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#rockbox log for 2013-05-30

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04:47:55amayerare .rfms valid theme files? ive seen .rwps and .rsbs and the wiki doesnt mention .rfms
05:00
05:01:10JdGordonyes
05:01:19JdGordonradio fms
05:38:56amayerJdGordon, thanks
05:41:34amayerwe only allow the theme zips to have 1 .rockbox/themes/*.cfg file right?
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09:36:18fs-bluebotBuild Server message: 3New build round started. Revision 5a1e697, 217 builds, 19 clients.
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09:44:29fs-bluebotBuild Server message: 3Build round completed after 492 seconds.
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10:26:24kugeljhMikeS: ping
10:27:56jhMikeSyes?
10:29:03kugelI can't make sense of of talk.c:restore_state()
10:30:10kugelwhy does it call a audio_get_buffer() twice with different talk_buf parameters?
10:32:38jhMikeSfirst one gets the buffer start pointer, second one promotes it to voiced only
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10:33:29jhMikeSit's hacky, sure
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10:51:11kugeljhMikeS: could the voice buf be detached from playback.c/audio buf?
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10:56:21jhMikeSit can be. I do have patches for that
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10:57:09kugeljhMikeS: I have found the cause of FS #12797; the problem is with audio_get_buffer basically
10:57:10fs-bluebothttp://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/12797 3RadioArt dataaborts with a corrupted skin buffer (bugs, new)
10:59:39kugelit would be best to get rid of audio_get_buffer() and handle demands for the full buffer via buflib
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11:01:16kugelbut doing that removes the ability to select whether to grab the voicebuf also
11:01:48 Quit stoffel (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
11:02:15jhMikeSmy patch doesn't remove that ability, it manages it, everyone becomes a user of that slack memory, asking permission to steal it from whoever has it
11:02:35jhMikeSvoice buffer is just a normal bufalloc but that's given up and included upon request
11:03:08kugelhow does that fit with the ring buffer architecture?
11:03:25jhMikeS??
11:03:53jhMikeSyou mean buffering?
11:04:13kugelyea
11:04:14jhMikeSwhen playback gives stops using it, it's free for anyone else to use
11:04:39jhMikeSs/gives//
11:05:10kugelright, but you said in your patch the voice buffer is just a normal bufalloc, i.e. a buffering handle
11:05:32jhMikeSthing I can't work out is threading w/callbacks and needs for synchronization at certain points
11:05:38jhMikeSit is
11:05:55jhMikeSthere's a shared buffer area manager
11:06:29jhMikeSeveryone gets a unique id when they get the buffer and must use that key to do further things later
11:07:02jhMikeSyou can even convert a buflib_alloc_maximum into a smaller private bufalloc
11:08:21jhMikeSthe patch has a bunch of other crud I was working out too, even basically rewriting talk.c to be more sensible
11:08:22kugelspeaking of it, I have work here that modifies buflib_alloc_maximum() to ask for all memory in the shrink_callback(), and that playback.c frees itself in the callback. this way buflib_alloc_maximum can be used as better a audio_get_buffer() alternative
11:09:01jhMikeSmy patch removes all use of playback.c as any sort of buffer manager
11:09:08kugelcan't your work be based on buflib somehow? I don't like the idea of yet another alloc/buffer manager
11:09:22jhMikeSit is, it just wraps buflib
11:09:48kugelit sounds like you wrap around bufalloc()
11:10:33jhMikeSno, just alloc_maximum
11:11:44kugeldoes it work well with my modification to it?
11:11:50jhMikeSit does talk to talk.c though if it wants the voice and talk.c just frees that
11:11:56jhMikeSwhich?
11:12:02jhMikeSthis work is old
11:12:03kugelthat I mentioned above
11:12:48jhMikeSwhat you said sounds irrelevant to it. the owner gets the shrink callback, not playback unless playback has it
11:13:45jhMikeSso, radioart.c would have its own, or whoever is using it.
11:14:22kugelhm, it sounds familiar. in my work radioart.c (which currently uses audio_get_buffer()) gets it's own shrink_callback due to calling core_alloc_maximum()
11:15:31jhMikeSI guess the main difference might be that playback gets asked, does whataever cleanup is necessary to giving up the memory area and then becomes irrelevent
11:15:40kugel(and playback.c frees its buffer in it's shrink_callback() due to the request of radioart.c's alloc_maximum())
11:16:49jhMikeSsounds similar in that way, except there are permissions involved and lockouts
11:17:18jhMikeSI don't care about simple or binsize, just making it reliable
11:17:58kugelpermissions and lockouts? :?
