Previous day | Jump to hour: 01 02 03 04 05 06 07 08 09 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 | Next day

Seconds: Show Hide | Joins: Show Hide | View raw
Font: Serif Sans-Serif Monospace | Size: Small Medium Large

Click in the nick column to highlight everything a person has said.
The Logo icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).

#rockbox log for 2005-07-21

00:00:37markunLear: there is a problem with changing the mixer volume, during crossfade the replaygain also needs to be faded..
00:00:56markunaltering the samles as you suggested would solve this
00:00:59Learwell, I was planning on doing the scale in dsp.c, so that shouldn't be a problem...
00:01:02Learcorrect. :)
00:01:32markunMaybe you should just go ahead with it
00:01:43markunI will be on vacation for 2 weeks.
00:01:44 Quit CBM-away (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:02:16 Quit webguest89 ("CGI:IRC")
00:07:11markunLear: Wait, I forgot something in the patch..
00:07:45Learhm... quite different from my approach, so not much to re-use...
00:08:04Learline sound_set and atodb? :)
00:08:26Learno, sorry, most seems to be there.
00:09:41markunYes, atodb was a quick hack
00:09:57MoosHi markun :)
00:10:03markunHey Moos!
00:10:18Moospv ;)
00:11:54HClwhats atodb?
00:14:04markunHCl: a function that reads a string encoded floating point number and multiplies it by 10
00:15:39 Quit ashridah ("Leaving")
00:16:48HClah o.o.
00:17:42markunLear: I wanted to do clipping preventions only by using shifts. That way we can do it while converting from 24-bit to 16 without extra costs. Is a multiply much more expensive than a shift?
00:20:28LearI don't remember how fast the mac is, but it is fairly quick... But the 24-16 conversion will be done in dsp.c anyway, so adding clipping prevention in dsp.c would be easy.
00:20:42LearThough I don't plan to for the first version at least...
00:20:53markunoff to my bed again. A bit ill after a festival this weekend..
00:21:00markungood night everyone
00:21:54markunLear: Right now 24-16 conversion is still done in Tremor, maybe you can fix that
00:22:10 Quit markun ()
00:22:14Learmarkun: sure, my local copy has that fixed... :)
00:22:33Learbtw, multiply by mac takes 3 cycles...
00:24:47 Quit rooomish ("game is over")
00:30:03 Join JAJDude [0] (
00:32:40bagawkThe ab-repeat patch is a .gz
00:32:49bagawkand when i decompress, it is binary file
00:33:02bagawkno tar
00:33:18bagawkI just did gzip -d ab-rep...
00:33:31HClwhat does that do?
00:33:52HClran file on it?
00:33:58bagawkif i try tar zxf on the file it will say that it is not a tar
00:34:02CtcpIgnored 2 channel CTCP requests in 3 hours and 23 minutes at the last flood
00:34:02*bagawk bagawk runs
00:34:26bagawkab-repeat-20050521.patch: gzip compressed data, was "ab-repeat-20050521.patch", from Unix
00:34:27 Quit JAJDude (Client Quit)
00:34:37bagawkBut I just did decompress that
00:34:40HCldouble gzipped
00:35:05 Join JAJDude [0] (
00:35:32bagawkumm when i try it again
00:35:43bagawkunknown suffix −− ignored
00:35:51HClrename it to .gz
00:37:21bagawkthat worked
00:38:51 Join stripwax [0] (
00:40:56stripwaxother than being a good rockbox citizen, what steps do i need to take to get a patch incorporated into cvs?
00:47:44 Join CBM_doing_idea [0] (
00:48:46bagawkstripwax, wait a few years :)
00:49:03bagawkj/k (sorta)
00:49:17bagawkThere are patches that have been in there for a few years left untouched :(
00:49:28 Quit Lear ("Chatzilla [Firefox 1.0.5/20050715]")
00:49:34bagawkJust nag LinusN of bagder once in a bit
00:55:55stripwaxbagawk sure.. seems odd (to me) that my useful (or so I believe) sokoban patch hasn't been considered, and yet today cosmetic graphics changes were committed into sokoban .
00:55:58*stripwax shrugs
01:04:08HClthe cache one?
01:04:19HCli'll look at it tomorrow if you toss me a download url
01:05:12stripwaxHCl - that would be ace!
01:06:05stripwaxthe current cache size is basically arbitrary (20 levels if plugin buffer size > 20KB). i bet we could cache the entire leveldata file on iriver currently
01:10:10HCli've been meaning to look at rockbox
01:10:19HClbut i was pretty busy today
01:10:37stripwaxI think the website was ooa most of today anyway
01:11:52HClrockbox is finally getting to the point where it gets actually usable
01:12:09HClneed to start using it as an end user and search for bugs / design flaws
01:12:24HClbut i'll do that tomorrow
01:12:34HClalong with testing and possibly committing your patch
01:16:09HCli'll also look at adding files to the tag database on the fly to support runtime information for files that aren't in the tagdatabase
01:19:58 Quit bagawk ("Leaving")
01:22:37 Nick CBM_doing_idea is now known as CheeseBurgerMan (
01:22:51HClwhenever i see that nick i think of a really fat person :/
01:23:07HClcan't help it :/
01:28:15 Join BBub [0] (
01:29:26*CheeseBurgerMan is actually skinny.
01:29:28DBUGEnqueued KICK CheeseBurgerMan
01:29:28*CheeseBurgerMan swipes your cheeseburgers to: [Blackhawk - Hole In My Heart] - [ 03:27 / 03:59 ] - [ 44 kHz 128 kbps ]
01:29:41CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
01:29:41*CheeseBurgerMan has wanted to use that script for awhile.
01:33:28 Join Strath [0] (
01:33:31 Join stripwax_ [0] (
01:35:13 Quit Aison ("( :: NoNameScript 3.72 :: )")
01:36:35*CheeseBurgerMan swipes your cheeseburgers to: ["Weird Al" Yankovic - The Saga Begins] - [ 00:05 / 05:28 ] - [ 44 kHz 160 kbps ]
01:36:53*stripwax_ wonders if stripwax == stripwax_ ... ?!
01:37:26stripwax_Trillian is a really dodgy IRC client..
01:37:29*CheeseBurgerMan wills stripwax's ping to time out so that stripwax_ can take his name... :P
01:37:42stripwax_other way round, no?
01:37:55CheeseBurgerManI don't think so.
01:38:00*HCl watches airwolf
01:38:01 Quit hicks (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:38:07HCli don't suppose any of you happen to have airwolf season 2 episodes
01:38:15*stripwax_ 's name shows up as 'stripwax' on his client anwyay..
01:38:18CheeseBurgerManif stripwax's ping times out, stripwax_ can change to stripwax
01:38:28CheeseBurgerManit shows up as "stripwax_" to me. ;)
01:38:33*stripwax_ boggles
01:38:54stripwax_trillian sucks.
01:39:17*CheeseBurgerMan uses mIRC
01:39:28CheeseBurgerManTrillian takes up too many resources.
01:39:40stripwax_whee, I can talk to stripwax_ and i get the same message on my client screen twice, once from stripwax and once from stripwax_ ! hahaha
01:40:44***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:40:45HClthat works, yea
01:46:16 Quit stripwax (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:47:39 Quit cYmen (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:48:27 Nick stripwax_ is now known as stripwax (
01:50:43stripwaxDoes anyone else see me in their userlists twice?
01:51:36CheeseBurgerManNot anymore.
01:53:05CheeseBurgerManYou're now unique.
01:53:45 Quit Moos (" HydraIRC -> <- The future of IRC")
01:53:52*lostlogic runs
02:04:06 Quit JAJDude ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
02:11:12 Part stripwax
03:27:20 Quit lostlogic (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:27:30 Join lostlogic [0] (
03:40:46***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:44:25 Quit BBub (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:04:27 Join amiconn_ [0] (
04:06:04 Join QT_ [0] (as@area51.users.madwifi)
04:12:59 Quit amiconn (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
04:13:00 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (
04:16:29 Quit QT (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
04:29:43 Join MO-Pantsu [0] (
04:48:01 Quit Rori (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
05:08:49 Join amiconn_ [0] (
05:12:22 Quit Rick (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
05:13:26 Join Rick [0] (
05:27:20 Quit amiconn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
05:27:21 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (
05:40:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:55:35 Join LinusN [0] (
07:03:26 Join tiegs [0] (
07:05:42tiegshi linus - are you familiar w ih120?
07:06:04tiegsi just got one and successfully patched rockbox...
07:10:07LinusNtiegs: i'm familiar with it
07:11:08LinusNit's like a little brother to me, i'm always picking on him :-)
07:11:09tiegswell, i have loaded and played stuff both w orig firmware and all is fine (no probs w rockbox install)
07:11:36LinusN(here it comes) sucks!!!!
07:11:49tiegsi just sat down to really get into the settings etc...i wanted to stop the scrolling of song titles
07:12:08LinusNwhile playing?
07:12:11tiegsso i was just mesing w some basic display settings etc..
07:12:30tiegsi am not sure if i was playing or not at the time..
07:12:47LinusNno, i wonder if you mean the song titles when playing music
07:12:51tiegsanyways, now the red power light is on but no buttons are working
07:13:20tiegsit is connected to pc also
07:13:29tiegsi do not want to remove it
07:13:43LinusNdo you have wma or non44-1khz wav files on the device?
07:13:46tiegsis it best to let the batteries run down and try ton recharge?
07:13:55tiegsi have .OGG
07:14:10LinusNanyway, just reset the device
07:14:13Ricktiegs: is there anything on the screen?
07:14:16tiegseverything was perfect...was testing the gapless playback title w time etc..all file info is on screen
07:14:53LinusNthen it doesn't matter if you remove it from the pc
07:15:00LinusNremove it and reset it
07:15:12LinusNthe player, not the pc :-)
07:15:16tiegsso just unplug USB? it doesnt even power off
07:15:21tiegshaha Linus
07:15:25LinusNi said reset do i do that please?
07:15:38LinusNthere is a tiny hole next to the usb connector
07:15:49tiegsok..i see that
07:15:55LinusNinsert a paper clip to puch the reset button inside
07:16:07Rickbe careful not to pop the button off :P
07:16:44LinusNthe paper clip should fit the hole precisely, don't use a too small one
07:16:55LinusNand absolutely not a needle
07:17:05tiegswow...that worked
07:17:23tiegsthank u so much..i thought i had fried the HD
07:17:25LinusNthe emergency eject pin that comes with CD-ROM players are usually perfect for this
07:18:04LinusNtiegs: it would be helpful if you could find out how you managed to hang it
07:18:09tiegswell, now i dont see files..i see the folder they are in but when i click the file nothing happens
07:19:19tiegsit's ok now
07:19:35tiegsi was messing w the scroll settings//.probably while playing
07:19:47tiegsshould i never adjust settings while playing?
07:20:06LinusNi wonder if it was the scroll or the .ogg file
07:20:28LinusNyou should be able to do anything while playing
07:20:36tiegsis there a way so that titles do not scroll at all?
07:20:51LinusNdesign your own wps screen
07:20:56tiegsthere are a few scrolling settings..not really sure what they all do
07:21:19tiegsshould that be done in rockbox?
07:21:54tiegsnow may i ask a very beyond basic and i am sure DUMB noob question?
07:24:02LinusNof course
07:25:19tiegsok..i just dont know if it is annoying to be asked moronic questions but i am new to this player (my 1st mp3 player actually) so here goes..
07:25:32tiegsi got the iriver so i could use rockbox for true gapless..
07:26:21tiegsnow say i want a particular artist and all albums chronoligical order...
07:26:50tiegsat the end of last sone of album 1, there is no pause before track 1 of album # 2 plays
07:27:03tiegssone= song/track
07:27:27LinusNyou want a pause between albums?
07:27:41tiegsnot sure if i should make a folder for an artist w several folders within that main artist folder for each album
07:28:03tiegsyes...a pause between albums, yet for the albums that require gapless i want the gapless to work
07:28:48LinusNit doesn't matter where you put the files, they will play gaplessly anyway
07:28:54tiegsi am thinking that last track album #1 goes directly to start of track #1 of album 2...since there is no gap inserted it is reading like a series of files
07:29:22tiegsso there is no way to do it?
07:29:41LinusNwell, rockbox will probably never have a feature to insert silence
07:30:18LinusNif you really want gaps between albums, you might try a little trick
07:30:23tiegsas a regular album w "songs" w breaks is played back (3 second pause or whatever) i want that same pause between each album
07:30:53LinusNencode an mp3 file with 3 seconds of silence
07:31:07LinusNand put it between the albums in the playlist
07:31:14tiegswell I just read the custom .wps page and am totally lost, so not sure how capable i am of tricks :)
07:31:21LinusNor have a copy of the file first in each album directory
07:31:36LinusNtiegs: look in the wps gallery
07:32:05LinusNuse one you like and remove all %s from the lines you don't want to scroll
07:33:20tiegsis that fior my "stop the scroll" wish?
07:37:53 Nick CheeseBurgerMan is now known as CBM-away (
07:37:53DBUGEnqueued KICK CBM-away
07:39:59tiegsone last dumb q...
07:40:51***No seen item changed, no save performed.
07:41:00tiegswhen you load you just drag them to the device or put them in "record" orm "audio" etc..can't i just drag them into the iriver so all the files are on the HD along w .rockbox etc..
07:41:11tiegswhat is best way to load stuff?
07:41:23LinusNyou can put them anywhere you like
07:41:53LinusNi suggest a directory hierarchy of artist/album/
07:42:04LinusNmaybe even genre/artist/album
07:42:13tiegsso an artist folder and album folders within the artist folder?
