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05:27:58 | | Join zoof [0] (~zoof@user-0ccesee.cable.mindspring.com) |
05:28:03 | zoof | hi |
05:28:48 | | Join MrHali [0] (yomomma@HSE-Ottawa-ppp157250.sympatico.ca) |
05:28:55 | MrHali | hi hi |
05:29:12 | zoof | I just heard about rockbox |
05:29:24 | MrHali | what happened to it? |
05:29:33 | zoof | I got my archos jukebox recorder last wek |
05:29:58 | zoof | and My friend just told me that you guys exist |
05:30:07 | MrHali | rockbox rocks |
05:30:20 | zoof | I haven't installed it yet |
05:30:31 | zoof | I could use some pointers |
05:30:49 | MrHali | you use pc? |
05:31:01 | zoof | yes |
05:31:04 | zoof | win98 |
05:31:13 | MrHali | hook up the usb cable |
05:31:16 | zoof | ok |
05:31:28 | MrHali | and look for a file in the root of the archos |
05:31:46 | zoof | ok |
05:31:48 | MrHali | called ajbrec.ajz |
05:31:59 | zoof | i've seen that |
05:31:59 | MrHali | if you see it, rename it to something like archos.ajz |
05:32:15 | MrHali | so, you can optionally boot it if you want the original bios |
05:32:40 | MrHali | then just unzip that .zip file recursively to the root of the archos |
05:32:47 | MrHali | and reboot |
05:32:47 | zoof | that's it? |
05:32:48 | MrHali | that's it |
05:32:52 | zoof | wow |
05:33:06 | zoof | what does rockbox have better than the original |
05:33:16 | MrHali | if you ever want to remove rockbox, just delete the ajbrec.ajz file and the .rockbox dir |
05:33:27 | MrHali | and rename that archos.ajz back to ajbrec.ajz |
05:33:31 | zoof | how will it boot then? |
05:33:36 | zoof | oh |
05:33:47 | MrHali | it will boot even if that ajbrec.ajz isn't there |
05:34:00 | MrHali | but, it will be the firmware version, that's all |
05:34:32 | zoof | I didn't know that |
05:34:33 | MrHali | rockbox is still in development... but.. it's hellvucool |
05:34:52 | zoof | maybe when laptop HD's go down in price I will install a bigger one |
05:35:01 | MrHali | i just loaded it onto mine a month ago |
05:35:26 | MrHali | if you are willing to dare testing some of the daily builds, the newer ones support recording.. |
05:35:30 | MrHali | but it's highly experimental |
05:35:42 | MrHali | i.e. the latest one crashes my archos |
05:36:04 | zoof | so what do you do then? |
05:36:13 | MrHali | hard boot it |
05:36:29 | zoof | hard boot? |
05:36:39 | MrHali | press off, press on ;-) |
05:37:02 | zoof | but id doesn't crash every time does it? |
05:37:15 | MrHali | no.. it just crashes when trying to recorder |
05:37:18 | MrHali | er.. record |
05:37:45 | MrHali | the games they added to it are cool |
05:37:56 | zoof | hmmm... |
05:37:57 | MrHali | i'm getting alittle tired of play tetris though |
05:37:58 | MrHali | ;-) |
05:38:03 | zoof | I need to record often |
05:38:40 | MrHali | yah, they are *just* working out the bugs now |
05:38:53 | MrHali | it's working with mine on an older build |
05:39:39 | zoof | is the current download stable? |
05:39:52 | zoof | rockbox1.4 |
05:39:59 | MrHali | yah.. 1.4 is stable |
05:40:04 | zoof | ok |
05:40:06 | zoof | what about this thing I read about on the web site about an occational problem with the HD becomming passwrod protected? |
05:40:06 | MrHali | but, there's no recording support |
05:40:19 | MrHali | i don't know.. i didn't have that problem |
05:40:27 | | Nick _seb_ is now known as seb-sleep (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
05:40:33 | MrHali | i'm just a user like you.. not a develop |
05:40:36 | MrHali | er |
05:40:45 | zoof | no recording support? |
05:40:56 | zoof | I downloaded "rockbox-1.4-recorder.zip" |
05:41:16 | MrHali | yes, that is stable, but it doesn't have any recording support |
05:41:35 | zoof | so it can't record? |
05:41:38 | MrHali | they are working on recording now, if you dare to try one of the daily builds instead |
05:41:47 | zoof | hmmm |
05:41:52 | MrHali | but, as i said, the latest one crashes my archos |
05:42:05 | zoof | I think i'll wait until they get it right |
05:42:12 | zoof | I record often |
05:42:22 | * | MrHali feels like he's talking in circles |
05:42:29 | zoof | :) |
05:42:46 | * | MrHali gets spiral eyed ;-) |
05:42:47 | zoof | I record meetings with clients |
05:43:07 | MrHali | then use the archos firmware until they release 2.0 stable |
05:43:17 | zoof | that's a good Idea |
05:43:24 | zoof | wheb is it due? |
05:44:14 | MrHali | i think these people are donating their time for this project... i don't think there's any timeline |
05:44:29 | MrHali | *coughwhenit'sdonecough* |
05:44:39 | zoof | ok, makes sense |
05:45:06 | zoof | thanks alot, you've been a great help |
05:45:14 | MrHali | no prob |
05:45:17 | zoof | bye |
05:45:20 | MrHali | cyas |
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06:27:19 | itisi | can i randomly play all the songs on a jukebox recorder, or do i need to make a playlist in matchbox? |
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07:09:35 | NJoin | OoLio [0] (~coin@lyopc213.in2p3.fr) |
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09:53:22 | Schnueff | moin |
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10:17:18 | | Nick Zagort is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) |
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10:39:49 | | Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) |
10:40:27 | | Part Zagor |
10:40:41 | | Join Zagor_ [242] (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) |
10:40:45 | Zagor_ | wtf? |
10:40:50 | Bagder | bouncy day today? :-) |
10:40:59 | | Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) |
10:41:05 | Zagor | yeah |
10:43:14 | | Join LinusN [0] (~linus@labb.contactor.se) |
10:45:00 | LinusN | hey, regarding the "remember settings between versions" request |
10:45:36 | LinusN | when playing a WPS file, we can copy it to .rockbox/.current.wps |
10:45:47 | LinusN | and load that one at boot |
10:45:58 | Bagder | indeed |
10:46:08 | LinusN | same with fonts and even .cfg files |
10:46:49 | Zagor | ugh, why copy wps files? we remember them anyway. |
10:47:06 | LinusN | Zagor: you don't read the mailing list, do you? |
