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#rockbox log for 2011-06-02

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01:23:12DBUGEnqueued KICK [Saint]
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02:24:54clmoeresults are in for attaching two cheap chinese 3600mah cells to my clipp!
02:25:15clmoehttps://spreadsheets.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AnnpTCiERQHLdGZDUXZuUVZYeTByNzNwc1RXWUNMNXc&hl=en_US&authkey=CIDbnIoL
02:26:00clmoeroughly 68 hours runtime, which would lead me to believe the batteries total 1250mah togeather
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02:58:51JdGordon[Saint]: ok, well i commited the %cs changes... I'm hoping to add a value for every top level menu item, let me know if you think any other screens would be useful
03:00
03:07:24[Saint]that part I don't quite get...but I'll look at it when I can (real life stuff)
03:07:42[Saint]I had a thought though...I'm not sure if I can think of 15 screens that use the .sbs ;)
03:07:58[Saint](this is only useful in .sbs enabled screens...right?)
03:08:26[Saint]Or is this going on the assumption that all these screens will *one day*, use the .sbs?
03:09:23JdGordonmaybe
03:10:34JdGordonwell, it lets you change the title bar in your cabbie theme more accurately
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05:05:33CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
05:05:33*[Saint] wonders if all the new %cs'able screens have strings in english.lang
05:06:01[Saint]I *really* want to drop the shitty bitmap system I'm using for the titlebar and use actual translation where possible.
05:06:56[Saint]The reason I hadn't done this is twofold...1: Bitmap fonts look like ass (this is now negated), 2: I didn't have all the %cs's I wanted...now it seems I do.
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05:28:55[Saint]JdGordon: Is CustomWPS and/or the manual updated regarding %cs changes?
05:29:03JdGordonboth
05:29:14[Saint](I'd prefer to not go digging to work out the ordering ;))
05:29:19*JdGordon went a bit crazy last night!
05:29:20[Saint]Oh! goodie, thanks.
05:29:33JdGordonI *even* tested it :)
05:30:07*[Saint] gasps, clutches his chest, and falls down in a state of shock.
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05:36:20[Saint]JdGordon: Since I'm on the edit page now, hovering over applying it...is the "correct" format to list it as 0~11 or 1~12?
05:37:06JdGordon1-12
05:37:44JdGordonthere is a 0 error case but that shouldnt ever be seen and %?cs<a> will show a when in the menu case, not the error case
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05:50:29[Saint]Ok...who do I need to talk to/bag/bag to add a few lang strings in to complete the usability of %cs (with the mind that my theme will, one day, become the default or the base of it)?
05:50:40[Saint]I need *quite* a few to be added.
05:51:07JdGordonwell this is an entirely different thing
05:51:19JdGordonand brings us back to the lang-in-skin support question
05:51:44[Saint]IIUC, it's allowable if the theme is the default.
05:51:58[Saint]but adding arbitrary strings for random themes is a no-no.
05:52:09JdGordonI'm not sure i agree with that
05:52:22JdGordonespecially when these strings wont be voiced
05:52:31[Saint]I need at least "Fastforward" and "rewind" to make this "work" with translation.
05:52:34*JdGordon suddnely remembers the talking skin support patch
05:52:42JdGordon?
05:54:04[Saint]I could, also, drop the part that switches the titlebar when playback stste changes...but I kinda like that feature.
05:54:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:56:23[Saint]Ideally, I'd like to drop the bitmaps I'm using for the titlebar heading with plain text, and if I do that...I'd like it to be translatable.
05:57:06[Saint]currently I could only offer translation for approximately half of the possible %cs states
05:57:49JdGordonthe ideal way is transparent skin translation support
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05:58:20[Saint]I guess.
05:58:44JdGordonusing a tag would be simpler from my POV but not as nice for users
05:59:05[Saint]I guess I'll just translate what I can, and when/if this theme makes it into svn...*than* I'll push for adding the non-translated strings.
05:59:20[Saint]*then*, rather
06:00
06:00:24[Saint]cabbiev2 has strings specifically for it in the lang file...so I assume if my theme takes over I can do the same.
06:00:24JdGordonWhere do you want to put FastForward and Rewind?
