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#rockbox log for 2012-01-31

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00:57:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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02:19:32[Saint]JdGordon|: You available for a skin syntax question?
02:20:46[Saint]Is "%?if(%vg(foo),=,value)<do this|do that>" valid?
02:22:11[Saint]Also...I _think_ I forgot to tell you...you should commit the "%T(foo,0,0,-,-,none)" patch
02:22:34JdGordon|[Saint]: yes, that should be valid
02:22:39JdGordon|and which patch is that?
02:23:52[Saint]The one that fixes up "none" firing on a long press if a short and long press touch area overlap and "none" is the short press action.
02:24:02JdGordon|its in git already
02:24:23JdGordon|8a3af26
02:24:28[Saint]Ah...whoops. Nevermind me then ;)
02:25:28[Saint]Now...to attempt to fix up the popups from locking you out if you get impatient and try to launch the popup before the condition goes false.
02:25:52*[Saint] has a plan for this, but it _may_ be ugly/unwanted behaviour.
02:31:50[Saint]%?Tl(foo)<%?if(%vg(foo),=,X)<%vs(foo,set,X)|%vs(foo,set,X)>>...looks like it should work.
02:32:33*[Saint] suddenly remembers that lacks any context to anyone.
02:33:26*JdGordon| vomits a bit
02:35:05 Quit MethoS- (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
02:36:25 Nick soap_ is now known as soap (~soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
02:37:20[Saint]JdGordon|: What's wrong with that?
02:37:39JdGordon|probably nothing
02:37:41[Saint]there's no other bloody way to do it...
02:37:45JdGordon|i just ifnd the syntax horrible
02:37:55[Saint]You made it!
02:37:56[Saint];)
02:38:00JdGordon|no i didnt!
02:38:59[Saint]You did %Tl , %vs/g & friends, and %if...I blame you ;)
02:41:08[Saint]I can't rely on %Tl(foo,timeout) to hold the popup(s) open...because you can get into a situation where it will lock you out if you don't wait long enough for it to time out.
02:41:50[Saint]So, instead, I won't be having the popups timeout anymore...instead the initial press will launch it, and a subsequent press will close it.
02:42:14[Saint]...it feels a little ugly, though.
02:57:15***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:57:51 Quit mystica555_ (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
03:00
03:17:51[Saint]JdGordon|: Is there a hard limit on the length of an identifier? And, are there any characters that are forbidden for use as/in an identifier?
03:18:05JdGordon|keep it ascii
03:18:07JdGordon|and no
03:18:17[Saint]I'll be converting all my single charcter identifiers.
03:18:24JdGordon|there are very few hard limits of any type anymore
03:19:48[Saint]I'll be using identifiers that are indicative of their function in the latest revision...to help those (that aren't seasoned "skin veterans") reading the code to better understand it.
03:20:51JdGordon|go hungarian notation!
03:20:59JdGordon|vFoo (viewport Foo)
03:21:12JdGordon|iFoo
03:21:36JdGordon|be careful with spaces... they should work but may not
03:22:55[Saint]Yeah...I just assumed it was safer to use underscores instead.
03:23:04[Saint]But, thanks for the heads up.
03:25:23DEBUGEOF from server (Success) (snapshot: netstuff.c line 545)
03:25:23***Cleanup
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03:25:23***Exit
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03:28:33funman[41430.868394] usb 4-2: not running at top speed; connect to a high speed hub
03:28:41funmando AMSv2 use full speed only ?
03:39:25[Saint]JdGordon|: How does one handle bitmapstrips with word-based inentifiers?
03:39:35[Saint]fooa, foob, fooc, etc?
03:39:41JdGordon|%xd(label, number)
03:39:50[Saint]Ah, thanks.
03:40:02JdGordon|which i always found 100x more understandable than Aa
03:40:27[Saint]The one thing I dislike about word-based IDs...is the added volume of code.
03:40:46[Saint]Some lines are *reeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllly* long now.
03:40:54JdGordon|yeah :/
03:41:07[Saint]One in particular is about 400 characters long.
03:41:19[Saint]*One line
03:41:25JdGordon|use # to split the line no?
03:41:36[Saint]Oh...You can do that?
03:41:39[Saint]Huh.
03:41:45[Saint]live & learn.
