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#rockbox log for 2005-09-14

00:08:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:10:56 Quit pike| ()
00:16:35preglowcurse this weather
00:19:25*Zagor just rode his bike back from the pub. No too shoddy weather. :-)
00:19:56preglowbut you haven't got some quasi hurricane going on at your coast either
00:20:22Zagoroh, dramatics at your end? /me checks theyr
00:20:27preglowi wont be going outside in this weather unless i'm forced
00:20:43preglownothing more dramatic than rain and wind, heh
00:21:14 Join Nuxator [0] (
00:21:18Zagorwhich city are you in?
00:21:40Zagoror near
00:22:04 Join pike [0] (
00:22:45 Quit chenco (Remote closed the connection)
00:22:48preglowquite smack dab in the middle of
00:23:09 Join linuxstb__ [0] (
00:24:28 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (
00:25:03 Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:25:50preglowso, i take it eliminating all mallocs i can is a good thing?
00:25:50 Quit gromit` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:26:11Zagorgenerally, yes
00:27:11 Quit Nuxator ("CGI:IRC")
00:27:11Zagorare you working on the flac now?
00:27:21preglowyeah, i was just about to start gutting out the malloc code
00:27:35 Join gromit` [0] (n=gromit`
00:27:36preglowi might end up stuffing some of the static structs in ordinary ram anyway, but still, it saves a malloc
00:28:29 Quit ashridah ("uni")
00:28:33ep0chpreglow: do you think libmad and tremor will get much of a speedup with the extra iram?
00:28:57preglowep0ch: well, at least some
00:29:04preglowep0ch: i've got some plans for both of them
00:29:18ep0chcoolm libmad is so nearly realtime without boost
00:29:24preglowi'll just have to get this frigging wav writer going
00:29:38preglowand things keep coming up and pushing me away from the computer, heh
00:29:46preglowep0ch: actually, it _is_ realtime for some bitrates
00:29:51preglowep0ch: 128 and 160, for instance
00:29:57ep0chgood job the weather is bad then :)
00:29:58preglowat 48mhz
00:30:27 Quit zeekoe (" ")
00:30:44ep0chyeah, some of my 192 kbps seem realtime, but some other 192 kbps aren't
00:31:00linuxstbMmm. *PANIC* Stkov Main - loading a new WPS whilst playing music on the iriver.
00:31:16preglowstkov _main_ ?
00:32:00linuxstbI was playing an ALAC file, but I'm pretty certain it would have happened with other codecs - I'll do some tests.
00:32:25preglowi got a stkov once
00:32:31preglowbut can't remember the thread
00:32:35preglowi didn't load no wps, though
00:32:50linuxstbBTW, is rebooting after a stkov by pressing ON one of Linus's new features, or has it always been there?
00:34:02preglowhmm, definitely not been there
00:34:10preglowi had to reset mine with some contraption when it happened to me
00:34:13preglowon the train, of course
00:34:14markunJust compiled rockbox and now I get 'codec failure' with all my ogg's.. I wonder what causes it.
00:34:26preglowmarkun: i get that sometimes, make clean, etc, etc
00:34:43Zagorlinuxstb: Now panicf() shuts off the hard drive and lowers the CPU frequency, it also reboots if ON is pressed.
00:34:46markunI did config, will try to clean eveything first
00:34:58Zagor(cvs commit message earlier today)
00:35:00preglowconfig doesn't necessarily clean all the files
00:35:03linuxstbZagor: That takes all the fun out of searching for something to press reset with.
00:35:16linuxstbiriver development is not the same...
00:35:24Bagderwe should punish linus for that
00:35:40linuxstbBut it's about time - I think a few people have broken their reset buttons by now.
00:35:47preglowhow to make downsample() and upsample() stereo without a kludge...
00:35:59preglowi don't know how they manage to do that
00:36:05preglowi've reset mine god knows how many times
00:36:13preglowi do tend to be careful, however
00:36:19 Join sheeep [0] (n=sheeep@
00:36:31linuxstbMy girlfriend will be pleased that she can keep her ear-rings in now.
00:36:42ep0chheh :)
00:37:59preglowlinuxstb: did you try some asm opts for alac?
00:38:19linuxstbNo, I'm waiting for your wav-writer :).
00:39:20linuxstbI've been trying to finish my Sudoku so I can commit it and forget about it when the feature freeze is over.
00:40:41preglowdont hold your breath for that wavwriter
00:40:45ep0chsudoku, cool! does it have a save option though? :s
00:41:05linuxstbep0ch: Of course. Check yesterday's CVS logs - you can download it now if you want to have a look.
00:41:39ep0chwhere can i get it precompiled?
00:42:11ep0chhaven't figured out how to get the cross compiler working under freebsd yet (am very lazy)
00:42:14linuxstbI can put up a for you. It changes the plugin API (adding the menus), so I can't just give you the .rock
00:42:42ep0chthat would be grand
00:43:45linuxstbIt's here:
00:43:56ep0chis it possible to cram super sudoku on the ihp screen? ;)
00:43:59linuxstbIt's my development version of Rockbox, so it also has the ALAC decoder in it.
00:44:07ep0choh lucky me :)
00:44:22ep0chi'll let you know how i get on with sudoku :D
00:45:13linuxstbIf you grab you will find two ".ss" files containing Sudoku games. Just open these in the file browser, and they will be opened by my sudoku plugin.
00:46:42ep0chdoes sudoku plugin set the cpu speed to 11 mhz or does it stay at 48?
00:46:52ep0ch(to save battery)
00:47:07linuxstbIt does nothing to the CPU speed. I didn't think Rockbox was capable of dropping to 11mhz (yet).
00:47:21linuxstbBut I would expect you to be listening to music at the same time.
00:47:36ep0chwell, if you go to the cpufreq menu and press the joystick button you get 11
00:49:14 Join bagawk [0] (i=1000@unaffiliated/bagawk)
00:50:34preglowthat doesn't make sense
00:51:04preglowit'll be switched to 48mhz as soon as you touch playback anyway
00:51:12ep0chi know
00:52:08 Quit ender` (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:52:33ep0chbut if dont want to listen to music while using the plugins you can save battery
00:52:38preglownot much
00:53:00preglowbut we'll see
00:53:03ep0cheverybit helps
00:53:20ep0chi usually drop it down to 11 when i'm using the radio
00:53:44ep0chgui seems just as responsive at 11
00:54:37ep0chsudoku is seriously cool :)
00:55:11ep0chpressing the joystick button to cycle numbers is a bit annoying though
00:55:52linuxstbWhat's the alternative?
00:56:28ep0chmy suggestion would be, that pressing the joystick should change between 'insert number mode' and 'navigate mode', and in 'insert number mode' up and down or left and right on the stick increment or decrements the number
00:56:39flurblelinuxstb: psychic mind-reading interface!
00:56:55linuxstbflurble: I knew you were going to say that.
00:57:34linuxstbep0ch: That was my original idea (and implementation). But I decided this way would be less keypresses. Just hold the joystick down and it cycles through the numbers
00:58:56ep0chyour original idea just seems more natural to me
00:59:21ep0chup/down o
00:59:27preglowlinuxstb: so, where does one get alac files? i thought the only place it was used was for the airport thinmg
00:59:43ep0chup/down on the stick is much less effort than tapping
01:00:06ep0chalso, a timer would be good
01:00:10linuxstbYou have to encode them via iTunes.
01:00:48linuxstbep0ch: Don't tap - just hold it down.
01:01:21ep0chi guess i will get used to it :D
01:01:29linuxstbTry and play a proper game and let me know what you think.
01:02:00linuxstbI agree a timer would be nice. But I just want the core program committed to CVS before I think about extra features like that.
01:02:20ep0choh ok, its been a few weeks since i did sudoku so i may take a while to finish a game :)
01:06:06ep0chlinuxstb: ok i've done a few moves, its quite easy to cheat :)
01:06:35linuxstbpreglow: I've put an example ALAC file here if you want a look: I downloaded it from mplayer's website, but it's not there any more after their recent server crash
01:06:42ep0chi.e. the 'Illegal move' prompt
01:06:56linuxstbHow can you cheat?
01:07:12ep0chcycle through each number without thinking
01:07:22ep0chuntil you dont get the illegal move
01:07:33preglowlinuxstb: 404
01:07:37linuxstb"illegal" just means it doesn't obey the three laws of sudoku. It could still be incorrect.
01:08:01linuxstbpreglow: Try again now.
01:08:16preglowlinuxstb: better
01:08:35linuxstbI hope that file works - I don't think I've tested it myself on the iriver.
01:08:37preglowlinuxstb: you got a codec for me as well?
01:08:53preglowlinuxstb: forget it, i keep forgetting codec files need core support ;)
01:09:47linuxstbDid you grab my file?
01:12:24preglownot important anyway, i can wait
01:12:42ep0chlinuxstb: 'solve' isnt implemented yet?
01:13:10linuxstbep0ch: No, but it soon will be.
01:13:21ep0chwill be a nice touch
01:14:05ep0chi cant see too clearly but do the hard coded values have a darker background colour?
01:14:31linuxstbYou can't change those (obviously), but you can always change anything else.
01:14:50ep0chmaybe i need to change the contrast to see the background colour :s
01:15:08linuxstbInteresting. I'm just using the default contrast.
01:16:15ep0choh thats better, i had contrast set to 26, now its 31 and i can see properly now
01:17:25 Join hicks [0] (
01:20:25 Quit sheeep ()
01:20:59 Join Strath [0] (
01:23:47ep0chlinuxstb: i like it, i'm used to the navigation now. I think maybe an option to always keep the backlight on would be useful.
01:24:13 Quit matsl (Remote closed the connection)
01:26:12linuxstbI'm not sure if a plugin can control the backlight (or if it should), but I'll add it to the to-do list.
01:28:23preglowit should
01:28:29preglowthe viewer, for example
01:28:34preglowi would love to have constant backlight
01:28:52ep0chlinuxstb: not sure if its specific to your build or not, but some of my mp3s no longer display the bitrate
01:29:01ep0ch(in the wps)
01:31:17linuxstbep0ch: I don't think it's my build - it should be up to date with CVS.
01:31:46linuxstbHold old was your firmware before you replaced it with mine?
01:31:55linuxstb^How old
01:32:17ep0chprobably something amiconn has done
01:32:46ep0chwell i updated earlier today, but didnt really test it then
01:32:54ep0chlast time before that was a few days ago
01:33:17markunpreglow: I was thinking of modifying rockbox to have a manual backlight switch.
01:35:46ep0chin fact most of my mp3s dont display bitrate now
01:35:59ep0chanyway i'm off
01:36:32 Part ep0ch ("Kopete 0.10.3 :")
01:37:23preglowmarkun: manual how?
01:37:35preglowsomeone please do this wavwriter for me :/
01:37:38markunpreglow: Use the record button as an on/off switch
01:37:39preglowi have no idea how this code works
01:38:08linuxstbpreglow: I think the hardest part is telling the wavwriter when to start and stop. Plus getting it to display information.
01:39:55preglowand i don't want the wps screen
01:40:09preglowtelling it when to stop is easy, i just want it to render one track
01:40:19preglowwhen i press 'stop' i've had enoug
01:40:26preglowjust like the good old xxx2wav plugins
01:41:04preglowi'll just give up for now, i have absolutely no idea of how to do this
01:41:13preglowand i'm nice and tired
01:42:12Mooshere too good night all
01:42:21 Quit Moos (" Like's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> <-")
01:42:23linuxstbIt would be easy if plugins could use the codecs. But that's not easy to make happen either.
01:42:38 Join rasher [0] (
01:44:05preglownot easy at all
01:45:26rasherPlugins can control the backlight
01:45:41rasherCheck clock.c and chessclock.c
01:46:10linuxstbrasher: Thanks - I'll have a look.
01:48:38 Quit gromit` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:50:43rasherWhat's the status of release? Other than what's on releasetodo
01:51:50preglowcommit amiconns changes, then release
01:51:56preglowthat's the last i heard from the uppity ups
01:52:14 Quit bagawk ("Leaving")
01:52:16linuxstbCheck the IRC logs from yesterday morning. (12 hours ago).
