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#rockbox log for 2009-04-13

00:00:50 Nick FlynDice_ is now known as FlynDice (n=jack@c-24-19-225-90.hsd1.wa.comcast.net)
00:03:53kugelFlynDice: ping
00:04:12FlynDicekugel: pong
00:04:45kugelFlynDice: can you test FS #10120 + using the Fuze's scrollwheel function?
00:05:06kugelsko reported it works nicely
00:05:26 Quit merbanan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:05:46FlynDicesure give me a few minutes to tie some thing up
00:10:00 Join faemir [0] (n=faemir@88-106-238-71.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com)
00:29:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:31:57 Join KBH [0] (n=hbk@pool-71-96-74-73.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net)
00:38:50 Quit Seed ("cu, Andre")
00:39:18 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@79.97.77.138)
00:39:36 Quit HBK (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
00:44:54bertrikkugel, what is wrong with your clip radio?
00:48:25 Part Keripo
00:51:58kugelbertrik: doesn't pick up the stations
00:52:12kugellike, nothing in the 100MHz+ region
00:52:57kugelwell, I'm not surprised, it's apprarently physically broken somehow anywa
00:52:59kugely
00:54:43bertrikthere is also a frequency (96 MHz IIRC) that the radio would tune to that is a multiple of the crystal clock and appears like a completely silent station
00:55:30 Quit {phoenix} (Remote closed the connection)
00:55:40bertrikand I think there's a bug when you try to change a radio setting when the radio hasn't been powered up yet
00:56:07kugelit worked fine some time ago, and it always worked fine on my ex-fuze
01:00
01:02:19 Quit bertrik (Remote closed the connection)
01:04:42FlynDicekugel: FS #10120 works very nicely for me
01:05:21kugelwith or without Fuze's scrollwheel?
01:05:28kugelscrollwheel function, that is
01:06:15FlynDicethe last patch that's posted, let me go look
01:07:57FlynDicescrolllwheel-polling-v2b.diff
01:08:49FlynDiceyou want me to try with the patch sko posted also?
01:12:49kugeltry to use the fue's scrollwheel function please
01:13:06kugelthat's in neither patch
01:18:33 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
01:20:56FlynDicekugel: Ok I'll give it a shot later and see how it works. Heading out for festivities in a few.
01:26:06 Join itcheg [0] (i=62db4767@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-c25ea6f0149cc1e7)
01:29:25 Join demmon [0] (n=demmon@77.28.1.100)
01:30:10demmoni have philips hdd6230 gogear and i saw there is rockbox for olympus m-rome looks almost the same as mine :) will it work
01:32:26 Quit demmon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:33:08rasherdemmon: Rockbox has been ported to a few of the other gogear devices, but hdd6230 doesn't appear to be one of them
01:33:28rasherIt doesn't run completely reliably on any of them though
01:33:30 Join dreamlayers [0] (n=dreamlay@bas4-windsor12-1279315722.dsl.bell.ca)
01:34:17rasherHe already left...
01:46:57froggymanI have some DRM AAC music that i want to play on my rockboxed iPod, whats the recomended way of converting them?
01:47:18rasherThere is none.
01:47:57froggymanohh, so i would basicly have to burn it to a CD then and re rip it?
01:47:58 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
01:48:00 Join amiconn_ [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
01:48:17 Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.)
01:48:20 Join pixelma_ [50] (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
01:48:20 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
01:48:29rasherYou're on your own.
01:48:39 Quit dmb (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
01:48:41 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (n=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
01:48:55froggymanohh ok
01:56:23 Quit froggyman ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
01:56:33 Join froggyman [0] (n=47ba40e2@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f8332867267a5d25)
01:57:48froggymanwhy are so many patches in the flyspray left un attended and out of sync for several years instead of being removed or put back into sync?
02:00
02:00:35rasherfroggyman: because the authors don't keep them up to date. We generally don't close them unless the function they performs is added to Rockbox or deemed unwanted
02:03:28froggymanohh ok makes sense
02:03:57 Join PaulJam_ [0] (i=Paule@vpn-3005.gwdg.de)
02:06:45 Join dmb [0] (n=dmb@unaffiliated/dmb)
02:06:53froggymansorry for so many questions, but why does the apple firmaware for the iPod seem to take way longer to load even compared to it being turned through the diagnostics
02:08:19dreamlayersfroggyman: I don't know what you mean by "it being turned through the diagnostics".
02:09:31JdGordondreamlayers: hey, i've been afk fgor a few days so completly out of it... have you had any more luck with the progress bar not getting updated problem?
02:09:40dreamlayersOn the 5G the diagnostics are small and in flash. The OF needs to be loaded from disk, and then it needs to load the database. The OF is much bigger than Rockbox.
02:09:54JdGordonI've just read your comment from friday so ill have a look in that area a bit
02:10:07dreamlayersJdGordon: Yes, I found out what was going on and I have a solution. I just don't know if it is the right solution.
02:10:10froggymanlike it being in hibernate, and you can actually shut it off through an optiong in the diagnostics (so its not in standby)
02:10:23 Quit barrywardell ()
02:10:26froggymansorry for that confusion
02:12:03 Join yashwa7 [0] (n=vijay034@c-75-72-150-85.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
02:12:35yashwa7Hi all, I'm a GSoC applicant needing a little bit of help for my task.
02:13:11yashwa7I setup the rockbox with cygwin, built it and am able to run with the simulator.
02:13:47yashwa7For my task, I need to write a new codec which outputs silence samples for 10 seconds.
02:13:50 Join motionman95 [0] (i=459792ac@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-06a682b97c4c110b)
02:14:25yashwa7I just followed the wiki section for writing a new codec and rebuilt the codebase.
02:15:05yashwa7However when I run a sample file (sample.yash) it just comes out after some time without running my codec.
02:15:43motionman95What method do you guys use to test your plugins? Do you just copy them over to your players, (which I think takes forever!) or do you use something else, like the simulator?
02:15:45*gevaerts has never done codec work before, so he can't really help
02:16:11yashwa7I use the simulator.
02:16:20gevaertsmotionman95: both I think. It probably depends on personal taste
02:17:03froggymanmotionman95: what one were you thinking of writing, or are you still undecided
02:18:46dreamlayersyashwa7: Is your metadata function being called?
02:19:13yashwa7Yep, it's getting called.
02:19:46yashwa7Because when I'm on the previous track, it displayed NEXT TRACK : "Codec works".
02:19:55 Quit PaulJam_ (".")
02:20:09yashwa7where "codec works" is the title I set in my metadate function.
02:20:14yashwa7and just return true
02:20:34 Quit PaulJam__ (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
02:20:57JdGordongevaerts: you dont like the wps idea in the touchscreen wiki page?
02:22:51yashwa7I am wondering how to use the DEBUGF statements....
02:23:47JdGordonDEBUGF is the same as printf for sim builds
02:24:01yashwa7Ok, thanx.
