| 00:00:10 | Davide-NYC | I disagree, I'd presume that over 90% of all users record with equal amount of gain |
| 00:00:15 | petur | rasher.dk/rockbox/people/">http://rasher.dk/rockbox/people/ |
| 00:00:24 | BHSPitMonkey | petur, I know... |
| 00:00:27 | | Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@host-194-46-233-207.dsl-ie.utvinternet.net) |
| 00:01:17 | * | linuxstb thinks rasher's map is confusing when made full-screen and you see two Australias... |
| 00:01:33 | | Quit Kohlrabi ("Quit") |
| 00:01:46 | petur | Davide-NYC:well all proposals for the WRS are welcome but yours I don't like very much. just my personal taste. sorry |
| 00:01:58 | * | Paul_The_Nerd is all by his lonesome on that map too, sorta. |
| 00:03:14 | * | petur feels sorry for mat, living in the sea in front of Belgium |
| 00:03:20 | COmputoman | Hey petur, can i Pm you? |
| 00:03:22 | Davide-NYC | Petur: No offense taken, I'm just trying to get the WRS and the RWRS plus all of the remotes to be syncronized |
| 00:03:27 | Mikachu | linuxstb: haha |
| 00:03:49 | petur | COmputoman: try it... |
| 00:04:00 | petur | but I'm off to bed soon |
| 00:04:06 | Mikachu | linuxstb: try the minimum zoom |
| 00:04:07 | | Join Sinbios [0] (n=Sinbios@HSE-Hamilton-ppp3513671.sympatico.ca) |
| 00:04:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | petur: I was vary careful with the positioning of my cursor. Someone could very nearly locate where I live with it. |
| 00:04:31 | * | Paul_The_Nerd wonders if that person perhaps lives in an aquatic environment. |
| 00:05:00 | petur | he was probably on a ferry when he registered :) |
| 00:05:04 | Mikachu | you can knock on the door with mine |
| 00:05:50 | * | petur discovers he lives in the middle of a river |
| 00:05:53 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: It sounds overcomplicated to me, just for the sake of removing one line. |
| 00:05:56 | Davide-NYC | I just added myself to that crazy map thing |
| 00:06:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | Mikachu: You could, but I'm in an apartment complex so there's about a 1 in 8 chance you'd get the right door. |
| 00:06:16 | Mikachu | heh |
| 00:06:19 | linuxstb | Mikachu: Aaaahhh! 5 Australias... |
| 00:06:29 | Mikachu | linuxstb: only the australias bother you? :D |
| 00:06:38 | | Quit pi ("Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com") |
| 00:06:39 | Paul_The_Nerd | Actually, a 1 in 2 chance if you're trusting in that I put the pin right where I'm sitting in my living room. |
| 00:06:42 | Davide-NYC | Paul_The_Nerd: But imagine the benefit on the remote! |
| 00:06:51 | | Join xilef [0] (n=xilef@lak-63-210.wohnheime.ruhr-uni-bochum.de) |
| 00:06:57 | Mikachu | heh, the map uses native names for everything, confusing |
| 00:07:06 | Mikachu | Magyarország |
| 00:07:11 | | Join pi [0] (n=pi@80-41-223-160.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 00:07:26 | | Part pi |
| 00:07:26 | scorche | meh....i put mine on the same hill i live in...i am the paranoid type sometimes |
| 00:07:34 | Mikachu | good luck finding anything in greece :( |
| 00:08:03 | Mikachu | at least i know the kanji for tokyo |
| 00:08:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: In what _legal_ cases is the remote screen the only screen you have available while recording? |
| 00:08:40 | Davide-NYC | Uh oh. If you're really introducing that line of logic then I'm sunk. |
| 00:08:48 | Davide-NYC | No wait! |
| 00:09:01 | Davide-NYC | Paul_The_Nerd: If you main unit LCD is broken. |
| 00:09:06 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:09:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | I'm just saying that the Remote, while nice, shouldn't be a reason to introduce a function that makes non-remote use more complicated. |
| 00:09:10 | _hotwire_ | meanwhile some people are googling to figure out what magyarorszag is... I already know |
| 00:09:22 | Mikachu | :) |
| 00:09:24 | Mikachu | <- half hungarian |
| 00:09:26 | petur | Paul_The_Nerd:stealth recording |
| 00:09:33 | _hotwire_ | <- little over half hungarian |
| 00:09:39 | Paul_The_Nerd | scorche: I'm secure in knowing that most people looking at that map probably wouldn't ever want to set foot in Texas, let alone cross to the center. |
| 00:09:40 | Mikachu | i don't speak hungarian though |
| 00:09:43 | | Join lukaswayne9 [0] (n=lukas@c-68-84-69-12.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 00:09:54 | _hotwire_ | neither do i... well... i can count, curse, and say thank you |
| 00:09:54 | petur | for small screens it should just scroll |
| 00:10:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | petur: I agree, scrolling is good. |
| 00:10:13 | _hotwire_ | although i have a certain like for tokaji aszu wine... |
| 00:10:33 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp137-203.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 00:10:35 | * | petur falls asleep... |
| 00:10:40 | Davide-NYC | good night |
| 00:10:40 | | Quit petur ("Zzzzz") |
| 00:11:01 | * | Davide-NYC still thinks it's a god idea. |
| 00:11:09 | * | Davide-NYC *good idea |
| 00:11:09 | amiconn | Paul_The_Nerd: Actually, much scrolling in the recording screen might be bad |
| 00:11:19 | Davide-NYC | yay! |
| 00:11:43 | scorche | Paul_The_Nerd: i just dont like the fact that eventually it will be on google, so that they can type either my handle or my full name and see a map leading right to my house |
| 00:11:43 | * | amiconn remembers the iriver remote ticking problem |
| 00:12:00 | Davide-NYC | amiconn: there is a solution to that problem. |
| 00:12:11 | | Quit xilef ("leaving") |
| 00:12:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Right, ticking while recording is bad. Forgot about that. |
| 00:12:30 | amiconn | The ticking can be reduced, but not avoided |
| 00:12:32 | Davide-NYC | Mmmm devise a keypress that de-activates the RLCD while recording. |
| 00:12:41 | Paul_The_Nerd | That's been done. ;) |
| 00:12:44 | Davide-NYC | Which eliminates the ticking. It's in CVS |
| 00:12:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | But the problem is, that doesn't help while you're trying to change settings on a remote. |
| 00:13:35 | Davide-NYC | sure, but in my usage the only reason to mess with settings during recording is in the case of clipping, in which case the recording is borked anyhoo. |
| 00:13:50 | Davide-NYC | Dig? :-) |
| 00:14:00 | Paul_The_Nerd | Why not just have a line that says "Gain: L XXdb / R XXdb" and that line acts like three lines (press down onto it, and you select both, press down again, you select L, press down again R, press down a final time, on to the next?) |
| 00:14:31 | Paul_The_Nerd | Instead of doing a splitting thing when you want to set individual ones? |
| 00:14:31 | Davide-NYC | Hmm, that's not a bad idea, how would you indicate what is selected? |
| 00:14:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | Capitalize and lowercase the L and R |
| 00:14:53 | Paul_The_Nerd | L R = both, L r = Left, l R = right |
| 00:14:57 | Davide-NYC | IMO not obvious enough to the new user |
| 00:15:10 | Davide-NYC | But I'd be very happy with that |
| 00:15:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | (L) R, L (R), and (L) (R) ? |
| 00:15:34 | amiconn | Paul_The_Nerd: That line is too long |
| 00:15:48 | amiconn | ..at least on archos and on iriver remote |
| 00:15:58 | A_M | bluebrother: You there? Can you check on target whether the 1px left margin is always there or just when the scrollbar is visible? |
| 00:16:01 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Show the word "Gain:" and then when the line is highlighted swap it for the values? |
| 00:16:04 | Davide-NYC | Also, I think SELECT should be what changes the selected state, not UP/DOWN |
| 00:16:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: I'm fine with different button mappings. I'm just trying to come up with alternate ideas in general. :) |
| 00:16:33 | Davide-NYC | yup, I'm with you |
| 00:16:38 | bluebrother | A_M, it's always there. |
| 00:16:43 | Davide-NYC | I really like your idea |
| 00:16:56 | Davide-NYC | It accomplishes the same thing (screen real estate) and is more elegant |
| 00:17:23 | Davide-NYC | what chars are used to indicate what is selected is easy to change |
| 00:17:29 | bluebrother | when the scrollbar is visible there is also an additional 1px between the scrollbar and the selector (which should be there) |
| 00:17:29 | Davide-NYC | :-) |
| 00:17:30 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 00:17:38 | | Part barrywardell |
| 00:18:01 | A_M | bluebrother: hmm... why can't I see it in the simulator? :-/ |
| 00:18:07 | LinusN | Davide-NYC, Paul_The_Nerd: just keep in mind that the strings will be translated |
| 00:18:27 | Davide-NYC | How long does the word Gain get? |
| 00:18:30 | Mikachu | i like how all windows programs are hardcoded to a specific font and size |
| 00:18:32 | Davide-NYC | :-P |
| 00:18:38 | Paul_The_Nerd | LinusN: Well, in the case of capitalizing the L and R, there is indeed a danger of languages that have left and right start with the same letter. |
| 00:18:38 | Mikachu | Davide-NYC: Förstärkning in swedish |
| 00:18:48 | LinusN | and that Left and Right might not be abbreviated with a single letter in all languages |
| 00:18:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | We have < and > though |
| 00:19:05 | Davide-NYC | (yay) |
| 00:19:09 | Paul_The_Nerd | We could have <, > and _ for unselected. |
| 00:19:19 | Mikachu | >_< |
| 00:19:22 | Mikachu | sorry :) |
| 00:19:24 | Paul_The_Nerd | Hehehe |
| 00:19:27 | bluebrother | A_M, hmm, maybe it's related to the font? |
| 00:19:31 | Davide-NYC | or [<] [>] and [-] |
| 00:19:44 | Paul_The_Nerd | And then you just have to worry about the size of the word "Gain" in other languages. |
| 00:19:59 | LinusN | sounds fair |
| 00:20:01 | Davide-NYC | no wait, that's not true |
| 00:20:13 | Mikachu | does < mean left or right? |
| 00:20:17 | Paul_The_Nerd | Left |
| 00:20:28 | pixelma | Mikachu: förstärkning is already a bit too long on Archos screens (dB) is cut off then |
| 00:20:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | It'll be on the left side, and pointing left, so hopefully that will be enough |
| 00:20:32 | Mikachu | i know it looks like an arrow to the left, but it also looks like a speaker to the right |
| 00:20:49 | Davide-NYC | We also have to display the values |
| 00:21:00 | LinusN | one could always try using some kind of icons |
| 00:21:00 | Paul_The_Nerd | You'll have [<] -20.4db | [>] 36.4db |
| 00:21:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | Icons could work. |
| 00:21:16 | Paul_The_Nerd | Actual arrows. |
| 00:21:35 | | Quit mkey (Connection timed out) |
| 00:21:38 | Mikachu | or you could just show L and R anyway |
| 00:21:54 | Mikachu | aren't headphones all over the world labeled L and R? |
| 00:21:59 | Davide-NYC | [<] -20.4db | [>] 36.4db, < -20.4db | [>] 36.4db and [<] -20.4db | > 36.4db |
| 00:22:05 | Mikachu | i've never seen V and H in sweden... |
| 00:22:16 | Davide-NYC | the mighty VH never toured in sweden |
| 00:22:20 | Davide-NYC | (sorry) |
| 00:22:48 | Davide-NYC | I'm getting confused with all of the brackets etc. |
| 00:22:56 | bluebrother | A_M, I have the effect with the nedore fonts but not nimbus. |
| 00:23:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: That looks good to me, at least. That was "Both" "Right" and "Left" correct? |
| 00:23:14 | Davide-NYC | Paul_The_Nerd: would you be willing to write up your idea and post it to the forum as I did. |
| 00:23:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: Where's your post again? |
| 00:23:51 | * | Paul_The_Nerd can never remember what forums posts are hiding in, or under what names |
| 00:23:52 | Davide-NYC | The line with all of the gobbledyguk was all three possibilities iterated sequencially |
| 00:24:02 | Davide-NYC | http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=5882.0 |
| 00:24:03 | A_M | bluebrother: Yeah, I've tried some different fonts as well and it appears some fonts have the margin, others don't. Kind of a PITA... :-S |
| 00:24:12 | | Quit ender` (" Pets are better than kids because: 11. If they get pregnant, you can sell their children.") |
| 00:24:27 | LinusN | gotta go to bed |
| 00:24:28 | Davide-NYC | petur just made a strange noise and left me to query him in IRC> |
| 00:24:33 | LinusN | cu around folx |
| 00:24:39 | Davide-NYC | 'night |
| 00:24:40 | | Part LinusN |
| 00:24:54 | bluebrother | so I guess there is the option blaming the affected fonts and live with it or simply add an additional 1px line on the right (no idea how hard this would be) |
| 00:25:16 | | Nick excitatory_ is now known as excitatory (n=excitato@CPE-70-94-13-227.wi.res.rr.com) |
| 00:25:36 | bluebrother | anyway, on larger displays I think the menu becomes way better with the multi-line settings. |
| 00:27:40 | * | Paul_The_Nerd definitely likes that two-line entry menu patch thingy |
| 00:27:52 | | Join mkey [0] (n=mkey@pD9E3532A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:28:01 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@AAubervilliers-152-1-38-164.w83-114.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 00:28:03 | * | A_M is happy it's appreciated |
| 00:28:46 | mirak | bonsoir |
| 00:28:51 | A_M | Adding the extra 1px to the right shouldn't be hard at all, but then there'd sometimes be a two pixel margin there. I really don't know what I'd prefer, and I seriously doubt I could code it to check whether the margin is inherit within the font or not. |
| 00:30:32 | Paul_The_Nerd | I think 1 or 2 looks better than 0 or 1 |
| 00:30:41 | Paul_The_Nerd | Mentally, at least. I'm just imagining it. |
| 00:30:52 | | Quit tommeyer ("Never put off till tomorrow, what you can do the day after tomorrow") |
| 00:30:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | It's just that when the text touches the edge of the screen, it gives the impression of it already being off the screen |
| 00:31:34 | | Join hotwire__ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 00:31:34 | bluebrother | I tried unifont, and as it's pretty big (at least on h100) the 1px that font has looks a bit ... tiny, so 2px won't hurt. |
| 00:31:34 | | Quit mirak (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:31:51 | | Quit matsl (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:31:55 | Davide-NYC | Paul_The_Nerd: Better = Gain: [<] -20.4db | 36.4db [>] |
| 00:32:22 | Davide-NYC | poutting the 'arrow' char all the way on the outside of the line. |
| 00:32:26 | Davide-NYC | *putting |
| 00:32:36 | A_M | aesthetically I agree with you guys, but as a coder it feels sorta ... ugly ... to just add an extra pixel there. it feels so damn... ad hoc. ... |
| 00:32:47 | | Quit _hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:32:52 | * | A_M cringes |
| 00:33:24 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@AAubervilliers-152-1-38-164.w83-114.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 00:33:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | A_M: It only feels bad because the fonts are inconsistent |
| 00:35:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | Davide-NYC: I agree that does look a little better. |
| 00:35:26 | | Quit lukaswayne9 ("Ex-Chat") |
| 00:35:31 | pixelma | Paul_The_Nerd: Davide-NYC: these lines are too long for Archos screens... for example as it is the WRS shows "Gain: 30.0 dB" - this already needs two thirds of the screen width (and in almost all other languages the word for "Gain" is longer) |
| 00:35:38 | Davide-NYC | http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=5882.msg45584#msg45584 |
| 00:35:56 | A_M | hehe, anyone familiar enough with font code to create a function that checks for empty pixel columns to the right of characters? |
| 00:36:23 | Davide-NYC | What is the shortest line length? |
| 00:37:19 | pixelma | do you mean how many chars would fit? |
| 00:37:26 | Davide-NYC | yes |
| 00:37:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | Would it be theoretically possible to just scroll the line to the right, when highlighted? |
| 00:37:35 | Davide-NYC | using system font (of course) |
| 00:38:16 | Davide-NYC | "Gain: [<] -20.4db | 36.4db [>]" <−− That doesn;t fit? Really? |
| 00:38:19 | pixelma | I think it's 18 |
| 00:38:27 | Paul_The_Nerd | So you get "Gain: [<] 37.2 | 26.4 " minus wherever it's cut off, and when highlighted you'd have something like "n: [< 37.2 |
| 00:38:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | errr |
| 00:38:31 | A_M | Paul_The_Nerd: yeah, I'd like that aswell. but I'm not familiar with the scrolling code at all |
| 00:38:47 | Paul_The_Nerd | "n: [<] 37.2 | 26.4 [>]" |
| 00:39:19 | Paul_The_Nerd | As long as the numbers will fit on the screen on every target, that solution would work. |
| 00:39:40 | Davide-NYC | Haha −−> [<]-20.4|36.4[>] is 17 chars |
| 00:39:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | And one more - sign |
| 00:39:52 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, 18 even |
| 00:39:55 | Davide-NYC | haha |
| 00:39:57 | Davide-NYC | right |
| 00:40:02 | Davide-NYC | [<]-20.4|-36.4[>] |
| 00:40:04 | A_M | Paul_The_Nerd: the scrolling code seems scattered about several different lcd*.c files, different implementations for differend targets. |
| 00:40:28 | pixelma | ok |
| 00:41:03 | Davide-NYC | Can it be conditional? Dependig on target? |
| 00:41:08 | Davide-NYC | *depending |
| 00:41:48 | bluebrother | A_M, got to go now. I'm offline this weekend but I'll try the next versions again when back ;-) |
| 00:42:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | In that case, the [ and ] characters should be replaced with spaces when unhlighted on charcells screens, so the text doesn't move around. |
| 00:42:36 | Paul_The_Nerd | Or un-selected, rather. So when just left gain is chosen, the right one is space, bracket, space |
| 00:42:47 | Paul_The_Nerd | Or space, less than, space, rather |
| 00:42:58 | Davide-NYC | Absolutley |
| 00:43:16 | * | amiconn wonders why no one suggested actual icons for [<] and [>] yet |
| 00:43:24 | linuxstb | Paul_The_Nerd: The only charcells screen we have is the player - no recording screen. |
| 00:43:28 | amiconn | They're smaller than wasting three characters... |
| 00:43:47 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:43:52 | * | Davide-NYC Presumed this would be easier to code. |
| 00:43:54 | | Quit bluebrother ("Leaving") |
| 00:44:09 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Icons are fine by me. I think LinusN suggested them earlier, and I said I'd be fine with that. |
| 00:44:15 | amiconn | The quickscreen uses icons, the pitchscreen uses icons... |
| 00:44:45 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: 1) It's bad to make the assumption that there will never again be a charcell target. 2) It'll look good with fixed width fonts too that way. |
| 00:44:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: But yeah, I forgot that the Player was just that... a player. |
| 00:45:06 | | Join lodesi [0] (n=lds@d02m-89-83-203-123.d4.club-internet.fr) |
| 00:45:31 | amiconn | The player also has icons (as special chars) |
| 00:46:07 | amiconn | Check how the player vkeyboard looks (in the sim) |
| 00:46:46 | linuxstb | Is the intention to keep using the system font in the recording screen? |
| 00:47:53 | amiconn | no |
| 00:48:06 | Davide-NYC | I think hte intention is to have other fonts as optional. |
| 00:48:17 | amiconn | All places should adapt to the ui font |
| 00:48:27 | Davide-NYC | ideally. |
| 00:48:43 | amiconn | (except debugging screen and stuff) |
| 00:48:50 | | Join timemob [0] (n=timemob@pp009362.brew.ne.jp) |
| 00:49:19 | timemob | lol guys what the heck is this |
| 00:49:35 | amiconn | Davide-NYC: It's pretty much a requirement. The sysfont is iso8859-1 only, so languages with non-latin scripts are only half-translations right now |
| 00:49:49 | Davide-NYC | understood |
| 00:49:49 | scorche | timemob: www.rockbox.org |
| 00:49:59 | timemob | when in 1track repeat mode pressing next track repeats same one! |
| 00:50:00 | Mikachu | i almost thought that said timecop |
| 00:50:44 | amiconn | timemob: Of course. Repeat one is, ahm, repeat one |
| 00:50:58 | Mikachu | still, i would expect pressing next to skip track and start repeating1 on that track |
| 00:51:02 | amiconn | You cannot skip out of that track because of the way repeat one works |
| 00:51:09 | timemob | im in my car trying to use rockbox |
| 00:51:17 | Mikachu | don't irc and drive |
| 00:51:22 | Davide-NYC | word |
| 00:51:23 | timemob | plz fix |
| 00:51:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | timemob: Saying "plz fix" is pretty much the worst way to get something changed, especially if someone tells you that it's working as intended at the moment. |
| 00:52:13 | Paul_The_Nerd | It helps to talk to people as if they were actually human beings, by using whole words and reading what they say to you in response. |
| 00:52:27 | Davide-NYC | guys, my intent is to try to unify the way RB works across the H1xx, the H3xx and all three available remotes for those units. |
| 00:52:29 | timemob | every player i ever seen can skip tracks in 1repeat |
| 00:53:14 | Davide-NYC | I intend to pickup an iRiver h320 with 'non-lcd' remote so that I can test all possible combos. |
| 00:53:17 | timemob | lol "as intended" |
| 00:53:29 | Paul_The_Nerd | timemob: Why is that funny? |
| 00:53:41 | timemob | dude |
| 00:53:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | Just because it's not what *you* expect doesn't mean it isn't how the person who wrote it intended it to work. |
| 00:54:08 | timemob | NO OTHER PLAYER does it |
| 00:54:23 | Paul_The_Nerd | No need to type in all caps. I can read lowercase letters just fine. |
| 00:54:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | No other players support SID, but we do and people aren't complaining about it. |
| 00:54:46 | timemob | mhm |
| 00:54:55 | Davide-NYC | Question: is there a document (maybe on the wiki) that describes all of the boundary conditions for all of the Rockbox capable targets? |
| 00:54:58 | scorche | and if every other player was not able to play mp3s, if we did, it would be wrong? |
| 00:55:05 | timemob | wow. |
| 00:55:05 | | Quit mkey (""Welcome to IRC; Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents!"") |
| 00:55:07 | Davide-NYC | especially in terms of display properties. |
| 00:55:34 | linuxstb | timemob: You're not the first to mention that behaviour. Search the feature requests and you'll find it there. But it needs somebody to do some work to fix it - that could be you. |
| 00:55:39 | Paul_The_Nerd | timemob: All I'm saying is that if you want something changed, it's a good idea to be polite, and think of constructive reasons why changing it is good, such as things that cannot be done the current way, rather than using the fact that other players do it as an argument. |
| 00:55:42 | | Join mkey [0] (n=mkey@pD9E3532A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:55:44 | timemob | you dont see the diff between a misfeature and feature? |
| 00:55:57 | * | Davide-NYC hopes his question isn't missed due to current opinion banter |
| 00:56:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | timemob: "Diff" is not a word. |
| 00:56:17 | * | amiconn points Davide-NYC towards http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DeviceChart |
| 00:56:26 | timemob | not being able to skip tracks in 1repeat is a bug |
| 00:56:40 | | Quit lodesi_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 00:56:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | timemob: It is not a bug simply because you don't like it. It's a bug if it's working differently than the code is expected to work. |
| 00:56:50 | Davide-NYC | amiconn: thank you very much |
| 00:56:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | The person who decides how the code is expected to work is the person who wrote it. |
| 00:57:33 | Paul_The_Nerd | A feature you don't like and think should change results in a "feature request" and for this one, one may already exist. There is an appropriate section of the website for such things to be checked. |
| 00:57:41 | amiconn | Actually rockbox' two playback engines (hwcodec for archos and swcodec for the newer targets) behave the same wrt "repeat 1" |
| 00:57:51 | Davide-NYC | One last question then I have to go eat dinner with the wife. Will ROckbox ever drop support of reall old targets? |
| 00:57:57 | timemob | i dont even know why i bother. youre so fucking full of it |
| 00:58:00 | | Quit timemob (Remote closed the connection) |
| 00:58:14 | * | scorche coughs |
| 00:58:24 | * | Davide-NYC scratches him head |
| 00:58:35 | Davide-NYC | Gotta go/. |
| 00:58:37 | Davide-NYC | later. |
| 00:58:42 | amiconn | Davide-NYC: As long as there are devs and some users, why should we drop them? |
| 00:58:51 | Davide-NYC | LCD size constraints? |
| 00:59:01 | Davide-NYC | You shouldn;t |
| 00:59:03 | amiconn | ??? |
| 00:59:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | I don't think it'll ever be actually _necessary_ to drop support. |
| 00:59:22 | amiconn | Rockbox should even work fine on targets with _no_ lcd |
| 00:59:28 | Davide-NYC | true |
| 00:59:34 | Davide-NYC | this is the best project ever. |
| 00:59:36 | amiconn | (although we don't have such target right now) |
| 00:59:38 | Davide-NYC | I gotta go |
| 00:59:43 | Davide-NYC | thanks again. |
| 00:59:48 | | Quit Davide-NYC ("Chatzilla 0.9.75 [Firefox 1.5.0.6/2006072814]") |
| 01:00 |
| 01:00:58 | Mikachu | wow i wonder if all japanese behave that way (dongs and timemob, if they are not the same person) :) |
| 01:02:12 | | Join _hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 01:02:53 | amiconn | Hmm, I wonder whether there'll be a target with oled display soon |
| 01:03:50 | Paul_The_Nerd | Mikachu: I would think it was the same person, but then, dongs is more well spoken, even if they acted similar |
| 01:04:34 | Mikachu | yeah, and this one sounded surprised at misfeatures but dongs should be accustomed to them by now :) |
| 01:05:04 | | Join fatherfork [0] (n=fatherfo@adsl-224-18-195.asm.bellsouth.net) |
| 01:06:30 | | Join TCK [0] (n=tckocr@bb-87-80-197-109.ukonline.co.uk) |
| 01:07:10 | Paul_The_Nerd | Mikachu: Not to mention I've told dongs the exact same thing I told this guy regarding the concept of "Working as intended" |
| 01:07:46 | Mikachu | i think in this case, it would still be desirable if next/prev actually skipped, but isn't possible with the current code |
| 01:08:56 | Paul_The_Nerd | I never said it was a bad idea, if you'll read my statements carefully. |
| 01:09:13 | Mikachu | too lazy :) |
| 01:10:59 | Paul_The_Nerd | My points were basically that he wasn't offering it up as a feature request, wasn't actually saying what the benefits of his method over the existing one were, and wasn't acting like the people here were human beings. |
| 01:11:27 | excitatory | just out of curiosity, what bit rate do you guys generally encode in? and also, what format? |
| 01:11:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | Depends entirely on the storage I have available. |
| 01:12:06 | | Quit mkey (""Welcome to IRC; Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents!"") |
| 01:12:10 | Galois | I use 48 or 64 kbit ogg |
| 01:12:26 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 01:12:28 | excitatory | yikes.. that would be horrible |
| 01:12:34 | Galois | it's not that bad!! |
| 01:13:07 | Mikachu | i use 100kbit ogg, just because <100 feels fundamentally wrong, i know it's really okay :) |
| 01:13:14 | Galois | in the old days people used walkmans with ungainly cassette tapes and put up with far worse |
| 01:13:20 | excitatory | heh, i was debating if i should delete my collection of 192 oggs (q6) and go for 256 (q8) |
| 01:13:31 | Paul_The_Nerd | Nah. |
| 01:13:44 | Galois | ogg is better than anything else at the low bitrates. Anyway I only do it because space is tight on the nano |
| 01:13:49 | Paul_The_Nerd | About ~160, it's almost definitely not worth the extra space unless you're definitely hearing an annoying difference. |
| 01:14:05 | Paul_The_Nerd | "Above ~160" rather |
| 01:14:22 | Galois | I assume (hope) you use aotuv ogg, right? Not the relatively crappy standard ogg encoder |
| 01:14:39 | excitatory | idk, i've been researching it all day, and things get pretty hairy below 256.. |
| 01:14:54 | Mikachu | Galois: i use aotuvb4.51_patch-libvorbis1.1.1.tar.gz.tgz, is that about the latest? |
| 01:15:02 | Paul_The_Nerd | excitatory: Can you hear a difference in a double blind test? |
| 01:15:20 | | Quit hotwire__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:15:25 | Galois | 2005-2006 Public group test of Lame MP3, Vorbis AoTuV, iTunes AAC, Nero AAC, and WMA Pro at ~135 kbit/s nominal. Results suggest that further group testing at this bitrate is unnecessary because all codecs are statistically tied near transparency. |
| 01:15:39 | excitatory | Paul_The_Nerd: i've only done blind tests between mp3 and ogg.. ogg was the clear winner every time. |
| 01:15:41 | | Quit A_M ("CGI:IRC") |
| 01:15:46 | Galois | but, that only holds true if you use the latest and greatest encoders |
| 01:16:03 | Mikachu | Galois: *jumps up and down* |
| 01:16:13 | excitatory | Galois: i've read that one.. if you read the details.. ogg comes out slightly on top in every example. |
| 01:16:22 | amiconn | Galois: MP3 transparent at ~135kbps? What music is that?? |
| 01:16:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | excitatory: Try doing a few double blinds between whatever quality settings your at (and I really hope you're not encoding CBR at those bitrates) and if you don't hear a clear difference, why bother? |
| 01:16:40 | pixelma | Paul_The_Nerd: the OndioFM has recording capabilities too and has the same screen size as the Jukebox Recorder ;) |
| 01:16:42 | Galois | amiconn: it's on Wikipedia, it must be true |
| 01:17:10 | amiconn | Depending on the music I can hear encoding artefacts in mp3 on some 192kbps tracks... |
| 01:17:10 | xorAxAx | fuzz |
| 01:17:20 | xorAxAx | amiconn: irrelevant |
| 01:17:29 | xorAxAx | amiconn: the bitrate doesnt mean anything |
| 01:17:35 | xorAxAx | the encoder matters :) |
| 01:17:38 | amiconn | I know |
| 01:17:44 | amiconn | I am talking about lame here |
| 01:17:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | pixelma: I was aware of that. I only named the JBR because it's screen size is shared on the Ondio FM, and I think iPod Mini (though I don't believe those can record) |
| 01:17:58 | xorAxAx | and full stereo 192 kbit can have severe artefacts |
| 01:18:04 | Mikachu | should i install 3.97 beta2 over 3.96.1? |
| 01:18:08 | excitatory | for me, mp3 sounds like crap below 192.. even 160 i can really hear the difference. i was playing this album i downloaded a few months ago.. all if it was assumed to be 192.. but then this one song came on.. i wasn't even paying attention, just doing the dishes, and i immediately heard it..it was odd.. so i checked it, and sure enough, that one track was 160. |
| 01:18:15 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: what is your target profile? |
| 01:18:21 | Galois | mp3 scored 4.60 with some error bar that overlapped with the vorbis error bar |
| 01:18:25 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: i.e. which bitrate? |
| 01:18:27 | Mikachu | abr 160 kbps or so |
| 01:18:35 | Paul_The_Nerd | excitatory: Songs you did not encode yourself NEVER count. |
| 01:18:36 | xorAxAx | 3.97 is better at vbr generally |
| 01:18:44 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: hmm |
| 01:18:49 | Paul_The_Nerd | excitatory: How do you know it wasn't ever at 64, then reencoded to 160 by someone stupid? |
| 01:18:57 | Mikachu | xorAxAx: i mostly encode to ogg now tohugh |
| 01:18:58 | amiconn | lame is imho the best mp3 encoder, and on difficult to encode tracks, lame −−preset standard sometimes produces >240kbps files |
| 01:19:09 | amiconn | There must be a reason why it does that |
| 01:19:27 | pixelma | Paul_The_Nerd: Minis have a slightly bigger screen (138x110 px) and can't record |
| 01:19:27 | dongs | allrighty then. http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5836 |
| 01:19:35 | xorAxAx | amiconn: sounds like a bug |
| 01:19:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | pixelma: I thought they were 110x64... |
| 01:19:51 | * | Paul_The_Nerd wonders what he's thinking of. |
| 01:19:52 | Mikachu | Paul_The_Nerd: hooray, my hunch was correct |
| 01:20:04 | xorAxAx | even lame is sometimes easily ABX'able on −−preset insane |
| 01:20:20 | xorAxAx | by normal people and cheap equipment. but thats mostly bugs |
| 01:20:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: You know, the simplest method would to be to actually explain *why* you want the feature, instead of trying to simply call the current way stupid. |
