#rockbox 2012-06-26

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#rockbox log for 2012-06-26

00:00:03	belak	I'll let you know if it herps a derp
00:00:04	bluebrother	there's no real reason not to add that −− disabled targets don't show up normally :)
00:00:23	*	bluebrother just installed a classic build into /tmp
00:02:41	[Saint_]	amayer: It may interest you to note that FS #12706 has been closed
00:02:42	fs-bluebot	http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12706 wpsbuild.pl: cabbiev2.cfg is generated with invalid paths (bugs, closed)
00:02:51	[Saint_]	Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
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00:03:42	belak	bluebrother: How can I make it install dev builds, in stead of stable?
00:04:53	[Saint_]	bertrik: That may interest you (though, only slightly ;)) too. I believe it was yourself that noticed a while ago that the backdrop was failing to apply in cabbiev2 due to unklnown/invalid path.
00:05:24		Nick [Saint_] is now known as [Saint] (~Saint]@unaffiliated/saint/x-8516940)
00:05:25	amayer	[Saint_]: thanks
00:05:29		Quit dfkt (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
00:06:21	bluebrother	belak: use the installation feature ...
00:06:31	bluebrother	(i.e. follow the "Installation" tab)
00:06:41	belak	Ahhh
00:06:43	belak	Missed that
00:07:00	amayer	[Saint]: i try to help when i can
00:07:02	amayer	(i dont have alot of time to dedicate but when i find time to tinker i make it count)
00:07:06	bluebrother	(though that tab will go away soonish :)
00:07:44	[Saint]	amayer: Every little bit counts. And its all appreciated.
00:07:56	amayer	well i hope to contribute more in the future
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00:08:31	amayer	im 100% linux so the ipod firmware was in the way. RB works out alot better
00:08:45	amayer	i forget how i found it but im glad i did
00:09:41	belak	amayer: which iPod are you using?
00:09:47	amayer	classic
00:09:54	amayer	120Gb
00:09:55	*	[Saint] never tires of hearing such compliments
00:12:15	amayer	what time zone does rockbox.org/irc report on? (im +5:00) and trying to figure out where i left off on the conversation
00:14:01	bluebrother	I guess UTC or CEST
00:14:42	belak	Ah, it's about the same with me... I got so sick of the Apple firmware... and finally freemyipod came out with emcore...
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00:15:36	belak	bluebrother: what can I do about the "No themes available for the selected target" issue
00:15:48	belak	I think iPod video stuff works?
00:16:18	amayer	If your on a classic ipod video stuff works
00:16:45	amayer	[Saint] told me themes just go by resolution but are platform independent
00:16:51	belak	Ah, ok
00:17:13	belak	Then is there a way to make the ipodclassic target for rbutil use the ipodvideo themes?
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00:17:56	amayer	belak: i dont know. ive never used rbutil
00:18:05	amayer	i was told it wont work with the classic
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00:20:13	[Saint]	belak: Just lie to RButil and say you have an iPod video instead.
00:20:29	[Saint]	You can manually configure the mountpoint and device type.
00:20:30	belak	lol, at least while installing themes
00:21:08	amayer	i just drag and drop the files from the .zip file then edit the settings after i boot it up
00:23:01	[Saint]	It turns out I was mistaken about themes being platform independant and assigned by resolution.
00:23:04	bluebrother	belak: well, the theme site obviously doesn't have any themes for the classic :)
00:23:20	[Saint]	It used to be this way, but, apparently I'm stuck in the past as it was changed ~4 years ago or so :)
00:23:27	bluebrother	afaik the resolution of the video is the same, so just select that.
00:23:34	[Saint]	it is, yes.
00:23:53	bluebrother	you _might_ come across themes that don't work since the supported theme syntax _might_ be slightly different (i.e. a different subset)
00:24:13	[Saint]	I cannot for the life of me think of a good reason why themes aren't assigned by resolution, exceopt for special cases like monochrome vs color.
00:24:20	[Saint]	But, this is the way it is...apparently.
00:24:32	[Saint]	I'd like to change this, but, it needs further discussion.
00:25:12	[Saint]	If a themer codes their theme properly, resolution and screen type (color/monochrome) is the only thing that should matter.
00:25:14	amayer	ive used 2 or 3 themes on my classic from the ipod video section and they all worked
00:25:55	[Saint]	amayer: this is to be expected, anything that a theme cares about between these two targets is identical.
