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#rockbox log for 2009-02-06

00:00:57 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=rmenes@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37)
00:01:51MacGrumpyHmm I got a creative zen here too, anyway of trying to get that thing to work?
00:01:55MacGrumpya well for tomorrow
00:06:22mcuelenaereMacGrumpy: probably not, the creative zen needs a lot of work to get Rockbox running..
00:06:53 Quit MethoS- ("Konversation terminated!")
00:06:59MacGrumpyto bad
00:07:03 Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@dyndsl-085-016-167-175.ewe-ip-backbone.de)
00:09:46MacGrumpyI am amazed how well it plays flac.. realy nice
00:09:48MacGrumpythx
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00:23:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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00:35:44bertrikthe conditions to initialise the serial port (call serial_setup) are a bit weird: #if !defined(HAVE_FMADC) && !(CONFIG_STORAGE & STORAGE_MMC)
00:38:00amiconnThis is the archos serial port, and the conditions might look weird, but they are correct
00:38:14bertrikas far as I can tell, STORAGE_MMC is used only by the ondios (fm, sp) and FM_ADC only by fmrecorder and recorderv2
00:38:52amiconnOnly the Player and Recorder v1 can use the remote. The FM recorder and Recorder v2 don't have that pin connected, and the Ondios must not even have that driver
00:39:22amiconn...because the serial port is taken by the MMC interface (SPI)
00:39:52bertrikbut do all other targets have something useful to do with the serial port then?
00:40:44amiconnThat serial port is only used on archos afaik.
00:41:38amiconnSome other archs also have serial ports (coldfire irivers for debugging, and ipods for accessories), but I don't know where these are handled
00:42:18bertrikmaybe we should use positive logic then (HAVE_SERIAL?) and define it for the archoses only
00:44:18 Quit Aurix_Lexico (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:47:24 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=rmenes@rockbox/staff/LambdaCalculus37)
00:48:47 Join moos [0] (i=Mustapha@81-66-158-88.rev.numericable.fr)
00:49:40bertrikooh, the packard bell vibe that Ph1 took pictures of is another PP5020 based player
00:50:03toffe82bertrik: there is an mi4 file inside
00:50:16toffe82the updater
00:51:35bertrikhas it been decrypted yet?
00:52:27DerPapstseems to have line in recording too
00:52:38toffe82bertrik: you can try
00:56:26*LambdaCalculus37 goes to look at the pictures
00:56:33bertrikmaybe tomorrow. the text on the photos of the PCB is really hard to read.
00:56:45 Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.")
00:57:27toffe82externally it looks like the hdd6330
00:57:46amiconnmcuelenaere: Are you sure ffs is now correct for mips?
00:57:56amiconnIirc it should return 0 for zero input
00:58:09mcuelenaerehmm that's weird
00:58:41mcuelenaeredoesn't 0 mean bit 0 is set?
00:58:59mcuelenaereand 32 means no bit is set?
01:00
01:00:45 Quit lostlogic ("leaving")
01:01:04amiconnAh yes, it should return 32 in this case, as firmware/common/ffs.c tells
01:01:27mcuelenaereamiconn: how exactly does ands r1, r0, r2 differ from and r1, r0, r2 on ARM?
01:01:38amiconnIt sets the flags
01:01:43mcuelenaerewhen?
01:01:57mcuelenaerebecause the MIPS implementation is exactly the same as the ARMv5 one, except for the conditional 31 substraction
01:01:59amiconnFrom the result of the 'and' operation
01:02:18mcuelenaereso if for example the result of it is 0, it doesn't set the flags?
01:02:50amiconnIt always sets the flags, as per result
01:03:18mcuelenaerehmm then why does there is a rsbne instead of a rsb after the clz instruction?
01:03:20 Quit TMM (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
01:03:37mcuelenaereoh you mean it sets the flags differently?
