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#rockbox log for 2006-08-01

00:00:36 Join Rondom [0] (
00:01:09 Quit Febs ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:05:36 Join Drkepilogue [0] (
00:05:39 Quit xoder ("Chatzilla 0.9.74 [Firefox]")
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00:14:09 Join kidd3ckz [0] (
00:15:22 Quit Sprite_tm ("[BX] For a good time, call 1-900-4BitchX")
00:16:03 Quit klrspz ()
00:21:31 Quit San| ()
00:22:49 Quit petur ("Zzzz")
00:23:33 Quit lightyear (Remote closed the connection)
00:24:41 Quit TucknDar ()
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00:27:04 Quit juxtap (Nick collision from services.)
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00:27:45 Quit TucknDar (Client Quit)
00:28:27 Join Genre9mp3 [0] (
00:28:29 Join TucknDar [0] (
00:29:59 Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (
00:31:59 Quit cal_rifken (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:33:11 Join sharpe [0] (
00:35:22 Join MrStaticVoid [0] (
00:35:37sharpemidkay: ye there?
00:35:48midkaysharpe: yessir.
00:36:20sharperemember the cake song video?
00:36:30sharpe .
00:37:12midkayhaha. how ...
00:37:34midkaythe stupid fake water.
00:37:46midkay666 ratings.
00:37:49midkay4/5 stars.
00:38:02sharpekind of a funny coincidence.
00:38:47sharpelook at the link in the first comment.
00:38:57midkay I am totally a pirate.... Yar-Har-Fiddle-Dee-Dee being a pirate is all right to be. Do want you want because a pirate is free. You are a Pirate. If you love to sail the seas, you are a piarte!
00:39:11 Join San||Away [0] (
00:39:11 Quit BigMac (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:39:17midkay.. "image has been moved or deleted"?
00:39:27sharperemove the space in the address
00:39:50sharpethe one in the middle of animations.
00:40:33sharpethe song is going on my ipod, like the cake one.
00:40:40midkaythe cake one owns though.
00:41:17midkaythose retarded dolls.
00:41:48midkayhaven't seen the video in a while. i have it on mp3 so that satisfies my listening needs.
00:41:56sharpei have it also.
00:42:12Paul_The_NerdSpeaking of funny songs / videos, you guys seen Boten Anna?
00:42:36sharpeno, but i will in a few seconds.
00:42:56midkayPaul_The_Nerd: have you seen the lazy town "bake a cake" song? it's lovely.
00:43:27 Join Sinbios [0] (
00:43:39 Join jn- [0] (
00:44:19jn-how do i reset rb to default settings.. i made it so i cant see any txt, i tried del and reinstalling .rockbox and rockbox.ipod but i still cant see any text in the menus
00:44:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:44:35sharpeswitch hold on while rockbox boots
00:44:39sharpeer, have it.
00:46:00jn-sharpe: with ipod?
00:46:07jn-worked thank you
00:46:57midkayPaul_The_Nerd: that's good, hahaha.
00:47:10 Quit jn- (Client Quit)
00:48:01tucozPaul_The_Nerd, would you be surprised if i told that song is the top charting one in sweden this summer.
00:48:11Paul_The_NerdI'd be quite surprised, yes.
00:48:29tucozI thought it was a joke, but when i visited my parents a week ago i found that out
00:48:42Paul_The_NerdI didn't think it was a joke, but I didn't expect it to be on charts.
00:50:05tucozthe top charting songs tend to be really crap during the swedish summer
00:50:07sharpeit doesn't have the same funny quality to it as the cake song and pirate song...
00:50:33midkaycake song > *
00:52:23tucoz <−− remake from the netherlands for those interested
00:54:11 Part TucknDar
00:54:17 Quit obo ("bye")
00:54:20 Quit Mmmm ("Byeee")
01:00:05 Quit hannesd (Connection timed out)
01:00:23 Join wehn [0] (
01:06:49 Join RaeNye [0] (
01:10:36RaeNyeLinusN: could it be that you've closed FS #5740 without commiting it?
01:11:01^jhMikeS^What happened?
01:11:07 Join scorche [0] (
01:11:12^jhMikeS^That's mine right?
01:11:19RaeNyeslow homepage refreshes
01:11:20Bagderlinus: firmware/target/coldfire/iaudio/x5 lcd-x5.c,1.10,1.11
01:11:35LinusN^jhMikeS^: yes
01:11:36Bagder(that's the mail subject of the commit mail)
01:11:49RaeNyejhmikes: yeah, I was about to commit it as well :)
01:12:20^jhMikeS^Reason for closing: Fixed?
01:12:23LinusNRaeNye: did you have any success with the pcf50606 i2c?
01:12:31RaeNyeI'm not in the rockbox-cvs list. too much RB mail :)
01:12:41LinusN^jhMikeS^: hehe, should have been "Accepted" :-)
01:12:43Bagdercan you get too much?
01:12:56RaeNyelinusn: didn't try it yet, but it's on my list
01:13:26^jhMikeS^I sort of shuffled it up the line :)
01:13:44*RaeNye gets funny mail he *has* to read, no room for cvs mails
01:14:27^jhMikeS^Gotta step out for a minute...brb
01:14:38RaeNyeand no, changes in firmware/export/config-iaudiox5.h aren't funny
01:15:17Bagderthe more the merrier!
01:15:34RaeNyeBTW, i've been thinking of rebuilding the main menu
01:15:59RaeNyeI think it's becoming less logical to navigate it as time passes
01:16:09 Join TCK [0] (
01:16:25RaeNyee.g., maybe have all "Browse .XYZ directory" in a single submenu
01:17:10Paul_The_NerdIt might be even easier to drop them from the menuing system entirely.
01:17:32RaeNyeor divide settings to categories such as "users change this settings only once" / "change this setting every song"
01:17:57Paul_The_NerdAll of the 'browse' ones could simply be user-accessible folders not hidden in .rockbox any more, and you reclaim that little bit of code.
01:17:58RaeNyebut if your browsing is not "all files", you can't enter .rockbox
01:18:32RaeNyeI personally dislike having many subdirs in /
01:18:37Paul_The_NerdI was thinking, you could have a Rockbox folder, and a .rockbox folder in the future.
01:18:43Paul_The_NerdSo you'd just have one extra visible subdir
01:19:07Paul_The_NerdUnder it would be Themes, Configs, Rocks, EQs
01:19:16Paul_The_NerdWPSes, and Fonts too, I suppose
01:19:23RaeNyebut when you enter the filebrowser, you start from current directory which could be too deep...
01:20:01Paul_The_NerdHolding Left will get you to root very quickly
01:20:26RaeNyeand if you're not using dircache, will spin HDD too much
01:20:54Paul_The_NerdMake long-left a shortcut to root.
01:20:59Paul_The_NerdSkip over in-between folders.
01:21:09Paul_The_NerdThat's beneficial anyway.
01:21:19RaeNyethat's a good idea w/o organizing menu at all
01:22:25RaeNyeadd a FS?
01:22:33Paul_The_NerdAnyway, organizing the menu might be fine. My idea was more of "A way to trim tiny bits of code out, without harming functionality *too* much"
01:22:53RaeNyefeature request in the tracker
01:23:10Paul_The_NerdOh, right
01:23:14Paul_The_NerdYes, I shall go do that.
01:23:17^jhMikeS^RaeNye: I was thinking: It doen't cause any noticeable delay to turn off the visible dislplay only with the backlight. I can standby the chip when the switch is flicked however.
01:23:28amiconnPaul_The_Nerd: The problem with 'just' using subdirs as-is is localisation
01:23:40Paul_The_NerdRaeNye: I think I've only ever added one feature requests to the tracker, and it was a request to disable "Critical" feature requests.
01:23:40 Quit xoder (Remote closed the connection)
01:23:45Paul_The_Nerdamiconn: Oh, right. This is very true.
01:23:49RaeNyepaul_the_nerd: And I might very well implement it :)
01:24:03RaeNyejhmikes: the problem is when you wake it up
01:24:31^jhMikeS^RaeNye: It's very fast if the chip is left on. 80ms.
01:24:46RaeNyepaul_the_nerd: I saw it. funny indeed.
01:25:12RaeNyejhmikes: so when do you shut it off completely?
01:25:24 Join YouCeyE [0] (n=YouCeyE@unaffiliated/youceye)
01:25:38^jhMikeS^When you explicitly do so or when it times out. Do we need another thread for that or just use the BL thread?
01:26:38RaeNyeI think the BL thread is ok for that. I'd prefer a more general power management thread replacing BL thread though...
01:27:57^jhMikeS^I have a routine to just do the visible display as well as a full power mode selection routine but I'm thinking that might be too elaborate? (but it is compact :)
01:29:15^jhMikeS^You don't really gain anything from sleep mode. Startup is basically the same.
01:29:44Mikachuwhat platform are we talking about? couldn't find it in scrollback
01:29:59^jhMikeS^Mikachu: x5
01:31:03^jhMikeS^Well, the BL thread can become the power thread. Don't change the code for other ports. Should work the same...I think.
01:32:08 Quit lostnihilist ("Leaving")
01:33:38*LinusN goes to bed
01:33:46 Join Torment [0] (
01:33:53*tucoz too
01:33:54LinusNnite all
01:33:55^jhMikeS^LinusN: goodnight
01:34:00 Part LinusN
01:34:07 Part Torment
01:34:39^jhMikeS^Wait, you've got a power thread...duh. I have to study all that first.
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01:35:59 Quit joe2 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:37:58^jhMikeS^RaeNye: Is the power thread just for charging / poweroff? Why does the backlight need to be separate?
01:40:23 Join scorche` [0] (
01:40:40RaeNyesorry, i wasn't here
01:40:44RaeNyealso gtg.
01:40:48 Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:40:59*RaeNye snaps his finger
01:41:01 Quit RaeNye ("CGI:IRC 0.5.7 (2005/06/19)")
01:44:39 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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01:56:21 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
02:00:49 Quit Sinbios (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
02:04:38 Quit secleinteer ()
02:05:26 Join secleinteer [0] (
02:09:08 Join JdGordon [0] (
02:11:25secleinteerhey, if i wanted to upgrade from an older daily build of rockbox, how would i do that?
02:11:39secleinteerdo i just replaced the rockbox.ipod file?
02:11:58midkayunzip the whole daily build..
02:13:28secleinteerwon't that delete anything i added to the folders in .rockbox?
02:13:34secleinteerlike fonts, etc.
02:13:58midkayno, that's not how unzipping works, it just overwrites whatever is there with the same filename. anything user-added will not be affected.
02:14:18 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
02:15:47JdGordonPrevent the simulator SDL audio skipping under Linux. <- does this mean sound works in the sim?
02:16:05netmasta10btyeah i got sound
02:16:17netmasta10btit did skip though and eat 100% cpu
02:19:49 Join lostnihilist [0] (
02:20:37 Join Sinbios [0] (
02:44:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:44:38 Join BigMac [0] (n=dummeska@
02:44:54BigMacanyone using the podzill bootloader and rockbox?
02:45:07BigMacist it a good idea or bad, i've heard both
02:45:08 Quit dan_a (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:45:24Mikachuyou mean the ipl bootloader, podzilla is their user interface thinger
02:45:39BigMaci typed that originally
02:45:44BigMacbut changed it
02:45:46Mikachuthe good thing about it would be the menu at startup that allows you to select what to boot
02:46:06BigMaci heard it causes problems
02:46:08Mikachuthe bad thing is it will probably take a little bit longer to load
02:46:19BigMacah nvm
02:46:22Mikachui haven't tried it myself
02:46:40BigMaci just hate how it takes me 2-3 tries to get into apple os
02:46:43Mikachubut if it gives a menu where you can choose, it has to have a delay to actually allow you to choose...
02:47:16 Quit lostnihilist (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:47:25BigMacMikachu: are you a dev?
02:47:30Mikachumy guess is it would be a lot easier if it was the select button...
02:47:38Mikachunot officially no, i just fiddle with lots of things
02:47:59BigMacperhaps jd could do that because hes fiddlin with the button mapping
02:48:20Mikachuone thing to be aware of is that you will fail if you move your thumb around, because the scrolling interferes
02:48:46BigMacso what do you "fiddle for"?
02:49:06 Join lukaswayne9 [0] (
02:49:18BigMacwhat model
02:49:30Paul_The_NerdBigMac: Once you get the hang of it, you should be able to get AppleOS the vast majority of times anyway.
02:49:51Mikachuone thing i fiddled is a menu to boot apple without having to press anything
02:50:11Paul_The_NerdThe iPodLinux bootloader really *shouldn't* cause any problems, but if Rockbox doesn't load for some reason, and you're using it, you'll need to go to them for help, or switch to our bootloader and see if it still doesn't load before asking, i sall
02:50:41BigMachow hard would it be to get video support in 5g
02:50:58BigMacbecause im trying to learn c and arm so i can actually contribute
02:51:02Paul_The_NerdVery is a soft word.
02:51:14Mikachunobody knows how that piece of the hardware works
02:51:18Paul_The_NerdFor good video support, you need to do some reverse engineering.
02:51:41BigMaci hate going to apple os its like eating hamburger after youve been eating filet mignonyour entire life
02:52:26BigMacis anyone working on video support?
02:52:31BigMacon 5g
02:52:43Paul_The_NerdNobody in Rockbox is working on 5G-specific video support, I believe
02:53:18JdGordonor any video support really..
02:53:20BigMacthat sucks. what are they working on for the 5g
02:53:46Paul_The_NerdBigMac: You seem to be missing the point. People for the most part work in things that affect everyone, not just one player
02:54:08BigMacoh i see
02:54:23Paul_The_NerdBesides, the 5G, and iPods in general, have *problems* that need to be fixed before someone does something as frivolous as working on a feature that would only benefit one player, and only a subsection of its users at best. :-P
02:55:23Paul_The_NerdThere has been a little work toward a generic video playback plugin, that would simply work on any player that was fast enough. But it's really not gotten far.
02:55:29BigMaci believe everyone who bought an ipod video, intended on using video. Otherwise they could have just bought a photo:-P
02:55:45FebsRight. Like, it would probably be a good idea to get skip-free *audio* playback working before worrying about video.
02:56:14BigMaci have never had a skip in audio
02:56:19Paul_The_NerdBigMac: Considering nowadays if you want a *new* HD iPod you have to get a Video, that's a very bad assumption to make
02:56:24FebsBigMac: Well, you're off by at least one, because the availability of video had zero influence on my decision to buy a 5g.
02:56:43Paul_The_NerdBigMac: As well, just because you don't get skips doesn't mean it isn't a problem. It's a very major problem, as is battery life.
02:56:56BloodySorcererEEK! battery life
02:57:02BloodySorcererthe curse of practically all the ports
02:57:07BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: Or you could get an H300, or an x5 right?
02:57:08 Quit Genre9mp3 ("I don't suffer from Rockbox psychosis. I enjoy every minute of it.")
02:57:16JdGordoncant get a h300 anymore
02:57:18 Quit Mikachu (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:57:21BloodySorcereri have an X5L and could care less about video playback
02:57:22JdGordonnot new anyway
02:57:44BigMacJdGordon: how long have you been here?
02:57:52BigMaclike the past 30 mins ?
02:57:53BloodySorcererif video playback is somebody's priority they should get an A2 or AV500
02:57:55JdGordonan hourish
02:58:06BigMacso did you here my suggestion?
02:58:06Paul_The_NerdBigMac: H300 and X5 aren't iPods. Some people want iPods for silly reasons like "style" or the scrollwheel, or the iTunes integration, rather than simply video support.
02:58:25Febs[20:09] * JdGordon has joined #rockbox
02:58:26BloodySorcererif they were ipods they'd be common ;)
02:58:30JdGordonits a bit diffucult hearing with all this background noise... speak up :D
02:59:00BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: style was not at all my concern. it was cheap and had all the functions i wanted, and supposed a good warranty
02:59:10BigMacJdGordon: your working on button mapping
02:59:14 Join Mikachu [0] (
02:59:26JdGordonyup, instead of doing ui assignments :p
02:59:39 Quit MrStaticVoid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:00:21BigMacJdGordon: then would changing the way to boot into a$$hole os from play to select be in the parameters of what your doing?
03:00:39JdGordonim not touching the booloader code
03:01:26 Part pixelma
03:01:35BigMacwould that be hard to do? changing play to select?
03:01:44 Quit Criamos ("( :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: )")
03:01:49FebsBigMac, I think that it is safe to assume that making it easier to boot the apple firmware is not very high on Rockbox developer's to do lists.
03:01:51JdGordoni doubt it
03:02:19BigMacwell then that is what im going to try to do
03:02:32 Join lostnihilist [0] (
03:02:55Paul_The_NerdSo do it?
03:03:24BigMaci i have to learn c to a good extent first and learn arm.
03:03:25Paul_The_NerdIf you read the ipod bootloader's .c file, you can probably find where it does the button check to see if it's being held down.
03:03:32Paul_The_NerdYou don't need to know ARM for this one.
03:03:32JdGordonPaul_The_Nerd: remember we were talking about how noone ever uses do.. while() loops? well i changed the while into a do while in the action code and got rid of 2 variables! so they are usefule!
03:03:36BigMacim not in college so i can't take a course on it
03:03:50Paul_The_NerdJdGordon: I admitted they're useful, just wondered if they were ever *necessary*.
03:03:51BigMacoh ok
03:04:10JdGordonBigMac: just look for BUTTON_SELECT in the bootloader and change it to BUTTON_PlAY
03:04:50BigMacwere is the code do i have to download with vmware?
03:05:10BigMacand i have to learn how to compile because i *still* cant do it
03:05:28Paul_The_NerdYes, you need to learn how to compile.
03:05:45Mikachuit is not very hard
03:05:54BigMacyah im trying just can't successfully do it
03:07:07Paul_The_NerdWith vmware all you need to do is open a terminal window, cd into the rockbox source folder, mkdir build, cd build, ../tool/configure, and then make
03:07:16Paul_The_NerdAt least for your first compile
03:07:43Paul_The_NerdThe VMWare image should have like, 90% of the setup work done for you already
03:07:45BigMaci have a question, what does vmware download? like what file type
03:08:23BigMacfor the source
03:08:47 Join Rondom_ [0] (
03:08:51FebsThe source is many files.
03:09:00 Join jn [0] (
03:09:20Paul_The_NerdVMWare is intended to be used with the cvs command to check out the whole sources from the repository.
03:09:35BigMacis that what i need to change the button?
03:10:13FebsPerhaps you should start with something a bit less ambitious.
03:10:29Paul_The_NerdFebs: The button is actually a really simple change, I think.
03:10:35jnhey rb pauses/skips every so often when the icon all the way to the top right shows up i tried enabling anti-skip and disk cache but that didnt help... is there a solution for this? im using a ipod-photo
03:10:42Paul_The_NerdBut really, the first thing he should do is get compiling working
03:10:58FebsYeah, but "really simple" is relative. If you don't know how to compile ...
03:11:19Paul_The_NerdFebs: Well yeah, I meant really simple in the context of "once you're ready to make source code changes, it's one of the easiest you could make"
03:11:28Paul_The_Nerdjn: What format files are you using?
03:11:36BigMaci dont think i could use it anyway so i guess i cant do it
03:11:47jnPaul_The_Nerd: mp3 vba
03:11:52BigMacim using jbuild so id have to apply it ove it
03:12:13jnjbuild freezes for me
03:12:18jntoo often
03:12:34Paul_The_Nerdjn: And it only skips when you the icon is displaying?
03:13:11BigMacjn:never freezes for me
03:13:14Paul_The_NerdIt sounds like it's the usual skipping when the CPU is too tasked. There's probably not anything you can do for it.
03:13:24jnBigMac: have you changed any settings?
03:13:27Paul_The_NerdBigMac: He has a 4G, which has its own set of problems. Remember, not all players perform the same.
03:13:41Paul_The_Nerdjn: Ignore the fact that it doesn't freeze for him. The 4G has a known freezing bug that the 5G doesn't have.
03:13:52Mikachujn: do you use the default wps with the peak meters?
03:14:04Mikachuchange to one without them
03:14:05jndefault everything
03:14:11jnwhat's it called?