01:52:47rasherSomeone should rewrite the recording section of the changelog :-\
01:59:13 Join gromit` [0] (n=gromit`
01:59:42linuxstbWow. I'm impressed with the Sudoku solver I've stolen. It solves a puzzle instantly, even on the Archos recorder.
02:00:03linuxstbThis puzzle must be easier than I thought.
02:00:19rasherI believe generating puzzles is closely related to generating them
02:00:47preglowlinuxstb: it's not
02:00:55preglowlinuxstb: but there exists a clever algo
02:01:07preglowlinuxstb: solving a sudoko puzzle is actually an np-complete problem
02:01:51preglowdancing links, the algo is called
02:03:50linuxstbI'm too tired to think about it.
02:04:29preglowsomeone please pay slasheri to do the wav writer :-/
02:06:16rasherAh, this is the sudoku thing I found: portable C, it seems
02:06:26rasherOf course, the page is written in Danish :-\
02:07:01linuxstbI used the solver from here:
02:07:32rasherWith an url like that, you can't go wrong
02:08:25linuxstbrasher: First good news - your Danish program has a copy of the GPL in the source code.
02:08:56***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:09:29preglowseems like it's a simple backtrakcing solver
02:10:13rasherIt mentions potentially taking days creating games
02:10:18rasherThe page, that is
02:10:30linuxstbrasher: The code seems to be split into three files - an X11 GUI, a win32 GUI and the core functions in C. So it seems a good bet for Rockbox.
02:10:35linuxstbUnless it takes days....
02:10:52preglowi'd imagine that's for a particularily large game
02:11:03rasherActually, it's for a small game, I think
02:11:08rasher(with few numbers)
02:11:15preglowthen that's a showstopper, plain and simple, heh
02:11:45rasherBut.. I don't know, it may just be in pretty extreme cases
02:12:02rasherBut the way the code is written lends itself nicely to using in Rockbox
02:12:26rasherI guess you could test its speed against the other solver
02:12:35preglowoooooh, i'll _never_ be rid all the mallocs in libflac :////
02:13:46linuxstbI wonder how well libFLAC 0.3 would work with current FLAC files.
02:14:30*linuxstb goes to test
02:14:47preglowdidn't these people in the least think of embedded platforms?
02:14:54preglowi'll frigging kill them, i swear
02:15:41linuxstbCalm down :).
02:15:42 Quit hicks (Remote closed the connection)
02:18:11linuxstbOh well, flac-0.3 doesn't work.
02:18:24linuxstbDidn't really expect it to.
02:20:12preglowstill, using an older lib isn't a very good solution
02:21:06linuxstbWhy not? The FLAC spec hasn't changed. If it works, it works. If not, then we won't use it - or we can fix anything that doesn't work.
02:21:47rasherI'm still annoyed that the reference decoder includes id3v2 skipping
02:21:53rasheronly served to give people bad ideas..
02:23:59linuxstbThat's been present since the very beginning of FLAC.
02:24:08linuxstbBut I agree it's a stupid idea.
02:24:59linuxstbBut on the other hand, FLAC has succeeded in becoming the most widely-implemented lossless codec, so he's done something right.
02:25:46preglowi just can't stand this source
02:25:47preglowit's unreadable
02:26:14linuxstbI know.
02:26:37preglowi think i'll flame the bugger and ask what the hell he's on
02:30:14 Quit markun ()
02:39:21preglowmost of the things i want to do depends on this frigging wav writer
02:39:24preglowoh well
02:39:29preglowi'm too tired to do anything now
02:40:11linuxstbWould resurrecting the flac2wav plugin help you?
02:41:52preglowwell, yeah, but let's not do that ;)
02:41:53preglownot yet, at least
02:42:00preglowgotta sleep for now anyway
02:42:02preglowsee ya later
02:42:26linuxstbYes - I wasn't planning on doiing it now - just if the wavwrite proves too hard.
02:42:47preglowslasheri at least said it should be easy, but he's also pretty familiar with the code, which i'm not
02:42:50preglowwe'll see
02:42:53 Quit preglow ("leaving")
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03:00:58 Quit _aLF ("Leaving")
03:15:46 Quit Sucka ("a bird in the bush is worth two in your house")
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03:55:42 Quit lostlogic ("Going to the moon")
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04:08:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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04:51:57 Quit rasher ("Ex-Chat")
05:37:41 Join snax [0] (
05:38:58snaxanyone try patching and installing the 1.65-US firmware on an iRiver H120?
05:39:39snaxI'm interested in the playlist/flac features of rockbox, but of course I won't want to risk bricking my player if it's still too unstable
06:09:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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06:47:37 Quit lostlogic ("Going to the moon")
06:51:47 Join LinusN [0] (
06:59:03 Join lostlogic [0] (
07:46:33B4gdersnax: many people have
07:56:03amiconnI just started a test of my latest xing fixes.
07:56:05snaxany word on when there will be an "official" release for the iRiver series?
07:56:10LinusNsnax: no
07:57:07amiconnI've left out the adaption to closest bitrate, it's a too complex change for a last minute addition, and it would need some thoughts about passing buffer size limits if we don't want to allocate the theoretical maximum
07:57:17snaxhmm, well, as long as I can reliably get back into the original firmware to reflash if somthing isn't working, then I suppose it's not a huge risk to try it now
07:57:25LinusNsnax: exactly
07:57:46LinusNsnax: in fact, you are more safe with the rockbox boot loader than without it
07:57:58B4gderthe biggest risk is that you won't want to ever return to the original firmware ;-)
07:58:22snaxalright, guess I'll give it a shot
07:58:36*snax double checks the md5sum
08:00:20snaxfc559f9797e5a11f7e84dff19d1ceb6d ihp_120.hex
08:00:37snaxlooks good
08:02:00snaxworked fine so far
08:02:16snaxgot the rockbox bootloader text, then the regular firmware kicked in
08:02:40snaxstill plays music :)
08:02:50snaxok, now to install the actual firmware image
08:03:44snaxI want to use flac, so I should probably grab a recent snapshot
08:04:10B4gderyou want a recent, regardless
08:05:43LinusN"emergency" poweroff works fine
08:06:00amiconnHmm. I think there's more work to do on the archos recording, but I don't want to delay the release too much...
08:06:01LinusNi wonder if it should splash() a message about it...
08:06:21snaxwhat does "dir buffer is full!" mean
08:06:41B4gdersnax: it means you need to read the FAQ
08:06:52snaxgood idea
08:07:14amiconnI want to finish the test of my latest xing fixes, which will unfortunately take until the evening
08:07:32LinusNamiconn: no rush
08:08:37amiconn"Emergency poweroff" sounds like Big Red Button ;)
08:08:57LinusNit's that timeout we discussed yesterday
08:08:58B4gderis that the button next to the self-destruct one?
08:09:06***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:09:14LinusNB4gder: no, it's behind a hatch
08:09:28LinusNpush the "self destruct" button to open it
08:10:07snaxso many settings!
08:10:17snaxwill this thing brush my teeth and feed my pet, too :)
08:12:31amiconnLinusN: Keep in mind that this shutdown after timeout isn't needed on Ondio
08:12:48amiconnAh, ignore me
08:12:56LinusNi always do :-)
08:13:16amiconnIt isn't needed because of failed spinups, but it still protects from event loops not using the default handler
08:13:49amiconnThe good thing with the Ondio is that there is no critical battery voltage range.
08:14:07amiconnEither it works, or shuts down completely
08:15:05amiconnI mean critical in the sense of disk access failing etc. Of course there is a critical range where you should better not try to flash rockbox etc
08:15:24snaxI like how it doesn't take 30 seconds to rescan the file system after unplugging the USB cable
08:15:46 Join ender` [0] (i=ychat@
08:16:32amiconnLinusN: Do you know whether mpeg version 2.5 is "allowed" in conjunction with layer 1 and layer 2, or whether it's layer 3 only?
08:16:45amiconnI tend to believe it's layer 3 only...
08:16:49LinusNme too
08:17:17amiconnOtherwise real 'monster' frames would be possible, max. would be 2880 bytes
08:17:27LinusNoh, i see that the recorder never saves the runtime db when powering off with the OFF double click
08:17:53amiconnThe off doubleclick doesn't fire SYS_POWEROFF ?
08:18:06snaxmy flac -8 files seem to play without skips as far as I can tell
08:18:12LinusNyes it does, but it lets the default handler take care of it
08:18:28LinusNand the db callback is only set in the main tree loop
08:18:54LinusNi don't really like using the callback for that
08:19:13LinusN(in fact, i don't like callbacks at all)
08:19:40amiconnThe runtime db should be in synced state if no music is playing
08:20:20LinusNnot necessarily
08:20:26LinusNthe file handle is still open
08:20:58amiconn...but the code calls fsync() after each update sequence
08:21:05LinusNah, rundb_unbuffer_track()
08:22:26amiconnI wonder whether it would be a good idea to let the default handler close all open files
08:23:10amiconnPerhaps not
08:29:04LinusNi think the database should be shut down regardless, now it's only shut down if rockbox enters usb mode from the browser
08:31:30LinusNin fact, if you enter usb mode from a menu or the wps, the database will use stale information
08:46:03LinusNi think i'll ditch the callback in tree.c
08:46:33LinusNand instead have two functions in tree.c called tree_flush() and tree_restore()
08:46:45LinusNwhich are called by the default handler
08:47:02LinusNor rather, the usb screen
08:47:30LinusNtree_flush() would be called when entering usb mode, and when shutting down
08:48:40LinusNif we later on find more things that need to be flushed, we just add more xxx_flush/restore functions
08:49:07LinusNimho, those callbacks are only good/useful for the plugins
08:49:34*amiconn wants to add another callback ;)
08:49:44amiconnNot related to shutdown/ flush etc
08:49:49snaxhas anything been done to address the "Low battery protection" bug?
08:49:49amiconnALso nothing for 2.5
08:50:02LinusNsnax: yes and no
08:50:11LinusNamiconn: what callback?
08:50:14snaxany sort of quick fix to at least prevent it from being in deadlock draining the battery below safe limits
08:50:38LinusNthat's what the "emergency shutdown" is for
08:50:50amiconnI want to add a "hook" to the screenshot function, so that the grayscale library version can implement its own version
08:50:59 Join einhirn [0] (
08:51:03amiconn...which can still be triggered by the standard screenshot method
08:51:10LinusNamiconn: that's a good thing
08:51:58 Quit gromit` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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09:01:48*amiconn is curious whether the 200KB firmware size limit was actually tested for fmrecorder
09:03:45amiconnPerhaps we have more space than we believe...
09:05:52LinusNwould be ironic
09:06:46*LinusN tests
09:09:30amiconnI'll probably do some firmware size limit tests on all my units (need to flash back to pure archos first), but I don't have an fmr
09:10:15LinusNdoh! it works!
09:10:38LinusNwe are so lame!
09:10:46B4gderthat is just too funny
09:11:10 Join markun [0] (
09:11:26amiconnI'll try to find the limits for Studio, Rec v1, Ondio FM and Ondio SP
09:11:43amiconnI *know* that the limit must be >~300KB for Ondio
09:12:17amiconn...because archos has some "non-returnable" firmware upgrades, that are one that flash themselves
09:12:31amiconnThese are >300 KB
09:13:22amiconnLinusN: How did you do it? Is it sufficient to just pad a .bin with zeroes, then scramble?
09:13:56LinusNi have gcc 3.4.3 here :-)
09:14:18amiconnAh, so you didn't test a certain value (yet)
09:15:06LinusNi think patching scramble.c would be the easiest
09:18:03LinusN256k works...
09:20:02LinusN300k too
09:21:22LinusN400k doesn't
09:21:39snaxrockbox seems to make more hdd clicks than I remember the official firmware doing
09:24:48amiconnLinusN: Do you test on an unflashed fmr, or with the old flash rom image + F1-boot?
09:25:21amiconnIs this a non-flashable fmr?
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09:25:33LinusNno, i just didn't bother
09:26:25amiconnIf the fmr archos loader has the same startup time as the rec v1 one, it would really annoy me...
