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#rockbox log for 2010-03-20

00:01:30TheSevenpamaury: there's still an evil brace at ~2370
00:02:17TheSevenerm, still lots of those
00:02:37pamauryTheSeven: fat.c is not consistent !
00:02:57pamauryI can make a special cosmetic commit afterwards if you want :P
00:03:03TheSevenyes, of course
00:03:27TheSevenok, let's forget about those braces then...
00:03:54pamauryNo stupid/weird comments left ? I think I'll commit, that way I will soon see if it's correct or not !
00:04:23TheSeventhe rest seems to be fine
00:07:00 Join elinenbe [0] (
00:07:47 Quit jgarvey (Quit: Leaving)
00:08:33Tornepamaury: i assume you have tested this code up tot he limit?
00:08:38Tornefilenames with 255 chars and the like?
00:09:03Tornehave you tried accessing directories that have been mangled by DOS? (rare and unlikely though that is..)
00:09:07TheSeven...and UTF16=>UTF8 translation worst cases
00:09:27TorneTheSeven: well those shouldn'tb e any better/worse in the new code
00:09:28TheSevenwhat was that referring to? ;-)
00:09:30Tornethey shohuld still fail :)
00:09:40 Join phanboy4 [0] (
00:10:27pamauryPerhaps I should test up to the limit...Arg, back to test then
00:10:48Tornewell it just seems like a good idea..
00:11:01Torneif you do that kind of testing as well, and it seems several people have tried it, then it probably can go in
00:11:19Tornei won't be able to test it until at least tomorrow, as the machine i use to build has some disk issues right now :)
00:11:54pamaurydon't worry, i won't test tonight
00:14:19*stripwax sighs at fs#11125
00:14:35stripwaxI'll try and find when/how that menu was enabled. given that it doesn't work and aborts instantly.
00:16:17*stripwax sighs at r22171. seriously, wtf.
00:17:58 Quit robin0800 (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
00:18:10amiconngevaerts: Can you do a rom dump and check the byte value at 0x3f0000 in the dump?
00:18:22 Join robin0800 [0] (
00:20:26*TheSeven sighs at fs#11132. how many times has that thing been fixed before?
00:20:38 Quit fred_99 (Quit: Ex-Chat)
00:20:54*amiconn has a suspicion
00:21:43pamauryI think the brickmania thing was not fixed correctly but I'm not sure
00:21:48 Quit Luca_S (Quit: CGI:IRC)
00:22:23TheSevenwell, *apparently* it wasn't fixed correctly. but somebody tried to fix those things like a dozen times before, IIRC
00:22:29gevaertsamiconn: 01
00:22:43amiconnHere it's 00
00:23:11amiconnI have a suspicion
00:23:43pamauryIt uses a bad algorithm to check whether lines intersects. There is an exact one but it uses an approx one iirc
00:24:00amiconnThe cowon loader sets vbus mode to whatever is specified there, and if we want the opposite value, we have to do a proper reset
00:24:11*amiconn prepares a test
00:24:24CIA-5New commit by 03stripwax (r25251): Revert r22171 (+r22186) for pacbox, given that it doesn't work, and causes crashes on COP targets, and we in fact already had an open unresolved issue ...
00:25:12gevaertsa reset of the bridge chip?
00:25:24gevaertsthat makes sense
00:25:38amiconnRight now we're just deasserting reset in our init, but that does nothing if it is already deasserted
00:27:35amiconnYep - that's indeed the propblem!
00:28:29amiconnIf the OF (and hence the cowon loader) is set to "hub mode" (self powered), our usb init will fail, because it tries to set "PC mode" (bus powered ) without reset
00:29:02amiconnI wonder why this didn't cause problems earlier... obviously most iaudios are set to bus powered
00:29:14gevaertsapparently, yes
00:29:23amiconnWith a proper reset, I can set self powered mode on mine, with usb working afterwards
00:29:39amiconnSo the question is just which mode do we want?
00:30:13gevaertsI'd say bus powered. We don't have charger control, right?
00:30:13amiconnThis isn't 100% clean anyway atm - the bridge can also tell us whether 500mA are allowed, or only 100
00:30:39amiconnWe do, but we don't use it. Another ages old fixme...
00:30:45gevaertsthat can be useful later on...
00:30:53*gevaerts tells Torne to make notes
00:31:09Tornecowon has usb power selection?
00:31:19Tornewell, someone can implement that when i finish my usbpower branch ;)
00:32:26Tornei am not fixing up every target ever that i don't even have to do it right :)
00:32:40Tornethough i am gonna do my best to get beast, h300, mini2g and the PP ipods to work
00:32:51Torne(the former three being the ones which have some kind of implementation of this already)
00:33:16gevaertss/mini/nano/ presumably
00:33:20Torneer yeah
00:33:41Torneonce my build machine is working again i'm gonna have a crack at it this weekend
00:34:33amiconngevaerts: Can you test whether this makes usb work on your X5: ?
00:36:23gevaertsamiconn: that works, yes
00:36:39amiconnProblem solved :)
00:39:02CIA-5New commit by 03amiconn (r25252): Reset USB bridge properly when selecting bus powered mode. The bridge might have been set to self powered by the cowon loader, and switching the mode ...
00:40:29 Quit liar (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
00:44:02 Quit petur (Remote host closed the connection)
00:44:09*amiconn wonders whether this is a critical fix...
00:45:23 Quit ender` (Quit: Any fool can use a computer. Many do.-- Ted Nelson)
00:45:25TheSevenerm, fs#11122 and fs#11123 => uchida?
00:46:07gevaertsamiconn: you mean for stable updates?
00:48:09gevaertsI don't know
00:48:15amiconnIt's obviously not a problem for most X5s, and there is no risk of bricking either
00:48:33gevaertsThere's also an easy workaround
00:49:11gevaertsAlso, we can't release an update for some targets only
00:49:51gevaertsMaybe commit to the 3.5 branch and include it if we do another update?
00:51:00gevaertsI can't remember anyone except fred_99 mentioning this on the forums or here during the past two years
00:51:56 Quit Strife89 (Quit: Restarting ....)
00:55:05stripwaxTheSeven - yeah, it looks like it
00:56:07TheSevenbad commit message, a total of 3 commits until it even compiled for all targets, and now two stkov's in FS... hmm...
00:56:15saratogagevaerts: when you get a chance would you mind doing another benchmark on your arm system?
00:56:28TheSevennow *which* one of the patches caused it?
00:56:42gevaertssaratoga: it's called a "phone" :)
00:56:57saratogai'm wondering if the arm asm was enabled when you compiled
00:57:38saratogawould you mind trying again with a "#define _ARM_ASSEM_ " at the top of misc.h?
00:58:17 Join Strife89 [0] (
00:58:46stripwaxgevaerts/saratoga - mm, what's this?
00:59:00saratogatesting libtermor on an arm system
00:59:23stripwaxah cool. as in, a non-rockbox system
00:59:23gevaertssaratoga: -D_ARM_ASSEM_ was in the CFLAGS
00:59:42stripwaxwhat kind of arm system?
00:59:50stripwax(I guess I mean which arm cpu)
01:00:26saratogagevaerts: then I don't understand why the speed up is so small compared to rockbox
01:00:57saratogai guess i should try porting the asm version of the current mdct to tremor and see how it performs
01:01:15amiconngevaerts: n900?
01:01:16stripwaxdon't forget vanilla libtremor (xiph) had a bunch of other inefficiencies which we improved upon in rockbox
01:01:25gevaertsamiconn: yes
01:01:32stripwaxi.e. speeding up just the mdct would look like a smaller % speedup if the inefficiencies are still there
01:01:39amiconnstripwax: So, ARM Cortex A8
01:02:22gevaerts500 I think
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01:02:35 Quit pamaury (Quit: Quitte)
01:02:37stripwaxamiconn - I'm guessing that isn't used in any rockbox targets ...
01:02:49 Join robin0800 [0] (
01:02:51amiconnIt's ARMv7
01:03:11gevaertsMaybe the mini2440 people can help if you want that sort of comparison
01:03:48amiconnBut since rockbox code doesn't make use of neon or other nifty features, the beast performance comes close (if you modify the cpu clock - it's currently not set dynamically)
01:04:04stripwaxsaratoga - when you said 'I guess I should try porting the asm version of the current mdct to Tremor' , I didn't understand. current as in old, or current as in mdctexp?
01:04:14saratogastripwax: the asm version of the old mdct
01:04:30saratogaalso the speed up was only like 3MHz on his system, and that includes ASM for windowing
01:04:49stripwax"only" 3MHz, for vorbis, sounds good, no?
01:04:56stripwaxif it's just the mdct that changed
01:04:57amiconngevaerts: What kind of cpu does the mini2440 have?
01:05:13saratogastripwax: tremor has a plain c mdct right now, the old version in rockbox has the ASM one
01:05:15stripwaxwe only saw about that on rockbox.
01:05:23gevaertsamiconn: s3c2440 IIRC
01:05:30saratogawhich speed things up by 2-3 MHz even before we added the new split radix version
01:05:54amiconnThat's more like the Gigabeat F then, and it's only ARMv4
01:06:07stripwaxarm7tdmi is armv4 , is that right?