03:14:26Mikachufind something called browse themes and select anything there
03:14:36Paul_The_NerdAnything but rockbox_default, that is
03:15:07jnloading dancepuffduo
03:15:27Paul_The_NerdThat one seems to be popular, since it's available by default.
03:16:07BigMacdance puff duo? 4g only?
03:16:34Paul_The_NerdI don't believe there's a 5G version of it, no.
03:17:52FebsDoesn't Dance Puff Duo have some animation on the WPS? That can cause skipping. (Though it's probably less of an issue on the 4g than on the 5g.)
03:18:09jnwhat theme do you reccomend i use?
03:18:17Paul_The_NerdFebs: Apparently the animation causes less issue than the peakmeters, if the results of the people in the forums is any indication.
03:18:59Paul_The_Nerdjn: Try iCatcher
03:19:17FebsOn the 5g, ANY updates to the wps can cause problems. For example, I can use the EQ without skipping if I keep Rockbox on a menu rather than the WPS.
03:19:49Paul_The_NerdFebs: What about a non-scrolling WPS without progress bar / time?
03:20:24FebsI had the same thought, but I haven't gotten around to making a simple WPS to test it.
03:21:20jnok thank you guys
03:21:38Mikachuecho > empty.wps
03:21:47Paul_The_NerdI'm kinda curious how much drawing can occur before it starts skipping. Maybe there's something funny in the WPS code too
03:23:05Mikachumaybe it refreshes the whole screen after every printed line or something stupid? but not likely
03:23:48FebsBigMac, I'm guessing that the change that you would want to make is in line 416 of bootloader/ipod.c.
03:24:21FebsEmphasize the word "guessing." I am no programmer.
03:24:42 Quit Rondom (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:27:36 Join cal_rifken [0] (
03:28:10secleinteerFebs: i had problems with the default wps causing skipping, and unicatcher works just fine
03:28:31secleinteericatcher should work too, it depends on which font you prefer
03:28:40 Quit Drkepilogue ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
03:28:58BigMacFebs: thanks, but like i said i won't be doing it because id have to overwrite my jbuild
03:29:21sharpethe bootloader is built seperately from rockbox.
03:30:12Paul_The_NerdBigMac: Indeed, changes that only affect the bootloader don't require using a different build
03:30:19BigMacso how could i overwrite my bootloader and apply it
03:30:35sharpeeasy, follow the installation instructions.
03:30:48 Quit TeaSea ("Leaving")
03:30:56sharpeand just *don't* extract a new build.
03:31:01BigMacso i could dl the bootloader.bin
03:31:08Paul_The_NerdAssuming you've still got apple_os.bin, you do the ipodfw -g 5g (or video or whatever) blah that merges apple_os.bin and bootloader.bin
03:31:12BigMacthen open it in wordpad?
03:31:15Paul_The_NerdAnd then you do the ipodpatcher -w step
03:32:09sharpewhat... would you open it in wordpad for, besides the fact it's a binary file?
03:32:28BigMacso i can change it?
03:32:42JdGordonyou have to change it in the code!
03:32:42sharpewhat are you wanting to change?
03:32:46JdGordonnot the binary
03:33:05BigMacthe way to go into apple os from menu to select
03:33:32sharpefor any change to the bootloader you're going to have to compile the bootloader.
03:34:21BigMaci really have to learn how to compile eventuallly...
03:34:32sharpeunless you could probably get by using a hex editor to change a string, but not much else, changing a string isn't going to help you here.
03:34:39JdGordonno.. dont.. we get more enjoyment this way
03:34:47JdGordonnot a string
03:34:56sharpelike i said, it wouldn't help him here.
03:34:57JdGordonan actual bonafide int
03:35:23sharpei can't remember, ARM is little endian, isn't it?
03:35:57sharpei think so...
03:36:19BigMacso on my list of stuff to do: learn to compile, c, and arm assembly
03:36:21Paul_The_NerdIt's the opposite of m68k.
03:36:27Paul_The_NerdIf that's at all helpful
03:36:32BigMacanyone learn to compile from a book
03:36:44sharpeokay, just need to know what endian m68k is then.
03:36:58sharpeBigMac: actually, compiling is pretty straightforward.
03:37:07BigMacive tried it
03:37:09Paul_The_NerdBigMac: Learning to compile Rockbox is something you learn by reading the documents at the Rockbox website. It's not like there are books published on the Rockbox development process...
03:37:26BigMacbut i don't know any of the commands, i have to use the tutorial
03:37:26Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: I think ARM is LE
03:37:26S0apBigMac - Follow the wiki instructions and build a stock CVS one, just to exercise the steps yourself. Baby steps.
03:37:49sharpeit's what i thought too, i remember something about it before.
03:38:11Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: I honestly can't remember if it was betoh or letoh that I needed to fix some bugs. =/
03:38:18S0apFor if you start with a modified build of ANY kind, and you have problems, it becomes impossible to troubleshoot if you don't know what a stock build should do.
03:38:25BigMacwooops, i meant learn c from a book
03:38:59sharpeyou can use, online material...
03:39:12BigMacno i would like to use a book
03:39:19sharpethere are books that are now online.
03:39:27scorche`actually, ARM is middle-endian
03:39:30S0apYou don't need to know jack about C to enact the change in the bootloader you want, BigMac. Learn to compile by paint-by-numbers, and then start playing...
03:39:57Paul_The_NerdBigMac: As for learning C, your very best bet is to go to a bookstore and flip through the books they have, and see which one feels least boring to read.
03:40:05Paul_The_NerdIf you *must* use a book
03:40:16sharpescorche`: have you seen the pirate video?
03:40:20BigMacS0ap: i want to learn c so i can contribute to the development on the 5g
03:40:38Paul_The_NerdAlso, I might recommend picking up an O'Reilly pocket reference for C or C++, just so you have something convenient to look things up in for syntax and basics.
03:40:39scorche`sharpe: eh?
03:40:51scorche`does it have anything to do with me correcting you on endianness?
03:41:00 Join Dae [0] (
03:41:01DaeHey, can anyone tell me how to make my hostname so it says something else? I seen people have it as like and such
03:41:01S0apBigMac - first things first. Play with the tools you have, and expand from there.
03:41:12sharpescorche`: nope. showed it to midkay earlier.
03:41:15BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: is it a book or on the oreilly site?
03:41:27S0apDae - checkout the freenode FAQ referenced in the MOTD
03:41:46Paul_The_NerdBigMac: It's a small book, pocket-sized, fairly handy.
03:41:54BigMacS0ap: hence me putting it on the to do list after learning to compile:- )
03:42:06Paul_The_NerdBigMac: It'd also be useful if you wanted to read the Rockbox source and try to understand what's going on.
03:42:08BigMaccool ill check if borders has it
03:42:21DaeS0ap: I can't find the FAQ
03:42:24Paul_The_NerdI got mine at a Borders.
03:42:57S0apDae -
03:43:02Paul_The_NerdI mean, everything in it *should* be in any other book you get, and it's not good for learning from, but it's really handy for if you can't quite remember the syntax of something. It's kinda like a dictionary. If you can speak English, it doesn't necessarily mean your spelling is perfect.
03:43:39sharpei have a book like that on c#. like a reference guide, i suppose you're talking about Paul.
03:44:10BigMacwait my spelling or the book, and yes i can speak english.
03:44:30S0apBigMac - Paul_The_Nerd was making an analogy
03:44:38BigMacoh gotcha
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03:44:51BigMacim not good at analogys
03:45:17Paul_The_Nerdsharpe: Yeah, I was talking about the O'Reilly pocket references. They're fairly cheap for computer books, rather tiny, and information dense. Very handy, especially for languages I don't really know but get forced to write anyway.
03:45:26 Quit kidd3ckz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:45:43sharpeheh, mine's an o'reilly one.
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03:46:11scorche`hadny, those things are indeed
03:46:17BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: this?
03:46:23DaeYou know where I can get a free hostname/ip cloak?
03:46:35 Quit cal_rifken (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
03:47:32S0apDae - read the FAQ. You can ask for a cloak here after you follow all the steps in the FAQ.
03:48:19S0apbut don't worry, I'll neverforget your address ;)
03:48:51BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: to program for the 5g do i need to know c++ as well
03:48:59sharpeBigMac: nope.
03:49:24Paul_The_NerdRockbox is C only, with bits of assembly here and there (which isn't necessary to know for most stuff)
03:50:15DaeS0ap: That's a proxy, but I want something cool
03:50:18BigMacPaul_The_Nerd: any recommended tutorial for learning c? (or anyone else for that matter)>
03:50:44S0apDae - then read the FAQ.
03:51:16Paul_The_NerdBigMac: I honestly don't even remember how I learned C/C++. Most of what I know, I just realized I had picked up along the way, by the time I took a course in it I found out I already knew everything that course was teaching, and so far I've managed to keep ahead of what various courses have tried to teach me.
03:51:47S0apBigMac - once you learn to compile, an active project (RockBox) you are interested in (RockBox) is about as excellent a tutorial as you can get.
03:52:53BigMacso youre saying just learn to compile and i should be good?
03:52:56 Join scorche`` [0] (
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03:53:05S0apBigMac - you can read patches, try to follow what they do and how, and ask the authors for _specific_ clarification on _specific_ troubles you have understanding. You'll wear out your welcome shortly if you as for hand-holding, but if you show an honest attempt to track the code yourself, and have _specific_ questions you'll most likely get answers.
03:53:49BigMack will do
03:53:50S0apCompiling is a hurdle which, once you cross it, allows you to play and experiment w/o reliance on others.
03:54:01BigMacim ordering the book tomorrow
03:54:55BigMacS0ap: should i learn to compile to the extent were i know the commands by heart, or just enough to be able to go through the tutorial
03:55:38Paul_The_NerdOnce you get to a point, there's only a few things you'll need to know
03:55:44S0apStep one would be simply follow the tutorial with a stock build to ensure you have everything set up right. Rule out as many variables as you can.
03:56:11Paul_The_NerdOne: How to make a build (mkdir build, cd build, ../tools/configure, make, make zip), how to patch (learn to use the patch and diff commands) and how to update to the newest sources (cvs update -dP)
03:56:22Paul_The_NerdLearn how to do those few things by heart, and you're set.
03:56:59BigMacill try them
03:57:47BigMaci really do want to help you guys out. I know i probably come of as an arrogant jerk, but i really am honestly trying to learn so i can help.
03:58:36Paul_The_NerdOh, believe me, at least in the forums I'm considered much more of a jerk than you will be unless you work on it.
03:59:05scorche``<3 Paul_The_Nerd
03:59:26sharpethat was... uncalled for...
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04:01:32BigMacyah but if any of you watch house im about to try and quote it "He must be really good or really clueless because thats the only way you can be a jerk"
04:01:45BigMacyou know enough to be a "jerk about it
04:01:50BigMaci know nothing about this
04:02:09Paul_The_NerdHouse gave me the confidence to call people on it when I'm 100% sure they're lying. So far I haven't made an ass of myself by getting it wrong.
04:02:24Paul_The_NerdI've gotten a few "LOL how did you know!" where I had the chance to explain to people the mistakes they made though.
04:02:57sharpei'm assuming you weren't speaking with them in person...
04:03:17Paul_The_NerdIn most of the cases.
04:03:53sharpehahahah. i'm going to sleep. g'night everyone.
04:04:54sharpei believe that's the first time you've said that to me paul.
04:05:13Paul_The_NerdIt's entirely random who I say it to. You're not special. :-P
04:05:46sharpeeh, oh well.
04:06:07sharpebye everyone.
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04:34:55BigMacnot very talkative guys?
04:35:40S0apYou should join the RockBox Last.FM group.
04:35:52S0apIt'd be a better social outlet than the IRC channel.
04:36:03S0apor maybe start a #rockbox-social channel here.
04:36:52BigMacand would anyone actually join it?
04:37:02BigMacthen id just be talking to myself
04:37:17BigMacand what is the last fm adress
04:38:44S0apyou and google need to meet.
04:39:40BigMacmy mommy told me not type to strangers
04:42:45BigMacrun dmc had a song called rockbox
04:43:04BigMacperhaps that could play in the background on the site lmao
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05:08:35BigMachow do i register my channel on freenode?
05:08:52 Join Crilen [0] (
05:10:05CrilenI just have a quick question for clerification.. I have an iPod Video 60GB. The site has iPod Video/5G, Hoping that means iPod Video OR the 5Gig one.. or something like that.
05:10:15CrilenDon't want to flash one that's not compatible..
05:10:24scorchethe "video" is the 5g
05:10:37 Quit TCK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
05:10:44scorchetechnically, the ipod video has not come out yet
05:10:45BigMac5g=fifth generation ipod
05:10:47CrilenSo the 60gig won't work then?
05:10:51BigMacwhich is the video model
05:10:52scorcheit will
05:10:54CrilenOhh ok
05:11:02CrilenJust wanted to make sure before I screw it up or something haha
05:11:07 Quit San||Away ()
05:11:12BigMacyup your good to go:-)
05:11:16CrilenThanks =)
05:11:21CrilenGonna give it a shot.
05:12:15*midkay stabs BigMac for being clueless.
05:12:23BigMacyup it works great on my ipod
05:12:33BigMaci helped out
05:12:53BigMacive been a good boy there is no reason to take out the whip again
05:13:04scorcheunnecessary help, but yes, you did =)
05:13:12midkay.. some kind of sexual innuendo? :o
05:14:39BigMaci was clarifying for him/her . scorche didnt give her a definitive answer so i was telling her/him one
05:14:47scorchei didnt?
05:15:05BigMacyou said video is the 5g is...
05:15:13BigMacbut video hasnt come out yet
05:15:24scorchelook at the quotation marks...
05:15:46BigMacim so sorry for trying to help
05:15:57BigMaci apologize soo greatly
05:16:12midkayvideo hasn't come out yet?..
05:16:27*midkay stabs BigMac for being wrong repeatedly. hasnt...but the "video" has =P
05:16:40BigMacim sorry Crilen, i have to ask for scorches approval when trying to help someone
05:17:50midkayand for good reason - don't forget past misinformation..
05:18:09midkaymaybe someone with a bit higher level of knowledge ought to explain these things.. :)
05:18:16 Quit Rob2222_ (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
05:18:20midkaywhen said person is around, of course.
05:19:06BigMac:roll eyes: back to mastering c
05:24:39BigMacmade a channel for rockbox users tp chat about non dev related issues
05:25:15scorchelet me know when someone other than you joins =P
05:25:37BigMacoh you won't be knowing
05:25:44BigMacyoull have to find out
05:25:51midkayyou'll be waiting a few thousand centuries.. maybe until someone happens to join just to see if such a channel exists..
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05:26:39midkaythat was @scorche.
05:26:42BigMacone person already
05:26:56BigMacbesides me
05:27:04scorcheno way!!
05:27:05*philth puts hand up
05:27:22scorcheyou should be ashamed of yourself!
05:27:25rus1Hey, I just put rockbox on my iPod Nano and somehow it seems to have removed my iTunes database because when I boot into the stock firmware it acts as if I have no songs on it. What are my options for rebuilding that?
05:27:38rus1(Is there an easy way, or will I have to remove everything and put it back?)
05:28:15rus1I tried the rewrite database feature in the foo_dop plugin for foobar2000
05:28:28scorcherus1: it should still exist...did you format your device?
05:29:34rus1I still have all my music and stuff on it - in ipod_control or whatever those hidden directories are and can play them through the file browser in rockbox.
05:29:46midkayrus1: in my experience, and many others', the foo_pod rewrite feature is broken and will not rebuild your database, instead just kind of screwing it up if it existed.
05:30:17midkayrus1: i don't know of any other way to rebuild it.. either you'll have to google for another tool, or reload all the music.
05:30:17rus1I'm not using foo_pod, because that's not compatible with foobar2000 version .9 and later. I'm using one called foo_dop
05:30:42midkayif it didn't work, you probably just need to reload it all, or keep searching.
05:31:00rus1And foo_dop is able to read the iTunes database from the iPod and load all the songs into a playlist.
05:31:37midkaythere's no reason it shouldn't show up in apple OS if the database is intact..
05:32:01rus1That's what I would think.
05:32:06rus1But it isn't showing up.
05:32:23midkayif you can, i'd just suggest recopying everything - it's a nano, so that won't take long.
05:32:55 Quit philth ("quittin' time")
05:35:26rus1I wonder if I can do that without installing iTunes. I'll try foo_dop first I guess.
05:36:19midkaywhy not just install itunes, even if you uninstall it afterwards?
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05:37:40rus1I'm anal and don't like it, and I JUST re-installed windows so everything is squeaky clean.
05:37:53rus1But I think I can handle re-adding my music.
05:38:22*midkay doesn't get people who hate some pieces of software so much they won't install them, even if just for a few minutes, in order to just get something done instead of looking for alternatives...
05:38:23 Quit scorche` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
05:38:29midkaysuit yourself, though.
05:38:50 Join scorche` [0] (
05:38:50rus1I know I'm being irrational.
05:39:12midkayat least you're aware of it, then :)
05:39:17BigMaccan you add bots on freenode?
05:39:37*scorche` looks at logbot_
05:39:37midkaydownload and install and configure and start one.
05:40:52BigMacfreenode doesn't have a botserv?
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05:41:34 Part scott666
05:41:45*scorche` looks over at freenode's FAQ
05:42:18*rus1 looks at scorche`
05:42:38*scorche` stares down rus1
05:42:49*rus1 looks away meekly.
05:44:10 Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
05:44:28*rus1 gets really frustrated with his iPod.
05:44:48scorche`throw it out the window then
05:45:12*rus1 isn't as frustrated as scorche` thinks he is.
05:45:17scorche`why do you even want to have music in apple firmware, if you have rockbox?
05:45:44rus1Little things. Like playing high bitrate MP3s without skipping.
05:46:33rus1Smart playlists.
05:46:39rus1That kind of thing.
05:47:02rus1Basically, take a look at "known issues" with iPod rockbox, and those are my reasons.
05:54:13 Quit sando (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
05:54:20rus1However, I'm very impressed by rockbox in general - non-retarded photo display, playing other formats, and the many options and settings available are awesome.
06:03:18*^jhMikeS^ says uhuhuhuhuh PortalPlayer - - by Erica Ogg
06:04:53 Quit netmasta10bt ("My damn controlling terminal disappeared!")
06:06:39^jhMikeS^Will their secrecy help them now?
06:08:38rus1What do I win?
06:08:50^jhMikeS^Cheers? \o/
06:09:00rus1Good enough.
06:10:59rus1The more I play with rockbox the more amazed I am. How did you guys make the iPod do all this stuff?
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06:15:17^jhMikeS^I don't know how for the iPod in particar. But many of these DAPs are little more than underutilized computers.
06:17:21acerunusim trying to install rockbox on my ipod video and when i try to combine the bootloader and the apple firmware i get "fread failed: Success"
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06:18:06^jhMikeS^I haven't gotten to see doom run on the x5 yet. It just hangs.
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06:29:24CrilenThere a site with RockBox themes?
06:30:19CrilenNever mind hehe
06:30:26CrilenI got it working great. Even got doom installed.
06:30:30CrilenSee you
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06:37:54Harrycan one code here
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06:38:41Nibbler me not
06:39:12Harryhow do i reg nick
06:39:13scorchei doubt that an open-source firmware channel has anyone in it that can code...
06:39:24Nibbleri would b surprised
06:39:38 Nick Harry is now known as Harry|b (
06:40:22Harry|bi tried
06:40:43Harry|bthis whole last week to code a visullir
06:41:07scorchefor rockbox?
06:41:09rus1I can code a little.
06:41:17Harry|bya scorche
06:41:30Harry|brus can u code a visulizer
06:41:31scorcheas a plugin, or in WPS
06:41:39Harry|bin a wps
06:41:45rus1Harry|b: I doubt it.
06:41:47rus1But I could try.
06:42:10rus1I mean, I do write code 8 hrs a day at my job, but I'm only an intern.
06:42:20Harry|bif u can i need 18 bars going up and
06:42:22rus1And that's C++ for Windows XP
06:42:25Harry|bi c rus
06:42:36Harry|brus where u intern
06:42:38scorcheso plugin format...
