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#rockbox log for 2007-05-16

00:00:25byteshacksweet, thanks
00:00:28chrisjs169I sorta made a 'mistake' earlier today, and now i'm getting radio-like noises in Rockbox (but not in the OF)
00:00:43pixelma_FireFly_: there's also a bug report of what you describe in the tracker (the reporter relates it to X5/M5) - but I'm not able to reproduce it myself, works correctly on my M5 here as well as the Ondio
00:00:57 Join TrueJournals [0] (
00:01:16_FireFly_pixelma: i can reproduce it on my h120 and with the uisim
00:01:48pixelmahe also claims that this problem occured somewhen in the beginning of may
00:01:51byteshackthe patches are probably not in the svn tree yet? probably awaiting review
00:02:42chrisjs169byteshack: patches are not in the svn tree. some are waiting to be accepted, while others are just modifications
00:03:13byteshackchrisjs169: yeah, case_ was asking about that, I think
00:04:26 Join jimbobuk [0] (
00:04:28amiconn_FireFly_, pixelma: I don't think there's an actual bug involved
00:04:32case_well, some of the patches i'm talking about seems to have been applied, but the problems are still there...
00:04:33jimbobukhey folks
00:04:44chrisjs169zivan56 isn't on, but for those who were trying to figure out what GPIOs E/J/L are (sansa) now that i'm getting these odd noises, GPIO E shows only 00 and 6D (on occasion others, but very rarely)
00:05:02_FireFly_i don't understand why the first track in the playlist is correct but the following tracks are sorted reverse
00:05:20pixelmaamiconn: what could be the reason then?
00:05:21amiconnThe recursive insertion just traverses the directory tree in "natural" order, i.e. like the subdirs appear on disk
00:05:44_FireFly_and then calls qsort to sort it
00:05:45amiconnSo the order you end up depends on what order your directory tree was written in
00:05:51bluebrotherI would be interested in the timestamps of those files
00:05:59bluebrother_including_ last access stamp
00:06:04 Quit byteshack ("Lost terminal")
00:06:07jimbobukanyone use logscrobbler to upload their .scrobbler files off of your rockbox?
00:06:17amiconnWindows explorer likes to write things in backwards order...
00:06:19chrisjs169jimbobuk: I have once...
00:06:37_FireFly_amiconn: i don't use windows ;)
00:06:42pixelmaah... I remember that in combination with a root.m3u I tried out once
00:06:45bluebrotherWindows explorer likes to write things in arbitrary order :)
00:06:48amiconnThat was just an example...
00:07:02chrisjs169bluebrother: maybe YOU can help me :) ever since I applied the barbeque sauce 'filter' I'm getting radio-like noises in Rockbox, but not in the OF
00:07:20jimbobukit looks ok, last night i tried submitting for the first time.. firstly i tried one of the linked php scripts... it seems to have uploaded things at funny times and dates... logscrobbler seemed better but i missed the chance to see what succeeded to submit and what failed, something the php uploader showed you.
00:07:32bluebrotherchrisjs169, why do you think I could help you?
00:07:58 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
00:08:00*bluebrother doesn't own or know the sansa
00:08:05pixelmabut that also wouldn't explain why it should be a recent thing (provided the reporter didn't change the directory structure and/or tested different directories)
00:08:05chrisjs169ah, ok
00:08:06amiconn_FireFly_: Rockbox sorts individual directories, but I doubt the recursive insertion sorts the whole list. The whole list of file names doesn't exist in memory at any time afaik
00:08:21chrisjs169bluebrother: I figured you might be able to help since you're part of staff
00:08:38chrisjs169JdGordon is a dev :)
00:08:52_FireFly_amiconn: thats right
00:09:35_FireFly_but the sorting is wrong also for one directory: first track correct but following tracks are sorted inverse
00:09:49chrisjs169you own a sansa right?
00:10:09bluebrothera plugin to show the fat structure might be a thing ...
00:10:12chrisjs169you see, today I decided to try applying the barbeque sauce filter...
00:10:16amiconn_FireFly_: Huh? I never observed that... oddity
00:10:23 Quit midkay ("Leaving")
00:10:34chrisjs169and now Rockbox emits radio-like noises, but the OF is fine
00:11:16_FireFly_amiconn: i'm using bleeding- 070515
00:11:30*JdGordon wonders wht bbq sauce filter is? you spilt some on the sans?
00:11:34amiconnOh, hmm, indeed
00:11:51chrisjs169not _on_ the sansa, _in_ the sansa :P
00:12:00*amiconn usually adds a single dir by playing the first track
00:12:18*bluebrother guesses that the list is sorted in the order on disk
00:12:23amiconn...and then the order is correct
00:12:24_FireFly_amiconn: e.g. files: title1,title2,title3,title4,title5 playlist after recursive insert: title1,title5,title4,title3,title2
00:12:49amiconn[00:11:34] <amiconn> Oh, hmm, indeed
00:13:16bluebrother_FireFly_, do you have "recurseively insert" enabled?
00:13:28bluebrotherdoes it also happen if you disable that?
00:13:57 Join hardeep [0] (
00:14:04amiconnAlso happens without recursive enabled
00:14:20 Quit TrueJournals (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:14:26jimbobukanyone know where to find support on logscrobbler then? and related to that.. it seems to get near perfect scrobbler support you have to apply a few patches, these seem to be a few months old in some circumstances, will they ever get merged into the main source?
00:14:27amiconnAnd for some reason rockbox doesn't switch to the wps if I start a playlist that way...
00:14:31JdGordonchrisjs169: wff? anyway, standard metho bath is the usual fix...
00:14:32bluebrothertoo bad. I hoped that was related.
00:14:44amiconnBtw, it's not limited to swcodec, I tested on recorder
00:14:57chrisjs169JdGordon: I tried that, and got all the bbq sauce off
00:14:58obojimbobuk: tried qtscrobbler? I'm hoping those patches will be commited...
00:15:03pixelmahmm... weird. Just tried again and it happens now too here - but I'm quite sure I tested a few times after reading the report :/
00:15:17hardeepamiconn: is this the directory playlist insertion issue?
00:15:19amiconnThis is a build from May 08
00:15:33chrisjs169JdGordon: there was what looked like tiny spots of corrosion though, so I wiped the off a little
00:15:44amiconnAh, Mr. playlist is around :)
00:15:47amiconnhardeep: yes
00:15:50chrisjs169JdGordon: should I try to give it another bath?
00:15:53jimbobukobo: i'm on windows, does that work? it all looks fine but it has wierd options with no explanation "shift after last played" for example.
00:16:15jimbobukobo: do patches have to be properly checked over before they make it into the main source?
00:16:18hardeepyeah, i know the cause... it was accidentally introduced with the menu api changes
00:16:51amiconnAnother JdGordon special ;\
00:16:59chrisjs169JdGordon: the bbq didn't really get past the usb 'slot' though, with the exception of a little getting through the power button, so it didn't cover the entire chip
00:17:10bluebrotherspecials all over here :)
00:17:24hardeepwell, it was a bit of a kludge in the onplay code which was, not surprisingly, missed
00:17:24JdGordonchrisjs169: :( you might have missed a bit.. i dunno
00:17:39JdGordonhardeep: ? whats I miss
00:17:39obojimbobuk: yeah, it hasn't really been documented :) It worked fine on windows the last time I tried, a few weeks ago
00:17:51obojimbobuk: yes, the patches need a dev to cast an eye over them
00:17:59*JdGordon will read logs later in the day.. gtg
00:18:18chrisjs169JdGordon: so should I try giving it another bath?
00:18:22hardeepJdGordon: this ones not really your fault. When inserting elements in the playlist before playback has started, you need to use INSERT_LAST instead of INSERT
00:18:22 Quit ompaul ("some light betime reading Network Internals(yawn)")
00:18:31jimbobukobo: hmm, its just failed to commit a whole album of stuff, deleted my .scrobbler file (i'd backed it up anyways) and thats it.. hopefully that was just caused by some kind of submit earlier than the last time i submitted.. hopefully it'll all be ok now.
00:19:00oboyeah, those spam filters can be annoying
00:19:05jimbobukobo: you're saying logscrobbler hasnt been documented, or that qtscrobbler hasn't? which do you use?
00:19:34obojimbobuk: qtscrobbler - I've wrote a few bits of it...
00:20:08jimbobukobo: well i guess even tho the times in the file are good, because I submitted a file yesterday, that was incomplete (an older snapshot of the .scrobbler file off of my PC) and on my rockbox i'd listened to a few tracks since they've now been blocked by the anti-spammer
00:20:30 Quit lee-qid_ ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
00:20:52Soapyep, submissions must be in chronological order.
00:20:52jimbobukobo: and qtscrobbler DOES work with windows? does it report back at least that certain files have failed, allowing u to patch the times to be hacked ones back from the current time in an hour or so to get them properly uploaded (albiet with incorrect timestamps)
00:21:12oboyes, that will cause the spam filters to kick in. In qtscrob the recalc button can be useful to fake the times if needed
00:21:51jimbobukwell now the .scrobbler file HAS been deleted on the rockbox should be fine.. i still wonder how i can manage my account with this spam filter in light of also using foobar2000 to submit to when on my PC.. i'm going to have to remember to submit the latest .scrobbler file before playing tunes on foobar :(
00:21:54oboAFAIK it works in windows. the servers don't report back what works and what doesn't - it just blindly accepts all
00:22:25jimbobukobo: oh, the php script i ran had ticks and crosses next to files it had submitted or not.. seemed to line up with what then appeared at a few minutes later
00:22:32Soapjimbobuk: I can't speak for qtscrobbler, but logscrobbler has the option of shifting your log file to times /after/ your last submission.
00:22:43 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
00:22:47Soapnever failed me.
00:22:59jimbobukSoap: ahh thats the button that i didnt know what it meant
00:23:14jimbobukso you are losing the ability to keep the actual time you listened to the tunes?
00:23:21 Join KenshinX [0] (
00:23:29Soapjust make sure you have a large enough window between last submitted and current time to fit your logged tracks in.
00:23:40SoapDo you think Last.FM uses that time?
00:23:57oboqtscrobbler has something similar - "Check last date"
00:23:58jimbobukSoap: well it tells you how long ago u listened on the page?
00:24:00Soapyou're throwing away the least significant bit.
00:24:04KenshinXI deleted rockbox from the ipod and now it wont boot to anythign or get recognized by the computer can anyone help?
00:24:14jimbobukSoap: page that is
00:24:19Soapit does, but I always thought that piece of information was part of the social aspect.
00:24:28Soapso your buddies can see what you are up to.
00:24:35jimbobukyeah, its not crucial.. but i do kind of like it :)
00:24:38Soapjudge your mood by your tracks.
00:24:42oboit was useful in the early days when people tried to spam like mad :)
00:25:05Soapyou MUST submit in order, so you have to toss it, or submit your dap before firing up foobar.
00:25:09jimbobukhaving just submitted then i'll need to wait at least an hour before trying to send the rest of the tracks
00:25:33obofuture dates do work by the way ;)
00:25:46obowell, a hour or two ahead do at least
00:25:51jimbobukSoap: yeah, a bit of a pain.. so long as i backup the .scrobbler file first then i'll see if it fails and know then to wait a few hours and submit with hacked times... should work
00:26:06jimbobuklets face it i dont care if its not perfect, it'll be nice to get more of my music listening habits being recorded at all
00:26:07linuxstb_KenshinX: Force your ipod into disk mode (hold MENU+SELECT together for a few seconds to reboot, then immediately press and hold SELECT+PLAY), and then follow the uninstall instructions in the manual.
00:27:25jimbobukwhat are the chances of the scrobbler patches being commited though so that i can get a build with them in... i've yet to setup the dev environment here, and i think i'll hold off on album art patches for the time being too.
00:28:11Soapjimbobuk: the scrobbler fix, FS #5495, just trades one bug for another in my testing.
00:28:26oboSoap: oh? what happens?
00:28:32jimbobukSoap: yeah i did read some threads of discussion along those lines
00:28:42Soapit double logs on pause/play events.
00:29:02jimbobukthe original problem is 1st track, last track not being submitted isn't it?
00:29:19oboand that's with the patch I posted 2 days ago?
00:29:23Soapyes, which you can work around with a dummy track you start first.
00:29:38Soapobo: sorry - I didn't know you had one that new.
00:29:48*Soap checks his email.
00:30:17Soapdang - I thought I had that task in my watch/notify list.
00:30:30Soapobo - I'll build tonight and test tomorrow.
00:30:39 Quit Psilonaut (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:31:27jimbobukobo: u said future dates work so if i resubmit with it set to after last submit it'll go into the future but should work... I wonder if that last time stuff works only if u keep logscrobbler running
00:32:25oboI'm not sure about logscrobbler, I don't use it...
00:32:32jimbobuki'd like to try and build sometime... cant decide whether to try on my mac or my PC (via cygwin i guess?) ... i am not loving mac + rockbox at the moment thanks to finder's sillyness over .<name> files
00:32:59jimbobukobo: sure sorry, I will try out qtscrobbler too.
00:33:35 Quit bluebrother ("Leaving")
00:34:14 Quit Siltaar (Remote closed the connection)
00:35:05hardeepjimbobuk: mac terminal build works great
00:35:38jimbobukhardeep: yeah i think that appeals, even though its a macbook, versus a fast main PC :)
00:36:06jimbobukhardeep: all the stuff on the wiki for building covers the mac too? or dont you need too much on the mac?
00:36:14jimbobuktoo much extra
00:36:14hardeepjimbobuk: cygwin slows the build down a lot... slower mac may still be faster
00:37:02hardeepjimbobuk: you need xcode installed
00:37:14jimbobukahh, never did get round to that... hmm.
00:37:17hardeepand also need to run tools/
00:37:18 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:37:41jimbobuki need to register to download xcode i think, started looking into it soon after getting my mac, and never got back round to it
00:38:02hardeepjimbobuk: yeah, it's a free download but you need to register as an "apple developer", whatever that means
00:38:09_FireFly_hardeep: is there a fix for the recursive insert problem?
00:38:17jimbobukcool qtscrobbler has a windows binary, trying that now.
