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#rockbox log for 2012-08-06

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00:06:49wodzpamaury: ping
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00:31:23pamaurywodz: pong
00:31:44pamauryI don't have much time and I'll be back on friday only
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01:31:10amayer[Saint]: what does it mean if a theme works on the simulator but doesnt work on the target?
01:32:16[Saint]Basically nothing noteworthy.
01:33:02[Saint]The sim is /supposed/ to be a fairly accurate representation of physical hardware....but, it isn't perfect. Nothing is.
01:34:35amayerdo you have time to look over a theme?
01:34:38amayerim not sure what the problem is
01:35:12[Saint]Unfortunately for you, its not he other way around. Else the sim would give you some nice(-ish) debug output. The device can't do this (presently).
01:35:33[Saint]...though it probably should log errors to disk.
01:35:45amayerwhere does it log errors to the disk?
01:35:59[Saint]It doesn't. that's the point.
01:36:28amayerwere you guys working on that?
01:36:30amayeri remember about 3 or 4 weeks back you guys were talking about it
01:37:46[Saint]It was a far more general error logging method being talked about (that probably wouldn't be active by default anyway), which afaik didn't include the skin engine.
01:39:31[Saint]I don't have time to look at your theme right now, but I may do (probably will) in a few hours.
01:40:34amayerim going to try commenting out each line and putting it on target to see if i can figure out which line it is.
01:40:36amayerif you have time to help later that would be great
01:41:22[Saint]Regarding on-target error logging for the skin engine, in a perfect world, it shouldn't be needed...what I mean is both sim and target should error out in exactly the same fashion. Unfortunately, this isn't always the case.
01:42:17[Saint]What you have left then is basically commenting out every line/function one-by-one and checking on target. Its tedious, but it works.
01:42:40[Saint]I've hit this before myself.
01:43:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:43:53amayerit shouldnt be too long(assuming its something wrong with the sbs file, wps works fine)
01:43:55amayermy sbs is only like 20 lines.
01:44:50amayerwhat does "Error no UI Defines" mean when compiling simulator?
01:45:18amayerwait... now it moved on
01:48:09amayernow it died:
01:48:11amayer...sim-ui-defines.h:449:2: error: #error no UI defines
01:50:23amayerdoes anyone else get this error while trying to compile simulator for IpodClassic 6G?
01:52:33 Quit [Saint] (Remote host closed the connection)
01:53:26linuxstbamayer: Sounds like the sim hasn't been implemented for the Classic. Just use the 5G sim - it should be the same as far as the WPS is concerned I think.
01:53:53amayerwell i was using Video sim
01:54:17amayerbut i wasnt sure if there was something different in the theme engine for the 6G
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01:59:50*[Saint] thinks JdGordon should probably weigh in on solutions for what to do when themes fail on target but not the sim.
02:00
02:01:02[Saint]On-target error logging would be nice, but the ideal solution (IMO) is to figure out why each behaves differently.
02:02:02JdGordonhrm?
02:02:16JdGordonon target error logging is "coming"
02:02:50JdGordonis saratogas logging in git yet?
02:03:01[Saint]Oh? For some reason I thought it was just for codec/playback.
02:03:12JdGordonit will be used for whatever we want
02:03:24[Saint]Ah. Nice.
02:04:46JdGordonjust to be pedantic...
02:04:48JdGordon09:33 <[Saint]> The sim is /supposed/ to be a fairly accurate representation of physical hardware....but, it isn't perfect. Nothing is.
02:04:56JdGordon<- no, the sim is a simulator NOT emulator
02:05:37[Saint]that's why I said 'fairly accurate' and not exact.
02:05:58[Saint]Skins /should/ behave the same on either.
02:06:19JdGordonyes, they should :/
02:06:31JdGordonhmm.. how much ram does the 6g have? 32+ right?
02:06:48[Saint]32 iirc
02:06:58JdGordonamayer: can you email me the theme zip please? rockbox at jdgordon dot info
02:07:30[Saint]I must say I've not looked at amayer's theme yet, but no matter what's wrong or not, in a perfect/ideal world sim/target should behave the same.