| 01:21:11 | Mikachu | dongs: the way this works is everyone is already spending as much time as they can/want on parts of rockbox they care about |
| 01:21:46 | Mikachu | you could get lucky and someone cares about your problem... or you don't |
| 01:22:17 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: It's also been explained to you rather clearly that changes from things that are working how they're expected to work by the person who wrote them are feature requests, no matter how stupid you think the current implementation is. |
| 01:22:28 | dongs | Mikachu: these are major usability problems im bringing up. this isnt some shit like porting doom or some other crap. normal users dont use doom. but I can guarantee you there was at least a few pissed off rockbox users per day who tried to use this feature. |
| 01:22:54 | Mikachu | you should also know open source devels in general don't care if their users "get pissed" |
| 01:22:56 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: The vast majority of porting Doom wasn't done by a core developer, so Doom is completely irrelevant. |
| 01:22:57 | | Quit mirak (Connection timed out) |
| 01:23:06 | Mikachu | i'm obviously only speaking for myself here |
| 01:23:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | It was done by someone who wanted Doom. |
| 01:23:19 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: i think its a little bit more difficult than that |
| 01:23:28 | amiconn | dongs: "Repeat 1" in rockbox has worked like this for years, and afaik nobody complained before |
| 01:23:28 | xorAxAx | s/difficult/complex/ |
| 01:23:38 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Clearly, if someone wants this "major usability concern" that you're the second person ever to complain about to be resolved, it'll get fixed sooner. Otherwise it'll get fixed when someone gets to it. |
| 01:24:15 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: e.g. i dislike it if other core devs in projects i am in piss off users |
| 01:24:16 | amiconn | I'm not saying that the behaviour couldn't be improved, but then I don't see the major usability impact either |
| 01:24:26 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: by e.g. comitting completly b0rked code |
| 01:24:40 | Mikachu | dongs: i'm not saying you shouldn't report problems of course |
| 01:25:00 | Mikachu | xorAxAx: cvs isn't for end users imo |
| 01:25:09 | Mikachu | and there is -D yesterday |
| 01:25:16 | dongs | amiconn: okay. i'm in my car, trying to drive, with rockbox playing some shit in 1track repeat. im tired of listening to same shit over and over, so i hit next track to move to next song. guess what happens? same shit repeats over and over. so now i have to focus my attention on this piece of shit software, and try to think of a way to go to next track, or disable 1 track repeat, or something else ot make it usable. |
| 01:25:29 | dongs | amiconn: result: my time is wasted because of a broken functionality. |
| 01:25:39 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: i am talking about releases |
| 01:25:48 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: i dont mind intermediary breakage |
| 01:25:58 | Mikachu | xorAxAx: right, okay. you said "commit" |
| 01:26:15 | xorAxAx | Mikachu: i mind a missing sense for quality |
| 01:26:21 | coob | dongs: how about not putting it in one track repeat in the first place |
| 01:26:21 | dongs | amiconn: its kind of like gnome/luinix, one day they decided by some idiotic vote that OK/Cancel buttons should be swapped. All this created was endless user confusion. |
| 01:26:27 | coob | (non) problem solved |
| 01:26:50 | * | Mikachu stabs the "hig" |
| 01:27:07 | dongs | coob: i put it in 1track repeat for a reason |
| 01:27:41 | coob | sounds like you've got a bug up your arse for nothing |
| 01:27:45 | coob | it's expected behaviour |
| 01:27:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: So, why the hell didn't you put the usage situation in the feature request, as opposed to some silly IRC pasting? |
| 01:27:56 | coob | no other media player on any other platform behaves differently |
| 01:28:12 | coob | if you want to alter the behaviour, alter it yourself, the source is there for you to do it |
| 01:28:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | coob: Actually, many go to the next track on next track, even in 1-repeat. Though I've also used some that don't. |
| 01:28:17 | dongs | its not a feature request. |
| 01:28:19 | dongs | its a bug. |
| 01:28:22 | amiconn | Hmm, actually I never used 1-track repeat except for testing |
| 01:28:24 | Paul_The_Nerd | coob: But really, never ever say "do it yourself" to dongs. |
| 01:28:32 | coob | no, its a change of behaviour request |
| 01:28:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: The definition of bug in this context has been explained to you before |
| 01:28:36 | dongs | every other person i talked to so far has agreed that next track would be the most logical choice. |
| 01:28:39 | coob | change it yourself if you care about it |
| 01:28:43 | xorAxAx | insane people need "1-track repeat" |
| 01:28:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: YOU do not get to redefine what this project considers a bug. |
| 01:28:47 | coob | obviously enough other people don't care about it |
| 01:28:48 | scorche | Paul_The_Nerd: wait...so dongs = timecob? |
| 01:28:49 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: stop wasting time on something you obviously dont understand |
| 01:28:59 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: What don't I understand? |
| 01:29:01 | Mikachu | scorche: dongs = timemob = timecop |
| 01:29:03 | amiconn | dongs: It can't be a bug because the code works as intended, and it works like that for over 4 years, and for more than one year in 2 completely different playback engines |
| 01:29:12 | scorche | Mikachu: yeah...i noticed... |
| 01:29:22 | scorche | figures... |
| 01:29:38 | coob | dongs: what;s to stop you from changing the source yourself and submitting a patch? |
| 01:29:41 | amiconn | Again: I'm not saying there is no room for improvement, it's just that there is no bug |
| 01:29:52 | Paul_The_Nerd | coob: He can't be bothered. He likes to complain, he's not constructive in any way. |
| 01:29:54 | coob | i'm going to go ahead annd suggest a lack of skill. |
| 01:29:59 | excitatory | dongs: really dude, you come off as trolling. |
| 01:30:20 | dongs | excitatory: yes, pointing out usability bugs in open-source projects usually gets marked as trolling, because these people dont know any better. |
| 01:30:22 | amiconn | But I have a somewhat helpful question: Does choosing another track from the playlist viewer work in repeat-1 mode? |
| 01:30:30 | dongs | excitatory: i can give you a dozen examples of such. |
| 01:30:44 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: It's your method, not what you're doing, that comes off as trolling |
| 01:30:47 | Paul_The_Nerd | As you surely know. |
| 01:30:49 | dongs | mostly because the 'programmers' are overprotective of their shitty code: I WROTE IT FUCKER< FOR FREE, AND I AINT FIXING IT is a typical response. |
| 01:31:00 | Paul_The_Nerd | Nobody has said that fixing it is a bad idea. |
| 01:31:01 | * | pixelma remembers a discussion about bug report vs. feature request with dongs right yesterday... |
| 01:31:01 | excitatory | dongs: but..it's not a "bug |
| 01:31:13 | Paul_The_Nerd | All that has been said, is that it's not a bug the way it works now. |
| 01:31:14 | scorche | is it time yet for us to kick dongs out of here? |
| 01:31:21 | Paul_The_Nerd | Clearly if you would actually LISTEN to what people said to you, it would help. |
| 01:31:27 | amiconn | If so, changing the behaviour shouldn't be that difficult |
| 01:31:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: I'm fairly certain changing tracks via playlists does work. |
| 01:32:00 | excitatory | dongs: it's a feature, or behavior request.. something like what you're talking about is a matter of opinion. i'm not aware of any objective human interface guidelines.. |
| 01:32:01 | * | Paul_The_Nerd goes to check |
| 01:32:54 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Yes, switching tracks from the current playlist view works fine in 1-repeat |
| 01:33:40 | excitatory | dongs: perhaps the problem here is that we're all playing semantics.. |
| 01:34:12 | Galois | oh my god this is such a trivial patch |
| 01:34:14 | amiconn | So iirc what the wps would have to do in repeat-1 mode is switching to next-in-playlist instead of just telling the engine to skip |
| 01:34:26 | Paul_The_Nerd | excitatory: The problem is that he can't be bothered to simply write a feature request that says "I feel it would be beneficial if 1-repeat mode allowed you to skip to the next track with the appropriate button, because this seems to make more sense and allows track changing without looking at the screen at no cost to existing functionality" |
| 01:34:36 | Galois | case REPEAT_ONE: |
| 01:34:51 | Galois | move that down a few lines, above case REPEAT_ALL: |
| 01:35:20 | Galois | or, wait, should it be up a few lines, before case REPEAT_OFF: ? because one could argue that either way would be a "bug" by dongs' standards |
| 01:35:43 | Mikachu | Galois: would that still stop playback from advancing? |
| 01:35:57 | amiconn | That would always be a rebuffering skip, since the engine buffers the same track in a "ring" in repeat one mode, but imho that's acceptable |
| 01:36:05 | * | Paul_The_Nerd agrees |
| 01:36:27 | Paul_The_Nerd | Galois: To dongs, a bug is anything that he feels should behave differently, even in cases where some people actually think his way is worse. |
| 01:36:39 | Mikachu | in winamp/xmms, repeat one is not the same setting as global repeat |
| 01:36:48 | Mikachu | so you can have repeat on/off + no advance playlist |
| 01:36:51 | * | ToyKeeper discovers that "all:" is matched not just at the beginning of a line :) |
| 01:36:58 | Galois | I honestly don't see any way around the rebuffering problem unless you want to be like karma and aggressively buffer everything just in case |
| 01:37:31 | Galois | anyway the relevant function is get_next_index in playlist.c |
| 01:37:48 | Mikachu | Galois: have you tried it already? |
| 01:38:02 | Mikachu | i would not assume anything about play(list|back).c |
| 01:38:38 | Galois | no, I'm just winging it |
| 01:38:42 | Mikachu | haha :) |
| 01:39:04 | Mikachu | i only have doom and pacbox left |
| 01:39:07 | ToyKeeper | Would I get shot in the head if I suggested a "true random" mode? (for example, randomly choose the next song from the first half of the playlist, then requeue it at the end after playing... provides a true random without the chance of repeating a song twice in a row) |
| 01:39:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | How is that different from shuffling the playlist? |
| 01:39:57 | Mikachu | you can unshuffle it |
| 01:40:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | You can unshuffle a playlist too. |
| 01:40:29 | Mikachu | depends on if it was sorted by key or by hand, but sure you can just save it first |
| 01:40:36 | Mikachu | however, you asked what the difference was :) |
| 01:40:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | Well, I really meant, how is that more "true" random? |
| 01:41:25 | ToyKeeper | It has different properties... the order is continuously shuffling, so it doesn't necessarily play each song once and only once. |
| 01:41:58 | Mikachu | true random could play the same song 500 times in a row |
| 01:42:01 | Mikachu | anything else is pseudo random |
| 01:42:29 | ToyKeeper | Yeah... pseudo random is fine with me. It's annoying to hear the same thing 5 times in an hour. |
| 01:43:17 | Galois | I think what you want is called "random without replacement" |
| 01:43:41 | Mikachu | Galois: well, that didn't work :) |
| 01:43:47 | Galois | oh well |
| 01:44:16 | ToyKeeper | What I'm really interested in is adding song ratings and automatic song selection based on the ratings. |
| 01:44:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | I mean, with that method, the odds of you hearing any given song a second time within a period depends on how long the second half of the playlist takes to consume. |
| 01:44:54 | dongs | lol, rating songs. what will you want next? social networking and blogging right off the ipod? |
| 01:45:01 | ToyKeeper | :) |
| 01:45:08 | Mikachu | oh god, would someone please get rid of him? |
| 01:45:12 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: I'm sorry, but doesn't your beloved retail iPod firmware already allow song ratings? |
| 01:45:28 | dongs | thats one of the reasons I dont use the retail iPod firmware. |
| 01:45:40 | ToyKeeper | Er, never actually used an ipod. |
| 01:46:09 | Paul_The_Nerd | You could just not use the feature. |
| 01:46:16 | ToyKeeper | I'm just hoping to have it play better songs more often, and worse songs less often. |
| 01:46:22 | | Join [HO]volt [0] (n=gcadidas@cpe-24-93-102-155.columbus.res.rr.com) |
| 01:46:36 | dongs | ToyKeeper: i have this great way of getting rid of 'worse songs' |
| 01:46:37 | Mikachu | or, you just have good songs |
| 01:46:39 | [HO]volt | Paul_The_Nerd: My iAudio came in today. |
| 01:46:41 | dongs | ToyKeeper: i jsut delete them |
| 01:46:46 | dongs | you can try it too |
| 01:47:05 | ToyKeeper | dongs: Mikachu: tried both, and didn't like it as much as a real rating system. |
| 01:47:20 | [HO]volt | i have an iAudio x5 and I'm having problems "setting foreground color" |
| 01:47:27 | Mikachu | the problem with playing good songs more often is that then they become less good |
| 01:47:34 | dongs | ah, so. well , feel free to submit a 'feature request' since that would be a feature request, as opposed to a bug, like things like 1-track repeat problem. |
| 01:47:44 | * | amiconn also wonders what the actual use of ratings and playback statistics is |
| 01:47:47 | dongs | ToyKeeper: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/ < start here. |
| 01:47:57 | Galois | actually, Mikachu, I just tested it, and it does work |
| 01:48:07 | ToyKeeper | Currently, my music sync script deletes any songs with a rating < 40%, and makes static playlists for songs with ratings >=51%, 70%, and 80%... it's better than nothing. :) |
| 01:48:13 | Galois | never mind, there's a flaw |
| 01:48:15 | Mikachu | Galois: i've been listening to 4 songs now in 1-repeat |
| 01:48:24 | Mikachu | without touching the controls |
| 01:48:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Define for me what you mean when you use the word "bug" since we seem to have different definitions. |
| 01:48:43 | Galois | still, I've got a ways to go before I match the effort required with the alternative approach |
| 01:48:45 | Galois | so let's keep going |
| 01:48:58 | Mikachu | bug = something dongs wants, feature request = something dongs doesn't want |
| 01:49:19 | amiconn | dongs actually wants bugs? ;) |
| 01:49:19 | | Part |AhIoRoS| |
| 01:50:02 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: functionality which makes no sense to anyone except the original developer = bug. unexpected, broken functionality = bug. shit crashing = bug. etc. |
| 01:50:17 | dongs | shit that confuses users = bug |
| 01:50:32 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: And so when several people think the functionality makes sense, and only one person actually reports it as a problem, should it be assumed to be a bug or not? |
| 01:50:58 | pixelma | if dongs is that one person... |
| 01:51:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | For example, the Pause icon thing. You're the only person who's *ever* spoken of it. |
| 01:51:26 | dongs | your point? |
| 01:51:52 | Mikachu | i agree that both are improvements if implemented |
| 01:51:52 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, the majority of respondents like it. |
| 01:52:00 | | Quit Sinbios ("If the definition of a klutz is someone who doesn't have eyes on their ass, then yes, I suppose I am a klutz.") |
| 01:52:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | Or at least prefer the existing method over your suggestion of lying about the paused status. |
| 01:52:33 | dongs | No, majority don't give a fuck and/or shrug it off as 'typical opensource brokenness', and the energy required to get these bugs fixed is obviously much more than just shutting up and dealing with it. |
| 01:52:35 | Paul_The_Nerd | All I'm saying is that you seem to define things as a bug based upon your own preference, even though the actions are actually intended. |
| 01:52:45 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: this is why opensource in general, linux specifically, and lunix GUIs even more specifically arent going anywhere. |
| 01:52:51 | midkay | typical brokenness.. my god.. |
| 01:52:56 | Mikachu | dongs: it would go much better if you didn't start off your report with "your all assholes" |
| 01:52:59 | * | amiconn wonders wth the Pause icon thing is |
| 01:53:03 | dongs | Mikachu: i didnt. |
| 01:53:07 | midkay | dongs: then WHY on earth are you using it? if you hate it so much and it's all broken and shitty and open source? |
| 01:53:19 | * | amiconn considers the gnome gui very usable |
| 01:53:24 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Dongs feels it should show the pause icon immediately after pressing pause, even if the music is still playing and the timer is advancing because it's fading. |
| 01:53:28 | dongs | amiconn: how do I view all my bugs? |
| 01:53:29 | dongs | i'll tell you |
| 01:53:38 | dongs | oh i see |
| 01:53:41 | Mikachu | dongs: "tasks reported by me" in the |
| 01:53:44 | dongs | amiconn: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5821 |
| 01:54:07 | amiconn | Paul_The_Nerd: I would _never_ have noticed that |
| 01:54:32 | [HO]volt | lol @ dongs for such a picky "bug" |
| 01:54:44 | dongs | yeah, thanks for 'lolling @ me' |
| 01:54:46 | Mikachu | sigh |
| 01:54:50 | amiconn | ..and I can tell you why - I have disabled all fading because fading annoys me. |
| 01:54:53 | [HO]volt | you have been lolled |
| 01:54:58 | dongs | amiconn: you know why it annoys you? |
| 01:55:09 | amiconn | yes |
| 01:55:18 | dongs | amiconn: because of htat exact bug - you dont get immediate indication that something happened |
| 01:55:21 | dongs | when you press a key. |
| 01:55:24 | amiconn | no |
| 01:55:26 | [HO]volt | my iaudio is telling me it hates me. AKA "Error Updating Playlist Control File." |
| 01:55:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: I'm okay with some indication that fading is occurring, such as an alternating Play/Pause icon, but I really strongly felt that displaying "Pause" if the music was still moving was a worse "bug" than not displaying it when it isn't truly paused yet. |
| 01:55:42 | amiconn | When I press pause or stop, I want it to pause or stop immediately |
| 01:55:48 | amiconn | I don't care about the icon |
| 01:55:58 | amiconn | I often don't even look at the display |
| 01:56:07 | dongs | yeah. |
| 01:56:14 | dongs | so when fade is on by default |
| 01:56:32 | amiconn | It's the fading itself that annoys me, not any type of indication on non-indication |
| 01:56:37 | dongs | and you press shit, and it starts fading (or not, in case player was sleeping), the fact that it doesnt put anthing on the screen as a notification is even more annoying. |
| 01:56:38 | Mikachu | fade on pause and peakmeters are things i wouldn't have enabled by default |
| 01:56:45 | excitatory | dongs: you know, i would agree with you on this useability issue.. and would even go so far as to prefer that as a functionality.. it does annoy me. however, it's not a "bug", and honestly, it's pretty negligible. |
| 01:56:55 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: As has been said before, there's a simple solution to all your problems: Don't use our software. |
| 01:57:20 | dongs | okay, then add a new group in tracker called 'usability' |
| 01:57:24 | dongs | and i'll be glad to move my "bugs' there. |
| 01:57:34 | dongs | and add hundreds more |
| 01:57:49 | Paul_The_Nerd | Why is it impossible for you to just post them as feature requests? |
| 01:57:55 | dongs | because they arent. |
| 01:57:57 | amiconn | dongs: If somewhat lagging indication would annoy me, I would e.g. use dircache, but I don't |
| 01:57:58 | dongs | you still dont get it. |
| 01:58:03 | Paul_The_Nerd | You want a feature changed. You're requesting it. |
| 01:58:31 | dongs | amiconn: well, dircache has nothing to do with fade on pause, really. |
| 01:58:38 | dongs | but yeah. |
| 01:59:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Remember, you don't get to define what is considered a bug in the tracker. Why do you refuse to post them simply because of what they should be named? |
| 01:59:22 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: because these are usability bugs. not feature requests. |
| 02:00 |
| 02:00:04 | midkay | why do you even bother, Paul_The_Nerd.. he won't give up his stance that functionality we've had since the feature was introduced is a bug.. |
| 02:00:04 | Mikachu | dongs: how about adding in the "User Interface" category? |
| 02:00:37 | Mikachu | can everyone do me a favor and stop arguing about whether or not it's a bug, everyone wants to change it |
| 02:00:41 | Mikachu | ? |
| 02:00:45 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Simply put, a bug is an "error" and if it's working as intended then the error isn't in the program, it's in the choice to MAKE that part of the program, and so you're requesting a change of what feature the program desires |
| 02:00:57 | excitatory | dongs: pretty much the only reason this is not a bug is because that functionality was designed to do exactly that.. if it, for example, would fail to change the icon, or it wouldn't change as soon as the music actually stops... well, then that is a bug. |
| 02:01:01 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: lets say a text editor doesnt confirm with user to save changes on exit, and just quits, losing whatever open work exists. would you call this a 'bug' because its obviously a usability bug, or a 'feature request' because prompt-on-exit-and-save was never implemented by 'original developer'/ |
| 02:01:02 | amiconn | A bug is a small animal ;) |
| 02:01:09 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 02:01:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | A bug is a problem in the program. A feature request is something lacking in the design philosophy. |
| 02:01:21 | dongs | i disagree. |
| 02:01:29 | Paul_The_Nerd | Well, that's the way they are in the tracker. |
| 02:01:32 | Mikachu | i'll just take that as a no then? |
| 02:01:33 | Mikachu | fine |
| 02:01:41 | * | Mikachu goes away |
| 02:01:45 | midkay | he disagrees. so, forget it. |
| 02:01:46 | dongs | Mikachu: i think i added the pause bug in user interface category. |
| 02:02:08 | * | midkay can switch it over to a feature request.. |
| 02:02:18 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: answer |
| 02:02:19 | Paul_The_Nerd | Mikachu: Well, dongs does report things worth considering, and it would be valuable to have him actually report things hopefully in a helpful way, if he can just deal with the fact that they're organized the way that they are. |
| 02:02:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: I would request that the feature be added. |
| 02:02:57 | dongs | i see. well, to anyone who's spent more than 5 minutes in a real company developing software and doing usability testing, its a bug. |
| 02:03:03 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: And that's 100% honesty. If they didn't feel it was necessary, and I do, clearly I want them to change their concepts of necessity to align with mine, so there's nothing "buggy" about the program, just the design concept |
| 02:03:59 | dongs | the way real world (not open source developers) see it, is, any functionality of a program which causes user to lose data is a bug. |
| 02:04:00 | fatherfork | I've spent the last several minutes reading the conversation, and the bug report, and I'd like to add that as only a user I do not see this as a bug. |
| 02:04:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: The problem is that the usability here is designed for the designers, as they're the primary users. You seem to miss that fact. |
| 02:04:32 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: I think i mentioned that more than once, this is one of the major reasons opensource in general isnt going anywhere. |
| 02:04:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: It doesn't matter if it's going anywhere |
| 02:04:41 | * | midkay moved it to Feature Requests... |
| 02:04:43 | dongs | you dont give a fuck about users, you care about 'scratching an itch'. |
| 02:04:44 | Paul_The_Nerd | Nobody's planning on selling Rockbox. |
| 02:04:46 | excitatory | dongs: yea, because the world of oss is fake. |
| 02:05:09 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, in the context of Rockbox, it would still qualify as a feature request. |
| 02:05:17 | Paul_The_Nerd | Since you can't use your definition of "it would be a bug in a software company" |
| 02:05:30 | dongs | midkay: wrong |
| 02:05:44 | midkay | dongs: how can i be "wrong" with saying that i moved it? |
| 02:05:46 | midkay | i simply did. |
| 02:05:47 | dongs | midkay: it either goes in bugs or into 'usability' category, which considering this is an opensource project, doesnt exist. |
| 02:05:48 | qwm | you're an obnoxious asshole, dongs |
| 02:05:52 | | Join webguest64 [0] (n=446bd58a@labb.contactor.se) |
| 02:05:56 | dongs | midkay: its in the wrong category now. |
| 02:06:07 | midkay | dongs: according to YOU. |
| 02:06:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: WE define what each category contains, NOT YOU. |
| 02:06:14 | Mikachu | Paul_The_Nerd: sometimes i think you argue with him just out of spite though |
| 02:06:18 | dongs | no, i submitted the bug. |
| 02:06:18 | fatherfork | this is another one of those "if you don't like it, don't use it." or in this case, just request it be changed as a feature. |
| 02:06:21 | midkay | live with it, or leave.. the latter would be preferable, but.. drop it. |
| 02:06:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: And you put it in the wrong place. |
| 02:06:54 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Do you think that a northbound bus will take you southbound even though it's labelled north, just because you say "I stepped on the bus"? |
| 02:07:05 | excitatory | dongs: and the thing about the open source movement is that it doesn't have an objective agenda.. it's not looking to profit, or get on 1 million desktops by the end of the year, or anything like that.. sure individuals have an agenda, but oss itself does not.. it does what it does, on its own time in its own way. it's how it's always been. |
| 02:07:28 | amiconn | "A software bug is an error, flaw, mistake, failure, or fault in a computer program that prevents it from working as intended, or produces an incorrect result." <= from wikipedia |
| 02:07:44 | midkay | any more bugs for me to convert? :) |
| 02:07:45 | fatherfork | the great wikipedia |
| 02:07:52 | webguest64 | Where can I get some help for my Archos I think deleated a file that lets it boot up, is there a way to get it back or it my 5000 ruined? |
| 02:07:54 | amiconn | So if it works as intended, it can't be a bug, even though it might not work as some users expect |
| 02:08:09 | qwm | i suppose dongs will add "feature request" to the article in a minute or two. |
| 02:08:17 | fatherfork | I submitted a bug about rockbox playing music earlier, I don't think it should do that. |
| 02:09:29 | Paul_The_Nerd | webguest64: What happens when you try to boot? |
| 02:09:36 | dongs | amiconn: very smart on not pasting the next sentence, "Bugs arise from mistakes and errors, made by people, in either a program's source code or its design." |
| 02:09:50 | fatherfork | "mistakes" |
| 02:09:52 | | Quit _hotwire_ (Connection timed out) |
| 02:10:10 | midkay | mistakes. errors. this is not a mistake, it is not an error. it is a design decision. |
| 02:10:15 | fatherfork | it's only a mistake if the programmer wrote it differently than he intended |
| 02:10:24 | midkay | you disagree, so you *request* that it be change. then we consider it. that's all. |
| 02:10:32 | Mikachu | it's not a bloody design decision, nobody wants the next key not to go to the next track |
| 02:10:46 | webguest64 | It showsJukebox ver 5.08 and then freezes till it shuts hop |
| 02:10:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: The "its design" part though implies a flawed design in the context of picking the wrong math to solve the problem, as it doesn't say anything about the actual design philosophy, IE, what features are chosen. |
| 02:10:50 | dongs | nobody? |
| 02:11:01 | dongs | go put random players in 1track repeat mode |
| 02:11:03 | dongs | and press next track. |
| 02:11:13 | Mikachu | dongs: i was agreeing with you there |
| 02:11:14 | midkay | Mikachu: maybe design decision is a bad word - it's what we set up to happen, and we intended it, even if it isn't for the best. |
| 02:11:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: NOBODY said it was a bad idea to change it to actually go to the next track. You're changing the subject from the definition of "bug" again. |
| 02:11:33 | dongs | oh, i missed hte 'not' |
| 02:11:58 | dongs | so, when can i expect it to be fixed? |
| 02:12:02 | fatherfork | haha |
| 02:12:16 | fatherfork | expect nothing |
| 02:12:21 | fatherfork | hope |
| 02:12:23 | dongs | yea, im not holding my breath |
| 02:12:26 | Mikachu | dongs: march 3rd |
| 02:12:27 | Mikachu | :) |
| 02:12:28 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: It's not as important as say, getting the player to stop freezing, so maybe give more important bugs a while to get worked out. |
| 02:12:32 | | Join lukaswayne9 [0] (n=lukas@c-68-84-69-12.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 02:12:51 | Mikachu | "you said 7 and a half minutes!" "IT WAS AN ARBITRARY NUMBER!" //sg-a |
| 02:13:04 | * | midkay hates flyspray. |
| 02:13:52 | Mikachu | quoting stargate always stops a discussion |
| 02:14:07 | midkay | haha. |
| 02:14:47 | webguest64 | so any help, please |
| 02:15:12 | fatherfork | 64, did you try redoing everything from the begining? |
| 02:15:23 | Mikachu | webguest64: can you get it into filetransfer mode anyhow? |
| 02:15:27 | Mikachu | somehow |
| 02:15:33 | Paul_The_Nerd | webguest64: So I take it you don't have Rockbox flashed? What did you do right before the problem happened? |
| 02:15:55 | webguest64 | yes I've even installed rockbox 3 time but I think maybe an archos file is missing and I cant find it |
| 02:16:13 | | Join Drkepilogue [0] (n=46e784d0@labb.contactor.se) |
| 02:16:32 | webguest64 | replaced some songs the previous owner had and put my own on |
| 02:17:52 | | Join _hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 02:19:23 | | Quit Drkepilogue (Client Quit) |
| 02:22:07 | | Join qwx [0] (n=qwm@h229n1fls34o1010.telia.com) |
| 02:22:56 | _hotwire_ | I've found a really nice article on design that might be fitting in this situation: http://headrush.typepad.com/creating_passionate_users/2006/05/dont_give_in_to.html |
| 02:23:38 | dongs | oh yeah, totally fucking relevant |
| 02:25:05 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Cursing isn't necessary. |
| 02:25:52 | midkay | haha. |
| 02:25:54 | midkay | 1) The Active Haters |
| 02:25:54 | midkay | Those who hate you no matter what you do. The more popular you become, the louder they become. |
| 02:26:04 | dongs | now all you need is for someone to feature request being able to change mp3 decoder engine 'just because one dveloper thinks decoder x sounds better htan decoder y' |
| 02:26:18 | midkay | dongs: i'm betting we'll get that from you soon.. |
| 02:26:25 | Mikachu | how many fixed point mp3 decoders do you know of? |
| 02:26:49 | | Quit webguest64 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 02:27:14 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:27:29 | Mikachu | mplayer has 3 different mp3 decoders compiled in by default |
| 02:28:30 | Mikachu | i don't have a point, i was just saying |
| 02:28:31 | Paul_The_Nerd | Ooh, we should bring back the old FLAC implementation and let users pick which one to use! :-P |
| 02:30:43 | Damme | hmm, I'm trying to use IDA to disassembly pp5020 binary .. cant find the cpu though |
| 02:31:02 | Mikachu | arm7tdmi? |
| 02:31:25 | Damme | arm710a I've got |
| 02:31:54 | dongs | Damme: goodluck, youre not gonna get very far |