10:47:40 | Zagor | i do. but apparently I missed something. |
10:47:45 | Bagder | it would remove the requirement for users to browse the .rockbox dir |
10:48:24 | LinusN | and it would allow us to remember wps files between rockbox versions |
10:48:43 | LinusN | even when the setting disk block is incompatible |
10:49:40 | adi|sleep | well.. frankly.. i would rather see a cfg file that pointed to the defaults of the other files |
10:49:50 | adi|sleep | ie: defaults.cfg |
10:50:04 | adi|sleep | and have: wps=../blah/mine.wps |
10:50:16 | Bagder | true |
10:50:22 | adi|sleep | and font=../blah/MyLargeFont.blah |
10:50:23 | LinusN | it may be noce, but it is easier to copy files than to edit them |
10:50:27 | adi|sleep | to me that would be cleaner |
10:50:32 | adi|sleep | and if there is no settings.cfg |
10:50:37 | adi|sleep | then we load system defaults |
10:50:59 | adi|sleep | fine then we resort to the default dir idea that .rockbox was supposed to be |
10:51:17 | adi|sleep | any .cfg or .wps in the .rockbox dir is the default loaded |
10:51:27 | adi|sleep | and if you have multiple, well its the first in the dir listing |
10:51:36 | adi|sleep | anything in subdirs is ignored |
10:51:44 | adi|sleep | no .wps or .cfg, then we load system defaults |
10:51:55 | Zagor | i don't like copying. adis idea to create a default.cfg is better imho. |
10:52:11 | adi|sleep | im happy either way.. but we do need a better way |
10:52:18 | adi|sleep | we could do the settings.cfg to start |
10:52:25 | adi|sleep | and if ppl don't like it, try something elese |
10:52:38 | LinusN | the current way is only a temporary solution, since we couldn't write files until now |
10:52:43 | adi|sleep | nods |
10:52:52 | adi|sleep | congrats to you all for that work btw ;) |
10:53:13 | LinusN | Zagor deserves heaps of credit for that |
10:53:56 | LinusN | the file write work seems to work good now |
10:54:01 | LinusN | code |
10:54:09 | Zagor | that's good |
10:54:20 | LinusN | my english is bad in the morning |
10:55:18 | adi|sleep | thats okay.. my swedish is non-existant ;) |
10:55:22 | LinusN | OoLio: you there? |
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11:00 |
11:09:49 | Zagor | LinusN: did you ever dig up the info for turning off player disks? |
11:09:50 | | Quit pyvasene (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
11:14:20 | LinusN | didn't find the time, will do later today |
11:14:27 | Zagor | ok |
11:23:14 | LinusN | PB4 |
11:23:18 | Zagor | ok |
11:23:50 | LinusN | (i found it in my mailbox, didn't try it myself) |
11:29:18 | Zagor | is that connected to anything on the older players? |
11:36:48 | Bagder | "I'm very tempted to condem gcc 3.2 and 3.2.1 as unsuitable for kernel compilation." |
11:37:12 | Bagder | Russell King |
11:37:33 | Zagor | yikes |
11:42:19 | dwihno | Isn't 3.2 "stable"? |
11:42:57 | Bagder | it is |
11:43:13 | dwihno | So why is it unsuitable? |
11:43:25 | Bagder | they found another pretty serious bug |
11:43:50 | dwihno | off. |
11:43:52 | dwihno | how serious? |
11:43:57 | dwihno | [xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ] that serious? |
11:44:16 | Bagder | it saves the wrong number of registers on the stack |
11:44:24 | Bagder | in this specific case |
11:44:38 | Zagor | ouch |
11:46:05 | dwihno | is that a bad thing? |
11:46:07 | dwihno | ;-) |
11:46:37 | Bagder | "Kernel panic: Attempted to kill init!" |
11:46:38 | Bagder | ;-) |
11:46:49 | dwihno | ;) |
11:46:54 | * | dwihno got a new font |
11:47:01 | dwihno | Do you got nice fonts for X? |
11:47:09 | dwihno | I'd like some nice terminalistic fonts :) |
11:47:26 | Zagor | "fixed" is the only terminal font you'll ever need |
11:49:50 | datazone | oh my god! they killed init! you bastards! |
11:59:14 | dwihno | Zagor: fixed is not a futuristic font ;) |
12:00 |
12:01:03 | Zagor | haha |
12:01:20 | dwihno | Such as that nexus font |
12:01:20 | Zagor | dwihno: look at themes.org. plenty of futuristic stuff there. |
12:01:24 | dwihno | or the fonts of artwiz |
12:01:29 | dwihno | :D |
12:01:47 | dwihno | Zagor - I use old stuff - 'cause it works! |
12:01:48 | dwihno | :-) |
12:01:56 | dwihno | I got dual view working with my laptop |
12:02:04 | dwihno | DFP+TV |
12:02:52 | Zagor | nice |
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12:07:21 | dwihno | yeah |
12:07:42 | dwihno | But it reboots when I do something |
12:07:48 | dwihno | strange. |
12:07:57 | dwihno | I never have that problem when using DFP-only mode. |
12:08:02 | dwihno | I blame it on the boogie! |
12:12:35 | | Join quelsaruk [0] (~zaknafein@faerun.ugr.es) |
12:12:41 | quelsaruk | hi |
12:13:02 | Zagor | hi |
13:00 |
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13:54:22 | NJoin | kargatron [0] (~Vincent@ppp12-250.ath.forthnet.gr) |
13:55:05 | NJoin | mecraw12 [0] (~mecraw@12-252-136-249.client.attbi.com) |
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13:55:05 | NJoin | mbr [0] (~mb@stlx01.stz-softwaretechnik.de) |
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14:03:49 | | Nick Zagor_ is now known as Zagor (~bjst@labb.contactor.se) |
14:03:56 | Zagor | i love tunnels |
14:04:08 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
14:04:51 | kargatron | especially quantum ones - they're the coolest. |
14:31:03 | | Quit zak|out ("KVIrc 3.0.0-beta1 "Eve's Avatar"") |
14:40:32 | | Join TotMacher [0] (tot@p508D91C7.dip.t-dialin.net) |
14:47:39 | | Join pyvasene [0] (~pyvasene@62.4.7.201) |
14:50:55 | Zagor | any player owners here? |
14:51:33 | LinusN | i have one :-) |
14:51:56 | Zagor | you have two :-) do you have time to test my ata-power change? |
14:52:03 | LinusN | ok |
14:52:13 | LinusN | what do i have to do? |
14:52:35 | Zagor | i'll mail you a patch. apply it to player-old and player-new and see that it works |
14:53:06 | Zagor | uh, apply it to player and test on both models, i mean |
14:54:38 | Zagor | if you have the set-up to measure current, that would be nice too |
14:54:58 | dwihno | :-) |
14:55:03 | dwihno | :-) :-) :-) |
14:57:48 | Zagor | power-up takes a teeny bit more time, but the mpeg thread "lowest" value is still >128KB |
15:00 |
15:00:38 | dwihno | Zagor: I need more power! |
