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#rockbox log for 2005-08-21

00:00:31 Join muesli__ [0] (
00:02:52muesli__XavierGr i use koss the plug which are imho not the worst
00:05:24 Nick Sucka`away is now known as Sucka (
00:05:28 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (
00:05:56XavierGrMoos: as far as I can remember these pops (now louder with the fix)were already there.
00:10:39muesli__g'night mates
00:11:17XavierGrgood night i have to go too. bye
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00:12:13 Quit Paul_The_Nerd ("Chatzilla 0.9.68a [Firefox 1.0.6/20050716]")
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01:20:36garethEvening All
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10:34:32 Join linuxstb [0] (
10:35:05linuxstbMorning all. I'm hoping someone can help me kill the last bug in my ALAC decoder...
10:35:45 Join XMaster-ShadowX [0] (
10:36:24linuxstbIf I play a FLAC or WAV file followed by an ALAC file, then the last second or so of the FLAC/WAV file isn't played.
10:37:07linuxstbIt seems that the initialisation of the ALAC decoder is causing what's left in the PCM buffer to be deleted.
10:42:01 Join arp [0] (
10:45:20arpho ho!
10:46:27Slasherlinuxstb: Hmm, that's weird.. you don't have crossfade enabled?
10:46:46linuxstbNo, crossfade is disabled. It only happens with ALAC, not the other codecs.
10:47:26Slasherok, that shouldn't happen then
10:47:30linuxstbI'm using CVS from about 8 days ago - I've been without proper internet access since then (I'm in an Internet cafe at the moment)
10:47:38arpso I hope people dont mind the following question...
10:47:45arpbut how stable/featureful is rockbox on iriver?
10:48:06Slasherit should be quite stable and very featureful
10:48:20arpall I really care about is gapless mp3's actually
10:48:48SlasherHmm, i think lame mp3's are almost gapless (there might be still some small errors)
10:48:53Slasherall other codecs are true gapless
10:49:05arpI'm tired of not having a portable mp3 player, and waiting for a vendor to get it right is annoying me
10:49:13arpyah, all my mp3's are lame encoded
10:49:26Slasherthen you should definately try rockbox :)
10:49:31arpI use my phone as an mp3 player, and I dont notice any problems with the gapless player
10:49:45arpbut I only have a 1GB sd card
10:50:02linuxstbarp: I've been using my H140 with Rockbox as my main player for a few months, and I'm very happy with it.
10:50:18arpwhat capacity is the h140?
10:50:24linuxstb40GB :)
10:50:34linuxstbThere is also a H120...
10:50:43ashridahH140's are getting more difficult to find now tho
10:51:06ashridahmostly been replaced by the H340 in retail, which rockbox hasn't been ported to, although they can still be found
10:51:31arpyah, and its still over $400, heh
10:51:50arpcheapest is like $439
10:52:21arpeven h120 is pricey, heh
10:52:41arpI have a slimx cd player that I've loved for a number of years
10:53:09 Join ender` [0] (
10:53:24arph120 for $400 or xs202 for $250
10:53:27arptough choice!
10:54:08arpanyone here have the xs202?
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11:08:50 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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11:16:57arpoh I see, it only supports the 220 not 202
11:17:01arphow confusing :)
11:17:15arpI guess I'll play the waiting game a little longer
12:06:03HCl220 what?
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12:55:27 Join Moos [0] (
12:55:36MoosHola !
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13:30:51 Join muesli- [0] (
13:33:11amiconnhirsch? ;)
13:33:41muesli-ahm..mist..hier gehts ja englisch zu ;)
13:34:07Moosdutsch men :)
13:38:30muesli-does somebody use trillian 3.1 ?
13:38:40 Quit dionoea_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:40:07 Join linuxstb [0] (
13:46:38linuxstbHello all. I found the problem with my ALAC decoder causing the PCM buffer to flush when a new track was initialised.
13:46:42 Join stripwax_ [0] (
13:47:22FebsHi folks. If there are any Archos users here, can you tell me whether the backlight fade-in/fade-out works on the Archos, or if that is an iriver only feature?
13:47:31FebsI'm working on updating the manual and wikimanual.
13:48:16linuxstbThe decoder was calling rb->seek_buffer to skip unwanted parts of the file header. This in turn caused playback.c to flush the audio buffer. Replacing seek_buffer with advance_buffer solved the problem, but I don't think that is logical behaviour for the seek_buffer() function.
13:48:25linuxstbFebs: I don't know.
13:48:47amiconnFebs: Iriver onlky
13:50:18FebsThat's what I thought, but wanted to be accurate.
13:50:38amiconnAre you trying to split the manual per model?
13:51:53FebsNo, all I am doing is copying over the parts of the hard copy manual to the page WikiManual so that there is a reference available (mostly for iriver users) prior to release.
13:52:02FebsAs I find things in the manual that are outdated, I am updating them.
13:52:11FebsAnd then I will mail the updated file to Cassandra.
13:52:19amiconnThe 2.5 release won't be an iriver release
13:52:23FebsI understand.
13:53:13FebsRight now, there is no manual available for iriver users (with iriver buttons, etc.) so the wikimanual will serve as an interim manual until there is a iriver release and a formal manual is released.
13:54:32FebsI am changing some things in the manual that are needlessly player-specific (i.e., use of the word "Jukebox" when the more neutral "player" would suffice) to make it easier to adapt later to other player models.
13:54:52amiconnplayer is less neutral than jukebox
13:55:26linuxstbMy H140 says "Multi-codec Jukebox" on the front...
13:55:34amiconnIn the rockbox world, 'player' almost always means the archos 'player' family (Jukebox 5000, 6000, Studio 10, Studio 20)
13:55:39FebsHm. I see what you mean. distinguish from the recorder models
13:55:57 Join webguest49 [0] (
13:56:03stripwax_DAP is more neutral
13:56:12FebsBut the manual used Jukebox with a capital "J," which I found confusing.