03:42:12JdGordon|it *may* work
03:42:18[Saint]beginningofreallylongline#
03:42:24[Saint]longlinecontinued#
03:42:28[Saint]endofline
03:42:30[Saint]?
03:42:40JdGordon|yeah
03:43:20[Saint]Right, thanks. I'll give it a go at least. Splitting all lines into 80 char widths would be "sane"
03:43:21JdGordon|there was quite some discussion about whether or not that behaviour was wrong
03:43:44JdGordon|being able to indent conditionals would be nice too
03:44:35[Saint]Wow...holy mother of...
03:44:53[Saint]Word based identifiers made my WPS grow in size ~30%
03:44:56[Saint];)
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03:45:30[Saint]I'm using *really* verbose identifiers, though.
03:45:47[Saint]Now "h" is "launch_volume_popup"
03:45:49[Saint]etc.
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03:47:49JdGordon|hmm... rockbox doesnt handle \t pretty much anywhere, so i could easily have the parser skip \t chars so we could add indenting
03:54:24[Saint]This is probably one of the shortest lines:
03:54:27[Saint]%?C<%Vd(album_art)%?vg(variable)<%Vd(current_track-aa)%Vd(next_track-aa)|%Vd(popup)|%Vd(volume_popup)>|%Vd(current_track-no_aa)%?vg(variable)<%Vd(next_track-no_aa)|%Vd(popup)|%Vd(volume_popup)>>
03:54:33[Saint]...lol
03:56:51JdGordon|http://pastebin.com/GLxgthyQ doesnt make it look so bad
03:59:55[Saint]*Completely* unreadable, though ;)
04:00
04:00:07[Saint]It looks nice, however. ;)
04:01:02JdGordon|you think so?
04:01:11JdGordon|surely line breaks are easier to figure out
04:01:44[Saint]I just think its terribly hard to follow.
04:02:10[Saint]I think I'll go with splitting into ~80 chars or less with comments.
04:02:48[Saint]I definitely won't be splitting a tag/identifier/function halfway through though...that makes it fucking impossible to read.
04:02:53JdGordon|I'll have a think about adding split line support and \t skipping
04:03:02JdGordon|i tihnk that line breaking makes it much easier to follow the logic
04:03:17JdGordon|with correct indenting it could easily work
04:03:28JdGordon|think about indenting viewports to make it really easy to find them
04:03:47[Saint]..."meh"...I'm not so sure, but your example is particularly bad due to where the breaks are.
04:04:09[Saint]Perhaps thats why it makes me want to stab my brain with a pencil.
04:04:16JdGordon|maybe
04:04:24JdGordon|yeah, that first line isnt so great i think
04:04:57[Saint]Its really hard to follow a conditonal when you can't see all the <'s and >'s easily.
04:07:16JdGordon|http://pastebin.com/index/GLxgthyQ is a bit better, at least the \n's are consistant
04:08:50JdGordon|http://pastebin.com/Pb05rQPc even
04:09:53[Saint]yeah...personally, I find that bloody hard to follow.
04:10:04[Saint]MAybe I'm just not used to it, though.
04:11:23[Saint]The beauty of skin syntax is that I'm free to just ignore it and never use it, ever, though. So its cool ;D
04:12:16[Saint]%?if does all the basic comparisons doesn't it?
04:12:21JdGordon|yep
04:12:27[Saint]>, <, =, etc.
04:12:32[Saint]Cool.
04:12:47JdGordon|you were so against %if when i introduced it :D
04:13:19[Saint]I couldn't see a use for it...and, there wasn't really...until skin vars went in.
04:13:20[Saint];)
04:14:03JdGordon|just remember skin vars are only in touchscreen currently
04:14:25*[Saint] nods.
04:14:47JdGordon|i expect that will change some day if it is wanted
04:15:01[Saint]it doesn't really make any sense for it to be touch only.
04:15:23[Saint]Though, there's a lot less opportunity to use it with a non-touch target.
04:15:26JdGordon|IIRC it adds a considerable amount of code and it isnt as useful on non touch
04:15:45[Saint]You could do some interesting effects, thopugh.
04:16:40[Saint]Hummm...I thought I remembered you saying skin vars was surprisingly cheap to implement.
04:16:58[Saint]I'm likely wrong, though.
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04:19:19JdGordon|maybe :) I don't remember
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04:19:25JdGordon|I'm sure there was a reason its touch only
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05:13:38[Saint]JdGordon|: http://pastebin.com/kW7dr0Si <−−- What do you think...? Easier to follow?
