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#rockbox log for 2008-07-31

00:00:00num1webguest46: Rockbox isn't really in the habit of manually changing the OF, either we completely replace it or install our own bootloader that dual-boots the OF and Rockbox
00:00:58webguest46but i am thinking it would have to be a modified firmware
00:01:13linuxstbnum1: That's not quite true, often we combine our bootloader code with the OF, in effect creating a modified firmware.
00:02:02linuxstbwebguest46: Yes, that's what someone needs to do. But it's easier said than done, especially as we don't fully understand the firmware file format yet, and don't know a way to add extra code to it.
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00:11:54robin0800bertrik any chance you could let me have a new sansapatcher? I've tried to make one but it seems to have errors in the build at least on vmware
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00:16:32peturrasher: genlang spits some warnings here, why aren't these visible on the build table?
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00:17:55rasherpetur: That's interesting.. let me check
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00:19:08rasherpetur: I don't see these errors. Are you sure they aren't your own fault?
00:19:16rasherAlternatively, pastebin them?
00:19:27peturhmm for a sim build of X5 but not for a target build of h300
00:20:24rasherStill no genlang errors here (for X5 sim).
00:22:33peturrasher: http://www.pastebin.ca/1087705
00:22:36kugellinuxstb: I managed to strip the actual bmp_resize(not resize_into_core) patch to 300bytes bin size increase, by removing the all those options the patch introduces and cleaning it up a little.
00:22:38bertrikrobin0800, I'm about to go to sleep, I'll help you tomorrow ok?
00:23:12kugellinuxstb: together with resize_into_core, I come to ~3KB bin size increase (now comparing the actual bin files)
00:23:43rasherpetur: and what do those line look like? Are diverged from SVN?
00:23:57peturnope
00:23:59kugelrobin0800: I could possibly build one for you
00:24:23pixelmarasher: why did you remove Manuel Dejonghe's name again?
00:24:54 Quit bertrik ("Leaving")
00:25:26rasherpixelma: I was unsure about whether he had actually contributed, he's in the svn log, but I couldn't find the patch in FS. Do you remember?
00:26:01rasherMost of the changes in that revision got modified pretty quickly anyway
00:27:35pixelmano, I don't remember, it was a bit before the time I started looking closer
00:28:00rasherAlso he's done good chunks of the French translation, so I figured that's what he does, and I may just have messed up when committing (I did the SVN commit)
00:28:38peturrasher: I wiped the build dir, did configure for target 30, S(im) and make - same warnings
00:29:00rasherpetur: would you mind sharing your hebrew.lang?
00:29:19peturit is svn...
00:29:44peturdiff says no differences
00:30:12*petur tries in his clean tree
00:31:45pixelmarasher: looking at his wiki page, it says he's from Germany/Belgium (and if I remember correctly he currently is in Germany) so it could be possible he speaks those 2 languages well enough. Not a big thing I suppose...
00:32:16peturrasher: weird, my cleant tree builds fine
00:32:31rasherpetur: Now diff the two.. and genlang, perhaps
00:35:16peturrasher: know a good diff program for directories? (gui)
00:35:29*petur wonders if winmerge runs under wine
00:35:39rasherWell I was thinking of just diffing the two hebrew.lang
00:35:45peturah
00:35:50rasherBut no - diff -r not good enough?
00:35:51kugelpetur: diff -ru dir1 dir2 works fine
00:36:49peturhebrew.lang: no differences
00:37:25rasherAnd genlang?
00:37:35petursame
00:37:40rasherGosh
00:38:37peturpatch at 9208... need some sleep now
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00:53:33robin0800kugel yes please if you could please post in forum where it can be found got to go to bed now!
00:54:18kugelWhich thread?
00:54:51joshinDo the e200 builds have the rockbox usb stack enabled by default or do I still need to roll my own?
00:55:13robin0800Sandisk installation I would think
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00:56:12kugeljoshin: No, it|s not enabled
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00:56:34 Part pixelma
00:56:47joshinThanks. Time to update my sources and kick off a build. :)
00:57:14kugelYou actually only need to edit the makefile made by configure AFAIK
00:57:33joshinYeah, it was pretty easy when I last did it (around 6-8 months ago or so)
00:57:54joshinI'm just lazy so was hoping not to have to still do it. :)
00:57:58kugeljoshin: But, it's disabled by default for a reason. It can be harmful to your filesystem (especially with HIGH_SPEED_USB)
00:58:16Lloreankugel: No. You can just add it to the target config file
01:00
01:02:06kugelLlorean: PortalPlayerUsb says it
01:02:14kugelthe wiki page
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01:05:45Lloreankugel: Yes, and the way on the page is one way to do it.
01:06:18LloreanA much more effective way, especially if you build for multiple targets or want to keep your changes orderly, is to just add it to the config-e200.h or whatever is appropriate for the targets you want to enable it for.
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01:21:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:24:35LambdaCalculus37Anyone with a Jukebox Player/Studio and a Mac around?
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01:25:35scorche|shyes you will need drivers ;)
01:26:11LambdaCalculus37scorche|sh: Goody. :) And my optical drive is borked.
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01:27:47LambdaCalculus37But thank Eris there's another Mac in the house. :)
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01:46:14*LambdaCalculus37 goes to get the drivers for the JB5000 copied to a thumb drive
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01:49:39 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
02:00
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02:17:44 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
02:26:46*MarcGuay acknowledges kugel's hard work on the resize patch
02:27:30kugelMarcGuay: Oh thanks!
02:29:00kugelI just want it be committed ;) Sadly, seeing the 2,7KB bin size increase (at least for the smooth scaling algorithm), I have the feeling the chances are low
02:29:14*kugel needs to talk with the RSB :)
02:30:14Lloreankugel: Does it use its own buffer to resize the image, or does it resize in place on the audio buffer?
02:30:30MarcGuayAre the targets where binsize is a troublesome issue the same targets that are less likely to use this? i.e. Can't it simply be excluded from those builds, making everyone happy?
02:30:58LloreanMarcGuay: It's not just a question of whether binsize is an issue now.
02:31:36LloreanRAM usage, and how much we can spare for compressed audio, is always a question worth considering. It's just less immediate and on a smaller scale for some targets.
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02:32:01LloreanBut it's still worth considering "how useful is this" vs "how much RAM does it use up" since every K of RAM is memory that could be used for a different feature instead.
02:32:19LloreanAnd it's much harder to remove a feature in favour of a new one than to say "Y'know, it's nice, but it's not *that* nice"
02:32:36JdGordonevery k of ram is about 0.2s or something rediculous... and we have ~30mb of the stuff to play with
02:33:02LloreanJdGordon: So are you saying we should just use all of it?
02:33:21LloreanThere's got to be an upper limit. And once you know you have an upper limit, you know that eventually it will matter, and if it'll matter eventually, then it actually matters now.
02:33:30JdGordonim saying using a bit more for a very popular feature shouldnt be considered bad
02:34:06JdGordonLlorean: that sentance also says "there is a limit, so why bother adding anything..."
02:34:06 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("Do quit now, there's a demon around the corner!")
02:34:29JdGordonsure, eventually we'll hit it... but whent that happens we'll worry about it
02:34:31LloreanJdGordon: No, it says "there is a limit, so make sure the things you're adding are the things you're willing to sacrifice later features for"
02:34:46JdGordonyay for stalling progress
02:34:49LloreanIt's much better to pick and choose carefully than to start deciding what to dump.
02:35:00num1this is a silly question, it's possible to use gotos in a plugin right?
02:35:33LloreanJdGordon: So if we just rejected it outright, would that be stalling progress too?
02:35:43 Quit massiveH (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
02:35:44XavierGrnum1 you can use it in the core too if used sanely
02:35:44LloreanOn the assumption that "better to reject it now, than possibly have to remove it later"?
02:36:11num1Llorean: sure it's better to choose carefully, but there's a line where you're letting too little in and that's what stalls progress
02:36:16JdGordonLlorean: well you bassically have already rejected it..
02:36:19XavierGrnum1: people are often afraid of goto too much but if used properly it can be a good thing
02:36:29LloreanJdGordon: No, I'm actually in favour of bitmap resize.
02:36:55num1XavierGr: alright, thanks.
02:37:02Lloreannum1: Bitmap resize isn't a functional feature. It's eye candy, and it's frankly stupid eye candy at that, since you can accomplish the resizing yourself.
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02:37:41LloreanJdGordon: I didn't comment on BMP resize's bin size use, just on MarcGuay's question as to whether binsize is a real concern.
02:37:50TuxOtakuhey, what video formats does rockbox support?
02:37:55LloreanTuxOtaku: MPEG1/2
02:38:01TuxOtakuk
02:38:02TuxOtakuthanks
02:38:09TuxOtakuthat's all though?
02:38:17LloreanThey're not exactly fast devices.
02:38:35TuxOtakuok, was just curious
02:38:37TuxOtakuthanks
02:38:42LloreanAnd the smaller your video, the less difference there is in bitrate savings between codecs in my experience.
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02:39:46LloreanJdGordon: But I'd rather BMP resize lean toward a small resizing algorithm that maybe isn't as pretty than trying to get the prettiest one we can in.
02:40:05MarcGuayLlorean: Doing the resizing yourself for any number of themes, even with a batch converter, is a pain in the rear.
02:40:45LloreanMarcGuay: And people who never use album art all pay a little bit to save those who do that pain in the rear?
02:41:03JdGordonsounds fair to me
02:41:05MarcGuayHow do they pay if we haven't reached the limit yet?
02:41:18MarcGuayHow do they notice?
02:41:23LloreanMarcGuay: RAM used for the binary isn't used for buffering audio, and lowers battery life.
02:41:25*linuxstb thought Llorean has already said he's in favour of bmp resize...
02:41:29LloreanBMP resize on its own is a small amount.
02:41:41LloreanBut Rockbox is a big pile of "small amounts"
02:42:10JdGordonso its either always bad to add feaures which means we may as well give up.... or add everything untill we get to the limit
02:42:12Lloreanlinuxstb: I think they missed that.
02:42:29LloreanJdGordon: OR add features we're willing to sacrifice other features for.
02:42:33advcomp2019i do not use album art, so i do not want rockbox to slow down.. i like the speed
02:42:42Lloreanadvcomp2019: Has nothing to do with speed.
02:43:44advcomp2019o ok.. you was talking about RAM up above and got a little confused then
02:43:54Lloreanadvcomp2019: Yes, RAM has very little to do with speed.
02:44:01*MarcGuay finds out that the Sony NWA series uses the same Coldfire chip as the X5/M5/M3...
02:44:58LloreanMarcGuay: On SWCodec we already use about 10% of the available RAM. Ideally we should be trying to free up more of it. New features aren't bad, but they should be considered based on "how much RAM do they cost" vs "what do they actually add to the total experience"
02:45:12LloreanBitmap resizing is a pretty small addition, over all, since it doesn't actually even let you do anything new.
02:45:27LloreanWe should try to add a version of it that's as small as possible if we're going to.
02:45:45JdGordon10% sounds alot worse than 3MB...
02:45:47MarcGuayLlorean: It lets you not waste your life resizing album art to 100 different sizes.
02:45:55LloreanJdGordon: And yet both are true.
02:46:04LloreanMarcGuay: Which you can script.
02:46:28LloreanMarcGuay: You could even propose adding a feature to RBUtil to check album art on your themes and make sure it's available in all those sizes.
02:46:34LloreanWhich would also solve your problem.
02:46:56JdGordonLlorean: actually no.. we have 16mb and 64 mb targets which both use 4mb :D
02:47:08num1How about a compromise, if resizing were added as a plugin that resizes every image in some directory, would it be accepted?
02:47:08JdGordon3*
02:47:10kugelLlorean: To answer your question, the resized bitmap is loaded into metadata buffer. I'm not entirely sure what happens with the orig bitmap after resizing though
02:47:17LloreanJdGordon: Yes, I was averaging out all swcodec targets, and approximating. Obviously it's worse for the 16mb and less bad for the 64.
02:47:31Lloreankugel: I mean *during* the resizing it has to be loaded, where is it?
02:47:53Lloreannum1: That's a different matter altogether, and really no reason not to do that one.
02:48:40kugelLlorean: in the audio buffer I assume, before the playback starts
02:48:52Lloreankugel: Please don't "assume"
02:49:38JdGordonhmm.. would be nice if it could use the plugin buffer to resize.. and fail if it cant get that buffer
02:49:47kugelLlorean: Well, I'm not the right man then. idak has done most of it. He'll be able to tell you
02:49:48LloreanJdGordon: It should be able to use the audio buffer
02:50:03linuxstbJdGordon: How would failing be nice?
02:50:26LloreanJdGordon: Since it's loading like metadata, and it has to go on the audio buffer eventually, we should either be able to load the whole image then resize it in place, or load the image elsewhere, then resize it to where it belongs, and release the old one.
02:50:42JdGordonLlorean: it could, but if the block it gets insnt continuous it might have problems, and the buffer may need to be moved.. its easier if its a static buffer
02:50:55linuxstbOr resize as it's being loaded - i.e. not load the entire image into RAM first
02:51:01LloreanJdGordon: It'd break TSR plugins.
02:51:11Lloreanlinuxstb: IIRC it was down to needing one line of the image at a time.
02:51:19LloreanBut that may have been before an algorithm change.