13:56:34linuxstbMaybe just change to lower-case - "jukebox".
13:56:37amiconnYes, that's because all archos hd models start with 'Jukebox ...'
13:56:46amiconn...and needs to be changed anyway
13:56:56amiconnThe Ondio has no 'Jukebox' in front
13:57:05FebsRight. What do folks think of "DAP"?
13:57:08amiconnI'd say just use 'jukebox' (small j)
13:57:09linuxstbDAP ignores the recording features (and FM radio...)
13:57:19linuxstbDigital Audio Player...
13:57:44linuxstbamiconn: I agree.
13:58:36FebsSounds good. I'll put something at the beginning of the manual defining the terms that are used in the manual ... (not that anyone will read that section ...)
13:59:33linuxstbIs anyone planning any major commits before midnight?
13:59:50amiconnI want to commit runtime db support for archos
14:00:20amiconnTouches database.c, mpeg.c and mpeg.h
14:01:33linuxstbI'm very happy with my ALAC decoder (it's more efficient than FLAC), but can't commit it until I get home next weekend - which is too late.
14:01:42FebsAnd Cassandra, if you read this in the IRC logs, I will e-mail you my revisions shortly. You are and I are rarely on IRC at the same time (I can't access IRC from work) but I do read the logs, so let me know if you have any other suggestions.
14:03:32 Quit tvelocity (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:08:21Mooslinuxstb: it's never too late, you'll can do it in 2 weeks :)
14:08:43webguest49Hi all. linuxstb- could you explain why ALAC is more efficient than FLAC, please? will ALAC be included in iRiver's supported codecs?
14:10:43amiconnlinuxstb: My guess is that wavpack is still more efficient than ALAC, or am I wrong?
14:11:11linuxstbYes, Wavpack is of course the "best". But ALAC is second, FLAC is third - in terms of CPU needed to decode a file.
14:11:55amiconnFLAC isn't even realtime with all files...
14:12:50linuxstbIŽm sure the FLAC format is no more complicated than ALAC, but the reverse-engineered ALAC decoder I used is orders of magnitude simpler than libFLAC.
14:13:03amiconnAnyway, I don't care much about lossless compression
14:13:41ender`what about TTA?
14:13:45amiconnImho such files are too large for usage on a DAP, and if I really have much space I can use plain pcm as well
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14:14:37linuxstbI use lossless on my PC, so I don't like to encode them again for my iRiver. But when I fill the HD up, I probably will.
14:15:02linuxstbThere is also too much choice in lossy codecs - I'm too lazy to do listening tests to find the best one for my ears.
14:16:39linuxstbwebguest49: I've finished an ALAC decoder for Rockbox, but probably won't be able to commit it for a couple of weeks - until after the "feature freeze".
14:17:22Moosmaybe for iriver release :)
14:20:02 Quit muesli- (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
14:20:02webguest49that's good news, thanks :-]
14:20:12linuxstbender`: I've never used TTA, but if you want to see it added to Rockbox, add info about it to the SoundCodecs wiki page.
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14:21:31linuxstbAAC is probably the next codec IŽll look at - unless someone else gets there first.
14:22:21amiconnImho someone with a clue should try to optimise FLAC, or we should take it out for a release. Same goes for MPC.
14:23:55Moosyeah Muse pack is so nice
14:24:04amiconnI never used it
14:24:07Moosand Flac too
14:25:04linuxstbI use FLAC, and most tracks play perfectly. I only get a very occasional drop-out. But maybe my kind of recordings (live bootlegs) are easier to decode.
14:25:39Moosfor MPC, it is not in real time :( currently
14:26:04Moosbuggish every 5 or 10 sec I don't remenber good
14:29:24webguest49I use mostly FLAC too -mainly studio recordings- I've noticed that sometimes, but very seldom, there is like 1s break during playback, maybe even less, it's like the data is send to the buffer or sth, I don't know...
14:30:43linuxstbwebguest49: Yes, that's the symptom of the FLAC decoder not quite being fast enough to decode in realtime. Sometimes the PCM buffer runs empty.
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14:36:24 Join preglow [0] (
14:36:31preglowlinuxstb: faad2 looks niceish
14:36:46preglowi think it should give decent quality on emac platforms as well
14:39:05preglowwoops, gotta go
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14:42:18linuxstbGotta go too. Bye.
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14:51:06Slasherusb mode fixed
14:51:31Slasherwe did hit the max thread limit
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16:06:02SlasherHmm, are ints 32 bit on all targets rockbox currently supports?
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16:07:29Slasherah, never mind that is not any issue :)
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17:09:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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17:21:25edkentHi, can anyone tell me where to get v3 of the Iriver bootloader pathcher?
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18:18:17amiconnSlasher: r u there?
18:19:06Slasheramiconn: hi, yes
18:19:40amiconnI got the impression that there might be something wrong with the USB acknowledge since the voice UI was introduced
18:20:06amiconnUSB from rockbox doesn't work; the logo appears but no drive in windows
18:20:14amiconnBootloader USB mode works
18:20:19Slasherno it works now (check the most recent cvs commit)
18:20:43Slasherbut you are correct, there was two problems
18:20:58amiconnI should compile a new build then
18:21:22Slasherinitially the usb acknowledgement thing was broken and i fixed that first. Then the we hit the max thread limit and i increased that
18:21:31amiconnI have another question
18:22:06 Join webguest90 [0] (
18:22:10amiconnHow do you handle sending the initial track change event?
