--- Log for 29.04.108 Server: leguin.freenode.net Channel: #rockbox --- Nick: logbot Version: Dancer V4.16 Started: 27 days and 18 hours ago 00.00.07 # the official build has viewports, so if your wps uses the scrolling margins patch you'll have to modify it to work with the curent build 00.00.30 # * amiconn is rather confused now by the linker :( 00.00.51 # still working on the UIE stuff? 00.01.23 # yes 00.01.28 # * ^Parrot^ is not a coder just a new user of rockbox 00.01.35 # * bertrik knows nothing about that 00.01.46 # Somehow the linker tries to find crt0-pp-bl.o outside librockbox.a 00.02.11 # <^Parrot^> so If I see a theme that needs the scroller patch, it is not likely to work with the latest build? 00.02.15 # That's probably because it's specified in the linker script 00.02.15 # If I remove firmware/ from the list of include paths, it complains in cannot find target/arm/crt0-pp-bl.o 00.02.33 # But .a files don't include paths afaik 00.03.08 # If I specify system.o explicitly on the command line, it works, but that's dirty 00.03.52 # And if I specify crt0-pp-bl.o explicitly (without removing the include path), it complains about duplicate symbols - obviously it tries to link that thing twice... 00.04.08 # are you sure crt0-pp-bl.o is actually inside librockbox.a? 00.04.15 # yes 00.04.20 # Maybe it's something to do with the way the library is build - it's finding main (and UIE when added) in the bootloader .o, but not symbols in the .a file 00.04.43 # arm-elf-ar -t librockbox.a shows it 00.04.57 # ^Parrot^: you don't need to be a coder to modify the wps. the format is documented here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WebHome?topic=CustomWPS 00.05.04 # s/-t/t/ 00.05.18 # <^Parrot^> what about bmp resize? should I make them 200x200 176x176 100x100? or make bmps at all 3 sizes depending on the theme? 00.05.28 # eh? 00.06.19 # <^Parrot^> PaulJam: I was not planning on doing any wps work at all. I just wanted to find a theme that I liked (I hve found a few) some require bmp resize, scrillomng and/orAA 00.06.52 Quit EspeonEefi ("さよなら") 00.07.33 # ^Parrot^: i think the easiest way is to try the WPS. if you see a very basic text only WPS, then it doesn't work with the official build. 00.07.46 # <^Parrot^> k 00.08.16 # <^Parrot^> Trial and error... o the days of punch cards come flying back to my brain 00.08.36 # <^Parrot^> reading that wps page thanks 00.09.04 # austriancoder: volume seems the same as on my previous build (17229), but I can't hear any difference at all between -6 and +9 on 17229, so I'm afraid you'll need another tester for that. 00.09.17 # The linker script specifies an explicit INPUT() 00.09.23 # <^Parrot^> at the risk of starting a war, what is the current status on a jpg patch or modified build that does suppor jpg? 00.09.25 # gevaerts: change bass settings 00.09.31 # * gevaerts either has wrong music or wrong ears for this 00.10.01 # austriancoder: I changed Settings -> Sound Settings -> Bass 00.10.08 Quit w1ll14m (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.11.35 # Aha, hmm.... 00.11.38 # gevaerts: okay.. I think i have found the probelm.. wm8751 defineds [SOUND_BASS] = {"dB", 1, 15, -60, 90, 0}, the probelm is now the 15.. I think i will revert this change until i/we found a good way to handle 1.5 db steps 00.14.18 # * gevaerts decides to never volunteer again for sound tests. You need to hear differences for that... 00.14.46 # ;) 00.15.11 # * linuxstb is reminded of the first version of the X5 audio driver that had something like no sound above about 10KHz - and no-one noticed for a while... 00.15.29 # yeah, I used that... 00.15.32 # In a way I'm lucky. I can use lower bitrates :) 00.15.42 # ... without noticing 00.15.44 # Bagder: Yes, I was thinking of your ears ;) 00.15.58 # * linuxstb probably wouldn't have noticed anything either... 00.18.10 # * gevaerts decides to rip out al these useless audio settings 00.19.23 Quit einhirn_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 00.21.56 Nick gregzx is now known as GregZzZzZzZX (n=chatzill@dss148.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) 00.23.04 # ^Parrot^: there's no patch or build that supports JPEG AA yet 00.23.09 Quit faemir (Connection timed out) 00.24.16 # gevaerts: #define HAVE_AUDIO_SETTINGS :) 00.25.16 # #define HAVE_TIN_EARS 00.25.19 # Nico_P: something like that. I think I'l keep the volume control :) 00.25.23 # * Bagder goes to bed 00.25.49 # * gevaerts thinks that this is an excellent idea. Goodnight 00.25.59 # good night to you both ;) 00.26.05 # Our users must be reassured to know devs of audio firmwares have such good hearing... 00.26.23 # * gevaerts only does usb :) 00.26.38 # <^Parrot^> Nico_P: thanx and GN 00.26.44 Quit gevaerts ("bedtime") 00.26.54 # * linuxstb only does lossless - so he can check the md5sum of the output 00.27.22 # tricky :-) 00.27.59 # * Nico_P did the same for early buffering code 00.28.14 # ...I wish it was as easy now 00.30.38 Quit shotofadds ("Leaving") 00.33.04 Quit lee-qid_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.35.32 Join Sh0rtnArm3d [0] (n=rsiyasen@adsl-156-98-239.asm.bellsouth.net) 00.35.40 # help 00.36.04 # im trying to install rockbox on my Ipod Nano 1st Gen 00.36.44 Quit ompaul (Client Quit) 00.36.51 # however when ever i try to install the bootloader i get an error saying "failed to add bootloader" in the progress window 00.37.31 Quit fyre^OS (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 00.38.18 Join bluefoxx [0] (n=bluefoxx@S01060015e968e813.vs.shawcable.net) 00.38.34 # can anyone help?? 00.38.36 # will rockbox run on a 2nd gen ipod nano? 00.38.48 # bluefoxx: nope 00.39.04 # DerPapst: is it planned to be done??... 00.39.28 # Derpapst: ne idea how to fix my "bootloader failed to add" problem? 00.39.40 # Sh0rtnArm3d: be patient. I don' know the solution to your problem but others might know. 00.39.46 # *don't 00.40.24 # bluefoxx: ports aren't planned, they're done by peoples interested in them. 00.40.26 Quit austriancoder (Remote closed the connection) 00.40.41 Quit bertrik ("bye") 00.40.58 # ah, i see... 00.41.02 # bluefoxx: and major problems have to be solved before a port is possible 00.41.09 # such as??... 00.41.20 # so it's not very likely something happens for the next years 00.41.30 Join zajacattack [0] (n=42617dae@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1e3e42a8048ea1db) 00.41.56 # the firmware is encrypted and it's currently not possible to run any custom code on the iPod 00.42.17 # well that sucks then :\ 00.42.20 # since this code has to be decrypted again. 00.43.06 # would it help if someone pestered apple for the code? 00.44.09 # Sh0rtnArm3d: most people in here are from europe and it's ~Midnight - 1am here currently. But normally bootloader installation should work fine from rbutil. Have you tried to restore your Ipod before? 00.44.25 # bluefoxx: no. 00.46.29 Join EspeonEefi [0] (i=espeonee@CERULEANCITY.MIT.EDU) 00.46.30 # bluefoxx: only ~0.5% of all nano 2g would be in this key and apple doesn't care about such a minority. 00.46.31 # Derpapst: restore? by pressing select and menu? 00.46.42 # Sh0rtnArm3d: restore with itunes 00.46.44 # not reset 00.47.44 # Der: il try right now... tell me if im correct you goon itunes then click ipod then summary and then restore? 00.48.01 # yep 00.48.26 # Der: now it goes to some software update window 00.48.46 # ..now its downloading something 00.48.55 # so how can i reset a ipod to factory settings in linux? what tools are there? 00.48.58 Quit ^Parrot^ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 00.50.31 # bluefoxx: dunno if you can in linux. 00.50.58 # Der: man you rock worked like a charm 00.51.13 Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1998a6d74973be26) 00.51.20 # DerPapst: damn. a computerless friend of mine wanted me to reset all the crap in his ipod he got given[a friend of his gave him they're old ipod] 00.51.41 # bluefoxx: does the OF still work? 00.51.50 # Der: i have one more question can i add music through itunes and still hear it on rockbox? and how about videos? 00.51.52 # DerPapst: yus 00.52.10 Quit ender` (" I think I remember an episode of MacGyver where he overthrew a violent dictator with a rubber band, 2 bottle caps, and some") 00.52.24 # bluefoxx: mount the iPod, go to iPod_Control/MusicFxx and dele all the files in the Fxx folders. 00.52.39 # DerPapst: kk 00.52.48 # and some other files such as the iTunesDB (all located under iPod_Control) 00.53.10 # Sh0rtnArm3d: 1. yes, 2 use the OF 00.53.29 # or use the MpegPlayerPlugin (check the manual for this.) 00.53.31 # DerPapst: so that removes his buddy's name from there to right? 00.53.40 # probably not. 00.53.49 # but that can be fixed from windows 00.54.18 # but honestly, i don't know for sure. i know almost nothing about these newer iPods 00.54.47 # >. < i dont do windows. the only windows PC remaining in my inventory is a 98box used for games WINE spews complaints about <. < 00.54.53 Quit herrwaldo ("Konversation terminated!") 00.55.18 # visit a friend with windows then :-P 00.56.31 # DerPapst: hehe, that might work XD 01.00.14 # Hah, finally I understand what causes the UIE problem 01.00.26 # Unfortunately I'm not sure about the best solution yet 01.00.59 # amiconn: may I ask what UIE means? 01.01.10 # (and congratulations btw ;) ) 01.01.11 # Unexpected Interrupt or Exception 01.01.56 # The problem has nothing to do with that specific function, btw, but only with how it's referenced, and how the linker collects the needed object files 01.03.22 # Hmm, seems the fix is even nearly trivial 01.03.25 # * amiconn verifies 01.03.36 # amiconn: :-) 01.05.43 # Ah, yes 01.05.55 # It's definitely an internal file order problem in the linker 01.06.32 # The problem is that both the Makefile specifies objects and libs on the command line, and the .lds specifies the crt0 object with INPUT() 01.07.00 # Obviously files specified with INPUT() are *always* processed *after* all files and libs specified on the command line 01.07.06 # did you get that problem for all targets? 01.07.25 # So symbols needed by crt0 *only* won't be included from libs 01.08.21 # There is a simple solution though - the startup file can be specified in the .lds by using STARTUP() instead of INPUT() - that causes it to be processed before all other files, including those specified on the command line 01.09.08 # So no more reference hackaround necessary 01.09.49 # DerPapst: Not all targets were affected by this problem, because the object(s) referenced by crt0 were already linked in by coincidence 01.10.24 # heh. Impressive that his coincidence worked so long. 01.10.28 # *this 01.10.35 # Afaik the problem exists for gigabeat S (hack in SVN), meizu, and logikdax (markun and linuxstb wanted to see it solved) 01.11.09 # ah 01.11.21 # You can easily recreate it e.g. for PP by just putting b UIE at the very end of crt0-pp-bl.S, and then trying to compile a bootloader... 01.11.54 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 01.11.56 Quit Sh0rtnArm3d () 01.12.35 # It will fail due to the missing UIE symbol, unless you also edit boot.lds for PP and replace the INPUT() with STARTUP() 01.12.39 Quit zajacattack ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") 01.16.12 # * DerPapst doesn't know what UIE does and better leaves crt0-pp-bl.S alone :-P 01.16.47 # It's the function that is called if an exception or an unmapped interrupt occurs 01.17.23 # If you put that call at the very end, it won't be called at all. Furthermore, that's just a compilation test, nothing that needs to be installed on target... 01.17.25 # ah. an exception handler od some sort 01.17.34 # *of 01.17.48 # Yes, that thing that displays all those data aborts, undefined instructions etc 01.17.50 # :-) 01.20.02 Quit PaulJam (".") 01.21.24 Quit Mouser_X (Nick collision from services.) 01.21.35 Join Mouser_X [0] (n=mouser_x@layl001.digis.net) 01.24.06 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) 01.25.59 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 01.27.23 # hmpf 01.27.32 # * amiconn can't test-build a beast bootloader 01.27.45 # shall i? 01.27.52 # No multilibs-enabled arm-elf-gcc in my cygwin... 01.28.37 # i have that multilibs-enabled arm-elf-gcc in my cygwin. If you give me a patch i can test 01.32.15 # http://pastebin.ca/1001081 01.35.11 # * DerPapst builds 01.35.33 # * amiconn also started a bunch of builds (most of his targets) 01.36.44 # does make soetimes die for you? it sits sometimes there not doing anything for hours. I have to kill it then and start again :-/ 01.37.56 # worked fine and without warnings :-) 01.38.06 # It only does this when trying the ctrl-C a build. Sometimes this still leaves subshells or 'make' processes running, and then a subsequent 'make' becomes very confused 01.39.05 # shall i try any other bootloaders? 01.39.06 # But as long as no zombies are running, 'make' never hangs for me, even when scheduling a bunch of builds in a long command line that needs ~3 hours to build or so 01.39.26 # The S is the only one in SVN that uses the hack 01.39.52 # ah.. i have multiple cygwin shells open if i compile for multiple targets. maybe that's the problem 01.40.12 # Hmm, it shouldn't, although I never tried that 01.40.24 # feels faster :-) 01.41.00 # * amiconn always uses make && make zip && cd ../2nd_target && make && make zip && cd ../3rd_target etc 01.41.35 # i bet building in parallel works faster... 01.41.43 # I doubt that 01.41.52 # I would even expect it to be slower 01.42.17 # * DerPapst should test that when bored. 