07:42:14LinusNdon't put anything in .rockbox
07:42:34LinusNtry not to have very many files in the same dir
07:42:54tiegsso you would have "The Beatles" folder - within that folder you would have folders for each album?
07:42:59LinusNvery many == more than 400
07:43:35LinusNnot that rockbox requires it, but it's convenient for browsing
07:43:42tiegsalso, to load latest bleeding edge - is it ok to download to desktop and replace the existing .rockbox folder?
07:43:51 Quit CBM-away (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
07:43:55LinusNtiegs: sure
07:44:11LinusNdon't forget the rockbox.iriver file
07:44:16tiegsit just replaces that w the most current correct?
07:44:19LinusNwhich is not in the .rockbox folder
07:44:51tiegsso the 2 folders/files needed to update are .rockbox and rockbox.iriver ?
07:45:04amiconnGood morning
07:45:16LinusNeasiest way is to extract the zip directly onto the iriver
07:45:19LinusNamiconn: morning
07:45:27tiegsthanks so much Linus - i have never patched any firmware before
07:45:40tiegsthebleeding edge .zip?
07:45:48tiegsthat contains everything i need?
07:46:03amiconnLinusN: You moved that wiki spam user to the Trash web, yet it is still linked from TWikiUsers. I don't think this is intended...
07:47:01LinusNamiconn: weird, i though i removed that too
07:48:06LinusNi think twiki lists all deleted users there
07:48:15LinusNverygoodsite is there too :-)
07:48:49LinusNtiegs: yes
07:49:09tiegsthanks for all the help Linus
07:49:12LinusNyou're welcome
07:50:50amiconnLinusN: AAAVeryGoodSite is not. I think all users deleted the normal way are (still) listed there.
07:51:04LinusNguess so
07:51:19amiconnYou'll need to delete it another way; I don't know how Bagder or Zagor did it
07:51:32LinusNmanually editing the password file
07:56:35 Quit tiegs ("CGI:IRC")
08:00:09 Join oxygen77 [0] (
08:10:06LinusNhi soldier
08:10:40SlasheriLinusN: Hmm, do you think should i change the crossfade setting from one bit to three bits in order to contain configured crossfade length in seconds or would it be better to create entirely a new configuration option "crossfade amount" for example?
08:11:11LinusNyou mean length in seconds where 0 means "off"?
08:11:22LinusNsounds good
08:11:29Slasherinice :)
08:12:26Slasherido i need to do anything special (like bumping up the config_block_version) if i change that from 1 bit to 3?
08:13:15LinusNyes, you must bump
08:13:19Slasheriah, ok
08:17:19amiconnSlasheri: If you bump the config block anyway, you cold do a pending change that wasn't done to avoid an extra bump
08:18:23amiconnresume (apps/settings.c line 201) now only needs one bit instead of two
08:21:19Slasheriamiconn: Hmm, sounds good. I can do it :)
08:23:58 Join Zoom2 [0] (
08:27:41LinusNSlasheri: in rebuffer_and_seek(), why do you reopen the file?
08:30:09 Quit Zoom2 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
08:36:06SlasheriLinusN: Hmm, that's because we don't know if the file has been already opened
08:36:32Slashericurrent_fd is the current file to be buffered, it might be even closed
08:37:30LinusNso we can avoid reopening the same file if we keep track of which file current_fd corresponds to
08:37:55LinusNopening a file can be a somewhat costly operation
08:38:08Slasheriyes, hmm. in fact we could check if track_ridx == track_widx
08:38:09 Nick QT_ is now known as QT (as@area51.users.madwifi)
08:38:35Slasherithen if current_fd is defined too, we don't need to repoen the file
08:38:48LinusNin fact, the current design of the id3 functions could be made smarter, so it could work on an already opened file
08:39:12LinusNtoday, each file is opened twice
08:39:23LinusNeven the archos suffers from this
08:51:36 Quit gromit` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
08:51:37 Join gromit`` [0] (~gromit`
09:02:21CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
09:02:21*LinusN tries the win32 sim playback, it stutters like hell
09:21:33*amiconn is trying to improve UART boot documentation
09:23:17*LinusN is reading it
09:23:51 Quit Strath ("Client closed")
09:23:55amiconnPlayer pictures are not yet added...
09:24:12LinusNand no fm
09:26:19amiconnOnly Jrg could add FM and Ondio info
09:27:02amiconnFor FM, there's at least the short paragraph where to find the needed pads
09:27:38 Join Maxime [0] (
09:32:39 Join Strath [0] (
09:32:47amiconnMeh, I need to convert the "Disassembling the archos" articles to wiki, because I need to add some info...
09:33:32LinusNhave fun! :-)
09:33:56amiconnBtw, do you think pages that are converted should be taken out from the www/ cvs module?
09:36:09amiconnSome totally unrelated hints, concerning
09:36:35LinusNyes, some day we should remove stuff from the www cvs module
09:36:48amiconn(1) On I think it should read "Advanced Systems" (missing 'd')
09:37:25amiconn(2) On I think the info about rockbox could be updated include the Ondio and maybe also the iriver already
09:39:11*LinusN finds no "Advance Systems" in do.html
09:40:07amiconnThe last box in the right column...
09:40:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:41:34 Quit Maxime ()
09:42:24*LinusN is blind
09:42:24 Nick Lynx_awy is now known as Lynx_ (
09:43:48LinusNfixed, thx
09:44:55*LinusN just received a job application by email, a guy looking for a job at Haxx :-)
09:48:46 Join Harpy [0] (
09:50:36 Join DJ_Dooms_Day [0] (
10:04:42 Quit Harpy ("Changing server")
10:08:58amiconnLinusN: Archos disassembling info wikified :)
10:17:46 Join ashridah [0] (
10:35:08 Quit Strath ("Client closed")
10:57:53 Join Maxime [0] (
11:05:21amiconnLinusN: UART boot pics and short description for player is there :)
11:08:20 Join preglow [0] (
11:09:16LinusNamiconn: interesting solution to the pulldown problem
11:09:59preglowwhy no silence adding in rockbox? should be really trivial to implement, and people would use it
11:10:10preglowinsane people, that is
11:10:39LinusNthis guy wanted pauses between albums
11:10:44amiconnLinusN: Yes, el cheapo solution. Otherwise you would need a triple switch...
11:11:10preglowahh, albums
11:11:55amiconnI added a red warning now...
11:13:09preglowargh, need to go
11:13:12 Quit preglow (Client Quit)
11:16:06 Join webguest40 [0] (
11:16:09 Join Lear [0] (
11:16:53webguest40hey everyone
11:17:03LearAnyone who knows the execution time for the movclr instruction? :)
11:18:21Leardoesn't include movclr... at least, I can't find it using the search function...
11:18:32LinusNwhat is movclr?
11:18:59Learhm... maybe that datasheet doesn't cover the emac...
11:18:59 Quit webguest40 (Client Quit)
11:19:16Learmove from mac accumulator and clear it.
11:22:22LearHm.. what's the difference between the 5249 and the 5249L coldfire?
11:22:46 Quit oxygen77 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
11:23:04 Join oxygen77 [0] (
11:24:20LinusNLear: i don't think moveclr takes any longer than a normal move from acc
11:24:57 Join MrStaticVoid [0] (
11:25:03Learyeah, I think so too, but I'd like to know for sure. I mean, it actually sets three things to zero (acc, accext and macsr)...
11:26:19 Quit MrStaticVoid (Client Quit)
11:26:42 Join cYmen [0] (
11:28:26LinusNLear: where have you seen 5249L?
11:28:41LearOn :)
11:28:49LinusNafaik, the 5249L is the QFP package
11:29:05Learah, ok
11:29:10LinusNand 5249V is BGA
11:29:31LinusNthe qfp version is slower
11:29:36LinusNmax 129mhz
11:30:41amiconnThe good thing (for ac) is that the 5250 is QFP, not BGA
11:30:54amiconnNo need to slaughter an X5 to trace the board
11:32:06Learqfp, that's with legs along the edges? (I know what bga is...)
11:32:24LinusNamiconn: yes
11:32:31LinusNLear: yes
11:32:58amiconnLinusN: Different thing - did you test the lcd transfer loop with trapf instead of nop?
11:33:10LinusNah, no i forgot
11:33:22Slasherii hope the cpu never burns from my iriver because BGAs are verry difficult to replace..
11:33:34LinusNSlasheri: hehe
11:33:50LinusNit will burn if you connect the wrong charger
11:34:37 Quit Maxime (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:34:38amiconnLinusN: We will also need at least partial schematics of the H3x0
11:34:55LinusNamiconn: yes, i am buying a broken 320 for this purpose
11:35:26amiconnAh. Do you think it's necessary to strip a board for this purpose, as you did with the H1x0?
11:35:57LinusNthat's why i'm buying a broken one
11:36:05LinusNi have a functional one
11:36:11LearBtw, I started a runtime test yesterday. With lame −−aps (~180 kbps) and "ideal" conditions, I got a (saved) runtime of 15h 50m. Pretty good...
11:36:35LearThat's on an H140...
11:36:37*amiconn usually gets significantly shorter runtimes
11:37:01amiconnThat's because of the many USB connects and tests. I usually get 6..8 hours
11:37:14LinusNsame here
11:37:46amiconnI also get significantly shorter runtimes than expected on my recorder V1. I was not yet able to track down the problem :(
11:37:51 Join XavierGr [0] (
11:38:24*Lear did say ideal conditions...
11:39:32LearThis was with straight playback, no skipping, very little backlight (just checking the runtime a few times).
11:40:46 Join Aison [0] (
11:40:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:42:06XavierGrhi all!
11:43:29XavierGrLinusN I just finished with my build. I posted it on MR (waits moderation until is posted) in the Rockbox forum.
11:43:47XavierGrDid you got my e-mail from yestaerday?
11:43:50 Quit cYmen (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:43:52LinusNyes i got it
11:44:03XavierGrdid you tried it?
11:45:18LinusNdidn't see an executable in the zip archive
11:45:36LinusNonly the .rockbox folder
11:45:49 Join cYmen [0] (
11:46:02XavierGrmy god what have I done!!! I am a fool
11:46:18LinusNbesides, i prefer source code patches rather than executables
11:47:08XavierGrWell I have made many change to many files. Do you want the .c and .h files?
11:47:19LinusNno, i want a patch
11:47:59XavierGr:( I will try to make one though I will not promise if I can. There are 8-10 files that I altered
11:49:24XavierGryes I have read it. I will try again. I remember that I had made one for a single file (snake2.c)
11:50:23XavierGrWhich by the way snake2.c has still the hiscore bug. I will send you a patch with all changes including these.
11:50:47amiconnLear: I tried to build a win32 sim with sound, however, linking fails :(
11:51:19LinusNamiconn: -lwinmm
11:51:34LinusNin the Makefile in your build dir
11:51:41LearYes, sorry, forgot about that one...
11:51:46amiconnHmm. Does configure take care of it now?
11:52:00LearI guess I should commit that. :)
11:52:30XavierGrhmmm have to sleep I stayed all night awake to have the remote support (at least for me) ready
11:52:56LinusNamiconn: the configure script is where you add it permanently i guess
11:52:58XavierGrGood morning to everyone (it is getting launchtime here)!
11:53:29LinusNLear: win32 sound playback stutters here :-(
11:54:44Learlinusn: that's one wine? or the real deal?
11:54:51 Quit XavierGr ()
11:54:52LinusNreal deal
11:55:11LearBtw, stutter as in between each 32 kbyte block, or once in a while?
11:55:19LinusNonce in a while
11:55:29LinusNpretty often really
11:55:50LinusNstops for a fraction of a second now and then
11:55:53Learthen I'd try tuning the "CLOCKS_PER_SEC / 200" stuff in thread-win32. Try with "/ 100".
11:56:09LinusNi have tried every possible combination there :-)
11:56:27Learincluding never sleep?
11:56:46Learstrange. beats me...
11:56:59LinusNcould be another process stealing cpu
11:57:41Learhow fast is the computer?
11:57:59amiconnAlmost no stuttering here, even when running on battery
11:58:11amiconn(meaning <600 MHz)
11:59:30amiconnThere are 2 things that occasionally make it drop out (once): The loopback at repeat, and when loading windows with other stuff, like dragging larger windows around
12:00:40amiconnSame thing happens with the X11 sim
12:10:10amiconnLear: The -lwinmm parameter should be added to the generated Makefile by configure imho
12:11:03LearPerhaps, but does it hurt in any way?
12:12:18Learsorry.. :)
12:12:18 Quit Seed (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
12:12:29 Join Seed [0] (
12:37:00 Join Moos [0] (
12:48:22 Nick Aison is now known as usa-sucks-lol (
12:56:34LearAh, vorbisgain works in the simulator. I guess a delay of 5-10 seconds before a settings change becomes effective is okay? Or should I delay it to the next track?
12:57:41crwlsettings change, you mean changing from track gain to album gain or additional gain setting or something like that?
12:58:18Learyes, like that.
12:58:38 Join edx__ [0] (
12:59:14crwlwell, most PC players need playback restart or track change for those...
12:59:35crwli'd say a delay is better than absolute need for track change
13:00:59*amiconn wonders who might use all this gain stuff
13:01:04Learand with a smaller pcm buffer, the delay becomes smaller
13:01:07crwlamiconn, me
13:01:24*Lear wonders how one can even use a dap without some sort of replaygain... :)
13:01:28crwlright :)
13:01:36amiconnI never used it and never missed it
13:01:48crwlright now, using a playlist made of several albums in shuffle mode (or something like that) is major pain in the ass
13:01:51crwlconstant need to fiddle the volume
13:02:11amiconnHmm? I don't need to do that...
13:02:14Learcrwl: exactly. that's what replaygain fixes.