02:24:36 Quit tvelocity (Remote closed the connection)
02:24:48 Quit CaptainKewl ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )")
02:25:09gevaertsJdGordon: the way described there is a good fallback, but a lot of actions that are possible from the wps have a corresponding icon, so I think it should be possible to do things like pausing by touching the play/pause icon
02:25:40gevaertsor actually, I think it should be possible to do that automatically, without adding extra tags
02:26:03kugelusing viewports for this seems ideal
02:26:09gevaertsNot everything is possible in this way, but a lot of it is
02:26:17JdGordonsure, but how on earth do we find out which rectangle has the play icon? and what happens when the wps doesnt have the icon at all?
02:26:20kugelthen other screens can be adabted too
02:26:48JdGordonusing viewports is a bad idea because it means breaking compatability with other targets with the same lcd size
02:26:57kugelnot at all
02:27:22kugelalso, we don't care about that as of now either
02:27:32JdGordonsince when?
02:27:40kugelwps which use rtc tags won't work on targets without rtc
02:27:51 Join evilnick [0] (n=evilnick@pool-173-52-140-21.nycmny.east.verizon.net)
02:27:52JdGordonthats different
02:27:57kugelhow?
02:28:08JdGordonand by the way... the RTC tags ARE there for that very reason
02:28:20kugelsame resolution, but still incompatible, that's the same
02:28:34gevaertsJdGordon: whatever is shown in %mp has a bounding box, so you can use that. If the icon isn't there, you can use explicit areas
02:29:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:29:16kugelviewports can a) take a additional parameter (which can possibly ignored on non-touchscreen for compability), or tag it in the definition
02:29:29*kugel adds a b) before "or"
02:29:30JdGordon%mp is just a variable to say the play status... it is usually used in a conditional, but that conditional could be showing a image, or enabling a viewport, or just doing text... way too complicated to figure it out
02:30:18gevaertshm, yes. If it's an image or text it should work, but viewports are tricky
02:30:19kugelbackwards compability isn't an issue anyway, touchscreens usually have a way higher resolution than non-touchscreen ones
02:30:34gevaertskugel: D2 is the same as ipod 5G
02:30:51JdGordonand beast if we allow both orientations
02:31:23kugel"usually" :p
02:31:54kugelhow come we start to care about cross-target compability of wpses?
02:32:00kugelviewports are still ideal, imo
02:32:25gevaertsJdGordon: this %R tag (to use the TouchpadInterface naming) would work in viewport context I guess?
02:32:53motionman95Just to clarify on this Simulator thing, I can just run "make" and use the output .rock in the Sim?
02:33:18JdGordonI'm not sure... it doesnt really make sense to have it relative to viewports... I would just have %R use the full screen
02:33:29 Part Dhraakellian ("Meddle not in the affairs of ircops, for they are (not so) subtle, and quick to anger.")
02:33:43JdGordonmotionman95: if you have used configure to make a simulator targte than yes
02:33:51JdGordonmake && make install to so it properly
02:34:01JdGordons/so/do
02:34:21kugeleverything is relative to viewports, why should %R not be=
02:34:23kugel?
02:34:37JdGordonviewports are for DISPLAY!
02:34:48gevaertsUsing screen coordinates would make some things very awkward to do, like e.g. a popup with buttons (similar to the D2 OF), or a WPS that has different icon positions depending on whether there is AA
02:34:57 Join midijunkie [0] (n=Miranda@pD9545524.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
02:35:55JdGordonwont that just be confusing?
02:36:53 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
02:36:58gevaertspossibly, but we don't have a rule against confusing WPSes
02:37:27JdGordontrue
02:37:39JdGordonseen as the whole thing is still an idea we can do whatever
02:37:54JdGordonI just thing adding more params to the exsisting viewport tags are a bad idea
02:38:27gevaertsAlso, working in viewport coordinates makes things easier for the WPS authors I think, as they can just copy other coordinates
02:39:35JdGordonfair enough
02:39:56 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@84-51-130-71.judith186.adsl.metronet.co.uk)
02:40:39kugelmaking %R the only thing not relative to viewports will be confusing too
02:40:55*gevaerts goes wild for a moment
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02:41:35 Join bmbl [0] (n=Miranda@unaffiliated/bmbl)
02:41:48gevaertsIf you don't restrict %R to the normal actions, you could have it set custom variables (booleans) that could be used as conditionals elsewhere
02:42:28*JdGordon 's head explodes!
02:42:34JdGordonsetting custom vars?!
02:42:38JdGordonnormal actions?!
02:43:07gevaertsthings like this mode tag you built a while ago (the one that triggered one of the many custom-buttons flamewars)
02:43:53JdGordonthat was well and truley killed wasnt it?
02:44:20gevaertsYes, but on a touchscreen you aren't redefining an existing button :)
02:44:33JdGordonwhich is also a supposed nono :p
02:47:25 Join MethoS- [0] (n=lem@host-091-097-241-138.ewe-ip-backbone.de)
02:47:31gevaertsBasically a touchscreen has an infinite (or nearly) amount of buttons, and unlike normal buttons they are very context-dependent, so I don't see a good reason to have the same aversion for creative button-use as on non-touchscreen targets
02:50:23yashwa7Hi, I'm involved in writing a dummy codec, and have got stuck.
02:50:54dreamlayersyashwa7: Was DEBUGF helpful?
02:51:17yashwa7After I added DEBUGF, I started seeing simulator crashes.
02:51:35yashwa7The DEBUGF statement is not allowed inside metadata function.
02:51:55yashwa7I used it in my codec but the string is not getting printed.
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02:53:12 Join CaptainKewl [0] (n=jason@207-237-172-77.c3-0.nyr-ubr4.nyr.ny.cable.rcn.com)
02:53:16yashwa7There's only one thing that I didn't follow according to what was mentioned in the wiki for "how to write codec".
02:53:51heiligehannahhello, anyone knows how to update a theme on the new site?
02:54:06yashwa7apps/codecs/Makefile
02:54:06yashwa7 * Add a rule like ${OBJDIR}/wav.elf : $(OBJDIR)/wav.o
02:54:40yashwa7The makefile is changed to Codec.make but this line didn't make sense to me.
02:55:39dreamlayersyashwa7: Yeah, that step seems obsolete.
02:55:52yashwa7ok,
02:56:09yashwa7otherwise, I have followed everything, and even got the codec built.
02:56:19yashwa7along with the metadata function.
02:58:09yashwa7may i get some ideas for debugging?
02:58:19dreamlayersgdb has helped me a lot
02:59:47yashwa7oh I need to enable debug flags while building so that -g gets added?
03:00
03:00:47dreamlayersI usually build sims with debug and logf enabled to help debugging.
03:01:07*JdGordon just uses printf
03:03:08dreamlayersGDB makes some things much easier. For example I used it to see what's going on with the FS #10102 progress bar problem.
03:03:18kugelyashwa7: sim is always with debugging
03:04:02yashwa7kugel : ok
03:04:05JdGordongdb is a bit of a pain though if you dont really know where to look
03:05:13 Quit bmbl ("Woah!")