00:38:34hardeep_FireFly_: I know the problem but don't have a fix yet. still trying to wrap my head around the new menu api code
00:40:34jimbobukobo: straight away the ability to shift select a range of tracks is helpful.. i want to just try resubmitting the 8 tracks it missed on my last submit.. select what i dont want, and then delete selected items?
00:41:14oboyup, that should do it
00:41:38jimbobukcool... i see timezone is selectable, this was in the php script but it got it so wrong
00:41:45jimbobukin BST atm, thats UTC+1 ?
00:42:13oboyes - I keep meaning to look at putting something in to change DST automatically...
00:42:29 Quit idnar (Nick collision from services.)
00:42:32 Join idnar_ [0] (n=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar)
00:42:44jimbobukthe experiment check last date.. is it that, or Recalc Date/Time I should use... the latter sounds more like it... being able to set the time next to it i guess.. is that time the time it'll start me listening to, or end the last track listening to around
00:43:01jimbobukobo: me too for an xmltv app i've written
00:43:35jimbobukwill this delete the items from the .scrobbler file after submitting, or is it left to the user to delete the .scrobbler file off of the rockbox after you've done?
00:43:52oboCheck last date tries to find the datetime of the last track you submitted, and then adjust everything to go after that. Recalc is manual, depending on what you enter
00:44:13oboit will delete the entire log file
00:44:51jimbobukcheck last date tries to use itself to figure the time out? i'll go manual i think
00:45:04jimbobukrecalc takes the time as the end or start time of your tracks?
00:45:25jimbobukohh i noticed that although i've selected a lot of rows, delete selected item is only deleting the bottom item of that selection each time i press the button
00:46:08KenshinXanyone have the ipod_fw.exe file?
00:47:10oborecalc works backwards from the last track
00:47:47 Nick idnar_ is now known as idnar (n=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar)
00:47:55 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:49:15jimbobukobo: cool so set to the near future if required... neat.. may be nice if it could show you the beginning time based on the current tracks in the list back from the end time you've selected. Did you know about not being able to delete multiple tracks in one go, does it do that for you on your machine (if you're not on windows)
00:50:40 Join Domonoky [0] (
00:51:05jimbobukobo: actually it works up from the selection.. as its just eaten through my tracks i was saving.. even though they were selected.
00:51:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:52:03oboI've just tried multiple select and delete, can't get it to delete anything here
00:54:29hardeepis 80 cols still a requirement for the code?
00:54:34 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
00:55:31linuxstb_KenshinX: ipod_fw.exe isn't required by Rockbox any more. What do you want to do?
00:56:19linuxstb_hardeep: Yes, the docs/CONTRIBUTING file is still the same...
00:57:23hardeephmmm, i see a bunch of instances where it's not being followed anymore
00:57:24 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay)
00:58:14linuxstb_If you see them, fix them. Unless they're in code imported from other projects (e.g. the codecs).
00:59:01hardeepyup, will do
00:59:04jimbobukobo: i'm using the button not delete on the keyboard (which seemed to want me to edit the track number txt)... that'd be good to fix that, i've done some gtk coding, but no QT I presume it has a similar API for iterating over the selected rows in what in gtk is a treeview
01:01:45Domonokyit would be nice to include this scobbler things into rbutil.. but i dont have enough time in the near future..
01:03:52obojimbobuk: QT doesn't seem to have an easy way - but the current code doesn't look right at all
01:04:50oboDomonoky: well, there is code in perl, c# and c++/qt - take your pick :)
01:05:19jimbobukobo: well its not running right thats for sure ;) .. i'm just downloading xcode stuff, maybe i'll get dev in osX working nicely and i'll take a look... so long as i can get good VIM usage i'll be happy
01:05:20Domonokyrbutil is written in c++/wxwidgets.. so.. :-)
01:07:53oboDomonoky: does WX have networking/http functions?
01:08:24_FireFly_hmm i have maybe found a solution for the recursive insert problem
01:08:52hardeep_FireFly_: I'm testing a fix right now
01:09:09jhMikeSsansapatcher −−delete-bootloader simply removes the rb bootloader and restores the OF, correct? (need a clean dump)
01:09:32obojimbobuk: sounds good
01:09:32_FireFly_it seems that playlist->last_insert_pos doesn't get updated
01:09:47Domonokyobo: it has some, i dont knwo too much about wx.. :-)
01:09:50linuxstb_jhMikeS: Yes, but it won't be identical to a pre-Rockbox Sansa - the OF is unencrypted. But the Sansa bootloader should still load it as normal.
01:10:04 Join z35_11 [0] (
01:10:07hardeep_FireFly_: yes, that's intentional... there are resume-related problems if we update it before playback begins
01:10:11 Quit z35_1 (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
01:10:17jhMikeSI wish I'd done a dump _before_ installing rb
01:10:25jhMikeSjust to have an orginal copy
01:10:32_FireFly_hardeep: no i mean in playlist.c:721
01:10:46linuxstb_jhMikeS: That's the first thing I do now when buying a new DAP.
01:10:55jhMikeSmakes sense :)
01:11:02hardeep_FireFly_: yes, that's what I'm referring to... it was done intentionally
01:11:58jhMikeSis it possible to reencrypt to restore it?
01:12:03 Part Domonoky
01:12:52linuxstb_jhMikeS: I think you can just copy an original .mi4 file to the root and start the original firmware. That will install that mi4.
01:13:22_FireFly_hmm after changing inserted_pos < playlist->last_inserted_post to inserted_pos > playlist->last_inserted_post the order is no correct... but i don't know if this change doesn't result in misbehaviour in other places
01:13:43jimbobukmadness, someone is selling a battery for toshiba gigabeats.. wasn't aware they were changable.
01:14:14hardeep_FireFly_: yeah, there was some problems with resume when doing that... i forget the details now but the history of playlist.c will describe it
01:14:45hardeep_FireFly_: the easy fix for recursive insert is to use INSERT_LAST before playback begins
01:14:59jhMikeSI was trying to backup and just start on a clean one...stupid question: where do I check fw revisions...if I've already got a clean one, I won't worry.
01:16:43 Nick chrisjs169 is now known as chrisjs169|brb (n=jack@unaffiliated/chrisjs169)
01:16:44_FireFly_hardeep: no it isn't a fix because the order will be wrong when i try to create a playlist with recursive insert when no playlist exist at that moment
01:17:16_FireFly_there is no option insert last when there is no playlist
01:17:28hardeep_FireFly_: hmmm, I don't follow. the order will be exactly correct. this is exactly what the code did before the menu change
01:17:34_FireFly_only insert and "insert shuffled"
01:17:49hardeep_FireFly_: right, i need to change "insert" to actually be an INSERT_LAST
01:19:31 Nick chrisjs169|brb is now known as chrisjs169 (n=jack@unaffiliated/chrisjs169)
01:19:45 Quit entheh ("^~")
01:19:45 Quit Joely (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:20:34 Part toffe82
01:21:06jimbobukhardeep: i'm getting xcode 2.2.1, that should be all i need on the apple side shouldnt it?
01:22:03 Quit obo ("bye")
01:22:23hardeepjimbobuk: I believe so
01:22:49jimbobukcool, i hoped so seeing as its an 800meg disk image
01:24:22 Join secleinteer [0] (n=secleint@
01:24:38 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
01:28:13 Nick z35_11 is now known as z35 (
01:29:13 Quit KenshinX ()
01:30:19jhMikeSlinuxstb_: It occurs to me I can just use their FW upgrade and redump actually after restoring it so I have one with the latest...any problems with newer fws?
01:31:09hardeep_FireFly_: please try the latest svn build once it completes... it should fix the issue
01:31:35linuxstb_jhMikeS: Not that I know of, but I'm not an expert on the Sansas (I don't own one)
01:32:13jhMikeSlinuxstb_: somehow I got some impression you did :P ??
01:32:37_FireFly_hardeep: i have change the value of the menupoint Playlist -> Insert form PLAYLIST_INSERT to PLAYLIST_INSERT_LAST and now it seems to work#
01:32:41 Join Alonea [0] (
01:33:37linuxstb_jhMikeS: I wrote sansapatcher, but without a sansa...
01:36:22jhMikeShehe...nice job then
01:36:57jhMikeSlinuxstb_: I can always reverse dd the backup if worse comes to worse right? dd works that way?
01:36:59_FireFly_hardeep: hmm shouldn't it be LANG_INSERT_LAST instead LANG_INSERT for the displayed text? because now there will be two menuetrys called Insert
01:38:49_FireFly_jhMikeS: dd makes an bit per bit copy of the specified "file" in your case from a partition #
01:38:50hardeep_FireFly_: Nope, there will be only one entry ("Insert"). The no_play option is only visible when audio isn't playing and the other one only when it is
01:39:50jhMikeS_FireFly_: so a dd from the working backup to the partition should be ok (I think you're implying)
01:40:05_FireFly_jhMikeS: yepp
01:40:09linuxstbjhMikeS: That won't restore the contents of the flash if the Sansa updater updates that...
01:40:23linuxstb(flash ROM)
01:40:29Nico_Pwoooo ! green build table :D
01:41:26Nico_Pso where's Bagder ? :)
01:41:45jhMikeSso noone's tried a rb install after an upgrade?
01:41:55 Quit robin0800 (" I love my HydraIRC -> <-")
01:43:15 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
01:43:38linuxstbjhMikeS: I'm sure they have - we would have heard about problems if there were any.
01:44:04Aloneaanything amazing this week?
01:44:24linuxstbNo, it's officially been a lame week.
01:44:26jhMikeSmaybe I'll play cautious until I'm in the mood for that sort of thing
01:44:55jhMikeSdumping the extracted mi4 worked fine though
01:45:14jhMikeSor using it to restore rather
01:45:48Alonealinuxstb: ah. oh well. sure something exiting will happen eventually. possibly software to talk to et? that would be cool...^__^
01:45:55 Part _FireFly_ ("Kopete 0.12.3 :")
01:46:19*linuxstb spots an all-green build table for the first time in a while
01:46:49Aloneaheh. supa-green!
01:47:33linuxstbjhMikeS: BTW, did you comment out the #warning because it annoyed you or because you fixed it?
01:51:00jhMikeSlinuxstb: because it annoyed Bagder and it's probably would've just hung around for a bit
01:51:07jhMikeSI think we got the point already :)
01:51:22linuxstbI'm not complaining, just checking...
01:54:23Nico_PjhMikeS: just wondering, how's progress with FF/RW in MPEGplayer ?
01:54:52 Quit Guile` ("KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'")
01:56:30preglowwhat happened to the core lock warnings?
01:58:24linuxstbThey're hiding
02:01:23preglowfor the sake of a green table? :P
02:02:02preglowbed bed
02:02:03preglownightie all
02:02:05XavierGrthen grats on the "fake-green" table hehe
02:02:08pixelmawell rombox is also only hiding...
02:02:12XavierGrgood night preglow
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02:03:13pixelmaoff to bed too
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02:05:14jhMikeSNico_P: coming along but I'm not rushing it
02:05:59jhMikeSI would've removed the warning and not commented it if it were actually fixed
02:07:24Nico_Pcool... looking forward to it :)
02:07:34Nico_PI can also test if you need
02:07:53jhMikeSit's just that to have it work really well on dual-core, we need core sync
02:08:24jhMikeSthanks. it's a little ways from there though
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02:19:23smokkinso i finally got myself an ipod yesterday, and my entire music collection is encodec in OGG, and i stumbled upon rockbox. looks awesome, i just cant find anywhere on the webapge if a 2nd gen nano is supported... anybody know?
02:20:37*Nico_P just discovered svn blame
02:20:48Nico_Pthis thing is awesome !
02:21:07linuxstbsmokkin: No it's not. The 2nd gen nano is completely different (on the inside) to the other ipods.
02:22:08linuxstbNico_P: I prefer the more positive version - "svn praise"
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02:22:20hardeepNico_P: laugh, nice. "blame" is a much better command then "annotate"
02:23:07Aloneaspeaking of svn, there is a small joke that is: svn commit seppuku
02:23:27smokkinah, bummer. so - keep waiting...
02:23:40Nico_Plinuxstb: haha, yes, but the real name is blame... though praise sounds nicer indeed
02:23:41linuxstbsmokkin: It could be a very long wait - no-one is working on it.
02:23:42smokkinthank you much linuxstb
02:23:58smokkinthank you
02:24:04Nico_Pactually with all these strange aliases I thought the command was mean to allow adding comments on commits
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02:33:38chrisjs169Hey zivan56
02:34:02chrisjs169After applying my custom bbq sauce filter, GPIO E slowed down a lot
02:34:27chrisjs169showing only 00 and 6D (for the most part, occasionally a few others)
02:35:19zivan56sounds like the sansa wasn't too happy with that :P
02:35:39chrisjs169it wasn' seems to have messed up Rockbox
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02:36:09chrisjs169any idea on what gpio e is?
02:36:28zivan56no clue
02:37:20zivan56how has it messed up rockbox?
02:38:08chrisjs169well, it displays everything fine, but it emits a radio-like sound through the headphones
02:38:18chrisjs169even if no music is player
02:38:28zivan56the radio noises are probably because austriancoder enabled line1 in in SVN
02:38:40chrisjs169back on friday?
02:38:52 Quit jimbobuk ()
02:38:54zivan56something like that
02:39:05zivan56how loud is the radio noise?
02:39:06chrisjs169uh oh
02:39:33chrisjs169i'm not getting a display now
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02:39:59chrisjs169this is not good...
02:40:14zivan56it happens quite frequently for me, especially when rebooting it alot
02:40:25chrisjs169what, the screen not turning on?
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02:40:36chrisjs169any idea on fixing it?
02:41:06zivan56hold down power for 15 secs
02:41:18zivan56once I had to do that 3 or 4 times to get it to work
02:41:35chrisjs169even if the scrollwheel lights up?
02:42:03zivan56im am surprised you haven't seen that before, it's quite a common problem
02:42:23chrisjs169I think this may be slightly different....
02:42:31chrisjs169you see, I don't even have a battery in it right now
02:42:39chrisjs169I'm turning it on by plugging the usb cable in
02:43:38chrisjs169still the same?
