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#rockbox log for 2010-11-16

00:00:41 Join Topy [0] (~Topy44@f048231108.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:01:24 Join JdGord [0] (~jd@58.104.94.102)
00:02:49 Quit Topy (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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00:04:19 Quit T44 (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
00:04:34krabadorhi people, i would to know if some of you guys are working on Sansa FuzeV1
00:09:59 Join casainho [0] (~chatzilla@bl15-96-164.dsl.telepac.pt)
00:10:08saratogayes of course, we have a stable port to the fuze v1
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00:11:02 Join simabeis [0] (~simabeis@lobmenschen.de)
00:13:34 Quit Xerion (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
00:13:51krabadorsaratoga, i use it with great fun, i had fear that rockbox developers are focused only on v2 , for the fuzes
00:14:22saratogai think theres not many people specifically working on any particular sandisk device
00:14:56Tornevery little is specific to the particular devices once they get to the point of being stable
00:16:33stripwaxkrabador - do you have a specific question regarding running rockbox on the fuze v1?
00:16:57 Quit mirak_ (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:17:40krabadorstripwax, battery duration will be improved again?
00:18:10 Join mirak_ [0] (~mirak@81-64-223-104.rev.numericable.fr)
00:18:56krabadorfuzev2 battery duration on rockbox are awesome, but for v1 are the half...
00:20:10 Join JdGordon| [0] (~jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
00:20:22casainhohello
00:20:35casainhocan someone tell me the state of Rockbox on Android?
00:20:45casainho(if there is sch thing)
00:20:51JdGordon|working well
00:20:56JdGordon|AndroidPort on the wiki
00:22:01casainhoJdGordon|: thanks ;-)
00:23:17saratogakrabador: there was some discussion of that today
00:24:18casainhoJdGordon|: do you have any idea of requesites for a board running Android + Rockbox?
00:24:28 Quit ender` (Quit: Engineers think that equations approximate the real world.Scientists think that the real world approximates equations.Mathematicians are unable to make the connection.)
00:24:29casainholike, how many RAM memory?
00:25:41tmzt_dg2rootboard?
00:25:48krabadorsaratoga, i can understand about v1 and v2 hardware differences, and how rockbox may vary on performance, on battery, i only hope that some of you developers are thinking about a solution to improve the battery duration on v1.
00:26:02tmzt_dg2rootyou wouldn't want to go below 128mb I would think for 2.2 without acceleration
00:26:22saratogakrabador: as I said, there was some discussion about that today
00:26:42saratogaRAM is so cheap i don't understand why you wouldn't just go with the standard 256 to 512 MB
00:28:00casainhoI have a board with 32MB...
00:28:13casainhothen I will port Rockbox to it
00:28:27saratogaha
00:28:27 Join fdinel [0] (~Miranda@modemcable235.127-131-66.mc.videotron.ca)
00:29:01casainhothis board: http://lyre.sourceforge.net/?q=content/imx233-3d-printed-enclosure
00:29:03saratogaif you just want to run Android + rockbox, you can actually buy ready made board with Android already ported to them, and then install your own build
00:29:26casainhoI want to sell and not to buy ;-)
00:29:31saratogaah ok
00:30:16 Join T44 [0] (~Topy44@f048224233.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:30:19casainhowill Rockbox continue to be developed for audio players?
00:30:32casainhoor Android devices are the future?
00:30:42saratogawhatever people want to work on
00:30:48casainhowill market still sell/have MP3 players?
00:31:29saratogayes, there seems to be room for both types of devices, although the days of hard disk and portable video players appear more limited
00:31:30casainhook
00:31:46 Join lixxus99 [0] (~lixxus@78-86-253-21.zone2.bethere.co.uk)
00:31:47amiconnCrystal ball, anyone?
00:31:50amiconn;)
00:32:08 Part lixxus99
00:32:12gevaertsamiconn: can we get one that runs rockbox? :)
00:32:21casainhoI want to build my own player, and sell it online −− produce at home and sell on shops like Etsy.com
00:32:37saratogadevices like the sansa clip will probably become the majority of the mp3 market, since they're in a cost, size and form factor that smart phones probably cannot reach
00:32:56JdGordon|famous last words!
00:32:57casainhobuild a device and sell it with Rockbox installed and full of music files with CC license
00:33:08JdGordon|watch phones will outsell smart phones eventually
00:33:10 Quit Topy44 (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
00:33:11 Quit jae (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
00:33:47saratogatheres a pretty fundamental limit to how small you can make a smart phone before the interface reduces it to a dumb phone
00:34:05scorchecasainho: an android device needs much more memory than 32MB...
