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#rockbox log for 2003-11-27

00:01:08tracktheripperhi top
00:01:36tracktheripperwhos gonna try that, substitute the HD with CF cards
00:02:33tracktheripperlol just one feature request I saw
00:02:43tracktheripper"change the HD for several CF cards"
00:03:14top_blokewhy would anyone want that
00:03:32tracktherippersave battery power since theres no HDs to spin up
00:03:50top_blokeyeah but way less storage
00:04:10tracktheripperwell u can get 1Gb CF cards
00:04:16tracktheripperso if you could fit 20 in the case
00:04:20tracktheripperget 20Gb of storage
00:04:37top_blokewhich have 20 HDs to spin up
00:04:53top_blokeor u mean the flash ones
00:04:59tracktheripperCF cards are flash memory, not HDs
00:05:06top_blokei was thinking the microdrives
00:05:12tracktheripperno not microdrive
00:05:13top_blokemy bad
00:05:23top_blokestill a stupid idea
00:05:37tracktheripperno HDs to be shoked or use up battery power
00:05:46top_blokewell then do it
00:05:53top_blokeif u like it so much
00:05:58tracktheripper20 cards would cost a fortune to buy
00:06:11tracktherippera 1Gb card costs the same as a new MP3 player!
00:06:20top_blokewell then thats that
00:07:07tracktheripperget mikeholden to fix it
00:07:42mecrawwhat's inside the 20 gb rio karma?
00:07:44top_blokeu hate him right
00:07:45tracktheripperyou are better off storing all your MP£s in compressed .zip folders to save HD space and not lose soundquality
00:07:58top_blokea gb drive?
00:08:04top_blokea 20 gb drive
00:08:41mecrawthanks, but what kind, it's smaller than an ipod
00:09:09tracktheripperanyway Dump all your MP3s into .zip folders and save plenty of HD space
00:09:09top_blokei'm talking out my ass
00:09:13top_blokei was guessing
00:09:40top_blokenever having seen a karma
00:10:15top_bloketracktheripper i thought mp3s dont compress well
00:10:26tracktheripperthey do compress a bit
00:10:53top_blokewell then its only a little bit
00:11:18hardeepmecraw: i believe they have the same hard drive as ipod: 1.8"
00:11:19tracktheripperyea compress 2000 MP3s, gain 20Mb of HD space extra :)
00:11:45top_blokewell u still cant play them on the archos as it is
00:11:46hardeepwhat's messed up about the karma is that they apparently have their own proprietary filesystem, they don't use fat32
00:12:08tracktheripperwell topbloke you uncompress them first prior to playing
00:12:23top_blokewell rockbox cant do that now
00:12:35top_blokeor ever probably
00:15:07tracktheripperdoes mikeholden ever come in here?
00:15:25top_blokei dont know
00:15:30top_blokemaybe hes here right now
00:15:34tracktheripperhe really upset me once
00:15:43top_blokemaybe i'm him
00:15:47top_blokeyou never know
00:15:59tracktherippernah u aren't him
00:16:40top_blokewell someone else could be
00:16:53tracktherippermikeholden come out come out wherever u are
00:18:15top_blokeis he one of the coders?
00:18:44tracktherippertopbloke read tthis
00:19:28top_blokei cant right now
00:24:09 Join midknight2k3 [0] (
00:24:44midknight2k3hi track
00:24:46midknight2k3hey zagor
00:24:48tracktheripperhi mid
00:24:49midknight2k3hello toppy
00:25:00*midknight2k3 repeats, "hi track"
00:25:43midknight2k3zagor: will any more patches make it in?
00:25:56midknight2k3how about my chip8 icon? :D
00:26:02Zagormidknight2k3: we'll see
00:26:04midknight2k3you need icons for files
00:26:11midknight2k3you cant miss a chip8 icon
00:26:26pokerjokerhey folks
00:26:33midknight2k3and my screens patch is neat,, so is the keyboard makeover
00:26:37midknight2k3so many patches
00:26:40midknight2k3so little time
00:26:41midknight2k3hey pokerjoker
00:26:49tracktheripperhi poker
00:26:53pokerjokerhowsit going homeslice
00:27:30tracktherippermidknight is the man poker
00:27:38midknight2k3i think he knows that
00:27:48tracktheripperi know im doublechecking
00:28:01*midknight2k3 bares teeth
00:28:53tracktheripperHey Midknight there is a request where someone wants to replace the HD with CompactFlash cards
00:29:26midknight2k3i once had a simlar idea
00:29:33midknight2k3it involved using a media card for buffer
00:29:36tracktheripperexcept with IBM Microdrives
00:29:50midknight2k3put in a 64MB CF card and get, well, 64MB Buffer
00:30:35tracktheripperput in a 1Gb Microdrive and get 1Gb of buffer
00:30:53midknight2k3thats where it gets ugly
00:31:02midknight2k3spend all your battery loading the buffer
00:31:30top_blokedoesnt the ipod do that?
00:31:38top_blokehave a flash buffer
00:31:48tracktheripperIpod buffers 25 minutes in advacnce
00:31:55top_blokeis it flash?
00:32:09tracktheripperno its ram
00:32:25midknight2k3not a good way to think of it
00:32:27top_blokebig ram there
00:32:28tracktheripperok mid how would u fit a card reader in the Archos?
00:32:36midknight2k3so if i have a 320kbps it will do 25 mins?
00:32:43midknight2k3and if i have 32kbps it does 25?
00:32:52tracktheripperwelll thats how APple measure it
00:32:55tracktheripper25 minutes of music
00:33:03pokerjokerim encoding a shozload of CDs into VBR
00:33:12top_blokei dont buy that its regualr ram
00:33:48midknight2k3top: it is regular ram
00:33:53top_blokeprove me wrong
00:33:58midknight2k3they just do it the simple way and say 25 mins
00:34:07top_blokeits gotta be huge then
00:34:10midknight2k3i wasnt planning to put a card reader in the archos
00:34:17midknight2k3or so
00:34:24midknight2k332 actually
00:34:51top_blokehuge compared to archos
00:34:54pokerjokeris 8mb the biggest upgrade you can do on the archos RAM?
00:35:11midknight2k3but i dont think anyones tried 16mb
00:35:20tracktheripperbut mid u still need a way to unload and load the card inthe ARchos
00:35:20pokerjokerit would be nice to try 16mb i think. wouldnt it?
00:35:31midknight2k3this wasnt an archos idea
00:35:36midknight2k3it was just an mp3 player idea
00:35:41tracktheripperok ok mid
00:35:50midknight2k3track: uhm
00:36:02midknight2k3'ok ok' usually means calm down
00:36:05midknight2k3i wasnt worked up
00:36:10tracktheripperi never said u were
00:36:17midknight2k3 ok ok mid
00:36:27midknight2k3seems like you really wanted to stress the fact that you understood?
00:36:40tracktheripperand I still wanna kick mikeholden's arse
00:36:40midknight2k3unless it was a large accomplishment on your part
00:36:49midknight2k3"i actually understand something he says!"
00:37:02midknight2k3tracktheripper: why
00:37:17tracktheripper"You Really didn't think this through did you!"
00:37:31midknight2k3YOU GOT BACK AT HIM
00:37:32pokerjokerim encoding pet shop boys
00:37:35midknight2k3at that one post remember
00:38:00midknight2k3"i got back at him finally"
00:38:08midknight2k3at the doom bug report
00:38:16tracktheripperwhen i get my Nomad you lot will miss me
00:38:20pokerjokerhow old are you midknight
00:38:23midknight2k3finally realized you did nothing but get told off a lot?
00:38:27midknight2k3i won't!
00:38:36tracktheripperok mid if u say so
00:38:40midknight2k3you shoudl stalp talking about mikeholden
00:38:45midknight2k3getting a nomd?
00:39:14tracktheripperone of the zens
00:39:25midknight2k3for sure?
00:39:34tracktheripperprobably next year
00:40:24tracktheripperill just use the archos as a portable HD
00:41:15top_blokewhats the lowest bitrate archos can play?
00:41:19midknight2k3that means dont stick around
00:41:23midknight2k332kbps i think
00:41:39tracktheripperyea 32kbs
00:41:40top_blokethe we can store 0:06:15 of music
00:41:50midknight2k3it can go lower but its not been tested - i think 32kb is lowest possible bitrate for mp3s
00:42:06tracktheripperMid in Soundforge it can go as low as 5kbs
00:42:25midknight2k3sounds stupid
00:42:33top_blokeat 8kb/s it can actually store 25 minutes
00:42:34midknight2k3thats like, fuzz.
00:42:36tracktheripperwell it can mid
00:42:43midknight2k3but whod wanna
00:42:45tracktheripperits ok for streaming voice over a 14.4k modem
00:42:58midknight2k3you couldnt stream 5kbps audio over 14.4
00:43:07midknight2k3even if you could it would suck
00:43:46top_blokeat 5kb/s thats 40 minutes in buffer!
00:44:12top_blokeapple got owned!
00:44:29top_bloke24 minutes....weak
00:44:33top_blokeor 25
00:44:38midknight2k32mb ram vs 32mb
00:44:48top_blokeu sure its 32?
00:45:20top_blokeabsolutely sure?
00:45:33midknight2k3positively 99% yes
00:45:35top_blokei cant check right now
00:45:55midknight2k3track could but he wont
00:46:03top_blokethen at 128k/s it can hold 0:33:20
00:46:22midknight2k3they dont use all 32mb for buffer
00:46:27top_blokewell then
00:46:57top_bloke25 min only takes 24MB at 128k/s
00:47:12midknight2k324mb buffer
00:47:12top_blokei gotta stop with these calculations
00:47:39top_blokeok one more
00:47:43tracktherippergood link mid
00:47:46top_blokeat 8k/s thats a massive 6:40:00
00:49:15top_blokei cant stop!
00:49:46top_bloke20GB archos can hold 52 days 2:00:00 at 32k/s!
00:51:03tracktheripperyes but you would have poor sound quality
00:51:14top_blokeits ok for speech
00:51:26tracktheripperwho wants 52 days of speech?
00:52:28tracktheripperhi mid
00:52:35midknight2k3what now
00:52:38midknight2k3did you watch it
00:52:42tracktheripperyes I liked it
00:52:46tracktheripperabout the ipods battery life
00:52:51tracktheripperonly 18 months
00:53:12midknight2k35 hours per charge
00:53:17midknight2k318 months per unit
00:53:28midknight2k3thats .. faulty
00:53:43tracktherippermid its carefully crafted so when it wears out you buy another ipod
00:53:50top_blokewhat kinda battery is it?
00:54:09top_blokesame as fm then
00:54:15tracktheripperSony 650mah lithium polymer
00:54:23midknight2k3650mah? haa
00:54:35 Join diddystar5 [0] (
00:54:58tracktheripperthe battery is made by Sony, the HD is made by Toshiba
00:55:36tracktheripperthe MAS is probably another one of Micronas's
00:56:56tracktheripperso you could buy a MAS off the shelf and build ur own MP3 player around it?
00:57:27top_blokeit would suck though
00:58:01tracktheripperMidknight on the Ipod the battery is made by Sony, the HD Toshiba, the controls Texas Instruments and the other electronics Sharp
00:58:03midknight2k3there is someone who did such a thing
00:58:06midknight2k3pretty nice
00:58:15midknight2k3tracktheripper: fascinating
00:58:35tracktheripperthank you midknight
00:58:42tracktheripperim glad u found it fascinating
00:58:55midknight2k3i didnt.
00:59:22diddystar5i did see a make your own mp3player kit somewhere
00:59:36midknight2k3this is better
00:59:38diddystar5you could solder everything, or get it presoldered and put it togehter
00:59:47diddystar5ill see if i can find it
01:01:48 Quit mecraw ("Trillian (")
01:03:11hardeepa couple I know about: and
01:04:39diddystar5yeah the one i knew about was the pjrc
01:04:45midknight2k3i think thats it
01:04:47 Quit matsl (Remote closed the connection)
01:06:49 Quit diddystar5 ("Leaving")
01:07:33 Join diddystar5 [0] (
01:08:02 Quit AciD` ("Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95")
01:11:55 Quit tracktheripper ("IceChat IRC client - Download it at")
01:19:10***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:24:18 Quit diddystar5 ("Bye")
01:24:48 Join diddystar5 [0] (
01:34:10hardeepmidknight2k3: i think there is a small problem with your keyboard patch. !? and " are no longer available in any of the layouts
01:34:25 Quit diddystar5 ("Leaving")
01:34:29midknight2k3are they?