02:51:20JdGordonof which we have 1... and when thats running people dont usually care about AA
02:51:49LloreanJdGordon: It'd make it impossible to test, for example, whether AA affects battery life in a measurable way after resizing is implemented.
02:52:18JdGordonif it can do one line at a time then it should be doable when its loaded seen as that reads it in one line at a time anyway
02:52:40linuxstbJdGordon: It breaks if someone is happening to use a plugin (or playlist viewer, or ...) when the track is buffered
02:52:42LloreanThough I think it might be better if we stored the un-resized image on the audio buffer.
02:52:54LloreanSuggest to users to store their images as "the largest size you'll use"
02:53:09LloreanIf you store the un-resized image, then the images will work even if there's a theme change during playback
02:54:11JdGordonyou want to resize it every time its drawn?
02:54:27LloreanIsn't album-art stored in the WPS structure once it's in-use, like the bitmaps in the WPS?
02:54:47JdGordonhmm.. yeah
02:54:48safetydanwhat about something similar to the codecs where an "image codec" is loaded in to the buffer along with the image?
02:54:52LloreanSo you'd resize on that copy
02:54:54linuxstbLlorean: A reasonably sized bmp isn't negligible in size - e.g. a 500x500 24-bit bmp is approx 750KB. So I don't think we should store the uncompressed version.
02:54:54kugelLlorean: The unresized version, yes
02:55:02linuxstbs/uncompressed/un-resized/
02:55:12Lloreanlinuxstb: People already use 200x200 ones.
02:55:25Lloreanlinuxstb: I'd say a reasonably sized one being "the largest size your WPSes support" isn't too much to ask
02:55:27LloreanSince they already do that anyway
02:55:49JdGordonis AA loaded manually on track change? I thought Nioc had it loading into the MoB already?
02:55:51linuxstbI would just want to store the original images I downloaded - most album-art I have is about 500x500
02:56:21Lloreanlinuxstb: I'd rather demand users perform a single resize, in advance, then resize that pre-resized image, than require rebuffering of all the album-art on WPS change.
02:57:15JdGordonsafetydan: the image codec idea has been brought up a few times... iirc the general consensus is that the extra code to support it would outweigh the beenfits untill we actually use more than one imgae format
02:57:21num1I'm starting to like Llorean's idea, adding a script to RBUtils that can resize images for you
02:57:27Lloreansafetydan: Well I think jpeg-in-the-core is still on the list of considered features anyway
02:58:03safetydanLlorean: having image codecs would allow support of multiple formats without adding core code...
02:58:22Lloreansafetydan: I doubt we'd want much more than BMP and JPEG anyway
02:58:25safetydana lot of work to get going though, and yeah messy interactions with WPS reload and track skipping back and forth
02:58:29kugelI just want to add, that album art is not the only use for resizing, but also icons to fit just every font size
02:58:33safetydanLlorean: and PNG
02:58:33LloreanAnd if you have to reserve room for the JPEG "codec", then you might as well just have JPEG in the core
02:58:52JdGordonsafetydan: also unless it can share the codec buffer, thats unaother 512kb wasted for it
02:59:09LloreanJdGordon: Doesn't have to be quite that big. Just as big as our largest image codec.
02:59:23*Llorean doesn't know why the codec buffer isn't sized to the largest codec instead of being locked in place.
02:59:26kugeland being able to get icons fitting the font size is desirable too imho
02:59:56linuxstbLlorean: Because some codecs use the unused RAM
03:00
03:00:00linuxstb(for data)
03:00:04Lloreanlinuxstb: All of it?
03:00:08linuxstbYes
03:00:10LloreanAh
03:00:11LloreanWell then
03:00:21LloreanI was thinking "largest" as in "largest amount used", so I guess it is sized to fit.
03:00:21Llorean:)
03:00:37JdGordonkugel: does the current resizing patch let you specify the resized bmp size?
03:01:02LloreanIs the current one "size down" only, or does it scale up too?
03:01:06kugelno, but it should be doable relatively easy
03:01:25kugelLlorean: there's no limitation, you can scale in any direction
03:01:43kugelwith the 2 special cases removed too
03:01:52JdGordonLlorean: I suspect some of the codecs will use as much ram as they have availble.. so even if you double or half the codec buffer they will still use it all hapily
03:01:54LloreanCould it be made smaller if it was down only?
03:02:03kugelJdGordon: ooops, sorry. Yes it does
03:02:30linuxstbkugel: Looking at the patch, the "upscaling" code seems to be a special case as well. i.e. I have a feeling the last branch in the if will also upscale.
03:02:31num1how does the jpeg plugin handle really big images? does it load the entire image into memory?
03:02:48linuxstbnum1: It loads the entire _compressed_ image into memory
03:03:05kugellinuxstb: worth a try
03:03:05linuxstbBut resizes as it decompresses
03:05:48kugelJdGordon: Sorry, I've read something totally different. You can specify the size just by throwing a bitmap struct at it, where you already put the sizes in
03:07:53JdGordonok
03:08:43JdGordonso yeah, icon resizing owuld be nice
03:11:14kugellinuxstb: You're right. the last branch will also scale up
03:12:02kugellinuxstb: But it shows pixel errors
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03:13:00kugellinuxstb: So, the first branch should be kept
03:13:41linuxstbOr fix the last branch...
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03:17:54num1what is the plugin buffer size?
03:18:38linuxstbIt's 32KB on low-mem targets (2MB or less), 512KB on others
03:18:41kugel524288 on e200
03:20:13kugelI don't think it's good to use the plugin buffer for that. I can imagine plugins which start playback (e.g. pictureflow in the (far) future)
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03:21:27num1is the plugins stack held in the plugin buffer?
03:21:49linuxstbplugins use the main stack
03:22:29linuxstbApart from plugins that create new threads - those new threads use the plugin buffer (or IRAM)
03:23:53kugelLlorean: So you are basically in favor of bmp resize? You seemed to argue against it
03:23:58DhraakellianI recently did a battery test on my e260 with q6 Ogg Vorbis (173kbps average). I now want to compare that with mp3, but the LAME V2 equivalent is 199kbps average. Should I stick with that or try V3?
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03:24:08kugelhehe, ok
03:24:44kugelDhraakellian: What was the result of the off test?
03:24:49linuxstbDhraakellian: It's up to you - what do you want to compare?
03:24:50kugels/off/of
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03:26:15Dhraakellianhmm
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03:27:19Lloreankugel: I'm afraid if it's rushed in, it'll then just be forgotten about.
03:27:25Dhraakelliankugel: 17h 7min
03:27:49Dhraakellianwell, the last entry in the benchmark file is at 17:07:05
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03:28:09kugeldoesn't sound bad
03:28:16kugeldefault settings?
03:28:44Dhraakellianhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaRuntime
03:29:38Dhraakellianlatest entry
03:30:37kugelI saw it
03:30:48Dhraakellian10-CD Bruckner symphony cycle
03:31:50kugelWould be interesting if this patch gives better results http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9155
03:32:58Dhraakellianhmm
03:33:13kugelit also fixes the buffer overflow problem btw
03:33:21Dhraakellianso should I just do that with the same files rather than doing different codecs
03:35:13kugelI'd prefer that, yes :)
03:35:38kugelmp3 will probably give a bit less runtime
03:38:12kugelDhraakellian: Looking at http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/CodecPerformanceComparison, the runtime is somewhat predictable
03:38:48Dhraakellianwhat would the best/quickest way to switch between the FS #8070 patch and the FS #9155 patch be?
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03:39:23*Dhraakellian hasn't touched the svn checkout since applying the FS #8070 patch and making
03:39:59kugelDhraakellian: get a new source (1 for each patch) or just remove the one patch before you apply the other one
03:40:39kugelthough, getting a new source probably means using a newer revision, which possibly affects the runtime
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03:53:27num1in the graphics API, xxx_scroll_X() always inserts white pixels, why does it do this as opposed to scrolling in the Foreground color?
03:53:48Dhraakelliankugel: r18117 is what I have
03:53:59Dhraakelliananything between then and now that would affect runtime?
03:57:12kugelWho knows. But I think not. It was mostly lang changes
03:58:09Dhraakellianand I'm guessing the patch would apply cleanly to either r18117 or current?
03:58:54kugelI think it doesn't matter
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04:23:47*MarcGuay contemplates the ease of porting to an STMP3600 device given the existence of a linux port.
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04:40:54*num1 hands marcguay a pin saying "Official Rockbox STMP3600 porter" ;)
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04:49:58dandersonSo, if I'm an embedded geek looking for something to mess with, what can I do for rockbox?
04:50:20dandersonGiven the supported device list, it looks like my best bet is a new platform. Is there a list of potentials somewhere?
04:50:31Hillshumsansa v2
04:50:32LloreanThe "New Ports" section of the forum
04:50:35Hillshumor others
04:50:42*scorche waves at danderson
04:50:51Hillshumhttp://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?board=16.0
04:50:56dandersonscorche: gah, the internets are too small
04:51:31scorchedanderson: well, which projects do you think i am in #gsoc for? ;)
04:51:52dandersonheh
04:51:56dandersonhmm, the sansa seems familiar
04:51:58dandersonoh, right
04:52:20dandersona friend has one, and I helped him do a little poking around in a disassembly of the firmware
04:52:28scorchedanderson: there are lots of devices around ebay not to mention cheap refurbished sansas all over the place
04:53:55dandersongot it. Looking at the forum to find an intersection of a nice player and a potential target :P
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04:54:58scorchedanderson: looking for something to port or an existing device?
04:55:19MarcGuayhttp://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/TargetStatus is useful as well.
04:55:51dandersonscorche: depends on the price, but something with good specs and a way to recover would be nice.
04:56:16dandersonThat way I can use it as a player during the day and bash at it with rockbox at night :P
04:56:43dandersonBut right now, it's honestly mostly idle speculation.
04:56:51Hillshumno e200 v2 then
04:57:24dandersonI see there is no recovery possible/known yet
04:57:40scorchedanderson: well, if you want an already working device on the cheap, you can have a look at the top here: http://www.froobi.com/MP3-Players-Access_c_78.html
04:57:45HillshumJTAG is close
04:57:58dandersonscorche: already working device, now where's the fun in that? :P
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04:58:09dandersonbut something that I have a chance of unbricking when I mess up, that'd be nice
04:58:14danderson(or I could just get 2 I guess)
04:58:35Hillshumcheap ones then
04:58:58scorchedanderson: you might want to have a look around the New Norts forum for partially working devoces/ones that havent gotten off the ground then
04:59:00Lloreandanderson: Well you could pick up one of the "port is in progress" ones like the Cowon D2 or the Onda SomeStringOfNumbers
04:59:05scorches/Norts/Ports
04:59:35Lloreandanderson: Or the Meizu M6 (I may have the number wrong) has a bit more work to do, but still recoverable I think.
04:59:50dandersonHillshum: Is the v2 an official designation by sandisk, or just your way of telling two board versions apart?
05:00
05:00:12scorchedanderson: it says "v2" on some devices...although it isnt prominently marked on the box (which cna be wrong anyway)
05:00:17Hillshuman offical on e200 and c200, m200 not
05:00:31Hillshumthe box never says
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05:01:00Hillshumalso, Fuze and Clip are all "v2" meaning same soc
05:01:03Lloreandanderson: We use "SansaV2" as a designation for all the AMS Sansas we know of, but the designation is official for some of them (but mostly useless since labeling of refurbished devices is inconsistent, and all new ones ought to be V2s anyway)
05:01:35dandersonright. I was looking on ebay for players, but their markings are bound to be quite inconsistent as well.
05:01:36LloreanAll new ones within those lines that they're actually a V2, that is.
05:01:38n9xvtas i have had no sucess at compiling,,is there any way to request/recomend a patch to be added?(as in full distro)
05:01:54Lloreandanderson: They're inconsistent because the V2 label is on the back plate, which is often replaced or swapped for refurbished players.
05:02:03dandersonI see.
05:02:07Lloreandanderson: The only guaranteed way to know which type it is, short of opening it up, is to check the firmware version
05:02:31Hillshumon some the splash lets you know
05:03:26Hillshumon e200 the v2 splash says 'sansa' in blue, v1 does not
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05:06:20dandersonok, so I need to troll the shops for such a brick.
05:08:58n9xvti've seen some sansas on craig's list,,
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05:22:17dandersonso, buying any new e200 nowadays is guaranteed to get me a v2, right?
05:22:49Hillshumif not take it back
05:23:35Lloreandanderson: If you're buying it from any moderately large store, sure.
05:23:40dandersonwas going to buy online, which makes that annoying
05:23:46Hillshumyeah
05:23:47scorchedanderson: well, they v2 has been in production for a number of months and they are seeping into the refurbished stock...most if not all new ones should be, but i suppose there is always a chance
05:24:08scorcheunsure about swiss stores though
05:24:13dandersonwell, worst case I guess I'll get a player fully supported by rockbox :P
05:24:25Hillshum:)
05:24:37Lloreandanderson: "Fully" is debatable, there's still some work to be done on USB at least.
05:24:50dandersonok
05:25:08LloreanAnd there's always the option to just work on new features instead of low level stuff.
05:25:32dandersonsure, but I find the low level stuff more fun
05:25:34advcomp2019danderson, how about the sansa view?
05:25:36dandersonI'm sick that way
05:26:23LloreanNothing wrong with that. :0
05:26:29LloreanThat was a )..
05:29:15dandersonok, time for sleep, but I'll be back.
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05:48:40HillshumCan i change the color of the links on the wiki?