13:02:17crwlLear, yes
13:02:24crwland that's why everyone needs it ;)
13:02:52*amiconn still doesn't understand
13:02:55crwlamiconn, there are huge differences in album volumes
13:03:15amiconnI never encountered this...
13:03:18Learespecially if you compare albums from today from e.g. 10-15 years ago...
13:03:27CoCoLUSthere sure is a difference, but it's never huge enough to be anoying, for me
13:03:28crwlmost pop/rock nowadays gets maybe around -9 ... -6 dB volume adjustment values, but there are many (especially older ones) that get -3 ... +1
13:03:33Learsingles collections are especially bad here...
13:03:34crwland there's a huge difference then
13:03:51amiconnBtw, I know what the replaygain stuff does, it's just that my albums only show minor differences in volume
13:03:53Learsome albums need -15 dB.
13:04:04amiconn...and these are from a >>10 years range
13:04:05Learwhat kind of albums do you have then? :)
13:04:18crwl-15, ugh :)
13:04:29amiconnPop, rock, electronic, trance....
13:04:30Learah, so they're from before the compression fad started...
13:04:39crwlone of the loudest ones i remember is the red hot chili peppers' californication
13:04:41Learer, no, read that wrong...
13:04:57amiconnFrom 1960s up to present
13:05:06 Quit edx (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
13:05:14crwlone good example is nick cave & the bad seeds, there are albums with about zero gain and then some with almost -10 dB
13:05:16Learthe (cd) mastering year is more important...
13:05:30crwleasy to blast ears with those when album changes
13:06:58MO-PantsuCUE file and ReplayGain support would be cool
13:06:59amiconnI'm not sure about the mastering years, but at least some of them are <1990
13:07:53 Nick edx__ is now known as edx (
13:08:27 Join hicks [0] (
13:10:08MO-Pantsueverything these days is compressed and pushed to the point of clipping
13:10:17amiconnImho cuefiles are a workaround for a non-existing problem
13:10:26Learbeyond clipping most of the time, really...
13:10:33 Join Febs [0] (
13:10:34crwli've never understood that CUE file thing myself either
13:10:55crwli guess it's just for stupid compression formats that can't do gapless, or maybe stupid players
13:11:15amiconnI know what they do, but imho it is way easier and straightforward to have the tracks as single files
13:11:39amiconnYOu can always split/ join at will, so what?
13:12:01MO-PantsuCUE files are also for burning
13:12:11MO-Pantsuso you retain the track changes
13:12:23amiconnI retain them without cue files
13:12:37amiconnJust rip the tracks as single .wav files
13:12:57MO-PantsuBut I have a lot of big MP3 and APE files with CUE files. It might not be required for newer stuff but CUE file support for my back catalog would be nice
13:13:04MO-PantsuI don't hold the CD's for these
13:13:16amiconnYou can split them for player use
13:13:21DJ_Dooms_DayI cut them all up. All 4200 of my songs have the full ID3 tags done, manually. :/ Fuck its tiring :P
13:13:26MO-Pantsuthen introduce a potential gap?
13:13:49MO-Pantsugapless is still not perfect for non-Lame MP3's
13:13:56amiconnNot when played sequentially, and when played in different order, a tiny gap doesn't hurt
13:14:03MO-Pantsuyes it does
13:14:10MO-Pantsufor me I listen to a lot of dance ixes
13:14:18DJ_Dooms_DayAny of you guys good with soundforge by any chance?
13:14:26amiconnMO-Pantsu: *Not when played sequentially*
13:14:54MO-PantsuI'd have to test that
13:15:16crwli just encode to ogg vorbis or flac myself... :P
13:15:17MO-Pantsuand I'd need a MP3 using CUE file splitter prog
13:16:00amiconnIf you experience gaps while playing mp3s encoded from a mix album, either the encoding or the player is crap
13:16:00MO-Pantsuyes it's OK for encoding but for existing 'copyright infringing' MP3's it's not
13:16:51MO-PantsuAll I am saying is I have a lot of existing non-Lame MP3 rips with CUE files I got off the net ;)
13:16:58amiconnYou can split a long mp3 directly, without reencoding and hence without quality loss
13:17:12MO-PantsuI will have to test it
13:17:31amiconn..and that doesn't introduce any gaps with a decent player (i.e. not iriver firmware)
13:17:32MO-Pantsuit's not a big deal really
13:17:53MO-PantsuI am sure someone will create an addon at some point
13:17:54amiconnI think cuesheet support would introduce a lot of problems
13:18:08MO-Pantsuas a plugin it might be ok
13:18:10amiconnHow to deal with tags?
13:18:35amiconnID3 tags are the same for the whole file, so you can't display individual track names
13:19:09amiconnMaybe there is some info in the cuesheet, but then the next question is which info takes precedence
13:19:12MO-Pantsujust override song and artist info to the display with the current cue track
13:19:35MO-Pantsuit's not that hard (Though might be hard to program I dunno)
13:19:41amiconn...and another question is how to synchronise the display with the current (virtual) track
13:19:47 Join uski [0] (uski@
13:20:09amiconnYou don't get the info from the playback engine, as there is really only one file
13:20:14MO-Pantsuhave it as a toggle
13:20:44MO-PantsuYou only need the bitrate etc info from the file and track name from the cue
13:21:01amiconnYes, but how do you decide when to display which track info?
13:21:08uskiguess what, i have my archos back, so I will be here, annoying people, again.
13:21:27MO-PantsuI can't see the problem myself. Programmers always find problems I can't see :)
13:21:56amiconnMO-Pantsu: I mean, how does the wps know when the (cuesheet-internal) track change happens?
13:22:04MO-PantsuI see it simplistically. It just reads the cue and makes a note of the track change points and reads the track name to the display at that time index
13:22:40MO-Pantsuthe cue plugin overrides the wps but then I don't know how your wps works so it's meaningless
13:22:49Learamiconn: you have the same problem if support for chained oggs are added...
13:23:30MO-Pantsufor cue you'd need a wps override methinks
13:23:42amiconnLear: Maybe. I don't know that much about oggs, and I'm not sure whether this kind of support is desired/ feasible/ possible
13:24:03MO-Pantsuit's just something to ponder
13:24:13MO-PantsuI want other things first
13:24:23MO-Pantsulike remote lcd functionality
13:24:32MO-Pantsuand radio and recording ;)
13:24:40amiconnYes, get all current rockbox features working on iriver...
13:24:51MO-Pantsuanything else can wait
13:25:19Leara chained ogg is one file that contains multiple songs, with tags for each song. A single mp3 with a cue file is very much like that...
13:25:43MO-Pantsueven that rockboy etc stuff could have waited but people wanted to work on it...which is fine....everyone does what they like which is what is so great about the project
13:26:13MO-Pantsuno need for chained ogg
13:26:37MO-Pantsusince ogg is naturally gapless
13:26:53Learyay, works on target too. :)
13:27:06amiconnThere are some other things that might get tricky, like ogg/flac
13:27:40MO-PantsuI may just convert all my ape to wavpack
13:27:50MO-Pantsusince it's lossless
13:27:58MO-Pantsuthere is no problem doing so
13:28:27MO-Pantsualthough the sizes may increase a bit
13:28:58MO-PantsuI tend to rip ape to ogg now anyhow
13:29:02MO-Pantsufor the player
13:29:30Learno "clip prevention" though. that'll be a separate thing...
13:29:48MO-PantsuI hate clip
13:30:21MO-PantsuI used to do stuff in a studio and the producer was always clipping our recordings. He pissed me off
13:30:38Learusually, just applying the gain reduces clipping, so it is still a step in the right direction...
13:30:52MO-PantsuYou end up with this DAT way into the red
13:31:29MO-PantsuThere was 1 DAT that the audio would actually cut out because it was too high. Never did recover that recording. Wish I could go back and shoot that dude.
13:33:31uskia question: is there still some work done for "classic" archos platforms, or is the work now concentrated toward porting rockbox to iriver (well, finishing the port)
13:33:51MO-Pantsuwhatever people want to work on
13:33:59uskii'm kinda loss, i wasn't here for several months, and i don't know at all what changed since
13:34:02Lynx_I there an effort to port to iFP devices?
13:34:03uskiok ;)
13:34:09MO-Pantsuthere is no timetable or priority
13:34:27MO-Pantsuanyone wants to pickup work on any part can do so
13:35:08MO-Pantsubut a lot of folks are into the iRiver thing right now so that's seeing more done than other stuff for the moment
13:35:52uskii just received a recorder 20, and i am in the process of repairing it
13:36:07uskionce it's repaired, i'll be able to work on rockbox
13:37:55MO-PantsuI can't figure out why my SPDIF on my soundcard keeps dropping out
13:38:14MO-PantsuIt keeps setting itself to 48Khz
13:38:24MO-Pantsuso when I playback 44Khz PCM it won't play
13:38:32MO-PantsuI have to reset it all the time
13:38:46MO-Pantsuit's usually after playing some MP3 in Winamp
13:39:03MO-PantsuOr Ogg
13:39:21MO-Pantsuannoying bug
13:39:34MO-PantsuNot a bad audio card otherwise
13:39:42MO-PantsuM-Audio Revolution 7.1
13:40:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:41:55MO-PantsuHas ASIO support which is why I got it.
13:44:01LinusNMO-Pantsu: i have a suggestion
13:44:15uskihmmm, try to report the bug, even if there is no chance that it will get solved one day
13:44:22LinusNdo you have an optical output from the sound card?
13:44:56uskiooo LinusN ! (I am sure you don't remember me :'()
13:45:01Leartried the prodigy drivers? :)
13:45:05LinusNuski: i do
13:45:12uskiwo00t ! :)
13:45:19uskilong time
13:45:22uski(no see)
13:46:04uskiremember my bad adventure with the flash chip replacement ? i received yesterday an archos with a small problem , i am attempting to repair it
13:46:20uskii will eventually end up with a working recorder 20 \o/
13:46:52uskii am using an archos gmini 400; i was not able to find what was the CPU/µC behind it
13:47:26MO-PantsuNo optical out on the card no
13:47:46uskiLinusN, why an optical output should help him ?
13:47:55MO-Pantsuand even if I did I would need a long optical cable
13:48:08LinusNmy suggestion was to connect the iriver
13:48:18LinusNand use my s/pdif analyzer
13:48:57uskia spdif analyzer ? it's a program or some hardware ?
13:49:13LinusNa debug menu option in rockbox
13:49:22MO-Pantsuwhat I tend to have to do is close winamp and then force it from 48khz back to 44khz output
13:49:33MO-Pantsuin the soundcard control panel
13:49:50ashridahLinusN: reminds me. did someone named 'meep' talk to you the other day?
13:49:51uskii have to try the new daily build of rockbox... it seems to be full of new features !!! brb, need to heat up the soldering iron :]
13:50:02LinusNashridah: hmm, no
13:50:09MO-Pantsuit never used to do it though so it might just be that xp needs a clean install
13:50:17LinusNuski: the spdif analyzer is iriver only
13:50:24uskiok :'(
13:50:34uskii think i understand why
13:50:44uski(no direct access to the spdif port)
13:50:50uski(in archos platforms)
13:51:01uskithe old problem with the archos units...
13:51:02amiconnThe mas can also tell something about the spdif signal it receives
13:51:38uskireally ? maybe i can write a spdif analyzer for archoses then ;)
13:51:41LinusNamiconn: yes
13:51:41uskireading the MAS registers
13:51:50ashridahLinusN: okay. i'll summarise the situation. he had a H140. was previously a rockbox user on archos a while back. He built himself a patched .hex file using fwpatcher (went to version 1.65, possibly US, i don't know, was originally on 1.60), and half-way through the patching process, the screen got filled with random characters. eventually, he had to reset the device, and the firmware flash appears to have worked (it booted rockbox,
13:51:50ashridah and the iriver device seemed to be working with iriver's firmware (enough to get usb mode working at least).
13:51:55LinusNsure, it's better than nothing
13:52:05ashridahso uh. yeah. near miss with a bricked unit imho
13:52:32amiconnDSP register 0x56: S/PDIF Input Channel Status Bits
13:52:35ashridahbut you might want to test out upgrading from a stock 1.60 firmware to 1.65 patched, see if we can't reproduce it (i told him to keep the .hex he used, perhaps it didn't get copied cleanly across)
13:52:52LinusNashridah: i'll try it
13:52:57uskiamiconn, ok. i have to read the DS anyway to see the meaning of each bit
13:53:15uskias soon as i'll have a working unit i'll try to do something with this register
13:53:25uskiback to the soldering iron. see you later :)
13:53:27amiconnuski: The bits aren't explained there
13:53:30ashridahit seems odd to me tho, the firmware flashing screen in iriver's firmware is an image
13:53:38ashridahso i can't imagine why it'd have been printing characters, not static.
13:53:39uskiamiconn, ok, then i'll find the meaning myself ;)
13:53:46uski(at least, i'll try to)
13:53:54amiconnI have a linux header file describing some of the channel status bits, but I'm not sure whether the mapping is 1:1
13:53:58uskior maybe i can ask micronas, who knows, maybe they'll answer
13:54:45uskibrb, see you later
13:54:48 Quit uski ("brb")
14:00:34LinusNamiconn: how much have you played with that register?
14:01:53amiconnNot much, as I have almost no s/pdif equipment. I did test the parity error bit, and made an experimental patch using that
14:02:01amiconnDo you still have that patch?
14:02:21amiconnOh, btw, while doing these experiments I found that the register number in the datasheet is wrong.
14:02:27amiconnIt's 0x52, not 0x56
14:02:39Slasherihmm, errors.. fixing
14:03:06LinusNno i don't have it
14:03:19Slasheriups, forget to commit two files :)
14:03:22LinusNbut i recall that the parity was there
14:03:58amiconnSlasheri the sim breaker ;)
14:07:07LinusNamiconn: thx
14:08:11LinusNamiconn: are you sure it is the parity bit?
