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#rockbox log for 2007-02-01

00:00:49JohnyTheHessNo, wow! I will certainly do that. I read the manual but did'nt go to that link. Thanks.
00:02:36JohnyTheHessGot it here now thanks for the help.
00:04:29Zagorall these target names make me consfused. why am I connecting sansa with samsung? is there a samsung chip in it?
00:06:34 Part JohnyTheHess
00:06:42 Join funky [0] (n=repulse@unaffiliated/funky)
00:06:42preglowZagor: no
00:06:47preglownot afaik
00:07:17preglowsansa is pp based, on they're a flash manufacturer themselves, so i bet the flash chips are sandisk
00:07:24 Quit ]RowaN[ ()
00:07:47***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:07:50 Join bun-bun [0] (
00:07:53Zagorso it's just my normal confusion then
00:08:05 Join subson [0] (n=ju@
00:08:07preglowprobably :)
00:08:49preglowwoot, i've now got a function capable of churning out one sine/cosine pair per 20 cycles! i rule!
00:09:23 Quit bkuhn ("Poker.")
00:10:05markunpreglow: you do :) will it be used for something nice?
00:10:22 Join TrueJournals [0] (n=aimjourn@
00:10:27preglowmarkun: nothing rockbox, it uses sse :/
00:10:34Soul-SlayerWelcome back TrueJournals
00:10:52 Quit Echelon (Remote closed the connection)
00:10:59 Join Echelon [0] (
00:11:08Soul-SlayerHave experienced no lockups or other lag whilst playing music and general navigation so far :).
00:11:12 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (
00:11:19TrueJournalsthat's good... very good :-D
00:12:04 Join upsioned [0] (n=ju@
00:12:06 Join datachild [0] (
00:12:39 Quit subson (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
00:13:29Soul-SlayerHopefully not too far away from a commit now :P
00:14:17 Quit Criamos ("( :: NoNameScript 4.03 :: )")
00:14:23dan_aIt would be good if we could get a list of players which are/aren't having problems with FS #5755
00:14:38Soul-SlayerWell, we need to test it out on iPods still
00:14:47Soul-SlayerHowever I can report it's working fine for the H10 5/6gb
00:15:00Soul-SlayerAtleast, TrueJournals version of it is
00:15:14TrueJournalsyeah, I wish someone here had an iPod to test it on...
00:15:27dan_aI'll do 3&4G greyscale iPods and the Sansa tomorrow night
00:16:19Soul-SlayerWould it be worth trying out on a simulator?
00:16:55Soapsim, not em
00:17:01dan_aSoul-Slayer: Only to confirm it doesn't break them - simulators don't emulate the hardware.
00:17:29Soul-SlayerAha, yes, I suddenly thought that after I said it... My bad :p.
00:17:47TrueJournalsSomeone just replied in flyspray with a H10 5 GB. they said it got rid of rebooting right at start up, but performance seemed "a bit sluggish"... But, with the past patches, some people have reported great improvement, and some people said sluggish, so I would say my patch fixes problems with kernel_on_cop_7
00:18:22Soul-SlayerLet's hope so ^^
00:18:38SoapI'll compile in KoCOP#8 right now for the iPod video. Results in ~1 hour.
00:18:53Soul-SlayerGood luck
00:19:00TrueJournalsI was having problems with kop7 and scroll-margins and some other patches, so I'm trying to compile that right now to see if it causes problems still
00:20:11dan_aI don't think it *should* cause problems, unless scroll-margins affects a thread which we move over to the COP.
00:20:31bluebrotherBagder, Zagor, around?
00:20:41TrueJournalsI wouldn't think so either... but for some reason, each patch alone worked, but together they caused problems
00:20:44TrueJournalsreally weird...
00:20:44ZagorI'm here
00:20:52dan_aThe big question for me will whether or not to move the codec thread onto the COP at commit time, or just have the kernel there for now
00:21:15bluebrotherI've got a license question. I'd like to add the ucs package to fix the utf8 issue for the manual
00:21:21Soapthat's odd, TrueJournals - I never had problems with KoCOP and scroll-margins.
00:21:31bluebrotherbut I'm unsure if I really need to include the complete package.
00:21:33TrueJournalsI didn't either until KoCOP7
00:21:43bluebrotherit's LPPL,
00:21:48Soapwell, did you ever get KoCOP7 working right at all?
00:22:16Zagorbluebrother: reading...
00:22:17TrueJournalsit was kinda sluggish I believe
00:22:24TrueJournalsso that might've been it...
00:22:29Soapok, so why are you bringing scroll margins into the equation?
00:22:34SoapI'm confused.
00:22:40bluebrotherso it's "conditions on distribution", 2. and 3. mostly afaics
00:22:48TrueJournalsjust because it's the only way that it crashed right after showing debug screen
00:23:09Soul-SlayerI think he was just trying using the KoCOP patch with the patches he currently used, which happened to be the scroll margin patch, and got errors... Could be wrong but that's my interpretation
00:23:53TrueJournals(debug screen = bootloader debug)
00:24:06 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:24:21 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:24:21SoapThen why did you say "each patch alone worked", if KoCOP7 never worked alone?
00:24:29Soul-SlayerHe means it didn't error
00:24:42*Zagor diffs LPPL v1.2 vs v1.3c
00:24:43Soul-SlayerKoCOP7 + Scroll margins = Impossible to even use
00:24:53Soul-SlayerKoCOP7 alone booted, but was sluggish
00:25:02 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:25:10 Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:25:43Soul-SlayerIt depends on how you interpret 'worked'. It didn't work as it was supposed to, but it did atleast boot into rockbox
00:25:47*linuxstb_ fails to understand the LPPL
00:27:00SoapFWIW, scroll margins + #7 behaved exactly the same for me as no scroll margins + #7.
00:27:28 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
00:27:31Soap(the best I could tell, molassas in January vs molassas in Feburary perhaps ;) )
00:27:41Zagorbluebrother: I'm afraid it looks like LPPL is no longer a free software license
00:27:54Zagor"Distribution of only part of the Work is considered modification of the Work, and no right to distribute such a Derived
00:27:54ZagorWork may be assumed under the terms of this clause."
00:28:00bluebrotherhmm. Meaning we can't distribute it?
00:28:23Zagorit depends. it's incompatible with GPL, so we can't mix it.
00:28:33linuxstb_Doesn't that just mean the right is covered by a different clause?
00:28:35bluebrotherso if we distribute the complete package this isn't a modification
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00:28:58Zagorbluebrother: correct
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00:29:24bluebrotherso would it be compatible with the manual license if we simply include everything in a subfolder?
00:29:33 Part webguest24
00:30:28Zagorbluebrother: is the manual GPL?
00:31:41Zagorthen we can't mix it in one package. Latex explicitly forbids distributing modified code, which is incompatible with GFDL.
00:31:52 Quit ender` (" Q: What's another name for the "Intel Inside" sticker they put on Pentiums 4? A: Warning label.")
00:32:02Zagorbut we can simply provide two separate downloads
00:32:22bluebrotherhmm. In what way?
00:32:24Mikachudoesn't that make the resulting pdf undistributable?
00:32:53ZagorMikachu: no, the licenses never apply to the works created. otherwise all gcc-compiled code would have to be GPL.
00:33:31Zagorbluebrother: Let's turn it around. Tell me want you'd like to do.
00:34:07bluebrothermy idea was to create a new subfolder in the manual folder with the complete package files in it
00:34:23Zagorin svn?
00:34:26bluebrotherand then modify the Makefile to use that styles found there
00:34:32bluebrotheryes, ideally
00:35:06bluebrotheranother option would be to require anyone building the manual to download and create that folder himself
00:36:12ZagorI think that's probably the better option. A little more hassle, but safer and cleaner.
00:36:39bluebrotherbut as distributions ship packages I'm unsure if we could add it.
00:36:44Zagorafter all we require builders to install a bunch of cross compilers, so this shouldn't be a big burden
00:36:56Zagoradd it?
00:37:12bluebrotherok, so simply attach the distribution archive to the wiki page?
00:37:23bluebrotheradd in terms of adding to our source tree.
00:37:39Zagorhow large is it? perhaps would be a better location.
00:38:08bluebrother1.0MiB as tgz
00:38:26bluebrotherit's also available as zip, I guess it's about the same size
00:38:40Zagorhaving it in svn could also tempt someone to commit a fix for something, which would immediately put us in violation of the license...
00:39:07Zagorok, 1MB is small enough to hang in the wiki
00:39:17bluebrotherI would have added a notice in that case
00:39:42Mikachui thought the license said you could modify it
00:39:55ZagorMikachu: yes, but not distribute the modified result
00:39:55linuxstb_What package are we talking about?
00:40:11Zagorlinuxstb_: LaTeX
00:40:14Mikachuthat's sort of pointless
00:40:20bluebrotherUnicode support for Latex
00:40:21Mikachuyou're always allowed to modify code if you don't redistribute it
00:40:23ZagorMikachu: indeed
00:40:59linuxstb_Can't we just point people to that page and the install instructions there?
00:40:59Mikachuwhy is he so unwilling to let people modify it anyway?
00:42:07Mikachu(i don't expect an answer to that)
00:42:56Zagorlinuxstb_: if we think that page is going to stick around, I agree we should simply link to it.
00:43:06bluebrotherI guess he just choose some common latex license
00:43:20Mikachuand then finally the funny s character will work!
00:43:30Zagorbluebrother: yeah, but the question is why latex is so closed.
00:43:37linuxstb_Anyone know what the Debian latex-ucs package is?
00:43:43bluebrotherno idea
00:43:58bluebrothersounds like exactly this package
00:44:25Zagor"This package provides support for using UTF-8 as input encoding in LaTeX documents."
00:44:43*bluebrother just found that on the web
00:44:50Zagorinstall latex-ucs-doc to find out more :)
00:45:22linuxstb_I've just installed it, and the README says (C) 2000 by Dominique Unruh <>
00:45:47bluebrotherthat's the guy who wrote it.
00:45:59Mikachulatex-unicode in gentoo
00:46:10linuxstb_The README is the same as the README on the website you linked to. So it looks like an identical package.
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00:47:22linuxstb_So I don't think we need to distribute it ourselves.
00:47:24preglowbloody latex
00:47:35preglowsomeone please make something not stuck in the seventies
00:47:38 Quit upsioned ()
00:47:59Zagorwe tried using openoffice for a while
00:48:09*linuxstb_ fails to think of something in the Unix world not stuck in the seventies
00:48:11preglowalso, something _better_ :)
00:48:21preglowlinuxstb_: good point...
00:50:07 Quit matsl ("Leaving")
00:50:10 Quit muesli__ ("ich will Khe!!!")
00:50:27Mikachucomplaining is always fun
00:51:38Mikachui wonder if we will live to see the release of latex 3
00:51:57preglowyes, that'll be the day
00:52:08preglowthe problem with latex 3, not that it'll ever be released, is that it's based on tex
00:52:12Zagorthe devs probably aren't allowed to distribute it
00:53:00preglowtex is really just starting to get old
00:53:47Mikachustill, when you show a latex made printout to a windows user, they invariably go "ooo"
00:53:55preglowtoo bad, 'cause it's pretty good, but with flaws
00:53:58preglowlike the font support
00:54:01bluebrothertex became a bit messy with all those macro packages floating around
00:54:02Zagorwhich problem did we have with openoffice that latex solved, anyway? I was never much involved with the manual.
00:54:10preglowZagor: collaboration
00:54:19linuxstb_Target-specific manuals.
00:54:20Mikachuit's hard diffing a gzipped xml file
00:54:38Zagorcan't openoffice work with the raw xml files?
00:54:45preglowthe openoffice manual was a one person thing, and it's not really easy to change that
00:54:51preglowalso, what linuxstb says
00:56:03ZagorI don't have much of a clue about either format, but if you could dump the compression couldn't the oo xml work ok? or can't it mix many files into a single doc?
00:56:05preglowxml doesn't really make for the nicest patches either
00:56:13preglowwith latex, it's easy to see what changes in a patch
00:56:29bluebrotherI'm pretty sure we won't achieve that flexibility in terms of optional sections and formatting
00:56:30preglowplus, latex output looks nice
00:56:43bluebrothertoo bad we don't have formulae ;-)
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00:56:49preglowindeed, heh
00:56:58Mikachuyou can jot down some equalizer equations
00:57:00preglowi rejoiced everytime i used to have to do math in latex, heh
00:57:10bluebrotherreading formulae in latex code is quite fun once you get used to it
00:57:12Zagorwe need more low-level codec math in the manual
00:57:16Mikachuextremely tangential is
00:57:23Mikachui just saw it earlier today and came to think of it now
00:57:25preglowi've already got some in latex format :)
00:57:34 Quit qiNOFF (Client Quit)
00:57:35bluebrotherbtw, doxygen can use latex to put formulae inside its documentation
00:58:10bluebrotherI once documented a heavy mathy function. The comment was nearly quite long, but the output awesome
00:58:24Mikachunearly quite long?
00:58:25 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
00:58:55bluebrotherIt's gotten late here ;-)
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01:00:50 Join VolfieakaAxlgrea [0] (i=473ce105@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:01:25VolfieakaAxlgreaive never checked out the irc before, its pretty cool
01:01:31preglowdamn straight
01:01:59VolfieakaAxlgreauh yeah. Anybody have any ipod problems
01:02:11Mikachuare you offering to fix them?
01:02:33preglowi could always use some pp documentation...
01:02:59VolfieakaAxlgreai guess i am offering to fix them
01:03:19 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Connection timed out)
01:03:29preglowpeople do come in here from time to time with problems, yes
01:03:41VolfieakaAxlgreaim axlgreasetires except the nickname thing cuts off at Axlgrea
01:03:51 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer))
01:03:51Mikachuthat's very interesting
01:03:57 Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:04:28VolfieakaAxlgreawell i better get back to my chemistry poop.
01:04:58VolfieakaAxlgreaso many molecular equations so little time
01:05:18Mikachui'm all about physics
01:05:50VolfieakaAxlgreayeah i prefer physics to chemistry. but at the moment im focusing on chemistry.
01:06:18bluebrotherok, so we now have a new dependency for the manual but now it works fine for me again.
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01:06:48 Quit VolfieakaAxlgrea ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
01:06:52Mikachuhow does this ucs thing resolve fonts for all different encodings?
01:07:02linuxstb_bluebrother: Did you read the discussion about /bin/dash earlier?
01:07:13preglowdash screws up on the makefile here
01:07:21preglowescape problems
01:07:24Mikachuit's extremely optimistic to point /bin/sh at anything but bash
01:07:30preglowMikachu: word
01:07:52bluebrotherwhat tells dash if you call it with −−version?
01:08:05Mikachudash: Illegal option −−
01:08:38linuxstb_As preglow said, it's the escaping in the dash echo command that breaks things.
01:08:56Mikachuthe man page for dash even states that it isn't posix compliant yet
01:09:37preglowMikachu: haha
01:09:44bluebrotheris there a homepage for dash or do I need to grab it from the debian packages server?
01:10:06preglowi think dash behaved pretty different from most other shells i tried the same echo commands on
01:10:19Mikachuit says "We expect POSIX conformance by the time 4.4 BSD is released."
01:10:22Mikachui assume they refer to netbsd
01:10:32Mikachuwhich is currently at 3.1
01:10:59preglowisn't dash a debian thing?
01:11:07Mikachu Description: Debian-version of NetBSD's lightweight bourne shell
01:11:37bluebrotherwhy does debian need to do everything different?