01:34:38midknight2k3oh btw inwindows they arent valid
01:34:43midknight2k3but hm
01:34:47hardeepfor filenames, sure
01:34:48midknight2k3feel free to add them if they are missing
01:34:53 Join diddystar5 [0] (
01:34:56midknight2k3what else for?
01:34:56hardeepbut we may want to extend this for writing into files and stuff
01:35:03hardeepand id3 info
01:35:07midknight2k3i will add them, or you cant
01:35:25hardeepgo for it, i was just quickly glancing through it
01:35:36midknight2k3i like it
01:36:06hardeepyeah, i like having upper and lower case on the same screen too
01:36:34midknight2k3did you try my f2 patch
01:37:15midknight2k3try it is good
01:38:09diddystar5hardeep: what about my changes to .rockbox browser patch?
01:38:26hardeepi haven't looked at those either
01:38:38diddystar5i need to do some updating
01:38:38midknight2k3and my chip8 icon!
01:38:41midknight2k3and my redzone!
01:38:44midknight2k3and this and that and this and that
01:38:55midknight2k3i should delete redzone
01:39:07 Join tracktheripper [0] (
01:39:09midknight2k3piece of junkiest patch if there ever was one
01:39:13diddystar5i need to remove some of the things (i think fonts and...) and im going to add seperater dirs for games, font etc
01:39:43midknight2k3tr == tracktheripper
01:39:52tracktheripperi know mid
01:40:20 Quit diddystar5 ("Bye")
01:40:28 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
01:53:58tracktheripperwho will win the codec war? MP3, WMA, AAC, ATRAC3?, OGG?
01:54:16zeogg's not a codec, it's a media container file format
01:54:17midknight2k3ask that on your mailing list junk
01:54:22midknight2k3ooh got told
01:54:23zevorbis is the codec
01:54:42tracktheripperok let me rephrase that
01:54:49midknight2k3a ha
01:54:54zeand they'll all lose in the end
01:55:04zelossy compression just sucks
01:55:06tracktheripperwho willl win the codec war, MP3, WMA, VORBIS, ATRAC3, AAC?
01:55:08zewe'll overcome the need for it eventually
01:55:20midknight2k3tracktheripper: mialing junk never got far?
01:55:28tracktherippermidknight u are picking on me yet again!
01:55:34midknight2k3just asking
01:55:41tracktheripperwell there was no need for the word junk
01:56:13midknight2k3tracktheripper: mialing THING never got far?
01:56:16midknight2k3back in a few mins
01:56:17tracktheripperone of them will win eventually
01:56:18tracktheripperok mid
01:56:20 Quit midknight2k3 ()
01:56:36zethey'll keep competing and new contenders will come along
01:56:51zeand then some breakthrough'll be made and we'll have tons of cheap storage and everybody'll forget about lossy compression
01:57:06tracktheripperi read somewhere the new formats will compress even further by "predicting what the waveform will do next"
01:57:10zecheap storage and cheap bandwidth
01:57:39zein fact there'll probably be some major technological breakthrough going on pretty soon
01:57:47zenot necessarily in the next few years, but within our lifetimes
01:58:06tracktheripperperhaps one day u could fit 20,000 CD quality songs on 1 floppy disk
01:58:50zespintronics, quantum computing, etc stuff's already developing
01:59:04zeand we'll keep figuring out new things to try
01:59:09tracktheripperlol a lot of companies tack "tronics" to make a name
01:59:14tracktheripperu could have zetronics
01:59:27zespintronics isn't anything do with any particular company
01:59:31tracktheripperzagortronics, linustronics, midknight2k3tronics,
02:00:03zespintronics is utilizing electron spin coherency
02:00:07tracktheripperoh ok
02:00:13tracktheripperstill a cool company for a HD
02:00:24zebasically the electrons all get their poles lined up the same
02:00:27tracktheripperoh ok
02:00:34zeand then you tilt one, and it tilts back and the tilt propagates in a wave down the line
02:00:47zeand that constitutes your energy transfer instead of moving the electrons between atoms
02:01:41zeelectronics is just the first big human technology
02:01:45zeit's certainly not the last
02:01:59tracktheripperim gonna set up a company called spintronics now
02:02:43zeeventually we'll reach a physical limit on information storage/retrieval/transmission density
02:02:54 Join midknight2k3 [0] (
02:03:02tracktheripperhi mid
02:03:22zeactually that kinda makes me wonder though
02:03:28tracktheripperwhats wrong mid?
02:03:32midknight2k3WHY do i keep getting this error
02:03:35zeif you can use compression algorithms to exceed that limit
02:03:37tracktheripperwhat error?
02:03:40midknight2k3../tools/scramble -fm /home/rockbox/newnewclock/build/rockbox.bin /home/rockbox/
02:03:40midknight2k3error: max firmware size is 200KB!
02:03:40DBUGSent KICK midknight2k3 to server
02:03:40midknight2k3make[1]: *** [/home/rockbox/newnewclock/build/ajbrec.ajz] Error 255
02:03:40midknight2k3make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/rockbox/newnewclock/apps'
02:03:40***Alert Mode level 1
02:03:40DBUGsent MODE #rockbox +b *!*hello@*
02:03:40midknight2k3make: *** [apps] Error 2
02:03:41Kick(#rockbox midknight2k3 :No flooding!) by logbot!
02:03:41***Alert Mode level 2
02:03:41Mode"#rockbox +b *!*hello@* " by logbot (
02:03:50zeor if ther'll be some way that it'll not work
02:04:24 Join midknight2k3 [0] (
02:04:30tracktheripperhi mid
02:04:34midknight2k3dumb ... uglybot
02:04:39zemidknight2k3: "error: max firmware size is 200KB!"
02:04:45zemidknight2k3: it's too big
02:04:50midknight2k3i know
02:04:54midknight2k3i didnt make it larger
02:05:00zewell who did
02:05:04midknight2k3one line of code cant make it go from 158kb to 200kb?
02:05:16zesure, depends on the line of code
02:05:22tracktheripperperhaps it does what the code something
02:05:26midknight2k3hows 19 characters sound
02:05:35zedoesn't matter how much code
02:05:38zeit matters what the code does
02:05:46*midknight2k3 fusses
02:06:10zelike malloc(43008);
02:06:10tracktheripperMid what did u think of a request I sent some time ago that may help u with ur >200kb code?
02:06:28midknight2k3oh a diff kind of plugins track?
02:06:59tracktheripperno it was "Multi-loading system to enable firmwares >200kb to load"
02:07:24zecan't you actually do that as it is?
02:07:25midknight2k3i know
02:07:31midknight2k3well SUCK
02:07:41zeuse ROLO to load >200kb fw?
02:08:01tracktheripperbut the Archos can only load up to 200kb
02:08:20midknight2k3i know
02:08:27zei thought the limit was in archos' firmware
02:08:29midknight2k3i dunno actually
02:08:36midknight2k3then why wont it build?! huh huh!?!!?
02:09:10midknight2k3well great
02:09:25midknight2k3it built before i made a new plugin
02:09:39 Join thedude02 [0] (
02:09:46tracktheripperhi thedude0
02:09:58midknight2k3any other ideas before i recheckout
02:10:10midknight2k3track: try "the<tab><enter>
02:10:21midknight2k3going once
02:10:24midknight2k3going twice
02:10:27midknight2k3rechecking out.
02:10:59tracktheripperthedude02 hi
02:11:14midknight2k3the then tab
02:11:17midknight2k3not t then tab
02:11:20midknight2k3or press t then tab twice
02:11:31tracktherippertop_bloke Hiya
02:11:36midknight2k3three times then
02:11:42tracktheripperpokerjoker hi
02:12:05tracktheripperit doesn't work
02:12:11midknight2k3it does
02:12:22midknight2k3it should say "thedude02"
02:12:40DBUGSent KICK tracktheripper to server
02:12:41Kick(#rockbox tracktheripper :No flooding!) by logbot!
02:13:08thedude02what is considered flooding
02:13:21midknight2k3three lines in a row quickly
02:13:36thedude02how quickly is quickly?
02:13:41 Join tracktheripper [0] (
02:13:42***Alert Mode OFF
02:13:50midknight2k3what you done
02:13:58tracktherippersorry flooded by accident
02:14:01thedude02that's what you get for saying useless stuff
02:14:02midknight2k3i noticed
02:14:17thedude02* tracktheripper was kicked by logbot (No flooding!)
02:14:18tracktheripperbe quiet thedude02
02:14:23midknight2k3ok i re-checked out
02:14:32midknight2k3now im gonna build before each update
02:14:36midknight2k3to see when it fumbles
02:14:45midknight2k3ill start right now without any hacking performed
02:14:50*thedude02 cowers in the corner holding my favorite stuffed animal tight
02:15:04thedude02dam I made that mistake again
02:15:05midknight2k3made dir, cd'd dir
02:15:07midknight2k3made makefile
02:15:13thedude02I need to talk in 3rd person
02:15:19thedude02now I'll shut uo
02:15:52midknight2k3then i insert my new plugincode, then move my clock over to the new dir
02:15:54midknight2k3ta da
02:16:18DBUGSent KICK thedude02 to server
02:16:18***Alert Mode level 1
02:16:18DBUGsent MODE #rockbox +b *!*Dude@*
02:16:18Kick(#rockbox thedude02 :Stop repeating yourself) by logbot!
02:16:18***Alert Mode level 2
02:16:19Mode"#rockbox +b *!*Dude@* " by logbot (
02:16:19 Join thedude02 [0] (
02:16:19***Alert Mode level 3
02:16:19DBUGSent KICK thedude02 to server
02:16:19Kick(#rockbox thedude02 :Go away, you're banned here!) by logbot!
02:16:19***Alert Mode level 4
02:16:59tracktheripperserves him right
02:17:03midknight2k3yes it does
02:17:04top_blokehey mid i once compiled rockbox and it filled up my whole hard drive
02:17:23midknight2k3you lier
02:18:10top_blokei was screwing around with the code and messed it up
02:18:22midknight2k3you lie
02:18:51top_blokei'm serious
02:19:50top_blokei think the rockbox.bin(?) was 140 MB
02:20:10top_blokeand it was trying to scramble it and ran out of space on my hd
02:20:27midknight2k3or directory
02:20:27DBUGSent KICK midknight2k3 to server
02:20:27Kick(#rockbox midknight2k3 :No flooding!) by logbot!
02:20:33top_blokeit was thrashing at it for a half hour
02:20:35 Join midknight2k3 [0] (
02:20:39midknight2k3stop him
02:20:41midknight2k3hes crazy
02:20:50tracktheripperhes banned the dude
02:20:58midknight2k3i cant make a bit of code public knowledge before he kciks me
02:20:59 Join thedude02 [0] (
02:20:59top_blokei like it!
02:21:06top_blokelogbot rules!
02:21:13top_blokepost it somewhere
02:21:29top_blokeinstead of flooding everyone
02:21:34top_blokein logbot i trust.
02:21:42midknight2k3i hate you
02:22:09midknight2k3we arent friends anymore if we ever were. so there.
02:22:15thedude02*and by some miraculous reason I ended that on an "a"
02:22:22tracktheripperwhats up mid?
02:22:22top_blokethats cold
02:22:31top_blokeu didnt have to go there
02:22:48midknight2k3it was cold and directed at you
02:22:53top_blokenah whatever youre so moody
02:22:58thedude02heheheheh (panting not laughing)
02:22:59midknight2k3you wanna see moody?
02:23:07top_blokeyoure moody as hell
02:23:11thedude02you don't want to see him moody
02:23:12*midknight2k3 slaps top_bloke around a bit with a large trout
02:23:15thedude02you're moody
02:23:24top_blokehes always moody
02:23:31thedude02but HE can become REALLY moody
02:23:38tracktheripperleave him top_bloke mid is alright
02:23:40midknight2k3my finger
02:23:58thedude02what happened to it?
02:23:59top_blokeultra moody
02:24:03thedude02which one?