00:26:10	amayer	[Saint]: oh ok
00:26:13	gevaerts	[Saint]: themes are managed by resolution on the theme site. That doesn't help for targets the theme site doesn't know about though
00:26:37	amayer	brb, reboot
00:26:42	[Saint]	gevaerts: Wait...what? a few days ago someone told me that wasn't the case and that I was stuck in the past.
00:26:51		Part amayer
00:27:18	[Saint]	not just "someone" as in some random person, but, someone I assumed aactually knew what they were talking about (a developer)
00:28:08	[Saint]	I thought it didn't make any sense, and, it seems very, very stupid to me at the time...but, I was assured that I was incorrect and that themes were assigned by target now.
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00:29:36	bluebrother	[Saint]: themes were sorted by resolution only in the past
00:29:59	bluebrother	this was changed to take differences in theme syntax between devices into account
00:30:06	gevaerts	Check the themesite. You'll find that e.g. gigabeat F, gigabeat X and fuze+ have the same themes
00:30:12	bluebrother	(like RTC vs. no-RTC targets)
00:30:14	[Saint]	bluebrother: gevaerts seems to disagree.
00:30:20	bluebrother	[Saint]: no
00:30:32	bluebrother	the themesite assigns themes to targets depending on the result of checkwps
00:30:40	*	gevaerts nods
00:30:49	bluebrother	if checkwps decides the theme work on a target said target gets the theme
00:31:04	bluebrother	but for the classic the problem is that there is no category for the classic :)
00:31:15	bluebrother	which means someone would need to add this
00:31:22	gevaerts	For a theme to show up, it needs to (a) have the right resolution, (b) pass checkwps for that target, and (c) not be deleted or hidden by an admin
00:31:43	[Saint]	I really don't understand why themes are assigned in this way, the only thing that actually matters is color/monochrome
00:32:09	gevaerts	You'd prefer if themes that won't actually load are shown?
00:32:27	[Saint]	Why wouldn't they load?
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00:32:46	gevaerts	That's what the checkwps test filters out
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00:33:27	[Saint]	Well, obviously the theme needs to be parsed, but, the only thing that is relevant in terms of assigning a theme to a target is the resolution and screen type.
00:33:36	[Saint]	Hardware differences don't matter at all. Even if the author doesn't assign a fasle case for hardware checks.
00:33:52	[Saint]	If the target doesn't have the hardware the theme checks for, it just ignores it.
00:34:18	gevaerts	Yes, so how exactly does the theme site get this wrong?
00:35:13	gevaerts	The colour/monochrome issue is debatable, and maybe we should reopen the debate (but only if someone promises to do the necessary work!), but I don't see what else you're actually unhappy about
00:36:49	[Saint]	Perhaps whoever explained it to me explained it incorrectly, I had a totally different idea of what was going on here. Its turned into a big confusing circle jerk.
00:38:34	amayer	sounds ugly
00:38:51	*	gevaerts didn't see said explanation, so he doesn't know
00:39:26	[Saint]	It was largely due to the fact that there are instances where themes that could be shared amongst targets weren't appearing in the lists when they should.
00:40:10	bluebrother	this sounds like some side effect that happened when updating the theme site to git
00:40:17	gevaerts	Sounds unlikely to me
00:40:19	[Saint]	I couldn't understand why, and it ultimately turns out that my understanding of how themes are assigned to a target was correct.
00:40:44	bluebrother	during which process something was mixed up (though that was only during the hour or so gevaerts was fixing it)
00:41:13	gevaerts	bluebrother: you mean the brief reign of the shuffle function? :)
00:41:36	belak	bluebrother: for a temporary fix on themes, configure_modelname can be set to ipodvideo...
00:41:59		Quit user485763 (Quit: Leaving.)
00:42:24	gevaerts	[Saint]: if a theme doesn't show up on the themesite where it should, it means either it shoudln't after all or checkwps is doing something wrong. Nothing the theme site as such can do much about...
00:42:38	bluebrother	gevaerts: yes :)
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00:42:52	belak	That still lets rbutil search for the ipodclassic target when looking for builds... and use the ipodvideo target for themes
00:43:31	bluebrother	belak: ok, but that is likely to break other things :)
00:43:42	belak	bluebrother: like what?
00:43:43	bluebrother	but if it's sufficient enough for your use case, fine
00:44:23	bluebrother	voicefile creation for builds that don't include the voice strings (and Rockbox Utility up to 1.2.14)
00:44:28	belak	I guess it would also change the voicefiles url... but those should also work fine...