| 02:32:03 | Mikachu | dongs: at least with open source, if you are really really annoyed with a bug, you can fix it yourself. if this was #apple you would have even less success |
| 02:32:27 | dongs | Mikachu: if this was #apple I wouldn't even have this problem because such bug would never be allowed into release build |
| 02:32:48 | [HO]volt | With my iAudio, while setting the time with Rockbox, how do I navigate to any other part of the screen than Hours ? |
| 02:32:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: Such as the MP3 playback bug that's been in iPods for several years? |
| 02:32:58 | | Join hotwire__ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 02:33:10 | Mikachu | dongs: you've never had problems with proprietary products that were impossible to fix yourself? |
| 02:33:24 | * | Mikachu gives his nvidia drivers the evil eye |
| 02:33:42 | dongs | Mikachu: most proprietary products I use that I have paid for have a very responsive development team which is happy to fix bugs I report. |
| 02:34:18 | Paul_The_Nerd | Odd. Any time I've tried to report a bug about the iPod, I've been accused of being a music pirate and sent on my way. |
| 02:34:48 | dongs | were you complaining that youre scene release ripped mp3s didnt play? |
| 02:34:52 | dongs | i'd say the same thing as well. |
| 02:34:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | "Your MP3 decoder can't handle all VBR MP3s" shouldn't be responded with "It'll handle ones our encoder makes. Why can't you just use it? Clearly if your music was obtained legally you could use our encoder." |
| 02:35:10 | dongs | precisely. |
| 02:35:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: I was saying that the MP3s I received from They Might Be Giants didn't work. |
| 02:35:12 | dongs | that is a valid answer. |
| 02:35:29 | Paul_The_Nerd | Fully legal, from a well known band, and fully compliant files. |
| 02:35:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | That their decoder chokes on because it can't handle bitrate spikes well. |
| 02:35:54 | [HO]volt | Encode to wmv with winamp then back to mp3 with (anything) |
| 02:35:54 | [HO]volt | ? |
| 02:36:05 | Mikachu | dongs: so saying you won't fix your mp3 decoder to play mp3 files is okay, but not adding a feature is a deadly sin? |
| 02:36:13 | | Quit qwm (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:36:14 | Paul_The_Nerd | [HO]volt: You mean "Completely and utterly destroy any remaining quality in the song by transcoding to another lossy format"? |
| 02:36:28 | Mikachu | [HO]volt: that is maybe the stupidest thing i've read tonight, and that doesn't say little |
| 02:36:40 | [HO]volt | Ouch |
| 02:36:42 | Paul_The_Nerd | My theory is that if I pay for an "MP3" player, that any compliant MP3 file should play in it, unless the packaging states otherwise. |
| 02:37:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | Seeing as nowhere in the official documentation or the packaging does it state that the product only works with AppleMP3, I, rightfully I believe, assumed it was compatible with the well known MP3 file format. |
| 02:38:11 | dongs | Paul_The_Nerd: did you send them a link to the specific MP3 which was causing trouble with the decoder? |
| 02:39:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: In that instance it was their phone support. I offered to though. |
| 02:39:11 | Paul_The_Nerd | They had no interest though |
| 02:39:21 | Paul_The_Nerd | Their official policy is that they are only required to support files encoded in iTunes. |
| 02:39:52 | dongs | sounds reasonable. |
| 02:39:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | In what sense? |
| 02:40:18 | dongs | they cant please everyone, and you probably never bought a single song from their store, which makes you that much less important to them as a customer. |
| 02:40:28 | Paul_The_Nerd | You can't sell a CDDA player that only plays Sony CDs and have the CDDA logo on it, because it's trademarked. |
| 02:40:35 | Paul_The_Nerd | Their store doesn't sell MP3s |
| 02:40:41 | Landus | Does anyone know if Rockbox has support for Japanese symbols in filenames and ID3 tags? |
| 02:40:46 | Mikachu | Landus: yes |
| 02:40:53 | Landus | Awesome. |
| 02:40:56 | Mikachu | Landus: you need to select a font with japanese chars first |
| 02:41:01 | Landus | Don't have to rename anything. |
| 02:41:03 | Mikachu | Landus: i know unifont and 6+12x13 do |
| 02:41:05 | dongs | Landus: it works. some mp3s that are in sjis tags will needs default codepage set. |
| 02:41:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: By advertising it as supporting the MP3 format, and then not doing so, they're breaking a few consumer protection laws in my state, at the minimum. |
| 02:41:25 | Landus | Bascially, I'm just fixing alot tags on my music. |
| 02:41:33 | Landus | Then putting everything that I fix back on my DAP. |
| 02:41:52 | [HO]volt | anyone that knows anything about rockbox + iaudio - help me set my time, please? i cant navigate away from the "hours" selection |
| 02:41:56 | Landus | It just want to know if I had to rename things because of the support, or lack of, for the Japanese characters in some of the music I'm putting bakc on. |
| 02:42:15 | Mikachu | Landus: http://mikachu.ath.cx/slask/mikachu-wps.png |
| 02:42:31 | dongs | here's a tip to help you organize your music: find a program that calculates CRC32 of a file, then calculate crc32 for all your MP3s then rename them to 0123ABCD.MP3 (the numbers obviously being the CRC32 calculated) then you can have an official mp3 collection fully 8.3 compliant. |
| 02:42:33 | Paul_The_Nerd | [HO]volt: It may be a side-effect of the recent button mapping changes. You might want to post in the thread. |
| 02:42:35 | Mikachu | (that theme is not a serious attempt at a good looking theme) |
| 02:42:43 | | Join JoeyBorn [0] (n=rootmeis@149.sub-70-208-149.myvzw.com) |
| 02:42:51 | pixelma | dongs: AFAIK the apple firmware doesn't play gapless - did you report it to them as a bug? |
| 02:43:06 | Paul_The_Nerd | pixelma: Gapless is "useless" to him. |
| 02:43:13 | dongs | indeed |
| 02:43:15 | dongs | thanks for answering fo rme. |
| 02:43:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | Which of course is again a misuse of the word, but we'll not go into that here. |
| 02:43:28 | dongs | Mikachu: that font is so damn ugly i just want to gouge my eyes out |
| 02:43:40 | Mikachu | dongs: well, get me a better one that fits on the nano screen |
| 02:43:54 | Mikachu | dongs: i use the exact same font for irssi btw |
| 02:45:24 | | Quit _hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:45:44 | [HO]volt | Mikachu: if that is an x5 screenshot, how do i take one? |
| 02:45:49 | | Join _hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 02:45:50 | dongs | what was that screenshot function in rockbox |
| 02:45:59 | Mikachu | [HO]volt: it's a nano, and no, it's from the sim |
| 02:46:04 | [HO]volt | ok |
| 02:46:06 | Mikachu | and yes, you can take a screenshot |
| 02:46:13 | Mikachu | but i don't know how to exactly |
| 02:46:22 | dongs | when does it screendump? |
| 02:46:25 | dongs | on usb conneect? |
| 02:46:31 | Mikachu | dongs: no complaints on the music selection then? |
| 02:46:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | [HO]volt: In the debug menu, enable screendump. Then when you plug in a USB cable it writes a .bmp to the root directory. |
| 02:46:50 | Paul_The_Nerd | Disable it for USB to work like normal again |
| 02:46:55 | [HO]volt | oka |
| 02:48:08 | dongs | Mikachu: http://pbx.mine.nu/f.png looks slightly less gay in my opinion. |
| 02:48:21 | Mikachu | dongs: what font is this? |
| 02:48:30 | dongs | mine. |
| 02:48:44 | Mikachu | would you care to share it? |
| 02:48:48 | dongs | that i generated out of windows fonts with a program |
| 02:48:54 | Mikachu | or is it copyrighted? |
| 02:49:01 | dongs | i can give you the program that made it. |
| 02:49:08 | | Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@c220-237-57-32.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 02:49:14 | dongs | (i think i gave it to markun at some point) |
| 02:49:29 | dongs | it collects sbits out of ttf fonts for cjk and makes a rockbox-compatible font. |
| 02:49:42 | | Quit JoeyBorn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 02:49:48 | Mikachu | ah, i think i saw that program the other day |
| 02:50:09 | Mikachu | also, not so much on the less gay with the pink :P |
| 02:50:14 | [HO]volt | might be gay but looks good to me, took about an hour to relearn wps and get everything lined up: http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/9300/voltbackgroundzj3.png |
| 02:50:20 | | Join JoeyBorn [0] (n=rootmeis@149.sub-70-208-149.myvzw.com) |
| 02:51:57 | dongs | where was default wps again |
| 02:52:08 | dongs | i need to remove peakmeters from it so i can forever dump this icatchier stuff |
| 02:52:19 | dongs | i remember someone told me the place to get it |
| 02:52:24 | dongs | in some source file |
| 02:52:26 | Mikachu | that was me |
| 02:52:28 | Mikachu | unfortunately i forgot |
| 02:52:58 | Mikachu | dongs: apps/gui/gwps-common.c |
| 02:53:02 | Mikachu | and remove this line |
| 02:53:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: The easiest place is to go to the WPSGallery and click the Recorder gallery |
| 02:53:06 | Mikachu | gwps-common.c: "%pm\n", false); |
| 02:53:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | or the Archos one, rather |
| 02:53:14 | Mikachu | well, put the , false); on the line before |
| 02:53:19 | Mikachu | you get the idea |
| 02:53:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | iCatcher has a few fairly major flaws in my opinion. =/ |
| 02:53:45 | Paul_The_Nerd | That stupid volume circle bottoms out at like, -40 or so. |
| 02:53:46 | Mikachu | i don't like the overall look of it |
| 02:53:56 | Paul_The_Nerd | And if you have the music pause, you get *no* volume display at all. |
| 02:54:03 | Mikachu | and it spins! yay |
| 02:54:42 | dongs | i dont like the fact that it doesnt wokr wiht my font |
| 02:54:48 | ToyKeeper | Hmm... I still haven't done anything with the volume meter on my theme. |
| 02:54:52 | dongs | (oh and looks ugly but never midn that) |
| 02:55:24 | ToyKeeper | I tried, but ran into some sort of total image size limit and gave up for the day. |
| 02:55:27 | dongs | what hte hell |
| 02:55:32 | dongs | Mikachu: i dont need to rebuild rockbox for this shit do i? |
| 02:55:39 | Mikachu | dongs: course you do |
| 02:55:43 | Mikachu | dongs: or |
| 02:55:49 | dongs | cant i jsut cut that shit out |
| 02:55:50 | dongs | into a .txt |
| 02:55:51 | Mikachu | dongs: copy the text in "" to a file and load it as a wps |
| 02:55:53 | Mikachu | yes |
| 02:55:55 | dongs | yea ok |
| 02:55:58 | Mikachu | i remember telling you this last time too |
| 02:56:26 | dongs | so its only like |
| 02:56:27 | dongs | 15 lines? |
| 02:56:28 | dongs | of stuff? |
| 02:56:40 | Mikachu | that sounds like an accurate description |
| 02:56:48 | | Quit hotwire__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:57:01 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsArchos#The_Rockbox_default_for_Recorder |
| 02:57:05 | Paul_The_Nerd | Easier to copy 'n paste from |
| 02:57:25 | dongs | ya im on ipod though. but thanks for trying |
| 02:57:26 | Mikachu | i suppose that works too |
| 02:57:32 | Mikachu | the default theme is the same on all targets |
| 02:57:35 | dongs | oh |
| 02:57:38 | dongs | k |
| 02:57:41 | dongs | ya that looks same |
| 02:57:57 | Paul_The_Nerd | Just erase the %pm (which doesn't show on Archos, but it's there in the code. Odd) |
| 02:58:45 | pixelma | Paul_The_Nerd: it shows on Archos if the user has turned off the status bar |
| 02:58:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | Aaah |
| 03:00 |
| 03:00:22 | * | Paul_The_Nerd never turns his off, so wouldn't have noticed. |
| 03:00:43 | dongs | oh thats anothe rthing |
| 03:00:43 | Mikachu | doesn't that waste awesome cpu powers? |
| 03:00:44 | pixelma | yeah me too.. just because I read the code |
| 03:00:47 | dongs | in icatcher theres no statusbar |
| 03:00:57 | dongs | so i cant tell what time it is |
| 03:03:03 | dongs | yes! |
| 03:03:04 | dongs | finally |
| 03:03:07 | dongs | im free from gayness |
| 03:03:35 | [HO]volt | how so? |
| 03:03:43 | | Quit lodesi ("leaving") |
| 03:03:45 | dongs | back to default wps with no peakmeters |
| 03:03:49 | [HO]volt | aha. |
| 03:04:15 | dongs | now i can play stuff on 120% speedup again without skipping |
| 03:04:27 | Mikachu | hooray |
| 03:04:33 | [HO]volt | how much battery life is used on the iaudio with hold on and player paused, vs. turning the unit all the way off |
| 03:04:35 | Mikachu | i think i can play at 140% |
| 03:05:01 | dongs | oh, i think it goes around there, but it would skip even at 120% wiht peakmeters on |
| 03:05:10 | Mikachu | ah |
| 03:05:33 | pixelma | Mikachu: don't think so because the peakmeters aren't a problem on Archos and I think it "knows" if the peakmeter should be drawn or not (think they aren't drawn in the off) |
| 03:05:33 | dongs | skips at 160% |
| 03:05:54 | Mikachu | pixelma: on ipods, the peakmeters makes stuff skip even if you're in the _menu_ |
| 03:06:09 | dongs | 150% doesnt skip |
| 03:06:15 | dongs | probably about max |
| 03:06:36 | | Join telliott_ [0] (n=telliott@68-179-149-245.bsr-c3-d1.evv.dhcp.sigecom.net) |
| 03:07:13 | telliott_ | Is the current daily build for V1 recorder broken? |
| 03:07:51 | dongs | is gray ipods still broken with rockbox? |
| 03:08:17 | Mikachu | i have heard amiconn talk a lot about grayscale ipods lately |
| 03:08:22 | dongs | hrm |
| 03:08:35 | Mikachu | well, black and white, but grayscale in rockbox |
| 03:08:38 | dongs | hopefully that means good things |
| 03:08:44 | | Join JoeXBorn [0] (n=rootmeis@130.sub-70-208-97.myvzw.com) |
| 03:09:10 | Mikachu | i do not know if they play mp3 at realtime |
| 03:09:16 | Mikachu | if they are the ones with broken cpu cache |
| 03:09:41 | dongs | surely, if original firmware plays mp3, then its a bug in rockbox :P |
| 03:10:00 | Mikachu | it has two cpus, rockbox only uses one |
| 03:10:07 | Mikachu | dan_a is working on that |
| 03:11:54 | dongs | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5755 |
| 03:11:54 | dongs | hurm |
| 03:12:29 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 03:14:19 | telliott_ | I tried yesterday's build and poweroff (double press "off") seems to be broke for my V1 recorder. |
| 03:14:26 | | Quit JoeyBorn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 03:16:02 | Paul_The_Nerd | I believe the 4G grayscale plays MP3 realtime just fine (not including freeze-bugs), the 3G does not yet. |
| 03:16:59 | | Part pixelma |
| 03:17:09 | Mikachu | ah |
| 03:18:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | The PP5002 have that broken cache issue, which means that it'll need to be worked around. And it's not like we were "comfortably" realtime on other iPods anyway |
| 03:19:12 | | Nick _hotwire_ is now known as hotwire_ (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 03:19:39 | hotwire_ | can anyone tell me offhand how many buttons are on the LCD remotes, and their rough orientation? |
| 03:20:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | Which LCD remotes? |
| 03:20:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | And "11" for the h100 one. |
| 03:21:45 | Paul_The_Nerd | You have three rockers (you can tilt them left or right, for two buttons, and push them in for a third, total of 9) with two rockers on the top of the remote, one on the bottom, and Play and Stop buttons on the face of the remote. |
| 03:22:07 | telliott_ | The build for 8/15 works cporrectly. |
| 03:22:16 | telliott_ | correctly |
| 03:25:39 | telliott_ | . |
| 03:25:43 | | Part telliott_ |
| 03:28:06 | | Join _hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 03:29:14 | ShadowdogMU | Anyone creative here, I need a new domain |
| 03:29:23 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 03:29:44 | Mikachu | just type characters into your browser until no page appears |
| 03:30:00 | ShadowdogMU | _-_ |
| 03:32:43 | fatherfork | what's the site for? |
| 03:34:02 | | Nick qwx is now known as qwm (n=qwm@h229n1fls34o1010.telia.com) |
| 03:34:12 | ShadowdogMU | Just a personal site to have fun with |
| 03:34:18 | ShadowdogMU | I current as www.brockarthur.com (my name) |
| 03:34:26 | ShadowdogMU | currently have* |
| 03:34:43 | Mikachu | just use your ip in decimal |
| 03:34:53 | ShadowdogMU | <.> |
| 03:34:55 | ShadowdogMU | >.< |
| 03:34:55 | fatherfork | www.brockarthurrocks.com |
| 03:35:00 | ShadowdogMU | haha fatherfork |
| 03:35:09 | fatherfork | ha |
| 03:35:28 | Mikachu | 1092418765 |
| 03:35:30 | Mikachu | there you are |
| 03:35:35 | fatherfork | www.onthebrocks.com |
| 03:36:39 | | Join Sinbios [0] (n=Sinbios@HSE-Hamilton-ppp3513671.sympatico.ca) |
| 03:36:40 | ShadowdogMU | haha, on the brocks |
| 03:37:00 | Mikachu | or arthurfromthebrocks.com |
| 03:37:09 | fatherfork | yeah man |
| 03:37:22 | fatherfork | on the brocks, shaken, not stirred |
| 03:37:29 | fatherfork | er something to that affect |
| 03:39:17 | _hotwire_ | Paul_The_Nerd: Any suggestion of a keyboard assignment of the keys for the UISim? |
| 03:41:24 | dongs | am i gonna get battery charging on nano while playing and plugged into usb? |
| 03:41:40 | | Quit JoeXBorn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 03:41:41 | Mikachu | i think the net effect might be drain |
| 03:41:58 | Mikachu | unknown register needs to be flipped to enable full charging is my understanding |
| 03:42:45 | Paul_The_Nerd | dongs: I get charging. |
| 03:43:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | I think it's kinda on the edge though, it depends on how high your boost % ends up during playback |
| 03:43:54 | _hotwire_ | Paul_The_Nerd: I'm gonna try to implement support for the LCD remote buttons in the UISim. |
| 03:44:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | _hotwire_: I don't know what would be good honestly. No clue. |
| 03:44:48 | _hotwire_ | How about QWE, RTY, XCV, and SD for Stop and Play/Pause? |
| 03:45:43 | Mikachu | that would suck if you don't use qwerty |
| 03:45:59 | _hotwire_ | true, but the vast majority do. |
| 03:46:09 | Mikachu | unfortunately :( |
| 03:46:16 | * | Mikachu pities the vast majority |
| 03:46:22 | _hotwire_ | With all those buttons, there isn't any more real estate on the numpad |
| 03:46:41 | Paul_The_Nerd | _hotwire_: You could always do 1-0 and - for the normal number bar? |
| 03:46:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, 123, 456, 789, 0 and - |
| 03:49:14 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 03:49:37 | hotwire_ | That I could try, so long as it doesn't interfere with the other numbers on the numpad |
| 03:49:56 | hotwire_ | however, in labellign them, we'd have to specify which "1 2 3 etc depending |
| 03:50:12 | hotwire_ | maybe label the BMP with yellow numbers for main keyboard and leave red for the numpad? |
| 03:50:49 | hotwire_ | anyway, i'm heading out for a pint... will be back later... feel free to discuss and I'll try to implement the consensus |
| 03:56:08 | | Join sharpe [0] (i=sharpe@user-0c8hc2c.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 03:57:15 | sharpe | I'm back everyone! |
| 03:58:52 | Mikachu | hooray |
| 04:00 |
| 04:00:35 | sharpe | Yep. Back to answer meaningless questions... |
| 04:04:21 | fatherfork | Sharpe, wht is the sky blue? |
| 04:04:23 | fatherfork | why |
| 04:04:28 | fatherfork | WHY??? |
| 04:05:05 | sharpe | fatherfork: Because. It is. |
| 04:05:17 | Mikachu | actually it is because of rayleigh diffraction |
| 04:05:53 | Mikachu | molecules in the atmosphere happen to have the right size for blue light to spread |
| 04:06:25 | fatherfork | yeah yeah, only the blue it let through except at thicker atmospheric point, ie. at sunrise and sunset |
| 04:06:28 | Mikachu | http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/atmos/blusky.html |
| 04:07:09 | fatherfork | no, that's why the moon and sun change colors, my bad |
| 04:07:17 | | Quit _hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:07:21 | Mikachu | all light is let through |
| 04:07:31 | Mikachu | the effect is rather that blue light is not let through |
| 04:07:41 | fatherfork | yeah yeah |
| 04:07:49 | fatherfork | I really didn't mean to start a discussion |
| 04:08:02 | sharpe | Well, what else is there to discuss? |
| 04:08:06 | fatherfork | I liked "because it is" |
| 04:08:06 | Mikachu | i know |
| 04:08:14 | Mikachu | i was just being annoying |
| 04:08:22 | sharpe | Fun sucker. |
| 04:08:27 | fatherfork | um, i still want to know why rockbox plays music, that has to be a bug. |
| 04:08:28 | | Part Paul_The_Nerd |
| 04:08:45 | Mikachu | yeah, it should be rocking my box |
| 04:08:48 | sharpe | fatherfork: It's one of the elusive, polymorphic bugs we cannot find. |
| 04:09:10 | fatherfork | jeez well f******* FIX IT ALREADY |
| 04:09:17 | fatherfork | gah |
| 04:09:28 | sharpe | Well, there is a fix for it. |
| 04:09:38 | Mikachu | fatherfork: rm .rockbox/codecs -rf |
| 04:09:40 | fatherfork | no, I want it to be coded in |
| 04:09:59 | Mikachu | you mean coded out? |
| 04:10:05 | fatherfork | I still want all the codecs to work, I just don't want music to play when I select it |
| 04:10:11 | sharpe | Or built in? |
| 04:10:26 | Mikachu | or laid carefully on top |
| 04:10:26 | sharpe | Ah. Easy. We can just comment out lines in the code. :) |
| 04:10:33 | fatherfork | no, coded in, it's a bug, it should be coded in. you have no idea what you're talking about. |
| 04:10:40 | Mikachu | or tied to the bottom with a very delicate piece of string? |
| 04:10:51 | sharpe | Sleeping with the fishes? |
| 04:11:05 | Mikachu | capisko? |
| 04:21:54 | | Join JoeyBorn [0] (n=rootmeis@adsl-75-3-25-93.dsl.chcgil.sbcglobal.net) |
| 04:23:55 | [HO]volt | so was the -72 to +6 volume system worked into all of rockbox or just my beloved iAudio x5? |
| 04:27:40 | sharpe | [HO]volt: It's dependant on the hardware. |
| 04:28:23 | sharpe | For instance, on an iPod 5G the scale goes from -58db to +6db. |
| 04:28:56 | apo` | [HO]volt, my iPod 4G has -74 to +6 |
| 04:29:16 | | Quit juxtap (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:29:36 | Mikachu | i never bothered checking the minimum |
| 04:32:15 | fatherfork | yeah, on the iPod the volume does go very low |
| 04:32:25 | | Quit midkay ("Leaving") |
| 04:32:28 | fatherfork | it's still a little loud when listening in bed |
| 04:33:40 | [HO]volt | so does that mean that anything above 0 is clipping (similar to Archos Recorders clipping at 92 and above)? |
| 04:33:52 | Mikachu | that depends on the input file level |
| 04:33:55 | [HO]volt | And that 0 is the maximum output without clipping by the mp3 player |
| 04:33:58 | | Join Ranix [0] (n=Ranix@dynamic-acs-24-154-118-84.zoominternet.net) |
| 04:34:08 | [HO]volt | i see... |
| 04:34:18 | Mikachu | below zero is at least guaranteed not to clip |
| 04:34:43 | [HO]volt | but 0 may clip |
| 04:34:48 | Mikachu | probably not |
| 04:35:05 | Mikachu | i am not sure exactly |
| 04:35:10 | Mikachu | but i think 0 is also safe |
| 04:35:29 | | Join midkay [0] (n=midkay@rockbox/developer/midkay) |
| 04:35:34 | [HO]volt | alright, i'll do some tests. |
| 04:36:44 | fatherfork | is there anyway to get the iPod volume to go lower? |
| 04:36:59 | Mikachu | i am fairly sure it's a hardware limit |
| 04:37:52 | Mikachu | you can use replaygain to change the volume further |
| 04:37:56 | Mikachu | (the pre-amp setting) |
| 04:38:11 | Mikachu | that will let you go down an additional -12 dB |
| 04:38:17 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:38:31 | fatherfork | oh that's true |
| 04:38:37 | fatherfork | I'll try it, thanks |
| 04:38:51 | Mikachu | i am not sure if it applies pre-amp if no tags are found |
| 04:38:52 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 04:38:58 | fatherfork | I have tags |
| 04:39:11 | fatherfork | 3 and a half hours worth of freakin tags |
| 04:39:15 | Mikachu | haha |
| 04:39:24 | Mikachu | okay, no foreseen problems then |
| 04:39:56 | | Join _jhMikeS_ [0] (n=jethead7@adsl-68-252-4-207.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net) |
| 04:40:11 | | Nick gtkspert_ is now known as gtkspert (n=gtkspert@203-59-171-67.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 04:40:31 | fatherfork | wow, yeah that does work |
| 04:40:32 | fatherfork | nice |
| 04:40:32 | | Quit JoeyBorn (Connection timed out) |
| 04:40:42 | fatherfork | thanks Mikachu |
| 04:40:46 | Mikachu | hooray |
| 04:40:58 | Mikachu | only problem is it takes five minutes to scroll to -12 :) |
| 04:41:15 | fatherfork | does the pre-amp do anything to decode time? |
| 04:41:22 | fatherfork | I mean, playback speed |
| 04:41:26 | fatherfork | I mean, uh, you know |
| 04:41:27 | Mikachu | did you have replaygain enabled already? |
| 04:41:30 | | Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:41:30 | fatherfork | yes |
| 04:41:39 | fatherfork | so I guess no |
| 04:41:41 | Mikachu | then let's hope the pre-amp is premultiplied with the tag gain |
| 04:41:50 | fatherfork | makes sense |
| 04:42:13 | fatherfork | and I just went to -5 |
| 04:42:43 | Mikachu | i guess you'd want to use as little pre-amp as possible |
| 04:42:49 | Mikachu | to not lose dynamic range |
| 04:42:55 | Mikachu | is that the right word? |
| 04:43:07 | Mikachu | sample precision anyway |
| 04:43:51 | fatherfork | yeah, I understand that |
| 04:44:32 | fatherfork | it's already "under-amping" most of my songs to -10 anyway |
| 04:44:44 | | Nick _jhMikeS_ is now known as jhMikes (n=jethead7@adsl-68-252-4-207.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net) |
| 04:45:07 | Mikachu | i wonder if it'd be possible to make rockbox change the hw volume based on replaygain and only do the fractional part in software |
| 04:45:26 | fatherfork | um... huh? |
| 04:45:33 | Mikachu | if the tag is -7.5dB |
| 04:45:34 | fatherfork | lost me a little there |
| 04:45:37 | Mikachu | and you have the volume set at -5dB |
| 04:45:52 | Mikachu | then when you open the file, rb sets the volume at -12dB and applies -.5dB in software |
| 04:45:52 | fatherfork | ah, yeah i gotcha |
| 04:45:59 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 04:46:00 | JdGordon | does anyone else think its bloody stupid that if u dont have a /Playlists folder and try going into the playlist ctaglog screens it will complain instead of just making it? |
| 04:46:07 | Mikachu | yes |
| 04:46:11 | Mikachu | that is bloody stupid :) |
| 04:46:13 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 04:46:21 | Mikachu | or "do you want to create it?" |
| 04:46:32 | fatherfork | it should make it, and store the playlists you create there, instead of in /root |
| 04:46:39 | Mikachu | but probably you did since you selected the playlist catalog |
| 04:48:35 | fatherfork | Mikachu, one more question... do you think it detrimental at all to set pre-amp to -5 then adjust hardware volume back up to compensate while listening normally just so I don't have to keep changing the pre-amp levels? |
| 04:48:54 | Mikachu | nah i doubt it's possible to hear the difference |
| 04:49:02 | Mikachu | but you're asking mr 100kbps ogg |
| 04:49:09 | fatherfork | haha |
| 04:49:17 | fatherfork | well it hasn't skipped yet |
| 04:49:24 | fatherfork | with at least 256 mp3 |
| 04:49:42 | Mikachu | you can look at the audio thread debug screen to get an idea of processor load |
| 04:49:51 | Mikachu | wait a minute or two and see what 'boost %' is |
| 04:49:53 | fatherfork | that on the unit itself? |
| 04:50:00 | fatherfork | debug? |
| 04:50:04 | Mikachu | info -> debug (keep out!) -> audio thread |
| 04:50:32 | fatherfork | boost is 100% |
| 04:50:38 | fatherfork | ok, 94% |
| 04:50:41 | Mikachu | you didn't wait a minute or two yet |
| 04:50:49 | Mikachu | i know this, because a minute has not passed |
| 04:50:56 | fatherfork | true |
| 04:51:07 | Mikachu | it only keeps track while you're in the screen |
| 04:51:12 | fatherfork | ah |
| 04:51:50 | fatherfork | that's cool that the cpu frequency changes on the fly |
| 04:53:28 | Mikachu | what is it now? |
| 04:53:36 | Mikachu | or when you got bored |
| 04:53:40 | fatherfork | hey the top black bar, "pcm", the longer the black, the higher the load? |
| 04:53:51 | Mikachu | no, only the boost % says what the load is |
| 04:53:52 | fatherfork | haha, I'm still not bored |
| 04:53:55 | fatherfork | ok |
| 04:54:02 | fatherfork | still 95% |
| 04:54:03 | Mikachu | the pcm bar is the decoded audio buffer |
| 04:54:06 | fatherfork | ah |
| 04:54:07 | Mikachu | oh |
| 04:54:18 | Mikachu | the other one is encoded audio |
| 04:54:19 | fatherfork | bad? |
| 04:54:23 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 04:54:32 | Mikachu | i'd say it's a tad high |
| 04:54:33 | | Quit XavierGr () |
| 04:54:34 | | Quit Ranix (Client Quit) |
| 04:54:38 | Mikachu | you're not scrolling around with the wheel or anything? |
| 04:54:45 | | Quit actionshrimp ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.01 :: www.XLhost.de )") |
| 04:54:51 | fatherfork | nope |
| 04:55:01 | Mikachu | well, i haven't tried 256kbps in that screen |
| 04:55:10 | Mikachu | what player is it exactly? |
| 04:55:11 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 04:55:27 | fatherfork | I turned the pre-amp back to 0 |
| 04:55:30 | fatherfork | will report |
| 04:55:39 | Mikachu | are you using the eq too? |
| 04:55:42 | fatherfork | no |
| 04:55:53 | fatherfork | not even crossfeed |
| 04:56:01 | fatherfork | crossfade is on |
| 04:56:10 | Mikachu | what ipod do yo uhave? |
| 04:56:14 | fatherfork | 5G |
| 04:56:16 | fatherfork | 60 |
| 04:56:18 | Mikachu | ah |
| 04:56:32 | Mikachu | that would explain it |
| 04:56:52 | fatherfork | yeah, no broadcom support |
| 04:56:59 | fatherfork | is that why? |
| 04:57:05 | fatherfork | bigger screen the problem? |
| 04:57:06 | Mikachu | no.. none of the other ipods even have that chip :) |
| 04:57:09 | fatherfork | ah |
| 04:57:11 | Mikachu | the bigger screen is the problem |
| 04:57:15 | fatherfork | i thought the nano did |
| 04:57:20 | sharpe | fatherfork: Nope... |
| 04:57:27 | fatherfork | oh |
| 04:57:33 | Mikachu | why would anyone put a hw video decoder in a nano? |
| 04:57:34 | fatherfork | same architecture? |
| 04:57:42 | fatherfork | no, not the broadcom chip |
| 04:57:48 | fatherfork | just the regular one |
| 04:57:54 | sharpe | The... processor? |
| 04:57:58 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 04:58:01 | Mikachu | the regular one is just a cpu, well two |
| 04:58:09 | Mikachu | we know how to use the cpu :) |
| 04:58:18 | fatherfork | yeah, I know that |
| 04:58:25 | Mikachu | i use the word "we" in the broad sense here |
| 04:59:06 | fatherfork | I mean, don't the 5G and nano use the same processor? |
| 04:59:29 | Mikachu | yes |
| 04:59:48 | Mikachu | but drawing the screen on the 5g takes much longer |
| 04:59:53 | fatherfork | so why is processor ... |
| 04:59:55 | fatherfork | right |
| 04:59:55 | Mikachu | and the debug screen does a lot of screen drawing |
| 05:00 |
| 05:00:01 | fatherfork | that's what I asked |
| 05:00:02 | Mikachu | probably more than the wps even |
| 05:00:33 | fatherfork | mikachu, btw, with pre-amp at 0, boost is 90% |
| 05:00:41 | Mikachu | hm, that's weird |
| 05:00:45 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 05:01:50 | Mikachu | if (global_settings.replaygain_preamp) |
| 05:01:53 | Mikachu | gain = (long) (((int64_t) gain * preamp) >> 24); |
| 05:01:57 | Mikachu | so it's premulted |
| 05:02:30 | * | JdGordon hopes he doesnt get his ass kicked for this... |
| 05:02:45 | Mikachu | uh this code is weird |
| 05:03:03 | Mikachu | oh right |
| 05:03:04 | Mikachu | nm |
| 05:03:35 | * | Mikachu kicks JdGordon's ass just in case |
| 05:03:40 | JdGordon | lol |
| 05:04:15 | fatherfork | haha |
| 05:04:16 | | Quit pike (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 05:04:53 | | Join solarflare [0] (n=supernov@hy-ovpn2-5.vpn.helsinki.fi) |
| 05:05:17 | JdGordon | grrr.. have the builds frozen again? |
| 05:07:58 | * | Mikachu watches nobody get surprised |
| 05:10:13 | JdGordon | no, it just took a few min to start! |
| 05:10:27 | Mikachu | maybe it was only a bit cold then |
| 05:10:39 | sharpe | Or maybe too hot, so it had to cool down. |
| 05:12:32 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 05:12:42 | * | JdGordon is impatient and wants to make a page scraper so i can get rss from the cvs build page |
| 05:13:20 | sharpe | Wouldn't be too hard. |
| 05:17:51 | Mikachu | i don't know if they want people to start rss pinging the poor 2mbit server every 5 minutes |
| 05:19:09 | JdGordon | no.. but im doing that anyway after a commit and its annoying coz it downloades all the pics every time |
| 05:19:20 | Mikachu | oh, get a better browser |
