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#rockbox log for 2006-06-20

00:03:09 Join [1]ZenMasterJG [0] (n=Jordan@
00:03:22Kronuzdamn 52% gross margin!!
00:03:49Kronuzbut I suppose the retailers get 20-30%
00:03:57Kronuzor not?
00:05:19 Quit MrStaticVoid (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:05:19 Join Guttersnipe [0] (
00:06:08 Join sharpe [0] (
00:06:30Kronuz"incorporates a multi-standard audio decoder core"
00:06:31 Quit smrq_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:06:43 Join smrq_ [0] (
00:06:50 Join MrStaticVoid [0] (
00:07:10 Join mikearthur [0] (
00:07:40 Quit mikearthur (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:07:44 Join mikearthur [0] (
00:08:21 Quit ender` (" On-line, adj. The idea that a human being should always be accessible to a computer.")
00:08:22Kronuzhmm.. MPEG1 and MPEG2 decoder too
00:08:44Mikachui'm not saying that's the chip in the ipod, just that broadcom makes video decoder chips
00:09:00Kronuzit certainly sounds it could be that one
00:10:12Kronuzthe release timing was perfect for iPod 5G too
00:10:36 Quit ZenMasterJG (Connection timed out)
00:10:36 Nick [1]ZenMasterJG is now known as ZenMasterJG (n=Jordan@
00:13:12Kronuzhey, if that one has audio decoding as well (as I suggested yesterday too -_-) it would be really nice to get it working
00:14:42peturwell start writing then ;)
00:14:56 Quit jd_ ()
00:15:26Kronuzas soon as I find the specs
00:17:33Kronuzthat must be it, it must be
00:17:58Kronuzor that one :P
00:19:59liyang(You may note Broadcom acquired Sandvideo last year. And BCM7411 roughly approximates what they were working on.)
00:20:10 Join akaidiot [0] (
00:20:31 Quit mikearthur (Remote closed the connection)
00:20:46smablyKronuz: it's the BCM2722 (see for scans)
00:21:21Kronuzyes, BCM2722 sounds about right (same limitations and everything)
00:21:22liyangBCM2722 is produced by an entirely separate group in Cambridge, UK.
00:22:32Mikachu"This component replaces the Wolfson audio codec used in the nano"
00:22:36 Quit Guttersnipe ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:22:43Mikachui didn't know the nano had a hardware audio codec?
00:22:45KronuzI read that too
00:22:50Kronuzit must have
00:22:58liyangBy CODEC they mean D/A.
00:23:04liyangStandard terminology.
00:23:08Mikachucrazy people
00:23:17KronuzD/A ?
00:23:20liyang(Well, D/A, mixing and all that.)
00:23:27liyangDigital to analogue conversion.
00:23:44liyangPCM is a code, after all
00:23:57Kronuzit really is the BCM2724 then
00:24:19Kronuzwe only need to get the programmers information
00:24:19Mikachuthe picture clearly says 2722
00:24:26Mikachuhah, only
00:24:29Kronuzthat I meant
00:24:52Kronuzwe should be able to get it, right?
00:24:55Kronuzwe have insiders
00:25:00Kronuz(or not?) O_O
00:25:01sharpewe've known it's been bcm2722...
00:25:28Kronuzwhy didn't anyone say anything about it yesterday when I asked :P
00:25:58sharpecouldn't tell you.
00:26:08Kronuzeverything was speculations yesterday, and today I know the model
00:26:20liyangIt's the BCM2722. BCM2724 is identical but for having twice as much (off-chip) SDRAM memory.
00:26:52Kronuztomorrow I'll have the programmers information and the day after a working implementation for rockbox
00:27:02Kronuz(yeah, right... I'm just dreaming)
00:27:05sharpeand there are no public datasheets for the bcm2722...
00:27:11liyangWhich sounds like the often-used industry trick to increase yields.
00:27:20Kronuzwhat about the BCM2724?
00:27:28sharpenone for it either.
00:27:35sharpebroadcom doesn't seem to like releasing datasheets.
00:27:54liyangi.e. make BCM2724s, and for those with duff memory (or as demand dictates), mark them as BCM2722s.
00:28:36Kronuzwe could unite the open source iPod world and start a founding to buy those specs
00:29:03liyangYou only need USD 130M or so...
00:29:24Kronuz(duh!, where do I get those stupid ideas)
00:30:08liyang(For that price you get the company too. <g>)
00:30:20 Join iriverh340 [0] (
00:30:47smablyeven if you managed to get them, i assume you'd have to sign an NDA saying you wouldn't release your code
00:31:24sharpeand then if you did, you could be sued! :)
00:31:33 Quit petur ("here today, gone tomorrow")
00:32:31Kronuzbut if I just happen to find them floating around and implement software to use the chip they can't do squad about it
00:33:17sharpeand the chances of that are...
00:33:17 Quit smrq_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:33:24Kronuzwho knows
00:33:28Kronuzwe might get lucky
00:33:35liyangYou know, there used to be trial versions of VideoCore toolchain floating about.
00:33:36sharpeand the chances of that are...
00:34:04Kronuzyou see, we're already getting lucky
00:34:14Kronuzabout the VideoCore toolchain
00:34:17liyangProblem is finding them.
00:34:33iriverh340one question, does the disk suffer when using disk poweroff?? does it really save battery in H340?
00:34:38 Join smrq_ [0] (
00:35:06smablydoes it save battery? yes - significantly
00:35:19smably...i doubt it would damage your disk
00:35:32smablythough i'm no hardware expert
00:35:41***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:36:09iriverh340smably: so you suggest that I turn this on? I have read that disk duration is based on the number of times it is turned on and off
00:36:11liyangnot immediate damage. It is known to reduce HD life but that's the tradeoff you pay for longer battery life.
00:36:41iriverh340liyang: ok, that's what I have read, it reduces HD life, but how much?
00:36:46liyangiriverh340: mostly the number of hours it's been on, but there are plenty of other factors at play.
00:37:03smablyas i said, i'm not a hardware expert; that being said, i was under the impression that it's the number of spinups that's significant
00:37:13liyangiriverh340: I'm willing to let it turn itself off to save battery life.
00:37:21liyangiriverh340: hard to quantify. :-/
00:37:22Mikachui would think it's spin ups and downs that shorten life, not giving power to the control chip
00:37:35Mikachui type too slowly
00:37:43smablyheh :)
00:38:07iriverh340ok, so you suggest me to use this option without fear?
00:38:59 Quit bluebrother ("Leaving")
00:39:34liyangiriverh340: you're not going to notice any shortening of the HD's lifespan.
00:39:49liyangOn the other hand you might notice the reduction in battery life.
00:39:54sharpeunless you use it until it actually dies.
00:40:07smablyAFAIK, the only reason it isn't on by default is an archos bug that caused certain players to crash with it on
00:40:26smablyliyang: disk poweroff has been shown to improve battery life
00:40:40smablyat least, i'm pretty sure that's what the benchmarks showed
00:40:42amiconnMikachu: Audio codec != audio dac
00:40:52iriverh340liyang: wow thanks then :) I will start using it right now, you are very kind guys thanks
00:41:07amiconnAudio codec usually means the combination of a dac and an adc
00:41:29amiconnSoe most ipods have an audio codec, but the minis only have an audio dac
00:41:31sharpethat means, a dacadc!
00:41:35 Part iriverh340 ("Abandonando")
00:42:47smablyer, never mind me
00:43:29 Join mikearthur [0] (
00:43:35liyangnot sure if that has VC support. The name certainly doesn't imply it.
00:43:54Kronuznah, that's just the ARC one
00:44:12Kronuzwe need that one but for VideoCore
00:44:26Kronuz(I suppose)
00:44:32sharpehow about,
00:45:00Kronuzthen we just need to build an open source toolchain
00:45:34liyangthat may come along eventually...
00:45:50Kronuzthis is it:
00:45:55Kronuzbut there's no trial there
00:50:41 Join Rob2222_ [0] (
00:50:42 Quit Rob2222 (Connection reset by peer)
00:50:58sharpegenerally, are most of the players big endian, or little endian ?
00:51:08 Join cismo [0] (
00:52:02amiconnDepends on the definition of 'most'
00:52:23amiconnSH1 (archos) and coldfire (iriver, iaudio) are big endian
00:52:39amiconnARM (ipod, gigabeat) is little endian
00:52:51amiconnThe sims can be both
00:55:38 Quit TCK (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:56:12sharpei'm bored, thinking up ideas for something.
00:56:28 Part tucoz ("Leaving")
00:59:04liyangI thought ARMs can be configured as either. :-/
00:59:19 Part nesukun_
01:01:42 Join nesukun_ [0] (
01:03:17 Join xmixahlx [0] (n=xmixahlx@
01:08:01 Join JdGordon [0] (
01:11:17Mekrobhey anyone here use aim
01:12:18Mekrobdo you know the approximate image size allowance of hand
01:12:19 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (
01:12:41Mekrobfor icons
01:12:50sharpe64x64 isn't it?
01:13:08 Quit Kohlrabi ("Hello my name is CoolClonk .")
01:14:40midkaysomething like that..
01:16:10sharpeor is it 48x48...
01:16:40 Quit cismo_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:18:10 Join blooe_ [0] (
01:19:08hardeepI have a kludgy fix for preventing the hang when stopping playback while a voice is playing but I'm not sure how well it'll fly: ignore the stop
01:20:40 Join JdGordon_ [0] (
01:21:18 Quit JdGordon (Nick collision from services.)
01:21:28sharpeooh. 111 megapixel camera.
01:21:28 Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (
01:21:36sharpeer, ccd sensor.
01:22:27 Quit MrStaticVoid (Remote closed the connection)
01:25:08Paul_The_NerdAnyone know if the limit for total image size for WPSes is after converting them to native depth, or before?
01:25:53sharpei'd imagine before...
01:26:00Paul_The_NerdYou'd think so.
01:26:10 Quit obo ("bye")
01:26:30sharpewoo! i was right in the fact thiat i was wrong.
01:26:35Paul_The_NerdAlright then, so using 8-bit bmps is only useful for saving HD space, not for fitting more images on your WPS?
01:27:05Paul_The_NerdBut there's a native buffer and a mono buffer, right?
01:27:15Paul_The_NerdOr is my memory not working their either?
01:27:52amiconnThe buffer is shared
01:28:19Paul_The_NerdAh, right
01:28:38 Quit pill (Remote closed the connection)
01:28:42Paul_The_NerdI remember now, it's just that an assumed use of some mono images as well is used to calculate the size the buffer will be.
01:30:15Kronuzactivating the second core might waste more battery, I'm just thinking
01:30:30Kronuzwhich is not a good thing :P
01:30:44 Join MrStaticVoid [0] (
01:30:47JdGordontis if u have shares in the elcetric company :p
01:31:19Kronuz(it already drains the batteries faster than the apple's firmware)
01:31:22Kronuz(for some reason)
01:31:57Kronuzmaybe enabling the second core in a wise manner would decrease battery waste
01:31:59Kronuzwho knows
01:32:21Paul_The_NerdKronuz: The main reason we drain batteries faster is that we run the core at 75 mhz quite often.
01:32:22Kronuzcan't think how right now... but it might :P
01:32:33Kronuzyeah, there's one reason
01:32:46 Quit mikearthur (Remote closed the connection)
01:32:48Kronuzenabling a second core and leaving them both at 30Hz
01:32:57Kronuzmaybe it's the same, who knows
01:33:12Paul_The_NerdBut yeah, the main core could be run at a constant speed, as low as possible, for the UI
01:33:19 Quit blooe (Connection timed out)
01:33:25Paul_The_NerdAnd other non-audio stuff
01:33:37amiconnThe clocks are not independent
01:33:47Paul_The_NerdOh, well that sucks.