11:18:34jhMikeSthe buffer id cookie, which must be handed back by whoever got ownership or else the functions fail
11:18:44jhMikeSnoone can just take it
11:19:27jhMikeSit's not the handle given back by buflib
11:21:10kugelmy solution works well in my tests, radioart.c gets the full buffer after playback.c is asked, the reverse case also works fine when resuming music playback (radioart.c's shrink_callback also gives up the buffer if asked to)
11:21:20kugelmy only issue is how to handle the voicebuf
11:23:06jhMikeSI'll give you the patch. It's got other stuff I'd do separately but. It won't work as patch since it's semi-abandoned
11:23:39kugelcool
11:23:39jhMikeSI just can't fix the threading problems
11:31:52jhMikeSjhmikes.cleansoap.org/buflib-manager.patch">http://jhmikes.cleansoap.org/buflib-manager.patch <= gotta lotsa other junk :)
11:33:17kugeljhMikeS: here's mine: kugel-/rockbox/tree/radioart-fixes">https://github.com/kugel-/rockbox/tree/radioart-fixes
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11:52:41jhMikeSI suppose at the heart of it it's sort of a similar idea, well, really, it's what's needed to avoid conflicts.
11:55:11jhMikeSand talk.c was such a wreck i couldn't stop changing it :P
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13:15:05kugeljhMikeS: I have an idea how talk.c can be handled with a separate buflib alloc
13:15:38kugelthe data in it should be easily movable right?
13:18:36kugeljhMikeS: I see your patch does that too for SWCODEC. can I re-use that work or is it tied to your other buffer manager work? also why only for SWCODEC?
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13:32:41gapanhi, I'm having problems with pictureflow, or rather with deleting pictureflow. Everything worked fine with 3.11, but then I upgraded to 3.13 and pictureflow would get stuck on boot.
13:33:18gapanI deleted pictureflow.rock, but now I get a message about it missing, on every boot and the worst part is that auto-resume doesn't work now
13:35:02gapanis this a bug? is there some other way to disable pictureflow? I had never even tried it until I upgraded to 3.13 and it was forced on me
13:35:36gevaertsThat sounds wrong
13:36:01gapanyes, I thought as much
13:37:05gapanipod 5.5G 30GB, by the way
13:39:13gevaertsCan you put your config.cfg file on a pastebin?
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13:40:26gapanhere: http://pastebin.com/XJF3imp5
13:40:37gapanI see the last line: start in screen: pictureflow
13:40:46gevaertsRight
13:40:51gapanwhat should I change it to?
13:41:02gevaertsremove the line. It will go to the menu then
13:41:10gapanaha!
13:41:18gapanso no more error message!
13:41:23gevaertsIndeed
13:41:25gapanthanks!
13:41:56gevaertsI suspect you accidentally set that at some point. That's *not* the default value for that setting
13:42:04gapanI didn't
13:42:13gapanI just unzipped 3.13 over 3.11
13:42:22gapanon next boot, pictureflow started
13:42:28gapanI had no idea what it was until then
13:42:53jhMikeSkugel: I suppose SW/HW codecs could be treated more similarly but obviously voice/playback are exclusive and overlapping on HWCODEC.
13:46:32kugeljhMikeS: what about my first question?
13:47:11gevaertsgapan: I can't really imagine a way of that happening all by itself, I never heard of anyone having this before, and we get quite a few people in here who have strange behaviours due to accidentally setting something (although never pictureflow before). Allow me to just be happy that the problem is solved :)
13:47:28 Quit jhMikeS (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
13:47:55kugel:'(
13:48:38gapangevaerts: sure, I just don't see how I could have changed it, I didn't even recognize the word pictureflow before that. Anyway, I'm happy that it's solved too. And thanks again :)
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15:07:07prince-kyleTrying to run rockboxdev.sh from git master, I'm getting errors trying to build the version of binutils it needs.
15:07:16prince-kyle../../../binutils-2.20.1/bfd/doc/bfd.texinfo:326: unknown command `colophon'
15:07:40prince-kyleI get something similar mentioning cygnus.
15:08:05prince-kyleGoogling tells me this is a bug in a version of texinfo that is older than what I have.