01.42.34 # hehe 01.43.05 # Anyway, compiling for the whole collection is a good job to run overnight 01.44.03 # heh on cygwin for sure. 01.44.11 # * DerPapst should try a vm. 01.45.57 Quit sitwon ("Leaving") 01.46.23 # * amiconn should probably try microsoft sfu again 01.47.17 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=768aa356@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 01.47.27 # I even have linux VMs to choose from, but using them regularly for builds just feels cumbersome 01.54.20 # blackhawk is proving harder then I'd hoped to contact 01.58.42 # saratoga: why does he need to be contacted? 01.59.32 Quit JdGordon|uni ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 02.01.26 # i'm starting with his patch for my GSOC project 02.01.40 # and i'd like to ask him about the build environment hes using 02.02.09 # it was different than what we use? 02.03.04 # oh youre one of the lucky ones? :-) 02.03.33 Quit barrywardell () 02.04.10 # * scorche|sh chooses to ignore DerPapst ;) 02.04.55 # :-P 02.12.06 # scorche|sh: i don't think so, but evidently he has to use some additional libraries to link it to the linux system running on his phone 02.12.11 # and i'm curious about how that works 02.12.22 # can probably figure it out on my own, but it'd be nice to have his input 02.13.21 Quit Rincewind ("bye") 02.13.22 Quit midkay ("Leaving") 02.16.45 Quit amiconn (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- The future of IRC") 02.17.19 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 02.23.16 Join Shaid [0] (n=adam@dsl-202-45-112-116-static.VIC.netspace.net.au) 02.35.39 Quit Mouser_X (Nick collision from services.) 02.35.48 Join Mouser_X [0] (n=mouser_x@layl001.digis.net) 02.55.24 # is the define really SCREEN_PORTAIT ? 02.55.31 # * midgey is playing blackjack in "spanish" on his gigabeat 02.55.42 # http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/2764/dump080428205118dd3.png 02.57.04 Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay) 02.57.45 # saratoga: looks like it... :\ 02.58.10 # defined in /firmware/export/config.h 02.58.19 # i'm tempted to try a global find and replace 02.59.07 # * midgey should start committing typo fixes to get his commit count up 02.59.28 # go for it! 02.59.29 Quit leox (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03.07.25 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03.07.48 Join DerPapst [0] (n=Der_Paps@p5B23D22E.dip.t-dialin.net) 03.11.05 # saratoga: typo fixed 03.11.09 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (i=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 03.12.25 Quit fpletz (Remote closed the connection) 03.13.23 # JdGordon|zzz: i was so close to figuring out the shell script to do that 03.13.50 Join fpletz [0] (n=fpletz@franz-pletz.org) 03.13.51 # hehe, simple find and replace in the text editor :) 03.14.20 Quit markun (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 03.14.24 Join markun [50] (n=markun@rockbox/developer/markun) 03.15.59 Quit kerframil (Remote closed the connection) 03.17.38 Part pixelma 03.18.56 Join leox [0] (n=leox@165-162-114-200.fibertel.com.ar) 03.22.15 Join zajacattack [0] (n=42617dae@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-bb166eb435b8afec) 03.26.00 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 03.27.51 Quit csc` (Connection timed out) 03.28.35 Join csc` [0] (n=csc@archlinux/user/csc) 03.38.43 Quit zajacattack ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 03.39.32 Join zajacattack [0] (n=42617dae@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ca810101635e8de4) 03.44.59 Join RoC_MasterMind [0] (n=Free@c-71-203-172-58.hsd1.fl.comcast.net) 03.45.12 # midgey: nice work! 03.45.31 # <-- sleep (finally) 04.07.38 Join mtrckbx [0] (n=4bafe6a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-43ef4aa52ad96f2f) 04.08.00 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 04.14.38 Join kerframil [0] (n=kerframi@synesis3-adsl.demon.co.uk) 04.18.30 # Can anybody out there advise on hoe to use the triggered recording fuctions on an iRiver H320? 04.25.38 # * mtrckbx says hello 04.25.48 Quit RoC_MasterMind ("Leaving") 04.29.17 # Anybody on this channel? 04.30.22 # there are many people in this channel. it's just that the active ones may not know the answer. patience is requested :) 04.31.42 # ok krazykit, thanks. 04.34.06 # ison 04.34.44 # lusers 04.35.28 # names #rockbox 04.35.59 # mtrckbx, have tried searching the manual and the forums? 04.36.50 Quit zajacattack ("CGI:IRC") 04.40.19 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepchen@p54BF5AB4.dip.t-dialin.net) 04.51.52 Quit mtrckbx ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 04.52.05 Join mtrckbx [0] (n=4bafe6a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-6d26630465607fc0) 04.52.13 # users 04.55.09 Quit miepchen^schlaf_ (Connection timed out) 05.03.27 Quit bluefoxx ("Leaving") 05.08.47 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) 05.21.28 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 05.26.04 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 05.30.54 Quit midgey () 05.33.46 Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@c-71-205-31-207.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) 05.41.04 Join bronsoja [0] (n=bronsoja@adsl-68-248-147-7.dsl.ipltin.ameritech.net) 05.41.28 Quit Horscht ("I am root. If you see me laughing, you better have a backup") 05.51.55 Quit csc` ("If you can't do anything smart, do somethin right ~Serenity") 05.52.37 # The font in doom is hard to read. :/ 05.55.31 # That would be id's fault, they probably didn't expect it to be on such small screens. 05.56.05 # That id. :( 06.01.55 # I'm having an issue with the RBUtil on ubuntu 8.04. My player is mounted at /media/Sansa e260 and i'm able to read the file contents in the file browser, but when I try to run the complete installation it stops after printing "No Sansa found". Any ideas? 06.03.45 Quit mtrckbx ("CGI:IRC") 06.05.52 # bronsoja: Are you sure it's a v1 sansa? 06.06.57 # I thought so, I can double check in the settings info. 06.08.22 # in settings, the listed version is 01.02.18A 06.09.05 # Could it be having a problem with the space in the mount path? 06.14.33 Join fyrestorm [0] (n=fyre@cpe-68-173-171-53.nyc.res.rr.com) 06.15.28 Quit Llorean ("Leaving.") 06.15.56 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) 06.19.13 Quit miepchen^schlaf () 06.28.14 Quit scorche (Nick collision from services.) 06.29.02 Join scorche [0] (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche) 06.42.25 Join Romanian [0] (n=mihai@c-76-115-184-61.hsd1.or.comcast.net) 06.42.33 # bronsoja: it could be the space in the mount path 06.42.34 # Hello all. 06.42.37 # hello 06.42.47 # Is anybody available to help me? 06.43.04 # yes, just ask 06.44.28 Join mtrckbx [0] (n=4bafe6a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-63624f813a4ebe86) 06.44.53 # Well, I've been having this problem with my iAudio X5L, started about 24 hours ago. It won't play sound. I can get it to load, everything works fine, but it won't play sound. It shows that it's playing, even at full volume, but nothing comes out of the speakers. Once every 20 loads or so, sound will play, and I will be able to change the volume for about 30 seconds. After this period has passed, I can't change the volume level. Happen 06.45.20 # I've formatted 5 times, reinstalled firmware, and checked my headphones. 06.46.49 # Also, the distinctive fuzzy "pop" sound when I boot it is absent. 06.49.00 # could be a hardware issue, something went funny inside 06.49.20 # like headphone socket coming loose from the board 06.50.11 # Nope, I've checked that. 06.50.44 # what happens in the original firmware? 06.50.50 # And if it were a hardware issue, is it possible that it plays at such odd intervals? 06.50.57 # I don't know; I haven't been able to re-load original firmware. 06.52.30 Quit mtrckbx ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 06.56.53 # Damn. 06.57.00 # Well, how would the A3 compare to the X5L? 06.57.30 # I got mine figured out. My linux inexperience showing.. when i ran rbutil with sudo, it was able to find the player. 06.57.42 # thanks all. 06.57.49 Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p549670A6.dip.t-dialin.net) 07.00.31 Join Lamez [0] (n=wizkid91@dsl-66-209-244-38.sptc.net) 07.00.37 # hi 07.00.43 Quit bronsoja ("Leaving") 07.00.49 # According to the player's page, you just place the *.bin in /drive/FIRMWARE/ and plug it in. When I do that, nothing happens; it just charges. Is there something else I'm missing? 07.00.51 # http://www.cowonamerica.com/download/iaudio_x5_jsfw.html 07.01.43 # hoe 07.01.47 # hi 07.02.09 # Hey. 07.02.14 # I need some help with rockboy 07.02.26 # What's wrong? 07.02.46 # it will not play my gbc roms on my 1g Nano 07.03.14 # Does it give any messages? 07.03.55 # nope, my file do not show up, then when I change the general settings to show all files, they show up, how come they are not supported? Would this be consider a bug? 07.04.42 # What's the suffix of the file's name? 07.04.55 # Or... extension, or whatever it's called. 07.05.08 # lol ok extension, gbc and gb 07.05.26 # hm 07.05.28 # which version do you have? 07.05.57 # the latest, I just downloaded it yesterday, I updated my old version, then I found out rockbox has its own emulator 07.06.08 # huh... 07.06.11 # sorry, I have no idea :\ 07.06.39 # I know, I have no idea what is wrong, I think I might try downloading a fresh copy of Rockbox, and see what happens 07.06.46 # Yeah, do that 07.07.12 # I did wanna do what the new installer was like, it could be possiable it corrupted some files, I have no idea. Well thanks any ways 07.07.29 # I did wanna see what the new installer was like * 07.07.57 # So, nobody else has any thoughts on my problem of not being able to play sound? 07.08.09 # Or load the original firmware, for that matter. 07.08.11 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 07.08.12 # you can't play sound 07.08.32 # what kind of play do you have? 07.08.36 # player 07.09.18 # iAudio X5L 07.09.23 # it started about 24 hours ago 07.09.29 # I just can't play sound from it. 07.09.35 # oh, then I have no idea, I am a iPod guy 07.09.42 # Yeah. Thanks, though. 07.09.51 # lol, sorry..later 07.09.55 Quit Lamez () 07.09.56 # Peace 07.12.44 Join rp-_ [0] (n=rp@193.154.222.107) 07.18.33 Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 07.19.50 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 07.24.06 Quit rp- (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 07.26.06 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 07.28.37 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 07.32.01 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 07.32.08 Join Synergy6 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 07.32.27 Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b7f3c1408b897ea8) 07.35.56 Join delta [0] (n=4c672a1a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b0c5a18d0b9fa372) 07.36.16 Quit delta (Client Quit) 07.42.10 Join ackbahr [0] (n=jean@d83-189-169-57.cust.tele2.ch) 07.50.03 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 07.51.41 Join DerDome [0] (n=DerDome@dslb-082-083-249-125.pools.arcor-ip.net) 07.52.24 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey) 07.58.43 Part Romanian 08.05.03 Join Synergy66 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 08.06.04 Quit Synergy66 (Client Quit) 08.07.18 Quit GodEater ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 08.20.30 Quit BigBambi (Remote closed the connection) 08.23.09 Join GodEater [0] (i=c2cbc962@rockbox/staff/GodEater) 08.23.21 Quit Synergy6 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.25.07 Join Llorean [0] (n=DarkkOne@adsl-69-154-187-90.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) 08.26.22 Quit DerDome (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 08.30.00 Quit jhulst ("Konversation terminated!") 08.37.34 # What's the best way to remove a theme? 08.37.50 # linuxstb__, markun: UIE() problem fixed :) 08.40.07 Join gatestone [0] (n=app@wlan.telis.fi) 08.41.02 Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 08.41.22 Join davina [0] (n=davina@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) 08.41.35 Join B4gder [241] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) 08.42.23 Quit midgey () 08.47.40 Join Rob2223 [0] (n=Miranda@p4FDCCD47.dip.t-dialin.net) 08.48.17 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 08.48.54 Join bertrik [0] (n=3e2d0d7f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-aec4096bf906f20d) 08.51.42 # amiconn: thanks! 08.52.59 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 08.54.26 Quit XavierGr (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 08.55.51 # amiconn: Congrats ;) 08.59.08 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 08.59.10 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection) 09.03.40 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@foo.eternallybored.org) 09.06.09 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.10.48 # http://miche.aqua-gero.com/rbonly/ - I wonder if this is our code, but not GPLed... 09.10.49 Quit [CBR]Unspoken|w (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 09.11.04 Join [CBR]Unspoken|w [0] (n=cbr@212.98.160.130) 09.11.26 # I meant "using our code".. 