06:00:46JdGordonit does, but I still think that is wrong
06:01:06[Saint]ffwd/rew pops up over the titlebar...depending on playback state of course.
06:01:06JdGordonand I have a feeling people with low mem targets will agree with me
06:01:43 Quit JesusChrysler (Quit: JesusChrysler)
06:01:55[Saint]so "main menu"/"whatever" becomes "fastforward"/"rewind" for the duration of fastforwarding/rewinding.
06:02:11JdGordoninteresting
06:02:20[Saint]not essential, but I like it and think it's a nice touch.
06:03:18[Saint]every single time I look at english.lang with regards to adding translation to a theme I'm surprised anew by what isn't in there.
06:04:11[Saint]I do realise that the .lang file is not an infinite resource...but some of the strings that *are* there seem a little odd compared to ones that aren't.
06:04:28[Saint]I'm talking about adding (maximum)...10 new strings?
06:04:52JdGordonask pixelma how hard it is making a voice file for hwcodec....
06:05:15JdGordonit is also a upkeep thing
06:05:26JdGordondeprecating lang strings isnt easy
06:05:50[Saint]No, but wasn't there a .lang maintennwnce schudule decided?
06:06:08JdGordonHAHAHA yeah, "sometime in the future... maybe....
06:06:14[Saint](I was under the impression that depricated strings were to be carved out during a release freeze)
06:06:46[Saint]I do recall that being discussed...no idea how "official" the discussion was.
06:09:39JdGordonregardless... I dont tihnk strings which are only for skins should go in the lang file
06:10:26[Saint]so far...I'd need Fastforward, Rewind, Pitchscreen
06:10:33[Saint]so, a lot less than I thought.
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06:12:36[Saint]I guess there's no harm in me just translating what I can...but there's a part of me that says "do it all, or don't bother"
06:13:18[Saint]I know that's irrational, but I can't explain to a user ahead of time why certain things are translated, and why others aren't.
06:13:29[Saint]it makes it seem like it's unintentional/a bug.
06:14:30[Saint]If/when this theme makes it into svn...I'll be voicing my opinions about skin translation a bit more aggressively :D
06:15:23[Saint]I like all my themes to offer as much LTR/RTL and translation support as I can.
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06:16:05[Saint]skin translation via the .lang files may not be ideal...but presently it's the only way to do it.
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06:49:50[Saint]Glargh!...ok...this is annoying.
06:50:12[Saint]For the .sbs, I need 2 lang strings to make it fully stranslatable.
06:50:30[Saint]but I can get away with only one "Pitch Screen")
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07:02:30 Quit wtachi (Quit: The hand that reaches from the grave to grip your throat is the strong hand you want on the wheel.)
07:06:24[Saint]Hmmmm...turmoil.
07:07:17[Saint]Add ~10 or so more strips to my bitmap titlebar strip, or, translate what I can and have it look weird for everything except english.
07:07:34JdGordonwhy would it look wierd?
07:08:55[Saint]<user_language>,<user_language>,<user_language>,random engligh<user_language>,random english,<user_language>,<user_language>, etc.
07:10:14[Saint]IMO, at least if the whole thing is english...it's easier to accept.
07:10:26JdGordonwhat?!
07:10:49[Saint]I'd find myself asking "why is a, b and c translated and x, y and z not?"
07:12:06[Saint]which, I would actually understand someone asking. As there doesn't seem to be any reasoning or pattern to what is translated ans what isn't.
07:12:25JdGordonbut it isnt going to show half english and half translated on the same screen
07:14:06[Saint]No...and that's not what I'm implying. I'd just find it odd (if I wasn't a native english speaker and relied on translation) to see certain things translated and others not.
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07:14:30JdGordonI think you're making far more out of this than you shold be
07:14:46JdGordonand this is a solvable problem so i really dont see why you are whinging?
07:15:30[Saint]Solvable how? If I put up a patch to add the strings I needed...there's about a 1% chance of it being accepted.
07:16:21[Saint]And I also don't see it as "wrong" or "whinging" to want a fully translatable theme
07:16:47[Saint](especially when that theme is being made for consideration of replacing the default theme)
07:17:46[Saint]If it was just a theme for me, I wouldn't care about translation at all...the fact that I know that non-english speakers may one day use this makes me want to consider that while developing it.
