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#rockbox log for 2007-02-16

00:00:17Nico_PBigBambi: i did't make any changes to the grayscale versions because there is no "rail" bitmap for the progressbar
00:00:30BigBambiI thought it must be something like that
00:00:51Mikachu |
00:01:06preglowforgot about command slash
00:01:06petur /\
00:01:11Mikachuheh, i made the same mistake but didn't press enter in time
00:01:15BigBambime too
00:01:18Mikachu/ / \ works
00:01:31Mikachusorry about that though :)
00:01:50Mikachuwhat are we celebrating?
00:02:00preglowmy -700 bytes for coldfire targets
00:02:28dan_aThe fact that now you can get green for optimising stuff, there have been 3 commits in the last hour to shave size!
00:02:28Bagderok, the delta column is now average
00:02:28Mikachueveryone wants their piece of the green cake
00:02:47BigBambipreglow: coldfire being the ones that really need it :)
00:02:53dionoeahum, icons in the menus are cool :)
00:03:08preglowBigBambi: oh sure, yes, the 0 minus for archoses really saved the day too
00:03:18BigBambilol, yeah
00:03:19preglowcan't help it, i'm an swcodec kinda guy
00:03:24 Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.)
00:03:30 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
00:03:33preglowjhMikeS: awake?
00:03:34 Quit midgey ()
00:03:49 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out))
00:04:25*Nico_P feels the pressure for a green commit
00:04:39Mikachuyep, that table was definitely my best idea today
00:04:54 Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
00:04:55BigBambiWatching it is almost hypnotic
00:05:07preglowamiconn has gotten his tool of the year, that's for sure
00:05:19pregloweven i want to optimise for size now :P
00:05:25midkay_hey JdGordon?
00:05:27pixelmaneat to see some optimising too today :)
00:05:39Mikachunow we just need a code style table for JdGordon ;)
00:05:40JdGordonhey midkay_
00:05:41 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (
00:05:46preglowMikachu: ahahah
00:05:55JdGordoncan you do an icon for the lcd remote please?
00:06:24midkay_oops :)
00:06:26 Nick midkay_ is now known as midkay (
00:06:42midkayJdGordon: sorry, last night you asked if i was still around - still need me?
00:06:59JdGordonthat was so i could ask aobut the icon
00:07:06amiconnAh, JdGordon :)
00:07:10Nico_Plooks like my cuesheet commit triggered some sort of optimising frenzy :p
00:07:10midkayJdGordon: which?
00:07:22amiconnJdGordon: I found 2 bugs in the new menus on the player:
00:07:53JdGordonmidkay: lcd remote for the display menus...
00:07:53LinusNamiconn: player dies when trying to spin up :-(
00:07:54amiconn(1) On entering, the "Param" icons gets activated correctly, but on leaving it doesn't get deactivated again
00:08:28midkayJdGordon: lcd remote for the display menus? huh?
00:08:33amiconn(2) The menu has a headline even though it shouldn't. The headline is too much of a waste with only 2 lines in total
00:08:36 Join Llorean [0] (n=Llorean@rockbox/administrator/Llorean)
00:08:50JdGordonmidkay: and icon for the lcd remote submenu in the display menu...
00:09:02*JdGordon was rudly woken by the phone and should stilll be asleep
00:09:04 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:09:18midkayJdGordon: haha, oh, alright..
00:09:19amiconnLinusN: Oh :( Is this on power on, or when actually sending the spinup command? Or does the disk spin up automatically?
00:09:23JdGordonamiconn: ok ta
00:09:47 Nick BjoernErik is now known as Bjoern-Erik (
00:10:04LinusNamiconn: when spinning up for buffer refill
00:10:22Nico_PBagder: maybe one (last?) thing that could be done on the size table: group columns by CPU type
00:10:51LloreanBagder: I think "It rebuffers" is about the extent of it re the other video player.
00:10:54 Quit directhex ("Leaving")
00:11:30BagderNico_P: I think I'll work on getting the order to the same as the table above
00:11:42amiconnLinusN: I thought so. I mean which step of the spinup causes it to die?
00:11:58*amiconn also wonders how it works on power up then
00:12:02JdGordonhaha aweoms...
00:12:18*JdGordon didnt even see the new table on the builds page till just now
00:12:24LinusNamiconn: i think it works on powerup because the user holds the ON button
00:12:45amiconnHmm, strange
00:13:23amiconnI wonder what's the difference between this and the ROM 5.x hardware versions
00:13:56amiconnWell, we could hold the On button electronically....
00:14:15*amiconn should check what the of does
00:14:26amiconnLinusN: What rom version is that?
00:15:31LinusNi gotta go now, cu tomorrow
00:15:51amiconnATA power is PB4, On button is PA5
00:16:29*LinusN goes to sleep
00:16:32LinusNnite all
00:16:43 Part LinusN
00:16:57*Bagder follows linus' example
00:17:44 Quit zylche (Remote closed the connection)
00:17:50 Join thegeek_ [0] (
00:19:08 Join zylche [0] (
00:19:37 Join safetydan [0] (i=cbca159f@rockbox/developer/safetydan)
00:22:53midkayJdGordon: having a bit of trouble coming up with an LCD remote icon, maybe you can just reuse the display one for now if you aren't already?
00:23:46midkayor, what do you think about just a smaller version of the display icon.. sec.
00:24:22JdGordonamiconn: ok, i think ive fixed both those bugs, do you want to test or rely on the sim?
00:24:57Lloreanmidkay: Why not cut the bit on the bottom off, and rotate the image 45 degrees?
00:25:39LloreanAnd then since it looks 4 pixels tall, add two pixels of bump on one of the ends to sorta simulate the shape of at least the current LCD remotes?
00:25:47midkayso it's a vertical box? doesn't read too well, i tried all sorts of boxes, something that looked like a remote (and a filing cabinet)... this seems like it works fine.
00:25:51LloreanDiagonal box.
00:25:53JdGordonmidkay: or, cut the bitt off the bottom, and attach what looks like a wire to the side?
00:26:57midkayLlorean: i already tried diagonal one, no good. (and yes, with a cord, even worse.)
00:27:16midkayJdGordon: then it has to get bigger or smaller or you have a huge 2 pixel cord and it's way out of proportion.
00:27:39midkayi think this is the way to go, 6x8 is a really limited space, all we can really do is indicate a smaller display.
00:30:25Lloreanmidkay: I was thinking more something like this:
00:31:11midkayto me that looks like a jaggy angled box with a pointed end :)
00:31:38 Join MonkeyTamer [0] (
00:31:51 Quit webguest18 ("CGI:IRC")
00:32:11MonkeyTamerIs it normal for the boost to be at 100% during mp3 playback on an ipod?
00:32:36midkaywhich ipod?
00:32:42 Quit ender` (" I spilled Spot Remover on my dog... Now he's gone.")
00:32:53MonkeyTamerI tested a FLAC file, which falls to less than 40%
00:32:54Lloreanmidkay: To me it's at least vaguely recognizable as an H100/H300 LCD remote. :-P
00:33:28MonkeyTamera VBR mp3 I tried however remains at 100%
00:33:28 Quit mirak (Remote closed the connection)
00:33:34midkayLlorean: haha. no offense of course. 6x8 is just too limited.. so those are our options. a semi-recognizable sorta-LCD remote, or a smaller display icon.
00:33:34 Quit thegeek (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
00:33:53Lloreanmidkay: I think the smaller LCD icon looks worse, from a 'unique recognizability' aspect.
00:34:29LloreanBut it's really just a matter of opinion, I suppose.
00:34:32midkayright, we just want something that reads well enough. i think "smaller display" works out well enough for that.
00:35:01Lloreanmidkay: Why not drop the 'monitor stand' bit of your image, and then slide the rectangle down so it's centered vertically at least?
00:35:24LloreanAnd can it be made the full width, instead of width-1?
00:35:32midkaybecause then it's just a box and not so recognizable. monitor = display.. box = .. could be just about anything.
00:35:55LloreanYou do have words next to it to give a few more clues...
00:36:06midkayhaha. may as well not have icons, though.
00:36:08MonkeyTamerhmm... same result with a cbr mp3 as well..
00:36:30Lloreanmidkay: I guarantee, if I were just looking at the icons, I wouldn't think an electrical plug went to plugins.
00:36:39midkayMonkeyTamer: ipod color is definitely about the worst-running ipod we support, i hear it's quite crashy and inefficient.
00:36:51MonkeyTameryes, unfortunately that is so
00:37:01LloreanThey don't have to match perfectly, what is most important is that the icons stand out relative to the others, and at least have *some* similarity. For LCD remote, once they've read the text once, they'll see 'an empty rectangly' as a symbol of the remote screen.
00:37:08LloreanThey're always going to have to read the text a first time.
00:37:15MonkeyTamerdoesn't really crash with koc, but it's the battery mostly
00:37:22 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat")
00:37:30LloreanMonkeyTamer: Is this 100% with the KoC? What other settings have you changed?
00:37:35midkayLlorean: this could be debated all day - icon not representing string, string not representing icon. you can tell that the plug next to plugins makes sense. a box next to lcd remote is just... plain and ambiguous.
00:37:53MonkeyTamerI haven't patched anything else, but I have been using crossfeed
00:37:54LloreanAnd a squished up monitor isn't?
00:37:56MonkeyTamerI'll play with that
00:38:17LloreanMonkeyTamer: Crossfeed uses some additional CPU. Of course, the bitrate of the MP3 also matters.
00:38:25midkayLlorean: squished up? i shrunk it so it remains the correct aspect. the term you want to use is "smaller", and yes, it's smaller, nice observation.
00:38:41Lloreanmidkay: The LCD remotes aren't the same aspect.
00:38:45MonkeyTamerI have been using 192 cbr, as well as 256 vbr
00:38:47Lloreanmidkay: At least the ones so far.
00:38:54midkaya monitor doesn't look at all like lcd remotes.
00:39:07midkayi'm portraying a monitor (with a stand), not an LCD remote with a stand.
00:39:10MonkeyTamerok, crossfeed dropped it, but it sounds terrible...
00:39:17Lloreanmidkay: Clearly, as the remotes don't have a stand.
00:39:31Lloreanmidkay: My point is, yours is just as un-representative as mine, but at least mine is a *different* image.
00:39:32midkayso what does a monitor with a stand have anything to do with the aspect of an LCD remote?
00:39:52LloreanIt stands out alongside the others more, or should.
00:40:01LloreanEven if it's boring on its own.
00:40:05midkayLlorean: it should be pretty clear a difference (2 pixels shorter, 1 pixel narrower) makes all the difference in a 6x8 icon.
00:40:25MonkeyTamerfinally got a drop; crossfeed on, koc, 85% boost
00:42:24Lloreanmidkay: Look, I just wanted to register my protest. I think that choice is a bad choice. Mine may not be good, but I don't think a smaller monitor is the right one in this case.
00:43:53midkayLlorean: i think it isn't ideal. i also think that tiny 6x8 monochrome icons are not ideal. that's something that has to be lived with, at least for now. i think the monitor gives a better indication of a display menu for a smaller screen, as opposed to a simple faceless box. neither of them are ideal.
00:44:06Soapsolid black box with a white R
00:44:39Lloreanmidkay: A very clearly rectangular box, I think, will be fairly indicative to people who actually have LCD remotes, especially after they've read the words even once.
00:44:49MonkeyTamerwow... FLAC is giving me less than 20% boost
00:45:03LloreanMonkeyTamer: FLAC is a very efficiently decoding codec.
00:45:16MonkeyTamerI didn't realize just how much so
00:45:22midkaySoap: that works in its own way too.
00:45:58midkayLlorean: you could grow accustomed to either of them. i don't think one really works better than the other.
00:46:30Lloreanmidkay: I think anyone can go accustomed to either, but having a distinctly contrasting icon helps.
00:47:00 Join Alonea [0] (
00:47:20midkayLlorean: i'm tired of this, i don't care which one gets used. it's just an icon. give JdGordon a blank rectangle.
00:47:21Aloneahey the rockbox logo does not take you to the homepage on the "patches" page
00:47:23LloreanI just don't feel that repeating the same icon, only smaller, really qualifies as a contrast. But it's not my decision, you're the one making them so it's kinda your pick.
00:47:26*JdGordon hopes to be the first to get 4 digits deltas in the new table :)
00:47:45SoapAnyone with iPod accessories you know work (or know DON'T work) with Rockbox, please add to
00:48:00linuxstbJdGordon: In what direction?
00:48:03 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
00:48:15 Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (
00:48:32JdGordonlinuxstb down :)
00:48:32Soapfour digit red might be grounds for execution.
00:49:12JdGordon4 digit red isnt that hard to do
00:49:18pixelmawell... then Nico_P was lucky that the table didn't exist while he was adding cue sheet support...
00:49:19SoapLlorean: whoa, I forgot you were Texan ;)
00:50:09Nico_Ppixelma: yes.. but it's kinda thanks to me that it was added :p
00:51:15Nico_Pah... just read the 4 digits bit :)
00:52:00 Quit Juddy (Connection timed out)
00:52:10Nico_PJdGordon: what do you intend to get 4 digits green with ?
00:52:23JdGordonconverting the display menu
00:53:43pixelmathat reminds me - safetydan: how far has the lung cleanup come? I'm mainly asking if there is something that a non-coder could do to help with it.
00:53:58pixelmaeh... lang too ;)
00:55:38 Nick _pill is now known as pill (
00:56:47|Rincewind|jdGordon: just a quick question, are you going to convert the onplay menu, too?
00:57:30JdGordonproabbly... but not yet
00:59:24|Rincewind|and the root menu patch was broken by the cue sheet commit
00:59:52JdGordonbah, ok
01:00:51|Rincewind|I was able to fix one hunk but then I gave up, because the next one would have required to understand the code
01:00:55 Join Landus [0] (
01:02:15|Rincewind|I have a suggestion for the root menu: pressing menu inside the root menu could be a short cut to enter the settings
01:03:19JdGordonno it cant :) the code wouldnt allow that to work so well iirc
01:04:05|Rincewind|that's bad, I was hoping to add this in my personal build if it doesn't get official support
01:08:32 Join midgey [0] (
01:08:37 Join charkins [0] (n=casey@pdpc/supporter/active/charkins)
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01:10:00Lloreandan_a: I'm curious which part of my statement the guy was 'Duh' ing at.
01:10:18 Quit petur ("sssssssssss---------PLOP!")