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02:44:13chrisjs169i think i may have bricked it....scrollwheel isn't turning on
02:44:20chrisjs169*lighting up
02:44:49zivan56it probably just needs a battery to start up properly
02:45:02chrisjs169i'll try
02:46:12chrisjs169it isn't completely bricked though....when plugging in the usb cable, i hear 'noises' like normal
02:47:01chrisjs169ok, scrollwheel lights up again :D
02:47:43chrisjs169guess i should just let it sit....plugging it in and unplugging it probably isn't good for it
02:49:16chrisjs169well, i plugged it in to my computer
02:49:21chrisjs169the bootloader crashed...
02:50:06chrisjs1690b70:0003 is what again?
02:50:28chrisjs169pre-boot mode?
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02:51:24zivan56no clue, 0003 is portalplayer, so it probably is
02:51:35chrisjs169yeah....that's bad isn't it?
02:52:07zivan56err mean 0b70 is portalplayer...
02:52:21zivan56sounds like you need to use e200tool
02:52:46chrisjs169now, if the scrollwheel doesn't light up, how will I know if it works?
02:53:20Soaplinuxstb: are you still awake?
02:53:22zivan56well it shows up as a usb device
02:53:41chrisjs169is using an e260 i2c bin fine on a e250?
02:54:18zivan56no clue, it should be the same for all of them
02:55:45zivan56I am quite sure something outside of the sansa fm tuner itself needs to be set, I found that modifying a frequency register and rebooting into OF would cause static unless I change the frequency
02:56:13zivan56and it stores settings between reboots
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02:57:51chrisjs169uh oh
02:57:53chrisjs169this isn't good
02:58:08chrisjs169there was.....water near the daughterboard
02:59:45chrisjs169i think i completely bricked it
02:59:57zivan56err, take out any power source and let it dry asap
03:00:16zivan56you probably did brick it now by turning it on
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03:03:27chrisjs169yeah =/
03:03:46chrisjs169it isn't appearing at all in lsusb
03:03:55zivan56just let it dry
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03:05:23chrisjs169is there hope?
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03:05:44major_worksYou don't smell anything burnt, do you?
03:06:01Soaplet it dry overnight w/o any source of power. stop plugging it in.
03:06:09Soapat least overnight.
03:06:13chrisjs169I did stop plugging it in once it stopped appearing
03:06:20zivan56maybe, see when it dries out, you are just making it worse by plugging it
03:06:32chrisjs169I know, that's why I stopped plugging it in
03:07:22chrisjs169Is there any possibility that it'll work again?
03:12:15major_workschrisjs169: If you didn't smell something burnt, that's a hopeful sign.
03:12:48major_worksYou've got to let it thoroughly dry... in the morning, set it near a window in the sun (if it's sunny, that is).
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03:17:41*BHSPitMonkey has a sploded a router before
03:18:54chrisjs169BHSPitMonkey: how?
03:19:17BHSPitMonkeyAC adapter mix-up
03:19:40chrisjs169did it work after that?
03:19:50BHSPitMonkey*fits*, *pop*, *smoke*, *sad*
03:19:55BHSPitMonkeyI miss that D-Link
03:20:04BHSPitMonkeynow we have a stupid linksys as a result
03:20:40chrisjs169i wonder if the daughterboard was the only thing that got messed up (if anything did)
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04:47:57streymastahey guys
04:48:02streymastai have a problem
04:48:56streymastacan someone please help me?
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04:59:05saratoga2ask your question
04:59:12saratoga2then someone will help if they know the answer
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05:52:45jbahey guys, teh gigabeat has been getting much svn love lately
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07:29:17 Part jhMikeS
07:29:23rigelim still getting "codec failure" every time i try and play a file on the h10 20gb
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07:41:34 Part kaaloo
07:42:47rigelthere should be a note that the mi4 file has changed since switching over to dual-boot
07:42:53rigelon the h10 20gb
07:43:06rigeli just updated the mi4 file, and now everything seems to work
07:43:22rigelbut that changes so rarely, it needs to be mentioned somehow
07:43:31JdGordoncodec failure means you didnt update your codecs...
07:43:50rigelare the codecs in .rockbox or in the firmware
07:43:54rigelthe mi4
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07:44:44rigeli completely replaced .rockbox like half a dozen times
07:44:56rigeldeleted it first, checked for bad sectors, the whole bit
07:45:01amiconnThe codecs must match your firmware
07:45:12rigelthey do, everything works fine now
07:45:16rigelthe mi4 changed though
07:45:25rigeli had last updated that in december
07:45:30amiconnThey will fail both if they're too old and if they're too new in relation to the main firmware
07:45:32rigelwhen the switch to dual boot was made
07:46:14rigelthat mi4 had worked flawlessly with every update until the last one i made of .rockbox, which was sometime in early april
07:46:40rigelthen i update it again yesterday, and i kept getting codec failed messages
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07:47:08rigeli finally went back and looked at the mi4 file, and it was different
07:47:39rigelmy point is that that should be indicated somewhere, that new .rockbox software past a certain date requires a new .mi4
07:48:37 Join lee-qid [0] (
07:48:39JdGordonits the otherway around...
07:48:47 Quit lee-qid (Client Quit)
07:48:51JdGordonyour new .mi4 needs a new .rockbox/ ...
07:49:06 Join lids [0] (i=lds@gateway/tor/x-83f8b6f07a81ba0a)
07:49:14JdGordonunless the mi4 your talking about is the bootloader? in which case its still the other way around...
07:50:00rigelhowever you want to phrase it, the .rockbox software before a certain date will not work with the current .mi4, and the rockbox software past a certain date will not work with the previous .mi4
07:50:14rigelmy point, again, is that I HAD NO INDICATION THAT THE MI4 HAD CHANGED
07:50:50rigelmy update procedure had consisted of simply downloading the zip file and installing directly to the unit
07:51:03rigelbecause noone told me the mi4 had changed
07:51:13JdGordonmeh, update more frequently then
07:51:26rigelhow about you just put a fucking indicator up somehow
07:51:42rigelsometimes people cant update as frequently as theyd like
07:51:53JurassicCwhoa Cowboy. We don't want any trouble
07:52:01JdGordonhow bout you watch the svn commits and when it says "you need a new bootloader" you do it
07:52:36rigelhow about you stop being an elitist fuckhole and realize that people less technically savvy than you use this shit
07:52:52JdGordonits just in my nature...
07:52:59rigeli enjoy using rockbox immensely
07:53:29rigelbut it behooves the developers to make sure that it is at least a little bit user-friendly so that its adoption can spread
07:53:31scorcherigel: chill outy
07:53:37rigelim totally chill
07:54:03scorcheusing expletives in this channel is unneeded and against the guidelines
07:54:07rigelim simply trying to get some recognition that this may be a problem for some people
07:54:21rigelexpletives schmexpletives. this is how people talk in the real world.
07:54:37scorcheand if you are in this channel, then re4spect this channel's guidelines
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07:54:57JurassicCrigel: you lose credibility when you do that
07:55:12rigelJurassicC: man, eat a fucking bushel of cocks.
07:55:18rigeli dont give a shit what you think about me
07:55:23rigelim trying to tell you you have a problem
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07:55:39rigelcredibility, i dont give a shit
07:55:46Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
07:55:50rigelim not trying to make friends
07:56:03Mode"#rockbox +b %rigel!*@* " by scorche (i=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
07:56:05JurassicCwell you want help, acting like a 5 year old doesn't help anythihng
07:56:11JdGordonbye bye :D
07:56:12scorchenow relax
07:56:18scorcheJdGordon: it is a mute..not a kick
07:56:21scorcheor a ban
07:56:33JdGordonclose enough
07:56:57scorcherigel: 10 the guidelines linked in the topic, or leave
07:57:56JdGordontoo bad about his attitude.. because he unfortuantly does have a point there..
07:58:16scorcheJdGordon: he is still here, just cannot say anything...he has 10 min to relax a bit
07:58:36JdGordonI know..
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08:04:21 Quit XavierGr ()
08:04:25scorcheJdGordon: it was brought up in the forums recently...basically, the attitude is, if rockbox has not been released for your device, you are a tester and it is your responsibility to check on these things if you wish to continue testing...the notifications are there in MajorChanges and the changelog as well as reports in the forums as well
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08:05:42JdGordonI get that, but really... unless something major happens at devcon, do you honestly see a proper "release" for any targets happening soon?
08:06:18JdGordonId be happy if a message went out to rockbox users ml if the commit message had "update bootloader" in it...
08:06:58Mode"#rockbox -b %rigel!*@* " by scorche (i=scorche@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
08:07:21rigelJdGordon: that's all i was asking for
08:07:55rigeljust put a tag on the build that says like "works with bootloader from this date"
08:08:22scorchethat would be quite superfluous and would just add clutter, imo
08:08:27scorchea mail would be decent
08:08:35scorcheplus, as long as we update MajorChanges
08:08:41rigela mail?
08:08:44JdGordonthat is there... has heaps of "update bootloader"-esqe messages
08:08:44rigelto who?
08:08:46scorchein the mailing lists
08:08:52rigelhow many unique ips download rockbox a day?
08:09:01JdGordonbootloader changes dont usually go in majorchanges
08:09:02rigelwhy do you want to limit this to developers?
08:09:10scorchewe dont
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08:09:27rigelthen why are you suggesting that it go out via mail?
08:09:33scorcheJdGordon: but, we can make them go into that
08:09:48scorcherigel: because many open source projects, including ours uses mailing lists
08:09:50rigelthe "current builds" only has what, like 2 days of commits listed?
08:10:06scorcheyou will see them in a link on the side if you dont subscribe
08:10:07rigelscorche: but how many people do you think use rockbox who are not in fact developers?
08:10:15rigeli sure didnt see anything.
08:10:19scorcherigel: i dont see how that matters
08:10:46rigelif i saw "bootloader updated 03/07" on the h10 page
08:10:52scorcheJdGordon: perhaps a recent bootloader with a changed (xx-xx-xxxx) on the current build page?
08:10:56rigelthen i would have updated my bootloader and saved myself the aggravation
08:11:17JdGordonscorche: what we really need is a way for the firmware to read the bootloader version..
08:11:31rigelscorche: it matters because you are providing software to people who may not know what theyre doing
08:11:40rigelthe more user-friendly your site is, the wider your adoption
08:11:43scorcherigel: as i said, you are testing an unreleased project
08:11:57scorchethere will be bugs and updates needed
08:11:58rigelwhat units has rockbox been "released" for thus far?
08:12:03JdGordonrigel: no, we arnt.... like scorche said, the only real users are the ones using rockbox 2.5 on the archos models... everyone else is a beta tester
08:12:04scorchethe archos units
08:12:05rigelthe ondios and archos?
08:12:21rigelgimme a break
08:12:33JdGordonyou had one already...
08:12:45scorchegive us a break...we develop this not get mad at us for doing so
08:13:02rigelim not getting mad, and certainly not for developing it
08:13:18rigelhowever, i have some motherfucking issues with your shitass elitist fuckhole assclown attitude
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08:13:22rigelso go fuck yourselves
08:13:24 Part rigel
08:13:30scorche"thanks for developing this, but do you think you could perhaps make a small change that would do x?" is a bit better attitud....not worth it
08:13:30midkayhaha. omg.
08:13:43JdGordonhaha, oh well
08:13:53midkaythat was.. haha.
08:14:11scorchei was about to offer him a full refund too =(
08:15:06Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
08:15:26scorchei like muting....much kinder than kicking =)
08:15:41scorcheas a first offense, at least
08:20:37calamwell, in fairness, his request seems one i can agree with to a point, not his manner though. i am a week old user, and have my share of difficulties, and yesterdays build has given me enough lockups that i went back to the one i started with, and i dont know if i should record & remark on the bugs i see, or if it is superflouis. i do think a notice posted in the log might be helpful for those of us who do not have
08:20:58scorchelatest bootloader: foorbar 2.3 (changed xx-xx-xxxx) on the builds page would be decent, no?
08:22:11kkurbjunwasn't there a suggestion a while ago to make the bootloaders aware of whether they are compatible with the build they are loading with some scramble magic?
08:22:39calambecause i have a couple requests for features i think would be easy (if i could help out, i would, but i do not know anything bout coding, so may be harder than i might expect) i would like to suggest if its okay.
08:22:52kkurbjunI remember linuxstb mentioning that when the work was being done on the gigabeat bootloader
08:23:13scorchecalam: we use the tracker for feature requests....please serarch if it has already been requested before first though please
08:23:21scorchei cannot type tonight...
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09:02:18*amiconn just realised that it would make sense to make splashes trigger the backlight
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09:04:53JdGordontrying t get bluetooth going
09:05:10JdGordonmy comp
09:06:12JdGordonmy phone
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09:07:06JdGordonsoo close... its askiung for a password or something :(
09:08:55 Quit hcs (Client Quit)
09:09:11JdGordonthe phone is asking for the key, not the computer...
09:09:43JdGordonI can send files across... cant sync though :(
09:09:47scorchetypically you type anumber in to use as the passkey, and then the computer will ask you to repeat that key
09:10:19JdGordontype the number on he fone, then it fails
09:10:54JdGordonthere is none
09:11:08daurnimatorlook up on web
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09:11:26scorchecheck in options of there is a place where you set the code
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09:40:36cropHehe. On, amiconn is only listed as an archos expert.
09:41:14scorcheit isnt fully fleshed out
09:41:36scorchethere are a few others who could qualify easily, but i would say he is the main archos dev
09:43:08cropscorche: but ONLY that?
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09:52:38linuxstbmarkun: Around?
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09:53:27cropscorche: I mean, I can't believe that amiconn can't be listed in many other sections
09:54:33scorcheas i said, it isnt fully fleshed out...also, devs can shoose to list themselves as whatever they wish
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09:58:17cropok, ok, I just wondered
10:09:09markunlinuxstb: I am now
10:10:43linuxstbmarkun: Looking at the gigabeat lcd driver in more detail, I've realised the lcd power-off (toggling bit 1 of LCD_CON1) is disabled unless enabled via the debug menu. I assume that was so it could be tested - any idea if it has been?
10:12:13markunlinuxstb: it was not saving any power according to toffe's measurements and gave problems with the remote
10:12:41markunso we turned it off for now
10:12:47linuxstbSo we could just remove it? Or do you think it's still useful if someone wants to do further tests?
