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#rockbox log for 2007-04-21

00:00:06 Join oKtosiTe [0] (
00:00:36Bagderthe recv1 is gonna get a nice red +80000 bytes ;-)
00:00:50LloreanNow someone trigger a build without size change. :-P
00:00:53 Join Br3nda [0] (
00:02:59 Part toffe82
00:08:05 Quit kkurbjun ("Leaving.")
00:09:43 Quit amiconn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:09:43 Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
00:11:34 Join AnRkey [0] (
00:11:38BagderI think I'll try to add an option to mark servers as slow-network
00:11:47AnRkeyhi all
00:11:51Bagderto avoid copying the zips from them
00:12:21AnRkeyi have installed rockbox on my h10 and it's seems to be working fine. How do i upload files to the device in windows now?
00:12:32AnRkeymusic files
00:12:37preglowBagder: to avoid copying zips? don't you have to do that?
00:12:55Bagderwell, I mean to make the one with faster nets do those builds
00:13:11BagderI just saw one server take 46 seconds on getting a zip copied
00:13:28preglowthere are builds with no zips?
00:13:39Bagderyeah, they're 19 zips and 59 builds or so
00:13:40TrueJournalsAnRkey: Plug in the usb cable, and while booting up, hold "O". This will make it act like a hard drive. Then, simply drag and drop
00:13:42 Part TrueJournals
00:13:44preglowah, of courswe
00:13:46preglowforget me
00:13:58preglownow THERE's a size delta, yes
00:14:06AnRkeyis there a way to make it always use ums?
00:14:19preglowBagder: will the random varying deltas vanish too now?
00:14:34Bagderthey seem to be real
00:14:52BagderI mean, different servers produce them with slightly different sizes
00:16:13 Quit davina ("byeeeeee!")
00:16:35 Join Hammer89 [0] (
00:19:15AnRkeyThanks so much for rockbox, finally i can ditch using windows for my h10, you guys rock!!!!
00:25:08 Join TrueJournals [0] (
00:25:25preglowso i hear
00:25:30preglowi'm inclined to agree myself
00:26:29 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
00:26:44AnRkeyis rockbox 2.5 debian 4?
00:27:04AnRkeywell what os is it?
00:27:12AnRkeysorry for the newb question
00:27:17Domonoky_rockbox Os :-)
00:27:18markunrockbox is the OS
00:27:32AnRkeywhat is it based on?
00:27:38preglowrockbox is rockbox
00:27:40preglowwritten from scratch
00:27:41Domonoky_scratch :-)
00:27:44preglowit's not linux, that's for sure
00:27:53markunnot DOS either
00:27:58pixelmaand rockbox 2.5 doesn't exist for H10 ;)
00:28:20preglowwhich reminds me, someone should talk about releases on devcon :>
00:28:34linuxstb_Yes, talk of releases is always fun
00:28:40Lloreanpreglow: That's why I wish I could go. I'd bring the whips and prods.
00:28:46 Quit Redbreva ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
00:28:57preglowLlorean: oh, but you can, it just requires you to use tons of money and lose some sleep
00:29:03AnRkeyfrom rockbox-info.txt
00:29:04AnRkeyld: GNU ld version 2.16.1Host gcc: gcc (GCC) 4.1.2 20061115 (prerelease) (Debian 4.1.1-21)Host system: Linux
00:29:10LloreanThe sleep's no big deal, the money's the problem.
00:29:21preglowas always
00:29:23*preglow curses money
00:29:29LloreanI'll be there next year though.
00:29:30preglowAnRkey: yes, it's built on debian, hooray
00:29:35pixelmapreglow: well rockbox 2.5 was released in 2005 - does that mean 3.0 is scheduled for 3000 ? :P
00:29:42LloreanAnRkey: That just means it was compiled on a debian system.
00:29:48AnRkeysheesh why so agro
00:29:51preglowLlorean: i'll force them to speak with me about the date in advance next year, so i will too...
00:29:55linuxstb_pixelma: Sounds optimistic...
00:29:59Lloreanpreglow: That would be good.
00:30:02AnRkeythanks for the help with the file transfers
00:30:11preglowthat's two years in a row, now, they've picked lousy dates
00:30:12markunbye bye
00:30:20markunAnRkey: have fun
00:30:20SoapDefault theme (I agree) shouldn't be a feature showcase, but it would be fun to ship one theme which packs more info onto a screen than is humanly tolerable.
00:30:27preglowpixelma: i think so!
00:30:34 Part AnRkey
00:30:37LloreanAs far as a release goes, I think the most important thing is setting goals for pre-freeze. Instead of what we need to be working on during the freeze, a checklist of things that we want done so that we *can* freeze.
00:31:04LloreanSoap: It should be shiny enough that people don't go "eww" when they compare it to their original firmware, though.
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00:31:18preglowi can't think of much, really
00:31:23preglowwma and album art would b nice
00:31:33preglowshinier aac support
00:31:36LloreanWell, the big problem last time is that we had features to add during the freeze.
00:31:47preglowLlorean: we did?
