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#rockbox log for 2011-05-10

00:00:28 Join lovasoa [0] (~lovasoa@2a01:e35:8a2e:8080:224:36ff:fee2:7c8f)
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00:41:31pamaury\o/ the fuze+ touch pad uses the synaptics RMI protocol; now I know how to talk to it
00:43:11jhMikeSwhisper sweet nothings to it
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00:52:09 Join Scromple [0] (~Simon@115-64-195-104.tpgi.com.au)
00:54:37pamaurythe fuze+ officially has a 2-D TouchPad sensor
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01:16:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:16:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:18:08 Part ibhan
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03:33:59[Saint]themes on the themesite are licensed as....?
03:35:58JdGordonCC-BY-SA no?
03:36:14[Saint]Right, yep..just checking.
03:40:21[Saint]Just replying to "Grooveshark theme guy" who decided to include the grooveshark logo in his theme directly.
03:40:54JdGordonyeah, saw the thread
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04:00
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04:10:03[Saint]kugel: I found a bug in RaaA
04:10:46[Saint]the HW "back" buttom exits rockbox after entering the "System" menu instead of going back one place to the Main menu.
04:11:09[Saint]I assume this is unintentional/undesireable...as it appears to be the only screen that does this.
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06:48:09 Join Peddy [0] (~apc@unaffiliated/peddy)
06:48:22Peddyis there a patch to enable rockbox USB boot on amsv2?
06:54:03JdGordoncheck the tracker
06:59:35PeddyJdGordon, I have - I can't find any mention of enabling boot-on-USB-plug. Any ideas?
07:00
07:01:51JdGordonchekc the bootloader source code
07:01:56JdGordonit is probably #ifdef-ed out
07:04:16Peddyshould I just remove the # from "#ifdef USE_ROCKBOX_USB"?
07:09:38JoshuaChangeh...
07:10:13 Join Judas_PhD [0] (~kevin@misterfluffy.dsl.xmission.com)
07:15:59JdGordonPeddy: no, #define USE_ROCKBOX_USB at the top of the file
07:16:04JdGordonor maybe its an option in configure
07:16:13*JdGordon isnt sure the correct way to enable it
07:16:33***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
07:19:19PeddyJdGordon, heh, I'll give that a shot... which file are you referring to?
07:19:40JdGordonthe bootloader
07:20:25Peddythere are many files in bootloader/. I looked in the sansa_as3525.c file, but there are no #define statements.
07:20:26jhMikeSthere's another define that should be removed
07:22:02jhMikeSit's USB_HANDLED_BY_OF (does that do anything? lol)
07:23:21PeddyjhMikeS, which source file is this in?
07:23:56jhMikeS /firmware/export/config/<playername>.h
07:26:56Peddyhm, it seems those options are all correct. I already have USB handled by rockbox, but I want the player to boot rb rather than OF when USB is plugged in (when the player is turned off).
07:28:13JdGordonjhMikeS: I could see a future use of a "metadata updated" event if you wanted to use that to tell the wps the AA is ready
07:28:37JdGordonif you wanted a more generic event than one only for aa loaded
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07:34:10jhMikeSI wanted to just do "track ready" which means metadata, aa, cuesheet and audio is loaded. track loading is split between mp3entry and the rest. if splitting it doesn't have whatever benefits it used to now, then no new event would be needed since it would be done in one shot.
07:34:42jhMikeSthe split also makes it all alot more complicated
07:35:49JdGordonisnt there always going to be the possibility of AA not being on the buffer when the track starts?
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07:46:38jhMikeSsure, allocate a space for it off the buffer and copy it
07:46:43 Join LinusN [0] (~linus@giant.haxx.se)
07:49:29JdGordonno, i mean, isnt the issue that the wps needs to be told when the AA is avilable?
07:49:30 Join Buschel [0] (~chatzilla@p54B679D3.dip.t-dialin.net)
07:50:01JdGordonwhich is always likely going to be a problem so an event is going to be needed anywa
07:50:55 Join kerobaros [0] (~kerobaros@75-132-19-83.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com)
07:51:35jhMikeSit appears to be the case sometimes unless something pushes the notification in sync with the audio thred
07:53:13kerobarosis there a certain person in charge of developing the Fuze Plus port? I'd like to help test, if needed.