10:14:11markunI guess it could be removed for the same reason as the DMA stuff
10:14:22markunit's still in svn if someone wants to play with it
10:14:33linuxstbWell, it's not actually causing any harm at the moment.
10:15:25linuxstbThe main reason I removed the DMA stuff was that it was buggy.
10:15:59chrisjs169|brbMy shorted sansa is now recognised again
10:16:00JdGordonyour sansa is working again?
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10:16:47chrisjs169|brbSort of
10:16:53chrisjs169|brbit's booting to preboot
10:17:11chrisjs169|brbso I use e200tool i2cprogram i2c-e260.bin?
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10:18:39JdGordonnot if you dont have to
10:18:52chrisjs169|brbso what do I do?
10:19:06chrisjs169|brbskip to just the BL?
10:19:31JdGordonpreboot is manuafacturer mode? or recovery?
10:19:45chrisjs169|brbpreboot is when the i2c fails
10:19:56chrisjs169|brbso it's lower than manufacturing mode
10:20:09JdGordonah, well you probably need to do the i2c thing...
10:20:16chrisjs169|brbprolly both...
10:20:16*JdGordon never got that low
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10:20:46chrisjs169|brbProgramming failed (-32, Broken pipe)
10:23:12linuxstbchrisjs169|brb: It sounds like your flash could be damaged - which is why it wouldn't boot in the first place.
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10:24:45chrisjs169|brbso i killed the flash?
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10:26:48chrisjs169|brbVerify error at 0x0000!
10:28:00chrisjs169|brbit does boot to preboot now, so I guess I just need to look for a new flash
10:29:55chrisjs169|brbthis might be a stretch, but could i possibly try reading from the sansa?
10:31:41chrisjs169|brbwait....part of the flash is still good
10:32:23chrisjs169|brbeven if I can't write to it, how could I possibly recover some of my files?
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10:38:44chrisjs169|brbXavierGr: you wouldn't happen to have a sansa would you?
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10:42:49chrisjs169|brbok....i'm gonna go back to bed.....can anyone tell me if it's possible to use e200 to recover some of my files? (it appears I can still read from it)
10:42:58chrisjs169|brb*use e200tool
10:44:33lachlanWhat files do you have on your sansa that need to be recovered? Surely its all backed up?
10:45:21SiltaarI added a #include"lang.h" in my sudoku plugin, and so now it has to compile lang.h and lang.c to generate a lang.o to link with sudoku.o...
10:45:36Siltaarbut the current makefile can't handle this...
10:45:42Siltaarany suggestion ?
10:45:58JurassicCchrisjs169|brb:what about i2cdump? (im probably way off base)
10:46:11JdGordonSiltaar: what are yuo trying to do?
10:49:31chrisjs169|brblachlan: It hasn't been backed up recently =/ I wasn't really planning on killing the flash today
10:49:41linuxstbSiltaar: You can't use core functions in a plugin - you have to export them via the plugin API. AFAIK, localisation isn't possible for plugins at the moment.
10:50:07chrisjs169|brbJurassicC: I'm trying to see if it's possible to recover my music etc using e200tool, since it seems I can still read (portions at least) of the flash
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10:51:21chrisjs169|brbI was thinking maybe ./e200tool read could do it, but I dunno the address of where the 'main' partition starts
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10:52:16Siltaarlinuxstb JdGordon, I added the talk_number and the talk_id function in the API
10:52:50Siltaarbut in order to use some IDs I need to include lang.h
10:53:17Siltaarmy goal is to achieve my speeking (adapted to blind poeple) sudoku
10:53:23chrisjs169|brbJurassicC: so would that be possible if I had the address?
10:54:07Siltaarthe talk number function is really great but, I need at least to be able to access to some labels such as 'No'
10:55:06JurassicCchrisjs169: yes, with the address. Right now im trying to find out what the e200tool i2cdump command does (maybe helpful?)
10:56:16Siltaaranother possibility could be to duplication I18n speaking functions in the code of sudoku plugin, and to build a second set of spoken 'labels' dedicated to Sudoku... :-(
10:56:59markunSiltaar: isn't it difficult to keep an overview of the sudoku board when you are blind?
10:57:33markunor do you have some solution for that?
10:57:50Siltaarit is possible, exactly as great chessplayers can easily play without the board
10:58:20Siltaarthe concept is proven, and usable on (or net)
10:58:34SiltaarI just adapt it to the Rockbox sudoku
10:59:20SiltaarAnd I certainly will make also a un-mine-man game using the same capabilities
11:00:05JurassicCchrisjs169: do you know the length you would need to read? if you start with 0x0000, couldnt you just read all of it, if you knew the length?
11:01:54SiltaarSo currently I was wondering about the better way to have lang.o accessible for sudoku linking, adding a link from existing lang.o to sudoku accessible directory ? Or addapt the sudoku make file...
11:02:30markunSiltaar: I don't think is the one, and .org doesn't do anything doesn't look like it either
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11:03:28SiltaarThen, I certainly be interested in adding I18n strings, for use in sudoku...
11:04:03Siltaarmarkun :
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11:05:13Siltaarcurrently, about every audio capabilities work, I just miss some strings such as 'draft list empty'...
11:05:29SiltaarI miss a enqueue-able beep
11:05:34SiltaarI miss I18n
11:06:05Siltaarand a self compiling project... (As currently I need to hand copy the lang.o file ^_^)
11:06:26markunSiltaar: ah, looks interesting:
11:06:38markunand doesn't involve your pro chess memory requirement
11:06:49Siltaarah ?
11:08:01markunI just wonder if we have enough buttons for playing the current row, column and square
11:08:16Siltaarits currently done like that in sudoku plugin, I added (on my side) a Speech menu, that allow to read lines columns squares and draft lists
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11:09:14Siltaarso the keybinding is the same as before for Sudoku
11:10:00markunbut you have not been able to play it yet with audio?
11:10:50Siltaarit works well with talk number function
11:11:01Siltaarand I added talk id as well in the API
11:11:22Siltaarbut now it can't compile with the current makefile
11:11:45Siltaaris the current sudoku makefile can't produce lang.o
11:12:39SiltaarSo was wondering, if it's better to ln existing lang.o in sudoku folder, or to modify the sudoku makefil
11:13:53SiltaarI don't understand so much the current makefile...
11:14:57XavierGrchrisjs169|brb: no I don't
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11:42:21daurnimatorJdGordon: you ever used openbsd?
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11:56:21Siltaaralso I wonder how to enqueue a 'bip' produced by pcm_beep
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12:04:19Siltaarif its possible
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12:13:10JdGordonanyone good with graphix and got 5 min spare?
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12:22:02SiltaarJdGordon, graphix means ?
12:23:58JdGordongraphics.. I cant spell... dont worry, decided i dont need help after all
12:29:06linuxstb_Siltaar: What exactly do you need from lang.o? Linking lang.o directly to your plugin doesn't sound a nice solution.
12:31:40linuxstb_Couldn't you just export language_strings[] via the plugin API and change the str() macro in lang.h to refer to rb->language_strings? I don't know the consequences of that though, and that may not be desired either...
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12:57:49pondlifeJdGordon: ping?
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12:57:59printfXh4Two questions.
12:58:09printfXh41) Does anyone know if Pacman works on Sansa e200?
12:58:15printfXh42) Can you play music while playing pacman?
12:58:27linuxstbyes, not on the Sansa.
12:58:27*printfXh4 is considering installing rockbox after finding out that there's a pacman plugin.
12:58:39printfXh4linuxstb, you mean yes to 1 and no to 2? :(
12:58:55JdGordonwhat can i do you for pondlife?
12:59:03pondlife perhaps? ;)
12:59:09printfXh4linuxstb, why no to 2? :(
12:59:13printfXh4Why oh why? :(
12:59:14pondlifeIt's a rather odd menu bug
12:59:18linuxstbBecause the CPU isn't fast enough to do both.
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12:59:45linuxstb(it's a Pacman arcade machine emulator, not a clone of Pacman, so it's very CPU intensive)
12:59:52pondlifeI expect it's something simple-ish, but I don't have time to do more than hit and run at the moment.
13:00:10printfXh4linuxstb, ah.
13:00:14printfXh4How about DOOM?
13:00:14linuxstbprintfXh4: In fact, I'm not even sure about 1), let me check...
13:00:16JdGordonpondlife: hmm... interesting.... wanna finish my crypto assignemtn so i can look at it ? :'(
13:00:18printfXh4:O :(
13:00:47pondlifeI work with crypto, but don't know much about the innards
13:00:57linuxstbprintfXh4: Yes, it's included in the Sansa builds.
13:01:01pondlifeAm happy to help with theory though..
13:01:10printfXh4!!! <3<3<3
13:01:18JdGordonpondlife: enigma machine is killing me :'(
13:01:28printfXh4linuxstb, but there's absolutely no chance music can be played simultaneously? How about music + DOOM? Or is that not possible either?
13:01:37pondlifeAh, that's not something I've covered.
13:02:08chrisjs169|brbnow that i have a (partial) backup of my sansa, how can I convert the hex file back into the regular files?
13:02:54pondlifeJdGordon: I'm more into the prime-based stuff, not substitution.
13:02:56linuxstbprintfXh4: No, that's not possible either. However, it could happen in the future if someone decided to use the second CPU core in the Sansa for it.
13:03:06pondlifeJdGordon: ?
13:03:17JdGordonpondlife: yeah, thats what we are woring off...
13:04:15linuxstbchrisjs169|brb: How partial is your backup? Do you have the start of the disk including the partition table etc ?
13:05:25linuxstbYou will need to try and run a FAT32 recovery tool on the partition dump. But the first thing to try would be to simply try to mount the disk image (simple in Linux, no idea about other OSes).
13:05:32*linuxstb afk for lunch
13:05:56chrisjs169|brblinuxstb: how could I mount it in Linux, being a hex file and all
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13:06:47chrisjs169|brbI've got 0x00000000 up to 0x02809a314 (roughly, when I originally said partial backup, it was because it timed out, so I restarted it)
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13:08:05chrisjs169|brbit's still running, up to ~55 megs
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13:33:33JdGordonpondlife: hmm... off bug you foun there :p
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13:58:35linuxstbchrisjs169|brb: You first need to extract the FAT32 partition from the whole-disk image (which is what I'm guessing you've dumped). I think "dd if=dump.bin of=part1.bin skip=63" should do it. Then (as root) "mkdir tmp ; mount -o loop -t vfat part1.bin tmp" to mount that partition. You can then copy files from tmp/
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14:18:47Siltaar(coming back from lunch) so, linuxstb, about lang.h, this file is in your /build folder, and so the makefile of sudoku plugin just give the following error message
14:18:56Siltaarno rule to make lang.o
14:19:47linuxstbYes, because you shouldn't be linking it directly in a plugin. It's linked to the core, so you can export it via the plugin API.
14:19:52Siltaaras I'm not so fond of makefiles, I was dreaming of a simple rule to add
14:20:55Siltaarcurrently I need to include lang.h in the plugin to be able to use talk_id
14:21:07Siltaarthat I added to the API
14:21:21Siltaarlike talk_number...
14:21:31Siltaarbut in fact
14:22:35SiltaarI would be pleased to be able to define a new set of talked strings... and new peusdo lang file (with mp3 inside), and index my imported version of talk_id on this new set of strings
14:23:30Siltaarif its help, I would prefer
14:23:47Siltaaras I need specific messages
14:24:50linuxstbThe problem is that currently plugins don't support speech or localisation - so you're adding those capabilities. I'm aware of some work (called langv2) which aims to implement it, but I'm not sure of the details. There is probably a wiki page about it though.
14:25:21linuxstbBagder is the main person behind it I think, but he's not around. If you wait, maybe someone who does know the plan will appear.
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14:27:18Siltaarok thanks
14:27:41Siltaarso next thing...
14:27:54SiltaarI use pcm_beep
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14:28:08Siltaarbut currently beep are not enqueued
14:28:47Siltaarand so, if I move fast accross the sudoku board, I may loose some beeps
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14:31:27Siltaaris it existing a system that allows to enqueue some beeps ?
14:31:57linuxstbI don't know.
14:33:33Siltaarok :-(
14:33:43LloreanWait, so you get a different number of beeps relative to the number of squares moved?
14:34:11SiltaarLlorean, no
14:34:21Siltaarjuste one beep by empty case
14:34:36LloreanWhat do you mean by losing beeps then?
14:34:43Siltaarbut we can moves faster that the "speaker"
14:35:26Siltaarso the numbers are queued, and continually said 'till you stop moving and they are all told
14:36:09Siltaarbut the beeps aren't queued, and so moving fast, you'll just ear the filled cell, and will loose the number of empty cell information
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14:36:34LloreanSo why not just play one beep per move, and only play the number if they stop in a cell?
14:36:52LloreanOr create an "empty" voice instead of using a beep?
14:37:51Siltaarplaying one beep per move is a good idea
14:38:31Siltaar"empty" is something long, beep is rather cool short, convenient
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14:54:22webguest05hey guys, ive just installed Rockbox Current build on my ipod 5th gen and when i start up Doom it comes up with a wad missing? any ideas? ant
14:54:51LloreanDid you get the necessary files from the Extras page for Doom?
14:55:49webguest05nope :( could ya post page over plz
14:56:12webguest05looking for it on rockbox now, but having difficultly finding it
14:56:25LloreanIt's the Extras page, it's got a download link on EVERY page of the site.
14:56:26bluebrotherwebguest05: read the section on the doom plugin in the manual
14:56:50bluebrotherit's all explained there. Including download links.
14:56:59webguest05ok :) sorry for being an idoit, thank you very much for your help :)
14:57:17 Quit FOAD_ ("I'll be back")
14:58:58lachlan_I was thinking- could the 'wad missing' message within doom be changed to something like 'wad missing- read manual for help'?
15:00:04JdGordonits a plugin, so some extra text is no big deal
15:00:28LloreanOf course, people are supposed to read the manual before asking for help anyway
15:00:47bluebrotherbut doesn't an error message somewhat imply "read manual / faq if you don't know what to do with this message"?
15:00:56LloreanI guess not.
