| 00:01:10 | dwihno | hm |
| 00:01:13 | dwihno | let me check |
| 00:01:20 | dwihno | (no configure script either?) |
| 00:01:35 | dwihno | C:\wip\src\rockbox\apps>make |
| 00:01:35 | dwihno | process_begin: CreateProcess((null), sh.exe -c "for d in .deps .deps/player; do |
| 00:01:35 | dwihno | { if [ ! -d ./$d ]; then mkdir ./$d; fi; }; done", ...) failed. |
| 00:01:35 | dwihno | make (e=2): The system cannot find the file specified. |
| 00:01:37 | Zagor | the tools dir doesn't use the configure script |
| 00:01:50 | dwihno | tools has been successfully compiled |
| 00:01:54 | Zagor | oh, ok |
| 00:03:36 | dwihno | hmm |
| 00:03:46 | dwihno | Depending on commercial tools is not that good, imho |
| 00:03:51 | dwihno | such as nmake :/ |
| 00:07:15 | edx | dwihno: yes - but thats not the point - use any other win32 make if you got one |
| 00:07:32 | dwihno | edx: I only have GNU tools :/ |
| 00:07:38 | * | dwihno is an advocate for free power tools :) |
| 00:08:01 | edx | free is cool for sure - but visual c++ just kicks ass and is much better than anything you get for free |
| 00:08:14 | edx | actually i think its the best you can get _at all_ |
| 00:09:09 | Hadaka | I could never use it, too many bugs, sorry :( |
| 00:09:21 | Hadaka | and it lacks too many C++ features as well |
| 00:09:43 | edx | damn |
| 00:09:45 | edx | waht bugs? |
| 00:09:59 | edx | never found a bug in the latest version. |
| 00:10:07 | edx | and i use it a lot really. |
| 00:10:14 | Hadaka | internal compiler errors on complex structures, running out of internal buffers for debug info, not specifying enough |
| 00:10:37 | Hadaka | hell, even VS8 isn't going to have all the necessary features |
| 00:10:37 | edx | never had those problems so fare. |
| 00:10:45 | edx | (has gcc?!) |
| 00:10:51 | Hadaka | gcc has |
| 00:11:56 | Hadaka | besides, not being able to compile a program on windows without a commercial compiler is just plain silliness |
| 00:12:11 | edx | oh well.. i've heard stuff about version conflicts etc. which would propably cause much more problems to me - also I hate the missing editor in linux (that is a vs-like editor) |
| 00:12:17 | edx | you all use emacs or what? |
| 00:12:21 | edx | vim? |
| 00:12:37 | Hadaka | I could never use the vs editor either - too few features, sucky indentation and all that :) |
| 00:12:50 | edx | why am i not able to compile a program without a commercial compiler - never said that :) |
| 00:12:57 | Hadaka | xemacs for me and vim at times |
| 00:13:06 | edx | what features are you missing in the vs-editor? |
| 00:13:17 | Hadaka | well take for example the indentation |
| 00:13:22 | dwihno | vim is really neato |
| 00:13:43 | Hadaka | most always it guesses wrong and can't fix it |
| 00:14:00 | edx | what is identation - sorry i dont understand the word? |
| 00:14:12 | Hadaka | on emacsen you can even pick the style of indentation you want - gnu or linux or stroustrup or k&r |
| 00:14:22 | Hadaka | um, the amount of whitespace at the beginning of lines |
| 00:14:26 | edx | ok got it |
| 00:14:35 | edx | well its just like i want it - plus I can fix it |
| 00:15:01 | Hadaka | anybody who writes a lot of code has to conform to a variety of different indentation styles |
| 00:15:09 | edx | im only used to the vc style but you can do some changes to the indentation style as well there |
| 00:16:12 | dwihno | Hadaka: what do you think about the vim configurability when it comes to indenting? |
| 00:16:14 | Hadaka | VS.Net has come a bit further in features such as narrowing and so, but still not enough for me |
| 00:17:22 | Hadaka | dwihno: vim is nice - the indenting there is a nice middle-line solution - not entirely fixed, but still helps a lot - but still it lacks in features I use daily so I haven't really gotten into it - I use it half of the time when I'm editing something small |
| 00:18:12 | edx | has vim a shortcut button to "compile stuff" |
| 00:18:31 | Hadaka | but I personally don't know a single professional coder who codes with VS and hasn't run into internal compiler errors and other bugs |
| 00:18:37 | Hadaka | vim has, as does xemacs |
| 00:18:43 | Hadaka | and emacs |
| 00:18:59 | edx | ok .. thats a little progress on the long way of comfort then :) |
| 00:19:10 | edx | i hate having to type makefiles myself |
| 00:19:15 | edx | (thats another thing.) |
| 00:19:41 | Hadaka | oh but you have to do that anyway - since VS never gets the linking correct when something complex is being done |
| 00:19:59 | edx | that means i've never done anything complex. |
| 00:20:27 | Hadaka | and usually there's atleast one thing in each project which has autogenerated code - and it's a pain in the ass to try and hook those up with VS |
| 00:20:51 | edx | no way. |
| 00:21:02 | edx | there's nothing auto generated if you dont want it to be there. |
| 00:21:04 | Hadaka | take for example the .lang files in rockbox - how would you make VS automatically create the lang.c and lang.h files when the english.lang file is changed? |
| 00:21:34 | edx | add a command to the project settings which calls the perl script or something like that |
| 00:21:41 | Hadaka | well see my example first - that's what I mean - or things like parsers which need lex or yacc or bison |
| 00:21:58 | Hadaka | I don't think you can make the command so it activates only when the english.lang file is changed? |
| 00:22:26 | edx | i dont know how it is with the parser stuff for other languages - that's a good point, maybe they dont support that yet. but using other compilers is no problem (or other programs, whatever) |
| 00:22:26 | Hadaka | or IDL compilers for RPC stuff |
| 00:22:40 | | Join Lowfiler [0] (H@p5085F91B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:22:42 | Lowfiler | hi |
| 00:22:46 | edx | hi |
| 00:22:55 | Lowfiler | hey edx ->query plz |
| 00:23:20 | Hadaka | besides - you can get autogenerated makefiles without VS anyway - just use automake and autoconf |
| 00:23:44 | Hadaka | (on windows) |
| 00:23:51 | edx | i know to little about those tools ;) |
| 00:23:55 | edx | too |
| 00:24:02 | Hadaka | for example at the place I work at |
| 00:24:22 | Hadaka | we have a win32 client and a linux server for those (no linux client) |
| 00:24:42 | Hadaka | and all the win32 compiling is done by driving the VS compiler directly out of GNU Make - using autoconf |
| 00:25:18 | Hadaka | works a _lot_ better for producing release builds and debug builds when the whole building process can be exactly defined |
| 00:25:20 | | Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-away (user@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
| 00:25:25 | Hadaka | and no GUI tools are necessary for building |
| 00:26:42 | edx | cool. sounds good (driving vs from autoconf) |
| 00:27:02 | edx | but the point is not the necesserity of GUI tools - the point is the COMFORT |
| 00:27:24 | Hadaka | yeah, that might be the point - but the problem is that they can't do the job :) |
| 00:28:06 | edx | i have the feeling that that's religious. |
| 00:28:28 | Hadaka | well take the case at work |
| 00:28:30 | edx | they don't do the job for projects where linux people are invlolved. that is true :) - cuz they never are up to date |
| 00:29:03 | Hadaka | we need to be able to produce builds by pressing one button and a CD comes out of the burner a few hours later |
| 00:29:37 | | Quit Zagor ("Client Exiting") |
| 00:30:01 | Hadaka | that involves several steps of generating code, compiling code, making packages, prepping installers, building ISO images and so on |
| 00:30:57 | Hadaka | I have a hard time seeing how to accomplish that without this current setup |
| 00:31:51 | edx | well. you are producing for linux or windows or both? |
| 00:31:57 | Hadaka | windows |
| 00:32:58 | edx | and why dont you use the vs-editor then? |
| 00:33:08 | edx | how do you edit the code if not with the vs editor? |