07:19:45JdGordonsolvable in that either the strings get added when it becomes default
07:19:56JdGordonor skin translation support is added (which is my preferred method)
07:20:19JdGordoneither way, assume it will be translated and move on
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07:45:32[Saint]JdGordon: The last entry for %cs...you think "Setting Chooser" is ok for that?
07:46:00[Saint]I'm not sure why, but it looks a little weird to me. But I can't really come up with anything that "looks" any better :/
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07:47:24JdGordSaint: I'm not sure what to call it
07:48:44JdGordIts the screen where u actually set tbe setting value
07:48:51JdGordVery open to a better name
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11:50:14*Torne will be spending a big chunk of time today checking everything is ready for devcon; anything you are waiting to find out please let me know ;)
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12:03:28LantiziaLo, presuming Rockbox doesn't work on iPod Touch devices, is there any way to add Ogg Vorbis support to the iOS that runs on an iPod Touch?
12:04:50AlexPNo idea
12:05:06AlexPI doubt it, but you need to ask elsewhere I'm afraid
12:05:21Lantiziamy other half has moved in (ipod touch user) and were merging music collections - only all my stuff is in vorbis
12:05:43AlexPI understand, but this channel is for Rockbox only I'm afraid :)
12:05:55Lantiziaok I'll try in #iphone thanks
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12:17:09bertrikFS #12065 - "Database RAM cache doesn't work with Chinese-simp" can be closed now, right?
12:17:11bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12065 3Database RAM cache doesn't work with Chinese-simp (bugs, requires)
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12:37:57SpaceghostHello all.
12:38:10SpaceghostI read in freemyipod.org that "2011-01-08 - The Rockbox port for the iPod Classic is slowly getting usable. Most of the blocking issues have been fixed. The first-generation 160GB model still doesn't work, and some people are experiencing slightly garbled display contents. "
12:38:51Spaceghostbut I couldn't find information about it in rockbox.org (I mean, about the support to ipod classic 160gb first generation)
12:39:12AlexPWe don't support it yet
12:39:33AlexPThe port is coming along, but isn't yet considered useable
12:39:52SpaceghostI would like to know about it because I have two ipod classics. One of the 160gb first generation and the other of 120gb. I would like to have the one with more posibilities to run rockbox
12:39:53n1sbertrik: yeah, i think so
12:40:10SpaceghostI don't know if there are differences of quality in the hardware
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12:40:19Spaceghostwhat do you suggest me?
12:40:31n1sI'm more a fan of cloasing tasks and reopening if it turns out not to be fix than let them hang around open for a few weeks and be forgotten
12:40:34Spaceghost(I will sell the other probably)
12:40:55TheSevenSpaceghost: both should work equally well
12:41:13TheSeventhe 120GB one is thinner, while the 160GB one has more storage capacity and batter runtime
12:41:24TheSevenso that's a matter of personal preference
12:41:35Spaceghostah
12:41:45Spaceghostthe battery of 160 1G is bigger?
12:41:59Spaceghostis the battery of 160gb 1G bigger?
12:42:13Spaceghostmore capacity?
12:42:13TheSevenyeah, there was more space for the battery because of the thicker case
12:42:23Spaceghostok
12:42:27TheSeventhe HDD also uses slightly more power, but that doesn't make up for the battery size difference
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12:43:11Spaceghostcan I replace the HDD's of each one? I mean interchage? or are those different to each other?
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12:55:25kugeln1s: I agree
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13:05:24Spaceghost¿?
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14:02:53TheSevenSpaceghost: the 160GB HDD is thicker than the 120GB one
14:02:56TheSevenso that won't work
14:03:31TheSevenfrom a spare parts point of view i'd favor the 120GB one, as you can use basically any ZIF 1.8" HDD in that one
14:04:03TheSeventhe 160GB HDD is a weird part that's only been found in ipods so far, so spare drives are rare
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15:52:41gbl08mahello everyone... I had an idea which is not directly related to Rockbox development but still it has a lot to do with Rockbox and so I'd like to expose the idea here.