06:42:53rus1Harry|b: not quite. Rockwell Collins in Cedar Rapids, Iowa.
06:43:15Harry|bso do u think u can code it
06:43:31rus1They make aviation electronics mostly. If you're ever flown in an airplane, they were probably using our communications equipment.
06:43:59rus1I don't think I could code it with my knowledge right now, and I don't think I have the time or desire to put into learning.
06:44:14Harry|blol thats okay
06:44:42Harry|brus wat if i get u pre coded
06:45:00Harry|bone thats used on psp
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06:45:13Harry|bdo u think u could do that one
06:45:56midkayHarry|b: you could either do it yourself, or stop asking every two minutes..
06:46:16Harry|bmidkay i try i cant do it
06:46:26scorchethen learn how
06:46:32midkaymost of the people who do code for rockbox are busy with their own thing right now. so if you can't do it, please, you'll just have to learn how, or wait.
06:46:40rus1He seems to think I was offering, but I'm really just making random chatter.
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06:47:53rus1Don't get mad. Get coding.
06:47:53Harry|bhow much ram does a ipod video got
06:48:13Harry|brus im less experced than u
06:48:14scorcheHarry|b: google is your friend
06:48:38Harry|bscorche a bib is ur friend
06:48:45scorchealso, there is DeviceChart in the wiki
06:49:04scorcheand wtf?
06:49:04rus1See, now you're just getting insulting.
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06:50:45rus1I wonder why he wanted this plugin so bad.
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07:09:28safetydanah, I see preglow is back
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07:09:55safetydannow I can harass him about the eq graph code :)
07:10:09Jungti1234hmm.. hello
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07:31:41Bg3rmorning ;)
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07:37:54JdGordonamiconn: you dont use dircache do you?
07:38:11amiconnYes, I don't use it
07:38:45JdGordonbecause the ram is better used by the audio buffers ye?
07:39:15JdGordonwhat would you think about temporarily using the plugin buffer for dc instead of the auidovbuffer?
07:40:04amiconnStrange idea.... and may be too small depending on the number of files
07:40:32Bg3ralso, what would happen when u run a plugin ?
07:40:55JdGordonye, paul sort of put it in my head... i just checked on my h300 and its about 340kb so it would fit in the plugin buffer
07:41:09amiconnI don't have any problems using rockbox without dirache. Imho dircache is much hassle for little benefit
07:41:26JdGordonwell it would releoad itself next time you enter the tree after loading a plugin
07:41:46Bg3rJdGordon: this means scanning the whole hdd again ...
07:42:05JdGordonye, i guess so, ignore me, just a wierd idea that shouldnt happen
07:47:42goffaanyone use nano in here (the text editor)
07:48:22JdGordonno, but whats the problem?
07:48:24goffai was just wondering how to get root from inside it...
07:48:37goffahate making a bunch of changes
07:48:43JdGordonget root?
07:48:44goffathen get permission denied
07:49:04goffayeah... like in vi you can switch to root from within the editor
07:49:28goffaother than running it in sudo
07:50:23goffaits no big deal.. i've lived with it for a year :)
07:51:51Bg3rgoffa: at least u can save the file under different location/name
07:52:23goffai just figured there was some "magic keystroke" i was missing :)
07:53:09goffai could make an alias sudo nano :)
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07:55:54*JdGordon reckons the bookmark system should splash saying "bookmarking song" when it starts to do it, not when its finished
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07:59:35JdGordonruddy hell... Bg3r, when you changed TIMEOUT_BLOCK to -1 you actually broke the whole thing :D
07:59:44Bg3rwhat ?
07:59:49Bg3rwhy ?
08:00:08Bg3rdid you use 1 instead of the define ?
08:00:48JdGordonno, worse.. i just passed timeout straight to button_get, so when TIMEOUT_BLOCK went it got -1 which it didnt like
08:01:07Bg3r :D :D :D see the comments these turks and egyptians are insane
08:01:09JdGordonwhich is hopefully why the debug screens are all broken
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08:03:24Bg3rJdGordon: i don't get you
08:03:32Bg3rget it :D
08:04:16JdGordoncrap, that wasnt the problem :'(
08:04:19JdGordonstill crashing
08:05:17JdGordonbacklight and audio threads still working fine tho :p
08:05:50Bg3rhaha :)
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08:19:34JdGordonwell... something is truly screwed up and i have nfi what it is :p
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08:26:01Bg3rwhat's screwed up ?
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08:57:33JdGordonBg3r: some of the debug screens crash the gui thread, i cant seem to figure out why
08:57:47Bg3rlogf ?
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08:59:21JdGordontried it, its definartly crashing and not going into an infinite loop in my action code, so im stumped
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09:01:45JdGordongrr... no, it is my code thats doing it.. userabort is not working correctly :p
09:03:27*JdGordon is gonna play for 25min then working on homework till dinner!
09:03:47***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:07:35Bg3rJdGordon: there is a reply from linusn
09:07:40Bg3rin the wiki
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09:17:38amiconnBg3r: Btw, why do we need a special value for "no remote"?
09:17:54amiconn(re your commit on 2006-07-29)
09:17:54JdGordonits nicer than 0 :p
09:18:03Bg3ramiconn: yes, as JdGordon said
09:18:26Bg3rmaybe 0 should be changed on some more places
09:18:33amiconnHmm, it seems I'm not 100% awake...
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09:20:11Bg3ramiconn: because we use it on some places, and, imho it's better to use a define then a const
09:20:47amiconnYes, saw that now
09:21:37amiconnI thought the value didn't exist before, since 'no remote' is indicated by a different method
09:25:56Bg3rit's used by the remote_type() func
09:27:19amiconn^jhMikeS^: There's a slight bug in your x5 lcd driver optimisations:
09:28:15amiconnWhen lcd_write_two() sends the second 9bit of the first pixel, the controller receives the msb of the first 9bit of the second pixel as lsb
09:28:37amiconnThis means the blue lsb of the first pixel is determined by the red msb of the second pixel
09:29:22amiconnThis wouldn't hurt at all if dithering in the lcd controller would be switched off (then the blue (and red) lsb wouldn't be used at all) - but dithering is enabled
09:29:24JdGordonwoot! fixed the problems :D
09:29:52peturJdGordon: again? :p
09:30:02JdGordonhopefully for the last time
09:30:22amiconnTwo options for fixing: (1) disable dithering. (2) change px2 >> 15 into (px2 >> 16) << 1
09:30:41amiconnI would suggest (1) since the source data is 16bit anyway, and it's faster
09:31:03Bg3rJdGordon: :D
09:31:06Bg3ri hope too
09:31:32amiconnApart from that, an asm version of lcd_write_data() would be helpful especially since the framebuffer was moved to dram now
09:31:41amiconnburst mode....
09:33:14JdGordonfixed :)
09:33:20JdGordonnow to learn ml for ui
09:33:53Bg3rml ?
09:34:02Bg3rJdGordon: could you upload the latest ver ? ;)
09:34:05*amiconn ponders doing some more work for a target he doesn't have...
09:34:07JdGordonthat damn annoying functional language
09:34:12JdGordonsure Bg3r
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09:40:33JdGordonBg3r: done
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09:51:56amiconnhi LinusN
09:52:10LinusNhey ho
09:52:25amiconnseen my comment regarding the x5 lcd driver in the log?
09:53:13LinusNsee it now
09:53:26LinusNwe should turn off fithering
09:53:31LinusNdithering even
09:53:57amiconnlcd-x5.c, line 225
09:54:26amiconnWhat do you think about an asm version of lcd_write_data()?
09:54:38LinusNwould probably be a good idea
09:55:14amiconnIt woul dbe similar to the h300 version, just with the extra bit shuffling action
09:55:36amiconnI like the addition trick for the rrrrr0ggg handling...
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10:03:05LinusNamiconn: yes, that's really clever
10:03:50LinusNhowever, wouldn't 0xf8 be enough?
10:04:08LinusNbit 8 should be 0 anyway
10:04:40amiconnBefore the addition, yes.
10:05:11amiconnWith moderately clever asm coding, the bitfiddle-and-store instruction count can be brought down by one (18 insns instead of 19), even avoiding the blue lsb problem
10:05:43amiconn(my ideas for asm lcd update)
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10:07:03amiconnLinusN: What would you think we should call a target specific asm driver part? lcd-x5-a.S ?
10:07:06LinusNit would be awfully nice if we could burst the reading from the frame buffer
10:07:27LinusNamiconn: is asm() painful?
10:08:01amiconnNot exactly painful, but ugly for complete functions
10:08:23LinusNok, then i guess lcd-x5-asm.S would be fine
10:08:55LinusNspeaking of asm, i wonder how we should handle the ata driver
10:08:56amiconnasm() _within_ a function, while being rather flexible, has some limitations which don't apply when writing an all-asm function
10:09:06LinusNit should go to target/coldfire/
10:09:17LinusNamiconn: yes, i see
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10:09:36amiconn...e.g. you can delay saving registers on stack until you actually need to
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10:09:58amiconnI use this in the h300 lcd driver, and memset() etc
10:10:56amiconnA call with a short run (not using the line-burst loops) doesn't need to save registers and hence lowers call overhead
10:11:29LinusNah yes
10:12:09amiconnI think this is less relevant for x5 though. The bit fiddling needs a number of extra registers anyway
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10:13:25LinusNguess so
10:14:00amiconnTop-level asm() blocks sometimes cause problems, btw. If you switch section within the block, gcc sometimes doesn't notice (depending on target, -O flag etc)
10:14:16amiconn...and so subsequent function(s) might end up in an unwanted section
10:14:30amiconnYeah, ouch indeed
10:14:52LinusNnot surprising though, as asm coding is done behind the back of gcc
10:15:18*Bagder has learned a new gcc error output to dislike
10:15:27Bagder"sorry, unimplemented: called from here"
10:15:30amiconnI ran into that problem when converting system.c parts to assembler for sh (to circumvent the braindead _alias_ decision for gcc4.0+)
10:16:17LinusNBagder: i have an arm jtag wiggler if you want to connect your sansa :-)
10:16:40BagderLinusN: you just figure out how to connect it first! ;-)
10:16:42*linuxstb thinks LInusN should keep that for his ipod...
10:16:57Bagderwe have MrH, we don't need jtag ;-P
10:16:58amiconnLinusN: Speaking of wigglers - any plans on updating the h300 bootloader (solving the nasty hd 'clack')?
10:17:01LinusNdoes ipod have a jtag connector on the pcb?
10:17:09LinusNamiconn: yes
10:17:54LinusNi'm working on the h300 bootloader, to add charging, rtc alarm and fix the usb mode
10:18:01linuxstbBagder: Did you say that MrH doesn't even own a Sansa?
10:18:06aliaskRTC ALARM! :D
10:18:18amiconnLinusN: Do we know how to set charging current now?
10:18:20Bagderlinuxstb: correct, he doesn't have any mp3 player
10:18:29Bagderhe's just plain insane
10:18:37LinusNamiconn: i'm not 100% sure yet
10:18:58LinusNBagder: so he fits right in here then
10:19:24BagderI tried to give away a Sansa to him, but he didn't want it
10:19:38aliaskIs there any way to stop gui_synclist from reserving the space at the top of the screen for the statusbar?
10:20:29aliaskProbably something obvious...
10:20:57linuxstbLinusN: At least the 4th Gen ipods have a JTAG connector - someone in IPL has recently succeeded in connecting to it.
10:20:59Bg3rLinusN: and backlight timeout, please ;)
10:21:33Bg3rand ... if u can cpu_idle()...
10:21:36*Bg3r shuts up
10:21:42LinusNlinuxstb: do you know how jtag and dual-core works?
10:22:14linuxstbNo, I have no idea.
10:22:52*amiconn would rather like to see the iriver bootloader going faster
10:23:24LinusNamiconn: where's the contradiction?
10:24:20linuxstbBagder: Have you tried simply writing to the address MrH thinks is the HW LCD framebuffer?
10:24:28Bagdernot yet
10:24:31Bagderbut I intend to
10:24:39Bagderwe have some i2c magic to test as well
10:25:00linuxstbNice. Is your I2C code the same as the ipod?
10:25:12Bagderyes, it seems so
10:25:19linuxstblostlogic was complaining about how slow our i2c code is...
10:25:19JdGordonif MrH is refusing a free mp3 player, wouldnt it be safe to assume he is a naughty bugger from sansa helping us out anonymously? :D
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10:25:41markunlinuxstb: do you have an idea why we could be getting a Stkov on the gigabeat when we run ata_init()?
10:26:06BagderJdGordon: if he is, he's one darned clever employee
10:26:13markunJdGordon: was thinking about that as well :)
10:26:17aliaskJdGordon: Shh! They hear everything *shifty eyes*
10:26:23safetydanhrmm... sim sound still isn't right
10:26:23linuxstbmarkun: No - I looked at the patch, and couldn't see anything obvious. I would try adding return(); statements into ata_init, to try and find whereabouts it fails.
10:26:29Bagderjust look how he cracked the iriver hex algo
10:26:41Bagdertook a few hours
10:27:02Bagder(the H10 BL hex that is)
10:27:11*JdGordon goes back to sml
10:29:32pondlifeamiconn: around?
10:30:12pondlifeJust noting your objection to allocating a fixed thumbnail clip buffer on Archos. Seems reasonable.
10:30:28pondlifeAre tagcache or dircache allowed on Archos?
10:30:34pondlifein RAM I mean
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10:30:43BuckfastHi all
10:30:51amiconntagcache in ram is currently enabled, dircache is not
10:31:06pondlifeOK, well there may still be a problem.
10:31:12amiconnI'll probably disable tagcache in ram as well because of code size considerations
10:31:37amiconnOn archos, voicefile and talk clip are never loaded at the same time as audio data
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10:32:05pondlifeThe original issue I was looking into was that dircache/tagcache allocated memory from audiobuf, resulting in the pointer to the thumbnail buffer being wrong - so loading a voice clip overwrote dircache data.
10:32:07amiconnvoice only works when music is stopped anyway (only one audio decoder), so the voicefile is loaded into the audio buffer
10:32:21pondlifeThis resulted in crashes sometimes
10:32:27amiconnThe thumbnail buffer is located behind the voicefile up to the end of the audio buffer
10:32:45pondlifeVoice file is irrelevant here.
10:32:46amiconnI don't see why this could cause problems
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10:33:00amiconnNo it's not (on archos).
10:33:13amiconn[10:33:10] <amiconn> The thumbnail buffer is located behind the voicefile up to the end of the audio buffer
10:33:53amiconnSo if tagcache/dircache shift te audiobuffer start, and voicefile loading wouldn't notice, it would already corrupt memory when loading the voicefile
10:33:54pondlifeThe problem was that dircache allocation increases the value of audiobuf. But nothing informs talk.c of this change, so it uses it's cached old value to load thumbnail clips
10:34:09pondlifep_thumbnail points to the dircache
10:34:34amiconnOn archos this can't happen. p_thumbnail is _behind_ the voicefile
10:34:51pondlifeWhat if there's no voice file in use?
10:34:59pondlifei.e. .talk clips, but no talking menus
10:35:07pondlifeOr no English.voice?
10:35:27BuckfastJust a question :/ Do u know a nice site with Sansa e200 firmware ar cool stuff for this mp3 player ? Ty
10:35:51pondlifeI guess I need to see a memory map..!! You mean that the same area is used for voice file and .talk clips?
10:36:15LinusNBuckfast: i have no idea, we are only hacking it, we don't use the damn thing :-)
10:36:23amiconnHmm, not sure. But on archos we don't need a fixed talk clip mem size
10:36:47BuckfastWhy not ?
10:36:57amiconnpondlife: Archos, music playing: audiobuf|<−−−−- audio data −−−−>|audiobuf_end
10:37:01LinusNBuckfast: because rockbox doesn't run on it yet
10:37:08BuckfastOkay thx :-)
10:37:14pondlifeOK, where does dircache/tagcache fit in?
10:37:24BuckfastMMh could u tell me what time is it plz ?
10:37:31BagderBuckfast: firmwares are available from sandisk ;-)
10:37:32amiconnArchos, no music playing: audiobuf|<−−- voicefile −−−−>|<−−−− talk clip buffer −−->|audiobuf_end
10:37:32pondlifeaudio data = voice file OR .talk clip OR music?
10:37:48BuckfastYes but i seek a firmware to unlock the radio with a EU version
10:37:50LinusNBuckfast: it's 10:37am here in stockholm
10:37:56BagderBuckfast: and you can probably soon patch your own "skin" using h3mod
10:38:11BagderBuckfast: I don't think it has the HW for it
10:38:22BuckfastSandisk said it has
10:38:22Bagderotherwise you could just install the US version
10:38:35Bagderthe US version firmware plays radio fine
10:38:41Buckfastbut when u install the US firmware the radio doesn't sound anything
10:38:45pondlifeSo we have tagcache | dircache | audiobuf on Archos too? (With audiobuf subdivided as above)
10:38:53dionoea_workmaybe you just don't have a radio
10:39:14amiconnALmost. (without the dircache in cvs builds, but it could be enabled, and if done, works)
10:39:27pondlifeOK, so we still have a problem.
10:39:33Buckfast:-( U think they made a different version only for the EU ?
10:39:43BagderBuckfast: so I find it likely that the EU version has no code for playing radio
10:39:50BagderBuckfast: I do
10:39:54dionoea_workwhy would they disable the radio if it's in the hardware ?
10:39:58Bagderthey did it for the X5 too
10:40:03BuckfastFu#####idea ...
10:40:07Bagderits some customs things
10:40:26BagderI believe
10:40:37pondlifeWhen dircache allocates from audiobuf, it changes trhe value of "audiobuf". But talk.c uses a cached value stored in "p_thumbnail" which is out of date. So it needs to just use "audiobuf" each time on Archos...
10:40:46pondlifeI'll update the patch for that.
10:40:51amiconnpondlife: There are 2 reasons why keeping the voicefile loaded on archos isn't possible and wouldn't even make sense. (1) The small ram. The voicefile almost takes the whole audiobuffer.... (2) Playing music and voice at the same time isn't possible with just one decoder
10:41:08pondlifeI'm not talking about voice files
10:41:09BagderBuckfast: you can dissassemble the US and the EU versions and compare! ;-)
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10:41:23Buckfastsomeone made it on ipodgeneration
10:41:30Buckfastthe only difference was 2 chips
10:41:35amiconnBut I think it _might_ be useful to statically reserve the talk clip buffer on swcodec. This way talk clips would also work during playback the same way as voice
10:41:42BagderI doubt they did
10:41:47pondlifeIt's not a nicety, it's a crash fix.
10:41:51Buckfastbut nobody found what there were used to
10:41:58BuckfastArf ...
10:42:02BagderI talk about code
10:42:05Bagdernot chips
10:42:22Buckfastthere is 2 files
10:42:33pondlifeIt's nothing to do with voice files, just a fix for bad memory allocation between dircache and .talk clips.... sorry to repeat myself ;-)
10:42:38Buckfastin the us
10:42:48Bagderno need to tell _me_ that
10:42:49Buckfastthe version is
10:42:51Buckfastant ud is
10:43:01Buckfastsi when you change it
10:43:11Buckfastyou can upgrade with an US firmware
10:43:16Buckfastso you have the radio menu
10:43:18amiconnpondlife: I don't see why it could crash on archos. reset_state() does p_thumbnail = audiobuf;
10:43:31Buckfastbut there is only a strange noise ... no radio reception
10:43:47amiconnAfaics audiobuf is the global value, so if something else changes it (e.g. tagcache), talk.c would use the new value
10:43:49BagderBuckfast: ... which indicates HW differences, don't you think?
10:43:50pondlifeNo, it probably doesn't crash on Archos. This is a SWCODEC-only problem.
10:44:11BuckfastYes but ...
10:44:26Buckfasti think HW difference cost money
10:44:36Buckfastand i don't know why they made that
10:44:39Buckfastthis is stupid
10:44:39dionoea_workamiconn, pondlife: just curious, what patch are you talking about ?
10:44:44Bagderso how else do you explain the non-function?