14:08:39LinusNi would have guessed it is the Validity bit
14:10:01 Join RotAtoR [0] (
14:14:42amiconnLinusN: Maybe this is called validity bit somewhere else, but Micronas calls it parity bit here:
14:24:20 Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:37:57 Join Yokalosh [0] (
14:44:24 Join uski [0] (uski@
14:44:42uskii can't believe how the archoses hardware is low quality
14:45:17uskii had a short because of one of the battery connector was in contact with the chassis; there is only a 1mm gap
14:47:20uskiwhere do i download the firmware_flash.rock plugin ? i finally have a flashable archos \o/
14:49:11uskiwhoops, it's provided with rockbox. sorry, i'm a bit rusty
14:50:40 Nick usa-sucks-lol is now known as Aison (
14:50:50uskiflashed ! \o/
14:52:14 Quit Yokalosh ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
14:54:21 Quit DJ_Dooms_Day (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
15:18:23 Quit uski (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
15:24:39 Quit HCl ("Lost terminal")
15:26:53 Join hcl [0] (
15:26:58 Nick hcl is now known as HCl (
15:28:04 Quit Seed (Nick collision from services.)
15:28:12 Join Seed [0] (
15:32:27 Join preglow [0] (
15:33:38preglowhi all
15:36:15 Join zer0 [0] (
15:36:22 Join R3nTiL [0] (
15:40:56***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:42:51 Join webguest89 [0] (
15:43:25webguest89is lame mp3 officially gapless ?
15:45:53ashridahmp3 in general is never going to be truely gapless
15:46:01preglowno, but lame mp3s can be
15:46:04ashridahthere are hacks, but it's a fundamental issue with the framing mp3 does
15:46:51preglowwebguest89: i made the lame gapless code in rockbox, and it wasnt working 100% when i left it, as far as i know, nothing more has been done to it
15:47:02preglowbut it seems to work ok
15:48:40 Join webguest99 [0] (
15:49:08webguest99Is there any reason we're not going to see gapless mp3 for non-lame mp3s?
15:49:30Learyes, and it's called padding
15:49:35preglowyes, they cant ever be perfectly gapless
15:49:46preglowsomeone should toss the answer to this into some faq
15:49:56webguest99Why can't the extranous bits be shaved off after decoding?
15:50:03preglownon-lame mp3s dont contain the exact song length
15:50:04Learwhen encoding, the source must be padded to an even multiple (due to the maths involved), and the amount of padding isn't stored anywhere.
15:50:09preglowso we dont know how much to remove
15:50:23webguest99Can't you just look at the samples?
15:50:32preglowwell, explain us how, then
15:50:34preglowit's not trivial
15:50:34webguest99And figure out where the song stopped, and the bogus data started
15:50:41preglowhow do you tell it's bogus?
15:50:46webguest99Well I'm asking
15:50:51preglowso am i :-)
15:50:52webguest89thanks preglow
15:50:52webguest99Other programs seem capable of doing it
15:50:53Learno, because we can't tell what is padded and what isn't (the sond could end with silence...)
15:51:17Learyeah, by cheating and cutting all zero samples...
15:51:21preglowthe data that's tacked on doesn't look bogus
15:51:26 Quit R3nTiL ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
15:51:27preglowit looks like perfectly valid data
15:51:39webguest99Is there anything wrong with cutting of zero samples?
15:51:53webguest99In, say, the last half second
15:52:18preglowin most of my music, the last half second contains music
15:52:25preglowi'd hate for that to be cut away
15:52:27Learnot as such, I guess, but you don't know if they where intentional or not...
15:52:33webguest99I was talking zero samples
15:52:38preglowso i see
15:52:52preglowi also have albums that contain zero samples at the end of the track, i want to keep that
15:53:13webguest99What's the maximum amount of padding, time-wise?
15:53:33preglowwe dont want to cut data thats zero, really, unless the track ends with silence, in which case gapless playback isnt really important, the data you need to cut isnt zero
15:53:57 Join kellyo [0] (
15:54:11preglowthe max amount is less than one mp3 frame, i'd guess
15:54:13 Quit zer0 (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
15:54:23webguest99How long can that be, roughly?
15:54:24preglowsomething around 1151 samples
15:55:23webguest99"the data you need to cut isnt zero" then I'm confused as to how other programs manage to do it by cutting zero samples
15:55:42preglowthey cut data that tends towards zero
15:55:55preglowthe data you need to cut usually goes towards zero
15:56:54webguest99I'm just confused that other programs manage, yet it seems so categorically to be declared impossible for rockbox
15:57:15preglowit's impossible to do _exactly_
15:57:23preglowand approximation is possible
15:57:32preglowi dont really care about it, so i dont know exactly how it's done
15:57:40ashridahparticularly if you've got a mountain of cpu power
15:57:54preglowi don't believe it's very expensive
15:58:49preglowbut again, i don't care about it, and thus far i'm the only one that's tried to make mp3 gapless
15:59:11preglowand that by supporting lame only gapless
16:00:45webguest99I've no problem with that. That noone's cared about it enough to do it is understandable. I was just confused why it was deemed impossible
16:01:22preglowsure, it's possible to cut away something of the data, there are tons of winamp plugins around that try this
16:01:58preglowfeel free to work out how they do it, if it's not too cpu intensive, it 's very probable it'll end up in the mpeg codec
16:02:38LearI'd recommend the dsp, as long as the codec can tell when it is on the last data chunk...
16:03:07preglowsure, that too is possible
16:03:31preglowand as long as the mechanism isn't in any case specific to how mp3 codes its data
16:03:54Learlooking for zeroes looks generic enough...
16:04:05webguest99It's not that I'm demanding anyone to start working on this or anything close. But I've seen/heard it done "good enough" multiple places, so reading that it's impossible confused me
16:04:22webguest99Well apparently looking for zeroes is not what you want, according to preglow
16:04:31Mooshi preglow, Mr. codec come back :D
16:04:33preglowlike i said, you're not looking for zero, you're looking for data that WAS zero before it was encoded
16:04:35preglowit wont be zero afterwards
16:04:50preglowmoos: hi, don't welcome me back just yet, i can't do any code for a while :/
16:04:56Learbut close to zero?
16:05:20preglownot necesserily
16:05:23preglowbut usually
16:06:26Moospreglow :just pleasure to relistening you a bit :D
16:06:56preglowanyway, someone has coded a gap remover, so someone knows of good ways
16:07:23*webguest89 goes to find somne
16:07:27preglowmore than one person has been praising a winamp plugin that does this
16:07:33 Quit ashridah (Remote closed the connection)
16:07:38 Join ashridah [0] (
16:08:30webguest99I'm pretty sure that xmms and mpd can do it as well
16:08:49preglowvery probably
16:10:30webguest99Anyway, what I was commenting on was the impression that it was impossible. That it's hard (if it is), tedious, or that people don't care about it, I have nothing to say about at all, obviously
16:11:05preglowwell, impossible it's not, but i wont be doing it until someone tells me how, at least
16:11:12preglowgot plenty of other tasty code i want to do on my plate
16:11:22webguest99Of course
16:11:30preglowbut now i gotta go, see y'all later
16:11:41 Quit preglow ("CGI:IRC")
16:11:53webguest99I'm not going to try and tell anyone what to do
16:14:01 Join arfo____ [0] (
16:14:43webguest99or complain about not doing what I'd like to see - I don't even care much for gapless mp3
16:18:38MO-Pantsupreglow it was me who was going on about winamps gapless method. I don't know if it's 'the best' but it's totally seamless for me. I never hear the join.
16:20:08MO-Pantsuthe current gapless on rockbox is good enough for now
16:20:23MO-Pantsuat least it beats iriver's own fw
16:20:48 Quit ashridah ("sleep")
16:21:16MO-PantsuI am more concerned about someone getting the remote lcd working as a proper file browser etc to be honest
16:25:59 Part LinusN
16:28:50 Part webguest89
16:40:56 Quit Lear ("Chatzilla [Firefox 1.0.5/20050715]")
16:42:49 Part arfo____
16:50:13 Quit webguest99 ("CGI:IRC")
16:58:55 Quit oxygen77 ("CGI:IRC")
17:01:22 Join Zagor [0] (
17:01:34Mode"#rockbox +o Zagor " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
17:01:39Topic"Rockbox - Coolest firmware around" by Zagor (foobar@Zagor.sustaining.supporter.pdpc)
17:02:17Mode"#rockbox -o Zagor " by Zagor (foobar@Zagor.sustaining.supporter.pdpc)
17:09:49 Join psy-Dead [0] (
17:10:04psy-Deadanyone here know what the point in "anti skip protection" is?
17:10:15psy-Deadon a HDD based jukebox it seems silly
17:10:38psy-Deadi thought it was declared obsolete, but its been added to iriver
17:10:42Zagorit was originally a debug thing we added to see if it helped some people who got gaps during refill
17:11:02Zagorthe theory was that sometimes the disk spinup and read would take longer than normal due to shaking etc
17:11:08psy-Deadi heard talk of removing it a while ago
17:11:11psy-Deadnow its been ported
17:11:43Zagori also think it should be removed
17:11:55Zagori too*
17:15:15Slasheripsy-Dead: that is needed. If you are for example walking with the player on your pocket, it cannot access the disk. So if you set the anti skip protection to for example 5 minutes, there will be no skip if the player can access the disk during that period
17:15:47amiconnSlasheri: Did you actually experience that?
17:15:51Slasheriamiconn: yes
17:15:53Slasherimany times
17:15:57psy-Deadon iriver?
17:16:06Slasheriwhen i stopped walking, then the playback almost immediately continues
17:16:15psy-DeadI've yet to see that
17:16:36Slasherieven a very small vibration to the unit is enough to prevent the hdd access..
17:16:43kellyohello- could anyone possibly lend a hand installing bleeding edge updates?
17:17:03amiconnOn archos, which has to rebuffer much more often, I keep anti-skip always at zero, and I've never had that problem except in artificial experiments
17:17:21Moosnow the min is 3 sec
17:17:23Zagori say we need more research on this. the 1.8" disks are quite rugged and not very sensitive to vibration
17:17:36amiconn...meaning you have to shake the unit relatively violently *and* continuously to prevent rebuffering
17:17:56Zagorsounds almost like a loose connection or something
17:18:06amiconnI would think an 1.8" HD is even less susceptible to vibration than a 2.5" HD
17:18:18Zagoramiconn: absolutely
17:18:45amiconnIt is *not* necessarily less susceptible to shock, like I had to experience :(
17:19:53amiconnSlasheri: You provide no zero setting for anti-skip? :(
17:20:12Moosyes 3 sec minimum :(
17:20:43Moos*5 sec
17:20:45 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (
17:20:48Slasheriamiconn: nope, anti skip cannot be zero because the hdd spinup takes some time. And if crossfade is disable, the pcm buffer is not long enough for that
17:21:10amiconnBtw, zero anti-skip on archos still means there is some margin. The anti-skip setting is an addition to the normal low watermark
17:21:15ZagorSlasheri: hdd spinup is calculated and added to anti-skip. or is that removed now?
17:21:28SlasheriZagor: Hmm, interesting..
17:21:31[IDC]Dragonhi guys
17:21:32Slasherii didn't know about that
17:21:36amiconnhello to Hanover
17:21:42Slasheribut i think it's currently ignored
17:21:44psy-Deadami - i thought it filled the ram as much as possible anyway
17:21:51psy-Deadisnt THAT aniskip in itself?
17:21:56[IDC]Dragonsome news from the MAS wav codec
17:22:03amiconnyay! :)
17:22:04Zagorpsy-Dead: no it's not. it's just buffering
17:22:18[IDC]DragonI now have the official letter from Micronas
17:22:20Zagoranti-skip is reading data from disk X seconds before necessary
17:22:46[IDC]Dragonthat we're allowed to use it as long as we still copyright it
17:23:09Zagor[IDC]Dragon: "we still copyright it"?
17:23:15psy-Deadwhere does the rockbox agreement fit in with that?
17:23:39[IDC]Dragonwe keep it marked as Micronas copyright
17:23:53[IDC]Dragon(it's their code)
17:24:00Zagorah, ok. well sure, anything else would be stealing.
17:24:15amiconn[IDC]Dragon: Is it available as source, or binary only?
17:24:21[IDC]Dragonbinary only
17:24:36amiconnHmm, then we might have a problem with the GPL here :/
17:25:08[IDC]Dragontreat it as initialization values
17:25:20amiconnOkay, maybe not. At last this is MAS code, not SH1 code, and we just need it to transfer into the MAS
17:25:36[IDC]Dragonyes, not part of our software
17:26:11[IDC]Dragonnow I'm waiting for the delivery :-/
17:26:49amiconnOn which MAS types does it work?
17:26:57[IDC]Dragonthe recorder
17:27:17[IDC]Dragondunno about Ondio SP
17:27:39[IDC]Dragonbut definitely not Studio
17:27:59amiconnI would think such a codec could potentially work on all MAS35xx
17:28:20amiconnThe DSP core is identical, just the amount of RAM and the interfaces are different
17:28:44[IDC]Dragonfor the 3507, there's one in the old "findings"
17:29:14[IDC]Dragonbut wrong interfacing, iirc
17:29:35amiconnThat's not really a 'codec'. It can only do 44.1 kHz 16 bit stereo, requires a continuous data stream, and can use parallel input only
17:34:50Zagorkellyo: you need to say something other than "hello" if you want a response
17:34:52amiconnDid someone try to dump program ROM from the MAS?
17:34:58amiconnIs that possible?
17:35:33Zagorkellyo: oh, you already did. sorry. what problem do you get when unzipping the file?