15:52:47*bertrik is fixing some issues with the RDA5802 tuner (used in some AMSv2 players)
15:53:38gbl08maI was thinking if there would be a way to convert TTF fonts into the Anti-aliased font format used by Rockbox, by using a website with PHP.
15:54:30gbl08maWould there be any problem in creating a script in which users upload a TTF file they want to convert, the script executes convttf from the shell, and then returns the Rockbox font for download?
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15:55:01gbl08maThis would allow people to easily convert fonts with a GUI even if they don't have the Rockbox source to build convttf.
15:55:28n1ssounds like you could do that easily enough
15:55:40gbl08maIt's something simple to write and i'd start right now if I weren't away form my development PC
15:55:42Torneyou could do it by running convttf as cgi :)
15:55:54Torneif you trust it to be secure against malicious user input
15:55:56gbl08maI have a Linux server I could use for that
15:56:15gbl08maphp's exec() is enough to run convttf I think
15:56:30TorneTo run it dangerously, yes :)
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15:57:42gbl08mathe process would be like the user uploads a font, the font is temporarily stored in the server while phpexec (or cgi) calls convttf and it returns a Rockbox font, then the resulting RB font would be stored temporarily on the server while the user downloads it.
15:58:10Torneright. this is fairly unsafe, though
15:58:18gbl08maobviously...
15:59:51n1syeah, if you can exploit convttf and the script lets you upload an arbitrary file to the server...
16:00
16:00:12gbl08maIf there was conf
16:00:24Tornethe same is probably true of checkwps on the theme site, though :)
16:00:25gbl08maoops... i didn't want to press enter
16:01:14gbl08maand has anyone exploited the wps check on the theme site?
16:01:28n1swe don't know :)
16:01:32Torneindeed :)
16:01:42Tornewhether someone has or not is not a good basis to decide whether this is a good idea, also..
16:01:56gbl08mawell, at least the server's still up and running
16:02:02gbl08mai got to go
16:02:07gbl08masee you
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16:06:33likfjdlskjsI have a clip v1 that I have been able to play boomshine on, and now wont work. I have been searching on google and the forums, and wonder if anyone might know why it stopped working for me (It stopped working while I was using the player, I did not do any updating)
16:08:36[Saint]Since hardware failure would have to be all types of messed up and crazy to affect one plugin specifically, I'd suggest checking the device for filesystem corruption.
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16:13:08likfjdlskjsI just went and got the fresh copy of the latest stable for the clip1, and it doesn't have the lua.rock plugin under viewers, which I assume Boomshine.lua would need to work. I wonder how boomshine could have possibly worked without that file
16:14:48Tornelikfjdlskjs: the clip's plugin buffer is too small for lua, iirc
16:15:43AlexPStrange that boomshine used to work though
16:16:16likfjdlskjsThat's what it seems like, everyone who has previously asked about it has come to the same conclusion. Yet, I know I was playing it 2 days ago, and then it started saying to me when I tried to run it, "Can't open file /.rockbox/viewers/lua.rock"
16:16:22likfjdlskjsYes, exactly.
16:17:55Tornelua's memory requirement has been the same for a long time
16:18:01[Saint]I seem to remember a recent boomshine related commit by funman
16:18:06Tornethe plugin is not even compiled on targets that are too small
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16:18:12Tornethis cannot be anything to do with boomshine
16:18:36[Saint]"don't build LUA.rock if LUA isn't built" (or something along those lines)
16:18:49likfjdlskjsYeah, in the fresh stable copy that I just pulled from rockbox.org, the lua plugin does not exist.