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05:51:30LloreanHillshum: They really should be left as per the current theme.
05:51:34LloreanWhy do you want to change them?
05:52:16Hillshumi think it might be from trying ghostzilla, but they are all too light colored to see
05:52:57LloreanThat's probably a problem with your browser.
05:53:11num1Hillshum: %NAVY% content %ENDCOLOR% subtituting navy for your color of choice works
05:53:25num1Hillshum: but in your case I'd recommend using greasemonkey or something
05:55:06num1well, your browser isn't firefox so no greasemonkey, but it sounds like a theme problem rockbox can't fix for ya
05:55:12Hillshumghostzilla is a pain
05:55:23Hillshumi do have firefox
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07:25:28fmlJdGordon: hello. Have you seen my comment about FFDB?
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07:30:07JdGordonfml: (arg)... yes, thanks
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08:29:18tywickraGuys
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08:29:39tywickraDo you have any plans coming up to support ipod classic ?
08:29:50tywickraaka 6th gen ?
08:29:56LinusNtywickra: no plans
08:30:20tywickra:(
08:30:51LinusNif someone does the initial work and decrypts the firmware, there might be a chance, but apparently nobody is working on it
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08:32:33tehpaperany plans for v2 sansas?
08:33:10tywickraLinusN, hmm true .. thanks for this info
08:33:30linuxstbtehpaper: Yes, people are working on them. It's impossible to say when the required breakthroughs will be made though.
08:33:42tehpaperyay
08:33:47tehpaperim happy its in the works
08:34:28tehpaperkinda wish i had known about the e270 va for $25 less before i bought this e260
08:34:41tehpaperv1*
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09:46:30crwlmy sansa e280 doesn't manage to stay in time very well, is there a known problem with it?
09:57:29linuxstbcrwl: I think I remember someone mentioning that problem on the c200 - have you searched the bug tracker?
09:57:56crwlbriefly.. i'll try to do a more thorough search after my morning coffee :)
09:58:24crwli haven't yet examined when and how much the rtc gets behind as i've had this player only for a few days now
10:00
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10:24:31crwlhmh, i couldn't find any bug filed about this
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10:27:54Nico_Phas anyone ever tried using unit testing for rockbox dev?
10:29:02wpyhno
10:29:19*wpyh wonders whether it is easy to do, since rockbox is not modular
10:30:58Nico_Pwpyh: no offence, but that question was really for the people who have a certain experience in the project
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10:31:31Nico_PI was interested in knowing whether it had been attempted in the past, and how successful it was
10:32:44*wpyh doesn't take offense, but he was just commenting ;)
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10:46:22*Nico_P didn't find any reference to attempts to use unit testing in the IRC logs
10:52:56linuxstbNico_P: My memory agrees with the IRC logs.
10:55:05LinusNwe did some unit testing of the FAT driver in the past, but nothing more serious than that
10:55:07Nico_Plinuxstb: can you think of any reason why it wouldn't be a good idea?
10:55:53LinusNi'm inclined to agree with wpyh about the modularity
10:56:25Nico_Pyeah that was my concern, but from what I can see it's fine to write tests for functions
10:56:32linuxstbBut I think working on making Rockbox more modular (i.e. using clearer APIs between different parts) could be benefical.
10:56:47Nico_PI agree
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10:59:09LinusNi believe most of our problems and bugs today would not have been found in unit test anyway
10:59:45MzzHi, the e200 version of rockbox will work under e260R ?
11:00
11:00:15LinusNsince it is often the interaction between the units that is the issue, and very often concurrency related
11:01:09LinusNi think we are better off if we make the simulator behave more like the real target
11:02:00Nico_PLinusN: finding at least some of the bugs is already helpful IMHO. and having a test suite can make some changes easier because you can easily check that you didn't break anything obvious
11:02:58LinusNMzz: yes, http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaE200RInstallation
11:03:18LinusNMzz: as long as it is a v1, of course
11:03:31MzzThanks
11:03:41Mzzi will ask the seller about it
11:03:44LinusNNico_P: yes, test suites are good
11:04:57Nico_PLinusN: have you ever used any of the existing frameworks for unit testing with C?
11:05:09LinusNnope
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11:12:14Nico_Pthere's embedded unit, which seems rather well suited but rather obscure (http://embunit.sourceforge.net/)
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11:15:46JdGordonNico_P: any modules in particular you want to unit test properly?
11:15:56Nico_PJdGordon: mine :)
11:16:11Nico_Pi.e. buffering/playback where possible
11:16:41Nico_PI think having tests on those two would be really helpful
11:16:51JdGordonsure
11:17:26Nico_Pplus, they have a rather well defined API
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11:18:44Nico_PI'll have a go at the idea when I get a chance, to get a sense of the feasibility
11:20:07linuxstbNico_P: Did you ever do anything more with your buffering experiments for low-mem flash targets?
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11:21:34Nico_Plinuxstb: I've been thinking about ways to optimise it while keeping it simple
11:22:24Nico_Pbut I still need to fix the bugs that appear after some time of use (prob. fd leaks)
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11:47:21JdGordonhow does the fontcode know how many bits each glyph uses? I cant figure this out :(
11:55:04LinusNbits, as in width?
11:55:51JdGordonyeah, and the height, although the eight is fixed isnt it?
11:56:07JdGordoneach one is mono so it uses width*height bits doesnt it?
11:57:00LinusNi believe font_get_bits() does that, doesn't it?
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12:01:04JdGordonhmm.. ok, so there is a width table at the end of the .fnt
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12:11:47*BigBambi spots a horrendous typo in rockboxdev.sh! - when you chose which architectures to install for, the all option should now say all four not all three!
12:12:33LinusNa definite showstopper for 3.0! :-)
12:12:41JdGordonok, project closed.... thats the final straw! :p
12:12:49BigBambihehe :)
12:13:16super: D
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13:02:49BigBambiIn actual fact, it shouldn't say all four as selecting all doesn't build for MIPS, it is commented out in the script
13:03:42BigBambiIt's just isn't clear from running the script what all should do - it appears after the four individual options, but only builds three of them
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13:10:47GodEaterBigBambi: that's because Begder was unsure if the MIPS version we'd picked was the right one or not
13:11:11BigBambiaha
13:11:18GodEaterso he left the "mips" install as a very explicit one for people who really knew what they wanted when they were installing it
13:11:26GodEaterrather than just generally including it under all
13:11:31BigBambiThat makes sense why it isn't, but the option all is very unclear now
13:11:38GodEaterI still think we're waiting for a judge's decision on whether it's the right one or not
13:11:40BigBambiIt looks like it should
13:11:48GodEatermcuelenare is still making his mind up
13:12:01BigBambiYeah, it isn't a big deal, it is just a little confusing :)
13:12:11GodEatercorrect
13:12:23GodEaterand it will remain so until we know we've picked the right compiler :D
13:12:43GodEaterit's in the IRC logs somewhere, Bagder said all this when he added the option in the first place
13:13:08BigBambiYeah, I guess what would be clear would be to move all above mips and have it say install the three above
13:13:14BigBambiProbably isn't worth it though
13:13:36BigBambiIt's is just a little test for everyone when they come to use rockbosdev.sh
13:13:44BigBambi-is
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13:16:55GodEaterfeel free to submit a patch etc. etc.
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13:20:44BigBambiGodEater: As I say, I doubt it is worth it
13:20:57BigBambiIt is just changing the order of two options
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13:21:48GodEaterjust a few minutes ago it was "a horrendous typo" :)
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13:22:21BigBambiThat was sarcasm, as evidenced by the exclamation marks :)
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13:26:18MarfuggaMy ipod video 5.5g has a half cracked display. Does rockbox have a function with which i can resize the screen so the screen gets scaled and appears only on the left half of my display? (the part that's not cracked)?
13:26:54Nico_PMarfugga: you'd need to build your own version
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13:28:18*BigBambi decides to submit one anyway, it is confusing :)
13:28:36MarfuggaIs the source commented enough for me to see what I have to change? I'm assuming i'd only have to change some number that corresponds to the horizontal part of the resolution, to make it half of what it is?
13:29:43Nico_PMarfugga: you need to change LCD_WIDTH and LCD_HEIGHT, in firmware/config-ipodvideo.h
13:30:08MarfuggaGreat thanks a lot Nico_P
13:30:17Nico_Pmaybe some other things are needed, but that might be enough
13:31:21Nico_PI've never tried it, so you might have to figure some things out or ask more questions to people who know better than me
13:32:11MarfuggaYeah i'm reading right now how to build it, i.e. what compiler and what header files and stuff. thanks
13:32:21GodEateror just look for a replacement screen on ebay =/
13:33:57Marfuggai don't realy use my ipod for videos or pictures, i just need something to listen to, and it's cracked on the left side so it's hard to see what music i'm scrolling through
13:34:15Marfuggabut yeah i might get a replacement screen if all else fails
13:37:29linuxstbMarfugga: Maybe the easiest would be to test the "custom list viewport" patch that is being developed. This will let you tell Rockbox to just use part of the screen for showing lists. But it means compiling Rockbox from source yourself, and apply the patch to the source code - http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8799
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13:43:45Nico_Plinuxstb: will changing LCD_WIDTH and LCD_HEIGHT make rockbox use only part of the screen, or can you think of issues I'm overlooking?
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13:44:35linuxstbIt will cause problems with the bitmap build system - the selected bitmaps are based on LCD width/height.
13:44:53linuxstbPlus WPSs will no longer work if they use a backdrop.
13:44:54Nico_Pah, crap
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13:45:43linuxstbUnless you choose the LCD size of another target's LCD.... But even then, you may need to modify the LCD driver to update the screen correctly.
13:46:04linuxstbSo I think the viewports option is easiest.
13:46:40Marfuggai'll try that then, so it lets you choose where on the screen to display the lists for browsin?
13:47:21Nico_Pthe sansa e200's LCD size would fit nicely
13:47:23linuxstbYes. But it's still an "in-progress" feature, and I've no idea how well it's working.
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14:39:06LambdaCalculus37rasher: Here?
14:39:30rasherLambdaCalculus37: more or less
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14:40:40LambdaCalculus37rasher: My girlfriend was wondering if she could be named the official maintainer of the tagalog language file, since she's pretty much doing the entire translation herself.
14:41:19rasherI don't see any problems in that - I can't commit anything right now though
14:42:56LambdaCalculus37No problem.
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14:48:33amaXxHello ppl, i need help with rockbox on ipod nano 3rd gen, anyone can help?
14:49:04LambdaCalculus37Yes.
14:49:08LambdaCalculus37You can't run Rockbox on it.
14:49:15amaXxwhy :O
14:49:24LambdaCalculus37Because there's no port for it?
14:49:31LambdaCalculus37And no one is working on one?
14:49:59LambdaCalculus37And it's also clearly listed on the front page that the 2nd and 3rd gen nano are not supported.
14:50:17amaXxomg
14:50:21amaXxthats so sad :S
14:50:58amaXxbut isnt this "iPod 3rd gen" at your site my iPod nano 3rd gen ?
14:51:13LambdaCalculus37No, that's the original iPod 3rd gen.
14:51:25amaXxdamn, i though it was mine
14:51:32LambdaCalculus37It looks like this: http://www.rockbox.org/playerpics/ipod3g-small.png
14:51:33amaXxoke thanks for information =)
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14:51:52amaXxoke
14:52:09amaXxbut is there any other OS for my iPod linux or smth? do you know?
14:52:23LambdaCalculus37No.
14:52:48LambdaCalculus37The firmware is encrypted, and no one has figured out how to run custom code on it.
14:52:56amaXxOke then i was stupid that i bought it -.-
14:52:59amaXxi see..
14:53:05amaXxapple gays :/
14:53:33LambdaCalculus37All complaints go to Apple, not us. We didn't build it.
14:53:40LambdaCalculus37Go on eBay and get a compatible device.
14:54:13amaXxyeye :D oke cu l8r guys i hope u make history one day and decrypt that fw
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15:14:28LambdaCalculus37logbot explain ipod
15:15:05#>>"explain beer" by petur (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
15:15:32mazlingbeer plz :E
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15:27:45superi just got a graphic bug on my ipod
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15:35:30xqtftqxwhats the bug?
15:36:09mcuelenaerexqtftqx: you asked for me some time ago I read in the logs; what was that about?
15:36:32xqtftqxhuh? what did i ask for?
15:36:44mcuelenaereI don't remember, let me see
15:36:47xqtftqxok
15:37:27mcuelenaerehttp://www.rockbox.org/irc/log-20080724#18:07:09
15:38:19xqtftqxoh yeah, i was wondering how you ported the sendfirm tool
15:38:58xqtftqxi realy cant talk now, im getting ready to get on a plane
15:39:02xqtftqxgot to go
15:39:08superhm
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15:39:16superhafl the screen is messed up
15:39:32supergonna try reinstalling
15:39:34linuxstbWhich ipod is it?
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15:48:33mcuelenaerehow does one make a dual boot gigabeat s rockbox bootloader? is there a wiki page for this?
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15:49:33toffe82mcuelenaere: there is awiki, but you need the OF first
15:49:46mcuelenaeretoffe82: what wiki page?
15:50:32dandersonscorche: ping
15:50:33toffe82http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GigabeatSInstallation
15:50:55mcuelenaeretoffe82: you mean step 1b?