00:31:49LloreanTagcache and the playback rewrite, notably
00:31:54webguest90hey can rockbox play videos on the 5th gen ipod video
00:31:59LloreanBoth of which were impossible to predict how long they would take.
00:32:03preglowah, yeah, but the last really does count as bugfixing, afaik
00:32:07Soapis HC AAC a problem because it's just that processor hungry - or is it lack of work?
00:32:08LloreanThe freeze shouldn't have happened until both of those were done.
00:32:17preglowLlorean: we'll have that problem now too, with the playbackj
00:32:22LloreanYeah, the playback rewrite was a bugfix, but it was also too big to go in a freeze with a release date.
00:32:23linuxstb_webguest90: It tries... But you're better off using the Apple firmware on the video ipod.
00:32:27preglowthat's for sure
00:32:27webguest90'Can Rock Box play videos on the 5th gen Ipod
00:32:39webguest90Ok Thank You
00:32:40LloreanSoap: Processor hungry
00:32:49Soap(and when I say "lack of work" I in no way, shape, or form, am saying "get on it you lazy bums!")
00:33:10 Quit webguest90 (Client Quit)
00:34:17preglowstop bringing that decoder up!!
00:34:20preglowi want to use it :>
00:34:43Lloreanpreglow: Basically, before a feature freeze, we need to know what's getting left out of the build (AAC?) so that time isn't spent working on it, and we need to know what needs to be fixed *before* the freeze can start (voice?)
00:34:44 Quit PaulJam (".")
00:35:08LloreanAnd we need some way to keep people from going into hiding. ;)
00:35:20LloreanIs Helix's license the problem?
00:35:50preglowthe going into hiding part is why loads of feature freezes never work, heh
00:36:24LloreanEspecially with all the unsupported builds that "publish" any patches / features anyway
00:36:24preglowoh, rombox will also need to work first :>
00:46:05 Part TrueJournals
00:47:01 Quit idnar (Nick collision from services.)
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00:50:08linuxstb_Bagder: Is this bug still open?
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00:56:23 Quit midgey ()
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00:56:37 Quit ender` (" Going to church does not make a person religious, nor does going to school make a person educated, any more than going to a )
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01:13:48cubekidis anyone on right now?
01:13:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:14:03Hammer89Probably :)
01:14:14cubekidi have a question
01:14:26cubekidwhich i was hoping someone could help me answer
01:14:33Hammer89I probably wont be able to help... I'm pretty new to this myself ;)
01:14:51cubekidwell, anyways
01:15:04cubekidthe problem is that i can't find this gbsystem folder
01:15:07cubekidand for some reason
01:15:23linuxstb_You need to enable viewing of both hidden and system files/folders.
01:15:32cubekidwindows explorer doesn't show my gigabeat as a drive (i.e. like X:\ or something)
01:15:35cubekidi did that
01:15:38 Quit Thundercloud_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:15:52linuxstb_Which gigabeat do you have?
01:16:32cubekidit shows my gigabeat as My Computer\TOSHIBA gigabeat
01:16:35cubekidit's really weird
01:17:05Soapwhich version of windows?
01:17:10cubekidxp sp2
01:17:11linuxstb_That sounds like MTP mode...
01:17:18linuxstb_Are you using the cradle?
01:17:19cubekidyea... is there a way to disable that?
01:17:26cubekidshould i not?
01:17:40linuxstb_The wiki says " Notice: Do not use the cradle and USB cable, just the USB Cable."
01:18:10linuxstb_It doesn't say why though...
01:18:27cubekidi don
01:18:34 Quit charkins ("Ex-Chat")
01:18:41cubekid*i can't believe i didn't try that
01:18:46Soapmanual does not mention the cradle problem.
01:19:08linuxstb_I wouldn't have thought to try that - my cradle is still in the box...
01:19:08cubekidyea the manual didn't seem to mention anything about the cradle
01:19:34linuxstb_Did that fix it?
01:19:37Soapthe cradle is too tight a fit, can't use even the thinest of silicone cases.
01:19:48cubekidbut its soo coooll.....
01:20:02cubekidmaybe its just me
01:20:17cubekidthis is the first big mp3 player ive had
01:20:26cubekidbesides the creative nomad jukebox
01:20:36cubekidwhich is more like a brick than an mp3 player
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01:27:44cubekidwhere do you get cases for the gigabeat?
01:27:57 Quit moos (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:29:58 Quit cubekid ("CGI:IRC")
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01:30:24Hammer89A google search might help you figure that out ;)
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01:34:56cubekidhm, doesn't seem to be working
01:35:07cubekidare there supposed to be other FWIMG files?
01:35:39linuxstb_Yes, leave those alone.
01:38:38 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
01:40:24 Join entheh [0] (
01:40:29cubekidso i downloaded the build, unzipped it, copied it over, downloaded the FWIMG.DAT from the website, renamed the existing one, copied the downloaded one into the folder
01:40:35cubekidwhat am i missing?
01:42:21linuxstb_Turning the battery switch off and on?