16:19:28likfjdlskjsTrying to see if perhaps something weird happened and the one I got recently had lua on it? brb
16:20:34AlexPfunman did +/* Lua needs at least 160 KB to work in */
16:20:34AlexP+#if PLUGIN_BUFFER_SIZE >= 0x80000
16:20:34AlexP boomshine.lua
16:20:34DBUGEnqueued KICK AlexP
16:20:34AlexP+#endif
16:20:48AlexPin r29895
16:21:17AlexPWhich should have just applied the same limits to building boomshine to those for building lua if I understand the commit message properly
16:22:23Tornelua has had that restriction a long time
16:22:33Torneyou should neve rhave had a lua plugin on the clip in the first place
16:23:30AlexPyes, exactly
16:23:48Torneit was removed over a year ago because its overlay loader was broken :)
16:24:05n1sso the correct solution to the problem is "delete boomshine.lua" :)
16:24:10Torneyup
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16:24:38Torneclip doesn't have enough RAM. if it worked before then you had a very old build of rockbox where lua was smaller
16:25:08Tornethere is also no way it could've stopped working spontaneously, you must have reinstalled/updated/something. :)
16:25:11likfjdlskjsI dl'd 3.8.1 on Monday for the first time onto this clip
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16:25:30likfjdlskjsYeah, that spontaneously stopping working thing is what really got me
16:26:07Torne3.8.1 doesn't contian lua on the clipv1
16:26:15Torneso i am afraid you must be mistaken :)
16:26:29Torneyou must've had something else on there before.
16:27:22likfjdlskjsYa, ima try to duplicate this working, if I have anything new happen, I'll report. THank you for your time, all!
16:27:44TorneYou will not be able to get it to work
16:27:55Torneunless you downgrade to a build that is over a year old
16:28:00TorneThere's no bug or issue here at all
16:28:14TorneYou must've had a very old build on there which still had lua
16:29:46likfjdlskjsI just wiped my .rockbox on player, replacing it with a fresh 3.8.1 copy and yes, I did not work. I have no idea what or why it worked before, haha.
16:29:52likfjdlskjsit*
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16:31:04Torneit worked before because clipv1 used to have a larger plugin buffer
16:31:29Tornebut it was reduced a year ago because it was very wasteful :)
16:32:13Torneso yes. it worked before because there was more memory. you upgraded, and now it doesn't. there is no mystery ;)
16:34:35Torneother plugins that need a lot of memory have overlay loaders so they can be loaded into the audio buffer instead of the plugin buffer, but lua's was broken iirc so it was just disabled.
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16:46:08bertrikthe RDA5802 has a couple of undocumented registers it seems ... :(
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16:53:46*[Saint] has a beautiful .sbs titlebar working in his current theme with svn head
16:56:10[Saint]anyone with a 480X800 target willing to verify that an .apk installs before I blindly link to it on my forum post?
16:59:17CIA-58New commit by 03nls (r29945): FS #12141 by Sean Bartell ...
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17:09:00*n1s wonders if the build system is feeling all right
17:15:54n1sBagder: could you kick the build server a little?
17:17:28*bertrik attempts his first commit using git svn
17:17:56CIA-58New commit by 03bertrik (r29946): Fix FS #11813 - Frequency is not tuned the first time the radio is turned on
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17:19:08*n1s wants to make another commit but wants the previous build to complete first
17:19:46n1shmm, it vanished, maybe someone kicked the thing in secret
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17:22:38CIA-58r29946 build result: All green
17:25:51CIA-58New commit by 03nls (r29947): Fix define name.
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17:29:40CIA-58r29947 build result: All green
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17:34:18n1shmm, the voice codec isn't built with the core -O switch so we could probably save a bit of codesize on lowmem swcodec targets there
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17:36:51n1sbuilding it with -Os cuts almost 3k on a clip build
17:37:53bertriknice
17:48:34n1si wonder if it's likely to break
17:50:51n1sanyone with a clip care to give voice a quick test?
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18:01:34bertrikn1s, I can try on my clip, but I don't know/remember how to install voice
18:03:03n1sbertrik: here's the patch http://pastie.org/2009234
18:03:43n1sgrab a voice file from here and stick it in .rockbox/langs http://www.rockbox.org/daily.shtml
18:04:18n1ssince only english voices are available you need to use english as language too
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18:10:17bertrikn1s, voice still works
18:10:34n1sbertrik: cool, thanks for testing
18:11:24CIA-58New commit by 03nls (r29948): Build the voice codec speex with core -O switch to save size on targets using -Os.
18:15:15CIA-58r29948 build result: All green
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19:58:24_kainhello, i have a question. if i install rockbox in my ipod, should i still able to synchronise it via banshee or i need to run rockbox ?