18:22:16amiconnI have the runtime db working now on archos, but it doesn't catch the first track (the one you start playback with)
18:23:02amiconnMy code properly sends the buffer/unbuffer event for this first track, but not the trackchange event (since there is no change)
18:23:37SlasherHmm.. if i remember correctly the playback code on iriver calls the buffer events when it finishes the current buffering
18:24:10Slasherthat trackchange event is sent by the pcm buffer callback (so it's synced with the audio playback)
18:24:26amiconnHmm, it seems the iriver trackchange is also sent at startup
18:24:34Slasheryes it is
18:24:58amiconnThe problem is that I can't simply send the event at startup on archos, since it would then be send *before* the buffer events
18:25:16amiconn(which are sent when buffering is complete, i.e. after playback already started)
18:25:34SlasherHmm.. :/
18:25:49Slasherbut i will have to go now, back soon ->
18:26:06amiconnI would have to send these after buffering is complete, but I have no simple idea how this could work
18:26:25amiconnThe initial buffering is done by the same code as all later rebuffering
18:27:07amiconnI can commit my code, so this turns from adding features (not really anyway) into pure bugfixing ;-P
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18:43:47Slasherhehe :) i will soon commit a fix to the pops. It was simpler to fix than i thought
18:44:05amiconnI had an idea how to solve the initial track problem
18:44:43amiconnI can call the trackchange event when actual playback starts; but I have to generate the buffer event immediately before that
18:45:05XavierGrSlasher: reallyyyy????
18:45:35XavierGrThese pops are annoying...
18:45:49SlasherXavierGr: yep, we can let hardware do that. Just initializing IIS2CONFIG properly should be enough (at least it will fix the very annoying initial pop at boot)
18:46:22XavierGramiconn: What about the file scrolling in jpeg viewer? What buttons do you suggest?
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18:46:55amiconnBah, modem connection :/
18:46:56amiconn if (track_changed_callback)
18:46:56amiconn track_changed_callback(audio_current_track());
18:47:06amiconnA slight drawback is that starting playback now generates 2 bunches of buffer events (if more than one track can be buffered)
18:47:09XavierGrAlso it would be good someone to advice me how big to make the buffer.
18:48:39XavierGrSlasher: What's your preference in changing files from the jpeg viewer?
18:49:11SlasherXavierGr: Hmm, i haven't think about that but it sounds like a good feature
18:49:36XavierGrCurrently it is set to up-down.
18:49:58XavierGrand if zoomed I will make it play+up-down.
18:50:14XavierGrBut maube my approach is wrong that's why I am asking.
18:53:06amiconnI would make it Play+Up/ Play+Down, always
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18:54:12XavierGrbut then it would be nuch of a hassle to scroll small pics.
18:54:47XavierGrand most people have smaller pics that 1280/1024
18:55:47amiconnI'm not sure at all about that
18:55:55amiconnDigicams yield way larger pics
18:56:25amiconnAnyway, before this feature can be committed, we need the button assignments for the other jpeg capable platforms as well
18:56:32amiconn(archos recorder, ondio)
18:56:57amiconnRecorder is easy, thanks to the many buttons, but Ondio will be a problem...
18:57:39XavierGrwell it would be easy to change anyway...
18:59:37XavierGr896pixels is the larget picture for recorders without zoom?
19:01:01amiconn896x512 pxiels without panning in the smallest zoom level
19:01:25amiconnIt's simple - 8x (linear) display resolution
19:01:38XavierGryes that what I did just confirmed it.
19:01:52 Join Nibbler [0] (
19:02:06XavierGrso to make the #if define:
19:03:02XavierGr#if CONFIG_KEYPAD == IRIVER_H100_PAD
19:03:27XavierGr#define MAX_Y_SIZE 1024
19:03:53XavierGror to take another argument for the model?
19:04:31amiconnI would simply use the same combo for switching pics, regardless of picture size
19:05:05amiconnChanging the meaning of buttons within one process would be very confusing imho
19:05:24Slasherhmm, does somebody know how the line out and headphone connector are connected (or how they are separate from each other)?
19:05:59amiconnImagine scrolling through a dir of pictures. The first 5 pics are small, so 'Down' would choose the next pic. The next pic is big, and all of a sudden 'Down' would no longer change pics
19:06:10amiconnI guess this would be very confusing for the user
19:06:41amiconnIf you don't like button combos, there are 2 free buttons for prev/next pic
19:07:58XavierGrhmm that is another option...
19:08:51XavierGrWhich will be next? Play (but it is upper than rec) or rec (which is more of a cancel button)
19:09:33amiconnI'd say Play=next, Rec=prev
19:09:49***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:11:07XavierGralso the buffer must be target dependant I think.
19:11:44XavierGrI have set pointers (which is # of entries) to 2000. And the buffer (which holds only names not paths) to 10000.
19:11:53XavierGrthat is 12KB.
19:12:05amiconnErgo won't work on archos
19:12:19XavierGrErgo? What that means?
19:12:30amiconnThere are ~7KB plugin ram left with the current jpeg.rock
19:12:44amiconnYour code will take some more
19:13:11XavierGrthen I can make a define to make it 500 and 4000
19:13:32amiconnErgo is latin, meaning 'that means'
19:14:13XavierGr4.5kb is good then?
19:15:10amiconnI don't know how much larger the code will get with your additions, so we can only adjust after compiling it for archos
19:15:38XavierGrmy additions are not that big. anyway guess you are right.
19:15:44amiconn500/2500 would be linear reduction
19:15:54XavierGririver memory is ~700KB
19:17:02XavierGrwhat about the Ondio?
19:17:32amiconnOndio is the as the recorder memory-wise
19:17:40XavierGrok then
19:17:41amiconn*is the same as...
19:22:48XavierGrwhich is the play button define for "Play"?
19:24:00amiconngtg, bbl
19:24:06 Part amiconn
19:24:09XavierGrbye and thanks
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19:33:21XavierGrnow only the alphabetical sorting remains...