15:01:21LloreanMaybe remove "Missing Base Wad" and replace it "See Manual to Install"
15:01:51bluebrotherremove all error messages and replace them with "RTFM!" :D
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15:02:27*bluebrother prefers error messages that actually tell details, even if the average user doesn't understand them
15:02:46*Llorean tends to agree
15:03:08aliaskWell, in this case having both the info and mention of the manual isn't unreasonable I wouldn't have thought.
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15:08:55bluebrotherhow about a "first start" plugin? Or a readme-first.txt in the root of the installation?
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15:09:26JdGordonyou really think people will read it?
15:09:45bluebrotherdon't know. Only if it's an autostart plugin that doesn't allow you to skip it.
15:09:52*JdGordon wouldnt have any problem with a rockbox-readme.txt file in the .zips
15:09:56aliaskThen it's just annoying if you update rockbox.
15:10:08LloreanI think a nag-screen plugin, even if it only runs once, would be irritating
15:10:22LloreanIt'd irritate more users than it'd help
15:10:26bluebrotherright. But it could be an autostart plugin that checks for some kind of magic file
15:10:36LloreanBut adding "See the manual" to every error message might not be the best solution either
15:10:48bluebrotherlike, if there is no config.cfg present, fire up the plugin
15:11:02bluebrotheror simply display a "check the manual" splash. Might be sufficient
15:14:52jaczehacknag screens to the people
15:15:19lachlan_Llorean: not to every message
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15:16:02lachlan_But some problems could be helped greatly by it. Doom for example. 'Missing wad' is a fairly basic error, it isn't something that needs a complex or comprehensive error message.
15:16:45peturs/Missing wad/Please install a WAD file
15:17:32JdGordonpetur wins!
15:17:43markunsounds friendlier
15:17:44Lloreanlachlan_: Most "error" messages are answered in the manual though
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15:19:36bluebrotherjust display "RTFM". Or even "PEBKAC" ;-)
15:19:45JdGordondaurnimator: wma's???
15:20:08daurnimatorsoz, caps lock'
15:20:14lachlan_The problem here is that your common village idiot (or user, if you will) runs into these problems simply because they neglect to read the manual. So having them pointed to the manual by the error message (when applicable, I'm not saying apply this to all, or even many error messages) will solve the problem
15:20:27peturbluebrother: keyboard and chair? more PEBDAC then...
15:20:46bluebrotherhehe :D
15:20:47Lloreanlachlan_: Yes, but then what criteria are used to select the messages that it's added to?
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15:21:43JdGordondaurnimator: i just connected you archos to see what music you had... acdc is in wma :'(
15:22:00daurnimatorheh, i still have that on there?
15:22:38daurnimatorI actually got in when I was in america - I was staying at an uncle's in chicago, and I had none of my own music there with me
15:22:51daurnimatorso, I loaded it up with his - which was 90% wma
15:23:26lachlan_Llorean: Its a common problem that a) is encountered by users that don't read the manual, and b) is fairly static c) is solved by the manual
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15:23:55bluebrotherrbutil will (hopefully) address this ...
15:24:06*JdGordon is guilty of nver reading the manual properly..
15:24:07Lloreanlachlan_: That's pretty much every error message we've got then.
15:24:08bluebrotherby presenting the user the manual :)
15:24:17JdGordona readme txt file would be nice...
15:24:22*bluebrother never read the manual too.
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15:24:49LloreanMost of the error messages other than the Illegal Instruction or Data Abort ones are there to help the user with basic problems
15:24:55daurnimatorJdGordon: if you're giving it back to me tomorrow, I'd appriciate not having to reload music onto it :P
15:25:14lachlan_except the 'common problem' part. Although common is fairly subjective, I would say 'doom isn't working how do i fix it ;(' is pretty common
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15:27:32LloreanDoom isn't working is maybe #2 for problems with an error message
15:27:45LloreanAfter "Codec failure / invalid version" style errors
15:28:16JdGordon... which a readme.txt file would be useless for :p
15:28:57Lloreanreadme.txt would be mostly useless anyway, if people aren't going to read the manual I think they're unlikely to read it either (in my opinion)
15:29:00bluebrotherit wouldn't be useless if the users would read it during installation on the pc.
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15:29:31bluebrotherLlorean, I tend to disagree. I usually have a look into the readme file in tarballs first
15:29:32lachlan_I'll stick with doom for the moment, I don't know much about the other errors. You usually just refer users to the manual anyway when asked for doom support, so why not just cut out the middle man?
15:29:53bluebrotherwhile I check the manual only if needed. But I might be by no ways representative ;-)
15:29:54Lloreanbluebrother: But you aren't the kind of user who wouldn't look to the manual when there's a problem.
15:30:10LloreanI think the sort of person who checks out a readme is the sort who'd also check out real documentation if they encounter a problem
15:30:25bluebrotherno, as I know who to nag I would go and do that instead :P
15:30:36bluebrotherbut speaking of the average user you're right.
15:30:53Lloreanlachlan_: My point though is that, if we're going to do it for doom, there are plenty of other relevant error messages it could be done for.
15:31:30Lloreanlachlan_: And I think adding a line to nearly every relevant error message is not the best solution: We shouldn't have to repeat it all over the place. We need to figure out some way to get the idea to them up front.
15:32:09bluebrotherreplace the website front page with a big fat link to the manual ;-)
15:32:30lachlan_Are the more variable that can be associated with the other error message though. Data Abort, for instance. Does that require help from a person as opposed to simple instructions from the manual? If not, then what problem is there with the error message reffering the user to the manual.
15:32:56LloreanData Abort does require human assistance
15:33:00LloreanIt's pretty much useless to the end user
15:33:06 Quit perldiver (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
15:33:11lachlan_Password protect the zip archives for the builds, and hide the passowrd in the manual
15:33:22LloreanBut my point is, it's incredibly tacky to have 2/3 of the error messages say "Please see the manual"
15:33:34LloreanIt feels very condescending to the intelligent end user
15:33:51*petur agrees
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15:34:17lachlan_When 2/3 of the messages can be resolved by seeing the manual, it makes perfect sense. What exactly do you mean by 'tacky'. Do you mean inconsistant? I would call it adaptive personally.
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15:35:21LloreanImproper and tasteless. It feels like a crude solution
15:35:35LloreanMost users are intelligent enough to use the manual
15:35:55LloreanAnd when an error happens after they have read the manual, seeing "Please read the manual" suggests to them that the program is saying that they mustn't have.
15:36:03LloreanIt's an issue of the face you put forward.
15:36:28lachlan_Yes, but wouldn't reading the manual in the first place have helped them to not get the error?
15:36:29LloreanAsking the user to read the manual as part of the error message creates an image that you feel the users may not be intelligent enough to think of doing that themselves.
15:36:52LloreanI'd rather respect the average user and deal with the occasional one who doesn't than have a message like that which seems on average, disrespectful to the larger group
15:37:08Lloreanlachlan_: You can read the manual and still make a mistake, rather easily
15:37:30LloreanBut the point is primarily an issue of tone
15:38:20lachlan_but if you apply the message only to basic mistakes which could be avoided by readi the manual...?
15:38:38LloreanWhich is *all* of them except Data Abort and Illegal Instructions
15:38:51LloreanBoth of which are only caused by errors in the software
15:39:00lachlan_I see your point, and maybe the 'read the manual' messages could only be applied to errors in a way that your average 'intelligent' user simply won't encounter them
15:39:17LloreanHow would you suggest doing that?
15:40:52lachlan_I don't know the ins and outs of Rockbox very well, but I would say your average 'intelligent' user would have no trouble at all working doom. Therefore your average 'unintelligent' user would be the only one that sees the 'read the manual' message. Seeming condescending to a user such as this is not really concerning.
15:42:18LloreanI'd rather not seem condescending to anyone, it discourages use of the software. But you're back to arbitrarily deciding which errors are "simple" and which aren't.
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15:43:14lachlan_Why is being told to read the manual in a doom error message different to being told to the read the manual by you when they inevitabley come into the IRC channel looking for answers?
15:44:05LloreanBecause most of the people who see that message *will* read the manual, *without* asking me.
15:44:14LloreanAnd without having to have a piece of software tell them to do something they already knew to do.
15:44:51LloreanThat's the thing: They install Rockbox, and Rockbox "includes" Doom, so it's reasonable to assume that Doom will work once Rockbox is installed, without further steps.
15:44:58LloreanWhen it doesn't, the intelligent user will look up Doom in the manual
15:45:17LloreanI wouldn't expect the majority to look up Doom before it failing to work, because they expect the "everything is included" aspect of Rockbox to extend to it.
15:45:19lachlan_Maybe if your phrased in nicely. "You were probably going to read it already, but incase you didn't know, Rockbox has a great manual that addresses this very issue". Obviously to verbose, but along those lines.
15:45:37Domonokyhm, a button for downloading and installing the free doom files in rbutil would be nice :-)
15:45:53LloreanI think the best solution would to be to add some further notes to the portion of the manual that explains the Extras for Fonts to go on to say that Doom won't work without th extras package for Doom
15:46:03lachlan_Domonoky: indeed it would. Perhaps you could impliment it.
15:46:26Domonokyif i find the time, i will, thats a really small feature.. :-)
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15:46:51lachlan_Domonoky: I was about to say, that should be fairly easy to add
15:46:51LloreanDomonoky: Yeah, the extras package is all you need, extracted straight to the device, it has the folder structure properly, much like the fonts one, if I recall.
15:47:22Domonokyjeah, its the same as font installing, so only a new button, and some glue is needed..
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15:48:18lachlan_Domonoky: Do you plan on making Ubuntu/Linux binaries, or is that a job for another man?
15:49:56Domonokylachlan_: i tried to build linux binarys, but there were some problems about depencies, and i dont know too much about linux binarys, and depencies.. :-)
15:50:13Domonokyso its probably a job for another man :-)
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15:51:07lachlan_I remember GodEater had a swipe at it a while ago and stalled in the same manner
15:51:15desowinobo: thanks for patch! You rock man!
15:51:45oboyou're welcome :)
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15:52:41Domonokythe problem with the depencies is that you need wx2.8 for rbutil, and thats not aviable as a package for most distros, so someone has to try to build a static binary :-)
15:53:30lachlan_is that a difficult task, or are there simply not enough motivated people?
15:54:12oboDomonoky: is it possible to add −−version 2.8 to the wx-config calls in the makefile?
15:55:04Domonokythere arent many people involved in rbutil, so its a lack of time and people :-)
15:55:52Domonokyobo: sure its possible, but i dont know what this switch does :-)
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15:56:27lachlan_I'm off to bed, goodnight all
15:56:29linuxstblachlan_: I think the problem is also the dependencies statically linking wx generates - i.e. wx itself also depends on lots of external libs. It's chaos...
15:56:31oboit forces wx-config to return 2.8 paths if more than one version are installed on a system - my machine has both 2.6 and 2.8 packages
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15:57:28desowinobo: anyway, the multiple delete isn't in win32 binary, it was introduced after 0.4
15:57:28olle_hello hello
15:57:33olle_anyone of you are involved in developing for newer irivers?
15:57:55obodesowin: ah, that would explain it
15:58:04linuxstbolle_: Which irivers are you referring to?
15:58:25olle_IFP series. at IfpCrypt Analysis in thw wiki, there seems like there's no progress
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15:59:13linuxstbolle_: The iFP port is basically a one-man job.
15:59:34Domonokyobo: i added it in my local copy, and will commit it, when i have a bit more changes :-)
15:59:37olle_yeah i know, thats a bit sad
15:59:58obothanks Domonoky
16:00:22olle_it just seemd like the ppl who succeeded to patch the firmware knows newer facts than in the wiki
16:00:39olle_maybe i should drop them a mail
16:01:19linuxstbThat's probably the best way to contact him - he's very rarely in IRC.
16:01:44olle_youre talking about Tomek?
16:02:14Siltaarlinuxstb, Llorean, I just tested with a beep.mp3 and the talk file function, its exactly what I needed :-) (ok users will have to install special sounds files to have a speaking sudoku, but it clear all the problems)
16:02:24olle_he seems to be the active IFP developer
16:02:29 Quit FOAD (Client Quit)
16:02:43linuxstbolle_: Yes.
16:04:01linuxstbSiltaar: Which device are you developing on? (are you aware of the differences between "hwcodec" and "swcodec" devices in Rockbox?)
16:05:02Siltaarno, I'm not
16:05:12Siltaarbut I'm curious ?
16:05:17Siltaaris it wrote somewhere ?
16:05:24olle_hardware codec VS software codec?
16:05:34Siltaarsound like this
16:06:27SiltaarI currently use the rockboxui, and will certainly have to make it work on Sansa (will be bought by my labo)
16:08:13olle_damn , im kind of angry, cos i had a draft of half of the source code for my program on a piece of paper, but i forgot it at school
16:10:21markunolle_: what kind of program?
16:11:44olle_in absense of the e.t. knowledge of Tomek, i will try to analyze the firmware's (assumed) checksums and compare it to my own calculated ones from the decoded file to get a key
16:12:26olle_to later make a complete encoder/decoder for the IFP/E/U/clix series
16:12:42markunah, I thought it was already quite complete
16:12:54olle_no unfortunatley not
16:14:20markunalso, it looks like the clix firmware is not decoded correctly
16:14:37olle_thats bad news
16:14:42olle_for the future
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16:15:15markunat least I can't see any strings like in the other firmwares (U10, T10/20/30, E10)
16:15:40olle_in the very beggining there must be a string "Clix " or somethg
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16:16:18markundoesn't work for the S10 neither
16:16:28olle_E10's has a lot of strings, but not as many as you couild excpect, maybe the UI strings are encrypted once more
16:16:41olle_what program are you using really?
16:17:04olle_ohkay, same as me
16:17:28olle_using " -f 2files" ? try that
16:17:55markunah, ok
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16:22:21linuxstbSiltaar: (sorry, I was taken away...) "hwcodec" refers to the older Archos devices Rockbox supports - they have a relatively slow CPU and a hardware MP3 decoding chip. "swcodec" refers to all other devices (iriver, cowon, ipods, sansa etc) where they have a relatively fast CPU which does all the audio decoding, and the uncompressed PCM data is sent to the DAC.
16:23:42kkurbjunmarkun, a new bootloader build might help him, there were some fixes done to the USB/ATA stuff after that latest bootloader
16:23:54kkurbjundoes this happen on your player also?