15:00:43 | dwihno | LinusN: Maximum warp! |
15:00:55 | dwihno | Mr Hadaka - shields up! |
15:01:27 | dwihno | Friday 13 december we will all get warped. |
15:01:31 | dwihno | Star trek NEMESIS |
15:01:31 | dwihno | :D |
15:01:33 | dwihno | YAY! |
15:01:50 | Zagor | :) |
15:03:52 | kargatron | as an ST fan, i look forward to NEMESIS, but keep my expectations sane (considering the track record of those in charge) - but the big money's on LOTR:TTT. |
15:25:15 | dwihno | kargatron: Klingon warship decloaking! Shields to the bridge! Modulate the pulsars! |
15:42:18 | OoLio | hello |
15:42:30 | OoLio | LinusN, do u receive the file ? |
15:43:53 | LinusN | yes i have, thanks a lot |
15:44:54 | OoLio | ok |
15:45:28 | Zagor | LinusN: did you try the atapower patch yet? |
15:50:35 | LinusN | no, not yet (busy day) |
16:00 |
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17:51:51 | | Join edx [0] (~edx@pD9EAA03E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
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18:10:19 | | Quit mecraw_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
18:40:41 | | Join Zagor [242] (bjst@as9-5-6.k.s.bonet.se) |
18:41:07 | Bagder | I'm off, see ya |
18:41:10 | | Quit Bagder ("http://daniel.haxx.se") |
18:43:04 | Zagor | LinusN: no go on the Neo work. he didn't want to pay. |
18:47:09 | LinusN | surprise! :-) |
18:47:41 | Zagor | not really. he seemed like "a Gerry" :-) |
18:48:21 | LinusN | haha |
19:00 |
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19:00:49 | | Quit edx (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
19:02:09 | | Quit nickr (Killed (NickServ (Ghost: nickr_!~panphage@e-64-35-146-236.empnet.net))) |
19:02:16 | | Nick nickr_ is now known as nickr (~panphage@e-64-35-146-236.empnet.net) |
19:03:50 | LinusN | Zagor: do we have ftell()? |
19:04:12 | Zagor | no |
19:05:10 | LinusN | so fseek(fd, 0, SEEK_CUR) then? |
19:06:15 | Zagor | yes |
20:00 |
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20:22:22 | | Quit pyvasene () |
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21:00 |
21:00:14 | [keno] | hey guys |
21:00:16 | [keno] | anyone up? |
21:00:40 | Zagor | yup |
21:04:08 | [keno] | I believe I found an undocumented bug (looked at the bugs list) |
21:04:17 | Zagor | ok? |
21:04:18 | [keno] | LinusN you alive? |
21:05:17 | [keno] | recorder was playing, paused, then I connected and used USB. When I disconnected, the paused "icon" still showed. when I hit play nothing happened |
21:05:31 | [keno] | when I hit "right", the next song played. |
21:06:36 | [keno] | I tried the exact same thing when the song was playing and not paused.. it did continue playing it when the unit "awoke" from USB, but like the previous case, the screen was blank until "right" (next song) was pressed. |
21:06:37 | Zagor | i think it is documented. maybe under a bad headline |
21:06:48 | kargatron | it's known behavior. |
21:07:14 | kargatron | [keno], after USB, you're stuck in browse mode - hit ON, press play, and it should play |
21:07:25 | kargatron | that's my experience. |
21:07:35 | [keno] | the song not continuing to play when "play" is pressed is not that much of an issue.. it's the blank screen that's an annoyance |
21:07:39 | kargatron | there might be a bug that the WPS doesn't show in that sich, dunno. |
21:07:43 | kargatron | right |
21:07:55 | kargatron | that's listed somewhere |
21:08:08 | [keno] | kargatron I did - screen was blank and song didn't play the first time (when it was paused) and did play the 2nd time (when it was playing before USB), but in both cases screen was blank. |
21:08:09 | kargatron | but it's non-fatal at least. :) |
21:08:16 | [keno] | yeah <G> |
21:08:29 | LinusN | i'm alive |
21:09:09 | [keno] | good (but mainly because there's no rockbox if you suddenly get dead :) |
21:09:20 | LinusN | the mpeg driver gets confused and thinks it is still playing |
21:09:36 | [keno] | and the blank screen? |
21:09:39 | LinusN | therefore the WPS is confused as well |
21:09:45 | [keno] | oh |
21:10:03 | LinusN | we should do mpeg_stop() when USb is inserted |
21:10:22 | kargatron | [keno], not sure you are aware of the non-linus core developers - LinusN is one, but not the only. :) [i am not one, just saying....] |
21:10:22 | [keno] | I found another one on the way home, but I forgot it before the PC booted ;) |
21:10:39 | LinusN | haha |
21:10:59 | [keno] | kargatron I acknowledge and respect all the other developers (even in awe of some :) |
21:11:16 | [keno] | but I've had a good run with linus so I try to stick with what werks |
21:11:31 | LinusN | hehe, he just meant that you don't have to look for only me |
21:12:23 | kargatron | i also meant that perhaps rockbox wouldn't necessarily die with you. |
21:12:23 | [keno] | hehe we should publush a "where's linus?" children book |
21:12:34 | kargatron | not that I'm proposing a test... |
21:12:56 | [keno] | well, not die, but development would definitely be held back quite a bit |
21:13:42 | [keno] | btw, can't there be an option for displaying hidden dirs? I copied a hidden dir and got scared cause I didnt find it while browsing with the archos. |
21:13:43 | | Nick seb-school is now known as _seb_ (trilluser@bgp420584bgs.union01.nj.comcast.net) |
21:14:43 | | Nick [keno] is now known as non-linus (~kenlarzo@80.178.32.34) |
21:14:46 | non-linus | heh |
21:15:12 | LinusN | non-linus: i thought we could display hidden dirs |
21:15:25 | LinusN | just select "all files" in the file filter |
21:16:02 | non-linus | hrrm. okay. my bad <G> |
21:16:13 | non-linus | was in "supported" |
21:16:38 | | Nick non-linus is now known as [keno] (~kenlarzo@80.178.32.34) |
21:16:48 | [keno] | wish I could remember the other issue I encountered on the way homew |
21:17:31 | LinusN | [keno]: a skip? |
21:17:39 | [keno] | I was way to distracted by the oscillograph :) |
21:18:06 | [keno] | had only one so far and I was walking very quickly (I keep it on my uniform belt with the provided case) |
21:19:00 | [keno] | btw is there a chance of keeping the backlight on when a "demo" is showing? it's kind of annoying to keep pressing a key to keep the backlight on for the oscillograph |