02:07:43JdGordonthats why i want to look at it :)
02:07:57[Saint]Well, in this regard at least.
02:13:35 Quit bertrik (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
02:17:35 Quit mgottschlag (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
02:18:27amayeri think 6G has 64Mb
02:18:39amayerjdGordon im zipping it now
02:23:03JdGordonok, recvd...
02:23:10JdGordonhopefully it fails to load on my video :)
02:23:22amayer*crosses fingers*
02:28:45JdGordonyep, sbs doesnt load
02:29:04amayerid does on the video simulator
02:30:02[Saint]that's messed up.
02:30:29amayeryup
02:30:29JdGordonno it doesnt :)
02:30:37JdGordonUnable to load font 2: '14-Adobe-Helvetica-Bold.fnt.fnt'
02:31:27amayerwhere did you get that error output?
02:31:45[Saint]Heh, double extension fail.
02:31:49JdGordonhmm, what is it supposed to look like?
02:32:38amayeri checked the theme file it only has it in there once
02:32:53JdGordonerr what? the %Fl() requirs the .fnt
02:32:54amayerfrom sbs:
02:32:56amayer%Fl(2,14-Adobe-Helvetica-Bold.fnt)
02:33:00JdGordonso why it it doable searching?
02:33:31JdGordonhehe ok, broken error message
02:34:47JdGordonok, sbs loads now
02:34:53JdGordondoes that font exist on target?
02:35:27amayerit does now and it works
02:35:37CIA-39Commit 7c31ff2 in rockbox by 03Jonathan Gordon: Fix skin engine error message
02:35:51amayeri thought i was using 15-Adobe not 14-Adobe
02:35:59amayeri didnt know they both existed
02:36:45JdGordonsbs loads on target for me once i put all the fontzip on it
02:37:39amayeri added the font to my DAP and it works now.
02:37:41amayerwhere did you get the error message from tho?
02:37:43amayer(being a programmer i apreciate feedback)
02:37:59JdGordonthe sim
02:38:19JdGordononly because i didnt have the fonts installed in my sim build
02:38:22amayeroh my sim preloaded the fonts so i didnt know
02:38:33*JdGordon really needs to fix the error reporting
02:38:37CIA-397c31ff2 build result: All green
02:38:53[Saint]I thought you did?
02:40:58amayeris someone working on error reporting for the theme engine?
02:41:14JdGordonno
02:42:09JdGordong#288 needs to be merged
02:42:11fs-bluebot3Gerrit review #288 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/288 : Introduce logging to disk feature into rockbox. by Michael Giacomelli (changes/88/288/8)
02:43:31amayerso you have a seperate branch for error logging?
02:43:34amayeror did nobody start working on error logging to disk?
02:52:46[Saint]See above.
02:52:58JdGordonno, i havnt started the work at all yet, too busy moving apartments
02:53:15JdGordonit is a relativly simple fix though if you want to get involved? :) (wink wink)(
02:59:51[Saint]Hmmmm...partial fix perhaps. Could RbUtil prompt the user to download the font pack if font(s) x/y/z are referenced in the theme(s)?
03:00
03:00:46*[Saint] never much liked this failing to load if a font isn't found business.
03:06:46JdGordonrbtuil should do the fnots in the minimal install :/
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03:28:05amayerJdGordon: i would like to get involved.
03:28:07amayerdo we already have an "error_to_file(str err)" function?
03:33:39JdGordonamayer: grab that gerrit patch i linked above and replace all the DEBUGF and ERRORF() in apps/gui/skin_engine/* with it :)
03:34:25amayer...right.
03:34:28amayerim not sure how to do that.(just getting started with git)
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03:43:28***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:47:41amayerJdGordon:
03:47:43amayerdo i have to download another branch or something?
03:47:59JdGordonhave you done the initial git clone?
03:48:05amayeryes
03:48:12amayerthats how i built the simulator
03:48:44JdGordonok, so then open the link above and under "Patchset 8" there is a command in DOWNLOAD
03:48:54JdGordonrun that and it will get that patch
03:49:08JdGordonthen do a "git checkout -b your_branch_name" and start working
03:50:15amayershould i backup the directory of the original clone first?