01:11:08 Quit Landus (Nick collision from services.)
01:11:08dan_aLlorean: I was, too. People are strange!
01:11:22 Join Landus [0] (
01:13:47***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:15:13 Quit wooo (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:18:02 Quit fasmaie_ ()
01:20:56 Quit entheh ("^~")
01:21:01perldiverlatest build breaks theme selection
01:21:25perldiverif you chose any theme it just resets to the old one after you try to go back from settings menu
01:21:31perldivergigabeat target
01:22:19 Quit fasmaie (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:23:10 Join dan_a_ [0] (n=dan_a@
01:23:11Lloreandan_a: Clearly this person is just eager to try random stuff...
01:24:51 Quit funky (Client Quit)
01:25:36 Quit toffe ("MegaIRC v3.27")
01:25:47perldiversettings menu takes longer to load now
01:25:55perldiverjust randomly reset now as well
01:26:00 Join fasmaie [0] (
01:26:03dan_a_Llorean: That's impressively random!
01:26:44Lloreandan_a_: Either he's reading a tutorial from someplace strange, or the descriptions in ipodpatcher were clear enough to allow him to make the exactly right wrong solution.
01:26:59*linuxstb goes to read the forums
01:27:27*dan_a_ has a Linux machine again! :D
01:28:19 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
01:29:12 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:31:38 Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:32:04 Quit Landus (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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01:35:29 Quit lee-qid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:36:17 Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:38:00 Join Gigabeater [0] (i=464e0a82@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:38:30 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (
01:38:49GigabeaterHey! Can anyone confirm if Rockbox voids the Futureshop and Toshiba Gigabeat warranties?
01:39:27LloreanGigabeater: Have you read the warranty? Generally they warranty itself makes clear what is or isn't allowed.
01:39:37GigabeaterI can't find it
01:41:55charkinsI think that's the warranty for it.
01:42:03GigabeaterThank you! Another question; How do I put music onto my mp3 player with Rockbox? just drag and drop?
01:43:01GigabeaterAnd I can easily delete rockbox and boot to my original firmware whenever I need to?
01:43:41LloreanAs long as you follow the install instructions properly
01:43:44*Domonoky updated the rbUtil patch, now it can also uninstall the bootloaders.. win binary: domonoky/"> Warning untested !
01:44:17GigabeaterThis warrenty things is kind of iffy to me right now, because I spent something like 85 dollars on a three year Futureshop warrenty and if it gets void, I'm going to be pissed.
01:44:23GigabeaterI see.
01:44:37 Quit spiorf_ ("Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)")
01:44:47LloreanGigabeater: Generally speaking warranties don't allow you to modify your hardware, and most places would consider this a warranty voiding modification.
01:45:09GigabeaterI guess I'll ask them directly.
01:45:51GigabeaterBut what should I ask? "Does dual booting with a third party software void my warrenty?"
01:46:06charkinsMy guess is you're better off not saying anything.
01:46:38charkinsIf you have a hardware problem, you should be able to restore the original software. If the disk/flash is bad, they probably won't notice it has rockbox on it.
01:47:05GigabeaterI'm thinking of lying to them near the end of my warrenty and hopefully gettign a new unit
01:47:19GigabeaterBut yes
01:47:49GigabeaterHow long do you think it will be before Rockbox hads a solid build for the Gigabeat
01:48:41linuxstbDomonoky: Did you make any changes to fix compiling in Unix? i.e. all the windows-isms in fwpatcher?
01:49:39 Quit pill ("changing servers")
01:50:05LloreanGigabeater: I'd consider the current one 'solid'. Using a vague word like that makes it unclear what you're asking.
01:50:07Domonokyi didnt made a make file for Unix..
01:50:34 Quit lostnihilist ("Leaving")
01:50:39Domonokydid you change anything for compiling in Unix ?
01:51:07GigabeaterLlorean: Sorry.. it just seems to be the least popular on the site, and seems like some of the other players have more "bug-free" software.
01:51:19LloreanLeast popular?
01:51:24Domonokybecause is use only the non windows-isms files in fwpatcher :-)
01:51:35GigabeaterI was just wondering if the Gigabeat's was comparable
01:51:38linuxstbDomonoky: Yes, basically replacing TCHAR with char and using fopen instead of the odd fopen that was there before. I assume I've broken unicode support...
01:52:00GigabeaterI had a hard time finding information on Rockbox for Gigabeat
01:52:10LloreanThat's because 99.9% of the information is just "Rockbox"
01:52:12linuxstbThat's because Rockbox is Rockbox...
01:52:33LloreanOther than what buttons to press, there's really not much specific to the gigabeat.
01:52:38 Quit BigBambi (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:52:41DomonokyAh, no i didnt change this..
01:52:47GigabeaterI thought the resolution might coem into play
01:52:56GigabeaterIt's screen is quite different than other players
01:53:03Domonokylike to share your changes with me so i can integrate it into the patch ?
01:53:29LloreanGigabeater: And what exactly would that affect, other than maybe what plugins run on it (and those are listed in the manual and PluginIndex)
01:54:17linuxstbDomonoky: My changes will probably break standalone compilation of fwpatcher though.... Forget it for now, and I'll try and find a cleaner solution after I move fwpatcher in SVN.
01:54:23GigabeaterI'm not sure; I'm just trying to be more safe than sorry.
01:54:32LloreanGigabeater: Have you read the PDF manual?
01:54:40 Join Phalangees [0] (
01:54:49linuxstbDomonoky: Did you change where rbutil reads rbutil.ini from?
01:54:53GigabeaterFor Rockbox? No, not yet.
01:54:57Phalangeeslatest svn build causes many problems on the gigabeat
01:55:16Phalangeesjust built 5 minutes ago. it keeps restarting rockbox when doing stuff in settings
01:55:40GigabeaterSo if I'm going to install, get the previous one?
01:56:09Domonokyi could also copy all functions from fwpatcher (and convert them to normal c)
01:56:12JdGordonperldiver: browse themes works fine for me
01:56:16LloreanGigabeater: If you wanted Gigabeat-specific stuff, I'd have thought the Rockbox on Gigabeat manual would be the *First* place you'd look.
01:56:25perldiverJdGordon try to go back
01:56:28perldiverfrom the settings
01:56:32perldiverafter you picked one
01:56:46GigabeaterI did look there, but to be honest it's almost too thoughough
01:56:48JdGordonyeah, just fixed that
01:57:13perldiverdoesnt reset for you JdGordon?
01:57:30JdGordonthe player or the theme?
01:57:40perldiverthe theme
01:57:46perldiverscreen goes black
01:57:50perldiverand the old theme is back
01:58:05JdGordonno, the theme loads fine here
01:58:14perldiverok ater you load it
01:58:24perldivergo back to root
01:58:28Phalangeesi've got the same problem JdGordon
01:58:43JdGordonim back in root.. still shows the new theme
01:58:59JdGordonmaybe you guys are trying to load a theme without a bg inmage and the old one had?
01:59:07perldiverhappens with any theme
01:59:12linuxstbDomonoky: That may be easier...
01:59:15 Quit dan_a_ (Remote closed the connection)
01:59:21Phalangeesit's not only the themes reseting. it restarts rockbox entirely
01:59:37perldiveryeah seems so, its a full restart
01:59:38Lloreanperldiver: He's using a newer build than you are.
01:59:38JdGordonPhalangees: ok, thats a bug i just fixed
01:59:56JdGordonwhich player is this?
02:00:03 Quit BHSPitMonkey (Remote closed the connection)
02:00:05perldiveri built around 20 min ago
02:00:12perldiveris that an even newer update?
02:00:14JdGordonsvn up and rebuild
02:00:16JdGordon2min ago
02:00:19PhalangeesJdGordon: Ok thanks. sorry for bugging you.
02:00:19perldiverok let me try
02:00:23perldiverha ok
02:00:31*JdGordon wonders why the gb doesnt show the panic screen?
02:00:39perldiverpanic screen?
02:00:46 Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:01:00GigabeaterI found my Owner's manual and it says nothing about software installation on there.. the closest thign to an infringement I found was "In no event shall TCL be liable for consequential or incidental damages including [...] modification or erasure of recorded data caused by use"
02:01:04JdGordonon the ipods and iriver, this crash shows a screen saying what the illegal instrcution was
02:01:25pixelmaon the Archos too ;)
02:01:40linuxstbMaybe it isn't implemented on the gigabeat yet.
02:01:59LloreanUsers have a tendency to think the screen is telling *them* to panic.
02:02:02amiconnJdGordon: I guess the bug caused a call to address zero, which doesn't necessarily mean there will be an illegal instruction exception
02:02:04perldivernice feature to have
02:02:06Phalangeesjust to let you guys now... rockbox is the most amazing thing ever. thanks very much.
02:02:06 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (
02:02:17amiconnMaybe there's something valid at address zero on gigabeat
02:02:24JdGordoncould be... anyway, the bug was easy to fix
02:02:34JdGordonforgot to actually assign a alue to the function * :p
02:02:36amiconnSome reset sequence, for instance
02:02:56amiconnJdGordon: Is an alue related to a enu? ;)
02:03:15JdGordonhehe yes
02:03:27GigabeaterIf I install Rockbox and delete it later, will the company know if I installed it or not
02:03:31*amiconn knows that keyboards sometimes don't want to behave
02:03:32 Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
02:03:40PhalangeesGigabeater: no
02:03:46JdGordontupid eyboard s issing he irts ey ff verey ord ype
02:03:48LloreanGigabeater: Probably not, but lying to them about it could be considered fraud.
02:04:02PhalangeesGigabeater: just make sure you keep a back - up of your original files
02:04:11GigabeaterBut if they don't ask me, I wouldnt be lying
02:04:12 Join pill [0] (
02:04:36Phalangeesi've taken apart my gigabeat so many times there's no way any place would touch it. :)
02:04:41GigabeaterOkay.. I guess I'll install it.
02:04:58LloreanGigabeater: You did already admit that you were going to attempt to defraud them once your warranty was nearing expiry.
02:05:09PhalangeesGigabeater: if you need help specific to the gigabeat you could stop by #gigabeat
02:05:10GigabeaterI know.. xd
02:05:25LloreanPhalangees: Nothing rockbox-related should be discussed in there though.
02:05:41GigabeaterI'll stay here
02:05:44GigabeaterI'm getting good help
02:05:47PhalangeesLlorean: oh. ok. :(
02:06:04GigabeaterSo what build should I get.. the latest one?
02:06:06LloreanPhalangees: Are they ignoring that again? This is supposed to be the official support channel.
02:06:09LloreanGigabeater: Yes.
02:06:31Phalangeeswell some just hang out in there. usually it's about gigabeat stuff and not rockbox
02:06:41LloreanPhalangees: The thing is, 99.9% of support questions aren't related to target-specific issues, and those of us who try to support multiple targets can't learn things about single targets by listening if you guys try to fork support locations.
02:07:08perldiverLlorean we send them all here
02:07:09PhalangeesLlorean: i'm sorry i didn't know.
02:07:14Lloreanperldiver: THanks.
02:07:28Phalangeesi'm just gonna go
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02:07:56perldivermarkun and me watch the rockbox discussion in there
02:08:10perldiverits mostly gigabeat hardware now
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02:08:31Lloreanperldiver: It's just very hard to discourage the view of "Rockbox on Gigabeat" being different from just "Rockbox" when people look elsewhere for support. :)
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02:12:39GigabeaterSorry guys!
02:12:47GigabeaterMy internet crapped out
02:14:05GigabeaterSo.. how exactly do I download the build? Do I click on the green 0 below my player?
02:14:59perldiverGigabeater id start with reading the gigabeat wiki page and manual
02:15:06perldiverlet me link you
02:15:16MikachuGigabeater: what's hard to understand about "below the table"?
02:15:16Gigabeaterokie dokie
02:15:37GigabeaterI'm dumb
02:15:52perldiverthats all the info you need to know to start
02:16:06Gigabeaterthank you
02:16:19GigabeaterI'll be back later with some more questions I'm sure.
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02:24:49*linuxstb commits Chopper and prays for a warning/error-free build table.
02:26:00perldiverlinuxstb is there a screen orientation option in chopper?
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02:26:22linuxstbperldiver: No.
02:27:20perldivermight be less fun in portrait mode on gigabeat
02:27:30linuxstbThen you know what to do :)
02:27:41safetydanlinuxstb, was that with or without menus?
02:27:42pixelmanice that it works on all targets now :)
02:27:52linuxstbsafetydan: With Rockbox menus.
02:28:15linuxstbpixelma: It's very difficult on the Archos devices though - I didn't adjust the size of the helicopter :)
02:28:24linuxstbBut playable.
02:28:29safetydanI had a lot problems with that crashing after entering and exiting the menu a few times.
02:28:37linuxstbYes, I fixed that.
02:28:55safetydanah, good
02:28:55pixelmawhat will "right" do on Ondio?
02:28:58linuxstbIt was simply returning from the switch() without calling menu_quit.
02:29:33linuxstbThere is a single control in chopper - "thrust". It moves your helicopter up.
02:30:02Lloreanlinuxstb: How do you feel about the 'Conway's Game of Life' plugin? (Though I think it's still considered 'unfinished' by the author, not sure)
02:30:14pixelmawhy not "up" then - and "off" for quit (IIUC)
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02:31:17linuxstbI only chose RIGHT because (from looking at the keymaps) it seemed to be the "do something" key on the Ondio. But it's easily changed.
02:32:03linuxstbThe code allows an alternative key to be used as well. On the irivers, it's either NAVI or UP.
02:32:28Soapmake him give us state loading and saving before it gets commited! ;) (Life)
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02:33:00jacksont123any word on the progress of the mpegplayer?
02:33:11xbansheexDoes rockbox work on 5.5gen 80g iPods? It's not listed on the website, has anyone tried it?
02:33:48Soapxbansheex: it does not work at this time - it is being worked on - the problem is known - no ETA
02:33:57LloreanSoap: That's about how I feel, state loading and saving, and maybe the option to load mono.bmps as a state?
02:34:14SoapLlorean: I was thinking text files, but .bmp would be tight.
02:34:24xbansheexSo, it won't work if I load the 60gig version onto it?
02:34:29Soapxbansheex: no
02:34:41LloreanWell, it could have its own format, associated as a viewer, but mono.bmps would allow anyone to easily prep a state (use with the "Open With" command, I assume)
02:35:00Soapthere is a reason the front page says that the 80 GB is not supported - if it was as simple as using another build, we would advertise that.