01:11:47Mikachuonly ubuntu does the crazy thing
01:12:02preglowthey primarily do to speed up startup
01:12:03preglowbut hell
01:12:07Mikachui doubt they can compile much of anything
01:12:08 Quit funky ("leaving")
01:12:09preglowwhy'd they have to redirect /bin/sh for that?
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01:12:20Mikachui doubt bash takes a significant portion of bootup time
01:12:25preglowMikachu: actually, this is the first problem i've come across
01:12:32bluebrotherso ... the current version of dash is 0.5.3?
01:12:47Mikachulooks like it
01:13:26bluebrotherok. I'll try it tomorrow
01:13:35 Quit Echelon (Remote closed the connection)
01:13:41bluebrotherbut now I should go for some sleep. Late here.
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01:17:59 Quit bluebrother ("nite!")
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01:20:59Zagortime for the overnight tailreader test. g'night all.
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02:07:50***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:14:33*pixelma wonders what package (if there is) a cygwin user has to get for being able to build the manual now
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02:18:19preglowthe same package as the linux users, i'd imagine
02:18:47pixelmaI can't find one named tetex-ucs or tetex-unicode
02:19:17preglowfind one where?
02:19:48pixelmain the cygwin installer
02:19:50preglowcygwin itself probably doesn't have it, but latex packages should work fine regardless of os, so just get it at ctan or something
02:20:21pixelmathanks... I'll look at it
02:20:38preglowi'm sure bluebrother will be eager to assist when he wakes up anyway ;)
02:20:38preglowgood night
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02:49:08TrueJournalswow, a lot going on in here...
02:50:37JdGordonthis is the peak time :p
02:50:53TrueJournalsstupid patches...
02:56:31 Quit Thundercloud_ (Remote closed the connection)
02:57:07midgeyTrueJournals: try again, i added palette-presets.h to the patch this time
02:58:06TrueJournalsYup, building this time... thanks :-D
02:58:21midgeywhich target are you on
02:58:26TrueJournalsH10 20 GB
02:58:56midgeyyou said you dont have the same issue as barrywardell?
02:58:56TrueJournalsI'll have to try to re-create barry's error...
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03:03:27TrueJournalsOK, loaded ROM... going to options menu...
03:04:12TrueJournalsNope, I don't get anything... I just changed the screen ratio and it changed fine...
03:05:18midgeyok, so it seems to be only an issue for barry, strange
03:05:25TrueJournalsvery strange...
03:05:50midgeyare you building from linux, mac, or windows?
03:05:58TrueJournalslinux... vmware
03:06:27SoapTrueJournals: I left a comment on FS. #8 works like a charm.
03:06:51TrueJournalsI saw! Glad to hear it :-D
03:06:52perldiverwas midkay around?
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03:45:30LloreanDoes flyspray have any tools for dealing with a task that's gone "off topic" as it were?
03:47:16Soapnot my 5755 comment I hope?
03:48:58SoapPS, Llorean "... regarding _user_ of real words." ;)
03:50:29LloreanSoap: Regarding 6095
03:50:47LloreanOn which certain users feel that discussing increasing the base processor frequency is a valid topic of discussion.
03:50:59LloreanBecause perhaps people can't understand that "freezing" is different from "music skips"
03:51:30LloreanOh, and I'm accused of flaming simply for trying to explain that it needs to stay on one topic.
03:52:26LloreanPut I'm kinda tired of receiving emails letting me know that yes, running the iPod 30mhz faster does in fact allow playback and the menus to run more smoothly, when I just want to know when they get the PP5020 scaling bug fixed.
03:53:35dewdudeindeed. my ipod froze this morning..i don't know just hardcore decided to freeze.
03:53:58dewdudei would still rather put up with buggy software than what came with the unit.
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04:03:24Soapuh, I thought that task was about the 5020 scaling bug. WTF is w1ll14m doing changing the focus of the thread. w1ll14m I notice you are here, so don't think I am talking behind your back, but it seemed to take w1ll14m long enough to realize the 5th gen didn't have a 5020.
04:04:24Soapand the 5th gen 60GB has the same processor as the 30GB, NOT a 5020.
04:05:22Soapnevermind, I scroll down more through this quagmire, and see you already addressed that Llorean.
04:05:59hcsnooo, my precious thread...
04:07:11Soapnot to mention I see all sorts of bluster about longer playback times, and not a single valid battery test to back up the claims.
04:07:31LloreanSoap: The longer playback times are possibly valid for the H10 users.
04:07:39LloreanWho would still get scaling out of that patch.
04:07:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:08:08LloreanBut it doesn't boost nearly as often, so the bug just isn't be triggered, rather than being fixed (or it seems that way, since without the increased CPU speeds, it seems to still happen)
04:08:48LloreanBut even though I addressed that, people are still trying to talk about increasing the CPU speed. And unlike the forums, I can't just "split" it, and then say "This is what this task is about, stay on-topic or I'll remove your posts"
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04:11:28SoapI'd be tempted to close it, open two others, and block-paste relevant comments lump-sum into the two new tasks. Removing cruft like "I've been playing mp3s for about 1.5 hours nonstop now." in the process.
04:11:50LloreanThere's over 100 replies.
04:12:23LloreanI was tempted, just closing it and trying to fix it isn't going to force the people posting in it to have a clue about posting in the new ones.
04:13:22TrueJournalsdid a new task get opened for just boosting the frequency, instead of actually fixing the problem?
04:13:39Soap'tis a fine line between squashing a young (misguided) idea and maintaining order. But it is such a mess now.
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04:14:28LloreanTrueJournals: No. Instead they seem to feel they're in the right and continue posting there.
04:14:42TrueJournals:rolleyes: great
04:14:48TrueJournalsanyway, I gotta go... see ya
04:14:52LloreanApparently, I've just a "flamer" for saying it's off-topic
04:14:56TrueJournalsand good luck with that...
04:15:12MrB...anyoen here who can answer a quick question about WPS coding?
04:15:13 Part TrueJournals
04:16:10Soapnobody can answer an unasked question...
04:18:22MrB...i'd like to know if you can have a conditional statement inside another conditional statement
04:19:12SoapI don't know the answer to that one. I assume you tried, it didn't work, and you're curious if your syntax was correct?
04:19:27MrByeah i'll post the line
04:20:19MrB%?C<%e|99|41|121|3|FFFFFF|%?ia<%ia|%?d2<%d2|Artist Unknown>>|%e|18|41|121|3|FFFFFF|%?ia<%ia|%?d2<%d2|Artist Unknown>>>
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04:44:46JdGordonhey aliask, your not karthic on ocau are you?
04:45:10aliaskI'm aliask on ocau, but I havn't been there in over 2 or 3 years
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06:05:48hachiocau? 'ocau'はなんですか?
06:06:12*hachi chokes himself
06:06:28hachiwhat's ocau?
06:10:26JdGordonthe 2nd largest geek forum in australia... could actually be the largest now
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06:19:01hachiEHLO hachi
06:20:19hachiwhat... nobody speaks ESMTP?
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06:20:58ppeomhi all
06:21:09aliaskhey there ppeom
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06:27:56gaohow to run rockbox_ifp simulator on winndows xp ?
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06:31:35crakmnky<−−first time trying rockbox... I get an error when running ipodpatcher 3 -r bootpartition.bin
06:31:58crakmnkygoes to [INFO] Writing 80262 sectors to output file
06:32:09crakmnkythen I get: Error reading from disk: The semaphore timeout period has expired.
06:32:57crakmnkyand this: [ERR] write in disk_read: Invalid argument and this: [ERR] −−read-partition failed.
06:33:14crakmnkyanyone know what could cause this?
06:33:41crakmnkyw/ a gen 4 black and white ipod
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06:42:46crakmnkyI'll try it from osx86 :P
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07:16:35jhMikeSFlyspray's busted. Can't connect to database.
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08:11:10*Llorean beats his head on a table.
08:11:56JdGordonpoor table :p
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08:13:00bluebrotherBagder: looks like the daily manuals are still broken
08:14:12LloreanJdGordon: I'm beginning to think that decayed.cell is intentionally ignoring things I've said.
08:15:15bluebrotherbtw, it would be nice to have the build log file available somewhere. Like, put it at the same location the pdf is, and use the same name (except for the extension)
08:15:30*Llorean kills the task.
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08:20:39bluebrotherLlorean: you asked something about the manual yesterday. Sorry for ignoring you, I was quite busy with work that time
08:21:04bluebrotherso you want to build a specific version that includes only the target-specific texts?
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08:23:07Lloreanbluebrother: Well, I was looking for a way to easily printout nearly everything to read through. I've never fully sat down and read things, but I wanted to say, compare the install sections for each, etc.
08:24:46bluebrothertucoz had the idea of a stripped down version too.
08:25:14LloreanSadly, I still think best when presented with things on a piece of paper.
08:25:46bluebrotherI'm not sure if that will help that much, as the idea is to have everything important first, so impatient users can explore the usage themself without the manual
08:26:25bluebrotherbut it might be worth a try −− simply remove (locally) everything that's more information than a first start and look if people like that
08:26:37 Quit juxtap (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
08:26:50Lloreanbluebrother: Oh, I think we're talking about two different ideas.
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08:26:57bluebrotherthe manual is build using optional blocks −− the the text for all players is at the "same" place and gets replaced when building
08:27:10*bluebrother isn't fully awake yet
08:27:27bluebrotherwhich might be the reason then ;-)
08:27:52LloreanI was looking for a way to printout all the optional sections of the manual easily. Basically a "full" manual, assuming that you had one target that had *every* feature. Plus all the unique install processes.
08:28:17bluebrotherah. Sure, that's easy
08:28:22LloreanThat's what I thought
08:28:37LloreanBut I'm not familiar with Tex, so I wanted to ask if it was considered relatively easy before I went and investigated.
08:29:01bluebrothertake the files in the platform/ folder and have a look at the first lines −− those \edef\UseOption
08:29:28bluebrotherand simply add all options that are defined somewhere in one platform file, and build using that
08:29:44bluebrotherthe result might look horribly chaotic though ;-)
08:30:30bluebrotherby that you can also replace the buttons names with something else ... hmm, this might indeed be a good idea to find out where the action codes are already used
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08:35:55safetydancan I just say that invadrox rules.
08:36:01safetydanshame it's almost unusable on the h120
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08:38:56midkaysafetydan: blurring?
08:39:23safetydanmidkay, yeah, so much that you can't even see your bullets
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08:39:33decayedcell_The ATA read/write functions have ASM-optimised versions for the Coldfire and SH-1 processors. An ARM version should hopefully greatly improve disk read/write speeds. - was this done in SVN 12099
08:39:36midkayouch.. damn that slow slow slow LCD.
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08:40:03*safetydan wonders if we can add effects to the sim to more closely simulate the lcd of the target
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08:41:02safetydandecayedcell_, yes
08:44:25*decayedcell_ updates wiki
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08:47:45fidjithiho all
08:48:47GodEaterwhat did Zagor do to the reader ?!?
08:49:11fidjitjust posted a question, but just found irc
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08:49:21GodEatertrying to read today's log is impossible now
08:49:23fidjitanybody know about the battery capacity indicator ?
08:49:49Lloreanfidjit: What about it?
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08:50:20ZagorGodEater: a mistake. reload now.
08:50:24fidjitgigabeat x30, specs show it has an 830mah batt, there settings in rockbox show 1500+ cap
08:50:35fidjitshows empy after about 7 hours onscreen but is still going
08:50:46fidjithow can i make the the onscreen indicator more accurate ?
08:50:53Lloreanfidjit: That value, the one you can set, is just for Runtime Approximation. For when it tells you that you have X hours left.
08:51:08fidjitrunning battery benchtest now to see exactly i can get out of it
08:51:26LloreanThe onscreen indicator is based on the read voltage. You can't do too much regarding it, until I believe things can be calibrated by knowing how low it has to be shut down.
08:51:43decayedcell_Is anyone having issues with PluginDoom turning off the backlight when it starts a game or is it just mean
08:51:54fidjithow can i assist, is battery bench test the best way ?
08:52:16decayedcell_Battery Bench would just turn it off when it reads a certain voltage wouldn't it
08:52:21Lloreandecayedcell_: Are you using any patches?
08:52:40fidjitbut does that help "calibrate" for the gigabeat if i can provide these figures ?
08:52:44decayedcell_Llorean: yes
08:52:50Lloreanfidjit: Are you following the listed procedureds for doing a decent battery bench?
08:53:04Lloreandecayedcell_: Some patches cause Doom to work improperly.
08:53:16fidjitummm think so, start battery bench test and run flat out till it dies :-)
08:53:18decayedcell_Llorean ah okay
08:53:19ZagorGodEater: I added "tail" functionality (so you don't have to reload) and autoscroll. but I forgot to make autoscroll optional... :-) now it is.
08:53:35Lloreandecayedcell_: Please, don't ever ask "is anyone getting this problem" in here when you're getting it on a patched build and haven't yet tested it with an unpatched one.
08:53:56decayedcell_Llorean okay then
08:54:31Lloreanfidjit: Yes, but what settings do you have enabled, are you using the default theme, and what format is your playlist, etc?
08:55:05LloreanHow long it takes for the batteries to die can depend a lot on whether you're using the equalizer, whether you have headphones plugged in or not, whether you press any buttons (or light up the backlight), etc.
08:55:33fidjitahhh , i keep pressing buttons to see if it's still going :-)
08:55:36fidjitno equilizer
08:55:37fidjitheadphones in
08:55:42fidjitdirectory cache
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08:55:49fidjitdatabase cache
08:55:53fidjit3 sec backlight off
08:56:59GodEaterZagor: thank you - that's what I needed!
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08:58:07Lloreanfidjit: Continued button pressed, lighting up the backlight, will have a noticeable negative effect on it.
08:58:19LloreanYou should have headphones plugged in, and just listen at them to see if it's still going.
08:58:46fidjiti can't program so how can i help with the gigabeat port then especially in terms of battery indicator accuracy ?
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09:01:30Lloreanfidjit: File a bug report that the estimated runtime remaining is invalid, and then attach a few good battery benchmarks to it.
09:01:53LloreanInclude mention that there's not a mAH value for the default battery
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09:05:40GodEaterah - I asked someone about that last night - they said they thought the GB battery was 850mAH
09:05:44GodEaterwhich sounds awfully low to me
09:05:57amiconnbluebrother: Hmm, am I wrong in thinking that defining all options in the platform file still won't give you all alternative texts? (because of \opt and \nopt which are always mutually exclusive?)
09:05:58fidjitthat's what i says on the hardware spec on rockbox
09:06:25GodEaterI'm amazed if that's true. I'm sure I've seen someone say they've got 19 hours runtime out of it
09:06:45GodEaterI don't think we got that on the H1x0s with the stock battery, and that's a 1300mAH
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09:07:17amiconnGodEater: Irivers (both H1x0 and H300) get 20+ hours with stock battery
09:07:21amiconn...and rockbox
09:08:51GodEatermy mistake then.
09:09:16GodEaterbut that still means the GB battery life is pretty amazing with such a low mAH figure for a stock baterry
09:09:29LloreanGodEater: The vast majority of H120s have batteries old enough to only get 12-16 in Rockbox now, but a fresh one at 1300 should get ~21 hours under decent use conditions.
09:09:46GodEaterheh - that's what I was going to say
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09:10:02GodEaterthe battery in mine has been failing for so long - I'd forgotten how good it used to be
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09:11:26fidjitwell, just removed 4 screws but can't easily remove back cover :-(
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09:12:53*GodEater spots another genius trying to get Rockbox working on a 2G Nano by magic means. (i.e. just installing it and hoping it'll work)
09:13:16LloreanGodEater: I think he may be confusing the words "mini" and "nano" a bit, if it's the one I'm thinking of.