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19:35:07Slashercommitted the "pop fix"
19:36:25crwlrockbox only plays classical music now?
19:36:40Slasherhehe :D
19:36:40 Join hshah [0] (
19:37:04Slasherthe annoying dc offset should have been mostly fixed now
19:37:23 Join linuxstb [0] (
19:37:23hshahthe what what Slasher? (soz ive just entered the irc)
19:37:39hshahand woo hoo they allowed us to stop that idiotic beeping :p
19:37:43Slasherhshah: just committed another fix for the playback pops
19:37:55Slasher.. :D
19:37:58linuxstbSlasher: Did you read in the logs that I found my ALAC problem?
19:38:04Slasheryeh, i fixed that too
19:38:06XavierGrSlasher Are they competely removed?
19:38:16Slasherlinuxstb: Hmm, not yet (i will check that)
19:38:44SlasherXavierGr: i am not sure.. at least with my sennheiser headphones they seem to be gone
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19:40:21Slasherlinuxstb: ah, you had a problem with the seek_buffer
19:40:33XavierGrGreat! I will start testing immediately.
19:41:06linuxstbSlasher: Yes. I didnŽ't realise that using seek_buffer() would flush the PCM buffer.
19:42:21Slasherlinuxstb: do you think it would be better if codecs could call the buffer flushing function?
19:42:51linuxstbEither that, or playback.c flushes the buffer before telling the codec to seek.
19:44:14Slasherhmm, flushing the buffer before would work too? i will try that
19:46:50linuxstbI think it would. But maybe the codecs could call a seek_completed() function to tell the playback code if the seek was successful (or not). That function would flush the buffer - so we are back to your first idea.
19:48:19linuxstbAnyway, it's not urgent - my ALAC code is working perfectly now with advance_buffer(),
19:48:48Slasheri do it now before the feature freeze.. :)
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19:55:06linuxstb Slasher: I think a seek_completed() function is probably the best approach - if you flush the buffer before telling a codec to seek, the codec may add more data before seeking.
19:56:25linuxstbBut I've got to go - 20 seconds left on the machine and no more coins...
19:56:49 Quit hshah ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
19:56:50 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
20:00:26 Quit dpassen1 ()
20:08:37 Quit XavierGr ()
20:16:52 Quit thegeek_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:18:42 Join thegeek [0] (
20:20:00 Join lost|X40 [0] (
20:20:55lost|X40i hvae one quick question. On the feature comparison page, there is listing that I don't know what it means: " FF/FR with sound". would someone mind explaining
20:21:37 Quit webguest11 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
20:25:21FebsRight now you don't hear anything as you FF/RW. That feature request is for a feature similar to the iriver firmware where you can hear something as you go to give you some idea of where in the song you are.
20:26:49lost|X40oh, ok
20:27:11lost|X40seems obvious now
20:30:50 Join hshah [0] (
20:32:51hshahcan some dev please add the mode and multiple align in wps b4 tomorrow!
20:33:26HClwhy before tomorrow?
20:33:37hshahfeature freeze
20:33:42HCloh right.
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20:39:05 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (
20:43:32SlasherHmm, what do you think about the alignment patch, is there any reason not to add it?
20:47:01Slasherand the mode patch, and
20:47:46Slasherif nobody has anything against them, i think i will commit these. please revert back should they cause any problems
20:48:14Paul_The_NerdI haven't used them personally, but I've seen/heard nothing but good things about the multiple aligns in forums 'n such.
20:49:03Slasherat least they seem to compile fine (i have tried just iriver at the moment) and i didn't notice any side effect
20:51:36Paul_The_NerdI should've tried it, now that I think about it. One of the biggest problems I have with my WPS could be fixed by it.
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20:53:44leftrightSlasher: could I inetrest you in implementing ReplayGain 'Track' mode if shuffle is selected ? :)
20:54:25leftrightperhaps make it a feature under ReplayGain submenu
20:54:30Slasherleftright: Hmm, that was discussed before and it could cause problems while shuffling only one album
20:54:39SlasherOf course if it's a separate option, i think it would be ok
20:55:28Slasherbut does anybody have any experience if the align/mode patches will break archos players?
20:55:28Paul_The_NerdYeah, but if you're gonna make it a separate option, why don't they just go and pick "track" mode anyway, 'eh?
20:56:04Paul_The_NerdI still need to kidnap my brother's archos one day, since he uses it no longer.
20:56:14leftrightbecause, I frequently switch between Track and album mode, depending whats in the playlist
20:57:23Slasherat least i will commit the mode patch, i am not yet sure about the alignment patch but it seems to be ok too
20:59:49Paul_The_NerdIs there any reason it shouldn't or might not work?
21:00:11*Paul_The_Nerd doesn't know the differences between the way things work on the Archos and the iRiver targets.
21:00:28Slasherit is a longer patch and i don't have archos to verify. I think some dev should verify it and after that it could be committed
21:01:24 Quit DangerousDan ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
21:08:37lost|X40for iRiver, is daily or the current release recommended?
21:09:19Paul_The_NerdDaily, the current "release" version doesn't support iriver at all.
21:09:37lost|X40oh, yea, i read that
21:09:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:18:00Slashermode patch committed
21:24:53 Quit Febs (" Like's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> <-")
21:26:43 Part nobby_zzzz
21:30:51Paul_The_NerdWhoa, red like crazy.
21:30:57*Paul_The_Nerd points to the daily builds page.
21:33:36Slasheroh, that's not good.. fixing..
21:36:58Paul_The_NerdReally, looking at the outputs, it doesn't look too bad.