01:33:54Paul_The_NerdNot unexpected I suppose
01:34:00Kronuznot independent?, but I read somewhere...
01:34:12sharpewell you read wrong :P
01:34:12amiconnIirc, both cores run at the same speed by default (if enabled)
01:34:21amiconnThen you can throttle the second core
01:34:27amiconn..but not vice versa
01:34:33Paul_The_NerdWell, the Apple firmware doesn't often go past 35 when decoding MP3, but they seem to keep the clock speed just fast enough to decode realtime, instead of something like our method.
01:34:54Kronuzyeah, on the second one, you can change it
01:35:00Kronuzthat's what I read
01:35:00sharpehmm... can we actually make use of the second core?
01:35:17amiconnKronuz: Yes, but only downwards starting from the 1st core's clock
01:35:27Kronuzyeah, that too
01:35:39Kronuzthe COP can't run faster than the CPU
01:35:42smablyquestion: why do we have realtime AAC playback on ipod but not iriver? just the different cpu architecture?
01:35:46Kronuzcan run slower tho'
01:36:27Kronuzwe might need to be able to switch threads in real time from one core to the other...
01:36:43Kronuzto be able to waste as little battery as possible
01:36:45Paul_The_Nerdsmably: Basically, yes. The AAC library happened to run faster on the iPod.
01:38:05smablyhmm, interesting. is anyone working on optimizing the code at this point?
01:38:26 Join TCK [0] (
01:38:31amiconnKronuz: I don't think we should use the COP at all as long as we can get away with a single core.
01:38:58amiconnIt would only complicate things.
01:39:14amiconnMaybe we'll need it if we (ever) implement video decoding
01:40:11Paul_The_NerdIt still might be good to test power efficiency of having both on at lower speed vs a single on at higher speed.
01:40:29Paul_The_NerdI mean, do we really know the COP isn't drawing any power right now?
01:41:15amiconnWe can't really tell anything w/o hw docs
01:42:09amiconnMigrating threads will surely add a lot of overhead, so that's out of question
01:44:16amiconnStarting threads on a selectable core might be possible, but even then we need to keep attention on data integrity
01:44:30amiconnEach core has its own cache, and there is no bus snooping
01:45:12amiconnRunning threads on both cores will very likely cause one of the threads run at less than 100% load
01:45:35amiconn*one of the cores
01:45:44amiconn..because we can't change clocks independently
01:47:53Mikachuwouldn't offloading lcd drawing help, since the code just sits and waits for sync signals anyway
01:48:13Mikachuthere should be a questionmark somewhere in there too
01:50:16amiconn(1) lcd transfer only waits for sync on g5. (2) It doesn't just wait, but sends a block, waits for sync, sends next block etc
01:50:44amiconnOffloading that to the second core wouldn't help battery runtime at all
01:50:47Mikachuoh, i was pretty sure it did that on ipods too
01:50:55Mikachuno i was just thinking performance there
01:51:15amiconnIt does on ipod g5, no others
01:51:45amiconn...because only the g5 has that broadcom c***
01:52:03Mikachuheh, i thought g5 was some other target
01:52:53liyangClearly the solution is to just run the codec on the BRCM side.
01:52:56amiconnI prefer g1 ... g5 over the switched version, because a number of users mistakes the latter for a capacity
01:53:06amiconn(even if it says g not gb)
01:53:22liyangCall it the vPod?
01:53:43Mikachuthe nano isn't a video ipod
01:54:09liyangAnd the 4G would be the pPod.
01:54:40amiconnliyang: Also wrong. There's a g4 grayscale and the color/photo version
01:54:56liyangamiconn: but that just ruins the joke. :(
02:12:24KronuzI'm back
02:12:24Kronuzsorry :P
02:12:40Kronuzamiconn: well, if it's well done it wouldn't complicate things
02:12:55Kronuz(just the threading code)
02:13:41Kronuzand also, what Paul_The_Nerd says it's true, we don't know if the COP is currently drawing power
02:17:18Mikachustar is really hard
02:17:42Mikachuthe game
02:18:06sharpei'm going to make a wps.
02:18:09sharpego me.
02:18:14Mikachusharpe power
02:18:14Kronuzamiconn: how do lcd transfers work?
02:18:31sharpetime to make a better one than i made before.
02:18:40sharpegentlemen, we can rebuild it.
02:20:43sharpealright, i'll stop with the bionic man comments.
02:21:06sharpei hate you midkay. :D
02:21:28 Join darkless_ [0] (
02:23:39sharpei still don't know why i have my ipod's casing covered in sand...
02:23:52midkaybecause you haven't cleaned it.
02:24:01midkayand you want to use it as a point of conversation.
02:24:02sharpei mean, why i haven't gotten around to doing so.
02:24:07sharpeah. good point.
02:24:18sharpeit also allows me to talk about my trip i took.
02:24:27midkaythe one which nobody wants to hear about. yes.
02:24:44sharpethe one that i obviously went to a sandy place. such as the desert or a beach. in this case, a beach.
02:24:54sharpeor a sandbox.
02:25:21sharpethe same trip i also got a sunburn on.
02:25:50midkaywe want to see.
02:26:01sharpei'll make a wps with the backdrop of it.
02:26:03midkaylet's see your face. show us your face.
02:26:56sharpei hate sand.
02:26:59sharpebut not really.
02:27:17smablyelectronics hate sand :(
02:27:25sharpegah! i just thought that i could've taken pictures and then made a theme out of them.
02:27:53sharpesmably: it's more like, electronics with moving parts...
02:29:16sharpei love it how sand gets in the most oddest places. like places that you'd think were sealed... like between the sub-lcd screen and the plastic layer on my cellphone...
02:30:01smablyi suppose it wouldn't be such an issue with an ipod
02:30:05smablyfor a digicam, on the other hand...
02:30:08 Quit darkless (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:30:40sharpethe only place sand got partially in on my ipod was at the hold switch...
02:32:03sharpeit was like one grain. and it's gone now. take that.
02:32:04 Join aliask [0] (
02:32:14midkayhyaayayayaaaa. owned.
02:32:26midkaysharpe was hassled by a grain of sand.
02:32:55aliaskmidkay: Any idea why star operates at different speeds between nano and video?
02:33:11midkayaliask, different LCD sizes, drivers, optimization..
02:33:25Paul_The_NerdDoes it move X pixels per second, instead of X% of the screen?
02:33:27Mikachualiask: i made a hack to make it slower on nano
02:33:42midkaythe nano's LCD is half the Video's size, that makes it update faster already, plus the driver is probably faster.
02:34:03midkayx pixels per second as probably 90% and more of the plugins we've already got.
02:34:13aliaskYeah, it was too fast on the H300 as well, so I made a patch, but I didn't know it was slower on the Video.
02:34:16midkaywell, not even per second.
02:34:22midkayjust x++ as fast as possible.
02:34:23Mikachuit just moves as fast as it can
02:34:28sharpemidkay: per unit of time :D
02:34:43midkaywhere unit of time is the fastest update speed possible, right.
02:34:46 Part pixelma
02:35:09Mikachualiask: that is just handtuned to nano
02:35:31sharpehow about a standard measurement... the "standard unit of measurment" (Um) which can be applied to any topic, cpu frequency, pixel rates, time, etc.
02:35:45***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:35:53sharpewithout a really consistent way of converting to and from Um.
02:36:19midkayyou should just introduce a rb->sleep(HZ/speed) and #define speed per-target.
02:36:24sharpeand none of the measurement conversions should be linear either.
02:36:30Mikachumidkay: sleep(1) is too slow
02:36:40Mikachufor star
02:36:45Mikachuand 0 is too fast
02:36:46aliaskYes I agree
02:36:54Mikachuthat's why i have that amazing if
02:36:58aliaskI like your 1 in 10 thing, it looks nice.
02:37:02sharpeuse 0.5! :P even if it has to be a long.
02:37:41Mikachucan you cast a value without converting it?
02:38:14Mikachujust curious
02:38:19sharpeor just, { if (!counter%5) { sleep(1); } }
02:38:40Mikachui think the ! has higher precedence than %
02:38:55sharpewell, that can be solved with parentheses.
02:38:58aliaskMore brackets then!
02:38:59Mikachubut i think comparison + assignment might be faster than %
02:39:20midkayjust move the ! outside the parentahses...
02:39:20sharpeyou can use bitwise and, !(counter & 4)
02:39:24midkayyeah, you can do that, no?
02:39:30Mikachuif needs a ()
02:39:33midkaynever mind.
02:39:42midkaynot thinking..
02:39:51sharpemidkay: when *do* you think?
02:40:02midkaysharpe, whenever you *don't*.. which is always.
02:40:05Mikachudo you two have a thing?
02:40:10sharpemidkay: bastard.
02:40:16midkayi have a thing, i don't think sharpe does.
02:40:27sharpethis is why i hate midkay.
02:40:36midkaydarn man-women..
02:42:06sharpeyou don't really notice how crisp and clear lcd screens can be unless you haven't seen them for a while and they've been behind a layer of plastic.
02:43:22midkaywhatever that means.
02:43:34Mikachuhat blue
02:43:49Mikachush dos
02:43:55Mikachurefined wh
02:44:04Mikachutoo hard
02:44:20midkaykiller t cell.
02:44:38sharpedeoxyribonucleic acid.
02:44:56aliaskHomozygous beta proteins! BOTH OF YOU.
02:45:27 Join Sinbios [0] (
02:48:13Mikachusuparsley string
02:48:21sharpefor god's sake midkay, you're spelling parsley wrong!
02:48:30midkayaaaaaaaaaa. damnit.
02:48:42sharpejust like parentheses.
02:48:44midkayi know how it's spelled, my fingers don't like that though.
02:48:57smablyi think sharpe wins :P
02:49:39midkaygo to hell. :(
02:49:46midkayi pride myself on spelling and grammar. :(
02:49:54Mikachuno more
02:50:21midkayTWO mistakes, one of which a typo, another of which is simply something that i forget? :(
02:50:22sharpeyes, score one for sharpe. sharpe : one, midkay : twenty.
02:51:12sharpein two minutes it went from 'hatred' to subatomic particles of parsley. to midkay's spelling.
02:51:33sharpeactually, five.
02:51:34midkaylet's start over again.
02:51:37sharpebut still.
02:53:41sharpeemeril lagasi.
02:54:00sharpeer. lagasse.
02:54:00 Quit smrq_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:54:15 Join smrq_ [0] (
02:54:59sharpecook with a show on the food tv network who uses garlic a lot a says "Bam!", however not as much as he used to.
02:55:02 Quit Xerion (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:55:29midkaylaughing aloud but not really.
02:55:41sharpemore of a quiet self-chuckle.
02:55:44 Join Rob2222 [0] (
02:56:20midkaynot even.
02:56:32sharpeoh well.
02:58:21sharpeback to the wps-design.
02:59:10sharpejust need to think of ideas for it's layout.
02:59:21midkay"its", you mean.
02:59:40midkayscore 582 for midaky.
02:59:43JdGordonhey, if i want an array of say 30x200bytes for a thing that nt everyone would use, is it better to define it as a static array or grab it from the audio buffer on load?
02:59:55sharpe"it's" would be showing ownership.
03:00:09smablyit's = it is
03:00:38 Part Paul_The_Nerd
03:00:43midkayso "thinking of ideas for it is layout" is wrong.
03:01:00sharpefor some reason, i just thought of the word contradiction.'
03:01:08midkaycongratulations. but you were still wrong.