02:35:19SoapLlorean: you are right, and it would make for fun exports.
02:35:39Soapthough, hell, while at it, make it export animated .gifs of the run.
02:36:12pixelmalinuxstb: sure, keymap changes are one of the few things I could do myself... btw. about the different difficulty: I find brickmania for example to be much harder on my Ondio too ;)
02:36:24LloreanSoap: Mono bmp is a good bit easier to use. ;)
02:36:49Lloreanpixelma: I don't think brickmania properly adjusts the ball speed for scale changes.
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02:36:59SoapI had never thought about bitmaps. Everytime I've written one I used text files. Life is about the limit of my coding skills.
02:37:30linuxstbSo what happens to the Rockbox logo in Life?
02:37:46Lloreanlinuxstb: Don't know yet, it doesn't yet support mono bitmap loading. :)
02:37:54LloreanBut that's what inspired the thought that mono.bmp would be a good file format.
02:38:35linuxstbjacksont123: No progress.
02:38:41LloreanIt'd be somewhat irritating to edit life templates on the device, but making it easy to import from PC (and as well from Rockpaint if it has/gains a mono export option) would mean the plugin itself wouldn't need an editor.
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02:41:14*linuxstb sees a green build table and goes to bed
02:42:14pixelmaas green as it gets these days...
02:42:33linuxstb:( At least my commit had a zero delta
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02:43:37pixelmayes (and maybe gives me a reason to upgrade) :)
02:44:17pixelmaor rather update
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02:45:24kopfhi, i just installed rockbox on my ipod 4th gen and it's literally the best thing EVER.
02:45:36JdGordonpixelma: any idea how much room is in the ondioSP rombox before its full?
02:45:43kopfi'm just wondering, is there any way of it to pick up on RATING tags in IDv2?
02:46:28pixelmaJdGordon: no - no idea.
02:47:09pixelmaWhy? Do you want to add something? ;)
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02:51:02JdGordonpixelma: no, just curious
02:53:33webguest60does any one know when rockbox 3.1 is coming out?
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02:54:05JdGordonmay 1st... :p
02:54:15safetydanwebguest60, there are no planned official releases
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02:55:06pixelmasafetydan: anything I could do as a non-coder to help with the lang patch?
02:55:54*Llorean wonders if the webguest knew that 3.0 wasn't out either.
02:56:32pixelmaJdGordon: I just tried it still has room for the backlight mod which was broken for my FM for a while now
02:57:34JdGordona-b mode?
02:58:08JdGordonunless im confused? a-b mode isnt enabled on the ondios to keep the size down right? but it does work
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02:58:45pixelmano - without that. Also IIRC it didn't work correctly when I tried
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02:59:17pixelmathough I don't remember what was wtong
02:59:45JdGordonwasnt the only problem having no buttons? and with changes done a while ago it could be enabled for ondio?
03:00:38pixelmayou gave me a version to try - which worked in a way but something was wrong there...
03:01:13JdGordonah ok
03:01:19safetydanpixelma, lots. There's not much programming actually involved with that patch. Just figure out what strings in the lang file aren't used by certain features and update the lang file accordingly
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03:06:06pixelmaJdGordon: check at 16:04. (IIRC the double-click should reset it or something)
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03:07:36pixelmasafetydan: thanks, that's what I've hoped. I'll probably look into it tomorrow and see what I can do :)
03:08:37JdGordonpixelma: ah ok... do we want it fixed? or just leave it
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03:12:54pixelmahmm... I'd say it would be better fixed and I'd like to be able to use it one day...
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03:23:18peekayHi, I have a question about the video software on rockbox. I downloaded Ocean's Twelve off limewire in mpg format and transfered it to my rockboxed ipod, but when I try to play it, it says buffering and then it takes me back to the folder where the video is located.
03:24:32JdGordonmpegplayer is very early in development
03:24:35JdGordoni.e it sucks atm
03:24:47JdGordonit doesnt do any rebuffering...
03:24:59pixelmaJdGordon: and I meant a backlight modded Ondio :) stock Ondios don't have a backlight so they don't need the extra code for backlight settings...
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03:25:34JdGordonpixelma: ah :)
03:26:10pixelmapeekay: did you read ?
03:26:33peekayGordon, I just finished converting the movie to mp4, but when I tried to play it, it showed as an audio file.
03:27:58midgeywe dont use mpeg-4 for video
03:28:00safetydanpeekay, the video player only supports mpeg1 video
03:28:13midgeyand mpeg 2 iirc
03:28:15safetydanand mpeg-2
03:28:43peekaythey support audio?
03:28:59midgeycheck the link pixelma send, it explains all this
03:29:13midgeybut yes, audio works, but is not synced to the video
03:30:36peekayokay thanks
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03:36:17blacknessIf i'm installing rockbox on a second ipod that is a different model will the backing up overwrite the first back up I did?
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03:41:36Soapyou could just rename your 1st bootloader.bin to bootloader.myotheripod.bin.
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03:42:02blacknessnice I just found out where the file is
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03:50:07perldiverchopper doesnt clean the backdrop on gigabeat
03:53:05peekayhey, can i put other games on here besides doom? like will other wad files work?
03:53:58Soapsome will
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05:07:44MrPockets_anyone here
05:08:04Mouser_XI am.
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05:08:15Mouser_XWell then.
05:10:01JerryLangeaparently he couldnt wait two mins.
05:10:21Mouser_XSo it would seem.
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08:05:24amiconnJdGordon: The menu fixes do work on the player :)
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08:07:33amiconnJdGordon: Are there plans to make the menu headlines optional, like the 'Show path' option for the browser?
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08:09:32midkayit doesn't obey that setting? i expected it to, i think it should.
08:09:40GigabeaterHey again
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08:10:13GigabeaterSo I just deleted all the music off of my gigabeat in preperation for Rockbox.
08:10:34amiconnmidkay: No it doesn't. Headlines are permanently enabled for menus now (except on the player, where it's the opposite)
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08:10:40GigabeaterI'm left with a folder called WORLD_HERITAGE
08:10:48GigabeaterIt's 6.3MB
08:11:01GigabeaterBut there is 23MB used space on my player
08:11:07GigabeaterHow do I see the hidden files?
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08:14:36GigabeaterHey anyone here wanna help me out with a Gigabeat install?
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08:16:14JerryLangeGigabeater: have you read the wiki?
08:16:22GigabeaterI did]
08:16:32GigabeaterBut I don't know how to browse the hidden files
08:17:27JerryLangedid you search the forums?
08:17:52GigabeaterI figured this would be quicker
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08:17:59GigabeaterAnd more helpful
08:18:45Mouser_XGigabeater: Are you browsing your Gigabeat from your PC, or the device itself?
08:18:54JerryLangeare the forums slow or is it just me?
08:18:58GigabeaterThere's one folder.
08:19:32GigabeaterAnd inside that is a lot of files that are just named with numbers
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08:20:02amiconnI don't know the gigabeat, but you shouldn't need to delete your music before installing rockbox, on any target.
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08:20:14Mouser_XAlso, are you browsing it as a HDD, or through some other software?
08:20:16Mouser_XMeaning, are you connected through the cradle, or are you on a straight USB connection?
08:20:28Mouser_X(Yes, I saw you mention that folder earlier.)
08:20:29GigabeaterI was told it wouldnt be playable because of the encrypted file-type
08:20:32scorcheamiconn: rockbox cant read the sid files
08:20:33*midkay sighs in realizing that he didn't fix the problem with his fix-commit...
08:20:37Lloreanscorche: SAT
08:20:40GigabeaterSo I deleted it rather than back it up and convert it
08:21:33GigabeaterI am connected through the cradle, but in the HDD
08:21:33Mouser_XSAT is the format that the Gigabeat OF turns files into.
08:21:48amiconnUrgh. Some sort of drm I suppose?
08:22:04GigabeaterGIGABEAT (I:)
08:22:13Mouser_XGigabeater: Try accessing it as a HDD through the USB, without the cradle.
08:22:20amiconnThen the gigabeat needs rockbox more than other targets imho
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08:22:49Mouser_XI've never seen the OF...
08:23:06amiconnImho that means Gigabeat OF == crippled by design
08:23:06Mouser_XWell, excluding for about 30 seconds, while I installed Rockbox.
08:23:13SurgerCan someone recommend the best flash based player with good recording capabilities that rockbox runs on?
08:23:41GigabeaterI bypassed the cradle
08:23:46GigabeaterIt's the exact same
08:23:58LloreanSurger: Right now there's really only one flashed based player that Rockbox is on and works decently.
08:23:59Mouser_XSo, no GBSYSTEM folder?
08:24:06Mouser_X^ @ Gigabeater
08:24:11amiconnSurger: There are currently only 2 flash based players which are supported by rockbox: the ipod nano (1st gen only) and the archos Ondio series
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08:24:27Mouser_XGigabeater: GBSYSTEM is a required folder, even for Rockbox.
08:24:30amiconnA third one is worked on, but it's not ready for use by non-devs yet
08:24:36Surgeramiconn: Ok - I can't even locate the Archos Ondio in my country. :(
08:24:43GigabeaterI got it
08:24:45GigabeaterIt's hidden
08:24:48GigabeaterBut it's there
08:25:12Mouser_XAh. Well, if you don't see anything but the DEMO folder, and GBSYSTEM, then I have nothing else to add.
08:25:19Mouser_XThat's what mine had on it, when I got it.
08:25:21amiconnMno, there's another one which already came a bit further, but also no sound yet (the Sandisk Sansa E200 series)
08:25:42GigabeaterI only see Demo folder
08:25:47GigabeaterGBSYSTEM is hidden for me
08:25:51amiconnSurger: Yeah, the Ondios are quite old now.
08:25:52GigabeaterBut I can acess it manually
08:26:13Mouser_XWell, do you have hidden and system files set as visable?
08:26:19Mouser_XMaybe something else is hidden.
08:26:29MonkeyTamerassuming ssd's come out fairly soon, there may be some greater options for consumers finally
08:26:29Surgeramiconn: Thanks. Maybe I should just wait a bit. The old iRivers are also hard to find.
08:26:30amiconnBut if mp3 recording is enough, the Ondio FM is a quite flexible recording device
08:26:34Mouser_X(I can see the GBSYSTEM folder on my PC just fine.)
08:26:50GigabeaterWeird.. I can not.
08:26:57amiconnIt also has a radio. Afaik the ipod nano can record too, if you manage to get/build an adapter
08:27:21scorcheamiconn: i dont think we have seen difinitive proof that the nano can record yet
08:27:22LloreanGigabeater: Usually that means that while you've turned on the option to show hidden files, you haven't disabled the OTHER option to hide system files.
08:27:33Mouser_XGigabeater: You might not have hidden files/folders/system files turned on. Windows has it their visibility off by default.
08:27:39GigabeaterHow do I change that
08:27:52Lloreanscorche: I _think_ we've seen it for the line in. I'm not 100% sure though
08:28:00amiconnscorche: Oh, I though that was already verified...
08:28:13MonkeyTamertaskbar, tools, folder options, view
08:28:51Mouser_X^ @ Gigabeater, I think
08:29:04SurgerAnd I hate these devices with the Microsoft based transfer crap. Needs to have UMS since I don't do the Windows thing. :)
08:29:07GigabeaterI made them visible
08:29:10GigabeaterBut Its not there
08:29:10MonkeyTamerit's about halfway down; there's also a setting for hiding system files a bit further, but I'm uncertain if it's necessary
08:29:41LloreanMonkeyTamer: Both of them are necessary, though I thought the GBSYSTEM folder was just hidden.
08:30:02Gigabeaterthere we go
08:30:04MonkeyTamerseems a bit strange for it to be hidden on the system side...
08:30:14Gigabeaterit is though
08:30:23GigabeaterI now have 4 things.
08:30:27Mouser_XGigabeater: So, after doing that, nothing else showed up?
08:30:32Mouser_XOh, well then.
08:30:40MonkeyTamerwell if there's a thumbs.db file, that doesn't count ;)
08:30:56GigabeaterSystem Volume Information, Recycled, DEMO_MUSIC, GBSYSTEM
08:30:57*Mouser_X hates thumbs.db with a passion.
08:31:21MonkeyTamerthe first two sound like standard folders
08:31:30MonkeyTamerassociated with any drive
08:31:30Mouser_XSystem Volume and Recycled are useless, but you can't get rid of them from within WinXP.
08:31:57Mouser_X(They're useless, since they're not *needed* on a Fat32 drive.)
08:32:01GigabeaterSo now I should back up my player?
08:32:20Mouser_XThey should be empty though, so you really don't need to worry about them anyway, I would think.
08:32:44GigabeaterThey're not
08:33:04MonkeyTameranything in there couldn't be using hardly any space regardless
08:33:04Mouser_XGigabeater: If you read the installation instructions, it will tell you specifically what file(s?) to backup.
08:33:16Mouser_XThere should only be one file that you'll be changing.
08:33:16Gigabeaterits not
08:33:20Gigabeaterlike half a meg
08:33:27LloreanMonkeyTamer: A recycle bin can be quite large.
08:33:35Gigabeaterit's 6kb
08:33:35MonkeyTamerin a FAT32 drive?
08:33:36LloreanSame with System Volume Information depending on how windows is configured.
08:33:38Gigabeaterbig deal
08:33:59LloreanMonkeyTamer: If you delete 400mb of small files, you have a 400mb recycle bin, that simple.
08:34:18*Mouser_X has the recyle bin disabled completely.
08:34:28Mouser_XIn other words, I don't have that problem.
08:34:39MonkeyTamerwait, llorean are we talking about the windows recycle bin, or the dfolder within the dap?
08:34:43Mouser_XI *do* have the problem of never deleting anything...
08:34:53Gigabeaterso I just rename FWIMG01.DAT to FWIMG01.DAT.ORIG
08:34:55LloreanMonkeyTamer: "dfolder"?
08:35:09MonkeyTamerer, *folder
08:35:13LloreanMonkeyTamer: If you mean "Folder", on the Gigabeat, the folder called 'Recycle Bin' in the root is the windows recycle bin for that drive.
08:35:24Mouser_XGigabeater: Yes.
08:35:36Mouser_XFeel free to backup, copy, whatever that file, if you wish.