01:06:08amiconnSo the beast is a much better comparison than the mini2440
01:06:15amiconnstripwax: yes
01:06:31saratogagevaerts has some arm7 thing IIRC
01:06:34amiconnPrecisely it's ARMv4t, but that doesn't matter for rockbox
01:06:40gevaertsyes, but the mini2440 can run both rockbox and linux, so it can be useful for comparisons
01:06:59amiconnsaratoga: ARM*v*7
01:07:05gevaertssaratoga: I have a v5 (sheevaplug) and a v7 (n900)
01:07:12amiconnThat's very different from ARM7 (which is ARMv4)
01:07:35amiconnARM versioning *is* confusing :\
01:08:37stripwaxsaratoga - it's entirely possible that the C butterflies behave quite nicely on the n900's cpu; a large chunk of the (old) mdct asm was to ldr/str on arm7tdmi, and inline some smull/umulls
01:08:45 Quit Casainho (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6/20100115133306])
01:08:50saratogathats true
01:08:59Torneregular gcc output is much more likely to not suck on A8
01:09:17stripwaxso I'd say 3mhz sounds pretty reasonable. 3Mhz improvement over what baseline mhz?
01:09:26stripwaxtorne - exactly
01:09:34amiconnDepends on pipelining
01:09:48Torneamiconn: i mean from experience
01:09:54amiconnah ok
01:09:58Tornemoving to A8 we eliminated a lot of our asm code
01:10:04Torne(in symbian)
01:10:10Tornebecause it faild to bench any faster than the C code
01:10:15Tornethough we do use ARM RVCT, not gcc..
01:10:17amiconnARMv6 needs very careful pipelining for best performance
01:10:46TorneRVCT I guess is more likely to arrange stuff well for the pipeline
01:10:53Tornethat beiung kinda the point
01:11:01amiconnIf you check the ARMv6 version of the APE filters, you'll see what I mean..
01:11:17 Quit Farthen (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
01:12:24amiconnBut then v7 could be different again. It's not really predictable - you have to check the reference manuals (which aren't public for ARMv7)
01:12:58 Quit bluebrother (Disconnected by services)
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01:13:19amiconnA similar example is that the v4 variants of ARM9 have quite different instruction timing from ARM7
01:14:54Torneyah. RVCT is pretty good on ARMv6 as well, tbh
01:14:54 Quit stripwax (Quit:
01:15:12Torneso maybe gcc output is *not* good enough, i dunno.
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01:15:31***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:28:54fidencioI was reading rockbox ideas for gsoc, and I would like to know more about Jonathan Gordon's proposal
01:29:31saratogafidencio: which one is that?
01:30:06fidencio"Clean up to raedio code"
01:30:34saratogai don't know much about that one, but there was a bit of dicusison about it the last couple days, maybe check the logs
01:32:50saratogaor check back at a better time
01:34:44 Quit Schmogel (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.
01:35:33fidenciook. thanks. Jonathan regularly visits this channel, righ? which you nick?
01:37:50Unhelpfulfidencio: usually "JdGordon" though i may have the capitalization not quite right. and if you mention his nick he will *probably* see in the log that you were looking for him. :)
01:40:01fidencioUnhelpful: ok. Thanks for the infos. :-)
01:40:09fidenciosaratoga: ^
01:44:59 Quit perfectdrug_ (Quit: perfectdrug_)
01:46:58amiconnstripwax fixed a rather obvious problem. Playback control cannot work in plugins which use iram themselves, and hence *must not* be added to them
01:47:51*amiconn wonders why teru committed this in the first place
01:49:46amiconnThat's a crash bug on many targets, and it's in the release...
01:52:23doomcupI just reformatted the ipod manually after itunes kept freezing up upon plugging it in
01:52:34doomcupReinstalled the firmware
01:52:38doomcupAnd reinstalled rockbox
01:52:50doomcupBut rockbox can't seem to find the partition for some reason
01:52:54 Quit planetbeing (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
01:57:56doomcupAttempting to reinstall just the bootloader
02:01:55doomcupNo luck
02:07:06doomcupLast ditch attempt, I'll try a manual install
02:08:50 Quit robin0800 (Remote host closed the connection)
02:09:51doomcupAnd why did I think that would work?
02:09:58doomcupNope, none of it is working
02:12:29TorneWhen you say reformatted manually, how did you do that?
02:12:34Torneand is it a 5.5G ipod video?
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02:21:14doomcupFinally got it working under itunes
02:21:17doomcupDid a restore
02:21:28doomcupI'm about to install rockbox with the windows installer instead
02:22:47Tornethe 5.5G ipod needs a special kind of format (2048 byte sectors)
02:23:09Tornei am guessing you formatted it in linux without specifying that..
02:23:16Tornerestoring it with itunes will frmat it correctly
02:23:56 Quit saratoga (Quit: Page closed)
02:24:11doomcupYeah, I got it working now
02:24:14doomcupThanks, though
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03:06:02doomcupThe two songs I put on there, both oggs, won't show up when I go to the directory they're in
03:07:12webguestLLWhat view mode are you in, and do they have the regular .ogg extension?
03:09:45doomcupThey do, and it's the files view
03:10:01doomcupTo answer your questions in reverse order
03:11:06webguestLLNo, what view mode in the file viewer?
03:11:10webguestLLSupported, music, playlists?
03:11:43doomcupNot sure
03:11:46doomcupMusic, I think
03:12:04Strife89Change it to All.
03:12:24Strife89Do a Long Select on the Files option on the main menu.
03:12:52webguestLL"music" should still show .ogg files.
03:12:55Strife89Then slect Show Files.
03:13:12Strife89webguestLL: Yes, but we want to make sure the files are even THERE.
03:13:36Strife89And if they are, we can easily determine if the extension is correct.
03:14:13Strife89"Show Filename Extensions" is, by default, set to "Only When Viewing All Types".
03:14:23Strife89Thus we kill two birds at once.
03:15:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:15:59Strife89I know checking something so basic may seem stupid,
03:16:17Strife89but doing this should throw out the need for a lot of questions.
03:16:50Strife89Unless I'm wrong (and I often am). :)
03:17:30Strife89Still with us, doomcup?
03:18:23 Quit xiainx (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
03:19:02doomcupYes, sorry
03:19:05doomcupI got called away
03:19:52doomcupLet me finish this transfer, then we can do the things you've suggested
03:20:28doomcupShouldn't be much longer, hopefully
03:21:30doomcupAlso, when I open up the ipod on my system, the songs are there
03:21:47doomcupI know cause I added the songs in Windows, then opened it again when I switched back to Fedora
03:21:53doomcupSo could be a hiccough
03:22:03doomcupWe'll know when this transfer's finished
03:22:07Strife89Double-check the extension, though.
03:22:26doomcupI can point you to where I got the two files in question
03:22:43doomcupTHey're from the free game Dwarf Fortress, the two classical guitar bits
03:22:44Strife89Might as well. :)
03:23:55doomcupOne moment
03:24:06doomcup <- Latest version is here
03:24:24Strife89Alright. :)
03:24:29doomcupIt's in the data/sound directory, song_game and song_title
03:25:04doomcupDon't bother with the linux version if you're going to play the game, though
03:25:08doomcupIt's rubbish
03:25:19doomcupWindows version is fine, don't know about OSX version
03:25:55Strife89Got it. I'll stick the files on my own iPod and give 'em a whirl.
03:26:32doomcupAwesome, thanks
03:27:50Strife89I have my Show Files setting on All at the moment.
03:27:59Strife89They show up and play.
03:28:42doomcupAh, so it might just be me then
03:29:49Strife89Test one more time, then.
03:31:19doomcupI'm about three quarters of the way done
03:32:14doomcupI will say this, both files play just playing them off the ipod's disk in audacious
03:32:52*Strife89 tries to pick something to delete.
03:33:06Strife89I'm strapped for disk space, as usual.
03:34:48doomcupAt least it's not stalling in the middle of disk transfers anymore
03:35:25Strife89Are you using Rockbox or the OF/Disk Mode to copy files?
03:35:33Strife89And what model iPod is it?
03:36:15 Part froggyman
03:37:44doomcupIt's a 5th gen ipod video, 30gb
03:38:00doomcupAnd I have it on as a disk, dragging music on
03:38:25Strife89doomcup: So you booted it to Disk Mode?
03:38:51Strife89So it's still in Rockbox, then?
03:39:08doomcupIt was in rockbox mode this time
03:39:37Strife89From my experience, USB transfers on the 4G and 5G iPods is a liiiitle sluggish.
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03:40:10Strife89Release builds actually reboot to Disk Mode when you plug in a USB cable.
03:41:14doomcupIt was on show playlists
03:44:01Strife89doomcup: Do you compile your own builds?
03:44:15doomcupNope, don't have the patience
03:44:18bofh__out of curiosity, does the person whose wiki userid is MichaelGiacomelli hang around here ever?
03:44:19doomcupJust use the installer
03:44:27Strife89doomcup: Ah, nevermind then. :)
03:44:40*Strife89 was about to recommend some patchs.
03:44:49Strife89Er, patches.
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04:07:18AusShirI am having trouble compiling rockbox on the vmware image - I get the error that a library uses FPA instructions but __ does not. Any help?
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04:09:28AusShirI only get this error when trying to compile the clip+ bootloader, clipV1 compiles fine
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07:37:22topikbofh__: that's saratoga. he's around a lot
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08:06:57saratogabofh__: whats up
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09:09:18Parsiis it true that with rockbox battery life is lesS?
