tried putting more files on/taking some off. i've tried both initialize now and update now, and have had the 'committing database' msg a few times, but nothing changes
01:38:53Seldaekamiconn: well I was really happy with it.. I just want an music player that can run rockbox well enough with 20-40gigs.
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01:39:27peturamiconn: sorry, completely missed that
01:39:44Seldaekgevaerts: yeah I guess, but even then, the jacks were a bit fucked up (only the optical out still working without shortcircuits)
01:39:53gevaertsSeldaek: just for playing ? If you don't need recording or a radio, lots of people seem to be happy with a gigabeat F
01:40:00pixelmajerichokb: I'd probably try deleting the database files (all the *.tcd files in the .rockbox folder and the initialise again)
01:40:00 Quit cendres (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:40:10jerichokbok, will try that - thanks.
01:40:18Seldaekgevaerts: I'll definitely try and open it and smash the hard disk a bit before buying anything new though
01:41:13Seldaekgevaerts: gigabeat F.. thanks, I'll have a look, I don't need recording indeed, just mp3 playback and opened USB-disk capability (not like those Sony crap if you see what I mean)
01:41:28*Hillshum loves smashing stuff
01:41:45Hillshumsee www.smashmyipod.com
01:42:01 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
01:42:09Seldaekwell I meant smash it gently see if it helps to repair it :P
01:42:18gevaertsOf course, you can try to find another H120. There's currently a seller on ebay who has lots of them new in box
01:42:31SeldaekUS?
01:42:44gevaertsYes
01:42:59Seldaekthat's not good :)
01:43:03*gevaerts ordered one. Luckily he ships everywhere
01:43:32Seldaekwow $150
01:44:02*amiconn wonders why the sansa's internal flash and card slot disappear & reappear several times in windows when using rockbox usb
01:44:48amiconngevaerts: c240 has the same problem as the mini when connected to the hub
01:44:53gevaertsSeldaek: lots of people seem to like the H120
01:45:13Seldaekyeah it's strong and nice imo
01:45:31gevaertsunfortunately that keeps prices high
01:45:38SeldaekI know some people that have gone through 2-4ipods during my h120's life
01:46:08Seldaekoh well my "wow $150" was not meant that way:) I think it's pretty cheap compared to what I paid for mine
01:46:42gevaertsamiconn: I'll try to look into those TXFILLTUNING options tomorrow.
01:46:44jerichokbpixelma: building database, but it seems to be going a lot slower than the first time i did it. is this a bad sign or am i just being paranoid and impatient?
01:46:58gevaertsSeldaek: gigabeat F is much cheaper (but probably not as solid)
01:47:03SeldaekI'd need some US guy to ship it for me as a gift though, but thanks for the pointer gevaerts, I'll definitely consider it..
01:47:07 Quit EspeonEefi ("さよăȘら")
01:47:23amiconnSo it looks like a PP5020 vs. PP5022 problem to me
01:47:38amiconngevaerts: What ipod do you have, again?
01:47:46gevaertsvideo 5G
01:48:09*gevaerts needs a PP5020 device
01:48:11amiconnHmm, so that's effectively also PP5022
01:48:41amiconnPP5020 is the one that works on my hub, btw
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01:50:44gevaertsDo you happen to have more hubs around ? I'd like to know how PP5020 behaves if you use more than one
01:51:16pixelmajerichokb: it's a full rebuild so it sure takes longer than an "update now", don't know about the initialising. You didn't delete the database.ignore file in there too by chance?
01:51:48jerichokbpixelma: nope, pretty sure just *.tcd
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01:51:59pixelmacould be a reason why it takes longer, otherwise it doesn't do harm. Ok
01:52:13jerichokbcheers :)
01:52:48amiconngevaerts: No, I only have this one hi-speed hub. It's this one, btw: http://www.transcend.de/Support/DLCenter/index.asp?LangNo=20&ItemID=TS0MHUB4EU&axn=SRH1_RLT&DLKeyWd=hub
01:53:27amiconnThere's an unpowered usb1.1 hub built into my monitor though...
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01:53:53gevaerts1.1 won't tell us much
01:54:23*gevaerts also has only one hub at home. Luckily at work there are boxes of them
01:55:04eluriahi, i'm wondering if there is a place where i can check how portage to 2nd gen nano's is going?
01:55:24krazykiteluria, there's a thread in the New Ports forum, but nothing's happenening.
01:55:39eluriaok thanks
01:55:48eluriaso you don't reckon there will be one any time soon?
01:55:56scorche|shnot unless someone works on it
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01:56:19eluriai have no idea how complex the code is but i might be interested
01:57:09eluriaare there really big obstacles to overcome for that particular port or just many small issues?
01:57:12scorche|shthe code isnt quite the issue
01:57:33krazykitundocumented hardware and encrypted firmware spring to mind as obstacles.
01:57:52eluriaahh how nice ;) a real challenge then
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01:59:25Hillshumdoes the firmware use symmetric or asymmetric encription?