01:04:01amiconnIn this case, it sets Z=1 for zero input, Z=0 otherwise
01:04:30amiconnAn 's' appended to arithmetic and logic instructions means "set the flags according to the result"
01:04:30 Join TMM [0] (n=hp@5ED10264.cable.ziggo.nl)
01:04:46amiconnWithout that 's', flags are left unchanged
01:04:59mcuelenaereyes I knew it did something like that
01:05:11mcuelenaerebut I don't understand how the not equal from rsbne reacts on that
01:05:23amiconnne means Z flag not set
01:05:54mcuelenaereok
01:05:56amiconnSee arm reference manual chapter A3.2
01:06:25amiconnSo in this case, 'rsbne' does nothing if the Z flag is set, i.e. the value was zero
01:06:58amiconnAnd since the arm 'clz' instruction returns 32 if the input value is zero, this is exactly what we want
01:07:25 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
01:07:30amiconnI don't know what the mips 'clz' instruction does, hence my question
01:08:06*amiconn couldn't find a nice mips programming manual
01:09:07*mcuelenaere found one, but can't remember where he found it
01:09:17mcuelenaereprobably on the official mips site
01:09:41 Join PaulJam_ [0] (i=PaulJam_@vpn-3006.gwdg.de)
01:09:50mcuelenaerehttp://www.mips.com/products/processors/32-64-bit-cores/mips32-4k/index.cfm#resources
01:10:00amiconnWhat kind of mips core is used in the Ondas?
01:10:15mcuelenaereThe CLZ instruction counts the number of leading zeros in a word. The 32-bit word in the GPR rs is scanned from
01:10:15mcuelenaeremost-significant to least-significant bit. The number of leading zeros is counted and the result is written to the GPR rd.
01:10:15mcuelenaereIf all 32 bits are cleared in the GPR rs, the result written to the GPR rd is 32.
01:10:17 Quit bertrik ("Leaving")
01:10:28mcuelenaerewoops multipaste, that was supposed to be on one line..
01:10:42amiconnAh, like arm then
01:11:02mcuelenaereamiconn: there's no clear reference of that in the datasheet, but I think I read somewhere it is 4k(-compatible)
01:11:03*amiconn likes clearly defined behaviour like this
01:11:07amiconnNot like x86....
01:11:45mcuelenaereamiconn: so it shouldn't be changed to this http://pastebin.com/m7a7a01eb ?
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01:24:53 Quit dabujo ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )")
01:26:36mcuelenaerecould it be possible that power is constantly feeded to a (removable) (micro)SD card instead of being software-controlled?
01:26:55Unhelpfulamiconn: we have times for several clz implementations on coldfire and arm now... the table-less one, if you add a couple more shift/mask passes to get it to produce correct output for all values, is as fast as the one with the 16B LUT on arm, and faster on coldfire.
01:30:25 Quit PaulJam (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:30:53amiconnmcuelenaere: Sure, why not?
01:31:11mcuelenaereperhaps it would be some kind of violation of the SD spec or so..
01:31:13Unhelpfulthe branchless version, using a multiply, *stinks* on both. too much time spent on rounding down to the nearest power of 2, and on the multiply itself, and the use of LUT seems to be fairly pessimistic on ARM :/
01:32:00amiconnThe Ondio does this (for MMC), which is nasty because the CPU uses SPI to access it, while the USB bridge uses the MMC protocol, and you can't switch back from SPI to MMC without power cycling -> the user has to power-cycle manually (by pulling the card)
01:33:26Unhelpfulmight just as well use a card reader at that point
01:34:07amiconnmcuelenaere: Do you know whether this mips core has the fast multiplier and divider?
01:34:27*mcuelenaere has to lookup what that is
01:34:46amiconnSection 1.3.2 Multiply and divide unit
01:35:46amiconn4Kc and 4Km can do 16x16 and 32x16 single cycle, and 32x32 in 2 cycles. Division 32/32 in 35 cycles, with shortcut for small dividends
01:36:15 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:36:16amiconn4Kp always needs 32 cycles for multiplies, and 35 cycles for divides
01:37:20mcuelenaereI'll look for a way to figure out what 4Kx this MIPS core is
01:37:44*amiconn hopes that it is 4Kc or 4Km
01:38:27Unhelpfulthat's a *huge* difference in multiply speed, and the slow multiply is pretty close to the division in speed. you could try timing loops of multiplies and divides, if you can't get it to tell you or find a doc that tells you
01:38:29amiconnBtw, I don't understand 'beqz' - I can't find it in the software manual
01:39:34mcuelenaereit is the same as beq t0, 0, jump
01:39:48mcuelenaereI'm not sure if it is an actual instruction, or just a shortcut name
01:40:12amiconnAh, it's a shortcut. Makes sense.
01:40:34mcuelenaereit seems to be a 4Kp or 4Km core
01:40:42mcuelenaereif I understand the C0 config register layout correctly
01:40:50mcuelenaere(Jz4740 has 0x3E63318A)
01:42:53mcuelenaereyes, MDU=0 ->Fast Multiplier Array (4Kc and 4Km cores)
01:43:39*mcuelenaere wonders whether this has some kind of special GCC switch
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02:00
02:00:33 Part toffe82
02:01:04amiconnmips register naming is confusing....