21:39:17Slashershould be fixed now
21:39:38Slasheri am quite afraid if i should commit the wps align patch too.. it can cause more problems
21:39:41Paul_The_NerdY'know, it's really irrational considering all the real things that could be being worked on, but every time I look at that page I wish someone would put in some hacks, or comment out something, or something so that the red bits on the right would go away. Hehehe
21:40:32Slasherit's easy to "fix" those reds but we don't want to do that..
21:40:41Paul_The_NerdBecause then someone might think it works?
21:40:49Slasherthat's because there is no bootloader for h3xx, lcd driver etc.
21:41:00Paul_The_NerdYeah, I figured that was the case.
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21:44:53LinusNSlasher: that was an odd comment for committing the multi-align patch
21:46:19LinusN"Archos players doesn't have a hold switch"
21:46:36Paul_The_NerdLook at the previous commit
21:46:39 Join BoD[] [0] (
21:46:42Paul_The_NerdAnd the build results for it.
21:46:43BoD[]Hello friends !
21:47:34 Join amiconn [0] (
21:51:46 Nick solex_ is now known as solex (
21:52:51amiconnSlasher: H1x0 sims still red...
21:56:56*LinusN fixed
21:57:16LinusNi still don't like the way the multi-align patch was committed
21:58:30SlasherLinusN: hehe, sorry if it was wrong.. i don't have an archos player
21:58:42SlasherLinusN: but what do you think about wps align patch?
21:59:10Slasherif you think it's ok, i could commit it now (i have to go soon, so if there are problems i can't fix them today)
22:00:31LinusNSlasher: you have committed it already
22:00:37Slasherno i haven't
22:00:46Slasheri just committed the mode patch
22:01:10LinusNjno you didn't
22:01:37LinusNSlasher: check your latest commit
22:01:42Slasherthat is the multi align patch and it's much bigger than the mode patch..
22:02:09Slasherargh, sorry about that :(
22:02:20Slasheri didn't mean to commit it..
22:02:29LinusNsee what i mean now?
22:02:31Slasheri had patched it again and i forgot that..
22:02:54Slasherplease feel free to revert it back
22:03:38LinusNnever mind
22:04:40amiconnAlmost ready to commit runtime database hookup for archos...
22:05:39 Join RotAtoR [0] (
22:10:04SlasherLinusN: Hmm, do you think we are going to keep the align patch? If so, i could commit the remaining little changes for that..
22:11:11 Quit BoD[] ("byebye")
22:12:45Slasherhmm, is there a way to modify the latest cvs commit log text? I would like to correct it too
22:13:27lost|X40guys, i just wanted to say thanks. i will definitely be hooking you up with some paypal in the near future. this is awesome
22:13:50Slasherthe latest commit i did, it was so wrong
22:14:07Paul_The_NerdPeople make mistakes.
22:15:25LinusNSlasher: commit the rest too
22:15:40LinusNamiconn: how does the db hookup look?
22:16:02LinusNi'm pretty sure it'll break the a-b function :-)
22:16:44amiconnLinusN: It looks quite similar to how it works for iriver
22:17:15amiconnI'm doing a final test with an album with many short tracks.
22:18:31SlasherLinusN: done
22:19:02Slashernight everybody :) ->
22:19:59LinusNSlasher: i was surprised that the codec thread worked at all when the thread limit was reached...
22:20:29SlasherLinusN: it was the pcm recording thread that failed to load :)
22:20:46 Join Lear [0] (
22:20:50Slasherthat's because it took some time to figure out what was wrong
22:21:28amiconnLinusN: Rockbox kernel magic ;)
22:21:48Slasherso the pcm recording initialized the queue and usb handler was waiting for that thread to acknowledge the connection too but it never did that
22:22:16LearSlasher: just curios, is space for voice codec always allocated if a language file is present? and how is a new languange selection handled? :)
22:22:40Slasheri also found that i couldn't activate the recording function, then i did some logf:ing and finally found that the thread did not load at all
22:23:03SlasherLear: yes, it's always allocated when there is a language file
22:23:18Slasheri haven't tried language changing but i think it should work
22:23:23LinusNSlasher: i guess a panic() is in place when a thread can't be created :-)
22:23:54SlasherLinusN: hehe, maybe it should be :) but instead everything was working "fine" :D
22:24:00LearI was wondering what would happen if the user changes to a language with a larger file...
22:24:10Lear(larger voice file)
22:24:28SlasherLear: iirc, it will re-initialize the audio system
22:24:40Slasherbut now i really have to go, c u tomorrow again :)
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22:29:11amiconnLinusN: Does the A-B patch still apply after my mpeg.c cleanup?
22:31:09LinusNamiconn: i doubt it very much
22:31:32LinusNi wonder about the mechanism you use for the db "events"
22:32:09LinusNthe a-b patch introduces an event system in mpeg.c
22:32:21LinusNand i assume your db hookup does that too?
22:32:22amiconnLook at how this is handled in apps/playback,c for iriver
22:32:41amiconnMy approach is very similar
22:33:19amiconnThe hardest part was to determine where to insert the callback calls
22:33:37LinusNcallback? not messages?
22:34:01amiconndatabase.c registers callbacks on iriver.
22:34:15LinusNoh, why?
22:34:22amiconnDoing the same on archos was the logical way for me
22:34:30LinusNi see
22:34:40LinusNi'm not a big fan of callbacks myself
22:34:54amiconnThe database code needs callbacks for 3 events, to avoid spinning the disk on every track change
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22:35:32LinusNi just wonder why callbacks and not messages
22:36:17LinusNcallbacks often gives problems, because you often don't know which thread will run the code
22:36:30amiconnMessages do have a problem - they have a standard layout
22:37:05amiconnThere is no database thread
22:37:09LinusNi know
22:37:25amiconnSo where would you send the messages?