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16:15:32amayerprince-kyle, did you look at this page (idk what your error means but this page helped me) http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/CrossCompiler
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17:06:51bertrikpamaury: the clip zip is on its way
17:06:58pamaurythanks
17:07:27pamauryif you want some device to play with, don't hesitate, I have plenty of them :)
17:07:28diginet_what is the "best" DAP to get for rockbox? in terms of SQ and compatibility?
17:08:12funmansansa clip
17:09:15diginet_v1, plus, zip?
17:13:22bertrikavoid sansa clip v1, it has a comparatively smaller amount of memory than the clip v2, plus or zip
17:13:48lebelliumand is discontinued anyways...
17:15:05diginet_so what's the best, v2, plus, or zip?
17:16:54lebelliumv2 is also discontinued
17:17:01lebelliumget a plus or zip
17:17:14lebelliumthey are the same for your criteria, there is not "best"
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17:22:50diginet_well, discontinued isn't necessarily an issue, could buy used
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17:23:19diginet_of all the rockbox compatible DAPs, which has the best SQ?
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17:23:53lebelliumyes but clip players already don't have an impressive battery life when brand-new. So better not buy a 3 years-old clip.
17:28:03gevaertsdiginet_: the old iaudios have a good reputation
17:28:14gevaertsGood luck finding them though!
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17:28:35diginet_hah, okay, one more criterion then: at least somewhat easy to find :P
17:29:48gevaertsWell, I'm perfectly happy with the way my gigabeat F60 plays 32kbps mp3 :)
17:30:02gevaertsWhich probably says my recommendations regarding SQ are useless
17:31:51copperdiginet_: some Clip+'s have CPU noise, the Fuze+ has some hiss with highly sensitive IEMs, the iPod Classic has a less than ideal output impedance of 5.5Ω but is dead silent, the iPod Video 5.5G has a slight bass roll-off
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17:32:15copperdunno about the Clip Zip
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17:57:42prince-kyleamayer: Thanks. Looking at the page, the only thing that jumped out at me was the dependencies, but I have all of them. The coliphon and cygnus errors are from what I was able to find elsewhere, bugs in texinfo 5.0, but should have been resolved. I have 5.1, which is supposed to have fixed the problem. I'm wondering if something else could be causing this somehow, but I'm not sure where to find the answer at this point.
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18:25:55Mirmy E260 is very nice but i also get a hiss at the start of an album that dissapears until a new track... but that hiss is less than noticeable... its more prevelent with FLAC files though :/
18:26:06Mirbut dat 27 hours battery life :3
18:28:34TorneMir: that sounds like you are hearing some interference from the storage system
18:28:44Tornei.e. while it's reading form the storage to buffer track data
18:29:02Tornethat's consistent with it being worse with FLAC, since flac files are bigger and so buffering happens more often
18:29:10gevaertsYes. The e200 is known for that
18:29:17Mircool
18:29:30Mirthank you... no one has explained that to me :)
18:29:43gevaertsIIRC saratoga had some ideas on possibly tuning the sd access patterns to push the noise into ultrasound
18:29:56Mirdoes that issue effect the c200 as well?
18:29:59prince-kyleWell, I guess this is what happens when I don't specifically ask Google about Rockbox issues :-P http://rockbox.haxx.se/irc/log-20130407#20:17:28 is my exact problem. I guess I need a way earlier version of texinfo to build the cross-compiler and binutils.
18:30:17Mirgevaerts: ohh that would be interesting
18:30:46*Mir roots saratoga on
18:31:06gevaertsMir: no. This is related to sd wires being close to audio wires on the PCB, which is going to depend on the actual device more than on the SoC
18:31:49gevaertsNote that it's entirely possible that saratoga found out by now that it's not feasible :)
18:32:17Mirahh
18:32:29Mirwell i found the battery life makes up for the hiss
18:32:53Mirflac and SDHC makes rockbox so worth it :3
18:32:57prince-kyleNice. For Arch Linux, I believe installing texinfo-legacy from AUR may solve my colophon and cygnus problem.