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02:05:01amiconnmcuelenaere: I think your pastebin is correct, but you could save one cycle for the nonzero case, at the cost of one more instruction
02:05:12TheNationhey is anyone here? i have a few quick questions about rockbox
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02:05:47mcuelenaereamiconn: so an extra 4 bytes would mean performance increase? that's not bad :)
02:05:47amiconnUse the delay slot...
02:05:54LambdaCalculus37TheNation: Just ask.
02:06:01*amiconn knows this concept from SH1
02:06:24TheNationaiight, im considering moving over from regular apple os on ipods to Rockbox, however i really need to know if it will still be compatable with an itrip
02:06:40paulvayI am trying to install rockbox on a sansa 240 1gb, I get Premission for disc access denied. Any ideas?
02:06:53TheNationit is a iPod video, and i use: http://www.abfnet.com/ctcost/griffin/itrip.jpg itrip
02:07:19amiconnhttp://pastebin.com/m250cb975
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02:08:43amiconnHmm, the beqz has a delay slot too, so it should be moved for optimising the zero-input case
02:08:49TheNationanyone know if they would still be compatable?
02:08:50*mcuelenaere never understood when the instruction after a jr got executed
02:09:45LambdaCalculus37TheNation: Accessory support is still in progress. It works, but you'll have to find out if your accessory is compatible or not. And the best way to find out is to just try it out.
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02:10:43TheNationLambdaCalculus37: alright, thanx man, ill just backup my songs and such and hope for the best, cause i really dont want to reformat it
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02:11:21LambdaCalculus37TheNation: Rockbox installation won't erase your songs, but yes, have a backup, because it's always good to. :)
02:11:27amiconnmcuelenaere: Afaiu it is always executed. This is a hardware trick to speed up the execution of branches
02:11:33LambdaCalculus37Just follow the instructions in the manual and you'll be fine.
02:11:40TheNationyeah, i know it wont erase my songs, but im saying just in case i gotta go back to apple on it ><
02:11:43 Quit midijunkie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:12:06amiconnChanging the address takes a while, so let's do another useful instruction meanwhile
02:12:40TheNationthanks though, ima start looking at the manual
02:12:48LambdaCalculus37TheNation: Even uninstalling Rockbox won't wipe your songs.
02:13:02 Quit Hillshum (Client Quit)
02:13:12TheNationoh, there is a way to uninstall it without formatting it?
02:13:27amiconnI'm not 100% sure whether this also applies to conditional branches on MIPS, but it seems it does. This leads to: http://pastebin.com/m59b185c6 (I usually put blank lines where the branch actually happens on such architectures)
02:13:30LambdaCalculus37Yes, the manual shows you how.
02:13:38TheNationoh, sickk
02:13:50TheNationand also, do i still manage songs using like winamp or songbird or any of those programs
02:13:51LambdaCalculus37It just involves removing the .rockbox folder and then the bootloader from your device (all in the manual).
02:14:06LambdaCalculus37Manage your songs however you feel comfortable.
02:14:14LambdaCalculus37Rockbox has no right or wrong way of doing it.
02:14:16TheNationalright sick, ill give it a shot
02:14:31LambdaCalculus37For example, I just drag and drop my files into a nicely organized folder structure.
02:14:38TheNationinteresting
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02:19:56mcuelenaereamiconn: any test case for the find_first_set_bit() function?
02:20:01mcuelenaeres/case/cases/
02:21:42amiconnHmm, no idea (other than hacking together a loop with a few test values)
02:22:53mcuelenaerehmm yeah, I did something similar (looped 0 till INT_MAX and compared it with __builtin_ctz() )
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02:23:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:00
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03:20:56Unhelpfulhere's the "winning" clz: http://pastie.org/381335
03:22:22Unhelpfuli wrote a benchmark plugin, it's as fast on ARMv4 as the one currently used in pictureflow. it's 12B longer (per use if inlined), but doesn't require the LUT. and it benchmarks faster on coldfire than either LUT-based one.
03:23:00Unhelpfulthe version with the 256B LUT is about 10% faster on ARMv4 than this or the current one
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03:30:47omarhiiiiiiiiii
03:31:04omar06450631062d06280627
03:31:08omar0643064a0641064306480646
03:31:26Unhelpfulthe social channel is #rockbox-community, please don't spam here.
03:31:38scorcheomar: stop that..