09.12.18 # It certainly appears to contain it 09.12.48 # Albeit a build from 2006 09.13.09 # so you get a bootloader that can't run rockbox! ;-) 09.13.24 # well, recent ones 09.13.30 # hehe, but also a GPL-violating tagnavi.config? 09.14.37 # He's included the licenses.txt/copying.txt at least 09.14.40 # But no source 09.14.57 # he probably just doesn't realize his obligations 09.15.02 # Indeed 09.15.12 # Do we have a friendly letter? 09.15.43 # I can't remember seeing any good template recently 09.16.00 # Not that I'm particularly bothered, but it's good not to violate stuff. 09.16.15 Quit daven (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.16.51 # B4gder: Don't suppose you had time to try any other build table formats? 09.17.05 # no, not yet 09.17.13 # Just wondering if I should read the past week's logs or not.:-) 09.19.10 # http://ipodlinux.org/User_talk:Miche seems to indicate that lack of source has been mentioned before - IF we're talking about the same person. 09.26.11 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 09.26.36 # My main problem with that installer is that it will just confuse users 09.27.43 # Indeed. 09.27.51 # It could at least link to us. 09.30.31 # It doesn't even say when it was created, and as it doesn't support the 1g-3g, I would guess it's old. 09.30.50 # Seems DerPapst has already been talking to Miche's hoster - http://ipodlinux.org/User_talk:AriX 09.31.26 # Hmm, files dated 25 June 2006.... 09.33.50 # does anyone here use the filetype colours thing? 09.34.05 # I have in the past and liked it. 09.34.12 # I just lost my color file and haven't made a new one. 09.34.37 Join DerPapst [0] (n=Der_Paps@dhcp-25-149.fh-friedberg.de) 09.34.37 # wanna see if fs#7887 is still a bug, and oping to not have to setup a config for it :p 09.35.12 # Suggest you ask the poster for a config ? 09.35.33 # heh, Nico_P's already fixing it too ;p 09.35.38 # JdGordon: He even mentions a sample .colors file 09.35.40 # Dev Fight! 09.35.53 # Llorean: I noticed that after posting here... going to test it 09.35.59 # * Llorean thought that was fixed, though 09.36.09 # * JdGordon rekons it problay has been 09.36.32 # Oh, wait. I think it was fixed, and then unfixed (due to the attempt at fixing breaking other things). And never committed. 09.37.02 # Why is there no setting in the menus for setting the playlist catalog folder? 09.37.07 Join daven [0] (n=daven@145.175.adsl.brightview.com) 09.37.12 # * Llorean really doesn't like non-theme settings being hidden in .cfg-only 09.37.44 # Should be a context menu when a directory is selected? 09.37.45 # seems fine 09.37.58 # "Store playlist catalogs here" 09.38.10 # isnt that folder hard coded? 09.38.22 # No 09.38.28 # There's an option in the .cfg file you can set, supposedly 09.38.37 # At least, so claims sdoyan. Says you added it too, if I recall. 09.39.18 # wouldnt surprise me if I did :p 09.39.33 # Somewhere between 16181 and 16195 he said. 09.40.21 # 16181 09.40.24 # He wants the path for saving /dynamic.m3u8 to automatically be the same as the path for your catalog. (I don't mind if you can set a default location for it to be saved, but I don't think it should be the same as your catalog, as I'd very much like to be able to continue keeping my catalog separate from my saved dynamic playlists) 09.41.07 Nick GregZzZzZzZX is now known as gregzx (n=chatzill@dss148.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) 09.41.28 # hmmm, I love it when bugs get fixed by *removing* code 09.41.48 # Less code = less bugs, always 09.41.50 # usually other bugs popup though 09.41.57 # pop back up though* 09.42.12 # Bugs are normally caused by code :) 09.42.28 # Do any targets implement more than one user time? 09.42.32 # s/time/timer/ 09.43.54 # Llorean: should I add the context menu items for it like the recording directories? 09.44.15 # That would be consistent 09.44.20 # JdGordon: Yeah, I think so. 09.44.43 # Is there some way to set the recording directory to root? 09.44.44 Join Mathiasdm [0] (n=Mathias@vpne194.ugent.be) 09.44.54 # I dont think there is... 09.45.04 # other than manually in the .cfg 09.45.08 # Hm 09.45.26 # Should be on the "Files" context menu, I'd think. 09.45.36 # Well, nobody should put their playlist catalog in the root. But if the option of a configurable prefix for /dynamic.m3u8 in the save screen is added, it'd need a way to be cleared. 09.46.24 Quit Mathiasdm (Client Quit) 09.46.29 # I have no problem putting dynamic.m3u8 into the playlist catalog, and yes, it needs to be clearable 09.47.11 # I don't think dynamic.m3u8 should be tied to the catalog 09.47.27 # I have no problem with it having a configurable prefix that can be set to /playlists, but I don't think the two should be forcibly bound. 09.47.39 # Since that removes the possibility of duplicating what is the current behaviour. 09.47.41 Join Synergy6 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 09.47.55 # does the PC do anything more than just store the files? 09.48.12 # its not like it can be used to randomly choose a playlist like dirplay can 09.48.29 # The PC can also be used for quickly inserting playing songs into any of a list of playlists. 09.48.48 # so why wouldnt the dynamic one fit there? 09.48.58 # I think you're missing the point. 09.49.10 # pondlife: sticking the option there would only be usable with a nasty hack... 09.49.17 # Right now when you try to save the dynamic one, the default path is "/dynamic.m3u8" 09.49.34 # He wants to change the default path to "/dynamic.m3u8" 09.49.48 # yeah, ok... so whats the problem? 09.49.57 # JdGordon: A dedicated context menu isn't necessarily a nasty hack. 09.50.06 # Meaning that for those of us who *don't* save our playlist into the catalog folder (I keep my normal playlists in various parts of the file tree) but rather use the catalog for various types of "Favorites" lists (playlists I modify as I listen) 09.50.16 # we have to clear that chunk out of the path every single time. 09.50.29 # Although you'd proabably have to have "File View" as a sub-option 09.50.36 # Why not just have a second option "Set as default playlist save folder" 09.50.58 # pondlife: well I was thining add it to the existing menu unless you got there through the settings menu 09.51.02 Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) 09.51.13 # JdGordon: Now that *would* be a nasty hack 09.51.38 # We need more consistency in our context menus, not less... 09.51.45 # Llorean: I dont think thats the usual use case though... wouldnt you want to store the dynamic playlist with the rest of them? 09.51.59 # pondlife: it would go in there always, but would be very confusing imo 09.52.06 Quit Shaid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 09.52.13 # Why not allow the "Files" context menu to be the same as for any directory, plus add "File View"? 09.52.26 # Referring to the root, of course. 09.52.55 # JdGordon: For me, absolutely not. I want my playlist catalog just to have a few mixed playlists. My dynamic playlist, on the other hand, almost always goes in a rather deep subdirectory and is a result of me reorganizing files with bad names so they play in the right order. 09.52.58 # (i.e. no Rename/Delete) 09.53.13 # JdGordon: Why is having a second option a *bad* idea for this, exactly? 09.53.51 # Is it possible to currently create a directory in the root? 09.53.59 # I'm not saying it is... 09.54.05 # pondlife: yes 09.54.22 # JdGordon: Well not having a second option makes people who actually *like* the current behaviour have a harder time. 09.54.24 # and I'm not sure how many of the regular context menu items should be shown 09.54.54 # Ah..Create Dir in a context menu doesn't act how I'd expect. 09.54.55 # It's basically shoving one group's problem onto another group, whereas a second option means both groups can be happy. 09.55.06 # It creates alongside the selected dir, not within it. 09.55.14 # pondlife: yeah 09.55.30 # pondlife: Isn't the option available on files too? 09.55.42 # it is a valid point though that you cant set / as a rec folder 09.55.47 # Yes, but I wasn't expecting that 09.55.52 # or do some of the playlist stuff on the folder 09.55.57 # Not a biggie, just less intuitive 09.56.02 # (IMHO) 09.56.17 # Maybe you should be able to scroll up to the Folder Name at the top, and put those kinds of things in its context menu? :-P 09.56.48 # no, that wouldnt work 09.58.15 # * JdGordon inclined to say "leave this for the devcon" :) 09.58.57 # Well it'd fall under "UI consistency improvements" 09.59.02 # Which is fast rising up the list of major concerns 09.59.13 # aka - the end of onplay.c ;) 09.59.22 # hear hear! 09.59.30 # You guys are lucky I can't make devcon, I suspect... :) 09.59.56 # * JdGordon would love to be in the room when a dozen geeks sit around the table with a cutout of every setting and menu and try to order it to something usable :) 10.00.02 # Inconsistency gets my OCD twitching 10.00.10 # JdGordon: I have a printout of all of them, for all targets, as of about 6 months back. 10.00.25 # I think MarcGuay's layout on the wiki is good 10.00.49 # pondlife: Which page is this? 10.01.02 # http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/MenuLayoutDiscussion 10.01.12 # It's better than what we have now, anyway. 10.01.23 # Scroll to the bottom 10.01.50 # Marc has a good eye for detail 10.02.24 Join pixelma [50] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) 10.02.28 # Hm 10.02.28 # The settings top level is a bit controversial, but sensible enough 10.03.04 # Replaygain isn't a "Sound" setting, since it's entirely dependent on the presence of metadata. 10.03.05 # Currently I tend to just ignore the top menu and go straight into General Settings most of the time 10.03.16 # It affects what you hear though 10.03.26 # Not necessarily 10.03.34 # It affects if we interpret a certain tag during playback. 10.03.51 # It won't affect other sounds at all (for example mpegplayer, radio, untagged recordings, etc) 10.04.15 # Does dithering affect the radio? 10.04.21 # no 10.04.26 # Dithering only affects digital audio, right? 10.04.40 # So that's not a sound setting either... ;p 10.04.52 # both should go under playback? 10.04.56 # No 10.04.58 # In my opinion, yes. 10.05.01 # I prefer both under Sound 10.05.10 # But, hey, that's just my preference 10.05.13 # They don't affect "sound output" but rather "digital playback" 10.05.19 # XML MENUS!! 10.05.27 # Same as stereo width ? 10.05.34 # Crossfeed too. 10.05.48 # they do affect the sound though... 10.05.49 # Users think of those as affecting sound output 10.06.11 # i.e. there's no need to get technical on the playback/sound distinction. 10.06.16 # There needs to be a distinction between ones that affect "all sounds", ones that affect "files played back" and settings that actually affect *how* we play back files 10.06.24 # Why? 10.06.36 # So people don't report bugs on things not working when they're not supposed to work? 10.06.54 # If something is intentionally not going to work in a certain case, it should be clear to users that it's not going to work in that case. 10.07.14 # in that case... I tihnk shuffle, repeat, nextdir and party mode should go into playlists 10.07.15 # Llorean: setting the recording directory would be "clear recording directory" which is in the recording settings, root was made the default for this case 10.07.25 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) 10.07.28 # Has anyone reported a bug that dithering doesn't affect their radio? ;) 10.07.30 # JdGordon: Yes. 10.07.31 # setting it to root, of course 10.07.48 # * pondlife jokes as he has cardboard ears. 10.07.57 # pondlife: Crossfeed would be more likely for someone to spot, I think 10.08.03 # And poor FM reception.. 10.08.13 # JdGordon: And auto-change directory. 10.08.21 # that was next dir 10.08.33 # True, but I don't think there's a need to make a technical distinction here - better to make options easy to find 10.08.46 # * Llorean disagrees. 10.08.47 # If I were looking for Replaygain, I'd go into Sound Settings 10.09.15 # People can look in the manual if they can't find something. 10.09.22 # sound - stuff that generally affects the output, playback - stuff which forcibly changes the output (?), playlists - the rest? 10.09.26 # They won't know to look in the manual if they assume something should work, and it seems to have no effect. 10.09.35 Quit [CBR]Unspoken|w (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 10.09.37 # If they have to look in the manual, then the design is too technical 10.10.05 # The underlying code and design must be strict, but the UI should be easy 10.10.12 Join [CBR]Unspoken|w [0] (n=cbr@212.98.160.130) 10.10.16 # not really sure how cuesheet and last.fm fits in that description though 10.10.18 # The UI should be easy, but not at the cost of misleading the user. 10.10.43 # Hence this is a matter for a devcon - it's ultimately our opinions 10.10.44 # hmm.. maybe they should both be in playlists also? 10.10.55 # I think if you put "Bass" and "Crossfeed" next to each other in the menu, the user will expect both to work under identical conditions 10.11.31 # They don't. But they currently are alongside each other. 10.11.35 # Indeed 10.11.36 # I don't hear a bug report 10.11.45 # So, I don't think many users have been misled. 10.11.48 # And I'd been on a working assumption that Crossfeed should work on all audio because I'd never stopped to think about it. 10.12.04 # pondlife: What is this: "It's okay if we mislead them as long as they don't complain about it?" 10.12.26 # No, more like "The layout of the menu is not misleading." 