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#rockbox log for 2011-06-06

00:00:01n1syay i found my bug
00:08:55 Quit bertrik (Quit: :tiuQ)
00:20:21 Join evilnick [0] (~evilnick@rockbox/staff/evilnick)
00:22:59 Nick kramer3d is now known as d3remark (~kramer@unaffiliated/kramer3d)
00:34:06 Quit liar (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
00:34:25pixelman1s: stripwax was there in Friday IIR/UC
00:35:19n1spixelma: thanks, i managed to answer one of my questions to him myself
00:36:01n1sthe other one was basically if he plans to do anything with FS #10071 or if it should be closed
00:36:02bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/10071 3Trying out Tremolo optimisations for tremor on ARM (patches, unconfirmed)
00:39:31 Join T44 [0] (~Topy44@f049166006.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:41:27[Saint]GodEater: ping?
00:42:27[Saint](since you don't like the DroidSans/-Bold font in particular...is it ok/fair for me to task you with finding a (or a couple of) .ttf fonts you *do* like?)
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00:43:10[Saint]the better the character support...the...better ;)
00:44:10*[Saint] wonders if others have a suggestion on this.
00:44:31[Saint]AlexP: kugel: ^?
00:45:38 Join Scromple [0] (~Simon@115-64-195-104.tpgi.com.au)
00:46:04[Saint]I quite like DejaVa Sans, and Ubuntu fonts myself.
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00:48:24[Saint]bluebrother: what about yourself...any font preferences that say "cabbie/RaaA" to you?
00:49:38[Saint]something where licensing isn't a problem, obviously...I don't have millions of bucks to spend on fonts ;)
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00:55:34[Saint]by way of design and conditionals...I no longer have to do any fancy blocking of the popups to prevent one opening on top of the other. I _think_.
00:56:40[Saint]It *could* still happen that one could open the volume popup overtop of the context/filebrowser/quickscreen popup...but I would assume that's not *too* much of a problem as it might even be wanted.
00:59:05 Join antil33t [0] (~antil33t@124-197-33-15.callplus.net.nz)
00:59:27[Saint](you might want to change the volume before the other popup has timed out perhaps...? bah, dunno. I might have to come up with a way to block this from happening if it gets annoying. It's not possible to do the reverse anymore and open the files popup overtop of the volume popup and have them both dissappear until they've timed out)
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01:15:49bluebrother[Saint]: I don't have any special problems with DroidSans. The spacing is bad but I guess this related to the convttf cinversion
01:16:05*[Saint] nods.
01:16:16bluebrotherother from that I like the DejaVu font famuly a lot
01:17:08[Saint]I might swing in that direction then, and yeah...you're correct, there was no option to force fixed width numerals in convttf when I converted the fonts originally.
01:17:42bluebrotherso as long as the spacing issue is fixed and it has a license that allows us to redistribute it I don't mind using DroidSans
01:17:50[Saint]also, it didn't seem to respect a few params in its earlier days, so font height and char spacing was a bit of a gamble.
01:18:15bluebrotherthough I think using DejaVu would be nice
01:19:03[Saint]GodEater has some form of aversion to the DroidSans family...and I'm in "keep everyone happy" mode.
01:19:47[Saint]So, I'll give DejaVu a try....I might also make an Ubuntu test-font too to see how it looks.
01:20:02bluebrotherthen try DejaVu :)
01:21:11[Saint]I've also dropped the tabs as well...the popups are still there, but I figured out a better (?) way of launching them, whilst cutting back on doubled-up touch areas.
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01:21:52[Saint](there was some concern at the tabs making people attempt to "swipe" the screen...so, removing them fixes this I guess ;))
01:22:54[Saint]the volume icon launches the volume pop-up/mute, and the current track info launches the filebrowser/context menu/quickscreen pop-up.
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01:52:37[Saint]Ok...right, I just need to convert the font (I'll do both Ubuntu and DejaVu and probably put in a .cfg to switch between the two easily for reference) and then I'll put up new links on my theme's thread for the scrutiny of those interested.
01:53:01[Saint]...I might not get time to do the font until I get home, though. So a few hours.
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02:00
02:01:12JdGordonpetur: i already split the peakmeters into seperate tags for the skins so it can be used vertically... just no themes use it
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06:02:40JdGordon[Saint]: you've got rid of the tab buttons?