| 00:33:33 | Hadaka | half of the windows people edit the code in the VS editor - half use emacs |
| 00:33:54 | Hadaka | but there's no way at all that the VS editor could manage to create a build |
| 00:34:19 | Hadaka | hell, it even has trouble managing to create the .sys file since the linking needed is very nasty |
| 00:34:34 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 00:35:24 | mecraw12 | Damn... Zagor left before I posted my patch. :( |
| 00:36:23 | edx | well. but the problem is (first of all) that not all ppl are willing to usethe vs net editor - which is a problem of the persons not using vs instead of the vs editor. generating the sys file is another thing. You need the DDK then (which I guess you use) and you need a well configured project file. but generally nearly anything is possible with the gui since it allows you to run external programs.) |
| 00:37:32 | Hadaka | oh ofcourse everything is possible since external programs can be run - you can run GNU make from the VS editor |
| 00:37:43 | Hadaka | but that's not excuse for it being so damn tough |
| 00:38:01 | PsycoXul | how come nobody knows how to use -r with diff |
| 00:38:15 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: ? |
| 00:38:32 | PsycoXul | -r −−recursive Recursively compare any subdirectories found. |
| 00:38:48 | PsycoXul | diff -ur olddir newdir >complete.patch |
| 00:39:02 | PsycoXul | no need for any seperate files |
| 00:39:03 | mecraw12 | cvs diff does it |
| 00:39:43 | Hadaka | and the problem is not that everybody isn't willing to use the VS.Net editor - we would probably do the building in that if it could manage it |
| 00:39:45 | PsycoXul | but almost every patch i see on the mailing list sends like .zip files with .c files or .c files AND one OR MORE .diff's |
| 00:39:47 | edx | Hadaka: well it really seems to depend on where you've grown up - i would call the hard-core linux command line stuff "tough" :) |
| 00:40:17 | Hadaka | but the external command hooking up is way too immature - no way to get any complex evaluations of command pipings done |
| 00:41:12 | Hadaka | in fact - I don't know of a single software company that would use the VS editor to produce their release versions of the software |
| 00:41:13 | mecraw12 | PsycoXul: that's because apps and firmware are in different cvs modules, cvs diff can't cross modules and it won't include new files |
| 00:41:14 | edx | yea, maybe - but you could use it to call a make-like program and have that program evaluate the rest for you :) |
| 00:41:34 | edx | Hadaka: I do. ID Software does (with quake2 at least they did.) |
| 00:42:31 | Hadaka | err, you sure about that? I thought they had automated building for quake2 already? |
| 00:42:51 | edx | at least the sources include vc project files. |
| 00:43:03 | edx | (which does not mean that the release is vc at all.. yes) |
| 00:43:08 | Hadaka | oh yes, that's for the developers to check whether it compiles or not |
| 00:43:13 | edx | but you could compile a release version with them |
| 00:43:39 | edx | so what compiler do you think they used for the release? or are you just talking about the make-script? |
| 00:43:51 | Hadaka | well you could compile the release binary - and the release installer separately - but that's in no way doing the packaging |
| 00:44:32 | Hadaka | I'm talking about the building process - the compiler is quite probably VS - it's not like anybody has a lot of choice there |
| 00:44:41 | edx | well why would you need vs to compile an installer? that's no use - you do the developing and then _one time_ you do the packaging |
| 00:45:01 | Hadaka | but how do you do the packaging? with what? |
| 00:47:14 | PsycoXul | mecraw12: whats cvs got to do with it? |
| 00:47:20 | Hadaka | we do several builds on CD:s with complete installers and autoboot per day - and those have to come out without anybody doing anything more than sticking in a new CD and telling to build |
| 00:47:25 | edx | msi? - well today you would (not at times of quake2) |
| 00:47:46 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: people should make patches by editing a working copy and then saying cvs diff and mailing that :) |
| 00:47:47 | edx | yes in your case thats a bit different propably. |
| 00:48:09 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 00:48:29 | Hadaka | well how is it different from any software company? think about building Microsoft Word release? |
| 00:48:38 | Hadaka | you think someone is manually wrapping them together? |
| 00:49:15 | PsycoXul | usualy i make a diff by making 2 fresh copies of the modules i'm changing in new dirs, make my changes to the one, and diff -ur between the 2 of them |
| 00:49:48 | Hadaka | or something like quake2 - sure you can get a binary for your own testing by pressing F7 (or was it F8) - but if you want something more than that - you have to do it with something else |
| 00:50:20 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: well the CVS method is a lot nicer - since it will survive 'cvs up' for updating the patch and a lot of other things - and it doesn't need that extra copy of the directory |
| 00:50:22 | edx | hmm quake2 might be a little different - they would not need an installer during the developing process |
| 00:50:23 | PsycoXul | then you can just go to the dir where the modules dirs are in, patch -p1 <blah.diff, and you're patched |
| 00:50:59 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: same thing with the 'cvs diff' |
| 00:51:00 | edx | Hadaka: Yes, I would like to know whether MS uses the editor to build word :) |
| 00:51:09 | Hadaka | edx: they do not :) |
| 00:51:17 | PsycoXul | it'll create any new files, change any files in any modules, etc |
| 00:51:29 | Hadaka | edx: they don't even use it to build VS itself |
| 00:51:33 | edx | Hadaka: are you sure about that |
| 00:51:35 | PsycoXul | the 2 dirs i create for it are just temporary, and ensure that the patch doesn't have any other source mod's i've made to my own tree |
| 00:51:45 | edx | Hadaka: what do they use instead |
| 00:52:03 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: well with cvs diff you have to make sure you've typed 'cvs add' on the new files - then it works |
| 00:52:31 | Hadaka | they have a separate commandline program that handles building VS |
| 00:52:40 | Hadaka | that's driven from some .BAT |
| 00:52:48 | PsycoXul | personally, i think all the stuff necessary to build rockbox should all be under a single module |
| 00:53:15 | edx | hmmm |
| 00:53:26 | edx | then we would not neeed modules at all (well, nearly not) |
| 00:53:27 | PsycoXul | so that instead of |
| 00:53:28 | Hadaka | had a longish talk with a guy who was working on VS8 |
| 00:53:29 | PsycoXul | cvs -z9 co apps firmware tools docs |
| 00:53:31 | PsycoXul | i can just use |
| 00:53:34 | PsycoXul | cvs -z9 co rockbox |
| 00:53:46 | dwihno | Isn't it possible to mimic the nmake behaviour? :) |
| 00:53:48 | PsycoXul | i used to use cvs -z9 co . |
| 00:53:56 | PsycoXul | but that also got www and junk like that |
| 00:54:04 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: well you can make a module that contains those other modules |
| 00:54:59 | edx | Hadaka: cool! do you know when they are going to release it? |
| 00:55:17 | PsycoXul | but its all besides the point, all i want is to stop seeing "patches" sent to the mailing list that consist of blah.c halb.c fooblah.diff gaah.diff etc |
| 00:55:28 | Hadaka | edx: well it's going to take a while |
| 00:55:36 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: well tell them to use 'cvs diff' :) |
| 00:55:50 | edx | Hadaka: yes.. i guess so :) |
| 00:55:59 | edx | it's become late. i gotta go |
| 00:56:07 | edx | good night |
| 00:56:11 | | Nick edx is now known as edx|sleep (~edx@pD9EAAB15.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:56:11 | Hadaka | nighty |