09:10:20Luca_Sit depends on the target
09:10:22n1sParsi: on some players, yes on others it's better
09:10:45n1susually the more mature ports have better batterylife
09:10:46Parsifor ipod nano 2nd gen
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09:19:01liarParsi: which bootloader are you using?
09:19:22Parsiliar: the last build
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09:21:17liarParsi: do you see the apple logo if you power the ipod on?
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09:22:51Tomiswow, that's anoying
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09:24:46Parsiliar: r25252
09:25:24pixelmamaybe B4gder or Zagor could delete this from the logs at least
09:25:41liarParsi: then the difference in battery runtime between RB and the OF should not be noticeable
09:25:54Parsiaha, ok
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09:29:44Parsiliar: can I apply anti-aliasing font to source code and compile it for nano 2nd g?
09:30:34amiconnAny perl experts around?
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09:33:00liarParsi: just try it?
09:33:17Parsiliar: and use:)
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09:53:29CIA-5New commit by 03amiconn (r25253): Filter out -g in PPCFLAGS. Some (older?) gcc versions add a comment when building dependency files and -g is present. The proper solution would be to ...
09:53:47*amiconn went for the cheap solution for now ^
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09:57:49CIA-5New commit by 03amiconn (r25254): Recognise (open)solaris as a valid simulator host OS.
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09:59:43stripwaxStrife89 - no they don't - release builds don't reboot to disk mode when you plug in a usb cable, since rockbox supports usb
10:00:24amiconnstripwax: Good find! (see
10:00:41stripwaxyeah, I just saw that
10:00:48stripwaxyour comment I mean
10:01:09stripwaxI closed the bug issue (naturally). but seriously, wtf. (as I think I said in irc yesterday :-)
10:01:41stripwaxSorry for putting "COP targets" in my svn commit message when I really meant "iram".
10:02:37amiconnYeah. Even more precisely, swcodec targets which use iram for plugins and codecs
10:02:54amiconns/iram/shared iram/
10:03:07Unhelpfulcommit messages are editable in git ;)
10:03:23amiconnAnd so they are in svn, if the svn admin allows it
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10:03:56*amiconn edited commit messages occasionally back when rockbox used cvs
10:04:19Unhelpful*that* i did not know. and i'm not sure we really want to be revising our revisions, although only commit messages wouldn't be the end of the world.
10:04:22stripwax_amiconn - I also wondered why teru would have committed that. but I also don't remember it being advertised/announced very heavily by teru.
10:05:05*stripwax_ wonders if it's even in the manual - arg.
10:05:08Unhelpfulstripwax_: i think he was just aiming to get playback control everywhere... perhaps he didn't realize there'd be a conflict?
10:05:09amiconnThat seems to be a general problem with our japanese committers. They often commit stuff without being around here :\
10:05:09*stripwax_ will check
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10:06:27stripwax_yeah, pacbox manual entry doesn't actually mention any of the menu items. so I guess that's ok ....
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10:13:28fred_99saratoga: hello, I did a battery test with the cowon original OS for my X5 and I confirm that it does not worked more than 10 hours. sorry not to be more accurate but it was during the night. and I was sleeping when it stopped.
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10:17:43fred_99a test I can do, it's directly measure the current with an amper meter. because I have to solder, please tell me if the results will be taken in account.
10:19:05fred_99have a good day.
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10:40:52Parsihave anyone compiled rockbox source?
10:42:15stripwaxParsi - what do you mean exactly?
10:42:29stripwaxare you looking for binaries, or looking for someone who knows how to compile?
10:42:42Parsistripwax: the second
10:43:01stripwaxin that case, I can help you
10:43:16stripwax(as can any of the other developers on here)
10:43:35Parsican I find anyone who apply one patch to RB source for ipodnano2ndG
10:43:38AlexPAnd many others besides
10:44:03AlexPParsi: You would be better off getting a dev environment set up and us helping you to do it yourself
10:44:18AlexPAs then you can update when you want instead of always having to bug others
10:44:47Luca_SParsi, if you're looking for the font AA patch, have you actually checked the attached comments? it's reported that on nano2g, it does not work well. do you still want to try it?
10:44:59JdGordonfidencio[AWAY]: pong
10:45:50ParsiLuca_S: hm, really? I haven't read all comments
10:46:06Parsiif it does not work well, I don't like it
10:46:38stripwaxI noticed that some change was made to diacritics recently, which might mean the aa patch works differently/better/worse than before
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10:46:49Luca_Sif you're determined to try, I can suggest you to download the vmware dev environment:
10:47:09stripwaxLuca_S - I think that comment applies to all targets, not just ipod nano 2g
10:47:28amiconnIs there someone around who builds simulators on OS X or *BSD?
10:48:10*Unhelpful really needs to take up working on font AA again
10:48:18Luca_Sstripwax: I suppose you're right, but the comment I remember was talking about the nano, I just reported that.
10:49:50amiconnThe diacritics handling is a mess
10:50:26stripwaxamiconn - is it possible for a plugin to use *any* (e.g. a small amount of) iram on swcodec targets with playback enabled?
10:50:35Unhelpfulprecompose is the fix, just going to be a pain to write.
10:50:50amiconnstripwax: no
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10:51:27stripwaxamiconn - dandy.
10:52:10amiconnIRAM is shared between codecs and plugins, and they're linked to fixed addresses
10:52:21stripwaxamiconn - and on the pp targets, is there a concept of 'non-shared' iram for use by cop?
10:52:36stripwaxjust thinking what the 'right' fix for pacbox would be
10:52:45amiconnSo any plugin using iram needs to stop playback *before* copying its iram section on plugin startup
10:52:50stripwaxother than making it use less CPU and no iram.
10:53:02amiconnThe right fix for pacbox is what you did.
10:53:13stripwaxamiconn - :-)
10:53:29stripwaxnot what I meant.
10:53:36amiconnPlugins using iram do so for a reason - they need it for speed reasons.
10:53:41stripwaxI just reverted it back to how it was; I'm thinking more about fs#8226
10:55:28amiconnWell, #8226 makes pacbox not use iram anymore. This might be fast enough on PP, also with music playing because of dualcore
10:55:37amiconnIt won't work on coldfire this way
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10:56:32amiconnBut then there are some codecs which also use the cop - they probably interfere with pacbox on cop
10:56:39*amiconn thinks #8226 isn't a good idea
10:56:58stripwaxamiconn right so #8226 is mine , and the problem is that it isn't fast enough on PP, because #8226 makes pacbox use both cores, which interacts badly with mp3. as commented in at the end of the FS itself
10:57:03stripwaxSo wondering what the better idea is
10:57:15stripwaxother than: making pacbox need less CPU and no iram
10:57:23amiconnImo we should just leave it as it is
10:57:36Unhelpfulstripwax: how, magic? ;)
10:57:56stripwaxif there is some kind of per-cpu non-shared iram, for example.
10:58:06amiconnThere isn't
10:58:07stripwaxif not, though, then yes. Magic.
10:58:40stripwaxok so it just need to be made faster. no biggie
10:58:59amiconnIf you want pacman and music at the same time, the best idea would be to write a native pacman implementation, and scratch pacbox
10:59:42amiconnIt would also be more flexible regarding graphics for various display sizes etc
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12:21:59adisbladisWhere is the sourcecode for the rockbox automated build system located?
12:22:13JdGordonone of the svn branches
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13:30:20CIA-5New commit by 03Buschel (r25255): Submit FS #9746 by Boris Gjenero. Set PP502x IDE pins low for iPod Video when IDE power is off. Done by OF the same way, might be used by other targets ...
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13:45:55CIA-5New commit by 03amiconn (r25256): Switch to using statvfs for simulated fat_size(). This makes io.c build on opensolaris, and also removes special ifdefing for freebsd and OS X.
13:48:18amiconnBuschel: Why did't you use atomic gpio manipulation?
13:48:35amiconn(for GPIO_I and GPIO_K, obviously)
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13:56:24bofh__topik: ah, noted. was going to poke him about SoC stuffs.
13:58:47Buschelamiconn: to be honest. I had this patch applied for months now (exactly like I submitted). So, I didn't take care of...
13:59:31amiconnAtomic gpio manipulation is both safer and smaller
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14:02:42Dobsonhello, i don't know if i'm doing something wrong, i recorded .mp3 file renamed it to put it into folder but still it doesn't talk (sansa fuze)
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14:08:47domonokyDobson: all newer rockbox targets want the .talk fil encoded as speex, without header. (rbspeexenc in svn can do that)
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14:19:54soapBuschel, last I saw on the FS #9746 thread you and dreamlayers were discussing further testing. Anything quantitative? Or just you running with the patch for the last few months?
14:20:12soap0.75ma ain't nothing to scoff at! ;)
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14:26:10Buschelsoap: I just kept it running over the last months. As dreamlayer somehow disappeared I thought it would be a good idea to submit this by myself. Of course only for the tested variant (iPod Video). The latest discussion were about testing it for other iPods or other PP502x targets as well. But with dreamlayers disappearance this was also dropped...
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14:33:17soapAny theory on why setting it high ends up saving power?
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14:36:26amiconnsoap: Iiuc it's set low
14:36:45amiconnAnd it makes sense to pull the interface pins low whenever power to the disk is cut
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14:53:35fred_99amiconn, thanks for the last release for the x5 USB fix
14:55:03ZincAlloyHi there! I'm have a weired problem with the WPS lately. Song infos are not getting updated reliably when the screen is off. When I turn on the screen there's still the title of the previous song
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15:02:47S_a_i_n_t_ZincAlloy: I think there's already an bug on the tracker for that...