| 05:19:24 | scorche | use lynx =P |
| 05:19:26 | JdGordon | ff |
| 05:19:57 | Mikachu | set your browser up better..er.. more well? |
| 05:21:22 | fatherfork | more betterer |
| 05:21:39 | BHSPitMonkey | gooder, people. |
| 05:21:57 | fatherfork | no, my old band director said gooder, kill them all |
| 05:22:40 | fatherfork | I recommend safari |
| 05:22:40 | BHSPitMonkey | anyone here who's good at calculus, and good at explaining concepts |
| 05:23:00 | BHSPitMonkey | +? |
| 05:23:04 | fatherfork | nope |
| 05:23:14 | * | fatherfork failed math, and life |
| 05:23:50 | sharpe | I'm taking Ap Calculus this year... |
| 05:26:41 | fatherfork | man that box keeps getting more green |
| 05:26:53 | BHSPitMonkey | sharpe, undertsands "Limits" fully? |
| 05:27:09 | sharpe | Eh. Not fully, no. |
| 05:28:07 | | Join pike [0] (i=amiga@c83-249-120-24.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 05:29:19 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 05:29:56 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 05:38:13 | Mikachu | BHSPitMonkey: explaining math over irc is never easy |
| 05:39:01 | Mikachu | limits are basically a way to be able to say that 0/0 = 1 |
| 05:39:03 | BHSPitMonkey | probably |
| 05:39:14 | BHSPitMonkey | oh dear |
| 05:39:14 | Mikachu | :P |
| 05:39:15 | BHSPitMonkey | lol |
| 05:39:28 | BHSPitMonkey | well, I'm going in early tomorrow for tutorials |
| 05:39:29 | Mikachu | but like, the chapter on limits is 50 pages or something |
| 05:39:35 | BHSPitMonkey | so hopefully that should clear some things up |
| 05:39:35 | Mikachu | i doubt i can sum it up for you |
| 05:39:46 | Mikachu | it's better to ask your teachers |
| 05:39:50 | Mikachu | that's what you pay them for |
| 05:39:54 | BHSPitMonkey | lol hahaha |
| 05:40:00 | BHSPitMonkey | at a public high school? ;) |
| 05:40:12 | BHSPitMonkey | maybe it's what my parents and the taxpayers pay them for |
| 05:40:22 | Mikachu | oh, high school calculus heh |
| 05:40:33 | BHSPitMonkey | it's AP Calculus BC, thank you |
| 05:40:45 | Mikachu | the random letters don't really tell me much |
| 05:40:46 | BHSPitMonkey | that's college Calculus 1 & 2 |
| 05:41:02 | BHSPitMonkey | wrapped together into one headache package |
| 05:41:13 | Mikachu | and why are you taking it in high school? |
| 05:41:37 | BHSPitMonkey | because it's free now, and NOT free later? |
| 05:41:47 | Mikachu | i see |
| 05:41:54 | scorche | aye...i did the same thing |
| 05:41:54 | Mikachu | it's always free in sweden |
| 05:42:00 | BHSPitMonkey | ah. |
| 05:42:05 | scorche | took BC, then stats |
| 05:42:10 | BHSPitMonkey | well, college in usa is 'spensive |
| 05:42:17 | Mikachu | yeah i know |
| 05:42:19 | BHSPitMonkey | stats doesn't sound like a fun class |
| 05:42:21 | sharpe | I have to do Ap Calculus AB Online :\ |
| 05:42:23 | scorche | it was |
| 05:42:23 | BHSPitMonkey | then again neither does calc |
| 05:42:34 | BHSPitMonkey | sharpe, why? |
| 05:42:35 | scorche | teacher was fun |
| 05:42:40 | scorche | maybe she made it fun |
| 05:42:46 | scorche | calc sucked |
| 05:42:47 | sharpe | BHSPitMonkey: Conflicts with my schedule. |
| 05:42:47 | Mikachu | our calculus teacher was awesome too |
| 05:43:00 | BHSPitMonkey | but didn't you take BC?? |
| 05:43:43 | | Quit jhMikes ("Client exited") |
| 05:43:45 | sharpe | No? |
| 05:44:01 | scorche | well, he has plenty of time to take it yet |
| 05:44:18 | BHSPitMonkey | sharpe, my apologies |
| 05:44:27 | sharpe | Haha :) |
| 05:44:29 | BHSPitMonkey | sharpe and scorche blended together in my weary eyes :( |
| 05:44:36 | BHSPitMonkey | I must rest |
| 05:44:48 | scorche | ew... |
| 05:44:54 | scorche | pardon me while i go take a shower |
| 05:44:57 | sharpe | That's odd. |
| 05:45:05 | BHSPitMonkey | nice interpretation there |
| 05:45:17 | BHSPitMonkey | I of course was referring to the names :P |
| 05:45:26 | scorche | still ew |
| 05:45:41 | * | BHSPitMonkey shrugs |
| 05:45:44 | scorche | midkay: he thought i looked like a dog =( |
| 05:45:45 | BHSPitMonkey | to each his own |
| 05:46:03 | sharpe | ... |
| 05:47:02 | | Join mihalis [0] (n=mihalis@adsl-71-159-136-1.dsl.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 05:47:18 | mihalis | got a problem... need major help =/ |
| 05:47:43 | scorche | mihalis: it is a little hard to help you if we dont knwo what is wrong =) |
| 05:47:44 | midkay | i wish the entire shar pei species went extinct. |
| 05:48:04 | mihalis | okay lemme explain... i just wanted to make sure someone was awake here... thx |
| 05:48:08 | scorche | midkay: harsh... |
| 05:48:19 | midkay | breed* |
| 05:48:19 | midkay | :) |
| 05:48:21 | fatherfork | haha |
| 05:48:32 | midkay | scorche: we'd all be better off! |
| 05:48:44 | scorche | mihalis: just because people dont respond, doesnt mean that people arent watching |
| 05:48:55 | scorche | it is better to simply get the question out |
| 05:49:06 | fatherfork | so I have learned as well |
| 05:49:53 | mihalis | i installed rockbox on my archos jukebox recorder 15... it's been working fine for about a month or so since... just now i changed the batteries, only to now get a message "Hard Drive Error; Please Check HD" when it's starting... |
| 05:49:57 | mihalis | any suggestions? |
| 05:50:02 | scorche | midkay: maybe we can kill them all and procure some kind of anti-wrinkle cream and get rich! |
| 05:50:06 | fatherfork | I'm trying to make a potato gun, can somebody tell me step-by-step instruction and make me a diagram? |
| 05:50:19 | fatherfork | (just kidding) |
| 05:50:33 | mihalis | i searched for this message on altavista, and rockbox stuff came up... particularly a chat which took place on this channel, which is how i got here.. |
| 05:50:50 | scorche | mihalis: odd... |
| 05:51:05 | fatherfork | you take the batteries out while it was on? |
| 05:51:05 | midkay | scorche: yeah... but we'd just get some lack-of-wittiness cream, if anything. |
| 05:51:12 | fatherfork | or not completely off yet/ |
| 05:51:14 | scorche | do you have rockbox flashed, or was this the original firmware speaking? |
| 05:51:43 | mihalis | the original firmware... not good, eh? |
| 05:51:55 | mihalis | it just says underneath it.. "OS Version 1.28" |
| 05:52:05 | scorche | yeah...that is original |
| 05:52:29 | scorche | hmmm...i have not heard it going off about the HD after putting in new batteries |
| 05:52:48 | scorche | does it say the same thing if you put the previous set of batteries in? |
| 05:52:57 | mihalis | yup... |
| 05:53:04 | mihalis | i tried that |
| 05:53:21 | scorche | do you have an external battery charger? |
| 05:53:58 | mihalis | i'd send it back, but the warranty is expired... i always have to charge my batteries externaly, as the internal charger port broke 6 months after i got it |
| 05:54:11 | mihalis | but the mp3 player has worked fine for 2 years since then |
| 05:54:40 | scorche | i once changed out new batteries in mine...had a similar problem...once i charged them externally, then put them in....it worked |
| 05:54:46 | mihalis | i know the batteries are good.. and i always use NiMH rechargeables |
| 05:55:01 | mihalis | these were charged externally |
| 05:55:49 | mihalis | i'm thinking my ol'"Gigameister" may have finally bit the dust... |
| 05:56:01 | * | mihalis named his mp3 player... |
| 05:56:04 | scorche | not all batteries are good...i have tried a set of cheap generic ones that did not have the resistance (?) to spin up the hard drive...but work fine in my mouse |
| 05:56:22 | mihalis | these were duracell... the expensive kind |
| 05:56:35 | fatherfork | it really doesn't sound like a battery problem |
| 05:56:49 | mihalis | and i'd used these 2 sets many times, charging one set while the others were in use |
| 05:57:01 | | Join Drkepilogue [0] (n=46e784d0@labb.contactor.se) |
| 05:57:04 | scorche | mihalis: will it boot into usb mode? |
| 05:57:11 | mihalis | nope... |
| 05:57:25 | * | mihalis thinks its a permanent hardware problem... *sigh* |
| 05:57:45 | scorche | well, i dont know much else to say, other than to try a different hard drive |
| 05:57:46 | mihalis | and the sad thing is that i've babied this thing ever since i got it |
| 05:57:56 | scorche | happen to have a spare 2.5? =P |
| 05:58:18 | mihalis | a what? |
| 05:58:27 | scorche | 2.5 inch hard drive |
| 05:58:43 | fatherfork | it's a 2.5 in that thing? |
| 05:58:47 | scorche | yes |
| 05:59:07 | scorche | i put a 160 gig drive in mine =P |
| 05:59:08 | * | fatherfork searches |
| 05:59:30 | fatherfork | oh wow, yeah those things were rocks |
| 05:59:34 | mihalis | no... i did have the presence of mind to back up all the material on it whenever the charger on it broke... i figured it was probably just a matter of time |
| 05:59:39 | fatherfork | (not to be confused with bricks) |
| 05:59:48 | mihalis | ever since then, ive always kept backups of everything on it |
| 05:59:58 | scorche | too bad that the hardware doesnt address sectors above 128 gigs...but it serves its purpose =) |
| 06:00 |
| 06:00:01 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S01060016b649355d.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 06:00:09 | fatherfork | haha |
| 06:00:10 | scorche | mihalis: that is a good practice with anything =) |
| 06:00:27 | * | mihalis will probably not get another archos... |
| 06:00:29 | billytwowilly | hey, I don't see anything about a bookmarking feature on the webpage, does rockbox support bookmarking? |
| 06:00:32 | scorche | but all i can say is to try a different hard drive |
| 06:00:43 | fatherfork | mihalis, in a couple weeks I'll have an extra 60gig you can buy from me cheep |
| 06:00:47 | sharpe | billytwowilly: yes. |
| 06:00:50 | scorche | yeah...they are great devices....but are getting pretty outdated |
| 06:00:57 | mihalis | i'm going with an ipod next time... and yes, i know i'll wind up paying for advertising, but hopefully it will work better |
| 06:01:10 | fatherfork | nah I love my iPod |
| 06:01:19 | fatherfork | it's not all hype |
| 06:01:26 | sharpe | billytwowilly: and i'm pretty sure there is somewhere on the website that mentions bookmarking. and if not, it's in the manual. |
| 06:01:26 | mihalis | thats what i hear |
| 06:01:32 | billytwowilly | sharpe: bookmarking like I can save multiple bookmarks or bookmarks as in the lame way the ipod does it? |
| 06:01:40 | scorche | the bumpers on the archos are really great =) |
| 06:01:48 | sharpe | billytwowilly: I don't use it, so I couldn't tell you. |
| 06:01:50 | billytwowilly | sharpe: ever used a rio karma? bookmarking like that or like the ipod? |
| 06:01:54 | billytwowilly | darn. |
| 06:01:56 | sharpe | Nope. |
| 06:02:01 | * | billytwowilly goes to look at the manual |
| 06:02:08 | scorche | i dont mind the size at all when i consider that i have a 160 gig hd in there =P |
| 06:02:18 | mihalis | fatherfork: you don't sayy |
| 06:02:26 | fatherfork | indeed |
| 06:02:31 | mihalis | i happen to be in the market for one |
| 06:02:35 | mihalis | ;) |
| 06:02:43 | mihalis | lets talk business... |
| 06:02:43 | fatherfork | can you wait no more than two weeks? |
| 06:02:50 | mihalis | i can wait two weeks |
| 06:02:58 | fatherfork | I mean, I'll have it in less than two weeks |
| 06:03:07 | mihalis | sure... |
| 06:03:10 | fatherfork | awesome |
| 06:03:12 | mihalis | take your time |
| 06:03:29 | billytwowilly | hmm. |
| 06:03:30 | fatherfork | I'm getting a macbook, and immediately upgrading the hard drive |
| 06:03:32 | scorche | mihalis: i would purchase one at a store or something first (so that you can return it) just to make sure that it really is the hard drive |
| 06:03:34 | billytwowilly | I wonder if I still have my old rockbox. |
| 06:03:37 | mihalis | thatll give me time for my next paycheck.. heh |
| 06:03:42 | billytwowilly | if I do I'll sell it to someone cheap.. |
| 06:03:44 | | Quit rotator ("zzzzzzzzzz") |
| 06:03:55 | mihalis | fatherfork: where are you located? |
| 06:04:03 | * | mihalis is in dallas, texas |
| 06:04:04 | fatherfork | scorche has a point, if it works, return it and buy it from me cheep |
| 06:04:16 | * | fatherfork is in Atlanta, Georgia |
| 06:04:56 | mihalis | i dunno scorche... i was about to upgrade anyhow.. |
| 06:05:02 | | Join Iris [0] (n=raghavse@125.23.53.151) |
| 06:05:08 | mihalis | 15GB isn't enoguh space... mine is completely full |
| 06:05:09 | sharpe | Ahah, Georgia. Haha. So funny... |
| 06:05:10 | Iris | hi |
| 06:05:13 | Iris | just installed rockbox |
| 06:05:13 | | Quit Drkepilogue ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 06:05:18 | fatherfork | why is that funny? |
| 06:05:20 | sharpe | Iris: Yay? |
| 06:05:24 | Iris | how do i see my music |
| 06:05:28 | Iris | in the apple os |
| 06:05:33 | scorche | mihalis: well, with fatherfork's drive, it would be 60 |
| 06:05:49 | sharpe | It isn't, I'm in a very irritable mood, have a headache, tried... :) I just said it for no reason. It isn't funny at all. |
| 06:06:03 | Iris | Can I access my music in apple OS if i installed rockbox |
| 06:06:08 | mihalis | yeah... my "backup" of my drive contains everything i would LIKE to have on it, and it's under 20 GB |
| 06:06:20 | sharpe | Iris: Yes |
| 06:06:24 | scorche | sharpe: what exactly did you "tried..."? |
| 06:06:25 | mihalis | and includes everything that is on it, plus some stuff that wont fit |
| 06:06:27 | Iris | how? |
| 06:06:52 | fatherfork | mihalis, souonds like I'll have what you need then |
| 06:06:52 | scorche | mihalis: well, i dont have that much music, but i also use my device and an easy and portable external hd |
| 06:06:59 | sharpe | scorche: Eh. I... tried... hmm. I tried to not be tired, but failed. |
| 06:07:03 | mihalis | fatherfork: are you a regular in this channel? |
| 06:07:09 | sharpe | Iris: Use Tagcache? |
| 06:07:11 | fatherfork | I seem to be now |
| 06:07:22 | Iris | tagcache?? |
| 06:07:30 | sharpe | It's in the manual... |
| 06:07:42 | mihalis | about what were you thinking of selling your ipod for? |
| 06:07:56 | Iris | i get that but cant I use the apple os in the manual its for rockbox |
| 06:08:00 | scorche | mihalis: he was offering a 60 gig hard drive..not a 60 gig ipod |
| 06:08:12 | mihalis | oh... |
| 06:08:14 | sharpe | Iris: No, the Rockbox manual... |
| 06:08:14 | mihalis | gotcha |
| 06:08:20 | * | mihalis misunderstood |
| 06:08:22 | fatherfork | indeed, just a drive |
| 06:08:30 | mihalis | whoa |
| 06:08:51 | mihalis | big misunderstanding... i was wondering why someone would get rid of an ipod... |
| 06:08:56 | fatherfork | that was the point of the whole buy it from a store so you can return it thing |
| 06:09:00 | mihalis | unless something was wrong with it |
| 06:09:08 | Iris | ok |
| 06:09:09 | mihalis | gotcha... |
| 06:09:11 | sharpe | Iris: Ahh. Wait. Yes. Yes you can, nevermind what I had said. I though you had asked something else. |
| 06:09:18 | fatherfork | yeah, me and mine are inseparable |
| 06:09:28 | mihalis | i was wondering why that comment was even relevant... now i undertand |
| 06:09:32 | mihalis | understand =P |
| 06:09:39 | fatherfork | haha |
| 06:09:48 | fatherfork | you still want it though? |
| 06:09:50 | Iris | and how do i play games and all that calculator and the plugins etc... |
| 06:09:55 | mihalis | umm... no hehe |
| 06:10:00 | fatherfork | ah well |
| 06:10:03 | fatherfork | ebay! |
| 06:10:08 | mihalis | i really think im going with the ipod |
| 06:10:11 | billytwowilly | woot, it appears to be closer to the karma bookmarking functionality than the ipod. score. |
| 06:10:12 | fatherfork | yeah |
| 06:10:12 | sharpe | Ah, via the menu. |
| 06:10:21 | billytwowilly | anyone running this on a nano? how's the battery life? |
| 06:10:47 | mihalis | the only downside to it, of course, is non-upgradeability |
| 06:11:03 | Iris | . If i install rockbox my apple os is useless right? |
| 06:11:10 | scorche | Iris: no |
| 06:11:13 | sharpe | Iris: Not at all. |
| 06:11:19 | Iris | then... |
| 06:11:26 | fatherfork | mihalis, by the time you fill it up, it'll be time to upgrade anyway |
| 06:11:30 | Iris | I got no notes, no contacts no music no pics |
| 06:11:43 | * | scorche has over 100 gigs of music |
| 06:11:45 | sharpe | Iris: Is it the latest Apple firmware? |
| 06:11:46 | fatherfork | by the time you have used it for a few weeks, you'll jump on any new iPod apple releases |
| 06:11:48 | * | scorche glances at fatherfork |
| 06:12:04 | Iris | yop |
| 06:12:08 | * | fatherfork has a fist in scorche's face |
| 06:12:24 | scorche | there is a reason i stick with my archos ;) |
| 06:12:30 | sharpe | There are some issues with the latest firmware and Rockbox, specifically, not showing anything. You'll have to downgrade your firmware... |
| 06:12:56 | fatherfork | I only have 20 gigs of music, but a hundred or so gigs of video |
| 06:13:25 | billytwowilly | lol |
| 06:13:33 | Iris | how do i downgrade |
| 06:13:44 | billytwowilly | I'm waiting for the terrabyte drives before I buy something that plays video.. I'd need it to hold my video collection;) |
| 06:13:44 | scorche | i have a few terabytes of video =) |
| 06:13:51 | Iris | and how do i exit this stupid space game |
| 06:13:56 | fatherfork | frikk |
| 06:14:12 | scorche | billytwowilly: MUCH cheaper to just get a ton of 250s and raid them |
| 06:14:22 | mihalis | yah... i never thought id fill up my 15 GB... nothing but music on it, and yet it's not nearly enough |
| 06:14:25 | sharpe | Iris: You'll just have to extract the firmware from a previous installer, and then install it with the bootloader, instead of the one you extract off your iPod. |
| 06:14:28 | billytwowilly | scorche: how do you backup all of it? I'm trying to decide.. I've got it on a raid array now.. |
| 06:14:38 | billytwowilly | scorche: I'm talking about for the pmp |
| 06:14:40 | billytwowilly | err. pmps |
| 06:14:45 | fatherfork | raid redundancy |
| 06:14:48 | fatherfork | rocks |
| 06:14:54 | scorche | indeed |
| 06:15:01 | billytwowilly | can be misleading though. |
| 06:15:04 | mihalis | i have a 120gb hard drive with music and videos... which i share on undernet ;) |
| 06:15:06 | Iris | how do i do that??? |
| 06:15:12 | billytwowilly | if your raid card dies you're screwed. |
| 06:15:14 | sharpe | i have a raid controller, which i don't use... |
| 06:15:21 | fatherfork | depend on the kinf |
| 06:15:24 | fatherfork | kind* |
| 06:15:24 | | Part solarflare ("Leaving") |
| 06:15:35 | scorche | billytwowilly: i started out burning onto dvds...that got old very fast with how much crap i have |
| 06:15:39 | sharpe | Iris: Are you on widows? |
| 06:15:41 | mihalis | well thanx for the help... |
| 06:15:43 | fatherfork | aren't raid 0s the most unstable? |
| 06:15:43 | sharpe | windows. |
| 06:15:46 | Iris | yes |
| 06:15:47 | mihalis | i'm hitting the hay |
| 06:15:49 | mihalis | g'nit |
| 06:15:51 | mihalis | e |
| 06:15:53 | fatherfork | night |
| 06:15:56 | scorche | now, i put it onto a hard drive, then stash the hard drives away |
| 06:15:56 | | Quit apo` ("Leaving") |
| 06:16:06 | billytwowilly | scorche: I'm in that position now. I just upgraded my comp to a 1 terrabyte raid array... |
| 06:16:07 | | Part mihalis |
| 06:16:10 | scorche | when i want to access those hard drives, i put them in my removable drive trays |
| 06:16:16 | | Join apo [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 06:16:16 | billytwowilly | but backing it up I'd need hundreds of dvds |
| 06:17:06 | scorche | billytwowilly: basically, i raid the drives that i use on a contstant basis, and stash the drives for storage that i dont use often |
| 06:17:17 | billytwowilly | hmm. |
| 06:17:20 | billytwowilly | interesting. |
| 06:17:39 | billytwowilly | still expensive though. |
| 06:17:40 | billytwowilly | fark. |
| 06:17:48 | billytwowilly | I'm a poor college student. |
| 06:17:54 | scorche | much cheaper than terabyte drives |
| 06:17:55 | Iris | sharpe: How do i downgrade |
| 06:18:07 | scorche | i usually get 250s for about $50 each |
| 06:18:13 | scorche | nice seagates |
| 06:18:17 | fatherfork | where from? |
| 06:18:22 | scorche | my connections ;) |
| 06:18:22 | sharpe | Iris: Ah, just use ipodwizard to downgrade the firmware, which will allow you to use an older ipod updater, which you can just install rockbox after using the updater. |
| 06:18:35 | Iris | ipodwizard? |
| 06:18:46 | sharpe | Iris: http://ipodwizard.net/ |
| 06:19:07 | sharpe | Which we can't really provide support for. |
| 06:19:08 | scorche | hell, i got my 160 gig perpendicular laptop drive for $60 when tehy were selling on newegg at 300 each =) |
| 06:19:22 | fatherfork | dang |
| 06:19:32 | fatherfork | you gotta hook me up |
| 06:19:38 | fatherfork | ok, you don't gotta, but come on |
| 06:19:41 | scorche | which is why i dont care about that 32 gigs lost |
| 06:20:00 | sharpe | Well. I'm going to go. Headaches suck. Later everyone. |
| 06:20:02 | | Quit sharpe ("Leaving") |
| 06:21:26 | fatherfork | I need a hitachi travelstar 7K100, can you get it? |
| 06:22:08 | fatherfork | if you can get me that sucker for 40 bucks, I'll double it and you can keep the extra 40 |
| 06:22:55 | scorche | not sure...my contact in in california atm |
| 06:23:02 | scorche | and i am not |
| 06:23:33 | fatherfork | they comin back soon? |
| 06:24:09 | scorche | no idea...he is in a wandering stage of his life =/ |
| 06:24:15 | fatherfork | ah |
| 06:24:16 | fatherfork | oh well |
| 06:24:21 | scorche | yeah |
| 06:24:33 | scorche | i need some more drives as well... |
| 06:25:09 | scorche | if/when i get back in contact with him, i will let you know |
| 06:25:09 | fatherfork | well if you get in contact with him, remember me |
| 06:25:12 | scorche | lol |
| 06:25:16 | fatherfork | ha, awesome |
| 06:26:19 | fatherfork | this is incredibly off topic, but have you (or anyone here) ever sold anything on ebay? |
| 06:26:29 | scorche | yes |
| 06:26:49 | scorche | if you wish to talk more, go private message...we have spammed the logs enough =) |
| 06:26:59 | fatherfork | indeed |
| 06:27:01 | | Part Iris |
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| 06:41:00 | | Quit BenPod (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
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| 06:44:16 | fatherfork | so in rockbox, after I release hold on my iPod, the first few key-presses don't register |
| 06:44:47 | | Quit apo (Remote closed the connection) |
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| 06:46:38 | NHeal | kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net |
| 06:46:38 | NJoin | slimeball [0] (i=jew@trailer-park.net) |
| 06:46:53 | NJoin | mocker [0] (n=ks@mocker.org) |
| 06:46:57 | NJoin | ScoTTie [0] (n=scott@unaffiliated/scottie) |
| 06:47:00 | NJoin | lex [0] (i=lex@evot.us) |
| 06:47:28 | NJoin | Bjoern-Erik [0] (n=unknown@164.80-202-111.nextgentel.com) |
| 06:47:35 | NJoin | webmind [0] (i=webmind@feather.perl6.nl) |
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| 06:48:06 | | Quit fatherfork () |
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| 06:53:40 | NJoin | dwihno [0] (n=dw@81.8.226.44) |
| 06:59:28 | NJoin | Ave [0] (i=ave@GKDXXXII.dsl.saunalahti.fi) |
| 06:59:29 | NJoin | bk [0] (n=bk@cpe-24-195-202-150.nycap.res.rr.com) |
| 06:59:42 | | Join Bg3r [0] (n=bager@87.246.10.62) |
| 06:59:43 | *** | Server message 505: 'logbot_ :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )' |
| 07:00 |
| 07:01:39 | NJoin | NastY [0] (i=nasty@pi.nxs.se) |
| 07:01:48 | * | NastY is gone. bbl |
| 07:03:50 | NJoin | chendo__ [0] (n=chendo@203-206-100-80.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 07:12:36 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 07:28:58 | | Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-70-112-165-230.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 07:32:35 | | Quit Rob2222_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 07:32:47 | | Part Paul_The_Nerd |
| 07:40:17 | Bg3r | morning |
| 07:40:38 | JdGordon | morning |
| 07:41:22 | | Join muesli|delhi [0] (n=muesli_t@125.23.51.51) |
| 07:42:28 | Bg3r | ;) |
| 07:42:40 | Bg3r | damned thunderbird ... |
| 07:43:33 | Bg3r | just realised that i've sent the .c file in the mail as text ... |
| 07:44:10 | JdGordon | meh.. its ok |
| 07:44:39 | Bg3r | ;) |
| 07:53:08 | | Join hotwire__ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 07:54:00 | | Quit hotwire_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 07:54:28 | Bg3r | hm.... |
| 07:54:57 | JdGordon | hmm? |
| 07:55:52 | Bg3r | will anyone object if i make impossible to turn off the player with h300 non-lcd remote ? |
| 07:56:05 | JdGordon | proably.. why? |
| 07:56:11 | Bg3r | because |
| 07:56:25 | JdGordon | doesnt the hardware auto turn off if yu hold down off? not software? |
| 07:56:41 | Bg3r | it has only REW,FF, Play/Pause(used to turn on the player), Vol UP and Vol Down |
| 07:56:58 | Bg3r | it's fully software function on iriver hxxx |
| 07:57:05 | JdGordon | ok |
| 07:57:13 | Bg3r | so |
| 07:57:28 | Bg3r | for example in the wps |
| 07:57:53 | Bg3r | i can't see how it would be possible to go to the file tree if short play/pause is "pause" and long is "turn off" |
| 07:58:31 | JdGordon | how did it used to work? |
| 07:58:38 | Bg3r | i have no idea :) |
| 07:58:42 | JdGordon | hehe |
| 07:58:56 | Bg3r | but i'm with older build at the moment (~ last one before the action stuff) |
| 07:58:57 | hotwire__ | can anyone give me a list of the current iriver lcd remote button map? |
| 07:59:00 | Bg3r | so i can try |
| 07:59:13 | JdGordon | play+rew to go back to tree? |
| 07:59:16 | Bg3r | hotwire__: can u wait a bit? |
| 07:59:31 | JdGordon | hotwire__: firmware/export/button.h |
| 07:59:50 | hotwire__ | how does 8 hours sound? I went to the pub tonight... fill in the rest |
| 08:00 |
| 08:00:04 | JdGordon | hehe |
| 08:00:54 | hotwire__ | JdGordon... I was looking more in terms of the physical locations. If i do I mapping on the keyboard for the remote buttons, i'd like it to roughly resemble the real thing... I don't have an iriver to base from. |
| 08:01:03 | JdGordon | oh |
| 08:01:06 | JdGordon | righto |
| 08:01:19 | JdGordon | there should be pics in the wiki? |
| 08:01:40 | hotwire__ | i had made a posting a few hours ago (maybe 5 hours), about how to lay out the keys |
| 08:01:48 | hotwire__ | could you tell me where in the wiki? |
| 08:02:12 | hotwire__ | as stated, unfamiliarity with the iriver ports has me at a disadvantage. |
| 08:02:17 | Bg3r | JdGordon: ah, yes, that is idea, hmmm... |
| 08:02:39 | Bg3r | (play + rew) |
| 08:02:50 | JdGordon | hotwire__: i dunno.... i can only tell yo the h100 lcd remote |
| 08:03:23 | hotwire__ | 2 pints of one beer, 1 pint of another... one black velvet (guiness and strongbow, layered), and an irish carbomb. |
| 08:03:26 | | Join theli_ua [0] (n=theli@mail.ukrcard.com.ua) |
| 08:03:36 | JdGordon | sounds like fun |
| 08:04:03 | scorche | i am of the opinion that irish carbombs can only be drunk on st. pattys day |
| 08:05:17 | JdGordon | Bg3r: you can close 5830 once you fix the remote buttons please? |
| 08:05:21 | Bg3r | http://www.barnonedrinks.com/recipes/shooters/t/thetrueirishcarbomb.html |
| 08:05:34 | Bg3r | JdGordon: okies |
| 08:06:45 | Bg3r | JdGordon: btw, what should be changed so when exiting from the settings stuff with left to be "accept" and not "cancel" |
| 08:07:12 | JdGordon | change it from ACTION_STD_CANCEL to _OK |
| 08:07:18 | Bg3r | where ? |
| 08:07:23 | JdGordon | we have agreed to go that way have we? |
| 08:07:30 | JdGordon | in the list context |
| 08:07:41 | | Join hotwire_ [0] (n=christop@toronto-HSE-ppp4321977.sympatico.ca) |
| 08:07:47 | Bg3r | isn't that also used by the file browser and menu tree ... |
| 08:08:01 | Bg3r | so it won't go "up" anymore with left ? |
| 08:08:49 | | Quit EbErT () |
| 08:09:02 | hotwire_ | from the UISims, it looks like the models with an LCD remote have the same model of lcd remote |
| 08:09:13 | JdGordon | no, the tre context is sepearte... the h100 keymap file is terrible :p |
| 08:09:20 | Bg3r | JdGordon: yep |
| 08:09:25 | Bg3r | :D |
| 08:09:44 | Bg3r | i immediately get a headache when i look into it :D |
| 08:09:48 | JdGordon | haha |
| 08:10:27 | * | JdGordon bbl |
| 08:10:38 | Bg3r | JdGordon: so, u want to tell me that menus and tree use CONTEXT_TREE ? |
| 08:10:45 | | Join Paul_The_Nerd [0] (n=Paul_The@cpe-70-112-165-230.austin.res.rr.com) |
| 08:10:51 | hotwire_ | well, i'm gonna log off for a few hours to get that sleep i was talking about. |
| 08:10:53 | Paul_The_Nerd | Y'know, it's nice to see 0-score builds again |
| 08:10:54 | hotwire_ | good night all. |
| 08:11:08 | | Join Zagor [0] (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor) |
| 08:11:18 | | Quit hotwire_ (Client Quit) |
| 08:18:56 | | Join ender` [0] (i=null@84.52.165.220) |
| 08:23:17 | | Quit hotwire__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 08:30:58 | | Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@ACB5A203.ipt.aol.com) |
| 08:32:31 | amiconn | Anyone with an ipod already noticed that using the wheel doesn't update the 'last user activity' variable? |
| 08:33:08 | Bagder | sandisk info receive, arm jtag adventure should be able to move to next stage |
| 08:33:18 | Bagder | receiveD |
| 08:33:18 | amiconn | I've had my mini switch off several times while playing sudoku, even though I scrolled back & forth more or less constantly... |
| 08:33:20 | Bg3r | Bagder: what info ?:) |
| 08:33:44 | Bagder | Bg3r: about their jtag setup and how they power the board when they jtag it |
| 08:35:03 | Bagder | now we should be able to connect the jtag and run for it |
| 08:35:27 | Bg3r | very good news, indeed |
| 08:35:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Is that perhaps why I can't seem to wake the backlight with the wheel? I have to press a button, and THEN scroll for volume it seems. |
| 08:36:09 | Bagder | and in the meantime, MrH has done some really fine lcd research for the H10 port |
| 08:36:10 | amiconn | Waking the backlight with the wheel works for me |
| 08:36:25 | amiconn | That's why I was scrolling so much in sudoku... |
| 08:36:55 | amiconn | Paul_The_Nerd: Maybe you have "first keypress enables backlight only" enabled? |
| 08:37:22 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: Oh, I definitely have that enabled, because my settings got cleared. I had assumed that the scrollwheel would count as a keypress after a certain distance, or something. |
| 08:37:35 | amiconn | Then using the wheel obviously doesn't count as keypress when backlight is off |
| 08:37:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | That's frustrating. |
| 08:37:51 | amiconn | Two odd bugs wrt wheel... |
| 08:38:06 | * | amiconn still doesn't like the wheel |
| 08:38:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | I just never got along with touch-sensitive surfaces. |
| 08:38:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | Laptop touchpads hate me. |
| 08:39:19 | amiconn | Touchpads are ok-ish for me because of the space constraints. Still better than those trackpoints |
| 08:39:24 | | Join pondlife [0] (n=Miranda@cpc1-rdng11-0-0-cust472.winn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 08:39:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | The problem I have is that half the time I touch them, and they don't respond to me, or they're very jumpy. |
| 08:40:02 | amiconn | I sometimes have the same problem, also with the ipod wheel |
| 08:40:10 | amiconn | I touch it and nothing happens... |
| 08:40:31 | | Join LinusN [0] (n=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN) |
| 08:40:33 | Paul_The_Nerd | Of course *now* the iPod wheel is waking the backlight for me. |
| 08:40:44 | Bagder | morning LinusN |
| 08:40:51 | LinusN | moo |
| 08:40:54 | Bagder | LinusN: seen the sansa mail? |
| 08:41:00 | LinusN | yes |
| 08:41:04 | amiconn | m00 |
| 08:41:12 | Bg3r | amiconn, Paul_The_Nerd so this "first keypress enables backlight only" should be off for ipods by default ? |
| 08:41:29 | amiconn | Bg3r: No, but the wheel should count as keypress... |
| 08:41:35 | Paul_The_Nerd | amiconn: I think it does. |
| 08:41:41 | Paul_The_Nerd | I think my wheel just wasn't picking up my scrolls earlier today |
| 08:41:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | It's working fine now that I'm home. |
| 08:41:49 | amiconn | ...both for waking the backlight _and_ resetting the poweroff timeout |
| 08:42:06 | | Quit muesli|delhi ("ich will Kühe!!!") |
| 08:42:53 | Bg3r | aha |
| 08:42:57 | amiconn | On a related matter, while sudoku saves state when quitting, it does not do so when the poweroff timeout hits while being in there |
| 08:43:15 | Bagder | amiconn: that's to teach you solve the puzzles faster! ;-P |
| 08:43:21 | amiconn | I guess that's the case with several other plugins as well which usually save state |
| 08:43:54 | amiconn | I also think a lot more plugins should disable the backlight timeout while they run |