03:05:37saratoga_workyeah i don't have the slightest idea how to use GDB
03:06:21kugelI just use the awesome gdb plugin of geany (my editor)
03:06:26kugelused most problems with it
03:06:34kugelused to solve*
03:07:26dreamlayersIt's easy to set breakpoints on one or a few relevant functions and then print important variables. eg. for the progress bar issue, audio_current_track() and track_changed_callback().
03:09:03dreamlayersYou can even do stuff like "b codec_main" when the codec isn't loaded.
03:09:24motionman95JdGordon: So your saying that I can't just download the SIm of the rockbox page? I have to build it myself?
03:10:02JdGordonumm... what did you want to do? you cant use a .rock from a target build with the sim
03:11:24motionman95Oh. I think I see. Thanks!
03:12:43 Quit heiligehannah ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
03:21:25dreamlayersIs there a policy regarding braces, other than for the first opening brace of a function?
03:22:19yashwa7I see that it doesn't even get into codec_main() and wanted to check if someone knows why.
03:22:37kugeldreamlayers: nope, but I'd welcome one
03:23:04yashwa7The codec.o file gets removed while building whereas the .elf and .codec files are there.
03:25:09 Quit motionman95 ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
03:25:36dreamlayerskugel: I'd also welcome one. When writing the 5G iPod LCD sleep patch, I put those braces on the same line because I prefer that and I saw it in other parts of Rockbox. Today I noticed that all other braces in lcd-video.c are on a different line, and I'm wondering if I should commit a patch to make it consistent within that file.
03:27:33kugeldreamlayers: well, I think there's a hidden guideline to not obfuscate code by mixing styles
03:27:47kugelbut, I'd prefer putting the braces on the next line too
03:28:12rasherdreamlayers: Follow the brace style of the file you're editing
03:29:05dreamlayersI don't feel that deserves to be called obfuscation, but I can see that it doesn't look nice. So I guess I should do a "code police" type commit?
03:29:25dreamlayersyashwa7: Can you see if the file is being buffered? The debug menu allows you to view information about the buffer.
03:29:29kugelwell, if there's no guideline, then there's no police
03:29:33 Quit agaffney (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:29:37rasherkugel: There is a guideline.
03:29:51kugelnot about braces other than the function ones
03:29:56rasherHuh?
03:30:01rasherThere IS!
03:30:16rasher"When changing code, follow the code style of the file you are editing. When writing new files, you may use the brace placement style of your choice."
03:30:45kugelyes, the follow the existing style
03:30:51dreamlayersOkay, I'll take care of that in lcd-video.c and be careful in the future.
03:30:57kugelthat's not the one I was refering to
03:31:06rasherIt's perfectly clear..
03:31:23rasherThe creator of the file gets to decide, after that, everyone follows that style.
03:32:09dreamlayersrasher: Thanks for pointing this out.
03:32:47rasherkugel: It's not a hidden guideline. See docs/CONTRIBUTING
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03:41:15 Join owen1_ [0] (n=oren@cpe-76-174-48-77.socal.res.rr.com)
03:42:32kugelrasher: ok
03:44:13owen1_i want to install rockbox on my ipod nano. the FAQ said to read the manual. there are many pictures in the manuals page. which one do i need?
03:44:27 Join Strife89 [0] (n=nds@204.116.244.200)
03:46:14dreamlayersowen1_: You need the "iPod Nano 1st gen" manual. (... and I hope you have a 1st gen Nano.)
03:46:33owen1_dreamlayers: i have 1 gig nano. how do i know the gen?
03:48:06dreamlayersowen1_: 1GB must be first gen
03:48:07Strife89Is the case design curvy?
03:49:12scorcheStrife89: if it is 1 gig, it cant be anything else...
03:49:28owen1_dreamlayers: Strife89 : i guess it's first gen! awesome
03:50:01*Strife89 doesn't always keep up with models by capacity.
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03:56:08owen1_i get "mountpoint is not writeable" after running ./rbutilqt
03:57:32owen1_(and choosing my ipod 1 gen from the dropdown)
03:58:29owen1_do i need to delete the content of my ipod? i have some old apple OS folders there.
03:58:54owen1_like iPod_control
03:59:37 Part Strife89
04:00
04:00:03dreamlayersowen1_: Check if the filesystem is writable. Can you copy files to it? You don't need to delete anything.
04:00:47owen1_dreamlayers: drwxr-xr-x 6 root root 12288 1969-12-31 16:00 nano
04:01:00owen1_(my mounted folder is /media/nano)
04:01:53dreamlayersowen1_: So, are you root?
04:02:13owen1_dreamlayers: no.
04:02:33owen1_dreamlayers: can i change nano folder to by me instead?
04:02:41owen1_to be me.
04:03:50owen1_dreamlayers: that's what i do to mount my nano each time i plug it - sudo mount /dev/disk/by-id/usb-Apple_iPod_000A27001829456C-0:0-part2 /media/nano
04:04:52dreamlayersowen1_: Yes you can, but you need to ask someone more familiar with your OS.
04:05:07owen1_dreamlayers: thanks. i'll do it and run again the installer.
04:07:55yashwa7dreamlayers : i found out the problem, with some printf's. It was just that the codec didn't get copied to the .rockbox/codecs directory.
04:08:17yashwa7Now my codec runs but the output is not what I expect.
04:08:36yashwa7I was wondering if someone can give comments on my codec that I've written.
04:08:45dreamlayersyashwa7: After you build a codec, you need "make install" to install it into the sim.
04:09:07yashwa7yep, my fault.
04:09:23dreamlayersyashwa7: If the codec wasn't there, you should have gotten "Codec failure".
04:09:46dreamlayersSo, what's the problem with it now?
04:09:48yashwa7No, i was getting codec load error: -1
04:10:09yashwa7that also comes only when I play some valid file and come to my file.
04:10:25yashwa7Ya, now the problem is as follows:
04:10:50yashwa7I keep my stream empty since I'm not going use it at all.
04:11:32yashwa7This is probably enabling the stop_codec or new_track flag because of which I
04:11:43yashwa7break out of my while loop, so I just removed that check.
04:11:52 Quit froggyman ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
04:12:19yashwa7My while loop has the following :
04:12:48yashwa7while (elapsed_time < 10 secs)
04:13:03Lloreanyashwa7: Please use a pastebin if you're going to be trying to share code for debugging.
04:13:25yashwa7yep, sorry will do that.
04:14:33yashwa7dreamlayers : my code is here, http://pastebin.com/d7ee235ed
04:14:54yashwa7The while loop finishes too fast and doesn't run for 10 seconds.
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04:19:15dreamlayersyashwa7: How quickly does it finish? It can finish too fast because data is being stored in the PCM buffer.
04:19:24 Part cmwslw ("Ex-Chat")
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04:21:11yashwa7it runs for around 1~2 seconds.
04:21:33yashwa7I do an yield(), and I thought it should play the samples.