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08:07:40webguest_ruhi all
08:08:43webguest_ruquick question, if linux install tool said my fancy "apple ipod classic 6th gen" not supported, does it really means it? I mean, any betas, or "unstable" available?
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08:20:48timcccwebguest_ru: freemyipod.org
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08:49:01webguest_rutimccc thnks!!
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09:00
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09:31:29[Saint]JdGordon: Yep.
09:31:48JdGordonand replace them with what?
09:31:56*JdGordon tihnks they look good and people trying to swipe are idiots :D
09:32:13[Saint]as per mailing list discussion, apparently th use case doesn't match the expected behaviour.
09:32:57[Saint]I haven't gotten rip of them completely...I mean, I still have that theme floating around. I'm just now trying to work on an alternative version.
09:33:41[Saint]I need to find better/the right magic for the skin vars to block both popups from opening at the same time.
09:34:01JdGordonthat would be my "best practices" email i'm working on
09:34:21[Saint]"best practices"?
09:34:28JdGordonhttp://pastebin.com/dhA6mr78
09:34:42*JdGordon back in 30
09:34:56*[Saint] nods
09:36:05*[Saint] *still* doesn't see the issue with single letter identifiers.
09:37:31[Saint]the only reason I need "word based" identifiers would be if I happened to need 52+ identifiers.
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09:56:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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09:59:13sfrankyhi everyone!
09:59:34sfrankyis anyone watching?
10:00
10:00:12n1sthere are lots of people in here, do you have a question?
10:00:21sfrankyi would seriously appreciate some help... i can't install rockbox on an ipod nano 2g, i have tried everything
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10:00:49sfrankyI install it, and then it freezes after 1-2 sec
10:01:28sfrankyI have formatted it, restored it, uninstalled the bootloader and reinstalled it, but it's always the same.. one or two times I even saw garbled graphics
10:01:59n1sso, after installing the bootloader the ipod freezes?
10:02:23sfrankyafter completing the whole installation, and unplugging it from usb, it loads, and then freezes
10:02:37sfrankyI see the main menu, I scroll up and down a bit and then boom
10:02:52n1sif you then reset it, what happens?
10:03:00sfrankythere's one thing i don't get... I read in the website that I m supposed to encrypt rockbox.ipod into rockbox.ipodx from *within* the ipod... I never have the chance to do it
10:03:02GodEatersounds like you *can* install it, just that it doesn't like working much.
10:03:02sfrankythe same
10:03:18sfrankyyes, I mean I can't have a working installation
10:03:33sfrankyany ideas?
10:03:37sfrankyah sorry
10:03:43n1ssfranky: you shouldn't need to encrypt anything unless you compiled your own bootloader
10:04:00sfrankysome times it says "undefined instruction at <00000000> , where that could be anything reallly
10:04:06sfrankyAh, no I didn't
10:04:07n1ssfranky: it works fine in the Original Firmware?
10:04:10sfrankyyes
10:04:43sfrankytoday I used itunes' restore function
10:05:12sfrankyand I got a new set of errors at the end of rockbox's installation (after reboot), but it soon started doing the exact same things again after 1-2 resetes
10:05:13n1si'd recommend asking TheSeven, he's the main guy for nano2g
10:05:50sfrankyI don't think he's really here now though..
10:06:05n1sare you doing the installation with rbutil or manually?
10:06:11sfrankyrbutil
10:06:19GodEaterthat's the way IRC works sadly - we can't all be here all the time
10:06:21sfrankyI tried installing the bootloader with ipodpatcher
10:06:26sfrankyyes i know
10:06:41sfrankyalso, rbutil always says I already have the bootloader installed
10:06:49sfrankyeven if I restore the ipod to the factory defaults
10:06:59sfrankythough nothing shows up in the info tab
10:07:28n1sIIRC itunes restore doesn't remove the bootloader
10:07:33sfrankyoops
10:07:54sfrankydidn't know that... anyway I tried with ipodpatcher and it seemed to work, but I still get the same message from rbutil
10:08:22n1shmm, strange
10:08:24sfrankyand the first error I got when fresh installing today was stack underflow viewport manager something
10:08:31sfrankybut that never came up again
10:09:54sfrankyI hate the ipod UI, I was given one second had as a gift, and I m trying to make it look like my old iriver h140 :(
10:10:35n1sgetting different errors like this indicates some corruuption IMO, so there could be something about the hw in your ipod that differs slightly from the ones that have been tested that we don't handle correctly somehow
10:10:54sfrankyok, sounds reasonable
10:11:13sfrankyis there anything else i can try?