09:26:53LinusNit's actually slower
09:27:16LinusNa *lot* slower
09:27:42amiconnBoot time is also why I would like to see rockbox in flash on iriver
09:32:30LinusNok, the fm limit is 400k
09:36:10 Nick Lynx_awy is now known as Lynx_ (
09:37:26snaxmaybe it's my imagination, but my iriver hd is a lot noisier now
09:37:46B4gdersnax: I doubt rockbox does that
09:38:15snaxI've uninstalled rockbox for the moment
09:38:58LinusNsnax: rockbox uses the hd a lot more, if that's what you mean
09:39:25B4gderit does?
09:39:36snaxI created a big playlist in the root directory
09:39:46snaxwhen I tried to select a song in it it told me there was an error reading the playlist
09:40:20snaxthat strikes me as strange
09:40:34snaxit can't read the playlist it just created
09:40:59snaxso I'll stick with stock firmware until I'm sure the hd isn't going bad or anything
09:41:21snaxcause if it is I don't want to try to reflash it with a bad hd before sending it in for repairs
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09:46:39LinusNsnax: how did you create the playlist?
09:47:05snaxI went into the playlist options menu and selected create playlist
09:47:27LinusNwhat was the exact error?
09:48:06snaxI can't remember the exact wording, but it said "error reading playlist" or "error accessing playlist"
09:48:19snaxI was browsing the playlist and hit play on one of the files when it happened
09:49:06snaxthe error message wasn't terribly descriptive
09:49:26LinusNthat sounds like if rockbox wasn't installed properly, or that your hard drive needs a scandisk
09:50:28snaxthere were approximately 3400 or so items in the playlist
09:50:34snaxso it was fairly large
09:50:44snaxI'll try fdisking it in linux
09:54:20B4gderI use a 4000+ song playlist almost daily
09:54:23B4gderwith no problemos
09:55:56snaxdosfsck 2.11, 12 Mar 2005, FAT32, LFN
09:55:56snaxReclaimed 2666 unused clusters (21839872 bytes) in 5 chains.
09:55:56snaxFree cluster summary wrong (632402 vs. really 632390)
09:55:56DBUGEnqueued KICK snax
09:55:56snax Auto-correcting.
09:55:56snaxPerforming changes.
09:55:57***Alert Mode level 1
09:55:57snax/dev/sdc1: 3440 files, 1806098/2438488 clusters
09:56:22snaxI'm not sure if that would have cause a problem
09:56:27snaxthat's all it found wrong
09:57:16B4gderdosfsck is unfortunately not the best of tools
09:57:44snaxshould I perhaps try the reformat option in the stock firmware, and tranfer all my music again?
09:58:08B4gderif the problems remain, then that's an option
09:58:24B4gderbut if you use linux, you can just mkfs it instead of using the stock firmware
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10:05:58***Alert Mode OFF
10:09:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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10:13:46preglowwhat, there is no 200kb limit? :PPP
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10:31:05snaxyou know what
10:31:20snaxprobably I've just never noticed the clicking before because I usually have the volume higher
10:32:16snaxit makes a click when the red light goes off, so I assume it has something to do with spinning down the disk or locking the drive head (which I understand some portable hdds do to prevent scraping)
10:32:40snaxif I have music playing at normal volume I don't even hear it
10:33:50snaxhow much control does the firmware have over the drive?
10:34:31snaxpower up/down, spin up/down, seek, read/write
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10:39:10B4gderjust about full control
10:39:59snaxis there any way it can mess up the drive?
10:40:35snaxphysically, that is
10:41:28B4gderas long as usb isn't "active"
10:41:30B4gdernot that I know
10:41:31LinusNi think we can damage it if we wrote a program that repeatedly turned it on and off
10:41:44LinusNand let it run a few months
10:42:07snaxI saw someone on the forum complain that their hd died after doing a large USB transfer in rockbox
10:42:16B4gderit didn't
10:42:36B4gderor rather, I claim it didn't
10:43:06B4gderpeople draw all sorts of conclusions and fill forums with their scew view of the world
10:46:00Zagora long usb transfer is a lot less rockbox-specific drive activity than playing music.
10:46:22Zagorthe drive is spinning constantly, just like in millions of laptops around the world
10:46:37preglowwhat, you mean in the way it isn't rockbox-specific at all? ;)
10:47:26LinusNZagor: but if he did the transfer with an early version of Rockbox, the CPU might have run at a high frequency, generating more heat
10:47:56ZagorLinusN: i'd say that's also pretty normal for laptop drives to handle. many laptops run very hot.
10:49:26LinusNbut onm the other hand, this isn't exactly a laptop drive, is it?
10:50:16LinusNi still don't think for a minute that rockbox caused the claimed hard drive failure
10:50:41B4gderdisks do break at times
10:50:41Zagoroh, this was a 1.8" drive?
10:50:52B4gderof course disks will break with rockbox installed as well
10:51:03LinusNZagor: i believe it was an iriver
10:51:12LinusNbut i may be wrong
10:51:54 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
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10:53:16snaxok, since it seems pretty much impossible for rockbox to cause a failure, and it doesn't seem to cause any weird disk thrashing when I used it, I'll go ahead and reinstall it
10:53:49snaxI had a hd go back in my Rio Karma player, and then the replacement had a bad headphone jack
10:54:05B4gdersnax: hundreds of people already use it exclusively on their irivers
10:54:13snaxthe flash memory in my first mp3 player ever (rio pmp500 I think) went bad, and the replacement they sent me then didn't work
10:54:19snaxso I'm REALLY paranoid about mp3 players failing
10:54:47 Quit cYmen ("w00t")
10:55:06snaxthis iRiver thing feels really solid and hasn't given me any trouble yet, and since it's now out of production I won't want to risk fubaring it, thus the paranoia :)
10:56:46snaxthe rockbox flac support is awesome, it's one of the things I missed about the karma
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11:03:15 Join snax [0] (
11:03:33CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
11:03:33*preglow curses flac
11:03:46snaxok, playing minesweeper while I listen to music is just plain cool
11:03:55 Join webguest84 [0] (
11:04:21snaxmultitasking :)
11:04:58pregloware we still using 512k for the malloc buffer?
11:06:22amiconncodec_malloc uses the remainder of the codec ram iirc
11:06:29amiconn256K - codec_size
11:07:21preglowsource says it uses start of the audio buffer
11:07:55amiconnOh, it does?
11:08:00*amiconn checks
11:08:10preglowextern unsigned char* mallocbuf; // 512K from the start of MP3 buffer
11:09:35amiconnUgly design...
11:10:57preglowi'd love to gut out all mallocs, but for libflac, that seems like quite some work
11:16:02preglowamiconn: i take it LINE_ATTR doesn't make much sense for iram?
11:17:24preglowanyone know what the trailing star in *(.text*) (lds files) means?
11:17:28LinusNamiconn: any comments on this?
11:17:33preglowjust a wildcard?
11:17:57preglowi'm going to try introducing the cache section again
11:18:22LinusNi believe it's a wildcard
11:19:28amiconnpreglow: The line alignment determines the use of burst mode for all memory areas (that are burst enabled), also for iram
11:19:51amiconn...but I guess the speed difference for iram is minimal, or even zero
11:19:58preglowyes, zero would be my guess
11:20:34amiconnpreglow: The *(.text*) wildcard is for linking .o files created with sectioned compilation
11:21:04amiconnSectioned compilation puts each function in a separate section, named .text_<function_name>
11:21:04preglowsectioned compilation?
11:21:44preglowwhat's the use of that, again?
11:22:33LinusNto eliminate dead code
11:23:01amiconnYes, in conjunction with section garbage collection in the linker
11:23:26preglowi thought the linker was perfectly able to do this without sectioned compilation
11:23:47LinusNno it isn't, not on a function level
11:23:57LinusNonly file level, in libraries
11:24:20preglowhmm, that sucks
11:27:06Zagordoes anyone know if there's a reason for this, other than "hasn't been implemented"? it doesn't feel like it would be a difficult thing to add.
11:29:05preglowi'm convinced some linkers, at least, do this
11:29:20amiconnIiuc the linker can only act on the section level.
11:29:45Zagorpreglow: convinced as in "surely they do?" or "i've heard from good sources linker X does"?
11:29:53amiconnAll offsets within a section are already fixed at link time
11:30:07preglowZagor: i _think_ i remember testing that one did ages ago
11:30:14preglowamiconn: no, they're not
11:30:59preglowif you check a disassembly, you can clearly see that all offsets are zero
11:31:08preglowthey're set at link
11:31:27preglowso excluding a function should be easy
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11:33:28preglowat least as long as the linker knows which symbols are what, but that most of them do
11:35:31preglowis sectioned compilation something we only use for dead code detection, or do we use it all the time for some platforms?
11:37:14amiconnIt's used for certain parts only
11:37:53amiconnThe plugin library does it, to ease maintenance of e.g. the grayscale library, which would otherwise be a mess of several dozens of source files
11:38:33amiconnAnother part is bootbox for archos, for the firmware part
11:45:02preglowbut no, i'm quite convinced leaving out unused code/data should be possible within a section, but ld most certainly doesn't seem to be trying to do so
11:46:05LinusNamiconn: is there a conflict with Stop and On/Off on the Ondio?
11:47:29LinusNaha, long on/off is used to stop the music...
11:48:08LinusNand bookmark-on-stop doesn't save the bookmark when pausing
11:48:26amiconnYes, short OnOff is pause/resume, long OnOff is stop
11:49:00LinusNso we might want to extend the off timeout?
11:49:41LinusNat least so it has time to save the bookmark position
11:52:38LinusNi guess the soft poweroff should take care of the resume, but i'm not that sure about the bookmark
11:53:26 Join [IDC]Dragon [0] (
11:54:04LinusN[IDC]Dragon: welcome
11:54:06*[IDC]Dragon smiles at Rockbox now growing twice in size ;-)
11:54:47[IDC]Dragon400 kB will be a challenge for ROMbox
11:55:04 Quit ashridah (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:55:45amiconnHi Jörg :)
11:56:06ZagorFYI all: We'll be having a chat with Neuros about their next player platform on tuesday 23:00 CET in #haxx.
11:56:10amiconnI've received my Ondio FM :)
11:56:19[IDC]Dragonwhich tuner?
11:56:31amiconnThe all-good kind, mask 0F08
11:56:50amiconnIt was a really new unit, shrink-wrapped...
11:59:41[IDC]Dragonanything special about #haxx?
12:00:16Zagornah, just keeping it in a separate channel to avoid too much everyday rockbox talk (support questions etc)
12:02:08[IDC]Dragonperhaps kicking trolls
12:02:18 Join Moos [0] (
12:06:12LinusN[IDC]Dragon: i /msg:ed you
12:07:09[IDC]DragonLinusN: I responded...
12:07:39LinusN[IDC]Dragon: ah, your nick is not registered
12:07:56LinusNfreenode filters /msg from unregistered nicks
12:08:01[IDC]Dragonthen it doesn't work?
12:09:11***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:09:32[IDC]Dragonwell, the last line of my email was "Is that OK for you? Greetings, Jörg"
12:10:17[IDC]Dragonseems that it is, I got no violent complaints ;-)
12:10:28LinusNit definitely is
12:10:32[IDC]Dragonso, consider the wav codec as "open"
12:11:04[IDC]Dragonpure "laziness" (swamped in other work) kept me from publishing
12:12:12[IDC]Dragon(I need to get the PCB job for my self-developed home control into production)
12:12:23LinusN[IDC]Dragon: ah, now i see, you signed the email twice, first with "Jörg" and then with the question, after the quoted email
12:13:00LinusNso now we will have WAV-playback for the Archos! Yiheaa!
12:13:31[IDC]Dragonthere's a little task in the way... ;-)
12:14:10[IDC]Dragonwe can munch on the 2nd 200kB with the codec
12:14:34[IDC]Dragonwhich RecV1 doesn't have :-(
12:14:43LinusNhow big is the codec?
12:16:02*[IDC]Dragon looks
12:16:22[IDC]Dragonin any case, it's ineffiviently stored in the Archos code
12:16:59LinusN32-bit ints with 20-bit data?