09:13:47GodEaterI just spotted that too - I asked him to clarify
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09:20:47LloreanShould there be an awful lot of warnings while making the manual?
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09:22:51*Llorean wishes people would quit spamming the 60/90 patch on other tasks.
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09:24:29markunfidjit: at least on the F series it's very easy to remove the front and back
09:24:57markunjust remove the screws on the bottom and slide the front or back up
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09:25:21fidjitmarkum, 2 screws on bottom, one in lanyard connector and one big one on the back.
09:25:38fidjiti'm not inept at taking things apart, but can't seem to easily get it off :-(
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09:25:57*GodEater is proud of his PDF Viewer thread response.
09:26:25fidjitcovers 3 sides with the buttons through the rhs
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09:27:26Lloreandecayedcell: Please, stop talking about off-topic patches on Tasks.
09:27:28 Join dune2 [0] (
09:27:29 Join petur [0] (i=d4efd6a6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
09:28:02Lloreanw1ll14m: Please, stop posting off-topic patches on unrelated tasks. You can create a new task, and then mention they're related, if you must.
09:28:03*dan_a echos Llorean's remark both at decayedcell and at w1ll14m
09:28:06decayedcellLlorean okay
09:28:24Lloreandecayedcell: I already closed 6095 because you and w1ll14m wouldn't shut up about running the CPU faster.
09:28:50Llorean140 comments of which maybe only 2/3 actually relate to the goal of stopping the freezes, and the other 1/3 are just about getting the menus smoother.
09:29:23markunfidjit: btw, we are doing some measurements right now to see how we can improve battery life
09:29:41markunIt looks like the battery scaling is doing more harm than good for example
09:29:47markuneh.. CPU scaling
09:29:58Lloreanmarkun: Wait, running at 100mhz has worse battery life than at 300?
09:29:59fidjitbattery life seem pretty good, just that the battery indicator is way off. It's been 0 for about 3-4 hours now
09:30:23decayedcellLlorean i think he means the constant switching between frequencies may actually be worse?
09:30:32fidjiti'd like some judgement as to when the battery will run out.
09:30:46markunLlorean: no, it looks like the consumption is the same at 100 and 300!
09:31:00fidjitnot that i'm complaining you understand, you've done a great job on it so far !! :-)
09:31:06Lloreandecayedcell: yes, but "better or worse" doesn't matter, only "solved" and "not solved". We know that switching is the problem. We know that switching less makes the problem LESS LIKELY to happen.
09:31:14markunbut I'm not 100% sure, dune2 will do some better tests
09:31:14LloreanBut fixing the problem is different from avoiding it.
09:31:33Lloreanmarkun: That's very strange.
09:31:45markunyes, I was surprised as well
09:31:48fidjitif i can assist in the testing any way just let me know i don't think there's many x series out there as it was only released in jap and aus i think
09:31:50Lloreandecayedcell: We can already avoid the problem all we want. There's a 100% consistently working workaround for the problem.
09:32:07LinusN"Patient: Doctor, it hurts when i pinch my arm. Doctor: Then don't do that."
09:32:08markunfidjit: ok, I'll let you know
09:32:10decayedcellso to solve the problem we need to know exactly what is causing the problem, then find a possible solution, test it, then make a diff?
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09:32:24fidjitmarkun: you can get my details from the forum i assume
09:32:45decayedcellyeah alright and this is better than avoiding the problem. Okay I understand now
09:32:56fidjitmarkun: i can't program but if i can help in any way :-)
09:33:04Lloreandecayedcell: Glad you do. I only said it twice already on the comments on task.
09:33:07dune2hey everybody, i'm getting a 0.01ohm resistor to do the measurement on the battery current
09:33:59decayedcellLlorean are you darkone out of curiosity?
09:34:07LloreanLinusN: The solution to "boosting frequently causes the iPod to freeze" was apparently "Run the CPU faster so it doesn't boost as frequently"
09:34:08Lloreandecayedcell: Yes.
09:34:52decayedcellso this all just comes back to not understanding the hardware enough
09:34:55LinusNLlorean: yes i know, hence the joke
09:35:22LloreanLinusN: Of course, we already knew that which is why there's a no-boosting build in the forums. :)
09:35:40LloreanLinusN: It does look like there is a proper working solution though, if you combine some of the work there with the Kernel_On_Cop patch, so that's hopeful.
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09:37:17decayedcellso, what exactly causes the freeze
09:37:42tucozLinusN: the issue is definitley back. It sounded like a "mistlur" for half a second when i powered on my h120 this morning
09:38:11tucozit only happens when the player has been off for some time (like overnight)
09:38:24LinusNdecayedcell: if only we knew that...
09:38:44GodEaterdecayedcell: if we knew that, we could fix it
09:39:14LinusNGodEater: you just made it to the GoldenQuotes page
09:39:33Lloreandecayedcell: We know that it's triggered when the CPU either boosts or unboosts.
09:40:08LloreanWhich suggests we either aren't changing the speed properly, or that the COP needs to be handled properly when this happens and we aren't doing that yet.
09:40:17LloreanBut only "suggests"
09:40:17decayedcellah okay so reducing the boosting is just avoiding the bug, but its really still there like you mentioned
09:40:32LloreanPretty much
09:40:59LloreanReducing the boosting just makes it less likely the bug will trigger, but doesn't guarantee it's gone, and at the same time isn't really related to the objective.
09:41:19 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:41:28tucozSlasheri: in the newest bootloader, could you investigate what you do differently compared to the old bootloader. It has something to do with resetting the uda i think.
09:41:56tucozSlasheri: speaking of the h120 here
09:42:13markunLinusN: do you know something about clock modes in the ARM by any chance?
09:42:32LinusNnope, not a thing
09:42:49LinusNwhich reminds me, i had a look at skyeye yesterday
09:43:01rp-dan_a: anything new on the freezing sansa?
09:43:03GodEaterLinusN: hahaha - glad you liked that.
09:43:09LinusNGodEater: :-)
09:43:11Slasheritucoz: the new bootloader does not initialize all hardware (including not resetting uda) when loading rockbox from ram/rom
09:43:23Slasheritucoz: however, lodaing from disk, it should work as before. Could you test that?
09:43:46LloreanLinusN: Looking at SkyEye to see if it looks like it could be used for some things?
09:43:55tucozsure, i'll do that when i boot it up tomorrow morning
09:44:30tucozSlasheri: the problem is that this only happens when the player has been off for quite a while
09:44:33LinusNyes, for reverse engineering arm code
09:45:21LloreanLinusN: Are signs hopeful?
09:45:40decayedcellSlasheri: I have heard from linuxstb that you've found the hardware registers to control the LCD on 5G iPods... is it possible to make a patch to utilise this
09:46:29LinusNwell, it looks quite competent - i don't know how hard it would be to run 2 cores, but it seems quite simple to add simulated hardware, like ata, lcd, timers etc
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09:47:27LloreanWell, that's promising at least.
09:47:55mitch04just wondeirng i was here before any up date news for anyone that knows how to get past the checksum
09:48:30LloreanWhat problem exactly are you having.
09:48:41Llorean"Getting past" the checksum is automatic if nothing goes wrong...
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09:50:23LinusNLlorean: the documentation is in chinese though...
09:50:36LloreanLinusN: That is... not ideal.
09:51:04decayedcellwell if it helps I'm chinese and I have chinese friends that could translate... if its not overly technical
09:51:06mitch04well this gie rewrote the firmware and cleaned up VERNEL32 +
09:51:18Slasheridecayedcell: in fact i didn't, it was just probably an I/O port direction register and changing its value activated internal pull-up resistors or something like that and dropped the backlight brightness a bit
09:51:20GodEaterLinusN: I just updated it to use my Wikiname - hope you don't mind.
09:51:38mitch04all he needs to do is try and get past the checksum
09:51:41decayedcellSlasheri ah okay
09:51:47mitch04and then it becomes esier
09:52:00mitch04to put for example rockbox
09:52:10mitch04this is for creative zen vision m
09:52:12Lloreanmitch04: Oh, you're not talking about the Rockbox bootloader Checksum check.
09:52:24mitch04no sorry
09:52:25LloreanYou kinda need to be specific if you're not talking about a feature of Rockbox in any way.
09:52:27 Part tucoz
09:52:50mitch04so would u know anything?
09:53:25mitch04he has made it all it just comes up failed
09:53:33markunme neither, what is VERNEL32 anyway
09:53:35mitch04k thanks tell me if anyone knows anything please
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09:54:01markunis this still about the PNG extraction?
09:54:16Lloreanmarkun: I think maybe "Kernel32" with a bad typo?
09:54:30markunLast time the port was almost done, this time someone 'rewrote the firmware' ...
09:54:34dan_arp-: Not yet - I'm going to try reverting r12000 tonight and see if that helps. Disabling writing didn't help, nor did adding extra delays in the LCD. It looks like a loop is hanging in the main thread
09:54:34Lloreanmarkun: It's apparently about getting unsigned code onto a Creative Vision M
09:55:10*petur reads something about vernel32 being a hacked kernel32
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09:56:43LloreanI had a hard time determining what was a typo, and what was intentional.
09:57:07LloreanLike "gie". Is that an abbreviation for something, or just some strange variant of "guy" I've not seen before, etc.
09:57:29*pondlife despairs about the state of
09:57:50Lloreanpondlife: It hasn't gone crazy like 6095 _yet_
09:57:56pondlifeAlmost though
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09:58:57*Llorean is tempted to create a "Llorean" tracker account, just so people will listen to him a bit more.
09:59:04pondlifeAre those IRAM mods needed just to get the COP working?
09:59:24pondlifeI suspect not, at least not on devices with no COP.
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09:59:53Lloreanpondlife: Why would you need mods to get the COP working on devices with no COP?
09:59:59decayedcellpondlife yeah sorry about that...
10:00:27pondlifeI just like to see a patch that only does one thing at a time. Call me old-fashioned... ;)
10:00:45pondlifeMakes diagnosis easier if something gets broken too.
10:01:42pondlifeLlorean: Yes, you should set up an account under that name. Is it welsh?
10:01:43decayedcellso basically, the cop patch allows the PortalPlayer targets to run at a lower speed, thus saving power? But does this still trigger the boost/unboost bug
10:02:06pondlifeThe two are independent problems.
10:02:18pondlifeThat's what's concerning me.
10:02:38Lloreanpondlife: Actually, it's just a name I made up at one point.
10:02:41pondlifeA mod to one may well make the problem go away (or become much less frequent) but that doesn't help solve it.
10:02:59pondlife(the "other" problem, I mean)
10:03:04bluebrotherLlorean: amiconn is right about the nopt thing. It came into my mind shortly after I left the computer ...
10:03:50bluebrotherbut there might be a better solution: redefine opt and nopt to show the arguments, so you'll also see which build includes the text
10:03:58Lloreanpondlife: I believe the fixes to *how* boosting happens are relevant to the Kernel_On_Cop patch since the current theory is that maybe the state of the coprocessor matters. It seems the KoC patch plus an earlier boosting fix actually seem to solve the problem, though full testing would be nice.
10:04:08Lloreanbluebrother: Thanks
10:04:26Lloreanpondlife: Well, I've created a Llorean account on flyspray just so the name's reserved now.
10:04:39pondlifeLlorean: True, but we are guessing, are we not?
10:04:44Lloreanpondlife: Indeed we are
10:04:57LloreanFortunately, the kernel_on_cop doesn't decrease the amount of boosting significantly yet, oddly enough.
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10:06:13decayedcellLlorean which boost fix is this?
10:08:36Lloreandecayedcell: Well, someone has said the one that changes the multiplier doesn't freeze with the newest kernel on cop, but it's not fully tested by any means.
10:08:50pondlifeLinusN: Don't suppose you have gained any info on the PCF50606 GPO stuff in the past 24 hours?
10:09:39Lloreanpondlife: We really *really* should be testing with working coprocessor support though, just because that's how it's meant to be using, and proper implementation of the coprocessor may already be the cause of the problem. And even if it's not, that's the final conditions under which a fix will have to work.
10:09:40LinusNpondlife: nope, was busy with Real Life(tm)
10:10:26pondlifeNo problem, just wondered. I might commit that USB charging anyway - got itchy commit fingers!
10:12:32LinusNpondlife: go ahead, provided that there is an option to turn it off
10:12:41pondlifeOf course
10:13:00pondlifeAssuming that it IS GPOOD2 that controls it.
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10:16:46hachiif you are so adept at working with small hardware systems like this in your spare time... what's your day job? (anyone)
10:17:00GodEaterLinusN: btw - did you catch up on the logs from yesterday re: your fat patch and dircache not playing nicely together ?
10:17:47LinusNfrustrating, to say the least
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10:17:53GodEaterindeed :(
10:18:17GodEaterthough I think perhaps getting another tester to check it out would be useful
10:18:42safetydanhachi, my day job is Java web development. About as far from Rockbox style stuff as you can get.
10:18:57hachisafetydan: nah, I bet porn star is further :)
10:19:01*decayedcell did someone say test xD
10:19:12safetydanwell, as far as you can get and still be in the IT industry :)
10:19:20scorchesafetydan: you poor poor soul...
10:19:48safetydanscorche, ? Java's great in the enterprise, so long as you stay far, far away from J2EE.
10:19:55hachiI'm a perl hacker... and I keep meaning to get into embedded hardware like this for fun, but there seems to be a pretty steep learning curve
10:20:14safetydanhachi, hardware programming yes. But most of Rockbox isn't at that level.
10:20:17*LinusN is an embedded software engineer
10:20:27*GodEater works in investment banking
10:20:42*JdGordo1 is a uni bum :D
10:20:47decayedcellme is a kid at high school
10:20:54safetydanLinusN, do you actually have an engineering degree?
10:20:54decayedcelloops /me
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10:20:59hachidecayedcell: your / key is missing :)
10:21:03*safetydan hasn't met too many other B. Eng (Software)
10:21:18LinusNsafetydan: no - i am self-taught
10:21:30*bluebrother is working on his diploma thesis in electronic science and wants to work as embedded engineer when finished
10:21:44*GodEater has a BSc Comp Sci (Soft Eng) but doesn't really use it much anymore
10:21:46JdGordo1safetydan: that will be me end of next year
10:22:01safetydanJdGordo1, oo, complete with IEAust membership? :)
10:22:19safetydan(not that it does much good)
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10:24:08decayedcellpondlife what does your USB charging commit do
10:24:14hachiI am... attacking the site as fast as I can to see how to compile rockbox :)
10:24:46*Jakeworld is slowly learning vmware...
10:24:56scorchehachi: SimpleGuideToCompiling
10:25:08decayedcellhachi I believe there is a SimpleCompile guide somewhere
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10:25:17*scorche coughs
10:25:29decayedceller yeah what he said... in my opinion I feel that the TWiki is a bit hard to navigate
10:25:35Jakeworldwhen i try to patch something, at times i get an endless loop asking me to skip the file... is there any way to stop this other than exiting the window?
10:25:43 Join Wiwie [0] (
10:25:56LinusNJakeworld: ctrl-c?
10:26:06Jakeworldi'll have to try it
10:26:06bluebrotherendless loop? patch asks if there are errors ...
10:26:19hachiugh, cygwin... I'll do this on my mac then
10:26:30scorchehachi: you dont have to use cygwin...