04:24:08 Quit itcheg ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client")
04:26:53dreamlayersyashwa7: I can't see an obvious problem, and I have to leave now. Sorry.
04:27:01 Quit dreamlayers ()
04:27:22yashwa7gevaerts : I'm wondering how I will submit my task though it might be partially complete.
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04:29:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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04:54:05owen1_i chaged the owner of my mounted ipod: drwxr-x−−- 6 oren oren 12288 2009-04-12 19:50 nano . i get 'permission for disk access denied' when trying to install rockbox.
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04:54:40jlyoDoes anyone know how to convert video for the Sansa Fuze using ffmepg/mplayer/transcode or similar?
04:55:25jlyoI can't find anything out by googling for it. It seems like nobody knows.
04:55:56scorchethere isnt a rockbox build for the fuze yet...
04:56:28jlyoIts very developmental it seems
04:57:14scorcheright...it is primarily for development at the moment...which is why it isnt made available yet ;)
04:57:56scorchethat said, see the PluginMpegplayer wiki page
04:59:06saratoga_worki don't even thnk mpegplayer works on the fuze
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05:02:31scorchehence the development lines, but we shall see...
05:03:30owen1_in the middle of 'getting themes installation' i got an 'unknwon error'. what should i do next?
05:04:42scorcheignore it for now and go to themes.rockbox.org to download manually
05:05:07rasherUnknown error shouldn't happen..
05:07:18scorcherasher: no?...we pushed out a new rbutil?
05:07:34rasherNo, but it should be giving an error with a nice error message
05:07:58jlyoI'm not running the rockbox port the the fuze. I'm running Sandisk's firmware. I figured this channel was my best hope. Is there somewhere else I should ask?
05:08:19rasherjlyo: The Sandisk forums. Not here.
05:08:30scorchejlyo: rockbox subjects only here
05:08:56jlyoOk, thank you for your time.
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05:11:52owen1_can i simply move mp3 files anywhere i want?
05:11:59owen1_rockbox is amazing!
05:15:46owen1_i just moved folder with some mp3. can i simply hear play them with rockbox?
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05:17:12saratoga_workyes
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07:33:08owen1_how to shutdown rockbox?
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07:33:41scorcheowen1_: i am sure the manual covers things like this...
07:34:38owen1_scorche: true. found it - long 'play' key.
07:34:56JayHarumornin scorche
07:36:39owen1_after playing 1 hour with rockbox i am amazed. this is awesome. how is it differ from iPodLinux project?
07:37:51scorcheowen1_: the 2 projects have completely separate goals...rockbox tends to focus on being the best music player it can be, while iPL tends to be more about fun, experiments, and an OS that just happens to also have an application that plays music
07:39:02owen1_scorche: got it. i'll stick with rockbox.
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07:54:21raymanismhello everyone... I need some help using mknkboot to patch my gigabeat S's firmware
07:56:29raymanismI'm not very good at compling, but I have compiled my own builds before (back in the early days of RB on the H300)....
07:57:46raymanismI read all the entries on the subject at rockbox.org, and I know that the Gigabeat S isn't supported yet... that's why I came here, instead of posting at the forum...
07:59:38raymanismI have all the necessary files (mknkboot.c, NK.bin, and the bootloader) and I am using Cygwin... I followed the instructions at the RB wiki to install Cygwin btw..
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08:02:19raymanismwhat else do I need to be able to patch the NK.bin? "mknkboot <firmware file> <boot file> <output file>"
08:06:51raymanismI placed all the three files (mknkboot NK.bin and the bootloader) in a directory, ran Cygwin, went to that directory, and did as the above instructions (with the appropriate file names of course).... and it said command not found or something
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08:14:13JdGordonno dreamlayers :(
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08:59:28jhujhitirockbox doesn't seem to understand id3 tags with track numbers like "A1, A2, B1, B2". is this intentional?
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09:02:36JdGordonyes
09:03:04jhujhitiis that because the track field shouldn't contain letters or because someone was a tad bit lazy? ;)
09:03:45JdGordonthe first
09:04:46jhujhitifoobar2000 doesn't seem to take issue with letters. does the id3 format have an official spec?
09:05:51jhujhitiright then, google
09:08:56jhujhitispec limitation indeed...
09:09:08jhujhitiis there a way to do what i want?
09:09:34jhujhiti(namely make rockbox display track numbers as A1, A2, etc)
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09:18:52JdGordonjhujhiti: you're calling them numbers.... why are you putting letters in them?
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09:19:48jhujhitiJdGordon: i'm calling them numbers because most software calls the field "track number". i'm putting letters in them because they're vinyl rips, so the anal-retentive correct track number has a side letter
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09:21:27JdGordonthe more correct wya would be to use the disk number field then
09:22:10jhujhiti<nitpicky>it's a side, not a disc
09:22:21jhujhiti(you will notice i did not close that tag ;x)
09:22:23JdGordonwell... if you want it to work
09:23:23jhujhitihmm, it's not a bad idea though
09:23:37jhujhition a related note, do you know of any id3 tag editor that doesn't *suck*?
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09:28:07*scorche notes the change of on-topicness
09:28:27jhujhitiit's.. tangentially related
09:31:26scorchethis channel is a bit strict with the topicness (especially as we have a different channel for off-topic matters like this)....it either is directly rockbox related, or not ;)
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10:10:03nls_webraymanism: you need to run it like ./mknkboot
10:10:33*nls_web goes to operate on the c240
10:16:19raymanism@nls_web: can you elaborate? :)
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10:45:52nls_webraymanism: . is not in PATH so you need to specify the path to the executable: . so run it as you tried to do but prepend with ./
10:48:19nls_webhmm, the pp chip in my c240 is nvidia branded and marked pp5023A-TDF
10:49:21linuxstbnls_web: Curious...
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10:54:01*bertrik wonders what triggered n1s to open his c240 and look at the chips
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10:56:54webmindgood healthy dose of curiosity? :)
10:58:17nls_webwell, it had developed an intermittent connection to the headphones so i disassembled it to see if any solerpoints were broken around the jack
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11:06:29bertrikweird to see a pp5023, I thought rockbox considered c240s as pp5022
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11:06:57bertrikI'll check if I still have any photos of my c240
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11:09:52bertrikoh, I do have photos of the insides, but I didn't take off the stickers on the PP chip ... (I just see P..... F, 0703 Korea)
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11:32:23pixelma[02:27:39] <kugel> wps which use rtc tags won't work on targets without rtc <- that's not true
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11:51:37nls_webthe operation was not a success :( still no proper connection after resoldering the jack, maybe the jack itself is broken...,
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13:25:11MassaGi everybody!
13:25:20Massas/G/H/
13:26:02MassaAnybody online now?
13:27:43motionman95I still can't figure out how to use settings_parseline(). I've looked at all the plugins that use it, but I'm still confused. I would be able to use it if I knew exactly what it did with the params given.
13:28:04linuxstbmotionman95: Then look at the source to the function itself.