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20:07:03[Saint]_kain: You can use whatever file manager you want.
20:07:30[Saint]rockbox doesn't need any particular application to sync, it supports drag&drop.
20:07:46_kainok, thanks... i'll try to read all FAQs and then try to install it ^^
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21:20:52_kainok, i read all the information about rockbox... but still lost... time for me to check the forums... seems to be a bit complicated for an ipod
21:21:39evilnick_kain:
21:21:48evilnickWhat are you lost about?
21:22:04evilnickAhem, why are you lost? What part is concerning you?
21:22:23_kainto install the rockbox "firmware" in my "old" ipod
21:22:30AlexPsee the manual
21:22:36AlexPIt is all explained
21:22:39_kainyep, i'm on it
21:22:47AlexPWe have a nice utility to do it, Rockbox Utility
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21:23:08_kaini dld the "rockbox-ipodcolor.pdf"
21:23:40*evilnick hopes that this corresponds to _kain's model of ipod :)
21:23:52_kainit is ^^
21:24:37_kainbut for now, my ipod is still on "do not disconnect" screen... and loading...
21:25:31_kain'cause of a synchronisation with banshee
21:25:51_kaini think i need to wait
21:26:11_kain12%...
21:28:06[Saint]that's only really important if you're going to bother keeping the iTunes database
21:28:13[Saint](which, ...I wouldn't)
21:28:56_kaini don't want it, i want to be able to listen to all my music files which contain .mp3 and .ogg
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22:52:57CIA-58New commit by 03nls (r29949): Disable some unused code in speex to save binsize.
22:56:45CIA-58r29949 build result: All green
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23:06:27_kainyeah ! my ipod is now rockboxed ! i'm happy !
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23:07:14_kainthanks a lot for you, people made this greaaaaat opensource ap.
23:10:56AlexP[Saint]: I've just been trying your wps
23:11:10AlexP[Saint]: Nice in general, but I have a couple of comments :)
23:11:54AlexP1) I expected that clicking on the volume icon that is always there would either let me change the volume, or would bring up the volume slider
23:12:02AlexPMaybe the latter would be good?
23:12:06gevaerts_kain: glad you like it :)
23:13:01AlexP2) I don't know how, but I managed to confuse it. I was just clicking on stuff, and one of the tabs disappeared, so I clicked on the other - it slid out and when it closed the other reappeared, but the one I clikced on disappeared
23:13:08AlexPI could repeat this a few times
23:13:39_kainnice step will be to transfer all my music, then test the new firmware and config it ^^
23:14:06AlexP3) I know not much you can do about it given the current RB touch system, but I really expected a slide action to bring out the tabs, so as I swiped I kept activating the tab then selecting one of the options in the tab all in one go
23:14:29AlexPThis might be something it is worth addressing in the code if possible (JdGordon?)
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23:26:46_kainonce on rockbox, can i remove all the files/folders in my ipod if i don't need them anymore ? (ex. Ipod_control, notes, contacts..)
23:26:55n1syes
23:27:00_kainnice
23:30:59gevaertsYou can, but whenever you boot the original firmware they'll be back (which may happen by something as simple as plugging it in when switched off with the hold switch set to "on"), so I wouldn't bother, really
23:32:51_kaini really don't want to boot the OFW... i'm on ubuntu and i really prefer rockbox
23:33:04gevaertsWell yes, but it does happen :)
23:33:27_kainhmm i see
23:33:37*gevaerts booted the OF on his ipod video earlier today when he wanted to charge it, merely because he didn't check the hold switch
23:33:56_kainhehe
23:34:39[Saint]AlexP: Thanks for your comments.
23:35:11[Saint]I believe I can block the opposite tab from opening, while the one you *want* open is open...working on that presently.
23:35:29AlexP[Saint]: It is more that the hidden tab
23:35:38AlexP"hidden" tab bit disappeared
23:35:43 Quit Strife89 (Quit: Leaving)
23:35:49AlexPSo it looked like there was no tab there at all on one side
23:35:55AlexPBut I'm not sure how I did it
23:36:03 Join Strife89 [0] (~Strife89@207.144.201.128)
23:36:21[Saint]regarding the volume icon, yeah... JdGordon mentioned that he expected the volume icon to popup the volume slider popup thingy also.
