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#rockbox log for 2015-02-18

00:11:10 Quit AlexP (Remote host closed the connection)
00:28:58 Quit ender` (Quit: There are two ways of constructing a software design. One way is to make it so simple that there are obviously no deficiencies. And the other way is to make it so complicated that there are no obvious deficiencies.-- C.A.R. Hoare)
00:32:42 Nick scorche|1h is now known as scorche|sh (~scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
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01:32:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:05:22AidanSonodaApologies if RaaA is considered off-topic here, but I'm running rockbox on a Galaxy S5 - with just about everything working great. One remaining issue is that the volume adjustment does not respect rockbox's 100 steps (as it used to on my previous phone). Rockbox shows the volume increase/decrease but the actual level simply "jumps" every 7 steps with no change in between the jumps. -27 to -26 is a large step in loudness then no
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05:54:59[Saint]A: Your message was too long and got truncated
05:55:18[Saint]B: is this in the lockscreen, or when Rockbox is otherwise backgrounded?
06:02:05 Join SuperBrainAK [0] (
06:03:05SuperBrainAKhey all long time no see, what would be the best way to get a replacement battery for the sansa clip zip?
06:04:28 Join krabador [0] (~krabador@unaffiliated/krabador)
06:05:11SuperBrainAKi saw a lot of 9 zips and one + that are various shades of broken, dunno if that would be worth the ~7$ for them
06:05:25SuperBrainAKon ebay
06:05:55[Saint]50 Shades of Broken Sansas.
06:08:46SuperBrainAKi might just strap an old novatel 1150mAH cell to the back and deal with the extra bulk
06:11:38SuperBrainAKis there a safe way to remove the clip and put it back on?
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21:21:48wodzpamaury: ping
21:22:48pamaurywodz: pong, i'm busy right now but i'll be available in 40min
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21:28:02wodzpamaury: I'd like to discuss hwstub/qeditor coexistence so I'll better wait
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22:01:50pamaurywodz: here
22:06:46wodzpamaury: Ok, so what I think of is to create proxy program which will talk to hwstub running on target using usb and queue commands from clients sent by TCP.
22:07:07wodzthen hwstub_shell and qeditor will be clients
22:07:32pamauryyes I agree
22:09:13pamauryI have started to design a protocol, my thoughts for the moment are to use DBUS on the local computer, qeditor/hwstub_shell would (by the use of a library) spawn a new hwstub server if needed, which could aggregate several sources like local usb devices and remote devices
22:09:38pamauryit could also forward its device over the network, doing the other side of the network
22:11:10wodzWhy would one want to aggregate several sources? How would you distinguish to which device you are talking?
22:11:59pamauryI mean it would just list all available devices, it doesn't matter if the device is local or not, of course it will be able to distinguish them
22:12:56wodzDo we really need this? I can't imagine to have more then one debugged device pluged in/accessed
22:13:23wodzmaybe for comparision but still unlikely
22:13:33pamauryin several occasions I have used several devices at the same time
22:13:59pamaurybut that's only a minor detail
22:14:30pamaurythe only thing which I fear will be slightly annoying is that server on a nat network will be inaccessible unless the router forwards the port, which is a very common situation when you have a box
22:15:25wodzthats unavoidable unless we finally switch to IPv6 and ISPs bend their mainds about this
22:17:24pamauryyeah :( anyway, I will finish my work on qeditor which is mostly done, I have begun to implement field values edition, it's still not pushed to gerrit
22:18:17wodzWhat about the protocol itself?
22:19:10pamaurylike we discussed before, I'd like the usb protocol to be HID based if possible (recall we don't need interrupt transfers)
22:19:51pamauryover this, I am thinking about some like SCSI: command block, optional data stage, reponse stage
22:20:01wodzyes but this is hw<->server part. I am asking about server<->client
22:21:03pamauryah, I'm still undecided, I see two options:
22:22:26pamaury1) have a specific protocol: like a DBUS method call
22:22:26pamaury2) keep the hardware protocol even on the local box and just forward "packets"
22:23:25pamaurydoes that make sense ?