15:51:36linuxstbmcuelenaere: I think it's on GigabeatSPort
15:51:41toffe82mcuelenaere: yes , but there is nothing :)
15:51:55linuxstbOr maybe GigabeatSInfo...
15:52:11toffe82you have to use mknkboot
15:52:16mcuelenaereI checked all three briefly but couldn't find anything
15:52:44toffe82mknkboot <firmware file> <boot file> <output file>
15:53:09LambdaCalculus37Then use sendfirm to send it to the Gigabeat.
15:53:12toffe82firmware is the OF , boot file is the rockbox boot and output is the nk.bin
15:53:20mcuelenaereand then you have a dual boot fw file?
15:53:23mcuelenaerenk.bin file*
15:53:26toffe82yes
15:53:31mcuelenaereok thanks
15:53:42supernano
15:53:44super1g
15:53:47LambdaCalculus37mcuelenaere: To access the OF on the beast, click hold on when you turn it on.
15:53:52mcuelenaereis this step integrated into rbutil?
15:54:03LambdaCalculus37I don't think it is.
15:54:03mcuelenaereLambdaCalculus37: I don't have a gigabeat
15:54:10linuxstbmcuelenaere: No, because it needs a copy of the original firmware, which isn't distributable...
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15:54:22mcuelenaereok
15:54:23LambdaCalculus37mcuelenaere: For a second there, I thought you did. :)
15:54:39mcuelenaere:) I'm just gathering information for the ZVM how others do this
15:54:43mcuelenaereI have a similar problem
15:55:09linuxstbBut I guess it will be just the same as the iriver (h100/h300) bootloaders - which require patching an OF that the user provides.
15:55:23mcuelenaeremkboot.c is for that purpose?
15:55:41linuxstbYes, I think that's the iriver version.
15:55:49LambdaCalculus37linuxstb: I think that would work best. Users can point rbutil to the OF file, and have it do the patching.
15:56:01mcuelenaereok and that step also isn't integrated somewhere else? (rockbox compilation, rbutil,..)
15:56:13JdGordonor rbutil could download it automatically
15:56:29linuxstbJdGordon: Download what, from where?
15:56:38mcuelenaereah I just see there are rbutil defines in mkboot.c
15:56:54JdGordonthe OF
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15:58:37linuxstbJdGordon: The only way to get the OF for the S is by physically removing the hard disk from the device and copying it. Toshiba don't distribute it.
15:58:51JdGordonah, ok
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15:59:25JdGordondo you have to remove the drive to install rockbox?
16:00
16:00:04LambdaCalculus37No, that's the ZVM that you need to do that on.
16:00:27LambdaCalculus37You'll just need to remove the drive to get at the firmware partition on the beast's drive.
16:00:37Nico_Pmcuelenaere: have you found anything on the exotic ZVM FS?
16:00:56mcuelenaereNico_P: I hope with the help of quetzalcoatl this problem will be solved soon
16:01:07JdGordondoes rockbox have access to the OF on the disk? could a plugin be made to fix it to be able to dual boot?
16:01:31mcuelenaereJdGordon: are talking about the ZVM or the Gigabeat?
16:01:47JdGordonbeast
16:01:49LambdaCalculus37mcuelenaere: You pray to Aztec gods now? ;)
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16:02:20mcuelenaereLambdaCalculus37: :) no, it's the person who did all the hdd reverse engineering at nomadness back in the nomad days
16:02:33LambdaCalculus37JdGordon: No, but with the USB stack in Rockbox, you can see both partitions mount when you attach it to a PC.
16:03:00LambdaCalculus37mcuelenaere: :) I know, I saw him on the forums. I was just joking around, as always. ;)
16:03:20Nico_Pmcuelenaere: you managed to contact him?
16:03:21LambdaCalculus37Maybe some of this info should be useful for the Dell DJ.
16:03:25mcuelenaereNico_P: yes, finally ..
16:03:33Nico_Poh, /me should read the forums\
16:03:34LambdaCalculus37*Speaking* of which... I need a new one.
16:03:39mcuelenaereat some point I found him on a wikipedia page :S
16:04:00mcuelenaereI recall myself searching all over the internet for this guy
16:04:05mcuelenaerethe only thing I had was his IP address
16:04:21mcuelenaereI even spammed his server with something like http://IP/PLEASE/CONTACT/ME/AT/MCUELENAERE/AT/GMAIL/DOT/COM/
16:04:26Nico_Phow did you find him on wikipedia? with his IP?
16:04:33mcuelenaereno, just by accident
16:04:40jac0b|won the gigabeat S install wiki page it says "TODO: How can a user uninstall Rockbox? We need a source for the original nk.bin..." I think I found a original nk.bin
16:04:47Nico_Phow did you get his IP btw?
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16:04:51mcuelenaereNico_P: I looked at the zen vision page and saw something about zenrecovery
16:04:57mcuelenaereit was in the nomadness posts
16:05:00linuxstbjac0b|w: Are you legally allow to distribute it?
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16:05:14mcuelenaereNico_P: and at that zenrecovery page his email address was..
16:05:17jac0b|wumm I dunno can I
16:05:28LambdaCalculus37I don't think you can, nor should you risk it.
16:05:43LambdaCalculus37If you have it, great. But you'll have to keep it to yourself.
16:05:44jac0b|wcheck this out http://www.aibohack.com/giga/
16:06:07jac0b|wthis person has a recovery tool
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16:06:18mcuelenaerehmm it seems my ZVM choked on this 2GB CF card :S
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16:07:11kugelhi guys
16:08:32kugelSlasheri: Could http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7287 cause database instabilities? Like songs that dissapear randomly from the database
16:09:31toffe82jac0b|w: he is the one eho make the por of rockbox on the S possible, he found the the way to bypass the security
16:10:02jac0b|woh ok I didn't know that
16:11:08linuxstbtoffe82: Did he also try to hack the Zune, or was that other people?
16:12:30toffe82linuxstb: he was looking for the zune first and as it was the same hardware as the S , he tried on the S also but no success on the zune
16:12:33Nico_Plinuxstb: he was mainly interested in hacking the zune
16:17:42dandersonhmm, looks like the sansa v2 work is already quite advanced.
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16:51:16scorche|shdanderson: disappointed? ;)
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16:53:48saratogaI think the V2 is probably the most reverse engineered target to have no rockbox code written
16:57:22funmanJust preparing for the best port ever \o/
16:57:43funmansaratoga: next step is reading from the buttons
17:00
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17:07:19GodEaterre: the OF for the beast
17:07:35GodEaterwasn't the Gigabeat V updater freely available from Toshiba ?
17:10:19*GodEater settles in to watch the tumbleweed
17:10:39GodEaterhttp://www.gigabeat.net/mobileav/download/module/gbv_update_1_5_jp.exe <−− looks like it's *still* freely available
17:11:43saratogafunman: shame you guys are having so much trouble with recovery modes on that thing
17:12:34funmanMaybe it was cheaper to not put one
17:12:49 Quit Marfugga ()
17:13:22funmanI don't know what additional hardware/software it requires for (normal way)engineering it
17:13:52 Quit Bensawsome (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:15:34linuxstbGodEater: Yes, but that's the "V" updater...
17:15:46dandersonscorche|sh: well, yeah. All the fun work appears to be over :(
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17:17:46GodEaterlinuxstb: yes, but wasn't it possible to "hack" the updater to make it work on the S ?
17:18:11linuxstbIIRC, that involved using the V updater to transfer an modified "S" firmware.
17:18:26linuxstbBasically what sendfirm does.
17:18:39GodEaterah
17:19:10GodEaterso no-one ever tried running the V firmware contained in the updater on the S then ?
17:20:15linuxstbI never heard anyone mention it
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17:20:52*GodEater goes over the old S30 thread
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17:27:31MarfuggaI'm trying to add this patch: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8799 using the instructions here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SimpleGuideToCompiling and cygwin just hangs
17:27:48linuxstbMarfugga: What's the exact command you're typing in cygwin?
17:27:55Marfuggaand I see patch.exe in the background using 0% cpu
17:28:03linuxstbI expect you forgot the "<"
17:28:41MarfuggaYeah i did, sorry.. thanks for the blazing fast reply :)
17:29:03linuxstbInvoice is in the post...
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17:54:02MarfuggaIf a patch fails with HUNK errors do I have to find the old revision that the patch was originally made for?
17:56:08domonokyMarfugga: either try to fix the failed hunks or patch agains the old revision that the patch was made for.. (but then you have a old version of rockbox)...
17:56:09GodEateror rewrite the patch to work with the current revision
17:57:52linuxstbMarfugga: Which version of the patch are you trying?
17:58:52Marfuggahttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8799 The one highlighted at the end of the original post
17:59:24MarfuggaIt reads (Revision 16791) after each file name when I open the patch file with a text editor
18:00
18:00:12linuxstbThat's very old - you should scroll down through the comments and use the latest. There are two different versions though - kugel's and jdGordon's, so take your pick...
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18:08:35kugelMarfugga: Take mine, jdgordons only implemented menus (not filetree) yet
18:08:45wpyhmcuelenaere: is there any way to restore the onda players with usbtool?
18:08:57mcuelenaere_wpyh: yes
18:09:19mcuelenaere_what you did yesterday is exactly the same as what the recovery program does
18:09:50mcuelenaere_wpyh: is your vx767 still broken?
18:10:15wpyhyesterday I have my sister's windows laptop to restore
18:10:48wpyhtoday, I didn't recompile the usbtool (so it's still the old usbtool which sends 10.bin), and when I ran it, my flash got erased again
18:11:02mcuelenaere_:P
18:11:13wpyhand now when I've recompiled usbtool, I can't get it to restore the player... weird
18:11:24mcuelenaere_that's because it loads onda.bin now
18:11:35wpyhhm...
18:11:36kugelMarfugga: Just put "list viewport: -,160,-,-,-,-,-" into your config, this will make the list and filetree take the right half of the screen. I also recommend removing the changes to wps/WPSLIST in the patch file, so that the themes will not reset the custom list
18:11:53mcuelenaere_wpyh: if you reset the player and hold down VOL UP, doesn't it boot into UMS?
18:11:58mcuelenaere_now that your flash is reset
18:12:03mcuelenaere_erased*
18:12:39wpyhmcuelenaere: hm... let me try that. I think I hadn't fully understood the recovery procedure :p
18:12:51mcuelenaere_:)
18:16:23wpyhhm... after formatting the disk and copying the firmware into it, I should reset the player while holding VOL DOWN, right?
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18:20:43wpyhmcuelenaere: nothing happens, the lcd is still garbled and the firmware is still not restored
18:21:35funmantest.S:7: Error: register or shift expression expected −− `cmp r1,0x75007300'
18:22:11mcuelenaere_wpyh: you say the lcd is garbled? is this also when you reset the player and hold VOL DOWN? or when you just reset the player?
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18:22:37wpyhthe lcd is garbled both when I reset the player, and when I hold VOL DOWN while resetting the player
18:23:20mcuelenaere_that means the recovery program changes the onda bootloader..
18:23:34mcuelenaere_or it flashes some program to the nand flash
18:23:55mcuelenaere_weird
18:24:02mcuelenaere_but you can get into USB UMS mode?
18:24:23wpyhhm...
18:24:43wpyhyes, I can get into UMS mode if I hold VOL DOWN and reset, then connect the player to my laptop
18:25:10wpyhotherwise, I get a huge UMS device: 4294967296 512-byte hardware sectors (2199023 MB)
18:25:22wpyhwhich doesn't have anything inside it (all zeros)
18:25:29funmanif i load my value in r2 I can compare 2 registers
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18:25:56funmancould I do any trouble writing in r2 ?
18:26:33funman"argument, temporary register" looks fine
18:26:34mcuelenaere_wpyh: yes that's rather strange, if you don't hold VOL DOWN you get some sort of unknown UMS device
18:26:39mcuelenaere_haven't looked into that one yet
18:27:12mcuelenaere_just reformat it and put sg301.hxf in (or vx767.hxf; dunno what's the case on your device) and reset + VOL DOWN
18:27:19wpyhwell, I think it probably exposes the whole nand
18:27:24linuxstbfunman: What are you doing? Are you playing with the utils/AMS/hacking/ code ?
18:27:52funmanyes
18:27:56mcuelenaere_wpyh: you think so? the whole nand isn't that big though
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18:28:19funmanI want to check the memory for a magic string and depending on the result, wait 5s, or not
18:28:21mcuelenaere_if it would be true, it could make life easier :)
18:28:29wpyhmcuelenaere: I think I missed the earlier lines... there are READ_CAPACITY errors there
18:28:48funmanI was looking for "be" but I think I have to use cmn and bne ?
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18:30:23wpyhmcuelenaere: here http://pastebin.ca/1088599
18:30:25funmanlinuxstb: http://pastebin.org/60462
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18:31:16TheLordOfSpadeshi there!
18:31:19TheLordOfSpadeshow can I see albumarts with RB on my IpodVideo?
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18:32:02mcuelenaere_wpyh: could you do a disk readout of the first 1024 bytes?
18:32:39linuxstbfunman: I wrote that code, but have now forgotten it... But if I was you, I would look at the start of the OF to see if there are any registers the OF reads values from.
18:32:58funmanthere are a lot
18:33:20funmanI just want to make sure that we can address memory beyond the firmware block
18:34:04linuxstbThe OF reads from a lot of registers at startup?