07:58:05JdGordonkerobaros: thats not how we do development here... if you want to help out join the forum thread and hang out here, get your hands dirty :)
07:59:02kerobarosdeal. anything special i need to keep in mind if i'm building the toolchain on Arch 32-bit?
07:59:07kerobarosor Arch 64-bit, for that matter
07:59:48JdGordonnope, sudo tools/rockboxdev.sh
08:00
08:00:13kerobarosrighteous.
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08:11:29smkBuschel : are there any more changes required in libfaad , regarding malloc?. it's mostly complete right?
08:12:33Buschelsmk: I am just adding some more error handling, if malloc fails
08:12:33jhMikeSI thought malloc could just have a setjmp trap like in vorbis
08:12:45 Part LinusN
08:13:03smkok..so i will move on to other tasks then.
08:13:10bluebroth3r[Saint]: it doesn't do that for me. Too bad, I would have liked having a secret "shutdown button" ;-)
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08:15:32[Saint]bluebroth3r: How recent is your build? You can build your own .apk right? If it's not, would you mind testing it on svn head for me if/when you can?
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08:16:57bluebroth3r[Saint]: it's HEAD from yesterday evening (i.e. like 10 - 12h ago)
08:18:21[Saint]Hmmmm....interesting.
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08:19:14[Saint]Yeah, for me if I enter the "System" (Main menu) top level, I can't back out of it with the HW back button.
08:19:24bluebroth3rso to make sure I got it correctly: change to System menu, then press back and it quits?
08:19:40[Saint]It's just that *one* place that does it, other than the main menu itself obviously.
08:19:56[Saint]yes, that's the correct "recipe"
08:20:24 Quit soap (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
08:20:51[Saint]Thanks for testing btw, guess it's something I need to look at, but I have no idea how any of my (trivial) patches are touching anything related to this. :-S
08:20:52 Join soap [0] (~soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
08:20:57[Saint]"weird shit" TM
08:21:53kerobarosi was going to suggest 'dark magic', but that would probably apply too
08:26:00mystica555yes
08:26:09mystica555always use dark magic
08:26:12mystica555never normal
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09:16:03sideralFS #12101 (Option for date format) seems to be miscategorized as "Database". Would it be "User interface", "Settings", or rather "Themes"?
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09:16:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:16:58JdGordonui or settings
09:17:35sideralThat narrows it down quite a bit ;)
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09:24:52 Join petur [0] (5bdc888b@rockbox/developer/petur)
09:26:35JoshuaChangseems the test_codec's option has a bug: the "Speed test with DSP" option always run the "Speed test folder with DSP" function
09:27:06maraz_this gives me an idea...
09:27:24maraz_wonder if there's a Rockbox target with enough juice to run a convolver dsp? :)
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09:29:01JoshuaChangconvolver seems impossible even on a gigabeats
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09:56:20 Join Drise [0] (~Drise@76.73.173.3)
09:57:00DriseHey guys, I know I'm always coming in with random stuff, but! I think you should accept bitcoins as a donation method.
09:57:30DriseCurrently they are worth 4$ USD, and rising.
09:57:45DriseIt would be a nice way to get donations and have instant investment.
10:00
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10:32:24DriseSaint! hey man
10:33:52DriseS_a_i_n_t, if you have any power over here at RB, I would like to propose rockbox to accept bitcoins as donations
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11:16:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:23:10kugelpS_a_i_n_t: it doesn't do that here. but it it did month ago until I fixed it
11:24:50kugelpdid you try my build yet?
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12:26:01CIA-81New commit by 03sideral (r29851): tagnavi.config: Add a logical-OR operator ("|") for tagnavi conditionals. ...