02:24:12midknight2k3i hit it on the keyboard drawer
02:24:19tracktheripperi did that once
02:24:23top_blokeyeah thats right
02:24:29top_blokeyou deserve it
02:24:34thedude02I don't have my keyboard in a drawer
02:24:36midknight2k3i deserve it AHA
02:24:53top_blokekeyboard in a drawer
02:25:02thedude02I have it on a sliding shelf that has a tendency to slide in and knock my joystick partially off
02:25:03midknight2k3the keyboard tray thing
02:25:11midknight2k3SLIDING SHELF
02:25:15thedude02and it doesn't lock
02:25:15midknight2k3TYPICALLY CALLED DRAWER
02:25:29thedude02IT ISNT CALLED DRAWER
02:25:43*midknight2k3 smacks thedude02
02:25:53thedude02oh yeah, and about moody, you need to see ME.
02:25:57*thedude02 slaps midknight2k3 around a bit with a large trout
02:26:06midknight2k3ill say
02:26:07*thedude02 says midknight2k3 sucks
02:26:16thedude02because he does
02:26:20***Alert Mode OFF
02:26:37midknight2k3i hope you dont mean what i think you mean
02:26:42midknight2k3if you do mean that, you are wrong
02:26:51thedude02no, I don't mean you're ***
02:27:01tracktheripperwhy don't we all make up?
02:27:24thedude02I PMd mid that word so none of you would know
02:27:37thedude02anyways it consists of three letters
02:27:41midknight2k3g a y
02:27:45midknight2k3what a bad word
02:27:50midknight2k3exactly like the ipod
02:27:53thedude02I don't mean you're gay
02:27:59tracktheripperGood one mid
02:28:04thedude02IPod is cool
02:28:08top_blokeu are so childish
02:28:10tracktheripperno they aren't
02:28:13midknight2k3they suck
02:28:14midknight2k3large ones
02:28:16midknight2k3yes, THAT WAY
02:28:17tracktherippernot with their cruddy battery performance
02:28:47midknight2k3they totally just ... never mind
02:28:55midknight2k3i wonder if logbot kicks for vulgar
02:28:57thedude02the review of the Dell Digital Jukebox says it's about $100 cheaper than iPod and has twice the battery life and is even smaller than the iPod
02:29:07midknight2k3not possible, no
02:29:16midknight2k3dude: learn some stuff. ipods stink
02:29:18thedude02buy one and see
02:29:28midknight2k3i dont care for dell
02:29:31top_blokeipod is sleek
02:29:34thedude02Get an iPod and a DJ and compare
02:29:40thedude02DJ is sleeker
02:29:46top_blokedude! youre getting a dell!
02:30:00midknight2k3a dell jukebox
02:30:01thedude02you alreadsy have 6 MP3 players; another 2 won't make a difference
02:30:13midknight2k3they will stink up the house
02:30:15thedude02I have everything DELL
02:30:19midknight2k3i'd wipe the floow with the Pod
02:30:23thedude02but I'm not getting a DJ
02:30:38thedude02I don;t give a ruudy dam f*** for MP3 players.
02:30:50thedude02sory for swearing.
02:30:53midknight2k3ruudy dam f**?
02:30:59thedude02sorry for swearing.
02:31:01midknight2k3i'd never call that swearing
02:31:09thedude02nor would I
02:31:13thedude02but you never know
02:31:19midknight2k3logbot decides that
02:31:27thedude02thare are more than just us 2 people here
02:31:34thedude02there are 23 excluding logbot
02:31:45midknight2k3none of which come around
02:31:54thedude02only four
02:31:55top_blokewhat logbot dont count?
02:31:58midknight2k3i doubt any person in here has never seen f*** revealed
02:32:02top_blokelogbot is people too
02:32:04thedude02me you trackripper and topbloke
02:32:10midknight2k3lots others
02:32:13midknight2k3you just never around
02:32:17midknight2k3thank god.. talk trasher
02:32:21tracktheripperyea but they aren't speaking
02:32:25tracktheripperthe others in the list
02:32:38midknight2k3better not than saying bad stuff
02:33:08*thedude02 slaps everyone around a bit with a large trout
02:33:36*thedude02 slaps everyone around a lot with a huge spikefish
02:34:02midknight2k3we dont all play alex 4, sorry
02:34:26thedude02hey I only saw that relationship when you told me
02:34:47thedude02I just meant a spikefish has spikes so it'll spike verybody who I slap with it
02:36:22thedude02I'll be going
02:36:27 Quit thedude02 ()
02:39:31 Quit tracktheripper (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:54:47midknight2k3yp[+n;plr divld noh pmrd
02:54:57midknight2k3top_bloke sucks big ones ^^
02:55:56top_blokeu suck
02:56:12midknight2k3i divl!
02:56:50midknight2k3u suck! ^
02:59:52top_blokeghjtsho joirhstoitrh rstoirstoitrh
03:00:02top_blokemidknight2k3 sucks ^
03:00:18midknight2k3make no sense
03:00:48top_blokeis does to me
03:01:05midknight2k3im busy heereeeee
03:01:13top_blokeit does to me
03:01:33top_blokefine. thats fine.
03:05:58 Quit scott666 ("i'll be back...eventually...")
03:10:19 Join scott666 [0] (
03:11:05 Quit hardeep ("BitchX: the original point-and-click interface.")
03:11:28 Join diddystar5 [0] (
03:15:51midknight2k3hi scott
03:15:55midknight2k3scott scott scotty
03:17:09pokerjokeryou guys still here?
03:18:30pokerjokerhow does the picture viewer work onthe daily build?
03:18:44midknight2k3picture viewer
03:18:56pokerjokeryeah theres some kind of pic viewer
03:19:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:19:17midknight2k3since when
03:19:44midknight2k3and whats it view
03:21:15 Join Jon1 [0] (
03:21:48Jon1have a question about jukebox. is this the right place?
03:22:33midknight2k3what is it?
03:22:36Jon1i have rockbox v2 on my jukebox. how do i make the songs play sequentially
03:22:40Jon1and not alphabetically
03:22:47midknight2k3get a daily build fir one thing
03:23:26midknight2k3get a daily build
03:23:28midknight2k3much better
03:23:28 Join Guest [0] (
03:23:54Jon1ok. am doing it now
03:24:07midknight2k3lots of games :D
03:24:20midknight2k3tetris and snake and star and all that
03:24:52Jon1how do i install this build
03:25:28midknight2k3just unzip the file to the archos
03:25:31midknight2k3its a zip file right
03:25:38midknight2k3the top line for "recorder
03:26:26pokerjokerhey Jon1. im a bit green behind the ears too. Just put the Daily Build on my REcorder a couple days ago
03:26:43 Quit Guest (Client Quit)
03:27:01midknight2k3dont mind poker hes a bit odd
03:27:05midknight2k3:) j/k
03:27:07Jon1ok. thanks guys. i will put the build on the root directory?
03:27:33pokerjokermake sure theres a .rockbox directory in your root.
03:27:44Jon1yes there is one
03:27:51pokerjokerthe directions will tell you how to make one. just make sure the files go in the right place
03:28:56pokerjokeryou need that file in the root, and everythign else goes in .rockbox
03:30:03Jon1ok. am doing it now
03:30:36Jon1i think i did it the right way
03:30:52midknight2k3then turn of shuffle
03:31:01Jon1OK. hold on
03:31:06midknight2k3i believe that may fix your problem
03:31:18midknight2k3pokerjoker is added to the bluelist
03:31:33Jon1still rebooting
03:31:38midknight2k3oh btw
03:31:44midknight2k3if you flash it.. it boots quicker
03:32:02midknight2k3>3, <5 seconds
03:32:06Jon1Ok. just booted it
03:32:22midknight2k3takes a few seconds
03:32:45midknight2k3now turn shuffle off (press f2 - top middle button)
03:32:53midknight2k3then press the correct arrow key
03:32:56midknight2k3as indicated
03:33:12Jon1the shuffle is off
03:33:23midknight2k3it should play sequentially
03:33:34Jon1i tried playing a folder but the player still plays alphabetically
03:33:36midknight2k3unless i don't understand what you mean..
03:33:45midknight2k3nono wait
03:33:54midknight2k3you want it out of order?
03:34:00midknight2k3shuffle is like random mode
03:34:09Jon1let me explain
03:34:11midknight2k3what do you want it to do, and what is it doing
03:34:15midknight2k3yes please
03:34:38Jon1the songs have numbers in front of them, corresponding to the way they
03:34:45Jon1were supposed to play on the original cd
03:34:53Jon1I want them to play in that order
03:35:12Jon1However, the display and the order they are played follows an alphabetical order
03:35:18midknight2k3is it like "1 - xx" "2 - xx" ... "11 - xx" "12 - xx" ?
03:35:24midknight2k3and so on?
03:35:39Jon1let me see
03:36:03midknight2k3if that is correct you'll want it to be "01 - xx" ... "11 - xx" ...
03:36:13midknight2k3aka 0's before single digits
03:36:33Jon1The label is 1. All I want
03:36:41Jon1"1. All I want"
03:36:54Jon1That is how it was automatically encoded on the computer
03:37:08midknight2k3change single digits to 0x
03:37:14midknight2k3add a 0 behind then
03:37:20midknight2k3should solve your problems
03:37:37Jon1Thanks. Will test that. Can you hold on?
03:37:40midknight2k3as is they probably go 1, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 2, 20 etc
03:37:44midknight2k3i stick around all night
03:41:05Jon1thanks. here's what i did. I modified the files on my computer while the jukebox
03:41:15Jon1was connected. It did arrange the files to my liking
03:41:23Jon1and that did solve the problem. thanks
03:41:47Jon1I'm sorry but is there an automatic way for the songs to be played the normal sequence
03:42:10midknight2k3not really
03:42:15midknight2k3what do you use to encode
03:42:37Jon1tried windows media player as well as musicmatch
03:42:53Jon1they encoded them with the numbers 1..2...3..4
03:44:59midknight2k3i believe you can tell it what to do
03:45:05midknight2k3or use Super Tagging in MusicMatch
03:45:41midknight2k3try this
03:45:49Jon1supertagging. let me see
03:45:51midknight2k3go to .rockbox->rocks->snake.rock
03:45:54midknight2k3on the archos
03:46:02midknight2k3press play on snake.rock
03:46:07midknight2k3and give it a whirl
03:50:15pokerjokersnake doesnt have anything to do with mp3s
03:50:22midknight2k3back in ONE MINUTE
03:50:22midknight2k3its fun
03:50:22pokerjokerhey jon
03:50:30pokerjokeryou use windows to encode mp3s?
03:50:46diddystar5i do
03:50:46Jon1yes. i use windows. am still figuring the supertagging
03:50:48pokerjokerwindows media player?
03:50:49 Quit midknight2k3 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
03:51:02pokerjokersupertagging? is that like ID3 tags?
03:51:08diddystar5i recomend using exactaudiocopy
03:51:22pokerjokeri use audiograbber with the LAME encoder
03:51:57diddystar5and cdex is good also
03:52:09 Join midknight2k3 [0] (
03:52:31pokerjokeraudiograbbers good, isnt it?
03:52:34 Quit Jon1 ("Leaving")
03:52:46diddystar5im not sure haevnt used it
03:52:55midknight2k3i used it
03:52:57midknight2k3hey he left
03:53:21 Join Guest [0] (
03:53:29pokerjokerJon is that yu
03:53:39Guestim back
03:53:48pokerjokermidknight what do you use
03:54:11midknight2k3audiograbber sometimes
03:54:15midknight2k3used to
03:54:18midknight2k3i dont rip much anymore
03:54:47pokerjokeryeah i use v1.8 with the LAME 3.8 encoder
03:55:09pokerjokeri stopped ripping after i built up my 100 cd archive two years ago
03:55:12Guestthis is jon, got renamed to guest due to haste
03:55:17pokerjokerbut now... im encoding much more
03:55:32midknight2k318:52:35 | <midknight2k3> hey he left
03:55:32midknight2k318:52:59 | * Guest has joined #rockbox
03:55:38pokerjokereverything at super=hi rate
03:55:38midknight2k3i eat my words
04:05:28pokerjokerhey jon
04:05:38diddystar5goota go
04:05:40pokerjokeryou should encode with audiograbber
04:05:40diddystar5 bye
04:05:44pokerjokerbye diddy
04:06:04midknight2k3ill try clock
04:08:26 Quit diddystar5 ("Bye")
04:08:51Guestjust finished using the supertag feature of musicmatch
04:09:09Guestit works and automatically puts the number as part of the filename
04:09:37Guesti just hope i remember to do it next time i "rip a cd"
04:09:38midknight2k3like i said
04:09:45midknight2k3good luck
04:09:51Guestthanks man
04:09:57Guestgot to go
04:10:00pokerjokeryou could get mp3 studio. pretty good
04:10:10midknight2k3no problemo
04:10:20 Quit Guest ("Leaving")
04:10:29pokerjokerthey never listen
04:17:20 Quit top_bloke (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
04:30:15*midknight2k3 wants to cry
04:53:35pokerjokerhey midnkight
04:53:54pokerjokerhow important is it to ... uhm... do that VBR thing
04:54:07midknight2k3vbr thing?