12:18:32[IDC]Dragonwhich makes it almost 12 KB
12:20:11[IDC]Dragonpacking would bring it to 7.4 K
12:20:38[IDC]Dragonwe can try UCL on it
12:20:51[IDC]Dragonor simply load it from disk
12:21:09[IDC]Dragonwav play/rec means a lot of disk traffic anyway
12:21:11LinusNload from disk seems to be the easier option
12:23:57LinusNwe might not be able to spin down the disk at all...
12:24:52[IDC]Dragonafk, lunch
12:25:25B4gderI wonder how long a typical archos can run with spinning disk
12:25:42LinusNover 100kbytes per second with 44100/16 stereo
12:25:45B4gderan hour?
12:26:21LinusN176400 bytes/s
12:26:57B4gderhow big is the buffer these days? 1764000 bytes?
12:29:07LinusNmine is 1583000 bytes
12:29:25LinusNor rather 1.583MB
12:29:47 Join webguest43 [0] (
12:29:53webguest43hi !
12:30:25webguest43i would just like to ask again if we could have an option to purge the on-the-fly playlist in the playlist menu.
12:30:25LinusNwhich is roughly 1700k
12:31:36LinusNwebguest43: a "Clear playlist" in the playlist menu?
12:31:58webguest43yes please !
12:32:29webguest43i dont save playlists, i just add some folders and press play
12:33:02LinusNwhat happens if you stop and then add a new folder?
12:33:16webguest43it gets added at the end of the playlist
12:33:44LinusNah, it doesn't get cleared unless you start a new playlist...
12:33:50LinusNi get it
12:34:36webguest43wait, i think i am lying to you
12:34:50LinusNshame on you :-)
12:36:04webguest43i am actually lying. if you stop playback and insert a new folder the playlist is reset.
12:36:14webguest43i am standing in the corner shaming....
12:36:35webguest43RTFM i guess :)
12:38:40webguest43i asked yesterday about some refinements on the recording screen, any news there ?
12:39:04 Quit Moos (" Try HydraIRC -> <-")
12:41:15LinusNwebguest43: what did you ask and when?
12:42:56LinusNthe choir recording?
12:43:01webguest43yep thats me
12:43:21LinusNand you wanted a peak meter?
12:43:30webguest43the main thing is that recording will overwrite its own files
12:43:40webguest43recording starts always into record-0.wav
12:43:48LinusNthe thing is that the river recording is just a test
12:43:59webguest43when stop, record is pressed again it records into record1.wav
12:44:16webguest43if you exit the recording screen and come back it will again record into record-0.wav overwriting the fiel
12:44:19webguest43file even
12:44:36webguest43yep i know thats why it is in debug, but it works, is stable I tested for more than 2 hrs
12:44:53webguest43a few tweaks and its ready for primetime
12:45:02LinusNwe will resume the work on the iriver recording once we release 2.5 for archos
12:45:31webguest43allright, its just that only really small things are missing
12:45:53B4gderthere are small things missing all over ;-)
12:46:00preglowthose things very probably arent missing the real recording code
12:46:13preglowno use in duplicating it when we'll integrate it properly soon anyway
12:46:33webguest43preglow: what do you mean ?
12:47:48webguest43alas, a small patch so recording does not overwrite its old files would still be great
12:48:09 Join Moos [0] (
12:48:11preglowwebguest43: archos already does recording, we can probably reuse some of that code
12:48:19preglowrockbox isn't iriver only
12:49:33webguest43sure, thanks for the great work you are doing,
12:49:51webguest43any idea about what % of userbase is archos vs iriver ?
12:50:53preglowwoops, gotta go
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12:56:03LinusNwebguest43: ok, it was a tiny change that didn't affect the archos code
12:56:28LinusNthe next bleeding edge will have proper file numbering
12:58:11webguest43you mean you just fixed that ?
12:58:28webguest43thanks man
12:59:03webguest43its great that you decide to donate so much of your time over such a long timespan to this project
12:59:15LinusNtell that to my family :-)
12:59:35webguest43hey famil: I think its great that LinusN develops rockbox !
13:00:19webguest43just to have a look, where is the recording code in the cvs ?
13:00:35amiconnB4gder: An archos v1 recorder can run ~4 hours with stock batteries and disk spinning all the time
13:00:56amiconnI tested this when comparing video playback with and without spindown
13:01:23webguest43from my recording test i would say iriver does 8 hrs with disk spinning on non-stock 1900mAh battery
13:02:04webguest432 hrs recording => 100% => 81%
13:02:20 Join Febs [0] (
13:02:26 Join edx__ [0] (
13:04:40amiconnB4gder: Maybe the time limit is lower depending on how often we actually read the disk. Even with the disk spinning all the time, power consumption is higher with actual disk access than without
13:05:46amiconnIn the video playback case, a buffer refill happened every ~25 seconds
13:06:05amiconnWith wav playback it will be every ~10 seconds (44.1/16/stereo)
13:06:27amiconnI'd still expect ~2 hours
13:06:51 Join DrMoos [0] (
13:08:17amiconnLinusN: Did you check the rec v1 size limit, or is this still an assumed value based on the player?
13:08:33LinusNdidn't check, will do
13:08:42 Quit Moos (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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13:14:16LinusNamiconn: it's 200k for v1 as well
13:15:43[IDC]Dragonhow large is rockbox v1?
13:15:56amiconnLinusN: Is there a reason why you often add dummy functions instead of empty macros?
13:15:57webguest43linusN: where in the cvs can i find the recording code you thankfully changed ?
13:16:45LinusNamiconn: yes, because i don't want to change the firmware code just because the bootloader doesn't want it
13:16:59LinusNwebguest43: apps/pcm_recording.c
13:17:52LinusNamiconn: empty macros would require #ifdef BOOTLOADER in the header files
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13:21:11amiconnLinusN: Yes, what's the problem with #ifdef BOOTLOADER ?
13:21:26webguest43looking at pcm_recording.c i think i urgently have to install a compile environment
13:22:34LinusNamiconn: the code is swamped with #ifdefs, and i don't think it's worth adding that many of them just because of the bootloader
13:22:47 Quit edx__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:23:40amiconnI'm asking because I want to search for empty functions in normal code, and eliminate them the same way...
13:24:43 Quit webguest84 ("CGI:IRC")
13:25:08 Join edx [0] (
13:33:30[IDC]Dragon7282 bytes left for the V1
13:40:28 Quit xNibbler ("life is like a rental car, you fuck it up, and give it back.")
13:40:38amiconn7138 bytes with my not-yet-committed xing header improvements
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13:46:38 Quit NibbIer (Remote closed the connection)
13:47:56[IDC]Dragonwav will add qite some code, too
13:48:03[IDC]Dragon quite
13:49:10amiconnI'll probably hack the wav codec a little when I have time, but real integration might have to wait until the playback engines are merged
13:49:30amiconnThe iriver playback engine is able to handle multiple codecs, with disk loading
13:50:01[IDC]Dragonand is not smaller, I reckon
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13:50:42[IDC]Dragonpcm feed from plugin api would be cool
13:50:54[IDC]Dragonlike current mp3 feed
13:51:04[IDC]Dragonbut much more useful
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13:51:36amiconnHmm. That would need a slightly different approach, imho
13:51:45[IDC]Dragonfor games and the mod tracker authors out there
13:52:45amiconnThe iriver playback engine is application layer, pcm playback is firmware layer
13:53:56amiconnIf we want pcm playback from memory, i.e. without the file playback engine, wav codec handling on archos would be totally different from codec handling on iriver
13:54:32[IDC]Dragonhow does the iriver talk, then?
13:55:33amiconnThere are 2 codec threads
13:55:51amiconnOne decodes the music, the second decodes the voice
13:56:01[IDC]Dragonone of them has to decode from memory
13:56:03amiconnThe dsp code mixes the output
13:56:29webguest43i am just highly impressed by
13:56:48webguest43but its missing a vital .exe namely cvs.exe
13:57:33webguest43whats best way to fix that ? shall I register and edit the wiki ? or try to find the maintainer of the RockBoxDevKit
13:59:09amiconn[IDC]Dragon: The important difference is that music decoding, voice decoding and mixing happens at the app layer, then the pcm data is passed to the firmware layer for straight output
13:59:28amiconnOn archos, we can't output pcm and mpa at the same time
13:59:36amiconnOur codec is lower level...
14:00:13Zagorwebguest43: it's not a mistake. .exe is optional.
14:00:25 Quit webguest43 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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14:03:22Zagorwebguest43: it's not a mistake. .exe is optional.
14:04:07B4gderopenneo commits again
14:04:20Zagorit lives! ;)
14:04:23webguest43yep found it
14:04:29B4gder−−- NEW FILE: system.c −−-
14:04:34B4gderint set_irq_level(int level)
14:04:43B4gder asm volatile ("stc sr, %0" : "=r" (i));
14:04:47B4gderblatant theft
14:05:12Zagordo they never learn?
14:05:36[IDC]DragonI've been approached for an Oscar port
14:05:41B4gderthey added 'errno' support
14:06:06[IDC]Dragon(the grandfather of the Archos SH)
14:06:16Zagor[IDC]Dragon: port?
14:06:23Zagorah, rockbox on oscar?
14:06:41Zagormassive user base ;)
14:06:53B4gderboth of them would be thrilled ;-)
14:07:01webguest43Zagor: its not finding cvs from command line
14:08:51 Join DrMoos [0] (
14:08:51 Quit Moos (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:08:56[IDC]Dragonit's practically the same as terratec m3po
14:09:15***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:09:23Zagorwebguest43: can't help you with that i'm afraid. I run linux and have never used the devkit on that page.
14:09:44LinusNi know lots of people do use it, with cvs
14:11:08[IDC]Dragonso an Oscar/m3po port should have some user base
14:11:32webguest43its a path issue, i think its a bit misleading in the guide, i think the guide talks about the mingw environment, but i am not sure
14:12:05Zagor[IDC]Dragon: are you thinking of doing it?
14:12:26[IDC]Dragonnot this year
14:12:32B4gderwebguest43: I don't think the wiki page author even knows what mingw is
14:12:35 Join tucoz [0] (
14:13:04tucozHi, how are the presets stored for the fm-radio. In the config block on disk?
14:13:09[IDC]Dragonif they send me a unit, something may happen
14:13:24 Quit ender` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:13:25 Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:13:54[IDC]Dragonmy livingroom lacks a player
14:14:01 Join ender` [0] (i=ychat@
14:14:14[IDC]Dragonbut these days, I'd rather go for a streaming client
14:14:17tucozJust read a thing in the forums that looks like a good idea. To be able to save presets in a file, when travelling for instance.
14:14:18B4gderno response from austriancoder
14:14:21 Join thegeek [0] (
14:14:28Zagoryeah, I have the slimp3. very nice.
14:14:31webguest43can i paste a few (15) lines here which demonstrate the problem ? its a path issue for sure
14:14:43 Join ashridah [0] (
14:15:07Zagorwebguest43: no long pastes, please
14:15:19[IDC]Dragonhow does it browse?
14:15:34Zagor[IDC]Dragon: using a remote control
14:15:50[IDC]DragonI mean, the experience
14:16:09[IDC]DragonI tried terratec noxon audio, but it's slow as hell
14:16:15bluebrother^tucoz: in a file below .rockbox
14:16:35[IDC]Dragonplus, they don't utilize the screen very well
14:16:40webguest43why is this path not finding /usr/bin/cvs ? /.:/bin:/usr/bin:/opt/sh1/bin:/opt/m68k/bin:/bin:/usr/bin:.:../bin:../usr/bin
14:17:01Zagorthe speed depends on the host computer. the slimp3 is just display and decoder.
14:17:11tucozbluebrother^: ok, thanks
14:17:28[IDC]Dragonwas it once a DIY project?
14:17:43ZagorI have a VIA Centaur 600MHz as host computer and it's not very fast but not annoyingly slow either
14:17:46[IDC]DragonI remember one with a very dumb client
14:18:02Zagornot DYI I think, but started as a basement project
14:18:39[IDC]Dragonhow does it support all those formats? Recompression?