10:11:42n1snothing that comes to mind except asking TheSeven
10:11:56sfrankybut he's not available...
10:12:01sfrankyi ll try another time then
10:12:10sfrankythanks very much n1s!
10:12:23n1sno problem, i hope you get it working
10:12:35sfrankyme too!! i love my rockbox
10:14:08sfrankybyebye
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10:15:38sfrankyn1s: sorry, one last thing
10:15:57sfrankyisn't the rockbox.ipod in the .rockbox dir supposed to be rockbox.ipodx??
10:16:49n1sno
10:17:25sfrankyok so this is also true only for the custom bootloader builds
10:17:26n1sif the encryption was the problem it wouldn't work for a second and then hang
10:17:54sfrankyoh right
10:18:08n1swell, the bootloader needs to be encrypted
10:18:33n1sit's flashed though so it doesn't really keep a filename
10:18:46sfrankygot it
10:18:54sfrankyso it's really not something I m doing wrong...
10:19:27sfrankyanyway, thanks a lot
10:19:28sfrankybyebye
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10:42:34*TheSeven extends his ears
10:43:58TheSevenwell, this sounds like some picky device that doesn't like our undervolting
10:44:16TheSevenhaven't heard of that kind of thing for a long time, but there might be a couple of monday's chips around...
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10:59:40[Saint]TheSeven: "mondays's chips"?
10:59:45[Saint]-s
11:00
11:28:17GodEaterdoes anyone know why the mkamsboot utility seems to keep mixing stdout and stderr for its output?
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11:47:27*[Saint] wonders why Ubuntu won't let him run RBUtil from his Nano2G directly
11:49:13[Saint]because it's NTFS perhaps?
11:49:24[Saint]Every time I set ther permissions they bounce straight back.
11:49:39[Saint]getting the "no application for executable files" error.
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11:50:43[Saint]but I can move it to the desktop and do chmod a+x foo.ext && ./foo and it runs fine, then I move it to the iPod and try to run it and the permissions reset. ;-S
11:51:13 Quit robin0800 (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
11:51:22[Saint]or extract it to the iPod, and set the permissions directly there...bounces straight back as well. very odd, something I'm missing I'm sure.
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11:54:12GodEater[Saint]: it's possible the entire mount is set as noexec if it's NTFS formatted.
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11:55:37[Saint]"The permissions of "NANO 2G 8GB" could not be determined"
11:55:39[Saint]:-S
11:56:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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12:40:59linuxstbGodEater: Re: mkamsboot - I doubt there is a good reason... I'm not even sure I know where it should be sent.
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13:19:00GodEaterlinuxstb: stdout seems more sensible to me for the [INFO] messages - so I might fix that whilst I'm working on it
13:20:19GodEaterPS - to everyone else - did we decide whose job it was going to be to knock up the script to remove all the svn keyword junk from our source tree?
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13:39:59wodzGodEater: I seem to remember that messages sent to stderr are easier to handle in rbutil (but I might be wrong)
13:40:31wodzanyway I was adviced to use stderr when I was writing mkmpioboot tool
13:46:20GodEaterwodz: ah ok
13:46:29GodEaterin which case, we should probably at least be consistent ;)
13:46:41GodEatersince there are still some messages sent to stdout in mkamsboot
13:46:49wodzsure
13:47:35wodzare there photos from DevCon somewhere online available?
13:47:55GodEateryes, check bagder's blog for the link : daniel.haxx.se/blog
13:48:07GodEaterit's petur's picasa feed, but I don't recall the link myself ;)
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14:10:18TorneGodEater: I can do it
14:10:33TorneGodEater: since i seem to have volunteered to work on the plans for git migration anyway
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14:18:05GodEaterTorne: sweet.
14:37:34*n1s hopes for a UsingGit page in the wiki popping up :)
14:37:44Tornen1s: Not just yet
14:38:14Tornei'm trying to set up a proper demo of gerrit first
14:38:44Tornebecause the specific details of how we opt to host things will be relevant for decent instructions
14:39:42n1sof course, i just think it would be very nice when we switch to make it easier for us git illiterates and probably make it less likely people do something wrong
14:39:46TorneRight.