00:34:51 Join jae [0] (~jae@jaerhard.com)
00:35:14casainhoI was just trying to know if I should port/use Android + Rockbox or just port Rockbox. Looks like I need to follow the "old" way
00:35:18JdGordon|about 100 before it really starts complaining
00:35:31keenerdsaratoga: By then we'll have solid voice control and bluetooth eyesets.
00:36:12 Quit komputes (Remote host closed the connection)
00:36:16saratoga"eyesets" are optically so difficult that they're probably never going to be feasible, and most people don't care for voice interfaces on devices
00:36:26scorchecasainho: the new archos android devices are going to be coming out for extremely cheap - it will be pretty hard for you to come anywhere close to them...
00:37:39keenerdsaratoga: $300 gets you QVGA, right now. Give it a few years to mature.
00:38:13krazykit`and between buying an archos android device and an amateur-built device, i know where my money is going
00:38:15saratogathe technology depends on having a large flat screen in front of your eyes at a significant distance away from your eye's lens, and no amount of maturation can change that
00:38:20 Quit krabador (Quit: Sto andando via)
00:38:45saratogatechnology can add more pixel and make the display cheaper but it can't change the fact that the underlying idea is completely unappealing
00:38:53casainhoscorche: yeah. But I want to make and sell a geek device
00:38:55 Quit JdGord (Quit: Bye)
00:38:58 Join krabador [0] (~krabador@host64-20-dynamic.251-95-r.retail.telecomitalia.it)
00:39:26casainhoI believe Android will not be geek
00:39:49casainhoRockbox is geek, I believe
00:40:01*scorche is a "geek" and has an android phone
00:40:11casainhono one commercial device come installed with Rockbox
00:40:11stripwaxcasainho - I suspect geeks would either want to buy a ready made commercial device, or a kit/board and make it themselves
00:40:16*JdGordon| has an android *because* he is a geek
00:40:24*stripwax too
00:40:29saratogain the long run android will probably replace all those random embedded operating systems and uclinux systems, so i think most little embedded electronic devices will run it
00:40:29keenerdscorche: Those are already out. Though the Archos 28 is stupid large. Same size case as the 32.
00:40:48stripwaxi kindof disagree but that's rather ot
00:41:10keenerdsaratoga: You are forgetting about routers and other devices without touchscreens.
00:41:14casainhostripwax: yes, I will explore that, try to give geek people what they look for
00:41:19saratogathose will probably run android too
00:41:25saratogawhy does a router need a touch screen?
00:41:57keenerdsaratoga: It does not. But Android does.
00:42:03saratogaAndroid doesn't need a touchscreen
00:42:16saratogaits a linux distribution, you can run it headless
00:42:46keenerdIt is part of their minimum specs, along with the four buttons and an accelerometer.
00:43:01saratogathere are no minimum specs to use android, its an open source project
00:43:08saratogayou're thinking of the minimum specs to use the google branding
00:43:25saratogamost of these cheap devices taht come with Android are not google branded
00:46:56casainhosaratoga: do you know if such Android code, need more than 32MB RAM?
00:47:04saratogayes, much more
00:47:10saratogawell for the GUI stuff anyway
00:47:40casainhohmmm
00:47:42saratogaif you want the actual google experience you need about 192MB or so minimum, though as you gut it you can obviously get away with less
00:47:55casainhoso, Rockbox port uses GUI from Adroid?
00:48:05stripwaxit's an app, that runs ON android
00:48:15casainhohmmm, ok
00:48:16saratoganot very much of it, but in the long run it may use more of the android gui elements
00:48:32scorchewell, it is more than just the GUI stiff - the way android deals with processes needs a decent bit of ram
00:48:34stripwaxcurrently it's very much looks and feels identical to other touchscreen ports
00:48:38saratogaright now its not much different then on other touch devices
00:48:55JdGordon|people here reckon android is bassically unusable with less than 100MB RAM
00:49:39casainhoin future, will not be problematic to have Android + other MP3 players devices code?
00:49:46JdGordon|here being work, not random people pulling numbers out of their ass
00:49:47saratogaAndroid basically includes a lot of things that Rockbox does not (networking, complicated windowing toolkit, java, web browser, VM, etc), so it needs quite a lot of memory compared to rockbox
00:49:54casainhowill not the code be to different?