10:44:45pondlifeNo,. talk.c didn't have code to re-setup p_thumbnail (reset_stat not being called)
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10:45:04LinusNBuckfast: i can imagine it has to do with eu import regulations etc
10:45:15BagderBuckfast: I'll send my contact a mail and ask about this particular thing...
10:45:25BuckfastEurope don't bring us anything good ... lol
10:45:30LinusNBagder: ask about jtag as well
10:45:30dionoea_workpondlife: thanks :)
10:45:33pondlifeBut I'm about to update it so it doesn't affect Archos
10:45:39BagderLinusN: will do
10:45:39BuckfastSo i must go to the haircutter
10:45:42Buckfastsee you soon
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10:46:29amiconnpondlife: talk_init() and talk_buffer_steal() both call reset_state()
10:46:45pondlifeHmm, well I can repro a crash on the H300 and H300 sim.
10:47:14pondlife has the details
10:47:55pondlifeI'll investigate some more, talk_buffer_steal should have been called at some point after dircache did it's allocation..
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10:48:33amiconnYeah, maybe it's an init order problem
10:48:34pondlifeInspecting values of p_thumbnail and audiobuf revealed that they did not stay in sync though
10:49:03amiconnA case for the realloc thing already talked about multiple times
10:49:13pondlifeIt shouldn't really matter which order they are inititalised in though.
10:49:44LinusNamiconn: yes?
10:49:54pondlifeI can probably fix it.; talk_buffer_steal should be called later anyway..
10:50:37pondlifeRather that than put more #if CONFIG_CODEC == SWCODEC in.
10:51:21LinusNdoes anybody know if ipod video has a jtag connector?
10:51:48pondlifeI just thought a 32K buffer wouldn't matter too much and would be cross-platform. But all the little buffers add up...
10:52:09amiconn32K is the size of the whole plugin buffer on archos
10:52:48amiconn...or around 2% of the audio buffer
10:52:53pondlifeThis is only allocated when a .talk clip is first played, not universally.
10:53:16amiconnYeah, but on archos it's till a waste
10:53:19pondlifeI thought a 2% loss was worth a potential crash fix. But as the crash doesn't occur, I'll pop some #ifs in.
10:53:32amiconnCalling talk_buffer_steal() later is probably the better method
10:53:41pondlifeLeave it with me
10:53:41preglowLinusN: i don't think anyone's opened one yet...
10:53:54amiconnpreglow: why not?
10:54:00LinusNwell, someone has:
10:54:04amiconnLinusN: Weren't you working on that realloc thing?
10:54:12preglowwell, sure, but not verified if there's a connector on it
10:54:20preglowonly recently did someone find out if this was the case even on 4g
10:54:51LinusNamiconn: yes, i gave it some thought, but but it on ice when i realized that there are a few places where buffer_alloc() isn't used
10:54:55linuxstbLinusN: Crack your 5g open and have a look...
10:55:18amiconnput but? ;)
10:55:28pondlifebuffer_alloc could do with taking an "alignment" parameter. The places it's not used need to be word aligned I think.
10:55:38LinusNpondlife: yes
10:56:03amiconnbuffer_alloc() could always align
10:56:04linuxstbShouldn't it just word-align everything?
10:56:15pondlifeHmm, think of the wasted bytes ;-)
10:56:17preglowthat's the better choice
10:56:25pondlife(says the 32K buffer eater)
10:56:30amiconnpondlife: 3 bytes vs. 32KB. See?
10:56:32linuxstbpondlife: I'm assuming it's not called many times
10:56:40pondlifeNah, I was just joking
10:56:45amiconnIn fact it's 1.5 bytes on average
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11:13:08linuxstb:) Hello.
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11:20:21lostlogicI see Slasheri has started hacking the playback engine again
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11:28:40LinusNlostlogic: we are forced to, since you went to hiding :-)
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11:30:25lostlogic:( :) I'll be back... eventually, I promise.
11:30:41lostlogicI'm reading the code changes and adding some 'response' comments at least for now.
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11:31:14LinusNlostlogic: i started an attempt to document the playback stuff, but i didn't come very far
11:32:07LinusNi believe the graphviz wiki plugin can help you explain some of the threading/locking stuff
11:33:30lostlogicnice −− it really needs to be broken up into separate files, which was definitely on my want-to-do list when I started working on it
11:33:46lostlogicit's really hard to document one file that large without giving oneself a stroke
11:34:25LinusNit sure melted my brain
11:34:27preglowi got downs syndrome from trying
11:35:22LinusNlinuxstb: so what is the status of the cop nowadays?
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11:36:10preglowsleeping soundly
11:36:45Slasherilostlogic: hi
11:37:02Slasherilostlogic: currently i am planning to separate, reimplement and design a buffering api for the buffering
11:37:15LinusNpreglow: i figured that, but what do we think about using it for some heavy lifting?
11:37:26Slasherithat should hopefully solve the existing issues with file buffering
11:37:35LinusNSlasheri: what are those issues?
11:37:44*amiconn is still under the impression that the swcodec playback engine is too complex for what it does
11:37:50*LinusN too
11:38:40SlasheriLinusN: currently mainly crashes and other restrictions (such as moving metadata to the same buffer)
11:38:43amiconnLinusN: Tried disabling dithering yet?
11:38:49lostlogicSlasheri: can't we just start with separating and clearly defining the APIs we have now?
11:38:55LinusNamiconn: no
11:39:02lostlogicSlasheri: and I already wrote a preliminary patch to move the metadata to the buffer
11:39:04Slasherilostlogic: sure
11:39:08lostlogicit's on the wiki page, but surely doesn't apply at all right now
11:39:18Slasheribut still i would like to completely redesign the buffering..
11:39:27Slasherias the current system has some restrictions
11:39:38preglowLinusN: dunno, i haven't really thought much about it. i'm pretty much content with one core as of right now
11:39:47pondlifeDocumentation would be my #1 priority. Especially better definition ot the responsibilities of each routine.
11:39:56Slasheriand then have a simple api playback engine could use for the buffering
11:40:00LinusNpreglow: but the performance sucks right now, doesn't it?
11:40:17lostlogicSlasheri: also, do you know the actual broken code path that the Q_CODEC_REQUEST_PENDING caused?
11:40:42Slasherifor example, playback engine could still read the files and use the buffering api to store that data (one possible way of doing it)
11:40:50lostlogicit's a very innocent event that simply stops playback when a track change will require a rebuffer
11:41:02lostlogicSlasheri: don't overengineer the world.
11:41:18Slasherilostlogic: i think clear_tracks() yielded, causing codec thread to finish and trying to load undefined codec
11:41:38Slasheriyes, and it exits the codec
11:42:01Slasheriwhile rebuffering is still going to happen
11:42:12Slasheriso the new codec then fails to init
11:42:34lostlogicI don't follow −− what does Q_CODEC_REQUEST_PENDING have to do with clear tracks yielding?
11:42:52preglowLinusN: sucks and sucks, it's more than usable
11:43:26lostlogicproblem with ipod is really battery life (as always with everything)
11:43:33lostlogic6 hours just doesn't cover a transatlantic flight ;)
11:43:34preglowat least on nano
11:43:43LinusNi keep hearing about issues with audio dropouts on ipod
11:44:02LinusNas soon as you use a heavy wps or the eq
11:44:14preglowoh yes
11:44:20preglowi happen to not to either
11:44:23Slasherilostlogic: looking from the logf, when playback thread yields, it causes codec thread to finish "New codec:0/3" and it thinks there is new codec to load. But codectype 0 is incorrect because metadata and codec has not yet been loaded
11:45:19lostlogicLinusN: oh yeah, that's true... I don't use those either :)
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11:46:03lostlogicSlasheri: hmm... weird −− that would seem that my while(1) loop is exiting when the Q_AUDIO_REQUEST_PENDING gets sent... must be missing link in this logic
11:47:11lostlogicSlasheri: does it only happen when you seek with rebuffer first, as the logf suggests?
11:47:45threwhi all !
11:47:51threwis there anyone please ?
11:47:52Slasherii am not yet sure what causes it, but it happens very rarely. Mainly you have to skip tracks a lot and finally buffers get desynced
11:47:58preglowLinusN: i'm just wondering what processes to offload to the second core. some people suggest dsp should be offloaded as well
11:47:59threwerf :)
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11:48:04Slasherithat desync issue still hasn't been fully fixed
11:48:18Slasherii managed to encounter it today again
11:48:25Slasheribut now it doesn't crash
11:48:50LinusNamiconn: dithering off looks awful :-)
11:48:51lostlogiccool, yeah −− seems like you're on the right tracks for it
11:49:01lostlogic(the desync thing)
11:49:25threwcould anyone help me for understanding how to use the LCD Display G112064-30 ? I download the datasheet from your website and i really dont understand it at all please ...
11:49:28amiconnLinusN: Huh? It shoudln't look any different to dithering on... our source data is 16bit anyway
11:49:43lostlogicwell I should take a short jet-lag-recovery nap before work this morning. I'll keep looking at the track skipping -> request_pending stuff later, hopefully.
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11:49:56LinusNamiconn: it gets a purple tone
11:50:27amiconnHmm, maybe dithering off requires the bits unshifted?
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11:51:34amiconnI.e. we're sending rrrrr0ggg and gggbbbbb0 now, but maybe dithering off requires 0rrrrrggg and ggg0bbbbb ?
11:52:44amiconnWorth a test, imho
11:52:54threwcould anyone help me please ?
11:53:04amiconnFirst word becomes easier, second word harder
11:53:13LinusNthrew: yes, but you still haven't asked a question
11:53:17Bagderthrew: in what target is that?
11:53:34safetydanpreglow, I have newlib's libm ported to Rockbox... this would make an EQ graphing plugin easier right?
11:53:36LinusNarchos recorder, i believe
11:53:50Bagderthrew: did you read the rockbox source code for it?
11:54:20threwwell, heuh..... not really :p
11:54:22preglowsafetydan: float? fixed?
11:54:29safetydanpreglow, float and double
11:54:35preglowit'd be excessively slow
11:54:38safetydanI'm using it for an astronomy plugin
11:54:40preglowi already have the graphing going
11:54:51preglowi just need to handle the division a bit more wisely
11:55:01safetydanah well, ignore me then
11:55:13preglowbesides, all i need for graphing is standard arithmetic and cos()
11:55:27preglowboth of which we have :>
11:55:31threwBadger, ok thx for the tips im looking for
11:55:59threwand it has been taken from Arcchos Ondio FM
11:56:21LinusNamiconn: from the hd66773r datasheet: "DIT: Hardware-dither mode when DIT = ?1?. Use hardware-dither mode with 18/9-bit interface modes."
11:56:28preglowsafetydan: besides, eq graphing _plugin_ ?
11:56:45preglowsafetydan: why would we want that functionality in a plugin? i'd rather it be built-in the eq gui
11:56:49safetydanwell... there's some talk that it might be better as a plugin since it would keep code size down
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11:57:01preglowgraphing won't add much
11:57:06safetydanbut I don't feel strongly either way
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11:57:44compubomb<−− loves rockbox so far
11:57:53compubombonly problem is it kills the battery quit a bit.
11:58:05compubombbattery dies much sooner running it.
11:58:19safetydancompubomb, what mp3 player? iPod, iRiver?
11:58:19amiconnLinusN: Yes, but that doesn't tell anything about the pixel format with dithering off...
11:58:20LinusNcompubomb: which player?
11:58:33amiconnDoes white stay white with dithering off?
11:58:43preglowsafetydan: that'
11:58:43LinusNamiconn: that may be because they don't expect you to use 9-bit mode without dithering
11:58:54preglowsafetydan: that's the main code which calculates the graph, not too much
11:58:56LinusNamiconn: white is purple-ish
11:59:14safetydanpreglow, wow, smaller than I thought it would be
11:59:20amiconnLinusN: Hmm, but if we keep dithering enabled, we need to solve the blue lsb problem
11:59:30amiconn(will be solved with asm lcd_write_data() )
11:59:38LinusNi suggest we solve that instead
11:59:48compubombsafetydan: ipod 30gb video
11:59:54compubombit's really thin, and black
12:00:04safetydancompubomb, I think battery life on iPod is a known issue
12:00:09safetydanlack of batter life I mean
12:00:13LinusNyes it is
12:00:54compubombpersonally, i find the usability in the rockbox os far exceeds that of the default ipod functionality.
12:01:37compubombin part to it's customizability and OSS nature, but also because i can browse my music via folders vs. ID3 tags which are not always labeled
12:01:51linuxstbLinusN: So far, I've been ignoring the COP because I'm expecting battery life to take a big hit if we try to use it and would like to try to get at least the basic features of Rockbox working nicely together on one core. Using the COP just feels like cheating...
12:01:57compubombmost of my music is dj rips etc which normally have the title in filename, not id3 tags
12:02:20preglowi can't exactly see battery life improving by using the cop either
12:02:25LinusNlinuxstb: how is the current draw when you enable the cop?
12:02:34compubomblinuxstb: if i pump the volume up 100% the ipod looses percentage on battery like crazy
12:02:41linuxstbNo idea.... We need someone like you to test :)
12:02:42compubombit goes atleast 3 to 5 times quicker
12:02:46dionoea_workmaybe two slow cores are better than 1 boosted core in terms of battery life
12:02:46LinusNpreglow: why not?
12:02:58preglowpreglow: the same work pretty much needs to be done anyway
12:03:08preglowyes, i'm talking to myself
12:03:36linuxstbdionoea: That's been suggested, but needs testing.
12:03:54preglowi don't think we'll be rid of the boosting anyway
12:04:02compubombwish functionality was kept a bit when fast forwarding on music via the wheel
12:04:10preglowbut sure, some testing most definitely needs to be done
12:04:30LinusNlooks like i should investigate the jtag issue
12:04:33dionoea_workdoes the ipod firmware do the audio decoding with the CPUs ? or do they use some other chip ?
12:04:36amiconndionoea: That's not to be expected. Two cores running at 50% should draw the same as one core running at 100% clock −− as long as core voltage stays constant. Due to synchronisation overhead, I'd even expect two cores to draw more
12:04:46linuxstbdionoea_work: There is no other chip...
12:05:02dionoea_workeven the broadcom chip on the Video ipods ?
12:05:06dionoea_workor is that video only ?
12:05:08amiconnThings would of course change if we learn to adjust core voltage (should be possible at least on PP5022, and I guess also PP5021)
12:05:10preglowif you decode video, it does audio
12:05:14preglowif you just play audio, it does nothing
12:05:26linuxstbafaik as well.
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12:06:13dionoea_worki guess that someone needs to do the infrared thermometer thing again then, to see what chip is using too much power compared to the apple firmware
12:06:13LinusNso how bad is the battery life with rockbox compared to the OF?
12:06:30linuxstbProbably about 50%.
12:06:39LinusNand is it the same with ipl?
12:06:45preglowipl is tons worse, afaik
12:06:52LinusNi see
12:07:08linuxstbIPL runs at a constant 75MHz, and they also use the COP (to run the FIQ handler).
12:07:18preglowspinlocking all the time
12:07:48linuxstbLinusN: Do you have the 30GB or 60GB 5g?
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12:08:23linuxstbDo you think we should add a new 64MB build, or try runtime detection? There's a patch on the patch tracker which adds a new build.
12:09:09LinusNruntime detection would be nice, but then we would have to solve the issue with the plugins
12:09:11amiconnLinusN: Did you run test_fps with the old and new lcd code and the framebuffer in dram?
12:09:15*amiconn is curious
12:09:23LinusNamiconn: no, i didn't, but mike has
12:11:29LinusNpreglow: so what we're saying is that we won't need the cop unless we really run out of cpu power?
12:11:42*amiconn thinks asm lcd_write_data() shouldn't be hard :)
12:12:07preglowLinusN: i don't really know due to lack of measurements, but it's not wholly unreasonable
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12:12:45dionoea_workbtw, did anyone try the mpeg2 raw video thing in the tracker ?
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12:12:56LinusNi mean, the performance today is bad, so how much do you think we can improve it?
12:13:12preglowLinusN: responsiveness would probably go up much if we used two cores, and that in itself might be worth sacrificing a little battery time, in some people's opinion
12:13:44LinusNpreglow: i suspect that the battery issue is similar to the x5 and h300
12:13:48preglowme too
12:14:07linuxstbI'm also worried about how much CPU time the button handler is taking - I could be wrong, but it seems that the scroll wheel seems to generate a lot of button events, which translates to lots of lcd_update() calls in the code.
12:14:07LinusNand that using two cores won't be as painful as we suspect
12:14:21preglowi don't think it'll be very painful at all, to be honest
12:14:24linuxstbThe cache coherency seems at least a little painful.
12:14:28preglowdepends on how many threads we want to migrate
12:14:49LinusNthe guilist code is inefficient, and we should take a look at the patch suggested in the mailing list
12:14:51preglowlinuxstb: some clever code restructuring might elimiate most of the cache coherency issues
12:15:08pregloweliminate too
12:15:31JdGordondoes anyone in here know sml?
12:15:40*dan_a wakes up at the mention of the COP
12:15:43preglowi don't even know what it is
12:15:56JdGordonStandard ML
12:16:01preglowand yes, let's not forget that 3g and so on would probably benefit greatly from using the cop
12:16:10linuxstbJdGordon: If you had asked me about 13 years ago, the answer would be yes. But I've completely forgotten it...
12:16:38JdGordon:'( i have an assignment due on friday and im getting errors i dont understand
12:17:04amiconnpreglow: Btw, any ideas how to speed up libmad on arm? I remember that you wrote the idct thing in asm for coldfire...
12:17:13preglowamiconn: already done for arm
12:17:15amiconnDo you think the benefit on arm could be similar?
12:17:20amiconnAh, ok
12:17:25preglowlibmad comes bundled with it
12:17:27linuxstbpreglow: Did you notice the -O2 -> -O commit for libmad?
12:17:29LinusNlibmad already has asm optimizations for arm, iirc
12:17:34preglowlinuxstb: indeed i did
12:17:44preglowlinuxstb: that kind of thing working makes me very unhappy, heh
12:17:56preglowi don't like having to stroke the compiler to make faster code
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12:18:22linuxstbI know... And we probably need to keep retesting with newer compilers.
12:18:32preglowsome kind of optimisation guide from portalplayer would be nicety
12:18:52*linuxstb prods preglow in the ribs to wake him up
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12:19:25preglowthe nice 64 bit mac instructions in the arm are good to have, i just wish they were faster
12:20:02preglowalso, they depend on input data
12:20:55amiconnWhat about thumb code?
12:20:58LinusNhow much of the apple OF is disassembled btw?
12:21:01linuxstbDo you have any other ideas for libmad? Or is it just a case of profiling it and seeing what could benefit?
12:21:54linuxstbLinusN: I'm not sure. The IPL people don't seem to publish their research anywhere...
12:22:45LinusNis it because of copyright issues, or is it the iriverlounge sickness?
12:23:57linuxstbI think it's the copyright issues.
12:24:04LinusNfair enough
12:24:20preglowamiconn: thumb code dsp code will be a bad idea, for gui code, etc, it might do wonders
12:25:15LinusNparanoia is probably healthy when dealing with large american corporations
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12:25:34*LinusN is off
12:25:34preglowespecially when you live in america
12:25:42LinusNcu later folx
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12:27:55Jungti1234LinusN.. :'(
12:28:20safetydanany interest in adding circle drawing to the lcd drawing routines?
12:28:34 Quit Jungti1234 ()
12:30:05amiconnsafetydan: Plugin lib yes, core no.
12:30:08preglowdon't really see where we'd need it
12:30:30safetydanI only ask because I just wrote one
12:31:05amiconnThat's what the xlcd plugin lib is for - routines that might be useful in plugins, but unnecessary in the core
12:31:20amiconnBtw, is it just circle, or also ellipsis?
12:31:40safetydancircles only since that's all I need
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12:31:59amiconnOn archos, a circle will look like an ellipsis
12:32:14amiconnnon-square pixels
12:33:09safetydanah... hrrmm
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12:34:05afruff23can somebody help me with sublining images with conditionals in a WPS?