14:39:51TorneI was also gonna produce such instructions, yes
14:39:58Tornebut not just yet :)
14:40:19Tornegerrit seems to be a pretty great option from my testing so far
14:40:55Torneit works as an authenticated server without needing ssh accounts (like gitosis and other things) but with a handy web interface to upload your ssh keys and so on
14:41:07Torneand then it also is a patch review system
14:41:58n1sso a bit like a more functional viewvc?
14:42:02TorneNo, it doesnt' do that part
14:42:17Tornethough it can link to one (it knows how to construct links for gitweb, cgit, etc)
14:42:27n1sah
14:42:51n1si guess i'll read up once it' sall set
14:42:52TorneI've taken the demo i put up at devcon down again for now pending reconfiguring it slightly
14:43:01Tornebut you can see one at https://review.source.android.com/
14:43:04Tornewhich is AOSP's gerrit
14:45:08n1sso it's like a patch/changeset queue where changes need to be reviewed to finally get into the repo?
14:45:19Torneit's up to configuration whether they *need* to be reviewed
14:45:41n1saha
14:45:45Tornei am proposing we allow committers to push directly to the tree still
14:45:58Tornebut people can optionally put things up for review first
14:46:04n1syeah, i like that
14:46:09Torneand non-committers can also create accounts on gerrit and put things up for review
14:46:24Torneand then a committer can commit it directly from gerrit without having to apply patch locally etc
14:46:30n1smight be easier to get attention than for a patch in fs
14:46:49TorneWell one big advantage over FS is you can comment directly on lines of a change
14:47:06Torneand comments apply to specific versions of the patch (you can upload new ones)
14:47:17n1ssounds good
14:47:19Torneone downside is that gerrit doesn't currently accept input via email
14:47:30TorneIt can send email when new things are uploaded, or when someone asks you to review something
14:47:46Tornebut right now you have to go to the web interface, or poke it via ssh, to comment/approve/reject
14:48:29n1scan you do fs by email?
14:48:52Tornenot sure.
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14:49:10Tornebut the alternative proposal discussed at devcon was to do this just by sending patches to rockbox-dev and discussing there
14:49:11n1sso that's probably no worse than what we have now
14:49:13Tornei.e. no tools
14:49:32Torneso I was hoping I could find a way to do it that had the best of both worlds.
14:49:53TorneIt's probably possible to write a lil email hook script that feeds comments from email back into gerrit
14:50:22Tornegerrit supports programmattically adding comments for things like buildbot output or automated source checks
14:51:31n1sa webinterface is fine to me
14:51:46Torneyah, i'm happ with that
14:52:00Tornei'm just trying to cover as many people's preferred use cases as I can to increase the chance that there is general approval of gerrit ;)
14:53:26n1si do think we have a bit too many channels of communication though so if this works out, maybe we should scale fs back to just bugs?
14:53:33Torneyes, that ws the idea
14:53:38Tornewe would stop accepting patches on FS
14:53:56n1sok
14:53:57Torneand then *either* have people put patches in some kind of review tool which is better at dealing with them, or have people mail them to rockbox-dev
14:54:06Tornepeople were in favour of both options
14:54:19Torne(the existence of a review tool doesn't preclude mailing patches, of course)
14:54:43Torne(but the existence of a review tool *does8 stop people from handling everything by email)
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14:56:43Torneaanyway. we seem to be decided on moving to git, but there are still questions about how to host it, how to convert current svn (our git-svn mirror is only trunk, we may want to convert it with something else which keeps all the branches/etc), and what the general preferred workflow/policy should be (whether that's enforced by tools or just advised)
14:57:12Torneso i'm gonna write up some proposals around this soon and see what people think
14:57:54Torneincluding a more or less fully functional gerrit instance with a pretend rockbox repo people can play with
14:58:10Tornei had it half going at devcon but my server apparently can't quite send email correctly atm ;)
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15:00:05n1sTorne: sounds good
15:00:08*n1s wonders if the coldfire cache is messing with him
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15:32:20n1summ, has CIA and or the build system died?
15:33:48n1shttp://build.rockbox.org/dev.cgi doesn't have the last 4 commits built
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15:42:12SzeraaxGood Morning! So Yesterday, I was dl'ing the source for rockbox to do some of my own tinkering through SVN (with Cygwin), and my copying of the trunk got interrupted. Is it possible to resume copying the trunk?