00:44:41	bluebrother	no, not the url. The genlang stuff
00:44:47	belak	genlang?
00:44:57	gevaerts	belak: doesn't sound like a very useful workaround in official builds. The issue is not that it's hard to make the theme site handle the classic (that's a five minute job), it's that it's not clear "unusable" targets should be there, and as far as I can remember (which could easily be wrong) no developer has asked for the classic to be added
00:45:00	bluebrother	the script on the server that retrieves the string to speak
00:45:21	belak	Ah
00:45:32	gevaerts	I would definitely not bet on classic and video voice files to be compatible
00:45:57	belak	What's the diff between the voice files?
00:46:46	belak	gevaerts: also, looks like there are some Unusable builds in rbutil
00:46:53	gevaerts	They only contain voice strings that are used for the target, so the string ids are different if those sets aren't the same
00:47:20	bluebrother	voicefiles also contain the target id.
00:47:29	bluebrother	if it doesn't match Rockbox doesn't load the voicefile
00:47:37	belak	Ahhh
00:47:39	belak	Ok
00:47:47	bluebrother	so even if the strings would be the same you can't load a classic voicefile on a video
00:47:49	gevaerts	belak: which ones?
00:48:01	belak	gevaerts: Sansa m200
00:48:22	bluebrother	belak: yes, as disabled build
00:48:25	gevaerts	Right. That's the AMS sansa m200 I guess
00:48:26	belak	And all the onda ones
00:48:28	bluebrother	that means it normally doesn't show up
00:49:05	bluebrother	which is the way to allow using Rockbox Utility for installing, but only if the user explicitly tells it to enable support for those
00:49:24	bluebrother	just because it's in rbutil.ini doesn't mean normal users will see it :)
00:49:26	belak	bluebrother: yeah, I know... he just mentiones it wasn't clear if unusable builds should even be in rbutil...
00:49:39	gevaerts	belak: no, on the theme site
00:49:55	belak	Ahhh
00:49:58	belak	I misunderstood
00:50:04	gevaerts	You need the entire chain
00:50:08	bluebrother	the point is in places where users normally see it
00:50:33	gevaerts	Anyway, feel free to start a discussion on the -dev mailing list about the theme site and the classic. If you can get a consensus to add it, I'll gladly do the necessary work
00:51:07	belak	bluebrother: and you said you'd be willing to add the classic to rbutil.ini?
00:51:21		Quit domonoky (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
00:51:28	bluebrother	belak: yes, as disabled target
00:51:37	gevaerts	Given that we have several unstable targets on there and that the thing that keeps the classic out of unstable isn't really relevant to themes at all, I'd say you should be able to manage that :)
00:51:42	bluebrother	which means you can use it _if_ you explicitly enable those targets
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00:52:07	bluebrother	but not as normally enabled one
00:52:19	belak	Well, it's still just a checkbox away
00:52:30	belak	I'll look into the mailing list
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00:53:39	bluebrother	plus a warning when enabling it
00:53:58	bluebrother	we could also disable that functionality for releases, but it doesn't hurt either.
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00:54:21	bluebrother	having to click a checkbox and a warning should be enough for users to not expect too much for those :)
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01:29:46	[Saint]	Its a troubling one, if the Classic is added to RBUtil, users will expect to install Rockbox using it.
01:30:03	[Saint]	Upgrades are fine, but, there's no way it could handle an initial installation.
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01:30:31	belak	[Saint]: what would have to be changed for it to handle an initial install?
01:31:22	[Saint]	firstly, it needs a bootloader, and secondly, ipodpatcher needs to be modified to include it.
01:31:31	[Saint]	The latter is fairly trivial, the former, not so much.
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01:31:54	amayer	what does "Admin work needed" mean on the themes website?
01:32:06		Quit TheSphinX^ (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
01:32:08	[Saint]	Exactly what it sounds like.
01:32:15	scorche\|sh	pay no mind to the man behind the curtain...
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01:32:24	[Saint]	Someone has requested an admin look into something.
01:32:24	amayer	well what type of admin work?
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01:32:38	[Saint]	Be it a theme with issues, a copyright violation, etc.
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01:33:06	amayer	oh. that doesnt mean you are looking for someone to help admin the website?
01:33:15	[Saint]	Nope.
01:33:21	amayer	ok. wasnt sure
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02:02:56	[Saint]	Hummmm....does the clip+ not boost/un-boost the CPU?