00:50:19stripwaxwe would always want to maintain a single code base.
00:50:49stripwaxalmost all of the android-specific stuff is implemented in separate android-specific files in the source tree
00:51:06saratogaalthough we might eventually want to support different GUIs for different devices (or multiple different GUIs on one device)
00:51:10stripwaxrockbox abstracts away from most of that stuff currently
00:51:22***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:51:23stripwax(^ by mostly supporting only one GUI currently..)
00:52:01saratogathe list interface is pretty nice, but if someone wanted to try another I'm sure that'd be accepted if it were implemented well and included the necessary separation of interface from underlying APIs
00:52:57stripwaxfor example - it might be nice to use fonts and media library functionality from the android host. (of course, it might not, but that's just one example)
00:53:46JdGordon|media library - almost certainly
00:53:46 Join Derreck [0] (~derreck@c-98-235-171-182.hsd1.pa.comcast.net)
00:53:55JdGordon|or tie into sql instead of our database
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01:00
01:02:07tmzt_dg2rootif your doing that you might as well support sqlite, but media scanner is not a very well implemented system on android
01:02:54saratogai'm sure we want to use our own media scanner, since we support all sorts of things Android doesn't
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01:03:55tmzt_dg2rootI mean if your going to write an sql backend might as well support sqlite on targets, at least ones with the memory to handle it, it's public domain license, in process, and not multithreaded
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01:07:29saratogaIIRC people have looked at sqlite and the memory requirements were quite large
01:07:43Torneit's huge compared to us, indeed
01:08:21saratogaFS #8852 - Add SQLite to the pluginlib
01:09:42Tornejust the *code* for sqlite is 300kb+
01:10:48 Quit casainho (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
01:11:00 Part toffe82
01:11:25saratogaplus it was never really clear to me what SQL really gets us, we don't exactly need complicated queries
01:11:39saratogaIMO we just need some more work on our current systesm
01:11:56saratogathings like the ability to log what files are being processed so that people can report files that crash the metadata parser easily
01:12:25saratogamaybe a portable database format so that we can more easily trouble shoot corrupted databases
01:12:37saratogathe problem is that the current database is barely maintained
01:14:38 Quit LambdaCalculus37 (Quit: Fwump)
01:16:58JdGordon|the logging should be simple to add...
01:17:13JdGordon|my biggest beef is not easily being able to resume a query
01:17:58JdGordon|it should be able to do something like "artist=foo,album=bar" just like the file browser can do "/music/foo/bar"
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02:03:20*JdGordon| wonders about moving more of the list settings (like the show icons and selector colours) into the sbs instead of the menu
02:03:38JdGordon|maybe not instead of, but at least making them available to the sbs more eaiyl
02:03:40JdGordon|easily
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02:51:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:31:26saratogalibmad synthesis patch now produces identical output to SVN
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07:47:06*Buschel 's nano just reached 8,5h runtime at 64% battery
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07:47:47Buschelthis extrapolates to about 1,5h extra runtime with the latest changes (core voltage scaling and lcd sleep)
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07:56:58S_a_i_n_tBuschel: Nice
07:57:10S_a_i_n_tNano2G runtime has greatly improved recently.
07:57:37Buschelyep, we might exceed 24h now :)
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08:20:53S_a_i_n_tBuschel: TheSeven's notes from (my) last night suggested that ~35h was possible with a few tricks and a brand new battery iirc
08:22:26BuschelS_a_i_n_t: there are some additional tweaks possible, like fiddling with the LCD's power supply when it is switched off (was removed from svn due to issues with USB)
08:22:42Buschelnice target to play with :)
08:22:53Buschel(except the codec performance)
08:23:08S_a_i_n_tyeah...I was wondering what LCD and USB had in common, it seems odd for one to affect the other.
08:23:35S_a_i_n_tAnd yes, it is a nice target...my second favourite though now I have another Nano 1st Gen.
08:24:10Buschelwhat is the benefit of the nano 1g over a 2g?
08:26:21S_a_i_n_tI just like them a lot better. They're nowhere near as fast as the 2G but I like the style of the 1st Gen a lot more...I would love to see if I could kludge the mainboard from a Nano2G into a 1st Gen shell.
08:30:10Buschelwell, when using both cores the nano 1g is significantly faster. especially when clocking it to 100 MHz (I am doing this with my iPod Video)
08:30:28Buschelthe memory (iram) is much faster on the PP CPUs
08:31:05S_a_i_n_twhat is the Nano1G clocked to in SVN?