03:50:17amayeri usually work on solo projects(sorry if i seem like a noob)
03:50:38JdGordonno, this is what git branches are for
03:50:56JdGordongit checkout <branch name> will get your changes
03:51:07JdGordonthen you can commit to it and swithc back to what you were wroking on before
03:51:20amayerso what branch name should i use?
03:51:52amayerand how do i switch back to the original clone?
03:52:16amayeri think i should read gitref before i start messing with this
03:53:09amayeri know c and ive been programing for ~7 years(not all in c) but im having some trouble wrapping my head around this git thing... its probably easier then im making it
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04:35:50amayerJdGordon: well im going to read the gitref then I will start working on the skin engine error logger.
04:35:53amayerfor now tho. i am trying this thing my GF has been talking about. sleep.
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10:10:21wodzwhich targets have system timer dependend on cpu freq? Coldfires for sure. Anything else?
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14:10:17preglowwodz: most of them do
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14:47:24wodzpreglow: So why only on coldfires we bother to change timer setup during speed change?
14:53:39preglowprobably has to do with pre/post scaler placement
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15:01:01wodz?
15:01:31wodzI was thinking this is due to 'up to 10ms for PLL lock' thing
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15:02:12DrTeethjust had bug report FS #12724 canceeled as it was a dupe, BUT the chap that cancelled it did not say what it was a dup of as he should have done as per http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/FlySpray
15:02:12fs-bluebothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12724 3Sansa Clip Zip USB error (bugs, closed)
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17:02:32bertrikfreqmod, how about removing the unused files from opus (like files only used for encoding)?
17:03:18bertrikI was also thinking of writing a simple kind of import script that copies relevant files from upstream
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18:45:12freqmodbertrik: thats a good idea
18:45:24bertrikalready on it :)
18:45:31bertrikalready on it :)
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20:24:55wodzmortalis: (logs) can you try g305 on hifiman? It would be lovely if you could do battery_bench with and without
20:24:57fs-bluebot3Gerrit review #305 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/305 : rk27xx: implement frequency scalling by Marcin Bukat (changes/05/305/1)
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21:05:59saratogai'll probably push the error logging patch shortly
21:06:23saratogai'm going to enable it for all device builds, but not for application or bootloaders
21:06:38saratogahttp://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/#/c/288/
21:06:43saratogaif nayone has feedback before i do
21:12:36wodzgo for it
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21:17:51amayersaratoga: if you need help with that i was talking to JdGordon about helping with it. i just have no idea how to use git.
21:17:53amayeri followed the directions and have the initial clone set up. but idk how to get the code for that node.
21:17:55amayeri am reading gitref.org tho. so maybe by tonight i could help if you needed/wanted it
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21:22:03wodzamayer: If you want to work on that, the first thing to do is to provide debug output in the sim (or more detailed output from checkwps - I don't care)
21:23:03saratogaamayer: you can just download the patch if you're not familiar with git
21:23:19saratogaregardless, i'm just asking for feedback on the code
21:23:58amayeroh ok.
21:24:00amayerim looking for something kinda easy to get my feet wet and JdGordon recomended that
21:25:55saratogawell its simple code for logging errors and warnings
21:26:09saratogaso you can play with it if you want, but its probably more interesting if you have some code you're trying to debug
21:27:45amayerim game for whatever(after i learn git) but i like making themes so this hit close to home because it would be really useful
21:28:15amayeri dont mind who does it as long as the functionality is there. thats one of the reasons i offered to help.
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21:32:14wodzamayer: The bug in debug output from skin engine I am aware of is that it doesn't report viewports out of bounds BUT simply stop parsing further
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21:40:52amayerwodz: *confused*
21:41:14amayerwouldnt that be part of the error logging system that saratoga is working on?