03:01:23JdGordonlook at me.... what u guys rekon?
03:01:26sharpeyour point? i still get to hold my one point victory over your head.
03:01:27*JdGordon wants attention!
03:01:49sharpeJdGordon: use an array :D
03:02:21midkayi reckon you oughta rand%1 that, bro.
03:03:07sharpemidkay: it's be rand() & 1, not rand()%1. if it was with %, it'd be rand()%2. hah.
03:03:25JdGordonactually, i think i can get it to 12bytes each so ill use a static array :D
03:03:30midkaywouldn't %1 return 0 or 1?
03:03:35midkayi'm quite sure it would.
03:03:46Mikachu%1 gives the rest when dividing with 1, which is always 0
03:03:46sharpeit'd return 1 on all but zero.
03:03:56JdGordon%1 is always 0
03:04:04sharpeer, vice versa of what i said.
03:04:20midkaymy bad..
03:04:31JdGordonrand()&1 is faster also
03:04:33sharpehah. another point for sharpe.
03:04:51JdGordonscroes are 30000:2..
03:05:04smablyi think that was worth a half-point
03:05:05*JdGordon stays out of it
03:05:11sharpewell, i'm on a roll. two scores in the past fifteen minutes.
03:05:41*JdGordon going for breaky
03:07:50JdGordonmy remote came :D
03:08:11sharpeit's amazing what you'll find when you take a breaky.
03:08:36JdGordonsilly me went to check the letter box instead of having breaky.. damn im hungry
03:08:40JdGordonbut now i got a new toy :D
03:08:56smablyh300 remote?
03:09:05JdGordonh100, but ye
03:09:08JdGordonit works :D
03:09:10smablyah, ok
03:09:33JdGordondamn the screen is tiny
03:09:41smablyi got the h100 remote but i didn't like the jog i splurged and got an h300 remote too :)
03:09:51sharpemidkay, ever take that look at the SIDE port source? hahah.
03:11:27midkaysharpe, no. you bastard.
03:11:41midkayever played guild wars prophecies? no.
03:11:51sharpei hate you midkay.
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03:12:06sharpeever see space invaders on your ipod? no.
03:12:32liyangRunning over MAME? Yes.
03:12:34sharpeeven if it does freeze after the first invader is hit...
03:12:34midkaysomeone had submitted a patch. Paprica i think.
03:12:43midkayand i was able to shoot invaders sans freezes.
03:14:42 Part Kronuz
03:24:05Mikachuhopefully gcc is smart enough to produce the same code for &1 and %2
03:25:15sharpeand the chances of that are...
03:25:21midkayJdGordon said that &1 was faster than %2!
03:26:31JdGordonok, unopitmized the &1 is faster
03:26:49JdGordonheheheh, bubble wrap :D
03:26:51*midkay never learned how '&' worked
03:27:46sharpe0&0=0 0&1=0 1&0=0 1&1=0
03:28:04hardeeper, 1&1=1
03:28:21sharpei was stuck on zeros
03:28:36midkayint i=10; i&1 = ?
03:29:06sharpei&1= i&2
03:29:14Mikachumidkay: convert it to binary and take the last digit
03:29:35midkayi mean what is i&1 and what is i&2.
03:30:01idnar2 decimal == 10 binary; 10 decimal == 1010 binary; 1010 & 0001 == 0000; 1010 & 0010 == 0010
03:30:03Mikachualso convert the 1 and 2 to binary and take the digits that are 1 in both numbers, and convert back to decimal
03:30:23Mikachuhence the name bitwise and
03:31:18midkaygot it
03:31:46sharpei at least brought up the topic of &.
03:31:49Mikachugenerally you don't go masking random decimal numbers though
03:32:42smablydoes anyone here know the remote code at all?
03:33:09sharpe& is also helpful for knowing if a bit is set. :D
03:34:40Mikachuthen there's the fun trick with a ^= b; b ^= a; a ^= b
03:34:57sharpehooray for switching variables without a temporary one.
03:35:18sharpea^=b^=a^=b also, isn't it?
03:35:33Mikachuthat statement makes me a bit nervous
03:36:12sharpeeither it's a pun, or it's a real statement.
03:39:30earHertzthe tick works for inrtegral types. don't even try it for non-integral types
03:40:02earHertzin fact, don't even try it, period. if you reallhy really must swap without a temp, then do it in assembly
03:40:34sharpeisn't there a swap instruction for some architectures?
03:40:58earHertzsharpe: probbaly. the other thing you might do is use a register, as thta's not really memory
03:41:20earHertzin fact you can do that in C, but there's nop guarentee that teh compiler will actually use a register:
03:41:39earHertzregister int c = a ; a = b ; b = c ;
03:42:42sharpexchg on x86...
03:42:55Mikachuthe wikipedia article mentions xchg only works on registers
03:43:13Mikachuwhich i just read but didn't link to.. :)
03:43:18earHertzMikachu:most assembnly works on registers
03:43:31Mikachuthat's the one
03:43:38sharpei'm good like that.
03:43:52Mikachueveryone should have a sharpe
03:44:18Mikachucan i have a strand of hair when human cloning is perfected?
03:47:21sharpebitwise operations are so fun
03:48:19smablydammit, adding proper H300 LCD remote support is going to be tricky :(
03:48:51smablyeverything's #define'd, but of course we can't decide the remote type at compile time
03:49:37Mikachudefine to a variable :)
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03:50:27smablyyeah, but...
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03:56:53smablyMikachu: it's only ever used in #if's, so that won't work
03:57:09smablyOTOH, i am a c n00b, so it's possible that i'm overlooking something obvious
03:57:45Mikachuah, i thought the issue was lcd resolutions for some reason
03:58:11smablyno, it's remote button configurations
03:58:50smablyand everything uses CONFIG_REMOTE_KEYPAD, which is set to either REMOTE_H100 or REMOTE_H300
03:59:15smablybut in order to find out which remote is connected, we need to use remote_type()
03:59:32Mikachuthere are some scribblings about keybindings in the plans for 3.1
04:00:02smablyyeah, i have a feeling that we're not going to get buttons working on the H100 and H300 remotes for 3.0
04:01:58smablyso, assuming that the only thing missing from H300 remote support is the button mapping, i'm thinking that we'll have to drop it from 3.0
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04:07:23smablyPaul_The_Nerd: do you happen to know about remote stuff?
04:10:18Paul_The_Nerd"remote stuff" is a pretty vague question, but I'm guessing the answer is going to be "no" because you're probably going to ask if I know about the portion of the source code relating to it?
04:10:56smablyheh, ok (you're right)
04:12:38smablyto my untrained eye at least, it looks like it would be very complicated to add on-the-fly remote detection
04:13:26Paul_The_NerdThere's already on-the-fly detection
04:13:39smablyright; on-the-fly button mapping
04:13:44Paul_The_NerdIf you look in the debug information, on I think the I/O ports one, it tells you which remote type is plugged in.
04:13:52smablyyes, i've looked at that
04:14:21Paul_The_NerdNow, what I see is that you're coming at it from the concept of labelling different buttons different things (the #defines) depending on which remote is plugged in, right?
04:15:29smablywell, sure, that's how it's done now
04:16:03Paul_The_NerdSince all the buttons work as buttons, but just do the wrong thing, is there any reason you can't just, for remote buttons, have a conditional that tells them to do different things depending on which remote was detected?
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04:16:15Paul_The_NerdSo you're not changing the defines, but rather what is done when a button press is detected.
04:16:33smablyhold on; i'll have a look at the code
04:18:30smablywell, what happens now is you #define the physical buttons to their functions (e.g., BUTTON_RIGHT to MENU_ENTER)
04:19:48Paul_The_NerdSo how does the "Optimized" build handle it?
04:19:52Paul_The_NerdWell "Experimental"
04:19:58Paul_The_NerdDoes it just break compatibility with H100 remotes?
04:20:04smablybut we want to map them differently depending on what remote is connected...which we can't do without calling remote_type()
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04:20:13smablyi'm not sure, but i can check
04:20:33Paul_The_NerdIt's possible the problem has already been solved, and nobody bothered to submit it back to us.
04:22:58smablylooks like i missed this before:
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04:39:15sharpeyay, firefox is using 172 megs of ram, and still going... :)
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04:45:27midkaystill going? it routinely uses nearly 300mb on my mom's PC..
04:45:48midkaydot dot dot what?
04:45:52sharpeactually i closed it now.
04:46:17sharpenooo, it's an ellipsis.
04:46:53Mikachu\loldots in LaTeX
04:49:12sharpenext in memory usage is avguard.exe @ 21.5mb.
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05:23:12 Join twisted_one [0] (n=mmschnei@
05:23:35twisted_oneHello everyone
05:25:26twisted_oneI am very new to rockbox. I just purchased my 5G iPod yesterday after doing a bit of research into rockbox. I have been putting it off for a while (buying an iPod that is). I have to say that I am very impressed with this software thus far.
05:25:53twisted_oneI was happy to take it home and install rockbox before I even booted it up into the AppleOS. =)
05:26:56smablyi think it's great how people are buying DAPs just so they can install rockbox :)
05:27:33twisted_oneI have much respect for Apple, I think they produce some very nice products, but it was not exactly what I was looking for. I have been an avid fan of FLAC for years and their lacking of support is what kept me from purchasing an iPod, thanks to rockbox I no longer have to worry about that.
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05:28:07sharpewe should keep a list of testimonies. :D
05:28:14twisted_oneMay I be the first?
05:28:26JdGordonthere is a thread on the forums for them
05:28:30 Part Paul_The_Nerd
05:28:32twisted_one"Thank you rockbox! You saved me from eternal damnation!!!"
05:28:35sharpethe rockbox appreciation thread.
05:29:03twisted_oneI shall post something, but I suppose I will have to lose the sensationalism.
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05:31:16twisted_oneOh I know one thing that I have been meaning to post. Perhaps I can find the answer here, is it possible to change ownership and/or permissions on the ipod? Right now I am doing everything as root and I really dont like to run anything as root if I don't have to. I would think it would be possible to manage my music collection without being root, but I have been unable to find out and whenever I try and run chmod or chown I get a message telling me
05:31:16twisted_one that the operation is not permitted.
05:33:30ashridahtwisted_one: which os are we talking about?
05:33:58twisted_onelinux 2.6
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05:34:09twisted_onenamely gentoo, pretty much up to date
05:35:04ashridahusing HAL to mount it or something? or just an entry in fstab?
05:35:19twisted_onefor now, just mount, not even in fstab yet
05:37:07ashridahi used to use an entry in fstab that had the 'uid' flag set
05:37:18ashridahbut nowadays, HAL just changes it to the group 'plugdev' which i'm a member of
05:37:23ashridahthis is on ubuntu, mind you.
05:37:51ashridahbut mount -o uid=yourusername /dev/blah /mnt/point *should* work.
05:38:11twisted_oneLet me give that a shot
05:38:28ashridahthe 'users' flag in fstab may work better for you. the man page for mount has a bunch of options under 'fat' and 'vfat' and general ones
05:38:34ashridahthat'll give you something that suits you
05:39:01twisted_oneI have the users flag set, but I still cannot write to it, just read the files.
05:39:08MrStaticVoidit's 'plugdev' on gentoo too, ashridah
05:39:57twisted_oneMrStaticVoid: do I need to do anything to configure HAL or is there a way to make use of it? I really hate to show my ignorance here, but I really have no idea with it.
05:41:40MrStaticVoidis it automounting?