05:14:22JdGordonyeah, add spaces after the commas everywhere also
05:14:41JdGordonand \t's
05:14:49[Saint]...howcome? I've never understood that.
05:14:58[Saint](re: spaces after commas)
05:16:10[Saint]It just ends up adding yet more to the total size of an already massive WPS/SBS
05:16:23[Saint]the WPS is HUGE!
05:16:37JdGordonjust easier to read, less wall of text
05:16:47[Saint]Yeah...I guess so.
05:16:49soapWOT?
05:17:47[Saint]soap: "%xl(shuffle,cabbiev2-shuffle-240x320x24.bmp,6,5,2)" vs. "%xl(shuffle, cabbiev2-shuffle-240x320x24.bmp, 6, 5, 2)"
05:18:01[Saint]etc.
05:18:52[Saint]I don't think it really makes it *that* much easier to read...but, if others do, I'll add it.
05:19:09[Saint]I like to think of my themes being teaching tools.
05:19:51JdGordonhttp://pastebin.com/x7U7zgSx
05:20:23JdGordonif you use viewports correctly even if the parser adds a few extra lines it doesnt matter
05:21:32JdGordonlol 'variable' is the variable name
05:21:39[Saint]Will that (the pastebin) actually parse correctly in current giut head?
05:21:42[Saint]*git
05:21:46JdGordonno
05:22:01[Saint]Yeah, didn't think so, just checkin'
05:22:12JdGordonbut do you think it isnt worth the addition?
05:22:20JdGordoni do think it is less horrible to look at
05:23:02JdGordonallowing \n in the middle of conditionals might not be so trivial, but skipping \t sure should be
05:23:41[Saint]All I'm saying is: "I (*/probably/*) wouldn't use it".
05:23:43JdGordonalso, you should remove the skin name from all image filenames
05:24:10JdGordons/should/really should/.
05:24:25[Saint]I like the alignment up in the image declarations...but I'm not a fan of splitting up conditions like that.
05:24:39[Saint]JdGordon: Why?
05:24:59JdGordonI tihnk for that one case it makes alot more sense, much easier to see which conditionas fixes which viewport
05:25:21JdGordon1) the bmp's are put in the skin folder anyway so its redundant, 2) it means its annoying to copy the image to another skin
05:25:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:25:33JdGordon3) it makes the line longer than needed
05:26:08[Saint]Well, I needed to do it presently so it doesn't get confused and grab the wrong image.
05:26:30[Saint]I'll use the standard naming scheme when it eventually goes in.
05:29:58JdGordondont call it cabbiev2 then
05:30:07JdGordoncall it cabbiev3 and its all done
05:30:21[Saint]WHAT!?!?!
05:30:53[Saint]YOU were the one that said *definitely* don't call it *anything* other than cabbiev2! :P
05:31:50JdGordonyes, but not while its still in development
05:32:02JdGordonand you know I change my mind all the time!
05:32:09[Saint]:D
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06:05:10[Saint]http://pastebin.com/qWSSNLXd
06:14:21JdGordonit does make it a bit easier to read
06:43:24[Saint]Uuuuuurgh...there's *so* many changes that I might as well re-write the whole bloody thing by hand.
06:47:43JdGordon?
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08:09:07[Saint]Well...that nice %if statement gives some FUCKED results on device...
08:09:12[Saint]:'(
08:11:05[Saint]JdGordon: turns out you can't do "%?Tl(popup_main,4.0)<%?if(%vg(variable),>,1)<%vs(variable,set,1)|%vs(variable,set,2)>>"
08:11:51[Saint]Well...you can, but, can you guess what happens with the "true" section of the %if statement?
08:13:15[Saint]See...I thought it would be "if value > 1, set 1" and that's that...but, for the 4 seconds its true for, it rapidly cycles between 2 and 1.
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08:14:57[Saint]Oh...whoops, didn't realize you were away JdGord
08:15:06JdGordNo worries
08:15:15JdGordWhat about it doesn't work?
08:16:24[Saint]if value > 1, set 1 ends up rapidly cycling between conditions 1 and 2 because as soon as it gets set to 2, its greater than 1 again...ad infinitum :P
08:16:56[Saint]It makes perfect sense when I think about it...but, I wasn't expecting it :)
08:18:12[Saint]looks like I need to approach this from a different angle.