08:36:08GigabeaterBut what is necesarry
08:36:11GigabeaterOr recomended
08:36:58Mouser_XRecommended is to rename it. Anything past that is simply extra precautions.
08:37:11Mouser_XWhich you are of course welcome to take.
08:37:25MonkeyTamerinteresting, for most drives I have, when it is deleted, the files are gone from the recycle bin once I remove the drive
08:37:41MonkeyTamermore specifically, it's called "RECYCLER" for me
08:37:49GigabeaterIf I happened to somehow lose it, could I come on here and get it sent to me or something?
08:38:40Mouser_XGigabeater: Probably, but I don't know if that would work (there's different versions of the firmware available. What version did you lose? That sort of thing).
08:38:49LloreanMonkeyTamer: And you're running windows XP?
08:39:08GigabeaterMeh.. I'll just do the reccomended backing up
08:39:15GigabeaterNow for the Rockbox boot loader
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08:39:53Gigabeater"Copy the extract the file FWIMG01.DAT from to X:\GBSYSTEM\FWIMG" Copy the extract the?
08:40:02MonkeyTamerotherwise the recycler maintains some <1kb files that I am unsure of the actual contents within
08:40:12LloreanGigabeater: Is that from the PDF Manual?
08:40:24GigabeaterIt's from the wiki
08:41:32LloreanI've fixed that page.
08:41:34bospaadjeare there any plans to support other filesystems than FAT (hfs, ext for example) for rockbox?
08:41:38LloreanBut honestly, why didn't you use the official manual?
08:41:51GigabeaterI didnt know there was one
08:41:57Lloreanbospaadje: There's not really a good reason to other than making the rockbox binary larger.
08:42:06LloreanGigabeater: What did you think the 'manual' link was on every single page?
08:42:17GigabeaterDidnt notice
08:42:29LloreanGigabeater: And I told you to read the manual in our previous discussion.
08:42:33LloreanYou told me it was too thorough.
08:42:41LloreanKinda contradictory to not knowing it exists now...
08:42:49GigabeaterThat manual
08:43:10GigabeaterWow.. I'm dumb
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08:44:05MonkeyTamerthe manual is totally an enjoyable read; no way is it too thorough :p
08:44:23Surgerbospaadje: Why would you want to use anything other than FAT32? Last thing you really need is a journaled filesystem on an MP3 player. Adds more complexity, eats more power and doesn't improve anything.
08:44:23MonkeyTamereach section is like an adventure
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08:45:01MonkeyTamerbut you can find the exact time and moment you used/played that file!
08:45:21LloreanSurger: The most commonly mentioned reason is that OSX has horrible Fat32 support and they'd rather not have to convert their iPod.
08:45:27MonkeyTamersorry... couldn't resist
08:45:54SurgerLlorean: Ah ... what do the iPods use?
08:46:11LloreanSurger: The Mac iPods use HFS+
08:46:16LloreanThe windows ones use Fat32.
08:46:28MonkeyTamereven on the OF ipods must user fat32 for windows
08:47:05 Quit midkay ("Leaving")
08:48:12SurgerFAT32 support is excellent in Linux - I'm surprised the code hasn't been ported to OSX yet.
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08:50:38Gigabeateristalling the build...
08:51:26MonkeyTamerI hadn't really known about the impedance issue with the ipod; I always wondered why there never seemed to be any bass
08:51:53MonkeyTamerit's a shame many of the "good" recommendations for headphones are 16 ohm
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08:53:02GigabeaterLlorean: I found a minor error in the pdf manual.. just grammar really. missing one word
08:53:07Gigabeaterif you care
08:53:49LloreanGigabeater: Sure, where at?
08:54:04Gigabeaterpage 12
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08:54:36Gigabeater3rd bullet after in "Installing the Bootloader"
08:54:57GigabeaterBlah blah blah. This too may hidden
08:57:10 Quit MonkeyTamer ("Chatzilla 0.9.77 [Firefox]")
08:57:28bospaadjeLlorean, Surger, thanks for the answers. Was just asking cause a friend of mine dislikes FAT for some reason.
08:57:38 Part norbusan
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08:57:50LloreanGigabeater: It'll be fixed in the next manual build.
08:58:17Lloreanbospaadje: He may dislike it, but in the case of DAPs it actually may be argued that it's a better choice since it's fairly light weight.
08:58:25GigabeaterHey uhh.. when I put the new fwing file in, do I put the splashscreen and audio file that come with it in the folder too
08:58:50LloreanThere's an audio file with it now?
08:58:56GigabeaterSo when I start up Rockbox, it's supposed to first show the Gigabeat loading screen?
08:58:59Mouser_XThat's news to me.
08:59:09Mouser_X(@ Llorean)
08:59:17LloreanGigabeater: That's not an audio file.
08:59:19Mouser_XBootsplash.raw is an image.
08:59:20LloreanThat's the image in a raw format
08:59:28LloreanThe .bmp isn't actually needed
08:59:36Gigabeaterit opens with winamp so I assumed
08:59:39Mouser_XThe RAW goes in the root of the player.
09:00:27amiconnLinusN: How did you power your player for your test? Lab power supply or 'ordinary' NiMH cells?
09:00:37LinusNNiMH cells
09:00:48GigabeaterAnd uhh.. I didnt install the font package but it still runs?
09:01:00LloreanGigabeater: The font package isn't necessary for it to run, but most themes will look wrong.
09:01:24amiconnI am still puzzled by it shutting down. The original 4.53 firmware does have functions to enable and disable ata power, and those functions are different from the place that does the initial ata power enable at boot
09:01:39LinusNamiconn: that is how my player has always worked with ata poweroff
09:01:40amiconnMaybe it's just a faulty NiMH cell?
09:01:54amiconnDoes it work in the OF then?
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09:02:20LinusNhaven't run the OF for many years
09:02:48amiconnI don't know when the OF calls these functions, but there are calls to them
09:02:59jimbobevening chaps, may I ask if there is any status on 2nd ipod nanos?
09:03:05Lloreanjimbob: No.
09:03:06LinusNamiconn: weird
09:03:10jimbob2nd generation...
09:03:11GigabeaterCan I delete the DEMO_MUSIC folder?
09:03:36 Quit JerryLange ("Leaving")
09:03:52GodEater_Llorean: is that "No you can't ask?", or "No, there's no status" ? ;)
09:03:58Mouser_XGigabeater: Most likely.
09:04:03LloreanGodEater_: Either one serves my purpose. Hehehe.
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09:04:07Mouser_XI don't see any reason you can't.
09:04:12Mouser_XI didn't, but that's me.
09:04:13amiconnLinusN: The reason I am thinking it might be a faulty cell is that I had similar behaviour on my recorder some months ago
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09:04:22amiconnAre you using the original cells?
09:04:29GigabeaterIt's filled with a bunch of weird files
09:04:32jimbobI understand that the 2nd gen uses a proprietary processor, which one would assume is the main stumbling block
09:04:36LinusNamiconn: i have used many different cells on that player over the years
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09:04:56amiconnHmm, then that's probably not the reason. Very puzzling
09:05:15GodEater_jimbob: the main stumbling block is the fact that for the first time, apple chose to encrypt the main firmware on an iPod
09:05:25LinusNit *could* be bad grounding or similar, i.e only my player is bad
09:05:34amiconnAta poweroff works like a charm on my player, but that's a newer hardware version
09:05:38amiconn(rom 5.06)
09:05:39Mouser_XGigabeater: Yes it is. Your point? It's fairly small. Back it up, and delete it, if you want. If there's problems, put it back on.
09:05:40GodEater_jimbob: with every other iPod, Apple have not done this
09:05:42 Quit decayedcell_ (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))
09:06:31amiconnLinusN: A simple test could perhaps tell us more. Just rolo the OF and see whether it also dies on rebuffer
09:06:33jimbobgodeater: ah, I see... this was largely the information I have been searching for - basically, what is preventing rockbox from being used on the nano 2nd gen
09:06:34 Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:06:43LinusNamiconn: i could do that
09:06:47amiconn(preferably newest version)
09:06:47GigabeaterMouser_X: Will do!
09:06:48Lloreanjimbob: It's covered in the forum thread on it, I believe.
09:06:50 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:06:56GodEater_jimbob: have you read the thread on the 2nd Gen in the forums ?
09:07:08amiconnIf it doesn't, I'll do the same and check whether the OF actually disables ata power
09:07:22LinusNdamn, no isd200 drivers on this computer
09:07:36amiconnIf it doesn't, there must be a reason why (i.e. some hardware versions not liking it)
09:07:46amiconnIf it does, then we must be doing something wrong
09:07:57amiconnLinusN: Windows?
09:08:04B4gderGoogle Summer of Code will be starting up soonly...
09:08:09LinusNyes, trying the vmware image now...
09:08:42JdGordonB4gder: for failed builds.. is the delta going to be a relaly massive negative number?
09:08:45LloreanB4gder: We gonna try to get in this year?
09:09:05B4gderJdGordon: my intention is to make it deal with that situation sensibly
09:09:18B4gderLlorean: I think it would be cool
09:09:27LloreanI do too.
09:09:31GodEater_they start their summer of code in winter ?
09:09:54JdGordonit starts may-ish doesnt it?
09:09:55B4gder" By early April, the final students will be chosen"
09:10:26hcsgotta make preparations
09:11:02GigabeaterI'm guessing the fonts package is unzipped to the root?
09:11:21Gigabeaterthank you
09:11:39Gigabeaterthemes aswell?
09:11:50B4gderI bet that varies
09:12:04B4gderas they're not official packages from
09:12:20GodEater_it does vary yes
09:12:31GigabeaterHow do I fond out?
09:12:38GigabeaterI chose Back
09:12:44GodEater_*most* of them unzip to root okay - but the occasional package creator includes a directory above .rockbox for no good reason
09:12:45GigabeaterThe theme for the Gigabeat
09:12:47 Nick pill is now known as pilled (
09:13:11B4gderlist the package contents before you unzip perhaps?
09:13:22GigabeaterI explored
09:13:26GigabeaterIt goes
09:13:35Gigabeaterback/.rockbox/the files
09:13:46Gigabeaterso I just copy the files after the .rockbox
09:13:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
09:14:18LloreanThe files in /.rockbox/ in the zip need to be in /.rockbox/ on the device
09:14:20GodEater_copy the .rockbox folder into the root of your player
09:14:42GodEater_why theme authors don't get this is beyond me
09:14:46GodEater_it's not tough to do it properly
09:15:06LloreanGodEater_: We haven't posted rules yet.
09:15:14GodEater_we shouldn't have to
09:15:23LloreanWhat ever happened with the guy running trying to get his site made 'official'?
09:15:24GodEater_it's pretty easy to work out
09:15:54GodEater_I posted a theme I hacked about a bit there yesterday
09:16:12GodEater_btw - where has that "Userform" at the bottom of the gigabeatWPS page come from ?
09:16:29LloreanCheck the revisions?
09:16:36GodEater_I'll rephrase
09:16:41GodEater_I know WHO put it there
09:16:48GodEater_I just couldn't work out how to get rid of it
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09:17:06GodEater_it seems a bit pointless having it on a page which lots of people edit, when it only ever appears at the bottom
09:17:48GodEater_so when I added my theme yesterday, it moved from being next to the theme the guy who added it made, to under mine, which makes no sense
09:17:58LloreanGodEater_ It's gone.
09:18:12GodEater_I think I need to go read the twiki docs :)
09:18:36LloreanI haven't, I just noticed there was an option to 'replace' it.
09:18:51LloreanAnd then when I clicked that, there was an option to replace it with 'None'
09:18:57GigabeaterWhere do I put my music?
09:19:17 Quit Mouser_X (Nick collision from services.)
09:19:17Gigabeaterjust make sure the folder has a .m3u in it
09:19:26 Join Mouser_X [0] (
09:19:32Gigabeaterplaylist file
09:19:38GigabeaterI thought thats what it was
09:19:49GodEater_it is - but the folders with your music don't NEED one
09:19:53Lloreanm3us are playlist files.
09:19:56LloreanBut you don't need one.
09:20:06GigabeaterI thought I read that you do
09:20:14GodEater_have you been smoking ? :)
09:20:22GigabeaterNot tonight
09:20:38retIn the FS view for a task (e.g. a patch), there is the field 'status'. But I can't see the field 'resolution.' For example, if a patch/bug report has the status 'closed' it could have been resolved by accepting it or by rejecting (not reproducable, not needed etc). Is it possible to include that field?
09:20:47LloreanGigabeater: You would _really_ benefit from just reading the basic sections of the manual
09:21:05Lloreanret: You can see why a task is closed...
09:21:42Lloreanret: For example, on you can see "Reason for closing: Accepted"
09:22:11*Llorean sneaks in a small actual source code change.
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09:22:56GigabeaterI really like how Rockbox plays .flac and Ogg
09:23:00retLlorean: aha, I didn't look at that area, only at the 'headers.' Thanks!
09:24:51GodEater_are up super early, or up really late Llorean ?
09:25:09LloreanReally late.
09:25:09Gigabeater25 after midnight here
09:25:25LloreanWell, not _really_ late, but late enough.
09:25:33jimbobThanks chaps, keep up the terrific work - it looks like I'll have to hunt around ebay for a replacement to my aging iAudio M3...
09:26:30GigabeaterIs there a way(or does) for Rockbox to change the charging screen? I'm worried it will burn into the LCD
09:26:39GodEater_jimbob: I recommend a gigabeat ;)
09:26:46GodEater_For X series
09:26:57GodEater_that shoudl read "F or X series"
09:27:06LloreanGigabeater: LCDs don't do burn-in...
09:27:29GodEater_I haven't seen a DAP with a plasma display either
09:27:33GigabeaterI continue to embarass myself
09:27:43LloreanMan, plasma burns bad, and ridiculously quickly.
09:27:52GodEater_that's why I bought an LCD TV ;)
09:28:16GodEater_it's all those little channel logos that everyone insists on displaying now that do the worst damage IMO
09:28:34*GodEater_ waves a flag for the good ol' BBC, who don't do that
09:28:39B4gderyou need to continuously change channel!
09:28:40LloreanGigabeater: It is changeable though, but requires you to recompile (not terribly difficult, no actually coding really necessary)
09:29:01 Quit ret ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
09:29:36LloreanI assume nobody minds if I kill warnings like that every now and then, even though I'm supposed to do manual stuff? ;)
09:29:47B4gderindeed not
09:29:59GodEater_I'm sure you'll find a ticking parcel through your door someday if someone does mind
09:30:01Gigabeaterif it doesnt burn in, im fine
09:30:03B4gderwe just secretly hope that you'll mess up so that we can laugh at you ;-P
09:30:14LloreanOh, that's absolutely fine. If I do, I deserve it.