| 00:56:29 | mecraw | Hadaka: i did use cvs diff for my patch, but i still needed 4 files to send it |
| 00:56:44 | Hadaka | mecraw: why on earth? |
| 00:57:13 | mecraw | i changed files in apps and firmware and added 2 files |
| 00:57:37 | Hadaka | adding files is no problem |
| 00:57:45 | mecraw | can i do 'cvs add' with anonymous access? |
| 00:57:52 | Hadaka | vi CVS/Entries |
| 00:58:04 | Hadaka | that's how you do it with anonymous access :) |
| 00:58:08 | mecraw | true, didn't think of that |
| 00:58:20 | Hadaka | but that's just a stupid bug in CVS why it doesn't allow that |
| 00:58:31 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 00:58:57 | Hadaka | but why don't you have a module in CVSROOT/modules that consists of firmware, apps, tools and docs? |
| 00:59:02 | mecraw | PsycoXul: i apologize for having so many files in my patch :) |
| 00:59:08 | PsycoXul | mecraw: :p |
| 00:59:12 | Hadaka | it doesn't require anything else except changing a single file? |
| 00:59:18 | PsycoXul | you're forgiven, this time :p |
| 00:59:36 | * | mecraw sighs with relief |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:11 | mecraw | Hadaka: how do I do the modules thing? |
| 01:00:27 | Hadaka | hm? |
| 01:00:44 | mecraw | CVROOT/modules, how do i do it |
| 01:00:44 | mecraw | ? |
| 01:00:58 | Hadaka | for the working copy, you have to do some creative generation of CVS files by yourself - on the repository side it can be fixed by editing that |
| 01:01:28 | PsycoXul | i need to figure out a violin mute |
| 01:01:41 | PsycoXul | i read on some web page that clothes pins clipped to the bridge work |
| 01:01:44 | mecraw | take the strings off |
| 01:01:47 | PsycoXul | but when i tried it, it didn't even make a difference |
| 01:02:04 | PsycoXul | mecraw: that doesn't make for very productive practice sessions :p |
| 01:02:25 | mecraw | your neighbors will appreciate it though :) |
| 01:02:28 | PsycoXul | mecraw: not only that, but that'll also let the bridge fall off and the soundpost fall |
| 01:02:51 | PsycoXul | and while the bridge is easy to put on, the soundpost requires [expensive] professional placing |
| 01:03:00 | Hadaka | PsycoXul: how about editing CVSROOT/modules and adding a line: rockbox &apps &firmware &tools &docs? |
| 01:03:22 | PsycoXul | Hadaka: go for it |
| 01:03:23 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 01:03:36 | Hadaka | me? I don't have access to the repository :) |
| 01:03:47 | PsycoXul | all i know about cvs is how to grab stuff from it |
| 01:03:47 | Hadaka | or should I send a patch? ;) |
| 01:03:48 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 01:04:17 | Hadaka | after that - cvs co rockbox creates a directory rockbox with apps, firmware, tools and docs under it |
| 01:04:26 | Hadaka | which is what you want, isn't it? |
| 01:04:30 | PsycoXul | yeah |
| 01:04:38 | Hadaka | and then people can do 'cvs diff' in the rockbox directory and get diffs for all the modules |
| 01:04:47 | PsycoXul | sounds good to me |
| 01:04:48 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 01:04:55 | | Quit Hes (brunner.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net) |
| 01:04:55 | NSplit | brunner.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net |
| 01:05:27 | NHeal | brunner.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net |
| 01:05:27 | NJoin | Hes [0] (~hessu@hessu.zedi.sonera.fi) |
| 01:05:59 | PsycoXul | hopefully my cheapo for-tuning piezo pickup gets here today |
| 01:06:16 | PsycoXul | for some reason my mic doesn't produce much of a signal from my violin |
| 01:06:55 | PsycoXul | and is awkward and cumbersome anyways |
| 01:07:18 | dwihno | make: *** No rule to make target `lang/.lang', needed by `build.lang'. Stop. |
| 01:07:19 | dwihno | (?) |
| 01:08:10 | PsycoXul | dwihno: is it trying to use ${LANG}.lang and LANG's not set or something like that? |
| 01:09:36 | dwihno | hm |
| 01:09:48 | dwihno | make -f win32.mak -DLANG=english or smth? |
| 01:10:02 | PsycoXul | you'd have to look at the makefile to see what it wants |
| 01:10:05 | PsycoXul | i'm just making a guess here |
| 01:10:34 | PsycoXul | i would also guess there's an official way to do it that you've somehow missed or something |
| 01:11:28 | mecraw | Do any of you build the windows simulator with mingw? |
| 01:13:23 | PsycoXul | hell no |
| 01:13:36 | PsycoXul | :p |
| 01:24:08 | dwihno | Nobody ever did ;) |
| 01:25:26 | mecraw | didn't bill napier work on it? |
| 01:25:36 | dwihno | dunno |
| 01:27:43 | dwihno | whoa |
| 01:27:44 | dwihno | it worked |
| 01:27:48 | dwihno | :) |
| 01:28:09 | dwihno | although the win32.mak in tools should be gnu-make:able :) |
| 01:36:43 | dwihno | and clean should also erase lang.c&h |
| 01:39:57 | dwihno | make -f win32.mak LANGUAGE=english |
| 01:40:02 | dwihno | or whatever language you want |
| 01:41:25 | PsycoXul | i guess configure doesn't work for the win32.mak's? |
| 01:41:47 | PsycoXul | or does configure even set the language/ |
| 01:42:01 | dwihno | win32.mak is purely for gnush users |
| 01:42:05 | dwihno | who won't use configure scripts ;) |
| 01:42:29 | PsycoXul | hmm |
| 01:42:32 | PsycoXul | what is gnush anyways |
| 01:44:18 | PsycoXul | so like the violin i got i'm suspicious that it was substantialy misrepresented on it's ebay ad.. :/ i sent an e-mail to its selling just now indicating all the problems i think it has and that i'll be confirming them with an expert's opinion |
| 01:44:31 | PsycoXul | s/selling/seller/ |
| 01:45:04 | dwihno | gnush is a 'pure' (no cygwin or such) sh-1 compiler based on mingw stuff |
| 01:45:17 | PsycoXul | i see |
| 01:45:29 | PsycoXul | and it doesn't have a sh or bash? |
| 01:47:43 | dwihno | nope |
| 01:48:00 | dwihno | And that's a pretty good thing, I think |
| 01:48:11 | dwihno | No dependencies (except the compilker) |
| 01:48:21 | PsycoXul | heh |
| 01:48:57 | PsycoXul | i guess :p |
| 01:49:07 | PsycoXul | though i've seen floppy-based linux distro's that could run that configure script :p |
| 02:00 |
| 02:06:44 | dwihno | :-) |
| 02:06:52 | dwihno | Windows is not Linux (tm) ;) |
| 02:10:54 | PsycoXul | heh yeah, but that's beside the point |
| 02:11:22 | PsycoXul | unless you're just planning some new software movement called WNL or something |
| 02:11:23 | PsycoXul | :p |
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| 04:19:19 | NHeal | brunner.openprojects.net irc.openprojects.net |
| 04:19:19 | NJoin | Hes [0] (~hessu@hessu.zedi.sonera.fi) |
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| 05:28:11 | RedLeg | Anybody awake in here? |
| 05:28:29 | mecraw12 | barely |
| 05:30:07 | RedLeg | Just wanted to report in.... I just installed a 60gb Toshiba drive in my JBR20. No real issues... |
| 05:31:20 | mecraw12 | cool |
| 05:32:17 | RedLeg | Yup. Took FOREVER to move the tunez in, but all is working fine. It's significantly more quiet than the Hitachi that came out too. |
| 05:32:54 | mecraw12 | you don't have a USB 2.0 card? |
| 05:34:38 | RedLeg | Nope. I use linux exclusively, and have a notebook as my primary machine. USB 2.0 support is new there, and I don't know of a pcmcia USB 2.0 card. |
| 05:48:07 | | Join noalavida [0] (MASTest@123-MAD2-X66.libre.retevision.es) |
| 05:48:49 | noalavida | hello |
| 05:50:17 | | Quit RedLeg ("Client Exiting") |
| 06:00 |
| 06:04:06 | noalavida | can anyone help me? |
| 06:04:42 | noalavida | i'm having a problem when compile rockbox |
| 06:05:13 | noalavida | i'm reciving this error |
| 06:05:31 | noalavida | sh-elf-gcc -Os -nostdlib -o ./archos.elf ./lang.o ./credits.o ./debug_menu.o ./ |
| 06:05:32 | noalavida | demo_menu.o ./games_menu.o ./lang.o ./main.o ./main_menu.o ./menu.o ./playlist.o |
| 06:05:32 | noalavida | ./settings.o ./settings_menu.o ./showtext.o ./sound_menu.o ./status.o ./tree.o |
| 06:05:32 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK noalavida |