10.12.37 # Are you saying it's obvious from the menu crossfeed won't affect the radio? 10.12.38 # You are reading it too technically 10.12.47 # No, but that's the sort of thing the manual should cover 10.12.57 # I thought they shouldn't need the manual.. 10.13.03 # The menu is about finding things, not techy stuff 10.13.21 # They can if they want the details, but they shouldn't care that much 10.13.22 # And people still find replaygain just fine under playback already 10.13.44 # I'm not particularly fussed. you can move it to Playback if you want, it's a wiki 10.14.11 # But given the choice Playback or Sound, I think of Replaygain as Sound 10.14.24 # Just how my inexact human brain is wired I guess 10.14.27 # But it doesn't affect all sound. 10.14.30 # Not even remotely 10.14.37 # I don't give a flying one 10.15.15 # Part of a UI's purpose is to convey information to improve the user experience. 10.15.16 # Like I said, change it if you want 10.15.27 # On their first try they *might* have to spend a couple seconds looking to find replaygain. 10.15.41 # But it's also quite possible they learn that its somewhere else, so it doesn't work like Bass 10.16.07 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10.16.10 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 10.16.10 # OK, so we move all the dsp stuff (digital audio only) into Playback? 10.16.26 # Haven't got that far yet. 10.16.40 # Since a lot of the playback stuff, as JdGordon mentioned, could really be playlist stuff. 10.17.13 # We could leave the "Playback" menu, and Sound could have under it "Digital Audio" with the DSP stuff? 10.17.23 # I agree with that - certainly the auto-change dir, repeat and shuffle stuff should be playlist 10.17.35 # Then it's in the more obvious "Sound" location, but in a submenu that makes it clear it's only for digital audio. 10.17.54 # That also keeps our sound menu from being too long. 10.18.18 # I agree 10.18.36 # The danger is that we end up with deep menus again - I'd prefer long over deep. 10.18.39 # we dont want menus to go too deep also... 10.18.51 # will the bass and treble options be in different places on players with hw tone controls and the ones using software? 10.19.05 # They shouldn't be. 10.19.39 # well, the hw controls also work on radio, the sw controls don't 10.19.45 # markun: the distinction was more which things affect only the digital audio.. not wheather its hardware r software controlled 10.20.07 # * JdGordon slow tonight 10.20.07 # Like I said, this is about humans, not technical details 10.20.10 # pondlife: I don't think deep menus are a bad things, as long as the deeper options tend toward "set once and forget" like replaygain, dithering, crossfeed, etc. 10.20.24 # Llorean: You may set once, others may not 10.20.43 # You don't set them more than once per playlist, though. 10.20.44 # I change stuff with .cfg files mainly, but certainly change crossfeed often 10.20.45 Quit Synergy6 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 10.21.11 # Either way, one of our current menu problems is too much depth, IMHO 10.21.16 # the whole point of crossfeed, arguably, is that it shouldn't be changed unless you change output hardware. 10.21.36 # Yes, switching from car to headphones, in my case 10.21.57 # In which case you're not really changing but moving between two presets, which is perfect for .cfgs 10.22.05 # Indeed 10.22.11 # Llorean: also for binaural recordings 10.22.15 # I really mean "thinks you're more likely to adjust often, and to a variety of values should be as shallow as possible" 10.22.37 # markun: binaural recordings should be preprocessed. :-P 10.22.41 # *things 10.22.46 # Beatles stuff too... 10.23.29 # Llorean: are we talking about the same thing? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binaural_recording 10.23.32 # But I think the real problem isn't "deep menus" as much as just poor positioning of things in general 10.23.45 # Submenus increase the button press cost by 1 for items within them. 10.24.04 # markun: Not in the slightest. Apparently my head is not functioning today 10.24.05 Join bertrik_ [0] (n=bertrik@127-013-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) 10.24.13 # Yes, but you can't see them until you go in... so searching can be slower. 10.24.27 # pondlife: I think the real problem is that the main "categories" aren't obvious enough for what's in them, and often the submenus themselves don't have obvious enough names. 10.24.32 # Yes 10.24.45 # "General Settings" anyone? :/ 10.24.51 Quit bertrik ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 10.24.54 # So a "Digital Audio" submenu, no matter how deep, wouldn't be bad as long as the chain of prior menus were all obvious enough 10.25.03 Nick bertrik_ is now known as bertrik (n=bertrik@127-013-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) 10.25.17 # I don't think it's necessary to separate out Digital Audio 10.25.27 # Technical, not human 10.25.37 # Humans make stupid assumptions. 10.25.41 # Yes 10.25.43 # Act to decrease that likelihood. 10.25.50 # No, let them be human 10.25.55 # Why? 10.26.17 # Because it'll make the UI easier to use. You can change the UI, not the user 10.26.46 # How is "A long list of sound settings that may confuse the user by seeming to arbitrarily not work when they should" easier to use than "A list of sound settings with a subcategory Digital Audio"? 10.26.46 # This is about easy, not educational 10.26.49 # What is "easier"? 10.26.52 # there is also an assumption that our users arnt that stupid... 10.26.53 # Why is it "easier" 10.26.56 # They're both a list of settings. 10.26.57 # we dont have to dumb down everything 10.27.21 Join Mathiasdm [0] (n=Mathias@vpne194.ugent.be) 10.27.36 # I don't think it's dumbing down, but to me "Digital Audio" is (a) irrelevant and (b) "this is a DAP, so it does Digital Audio" 10.27.46 # i.e. I don't think "not radio" 10.27.47 # long lists are harder to process because the brain doesnt handle more than 7-8 things well 10.27.55 # 7 is about right 10.27.59 # pondlife: so DSP then? 10.28.11 # Better, but you've just put a TLA in 10.28.12 # pondlife: 100% on that point though 10.28.12 # How is it "irrelevant"? 10.28.21 # It's just sound 10.28.28 # No, it's not "just sound" 10.28.34 # If it were "just sound" it's work on all sound. 10.28.43 # I mean, from a user's perspective - they don't care if ir's digital or analogue 10.28.46 # it's 10.28.50 # it is.. anything coming out of the headphone jack is "digital audio" as far as most users understand 10.29.00 # They really don't care, they just want to sort out the volume 10.29.15 # Yes, and if a user then encounters things in Digital Audio NOT working, they might just ask "why did they make a distinction" rather than simply filing a bug report 10.29.24 # The whole point is to MAKE some of them care. 10.29.32 # you cant change users! 10.29.37 # The fact that a bug report on this hasn't been filed yet just means that we have a small user base. 10.29.49 # JdGordon: You can't change users, but you CAN choose not to intentionally hide information from them 10.29.58 # They might equally well start reporting bugs where none exist, and still not think or get the distinction. 10.30.01 # Intelligent users, of which there are plenty, will still get things wrong if they aren't provide with any clues at all 10.30.01 Join DerDome [0] (n=DerDome@dslb-082-083-249-125.pools.arcor-ip.net) 10.30.12 Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 10.30.18 # Anyway, like I said - update the wiki if you can improve it. 10.30.22 # pondlife: So your point of view is "you can't prevent ALL bug reports, so take no action to reduce the number" 10.30.29 # No, don't be silly 10.30.39 # I'm not arguing with you again. 10.30.41 # You said "They still might not get the distinction" 10.30.48 # is there a nicer term for post-proccessing we could use? 10.30.54 # They might or might not 10.30.59 # Indeed 10.31.04 # Audio Processing 10.31.05 # I doubt mrs pondlife would 10.31.12 # And do you agree that putting them in a category is a clue that will improve the odds of SOME users getting it? 10.31.14 # She's my target user 10.31.15 # By providing more information? 10.31.18 # dinner... bbl 10.31.42 # Users don't generally care, they just want to find things 10.31.52 # We do, because we are technically minded 10.32.30 # But that doesn't make for a good UI for the non-computer-literate (the ultimate test case for a UI) 10.32.40 # 1) We don't make it for the users first. 2) Plenty of them would catch the distinction. 3) Those who "don't care" won't care that there's one more submenu anyway 10.32.54 # I refuse to accept that we're designing Rockbox for the computer illiterate. 10.32.58 # If we were, 95% of it should be gone. 10.33.18 Join Synergy6 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 10.33.29 # (1) I agree, but that's no excuse for bad UI (2) True (3) They might not look in the submenu and miss something useful 10.33.47 # How is "Distinguishing options that don't work the same" bad UI? 10.33.49 # But, as I said 20 times now, I don't care that much - so go and update the wiki. 10.33.50 # Bye 10.34.08 # You win again, I have to work 10.34.19 # * Llorean hates the idea of intentionally hiding useful information, just because "some users won't care about it" 10.35.13 # * gevaerts doesn;t think post-proccessing is useful, since he can't hear the difference anyway 10.35.23 # * gevaerts runs away, after replacing a ; by a ' 10.38.35 Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@rockbox/developer/aliask) 10.44.07 Join n1s [0] (n=nils@rockbox/developer/n1s) 10.57.33 # Llorean: menu depth is also a problem, because the submenu isn't always 1 "click" away if you have to move up/down a list before and have to remember the name of the next submenu (or be able to find it easily) - a good example is probably the "Theme Settings" submenu vs. "General Settings > Display" (which is also a problem of old habits). 10.58.13 # Another example: sometimes it bothers me that I need to enter submenu after submenu on my Ondio if I just want to change shuffle or repeat mode and start thinking "when will I be at the right place?" 10.58.35 # pixelma: True, *but* the options the submenu represents would also have to be that far down in the list too, anyway... 10.58.59 # I'm not saying it's bad in general to establish some categories but it needs to be well balanced - which is a *hard* thing to do (I know) 10.59.05 # I agree with that 10.59.39 # I was in the process of typing more or less the same idea 11.03.03 Quit ackbahr (Remote closed the connection) 11.06.20 # do you prefer a tshirt or a polo shirt? 11.06.51 # * DerPapst votes for t-shirt 11.07.22 # * Llorean rather likes polo shirts 11.07.52 # * gevaerts wants both :) 11.07.54 # * pixelma would prefer a polo shirt a bit 11.08.05 # In my limited observation I get treated better at restaurants wearing the shirt from two years back than when wearing the shirt from last year. I think it makes me look like I have money to leave better tips. 11.08.10 # :-P 11.08.24 # haha 11.09.03 # polo shirts are more expensive in general but I'm probably not going for the coffee mugs this year so we could spend some more on the shirts 11.09.49 # (it's not really a fixed limit, just what we feel spending on this) 11.10.03 # I figured, considering recent income boosts. ;) 11.10.28 # well, the shirts are sponsored by Haxx 11.10.33 # Ah 11.10.50 # the fund will be used to pay participants that go to devcon 11.11.00 # at least a little sponsorship 11.11.35 # we did 100 euro/person last year but we've discussed a more advanced distribution this year 11.12.32 # since some people won't even pay 100 euro to get there ;-) 11.13.50 # Yeah, a small amount of weighting probably wouldn't hurt 11.14.39 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net) 11.14.48 # I think I'll come up with something 11.18.55 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.25.31 Join YAVI [0] (n=5531ade5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-99a13c24a600b345) 11.26.13 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 11.26.36 # HI 11.27.24 # One question, anyone has found how to increase the ipod volume when using it on a dock? 11.27.49 # * GodEater used the volume controls on the dock 11.27.55 # this appeared to work nicely 11.28.15 Join ackbahr [0] (n=jean@d83-189-169-57.cust.tele2.ch) 11.28.27 # no, not on mine 11.28.47 # on the dock the volume does not do anything 11.29.01 # it has a line level, but cannot be changed 11.29.11 # Does the dock itself have volume controls? 11.29.29 # yes, but only by remote 11.29.41 # and it does not work when it is with rockbox 11.30.06 # just in the apple software 11.30.11 # Well then there's really nothing you can do right now. 11.30.43 # ahamm 11.31.14 # I was surprised when it worked for mine actually, I didn't realise quite how simple some docks were. Pleasantly surprised ;) 11.31.35 # It's strange, though. The iPod outputs at line level, so any volume adjustment *any* dock does *should* just be between the dock and its controls. 11.31.50 # Unless somehow the volume adjustment is communicated to the iPod and then back down to the dock. 11.31.58 # don't think so 11.32.01 # GodEater: Have you tried, in AppleOS, adjusting the volume on the dock using the scroll wheel? 11.32.10 # GodEater: may be right 11.32.17 # Llorean: not possible, I have no music accesible in AppleOS 11.32.21 # Ah 11.32.22 # some docks can modify the line volume 11.32.26 # It would be *really* strange anyway 11.32.31 # yes 11.32.32 # not the ipod volume 11.32.45 # YAVI: why is that a good idea ? 