18:34:16BigBambiTheLordOfSpades: www.rockbox.org/wiki/AlbumArt
18:34:24funmanhm sorry I misunderstood
18:35:06funmanstrcc r2, [r3], #4
18:35:13funmanthe first register is the destination isn't it ?
18:35:21TheLordOfSpadesthank you BigBambi
18:36:08BigBambino probs
18:37:15linuxstbfunman: No, r2 is the value to be stored.
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18:37:57wpyhwith the erroneously big disk?
18:37:58wpyhhm...
18:38:02wpyhjust now I renamed the VX767.HXF to SG301.HXF, and then now I can't get it into UMS mode anymore...
18:38:27mcuelenaere_wpyh: how so? you renamed it and didn't do anything to the device itself?
18:38:28funmanlinuxstb: I missed mov r2,#0 2 lines above.. so I can safely use r2
18:38:42funmanthanks for the hint
18:38:59wpyhuh, I mean, I renamed it and then held VOL_DOWN while resetting
18:38:59wpyh:p
18:39:02funmanwith my poor assembly skills I say the firmware reads from no registers at init
18:39:26linuxstbfunman: I wouldn't expect it to, but it doesn't hurt to check...
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18:40:04mcuelenaere_wpyh: you didn't even umount the drive?
18:40:27mcuelenaere_that could be bad for your filesystem as some data could still be in some cache
18:41:02wpyhmcuelenaere: I did unmount it...
18:41:11wpyhthis thing is getting weirder and weirder...
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18:42:17wpyhshould we look at the bin files first?
18:43:05mcuelenaere_wpyh: try again from the start (ie formatting)
18:43:40mcuelenaere_the only difference between the vx747 and the vx767 is the LCD + TV OUT so USB and NAND access should be working
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18:44:52funmanyes I can read the whole firmware
18:45:00funman(whole) I must check reading the last 4 bytes
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18:46:35funmanhum but since the checksum changes when I change the code I have to calculate it properly ..
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18:46:45LambdaCalculus37domonoky: Here?
18:47:00*domonoky waves.. :-)
18:47:12*LambdaCalculus37 waves back :)
18:48:22LambdaCalculus37domonoky: Question: Regarding the "How to Translate" section of the RButil dev page: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/RockboxUtilityDevelopment#How_to_Translate, do I need to have Qt compiled and installed before I attempt to run the lupdate and linguist commands?
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18:49:19LambdaCalculus37When I tried this on my Mac, it doesn't recognize the commands, and even adding ./ before them doesn't help.
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18:50:00domonokyyou need at least lupdate and linguist (they re Qt helper tools) there maybe prebuilt ones avialable
18:50:18domonokys/they re/ they are/ :-)
18:50:22LambdaCalculus37domonoky: Ah, I thought so. :)
18:50:42LambdaCalculus37I need to clear some space for the compile process, then.
18:50:59domonokyand if you want to test the translation, you also need lrelease..
18:51:12LambdaCalculus37Also a Qt helper tool?
18:51:23domonokyyes, all included in Qt..
18:52:20LambdaCalculus37domonoky: OT... How much free space should I have to compile Qt? I have 3.82GB originally, and the compile process chewed it up like it was popcorn.
18:52:33domonokytheoretically you can edit translations by hand (they are xml). :-)
18:52:55domonokyis there no Qt binary release for Mac available ?
18:53:06wpyhI've extracted all the BIN resources from the firmware writer
18:53:20wpyhthere are 7 bin files. the first one is an inf file, the second one is a windows program, and the others are to be sent to the device. this is true for both the vx747 and vx76 writer programs
18:53:21wpyhfor the vx747 (since you're familiar with it), the 3rd bin resource is sent as 1.bin
18:53:27wpyhthe 4th bin resource is sent as 3.bin, the 7th bin resource as 5.bin, the 5th bin resource as 7.bin, and the 6th bin resource as 10.bin
18:53:36LambdaCalculus37domonoky: There is, but I wanted to compile from source for optimization.
18:53:38wpyh2.bin is 0x00 as a LE 32-bit int, 6.bin is 0x01 as a LE 32-bit int, 8.bin is also 0x01 as a LE 32-bit int, 9.bin is a single byte 0x01
18:53:43wpyhthe interesting part is 4.bin: it seems to be two int values
18:53:45wpyhthe first one I don't know, the second one is the length of 3.bin
18:54:00funmanshould I understand LDR (load word) in the sense 16 bits or 32 bits ?
18:54:07wpyhmcuelenaere: I think the network is too slow here...
18:54:19 Quit petur ("*plop*")
18:54:50*domonoky checks the size of his Qt dir.. :-)
18:55:07mcuelenaere_wpyh: I receive you
18:55:24kugelprobably not as large as a linux kernel source after compilation
18:55:40wpyhmcuelenaere: I'm receiving the messages after a long delay :(
18:55:50pixelmaLambdaCalculus37: did you see my questions about the committed part of the japanese language update in the logs yesterday?
18:55:57mcuelenaere_wpyh: what happens if you upload the vx767 files?
18:56:09domonokymcuelenaere_: my Qt 4.40 dir is 3,53g big, but it may need more temporary while compiling..
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18:56:23wpyhmcuelenaere: which one?
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18:56:56LambdaCalculus37pixelma: Yes, rasher and I already spoke about that.
18:57:05mcuelenaeredomonoky: ?
18:57:15LambdaCalculus37I'll edit the patch next time to take out untranslated strings.
18:57:29mcuelenaerewpyh: rename the files as 1.bin 2.bin etc and run usbtool 6 on them
18:57:37domonokyup it was for LambdaCalculus37 :-)
18:57:43mcuelenaerek :)
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18:58:04pixelmaLambdaCalculus37: it was not about untranslated strings (if I understand correctly), unfortunately I'm not sure
18:58:15domonokyfunman: ldr is "load register" so it should be 32bit i think..
18:58:32kugeldomonoky: well, even bigger than the linux kernel. I'm impressed
18:58:39LambdaCalculus37pixelma: I think it's rasher's page that's spitting out the patches like that.
18:58:55pixelmathat answer confuses me
18:59:21LambdaCalculus37pixelma: This: rasher.dk/rockbox/translate/">http://rasher.dk/rockbox/translate/
18:59:50pixelmaI know about the toll but I'm not sure we are talking about the same things
18:59:59pixelmas/toll/tool
19:00
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19:00:21*LambdaCalculus37 adjusts his wavelength a little bit so as to not further confuse people ;)
19:01:34domonokykugel: well, Qt 4.4 now contains many big subsystems, like Webkit and Phonon, etc, and all multiplatform, so this eats the space :-)
19:01:46funmandomonoky: thanks
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19:02:43pixelmaLambdaCalculus37: I just looked at the diff of yesterday's commit with ViewVC and noticed two things that look suspicious - "button light timeout" string was emptied (l. 3842 and 3847) and the accessory power supply (last change)
19:02:47kugeldomonoky: Good to know, I already ran out of space once while compiling the kernel (which is about 3GB).
19:03:07wpyhmcuelenaere: what should I send as onda.bin?
19:03:35mcuelenaerewpyh: 10.bin
19:03:40wpyhok
19:04:33LambdaCalculus37pixelma: I noticed that, too. But what's strange is that rasher's site listed that string as untranslated and empty.
19:04:47LambdaCalculus37I didn't know it was translated to begin with.
19:06:04LambdaCalculus37All I had done was the addition of the button strings. I didn't touch any other strings.
19:06:29wpyhmcuelenaere: nothing happens
19:06:54mcuelenaerewpyh: you're sure all the files are according to the vx747 extracted ones?
19:07:10wpyhyes
19:07:31pixelmaLambdaCalculus37: ah ok. But what happens next?
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19:08:48rh387I know that the ipodlinux loader is not supported, but does anyone have a mirror where i can find it with the ipodlinux site being down
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19:10:24wpyhhm...
19:10:35wpyhmcuelenaere: I get some warnings
19:11:17mcuelenaerewpyh: like?
19:11:18wpyhhm... the warning was "[WARN] Sent data isn't the same as received data..." for 1.bin, but it only appears sometimes
19:11:33mcuelenaerebut nothing comes up on the device itself?
19:12:02mcuelenaereif you get a change to get a windows pc, you should try logging what the original program does
19:12:06mcuelenaere(through an usb logger)
19:12:43rasherpixelma: I think what happened was that the source changed from including only *, to including * and a target, where * was empty
19:13:03rasherpixelma: so my tool didn't really have any other option but to empty * and create a new (empty) string for the target
19:14:32wpyhyeah, nothing comes up
19:14:36wpyhmcuelenaere: would you recommend some free usb logger?
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19:15:03mcuelenaerewpyh: yes, device monitoring studio; it is shareware though
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19:15:26mcuelenaerewpyh: now for you to recover your device :)
19:15:40rasherpixelma: I'm not even sure the string was getting included previously (though it might have been, I guess)
19:15:45funmandid you see my joy before my connection was cut ? ;)
19:15:59mcuelenaerewpyh: I would recommend rerunning the vx747 files (rename 10.bin to onda.bin) and do the recovery procedure (again)
19:17:12wpyhhmm... I'm currently using the vx767 files..
19:17:32mcuelenaereand does that work?
19:17:33wpyhweird
19:17:36 Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection)
19:17:41wpyhno, the vx767 files don't work
19:17:50wpyhand the weird thing is, now I get a 65 MB device
19:17:54mcuelenaere:)
19:17:59 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC")
19:18:07mcuelenaereand does holding VOL DOWN work?
19:18:18wpyhnot tried that yet
19:19:16wpyhI've tried reading the first 1024 bytes of the 65 MB device, and it's just "SFHI" then 0x00 0xfs 0x01 0x00 0x04 0x00 0x00 0x00 followed by 0xff's
19:19:22wpyhdo you recognize that string?
19:19:28funmanHFS ?
19:19:52wpyhfunman: hm... not likely :p
19:20:23mcuelenaeresfhi does ring a bell
19:20:30mcuelenaereihfs
19:20:33mcuelenaerereversed
19:20:49mcuelenaeresome strings in the OF can be found containing that
19:20:52mcuelenaereeg ihfs_seek
19:21:00mcuelenaereso it's the filesystem
19:21:15mcuelenaerenice :)
19:21:16funmantest.S.
19:21:17funmanYou cannot upload that type of file. The only allowed extensions are txt,pdf,jpg,gif,png,c,h,doc,bin,cfg.
19:21:22wpyhhm...
19:21:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:21:24mcuelenaerewpyh: could you do a full dump?
19:21:27funman:/
19:21:27mcuelenaereand upload it somewhere
19:21:28Marfuggawhich is the default theme for rockbox? i'm trying to figure out which config file to edit to change the dimensions of the list
19:21:58pixelmarasher: in case of the button light time out I can see the string on my c200 with a slightly older build
19:22:06rashermcuelenaere: http://www.cs.adelaide.edu.au/users/fred/projects/ihfs/ ?
19:22:20pixelmaat least it looks similar enough...
19:23:00mcuelenaererasher: I found that page too some time agoo, didn't look into it though
19:23:14mcuelenaeredo you think it could be used as a NAND flash wearing structure thing?
19:23:20mcuelenaerelike yaffs2
19:23:24funmanthe forum offers file to be downloaded only as binary mime type :/
19:23:37SoapI want to start separating the wheat from the chaff in the wiki WPS galleries today.
19:23:49wpyhmcuelenaere: any idea, where to upload?
19:23:50rashermcuelenaere: seems a bit weird. As far as I can tell it's an experimental thing
19:23:54mcuelenaerewpyh: could you ask your Ingenic friend about ihfs ?
19:23:55 Quit Zom (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:24:06mcuelenaerewpyh: mediafire.com ?
19:24:17mcuelenaerezip it first
19:24:48wpyhmcuelenaere: ok, I'll try
19:24:58SoapI was thinking there were two ways to do this. One was to split every gallery into two sections - "Freely Licensed" and "Unlicensed". The other way would be to pull all the unlicensed WPSs into one new gallery page of "AbandonedWpss"
19:25:15rasherSoap: I like the latter
19:25:49SoapOn my second pass through the galleries I plan on fixing as many of the "Freely Licensed" WPSs as possible.
19:25:54wpyhhm... seems like mediafire is blocked here
19:26:28*wpyh is looking at a ton of "0xdeadface" values in the full dump
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19:26:44SoapAlso putting a disclaimer on the galleries, that from this day forward all submitted WPSs MUST meet the "Soap Seal of Approval" guidelines.
19:26:51funmanhm ..
19:27:09scorche|shor just nudge linuxstb a bit harder... >_>
19:27:13SoapWhich is something I think we (as a community) should debate (and hopefully agree on)
19:27:14funmanif I read from an uninitialized register, how much chance do I have to get random data ? (i.e. one time 0, one time 1)
19:27:15wpyhmcuelenaere: any other good file sharing sites?
19:27:34Soapscorche|sh, 1 - the WPS situation is _currently_ out of hand.
19:27:56*funman feels sorry for disturbing any political debate
19:28:03Soapscorche|sh, 2 - The separation of freely licensed from non needs done before transition to new gallery regardless.
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19:28:35Soap3 - The culling of broken WPSs needs done before transition to the new gallery regardless.
19:28:39mcuelenaerewpyh: rapidshare.com?
19:28:51mcuelenaerewpyh: where are you located currently?
19:28:57SoapI do not think there is a single step I plan on doing which does not need to be done anyway as part of the transition.