09:32:29Gigabeaterso.. i think I installed Back right
09:32:32GigabeaterBut it doesnt show up
09:32:41Gigabeateris there something I could have done wrong
09:32:44jimbobgodeater: well, I'm hoping for something small and compact, with Ogg support
09:33:20GodEater_if you want something THAT small then a 1st Gen Nano is about your only option
09:34:00jimbobyes, I cannot find any stores here that still stock the 1st gen however...
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09:34:02GodEater_from a personal view point, I don't tend to actually _recommend_ iPods as a rockbox platform - there's still a lot of polishing needs to happen
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09:34:32GodEater_it is, however, all about personal taste
09:34:45GodEater_by Ogg, I assume you mean vorbis btw ?
09:34:46jimbobI love the idea of an open source firmware on an attractive player
09:34:59jimbobyes, vorbis
09:35:12GodEater_well just bear in mind you'll get worse battery life than on the OF with an iPod, about 50% worse
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09:35:58jimbobI don't mind terribly, as long as the battery holds out long enough to go cycling for a few hours
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09:36:15GodEater_that it should do :)
09:36:16 Join darkless [0] (
09:36:48jimbobcurrently, I have to be content with singing to myself...
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09:37:39GodEater_tough to do when you're riding up a steep hill, even if you're lance armstrong
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09:37:50Lloreanjimbob: The 1G Nano will give you at least 5 and a half, and that's pretty much 'worst case' conditions.
09:37:54GodEater_which I assume you're not ;)
09:37:58LloreanOther than the backlight.
09:38:36jimbobno, I'm afraid not.
09:39:13jimbobby the way, is there a standardised model numbering system with ipod nanos? I see a few stores listening numbers such as 'MA107J'
09:39:18GigabeaterI'm frozen
09:39:27*hcs casts fire
09:39:39GodEater_bit drastic
09:39:41GigabeaterI had it on and plugged in the usb
09:39:49Gigabeaternow its stuck on the WPS
09:39:49Lloreanjimbob: I'm not familiar with any numbering system.
09:40:08GodEater_jimbob: you could *try* looking in the iPL wiki, they might have more info on that
09:40:26LinusNamiconn: looks like the cells aren't in shape, i'll try with a fresh set this evening
09:40:30GigabeaterWhat should I do?
09:40:30GodEater_but I don't recall such a system either
09:40:43GigabeaterTurn off the battery?
09:40:57LloreanGigabeater: If it's not responding to any button presses and not playing music you might have to, but that's unusual.
09:41:08Gigabeaterit is not
09:41:17GodEater_did you unplug the usb again ?
09:41:54jimbobwell, lists that particular model (4gb black 1st gen) as unavailable, with only the 2nd listed for purchase
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09:45:53jimbobI do wish I could get my old iaudio M3 fixed...
09:47:12 Quit midgey ()
09:48:10jimbobtake care chaps, keep up the good work!
09:48:31 Quit jimbob ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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09:51:55GigabeaterThanks for all your help, guys
09:52:03GigabeaterTime fore bed.
09:52:45 Quit Gigabeater ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
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09:58:22pondlifeLove the binary size table.
09:58:50pondlifeAny idea why LinusN's commit - "Shave a few bytes off the binary size" - increases binary size on some targets?
09:59:02pondlifeJust for educational purposes.
09:59:18jhMikeSthe law of equal exchange?
10:00:28pondlife:) But seriously, I can't see anything in the diffs that should increase binary.
10:00:54LinusNpondlife: i haven't checked, but i guess it has to do with expensive function calls
10:02:13pondlifeLinusN: bytes2int uses more space as a function call, rather than being a macro? That would be counter-my-intuition.
10:02:34LinusNit sure is odd
10:03:08pondlifeIs there some compile optimisation that's not enabled on the coldfires perhaps?
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10:03:54B4gderjhMikeS: thanks, now I could test what the sizes table did on failed builds :-)
10:04:17jhMikeSB4gder: pleased to be helpful :-)
10:04:22peturjhMikeS: I made another perfect recording :)
10:04:26pondlifeB4gder: I can help some more if you want
10:04:32blacknessfor some reason the dual boot on my ipod 4g greyscale doesn't work, any help?
10:04:49jhMikeSpetur: cool. i toughened it up even more in the commit :-)
10:05:18pondlifeB4gder: What's the rightmost column in the delta size table?
10:05:25pondlifee.g. the red 71
10:05:26Lloreanblackness: Did you use the new or old install instructions?
10:05:37pondlifeSource lines?
10:05:40B4gderpondlife: average delta per listed target
10:06:06jhMikeSI guess some versions of gcc don't like static on scoped functions :\
10:06:51blacknessi used the manual
10:07:15Lloreanblackness: Did it involve the ipod_fw tool?
10:07:21LloreanOr only ipodpatcher
10:07:34 Join My_Sic [0] (
10:08:16blacknessjust ipodpatcher
10:08:54LloreanThat's your problem then
10:09:02LloreanThe new instructions seem to break dual boot on the grayscale targets right now.
10:09:23blacknesswhere are the new instructions?
10:10:10 Join alsaf [0] (
10:10:28LloreanThose were the new instructions.
10:10:31LloreanYou need the old ones.
10:10:41alsafhas anybody heard of the MVIX media centre?
10:10:43LloreanThe IpodInstallation wiki page, but you'll need to restore your bootpartition.bin first.
10:11:02Lloreanalsaf: It's a PC, isn't it?
10:11:06 Quit GodEater_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
10:11:30LloreanOh, wait, wrong media center.
10:11:33blacknessthanks llorean
10:11:58 Part blackness
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10:12:23B4gdernew rockbox target? ;-)
10:12:48alsafits a media player that you stick a HDD in and plays multimedia files
10:12:57alsafit runs through firmware
10:13:28Lloreanalsaf: Pretty much any complex electronic device runs through either firmware or software.
10:13:43Lloreanalsaf: It's not in the general category of "Portable music player" at all though.
10:13:57LloreanB4gder: If it ends up truly wholly open source, I bet it'll happen.
10:14:06alsafwhat i meant AFAIK it isn't bootable O/s
10:14:19linuxstb_03.24.32 # <JdGordon> mpegplayer is very early in development ; 03.24.35 # <JdGordon> i.e it sucks atm <−−−− A bit harsh :)
10:14:31 Quit petur ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
10:14:49 Join petur [0] (i=d4efd6a6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
10:15:52alsafthe wireless version has a linux SDK
10:16:05jhMikeSis the build stuck or did B4gder stop it? seems to be taking awhile
10:17:03B4gderthat's usually due to a ssh hanging to one of the servers
10:19:28B4gderoddly enough, ssh doesn't provide any good timeout options for that
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10:26:06jhMikeSooh, I forgot to mention that it limits prerecord time if it would exceed the high watermark. old recording did that too. should almost never need invoking except for 88k stereo WavPack on x5.
10:27:06 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
10:27:56jhMikeSthat format 9/10 times doesn't require priority boost on that device either but before always needed it
10:29:12amiconnjhMikeS: Doesn't that mean the same for 88kHz stereo wav?
10:29:41amiconnreboot, brb
10:29:44 Quit amiconn (" HydraIRC -> <- State of the art IRC")
10:29:50jhMikeSamiconn: no, wav and aiff run so fast it's like not even having an encoder
10:30:18jhMikeSin watching the pcm buffer they never show > 0
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10:32:01jhMikeSiiow they do so much yielding flushing is pretty easy
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10:37:39*jhMikeS suspects wavpack can be improved further with some encoder tweaks in the yielding and always encode 75% of remaining data so extra chunk size isn't needed for the negative compression case
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10:39:44 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC")
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10:42:05jhMikeSactually 80% is better since four iterations will leave 8 samples unencoded with no remainders at any one
10:42:47*petur feels the binsize table could do with a little cell padding
10:43:58*jhMikeS agree with that...and should have cell borders and the numbers right-jutified :-)
10:44:06 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
10:44:24B4gdercell padding delivered
10:45:06amiconnjhMikeS: I was referring to the watermark limiting
10:45:20*petur thinks delivery is quite fast :)
10:47:22 Quit GodEater_ ("CGI:IRC")
10:47:27jhMikeSamiconn: oh...sorry. sure...prerecord limits would have to apply there too but less so atm because there's 5% padding in wavpack chunks and the chunks are smaller so more precise
10:48:50jhMikeSreally it would potentially apply to anything if the prerecord time were set to something far longer that settings allows
10:49:18amiconnWhy do wavpack chunks need padding?
10:49:32peturB4gder: maybe it should have been cellspacing iso padding, or a combination of both?
10:50:02*amiconn would expext a lossless compressor to store the samples verbatim if applying the algorithm would cause expansion
10:50:17*petur tries to mind his PaidWork(tm)
10:50:26jhMikeSamiconn: you can get negative compression in wavpack
10:50:40amiconnOdd format....
10:51:40jhMikeSthe inventor apparently doesn't care to handle the case by just storing uncompressed samples in that (rare) instance. can't figure why.
10:51:41 Quit directhex|work ("Leaving")
10:56:43jhMikeSI discussed that stuff with bryant
10:58:58 Join webguest11 [0] (i=8506cf9d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
10:59:53webguest11Hi there. I noticed work on a Rockbox port for the Archos AV300. How about the AV400? Similar, or a totally different beast?
11:00:10B4gderwebguest11: quite different
11:00:16B4gderalthough still possible
11:00:27B4gderjust that no AV400 users are interested enough it seems
11:01:02webguest11OK thanks
11:01:23webguest11Wish I had a couple hundred hours of free time to work on it myself ;-)
11:01:43B4gdercut down two hours sleep for 50 days and voila! ;-)
11:02:16webguest11Already maxxed out on sleep deprivation, unfortunately!
11:02:32 Join GodEater_ [0] (i=c2cbc95c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
11:02:34GodEater_identify f566mgy
11:02:43B4gderand now, it is time to change password!
11:02:47GodEater_certianly is
11:03:51scorchelooks like someone pulled a safetydan =P
11:04:22GodEater_not *entirely* my fault - cgi:irc changed the input focus midway through me typing
11:05:18*jhMikeS has that one automated
11:05:19B4gderyeah yeah yeah, we believe you yes yes yes :-)
11:05:55 Join himitsu [0] (n=himitsu@
11:08:08 Join barrywardell [0] (
11:09:03GodEater_is it possible to automate it with irc:cgi ?
11:09:10GodEater_cos if it is - I'll do it
11:13:06*webguest11 runs a window manager that forbids automatic focus changing
11:13:23peturinside the browser?
11:13:58webguest11At a window level (I'm on Linux running X), maybe I misunderstand what focus is being talked about here....
11:14:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:14:07GodEater_it's not the window manager's fault - it's the scripts - it switches inside the firefox window it's running in
11:14:27 Join reacend [0] (
11:14:44webguest11Nothing a greasemonkey script can't fix :-)
11:15:29GodEater_I thought of that too - but I'm not sure how to make sure the same thing doesn't happen to the greasemonkey script
11:16:11reacendhi, I got last night installed rockbox on my G5 video 30gb
11:16:33reacendand it work greate, but one question: i got a usb charge adaptor
11:16:51reacendwhen I plug it in the ipod thinks it is a computer and change to disk mode
11:16:59reacendhow can I deny tjis?
11:17:11Lloreanreacend: Are you using an official build?
11:17:30LloreanIn the Info -> Version screen, what does it say your version is?
11:17:53reacendwill check one moment
11:18:11*GodEater_ thinks the info version screen should display the version at the top
11:18:30*Llorean thinks the version should stay displaying even after it flips to the credits.
11:18:36GodEater_that too
11:18:36 Quit webguest11 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
11:18:56GodEater_pretty recent
11:19:21Lloreanreacend: What brand charger is it?
11:19:41reacendit is a ac-usb adaptor and a normal usb ipod cable
11:19:53LloreanThat's not what I asked.
11:20:29reacendbut it has no manufactor
11:20:59LloreanTry holding Menu while you plug the cable in. (Make sure you're already inside Rockbox)
11:20:59reacendmade in china
11:22:37reacendwill charge it first
11:22:41reacendthe night was to long ;)
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11:25:43 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection)
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11:29:05reacendworks very great
11:30:53reacendalso one question
11:30:56reacendalbum arts
11:31:10reacenddo I have to patch my rockbox?
11:34:24reacendbmp album arts
11:34:27linuxstb_Yes, or download an unofficial build that has already been patched.
11:36:15reacendso is there any planed release that uses the ipod video hardware decoder?
11:36:24reacendhardware mpeg decoder
11:37:11LloreanUnless someone comes along and reverse engineers it for us, it's unlikely to ever be used.
11:37:46reacendso its not a problem
11:37:53reacendso the last question ;)
11:38:10reacendcan I use the bootloader from ipodlinux to boot your rockbox?
11:39:52 Quit barrywardell (Remote closed the connection)
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11:45:16reacendLlorean: do I have to install the gba emulator seperatly?
11:45:22preglowjhMikeS: oy
11:45:26Lloreanreacend: There is no GBA emulator
11:45:29Lloreanreacend: Please, read the manual.
11:46:39reacendRockboy is a Nintendo Game Boy and Game Boy Color emulator for Rockbox based on the gnuboy emulator. To start a game open a ROM file saved as .gb or .gbc in the file browser.
11:47:02GodEater_that's gameboy, not gameboy advanced
11:47:18reacendsorry m;)
11:49:04linuxstb_reacend: And everything described in the manual (apart from the fonts) comes in the standard you've (I assume) downloaded and installed.
11:52:35jhMikeSpreglow: yo
11:54:58preglowjhMikeS: did the wavpack commit about five weeks ago mess up compression efficieny?