05:42:00MrStaticVoidif it is run "gpasswd -a yourusername plugdev"
05:42:07MrStaticVoidand relogin
05:42:16MrStaticVoidthen you should have writable access to hal mounted devices
05:42:18sharpehahah, i just realized something i said would make a name for something for rockbox... "sandbox"
05:43:08sharpewith the cliche -box suffix.
05:45:14twisted_oneMrStaticVoid: If you are willing to help me here, I have never actually used anythign that has automounted. I have never really had a need for it in the past.
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06:22:46pussfelleri'm getting all these buffer i/o errors and crc errors in var/log/messages when I plug in my ipod, does that mean the HD is bad AGAIN
06:22:59pussfelleror should I reformat it... i don
06:23:05pussfellerdont think it will mount
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06:28:07pussfeller"bread failed... cant read superblock"
06:31:25sharpepussfeller: try reformatting it.
06:31:42pussfellerall right sharpe
06:32:33sharpeand if that doesn't work, your HD may be bad. again. :)
06:34:11pussfellerdo i need to keep that 41 mbs of free space
06:34:28pussfelleror do i just change teh type and then change it back or such
06:34:32sharpeyou mean the empty partition?
06:34:52pussfelleryeah, theres an empty free space at teh beggining of the disk
06:35:04sharpeyeah, it's preferable for you to keep that.
06:35:25sharpeas, that's where the bootloader is.
06:35:32pussfelleric :)
06:35:34sharpealong with the apple firmware.
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06:36:43pussfellerach that gives me BUFFER IO stuff again
06:36:58pussfellerits the hd
06:37:01sharpewell, it would make sense that it's the HDD then
06:37:34pussfellerbut, how do get in there to take rockbox off so when I send it back they don't say i violated tos
06:38:35sharpehit it hard enough to where it physically damages the hdd. :) but if it's the hdd that has problems, i doubt they'll be able to read much from it.
06:38:56pussfellerit still boots up tho
06:39:24sharpejust zero out all that you can :)
06:39:40pussfellerstupid ipod
06:39:49twisted_one/dev/random is fun too
06:39:55pussfelleri have had this thing less than 9 mos and its the second hd gone bad
06:40:37scorchewhat brand is the hd in there anyway?
06:40:52sharpei'd imagine it depends on which ipod it is, scorche. :)
06:41:01scorche5g =)
06:41:33pussfellertoshiba mk2006GAL
06:41:46pussfellera photo 20 gig
06:41:49*scorche is too lazy to look things up
06:42:25sharpepussfeller: just zero out the first few megs or so.
06:42:47pussfellerwhat, delete the free space if I can?
06:43:17pussfellerthat should do something anyways
06:44:05sharpewell, the only way you can tell if the rockbox bootloader has been on it, would be if it still exists at the beginning of the hdd.
06:44:05pussfelleri dont even hardly jog with this thing at all.... i must conclude, ipods are cheaply made or somehitng
06:44:43pussfellera dead ipod would be better than one with RB on it... they aren't going to go in and chack the files
06:45:21sharpeit wouldn't make sense to do anything if the files existed anyway, anyone can have /.rockbox/ on their ipod without rockbox.. :)
06:46:16pussfellerwell thanks... now i have to wait a week again :(
06:46:17sharpeyou can use dd to do so.
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07:24:33JdGordonif u change the firmware/export/config-X.h file do u need to reconfigure before reuibling?
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08:31:39JdGordonsince when could u not turn off the h300 if it was plugged into the ac?
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08:37:14dangaiohello everybody. First of all, if there are any of the developers here, thank you thank you thank you. Rockbox rocks.
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08:38:02B4gderthere are devs around
08:39:07dangaioMy iPod has new life. There are 11 iPods in my work location and everybody has installed rockbox.
08:39:45dangaioWhat they love most is not having to use iTunes any more and the interface is just superb (added themes).
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08:42:08dangaiowhat will be the changes in Rockbox 3.0? Where can I find that info?
08:42:26scorchedangaio: not much for ipods
08:42:32B4gder3.0 is planned to be exactly what is available now, although bugfixed
08:42:55B4gder...and not released for ipods...
08:43:04dangaioso, will the graphic equalizer work w/o skipping on playback?
08:43:08dangaiooh, ok.
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08:54:49sharpeBlargh. Goodnight Everyone.
08:58:58 Join petur [0] (
09:02:07sharpeYes. Blargh. A combination of Blargle, and Bleh.
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09:03:08sharpeG'night. Peoples. Yeah. Peoples. Multiple Persons. :D
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09:45:48 Part Paul_The_Nerd
09:48:40*preglow kills c++
09:48:59ashridahhit it! hit it again!
09:49:23 Quit chendo (Remote closed the connection)
09:50:33*preglow skins it!
09:50:51*preglow also kicks gtk
09:51:21peturgetting violent, eh?
09:51:28*B4gder moves slowly away from preglow to not get in the way
09:52:07preglowwasting four hours in cryptic bugs all originating from a single missing & is too much sometimes
09:52:15preglowbloody c++ is such a cobbled together hack sometimes
09:52:23peturat least you found it
09:53:15peturI blame the programmers who (mis)use it
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09:53:34nudelynIMO C++ is one of the best thought out languages, though its C legacy and some other old stuff made it a bit more complex than it needed to be.
09:53:41preglowyes, indeed
09:53:50preglowi hate languages where classes are not necesarily reference types
09:54:04preglowat least after this bug i do
09:54:09nudelynWhen I went back to Java it struck me that the people at SUn don't know WTF and are unable to think things through, yet extremely arrogant about their retarded language design.
09:54:21preglowjava is a sin
09:54:38nudelynI kind of miss stack based classes (mostly doing C# these days)
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09:54:48preglowc# looks pretty nice
09:54:54preglowstack based classes?
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09:55:14nudelynit is. it's not perfect but it's nice... C++/CLI is also very nice, though. I'm not sure which I'd choose given a free hand
09:55:52nudelynstack based as in allocated on the stack, not with new, so that they're destroyed on exit from the current block. C# has "using" but it's not as good and you have to specially write classes for it... all pros and cons of garbage collection
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09:58:29preglowahaha, right, yeah
09:59:17preglowi just want a prettier language than c++
09:59:24preglowc++ is too complex for what it does
09:59:35nudelyni tihnk the library/libraries are the most important thing (so long as the language/core-library design isn't totally b0rked like in java)
09:59:42nudelynhmm yeah i agree
09:59:50preglowand c++ has no libraries :P
09:59:54preglowapart from stl, of course
09:59:56nudelynonce you know c++ inside out you forget how long it took to get there
10:00:07preglowand boost, which is almost mandatory, though not bundled by default
10:00:36nudelynyeah it sucks... every time i see these great libraries for stuff like Perl/Ruby/Java and other languages people shouldn't be writing full applications in I cry and wonder WTF they weren't written for C++. Especially when they ar eprobably written *in* C++
10:01:01*preglow hugs perl
10:01:15nudelynI've still never used boost. :) Need to look at it really as it sounds pretty official/good. Was always put off by depending on some random library but it seems to be very well accepted.
10:02:08nudelynI *really* miss STL when writing C#, although I'm stuck in .Net1.1 land so don't even have generics. I hope .Net2 is better but haven't used it much yet. .Net1.1's collections are a joke... Apart from the lack of type safety it seems that the made 50 completely random collection classes.
10:02:30nudelynIf you want to do something yuo ahevt o look through all of them, which are randomly named with random features that don't mesh together to cover everything you want to do.
10:02:41nudelynand in the end you always end up writing your own :)
10:03:02nudelynwhereas with STL everything was there. it rocks.
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10:03:43nudelyn(e.g. some .Net1.1 collections don't let you specify a comparison thingie, so it might be perfect in terms of how you access objects, but it won't quite do what you want (e.g. case-insensitive string compares).
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10:04:04nudelynanother will let you set the comparator but won't do the other thing you wanted... it's frustrating. and you waste 10 minutes looking through them all each time.
10:04:45preglowstl is nice, indeed
10:04:57preglowby far what i use most, that and boost smart pointers
10:04:58nudelynalso some classes called "Lists" are actually dictionaries, and some dictionaries behave like lists... which is evne more great when there's no compile time type checking so you don't find an error about your assumption of the types until runtime
10:06:08peturoh how nice... dropped back to VB style, did they?
10:08:24_FireFly_nudelyn: in .Net2.0 there are now generics which are similar to the template container in stl. So you can now specify which type should be used e.g. LinkedList<string>
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10:15:07*B4gder sticks with C
10:17:30*petur has no problems with c++ if it's not abused
10:17:30JdGordondoes the uisim use the config-<target>.h file or its own one?
10:17:44peturthat file
10:17:51B4gderit uses the config-<target>.h ones
10:18:04B4gderbut they do (often) have #ifdef simulator in them
10:18:27peturthey all have I think
10:18:40JdGordonhmm.. ive added a HAVE_BLAA define and in the menu it works on the target but is skipped in the sim and i cant see why :'(
10:19:20peturbecause it's inside a #ifndef SIMULATOR block?
10:19:40peturand anyway, sheep don't compile too well
10:21:03*petur kicks microsoft
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10:27:52B4gderthis should cheer you up =>
10:28:17B4gder(and I mean all of you)
10:29:05peturhahaha the post of savagenator is nice :)
10:29:29peturthe one after that too
10:29:51markunyes :)
10:30:20scorchedrippydonut scares me
10:32:34nudelyn_FireFly_ (Sorry was in the shower), but can you also pass comparitors for *every* collection, or just some? And is it clear when something contains DictionaryElement<x,y> and when it doesn't?
10:32:51nudelynI guess the whole enumerator thing must be cleaner in .Net2
10:35:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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10:38:58JdGordonthe bloody #define was hidden in a #ifndef simulator that was off the screen :'(
10:39:23petur[10:19] <petur> because it's inside a #ifndef SIMULATOR block?
10:39:32JdGordonye, i know :p
10:40:18nudelynI like how newer visual studios grey out stuff inside #if* blocks
10:40:39nudelynnot much use for RB but i like it :)
10:42:08saa[b_r]iderhi guys, I made 4 different battery tests on my H340 1) unofficial build with fix under realistic settings, 2) same unofficial build under minimal settings, 3) official build with fix under minimal settings, 4) official build without fix under minimal settings
10:42:13_FireFly_nudelyn: i have no clear answer to your question because i have only a very small experiences with .Net an C# but you can look in the msdn about the new generics in .Net 2.0
10:42:47B4gderhide-ifdef-mode in emacs!
10:43:06nudelynthanks ff, i'll have to look at it when i can finally move to .net2.0 at work (stupid corporate builds mumble grumble)
10:43:31Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: What were the results for 3 & 4 ?
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10:45:11preglowH140D model?
10:45:54saa[b_r]iderI got interesting results, and now I plan to do my 5th test using the iRiver firmware, what do you guys think the equivelant of -25 db is in iRiver's fw?
10:47:25saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3 I got a 112% boost 3) 8:41 4) 4:35
10:47:56saa[b_r]iderusing a 2 year old stock battery... my battery is dying, but I got a boot in battery life nonetheless
10:48:35Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: So, it's clear that the fix more than doubles the battery life
10:48:40 Part ashridah ("Leaving")
10:48:50Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: But you need a new battery, indeed
10:49:07saa[b_r]iderit's interesting though that I got the same battery life as the estimate the player calculates for 1300mAh batteries
10:49:33Genre9mp3The estimation is going to change soon, though...
10:49:44saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: yeah, I do need a replacement. but to make my 5th test, any idea what -25 db is equal to in iRiver's fw?
10:49:51preglownudelyn: any progress on green theme for non-5g targets? :>
10:49:57markunsaa[b_r]ider: as you live in china it will not be difficult to get a new battery
10:50:16saa[b_r]idermarkun: they're dirt cheap :p but that's what scares me :D
10:50:35Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: Are you going to do a test with iriver fw?