10:26:43decayedcellscorche: didn't see you say simpleguide, I have to scroll everytime someone says something on this web IRC client :p
10:26:47scorcheVMware or Colinux works just as well
10:27:08hachioh good, I have colinux, many of them
10:27:10decayedcellthere was quite a discussion on it yesterday lol
10:27:16Jakeworldawesome, thanks LinusN
10:27:24scorchehachi: search for the colinux wiki page then
10:27:25LinusNdecayedcell: no need to navigate:
10:27:43hachiman, you guys have everything
10:27:53LinusNdecayedcell: i.e click on the "index" link in the menu to the left
10:27:56bluebrotheror just type the page name in the box at the top
10:28:25LinusNhachi: no, i don't have everything. for example, i have no time :-)
10:29:16*bluebrother wants a "donate time" button for his non-existing webpage
10:29:38hachiLinusN: my job... I am the lead engineer's minion at my work
10:29:41hachiI love my job
10:29:55hachimeans I get to work on all the stuff he doesn't have time to do
10:30:19LinusNhachi: like fetch coffee, spend time with his wife etc :-)
10:30:59hachino, like... work on livejournal, perlbal, djabberd, mogilefs, and whatever else we're doing
10:31:37bluebrotherhey, we don't have a jabber server! ;)
10:32:05GodEaterhahaha - spend time with his wife - love it!
10:32:09 Part Llorean
10:32:09hachiyou want one? we have one
10:32:21bluebrotherGodEater: that would depend heavily on the wife
10:32:31LinusNbtu we did have a CS server for quite some time :-)
10:32:44GodEaterI meant I loved the concept - not that I would actually love to do it ;)
10:33:26bluebrotherI'm fine with public jabber servers for now
10:33:30decayedcellloll a CS server...?
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10:34:00bluebrotherhow about UT99?
10:34:53Jakeworldwhere exactly does an exported build get sent?
10:35:21Jakeworldfound it
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10:38:27decayedcellwow thats the first time I've seen a mass disconnect of 11 people from an IRC channel...
10:38:37hachicalled a split
10:38:45scorchenetsplit actuallyt
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10:38:53amiconnThe usual freenode netsplits...
10:38:53***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
10:38:54NJoinCaliban_ [0] (
10:38:54bluebrotherirssi even announces it as Netsplit
10:38:55rp-never been on quakenet? :)
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10:39:02*GodEater high fives scorche for being the other pedant in the channel
10:39:18*scorche winks at GodEater\
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10:39:36*decayedcell puzzles over this thing called a netsplit
10:39:49GodEaterread up on how irc works
10:39:58scorchedecayedcell: for more understanding, see wikipedia
10:40:03hachiI can chock my calling it a 'split' up to the fact that I'm an operator on a couple networks and so implicitly it's a net thing, no matter what)
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10:40:24*scorche declines hachi's cop out
10:41:44Jakeworld:( first try on a compile failed
10:41:53Jakeworldfreezing issues
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10:52:20pondlifedecayedcell: Sorry, been on the phone. The USB charging patch gives an option to enable USB charging on the Iriver H300. I didn't write it, but I like it.
10:52:49pondlifedecayedcell: It's here ->
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11:00:14Jakeworldhmm... everytime I compile a build... it freezes on the iPod
11:00:15{Abcminiuser}Hmm, just tried out the kernel_on_cop_8.patch flyspray patch on my B&W 4G
11:00:42{Abcminiuser}Seems to work, but the debug menu shows only the codec stack running on the second CPU - should this be the case?
11:00:54{Abcminiuser}I was under the impression that the main stack should also shift to the second one
11:01:11JakeworldI can't even get it to work
11:01:20Jakeworldi can't compile correctly without a freeze
11:01:37{Abcminiuser}Works fine for me, although my SVN is about 3 days old
11:01:40decayedcellJakeworld: have you updated the bootloader as well as rockbox
11:01:45{Abcminiuser}I've patched it up the wazoo :D
11:01:55Jakeworldbut i can try again
11:02:06{Abcminiuser}Any ideas as to why the main thead isn't on the COP?
11:03:20Jakeworldwhat patches are you using?
11:03:20 Quit Wiwie (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:04:33Jakeworldthe only one I've been able to patch is the cop, but I'm still working on actually getting it to load consistently..
11:05:08***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:05:16{Abcminiuser}chopper.patch, NoCPUscale.patch, ipod_piezo.patch (the hard-coded one I've modified, not the broken threaded one), kernel_on_cop_8.patch, mod.patch, shutdown.patch, spc22.patch, starfield_pulse.patch
11:05:26{Abcminiuser}Oh, and the new fixed-point NSF patch
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11:05:46Jakeworldthat's quite a number
11:05:55{Abcminiuser}Yes, yes it is :D
11:06:05Mikachuthat last one is already in svn
11:06:06n1smy monies are on the NOcpuscale thing ....
11:06:16{Abcminiuser}I'm working on making the ultimate build, since the SVN i'm using is now stable
11:06:34{Abcminiuser}The NoCPUScaling is one I made, just turns of the CPU scaling define in config-ipod4g
11:06:41Jakeworldthat's good, sometimes the SVN is a bit hit and miss sometimes with me
11:06:59n1swhat exactly is an "ultimate" build? Just include as many patches as possible?
11:07:27{Abcminiuser}As many of the decent ones :)
11:07:33{Abcminiuser}I've been through the list and added the ones I like
11:07:46*n1s shrugs
11:08:03{Abcminiuser}More codecs = good (and I quite like NSF, MOD and SSM) as well as the COP patch for speed
11:08:05GodEaterthat is, after all, the beauty of open source
11:08:21{Abcminiuser}Others are just eye-candy, games etc
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11:08:33GodEaterbut I think calling it *the* ultimate build is perhaps misguided. It may seem "ultimate" to you - but not to all ;)
11:08:56{Abcminiuser}Well, I've called it "MyRockBox" as a build
11:09:03Mikachuit won't be ultimate tomorrow
11:09:08{Abcminiuser}So it's Ultimate and definitive relative to me :D
11:09:51{Abcminiuser}Nothing interesting has been committed in the last three days, so it's still good
11:10:01LinusNn1s: there is no tetex-ucs on debian either...
11:10:09{Abcminiuser}And in any case, at least I have a stable, feature-full build I can fall back on
11:10:13LinusNi used latex-ucs and it worked fine
11:10:31{Abcminiuser}In any case, any ideas on whacking the main thread onto the COP?
11:10:40LinusNwhy would we?
11:11:08{Abcminiuser}Well, I assumed someone here would be familiar with the patch's workings...
11:11:32LinusNi mean, what would be the gain of having the main thread on the cop?
11:11:38decayedcellspc is up to revision 24 :p
11:12:00n1sLinusN: fixed
11:12:11Jakeworldhm... i still seem to be having freezing problems
11:12:34{Abcminiuser}Is the main thread responsible for the UI?
11:12:46{Abcminiuser}Bugger that then, it can stay where it is
11:13:02{Abcminiuser}Better to keep the codec thread on the COP alone to give it the full processing power
11:13:13GodEaterthat's the theory anyway
11:13:22JakeworldI suppose the scaling is messing with me
11:13:28{Abcminiuser}Theory? How so?
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11:24:27LinusNwow, skyeye has added coldfire simulation in svn :-)
11:25:24n1show long is the time-before-bug-gets-closed-'cause-the-poster-doesn't-reply ? 2 moths?
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11:25:47Mikachuright now it appears to be \infty
11:25:54LinusNn1s: it depends on how badly we want it to be closed :-)
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11:28:28BigBambiAny ideas on - was there a change in drawing code that did this? - anything that should be shown when the bitmap isn't (in a subline) - is hidden
11:28:30*jhMikeS wants B#6109 closed for good but may need to see a psychiatrist first :P
11:29:24BigBambiAlso, the main iAmp wps on H1x0 needs 2 spaces removed before %pv - at the moment volume is hidden below the play or pause pic
11:29:36BigBambimain as in main unit not rwps!
11:30:19pondlifeIs there much similarity between the X5 and the H300 internals (beyond Coldfire)?
11:30:35pondlifeThe USB support in particular?
11:31:14LinusNpondlife: same usb chip
11:31:27LinusNpcf50606 in both
11:31:34LinusNthey are very similar
11:31:48LinusNhowever, the battery charging is totally different
11:32:09pondlifeThere is now a report of some X5s which work with old USB code and some with updated USB code. Sounds a little like the H300 USB bootloader!
11:32:31pondlifeProbably not related, but it got my interest.
11:32:58pondlifeApparently this mod broke USB for someone
11:33:00LinusNpondlife: i think it has to do with threads not responding to SYS_USB_CONNECTED
11:33:23pondlifeHmm, what threads are running in the bootloader? Not many I assume.
11:33:40LinusNthe bootloader has nothing to do with usb on the x5
11:34:04pondlifeSorry I was assuming you meant the H300.
11:34:25*pondlife crawls back under his rock
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11:35:12LinusNi'll have a look at the x5 issue
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11:38:02pondlifeLinusN: in case you didn't see it.
11:43:33LinusNhmm, looks like it was better to have it self-powered
11:44:00LinusNi really wish i could work with rockbox full-time
11:47:57BigBambiI wish you could too :)
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12:07:04pondlifeHow long should it take for a new build to be triggered?
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12:15:14B4gderabout 60 seconds
12:15:29pondlifeBeen about 30 mins
12:15:36B4gdernew month today
12:15:36pondlifeShow me the Red!
12:15:41B4gderbeen a daily reboot I believe
12:16:01B4gderand I've been sloppy with the startup script
12:16:58pondlifeLucky really, I got my Oops in without any red.
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12:31:24pondlifeHmm, the build started but hasn't completed.
12:32:19pondlifeSorry B4gder, can you kick it?
12:35:59*pondlife wants to go to lunch, but not without a good build
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12:49:13amiconnBagder: Daily reboot?
12:50:59JdGordonwhy? unles your running windows 98 there is no real need
12:51:23LinusNthis server is a playground for many employees at contactor
12:51:38LinusNso we have plenty of runaway scripts eating power
12:51:49JdGordonah, ok
12:51:51LinusNso we reboot it once in a while
12:52:07B4gderreboots are good to kill off all idle processes
12:52:12pondlifePlease can someone stop the stalled build?
12:52:28LinusNit's also a way of spotting bad or missing startup scripts
12:52:29pondlifeI'm getting hungry and almost out of biscuits
12:54:01GodEaterdisaster. no biscuits.
12:54:23pondlifeWorse still, no tea!
12:54:25GodEaterI don't have any at all - so none to run out of. :(
12:54:40*pondlife sends his last biscuit to GodEater
12:54:50GodEateror possibly tack
12:54:58directhex|worki'm never almost out of biscuits
12:55:02pondlifeWait! I have one more for whoever can make the build server do a build!
12:55:02GodEatersince I'm given to unserstand the former means "roof" or somesuch
12:55:14pondlifeIn which language?
12:55:18directhex|worki either have an unopened pack or an empty pack. i'm not sure what happens in the middle, but it's over in a flash
12:55:32pondlifeAh, my swedish is worse than yours then.
12:55:49GodEaterthat's an impressive feat - I know very little :)
12:56:04GodEaterwhich is shocking really - I worked ni Stockhom for 18 months or so and picked up a tiny amount
12:56:23pondlifeMy only skills seems to be killing off build servers.
12:56:30MikachuGodEater: roof and ceiling are the same word in swedish
12:56:30pondlifeObviously not grammar!
12:56:53GodEaterMikachu: and is that word "tak" ?
12:56:58Mikachuyes :)
12:57:11GodEaterheh - I remembered something then
12:57:30pondlifeI learnt something, don't know if I'll remember it for 18 months
12:57:39GodEaterthat's a less embarassing mistake to make than the one I did with the gingerbread house one I did a couple of years ago
12:58:00*pondlife is not sure he wants to hear the full embarrassment
12:58:11GodEaterthe words for "cake" and "cock" are pretty close in swedish if you get them wrong....
12:58:24pondlifeBirthday cake anyone?
12:58:36pondlifeWhat about fairy cakes?
12:58:43scorcheGodEater: and then there is slut and bra...
12:58:56jhMikeSthese conversations sometimes :)
12:59:26scorchethey are perfectly clean words in swedish!
12:59:56pondlifeNowt wrong with them in English
13:00:09GodEaterbra = good as I recall
13:00:15GodEaternot sure I learnt "slut"
13:00:17jhMikeSno bra is better
13:00:27scorcheit depends how it is used...
13:00:30LinusNslut == end,finished
13:00:41GodEaterI also learnt that ordering a greek salad in swedish can be fraught with danger as well
13:00:50pondlifeSo the build has just slut.
13:00:55pondlifeThanks, whoever!
13:00:56LinusNGodEater: du har slut p kakor
13:00:58*scorche would like to go and work somewhere in sweden...
13:01:16GodEaterscorche - I recommend it - it was great fun
13:01:17pondlifeWhat's kakor?
13:01:31LinusNor rather, cookies
13:01:37jhMikeSyou have finished the cookies?
13:01:39scorcheGodEater: but it costs money...and who would ever hire me?
13:01:45pondlifeyour cookies
13:01:48GodEaterdepends what you do :)
13:01:58MikachuLinusN: there is a machine on the road near here that dispenses maps, it has a button and a light, both labeled in swedish and english, from top to bottom it reads "tryck push slut empty" :)
13:01:59scorchenothing terribly unique
13:02:02GodEaterStockholm is my favuorite city in Europe - I love going there
13:02:27pondlifeMaybe Devcon2007?
13:02:42GodEaterI'd go - but I'm not sure how much use I'd be
13:02:43*JdGordon would love to be in stockholm in 14 days
13:02:43scorcheGodEater: and i would have to have someone hire me first so i could get a visa
13:02:44LinusNdevcon 2007 is coming closer
13:02:55LinusN14-day devcon...
13:03:00GodEaterI like partying in Stockholm :)
13:03:01scorcheoh wow...
13:03:03bluebrotherhas devcon already a date?
13:03:07JdGordondark tranquillity concert then :'( you lucky basterds
13:03:20GodEaterCafe Opera, Blue Moon Bar, Akurrat....
13:03:29LinusNwe are discussing the dates, perhaps april or may
13:03:41*GodEater has his name on a brass plaque on the bar in the Sergel Plaza hotel
13:03:54GodEaterfor anyone interested ;)
13:03:57pondlifeDid you make the bar?
13:04:03*LinusN takes notes
13:04:06GodEaterI just propped it up a lot
13:04:10Mikachudid you make the plaque?
13:04:21GodEaterone of the hotel staff had it made
13:04:29pondlifeTo A Good Customer
13:04:35GodEaterkind of :)
13:04:51LinusNbest hotel room trashing of the year
13:04:55GodEater"To someone who appears to be a terminal alcoholic" more like
13:05:07bluebrotherI'd love to visit sweden but no time until at least may :(
13:05:09GodEateralong with six of my then colleagues
13:05:10***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:05:24bluebrotherbloody uni
13:05:30Mikachuwhy would anyone want to visit sweden? most boring country in the world if you ask me :P
13:05:32GodEaterthe plaque went on in about 1998 I think, and was still there in 2004 when I checked
13:05:35bluebrotherit's too greedy about my time
13:05:44GodEaterMikachu: its's full of hot girls ?
13:05:49*LinusN is trying to figure out how to get to Graz without spending a fortune
13:05:50JdGordonMikachu: all the melodic death metal bands come from there..
13:05:57pondlifeHmm, if you want to trash a hotel room, put coca cola in the kettle and leave it boiling with the switch taped down.