11.32.51 # it s like a pre-amp 11.33.03 # * GodEater can't see the point 11.33.18 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 11.33.29 # I don't get you GodEater 11.33.37 # what did you say is a good idea? 11.33.43 Quit ackbahr (Remote closed the connection) 11.33.49 # The whole point of a line-out is to be at line level for something else to amplify it. 11.33.54 # exactly 11.34.34 # but the problem is that the ipod has a line level lower than other things such as cds etc 11.34.52 # * GodEater backs out of the conversation slowly 11.35.07 # the idea in some docks is to preamlify the ipod line to be the same as the rest of inputs of your amplifier 11.35.29 # YAVI: Rockbox doesn't run on the dock. 11.35.41 # I still don't see what that has to do with the volume on the ipod 11.35.54 # If the dock has an amp in it, it should be irrelevant what firmware is on the iPod, since the iPod still outputs *to* the dock at line level. 11.36.36 # Llorean: the problem is that my dock does not amp the line level, so I can do nothing about it 11.36.49 # then I would suggest your dock is not doing what it should 11.36.50 # YAVI: If your dock has volume controls, it *should* 11.36.52 # the one of GodEater may have it and he can manage it 11.37.07 # The iPod volume does not adjust the line out from the dock connector. 11.37.51 # Llorean: that is true, what I mean is that some docks amplify the line level not the ipod volume 11.38.11 # I don't understand what you're asking then. 11.38.16 # nor me 11.38.20 # that is to say it does it itself, it does not modify the ipod volume itself 11.38.38 # and mine does not do it :( 11.38.52 # so i can´t change the volume but from the amplifier 11.38.56 # What you have is (iPod at line level) -> (dock, which may do stuff). In both Rockbox and AppleOS the iPod is at line level. 11.39.04 # and the line level is lower than from the cd 11.39.15 # I don't see what that has to do with anything 11.39.24 # yeah Llorean 11.39.32 # So what does this have to do with Rockbox? 11.39.34 # what I wanted to know 11.39.54 # was if somehow line level could be modified 11.40.05 # It will cause clipping 11.40.11 # The line level is at 0dB, it really is a "line level" 11.40.29 # but not the same as other devices 11.40.49 # I do not know much about electric matters 11.41.04 # The other devices you have may be pre-amping. 11.41.13 # but I think others are at 1v and this one is something like 0.7v?¿ 11.41.50 # This doesn't remove the fact that you will encounter clipping if you try to increase the output gain on the line out. 11.42.09 # aham 11.42.24 # so it is a hardware "problem" 11.42.47 # that If I could modify by software would cause clipping? 11.43.12 # * GodEater would suggest just buying a better dock 11.43.35 # it is not a really big problem anyway 11.43.44 # it is just that if i forgget about it 11.43.51 # and play a cd for example 11.44.04 # and forget to modify the volume at the amp 11.44.12 # it would be too high 11.44.26 # its about 1/3 slower than in other devices 11.44.31 # YAVI: please try to write entire sentences on a line 11.44.35 # sorry lower 11.44.59 # Ok gevaerts sorry :( 11.46.19 # GodEater: , and can you use your remote from the dock to change the songs, etc using rockbox? 11.47.21 # No, Rockbox can't yet properly communicate with the dock. 11.47.56 # aham, so you are working with it? 11.48.33 # Not much work is being done in that area, though there has been a small start. 11.48.45 # good to know 11.51.43 Join DerPapst [0] (n=Der_Paps@dhcp-25-149.fh-friedberg.de) 11.58.10 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barry@barry-workstation.ucd.ie) 11.58.54 Join JdGordon_ [0] (i=jonno@c211-28-93-8.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) 12.00.18 Quit JdGordon (Nick collision from services.) 12.00.19 Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (i=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 12.05.01 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 12.17.57 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 12.18.35 # the dock I was using: a) wasn't mine, and b) didn't have a remote 12.18.46 Nick JdGordon|uni is now known as JdGordon_ (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 12.22.51 Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@atheme/member/desowin) 12.25.53 Join mf0102 [0] (n=michi@85.127.182.34) 12.32.19 Quit JdGordon (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 12.33.35 # Chronon, in regards to http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=16653.0 12.34.05 # I don't have time, I'm out the door - might want to mention the fact accessory power is now turned off by default and yadda yadda yadda 12.34.12 # (if you don't mind) 12.34.33 Quit JdGordon_ ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 12.37.59 Quit desowin ("KVIrc 4.0.0 Insomnia http://www.kvirc.net/") 12.40.03 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=d31c5d08@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-2008c6cd870e766d) 12.41.13 Nick JdGordon|uni is now known as JdGordon (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 12.44.35 Quit JdGordon (Client Quit) 12.45.06 Part gatestone 12.47.11 Quit bertrik ("Leaving") 12.56.26 Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@127-013-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) 12.58.04 Join Nico_P [50] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP) 12.59.54 Join ctaylorr [0] (n=ctaylorr@bas1-toronto43-1279532451.dsl.bell.ca) 13.03.55 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 13.04.30 Nick JdGordon|uni is now known as JdGordon (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 13.06.37 Quit JdGordon (Client Quit) 13.07.43 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 13.08.51 Nick JdGordon|uni is now known as JdGordon (i=d31c5d08@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 13.16.12 # bertrik: your ata_disk_is_active sim stub looks fine to me 13.16.36 Join JdGordon_ [0] (i=jonno@c211-28-93-8.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) 13.17.39 Quit JdGordon ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 13.26.17 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 13.29.45 Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) 13.29.57 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 13.31.22 # Nico_P: not too complicated? I could have just let it always return true or false 13.32.39 # but not it returns true on the first call and false on the rest, to vary it a bit and possibly make other code that depends on it touch some different paths 13.32.55 # not->now 13.42.23 # ata_:disk_is_active should go away 13.43.27 Quit ctaylorr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.43.56 Join PaulJam [0] (i=PaulJam_@vpn-3080.gwdg.de) 13.44.30 # yes and no 13.44.38 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 13.45.12 # it cant go away while there are things using the callnack to signal other threads 13.45.55 # unless we add a keep_disk_active() count like boost does? 13.46.12 Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (i=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) 13.46.42 # ? 13.47.11 # ata_disk_is_active is polled by some stuff which should really be converted to using the callback 13.47.43 # Stuff polling ata_disk_is_active often fails on flash targets 13.48.40 # yes, but playback (not actually sure if its still doing this) tells its thread to rebuffer in the callback, but the buffering doesnt happen untill the playback thread is active again and by then it may not be spinning still 13.48.54 # it is abused alot though 13.48.56 # but providing a sim version instead of #ifdefs is generally a good idea! 13.49.11 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!") 13.50.16 # B4gder: I agree, if it's something that's supposed to stay. However, for something that's supposed to go away it's just wasted time imho 13.50.25 # true 13.50.38 # but that assumes someone is going to fix the problem in the near future 13.50.50 # * JdGordon has nothing better to do :p 13.52.23 # there does need to be some way to stop the disk from spining down if its removed though... 13.54.37 # playlist.c is the only core apps/ code using it except recorder/peakmeter and recording (both only once, and I'm not sure howd you'd remove it from there) 13.55.36 # its probably fine to keep in firmware/ 13.55.59 # There is. ata_disk_is_active() has nothing to do with that, it's a monitor 13.56.11 # The function to keep the disk spinning is ata_spin() 13.57.03 # you cant guarentee the thread you want to run will happen before the next spindown... 13.57.14 # although, I guess it would keep calling spin and eventually work itself out 13.58.28 # the main thing is battery_bench is misusing the call... 13.59.53 Join AndyIL [0] (n=pasha_in@212.14.205.32) 14.01.03 Quit AndyI (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14.04.03 Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@resnet21.nat.lancs.ac.uk) 14.04.28 # well, I've removed the call from playlist.c, not really how how to make sure it does stkov ata though 14.14.53 Quit mf0102 (Remote closed the connection) 14.16.32 # amiconn: http://pastebin.ca/1001695 but only have my e200 so dunno how to test it properly 14.22.52 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 14.25.14 # B4gder, markun: I don't know if he's mentioned it, but gevaerts noticed that the USB controllers in the S5L8700X (Meizu), TCC77x (DAX, Sansa M200) and TCC780x (D2) are all identical. 14.25.25 Quit Synergy6 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 14.25.42 # wow 14.26.08 # So this gives us a major problem : what name should the driver get ? 14.27.07 # * linuxstb thinks that B4gder, as the only person owning two different chips is the ideal person to write this driver ;) 14.27.16 # haha 14.27.24 # we should be so lucky if the only problem is the filename :p 14.27.43 Quit homielowe () 14.28.15 # they're probably all base on the same USB controller hardware design, so use the name of the hardware design (if there is one) 14.28.40 # bertrik: Which is what? ;) 14.29.34 # JdGordon: it's probably not the only problem, but it's impossible to write code without deciding on a filename ;) 14.30.18 # Could we perhaps configure Flyspray to default the Severity to Low, rather than NULL (or whatever it is)..? 14.30.33 # * bertrik googles for a name 14.30.47 # I guess the problem is that normal users don't have permission to set Severity. 14.31.20 # That's intentional 14.31.31 # Yes, but the corrupt display isn't, surely. 14.31.46 # JdGordon: you closed FS#7887. but i can still reproduce it here in the uisim (r17290). the reproduction changes a little bit, because the default theme now uses a backdrop and 4 14.32.01 # E.g. http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8913 14.32.19 # ... a gradient lineselector. 14.32.19 # PaulJam: and 4 ? 14.32.28 # (and "Notice: Undefined index: 0 in /usr/share/flyspray/htdocs/includes/class.flyspray.php on line 344") 14.33.07 # I don't have a corrupt display, but I do see that notice. 14.33.17 # PaulJam: ah nuts, sorry, missread the report, ill reopen it 14.33.18 # I've only been seeing that recently though 14.33.29 # Since the last upgrade, I suspect 14.33.48 # The corrupt display here is at the Comments/Related Tasks tab. 14.33.49 # But I don't see changing the default severity as really being a fix. 14.33.57 # Why not default to Low ? 14.34.02 # No corruption here. 14.34.07 # It's currently defaulting to something invalid 14.34.38 # It'd be nice if there was an actual "unset" value. 14.34.41 # At least set up a value for "Unknown" and use that 14.34.43 # :) 14.35.04 # I don't like "low" personally because that's actually setting a value to it before anyone's looked at it. 14.35.36 # True. not that we use severity. And the other fields have defaults too. 14.35.54 # We use severity from time to time. 14.36.05 # Yes, each release mainly ;) 14.36.19 # gevaerts: do you have a datasheet or register description for the USB controller in those players? 14.36.34 # pondlife: Well, it's still better than seeing "Critical" feature requests from users. 14.36.36 # if(!j % 100 && !j) will never be true will it? 14.36.44 # pondlife: But I think Zagor is the only person who can fix it. 14.36.56 # bertrik: google for TCC77X.pdf 14.37.03 # that is with j incrementing and always positive... 14.39.39 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=44a0430f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-4214ed5cb5acd60b) 14.40.59 Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Jelle@ip565fbeaa.direct-adsl.nl) 14.41.13 Join mtrckbx [0] (n=4bafe6a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0951769913a1a0c6) 14.45.18 # Can anybody on the channel help with this issue? I have recently loaded rockbox on six H320s. All went well except for one of them. When I turn this unit on I see the rockbox boot information then the Rockbox splashscreen briefly, then the unit goes dark. When I first loaded rockbox onto this unit I had better success and I have a feeling that I may have somehow set the backlight option to OFF. Could this be the 14.46.00 Join agm3nt [0] (n=opera@bartek.tu.kielce.pl) 14.46.19 # mtrckbx: You cut off. 14.46.30 # Does bootloader USB mode work, at least? 