| 06:05:32 | noalavida | ./wps-display.o ./wps.o ./recorder/bmp.o ./recorder/bounce.o ./recorder/icons.o |
| 06:05:32 | noalavida | ./recorder/oscillograph.o ./recorder/snake.o ./recorder/snow.o ./recorder/sokoba |
| 06:05:32 | *** | Alert Mode level 1 |
| 06:05:32 | noalavida | n.o ./recorder/tetris.o ./recorder/widgets.o ./recorder/wormlet.o -L. -lrockbox |
| 06:05:33 | *** | Alert Mode level 2 |
| 06:05:33 | noalavida | -lgcc -L../firmware -T../firmware/app.lds -Wl,-Map,./archos.map |
| 06:05:35 | noalavida | ./lang.o(.data+0x0): multiple definition of `language_strings' |
| 06:05:37 | noalavida | ./lang.o(.data+0x0): first defined here |
| 06:05:39 | noalavida | make: *** [archos.elf] Error 1 |
| 06:15:34 | *** | Alert Mode OFF |
| 06:30:41 | | Join edx|sleep [0] (~edx@pD9EA8DCA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 06:31:22 | mecraw | hi, edx|sleep |
| 06:34:41 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 06:37:55 | | Join indigo99 [0] (~indigo99@12-234-39-56.client.attbi.com) |
| 06:41:06 | | Part indigo99 |
| 06:51:11 | | Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-sleep (user@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
| 07:00 |
| 07:03:13 | | Quit noalavida () |
| 08:00 |
| 08:08:10 | | Join indigo99 [0] (~indigo99@12-234-39-56.client.attbi.com) |
| 08:08:32 | | Part indigo99 |
| 08:34:44 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 08:53:12 | | Join werty1st [0] (we@brln-d9b820a6.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 08:53:16 | werty1st | hello |
| 08:53:36 | werty1st | how can i use the new language files |
| 08:58:49 | | Nick edx|sleep is now known as edx (~edx@pD9EA8DCA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:15 | | Part Remo |
| 09:30:04 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK werty1st |
| 09:30:04 | werty1st | why don`t we have an 'auto off' feature yet? |
| 09:44:47 | | Quit edx ("later") |
| 10:00 |
| 10:19:04 | | Join edx [0] (~edx@hmbg-d9b88aa3.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 10:34:45 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 10:50:00 | | Join TotMacher [0] (tot@p508DB5F9.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:00 |
| 11:10:30 | dwihno | werty1st: to use the new language files, you must compile your own firmware (that will probably change). |
| 11:10:41 | dwihno | werty1st: the auto off feature is in in the works, afaik |
| 11:23:03 | | Quit Lowfiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 11:28:33 | | Quit TotMacher (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 11:34:46 | werty1st | @ <dwihno> which daily build will include the auto off feature? |
| 11:35:54 | dwihno | werty1st: since it's work-in-progress, it's not certain yet. It might be today, tomorrow or even two weeks. |
| 11:36:11 | werty1st | ok |
| 11:37:11 | werty1st | i found it very difficlut to get behind the rolo. i didn´t know that i have to disable the music filter and then "play" the mod files ;-) |
| 11:38:17 | dwihno | the rolo feature has proven quite useful for people who really want to use rockbox and then just the stock firmware for recording |
| 11:39:01 | werty1st | i think i found a bug in a sokoban level |
| 11:40:12 | dwihno | report it on the sourceforge bug page then |
| 11:41:23 | | Join laotan [0] (~jesse@markham.openflows.org) |
| 11:42:10 | werty1st | could it be possible to write a leveleditor for sokoban because i´ll finish it soon |
| 11:42:30 | | Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Bdb70.pppool.de) |
| 11:43:54 | dwihno | well, nothing is impossible :) |
| 11:44:00 | dwihno | good morning, langhaar |
| 11:44:06 | langhaarrocker | moin! |
| 11:49:04 | langhaarrocker | is there in cygwin some kind of initial shell script where I can change my path? |
| 12:00 |
| 12:02:09 | langhaarrocker | Is there someone with cvs access around? |
| 12:02:16 | Schnueff | langhaarrocker: u mean http://www.cygwin.com/faq/faq_4.html#SEC34 ? |
| 12:04:15 | | Join linuxstb [0] (~dave@dsl-212-23-31-215.zen.co.uk) |
| 12:08:01 | langhaarrocker | Schnueff: Thanx. Exactly wha I needed. |
| 12:08:40 | Schnueff | np |
| 12:34:47 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 12:37:33 | | Part langhaarrocker |
| 12:41:42 | | Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@Bdb70.pppool.de) |
| 12:42:26 | langhaarrocker | Code police becomes superficial. |
| 12:43:19 | langhaarrocker | Someone bothered about german.lang / deutsch.lang but didn't notice that the file doesn't work. |
| 12:44:06 | dwihno | :O |
| 12:45:23 | Ctcp | Ignored 2 channel CTCP requests in 3 hours and 24 minutes at the last flood |
| 12:45:23 | * | langhaarrocker has to work on sundays |
| 12:46:49 | dwihno | So what do you do for a living? |
| 12:47:11 | | Quit langhaarrocker (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 12:58:02 | | Join TotMacher [0] (tot@pD9520171.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:58:18 | | Quit TotMacher (Client Quit) |
| 12:58:39 | | Join TotMacher [0] (tot@pD9520171.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:00 |
| 13:27:13 | | Nick edx is now known as edx|eats (~edx@hmbg-d9b88aa3.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 13:55:28 | | Nick seb-sleep is now known as seb-away (user@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
| 14:00 |
| 14:05:25 | | Nick edx|eats is now known as edx (~edx@hmbg-d9b88aa3.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 14:24:46 | | Join YeAhx [0] (~aarond@66.81.88.2) |
| 14:25:02 | YeAhx | hey peeps how goes it? |
| 14:27:49 | YeAhx | no one around huh? |
| 14:34:48 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 14:37:33 | | Join DownKaos_ [0] (littldevl@BV2-24.207.202.25.charter-stl.com) |
| 14:42:11 | | Nick DownKaos_ is now known as DownKaos (littldevl@BV2-24.207.202.25.charter-stl.com) |
| 14:50:02 | | Join ronnymorc [0] (we@b-180-178-109.s.dial.de.ignite.net) |
| 14:50:02 | | Quit werty1st (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 14:56:32 | | Quit YeAhx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:00 |
| 15:32:42 | | Quit ronnymorc () |
| 15:39:09 | dwihno | :-) |
| 15:39:11 | dwihno | Hellצ |
| 16:00 |
| 16:21:14 | | Join Jet8810 [0] (~Joshua@adsl-35-1-217.bct.bellsouth.net) |
| 16:29:17 | | Quit TotMacher () |
| 16:34:51 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 16:52:15 | | Join TotMacher [0] (tot@pD9520171.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:00 |
| 17:27:59 | | Nick edx is now known as edx|away (~edx@hmbg-d9b88aa3.pool.mediaWays.net) |
| 17:35:45 | | Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@B44de.pppool.de) |
| 18:00 |
| 18:04:50 | langhaarrocker | Any news about the t-shirt contest? |
| 18:08:12 | | Join Phantom [0] (Phantom@ASte-Genev-Bois-109-1-2-41.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 18:08:16 | Phantom | HI |
| 18:08:25 | langhaarrocker | :) |
| 18:13:19 | Phantom | is somebody can make a FR ? |
| 18:13:19 | | Quit langhaarrocker (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:13:28 | | Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@B474a.pppool.de) |
| 18:13:50 | langhaarrocker | any alpha testers around? |
| 18:14:02 | Phantom | Yes, me.is somebody can make a FR ? |
| 18:14:30 | langhaarrocker | What's a FR? |
| 18:14:56 | Phantom | french version |
| 18:15:18 | langhaarrocker | Je na sais pas de francais. |
| 18:15:40 | Phantom | ;-) |
| 18:16:17 | langhaarrocker | If you have a recorder I'd be pleased if you could test the volume meter berzerk mode www.x-phobie.de/ajbrec.ajz |
| 18:16:26 | Phantom | juste to compile a Firmware with the french.lang |
| 18:16:49 | langhaarrocker | You want a french version? |
| 18:16:57 | Phantom | Yes |
| 18:17:00 | langhaarrocker | Player? Recorder? |
| 18:17:13 | Phantom | the recorder, with Games... |
| 18:17:36 | | Join gizz [0] (gizz@lyon-4-a7-62-147-48-77.dial.proxad.net) |