08:31:18Buschel48 MHz unboosted, 192 MHz boosted
08:31:25Buscheloops, that was nano 2g
08:31:30S_a_i_n_tI forget, it's been months since I've had my hands on one. Just loading a build onto one now.
08:31:33Buschelnano 1g: 80 MHz
08:32:00S_a_i_n_tdoes it handle 100 MHZ well? the Nano1g?
08:32:22Buschelnot all PP's work stable or even start at 100 MHz. you could try, it's quite easily tested
08:33:25Buschellike this -> http://pastie.org/1301912
08:33:37S_a_i_n_tI'll gve it a go.
08:33:50Buschelyou do not need to et the "#if 1" though, that's for using 24 MHz unboosted clock
08:33:54Buschel*set
08:34:29S_a_i_n_tdoes lowering the unboosted clock get any power savings?
08:34:47Buschela lot
08:35:05Buschelbut the gui will be somehow laggy. you might try it though
08:35:30Buschelthat's why I use a gui boost patch which boost the CPU (with timeout) when using the buttons
08:35:45Buschelsavings are 1 mA per 4 MHz
08:35:59S_a_i_n_tah...right, if the UI is going to be slower I may leave it out...I can't stand the UI being laggy.
08:36:40Buscheldo you only use your nano for music playback or for games as well?
08:37:33S_a_i_n_ta bit of everything
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08:37:53Buschel24 MHz saves ~4 mA compared to svn (40 MHz). but only for high efficiency codecs like mpc, flac or mp3
08:38:12S_a_i_n_tI use mp3 solely
08:38:48Buschelthen you should _really_ think about using 24 MHz and the gui boost patch.
08:39:06S_a_i_n_tgui boost patch?
08:39:29Buschelfs#8668
08:39:51S_a_i_n_tthanks, so apply that patch, and the pastie you sent?
08:40:50Buschelyep, not sure whether tha patch still apllies. give me a note, if it doesn't
08:41:04Buschelneed to go to the dentist now, wish me luck! :/
08:41:16S_a_i_n_tpoor fellow. :/
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09:50:33TheSevenBuschel (for the logs): I have the impression that CPU sleep isn't working properly.
09:51:36TheSevenWhen I'm in emBIOS, it doesn't make a huge difference whether it's sleeping at 48 or 192MHz. In rockbox, this seems to account for several milliamps though, while it doesn't seem to make any difference if the CPU is decoding audio or not, as long as it isn't boosted.
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10:06:58ZagorTheSeven: I didn't know we even used sleep
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10:23:20TheSevenZagor: oh? that would explain a lot...
10:23:25TheSevenhow are we idling then?
10:23:52Zagorlast I looked, we're just lowering the clock
10:24:13TheSevenwhat is our "idle thread" doing? do we even have one?
10:24:31TheSevenor are we just doing threadswitches like crazy if no thread wants CPU time?
10:26:58Zagorno, I'm confused. we do sleep in that case.
10:27:23Zagorfirmware/thread.c:1206
10:28:36TheSevenapparently we're doing that fairly inefficiently...
10:29:47TheSevenemBIOS hits 50 hours of battery life when idling at 192MHz, rockbox about 30-35 hours at 48MHz
10:29:53TheSevensomething can't be quite right.
10:30:33TheSevenrockbox at 192MHz would be more like 25 hours
10:30:53Zagorperhaps it's due to how much we're really idling. I'm not sure but I think we wake up every tick to check for activity.
10:31:09TheSevena part of the power is certainly by the codec chip bein powered up, but certainly not all of it
10:31:50TheSevenemBIOS also wakes up every 10ms to do a thread switch, it isn't using a tickless system either
10:31:55Zagorok
10:32:30TheSevenwhat baffles me is the difference between idling at 48 and 192MHz in rockbox, while there doesn't seem to be much of a difference in emBIOS
10:32:34Zagorsounds like there's room for big improvements then
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10:32:50TheSevenand even if we aren't idling that much, idling at the higher frequency should mean that we're idling way more.
10:33:49TheSevenhaha, if we get that lcd sleep vs. ldo2 vs. usb issue sorted out we might be able to hit 50 hours :)
10:33:57TheSevenbut not when playing audio
10:34:03TheSeven40 hours might be doable though
10:34:10S_a_i_n_tthat's insane.