22:23:27wodzI was thinking about 2). I know next to nothing about DBUS
22:24:10pamauryyeah I think 2) is better, and it allows to use any method to communicate with the server, even the "remote" protocol but just locally
22:25:16wodzhowever I would avoid simple encapsulation as this means that change in 'hw protocol' part forces 'remote protocol' part change
22:25:55wodzwell, that what I though initially that you spawn server and talk to it TCP always
22:26:06wodzlike gdbserver
22:29:34pamauryhum, but if we use a different protocol, that means we would have to translate it; I think it's better to separate the transport protocol (TCP, USB HID) from the protocol itself (the commands). Yes I thinking DBUS but TCP is fine locally too
22:30:43pamauryAnyway, before writing any code I'll send you a detailled documentation so we can (d)sagree :)
22:32:34wodzwell this is not going to be monster - currently we define 7 commands total
22:33:15pamauryyes, but we'll need to rewrite nearly all the code
22:33:27wodzthe lib part, yes
22:33:38pamauryexcept if we keep the current hardware protocol and just add a network layer
22:34:36wodzthis will bring the oddities of usb transport layer as for example separate READ nad READ2 to get data
22:34:57pamauryyes, I don't like this solution either
22:37:47pamaurylet's hope my network programming skills are still up to the task ;)
22:38:53[Saint]With your demonstrable skills, I would be very worried if they weren't.
22:39:01[Saint]Frankly, you're a machine dude.
22:39:55[Saint]Yourself and wodz are two reverse engineering/hacker/programmer types that I hold in very high esteem.
22:40:04[Saint]extremely so.
22:40:28pamaurythank you :)
22:40:46[Saint](might not be obvious due to poor wording, but, its a compliment to you both)
22:41:49[Saint]I go through a lot of your gerrit submissions and some of the solutions you guys come up with are extremely elegant. Things I never would have even considered thinking about, nor have the capacity to do so.
22:41:59[Saint]Its really awe inspiring to watch from a distance.
22:55:46wodzpamaury: so what about sticking to the current commands BUT without split so HWSTUB_GET_LOG, HWSTUB_READ, HWSTUB_READ_ATOMIC, HWSTUB_WRITE, HWSTUB_WRITE_ATOMIC, HWSTUB_EXEC ?
22:56:44pamauryyou mean changing the protocol or just present a different protocol for TCP ?
22:56:45 Quit wubking (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
22:57:06wodzdifferent over TCP
22:57:48wodzwe want to change usb part anyway
22:59:53pamauryyeah that's possible, that would be a good point for you suggestion to use a different network protocol
23:02:54wodzpamaury: btw. do you know how sw breakpoints work in gdbserver? Patching memory and catching trap is easy but how this is signaled to running gdb?
23:03:18pamauryI don't know, I never looked too deeply into the gdb protocol
23:05:16wodzThe only thing which comes to my mind is that gdb polls the server but thats stupid
23:05:27pamaurymy guess is that gdb rewrites the memory so that a trap(swi) is signaled and then the gdbstub notifies a running state change (like run -> stop)
23:07:25wodzthe lowlevel part is clear, gdbserver patches instruction in memory so to cause trap and intercepts this. But how gdb (running remotely) is signaled?
23:09:18pamaurywell the communication link is full duplex so when the code is interrupted, some OS code is ran and sends a message over the link
23:11:08pamauryanyway even if gdb was polling, so OS code would need to handle the request so that's doesn't make sense to poll
23:12:08wodzI know some gdbservers work on half duplex physical layer (BDM pod using usb transfers for example)
23:14:35pamauryit is also possible that gdb handles several configuration, depending on the capabilities of the stub
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23:51:06 Quit ender (Quit: /[,\(\s]?#1(s)(\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?)(\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?\s+-?\d+(?{}\.\d+)?)+(\)?=|\s|$)/)
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