18:34:06Mirjust as a heads up the rockbox installer on opensuse 11.4 and up requires admin rights to install or update
18:35:20Tornefor certain players the installer needs root, yes, on all systems
18:35:22Tornefor other players it doesn't
18:35:33Torneit depends whether the install process for that device requires raw access to usb and/or the disk
18:36:40Miri found that with opensuse it needs root access for all that i have tried.. iriver, clip, clip+ zip, fuse fusev2 fuse+ C200 e200 gigabeat
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18:37:12Mirit needs root access similar to changing the filesystem
18:37:21Torneit's not distro-specific, and we know already, you don't need to report this
18:37:29Mirahh
18:37:39Tornein fact it should say so in the instructions :)
18:37:51Mirbut what you said was right though
18:37:59Tornefor some devices if the player was already automounted by the system (usual for desktop systems) then we can install just fine as the user
18:38:19pixelmaMir: I do hear this storage access hiss on my c200 as well, it's there in the OF too, e.g. when "updating music database" but with the exception of this a bit less noticeable
18:38:25Tornebut many devices need raw disk access which will always need root, or libusb access, which may need root on some systems
18:38:48Mirpixelma: good to know i am not alone
18:39:27gevaertsMir: if you don't mount the filesystem with user access, you'll need root for everything, yes
18:39:39Mirgevaerts: but thats the thing
18:39:43Miri have done that
18:39:53Mirit still needs root access
18:39:55gevaertsThat's not a rockbox issue though
18:40:02Mirexactly
18:40:10Mirwhich is why i mentioned it for suse
18:40:20Torneit's not an issue at all
18:40:25Miri have not had this issue on puppy, tinycore, ubuntu, arch
18:40:48Mirnope... not an issue but you never know when someone will come in complaining about it
18:40:48Torneyhou would if you tried to install on an ipod, or various other devices
18:40:49Mir:)
18:40:59Torneyou can't install on an ipod on *anything* without being root
18:41:11Tornebecause the firmware partition is not mountable and we access it via /dev/sd?
18:41:16n1sprince-kyle: g#471 should fix your issue
18:41:19fs-bluebot3Gerrit review #471 at http://gerrit.rockbox.org/r/471 : 3Fix building of sh, arm and m68k toolchains with new texinfo by Nils Wallménius (changes/71/471/1)
18:41:20*gevaerts could be pedantic here and disagree, but he's not going to :)
18:41:21Mirsadly my ipod i had that was compatable had a dead battery
18:41:58Mirand for some reason would not sync :/
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18:42:16n1sprince-kyle: if you put the patch files in the rbdev-dl (?) dir in /tmp it will find and apply them
18:42:21Mirthe only other apple products i got is an itouch and a 3rd gen nano
18:42:33n1swith that patch applied of course
18:43:09MirTorne: thanks for explaing it :)
18:43:28prince-kyleOh didn't see that one. Thanks. For now, I got texinfo-legacy installed, and it's building correctly. I can try it with the patch as well if needed. I plan to reinstall texinfo 5.1 after the build is finished.
18:51:44amayerare users allowed to put a "readme.txt" or "directions.txt" file in theme zips?
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20:32:24Mirhas the USB issue with the fuze been resolved yet?
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20:33:32funmanwhich issue exactly ?
20:35:21Mirthe one where the OFW is in use when plugged into usb
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20:40:35funmannot aware of that one
20:41:48funmanfuzev2 boots to rockbox when powered by USB since december 2011 and fuzev1 since july 2010
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20:47:22Mirodd
20:47:25Mirmine doesnt :/
20:47:31Mirrockbox 3.11
20:47:47funmanupdate the bootloader
20:48:04funmanwith latest version mkasmboot or rbutil
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20:55:04Mirsweet
20:55:38Mirfunman: i took your suggestion and updated to the lates stable... it seems to have worked :) thank you
20:55:39 Join Provel [0] (~Provel@75-132-18-44.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com)
20:56:51funmanthanks for being a so long user, you're welcome :)
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21:05:07Mirthere
21:05:32Mirall 3 C240's and two E260 are updated as well as one fuze
21:05:35Mir^-^
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22:48:23kiwicamdiginet_: I prefer the Clip+ over the Zip. The Zip is really nice and I'm sure you wouldn't be disappointed with it, but for me it came down to ergonomics.
22:50:07kiwicamOn the Zip the Left/Right (FF/RW) key sare very easily knocked. Not so bad when you're in an environment where you can keep from accidentally bumping it against something, but too frustrating for my use.
22:51:07kiwicamI purchased an oldish Clip+ recently and the battery lasts all day and I would us it 8-12 hours a day.
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