12:30:53CIA-81r29851 build result: All green
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14:58:21sideralamiconn: FS #12107 - Remove track-number generation heuristic from database
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16:35:32Slasherisideral: another way would be to use the stored flag FLAG_TRKNUMGEN when displaying results in tagtree.c and disable track number for files when that flag is present
16:37:11sideralSlasheri: hmm, but of what other use would the generated track number be if it's not used in tagtree.c? I didn't find any other use of the data
16:38:18sideral(at first I thought it was used for scrobbling, but that's apparently not true)
16:38:23Slasherisideral: i meant that it could be made user configurable by an option or via tagnavi.config whether to display or hide generated track numbers
16:39:13sideralSlasheri: that's right. There even could be a tagnavi conditional for it.
16:39:17Slashericurrently that flag is not used anywhere, but it should be possible quite easily create an option
16:39:28Slasheriindeed
16:40:22sideralBut if we retain the feature, I think it should read the track number from the beginning of the file name, not from its end. Or is there any specific reason why you implemented scanning from the end?
16:42:12Slasherii think the reason was that some of my badly named tracks container disc number at the beginning and the track number was the least one. But indeed, it's quite impossible to make any foolproof assumptions
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16:43:49sideralI was thinking about using filename sort by default, which would take care of the sorting issue without resorting to track-number guessing, but making that the default would be confusing as well I guess
16:44:23sideralAlso, filename sort sounds somewhat expensive
16:44:51sideralBut it should be doable today with custom %format and %strip clauses
16:45:02Slasherihmm.. that could create quite some confusion. Then it would be hard to play tracks in disc order?
16:45:45sideralDon't think so, if we'd include the full pathname
16:46:27sideralBoth "Disc 1/01. Track 1.mp3" and "01.01. Track1.mp3" would sort nicely
16:47:06Slasherifilename sort could work.. but it would hog the whole memory available for sorting and displaying results much more easily i think
16:47:49sideralright, it's kinda nightmarish... I considered using an order-preserving hash, but eventually decided that it's not worth the effort
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16:49:04sideralBTW, have you seen that I've added logical-OR for tagnavi? I'm proud as hell :)
16:49:42Slasherisideral: yes, i just found that :) looks pretty good
16:51:19Slasherithe lack of parentheses was the reason why i never even thought doing anything but ANDing :)
16:52:48sideralI think that my solution (& trumps |) is quite workable. In my personal use of it, I could actually make use of a parenthesis, but it's just as fine to just repeat the conjunction
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16:54:27DriseHey guys, I know I'm always coming in with random stuff, but! I think you should accept bitcoins as a donation method.
16:54:28DriseS_a_i_n_t, if you have any power over here at RB, I would like to propose rockbox to accept bitcoins as donations
16:54:33DriseCurrently they are worth 4$ USD, and rising.
16:54:47DriseDisregard that comment to saint... heh... my bad
16:54:54sideralSlasheri: BTW, Thanks for your comments regarding resurrection and dynamic DB extension.
16:54:56DriseIt would be a nice way to get donations and have instant investment.
16:55:06Torneis there some way we can use them to pay for physical goods? :)
16:55:12DriseNo fees, no paypal.
16:55:16Slasherisideral: no problem :)
16:55:26DriseYes torne, I buy amazon cards all the time.
16:55:39TorneThat's not normally the kind of thing the rockbox fund gets used for.
16:55:51DriseYou can also buy services, such as website design
16:56:09sideralSlasheri: Re DB extension: I thought that maybe there's a way to do incremental commits and DB loads, given that the existing DB is pre-sorted. Or is anything like that already in place?
16:56:32TorneRight, but currently we tend to spend the fund on things around devcon, or occasionally on buying neat things like that usb protocol analyser
16:56:32Drisecheck out http://www.bitcoin.org/smf/index.php?board=5.0
16:56:44TorneIt seems unlikely that we can actually buy any of those things with bitcoins
16:56:51Slasherisideral: the dynamic DB extension is a really interesting idea. But doing it efficiently would need larger structural changes to the DB (like adding a binary index used for sorting)
16:56:52DriseAnd sometimes you can get really good deals.