17:35:45kellyohi Zagor - didn't want to butt in :) quick q - is there an easy way to stop titles from scrolling thru scroll settings or must i write a .wps ?
17:35:57kellyohi zagor..i fixed that
17:36:14kellyoi had deleted a rockbox folder :(
17:36:35Zagorkellyo: you need to alter the wps and remove the %s tag
17:36:53kellyoalso re: bleeding edge/daily builds do i need to run upgrade firmware everytime i add a new update?
17:37:49Zagorno, just unzip the archive
17:38:55kellyoshould i download the build to the iHP root, or beter to just d/l to desk, unzip then send folder to iHP ?
17:39:45kellyoso that when i go to direct folder to iHP it should ask if i want to replace all as a rockbox or .rockbox folder already exists?
17:40:17Zagordownload it to your desktop and unzip it onto your ihp
17:40:38kellyothanks, that will replace the "old" folder correct?
17:40:52amiconn[IDC]Dragon: I did a rewrite of the UART boot wiki article and added player info. Could you please have a look at it and add FM recorder / Ondio info as far as you have that?
17:40:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:41:06Zagorkellyo: yes
17:41:13kellyothanks Zagor
17:41:59kellyoregarding the .wps and % to stop scrolling..i dont understand..can you help or should i just experiment - not sure what the etiqueete is for asistance here or if you guys are just talking development
17:42:43 Join webguest45 [0] (
17:43:13webguest45everyone absent?
17:43:45kellyowebguest - everyone is here and very cool - you should get a nick
17:44:08 Nick webguest45 is now known as Daniel (
17:44:30Daniellike that
17:44:51psy-Deadwe are all here
17:44:53kellyoi am a noob and have had great assistance here, just be patient
17:45:30Danielmy question is kinda easy i think
17:45:47Danielim considering to buy an iriver h320
17:45:58Danielbecause of its record functions
17:46:05Danielis that a good idea?
17:46:20kellyoi am not familiar w 320
17:47:06psy-Deadit WILL be good when rockbox is ported to it ;)
17:47:22Danielwell what makes me wonder is that the 320 is newer and has all this on the go and colour stuff but is not much more expensive compared to h120
17:47:40Danielbut that will take a long time wont it?
17:48:15psy-Deadit could do
17:49:15 Join asdsd____ [0] (
17:49:20 Part asdsd____
17:49:47Danielso you cant help me in that case right?
17:50:26kellyothanks all...just got my iHP120 and am now going to try to write a .wps - thanks Zagor & all
17:51:11Danielhow much did you pay for the h120?
17:51:24kellyo175 i think
17:51:39Danieldollars? pounds? euros?
17:51:53kellyoa fruend had an extra- barely used..i wanted gapless and found out about rockbox
17:52:04psy-Deadthats cheap
17:52:33kellyoi'd have paid double - i love this thing..though am not familiar w it yet
17:52:34psy-Deadright now theyre almost as much new on ebay as mine was from a store
17:52:45kellyohow much do they go for on Ebay?
17:53:17Danieli did only see some for ap. 280 %u20AC ... same for h320
17:53:30Daniel280 euros
17:54:10Danieli dont get it
17:55:36kellyowell, good luck. great guys in here - you will love your iRiver i am sure., thanks again Zagor & all
17:55:39 Quit kellyo ("CGI:IRC")
17:56:08[IDC]Dragonamiconn: I will have a look at the uart boot
17:56:30[IDC]Dragonat first attempt, I found only the recorder pictures
17:58:04amiconnPerhaps it would be useful to attach the uart_boot executable as well.
17:58:36amiconnWhile I do have such an executable, I'm not sure whether this is an ordinary one, or one for player @38400 bps
17:58:44amiconn...and I can't test atm
17:58:45[IDC]Dragonif I don't mess up the baudrate clash...
17:59:24amiconnSomeone should make a 'Disassemble the Ondio' description.
17:59:45amiconnWhile it is relatively easy, there is at least the screw length trap when reassembling...
18:00:03[IDC]Dragonthat's the assembly part
18:00:15amiconnYes, of course I'm thinking of both parts
18:00:46amiconnI'll convert some more old-style pages to wiki
18:00:58amiconn(serial mod, reassembling the player)
18:01:19[IDC]DragonRockbox says thank you!
18:01:44amiconnHaha, there is a funny typo on - "bumbers"
18:02:09 Join Coldtoast [0] (
18:10:06 Join Yokalosh [0] (
18:11:27Yokaloshhey guys, the solder on the dc in of my jbr10 came off and it became disconnected, will this be easy to solder back on?
18:12:05psy-Deadyes, afaik
18:12:45psy-Deadas far as i know
18:12:50Yokaloshoooooh ok
18:13:16Yokaloshmy soldering is quite bad, i'm doing electronics for gcse at school
18:13:22Yokaloshbut its getting there
18:13:42 Join Rori [0] (
18:14:06Yokaloshright, now to find a torx 10
18:18:39Coldtoastif I were you, I'd get somebody competent to do it
18:19:14Coldtoastsre it's a nice feeling when you fix somebothingyourself but man, the opposite is also true when you fubar something
18:20:13Coldtoastif you need to practise your soldering, you really don't wanna do it on something you still use. heh
18:21:26Yokaloshyeh :)
18:21:38Yokaloshi get it right 99% of the time ;)
18:21:47Yokaloshbut i nvr did micro electronics
18:21:53Yokaloshit is soo much smaller
18:22:09Coldtoastdo you have a nice, small tip for your iron?
18:22:23Coldtoastand do you have temperature control?
18:22:30Coldtoasthow small? <1mm?
18:22:37Yokaloshhmmm maybe
18:22:46Yokaloshi dont have temperature control
18:22:48 Join [-AIR-] [0] (
18:22:50 Nick [-AIR-] is now known as west-acre (
18:23:24Yokaloshi could get my electronics teacher to do it....
18:23:29Yokaloshbut i finish for the holidays tomorrow
18:24:18Yokaloshhas anyone ever had to solder one of these on before?
18:24:29west-acrehey. errr, the crossfade setting. how can you adjust it ?
18:24:42Coldtoastgo into Crossfade, as before
18:24:56Coldtoastit's adjustable from OFF, 2s, 4s, etc
18:25:05Coldtoastrather than just Yes and No
18:25:13west-acreyer, can see, i'll update firmware in iriver...seems to work somethymes :S
18:25:52Coldtoastcan you wait 4 mins? heh
18:26:01Coldtoastlooks liek a new build coming
18:26:16west-acreok will do :)
18:26:18 Quit Yokalosh (Remote closed the connection)
18:26:19 Nick Lynx_ is now known as Lynx_awy (
18:26:20Coldtoastok. my h140 did something today it did the other day
18:26:27Coldtoastonly the second time it's done it so far
18:26:47ColdtoastI can't remember if I had crossfade enabled or not
18:26:55west-acre16:28? it's 17:25 ?
18:27:11 Quit Rori (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
18:27:19Coldtoastyou must be GMT+1
18:27:35HClno. its 18:26 in gmt+1
18:27:38 Join Rori [0] (
18:28:22Coldtoasthmmm. well, according to the site, it's in GMT and I'm GMT+10, making it 02:28
18:28:28Coldtoastso my time's correct
18:28:42Coldtoastyou have daylight savings?
18:28:47HClno idea.
18:28:54HCli know i'm in gmt+1
18:29:48ColdtoastI had a song that was 03:30 and when it got to the end of the track, the progress bar was full, as you'd expect, and the next track started but the progress bar and time didn't reset on track change
18:30:45Coldtoastso I was a little way into the next song with a full progress bar and the time was 04:20/03:30
18:30:49 Quit MO-Pantsu (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:31:57Coldtoastmy time format is current/track time so I was 4 mins 20secs into a 3min 30 song
18:32:27Coldtoastthe bug was just visual tho. no playback issues
18:33:29Coldtoastoh. and something else that happened today
18:33:48Coldtoastpowerd on via the remote and there was no Rockbox logo on the remote
18:34:02[IDC]Dragonjust got the wav codec docu
18:34:06Coldtoastthe display was just filled with light grey
18:34:37Coldtoastno idea if powering on vie the remote has anything to do with it as it's teh first time I've seen it
18:34:45[IDC]Dragonfor review, not public disclosure yet
18:35:20MoosCassandra: are you here?
18:36:19[IDC]Dragonit can play via SPI, phew
18:37:35MoosCassandra: hi, just for know if you've planed something for the quick menu, there is still 1 key non used
18:38:00Moosthe Crossfade can be very cool
18:38:01[IDC]Dragonall sample rates supported
18:38:34amiconnHCl: We're GMT+2 if DST is in effect
18:43:36[IDC]Dragonamiconn: read my above?
18:44:20amiconnI converted some more docs stuff to wiki :)
18:46:14amiconnWill it be allowed to publish the wav codec docs in some way? If not, it may be tricky to use...
18:46:28[IDC]DragonI think so.
18:46:46[IDC]DragonJust got some advance information.
18:48:55*amiconn will soon have twice the bandwidth, for less costs than before :)
18:49:05[IDC]Dragonme too
18:49:11[IDC]Dragon6 Mbit
18:50:12amiconnI don't need 6 MBit. I'll upgrade to 2 MBit when I get confirmation for the "DSL flat" -> "DSL flat classic" transition
18:50:22[IDC]Dragonand 576 kBit upstream
18:50:48amiconnThe upstream is way more important. I think I'll choose the upstream extension
18:52:03 Quit Rori (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:55:50 Join uski [0] (uski@
18:56:00uski[IDC]Dragon !%$£@# ! :)
18:56:11psy-Deadanyone know why teh crossfade setting is so limited?
18:56:16psy-Deadi want 1 second fade
18:57:00[IDC]Dragonuski: ?
18:57:17uski[IDC]Dragon, it's my way of saying "hiii !!!! how are you ??? long time no see !!! what's up ???"
18:57:20uskibut it's a lot shorter
18:57:41[IDC]Dragonyou missed the wav 4 archos part
18:58:19[IDC]Dragonafter a looong wait, we're getting the wav codec for the MAS
18:58:36uskimicronas sent it to you ?
18:59:07[IDC]Dragonno, Archas, after Micronas gave official permission for disclosure
18:59:14[IDC]Dragon Archos
18:59:52[IDC]DragonI've asked for ogg, aac, wma, too ;-)
19:00:04uskido they have them ?
19:00:18[IDC]Dragonthat was a joke
19:01:15HClit might be able to do wavpack :p
19:01:18uskihow did archos send the firmware ?
19:01:25amiconn[IDC]Dragon: The Archos Ondio FAQ talks about upcoming WMA implementation...
19:01:42[IDC]Dragonthey didn't, yet
19:02:18[IDC]Dragonhowever, I have it as a binary ripped from the 3x0
19:02:37[IDC]Dragonbut let's wait to see if this is the same
19:02:40uskihey [IDC]Dragon i FINALLY flashed my archos today
19:03:05uskiand i flashed the player of my brother in the same movement
19:03:41[IDC]Dragonamiconn: do you really think they'll maintain such an old product?
19:03:55uski[IDC]Dragon, maybe there are some nostalgic developpers
19:04:13[IDC]Dragonno, the Ondio developer left Archos
19:04:17amiconnSecond last question under Music MP3
19:05:49uskiAre there any future plans to integrate compatibility for Windows WMA format?
19:05:49uskiA: Yes, Archos is currently working on also supporting WMA format for all Jukebox players.
19:06:03uskimaybe tey are just waiting for micronas to release a wma codec
19:06:40[IDC]DragonI'd be surprised if that fits into the download part
19:07:57uskihmm you are right, the firmware is 2 years old...
19:09:12uskiit's unbelieveable archos will, finally, give us something (the wav "codec")
19:09:28[IDC]Dragoninteresting findings, this wav section
19:10:41 Join samwichse [0] (
19:11:08samwichseanyone around this time of day?
19:11:52uskihey amiconn, i just have found the meaning of a bit of the MAS register 0x52 (spdif info): bit 12 = 1 ==> parity error
19:12:11amiconnI know that for almost a year....
19:13:07uski:( ;)
19:13:45amiconnThere's ye olde patch of mine that displays parity errors. I tested it (by attenuating the s/pdif in signal until it gave errors), it works
19:14:54amiconnI was the one who attached the MAS3587 manual addendum concerning a possible malfunction:
19:24:33uski[IDC]Dragon, how do you know that the ondio devs left archos ?
19:26:00uskiit would mean that the recorder devs also left archos i think
19:31:09[IDC]Dragonthat was singular
19:31:18uskimaybe that one day they will give us the source code of their firmware and the schematics of their hardware
19:31:46[IDC]Dragonwe don't need it
19:31:55[IDC]Dragonany more
19:31:56uskihmmm, i need someone with electronic engineering skills
19:32:15uskiwe had some problems with player LCD mysteriously burning out, do you remember ?
19:32:31[IDC]Dragonwe = I ?
19:32:48uskiwell, i remember i have tried to help you with this issue
19:32:52uskibut it doesn't matter
19:32:58uskiis it solved by the way ?
19:33:16[IDC]Dragonyou mean the player LCD init when flashed?
19:33:32[IDC]Dragonamiconn did that, yes
19:34:14uski bottom left; the 34063 IC is getting very hot very quickly on my unit when charging battery; any idea of the origin ?
19:34:33uskiI removed D7 to prevent any accidental damage until i can find the origin of the problem
19:35:39uskimaybe that T3 burnt and now it is directly the 34063 which feeds the power to the battery
19:38:55[IDC]Dragonsorry, I gotta run
19:39:07[IDC]Dragon(no idea without closer thinking)
19:39:14 Quit [IDC]Dragon ("CGI:IRC")
19:40:54 Quit Daniel ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
19:41:00***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:44:04 Join Shebb [0] (
19:45:26 Part Shebb
19:45:56 Join Shebb [0] (
19:47:16ShebbCan anyone give me some help on getting audio running in a plugin?