21:20:39 | [keno] | a skip.. −−> had only one so far and I was walking very quickly (I keep it on my uniform belt with the provided case) |
21:23:27 | [keno] | well, as for the blank screen on resume playing/paused song when returning from USB, should I submit it? |
21:25:22 | [keno] | OH. I remember the other issue now. not that much of a bug, but a MUST improvment |
21:26:22 | [keno] | not being a C programmer I can't be sure if it's possible technically, but according other implemented features it should be a breeze.. |
21:26:49 | * | [keno] is talking to himself |
21:27:57 | [keno] | got an mp3 here that just wont stop skipping. only happens with this one. |
21:29:12 | Zagor | excellent. please upload it somewhere (or dcc it to me) |
21:30:07 | [keno] | Zagor okay but lemme just make sure I defrag and try again first to make sure it's not that |
21:30:14 | Zagor | ok |
21:32:32 | [keno] | thing is this; when I want to move on to the next song and I hit "next", I can't hit next again to skip that song too until it starts playing. |
21:33:27 | Schnueff | this is because disk I/O hasnt finished then? |
21:33:28 | Zagor | yes, this is a bit annoying |
21:33:33 | Schnueff | k |
21:33:47 | [keno] | I figured that the next song's filename could display for say a ¼ second, and if I hit "next" again during that ¼ second the mpeg wouldnt even start decoding - it would just show the next filename instead |
21:33:56 | Zagor | it is due to the mpeg thread design. it will be redesigned Real Soon Now :-) |
21:34:36 | Zagor | [keno]: yes. currently it is not just a UI issue, however |
21:34:53 | [keno] | great.. but will it be that responsive to allow me to keep browsing forward ? |
21:35:23 | Zagor | hopefully |
21:35:24 | [keno] | oh. okay.. I thought that a small timeout before next mpeg starts decoding would solve this.. |
21:35:43 | Zagor | decoding is not the problem, reading is |
21:36:40 | [keno] | a small timeout before reading.. or is the reading of the next filename slows down processing enough by itself to prevent reading the filename after that? |
21:37:26 | Zagor | no, but adding a timeout will *always* slow down the start of next track, which isn't what we want either |
21:37:55 | Zagor | the redesign will fix so the reading is aborted immediately if you press next |
21:38:24 | [keno] | that would be better than a mandatory ¼ sec |
21:38:30 | Zagor | yes |
21:38:40 | [keno] | damnit wish I could help out this project |
21:38:51 | Zagor | why can't you? |
21:39:05 | [keno] | um.. no C experience whatsoever is a good start :) |
21:39:46 | Zagor | hehe |
21:40:20 | [keno] | but I gurantee that once you get the MAS to support ASP/VB - count me in!!! hehe |
21:40:28 | Zagor | lol |
21:40:42 | | Join Mine78 [0] (Pozzolo@host116-22.pool80116.interbusiness.it) |
21:41:17 | Mine78 | hai guy... any plan to a recording release ? |
21:41:26 | Zagor | yes |
21:41:37 | Mine78 | is it possible to know almost when ? |
21:41:42 | LinusN | Mine78: no |
21:41:44 | Mine78 | a month ? 2 ? |
21:41:53 | Mine78 | :P |
21:42:03 | Mine78 | I tried to search for MP3Pro info... |
21:42:03 | LinusN | When It's Done |
21:42:05 | Mine78 | nothing ! |
21:42:12 | LinusN | the MAS can't do mp3pro |
21:42:14 | [keno] | Zagor: must one know anything about embedded processing to contribute to the rockbox project? |
21:42:16 | Schnueff | heh |
21:42:22 | LinusN | [keno]: it helps |
21:42:48 | LinusN | [keno]: but there are lots of non-programming things to do |
21:42:51 | Mine78 | I dont' want mp3pro to be palyed, only to be correct-display the song lenght |
21:43:08 | Zagor | Mine78: mp3pro is a proprietary undocumented format |
21:43:10 | [keno] | LinusN such as? maybe I can do something |
21:43:15 | Zagor | we will be sued if we implement it |
21:43:26 | Mine78 | There must be a math function |
21:43:34 | Mine78 | yes yes, I dont' want MP3pro to be played |
21:43:48 | Mine78 | I would only that Archos read the song lenght correctly |
21:43:52 | LinusN | [keno]: documentation, testing, ... |
21:44:16 | Zagor | Mine78: find the necessary information, and I will personally add it to Rockbox |
21:44:30 | Mine78 | I am testing |
21:44:44 | [keno] | LinusN alright. good to know. if anything is needed I'd be happy to assist |
21:44:54 | Mine78 | I am trying to find a relation between the fake lenght and the real one |
21:45:13 | Zagor | Mine78: it's not that simple |
21:45:13 | Mine78 | almost to have an "aproximate" correct lenght |
21:45:25 | Mine78 | why zagor ? |
21:45:36 | Zagor | because compression is not linear |
21:46:04 | [keno] | is there a chance of an option to keep the backlight on when a "demo" is showing? it's kind of annoying to keep pressing a key to keep the backlight on for the oscillograph |
21:46:04 | Mine78 | Yes, but if you look 3 mins files are almost 25 mins-fake-lenght |
21:46:25 | [keno] | LinusN is any testing/documentation needed at the moment? |
21:46:27 | Mine78 | Maybe not te exact lenght... but near |
21:46:35 | Mine78 | 3 mins insted of 25 is enough ! |
21:46:36 | LinusN | [keno]: backlight on when demoing is a good idea |
21:46:41 | LinusN | and easy to do |
21:46:56 | Mine78 | Zagor a question: is there a way for rockbox to recognize a PRO file ? |
21:47:07 | LinusN | Mine78: yes it would be feasibke |
21:47:10 | LinusN | feasible |
21:47:16 | Zagor | Mine78: not until we get documentation that describes at least part of the format |
21:47:29 | Zagor | guessing is no fun |
21:47:32 | LinusN | Mine78: put an mp3pro file up so i can download it |
21:47:41 | Mine78 | ok I will put it on my site |
21:47:44 | Mine78 | one momente |
21:47:46 | Mine78 | moment |
21:48:04 | [keno] | LinusN should I submit it then or is it too small of a feature to mention? |
21:48:23 | LinusN | [keno]: submit it, it's so easy to forget |
21:49:01 | * | LinusN is working on the MP3 parsing |
21:49:11 | [keno] | LinusN right. what about the blank screen on resume played/paused song when returning from USB? |
21:49:31 | Mine78 | LinusN, will be a variable bitrate Pro good for you ? |
21:49:56 | LinusN | Mine78: to start with, yes |