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22:37:39LinusNi haven't looked into the db code myself
22:37:57preglowis it just me, or is something wildly wrong with the codecs? even libmad boosts 100% here now
22:38:22LinusNpreglow: ouch
22:38:30preglowsomeone please check
22:38:31*LinusN blames Slasher
22:38:35preglowthis isn't the newest build
22:39:13LinusNamiconn: will you commit this evening?
22:39:26amiconn[22:17:17] <amiconn> I'm doing a final test with an album with many short tracks.
22:40:14amiconnShould be done in about 30 minutes
22:40:44LinusNi want to do the a-b stuff tonight
22:40:53amiconnThis will add another ~1.2 KB to the archos builds... :/
22:41:02LinusNi'm sure
22:41:09LinusNpreglow: a-b repeat
22:41:10amiconnNo, db hookup
22:41:27amiconnPart of it is code in database that was disabled for archos
22:42:42amiconnLinusN: I don't think callbacks are problematic as long as some general rules are obeyed
22:42:56LinusNperhaps not
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22:43:07amiconnIn case of the database callbacks it would be a very bad idea to call them from an isr...
22:43:09LinusNbut sometimes "registering" is a quite unnecessary thing
22:43:40amiconnIn this case registering is avoiding hard-coded callbacks from firmware to app layer, at least on archos
22:44:29LinusNyes, the playback should really be moved to apps/ on archos too
22:44:44preglowLinusN: seems he fixed it with the unused codec swapping commit
22:44:53preglowin which case codec swapping sure as hell carries an overhead
22:45:17amiconnLear: I agree, but that needs quite some changes. Currently mpeg.c handles both playback and recording...
22:45:48LinusNi know, but it should still be done some day
22:46:04amiconnActually I would love to see playback code unified. I need a way to integrate pcm support....
22:47:20amiconnI'll probably play a bit with the pcm codec soon
22:47:27preglowso, you've gotten it?
22:47:43amiconnYes, accompanied by the documentation :)
22:47:50preglownow, there's something
22:47:58amiconnI'm not yet allowed to publish it though
22:48:09preglowis there a mas assembler around?
22:48:16amiconnAwaiting the final ok from Micronas
22:48:26amiconnYes, but not officially
22:48:49amiconnThere's also some documentation about the assembler. DSP assembler is really weird
22:49:13amiconnWhat is missing is all interface documentation, i.e. how is dma working etc
22:49:15preglowmas is weirder than most
22:49:23preglowbut dsps can be pretty strange, yes
22:51:49 Quit thebum ("ah fuck it")
22:52:31amiconnpreglow: Actually the mas assembler also contains an emulator...
22:52:39preglowwell hooray
22:53:03preglowi'm not touching that stuff with a five foot pole, though ;)
22:57:43preglowjust a little faster, and libmad should be content with 48mhz for most bitrates :/
22:58:09amiconnIt already is for 128kbps...
22:58:29preglowyes, and almost for 192
22:58:36amiconnHowever, one of my planned changed will lower the standard frequency a bit...
22:58:57preglowwe should do some tests before we lower it, imho
22:59:21preglowto see if it even pays off
22:59:44amiconnI won't lower it much. I just need it to be an integer multiple of the default frequency for better timer handling through frequency changes
23:00:06preglowwell, in what steps can you alter it?
23:00:12amiconn11 MHz
23:00:30amiconnStandard frequency will be ~45 MHz, boosted ~125 MHz
23:00:42amiconn(x4 and x11)
23:00:44preglowsounds reasonable enough
23:01:08preglowi still wonder if doing all heavy work at 120mhz is better than doing what you can at 48
23:01:21amiconnWe already do the latter...
23:01:26preglowyes, i know
23:01:41amiconn...and I think it is the better solution
23:01:46preglowbut that's not something we do because we know it to be better
23:02:03preglowyes, i kind of think it to be the best solution myself
23:02:11amiconn...because it keeps the cpu boosted for less time, and avoids idling
23:02:27preglowand when we've even got some codecs going at 48mhz, it's all good
23:02:43preglowlibmad, wavpack and ac3 is content with 48mhz, mostly
23:02:47amiconnIf idling would need *no* power, the other solution might be better, or at least equivalent
23:03:04amiconn...but idling *does* need some power
23:03:35amiconnI wonder a different thing, and I think I will do an experiment soon
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23:04:01amiconnFrom the datasheet it looks like the pll can also clock *down* i.e. < 11 MHz
23:04:10amiconnDoes that save power?
23:04:22preglowwell, no point unless it does
23:04:23preglowbut sounds dubious
23:04:33amiconnThe core will eat less power, but in turn we need to leave the pll running instead of setting it to bypass
23:04:46preglowyes, and i dont know how much it needs
23:04:49preglowbut seems i gotta go
23:04:55 Quit preglow ("CGI:IRC")
23:05:34 Part vbb ("Leaving")
23:06:05 Quit zezayer ("C Ya's All")
23:09:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:11:06 Join shin [0] (
23:11:42shinmaybe someone has seen jayms lately ?
23:12:22 Join Febs [0] (
23:12:22Bagderwhat's that?
23:13:05shinwhats what ?
23:13:09shinjayms ?
23:13:20shinsome guy who stole my pic ..
23:13:27shinand i want to talk with him
23:13:34shini found logs that he was chatting here
23:15:20amiconnOkay, seems to work. Prepare for impact... ;)
23:15:39Bagder3:45 hours to freeze
23:16:13 Quit shin ("BitchX: Now available for the Gibson")
23:16:28amiconnWah, I don't manage to get solid cube on archos in before freeze :(
23:16:55Paul_The_NerdYou have time, quickly! :-P
23:17:26Bagderdoes anyone use the runtimedb?
23:17:32LinusNamiconn: i'll file a bug report about the cube not being solid :-)
23:17:40 Join stripwax_ [0] (
23:17:50stripwax_ello ello
23:18:16Paul_The_NerdBagder, that's the convenient thing that lets you sort by album, artist, or genre, right?