| 18:17:43 | Phantom | if you make it, I test the volume meter ;-) |
| 18:18:23 | langhaarrocker | If you give me your mail addr I'll mail it. |
| 18:18:39 | Phantom | djp007@wanadoo.fr |
| 18:19:04 | langhaarrocker | Hm. French version doesn't compile. |
| 18:20:42 | Phantom | !!! |
| 18:23:16 | | Quit Jet8810 ("Client Exiting") |
| 18:23:19 | Phantom | how to use volume meter ? |
| 18:23:56 | langhaarrocker | You've got to edit your .rockbox/default.wps file and put a line with %pm somewhere. |
| 18:24:23 | Phantom | ARG k |
| 18:27:04 | langhaarrocker | so now why the f&%k doesn't the french version compile while the english does? |
| 18:27:17 | * | langhaarrocker is sniffing in some makefiles |
| 18:28:57 | * | Phantom say : THE VOLUME VOLUME METER IS VERY FINE,GOOD,POWERFULL !!! |
| 18:29:55 | langhaarrocker | I'm especially interested in wether we need the berzerk mode or not. You can switch in General Settings->display->peak meter |
| 18:30:08 | Phantom | what does it change ? |
| 18:30:26 | langhaarrocker | Without berzerk mode the meter is less precise and can miss peaks. |
| 18:31:03 | Phantom | I try... |
| 18:31:06 | langhaarrocker | But berzerk mode makes the thing more buzy -> battery drain -> risk of skips, etc |
| 18:31:58 | langhaarrocker | http://rockbox.haxx.se/mail/archive/rockbox-archive-2002-09/1066.shtml |
| 18:33:27 | Phantom | With, definitly, with... |
| 18:33:44 | Phantom | I ve test with U2 Elevation |
| 18:34:05 | Phantom | And is 18/20 with, and 5/20 without |
| 18:34:44 | Phantom | Berzerk in really important |
| 18:34:50 | langhaarrocker | Is that foud/real peaks? |
| 18:34:52 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 18:34:53 | langhaarrocker | found |
| 18:35:34 | Phantom | with berzek that is perfect, without it's very (but really very) bad |
| 18:36:16 | langhaarrocker | Zagor / LinusN won't like that. |
| 18:36:36 | Phantom | they don't try U2... |
| 18:36:39 | Phantom | ;-) |
| 18:37:01 | langhaarrocker | I try, U2 :) |
| 18:37:31 | Phantom | Elevation |
| 18:38:44 | langhaarrocker | I think I shall go and make some measurements concerning power consumption. |
| 18:39:27 | Phantom | ok |
| 18:39:42 | Phantom | what are other things you work on ? |
| 18:39:49 | | Quit edx|away () |
| 18:40:12 | langhaarrocker | I should make the meter show dBfs instead of linear scale. But I don't grasp the math. |
| 18:40:30 | Phantom | ok |
| 18:41:01 | langhaarrocker | Finally someday I'll make graphical split editor. |
| 18:41:06 | Phantom | what is about recording ? |
| 18:41:57 | langhaarrocker | I'm so slow that I think it's realistic that someone else will have done that by the time I'll have done the split editor. ;) |
| 18:42:23 | linuxstb | Hello all - what's a split editor? |
| 18:42:48 | langhaarrocker | To split mp3 files on the recorder. |
| 18:43:20 | gizz | is hdd write enabled ? |
| 18:43:24 | gizz | :) |
| 18:43:31 | Phantom | when you record a full CD, it is in 1 file, then you split it in part... |
| 18:43:45 | linuxstb | I'm currently working on cue-file support for Rockbox (almost there) - I eventually want to be able to create cue-files on the recorder. |
| 18:43:55 | langhaarrocker | I don't think so. I think Zagor is working on writing. |
| 18:44:55 | langhaarrocker | Phantom: There you mention something. I always wanted to investigate wether we can detect song changes via spdif. |
| 18:45:05 | gizz | lang..: ah ok, you were talking about a future spli editor ;) |
| 18:45:12 | langhaarrocker | yes |
| 18:45:13 | gizz | split |
| 18:45:15 | gizz | ok |
| 18:45:17 | gizz | ;) |
| 18:45:22 | langhaarrocker | I have that dream... |
| 18:46:05 | Phantom | "I ve make a dream..." It is my actual English Lesson... |
| 18:50:30 | Phantom | So nobody to compile a french version with the new font code ? |
| 18:51:07 | langhaarrocker | I'm too stupid to debug that &% tool/configure! |
| 18:55:58 | Phantom | :-[] |
| 18:58:42 | langhaarrocker | now I start finding bugs in francais.lang |
| 19:00 |
| 19:00:21 | langhaarrocker | french is on its way |
| 19:04:13 | dwihno | c'est parfait |
| 19:04:40 | gizz | hey, think about english chatters :) |
| 19:05:23 | langhaarrocker | I guess he thought about them while chatting french. |
| 19:09:29 | dwihno | are there any lsof equivalents for win32? |
| 19:10:14 | langhaarrocker | whats lsof? |
| 19:10:19 | Phantom | langharrocker, can U send me Source of the french version ? |
| 19:11:05 | langhaarrocker | Do you mean the francais.lang? |
| 19:11:32 | mecraw | linuxstb: what is cue-file support? |
| 19:11:39 | Phantom | know, in fact, I know how to compile, but not how to compile with a language... |
| 19:12:46 | langhaarrocker | easy: just call tools/confiugre script form within your build directory. I makes a new Makefile and lets you choose the lingo interactively. |
| 19:13:22 | langhaarrocker | mecraw: cue files tell cd burning programs where to put which song. |
| 19:14:36 | dwihno | langhaarrocker: it lists open files on *nix systems... |
| 19:14:45 | dwihno | langhaarrocker: and the application having the file open |
| 19:15:04 | langhaarrocker | ok. I'll shut up and be ashamed in the corner. |
| 19:15:26 | * | mecraw still wonders what linuxstb meant then |
| 19:15:35 | Phantom | langhaarrocker, plz, send me your sources... PLZ |
| 19:16:49 | langhaarrocker | No, they're too intermediate. I can send you the francais.lang file as that was the buggy one, though. |
| 19:17:13 | Phantom | k |
| 19:18:49 | langhaarrocker | If you don't want to fiddle with cvs you still could get the daily tarball. |
| 19:19:55 | Phantom | Yes, but that is without the volume meter |
| 19:20:08 | linuxstb | mecraw: See http://www.syenar.hu/xmcd2cue/ for an example of a cue file. |
| 19:21:08 | linuxstb | My "cuefile support" currently loads and parses a cue file and displays "tick marks" along the progress bar on the recorder to indicate where the tracks are. |
| 19:21:17 | langhaarrocker | well, the .cue file is just what I has in mind. |
| 19:21:48 | linuxstb | I am about to make the "next/prev" buttons aware of the cue file. The final task for tonight will be displaying track titles from the cuefile. |
| 19:22:14 | mecraw | ah, i get it now, sounds cool |
| 19:22:39 | langhaarrocker | oh. cool. So that would end in a whole playlist / directory being displayed by the progress bar? |
| 19:23:09 | mecraw | do you rip all of your CDs to just one mp3 file? |
| 19:23:18 | langhaarrocker | no. |
| 19:23:49 | linuxstb | No - I record a lot of radio broadcasts (directly as mp2 from digital satellite broadcasts) and I need to navigate within them. |
| 19:24:33 | Phantom | "make: *** No rule to make target 'lang/.lang', needed by 'build.lang'. Stop." |
| 19:24:36 | langhaarrocker | Do you intend to make the 'cue points' editable from within rockbox? |
| 19:24:47 | linuxstb | lang...: yes. That's my intention. |
| 19:24:57 | mecraw | it's amazing how many different ways there are to use rockbox |
| 19:24:58 | Phantom | "make: *** No rule to make target 'lang/.lang', needed by 'build.lang'. Stop." : What that ??? |
| 19:25:21 | langhaarrocker | Phantom: make a new makefile using tools/configure. |
| 19:25:49 | linuxstb | Did anyone read my post to the mailing list about a duplicate "lang.o" in the Makefile? |
| 19:25:51 | langhaarrocker | linxstb: we should share our ideas as that is exactly the same task as file splitting. |
| 19:25:53 | Phantom | I m under Windows !!! |
| 19:26:16 | mecraw | Phantom: are you using cygwin? |
| 19:26:19 | langhaarrocker | Phantom: no cygwin? |
| 19:26:25 | Phantom | no |
| 19:26:36 | Phantom | Sh-elf Tool Chain |
| 19:26:38 | langhaarrocker | I only know the cygwin way. |
| 19:26:42 | linuxstb | Yes - I see splitting and cuefiles as the same thing. Step 1 - create cue file. Step 2 - split according to information in cue file. |
| 19:27:01 | mecraw | Phantom: i build with cygwin as well |