08:18:32JdGordDunno.. way too tired to think.. back in a few hours (like.. 6 :) )
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08:20:39[Saint]Hmmmm...even if I don't specify a timeout period, the default (and minimum) timeout of one second still is apparently enough time for it to cycle through the conditions ~10 times.
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09:09:19kugel[Saint]: well your code does just that
09:10:22CIA-81Commit 55d49a9 in www by 03Björn Stenberg: (Author: Nils Wallménius) Fix link to gitweb for build in progress.
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09:24:14[Saint]kugel: No...no, no...no, it doesn't. :)
09:24:35[Saint]You're either mistaken in what you believe I meant above, or, just wrong.
09:24:47[Saint]Hopefully the former.
09:25:12kugelthe statement is evaluated each time the skin is updated
09:25:27kugelwhich is 5 hz or so?
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09:25:44[Saint]Yes, which means you're completely missunderstanding what I meant above.
09:25:52kugelthen please clarify
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09:27:09[Saint]With the %if statement I just tried, the condition cycles between two viewports at a ridiculously fast rate.
09:27:26[Saint](the screen refresh rate, I presume)
09:27:48kugelthis is what I understood
09:27:53kugeland the skin code does that
09:28:10[Saint]not thecurrent code in thetracker, no.
09:28:33[Saint]you seem to be seeing bugs no one else ever sees.
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09:28:45daurnimatorjust updated my fuze to 3.10
09:28:59daurnimatorthe usb HID functionality is a cool unexoected feature :)
09:29:05kugelyou want it to cycle quickly and it doesnt do that, or you don't want it to cycle?
09:29:55[Saint]I don't. And it currently doesn't. The if statement I just tried I expected to work, and...its a LOT worse then what I have currently.
09:30:43[Saint]fwiw, its also possible to get svn cabbie into the same confused state.
09:30:55kugelthe skin code is "if x > 1 then x = 1 else x = 2". as this statement is exectuted repeatedly I would expect x to be toggled between 1 and 2
09:31:49[Saint]Yes, that's the failed statement I just tried...that's not whats in my current code on the tracker, though.
09:32:29kugelokay
09:32:49[Saint]well...actually, what I just tried is "if x > 1, set 2, else, set 1"
09:33:04[Saint]I didn't expect it to cycle at the refresh rate though ;)
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09:33:11kugelthat statement is a lot different
09:33:15[Saint]But, now it sems obvious why it does this.
09:33:49kugelthat is not expected to toggle 1 and t
09:33:50kugel2
09:35:00[Saint]Yeah...I didn't immediately expect it to, but it sems obvious why its doing that. I need to sit down and really get creative with it.
09:35:42kugelyour 2nd statement shouldnt cycle. why is it obvious it's doing it?=
09:35:50[Saint]What I'm hoping for is not relying on the popups to time out, but rather have the initial press launch the pokpup and a subsequent press remove it from view.
09:36:18kugelsounds annoying
09:37:11kugelno other popup needs to be "clicked away"
09:37:39[Saint]The problem is though (and this hits svn cabbie too), if you rely on the timeout you need to wait for the timeout to be false before you can launch it again.
09:37:58[Saint]Its just /slightly/ harder to get svn cabbie into this state.
09:38:02kugelwell, I guess that isn't true, but I quite like that I don't need an additional press
09:38:51kugelI haven't noticed the problem with git cabbie
09:38:53[Saint]Oh...so do I. But I don't like this situation of needing ton wait for the timeout to go false before you can launch another popup.
09:39:06[Saint]*to wait
09:39:06kugelbut it hits me every single time I enter the wps with your theme
09:39:35[Saint]I'm using a slightly longer timeout.
09:39:50[Saint]so it takes longer for it to go false upon entering the screen.
09:40:34kugelin git cabbie the popup is able to show right after entering, and times out after 2s (or so)
09:41:01[Saint]you're just using %Tl for the "context popup" which has a default value of 1 second.
09:41:07kugeland the volume popup can immediately override the menu pop without waiting for the timeout
09:41:08[Saint]which is why its harder to hiot.
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09:41:28[Saint]and the latter statement you made there is untrue.
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09:41:36[Saint]I can get it into that state.