10:50:42JdGordoncan u type cast a function? i.e if a function is asking for void (*blaa)(void* a) in its param list can u give it a bool blaa(bool boo) with the type cast and not get error/warnings?
10:50:53markunI got one of those cheap chinese '2200mAh' a long time ago and it's still working fine
10:51:38saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: yeah, that's what I'd like to do, to compare the battery life on the iriver fw with RB after the fix
10:52:01saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: maybe try to prove that RB increases battery life :)
10:52:29nudelynpreglow: no, but I finshed my opus plugin update (finally, god damn that was tedious) so maybe sometime in the next decade i'll find the energy hehe
10:52:35Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: I don't know what -25 db is equal to in iriver's fw but I suppose tha 0 dB equal to 40
10:52:47saa[b_r]idermarkun: wasn't it thicker than the stock battery though? and does the H100 have the same 1300mAh battery as the H300?
10:53:38saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: yeah I know that much :) what's the lowest volume value in RB in db? (too lazy)
10:53:54Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: -84dB
10:54:37Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: But I don't think the volume range is the same with iriver fw
10:54:51Genre9mp3It's not safe to calculate
10:55:16saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: yeah I can imagine... where are all the audiophiles when you need them :)
10:55:28JdGordonjust test them both with full volume
10:55:51Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: I agree with JdGordon
10:56:00Genre9mp3This is the only way to be sure
10:56:20markunsaa[b_r]ider: a tiny bit thicker, but I don't know about the battery in the H300.
10:56:28saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3 JdGordon: that means two more tests :p
10:56:45JdGordonwell.. no ... and yes..
10:56:48Genre9mp3Yes but you have already made 4
10:56:58JdGordondoes the volume make such a diff anyway?
10:57:09saa[b_r]idermaybe a little...
10:57:20saa[b_r]iderI guess there only one way to find out ;)
10:57:37markunsaa[b_r]ider: do you have your headphones connected?
10:57:43Genre9mp3I don't think that makes much of a difference though...
10:57:57saa[b_r]iderand it would be interesting to know since I usually play music @ 0 db anyway
10:58:04saa[b_r]idermarkun: of course ;)
10:58:37markunto compare you could leave them disconnected. Then the volume will matter even less
10:58:40Genre9mp3Also, mind that you can do 2 "exactly the same" tests and get different results
10:58:57saa[b_r]iderI made my tests using -25 db since most of the other used that volume
10:59:03saa[b_r]iderof course...
10:59:06Genre9mp3I once made 2 such tests and I got 9:30 & 10:00
10:59:33saa[b_r]ideryeah, that's why an average out of 3 tests is usually recommended
11:00:52*petur doesn't understand all the fuss about runtime tests
11:01:05Genre9mp3I suppose that the difference is because of the timing that the disk decides to spin up when the battery is almost empty
11:01:30saa[b_r]idertest #5 started in iRiver fw :0
11:01:47saa[b_r]iderman the replay logos are confusing!
11:02:38saa[b_r]iderwhat's the difference between (D) and i!(d) ? (I hope you understand my ascii art :p)
11:04:06aliaskDirectory and repeat directory I think it could be.
11:04:47aliaskOne just plays the directory through and stops, the other loops back to the start when it's done. (at least I think it does, it's been so long.....)
11:05:21saa[b_r]ideraliask: so there isn't something like 1(D)
11:06:15aliaskI honestly can't remember.
11:06:40aliask(Plus I'm not 100% sure I got your ascii art)
11:06:47saa[b_r]iderI set it to i!(D) your explanation is what I thought...
11:06:55saa[b_r]iderno I think you did :D
11:07:12aliaskMaybe it's my superpower.
11:07:19saa[b_r]ideri! representing repeat arrows :)
11:07:28aliaskYeah the "recycle" arrows.
11:08:09 Quit nudelyn ("At Argon, we're working to keep your money.")
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11:08:24saa[b_r]iderso what are your thoughts? my best time in RB was 8:41... anyone wanna place any bets on the iRiver test?
11:08:56aliaskI'm thinking it's probably less, judging that the H100's get better battery than the original now.
11:11:00amiconnpetur: The 'fuss' about runtime tests is to calibrate the runtime estimation
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11:11:19amiconnOf course that does only make sense with a non-degraded battery
11:11:28pondlifeHi guys,
11:11:39*amiconn is doing a whole series of runtime tests
11:11:51pondlifeI think I just made a bit of a discovery regarding voice crashes
11:12:29aliaskHow exactly is the runtime calculated?
11:12:33pondlifeI had regular .talk clip crashes and got a recipe for them. I now find that disabling Dir Cache fixes them
11:12:57pondlifeSo maybe the .talk playback code isn't waiting for disk spin-up nicely?
11:15:31amiconnaliask: The runtime calculation takes an average current (unit playing 192kbps mp3), add some extra currents to that (e.g. when the backlight is always on), then divides the battery capacity by the calculated current
11:19:56aliaskSo it takes the current level of battery drain into account. (If I understant correctly)
11:21:43aliaskpondlife: The dircache clue is a good one, it'll probably make finding the bug a lot easier. I might even take a look at it myself (I'm very unfamiliar with all voice and playback code, but it might be a simple fix)
11:22:30pondlifeI've been looking at the playback code with a blank look on my face for a while now
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11:23:30pondlifeThought I'd mention this but not sure whether it's worth pointing it out directly to hardeep or lostlogic yet....
11:23:49pondlifeIt would be good if those who are suffering voice problems could report back with their Dir Cache settings, and disable it if enabled.
11:25:05aliaskpondlife: I've never used .talk files before, how do they work?
11:25:22pondlifeHang on, I'll find the wiki
11:26:28pondlifeI'm not blind, but I do find talking very useful when I'm driving
11:26:39pondlifeAnd I do most of my Rockbox use when driving
11:26:57pondlifeWhich is why a hard crash is a particular PITA!
11:27:19pondlifeThat reset button isn't easy to operate at 70mph ;-)
11:27:35*petur gets hungry and blames pondlife for mentioning food
11:28:04pondlifeThat's pitta, not PITA!
11:28:16aliaskHah, I just realised I'm hungry because of you petur, so you're equally blamable.
11:28:30pondlifepetur bread?
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11:28:53pondlifeAnd then there's nudel..
11:29:27 Quit Kohlrabi ("Hello my name is CoolClonk .")
11:29:29pondlifeWith a sprinkling of Paprica.
11:29:37aliaskWell, enough of this talk of food, dinner time!
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11:30:00peturbah... 30 minutes till lunch :/
11:30:14*pondlife has to wait another hour or 2 at least
11:30:44preglowfive more hours, then beer in the sun!
11:31:18peturhmmm... more like 9 hours here
11:32:42pondlifepetur: What, no beer at lunch?
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11:33:43preglowhahaha, coming back from lunch smelling of beer is a surefire way to get fired in this country
11:34:27pondlifeCountry or company...?
11:34:40pondlifeNot even one, on a Friday?
11:34:56preglowmost companies would frown on that for sure
11:35:14pondlifeHmm, the past 2 companies I've worked for encouraged it!
11:35:19preglowwhich is admirable!
11:35:31pondlifeJust the one of course, and no heavy machinery involved
11:35:42pondlifeTeam building I think they called it.
11:36:19pondlifeThe place was deserted on Friday from 12:30 to 14:00
11:37:17peturat my previous job they served free beer at noon
11:37:33preglowghah, blast this puritan asshat country
11:37:33pondlifeWas that in a brewery?
11:37:41pondlifepreglow: Which country is that ?
11:37:52pondlifeNot the US then?
11:38:00preglowhaha, no
11:38:06preglownice country overall, but in a few areas it sucks rod
11:38:10*scorche frowns
11:38:40*scorche has to go to europe on of these days...
11:39:17scorchesomewhere over there =P
11:40:04scorchewhere ever the first chance i get takes me to i guess
11:40:57pondlifeI just found out about Norwegian beer law. More than 4.5% alcohol and they're more controlled/taxed? Is that true?
11:41:32preglowall alcohol is heavily taxed
11:41:38pondlifeIn the UK, most lagers are >4.5% (sadly)
11:41:44pregloweverything above 4.7 has to be sold in the state wine/liquor monopoly shops
11:41:55preglowat exhorbitant prices
11:42:01peturbeen there done that :)
11:42:02preglowalso, the variety of beers sucks
11:42:19pondlifeWould you like pils, or pils?
11:42:22preglowi'm tired of light lagers, but that's all norwegian breweries make
11:42:24 Quit dj-fu (No route to host)
11:42:43pondlifeHmm, wheat beer for me. Or a pint of Summer Lightning...
11:43:21preglowwheat, stout, bitter, ipa, dunkel, everything, but not pils
11:43:29preglowenough of those, thank you
11:43:34preglownow you made me rant about beer again
11:43:46pondlifeSorry. I missed the other rants.
11:43:53preglowit's a weekly event
11:44:10pondlifeHere's my local:
11:44:17*amiconn thinks it happens more often ;)
11:44:38*petur invites preglow to Belgium
11:44:50preglowi'm going to england soon
11:44:53preglowthat'll do just nicely for me
11:45:25pondlifepetur: I enjoyed my last visit to Belgium, but can't remember why
11:46:18markunpetur: the last time in Begium was at the Dour festival last year, do you know it?
11:46:40peturI know it but have never been there
11:48:22 Quit _FireFly_ ("Client exiting")
11:49:01pondlifeAh I've got a non-beer related question... about... Rockbox..
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11:49:11*scorche wonders why he never goes to sleep
11:49:41preglowrockbox, ah yes...
11:49:58pondlifeWhen playing a track, didn't there used to be an option when returning to the file browser to show the playing directory (follow playlist or somesuch)?
11:51:07scorchecat brought in a wounded mouse for me
11:51:19preglowit's proud! pat it!
11:51:20pondlifeI got a frog that way yesterday.
11:51:26pondlifeIt's a gift
11:51:36pondlifeShow your appreciation by playing with it for a bit, then eat it.
11:51:41pondlifeThe mouse, not the cat.
11:51:54scorchei like it much better when she brings in birds
11:51:57preglowi've got to detach, this grew too entertaining
11:52:09scorchefeathers all over is much better to clean up than blood all over
11:52:24pondlifeUrgh. Birds that are injured can leave blood and feathers everywhere.
11:52:35amiconnPoka64: 'follow playlist' is the option you're lloking for
11:52:35scorchetrue...bird have blood too...
11:52:36pondlifeI've still got bird bloodstains on my curtains.
11:52:41amiconn*looking even
11:53:23pondlifeamiconn: Thanks, I think I was looking in the wrong place.
11:53:35 Quit ze (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:54:23scorchepondlife: i find your handle amusing when you talk about your cat bringing in a frog =P
11:54:47pondlifescorche: haha
11:55:37pondlifeUnrelated. The term pondlife was used by some marketing people I met (referring to those who would take up an initial good value offer, but not become regular customers).
11:55:59scorcheand on that note i am off
11:56:03*scorche zZZZz
11:57:35pondlifeBefore I go, could someone with Flyspray permissions mark #5570 to be due in 3.0..?
11:58:06 Join _FireFly_ [0] (
11:58:12pondlifepetur: Thanks
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12:05:00imbrandonmorning fellas
12:05:28JdGordonmorning... again?? oh bloody hell..
12:09:35 Quit gtkspert (Remote closed the connection)
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12:30:38pondlifeAnother question - is it intentional that if set to Repeat:All , the Follow Directory option is ignored? I'd expect it to follow directories, then repeat from the last one to the first...