19:29:07wpyhmcuelenaere: I'm in singapore right now
19:29:10 Quit Marfugga ()
19:30:32mcuelenaerewpyh: does your IRC client support DCC?
19:30:48SoapThe main questions I have are:
19:31:06wpyhmcuelenaere: I'm not sure
19:31:14Soap1 - Does the community agree on enforcing http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SoapSealofApproval as the WPS standards?
19:31:23mcuelenaerewpyh: what client do you have?
19:31:36wpyhI'm using pidgin
19:31:45wpyhbut hey, I think I'll just uuencode and post on pastebin
19:31:46rasherSoap: iirc, I agree. But I don't think it should be called that..
19:31:46wpyh;)
19:31:47Soap2 - Does the community agree on scraping the unlicensed WPSs to their own page (organized by device/resolution)
19:31:58mcuelenaerewpyh: good enough for me :)
19:32:03Soaprasher, yea - that was just the working title.
19:32:13mcuelenaerebe warned though that the site could just give a php memory error
19:32:40rasherJust call them "Theme guidelines" or something. And mention that "Themes must follow the theme guidelines"
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19:34:53wpyhmcuelenaere: should be small...
19:34:54LambdaCalculus37I think we should label themes that don't work with current builds as such.
19:36:54*domonoky is for this Theme cleanup, so Soap go for it.. :-) if you want a definite answer, you could ask the newly formed RSB :-)
19:36:55 Quit vcf (Client Quit)
19:37:09rasherThemes should either be "Abandoned+unlicensed" or "Properly licensed and fixed to work with current build"
19:37:26LambdaCalculus37rasher: Agreed.
19:37:37rasherWhich is part of Soap's plan, as far as I can tell
19:38:24SoapLambdaCalculus37, my thoughts were to move all the trash^H^H^H^H^H unlicensed themes out of the way, then verify theme packaging (proper .zip structure, proper license notice, etc) THEN fix broken ones.
19:39:19wpyhmcuelenaere: http://pastebin.org/60615
19:39:26Soapinsert step 2 = Notification on all gallery pages than as of today no unlicensed and improperly packaged themes will be allowed. All new themes must be proper or will be deleted.
19:39:30 Quit XavierGr ()
19:39:53pixelmacan one move WPSs/themes over after fixing, giving a proper license and packaging correctly?
19:40:17pixelmafrom "trash" to the gallery I mean
19:40:19SoapI am not sure I follow the question pixelma.
19:40:35SoapI wasn't planning on moving broken themes, just unlicensed themes.
19:41:05 Quit nuonguy ("This computer has gone to sleep")
19:41:06Soapthe galleries will spend some time with broken themes on them until I (or others) get around to fixing the ones we have the rights to fix.
19:41:14pixelmajust thinking of my few Archos themes and would need to fix them (and I don't remember stating a license back then)
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19:41:36rasherpixelma: Then they're unlicensed and would be omved to the graveyard
19:41:39Soapsure - I have no problem with people moving themes back out of the unlicensed page.
19:41:51rasherOh, like that!
19:42:10 Quit desowin (Excess Flood)
19:42:26SoapIt would be great (ps - good name for the wiki page rasher "WpsGraveyard") if people would license their themes and move them back.
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19:43:06LambdaCalculus37Soap: In other words... "raising the dead"? ;)
19:43:45 Quit mf0102 (Remote closed the connection)
19:43:55SoapI'm going to go take a bikeride - be back later and will read any discussion since then.
19:43:59Soapin summary I want to:
19:44:13Soap1 - Move all unlicensed themes to new gallery.
19:44:42pixelmaok, I will give them a license, need to read up on that a bit. I see lots of creative commons share alike, is that the recommended one? Pros and cons?
19:44:53Soap2 - Insert disclaimer on all current galleries than a permissive license is required of all themes from this day forward.
19:45:14 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Remote closed the connection)
19:45:30LambdaCalculus37pixelma: Everyone seems to be using this CC license, specifically: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/3.0/
19:45:32Soap3 - Start verifying theme structure and packaging (including license in .wps and .cfg files as well as contact info)
19:45:39LambdaCalculus37That may be the best one.
19:45:42rasherLambdaCalculus37: Err.. we DONT want by-nc-sa
19:45:47Soap4 - THEN start fixing themes.
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19:46:07funmanlinuxstb: do you remember if the size of your firmware file had increased when you tested mkamsboot ?
19:46:14*LambdaCalculus37 shrugs
19:46:17scorche|shLambdaCalculus37: cc-by-sa
19:46:23rasherWe should require GPL or by-sa imho. Practically say the same
19:46:27BigBambiSoap: Sounds a good plan - if you want help let me know and we can split up galleries
19:46:37LambdaCalculus37Dunno why people are using it, but meh...
19:46:53rasherLambdaCalculus37: Because they're afraid some evil coorporation will profit from their work
19:47:00SoapBigBambi, will be hard to split the initial task as I will be cutting and pasting from one page into another. After step one the work is easily divisible.
19:47:09BigBambiWell, as and when
19:47:38LambdaCalculus37rasher: Ahh.
19:47:49*LambdaCalculus37 goes to read up on CC licensing some more
19:47:51rasherThe -nc is the problem, and not really compatible (in spirit) with the GPL
19:49:08LambdaCalculus37rasher: Is this a better license, then? http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0/
19:49:11Soapwell, we NEED redistribution and NEED modification rights (on the .wps files, not the images) and WANT modification rights on the images and WANT no stupid non-commercial restriction, right?
19:49:28BigBambiI think it should be allowed for the theme site though, but not for themes that want to be included
19:49:44rasherLambdaCalculus37: That's the one that's basically the same as the GPL
19:50:00BigBambiIdeally it wouldn't have -nc, but if people want it, I wouldn't ban it
19:50:01rasherSoap: I think the license should cover all included files
19:50:03linuxstbSoap: IMO We want modification rights on the images as well - to be able to fix things. At the very least, themes need new codec icons for newly added codecs.
19:50:32Soaplinuxstb, those would be additional images, not modified ones though would they not?
19:50:34linuxstbe.g. if you can't modify the image files, you couldn't convert bitmaps into bitmap strips for example.
19:50:44Soapsolid point.
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19:50:58linuxstbSoap: Depending on the required background, font etc, they may be created by modifying existing ones
19:51:16linuxstbThat's how I've added codec icons to iCatcher in the past for example.
19:51:50rasherSoap: They could also be based on existing images
19:51:53linuxstbI'm happy to ignore themes where the authors want to restrict their use - the authors are free to distribute them elsewhere.
19:51:58Soapso demand redistribution, full modification, and ask for lack of use restrictions (stupid NC)?
19:52:06pixelmawhich reminds me that some SVN themes need a new codec icon...
19:52:16LambdaCalculus37Yep... a SAP icon.
19:52:35rasherI think we should really discourage NC. I'm in favour of not allowing it at all on the theme site
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19:53:14BigBambiI'm not too bothered. I'd discourage but not ban personally, but I wouldn't argue for it :)
19:53:37SoapUnless more developers agree with you (and chime in before I start) how about we leave that detail for later?
19:53:40LambdaCalculus37A NC license should simply mean that their theme can not be included in Rockbox in the future.
19:53:47linuxstbThings will be so much simpler if we enforce a single license on the themes site - so people can pick and choose from existing themes to create new ones, without worrying about licenses
19:54:12BigBambitrue
19:54:18rasherVery good point
19:54:28LambdaCalculus37Didn't that cause problems with some of senab's themes, anyway?
19:54:35kugelrasher: by-sa isn't GPL-compatible either
19:54:37SoapI agree in theory - but we already have a mess of CC licenses - are we going to throw them all out?
19:54:42BigBambiLambdaCalculus37: he has -nd too
19:54:56rasherkugel: It doesn't have to be - we're not compiling anything in.
19:54:57LambdaCalculus37BigBambi: Ack... no wonder.
19:55:06rasherkugel: I said in spirit.
19:55:11linuxstbSoap: I've always thought that we should throw everything out and start again with a new site.
19:55:26BigBambime too tbh - people can just resubmit
19:55:31*rasher doesn't see a reason to throw working and properly licensed themes out
19:55:36linuxstb(and let the authors upload their themes, as only they can tick the box to say they agree to the license we choose)
19:55:43kugelrasher: but in parenthesis, that doesn't count ;)
19:55:55BigBambiProblem is, the gallery is a mess now, and we don't have a themes site (cough) :)
19:56:16rasherWell if only it was available in svn
19:57:16BigBambirasher: If we are going to insist on a single license then either the author needs to do something, or if it is already suitably licensed one of us can fix and submit it to the new site
19:57:17SoapHow about I keep permissive licenses for now, demand GPL or CC attribution SA (is that not GPL compatible?) for all new ones, and make clear that only those which meet said standards will move on to the new page?
19:58:16*linuxstb commits the code he has so far for the new themes site
19:58:25rasherSoap: The theme doesn't need to be GPL compatible (none of the CC licenses apart from BY are).
19:58:50Soapby-sa isn't?
19:59:11rasherI agree with linuxstb that *ALL* themes should have the exact same license to make things less confusing
19:59:22wpyhmcuelenaere: did you find something interesting?
19:59:38rasherSoap: Nope. But that's okay, because we're not mixing the two - just distributing them alongside eachother
19:59:53kugelSoap: by-sa isn't. But as rasher said, it doesn't need to
20:00
20:00:05wpyhI found that if I use the vx747 bin files on the vx767, then used usbtool, the device will reset after 10.bin is sent, and then the 65 MB device will appear
20:00:31wpyhthen if I hold VOL DOWN while resetting the device, the flash (4 GB) will appear
20:00:33SoapI agree they all should be one license, but should I stop my proposed work until one is agreed on, or stick with "permissive licenses" for now?
20:00:58SoapI /really/ think we need to get the unlicensed crap out of the way sooner than later.
20:01:05kugelI'd say go for by-sa, it's easier to understand
20:01:13BigBambiSoap: I guess that depends whether you want to do it twice :)
20:01:52wpyhthe flash seems to be located *after* the 65 MB area, this is maybe two partitions/separate areas on the nand
20:02:00kugelmost themers actually don't care about licenses (from what I've seen), it with by-sa there's at least the chance, that the themers will actually read it
20:02:05rasherSoap: I'd say move anything but by-sa to the graveyard. We can always fix permissive themes from the graveyard and wait for the author to relicense
20:02:05SoapBigBambi, My goal is to have all themes in the Galleries _working_ and _fixable_ - we can filter by license on the transition to the new theme site.
20:02:22wpyhalso, the 65 MB device starts with SFHI, and ends in 0xdeadface values, while the 4 GB device is all 0xdeadface AFAICS
20:02:29linuxstbSoap: To be honest, I don't think it's worth doing anything... We just need to get a new themes site working, and then let authors resubmit. After the initial wave of uploading, we can then take a look at the Galleries and see if there are any themes left there that are not on the themes site, but have the same license as the one we choose.
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20:04:30domonokylinuxstb: whats the status of the theme site ? ie what works, and what is missing ?
20:04:35BigBambiSoap: If you are going to filter by licence later, then just go with anything permissive. Personally however, I agree with Rasher's last statement
20:05:05*rasher attempts to checkout themes.rockbox.org and fails hilariously
20:05:24linuxstbdomonoky: It's here - linuxstb.cream.org/themes/">http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/ and http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/
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20:05:53linuxstbAs you can see, very basic browsing and downloading is working. The upload script is still in progress - linuxstb.cream.org/themes/upload.php">http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/upload.php
20:06:23kugellinuxstb: can I have 4 columns? :)
20:06:55linuxstbHere is the dump I made of the old themes site, along with a "themes.txt" file which is the metadata about all the themes - linuxstb.cream.org/theme_dump.tgz">http://linuxstb.cream.org/theme_dump.tgz
20:07:23linuxstbkugel: Only after you finish the rest of the site.
20:07:45kugelok, i'm fine with 3 :)
20:07:46linuxstbIMO the important thing is the file upload and the validation of the uploaded zip.
20:08:00linuxstbAll the other features can come after it launches
20:08:06rasherlinuxstb: are you working on it?
20:08:34linuxstbrasher: No, I have no time. Real work is keeping me too busy.
20:08:49rasherI might have a go then
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20:08:56domonokysimple file upload shouldnt be a problem, but the validation is the thing.. how far is this part ?
20:08:59*LambdaCalculus37 wonders just how many of those themes on the new site are broken :)
20:09:53linuxstbWe should throw away everything from the old site - I just imported them to have some test data
20:09:59 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
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20:10:34linuxstbdomonoky: Quite advanced - I think the code to check the structure of the zip, and check for all required files is working. Or if not, it's very close.
20:11:08linuxstbThe final thing would be to validate the WPS with checkwps, and then actually add the theme to the site.
20:11:18pixelmalinuxstb, kugel: I made a try with floating divs to adapt to different screen/window sizes better but it has 2 downsides - the div for a wps would need to be fixed sized and there's a small bug with it in firefox...
20:11:34 Quit St_MPA3b (Remote closed the connection)
20:11:44linuxstbThe site is using a text file as a database, but as scorche's server is running mysql anyway, we may as well move the metadata into a table there.
20:13:05kugelpixelma: Hmm...sad
20:13:28rasherlinuxstb: or just use sqlite
20:13:58scorche|shrasher: probably would be simpler to use mysql, but /shrug
20:14:20rasherIn which way? SQLite is pretty simple
20:14:25*scorche|sh shrugs
20:14:33scorche|shif you code it, go for it
20:14:44linuxstbrasher: If mysql is already running, what's the gain with SQLite?