19:47:33ShebbCurrently I render everything to waves which I must exit to hear
19:48:41 Join DT [0] (
19:49:12DThows it going
19:49:33uskiit walks, and sometimes it runs
19:50:06DTare you a member of the team?
19:50:27uskidepends which team
19:50:34 Quit solex_ (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
19:50:37DTwhich team are you?
19:50:48uskii don't have the honor of being part of the rockbox developement team
19:51:04uskibut maybe i can help you
19:51:09Coldtoastonly there is no team
19:51:41DTI have an iriver player
19:52:00Coldtoastreally tho. there's not
19:52:07uskiDT: which model ?
19:52:28uskiand you want to know if it is supported, and if not, when ?
19:52:38DTi know all about the development really
19:52:40Zagorwell there is a team, just not a formal member list
19:52:51DTi just wanted to see whats happening here
19:53:07uskiDT: well, it's a cool channel, and i am very happy to be here
19:53:20uski(what ? i am saying plain things ? anyway, it's true :))
19:53:35uskiZagor: do you have some electronic engineering knowledge ?
19:54:22DTuski i may stay around then
19:54:27uskii have a weird problem on my unit and i think i know what is failling, but i'd like someone to confirm
19:54:34uskiDT do so
19:55:16Shebbhmmm, can anyone help?
19:55:18 Join solex [0] (
19:55:26DThelp with what?
19:55:33Shebbmentioned it earlier
19:55:42ShebbI need to get playback in a lugin
19:55:47uski<Shebb> Can anyone give me some help on getting audio running in a plugin?
19:55:48uski<Shebb> Currently I render everything to waves which I must exit to hear
19:55:48uski−−> DT ( has joined #rockbox
19:56:09ShebbI have made a step sequnecer
19:56:40uskistep sequencer ? what's that ?
19:56:45ShebbDrum machine
19:57:36ShebbI can can currently output a wave file of a loop that I create
19:57:53Shebbbut it is no good if it is not interactive
19:58:27uskiwell, maybe you can see how other plugins does it
19:58:53ShebbThey dont
19:59:21ShebbWell none that work with a software decoder
19:59:37ShebbPlugins like the metronome only work with the archos models
20:03:07 Join Stryke` [0] (
20:08:30 Join godzirra [0] (
20:08:32godzirraHEya guys.
20:08:48godzirraAnyone recommend a tool that is for linux to retag files? I had one but cant remember the name of it.
20:09:10uskiwhat is your distro ?
20:09:29uskii like to use the packages managers to search for programs
20:09:37godzirraI'm not sure what to even search for though?
20:09:39godzirrafile tagger?
20:09:41uskihmm i don't know it well enough
20:09:53uskimp3, why not
20:09:55uskiand so on
20:10:14uskiit is useful only if you can search through the packages description
20:11:38 Join belgarath [0] (
20:11:49godzirraYeah... thats not showing much that supports downloading tags for a whole cd.
20:11:50belgarathhey coldtoast
20:17:07uskiwhy do i get "incompatible version" with the video viewer plugin ?
20:17:54uski[IDC]Dragon, come back ! :)
20:19:13amiconnOfficial build?
20:19:25uskifrom today
20:19:28amiconnHmm, strange
20:19:41uskii just have downloaded the video_2mb.rock plugin
20:19:56uskimaybe it is an old version, i am not sure where to get the plugin
20:20:10amiconnWhat do you mean, video_2mb ???
20:20:19uskia video_2mb.rock file
20:20:52amiconnOld plugins will most likely not run. Several incompatible api changes happened meanwhile
20:21:23amiconnBtw, why do you need a separate video plugin at all? The video plugin is part of the official build for... I don't remember how long
20:21:40uskiwell, i'll totally remove the .rockbox directory and reinstall it again
20:21:42uskijust to be sure
20:21:46belgarathIs grayscale jpeg viewing for iriver h100 series on the cards at all?
20:21:54amiconnThe link you gave is stuff from the stoneage
20:21:57 Join Lear [0] (
20:22:41amiconnbelgarath: I'm just working on the grayscale lib. First converting it to the new api, then extending it to H1x0. This will enable jpeg viewing
20:23:08amiconnJpeg viewing with only the 4 native shades doesn't really make sense, imho
20:23:20uskiamiconn, i get "plugin returned error"; maybe my files are too old :)
20:23:54uski(i just have totally reinstalled rockbox)
20:24:22uskiamiconn, now it works
20:24:24uskii had a bad file :)
20:30:17samwichseMan, you guys are cool
20:30:49ShebbAnyway, the source to my drum machine can be found here: , along with a little info
20:31:30ShebbIf anyone around now knows a bit about audio playback I would love any help
20:33:58 Join F1^Aison [0] (
20:37:21 Join Psy-Dead1 [0] (
20:37:29Psy-Dead1stupid shitty cable
20:45:04 Part Shebb
20:48:27 Quit psy-Dead (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:50:47 Quit Aison (Connection timed out)
21:00:56 Join LinusN [0] (
21:01:02Learshebb: you mean as in answering a few questions, or as in helping with writing code? :)
21:14:11 Join webguest82 [0] (
21:17:28 Quit webguest82 (Client Quit)
21:20:22Psy-Dead1ka kaw ka kaw
21:20:28Psy-Dead1tookie tookie!
21:23:35uskiomg, , the world will know that im crazy
21:23:54Psy-Dead1dey will
21:24:00Psy-Dead1HEY EVERYONE
21:24:02Psy-Dead1USKI IS CRAZY
21:24:05 Join lowlight [0] (
21:24:12*uski hides
21:24:18*Psy-Dead1 hides
21:24:30*uski readjusts his clothes
21:24:33uskiLadies and Gentlemen,
21:24:40uskiI am NOT crazy.
21:24:45*uski erm erm
21:24:50*Psy-Dead1 hides
21:25:16*uski looks for Psy-Dead1
21:25:22*uski found him
21:25:25uski"ha ha ha"
21:25:43*Psy-Dead1 implodes
21:26:32 Quit uski ("exploded by Psy-Dead1")
21:26:58 Join uski [0] (uski@
21:27:38Psy-Dead1whats a "kc"?
21:27:42uskii don't know
21:27:43Psy-Dead1or an "og"
21:29:00*Psy-Dead1 pokes uski
21:29:04uskihmmm, there are so much things I'd like to change in rockbox... i really have to find some time
21:29:11Psy-Dead1you code?
21:29:18uskii keep saying "i'll do this, i'll do that"... and i don't
21:29:21uskiyes, in my spare time
21:29:28lowlightHi all
21:29:28*Psy-Dead1 bows
21:29:33Psy-Dead1'lo low
21:29:38uskii am not very good, but i don't make ugly code at least :)
21:29:48uskii.e. i know what i can do and what i can't
21:29:57lowlightLatest cvs seems to have a bug...
21:30:05Psy-Dead1i write horrible code. Its inherently horrible, because its VB code
21:30:12uskii started with VB
21:30:14 Join Shebb [0] (
21:30:24lowlightthe pcm buffer is only 352800 (with cross fade off)
21:30:31uskithere is a STUPID alarm in my neighboorhod (sp?)
21:30:38Psy-Dead1very latest?
21:30:39uskione day i'll destroy it
21:30:41Psy-Dead1or only recent?
21:30:47ShebbLear? notices on the log you replyed just after I went off...
21:30:49lowlightcodecs keep boosting to refill the buffer
21:31:05lowlightsince it's not using the whole thing
21:31:15Psy-Dead1very latest?
21:31:15Psy-Dead1very latest?
21:31:16Psy-Dead1or only recent?
21:31:37Psy-Dead1a related bug was quashed in one of the last few commits
21:31:47ShebbWell, all I really need is a hand on the audio playback
21:31:47Learlowlight: it's supposed to be smaller, though I don' t know how small...
21:31:53lowlightI checked it out a few hours ago
21:32:28lowlightI thought it was 1 Mb
21:32:44lowlightor MB
21:32:44 Quit belgarath ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
21:33:01Psy-Dead1"checked it out" you built from source?
21:33:08Learit was, before the commit earlier today, that made it dynamic.
21:33:24Shebbmy attempts with pcm_play_data have ended wih nasty blank screens and a reset
21:33:43lowlightPsy-Dead1: yes, built from source
21:33:56Learah, that kind of audio playback and that kind of problems.. :)
21:34:49Learand you did provide a good get_more pointer?
21:35:12ShebbNot a good enough one it seems
21:35:19Psy-Dead1try the latest allready-compiled bleeding build
21:35:23ShebbI based it off one in the old debug code
21:36:13lowlightLear: I saw that pcm buf is dynamic, but I'm not using crossfade
21:36:39Learyes, and because of that, the pcm buf is made rather small.
21:37:58lowlightbut it's boosting like every second to refill the buffer
21:38:45 Quit samwichse ("Leaving")
21:38:53Learbut what is the boost rate?
21:38:56lowlightLear: so how do I get the whole buffer back?
21:39:22amiconnlowlight: Why would you want that?
21:39:32Psy-Dead1lowlight, its probably better for the battery to have a short pcm buffer and a long mp3 file buffer
21:39:33Learincrease the buffer size for the case with crossfade off; not that I know how that is done...
21:39:53amiconnA smaller pcm buffer means a larger file buffer, that should save battery long as it doesn't influence boost ratio
21:40:46amiconnNote: boost ratio, not boost frequency
21:41:01Slasherihmm, about the voice ui.. i was just wondering that one approach could be to "suspend" the currently running codec (copy iram contents to dram etc.), keep data running from the pcm buffer, fork a new voice codec for a short period to decode the voice data and after that resume normal operation of the suspended codec
21:41:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:41:23amiconnI doubt that this will work
21:41:38amiconnThe voice may be babbling for more than a few seconds
21:42:02Slasheriyes.. then we could do continuous switching between the codecs to keep pcm buffer filled
21:42:17Slasherii think the voice decoding should be very fast because it uses extremely low bitrate
21:42:38amiconnDo you think this will work reliably?
21:42:56Slasherii don't know, i think it's possible to make it work reliably
21:43:02Learwith a larger pcm buffer, perhaps? ;)
21:43:17SlasheriLear: yes, several seconds are required at least
21:43:45Slasheribut in fact the codec suspension and resuming should be pretty fast..
21:43:50amiconnAnother question is whether the voice file should be buffered at all times if the voice UI is switched on
21:43:56amiconn(I think it should)
21:43:56ShebbSorry, but does anyone have any working source that gets sound working in a plugin?
21:43:57uski(sorry to insert my questions in your technical and interesting discussions) what is the "auto volume" setting for ?
21:44:25lowlightHmm...playback crashes when I enter the crossfade menu
21:44:35Slasheriamiconn: i think it's good to have it buffered if we are using voice ui
21:44:57amiconnSlasheri: There are a few more questions I don't know how to handle.
21:45:03Slasherilowlight: really, does it always crash?
21:45:16amiconn- What happens if the voice UI is switched on or off while playing music?
21:45:33Slasheriamiconn: of course.. i just got that idea and that _could_ be solution to one of the hard issues
21:45:56amiconnI mean, how is the buffer change handled
21:45:59Slasheriamiconn: Hmm, we cannot free the buffer space if music is playing
21:46:03Slasheriso nothing will happen
21:46:09Slasherior the playback has to be stopped
21:46:23amiconnHow do you handle this when the crossfade setting is changed?
21:46:25Slasheriand restarted (as the crossfade setting change does at the moment)
21:46:34Slasherii restart the playback
21:47:20amiconnI'd vote for delaying the change until playback is stopped
21:47:21lowlightSlasheri: yes, when I enter the menu (not changing the setting)
21:47:35Slasherilowlight: interesting.. :/
21:47:56Slasherilowlight: did you have music playing?
21:48:02Slasheriand have you tried the latest bleeding edge?
21:48:17amiconn(if it is a change that required to reserve additional memory. Changes in the other direction may happen right away, just leaving the unused buffer hanging around until the next playback stop)
21:48:37lowlightSlasheri: not crashing, just stopping playback
21:48:52Slasherilowlight: ah, that is the "behaviour"
21:49:06Slasheriwe have to stop the playback in order to change that value
21:49:29amiconnSlasheri: I'd suggest to delay this setting until the settings item is left, and only stop if it really changed
21:49:36Coldtoastwasn't that changed in teh latest buld?
21:49:45lowlightSlasheri: I pulled the source from cvs a few hours ago. I might have missed your last commits.
21:49:47amiconnThis is done in some other places as well
21:49:52Slasheriamiconn: that's a good idea.. but i don't yet know how to do it..
21:50:02lowlightI'll grab the latest
21:50:02Coldtoastoh. it resumes once changed
21:50:18Coldtoastit'll still stop but will resume after you finish changing the crossfade
21:50:45amiconnSlasheri: E.g. the voice menu setting does this, to avoid live disabling
21:50:59Slasheriamiconn: ah, i will check that
21:51:07ColdtoastSlasheri: so I took my h140 to the gym and used it as I normally do
21:51:11amiconnThe runtime db setting also does this
21:51:14Slasheribut does it have options?
21:51:24Coldtoastand all was good. no playback glitches at all
21:51:36Slasherii can do this with simple on/off or int types but i don't know how to manage "option menus"
21:51:52Coldtoastjust a bit of a wps issue I've only seen once before and it random it seems
21:52:40amiconnSlasheri: Same mechanism, only different settings function
21:52:47lowlightFYI...I uploaded a patch for FLAC vorbis comments (#1242504) if anyone's interested.