03:31:57omarshoo
03:32:36scorche"shoo"?
03:32:44omar06340648
03:33:09Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
03:33:11Mode"#rockbox +b %omar!*@* " by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
03:33:44scorcheyou have been muted for 10 minutes..please use this time to read the channel guidelines linked in channel topic
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03:43:26Mode"#rockbox -b %omar!*@* " by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
03:43:32Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
03:49:07soapany recommendations as to which non-US firmware to put on my H320 prior to Rockbox?
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03:50:21 Quit Seed ("cu, Andre")
03:51:16soapand the Rockbox manual says to connect your iRiver to your computer as described in your player's manual - which I do not have. I assume I use the USB port labeled "data" and not the one labeled "media"?
03:56:38JdGordonsoap: it makes no difference.... you'll only ever use it once
03:57:20soapgah, I can't figure out the OF controls at all.
03:57:38JdGordonand yes, use the data port
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03:58:34TheNation7hey, i just installed rockbox, where can i go to view the movies that were on my ipod before?
03:58:55scorcherockbox will not play those video files
03:59:13TheNation7ahh, ok..
03:59:22TheNation7and also about playlists from before? same deal?
03:59:48scorchecorrect...apple uses their own proprietary playlist format, while we use the m3u format
03:59:57soapcan I format the H300 safely before installing Rockbox?
04:00
04:00:08JdGordonyes
04:00:17scorcheyou might want to have a look through the manual, as it should answer all of these questions and much much more
04:00:18JdGordonyou only need h300.hex to install the bootloader
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04:00:43TheNation7alright, ill read up on the playlists, thanx
04:01:19soaphmm, 258.86 megs unallocated at the end of my H300's drive.
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04:07:41LambdaCalculus37soap: I have 1.29 J on mine. But anything works. ;)
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04:17:34soaphmm, now the H300 isn't showing up via USB.
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04:18:40LambdaCalculus37soap: Odd. What have you done so far?
04:18:58LambdaCalculus37Or are you using the left USB port or the right?
04:19:25soapattempted to format it with gparted, then gparted tossed an error saying it couldn't read the drive and since then it doesn't show up even with lsusb
04:19:37soapand it's back
04:21:34LambdaCalculus37The drive might either be bad or coming off the internal connector.
04:22:22LambdaCalculus37I had a similar problem with my iPod color not booting or showing up as a drive on my PC. Turned out the drive was disconnected from the hard drive connector.
04:23:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:27:52soapif the drive is dying I don't care, I plan on going CF soon.
04:28:32LambdaCalculus37Ahh, okay.
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04:43:25soaphmm, rbutil claims to have patched the .hex file. rbutil clealy placed the .hex file into the root of the device. The device either is not upgrading to the .hex as it claims or it is unpatched.
04:44:11JdGordondid you actually use the firmware upgrade option in the OF?
04:44:25soapyes
04:46:07scorchesoap: did you try it twice?
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04:46:16soapindeed
04:47:41soaphmm, RButil has placed a .hex file in the root of my player with the same md5sum as the one I downloaded.
04:49:21JdGordonthen it no worky :)
04:49:33JdGordonyou can do the patching the old cli way
04:50:19soaprbutil : http://pastebin.ca/1328666
04:51:11soapmd5s: http://pastebin.ca/1328667
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04:51:52soapwhich is the same MD5 as the firmware as downloaded from iRiver and as mentioned on Rasher's page.
04:51:56 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:51:58soapv1.29J
04:53:19soapfwpatcher.exe from 30-Jul-2006 being the old cli way?
04:55:15JdGordonoh windows? yeah that will do it also
04:55:27JdGordonbut that probably has v4 of the bootloader?
04:55:40JdGordonv5 being current...
04:57:04soapthat has v5
04:57:30soapand yea, windows. Ran it through WINE. Produced md5 verified output. Matches what the wiki says it should
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08:52:16amiconnUnhelpful: Do you know the speed of the various clz implementations on SH1?