13:06:13bluebrotherMikachu: I've never been there
13:06:31*GodEater very much appreciates the swedish ladies
13:06:49preglowLinusN: by using rockbox donation money :>
13:06:50LinusNmelodic death metal - what an oxymoron
13:07:10pondlifeI hope for a melodic death.
13:07:26JdGordonmaybe so.. but its awesome :D
13:07:42LinusNpreglow: would be a shame to spend all that money on a trip
13:07:54preglowLinusN: shame, but fun
13:08:00preglowfirstclass here and back :)
13:08:14Mikachuhow much is "all that money"?
13:08:15GodEaterwaste of time intra-europe in my experience
13:08:22pondlifeAha, just spotted an old "daily build" menu on
13:08:24JdGordoncant you just drive? europe is tiny
13:08:32preglowit still takes a while
13:08:41Mikachugas is expensive
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13:09:06*Genre9mp3 spots some NWOSDM talk :)
13:09:10GodEaterand there's water in the way
13:09:22GodEaterNWOSDM ?
13:09:25bluebrothertravelling long distances is much more a problem in europe than in australia
13:09:39Genre9mp3New Wave Of Swedish Death Metal aka. melodic death metal
13:09:41JdGordon1200km to vienna... although thats by actual lat/long co-ords... its only a day and a half drive... thats nothing
13:09:58LinusNJdGordon: time is money
13:10:12GodEaterbloody students!
13:10:20directhex|workGodEater, they're filthy
13:10:22JdGordontake your laptop... then you can work while your driving :D
13:10:44bluebrotherwhen I was for a visit to australia travelling was _much_ cheaper when calculating money / distance
13:10:53GodEater"...a large crash on a German autobahn today was caused by a driver attempting to debug a core dump...."
13:10:59B4gderyeah, gprs-connected for 48 hours through europe is... not expensive
13:11:02jhMikeSJdGordon: I swear some drivers do here.
13:11:07 Quit jba (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:11:25bluebrothermake Rockbox dumping cores!
13:11:34Mikachuisn't gprs per MB usually?
13:11:45B4gderI bet, but with gsm and roaming deals...
13:11:54bluebrotherat least here it is.
13:12:02directhex|workMikachu, yeah. so demand everyone you know shortens their irc nick to save money!
13:12:24directhex|workit adds up!
13:12:29GodEater& rvrt 2 txt spch
13:12:30Mikachulets start with you
13:12:38directhex|workoh, and use lowercase. uppercase letters are heavier, so obviously cost more to send
13:13:11JdGordondamn that was hard to type :p
13:13:23bluebrotherhard to type? why?
13:13:28MikachuJdGordon: put your thumb below the space bar :)
13:13:34directhex|workdamn, the future is beautiful
13:14:00GodEaterswedes don't bother with spaces a lot
13:14:15pondlifeWe could rename some of the files too, p.c rather than the wasteful playback.c...
13:14:16 Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
13:14:17JdGordonoh, my brother rekons australia is the only country with drive-through bottle shops... please tell me he is wrong?
13:14:24GodEaterI used to work for (and excuse lack of proper swedish vowels here) : Varderpapperadministration
13:14:35GodEaterwhich appears to be at least three words rolled into one
13:14:42MikachuJdGordon: what's a drive-through bottle shop?
13:15:03GodEateroff licence ?
13:15:07MikachuGodEater: compound words don't use spaces in swedish
13:15:19GodEatervery economical of you Mikachu :)
13:15:34Mikachuit's very hard to read them when written with spaces, the meaning can change very much
13:15:44Mikachuunfortunately people seem to be doing that a lot lately
13:15:48preglowgo lack of spaces!
13:15:57jhMikeSJdGordon: bottle shop = liquor store?
13:16:01preglowmost norwegians do seem to think the spaces belong, though...
13:16:29Mikachufor example, long-haired nurse is "långhårig sjuksköterska", if you write "lång hårig sjuk sköterska", it means tall hairy sick nurse :)
13:16:31pondlifeHmm, what happened to the H100 build?
13:16:35Mikachu(oldest example in the book)
13:16:36pondlifeIt works here.
13:16:48amiconnMikachu: Hah, same problem in German
13:17:12Mikachui can imagine
13:17:42amiconnMany people put spaces where they don't belong. A related problem is the improper use of apostrophes
13:17:49pondlifebadger man
13:17:53JdGordonMikachu: dunno where the sick comes in.. but that sounds like a problem with the ambiguity of the languae, english has the same problem
13:17:54pondlifeI mean bad german
13:18:17*bluebrother remembers
13:18:30bluebrother(german page dealing with additional wrong spaces)
13:18:34MikachuJdGordon: nurse means two different things, swedish has separate words for them
13:18:35jhMikeS'tisn't apostrophe's
13:19:02Mikachui guess they're almost synonyms though
13:19:32Mikachubluebrother: there was a similar one in sweden,
13:20:03 Quit {Abcminiuser} ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby")
13:20:51pondlifeAnyone else want to commit something to get the H100 build fixed? I'm off to lunch.
13:21:00*pondlife goes to get biscuits
13:21:07MikachuJdGordon: the problem is that it isn't ambiguous, and people write it incorrectly
13:21:19JdGordonok then
13:21:38*JdGordon gives up trying to remmeber the really ambiguous english sentence which cracks him up every time
13:22:23 Quit JoeBorn (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
13:22:29GodEaterwell there's the "Eats shoots and leaves" one from the book of the same name ?
13:22:54jhMikeSHow come Abcminiuser has my "- because it's Xtra, baby" thing? I added that TMBG reference to my VisualIRC quit message way long ago.
13:23:20GodEaterit's the default in VisualIRC
13:23:26JdGordonGodEater: no its being ths same as a koala... eats roots and leafes
13:23:30jhMikeSnot the "- because it's Xtra, baby"
13:23:31JdGordondoesnt quite work typed tho :p
13:23:46GodEaterit is in mine jhMikes
13:23:57GodEaterI've not changed it from the default, and I get that in my quit message
13:24:11jhMikeSI added it manually cause it only said "User pushed the X" of course that came to mind.
13:24:31GodEaterI promise you it's the default in VisualIRC 2.0
13:25:48pondlifeHah, I wondered it that was a SEXXY reference
13:25:55jhMikeSI must be insane and thought it must have been me that put it there then.
13:26:16pondlifejhMikeS: Did you forget writing VisualIRC 2.0?
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13:26:44MikachujhMikeS: if "of course it came to mind" maybe they added it independantly
13:26:49jhMikeSpondlife: entirely possible :P The message didn't seem to be there in July when I installed it.
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13:29:29jhMikeShrm...ok I'm cracking up...too much stress...I have to check the installer image I used if I still have it.
13:33:07jhMikeSok you're all embarrassed...and concerned :P
13:36:27preglowjust don't purge our svn tree
13:36:53jhMikeSWhat I did was change "Client Exited" to "Y? Because it's extra." you all know how close to the nut house I am.
13:37:23jhMikeSpreglow: svn?
13:38:16jhMikeSok...I'm not _that_ out of it :)
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13:40:09AbcminiuserWell bugger :P
13:40:28AbcminiuserApparently the bootloader was upgraded for the COP iPod patch
13:43:11 Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
13:44:37preglowjhMikeS: who knows, you might claim it attacked you!
13:44:45JdGordonwould it be ok if i move the apps/*_menu.c files to apps/menus/ and then edit them in place?
13:45:13*jhMikeS is trying to fix a bug that noone can reproduce at will and seems to have no apparent concrete reason
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13:46:36AbcminiuserHow do you use the latest ipodpatcher to patch a rockbox boot.bin file with the extracted firmware .bin?
13:47:20JdGordondo you still have the unpatched booloader.bin?
13:47:44AbcminiuserAnd the latest ipodpatcher
13:47:50peturjhMikeS: recording glitches?
13:47:51AbcminiuserThe directions used to be in the manual
13:47:53JdGordoni guess you write it back, then patch it with the new one
13:48:01*JdGordon could be wrong tho
13:48:01jhMikeSpetur: indeed
13:48:02AbcminiuserNow it just references a pre-made .ipod bootloader
13:50:26JdGordonis there any objection to adding an option to write a "theme cfg" file from the current setting, which just saves settings needed for themes?
13:51:14peturwhat about an option that writes a cfg that only contains changed values (<-> defaults)
13:51:19linuxstbAbcminiuser: ipodpatcher modifies the firmware directly on the ipod. You should be able to upgrade the bootloader with "ipodpatcher [device] -a bootloader.ipod"
13:51:47JdGordonpetur: hrmm?
13:52:17pondlifeJdGordon: First up, is there a definition of "theme"? i.e. is it all display parameters or just some of them?
13:52:50JdGordonany setting with the F_THEME flag... we can choose which
13:52:56peturJdGordon: or maybe only store non-default values in the cfg? or maybe you do that already?
13:52:58JdGordonbut font, wps, colours, etc
13:53:15Abcminiuserlinux, yes, but I downloaded a .bin bootloader from the COP patch entry
13:53:22AbcminiuserIt only has a .bin, not a .ipod
13:53:26JdGordonpetur: checking each value against the default would slow saves down a bt wouldnt they?
13:53:31linuxstbPeople shouldn't be posting .bin files...
13:53:49peturJdGordon: chacking should be faster than the writing to disk
13:53:55peturchecking even
13:54:02JdGordonthats true
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13:54:15linuxstbYou can convert it using the scramble tool in the Rockbox source, or ask the person who uploaded it to make a .ipod version available. But binaries shouldn't really be in the patch tracker at all.
13:54:39AbcminiuserIn the talk section, someone posted the bootloader in .bin form for convenience a while ago
13:54:57 Join Arathis [0] (
13:55:09AbcminiuserI believe the fact that I haven't upgraded my bootloader is the cause for the lack of a second main thread on my iPod's COP
13:55:25AbcminiuserInterestingly however, I am seeing some benefits with only the codec thread on the COP
13:55:30linuxstbThat's a very old bootloader. When did you install Rockbox?
13:55:49linuxstbIf you install the current official bootloader, that should work fine with the COP patch.
13:55:52AbcminiuserA long time ago, but I upgraded the bootloader only a little while ago
13:56:03AbcminiuserPerhaps a month ago
13:56:20linuxstbWhich ipod do you have?
13:56:38AbcminiuserYes, I see COP benefits, but the stack debug view shows only one main thread, running on the main core - the patch talk seems to indicate there should be a second on the COP
13:56:44AbcminiuseriPod 4G B&W
13:57:27preglowlinuxstb: what's the point in running a whole kernel on the cop?
13:57:29linuxstbIf you don't see any threads on the COP, then you need to upgrade your bootloader.
13:57:44jhMikeSpetur: do you have the time indexes of those glitches in that recording? I thought I saved them but can't find them and it's hard to find in the file. I'll keep looking though.
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13:58:05linuxstbpreglow: dan_a invented it... But it means we can run multiple threads on the cop, and those threads can yield() and sleep() as normal.
13:58:14AbcminiuserI see the codec thread on the COP
13:58:19AbcminiuserNothing else
13:58:23preglowlinuxstb: do we really want that?
13:58:43peturjhMikeS: you mean more exact than those in the bugtracker?
13:59:21jhMikeSpetur: I guess I forget they were there. I can find the exact samples in the editor.
13:59:53linuxstbI thought the same as you at the start - i.e. we just want to start and stop a single thread on the cop. But if we do that, we would need a special sleep() function for the COP, and #ifdefs for threads that run on the COP on PP targets, and the main CPU on other targets.
14:00:26preglowlinuxstb: yes, that is a valid point
14:00:28linuxstbIt seems simpler and cleaner to just run a kernel.
14:00:55preglowobviously is, but it will kill a bit of performance
14:01:02AbcminiuserHmmm, and the recording screen freezes when I enter it
14:01:02preglowthen again, that might not be a problem
14:01:06*preglow curses pp for going dual core
14:01:07AbcminiuserNot that I use it, but still :P
14:01:16jhMikeSpetur: Just those five then?
14:02:27peturI haven't written the times down of the other glitched one
14:02:44peturand I don't have time to give you more details :/
14:02:59AbcminiuserAnywho, so how can I start a second kernel on the COP then?
14:03:17AbcminiuserPerhaps the lack of that is causing the recording freezes
14:05:39LloreanDoesn't recording on the PP targets break playback after anyway?
14:05:43jhMikeSpetur: Those ones don't seem to match the file I have but some list you gave did.
14:05:55linuxstbLlorean: Yes.
14:06:07AbcminiuserYes, until you restart
14:06:24LloreanSo I'd guess the fact that recording freezes with Kernel_On_Cop may as easily be an artifact of the recording patch than the kernel_on_cop patch.
14:06:36LloreanAbcminiuser: You don't have a Main thread on the COP?
14:06:43 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
14:06:53AbcminiuserDebug stacks list shows only one main thread, on core 9
14:06:57Abcminiuser*core 0
14:07:02linuxstbAbcminiuser: Have you upgraded your bootloader yet?
14:07:16AbcminiuserNo, because I can't - the posted .bin is too old apparently
14:07:28peturjhMikeS: ah you mean that short clip I gave you.... If you listen to is, it will be obvious where it skips... no
14:07:30AbcminiuserAnd I'm not entirely sure how to compile the new bootloader
14:07:30jhMikeSdo threads on different cores run preemtively?
14:07:34linuxstbI've already told you - just use an official bootloader.
14:07:48AbcminiuserSo the latest official bootloaders are COP ready?
14:07:53jhMikeSpetur: not the short one. the entire concert one...after the BRP
14:08:01AbcminiuserI thought they were incompatible with non-COP patched builds?
14:08:03linuxstb13.55.49 # <linuxstb> If you install the current official bootloader, that should work fine with the COP patch.
14:08:20AbcminiuserBugger me, sorry :$
14:08:23*petur kicks his poor memory
14:08:40LloreanAbcminiuser: Just follow the instructions in the newest version of the manual. You don't use a .bin any more.
14:09:00AbcminiuserLast upgrade I did to the bootloader use a .ipod
14:09:17AbcminiuserShortly after it was patched so that the hold switch selected the firmware on startup
14:09:27LloreanAbcminiuser: Well, you said the .bin was out of date earlier.
14:10:02AbcminiuserThat was the special COP bootloader in the COP patch entry
14:10:20peturjhMikeS: I don't find anything here on my work pc, and I won't be at my home pc for several days... sorry... what date was that recording? I could have a quick listen
14:10:26AbcminiuserHow recently was the official bootloader changed to support the COP patch?
14:12:29jhMikeSpetur: I guess the clip isn't there anymore but I do have the clip and the mono version of the whole concert. I downloaded it on 4 dec
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14:14:16LloreanAbcminiuser: The version that uses the hold switch to boot Apple *should* work with it, I though.
14:14:21peturjhMikeS: sorry, I had to wipe a lot of personal stuff here to make room... dams work (and real life) interference
14:14:36AbcminiuserWell it seems to work (and is faster) but there's definetly only one main thread
14:14:49peturjhMikeS: what are you hoping to see?
14:15:15LloreanAbcminiuser: And you're just using kernel_on_cop8 and no other patches?
14:15:28AbcminiuserActually, quite a few others
14:15:35linuxstbAbcminiuser: I'm almost certain the bootloader changes for the hold switch were made after the COP-related patches. I don't think anything else has been changed with the bootloader.
14:15:51JdGordonLlorean: your the support person... do you think it would be bad to only store settings which are different to default in the .cfg files?
14:15:52AbcminiuserI can do a DIFF against the bootloader I'm using, one moment...
14:15:53jhMikeSpetur: The timing of everything going on. Interesting that I hear an immediate "clunk-clunk" after the one double glitch I found.