14.47.07 # mtrckbx: if you hold down REC while booting the settings will reset 14.47.07 # Yes, bootloader USB works, although I do not know what that mode does. 14.47.26 # It allows you to access the hard drive in case something goes wrong. 14.49.13 Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 3.0b5/2008041514]") 14.51.14 Quit mtrckbx ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 14.51.54 # * JdGordon doesnt see a clean way to make batt_bench use ata notify :/ 14.53.20 Join mtrckbx [0] (n=4bafe6a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ab8b785a39a051e2) 14.54.32 Quit bertrik ("bye") 14.55.31 # LambdaCalculus3 and n1s, I can boot to the iRiver firmware using the (hold down REC mode), but this does not allow me to boot the rockbox firmware. Lambda, what is your advice using the USB bootloader? 14.55.40 # if(!j % 100 && !j) should be if(!j % 100 && j) shouldnt it? 14.56.04 # battaery_bench.c:326 14.56.09 # mtrckbx: then you are holding down rec too early, try pressing it right before you see the splash 14.56.29 # mtrckbx: in usb mode you can edit the file .rockbox/config.cfg and remove the line with the backlight setting 14.56.49 # * LambdaCalculus37 was just about to say that, too :) 14.58.15 # Thnaks LambdaCal,n1s,PaulJam, that did it. I was holding down REC at the wrong time. 14.58.58 # mtrckbx: Enjoy the irivers! :) 15.00.49 # Thanks, I have six for a scietific study so I may not get to use them for fun. But I am beginning to think I might get might own at some point. 15.01.57 # * LambdaCalculus37 wishes he had six H320s 15.02.36 # think of the tower you could make! 15.04.07 Quit mtrckbx ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 15.04.17 # :) 15.04.20 # * JdGordon is now convinced that line is rotten 15.08.20 # although.. it has to work or it infinite loops?! 15.12.37 Join Mathiasdm [0] (n=Mathias@vpnj229.ugent.be) 15.12.38 Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 2.0.0.14/2008040413]") 15.21.07 # linuxstb: nice found about the shared USB code! 15.21.24 # ah, that was gevaerts :) 15.26.18 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 15.29.29 # markun: What's the status of your Meizu work? 15.31.39 # linuxstb: I wrote a test-firmware but it the meizu refuzes to flash it 15.31.47 # will try to find out why tomorrow 15.31.59 # So you haven't run any code yet? 15.32.04 # nope 15.32.47 # what's the status of the other players with the same USB controller? 15.33.21 # could someone start adapting the USB driver for one of them? 15.35.40 # markun: I plan to have a go at a driver somewhere this week 15.36.49 # gevaerts: do you have any of those players besides the meizu? 15.37.35 # markun: no. I'm counting on you to be able to test the driver soon ;) 15.39.56 Quit YAVI ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 15.44.42 # gevaerts: what targets do you have these days? 15.46.04 # preglow: h320, f20, ipod5g, c250, m6, soon h120 and f60 15.47.14 # gevaerts: Get a Gigabeast and you'll be unstoppable! :) 15.47.14 # and when did you start to run rockbox? 15.48.16 # markun: 2008-01-05 15.48.23 # :) 15.49.12 # the bug has bitten him *hard* 15.49.28 # *Very* hard. 15.49.41 # gevaerts: not bad :P 15.49.59 # * preglow likes his h120 15.55.09 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=miepchen@p54BF5AB4.dip.t-dialin.net) 15.55.53 # * markun hasn't used his h120 in ages 15.58.03 # * gevaerts asked his first question on #rockbox on january 7th 16.02.55 Part kkurbjun 16.05.03 Part LinusN 16.07.00 Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) 16.07.12 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 16.08.43 # my h120 still is the player i use the most 16.26.33 Join MaCkenzIe [0] (n=user@athedsl-420532.home.otenet.gr) 16.26.57 # hello 16.27.28 # linuxstb: Question... ever take a look at the Sansa e100 series? 16.27.59 # They look a bit similar to the m200 series, except that the body layout is more squared off, and it has an SD expansion slot. 16.28.00 # can i ask something about rockbox? 16.28.05 Join Llorean_Web [0] (n=46ff6b35@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-61d6009cfc200275) 16.28.12 # MaCkenzIe: Yes. 16.28.31 # if i install it on my ipod 16.28.39 # all songs will delete 16.28.41 # ? 16.28.46 # amiconn (and Bagder / B4gder perhaps): Around what time should I aim to arrive, if flights are flexible enough? 16.28.53 # MaCkenzIe: First question: Which iPod model? 16.29.02 # 5.5g 16.29.17 # Plastic front? 16.29.25 # yes... 16.29.45 # Okay, just making sure. Lots of people are confusing the iPod video with the iPod Classic. 16.29.53 # Anyway, no, your songs will not be deleted. 16.30.15 # But any songs purchased from iTunes won't work due to DRM. 16.30.17 Join nplus [0] (n=npl@141.25.Globcom.Net) 16.30.29 # LambdaCalculus37: don't forget the HFS/FAT issue 16.30.35 # if i change my mind can i uninstall rockbox to its previous original firmware? 16.30.40 # has any work been done on the austriamicrosystems socs? 16.30.55 # MaCkenzIe: you can, but you can also dual boot when you've installed Rockbox, so there's not much reason to uninstall it 16.31.01 Quit Llorean_Web (Client Quit) 16.31.19 # dual boot ? 16.31.29 # start either the original firmware, or rockbox 16.31.32 # at the flick of a switch 16.31.33 # have both firmwares 16.31.51 # correct 16.31.51 # yes 16.32.14 # i must do sth in order t do this? 16.32.16 # do you use your ipod from a PC, or a Mac ? 16.32.25 # windows 16.32.29 # that's good then 16.32.55 # in order to use the Apple firmware when you've installed Rockbox, you just flick the hold switch when you turn the ipod on 16.32.57 # it's very simple 16.33.37 # i will install rockbox as the manual in tha site & it will work in dual mode..? 16.33.42 # yes 16.35.06 # i turn the hold swith before the rockbox install..? 16.35.41 Quit EspeonEefi ("さよなら") 16.36.32 # no - leave it alone during the install 16.37.59 # gevaerts: Of course. :) 16.38.22 # if i want to return my ipod in original (with not rockbox & with all the songs-playlists.... that i have now ) what can i do? 16.44.20 # there are uninstall instructions in the manual too 16.44.51 # ok 16.45.15 # thanks for the help 16.57.02 Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c50e@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1cacb33418710a78) 16.58.09 # preglow: theres a patch for the AS SOC on file spray, but i don't know how useful it is 16.59.07 # saratoga: What's the FS #? 16.59.15 # * LambdaCalculus37 remembers coming across it but forgot 16.59.59 # http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8843 17.01.49 Join Davidz [0] (i=Davidz@60.166.108.76) 17.03.34 # * LambdaCalculus37 looks through the patch 17.04.18 # It's against a slightly older SVN trunk. 17.04.53 # theres a lot there, but without a way to run code on any AMS targets, its not quite useful yet 17.06.42 # I haven't got any AMS targets, so I can't do anything with it. 17.07.20 # Although if I do see a Sansa Clip for dirt cheap, I'd get one. 17.09.04 # the clip doesn't have any SDRAM, so its not worth getting unless you like the retail firmware 17.09.17 Join Synergy6 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 17.09.54 # Bah... the Clip is out of the question, then. 17.11.41 # Of course, if you like a _real_ challenge... ;) 17.12.50 # gevaerts: A _real_ challenge would be porting Rockbox to the Rio PMP300. :P 17.13.11 # spoke to jott...he licensed his code under GPL v2.0 or later...and regarding if he used any other code in the patch: 17.13.41 # atleast the core routines are mine, the font generation/converter is based of a freetype provided example any license on that code? hm it's basically just initalization stuff of the freetype engine.. oh and it contains parts of the rockbox 1-bit font converter 17.14.30 # (this is regarding the antialiasing patch if there were questions..) 17.17.00 # LambdaCalculus37: is there hardware information somewhere ? 17.17.20 # gevaerts: For the PMP300? No idea. 17.17.50 # LambdaCalculus37: then asking for a port is a bit useless, isn't it ? ;) 17.18.04 # gevaerts: Yes, it is. ;) 17.18.30 # Besides, what kind of nutcase would even attempt a port like that? 17.19.33 # * gevaerts looks around 17.20.23 # GodEater 17.20.29 # install done 17.20.32 # Let's give one to linuxstb :) 17.20.33 # but 17.20.48 # linuxstb had a PMP300 at one point. :) 17.20.56 # But I digress... 17.21.05 # tha songs dont play 17.21.24 # MaCkenzIe: Are the songs purchased from the iTunes store? 17.21.32 # no 17.21.36 # why? 17.21.36 # What format? 17.21.43 # mp3 17.21.47 # mp4 17.21.56 Quit Davidz () 17.22.12 # Rockbox will not, and never will, play any DRM-encumbered songs. 17.22.25 # That's why I asked if the songs you're trying to play are DRMed. 17.22.26 # what is that? 17.22.34 # Rights protected 17.22.41 # http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_rights_management 17.23.03 # MaCkenzIe: Put it mildly: DRM = no rights for you, the consumer. 17.24.34 Join webguest24 [0] (n=ac83dfb3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-622b8504f5053a0f) 17.24.48 # so i must uninstall rockbox in order to ply my songs? 17.25.02 # in original firmware 17.25.07 Nick webguest24 is now known as sansa240user (n=ac83dfb3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-622b8504f5053a0f) 17.25.24 # can i load rockbox on a sansa 240? 17.25.36 # not having any luck 17.25.52 # c240 17.25.57 # Is it a v1? 17.26.02 # yes 17.26.22 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 17.26.33 # 01.01.05p 17.26.42 # 1gig 17.27.15 # Is it in MSC mode ? 17.27.29 # how do u get to msc mode? 17.27.38 # Does rockbox have a prefered music manager software? 17.27.47 # Synergy6: no. Use whatever you like 17.28.32 # Are players set us as clean disk space? 17.28.32 Quit GodEater ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 17.29.02 # is there a way to play my songs on rockbox? 17.29.08 # sansa240user: I seem to remember vaguely that 01.01.05 is one of the versions that don't have msc mode, but I'm not sure. 17.29.14 # the 01.01.05 firmware doesn't have a MSC mode setting, there are a few possibilities to still get it there (there's a trick which involves holding buttons, using linux seems to work too or downgrading the firmware) 17.29.43 # Synergy6: I'm not sure what you mean 17.29.55 # ok thx 17.30.02 # i will look it up 17.30.03 # Like, storage space 17.30.05 # sansa240user: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaC200Port#No_MSC_Mode 17.30.13 # thx 17.30.13 # As opposed to requiring specific software to manage music 17.31.03 # Synergy6: ah, ok. Rockbox always uses normal USB storage access, and can play files from anywhere on the disk 17.31.18 # Oki, ty 17.31.26 # MaCkenzIe: if your music is not DRMed, rockbox should play it fine 17.32.34 # i fixed it 17.32.44 # in the database 17.33.00 # now its ok 17.33.11 # MaCkenzIe: also, please try to keep sentences on one line 17.33.28 # ok sorry 17.34.46 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 17.34.54 # can't i have the playlists i have on itunes 17.34.57 # ? 17.37.04 # Playlists in Rockbox are in the .m3u format. 17.37.26 # So they need to be converted first. 17.38.07 # yes . can i have the plylists as on itunes..? 17.38.21 # shown on rockbox 17.39.06 # anyone know where to get old firmware? 17.39.45 # There's a link on the wiki to various versions of the Sansa c200 firmware. 17.40.23 # Umm... oh crap! 17.40.29 # * LambdaCalculus37 sees the link is dead 17.40.49 # They were located here: http://files.zefie.com/PMP/sansa/c200/firmware/1.01.00/ but the link seems to be dead at the moment. 17.41.07 # ya i will try it 17.41.09 # http://files.zefie.com/PMP/sansa/c200/v1/firmware/1.01.00/ 17.41.34 # gevaerts to the rescue! :) 17.42.18 # its dead i will google and see if i can find a diff link i would really like to use rockbox on here 17.42.20 Join herrwaldo [0] (n=waldo@ip-81-11-222-73.dsl.scarlet.be) 17.42.32 # sansa240user: the one I gave isn't deas 17.42.36 # s/deas/dead/ 17.42.51 # * gevaerts fixed the wiki 17.43.04 # sansa240user look here http://www.felixbruns.de/iPod/firmware/ 17.43.42 # MaCkenzIe: Why do you think his/her name is sansa240user? :) 17.43.48 # MaCkenzIe: eh? What does an Ipod firmware help her? 17.43.55 # *here 17.44.08 # dont know... 17.44.10 # Although thanks for the link anyway. 17.44.27 # i tried to help... 17.45.06 # ok 17.46.05 # MaCkenzIe: Thanks for pointing out that iPod firmware link. I could at least grab some of the firmwares for research. 17.46.07 # so . how can i put the itunes playlists on rockbox? 17.46.33 # You have to convert them to .m3u playlists. 17.47.04 # there is a program to do this? 17.48.15 # Look on this page: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UsefulTools 17.50.17 Quit perrikwp ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") 17.51.34 # http://files.zefie.com/PMP/sansa/c200/v1/firmware/1.01.00/ working link 17.51.51 Join perrikwp [0] (i=9821707c@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-3081268390bf5666) 17.52.13 # sansa240user: that's the one I gave earlier... 17.52.43 # hmm 17.52.56 # didnt work when i clicked on it 17.53.03 # oh well 17.53.22 # wish i saved the box i would take this back to walmart!!! 17.53.29 # i think that if rockbox didn't needed to convert playlists. it would make rockbox better..... 17.53.51 # MaCkenzIe: rockbox supports _the_ most usual playlist format, i.e. m3u 17.54.04 # i think that if rockbox supported absolutely everything in the known universe, it would make rockbox better.... 