10:34:55*S_a_i_n_t wonders what he'd be getting if he dropped the 600mAh battery he has in a Nano2G
10:35:10S_a_i_n_tiirc, default == 400mAh
10:35:48TheSevenyes
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10:36:54megatog615hello
10:37:15megatog615i have set up rockbox on my sansa fuse v2
10:37:21megatog615it works great, and i love it
10:37:27Stummifine :)
10:37:28megatog615but i was wondering
10:37:51megatog615i have a car stereo with a usb port
10:38:05megatog615and 'ipod interface' if i guess when an ipod is detected
10:38:24megatog615can rockbox emulate the ipod interface if i use my sansa fuse usb cord?
10:38:51S_a_i_n_tI believe I have two of them, I just have to find them in my piles of electronic crap...if I find them I'll send one in your direction TheSeven. exactly the same dimensions as the Nano2G battery (actually ~2mm shorter ~1mm less wide), same specs except 600mAh
10:39:31gevaertsmegatog615: no
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10:40:29megatog615aww
10:40:35megatog615is such a feature planned?
10:40:37Zagormegatog615: no. but have you tried connecting it? some ice systems support "usb sticks"
10:40:51megatog615yes it reads it as if it was a usb stick
10:40:57megatog615but i have lots of flac music
10:41:13megatog615and the stereo wont play anything but mp3, wma, and aac
10:41:26Zagorok
10:41:27TheSevenS_a_i_n_t: yeah, go for a 60 hours of playback, 64 gigabyte nano2g :)
10:41:49S_a_i_n_tthat'd be awesome ;)
10:42:09S_a_i_n_tYou reckon that a 600mAh battery would give the Nano2G 60hours?
10:42:29Zagormegatog615: there's been some research into emulating an ipod interface but nothing usable
10:42:58S_a_i_n_tboth these batetries are new too, well...new when I bought them. I really should find them, it's worth opening up a Nano to get that kind of runtime in return.
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10:43:31gevaertsmegatog615: first of all it's not clear what "ipod interface" means. It might just be some extension that talks to the ipod database, in which case implementing that still won't give you flac
10:43:47megatog615Zagor: i dont even know if this cable or the fuze itself can do line out, line in, etc etc like an ipod
10:44:37megatog615im assuming an ipod's 'ipod interface' allows the stereo its connected to to control the ipod as well as accept line out from it
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10:45:04gevaertsDoes that ipod interface still use USB?
10:45:08Zagorright. if it's just an usb slot in the car then you're probably stuck without flac
10:45:22megatog615my stereo can apparently do play/pause/next/previous
10:45:32megatog615for ipods
10:45:59megatog615luckily for me it has an aux input
10:46:12megatog615still restricted by battery life though
10:48:15keenerdmegatog615: Sansa players have line in/out as part of that giant connector.
10:48:44Zagorkeenerd: yes, but if the car has a usb slot that doesn't help
10:49:16megatog615the sansa end of the connector looks like it has all the pins
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10:50:06megatog615why cant line out/in be done over usb?
10:50:18Zagormegatog615: I would guess your stereo does the actual file encoding for ipods too.
10:50:20gevaertsBecause USB is not line in/out
10:50:25Zagor*decoding
10:50:47megatog615gevaerts: yes but the sansa end of the cable is rather large
10:51:06gevaertsMost of that is not USB
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10:51:42megatog615im betting that there's a chip that converts it to a data stream much like the interface for usb game pads and other such thing
10:51:50Zagor...and the "ipod interface" is about reading playlists and the song database off the ipod
10:52:02megatog615mm
10:52:04megatog615well
10:52:09megatog615obviously it doesnt work
10:52:15megatog615so my question is answered
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10:52:58Zagormegatog615: we could probably do a combo solution, where you can control the sansa over usb but have to connect aux for audio
10:53:11Zagorotoh the car stereo probably can't mix those modes
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10:54:17megatog615cant believe line in/out cant be done over usb despite the fact that there's many usb headsets, etc
10:54:34Zagormegatog615: it *can* be done. but ipods don't.