14:16:13LloreanAbcminiuser: Perhaps you should actually try using JUST that patch in case some other patch you're using is breaking it.
14:16:41LloreanJdGordon: When someone chooses to write a .cfg, it *has* to include all settings.
14:17:00JdGordonit does?
14:17:03Mikachulinuxstb: i am certain, i have the blue one and cop works fine
14:17:12LloreanJdGordon: If I like equalizer off, loading my preferred settings (I use EQ on for audiobooks) should turn it off, even though EQ defaults to off.
14:17:28AbcminiuserOk, bootloaders are identical
14:17:30JdGordonok, that makes sense
14:17:50AbcminiuserLLorean: That will have to wait until tomorrow, it's late and my build computer is offline for now
14:18:04JdGordonLlorean: but saving o config.cfg should only save the changed to speed it up (hopefully)
14:18:22AbcminiuserBut I doubt any of the changes would have effected it - they were very basic ones (like turning off frequency scaling to avoid the freezes)
14:18:27LloreanJdGordon: Yeah, config.cfg can be limited, I think.
14:19:00AbcminiuserShouldn't I be seeing serious instabilities if the COP kernel really isn't running?
14:19:34LloreanAbcminiuser: And we aren't sure that it isn't, right now.
14:19:57LloreanIt's possible that it's just not reporting properly, a lot of strange things are possible when you mix patches.
14:20:49peturjhMikeS: can't help any more and running out of time here now :(
14:21:05*petur curses workload
14:21:33jhMikeSpetur: that's ok, I'll keep looking since I've got time right now.
14:21:37AbcminiuserI'm pretty sure it is; I can run the plasma plugin now without the audio knackering up
14:21:48peturjhMikeS: lucky you :/
14:21:56AbcminiuserBefore it would cause the audio to skip every second or so for a second or so
14:22:05AbcminiuserNow I see brief skips every 8 seconds or so
14:23:12AbcminiuserIf anyone can compile the COP8 patch for the ipod4g and send me the .ipod, I can check it out now
14:23:22AbcminiuserOtherwise I'll have to wait until tomorrow at the earliest
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14:26:37jhMikeSpetur: but I do have to repair a customer's table soon but it's a paint, wait, and paint some more thing.
14:27:16peturI could live with that ;)
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14:27:44AbcminiuserApparently not. Oh well, I'll give it a go tomorrow then
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14:37:21JdGordonamiconn: you ok with adding code to make config.cfg saving/loading faster at the expense of bin size? (dunno how much this adds... doubt very much)
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14:39:55webguest20Hello. I'd like to repeat my question from yesterday 17:35:23: What happens to the hidden disc sector after updating to a RB version where settings are stored in cfg files? Can the sector be removed so that there will be no tracks of RB if I delete RB specific files?
14:40:17Mikachuyou can overwrite the sector with zeroes or random bytes if you want
14:40:22B4gderwebguest20: you can whipe it as you please
14:40:25Mikachujust be sure you write to the right one
14:40:53B4gderin fact, you always could since rockbox detected if it was a good area or not
14:42:14webguest20B4gder: but how can I do this? RB doesn't write to it anymore, right? So should I use some low level disc utilities?
14:42:30linuxstbI would do something like "dd if=/dev/sda of=backup.bin count=100" to create a backup, then "dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sda seek=62 count=1" (I _think_ 62 is right)
14:43:05webguest20linuxstb: and if I have Windows?
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14:43:29linuxstbUse cygwin. Or find the equivalent Windows app to "dd".
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14:44:45webguest20linuxstb: ok, I'll try. Actually, there is a dd port for windows. Now I just have to find out the device name.
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14:49:58linuxstbwebguest20: It would probably be easier to just install cygwin.
14:50:25JdGordonjust to get dd working? no way
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14:50:49LloreanWell, there's dd for windows if you google for it.
14:50:56webguest20linuxstb: ok, I'll try it with cygwin. Another question: does '62' depend on the DAP (I have H1xx)?
14:51:08linuxstbDoes the "dd" port for windows fake the /dev/zero device?
14:51:10LloreanBut I can't imagine removing that one sector being that significant unless you're planning perjury of some sort.
14:51:35JdGordonthat sector is unused anyway isnt it? why bother erasing it?
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14:52:47linuxstbYes, seems that dd will work fine.
14:53:03amiconnlinuxstb, webguest20: The correct sector is 61 (on most hdd targets)
14:53:14webguest20JdGordon: in order to have the disc as it would be if RB was from the beginning as it is now
14:53:55linuxstbSo it would be skip=61?
14:54:18Mikachuskip or seek?
14:54:35linuxstbI'll get there in the end...
14:54:35JdGordonoh poo... damn english.lang is out of sync with server :'(
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14:56:53JdGordonpondlife: your commit added a lang in the middle of the file..... isnt that wrong?
14:57:22amiconnyES, VERY BAD...
14:57:36amiconnOops, sorry for inverted caps
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14:58:19JdGordonshould i remove his addition and move it to the bottom?
14:58:23JdGordonor is it all too late?
14:58:32webguest20Why wasn't that sector used? Is it caused by the FAT rules?
14:58:36amiconnI'd say move it to the end
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14:58:55amiconnwebguest20: No, it is caused by the partitioning
14:59:26amiconnIn the first track, just sector 0 is used (the mbr), all others are left free
14:59:45amiconnand most disks are partitioned with 63 sectors/track
15:00:08JdGordonamiconn: does its position in deustch.lang matter?
15:00:18webguest20amiconn: ah, ok. So, before-the-last sector was used?
15:00:27LinusNwebguest20: it's because a partition must start on a track boundary
15:01:30LinusNwebguest20: so there are plenty of free sectors before track 1 starts
15:02:33webguest20...err... the *last* sector in the track 0 was used, right?
15:02:56JdGordonB4gder: does the position of a lang in the non english .langs matter?
15:03:28JdGordonpondlife: back from lunch yet?
15:03:59GodEaterclearly his biscuit quest is taking longer than anticipated
15:04:12GodEaterI've been to the pub and back in the time it's taken him to try and find some
15:04:32amiconnwebguest20: No, the second last sector was used
15:04:37GodEatersank 2 pints, and won three games of pool!
15:04:51JdGordonwell done
15:04:58GodEaterthank you :)
15:05:12***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:05:30scorchewait...were the pints before or after the pool?
15:05:41GodEaterplayed five games total
15:05:55webguest20amiconn: ehmm... yes! skip 61 means 'write to the 62-nd sector'. And there are 63. So the first thought is the right one.
15:06:06scorchedid you win the games after the pints? =P
15:06:23GodEaterwell I guess I won the last one after I'd finished the pints
15:06:29webguest20amiconn: and why that? Why not the last?
15:06:32GodEaterit *was* only Shandy though - given I had a desk to come back to
15:07:02linuxstbAnyone know what size Torx screws are used in the Archos Recorder and H140?
15:07:27GodEateron the H140 at least
15:07:42GodEaterI'm waiting for my T4 screwdriver to arrive so I can replace the battery
15:07:59linuxstbWhere did you buy it from? I see various sets on ebay...
15:08:20GodEaterI have a set already - but it only went down to T6 (from Maplin) I ordered the screwdriver from.... (consults email)
15:08:42*petur hears drumroll
15:09:04scorchelinuxstb: #10 for recorder
15:09:04linuxstbSounds a reputable retailer...
15:09:14linuxstbscorche: Thanks.
15:09:28GodEaterhasn't actually arrived mind you
15:10:00scorcheactually torx go up or down in size as the number increases?
15:10:11GodEaterup in size
15:10:17GodEaterT4 is smaller than T6
15:10:18scorchethen #10 it is
15:10:45GodEaterI might nip into Maplin again later and see if they sell T4s in there
15:12:05linuxstbI'm going to upgrade my AV340's disk, and that needs a T10, so thought I might as well cover my other devices at the same time.
15:12:17linuxstbAnd yes, the recorder and AV340 look the same size.
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15:12:49scorchewell, same company
15:14:17*scorche should start looking for AV340s on ebay...
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15:14:29GodEaterI'm fairly sure the set I got from Maplin includes a T10
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15:14:37GodEaterI needed it for dismantling my Xbox
15:14:39scorcheGodEater: it is a common size
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15:17:00GodEatermaplin don't do a T4 according to their site :(
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15:17:55Mikachui think a T15 hammer will do the job too
15:18:17GodEateryes - but I'd like to put it back together afterwards without having to use glue and the power of prayer
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15:19:33*JdGordon sets alarm for 10am and goes to bed
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15:24:16*pondlife learns something new about lang files and thanks JDGordon
15:25:27GodEaterwell timed
15:25:43pondlifeLunch took too long
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15:26:17GodEaterthey must be very heavy biscuits
15:26:45ppeomwhere is old rockbox build...?
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15:29:39pondlifeppeom: ?
15:29:41ppeom2/1 build album art patch able complie ?
15:30:19pondlifeSorry, I don't understand or know anything about album art.
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15:30:24jhMikeSpetur: what do you think about my removing all that PCMREC_PARANOID stuff I put there? Doesn't seem like anyone's testing with it and to me it's just complicating the source.
15:30:48peturI admit I haven't looked at it myself
15:31:18peturis that the stuff that logs glitches?
15:32:05jhMikeSIt does a lot of extra integrity checks beyond buffer overflows but needs the #define to be enabled so a custom build
15:33:38GodEaterppeom: no official rockbox builds suppoer album art. Look in the "Unsupport builds" section of the forums.
15:33:55GodEatermy typing is just shocking today
15:34:07*GodEater reaches for Mavis Beacon
15:35:55jhMikeSpetur: it's a slight overhead but not too bad. It could possibly catch something important if actually used in a real setting and noone forgets to check the warning
15:36:17pondlifeBut too much overhead to put in normal builds?
15:36:47peturthe trouble with (stealth) recording is you can't look at the warning....
15:37:10jhMikeSI think for normal builds it's a bit too much maybe.
15:37:37jhMikeSThe warning won't go anywhere unless you stop and then restart
15:37:50pondlifeOK. I'd leave it in until you're happy that the glitches have been resolved. That is, if you think there's possible progress.
15:38:22jhMikeSYou'll just see a bitmask of all warnings that have occurred so you can check it after leaving
15:38:53jhMikeSpondlife: yeah, under that criteria it's not going anywhere :)
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15:40:10jhMikeSAll I need is one good report that rules out other stuff...or I happen to find something.
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15:43:38*Genre9mp3 wants FS #5725 in SVN
15:44:07Genre9mp3very nice game and it seems that it works for all targets
15:44:10jhMikeSThe disk is given 30s to comply so it can't be waiting in a single file call that long or else an error would occurr and recording would cease
15:44:10pondlifeHmm is it only English.lang where new strings must go at the end? What about deutsch.lang?
15:44:25Genre9mp3(maybe not for Gigabeat and Sansa)
15:44:45MikachuGenre9mp3: i never managed to finish level 2 :)
15:44:47B4gderpondlife: the english one decides the order so that's the only one with hard order rules
15:45:10Genre9mp3Mikachu: I got addicted and finished all levels (15)
15:45:39Genre9mp3Mikachu: The only drawback of the game seems to be that... needs more levels
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15:46:24Genre9mp3Mikachu: But it's very nice, well designed and not buggy so I think it worths an inclusion
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15:47:05Mikachui meant level 4
15:47:14Mikachubut other than that i agree :)
15:47:30Mikachuit seems to not clear the background properly when i start it, but maybe it's not rebuilding properly and i got an old compile
15:47:31Genre9mp3hehe... maybe I should write a PegBox Walkthrough then! :P
15:47:36jhMikeSThe fact that the skips are all exactly on chunk boundaries keeps me obsessed with that. I will increase the allotted time to about what the old allowed (11.6s or 2MB)
15:47:53pondlife doesn't seem to have a license mentioned.
15:48:07*GodEater has just been told that apparently there's a T5 size of Torx as well. "So I'm not sure the H140 *is* a T4 after all".
15:48:10peturjhMikeS: I'd like that...
15:48:21Genre9mp3Mikachu: I have to admit that I never use backdrop so I don't know about that but I guess this would be easy to fix
15:49:21Genre9mp3pondlife: AFAIU the game is based on detachedsolutions, it's not actually a port
15:49:42Mikachuaha, i finished it
15:49:45Mikachu(the level)
15:49:49jhMikeSI figure absolute minimum 10s if the drive spin reads zero and hopefully that won't just delay the inevitable.
15:50:04pondlifeOK, so no property rights issues?
15:50:17Genre9mp3I think so...
15:50:39pondlifeThe only legal-ish thing I can see is Copyright 2000-2007 Detached Solutions
15:51:01Genre9mp3We should ask midgey about that first
15:51:47*GodEater just checked the misticriver guide for battery replacement in an H140 - it's a T5 :(
15:51:55*Genre9mp3 thinks that "midgey" and "midkay" is a bit confusing
15:52:34Genre9mp3someone has to change his nick :P
15:53:08jhMikeSthey rhyme though
15:54:04amiconnjhMikeS: If drive spinup time reads zero (i.e. no measured spinup yet), you should use a safe default for calculation
15:55:00Genre9mp3Speaking of nice games another one might be FS #5535 (Chopper game) but last time I tested the game freezes the player (H300) when exiting
15:55:46jhMikeSamiconn: It sometimes reads out nonzero, then zero, then nonzero unless that's a bug. What's a safe default for most drives? I usually see ~240-250 ticks.
16:04:03amiconnHmm, it shouldn't go back to zero.... I would use 3.5s as default
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16:05:07jhMikeSamiconn: I've seen it go back and forth watching things work on the remote logf.
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16:06:48jhMikeSI could be mistaken and that was the first spin though and just never thought to make sure
16:07:13jhMikeSI'll have to confirm
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16:35:16GodEaterthis battery replacement looks like it's going to be somewhat challenging for my fat fingers
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16:39:09TravisHGodEater: Which device?
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16:50:21GodEaterTravisH: H140
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17:03:56GodEaterooh ooh - one more post to go before two hundred!!
17:05:18***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:05:19perl|workGodEater hows your gigabeat doing
17:05:40markunGodEater: in the forums?
17:06:03 Join Llorean [0] (n=Llorean@rockbox/administrator/Llorean)
17:06:10GodEatergigabeat is awesometastic
17:06:15GodEatermarkun: yep ;)
17:06:32directhex|workmy gigabeat arrives tomorrow, so if it's not fantastic, i'll be getting my bonesaw & coming after you
17:06:39GodEaterbring it buddy
17:07:10directhex|worki play violent videogames! i could snap at any moment!
17:07:34markundirecthex|work: there is no rockbox for the Gigabeat! Didn't you read the date of that post??
17:07:44markunsomewhere in april
17:08:17GodEaterwe have posts from the future? Wow!
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17:09:57GodEaterLlorean was surprisingly gentle with me there
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17:11:32LloreanGodEater: I have no problem with people using the software they like.
17:12:22LloreanI *think* there's a mistake in JdGordon's theme-saving change.
17:13:12LloreanIt looks like it saves the FM Presets file as part of the theme. Though I might be misreading it. =/
17:15:11GodEaterLlorean: I meant for not using proper english in the forums ;)
17:16:12LloreanThis stick up my rear doesn't quite go far enough for me to yell at people about nonessential things in quotes. ;)
17:16:25directhex|work"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible!"
17:16:57GodEaterah, Ralph Wiggum - thank you for so many fantastic one liners.
17:17:05GodEater"I bent my wookie!"
17:17:55*GodEater wonders what to do with an evening without the g/f at home...