11:55:02preglowefficiency too
11:56:40 Quit Tom0473 ("[G]Script - v3.3 daGroove - -")
11:56:41jhMikeSpreglow: I think I was out to lunch on the size thing (forgot I was doing 88k :p) but the playback seems harder
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11:57:16jhMikeSx5 could play those 88k ones just fine after the pcf50606 i2c driver update
11:57:24preglowoh, ok
11:57:30reacendlinuxstb_: okay, that is the problem that some themes will not work correctly
11:57:35preglowjust thought you should tell david braynt if it was so, you see
11:57:41preglowhe's usually very helpful
11:57:55jhMikeSI'll shoot a message to him
11:58:07preglowhe's been working on optimising wavpack lately, i wonder if that stuff will fit into our decoder
11:58:10Lloreanreacend: A) Have you installed all the fonts, and B) Do the themes require modified builds perhaps?
11:58:25reacendLlorean: that i have to check ;)
11:58:49*jhMikeS wishes he'd just break down and store raw pcm if compression is negative :\
11:59:54preglowyou've really got to have some fancy algorithms going if you manage negative compression ratio
12:00:41jhMikeShe says it should manage it with random data but I tried white noise in CoolEdit and it compressed better than
12:01:16preglowthat's... weird...
12:01:30preglowthat doesn't exactly bode well for the noise generator in cool edit
12:01:31jhMikeSpreglow: why's it "fancy"? haven't looked at what wavpack employs
12:01:52jhMikeSI could try the rockbox random
12:02:02preglowwavpack just does tons of decorrelation passes with a potentially different filter each time
12:02:18preglowand then encodes the residue
12:02:40jhMikeSsound a bit flac-y
12:03:27*linuxstb_ wonders how flake, the new flac encoder is coming along
12:03:55 Join directhex|work [0] (
12:03:56preglowjhMikeS: it kinda is, but flac just does one pass, and uses a higher order filter
12:04:10preglowjhMikeS: the wawvpack filter is almost always one-tap
12:04:13 Join My_Sic [0] (
12:04:21preglowlinuxstb_: i hope the flake guy stopped using bigger block sizes
12:04:34preglowi think josh told him kindly not to
12:04:39DataGhosthm linuxstb_... I'm not that much into the GPL
12:04:40 Join matsl_ [0] (
12:04:48jhMikeSwhat about the exaustive option? it searches with that one afaik
12:05:01 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:05:01DataGhostbut wouldn't including ipodpatcher binary in a 'installer' which has no released sourcecode and license mean a violation of the GPL?
12:05:22linuxstb_Sorry, not the ".exe", but the code iself.
12:05:27 Quit matsl_ (Client Quit)
12:05:34DataGhostwell, he included the .exe IN another .exe
12:05:35preglowjhMikeS: wouldn't know, there's a doc around on how wavpack works, btw, if very interested
12:05:44 Join matsl_ [0] (
12:05:45jhMikeSof course as always :)
12:05:46DataGhostand as far as my grepping can see, he doesn't mention the copyrights anywhere
12:05:53preglowi'll dig out the url
12:06:01linuxstb_DataGhost: Do you have a URL?
12:06:02preglowbah, luckily, my mail server is down
12:06:07GodEater_DataGhost: who is this ?
12:06:22DataGhostsome guy who made an 'installer'
12:06:30DataGhostdon't know who he is
12:06:40preglowjhMikeS: i think he posted the url on hydrogenaudio some time, but i'll let you know when my mail server comes back upå
12:06:42directhex|workDataGhost, you can include gpl'd binaries in any format you like, including proprietary installers made by installshield, as long as source code to the gpl binaries is also available
12:06:43DataGhostbut he 'refuses' to give the source... he's been asked to do so several times
12:06:44preglowup <-
12:06:52DataGhostah ok directhex|work
12:07:03DataGhostI thought the copyright holders had to be mentioned as well
12:07:19DataGhostI haven't tried his installer but it just dd's a new MBR to the iPod 30GB
12:07:22directhex|workDataGhost, not explicitly. a copy of COPYING is needed though
12:07:27jhMikeSpreglow: how does mp3 with an encoded residue to restore the original values compare in compression? I've heard the method used haven't encounter the format.
12:07:31DataGhostone which will cause the ext3 partition to be trashed after a hibernation
12:07:52DataGhostand it contains the ipodpatcher binary, loader2 bin and a dd dump of his ext3 partition
12:08:16DataGhostso I'm not going to try it :P
12:08:23preglowjhMikeS: actually wouldn't know, but i wouldn't have too high hopes, the residue can be quite big with mp3, it never was an algorithm based on minimising residue
12:08:45preglowas evidenced by it being a transform codec
12:08:54jhMikeSIt's not something I plan on trying but just heard of it being used
12:08:56markunI'm writing a new button driver for the Gigabeat to return x, y and a pressure value.
12:08:56directhex|workDataGhost, he needs to provide the source to the gpl'd items on request, and he needs to include a copy of the license (but the gpl explicitly states that you don't need to accept it, so it shouldn't be included as part of the accepot/reject eula bit of the installer)
12:09:24DataGhostno but the inclusion of the software indicates that he accepts the GPL, for what I've just read
12:09:29DataGhostit's just a little bit hard to interpret :P
12:09:31directhex|workmarkun, any idea where the lcd power down default is set? i really need to change it to off by default :/
12:09:43markundirecthex|work: yes, I do, one moment
12:09:54LloreanDataGhost: What he means is that the people who use his tool don't have to accept the GPL.
12:10:01linuxstb_DataGhost: Yes - the only rights he has to redistribute my code are the permissions I gave him under the GPL.
12:10:02*jhMikeS is gonna straighten out the upsamping...playback must accept that no data might come out of the dsp
12:10:04DataGhostoh ok :)
12:10:15jhMikeSdownsampling rather :)
12:10:21DataGhostbut 'we' just like to see the source code of his installer
12:10:27DataGhostwhich I basically got through reverse engineering now
12:10:31directhex|workDataGhost, as a distributor, he has to accept it, yes. which is why he needs to provide the source to the gpl'd files, on request, for a nominal media fee if need be
12:10:33LloreanDataGhost: But he does have to provide the source of the GPL'ed parts of his software (and he has to actually _provide_ them, of the specific version he distributes, not just point to them)
12:10:49linuxstb_DataGhost: Looking at the .exe, he's also include the Rockbox bootloaders... Hence he's infringing the copyright of most Rockbox developers...
12:11:04preglowjhMikeS: interesting nevertheless, though, i've never actually thought about it
12:11:10linuxstb_(he also needs to be providing the source to those bootloaders)
12:11:10DataGhostoh yes that comes with ipodpatcher... hm, heh.
12:11:28preglowjhMikeS: i expect some of the challenge might be finding a nice way to encode the residue based on its probability distribution
12:11:34directhex|worklinuxstb_, that source doesn't need to be included per se - but he needs to provide it on request
12:11:52linuxstb_directhex|work: Yes, that's what I meant.
12:11:58linuxstb_"needs to be providing"
12:12:35jhMikeSpreglow: don't the rice codes in flac do that? I need to sit back and tune back into the maths for a bit.
12:13:40*jhMikeS can't even recall if "rice codes" is a total munging of something :\
12:14:09DataGhostby the way linuxstb_
12:14:17DataGhosthow do your apple modifications work?
12:14:24DataGhostmac-partition modifications*
12:14:31DataGhostfirst try msdos partitioning, then fall back to apple?
12:14:56jhMikeSwell, stepping away from things for awhile and doing other things inpires a flood of ideas when returning to it
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12:16:11linuxstb_DataGhost: Exactly the same way as loader2 - there is some magic in sector zero that's checked for a DOS partition table, if that isn't there, it checks the same sector for magic for an Apple Partition map.
12:16:22DataGhostok good
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12:16:38DataGhostbecause I noticed that, after restoring my iPod to a winpod again, my mac partition map is still there
12:16:49DataGhostat least parts
12:16:54DataGhostI'm not sure about the first sector anymore
12:17:05DataGhostif that was completely 000000 or contained a jump instruction
12:17:12 Join Criamos [0] (
12:17:28*jhMikeS figured out why leaky integrators suck, for instance.
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12:17:40linuxstb_DataGhost: BTW, that installer also includes the loader2 source, so the loader2 copyright holders could shout at him as well.
12:18:04preglowjhMikeS: oh?
12:18:08DataGhost2.5d6 so that includes me
12:18:25directhex|worklinuxstb_, have people explicitly requested his source code & toolchain details for the gpl binaries (not the installer itself)?
12:18:25DataGhostbut I guess that's only the request that he provides the source to the loader, right?
12:18:40linuxstb_directhex|work: He's infringing by not offering them IIUC.
12:18:41DataGhostwell, the source for the installer, afaik. directhex|work
12:18:52DataGhostbecause it was unknown what it does
12:18:59LloreanAnd by not including the copyright notice.
12:19:03preglowjhMikeS: rice codes work best on exponentially distributes residuals, afaik, something well-adapted lpc obviously yields
12:19:13DataGhostyet he put it on, for example, the 5.5G wiki page 'here is an automatic installer' (top of the page)
12:19:13directhex|worklinuxstb_, he doesn't need to explicitly offer them, he needs to provide them on request
12:19:28Lloreandirecthex|work: He does need to explicitly state the copyright though
12:19:37LloreanAnd the license terms.
12:20:05linuxstb_directhex|work: Read section 1 of the GPL...
12:20:05preglowjhMikeS: the problem with describing the residual for mp3 is that it's a perceptual codec, the residual can be described mathematically, but it won't be anything easy and closed form
12:20:05jhMikeSyeah, they don't really block dc. when fed a constant dc value they settle at a value that exactly leaks off the value over 1 period...bugger.
12:20:38preglowthey don't block dc at all, no
12:20:46preglowif they did that, all would be good
12:20:49jhMikeSI did pop in a true dc blocker in that thing which is quite better
12:20:50linuxstb_directhex|work: And section 3) (especially 3b)
12:21:29preglowjhMikeS: still not perfect, though, there'll still be precision problems with the triangle wave, afaik
12:21:40DataGhostI can request the kernel source, by the way
12:21:47DataGhostso I can see what he's done to it
12:21:56DataGhostbecause it's not mine but it sure as hell includes my modifications
12:21:59jhMikeSpreglow: that's cause they turn the nice low -120 - -130 db noise floor into brown noise
12:22:41LinusNjhMikeS: "brown noise", is that farting? :-P
12:23:15LinusNlovely term
12:23:20jhMikeSLinusN: lol :P It's the noise that makes you crap your pants automatically
12:24:38jhMikeSpreglow: and it integrates that noise floor twice for a nice nasty 12db/octave rolloff...that's diarrhea
12:24:52preglowall this math does stress the bowels
12:24:55directhex|workDataGhost, so he's missing two things - the copyright notice and the 'source available on request' notice. has he been asked to provide those things explicitly?
12:24:57markundirecthex|work: in firmware/target/arm/gigabeat/meg-fx/lcd-meg-fx.c: lcd_poweroff = true;
12:25:08markundirecthex|work: if you comment it out you will be fine
12:25:17DataGhostI think he has actually supplied some
12:25:24DataGhostbut I'm going to ask for the iPL source now
12:25:40Lloreandirecthex|work: He might actually be using GPL'ed code in his installer though.
12:25:49directhex|workmarkun, thanks. is there any reason not to make that the default?
12:25:53LloreanDoes it run ipodpatcher.exe separately, as it's own application?
12:26:05 Quit _Veseliq_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
12:26:42markundirecthex|work: I think I will commit it, but it would have been nice if we found the actual problem
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12:28:26 Quit thegeek_ (Remote closed the connection)
12:28:27DataGhostI really don't know Llorean... I think so, since he included the entire binary (even the usage is in there0
12:28:42DataGhostbut obviously, I can't test it since I haven't got a 30GB 5.5G
12:29:00*jhMikeS is relieving his by typing it all here :p
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12:34:16linuxstb_Llorean: I've just checked, and the installer .exe contains the entire ipodpatcher.exe embedded in it - "dd bs=1 skip=418700 count=460288 if=5.5gipl.exe of=ipodpatcher.exe" gives you the win32 ipodpatcher binary....
12:35:16reacendis it possible to control the ipod via usb?
12:35:24reacendplay ff rw etc
12:35:44 Quit B4gder ("Rockbox TCP exception #04123 - connection reset and user kicked out")
12:35:45linuxstb_In theory, yes, but there are no USB drivers in Rockbox.
12:36:18reacendhow is it with these fm transmitter
12:36:27reacendthat you plug on the bottom of the ipod?
12:37:06linuxstb_Rockbox doesn't have any support for ipod accessories. But some may work anyway, if they don't try and talk to the Apple firmware.
12:43:18jhMikeSooh...fixed the downsampler entirely :)
12:44:21jhMikeSnow for some math as a reward
12:50:57 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:52:45jhMikeSpreglow: want to do an arm version of those functions...pretty please? I'm gonna do a coldfire one. A partial assembly one saves about 15% boost on the scp codec on cf and an optimized c about 10%. :)
12:53:03jhMikeSspc codec even
12:53:32 Quit Rick (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:53:58reacendlinuxstb_: is my version the actual csv?
12:55:33 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
12:56:14preglowjhMikeS: i'd rather spend time on making a new resampler, but ok... perhaps
12:56:37preglowan interpolator is probably needed anyway
12:57:02preglowshould probably unroll it then
12:57:21preglowso we don't have that for statement in the innerloop
12:58:05jhMikeSpreglow: did that
12:59:40jhMikeSI don't know if can have a fancy one going but the resampling is a big bottleneck that really shows itself with that codec. I can with that get about 69-70% boost on Uncharted Waters (H120) with that.
13:00:12*jhMikeS put a lot of "with that"s in that *tired*
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13:03:41preglowthen it's time to reenable the echo
13:03:46preglowspcs sound so dead without that
13:04:28preglowthe fir filtering part of it is also begging for some movem.l and mac.l
13:04:28jhMikeSThat was my next step to emac that when I got enough room but have to have the core ready
13:05:19preglowdon't use FRACMUL there, like you've been saying in the tracker, btw
13:05:29preglowinteger mode is what will work there
13:05:43preglowas far as i could see, the sample data is all 16 bit
13:09:24jhMikeSpreglow: no...hell no. that was for other stuff
13:10:18 Quit matsl_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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13:11:20jhMikeSyes it's 16 bit. I suppose the clamping after voice mixing ought to go as well since the dsp clamps. See a problem with that anywhere?
