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Subject: RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g

RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g

From: Jammit Timmaj <jammit999_at_hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 22:00:20 +0000

---- My response at the bottom ----

From: megamansuperior_at_hotmail.com
To: rockbox_at_cool.haxx.se
Subject: RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2011 15:16:08 -0400

Thanks! Good idea... Will try that and see what
happens. Just wondering, any way i can get iTunes to recognize the music on the
pod already and add it?
 
THX, D!J!X!

From: rockbox-bounces_at_cool.haxx.se
[mailto:rockbox-bounces_at_cool.haxx.se] On Behalf Of Jammit
Timmaj
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2011 3:03 PM
To:
rockbox_at_cool.haxx.se
Subject: RE: Onkyo S-5300 and iPod Nano
1g

I'm not an expert on Rockbox, and I don't have an Onkyo s5300 so I
probably don't have the right answer. I see the Onkyo is using a Buur-Brown DAC
in it. Normally I don't think this would be a problem, but I believe Onkyo has
made a deal with Apple to allow them to use the Apple proprietary database on
the iPod to pull the music off of the iPod via the USB connection and using
their own DAC to directly convert digital to audio. The iPod dock you're
probably using doesn't do that. It pulls the audio not from the USB, but from
the analog part that's built into the dock with the USB. When the Onkyo tries to
read the iPod database, it sees there's nothing in the database and gives up.
You may want to add a few test songs to the iPod via iTunes just to see if it
works. If it does work you need a way to edit the proprietary iPod database
that's on the iPod to point to the Rockbox files. I'd probably just move the
music onto the computer, remove the music from Rockbox, add the music back to
the iPod via iTunes and the iPod normal OS. After transferring the music to the
iPod the Apple way, reboot into Rockbox and have it rescan for your music.That
way, both Apple OS and Rockbox have the same data.

From: megamansuperior_at_hotmail.com
To: rockbox_at_cool.haxx.se
Subject: Onkyo
S-5300 and iPod Nano 1g
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2011 04:10:38 -0400

My Onkyo s-5300 home
theater comes with an accessory iPod dock. When I dock my iPod nano 1g (running
the latest iPod firmware and the latest Rockbox official release) to my regular
iPod docks, the iPod works with no problems; meaning it plays
instantly.
However, if I turn on or
restart the iPod and dock it onto the s-5300's dock, nothing will happen. I've
checked the manual, tried everything I know of, including turning the TV on
before docking etc, diferent power on orders, still no audible playback, though
rockbox shows the wps and is actually playing the music, since you can hear it
through the headphones if you plug them in.
 
If I put it on one of my
regular iPod docks though, restart rockbox, start playback of a song, then
undock it from that dock and move it back to my s-5300's dock, after about 30
secs or more, it'll start playing like nothing. It however won't dock at all to
my s-5300's dock unless I go through the hassle of docking it on a regular iPod
dock first and then moving it over.
 
My question is, what
could the cause be? I don't think it has to do with rb, just wondering if
there's some settings I can look at, or if there's something I should do
different? Could it be an issue with the ht's dock? Perhaps the
iPod?
 
Not sure why it works
when the iPod is first docked and restarted on a normal iPod dock. But if after
it's working on the s-5300's dock, if I restart it again, it won't work. The
iPod does turn on, load rockbox etc, but there's just no audible playback, so I
have to do the same thing, take it to a regular dock, dock it, restart it, start
playback, then move it back. Is there a startup flag or something that let's the
pod know its docked? How does rockbox handle docks, is it officially supported?
As I said, this is the first time I've encountered this, both of my regular
docks work fine though.
 
Also, when the s-5300's
dock is working, I should be able to control it via the home theater, however
that doesn't work either. Could this part be related to the fact that rockbox
responds differently to remote/dock commands, or it perhaps doesn't support that
feature?
 
Sorry for the confusing
explanations and bunch of questions, just trying to give as many details as I
can to reproduce the issue, since most people might not know exactly what I'm
talking about. I'm just trying to see if anybody's ever encountered this
problem/situation, or if anybody has any ideas etc. I haven't loaded the iPod
firmware and taken it for a spin on the s-5300's dock directly, since I use
rockbox exclusively, but I might try that when I get a
chance.
 
Any thoughts, comments,
suggestions, questions or ideas welcome!
 
TIA,
D!J!X!
 
P.S. This is not such a
big deal to me, but it's the first thing I find that this awesome firmware
(rockbox) can't do, so just want to see if I can fix it or at least find the
issue if it's not rb
related.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I put my response at the bottom because this list has a rule about replying to a post by appending to the bottom. I noticed that your response and my response wasn't posted like that. I thought I did respond at the bottom, but it looks like I or my email program messed that up, and I hope that this is at the bottom like its supposed to be. I also hope this doesn't confuse anybody. If this response does get messed up and reposts this at the top, I apologize to the list and will try and fix it.

To your question about getting iTunes to recognize songs on the iPod under Rockbox being recognized, that may be really difficult. Rockbox doesn't use any external programs (external means you don't need to have anything installed on a computer) to index the music. Rockbox searches itself for music and adds a "link" to the song in its own database. The Apple OS doesn't do this. When you sync with iTunes, iTunes not only copies the music onto the iPod, but also adds a "link" to the song on the iPods database. When you tell iTunes to play a song, the Apple OS only reads the database and doesn't look for anything else. When you add a song under Rockbox and then tell Apple OS to play, the Apple OS won't "see" anything because not only does Rockbox not need another program to tell it where the music is, but any program we make that runs on a computer would need to understand how Apple writes this database of "links", and this database isn't done in any easy or normal way.

The easiest way to setup a dual Rockbox/Apple OS is:
Tell the iPod to boot into Apple OS.
Plug the iPod into the computer.
When iTunes starts, ignore it and minimize it for now.
Open "My Computer" and navigate to where you copied the music to the iPod.
Copy the music from Rockbox onto the computer. You probably want to make a new directory on the computer.
Delete the music from Rockbox, but keep Rockbox installed.
Go back to iTunes and tell it you want to manually manage music.
Add the directory you just made on the computer to iTunes.
Tell iTunes to sync the iPod.
After iTunes does the copy, eject the iPod in the normal way.
Reboot the iPod into Rockbox (if it hasn't booted that way after ejecting).
Tell Rockbox to rescan for music.

This way may have a lot of steps, but is known to work. Any method of recursively adding music from the iPod to iTunes and back to the iPod would probably cause an infinite loop, and Apple has prevented iTunes from doing this. Even if you were able to recursively add music from the iPod back onto it, iTunes makes a copy on the iPod with a different name and then you'd have two copies. If you went back into the iPod and deleted the original copies, iTunes would see you deleted the originals and the delete the copies it just made on the iPod.
                                               

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Received on 2011-09-05


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