17:18:23GodEaterI can hear the siren call of the pub...
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17:23:16rp-from where is __backlight_set_brightness called? i guess somewhere from the settings, but couldn't find the settings*.c
17:23:24habhi all
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17:25:05habjust a jump to notice you that recent update seems to make Rockbox highly unstable with sansa (way more unstable that a SID Debian)
17:25:59habtested with a recent cvs. Kudos for invaders clone, its very nice :)
17:26:02rp-hab: the current sansa build freezes after a few seconds, it's because of some endless loop in the main thread, dan_a said
17:26:27GodEatergiven the highly developmental status of the sansa port, I'm not in the least bit surprised
17:26:46habi know it's a highly developped target so dont mind really :)
17:27:01directhex|work"unstable" in the debian sense means "changes a lot" not "crashes a lot"
17:27:19habthanks to Rockbox, i manage to start reading C verses
17:27:31GodEatereven "testing" isn't usually too bad in debian
17:27:59habif i well remember first Ubuntu bases were from SID (?)
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17:29:05directhex|workbecause the software in there tends to be updated frequently. i.e. changes a lot
17:29:17directhex|workcoo, "Track Gain if Shuffling." there are some rather nice features in this 'ere rockbox
17:29:23GodEaterDebian stable moves slightly more slowly than a glacier
17:31:12LloreanGodEater: Well, it's been more than a year since Rockbox Stable has changed.
17:31:31GodEatertrue - and it's only available for one platform!
17:31:40LloreanNot true.
17:31:55*jhMikeS forgot where he put the call to __backlight_set_brightness
17:32:03LloreanArchos Player, Recorder, FM Recorder, Recorder V2, OndioSp, and OndioFM are either 3 or 6 platforms.
17:32:10LloreanThey're just a single architecture.
17:32:21GodEaterI think that's what I meant
17:32:24directhex|worki remember my old archos
17:32:34LloreanMy recorder is mysteriously able to charge again.
17:33:13directhex|workshaped like a brick with rubber feet, fed by AA batteries, absolutely nightmarish to navigate, and incapable of 'normal' usb mass storage due to some silly chip it used i forget the name of
17:33:22directhex|workis200 or something like that
17:34:10amiconndirecthex|work: Wrong.
17:34:16GodEaterI think my first mp3 player was the Rio600 or somesuch
17:34:17jhMikeSrp-: from backlight_set_brightness in backlight.c if your questions still relevant now
17:34:36amiconnOnly the archos player and the recorder v1 <20GB has a non-msd compliant usb bridge
17:34:57amiconnThe recorder v1 20GB, the v2/fm and the Ondios all have standards compliant bridges
17:35:46directhex|workamiconn, what did i say, specifically, that was wrong?
17:36:01*GodEater was trying to figure that out too
17:36:03rp-jhMikeS: thank you, found it already
17:39:36*jhMikeS wonders if ata_write_sectors might ever end up not yielding enough if called on a boosted thread
17:40:22amiconnata_write_sectors only yields if it has to wait for the disk to spin up
17:40:42amiconnOnce the transfer started, it happens in one go without yielding
17:41:03amiconn(up to the maximum specified in the ata standard - 256 sectors)
17:41:27 Quit hab ("CGI:IRC")
17:43:11jhMikeSamiconn: It seems to yield a lot during a flush at normal priority to where explicitly yielding there only causes more loss of ground. There's no explicit yield at all in pcmrec_flush but when boost it may be too aggressive.
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17:48:59GodEateranyone got any ideas on the latest Apple install forum post. I seem to recall someone else describing the same issue recently - but don't recall if we managed to get their computer to recognise the iPod again properly ? (I think this was posted in the mailing list somewhere?)
17:51:44GodEaterwoo - post 200
17:53:50jhMikeSIf it didn't end up yielding a fair amount the screen would freeze up till the flush was over. If it boosts the screen crawls. Overcompensating one end of this recording thing could possibly cause the observed problems from the other end.
17:54:08Genre9mp3GodEater: only 6095 left to catch up Llorean! :P
17:54:37LloreanI've actually sent over 250 PMs as well.
17:55:13Genre9mp3Llorean: hehe, its 6500+ then?
17:55:13LloreanThough about half of them are either "No, I will not give you (type) ROMs" or "No, I will not compile a build for you"
17:55:23LloreanOnly if you count PMs.
17:55:52LloreanI still haven't hit the "10% of posts" point. I think I'm always gonna be about 200 behind.
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18:02:41jhMikeSWhen it boosts priority on x5 with 88k wavpack, it goes from flood to dumping the whole buffer to disk in < 1 sec. Too drastic.
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18:59:27kkkthxquick question here guys
18:59:41kkkthxi understood that the 2nd gen nano has an encryption in the boot sector
19:00:16kkkthxthis disables ALL programs like podzilla rockbox ipodlinux etc etc, so basically this means its impossible to play video on 2nd gen nano's ?
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19:03:33kkkthxanyone ?
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19:05:19***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:05:29Mikachuindirectly yes
19:05:47kkkthxwell have to wait :(
19:05:56kkkthxon some smart cracker to crack the encryption
19:06:09Mikachuthen you have to figure out how the actual hardware works
19:06:24kkkthxomg i fucking hate this if i had bought my nano some earlier i wouldnt have this problem, sigh
19:06:31kkkthxwell the hardware isnt much different
19:06:40Mikachuactually it's completely different
19:06:42kkkthxthe firmware is encrypted on some essential parts as far as i know
19:06:51Mikachuit's not even the same cpu
19:07:14Mikachuit's essentially a completely new port
19:07:26kkkthxwell thats some bad news
19:07:42kkkthxthey havent even completely dug out the old port
19:07:50kkkthxlet alone the new 2nd gen
19:08:18kkkthxargh wish i was an extremely gifted programmer lal
19:09:37 Quit kkkthx ()
19:11:37Mikachuhaha, "lal"
19:11:57Mikachuwhen people can't even spell lol correctly...
19:12:58perl|workits the 1st time i see a misspelled "lol"
19:15:52Genre9mp3haha... weird though..."a" is "miles" away from "o"
19:16:47Mikachuit's next to it on dvorak, but i doubt he uses that
19:16:53crwli'd say it wasn't misspelled, it was just an alternative spelling :P
19:16:59crwl(i.e. i've seen that earlier)
19:18:03Mikachulaughing arbitrarily loud?
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19:26:18perl|workwhy would you want to watch videos on 1.5 inch screen again?
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19:33:51perl|work"Rockbox sounds LIKE A BAG OF SHIT, compared to Iriver FW."
19:33:56perl|worknice quotes
19:35:30rp-i have fixed the bug, that keeps the sansa freezing
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19:36:00rp-it was introduced with revision 12093 −−> settings change
19:36:51rp-bad that dan_a or barry isn't here
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19:44:50bluey-how do i see, when the database scan is completed? it always says: database is not ready
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19:46:15n1sbluey restart
19:47:48bluey-worked thx
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20:48:58hachiooof, gonna have to create yet another pcap device for colinux
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20:50:35dan_arp-: Nice work, sir! I'll get it tested+committed shortly
20:51:01rp-no problem :)
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20:51:30rp-i currently doing a brightness/backlight patch
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20:55:01*robin0800 test
20:56:32 Nick Gibbed is now known as Rick (
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21:05:22***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:07:50rp-here is the patch: FS #6608
21:08:39dan_aLet me test the first one first!
21:08:43hachimy gosh, how big is the rockbox checkout size?
21:09:01rp-dan_a: of course :)
21:09:18rp-hachi: around 120mb, it takes ages to checkout ;)
21:09:41hachiwell screw this then, I'm switching to svk
21:10:06n1smy svn checkout is about 60 megs and that's supposed to have everything twice...
21:10:46hachisvk is more diskspace efficient, and I can offline easier... whee
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21:16:15Spughmm, my h320 won't boot after i unzipped the latest SVN build
21:16:43dan_arp-: Are you in the credits file already?
21:17:19rp-dan_a: no
21:20:08*mattzz cheers to rp for fixing the sansa freeze
21:22:12rp-testing the backlight was really hard with the freeze, so i looked at it
21:23:13dan_aYour fix is committed! Now I can take a look at FS #6608
21:28:55amiconndan_a: Ah, so it was "just" the increased stack demand caused by the settings save?
21:29:14amiconnWhat about test_disk.rock?
21:29:48dan_aamiconn: Still not working properly
21:30:59dan_aI plan to write a ~300Mb file of data to the disk, where you can calculate the data at each location so that I can see if reading is working properly
21:32:21n1sWould youa guys thing that introducing a HAVE_USB_CHARGING would be a good thing?
21:32:32dan_aamiconn: I still want to rename ata-e200.c to something more appropriate - do you have any suggestions? Is flash-e200.c OK?
21:33:14amiconnn1s: I don't think we need an extra define for this
21:33:29amiconnHAVE_USB_POWER effectively means the same
21:33:42n1samiconn: ok
21:34:13amiconndan_a: The data sequence written by test_disk is predictable
21:34:25dan_aI thought it was random?
21:35:06amiconnIt's pseudo-random, as all computer-generated "randomness", and the seed is fixed
21:36:02amiconnThat's how it works: it first writes a test file using this pseudo-random sequence, then reads back and compares what it gets using the prng
21:36:12amiconn(resetting the seed beforehand of course)
21:37:24hachiwhat sort of revision numbers are we at in rockbox
21:37:44dan_aSo if I modify the plugin to write two files (resetting the seed between them), they ought to have the same contents - and a bug in the writing part of the driver will show up if they are different
21:38:57amiconnIn order to cause maximum stress, the block sizes and alignments for each block are chosen randomly (using a second prng - the standard rockbox rand() - so that mechanism doesn't interfere with sequence generation)
21:39:16linuxstbdan_a: Is the ata-e200.c driver Sansa specific or should it work on any pp5024?
21:40:23dan_alinuxstb: I think it's Sansa specific - there is a Sandisk chip which is believed to act as a flash<->SD bridge. We'll only really find out when we have another PP5024 target, though
21:40:29amiconnI am thinking about adding some logging facility to it, which would log the write block boundaries & alignments for each block, and print an "expected data/actual data" comparison if it hits a difference
21:41:15Spughmm, the SVN build makes my H300 unable to boot Rockbox, and the daily build works, but doesn't have the USB charging patch commited
21:41:29Spugmight the USB charging be the problem somehow?
21:41:30amiconndan_a: Doing what you want is rather simple: just comment the cleanup operation so that the test file isn't deleted. Then rename the file after the first run and start another
21:42:27dan_aamiconn: Thank you. I should know very soon writing is a problem then...
21:43:20rp-i wrote some debug files on the sansa and had never corrupted files, just for info
21:44:08amiconndan_a: Regarding the driver name - what about sdc-sansa.c ?
21:44:13amiconn(sdc for sd card)
21:44:37amiconnI guess this driver might also work (probably with some adjustment) for the c200
21:45:03*amiconn should probably rename ata-mmc.c to mmc-ondio.c
21:45:15dan_arp-: It's not a problem that shows up immediately - but it always shows if you run the stress test (unless my Sansa has some bad flash)
21:45:49dan_aamiconn: Or just sd-sansa.c - it doesn't actually support the SD slot yet
21:45:56amiconnThe "ata-" part was just meant for showing that this file implements the same api as the ata driver
21:46:08rp-dan_a: i will check if i can reproduces it on my sansa
21:46:33amiconnrp-: Just enable building test-disk.c, the run the fs stress test...
21:46:45rp-btw. with the current build my lcd_yuv_blit() works, no more blocking effects, but bad fps
21:47:02amiconntest-disk runs without error on all my targets (which don't include a sansa)
21:47:06dan_arp-: Thanks. You need to add test_disk.c to apps/plugins/SOURCES
21:48:28amiconndan_a: Btw, comparing data from 2 subsequent runs will only show a difference if the error is random
21:48:44amiconnIf it's consistent, both files will be identical but still wrong
21:49:10dan_aamiconn: Would two different targets produce the same file?
21:49:13amiconnYou could write a test file on another target (iirc you have at least one) and compare
21:49:28amiconnIt should even work in the sim, but I didn't try that yet
21:49:37amiconnYes, all targets should produce the same sequence
21:50:01 Quit Lear ("Chatzilla 0.9.77 [Firefox]")
21:50:23amiconn(just the Ondio stops earlier - writing a 300MB test file onto the 128MB internal flash obviously won't work ;) )
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21:51:40linuxstbCould you run the read part of the test in the sim (or another target), with the file written on the Sansa?
21:51:54amiconnHmm, running test_disk in the sim produces a "Write error"
21:52:23hachila la la, still waiting for revisions 12177 to finish downloading
21:53:10n1sbut now rev 12177 is old :-P
21:53:28*amiconn needs to check the creat() parameters
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21:54:10hachiit's okay, I'll sync again after this finishes
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21:57:28*rp- starts test_disk
21:57:44rp-FS stress test or disk speed?
21:57:49dan_aStress test
22:00:08rp-compare error
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22:00:51dan_arp-: Good - that means that my Sansa's not broken... unfortunately it means that my code is.
22:01:29rp-dan_a: but it's easier to fix your code than your sansa ;)
22:03:50*amiconn is puzzled about creat()
22:04:26amiconnGoogling tells me the second parameter is the file mode, i.e. I should use 0666
22:05:15linuxstbAccording to the manpage, it's the same as open(path, O_CREAT | O_TRUNC | O_WRONLY, mode);
22:05:20amiconn...but all other rockbox code uses creat("/filename", O_WRONLY); (??)
22:05:40linuxstbMaybe our creat isn't POSIX.
22:05:44Bagderwell, the 'mode' doesn't do anything rockbox, does it?
22:06:00amiconnBagder: No, not in rockbox itself, but in the sim it does
22:06:22amiconnHence just using 0 doesn't work in the sim
22:06:37linuxstbOur creat is: return open(pathname, O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC);
22:06:42BagderI guess the sim needs to override that value then
22:06:43linuxstbi.e. mode is ignored.
22:06:48amiconnIf I use 0666 it works, but why the heck does all other rockbox code use O_WRONLY?
22:07:06 Join hcs [0] (n=hcs@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
22:07:07amiconnO_WRONLY isn't a mode in this sense afaiu
22:07:10Bagderamiconn: probably started once and then everyone copied the first mistake
22:07:23dan_aamiconn: The files on the Sansa are different, and it looks like it is to do with the alignment - the same sequence of bytes occurs in both files, but offset by 2 bytes. There are only 10 mismatches in the 300Mb, though
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22:08:49amiconnDoes that mean the 2 files written on the same Sansa differ?
22:08:57dan_aamiconn: Yes
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22:10:09amiconnBagder: Hmm, what do you think would be better: Staying with posix and keeping the useless (for rockbox) 'mode' parameter, or deviating from posix and killing 'mode'?
22:10:19dan_aLet me compare them to the iPod...
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22:10:32Bagderamiconn: I would prefer staying posix
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22:10:44amiconnJust overriding it for the sim sounds like a worse idea than keeping it plain posix
22:11:07linuxstbShouldn't the open have a mode parameter as well if we're being posix?
22:11:16amiconnOur 'open' isn't plain paosix either
22:14:18*amiconn tends towards killing the 'mode' parameter for creat()
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22:16:29*linuxstb tends to agree - having a parameter we ignore seems like it can only cause confusion (as it has done...)
22:16:40amiconnHmm, that's confusing: says creat(file, mode) is equivalent to open(file, O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_TRUNC, mode)
22:16:55Bagderyeah, remove the arg
22:17:06amiconn..but then it defines open(file, oflag, ...)