| 08:44:24 | amiconn | Including, but not limited to: sudoku, chessbox, doom |
| 08:44:39 | JdGordon | <Bg3r> JdGordon: so, u want to tell me that menus and tree use CONTEXT_TREE ?<- no, but both contexts return the same list for iriver |
| 08:44:48 | | Join mikearthur [0] (n=mike@82-41-205-190.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 08:44:58 | Bg3r | amiconn: disable or set to a bigger timeout (like 1-2 min) ? |
| 08:45:07 | amiconn | Disable |
| 08:45:42 | amiconn | The longest available timeout is 90 seconds, and I would expect a user to run a plugin on purpose |
| 08:45:57 | Bg3r | probably |
| 08:46:15 | Bg3r | but |
| 08:46:20 | amiconn | Note: _not_ all plugins should do this, only ones with graphical interaction |
| 08:46:21 | Bg3r | what if someone calls u ? |
| 08:46:54 | Bagder | I agree, sudoku and jeweles etc probably should just have a very long timeout |
| 08:47:04 | Bagder | not entirely disabled |
| 08:47:09 | Bg3r | yep |
| 08:47:30 | | Quit mikearthur (Client Quit) |
| 08:48:27 | | Join mikearthur [0] (n=mike@82-41-205-190.cable.ubr11.edin.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 08:48:28 | | Quit mikearthur (Remote closed the connection) |
| 08:48:40 | JdGordon | http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=5881.0 <- that looks cool! |
| 08:48:45 | Bg3r | Bagder: did you send the e-mail to the mailing list ? i guess u didn't |
| 08:48:54 | Bagder | no I didn't |
| 08:49:13 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@AAubervilliers-152-1-32-253.w83-114.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 08:49:15 | Bagder | I'm mailing back and forth quite a lot with the guy and I only occationally show them |
| 08:50:08 | Paul_The_Nerd | Wow, I'm getting about 35 fps with the 16x9 Elephants Dream movie on my Nano now. |
| 08:50:16 | * | Bagder faints |
| 08:50:44 | Paul_The_Nerd | At least on Nano, the speeds are going to be more than acceptable it seems. |
| 08:51:05 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, Sandisk is turning out to be moderately helpful then? |
| 08:51:24 | Bagder | moderately, yes, about things that they are in complete control over |
| 08:51:30 | Bagder | ie not source code |
| 08:51:38 | Bagder | or cpu details |
| 08:51:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | Well, that was pretty much expected anyway. |
| 08:51:45 | Bagder | yeah |
| 08:51:52 | Paul_The_Nerd | I kinda wish Portalplayer would've at least been polite enough to reject me. |
| 08:51:59 | Bagder | with luck, we can suck out some goodies using jtag |
| 08:52:47 | Paul_The_Nerd | Y'know, I don't think I've heard heard "suck out some goodies" be used in a hardware context. |
| 08:53:09 | Bagder | :-) |
| 08:53:24 | Bagder | you need to imagine a harsh sweeedish accent on that too ;-) |
| 08:53:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | Hahaha |
| 08:53:54 | Paul_The_Nerd | Swedish accents make everything better. |
| 08:54:02 | Bagder | bork bork bork |
| 08:55:00 | Paul_The_Nerd | I actually have a videogame that gives "Bork Bork" as a language option. |
| 08:55:19 | Zagor | doesn't google too? |
| 08:55:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | Google does as well, yes. |
| 08:59:25 | amiconn | JdGordon: My opinion: The 2-line approach wastes too much screen space and the one-line approach doesn't work well on small screens (and very bad on charcell) |
| 08:59:56 | amiconn | The recording trigger uses a similar layout as this one-line approach, and imho it's ugly... |
| 09:00 |
| 09:00:28 | LinusN | i like the 2-line approach, but i would like to skip the edit state on the booleans |
| 09:00:43 | LinusN | a single right-click to toggle would be enough imho |
| 09:00:57 | | Join einhirn [0] (i=Miranda@bsod.rz.tu-clausthal.de) |
| 09:03:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | Just aesthetically, I like the way the two-line method looks. |
| 09:03:50 | amiconn | Way too much empty screen space... |
| 09:04:05 | amiconn | I'd rather keep the settings a separate screen |
| 09:04:58 | amiconn | If we want to show the current value of a setting without entering it, we could perhaps use some kind of pop-up "bubble" (framed box) that appears next to the selected line |
| 09:05:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | We should probably just leave it as it is now. |
| 09:05:40 | amiconn | My mobile phone does it this way, and it looks way better than a list with more spaces than text imho |
| 09:05:55 | Paul_The_Nerd | With viewports some more options will open up anyway. |
| 09:07:20 | | Join Gnelik [0] (n=Miranda@193.110.17.19) |
| 09:12:40 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 09:14:51 | | Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!") |
| 09:18:19 | Gnelik | Who knows how work with Sansa going there is no news for a week |
| 09:18:22 | Gnelik | ??? |
| 09:18:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | Gnelik: When there's news, there will be news. |
| 09:18:52 | Bagder | Gnelik: feel free to make things happen |
| 09:18:57 | Bagder | like fixing the sim |
| 09:19:17 | Bagder | Gnelik: we hope to test drive the jtag on it soonish |
| 09:21:11 | Bagder | and |
| 09:21:22 | | Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c210-49-190-113.eburwd8.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 09:21:28 | Bagder | we still haven't had anyone test a mi4 with full length plain data |
| 09:21:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | Full length plain data? |
| 09:22:04 | Bagder | yeah, the mi4 has a counter for "amount of unencrypted data" |
| 09:22:11 | | Join petur [0] (n=d4efd6a6@labb.contactor.se) |
| 09:22:18 | Bagder | the idea that perhaps we can set that to the full file size |
| 09:22:32 | Bagder | and skip the TEA encryption |
| 09:22:49 | Bagder | mi4code can set that length field |
| 09:23:16 | Bagder | no encryption and a fake signature would be great ;-) |
| 09:23:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | That almost sounds too easy |
| 09:23:40 | Bagder | yeah, but the dummy dsa sig worked... |
| 09:27:37 | Bagder | armu-ice certainly doesn't do much of noise on the net |
| 09:27:58 | Bagder | SanDisk quote: "Our dev team use multi-ice or ARMU-ice" |
| 09:28:39 | Bagder | http://www.kaise.com.tw/studio/product/ice/armub_ice/armub_ice.php |
| 09:29:10 | Paul_The_Nerd | Hehehe |
| 09:29:26 | | Quit Gnelik (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 09:30:21 | Bg3r | Bagder: u understand all of the page, yep ? :) |
| 09:30:29 | Bagder | oh yes of course |
| 09:30:31 | Bagder | ;-) |
| 09:30:42 | Bagder | try their front page |
| 09:31:03 | | Quit petur ("worrrk") |
| 09:31:07 | Bagder | my guess is they focus on asian customers ;-) |
| 09:32:29 | Bg3r | http://www.kaise.com/NEWWebpage2/english.htm ? |
| 09:32:52 | Bg3r | nothing interesting here :) |
| 09:37:43 | | Join perplexity [0] (i=heh10903@dxb-as59277.alshamil.net.ae) |
| 09:39:16 | | Join juxtap [0] (n=juxtap@mtngprs7.mtn.co.za) |
| 09:42:21 | | Join webguest85 [0] (n=c27f0812@labb.contactor.se) |
| 09:43:46 | webguest85 | In english.lang, I read: If you want to remove a string, just blank it, don't actually remove it! And further: If you re-order things or remove entries, you must bump... Does it still hold? |
| 09:46:39 | amiconn | yes |
| 09:48:56 | amiconn | And you should refrain from bumping the language version. This should be a very rare operation, since it also breaks voice files |
| 09:49:14 | | Quit _Veseliq_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 09:50:08 | webguest85 | amiconn: so the old entries that are no more needed should be retained as a dead ballast? |
| 09:50:36 | amiconn | The strings should be set to empty (""). Then they will take up a single byte in th e.lng |
| 09:51:24 | amiconn | Unused voice entries should of course also be set to empty |
| 09:51:25 | webguest85 | What about Id? |
| 09:51:56 | amiconn | The ID has to stay unique |
| 09:52:43 | amiconn | Iirc you can set it to something else, e.g. LANG_BLAH could become LANG_BLAH_UNUSED |
| 09:52:53 | | Join _Veseliq_ [0] (n=veseliq@195.85.215.210) |
| 09:53:34 | amiconn | This *should* make the matching entries from other .lang files no longer match, so they're also not used anymore |
| 09:53:39 | webguest85 | Is there a standard comment for unused items, e.g. "made obsolete by patch XYZ (FS#xxxx)"? |
| 09:53:50 | amiconn | This may break the uplang script though, so better keep the ID as-is |
| 09:54:12 | amiconn | the standard comment is "DEPRECATED" |
| 09:54:44 | webguest85 | Without telling why/since when? |
| 09:54:46 | amiconn | uplang can detect this iirc (Bagder?) |
| 09:55:00 | amiconn | You can see why/when in the cvs history |
| 09:55:13 | webguest85 | Ok |
| 09:56:44 | webguest85 | Another point (it has been discussed here of in forums recently): the stop button acts as 'Stop' on press, not on release. Are there plans to change that? |
| 09:58:26 | amiconn | why? |
| 09:58:46 | midgey34 | I just added a patch to the tracker that changes some plugins I mentioned a few days ago to use the menu API |
| 09:58:49 | midgey34 | http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5839 |
| 09:59:03 | amiconn | Triggering on press is always preferred, but of course it's only possible if the button has no dual function |
| 09:59:04 | aliask | webguest85: JdGordon said he's working on it atm |
| 09:59:18 | Slasheri | webguest85: yes, it seems stop has been broken once again |
| 09:59:38 | Slasheri | this was probably the 4th or 5th time :D |
| 10:00 |
| 10:00:01 | Paul_The_Nerd | There are complaints of setting the time/date not working |
| 10:00:56 | webguest85 | The reason I ask is: how can we tell the pressing of stop from holding stop down (which leads to shut down)? |
| 10:02:46 | amiconn | The question is why? |
| 10:03:11 | LinusN | why should it not stop the music when you turn off? |
| 10:03:53 | amiconn | LinusN: Hehe, to save battery? ;) Playing w/o being powered... |
| 10:04:11 | * | linuxstb would welcome suggestions for a "real" video to encode as mpegplayer test files |
| 10:05:14 | webguest85 | I want to know what screen was active just before shut down (e.g. radio). With the current logic, this will always be file browser. |
| 10:05:36 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: Night of the Living Dead was released into the public domain, thought it's black and white. |
| 10:06:45 | LinusN | webguest85: and why do you want that? |
| 10:06:45 | linuxstb | Paul_The_Nerd: Yes, www.archive.org has a lot of black and white movies - not good tests... But they do also have some colour movies, so I'll just need to keep searching... |
| 10:06:48 | Zagor | webguest85: press is sent immediately, hold slightly later |
| 10:07:11 | linuxstb | I guess to resume to that screen on boot? |
| 10:07:18 | LinusN | aha |
| 10:07:28 | webguest85 | linuxstb: yes |
| 10:07:29 | linuxstb | Which I think could be nice. |
| 10:07:47 | webguest85 | linuxstb: see patch 5049 |
| 10:07:53 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: Out of curiosity, what about Elephants Dream or whatever makes it a bad test? |
| 10:08:10 | LinusN | maybe it's a good idea to turn the screen display into a state machine? |
| 10:08:20 | LinusN | shouldn't be *that* hard |
| 10:08:39 | linuxstb | Paul_The_Nerd: It's too digital - i.e. very easy for the encoder to encode at low bitrates. |
| 10:09:27 | linuxstb | mpegplayer performance is very dependent on the bitrate - you can easily increase the fps by lowering the bitrate. The question I want to answer is what bitrate should we aim to make mpegplayer support. |
| 10:09:49 | * | markun bought a iriver T30 last night |
| 10:10:00 | markun | but the rockbox port will have to wait a bit :) |
| 10:10:07 | * | linuxstb was considering a T30.... |
| 10:10:07 | ze | mpeg is optimized for "real" images isn't it? |
| 10:10:13 | webguest85 | LinusN: I think that would make RB structure clearer. I don't know RB well though. |
| 10:10:26 | | Join _FireFly_ [0] (n=FireFly@p54A46030.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:10:28 | ze | sorry if i'm naive for jumping in in the middle, but ya know |
| 10:10:38 | ze | typically video encoding schemes do lousy at "digital" sorts of images |
| 10:10:53 | ze | unless they're specifically made for it |
| 10:10:54 | linuxstb | ze: I would assume so. But some source material is easier to encode than others. So we need to find out what bitrate gives reasonable quality for most source files. |
| 10:10:57 | markun | linuxstb: it is used, but I payed only EUR 45 (for the 1GB version) |
| 10:11:25 | linuxstb | markun: Can you drag-and-drop files via USB? |
| 10:11:30 | ze | well yeah |
| 10:11:35 | markun | yes |
| 10:11:48 | ze | just don't assume that because it should be easy to encode in theory, that it's easy to encode for a particular codec |
| 10:11:55 | markun | You can choose to update it with a UMS or MTP firmware |
| 10:11:57 | ze | clipart type things are very easy to encode for say gzip |
| 10:12:00 | webguest85 | LinusN: so there's no chance to correctly detect the screen before shut down without further time and thread related tricks? |
| 10:12:03 | ze | and difficult to encode for jpeg |
| 10:12:29 | LinusN | webguest85: or move the stop action to stop+rel |
| 10:13:01 | ze | but yeah i guess a representative "normal" source type of thing is generally what you wanna use as a model |
| 10:13:25 | ze | which means i just jumped in to pick nits :p |
| 10:14:12 | webguest85 | LinusN: what's that stop+rel? |
| 10:14:27 | LinusN | sorry, BUTTON_OFF|BUTTON_REL |
| 10:14:44 | Bg3r | webguest85: what target ? |
| 10:14:59 | | Join dan_a [0] (n=dan-mirc@wormhole.domicilium.com) |
| 10:15:55 | webguest85 | Bg3r: iriver H1xx |
| 10:16:52 | webguest85 | LinusN: that would mean stop fires on release, not on press? |
| 10:17:00 | LinusN | yes |
| 10:17:38 | webguest85 | LinusN: is only one place in code to change? Or is that definition in many places? |
| 10:17:45 | | Quit Rob2222 () |
| 10:18:05 | Bg3r | webguest85: one place |
| 10:18:15 | LinusN | webguest85: apps/keymaps/keymap-h1xx_h3xx.c |
| 10:18:16 | Bg3r | apps/keymaps/keymap-h1x0_h3x0.c |
| 10:18:20 | LinusN | :-) |
| 10:18:26 | Bg3r | beaten :) |
| 10:18:48 | linuxstb | markun: One problem with respect to porting Rockbox to the T30 is that there doesn't seem to be any failsafes against installing a bad firmware - so even though the encryption has been cracked, running our own test code will be tricky. People who have modified the images in the T30 firmware have managed to brick their players. |
| 10:20:07 | Bagder | that's a tricky situation |
| 10:20:10 | Bg3r | webguest85: what do you complain about btw ? stop in filetree ? |
| 10:20:31 | | Join Rob2222 [0] (n=Miranda@ACB5A203.ipt.aol.com) |
| 10:20:54 | webguest85 | Bg3r, LinusN: so if I'd do it, the change would be platform specific, right? Is it good? |
| 10:21:00 | markun | linuxstb: perhaps the way tomazs did it (change WMA player into a bootloader) |
| 10:21:13 | Bg3r | webguest85: i'm currently working on this file |
| 10:21:15 | webguest85 | Bg3r: stop in radio, recording and WPS |
| 10:21:22 | Bg3r | and yes, platform specific |
| 10:21:34 | Bagder | markun: yeah the gmini400 also seem to exploit an avi overflow to start code |
| 10:21:34 | Bg3r | webguest85: strange... in the wps it should work ok |
| 10:22:04 | webguest85 | Bg3r: sorry, didn't tries WPS recently |
| 10:22:15 | Bg3r | webguest85: try it |
| 10:22:41 | LinusN | the problem is that reacting on key release makes the interface feel sluggish |
| 10:22:53 | webguest85 | Bg3r: I can't atm. But if you say it works then I take it for granted :-) |
| 10:22:57 | linuxstb | One odd thing about the T30 is that the ARM code in the firmware image is big-endian... |
| 10:23:06 | Bagder | uuu |
| 10:23:09 | Bg3r | webguest85: don't take it for granted |
| 10:23:12 | markun | yes, that is strange |
| 10:23:13 | Bg3r | :P |
| 10:23:13 | Bagder | well arm can be set big-endian... |
| 10:23:16 | Bagder | just very unusual |
| 10:23:46 | webguest85 | LinusN: yes, that's a dilemma :-( |
| 10:23:55 | Bagder | possibly they use some big-endian chips or memory-related stuff which made the opt for big-endian all the way |
| 10:26:23 | LinusN | so, how about making the screen display use a state variable instead? |
| 10:26:45 | | Join lightyear [0] (n=lightyea@p54876E1E.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:26:50 | LinusN | it would help flatten out the ui, and allow for more flexible screen transitions |
| 10:26:56 | | Quit Sinbios ("If the definition of a klutz is someone who doesn't have eyes on their ass, then yes, I suppose I am a klutz.") |
| 10:27:05 | Bagder | LinusN: makes sense |
| 10:27:39 | LinusN | so the main loop would simply switch on the state variable and call the appropriate screen function |
| 10:27:40 | Bagder | then all screens would need ->enter and ->leave functions and then we could jump around between them in any manner |
| 10:27:45 | webguest85 | LinusN: I tried it. I added tracking code to radio_screen() and recording_screen(). But I can't figure out where should I track playback start/stop. |
| 10:28:08 | LinusN | tracking? |
| 10:28:40 | Bagder | LinusN: so I vote for a little 'struct screen' with function pointers for the enter/exit functions and one main switch to go between the states |
| 10:29:24 | webguest85 | LinusN: yes, a have a variable that tells which screen is active now. It's set to 'RADIO' at the start of radio_screen() and is restored just before return −− as an example. |
| 10:29:40 | LinusN | restored to what? |
| 10:30:12 | webguest85 | LinusN: to the value it had before entering radio_screen. |
| 10:30:28 | LinusN | i suggest a set_screen() function that sets the state variable to the screen to be displayed |
| 10:30:53 | LinusN | and the main loop enters that screen |
| 10:31:01 | Bagder | yeps |
| 10:31:10 | Bagder | or perhaps goto_screen() |
| 10:31:33 | webguest85 | LinusN: that wouldn't solve the problem. You press and hold stop. The screen changes from radio to file browser (or whatever) −− and the info is lost. |
| 10:31:42 | LinusN | goto_screen() might not be a good name, since it won't actually go to that screen until you return to the main loop |
| 10:31:47 | | Join A_M [0] (n=51e2cbe3@labb.contactor.se) |
| 10:32:05 | LinusN | webguest85: you are correct, i'm not trying to solve your specific problem here |
| 10:32:08 | Bagder | LinusN: no, but you request a goto to that screen |
| 10:32:27 | Bagder | anyway, the exact name is not important |
| 10:32:39 | Paul_The_Nerd | webguest85: But then with "resume on startup" enabled, the state of the previous non-filetree screen could be stored. |
| 10:32:53 | Paul_The_Nerd | So, instead of just resuming a playlist, it could remember that it was Radio or Recording instead. |
| 10:32:57 | Bagder | indeed |
| 10:32:58 | Paul_The_Nerd | And resume one of those. |
| 10:33:00 | LinusN | Paul_The_Nerd: but how do you resume to the file tree then? |
| 10:33:07 | Paul_The_Nerd | Disable "Resume on startup" |
| 10:33:21 | LinusN | fair enough |
| 10:33:51 | Bagder | or shutdown the player while showing the file tree |
| 10:33:51 | webguest85 | LinusN: no, I want to have the screen I had before shut down. Even if it was file browser. |
| 10:34:21 | Paul_The_Nerd | Bagder: Well, the problem with that is that with "Stop" being an on-press action, pressing and holding it displays filetree before shutting down |
| 10:34:21 | | Quit alberink (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:34:22 | LinusN | that could be solved in two ways: |
| 10:34:33 | LinusN | 1) use the release event |
| 10:34:37 | Bagder | Paul_The_Nerd: ah right |
| 10:34:54 | webguest85 | Paul_The_Nerd: this is exactly I'm talking about |
| 10:34:57 | | Join mantono [0] (n=mantono@c83-250-204-173.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 10:35:25 | LinusN | 2) handle it in the tree code by checking if sys_poweroff is the first event after returning from a screen |
| 10:35:36 | * | Paul_The_Nerd likes #2 |
| 10:35:53 | Bagder | yeah, #2 is probably the way |
| 10:35:58 | Bagder | even though slightly more hackish |
| 10:36:09 | LinusN | the problem is that sys_poweroff might be preceded by a BUTTON_OFF|BUTTON_REPEAT |
| 10:36:10 | Paul_The_Nerd | Just because I fear someone pressing stop, seeing it not leave the playback screen, holding it a few seconds thinking the UI is sluggish, and shutting down, and filing a bug report about stop not working. |
| 10:36:27 | Zagor | won't the tree be displayed anyway, since there is a delay before the poweroff event is sent? |
| 10:36:46 | Bagder | Zagor: shown yes, but it wouldn't have to be stored as the "last screen shown" |
| 10:37:18 | Bagder | since the guy actually pressed STOP to shutdown in another screen |
| 10:37:22 | Zagor | could be quite confusing though |
| 10:37:26 | Bagder | yes I agree |
| 10:37:30 | Paul_The_Nerd | How 'bout this: |
| 10:37:32 | LinusN | btw, i think the file browser would be just another screen |
| 10:37:33 | Paul_The_Nerd | Stop stops the music |
| 10:37:40 | Bagder | LinusN: yes |
| 10:37:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | On RELEASE of Stop, it sets the active screen to filetree? |
| 10:37:48 | Bagder | now there's a thought |
| 10:37:51 | LinusN | and all screens return to the main loop |
| 10:38:05 | LinusN | Paul_The_Nerd: good idea |
| 10:38:06 | Paul_The_Nerd | That way stop is instantaneous, setting of the screen is not, but the user doesn't know about that anyway. |
| 10:38:11 | Bagder | LinusN: yes it would be a flat system with "equal" screens |
| 10:38:16 | | Join tucoz [0] (n=martin@rockbox/developer/tucoz) |
| 10:38:17 | Zagor | Paul_The_Nerd: sounds good |
| 10:38:21 | Bagder | file tree being one of the screens |
| 10:38:34 | LinusN | that opens up the possibility of making the wps the "main" screen for those who want that |
| 10:38:39 | Bagder | yeps |
| 10:38:42 | | Join Chipaca [0] (n=john@82-43-224-223.cable.ubr01.pres.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 10:38:44 | LinusN | (yuck) |
| 10:38:54 | Bagder | except that we can't currently show it without music |
| 10:39:01 | LinusN | that's easy to fix |
| 10:39:05 | Bagder | I know |
| 10:39:14 | LinusN | rockbox 1.0 did that iirc |
| 10:39:35 | LinusN | and it was struck down b y people complaining that it didn' |
| 10:39:38 | Bagder | 1.0 didn't work on my device ;-) |
| 10:39:42 | LinusN | t return to the file browser |
| 10:39:50 | | Join Sinbios [0] (n=Sinbios@HSE-Hamilton-ppp3513671.sympatico.ca) |
| 10:39:53 | LinusN | those were the days |
| 10:40:15 | | Part midgey34 |
| 10:40:21 | webguest85 | LinusN: "that opens up the possibility of making the wps the "main" screen" −− are you kidding? :-))) |
| 10:40:31 | LinusN | ;-) |
| 10:41:18 | LinusN | this goes along the lines of the old ui discussion by peter favrholt in the wiki |
| 10:41:21 | firenx | what version is rockbox at now? |
| 10:41:29 | LinusN | firenx: 2.5 |
| 10:41:38 | firenx | cool.. i love it |
| 10:41:41 | Bagder | well, versions don't really apply to rockbox anymore |
| 10:41:48 | firenx | cant wait till it plays vids too :) |
| 10:41:50 | Bagder | we've outgrown version numbers |
| 10:41:55 | Bagder | we're in the future |
| 10:42:06 | LinusN | firenx: it does |
| 10:42:15 | LinusN | without sound, though |
| 10:42:16 | webguest85 | LinusN: on a more serious note: I see that a solution exists but I'm not familiar enough with RB to do that. |
| 10:42:20 | firenx | well yeah |
| 10:42:25 | Paul_The_Nerd | Next time someone asks the version number, respond something like "Q" or "-13" |
| 10:42:30 | LinusN | 42 |
| 10:42:35 | Paul_The_Nerd | Or "i" |
| 10:42:36 | firenx | lol |
| 10:42:37 | Bagder | 20060818 |
| 10:42:49 | firenx | cvs |
| 10:42:56 | flux__ | bagder, that's hardly imaginative! |
| 10:42:56 | Bagder | 20060818-0842 |
| 10:43:02 | LinusN | webguest85: i understand |
| 10:43:03 | flux__ | and not very misleading |
| 10:43:08 | Bagder | no, but the version string we actually provide |
| 10:43:13 | linuxstb | Bagder: Isn't that the compile time? |
| 10:43:24 | LinusN | webguest85: you should be able to implement Paul_The_Nerd's solution though |
| 10:43:25 | Bagder | yes, but the dailies say that in the version string |
| 10:43:34 | firenx | so is there any good sites to get games for rockbox? some of the ones it came with are sweet, way better than the ones that came with ipodlinux |
| 10:43:56 | linuxstb | firenx: Anything good is assimilated into the official builds. |
| 10:44:24 | LinusN | assimilate or die! |
| 10:44:25 | webguest85 | Bagder: that makes 20059976 |
| 10:44:41 | LinusN | webguest85: :-P |
| 10:44:46 | firenx | linuxstb: ok |
| 10:44:48 | linuxstb | firenx: it's hard for someone to publish and maintain binaries for all the different Rockbox targets - so people don't bother trying, they just submit their code for inclusion in CVS. |
| 10:45:01 | firenx | ok.. that makes sense |
| 10:45:06 | firenx | so its pretty much got everything then |
| 10:45:14 | LinusN | and then we let it rot in the tracker until nobody cares anymore |
| 10:45:19 | LinusN | :-) |
| 10:45:23 | firenx | haha |
| 10:45:34 | firenx | i got the jbuild running with that sweet theme (forget what its called) |
| 10:46:13 | firenx | one thing that i really like about rockbox is how i dont have to have my music in that stupid itunes database format! |
| 10:46:19 | Chipaca | hi all |
| 10:46:26 | firenx | what is the processor in the 5g |
| 10:46:45 | coob | PP502x |
| 10:46:48 | linuxstb | A PortalPlayer PP5021 - it contains two arm7tdmi cores. |
| 10:46:49 | Chipaca | is the "archos recorder" supported by rockbox the same as "archos av400"? |
| 10:46:54 | coob | which has two arm7tdmi cores |
| 10:46:58 | Bagder | Chipaca: no |
| 10:47:00 | coob | bleh |
| 10:47:05 | * | coob pummels linuxstb |
| 10:47:08 | firenx | hm ok that means nothing to me haha |
| 10:47:14 | Chipaca | rats |
| 10:47:29 | firenx | umm.. how about how fast is it? |
| 10:47:36 | Bagder | Chipaca: but please go ahead and port it to the av400 ;-) |
| 10:47:48 | Paul_The_Nerd | firenx: Faster than a calculator, and slower than your desktop. :-P |
| 10:47:51 | linuxstb | Whhhoooooooosh <- That fast |
| 10:47:52 | Bagder | firenx: 75mhz x 2 ARM7 |
| 10:47:57 | Chipaca | Bagder: I'm trying to find a player to buy on which I can run rockbox, but I can't spend too much cash on it :-/ |
| 10:47:58 | firenx | ok cool.. |
| 10:48:08 | coob | scalable |
| 10:48:11 | firenx | it runs sweet on my ipod video |
| 10:48:15 | LinusN | Chipaca: iaudio x5? |
| 10:48:40 | webguest85 | LinusN: you mean stop on press, screen change on release? Ok, I'll try. |
| 10:48:45 | * | LinusN is paid by cowon to say that everytime someone asks |
| 10:49:04 | Bagder | you need to show the banner too to get paid! |
| 10:49:17 | LinusN | dammit, that's why i never got any money |
| 10:49:35 | Chipaca | LinusN: that is over my price, unfortunately |
| 10:49:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | Chipaca: "can't spend too much" doesn't tell us how much cash that is, nor how much storage you're hoping for. :-P |
| 10:50:00 | Chipaca | too much cash is anything over 40 gbp |
| 10:50:07 | Bagder | wow |
| 10:50:09 | LinusN | most rockboxable players are in the higher price range |
| 10:50:12 | Chipaca | storage: anything over a gig is good |
| 10:50:24 | Bagder | so go ebaying for old archos players |
| 10:50:33 | Zagor | perhaps you can get a small ipod nano for that? |
| 10:50:37 | Chipaca | LinusN: I know :( |
| 10:50:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | Chipaca: Ebay the 1gb iPod nano? |
| 10:50:44 | linuxstb | The 1GB Nano is 100UKP IIRC. |
| 10:50:54 | coob | less with educational discount :D |
| 10:50:55 | linuxstb | (or GBP) |
| 10:51:05 | Bagder | and less when used |
| 10:51:16 | coob | also scratched++ when used |
| 10:51:21 | Bagder | haha |
| 10:51:29 | Bagder | well rockbox works even on scratched ones |
| 10:51:31 | Bagder | I think |
| 10:51:35 | linuxstb | That's the problem with video - I'm now noticing all my scratches.... |
| 10:51:57 | crwl | new iriver h120's cost about 100 GBP or so from ebay :P |
| 10:52:23 | theli_ua | btw, how is X5 port now? does it perform well? is it better/worse then on other targets? |
| 10:52:47 | Bagder | it performs pretty good |
| 10:52:47 | | Part webguest85 |
| 10:53:10 | Bagder | it is probably a pcf driver from overtaking the OF in runtime |
| 10:53:16 | Bagder | a pcf driver away I mean |
| 10:53:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | I'd say it's probably better for music playback than the iPods, but lacks a few things like proper remote support still. |
| 10:53:54 | | Join Seasor [0] (n=Seaser@p54BDEE16.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:54:00 | aliask | Then again, iPods don't support remotes at all... |
| 10:54:16 | linuxstb | ipods do, Rockbox doesn't... |
| 10:54:37 | aliask | Yes, sorry, that's what I meant... :) |
| 10:54:50 | linuxstb | And I meant Rockbox on the ipods... |
| 10:55:12 | Chipaca | http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Brand-New-Boxed-iPod-NANO-Design-1gb-MP3-4-Player-LCD_W0QQitemZ170019572473QQihZ007QQcategoryZ73839QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
| 10:55:17 | Chipaca | oops |
| 10:55:26 | linuxstb | "ipod nano design" - probably not a Nano... |
| 10:55:28 | Chipaca | umm... well, I could now post the tinyurl too |
| 10:55:30 | Chipaca | :-/ |
| 10:55:56 | aliask | "We also have this model in Green and Orange too" |
| 10:56:15 | Paul_The_Nerd | Hehehe |
| 10:56:20 | Bg3r | haha what if it's 1:1 nano ? :) |
| 10:56:39 | Bg3r | copied schematics etc |
| 10:56:47 | linuxstb | "perfect sound quality" :) |
| 10:56:49 | Chipaca | aliask: yeah, that is strange, no? |
| 10:57:03 | aliask | All the specifications are wrong too, it's almost definitely a fake. |
| 10:57:31 | linuxstb | Chipaca: That's 100% definitely not a Nano. ipods don't have FM tuners, MP1/MP2 playback, WMA, WMV, etc etc |
| 10:57:36 | Chipaca | "ipod nano design" |
| 10:57:37 | tucoz | linuxstb, I doubt this move is very good. But it's available as a free download at least (not sure about the licence though). http://www.panicstruckpro.com/revelations/ |
| 10:57:41 | Chipaca | whatever thta means |
| 10:57:50 | tucoz | too bad charade was removed from archive.org |
| 10:59:26 | Chipaca | re the iriver h100, there are none on ebay |
| 10:59:53 | Bg3r | they are ... priceless :) |
| 11:00 |
| 11:00:04 | Chipaca | ah |
| 11:00:06 | tucoz | Chipaca, maybe a h120 or a h140 then? |
| 11:00:14 | linuxstb | It's not called the h100 - try searching for h120, h140 or (I think) ihp-120, ihp-140 |
| 11:00:21 | Chipaca | ah! :) |
| 11:00:23 | * | Chipaca is clueless |
| 11:00:30 | pondlife | LinusN: I've fixed some more voice stuff, largely reverting some earlier changes (caused by me not understanding the memory layout properly). Update is at http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5844 if you want it. |
| 11:01:03 | linuxstb | Chipaca: 120 is the 20GB model, 140 is the 40GB model. The 140 is slightly bigger physically, but that's the only difference. |
| 11:01:26 | LinusN | i would buy this, but only because i know how to repair it: http://cgi.ebay.com/iRiver-iHP-120-MP3-Player-As-Is_W0QQitemZ280018515486QQihZ018QQcategoryZ48683QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
| 11:02:31 | linuxstb | LinusN: What do you think the problem is? Just a loose connection or something more? |
| 11:02:39 | linuxstb | (or are you not telling and will bid for it...) |
| 11:02:40 | firenx | can i mount my ipox in rockbox? |
| 11:02:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | LinusN: "and has only one dent on the top left corner." <−− dropped? |
| 11:02:52 | LinusN | it's probably the old usb daughterboard connection problem |
| 11:03:01 | tucoz | hehe, "...and you cannot access the songs. I'm not sure if this is fixable, but the player works great other then this problem." |
| 11:03:10 | LinusN | haha |
| 11:03:13 | linuxstb | An expensive radio then... |
| 11:03:31 | Bg3r | http://cgi.ebay.com/BRAND-NEW-IRIVER-H140-iHP-140-NO-RESERVE_W0QQitemZ180018733611QQihZ008QQcategoryZ48683QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem <= haha |
| 11:03:36 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: I don't imagine you could get to the radio screen... |
| 11:03:48 | tucoz | $20 is not that bad for a radio, I would say |
| 11:04:18 | pondlife | LinusN: And I found out that it was tagtree.c that was updating audiobuf without using buffer_alloc. Hence http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5845 |
| 11:04:19 | LinusN | Bg3r: for sale - broken caps-lock key |
| 11:04:22 | linuxstb | Paul_The_Nerd: You're probably right. I've no idea what the iriver firmware would do in that case. |