21:50:10 | LinusN | but a CBR would be good too |
21:52:57 | [keno] | Zagor jeez I need a USB2 PCI adapter.. takess AGES to defrag with USB1.1 even with only 6GB/20GB in use |
21:53:52 | Zagor | indeed it does |
21:54:07 | Mine78 | Linus the file is up |
21:54:11 | Mine78 | did you received the link ? |
21:54:21 | LinusN | yup |
21:54:51 | LinusN | downloading... |
21:55:04 | Mine78 | Encoding Quality: Highest |
21:55:10 | Mine78 | VBR Quality: Highest |
21:55:17 | Mine78 | these are the only info I can give you |
21:55:27 | Mine78 | I did it with Nero MP3Pro plugin |
21:55:36 | LinusN | downloaded |
21:56:05 | Mine78 | do you need others ? |
21:56:22 | Mine78 | maybe some mp3pro done in a particular way ? |
21:56:26 | Mine78 | for example only silence |
21:56:29 | Mine78 | tell me |
21:57:51 | LinusN | Mine78: i'll get back to you |
21:58:00 | Mine78 | in which way ? |
21:58:40 | Mine78 | i removed it form the site... xoom doesn't like mp3, even zipped |
21:58:56 | LinusN | give me a minute |
21:59:00 | Mine78 | ok |
22:00 |
22:01:15 | | Quit Mine78 ("Shokowahhhhh dwahhhnowan!!") |
22:04:20 | | Join Mine78 [0] (Pozzolo@host116-22.pool80116.interbusiness.it) |
22:04:21 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
22:04:25 | Mine78 | here I am again |
22:04:35 | Mine78 | sorry linus but rockbox won't connect to usb |
22:04:38 | Mine78 | I had to reboot |
22:06:53 | | Join slazZ [0] (~slazz@b101172.adsl.hansenet.de) |
22:07:39 | LinusN | Mine78: the reason that the time is incorrect in the VBR mp3pro file is probably that it has no VBR header |
22:08:04 | Zagor | no mp3 vbr header anyway :-) |
22:08:47 | LinusN | no header at all as far as i can see |
22:08:52 | Zagor | ok |
22:09:08 | LinusN | no ID3, no XING, no VBRI, nothing |
22:09:54 | Mine78 | shoul I try to code in another way ? |
22:10:31 | Zagor | Mine78: di you see a song name or artist when you play that file? |
22:10:41 | Mine78 | Winamp told me (with mp3pro plugin) it's a 5:25 minutes song |
22:11:22 | Mine78 | no, only the mp3 name file + MP3PRO written after |
22:11:28 | Mine78 | in the scrolling bar of winamp |
22:11:37 | Zagor | ok |
22:12:07 | Mine78 | but I think even winamp show incorrect lenght...a notherone bites the dust is not 5:25 !!! |
22:12:56 | Mine78 | This is what I see: |
22:13:01 | Mine78 | 02 - Another One Bites The Dust.mp3 - MP3PRO (5:25) |
22:13:07 | Mine78 | scrolling |
22:16:21 | LinusN | Mine78: there is probably more to it |
22:16:29 | [keno] | Zagor forget about that skipping mp3 file |
22:16:35 | Zagor | ok |
22:16:38 | [keno] | Zagor winamp skipped too :) |
22:16:42 | Zagor | haha |
22:16:47 | [keno] | Zagor must be some lame encoder |
22:17:35 | Mine78 | I don't understand |
22:18:18 | LinusN | [keno]: there are lame encoders out there that doesn't set the CRC protection bit correctly |
22:18:38 | LinusN | or, the file may be corrupt |
22:18:38 | | Quit edx (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) |
22:19:45 | [keno] | LinusN yes.. had my fair share of bad encoders. now I use either lame or aaps (audioactive production studio), that is, if I don't encode to ogg :) |
22:20:09 | Mine78 | someone want the winamp plugin for mp3pro ? |
22:20:56 | LinusN | no need |
22:21:09 | Mine78 | ok |
22:21:14 | LinusN | Mine78: tell me, how long is the song, in seconds? |
22:21:24 | Mine78 | in the reality ? |
22:21:27 | LinusN | yes |
22:21:28 | Mine78 | i must check |
22:22:11 | Mine78 | some mins |
22:22:29 | Mine78 | wait |
22:25:37 | | Quit slazZ () |
22:26:00 | Mine78 | 3:38 |
22:26:27 | Mine78 | The winamp bar is still in the middle (almost) but the song end and it start with another song from the beginning |
22:26:48 | Mine78 | (many grammatical errors, sorry !) |
22:27:22 | Mine78 | if you want I can send you a complete album difference between what rockbox shows and what winamp says: |
22:27:27 | Mine78 | 015:19 - 23:09 |
22:27:28 | Mine78 | 025:39 - 20:57 |
22:27:28 | Mine78 | 039:19 - 38:59 |
22:27:28 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK Mine78 |
22:27:28 | Mine78 | 045:15 - 23:28 |
22:27:28 | Mine78 | 056:01 - 28:26 |
22:27:28 | *** | Alert Mode level 1 |
22:27:28 | Mine78 | 069:00 - 35:40 |
22:27:30 | Mine78 | 076:39 - 38:23 |
22:27:31 | Mine78 | 088:16 - 37:49 |
22:27:34 | Mine78 | 097:23 - 35:34 |
22:27:36 | Mine78 | 1010:17 - 40:16 |
22:27:38 | Mine78 | 115:44 - 26:26 |
22:27:40 | Mine78 | 126:43 - 30:04 |
22:27:41 | Mine78 | I don't know the REAL lenght |
22:27:47 | Mine78 | but i will check the net |
22:27:49 | Mine78 | one moment |
22:29:21 | Mine78 | the album is "El Vals Del Obrero" artist "Ska-p" |
22:29:30 | Mine78 | i cannot find the real lenght on the net |
22:32:33 | Mine78 | 015:19 - 23:09 real 2:43 |
22:32:41 | Mine78 | do you need something else ? |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 015:19 - 23:09 real 2:43 |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 025:39 - 20:57 real |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 039:19 - 38:59 real 4:40 |
22:34:33 | *** | Alert Mode level 2 |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 045:15 - 23:28 |
22:34:33 | *** | Alert Mode level 3 |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 056:01 - 28:26 |
22:34:33 | *** | Alert Mode level 4 |
22:34:33 | Mine78 | 069:00 - 35:40 |
22:34:35 | Mine78 | 076:39 - 38:23 |
22:34:38 | Mine78 | 088:16 - 37:49 real 4:27 |
22:34:40 | Mine78 | 097:23 - 35:34 |
22:34:41 | Mine78 | 1010:17 - 40:16 real 4:47 |
22:34:44 | Mine78 | 115:44 - 26:26 |
22:34:45 | Mine78 | 126:43 - 30:04 |
22:35:25 | Mine78 | Still someone there ? |
22:35:49 | Zagor | yup :) |
22:36:00 | Mine78 | Found something fun ? |
22:36:50 | Mine78 | there is a strange thing... if i manually scroll the bar near the end the song is still there... |
22:36:51 | LinusN | Mine78: my mp3 parser program says it's 3:37 long |
22:36:54 | Mine78 | maybe a bad winamp plugin |
22:37:26 | Mine78 | I checked it with my clock, maybe I did a 1 sec error |
22:37:34 | LinusN | my program == rockbox |
22:37:59 | Mine78 | one moment I upload it to rockbox |
22:38:21 | LinusN | Mine78: don't bother, it's not in the buld yet |