02:12:13	saratoga	[Saint]: it doesn't
02:12:33	saratoga	i was thinking about working on that the other day
02:12:37	[Saint]	Is there a particular reason for this?
02:12:49	saratoga	we tried and it didn't help power use much IIRC
02:12:58	[Saint]	Ah, right. Thanks.
02:13:10	saratoga	but we just changed the main CPU clock, was thinking it might make more sense to change the P clock tho
02:13:21	saratoga	seemed like raising that made things a lot faster and hurt battery life quite a bit
02:13:33	saratoga	so i tried testing the other day with a much lower clock and that also hurt battery life
02:13:40	[Saint]	I just didn't know if it was something that could be enabled but just wasn't due to a bug/instability/other, or it it wasn't known how to scale the CPU.
02:13:48	[Saint]	Thanks for the explanation.
02:13:49	saratoga	so i guess i need to test more settings and see if maybe bouncing back and forth between two pclks would work
02:14:54	[Saint]	Its actually quite cool that the Clip+ gets as much battery life as it does with Rockbox considering there's no scaling going on.
02:16:54	saratoga	i think at the moment the reason the fuzev2 doesn't have as good batteyr life is that we run the PCLK faster so that the UI is responsive
02:17:23	saratoga	i think with the GUI boost stuff in it'd make sense to try boosting pclk rather then keep it high always
02:18:08	CIA-47	Commit 41fb990 in rockbox by Jonathan Gordon: Fix the classic_statusbar sbs' to actually work
02:20:32	saratoga	[Saint]: ah here it is FS #11297
02:20:34	fs-bluebot	http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/11297 as3525v2: set_cpu_frequency (patches, assigned)
02:21:10	[Saint]	Oh, thanks saratoga
02:23:48	[Saint]	Hmmmm....it doesn't want to load :-S
02:24:24	saratoga	its very slow today
02:24:46	[Saint]	yes, seems so. Turning off adblock plus seems to have helped.
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02:25:40	saratoga	basically we don't really understand what the relationship between the various clocks is
02:26:03	saratoga	although from my testing 20 MHz and 40 MHz are somewhat worse then 24MHz PCLK
02:26:08	saratoga	sorry 16 MHz
02:26:13	saratoga	i need to test 20 mHz next
02:26:33	saratoga	then i want to test lower main CPU clock and maybe play with voltages
02:31:05	JdGordon	gevaerts: you still up?
02:31:11	JdGordon	looks like the build server needs a kick
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09:03:01	CIA-47	Commit 3214849 in rockbox by Bertrik Sikken: (Author: Enric Morales) FS #12707 - [PATCH] Last missing strings in Catalan translation
09:16:46	JdGordon	wodz: bflt?
09:18:11	wodz	yeah - the format with relocations so we can load plugins at arbitrary address
09:19:40	wodz	this potentially can be used to 1) multiple plugins at the same time 2) use buflib to allocate plugin buf at runtime which will remove artificial limit on plugin size for example
09:20:00	JdGordon	cool
09:20:34	wodz	finally maybe we could split our codebase and load needed functionality at runtime when needed
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09:49:00	gevaerts	JdGordon: I can't kick buildservers
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10:08:48	davo	you guys know of any way to force battery consumption on devices when there is no access to the interface?
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10:52:26	wodz	Torne: ping
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11:03:33	kugel	wodz: how did you solve the header problem?
11:04:17	wodz	kugel: what you mean?
11:06:07	kugel	you had problems with the rb and entry point pointers in the plugin header didnt you?
11:06:47	wodz	ah no, I simply missed the fact that relocation entries are not sorted
11:07:03	wodz	well I mean it works ok
11:07:41	kugel	okay
11:07:55	kugel	wodz: can you show some code?
11:07:58	kugel	I'm curious
11:08:21	wodz	I need to clean it up. Maybe later today if I find time
11:08:33	kugel	okay
11:08:55	kugel	did you change the load_code api?
11:09:28	wodz	I added new function to load bflt file
11:10:02	wodz	Some plugins don't want to exit and I need to find out why
11:12:10	wodz	interestingly long play shuts down dap cleanly in this state
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11:28:57	kugel	wodz: some plugins call exit() which longjmps back to plugin__start()
11:29:33	kugel	and many of them do in their mainloop which also allows the core to see the long press to shutdown
11:29:53	kugel	(see exit_on_ubs())
11:29:56	kugel	usb*
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11:42:11	wodz	ok cube uses explicit exit() and works, logo uses return PLUGIN_OK and doesn't exit properly
11:49:43	kugel	strange
11:51:06	kugel	wodz: does it crash or does it nothing at all?