12:32:01 Quit yuriks (Success)
12:33:05_FireFly_pondlife: afaik the repeat:all option affects only the current playlist
12:33:26pondlifeOK, that makes sense with the current behaviour
12:35:21aliask|afkAm I doing anything wrong with this getting rockbox to voice dirnames? I'm putting a short mp3 (not actually voice) into a directory and renaming it Voice directories is set to ".talk mp3 clip".
12:35:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:36:07aliask|afkIf I move the cursor over a folder with a in it, the HD led comes on for a tic, but no voice.
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12:41:13pondlifeDid you enabled the option too?
12:42:13pondlifeI don't know, but there may be hard-coded restrictions on voice files (e.g. mono)?
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13:10:50peturpondlife: I'm sure there is a size restriction on the voice clips
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13:18:46preglowvoice files are low bitrate, mono, low samplerate
13:19:06preglowother than that, i don't know of any criteria, though size almost certainly makes an appearance on the list too
13:20:24amiconntalk clips, not voice files
13:20:47amiconnThere surely is a size restriction, but I don't remember how large
13:20:47preglowi thought the same criteria generally applied
13:21:08preglowalso, it wouldn't surprise me if hwcodec has some of the criteria, ie. mono, hard coded
13:21:25amiconnOther than size, the only restriction is that the file must be mp2/mp3
13:22:04amiconnHmm, maybe. On hwcodec, there is no other restriction, i.e. in theory it could be 48kHz stereo 320kbps
13:22:30amiconn(but then the possible playtime would be pretty short)
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13:30:35JonSeniorJust to add my thanks to the chorus. A battery benchmark run from full charge took a 24h48 to discharge the battery. That was using one of the iPod replacement batteries (Although I've forgotten the size) and continuous playback of an album recorded as OGG quality 5. Volume was set to -30dB. The headphones were only connected occasionally to check progress and no buttons were touched after the file started playing. Not a realistic evaluation of gen
13:31:49pondlifealiask|afk: Any luck yet?
13:32:59aliaskI can get it to crash, just not play the voice. I'm looking at the code now.
13:33:43dprosince my ipod video was stolen on the weekend anyone knows if there's already a service where people can register their serial numbers so honest souls can check when thei're offered a 'bargain' ?
13:34:20pondlifealiask: Does your crash go away if Dir Cache is disabled? There may be a seperate voice crash if the voice files are missing/incorrect.
13:34:45 Quit JonSenior ("CGI:IRC")
13:34:46aliaskLet me check.
13:35:03pondlifeEither way, looking at the code is good!
13:40:28aliaskHrm, now I can't get the error at all >_>
13:45:50amiconnpreglow: In fact there is no size restriction other than clip_size <= (audio_buffer_size - voicefile_size)
13:46:26preglowno people skilled at gtkmm here, no?
13:46:36amiconn..and hence talk clips only work when music is stopped
13:46:41*petur looks up the word
13:47:34amiconnImho that should be changed, reserving a small extra buffer for talk clips (I suggest 64KB) when talk clips are enabled
13:47:35 Quit Mekrob (" HydraIRC -> <- IRC has never been so good")
13:47:41pondlifeamiconn: Aha - wondered why voiced menus will play overy music, but .talk clips don't.
13:48:23amiconnI also suggest changing the 'voice files' and 'voice directories' options a bit
13:48:47amiconnE.g. I would like a fallback to spelling when talk clips are absent
13:49:03pondlifeDoes anyone use folder numbers?
13:49:40pondlifeI think I'd like .talk folders to fall back to spelling, but .talk files to fall back to numbers.
13:50:02amiconnI suggest splitting both options in 2: (a) the voicing variant itself (off/numbers/spell) and (b) enable .talk clips
13:50:12amiconn(b) would be a simple boolean option
13:50:24preglowand i'd like a speech synthesizer!
13:50:38 Join Captain_America [0] (
13:50:43juxtaplol, i am scared to play doom on my ipod 'cause the buttons are so fragile
13:51:05pussfellerdpro: I was thinking about something like that the otherday, but more like, is the ipod strong enough for rockbox to run an network stack and send out pings and system info to an ip?
13:51:08amiconnSo, if (b) is enabled and a .talk file present, it would use that, and fall back to the option selected in (a) without a .talk file (or if (b) is off)
13:51:10pondlifeWhy not just enable them if they exist automatically? Would that increase disk spinup? (Assuming Dir Cache can be used!)
13:51:31amiconnDircache doesn't prevent spinups for .talk clips
13:51:44amiconn...because it's *dir*cache, not data cache
13:51:55pondlifeNope, but for checking .talk existance
13:52:09amiconnThat's already done for filename clips
13:52:18amiconn..even without dircache
13:52:31pondlifeGreat, so why bother with option (b) at all?
13:52:35peturright now if a talk file exists, memory is reserved for it and it gets loaded, even with voice disabled :/
13:52:51pondlifei.e. just use .talk if it's present.
13:52:57Captain_Americahow do i register my nick
13:53:02Captain_Americaweres the url
13:53:07Mikachu/msg nickserv help
13:55:29amiconnpetur: Wrong, it's not. But it should be according to my suggestion
13:56:11Captain_Americahow do i change my pass
13:56:17Captain_Americai set it to help
13:56:31amiconnpondlife: If someone doesn't want to use .talk clips, disabling (b) would serve 2 purposes (1) the check for the clip(s) (2) not reserving the suggested extra buffer
13:56:39peturamiconn: well according to my experience it works that way unless it got changed recently
13:57:31peturamiconn: I fixed a bug some time ago where you'd get a crash on a voice file even with voice disabled
13:57:58amiconnpetur: You probably confuse .voice and .talk files
13:58:02pondlifeamiconn: OK, I thought you meant that the check for the clips was inexpensive here. But the buffer space is worth having. Can't .talk clips use the main voice buffer (assuming that's the same buffer as used for spelling)
13:58:22peturamiconn: I probably do (/me slaps forehead again)
13:58:29amiconnpondlife: No, because the voice buffer is taken by the .voice file
13:58:44pondlifeamicoinn: Of course!
13:58:57pondlifeAnd I can't spell your name either
14:01:03Jungti1234I have problem.
14:01:08*petur gets extremely bored by platformbuilder
14:01:09Jungti1234Rockbox . Main . IriverE10Info (oops)
14:01:11 Nick jd_ is now known as jd_miam (n=jd@wikipedia/Meanos)
14:01:14Jungti1234Topic save error
14:01:14Jungti1234During save of file Main.IriverE10Info an error was found by the version control system. Please notify your Rockbox administrator.
14:01:14Jungti1234Save attachment error /usr/bin/ci -q -l -m%COMMENT|U% -t-none -w%USERNAME|S% %FILENAME|F%
14:01:14DBUGEnqueued KICK Jungti1234
14:01:14Jungti1234Go back in your browser and save your changes locally.
14:01:16Jungti1234cismo: missing message for -m option
14:02:09 Join Rori [0] (
14:02:12Captain_Americaanyone know why all movies i get dont work
14:02:18Jungti1234anyone don't know?
14:02:19Captain_Americathey just show ambience
14:02:26Captain_Americaand i hear sound
14:02:58peturinstall divx?
14:03:10pondlifeOr flash..?
14:03:20peturor the required codec
14:03:37ZagorJungti1234: try again
14:03:55RoriHey guys. I am having a problem with my nano losing my custom settings (Posted on forum also about this). At first I thought it was from letting the battery drain flat. But today it did it again after I have shutdown correctly, put the hold button on to prevent accidentally switching it on, then switching it back on about an hour later to find it had lost all my settings again.
14:04:37peturon+hold resets settings
14:04:50Captain_Americawhats an xvid
14:04:50Rorithat makes sense
14:04:51sharpeGoodmorning everyone.
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14:04:53peturrtfm ;)
14:05:23Rorithat could be a nuisance. I like to use hold while it's off to prevent accidentally switching it on
14:05:27pussfellerwill resotring using that apple utility erase all the rockbox stuff?
14:05:43Rori@ pussfeller
14:05:47pussfellercool thanks
14:05:53sharpeor it could be, rtfaqtnstr. "read the frequently asked questions that nobody seems to read"
14:06:08peturCaptain_America: what movies do you try to play? they're probably encoded using DivX or another codec that's not installed on your pc
14:07:11Jungti1234hmm Zagor
14:07:48Jungti1234It doesn't work yet.
14:08:52ZagorJungti1234: same problem?
14:09:23Jungti1234ah, you know?
14:09:44Jungti1234If there is Korean in file root, its error happens.
14:09:59Jungti1234root -> Path
14:10:12Zagoraha. try moving the file to a simpler path.
14:10:29Jungti1234But, even if it doesn't exist now, error happens.
14:13:01pondlifeHmm, what does I0B:Line-F at 32F06208 mean?
14:13:20Jungti1234Zagor? you don't know?
14:13:41Jungti1234You can upload it.
14:14:24amiconnJungti1234: You need to enter something into the "comment" field. Without a comment, you'll get that error message
14:15:04Jungti1234thanks amiconn
14:15:16Jungti1234I didn't know it.
14:15:22 Quit Captain_America (" HydraIRC -> <- IRC has never been so good")
14:18:04Jungti1234How do I change image?
14:18:05amiconnZagor: Btw, I consider this a bug in twiki. Maybe it's fixed in a later version?
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14:19:54Jungti1234ah I know
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14:22:06Zagoramiconn: possibly it is, yes
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14:30:34*pondlife must eat
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14:38:14dpropussfeller: I don't think that this is really an option, I guess what the thief will do when he sees rb booting is "restoring" via itunes et voila ...
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14:43:00*dpro will grab the skateboard now and see how much of vienna's city center is affected by bush's visit ;)
14:43:30*petur whispers 'kill kill' :)
14:43:50*dpro would rather leave that to the experts ;)
14:44:06peturGermany is preparing for Bush too:
14:44:11preglowi've always had full confidence in you
14:50:12PaulJamJdGordon: thank you for fixing the random folder patch, i really like it.
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15:20:51Jungti1234I updated it
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15:23:11Genre9mp3nice conversation there petur! :)
15:23:28*petur gets extremely bored by platformbuilder <−−−−-
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15:28:16*amiconn wonders what this platformbuilder thing is
15:28:31peturwindows CE
15:29:11peturit's even slower than cygwin (x10 at least)
15:29:24peturand *very* buggy
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15:35:15JdGordonPaulJam: hth :D
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15:43:37peturnice comment:
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15:48:01sharpeodd comment.
15:48:17peturbut not a spammer
15:48:57Mikachuwhat about the link to
15:49:25sharpebut it's only there two times. :D
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15:53:37sharpei thought i had gotten six hours of sleep, but turns out to be less than five hours.
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15:54:58saa[b_r]iderguys, how do you charge your H300?
15:55:34saa[b_r]iderdo you have it charge under iRiver's fw, or under rockbox?
15:56:14saa[b_r]ideris it more effective?
15:56:45PaulJami think it is hardware controlled, so there should be no difference
15:57:47saa[b_r]iderbut with the current boot loader, if the player is off and the AC adapter is connected, it charges under iRiver's fw, correct?
15:58:42saa[b_r]iderso you start rockbox to charge your player...
15:59:36peturLinus still has to make a bootloader that starts rb on AC
15:59:45_FireFly_why should the dap start when the AC adapter is connected ?
15:59:58peturto charge?
16:00:08peturand for car mode?