16:57:09Torneso, we'd end up converting them into regular money via paypal or similar anyway, and that's less efficient..
16:57:12DriseItr also can be converted to a currency of you choice, just find someone to trade for it
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16:58:11sideralSlasheri: I think that given the indices are sorted in memory, finding the place to insert could be a simple binary search without another index
16:58:11DriseWell, its also a nice investment method, as prices have been rising, yesterday I saw it go from 3.8$ to 4.75$
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16:58:43Slasherisideral: basically the master index (tagcache_idx.tcd) is always appended, while other tables are re-built during commit. It may be possible to do partial re-built on those other tables, but i can't say for sure
16:58:58DriseAnd it was an idea, also they asked us to ask organizations to try to acept them.
16:59:13Drise*accept
17:00
17:00:11sideralSlasheri: The disk non-master indices could be left to be committed at next commit time (possibly reboot). We'd just have to log the updates much like we do today
17:00:40DriseAnd Torne, if you so wish, I could trade them for you to paypal. I'm always on there trading anyway.
17:01:07DriseI know that sounds kinda sketchy, but I do have a reputation there that I can be trusted.
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17:01:11Tornei'm not suggesting it's a bad idea, just pointing out that there's not a lot of reason for us to encourage it
17:01:22Slasherisideral: ah, indeed :) that sounds much more efficient, simpler and doable now :)
17:01:34DriseWould it hurt to put Donate via bitcoins! ?
17:01:50Tornesince it's likely that the end result of someone sending us what they think is the bitcoin equivalent of $5 will end being worth a lot less to us than if they sent us $5
17:02:02DriseI would donate via bitcoins, but not persay paypal.
17:02:19Tornewell feel free to :)
17:02:25sideralSlasheri: of course, that only works with Load-DB-to-RAM
17:03:19scorcheDrise: there isnt really a bad side and it wouldnt hurt - i mean donations are donations, however for our purposes (buying devices, devcon expenses, and giving money to developers for other similar) i dont see it as a preferable option to paypal
17:03:21DriseWell as I said its an investment, as that 5$ donation may be worth 5.5$ tomorrow.
17:03:53scorcheand if we are needing to paypal money to convert them to "real money" anyway, then i really dont see the point
17:04:04Drisescorche, I do see you points, and its easily tradeable for USD
17:04:33TorneSure, but the thing there is from our point of view it is much more convenient if the person who wants to donate trades them for USD first ;)
17:04:42DriseYou mostly do direct interactions with traders, and you say "I was to sell 5 BTC at 4.5 USD via paypal"
17:04:47DriseAnd it generally works well.
17:05:05scorcherockbox isnt in the investment business - the donations are simply there for people who feel that they got something from rockbox to give back in a monetary way
17:05:22scorchethe simpler this process is to use these donations, the better
17:05:34DriseI know its not an investment business but you can let them do a little growing for you.
17:05:49Torneinvestments may go down as well as up :)
17:05:59DriseBut surely I understand.
17:06:17DriseGood point, but most of us see for the forseeable future of it rising.
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17:06:55DriseI myself have invested nearly 200$ in them, and I have more on the way, as I got hired and paid via btc.
17:07:14DriseIt was a proposeale.
17:07:19Drise*proposal.
17:07:56scorcheDrise: thanks for the idea, but honestly, i dont see us getting into the bitcoin market until there is a nice, easy button to convert to "real money"
17:08:31Torneok, it comes down to: we are a pretty small project and we deal with pretty small amounts of money on the whole, and virtually everything we'd spend it on would need us to trade it for legal tender first.
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17:09:29DriseTorne, I understand, and as I said previously, I would be willing to trade them for you.
17:09:54DriseBut that is just a s risky.
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17:10:13Torneit's not really about risk, it's about effort
17:10:13DriseBut I have loved rockbox for ages,and would be willing to help out.
17:10:26scorcheand much much much more complicated than just accepting via paypal ;)_
17:10:42Torneparticipating in an alternate economy is only really worthwhile if you can actually trade for some reasonable proportion of your needs through it
17:11:18DriseI do know of one gentlemen who is taking a roadtrip only on bitcoins, trading them along the way for gas or food. But I understand.