11:51:30	wodz	nothing at all - plugin simply runs as usuall
11:53:11	Torne	wodz: hi ;)
11:54:00	wodz	Torne: look in logs - maybe you will have a clue whats wrong
11:54:16	Torne	with exiting?
11:54:19	wodz	yep
11:54:24	Torne	i dunno, post the code :)
11:54:46	Torne	the things that use the exit() emulation work, but not the things that just return from their main?
11:55:00	Torne	that seems bizarre because those both exit the same way ultimately :p
11:55:01	wodz	yes seems to
11:55:09	Torne	since the exit emulation works by longjumping back to main and then returning
11:56:48	wodz	my tests were very limited - cube works, logo, mosaique and snow does not exit
11:57:00	Torne	well, show your work :)
11:57:08	wodz	rockblox hangs on start
11:57:13	Torne	presumably the way you get to plugin_start is different
11:57:20	Torne	so, the difference is the important bit :0
11:57:37	wodz	I'll post the code when I get home and clean it a little bit
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12:58:07	hype	is there something wrong with latest rock box utility? every time I try to patch a original firmware it crashes...
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13:09:12	PwnsomeWin	hello
13:10:33	wodz	hype: could you give more details?
13:11:23	PwnsomeWin	wodz, were you the one i was talking about TTS yesterday?
13:11:45	wodz	yes
13:11:55	PwnsomeWin	ah ok
13:12:22	PwnsomeWin	i took the source from the espeak, whats the next step?
13:12:32	wodz	port it?
13:12:42	PwnsomeWin	oh okay
13:12:49	PwnsomeWin	>_>
13:12:54	hype	wodz When i updated to latest 1.2.14 and tried to install rock box bootloader it started to patch the original firmware, then suddenly crashed
13:13:17	hype	wodz but I tried 1.2.13 and it worked as usual...
13:13:45	hype	using mac os x 10.7.4
13:13:51	wodz	hype: player type is the missing bit as different players use different patching functions
13:14:04	hype	sansa fuze+
13:15:40	wodz	hype: pamaury is the guy behind f+ port - try to catch him
13:16:32	hype	wodz Ok but i got it worked with 1.2.13 version...
13:16:49	gevaerts	There's a known bug with 1.2.14 and the fuze+, yes
13:16:54	wodz	there were some changes in imx tools
13:18:50	PwnsomeWin	wodz, which langauge does rockbox take?
13:19:29	wodz	C
13:19:32	hype	Ok I stick to 1.2.13 until bugs fixed
13:19:39	PwnsomeWin	okay
13:19:44	PwnsomeWin	eSpeak is c++
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13:20:44	PwnsomeWin	does rockbox have some different display method?
13:20:51	wodz	it is not
13:20:59	PwnsomeWin	eSpeak isn't c++?
13:21:26	wodz	there is some c++ish syntax left but you can compile it as pure C with little effort
13:22:05	PwnsomeWin	wait, was i supposed to use that src from the link you gave me yesterday?
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13:26:21	wodz	PwnsomeWin: no it was just for reference. You should port recent version of espeak in a way it be maintainable
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13:26:39	PwnsomeWin	oh okay
13:29:33	pamaury	hype: I think there was a bug in the latest rbutil released. I thought bluebrother had re-released the fixed version, or that's a new bug
13:29:50	pamaury	bluebrother: can you confirm ?
13:34:29	PwnsomeWin	what is plugin.h? is it a header file for rockbox?
13:34:49	pamaury	PwnsomeWin: yes, in apps/
13:34:55	PwnsomeWin	okay
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13:40:07	PwnsomeWin	#elif CONFIG_KEYPAD == IAUDIO_X5M5_PAD is there a list of variables for the mp3 players?
13:41:31	wodz	PwnsomeWin: yes in various places unfortunately. Most are in config.h and in export/config/*.h files
13:42:39	PwnsomeWin	okay
13:42:53	PwnsomeWin	where is config.h?
13:42:57	PwnsomeWin	is that in the rockbox source?