16:00:20saa[b_r]iderI'm just surprised that after 5 hours of continuous playback under iRiver's firmware, not a single battery bar has dropped yet, and the most I got under rockbox after the fix is 8 hours 41 minutes
16:00:28_FireFly_my h120 doesn't start when i plug the AC adapter ;)
16:01:38preglowsaa[b_r]ider: ehh?
16:01:42preglowsaa[b_r]ider: how's that possible?
16:02:16saa[b_r]iderpreglow: i have no idea!
16:02:31amiconn_FireFly_: The H300 does.
16:02:37peturrepeating same song again and again?
16:02:45saa[b_r]iderpreglow: I already made 4 different tests under rockbox
16:02:51PaulJamI think the batterydisplay under the original firmware is not linear
16:03:01preglowbut eight hours anyway
16:03:02preglowthat's not much
16:03:08saa[b_r]iderpetur: no, I'm repeating an album, same one I used under the rockbox tests...
16:03:34saa[b_r]iderpreglow: my player is old, that time is actually a 112% boost over the pre-fix build
16:04:03saa[b_r]iderpreglow: I use to get under 5 hours with rockbox before amiconn's fix
16:05:28saa[b_r]iderI thought that my battery is just too old... but now that I've been going for 5 hours straight under irirver fw and still having a full set of battery bars, I'm having second thoughts
16:06:15saa[b_r]ideralbeit the battery meter in iRiver's fw isn't a very accurate representation of the current voltage
16:07:30amiconnIf you get ~8 hours in rockbox, I'd expect ~7 hours in retailos
16:08:02Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: Just wait and see for the results...
16:08:15amiconn(and strongly recommend replacing the battery)
16:09:13saa[b_r]ideramiconn: that's what I was expecting... but not one bar dropping? could the "what's it called" battery memory? damaged or something?
16:09:20Genre9mp3I remember the battery indicator in iriver fw been empty while I just disconnected the player after a full charge
16:09:34saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: can't help being surprised :p
16:10:16saa[b_r]iderstupid iriver fw :)
16:11:12saa[b_r]iderI remember having iRiver saying the battery fully charged, only to disconnect it and finding that the battery was actually empty
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16:13:55bluebrothergreat "bug": :(
16:14:01bluebrotherwhat do the users think?
16:14:30peturI'll make it a feature request
16:14:40bluebrotherI thought about closing it.
16:14:54peturoh, maybe better :)
16:15:09bluebrotherafaik the ipl bootloader can load rockbox, so what's the reason for a "new" rockbox bootloader?
16:15:50bluebrotherI'm just amazed again and again what "useful" "bugs" appear in the tracker :(
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16:28:42pussfellerhmmm my ipod was fuxored with IO buffer errors, but I pounded it on the carpet HARD and seems to be fine now
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16:30:11peturthrowing it out of a window helps too - you'll never see the error again ;)
16:30:43pussfellerthat might void the warranty :)
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16:42:06saa[b_r]iderfinally one bar dropped :)
16:42:29*petur helps the bar back up
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16:43:01*saa[b_r]ider doesn't want to stay up all not to find out how long the iriver firmware lasts
16:45:15Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: plug it to the pc via line-out and start recording...I'm not sure though if this will affect the test
16:46:49Genre9mp3Hopefully though, it won't last long ;)
16:47:32saa[b_r]idernah.. I'll just sit and wait ;)
16:47:52bluebrotherXavierGr, any success with your broken mbr?
16:48:41XavierGryes :) I managed to get over it, thanks
16:49:06bluebrotherI wanted to mention testdisk to you, but you already left.
16:49:07XavierGrJust before I delete my mbr I had a backup of the partition I lost
16:49:33bluebrotherbackups are really useful ;-)
16:49:55saa[b_r]iderhahaha, second bar dropped :D
16:49:59Genre9mp3backups are life savers actually
16:50:52Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: The fall of the iriver empire....LOL
16:51:09XavierGrwindows recovery console made me make the backup. Though it isn't windows fault, it said that maybe I will loose my data if I rewrite the mbr. Windows wrote the mbr correctly but the boot issues weren't solved so I just deleted the mbr info myself and there you go...
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16:58:00XavierGryo hardeep!
16:58:49XavierGrWasn't there a plan to remove battery_test from CVS? Many people seem to be confused with both plugins there.
16:59:02hardeepi dunno
17:00:13hardeepi'm sure it'll be removed if it's not necessary
17:01:53XavierGrI heard about it 2-3 months ago, that's why ask.
17:02:21XavierGrAlso, Genre9mp3, wasn't you who mentioned a loud POP when you accidentally started the plugin?
17:02:43Genre9mp3Yes..but that was some time ago...
17:03:08Genre9mp3Let me check it again
17:03:27Genre9mp3(with the earphones ta a safe distance though)
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17:07:26RoC_MMany 4g development lately?
17:08:04Genre9mp3What the battery test actually do?
17:08:30XavierGrsimulate archos usage
17:08:52XavierGrit just fills the buffer with dummy data and repeats that at specific intervals
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17:09:16XavierGrspecific intervals = when the archos bufffer is supposed to end
17:09:16Genre9mp3It resulted to: 18:14:32 86%
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17:09:55Genre9mp3the 18:14:32 is the current time, not battery estimation, right?
17:10:08XavierGrI guess so, I am not sure
17:10:39XavierGrthe thing is that the plugin is useless now except maybe for archos.'s the time
17:11:52amiconnbattery_test is completely useless now that we have battery_bench
17:11:57Genre9mp3What a co-incidence though....
17:12:10amiconnThe latter gives much more realistic figures even on archos
17:12:32XavierGrthen for the sake of consistency someone should put it in the attic.
17:13:00Genre9mp318 hours could easily corespond to 86% after the fix
17:13:22andrewydoes rockbox have a way to save a list of songs listened to to a file? (for use with
17:13:39linuxstb_B4gder: You're too kind not closing bug #5574...
17:13:52peturandrewy: there's a patch in the tracker
17:14:19peturandrewy: and some experimental builds offered in the forums include it
17:14:42andrewycool, thanks petur
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17:39:30saa[b_r]iderguess what, I'm down to 0 bars :p
17:40:18peturgoodnight ;)
17:40:35saa[b_r]iderstill running though :D
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17:43:03sharpei guess we'll find out when you actually run out of power?
17:43:41PaulJamwrong window..
17:44:12sharpehow dare you.
17:46:16saa[b_r]idersharpe: most likely
17:49:41saa[b_r]idersharpe: you can relax now... test ended!
17:51:50markunsaa[b_r]ider: how long was it?
17:54:00sharpegod. i read 'satan' as 'santa'
17:54:21saa[b_r]idermarkun: 6:47 under iRiver fw with full volume...
17:54:34XavierGrthen hooray
17:54:54XavierGrit's your battery to blame :p
17:54:57saa[b_r]idernow I need to do one more test under RB with full volume as well to proove that RB gives better battery life
17:55:21saa[b_r]iderXavierGr: well yeah :(
17:56:22sharpesuch time consuming tasks...
17:56:43XavierGrsaa[b_r]ider: you will be happy as hell when you upgrade
17:57:13saa[b_r]iderXavierGr: tell me about it! I wish I can get a battery as impressive as yours though! 30 hours!!!
17:57:14Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: So iriver firmware lets you with the impression that you have "full" battery and suddenly all battery "bars" begin to drop!
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17:58:04saa[b_r]iderGenre9mp3: very true.. at least in my situation... I guess it's because the battery doesn't have that much life in it left
17:58:04Genre9mp3saa[b_r]ider: You had a full battery icon at 5 hours, and the result was 6:47...
17:58:38saa[b_r]ideractually it felt as if all the bars started to drop only at the last hour!
17:59:43saa[b_r]iderXavierGr: was the ionity battery you got thicker than the stock battery?
18:02:16XavierGryes it was a little thicker
18:02:27XavierGrit was a very tight fit with my unit
18:02:38XavierGr(though I didn't remove any padding)
18:03:02XavierGrwhen I say tight I mean I was wrestling with the player to put the screws in
18:03:49XavierGrAnd I am afraid to open it up because maybe some of you know about my USB OTG problems
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18:10:43saa[b_r]iderXavierGr oh? what problems?
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18:13:25XavierGrwell my H340 came with USB OTG being defective
18:13:36XavierGrI had to sent it 2 times in Germany to fix it
18:13:49XavierGrand the fix they did was only temporal
18:14:26XavierGrI opened the player apart and took my soldering iron
18:15:01saab_rider2sorry to hear about that...
18:15:02XavierGrIn a fix-it-or-die frenzy I soldered many joints untill I gave up on the verge of breaking it!
18:15:24saab_rider2so it still doesn't work?
18:15:48XavierGrwell after I closed the case it magically started to work.
18:16:01XavierGrbut when I changed the battery I had problems
18:16:17XavierGrfinally it is now working but I am afraid to open it up again
18:16:27XavierGrit is clear that the pcb is damaged somewhere
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18:16:39saab_rider2I remember when I first got my H340... the PC wouldn't recognize it no matter what
18:16:57saab_rider2turns out that my player was shipped with a defective USB cable :|
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18:38:35Lynx_cologne is full of crazy swedes...
18:39:28HansmaulwurfI hope we play vs england in the next match
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19:00:49ryranmcdonalds = evil ... but mcflurry = mmmmmm
19:01:43juxtaporeo mcflurry ftw
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19:05:32sharpewhat would be a good thing for me to work on...
19:06:06juxtapa slow-me-down plugin :]
19:06:23sharpeand what would this slow-me-down plugin do?
19:06:43juxtapit would slow down a track without altering pitch
19:06:56juxtap(to a desired degree)
19:07:20freqmodHow do I set the equalent of the oss audio format "AFMT_S16_NE" in an audio codec?
19:07:31juxtap(useful for musicians)
19:07:45sharpewell, i know very little about playback, so you'll just have to deal with demonic sounding voices for now. :D
19:08:16juxtapdemonic sounding voices?
19:08:51sharpeyes, slowing playback to 50% results in lower-pitched sounds.
19:09:57juxtapoh heh :p
19:10:16juxtapthought you were on about another plugin of yours
19:10:21juxtapthe demon plugin
19:11:22sharpei don't have a demon plugin...
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19:11:34ryranugh. sooooooo don't want to be working right now.
19:13:15sharpehah, i did not know the library of congress has collections on file formats...
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19:17:03sharpei'm bored, i'll look into video playback. nothing will come of this though.
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19:18:23RedBrevaIf this PHP code: $Line=preg_replace('/\n/','',fgets($FileHandle)); removes UNIX end of line, what would I use to cope with Windows OR Unix EOL's??
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19:23:39sharpeRedBreva: use *two* preg_replace()es ?
19:24:53RedBreva'/\n\r/' first, then '/\n/' after?
19:25:46sharpesure!, except, have the second use $Line as the input.
19:28:46RedBrevaOK, will give it a try, just wondered if there was some clever regex magic that could do it in one pass... Thanks
19:29:53sharpei think there is, i'm looking...
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19:31:30sharpeah... try '/\n|\r/'
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19:31:54amiconnRedBreva: I'd check for both \r and \n and replace them with nothing. This way the script will cope with all variants of line ends
19:32:05amiconn(dos/win, unix, and mac)
19:32:23RedBrevaAh, good thinking ;-) Will do
19:32:48sharpei've really no idea about regular expressions, so i'm not really of help. :D
19:33:25RedBrevaI know even less, so don't worry ;-)
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19:34:22sharpelol, are you still working with the php wps/theme thing?
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19:37:45amiconnRedBreva: sharpe's suggestion should work afaik
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19:38:22sharpego me... possibly.
19:38:30RedBrevaYes, just trying to clear out the last remaining bugs in my PHP code :)
19:38:43sharpeah, quite fun.