09:41:46kugelI'm trying it in this very moment
09:42:06[Saint]I've been playing with it most of the day, and I can get it confused in the same way.
09:42:19kugelwhat is the way to confuse it?
09:43:29[Saint]You can launch the contect popup, and then launch the volume popup on top of it, then as soon as the volume popup times out try launch it again.
09:43:43[Saint]if you keep trying, it never goes false, and won't launch.
09:44:36[Saint]If you can't get it to do so, then, there's some "very weird shit(TM)" going on.
09:44:50[Saint]As that's a repeatable recipe for me.
09:46:45kugelworks for me
09:46:48[Saint]I have expected for some time now that we've been seeing different results...but, I cannot fathom how that is possible. There simply shouldn't be any device dependant weirdness with regard to this...but if you can't repeat the above recipe, I don't know what else it could be.
09:48:10kugelare we trying the same cabbie, i.e. 320x480?
09:49:04[Saint]Yep. I recently acquired a device of this resolution.
09:49:54[Saint]It really does seem as though there's some device dependent weirdness here if we're both seeing different results.
09:50:02[Saint]But, I cannot understand why.
09:50:19kugeljust so we're clear
09:51:04kugelI enter the wps. then I press on the right side of the album art to launch the menu pop. then I quickly launch the volume pop by tapping the volume icon. I then do nothing to let the volume pop time out
09:51:26kugelboth re-launching the volume pop and menu pop works after it timed out
09:51:52[Saint]Yeah...I'm getting completely different results on my targets.
09:52:18[Saint]I can't get it to launch unless I wait for it to go false.
09:52:30kugelwhat is "it" here?
09:52:41[Saint]either popup.
09:52:58kugel"either popup to go false"?
09:53:07kugeloh I meant the second it ;9
09:53:18kugel;)*
09:53:22[Saint]Oh, the timeout.
09:54:37kugeland by "timeout to go false" you mean "timeout to expire"?
09:55:33kugelI think a youtube video is in order :p
09:55:38[Saint]Haha.
09:56:02[Saint]It might be interesting if you supplied me with one of your binaries for testing.
09:56:30[Saint]I've been using rasher builds...I wouldn't expect it to make a difference, but, one never knows.
09:57:44[Saint]I have used up my available hacking time for the day...but, I will be getting into this all day tomorrow as I have a day off.
09:58:03kugelI cannot open the menu pop while the volume popup is open, that's true. but after the volume pop disappeared I can open both just fine
09:58:28[Saint]curious.
09:58:46[Saint]I *can* open the menu popup while the volume popup is open.
09:58:54[Saint]...this is fucking weird.
09:58:57kugelwhile in your theme I can't open any popup anymore even after waiting for a long time
09:59:25[Saint]4 seconds after the popup dissappears.
09:59:35[Saint]because of the way %Tl works.
09:59:36kugelI only tried your theme on the sdl app so far, btw. but shouldn't make a difference
09:59:55[Saint]It very well might. I'm not sure though.
10:00
10:00:18kugelgit cabbie works the same in sdl and android
10:00:29kugeland the touchscreen interface (in the code) is target independent
10:01:53[Saint]Sorry, I'm not being rude, but I really need to get some housework done. I'll still be online in case you have any observations, but I'll be afk for some time.
10:01:59[Saint]EBADTIMING ;)
10:02:29*kugel has a bachelor thesis to write :)
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11:23:54TopDollar2006Anyone up?
11:25:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:26:15ZagorTopDollar2006: got a question?
11:26:29TopDollar2006OK. I have an issue with a 4gig Sansa Fuze V2.
11:26:52TopDollar2006It's totally unresponsive, no OF screen, no rockbox screen, power off doesn't work.
11:27:22TopDollar2006I installed the latest rockbox build and it bricked on me.
11:28:02TopDollar2006In a nutshell, I'd kind of like to get it working again, or at least restore it to factory and start over.
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11:29:23gevaertsTopDollar2006: hold the power button for *at least* 30 seconds
11:29:36TopDollar2006I have done this repeatedly to no effect.
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12:12:25themoonhi there. Can anyone pls tell me if there is a way to set max volume at +6 dB on my rockboxed iRiver H140. I tried 3.8 rockbox build cause I like it better than newer 3.10
12:13:46themoonwhat I mean is I can only set 0dB volume whereas manual says it should be +6 setting as well
12:19:04gevaertsthemoon: anything above 0 may distroort sound, and not all hardware has that. If it doesn't go above 0 and the manual says it does, the manual is probably wrong
12:23:25themoonthat's a shame. I think I somehow managed to set +6 but on a previous RB build and have updated in since more than once.