10:54:39megatog615ok
10:55:15megatog615i guess the stereo reads the db and playlists and handles ipod control but reads the files off the ipod via the usb interface
10:55:28Zagoryes
10:55:33megatog615decodes them in the stereo instead of the ipod
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10:55:48megatog615well thats a huge bummer
10:55:54Zagorthere's also a bling feature in the protocol to upload a logo to the ipod
10:56:09Zagorso there's a BMW roundel or such on the ipod when connected
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10:56:40gevaertsLine in/out can *not* be done directly over USB. You need support for the USB audio protocol on both sides. It's not a matter of putting audio on one of the wires
10:56:59megatog615too bad rockbox cant present a list of files in mp3 format and transcode on the fly when they're accessed :)
10:57:10gevaertsAnd as I said, it's not at all clear what these car things expect
10:57:12Zagormegatog615: haha, neat idea ;)
10:57:28megatog615sort of like DAAP
10:57:58megatog615doubt the little fuze can transcode in a timely manner to do crossfade etc
10:57:59Zagormegatog615: does the stereo support wav?
10:58:20megatog615Zagor: havent tried wav(i dont use it for my music)
10:58:52megatog615but if it did support it then transcoding would be easier
10:58:52Zagorif it did, transcoding would be a theoretical possibility
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10:59:43Zagorand a lovely obfuscation of the usb layer ;-)
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11:00:25megatog615the stereo is a Kenwood KDC-BT472U
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11:01:59*gevaerts still wants to work on MMC support in the MSC code to be able to present an audio CD view of a playlist
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11:08:58-->"seen Slasheri " received from sideral (~sideral@unaffiliated/sideral)
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11:44:11*Stummi wonders if still somebody is on his rockboy-patch or if he should look for somebody else to bug with this
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12:55:06kreislaufhi, ahm, is this the place for technical questions regartind rockbox?
12:55:42pixelmaanything Rockbox related
12:58:01kreislaufwell then, should you be able to connect the player to your computer, while rockbox in online? i'm asking, because i have to shutdown my fuze V2 to get it connected and that will happen with original firmware.... while in rockbox, i am not able to connect, just power up the battery
12:58:08kreislaufis that normal behaviour?
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13:00:07megatog615kreislauf: same fuze here, i hate the library updating in the OF
13:00:23megatog615takes more than 45 seconds on most occasions
13:00:28pixelmaas far as I know the Fuze v2 doesn't have Rockbox USB yet so you have to use the original firmware for this, so I think it's currently normal. I don't have such a player though
13:00:36megatog615cant wait for stable usb
13:00:43kreislaufah ok
13:00:57kreislaufi can live with it, it's just a little annoying...
13:00:59kreislaufthank you
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13:14:32keenerdpixelma: I don't miss rockbox usb. Means I can charge and listen at the same time without using my hacked up (no data) usb cable.
13:14:56pixelmayou could do so with Rockbox USB too
13:14:57keenerdThough the keyboard/mouse emulation is pretty sweet.
13:15:14keenerdNever say anything in the manual to that effect.
13:15:20keenerd*saw
13:15:58gevaertsYou possibly didn't look in the right place then
13:16:10*keenerd looks again
13:17:25pixelmaparagraph 3.3
13:17:56*pixelma wonders a bit why this is already in the Fuze v2 manual
13:18:12pixelmait's probably not wrong but unnecessary
13:18:23gevaertsThe manual doesn't know about the hack to not reboot for USB
13:19:22keenerdAh. I only read ch 4 onwards :-(
13:20:25pixelmaah true, forgot that this would usually be needed even without Rockbox USB - the normal behaviour would be an automatic reboot to the OF which was just disabled for these devices as it can get you into trouble
13:21:54keenerdHeh, it works. (On my old c250.) Holding select does stuff in the UI though. Guess I was looking for a way to disengage rockbox usb.
13:21:58keenerdpixelma: Thanks.
13:24:18megatog615speaking of the keyboard emulator, is there any way to change the controls on it for my fuse v2?
13:24:57megatog615its a bit awkward to have left/right rotate as left/right and up button/down button as up/down
13:25:12megatog615or was it the other way around
13:25:34megatog615i've avoided playlist creation simply because of this
13:26:15keenerdReally? I thought the mapping was pretty slick. Though playlist and home could be switched to be more in line with the OF.
13:27:20megatog615no no i mean the on screen keyboard when naming playlist files etc
13:28:15keenerdOh. I use Morse instead :-)
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13:39:11JdGordongevaerts: have you heard any reports about rockbox usb (on ipod) causing the pc to not bootup and windows to freeze on boot?
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13:39:40gevaertsThe former, yes (BIOS things), the latter, no
13:40:21JdGordonprobably the same thing, I connected it apparently too early and windows got nowhere... anything I can do to debug?
13:41:06Zagorask Steve for the source?
13:41:13ZagorB->
13:41:58JdGordonactually I have a mate in windows...