20:15:16rasherlinuxstb: Everything would be contained within the dir, and it's easier to move if need be
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20:16:22linuxstbrasher: Sounds good to me. I always try and keep websites as simple as possible, and avoid database servers...
20:16:25rasherAnyway, that's a bikeshed problem, the text file will do for now
20:16:47rasherApparently my debian mirror has gone AWOL
20:16:59linuxstbrasher: Are you planning on working on it?
20:17:30rasherYeah, I'm trying to set it up now. First step is getting subversion installed, which is giving me some grief
20:17:45scorche|shrasher: if you do, i will be forced to nab a sansa for you ;)
20:18:13funmantest.S:18: Error: bad instruction `bt noloop'
20:18:23funmanhum the same instruction
20:18:31funman.. is used in rockbox
20:19:20funmanbut I don't see it in the list of conditions
20:19:52linuxstbrasher: The README is incomplete, so feel free to ask me any questions. The code is quite small though, so should be easy to follow.
20:20:15pixelmalinuxstb, kugel: this shows how it should work http://home.infocity.de/m.arnold/temp/themes/title-themes_div.html . The bug in firefox is that if you start small it doesn't expand (refreshing the page helps), funnily enough it works in IE7
20:20:58kugelpixelma: it works for me in ff
20:21:11pixelmait was a quick try though and is already a few months old (from April)
20:21:24kugelbefore ff3 probably
20:21:56pixelmakugel: what version of ff? And what happens when you us a small window, refresh page and then expand?
20:22:25kugelpixelma: ff3, works fine
20:22:35rasherpixelma: works as expected here on iceweasel3
20:22:41pixelmainteresting
20:23:16linuxstbpixelma: It doesn't seem too bad in ff 2.0.0.14 either
20:23:22kugelI made the window small, closed ff, then clicked on your link (firefox started small then -> 3 colums), then I went for fullscreen and got 5 colums w/o refreshing
20:23:38*BigBambi joins the bandwagon
20:23:41BigBambiWorks here too!
20:23:43rasherpixelma: Works with epiphany-webkit as well
20:23:54linuxstbIt never went to 5 columns for me though - it stopped at 4, regardless of the window's width
20:23:58BigBambiI got 5
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20:24:19BigBambiIn FF3.something
20:24:24linuxstbAh no, I lied...
20:24:28pixelmalinuxstb: still doesn't work as it should in FF 2.0.0.16 for me
20:24:30domonokyworks fine here with ff 3.01
20:24:37kugeli get 5, but I can't make the window bigger than my screen width
20:24:42rasherpixelma: I'd consider that quite a minor flaw
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20:25:04linuxstbpixelma: No, it's not working. It never resizes to larger than the size when you first load the page
20:25:21linuxstbBut I agree with rasher that it's a minor flaw, and not a show-stopper.
20:25:30pixelmathat's what I meant
20:25:34kugelseems to be fixed in ff3
20:26:03BigBambiYes, it definitely works in FF3
20:26:13dr3qmAnybody know where I can find a gigabeat s30? I need one for a project...
20:26:21BigBambiebay normally
20:26:32scorche|shdr3qm: ebay?...they get a bit pricey there though
20:26:43dr3qmThanks, Surprisingly they all seem to be bought up now...
20:26:49pixelmabut it still leaves the problem that you need to fix the size of the divs otherwise everything gets messed up - and if we allow any length in the description that wouldn't work...
20:27:21dr3qmNothing on ebay, Trying to see if someone is willing to trade or sell at this point...
20:27:38kugelpixelma: is the height fixed too? the c200 cell is a bit smaller (in the height)
20:28:34dr3qmIf anyone's got one, now is the time to sell...
20:29:05pixelmakugel: yes the minimum height is - and it is a bit too small in that version
20:29:41kugelpixelma: but if the cells can be bigger than the minimum height, comments of any length should be possible
20:29:53pixelmamy quick try back then for a themes page itself http://home.infocity.de/m.arnold/temp/themes/mini-themes.htm
20:31:01pixelmakugel: no, as then you get different high divs and that makes them jump around - there's no grid or columns and rows
20:31:19kugelah ok then
20:31:33kugelI'd rather have fixed comment length though
20:32:06 Quit snoh (Remote closed the connection)
20:32:09kugelif the themer has to say much, he can still put a readme in his package
20:33:45*rasher is not a big fan of global variables in PHP :\
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20:39:55linuxstbIf anyone else wants to help with the themes site, a ThemesSubmission wiki page (and ThemesInstallation) need to be written - the idea is that they are linked to from the themes site. The "ThemesSubmission" page would contain the link to the "upload" page - there won't be a link anywhere else.
20:40:26linuxstbI meant ThemeSubmission and ThemeInstallation - see linuxstb.cream.org/themes/">http://linuxstb.cream.org/themes/
20:41:06rasherlinuxstb: couldn't the themessubmission page simply include the appropriate form?
20:41:30linuxstbThe form is quite big...
20:41:34rasherEh, maybe not. I don't suppose we want that world writeable
20:41:40linuxstbAnd that...
20:42:23rasherThe player page seems unavailable
20:42:26*rasher dives in
20:43:00linuxstbAnother question is whether we want to enforce a real name policy for themes. My feeling is that we do, and that's how the site is currently written...
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20:43:26rasherI think we do
20:43:33linuxstb(based on the principle that the themes and theme authors should be treated the same as the code and the code authors)
20:44:18linuxstbThe upload page contains a link to a non-existent WhyRealNames wiki page which also needs writing...
20:44:51rasherThere's some text in the code guidelines to that effect, iirc
20:46:04rasherapparently 0 == '' evaluates to true.. or something.
20:46:32linuxstbObviously...
20:49:30linuxstbrasher: There's also a nastier issue - dealing with targets that vary slightly (e.g. RTC vs no RTC, hold vs no hold), and also those targets with remotes. e.g. the ipod Color/Photo and H300 both have a 220x176 screen, but the H300 also has a remote.
20:50:54 Part Psyco
20:52:02pixelmathere's no target with no hold, even the soft hold targets can show their status in the WPS
20:52:41linuxstbOK, I'm sure I saw some things in the wps parser which were #ifdef'ed though. Meaning the WPS would fail to parse on some targets
20:52:45pixelmabut I also wanted to ask about the RTC tags... would it be possible to have an RTC available conditional?
20:52:46*linuxstb goes to check
20:54:46pixelmait needs to ask for a different status. The WPS tag wasn't available for a long time but the statusbar could show it and so I c+p'ed over
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21:00
21:01:25rasherlinuxstb: so basically, validate_zip needs to be expanded?
21:03:00pixelmathe remotes question gets even harder with the 160x128x2 themes - there could be 2 different RWPS screens... (M5 and H100). Maybe we should put the rwps on their own page?
21:03:06linuxstbrasher: Yes. Plus the code to do something after it's finished....
21:03:16rasherAh right
21:04:23linuxstbpixelma: Do many people create rwps files? I mean is it something we could perhaps ignore for the first version?
21:08:12rasherlinuxstb: have you considered using the zip extension for php? Iirc, it's fairly widely supported. Never used it though
21:08:39linuxstbrasher: scorche mentioned it, but I was happy to just parse the output of unzip...
21:08:55pixelmasome do but I guess the major part is main screen WPS, maybe we could skip that for now. But I just realised that currently all RWPSs could be main screen WPSs for other targets - ifp, Logik Dax etc. in case of the Iriver remote and the Iaudio remote is the M3's "main screen"...
21:09:22linuxstbrasher: I'm assuming (!) that unzip is quite robust against badly formed input files. I've no idea about PHP's zip library...
21:09:23rasherlinuxstb: Just seems somewhat fragile and a bit clumsy to me.
21:10:13linuxstbIt's up to you.
21:13:29pixelmajust something that crossed my mind (not really thought through). Could we *somehow* use our WPS "build" system to create different packages depending on target?
21:14:02 Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/staff/bluebrother)
21:14:19 Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
21:14:57funmanI learn about CPU architecture by reading patents .. http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5596761.html
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21:15:30rasherlinuxstb: any good reason for the many arrays, rather than a single multi-dimentional one?
21:15:51linuxstbrasher: I don't know how to do multi-dimensional arrays in PHP ;)
21:15:59rasherThat's a very good reason!
21:16:12rasherJust poking around for now
21:16:34linuxstbThere are possibly some new targets by now as well...
21:17:02rasherIf there aren't, someone's not working hard enough
21:17:03linuxstbpixelma: I think something like that would be very nice.
21:17:30pixelmaguess that's something for later though
21:17:43linuxstbrasher: No, there doesn't seem to be any new targets...
21:17:56linuxstbAt least not ones with current builds.
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21:20:49 Quit amiconn_mm (Remote closed the connection)
21:21:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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21:22:23peturpixelma: did you already try the latest patch from 9208?
21:23:02pixelmano, not yet. Didn't have much time yesterday and today...
21:23:13*pixelma goes to download
21:23:31 Quit wpyh (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:24:57 Quit bertrik (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
21:26:17pixelmapetur: btw. I noticed after you told me that the trigger bar was gone (in svn) on my M5 too because I only noticed that I still had triggered recording enabled after a test when I started wondering why recording stopped...
21:26:42pixelmasorry for the twisted sentence
21:26:53peturI got it ;)
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21:27:28Spindizythats quite a mouthfull :) I read it like you said it all in one breath.
21:31:27rasher!
21:31:44pixelmapetur: do I need a make clean and reconfigure?
21:31:58pixelmato test the patch of course ;)
21:32:01peturjust make should do it
21:32:35*petur practices 1-arm computing
21:34:17Soapwill a "theme" with a RWPS break on a target w/o a remote?
21:34:33pixelmahmm... I get some warnings unrelated to your patch I think in some languages, like: warning: source before line lacks quotes (none)!
21:34:58linuxstbSoap: My guess is that the RWPS will just be ignored.
21:35:01peturaha, so it is my patch :(
21:35:24peturpixelma: I saw them too, thought my tree was broken...
21:35:39peturI'll have a look what's borked
21:35:44*bluebrother notices some code in the themes folder :)
21:36:16pixelmapetur: but your patch doesn't touch those languages
21:36:16Soapif the RWPS is ignored then what is the issue with H300 and Color WPSs on the same page? Am I missing something?
21:36:23kugelSoap: I agree with linuxstb, the rwps should be #ifdef'd out, so that non-remotes should just ignore it
21:36:38peturI know, but it seems to cause the warnings
21:36:49linuxstbSoap: In that case, there isn't. But pixelma thought of a better example - 160x128x2 main LCD and two different remotes (iriver and iaudio)
21:38:23Soaplinuxstb, I see a potential source of confusion there, but not a deal breaker in my mind unless the presence of a iriver RWPS breaks parsing on the iaudio - which I'm assuming it does? If it doesn't there just needs to be a tick-box listing which RWPS is included?
21:38:58*bluebrother wonders if we could use http://pecl.php.net/package/zip on the themes site and if it would be nicer than using the command line zip
21:38:58Soap(Guess that leads to another question - there isn't a way to include both an iriver and an iaudio RWPS in one theme is there?)
21:39:13linuxstbbluebrother: rasher already wondered that...
21:39:15pixelmapetur: well I just svn up'd right before and didn't try compiling without the patch. But maybe your patch just unvails some mistakes in the languages because the SYSFONT strings are now gone? That's a wild guess though
21:39:28bluebrotherlinuxstb: :)
21:39:48linuxstbbluebrother: Read back about 30 minutes... ;)
21:39:52peturpixelma: my clean svn tree builds just fine
21:40:22kugelcould the rwps be in a seperate package, with a link to (e.g. click to download the rwps too), to avoid checkwps failing because of the rwps
21:40:40bluebrotherseems that happened just the minute(s) before I came in. Now someone give me enough time and I'll give that scripts a look ...
21:42:01bluebrotherwell, separating out the rwps for themes will also require changes to rbutil.
21:42:32bluebrotherhmm, and there currently isn't a script to generate the required output for that afaics.
21:42:34pixelmapetur: happens to me in hebrew.lang too (as I remember you saying yesterday) and one of those is in bulgarian.lang
21:42:35kugela little one, the link to the rwps would be stored in the metadata
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21:43:08linuxstbbluebrother: No, but I'm guessing that's relatively trivial...
21:43:27peturpixelma: yup. and doesn't happen if I build for h300
21:43:27*petur still reading patch
21:43:34rasherMaybe it's time to dust off my convert-langv2-to-xmllang script - caught some errors last time I tried it
21:43:43linuxstbbluebrother: I just wanted to concentrate on the upload facility first. The rbutil integration could even wait until after the site goes live....
21:43:52bluebrothertrue. As I did the old one I might try creating a new one ...
21:44:30bluebrotheris there a reason you choose one big database file? Wouldn't it be nicer to split it up based on resolution?
21:44:49bluebrotherotoh, that file won't get too big anyway, so ...
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21:45:31peturrasher: what's the reasoning behind the usage of "" versus none for not used strings?
21:45:53rasherAbsolutely no idea. I think you want Bagder
21:46:17kugelpetur: I also wondered about that
21:47:42afruff23I need help debugging a wps
21:47:44afruff23http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=17984.msg131225
21:48:21 Quit Schmo ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org")
21:48:31afruff23Can anyone here help me?