04:54:10pokerjokeri think its "create a VBR header"
04:54:31midknight2k3oh.. on+play, update vbr file?
04:56:42pokerjokeryeah. see i just noticed something in Audiograbber, i think, that does that too...
04:57:03midknight2k3i dont think its that important
04:57:12midknight2k3only useful if your tracks show wrong info or something
04:57:41pokerjokeroh ok
04:59:33pokerjokerVBR header repair/add:
04:59:40pokerjokerunder mp3 tag studio
05:00:03midknight2k3same as on rockbox
05:00:13midknight2k3just do if it shows incorrect time or so
05:00:52pokerjokeroh ok. i see. thats cool.
05:01:45midknight2k3you might wanna check it just in case
05:02:05pokerjokermp3 tag studio has tht option - to fix teh tags. cool
05:02:36midknight2k3just check it
05:04:55midknight2k3jesus christ
05:17:19 Join Arnaud [0] (
05:18:09midknight2k3back in a few
05:19:14***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:01:10 Quit Arnaud (Remote closed the connection)
06:01:14 Quit scott666 ("i'll be back...eventually...")
06:04:16 Join Dogger [0] (
06:15:13midknight2k3hi poker
06:46:05 Join matsl [0] (
06:49:23midknight2k3hey matsl
06:55:28midknight2k3whatcha doing
07:10:50 Quit midknight2k3 ()
07:19:16***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
07:33:25 Join AciD` [0] (
08:29:03 Quit Dogger ("Client Exiting")
08:55:07pokerjokerno one home
09:13:37pokerjokerhows it going
09:13:54webmindquite good
09:17:14pokerjokerdoing alrite. where you from
09:19:19***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:19:46pokerjokernl ?
09:21:34pokerjokerwhts that mean
09:21:57pokerjokeri just encoded 1.83 gigs of Pet Shop Boys
09:24:53 Join Schnueff [0] (
09:31:25pokerjokeroh k. i think ive heard of that
09:31:36webmindyou've heard of it ???
09:31:40webmindyou think?
09:31:52webmindwhere's you from? us? :)
09:32:04pokerjokeryeah. isnt netherlands a state too?
09:32:50webmindalmost these days :)
09:34:37pokerjokerim just joking with you
09:34:43webmindi know
09:35:05webmindbut your close.. current gov is sucking bushes arse
09:35:09pokerjokerhave you upgraded archos hardware before. like, added more RAM ?
09:35:23webmindneh.. i only upgraded my hd
09:35:31pokerjokerdon't worry about your government... its not like they are representing you.
09:35:50pokerjokerno one i know (well maybe one or two people) actually agrees with bush
09:36:04webmindwell.. that's the idea with democracy.. they do
09:36:07webmindjust not me
09:36:20pokerjokernot many people here like george bush
09:36:31pokerjokerthe ones who do are too stupid and lazy to vote
09:36:37webmindis good.. but he still got elected
09:36:56pokerjokerso basically, he just seized control of our country... like a terrorist seizes control of a plane. how, ironic.
09:37:20webmindyou call that a dictator
09:37:24pokerjokeranyway. what kind of HD did you get?
09:37:35webmind40gb one
09:37:40pokerjokeryeah i think bush is a tyrant. people dont realize how fucked up it is
09:37:50pokerjokerIve been looking at 40GB too
09:37:56webmindhe's a christian fundamentalist aswell
09:38:09webmindand those are just as bad as any other
09:38:12webmindjust bigger
09:39:15pokerjokermy grandma is a bit of a fundamentalist. but shes not an idiot like bush is. she knows Iraq was stupid
09:39:37pokerjokerkinda surprised me, that she would be so wise. she is from the WW2 generation.
09:40:06webmindany kid could've known that what they did too iraq and how they did it was stupid
09:40:10pokerjokerthe whole situation frustrates me. but i think it will make people more political now. everyone is going to vote next election
09:40:19webmindhell i know a 10 year old that knew
09:40:36pokerjokeryeah, try telling that to a fundamentalist Marine.
09:40:48pokerjokerits easier to be ignorant
09:41:01pokerjokermilitary people are fucked
09:41:06webmindwell it makes you think.. there are 10 year old kids smarter then the peopl ruling of a country
09:41:14pokerjoker...and they are self righteous
09:41:34pokerjokerim not sure i would say smart. its just a matter of pride
09:41:46pokerjokerand vanity
09:42:11pokerjokeryou have to be really vain to think that by destabilizing a country, that you can make peoples lives better
09:42:29pokerjokerbut i dont think that bush really believes that. i think rumsfeld and powell are evil men.
09:42:48pokerjokerever since 1996 i have disliked powell. i think he is yellow, and i think he is a coward.
09:43:11pokerjokerin 1996 both parties wanted him to run for president
09:43:37pokerjokeroh well. its a mess. like i said, i studied history in college. and situations like Vietnam are understandable, to me.
09:43:57pokerjokerbut Iraq, ...Iraq was a scam
09:44:26webmindit's egoism
09:44:40pokerjokeryou ask any professor at a university here and he will tell you bush is wrong.
09:44:44webmindand plain stupid
09:45:08webmindthey didn't even have a plan for after the war
09:45:14pokerjokerwebmind, the goals of people like bush is not to "stabilize" the world, but to fuck it up and make some money
09:45:17webmindyeah we won!.. now what?
09:45:28dwihnostable! stable as hell! :D
09:45:56pokerjokerthe plan after messing iraq is to get your hands in the rebuilding. they have a monopoly on contracts, they wouldnt even share with Britain after Blair put his ass on the line
09:45:59webmindhell would be correct :)
09:46:02webmindmorning dwihno
09:46:04 Quit AciD` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:46:22webmindpokerjoker, basicly.. put there where no detailed plans
09:46:29pokerjokerAfter the gulf war, there were several politicians who had contracts on commodities and other things, made billions of dollars.
09:46:46pokerjokerwebmind, they didnt care about plans. that wasnt the objective.
09:46:49dwihnomorning webmind
09:47:08webmindawell.. it was/is stupid..
09:47:14pokerjokerthe objective, was money and power. it makes me sick. i wish Jimmy Carter were president
09:47:26webmindwho's that ?
09:47:34pokerjokerif Carter told me to join the army and fight for him, i would. and im a passifist
09:47:35 Join oxygen77 [0] (
09:47:37webmindi'd wish people would think for them selves
09:47:45pokerjokerCarter was a president we had in the 1970s
09:47:52webmindpokerjoker, uhm that's bad
09:47:56pokerjokerhe is very cool
09:48:04webmindno person should go above your own principles ?
09:48:07pokerjokerhe is a humble guy, very very smart, and a humanitarian
09:48:28pokerjokerfor carter i would. he is a generous man. he failed to be reelected though...
09:48:30webmindyou had a smart person and a humanitarian as president ??
09:48:57pokerjokerbecause he lost to Reagan. He lost because he had plans and argued on issues for envirmental and energy control
09:49:12pokerjokerand all reagan said was "im for democracy and freedom" ... that was bullshit
09:49:38pokerjokerCarter was a great guy, no shit ... he still does stuff. won a nobel not too long ago
09:49:45webmindthat's why i wouldn't join the army.. i'd never fight for a country like that..
09:49:57pokerjokerhe started a program to help homeless people. does bush care about homeless? nope.
09:50:03webmindwell unless loss would be worse.. but i'd prolly not fight within the army
09:50:12webminddon't like to be cannon fodder
09:50:21pokerjokerme either
09:50:28pokerjokerreagan was an asshole
09:50:39pokerjokerbush senior was cocky
09:50:40webmindwasn't he an actor aswell ?
09:50:55pokerjokerclinton was "ok" i guess. and bush junior is a poophead.
09:51:17pokerjokerreagan was an actor. acted with the Duke, which is his only redeamable quality
09:51:59webmindclinton wasnt much better
09:52:04webmindjust a little less worse
09:52:53webmindproblem stays the same though.. a country isnt it's president.. people should just think
09:55:34pokerjokerwell, its a conundrum
09:55:55zeit's no big deal
09:56:18zecheck out the top post (or 2) on for another perspective
09:57:18webmindpokerjoker, not really.. it all lies within people
09:57:28dwihnoDitt namn är Jan Banan!
09:58:09pokerjokerwhat does
09:58:18pokerjokerpeople are powerless
09:58:23webmindno they are not
09:58:26pokerjokerwe are bred to be stupid and greedy
09:58:31zepeople have way more power than they realize
09:58:41webmindpokerjoker, doesnt mean you have to follow
09:58:45zeeven a single individual has more power than most people know
09:58:50webmindpeople have the ability to choose
09:58:54webmindthey just don't
09:59:05pokerjokerdo you think that we are evolving, like animals? no, we are being domesticated like dogs. The strong are removed.
09:59:35webmindactually there is some evolution within humans.. but this i consider a completely different subject
09:59:48webmindpeople just don't do a fuck
09:59:52zethats something that's lost on the bulk of the population though... the fact that most of the major changes in the human world have been set in motion by individuals
09:59:57webmindbecause they think they are happy
10:00:00webmindso all is well
10:00:01pokerjokerI believe we are devolving
10:00:13zepokerjoker: lots of people on this planet
10:00:29zeone can't really say anything about all of them
10:00:35webmindpokerjoker, we are not one.. some people do, some people don't
10:00:38pokerjokerwebmind, people dont do anything - but that doesnt mean that they consider their life fortunate
10:00:44zemaybe the masses are devolving
10:00:44webmindsome people do
10:00:55zebut there's still evolution going on
10:01:02pokerjokerhave you ever lived in the states webmind? its a lot different here
10:01:15webmindpokerjoker, then they think there actions are meaningless
10:01:21pokerjokerze, if theres evolution, its for about 5% of the population or so
10:01:26zepokerjoker: sure
10:01:32zepokerjoker: but thats enough
10:01:32webmindpokerjoker, the US aren't the world.. you people should learn that
10:01:37webmindlot's f other countries
10:01:57pokerjokeri know people who work 80 hours a week. 80 hours. and do they think they have control of their lives?
10:02:08webmindhmm. i work 24 hours a week :)
10:02:12zei don't work
10:02:14pokerjokernever said we were the world. dont misinterpret what i am saying
10:02:25webmindpokerjoker, you implied it..
10:02:40webmindpokerjoker, but even if you work 80 hours a week.. there is atleast some things you can do
10:02:59webmindpardon my broken english today
10:03:00pokerjokernever implied it at all. im just saying its different here. its not like most people think. Its not "seinfeld" or an episode of "friends"
10:03:13webmindheh.. ofcoz not
10:03:14zehaha those shows are so dumb
10:03:35zethose are like the 2 most perfect examples i know of, of how inane and assinine popular television is
10:03:40 Quit oxygen77 ()
10:03:42pokerjokerwebmind, you should know - if you studied the classics - its easier for people to be disenfranchised and led, and to create profit for the upper class
10:03:48webmindeveryone knows it's like oprah.. ;)
10:04:09webmindpokerjoker, ofcourse it's easier..
10:04:09pokerjokerhas technology freed us from work? no.
10:04:16zenot yet
10:04:26zebut corporations and idiots keep holding it back
10:04:33webmindpokerjoker, but if people would think they wouldn't be fooled so stupidly
10:04:38webmindpeople just don't know
10:04:41webmindthat's step 1
10:04:57pokerjokerpeople arent taught to think. the US is what i know best, and i know how peopel live here.
10:05:05pokerjokerits a very stressful, competitive place.
10:05:22webmindpokerjoker, doesnt mean thay shouldn't
10:05:26zeit's true, they're not taught to think
10:05:28zethey're taught to repeat the tasks given to them
10:05:33webmind"you can escape your programming"
10:05:39webmindjust takes effort
10:06:00pokerjokerpeople cannot enlighten themselves. its the responsibility of the enlightened to show others. but education isnt disseminated thru our culture here.