14:18:48 Join muesli- [0] (
14:19:21Zagorthe newer models support lossless playback so the host computer decompresses and sends flac to the player
14:19:53Zagoror wav perhaps. don't know, my model is old :-)
14:20:05[IDC]Dragonnot nice
14:20:15webguest43i just compiled rockbox ! feels like making fire ! will have a fiddle with the pcm_recording.c
14:20:29webguest43thanks a lot all ! sorry for being a pita sometimes :)
14:20:56Zagormy player is serial number #8 :-)
14:21:13tucozwebguest43: sounds nice. what do you think of moving the settings for recording to a context menu?
14:21:14webguest43gotta do some real-life-work now, bye
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14:22:02webguest43tucoz: i think the devs will do proper recording in time. this one is just a hack I think
14:22:31webguest43I just want to do some small modifications, mainly moving the buttons around
14:22:32tucozI'll have a look at the archos recording before I suggest anything
14:23:14webguest43there is one button on the remote that I would like to be on the main unit so I dont need the remote for recording
14:23:34tucozI believe the settings are taken care of in a nice way on the archoses
14:23:45[IDC]DragonZagor: sounds like a wide user base, too
14:24:10 Quit webguest43 ("CGI:IRC")
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14:24:15Zagoryes. they have the right approach to pretty much everything imho, and it pays.
14:25:44[IDC]Dragonwee, lots of resources
14:25:46webguest43how much is that slimp3 thing ?
14:25:49Zagorthe server software also has a http interface that you can control the player from
14:25:53[IDC]DragonI wouder what for
14:26:19[IDC]Dragon50 MHz, 64 MB ram, 16 MB flash
14:26:26[IDC]Dragon250 MHz
14:26:39[IDC]Dragonand 1000 mA power
14:27:47Zagorfor supporting demanding codecs, i guess
14:27:56Zagormy old model has a hardware mp3 decoder
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14:29:51 Quit B4gder ("Lämnar")
14:30:22Zagorit listens to JVC DVD remote control codes, so you can use a standard universal remote for it
14:30:47[IDC]DragonI have a learning one
14:31:00[IDC]Dragonor, trainable
14:31:25[IDC]Dragonnice product, I'll keep an eye on it
14:31:43webguest43where do you find info about it ?
14:33:27webguest43slimp3 = squeezebox ?
14:34:24Zagoryes, it was called slimp3 earlier
14:34:39webguest43ah, they are quite expensive though
14:35:24ZagorI wouldn't say $199 is expensive, but it's subjective of course.
14:35:25webguest43wonder if one could build something like that from standard parts
14:35:53webguest43i would use one of my laptops, but their D=>A converters suck big time
14:38:40[IDC]Dragonsound a lot cheaper
14:42:38 Join tucoz [0] (
14:43:47webguest43the design of the old wired ones is much nicer than the new wireless ones :)
14:44:52[IDC]Dragonof course the thing is more expensive in %u20AC than in $
14:45:05 Quit tucoz (Client Quit)
14:45:13[IDC]DragonEUR than in $
14:46:34[IDC]DragonZagor: did you look at Roku, too?
14:47:17Zagorroku didn't exist when I bought the slimp3. they are a ripoff of it, even using the slimdevices server software without attribution.
14:47:56[IDC]Dragonopenroku? ;-)
14:48:09Zagornot quite :-)
14:48:20[IDC]Dragonas in openneo
14:48:30Zagorah, yeah
14:51:42webguest43i like roku design though
14:53:14Zagorif you acted on such impulses, you'd own an ipod and not be here in the first place :-)
14:53:58webguest43on the remote-mp3-playback note, do you guys think it would be possible to wire the remote-port of the iriver somehow into a computer ? so one could just use a computer to control it ?
14:54:24Zagoryes of course
14:54:32Zagorbut the "somehow" might be rather complex
14:54:43 Join rasher [0] (
14:54:56webguest43you assume ! i actually like the iriver 140 design more than the white boxes
14:55:11webguest43well its a standard protocol talking to the remote i2c ?
14:55:47Zagori don't remember
14:56:04webguest43cause I am sure for that there is usb dongles or something
14:56:14ashridahisn't the remote attached to the i2c bus? or is it a different bus?
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14:58:27amiconnAfaik the remote button output signal is just a chain of resistors, wired to an adc inside the main unit
14:58:54amiconnThe remote lcd is controlled via SPI
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15:08:04 Join rasher [0] (
15:28:29muesli-hi rasher, was there any discison in the end about negerpunk? ;)
15:29:20webguest43on another note, i got my iriver hooked up to my stereo, and every time until rockbox is booted it makes a horrible humming sound, does anyone know what I could do about this ?
15:29:46webguest43so basically while iriver is off it humms
15:30:23ashridahwebguest43: is it plugged into the charger at the same time? sounds like a ground loop. get a DC decoupled audio cable? use optical? :)
15:31:04webguest43it is something like that, its loud without charger and gets really loud with charger
15:31:13rashermuesli-: looks like it died down
15:31:15webguest43whats a DC decoupled audio cable ?
15:31:38ashridahwebguest43: one that only has AC coupling, thus, no ground loops
15:32:08ashridaharghl. must sleep
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15:33:23webguest43wait !
15:34:36webguest43anyone know how to do that ?
15:35:14flurblego to the store and say "can you sell me a DC decoupled audio cable" ?
15:36:30webguest43thanks for the how-to ! :)
15:37:26webguest43another thing: when I use the recording on iriver, after exiting recording mode, playback is not producing any sound output. I have to restart the iriver. any ideas anyone ?
15:37:54rasherThat's the fix
15:38:06webguest43whats the function call for that ?
15:40:54[IDC]Dragonwebguest43: you can get a cable with a transformer, common for car hifi
15:41:36webguest43thanks, will try to get one of them, it disturbs my cat every time I unplug the iriver
15:43:49webguest43any ideas on the playback problem ?
15:47:05LinusNwebguest43: the recording code is in the debug menu for a reason
15:47:25LinusNand there is also a reason why we don't work on it now
15:48:01webguest43allright, i thought maybe its just a funciton call missing
15:48:28webguest43i presume if i do some mods in the current pcm_recording code its all wasted time right ?
15:49:15LinusNyes, if you change the ui
15:49:55webguest43so basically recording UI is working in Archos and will be ported to iRiver once someone has time ?
15:49:58LinusNbut not if you fix the playback issue, or other technical stuff
15:50:07flurblewebguest43: if you use it yourself it's not wasted time anyway, is it?
15:50:51webguest43fixed what i need already, its so cool !
15:54:28webguest43whats the difference in recording volume and recording gain ?
15:56:24 Quit NibbIer ("life is like a rental car, you fuck it up, and give it back.")
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16:01:02webguest43gotta go, bye
16:01:04 Quit webguest43 ("CGI:IRC")
16:02:06*amiconn wonders why Linus defined the size limits as hex values...
16:02:54LinusNthe original limit was in hex
16:03:07LinusNso i just followed the tradition :-)
16:03:22amiconnI would have used 200*1024, 400*1024 etc
16:03:24LinusNi could have written (200*1024)
16:04:00LinusNi don't personally see hex values as obfuscated though
16:04:16LinusNno real programmer should :-)
16:06:33 Join Moos [0] (
16:06:33LinusNgotta go
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16:06:35 Part LinusN
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17:33:22 Nick DrMoos is now known as Moos (
17:36:09Mooshi, are you here?
17:36:30flurbleI'm not.
17:36:53Moosoops wrong window scuse all :)
17:40:30muesli-mmh...i've downloaded a rls within this afternoon and it crashed ~10secs after power on
17:41:47muesli-dunno if something is wrong with gilbert's wps but i reckon there's something wrong with xaviers remote build
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17:50:49 Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
17:51:24 Join Sandking [0] (
17:51:36Sandkinghi there
17:51:50 Join einhirn [0] (
17:52:10Sandkingtoday I've found by mistake rockbox and I'm quite excited about it
17:52:19 Quit einhirn (Client Quit)
17:52:29Sandkingit hasn't destroyed my h120 till now :D
17:52:49rasherIt shouldn't
17:53:19Sandkingi was rather afraid about it since it isn't official as it is mentioned on www
17:53:49SandkingI installed it but it gives me error about the codecs... should I install them separately?
17:54:02rasherThat's strange
17:54:20rasherHow did you install?
17:54:24Mooswhat kind of files?
17:54:40SandkingI patched the latest iriver firmware
17:54:49*Sandking copied it, updated firmware
17:55:00Sandkingthen I copied rockbox.iriver
17:55:08rasherYou need a .rockbox directory as well
17:55:12rasherThat should be in the zipfile
17:55:13Sandkingto root and to .rockbox which I created
17:55:44rasherrockbox.iriver should be in root, .rockbox should be in root, containing lots of stuff from the zip
17:56:03Sandkingok, let me check the zip
17:59:31Sandkingok - sorry - os x doesn't see the .rockbox dir
17:59:34Sandkingin zip file
18:00:54Sandkinghow old is this project?
18:01:05Sandkingand when was the first release?
18:01:42Sandking[i got a strange feeling that rockbox boots a LOT faster]
18:03:03Sandkinggod, how I love things like this... tweaking and all that... :D
18:04:26Sandkingomfg it displays graphics!!
18:04:51 Quit Maxime (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:05:36rasherWhich project?
18:05:42rasherThe iriver port, or Rockbox?
18:07:03rasherThe iriver port is almost a year old, with the first usable (meaning "playing music") version about 3 months ago
18:07:58Sandkingis there a possibility playing movies on this?\
18:08:05rasherRockbox 1.0 was released at 2002-06-01 after about half a year of work
18:08:16rasherGreyscale like the jpeg viewer, yes
18:08:39rasherIt already exists on the archos players, so it's quite likely to be implemented on iriver eventually
18:08:39Sandkingok, I need to read all the docs and then ask questions :D
18:09:02SandkingI wish I had a paypal to support you guys
18:09:16rasherDo you have a credit card?
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18:09:26Sandkingnope :|
18:09:34rasherAh well
18:09:49Sandkingbut I'll ask a friend to do me a favor
18:10:09rasherYou don't have to have a paypal account - you can just do a direct payment
18:10:09Sandkinggot to keep stones rolling :]
18:10:38Sandkinglike in a bank or a post office?
18:10:46Sandking[where are you guys from anyway?]
18:11:12rasherNo, just a "regular" credit card payment
18:11:22rasherI don't think you can manage without a credit card
18:11:32Sandkingi'll handle it
18:11:35fuzziehow do you do credit card payments without paypal?
18:11:42rasherThrough paypal
18:11:55Sandkingi don't :D
18:11:58rasherBut you don't have to have an account.
18:11:59Sandkingmy friend does
18:12:24fuzzierasher: hm, i paid someone via paypal a few months ago and it force-made me an account
18:12:41rasher"Internal Server Error", good one paypal
18:13:05rasherfuzzie: I'm pretty sure there's a "I don't have an account" if you click the donate button
18:13:15rasherThat just takes you to a "direct" payment thing
18:13:48Sandkingok, I go to read all those faqs and docs, be back soon with questions :]
18:14:04fuzzierasher: neat
18:14:46*fuzzie donates $10 in the hope it might come in useful
18:16:03rasherfuzzie: Did it work?
18:16:17fuzziesure did
18:16:23fuzzie"You have sent a secure payment of $10.00 USD for the items below. This credit card transaction will appear on your bill as 'PAYPAL *ROCKBOX'. You will receive an email receipt for this transaction shortly."
18:17:47rasherI'm still curious about how much money has been donated
18:20:19muesli-guess this is not open source ;)
18:22:01 Join Dan [0] (
18:22:11Dananyone alive?
18:22:38Danyou use rockbox?
18:23:13muesli-who doesnt in this channel? ;)
18:23:17flurbleI'm not alive, but I use rockbox
18:23:59Danim thinking of getting an iriver h120
18:24:06Danit should run on that, yes?
18:24:13 Nick Mxm`Pas`Bien is now known as Maxime` (
18:24:23rasherIt does
18:25:16Danitl be second hand
18:25:24Danis 155£ a decent price?