12:24:18themoonso there actually no hidden settings? If its not there right after install there's no other way, right?
12:25:21gevaertsright
12:32:37themoonok, thanks a lot!
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13:00:26Kilian]Hi guys, is it possible to donate hardware ?
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13:08:46ZagorKilian]: yes. while we don't have a central administration for it, post your offer here and/or the mailing list see if any devs are interested
13:12:14Kilian]Zagor: okay, I have a Trekstor i.beat move s. I dont use it anymore, because the accu is built in and works only for about 30mins. If someone is interested please ping me :) See http://trekstor.de/de/products/detail_mp3.php?pid=90 for details.
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13:19:15Kilian]hm, sorry this was the wrong url. Looks like there isnt an offical page anymore. I will make an post on the ML in the next days.
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16:04:57dfktit's impossible to display album art in two different viewport conditionals? i want to display full screen album art while paused, and smaller album art + info when playing
16:05:54dfktdepending on how i sort my wps code, either one or the other works
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16:27:13Tornedfkt: i think you can only have one *size* of album art
16:27:30Tornei.e. it only loads/scales the image once
16:27:39Torneyou can probably display it in multiple viewports/etc if it's the same size in both
16:27:47gevaertswell, once per skin
16:27:57gevaertsYou can have a different size in the sbs
16:28:50gevaertshm, *maybe* with some trickery you can make a weird wps/sbs combination that does what you want
16:29:35*gevaerts is tempted to try :)
16:29:37dfkti tried using the same size for both conditions, but it doesn't work properly as well
16:30:05dfktie. album art in pause mode stays blank, but skipping to the next track while paused displays it
16:30:12dfktand similar issues
16:31:00dfkti will try if some nasty hack in the sbs will display a different album art than in the wps :)
16:32:06gevaertsYou can display AA in the sbs, but I haven't tried that yet with an sbs that shows in the wps
16:32:47dfkthmm, yes - and another issue is the UI viewport identifier - i don't think that can be conditional
16:33:00dfkt%Vi %LB i mean
16:33:45gevaertsyes, that's the main possible obstacle I think
16:37:02dfktTorne, it seems the main issue is that %Cd can only be called once - whichever %Cd comes first in the wps works, the next one is ignored
16:40:04dfktno matter the size or viewport
16:40:24dfkts/the/which
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17:05:34wodzTorne: have you had a chance to look at unwarminder?
17:06:08TorneBugger, no, sorry
17:06:15TorneI'll see if i can take a peek tonight
17:10:15wodzok, thanks
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18:19:55pixelmagevaerts: the current supported Irivers can't go above 0dB IIRC, I'll go on and check the manual next
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19:25:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:33:53bertrikIt's a bit of a shame when you have a perfectly good patch, but can't commit it because you don't know the real name of the contributor ..
19:34:51dfktjust use John Doe :)
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19:38:09funmanor put your name ?
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19:40:31bertrikthat would be plagiarism
19:41:18dfktexplain the situation in the comment?
19:41:51n1swer actually expected to follow the Real Name policy
19:42:50n1syou could rewrite the patch but doing that without just retyping it when you have looked at it is rather tricky
19:43:50bertrikI think I'll just have to be more patient, it's about g79 by the way
19:47:12n1si bet one of the forum admins could get his email address
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19:54:39scorche|shlet me check
19:54:44scorche|shg79 is the user?
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19:58:12bertrikscorche`, g79 is the gerrit entry, user is http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?action=profile;u=32552 but maybe I really should be more patient
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20:11:49scorche|shbertrik: i PMed you the address
20:17:34funmanbluebrother^: ping
20:24:06CIA-81Commit 88cda7e in rockbox by 03Rafaël Carré: mkamsboot: fix some Clipv2 that we used to brick
20:26:34funmanbluebrother^: is it possible to make a new rbutil release with 88cda7e soon?
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20:28:46funmanTorne: also i wonder if we should branch to our start code from fiq/irq vectors too
20:28:57funmani think dualboot.S doesnt even disable interrupts
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20:35:41funmandid anybody try gcc 4.7 LTO on arm ?