22:17:16 Nick xiaolong is now known as maquis (n=erins@
22:17:16*amiconn wonders about the '...' part
22:17:21Bagderamiconn: yes, since mode is not required for reading
22:17:32Bagdermode is only used when the file is created
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22:18:51amiconnHmm, makes sense.
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22:29:01zylchebug, invadrox on ipod video 5g crashes rockbox completely.
22:29:14*linuxstb discovers the portalplayer website is still at (without the www.)
22:30:00 Join hcs [0] (n=hcs@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
22:31:47Bagderbut I also noticed that the product briefs are also available on the nvidia site
22:31:50dan_aHmmm... it's aligned writing which is breaking the Sansa. If I remove that, the stress test passes. That suggested to me that declaring the registers as ints instead of shorts had messed things up - but fixing that doesn't make the test pass.
22:32:36linuxstbBagder: They are? I've failed to find anything on the nvidia site.
22:32:53Bagderlemme see if I can find them again...
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22:33:57dan_aIt was in the "handheld" section, but that looks a bit broken to me
22:34:10*zylche prods the channel to see if they heard him..
22:34:24linuxstb_zylche: I'm just compiling now to test on my 5g
22:35:03linuxstb_html pages that send PDF files?
22:35:09Bagderit seems so
22:35:14amiconnBagder: Our creat() wasn't even pure posix in the sim:
22:35:39zylcheYou should see a flash of the game for a second, then it'll black out and sound will cut.
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22:36:03amiconnInstead of passing 'mode' to the OS, it translated 'mode' into additional 'oflag' flags, and then ored them with O_CREAT | O_TRUNC
22:36:16[NoobSaucitizer]is this rockbox?
22:36:25Bagderamiconn: nasty indeed
22:36:38[NoobSaucitizer]How do I stay in rockbox while charging my iPod?
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22:36:50amiconnI just started a build with the 'mode' parameter removed
22:37:00n1s[NoobSaucitizer]: hold down menu button when connecting
22:37:02linuxstb_[NoobSaucitizer]: Hold MENU as you insert the cable. (you need to start Rockbox first)
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22:39:52linuxstb_zylche: Works fine for me.
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22:40:04bluebrotherBagder, you're aware the manual didn't build today?
22:40:10 Part [NoobSaucitizer]
22:40:28*Bagder is unaware and happy ;-)
22:40:33linuxstb_Does the server have latex-ucs installed?
22:40:52BagderI doubt that
22:40:53bluebrotherthat was my first thought too
22:40:56LinusNBagder: the build server didn't have latex-ucs installed. now it has
22:41:12Bagderbluebrother: yes of course it has! ;-O
22:41:40*Bagder can't even reply the right person
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22:41:49dan_aWhy do we use SET_16BITREG(reg, val) in ata.c instead of just reg=val?
22:41:52amiconnbluebrother: Hmm, how would I install this ucs stuff?
22:42:08amiconnThere is no cygwin package for this
22:42:22bluebrotherhmm. Haven't thought about cygwin
22:42:23amiconndan_a: This is a remnant from the gmini port
22:42:27bluebrothermaybe latex-unicode?
22:42:28LinusNdan_a: it's because not all targets can use a simple assignment like that
22:42:33SpugSVN builds do not have the date in the version number, only the daily builds? or do both?
22:42:36amiconnGmini didn't have memory mapped ata i/o
22:42:47dan_aLinusN, amiconn: Thanks
22:42:53BagderSpug: both should have dates and rev number
22:43:23Spugi installed the SVN build, but the USB charging doesn't seem to work (iriver H300)
22:43:28Spugdo i need to enable it somewhere?
22:43:38Spugi'm holding REC while inserting the cable, is that correct?
22:43:49n1sthere should be asetting
22:44:14Spugaaah, yeah, thanks
22:44:16Spugfound it
22:45:28linuxstb_What is the setting for?
22:45:49LinusNlinuxstb_: enable usb charging on h300
22:46:07amiconnEnable, or just switch between 100 and 500 mA
22:46:24LinusNamiconn: don't know yet, i suspect it is switch 100/500
22:46:25Spugso if that setting is set to "No", what happens when inserting the USB cable while holding REC? nothing seems to happen (except that an icon in the status bar changes), so what's the pointing in having it set to "No"?
22:46:53n1susb hubs for example don't provide enough power
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22:47:49*linuxstb_ spots a new "Charge during USB connection" on his ipod...
22:47:53Spugaha, okay
22:47:59tucozbluebrother: while i got the virtualbox vm to work with shared folders, i can not use it as i wanted. the script files won't work as windows can not set the executable bit
22:48:11n1sAnd trying to draw too much from a low powered port will either break something or just not work :-)
22:48:27Spugi see :) thanks
22:48:50amiconntucoz: There is no point in using a *nix based vm and let the build run on shared folder.
22:49:04amiconnIf you do that, it will be as slow as building under cygwin
22:49:08tucozamiconn: you are probably right
22:49:18tucozi live and learn ;)
22:49:36amiconnThe underlying problem is that the windows filesystem is slow when dealing with lots of small files
22:49:48amiconnIt has nothing to do with cygwin being slow by itself
22:49:48Mikachufat or ntfs?
22:49:49tucozi see. is that what makes cygwin so slow?
22:49:59tucozi use ntfs
22:50:06dan_aCan anyone have a look at ata_e200.c, and see if they can spot any bugs in the 16 bit aligned section of copy_write_sectors that wouldn't go away by making sure DATA_REG was 16 bits?
22:50:28amiconntucoz: I tried that with vmware shared folders once
22:50:28tucozbut this vm is really good. i compiled rockbox for h120 in 1m3s
22:50:38tucozhehe. i see
22:51:04linuxstb_dan_a: Have you tried just using the ASM versions/
22:51:16tucozand it feels like the manual builds faster on this, compared to my linux install
22:51:37amiconnMikachu: ntfs definitely has that problem. And who would install windows on a fat partition?
22:51:53dan_alinuxstb_: Not yet. I've tried taking out the 16 bit aligned code, and that works, but I want to understand what I've done wrong - if I've done anything wrong
22:51:55amiconnA test would probably be a good idea though
22:52:24tucozamiconn: is it possible to access the vm-files from windows?
22:52:47amiconnYou mean when the vm isn't running?
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22:53:09bluebrothersorry, just got a phone call
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22:53:18tucoz_no, when the vm is running
22:53:23bluebrotheramiconn, if there is no package you can install it yourself from the source
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22:53:45amiconnbluebrother: I've read that, but the instructions aren't very detailed
22:53:45bluebrotherI'm going to look into cygwin
22:54:21bluebrothereasiest way: put the mentioned files and data/*-[01].* into the root of the manual tree
22:54:28amiconntucoz_: No, and it would be a bad idea to access it from the outside. The guest's file system wouldn't know about changes done from the outside
22:54:37pixelmaI just installed the necessary files manually and followed the install instractions - see wiki ;)
22:54:43amiconnBut you can share some paths with samba
22:54:50 Quit dune2 ("Sleep in progress ... please, wait a while during dreams syncing ...")
22:55:16tucoz_virtualbox has it's own filesharing
22:55:23pixelma(regarding unicode and cygwin)
22:56:31tucoz_so i can share files between the vm and the windows host
22:57:16TrueJournalstucoz: I'm actually trying to setup Debian on VirtualBox right now to try that out for myself... SAMBA doesn't work that well in VMWare :-\
22:57:33tucoz_TrueJournals: i am running debian in my virtualbox
22:57:41linuxstb_dan_a: The copy_write_sectors looks identical to the version in ata.c to me...
22:58:05 Join GodEater [0] (
22:58:11TrueJournalslol, I just dowloaded some net install floppy images because I was too lazy to download a CD and wanted a minimal install
22:58:13tucoz_TrueJournals: but you have to use the proprietary version to be able to share folders
22:58:21tucoz_me too
22:58:27tucoz_oh. not floppys
22:58:29GodEaterone H140 battery upgrade complete.
22:58:38GodEaterdone whilst half drunk too - so it can't be that hard
22:58:47TrueJournalstucoz: I downloaded Debian3.1r4... will that be OK?
22:58:50dan_alinuxstb_: I'm going to give amiconn's ASM version a try - but if it doesn't work I won't be too surprised
22:59:06tucoz_TrueJournals: is that testing? in that case, it will be great
22:59:13TrueJournalsI'm not quite sure :-p
22:59:21 Quit lini (Connection timed out)
22:59:34tucoz_hehe, me neither. i downloaded the testing businesscard iso
22:59:37linuxstb_dan_a: Transfers are 16 words at a time?
22:59:40amiconndan_a: Maybe we're doing something too fast or too slow? Did you try different cpu frequencies? (boosted/unboosted/default)
22:59:44 Join Abcminiuser [0] (
22:59:51TrueJournalstucoz: Oh, from I need to go to testing?
23:00:23tucoz_i do not remember. i can try to find where i downloaded mine
23:01:24amiconnI would always use the net installer (provided the machine does have network access)
23:01:33dan_alinuxstb_: Yes. amiconn: I've only tested at 75MHz so far - but it was failing when it had the lcd_update call in there too, so I'd be surprised if it was that
23:02:11 Part perl|work
23:03:53 Quit tucoz_ ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:04:37 Join tucoz_ [0] (i=50ca62ea@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:05:07 Quit CriamosAndy ("( :: NoNameScript 4.03 :: )")
23:05:09tucoz_i think 3.1r4 is some old stable debian
23:05:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:05:28 Quit rp- ("good night rockboxers")
23:06:20 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
23:06:45Zagoronly stable versions have version number in debian. so yes, 3.1 is stable.
23:07:20Zagorand you don't want to run stable unless you have a server farm or something
23:07:30TrueJournalsah, guess I'll have to get the latest version then :-p
23:08:51TrueJournalsDo you know what the kernel version is on that testing version?
23:09:16Bagder2.6.18-3 probably
23:09:58Zagoryeah, that's what my testing laptop has anyway
23:11:21*Bagder installed today on his arm9-based board
23:11:28Bagderfunny I'd have an older one at home
23:13:22TrueJournalslalala... installing debian...
23:13:53 Part tucoz_ (""good night"")
23:14:31amiconndan_a: Now the sim produces 'compare error', grr :(
23:14:51 Join jba [0] (
23:15:01 Quit jba (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:15:52*GodEater wonders if Llorean is around
23:16:17 Join elinenbe [0] (
23:16:30 Part LinusN
23:17:27 Join atsea-196 [0] (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-9bc9f940298def6e)
23:19:58 Part TrueJournals
23:20:25dan_aHmmph... ASM optimised reading/writing hangs the Sansa
23:20:47GodEaterit's not your friend this week is it ?
23:21:21*GodEater offers dan_a a consolation virtual beer
23:21:34*dan_a has one in front of him!
23:21:41GodEatera real one I hope
23:21:54amiconndan_a: Probably asking the obvious, but did you adjust the port address?
23:22:46dan_aamiconn: Yes. GodEater: Okells Mac Lir - a local wheat beer.
23:23:41 Join hiddenangel [0] (
23:23:47 Part hiddenangel
23:24:19GodEaterdan_a: never heard of it - but then I've never had the pleasure of a trip to the IoM
23:24:47GodEaterso much beer to try - so little time!
23:25:41Bagderthere's a
23:25:59 Quit efyx (Remote closed the connection) even
23:26:18Bagderperhaps I should spellcheck my nick now ;-)
23:26:49dan_aI'll write and ask if they'll make a Bagder beer
23:27:38GodEaterfree samples too please
23:28:20 Join amiconn_ [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
23:28:21*dan_a owes several developers beers at Devcon
23:28:32 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
23:28:32 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
23:29:00amiconnBagder: But no ;)
23:29:19 Quit bluebrother (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:29:50Bagderamiconn: those british people can't spell
23:30:20dan_aThey're pretty nice beers - I've had a few in my time. (/me ignores the topic)
23:31:00amiconnBlargh. The compare error in the sim seems to be a windows problem
23:31:08 Join Thundercloud__ [0] (n=thunderc@
23:31:11amiconnI need to add O_BINARY to th emix
23:32:47 Join r121 [0] (
23:33:52*amiconn wonders whether O_BINARY is plain posix
23:34:31 Quit Abcminiuser ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby")
23:34:32BagderI don't think so
23:34:41 Quit GodEater ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby")
23:35:44Bagderno O_BINARY there at least
23:36:12amiconnOk, so #ifdef WIN32 it has to be...
23:36:21 Quit r121 ("Leaving")
23:36:28Bagderor #ifdef O_BINARY ...
23:36:44Bagderstrictly speaking, other OSes use the binary concept
23:36:51Bagderbut none that our sim runs on ;-)
23:37:04 Quit elinenbe (" HydraIRC -> <- The dawn of a new IRC era")
23:38:09 Nick Everybody is now known as Everybody|away (
23:38:48amiconnBagder: Hmm, this is needed multiple times in uisimulator/common/io.c
23:39:05amiconnDo you think it would be a good idea to do this at the top:
23:39:10amiconn#ifndef O_BINARY
23:39:15amiconn#define O_BINARY 0
23:39:23Bagderyes, sounds like a good idea
23:40:49 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
23:41:11 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
23:41:18 Quit ender` (" Two hotdogs are being boiled. One Hotdog turns to the other and says: "Oh my god, we're being boiled!" The other hot dog tur)
23:42:48 Quit bkuhn ("switching networks")
23:43:36 Join bluebrother [0] (i=Q7HqEsLS@rockbox/staff/bluebrother)
23:44:00Bagder#6609 ?
23:44:04Bagder"The .m2v doesn't play"
23:44:33 Join TrueJournals [0] (
23:45:02*n1s wants to close with "Invalid" reason: no shit! (or similar rude comment :-)
23:45:08mattzzcan somebody please help me with a stupid c/pointer/array question?
23:46:39dan_amattzz: Ask the question, and we may be able to help...
23:47:47mattzzOK, thanks. I have a "char array_a[x][y]". How does a pointer to this array look like, which I want to pass to a function?
23:48:04mattzzist the pointer "char *parray"?
23:48:42Zagordepends how you intend to use it. char *parray will point to it, but you'll have to case to get to both dimensions.
23:49:27*amiconn has to bump the plugin api version...
23:49:36 Join bkuhn [0] (
23:50:12n1s"wy doesn't the biary plugin I downloaded work!1!1!!!?" :-P
23:51:13dan_aBagder: You should have just closed FS #6610 with the comment "Yes... yes, I can."
23:51:16mattzzZagor: I want to switch arrays like a double buffer. I need something like "parray=next_array" and pass parray to functions to do something with "next_array"
23:53:27hachiwhoever said rockbox takes up 60MB... I just synced against 12177 and it's 350 MB
23:54:49mattzzZagor: should I use "char **parray " as a pointer to a 2-dimensional array?
23:54:55Mikachui'm at 150MB or so
23:55:01Mikachu(without compiled objects)
23:55:47dan_ahachi: My SVN dir is 225MB, with some compiled objects in there. My git dir is 686MB, though
23:56:03hachiwait, you use git?
23:56:12hachinow I'm confused
23:56:31Zagormattzz: do you want both dimensions in yout function, or do you just want to send a simple pointer there?
23:56:32dan_aI use git locally - it means that I can have lots of different branches easily
23:56:53 Join Wiwie [0] (
23:57:14mattzzZagor: I need to modify the (global) array in my function, so I need both dimensions
23:58:22Zagorthen char** is wrong. map the memory in your head: char** means your pointer points to another pointer.
23:58:52mattzzargh, right.

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