17.54.17 # haha 17.54.24 # preglow: Except for DRM. 17.54.29 # preglow: think of loading times ;) 17.54.29 # even that! 17.54.37 Quit miepchen^schlaf () 17.56.46 # D/L old firmware now 17.56.49 # :) 17.58.01 Join miepchen^schlaf_ [0] (n=miepchen@p54BF5AB4.dip.t-dialin.net) 17.58.54 Join PaulJam_ [0] (i=PaulJam_@vpn-3080.gwdg.de) 18.00.37 Quit gevaerts ("work->home") 18.02.53 # thx all 18.03.09 Quit sansa240user ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 18.03.31 # markun: Replying to your question about the status of other ports with the same controller - the D2 is most advanced, but still only has an unstable read-only flash driver. My current ports (Logik DAX and Sansa M260) are progressing now, but don't have any kind of flash driver. The hope is to use USB to dump the raw flash pages, to help us understand how the translation from flash pages to disk-style sectors works. 18.06.16 Join faemir [0] (n=daniel@88-106-220-26.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) 18.06.46 Join styleism [0] (n=styleism@87-194-104-214.bethere.co.uk) 18.09.50 Join bertrik [0] (n=bertrik@127-013-045-062.dynamic.caiway.nl) 18.22.13 Quit PaulJam (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 18.25.53 Join DerPapst [0] (n=Der_Paps@p5B23C369.dip.t-dialin.net) 18.25.58 Nick miepchen^schlaf_ is now known as miepchen^schlaf (n=miepchen@p54BF5AB4.dip.t-dialin.net) 18.27.56 Quit XavierGr () 18.29.11 # * preglow wonders if there is a standard for charsets on dab transmissions... 18.29.19 # the d2 doesn't handle norwegian characters too well, heh 18.29.29 Join dabujo [0] (i=xx@p4FDB39F7.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) 18.32.19 Join gevaerts [0] (n=fg@rockbox/developer/gevaerts) 18.34.05 Quit MaCkenzIe ("bb cu") 18.40.02 Part pondlife 18.41.26 Quit Synergy6 ("Adios") 18.41.55 # preglow: Download the DAB specs and find out... 18.45.04 Join Mathiasdm2 [0] (n=Mathias@vpnd127.ugent.be) 18.45.29 Join midgey [0] (n=tjross@c-71-205-31-207.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) 18.46.48 # they're free? 18.47.40 Quit DerPapst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 18.47.41 # Yes, although you may need to register with the ETSI 18.48.03 # Google finds it though - http://www.google.com/search?q=ETSI+EN+300+401 18.48.29 # It's been a while since I looked on the ETSI website directly - but I've downloaded all the DVB specs from there in the past. 18.48.43 # Bagder: ping 18.48.55 # The DAB+ spec is here - http://webapp.etsi.org/action/PU/20070213/ts_102563v010101p.pdf 18.50.17 # preglow: how's the quality with DAB? Do you have a clear signal if you travel around? 18.50.30 # markun: haven't had time to travel too much around yet 18.50.39 # signals around here are decent enough, though i do hear errors 18.51.03 # Dealing with the errors in a nice sounding way is going to be a problem I suspect. 18.51.04 # linuxstb: ahh, hundred page specs... think i'll wait with this treat until coding starts 18.51.25 # linuxstb: well, for dab the options are quite clear, at least 18.51.32 # * gevaerts goes to read up on gigabeat surgery 18.51.34 # since layer 2 is such a simple encoding 18.51.56 # gevaerts: received you player? 18.52.15 # the d2 os doesn't always conceal errors so nicely, i've had high pitched squeaks from time to time 18.52.37 # markun: yes. It worked, but apparently I did something wrong with the bootloader installation 18.53.11 # gevaerts: and what do you get now? 18.53.24 # markun: it hangs on the gigabeat splash screen 18.53.54 # has happened to a lot of people 18.54.01 # midgey: wanted to ask you how you want to deal the new voice strings just to get an impression myself 18.54.19 # * gevaerts feels relieved :) 18.54.47 # pixelma: i'm not sure the way i'm currently doing it will be what is committed 18.55.03 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 18.55.20 # when i plugin is loaded, i steal the core lang buffer and load that with the plugin strings 18.55.35 # then on exit, i reload the core lng file 18.55.44 # I think there was a page listing some options in the wiki. Are you aware of that? 18.57.37 # hmm, i see. none of those are really what i was doing 18.58.03 # i don't like my method because the strings aren't linked with the plugin right now 18.58.22 # so if the lng file is missing from the disk, the plugin is basically unusable 18.58.31 # not very nice 18.58.57 Join pondlife [50] (n=Steve@rockbox/developer/pondlife) 18.59.06 Quit pondlife ("Leaving.") 18.59.20 Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@atheme/member/desowin) 19.02.08 Join domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@rockbox/developer/domonoky) 19.03.23 # yeah, the page is more a collection of ideas and I saw discussion about that arise here from time to time. One thing crossing my mind right now: what's with common strings that you could find in a lot of plugins (like quit or level and such) 19.03.34 # midgey: I think plugins should do it the same way as tge core, i.e. having the english strings built in 19.04.11 # The challenge is handling the .lng and .voice chunks, one per "user" (core, and each localised plugin) 19.04.28 Join PortableDude [0] (n=upirc@72.10.125.130) 19.04.48 Quit Mathiasdm (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.04.49 # amiconn: i would agree that they should be built in. Upon reading the wiki page, option 1 seems ideal but also the hardest 19.05.14 # I think the plugin shouldn't overwrite the core buffers though, otherwise calling back some core menu will break 19.06.14 # Also, buffer size requirements are different for each "user" 19.06.57 # indeed, right now i have no safety checks at all in the code so a plugin with a lot of strings will certainly crash 19.07.00 Join BigBambi [0] (n=Alex@rockbox/staff/BigBambi) 19.07.04 # i need to read up on the user field 19.07.24 # There is no such filed yet 19.07.28 # *field 19.07.28 Quit PortableDude (Client Quit) 19.08.17 # There are some further ideas regarding that. If we come up with a nice way of handling chunks, we could also extend it to handle individual strings/clips 19.08.20 # linuxstb: dab+ spec was small and nice 19.08.48 # This would allow to do away with per-target .lng and .voice files, while keeping the space advantages 19.09.03 # i guess that would explain why the field is always blank 19.09.08 # ...i.e. only loading those strings/clips which are actually needed on a particular target 19.09.28 # I mean combination of target and user 19.09.49 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 19.09.54 Join dandin1 [0] (n=anon2155@bas7-ottawa23-1088834472.dsl.bell.ca) 19.10.03 Join mrkiko [0] (n=mrkiko@adsl-ull-85-33.47-151.net24.it) 19.10.15 # i understand. one universal lang file for all targets and they load which strings they need 19.10.35 # Yup. Same for .voice 19.11.27 # so when a plugin is loaded, would the buffer be flushed and reloaded with the strings needed by that plugin (plus any core string - playback menu)? 19.11.46 # no 19.11.59 # The plugin would need its own buffers in the plugin ram 19.12.13 # rockboxed_daps++ :) 19.12.45 # Btw, .voice files would probably not end up completely universal, 'cause handling 2 different audio formats for the clips would become nasty 19.12.46 Quit dabujo ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )") 19.12.59 # So one universal .voice for hwcodec, and another for swcodec 19.13.04 # makes sense, perhaps the plugin strings would be P_LANG_ when referenced 19.13.09 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 19.13.55 # Yeah, that's the interesting part - handling those IDs in an efficient way when they are no longer contiguous 19.14.30 # wouldnt it make sense to keep the voice files target specific ? as the core voicefile are now also target specific ? 19.15.42 # and if we update the voice format, it would be coud to include some version string, so we could check if the voicefile fits the current installed build ? .. 19.15.47 # Right now the LANG_* IDs are generated per target at compile time, leaving out the ones excluded for that target. So the IDs are always contiguous, and can easily be regenerated at runtime (no need to build the pointer array into the binary, which saves several KB) 19.15.57 # s/could/good/ 19.16.25 # domonoky: The idea is that there should ultimately be only one single voice file for all targets, covering core and all voiced plugins 19.16.36 # One file per language, of course 19.17.04 # There is a version marker in .lng and .voice iirc 19.17.19 # so we would exclude the not need voice strings at loadtime ? 19.17.21 # Are there voiced plugins? What plugins are voiced currently? 19.17.28 # none 19.17.38 # That's part of the project... 19.17.47 # there is a version in the voicefile, but this version is for the format, not for the build.. 19.17.48 # mrkiko: no, that would be a secondary task for my proposal 19.18.06 # as in "get translations working first" 19.18.45 # From the last codep olice raid on, rockbox freezes very often in my player.. 19.18.45 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19.19.03 Join DerPapst [0] (n=Der_Paps@p5B23F639.dip.t-dialin.net) 19.19.15 # is someone encountering other problems? I'm using official builds now, not my own ones. 19.19.16 # the challenge is coming up with a universal .lng but still not added much to binsize 19.19.50 # mrkiko: Please use specific revision numbers. 19.20.01 # * amiconn thinks that should be possible 19.20.19 # It will probably use somewhat more ram than what we need now though 19.20.22 # Llorean: sorry, i allways forget to do so... 19.20.24 # The last build to actually use the words "code policing" was only changes in files for the ZVM. 19.20.32 # Not ideal, but probably not avoidable either 19.20.41 # Llorean: search the recent logs for jott...i think you missed it 19.20.50 # i think my current method adds ~150 bytes, but is not an ideal method 19.20.59 # so i'll probably be starting over 19.21.57 # Aniway I have a new iRiver h340 now, and I noticved rockbox freezes the same way as with the old one I have again... 19.22.06 # scorche|sh: Sounds like it's clean then. 19.22.11 # So I'm not mad :) 19.22.50 # Llorean: well, i dont know about that sample code, but /shrug 19.23.06 # scorche|sh: If it's from Freetype it should be GPL 19.23.35 # Llorean: should be, but it doesnt hurt to make sure ;) 19.23.54 # Binsize is more critical than ram (although more free ram is also a good thing) 19.23.58 # Well, Freetype is GPL. So as long as that's where it actually came from... :-P 19.24.04 # just so everyone's aware, i'll be gone this weekend without my computer and i'll be in california for most of next week. i might have internet but i'm not sure how much coding i'll be able to get done 19.24.10 # ah...i didnt know for sure 19.24.22 # midgey: where in cali? 19.24.29 # santa barbara 19.25.06 Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@gnewsense/friend/ompaul) 19.25.06 # figured it was better to tell everyone now rather than just disappear :) 19.25.13 # bah...a bit far 19.25.57 # 2 hours and change provided traffic is good 19.26.23 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 19.26.35 # midgey: good luck 19.26.38 Join Horscht [0] (n=Horscht@xbmc/user/horscht) 19.26.45 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 19.26.53 # thank you 19.27.11 # you're welcome 19.28.27 Join Synergy6 [0] (n=Synergy6@0-1b-24-4c-ae-79.hb.esol.dur.ac.uk) 19.38.51 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)) 19.41.50 # * amiconn wonders what the criteria are which targets are listed on BuyersGuide and which are not 19.44.09 Join houbysoft [0] (n=houbysof@30.255.broadband5.iol.cz) 19.44.32 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 19.44.39 Quit houbysoft (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 19.45.02 Join houbysoft [0] (n=houbysof@30.255.broadband5.iol.cz) 19.45.25 # amiconn: "If they play music in Rockbox, and someone knows enough about them to fill in the relevant fields" is all, I think 19.45.44 # Well, there's a number of targets not listed at all 19.45.50 # SHould I add those? 19.46.21 # In my opinion, yes. 19.46.44 Quit Mathiasdm2 ("Yuuw!") 19.46.55 # Can someone tell me why rockbox isn't keeping my settings when it shutdown or restarts? 19.47.10 # what player 19.47.14 # which ones? 19.47.16 # ipod 5.5 gen 30gb 19.47.21 # And how are you shitting down? 19.47.29 # haha 19.47.31 # *shutting, of course :) 19.47.35 # * Llorean thinks it's odd the buyer's guide doesn't distinguish "mp3-only" (and WAV) players 19.47.37 # hehe 19.47.56 # either holding the play button and it says "shutting down" or force restarting as if i've had a freeze 19.48.09 # holding down play should be fine 19.48.11 # which happens a lot less now compared to last november :D 19.48.21 # could it be write access problems? 19.48.25 # Using the reset (menu + select) is a hard reboot and will not save 19.48.26 # does it not hold any settings at all? 19.48.37 # or just settings like background or similar stuff? 19.48.38 # nah 19.48.38 # faemir: in that case run chkdsk 19.48.48 # I mean every single option 19.49.04 # stuff like pause on headphone coming out etc 19.49.11 # faemir: there were cases where settings weren't saved because of filesystem corruption 19.51.00 # will fsck do? 19.52.07 # i guess so (i'm not extremely familiar with linux) 19.52.15 # ok 19.55.57 Join osjfozisg [0] (n=styleism@87-194-104-214.bethere.co.uk) 19.56.20 Quit bughunter2 ("Leaving.") 