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21:24:19funmangevaerts: why didn't you talk to me about r31434?
21:25:29gevaertsfunman: because it was urgent. More and more people started losing data due to this
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21:25:50gevaertssee the irc logs from around then
21:26:04funmanthere were other options than a revert
21:26:22funmanno problem for reverting it at the time but you could have told me (i didnt notice it)
21:26:36saratogawhat was the issue, that it would delete music added in MTP mode?
21:27:33gevaertssaratoga: that it would delete those directories on *any* player (not just sansas) if the user selected "all" in disktidy. "music" isn't an uncommon place to put music
21:27:43gevaertsfunman: true, sorry about that
21:28:09funmanwell wasn't it easier to remove MUSIC/ from the list?
21:28:37funmanor all directories
21:29:56funmanwe can make disktidy remove empty dirs recursively
21:30:13funmanthat'd work with RECORD/ which has FM/ and MIC/ subdirs
21:30:22gevaertsWell, it's not clear to me if the others should be deleted. The manual says disktidy "deletes junk files commonly left behind by Windows, Linux and OS X", so rather explicitely *not* OF stuff. Changing that needs more discussion IMO
21:30:32gevaertsYes, empty directories are much less of a problem
21:30:39funmaneh, we can add that option to the manual
21:30:49 Quit saratoga (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
21:31:42funmanor rework the 'ALL' selection
21:32:11gevaertsWhat do those OF files do? Store preferences?
21:32:32funmanperhaps
21:33:20funmani don't really want to check what they do. the manual can say that they store OF preferences if that reassure you
21:34:03*gevaerts thinks disktidy needs more thinking and flexibility before we add much more stuff to it
21:34:11funmanone of the dirs probably store music transferred in MTP mode
21:34:48AlexPIf they remove any OF settings or music or anything I don't mind them being added as long as they aren't default in any way
21:35:11AlexPThem being in ALL is debateable too, even though ALL would then be a lie
21:35:12gevaertsSome stuff can be deleted without warning (various removed file stores, thumbs.db ...), but some other stuff should be a lot more careful I think
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21:35:38AlexPI wouldn't mind an e.g. "Sansa OF files" or somesuch
21:35:46funmanAlexP: it said so already.
21:35:56AlexPIt was in ALL, no?
21:36:59funmansee 3bc771d669676
21:37:36AlexPbloody stupid tags
21:38:55AlexPOK
21:39:18AlexPalso, saying "No" is rather easier than making me search for a commit
21:40:08gevaertsThe discussion around my revert is at http://www.rockbox.org/irc/log-20111226#00:48:46
21:40:26funmanAlexP: 1/ the answer is not "No" because ALL selected it.
21:40:46funman2/ you can use git show "what i pasted" and see for yourself and make your own interpretation
21:41:19AlexPSo how does looking at that commit help me?
21:41:26AlexPIt doesn't show that ALL selected it
21:41:29funmanyou see where it was
21:41:36AlexPI'd have had to look at the rest of the file for that
21:41:40AlexPanyway, whatever
21:42:19funmani agree that disktidy UI is confusing
21:42:48funmanperhaps just putting ALL at the end would be enough because you'd have to scroll down and see all what is deleted
21:42:56gevaertsno
21:44:11funmangevaerts: http://pastie.org/3291146 ?
21:49:49gevaertsI'd still like to have some sort of confirmation that those are "junk files" (as the manual puts it). They shouldn't be critical, and some of them look like junk (is UPGRADE.FIN some sort of marker for a GUI updater?), so I can live with this. The manual should be updated to mention OF files though
21:51:23funmanthey are junk as far as rockbox is concerned
21:51:30bertrikI think upgrade.fin exists only just after a firmware update, it's automatically deleted by the OF on the next boot
21:51:36funmantrue
21:52:12funmani'll check their content
21:54:42AlexPGiven we allow dual boot, we shouldn't be removing things the OF uses and that people would notice
21:54:43bertrikdeleting some of the other OF files may have side effects, I think one of them contains the OF settings or regional code, so deleting them may cause the OF to ask again about the language to use, etc.