15:03:10S_a_i_n_t_Unless it was you that posted it, but I think it was some time ago/been there for some time.
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15:04:35ZincAlloyoh, I see. I couldn't find it :)
15:04:45S_a_i_n_t_No idea what would be causing it though, some say its scrolling/dynamic lines...but if that were the case, none of my WPSs would work.
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15:09:47ZincAlloyI'm having the problem with song names that are too short for scrolling as well :)
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15:14:56ZincAlloythe progressbar updates correctly.. interesting.
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15:17:29fidencioJdGordon: ping :-)
15:21:52fidenciofine. :-). I'm interested in your idea for GSoC
15:22:31fidencioCan you talk more about it?
15:22:55JdGordonim a bit tipsy, but yeah I can talk
15:25:49punktJdGordon: I'm updating the wps variables patch to use HAVE_WPS_VARIABLES. So far, I've defined this in cowondd2.h.
15:26:03punktJdGordon: Should I define this for all targets with HAVE_TOUCHSCREEN?
15:26:09JdGordonI think so
15:26:22JdGordonfidencio: anything specific you want to tlak about?
15:27:56fidencioJdGordon: I I wonder if it's possible to test the refactored code without having a sepecific hardware for that
15:28:18JdGordonprobably not
15:28:52TheSevenfidencio: I think that depends on what area of code you are touching
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15:29:02TheSevensome areas might be testable in the simulator
15:30:07*domonoky1 thinks that it also shouldnt be a problem to buy a dap with the inital 500$ gsoc provides :-)
15:30:07TheSevenwhich GSoC projects are you interested in? There are things like the theme editor that could easily be done without special hardware. However you could also just get some sansa rather cheap.
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15:31:49fidencioTheSeven: The JdGordon idea was made a clean up/refact in radio code
15:32:38fidenciodomonoky1: Yeah. You are right!
15:32:46TheSevenyou should get yourself at least one target with an FM tuner for that.
15:33:27JdGordonyeah, sholdnt be too hard assuming the v2 sansa radios all work
15:33:29*domonoky1 thinks for the radio refactoring, you certanly need a target with radio, more then one target with different radios would be even better :-)
15:33:31JdGordonanyway, im falling asleep
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15:37:01fidencioTheSeven: and many people have been looking for GSoC here?
15:37:15funmanFlynDice: i noticed the volume doesn't go down to 0 on Clip+ , the volume might be on 6 bits and the MSB is always set
15:37:29funmanmaximum volume looks ok, balance too
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15:38:22TheSevenfidencio: you're the first one I've seen, but I wasn't here too long during the last days
15:38:23funmanfidencio: if you look for a sansav2, all have working FM, except the c200v2 might need a fix/workaround
15:40:55fidencioHmm. I'm really interested on the project, but is not easy to send a patch before send GSoC proposal
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15:41:40fidencioI "work" in more 2 projects (enlightenment and exaile)
15:43:36funmanfidencio: it will be easy once you have a player!
15:46:09fidencioOk. I'll get this weeks and write the proposal, look at the code, bla bla bla
15:47:02fidencioIf proposal is accept, I'll buy some gadgets with FM.
15:49:44fidencioTheSeven: funman: thanks. :-)
15:50:02fidenciodomonoky1: ^
15:51:37funmanfidencio: < list of unstable or supported, swcodec, targets without FM tuner, so try to get one not in this list ;)
15:51:41S_a_i_n_tOk...I'm looking at FS #6697 New Dict Plugin ( ), it compiles fine with a little bit of 'patching-by-hand' which I don't mind...but I want to move the menu entry "Dictionaries" out of the main menu and into the "Plugins" subdir. Is anyone able to push me in the right direction?
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15:52:34TheSevenS_a_i_n_t: the plugins menu is actually a file chooser. having a "virtual entry" in that menu won't be easy
15:52:51fidenciofunman: ;-) thanks
15:53:05TheSevenwait, what is that thing? a core feature, or a plugin?
15:53:54S_a_i_n_tI guess its a plugin...its built mostly off the original dict
15:53:57ThomasAHfunman: I saw your gentemen mail. Congratiolations! (and of course I'm eager to try it :))
15:54:07S_a_i_n_tbut it menu entry is in the main menu...and I hate that.
15:54:12TheSevenif it's a plugin, do you mean the main menu of the plugin (and want to get that dictionaries thing one level up into the rockbox menu) or do you mean the rockbox main menu?
15:54:47funmanThomasAH: i pasted the patch yesterday, now it requires a bit of cleanup before it is committed, and i wait to know if FlynDice wants to work on it so we don't walk on each other toes
15:55:12S_a_i_n_tI mean, as it compiles now, it puts "Dictionaried" just before System on the main menu...and I'd like to have it in the "plugins" subdir"
15:55:25ThomasAHfunman: I was online, but I did not saw the paste
15:55:53funmanS_a_i_n_t: plugins shouldn't modify main menu
15:56:05S_a_i_n_tThis one does...
15:56:19S_a_i_n_tThat's the only thing I don't like about it.
15:56:34ThomasAHfunman: argl ... searching for "paste" would not find "pastie" :)
15:56:43TheSevenaha, so this thing is actually a viewer and introduces a new file chooser in the main menu
15:57:02ThomasAHfunman: thanks, I'll try now
15:57:17S_a_i_n_tAhhh..., yes, that'd be the better/correct way to put it.
15:58:12S_a_i_n_tits *way* better than dict.rock (has scrolling, fuzzy search etc.) but having the entry in the main menu a: looks ugly, and b: pisses me off.
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15:59:21ThomasAHfunman: hmm, it says "patch unexpectedly ends in middle of line"
15:59:37ThomasAHah, no EOL
16:00:03funmanright, pastie eats newlines
16:01:10ThomasAHnever had such a problem with
16:01:59fidencioah, funman, TheSeven, where are you from?
16:02:32CIA-5New commit by 03Buschel (r25257): Submit FS #11065. Introduce a new system setting for en-/disabling the Line-out. For now only implemented on iPod Video. This allows to save power if ...
16:02:51funmani'm from the internet, sir :)
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16:03:51fidencioTheSeven: funman: Just for me sync an hour to found you in internet. hehe
16:04:00fidencioI'm Brazillian, GMT -3
16:04:34funmanfidencio: france, CEST (UTC+1, +2 soon i believe)
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16:07:39ThomasAHfunman: Gentleman, I have sound! Thank! :)
16:07:42ThomasAHThanks even
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16:10:20ThomasAHfunman: Hmm, sound with FM radio is expected to not work yet?
16:11:00funmanyes, it's expected not to work. also you can't lower the volume completely : even if rockox shows a muted speaker it's still quite loud
16:11:35funmanthat, and there are some crashes in the long run probably related to SD but don't tell FlynDice yet :)
16:11:41ThomasAHfunman: I have an adapter with volume control, so that's not a big problem
16:11:50ThomasAHfunman: (clip+ was too loud for me in bed anyway)
16:14:10fidencioI going to a barbecue, I'll later, drunked :-)
16:14:12fidenciovery thanls
16:14:22ThomasAHfunman: Crashes are ok, now it is just to be able to try out listening music with rockbox :)
16:14:26ranmachanfunman: I updated and
16:14:59funmanranmachan: that's a lot of new code, it makes me wonder if your other patch with a thread is simpler
16:15:28ranmachanBTW, since they apply to all AMS models, it would be great if someone could test on those
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16:16:20ranmachanfunman: For making c200v2 sooner I suppose committing the thread patch would be faster I guess
16:16:40funmanyou're the one who knows the code :p
16:17:40ranmachanI just mean, yeah because it's a lot of touched code it may need more testing before going into svn
16:18:10ranmachanWorks fine for me so far though (currently listening to music on my c200v2 with the patched rockbox)
16:19:17ranmachanMultibyte writes are still untested though, but multibyte reads (DACNT>1) work fine :)
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16:19:35ranmachanGenerates one interrupt per byte though.
16:20:12ranmachanI'd hoped it would have a deeper FIFO and only generated one interrupt for multiple bytes.
16:20:31funmanrtc driver writes 4 bytes but one by one
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16:24:24 Part punkt
16:25:17funmanranmachan: both patches seems to work fine on Clip+
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16:26:21S_a_i_n_tBah...One failed attempt after another, it'd be *SO* much better (and I'd actually put it in my builds...) if the "new dict" put its menu entry into "Plugins", but its evidently a bit past my technical knowhow to do so.
16:26:23elinenbefunman: quick question...
16:26:32funmanare you sure I2C2_INT_CLR isn't write-only register?
16:26:41elinenbeIf I build the clip+ from source, will it play MP3s, or was that on an internal build?
16:26:45S_a_i_n_tIf anyone can do it, I will proclaim them to be my new God.
16:27:42funmanelinenbe: you need to apply the patch i mentioned at
16:28:14funmanranmachan: the OF uses |= too, so it should be ok
16:28:51ranmachanYeah, I copied that from OF
16:28:58elinenbefunman: thanks.
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16:35:17CIA-5New commit by 03Buschel (r25258): Use consistent wording for line-in and -out.