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08:54:09Unhelpfulamiconn: no, but i still have a patch for the benchmark plugin. might want to up the step size on it, though, and remove clz3, i'm guessing it probably takes ages longer to bench on sh1 than on pp
08:55:48Unhelpfulmostly because of relative clock speeds, i mean
08:56:40amiconnMay be interesting
08:57:49Unhelpfullet me crank out a new patch, without the clz3 one... i would imagine that's a sure loser on sh1, since there's no hardware 32x32 multiply
08:58:17*amiconn would just run it unchanged
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09:03:13Unhelpfulok, here's a patch, the only difference from the one tested on arm and coldfire is 4x fewer loops, and correction of a bad initial value for r in clz4 (i checked before committing, it doesn't change the code generated aside from two of the immediate values being different)
09:03:19Unhelpfulhttp://pastie.org/381480
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09:39:26amiconnUnhelpful: Here are the SH1 results: 0: 988, 1: 832, 2:1845, 3: 1087
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09:44:43Unhelpfulhrm... about 16% gain for the 256B LUT... but that's a *lot* of memory to use for it.
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11:07:15insanepotatohello, how do i take screen shots from the simulator?
11:09:26kadobaninsanepotato: F5 (they'll show up in simdisk)
11:09:43insanepotatothank you kindly =)
11:09:47kadoban:)
11:10:28BigBambiinsanepotato: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UiSimulator might be useful for you
11:11:11insanepotatosorry, i should have checked there first. thanks for the help
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11:17:00insanepotatoi tried f5,f4 and NUM0 but nothing appeared in the simdisk directory. im simulating an ondio if that matters
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11:18:38kadobanhmm, that's odd. i know for sure it works in ondio, i just did one earlier today.
11:19:43kadoban...scratch that, i didn't. it should work though...let metry
11:22:41mcuelenaerehmm it seems as if the top line isn't captured on the D2 simulator when screenshot'ing
11:27:55kadobanokay, i can't get ondio to take a screenshot either
11:31:27insanepotatook, thank you, i will try the other players
11:36:07qballhmmm rockbox is acting odd, I can only go up/down from files to system.. but nothing else.. I cannot go to anther entry, I can not open files or system, i cannot shutdown
11:36:11qballreboot did not help
11:36:12qballyet
11:36:21qballhold works
11:38:53pixelmainsanepotato, kadoban: in an Ondio sim the dumps should be called dump0001.bmp etc. (not with the date) - are you sure no such dump bmp exists? I'll try here too but it'll take a while
11:39:17insanepotatoi get no new files at all in the simdisk directory
11:39:18kadobanpixelma: yeah, it wouldn't work for me...it's possible i'm doing something retarded, but it worked fine in recorderv2
11:39:39insanepotatoim trying out the ipod vid now
11:42:59BigBambiqball: I don't think that is very surprising given that you are using drivers for other targets on one that you only started playing with yesterday :)
11:43:29insanepotatoipod vid can screenshot
11:44:19*pixelma has a suspicion
11:46:28qballBigBambi: bah, ik worked for hours last night :D
11:46:55BigBambiqball: Maybe, but I'm still not surprised :)
11:47:40*kadoban wonders how that piece of information didn't seem relevent when reporting odd behavior
11:47:44qballconnecting to computer in Recovery mode, then booting again works
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12:21:43pixelmainsanepotato, kadoban: taking screenshots in a normal Ondio sim is broken here too but works when you make a backlight enabled build (for screenshots one of the Recorders will do because they have the same display). I suspect it's related to r19838
12:22:02insanepotatook, thanks =]
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12:26:20insanepotatois the reason there is no support for ipod accesories the lack of USB support?
12:26:52kadobaninsanepotato: there /is/ some support for ipod accessories iiuc.
12:27:18insanepotatosorry, what is iiuc?
12:27:25kadobanif i understand correctly
12:27:31insanepotatook
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12:28:16gevaertsipod accesories are unrelated to USB
12:29:17insanepotatoi thought they would be connected because the ipod socket is used for usb connection to a pc as well
12:29:53pixelmahmm... my statement about using Recorder sims for screenshots is not entirely correct. If you display something related to RTC (like the clock in the background of the bounce plugin), it'll be wrong for Ondio because those don't have an RTC
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12:35:13insanepotatoim off to bed, thanks and night.
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12:48:34J-23can the plugin access raw data from FM receiver?
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15:50:49linuxstbJ-23: Plugins can do anything you want them to do. You probably need to add functions to the plugin API to enable you to access the FM tuner though.
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17:28:44nim-bushello hello
17:30:43*evilnick_7 waves
17:31:11Bavlitohi
17:31:18nim-busLooking for some information on how the sansa with rockbox handles micro sd memory.
17:31:54evilnick_7Ask away then; what exactly do you want to know?