| 19:27:03 | langhaarrocker | That's a way I've thought of, too. |
| 19:27:10 | | Nick dwihno is now known as dw|gone0r (dwihno@Bald067.Baldakinen.Umea.SE) |
| 19:27:10 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK dw|gone0r |
| 19:27:16 | Phantom | Can you help me to install cygwin ? |
| 19:28:01 | mecraw | just go to cygwin.com and click on the setup link |
| 19:28:27 | mecraw | make sure you select to install gcc, make, and perl |
| 19:29:07 | mecraw | then go to http://rockbox.haxx.se/cross-gcc.html and follow the directions |
| 19:29:42 | mecraw | langhaarrocker: have you ever built the win32 sim? |
| 19:29:49 | Phantom | what is the default text file type ? DOS or Unix ? |
| 19:29:57 | langhaarrocker | unix |
| 19:30:14 | langhaarrocker | mecraw: yes with Visual c++ V6 |
| 19:31:01 | mecraw | langhaarrocker: i want to do it without needing vc++ :( |
| 19:31:13 | langhaarrocker | I understand that desire. |
| 19:31:56 | mecraw | i tried to use mingw yesterday but had problems with the lang files |
| 19:32:31 | gizz | ok bye all |
| 19:32:33 | | Quit gizz () |
| 19:32:46 | Phantom | near of gcc it is write : n/q |
| 19:32:55 | Phantom | ? |
| 19:34:13 | langhaarrocker | linuxstb: do you put your cue points on mp3 frame boundaries? |
| 19:34:19 | mecraw | Phantom: where does it say this? |
| 19:34:27 | Phantom | no, i ve found |
| 19:35:16 | linuxstb | Cue points seem to be linked to CD frame boundaries - I don't have any choice. |
| 19:35:39 | linuxstb | There seem to be 76 "CD frames" per second - but I may have misunderstood things. |
| 19:35:53 | langhaarrocker | I see: you take existing cue files that came from ripping? |
| 19:36:11 | linuxstb | No - I don't, but I am assuming that "most users" will be doing that. |
| 19:36:51 | linuxstb | I think we will need non-standard extensions to cue files to handle mpeg audio frames. |
| 19:40:04 | Phantom | I install...cygwin with make, perl ans gcc |
| 19:40:10 | Phantom | then ? |
| 19:40:37 | langhaarrocker | follow the link mecraw posted |
| 19:41:24 | Phantom | I must dl : binutils-2.11.tar.gz |
| 19:41:29 | Phantom | ? |
| 19:41:39 | mecraw | yes, follow the directions |
| 19:41:40 | Phantom | binutils-2.11.tar.gz ? |
| 19:41:44 | Phantom | arf |
| 19:41:46 | Phantom | ok |
| 19:41:54 | mecraw | it takes awhile to build it |
| 19:42:15 | mecraw | you must have patience, grasshopper |
| 19:42:20 | langhaarrocker | but afterwards you can build everything but the simulators :) |
| 19:42:49 | mecraw | somone needs to figure out how to build the sims with cygwin |
| 19:42:58 | mecraw | someone -> not me |
| 19:43:00 | langhaarrocker | not me. |
| 19:43:04 | langhaarrocker | :) |
| 19:43:19 | Phantom | "but afterwards you can build everything but the simulators :)" => what is "everything" |
| 19:43:23 | Phantom | ? |
| 19:43:50 | langhaarrocker | player / recorder / tools / makefiles / languages... |
| 19:44:08 | Phantom | ok what are tools ? |
| 19:44:32 | langhaarrocker | eg. the scramble thing, the perl scripts used for the lang support... |
| 19:44:55 | Phantom | ok |
| 19:44:55 | langhaarrocker | and what's most important: you can use configure to make your Makefile. |
| 19:45:03 | mecraw | Phantom: http://rockbox.haxx.se/docs/how_to_compile.html |
| 19:45:10 | Phantom | how to change the boot screen ? |
| 19:45:57 | langhaarrocker | I never did that |
| 19:47:21 | langhaarrocker | linuxstb: what do you want a cue editor to be like? |
| 19:49:33 | Phantom | what is diffיrence between cue and playlist ? |
| 19:50:42 | langhaarrocker | cue files specify points within a file. |
| 19:51:16 | Phantom | ok |
| 19:52:09 | langhaarrocker | linuxstb: What about a list like editor for the different cue point entries and then a graphical editor for editing one specific cue point? |
| 19:53:52 | linuxstb | Just arrived back.... |
| 19:54:00 | Phantom | where can I dl binutils-2.11.tar.gz, and so on |
| 19:54:23 | mecraw | ftp.gnu.org |
| 19:55:08 | linuxstb | Re: cue and playlist - from an abstract level they can be thought of as the same thing. |
| 19:55:47 | linuxstb | But at the momement a cue file is not read directly - it is read when the mp3 file it relates to is read. |
| 19:57:07 | linuxstb | Re: editting cue points - I think we need some kind of zoom/scroll for the progress bar and a numerical display of the mp3 frame number |
| 19:57:39 | linuxstb | ..but I haven't given it too much thought yet. |
| 19:58:02 | langhaarrocker | I want oscillographs. At least for finetuning the cue / split point. |
| 19:58:41 | linuxstb | I think that's too ambitious to start with. It means decoding the mpeg file in software - or passing the whole file through the hardware decoder. |
| 20:00 |
| 20:00:10 | langhaarrocker | I thought of |
| 20:00:10 | langhaarrocker | 1.) you press pause to specify the rough point |
| 20:00:10 | langhaarrocker | 2.) enter some graphical editor that uses the MAS to obtain oscillosgraphic info while playing |
| 20:00:10 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK langhaarrocker |
| 20:00:10 | langhaarrocker | 3.) looping the environment of the split point |
| 20:00:21 | langhaarrocker | 4.) finetune the split point. |
| 20:00:53 | langhaarrocker | You don't need to parse the whole file - just the environment of the cue point. |
| 20:01:14 | linuxstb | That may work - but it seems very complicated. |
| 20:01:32 | linuxstb | And how much RAM will it need? |
| 20:02:03 | langhaarrocker | 132 bytes for the graph. |
| 20:02:30 | langhaarrocker | (screen width) When zooming the graph has to be rebuilt while playing. |
| 20:04:18 | linuxstb | OK - I think I understand what you mean. |
| 20:05:08 | linuxstb | I guess we are all waiting on write support - has anyone risked turning it on? |
| 20:05:18 | langhaarrocker | no :) |
| 20:05:37 | langhaarrocker | I have no backup media for the 20 GB in the recorder. :) |
| 20:06:09 | linuxstb | I am the same. However, this should change next week - my boss has bought two PCs with DVD recorders. |
| 20:06:35 | langhaarrocker | Nah. They don't fit into the jukebox. |
| 20:07:16 | Phantom | lol |
| 20:09:32 | | Join EnnaN [0] (bla@CC53164-B.GRONI1.GR.HOME.NL) |
| 20:09:51 | EnnaN | hello.. |
| 20:10:43 | Phantom | hi |
| 20:10:55 | langhaarrocker | linuxstb: Assuming you do the editor part with the scroll bar / mp3 frame number thing - It would be easy to define an inface to call the graphical with. And that would be my part to do. |
| 20:12:08 | linuxstb | I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet - I'm still trying to get the "read support" working first. |
| 20:12:27 | linuxstb | But I'm sure I'll do something on the editting part later. |
| 20:13:48 | langhaarrocker | I'm not going to start writing the editor tomorrow. |
| 20:13:48 | langhaarrocker | Even if I fail to do the graphical editor you wouldn't depend on me heavily. |
| 20:13:48 | langhaarrocker | Neither I would depend on you because the interface wouldn't comprise more than the file and position info in some way. That's info I could get somewhere else, too. |
| 20:13:51 | EnnaN | any1 can tell me what the standard .WPS is? its omething like "number/total number filename?" and 2nd line remaining/total time... |
| 20:14:18 | langhaarrocker | EnnaN: standard wps is no wps. |
| 20:15:04 | EnnaN | langhaarrocker: there's no file, but there should be *something*..because you see chars in the screen.. |
| 20:15:11 | EnnaN | :) |
| 20:15:26 | linuxstb | langhaarrocker: one problem is that I think that mpeg.c keeps track of milliseconds instead of frames. Currently, I'm only working in with times. |
| 20:16:30 | Phantom | just a simple question : what are other projet for rockbox (not recording support, smaller things) |
| 20:16:45 | langhaarrocker | I don't think it will be much difference wether we use time, frames, number of popcorns eaten. |