| 11:04:34 | Paul_The_Nerd | linuxstb: The iRiver firmware doesn't boot if the disk isn't readable, I believe. |
| 11:04:44 | LinusN | it does |
| 11:04:52 | LinusN | it just says Files: 0000 etc |
| 11:06:12 | Paul_The_Nerd | Aah |
| 11:06:14 | Bg3r | LinusN: so it's not probably a dead HDD ? |
| 11:06:21 | aliask | Yeah, happened to mine infrequently in OF. |
| 11:06:26 | dan_a | You guys are tempting me to buy a broken, repairable iRiver now :( |
| 11:06:40 | LinusN | Bg3r: could be, but the usb daughterboard problem is very common |
| 11:06:41 | * | Paul_The_Nerd is tempted to as well, and then have a spare. |
| 11:07:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | Actually if I were going to buy a second, it's be of the H140 family, preferably not a D |
| 11:07:06 | Bg3r | for this price ... |
| 11:07:14 | Bagder | now now don't ruin LinusN's business idea ;-) |
| 11:07:31 | pondlife | Hmm, if only we all had more time... |
| 11:07:38 | LinusN | i have bought a few broken h100's on ebay, repaied the usb board and then sold again |
| 11:07:42 | scorche | hmmmm....i am thinking about this one just to nab the USB 2.0 compatibility |
| 11:07:52 | scorche | still that cheap at a bit more than a day left |
| 11:07:54 | scorche | http://cgi.ebay.com/ARCHOS-JUKEBOX-RECORDER-20-20GB-MP3-PLAYER-RECORDER_W0QQitemZ260021681733QQihZ016QQcategoryZ114620QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
| 11:07:55 | dan_a | Paul_The_Nerd: Did you see my PM on the forums? |
| 11:07:59 | Bg3r | Feedback:100% Positive |
| 11:08:10 | preglow | LinusN: how do you repair it |
| 11:08:11 | preglow | ? |
| 11:08:35 | LinusN | i remove the usb board, and solder the usb daughterboard connector back again |
| 11:08:44 | Paul_The_Nerd | dan_a: No... I have no idea how I missed it. |
| 11:08:46 | LinusN | takes some soldering skills |
| 11:09:02 | Paul_The_Nerd | dan_a: Done |
| 11:09:21 | dan_a | Paul_The_Nerd: Thank you! |
| 11:09:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | Sorry 'bout the delay. And pardon our dust, since you can see all the clutter now. |
| 11:10:28 | LinusN | maybe i should put up a usb resoldering tutorial in the wiki |
| 11:10:58 | Chipaca | oh well, I guess I'll not be getting myself player yet, then |
| 11:11:03 | Chipaca | thank you all |
| 11:11:05 | * | Chipaca waves |
| 11:11:06 | | Part Chipaca |
| 11:11:16 | Bg3r | LinusN: don't do it :) |
| 11:11:29 | Bg3r | it'll raise the price of such units :D |
| 11:11:34 | | Part Seasor |
| 11:11:35 | LinusN | haha, true |
| 11:12:43 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 11:13:25 | | Join Mancer [0] (n=Mancer@dsl-202-173-137-229.sa.westnet.com.au) |
| 11:14:08 | * | linuxstb spots a stats-boosting language file commit from LinusN... |
| 11:15:11 | Bagder | hahaha |
| 11:15:18 | aliask | Stats? |
| 11:16:43 | LinusN | linuxstb: damn, i forgot to commit them one by one :-) |
| 11:16:57 | Bagder | aliask: we counted commits-per-person the other day |
| 11:17:10 | Bagder | LinusN: with my way of counting it makes no difference |
| 11:17:17 | aliask | Ah, I see |
| 11:17:50 | LinusN | Bagder: but mikachus way is better for me :-) |
| 11:17:57 | preglow | anyone know what this CODIC math being talked about on the wma flyspray page is? |
| 11:18:05 | Bagder | I didn't see his results |
| 11:18:07 | LinusN | i assume he means cordic |
| 11:18:11 | Bagder | did he get the entire history? |
| 11:18:13 | preglow | why'd we need that in wma? |
| 11:18:23 | preglow | you usually get away with table lookups when doing codecs |
| 11:18:49 | theli_ua | linuxstb, have you tried last zxbox patch? |
| 11:19:07 | Bagder | preglow: when it comes to wma, I think there's too little knowledge and too much speculations |
| 11:19:10 | * | Paul_The_Nerd is just happy to see the build table moving to a nice, solid green again. |
| 11:19:28 | LinusN | it looks like my prediction comes true regarding the wma codec |
| 11:19:47 | Bagder | yeps |
| 11:19:48 | aliask | Haha |
| 11:19:51 | Bagder | we just don't see it happen |
| 11:20:09 | preglow | Bagder: probably |
| 11:20:12 | LinusN | much talk and no code |
| 11:20:14 | Bagder | those claimed wma hackers aren't team players |
| 11:20:36 | LinusN | wma isn't exactly the team-player codec either :-) |
| 11:20:45 | Bagder | hehe |
| 11:21:07 | Bagder | "one man in a closet for a year is better than 100 eager skilled rockbox devs" |
| 11:21:16 | | Join mirak_ [0] (n=53722efd@labb.contactor.se) |
| 11:21:56 | pondlife | LinusN: did you see my comment above, or are you still sore about the last oops? ;-) |
| 11:22:32 | LinusN | hehe, i saw it |
| 11:22:41 | pondlife | This fixes some crashes using multiple codecs and also changing config settings |
| 11:23:01 | pondlife | I've just put the positioning of filebuf and the voice file back to where they were |
| 11:23:21 | pondlife | Am getting some other users to test for me from the ML |
| 11:23:27 | pondlife | (hopefully) |
| 11:23:44 | LinusN | i vote for giving pondlife cvs access |
| 11:24:00 | pondlife | Hmm, I'm not sure about that... |
| 11:24:07 | pondlife | I'd fear it |
| 11:24:24 | | Join Funky [0] (n=jack@89.240.215.74) |
| 11:24:49 | Paul_The_Nerd | We've had daily builds that don't play music before. You can't do worse than breaking the primary purpose for 24 hours for most people. ;) |
| 11:24:54 | Bagder | fear can be good ;-) |
| 11:25:14 | pondlife | I could break it all and go on holiday with marsdaddy? |
| 11:25:20 | Bagder | hahaha |
| 11:25:35 | Funky | ive installed rockbox but i get a error is there a way of patching that up without redoing the whole instalition |
| 11:25:41 | linuxstb | preglow: I'm surprised that Henry's (proprietory) WMA decoder can't do 44.1KHz playback on a 96MHz ARM. |
| 11:25:49 | pondlife | I'd almost certainly introduce Windows CRLFs... |
| 11:25:50 | preglow | me too |
| 11:25:54 | preglow | wma isn't that complex |
| 11:26:04 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: What error? |
| 11:26:05 | Bagder | sounds like a crappy codec to me |
| 11:26:22 | Paul_The_Nerd | Maybe he forgot to remove some floating point? |
| 11:26:43 | preglow | god knows |
| 11:26:49 | Funky | rockbox error: -1 |
| 11:27:04 | preglow | i just wish the wma porters would post some bloody code so we can stuff it in vs |
| 11:27:08 | preglow | cvs |
| 11:27:09 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: Traditionanlly that means you haven't extracted a build onto your player |
| 11:27:09 | linuxstb | But still, any implementation would be good, even a slow one... |
| 11:27:29 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: Did you download a CVS or daily build and extract it? |
| 11:27:32 | linuxstb | preglow: We've all been saying that to them for months... |
| 11:27:44 | Funky | yes |
| 11:27:49 | | Quit Sinbios ("If the definition of a klutz is someone who doesn't have eyes on their ass, then yes, I suppose I am a klutz.") |
| 11:27:51 | Funky | but i may have done it to the wrong place |
| 11:28:15 | Funky | where shud i have extracted it to? |
| 11:28:21 | Paul_The_Nerd | In the root |
| 11:28:23 | Paul_The_Nerd | F:\ |
| 11:28:37 | Paul_The_Nerd | You should have F:\.rockbox\ and F:\rockbox.playername (ipod, iriver, iaudio) |
| 11:28:39 | preglow | in a related matter |
| 11:28:43 | Paul_The_Nerd | Where F is the driveletter of your player |
| 11:28:54 | preglow | i'm hitting severe precision problems with the lowshelf eq filter |
| 11:29:01 | preglow | which MIGHT be affecting audio |
| 11:29:06 | Funky | o ok so i think min is the E |
| 11:29:08 | pondlife | Did anyone see this - http://news.com.com/Real+to+plug+Windows+media+support+into+Linux/2100-1025_3-6105970.html?tag=nefd.top |
| 11:29:21 | pondlife | Unlikely it will be fixed point I know |
| 11:29:33 | pondlife | Or even license-compatible. |
| 11:29:35 | preglow | we can't us eit |
| 11:29:39 | preglow | probably helix licensed |
| 11:29:50 | linuxstb | pondlife: ffmpeg have had an open wma decoder for years... |
| 11:30:05 | pondlife | But floating point only I assume? |
| 11:30:17 | preglow | yea |
| 11:30:19 | linuxstb | Yes - that's the source currently being ported to Rockbox. |
| 11:30:21 | markun | Funky: E or F, doesn't matter which drive letter |
| 11:30:57 | linuxstb | pondlife: But yes, as preglow says, Real's open source license isn't GPL compatible, no it's a no-go for Rockbox. |
| 11:31:08 | mirak_ | salut |
| 11:31:19 | markun | morning mirak_ |
| 11:31:30 | Funky | ok im not sure where this f drive is,is it my c drive or the actual ipod? |
| 11:31:39 | linuxstb | pondlife: And that article says it won't be in their open source player - just their closed source version... |
| 11:31:40 | mirak_ | linuxstb it could be an external codec ? |
| 11:31:53 | amiconn | Bagder, LinusN: Regarding screen transitions - I don't think we need separate enter() and leave() functions and a full blown struct |
| 11:32:17 | markun | Funky: Extract the rockbox zip to the root of you ipod. That should be all. |
| 11:32:19 | linuxstb | mirak_: There's no such thing.... |
| 11:32:30 | Funky | anyone? |
| 11:32:33 | Bagder | amiconn: it might suffice with just an array of function pointers |
| 11:32:51 | amiconn | The available screens could just be put in an enum, and one screen's function would return the id of the screen to enter on return |
| 11:33:10 | markun | Funky: if you open the drive of your ipod do you have a rockbox.ipod file? |
| 11:33:16 | markun | Funky: and a .rockbox folder? |
| 11:34:01 | Funky | i extracted it to the c drive |
| 11:34:12 | markun | Funky: then it will not work |
| 11:34:22 | LinusN | amiconn: yes, i guess that would be enough, but i think i would prefer a set_screen() function instead of using return valuies |
| 11:34:29 | amiconn | why? |
| 11:34:31 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: You need to extract it to your iPod's drive |
| 11:34:40 | LinusN | that way you can select the screen in menus |
| 11:35:00 | LinusN | and the screen calling the menu wouldn't need to care |
| 11:35:11 | amiconn | it would |
| 11:35:24 | amiconn | ...because it has to exit in order for the new screen to be called |
| 11:35:39 | LinusN | of course it has to exit |
| 11:35:45 | Funky | so i plug in my ipod and it pops up in the my computer panel i open that up and drop the file into there |
| 11:35:46 | Funky | ? |
| 11:36:00 | amiconn | LinusN: Then it can just return the new screen id as well |
| 11:36:01 | LinusN | we need a global state variable in any case, for the resume-to-screen info |
| 11:36:05 | Bagder | eeeh |
| 11:36:09 | Bagder | + *: "RECORD = Delete" |
| 11:36:20 | markun | Funky: we told you a few times now. If you can't figure it out perhaps rockbox isn't for you. |
| 11:36:22 | Bagder | isn't that a bit too generic? |
| 11:36:33 | LinusN | Bagder: in my commit? |
| 11:36:38 | Bagder | see mmmm's commit just now |
| 11:36:40 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: You don't just drop the rockbox.zip there, you need to extract it. |
| 11:36:55 | Funky | yes i gatherthed that =p |
| 11:37:31 | Paul_The_Nerd | Well, you *said* something else. |
| 11:38:21 | | Quit mantono ("memcheck(brb: 20minutes)") |
| 11:38:57 | linuxstb | Bagder: Yes - it's a bit too generic... |
| 11:39:09 | firenx | he needs to use one of the installers heh |
| 11:39:12 | LinusN | is mmmmm on irc? |
| 11:39:14 | firenx | to setup the boodloader |
| 11:39:18 | | Join mantono [0] (n=mantono@c83-250-204-173.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 11:39:55 | markun | firenx: without a bootloader he wouldn't have got "error: -1" |
| 11:40:39 | firenx | well to add rockbox to the bootloader? |
| 11:41:00 | Paul_The_Nerd | firenx: That's a very simple procedure. Extract a daily or CVS build onto the drive. |
| 11:41:15 | firenx | oh thats it?.. didn't know it was that simple heh |
| 11:41:46 | | Part mantono ("Don't worry, be happy") |
| 11:41:46 | Paul_The_Nerd | Once the bootloader is installed, the build is just files on the disk |
| 11:41:53 | Funky | ok what shud the folder be called on the ipods drive? |
| 11:42:02 | firenx | it does it for you! |
| 11:42:04 | firenx | just mount your ipod |
| 11:42:06 | firenx | open that archive |
| 11:42:10 | firenx | and extract it to g:\ |
| 11:42:13 | firenx | or whatever your ipod drive is |
| 11:42:30 | firenx | you're using winrar? |
| 11:42:38 | Funky | yes |
| 11:42:47 | firenx | open it, extract to your ipods root folder |
| 11:43:20 | Funky | kk |
| 11:43:48 | Funky | done |
| 11:44:28 | firenx | ok try it |
| 11:45:02 | Funky | seems to be working |
| 11:45:08 | firenx | cool |
| 11:45:13 | firenx | what are you installing it onto? |
| 11:45:14 | Funky | so what can i do now? |
| 11:45:17 | amiconn | "RECORD = Delete" is one of those careless commits imho. Rockbox is really multi-platform, I wonder why people keep forgetting that... :( |
| 11:45:49 | LinusN | amiconn: agreed |
| 11:45:51 | Paul_The_Nerd | Funky: Read the manual to find out more about what Rockbox can do... |
| 11:46:09 | firenx | you'll want to change the theme |
| 11:46:15 | Funky | yes |
| 11:46:24 | linuxstb | amiconn: The original file even had a generic string, and an iriver-specific string... |
| 11:46:31 | firenx | jblackglass is really nice |
| 11:46:59 | firenx | http://pijulius.blogspot.com/2006/05/jblackglass-for-ipod-photocolor.html |
| 11:47:50 | Funky | hm looks good |
| 11:48:07 | firenx | are you using an ipod? |
| 11:48:26 | Funky | yes a nano will it work with that? |
| 11:48:32 | firenx | umm |
| 11:48:42 | firenx | yeah i think theres one for that |
| 11:48:44 | firenx | its a little smaller |
| 11:49:18 | Funky | same site? |
| 11:49:24 | Bagder | if someone is not on IRC and does not respond/react to mails on the dev list, I think commits are a bad idea |
| 11:49:28 | firenx | http://www.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=176x132x16 |
| 11:49:33 | firenx | theres themes around |
| 11:49:52 | Funky | ah thankd |
| 11:49:55 | Funky | thanks* |
| 11:50:07 | | Join mkey [0] (n=mkey@pD9E3532A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:50:19 | firenx | np |
| 11:50:26 | firenx | most themes you install the same way as rockbox |
| 11:50:36 | Funky | exrtracting? |
| 11:50:49 | | Part Paul_The_Nerd |
| 11:52:15 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp137-203.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 11:52:30 | Funky | dosent see to think its connected.. |
| 11:53:44 | Funky | .. |
| 11:54:22 | Funky | done dont worry :p |
| 11:57:10 | Funky | ive put the teme on and set it but it doesnet look like it suppose to |
| 11:57:15 | Funky | theme* |
| 11:58:17 | Funky | :( |
| 11:58:19 | * | linuxstb discovers that mpeg decoders use a 27MHz system clock and wonders how to implement accurate timing... |
| 11:58:35 | firenx | hmm the blackglas theme? |
| 11:58:42 | Funky | ye |
| 11:58:46 | firenx | you need to install a special build |
| 11:58:48 | | Join Arathis [0] (n=doerk@p508A6C88.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:59:06 | Funky | ok |
| 11:59:20 | firenx | called jbuild or somethin.. google it |
| 12:00 |
| 12:03:56 | amiconn | linuxstb: What's the problem with that? Is the framerate given as number of 27MHz ticks? |
| 12:04:15 | Funky | cant find it... |
| 12:07:17 | linuxstb | amiconn: The fps is represented as "frame period" - an integer number of 27MHz ticks. |
| 12:07:30 | | Quit TCK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 12:07:51 | | Quit einhirn ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 12:08:13 | | Join apo [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:09:09 | | Join Mmmm [0] (n=mscarrat@cpc1-hem13-0-0-cust291.lutn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 12:10:36 | markun | linuxstb: do you need to decode a frame completely if you want to skip it? |
| 12:12:00 | Bg3r | Min Version: Rls 2.5 <= does anyone know what is that supposed to mean ? |
| 12:12:04 | Funky | found it |
| 12:12:54 | markun | Bg3r: looks like "minimal version: release 2.5" or is that not your question? |
| 12:13:29 | Bg3r | markun: unlikely ... there's no 2.5 rockbox release for non-archos devices ... |
| 12:13:41 | Bg3r | markun: http://www.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=220x176x16 |
| 12:14:32 | Bg3r | who is martin scarratt ? |
| 12:14:39 | Mmmm | sorry...thats me! |
| 12:14:42 | markun | :) |
| 12:14:51 | Mmmm | record = delete right? ;) |
| 12:15:01 | Bg3r | Mmmm: eh ... |
| 12:15:13 | Bg3r | i was working on this file since yesterday ... |
| 12:15:21 | Mmmm | ahhh... |
| 12:16:04 | Mmmm | I just got home and found all the buttons arent working on the remotes so i thought id get down to it! :) |
| 12:16:13 | linuxstb | markun: I'm pretty sure all frames will need to be decoded to meet the dependencies of future (and past, in the case of B-frames) frames. But maybe some frames will be skippable. |
| 12:16:51 | LinusN | Mmmm: the thing is that rockbox runs on many targets |
| 12:17:28 | | Join amiconn_ [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 12:17:37 | LinusN | you can't just change the strings for all the other targets when you remap a button |
| 12:17:52 | Mmmm | Yes I forgot about the record thing....sorry....so we should have h100,h120,h300: "RECORD= Delete" |
| 12:17:57 | Mmmm | I didnt remap it! |
| 12:18:07 | LinusN | sorry |
| 12:18:12 | Mmmm | I think JDGordon must have! |
| 12:18:39 | Mmmm | its only for the h1xx/h3xx though so it's just the lang file |
| 12:18:51 | Mmmm | i hope |
| 12:18:55 | LinusN | - *: "ON+Play = Delete" |
| 12:18:55 | LinusN | -h100,h120,h300: "ON+NAVI = Delete" |
| 12:18:55 | LinusN | + *: "RECORD = Delete" |
| 12:19:04 | LinusN | this is what bothers me the most |
| 12:19:32 | LinusN | you deleted the target specific strings and made the new text global for all targets |
| 12:19:37 | Mmmm | yes.. should be h100,h120,h300: "RECORD= Delete" |
| 12:19:55 | LinusN | instead of just changing the iriver string |
| 12:21:50 | Bg3r | Mmmm: are you going to make more changes ? |
| 12:21:53 | Bg3r | to this file |
| 12:24:08 | A_M | Hmm... what've I've done wrong when I can't compile a file unless I remove every instance of bool/true/false? |
| 12:24:37 | Bg3r | u've removed some header |
| 12:25:00 | Bg3r | (probably) |
| 12:25:47 | A_M | that's what I was thinking, but can't figure out which one to include to get it to work. (this is a new .c file, not a modified old one) |
| 12:26:34 | Bg3r | plugin ? |
| 12:26:35 | pondlife | LinusN: forgot to mention I found out what was allocating memory mysteriously (aka ???)... |
| 12:26:48 | A_M | not a plugin |
| 12:26:49 | pondlife | It was in tagtree.c. |
| 12:26:51 | LinusN | pondlife: yes, saw that |
| 12:26:55 | pondlife | Ah, ok |
| 12:27:14 | LinusN | A_M: stdbool.h |
| 12:27:42 | pondlife | I have replaced it with a buffer_alloc(0), followed shortly by a buffer_alloc(<size>) as the size isn't known upfront, and many multiple allocs would be slower. |
| 12:27:52 | Funky | whats rockbox error: -5? mean |
| 12:28:24 | pondlife | I see this idea already used elsewhere so hope it's ok. Given no yield in between.. |
| 12:28:29 | A_M | LinusN: thanks, that did the trick |
| 12:28:40 | LinusN | Funky: it means that the checksum of rockbox.ipod is wrong |
| 12:28:45 | Mmmm | LinusN: Is this no good then? h100,h120,h300: "RECORD = Delete" as the delete button on the I rivers is record. |
| 12:29:07 | LinusN | Funky: possibly because you have downloaded the wrong version of rockbox for your model |
| 12:29:24 | LinusN | Mmmm: sounds correct |
| 12:29:25 | Funky | i tried downloading jbuild for the nano |
| 12:30:04 | Mmmm | LinusN: Ok...sorry about all that..I've been a bit stupid! |
| 12:30:41 | LinusN | Mmmm: don't worry, i'll recall my hitmen |
| 12:30:50 | Bg3r | Mmmm: are you going to make more changes to keymap-h1x0_h3x0.c ? |
| 12:30:55 | pondlife | Bang! Too late!! |
| 12:31:13 | LinusN | hmmm, phone is busy... |
| 12:31:21 | LinusN | :-) |
| 12:31:24 | Mmmm | Bg3r: If you want me to leave it because you are busy with it, I will |
| 12:31:39 | Bg3r | that's what i'm asking for :) |
| 12:31:50 | Funky | how can i install a new theme to my nano withouth getting errors? |
| 12:31:52 | * | Mmmm hides in a corner just in case... |
| 12:32:05 | Mmmm | Bger: ok... :) |
| 12:32:08 | Bg3r | Mmmm: haha LinusN isn't so dangerous :P |
| 12:32:14 | Mmmm | :D |
| 12:32:40 | | Join webguest85 [0] (n=c27f0812@labb.contactor.se) |
| 12:32:46 | pondlife | Except when he commits one of my patches |
| 12:32:57 | Bg3r | :D |
| 12:33:46 | linuxstb | Funky: That's a bit of a vague question... The "-5" error means the rockbox.ipod file is corrupted in some way. Maybe you didn't eject it properly from your computer after copying - so just try again. |
| 12:34:14 | linuxstb | (or -5 can also mean you downloaded a version not for the Nano..) |
| 12:34:20 | pondlife | On another topic, I just tried playing an AAC file on my H300 for the first time and was surprised at how much trouble it had keeping up. CPU was boosted all the time too. |
| 12:34:23 | Funky | well it was jbuild |
| 12:34:27 | webguest85 | LinusN: regarding screen switching: after having thought about it, I'd say it's impossible to control everything from the main loop since e.g. the radio and record screens are entered from menu. I.e. you'd have to change menu code which isn't good. |
| 12:34:32 | Funky | im not sure if it works on the nano? |
| 12:34:54 | LinusN | webguest85: why is that? |
| 12:34:56 | Bg3r | hmmmm |
| 12:35:05 | linuxstb | Funky: Where did you download it from? |
| 12:35:22 | | Quit amiconn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 12:35:22 | | Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 12:35:35 | Funky | one sec |
| 12:35:38 | LinusN | webguest85: the idea is that the recording and fm screens would replace the wps |
| 12:36:08 | LinusN | so that (to the user) they would be equal |
| 12:36:11 | | Part Funky |
| 12:36:29 | webguest85 | LinusN: that's my understanding of how things work. In the main loop, only main_menu is called. From there, radio_screen is called. I.e. radio_screen is not called from the main loop. |
| 12:36:42 | | Join Funky [0] (n=jack@89.240.215.74) |
| 12:36:42 | LinusN | that would probably require a change of the menu structure, and of the entire ui |
| 12:36:45 | pondlife | If you're recording from radio, which screen is displayed? |
| 12:37:13 | Funky | well i fixed the error i just want a new theme so how do i go about this :p |
| 12:37:14 | pondlife | You may want to pause recording, or you may want to change radio tuning |
| 12:37:20 | LinusN | webguest85: what i'm suggesting is restructuring the entire ui code |
| 12:37:50 | | Quit Mmmm (Remote closed the connection) |
| 12:37:53 | LinusN | pondlife: on the iriver, you switch to the recording screen |
| 12:38:05 | LinusN | on the archos, you record in the fm screen |
| 12:38:15 | webguest85 | LinusN: yes, that would be the implication. And the menu engine too. But then it's not for me (I fear I'll corrupt everything). |
| 12:38:36 | LinusN | webguest85: we should probably do this in small iterations |
| 12:38:59 | Funky | can any one help me install a them to a nano |
| 12:39:08 | pondlife | I suppose I meant "Which screen should be displayed?" |
| 12:39:16 | webguest85 | LinusN: mm... I think it won't work without (at least one) big bang. |
| 12:39:20 | linuxstb | Funky: You'll need to ask a specific question. |
| 12:39:26 | LinusN | webguest85: sure |
| 12:39:45 | LinusN | pondlife: there are two camps here |
| 12:39:49 | pondlife | Recording screen would be most obvious, but if I was recording and wanted to tune up or down a bit to improve reception... |
| 12:40:09 | LinusN | there is the "recording should work in the fm screen", and the "switch to recording screen" camps |
| 12:40:20 | pondlife | My IRiver seems to either drift off a bit or maybe the transmitter does... |
| 12:40:24 | Funky | linuxstb:i have just installe rockbox and i need to get a them for it im not sure how to go about it |
| 12:40:25 | | Join Mmmm [0] (n=mscarrat@cpc1-hem13-0-0-cust291.lutn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 12:40:29 | webguest85 | LinusN: ...which should be made by a core RB developer who understands many (if not all) twists |
| 12:40:39 | LinusN | webguest85: probably |
| 12:40:56 | webguest85 | LinusN: ... and that's definitely not me. |
| 12:40:57 | pondlife | I prefer "recording screen" I think, but it should be possible to exit to radio screen without stopping recording! |
| 12:41:05 | LinusN | we should think about how we would want the ui to work |
| 12:41:07 | | Join petur [0] (n=d4efd6a6@labb.contactor.se) |
| 12:42:11 | linuxstb | Funky: Go to http://www.rockbox-themes.org, download a zip file for one of the themes for the Nano, and extract the contents of that zip file to the .rockbox folder on your ipod. |
| 12:42:29 | LinusN | i.e how do we want to switch between screens in the ui? |
| 12:42:43 | scorche | linuxstb: i believe he is trying to get jblackglass to work |
| 12:42:47 | Funky | linuxstb: ok |
| 12:43:01 | Funky | i was |
| 12:43:29 | linuxstb | Funky: That's not what you asked... |
| 12:43:45 | Funky | i know becasue i am not anymore |
| 12:44:08 | Funky | but.. |
| 12:44:25 | Funky | when i install a them their basic and dont look anything like they should |
| 12:44:29 | Funky | theme* |
| 12:44:57 | webguest85 | LinusN: IMHO the current bahaviour reg. screen switching is ok (for the user). But the mechanics under the hood should be reworked. |
| 12:46:30 | scorche | Funky: some themes require different fonts...the fonts are packaged separately...look for the font package in the daily builds page |
| 12:46:30 | | Quit Kitar|st (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 12:46:31 | | Join Kitar|st [0] (n=Kitarist@BSN-77-87-55.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 12:46:55 | Bg3r | Funky: especially the jblackglass theme needs non-oficial rockbox build ... |
| 12:47:21 | Bg3r | (which includes many patches not in the rockbox's cvs tree) |
| 12:47:40 | Funky | the only thing i can get to work is the backdrop... |
| 12:47:57 | Bg3r | very possible |
| 12:48:10 | Bg3r | also u should be sure that u've extracted the fontpack ... |
| 12:48:31 | Funky | yes now the fonts are working and not the backdrop! |
| 12:48:41 | LinusN | webguest85: some people have expressed concerns about having FM and recording as menu items |
| 12:49:08 | | Join dwihno_ [0] (n=dw@81.8.226.44) |
| 12:49:17 | Bg3r | Funky: what is your ipod ? |
| 12:49:22 | webguest85 | LinusN: concerns = they don't like it? |
| 12:49:23 | Funky | nano |
| 12:50:42 | | Quit dwihno (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 12:50:53 | Bg3r | Funky: are you sure that jblackglass is ported to the nano ? |
| 12:51:27 | Funky | bg3r:http://www.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=176x132x16 |
| 12:51:41 | LinusN | webguest85: yes |
| 12:52:41 | Funky | i get the backdrop but i dont seem to get the media player pics |
| 12:54:30 | Funky | the overall layout doesnt change |
| 12:54:54 | webguest85 | LinusN: Hmm... They are something special in the sence that it's not settings but rather 'do it!' entries. But if we don't have enough buttons we could dedicate to it, we must put it into menu. |
| 12:54:54 | Bg3r | Funky: and u're sure u've installed it correctly ? |
| 12:54:56 | | Join MadDog011 [0] (n=MadDog01@212-200-212-95.adsl.sezampro.yu) |
| 12:55:10 | linuxstb | Just thinking aloud about the UI (don't kill me), one approach would to flatten everything - so file browser, WPS, FM and Recording (and maybe the tagcache browser) are all the same level, with a root menu containing entries for those screens (and an option could be added for the default-startup screen). The main menu itself could either be there as an option, or accessible via the MENU button. We could have buttons assigned as shortcut |
| 12:55:10 | linuxstb | s between the screens if people wanted (e.g.) a quick way from WPS to filebrowser (and back), but users could go via the root menu if they wanted. |
| 12:55:16 | Funky | im sure :( |
| 12:55:44 | | Quit A_M ("CGI:IRC") |
| 12:56:19 | * | webguest85 likes linuxstb's idea |
| 12:56:36 | * | Bg3r shoots linuxstb right in the head |
| 12:56:53 | | Nick dwihno_ is now known as dwihno (n=dw@81.8.226.44) |
| 12:56:59 | Bg3r | seriously, the ida isn't bad |
| 12:57:04 | Bg3r | s/ida/idea |
| 12:57:07 | | Join Kohlrabi [0] (n=Kohlrabi@dslb-082-083-142-181.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 12:57:14 | * | webguest85 shoots Bg3r right in the head :-))) |
| 12:57:57 | Bg3r | ouch |
| 12:58:18 | * | petur thinks ida isn't bad either |
| 12:58:42 | Bagder | linuxstb: yeah, I think we basically agree we should flatten it and then that will be quite easily done |
| 12:59:10 | LinusN | linuxstb: pretty much what i had in mind too |
| 12:59:26 | Bg3r | Bagder: i'm sure that if i dig into the irc logs, i'll find the oposite statement (again said by you) :D |
| 12:59:42 | Bagder | that we should flatten it? |
| 12:59:43 | webguest85 | Sounds like a major change. And it started so innocently! |
| 12:59:44 | Bg3r | s/oposite/opposite |
| 12:59:45 | | Join mantono [0] (n=mantono@c83-250-204-173.bredband.comhem.se) |
| 12:59:50 | Bagder | I don't think I've ever opposed that |
| 13:00 |
| 13:00:05 | Bg3r | ah, maybe it was linus |
| 13:00:15 | Bagder | but yeah, I do change my mind from time to time |
| 13:00:39 | * | petur watches Bagder open his head and swap brains |
| 13:00:45 | Bg3r | haha |
| 13:01:08 | Bg3r | it's always nice to have a backup one |
| 13:01:19 | aliask | I don't quite understand the idea: would you have WPS, recording etc on in the existing main menu? Or would this be accessed by select? |
| 13:01:38 | Bg3r | aliask: afaics the last |
| 13:01:50 | linuxstb | aliask: There would be a new "root menu" or "screen menu" - different to the main menu, which is in effect a "pop-up" menu accessible from anywhere. |
| 13:02:08 | aliask | Finally a real use for the record button? |
| 13:02:18 | Bg3r | haha |
| 13:02:29 | petur | would this be a new root one level below the current one, and the browser would be a 'folder' |
| 13:02:43 | | Quit pondlife ("byebye") |
| 13:03:01 | linuxstb | petur: Yes, it would replace the file browser as the "root" screen in Rockbox. |
| 13:03:18 | Bg3r | what about 'functions menu' : wps/fm radio/record/browse [filetree|tagcache]/settings |
| 13:03:27 | aliask | I think it would certainly make it easier for people moving to rockbox. |
| 13:03:33 | * | petur wonders what amiconn will say about this ("urgh it adds another keypress to my music") |
| 13:03:46 | Bg3r | petur: :D |
| 13:03:58 | aliask | petur: That's what *I* thought at first |
| 13:04:00 | Bg3r | the idea is to have a startup screen |
| 13:04:07 | petur | linuxstb: I'm all for it |
| 13:04:08 | linuxstb | petur: It wouldn't have to. We would have 1) an option to boot straight into one of those screens (e.g. file browser); and 2) a shortcut button from WPS to filebrowser. |
| 13:04:10 | Bg3r | so u can set it to the filetree |
| 13:04:26 | aliask | linuxstb: I really like this idea. |
| 13:04:32 | petur | go go go |
| 13:05:55 | Bg3r | LinusN: btw, any plans for new h3xx bootloader ? :-[ |
| 13:06:09 | * | Bg3r hides |
| 13:06:10 | petur | for that to work, fm recording must take place in the fm screen otherwise this gets confusing |
| 13:06:13 | * | aliask joins Bg3r :( |
| 13:06:23 | | Quit Kitar|st (Connection timed out) |
| 13:06:24 | Bg3r | aliask: now join in hiding :D |
| 13:06:24 | linuxstb | What about a new "fm recording" screen? |
| 13:06:42 | LinusN | Bg3r: plans: yes, time: no |
| 13:06:56 | webguest85 | How does it come that this is is being discussed now with RB being several years old? Or did Bagder do the trick by swapping the brain? ;-) |
| 13:06:57 | Bg3r | LinusN: :( |
| 13:06:57 | petur | there's plenty of space on the fm recording to add recording, no? |
| 13:07:06 | aliask | linuxstb: Certainly more intuitive than setting the source to "Line in" |
| 13:07:28 | Bg3r | why not fm radio->recording jump ? |
| 13:07:28 | LinusN | the archos fm screen allows recording |
| 13:07:28 | Bagder | webguest85: yeah, we isn't rockbox already complete and bugfree? |
| 13:07:40 | | Part MadDog011 |
| 13:07:46 | Bagder | webguest85: I blame you for not having saved us in the past ;-) |
| 13:08:10 | * | petur laughs a bit and rolls off the channel |
| 13:08:30 | petur | beer time in 4 hours, gotta work a bit now ;) |
| 13:08:35 | | Quit petur ("later") |
| 13:08:50 | * | webguest85 joins petur |
| 13:08:50 | LinusN | the line-in trick is just a workaround |
| 13:08:55 | | Part webguest85 |
| 13:09:14 | linuxstb | So, is anyone willing to try to implement that idea?.... |
| 13:09:35 | LinusN | i am willing, but you will first have to invent a time-machine |
| 13:09:53 | LinusN | and a device that teleports my family to a parallel universe |