17:32:59nim-busI go t a chip and installed it. I can see it in files and access it. I am not able to put any files onto it via rockbox nor my card reader. I found a work around. My camcorder uses sd and with the adaptor I can use my camcorder to read and move files to and from the chip. If I did not have that camcorder I am clueless as to how I would put stuff on that chip
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17:33:42nim-busOnce on the chip it shows up in files just fine and plays. I just can see no where when connected to the sansa to move files to this chip. It only shows my onboard memory
17:33:57nim-busI wonder how it works for others. Reading forum now. Doing search
17:33:58evilnick_7nim-bus: Did the card come with an adapter for your PC?
17:34:39nim-busI bought a 4 gig micro sd memory card on ebay. It came with an SD adaptor to make it full size. It will not read in either of my card readers.
17:35:04nim-busI doubt that sansa would require you to have a card reader anyway to use memory but that may be a bad assumption
17:35:13evilnick_7If it's SDHC then the Original Firmware won't see the card; therefore you'd have to connect it directly to your PC and transfer files, or you could use Rockbox's Copy and Paste functions to move files from the internal memory to the card.
17:35:48evilnick_7It also sounds like the card readers can't handle SDHC either - but that's offtopic as it's not Rockbox-related.
17:36:15nim-busHmmm maybe a new reader is in order
17:37:10nim-busSo what is the NORMAL micro sd defines as. Just SD?
17:37:46nim-busMaybe I look for that form of SD as well. Maybe my camcorder reads SDHC fine so I have worked around that way
17:38:12nim-busfunny thing is that the sansa WILL see the memory and play what I put on it using the camcorder to read it
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17:39:23evilnick_7nim-bus: In that case it can't be SDHC, so can't you connect the Sansa to your PC and access the SD card that way? What happens when you plug it in when the OF is running and the card is in?
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17:41:11nim-busNo when I connect the cable between the sansa and the computer 2 new devices come up. One is the internal memory of the sansa and nothing else. The other I assumed would be this external memory I added. When I try to open that device it acts the way my card readers or dvd drives act when nothing is in them. It says there is nothing there to open.
17:42:48nim-busThe sansa itself reads the card fine. It shows up as a folder in the files section. The files I put on it using the camcorder read and play fine. I am just unable to send stuff directly to the card using the usb cable. Even my 2 card readers will not read it. I assumed that was because the sansa was a weird file format. I see it listed as fat32 however. I assume the sansa uses fat32 as its file format
17:43:01evilnick_7nim-bus: That makes sense. You're right that there will be one drive for the internal memory and one for the SD card.
17:43:59nim-busBest I can figure out there is something different about this chip that lets the sansa read it but not write to it, and my card readers can not even read it. I think a new card reader may be in order. I am reading up on SD ram from their home website now
17:44:17nim-bussorry micro sd that is
17:44:39evilnick_7Just to make sure; when you said that the Sansa CAN read the card, are you talking about the OF or Rockbox?
17:45:37nim-busRockbox can read it. When I boot to the original firmware it does not even know it is there
17:46:54nim-busI have another little issue with the sansa. I bought a USB box that powers the sansa if its internal battery goes dead in the field. It is basically a portable usb. The only problem is that the sansa insists on booting into the original firmware and not rockbox with powered by usb. How can this be stopped?
17:47:03evilnick_7Ah, I misunderstood you. That would definitely point to the card (not chip!) being SDHC and all the other information now makes sense. Yes, I'd say that the adapters you have can only use SD (non HC) cards.
17:48:27evilnick_7nim-bus: Hold the correct button (I think it's Select but check the fine manual) when plugging in. I believe that Rockbox now handles USB charging (but could be corrected)
17:48:31nim-busSays here that SDHC starts at 4 gig. That is what this is so it must be something to do with that. Perhaps If I bought a 2 gig micro sd it might read it fine
17:48:55nim-busIt would probably come up as that other device
17:49:19evilnick_7An adapter would probably be cheaper, and it'd let you use all that extra space.
17:49:59nim-busThat will be my first choice. A new card reader would solve it.
17:50:04evilnick_7Also, remember that you could copy files from the internal storage to the card from within Rockbox (although this is still slightly experimental so not recommended if you don't have backups)
17:50:23nim-busFor now I can use my video camcorder
17:50:38nim-busSo do you know anything about the usb problem I just mentioned?
17:51:26evilnick_7nim-bus: Hold the correct button (I think it's Select but check the fine manual) when plugging in [and Rockbox won't reboot]. I believe that Rockbox now handles USB charging (but could be corrected)
17:51:35nim-busI tried holding down all sorts of buttons while booting from usb power but every time it goes into original OS
17:52:11nim-busNot sure I pressed the select button. I can give that a try now
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17:54:23evilnick_7nim-bus: Holding Select and then plugging in works on mine. I just tested it.