16:24:09markundidn't try it
16:24:16markunbut thought you would be interested
16:24:30Siltaarlinuxstb: it implies some problems using talk_file function ? (depending on the device ?)
16:25:03kkurbjunit shouldn't be any different then connecting from the main build
16:26:20linuxstbSiltaar: I don't know very much about the talk functions, but I would expect there to be at least some subtle differences between hwcodec and swcodec. Hopefully someone who does will be along soon...
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16:41:41amiconnlinuxstb, Siltaar: talk_file should work on all targets regardless
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16:43:02linuxstbamiconn: What about the issue of stopping playback? (is it an issue?) sudoku doesn't normally require it.
16:43:48linuxstbamiconn: (I don't know if you're read the logs, but Siltaar is working on a talking sudoku)
16:46:58pixelmaI _guess_ it just wouldn't talk while music is playing (like the menus...)
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16:48:57michaelhoHi all, I seem to have a problem installing rockbox to my ipod video
16:49:51michaelhoafter i installed the bootload the ipod freezes at the apple screen and it wont connect with the computer
16:49:55michaelhoanyone care to help me out?
16:50:53Siltaar(sorry haven't an iPod)
16:51:16Siltaar(don't loose hop)
16:51:39***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:52:25Lloreanmichaelho: Did you install Rockbox itself, or just the bootloader?
16:52:33linuxstbmichaelho: Did you actually install Rockbox? i.e. download and extract the contents to your ipod.....
16:52:33michaelhojust the bootloader
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16:52:50michaelhothe thing is, i cannot get access to the ipod now
16:52:53linuxstbmichaelho: Out of curiousity, which instructions are you following?
16:53:04michaelhowhen i link it via usb nothing shows
16:53:13michaelhofollowing the manual i downloaded from rockbox site
16:53:16habuntuHi all
16:53:47Lloreanmichaelho: Okay, then why didn't you follow the instructions as they were written in the manual? Is there some way we can make it more clear that you need to do all of the steps?
16:53:50amiconnlinuxstb: pixelma guesses correctly, it just wouldn't talk on hwcodec while music is playing
16:54:15michaelhoi thought i did follow them correctly
16:54:24Lloreanmichaelho: As for your current problem, if you hold Menu+Select to reboot, then turn on the hold switch immediately, it should go into the Apple firmware and you can finish from there
16:54:25habuntufor sansa dev hackers, i may have discovered a bug with rockboy functions.
16:54:29Lloreanmichaelho: You skipped an entire full section of the manual
16:54:50habuntucant save/load anymore
16:54:52michaelho2.1 prerequisities
16:55:00Lloreanmichaelho: You skipped 2.2.3.  Installing the firmware
16:56:11michaelhodamn.....i see it now
16:56:22michaelhoLlorean is my ipod now totally broken?
16:56:29Lloreanmichaelho: I already told you what you needed to do.
16:56:33Lloreanmichaelho: As for your current problem, if you hold Menu+Select to reboot, then turn on the hold switch immediately, it should go into the Apple firmware and you can finish from there
16:56:52linuxstbmichaelho: Seriously, if you can suggest how we can improve the manual, please do. I'm not sure how we can make it clearer...
16:57:15michaelhomaybe break up that section a bit more
16:57:21linuxstbWhich section?
16:57:38LloreanYeah, I'd thought a section entitled "Installing the firmware" would be fairly clearly a step you want to do when you want to install the firmware.
16:58:02LloreanIsn't 2.2.2 just "choosing a Rockbox version"?
16:58:07michaelhoAfter downloading the Rockbox package connect your player to the computer
16:58:10michaelhothis section
16:58:20linuxstbmichaelho: I agree 2.2.2 is long, which is why 2.2.3 is now separate (it used to be part of 2.2.2 as well).
16:58:25michaelhoadd a subtitle here so people know this is the iimportant step
16:58:38michaelhobut yes, tbh its my fault for not reading it all
16:58:45michaelhoi am kind of impatient
16:58:51Lloreanmichaelho: Is "2.2.3.  Installing the firmware" not a subtitle?
16:59:14michaelhoyes, but i think steps for installation from beginning to end should short steps
16:59:16linuxstbAll the steps are important, which is why they're there. I guess people don't realise that.
16:59:53LloreanSo, it's not really a solvable problem, since it seems to be 'people don't want to read that much' vs our 'people need to know at least this much'
17:00:05michaelhothe text above 'After downloading the Rockbox package connect your player to the computer via'
17:00:10michaelhoseems to be just description
17:00:22Lloreanmichaelho: Where in the manual does it say "After downloading the Rockbox package" exactly?
17:00:28LloreanWhat section, as I'm not seeing it in the one I'm looking at.
17:00:36michaelhopage 12
17:00:52michaelho4th paragraph
17:01:02linuxstbWhat's the section number? (I'm browsing the HTML)
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17:01:26michaelhoafter archieved build
17:01:27Lloreanmichaelho: What's the date on the .pdf file you have?
17:01:28michaelhoafter note
17:01:34LloreanYou're using an outdated manua
17:01:42michaelhomay 2007
17:01:46michaelhomay 5
17:01:53LloreanYes, that's 11 days old
17:02:11LloreanThe installation section has been changed for clarity since then
17:02:16michaelhoah right
17:02:18michaelhook thanks
17:02:25michaelhoill get that one and start again
17:02:35bluebrothermichaelho, out of curiousity: where did you get the manual? From
17:03:04LloreanDid you download it 11 days ago then?
17:03:17michaelhoi must have, i didn't download it today
17:03:30michaelhook i have may 16 now
17:03:48*bluebrother wonders how many outdated manual downloads are around in the internet
17:04:10Lloreanbluebrother: Probably not too many
17:04:15michaelhothanks for your help Llorean
17:04:21LloreanPeople who tend to host their own copies to share often create their own "tutorial"
17:04:33michaelhoi should have read it more closely
17:05:02Lloreanmichaelho: You should never, ever install anything referred to as "firmware" without very very carefully reading the instructions
17:05:17LloreanThough iPods are fortunately pretty safe, many devices can be permanently disabled by an improper firmware install.
17:05:37linuxstbmichaelho: Don't take it too personally, it's a common error - which is why the manual was improved. It's just unfortunate you used a slightly old version of the manual without the clarification.
17:05:59michaelhoi'm usually quite good with instructions but i think this maybe i read over it too fast
17:06:10michaelhobecause i didn't see that bit that i highlighted above
17:06:22michaelhothe 1st set of instructions i saw was the bootloader bit
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17:17:30Siltaarhum... for-cultur question
17:17:53Siltaarthere are some chars, ints and shorts in the Sudoku plugin
17:18:03michaelhoim installing the fonts package now
17:18:25Siltaarthe regarding to the encoded values, everything could be encoded in chars
17:18:29michaelhois that dragging the rockbox folder in the fonts zip file to the player directly and overwriting any necessary files?
17:19:13 Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
17:19:19Siltaaris there any policy about the choice of type ? is really a visible gain of performance using shorts and not ints ?
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17:20:44linuxstbSiltaar: Generally, ints are prefered, as that's the type the CPU works best with. Only if you have a lot of them should you use chars or shorts. Also be aware that for portability, you should specify "signed char" or "unsigned char" explicitly if you're using them to store numbers.
17:21:06linuxstb(numbers < 0 or numbers > 127)
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17:22:31Siltaarok, so I will pass the two editmode and (new) talkmode in unsigned chars...
17:22:57Siltaaralso the table of possibilities
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17:26:48linuxstbmichaelho: Dragging should work, but the suggested method is to use the "extract to" option in your unzipping program, and select your ipod's disk as the destination.
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17:47:38pearldiverany idea why am i seeing the default wps instead of any custom ones when with the current build?
17:47:42pearldivergigabeat target
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17:53:57linuxstbpearldiver: Are your WPSs compliant? The parser is very strict now and rejects invalid WPSs.
17:54:11pearldiverim looking at it right now
17:54:18pearldiversome of them still work
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17:58:59Nico_Ppearldiver: album art tags in an official build can cause the problem, you should comment them out
17:59:17Nico_Ppearldiver: otherwise it can be because of irregular conditionals
17:59:38pearldiverNico_P yeah, i was just commenting them out as you typed that :P
18:00:08pearldiverdoes it mean we can say byebye to the aa patch?
18:00:30Nico_Pno, because the AA patch will make AA tags be recognized correctly
18:00:42pearldiverahh i see
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18:01:31Nico_Pthe problem comes from the fact that the AA tags uses '|' chars and these aren't allowed outside a conditional or some special tags... in a regular build the AA tag isn't recognised as one of these
18:01:54pearldiveri see that aa patch wasnt updated in a while
18:02:12pearldiverdo you have an idea if its synced Nico_P?
18:02:34Nico_PI'm not maintaining it anymore... there are a lot of people who know how to and I can't make it any better until I do MoB
18:02:48Nico_Pso I'm focusing on more important things
18:02:51linuxstbNico_P: What happens with RTC tags on a target without RTC? Are they ignored silently, or do they mean the WPS is rejected?
18:03:18Nico_Plinuxstb: they get ignored silently because they don't contain any special chars
18:03:39Nico_Pthe debugwps output will show them as "unknown tag"
18:04:09linuxstbAh, OK.
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18:17:42XavierGrdamn I forgot and top-posted :(
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18:26:15michaelhohi all, i downloaded a theme from rockbox theme site, extracted the dir to the rockbox folder and then selected the theme in browse theme section of rockbox
18:26:41michaelhohowever my screen looks nothing like the screen shot on the theme site
18:26:57michaelhohow do i apply the theme?
18:28:00linuxstbWhich theme?
18:28:17michaelhoajant orange
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18:29:04michaelhofor ipod video
18:29:17linuxstbHow is your ipod different to that theme? Is the background image there? Does the text font look different?
18:29:30linuxstbi.e. exactly what are the differences?
18:29:31pearldiverah AA patch still works, good
18:29:53michaelhothe batery symbol
18:29:54michaelhothe time
18:30:10michaelhopeak bar thingy
18:30:24michaelhothe one on my screen looks very very basic
18:30:48michaelhoand yes background is different too
18:31:09linuxstbAre you sure all the files are in the right place? e.g. in the .rockbox folder on your ipod, you should have a wps folder, and in that folder, an "Ajant Orange" folder containing lots of bmp files.
18:31:44linuxstbIn .rockbox/backdrops/ you should have an "Ajant Orange.bmp" file...
18:31:54michaelhoi basically dragged the rockbox folder from the zip file to my ipod root folder
18:32:15 Quit hcs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:32:27michaelhothat should put them in the right places?
18:32:48linuxstbDid your screen change at all when you selected the theme in Browse Themes?
18:32:58michaelhoorange background
18:33:02michaelhofont changes
18:33:30linuxstbDo you have the files I listed?
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18:35:06linuxstbtoffe82: markun told me that you did some power measurements with the lcd poweroff enabled/disabled (the debug menu option). Can you remember the details of your results?
18:35:16linuxstbmarkun said it made no difference...
18:35:28toffe82it is on the wiki
18:36:31jacobIs there a way to drag and drop music directly to an ipod and play it? If so, what directory should I drag it to?
18:36:40michaelholinuxstb yes all the bmps are there
18:38:48linuxstbtoffe82: Thanks. What do "lcd on", "lcd half off" and "lcd off" mean in those tests?
18:39:07badsheepyonly in rockbox jacob, and then you can put it anywhere you like on the device
18:39:14linuxstbjacob: You can drag music anywhere you want - most people use some variation of "Artist/Album/track.mp3" organisation.
18:39:47linuxstbmichaelho: Then I'm not sure what the problem is. Do other themes work for you?
18:40:00jacobyou mean in the /.rockbox directory?
18:40:04michaelhoi tried ajant blue
18:40:08michaelhoand it was same result
18:40:13badsheepyno anywhere on the device you like
18:40:22jacobawesome, thanks!
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18:43:40toffe82linuxstb: lcd on is with the default setting of brightness, off is when the backlight goes off, and half is a setting which is by default on the original firmware (it doesn't go black while listening, just half if I remember)
18:44:16linuxstbOK, so it just means "backlight on", "backlight half-off" and "backlight off" ?
18:44:49pearldivertheres a setting for half-off now?
18:45:18toffe82linuxstb: I can redo it if you want to see something else, if I have some times;)
18:45:18linuxstbtoffe82: markun was referring to the extra lcd poweroff code (gwhite added it, it's enabled by an option in the debug menu) to toggle bit 1 of LCDCON1 on and off.
18:45:34linuxstbThe code is in the lcd driver, but is disabled by default...
18:45:56michaelhoi have read about a patch for applying themes to the ipod video
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18:46:24michaelhoi haven't applied any patches, could this be the problem?
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18:47:01toffe82linuxstb: I remember , I didn't mentioned it becaus it was more or less the same, there was no difference, but I can recheck
18:47:08linuxstbmichaelho: Maybe the ajant themes just don't work with current Rockbox any more. The WPS parser has become stricter recently, so some old (and not 100% perfect) WPSs are now rejected.
18:47:40 Quit olle_ ("Konversation terminated!")
18:47:50linuxstbtoffe82: Yes, that's the check I'm interested in. I'm trying to clean up the code, and if that experiment didn't improve anything, maybe it should be removed.
18:48:32linuxstbmarkun also mentioned something about it causing problems with the remote...
18:49:43toffe82linuxstb: I try to do it but can't say you when, hope before the end of the week. I don't remeber about the remote
18:51:27linuxstbOK, thanks. It could be interesting to see if Rockbox has changed in the last few months.
18:51:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:51:49michaelhoall the themes i have triedseem to have the same problem
18:52:08michaelhothey all look the same except the colour of their background
18:52:21linuxstbWhat about the themes that come with Rockbox - e.g. iCatcher ?
18:52:53michaelhothat one seem to work
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18:53:28linuxstbYou need to make sure you only download themes that say "Any Recent Daily Build" underneath them - unless you install whatever unofficial version of Rockbox the theme demands.
18:53:38linuxstbBut I need to go, good luck.