15:42:29Torneyup, just do svn update
15:42:41Torneit should carry on from where it left off (and also update any of the files you have downloaded that have changed)
15:43:22SzeraaxSchweet
15:44:35SzeraaxChanServ: when you say, 'do SVN update' You mean to 'run "$ svn co svn://svn.rockbox.org/rockbox/trunk rockbox" again, correct?'
15:47:06Torneno
15:47:10n1sno, run "svn update" (or svn up)
15:47:12Tornejust go into the directory and run "svn update"
15:48:00Szeraaxok, thanks
15:53:31*GodEater will wait for a working gerrit system before submitting his patch to mkamsboot
15:53:38GodEaterto test the thing out with real code
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15:57:45GodEaterdamn it
15:57:53Torneoh?
15:57:56TorneWell, I guess you could
15:58:07Tornei can't really host a real repository though :)
15:58:10Tornetoo little bandwidth
15:58:30Torneiot's why i only committed 1MB of rockbox code in my demo
15:59:50*GodEater wonders why his local 'master' claims to be ahead of origin/master by 19 commits
15:59:57GodEatereven though I've not bloody changed it
16:00
16:00:14Tornebecause you've picked up updates via git-svn and the git mirror is stuck?
16:00:16GodEatergit diff reckons there's a load of android changes been made - but I certainly didn't make them
16:00:18Tornethat's one possibility anyway ;)
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16:08:22GodEaterI don't think my tree knows about the git mirror
16:08:45GodEateroh no - it does
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16:22:00SzeraaxOk, more problems, yay! So while doing an SVN update from the trunk to my local directory (getting the source with Cygwin), I get the error, "failed to add file ... an unversioned file with the same name already exists" To tell SVN to overwrite any file that I have and give me exactly what is on the server, should I use 'svn update −−force' or 'svn update −−accept theirs-full' ?
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16:27:53saratogado what the message suggests?
16:30:50saratogai didn't realize we were thinking about dropping HWCODEC support, what was discussed exactly?
16:37:00GodEaterit wasn't a serious suggestion saratoga
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18:14:36sideralAny ETA for when http://build.rockbox.org/dev.cgi will return to full operation?
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18:46:12n1ssideral: was it taken down or has it just broken?
18:46:36sideraln1s: No idea
18:46:58n1si just noticed that no builds happens today but i haven't gotten any response
18:47:24n1sit's the national day here so i guess Bagder and zagor won't be around much
18:48:18sideralOK, sounds like we have an ETA now, as in "not today" :)
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18:53:23bertrikn1s, the build system got broken yesterday
18:53:45n1sbertrik: are Bagder and Zagor aware?
18:54:00bertrikquite sure about that
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19:30:07pixelmathere were changes to the build system done at DevCon and IIRC these went "online" yesterday in the afternoon. It's probably related to that and we may need to wait for Bagder or Zagor
19:30:31pixelmaoops, should have read all of the backlog before
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19:55:32sideralpixelma: The reason gevaerts gave for closing FS #4755 <http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4755> (still have no complete author information) looks rather bogus to me, as you've already done the detective work to find out the real name of the contributor. Care to comment?
19:55:33bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4755 3Wikipedia (patches, closed)
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19:57:44sideralAlexP: Have you had a chance to play with the dynamic DB-add patch, FS #12073 <http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12073>?
19:57:45bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12073 3Dynamically add files to database as they are played (patches, new)
19:58:14AlexPsideral: yes indeed, but each time I've remembered to tell you you haven't been online :)
19:58:43AlexPIt seems to work very nicely - I initialised the db with one track via liberal use of database.ignore
19:59:04AlexPAnd since then have just been using the player, and checking every now and again
19:59:20AlexPAs far as I can tell what gets played is turning up in the db :)
19:59:31sideralCool, thanks for testing!
19:59:33sideralHave you used it for autoresume yet?
19:59:52AlexPnot yet actually, I've been listening to a bit more music recently
20:00
20:00:03pixelmaI can't remember doing anything about the wikipedia patch... must be ages ago if at al
20:00:05pixelmal
20:01:00sideralAlexP: Have you noticed any performance degradation?
20:01:37AlexPsideral: Not noticed any no
20:01:37sideralAlexP: Looks like it makes no sense to ask whether you've noticed it missing to add any track :)
20:01:58sideralHow many tracks have been added in the meantime?