10:06:20pokerjokerits all greed, hedonism, self preservation, egotistical and vanity
10:07:01pokerjokerwell, lets suppose for a moment that i am "enlightened" (for lack of a better word)
10:07:23webmindyou can enlighten yourself. if you want
10:07:31 Join oxygen77 [0] (
10:07:33pokerjokerthen why are others not aware of their environment? because they have been bred to be weak, and led, domesticated
10:07:36webmindjust not very easy
10:07:43webmindsome people are
10:07:47pokerjokerbut some peopel choose not to. why?
10:07:47zewebmind: the problem is they don't have anything to spark it
10:08:08webmindze, true..
10:08:13webmindze, and help does help a lot
10:08:28zepersonally, i only took what i wanted from public education and rejected a large deal
10:08:31webmindbut it's not like they can't
10:08:32pokerjokerwhy would someone rather suffer their entire life, hauling lumber on their back instead of getting a nice job with insurance and holidays
10:08:39zenot rejected education but the methods mostly
10:08:45zeall that rote memorization and repetitive tasks
10:08:54zei got through school on test scores hehe
10:09:02pokerjokeri believe its difficult to succeed here
10:09:09webmindpokerjoker, because they find hauling lumber satisfying ?
10:09:23webmindpokerjoker, there are acually loads of valid reasons
10:09:29pokerjokerand only a few can. the rest, suck ass their entire lives. they live in the repetitive cycles of crime and poverty, and poor health
10:09:32zepokerjoker: the perception that it's difficult is the problem
10:09:39zepokerjoker: that's part of what's being taught
10:09:45zepokerjoker: and it's what actually makes it difficult
10:10:12pokerjokerwebmind, a more valid reason is this: its easier for people like Bush to say " i like freedom and liberty, now lets work" then it is for Bush to actually promote education
10:10:16zesuccess is just a matter of keeping trying
10:10:18webmindpeople shouldjust take a look and think on what people are saying
10:10:27webmindand i'm not promesing better jobs..
10:10:34pokerjokerits easier for the rich to keep the stupid stupider
10:10:34webmindthat's populistic bullsjit
10:10:53webmindtrue.. but ain't everything
10:11:27pokerjokerthe solution to 9-11 was this : better diplomatic and foriegn relations.
10:12:02pokerjokerANYONE with any sense and critical thinking knows to address the problem, and not react to it. but, the goals for politicians isnt to SOLVE problems
10:12:07zeyeah giving the taliban $40mil a few months earlier was such an aggressive thing to do to them
10:12:08pokerjokerbut to profit from them
10:12:51pokerjokersure, the taliban was great when we were worried about the communists
10:12:56ze(which, btw, was equivalent to the taliban's annual budget at the time.. you could say we funded the attack on ourself)
10:13:12pokerjokerze, we did bring it upon ourselves
10:13:28zei'm not sure i see the taliban's motivation
10:13:47zeand i still think it's kinda strange that no responsibilty was claimed
10:13:55pokerjokerthe responsible action wouldve been to find a solution to the cause of problems.
10:14:13webmindze, the motivation wasnt about money
10:14:16zei guess one could argue that the attack was self-explanitory enough in it's message, but generally terrorists are trying to make some sorta point and aren't shy about it
10:14:19webmindthe world isnt about money
10:14:20pokerjokerthe whole thing stinks doesnt it? im not sure i believe anything
10:14:42pokerjokerwebmind the world IS about money
10:14:47zewebmind: i didn't say anything about money
10:14:58webmindpokerjoker, no.. that's what they want you to think.. so you play there game
10:14:59pokerjokermoney and power
10:15:09pokerjokerhow do i play their game?
10:15:19webmindbuy asuming the world is about money
10:15:19zei just don't believe that 9/11 is what everybody's been told it was
10:15:22webmindbut it isnt
10:15:27webmindmoney isnt more then a simple tool
10:15:37zei honestly would not be suprised if the bush's and their friends didn't have something to do with it
10:15:37pokerjokerim not sure i get your reasoning
10:15:38webmindthere's a lot mor too it
10:15:43webmindthere's +e
10:15:48webminddamn typo's
10:16:15zemoney's fucked
10:16:18zeit's a mass hallucination
10:16:23zeespecially in the current condition
10:16:36zemost of it's value is artificial
10:16:40webmindpokerjoker, money is a tool useful for exchange.. nothing more.. the world is a lot more.. and doesnt revolve around it
10:16:48zei guess money is ok if there's real worth attatched to it
10:17:05zebut so much of it now isn't even supported by anything
10:17:06webmindif the world was about money.. lot's of initiatives i've seen never would've existed
10:17:11pokerjokermoney represents the distribution of goods
10:17:30pokerjokerwebmind, you are living in a more socialist area
10:17:36webmindpokerjoker, i try to..
10:17:56webmindi choose my surroundings carefully
10:17:57pokerjokerwe are very materialist here
10:18:08pokerjokerwere you born in the states
10:18:29webmindpokerjoker, doesn't mean the world is about money
10:18:39webmindif you tihnk that you're basicly lost
10:18:51pokerjokerno sir. if you dont realize it, then you are lost
10:19:07pokerjokerperhaps you misunderstand me
10:19:21pokerjokerbut my contention is this: things happen for the sake of money and power
10:20:14pokerjokeryou think Spaniards came to South America to help natives out? You think Brits stayed in India for a few hundred years because they liked them? And the French in Asia?
10:20:20webmindpeople are selfish and powerhungry.. and think money will make them happy
10:20:36pokerjokerTo me, money is not very important. Im close to being a Buddhist, in many ways.
10:20:43webmindpokerjoker, things happen because of money.. doesnt mean the world is about money
10:21:28pokerjokerBut money and power - economics - drives everything. Aristotle said it, Marx restated it, and Bush and Rumsfeld sure as hell know it...
10:21:40pokerjokerour fates are decided by money
10:21:51webmindnot everything by far
10:21:59pokerjokerthose with it control our destiny, in the material world
10:22:07webmindyou choose your live
10:22:09webmindnot money
10:22:21pokerjokerwebmind you cannot live by yourself
10:22:26pokerjokerwithout others
10:22:39webminddepending on where you live, you may have little choice.. but there is -alway- choice
10:22:46webmindpokerjoker, you can.. and people do
10:22:50pokerjokerand if you live with others, you depend on their contributions, their assets
10:23:26webmindmoney doesn't decide what i will do tomorrow
10:23:30pokerjokername one group of people who have not been affectd by money
10:23:35webmindmoney doesnt decide what i'm gonna with my life
10:23:47pokerjokerwebmind have you ever had a job
10:23:54webmindi have one now
10:24:00pokerjokerwould you work for free?
10:24:07zepokerjoker: there's several tribes sprinked throughout the world that have not had any contact with anything from the modern world
10:24:07pokerjokerwould you continue to work if you didnt get paid
10:24:08webmindpokerjoker, i do.. i volunteer
10:24:25pokerjokerso the only job you have is a volunteer job
10:24:28webmindpokerjoker, if i would be able to survive
10:24:51zethere's also plenty of people who hole themselves up in some remote chunk of land somewhere
10:24:54pokerjokerbut you CANT survive without money. without becoming part of the system. Man, havent you ever listened to Roger Waters?
10:24:55zethere's always possibilities
10:25:03zepokerjoker: you can
10:25:11webmindpokerjoker, you can.. lots of people do damnit.. get some sense of what happens in the world
10:25:17zethere's communes out there too
10:25:25webmindand mind you.. i'm not saying money isnt usefull.. it just doesnt rule my life
10:25:33pokerjokerze - many tribes have been killed or moved for land or oil, or religion - and religion (like Catholicism) usually factors back to money and power
10:25:42zepokerjoker: yeah, so?
10:26:03zethe point is there ARE groups of people living on this planet that don't use money and aren't being effected by the rest of the world
10:26:18webmindpokerjoker, stuff happens for money.. it doesnt make the world though.. only if everyone believes it does.. which is what people with money want you to think
10:26:34zeat least not directly.. of course you could say our contributions to global warming and air pollution and stuff has an impact on them, but that's not what we're talknig about so hehe
10:26:39webmindmoney is useful as trade too aswell..
10:26:42pokerjokermy point is, economics drives history. its a matter of time before everyone becomes part of the machine
10:26:58zeit's not a matter of time
10:27:14webmindi don't work here -because- i get paid.. i could work somewhere else if this place suit me anymore
10:27:15pokerjokerwebmind, i have seen many things in my time, and the result has been a rejection of money and material wealth
10:27:36webmindpokerjoker, that's because people believe in it..
10:27:41webmindonly reason why it works
10:27:52zepokerjoker: would you have seen those things without this state of affairs?
10:28:08zepokerjoker: you say they're breeding dogs
10:28:08pokerjokerwhat state of affairs are you reffering to
10:28:23zepokerjoker: yet it's this very machine that's provided you with the information and motivation to come to such conclusions
10:28:31zepokerjoker: there's always cracks in the wall
10:28:34zepokerjoker: always.
10:29:11pokerjokerits predominately the rule though
10:29:24webmindpokerjoker, i use money yes.. i don't live by it.. money wouldn't determin my vote.. if i would fight or not.. or what things i choose to live for
10:29:43zetechnology's reaching a point (and may get there sooner than anybody realizes) where something new can happen
10:29:52webmindmoney helps me provide as a tool.. not a goal.. otherwise i'd be working a lot better job
10:29:58pokerjokerthere might be a band of monks that live in Temple A on the outskirts of civilization. But when Civilization B gets tired of being disenfranchised, people result to greed. Its human nature, and survival
10:30:08zeit's coming to the point where it's sufficiently advanced to be used to either enslave or free people
10:30:15zeeach to a much higher degree than ever before in history
10:30:24webmindpokerjoker, greed is MADE human nature
10:30:31webmindpokerjoker, it's a cultural thing
10:30:37webmindnot natural
10:30:44pokerjokerwebmind, i dont believe that many people consciously choose to do things for the sake of money. most people do not
10:30:51zeactually from what i've read greed is part of the survival instinct
10:30:53pokerjokerthat doesnt make at any less of a factor though
10:30:54zea leftover from harder times
10:31:07zeand there's nothing wrong with greed
10:31:17zemost people just have it misplaced
10:31:21zeyou should be greedy for life and experience
10:31:33webmindpokerjoker, it is a factor.. because people believe in it.. i'm not dening it doesnt have power.. but the power is -only- there because people believe in it
10:31:36zenot material wealth
10:31:48webmindthe less people believe.. the less power
10:31:53pokerjokerfor my example, i was trying to say something along the lines of China and Tibet. kinda skewed it though
10:32:07webmindand that's the point.. you shouldn't believe. it's in your disadvantage anyway
10:32:21pokerjokerwebmind, if people did not believe in money - in a unifying factor - their would be chaos, or complete assimilation.
10:32:33webmindpokerjoker, i didn't say that
10:32:46webmindi said people shouldn't believe in the -power- of money
10:32:55zeforget about money
10:32:57pokerjokeryou said several times, "money is a factor" because people believe it
10:33:01zeit's exactly what you think it is but it doesn't matter
10:33:08webmindpokerjoker, within power
10:33:13zeyou can live without it
10:33:26zeand not only that, but credit and inflation and such
10:33:44zehave pretty much dug into the foundations of our economic system so deep that it doesn't have the support it needs to survive
10:33:59zelike i said, too much of the money out there doesn't have anything backing it
10:34:21zei'm not saying it's all just gonna collapse soon or anything
10:34:28 Join tracktheripper [0] (
10:34:32zebut it's certainly not here to stay
10:34:35pokerjokerwebmind: what troubles me about this topic is that you seem to be addressing some personal aspect of my life, and i am speaking about the influence on society as a whole
10:34:40pokerjokerthat is my perspective
10:34:46webmindpokerjoker, i am not
10:34:53tracktherippermorning webmind
10:34:57webmindmorning tracktheripper
10:35:07zeso just start a campaign to educate people on the truth
10:35:10pokerjokerall you need is love
10:35:11tracktherippermakes a change that you didn't say "oi" this time
10:35:14webmindpokerjoker, the point is.. the world is about yourlife.. and mine.. and ze's and tracktheripper's
10:35:25tracktheripperand midknight2k3s
10:35:35pokerjokerze, i have tried to be benevolent and kind and helpful to people, but they would rather be ignorant to the truth
10:35:42webmindit's about people.. the things that actually are on this planet
10:35:48zepokerjoker: everybody's got their perspective
10:35:52webmindmoney isn't anything by itself
10:35:59zepokerjoker: you can get anybody from any perspective to any other perspective
10:36:05tracktheripperWhat happened to the rockbox chat that used to be on here
10:36:08zepokerjoker: the trick is just in the dynamic feedback
10:36:22webmindtracktheripper, i noticed pokerjoker was american and couldn't resist ;)
10:36:28zepokerjoker: you have to link from what's there
10:36:30pokerjokeryes ze, but some peoples perspectives are really stupid and flawed. im not talking about you guys ... im talking about people who agree with my president and war and such.