13:28:24motionman95Ooohh! Where's that!
13:29:08linuxstbSomewhere in apps/ I would guess. (I don't know exactly)
13:29:51MassaIt's in "apps/misc.c"
13:33:48MassaIs somebody here who knows how to install the rockbox bootloader on a Sansa Fuze? (I know it's unsupported...)
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13:36:30linuxstbMassa: You need to merge the Rockbox bootloader (bootloader-fuze.sansa) with an original firmware .bin file using mkamsboot, and then install that merged file onto your Fuze in the same way as a normal firmware update.
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13:47:02robin0800There are two posts in forum WPS about the new theme site, hope you don't mind me drawing your attention to them?
13:47:24Massalinuxstb: and where can I find mkamsboot?
13:47:54bertrikrbutil/mkamsboot
13:50:44Massabertrik: Thanks - I have to build it manually; I thought it'd be automatically built together with the tools :)
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13:51:46linuxstbMassa: Just type "make" in rbutil/mkamsboot/
13:52:47Massalinuxstb: I already did it - now I try to find out how to use it, but there are always error messages...
13:53:36MassaI tried "mkamsboot bootloader.bin fuzea.bin new.bin"
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13:53:48linuxstbMassa: Re-read my message
13:55:11Massalinuxstb: ??? I compiled it and now I try to use it. The call without parameters says "Usage: mkamsboot <firmware file> <boot file> <output file>"
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13:55:46linuxstbMassa: My message from about 19 minutes ago when I explained what you needed to do.
13:56:06fuzziewho is responsible for the ipodpatcher code?
13:56:39linuxstbfuzzie: Everyone and no-one, like the rest of Rockbox. What's the problem/question?
13:56:53fuzzieit doesn't build on big-endian because it tries re-defining macros as functions, but the pre-processor expands the macros first - fuzzie.org/nfs/rockbox_ipodpatcher.txt">http://fuzzie.org/nfs/rockbox_ipodpatcher.txt makes it work but perhaps there is a better fix?
13:57:44linuxstbfuzzie: What OS is that? OS X?
13:57:50fuzzielinux
13:57:57Massalinuxstb: aah - now I got it: "mkamsboot fuzea.bin bootloader-fuze.sansa new.bin" does the trick ;) - Thanks!
13:58:15linuxstbMassa: That looks right ;)
13:58:18MassaNow I'll put it on the Fuze and hope it doesn't brick :)
13:59:40linuxstbfuzzie: I would be probably choose to rename those functions so they don't clash.
14:00
14:00:25linuxstb(and make them static)
14:02:08linuxstbMassa: Remember the port is not supported...
14:02:53Massalinuxstb: I know - I'm just curios what works and what now ;)
14:05:24fuzzielinuxstb: that would be great too, just wouldn't know what to name them. fuzzie.org/nfs/rockbox_ipodpatcher2.txt">http://fuzzie.org/nfs/rockbox_ipodpatcher2.txt builds fine, just a trivial search-and-replace..
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14:08:26harguthello
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14:09:24hargutis there any active work in progress for the iaudio 7?
14:12:54bertrikthe iaudio 7 wiki page hasn't been updated since december, so I think that's a no
14:13:29hargutbertrik: thanks.
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14:25:30Massalinuxstb: it works - even music plays (I didn't notice the "ladies and gentlemen we have sound" message at the mailinglist :)
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14:30:53pixelmadid someone else have the problem that playback stutters in the sim when changing volume? (This is a cross-compiled win X5 sim, r20699)
14:31:34pixelmaplaying MP3, vbr ~170kbit/s
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14:36:17CtcpIgnored 4 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
14:36:17*pixelma also notices some weird static noise :\\
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14:36:49*LambdaCalculus37 needs a couple more testers for FS #10108
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14:37:25LambdaCalculus37So far using gmake -r and make -r doesn't seem to break anything in Linux, but I would like to know if maybe a *BSD or other *nix owner can try it out.
14:44:14linuxstbLambdaCalculus37: I would say go ahead and commit. IIUC, using "-r" means that "make" only uses rules explicity set in the Makefiles (the gcc and binutils Makefiles), so if it works in one place, it should work everywhere - i.e. it means that those Makefiles don't assume any built-in rules from make.
14:46:45LambdaCalculus37linuxstb: Done deal. I'll commit when I get a chance to get access.
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15:16:45raymanism2hey everyone... still having problems with mknkboot
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15:23:42kugelFlynDice: ping
15:23:50kugelDomonoky: ping
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15:24:43kugelmoos: ping
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15:27:43mooskugel: pong
15:28:00kugelmoos: new patch at FS #10127, please test :)
15:29:02mooskugel: ok, let's me few minutes
15:29:46moosbtw, AMS ports is going pretty well those days :)
15:29:56moos*is/are
15:30:28kugelmoos: yep, I plan to look at making mkamsboot more sane and rbutil integration soon
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15:30:53kugelmore sane as in, build-in the bootloaders and maybe patch the firmware in-place
15:31:04skomoos: yeah, right, i'm using the of only for file transfer since the ams sansas can play mp3
15:31:04mooswee, rbutil is definitively an important step for support
15:31:52moossko: long time since I don't use any of OF on those players I have :)
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15:32:52BXCracerBut still we need usb driver
15:32:57BXCracerfor ams
15:33:11kugelthat's not essential imo
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15:36:43mooskugel: building...
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15:48:44mooskugel: working well here
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15:49:08kugelthen I commit it
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15:50:18mooswell done! (just maybe a bit too easy to wrap, but I guess that's subjective)
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15:56:28kugeltoo easy?
15:56:55kugelyou should be forced to scroll very slowly or even stop if you want to wrap
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15:58:05kugelmoos: what would you like more?
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16:01:35mooskugel: I guess that is because I'm not a wheel user.
16:02:57moosbut I'd say nice anyway, go ahead
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16:10:37kugelmoos: done :)
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16:14:05mooskugel: nice :)
16:14:37moosand welcome to sko in Rockbox credits btw
16:14:50skothank you
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16:40:24FlynDicesko: kugel: Most excellent work on e200v2 scrollwheel!
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16:46:40*kugel spots http://cgi.ebay.de/Li-Polymer-BATTERY-for-SANSA-SANDISK-FUZE-4GB-8GB-ACCU_W0QQitemZ270358461923QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CE_MP3Access_RL?hash=item270358461923&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318
16:46:53kugela sansa fuze replacement battery
16:47:12kugelit says 550 mAh. Could that also apply to the original battery?
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16:52:10bertrikkugel, that could be about right, e200 is about 730 mAh, c200 is 530 mAh for comparison
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16:54:10bertrikif we knew the markings on the fuze battery, we could look up the capacity from the manufacturer site
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16:56:55pixelmaabout putting the SVN themes onto the theme site - I thought about doing this but then was thinking it would be much easier for some site admin (as he wouldn''t need the confirmation step for every single one)
16:57:22bertrikkugel, do you still have your fuze?