13:42:19gevaertsPossibly enable lots of logf()s in usb_storage.c and see what it's doing
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13:43:58wodzI am reading button-mini1g.c and I am wondering if int_btn shouldn't be declared volatile. As far as I remember variables modified by ISRs should be volatile am I right?
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13:48:43JdGordon13 small not-entirely-unrelated bug fixes really should be in 3 sperate commits right?
13:48:52JdGordon1fs#11721, 11722, 11723
13:51:18gevaertsProbably
13:51:25gevaertsDo we have his real name?
13:53:54JdGordon1yeah
13:54:09JdGordon1arg, tabs instead of spaces
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13:55:23CIA-7New commit by 03teru (r28607): rockpaint: change the way to handle tools to improve readability. ...
13:57:53CIA-7r28607 build result: All green
13:58:18JdGordon1crap... who knows playback.c :(
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14:15:54Stummiteru, are you still on the rockboy-patch or shall i look for someone else to bug with this? ;)
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14:17:42CIA-7New commit by 03jdgordon (r28608): Accept FS #11722 by Michael Hohmuth ...
14:18:49teruStummi: no i'm not. i'm sorry.
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14:19:33CIA-7r28608 build result: All green
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14:21:43Stummiteru, ok, no problem. Thanks anywhere, you had helped me a lot on my two tasks :)
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15:02:26S_a_i_n_tBuschel: (logs) build result - nano2g bootloader w/ FS #8668 http://pastebin.com/YVdDLwQi
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15:16:18*S_a_i_n_t wonders if we could pass speex encoded voice clips through the iPod piezo...
15:16:40S_a_i_n_tthat'd be kinda cool for the non-sighted
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15:18:18*Strife89TX imagines it would sound ... interesting.
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15:19:32*S_a_i_n_t has heard voice outputted through a piezo before, it's definitely possible
15:20:01S_a_i_n_tand...sure, it doesn't sound *amazing*, but it's quite audible
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15:39:33Stummia developer here who has some free time? I am looking for somebody to review my rockboy-patches and apply them to the svn-version
15:39:55*S_a_i_n_t gets a weird bootloader error "No partition found insert USB and fix it"
15:40:12Stummihttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/11757
15:40:14S_a_i_n_tStummi: Them being on the tracker is enough
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15:40:36StummiS_a_i_n_t, don't seems so
15:40:44S_a_i_n_tI'm sure developers have seen it the last 3 or 4 times you've mentioned it ;)
15:42:04Stummisomebody said i have to bug this chan with this :p
15:42:33Stummiif i want this to get worked
15:42:40S_a_i_n_tyes, but "bug" didn't really mean "spam the channel 3, 4, 5 times a day" ;)
15:43:34Stummihm, ok *g*
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18:08:32kugelthe froyo update for my legend fixed the htc bug
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19:11:13bluebrotherAlexP: yes, the links in Rockbox Utility are links and are supposed to work. However, since that invokes the default system browser this might not work in all situations (but I'm pretty sure it works on Windows and OS X)
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19:18:26BuschelS_a_i_n_t: somehow a change in arm/ipod/button_target.h is missing. try this -> http://pastie.org/1303197
19:18:39BuschelS_a_i_n_t: the above patch compiles for ipod nano 2g here
19:18:45Buschelahem, nano 1g
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19:35:29saratogaBuschel: I got libmad working with the new filter coefficient ordering
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19:35:49 Join Chronon [0] (~quassel@c-67-171-217-43.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
19:36:04ChrononDid we lose the search link and entry box for WikiNames in the recent upgrade of Foswiki?
19:36:30saratogastarted converting it to 16 bit precision last night, but got hung up in the mess of macro's for fixed point in libmad and went to bed
19:37:00saratogai'll also try and get some armv4 ASM for you to try on your nano2g soonish :)
19:37:13saratoga(using 32 bit coefficients of course)
19:37:27ChrononI'll leave a note on the WikiIssues page about it.