17:56:45nim-busThat is the center round button right? I just tried it here. It ends up in the original sansa firmware. I see the DOS like list appear and then it goes into the original sansa OS. I will try once more. DO you keep it pressed or just a few seconds ?
17:57:29evilnick_7I kept it pressed while inserting the USB cable.
17:58:15nim-busThe rockbox icon comes up for a second then the dos like list appears then into the sansa OS. DRAT
17:59:57nim-busI have 2 of them here and they are both doing the same thing. One is an e250 and the other is an e260. 2 and 4 gig models
18:00
18:00:19evilnick_7From the fine manual: "The player can be powered over USB without connecting to your computer by holding Select while plugging in. This allows you to continue using the player normally."
18:00:38evilnick_7nim-bus: http://download.rockbox.org/manual/rockbox-sansae200/rockbox-buildch3.html#x5-380003.3
18:00:41domonokynim-bus: try it while rockbox is already running.
18:00:43evilnick_7What build are you using?
18:02:01nim-busbuild? I am trying to find the build number somewhere hang on
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18:03:01nim-busI found the rockbox version #
18:03:29evilnick_7System->Rockbox Info
18:04:49nim-busI see no build number there. Do you mean version?
18:05:30evilnick_7Yes
18:05:50nim-bus19569-08223 is version number
18:06:32nim-busoops left out a digit
18:06:44nim-bus19569-081223
18:07:03nim-busso small my old eyes can not read it easy even with glasses on
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18:07:52evilnick_7nim-bus: Please update to the most current build, that's a couple of months old.
18:08:53nim-busOK I will try updating rockbox. Is this feature that new?
18:09:19Guest79873tried the new firmware on my sansa e200 and no video, anyone know why?
18:09:45nim-busdid you convert your video with the video converter?
18:09:58Guest79873used ffmpeg to convert to mpeg1
18:10:01nim-busWhen I loaded normal video on mine at first nothing played.
18:11:06nim-busDoes the sansa play mpeg1 nativly now or do you have to load in the plugin for that? I know there is an mpeg player plugin. I have not bothered as my interest is audio and not video
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18:12:07Guest79873I thought that the plugin was part of the install, as this http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginMpegplayer says... where would I look for plugins?
18:12:29domonokyGuest79873: its already installed.
18:12:58Guest79873thanks, but no video... I also tried the sample Elephants dream, and that wont play on it either
18:13:02domonokybut perhaps your video is not in the correct size ? try the sample video on this wiki page
18:13:05Guest79873is there something I am missing?
18:13:32domonokywaht means "wont play" is there a error message ?
18:13:39PaulJamGuest79873: what happens when you try to play the file?
18:14:08Guest79873the files are never visable from within rockbox
18:14:33Guest79873so I cannot select them
18:14:42domonokyGuest79873: change the file view to show all files.
18:15:37Guest79873ok ...
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18:16:48Guest79873thanks, now it works.
18:17:12Guest79873Sorry about needing to ask, I did look for documentation but didn't find it.
18:17:17Guest79873All works well now
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18:26:42pixelmashow "supported" files should do for mpeg videos
18:27:40rasherCertainly for e200.. weird
18:31:14evilnick_7Are we going for "British English" in the manual? I'd like to have a look through and make some small corrections/suggestions.
18:34:05n1sevilnick_7: yes we are
18:34:40n1splease put suggestion sin the tracker even if you don't submit a patch so they are not forgotten
18:35:06nim-busI have one other little question. I use the sansa to record voice files. Currently it places these recordings in the root directory. When in the original firmware it would place them in the record directory. What I would like to be able to do is make my OWN directory somewhere and have it put the recorded files there. Is there a way to do that or must I move them with copy and paste or something?
18:35:20evilnick_7Right-o, that'll be my weekend project then. I could pass them onto LambdaCalculus37 as he knows Tex.
18:36:10n1sevilnick_7: if you are not changing anything major you really don't need much TeX skill
18:37:03evilnick_7nim-bus: Create the directory, then long-select on it and there's an option called "Set As Recording Directory"
18:37:06domonokynim-bus: this is possible, take a look at the manual to see how.
18:41:17nim-busAh ok Let me try that. I would actually LIKE to have it record on the external memory if it can. This should be interesting
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18:43:02evilnick_7nim-bus: It works as expected.