21:42:03saratogathe stuff i'm working on just provides a mechanism for logging
21:42:06saratoganothing actually uses it yet
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21:46:22saratogasee g#292 for example
21:46:24fs-bluebot3Gerrit review #292 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/292 : Introduce new logging system to codeclib. by Michael Giacomelli (changes/92/292/4)
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22:03:02amayeroh. so your working on making a logging system.
22:03:05amayernot acutally putting code in that logs the errors.
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22:04:21bertrikThere was already a logging system, it just didn't log to disk
22:04:49TheDarkPiratepeople, is it normal that when I turn on my iPod Classic 120G, the rockbox starts processing "something" (I don't know what could it be), and it's so slow that for a while I can't even connect it to my computer because it hangs?
22:05:09bertrikWith the patch, we log in memory until disk is accessed anyway and then flush the cached logs to disk too
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22:10:43amayerTheDarkPirate: the ipod has to boot before it can be connected to the computer
22:11:16TheDarkPirateyes, I don't mean the boot, I mean when rockbox loads
22:11:31TheDarkPirateI can listen to music, but can't connect to the computer
22:12:12amayerthat dosent sound good.
22:12:14amayeri also have an ipodclassic 120gb. ive never experienced that. are you using the most recent dev build?
22:12:31TheDarkPiratelet me explain a little better
22:12:51TheDarkPirateif I wait some minutes, I can do it
22:13:22TheDarkPiratebut when I just installed it, and proved it with a few songs, it didn't happen
22:13:28gevaertsCould be a dircache or database scan
22:13:44TheDarkPirateso, I don't know if it is something normal or not
22:13:52gevaertsI'd start by checking the filesystem
22:13:58TheDarkPirateyes, that's what I think, but I'm not sure
22:14:11TheDarkPiratemmm, ok
22:14:14TheDarkPirateI'll do that
22:14:16TheDarkPiratethanks
22:14:16amayerthe database thing might be it.
22:14:16TheDarkPirate!
22:14:19amayeri have auto update disabled for database.
22:14:38TheDarkPirateI think I have it disabled too
22:16:09amayermy disk spins for about 10 sec after boot. but in that 10 sec i can connect it to a computer or play music.
22:16:12amayeri think its just dircache or buffering the currently playing/paused song info mem(not sure if rockbox does that)
22:16:57gevaertsIt does, but not before you press play
22:17:13gevaerts(unless you have your start screen set to wps)
22:17:55TheDarkPirateI have it set to the main menu
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22:34:51wagnerfhi, i'm new to rockbox and i'm writing a new plugin for my sansa clip +
22:35:23wagnerfon my pc, the plugin works fine but when loaded on the clip+ it gets stuck in a recursive function
22:35:48wagnerfis there a limit to recursion and how can I know if it is exceeded ?
22:36:02wagnerfwhat's more, what is the best way to log what is happening ?
22:36:30wagnerfI somehow do my debuging with rb->splash but it's not very convenient
22:37:04gevaertsYou only get a few kilobytes of stack
22:37:13gevaertsSo yes, recursion is to be avoided
22:37:39wagnerfok
22:38:35wagnerfdo you also know what is the amount of RAM I have ?
22:38:45wagnerfI tried to find this information but with no success
22:39:03wagnerfI hope it is at least a few megabytes
22:39:12gevaertsDepends
22:40:34wagnerfany hint for the best way to debug ?
22:40:39gevaertsYou get 512K in the plugin buffer. If you stop playback, you can get the audio buffer too, which will be five or six megabytes on the clip+ I guess
22:41:19wagnerfwow, I guess I'll start counting my bytes right now
22:41:34gevaertsThere's 8MB RAM in total in there
22:41:42[Saint]Some targets are more highly restricted, too.
22:42:16[Saint]And in general its best practice for a plugin to run on as many targets as possible.
22:43:00gevaerts[Saint]: sure, but if 8MB targets are a problem already, I'd say 2MB targets are hopeless
22:43:03[Saint]Assuming the idea us to commit the resulting plugin?
22:43:29wagnerfyes, I hope I can still make something useful from my holidays :)
22:43:29[Saint]gevaerts: depends on why its a problem.