20:02:12AlexPI haven't been looking, but if I haven't noticed that must mean it hasn't seemed slower :)
20:02:34AlexPI tend to listen to full albums, so I can have a look if it has missed any
20:02:50AlexPAnd I would guess it has added a hundred or so
20:04:05sideralpixelma: Right, that was ages ago: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4755#comment32360
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20:06:26sideralAlexP: Thanks again! Let me know if you make use of the DB at all eventually, and if you notice any missing features (or misfeatures ;) )
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20:07:00AlexPsideral: heh, will do :)
20:08:57pixelmasideral: well, maybe he needs to give his ok for the replacement. Maybe one could even get hold of him in IRC as he's around a little more regularly in #quassel (freenode too)
20:09:25pixelmaas freqmod or some derivate of that
20:09:34sideralpixelma: I'm already trying to chat him up.
20:09:53sideralpixelma: Which "replacement" are you referring to?
20:11:10pixelmaI understood "> 4) Documentation refers to "freqmod" - can that be changed to a real name?" as "there is some files that state freqmod as author" but I really don't remember much and may be lacking context
20:11:39pixelmathere "are" some files too
20:13:51sideralpixelma: Thanks. OK, I'll try to clarify that he's the author. I find closing FS #4755 <http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4755> a bit premature, as there seems to be lots of interest in the task. I am myself using it, and I'd be interested in shepherding it in if no one else steps up
20:13:52bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/4755 3Wikipedia (patches, closed)
20:14:15pixelmathere seem to have been quite a lot of contributors to the patch though, most of their real names seem to be known though
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20:16:34sideralpixelma: Right. There also seem to be several changes in some private repositories on github & similar that aren't included in the tracker item. I'm going to check them out one by one as a low-prio task. There's a lot of history to cover after 4½ years :)
20:19:45pixelmafor some reason I only noticed that there was some discussion about the wikipedia patch these days but not exactly what's been said. One thing I remember having heard was that it wouldn't work nicely, haven't tried myself though. Maybe you could bring it up once more on the ml or so
20:20:51sideralI saw someone asking for / interested in working on bi-directional text support
20:26:48sideralOn an entirely unrelated note:
20:26:49sideralI'm working on several improvements for podcast playback and management, including last-played highlighting (FS #12054 <http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12054>), a "mark as complete" function, enhancements to podcatcher synchronization, a podcast rating function, and other things.
20:26:49bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12054 3Highlight each album's last-played track in database views - great for audiobooks and podcasts (patches, new)
20:27:02sideralI have trouble finding a good venue for discussing all this with potential users. Any suggestions?
20:27:18AlexPI'd say -dev would be a good first step
20:27:37sideralHmm... We don't seem to have many podcast listeners in the group of developers
20:27:40AlexPAs the devs are realy the ones whose opinions come first :)
20:28:18AlexPI mean as in you don't want to spend ages getting opinions and things like that if the other devs don't like it :)
20:29:03sideralAlexP: I'd like to get some input on requirements from users first, not endless discussions on what's allegedly not possible :)
20:29:50AlexPWell, it is up to you
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20:30:42AlexPI dislike generally separating podcasts from any other type of file
20:31:31sideral:) see?
20:31:51AlexPRight, and devs opinions win over users
20:32:02AlexPSo you need to convince the devs first :)
20:33:22sideralI think it might be easier to convince the developers if there's no need to hypothesize whether there actually is any demand
20:33:43AlexPMaybe, but demand hasn't meant anything in the past
20:34:12AlexPAs in if the devs don't want something, some users wanting it doesn't change anything :)
20:34:25AlexPAnyway, I'm not talking about this thing now
20:34:31AlexPJust in general terms :)
20:34:53sideralSure. But please remember that I am a developer, I'm not asking anyone to do the work for me :)
20:35:01AlexPOh, I know :)
20:35:17AlexPBut that doesn't mean it'll get in if the others are against it :)
20:35:29sideralTo your point: I don't particularly like special cases either, but it seems to me that podcasts actually prefer some settings to be different
20:35:57AlexPSpoken word anyway
20:36:38AlexPbut yeah, possibly
20:36:50AlexPIt is a general dislike of mine, not a hard rule :)
20:37:05sideralIn the Sansa OFs, for example, these settings are keyed to the directory names.
20:37:10AlexPwhich is wank
20:37:26sideralany better alternative?