18:43:20nim-busAllright... that worked fine. It recorded to the external memory chip. Apparently Rockbox CAN read this secure digital memory
18:44:10*evilnick_7 is shouting "CARD NOT CHIP. CARD NOT CHIP" in his head!
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18:44:17nim-busI guess when I connect the USB to it either it uses the sansa firmware to read write Or something. For some reason it will not read that chip via usb but the sansa CAN read and write to it in rockbox mode
18:44:28domonokyyes, rockbox can read sdhc cards. but the of does not. Thats why it doesnt work over usb. (until rockboxs own usb is ready)
18:44:50nim-busOK sorry card LOL
18:45:50nim-busI must say the rock box project is a great one. I must donate to the cause. I assume there is a place to do so. I wonder if that helps?
18:46:32domonokynim-bus: there is a paypal button on the website, it helps for developer meetings and beer :-)
18:46:49n1sand equipment
18:46:56nim-busIs anyone in here involved in the developement etc?
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18:47:05n1syes a lot of us are :)
18:47:36nim-busDo people meet in person or online. If in person where? I am up in Manchester NH. Is there anyone up here in COLD country lol
18:48:27n1snim-bus: some devs gather for a devcon about once each year
18:48:30*evilnick_7 points nim-bus at #rockbox-community for any chat that isn't directly about Rockbox
18:48:31domonokyonce in a while there is DevCon (see wiki) where we meet in person..
18:49:00domonokyat such meetings we do such nices things as this: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/TowerOfRockbox :-)
18:52:08nim-busha ha ha that looks like fun
18:53:11nim-busDo any of the members of the group get into TALKING using their rock box devices? that is my main interest actually. I love talking and meeting people via digital voicefiles. I also podcast. Check out www.scottpodcast.com
18:53:47nim-busI just completed a donation to the project from my ebay funds. I will add a bit more later as I sell more stuff!!
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19:43:52soapI had filed a bug report with QTScrobbler for improperly handling UTF-8 ID3v2.4 tags. obo came back and said my provided scrobbler.log was actually in ISO 8859-1 and implied that Rockbox passed the metadata straight through from the tag to the log.
19:44:47soapWhat confuses me about this is that all my mp3s were tagged by Foobar2000, which claims to use ID3v2.4 UTF-8. My FAT filesystem (for what it is worth, I think nothing) is in UTF-8 at that.
19:45:11soapIs there possibly some setting in Rockbox that I have setup wrong?
19:47:14kadobansoap: there's a "Default Codepage" in settings, but it's in display so i have no idea if that could have anything to do with anything (i suspect not)
19:47:30soapDefault codepage is set for UTF-8.
19:48:34soapI'm also asking this at #foobar2000, as perhaps my tags are not what I think they are - as non UTF-8 tags would explain why WPS display of "unusual" characters is broken, despite using unifont.
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19:53:04pixelmasoap: looked at them with a different tagging tool? But if they work with unifont it only sounds like a problem with missing characters, not codepage issue (to me)
19:53:38soapI'm sorry if I was unclear. They don't work, even with unifont.
19:55:36pixelmaoh, misread... so not broken in the sense of seeing the missing char box but seeing to (or so) different unusual characters in place of one?
19:55:47pixelmas/to/two
19:56:03soapaye
19:57:03soapSo I agree, I need to verify the codepage of the tags. I threw this out here to make sure, in my round-a-bout questioning way, that Rockbox was not responsible for reading a tag in codepage X and writing a scrobbler.log in codepage Y.
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20:01:37kadobanisn't there a "new" menu API usable in plugins? i'm trying to grep for an example, but failing. specifically i'm trying to find a way to do a menu with custom strings without having a big list of "case <raw number>:"s in a switch statement
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21:40:25kugelkadoban: you can always use an enum if numbers aren't your taste
21:40:56kadobankugel: yeah, i thought that there was a pretty way to keep the next to each other...maybe i was thinking of something else, i can't find it
21:41:02kadobanthem*
21:45:25qballhi kugel
21:45:35kugelhi
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22:31:56webguest98Hi, is Ogg Vorbis playback still glitchy on the Sansa Clip?
22:33:21BigBambiCould well be, the clip isn't released and is suitable only for developers at this time
22:34:50webguest98Thanks. Will keep an eye out for eventual release.
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22:41:38bertrikwebguest98, actually ogg vorbis works better for me than mp3
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23:51:17kadobanthe statusbar is really bad at drawing itself in menus in plugins. is that a known bug? can't find an entry in FS except for WPS related
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