12:35:44afruff23This line isn't working proeprly
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12:49:55safetydanright... now I have an ellipse drawing routine
12:52:58preglowthat was fast
12:55:29safetydanthe power if the intarwebs
12:55:40safetydanof even
12:56:49safetydanhrmm... now I need a way to fill in a pie slice of a circle...
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12:57:12afruff23_I can't figure this out. Something as simple as %t7%xdS;%t5%xdR does not work. It just keeps displaying image "S" forever.
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13:01:09preglowjust draw a couple of lines?
13:01:29afruff23_can anybody direct me to a WPS with sublined images?
13:01:42preglowamiconn: you think redoing wps handling to not parse the wps every update will save us much?
13:02:13afruff23_please not the icatcher(that thing is impossible to understand with its formatting)
13:02:22amiconnIt won't save much I think... but the wps parser is in urgent need of rework
13:03:19preglowamiconn: how?
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13:04:58compubombi'm not sure if this is a known bug, when i changed the equalizer and turned it on, my ipod started skipping on music every say 5 seconds or so.
13:05:08compubombturn the eq off and it stops
13:05:24Mikachuthe eq uses too much cpu
13:05:31Bagderthat's one of the mostest known isues
13:05:52preglownot much i can do about it either, the eq should be pretty fast :/
13:06:43compubombpreglow: :(
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13:07:00compubombwell, i wish i could bump up the treble and get bass to lower
13:07:09compubombproblem is the treble / bass feature doesn't do shit it seems
13:07:33preglowit does
13:07:41preglowbut the default cutoff frequencies are a bit retarded
13:07:49amiconncompubomb: What ipod?
13:07:57compubombipod video
13:08:15amiconnpreglow: On mini (g1 and g2) and video, treble & bass controls don't do anything
13:08:20compubombi have the bass set to -6db
13:08:31compubomband my headphones can handle bass, but it's totally destorted
13:08:54compubombhow do i find out which one i have ?
13:09:01compubombi have an ipod video 30gb
13:09:13compubombi don't have the tiny one
13:09:21compubombit's pretty big ipod, just very thin
13:09:34afruff23he jsut told you
13:09:48compubombno treble / bass
13:09:55compubomb*sniff* *sniff*
13:10:08afruff23get some better headphones?
13:10:40compubomb<−− wearing Sennheiser hd540 reference
13:10:59compubombi have a pair of Sennheiser hd580's next to me and in the other room a pair of sennheiser hd600's
13:11:20compubombafruff23: i'd wager they are better than the ones you have.
13:11:25safetydanpreglow, there's been a few goes at redoing the WPS parser. mostly just tokenising the WPS and using that for display instead of reparsing each time
13:11:45markunpreglow: he's right.. /* Not yet implemented - this is the wm8975 code*/*
13:11:50afruff23Then I don't know, use a better codec?
13:12:12crwli wonder how well you can drive hd580's or hd600's with a portable player
13:12:24markuncompubomb: yes, trebble and bass are not implemented for the ipod video
13:12:24crwlthey are pretty high impedance phones after all
13:12:26afruff23yeah, do you have a headphone amp?
13:12:28amiconnpreglow: The WM8711/21/31 (ipod g1..g3 and mini g1, g2) don't have tone control at all, and the WM8758 (video) does have a hw 5-band eq instead which we don't use (yet)
13:13:25amiconnMaybe we could (and should) use the hw 5-band eq as treble/bass on video?
13:13:32compubombwhen i turned off crossfeed, shit started to sound more clear
13:14:14afruff23also the ipod video has 2 cores, but rockbox only uses one (so far)
13:14:18compubombamiconn: when i set the eq, i started to notice it works good as treble / bass control
13:14:31compubombbut it started clipping every 5seconds or so.
13:14:38amiconncompubomb: I'm not talking about the software eq here
13:15:01Bagderamiconn: sounds like we should use that, yes
13:15:23compubombamiconn: i'm not sure how much you've worked on this project, but all i can say is rockbox truely does rock in functionality, it's way better than the ipod software
13:15:37compubombipod software is way too limiting in media and general functionality.
13:15:46compubombatleast for a user such as myself
13:15:50 Quit A_M ("CGI:IRC")
13:16:08amiconnOr we should use the hw 5-band eq as true eq, replacing standard treble & bass
13:16:25*amiconn wonders whether this hw eq is fully parametric
13:16:50*compubomb does not know how to use a real eq :/
13:18:52linuxstbamiconn: If you're interested, I've been working with the WM8983 datasheet for the 5g (available on WM's website) - everything seems to be identical to the 5g's WM8758 so far...
13:19:29compubomb<−− haven't a clue wtf crossfeed does
13:19:55amiconnI won't do any work into this direction as I don't have a video, and this is far too involved to be done blindly
13:20:05afruff23sends sound form the right side to the left, andfrom the elft to the right?
13:20:15Bagdercompubomb: consider reading the manual
13:20:18amiconnIf the hw eq is _not_ parametric, then I would indeed suggest using it for hw treble & bass
13:20:39*linuxstb goes to add 5g hw eq to the ipod to-do list.
13:21:10afruff23where can I find a properly formatted icatcher WPS?
13:21:17amiconnToo bad the g3 and the minis will never have hw tone controls :(
13:21:32afruff23the one included with rockbox is just three lines(hard to read)
13:22:07amiconnafruff23: Load the theme, not just the wps
13:22:23amiconnWith the correct font there will also be the correct number of lines
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13:23:27afruff23I emant the actual wps itself
13:23:30pixelmaafruff23: did you open iCatcher.wps with notepad?
13:23:31afruff23the code in it
13:23:40pixelmatry wordpad
13:23:42afruff23with word wrap off?
13:24:20Mikachuwindows doesn't use the same format on text files as unix
13:25:12 Quit afruff23 ("Famous last words")
13:25:17amiconn(plain) Notepad is silly
13:30:46preglowi could also make software based simple bass/treble filters
13:30:50preglowas a matter of fact, i already have
13:31:48linuxstbI would quite like to play with the 5g's hardware eq, but I'm starting to build up a list of half-finished patches...
13:32:46*dan_a does a little dance
13:32:54linuxstbA COP dance?
13:33:01amiconnlinuxstb: Unfinished by you, or what?
13:33:17linuxstbYes, half-finished by me - my recording work and also RoLo.
13:33:56*preglow hugs coldfire
13:34:41 Quit muesli|delhi ("ich will Khe!!!")
13:35:47tucozAnyone know how to search and replace all occurances of a word in a bunch of files. Preferrably by using linux command line.
13:36:16dionoea_worksafetydan: filling a pie slice shouldn't be too hard since it's convex.
13:36:29dan_atucoz: sed
13:36:32linuxstbtucoz: I would use AWK, but there are probably better ways....
13:36:34preglowwhat's our plan for the 5g hardware eq anyway? just offer an additional limited eq in addition to the software one (which i assume we'll be including on all software targets) ?
13:36:41dionoea_workJust loop through all the x (or y) and draw lines between the two borders
13:36:49filRtucoz: awk is probably the easiest way to go.
13:36:59tucozdan_a, linuxstb: just sed,awk, or by using find and pipes?
13:37:06safetydandionoea_work, yeah that's pretty much what I was going to do
13:37:31safetydangot other bits to make work first before I need to do that though
13:37:45linuxstbtucoz: I would do something like: "mkdir NEW ; for f in *.txt ; do awk '{gsub(/old/new/) ; print $0}' $f > NEW/$f ; done"
13:37:58dionoea_workelse it's a bit more complicated i guess, espically when you don't really know what shape you're filling. (i have one algorithm for filling random shapes in rockpaint ... but it must be suboptimal ... well not sure)
13:38:06tucozlinuxstb, thanks :)
13:38:06linuxstbsorry, the gsub should be gsub(/old/,"new")
13:38:22tucozok, I'll try that
13:38:34dan_atucoz: I'd do something like "for i in * ; do sed -i -e 's/oldword/newword/g' $i; done"
13:38:38filRlinuxstb: i don't think you need the for loop. can't you just give awk *.txt as input? (it's been a long time since i last used awk though)
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13:39:15tucozi need to search in sub-folders as well
13:39:29filRoh, ok. :)
13:39:31Bagder"Oh, and just to put some wild theories to rest, no, I do not work for Sandisk, iRiver, PortalPlayer or any similar company." / MrH
13:39:38amiconndionoea: Any news concerning solitaire?
13:39:44linuxstbBagder: Is he spying on us? :)
13:39:48Bagdersomeone reads logs ;-)
13:39:57*linuxstb waves to MrH
13:40:02Bagderor even is joined
13:40:16dionoea_workamiconn: ideas about what ? fixing the display on small screens (i started doing that) ? or something else ?
13:40:58amiconnYes, fixing it for small displays (and using the bitmap build system - perhaps even native bitmaps)
13:41:26amiconnThe latter could be interesting for large displays (like ipod video)
13:41:26dionoea_workyep, i'm using linuxstb's bitmaps and fixing the code
13:41:39dionoea_workand cleaning the code a bit
13:42:11tucozlinuxstb, do you know how to use for to search in sub folders as well?
13:42:29dionoea_workfor i in $(find . -type f)
13:42:36tucozdionoea, thanks
13:43:35linuxstbpreglow: (regarding the hw eq) I was thinking of adapting the current EQ settings screen to work with the 5g's hw eq, and then take it from there - depending on how good the hw eq turns out to be.
13:43:37filRbtw, another option (yes, for works nicely) would be find . -iname *.txt -type f −−exec sed -bla 'bla' {} \;
13:43:58tucozfilR, cool. I'll try that as well
13:44:15linuxstbAlways 1001 ways in Unix to do the same thing....
13:44:19filRtucoz: the result should, hopefully, be the same. but np.
13:44:21amiconnlinuxstb: Why not just use the hw eq for treble and bass?
13:44:44MikachufilR: in zsh you can do sed -i s/whatever// **/*.txt
13:45:07dionoea_workneat, i didn't know about **
13:45:12filRMikachu: now if i could only stop being lazy and install zsh. ;)
13:45:26Mikachuit's a shorthand for a more complex expression i can never remember
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13:45:57preglowlinuxstb: well, it's probably decent, but the limited selection of cutoff frequencies is a bit annoying
13:46:21linuxstbWould it give us reasonable bass/treble settings?
13:46:29 Quit TCK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:47:29tucozfilR, I get find: invalid predicate −−exec
13:47:43dionoea_work-exec maybe
13:48:02 Quit safetydan ("Ex-Chat")
13:48:10dionoea_work(i'm just guessing)
13:48:24tucozwell, I didn't get an error so you are probably right
13:49:11preglowlinuxstb: can't remember the exact settings from the datasheet, so i dunno
13:49:32filRhm, yeah, could be -exec. linux command parameters are always annoyingly unique.
13:50:34dionoea_workfind options just don't use the regular shortops/longops scheme ... must be some historical reason
13:50:38linuxstbpreglow: What cut-off frequencies would you suggest for bass/treble? The choices for band 1 seem to be 80Hz/105Hz/135Hz and 175Khz, and for band 5: 5.3Khz/6.9Khz/9Khz/11.7KHz. You can adjust the gain in 1dB steps from -1db to +12db or -12db in each band.
13:51:26preglowdepends on the filter type. i think 105 sounds nice if it's an ordinary 2 pole shelving filter
13:51:41preglowfor the upper one, god knows
13:51:41BagderfilR: find predates linux
13:51:56preglowneeds testing anyway
13:52:23rconanfilR: if you notice old things like gcc dont either
13:52:25linuxstbThat's why I think I would like to write a test patch giving users with better ears than me the chance to experiment with it.
13:52:38filRBagder: that doens't make the parameter options much easier. :)
13:52:44linuxstb^a test patch allowing full control over all the settings
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13:53:43Bagderah, you should learn them by heart anyway then it doesn't matter how you use them! :-)
13:54:05agabusif i use the official ipod firmware reinstall thing, will that wipe rockbox and put it back to normal?
13:54:07linuxstbBagder: That's what "man" is for...
13:54:25filRBagder: that is what i find so annoying. very unintuitiv. :(
13:54:46*dan_a does a bigger dance
13:54:58BagderI advocate using xargs instead of -exec anyway
13:55:00linuxstbagabus: Yes. But there are easier ways to uninstall Rockbox if that's what you want to do.
13:55:01dionoea_workdan_a: you have the COP working ?
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13:55:11dan_aI can now run code on the COP
13:55:12agabuslinuxstb - how is that way hard? and what could be easier?
13:55:25dionoea_workyay !
13:55:26dan_aIt needs a patched bootloader though
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13:55:40linuxstbagabus: It's "hard" because it reformats your disk. "ipodpatcher -w 1 bootpartition.bin" is easier.
13:55:48preglowwhen do you wake the cop anyway?
13:56:19agabuslinuxstb - fair enough. it's just i have my bootpartition.bin file on another hard-drive and it would take me a while to plug in that hard-drive and do that
13:57:06dan_apreglow: I put it to sleep just after remapping, and then I wake it manually from a debug menu
13:58:04linuxstbdan_a: What changes did you make to the bootloader?
14:00:15dan_alinuxstb: I made it return after loading Rockbox in the same way as it does after loading IPL
14:00:45 Quit Kohlrabi (Nick collision from services.)
14:00:51linuxstbdan_a: Good - that's a change I was planning making. Does the current CVS Rockbox still run fine?
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14:01:35*linuxstb dreads the time when we need to make all ipod users upgrade their bootloader....
14:02:06dan_aI think it will (though with the COP switched on)
14:03:24preglowlinuxstb: ugh
14:07:00dionoea_workcan't you just switch the COP on after the bootloader ? (i really don't have a clue about how that works)
14:07:03dan_aIt's probably best, if we do use COP code to make it detect in the firmware if the COP can be controlled, so nothing breaks if you've not changed your bootloader
14:07:50dan_adionoea_work: You *can*, but you don't know what the COP is going to be running if you do that
14:08:12rconana lot of ipod users could be using the ipodlinux ipodloader2
14:08:19rconanwhat effect would that have?
14:08:24dionoea_workwhy don't you know ?
14:08:40amiconnDoes that mean you can't switch the cop on & off at will, and still know what code it is running?
14:08:53dan_arconan: The IPL bootloader will need to be changed too
14:09:08rconanwhat is the change?
14:09:39rconanand what effect could it have on the ipl code
14:09:54rconanits a major change your suggesting
14:11:12rconansurely the ipl team wouldnt want to change something in their bootloader if it might effect how it loads ipl and the native fw
14:11:31dan_adionoea_work: I'm a bit unsure on the details, but the addresses where code gets run from is changed by the bootloader, and without the change the COP won't know that
14:11:33linuxstbrconan: No - it's just the Rockbox loading feature that needs to be changed.
14:11:43rconanah ok
14:11:52linuxstb(which I wrote for them anyway...)
14:12:00dionoea_workdan_a: and i guess that this is impossible to do afterwards in rockbox ?
14:12:00rconani didnt realise there was a special rockbox loading feature
14:12:39dan_aamiconn: You can switch the COP on and off at will, but if you relocate code while it's asleep, there may be unexpected results
14:12:56dan_adionoea_work: As far as I can tell, yes
14:13:03linuxstbs/relocate code/relocate SDRAM/ ?
14:13:04dionoea_workhmm ... ok
14:13:04rconanthe best solution is surely to do it in the loader
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14:13:23dan_alinuxstb: Yes
14:14:06amiconndan_a: I guess it wouldn't be a problem if the COP's PC is located in IRAM when it's asleep?
14:15:30dan_aamiconn: I guess not. I'm not really a programmer, so there's lots of things that I don't know
14:15:39*amiconn wonders how the COP wakeup is done
14:16:20dan_aYou write a wakeup command to the COP controller
14:16:30linuxstbdan_a: So both cores are now executing the memory remapping code?
14:16:44linuxstbAnd the COP then puts itself to sleep after the remapping is done?
14:16:48dan_alinuxstb: Yes - that's how IPL do it
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14:16:55linuxstbYes, I noticed that.
14:18:05linuxstbSo if you commit your changes to CVS now, it won't break people using the old bootloaders because the COP is asleep anyway?
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14:18:43preglowdan_a: you've just succeeded making the cop run code of your own and you're "not a programmer"? :>
14:19:02dan_alinuxstb: That's correct
14:19:30dan_apreglow: It's not programming: it's just cutting and pasting... with style!
14:19:37amiconnStrange.... does that mean the cop has its own memory mapping?
14:20:18preglowdoubt it
14:20:52Mikachui thought the problem was it doesn't
14:20:54linuxstbdan_a: You've discovered the art of programming.
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14:21:53aliaskUh, am I doing something wrong - the CVS server is rejecting my (read-only) login?
14:22:19[HO]vo|thello i need the name of the software used to format via usb please
14:22:31peturaliask: use anonymous?
14:23:09aliaskOh... haha copied from the wrong part of "UsingCVS" wikipage :P
14:23:20dionoea_work[HO]vo|t: if you're using windows it's called "the mouse"
14:23:33dionoea_workjust right click on the drive and it should be somewhere in properties
14:23:51[HO]vo|toh i meant for FAT32 > 32GB
14:23:56 Quit TeaSea (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
14:24:15Bagder[HO]vo|t: swissknife
14:24:16amiconnswissknife or h2format
14:24:20[HO]vo|ti have used it before but since reinstalled on my computer, it was Swiss Army Knife or something
14:24:24[HO]vo|tbadger: yes that's it thanks
14:24:34 Join TeaSea [0] (
14:24:58[HO]vo|ti was searching Swiss army knife
14:34:51dan_aThe coprocessor patch is here: There's a lot of things which I've only coded for PP5002, and some things that were just tests I was doing still in there
14:34:53Bagder"> is there any other document availabe that talks about porting uboot on new ARM board?"
14:34:59Bagder"Yes - the source code. It speaks for itself."
14:35:14[HO]vo|tok one more question and i know this is probably just a hint of computer illiteracy, can i make a partition bigger without deleting any information
14:35:18dan_aI'll clean it up and get it in Flyspray after work
14:35:58dionoea_work[HO]vo|t: tools like partition magic will let you do that
14:36:01Bagder[weirdest nick ever]: there are tools that can, yes
14:36:14dionoea_workbut to stay safe i'd advise that you backup important stuff first
14:36:15 Nick [HO]vo|t is now known as volt (
14:36:46voltdion:but that's money, so i've heard
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14:37:13dionoea_workyeah, but it's the only one which works fine for stuff like NTFS. I don't know about fat32
14:37:41Galoisfat32 is easier
14:37:44dionoea_worksomelinux live cds also have qparted or gparted which does some resizing
14:37:55voltdionoea_work: well i only asked for fat32 so i could find the program, i'm actually working with ntfs on a pc backup drive
14:38:26dionoea_workknoppix should have all the needed tools
14:38:50volti have 20gb unformatted and 60gb that has about 50gb of stored files
14:38:54GaloisI always use for resizing
14:39:13voltGalois:thanks, i'll give it a shot
14:39:52voltoh linux? i'm on winxp
14:40:26dionoea_workthey're live cds
14:40:40dionoea_workyou just boot on the CD, do the resizing, eject the CD and you're back to windows
14:41:03voltalright sounds like a plan
14:41:16dionoea_workmost of them even have a graphical interface these days ... so they're usable even if you don't know linux
14:41:57voltshould i go with sysresccd or knoppix
14:42:38dionoea_worksysresccd is maybe better since it's dedicated to such tasks
14:43:41dionoea_work -> shows the nice resize stuff in qtparted
14:45:25voltalright, downloading sysresccd now
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15:03:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:08:22 Quit aliask ("sleep")
15:08:54tucozBagder, did my last commits succeed? The frontpage isn't updated
15:09:14BagderI got lots of commit mails
15:09:22tucozcool then
15:10:01tucozah, just remembered that viewcvs is my friend
15:10:27peturthey're also here:
15:11:10tucozpetur, thanks
15:11:46linuxstbor type "cvs log file.tex" to see the cvs history for a file...
15:13:26tucozlinuxstb, yes. But I prefer the colored diffs of viewcvs :)
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15:20:20tucozBagder, I am summing up a list of emails for the manual contributors (in case we want to change licence). But I fail to find an email to peter schlenker
15:21:04tucozdo you remember his nick by any chance?