16:36:48*S_a_i_n_t wonders if FS #11101 is headed for a commit any time soon..? Just found it, awesome :D
16:39:44Buschelis it intentional that LANG_LINE_IN and LANG_SYSFONT_LINE_IN define the same text?
16:39:51Dobsonhow you guys get OF code?
16:41:51CIA-5New commit by 03Buschel (r25259): Add german translation for line-out.
16:43:26funmanDobson: usually with the firmware updates distributed by the manufacturer
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16:44:07funmanon models where firmware updates aren't distributed as standalone files (like ipod nano2g), it requires some genious and potentially soldering skills
16:45:08pixelmaBuschel: yes, but the SYSFONT one should go as soon as it is not needed anymore (I don't even know if it still is). The sysfont strings were introduced when e.g. the recscreen couldn't use the userfont
16:45:29pixelmais it not deprecated yet?
16:45:36AlexPDobson: And then reverse engineering
16:45:44elinenbefunman: how long until is checked in?
16:46:11funmanelinenbe: no estimation
16:46:35funmansome more work is required
16:46:38gevaertsS_a_i_n_t: as far as I'm concerned, that patch should not go in as-is. Thanks for reminding me that I needed to review it :)
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16:47:29S_a_i_n_tgevaerts: I*really* like the idea though...I'm not abig fan of the current (also activates the quickscreen) behaviour
16:47:42S_a_i_n_tDo you think it (or a variant) will make it in?
16:47:47elinenbefunman: Okay −− cool. Thanks.
16:48:18gevaertsI don't know. There's one other thing "wrong" with it I think, but right now that's not *too* important
16:48:49pixelmaBuschel: is this new setting in a "things to enable/disable" submenu? Just reading "Line out" wouldn't tell me much
16:49:17gevaertsOne HAVE_USBSTACK targets, we're (slowly) collecting more class drivers, and at some point someone should work out a decent set of settings for them. This setting should be integrated into that
16:49:36Buschelpixelma: the SYSFONT text is only used in recording.c
16:50:29Buschelpixelma: the "line out" setting is placed in the system menu right beneath the accessory power supply.
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16:51:22AlexPbattery capacity is only used for runtime estimation yes?
16:51:37S_a_i_n_tThe only thing I dont like about the way it is for the iPods now is that holding menu also activates the quickscreen, which is purely aesthetic except for the (about 3 out of 5 times for me) times when you don't get it quite right and end up messing up your quickscreen settings.
16:52:01AlexPS_a_i_n_t: I don't see how that setting wil lchange that
16:52:15AlexPYou will still have to hold a button for one of the actions, you can just chose which
16:52:29AlexPAnd there isn't really any way of gettign around that seeing as all buttons are used
16:52:36S_a_i_n_twell, you won't need to hold menu to activate "charge only" so, it will fix it completely.
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16:53:02S_a_i_n_tI've *always* wanted charge only to be a manu setting.
16:53:03AlexPIf you use it that way round, yes
16:53:07AlexPgood for you
16:54:41gevaertsThis setting is not related to charging!
16:55:01AlexPgevaerts: And thanks for pointing out the lack of manual update
16:55:30gevaertsAlexP: if I'm complaining about a patch, I might as well do it properly :)
16:56:55AlexPgevaerts: Incidentally, battery capacity is only used for runtime estimation, yes?
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17:15:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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17:32:23FlynDicefunman: re sound patch, Don't wait for me, I went back to looking at SD code once I heard sound coming out of my headphones..... I can confirm your volume min & max observations though.
17:32:51funmanok i'll continue on this, i tried to have mt work on it but he's too busy :o
17:34:53FlynDiceIf you want me to work on it I can try, but I'm in one of those "learn as you do" situations in that area vs. I have a pretty good handle on SD related things now.
17:35:28funmanyou're da SD man you mean :)
17:36:05FlynDiceI'll wear that hat proudly... stop laughing.. ;-)
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17:37:28mooscongratulations to you guys, very well done !
17:37:33sevardCan anyone please point me to documentation on the rockbox calendar plugin?
17:37:46funmanbtw i had some crashes when loading plugins (mostly data aborts), but listening to music for a long time showed no artifact
17:37:56sevardI dropped an ical calendar I exported from google calendar into the Calendar directory but I can't figure out this plugin :|
17:37:57funmanalthough i have seen timeouts when waiting for TRAN state
17:38:46funmansevard: , doesn't look like you can import calendars
17:39:16sevardwell, it must read from a file..
17:39:19moosas far I remenber, indeed you canot do so
17:39:21sevardso it's in some sort of format
17:40:02funmansevard: look at .rockbox/rocks/apps/.memo
17:40:42FlynDicefunman: I've had no problems while reading from SD, I've had state problems while trying to write but have not spent a whole lot of time yet.
17:41:46sevardthis .memo file is empty
17:41:57sevardI found a
17:42:03sevardit's too bad he didn't post his perl script.
17:43:18funmansevard: did you write memos in the calendar plugin already?
17:43:52sevardno mate, i can't figure out the buttons
17:43:55sevardi'm still playing.
17:44:17S_a_i_n_tsevard: that's what the manual is for ;)
17:44:59sevardar ethese applications
17:45:03sevardhardware specific?
17:45:07sevardthat calendar app looks sweet.
17:45:26sevardi'm running an old 4th generation greyscale ipod
17:45:48funmansevard: have a look at the manual, all the supported plugins are listed
17:46:25sevardright right, but it says nothing about the file format in the pdf
17:47:14sevardso it's not really calendar appointments, it's a memo on a day.
17:47:17S_a_i_n_tuse the plugin...the look at the format it has written.
17:47:36sevardso figuring out the the encoding and then writing a script to convert would be kind of useless
17:47:44sevardconvert from ical to memo*(
17:50:12funmanlinux as3525 code lists as3515 or as3517 for i2c code (not the as3514)
17:51:34funmanah, as3517 is only in as3527
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17:53:36pamaurymc2739: ping
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18:09:48CIA-5New commit by 03funman (r25260): Clip+: enable sound on "as3514" (as3543 in fact) ...
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18:33:21pamaurymc2739: if you see this message, could you have a look at the message I let you on flyspray about high dircache usage ?
18:33:34kunali need some help with one of the idea listed in GSOC '10 ideas
18:33:53saratogakunal: which one
18:34:41kunalclean up the radio code. I get that the code need to be refactored, but it says "(building on the existing tuner_get/set() system)."
18:34:55kunalwhat is the existing system ?
18:35:07saratogakunal: hmm thats one of the few I don't know much about
18:35:28saratogathe basic problem though is that the radio code is ancient and i think a lot of it predates modern software decoding rockbox targets
18:35:49saratogaI'm curious why you're interested in that project, I thought it was the one we were least likey to hear anything about
18:36:04funmankunal: have a look at tuner.h and the tuner-specific headers included from here
18:36:53kunalsaratoga: actually i am totally new to rockbox, so that is the one i could actually understand much better compared to others..
18:39:32*domonoky1 thinks the most work in this project would be to rework the radio code, so the radio drivers get really generic, and all target specific parts go into our target tree.
18:40:19domonoky1kunal: do you have any rockboxable mp3players ?
18:40:38saratogawhat are the generic parts of the radio code? scanning for channels, the GUI, and ?
18:41:00funmanwhere is jdgordon when you need him!
18:41:02kunaldomonoky1: no
18:42:14domonoky1with generic radio drivers i mean radio driver code whitout target-depended defines, they should just use the data transfer functions from the target tree.
18:44:50AlexPkunal: I think you would need one (with a radio) for this project :)
18:49:16kunali saw that some of apple ipod works with rockbox
18:49:31kunalcan you tell me if ipod nano 5g or itouch works with rockbox ?
18:49:44AlexPIt is on the front page
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18:50:34kunalmost of it i dont think is available in India
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18:51:24kunalthe first one says just ipod, it is not specific that which of the ipod it is talking about
18:53:27AlexPkunal: eh?
18:53:37AlexPkunal: says "Apple: iPod 1g through 5.5g, iPod Mini and iPod Nano 1g"
18:53:57AlexPfor stable ports, and "Apple: iPod Nano 2g" for unstable
18:54:13kunal"Apple: iPod 1g through 5.5g " does that means it is talking about ipod classic ?
18:54:22kunalor shuffle
18:54:24funmanclassic is 6g afaik
18:54:42AlexPyes, classic is 6g
18:54:59AlexPkunal: and shuffle isn't mentioned so therefore not supported
18:55:16AlexPWe explicitly list the targets we work on
18:55:34saratogaif in doubt what an mp3 player is, check wikipedia :)
18:55:42AlexPNote that ipods don't have radios so if you went the ipod route you would also need an add-on
18:55:56AlexPOne of the sansas with radio would be a better bet IMO
18:56:04saratogaa sansa is a pretty good choice since they have radios and are really cheap
18:56:14funmani just looked at that, it seems fm for ipod is implemented externally to the device (in the headphones)
18:56:15bluebrotherthe IpodFAQ wiki page has a link to an apple page that in detail tells how to identify your player model
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19:00:02funmanhm what does HAVE_FMRADIO_IN tell that CONFIG_TUNER doesn't ?
19:01:17Dobsonhm for some reason in theme "dance puff dua" battery level is indicating out of LCD limits
19:01:36funmanah, HAVE_FMRADIO_IN is defined if (INPUT_SRC_CAPS & SRC_CAP_FMRADIO)
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19:12:12bieberI'm looking at the Theme Editor SOC project, and I'm wondering about the "current theme editor" that the project description mentions. Is this somewhere in the SVN tree? Google only turns up some amaroK script and a link to the SOC page suggesting the project when I search for "Rockbox Theme Editor"
19:12:31bluebrotherbieber: hello
19:13:07bluebrotheryou're Robert Bieber?