23:36:54[Saint]I guess I need to find another function for the right tab, as I'm not really a fan of the idea of both the tab *and* the volume icon popping up that slider.
23:37:04AlexPyeah
23:37:21AlexPclicking on volume bringing up the volume slider would be good
23:37:26[Saint]but if it's preferred that the volume icon popup that slider popup thing, then sure.
23:37:55AlexPIt just seems more obvious that clicking on the volume indicator would let you do something with the volume
23:38:20[Saint]I guess the right tab could bring up a second box of options similar to the left tab, but with...I dunnu, Hotkey, Playlist, <other?>?
23:38:31AlexPAs at the moment when you bring out the right tab there is no indication what the bar is for, it could be anything
23:38:46AlexPyeah, I'll have to think about that :)
23:39:40AlexPleft is file browser, context and quick IIRC
23:39:47[Saint]yeah, I'm thinking of adding text to that screen. and also two "-" and "+" tabs so you don't have to seek the volume with the bar.
23:40:00AlexPIt is nice though :)
23:40:05[Saint]that's correct re: left tab.
23:40:11[Saint]and thanks ;)
23:40:14AlexPI like the grouping of << play/pause >>
23:40:35[Saint]that was a very long IRC discussion to get that :D
23:41:03AlexPI seem to remember being for it right at the start when the swapping of play/pause icons came up :)
23:41:57[Saint]I was initially agains the idea of swapping the play/pause icons around...but now it seems perfectly natural to me.
23:42:07AlexPhehe :)
23:42:16[Saint]At first, clicking on a "stop" icon to "play" something seemed awkward.
23:42:35[Saint]then I realised that's pretty much the way every touch ui works.
23:43:13 Quit ender` (Quit: Jesus may be able to walk on water, but Chuck Norris can swim through dry land.)
23:43:19AlexPMaybe clicking on next track should do something
23:43:40AlexPI was initially thinking playlist viewer too, but maybe skipping to next track would be neat
23:43:53AlexPClick on the next track -> get skipped to it
23:44:07 Quit _kain (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
23:44:17[Saint]it does that ;)
23:44:24AlexPnot here
23:44:31[Saint]not *click* though, click'n'hold.
23:44:43AlexPoh, I haven't done that anywhere
23:44:57[Saint]you'll find more things now ;)
23:45:33 Join mudd1 [0] (~cmertes@ip-78-94-202-227.unitymediagroup.de)
23:45:41AlexPindeed so
23:46:21 Quit TheLemonMan (Quit: Ex-Chat)
23:48:10 Join _kain [0] (~kain_@2a01:e35:2f66:5a0:6ef0:49ff:fe02:f036)
23:50:44[Saint]It's possible now to remove some of the "doubled up" touch areas...they are a bit of a legacy from the "before the tabs worked properly" age.
23:51:59[Saint]some of them have a reasonable case for being there still I guess, depending on how you use the theme. even with the pop-up boxes I still access the quickscreen via the titlebar for instance.
23:53:04 Quit pamaury (Remote host closed the connection)
23:53:42AlexPyeah, I don't think doubling up is necessarily bad
23:53:57[Saint]Ideally, I'd like for there to be as little areas of the screen as need be with click *and* click&hold touch areas. the "click" areas can be annoying if you keep bringing them up accidentally.
23:54:23AlexPthe click and hold are less obvious as well
23:54:36[Saint]that is true.
23:54:41AlexPis there a reason that next track is click and hold and not just click?
23:55:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:55:31[Saint]yes, if it's just "click" it'll repeat. and you want it to only fire once.
23:55:54[Saint]otherwise you're at the end of your playlist in lightning speed without knowing what you did ;)
23:56:05AlexPOK
23:56:16AlexPoh, I see what you mean
23:56:32AlexPhmmm
23:57:03[Saint]a "click" action will repeat if it's held, only a "click& hold" action has a modifier to get it to only fire once.
23:57:09[Saint]and that's a very recent addition.
23:57:39AlexPIt would be nice to have that on click too
23:57:53AlexPI've no idea if that is feasible :)

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