13:44:06	wodz	yes
13:44:45	PwnsomeWin	i should probably download that, shouldnt i
13:44:47	PwnsomeWin	>_>
13:45:12	PwnsomeWin	i have no idea why i havent yet
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14:19:56	hype	pamaury ok… I wait for the fixed one then...
14:20:15	pamaury	just use the older one or use the git version
14:20:40	pamaury	it just happened that we didn't test the released version and fixed it just after the released
14:20:43	pamaury	*release
14:21:21		Quit [Saint_] (Remote host closed the connection)
14:21:41	pamaury	or ask bluebrother if can provide you a windows version, I think he wanted to upload the fixed one
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16:12:32	PwnsomeWin	how do i download the rockbox src from git?
16:14:28	gevaerts	http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/UsingGit
16:16:08	PwnsomeWin	i used that, and i got as far as opening git
16:16:34	PwnsomeWin	i dont know where to go to type in the git clone thing
16:16:53	PwnsomeWin	waite
16:16:58	PwnsomeWin	nvm got it
16:16:59	PwnsomeWin	=P
16:19:17	PwnsomeWin	i keep getting an error
16:19:45	PwnsomeWin	Clone failed. Cannot fetch branches and objects. See console output for details.
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16:21:12	PwnsomeWin	anybody know why im getting that error?
16:21:48	wodz	where you typed this commands if you are adviced to look at console?
16:22:08	PwnsomeWin	huh?
16:23:46	PwnsomeWin	im confused at what you asked
16:24:28	wodz	where you typed this commands?
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16:25:30	PwnsomeWin	i went to clone existing repository and typed it in
16:25:36	PwnsomeWin	next to source locationg
16:26:38	wodz	do you know what is console?
16:26:50	Torne	PwnsomeWin: it sounds like you are using a graphical git client
16:26:57	PwnsomeWin	yea, im using a gui
16:27:00	Torne	the things to type there are console commands
16:27:10	Torne	so, if you're pasting one of those into a GUI client it's not going to work :)
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16:27:59	PwnsomeWin	frikkin browser likes sending me back a page when i press backspace
16:28:01	PwnsomeWin	ok
16:28:10	PwnsomeWin	do i type it in cmd?
16:28:27	PwnsomeWin	no, that doesnt really make sense
16:28:31	Torne	you can use a GUI client if you want
16:28:39	Torne	you just need to put the right things in :)
16:28:43	PwnsomeWin	ok
16:28:50	PwnsomeWin	what are the right things
16:28:52	PwnsomeWin	=P
16:28:58	Torne	what is it asking for?
16:29:00	Torne	and what did you already try?
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16:29:38	PwnsomeWin	i dont know anything about git, so im confused
16:29:38	PwnsomeWin	=P
16:29:54	Torne	surely you know how to read the text on your own screen, though
16:30:00	PwnsomeWin	well yeah
16:30:04	Torne	you want to clone our repository. it sounds like you found how to clone a repository with this client already
16:30:07	Torne	so, what does it ask for?
16:30:12	Torne	and what did you type that didn't work last time?
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16:30:27	PwnsomeWin	its asking for a source location, and a target directory
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16:30:57	PwnsomeWin	i put git clone git://git.rockbox.org/rockbox in the source and i put in an unmade rockbox folder in the target
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16:31:32	Torne	"git clone" is the command to run on the command line
16:31:38	Torne	it wants to know the URL to clone fron
16:31:44	PwnsomeWin	hhh
16:31:46	PwnsomeWin	ohhh*
16:31:53	PwnsomeWin	so i delete the git clone part?
16:38:45	PwnsomeWin	i delete that part?
16:40:53	Torne	i presume you knoww hat a URL looks like
16:47:01	wodz	do we explicitly preprocess lds scripts?
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16:49:56	wodz	hmm we do
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16:52:11	pamaury	wodz: yes
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17:00:07	PwnsomeWin	okay i got the source
17:00:16	PwnsomeWin	where are the mp3 player variables?
17:00:27	Torne	er
17:00:29	Torne	what do you mean?
17:02:24	PwnsomeWin	lemme get an example
17:02:33	PwnsomeWin	#elif CONFIG_KEYPAD == IAUDIO_X5M5_PAD
17:02:43	PwnsomeWin	the IAUDIO variable is an example of what im talking about
17:02:59	Torne	you mean the configuration
17:03:05	Torne	those are, in fact, the opposite of variables :)
17:03:11	Torne	since they are all compile time constants
17:03:31	Torne	firmware/export/config.h and firmware/export/config/playername.h
17:03:49	PwnsomeWin	oh lol
17:03:56	PwnsomeWin	ok
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17:17:49	wodz	ehh, elf2flt started to segfault :/
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18:22:01	bluebrother	hype, pamaury: the bug _is_ fixed. There just hasn't been a new release yet. You can use a development binary in the meanwhile.