15:21:37BagderI'm afraid I don't
15:22:48tucoznice and informative webpage
15:24:27Bagderthat's the email he used during 2003-12 and 2004-01
15:24:56Bg3r LOL :D :D :D
15:25:06 Join sharpe [0] (
15:25:14tucozBagder, thanks :)
15:26:56peturBg3r: rofl
15:27:17 Quit San ()
15:27:42Bg3rthis is pure scoff :D
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15:36:24tucozhmm, would GPL be possible to use on the manual?
15:36:39tucozor is the Creative Commons licence our best bet so far?
15:37:39BagderI'm not very good at the docs licenses
15:37:50Bagderbut yes, it should be possible to use the GPL
15:37:54Bagderif even a bit uncommon
15:38:22tucozYes, but we do use 'source-code' for the manual. And we could definitley benefit from people enhancing that
15:39:01tucozI am not sure the Creative Commons licence gives us the right to use the source-material (I have to look that up).
15:40:50tucozbut if the source code is licence under that, I would assume that enhancements would also be licenced under that same licence.
15:41:32dan_atucoz: Why not licence the text of the manual as CC, and the source code as GPL?
15:41:57tucozdan_a, I am not really sure where the difference is
15:43:04tucozdan_a, if the source code for the manual is licenced as GPL, what licence would the pdf/html manual get?
15:43:25Mikachuif you redistribute the pdf, you'd have to distribute the .tex
15:43:33Mikachubut you could still copy the text and copy it freely
15:43:43dionoea_workisn't GFDL the usual license for docs ?
15:43:45Mikachuthat is my guess at least
15:43:54tucozdionoea, yes. But it has its limitations
15:43:58dionoea_worklike ?
15:44:03tucozdionoea_work, it's not as free as GPL
15:44:22dionoea_workwell you don't want rockbox inclusion in debian do you ? :)
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15:44:56tucozno, I don't. But I think we should be able to benefit from possible branches of the manual as well as the rest of rockbox
15:45:11tucozat least, not leave that opportunity out because of licence issues
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15:46:23dionoea_worktucoz: does GFDL forbit branching ?
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15:47:08dionoea_workpoint 4. just says that you need to state that it's not the original version. But you're free to modify it
15:47:14Mikachui think it allows branchers to disallow us to use their changes
15:47:17dionoea_workas long as you give credit to the original authors
15:48:00tucozMikachu, something like that. We might have to use the branched front page text for instance
15:48:12tucoz(I don't remember really)
15:48:19tucozrasher mentioned something about this.
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15:48:53Mikachuquite a strange license
15:49:06dionoea_workhum... anyway changing the current license might be a bit hard to do too
15:49:15dionoea_workunless you have a limited numbers of contributors
15:49:21tucozdionoea_work, but it's worth a shot imo
15:50:03tucozuntil the 2.4 docs were committed to cvs, there were only 3 people listed as contributors to the manual
15:50:31tucozand the cvs commits / flyspray patches are not that hard to follow.
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15:59:42tucozFebs, in case you didn't notice. I renamed the rockref macro to reference
16:00:13 Quit XavierGr ()
16:01:51FebsI saw that, thanks.
16:02:49 Join scorche [0] (
16:02:53JdGordonhey folks
16:03:51 Quit pondlife (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:04:08 Quit _Lucretia_ ("Leaving")
16:05:07Bg3rJdGordon yep ;)
16:05:45JdGordonim getting nowhere in the assignment
16:08:37 Quit Febs ("Windows sucks. Must reboot.")
16:11:32Bg3rhuh :(
16:12:59tucozsml is a pita
16:13:10Bg3rwhat's your task?
16:14:03dionoea_workis sml like caml ?
16:14:13JdGordonmake functions to work with numbers of unlimited magnitute
16:14:54 Join Febs [0] (
16:16:00Bg3r ?
16:16:25tucozit's a functional programming language
16:17:07*xorAxAx has to do sml as well
16:22:09FebsI was thinking this morning that it would be useful to set the default directory for Rockbox.
16:22:58FebsFor example, many people have a "music" directory, and it would be convenient to have Rockbox boot into /music, or return to /music when follow playlist is set to off.
16:23:34FebsPersonally, I'd like to have Rockbox start in /settings, where I have a number of config files stored for various applications (car.cfg, headphones.cfg, etc.)
16:23:38amiconnWhat would be the advantage of having a "music" directory?
16:23:54Mikachuto not mix up music with other things?
16:24:29amiconnWhat other things would that be? The main purpose of a music player is playing music....
16:24:34S0apyea, having 800 albums in the root directory is a mess
16:24:36FebsI'm just saying that some people organize their music that way. Plus, IIRC, the H300 series automatically creates such a directory in the iriver firmware, so I suspect most H300 users have that structure.
16:24:59Mikachui have /pics, /lyrics, /audiobooks, /notes, /playlists, /games, /sudoku
16:25:05amiconnAn extra dir level just doesn't make sense to me...
16:25:25S0aphow many albums do you have in your root, amiconn?
16:25:48Mikachualso fat has a limit on how many entries you can have in /, but we probably won't hit that
16:25:50amiconnI have structured my music into /style/artist/album
16:26:06Mikachuthen we have the same number of levels, i don't have style/
16:26:23*S0ap likes to think most of his music defies genre/style classifications :)
16:26:25amiconn...with style being a coarse categorisation related to genre
16:26:45linuxstbI have my audio files split into "music", "comedy" and "bootlegs" (which I like to keep separate from my studio albums in /music) If I had any audiobooks, I would keep those separate as well.
16:26:49FebsEven so, the ability to boot into a /settings directory would be an easy way to select a certain configuration. It would (indirectly) address the concern of people who think Rockbox should boot into the WPS so they can adjust volume before playing music.
16:27:13amiconnGenre is too fine-grained for me; I just have 12 "styles"
16:27:17Febs(Note that I am NOT suggesting that Rockbox should start anywhere but the file browser.)
16:27:20linuxstbHow about just remembering the last folder you were navigating in?
16:27:24S0apFebs - so are you thinking a hardcoded default directory, or a user-configurable default? For I'd not like the former.
16:28:00Febslinuxstb: I thought about that, but it would not address my /settings idea.
16:28:43FebsS0ap: No, not a hardcoded directory. I was thinking more there could be an selection in the folder context menu for "Set as default."
16:28:54amiconnFebs: What about (a) just using 'manage settings' or (b, like I do) keep some .cfg files in the root?
16:28:59Mikachuisn't it a bit difficult to save a path string in the config block? or is there plenty of space?
16:29:13amiconnMikachu: No there isn't
16:29:18linuxstbI can't see a problem with a user-configurable default startup directory. But I think it needs to wait for the switch to .cfg files. (as Mikachu just said...)
16:29:23linuxstb(and amiconn...)
16:29:46Febsamiconn: convenience.
16:30:35FebsFiles stored in the root display under folders in the root, so it requires a number of keypresses to get to them, or to get to browse .cfg files.
16:30:45Mikachupress up instead of down
16:30:47amiconnJust press Up once...
16:30:57linuxstbIMO Rockbox is all about giving the user control over their own DAP... I agree that we need to control the number of features and settings, but we also shouldn't say no to every suggestion, which seems to be the default response nowadays...
16:31:42Febsamiconn: that works only if your config files are the only files in the root (or the last of the files in the root).
16:32:13FebsMy idea would allow a user to select a custom configuration at startup with as few as one button press.
16:32:16amiconnMaybe a default startup directory might be useful in some situations, but we also have to keep more than just one eye at (a) code size. (b) option bloat
16:32:34dionoea_worki second the "change default folder" option
16:32:37amiconnMore and more options also make rockbox more difficult to operate
16:33:41amiconnAfter switching to .cfg files, implementing this default dir idea shouldn't be too complex though
16:33:57S0ap"default" directory could be one of those features which ships set to root, and only gets changed if someone opens up the .cfg file in their text editor, reads the comment on what it does, and decides to change it.
16:34:04FebsI'm well aware of ease of operation issue, considering that I've written a large part of the 100+ page manual and answered a gazillion questions in the forums. ;)
16:34:25amiconnSame goes for the recording dir then. Currently there's just the choice between current dir and /recordings ... rather inconvenient e.g. on Ondio
16:34:28goffawow... that x5 lcd code must have been a mess...
16:34:42S0apthere is no reason features such as that need to be part of the average user's learning curve.
16:34:53goffaseems like every day since the feature freeze they've optimized the code in some way
16:36:18S0apso that addresses option bloat in my mind, but I could see where code size is still a very real issue.
16:36:41*amiconn is working on grayscale lib lcd linearisation and gamma correction
16:37:35*amiconn hopes to fix the doom "headache bug" on h1x0 with the first step - linearisation
16:39:09 Join fliegenderfrosch [0] (
16:39:14dionoea_workand have fun with the second step ? :)
16:39:37amiconnThe second step will improve jpeg viewing...
16:39:58FebsS0ap: I suppose another way to do it could be to have the default path in a text file in the .rockbox directory. Check for that filename, if it exists, make it the default, else default to root.
16:40:45dionoea_workisn't that the same as putting it in the configuration ?
16:41:35Febssame idea, but it avoids the problem of path string in the .cfg file.
16:42:06linuxstbPath string in the .cfg file is easy. Paths in the current binary config sector are troublesome.
16:42:21FebsI misspoke.
16:43:00dionoea_workbtw, is it planned to move the config to some file instead of a hidden disk sector ?
16:43:28linuxstbEveryone seems to agree it's a good idea, but afaik, no-one is currently working on it.
16:43:38fliegenderfroschI've got a problem: i downloaded rockbox a few days ago and installed it on my iriver h140. the installation went well, but I experienced problems with a few songs i tried to play. Rockbox won't play them, shows an other song of the directory in the wps and won't play any song until it's rebooted. Today i upgraded rockbox to the daily build but nothing changed. Has anyone any idee how to solve this problem? With the original firmwa hard would it be to make a computer-side reader/writer for the disk sector?
16:44:15 Join _Lucretia_ [0] (
16:44:15 Quit San||Away () runs off to see what sector is what.
16:44:26linuxstbS0ap: Why would that help? It would be tricky because the sector has a different format for every target (depending upon the enabled features and settings).
16:44:27amiconnS0ap: The problem is that it's just a sector, nothing suitable for storing longish paths
16:44:37dionoea_worklinuxstb: i'll give it a try then ... and post a patch on the tracker for discussion
16:45:17dionoea_workwould the config file be a different format than the .cfg files ? or can we just use one of those ? (or maybe we want to keep it binary ?)
16:45:21linuxstbdionoea: One of the issues is the delayed-writing of the settings - the config sector has a special place in Rockbox, and is written to disk only when the disk spins up.
16:45:51amiconnsome settings need to stay binary
16:46:17S0aplinuxstb - As to why...I assumed (cough) that allowing manual editing of infrequently changed settings would do more for preventing bloat than creating the structure to change such settings on the DAP.
16:46:19amiconn...but they should go to a file as well, if no special binary storage is available on the target
16:46:47 Quit petur ("worrrk")
16:46:52linuxstbS0ap: OK. But that wouldn't deal with the extra code needed to implement those settings.
16:47:02dionoea_workso like base64 encode the binary settings ? (btw, which settings need to stay binary ?)
16:48:34amiconnNo... the binary settings I mean need to stay binary for several reasons. (a) cumbersome to convert to ascii. (b) they're accessed frequently, so access should be fast. (c) Storing them in a .cfg would be a bad idea because they're rather dynamic things
16:48:38amiconn- resume position
16:48:46amiconn- battery runtime data
16:49:13linuxstbfliegenderfrosch: What kinds of files are the ones that don't work in Rockbox?
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16:49:25fliegenderfroschlinuxstb: .ogg
16:49:29dionoea_workwell the only issue is basically conversion to and from the config format
16:49:53S0apfliegenderfrosch - are these non-working oggs of your own creation?
16:50:07fliegenderfroschaudio cds ripped with grip
16:50:11amiconndionoea: That's not the only issue
16:50:23JdGordonamiconn: wasnt it you who said the plan was to goto a text based config system without the hard disk block?
16:50:33amiconnIf it were, we could have switched a long time ago
16:50:40linuxstbfliegenderfrosch: Did you enable id3 tags in grip?
16:50:40amiconnJdGordon: Yes
16:51:00JdGordonso now its not?
16:51:15amiconnIt is
16:51:23amiconnI just say it's not trivial
16:51:29fliegenderfroschlinuxstb: at the moment: yes; when i ripped these tracks: i don't know
16:51:42fliegenderfroschprobably yes
16:52:28linuxstbid3 tags don't belong in Ogg files, so grip shouldn't give you the option to do them. I'm guessing that if you either remove the tags, or re-rip with that option disabled, they'll work.
16:52:30dionoea_workamiconn: what other problems would there be ? access would still be fast since the config is kept into RAM at runtime (or if it isn't it would)
16:53:50amiconnConfig is updated frequently in RAM, and written to disk at the next spinup or at shutdown
16:55:42dionoea_workwell maybe we could split it into config stuff set by the user (doesn't change a lot) and rockbox core changes (frequent)
16:55:48dionoea_workor into sub categories
16:55:59dionoea_workand only write what needs to
16:56:52fliegenderfroschlinuxstb: if i disable id3-tags, are oggs tagged with a special "ogg-tag"?
16:57:51markunfliegenderfrosch: yes, called 'vorbis comments'
16:58:08Mikachuthat is sort of strange though, aren't they saved on the ogg container level?
16:58:23markunno, I don't think they are
17:00:29fliegenderfroschok. is there an easy way of removing id3 tags of ~4000 songs? and will other programs and the original firmware be able to read the ogg tags?
17:01:38Mikachui have never ever heard of id3 tags on ogg files
17:02:00linuxstbYes, Ogg vorbis players should all support vorbis comments - it's part of the Ogg spec.
17:02:47 Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN)
17:03:27LinusNgoffa: the x5 lcd code wasn't a mess, quite the opposite
17:03:47LinusNit was very simple, and thus very unoptimized
17:03:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:04:31linuxstbfliegenderfrosch: I'm not sure where it came from, but I've got an app called "id3v2" in my Debian installation - "id3v2 -D *.ogg" should do it. But obviously test on a copy of one file first :)
17:04:56goffai stand corrected LinusN :)
17:05:01LinusNamiconn: the resume and battery info doesn't have to be binary on all targets
17:05:06LinusNgoffa: :-)
17:05:22LinusNamiconn: since we only have to save it when we shut down
17:05:42amiconnWhat if we run out of power during playback?
17:05:59LinusNthen we lose the resume position
17:06:12amiconnYes, and that would be rather bad
17:06:19LinusNor we make sure to save the settings when we are close
17:06:32 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
17:06:32S0apnon-graceful battery death is an open ipod bug is it not?
17:06:39Bagderisn't a HW shutdown the more likely scenario to cause trouble
17:06:43amiconnToday, when the player runs out of power, resume takes you back to the point of last succesful spinup
17:06:46dionoea_workso basically you'd write it every time the disk spins up ? or like every time the disk spins up and battery is less than 5% full ?
17:07:08amiconnEvery time the disk spins up.
17:07:13linuxstbBut the last disk access could be a number of tracks before the currently playing one on swcodec (and especially the 60GB 5g).
17:07:24Mikachuwhat is the definition of disk spinup on flash players?
17:07:26amiconnThis also protects the resume info against rockbox freeze as much as possible
17:07:45linuxstbMikachu: I believe it's simulated, in order to reduce the number of disk writes.
17:08:52LinusNS0ap: non-graceful battery death is an issue on all rockbox targets
17:08:57dionoea_workcurrent position and battery stats are the only informations which need to be written every time ?
17:09:09fliegenderfroschlinuxstb: one more question. grip added id3 tags to the files as well as ID3v2 tags. will id3v2 (i found it in the ubuntu repository) delete both of them?
17:09:48LinusNdionoea: think so
17:10:00linuxstbfliegenderfrosch: Yes.
17:10:08dionoea_workok, well i'll try writting a sensible patch and post it here for comments
17:10:30fliegenderfroschlinuxstb: thanks for your help :D i'll try if it works
17:25:32 Join Terinjokes [0] (
17:27:06Terinjokeswas talking with midkay the other day, i have to have my ipod in FAT32 format, just can't find a windows computer to format it on
17:27:06 Join BigMac [0] (n=dummeska@
17:27:15 Quit _Lucretia_ ("Leaving")
17:27:25LinusNTerinjokes: what OS do you have then?
17:27:42LinusNi thought mac could format fat32
17:27:54Terinjokesit can, just not an ipod
17:28:40Terinjokesapple figures everyone on a mac wants their ipod in HFS+
17:29:11LinusNso what does the disk utility say?
17:29:45Terinjokesi can format it to FAT32 yes, but it ah, breaks the ipod (removes the firmware)
17:30:17LinusNyes, that's expected, isn't it?
17:30:34filRjup, you need a windows computer / parallels/vmware/whatever to format fat32 "properly". :(
17:31:05Terinjokesyes, i don;t have any of that, or i would be jamming to rockbox (or troubleshooting an error)
17:31:17BigMacanyone here have an ipod 5g
17:31:28Terinjokesi got a nano
17:31:41filRBigMac: i do.
17:32:04BigMacdo you use the ipl bootloader in conjunction with rock box filR?
17:32:17Terinjokesanyone (besides me) have an apple nano?
17:32:28filRBigMac: hm, i have no idea which bootloader i am using. it was the one linked in the install howto on the page.
17:32:41BigMacnope not it
17:32:50filRTerinjokes: i have a friend who has one. so there is at least one other person in the world that has one. ;)
17:32:59filRBigMac: ok, then i am not using the ipl bootloader. :D
17:33:23BigMacits all good filR
17:33:44filRBigMac: is that the bootloader, which ipodlinux uses?
17:34:07TerinjokesBigMac, i've never gotten ipl to work correctly, ipl is not very organisated
17:34:25BigMacbut you can use it with rockbox so you don't have to do the keypresses to boot in apple os
17:34:33preglowFebs: how do you think an eq graph would fit into an eq gui?
17:34:38TerinjokesBigMac, its loader2
17:34:54 Quit Criamos ("( :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: )")
17:34:55BigMaci know that
17:35:10BigMacbut i want to know if anyone is using that with rockbox on there 5g\
17:35:10linuxstbTerinjokes: Have you read the instructions for converting an ipod to FAT32 on the IpodInstallationFromMacOSX wiki page?
17:35:38BigMaclinux, do you have a 5g?
17:35:50tucozTerinjokes, wouldn't it be possible to run a ubuntu live cd and format it with that. Ubuntu supports power pc's as far as i know.
17:36:18Terinjokesi have a ubuntu live cd, but if i format it, i'll remove the firmware
17:36:51BigMacTerinjokes: how aboot you send me your ipod, and ill fat32 it for ya:D
17:36:58Febspreglow: depends on the target resolution. But with anything at least the size of the h100 I think it would be doable if we used the graph for about 75% of the display, with the remaining 25% used for adjusting the three parameters (one band visible on the display at a time).
17:37:13TerinjokesBigMac, i found instructions thanks to linuxstb
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17:37:57Febspreglow: I have a Line6 XTLive which has a semi-parametric eq, and it uses a similar system on its display.
17:38:03 Join Criamos [0] (
17:38:24Terinjokeswell, i'm about to say goodbye to my ipod
17:38:52filRgl Terinjokes. :/
17:39:43preglowFebs: might work
17:39:45Terinjokesforgot to unmount
17:40:34preglowFebs: but that'd be a bare minimum, screen real estate wise
17:41:04preglowFebs: that's the graph at h1x0 resolution, not exactly very detailed
17:41:16BigMacanyone know of any plays for a nice looking homemade dock? for a 5g
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17:42:12preglowFebs: though that's linear frequency scale
17:42:20preglowwhich we wouldn't want, i guess
17:42:54 Quit actionshrimp (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:43:42BigMacso a quick question, why can't the source be available on the site, so we dont have to jcompile it ourselfs?
17:44:02FebsNo, we'd definitely want a log scale. I think that level of detail on the graph is fine. It conveys *far* more information than the current slider graphics.
17:44:09dionoea_workpreglow: is that a polynomial interpolation ?