18:26:07SandkingDan - I just installed it and it works :]
18:26:09Danthats 283 usd i think
18:26:20SandkingDan - and imagine how faster it can boot :D
18:26:39Danhow much did you pay for your h120?
18:26:54Sandkingit was a year ago - 300$
18:27:34 Join Maxime [0] (
18:27:34Danso i guess £255 isnt such a good price
18:27:34 Quit Maxime` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:27:35Sandkingbut now I would prefer h10 or ipod nano but since I discovered rockbox I'm so happy :D
18:27:37rasherI paid 209, new
18:27:55rasherWell, they're not dropping much in prices
18:28:06Danused condition though
18:28:06SandkingI got this one on amazon
18:28:11rasherI've heard of them going for *above* new price. Not sure if that's true
18:28:32Danim really tempted to get one
18:28:45Danbut only because of rockboxes leetness
18:29:14Danh10 + rockbox doesnt look like its gunna happen
18:29:39Sandkingyep - but it looks nicer
18:29:45Sandkingand it charges through usb
18:29:52Sandkingand you can buy another battery
18:30:13Danbut it doesnt have rockbox
18:30:20Danand itl suck without it :/
18:30:22Sandkingyes :D
18:30:47Danso what are the main + points of rockbox?
18:30:52rasherRockbox on H10 doesn't look very likely, no.
18:31:15Sandkingdon't ask me - I'm reading docs :d
18:31:40 Join paugh [0] (
18:32:05Sandkingrasher - have you tried too contact iriver to help you? or you didn't wanted to?
18:32:09Dando you get like a boot menu
18:32:18Danlike on ipod linux?
18:32:31rasherDan: No. By default Rockbox boots, but if you hold down record when you turn it on, the original firmware boots
18:32:36flurble"it's like a boot menu! but smaller! We call it a ... shoe menu!"
18:32:53Danthats great
18:33:04Sandkingit's like presssing f8 all the time :d
18:33:16Daneither of you two got a camera?
18:33:27Dani just wanna see the size of the player
18:33:41rasherSandking: don't think anyone has, but it's not really worth it, since the chip manufacturer (portalplayer) doesn't publish documentation
18:35:17Danhow thick is the thing?
18:35:23Danis it gunna bugle in my pocket?
18:35:40SandkingDan - it's a bit bigger than a cigarette pack
18:35:52Sandkingand maybe bit thinner
18:35:59Danah :)
18:36:17Sandkingwell, it's just more higher than that
18:36:20Sandkingjust checked
18:36:29Danwhats the song browsing like?
18:36:35Danand how about playlists?
18:36:52Sandkingare you asking about rockbox?
18:37:13Danbecause the first thing id do is shove RB on it
18:37:13Sandkingask me tomorrow :d
18:37:20Danlol :/
18:38:02Danone last question
18:38:12rasherThere are two ways of browsing: directory-browsing, and id3-database browsing
18:38:41Danwould you get a new h10 20gb for £170, or a second hand h120 20gb for £155?
18:39:04Sandkingare there 20 gb h10?
18:39:05rasherH120. For two reasons: Ogg support and Rockbox.
18:39:16Dandamn right
18:39:23Danlooks like ill get it then
18:39:34Sandkingh10 doesn't support ogg? well i don't like it...
18:39:36rasherh10 is smaller though, if that matters a lot
18:39:42Slasherioh.. i mean h120 of course
18:39:45Slasherii read new h120 :D
18:39:49preglowi want a ipod nano, please port rockbox!
18:40:05rasherpreglow: No, you do it.
18:40:11Danid port rockbox myself but
18:40:18Dan1) i dont know ASM
18:40:21preglowok, buy me an ipod then :P
18:40:29Dan2) time is a shit
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18:40:37flurbleDan: so your todo list goes 1) learn ASM, 2) port rockbox
18:40:41flurblesimple :)
18:41:18SlasheriDan: that's is not a big problem if you don't know asm because you still have to learn the processor specific assembly language
18:41:48muesli-when using this line in the wps %xl|a|mp3.bmp|16|111| where should the image be stored?
18:42:39muesli-theres %xl
18:42:55rasherMeant %xda
18:43:00SlasheriDan: and secondly you need some hardware you can use to load code to the cpu/flash/ram
18:43:26muesli-got it from gilbert
18:43:34Danhang on
18:43:41muesli-but rbx crashes when i activate it
18:43:46Dantheres a 120 for £125
18:43:54Dansilver, but ill paint it
18:44:24rasherPAINT IT?!
18:44:39rasherThe champagne is so lovely
18:45:10muesli-yeah...much lovelier than black...
18:45:15Sandkingi got black 120 and 3 days ago i brushed all the paint cause it was falling off
18:45:19muesli-rasher any idea`?
18:46:03muesli-yeah, black is a pain in the ass in terms of falling offs
18:47:22Dan1 last question
18:47:27Danhow loud is it?
18:48:33Slasheriit's "loud enough" :)
18:48:48amiconnmuesli-: It seems I found the cause for rb crashing with certain wps'es.
18:48:48Sandkingit can be LOUD
18:48:57Slasheriand the sound quality is great
18:48:58Sandkingbut it's all about the files
18:49:05Danyea ok
18:49:06amiconnThe load buffer is allocated on the stack - maybe it's a stack overflow
18:49:08Dansold as fuck
18:49:10amiconn1600 bytes...
18:49:26muesli-hum..but it it from another user
18:49:54muesli-does it crash when bmp's are not found?
18:50:06Danok and
18:50:17Danwhat are its downfalls?
18:50:18amiconnNo idea... I never tried a wps with images myself
18:50:24Danworst features?
18:51:01Sandkingwell it's design isn't best
18:51:10rasherDan: the joystick is not exactly stellar
18:51:11Sandkingthose edges...
18:51:20Sandkingbut I love the joystick!
18:51:33rasherI can't see what's wrong with the edges..
18:51:51Sandkingimagine that you have pants and you hardly can get your player out - with joystick like this, controlling player is so easier
18:51:56Danis it easy to navigate?
18:52:41Sandkingrasher - well, it's just my opinion - I would like something smoother
18:52:55Sandkingdisplay could be bigger
18:53:02Danthink ill regret buying it?
18:53:13rasherImpossible to tell, really
18:53:16flurble"imagine that you have pants" ?
18:53:21rasherDepends on what your expectations are
18:53:31rasherflurble: as opposed to a skirt, silly
18:53:31Danyea i suppose
18:53:38Dandid you regret buying yours?
18:53:42Sandkingflurble - :D
18:53:44rasherNot a second.
18:53:49Danwell then
18:53:55Danim getting it for 1/2 the price
18:54:16Sandkingflurble = i was talking about getting player out from tight pants :D thought shortcut
18:55:44flurbleamerican-style pants?
18:57:50Sandkingmay be :D
18:58:02Sandkingis there a place to get more plugins?
18:58:38 Quit [IDC]Dragon ("CGI:IRC")
18:59:15rasherNot really. There are a few in the patch-tracker though
19:04:27MoosHi Slasheri: the infamous cfg files during playback bug is definitively fixed now? :)
19:05:38amiconnDoesn't look like an elegant fix to me. Stopping playback just because of config loading....
19:06:42Moosare they others ways?
19:07:48Mooshow it does in archos playback?
19:08:19amiconnIt doesn't stop
19:08:33amiconn...on archos
19:09:03Moosit's better :)
19:09:10rasherDoesn't sound like much of a fix to me
19:09:38MoosSlasheri ?
19:11:49Slasheriamiconn: reloading voice files (especially with a different size), there is no other way than stop the playback
19:11:54SlasheriMoos: i think so
19:12:43amiconnSlasheri: Yes, but it seems playback is always stopped when loading a config. I have a number of configs that don't touch the voice ui/ language settings
19:12:45Slasheriamiconn: but that's true, maybe i should add a check if the voice file buffer has has really changed
19:12:55Slasheriyes, i will fix that
19:13:09amiconnPlus, iirc playback is restarted if you change voice files from the menu
19:13:37Slasherihmm, that was with crossfade
19:13:50Slasheribut could be implemented to voice also
19:14:06amiconnWhat happens if I enable/disable voice menus while music is playing,
19:14:06Slasheriyes, the voice file remains loaded once it has been loaded
19:14:37amiconnor when I select a different language while voice menus are enabled?
19:14:48amiconn...and music is playing of course
19:15:05Slasherithat crashed the player previously, but that new commit should fix that
19:15:08Slasheri(i haven't tried yet)
19:15:55amiconnThere are 4 situations: (1) old language has voice file, new language doesn't. (2) old language has no voice file, new language has. (3) both have voice files (4) both don't have voice files
19:16:16 Join dpassen1 [0] (n=dpassen1@resnet-233-61.resnet.UMBC.EDU)
19:16:36amiconnThe voice files can also have different sizes
19:17:26Slasheriyes, if the new voice file is bigger that the previous one, then we have to stop/restart the playback
19:17:31amiconnI'm not sure whether it would be a good idea to make the voice file buffer fixed size, and refuse loading larger voice files
19:17:54SlasheriHmm, maybe not
19:17:55 Nick banan_ is now known as merbanan (
19:18:07amiconnThe iriver playback code does a bit much dynamic reallocation for my taste...
19:19:22SlasheriI think that dynamic allocation is necessary if we want efficiently use the buffer
19:20:08Slasheriand restarting the playback is enough to reinit the allocation
19:20:25amiconnI think we can get away without dynamic reallocation in most cases.
19:20:26Sandkingdoes rockbox has something like rating songs?
19:20:44rasherSandking: Yup
19:20:54rasherSee... hang on, wait for it...
19:21:00amiconnThe directory and playlist buffer sizes are such a case. They only take effect after a reboot
19:21:28Sandkingi love del dir option :D
19:21:41rasherSandking: I think..
19:21:50Slasheriamiconn: for example changing the pcm buffer size requires a reallocation and there is no point in having something like 14s pcm buffer if crossfade is not used at all :)
19:22:12Slasheriah, you mean that
19:22:13Sandkingrasher - thx - I just wanted to know what to expect
19:22:16amiconnYes, but the reallocation doesn't have to be dynamic
19:22:26Slasheriaudio buffers etc. are allocated at the end of memory
19:22:52SlasheriHmm, what do you mean with that?
19:22:53amiconnDynamic reallocation increases complexity, and hence increases the probability of hard-to-find bugs
19:22:55Sandkingwill there be option to move dirs and files?
19:24:26rasherSandking: "rename" accepts a directory
19:24:45rasherthat is, if you rename "foo.txt" to "/text/foo.txt", it will be moved
19:24:57Sandkinggreat! :D
19:25:25amiconnSlasheri: Hmm, my second-last statement wasn't precise. I mean, sometimes we need dynamic allocation, but we don't need dynamic _re_allocation
19:25:50Slasherinow i understand ;)
19:27:38 Part ep0ch ("Kopete 0.10.3 :")
19:35:10Slasheriamiconn: do you think we should keep the voice codec buffer static once it has been allocated at boot?
19:35:51Slasherithen we would just fail to load a new voice file if it's bigger without stopping playback
19:36:07Slasheri*voice file buffer
19:36:18rasherIf opening a larger voice file it could say "reboot to load", set the config, and leave the current voice file (if any) in place?
19:36:42SlasheriHmm, yes, that might be possible :)
19:37:26amiconnHmm. If we set the buffer static, we either waste space (fixed size) or fail to load a new file if it's even a tiny bit larger
19:37:41amiconnOtoh, if we don't want this, we need to reallocate
19:37:46SlasheriTrue.. But not setting it static, requires reallocation
19:37:49Slasheriyeah :D
19:38:47amiconnI'm not that much concerned about the waste between various voice file size, but about the waste when disabling voice menus altogether
19:39:23SlasheriCurrently disabling voice menus requires removing the voice file and rebooting the unit
19:39:26Sandkingsomeone knows what is battery capacity in iriver h120?