18:53:40 Quit linuxstb ("Client Exiting")
18:53:57michaelhothe ajant orange says recent daily build
18:54:16jaco1Hi, awhile ago I asked about draging and droping in Rockbox. I tried dragging onto the iPod, but no luck. The music wasn't found when I selected database in the menu. Am I doing something wrong?
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18:55:19michaelhojaco1 did you check under files?
18:57:21jaco1All that's there is calender, notes and stuff like that
18:57:25michaelhocan someone with a 5th Gen ipod try the ajant orange theme and tell me if it works or not please
18:57:38michaelhowhere did you drag ur music into?
18:58:08michaelhowhere it has calender etc.
18:58:13michaelhocreate a folder called MUSIC
18:58:17michaelhoand put all ur music in there
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18:59:42aldoHi There
18:59:44jaco1Hey that worked, thanks
18:59:53michaelhowhich ipod do u have?
18:59:55jaco1Where do I get the theme? Mines 5th gen
18:59:59michaelhook cool
19:00:04michaelhou can help me check if the theme works or not
19:00:12michaelhogoto rockbox website
19:00:22michaelhoand click on the link 'extras'
19:00:44michaelhojust go here
19:01:14jaco1I'll try it soon, what time will you be on today?
19:01:16michaelhodownload a theme you like
19:01:53Domonokyyou could also try rbutil for installing themes :-)
19:02:06jaco1thnx, i have to go now, bye!
19:02:12 Quit jaco1 ("Leaving.")
19:03:08michaelhorockbox utility is available for osx?
19:03:25michaelhoit says it on on the site but then in the download box it says n/a
19:03:45Domonokyat the bottom of the page is a .dmg file..
19:03:58Domonokybut its not the newest version, but it should work..
19:06:13mcuelenaereis there anyone here who wants to help me testing a plugin I made ?
19:07:41michaelhohmmm the ajant orange theme still doesnt work
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19:24:31*Domonoky needs someone with graphical skills, i need a new button pic for rbutil ( Doom installation)
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19:26:27leftrightwhat is the shuffling algorithum that RBox uses ? please.
19:28:23leftrightit has a fancy name, amiconn ?
19:29:22Domonokyafaik for random rockbox uses the "mersenne twister" but for the shuffel, i dont know :-)
19:30:21leftrightthanks, i wan to read up about it, for I am not sure if shuffle is shuffling :-)
19:31:35LloreanUm, what do you mean by it not shuffling?
19:31:57leftrightwhen I create large playlists, >80 tracks, I get two songs form the same album consective, so I'm wondering if this is intended behaviour
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19:32:20LloreanI mean statistically speaking, this is entirely possible.
19:32:26LloreanIt has never, ever happened to me though
19:32:31LloreanBut there's nothing to prevent it.
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19:33:06leftrightuhuh, it just seems stange to get two of a kind in a shuffled list
19:33:19leftrightespecially a large list
19:33:22LloreanIt's just unlikely, but for a true shuffle, it's not nearly impossible.
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19:34:31leftrightI honestly dont expect that, but if that's the intended behaviour then it is what it is
19:34:40mhoDid the recent build affect the themes a great deal?
19:34:47LloreanWell, what do you mean by intended behaviour?
19:35:06LloreanIt's intended that a shuffle is a random reorganization of the song list, which would allow the possibility for some to end up sequential.
19:35:22LloreanDo you expect shuffle to force sequential songs to be separated if they happen?
19:35:49leftrightI dont expect two songs concecutively from the same album in a large playlist when shuffled
19:36:07LloreanYes, but what do you mean by "don't expect"?
19:36:14LloreanDo you mean that you expect it to be impossible, or just unlikely?
19:36:47pixelmaSoap: hopefully you are around... if you have some time, could you answer me some questions about colinux?
19:36:52leftrighterr, do you know what the name of the shuffle algorithim is ?
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19:37:38LloreanNo, I do not, or I would've answered when you first asked it.
19:37:51leftrightjolly good
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19:38:01LloreanBut do you expect it to be impossible or merely unlikely?
19:39:10leftrightthats why I want to know what the intended behaviour of the algorithim is, I woouldn't expect that type of shuffling in large playlists
19:39:28LloreanI'm trying to figure out what you mean, but you keep avoiding the question
19:39:34LloreanWhat *exactly* do you mean by "wouldn't expect"
19:39:38LloreanThat suggests to me that it surprised you.
19:39:41LloreanBut I got that already
19:39:43LloreanWhat DO you expect?
19:41:02leftrightto me, shuffle means I shouldn't hear two from the same album consecutive, thats my interpretation of it, but let me stress that I want to find out the intended behaviour of the algorithim
19:41:17LloreanShuffle means "randomized order"
19:41:32LloreanLike shuffling a deck of cards, or any other thing.
19:41:49leftrightso two from the same album consecutively is Random ?
19:42:00LloreanWhy wouldn't it be?
19:42:16Domonokyi need a pic for the doom installing button for rbutil, paint on this pic : domonoky/default.bmp">
19:42:36leftrightyes youre totally right 100% correct, completely,
19:43:03Lloreanleftright: If it's truly random, there is possibility that sequential songs could happen. If it prevented sequential songs it would no longer be random.
19:43:32leftrightthats your logic, and i dont agree
19:43:47LloreanHow can you disagree?
19:43:52LloreanRandom has a set definition.
19:44:39LloreanA random shuffle means that any as you're generating the list, any song not yet in the list has an equal probability of being chosen as the next entry
19:44:49LloreanThis includes the song that actually is sequentially next from that album
19:44:57leftrightyes you're right, 100%,can we stop this pleae, all I want is the name of the algorithim
19:45:00LloreanIf you prevent that song being chosen, it is no longer matching the mathematical definition of random
19:45:21leftrightI KNOW tyhe meaning of random, thank you
19:45:33pixelmamho: are you the one with problems regarding the ajant theme? Had a quick look at the "code" and it has at least two mistakes in the code that makes parsing fail now, so that rockbox falls back to the default (a while ago rockbox was more tolerant and the theme seemed to work, that's why noone noticed)
19:45:46Lloreanleftright: Then how do you think that preventing equal distribution is still truly random?
19:46:14leftrightmaybe the info in on the wiki ?
19:46:31leftrightthanks later
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19:46:56*Llorean laments the fact that people aren't forced to take a class in statistics.
19:47:06 Quit FOAD (Remote closed the connection)
19:47:34LloreanA true random shuffle could give you the exact same playlist back every single time over 100 reshuffles and still be working fine. =/
19:48:31DomonokyLlorean: if you get this on your player, you schould be playing lotto :-)
19:48:52LloreanIf it ever happens, even once, that very same day I'm going out for lotto tickets. :-P
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19:52:22pixelmaDomonoky: how do the other buttons look like? And would it be allowed to use a standard doom icon?
19:53:03Domonokyi will upload a few other button pics..
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19:55:41Domonokyother button pics: domonoky/tools2_3d.bmp">
19:56:26Domonokyand the new doom button shouldnt be too different, but do as you like :-)
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19:58:16*linuxstb reads the logs and would expect a shuffled playlist of only 80 tracks to produce consecutive tracks from the same album almost always
19:58:39LloreanI'd expect it at least moderately often, yes.
19:58:46Llorean80 isn't really that long.
19:58:52linuxstbIt's only 8 albums of 10 tracks...
20:02:22pixelmaDomonoky: any reason for the bmps being 8-bit?
20:02:40Domonokyi just converted them..
20:02:46pixelma(or at least the default is)
20:03:00Domonokythey are in xpm format in rbutil, but i can convert..
20:03:15Domonokythe theme one is 24 bit..
20:03:34pixelmaok - so I don't have to care
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20:15:55mhohi, can someone tell me the date in which the build started affecting themes?
20:16:46LloreanWhat do you mean?
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20:17:02LloreanThe change that prevents broken themes from loading is in the changelog.
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20:17:40mhoLlorean you said that the coding for themes is more pricky now, and therefore some themes no longer work
20:17:58LloreanThe coding isn't changed.
20:17:58mhoi really like the ajant orange theme and want to use an older build so that i can use that theme
20:18:09mhoJust wondering which build it is that i should get
20:18:09LloreanRockbox just refuses to load themes that had errors, where before it would load them.
20:18:17mhoah right
20:18:36mhoi basically have the same problem as this person
20:18:53mhohowever they manage to fix their problem by reinstalling rockbox
20:18:57LloreanBasically, the proper solution is to fix the theme.
20:19:06mhoive tried this many times but there is no change
20:20:13LloreanIf the problem is actually the theme, reinstalling Rockbox won't fix it.
20:20:17linuxstbmho: You could edit the .wps file and fix the problem there.
20:20:36linuxstb.wps files are just plain text files - the CustomWPS wiki page explains the formatting codes
20:20:49mhoi'm a real noob, i doubt i will be able to do it, only started using rockbox today
20:21:14linuxstbNobody is born understanding Rockbox .wps files...
20:22:32 Quit hcs ()
20:22:56pixelmamho: I told you something about this before - I've found at least 2 errors in the code that make the parsing fail after a quick glance.
20:23:04pixelmaDomonoky: could I try DCC send or should I upload it
20:23:29Domonokypixelma: i think dcc doesnt work, so you have to upload, or email..
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20:24:34mhopixelma yes i understand that the theme doesnt work with the current build because of errors, however I was just wondering if i could use it with an older build?
20:25:05 Quit chrisjs169|brb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:26:20pixelmaDomonoky: pm
20:26:24Lloreanmho: It'd be better to just fix the theme, or you're going to be stuck using an outdated Rockbox build.
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20:28:07mhoLlorean am trying to find the custom wps wiki page, would you have a link to it?
20:28:28pixelmamho: it would be, but you could also open up the .wps file in text editor and fix it - if you want to, I could tell you the two things I saw - not sure if that's all, parts of it are quite confusing and there's on tag in it I don't understand at all
20:28:45linuxstbNico_P: How self-contained is the WPS parser? I'm wondering if some makefile magic could create a verbose wps validator. Such a validator could even be added to
20:29:24linuxstb(I'm talking about a standalone executable)
20:29:35mhopixelma, please tell me what you saw, id really appreciate it
20:30:18pixelmado you have the file open in an editor?
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20:31:29Lloreanlinuxstb: From the sound of it, it sounded like parsing could be split semi-readily when there was discussion of pre-parsed files, but I'm not sure if any of the talk came from Nico_P himself in that discussion so I could be wrong
20:32:00mhopixelma yes
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20:33:07Javacat_Hey! I've just got an X5 and want to install rockbox on it, but there are two firmwares (X5 and X5V), anyone know the difference?
20:33:16Javacat_Mines the 60GB X5
20:33:28Javacat_*Cowon iAudio
20:34:35Javacat_bah, think it's just X5
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20:34:57pixelmamho: anything against pm - don't want to clutter up the channel (and logs) with it
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20:36:09LloreanJavacat_: Yes, the X5V firmware is for players specifically of the X5V type. you want the normal X5
20:36:39Javacat_out of interest, do you happen to know the difference?
20:37:03LloreanNo clue
20:37:12crwlX5V didn't have a radio, IIRC
20:37:58LloreanI was thinking that might be it
20:38:20LloreanBut there's so many with/without Radio variants of players I can't remember which ones got a special name and which didn't
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20:42:34Javacat_w00t, rockbox is flashed and installed on it
20:43:35simmelMy X5L is loving rockbox FYI =P
20:44:39Javacat_does the radio in rockbox automatically adjust the frequency to get the best signal?
20:44:44Javacat_(like a car stereo)
20:44:53Javacat_or is that hardware dependant?
20:45:24*amiconn notices the X5V isn't listed on
20:45:37olle_ive never heard of anything other than a car stereo with that feature
20:45:58olle_sounds rather difficult to implement
20:46:21amiconnYou're probably referring to an RDS feature
20:46:26olle_car stereos use RDS for that
20:46:38amiconnThat would require an RDS capable tuner, which none of our targets has
20:47:11olle_isnt RDS data among the radio sound?
20:47:41olle_if so, shouldnt this be possible with rockbox ?
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20:48:25amiconnIt's way above the normal radio sound
20:48:38Javacat_"a 57kHz subcarrier to carry data at 1187.5 bits per second."
20:48:43Javacat_wiki :P
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21:03:00jac0bis the gigabeat build recognize usb
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21:05:12chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: Tried mounting it - Didn't work. I think it's because I started at 0x0, so it included the bootloader/firmware/etc. What's the address where the main partition starts?
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21:09:12linuxstbchrisjs169|afk: Check the logs - I suggested the commands earlier.
21:09:22chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: ok
21:09:56linuxstbHow big is the file you dumped? Does it match the size of your flash?
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21:11:09chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: the last time I tried it it timed out at around 55megs, but I started at 0x0, which includes the bootloader etc. 20M past that is 0x01400000, so I'm going to try again to read from there on. Is that right?
21:11:34chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: I saw the commands you listed, but it didn't work (i'm guessing because of the bootloader being included)
21:11:44lozzyHi there. Does the database function on the iPod 5G Rockbox scan files that were originally put on there by iTunes?
21:12:04 Quit relaxed (Remote closed the connection)
21:12:11chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: I'm guessing I start at 0x01400000 right?
21:13:14LloreanWhoah, green build table.
21:13:17lozzyi.e. stuff in the scrambled iPod_control folder?
21:13:29Lloreanlozzy: As long as they're files Rockbox can play, yes
21:14:45lozzyLlorean: Thanks, is there an easy way of preventing that from happening OR will simply deleting all of iTune's music on the disc solve the problem?
21:15:10mpeccorinilozzy: that's what I did and it worked
21:15:24Lloreanlozzy: You can't prevent it from scanning files, so yeah, you just have to remove them
21:15:24lozzympeccorini: Awesome, thanks.
21:15:38mpeccorinijust make sure you don't delete other things or you may not be able to dual boot the original firmware
21:15:43lozzycheers guys. I'm planning a complete moveover to rockbox, that's really helpful.
21:16:02mpeccoriniI totally recommend you do that ! ;)
21:16:19lozzyI was really pleased to find out rockbox works with the dock in my car.
21:16:26linuxstbchrisjs169|afk: I would expect a dump of the disk to be many GB, not 55MB...