23:18:25amiconnBagder: I don't know, but having dead code is imho worse than having a working feature, even if only a couple of people use it
23:18:33BagderPaul_The_Nerd: no, that's the regular songdb
23:18:39Paul_The_NerdWhat's runtimeDB?
23:18:54BagderPaul_The_Nerd: its the db that collects run-time data about played songs
23:19:08Paul_The_NerdAh, for "times played" and such?
23:19:21Bagderamiconn: I'm not arguing about that, I'm just curious if there is a single user of this
23:19:29amiconnTimes played and rating as of now
23:19:35Paul_The_NerdI considered using that, but seeing as I didn't know the behavior I chose not to.
23:19:35 Join hicks [0] (
23:19:38amiconnBagder: HCl?
23:20:02Bagderyes, one could assume he uses it ;-)
23:20:09amiconn...and actually me atm, as I need to test the hookup ;)
23:20:11Paul_The_NerdLike, I personally would like it to only register a song as "played" if I listened to more than the first 15 seconds or so, and such, as I tend to just load up a playlist of nearly everything, then skip songs I'm not in the mood.
23:20:37BagderI agree
23:20:47Paul_The_NerdI downloaded like, 1300 OCRemixes, and it would be really convenient to later be able to see which ones I've skipped the most often, or every time, and remove them from the player.
23:20:57Paul_The_NerdSo, I'd really like to see it with a few options like that, but I don't use it at the moment.
23:21:01 Quit webguest90 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:21:15amiconnI think a song should count as played if it is played more than 50%
23:21:54Bagderwe could use the same limits audioscrobble does
23:21:56amiconn...and if things like this are handled within the playback code (it should know about such thing), we would even save one callback...
23:22:45amiconnThe playback code could record how many seconds of the song are actually played. Then the unbuffer event callback can decide if this counts as 'played' or not
23:23:01amiconnIt could cumulate the actual runtime as well
23:23:02 Join ]RowaN[ [0] (
23:23:59stripwax_we could even store 'number of times played' as a fixed-point value .. rather than saying 50% means played or not, just say that we have played the file 0.5 times ..
23:24:31amiconnLinusN: 1632 bytes left for fmrecorder... (gcc 3.3.6)
23:25:34]RowaN[is up to date, in that midi does not yet work on iriver?
23:25:44amiconn'Thanks' to all those graphical bells & whistles ;-/
23:26:37Paul_The_Nerd]RowaN[: They show up, and launch a viewer, but at least on my unit, no sound is produced, and eventually the viewer drops me back to the filetree with no visible/audible result.
23:27:03]RowaN[OMG talking directories now works! never worked for me before
23:27:08amiconnPaul_The_Nerd: It should write a .wav file
23:27:13Paul_The_NerdWhere does it put it?
23:27:24Paul_The_NerdMy MIDI's in the root, and no new files show up there.
23:27:40amiconnTry to change into a sub-dir and back
23:28:00amiconnReturning from a plugin doesn't refresh the tree view
23:28:20Paul_The_NerdI've run it a few times, and it doesn't even show up from USB-connection
23:28:32amiconnAh, hmm.
23:28:41amiconnDo you have that midi patch file installed?
23:28:45]RowaN[what the trip.. it reads a mp3 file name then just keeps spouting random letters after that
23:29:01Paul_The_NerdIt loads the patchset with no reported problems, then sits at "I hope this works..." for a while
23:29:04Paul_The_NerdThen, bam, back to filetree.
23:29:22]RowaN[midi patch file? nope where is it
23:29:31amiconnI admit I didn't try it myself so far
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23:30:03amiconnBagder: Compilation estimate is short as almost always :/
23:30:33Bagderits sliding average of the last 4 builds
23:30:36Paul_The_NerdIt feels like it's acting really dangerously too. The backlight stays at whatever brightness it's at when it gets to the "I hope this works..." step... like, if it's on, it stays on, and if it's off, it stays off.
23:31:12Paul_The_Nerd]RowaN[: It's the "separate sound set" mentioned on the page you linked.
23:31:15amiconnBagder: Hmm. I wonder why it is short everytime I check it for my commits...
23:31:39Bagderprobably because it doesn't show/include seconds
23:31:48hshahhi - has the multiple align patch in wps been added then?
23:31:54amiconnIt's several minutes short...
23:32:05Paul_The_Nerdhshah: Yes, apparently
23:32:29]RowaN[are the "voice menus" recorded words or does it generate those words on the fly?
23:32:50Bagderamiconn: well I have no other explanation, and it usually is not several minutes short when I've looked at it
23:32:54Paul_The_Nerdamiconn: I'm even about 90% sure I'm using the same MIDI file as the designer tested it on, since I'm pretty sure I got it from where he'd linked it once.
23:32:56stripwax_]RowaN[ - recorded words
23:33:07hshahYAY - i asked Slasher to do those two patches he did for me :)
23:33:30stripwax_is anyone likely to commit my sokoban or solitaire patches any time soon? ;-)
23:33:43amiconnBagder: Took 5 minutes longer than estimated this time...
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23:33:58]RowaN[paulthenerd: whats a .tbz2 file?
23:34:03BagderI can only repeat myself
23:34:13stripwax_]RowaN[ - bz2-zipped tarfile
23:34:15Paul_The_Nerd]Rowan[: It's a type of archive, like a .zip or a .rar
23:35:19hshahPOO - my cvs build is causing errors :(
23:35:20]RowaN[ive set dirs & filenames to use the .talk clip (of which i have none yet) but instead its still spelling them out.. is it normal for it to default back to that rather than do nothing? (i have rebooted)
23:35:30Bagderit currently estimates build time to 767 seconds
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23:35:51stripwax_hshah - hrmm?