10:36:56zepokerjoker: you just have to know where they're at and how to go from there to where they need to be
10:37:08pokerjokerze, their may be a method to it. they call it charisma i think.
10:37:27zeit's not all about charisma
10:37:31webmindeveryone has it's own level of understanding.. but they should understand
10:37:34pokerjokertrue. havent thought of that, though i see what you are saying
10:37:37zecharisma helps, but that's not what it is
10:37:50pokerjokerthen again, if i were closeminded, then i might never see your point of view
10:37:58zebut that is another approach, with charisma you can sell most people almost anything
10:38:13pokerjokeri know what you saying though
10:38:24webmindclose minded is one of the stupidest things you can be.. the chances of 1 person actually being absolutely right...
10:38:29pokerjokerand web, i hope you didnt argue with me b/c im from the states, seriously
10:38:40webmindpokerjoker, neh. :)
10:39:02zepokerjoker: part of the thing of getting through to people is reading their current state
10:39:17zeevery education is tailored to the individual
10:39:45zethe method is to be aware and dynamic, to not use a method :p
10:39:47pokerjokerlots of pragmatic people though, its not easy to "help" them
10:40:04zeit doesn't matter what perspective they have
10:40:12zewhat matters is understanding what perspective they have
10:40:22pokerjokerwell, for example
10:40:31pokerjokeri have this friend who is very reasonable
10:40:37webmindactually.. telling people the truth usually doesnt help a lot
10:40:38zeyou just gotta find the bits to throw them that they'll take to
10:40:46webmindshowing them on the other hand
10:40:46pokerjokerbut he has reasoned some unreasonable thoughts. he has been misled.
10:41:06zewebmind: good point
10:41:11zethere's a lot more to communication than just words
10:41:12pokerjokerhis point of view is selfish and intolerant, he is racist and hateful. i cannot change that i believe. how can you?
10:41:18zeexperience is the most powerful thing there is to a human mind
10:41:50webmindze, because the most trust worthy person is yourself.. in anycase
10:42:04pokerjokerhell, ive met fundamentalist christians with PhD's who would NEVER listen to you say something. i suppose its postmodern - or something
10:42:09zewebmind: well hopefully, for most people
10:42:17webmindpokerjoker, reminds me of a episode of the twilight zone :)
10:42:21pokerjokersome people have reasoned themselves to be unreasonable
10:42:40webmindpokerjoker, just beat they're reasoning
10:42:42zepokerjoker: but there's always a way to reason them out of it... but like webmind pointed out, it might take more than words
10:42:45webmindif you're right.. it's possible
10:43:08zeshit it's almost 2am
10:43:15pokerjokerbut they root their reason is arguments like "well, it is just my world view that there is a creator" or "Well, its my belief that might makes right"
10:43:17webmind10.40 here
10:43:17zei was supposed to go to bed Earlier tonight not later
10:43:40pokerjokerif someone attaches himself to a core belief like that, after about 25 years of living, its hard to pry them from it
10:43:43webmindpokerjoker, look at the flaws then
10:43:54webmindchristianity has loads of them
10:44:00webmindand don't point them out
10:44:02webminduse them
10:44:09pokerjokersure, you could take them to Rwanda and show them reality ... but these people dont have to experience this, so they never will
10:44:27webmindchristianity for instance is very selfish belief...
10:44:59webmindit's inflexbile.. self powering
10:44:59pokerjokerhow would you reason someone out of being christian
10:45:04zewebmind: thats funny cause most people aren't selfish enough
10:45:12webmindze, exactly..
10:45:26webmindshow them what they are really doing
10:45:43zepokerjoker: don't use reason
10:45:49zepokerjoker: religion isn't based on reason
10:45:49webmindpokerjoker, depends on the person.. and how they believe.. as ze's said.. it's tailer made
10:46:01webmindze, uhm.. but reason can beat it
10:46:07zewebmind: indeed
10:46:14pokerjokeri think you guys are full of demons. someone get the stocks ready. build a fire.
10:46:20zeas pokerjoker seems to know
10:46:33zeit tends to close itself off from logical scrutiny
10:46:45webmindmind you.. i don't deny the existance of a god.. but i do claim the belief in it as mainly used is abusing
10:47:01webmindalthough abusing isnt the right word
10:47:13webmindze, true
10:47:26webmindze, b ut if you show them.. they'll have to see it
10:47:37webmindit's not a miracle system.. it takes time
10:47:56zeone time i had this dream where i had godlike powers
10:48:04webmindbut if they can't avoid it.. they'll have no choice
10:48:08pokerjokerhow old are you guys? no bullshit.
10:48:10zeand after flying around and stuff for a bit we went into this church
10:48:22zeand i started telling them all about how their religion was bullshit and etc
10:48:39zeand i was like here watch i'll prove it, i'll create life and i manifested a tree
10:49:14webmindze, godlike powers can be extremly boring btw.
10:49:14zewhich is kinda weird cause i was actually christian at the time i had the dream, and for a few years after... it wasn't untill several years later that i even remembered having it
10:49:23webmindze, heh
10:49:36zewell they weren't so godlike afterall
10:49:43webmindze, god was showing you that you shouldn't believe in him :)
10:49:47zeat the end of the dream i tried to do something and fucked up and tore some kinda hole in reality
10:49:59zeand like lost my powers before getting sucked into it
10:50:12webmindpokerjoker, why?
10:50:21tracktheripperhi Dwihno
10:50:23zepokerjoker: i'll be 23 dec 9
10:50:31dwihnoHi track!
10:50:36pokerjokerim 26
10:51:00webmindze, you're 2 months older :)
10:51:08webmindminus a little
10:51:09zeoh yeah? hehe
10:51:52webmindpokerjoker, but what kinda archos do ya have? :)
10:52:58pokerjokera christian one
10:53:18webmindaw, you painted a cross on it ?
10:53:25pokerjokerits a 20gig recorder. paid 83 bucks for it. thats like, 70 euros or something
10:53:35webminddamn.. that's uhm cheap
10:53:55pokerjokergot it on ebay. it was "broken' until i ran scandisk. works like new. no HD errors
10:53:58 Quit tracktheripper ("IceChat IRC client - Download it at")
10:54:18pokerjokerim loading some pet shop boys on it
10:54:26zegoddamnit i gotta get up at 9am tomorrow and i'm not even really tired
10:54:35pokerjokerze wher u from
10:54:45pokerjokernever heard of it
10:54:54pokerjokeri just want to say i really like you rockbox guys
10:55:07webmindawww, thank you :)
10:55:13pokerjokerno hard feelings about our heated exchange ok
10:55:24pokerjokerwebmind, i might come live with you for a few weeks ok
10:55:26webmindi do not see why..
10:55:31webmindpokerjoker, why?
10:55:42pokerjokermy ex girlfriend wants me to go see her in germany
10:55:46pokerjokeri dont know if its a good idea
10:55:59webmindheh.. germany isn't really nearby though
10:56:03pokerjokerso, if i cant stay with her, or this other german girl i know, then im coming to stay with you!
10:56:22zewebmind: where are you?
10:56:25webmindhmk don't sure if ya like it or that i've got a place to crash
10:56:25pokerjokerits closer than moscow. and the russians i know dont like me anymore
10:56:28webmindze, netherlands
10:56:36webmindze, but i don't really live anywhere here
10:56:40webmindmove around a lot
10:56:53webmindchange is good :)
10:57:19zei like to travel, i wish i could be out roaming around most of the time
10:57:34zein fact, i'm out to explore the universe
10:57:37*webmind thinks of moving out of the country for a year
10:57:45webmindactually planning on visiting the us next year
10:57:51zei'll let you guys know when i get my intergallactic spacecrafts together
10:58:06webmindze, plz do.. love to hitchike along :)
10:59:51pokerjokerwhat is the best way to organize mp3s on your archos?
11:00:12zedepends on your selection
11:00:24zewhat worked best for me was like Artist/Album/#-Track.mp3
11:00:34pokerjokerwhen i had a 20 gig player, i had ten directories, like A Thru C was one, then D thru F was another...
11:00:46zeyou could do that too
11:01:03pokerjokerwell, that (what i did) is probably the best way to go for a "player"
11:01:18pokerjokerbut since i get so many lines on my recorder, your method might be best
11:01:32*webmind uses artist-album/#-track.mp3 mainly although on my hd i store them with artist/album/#-track.mp3
11:01:38ze*shrug* it can still be a lot to go through
11:01:44zedepending, again, on your selection
11:01:59zei've got a zen these days actually
11:02:07zeit's a lot nicer to browse cause it's got a scrollwheel
11:02:21zeyou can skip through a lot quick or go slow etc
11:02:25webmindif you have a lot of loose mp3's artist/album is undesirable
11:02:31webmindze, have you seen the new rio ?
11:02:39zewebmind: or lots of VA stuff
11:02:44zewebmind: the karma? looks fucking sweet
11:04:31zestill i won't be satisfied till it's all something completely different from the current paradigm
11:05:09webmindwhat paradigm ?
11:05:29zei want virtually unlimited storage with total overkill quality and without a box :p
11:05:51zeand by overkill quality i mean like the level of the most sophisticated audio equipment on earth today
11:05:56pokerjokerok i got a new method for organizing
11:06:09webmindze, 300GB close enough ?
11:06:17zewebmind: not even
11:06:28webmindterabyte ?
11:06:34zeit's hard to estimate
11:06:40zethink like ridiculous
11:06:58zethink beyond current digital limits
11:07:11zethink like a full perfect reproduction of audio
11:07:25zeincluding velocity and directional information of each component and etc
11:07:50zelike an exact copy made of the 4D accoustic environment
11:07:58webmindwell.. 5min of raw audio is 50meg right.. add some lossless compression 50%
11:08:08webmindalbum is about 60min ?
11:08:20zeno no no
11:08:30zei'm talking far beyond whats possible with our current technology :p
11:08:47webmindyou perfectly recorded resonation
11:08:55zelike think in terms of CD quality being worthless low-res crap
11:09:18webmindso.. uhm.. why ?
11:09:27webmindat a certain point you wont hear the difference anymore
11:09:37zelike think in terms if you were to take this sortof stream of audio and wish to isolate some far beyond audible range
11:09:54zeyou could extract that information from it perfectly as it existed when it was recorded
11:10:01webmindhmmm k
11:10:06zeand do scientific analysis and get accurate results
11:10:23zewebmind: because there's more to sound than what you can hear
11:10:24webmindand know the location of it relative to the recording devive?
11:10:31zeand you never know what information could be useful
11:10:57zewebmind: sure
11:11:27zeanother thing is that inaudible components can feasible contribute audibly through interference effects
11:11:46zesome of which could be lost with any current sampling methods
11:12:19zeand other things, you know there's lots of odd stuff in this universe, strange effects that we don't tend to consider
11:12:51zeour basic perception of things is based on strange effects
11:12:55zeresonance, energy propagation, etc
11:13:01pokerjokeryou mean like spirits?
11:13:25pokerjokerare you talking about an audio-ectoplasmic generator?
11:13:45pokerjokeror "regenerator"
11:14:02zethe way things look, there's so many different physical effects that contribute to the different way materials and other things produce the visual information we recieve of them
11:14:03pokerjokeror does this border more on time travel
11:14:13zepokerjoker: what're you talking about?
11:14:35zeyou do realize that resonance plays a key role in both sight and sound right?