16:57:52bertrikI assume any damage done by disassembly is not going to be a big problem anymore ...
16:58:08rasherpixelma: why not?
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16:58:51kugelbertrik: the rest of it, yes
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16:59:41pixelmarasher: would have thought that an admin had access to the database directly
16:59:58rasherpixelma: Sure, but it's not really a lot easier :)
17:00
17:00:09rasherI'd just do it manually if I were to upload them
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17:01:34pixelmaah hmh
17:02:40kugelbertrik: the battery is in some kind of silver foil, not in a plastic case?
17:02:50kugels/?/./
17:03:01kugelcan i just cut the foil off?
17:03:20bertrikdoes it have letters and numbers on it? like ATL ....?
17:03:37*pixelma args at hitting FS #10102
17:04:03kugelno
17:04:20bertrikli-polymer can be very flexibly shaped IIRC and doesn't need to be in a rigid container
17:04:25rasherpixelma: The only one we don't have relicensed yet is marquee
17:04:33bertrikkugel, nothing at all?
17:05:10bertrikI would be very careful with the battery, and not try to rip parts off
17:05:10kugelbertrik: these numbers are on it 608695 354239 a76814
17:05:16pixelmarasher: maybe I'll find time by the end of the week and try my luck if no-one beats me to it
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17:06:17bertrikthe 354239 could mean the dimensions of the battery, lik 3.5cm x 4.2cm x 3.9 mm
17:07:29*pixelma wonders what would happen if someone submits a screenshot for the same theme and resolution but different targets (e.g. the Ondio screenshots actually have a different colour than the Recorders' now )
17:10:05*kugel wonders why the fuze is so broken, there's no obvious damage on the mainboard
17:14:14kugelbertrik: shall I cut the silver foil away?
17:14:33bertrikkugel, I was hoping to find it on this page: http://www.atlbattery.com/eng/productseries.asp but can't find it
17:14:36bertrikno
17:15:10bertrikI think it's dangerous to mess with it too much, especially after it's already been run over
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17:16:04kugelyou think the stuff in it is going to explode?
17:17:01bertrikyes, maybe not explode, but possibly burn
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17:23:51saratoga_workbetrik: i dug through that site a while ago using the fuze battery serial numbers
17:24:09saratoga_workthe exact model isn't there, but going by volume it was about 500-600mah I think
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17:27:37kugelsaratoga_work: 550mah seems resonable then
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18:19:28amiconnjhMikeS: ping
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18:25:31mc2739kugel: ping
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18:28:09mc2739kugel: for the logs - I noticed 2 issues with the e200v2/fuze button driver
18:28:47kugelmc2739: which
18:28:57mc2739kugel: 1) the scrollwheel works with the hold switch on - it should be enclosed in if (!hold_button) {}
18:29:12kugel\o/ compiles and works on windows! http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/9371
18:29:25kugelah right
18:29:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:30:12mc2739kugel: 2) the wheel_tbl does not seem to match the dbop-din output on the debug screen
18:31:02kugel:?
18:31:23kugelthe wheel table only covers bits 13 and 14, not the whole dbop_din
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18:32:38mc2739kugel: when I rotate the wheel clockwise, bits 15:12 = c -> 8 -> a -> e
18:33:13kugelmc2739: the wheel table is a bit tricky
18:33:41kugelthe values aren't read as-is, it's an array accessed with the previous wheel value
18:34:04kugel(thus, not linearly accessed)
18:35:03mc2739it's not read in the same order as the wheel?
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18:36:35MTlinuxstb : I'm testing the decoder (cook) .. I've tried dump_cook_context() and it worked fine .. but when I call cook_decode_init() I get a seg fault. The program doesn't even enter the function (tried putchar/printf at the beginning of the function and there was no output)
18:36:39kugelthe array isn't linear to what the wheel produces, right
18:36:54kugelbecause of [old_wheel_value]
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18:37:01linuxstbMT: Is your latest code in SVN?
18:38:04MTlinuxstb : the demuxer yes, I didn't add anything to it since I started working on the task. But the decoder no.
18:38:27linuxstbMT: So how can I help? ;)
18:39:06merbananMT: I have a pending patch for cook, it adds multichannel support :) maybe not a needed feature in Rockbox
18:39:18*MT apologizes ! :)
18:39:46rashermerbanan: we already do A52, why not?
18:39:54mc2739kugel: ok, I guess I'll take your word for it, even though it doesn't look right compared to the e200v1 code
18:39:55MTmerbanan : great ! :)
18:40:13kugelmc2739: you can check the table like this
18:40:40kugelif the wheel was 01, [1] of the array needs to be the current value (which is 11 afaik)
18:42:25bertrikkugel, google found a hit for the 354239 battery number: http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/template/LISEXT/1FRAME/showpage.html?name=BBCV2.MH27725&ccnshorttitle=Lithium+Batteries+-+Component&objid=1075284287&cfgid=1073741824&version=versionless&parent_id=1073747351&sequence=1
18:43:01bertrikit's mentioned as a 550 mAh battery
18:43:07kugelyep
18:44:26linuxstbmerbanan: Is multi-channel cook very common? I've never heard of such a beast...
18:45:10kugelmc2739: it took me some hours to get it right, I'm fairly sure it's correct
18:45:52kugelmc2739: and if you look at the v1 driver, the wheel table doesn't match the actual wheel changes too
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18:48:47mc2739kugel: ok, I see that now in the v1 driver
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18:50:12mc2739kugel: do you want me to put up a patch for the scroll wheel hold switch changes?
18:50:46kugelmc2739: no, I have one. but you can test it if you want http://pastie.org/445114
18:50:53*kugel isn't able to test anymore
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18:51:51mc2739kugel: I'll test on e200
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19:02:54mc2739kugel: works fine on e200 - except for the extra "d" at the end of http://pastie.org/445114
19:04:42kugeloops
19:04:55kugelthat's not in the diff, I think, just in the paste
19:05:12mc2739that is what I figured
19:05:26kugelmc2739: I think I'm adding another check in kernel-as3525.c, so that the whole dbop isn't read too
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19:08:33mc2739kugel: any idea why the ports debug screen shows 32 bits but when you press the record button it only shows 16 bits?
19:08:52mc2739kugel: for dbop_din
19:09:37mc2739oops - s/32/64/ s/16/32/
19:10:15mc2739no, I was right the first time
19:10:35kugelmc2739: no, not really
19:10:47kugelI have that too, but no idea really
19:11:06mc2739ok, I'll try to track it down
19:11:49kugelmc2739: I assume it's an issue with snprintf and the %x format
19:13:33amiconnThe is no such issue known. It would affect all targets ifr it existed...
19:13:38amiconn*There
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19:15:19kugelsure
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19:21:01MTlinuxstb : there https://rm-wavconverter.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/rm-wavconverter/cook/ .. main is inside cook.c
19:22:40linuxstbMT: There is no Makefile?