18:22:24	bluebrother	I unfrequently put development binaries online. See http://tinyurl.com/rbutil-dev
18:22:47	bluebrother	(btw, this error has already been discussed in the forums. Usually a good place to search :)
18:31:07	CIA-47	Commit 46a57b8 in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Make Info widget update independent from tab index.
18:31:07	CIA-47	Commit 8cc46fb in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Add Ipod Classic (6G) as disabled target.
18:31:08	CIA-47	Commit 362f447 in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Create dedicated backup dialog.
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18:48:37	wodz	SEC_ALLOC flag is set for .bss section how do I make this flag set also for .ibss ?
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18:54:18	bluebrother	good news: I'm pretty much finished with the Rockbox Utility UI changes :)
18:54:41	bluebrother	which means I can look into the test thingy afterwards
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19:01:41	bluebrother	ok, anyone interested in a comparison? http://www.alice-dsl.net/dominik.riebeling/rockbox/rbutil-1.2.14_vs_1.3pre.jpg
19:02:42	bluebrother	the original (already 3 years old!) idea that lead to it: http://www.alice-dsl.net/dominik.riebeling/rockbox/rbutil-mainwindow-idea.jpg
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19:10:54	wodz	looks nice
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19:38:24	megal0maniac	bluebrother: Any binaries available yet?
19:38:48	megal0maniac	Really like the layout
19:39:33	bluebrother	megal0maniac: not yet, but I'm planning to push the changes tonight (after giving people a chance to discuss it a bit) and create binaries afterwards
19:40:00	bluebrother	(oh, and to avoid confusion: the left image is the new version :)
19:40:05	megal0maniac	So technically, I should be able to build it myself from git?
19:40:19	bluebrother	well, yes. After I pushed :)
19:40:21	bluebrother	so not yet
19:40:44	megal0maniac	Obviously. But yeah, 10 points to you.
19:41:31	bluebrother	:)
19:41:55	bluebrother	if that UI makes it clearer to users (which is the original idea behind it) I've reached the goal
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20:00:54	saratoga_	http://anythingbutipod.com/forum/showpost.php?p=614974&postcount=427
20:01:05	saratoga_	this post says that changing the theme breaks USB on the Clip Zip
20:01:11	saratoga_	anyone else seen that happen?
20:02:01	wodz	is it with recent build? funman fixed some theme allocation bugs not so long ago
20:03:30	bertrik	I looked casually at allocation stuff around USB, I suspected some big problem, but it actually turned out to be correct.
20:03:49	bertrik	The entire theme is unloaded upon USB plugin and loaded again upon USB plugout
20:04:09	bertrik	I think I saw some duplicate stuff, but nothing like memory holes
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20:20:31	ptrkmj	is there animated gif viewer for rockbox?
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20:22:32	wodz	no
20:22:46	wodz	I think we don't support gifs at all
20:24:26	saratoga_	wodz: yes that build is from yesterday IIRC
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20:26:43	saratoga_	the Zip seems to have terrible problems with USB for many people, while the Clip Plus is quite solid
20:27:02	saratoga_	i wonder if the differences in how themes are allocated on color vs. monochrome targets is responsible
20:27:12	saratoga_	since the devices are otherwise identical
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20:29:42	bluebrother	iirc there was a gif plugin in the tracker some years ago
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20:33:02	megal0maniac	I had problems with USB stability on my Clip+ even after it was deemed stable. Disagreed with the decision to put it in the stable build at the time. Haven't used it recently though.
20:34:53	saratoga_	some people had issues with Clip+ USB, but they were very few
20:35:05	saratoga_	it seems like the Zip has trouble for most people
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20:41:18	bluebrother	hmm. Is there a way to enable CF mode on a microdrive from an Ipod?