22:38:22 | LinusN | build |
22:38:44 | Mine78 | So it's an improvement |
22:38:46 | LinusN | Mine78: just curious, why MP3pro? |
22:39:19 | Mine78 | rockbox 1.4 says: 29:15 |
22:39:30 | Mine78 | well if it's ok it0's cool ! |
22:39:43 | LinusN | Mine78: let me explain |
22:39:47 | Mine78 | Ok |
22:39:58 | LinusN | rockbox thinks that it's a CBR file, since there is no VBR header |
22:40:15 | Mine78 | ok |
22:40:28 | LinusN | i have written a (soon to be included in rockbox) VBR header calculator |
22:40:37 | Mine78 | AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH |
22:40:50 | Mine78 | Will it take more time to play a song while calculating ? |
22:40:54 | LinusN | that program has no problem with your mp3pro file |
22:41:07 | LinusN | Mine78: it is supposed to add a header to the file |
22:41:22 | LinusN | not while playing |
22:41:26 | Mine78 | But it phisiccally add it (writing it in the file) or only in memory ? |
22:42:24 | LinusN | writing to the file |
22:42:30 | Mine78 | Automatically ? |
22:42:38 | Mine78 | The 1st time it's played ? |
22:42:47 | LinusN | that function is intended for the recording function in rockbox |
22:43:10 | LinusN | but i will implement it so people can run it on any file they want |
22:43:11 | Mine78 | COOL ! So I can say I had been useful to rockbox even if I am not good at programming at all ;-) |
22:43:34 | Mine78 | But if a header is already present ? It will be overwritten ? |
22:43:39 | LinusN | there is a program called VBRFix that can be downloaded from the net |
22:43:47 | LinusN | this is the same thing |
22:44:12 | LinusN | Mine78: it will not add a header to a file that already has one |
22:44:27 | Mine78 | so I have to "pass" all my mp3pro files through that VBRFix, right ? |
22:44:34 | LinusN | yup |
22:44:35 | *** | Alert Mode OFF |
22:44:40 | Mine78 | where can i find it ? |
22:44:45 | LinusN | just google it |
22:44:50 | Mine78 | ok |
22:44:54 | Mine78 | another thing: |
22:44:54 | LinusN | it's a Windows program |
22:45:00 | LinusN | i have never used it |
22:45:30 | Mine78 | sometimes, when (i will try it for you) i press the on button to exit a song while playing, when I re-enter the song the screen is blank |
22:45:34 | Mine78 | is it a known bug ? |
22:45:39 | LinusN | no it isn't |
22:46:08 | Mine78 | It happens when I exit the song and stay out many minutes |
22:46:25 | Mine78 | when I re-enter (a new song is playing) the screen show only the upper bar |
22:46:53 | LinusN | file a bug report |
22:47:26 | Mine78 | yes but I dont' know how to exactly reproduce it... if I will find out I will |
22:48:02 | LinusN | Mine78: please do |
22:48:21 | Mine78 | Now ? |
22:48:34 | Mine78 | even if i don't know how to reproduce ? |
22:48:50 | LinusN | wait until you can reproduce |
22:49:02 | Mine78 | ok I surely will ! |
22:49:15 | LinusN | that's how non-programmers can help |
22:49:29 | Mine78 | Ok |
22:49:33 | Mine78 | ah one last thing |
22:50:12 | Mine78 | sometimes, when the recorder is off and I connect the power supply, it charges for hoyrs (6-7-8 or more) but it still says CHARGING... is it normal ? |
22:50:34 | Mine78 | hoyrs=hours |
22:50:51 | LinusN | that may happen if the batteries are worn out |
22:51:15 | Mine78 | but they are new ! |
22:51:22 | LinusN | ok |
22:51:23 | Mine78 | only 2 weeks ! |
22:51:47 | LinusN | i think the archos firmware doesn't use negative-delta detection for the battery charging |
22:52:04 | LinusN | only reaching a certain voltage |
22:52:10 | Zagor | yeah maybe |
22:52:36 | Zagor | aren't they also using trickle all the time? i.e not full throttle. |
22:52:42 | Mine78 | VBRFIX WORKS !!!! |
22:52:47 | LinusN | and that they have fine-tuned their charging code for those green batteries |
22:53:11 | Mine78 | Works for rockbox but not for winamp... doesn0't matte r:) |
22:53:12 | LinusN | Zagor: probably |
22:54:01 | Mine78 | Thank you all ! |
22:54:12 | Mine78 | I will scan for bugs (if i find them) and report ! |
22:54:19 | LinusN | great! |
22:54:45 | Mine78 | I hope a new release with BMP/JPG " abilities ". Someone told me it is already ready but not prefect ! |
22:55:07 | Mine78 | The recording capability will be at 192 max ? as the original ? |
22:55:22 | LinusN | yes, we can't change the encoder |
22:55:34 | Mine78 | ah it's hardcoded ok ! |
22:55:41 | LinusN | yup |
22:55:46 | Mine78 | thank you again ! see you soon ! |
22:56:53 | Mine78 | OH ! Another thing (you will say "nooooooooo stop!!") |
22:57:02 | Mine78 | did you try to skip inside the mp3pro ? |
22:57:33 | Mine78 | with 1.4 it will go further with seconds (bad-displayed) |
22:57:40 | Mine78 | is it caused by that absent header ? |
22:57:58 | Mine78 | wrongly go further |
22:59:14 | LinusN | Mine78: exactly |
22:59:30 | LinusN | without VBR header it is impossible to seek within the file |
22:59:33 | Mine78 | So in the new version or with a good vbr it will be fixed |
22:59:38 | Mine78 | ok great ! |
22:59:56 | Mine78 | This time is ALL ! |
22:59:59 | Mine78 | BYE ! |
23:00 |
23:00:01 | | Quit Mine78 ("Shokowahhhhh dwahhhnowan!!") |
23:00:53 | [keno] | I can reproduce a similar bug to the one he mentioned |
23:02:37 | [keno] | GOT THIS FROM ARCHOS TECH SUPPORT JUST NOW |
23:02:39 | [keno] | 3) What are your thoughts about the independent firmwares released for archos jukeboxes? (see http://rockbox.haxx.se/ specifically) Any negative or perhaps positive critisism? Any warnings/suggestions? They did an amazing work functionality wise, and when they sort out the charging/recording issues it would be a killer firmware replacement. |
23:02:39 | [keno] | |
23:02:39 | [keno] | We don’t have comments on this, you’re free to try it with you own device. Be advice that doing so, may void the warranty. |
23:02:41 | [keno] | |
23:03:12 | [keno] | very lame of them. "no comment" crap. |
23:04:42 | [keno] | LinusN Zagor wake up |
23:05:25 | [keno] | this bit is interesting too. I don't even understand his answer |
23:05:25 | [keno] | 5) Why isn't my firmware (1.28) listed on the firmware history page? I am being told it is identical to 1.27d. If so, why the misleading labeling? |