| 20:17:13 | EnnaN | popcorns eaten?? :) |
| 20:17:19 | linuxstb | You're probably right - but we do need frame-accurate editing. |
| 20:18:23 | langhaarrocker | yes. And we can use time to name the point as well. Although I agree that frame info might be the easier choice. |
| 20:21:45 | langhaarrocker | EnnaN: the default wps is something like |
| 20:21:45 | langhaarrocker | "%s%fp\n" |
| 20:21:45 | langhaarrocker | "%it\n" |
| 20:21:45 | langhaarrocker | "%id\n" |
| 20:21:45 | langhaarrocker | "%ia\n" |
| 20:21:46 | *** | Alert Mode level 1 |
| 20:21:46 | langhaarrocker | "%fb kbit %fv\n" |
| 20:21:48 | langhaarrocker | "Time: %pc / %pt\n" |
| 20:21:50 | langhaarrocker | "%pb\n" |
| 20:22:12 | Phantom | "%pm" ;-) |
| 20:22:12 | langhaarrocker | Taken from wps-display line647 |
| 20:23:27 | | Join Zagor [0] (bjst@as9-5-6.k.s.bonet.se) |
| 20:23:41 | langhaarrocker | yes. %pm is very suitable as last line because then you can toggle displaying the meter via status bar :) |
| 20:24:44 | EnnaN | langhaar: ok..i didn't catch a thing you just said...pm isn't in the custum_wps_format.html, nor do i know anything about a "meter".. |
| 20:25:17 | EnnaN | just send me towards a file if i'm asking for info that's writen down in some docs :) dont wanna be a bother.. |
| 20:25:45 | Phantom | pm is for Peak meter |
| 20:25:48 | langhaarrocker | EnnaN: don't worry. It's nothing official yet. I made a volume peak meter for the wps. That can be adressed with the %pm tag. |
| 20:26:04 | Phantom | the two level bar in the original archos firmware |
| 20:26:25 | EnnaN | nice.../me got player...still talking about peakmeters? |
| 20:26:32 | langhaarrocker | no |
| 20:26:43 | EnnaN | :| |
| 20:27:09 | langhaarrocker | Be happy: your batteries will last longer :) |
| 20:27:09 | linuxstb | Can anyone here answer questions about how mpeg.c works? |
| 20:27:26 | linuxstb | (don't worry - not the MAS parts!) |
| 20:27:30 | EnnaN | :) |
| 20:28:46 | linuxstb | I was wondering why Rockbox has room to buffer 16 ID3 tags |
| 20:29:05 | | Nick seb-away is now known as _seb_ (user@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
| 20:29:10 | linuxstb | I am implementing cuefile support and am worried this means I need to cache 16 cue files. |
| 20:29:14 | Zagor | linuxstb: because we can have many tracks in ram simultaneously |
| 20:29:47 | Phantom | the zagor is back |
| 20:30:08 | EnnaN | langhaar: another quick question: can or can i not have 2 lines scrolling (if i'm not using times that is)...the html clearly says no, but i read (i believe in the mail archive) dat one can... |
| 20:30:26 | langhaarrocker | If we can do that it is new. |
| 20:30:39 | linuxstb | Zagor - What will happen if we have more than 16 tracks in memory? |
| 20:30:46 | EnnaN | linuxstb: if cuefile is what i think it is, i'm bowing to you for working on that :) |
| 20:30:52 | Zagor | EnnaN: the current firmware does not support it, but we could do it |
| 20:31:09 | Zagor | linuxstb: i don't remember. I think we simply stop buffering after 16 tracks. |
| 20:31:28 | EnnaN | zagor: ? like, daily build cannot, but could be able to? |
| 20:31:46 | Zagor | EnnaN: it can be written. we haven't written it. |
| 20:31:47 | *** | Alert Mode OFF |
| 20:31:49 | Phantom | linuxstb talk to Zagor who talk to EnnaN who talk to linuxstb |
| 20:31:58 | Zagor | Phantom: :) |
| 20:32:06 | Phantom | that fun |
| 20:32:24 | EnnaN | :) |
| 20:32:24 | linuxstb | Zagor: A cuefile can contain up to 99 tracks, each with their own title, performer and index. I don't think I should buffer 16 cuefiles. |
| 20:33:21 | linuxstb | Zagor: would anyone object to reducing it from 16 to 4 tracks? Does anyone have lots of 400K mp3 files? |
| 20:33:32 | langhaarrocker | Zagor: might these 16 mp3 entries be abused for jump points within an mp3 file |
| 20:34:02 | linuxstb | langhaarrocker: that's a possiblity - but will complicate everything. |
| 20:34:23 | langhaarrocker | we don't want to complicate things. |
| 20:34:29 | Zagor | langhaarrocker: no |
| 20:34:46 | Zagor | cue files should be handled as playlists |
| 20:34:55 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 20:35:19 | langhaarrocker | can playlists specify jump points withim a mp3 file? |
| 20:35:23 | linuxstb | Zagor: A playlist can contain an mp3 that has a cuefile. Does that mean we need recursive playlists? |
| 20:36:03 | Zagor | linuxstb: no. we simply will not support cue files in playlists right now |
| 20:36:21 | Ctcp | Ignored 2 channel CTCP requests in 33 minutes and 0 seconds at the last flood |
| 20:36:21 | * | Phantom think there are things more important than use cue, recording and add some games for exemple... |
| 20:36:34 | Zagor | iterative development: start simple, add complex things later |
| 20:37:02 | langhaarrocker | about 80% of all posts start with Zagor: |
| 20:37:03 | langhaarrocker | The rest is by Zagor. |
| 20:37:31 | linuxstb | Zagor: How much RAM is reserved for playlists? |
| 20:37:39 | Zagor | linuxstb: 10000 entries |
| 20:37:46 | Zagor | i.e. 40000 bytes |
| 20:38:11 | EnnaN | langhaar: and a couple of q/a's towards you;) |
| 20:38:33 | linuxstb | Zagor: A general question - are directories handled the same as playlists? |
| 20:39:34 | Zagor | linuxstb: yes. they are treated as in-ram playlists. |
| 20:40:03 | Phantom | do I really need to use GDB ? |
| 20:40:47 | langhaarrocker | no |
| 20:40:55 | | Part langhaarrocker |
| 20:40:55 | Zagor | 561.63 MB .ajz files and 258.58 MB .mod files downloaded since aug 6! |
| 20:41:12 | | Join langhaarrocker [0] (~Philipp@B474a.pppool.de) |
| 20:41:15 | Zagor | Phantom: you can't, unless you do the serial port mod |
| 20:41:39 | * | langhaarrocker has a draned keybord |
| 20:41:54 | EnnaN | .. 56 or so kb a piece... |
| 20:42:13 | Zagor | 6388 .ajz files and 5414 .mod files |
| 20:42:27 | Phantom | cool, daly/cvs inclued ? |
| 20:42:27 | * | Zagor is looking at http://rockbox.haxx.se/statistics/ |
| 20:42:33 | Zagor | Phantom: yup |
| 20:42:48 | EnnaN | zagor: hmm.. i got 4728 mods... |
| 20:42:59 | linuxstb | Zagor: my current (first attempt) at cuefile support adds it at the "id3 level" - i.e. the mp3info function calls my new read_cuefile routine. |
| 20:43:25 | Zagor | EnnaN: are you looking at the whole of 2002 or just one month? |
| 20:43:43 | linuxstb | This makes it completely separate to playlists - i.e. allows playlists to contain mp3 files with cues. |
| 20:43:53 | EnnaN | zagor: i just did your 258.58*1024/56 :) |
| 20:44:08 | Phantom | are "Linus" everytimes such powerfull in computer using ??? |
| 20:44:11 | Zagor | linuxstb: just remember to keep firmware and apps separate. firmware code can never call app code. |
| 20:44:47 | linuxstb | Zagor: Why is the id3 code in "firmware" ? |
| 20:44:56 | EnnaN | phantom: i think, if i get a kid, ill call him linus just to be sure...:) |
| 20:45:34 | | Join edx|away [0] (~edx@pD9EA8DCA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:45:39 | Phantom | after, linus trosvald and is LINUX, Linus Nielsen Felt and Rockbox |
| 20:45:53 | | Nick edx|away is now known as edx (~edx@pD9EA8DCA.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:46:27 | EnnaN | phantom: i don't think the other popular linus (you know, from snoopy) is a comp. wizz.... |
| 20:46:59 | EnnaN | phanotm: on the other hand, he IS the intelectual of the gang... |
| 20:47:22 | Phantom | of the gang ... |
| 20:50:11 | Phantom | Question : who are in Credits ? What must I do to be in ? |
| 20:50:14 | Phantom | ;-) |
| 20:50:32 | Phantom | I've made 50% of the french translation... |
| 20:50:56 | Phantom | I ve test Peak Meter |
| 20:51:14 | Phantom | I ve tried new fonts... |
| 20:51:17 | Phantom | ;-))) |
| 20:51:33 | EnnaN | ? |
| 20:52:25 | langhaarrocker | I _did_ the Peak meter and still my name doesn't scroll over the lcd... |
| 20:52:53 | EnnaN | langhaarrocker: you should pick a shorter name? :) |