21:16:40lozzyIt's an awesome bit of software
21:17:12Lloreanmpeccorini: You can wipe out every folder on the ipod and the original firmware still works
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21:17:59chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: i would to, but it seems to keep timing out
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21:18:25mpeccorinillorean: thanks Llorean (that's why I said "may not"). It's good to know so I can save some more space
21:18:32linuxstbchrisjs169|afk: Then that's a problem... Do you really need what's on the disk?
21:21:13Domonokylinuxstb: could you build a new mac version of rbutil ? its now at version 3.23 :-)
21:21:50chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: I kinda do...
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21:22:04chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: it times out in different places though
21:22:50chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: I think if I had the address of where the 'main' partition starts I'd be able to see what it's doing (or not doing)
21:23:30linuxstbchrisjs169|afk: Are you sure e200tool even reads from the flash disk? It looks to me as it only reads/writes the RAM...
21:23:48linuxstbDomonoky: Are you planning any more updates tonight? :)
21:24:04Domonokylinuxstb: nope, and i will have less time in the future..
21:24:37*linuxstb wonders if Bagder is really here?
21:24:42chrisjs169|afklinuxstb: I also think it may be reading the RAM - using hexedit shows the same thing over and over again
21:25:02Domonokywin version of the new rbutil domonoky/">
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21:27:32chrisjs169|afkthe i2c is completely blank
21:28:16Domonokyuups, the links is domonoky/"> :-)
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21:30:27Domonokyand it would be nice if someone with access to could move the rbutil zip to this place :-)
21:30:57Bagderlinuxstb: I am...
21:31:13*Bagder got back from Turkey a few hours ago
21:31:22chrisjs169|afkBagder: Do you also think I permanently killed my Sansa?
21:31:44linuxstbBagder: Welcome back. Domonoky is in need of your powers....
21:31:58Bagderchrisjs169|afk: I haven't read the channel, I have a bazillion mails in my backlog
21:32:52chrisjs169|afkBagder: basically, I got water around the daugherboard of the sansa, and not realising it was there, I turned the sansa on
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21:34:58 Part austriancoder ("Kopete 0.12.4 :")
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21:41:49linuxstbDomonoky: I've compiled rbutil, but found a bug. For some reason the 8MB recorder build came up as the default, and rbutil can't find the manual for it. It generates a strange "recorderg" URL.
21:41:54 Part norbusan
21:42:40linuxstbBut the manual tab is very nice indeed - shame it can't be resized.
21:43:20 Quit toffe82 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:43:31Domonokylinuxstb: ups the strange url came from the hack because there is no manual for recoder8mb
21:43:39Domonokywill fix it :-)
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21:44:12linuxstbAlso, I'm not sure about the legality of using the Doom logo...
21:44:40pixelmahmm... I asked that before but got no answer
21:45:13linuxstbIIUC, the code itself is GPL'd, but all the images (which are in the WAD) are still under a non-free license.
21:45:26mpeccorinianyone: I'm making several changes to the chessbox plugin but I've read it's highly recommended to make separate patches by functionallity
21:45:36mpeccoriniI've submitted one of them
21:45:54mpeccorinihow do I make a "new separate patch" if the other hasn't been commited yet?
21:46:31linuxstbRevert your first patch locally (e.g. patch -p0 -R < patch1.diff) and then work on the second feature independently.
21:46:52linuxstbBut if your patches rely on each other, it's harder...
21:47:28mpeccorinilinuxstb: thanks a lot ! and no, they don't ATM
21:50:13mpeccorinihmmm, I don't appear to have a "patch" command, is it a subcommand of SVN?
21:50:27linuxstbIt's a separate tool.
21:50:57mpeccoriniI'm using Cygwin BTW
21:51:28linuxstbI would expect it to be installable via the cygwin setup.exe. I don't know if it's a package by itself, or part of something else though (e.g. textutils)
21:51:30pixelmalinuxstb: one would have to draw an own rockdoom logo or something? That makes it a lot harder (especially for me who doesn't know much about doom...)
21:52:27mpeccorinilinuxstb: ok thanks, I'll look for it
21:52:58linuxstbpixelma: I'm not 100% sure, but my understanding is that unless someone can find a statement from ID Software that we can use it, we can't...
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21:55:47Lloreanpixelma: I bet Freedoom has a usable logo
21:56:36LloreanOooor, maybe not so much
21:56:51*pixelma doesn't have doom installed and can't comment on that
21:57:27pixelmashould have tried on my Ondio back in april :P
21:57:29LloreanFreedoom is a GPL licensed replacement of the art and level resources.
21:57:41LloreanAnd sounds
21:57:52LloreanSo the title / logo from it would be usable, but I don't see an image of it on their site.
22:02:11pixelmadoes a logo appear when starting freedoom in rockbox (assuming you do... very newbish)
22:02:23LloreanYeah, I'm pretty sure you get a title screen
22:02:51LloreanTo be honest the only time I've tried it is when verifying that Doom still works before I tell someone "It works for me" :)
22:03:10linuxstbmpeccorini: Looking at your chessbox patch on Flyspray, am I right in thinking you are constantly writing to the disk?
22:03:18pixelmawould a screendump of this be allowed then?
22:03:42linuxstbI would assume so, but don't know the license for freedoom.
22:04:24linuxstbLicense is modified BSD -
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22:08:48pixelmaLlorean: when I'd start doom, it would only say "missing base wad" ;)
22:09:07Siltaarpixelma, idem
22:09:15Siltaarnot so fun
22:09:22Domonokypixelma: thats why rbutil needed your button :-)
22:11:33pixelmawell it seems that it can't be used this way
22:11:53chrisjs169|brbwhich is the serial number on the sansa? the one beginning with Sansa e200[numbers] or the nine character code above it?
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22:12:53 Quit bospaadje ("great minds run in great circles")
22:16:07chrisjs169|brbthey didn't complain about the one I entered...
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22:27:21 Join zivan56 [0] (
22:27:49zivan56very good news, sansa radio is now at normal volume levels, all that is left is tuning and volume control :)
22:28:16TrueJournalsWhen's someone going to figure out how to work the H10 radio ;-)?
22:28:49saratogazivan56: congrats
22:29:12zivan56the cowan d2 uses the same radio as the sansa btw
22:29:33saratogashould be handy if anyone ever gets around to a d2 port
22:30:16zivan56definitely, now I just have to figure out how to tune, unless we want to boot to OF to change frequencies
22:30:36zivan56and volume control
22:30:51 Quit ompaul ("sudo make me a sandwich")
22:31:02zivan56Toni figured out how to get the volume "enabled" btw, see his last post on rockbox-dev
22:31:54saratogaI remember dan_a saying something about the tuning process
22:32:05saratogai take it that its difficult?
22:32:23dan_aIt's weird, I'll tell you that!
22:32:41saratogahows it work?
22:33:11zivan56yes, its very strange
22:33:40zivan56it involves a bunch of calculations, 3 main registers and "counting" ticks produced by the tuner
22:33:46linuxstbsaratoga: Any luck with ffmpeg yet?
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22:34:46chrisjs169|brbzivan56: so now that i killed my sansa, the radio works?
22:35:00zivan56yes, but no tuning yet
22:35:21zivan56there is an MPX output, if it was connected, we could theoretically get RDS as well
22:35:32*chrisjs169|brb wishes he never spilled barbeque sauce on it...
22:35:49linuxstbzivan56: Do you know if it's connected?
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22:35:59saratogalinuxstb: none to speak of
22:36:15saratogaironcially, I did meet someone on the ffmpeg channel trying in vain to get the same example code to work
22:36:26saratoganeither of us got anywhere last night
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22:37:29linuxstbsaratoga: I still think you would be better off starting from scratch....
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22:40:20saratogalinuxstb: i'm not really sure how to go about doing that
22:40:31saratogaits not obvious to me what the asf and wma components actually need
22:40:37zivan56linuxstb: no clue
22:40:42saratogathey reach into all sorts of data structures
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22:45:57linuxstbsaratoga: I mean to try and understand the asf and wma bitstream structure, and write your decoder from scratch. e.g. start by writing a standalone C program that parses the ASF stream and dumps the raw WMA packets. The ffmpeg source will of course help you with this, but I think it's helpful to also know what the code should be doing.
22:48:23zivan56wow. afc is really good on this radio, it just goes to the next closest station when enabled :P
22:51:37saratogalinuxstb: you're probably right
22:51:47***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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22:55:16preglowwe'll need to do it anyway, in order to fix up metadata.c
22:56:27saratogai realize that, but I was hopeing to avoid having to understand how asf actually works and instead just use the metadata structs returned by the ffmpeg parser
22:56:42saratogaits considerably less interesting
22:57:24linuxstbI think the metadata and writing a nice ASF parser which sits well in Rockbox is a large part of the project...
22:57:27preglowsaratoga: well, yeah, but then we'd need to link parts of ffmpeg into rockbox
22:57:34preglowwe don't want that
22:57:45preglowso i agree with linuxstb here
22:58:01preglowless interesting indeed, but also needs to be done :)
22:58:37saratogathe oringinal wmadec and toni's plugin just seperated a few ffmpeg files and wrapped them
22:59:05preglowstill more than ideally, but anyway, i'll grant you that it's less important than getting wma playing
22:59:24preglowbut finally, i would very much like it if rockbox had its own parser
22:59:54preglowdepending how complex the stuff is, of course, and i have no idea about that
23:01:09 Quit Thundercloud_ (Remote closed the connection)
23:01:15linuxstbsaratoga: I haven't looked at the existing wma work for a while, but my memory tells me there was a lot of ffmpeg stuff still there - a lot more than we would want.
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23:01:29saratogayeah there was
23:01:41saratogai was hoping to wittle that down rather then build something up
23:01:46linuxstbBut just think of it as optimisation - something that needs to be done anyway.
23:01:57saratogathe parts needed aren't really that much
23:02:00saratogathey're just spread out
23:02:05saratogaacross 800 different datastructures
23:02:42linuxstbThat's the problem IMO - far more abstraction than is needed for us. It will also handle video streams in asf, something we just want to ignore.
23:03:38linuxstbBut it's still up to you - getting something working at all is most important.
23:03:39saratogaI'm thinking of going back to the old source code, at least it worked, and for the parser it's probably a good place to start
23:04:18saratogai had this vision of getting everything working and then stripping parts away
23:04:27saratogaand at each step making sure it actually worked
23:04:54saratogamaybe i should just focus on the parser now, strip that away to the bare essentiallys sans ffmpeg and then write the decoder
23:05:26preglowmight do, but you should keep good track of where different pieces of code comes from
23:05:45preglowthe wma codec in ffmpeg is still updated now and then, and we want to be able to recognize when they fix something that might benefit us
23:06:04saratogaat least the decoder parts are selfcontained
23:06:09saratogathe API is horrible
23:06:17saratogabut theres only a handful of actual functions that do anything
23:06:48saratogathough honestly, if I'm changing all their fp variables anyway, I'm not sure how easy it'll be to include changes
23:07:18saratogai think their patchs might "inspire" ways to improve this code more then anything
23:07:38preglowwell, the closer it is, the betetr
23:07:52preglowand i don't think fixed pointizing it will change the structure much, if at all
23:08:08preglowbut argh, i was really hoping the wma codec would be fixed pointified for us by now :/
23:08:30saratogai think stripping away the ffmpeg stuff is going to change things a good bit
23:08:37saratogasince we probably don't want to keep all those structs
23:08:38preglowmost certainly
23:08:43saratogai think a few could be consolidated
23:09:05saratogathough maybe those changes will be superficial
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23:09:58saratogaalso, have the other google projects begun?
23:10:11saratogai'm wondering about the USB project
23:10:26saratogasince i actually use usb
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23:11:22preglowi don't know, coding will start officially late in may, i think
23:11:36preglowchristian gmeiner is about these days, but i don't know if he's started looking at usb
23:11:56preglowas for the other projects, i have heard nothing at all
23:12:02linuxstbI haven't seen any mention of the other projects either.
23:12:28preglowat least nico_p is about too
23:13:07saratogahes doing MOB right?
23:13:26preglowanother project i'm looking forward to
23:13:26saratogathat'll be another nice thing to have
23:13:38saratogafinally get this album art patch nonsense squared away
23:14:00preglowthe text to speech project tickles me a fair bit too, but i don't use voice menus, so won't really get to use it
23:14:21preglowthough i'm sure i'll play around for it a fair bit, heh
23:14:37*preglow puts down: diversify expressions in the future
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23:32:43 Quit aldo ()
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23:33:31BigMacHey what does the file do exactly?
23:33:49Bagderdownloads the tarballs, extracts them, builds them, installs them
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23:33:55 Part maffe
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23:34:51BigMacBagder: The tars for what though, I am just wondering what is causing me to not be able to patch, I know it is a pathing issue, but I have put paths everywhere I needed to
23:35:14nlsgcc and binutils
23:35:38Bagderand for the possible extra patch
23:35:48BigMacalright well then I will reinstall build-essentials
23:36:32 Quit RaRe` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:36:55BigMacDo I need to run it as a super user?
23:37:59Bagderit depends on what paths you use
23:38:05Bagderwith the default paths, yes
23:40:02BigMachmm, any link I can read up on to see what I am doing wrong for my paths to not be working in ubuntu?
23:40:21lozzyI've just started using a theme with a black bg. My icons aren't displaying, so I switched my /.rockbox/icon/viewer.bmp with a different set. Icons still don't display, can anyone advise me on what I need to get icons on a black bg?
23:40:51 Quit RaRe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:41:44nlslozzy: do you mean /.rockbox/iconS/viewerS.bmp ?
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23:42:02Cassandralozzy - I believe you need to have a theme file set up that loads them.
23:42:07lozzyyeah, I do nls
23:42:21lozzyCassandra: ah, okay.
23:42:27CassandraSince you can't load them via the UI.
23:42:39lozzydamn, is there any way around that?
23:43:13lozzymany thanks.
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23:45:44 Quit zivan56 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:48:51DomonokyCassandra: did you take a look at the new version of rbutil, it would be nic if we could make list, of whats needed to get a 1.0 Release of rbutil :-)
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23:58:54nlshmm, gcc 4.2 has been released, I wish I knew more about this stuff so that I could try it out for rockbox (or had time to learn... :-/

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