| 13:10:23 | Bg3r | LinusN: wouldn't it be easier just to make 1-2 your clones ? :) |
| 13:10:26 | aliask | I'm already working a lot in the UI code, I could give it a shot, but my C skills are pretty poor in comparison to most people here. |
| 13:10:31 | LinusN | Bg3r: good idea |
| 13:10:45 | * | LinusN goes to lunch |
| 13:11:24 | | Quit Funky () |
| 13:12:00 | | Quit apo (Remote closed the connection) |
| 13:12:29 | | Join Gnelik [0] (n=Miranda@193.110.17.19) |
| 13:12:35 | linuxstb | aliask: Go for it... I'm sure others will help. |
| 13:12:38 | | Join apo [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 13:12:41 | | Quit Gnelik (Client Quit) |
| 13:12:44 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 13:13:13 | dongs | allright what the fuck is going on. |
| 13:13:24 | dongs | first my bug report gets moved to 'feature request' while it isn |
| 13:13:32 | Bg3r | ~30kb keymap-h1x0_h3x0.c ... |
| 13:13:33 | dongs | then it gets closed and 'duped' by something written by a 10 years old you cant spell 'you' |
| 13:13:46 | | Quit Mmmm ("Byeee") |
| 13:13:54 | Bagder | dongs: with your language and attitude, that hardly surprises me |
| 13:13:54 | linuxstb | dongs: But it was a duplicate - why didn't you add comments to the original? |
| 13:13:56 | dongs | (and the 'dupe' IS actually a feature request since it changes functionality |
| 13:14:03 | dongs | it is NOT a duplicate. |
| 13:14:08 | dongs | he wants different functionality for the keys. |
| 13:14:13 | | Join actionshrimp [0] (n=nn@host81-157-226-72.range81-157.btcentralplus.com) |
| 13:14:17 | dongs | it has nothign to do with my bug report. |
| 13:14:56 | dongs | my bug report is for 1track repeat operation. |
| 13:15:05 | dongs | his feature request is to add some extra way of navigating out of 1track mode. |
| 13:15:35 | Bagder | I just rejected the request for changing the closedness |
| 13:15:42 | Bagder | the entry was crap |
| 13:16:01 | Bagder | if that's the one you're talking about |
| 13:16:47 | dongs | i disagree. |
| 13:16:50 | dongs | the dupe entry is crap. |
| 13:17:01 | Bagder | possibly that too |
| 13:17:14 | dongs | however, my bug report has nothing to do with it. |
| 13:17:24 | linuxstb | dongs: No, it's a duplicate. The original task just suggests a different solution to the problem than you - it's much more useful to add your comments to that task (i.e. start a constructive debate) than to create a new task. |
| 13:17:27 | dongs | if you dont like the way it was reported, feel free to edit it, but the bug still exists. |
| 13:17:40 | dongs | linuxstb: he wants new functionality. |
| 13:17:41 | Bagder | and what _is_ the bug? |
| 13:17:54 | dongs | Bagder: 1-track repeat does not skip to next song on prev/next track buttons/keys. |
| 13:18:14 | Bagder | it isn't a bug |
| 13:18:19 | Bagder | its designed to do that |
| 13:18:31 | dongs | lol, here we go awain |
| 13:18:33 | dongs | again rather. |
| 13:18:37 | Bagder | so its a feature-request to have it changed |
| 13:18:43 | dongs | why don t you scroll up 12 hours ago and see where this has been beaten to death already. |
| 13:19:05 | Bagder | I have my opinion no matter what anyone said 12 hours ago |
| 13:19:09 | linuxstb | dongs: It doesn't matter if you want to call it a bug, and others want to call it a feature request - it won't make any difference to whether a developer decides it's worth implementing. |
| 13:19:38 | dongs | its a usability bug. |
| 13:19:48 | Bagder | but sure, I could possibly have rewritten the entry and re-opened |
| 13:19:49 | linuxstb | I just prefer to call them tasks - it's a fine line between bug and feature, and debating it is a waste of everyone's time. |
| 13:20:13 | Bagder | I decided it was badly written and didn't add any value to the procject: closed |
| 13:20:30 | dongs | okay then. 10 years old 'u' task is a request to have some new shit added, and my 'task' is a report of a broken functionality. |
| 13:20:43 | midkay | why isn't he banned yet? |
| 13:20:53 | XavierGr | dongs I suggest you chill out.... |
| 13:22:27 | dongs | XavierGr: yeah ok. http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5836 vs http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/1309 |
| 13:22:33 | dongs | XavierGr: which one is a bug report and which one is a feature request |
| 13:22:47 | linuxstb | dongs: I'm just saying that even if you persuade everyone that it should be called a bug, what changes? |
| 13:23:06 | dongs | linuxstb: the report needs to be reopened, until its fixed |
| 13:23:14 | midkay | dongs: there |
| 13:23:48 | midkay | there's already a report requesting functionality change for Repeat One. why don't you comment on that with your idea if it's any different from his? |
| 13:24:01 | Bagder | dongs: if you file a properly phrase entry saying you'd like the behaviour modified as you suggest, then I'm fine with it. Like or not but 1309 is very similar to what you asked. |
| 13:24:03 | XavierGr | dongs I agree with Bagder that the report is badly written and I agree with you that it is a bug |
| 13:24:17 | Bagder | but add that to 1309! |
| 13:24:29 | Bagder | no need start flooding the system with almost-similar requsts |
| 13:24:39 | midkay | Bagder: is that at me? |
| 13:24:49 | midkay | i said, comment on it.. i meant comment on 1309. |
| 13:24:58 | Bagder | yes I agree with that |
| 13:25:10 | midkay | k. |
| 13:25:28 | XavierGr | dongs and the attitude in the report is just spoiled. "Well, this one is a no-brainer. |
| 13:25:28 | XavierGr | One would be hard-pressed to find a player that did this, besides rockbox. |
| 13:25:37 | XavierGr | what sort of report is that? |
| 13:25:52 | Bagder | its an attitude problem shining through I'd say |
| 13:26:02 | midkay | that's dongs, and i absolutely can not believe that nobody has even warned him of a kick or ban yet.. |
| 13:26:28 | midkay | he's a broken record troll, "open source sucks", "this is typical", "you idiots", "this is a BUG because i say it is".. |
| 13:26:54 | XavierGr | then ban him and end of story :) |
| 13:26:58 | midkay | arguing along with him for days and days is hardly discouraging to him.. |
| 13:27:10 | midkay | XavierGr: honestly - why hasn't that happened yet. :) |
| 13:27:54 | XavierGr | who knows, main devs feel forgiving maybe? |
| 13:28:20 | midkay | too forgiving.. that and they don't seem to be on often enough to catch it. :) |
| 13:28:23 | dongs | because deep inside, you know I am right, and you're just lazy/whatever to fix the bugs. |
| 13:28:30 | dongs | :D |
| 13:28:30 | midkay | see? again.. |
| 13:28:31 | Kick | (#Rockbox dongs :Bagder) by Bagder!n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder |
| 13:28:41 | XavierGr | LOL |
| 13:28:44 | midkay | thank you. :) |
| 13:28:50 | Bg3r | LAZY ? |
| 13:29:00 | | Join dongs [0] (n=HPUX@h193107.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp) |
| 13:29:03 | dongs | allright. |
| 13:29:16 | Bagder | I'll ban next time |
| 13:29:19 | dongs | back to idle for me until i find a new bug |
| 13:29:32 | Bg3r | dongs: maybe u're the lazy person who doesn't want to fix the bug in his spare time, instead of attacking the other developers |
| 13:30:22 | midkay | yes, we're so lazy, doing the boring little things that don't matter like revamping code, extending stability and support, when we ought to be dealing with the REAL issues here like modifying how the repeat function works or showing the "pause" icon when the fade begins instead of afterwards even though there's about a 1/2 second difference between the two.. |
| 13:30:26 | midkay | we have our priorities all wrong. :( |
| 13:30:57 | * | Bagder is a lazy bastard |
| 13:30:59 | aliask | midkay: Don't feed him... |
| 13:31:59 | midkay | aliask: that's a joke and i didn't mean it in any way to be read by him - i wrote it as he was kicked. that and even if i were feeding him, it's nothing compared to the hours of argument that take place every night over stupid little things like a pause icon. |
| 13:32:25 | Bg3r | he is fed enough ... http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b38/dagg12/a%20couple%20other%20pictures/fuck_on_first_date.jpg |
| 13:32:25 | dongs | midkay: i duno, this is the last thing im gonna say today to avoid getting b&, but, perhaps you should consider your target audience, is it users or 'developers'? End users don't care that you rearranged 50% of playlist.c or somehting, but end users DO care about usability and those 'stupid little features like pause indicator' a lot more than you've spent half a day rewriting code. honestly. |
| 13:32:44 | midkay | Bg3r: haha. |
| 13:32:55 | Bagder | hahaha |
| 13:33:25 | linuxstb | Going back to the root menu idea, I think it needs to have a consistent key assigned in all the screens (WPS, File Browser, Radio, Recording and Tag Browser) to exit back to the root menu. Any suggestions for the various targets? |
| 13:33:28 | Bagder | dongs is way out in the blue |
| 13:33:54 | midkay | dongs: once more, you're the only one we've had complain nearly so extensively about such little things, and in response, why on earth are you using it when apparently we don't care at all about the end user? nobody is forcing or even asking you to.. |
| 13:35:46 | Bg3r | linuxstb: something like stop ? or record for hxxx |
| 13:35:52 | * | amiconn (somewhat) returns and thinks "Oh noes! Not that root menu idea again!!" |
| 13:36:28 | XavierGr | hehe |
| 13:36:31 | amiconn | Imho that's a bad concept. Some retail firmwares use it |
| 13:37:03 | Bg3r | what's wrong with this concept ? |
| 13:37:35 | | Join webguest85 [0] (n=c27f0812@labb.contactor.se) |
| 13:37:41 | Bg3r | it gives the opportunity to set whatever screen you like to be the first showed up upon loading |
| 13:38:53 | amiconn | That can be done without a root menu |
| 13:39:19 | | Join gtkspert_ [0] (n=gtkspert@203-59-197-151.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 13:39:23 | webguest85 | Bg3r: actually I liked the way it worked in the original iriver H1xx firmware. I mean: RECORD gets you to the recording screen, long press of PLAY switches between the radio and file browser and/or WPS. |
| 13:39:45 | Bagder | I never understood the h1x0 OF, it was downright confusing to me |
| 13:40:02 | Bagder | not to mention the X5 one |
| 13:40:29 | Bagder | (where I had to pull out the manual to escape from the FM screen) |
| 13:40:45 | midkay | haha. |
| 13:40:51 | Bg3r | Bagder: how do u exit from that screen ?:) |
| 13:41:03 | Bg3r | webguest85: not all people record so often ... |
| 13:41:07 | Bagder | I don't remember anymore, but it made sense once I learned it |
| 13:41:15 | aliask | amiconn: It makes it dead easy for a person starting to use rockbox to learn the ropes. |
| 13:41:16 | Bg3r | haha |
| 13:41:22 | webguest85 | Bagder: how about this (iriver H1xx specific): long pressing of PLAY brings up the screen menu? I don't like the idea myself but maybe it will bring the others to bette ones. |
| 13:41:30 | linuxstb | amiconn: I'm happy to be persuaded against it, but a) users like yourself could avoid it by setting a default start-up screen; and b) shortcuts between screens would keep most (hopefully) all of the existing navigation. |
| 13:41:58 | linuxstb | ^I meant "most (hopefully all)" |
| 13:42:29 | linuxstb | i.e. the best of both worlds - an easier to learn menu system, plus shortcuts. |
| 13:42:38 | amiconn | Bagder: My impression was that the X5 retail fw is more logical than the iriver retail fw |
| 13:43:44 | webguest85 | Bg3r: yes, I haven't recorded a single time. I mainly use playback and radio. But there was no option to start the player in the radio mode (as opposed to recording and WPS). That was the start of FS #5049. |
| 13:43:52 | amiconn | linuxstb: When you can set a startup screen (which is btw already possible - in a limited way) and want shortcuts for switching - why would you need the root menu at all? |
| 13:44:18 | tucoz | I think the only thing in rockbox that I do not like are the quickscreens. As they are not (as far as I know) user configurable, and hence of little use as they are so limited to 4 directions. |
| 13:44:45 | amiconn | We need a virtual root (the screen "dispatcher"), but than virtual root doesn't need a screen itself imo |
| 13:45:01 | tucoz | Maybe they make sence on the archoses |
| 13:45:56 | amiconn | s/than/that/ |
| 13:45:59 | linuxstb | amiconn: I agree - we can implement a new higher-level root without it actually being a screen. But if we have five different screens capable of being dispatched, you'll soon run out of buttons. |
| 13:46:33 | amiconn | Not every screen needs a button, some can be put in the menu, as it is now |
| 13:46:47 | webguest85 | linuxstb: not every transition should have a dedicated button |
| 13:47:08 | tucoz | I actually liked linuxstb's file based shortcut approach |
| 13:48:37 | amiconn | tucoz: How would you localise that?? |
| 13:49:03 | tucoz | amiconn, I know. But, how often do you change language on your player? |
| 13:49:06 | tucoz | I never do |
| 13:49:57 | tucoz | But, the problem is that the shortcuts are hardcoded in the core right? |
| 13:50:33 | | Join JoeyBorn [0] (n=rootmeis@180.sub-70-208-191.myvzw.com) |
| 13:50:52 | tucoz | so to use this, you would have to make a language specific build? (in case you use something other than english) |
| 13:50:59 | amiconn | I do change language every now and then |
| 13:51:28 | amiconn | If the shortcuts are built-in the localisation can be done the standard way |
| 13:51:50 | amiconn | File-based shortcuts can't be handled that way. |
| 13:51:55 | | Quit gtkspert (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:52:07 | amiconn | The very same problem is still unsolved for the tagnavi.config |
| 13:52:30 | tucoz | ok. So that is only in english? |
| 13:52:46 | | Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@82.193.235.34) |
| 13:52:50 | amiconn | yes |
| 13:52:59 | | Quit lukaswayne9 ("Ex-Chat") |
| 13:53:00 | amiconn | I don't like that |
| 13:53:12 | linuxstb | amiconn: If you agree with the idea of a new virtual root, what do you lose by having a menu to show the actions available from that virtual root? |
| 13:53:16 | | Quit webguest85 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.7 (2005/06/19)") |
| 13:53:32 | tucoz | amiconn, but the query language should be in english. Or are you against that as well? |
| 13:53:40 | amiconn | no |
| 13:54:04 | tucoz | ok. But the strings are user configurable right? (I never looked at that file before) |
| 13:54:14 | amiconn | The query language needs to be documented and can be english, but it should be possible to localise at least the standard categories |
| 13:54:32 | amiconn | ...without forcing the user to edit the file |
| 13:54:36 | tucoz | ah. I get what you mean. |
| 13:57:55 | | Join Sinbios [0] (n=Sinbios@HSE-Hamilton-ppp3513671.sympatico.ca) |
| 13:58:04 | | Nick gtkspert_ is now known as gtkspert (n=gtkspert@203-59-197-151.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 14:00 |
| 14:01:28 | mirak_ | linuxstb I mean just not provide the codec module. you would need to copy it manually in rockbox |
| 14:01:31 | | Join TCK [0] (n=tckocr@bb-87-80-197-109.ukonline.co.uk) |
| 14:03:27 | linuxstb | mirak_: Yes, I know. But a) codecs need support in the core - it's not possible to implement a codec adding supporting code in the core; b) Rockbox plugins (including Codecs) need to include GPL'd headers and GPL'd code, so (IMO) must be GPL'd. |
| 14:04:31 | mirak_ | linuxstb but I guess the codec was kind of reverse enginered no ? (seems not) |
| 14:04:38 | tucoz | hmm, with language v2 we can localise plugins. Then a tagnavi translator could be made. |
| 14:04:54 | Bagder | tucoz: we can't localise them yet though |
| 14:05:16 | Bagder | we just have the concept laid out, not actually implemented |
| 14:05:19 | tucoz | ok |
| 14:08:09 | | Join Rob2222_ [0] (n=Miranda@ACAE1FB0.ipt.aol.com) |
| 14:09:30 | amiconn | linuxstb: You don't lose something with a root menu provided the startup screen is settable, but you increase code size unnecessarily |
| 14:10:02 | * | amiconn remembers the old idea of replacing the quickscreen with a user configurable menu |
| 14:10:16 | amiconn | That would be more useful imo |
| 14:10:16 | LinusN | amiconn: i think a root menu would be very friendly to the beginner |
| 14:10:28 | amiconn | LinusN: You think so? I don't |
| 14:10:42 | amiconn | The archos Ondio firmware has a root menu. It's annoying |
| 14:10:56 | Bagder | I think most players have a root menu |
| 14:10:56 | LinusN | amiconn: are you a beginner? |
| 14:11:08 | amiconn | no |
| 14:11:11 | LinusN | there you go |
| 14:11:21 | LinusN | that's probably why you find it annoying |
| 14:11:50 | amiconn | Bagder: Define 'most'. The old archos retail firmwares didn't have that, and that was convenient |
| 14:12:10 | Bagder | most as in most of the players you can buy |
| 14:12:22 | tucoz | including cell phones etc |
| 14:13:04 | amiconn | tucoz: A cellphone is a different matter here, as the music playing capability is an add-on (imho even just a gimmick) |
| 14:14:04 | amiconn | If you have a dap that acts as an ums device when connected to the pc, it's only logical that the file browser is also the root within the firmware, imho |
| 14:14:42 | tucoz | amiconn, I was mainly thinking of that a root-menu gives a list of the available features, without having to know that a certain key takes you to that menu |
| 14:14:56 | | Quit apo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 14:15:05 | tucoz | that is applicable to both cell phones and daps. |
| 14:15:17 | amiconn | tucoz: It does that, but then it also has at least two disadvantages (apart from increasing code size) |
| 14:15:36 | LinusN | most users don't care about code size |
| 14:15:46 | | Join apo [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:15:46 | amiconn | (1) It makes accessing the main functions slower (that can be solved by having a configurable startup screen |
| 14:16:24 | amiconn | (2) In its plain form, it's not configurable, i.e. it also shows functions I never (or almost never) use |
| 14:16:41 | amiconn | That's why I reiterated the idea of a user configurable menu |
| 14:16:51 | LinusN | is (2) anything new? |
| 14:17:12 | amiconn | yes |
| 14:17:19 | LinusN | the menu today is full of stuff i never use |
| 14:17:20 | markun | LinusN: on the portpins page, what does the status F mean |
| 14:17:31 | amiconn | LinusN: Do you see the menu on startup? |
| 14:17:32 | LinusN | (F)unction |
| 14:17:41 | LinusN | amiconn: no i don't |
| 14:17:48 | amiconn | It could also act as startup screen as long as no other screen has been set as that, and contain the main functions |
| 14:17:52 | tucoz | Sure. A user configurable menu is fine by me. And if we set an option (optionitis, yes) to for instance 'start in ->file browser/root menu'. Where the root menu is configurable |
| 14:17:58 | LinusN | neither will you, since you will configure the startup screen |
| 14:18:41 | Bagder | I certainly would not either |
| 14:19:04 | Bagder | but I guess we might not be the typical users |
| 14:19:14 | amiconn | The user could then either set a different startup screen, and/or opt to keep the user configurable menu as startup, but remove the screens he doesn't use from it, and add other often-used things |
| 14:19:35 | tucoz | On a related note. What do you think about moving the playback options to the top-level of the menu? |
| 14:19:56 | LinusN | instead of the bookmark stuff? |
| 14:20:11 | tucoz | hmm. No, not instead of anything. In addition to |
| 14:20:46 | markun | Bagder: do you know what F is in I/O/F on the portpins page? |
| 14:20:57 | Bagder | <LinusN> (F)unction |
| 14:20:58 | LinusN | markun: i answered you |
| 14:21:04 | markun | Ah, sorry |
| 14:21:16 | tucoz | The reason for suggesting this is because it is a dap, and playback options/sound options are the key features in a dap. The other options are stuff you change more seldom (fonts etc) |
| 14:25:51 | | Join lodesi [0] (n=lds@d02m-89-83-203-123.d4.club-internet.fr) |
| 14:26:04 | | Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 14:28:24 | tucoz | what is databox used for these days? |
| 14:28:49 | amiconn | I don't think you can use it at all |
| 14:29:02 | tucoz | Then we can get rid of it |
| 14:29:05 | tucoz | imho |
| 14:29:08 | LinusN | where was the root menu idea discussed the last time? in the forums? |
| 14:29:23 | amiconn | HCl wanted to adapt it to tagcache. Perhaps it could be turned into an editor for tagnavi.config, to aid in creating queries |
| 14:29:30 | tucoz | aha |
| 14:29:51 | tucoz | but maybe we can stop building it, but keep the sources in cvs then |
| 14:29:55 | linuxstb | Maybe leave the code, but take it out of plugins/SUBDIRS ? |
| 14:29:58 | tucoz | :) |
| 14:30:06 | linuxstb | Ah... Good idea. |
| 14:30:09 | tucoz | hehe |
| 14:30:12 | amiconn | LinusN: What do you think about the user configurable menu idea, with that menu being the root menu unless configured differently? |
| 14:30:44 | LinusN | sounds fine to me |
| 14:31:33 | | Join daurn|lap [0] (n=quae@124.243.137.107) |
| 14:31:43 | Bagder | to me that sounds like a configurable root menu :-) |
| 14:31:46 | daurn|lap | hi Bagder |
| 14:31:53 | Bagder | hey |
| 14:32:12 | daurn|lap | can you debug pcs? |
| 14:32:19 | amiconn | User configurable menu means every menu submenu would need a unique identifier. These identifiers would then be stored in the .cfg, with a fallback to a built-in list |
| 14:32:23 | Bagder | "debug pcs" ? |
| 14:32:27 | daurn|lap | well |
| 14:32:31 | daurn|lap | my computer is fucked |
| 14:32:36 | daurn|lap | - i want it fixed |
| 14:32:36 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 14:32:40 | Bagder | hahaha |
| 14:32:48 | Bagder | buy a new |
| 14:32:50 | markun | Sounds like a job for bagder ;) |
| 14:32:51 | daurn|lap | can you lend me $1000? |
| 14:33:08 | | Quit chendo__ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 14:33:17 | | Join chendo [0] (n=chendo@203-206-100-80.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 14:34:02 | markun | One of the pins of the gigabeat is configured as a pwm timer output. Does anyone have an idea what it could be used for? |
| 14:35:38 | Bagder | someone for generating pwm pulses I guess |
| 14:35:40 | Bagder | somehow |
| 14:36:04 | markun | yes, but for what. It's probably not connected to the backlight |
| 14:36:22 | amiconn | Can you trace it? |
| 14:36:52 | markun | amiconn: well, wibbix tried that and this is the result :) http://www.faxus.net/wade/bad_job.jpg |
| 14:38:09 | daurn|lap | lol |
| 14:38:12 | daurn|lap | nice job |
| 14:38:14 | daurn|lap | :p |
| 14:38:27 | markun | It's from the probe of the logic analyzer. The CPU is BGA so it's pretty hard to trace. |
| 14:38:42 | daurn|lap | maybe don't use a 1m rasp next time |
| 14:38:43 | daurn|lap | ;) |
| 14:38:52 | markun | daurn|lap: I'll tell him |
| 14:40:00 | | Quit JoeyBorn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 14:41:19 | amiconn | markun: ouch! |
| 14:41:33 | * | amiconn remembers tracing some things on his Ondio SP |
| 14:42:18 | amiconn | Closeups of some pins of the clock gating chip might look similar (w/o any pin failing though) |
| 14:42:20 | * | daurn|lap doesn't remember.......... anything |
| 14:42:35 | | Quit apo (Remote closed the connection) |
| 14:43:16 | | Join apo [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 14:44:08 | * | amiconn wonders what the update cycle of rasher.dk/rockbox/people/">http://rasher.dk/rockbox/people/ is |
| 14:44:12 | * | LinusN remember tracing the whole goddamn h100 :-) |
| 14:45:00 | markun | LinusN: we are hoping for a broken gigabeat to desolder all the components and open up the LCD module |
| 14:45:23 | linuxstb | markun: Looks like wibbix may have one soon :) |
| 14:45:37 | | Join barrywardell [0] (n=892b7a86@labb.contactor.se) |
| 14:46:59 | * | amiconn thinks that a lot of the new suggestions would profit from switching to .cfg files |
| 14:47:05 | LinusN | oh yes |
| 14:47:40 | | Join Kitar|st [0] (i=Kitarist@BSN-210-230-171.dial-up.dsl.siol.net) |
| 14:47:55 | * | amiconn also wants one of those time machines LinusN requested earlier :/ |
| 14:48:14 | daurn|lap | LinusN: can you help me with a NewPort? |
| 14:48:21 | LinusN | we should start working on those instead of that silly audio player stuff |
| 14:48:44 | LinusN | daurn|lap: shoot |
| 14:48:54 | daurn|lap | well, i want to start on a new port |
| 14:49:02 | daurn|lap | i have hardware addresses |
| 14:49:23 | daurn|lap | and just pretty much need help setting up a area in the rockbox files |
| 14:49:45 | daurn|lap | - i just CAN'T do makefiles |
| 14:49:46 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 14:49:49 | markun | daurn|lap: which player? |
| 14:50:05 | daurn|lap | gmini 402 |
| 14:50:19 | LinusN | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PortingHowTo |
| 14:50:38 | LinusN | a work-in-progress porting howto |
| 14:51:20 | daurn|lap | yay |
| 14:51:20 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 14:51:40 | daurn|lap | ok, i'll do that - then come back and beg for more help |
| 14:51:41 | daurn|lap | ;) |
| 14:51:49 | Bagder | wooo |
| 14:52:05 | LinusN | it's a start at least |
| 14:52:26 | | Quit mkey (""Welcome to IRC; Where men are men, women are men and little girls are FBI agents!"") |
| 14:52:34 | | Join webguest36 [0] (n=3efc4010@labb.contactor.se) |
| 14:52:41 | Bagder | anyone with windows around feeling like extracting some mi4/bl files for me? |
| 14:52:51 | daurn|lap | never heard of them |
| 14:52:52 | LinusN | i can do it |
| 14:53:08 | Bagder | http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/tatung/FWSetup_M310_2006_Feb_16(WIN_XP)(1140)(EU).exe |
| 14:53:18 | Bagder | http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/tatung/firm/Firmware_Setup_2005_Dec_28(Europe).exe |
| 14:53:39 | Bagder | they're for two different Tatung Elio players |
| 14:53:41 | | Join bluebrother [0] (i=VUdgNRdl@nat-wh-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de) |
| 14:54:05 | Bagder | they're refused when run with wine |
| 14:55:32 | Bagder | daurn|lap: http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/mi4.html |
| 14:55:50 | LinusN | Unable to run the firmware installer! tatung M310 utility does not been installed on your computer |
| 14:56:07 | Bagder | :-/ |
| 14:56:17 | LinusN | hang on |
| 14:56:33 | Bagder | that's of course possible to install, but still might not be worth it |
| 14:57:00 | mirak_ | hey look that, http://joris-dedieu.developpez.com/coldfire_intro/ it's a coldfire programmation tutorial in french |
| 14:57:24 | mirak_ | maybe it's alerady known |
| 14:58:05 | amiconn | LinusN: Do you have an idea what might cause some things mysteriously not working on X5? |
| 14:58:22 | LinusN | amiconn: that was a very general question |
| 14:58:56 | amiconn | E.g. 'metronome' doesn't work for me at first start after boot. It doesn't crash, and you can make it 'tock' with the tap button, but it doesn't tock autmatically |
| 14:59:10 | amiconn | Leaving it and re-entering fixes this until the next boot |
| 14:59:32 | LinusN | amiconn: i thought i had fixed that a long time ago |
| 15:00 |
| 15:00:03 | amiconn | Also, doom hangs at 'starting gfx engine'. It's not the user timer,as it also happens when compiling with the tick-sync mechanism |
| 15:00:09 | | Quit XavierGr () |
| 15:00:15 | amiconn | LinusN: oh? |
| 15:00:38 | LinusN | and now it is back |
| 15:01:08 | amiconn | I already compared the MCF5249 and SCF5250 datasheet's timer sections, but couldn't find a difference that maight cause timer misbehaviour |
| 15:01:33 | amiconn | There are differences, (5250 can't do some things that 5249 can), but we don't use those features |
| 15:01:54 | daurn|lap | ok |
| 15:02:02 | amiconn | LinusN: Do you remember rthe cause? |
| 15:02:08 | daurn|lap | what do i put for compiler to use? |
| 15:02:14 | LinusN | amiconn: trying to...... |
| 15:02:22 | daurn|lap | i want to compile for arm9 |
| 15:02:28 | daurn|lap | do i use arm9tdmicc? |
| 15:03:50 | Bagder | well, arm is arm |
| 15:04:05 | Bagder | you don't _have to_ alter anything |
| 15:04:06 | | Quit Kohlrabi (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 15:04:09 | | Quit webguest36 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 15:04:19 | | Join MadDog011 [0] (n=MadDog01@212-200-212-95.adsl.sezampro.yu) |
| 15:04:24 | Bagder | using -march or -mcpu can of course optimize some things |
| 15:04:32 | | Join Kohlrabi [0] (n=Kohlrabi@dslb-082-083-142-181.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:04:33 | daurn|lap | i mean in the configure script |
| 15:04:43 | Bagder | then use arm like the others I'd say |
| 15:04:49 | daurn|lap | all have different ones |
| 15:04:50 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 15:04:56 | | Join webguest46 [0] (n=3efc4010@labb.contactor.se) |
| 15:05:11 | Bagder | ah |
| 15:05:27 | Bagder | well is your core really a arm9tdmi? |
| 15:05:39 | daurn|lap | arm DM320\ |
| 15:05:43 | daurn|lap | (arm9) |
| 15:05:47 | Bagder | that's not the name of the core |
| 15:05:51 | daurn|lap | well |
| 15:06:03 | daurn|lap | 1 sec |
| 15:06:15 | daurn|lap | ARM926EJ-S |
| 15:06:24 | Bagder | right, that's not a tdmi |
| 15:06:27 | daurn|lap | so, not tdmu |
| 15:06:28 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 15:07:04 | Bagder | still |
| 15:07:15 | Bagder | I doubt thouse -mcpu options do much good... ;-) |
| 15:07:24 | Bagder | but you should create a new such function I'd say |
| 15:07:38 | Bagder | arm926ejcc or similar |
| 15:07:52 | daurn|lap | :( |
| 15:07:59 | daurn|lap | this is already looking like too much effort |
| 15:08:00 | aliask | Man, I love this to-and-fro with bluebrother and Datman on flyspray :D |
| 15:08:06 | Bagder | why? they are 4 lines? |
| 15:08:18 | Bagder | if that is too much effort then eject now yes |
| 15:08:27 | | Part MadDog011 |
| 15:08:28 | Bagder | you'll need to write HEAPS of much more |
| 15:09:21 | Bagder | aliask: yeah, seems its gonna be quite a few episodes of this.. |
| 15:10:04 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 15:10:16 | * | daurn|lap hides in his gmini402 |
| 15:11:08 | aliask | Very early root menu work - now in a patch... here: aliask.dyndns.org:70/temp/rb/">http://aliask.dyndns.org:70/temp/rb/ |
| 15:11:27 | aliask | I'm stopping for the night, too many hours sitting staring into putty is giving me a headache |
| 15:12:27 | daurn|lap | damn |
| 15:12:35 | daurn|lap | i'm just a lowly highlevel C coder |
| 15:12:46 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 15:12:49 | daurn|lap | i can't do fucking make files and shell scrtips |
| 15:13:01 | LinusN | and i'm a highly lowlevel coder :-) |
| 15:13:16 | | Join MadDog011 [0] (n=MadDog01@212-200-212-95.adsl.sezampro.yu) |
| 15:13:19 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 15:13:20 | | Part MadDog011 |
| 15:13:27 | aliask | you should join forces to become an averagely average C coder! |
| 15:13:39 | daurn|lap | i normally just get a ready to use toolchain |
| 15:13:42 | daurn|lap | and write C code |
| 15:13:46 | | Join MadDog011 [0] (n=MadDog01@212-200-212-95.adsl.sezampro.yu) |
| 15:13:49 | daurn|lap | no makefile stuff |
| 15:13:52 | | Part MadDog011 |
| 15:13:57 | daurn|lap | no compiller worries |
| 15:14:28 | LinusN | aliask: 10060 - Connection timeout |
| 15:14:58 | LinusN | daurn|lap: welcome to the real world :-) |
| 15:15:17 | aliask | Ugh, my lowly 256k upstream can probably only handle like 2 concurrent connections |
| 15:15:54 | | Part webguest46 |
| 15:16:00 | Lynx_ | Bagder: did you get your mi4 files yet? |
| 15:16:13 | Bagder | no, the exe files are annoying |
| 15:16:22 | | Join Mmmm [0] (n=3efc4010@labb.contactor.se) |
| 15:16:37 | Bagder | requiring other sw to be installed |
| 15:16:58 | Lynx_ | Bagder: no they don't ;). just a sec. |
| 15:17:02 | Bagder | I found this: http://support.eliohome.com/index.aspx |
| 15:17:19 | | Quit lex ("halt ->") |
| 15:17:21 | Bagder | which seems to have firmwares for all four players, and I would assume all of them are PP based |
| 15:18:27 | Lynx_ | Bagder: tbayer.net/misc/PP5020.mi4 the first of your links |
| 15:18:47 | Bagder | Lynx_: is there are BL for it too? |
| 15:19:15 | Lynx_ | Bagder: no, there is a Ufont.fnt |
| 15:19:22 | Bagder | ok |
| 15:19:45 | linuxstb | Bagder: When you run the .exe files in wine, are any files created in /tmp before it stops working? |
| 15:20:16 | linuxstb | I think that's how I got the Sansa firmware out the exe originally... |
| 15:20:34 | Mmmm | Bg3r: What is it you are doing with keymap-h1x0_h3x0.c ? Would it be ok if I tried getting the recording screen up and running or is that going to muck up what you're doing? |
| 15:20:55 | daurn|lap | what should i put for GCCOPTS? |
| 15:20:56 | Lynx_ | linuxstb, Bagder: those are NSIS installers, 7zip supports extracting them (partly) |