17:11:33DriseHe is in the process of promoting them.
17:12:33DriseI do appreciate the discussion, and not "Drise gtfo". Wonderful to speak with you guys as always.
17:13:33DriseAlso, I have a question, any updates on the AMSv2 usb code?
17:15:08pamauryDrise: I'm rewriting some code but it's not finished and it's still not sure that it will bring any improvement
17:15:29DriseAlright.
17:16:27DriseThank you gentlemen, and I shall be off.
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17:18:24sideralSlasheri: Can you give me an elevator-pitch overview of how chunked browsing works in the DB? When are the chunks generated / sorted / loaded?
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17:30:21saratogafrom what i can tell bitcoins are somewhere between a scam and a bad idea
17:30:23saratogahttp://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2011/04/the-economics-of-bitcoin.html
17:30:29saratogaso probably not a great idea
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17:33:11DriseNot a scam, no
17:33:52DriseThey are a new way to send money to someone without 3rd parties.
17:34:13DriseBut I'm not going to push it anymore. I accepted defeat ;)
17:34:16Tornea highly *variable* amount of money
17:35:00Tornethe guy makes a good point: what people actually want is an anonymous transaction system
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17:37:36DriseI just propose that you put an adress up anyway Torne. You would get atleast two donators, as I mentioned rockbox in #bitcoins-otc, and one gentlemen was Rockbox? I love rockbox! It let me tell apple to kiss my ass!
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17:44:00DriseHey guys I was given a question, primary> Drise: What platform is best for rockbox?
17:44:14DriseI assume which is the most feature rich/stable
17:45:43krazykitdepends on if you want a flash device or a hard drive device, really
17:46:31DriseEither way, the best of them all.
17:46:53JoshuaChangi'll vote for gigabeat s
17:47:33krazykithardly. it may be the most powerful, but it has plenty of problems, not the least of which is the device deciding to format the hard drive
17:47:38gevaertsJoshuaChang: that one is known for causing headaches...
17:47:49gevaertsAnd it has rather poor battery life
17:48:05JoshuaChangbut it's cpu was sooo strong...
17:48:05gevaertsThere is no best of them all if you don't have priorities
17:48:29DriseBest flash one then?
17:48:37DriseI'm not sure what he was wondering.
17:48:41krazykiti could say "whatever is the cheapest" if i'm going to be putting it into harm's way
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17:49:15JoshuaChangi couldn't make vgm music with high quality reverb effect with my cowon d2
17:50:03gevaertsIf you want me to point to a specific device, I'd say the Archos Player is best, because it can get the biggest storage, and it has a screen with few enough detail to avoid confusion. Now don't complain that this is misleading advice!
17:50:18JoshuaChangthey eat around 250mhz cpu
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17:54:35DriseHeh gevaerts, it seems #bitcoin-otc agrees with you.
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17:56:33JoshuaChangdrise, are you interested in console game music?
17:56:46DriseHm?
17:56:57DriseI'm not sure what you are going about...
17:57:01JoshuaChanglike spc ,vgm music format
17:57:13DriseYou've gone over my head sir.
17:57:46JoshuaChang......forget it
17:58:45DriseSorry
17:59:03DriseI'll just say Sorry, not really.
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18:00:23JoshuaChangif you don't know the format i said, then a archos player should be enough
18:01:05gevaertsuh, no
18:01:15gevaertsIf you only want mp3, an archos player should be enough
18:01:17DriseI was just asked what platform is best for RB
18:01:31gevaertsThere *are* more formats than mp3 and console game music
18:01:39DriseAnd I didnt know, so I asked the guys who wrote the code
18:02:04JoshuaChangfor me, a powerful cpu is really important
18:03:00JoshuaChangi think all the stable devices in the list are best for rb
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19:05:07pamauryI think I found which are the two types of LCDs of the fuze+: id 9325=ili9325, 7783=st7783, there are pretty close registerwise it seems
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19:22:29CIA-81New commit by 03pamaury (r29852): fuze+: add init/enable/disable lcd sequences for the second lcd kind (only based on disassembly, untested)
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20:21:03CIA-81New commit by 03Buschel (r29853): Proper initialization of static variables in codeclib.