17:44:35Terinjokesi need ipod_fw any ideas?
17:44:35FebsBigMac: the source is available on the site.
17:44:35preglowdionoea_work: no, it's the exact spectrum calculated directly at each point shown on the frequency axis
17:44:51preglowdionoea_work: "exact" as in "the closest i can get
17:44:52BigMacFebs: so i could just edit it?
17:44:52MikachuBigMac: you have to compile it, that's what you do with source code
17:45:00BigMacthen would i have to compile it?
17:45:21*Terinjokes still looking for ipod_fw
17:45:27dionoea_workpreglow: hum ..ok. But the equalizer only has like 10 settings doesn't it?
17:45:38amiconnpreglow: Do you have fixed point ln() and exp() ?
17:45:41preglowdionoea_work: more like 16
17:45:49FebsBigMac: it must be compiled. Otherwise, it's like spreading the pieces of a car engine all over the floor, changing one piece, and saying, "why won't the car run?"
17:45:52BigMacTerinjokes: i have it
17:46:06BigMaci can email it to you if you wish
17:46:18preglowamiconn: i just did a simple table for this one
17:46:34preglowamiconn: i think replaygain.c has fixed point exp
17:46:36BigMacFebs: nice analogy. got the point across in a way i can understand:-)
17:48:15preglowdionoea_work: what's that got to do with it anyway?
17:49:06dionoea_worknothing ... i was just wondering how you build the curve :)
17:49:15BigMacfebs:can i download the bootloader and modify that?
17:49:16 Quit scorche (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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17:49:29preglowdionoea_work: <- with that code and filter coefficients
17:50:41FebsBigMac: Yes. We had a whole discussion about that yesterday.
17:52:08 Nick ScoTTie is now known as scotteh__ (n=scott@unaffiliated/scottie)
17:53:30*Terinjokes still looking for ipod_fw
17:54:32*Terinjokes knows how to google
17:54:52dan_aTerinjokes: Isn't this it?
17:54:59Terinjokesi found it already
17:55:26dionoea_workpreglow: is that like a Bode plot ? (/me tries remembers some physics)
17:55:41preglowdionoea_work: it's exactly like it
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18:00:16dionoea_workpreglow: are equalizer settings points on the Bode plot ? or are they parameters which define the frequency response curve ?
18:02:22 Quit Hansmaulwurf ("( :: NoNameScript 3.81 :: )")
18:04:28amiconnWoot :)
18:04:53amiconnJPEGs already look considerably better just with linearisation
18:05:45tucozamiconn, cool
18:10:17 Quit scotteh__ ()
18:10:45preglowdionoea_work: the last
18:11:04dionoea_workdo you have a doc or link explaining how that works ?
18:11:21preglowdionoea_work: each eq filter will affect all the others such that the sum of all of them doesn't necessarily go through the settings you defined
18:11:36preglowdionoea_work: if this was not so, the point of an eq plot would be pretty small
18:11:52preglowdionoea_work: can't think of any good docs, no, but the net should have some info somewhere
18:12:20dionoea_workpreglow: any keyword i should use ?
18:14:11preglownot really, no
18:14:16preglowthat i can think of
18:14:42dionoea_workis like some fourrier transform, changing the coefficients and doing an inverse transform ?
18:14:47dionoea_work*is it
18:15:24 Quit tucoz ("Leaving")
18:15:44preglowit's pretty much like doing the inverse z-transform on the unity circle
18:16:09preglowno, not doing the inverse, just evaluation the z-transform on the unity circle
18:16:16Terinjokeshrm, my ipod won't get off the "Do Not Disconnect" screen
18:16:21preglowevaluatING, my brain's asleep
18:16:28dionoea_workz-transform is a laplace-transform variant right ?
18:17:01Terinjokesshould i just unplug it anyways?
18:17:09dan_aTerinjokes: On Linux, you have to "eject" it... is there something similar in OSX?
18:17:30Terinjokesyes i already ejected it, i checked mount, its no longer mounted
18:17:56preglowdionoea_work: the z-transform is the discrete math equivalent of the laplace transform
18:18:36preglowdionoea_work: evaluationg a z-domain expression on the unit circle is the same as evalation a s-domain (laplace) expression on the imaginary axis, you get the system response out
18:18:36dionoea_workok. thanks for all the info :)
18:18:51preglowplease ignore the typos, i just can't type today
18:18:54 Part fliegenderfrosch
18:19:28Terinjokesok, i got rockbox!
18:23:01Terinjokesah, i'm stuck in "dice"
18:23:43dionoea_workclick select+menu
18:23:45dionoea_workor menu
18:23:47dionoea_workor select
18:24:38Terinjokesthere we go, itunes no longer recognises my ipod ;-)
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18:26:10linuxstbAre you using firewire?
18:26:14 Join bondolo_ [0] (
18:26:45Terinjokesno, USB, but i don't care, copying the files in finder is ok by me (plus i can get to them on a computer ;-) )
18:27:00linuxstbOK. So the ipod is recognised as a disk, just not by itunes?
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18:27:58Terinjokesprobably has something to do with suddenly dropping a new partition table on the ipod
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18:32:30Febspreglow: Have a look here Febs/Rockbox/"> <−− this is a very rough sketch, but it gives you an idea of what I'm thinking.
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18:34:45preglowFebs: that pretty much implies we should quantise the center freqs to coincide with the plot grid, otherwise the peak on a narrow enough filter might not even show up completely
18:35:15FebsOne possible button configuration for #1: Left/right: select EQ band | select/navi button: select parameter | up/down: adjust selected parameter
18:35:21preglowFebs: if we go for the first one, that is
18:35:43preglowthe first one actually seems to be the nicest too
18:35:54FebsI prefer that one as well.
18:36:09Terinjokescan i play video in rockbox?
18:36:17preglowTerinjokes: not on anything but archos
18:36:41Terinjokeshrm, ok, diggnation would look better on my computer's screen anyways
18:37:13dionoea_workyou can still reboot to the apple firmware if you need to watch a video
18:37:45 Quit juxtap ()
18:38:23preglowFebs: actually, that isn't entirely unfeasible, no. that would leave us with about 160 possible frequencies, logarithmically spaced to our choice
18:38:50preglowFebs: one "problem" would be that frequency granularity would be lcd size dependent, but i don't know how much i care about that
18:39:07Terinjokesthe apple firmwire doesn't support videos ;-)
18:39:29preglowFebs: another problem will be that eq adjusting will be _much_ more cpu intensive
18:39:32 Quit agabus (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:39:38preglowFebs: since i'll also need to update the graph in realtime
18:39:43dionoea_workTerinjokes: oh, i though that you had a video ipod :/ sorry
18:39:56FebsWould it be possible to leave the frequency granularity as is and round to the nearest point on the graph for display purposes?
18:40:18FebsGiven the resolution, that wouldn't make all that much difference in the accuracy of the display.
18:40:22 Quit dionoea_work ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
18:40:26preglowFebs: sure, no, but it'll no longer be exact, of course
18:40:49preglowFebs: oh wait, it might be a bit kludgey
18:40:54amiconnpreglow: What about remote and main LCD differences?
18:41:18preglowFebs: i create the graph from the filter coefficients themselves, which would pretty much mean i need to calculate two sets of coefs, one for actual eq processing, and one for displaying
18:41:23preglowamiconn: *shrug*
18:41:42FebsMaybe text only display on the remote?
18:41:57preglowi'd be very tempted to go for that to not completely kill performance
18:42:12Terinjokeshow do you install a theme?
18:42:30FebsJust display the band being adjusted and the 3 parameters.
18:42:34Febson the remote.
18:42:52FebsIf the user wants to know what his EQ looks like, he/she can check the main display.
18:43:03Terinjokesah, how do you install a theme?
18:43:23FebsTerinjokes: unzip it to your player.
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18:43:34FebsIf the theme is set up well, you can unzip it to the root.
18:43:35Terinjokesjust any folder?
18:44:24preglowi guess i could also go for making eq filter specific plotting routines, but that would mean both bigger code size, less flexibility, and more important, lots more developer time for me
18:44:24FebsOtherwise, you'll need to make sure that the .cfg file goes in /.rockbox/themes. The .wps file goes in /.rockbox/wps. There should be a folder with the same name as the wps that goes in /.rockbox/wps/wpsname
18:44:34Febs(where wpsname is the name of the wps)
18:48:28Terinjokesok, i understand now
18:50:32 Quit nudelyn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:51:07 Quit _Lucretia_ ("Leaving")
18:53:24Terinjokeswhat does "CBA" mean?
18:54:26dan_aTerinjokes: In what context?
18:54:39Terinjokeson the now playing menu
18:55:04dan_aCBR: Constant Bit Rate
19:00:00 Join joe2 [0] (
19:00:36Terinjokesyeah, my Jet songs have too high of a bit rate
19:00:43 Join agabus [0] (
19:02:10dan_aWhat it means is that they have been encoded in a certain way (Variable Bit Rate being the other)
19:02:37Mikachuin vbr, the bitrate can be different in different parts of the file
19:02:40Terinjokesyes, my Jet songs are skipping (same thing happened in ipl)
19:02:55Mikachuso vbr gives better quality for less space
19:03:04 Quit YouCeyE (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:03:21Terinjokesi normally use OGG, but having been using itunes, most of my files are in MP3
19:03:29Terinjokes::Spader Out::
19:03:40 Quit Terinjokes ()
19:03:52 Quit akaias (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:03:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:06:26 Quit barrywardell ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
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19:19:04 Quit tvelocity ("Ex-Chat")
19:22:18 Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
19:23:01*jaczehack needs to restart to get the vmware player running
19:23:05 Part jaczehack
19:24:32BigMacwhat is the best ipod 5g skin out their?
19:27:01FebsThat's totally a matter of personal opinion.
19:27:46filRBigMac: i really like but there are many good ones out there. and "best" is of course personal preference.
19:27:52BigMacwell what do you think Febs
19:28:03BigMacoh no no
19:28:11BigMacI meant like a case
19:28:25filRa, ok. lol.
19:28:36BigMacim thinking of the claro
19:28:41BigMacit looks nice
19:28:50BigMacvery scratch resistant
19:29:03filRi haven't really looked at any. as i only use my 5g in the car, i am not overly woried about scratching it.
19:29:13BigMacoh yah
19:29:44 Join jaczehack [0] (
19:29:47filRbut i think most of the "ipod extras" are totally overpriced.
19:34:18goffathat "i" costs a lot of money :)
19:34:28goffalike if it was a case it would be cheap
19:34:40goffabut if its an iCase then you are looking at $$
19:35:25amiconnA Pod would also be cheap then? ;)
19:35:56BigMacit doesnt have to be apple brand
19:35:59BigMacany case
19:36:03BigMacbut i want a good one
19:40:07 Join Acksaw [0] (
19:40:24 Join muesli__ [0] (i=muesli_t@
19:45:12tucozIn case you wondered how emoticons looks like on a real human face, hehe.
19:47:46 Quit muesli__ ("ich will KEe!!!")
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19:51:49 Part BigMac
19:53:39oboLinusN: any thoughts about the Audioscrobbler patch?
19:53:59LinusNnot at the moment
19:59:28^jhMikeS^Dumb Q: How do you declare a variable to be in IRAM?
20:00:10 Join tcmjr [0] (n=tcmjr@
20:00:20 Part tcmjr
20:01:06amiconn^jhMikeS^: Depends slightly on what type you want: constant, initialised variable, or uninitialised variable
20:01:32amiconnconst int constant ICONST_ATTR = 123;
20:01:43^jhMikeS^amiconn: static global init doesn't matter
20:01:44amiconnint variable IDATA_ATTR = 456;
20:01:55amiconnint scratch IBSS_ATTR;
20:02:12^jhMikeS^ahh thanks
20:02:32amiconnIt's probably the last one you want then...
20:02:48dionoeawhat does the IBSS part mean ?
20:03:14amiconnIt means a bss segment (uninitialised data) in IRAM
20:03:33dionoeaBSS is an acronym for ... ?
20:04:15amiconn"Block Started by Symbol"
20:04:38dionoeathanks :)
20:04:52^jhMikeS^thank amiconn
20:04:52dionoea(doesn't help understanding what it means ... but it could've)
20:05:58amiconn^jhMikeS^, dionoea: Programs are split into different sections. The standard ones are .text (code goes there), .data (initialised data), .rodata (constants) and .bss (uninitialised data)
20:06:43dionoeaok :)
20:07:16^jhMikeS^I know about segments
20:07:30amiconnFor IRAM usage, we have another set of sections: .icode, .idata, .irodata and .ibss
20:07:40dionoea^jhMikeS^: i dont :)
20:07:58 Join Poka64 [0] (
20:08:22dionoeai've never done any assembler or anything lower level than C
20:10:40dan_aamiconn: what is the difference between initialised and uninitialised data? Or at least, what is the reason for separating them?
20:10:59amiconnuninitialised data doesn't need to be included in the binary image
20:11:43tucozthis page seem to go into this subject quite thorougly
20:12:52 Quit Acksaw ("( :: NoNameScript 4.03 :: )")
20:14:04tucozquite an interesting read (^^that page)
20:15:29dan_aThanks, amiconn and tucoz!
20:16:10tucozthanks to yourself and dionea for raising this question. Never thought about this before :)
20:18:47mirakhum, on the H300 the cpu speed is dynamical or it must be set manually (in the code of course)
20:19:38mirakdoes a plugin need to set that or is it always the max cpu usage ?
20:19:46LinusNmirak: it's set by the cpu_boost() function
20:19:57dan_amirak: I think it's dynamic - at least according to firmware/export/config-h300.h
20:20:14mirakLinusN: that's new or was it always like that ?
20:20:18LinusNwhenever you need to do something cpu intensive, you call cpu_boost(true), and then cpu_boost(false) when you're done
20:20:29LinusNhas always been like that
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20:20:48mirakI ask that because I wonder if I used all the cpu power when working on the video codec
20:20:56 Part gursikh
20:21:10mirakI believe that I didn't if you say it must be forced
20:21:29mirakso this can motivate me to try again
20:21:35mirakyou remember ?
20:21:46LinusNvaguely :-)
20:21:48mirakI did plug to read xvid and mpeg stream
20:21:55mirakdid a plugin
20:22:07LinusNah yes
20:22:23markunmirak: you didn't boost in your video decoder??
20:22:27mirakso I obtained something like 2 frames second
20:22:33mirakmarkun: no ...
20:22:42mirakI didn't know you needed to do that
20:22:53markunSorry I didn't tell you then..
20:23:01markunI didn't even check
20:23:05LinusNoh, so now you can get 8 frames/s :-)
20:23:17mirakwhat's the base speed ?
20:23:19markunmirak: did you use IRAM?
20:23:20mirak10mhz ?
20:23:28LinusNmirak: read the page i gave you
20:23:34dionoeavideo playback ? sounds great :D
20:23:36mirakmarkun: I vaguely used it, but gained not much.
20:23:53tucozLinusN, it says that you should not switch frequency often because the tickcounter looses accuracy. Does this mean the tick timer will be way off after some hours (days) of playing tracks that needs boosting?
20:24:03mirakmarkun: I tried to use it, but it could have been far better, with more experienced coder
20:24:13mirakthe goal is still to reach 25 frames second
20:24:31mirakI am sure we could get that with uncompressed sound
20:24:35amiconntucoz: No, it's not that large an accuracy loss
20:24:35markunIs that the fps of the H300 firmware?
20:24:37tucozLinusN, a 100 tracks will possibly be one second off?
20:24:50mirakmarkun: no thir firm is 10fps
20:24:54tucozamiconn, ok
20:24:58markunmirak: ac3 is very efficient
20:25:27markunwhy not make 10fps your first goal then?
20:25:44 Join SereR0kR [0] (
20:25:52tucozand then persuade preglow and amiconn to get working on the asm :)
20:26:24mirakmarkun: I think the first goal was to get over 2fps because I really didn't exepected so poor performances
20:26:26amiconnI can't even follow the codec maths in C, let alone asm...
20:27:03amiconnBah, laptop sound stopped working again :/
20:27:16dionoeamirak: is your decoder doing some rescaling ? or are the videos already LCD size ?
20:27:18LinusNmirak: the coldfire has a really inefficient bus controller
20:27:39amiconntucoz: No, winxp
20:27:48 Join mikearthur [0] (
20:27:51LinusNso the sdram memory bandwidth sucks badly
20:27:53mirakdionoea: I extracted a stream I used with the iriver firmware, so that was the lcd size
20:28:09*LinusN goes to eat
20:28:11dionoeaok :(
20:28:22tucozok. if it was linux, I wouldn't be surprised. Sound and linux doesn't mach too well in my experience
20:28:42dionoeawhat codecs did you say that you were using ? mpeg2 ? mpeg4/divx ?
20:28:59mirakdionoea: yes
20:29:05dionoeayes what ? :)
20:29:20mirakI ported xvidcore
20:29:23dionoeadid you see the mpeg2 patch on the tracker ?
20:29:29mirakand libmpeg2
20:29:33dionoeaok :)
20:29:39mirakdionoea: that's mine
20:29:42Mikachumirak: in recent years, i haven't had any problems with sound
20:29:50dionoeaah ... :)
20:30:05mirakMikachu: why do you say that ?
20:30:17Mikachusorry, tucoz
20:30:21dionoeaare the streams encoded with B frames ?
20:30:27Mikachuyou have the same color and nick length :)
20:30:56mirakamiconn: so the player was running only at 45mhz or 11mhz with the plugin ?
20:31:05tucozMikachu, :) I have a hard time getting sound from different sources playing at the same time
20:31:07tucozfor instance
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20:31:21mirakamiconn markun : I mean before starting a plugin the default is idle or normal ?
20:31:28dionoeatucoz: did you try alsa software dmix ?
20:31:33*mirak hopes it was idle
20:31:36mirakah crap
20:31:36tucozdionoea, no. What is that?
20:31:44amiconnidle is only used during usb
20:31:47Mikachutucoz: i have a sb live, the driver supports hardware mixing
20:31:58mirakamiconn: not radio ?
20:32:11dionoeatucoz: software audio mixing in alsa. So all the apps work at once. Check dionoea/asound.conf"> (and copy it to /etc/asound.conf)
20:32:23dionoeaworks here :) (no need to use esd or arts anymore)
20:32:25amiconnAh, radio too. (without recording)
20:32:37tucozMikachu, ah. the sb live is supposed to be great on linux. But, I run a laptop with a realtek chip. :(
20:32:50tucozdionoea, cheers. that sounds like magic
20:33:05mirakso that's a 2,6 boost on the fps, that's still weak, but I guess iram and asm optimisation would be more visible
20:33:11 Quit mikearthur (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
20:33:33Mikachutucoz: yeah that might be harder
20:33:39Mikachutucoz: i bought this card to work on linux
20:33:51dionoeamirak: did you try using videos with I frames only ? (they might be easier to decode i guess)
20:34:58amiconnI-frames only is usually slowest
20:35:06mirakdionoea: not sure it's easier for xvid, because aren't the blocks moved ?
20:35:09 Quit muesli__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:35:14amiconn(from what I saw in various video players on restricted hardware)
20:35:23tucozdionoea, I do not have a asound.conf in that directory. Will this work anyway?
20:35:35dionoeatucoz: i think it will (i didn't have one either)
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20:35:37mirakfrom what I understood, the I frames only is equivalent to do mjpeg
20:35:42tucozdionoea, coool
20:35:45dionoeayeah, it's full frames
20:35:45amiconnMPEG1 and MPEG2 that is. I have no idea about MPEG4
20:35:54dionoeafull frames too in mpeg4
20:36:20mirakso you always decode all the blocks, but with P frames, blocks are moved, and conserved from one image to the other
20:36:27amiconnYeah. I mean related to what frame type is fastest to decode
20:36:35*tucoz reboots
20:36:38dionoeai'll ask people who might know
20:36:53 Part tucoz ("Leaving")
20:37:13dionoeamirak: btw, ffmpeg seems to have some ARM assembler. I don't know what codecs they use it for and what it's worth, but you might want to have a look
20:37:42mirakdionoea: yes, markun suggested that, but codecs are horrible to extract from ffmpeg
20:38:21mirakthere is to much depencies, to many things to strip
20:38:42dionoeaok, P frames should indeed be faster. (the issue being: if you decode only 2 frames per second ... you won't be decoding much P frames if you do frame skipping to keep it real time)
20:38:52mirakyou waste a lot of time keeping only what's needed for the codec
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20:39:19senabobo: are you here still?