20:42:33	bluebrother	would be interesting to reuse that thing, but it doesn't work with my card reader
20:42:44	bluebrother	which, I guess, is related to this CF mode thing
20:48:38	wodz	bluebrother: I don't understand - in ipod (mini I guess) you don't need to set enything to use CF instead of microdrive
20:49:27	bluebrother	wodz: I want to do it the other way round −− use the microdrive left from the mini as CF card in a different device
20:49:57	wodz	thats tricky - microdrives don't adhere to current standards well
20:50:31	*	bluebrother just ripped a CF-to-Cardbus adapter apart
20:50:45	bluebrother	now I can plug it in. Let's see if the PC likes that :)
20:51:22	wodz	elf2flt stopped to segfault finally
20:51:40	bluebrother	you need not to put segfaults into the code! ;-)
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21:16:31	gevaerts	In the apparent absence of Swedes, I'm hosting this week's hangout.
21:17:36	wodz	whats the hangout btw?
21:17:50	gevaerts	On Google+
21:18:12	gevaerts	Some sort of video chat
21:19:34	wodz	My work mate asked me why we don't have 'official' rockbox dap which one may buy. Not to get rich but to populate things. Maybe something open hardware or so
21:20:40	bertrik	There have been plans for that, but anything open seems so much bulkier than something commercial you can buy
21:22:27	wodz	I disagree - it is only a matter of engineering the design - look at rPi it IS small
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21:22:53	wodz	I guess the price will be limiting though
21:22:55	bertrik	it's a bare PCB
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21:27:07	pamaury	and not all people agree on what is the perfect mp3 :)
21:28:36	saratoga	the problem is the casing and ergonomics more then anything
21:28:56	saratoga	it would probably be easy to come up with a rockbox dev board, less so to come up with something you'd want to put in your pocket
21:29:53	wodz	its not about 'perfect' its about something usable
21:30:34	wodz	saratoga: all in all its a matter of funding - professional design of small plastic case is rather cheap. Producing mold IS expensive
21:31:09	saratoga	yes expensive and also requires some engineering talent to design something that works well and can be manufactured
21:32:14	wodz	saratoga: well yes and no - current tools are quite good in helping to get correct design from technological point of view
21:32:42	wodz	the aesthetic merit needs some talent yes
21:32:48	saratoga	i mean just coming up with a plastic shell and buttons that will fit the boards, be durable enough and also look and feel good
21:35:30	wodz	The design is not that expensive I think with something like 1k eu you can get the work done. Mold is order of magnitude more expensive
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22:00
22:00:19	CIA-47	Commit 40e306b in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Make Rockbox logo smaller and move device information up.
22:00:20	CIA-47	Commit f419128 in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Show player picture left of device configuration.
22:00:22	CIA-47	Commit fa17cb9 in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Rework Installation and remove Quick Start tab.
22:00:25	CIA-47	Commit 9b783bc in rockbox by Dominik Riebeling: Separate select and install parts in themes install window.
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22:21:14	gevaerts	Bagder: could you have a look at the build system? It seems to be stuck
22:23:14	Bagder	ouch
22:23:22	Bagder	I'm not really sure what to do about that...
22:23:36	gevaerts	If all else fails, reboot the server :)
22:29:06	Bagder	the master process is restarted, so it might be okay
22:35:06	wodz	Torne, kugel: g#286
22:35:08	fs-bluebot	Gerrit review #286 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/286 : bFLT loader for plugins by Marcin Bukat (changes/86/286/1)
22:35:22	wodz	this is early stage though
22:37:36	gevaerts	Nice
22:41:48	CIA-47	Commit 4e4eaea in www by Björn Stenberg: (Author: Frank Gevaerts) Add latex to the toolchains, in preparation for manual autobuilding.
22:42:35		Quit benedikt93 (Quit: Bye ;))
22:43:04	*	gevaerts can't remember if ARM ever needs -fpic or -pie, and if so, when
22:43:39	*	pamaury is doing some mtp analysis and this is not fun
22:44:38	wodz	pic is used for shared libraries AFAIK
22:45:59	gevaerts	I'm sure Torne will tell us the details :)
22:47:16	wodz	I hope he will point out the errors within eye blink so all plugins will work correctly :-)
22:48:33	gevaerts	It's just that it seems to me that on an MMU system you can link executables to always run at the same address, so things like pic are only needed for libraries, but then these things tend to confuse me
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23:13:27	saratoga	new rockbox utility looks really nice
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23:54:47	PwnsomeWin	ive decided im gonna try a creative muVo v100 port
23:55:32	PwnsomeWin	i know what the cpu is, whats the next step?
23:56:41	bertrik	try to find a datasheet of the cpu / SoC, and study any firmware update image (if available)
23:56:49	PwnsomeWin	okay

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