21:52:50Coldtoastwhere when the next track starts, the time didn't reset and the progress bar didn't reset
21:53:27Learlowlight: did you try to consolidate the code with the ogg vorbis comments?
21:53:46 Join MrStaticVoid [0] (
21:53:54amiconnThe basic idea is to load a temporary variable with the global value, let the setting function work on this temporary variable, and compare the temporary with the global value when the setting function returns
21:53:57lowlightLear: yes, same code
21:55:22amiconnSlasheri: The settings lists or option menus as you call them are just numeric settings in disguis
21:56:09 Quit RotAtoR ()
21:57:25Slasherioh.. i think i found the solution :)
21:57:57Slasheriyes, of course.. =)
21:58:26lowlightThanks to see if the latest bleeding edge fixes my problems
21:58:30 Part lowlight
21:59:49west-acrehey peeps. concerning the crossfade adjustment. could there be an option for less than 2 secs, like a one second option? what was it set to b4 we had the option to change it ?
21:59:59Slasheriamiconn: that was simple to fix.. i will commit :)
22:00:06Psy-Dead15 i think
22:00:12west-acrewas set to 5 second?
22:00:12Psy-Dead12 second isnt long
22:00:18west-acrehmm spose.
22:00:41west-acrei think 1,2,4,5,10 would be better? maybe not.
22:00:42west-acreim off
22:01:06Psy-Dead1i think 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,19 would be better :P
22:01:26Psy-Dead1*i think 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 would be better :P
22:01:43SlasheriHmm, that's too much options..
22:01:51Slashericurrently we use just 3 bits for crossfade
22:05:09uskiwhy storing this setting as an index-table (i.e. 001 ==> 1second, 010 ==> 5 seconds, ...) and not a direct number ?
22:05:54Slasherithat would allow only 0-7s.. but maybe we could increase it to use 4 bits
22:06:07Slasherihmm, but that would require config version bump again
22:06:18uskiare we that memory hungry ?
22:06:21uskiwhy not 1 byte ?
22:06:39uskiit's not an important change, it may wait for another change
22:06:42Slasherithe config block size on the disk is limited
22:07:08amiconnThe most important setting is 'off' anyway :-P
22:07:13uskiisn't the configuration stored on a regular file ?
22:07:24Slasheri/* Sum of all bit sizes must not grow beyond 0xB8*8 = 1472 */
22:07:35uskiwhy that ?
22:07:37amiconnuski: no
22:07:46Slasherino, it's a bunch of unused sectors on the disk
22:08:00amiconnIt is *one* unused sector on disk
22:08:01uskiwell, i learn things everyday
22:08:03Learslasheri: don't you think an anti-skip buffer of 10 minutes is a bit ... excessive? :)
22:08:25uskithat's why i keep my configuration even after removing .rockbox.....
22:08:59Slasheriuski: it might be but we have the 8 options so why not to use them all ;) i think 10 minutes should be enough for everybody
22:09:17uski10 seconds you mean ?
22:09:24Slasherino, minutes
22:09:37uskioh ok sorry i was thinking of something else
22:09:50Slashericurrently i use 1 minute watermark level and trying to see if that causes any problems
22:10:00Slasheriif it does, i will try a higher setting
22:10:14Psy-Dead1a dynamic anti-skip would be interesting
22:10:30Psy-Dead1scale it up and down as needed
22:10:37amiconnSlasheri: What happens when I set anti-skip to 10 minutes and then play a .wav ?!!
22:10:55Learslasheri: that means the drive will spin up and load data that is needed ten minutes later. Really, shouldn't happen. It's for dealing with drives that are a little slower than normal...
22:10:57amiconnObviously we don't have >100 MB...
22:10:57Slasheriamiconn: the maximum watermark level is half of the buffer size
22:11:05Slasheriso the disk will not constantly spinning
22:11:35amiconnI'd vote for completely removing the anti-skip setting, like Zagor
22:11:52SlasheriLear: i have that problem while walking
22:12:01Slasherithe unit simply cannot access the disk at all
22:12:11amiconnThe disk spinup time is already taken care of (I hope it also is on iriver?)
22:12:32Learhow are you walking anyway? >:)
22:12:33Slasherii will really need that setting :/
22:12:51LearWell, if it is needed...
22:12:51Slasherinormally, but i have the player in my pocket
22:12:56Slasherinot very fast
22:13:31Psy-Dead1is it loud when accessing the disk?
22:13:48Psy-Dead1any sign of click of death?
22:16:46uskiomg they're crazy
22:18:18SlasheriPsy-Dead1: no, but i have had that "click of death" hundreds of times with the bootloader usb mode :/
22:24:10Coldtoastit'd be nice if you could power off in USB mode I reckon
22:24:45amiconnThat would be a bad idea imho
22:24:53Coldtoastthe CLICK you get when you unplug in USB mode seems quite loud. Is it the same as when you power up normally?
22:25:00Coldtoastyeah. it would
22:25:07Coldtoastdata loss central
22:25:46ColdtoastI thinklI'd really only use bootloader USB mode if I bricked my player somehow
22:26:45Coldtoasteasy enough to boot rockbox, connect USB,update rockbox then reload it
22:26:50amiconnYou only get the click if you unplug very quickly after the last access
22:27:53amiconnAnd yes, that click isn't really good for the HD, as it means the HD performed an emergency park, but it's not *that* bad either
22:28:02 Join ]RowaN[ [0] (
22:28:17Coldtoastto be completely off topic, MAN they're making a massive deal about that sex minigame in GTA: San Andreas
22:28:36]RowaN[is there a prob with flac at the mo? on the last few builds ive noticed that when playing flac, theres a pause every 10 seconds or so
22:29:00ColdtoastI'll try FLAC here
22:31:01Coldtoastit's playing perfectly here
22:31:12Coldtoast883kbps FLAC
22:31:22Coldtoastwell, 883 VBR
22:32:54Coldtoast~60% boost ratio, fluctuaring betwen 48MHz and 120MHz
22:32:56LearNow what... Playback stopped, with the codec in the WPS set to ERR...
22:33:14Coldtoasttopping out at around 75% boost
22:33:42 Join psy-Dead [0] (
22:33:48Coldtoast4misn without a skip
22:35:49pabsany documentation out there for getting started building embedded systems?
22:35:49 Join memmem [0] (
22:36:16pabsi've been looking at buying either a gumstix or a soekris (probably the former), and hooking it up to an LCD
22:37:09pabsi'm pretty sure i know enough, but any additional pointers would be appreciated
22:40:19]RowaN[coldtoast: i'll try some other flac files
22:41:44LearStrange, problem is repeatable with that particular playlist; maybe a bad entry in it...
22:42:18LearBut I can't skip past it, and it also means the playlist autobookmarking is rendered inoperable... :/
22:42:23 Quit Psy-Dead1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:43:22LearYep, error in playlist. :)
22:43:43*Lear wonders how that happened though; it is generated by a script...
22:44:26 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (
22:44:51uski[IDC]Dragon, \o/
22:45:26uskiit's funny, i don't understand more than 20% of what is said here :D
22:45:32uskii missed too many things (iriver port, ...)
22:45:39[IDC]Dragonme too
22:46:42 Join bobbers [0] (
22:47:43[IDC]Dragonamiconn, LinusN?
22:48:25*amiconn is annoyed by his own code :-/
22:48:33[IDC]DragonI got another "teaser" from Archos meanwhile
22:48:40*psy-Dead is annoyed by his lack of code
22:48:59[IDC]Dragonthe codec as a C array, plussome code tidbits
22:49:38[IDC]Dragonwith no realease go yet
22:49:54amiconnI'm currently wading through the grayscale lib code, facing tons of changes :-/
22:49:56[IDC]Dragon(uh my typing sux)
22:50:08amiconnvirtualease ? ;)
22:50:09[IDC]Dragonsorry for bothering
22:50:20 Quit solex ("leaving")
22:51:06amiconnI'll cut down the unbuffered functionality of the grayscale lib to a minimum
22:51:37amiconnUnbuffered operation will only allow clearing the display, drawing greyscale bitmaps, and scrolling
22:51:51uski[IDC]Dragon, "code tidbits" what's that?
22:51:52amiconnAll other functions will only be available in buffered mode
22:52:18amiconns/All other/All/
22:52:27[IDC]DragonI'm not aware of the 2 concepts
22:52:50amiconnThe current cvs implementation is unbuffered, meaning the following
22:53:15amiconn(1) Everything is drawn directly into the bitplanes, and hence shows up while drawing
22:53:28amiconn(2) It needs less ram
22:53:42[IDC]Dragonsounds good to me
22:54:00amiconnIt depends
22:54:16amiconnFor just showing images it is good because it needs less RAM
22:54:28amiconnFor other purposes like animation it is bad
22:54:56uskiamiconn, so you want to implement somekind of double-buffering ?
22:54:58amiconnBuffered mode will use 2 chunky buffers in addition to the bitplane buffer.
22:55:06[IDC]Dragonclear, draw and scroll are sufficient for the jpeg viewer
22:55:17amiconnThe drawing functions will draw to the front buffer
22:55:22uskibtw there is a bug with the "grayscale" plugin
22:55:26uskii don't know if you have noticed it
22:55:49uskiif you scroll the picture out of the screen, when you scroll it back on the screen, the part which was off-screen gets blank
22:55:59amiconngray_update() will then compare the front buffer with the back buffer, and perform the necessary changes in the bitplanes
22:56:18amiconnuski: This is no bug, it's how the lib works
22:56:25LearBtw, an odd thing happened a while ago. I hooked my iRiver to a laptop via the USB cable. Still had my earphones on. And I could hear some sort of radio reception!
22:56:25amiconnIt's scrolling, not rolling
22:56:28uskiok, i see how it works
22:56:48uskiLear: A(mplitude)M(odulation) ?
22:57:01uski_or_, if it has a FM tuner, some crosstalk
22:57:31amiconnThe buffering concept has several advantages. (1) It will be faster if there are few changes. (2) Since it only touches pixels whose brightness really changed, there will be way less flicker with moving content
22:57:46amiconn(3) The drawing functions get very simple
22:58:03amiconnThe only disadvantage is that it needs more RAM
22:58:15LearDon't know what it was; I noticed it on two occasions, once it was someone talking with an odd English accent, another time it was some Baltic language I think. I thought AM as well, but could just as well have been Swedish radio P2 (FM)... :) I'll leave unbuffered mode available with minimal functionality just for jpeg viewer and mandelbrot
22:58:34uskiLear: ok :)
22:59:05LearThe iRiver has a radio, but I was using Rockbox at the time, so it shouldn't be active or anything...
22:59:18uskimaybe that rockbox initialises the radio only when you want to use it
22:59:29uskiso maybe that the RAM of the radio receiver had a random content
22:59:33amiconnuski: It doesn't support it yet
22:59:35uskiso that it was actually tuned on some channel
23:00:08uskiand as the switch that switches between mp3/whatever or radio is not perfect (i guess), you heard some sound from the radio
23:00:11uskiit must be sth like this
23:00:19amiconn[IDC]Dragon: Guess why I want buffered mode? I want moving greyscale demos on archos... like the solid greyscale cube
23:00:32amiconn..and I really hope to see more stuff
23:00:48uskimaybe we'll have a raytracer for archoses one day ? :D
23:01:20uskii hope that i'l find a color LCD that can be fitted into the archoses one day
23:01:26uskii have some, but they are a bit too big
23:01:37amiconnBuy an iriver H3x0 instead
23:01:46uskino money ;)
23:01:50amiconnChances are high that it will be supported soon
23:01:57uskii have an archos gmini 400 but... no info on HW
23:02:20uskii bought it knowing that rockbox will not run on it, but i really needed video playback
23:02:22*amiconn should hurry getting a H3x0 too, to be prepared for Linus' bootloader ;)
23:02:43amiconn...and be able to work on the colour LCD driver :)
23:03:17uskii have already worked with a color LCD in one of my personnal projects
23:03:22uski"it's so cool" :D
23:03:32uskiit really add something
23:03:40 Join lowlight [0] (
23:03:51amiconnNah, I think the driver will need less sophisticated thinking.
23:04:29uski"add something", i mean the project is more, erm, "value added"
23:04:32uskimore "good looking"
23:04:37uskiit's not at all harder to program :)
23:04:47amiconnPlus, for one I don't like colour displays in mobile devices that much. Unless they are the newest generation, they eat too much power and are not readable without the backlight
23:04:48uskiin fact i think it is easier to program than some B&W LCD displays
23:05:00uskiwell, depends
23:05:03 Part LinusN
23:05:11uskii had a color LCD display with a PCF8833 controller
23:05:18uskithis controller has a special power saving 16 colors mode
23:05:32uskiit automatically uses the 4 high-order bits of its memory, and renders it in 16 colors
23:05:36uskiit doesn't use much power
23:05:50amiconnIt's not a problem of the controller. The backlight is what consumes most of the power
23:06:09uskias you said the main problem is the backlight, but the display is readable in the dark as long as care is taken to use high contrast colors (i.e. not pale yellow on pale orange, but blue on white, and so on)
23:06:46uskiwhen i use a color LCD, i don't abuse of the colors; i almost use the LCD as if it was B&W so there is a very high contrast and everything can be read in the dark
23:06:51uskiwithout the backlight
23:07:00lowlightHi...about this dynamic pcm buffer...
23:07:01amiconnI know there are colour displays that are readable (and I mean *readable*) without backlight, but so far I only know one device series that uses them
23:07:08uskialso, designers sometimes do S***: in the gmini 400 they didn't do anything to set the backlight intensity
23:07:25uskiit is VERY easy to do, many microcontrollers now have hardware PWM output
23:07:32amiconn...the Blackbery 72x0 series
23:07:45lowlight...I've noticed my boost ratios have gone from ~12% to 20% with some oggs (~126 bps)
23:08:15uskiamiconn: that's because they use reflective LCD screens and not transflective LCD screens i think
23:08:41uskioh, i saw a photo
23:08:49amiconnThey must be transflective, as they have a backlight too be readable in the dark
23:09:19uskiyes, but they are "mainly" reflective
23:09:29lowlightIs there an easy way to adjust the pcmbuf size and the watermark?