11:14:55pokerjokerim joking. we understand what you are saying ze
11:15:03pokerjokercan i ask a serious, boring question
11:15:16zeis it really boring? go ahead
11:15:29pokerjokerim a bit confused about "deep discharge" and trickle charge
11:15:36zeoh, that is boring
11:15:59zeyeah i dunno, i had a player and then i had an fmrec and neither of those had those
11:16:02pokerjokerwell, it seems to me that you should only be able to turn one of those on at a time
11:16:42pokerjokerdo you understand web? im confused about it
11:17:04webmindsorry.. i got a player..
11:17:08webminddoesnt have that function
11:17:18pokerjokeroh. why dont you ever get a recorder?
11:17:33webmindcos i don't have the money ?
11:17:39webmindwell i do
11:17:47webmindbut don't wanna spend so much on it
11:17:51webmindsince i have a player
11:18:04pokerjokerkeep your hard drive, sell your player
11:18:11zeyeah i was honestly planning on keeping my player untill about the 2nd or 3rd generation portable video devices came out
11:18:26pokerjokerbuy a used Recorder 15, pop out the 15 gig HD and sell it too...
11:18:26webmindpokerjoker, my player is uhm.. somewhat modded :)
11:18:30zebut i ended up getting 2 free upgrades so far from bestbuy under the service plan when the others broke
11:18:48pokerjokerwebmind what do you have on it
11:19:15webmindpokerjoker, well the adapter has nice green lights.. and the player itself no casing
11:19:22***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:19:33zeso thanks for going back to mundane stuff, now i can go to bed... night :p
11:19:55pokerjokerze goodnight
11:20:07pokerjokersee you soon i hope. happy thanksgiving
11:20:23webmindnite ze
11:20:28webmindthanksgiving ?
11:20:56webmindisn't that the fest where you celebrate the opression over the natives ?
11:21:30pokerjokerwe celebrate not getting involved in WW2 until the last minute, because of smart ass europeans
11:22:06webmindand then claim it was you who came to the rescue? you and you alone freed us from the nazi's ?
11:22:18pokerjokerwell it sure as hell wasnt the French
11:22:28webmindnope.. the canadians :)
11:22:32pokerjokerand i dont think the Germans were stopping the Nazis. Nein
11:22:39pokerjokerFuck the canadians.
11:22:47webmindthe russians helped a lot too
11:22:49webmindand the english
11:22:57pokerjokeryeah right. you really know your history.
11:23:02webminduhm yes
11:23:04webmindbut do you ?
11:23:09pokerjokeri liked how the russians helped the Jews out in Prague. remember that one?
11:23:27webminddon't recall
11:23:35pokerjokerall stalin and hitler agreed on was not to get into it too early on, so they could all fuck up europe in their own way. remember that treaty?
11:23:55webmindbut you only joined in because of that the germans attacked your trade ships
11:24:13pokerjokerok my bad. it wasnt prague, maybe it was poland. Stalin came in with propaganda and told the poles to rise up against hitler,
11:24:28pokerjokerand when the jews did so, stalin left them cold. and hitler wiped them out
11:24:31webmindpokerjoker, you seem to have different history books
11:24:35pokerjokerit was an evil little trick
11:25:01pokerjokerwebmind i think german tradeships is more WW1
11:25:07webmindah yes
11:25:10webmindmy bad
11:25:17pokerjokerwebmind dont dissapoint me!
11:25:17webmindjapan was the thing right for ww2 ?
11:25:24pokerjokerallow me to tell you about thanksgiving now
11:25:52pokerjokercontrary to popular belief, the "natives" werent oppressed quite like you might imagine
11:26:31pokerjokerits a bit of a misnomer. and just because there were some people who did evil things in the name of "america" doesnt mean that the majority of the population was evil
11:27:01pokerjokermost people have indian relations here. most scots and irish and french who settled here were friendly with the natives
11:27:12 Join AciD` [0] (
11:27:34pokerjokerhowever there were hostile tribes, and there were government operations that seized land (not too different from Iraq)
11:27:58pokerjokermost people, on the low levels, tried to get along in the states, throughout history.
11:28:31pokerjokerhell, even in Memphis blacks and whites got along fairly well between 1920 and 1960s
11:28:53pokerjokerits just unfortunate that some people screw things up
11:29:34pokerjokeror misunderstand things. relations with natives was not peaceful all the time, and native to native relations werent always peaceful either.
11:29:55pokerjokerbut there have been lots of people who crossed the boundaries of "difference" and learned to get along with others
11:30:20pokerjokeryou see, the thing that gets me is, i had a sociology teacher who told us that he would NEVER celebrate thanksgiving
11:30:48pokerjokerhis reasoning was very liberal, and although i heard him out and considered it for a while, i had to ultimately reject it, because it was just crazy liberal crap
11:31:05pokerjokerkind of like a Michael Moore documentary
11:31:16pokerjokerok i rest now
11:31:29webmindthat documentary seemed rather good actually
11:31:48pokerjokerno, its very ungood. roger and me? or Bowling for columbine? both are ungood
11:31:56webmindwhy ?
11:31:58pokerjokerdoubleplus ungood
11:32:10webmindhe made some rather good points on guns
11:32:26pokerjokerb/c it is very biased and illogical.
11:32:44pokerjokeri cant believe you think its a good movie
11:32:51pokerjokerthis hurts my heart so much
11:33:03webmindnow that is close minded
11:33:05pokerjokerhe fails to explain the truth
11:33:12webmindplz do the
11:33:23pokerjokerguns are a part of our culture
11:33:33pokerjokerthey are not evil. in fact they are good.
11:33:36pokerjokerthey are tools
11:33:43webminduhm.. he doesnt say guns are evil..
11:33:45pokerjokerMoore grew up in Michigan
11:34:13pokerjokerdo you know that in Minnesota and Michigan, people sustain themselves mostly on game?
11:34:33webmindpokerjoker, he doesnt say guns are evil
11:34:51pokerjokerin the 70s and 80s, i belive the stats were that most Minnesota residents got 70% of their meat from game
11:34:55webmindhave you actually watched the entire movie ?
11:35:05pokerjokerwhat does he say then? that dick clark is responsible for homicide
11:35:18webmindhe refers to the media
11:35:21webmindas hyping it up
11:35:28pokerjokeri watched it all. it was negative. he blamed corporations for the problem
11:35:31webmindcreating fear
11:35:39webmindhe blaimed the media
11:35:43webmindwho is indeed the blame
11:35:59webmindthere is reason us media is one of the lesser free media's of the world
11:36:02pokerjokerthen why did he attack celebs? isnt THAT a poor use of media?
11:36:12webmindcelebs ?
11:36:20pokerjokercelebrities ...
11:36:46webmindi don't recall him doing that in the movie
11:36:48pokerjokerhis use of the media was moronic, to blame Heston and dick clark for deaths
11:36:56pokerjokerit was sad
11:36:59 Part oxygen77
11:37:02webmindmind you.. i didn't say it was a good documentary.. but he had a good point in the end
11:37:13pokerjokerthe point about the media bothers me
11:37:25pokerjokerpersonally, i dont pay attention to the media.
11:37:27 Join oxygen77 [0] (
11:37:35webmind99% of people does
11:37:39webmindoxygen77, ?
11:37:49pokerjokerCNN and ABC and CBS are all biased and stupid. i would rather watch BBC or independent newlinks
11:38:06webmindBBC isnt a US channel
11:38:10pokerjokerwebmind, not in the states. Not many people do, especially in my generation
11:38:34webmindpokerjoker, for some reason they do seemed influenced by it
11:38:35pokerjokerTom Brokaw and DAn Rather, they know the only people who watch them are WW2 and babyboom era people.
11:39:07pokerjokeri think that my generation - either because they are desensitized or wiser - pay little attn to the media's
11:39:34pokerjokerthats an observation. may be just wishful thinking. we are more globally minded.
11:40:02webmindi maybe can't judge much.. but i think it might be jsut your direct surrounding
11:40:10pokerjoker"Fear" is pumped mostly into the older generation, that dealt with the Depression, the world wars, cold war, etc. They worry, and they are abused by the media
11:40:41pokerjokerthey also trust the media, becuase they were brought up to trust their country
11:40:57pokerjokerand the media whores them. makes them afraid. takes their money.
11:41:08pokerjokerbut my generation isnt so much like that
11:41:24pokerjokerfor better or worse, we are skeptics
11:41:24webmindi hope so
11:41:32pokerjokerhow old r u
11:41:49webmindread back
11:41:51pokerjokermichael moore is as guilty as the rest of the media
11:42:10webmindmichael moore doesnt seem to choose any side in his documentary
11:42:21webmindi'd sugest you watch it again
11:42:21pokerjokerhe doesnt tell teh truth
11:42:24pokerjokertell me web...
11:42:27webmindya seemed to have missed some things
11:42:33pokerjokerno web
11:42:37pokerjokerdont diss me like that
11:42:49pokerjokerexplain to me why a bank would hand out guns?
11:42:56pokerjokerwhy would a bank do that web? why? do you know why?
11:44:04pokerjokerremember when he got the bank account and they offered him a rifle?
11:44:58pokerjokerhe never did explain "Why" they gave him a rifle, of all things
11:45:26pokerjokerto europeans, it must just be because americans are violent, murderous bastards
11:46:38webmindi'm not dissing
11:47:03webmindand i'm mainly refferning to the end of the movie
11:47:28webmindas during it.. he mainly asks a lot of questions
11:47:45webmindmaybe rediculing where unapropriate
11:48:06webmindbut his end point is rather good
11:48:13pokerjokerhe is misleading
11:48:39pokerjokerhe fails to prove his point. if there is one thing i know its sociology and such - his documentary is a lie
11:48:51pokerjokerit is poorly made and poorly representative of the truth
11:49:07pokerjokerhe is like Rush Limbaugh, equally as bad - only the exact opposite
11:49:14webmindi can't agree with ya.. but won't discuss it now
11:51:57pokerjokereuropeans hate the states
11:52:16pokerjokerif you were chinese, i would say "i cant blame you" ...but you are western like me
11:52:46webmindi am not
11:53:24webmindand i don't hate north america.. beautyfull country
11:53:32webmindquite some nice people aswell
11:53:38webmindi do hate certain ideas and actions
11:54:06webmindand maybe people who are awere o that they are manipulating and destroying other people
11:54:12webmindbut mainly i don't hate people
11:54:17webmindhate is bad
11:54:32pokerjokermoore dissapointed me
11:54:39pokerjokerwebmind i have to tell you
11:54:40 Join LinusN [200] (
11:54:43pokerjokerim not a social person
11:54:48webmindoi LinusN
11:54:54pokerjokerim not athletic and im not technically minded
11:55:07pokerjokeri spent my entire life asking these questions
11:55:19webmindwhat questions ?
11:55:21pokerjokerwhy ... why about basically everything thats ever happened
11:55:39LinusNwebmind: yo
11:55:43pokerjokeri think i have some of the answers
11:55:49webmindLinusN, sup.. 2.1 comming up?
11:56:07webmindpokerjoker, work with them then? and asume they can be wrong
11:56:19pokerjokeri will shuttup about it though. what i really want to know is how to get my battery charged
11:56:25webmindah ok
11:56:32pokerjokerwebmind, my ideas arent wrong. trust me
11:57:03LinusNwebmind: we have to sort out the documentation details, like the manual, release notes and stuff
11:57:11webmindpokerjoker, i won't i don't even fully trust myself with it
11:57:23dwihno\o/ linus \o/
11:57:29webmindpokerjoker, and thinking -you- are right is quite closeminded.. you can always be wrong
11:57:38pokerjokerwell, if you cant believe in anything, then i pity you
11:57:41LinusNdwihno: i salute you, my apprentice
11:57:41webmindLinusN, documentation? yay! :)
11:58:00pokerjokerwebmind you have to have belief in something. and when you reason out the correct answer you cant keep doubting
11:58:00webmindpokerjoker, don't i'm very happy how i live.. i believe in everything..
11:58:25pokerjokerwell do me a favor and dont believe in michael moore
11:58:45webmindi don't believe in him anymore then any other person
11:58:45pokerjokerhe should be discredited
11:59:05webmindi just take up the information.. and use it.. apropriatly
11:59:29webmindbut nothing.. litterly -nothing- is absolute in my world
11:59:42pokerjokerhow do you know you use it appropriately? you should doubt yourself as much as you tell me to accept my possible wrongness
12:00:14dwihnoLinusN: I'm young padawan :D MPEG header learning, I must!
12:00:16webmindpokerjoker, because i know it's value..