19:23:54bertrikI also spot the 363830 battery from the Clip on that page, it's mentioned as 350 mAh
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19:25:33MTlinuxstb : no, I compiled it : gcc $(ffmpeg-config −−cflags) cook.c bitstream.c fft.c mdct.c libavutil/random.c libavutil/log.c libavutil/mem.c libcook.a -lm -o program
19:26:09hillshumWhere's the build table?
19:26:29kugelbertrik: fine, let's take those values
19:27:52linuxstbMT: What is that meant to do?
19:30:47MTlinuxstb : is there something wrong with it ?
19:32:07saratoga_workMT: I've got a makefile for the wma codec and parts of ffmpeg it uses if you want it: http://www.duke.edu/~mgg6/rockbox/wmadecoder.zip
19:32:20linuxstbMT: It doesn't do anything... And it doesn't use your demuxer.
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19:34:18MTlinuxstb : oh sorry, I didn't mean that I'm testing the decoding part, I was just testing to make sure I've properly extracted the codec, so calling cook_decode_init() should return an error or anything of the sort, am I wrong ?
19:34:26MTsaratoga_work : thanks :)
19:36:08linuxstbMT: I think you need to populate parts of avc before you pass it into cook_decode_init(). But the fact that it compiles (almost) cleanly is a good sign.
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19:37:22MTlinuxstb : but I have tried printing some output at the beginning of cook_decode_init() and still got seg fault before anything was printed .. should I ignore this ?
19:39:02linuxstbMT: Yes, I would. I expect it's because avc isn't initialised correctly.
19:39:07MTlinuxstb : and for the compiler warnings I'll just have to replace the functions used from random.c with better ones from lfg (or avlfg can't remember the name correctly).
19:39:59MTlinuxstb : ok .. then the following steps would be to write a Makefile, and start using it with the demuxer ?
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19:42:31linuxstbMT: Yes, I think so.
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19:44:50*MT gets back working.
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20:47:38merbananlinuxstb: like 10 samples known
20:47:49merbanantotal waste of time to implement
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20:52:04linuxstbmerbanan: ;)
20:52:16merbananso I did it
20:52:18 Nick JdGordon| is now known as JdGordon_ (i=836b0049@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-fa080185ca479eb0)
20:53:59gevaertsWe must also have it!
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21:47:19Dekkardsorry for the intrusion..but.. what does it mean that the usb stack is not enabled in the current release 3.2 ?
21:47:56hillshumThe USB doesn't work
21:48:19JdGordon|WRONG!!!
21:48:30Dekkard.. ok. so how do you charge and load files
21:48:41hillshumuse the OF
21:48:46DekkardJdGordon, ok.. so what does it mean?
21:48:46JdGordon|usb does work, and its not enabled in 3.2
21:49:39agaffneyJdGordon|: I believe hillshum's point is that it does not work because it's disabled
21:49:43agaffneynot because it's broken
21:49:51hillshumquite
21:49:55*Dekkard confused
21:50:07Dekkardcan i still load tunes and charge via usb?
21:50:10 Quit HellDragon (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:50:21hillshumUSB doesn't not function in Rockbox with 3.2
21:50:25agaffneyDekkard: all it means is that when you plug in USB, the device will restart into the original firmware (at least in the case of the Sansa)
21:51:41Dekkardso you have to reset and everything is groovy?
21:52:12hillshumreboot yes
21:52:16Dekkardokee
21:52:35hillshumthe bug has been fixed so a current build should work fine
21:52:56Dekkardbecause im noticing on the last current build i loaded..that it seems the device is not shutting down.. or something.. becasue the battery is like dying real fast
21:53:35hillshumwhat target do you have?
21:53:53Dekkardipod nano 1st gen
21:54:26Dekkardand i noticed that there seem to be some bugs.. at least in the compile log for the new current build
21:54:30hillshumwhich current build?
21:54:40Dekkardhmm..
21:54:46Dekkard20777 i think
21:54:56Dekkardat least thats what i thought i saw on the build page
21:54:59hillshumget a new one from today
21:55:29hillshumGo to System>>Rockbox Info on iPod
21:56:23Dekkard20666-090409
21:56:59hillshumthe issue with building has been fixed
21:57:42Dekkardkoo
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22:00
22:05:51 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere)
22:08:09MTlinuxstb : I'm trying to write a function that will produce a properly reordered audio frame for decoding. I have 2 paths to go :
22:08:23MToops, pressed enter by mistake
22:08:25JdGordon|go left!
22:08:42MT:D
22:09:23linuxstbgo right!
22:09:26 Quit Strife89 ("-------->")
22:09:45gevaertsStraight on!
22:09:56linuxstbAh, you've found a third path?
22:10:00MTgevaerts : sorry, no third one :P
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22:10:13*JdGordon| refrains from breaking into song
22:10:13gevaertsoh well
22:10:43*linuxstb reminds all Rockbox devs to go into #rockbox-gsoc if they're interested in the discussions.
22:11:07*linuxstb pings Bagder BigBambi Llorean pixelma as they're marked away...
22:13:04MTso linuxstb : 1. would be to use ffmpeg's function and do as little modifications as possible to get it running or 2. I could use the same way and write my own functions so as not to have to deal with AVFormatContext .. etc. but the downside is that I'll have to modify cook.c's functions to work along which would of course take more time, but the benefit is that it'll save time later when...
22:13:05MT...porting to rockbox. Which do you think is better ?
22:13:46MTlinuxstb : are students allowed into -gsoc ?
22:13:52linuxstbMT: No ;)
22:14:00MT:) alright
22:14:45scorche|shyou couldnt enter anyway =)
22:15:11 Quit midijunkie ("?(???~~)?")
22:15:13MTscorche|sh : good, I just didn't want to try and then be asked to leave :P
22:16:02MTlinuxstb : about the rm-related question above ::) ?
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22:17:20linuxstbMT: Have you looked at Rockbox's WMA and FLAC codecs? They're both based on ffmpeg.
22:18:06 Quit _lifeless (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:18:49kubershould rockbox on an 80gb ipod be able to play m4as encoded with faac ?
22:19:00MTlinuxstb : had a quick look at them. I'll look again now.. btw, I've made the makefile, (or to be accurate, edited saratoga's to work with my codec :) ) Thanks saratoga !
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22:29:37***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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22:44:28MTlinuxstb : both codecs only use GetBitContext struct from ffmpeg. I think I'll start "minimizing" the code for cook/rm first before trying to work with decoding.
22:45:01MT( by both codecs I mean flac and wma ofcourse)
22:45:59linuxstbMT: That sounds sensible.
22:46:48MTok great. Thanks. I have to go now.
22:47:19MTbye all ! :)
22:47:26*hillshum waves
22:52:13froggymanwhats the gigabeats clock speed?
22:52:21 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:52:47Lloreanfroggyman: Which gigabeat?