13:12:02 Part norbusan
13:13:06preglowif we can make mac clamp, then yes, doing that is good
13:13:38preglowthat whole spc processing loop looks kinda of hostile towards optimising
13:13:53preglowlooks like it does one whole heap of stuff in one big per sample loop
13:13:59jhMikeSthat's even better but the core dsp already does it
13:14:03***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:14:09preglowahh, yes indeed
13:14:13*jhMikeS also messed up his commit message - how to fix that
13:14:35preglowdon't know, with cvs it was "cvs admin lolroflwhatever"
13:15:35jhMikeSyes, but I don't see an item in svn help that looks like it does that. It should have said "downsamping"
13:15:39GodEater_you forgot "omgwtf?!?!?!"
13:16:13preglowi think we'll survive typos
13:16:44jhMikeSbut that's just blatantly wrong :P
13:17:05jhMikeSthe message that is...surviving typos is ok :)
13:18:01directhex|workgah, sorry, cheese sauce incident
13:19:01markunCan anyone comment on my code for a new Gigabeat button driver? perhaps the calculation of xmin/xmax etc can be done faster?
13:19:02preglowdirecthex|work: it was either that or you were dying
13:19:03*jhMikeS wondered if that was the svn command
13:19:24GodEater_jhMikeS: it may well be
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13:19:30directhex|workpreglow, when i miss out on food, there's little difference :(
13:19:31preglowjhMikeS: btw, samples are 16 bits in the spc deal, yes? i see 'int' is used here and there for sample storage too
13:20:19jhMikeSpreglow: yes, should be faster so math is done in 32 bits
13:20:41Mikachulooks like you need to give Bagder some flowers
13:20:57linuxstb_preglow: Would your dsp code (eq, crossfeed etc) need many changes to deal with other samplerates? (I'm assuming it works on 44.1KHz data at the moment).
13:21:45preglowlinuxstb_: my code would need none at all for eq, just a simple change in the eq setting code and crossfeed will be worse :-)
13:22:32preglowi'll need to find some way to free a register for that
13:23:00*linuxstb_ wants someone to add varying samplerate playback to rockbox...
13:23:09preglowbut don't let that stand in your way if you want to introduce multiple sample rate support...
13:23:21preglowit will work in the meantime, it just won't be right
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13:23:42jhMikeSrrrr...stupid connection
13:23:55linuxstb_preglow: I want it, but can't bring myself to try and enter playback.c and do it...
13:24:05Nico_Pmarkun: would it be hard to add rotating to the gigabeat lcd driver ?
13:24:39jhMikeSMikachu: don't know if you got it...thanks
13:26:57pixelmaGodEater_: about the rockbox webclient login... you could try the "advanced" link in the login window. This leads you to a more sophisticated login mask where you could type your password beforehand. :)
13:27:11GodEater_heh - thanks ;)
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13:29:40jhMikeSno pre-revprop-change hook :(
13:30:52jhMikeSmaybe svnadmin will do it :\
13:31:10 Quit petur ("stkov :(")
13:36:58 Nick ^BeN^ is now known as Paprica (i=Paprica@
13:37:03Papricalinuxstb_... thank you for commit chopper :)
13:39:19 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
13:39:29linuxstb_Paprica: You're welcome.
13:40:52*LinusN can't find PluginChopper
13:41:30PapricaLinusN.. may i recive my commit access again?
13:42:40LinusNPaprica: i /msg:d you
13:43:38preglowjhMikeS: you gonna commit that resampler asm code today? i'll just wait until you do so i don't do anything completely different
13:43:39*GodEater_ just enjoyed the chopper plugin for the first time
13:44:45linuxstb_preglow: Looking at the current (SVN) version of flake, the blocksize defaults to no more than 4608 (the same as libflac) for all compression levels, so all seems good there.
13:45:51preglowlinuxstb_: excellent
13:46:21jhMikeSpreglow: as soon as I get a chance to do it up. I suppose I'll add it to dsp_cf.S and add #define DSP_HAVE_ASM_RESAMPLING to dsp_asm.h. The parameter order will allow easy use of movem.l <= tell me if that's bad for arm
13:47:20pregloweasy use of movem.l almost always translates to easy use of ldmia on arm, so go ahead
13:47:35preglowand arm has no address/data register concept
13:47:42preglowso the order shouldn't matter
13:48:01jhMikeSwell, then I'll jsut group it best for coldfire
13:50:41linuxstb_With my first test file, "flac -8" took 25 seconds to compress, "flake -9" took 6.3 seconds, and the flake file is very slightly smaller (but negligible)....
13:51:26 Quit fejfighter ()
13:54:01GodEater_that's fairly impressive
13:54:05 Part Llorean
13:54:38SirFunkhmm.. what's flake?
13:54:43GodEater_a flac compressor
13:55:01SirFunkhmm.. the output is readable by flac decoders?
13:55:12GodEater_I imagine that's the idea...
13:55:12linuxstb_Of course, it wouldn't be flac encoder otherwise.
13:55:17Mikachuthat is sort of the definition of a flac encoder
13:55:22SirFunkyeah yah :-P
13:55:30jhMikeScan this lead to flac_enc.codec or not fast enough for that/
13:55:39linuxstb_It uses floating point...
13:55:45SirFunki wonder how it compares to wavpack
13:55:48GodEater_that answers that then
13:55:48preglowlinuxstb_: throughout?
13:55:59linuxstb_Just in parts I think.
13:56:07preglowordinary flac also uses some floating point, afaik
13:56:32SirFunki think from my tests flac tended to be smaller than wavpack but it took way longer to compress.. maybe flake will fix that
13:56:33linuxstb_"svn co flake-enc" will get you the source
13:57:00Mikachuare they still doing main development there, or in ffmpeg?
13:57:27 Part Teknomancer
13:57:36linuxstb_I don't know, but I certainly hope the standalone encoder remains.
13:57:56preglowbut anyway
13:58:06preglowlibflac performing badly just doesn't surprise me
13:58:13preglowit's one of the worst pieces of c i have seen
13:58:20Mikachuit's just a reference implementation
13:58:28preglowstill doesn't forgive the way it's written
13:58:29linuxstb_Last update was on 27th January 2007, so it seems active.
13:58:33jhMikeSc = chit?
14:00:30linuxstb_preglow: But it worked - i.e. FLAC became the de-facto lossless compression standard. In its defence, the library and API are well-documented and easy to incorporate into players.
14:01:39preglowlinuxstb_: i don't really see the heavy-handed way that library has written as any part in that
14:01:40linuxstb_Someone should release the ffmpeg flac decoder as a companion standalone decoder to flake though...
14:02:21preglowif they'd written it in the style of the ffmpeg decoder, nothing much would have changed
14:02:28preglowit would still be a popular format
14:03:08Mikachulinuxstb_: iiuc they changed the api incompatibly in 1.1.3
14:06:34linuxstb_That would surprise me if it was the case. But still, we don't use it, so we're happy.
14:07:00Mikachui remember seeing some swearing in the commit logs of some audio players
14:10:10preglowi think that's an effect you see often when observing people dealing with that library
14:10:15linuxstb_preglow: Looking at flake, floating point seems to only be used internally within the lpc.c file (in the functions labeled static).
14:10:31preglowi'm still not the same guy i was
14:10:50preglowlinuxstb_: yeah, i expected that
14:11:13preglowlinuxstb_: i don't think i would have dared doing that in a lossless encoder, but i guess he knows what he's doing
14:14:08linuxstb_BTW, wavpack (the default options) takes 3.6 seconds to decode the same file "flake -9" took 6.3 seconds for....
14:14:23linuxstb_(and FLAC 25 seconds)
14:14:56preglowi'm using wavpack myself
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14:15:15preglowonly thing i miss with it is the possibility to decode from/to cue points in a single file
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14:15:27linuxstb_But flake default is 2.1 seconds to encode...
14:17:10linuxstb_In my 25MB (when compressed) file, wavpack default is about 150,000 bytes smaller than flake default.
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14:30:03linuxstb_preglow: Maybe Mr Bryant would add that for you...
14:30:18preglowlinuxstb_: i'm thinking of asking...
14:30:35preglowon second thought, i'd also like support for reading raw files
14:30:49preglowwhich selectable endianness
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14:32:10linuxstb_I can't imagine decoding to/from cue points would be hard to implement though.
14:33:11preglowyou'd need a cue parser
14:33:24preglowand i've discovered i truly, truly hate writing those
14:33:33preglowprobably because i don't really know how to do it well
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14:33:42preglownot without using yacc, anyway
14:33:44Mikachudon't you have one of those already?
14:33:58preglowprobably plenty :>
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14:34:04Mikachui maen in rockbox
14:34:47preglowthat's gpl code, though, how would that sit in a bsd project?
14:35:05Mikachuaren't they compatible?
14:35:22linuxstb_Only in one direction...
14:35:24preglowwell bsd allows you to not release sources, gpl does
14:35:26preglowso no
14:35:35preglows/allows/doesn't require you to/
14:35:57linuxstb_I thought you just meant something like flac's "−−skip" and "−−until" options.
14:36:24preglowlinuxstb_: i mean it's −−cue option
14:37:21 Part LinusN
14:37:40linuxstb_Ah, so you mean the ability to embed a cuesheet and then extract one track based on that cuesheet?
14:39:21preglowit's really just for an easy cd archival thing i've got going
14:39:51preglowi rip as one big bin/toc, then encode to lossless with embedded cue, and then have a script that can transcode automatically to whatever i want based on that combo
14:40:04preglowi'm tired of ripping cds...
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14:41:48preglowi could just decode to wav, then split that wav, then encode, but i'd rather not
14:44:48pixelmaoh cool... when I want to start chopper, I get a "I09: CPUAdrEr at 091F91F8" - only rolo'ed in though and it worked in the sim...
14:45:27preglowhow nice
14:46:39reacendafter pluggin in the ipod with menu haven hold down, the ipaq plays 10 seconds and then it poweroff
14:47:06pixelmanot when I start the plugin but when choosing "start new game" in the menu
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14:48:37reacendany help?
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14:49:30markunreacend: you try to connect your ipod to a ipaq?
14:50:07reacendi mean
14:50:18reacendi got also an ipaq right here
14:50:50amiconnAddress error... 'nice' :/
14:51:33preglowman, i love the size table
14:52:05*markun too
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14:52:42markungood day B4gder
14:52:49B4gderhey ho
14:53:26reacendmarkun: any help?
14:53:54markunreacend: no idea
14:54:22markunI thought maybe menu is also the shutdown button on the ipods, but it isn't..
14:55:45*linuxstb_ knew he would regret committing chopper...
14:55:56reacendhow long does it take to charge a ipod?
14:56:06Shaid2 to 4 hours
14:56:08Shaidfor a 4th gen
14:57:11 Quit himitsu (Read error: 111 (Connection refused))
14:57:21Shaidabout the same, really
14:57:37ShaidI usually leave it overnight.
14:57:56Shaidthough take into account I'm using the firewire wallcharger.
14:58:08reacendohh fuck, i have to search for my sennheiser headset
14:58:21Shaidthose aren't small usually.
14:58:36reacendtommorow is motorbike time with rockbox ;)
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14:59:47linuxstb_pixelma: So you are always getting that error with chopper when attempting to start a game?
15:00:39pixelmayep... for once it wos an IllInstr though when I set another level before (but that's not reproducable)
15:01:32pixelmaa different thing (probably because of the menu icons thing) the "Rockbox Info" screen is shifted to the right
15:02:09 Quit tvelocity ("Αποχώρησε")
15:02:32pixelmaalso the "Runtime" screen
15:02:51amiconnThe address error happens in xlcd_filltriangle...
15:05:36linuxstb_No idea if this is the bug you're seeing, but the chopAddParticle function looks broken - that looks like it should be checking NUMBER_OF_PARTICLES in the if(), not NUMBER_OF_BLOCKS.
15:05:54*linuxstb_ pings Paprica
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15:14:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:18:54pixelmawhen I switch off the icons, the two screens are shifted not that far to the right (only the dimension of the scrollbar I suppose though there is none).
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15:19:08Shaidnew port testing?
15:19:58BigBambiSpeaking of chopper bugs: on the H1x0, when you die the screen freezes. Pressing navi takes you to where the menu should be, but there is nothing on screen. However, the menu is still there, for if you press down the correct number of times the menu item that would be hilighted is selected
15:21:20preglowstarting to sound like quite a game, this
15:21:48BigBambiIt is good fun to play!
15:21:59B4gderyou just need to make sure you don't die
15:22:25BigBambilol, yeah :) Sadly I'm not yet good enough that that works
15:22:57GodEater_best I've managed is a distance of 2771
15:23:06BigBambi16xx for me :(
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15:23:10GodEater_it start's getting too fast for me after that
15:23:30GodEater_I've got to stop with the pointless apostrophes
15:23:33ShaidI think you have no choice but to die eventually.
15:23:41BigBambiI clearly need to practice - yet another thing to distract from work
15:23:57BigBambiShaid: very profound
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15:32:34pixelmagot the IllInstr with chopper again... "I04: IllInstr at 00000404" if that helps
15:33:43linuxstb_pixelma: Can you try changing line 382 of chopper.c to read NUMBER_OF_PARTICLES instead of NUMBER_OF_BLOCKS ?
15:34:36pixelmaI will try
15:36:25linuxstb_BigBambi: That sounds like a colour problem (as he isn't here, I can try and blame midkay's changes for that...)
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15:37:19BigBambilinuxstb_, colour in what way? Conversion from original colour to greyscale?
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15:37:57linuxstb_BigBambi: As in, for greyscale targets, the colours aren't being reset correctly before the menu is drawn.
15:38:25BigBambiI did compile chopper when it was a patch and didn't have any problems, but it was using its own menu then
15:38:39pixelmabtw. about midkay's changes: The "game over, press x to continue" doesn't fit on Archos screens. If it was a real splash it could I think (because it could take up two lines I thought)
15:38:47 Part kaaloo
15:39:02pixelma(as seen in the sim)
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15:39:22BigBambiPixelma - so I guess that splash isn't being displayed on the H1x0 when I thought the screen had frozen. Presing navi is OK
15:39:24Mikachumaybe the text ingame shouldn't be drawn in black, as the background is also black
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15:44:24pixelmalinuxstb_: changing that line didn't help
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15:56:27pixelmaBigBambi: sounds likely or maybe you just can't see it - as Mikachu's find implies (?) - I guess it would read "press 'Navi' to continue" anyways
15:57:02BigBambiYes, I suspect that too - it seems tied in with the drawing problems of the menu
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16:08:47*Domonoky updated his patch to rbUtil again, now fwpatcher is completly assimilated and compiling on Unix schould be easier
16:11:38linuxstb_Nice. I should have time this evening to try it out. Do you think it's ready for committing yet, or are you still working on it?