20:39:27mirakdionoea: well I would happy if someone worked on the codec
20:39:30dionoeamirak: you might be able to keep some of the inner routines (like chroma conversions, block decoding, ...)
20:39:34mirakI did it because I had time
20:39:52senabobo: alrite mate, i'm just testing out your piezo driver, just one small thing i was hoping you could help me with
20:40:02mirakdionoea: arm optim will be usefull only for ipod
20:40:16dionoeaoh, h3x0 isn't using ARM ? :/
20:40:23obosenab: shoot
20:40:40mirakdionoea: no. I would have used ffmpeg otherwise :D
20:40:46dionoeahehe :)
20:40:52 Join tucoz [0] (n=martin@rockbox/developer/tucoz)
20:41:00senabobo: it's working nicely other than when a button is held, the piezo driver repeats too, is there anyway of disabling the piezo for button presses?
20:41:04dionoeatucoz: did it work ?
20:41:14tucozlet's see
20:41:20senabobo: so it's just works for scroll events
20:41:31 Join fraggsta [0] (
20:42:01senabobo: i've had a look at the code but i can't differentiate between scroll/button presses for button_beep events
20:42:14fraggstadoes anyone know if the USBOTG patches for the X5 were ever merged in? I can't find a clear answer searching the mailing list, and the patch doesn't really seem to work against current CVS
20:42:14tucozdionoea, flash and mplayer at the same time doesn't work
20:42:23dionoeaboth using alsa output ?
20:42:26tucoz(with sound)
20:42:26dionoeaor oss ?
20:42:29obosenab: yeah, I've noticed that too. I'll have to do a bit of digging - freqmod extended my very basic driver so it actually did something :)
20:42:30tucozno idea
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20:42:54dionoeai don't think that you can have more than one app using the oss emulation at once
20:42:56tucozdionoea, mplayer uses oss
20:43:00senabsenab: his patch doesn't seem to work for me
20:43:10dionoeamplayer should be able to use alsa
20:43:15obosenab: although I'm not sure if that section of code is going to be changing soon or not - there is a large button patch on the horizon
20:43:18tucozOk. I'll try that
20:43:19*dionoea doesn't use mplayer ... VLC rules :)
20:43:29senabobo: ahhh ok
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20:45:15obosenab: I'll have a bit of a play anyway, I'll let you know if I fix that
20:47:08fraggstaIf I can see something in the CVS commits, but it's marked as "Patch", does that mean the patch was integrated committed into rockbox CVS, or just that they're acknowleding that the patch exists?
20:47:50senabobo: just saw in button.c there's a section regarding button_repeat with a beep(1) in the method, i'll try changing it
20:47:50dionoeacommitted into rockbox
20:51:33fraggstaholy crap, most of what I used to patch in has now been committed to CVS :O
20:51:57 Quit mikearthur ("Konversation terminated!")
20:52:00tucozdionoea, it works now. I needed to edit someting in /etc/firefox/ to get flash working
20:52:13fraggstaJust the audioscrobbler plugin now. I loves me some audioscrobbler.
20:52:27tucoza new experience. Two sound sources at the same time
20:52:37dionoeatucoz: might i ask what that is ? (i don't think that my flash uses alsa)
20:53:20fraggstaDoes anyone else here have sound sync issues with flash? It's been driving me insane for literally years on multiple machines? (different motherboards, soundcards..)
20:53:43tucozI edited /etc/firefox/firefoxrc and changed the FIREFOX_DSP ="none" to FIREFOX_DSP="aoss"
20:53:55fraggstaI'm beginning to think Macromedia just hate Linux..
20:54:03tucozbut I needed the alsa-oss package as well.
20:54:04dionoeatucoz: neat :)
20:54:17dionoeacan it use alsa ? instead of aoss ?
20:54:59tucozthe flash player uses oss, so that is a wrapper for alsa around oss
20:55:12dionoeasounds logical
20:59:12tucozdionoea, and now I confirmed that your conf file works as well. I am running two mplayers with sound at the same time. Hats off
20:59:46dionoeayou should run two VLCs instead
21:00:22tucozI like the command-line nature of mplayer, as I often browse with the shell
21:00:32*dionoea 's still fixing solitaire .... indentation is broken like hell
21:00:47dionoeatucoz: you can use VLC command line too (i always use it command line or with ncurses)
21:01:01tucozoh, really. that sounds cool
21:01:31 Quit senab (" HydraIRC -> <- Leading Edge IRC")
21:01:39fraggstaI used to think XINE was the best video player. Now I'm not sure what to think any more :(
21:02:12dionoeaVLC definitively is the best media player i know :) </parrot>
21:02:30 Join mikearthur [0] (
21:03:08fraggstaI haven't dabbled extensively with VLC but I have found stuff that it wouldn't play (Using Ubuntu binary packages so who knows what compile time options they used, caveat empor, YMMV, etc)
21:03:18fraggstathat mplayer would
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21:04:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:04:12dionoeawell VLC doesn't load binary codecs like mplayer. You can load dmo codecs (wma/wmv) if you compile it yourself, nothing about real media yet
21:04:27dionoeaso that kind of sucks if you have anime mkv's with real video
21:05:00fraggstaI've completely given up on Real stuff. If it's in that format, I'm not watching it.
21:05:10dionoeawmv3 decoding now is native in ffmpeg
21:05:19dionoeaso the only thing we'll really be missing is wma3
21:05:26tucozwell now I have vlc running at the same time as mplaye with a flash running in firefox :)
21:05:33tucozall with sound.
21:05:36fraggstaI think I found a few weird container/codec combinations VLC didn't seem to like though I can't remember what they were..
21:05:44Mikachutucoz: complaining on irc is so rewarding
21:06:21tucozMikachu, yeah. hehe. I completely changed my mind. Linux and sound do go hand in hand
21:06:59fraggstaalso, what the hell is up with pressing "f" for fullscreen but having to press "escape" to get back out of it in VLC? Hello there, counter-intuitive UI design!
21:07:09dionoeaf works here to get out
21:07:11dionoealet me check
21:08:34dionoeahotkeys don't always work when you're using the wxwidgets interface though (that's why we're rewriting that in Qt)
21:08:50dionoeawell ... that's one of the reasons at least
21:09:29tucozdionoea, we're? so you're an insider, eh?
21:09:38dionoeayeah :)
21:09:45fraggstayup, it's the wx frontend (oh wxwidgets, who would love you?)
21:10:08dionoeatry vlc -I skins2 and it should work kind of better (or svlc)
21:10:13 Join Astronaut [0] (i=astroscu@
21:10:32dionoea(the skins2 interface also has its bugs ...)
21:10:34fraggstaa Mac clone! :(
21:10:44dionoeaoh, you're using an old VLC then
21:10:49dionoeawe changed the default skin in 0.8.5
21:11:21fraggstacomplain at whoever packages it for Ubuntu, it's their fault
21:11:36dionoea has newer ubuntu packages
21:11:52dionoeabut i don't know how well they'll work :p
21:12:50fraggstaupgrading now..or am I waiting for some awfully slow mirrors to update..
21:12:57fraggsta(not yours)
21:13:44fraggstanope, skins2 still looks like a mac clone. CLONE!
21:13:53dionoeawhat ubuntu version are you using ?
21:13:55dionoeadraper ?
21:14:09dionoea(or whatever it's called)
21:14:30dionoeawell the ubuntu builds are broken i guess :)
21:14:34fraggstaI like it except for their annoying decision to freeze the versions of all their packages
21:14:54dionoeawould you like debian better ? :)
21:14:56fraggstanah, when they have a stable release they stop doing anything to packages other than bugfixing them installation guide for the iAudio X5 on coming soon or do I have to guess?
21:15:26fraggstaI *was* using debian unstable, except every now and then something would break and Debian would kill my dog, rape my wife, etc..
21:15:32dionoeahum ... the ubuntu builds are indeed a bit old
21:15:58 Quit obo ("bye")
21:16:24fraggstaI remember the breaking point was when they decided to change the X keymaps. Their changes didn't work, which resulted in no-one being able to actually type anything in X.
21:16:28 Join dsh-1 [0] (
21:17:10 Quit mikearthur ("Konversation terminated!")
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21:18:40fraggstaI think the other reasons I switched was because debian ummed and aahhed so much about switching to X.Org for ages. Also, up until the point I switched, they *still* hadn't managed to get HAL to work properly.
21:18:46 Join obo [0] (
21:19:24dionoeafraggsta: hehe
21:19:49fraggstano seriously, you'd plug in a USB mass storage device and...nothing
21:20:21Mikachuthat's what's supposed to happen
21:20:27tucozAstronaut, no installation guide? have you looked in the wiki?
21:20:48fraggstalet's compare and contrast this to Ubuntu, which adopted X.Org nice and early, so I get to keep being leet - and HAL actually worked! I plug in my camera, and it appears on the desktop and says "lol this device contains photos, want to import them?" (may not be exact wording)
21:21:25tucozAstronaut, have you checked this page?
21:21:47Astronauttucoz: yes, I saw that one
21:22:04Astronautdidn't load :\
21:22:09tucozAstronaut, after that, download the latest daily from and unzip that to the root of your player
21:22:16fraggstaIt has probably moved on a little since then. I really like Debian, having an actual constitutionand all that is good. Trouble is the distro doesn't progress fast, because they're too busy arguing over political issues, having elections and bickering.
21:22:37tucozAstronaut, I do not have an x5 myself. But, what went wrong?
21:22:53fraggstaand I'm sure as fuck not going run an RPM based distro or Gentoo (oh, I went there!)
21:23:07Astronautjust unzip to root? I'll try that
21:23:31tucozAstronaut, yes. That will install the files needed to get rockbox running, as long as the bootloader is in place
21:23:49Astronautsounds good
21:24:03Astronautno problem to revert to original firmware
21:24:05tucozinstalling gentoo is one of the most painful experiences in my life (not really, but close)
21:24:06Astronaut, right?
21:24:29tucozAstronaut, no. Just follow the steps on the IaudioBoot page
21:24:56tucozand after that delete the rockbox.iaudio file and the the .rockbox folder
21:25:37Astronautit was the last step of the install guide that wasn't 100% clear to me: "Proceed with installing the X5 version of Rockbox from the daily build page."
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21:26:21tucozAstronaut, I can agree with you on that. We are working on getting the manual complete with instructions like that
21:31:02Astronauttucoz: hmm...I've got the binary in the firmware folder and the .rockbox-folder and rockbox.iaudio on the root. Still booting the old firmware, though
21:31:09 Quit xmixahlx ("blah blah blah")
21:31:27tucozAnd you did follow the instructions at IaudioBoot?
21:31:40 Quit rconan (Client Quit)
21:31:50tucozlike, insert the charger etc.
21:31:53Astronautpretty sure I did..
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21:32:12Astronautwait, I should ask straight away:
21:32:48Astronautyou've got two versions of the bootloader, x5 and x5v... never heard of the x5v anywhere else...
21:34:08Astronauttucoz: ah, got it
21:34:14tucozok. It works now?
21:34:22Astronautlooks like it
21:34:50Astronautproblem was with "Turn the X5 off and insert the charger.", I still had the USB connected
21:34:57tucozcool. You should download the fontpackage as well. You'll find that on the daily build page
21:35:20Astronautgreat, looking forward to playing a bit with this
21:35:31Astronautthanks a lot, you've been most helpful :)
21:35:34tucozI think you just unzip that to the root of the player. The fonts should go in ./rockbox/fonts (or something like that)
21:35:38tucozAstronaut, no problem
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22:11:22axdoes anyone know if it is possible to have the "album" list after you select artist have the <all tracks> or whatever item at the bottom not the top?
22:11:43axI generally don't want to play all tracks by the artist, i like to listen by album so I always skip that
22:12:13Mikachui think you can edit the tagnavi.conf file to set stuff like that
22:12:28axalso, is it possible to order tracks in the all tracks by album,number rather than alphabetically?
22:12:33axokay, i'll look at that
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22:39:20pondlifeHi guys, I've updated patch #5690 so it only affects SWCODEC configurations.
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22:40:30 Quit webguest45 (Client Quit)
22:40:39pondlifeTried using/abusing talk_buffer_steal to force stuff to resync, but couldn't get it to work without causing problems in playback or apparently upsetting tagcache.
22:41:04pondlifeSo decided to put in the fixed thumbnail buffer for SWCODEC only.
22:41:30 Quit _FireFly_ ("Leaving")
22:44:11pondlifeHave tested on H300/H300 sim - crash is fixed. Have only checked that Archos Recorder sim builds.
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22:44:43pondlifeMaybe worth a check if your V2 has finished charging...
22:44:59pondlife...and you've nothing better to do!
22:45:55LinusNpondlife: what happens if you try to allocate a thumbnail buffer when audio is playing?
22:46:08pondlifeIt won't do that
22:46:26LinusNwhy not?
22:46:38pondlifeAh, it won't under MASCODEC
22:46:48LinusNsorry, i meant swcodec
22:47:28pondlifeI'll see if I can try that... it will attempt to...! (and updates audiobuf)
22:47:44LinusNkaboom :-)
22:48:02LinusNthis got me thinking a little
22:48:10pondlifeI could just allocate the buf upfront?
22:48:23pondlifeRather than trying to be clever
22:48:27pondlifeand failing
22:48:35LinusNi'm not normally that promiscuous with memory usage, but it feels simpler to just allocate the damn thing regardless
22:48:55LinusNi mean the swcodec platforms have plenty of ram anyway
22:50:20pondlifeDo you think amiconn will agree with this strategy?
22:50:56LinusNbut if you use buffer_alloc() for the allocating, we can solve this in a better way later on
22:51:06pondlifeI want to use buffer_alloc, but I need alignment
22:51:15pondlifeSo that's a pre-requisite for you!
22:51:19LinusNyou didn't see my commit today?
22:51:24pondlifeAh, no
22:51:28pondlifeThanks ;-)
22:51:40*amiconn doesn't have anything against a static talk clip buffer on swcodec - if that makes talk clips during playback work
22:52:03LinusNpondlife: ehum, i don't see it either
22:52:16LinusNf*ck, something went wrong
22:52:18pondlifeNope, front page isn't updating in August
22:52:23pondlifeMaybe it went on holiday?
22:52:32peturthe 'since 2.5' page is ok
22:53:24pondlifeI thought it had been quiet today.
22:53:46pondlifeLinusN: OK, I'll use buffer_alloc... here goes #5690v3
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23:02:45 Quit Bger ("nite")
23:04:05***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:08:03*jaczehack running his first homebuilt rockbox
23:13:30pondlifeOK, take 3 is at - along with a seperate patch to enable .talk clips during playback (on SWCODEC). Seems to work fine here. Please test on Archos, somebody!
23:15:54LinusNi guess the separate patch would need some #ifdefs for the hwcodec targets, right?
23:16:11pondlifeShouldn't do, as talk_file already has that test in it
23:16:15 Quit Rick (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer))
23:16:46pondlifeOK, so they'll waste a bit of time (and maybe spinup) checking for file existenct, so you're probably right
23:18:34pondlifeI'm not overly happy at introducing more #if CONFIG_CODEC tests as it is.
23:19:00LinusNnone of us are
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23:19:23pondlifeActually, I'm not sure that tree.c needs to check for file existence.
23:19:46pondlifeAh - it's so it can fall back to spelling
23:20:01pondlifeor number or whatever
23:21:06pondlifeDoes anything in Rockbox cache the current directory?
23:21:19pondlifei.e. to avoid spin-up on simple file exist checks
23:21:46pondlifeSmart guy, huh?
23:21:50pondlifeYou got me!
23:21:55Mikachusorry, won't do it again
23:22:07BagderLinusN: you remember why -DTARGET_TREE is in GCCOPTS and not EXTRA_DEFINES ?
23:22:48LinusNnot really
23:22:53Bagderperhaps even moved to the config-*.h file...
23:23:07Bagderthing is, as it is now we can check for it in SOURCES
23:23:11Bagdercan not
23:23:57Bagderand me wanting to add more targets that are target_tree now face this
23:24:21LinusN#ifdef TARGET_TREE in SOURCES?
23:24:33Bagdersee firmware/SOURCES
23:24:37Bagderit currently checks for X5
23:24:50LinusNyes it does
23:25:04Bagderwhich seems wrong
23:25:21Bagderdrivers/power.c for example
23:25:30Bagderis provided by the target_tree for x5
23:25:53Bagderand I'd guess for all target_tree targets
23:26:17LinusNso you want #ifndef TARGET_TREE there?
23:26:54LinusNfair enough, until all targets are ported to the target tree
23:27:27LinusNjust check that EXTRA_DEFINES are used everywhere
23:27:42BagderI'll try defining TARGET_TREE in config-e200.h
23:28:13pondlifeLinusN: I've put a check in the tree patch to allow .talk clips during playback, so as to save spinups on Archos.
23:28:27pondlifeI think that's me done for tonight
23:28:58 Quit pondlife ("Nighty-night")
23:30:29Bagderfirst target without ATA I guess
23:31:39Bagderwell, ata_mmc counts as ATA here ;-)
23:31:39amiconnFirst target in target tree without ata, yes. But not the first target without ata
23:31:59amiconnthere's also ata_flash (iFP7xx)
23:32:26amiconnAnd MMC is quite different from ATA
23:32:41BagderI should possibly try to use the ata_flash approach in the future
23:32:46amiconnata_mmc() just implements the ata.c api, as does ata_flash()
23:36:31LinusNSlasheri: could you try to use buffer_alloc for the dir/tagcache?
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23:42:02fraggstaI like working echelon wordlists into my MSN conversations, just to unnerve my friends a bit ;)
23:43:36 Join Astro [0] (i=astroscu@
23:43:46fraggstahopefully somewhere a cluster is trying to work out what the hell I was on about..
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23:45:02BuckfastHi all
23:45:09*dan_a is trying to get his head around running threads on different processors
23:45:54fraggstaisn't synchronisation going to be a nightmare with that kind of thing? (it's bad enough with just one)
23:45:59 Part Buckfast
23:47:05dan_afraggsta: I'm not sure yet. I figure that the best way to find out is to play with it though
23:47:41fraggstaas with so many things in life..
23:48:05 Quit midkay ("Leaving")
23:48:57dan_a(By the way, does anyone have any comments on ?)
23:49:30fraggstaother than "pfft iPods"?
23:50:50markundan_a: the COP can only run as fast as the main CPU or slower right?
23:51:22dan_amarkun: So I believe. I don't know how to change its speed at all
23:53:13 Quit Febs ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:53:57 Part jaczehack
23:54:55Bagderbarrywardell: I'm having parts of your h10 work in my sansa work now
23:55:09barrywardellthat's good to hear
23:55:24Bagderhopefully to commit within a day or two
23:55:26barrywardellhopefully I went about it right
23:55:48barrywardelli updated it today to get the simulator to build
23:55:55Bagderbarrywardell: I've focused on the sansa stuff but I've tried to incorporate some of your stuff too to reduce the risk of major collisions
23:56:25amiconnyeehah! Working gamma correction for the grayscale lib :)
23:56:35markunamiconn: nice job!
23:56:36barrywardelli look forward to seeing it. i will try and adapt my stuff to your updates
23:56:38LinusNamiconn: wee
23:56:45amiconnBut the archos lcd is slightly too dark - need to measure natural gamma again
23:56:55markunamiconn: almost ready for commit?
23:57:03amiconnH1x0 is really nice now
23:57:31barrywardellBagder: how is the Sansa work coming along? any more progress?
23:57:47 Join Rick [0] (
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23:57:51Bagderslow, I've been busy with work and stuff
23:58:07BagderMrH has done more research I need to test
23:58:19Bagderso I want to get a build I can use for easier experimenting
23:58:51barrywardellhopefully that will go better for you than it did for me. I still can't figure out where I went wrong

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