12:00:20pokerjokersomethings have to be accepted
12:00:23webmindpokerjoker, and ofcourse i doubt it..
12:00:29pokerjokerthere are laws to this world
12:00:39webmindpokerjoker, only relative to certaint things
12:00:52pokerjokerthings such as reality
12:01:08webmindpokerjoker, let's not discuss reality..
12:01:14pokerjokerwhy not?
12:01:20webmindpokerjoker, you really don't want that with me.
12:01:32pokerjokersuspending reality is the first step in many theories
12:01:45webmindreality is a joke in many ways..
12:01:55webmindbut the discussion in irrelevant
12:01:56pokerjokerhows that
12:02:10webmindi said.. let's not discuss it
12:02:12webmindand i won't
12:02:28pokerjokeralright. no reality. i guess its not relevant. though im not sure if i agree
12:02:31webmindit can be fun at times.. but i see no use
12:02:41webmindpokerjoker, it doesnt matter if you agree or not
12:02:59pokerjokeras i said earlier, these "world building" theories people use, basically guide their whole cosmogony
12:03:18pokerjokerare you a nihilist
12:03:34webminddon't think so
12:03:44webmindbut i see -everything- relative
12:04:01pokerjokerrelative to what
12:04:39pokerjokerwell thats a good start. but, if someone is talking about something outside your experience, how can you make a sound judgement
12:04:53webmindthe information you give me, is relative to how trustworthy i think you are and how much the data could make sense
12:05:23webmindon reliability that is
12:05:32webmindi also combine it with my own experiences
12:05:34*LinusN is surprised how little technical rockbox talk there is on this channel nowadays
12:05:42pokerjokerif thats the case then, i only wish to futher add to your "database" of relativity
12:05:46webmindinformation other people have given me
12:05:52webmindand how trustwordthy that it
12:06:01webmindLinusN, uhm.. sorry.. couldn't resist :)
12:06:16pokerjokerLinus can you help me with battery issues for Recorder?
12:06:17webmindpokerjoker, you do.. and so does LinusN here..
12:06:51 Quit dwihno ("Nu bär det av på bartenderturné! Åter måndag.")
12:06:53LinusNpokerjoker: what's the prob?
12:07:14pokerjokerim not sure i understand why "deep discharge" and "Trickle" can work...
12:07:22pokerjokeri mean, can you set them both to "yes" ?
12:09:17pokerjokerand if you can set deep disharge and trickle to yes, then dont they cancel eachother out?
12:11:37LinusNhehe, i agree
12:11:42LinusNlet me check that out
12:12:22pokerjokermaybe checking YES on deep discharge cancels out the YES in Trickle
12:13:30LinusNfrom what i can see, it works like this:
12:13:48LinusNthe deep discharge option only controls when to start charging
12:14:31pokerjokerok. and trickle?
12:14:36LinusNat 10% battery capacity or at 90%
12:14:42pokerjokertrickle controls when to Stop charging?
12:14:58LinusNand trickle controls if it is to maintain the voltage after charging
12:15:30LinusNif tricke is off, it will stop charging and not restart charging until the voltage drops below the threshold
12:16:05LinusNif trickle is on, it will maintain the charge until you disconnect the charger
12:16:29LinusNso, having both set to yes makes little sense
12:16:59pokerjokertrickle... hmm hold on
12:19:55pokerjokertrickle charge is needed to keep the batteries full after charging, because the JB cannot be turned off while its connected?
12:20:03pokerjokernot sure what that means
12:20:28pokerjokerso it keeps the batteries at full charge
12:20:39pokerjokerwouldnt that damage them though, in the long run?
12:22:22LinusNyes, that's why you have the deep discharge option
12:22:48LinusNso they should really be combined into one "charging strategy" option, imho
12:23:05LinusNNormal, Deep discharge, Trickle
12:23:10LinusNor something
12:23:36LinusNthe deep discharge option is for those who always keep the jukebox connected to the charger, to not waer out the batteries
12:24:11pokerjokerok linus. so lets say that you have batteries at 9% and you want to hook the JB up to the wall outlet AND use it for a couple hours. what do you choose?
12:24:21pokerjokeroh ok
12:25:05pokerjokerand trickle is used when the batteries are full. for some reason this simple thing confuses me
12:25:56LinusNstill confusing?
12:27:21pokerjokerwell, when my batteries are dead, like 6%, then i take it and hook it up, and set DEEP DISCHARGE to ON and Trickle to OFF ... right
12:29:56LinusNthe trickle charge option only controls what happens when the batteries are charged
12:30:45LinusNthe deep discharge option controls what to (re)start charging, below 10% or below 90%
12:31:24LinusNin your example, it won't matter how you set either option
12:31:51LinusNit will start charging regardless of the discharge setting, since the battery level is below 10%
12:31:52pokerjokerok. and the default is NO to deep discharge and YES to trickle?
12:32:01LinusNi think so, yes
12:32:32pokerjokeri think i will keep deep discharge YES to deep discharge and NO to trickle.
12:33:20pokerjokeroh another big Q. what is that Car Adapter optoin!!
12:34:04pokerjokeroption. on the daily build
12:35:42LinusNit is a feature that attempts to behave when you connect the jukebox to a car charger adapter
12:37:21pokerjokeri have a car charger adapter
12:37:41LinusNit pauses the music when the external power disappears, and resumes when it comes back
12:38:49pokerjokerim asbout to pass out. its 6.40. am ... been up too late.
12:38:58pokerjokeri will heed your advice., thank you
12:40:39pokerjokergoodnight for now
12:41:46 Part pokerjoker
12:46:17 Quit LinusN ("disconnecting from stoned server.")
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12:59:05 Quit AciD` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:00:45 Part LinusN
13:00:50 Join LinusN [200] (
13:01:26 Part LinusN
13:01:31 Join LinusN [200] (
13:12:55 Part LinusN
13:19:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:36:04 Join upiom [0] (
14:36:52upiomWhat voltage is a powersupply for an archos recorder 6GB suppused to produce?
14:42:06webmindi'll take a look
14:42:15 Join AciD` [0] (
14:42:27webmindupiom, 9volts
14:43:37upiomwebmind: thanks.
14:44:27webmindwhy btw?
14:46:29upiomMy jukebox has been broken for some month and I havn't really looked in to it (happend about the same time as the guaranty expired). I got a "read access error". Now I've fiddled abit with it and it's still somewhat broken but atleas occasionaly boots up.
14:48:17upiomI took out the disk and plugged it into my pc and ran scandisk and all kindes of stuffed. The disk seemd to work. I put the disk back in the archos and it seemed to work. I screwd the archos together, confident that I had fixed the problem and bang, it didn't work
14:49:03upiomturned out that if I unscrew two of the torx-screws on the left side of the machine it works (most times). It the screws are in it doesn't.
15:06:34oxygen77I heard of somebody having the same problem with its JBMM
15:10:07upiomWell it's better then not running at all. But I'd actually rather see that the disk was broken or something that could be fixed more permenantly. The player doesn't have a very solid feeling anymore. Don't even know if I dare to put it in a poket
15:11:23upiomwell gotta go. Maybe i should write a page about the problems i got incase anyone is interested.
15:12:33 Quit upiom ("using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.2.4")
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15:53:30quelsarukanyone alive?
15:57:51quelsarukwebmind, have you seen zagor today?
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18:23:30 Join Bluechip [0] (
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18:25:25Bluechipanybody here able to help me resolve an "Error 255" during "make" in the "plugins" directory?
18:27:05zethats not the error, look a bit higher
18:27:51Bluechipno OBVIOUS error mesages :(
18:31:25Bluechipany idea what I might be looking for?
18:32:52 Quit oxygen77 ("ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/7]")
18:33:37zewell some command's failing and it should give an error message and then a couple error's like that coming out of make afterward
18:35:10zelook between the last thing that looks like a commandline and that Error 255, it should be in there
18:37:15 Quit Dogger ("Client Exiting")
18:38:25Bluechipfone brb
18:51:31Bluechipsorry about that - friends hey! who would have them ;)
18:52:24Bluechipsimply says "make[2]: entering dir: plugins" then "make[2]: [all] error 255" :(
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19:09:25 Join edx [0] (
19:09:27 Join _aLF [0] (
19:19:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:24:28 Join ozric01 [0] (
19:28:50 Part Bluechip
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19:48:51 Quit AciD` (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
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19:56:27 Quit AciD` (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
19:58:40 Join tracktheripper [0] (
19:59:38tracktheripperthe battery meter takes ages to appear on the latest bleeding edge
20:01:20 Join AciD` [0] (
20:01:50tracktheripperhi acid#
20:02:38tracktheripperor oi
20:03:07 Join cjnr11 [0] (
20:05:36 Quit Schnueff ("leaving")
20:07:33tracktheripperhi cjnr11
20:13:09 Join Dogger [0] (
20:13:39tracktheripperhi dogger
20:14:15 Quit Arnaud (
20:14:15 Quit scott666 (
20:14:15 Quit uski (
20:14:15 Quit MT (
20:14:15 Quit Dogger (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:14:55 Join Dogger [0] (
20:15:19tracktheripperhi dogger
20:15:46tracktheripperlol we had the Mafia in here yesterday :)
20:16:34Doggerlol nice,
20:16:42Doggermafia being?
20:17:05tracktherippermidknight2k3, thedude02, and that other chap whose name I forgot
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20:18:04NJoinMT [0] (
20:18:04Mode"#rockbox +bb *!*Dude@* *!*hello@* " by
20:18:04DBUGsent MODE #rockbox -bb *!*Dude@* *!*hello@*
20:18:05Mode"#rockbox -bb *!*Dude@* *!*hello@* " by logbot (
20:42:43 Quit Dogger ("Client Exiting")
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20:58:16 Quit methangas (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
21:19:35***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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21:25:11 Quit funkymonkey (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:25:11 Nick methangas is now known as funkymonkey (
21:28:05 Join hardeep [0] (1098@
21:31:03 Quit ozric01 ("bye")
21:40:08 Quit tracktheripper ("IceChat IRC client - Download it at")
21:42:25 Join quelsaruk [0] (~r00t@
21:42:44quelsarukseen ozric01 this night?
21:58:35quelsarukcu soon!
21:59:05 Quit quelsaruk ()
22:16:09 Join Bagder [0] (
22:24:19 Join nz [0] (~vladimir@
22:25:16 Part nz
22:27:47Bagderany v2 user in?
22:27:58Bagderor v2 owner rather
22:28:36 Join nz [0] (
22:28:55BagderI found the usb problem
22:29:14nzwhat was it?
22:29:25Bagdera stupid platform check
22:29:30Bagderthat wasn't fixed for the v2
22:29:37Bagderso it used the plain recorder code
22:29:41DBUGSent KICK nz to server
22:29:42Kick(#rockbox nz :Stop repeating yourself) by logbot!
22:29:52 Join nz [0] (
22:29:58Bagderevil bot ;-)
22:30:09nzoh :-)
22:32:15uskioh, un frenchie ;)
22:34:03*Bagder wanders off to take care of displeased daughter...
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22:40:27 Part nz
22:54:20 Quit Cheek ()
23:00:09 Quit funkymonkey (" HydraIRC -> <- s0 d4Mn l33t |t'z 5c4rY!")
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23:19:36***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:31:03 Join tracktheripper [0] (
23:31:28tracktheripperhi webmind
23:31:40tracktheripperon the latest daily build the battery meter takes ages to apperar
23:38:25webmindno clue
23:38:30webmindsorry not completely here
23:38:40tracktheripperdon;t think anyone is lol
23:38:55tracktheripperi wouldn't touch an Ipod with a cheap 1980s walkman
23:38:58tracktherippergonna make tea
23:47:06tracktheripperWhich is faster, a 2.4Ghz Celeron or a 2.4Ghz Pentium?
23:47:32webmindmore cache
23:48:08tracktheripperI would think that they would run theoretically at the same speed being 2.5Ghz
23:48:40webmindclockspeed the same
23:48:56webmindbut speed is also dependant on memmory speed
23:49:09tracktheripperok so would a 2.4Ghz Celeron be faster than a 1.5Ghz Pentium?
23:49:41webmindin execution ?
23:49:53webmindclockspeed ofcoz slower
23:49:58tracktheripperoh ok
23:50:02webmindbut intels are hard to benchmark
23:50:07webmindcisc junk
23:50:26 Quit _aLF (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:52:58 Quit edx ()

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