16:19:22DomonokyBootloader support for H10 is still missing, and it needs testing for targets other than ipod and h1x0
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16:25:12Domonokyfor gigabeat, is the newest bootloader on ? (and there is no bootsplash.raw on is this needed ??
16:27:37directhex|workattachment on is newer
16:28:17linuxstb_Domonoky: How big is the Windows executable for rbutil now?
16:29:07Domonokywith compression (i think ucl ) its 2.604 KB ..
16:29:36Domonokyso dont try rbUtil on Gigabeat. :-)
16:29:51Domonokyit will install the older loader.. (and no bootsplash ) :-)
16:34:03linuxstb_rbutil is going to be a bandwidth hog if it becomes the standard way to install Rockbox...
16:35:29Soapor I can directly mirror it - perhaps Bagder could set up a rotating mirror link.
16:36:02B4gderwe can use a round robin dns
16:36:15B4gderlike with
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16:37:28SoapI have a couple hundreg GB of unused monthly tranfser allowance.
16:37:33Soaphundred even
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16:39:49linuxstb_I also think rbutil needs a better name...
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16:40:29DomonokyrockUtil :-)
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16:47:03GodEater_at the risk of sounding boring, I think "Rockbox installer" is probably best
16:47:49SoapGodEater_, if you said "Rockbox iNstaller" you would have my vote.
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16:48:49Domonokyhm, and if it does in the future more than installing ? (database generation has been suggested)
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16:49:00GodEater_why the capitalised N ?
16:49:11Mikachuan iPun
16:49:15thegeeklinusN ?
16:49:16l33chhi all :) is kernel_on_cop_8.diff working good for you ? target is H10 :)
16:49:18GodEater_ah - I'm so slow today
16:49:31thegeekDoes anyone know if linusn has made any progress on the fat code (for the 80gb) ?
16:49:41GodEater_read the forums thegeek
16:49:48thegeekI do
16:50:03GodEater_well then you know what progress he's made
16:50:08SoapHe answered that quesiton himself within the last 12 hours.
16:50:09linuxstb_Domonoky: support could be useful for some people
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16:50:44Domonoky:-), so Rockbox Installer isnt a good name..
16:50:45*GodEater_ hopes his cheeky response to LinusN's statement on the matter is taken in good humour
16:51:24thegeekoh yes;P
16:51:33directhex|workit sounds like some kind of generic rockbox utility. the name needs to relfect that. and lower case letters are cool. i propose "rbutil"!
16:51:34thegeekI know the question is not the "best"
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17:36:10Dunkelschubis there a reason rockbox isn't picking my ID tags on my mp3 files?
17:36:16 Quit redbreva (Client Quit)
17:43:54pixelmaWhat build and target you are using? And do you mean it is not showing the tags in the WPS or when building the database (and/or showing them in database view)?
17:45:37Dunkelschub2007-02-16, Gigabeat F40, it's not picking up the song or artist name in the WPS
17:46:11Soapare you sure you have ID3 tags and not APE?
17:48:13DunkelschubI think the tags are just bad, I uploaded some other songs and they work fine
17:48:27Dunkelschubthanks anyway
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17:51:05directhex|worki have no tag issues on my real gigabeat, so it's probably a files issue
17:51:12TnadenHi, can i make a suggestion for a future release? (or am i just too stupid to realise that i allready have this functionality)
17:51:55Mikachugo ahead
17:51:59TnadenWhen playing a playlist, and pressing the select button, is it possible to go back to the original playlist
17:52:15Tnadenif you shuffle a dir the battery consumtion is huge
17:52:25Mikachuif you saved it first
17:52:36Tnadeni mean..
17:52:59Tnaden if i open (and have the shuffle function on) the whole list is shuffled
17:53:20Tnadenso when i press select all songs are in a complete mess :P
17:53:43Tnadenif I open a playlist*
17:54:17Mikachuare you suggesting the shuffle option shouldn't enable shuffle?
17:54:26Tnadenno not at all :P
17:54:28Soapas in a .m3u playlist already on your player in file form?
17:54:37Tnadenyeah a m3u file
17:54:53Soapthen turn off shuffle and reload the playlist, or am I still missing something.
17:55:03Tnaden sort of :P
17:55:20Tnadeni used to have a creative zen mirco
17:55:55Tnaden if you loaded a playlist and enabled shuffle, you still could view the original playlist and choose songs if you wanted too
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17:56:59Soapahh, but that is where the winamp paradigm and rockbox one differ.
17:57:10Tnadenif you didn't it would shuffle away.. if you did, it would keep shuffling after that song was played..
17:57:12Tnaden oh?
17:57:35SoapRockbox works off of playlists.
17:57:37Tnadenso should i make a playlist via the rockbox os?
17:57:59SoapWhen you open a playlist in shuffle mode, it creates (doesn't save) a new, shuffled, playlist.
17:58:39 Join XavierGr [0] (
17:59:07SoapSee, Winamp doesn't need to worry about filling a playback buffer like rockbox does. PC hard drives are faster, and there not the need to worry about conserving every precious drop of battery juice as there is in an embedded project like Rockbox.
18:00:27SoapSo rockbox is, even in shuffle mode, pre-loading a playlist's contents into RAM...
18:00:31Tnadenso i cant shuffle a playlist and when i view it see it in the same order as it originally was?
18:00:48Soapnot to the best of my knowledge.
18:01:17Tnadenthat can only be done if i shuffle a dir atm..
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18:01:43Tnadenand if i do that i'm tecnically not viewing the playlist..
18:02:10Tnaden just choosing wich song the new playlist should start with.
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18:02:39 Quit ericthefish ()
18:03:01Tnaden>< it works but is very battery consuming, even if i don't choose new songs and just leave the shuffle on
18:03:51Soapwhat is very battery consuming?
18:04:41Tnadento go into a dir and choose a song, forcing rockbox to create a new playlist (containg that dir) and shuffle it
18:05:22Soapyea, that would do it.
18:05:23Tnadenbah, i gotta go... thx anyway ;)
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18:23:10preglowanyone else think the default lowshelf eq cutoff freq is a bit low?
18:24:21preglowand the highshelf one might be a bit high too
18:24:23perl|worknew iriver offering
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18:33:00xamoxanyone ever just get a blank screen with rockbox?
18:33:14xamoxI tried pluggin it in via USB but isn't doing anything
18:33:33xamoxanyway I can reset it?
18:33:50Mikachuyou want to mention what device you have
18:33:59xamox1st gen
18:34:13Mikachumenu+select then
18:34:29xamoxahh, awesome, thx
18:34:32xamoxthat fixed it
18:34:45xamoxMikachu, ^^^
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18:42:56perl|workamusing thread
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19:14:09***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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19:17:01*preglow discovers wxmaxima
19:22:47*Soap googles wxmaxima
19:27:16preglowbAM, finally solved the bloody filters for good
19:27:22preglowtime for a couple of bitters
19:27:33GodEaterpint of ?
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20:55:16Redboy1Anyone here?
20:55:25Dunkelschubwhat do you need?
20:57:16Redboy1I just installed Rockbox bootloader. Now my ipod boots to the "rockbox boot loader Version: blah blah" screen and goes no further.
20:57:28Redboy1Rebooting the ipod has no effect.
20:57:40nlsRedboy1: which ipod?
20:58:12peturdid you also unzip the latest rockbox build onto it?
20:58:44Redboy1I can't access the ipod from the pc at all now...
20:58:57Redboy1When I do ipodpatcher −− scan it sees nothing.
20:59:31Soapno error message on your ipod's screen when you boot?
21:00:57Redboy1Yes...80 GB
21:01:06Redboy1I can type whole message:
21:01:10nlsRedboy1: It is NOT supported
21:01:17Redboy1Rockbox boot loader
21:01:25nlsRedboy1: follow the uninstall instructions
21:01:34nlsor use itunes to restore it
21:01:37peturdidn't you read the page where you got ipodpatcher?
21:01:49Redboy1IPOD version: 0xFFFFFFFF
21:02:00Redboy1TOSHIBA MD8010GH
21:02:14Redboy1I tried...I can't connect w/ ipod from PC any more...
21:02:21Redboy1That's the problem, or I would have uninstalled.
21:02:33hcsuse disk mode, hold select and menu while booting
21:02:37Soapmenu+select to reboot
21:02:56Soapas soon as it reboots (apple logo) select+play to force disk mode.
21:02:59hcserm, sorry, select and play
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21:03:26Redboy1I get the apple for like 1/4 second, but I'll try.
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21:03:48Redboy1Ah...that seems to be working.
21:04:19Redboy1Now...can I salvage the install somehow, or should I just remove it?
21:04:30nlsRedboy1: NOT supported
21:04:46nlsiow remove it
21:05:00nlsit being the bootloader
21:05:10Redboy1Oh...5.5G not supported? ...or just 80GB not supported...?
21:05:24Soapjust the 80GB drive
21:05:39nls80GB not supported, as the frontpage manual and install instructions in the wiki says ...
21:05:44Redboy1So I have to wait anyway, regardless, until Rockbox supports mine...?
21:05:54 Quit bonbonthejon ("Konversation terminated!")
21:05:58Redboy1I thought I read bad
21:06:35Soap(when Rockbox says "not supported" they mean it doesn't work) (when IPL says "not supported" they mean - "eh, it may work, but don't ask for help")
21:07:57nlsmaybe we should change the frontpage to explicitly say that it "will not work" instead of "not supported"
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21:09:46Redboy1Well...on the linux page I was reading that, although the 5.5G is "unsupported", there are various folks who have used it successfully and like it.
21:09:47peturand put <H1></H1> around it ;)
21:10:25Redboy1I lumped Rockbox into the same category, and figured if it doesn't work then it just won't work.
21:10:38peturand it didn't ;)
21:10:56Redboy1Didn't realize it would hang altogether... and then couldn't find those book-key combinations
21:11:10Redboy1I appreciate your help...and will wait for the release that supports mine I guess.
21:11:43DunkelschubI remember doing that for the Gigabeat
21:11:47Redboy1Anyhow...thanks for the information.
21:11:55Redboy1I really do appreciate it.
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21:18:08Redboy1I've got the original firmware running again and successfully removed Rockbox. Thanks for your help.
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21:22:42 Quit desowin ("use linux")
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21:28:35blacknesswhats the best way to dissect a dock cable?
21:29:39blacknessfor the ipod that is.
21:30:02hcsmine sort of dissects itself from overuse...
21:33:33Soapblackness: are you planning on making your own dongle out of an existing cable?
21:33:52blacknessyeah I have one cable with one side of it alreadly loose cuz its old, I just wanted to be able to put it back together
21:34:08Soaphow are your soldering skills?
21:34:51blacknessthey are alright...
21:34:57blacknessalright i'm lying
21:35:19blacknessi'm trying to make a line in with a 3.5mm jack
21:35:27 Join |Rincewind| [0] (
21:35:57SoapI dig, but I really think you should consider buying "naked" connectors from the ipodlinux group buy.
21:36:16SoapThey are cheap, delivered quickly, and you can get a larger one with more room in which to work.
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21:41:19blacknessis it really bad?
21:42:37Soapit's tight in there.
21:43:02Soapat least look at the ipodlinux wiki page on the dock connector.
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21:46:57blacknesswell I already broke this one I have
21:47:30blacknessI just wish I had a good tut on making the thing
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21:49:38SoapIf you have any specific questions, I can probably answer them.
21:50:01blacknesswhat pins exactly do I have to solder for the line in
21:50:26Soapnow that is something you can get from the Ipodlinux dock connector wiki page.
21:51:16 Quit Mouser_X (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:51:24SoapI'll gladly help (though we should do it PM) but I'm not going to do your reading for you.
21:53:53kopfanyone here use foobar2000 and rockbox and
21:54:15kopfi'm having some troubles -
21:54:28kopftracks aren't submitting from foo_audioscrobbler any more :<
21:55:00Soapthis is strictly a rockbox channel, if you want to discuss off topic, yet still rockbox themed stuff #rockbox-community is a better place.
21:55:39kopfok :<
21:56:03blacknesshow do I remove the metal casing
21:56:55Soapblackness: same with you - this should be in PM or #rockbox-community.
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22:37:42barrywardellif I'm setting the props on a svn file, do I just do 'svn propset svn:keywords Id [filename]'?
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23:21:05Bagder28 growth points to barrywardell ;-)
23:21:36 Part perl|work
23:21:49barrywardellbut I did add a new function, so it's not so bad :)
23:22:14Bagderindeed, and the sensitive platforms were unaffected
23:22:15pixelmabesides the red for Ipod3g ;)
23:22:49Bagdertricky with *two* tables to check now ;-)
23:23:10barrywardellyeah, I'm fixing the red now
23:23:12Mikachuwhen there's a build error, do you compare to the size before that?
23:23:15 Quit |Rincewind| ("Cya")
23:23:19BagderMikachu: yes
23:23:35Mikachuoh that has already happened, i didn't notice that first
23:23:45preglowbarrywardell: so the usb parts in the ipods are switched off and powered down? :/
23:24:21Mikachuif you connect two rockboxed ipods, does the client try to charge from the host then?
23:24:44Mikachui didn't think that through all the way
23:24:48barrywardellpreglow: I'm still not sure if they're powered down
23:24:55preglowor more importantly, if you connect a rockboxed ipod to a retailos ipod, will rockbox leech off the other as far as it can?!!
23:25:35SoapRockbox is a parasite?
23:25:50barrywardellthere seem to be some differences related to power setting between the driver I have as a reference and what's in the PP chip
23:26:01Mikachutechnically, yes :) you install it in a host and it lives there, drawing power from it
23:26:05barrywardellpreglow: haha. that would be interesting
23:26:28preglowbarrywardell: so it's not a perfect match after all?
23:26:56barrywardellalmost perect. I think it's just the transceiver that is different. But I'm not even sure about that
23:27:31 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:30:16pixelmaumm.. linuxstb__: is it wise to point the guy in the forums to the install instructions - he seems to have a 80GB Ipod... ?
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23:32:59preglowat least we'll find out if he's good at reading
23:33:48Mikachumaybe by the time he manages to install it, linusn will have nailed the fat driver
23:34:51preglowand here's me warning everyone not to let those two in the same room together
23:35:26*preglow kicks fixed point
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