23:35:51hshahit won't compile
23:36:15*Paul_The_Nerd has developed an innate distrust of the phrase "I hope this works..."
23:36:33amiconn]RowaN[: .talk clip should fall back to numbers if no clip exists
23:36:54 Join Coldtoast [0] (
23:36:54amiconnAt least it does on archos & for dirs
23:37:01]RowaN[it has fallen back to numbers for the dirs but spelling for the filenames
23:37:05stripwax_hshah - do you get an error message? (I'm guessing you do - what is it?). CVS build seems to work for me
23:37:07amiconnDunno about files since I don't use clips for files
23:37:17Coldtoasthey amiconn. I checked out the JPG viewer for the first time. VERY impressive!
23:37:40amiconnThanks, but the actual jpeg viewer isn't even my work
23:37:42]RowaN[yeah that jpg viewier is absolute mint =]
23:37:53 Part XMaster-ShadowX
23:38:01amiconnI just adapted it to iriver after implementing the grayscale library
23:38:19ColdtoastI'd rescued some stuff off a friend's sister's dead laptop and was browsing around for MP3s anc came across some JPGs
23:38:19 Quit hshah ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:38:27stripwax_we really need the viewer to be able to view BMPs/GIFs too
23:38:36amiconn(which then was quite some work)
23:38:46 Join hshah [0] (
23:38:49amiconnstripwax_: .bmp should be trivial
23:38:56*stripwax_ knows
23:39:10amiconn(if neglecting rle variants)
23:39:35hshahthats my error stripwax_
23:39:39stripwax_hshah - dude, you've got a bad CVS merge!
23:39:47LinusNhshah: the cvs update found conflicts
23:39:48Bagderresolve the conflict
23:39:52stripwax_go edit status.h and manually resolve
23:39:56stripwax_^^ what they said
23:40:10 Join Chamois [0] (
23:40:33hshahhow do u do that?
23:40:40Coldtoastcan I jsut say, hshah .... that's a HORRIBLE looking Windows you have goign there. heh
23:40:48stripwax_hshah - with a text editor.
23:40:59Bagderhshah: you edit the code to be real code again
23:41:13hshahColdtoast - this is not my pc - its the family one
23:41:31Coldtoastok :)
23:41:32Bagderor you remove the file and update the CVS version of it
23:41:34hshahshall i just download the status.h file from the site and replace it
23:41:40stripwax_hshah - or even, if you haven't modified status.h, just go "cvs up -A status.h" to pull the cvs version
23:42:06 Quit Lear ("Chatzilla [Firefox 1.0+/undefined]")
23:42:12ColdtoastI have a my new fave Linux distr
23:42:30stripwax_Coldtoast better than ubuntu?
23:42:30Coldtoasterr... have a new fave
23:42:36Coldtoastnah. it IS ubuntu
23:42:46ColdtoastI'd been using Mandriva
23:42:48stripwax_:-) lucky guess. never used it mysel. why so great?
23:43:03Coldtoastreally small with REALLY hardly any extras
23:43:12Coldtoastplus it's Debian I guess
23:43:31leftrightme still thinks that track mode and shuffle is a good match
23:44:22 Join Shebb [0] (
23:47:21 Quit webguest10 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:48:43]RowaN[well, those forum posts were useless, no one else agrees that its a bad thing for foobar to butcher all tags when adding replaygain
23:49:17]RowaN[even the "remove replaygain values" option deletes tags! how krazy is that
23:49:21leftrightwhy aren't your v1 and v2 tags the same in the first place
23:49:33]RowaN[because id3v1 has a character limit
23:49:34Bagderso many people have foobar tag problems
23:50:00Coldtoastfoobar wiped all my tags too
23:50:02]RowaN[all i want to do is add replaygain info without butchering my existing tags (whatever they may be). foorbar cannot do this
23:50:02amiconnI don't ;)
23:50:05leftrightso what if it has a character limit, do you tag v1 seperately in your music
23:50:12amiconnI never used foobar :)
23:50:20Bagderme neither
23:50:41]RowaN[leftright: i only use v2 when i have to
23:50:49Coldtoast]RowaN[: well, I replaygained an album and it didn't kill my tags. Bt it did copy v2 info to v1
23:51:06leftrightv2 is better than v1
23:51:10Coldtoastall my mp3s have no v1, just v2
23:51:18]RowaN[it has different surprises depending on which options you choose
23:51:31ColdtoastI was surprised that foobar copied v2 to v1. Must be a setting
23:51:58leftrighti reallt dont see the big deal, v2 is the way to go
23:53:10]RowaN[foobar cant seem to merge tho.. say i have a big comment in V2 tag.. thats all in v2.. then the rest of the info in v1.. it deletes everything apart from the v2 comment, so you lose title & artist etc
23:54:07]RowaN[anyway, foorbar bleugh, uninstalled. are there any other programs for writing replaygain tags?
23:54:30stripwax_anything bad happen if the tagdatabase was generated from a different filesystem than my actual irver?
23:54:53 Nick AliasCoffee is now known as paugh (n=pete@2001:5c0:8fff:ffff:8000:0:3e03:6822)
23:55:09Bagderstripwax_: no, not if you have the path setup properly
23:55:44stripwax_Bagder kewl. well, I think I probably do, but then, −−help doesn't actually output any help, so it's hard to tell :-)
23:56:02 Quit hshah ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:56:06Coldtoast8am. bedtime
23:56:11 Quit Coldtoast ("Leaving")
23:56:20Bagderstripwax_: yeah, the whole db situation is badly documented
23:56:32leftright]RowaN[: you should sync you v1 and v2 tags, you wouldnt have these issues then
23:57:14Paul_The_NerdYeah, is there any practical reason to not have v2 tags as well?
23:58:16 Join hshah [0] (

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