19:37:28bertrikChronon, I think so
19:38:22Buschelsaratoga: I saw that you've updated your patch. I will be happy to test any patch from you −− will of course need to wait until the runtime test is finished. this might still take a while :o)
19:38:36saratogathe current version is probably still slower anyway
19:38:54saratogai think on armv4 this version won't be much better then what we have now
19:39:07saratogathe main speed up will just be us getting around to properly scheduling for arm9
19:39:40saratogasince i don't think theres any advantage to doing load pair wise sequential verses loading all the odd indecies on arm9
19:40:27saratogaso the savings will just be one cycle per load by avoind the ldr -> mul interlock in the current code
19:40:36AlexPbluebrother: Yeah, domonoky said - they don't work however for me (KDE). Not a big issue, it just confused me a bit :)
19:40:54saratogathough i guess if 16 bit precision is good enough, there might be some savings by letting the multiplication early terminate on armv4
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19:42:15Buschelwe will see :)
19:43:21 Quit einhirn (Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org)
19:44:01ChrononHmph. I'm getting rejected by a validation screen that doesn't contain any controls for actually validating.
19:46:38*Buschel nano 2g is heading towards 24h runtime (+2h against latest test)
19:51:05ChrononHmm... The page source suggests it might be that my browser (firefox) is blocking cookies. I looked in preferences and don't see any setting for cookie policy there.
19:51:24ChrononBRB
20:00
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20:13:33ChrononWell, I have double checked that both cookies and javascript are enabled. I still get a blank verification page, so I can't edit WikiIssues (or other pages in the wiki apparently)
20:14:15Buschelworks for me here (Firefox 3.6.12)
20:14:43Chrononstrange. I am using the same version
20:15:38Chrononoops. apparently setting custom history settings didn't take. It might be my fault about the editing.
20:15:43BuschelI need to type wiki name and password two time though. 1st time in the well known popup, 2nd time on a wiki page. afterwards I can edit pages
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20:24:05ChrononBuschel, it seems like a problem with my browser. I just edited a different wiki page with rekonq with no problem. I guess I'll go try to find out what's wrong with my firefox.
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20:30:30Jaykayhi, i think FS #5192 and FS #5448 can be closed.... first has a 3-years-old patch which didn't even work when it was created, second one has a 4 year old patch and mainly adds signal strength for the tea5767, which is in svn now
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20:53:01pixelmaChronon: I see the same as Buschel - needed to log in twice but it works. Firefox 3.6.12 here too
20:55:50Chrononpixelma: Yeah. I'm going to search for the problem. I can edit and save changes using the rekonq browser. I am beginning to suspect that my firefox user profile has a problem since I am having problems with setting custom settings (the only way I get access to cookie-related settings).
20:58:24ChrononI'm going to delete cookies.sqlite and see if that fixes it.
20:59:12Chronon(Anyway this is off-topic here now. The only rockbox issue is the lack of search link and entry box for WikiNames.)
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21:53:52AlexPbertrik: Could %tr be made to be used in a conditional pretty please? I'd like to use a nice image for it :)
21:54:05AlexP(or would you prefer I prod JdGordon?) :)
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22:06:42AlexPStummi: Bugging people is fine :)
22:06:52AlexP(within reason) :)
22:10:28wodzanyone know how exactly look the waveform from ipod clickwheel used in mini 1G?
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22:47:38bertrikAlexP, actually i know very little about tags, any inconvenience is not intentional
22:48:00AlexPbertrik: No inconvenience at all, sorry if it came across like that
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22:55:03eWillAre they any RB-ported players with an AM radio inside?
22:55:21ChrononAM radio antennae have to be very large −− so no.
22:56:20gevaertsYou could attach some simple electronics to line-in I guess :)
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22:56:34eWillanyone know the cheapest player with a line-in?
22:56:45eWillthat is RB-ported
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22:58:25evilnick_BThe H1x0 irivers have line-in, but as most of the RB-able players are only available second hand it depends on what you can find in your area
22:58:41*evilnick_B is not saying that the H1x0s are necessarily the cheapest
22:58:50eWillthank you
23:00
23:00:28ChrononThe big advantage of the H1x0 is that it has a 3.5mm input jack for access to line-in (rather than a proprietary dock).
23:00:45Chronon(H3x0 has this too)
23:03:08evilnick_BH1x0 has the advantage of optical (over the H3x0) in case that is important
23:03:49*gevaerts would just buy a cheap AM radio
23:05:13ChrononI would like to clarify that there are some small antenna designs for AM. I found a media player with AM here: http://www.engadget.com/2008/11/11/c-crane-witness-am-fm-dap-will-make-you-wish-wolfman-jack-was/
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23:08:36saratogai bet AM reception isn't that great without a real antenna
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23:11:31*Buschel 's nano 2g just stopped playing after >24h of playback
23:11:43Buschelthat's amazing :o)
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23:14:44eWillc crane is supposed to be good
23:14:50eWilli thought
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