19:40:03RedBrevaI have discovered the joy of debugging non-interactive code, that works diffently on my Windows test server to the Unix based ISP server, in a language that I only started to learn two weeks ago... :D and I am lovin' it
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19:43:42sharpei am determined to get a frame from an avi displayed, in rockbox. :D
19:43:53RedBrevaOK, the desription text etc now displays (where there is a suitable file) ie, now to make the parsing platform agnostic
19:47:40amiconnRedBreva: WPSes cannot necessarily be shared among all platforms wth identical resolution
19:48:21amiconn..e.g. when a 160x128x2 wps contains time/date tags, it will work on ipod g4 but not on h1x0
19:48:39amiconnWell, it will work but the tag(s) will be displayed literal
19:49:22RedBrevaPersonally I think the WPS display code should ignore non-recognised tags ;-)
19:49:41sharpewhat happens on an unrecognized code now?
19:49:44sharpee,r tag.
19:49:58amiconn[19:47:58] <amiconn> Well, it will work but the tag(s) will be displayed literal
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19:50:46RedBrevaBut even so, once I am happy that the code is sound, changing to platform names rather than resolution shouldn' be too much work... I wold just rather 'finish' version 1, before starting version '2' :D
19:50:49sharpehow can i miss that?
19:51:01RedBrevawold!! would even
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19:54:16sharpesince when was i recording video from my tv tuner in 480x480 ?
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19:57:21amiconnRuntime at backlight brightness = 2: 16:21
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19:57:56Genre9mp3amiconn: What was the runtime with brightness 9?
19:58:29amiconnDidn't measure brightness = 9, but brightness = 8. Runtime 11:57
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19:59:22Genre9mp3Unfortunately brightness set to 2 is not enough
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19:59:38amiconnI expect a small amount of current draw to be caused by the lcd controller itself, which in turn causes the observed nonlinearity of brightness vs. current draw
19:59:40Genre9mp3I prefer it to 5 or 6
20:00:01amiconnIn fact the curve may be perfectly linear when subtracting the constant current caused by the lcd
20:00:20amiconnI'll make a special build which doesn't shut off the lcd when turning off backlight
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20:33:22freqmodDoes anyone know why a codec that works in the simulator produses (much) background noise on an iPod?
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20:34:19freqmodexcept that problem (and a little speed problem) i have made an speex(mono) decoder for ipod/rockbox
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20:37:40linuxstb_freqmod: How little is the speed problem? (nice work by the way)
20:37:54freqmodworks when playing with 50% pitch
20:38:06linuxstb_Is it using floats?
20:38:08freqmod(should then work with dual core)
20:38:18freqmodno, ints, but no arm assembly
20:38:45freqmodand a few float functions i.e. log
20:38:51linuxstb_50% speed is reasonable for a first (non-optimised) port.
20:39:13freqmodyea, if it wold work without all that noise :(
20:39:37*freqmod dosn't like differences between the simulator and the real things
20:39:43*amiconn remembers the first days of libmad on coldfire
20:39:50linuxstb_My first guess would be an endian problem - what CPU are you running the simulator on?
20:40:19linuxstb_Ah, that's a significant difference.
20:40:28freqmodbut i hear the sound in the background...
20:40:52linuxstb_What types are you using? int or long?
20:41:12freqmodmostly short...
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20:42:07amiconnlinuxstb: doesn't look like endianess then
20:42:40linuxstb_Nope. freqmod: Have you tried writing the decoded data to a WAV file and playing that on your PC?
20:42:43 Quit fiftyfour123 (Client Quit)
20:43:08freqmodi just managed it to work 15 min ago
20:43:16amiconnCould be either a datasize/overflow problem (some intermediates might use the full 64 bit), or structure packing, or bitfield handling differences
20:43:17linuxstb_It could also be the way you are initialising the codec (sampledepth etc) causing something bad.
20:44:37*freqmod makes a package of the code
20:45:40linuxstb_BTW, what Ogg parser are you using?
20:45:56freqmodlibogg, tremor's didn't work
20:46:06amiconnHmm, may also be signed vs. unsigned char - iirc we already had that once...
20:46:22linuxstb_Yep, forgot that one...
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20:52:11freqmodRockbox (speex) source:"> , may need to edit apps/codecs/Makefile to fix libm.a / libspeex build
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20:53:40amiconnRedBreva: The player lcd is charcell 11x2, not 11x1
20:53:51freqmodyes, it seems like i have got som .a files lying in it
20:53:56amiconnAlso, the bit depth is 1 (monochrome). 0 isn't possible
20:56:17*freqmod is making a smaller one for those with slow connections
20:57:12RedBrevaamiconn: Thanks for that, corrected the page, but that has shown up another bug.. it now tries to display an empty table!! Will look into that after the football finishes (or perhaps half time) ;-)"> (8,2M)
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20:59:47freqmodplease note that only _mono_ speex files works (yet!)
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21:02:22juxtap(totally off topic: anyone know how i can burn an xvid file to dvd so it's playable on a standalone player?)
21:03:55louconvert to (s)vcd with nero?
21:04:42louor in case your dvd player supports xvid ... well just burn the file onto a cdrom and it will play automatically
21:04:48juxtapi did that.
21:05:05juxtapnero said "sorry you compilation cannot be burned on this type of disc"
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21:05:35freqmodjuxtap:i think nero expects (s)vcd compatible mpeg1 files
21:05:38louno idea
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21:06:02juxtapyeah probably
21:06:12juxtapi only got dvd-rs heh
21:07:06freqmodif your (standalone) player supports DIVX/XVID it is most likely that you shuld just put the (avi) file in the root of the filesystem.
21:07:27freqmodhave your tried to search the net?
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21:13:37 Part amiconn
21:16:31freqmodthe sound is really similar to the ipod when CLIP_MAX & MIN is set: (short *)((1 << 16) - 1)
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21:43:17linuxstb_juxtap: Try
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21:48:15*ender` yawns
21:56:37*sharpe is bored.
21:58:07*scorche stabs sharpe
21:58:12Paul_The_NerdI have the same response to "is bored" responses as I have had for weeks.
21:58:29ender`<- not bored, just yawning all the time
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21:59:54*sharpe just doesn't have anything to do.
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22:05:36Mikachuhaha, it always gets rope
22:06:59pixelmaMikachu: Australians should be scared
22:07:34dionoeais that the fake cnn movie ?
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22:44:28amiconnbeep beep
22:45:05peturamiconn: do you still have plans to auto-boost in the ATA driver?
22:45:41amiconnyes :/
22:48:06*amiconn is like #rockbox. amiconn won't estimate time frames
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23:31:05bleakedso i've been using rockbox with quite a bit of success on my ipod nano for a few months now..
23:31:41bleakedi notice that the apple firware is still on the device −− and for the longest time, i liked to have the option..
23:32:01bleakedbut in the last two months, i have not used it once..i see no point, it sucks.
23:32:49bleakedso is it advisable and/or possible to remove it? the idea would be to increase space on the device, but is it even worth it?
23:33:10Mikachuyou can remove it, but it wouldn't give you any more space
23:34:12hardeepamiconn mentioned that it does improve startup performance though
23:34:31bleakedMikachu: is that purely because it's on a separate partition?
23:34:50Mikachubleaked: have you not noticed very poor transfer speeds when not using the apple firmware?
23:35:20bleakedlike transfering to the device?
23:35:53bleakedidk, i just use konqueror, and it reports about 5-7 MB/sec
23:35:56bleakedso i don't think so
23:35:59Mikachuon my nano and some others', using the apple firmware is a lot faster than the emergency one
23:36:13Mikachumaybe they fixed it
23:36:51Mikachuif you are feeling like experimenting, you can create a third partition and shrink the boot partition
23:36:55Mikachuthat will give you about 60MB
23:37:09Mikachuyou don't have to remove teh apple firmware to do that
23:37:14bleakednice, that's about an extra album or sometimes two
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23:37:30Mikachuyou'll also need to enable multivolume in firmware/export/config-ipodnano.h
23:37:35bleakedwell, what would be teh ideal nano rockbox setup then..
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23:37:51bleakedi don't intend on using the apple firmware
23:37:55bleakedsince most of my music is ogg
23:37:58Mikachuthen the extra partition will show up as <HD1> in your file browser
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23:38:25Mikachuwell, removing the apple firmware will only give you boot speed, i don't think it's large enough to let you shrink the boot partition another block
23:39:12bleakedalright.. well, what exactly do i do..i'm sort of lost at what to do what with what..
23:39:53Mikachudo you know how to compile rockbox?
23:40:27bleakedwell, maybe not exactly
23:40:35bleakedi know how to compile..
23:40:45bleakedif that's what you mean..
23:40:51Mikachuwell, set it up according to the instructions in the wiki
23:41:27Mikachuthen edit firmware/export/config-ipodnano.h and add #define HAVE_MULTIVOLUME anywhere
23:41:53Mikachuthen use a partition editor, like fdisk, to shrink the boot partition from 10 blocks to 2 blocks, and create a third partition in blocks 3-10
23:42:02Mikachuand mkdosfs -F 32 it
23:42:06Mikachuthat should be it
23:42:12Mikachuyou may want to save that in a file for later
23:43:09linuxstb_If you don't install the Apple firmware (use a 512-byte dummy file instead of apple_os.bin when creating rockboot.bin), then you should be able to shrink the boot partition even more. I don't know how Apple's bootloader would react though.
23:43:24Mikachuto only one block? yeah that might work
23:43:42Mikachui haven't checked how big my boot partition is, i just hoped 2 would be big enough :)
23:44:05Mikachubleaked: and no warranties etc
23:44:13bleakedof course
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23:44:58linuxstb_bleaked: I wouldn't create a third partition - just shrink the boot partition, and create a new (larger) FAT32 partition.
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23:45:24Mikachuif you do that, you probably don't want to ever boot apple firmware
23:47:06bleakedwell, honestly, i don't ever intend to.. like i said, 90% of my music is ogg, and i am an album listener and frankly, gaps just don't cut it for me..
23:47:13bleakedso rockbox is it for me. :D
23:47:48Mikachuif you do recreate the fat partition you obviously have to copy all your music from it first
23:47:49bleakedi'm excited for tagcache to take off more
23:48:08bleakedyes, done.
23:48:19Mikachusince i do boot apple firmware i don't want to accidentally destroy my whole partition, just the small third one
23:48:32Mikachualso, if you do just the one big one, you don't need to recompile or anything
23:48:57bleakedah nice.
23:49:15bleakedyea, here's a nice tip to pass along..
23:49:40Mikachubut still make sure you give -F 32 when you mkdosfs it
23:49:48bleakedas you know, in the current stage of tagcache, it does not update the db when you remove music
23:51:04bleakedif you're using at least amarok 1.4, it has flash device support (along w/ full ipod support :D)..
23:51:15bleakedand so it's annoying that the db is not updated
23:51:37bleakedbut for a temporary fix, you can set up pre-connect, and post-disconnect commands
23:51:49bleakedand i've setup one to delete all of the appropriate db files
23:51:56bleakedidk, it's dirty, but works for now.
23:52:22bleaked(though, as of this week, i've just given up on tagcache since it drains the battery so much)
23:53:02bleakedidk, maybe someone will find that tip useful..if not.. whateva.
23:53:28bleakedMikachu: thank you so much for the info
23:53:44bleakedlinuxstb_: you too :D
23:53:50Mikachusorry for not thinking and trying to do it the most possibly complicated way
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23:54:20Mikachuhm, should that be "possible"?
23:54:50Mikachumaybe "most complicated way possible"?
23:55:33scorchelast one ;)
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