19:13:15bieberYes, I think I emailed you yesterday
19:13:17Dobsoni believe current editor is noteoad
19:13:31bluebrotherindeed. Just wanted to reply you, didn't get around earlier :)
19:13:54Dobsonnotepad, but GUI theme editor would be realy nice
19:14:05bluebrotherbieber: check utils/wpseditor, that's the current editor.
19:14:29bluebrotherit's been done in SoC2008 (?) but almost hasn't been touched since.
19:15:36bluebrotheryes, it was 2008. There's even a wiki page about it, see
19:15:46Dobsonwhere is utils? because i cant find them? or is this "still in process" thing?
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19:16:10bieberIf you check out the SVN tree, there's a directory "utils" in the root directory
19:16:14bluebrotherDobson: it's in svn. You just need to get trunk, then you also get utils
19:16:22bieberThanks for the header, I'm going to compile it and take a look now
19:17:02AlexPIf it compiles
19:17:08Dobsongod my english is bad, what is trunk?
19:17:21AlexPThe "root" of the Rockbox SVN repository
19:17:36AlexPThink of it like a tree
19:17:51funmanDobson: have a look at
19:18:34bluebrotherDobson: to be more specific it's a convention in the svn world. You have some top-level folder, and the one the main development is going on is called "trunk" per convention. Same is with the folders "branches" and "tags".
19:18:52bieberOkay, it doesn't compile
19:18:54bluebrotherThat's simply because svn doesn't know about tags, branches and stuff. It "just" deals with copies.
19:19:03Dobsonye I get it, i got another thing in my mind
19:19:22AlexPbieber: WPS code has had a *huge* amount of change since 2008, I'm not suprised
19:19:33Dobsoni was thinking about finished utils :)
19:21:03bluebrotherbieber: the problem with the wps editor is that it reused quite some code from the main Rockbox tree to avoid duplication.
19:21:21funmannot much luck with FM audio out :/
19:21:35bluebrotherwhich means that you need to also deal with Rockbox code. Not the low level stuff, though.
19:22:30bieberI would imagine mostly the stuff in apps/gui/skin_engine, right?
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19:23:42funmanfm regs are identical for my fuze & clip+ so i suppose no changes are needed in si4700 code
19:26:06Dobsonrockbox just crashed on my fuze
19:26:10bieberI'd expect to have to refactor the skin parser a good deal, as it seems to use a lot of conditional compilation for different targets, and the editor would need to be able to handle that kind of thing at runtime
19:26:53bluebrotherbieber: there's a small ... "problem" with terms: the first part (and pretty long the only part) that was customizable is the While Playing Screen, i.e. WPS. Bundled with some other settings (like fonts and colors) that was called theme. Later it was extended to allow further customization.
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19:28:22pixelmabluebrother: did you get my note about audible clicks at the beginning of any clip (either in a voice file or in a talk file) that I made on the Mac?
19:28:39bluebrotherit depends. The old wpseditor tried to build a libwps for each target and use that. We already have checkwps which works similar (though it doesn't create libs :)
19:28:45bluebrotherpixelma: no, missed that.
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19:29:26pixelmaI wonder whether it comes from the TTS or a maybe still faulte wavtrim or so
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19:29:35pixelmafaulty too
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19:30:04bluebrotheryeah, I was thinking about the same thing. Though I hoped that wavtrim and friends are finally fixed :o
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19:30:29bluebrotherhave you checked if the clicks also appear if you use a different voice?
19:31:30bieberDoes anyone remember working with the old editor? Would it likely be more worthwhile to try to get it to compile and work on it from where it is, or start with a new one?
19:32:05bluebrotherdomonoky is the one who mentored the project back then.
19:32:32pixelmabluebrother: it's in all different voices I tried (though all infovox ones currently) and sounds the same as far as my ear can tell
19:33:14AlexPbieber: I doubt anyone has used the old one, it never really got to "release"
19:33:54AlexPbieber: I think that decision should be made after you and your prospective mentor (and others in here) have discussed it
19:34:05bluebrotherI remember I had the old editor running once. Though it was rather clumsy to build it at all.
19:35:08bluebrotherIIRC that project unfortunately failed in the end so my guess is that it might be easier to start from scratch.
19:35:20bieberOn another note, what kind of requirements/preferences would you all have for a student for the project?
19:35:57AlexPSomeone who communicates well, has some skills, etc.
19:36:04AlexPJust the standard ones :)
19:36:18bluebrotherAlexP: define "standard" ;-)
19:36:31AlexPbluebrother: I just did :)
19:36:37AlexPAdd works hard too :)
19:36:43bluebrotherAlexP: by yourself? ;-)
19:37:04bieberIs previous experience a must? I'm a good student, and I think a good coder, but this would be my first time working with anything this large
19:37:12*domonoky thinks the old wps editor is only useable as inspiration. A new theme editor should probably built from scratch...
19:37:14Dobsonknows asm :)
19:37:28Dobsondont listen to me i'm not in this thing
19:37:36pixelmabluebrother: I can't tll if it's there on my Ondio but I had to go down with the quality quite a bit and mp3 compresses could possibly give different results anyways
19:37:42domonokyi also dont know if it worth to reuse rockboxs parsers etc, maybe its better just write new parsers..
19:37:48bieberWell, I know one asm, but I don't think I'd write a theme editor with it ;)
19:38:25AlexPI hope not :)
19:38:25gevaertsbieber: previous experience definitely helps, but we do know that "student" means "not an experienced professional"
19:38:49domonokyusing rockboxs parser would help to not dublicate code, but it also makes it very complicated .. the old project essentially failed because of that.
19:38:51Dobsoncontroling analog signals in asm ir real pain
19:39:04bieberdomonoky: I was beginning to have the same thought as well. I've been scanning over the current skin_parser.c for a little while, and it looks like it's really heavily tied into Rockbox's architecture
19:39:35AlexPAbility to "easily" keep it up-to-date with Rockbox changes is something to think about too
19:39:50domonokyyes, it would many wrappers etc to make it compile on PC, and they would always fail if something changed in rockboxs code.
19:39:53bieberI'd think I could probably build something with Bison or something similar more easily than I could refactor all of that code
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19:41:05domonokyif the tokens etc are defined via some textfile or similar, it would probably be easy enough to keep it uptodate.
19:41:51bluebrotherbieber: from my point of view if your are keen to learn, willing to spend the time (I'm considering SoC like a full time job for students) and communicate well then you have the main requirements met. Previous experience definitely is a plus but nothing I'd consider being important. You need to start somehow at all, don't you?
19:42:24bluebrother(I've started the Qt port of Rockbox Utility, and back then I started learning Qt and C++. Wasn't SoC, though)
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19:43:26bieberI'm definitely up for the work, and I don't have any large project experience, but I have done enough work with scanners and parsers to know what I'm doing there
19:43:48Dobsonfm spreset file contains realy accurate frequensy is it real to set that acurately?
19:44:13bieberI haven't worked with QT yet, but I don't think that will take long to get up to speed on, especially with the amount of time I'll be spending on it
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19:44:53bluebrotherno, Qt is quite nice to learn.
19:44:57funmanDobson: i think the frequencies are accurate to 1Hz but fm chips use a much lower accuracy (si4700 is accurate to 0.1MHz)
19:45:58bieberbluebrother: That's the impression I got from the little bit I've looked into it
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19:46:54Dobsonbut i easily can feel diference between 0.05 and 0.1Mhz on my fuze
19:47:20stripwaxhow do you 'feel' the difference between frequencies .. ?
19:47:26funmanDobson: hm i can only increase/decrease by 0.1MHz on fuze
19:48:19Dobsonif you choose region "other" then you can chage it by 0.05
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19:49:06funmandon't remember why we use different spacing dependign on the region
19:49:16funmanDobson: what is the range: 87.5 - 108MHz ?
19:49:28CIA-5New commit by 03zagor (r25261): Don't print fractions of seconds.
19:49:32Dobsonsomething like that
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19:51:49bieberThanks for the discussion, everyone. I'll be in touch :)
19:52:15stripwaxfunman - the region determines the actual frequency parameters that the broadcast uses - some regions allow for broadcasts at 0.1Mhz intervals, some regions allow for broadcasts at 0.05Mhz intervals etc
19:52:27domonokywe have different frequency spacing in different regions, because thats the way thos radio frequency are defined. some countrys have radios 0.05 apart, others only 0.1
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19:59:46Dobsonhow wide is sansa fuze radio chip freqlensy?
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20:03:00bofh__saratoga: around now?
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20:04:29Dobsoni mean how low and how high it could get on frequency
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20:08:52 Part froggyman
20:08:53domonokyDobson: from si4700.c i would guess 76-> 108
20:09:14Dobsonwhat is exatc chip model?
20:10:07Dobsoni wouldnt believe that top would be 108 just on the edge
20:10:27Dobsonit should be 109 at least to have a reserve
20:10:28domonoky /firmware/export/config/sansafuze.h say si4700 :-)
20:10:52stripwaxDobson - why?
20:10:52domonokya silicon Labs chip.