19:39:45amiconnThe dilemma is caused by the iriver being able to support voice menus while playing music... something that is impossible on archos
19:39:48Slasheri(with disabling i mean the buffer space is freed)
19:40:29 Quit muesli- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:40:46amiconnThe playback restart for crossfade change is a clean restart, i.e. the old buffer is completely discarded and everything is rebuffered?
19:41:12amiconnHmm, doesn't sound too complex.
19:41:15Slasherithat's because the file buffer and pcm buffer sizes will change
19:41:38amiconnIs the pcm buffer and voice buffer allocated at the same "end" of the main buffer?
19:41:43Slasheriwe will just save the resume position, and resume playback from that position after buffer sizes have been adjusted
19:41:52amiconnAh, yes
19:42:06Slasherino, voice buffer is allocated at the beginning (memory allocation at boot)
19:42:23amiconnAny special reason for that?
19:43:27SlasheriHmm, let me think :)
19:43:59amiconnThat means that the larger-new-voice-file problem exists in current cvs
19:44:16amiconn(or even enabling voice ui)
19:44:29SlasheriWe could allocate the voice buffer from end also but we still would need to reallocate everything
19:45:11Slasherivoice buffer is allocated at boot if the voice file is present. File is loaded when we access the first voice sample
19:45:23amiconnWhat does "everything" consist of?
19:45:35amiconnMeaning, how much complexity does it add?
19:45:36Slasheriplayback buffers and voice buffer
19:46:27amiconnPerhaps there's a way to even lower the complexity, by doing all special buffer (re-)allocations in one function
19:46:37Slasheriit yes, it's better to place the voice buffer at beginning of the memory because we might need to use talkbox also
19:46:40amiconn...which would stop playback, reallocate all buffers, and resume
19:46:48Slasheriand if the buffer is at end, we run out of space
19:46:53Sandkingby mistake I'm listening right now to radio and mp3... :|
19:47:03Slasheriyes, that could be a good solution
19:47:13amiconnSlasheri: Talkbox clips are also loaded into the voice file buffer?
19:47:33Slasherii think those are loaded at the end of voice buffer (unallocated space)
19:47:38amiconnI thought they are loaded into the main buffer, and that's why they don't work during playback...
19:47:46Slasheriso playback has to be stopped before loading those
19:48:04Slasheriyes, they will overlap the main playback buffer
19:48:46amiconnIn fact I would not want the talkbox feature to work during playback, so the talkbox clips could simply use the main buffer
19:49:33Slasheriyep, that is the easiest (and maybe best) solution
19:50:45Slasherihmm, i think creating a new function to reinitialize all buffers is a good idea
19:51:01Slasherithat would also display the splash message "Restarting playback"
19:52:43amiconnYes, and it should only do that if the buffer sizes have really changed
19:53:31Slasheriyes, the function could check that and return if it detects no changes
19:54:12rasherSandking: go into the radio screen and exit by pressing stop
19:54:42Sandkingrasher - yeah, I got that, but shouldn't it suppose to happen?
19:54:43rasherSandking: of course, it should stop radio once a song is started - that's a bug
19:55:23Sandkingwill it be any use if I write here a suggestion?
19:55:45rasherGo ahead
19:56:43Sandkingok - when a mp3 is goind on and I'm browsing dirs it would be ok if when I'm in root and press left I would be back with "now playing screen"
19:56:58Sandkingit's a small thing, but maybe worth?
19:57:25rasherThis has been discussed.
19:57:38rasherIt'd confuse me.
19:57:49rasherThe filebrowser is the main window of Rockbox - not the wps
19:58:29Sandkingbut the wps is more important in terms of usability I think
19:58:43rasherAnd it'd also eliminate the possibility of going to the root from a deeply nested directory by pressing left a random number of times
19:58:57Sandkingand other thing - people like me, who were using iriver soft will be familiar with it
19:59:36rasherDoing something because "that's how iriver" does it is not really a good idea since it'd confuse the current userbase
20:00:05Sandkingclicking joystick again will bring you back to root :]
20:00:15amiconn(1) Rockbox doesn't try to mimick the original firmware. (2) Rockbox is multiplatform
20:01:01SandkingI agree to second point but I'm not talking about mimicking - rather about smooth switch
20:01:22rasherthere's already a smooth switch
20:01:24rasherpress play
20:01:29Sandkingbut it's useless when going back to second point :]
20:01:47Sandkingok, you got me :d
20:02:23CoCoLUS<fn~rasher> The filebrowser is the main window of Rockbox - not the wps
20:02:26CoCoLUSimho, thats not true
20:02:37rasherBut it is.
20:02:40CoCoLUS98% of the time the player is running, it will display the wps
20:02:52dpassen1By design, the filebrowser is the main screen that you get to all others from.
20:03:07rasherWhat dpassen1 said.
20:04:15amiconnCoCoLUS: The main, or root, screen is not necessarily identical with the one displayed most often
20:04:51CoCoLUSi always considered my iriver as a music player with a file chooser, not a file browser with a playing option
20:05:03amiconnImho having the file browser as the root does make sense. It's the logical order: First you need to select something for playback
20:05:41Sandkingis there an option to implement a... clock?
20:05:56CoCoLUSno one is argueing about the "start" screen, i just think what should be considered the "main" screen is the wps, since it equals the main function of the player... "playing"
20:06:07rasherSandking: not really (on h120)
20:07:00CoCoLUSselecting left while in the root of the file system does nothing currently, right?
20:07:14SlasheriSandking: that would be really hard because we don't have hardware rtc chip
20:07:26Sandkingok, thx
20:07:29rasherCoCoLUS: Right. And I wouldn't want it to.
20:07:34Slasherieven if it might be possible, the clock would get inaccurate
20:07:46rasherSay "option" and there'll be trouble.
20:08:02dpassen1CoCoLUS: its nice to return to root by pressing left more times than required.
20:08:10CoCoLUSi don't see the problem, users used to rockbox won't go left anyway, if they think it won't do anything?
20:08:41rasherIt's not at all logical
20:08:53CoCoLUSbut comfortable :)
20:09:21***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:09:30amiconnCoCoLUS: The problem is that you can simply press left a sufficient number of times now to get to the root
20:09:47amiconnThis wouldn't be possible if left in the root would call the wps
20:09:47dpassen1which is very useful
20:09:48CoCoLUSand you're afraid you'd "skip over" ?
20:09:57rasherNot afraid - certain.
20:10:22CoCoLUScan the button driver detect something like a "double click"?
20:10:32Sandkinglong click for sure
20:10:38dpassen1i believe so, wasn't that used in iriver fw?
20:10:51dpassen1click then hold or something similar
20:10:52CoCoLUSif long left would jump directly to the root, that would be nice
20:11:07rasherThat's an idea
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20:23:08zeekoeis there a problem in the resume code somewhere?
20:23:26zeekoeI sometimes get a "Nothing to resume" popup
20:23:29 Quit paugh ("Leaving")
20:24:03Sandkingdoes gamebox [or how is it called
20:24:08Sandking] play gba color?
20:24:22Sandkinggb color
20:24:35Sandkingi don't suppose it'll run gba games?
20:25:07zeekoeeven my phone doesn't run gba games
20:25:11rasherIt runs gbc
20:25:20zeekoeit's 120 MHz, and can run nes games smoothly
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20:39:56 Join cat-dog [0] (
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20:46:07 Quit solex_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
20:47:59cat-doganyone have dir buffer is full errors with the latest iriver 120 build? i've upped my max setting, but there was less files in the dir than the default already.
20:50:34Sandkingrasher - have you used rating system?
20:50:42SandkingI can't figure how it works
20:52:47Dandoes rockbox work with the ihp-120?
20:52:57cat-dogDan: yes..
20:53:08Danihp-120 = h120?
20:53:16Danok good
20:55:31amiconnHrmpfz :(
20:58:59preglowwhat ho
20:59:09rasherSandking: Have you build a database?
20:59:53rasherYou should
21:00:02amiconn(1) Something is wrong with the xing headers. (2) Recording at q=7 broke down after ~01h 39 min
21:01:29Sandkinganother question - how to play rvf? I enabled listing all the files but don't know how to load it
21:02:34rasherYou can't yet
21:04:37SandkingI can't on h120 or in general?
21:04:58rasherNot on iriver
21:05:34Sandkingi'd love to see scummvm port for rockbox :D
21:06:24 Part cat-dog
21:07:00Sandkingis everything ok with sound in gamebox?
21:07:08Sandkingi can't hear a thing
21:07:23rasherIt's disabled (rockboy)
21:07:29rasherBecause it's not quite fast enough
21:10:24Sandkingby creating db you mean creating root playlist?
21:11:59rasherNo.. I don't know where the documentation for this is..
21:13:04MoosSandking: the java or perl one
21:13:17Moosand enable gather database option
21:13:34 Join _aLF [0] (
21:13:59MoosCheck the wiki for creating database;)
21:15:39 Quit fuzzie ("leaving")
21:16:30*amiconn found the cause for (1).
21:16:44amiconnNote to self: Never fix things in a hurry :/
21:16:49Mooshorray :)
21:17:08Moosthe release hurrying :(
21:18:34 Join muesli- [0] (
21:19:31zeekoeSandking: if you want ScummVM you can buy an MPX200 phone. It's smaller than an mp3 player, it runs ScummVM, SmartNES, pockethobbit (c64), and costs about 100 euro...
21:19:48zeekoeoh, and you can call with it
21:20:07Sandkingjust joking :]
21:25:00 Join webguest02 [0] (
21:26:23webguest02anyone know one plugin for WMA for foobar, I want to transcode my 2 wma albums because Rockbox of course here ?
21:27:37webguest02I didn't find the original copie and don't want to start original fw for this
21:27:39bluebrother^how does the wps parsing work?
21:28:00rasherPretty well.
21:28:08rasherWhat do you mean?
21:28:13bluebrother^wps are parsed once when loaded and the text / conditional stuff is called on every redraw?
21:28:36webguest02anyone can help me please?
21:28:45bluebrother^I'm thinking about what tags are parsed only on load.
21:28:54bluebrother^as for the statusbar patch.
21:29:13rasherwebguest02: Don't use foobar, sorry.
21:29:29webguest02thanks :(
21:29:36bluebrother^but afais the tags in that patch are called on every screen update.
21:29:44webguest02anyone here use the marvellous foobar?
21:30:16bluebrother^webguest02: used it once, but I can't tell you anything about plugins that's not on the web page
21:30:35webguest02thanks too :(
21:30:49bluebrother^if I understand the wps parsing correctly.
21:33:39bluebrother^webguest02: just look for foobar special
21:34:04webguest02ok thanks I'm looking
21:34:06bluebrother^it's on the official download page
21:35:11bluebrother^rasher: is there anything like a function-block-diagram of rbx avaliable? Would be nice for beginners.
21:35:28 Join matsl [0] (
21:36:13rasherbluebrother^: Not a thing. "Read the code" is the official advice
21:37:06bluebrother^ok. Works also but is a bit harder :)
21:37:20rasherThere's been some talk about using doxygen
21:37:29bluebrother^doxygen is great.
21:37:33webguest02dpassen1: how I add one .dll at foobar?
21:38:23dpassen1put the .dll in \foobar2000\components and restart foobar
21:39:17bluebrother^I used it to document an Atmel project I was working on. Only the asm-parts didn't worked as I expected. Fortunately I had only a few lines.
21:40:05webguest02dpaseen: error message
21:40:16dpassen1what error?
21:40:39webguest02grr I can paste and cut
21:40:42webguest022 sec
21:41:25webguest02utf8api.dll not found
21:42:11 Quit webguest02 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
21:42:12dpassen1not sure, i don't use foo_wma, i guess i'd try the special installer then
21:42:43 Join webguest01 [0] (
21:42:55webguest01unable to load DLL
21:43:24webguest01i use v0.9 beta 6
21:43:37dpassen1that's why, that dll is for v0.8.3
21:43:52webguest01ah ok
21:44:27webguest01any other.dll for v0.9.6 one
21:44:35dpassen1not sure
21:45:20webguest01I'm afraid to "downgrade" version and lost my ReplayGain config
21:48:10 Quit Sucka ("a bird in the bush is worth two in your house")
21:48:15Sandkingwhat's the diffrence between java and perl version of dbs?