20:37:36AlexPsure, tags, user settable
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20:37:52sideralthere's no universal tag for podcasts or audiobooks
20:37:54AlexPA massive thing of Rockbox for me and many people is not being forced to do things like that
20:38:21sideraland you could argue tags shouldn't be forced on the user either, much like directory names
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20:38:33AlexPLet the users pick the directories then
20:38:41AlexPBut I am well against specific directory names
20:39:33AlexPWhat about languages other than English?
20:39:33*amiconn agrees with AlexP
20:39:33amiconnFurthermore I don't really understand why spoken word needs different handling than other audio stuff
20:39:33sideralI could live with configurable directories. autoresume implements it this way
20:39:40sideralanother alternative I see is having per-directory .config files. Why has that idea been rejected in the past?
20:39:43AlexPI would stick out long against anything that forces certain naming/layouts
20:39:51AlexPThis is you being a db user I think
20:39:59AlexPNot caring much where things are on disk
20:40:30AlexPsideral: I'm not sure, per dir config would be nice if done properly
20:40:52sideralI do care where stuff is. But I think asking users to place stuff into a certain (configurable) dir if they want some function seems reasonable to me
20:40:55amiconnPer directory config is actually hard to do
20:40:59AlexPsideral: Not to me
20:41:13AlexPI find it the exact opposite
20:41:20AlexPI have my stuff organised how I want it
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20:41:34AlexPI don't want to have to move bits of it around just to get a feature to work
20:41:45amiconnSince we don't want to spin the disk on each track change, you would somehow have to store such configuration data as part of each buffered track's metadata
20:42:16AlexPamiconn: Yeah, that's what I meant by properly - I don't think the idea itself is rejected, it just has to be done to avoid stuff like that
20:42:19sideralamiconn: I figure it could be cached quite easily.
20:43:13amiconnLess easily atm considering we have two different playback engines, each having its own buffering system
20:43:16sideralper-dir config could open up more configurability that's often requested, such as per-podcast compressor settings
20:44:01AlexPIt'd also make a lot of other things not necessary
20:44:02*amiconn will hopefully be able to do something about that
20:44:27AlexPPeople can have fine grained settings and not the ones we pick for different "modes", and applied to wherever they want
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20:46:54sideralAlexP, amiconn: Thanks for your input so far!
20:47:18sideralamiconn: BTW, any further comments re FS #12107 <http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12107>?
20:47:18bluebrother-bothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12107 3Remove track-number generation heuristic from database (patches, new)
20:48:04AlexPsideral: No worries, and sorry for being a bit negative - but I was talking generally, and not about anything your proposing at the minute :)
20:48:14amiconnI'm in favour of removing the guessing, as I already expressed several times
20:48:44sideralamiconn: Also in the light of the feedback given by Slasheri, I assume?
20:49:34amiconnyes
20:49:45sideralalright, thanks amiconn!
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21:35:34n1sper dir configs would also be tricky if you want the settings to *only* apply in that dir since you'd need to keep the old settings somewhere and what if you have a playlist with tracks from multiple dirs and one dir has a settings change that needs a reboot or a playback restart?
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21:36:12n1sand does the settings menu reflect the settings in the current dir?
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22:19:20gevaertssideral (I hope you read logs): the way I understand the wikipedia task is that freqmod did add a lot to the wikipedia patch, but he didn't write the original one, and whoever did that has not been identified
22:20:55gevaertsSo no, I don't agree that this should have been left open
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22:25:59pixelmathere were so many comments and changes in the patch that I quickly lost track
22:32:44pixelmagevaerts: doesn't sound like freqmod based his work on the project mentioned right before in the task but I am not sure. Maybe he can tell us more about its history and as I said it should be possible to get hold of him
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22:33:21pixelmamaybe not immediately
22:34:50gevaertshm, that's possible
22:36:24pixelmaor maybe he even was referred to in the misticriver link post, unfortunately it doesn't seem to be around anymore (or maybe you have to be registered or whatever)
22:37:56gevaertsright, on re-reading it looks like the code may be from freqmod after all, with later modifications by other people, who all seem to be named
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22:43:04*gevaerts decides that sideral is the right person to investigate this :)
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23:13:43*Zagor crosses some fingers and presses the button
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23:23:49CIA-58r29976 build result: All green
23:24:00n1s\o/
23:24:38Zagorthe logs are awfully empty though...
23:29:13Zagorthere we go
23:30:16Zagorincluding the android build
23:31:29AlexPah, nice
23:33:43bertrik\o/
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23:39:56n1sdelta table doesn't seem to have updated
23:40:13Zagorindeed
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