20:25:46CIA-81r29853 build result: All green
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20:42:03dpis anyone working on the iPod Nano 3rd Gen port?
20:43:31pixelmahaven't heard of anyone working activily on such a port
20:43:56dpk
20:47:56*benedikt93 is spending some (tiny bit of, actually) time on doing RE stuff on this, and code from the Classics can partially be used, but time (besides my missing experience) limits me pretty much
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20:51:41pixelmasideral: any plans on updating the manual and or the DataBase wiki page for your "or" change?
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21:04:34CIA-81New commit by 03Buschel (r29854): Implement error handling for libfaad's memory allocation. Do not allocate PS related types dynamically anymore to minimize code changes.
21:04:46kugelpixelma: did you have time to test that build?
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21:07:11pixelmahmm, no yet. Is ther anything specific I should look out for?
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21:12:18semizillahey you guys!
21:12:51semizillaI'm affected by the bug where the Now Playing Screen display is blank a lot of the time (on the clip+),
21:13:27semizillawhere on the website could I find out the latest version of rockbox not affected by this bug?
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21:16:02saratoganever heard of that bug, which build are you seeing it in?
21:16:33semizillahold on, let me look
21:16:40kugelpixelma: no, just if it runs
21:16:46semizilla3.7.1
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21:17:08semizillaand the botio theme
21:17:48saratogaupdate then, we don't support old builds
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21:18:41semizillahow old is 3.7.1, I thought I just updated in the winter
21:18:59saratogait was forked in September i think
21:19:54semizillaalright well I'll update later today and see if it's still there
21:20:01semizillaI had no idea your development was so quick ;)
21:28:11AlexPsaratoga: branched rather than forked :)
21:28:21AlexPsemizilla: releases are every 3 to 4 months
21:28:26AlexP3.8.1 is current
21:28:34AlexPmajor releases that is
21:28:40AlexPpoint releases are as needed
21:28:53semizillawhat does it mean by branched?
21:29:07semizilla3.7.1 was released, and then work contined on the main front?
21:29:15semizilla*continued
21:29:16AlexPsemizilla: Created a separate branch for it in the source code
21:29:28AlexPso that main development can continue in the trunk
21:29:34semizillaok
21:29:52semizillaand that lets you make minor adjustments in the branch as needed too?
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21:30:08gevaertsyes, exactly
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21:30:26AlexPWhen it comes time to release, we branch off the current state of the trunk into a branch, then we can release and put fixes into the branch, while introducing new exciting stuff into the man trunk
21:30:35AlexP*main
21:30:43gevaertsOr new boring stuff, as the case may be :)
21:30:50AlexPnever!
21:31:11sideralpixelma: I have already updated the DataBase wiki page. I don't think the manual covers the tagnavi format in any detail, does it?
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21:37:04pixelmasideral: oh ok. I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't, haven't checked sorry
21:38:31sideralpixelma: Me neither, so let's assume it's true. :) I'm planning to touch up the wiki page incrementally, perhaps we can use it in the manual eventually.
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21:43:54wodzI need advice how to check if the cpu goes really into sleep mode in core_sleep()
21:44:02wodzany ideas?
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22:20:08CIA-81New commit by 03alle (r29855): Manual: typeset the commas using the normal font, not as 'fname'
22:24:27CIA-81r29855 build result: All green
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23:16:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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23:38:32CIA-81New commit by 03Buschel (r29856): Correct notation of a few supported audio formats in the manual.
23:41:35 Quit semizilla (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86.1 [Firefox 3.6.13/20101203075014])
23:42:31CIA-81r29856 build result: All green
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23:51:16 Quit ender` (Quit: Kiss a pair of boobs and the movie's rated R. Chop them off and it's PG-13.-- Jack Nicholson)

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