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21:49:08pixelmapetur: in hebrew.lang the AGC related strings seem to be affected and it looks like they have the translated string in the default part (the "*: ") where the string should be in the "agc:" part. I was building for my OndioFM which doesn't have AGC
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21:50:43pixelmapetur: none will exclude the string completely, "" will insert an empty string which is needed (if I understand and remember correctly) to keep language file and voice in sync
21:53:35linuxstbafruff23: Have you tried running the uisim with the −−debugwps option?
21:53:35*petur returns and says gracias
21:55:47afruff23is that just running debugwps.bat in the UIsimulator folder
21:56:01afruff23*?
21:56:27linuxstbProbably
21:56:30peturpixelma: so if I deprecate I should use ""
21:56:32afruff23I did that
21:56:55afruff23I'll add the output to my forum post
21:57:08*petur wonders when we can get rid of all those deprecated entries
21:57:47pixelmapetur: that's how I understood it
21:58:12afruff23I added the debugwps output to the topic
21:58:14linuxstbpetur: Probably with 3.0
21:58:26petur\o/
21:59:06 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
21:59:20linuxstbafruff23: Did you paste it twice?
21:59:24 Quit kugel (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:00
22:00:08afruff23no, I first opened the UIsim then I reloaded the theme to make sure
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22:03:26saratogai was just looking through the tremolo source code, and their version of tremor is likely faster then ours
22:03:55saratogaand they've put a lot of work into writing an asm MDCT, including parts we haven't bothered doing
22:04:05saratogai suspect we could benefit from that
22:04:07bertrikhmm, the sansa c200 is not PP5024 but PP5022, right?
22:04:13saratogano its 24
22:04:48pixelmapetur: the warnings go away if you use the none correctly in the default case
22:04:58linuxstbsaratoga: I thought the AMS part was physically separate?
22:05:40bertrikyeah, exactly, I thought PP5024 was basically PP5022 + AS3514, but the c200 has a separate AS3514
22:05:50saratogai could be mistaken
22:05:58*linuxstb spots a picture of the AS3514 here - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaC200Port#Hardware_Details
22:06:42saratogashame we took the time to write our own ASMed Tremor when there was already a very well developed one for arm
22:06:58pixelmapetur: so I guess those strings weren't used before but the sysfont equivalents? And so the bug in the two languages didn't show... ?
22:07:36bertrikthen the PortalPlayer wiki page must be wrong about c200 and e200
22:07:48 Quit LinuxMafia ("Leaving")
22:08:29bluebrotherdomonoky: already noticed Qt 4.4.1?
22:08:38BigBambilinuxstb: For the single licence for the themes site, would your preference be cc-by-sa?
22:08:46BigBambiDoes anyone else have an opinion?
22:09:43linuxstbBigBambi: Yes. Oddly, I agree with rasher ;)
22:10:28 Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection)
22:10:54rasherI'm not sure anyone is advocating other licenses
22:11:10BigBambiI agree too, just checking :)
22:11:11rasherJust the "do we really need just one license?" angle
22:12:36domonokybluebrother: yes, i just checked the changlog, seems no important changes for us..
22:12:53bluebrotherno ... still nice to see bugs fixed :)
22:13:50pixelmaI thought about GPLing mine but don't have a real preference
22:14:39scorche|shwhat do people have against cc-by-sa? (besides any nc clauses)
22:15:11pixelmanothing, I just know too little
22:15:49scorche|shit is quite a simple license (which is part of the appeal, imo)
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22:18:00SoapI'll email those wiki account holders with a published email address to tell them their theme has been moved. I assume cc-by-sa working themes from the wiki will be able to be uploaded to themes.rockbox.org by anybody?
22:18:32linuxstbsaratoga: One problem with Tremolo is that it seems to be licensed under v2 only of the GPL.
22:18:54linuxstb(plus a second, home-brew license, not compatible with the GPL)
22:21:59linuxstbSoap: Are there many cc-by-sa themes?
22:22:17bertrikis anyone using the md5sum plugin?
22:23:26bertrikIt's too easy to start md5'ing the whole flash disk and I can't abort it, I think that should be fixed
22:23:39linuxstbbertrik: I think I saw a bug report about that
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22:26:00bertrikah, I'll have a look at that patch. I think the current behaviour is unacceptable.
22:26:40BigBambibertrik: I agree, a quit is essential
22:27:07saratogalinuxstb: you mean the GPLv2 only thing or GPL in general (verses LGPL or BSD)?
22:27:24linuxstbGPLv2 only
22:28:02linuxstbI thought a decision was made at devcon to move Rockbox to "v2 or later", and remove any "v2 only" code?
22:28:24saratogalinuxstb: the author is pretty reasonable, he'd probably allow us GPLv3
22:28:33saratogaI'll ask him about it
22:28:37linuxstbWe don't want GPLv3... We want "v2 or later".
22:28:45saratogawell if he offers 2 and 3
22:29:08linuxstbWe want "v2 or later"...
22:29:28bluebrother"later" is still different −− it could be v4 once that comes out ...
22:31:11 Join itcheg [0] (n=IceChat7@h-67-100-146-176.nycmny83.covad.net)
22:32:23linuxstbI don't understand his comment that he used GPL instead of xiph's BSD-style license "so that fully GPLd software such as ScummVM may use it with no problems". It also still includes files with Xiph's license header in them... So the licensing seems very confused.
22:35:58 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
22:38:16linuxstbSoap: Why did you move all the Archos themes? Were they broken, or is it simply because they didn't have a license?
22:38:47 Quit Nibbler (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:40:35Soapthe ones w/o a license.
22:40:55SoapIn the process of contacting those who I can.
22:41:00BigBambiI've written a little blurb about licensing - anyone have any thoughts? http://www.pastebin.ca/1088864
22:41:35 Quit funman ("leaving")
22:41:48linuxstbSoap: Why move themes that work?
22:42:15SoapI thought my intentions were perfectly clear two hours ago.
22:43:46SoapYou said you weren't sure it was worth doing - which I took as saying "perhaps you are wasting your time better spent with the wife" not as "don't do it"
22:44:46SoapMy intentions were to make the existing WPS galleries full of only themes which A-were permissively licensed, B-worked, and thus C-Ready for upload to the new site once it was up and running.
22:45:37SoapIf you want me to change my goals to "permissively licensed and / or working" I can do that too.
22:46:29linuxstbSoap: That's probably was what I meant ;) It just seems that the Archos gallery is a special case, as most (all?) of those themes probably still work. Reading your comments again, I agree with your plan for the others.
22:47:05 Quit neddy ("Leaving.")
22:47:11 Quit massiveH ("Leaving")
22:47:39Soapmy plan being the one I outlined A,B,C style just now? Or my alternative plan I mentioned the next line? ;)
22:48:12linuxstbThe original one to get rid of all unlicensed themes.
22:48:19Soapok - can do.
22:48:47SoapI'll revert Archos and only graveyard ones (if any) which fail on the sim.
22:49:05SoapBigBambi, _I_ like your preamble.
22:49:48BigBambicool :)
22:50:56Soapdamn-it - there isn't a revert button, is there?
22:52:03BigBambiVery minor change - swap extent for maximum and remove a typo - http://www.pastebin.ca/1088879
22:52:08linuxstbSoap: Just leave it... But maybe have a link to the graveyard?
22:52:16SoapThat is comming
22:53:15linuxstbSoap: Is the plan one huge graveyard? I'm thinking that separate graveyards for each LCD will be needed.
22:53:37SoapThe plan was one huge graveyard, but I can split it.
22:53:56linuxstbIt's up to you - but I'm guessing the majority of themes will be there, at least initially.
22:54:03pixelmahmm... what about WPSs that use the %m tag? It doesn't fail but will look wrong...
22:54:24linuxstbThey dont' fail?
22:54:36Soappixelma, I wasn't going to work on fixing such themes until after the division. (Not saying someone else can't)
22:55:55pixelmalinuxstb: didn't fail for me after the change got it in, I'm not aware of any "fixes" for that and changed my WPS since
22:57:02 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:58:06pixelmaSoap: it was more of an idea thought out loud for the validation automation on the themes site. Seems I'm not very concentrated today and jump topics a bit... ;)
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23:00
23:00:42linuxstbpixelma: Yes, I've just tested, and %m doesn't give an error... I don't understand why though. Nico_P?
23:01:30afruff23linuxstb: were you able to find the bug with the WPS file?
23:01:36pixelmalinuxstb: JdGordon guessed it was because of the other tags starting with %m - like %mh %mm and such
23:01:51 Nick num1_away is now known as num1 (n=brian@c-68-63-193-45.hsd1.az.comcast.net)
23:01:55pixelmaIIRC
23:02:02afruff23here's the link again: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=17984.msg131225
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23:04:31linuxstbafruff23: No.
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23:05:00 Quit bertrik (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
23:06:10linuxstbpixelma: Hmm, seems that the wps parser doesn't give an error when it finds any unrecognised tag...
23:06:21 Join massiveH [0] (n=massiveH@ool-44c48a1e.dyn.optonline.net)
23:09:53afruff23what sites can host zip files?
23:11:05Nico_Plinuxstb: no it doesn't. you think it should?
23:11:19 Quit bertrik_ ("Leaving")
23:11:29linuxstbNico_P: I'm not sure...
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23:21:31***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:21:41pixelmapetur: I find the peakmeters much too big on my Ondio now and it seems they are not working (source is set to microphone and they are not moving, I only saw them shortly when entering the screen
23:21:56peturhmmm
23:22:08peturmost people complain they are too small
23:22:15 Quit tehpaper (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:22:47pixelmaon the Archos screens the peakmeters were even only one line before - an the others already 2 sysfont lines
23:23:00peturI removed one of the two PM draw calls, I'll need to check why the second one was there
23:23:11pixelmasame applies to the Iriver remote screens I think
23:23:33peturso you want them smaller again?
23:24:02HellDragonscorche:
23:26:14 Quit massiveH ("Leaving")
23:26:21pixelmapetur: *I* would want that, yes. Not sure my opinion counts - I also have to admit that I use a slightly larger font currently (nedore-9)
23:26:31pixelmabtw. it also doesn't seem to record
23:26:37Soapcc-by-sa or CC-BY-SA or CC-by-SA?
23:26:40peturbugger
23:27:05BigBambiCC-BY-SA I think
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23:31:31pixelmapetur: or the time / size and statusbar are not updated - though I see "disk activity" when I start recording. But the worst thing is that it hangs when I try to leave the recording screen: everything freezes except the backlight is still reacting and I need to hard reset
23:32:20afruff23linuxstb: here is a complete zip file of the them I'm making for the gigabeat F. Can you please check it out and find the bug?
23:32:22afruff23http://www.fileden.com/files/2008/7/31/2028676/HiPodNextV5.zip
23:32:40afruff23of the wps that I'm making*
23:33:11 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
23:33:39peturpixelma: this is on an ondio, right?
23:33:45pixelmapetur: no matter whether I started a recording before or not
23:33:47pixelmayes
23:33:52pixelmabacklight modded
23:34:11pixelmaOndioFM to be precise ;)
23:34:32*petur checks why his real-life tasks are hogging his system
23:36:07linuxstbafruff23: Your error is on line 14 - you've written %xK instead of %xdK
23:37:48pixelmapetur: the patched build looks ok so far on my c200, unfortunately I can't test on M5 this evening as it looks like I left it at work :\
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23:38:15peturI'm not committing tonight anyway ;)
23:38:48afruff23thanks
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23:43:23pixelmapetur: Archos owners who regularly record with their devices will be thankful ;)
23:43:28 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
23:44:00petur:(
23:44:19 Quit snoh (Remote closed the connection)
23:44:47pixelmaI'd like to help tracking down the problem but don't know how
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23:48:34Soapok, most controversial work of the night:\
23:48:47SoapUpdated ThemesGuidelines
23:50:19 Quit libzhark (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:50:29Soapchanged a couple of "should"s to "must"s. Mentioned the expected license,
23:51:26 Join pandark [0] (n=pandark@91-168-196-247.rev.libertysurf.net)
23:51:30pandarkhello
23:51:50pandarka firmware is out for a creative muvo ?
23:51:56pandarki want test
23:52:03pandarki have a old player :/
23:52:11BigBambinope
23:52:14pandarkok
23:52:49pandarki go search other mp3 player ...
23:52:51 Join Imaginal [0] (n=travis@c-67-160-44-129.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
23:53:15pandarkin a day when a more money
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23:53:29pandarkbye
23:53:32 Part pandark ("-__-")
23:55:20ImaginalHow does rockbox estimate battery time remaining?
23:55:43BigBambiblack magic
23:56:11BigBambiMore seriously, for those players on which it works, it uses calibrated measurements.
23:56:15peturs/black/octarine
23:56:31BigBambiThere are many players on which it isn't too accurate
23:56:58ImaginalSpecifically, I just replaced my ipod battery. Do I need to recalibrate anything?
23:56:59Soappixelma, isn't you Archos cabbie v2.0 gpl licensed by "default" because it is included in the daily builds?
23:57:00bertrikI think it estimates the charge level from the voltage, time = charge level * max battery time * 100%
23:57:29Soaponly thing you can change which affects the estimated runtime is the capacity, Imaginal
23:58:18Imaginalhmmm... I think I have an angry e-mail to write then about getting a weak battery
23:58:20pixelmaSoap: I would think so

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