22:43:51wagnerfI guess, I can somehow parametrize the consumption with macros
22:44:34[Saint]If its a problem /after/ sane coding practice, sure. If you're trying to save massive arrays to RAM when there's other options...notsomuch :)
22:44:40wagnerfthe 512k for the plugin buffer, is it for both code and data ?
22:44:51wagnerfhow can I know if I am too big ?
22:44:54gevaertsThat's code and data
22:44:58gevaertsIt won't link :)
22:45:04[Saint]Haha.
22:45:16wagnerfok that's good
22:46:58wagnerfdoes it mean the resulting .rock file should be under 512k ?
22:47:06wagnerfcurrently it sits here at 513k
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22:48:06gevaertsFor a target build?
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22:48:44wagnerfno, you're right
22:48:54wagnerftarget build is only 27k
22:49:14wagnerfok, that's good
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22:49:50wagnerfthanks for the hints, I got a better picture of my constraints
22:49:55gevaertsThe size of the file isn't the only indication. bss isn't in the file
22:50:13wagnerfyes of course
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22:51:59gevaertsFor non-static allocations, have a look at plugin_get_buffer() to get the remaining bits of the plugin buffer, and plugin_get_audio_buffer() to get the audio buffer (which will stop playback)
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22:53:09wagnerfok, i have a custom malloc function for now but I guess plugin_get_buffer seems more clean
22:53:37wodzmalloc from which pool? big static array?
22:54:16wagnerfI have different arrays for the different types of structures I allocate, each with a different size
22:54:28wagnerfbut yes, its different big static arrays
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22:55:32wodzplugin_get_buffer() will make no difference then as globals and statics sits in plugin buff already
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22:57:14wagnerfwell, I don't know exactly how the plugin_get_buffer works but if it can work like a malloc/free that would still be better for me because i'm not sure of the max size I should give to each of my arrays
22:57:42gevaertsIt doesn't. It just gives you the unallocated chunk
22:58:16wodzplugin_get_buffer() returns the pointer to unallocated pool within pluginbuf
22:58:30wagnerfok, well, i'll stuck with my arrays then
22:58:49wagnerfthat's somehow again and i'm proud of my code
22:58:50wagnerf:)
22:59:18gevaertsIf you need malloc, you can try tlsf (check out some other plugins to see how), but remember, we don't use an MMU, so you'll get fragmentation
22:59:48wodzgevaerts: AFAIK tlsf is not exported to plugins.
23:00
23:00:51gevaertsAt least mikmod uses it
23:01:03gevaertsIt links its own copy though
23:01:09gevaerts(I think(
23:02:14saratogaare plugins on the clip+ really 512kb?
23:02:39saratogasince codecs are smaller, i assumed we made the plugin buffer smaller too
23:03:10gevaertssaratoga: that's what config/sansaclipplus.h says
23:03:14saratogaah ok
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23:03:43wagnerfthanks all for your help. I need to go now, but i'll drop by again eventually
23:03:47wagnerfsee you
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23:25:37amiconnwodz, preglow: PP for instance does not (and neither does SH1, because cpuclk is not variable there)
23:27:23 Quit madorangepanda (Quit: Page closed)
23:28:00wodzamiconn: what is the primary reason for 'complicated' scheme of freq change on coldfires? pll lock time?
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23:34:52funmansaratoga: i think one or two plugins need a lot of room, while the rest could easily do with half that size
23:40:27gevaertsReducing the plugin buffer would make things like the text viewer need to stop playback sooner
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23:46:40funmanalso doom
23:50:13funmanhttp://pastie.org/4402182
23:51:19funmani used cmp-plugins-size.py
23:52:19gevaertsDoom needs to stop playback anyway
23:53:17gevaertsI mean, with a 512K plugin buffer, you can read most books while listening to music. Reduce it to 128K and you're stuck with 40 page booklets
23:54:34gevaertsThat doesn't mean we have to stay at 512K forever, but reducing it isn't a clear-cut advantage
23:57:34funmani wonder if making it higher has any incidence on battery life

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