23:05:26 | [keno] | 6) No, is not misleading. The version on your JB is newer. Though, it is the same as the version posted on our website. Only update when the posted firmware version is high in version number than what you have currently installed. |
23:06:04 | [keno] | "the version on your JB is newer" .. "it is the same as the version on our website" |
23:06:11 | [keno] | yeah. "is not misleading" alright |
23:06:38 | _seb_ | heh |
23:10:09 | LinusN | interesting |
23:10:30 | LinusN | their answer on the rockbox issue isn't very surprising |
23:10:42 | LinusN | more or less what they have to do |
23:11:02 | LinusN | they can't be negative, cause customers may dosagree with them |
23:11:33 | [keno] | I expected they would declare it satan and you the antichrist. |
23:11:38 | LinusN | they can't be positive, because they don't want to say that their own firmware sucks |
23:11:54 | LinusN | so they don't comment it at all |
23:12:39 | [keno] | it's a positive thing.. they could have said "We discourage blah blah it is a risk to use 3rd party blah blah from independent developers" |
23:13:04 | [keno] | instead they chose to not comment at all. |
23:13:05 | LinusN | they do mention voiding warranty |
23:13:22 | [keno] | yep, but I don't think they cover israel, so I don't have warranty anyways :) |
23:13:35 | LinusN | [keno]: israel? |
23:14:05 | [keno] | yeah |
23:14:21 | [keno] | or was it israhell? I can't tell <g> |
23:14:31 | LinusN | haha |
23:15:05 | [keno] | just too many bombs going off lately.. |
23:15:10 | [keno] | why are you surprised? |
23:16:00 | _seb_ | I've never seen someone from Israel in IRC before |
23:16:31 | [keno] | hey archos should change the answer to this one to "We are consulting linus 'bout this at the moment": 11. Can I get rid of the background noise when recording with I the built-in MIC? |
23:16:31 | [keno] | Unfortunately, the background noise is caused by the hard drive spinning. The built-in MIC is more for voice messages. For best results, a pre-amped stereo MIC is recommended. |
23:16:44 | [keno] | _seb_ really? I find that hard to believe.. |
23:16:54 | [keno] | _seb_ it's not a 3rd world country you know :) |
23:17:15 | LinusN | [keno]: the background noise is hard to get rid of |
23:17:29 | LinusN | [keno]: have you used the archos recording function? |
23:18:00 | [keno] | LinusN yes but rockbox (as of 24/11) recordings sound better than archos' 1.28's |
23:18:07 | [keno] | yes (mic only so far) |
23:18:33 | LinusN | i wonder, does the hard drive spin down with the archos fw? |
23:20:03 | [keno] | easy enough to check.. |
23:20:17 | [keno] | LinusN you're from sweden right? (most rockbox developers are I believe..) |
23:20:30 | LinusN | i am |
23:22:23 | | Join paulheu [0] (paulheu@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) |
23:22:32 | | Quit paulheu (Client Quit) |
23:23:22 | [keno] | I'm probably visiting sweden/holland/czech republic right after I discharge from the army. any must-see places? |
23:23:38 | | Nick paulheu|sleep is now known as paulheu (~Paupvdh@node1e8d4.a2000.nl) |
23:23:40 | [keno] | (sorry for the off-topic q) |
23:23:43 | LinusN | my place |
23:23:47 | LinusN | :-) |
23:24:35 | [keno] | heh.. the linus shrine |
23:25:04 | paulheu | The Amsterdam RedLicht district for sure.. ;) |
23:26:09 | paulheu | Not that it's a large place.. always fun when tourists are dissapointed it's such a small area.. |
23:28:40 | [keno] | I already visited amsterdam.. twice. and I just have to come back.. |
23:28:56 | [keno] | paulheu you from the netherlands? |
23:29:13 | [keno] | I miss de efteling :) |
23:30:29 | paulheu | yes.. Amsterdam the Netheralands.. City of Sin if you believe the Americans.. |
23:31:04 | [keno] | I don't think so at all. City of freedom and open minded government more like it |
23:31:37 | Ctcp | Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood |
23:31:37 | * | [keno] hasn't smoked pot in 2 years and seven months :( |
23:31:44 | paulheu | I go to the Efteling, one of the oldest entertainment parks in the world.., at least once a year.. always fun.. |
23:31:45 | [keno] | I miss dutch pot.. |
23:31:58 | [keno] | paulheu I loved it so much.. way better than eurodisney |
23:32:07 | paulheu | ;) .. we seem to have a huge menu here... |
23:32:17 | [keno] | though it may be the fact that I was friggin' stoned <g> |
23:32:40 | [keno] | I hear it's legal now in sweden (or was it switzerland?) and the UK too, right? |
23:33:07 | paulheu | Well ... our governement is soemwhat less openminded nowadays.. at least on paper ;) |
23:33:26 | [keno] | paulheu my favorite coffeeshop is "barney's breakfast bar". GOD what I wouldn't give to be there right now instead of serving the damn army. |
23:33:27 | paulheu | It's not legal! |
23:33:40 | [keno] | paulheu less openminded? why? |
23:34:11 | [keno] | paulheu and I thought the UK government has decriminalized it.. even opened a first coffeeshop and everyhing.. was in the news |
23:34:54 | paulheu | Softdrugs are condoned.. you are allowed to carry a small amount for personal use (I believe 3 gammes.. not sure) dealing is officially illegal.. but hey..prostitution was illegal for a long time too.. so who knows :0 |
23:36:10 | paulheu | Well on the openmindedness.. Our gov is currently under the influence of some heavy Americanism.. I have seen this closeby.. a bit to much to go into detail.. but the bully that is the USA is even gettig a grip here.. |
23:36:11 | [keno] | the world is beginning to get more realistic about this issue. it's all because of america (the brainwashing against cannabis) |
23:37:33 | paulheu | It is my opinion that the #1 threat to the world as we know it right now is still mr Bush.. the triggerhappy son of a frustrated former president |
23:37:35 | _seb_ | the usa has to stop being such a bully, and also stop trying to police sovereign nations |
23:37:42 | [keno] | to an exetent that they may affect the locals' life ? |
23:37:47 | paulheu | Amen to that _seb_ |
23:37:56 | _seb_ | (and I speak as a USian) |
23:38:22 | [keno] | good self awareness there seb |
23:38:33 | [keno] | (and please dont get me started about israel :) |