20:11:14Dobsoni cant find it's datahseet
20:11:39Dobsonou i believe i found it
20:12:28domonokysearch for si4702
20:12:51ViakenBah. Woot sent me a FuzeV2.
20:12:52domonokydatasheet says too 76-108Mhz
20:12:54Dobsonit is on the edge
20:13:17Dobsoni believe thay are saving money on varistors
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20:14:27stripwaxif the highest broadcast frequency is 108, why would you need to go to 109?
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20:21:10soaphave you benched either of these last two commits, Buschel? If the estimates are right you're talking a combined impact of an ~1.5 hours on 60/80GB models and ~1 hour on 30GB models!
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20:26:25Buschelsoap: I have measured the line-out disabling several times. I would assume +20 min on a 30GB model. The ATA patch was measured by dreamlayers and myself in benchs without any clearly visible effect. The measurements via debug screen told another story... In total I do not expect the total runtime to go up more than 20-30 min on a 30GB model. But even that is fine :o)
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20:28:07saratogabofh__: am now
20:28:59saratogabofh__: the channel is logged so you can always ask questions even if I'm not around
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20:37:31fmlpixelma: hello. Would you like to talk about non-floating screenshots? I.e. screenshots not nested into a 'figure' environment?
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21:06:03stripwaxi wonder what else we aren't doing properly, if the OF has accessory supply and lineouts active at all times but (seemingly) longer runtime
21:07:31Tornestripwax: you mean on ipodvideo?
21:08:22Tornewe beat the OF by a good four hours at least...
21:08:27stripwaxmaybe I'm misremembering then!
21:08:53TorneI got 25+ hours on ipodvideo64mb *before* this latest set
21:08:59Torneand apple's own data only says 20 hours
21:09:20stripwaxis that with "turn off lcd and use no wps" type stuff though?
21:09:38Torneturning off lcd, yes, but a normal wps
21:09:59Tornei'm fairly sure we're on par with OF at worst with LCD on though
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21:10:17stripwaxhm, ok. i fancy testing that ..
21:10:24Tornethere are other things we don't do that we could: we don't shut down the BCM processor entirely
21:10:28Tornethere's a FS# for that somewhere
21:10:34Tornewhich might give us even *more* runtime with lcd off
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21:15:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:17:23fmlpixelma: ping
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21:31:29 Part Maxxie ("No matter how dark the night, somehow the Sun rises once again")
21:32:20pixelmafml: pong... well, I'm not sure what that means for the endproduct (especially the pdf). Can you explain it a bit?
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21:34:29fmlpixelma: as of now, not much perhaps. It could speed up typesetting since (it's my assumption) typesetting a fixed object is faster than typesetting a floating.
21:35:09fmlpixelma: as a side product, we'll free floats for really floating objects should we need them.
21:35:42 Join moos [0] (moos@rockbox/staff/moos)
21:35:58fmlSince now floating objects aren't really floating because they are placed exactly where they are in the source text.
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21:39:35pixelmasorry, I still can't follow
21:40:36pixelmamaybe I have a wrong picture what "floating" means here
21:41:54fmlpixelma: "floating" means in LaTeX that the object is placed (in PDF) not exactly where it's in the source text but maybe somewhere else −− to better fill up the page for example.
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21:45:05pixelmaand pictures/screenshots are currently "floating"? I ask because I can't remember seeing a screenshot which I thought was mispkaced.
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21:46:21pixelmaon the other hand, if we keep the somewhat "wasteful" layout with the big margins etc...
21:49:03fmlpixelma: technically, yes. They are placed into a 'figure' environment which is a floating. LaTeX tries to put such things where they are but may also shift them. We redefined figure placing to be 'H' which effectively means 'no shifting'.
21:49:59fmlThe only purpose of having 'figure' is the possibility to have a caption. But captions can also be set in another way, without 'figure'.
21:50:36mc2739pamaury: FS #11043 has been updated
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21:52:51MrIphonehey guys one question i read about a rockbox app for iphone is that real ?
21:52:56 Join kugel [0] (~kugel@rockbox/developer/kugel)
21:53:40TorneIt's an idea, nothing more
21:54:46MrIphonethx for the help torne
21:55:00MrIphonei really do hope iphonelinux is the same as ipodlinux
21:56:38pixelmafml: hmm, if I understand you correctly, then we say "float" but later we prevent it from being used that way?
21:57:31fmlpixelma: exactly. Look into preable.tex where figure placement is redefined.
21:57:45stripwaxMrIphone - I'm not sure what iphonelinux has to do with rockbox?
21:57:56stripwaxbut rockbox-as-an-application is a GSoC 2010 project
21:59:14pixelmafml: for the captions... how would you make them work then and how many chhanges are needed for it?
22:01:19 Join DV [0] (~DV@
22:02:31fmlpixelma: no, not many changes are needed. See FS #11129
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22:03:46MrIphonewhat is gsoc2010 ?
22:04:01FarthenMrIphone: google summer of code 2010
22:05:25MrIphonewell rockbox as app would be the best thing ever but i am quite sure apple wont allow it
22:05:36MrIphonelike the coreplayer
22:06:10saratogano one has ever allowed a rockbox port before
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22:08:30FarthenMrIphone: hu? apple won't allow rockbox as an app? what does apple have to do with that?
22:08:45gilmorenatorAny mentors on board to discuss GSOC project Ideas?
22:09:04CIA-5New commit by 03torne (r25262): Prevent accidental skipping to beginning/end of file in text viewer. ...
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22:09:41Tornegilmorenator: are you a student? or just have a suggestion?
22:10:18gilmorenatorTorne: I am a Student...
22:10:49Tornewell, you can discuss it. there are numerous devs here and the mentors are either probably around or will read the log
22:10:58MrIphonerockbox gonna provide a better music player on the iphone
22:11:03MrIphoneand we all do know apple
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22:11:26gilmorenatorTorne: Thanks...
22:11:40TorneMrIphone: Apple's approval process is not really relevant; we know tha Apple would not allow it on the app store, but someone would be welcome to develop it anyway.
22:11:53Farthenapp doesn't mean iphone. there are apps for all other kinds of devices like android
22:12:09TorneIndeed. The major part of rockbox-as-an-app is not device-specific
22:12:09saratogagilmorenator: which project did you want to discuss anyway?
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22:12:34Tornegetting it to run on the first device will be tricky, subsequent devices would hopefully be easier
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22:14:43gilmorenatorsaratoga: Of particular interest was the port across to the Android platform - I have a deep interest in Android apps however i probably lack the GNU skills involved
22:15:22MrIphonewell i still hope to get rockbox soon in my hands again lol ^^ freedom for better music :D
22:15:34saratogagilmorenator: have you done any work on android?
22:15:51kugelwhy doesn't our website state we are accepted for gsoc?
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22:16:23gilmorenatorsaratoga: Yes have completed a few apps for Android now mainly for research projects at University
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22:16:33saratogakugel: update it!
22:17:04kugelhow many slots did we get?
22:17:20Tornegilmorenator: do you have/use a rockboxed player?
22:17:34Torne(this is not mandatory)
22:17:50gilmorenatorsaratoga: Recently completed a pattern matching application for Biometric identification i.e. Even if someone knows my password they can type it in but if the pattern is incorrect they are not who they claim to be
22:17:55pixelmakugel: that's not decided yet
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22:18:15gilmorenatorsaratoga: Yes I have it running on my iPod
22:18:44saratogaso you've done android and apple stuff?
22:20:22 Quit DV (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
22:21:09gilmorenatorsaratoga: If that question is for me - then I have only developed for Android but not Apple - Just used Rockbox on iPod
22:21:24saratogaah ok misunderstood you
22:21:50saratogai wouldn't say rockbox involves a lot of GNU stuff exactly, we're somewhat different then most other projects
22:22:10saratogabut it would involve a lot of reading other peoples c code and trying to understand a lot of old and often confusing code
22:23:37pixelmafml: do I understand correctly, that the patch uses a new package (caption2) - and if so is it standard? I guess I could try though...
22:24:40gilmorenatorsaratoga: My background is hardware: PIC microcontrollers, Electronics, Arduino, DSP etc... I'm proficent in Assembler, C (intermediate) and .net languages with a focus on C# I also teach Object Oriented Programming to 2nd years
22:25:17gilmorenatorsaratoga: Sounds like a large undertaking with a lot of challenges to complete within the time scale
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22:34:41pamaurymc2739: thanks ! I'll read it with interest
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22:43:33Tornepamaury: i've added your FAT directory patch to my ipod build, so I'll see how it goes :0
22:44:02pamauryok, I'm going to push it to the limits to check
22:44:54saratogagilmorenator: if you're interested in this you should apply
22:45:05saratogawe'll evaluate your application and then can discuss it in more detail
22:45:08MrIphoneis there a homepage for app projekt of rockbox or is there anyway to support the projekt
22:45:30TorneMrIphone: It's only an idea. There is no work being done yet.
22:45:51MrIphonewell i hope somebody gonna work on that idea
22:45:56sevardgilmorenator: make a better calendar plugin.
22:48:23 Join fml [0] (
22:48:28fmlpixelma: sorry, I was off for a while. Yes, the patch uses the package caption2 (which is a rather standard package IMO) to typeset captions −− instead of using 'figure'.
22:48:37gilmorenatorsaratoga: Im just looking at other Android projects and will make my application in due course - the Rockbox idea is a good one but its just a matter of getting it started i guess
22:49:02gilmorenatorsevard: A calendar plugin for Rockbox?