19.59.19 Quit osjfozisg (Client Quit) 19.59.36 Join osjfozisg [0] (n=styleism@87-194-104-214.bethere.co.uk) 20.00.01 Quit osjfozisg (Client Quit) 20.01.00 # PaulJam_: there were errors, but they appear to be fixed now 20.01.01 # :) 20.01.43 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 20.01.43 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.01.52 Quit houbysoft (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.02.32 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst) 20.02.50 Quit styleism (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.02.56 Join houbysoft [0] (n=houbysof@30.255.broadband5.iol.cz) 20.03.16 Quit houbysoft (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.04.05 Quit XavierGr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.07.21 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection) 20.08.41 # amiconn, Llorean: The BuyersGuide page was (to quote the page itself...) "For Rockbox supported players that are currently available for purchase". But people now seemed to have added other targets (and targets haven't been removed)... 20.09.14 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 20.09.48 Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-024-163-032-204.nc.res.rr.com) 20.11.31 # linuxstb: Well, no rockboxable target can be bought new (except for some stock clearing). So the main supply is ebay, I think, and if someone is looking for a dap on ebay, he could choose from all supported models 20.11.43 # Some are very rare though 20.12.08 # Yes, I know - I'm just saying that the purpose of the page has changed over time - which would explain the inconsistencies... 20.12.25 # The page needs to be cleaned up, then. 20.12.26 # IMO it should list all targets... 20.13.10 # It would be nice to include (if we can find it) a date range saying when each DAP was available to buy. 20.13.23 # * LambdaCalculus37 sees amiconn editing away at the page 20.14.44 # * amiconn added the missing archoses, the M3, and some missing info for others 20.14.57 Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/staff/bluebrother) 20.16.29 Join spiorf [0] (n=spiorf@host13-217-dynamic.21-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) 20.18.21 # linuxstb: Date range might be difficult to define. Start date would be easier 20.18.53 # Iirc the archos Player was the first of the supported targets, released in 1999 20.19.12 # Maybe just start and end years would be enough. 20.19.38 # It's just to give people an idea of the different generations of players, and approximately when they went out of production. 20.20.06 # Ipod dates should be easy to find. 20.20.58 # they're on wikipedia. 20.27.19 Part agm3nt 20.27.19 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.28.29 # markun: How does the meizu boot? 20.28.56 # the boot sequence? 20.29.23 # yes 20.30.19 # there is a bootloader in a 50KB rom which had the rescue mode and looks for other places to find a boot image 20.31.05 # in case of the M6SL it finds the bootimage in the NAND flash rom, loads it to SDRAM, maps SDRAM to 0x0 and executes it 20.34.19 Join Buschel [0] (n=abc@p54A3EFCF.dip.t-dialin.net) 20.34.35 Join EspeonEefi [0] (i=espeonee@STRATTON-FOUR-SEVENTY-SEVEN.MIT.EDU) 20.34.39 Join saratoga [0] (n=9803c570@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d6449d4b10c5279e) 20.41.26 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 20.41.32 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 20.42.52 # markun: So in theory, it's unbrickable? 20.43.13 Quit desowin (Remote closed the connection) 20.44.16 Join Nibbler [0] (n=Nibbler@HSI-KBW-091-089-241-133.hsi2.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de) 20.44.17 Quit PaulJam_ (".") 20.44.39 Quit davina (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 20.45.06 # linuxstb: yes, should be. Unless we can write to the internal ROM 20.46.11 Quit TMM (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 20.47.31 # amiconn, JdGordon: can I commit FS#8947 (stub ata_disk_is_active for the simulator)? 20.48.01 # you discussed it earlier today but there was no conclusion as far as I understood 20.48.32 Quit mrkiko ("... eee is shutting down") 20.49.00 # * linuxstb is currently working on the m260 with the nand flash module physically removed - very safe :) 20.49.15 # (unless I lose it of course...) 20.55.10 # i think i have an m240v1 and m240v2 20.55.54 # i'd like to see rockbox on both (once the v2 firmware is figured out) 20.57.08 # linuxstb: thats a v1 model? 20.57.24 # also, FAAD has actually had a few CVS checkins these last few months 20.59.07 Join TMM [0] (n=hp@c514753fe.cable.wanadoo.nl) 21.00.51 # saratoga: yes 21.01.49 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) 21.05.10 Quit J (Remote closed the connection) 21.06.38 # markun: do you have any idea about the register endianness for the meizu usb controller ? 21.07.03 # no idea 21.07.11 # do you have the s5l8700 datasheet? 21.07.15 Join mcuelenaere [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 21.07.46 # yes 21.08.00 Join mcuelenaere_ [0] (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 21.08.29 Join sansa240user [0] (n=aca224fd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0ee315b598ad6b0c) 21.10.15 # is there any way to del the sansa OS and only have rockbox? 21.10.38 # sansa240user: rockbox doesn't have a native usb mode yet 21.10.46 # damn 21.11.01 # ok i got the rockbox working and its great!!!! 21.11.18 # they should make there own mp3 players 21.11.36 # 1000 times better than b4 21.11.59 Quit jhulst ("Konversation terminated!") 21.12.36 Quit sansa240user (Client Quit) 21.15.32 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 21.16.52 Join J [0] (n=john@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust297.nott.cable.ntl.com) 21.17.47 Quit J (Client Quit) 21.18.01 Join J [0] (n=john@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust297.nott.cable.ntl.com) 21.18.08 Quit J (Client Quit) 21.18.17 Join J [0] (n=john@cpc2-mfld9-0-0-cust297.nott.cable.ntl.com) 21.25.40 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) 21.25.44 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) 21.26.26 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 21.30.04 Quit tarbo (Connection timed out) 21.32.34 Join OlivierBorowski [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-134-116.w90-6.abo.wanadoo.fr) 21.36.36 Quit Nibbler ("Leaving") 21.42.27 Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 21.42.35 Quit linuxstb_ (Nick collision from services.) 21.42.41 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) 21.42.52 Nick mcuelenaere_ is now known as mcuelenaere (n=mcuelena@rockbox/developer/mcuelenaere) 21.46.01 Join m0f0x [0] (n=m0f0x@189-47-5-153.dsl.telesp.net.br) 21.46.34 Join styleism [0] (n=styleism@87-194-104-214.bethere.co.uk) 21.52.13 Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) 21.55.27 # * LambdaCalculus37 now has a Sansa e100 firmware update and will be looking through it later on 21.56.42 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)") 21.58.44 Join gregzx [0] (n=chatzill@drg11.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl) 21.59.08 Join tessarakt [0] (n=jens@e180077190.adsl.alicedsl.de) 22.00.44 Join homielowe [0] (n=eric_j_l@66.183.89.40) 22.02.05 Quit homielowe (Client Quit) 22.03.27 # gevaerts: USB serial port can be activated just by defining USB_SERIAL, right? does it also disable mass storage? 22.04.44 # oh, I think I see, I think I have to edit usb_core.h 22.04.59 # bertrik: it doesn't disable mass storage. However, to actually activate it at runtime, you also need to call usb_core_enable_driver(USB_DRIVER_SERIAL,true) (this is done by the debug menu code now) 22.05.06 Quit markun (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 22.05.13 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 22.06.09 Join markun [50] (n=markun@rockbox/developer/markun) 22.10.25 Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection) 22.10.48 Quit Buschel () 22.11.01 Join OlivierBorowski [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-134-116.w90-6.abo.wanadoo.fr) 22.14.12 Join GShang [0] (n=geoff@82.80.132.212) 22.15.05 Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection) 22.15.23 Join OlivierBorowski [0] (n=OlivierB@ANancy-157-1-134-116.w90-6.abo.wanadoo.fr) 22.17.51 Join bughunter2 [0] (n=Jelle@ip565fbeaa.direct-adsl.nl) 22.21.32 Quit mcuelenaere (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) 22.23.24 # Apologies if this is offtopic for this channel. I've been asked to research whether Rockbox will run on the Iaudio A3. I've not found any evidence that it will but thought I'd ask here before I reported back. 22.23.27 Quit nplus (Remote closed the connection) 22.23.55 # it doesn't 22.24.08 # All supported daps are listed on the fromtpage. If it isn't there it's not supported :-) 22.24.36 Join stripwax__ [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 22.25.22 # * gevaerts warns DerPapst about using the word "supported" if pixelma is nearby 22.25.39 # s/supported/working/ 22.25.42 # *cough* 22.26.37 # * scorche|sh wonders about that particular usage of the word 22.26.59 # Thanks. Keep up the great work. We'll find another model for my friend to buy that supports it. We rely on Rockbox for the speech output. 22.27.54 Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 22.31.16 Quit GShang ("Leaving") 22.38.28 # just wanted to prevent misunderstandings... 22.40.25 # pixelma: however referring to that list in particular, those *are* the supported units 22.40.36 # why? 22.40.55 # the list refers to them as "Rockbox runs on these players" 22.41.04 # rockbox may "run" on other devices...and i hesitate to say "run fully", as those devices may not all run fully 22.41.41 # and I'd imagine something different about something "supported" 22.41.46 # i agree with your usage, but i just get all bundled up when i think of the technical usage 22.42.27 # or I "could" 22.42.43 # IMO the problem is not saying something is "supported", it's the reverse - i.e. saying it's "not supported". That could imply that it works. 22.43.10 # rockbox "runs" on the, say, D2, however it is not supported and doesnt run rockbox near completely 22.43.26 # that's where the discussion started 22.43.32 Quit bertrik ("bye") 22.45.48 # scorche|sh: http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=15859.0 (I started this after asking here if I should create a NotSupported wiki page...) 22.48.02 # and i agree...we should say it doesnt run on those devices rather than "not supported" and i have changed my wording on that 22.49.15 # my issue is with the front page list which is obviously a list of players we "support"...it is also an incomplete list of "the targets rockbox runs on"....it is also a list of "devices rockbox runs on that we have judged to be complete enough and usable enough for general users" 22.49.57 Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@87-194-34-169.bethere.co.uk) 22.51.41 Quit petur ("kicked by real life") 22.52.06 # scorche|sh: So how would you reword the front page? 22.52.52 # i dont know =/ 22.53.01 Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@rockbox/staff/XavierGr) 22.53.22 # it is fine for general use...i just get hung up on the technical side when technically rockbox does run on other devices 22.53.29 # I agree that "runs" isn't 100% accurate, but I think it's good enough. 22.54.01 # And I can't think of a short way to say it better. 22.54.27 # it gets the message across to the users correctly...i just find i hard to say "the front page has a list of targets that rockbox runs on" 22.55.09 # actually, i suppose that line is alright as long as we dont say "all" or "complete" 22.55.35 # "targets that rockbox runs on good enough so that we can tell average people to go ahead and try it on them" :-) 22.55.49 # ....it is also a list of "devices rockbox runs on that we have judged to be complete enough and usable enough for general users" 22.55.57 # as i said above ;) 22.55.59 # "It runs well on..." =) But basically I think that only mention the players it works good enough is better than imply (if only a few people get confused) that maybe no-one's tried etc. 22.56.52 Join matsl [0] (n=matsl@1-1-4-2a.mal.sth.bostream.se) 22.59.14 Quit fyrestorm (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 22.59.29 Join fyrestorm [0] (n=fyre@cpe-68-173-171-53.nyc.res.rr.com) 23.03.05 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.81 [Firefox 3.0pre/2008042305]") 23.03.20 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") 23.07.23 Quit stripwax__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) 23.09.30 Join Hillshum [0] (n=chatzill@75-165-234-225.slkc.qwest.net) 23.19.44 Quit domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) 23.24.51 Quit m0f0x () 23.26.00 Quit n1s () 23.26.30 *** Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" 23.41.20 Join davina [0] (n=davina@cpc1-sout6-0-0-cust616.sotn.cable.ntl.com) 23.48.58 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) 23.49.04 Join amiconn [50] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) 23.49.28 # how would i hack the sansa v2 checksum? 23.50.51 # hack? 23.51.04 # like, figure it out 23.51.07 Quit davina (Remote closed the connection) 23.51.16 # http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2007/12/05/i-solved-the-ams-sansas-firmware-checksum-puzzle/ 23.51.25 # perhaps 23.51.38 # but there's some additional info in the v2 thread in the forum too 23.53.05 # ive read the thread 23.53.24 Quit styleism (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))