23:39:19 | _seb_ | heh |
23:39:35 | _seb_ | well I don't know what you think about israel, I have my own opinions there |
23:40:03 | paulheu | Keno: definately.. A friend of mine is currently in jail, and has been for almost a year, for something he has NOT done plain simpel because he is not clever enough to even come up with, facing extradition to the USA based on annonymous testimony by members of a US drugs gang. |
23:41:36 | [keno] | _seb_ what can one think about a country which is led by general after general? that right now is being led by a right wind fanatic (though much less than before)? |
23:42:27 | [keno] | a country that is also "beind held hostage" one too many times by religous zelouts who keep blackmailing the government? |
23:42:32 | _seb_ | true |
23:42:52 | [keno] | paulheu that's very bad! what is the charge? |
23:43:39 | paulheu | Well the whole issue is one that will be extremely hard to resolve.. I fear that trust is hard to find nowadays and not that I approve, but when you have nothing to put against tanks and well equipped soldiers I can imagine you get 'creative' ;( |
23:43:45 | [keno] | _seb_ I believe generals should lead armies and spiritual statesmen should lead nations. generals are too war mongering and set in their ways to rule nations. |
23:44:42 | [keno] | paulheu I agree to a certain extent. Civilians should never be targeted though, no matter what. |
23:45:46 | [keno] | paulheu a "hamas" group terrorist shot 2 jewish kids in their bedroom at POINT BLANK, *THROUGH* their mother who was trying to protect them. |
23:45:54 | paulheu | He is charged with being the dutch leader in teir XTC ring.. could face 20 years in a US prison. And believe me when I say that this guy has to be an EXTREMLY good actor to have done this, since he NEVER had any money.. and I often payed for his drinks of a cab home .. |
23:46:04 | [keno] | paulheu this took place within israel, not in one of the illegal settlements |
23:46:22 | [keno] | jesus! |
23:46:26 | [keno] | poor guy |
23:46:53 | [keno] | his story should be made public so that pressure could be put on dutch authorities.. |
23:47:17 | _seb_ | [keno]: although it does not happen as often, one must keep in mind that jewish extremists have made similar attacks |
23:47:19 | paulheu | Keno.. I agree with you.. and as I said I do NOT approve.. but I think the hugh problem now is that teh current generation on both sides grows up with hate built in.. and this is always a bad thing.. |
23:47:31 | _seb_ | paulheu: I totally agree |
23:48:36 | [keno] | _seb_ if my military unit would have been stationed near a settlement I would have personally made sure israeli extremists never lifted a finger against arabs, any arabs |
23:48:59 | [keno] | but the thing is - israeli extremists NEVER hurt arab children - not once. |
23:49:34 | _seb_ | of course, the israeli military has destroyed entire buildings, where innocent families live, in retaliation for suicide bombings |
23:49:43 | [keno] | the israely army has, but it has issued a formal apology and is paying money to the family of that child every month. |
23:50:17 | [keno] | _seb_ yes I know. It is the only intimidation that ever worked against suicide bombers. |
23:50:30 | _seb_ | I know, the fear of their families suffering |
23:50:32 | [keno] | I know soldiers who have abused arabs. |
23:50:49 | [keno] | I have personally reported two soldiers who have stolen from arab homes during curfews and such |
23:51:04 | paulheu | keno.. We do everything we can.. As he is a regular in the Amsterdam Music scene we have held concerts, been to TV shows,, Hell even did a huge public Jamsession in fron of the house of government here.. December 3rd we hope he will be alowed to leave jail, but I fear he will be shipped of to the USA.. The most f*cked up thing is the prosecutor in the US even told his lawyer'he was willing to 'rethink the extradition' if he could name some names of ot |
23:52:16 | [keno] | many israeli soldiers ENJOY hitting arabs and it's the most disgusting thing I ever heard of. the FIRST "commandment" any israeli soldier is taught is "weapon purity" (free translation) which means a soldier should never use his weapon or body for anything other than what he's been ordered too. |
23:53:05 | [keno] | paulheu but if he's ideed innocent and there are no others to tell on?? |
23:53:38 | _seb_ | [keno]: don't they understand that such actions only contribute to the Arab/Israeli hatred? |
23:54:03 | [keno] | _seb_ they are young and too blinded by hate. it's a cycle that's very hard to break. |
23:54:09 | _seb_ | paulheu: I hope your friend doesn't get sent to the USA, we have really bad drug laws here |
23:54:17 | [keno] | _seb_ whenever I speak against it among other soldiers I get teased, but some hear me. |
23:54:49 | [keno] | _seb_ then join DRC / NORML - they write congress and try to change drug laws in the states |
23:55:02 | paulheu | _keno_ That's the issue.. he is doomed from the get go.. no way he can 'assist' the US gov. Once there he either pleads guilt and gets a deal.. or goes to trial and faces 20 years.. you tell me that sounds like a fair deal.. |
23:55:25 | _seb_ | [keno]: yeah I know, but I'm young and really busy... once I am in college I'll get more involved |
23:56:12 | [keno] | paulheu but are dutch authorities one hundred precent sure that he's guilty? positive enough to extradite him??? |
23:56:39 | _seb_ | even if they have no clue about his case, the USA will bully them into extraditing him |
23:57:06 | [keno] | _seb_ rightous mr. bush.. yep. |
23:57:07 | paulheu | Tey do not HAVE to be sure.. if the US gov can make a case or even say they have a case he might be extradited |
23:57:42 | paulheu | It is really f*cked up and makes me mad writing about it! |
23:58:22 | [keno] | paulheu the americans have that much power over dutch gov. ??? jesus |
23:58:33 | paulheu | It is my belief the US systemof law if more that you are guilty unless proven innocent to be honest.. |
23:58:48 | _seb_ | paulheu: I definitely agree. especially if the trial is at all publicized |
23:58:55 | | Part kargatron |