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22:52:22pamauryTorne: I just spotted some potential bugs in my FAT code. If some entries are longer than the spec allows, it will be a nice buffer overflow
22:52:40TorneOh :)
22:52:53sevardgilmorenator: yeah ;)
22:53:02pamauryI think I'll also further reduce the size of fat_dir->longname
22:54:06pamauryOh sorry, increase :) To avoid another overflow if the number of LFN entry is good but the size is >=255
22:54:48Tornewhat's the maximum length we can reasonably deal with?
22:55:22pamauryin which part of the code ?
22:55:30Tornein general.
22:55:40Tornei mean eventually you'd hit MAX_PATH no?
22:55:47pamaurywell, MAX_PATH is rather present even though I would like to suppress it
22:56:13pamaurythat's 260 actually
22:56:23fred_99saratoga, I did a battery bench with my x5 under cowon OS, and the result is almost the same. I can mesure the real current consumption with an amper meter if you want.
22:57:20fred_99if it helps of course
22:57:27pamauryTorne: hum, I think the current and older code was/is buggy: LFN entries are not always NUL terminated
22:57:35Tornewell there's no point in handling filenames longer than MAX_PATH, is there?
22:57:45Tornesince we can't actually pass them to the caller]
22:58:02Torneanyway yeah, i'll take the patch out I think
22:58:13Torneif you come up with another one i will review it if you like
22:58:19Tornei didn't really look at this in detail
22:58:30pamauryI don't like fat spec, look:
22:58:39pamaury Names are also NUL terminated and padded with
22:58:39pamaury0xFFFF characters in order to detect corruption of long name fields by errant disk utilities. A name
22:58:39pamaurythat fits exactly in a n long directory entries (i.e. is an integer multiple of 13) is not NUL terminated
22:58:39DBUGEnqueued KICK pamaury
22:58:39pamauryand not padded with 0xFFFFs.
22:59:07pamauryNUL-terminated ? not NUL-terminated ? That is the question :)
22:59:15fmlpamaury: are you talking about the current FAT code? AFAICS there is a check whether the LFN still fits into the buffer. If not, the short name is used.
22:59:26TorneIt's terminated by a NUL or by the fact that you've reached the last LFN entry
22:59:31Torneer, the end of the last LFN entry
22:59:35TorneTHis is just tough
22:59:53pamauryWell, I'll change the code, not to assume it's NUL-terminated then
23:00:00sevardIs any portion of this conversation related to parking the drive?
23:00:25Tornesevard: what? no.
23:00:33 Quit fml (Quit: CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06))
23:00:34Tornedo you have a problem?
23:00:43sevardyeah, I'm having an issue when I pause my audio and rockbox goes into power save mode it must not be parking the drive correctly
23:01:02Tornei don't understand what you mean..
23:01:05sevardI figured it was my drive, but I put a brand new hdd in the 4th gen ipod
23:01:18Tornewe leave the hard disk off almost all the time
23:01:27sevardwell, when I press play to wake it up, the drive will click and I have to give it a sharp rap or else it'll give me an error screen
23:01:39Torneit's only on when we're refilling the buffer, or when you are doing somethign in the UI which requires disk access
23:01:55Tornewhat do you mean, power save mode?
23:01:58Torneyou mean idle poweroff?
23:02:13Tornerockbox doesn't support sleep mode
23:02:26sevardif that's what you call it, yes. it completely shuts down after a minute or two of inactivity
23:02:45TorneThen that's not anything to do with Rockbox
23:03:00Tornewhen it powers off it's off
23:03:08Tornewhen you turn it back on, the Apple code in the flash rom runs
23:03:20Torneif it doesn't even make it to our bootloader then it can't be rockbox causing it..
23:03:23TorneI would guess you have a hardware problem
23:03:50sevardI'm saying the issue lies when rockbox goes in to powersave mode, when it shuts off because of inactivity, it doesn't park the drive correctly.
23:03:54Torne(and idle poweroff is not normally a minute or two, it defaults to much longer, unless you have set it
23:03:58sevardthe drive works perfectly without seek errors or whatever
23:04:12sevardinteresting, i'll poke around in the manual and try to adjust it
23:04:13TorneThere is no "parking the drive"
23:04:16Torneit does that itself
23:04:28Torneit's been decades since disks needed to be parked by software
23:04:34Tornethey do it automatically on poweroff.
23:04:35sevardwell then
23:04:52sevardi aman old fashioned idiot eh?
23:05:11Tornewell no, clearly your ipod has a problem
23:05:20sevardwhen you reboot, with menu and select, the harddrive shuts off and starts up again, right?
23:05:20Tornei am just saying that it seems a lot more likely to be hardware.
23:05:36Tornesevard: I believe so
23:05:43sevardI don't have an issue with drive parking then
23:05:46Tornealso, that's not the normal way to reboot
23:05:51 Quit fred_99 (Quit: fred_99)
23:05:56Tornethat's a hrd reset, for emergencies only
23:06:00sevardeg, if it's running and i reboot it with menu/select the drive fires up just fine.
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23:06:18sevardah, I was completely un aware, i guess there's a soft-reboot option in system?
23:06:25TorneRockbox doesn't have a reboot option
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23:06:30Torneyou just power off then power back on again
23:06:39TorneIf you hard reset you will lose chagned settings, etc
23:06:44Torneyou should only do that if it's hung.
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23:08:40Tornesevard: anyway, it's *possible* there is a problem with rockbox, I am just saying it seems unlikely
23:08:57Tornesevard: does it boot ok to the original firmware, if you turn on the hold switch? or does it have the same problem there
23:09:25sevardit's supposed to boot back to the apple os when you turn on the hold switch?
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23:11:03sevardTorne: because it does not doo that, heh.
23:12:16Tornesevard: If you have the hold switch turned on while booting up, it will start the OF, yes
23:12:31Torneyou need to turn it on immediately after powering on
23:12:54Tornebut it will've had to already bring the disk up at that point, since the dual booting is done by our bootloader
23:13:54sevardyes it does boot to the ipod firmware
23:14:07Torneand it does that without a problem?
23:15:22 Quit robin0800 (Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.)
23:15:23sevardtesting that
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23:15:50sevardi need to wait for rockbox to go in power save shut off.
23:15:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:16:30Torneyou don't..
23:16:35TornePowering off is always the same
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23:16:40Tornepowering off by holding play is identical
23:16:44Torneit doesn't do anything different
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23:17:32Tornelike i said, it's not a power save mode, it just shuts down automatically after idle for whatever time you set it to.
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23:22:15sevardI don't know what to say now. It's not doing it.
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23:22:32sevarda frequent problem, for a month, and now nothing.
23:23:21stripwaxmaybe it didn't like being rebooted via menu+select :-)
23:23:37stripwaxit's quite a severe thing to do
23:23:46sevardthe problem was when I was playing music on the way to work, I'd stop at the gas station, come out, my ipod would be shut off
23:24:04stripwaxonly if you pause/stop it, presumably ?
23:24:06sevardI pressed play and could hear the read head clicking, and it would error/not boot.
23:24:14stripwaxwhat does that mean?
23:24:17sevardyeah, I press pause when I get out of the car.
23:24:21stripwaxwas there actually an Error Message
23:24:33sevardIt's the apple sad mac error message
23:25:11stripwaxthat is indeed really weird
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23:44:41amiconnpamaury: MAX_PATH is 260 in rockbox, but each path component is limited to <= 255 as per fat specs
23:45:20pamauryyes I now
23:45:29pamauryfat spec also limit a path to 260
23:45:36pamaury(characters, not bytes !)
23:46:11amiconn(and the actual limit *in characters* might be even lower due to the fact that MAX_PATH is 260 *bytes*, rockbox using utf-8, and fat using ucs-2)
23:46:44pamauryyes, rockbox doesn't handle all filenames that FAT handles
23:46:52amiconnOr utf-16, not 100% sure whether fat allows extended characters
23:48:29amiconnActually MAX_PATH == 260 is not actually a fat limit, but used by convention
23:48:30pamaurythe spec is rather vague
23:48:57pamauryamiconn: the FAT spec limits the maximum length of path to 260 characters
23:49:00 Quit stripwax (Quit:
23:49:08pamauryLong names are limited to 255 characters, not including the trailing NUL. The total path length of a
23:49:08pamaurylong name cannot exceed 260 characters, including the trailing NUL.
23:49:28amiconnThe unicode file api in windows allows path lengths of up to (a little less than) 64K chars, but keeps the 255 chars per path component limit
23:49:48pamauryyes the windows api is not the fat spec ;)
23:50:23amiconnThat's true, but then I don't see why a filesystem specs should limit total path length
23:51:14ender`<amiconn> The unicode file api in windows allows path lengths of up to (a little less than) 64K chars, but keeps the 255 chars per path component limit <- only when you prefix the path with \\?\, and only for programs that don't assume MAX_PATH limit
23:51:19amiconnAnyway, total path length isn't a propblem in the fat driver (iirc)
23:51:27ender`(and only for absolute paths)
23:51:39amiconnender`: That's why I said *the unicode api*
23:52:23ender`even if you use unicode api, without \\?\ prefix, you're limited to 260 characters (99% of programs fall under this limit)
23:52:45 Quit liar (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
23:55:30 Join JdGordon [0] (~jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)

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