| 15:21:14 | Bagder | linuxstb: nope :-/ |
| 15:21:27 | LinusN | gtg, cu all |
| 15:21:29 | Bagder | Lynx_: I tried that on my linux box but 7zr didn't extract anything? |
| 15:21:32 | daurn|lap | Bagder/ |
| 15:21:33 | | Part LinusN |
| 15:21:54 | Lynx_ | Bagder: i had to get a recent version of 7zip, works for me |
| 15:22:25 | | Join lex [0] (i=lex@evot.us) |
| 15:22:28 | Bagder | daurn|lap: the correct line, use the existing ones as inspiration |
| 15:22:37 | markun | daurn|lap: you don't need to change any make files |
| 15:22:52 | Bagder | markun: no but the configure |
| 15:22:56 | markun | yes |
| 15:22:59 | daurn|lap | ok |
| 15:22:59 | daurn|lap | fine |
| 15:23:14 | Lynx_ | Bagder: you want the file from the second link, too? |
| 15:23:19 | Bagder | yes please |
| 15:23:21 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: And "man gcc" may help with the correct options for your CPU. |
| 15:23:21 | * | daurn|lap guesses: GCCOPTS="$CCOPTS -mcpu=arm926ej -ffunction-sections -mlong-calls" |
| 15:23:34 | Bagder | daurn|lap: probably |
| 15:24:35 | Lynx_ | Bagder: there are 2, one in a 'latest' dir, one in an 'upgrade' dir |
| 15:25:08 | Bagder | and a BL? |
| 15:25:41 | Lynx_ | Bagder: no .bl, but a elio_anim.anm in addition to the .fnt one |
| 15:26:04 | | Join gtkspert_ [0] (n=gtkspert@203-59-171-67.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 15:26:25 | Bagder | weird, the guy in the forum had a BL for that player |
| 15:26:30 | daurn|lap | ok, question that i WILL need input for: - to get my way of loading code to work, i need a binary compilation (.bin) to be inserted into an avi |
| 15:26:40 | daurn|lap | i have a program that does the inserting |
| 15:27:10 | daurn|lap | but, how do i get rockbox to execute it while its code is in the .bin stage? |
| 15:27:13 | Bg3r | Mmmm: here ? |
| 15:27:37 | | Quit aliask ("sleep") |
| 15:27:42 | Lynx_ | Bagder: tbayer.net/misc/2nd/PP5020-L.mi4 and tbayer.net/misc/2nd/PP5020-U.mi4 the -U and -L is from me, they had the same names but were in different folders |
| 15:27:42 | | Quit barrywardell ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 15:27:57 | Mmmm | Bg3r: im here |
| 15:28:04 | Bg3r | wanna see it ? |
| 15:28:17 | Mmmm | see what? :D |
| 15:28:23 | Bg3r | the diff :D |
| 15:28:44 | Mmmm | ok..is it just keymap-h1x0_h3x0.c or have you done the works? |
| 15:28:58 | Bg3r | only this file |
| 15:29:14 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: If you start by building a bootloader (which is just a minimal build of Rockbox, it doesn't have to load anything), it will get compiled to a bootloader.bin file. |
| 15:29:22 | Bagder | Lynx_: great! can you do this also please: http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/tatung/FWSetup_P810_2005_Nov_30(WIN_XP)(2145)(Europe).exe |
| 15:29:33 | Mmmm | Bg3r: right..yeah ok...it's finished? |
| 15:29:35 | daurn|lap | linuxstb: ok........ |
| 15:29:35 | Bagder | that's the last |
| 15:29:41 | | Quit Ribs (Connection timed out) |
| 15:29:45 | Bg3r | Mmmm: nearly, but not tested ... |
| 15:29:49 | Lynx_ | Bagder: yessir |
| 15:30:40 | Mmmm | Bg3r: Ok, Are you going to put it on the wiki? |
| 15:30:48 | | Quit Sinbios ("If the definition of a klutz is someone who doesn't have eyes on their ass, then yes, I suppose I am a klutz.") |
| 15:30:54 | Bg3r | Mmmm: soon |
| 15:31:29 | | Join MadDog011 [0] (n=MadDog01@212-200-212-95.adsl.sezampro.yu) |
| 15:31:33 | | Part MadDog011 |
| 15:32:43 | Lynx_ | Bagder: tbayer.net/misc/3rd/PP5020.mi4 |
| 15:33:16 | Bagder | Lynx_: thanks! got them all |
| 15:33:18 | Lynx_ | Bagder: no .bl either |
| 15:33:26 | Bagder | odd |
| 15:33:45 | Bagder | well, they might have a fine installed already |
| 15:33:55 | Bagder | just that it makes it harder to decrypt them |
| 15:34:28 | Lynx_ | Bagder: there is a $Plugins dir in the installer also, with some .dll files. but i guess that has nothing to do with the firmware. |
| 15:34:45 | Bagder | no, nothing we care about at least |
| 15:36:55 | Lynx_ | Bagder: are you planning to port rockbox to 23 similar targets at once? ;) |
| 15:37:03 | Bagder | yes! |
| 15:37:05 | Bagder | hehe |
| 15:37:13 | Bagder | they're not that similar unfortunately |
| 15:37:25 | daurn|lap | how do i find out about my rtc? |
| 15:37:44 | | Quit gtkspert (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:37:47 | Bagder | daurn|lap: analyze your PCB, dissasemble firmware, guess... |
| 15:37:52 | Bagder | or just ignore it for now |
| 15:38:22 | daurn|lap | .//ignore |
| 15:38:24 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 15:41:10 | Bagder | Lynx_: but I've at least opened the door for 23 new targets! |
| 15:41:23 | Bagder | I should say MrH has |
| 15:41:23 | | Quit TCK (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 15:41:28 | daurn|lap | please xplain BATTERY_CAPACITY_DEFAULT |
| 15:41:36 | Bagder | daurn|lap: ignore for now |
| 15:41:54 | Lynx_ | Bagder: is it really so many? |
| 15:42:11 | Bagder | I have 20 mentioned on my mi4 page |
| 15:42:22 | Bagder | I bet we can easily find a bunch more |
| 15:42:28 | Lynx_ | Bagder: and who is MrH? |
| 15:42:40 | Bagder | he's an anonymous source of much hacking wisdom |
| 15:43:05 | Lynx_ | ah. you'd think MrX would be more appropriate then. |
| 15:43:21 | Bagder | we throw the hardest nuts to him and he comes back with the algorithm and code to decrypt ;-) |
| 15:43:46 | Bagder | and I'm left to edit HTML |
| 15:43:57 | Lynx_ | hehe |
| 15:44:38 | Lynx_ | is he on the forums? |
| 15:44:45 | Bagder | nope |
| 15:44:56 | Bagder | only by private mail |
| 15:45:03 | Lynx_ | i see. you exchange messages hidden under a park bench. |
| 15:45:16 | Bagder | yeah, at midnight |
| 15:45:26 | daurn|lap | could you help me with keypad thing(s)? |
| 15:45:28 | Lynx_ | :) |
| 15:47:06 | Bagder | daurn|lap: define a keypad type for your target |
| 15:49:02 | tucoz | Mr Z was a famous man in the old days of the 64, iirc |
| 15:49:18 | Bagder | yeps |
| 15:49:36 | Bagder | swedish he was |
| 15:49:38 | tucoz | he wrote turbo tape 64, right? |
| 15:49:42 | bluebrother | damn, I hate users that can't read :( |
| 15:49:47 | Bagder | yeah and cracked a zillion games |
| 15:49:47 | tucoz | or was it another compression |
| 15:49:58 | Bagder | "cracked by mr z" |
| 15:50:15 | * | tucoz gets nostalgic |
| 15:50:21 | Bagder | he was a friend of a friend |
| 15:50:45 | tucoz | cool. So I have chatted with mr z's friends friend :) |
| 15:50:57 | Bagder | hehe |
| 15:52:39 | tucoz | Bagder, is this the one? http://noname.c64.org/csdb/scener/?id=8072 |
| 15:52:50 | Bagder | yeps |
| 15:53:04 | tucoz | his cracking cv sure is impressive |
| 15:53:16 | Bagder | yeah |
| 15:53:37 | ze | Bagder: what're these 23 potential new targets? |
| 15:53:51 | Bagder | ze: pp based ones: http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/mi4.html |
| 15:54:06 | bluebrother | was it intended the horizontal scrolling got removed with the new button stuff? |
| 15:54:16 | ze | Bagder: cool |
| 15:55:00 | ze | Bagder: aww, not the karma though? or maybe? |
| 15:55:17 | Bagder | that's not PP is it? |
| 15:55:21 | ze | yep |
| 15:55:22 | Zagor | karma is not pp |
| 15:55:34 | ze | the portalplayer chip right? |
| 15:55:35 | linuxstb | It's the PP5003 IIRC... |
| 15:55:45 | ze | or one version of it rather |
| 15:55:49 | ze | linuxstb: something like that, yeah |
| 15:56:06 | Bagder | ze: you know if there's any mi4 for the karma anywhere? |
| 15:56:11 | Zagor | if you say so :-) |
| 15:56:16 | Bagder | possibly they didn't do it mi4-style back then |
| 15:56:31 | ze | Bagder: i never even heard of mi4 till just now |
| 15:56:37 | ze | so i'll have to figure out what its about and look into it |
| 15:56:41 | Zagor | pp5020 according to wikipedia |
| 15:56:44 | Zagor | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PortalPlayer |
| 15:56:57 | ze | Zagor: yeah thats what i was thinking |
| 15:57:42 | daurn|lap | arg |
| 15:57:45 | daurn|lap | this is shitting me |
| 15:57:46 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 15:57:54 | daurn|lap | the src is so hard to follow |
| 15:57:57 | Zagor | Interesting. The karma has (had) quite a different firmware from most other pp players. that's why I thought it wasn't pp. |
| 15:57:57 | daurn|lap | TO MANY TARGETS |
| 15:57:58 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 15:58:12 | linuxstb | Zagor: Don't believe wikipedia - they quote Rockbox's wiki as a reference to the fact the Karma has a PP5020. Googling will tell you it's a PP5003. |
| 15:58:21 | Zagor | linuxstb: aha, ok |
| 15:58:35 | linuxstb | (and our wiki just says it uses a portalplayer chip) |
| 15:58:51 | ze | heh |
| 15:58:56 | daurn|lap | ok, who wants to help a noob like me? |
| 15:59:12 | ze | im trying to find my riovolution forum thread where an ex-rio engineer said some specific stuff |
| 15:59:15 | linuxstb | It must have been one of the first PP DAPs - and they went their own way. |
| 15:59:39 | Bagder | so its likely they didn't do it mi4-style |
| 15:59:44 | ze | :/ |
| 15:59:54 | Bagder | but checking doesn't hurt |
| 15:59:54 | linuxstb | Interesting link: http://tonytalkstech.com/2004/06/04/ogg-on-the-ipod/ |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:57 | Zagor | yeah, they did gapless, ogg flac etc. |
| 16:01:12 | Bagder | "The gen1/2 stored their code from flash, not SDRAM" |
| 16:01:18 | Bagder | funny way of putting it ;-) |
| 16:01:29 | daurn|lap | could you help me with keypad thing(s)? |
| 16:01:36 | daurn|lap | well |
| 16:01:46 | daurn|lap | mainly with the whole - add a new target thing |
| 16:03:45 | Mikachu | and this reply http://www.gizmodo.com/archives/ogg-vorbis-on-ipod-a-rebuttal-015738.php |
| 16:05:20 | ze | weird, my thread seems to have disappeared... i wonder why, there still seems to be older posts of mine on there... |
| 16:07:00 | ze | man, why doesn't the wayback machine have anything that takes parameters :/ |
| 16:07:04 | Zagor | ze: probably just a conspiracy |
| 16:07:26 | linuxstb | Mikachu: We should contact Monty and challenge him to prove it by optimising the Rockbox Tremor implementation for us... |
| 16:07:32 | Mikachu | :) |
| 16:07:40 | ze | Zagor: maybe an ex-rio engineer posted a reply they shouldn't have :p |
| 16:07:47 | Mikachu | not likely if gcc can beat him at optimising arm |
| 16:07:53 | linuxstb | :) |
| 16:08:35 | Zagor | well he did write about asm, not arm |
| 16:08:38 | linuxstb | Also, isn't ARM720 significantly more powerful than arm7tdmi? |
| 16:09:20 | Zagor | meh, I suck at reading today... |
| 16:09:30 | Zagor | if you want me, I'll be in that corner −−−−−−−−> |
| 16:09:30 | preglow | Mikachu: doesn't happen often... |
| 16:09:39 | | Quit daurn|lap (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:09:58 | | Join daurn|lap [0] (n=quae@124.243.137.107) |
| 16:11:14 | ze | whoa, google's got it cached |
| 16:12:16 | ze | "If you did manage to, the one hint I can give you is that the 5003 chip in the Karma is closer (in terms of register locations) to the 5020 in the gen 4 ipod than the 5002 in the gen1,2,3 iPods." |
| 16:12:22 | ze | now that thats old news :p |
| 16:12:51 | linuxstb | Anyone have a Karma firmware? |
| 16:13:30 | * | amiconn just had an idea how to optimise the serial data transfer for the remote lcds on coldfire (Irivers and X5) even more than it already is for the Irivers :) |
| 16:13:33 | ze | well i've got a karma :p |
| 16:13:48 | | Join mkey [0] (n=mkey@pD9E3532A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:14:03 | amiconn | I'll use a technique that could be called "binary derivative" ... |
| 16:14:30 | ze | linuxstb: the biggest problem with the karma still, afaik is |
| 16:14:33 | ze | linuxstb: "a big hurdle is that the firmware updates are encrypted which means it's hard to load anything onto the unit - and it's unlikely that anyone would be able to give authorisation to release this information now." |
| 16:15:01 | ze | not just "encrypted", i guess that line doesn't say but i was later told its public-key encrypted |
| 16:15:08 | daurn|lap | ok, who wants to help a noob like me? |
| 16:15:15 | daurn|lap | well |
| 16:15:17 | daurn|lap | mainly with the whole - add a new target thing |
| 16:15:21 | linuxstb | ze: Is there any demand for Rockbox on the Karma? I thought the original firmware was very well liked? |
| 16:15:57 | ze | linuxstb: it is in general, but its got some bugs and really doesn't fulfill the device's potential |
| 16:16:30 | ze | linuxstb: and now that rio's dead, thats sortof a indefinite condition without a replacement |
| 16:16:52 | bluebrother | tucoz, I gave the "blurry images" issue a shot −− what do you think of that values? http://pastebin.ca/137582 |
| 16:16:55 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: How far have you got? Have you edited tools/configure ? |
| 16:17:08 | daurn|lap | yes |
| 16:17:20 | daurn|lap | i've just finished with ata registers |
| 16:17:27 | daurn|lap | - i'm not doing anything in order |
| 16:17:27 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 16:17:38 | preglow | blurry images? |
| 16:17:46 | daurn|lap | where are all the hardware regs kept? |
| 16:18:03 | daurn|lap | ones i'm doing now are: firmware\target\arm\archos\gmini402 |
| 16:18:13 | daurn|lap | copied from ix5 |
| 16:18:21 | preglow | what cpu does gmini502 use? |
| 16:18:24 | preglow | 402 <- |
| 16:18:28 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: You should at least copy another ARM target... |
| 16:18:34 | bluebrother | preglow, see http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5620 −− on the large sized daps the images get scaled pretty heavily which looks ... blurry. |
| 16:18:34 | Bagder | preglow: tms320dm320 |
| 16:18:42 | tucoz | bluebrother, looks good. Apart from the fact that images do not look blurry when using acrobat |
| 16:18:43 | daurn|lap | linuxstb: ix5 is arm |
| 16:18:51 | daurn|lap | fuck |
| 16:18:52 | daurn|lap | i mean |
| 16:18:57 | preglow | bluebrother: isn't there a way to tell the display driver that you don't want interpolation? |
| 16:18:57 | daurn|lap | i copied from iriver h10 |
| 16:19:02 | daurn|lap | all these is |
| 16:19:03 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 16:19:03 | tucoz | bluebrother, this is a xpdf problem right? |
| 16:19:08 | bluebrother | tucoz, I don't have acrobat installed ;-) |
| 16:19:09 | mirak_ | daurn|lap you are porting to gmini ? |
| 16:19:12 | daurn|lap | "i"s |
| 16:19:14 | mirak_ | 40 |
| 16:19:16 | daurn|lap | mirak: trying |
| 16:19:17 | mirak_ | 402 |
| 16:19:38 | bluebrother | I'm not sure if it's only xpdf. But the screenshot text becomes pretty unreadable on manuals like the video. |
| 16:19:57 | bluebrother | so I think increasing the size would be the best. Think of users who print the manual ... |
| 16:19:59 | tucoz | bluebrother, no. But there is another open source pdf viewer (do not remember the name) that works better than xpdf |
| 16:20:04 | mirak_ | maybe I would have bought that one if there was rockbox. it was a serious contender but I bought H300 instead |
| 16:20:12 | daurn|lap | heh |
| 16:20:16 | daurn|lap | 402 is great |
| 16:20:16 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: If I was you, I would just get a bootloader compiling (adding empty functions everywhere as needed), and then gradually start filling them in. |
| 16:20:29 | tucoz | bluebrother, if people print the manual, then we will not have this problem as a printer uses more dpi compared to a screen |
| 16:20:30 | linuxstb | (I mean a bootloader that doesn't actually do anything...) |
| 16:20:34 | Mikachu | bluebrother: have you tried evince? |
| 16:20:45 | preglow | tucoz: the printer driver might very well still interpolate the picture |
| 16:20:49 | daurn|lap | linuxstb: well, where is hardware registers like RAM, Screen etc? |
| 16:20:50 | tucoz | preglow, ok |
| 16:20:57 | preglow | but it's not so much of a problem in general, no |
| 16:21:01 | mirak_ | some guy showed me a video on the gmini402, that's really smooth, but the screen seemed less quality than the H300 |
| 16:21:42 | daurn|lap | mirak: best thing is it has divx nativky - just download a vid from the "reggular" places, and it can play it (99% of the time) |
| 16:21:52 | tucoz | bluebrother, but if you think it works fine and it solves a common problem. I think you can commit that. |
| 16:21:56 | | Join A_M [0] (n=51e2cbe3@labb.contactor.se) |
| 16:22:17 | daurn|lap | linuxstb? |
| 16:22:36 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: I'm not sure where any RAM initialisation would go, but anything to do with the screen will go in something like lcd-gmini.c - the LCD drivers are split into two parts, a high-level framebuffer drawing part which depends on the format of the LCD (e.g. lcd-16bit.c) and a low-level driver (e.g. lcd-ipodvideo.c). |
| 16:22:37 | tucoz | It will probably waste one or two pages, but that is no biggie as long as people find the manual more usable |
| 16:22:41 | bluebrother | evince is a bit better but "blurry" while xpdf is kindof pixelated. |
| 16:23:12 | daurn|lap | linuxstb: i just want the file all the adresses are in |
| 16:23:13 | daurn|lap | S: |
| 16:23:17 | tucoz | let me check with acrobat |
| 16:23:38 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: Then you want the linker file - firmware/boot.lds for the bootlaoder, firmware/app.lds for Rockbox itself. |
| 16:23:57 | bluebrother | to quote that task up to now they are "to the point of being unreadable" so I guess this would be the best. |
| 16:24:05 | amiconn | linuxstb: Speaking about lcd-16bit.c - in case we get HWM for the H300 and X5 lcd controller going, it might be desirable to flip the framebuffer for those devices, needing different drawing routines. |
| 16:24:26 | tucoz | bluebrother, yes. That is of course not what we want |
| 16:24:30 | amiconn | That would probably mean we will have two of them... |
| 16:24:34 | daurn|lap | o fuck |
| 16:24:45 | daurn|lap | i'll need a good coder's help for this part |
| 16:24:52 | linuxstb | What do you mean by flip? Write "columns" of pixels to the LCD instead of rows? |
| 16:25:24 | amiconn | Yes |
| 16:25:36 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: Or just patience... It took me a long time to understand all this when I started the ipod port. |
| 16:25:49 | bluebrother | wow, there's a package of acroread available for my system... |
| 16:25:56 | amiconn | The lcd controller has a special high speed mode where you have to write in multiple of 4 pixels, but it's twice as fast as the normal mode |
| 16:26:04 | daurn|lap | linuxstb: or - you could help me ;) |
| 16:26:33 | tucoz | bluebrother, I guess you can commit that. When looking at a screenshot in 100% view. It is blurry |
| 16:26:37 | amiconn | The problem is that the high speed mode doesn't support the update direction setting, but always updates rows (as seen by the controller) |
| 16:27:24 | amiconn | ..and the LCD is mounted "vertical", i.e. controller rows are columns as seen by the dap user |
| 16:27:33 | preglow | should we call the h1x0 button navi or select? manual seems to call it select, lang files call it navo |
| 16:27:41 | preglow | navi, yes |
| 16:27:46 | tucoz | bluebrother, but this also raises another issue. The current screenshots use the same font for all targets (which is the case for rockbox in general). I would propose that icatcher or whatever as standard |
| 16:27:50 | * | amiconn votes Select |
| 16:27:52 | | Quit Caliban (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:28:06 | tucoz | preglow, the manual calls it navi. However, the picture of the h1x0 still calls it select |
| 16:28:25 | preglow | was talking about the picture, yes :> |
| 16:28:38 | tucoz | The reason we call it navi, is that it's called navi in the manual for the iriver fw. |
| 16:28:47 | daurn|lap | select |
| 16:28:47 | preglow | ah, right |
| 16:28:50 | preglow | then lets go for navi |
| 16:28:54 | amiconn | tucoz: For the H1x0 as well? |
| 16:29:03 | tucoz | amiconn, yes. LinusN said so |
| 16:29:09 | amiconn | Ah ok then |
| 16:29:23 | preglow | manual's looking good |
| 16:29:34 | bluebrother | tucoz, do we have the player pictures available somewhere without the button names? |
| 16:29:45 | preglow | what would do the ipod 5g screenshots a world of good is a better font |
| 16:29:50 | tucoz | bluebrother, there are some in the Comparison table |
| 16:29:54 | tucoz | in the wiki |
| 16:30:05 | tucoz | not that hires for the h1xx |
| 16:30:07 | preglow | it's _TINY_ |
| 16:30:08 | bluebrother | maybe we could set the names differently ... like using pstricks (don't know them, but who knows) |
| 16:30:21 | | Quit nudelyn2 ("At Argon, we're working to keep your money.") |
| 16:31:00 | tucoz | preglow, no kidding. I think a resolution specific default font is quite hi priority. But that's me :) |
| 16:31:15 | preglow | i've always thought that, but we're mostly coders here... |
| 16:31:26 | amiconn | tucoz: The H140 pic is hires |
| 16:31:39 | amiconn | ..'cause it's a scan |
| 16:31:54 | tucoz | amiconn, ok. great :) |
| 16:32:02 | amiconn | Ah, no, the version in the comparison table is only medium resolution |
| 16:32:12 | amiconn | ..but I should still have the original |
| 16:32:39 | linuxstb | amiconn: So I'm guessing we'll need two versions of lcd-16bit.c, unless we can work out how to do the same on all targets? |
| 16:32:52 | tucoz | but maybe that is enough. We do not want too hi res either. As that will make the manual increase in size too much. |
| 16:34:07 | amiconn | My original file is 851x1430 pixel PNG (300 dpi at original size) |
| 16:34:18 | amiconn | 1.2MB |
| 16:34:38 | tucoz | sounds great. The comparison table picture is a jpg iirc. |
| 16:34:55 | amiconn | Yes, for faster display and better browser support |
| 16:35:03 | amiconn | want the png? |
| 16:35:08 | tucoz | amiconn, yes please |
| 16:36:12 | tucoz | thank you |
| 16:37:10 | bluebrother | tucoz, committed. |
| 16:38:01 | tucoz | cool |
| 16:38:02 | ze | hmm how many colors does the table have? |
| 16:38:19 | tucoz | bluebrother, I'll fix the h140front image then |
| 16:38:24 | | Quit Mmmm ("CGI:IRC") |
| 16:38:47 | ze | jpeg and rgb-png both sound like odd choices if it can be indexed color |
| 16:39:00 | | Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@adsl-68-252-4-207.dsl.sfldmi.ameritech.net) |
| 16:39:37 | tucoz | bluebrother, and I can use the mini scan from the comparison table |
| 16:40:14 | amiconn | I also have several other scans (as png or tif) |
| 16:40:43 | bluebrother | tucoz, nice. I'd still would prefer it if we could set the description directly using Tex |
| 16:40:45 | jhMikeS | I was wondering if I should continue down the path of consolidating the codec and format info from various places into a single structure array. It should make things easier to maintain and save some memory. |
| 16:40:54 | daurn|lap | who are the rockbox devs here? |
| 16:41:01 | tucoz | ok. But the mini is hires, and it looks like it is without jpg artifacts |
| 16:41:15 | daurn|lap | Bagder, amiconn, linuxstb, LinusN, who else? |
| 16:41:16 | bluebrother | but that's pretty low priority. But it's on my todo list ;-) |
| 16:41:26 | jhMikeS | daurn|lap: I might be too :) |
| 16:41:28 | tucoz | bluebrother, like overlay the keys to the image? |
| 16:41:43 | bluebrother | yes, like that. Maybe xfig can help us doing that. |
| 16:41:57 | daurn|lap | jhMikeS: ORLY |
| 16:42:04 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: What codec and format info do you mean? |
| 16:42:13 | jhMikeS | darun|lap: I have a badge |
| 16:42:16 | Mikachu | daurn|lap: http://www.rockbox.org/viewcvs.cgi/docs/CREDITS?rev=1.172&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup |
| 16:42:35 | tucoz | bluebrother, we could just commit a layered gimp image until then |
| 16:42:39 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: One thing to pay attention to is the split between hwcodec and swcodec platforms - it may not be possible to unify things because of that. |
| 16:42:42 | daurn|lap | Mikachu: i want it with irc nicks |
| 16:42:43 | daurn|lap | :P |
| 16:42:48 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: the labels and codec filenames in sync with the AFMT_* enum |
| 16:42:53 | bluebrother | hmm. That's an option. |
| 16:43:02 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: I have that covered :) |
| 16:43:11 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: Then it seems sensible to me. |
| 16:43:31 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: There are no *.codec file for HW codec players right? |
| 16:43:38 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: Right. |
| 16:43:42 | linuxstb | (yet...) |
| 16:43:52 | jhMikeS | Covered that too. |
| 16:43:58 | tucoz | amiconn, we miss scans of the ipod4g, ipod color, ipod video, ipod nano and the x5 |
| 16:44:16 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: just some simple macro changes is all |
| 16:44:39 | jhMikeS | depending on CONFIG_CODEC and such |
| 16:44:48 | daurn|lap | ANYWAY |
| 16:44:55 | daurn|lap | who can help me? |
| 16:44:56 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 16:45:32 | markun | daurn|lap: did you create a config file in firmware/export ? |
| 16:45:39 | daurn|lap | yes |
| 16:45:49 | jhMikeS | daurn|lap: ORLY- my name is there if you doubt it. :) |
| 16:46:01 | amiconn | tucoz: Hmm. I only have mini g2, ipod color (not perfect but usable), and several archos scans |
| 16:46:10 | amiconn | Oh, and H340 |
| 16:46:10 | linuxstb | daurn|lap: Then you just need to try and build a bootloader for your target, and fix the problems one by one... |
| 16:46:52 | daurn|lap | :S |
| 16:47:15 | Bg3r | anyone willing to test the new iriver keymaps ? |
| 16:47:25 | Bg3r | i gotta go, but it's on the ButtonActionIdea wiki page |
| 16:47:48 | | Join RydellFireDragon [0] (i=Rydell_F@204.186.175.218.res-eph.ptd.net) |
| 16:47:48 | | Join fatherfork [0] (n=fatherfo@adsl-224-18-195.asm.bellsouth.net) |
| 16:47:54 | amiconn | And I made actual photos of (back then) all my targets (7) showing a faked rockbox 3.0 booting |
| 16:48:06 | amiconn | I could add an 8th target |
| 16:48:07 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: Any opinion about the best file to contain that structure? I'm neurotically indecisive. |
| 16:48:09 | amiconn | now |
| 16:48:32 | tucoz | amiconn, ok. Then could make use of the player, recorder, and the recorderv2fm |
| 16:48:47 | tucoz | *I |
| 16:49:49 | amiconn | The scans? |
| 16:50:20 | tucoz | scans or photos. If you think they could work in the manual that is |
| 16:50:46 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: What are your options? |
| 16:50:53 | tucoz | and also the ipod color :) |
| 16:52:35 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: I suppose id3.c, playback.c or codecs.c. Something else maybe? Can always move it later. |
| 16:53:05 | amiconn | id3.c is used on hwcodec |
| 16:53:53 | jhMikeS | It needs to be there for both, yes. |
| 16:54:06 | tucoz | amiconn, thank you very much |
| 16:54:57 | jhMikeS | amiconn: That's the only one of those files thats for both? |
| 16:55:25 | | Join s9|sure [0] (n=sure@cpc5-hem13-0-0-cust676.lutn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 16:55:39 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Yes, currently |
| 16:56:33 | | Join Febs [0] (n=40be240f@labb.contactor.se) |
| 16:57:31 | tucoz | linuxstb, do you have a scan of the video? |
| 16:58:54 | amiconn | Yes, but a very dark one of a black video -> you see a black picture with white text where the wheel is |
| 16:59:13 | amiconn | Ahem, I got that scan from linuxstb |
| 16:59:36 | tucoz | hehe. Hmm. But maybe it is possible to tweak it a little. |
| 16:59:50 | amiconn | Ok, I'll send it |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:00 | tucoz | thanks |
| 17:00:07 | amiconn | But one of the 5 others need to finish first (I only mapped 5 ports for dcc send) |
| 17:00:23 | tucoz | ok |
| 17:00:39 | linuxstb | tucoz: As amiconn mentioned, my scans are not the best.... |
| 17:00:39 | | Quit theli_ua (Remote closed the connection) |
| 17:01:05 | amiconn | The ipod color scan is also from linuxstb, but that one is better |
| 17:01:06 | tucoz | linuxstb, I'll see if I can make use of it for the manual in any case. |
| 17:03:05 | | Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") |
| 17:03:43 | tucoz | the 4g and the color are very similar, right? |
| 17:04:09 | linuxstb | tucoz: The problem with my 5g is that the wheel is a shiny black, and the rest of the ipod is a matt black. So my scanner didn't pick up the difference very well.. |
| 17:04:16 | tucoz | in that case, I only miss the nano and the x5 |
| 17:04:34 | tucoz | ah. I think I have seen that scan some time ago. |
| 17:04:36 | amiconn | I should be able to provide an X5 scan next week |
| 17:04:42 | tucoz | nice |
| 17:04:50 | linuxstb | tucoz: There are ipod pictures here: http://ipodlinux.org/Generations (not usable for you, but it will show the differences) |
| 17:05:50 | linuxstb | tucoz: The two generations of Mini look slightly different (the colour of the writing matches the case on the 2nd Gen), but maybe that can be ignored. |
| 17:06:04 | tucoz | I think so |
| 17:06:12 | tucoz | so is the case for the h1xx series |
| 17:06:47 | * | amiconn should also have an Ondio scan somewhere... |
| 17:09:48 | | Join merbanan [0] (n=banan@c80-216-155-218.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 17:10:02 | tucoz | both the fm and the sp scan suffer from jpg artifacts, so that could be useful |
| 17:12:48 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 17:16:57 | preglow | in the manual part about the channels setting |
| 17:17:11 | preglow | is the last opt line before the table really necessary? |
| 17:17:23 | preglow | i'm just doing some minor rewriting and it seems redundant |
| 17:17:28 | tucoz | where is that? |
| 17:17:32 | preglow | sound settings |
| 17:18:02 | | Quit mantono (Remote closed the connection) |
| 17:18:18 | preglow | i don't like the references to "mixing" everywhere in it |
| 17:18:23 | preglow | the ordinary user might not know what mixing is |
| 17:18:33 | tucoz | hehe, you are right |
| 17:18:58 | preglow | i also found the volume description somewhat confusing, so i'm rewriting that a bit |
| 17:19:28 | tucoz | good. I have a half baked approach to a better crossfeed description. |
| 17:19:35 | preglow | but that is perfect! |
| 17:19:35 | tucoz | crossfade |
| 17:19:35 | preglow | :P |
| 17:19:38 | preglow | ahh, crossfade |
| 17:19:41 | preglow | i didn't write that, heh |
| 17:20:33 | fatherfork | call crossfeed crossfade, what? |
| 17:20:51 | markun | fatherfork: what? |
| 17:20:56 | fatherfork | nothing... |
| 17:21:01 | Mikachu | nothing what? |
| 17:21:05 | markun | :) |
| 17:21:08 | fatherfork | what nothing? |
| 17:21:31 | fatherfork | nothing... master. |
| 17:21:33 | fatherfork | better? |
| 17:21:44 | ShadowdogMU | Yay DNS went through! |
| 17:22:00 | ShadowdogMU | Now I just need an idea for a new domain, what am I going ot put on it |
| 17:22:47 | fatherfork | I still like on the brocks |
| 17:23:11 | Mikachu | why would you buy a domain before you know what to do? |
| 17:23:55 | ShadowdogMU | I still haven't bought the domain |
| 17:23:55 | billytwowilly | what domain is it? |
| 17:25:32 | ShadowdogMU | billytwowilly, dunno yet |
| 17:25:35 | ShadowdogMU | gotta think of one |
| 17:25:39 | ShadowdogMU | and what to put on it |
| 17:26:06 | * | billytwowilly recommends funkymonkeyjunky.com |
| 17:28:02 | billytwowilly | I learned something interesting about italian people researching a racial slur today. Did you know the moors went on a conquest throughout italy in the 9th century and because of that most italians have black people atleast in part as their ancestors? (the moors were black) |
| 17:28:32 | billytwowilly | interesting stuff. |
| 17:31:06 | | Join apo` [0] (n=apo@dslb-084-057-067-064.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 17:31:49 | | Quit apo (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 17:33:11 | | Quit Mancer (" Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-") |
| 17:38:50 | preglow | TALES - OF - INTEREST |
| 17:42:30 | preglow | However, the sound from the left speaker reaches your left ear slightly later than the sound from your right ear <- what was i drinking? |
| 17:42:59 | | Quit RydellFireDragon ("back to work") |
| 17:43:12 | fatherfork | whatever is was, I want some |
| 17:44:52 | Mikachu | preglow: heh |
| 17:46:31 | Mikachu | i wonder if it would be possible to apply hrtf in realtime |
| 17:46:46 | xorAxAx | preglow: you have weird ears :) |
| 17:46:52 | Mikachu | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HRTF |
| 17:47:06 | preglow | |
icon identifies that the person is a core developer (has commit access).