23:09:41uskiwhat's this famous watermark ???
23:10:26amiconnCould be. I would much prefer this kind of display in my mobile phone... I had to get a new one because my old one broke, and the non-readable-in-standby colour lcd is what still annoys me most
23:11:14uskii used a mobile phone color LCD for my project
23:11:22uskimost of the time, they use a VERY bad reflector
23:11:31uskii.e. a white sheet of "plastic paper"
23:11:42amiconnI must say that I am somewhat surprised by the battery standby time. Although the battery is the same capacity as the one in my old phone, standby time is longer, despite of the colour LCD (!)
23:11:46uskii think they could improve a lot ease of reading by using a real reflector
23:12:11amiconnThe display of my mobile phone is pitch black when not illuminated
23:12:26uskimaybe that it is shut down by the phone in fact
23:12:36uskitry putting your phone near a light bulb
23:12:38amiconnYes, probably
23:12:50uskiif it is still pitch black then they shut down the LCD
23:12:53amiconnNot much sense in doing otherwise with this kind of display
23:12:54uskiwhich is, i think, stupid
23:12:59 Quit ze (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:13:29amiconnI know some other phones that do display the time or such when in standby, without backlight
23:13:34uskithe mobile phone of my father has a color LCD and it displays the time (at least) ;)
23:13:48uskiit is hard to read, but it's still readable
23:13:55amiconnBut that kind of display isn't really readable
23:13:56ColdtoastsI had a K700i which wa a DAMN nice phone
23:13:59uskibut the problem is the bad reflectors they use
23:14:26CassandraHmmm. The ON button of the JBP I bought off eBay seems to have become detatched. (Not the grey bit, the actual contact.) Any suggestions for fixing it>
23:14:36Coldtoastcracked the LCD at work tho and the replacement I got from Europe was faulty. can't be arsed waiting on a new one so I bought an old non-colour phone with nothing fancy at all
23:14:42uskiCassandra, take a soldering iron ?
23:14:54uskiand resolder the button
23:15:09CassandraNow that might work if I had all of the button. I don't.
23:15:16CassandraI have the top half.
23:15:27 Part lowlight
23:15:34uskiwhat ? you are missing some of the surface mount buttons ?
23:15:34Cassandra(Working from comparison with the Menu button.
23:15:41Coldtoastplus aren't you a bit visually impaired Cassandra?
23:15:43CassandraIt would appear so.
23:15:52CassandraYes. My soldering is crappy.
23:15:53uskithen the one who sold you the jukebox took them...
23:16:20CassandraI can see two contacts where the ON button should be.
23:17:01uskii do not know where to purchase replacement buttons
23:17:09CassandraSomewhere there should be a metal ring to go under the button top.
23:17:11LearArgh, I don't like it when I do a small change, download it to the player and really odd things start happening....
23:17:19CassandraUnfortunately I can't seem to find it on the floor.
23:17:31LearThen I make a full rebuild and download that, and voila, things work as expected again...
23:17:52uskioh, Cassandra, I misunderstood your problem
23:17:55 Nick F1^Aison is now known as Aison (
23:18:20[IDC]DragonCassandra, I can send you a button (the actual switch, not the plastic part)
23:18:26LearBut just now I think I know what it was caused by... :)
23:18:26amiconnCassandra: These SMD buttons aren't supposed to fall apart. If they do, they're broken
23:19:34Cassandraami: Am I stuffed then? (I can always power on from USB, I suppose.)
23:19:51CassandraPossibly I could solder two wires and a push button on.
23:19:58CassandraIf I had two wires and a push button.
23:20:05uskiit will be very hard to solder this I think...
23:20:11amiconnI think you need to replace the button. [IDC]Dragon said he still has some
23:20:44CassandraI'll pop him a mail then.
23:21:41CassandraOn an unrelated note, arse. Went it to listen to a Teac Reference 300 stereo today, liked it, then the bastard salesman made me listen to the Arcam Solo.
23:21:46CassandraI am truly in love.
23:21:57CassandraWith a thousand pound stereo.
23:22:21[IDC]Dragonbah, cheap stuff
23:22:55[IDC]DragonI have british gear as well
23:23:35CassandraIf I got it with the Epos 12.2 speakers, which I also really like, it'd be an entirely British stereo system. :)
23:23:55CassandraOh, [IDC]Dragon, do you have any spare player pushbuttons?
23:24:11*[IDC]Dragon fires up the soldering iron
23:24:40amiconn[IDC]Dragon: Please unsolder 2 of them....
23:24:49[IDC]DragonCassandra, yes
23:25:03 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
23:25:04CassandraCool. You want money?
23:25:26*amiconn still has Linus' oldplayer laying around, with that missing "-" button...
23:25:30 Quit Shebb ("CGI:IRC")
23:25:48CassandraThat's kind of you. Thanks. Remind me of your email and I'll send you my address.
23:26:12[IDC]Dragonit's all over the mailing list
23:26:54LearHm.. The playback menu is getting crowded... A few items could be moved to system, IMO...
23:28:44 Join Strath [0] (
23:29:57uskiI wish I could change the way we set settings on the archos: instead of being in a screen with :"Setting name" and "setting value", we could stay in the menu, and use a window over it with the setting value
23:30:04uskimaybe a slider, or a dropdown list
23:30:19uskii'm afraid i don't know enough of rockbox code to change this
23:31:03psy-Deadwait til the new graphics api is finished 1st
23:31:19uskiyou're right
23:31:27amiconnThe new graphics api is finished in the core
23:31:48Cassandrauski: I've thought of doing something similar for the graphical players too.
23:31:58CassandraIt ought to be feasible.
23:32:17CassandraI'm just not sure whether it would be simpler or more confusing.
23:32:23uskiit is, and it shouldn't be very very hard for somebody experienced
23:32:40amiconnI think it would be more confusing
23:33:05amiconnI had a slightly different idea (well, I got the idea from my new mobile phone)
23:33:23amiconnThe settings should keep their separate screen, but with 2 changes
23:33:54[IDC]Dragonone button off
23:34:24amiconn(1) The value of the current setting would be displayed in a small info box to the right and below (or above, as it fits) the current line
23:34:38amiconnFor changing the setting you would still enter a separate screen
23:35:02amiconn(2) The separate screen would show all choices as a list for multiple-choice settings
23:35:48Cassandraami: My idea was to do (1) on the main screen and have up down change options, left right change values.
23:36:12amiconnYes, and I don't think this is a good idea
23:36:17CassandraSelect to confirm changes, stop to cancel.
23:36:26 Join ze [0] (
23:36:27uskii'll do a simulation of my idea from a screenshot of a menu
23:36:48amiconnThe screen would become too crowded and confusing, especially with larger fonts
23:37:03uskioh you're right, i have forgotten the fonts problem
23:37:16uskii use a very small font, but not everyone can do this
23:37:23amiconnThe trigger settings screen does this, and I think it really is confusing
23:37:40CassandraI don't see it as particularly less confusing than keeping a seperate options screen.
23:37:47Cassandratrigger settings?
23:37:56amiconnThe recording trigger
23:38:41[IDC]Dragon2nd button off
23:38:56[IDC]Dragon(this is difficult, takes time)
23:39:04amiconnAnyway, before changing anything major in that direction, I think it is necessary to consolidate some code
23:39:12[IDC]DragonCassandra, do you have means to solder it?
23:39:20amiconnWe're really tight on space now.
23:39:36uskispace ? because of the flash size ?
23:39:37CassandraI have an iron, yes.
23:40:06amiconnI'm rethinking t0mas' idea of a universal list browser, after I first rejected the idea
23:40:08CassandraAlthough quite how you get solder between the button and the board, I'm not sure.
23:40:13[IDC]Dragonand calm hand, sg
23:40:30CassandraThat I'm not so good with, but I get by.
23:40:46amiconnuski: Not the flash size, but the hard limit for .ajz loaded from disk
23:41:03amiconn...for those poor people that have an unflashable box
23:41:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:41:12uskiheh, i was part of these poor people
23:41:18uskii tried to replace the flash chip, and it fried my archos
23:41:28uskithat's why i didn't have a box for several months
23:41:35amiconnAh, yes
23:42:05uski(and i still do not understand what fried, i did it with a lot of care and i have all the required hardware, even a hot air soldering station.....)
23:42:37uski : i love these fancy OLED displays; i would love to get one to play with, but they are hard to find
23:43:32*Cassandra boggles as $local hifi shop beats the internet on price by 100 quid.
23:44:49amiconnAn universal list browser may possibly help to cut down binary size. From removing the MAS debug menu items I know that larger switch() constructs may get large...
23:45:13*Cassandra decides to snap Sevenoaks Sound and Vision's metaphorical hand off.
23:45:17amiconnEek, I mean, may get large in binary size as well
23:46:16amiconnI also think the bookmarking code is way too big for what it does...
23:46:27amiconn...but I don't know why yet
23:46:31Cassandraami: Makes sense (re list browser)
23:46:51CassandraI wouldn't do the options like the trigger screen.
23:46:53uskiamiconn, if it was me, i would remove it :D
23:47:01amiconnAnother strange thing is that the Ondio FM binary is >10 KB smaller than the FM recorder binary
23:47:23amiconnI can't believe this is only due to the F2/F3 menu(s)
23:47:33CassandraI'd go split screen with the bottom line of the screen inverted and turned over to display the setting of the current option under the cursor.
23:47:42amiconnThe ATA and MMC drivers are comparable in size, so that can't be it
23:47:54uskibtw what's the hard limit of the .ajz file size ?
23:48:00amiconn200 KB
23:48:17amiconnCassandra: Bottom line is bad, that interferes with the button bar
23:48:23amiconn(on archos recorders)
23:48:40Cassandraami: If it's only an issue for on disk, can we configure the Rockbox rescue build to automatically ROLO a larger image?
23:48:48[IDC]Dragon4 buttons off, enough for today
23:48:52CassandraThen we neatly sidestep the whole size issue.
23:49:02amiconnCassandra: We could, but that's not the point here
23:49:31amiconnSomehow I think there is much potential for saving binary size in rockbox
23:49:32CassandraNo, but Rockbox is going to hit the 200kb mark sooner or later.
23:50:07amiconnRockbox is way bigger than the archos firmware, in spite it does localisation externally, while archos has the whole localisation built in
23:50:39]RowaN[the prob i have with flac playback just seems to be on one flac file (i only have 2 hehe)... the flac file in question reports as 1068kbps
23:50:47CassandraWe do so much more than Archos though.
23:51:05amiconnI know it does have more features, but I don't think this is the only reason
23:51:16CassandraPerhaps we should start compiling with a higher -O option.
23:51:20CassandraThat can't be helping.
23:51:29amiconnThat makes the binary larger, not smaller
23:51:38 Join ashridah [0] (
23:51:38amiconnI tried it
23:51:45uskidepends which optimisations
23:51:54uskithere are options to prefer size of speed
23:51:59amiconnThe only option that makes the binary a little smaller is -Os
23:52:06amiconn...but not much
23:52:10amiconnI tried all of them
23:52:21uskiso we have a problem :D
23:52:25amiconn..both with gcc 3.3.x and 3.4.x
23:52:36amiconnWe would have more problems
23:52:42uskisuch as ?
23:53:02amiconnBinaries created with -O2, -O3 and -Os won't run on the archos
23:53:06CassandraWe've had crashes compiling with high -O values.
23:53:08amiconn...with any gcc
23:53:24amiconnI know the workaround to make -O2 and -Os work with gcc 3.3.x
23:53:33CassandraMaybe we ought to find out why.
23:53:34uskihave you tried GCC 4.x btw ?
23:53:42amiconn...but so far no solution for -O3 or gcc 3.4.x
23:53:47Cassandra(She says, being totally incapable of doing so herself.)
23:54:07amiconngcc 4 doesn't compile at all for archos, due to a stupid decision of the gcc team
23:54:16uskiwhich decision ?
23:54:21uskithey removed the SH1 target ?
23:54:45amiconngcc 4+ only allows aliases to functions defined in the same translation unit
23:55:14uski(i don't understand a bit of what it means, but thanks anyway :D)à
23:55:16amiconn...but system.c uses aliases to functions defined in an asm block (perfectly legal!) - and gcc 4 chokes
23:55:47uskioh ok i understand nowx
23:55:48CassandraThat kind of sucks. Have you talked to the gcc guys about it?
23:56:15amiconnI would do so, but gcc requires registration just for reporting bugs
23:56:18uskithere is a workaround for this; maybe you can write an inline function for each ASM function
23:56:43uskii.e. instead of writing several functions in a big ASM block, write an ASM block for each function
23:56:49uskiit will work, will not it ?
23:57:15uskiwhy ? o:)
23:57:25amiconnThe functions in the asm block aren't complete functions, but very short stubs
23:57:40amiconn...jumping to a common function after saving a parameter
23:57:51uskii see
23:58:06amiconnWe could perhaps find a workaround with considerable effort, but I don't bother
23:58:07CassandraPhew. Sent my home address to the Rockbox list by accident. Fortunately from the wrong email address so it bounced.
23:58:46 Quit DT ()
23:58:49CassandraThere's no guarantee GCC4'd fix the optimisation problems we're having anyway.
23:58:55amiconnI'm sure gcc 4 won't bring down code size, at least that's what I derive from comparison of rockbox code size with gcc 3.4.x and gcc 4

Previous day | Next day