21:49:00bluebrother^the programming language?
21:52:02Sandkingi know that, but what diffrence will it make for me as a user?
21:52:27dpassen1i thought java was recommended
21:53:31 Join webguest43 [0] (
21:54:21webguest43webguest 01: if you are still looking for wma=>ogg here is something:
21:54:36webguest43install ogg and wma plugin and off you go, its really nice and free
21:54:44webguest01still here
21:55:14webguest43i transcoded 334 wma's to ogg yesterday, setting up took 5 min
21:55:27dpassen1lossy to lossy, eh
21:55:55webguest43sure, but they were ripped into wma which i dont want, and i will never convert them to anything else any more, so its ok for me
21:56:12dpassen1why not wavpack or flac
21:56:20dpassen1is space a large concern?
21:56:23webguest43size matters you know ?
21:56:45webguest43got 25gb of music on h140 and a few large recordings to do next week
21:56:48 Join DangerousDan [0] (
21:56:58webguest43also use it for data transfers, so yes space is a concern
21:57:19webguest43and its jazz man, its the sound not the bits !
21:57:35bluebrother^dpassen1: I simply guess because most windows users have java installed but not perl
21:58:01webguest43i was talking to a friend of mine about how good digital sound is and how bad vinyl is, and he just said: " i dont care as long as the music is good "
21:58:18dpassen1dpassen1: i thought perhaps the java version was more recently updated
22:00:12webguest01for gapless, need I use mp3 lame, right?
22:00:33dpassen1ogg, flac, wavpack, and lame mp3 should be gapless (wav?)
22:00:38webguest01webguest: I will lost quality no?
22:00:50webguest43you need to use a recent lame i think > 2.92 or so
22:00:58webguest43(numbers could be wrong, do research)
22:00:59dpassen13.90 or better, i imagine
22:01:10webguest43so its maybe 3.92
22:01:19dpassen1i use 3.90.3 and i can verify it works
22:01:20webguest43it introduced the "exact length of song" header
22:01:25webguest01dbpower propose me to convert in mp3 lame files
22:01:35webguest43go for ogg
22:01:43webguest43install the ogg plugin
22:01:48webguest01not qualty lost?
22:01:53amiconndpassen1: lame 3.90.3 is oooolllld
22:01:58webguest43still lossy, but free
22:02:07dpassen1amiconn: its the most widely tested version
22:02:11amiconn...and there was heavy work done on improving vbr
22:02:11webguest43if you want lossless you need flac or wavepack
22:02:20amiconnI use 3.96.1
22:02:29amiconnEven that is more than half a year old
22:02:41dpassen1i've been meaning to switch as 3.96.1 is very well tested and fast for −−preset standard
22:02:48webguest43mp3 is licensed, so imho evil
22:03:08webguest43go for ogg if you want lossy with quality 0.6
22:03:13webguest01I'm afraid to lost lot of quality with this transcodage :(
22:03:31dpassen1ive been experimenting with wavpack lossy lately
22:03:44webguest43well, transcode a few songs, listen to them, see if you find difference
22:03:58webguest01yes i'll try thanks
22:04:04amiconndpassen1: Yes, that's what I use for my ordinary encodings, occasionally using it with -nogap
22:04:04webguest43i couldnt hear a difference doing wma=>ogg 0.6
22:04:16webguest43it still sounded as bad/good as the original wma
22:04:19webguest01but need to have the same bitrate?
22:04:34webguest01or can I incease?
22:04:43webguest43morale of the story: never let your girlfriend rip cd's, she'll do it in wmp
22:04:59webguest43ogg is not about bitrates, its about quality
22:05:10webguest43it will use the bitrate it needs to achieve a certain quality
22:05:15dpassen1they do have nominal bitrates, though
22:05:18rasherWell, increasing the quality should produce less artifacts
22:05:23webguest01I'll use the best quality
22:05:25amiconnwmp doesn't do accurate rips afaik
22:05:29webguest01oh :(
22:05:33rasherTry a few different quality-settings
22:05:36 Join linuxstb [0] (
22:05:47rasherSee what sounds "acceptable"
22:06:16webguest01I'll test just after eat a bit ;)
22:06:16dpassen1the prospect of transferring the wavpack lossy to my H120 and keeping the correction files along with the lossy for lossless playback on my computer is tempting
22:07:00webguest43yep i think this is a really cool idea,
22:07:29webguest43but i suspect data storage will become so cheap that in a few years we will laugh at this
22:07:34amiconndpassen1: If only the wavpack lossy was comparable to the real lossy codecs in terms of quality vs. size...
22:08:06dpassen1but on a portable, i'm not sure how evident the difference would be
22:08:13webguest43but then i think my q6 oggs sound fine, so what else do i need ?
22:08:23webguest43gotta reboot, bye
22:08:28webguest43hate windoze
22:08:31 Quit webguest43 ("CGI:IRC")
22:09:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:11:51Sandkingwhy when I set wps and I turn off my player it resets to default?
22:11:51dpassen1whats the boost ratio looking like for oggs lately?
22:12:08dpassen1wps must be in the .rockbox directory for it to be remembered
22:13:27 Quit matsl (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:13:43Danthanks for helping me decide you lot :)
22:15:10dpassen1pretty easy decision
22:15:32 Join matsl [0] (
22:15:36 Quit webguest01 ("CGI:IRC")
22:17:25Dannow i just gotta wait for it to get here
22:23:08 Quit Moos ("Parti")
22:25:37amiconnWtf is the silly mas doing???
22:33:55 Quit Dan ()
22:35:45 Join Moos [0] (
22:39:11amiconnNow for a rix...
22:40:23Moosamiconn: what's about your xing headers fix?
22:40:32Moosstill puzzled?
22:43:20amiconnNew test is running
22:43:34amiconnI'm puzzlked about the broken recording with q=7
22:44:05amiconnThe mas bitshifted it with analog recording, while I believed this would only happen with s/pdif
22:44:07Moossomething in head?
22:44:19amiconnThe strange thing is *how* it shifted it
22:44:35amiconnThe first ~96 minutes where ok
22:44:48 Join webguest14 [0] (
22:44:55webguest14hey dudes
22:45:10amiconnThe next ~136 minutes the data is shifted one bit to the right
22:45:18 Quit webguest14 (Client Quit)
22:45:40amiconnAfter that point the data is shifted one bit to the left until the end of the recording
22:46:02amiconn(which went on for another 505 minutes)
22:46:42Sandkingdo i have to run updater of database in rockbox each time I add something or delete?
22:46:52Sandkingor is it in some way autoupdating?
22:47:04amiconnI'll probably commit the xing changes in the night, if the test runs fine
22:47:16amiconn(around 02:00 cest)
22:47:35Moosgreat :)
22:47:44BagderSandking: there's no (auto) update available
22:47:49Moosalways working :D
22:48:15amiconnHowever, I really want to understand the strange things the mas is doing...
22:48:59Sandkingok, but database keeps info about ratings and all that stuff - right? so when I add some music or delete - does the db builds anew or is it only updating it?
22:49:12amiconnI'll do an experiment now (as I have to wait for the test anyway): I'll write a small program to correct the shift the mas has done, and check whether the files become playable...
22:49:14 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:49:24Sandking[i'm talking when I run the db soft]
22:49:31BagderSandking: there are two dbs, one with all the songs/tags and one runtimedb
22:49:32dpassen1you're confusing run time database and tag database, i think
22:49:51Sandkingok, right now I'm creating tag databse
22:49:58Sandkingwhat's run time db?
22:50:04Bagdercollects run-time info
22:50:12Sandkinghow to make it?
22:50:17Bagderlike ratings, playtime, play counter
22:50:22Bagderyou enable it in an option
22:50:40Bagderand it requires that you have a tagdb
22:50:43Sandking... i'm trying to enable ratings all evening :]
22:50:45 Join matsl [0] (
22:50:54Sandkingthat explains a bit
22:50:56amiconnPerhaps it's possible to rescue some valuable recordings done by users...
22:51:35SandkingBagder - so when I change tag db, run time db keeps info about all the stuff?
22:53:17Sandkingdoes rating have any meaning at all?
22:53:29Sandking[at the moment]
22:53:33rasheryou can show it in WPS
22:53:37rasherand search for it
22:53:43rasher(using the databox plugin)
22:54:06Sandkingcan I use it for shuffle?
22:54:14Sandking[10 best songs or something]
22:55:20Bagdernot yet
22:55:39rasherYou can do [all songs rated > 8]
22:57:13Sandkingone more thing and I'm gone - how to rate on h120?
22:57:32rasherhold down joystick while in WPS
22:57:48Sandkingthx for all help
22:57:53Sandkingsleeep now :D
22:58:08 Part Sandking
22:58:24muesli-BiDi = whazz this?
23:00:00muesli-does that mean its scrolling from right to left?
23:00:35Bagderit generally refers to supporting text written either way
23:01:28muesli-chees & bye
23:04:42 Quit dpassen1 ()
23:06:46 Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:08:02 Join thegeek [0] (
23:11:42 Join Mojito [0] (
23:11:57Mojitosomeone here? ;)
23:11:58 Quit muesli- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:12:09Mojitoyesterday i get my new iriver h340! :))
23:12:17Mojitoits great :)
23:13:37 Quit DangerousDan (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:13:44Mojitois someone here, who can help me with english?
23:15:38 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:16:24 Join DangerousDan [0] (
23:20:41zeekoeMojito: i may be able to help
23:20:48Mojitohi zeekoe
23:21:10zeekoeyou don't understand what 'query' is?
23:21:15Mojitoi mean
23:21:19Mojitocan we speak in query?
23:21:25zeekoeoh :-P
23:21:33Mojitoi'm not registred yet
23:22:03MojitoAcknowledging chat request...
23:22:15Mojitounable :(
23:22:17zeekoehm... i'm behind a NAT here
23:22:24zeekoecan you try to start one?
23:23:24Mojitocan you join my channel: #mojito1 ?
23:27:32 Quit thegeek (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:28:35 Join thegeek [0] (
23:32:21 Join tucoz [0] (
23:33:13tucozHi, I was looking at the source earlier on but I couldn't find where the fm-radio is displayed. Is this in tuner-philips/samsung, or is this only hw-control?
23:33:56 Join henrikb [0] (
23:34:06 Quit DangerousDan ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
23:35:18amiconnUnbelievable.... These bitshifted mas recordings are perfectly playable after undoing the shift....
23:35:24rashertucoz: apps/recorder/radio.c
23:35:31tucozrasher: thanks
23:35:54Moosamiconn: :P
23:36:02 Join markun [0] (
23:36:04tucozdidn't dare to look in that directory ;). Thought it was some archos stuff.
23:36:23 Quit henrikb (Client Quit)
23:36:27MoosRe markun
23:36:44markunHi Moos
23:38:04tucozanyone from netherlands here?
23:38:17tucozI am trying to find the postal code for eindhoven
23:38:53tucozgirlfriend is waiting for a package.
23:41:28markuntucoz: Yes, I'm from the Netherlands
23:43:02tucozmarkun: oh, great. Well, gf is waiting for a package sent by TNT. need the postal code to get the transit time. thanks for the link :)
23:45:17 Join matsl [0] (
23:47:14 Join DangerousDan [0] (
23:48:01tucozthanks for the help markun. found out what I needed.
23:48:12markunno problem
23:48:53zeekoeHolland, Holland! :-P
23:49:13Moosweed, weed :P
23:50:15zeekoenah.. weed is bad for your health
23:50:58Moosdepand on the his usage
23:52:01Moosis like cigarets
23:52:03zeekoehmyeah, probably
23:52:14zeekoecan cigarets be good for your health?
23:52:34tucozgood night
23:52:36Mooscomputer is good for your health?
23:52:38 Part tucoz
23:53:10zeekoehmm... good question
23:53:27zeekoei think it can be
23:53:42MoosI don't think for your eyes ;)
23:53:52zeekoeso that's why i need glasses :)
23:54:14Moosnot all users do this
23:55:47 Quit matsl (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:56:19MoosTHC at good measure can it be medical enefits ;)
23:56:25Moosfor your knowledge

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