21:54:54AlexPEven if to Rockbox they are junk
21:57:08funmani could make that a separate plugin
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22:08:34bertrikhm, it's taking a very long time to boot rockbox on a clip zip after having inserted an sd card, although I think I've seen this behaviour on a clip+ too
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22:13:10Tornefunman: maybe dualboot.S should disable interrupts? :)
22:13:31Tornefunman: i guess we could branch to start if start immediately disables interrupts
22:13:41Tornefunman: and explicitly drops itself into the right mode
22:13:49namnufindeed but note interrupts never happened on any model
22:14:07namnufelse we'd have been in an infinite loop
22:14:15namnufirq/fiq
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22:14:47funmanso i'm not sure about it
22:15:40funmanis there an instruction which sets the right mode, disable irq/fiq, enables MMU, jumps to our startcode, and load 4 XMM registers from memmory at the same time?
22:15:44funmanah it's not x86 forget it
22:15:53Tornehaha
22:16:57Torneyou can do it in, er, two maybe?
22:17:17Tornemsr to SPSR from an immediate to set mode and irq bits in it, then movs to pc
22:17:25Torneno mmu, but hey
22:17:54funmani mean we cant put it in the reset/swi vectors
22:18:18Tornei don't see why you'd need to
22:18:33Tornewhat are you actually concerned about here?
22:18:40funmanyes so putting it at code start is ok
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22:19:08funmannothing
22:19:33funmani will let it like it is - interrupts should be disabled already when we enter that code
22:19:39funmani don't know how SWI works though
22:20:49Torneswi disables irq, but not fiq
22:21:06Torneonly reset and fiq disable fiq
22:21:40funmanokay so it's alright
22:24:52Torneyeah. all exceptions disable irq, only rst and fiq disable fiq
22:25:06funmandfkt: ping
22:29:23dfktfunman: pong®
22:29:53funmandfkt: do you know what those OF files do?
22:32:01dfktMTABLE.SYS is the database, according to a hex editor
22:32:52dfktno idea about the other ones, though SYS_CONF.SYS seems obvious
22:34:56dfktthey all get recreated anyways when booting the of
22:37:41funmani should make a bootloader which doesn't let you boot OF anymore
22:37:50dfktthat would be nice :)
22:38:07funmanhm in fact that clipv2 is a nice occasion to do it
22:38:21dfktjust looked through the other OF files, they're mostly 00's, and version.sdk is plain text
22:39:01dfktmaybe RES_INFO.SYS is the DRM crap, and it's empty on my clip since it's never used?
22:39:16gevaertsfunman: can we update bootloaders if the OF isn't there?
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22:43:56funmanyes
22:44:15gevaertsok
22:44:24funmanit'd mean export sd_write_sectors to a .rock or reimplement them in the .rock
22:45:10funmani have done it in the past when we didnt know recovery mode
22:45:38funmanhm actually sd_write_sectors avoid those bootloader blocks carefully
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22:50:59bluebrotherfunman: pong
22:51:43funmanbluebrother: can we make a new rbutil release with the clipv2 fix ?
22:51:43bluebrotherthe main problem is that my release scripts are currently broken, and I'd like to fix them before making a new release.
22:52:16bluebrotheralso, I wanted to finish the multithreading support for encoders as well. I already have a first implementation ...
22:52:24bluebrotherhow much of a problem is it right now?
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23:06:02funmanclipv2 can be bricked
23:06:31bluebrotherurgh, that's ugly.
23:07:49funmanit's been that way for more than 2 years and a half though. we can wait a bit more
23:08:53bluebrotherthat's still a bad thing. I'll try to get things done until the weekend (or during the weekend) if possible
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23:49:40saratogarasher: are test plugins disabled in your sim builds for a reason?
23:50:08saratogawould probably be nice to at least have test codec available so that windows users can trouble shoot without needing to setup a vm
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23:52:14rashersaratoga: dunno, that's how it builds. If you enable it in the default build it should appear I guess?
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23:53:44skamsterhello, i've just a very little time, but i've like to install avlo on my av100, but it tells me every time, the update is not valid
23:53:51skamsteri've used the tutorial of archopen, just renamed the file into BJBM instead of CJBM (because this is for av300, i think)
23:54:02skamsterwould be very very cool if you could help me
23:54:12skamsteravlo is 4.2 from sourceforg
23:54:21skamster makes me crazy, because i couldn't use ogg, flac, wav, etc this way :s
23:54:41skamsterthink, you could have a clue, why it doesn't take the update?
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23:54:52skamsteryou may also use avlo?
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