| 20:52:58 | Phantom | arf |
| 20:53:11 | langhaarrocker | :) |
| 20:53:37 | langhaarrocker | I want it to scroll all around the jukebox. I need a hardware mod for mounting three additional lcds. |
| 20:54:39 | EnnaN | langhaar: you should get 5 additional, and than play "snake" with your name in 3d all around the thing... |
| 20:54:46 | Zagor | linuxstb: it's in firmware because we considered the functionality integral to the device |
| 20:56:53 | linuxstb | Zagor: I think cuefiles are part of the "meta-info" about the mp3 file so should be linked with the id3 code. |
| 20:57:13 | linuxstb | In fact, cue file information can be stored in id3v2 tags - mp3cue for winamp does this. |
| 20:57:18 | Zagor | linuxstb: i disagree. cue files are a CD thing, not an mp3 thing. |
| 20:57:33 | Zagor | anything can be stored in id3v2 tags... :-) |
| 20:59:07 | langhaarrocker | eg glitches? |
| 20:59:41 | Phantom | I want to read Mini-Disc with AJR and play doom aswell |
| 21:00 |
| 21:01:42 | linuxstb | I'm going to post my patch (with cuefiles in the firmware) to the mailing list later tonight. Hopefully you can then suggest improvements. |
| 21:02:38 | Zagor | sounds good |
| 21:02:58 | linuxstb | On another subject - did you see my post about the duplicate "lang.o" in the apps Makefile? |
| 21:03:21 | Zagor | umm, not yet. still wading through my mail :-) |
| 21:03:44 | linuxstb | I couldn't compile the latest CVS (gcc 2.95.2 under Linux) before removing that from the Makefile. |
| 21:03:58 | Zagor | very strange |
| 21:04:04 | langhaarrocker | many languages don't compile. (deutsch & francais) |
| 21:04:04 | langhaarrocker | I posted patches |
| 21:04:31 | langhaarrocker | I think there are still some problems with cr/lf in *.lang files |
| 21:05:30 | linuxstb | Zagor: the OBJS variable contains lang.o twice. Was gcc right to complain? |
| 21:06:33 | Zagor | yes it was. i'm just puzzled why it added two there. |
| 21:07:01 | linuxstb | I'm assuming no-one else has complained. |
| 21:07:34 | Zagor | your patch assumes there is a lang.c in the target dir already |
| 21:08:54 | Zagor | a clean build has no lang.c |
| 21:09:30 | linuxstb | I tested it many times with a completely clean build directory. |
| 21:09:48 | linuxstb | Does it depend on the order things happen in the makefile? |
| 21:10:06 | linuxstb | I'm using an SMP machine by the way. |
| 21:10:34 | Zagor | but your not using make -j2, are you? |
| 21:11:02 | linuxstb | Not explicity - could my distribution (SuSE) be doing that for me somehow? |
| 21:11:09 | Zagor | i doubt it |
| 21:12:59 | langhaarrocker | apropos makefile: I think the dependencies could be improved. If the *.lang file is changed nothing gets rebuild. |
| 21:14:02 | linuxstb | I've just tried it again (brand new build directory) and get the same problem. I'll test some more now. |
| 21:14:08 | Zagor | langhaarrocker: it updates here |
| 21:14:34 | Zagor | linuxstb: which version of make are you running? |
| 21:15:06 | linuxstb | GNU Make version 3.79.1 |
| 21:15:58 | langhaarrocker | Zagor: stupid me. Mine does, too, when I edit the correct *.lang file. |
| 21:16:14 | Zagor | ok, same as here. how are you running your build? mkdir build; cd build; ../tools/configure; make ? |
| 21:16:19 | Zagor | langhaarrocker: hehe |
| 21:16:29 | linuxstb | Zagor: yes - exactly that. |
| 21:17:07 | Zagor | linuxstb: that's so strange. in that case, there *is* no lang.c in the target dir, so how can it get a double??? |
| 21:17:30 | linuxstb | Yes - there is a lang.c file in my build directory. |
| 21:18:01 | linuxstb | Sorry - and in "apps" |
| 21:18:32 | Zagor | there is no lang.c in apps. then you are not using cvs code. |
| 21:18:55 | linuxstb | I am using CVS - but something must have gone wrong. Problem solved. |
| 21:19:17 | linuxstb | I think I accidently ran "make" in the apps directory at one point. Time for a fresh checkout. |
| 21:19:33 | Zagor | that sounds like a possible reason |
| 21:21:54 | linuxstb | Yes - I've done a fresh checkout and everything is fine. |
| 21:22:04 | langhaarrocker | any news about t-shirt contests? |
| 21:26:32 | Zagor | linuxstb: good |
| 21:26:40 | Zagor | langhaarrocker: that's bagders domain :) |
| 21:29:02 | langhaarrocker | So he get's all the t-shirts? |
| 21:29:46 | Zagor | haha, yeah he'll never have to buy clothes again |
| 21:31:02 | langhaarrocker | My collegues keep telling me I was a freak. To you have F-shirts, too? |
| 21:31:36 | langhaarrocker | (two left hands) |
| 21:31:48 | Zagor | hehe |
| 21:33:22 | Phantom | question : how are you going to manage translation for those who don't compile there own .ajz, (for "normal" people) |
| 21:33:40 | langhaarrocker | that's not normal people :) |
| 21:34:47 | Phantom | are you going make daily build for each language ? |
| 21:35:11 | Zagor | we haven't decided |
| 21:35:41 | langhaarrocker | I think someone said something about a web interface so that you can configure the makefile with it and the build ist started interactively. |
| 21:36:55 | Phantom | that should be very cool ! |
| 21:38:32 | langhaarrocker | I want a waterproof laptop |
| 21:38:42 | * | langhaarrocker is about to enter the bath tub |
| 21:48:37 | | Quit Phantom () |
| 21:50:11 | | Quit langhaarrocker (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 21:53:31 | linuxstb | I'm just posting my first cuefile patch to the mailing list. I have to leave IRC now - but will probably return later. |
| 21:56:50 | | Join Silly_Fly [0] (~luk@212.199.219.19) |
| 21:59:45 | | Join xtac [0] (s@ool-18bb6a75.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 21:59:58 | | Quit edx (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:00 |
| 22:00:00 | xtac | Is it possible to have ogg support? |
| 22:00:28 | xtac | or is the chip in the archos,not capable of floating points |
| 22:01:03 | EnnaN | the faq says no i think... |
| 22:01:10 | Zagor | xtac: the chip is a 12MHz risc. it can't even decode mp3. |
| 22:01:39 | xtac | ah |
| 22:01:47 | | Join Miran [0] (~dani@collcott.demon.co.uk) |
| 22:01:58 | EnnaN | quote: So the grim reality is that Ogg will never be supported by the Archos Players and Recorders |
| 22:02:08 | xtac | yeah I just read that |
| 22:02:19 | xtac | Kinda sucks |
| 22:02:39 | EnnaN | whats ogg anyways? |
| 22:02:47 | xtac | www.vorbis.com |
| 22:03:18 | xtac | I should have purchased the recorder jukebox |
| 22:03:20 | xtac | darnit. |
| 22:05:43 | xtac | just wondering,which headphones do you guys like best with the archos |
| 22:05:55 | xtac | The ones that came with it,one side is dead,and their not too great anyhow |
| 22:06:10 | Zagor | i use Sony EX-70 |
| 22:07:07 | xtac | are they good? |
| 22:07:22 | Zagor | yup, they are very good |
| 22:07:35 | EnnaN | one side is dead?? |
| 22:08:02 | xtac | Yes,one of the headphones is dead |
| 22:08:07 | xtac | the left side |
| 22:08:14 | xtac | speaker or w/e you call them |
| 22:10:32 | EnnaN | ? mine is fine, but i use my sony MDR-CD250 |
| 22:11:05 | EnnaN | little old, but still good.. |
| 22:16:04 | Silly_Fly | I use sony MDR-Q33LP |
| 22:17:46 | EnnaN | that's a whole different thing than mine :) my h.phones are huge..(little to big for traveling, some say), but nothing (wind/people/trains) bothers you :) |
| 22:28:36 | | Quit Silly_Fly ("Connection reset by peer (כשאני ימצא את הפיר הזה אני יכסח לו את האמאמא)") |
| 22:34:56 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 22:35:51 | | Quit Zagor ("Client Exiting") |
| 22:42:14 | | Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-away (user@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
| 22:52:42 | | Quit Miran ("Its not that you do not see, it is mearly that your eyes do not perceive") |
| 23:00 |
| 23:03:58 | | Quit linuxstb ("using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.0") |
| 23:32:16 | | Quit EnnaN (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).