02:00
02:00:42 Quit gevaerts ("sleeping is boring, but doing without it isn't easy")
02:02:57amiconnAfaik nothing is known apart from the fact that the firmware is encrypted
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02:05:18*amiconn ->sleep(HZ*21600);
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02:10:32pixelmajerichokb: is it still initialising?
02:11:03jerichokbpixelma: yes, only at 64...i'm pretty sure there's around 400 tracks on there
02:11:29pixelmathat doesn't sound right
02:12:15 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
02:14:48peturbah
02:15:20pixelmajerichokb: I only have 2 ideas what could be wrong. Sometimes it's choking on bad tags of some files (e.g. too large) - or together with the fact that you had a few entries before for each song it could also be filesystem errors.
02:16:02Shaidhas anyone dumped the firmware from the ipod classics and nanos?
02:17:05jerichokbpixelma: hmm, bad tags doesn't sound likely as it was coping fine with much the same songs.
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02:20:19pixelmajerichokb: you could check the filesystem for errors (chkdsk on windows, don't know what tools are there on linux etc.). Hope someone else could help you as I need to get some sleep too
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02:21:15jerichokbpixelma: cheers for your help so far (fsck on linux, iirc)
02:21:23Shaidyeah, fsck
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02:22:05pixelmaok, good luck
02:22:10jerichokbthanks!
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02:34:01*petur got the proof that fixing something quickly ends up taking more time :(
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02:55:45BHSPitMonkeyOh yeah, I have the inductive proof to that lying around here somewhere
03:00
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03:23:16***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:52:23poorchcan i ask for some help?
05:53:22poorchi have an 5th gen ipod, 80gig, that i recently put rockbox on; it was working eariler today but now all i get is the sad face screen
05:55:45poorchi tried reseting but thatr didnt do anything
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08:53:53LloreanLinusN: Well, "Initialize Now" will probably always be there for rebuilding from scratch when you've changed metadata on something (though perhaps the option to select a folder from the context menu and manually choose "Rescan" or similar...)
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08:54:12*Llorean isn't even sure what the bugs are that people suggest deleting the .tcd files for anymore.
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08:55:08JdGordonand on that topic.. does anyone know why (or having the same problem) where the databse cant be commited in the sim? so you cant actually use it?
08:56:02LloreanJdGordon: No, but I bet if you investigate you'll probably end up solving some on-target problems in the process. ;)
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08:56:41JdGordonprobably :p
08:59:08LloreanI think people have run into problems getting it to commit on target too.
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09:05:56*amiconn wonders about petur's fix for 'float'
09:06:25peturwe don't need fancy color settings
09:06:47JdGordonSlasheri: any ideas about the not commiting problem?
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09:06:49amiconnConverting the hsv conversion to fixed point is really simple. I hacked together a fixed point version in 10 minutes
09:07:03amiconnNeed to test compile
09:07:59peturamiconn: yes, I was about to, but I didn't really like the operation so I killed it anyway. White and red is (imho) the colors one needs so this implementation is way easier.
09:08:25peturso: I do not want a fixed point implementation of the previous version ;)
09:10:03LloreanWhy red?
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09:14:15peturnight vision
09:15:35peturif you use red light in the dark your night vision will remain pretty good, if you use white you'll see nothing for the first 5 minutes ;)
09:16:24JdGordonarg, how to you get gdb to jump to continue to the next line of code?
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09:20:41amiconnpetur: I didn't test the plugin yet, but lcd_set_invert_display() requires an lcd_update() afterwards on most targets, as the comments in the target lcd-*.c say
09:20:56peturouch :(
09:20:58amiconnAlso, m:robe 100 is mono, hence won't see the fix
09:21:59amiconnlcd_set_invert_display() exists for all bitmap depths (although for some targets it's empty - unrelated to depth but to knowledge about the lcd controller)
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09:22:45petureuh, the call is there for all targets that have the dfeine, not just 1+ bit
09:22:50petur*define
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09:23:28amiconnUmm, too many #ifdef error ;\
09:23:58peturbut the update is missing, that's true
09:24:03Bgerhrm.. what's this 'Accessory Power Supply' ? Power supply for ipod's accessories ?
09:24:12*petur has no svn access at work :(
09:25:06LloreanBger: Yes
09:27:00amiconnpetur: Eh, sorry, I confused something...
09:27:13*amiconn obviously not fully awake yet
09:27:30*B4gder orders a large coffee for amiconn
09:27:32amiconnlcd_set_invert_display() doesn't require lcd_update() - confused it with lcd_set_flip()
09:27:42peturphew...
09:30:07JdGordonSlasheri: you round?
09:31:10amiconnSo all is well, and the remaining question is whether I should scrap the fixedpointified hue code.
09:32:11peturyou can add it and use up/down keys to switch between fixed color and variable color modes ;)
09:33:50peturimho the limited fixed colors are fine. The provious one even had a bug, you couln't get to white light again
09:34:20amiconnThat should have worked...
09:34:40JdGordonSON OF A ....
09:34:41peturI tried it on h300, it didn't
09:34:43amiconnh goes 0..360 in the original code, modulo 365 in steps of 5
09:35:00amiconn0 means white, 5...360 means a hue of 0..355
09:35:12