22:56:10froggymanthe f and s
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23:00:37Lloreanfroggyman: The F is 300mhz, the S is 532 but running at half speed (which comes out a bit faster than the F under well optimized conditions I believe, due to architectural differences)
23:01:20froggymanLlorean: wow, thats quite fast, didnt realize how fast they were
23:01:40LloreanThe "Gigabeat S" is often called "The Gigabeast".
23:01:51froggymanlol
23:01:56LloreanIt's also got some more juice in it in some coprocessing power that I believe isn't tapped anywhere yet.
23:02:20froggymanwhat is there screen size?
23:02:48Llorean240x320
23:03:35froggymanis that bigger or smaller than the iPod videos?
23:03:47LloreanIt's exactly the same, except rotated 90 degrees
23:03:50rasherLlorean: Yeah, it has a FPU... amazing thing
23:03:53LloreanAt least, in terms of number of pixels.
23:04:12Lloreanrasher: Doesn't it also have some accelerated functions for video decoding, too?
23:04:36froggymansweet, i think i might consider getting one of those to replace my iPod video some day
23:05:17LloreanThe Gigabeat F has a touch cross some don't like
23:05:25LloreanThe S has a cross that's real buttons.
23:05:43hillshumthe iPod has a wheel
23:05:46gevaertsOn the other hand, currently the F has much better (3 or 4 times) battery time than the S
23:05:49LloreanOther than that, in terms of the Rockbox experience, they're pretty similar right now (outside of obvious differences - the S has a radio, etc)
23:05:57 Quit blithe ("Lost terminal")
23:06:04Lloreangevaerts: That much, I thought it was only about double.
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23:06:13*Llorean admits to having an old, old F though.
23:06:59gevaertsLlorean: maybe 4 is a bit exagerated, but I've done 23 hours battery benches
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23:09:37kugelthe S gets 67h max, 3-4 seems correct
23:09:37froggymanLlorean: what do you do for a living (besides rockbox), but, if you dont want to say that would be fine to
23:09:40kugel6-77
23:09:43kugel6-7 ;;
23:10:06hillshum67hours?
23:10:27Lloreankugel: Only 6-7? I would swear I've gotten somewhere around 9 or 10 on mine. Though I've not done a definitive test.
23:10:43JdGordon|i was luck to get 2 before mine carked it
23:10:57kugelLlorean: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GigabeatRuntime
23:11:28Lloreankugel: Well, I've been listening to very low bitrate content, that probably helps a lot.
23:11:48LloreanThe buffer probably holds ~2hrs of audio for me.
23:13:14kugel64MB right?
23:13:17Lloreanfroggyman: Off-topic chat belongs in the other channel anyway.
23:13:19Lloreankugel: Yes.
23:13:52hillshumIsn't there a wikipage with each codec/target's perfomance?
23:14:27 Quit raymanism ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:17:12*n1s remembers around 5-6 hours on his beash, that was before jhMikeS latest power savings though, but it has a pretty small battery so i guess the chances of it reaching the same times as the f are small
23:17:24n1sbeast*
23:19:40Lloreann1s: We don't do any boost/unboost yet either, do we?
23:20:04rasherLlorean: That turned out to not save any battery, mysteriously
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23:20:28Lloreanrasher: On the *S*? Are we sure we were doing it right? Why don't we have it clocked at 532 then?
23:20:47rasherLlorean: I'm pretty sure it was on the S... other than that, no idea
23:20:50LloreanI remember the F not needing boost/unboost and a theory about it handling power savings there itself when we left it alone (boost/unboost made it worse)
23:21:02rasherHm, that could be it maybe
23:21:36LloreanBut I can't imagine why we'd run the S at half clock if lowering the clock *didn't* offer savings (assuming we know how to change it)
23:26:24 Quit Zoxc ()
23:26:35kugelLlorean: because people thought it saves much, but didn't double check it
23:26:49kugelIIRC jhMikeS noticed the very little savings just recently
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23:28:26Lloreankugel: Well if half clock provides marginal savings from full clock, I'd imagine boosting between half and a much lower speed probably offers some more savings.
23:28:31n1sLlorean: jhMikeS knows the details but we do know how to change the clock, amiconn did it to bench the ape codec
23:29:43n1si think most of the potential savings on the beast would come from dynamically adjusting the clock together with the voltage for the cpu
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23:39:29UnhelpfulLlorean: a month or so ago i recall amiconn talking about running tests at different clocks - it would appear that the beast idles cheaply enough to make clock changes not have a very large impact, as they don't change the number of cycles spent working.
23:42:33LloreanUnhelpful: But can we also lower the voltage as n1s suggested?
23:43:29n1sLlorean: the SoC has features for doing that at least
23:43:51Unhelpfuli understand that the voltage *can be* lowered. i don't know if we've tried or succeeded yet, and i've no idea what the best power-saving measures might be in that case... probably always running at a clock where there's just a little idle time?
23:45:25LloreanDidn't the OF at least claim to get better battery life than we do?
23:45:51Hillshum_Aren't the claims generally bogus?
23:45:55n1sIIRC they clam 13hours for the OF so that's a bit better than us
23:46:01n1sclaim
23:46:26LloreanHillshum_: Yeah, but 7 hours vs 13 hours is a pretty significant difference still
23:46:35n1sHillshum_: i wouldn't calll them bogus but rather under ideal condidtions, similar to our benches
23:46:54Hillshum_true
23:46:59LloreanWe've had a tendency to be able to beat OF claims under realistic conditions on other players. I'm at least hoping we can do so here, then.'
23:48:08n1sLlorean: of course there might be some component that isn't powered down correctly that we don't know about and that is sucking down the power we want to save :)
23:48:41Hillshum_is the LCD sleeping?
23:48:54Unhelpfulhillshum: i think jhMikeS did that a bit ago
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23:53:27froggymanis anyone here helping with the Lyre project
23:55:01 Quit dfkt ("-= SysReset 2.53=- Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.")
23:55:14Lloreanfroggyman: By helping do you mean "one of the people actually working on it" or "answers questions when the people working on it struggle with Rockbox code"?
23:56:45froggymanLlorean: what i really want to know is if anyone here knows when stable builds of it get will be done (just estimations, like 1 year, 3 months, ect)
23:57:02LloreanWell, that's pretty much impossible to estimate
23:57:10Hillshum_we never estimate that sort of thing
23:57:35LloreanEven if they finalize on a hardware design, it depends on whether they find a manufacturer, how long it takes them to adapt Rockbox to that hardware design, how long it takes that manufacturer to start selling them, etc.
23:57:54froggymanok, so it may be several years then?
23:58:00 Quit Domonoky (Remote closed the connection)
23:58:24Bagderor two weeks
23:58:27gevaertsit could be three months, it could be three years...
23:58:32BigBambipossibly
23:58:33linuxstbfroggyman: Put it this way, if I was looking to buy a new DAP, I wouldn't wait for the Lyre...
23:58:35Hillshum_three days
23:58:39LloreanBagder: Be fair. Probably no sooner than at least a couple months. :-P
23:58:51LloreanBut they do have that one guy looking to start producing his variant of them.

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