01:45:53 Join capo [0] (
01:48:07 Quit Alonea (Remote closed the connection)
01:48:21cubekidim getting a rockbox error: -2
01:51:06cubekidsweet! it's working
01:51:40cubekidthough it's kinda ugly and small right now
01:52:26 Join Alonea [0] (
01:52:31cubekidawesome, thanks a bunch guys
01:52:41cubekidsorry for all my stupid quesitons
01:52:41linuxstb_Just go to Settings->Browse Themes
01:53:11 Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
01:57:40cubekidis there a specific theme you guys like?
01:59:37midkay"you guys"? well, there's 133 people in here.. i don't think we've all settled on one theme we all enjoy.. :) pick one you like.
02:00:34cubekidwell does anyone have a favorite that they'd like to share?
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02:22:27 Quit moos ("Glory to Rockbox")
02:24:22 Quit capo ()
02:24:34 Quit cubekid ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
02:27:13 Quit robin0800 (" Like's GUI? Then try HydraIRC -> <-")
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02:50:15*BHSPitMonkey uses the zelda theme
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03:13:59***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:15:57 Part pixelma
03:21:02 Quit mr_pink ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
03:36:26Hammer89are plugins supposed to work on the UIsimulator?
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03:55:36Feral_KidWell, got rockbox working nicely with my 4G, and finally figured out how to get amarok transferring files... But, am I stuck with those ridiculous files names that itunes seems to create?
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05:14:00***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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05:34:07Soapdo you also want to use the Apple Firmware, Feral_Kid ?
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06:51:30amiconnkkurbjun: You shouldn't need to include s3c2440.h explicitly
06:51:58amiconnMaybe it's missing for the gigabeat cpu, but a simple #include "cpu.h" should include the cpu specific one
06:53:09 Join neoAKiRAz [0] (
06:53:13kkurbjunI think it works to just inlcude cpu.h for the gigabeat as well. Which file in particular were you referring to?
06:53:35kkurbjunoh, yep, I'll fix that
06:53:44kkurbjunthanks for the pointer
06:54:00*amiconn would think debug-menu.c would already include cpu.h
06:54:07amiconnExecept for the sim that is
06:55:43amiconnHmm, it doesn't...
06:57:37*amiconn notices the gigabeat built has its logo back :)
06:57:43amiconnOn boot that is
06:58:08kkurbjunyep, I prefer the builtin logo to all that bootsplash stuff
06:59:09*amiconn too
07:00:43amiconnkkurbjun: A bit of yellow...
07:01:11kkurbjunyep, I saw that, forgot to pull that variable out before I committed it.
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07:10:35neoAKiRAzi've posted a screenshot of a WPS I made for Sansa... if anybody wants to check it out:
07:14:04***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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07:15:20BHSPitMonkeyare images just hidden from guests I presume
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07:56:32kkurbjunCan someone fix the Gigabeat bootloader link, I put the new on up there, but I don't know how to upload into the directory that has the "official" versions
07:56:51kkurbjunand when you click the links that I put in firefox treats them as text
07:57:03kkurbjun(or tell me how to fix it)
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08:02:04amiconnOnly Bagder, Zagor and LinusN can put things on
08:02:37kkurbjunahh, well, I guess it will have to wait then
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10:17:27pixelmaRedbreva: around?
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10:27:16Redbrevapixelma: you want me?
10:28:45pixelmaRedbreva: do I remember correctly that you admin
10:29:19 Quit preglow (
10:29:43NJoinpreglow [0] (
10:30:03pixelmajust browsing it and noticed that it has wrong info for the M5
10:30:38RedbrevaAhhh... What's wrong and I'll change it ASAP
10:30:47pixelmathe M5's sceen has the same specs as the H1x0s and Ipod4G greyscale - that's why you could link the same WPSs
10:31:07pixelmascreen too
10:31:20amiconnNot exactly - M5 and iPod G4 grayscale do have an RTC, H1x0 does not
10:31:35pixelmaok, but as a beginning :)
10:31:36amiconn(in case the wps uses rtc tags)
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10:35:44pixelmaRedbreva: thanks :)
10:39:44Redbrevaamiconn: I have placed a note at the top of the table to that effect now. I know no one will actualy read it, but it will at least be a reminder for me in the event of a query - Thanks ;-)
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10:50:42amiconnRedbreva: The same problem exists for Ondio<->Recorder, btw
10:55:26pixelmabtw. that's an interesting question wrt included WPSs - so far whether a .wps will be built for a certain target is only decided by screen resolution (that's in the name of the wps)
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11:01:10JdGordon... now just gotta get Slasheri to fix the thread locking stuff and we can have a green table again :)
11:03:52 Join ender` [0] (i=krneki@
11:05:00*linuxstb would have preferred the red to have stayed
11:06:29linuxstbSo we know it's broken...
11:06:47Bagderbut there's no fix in sight, it could just as well never happen
11:06:50linuxstbBut I can see the argument both ways....
11:07:15linuxstbI thought [IDC]Dragon's new bootbox was one fix on the horizon?
11:07:36Bagderhe recently said he wanted to redo it differently
11:08:04linuxstbYes, I realise that may be a long wait...
11:08:21Bagderalmost all targets have things that don't work, I don't think we need to make the table red to visualize that
11:09:09markunBagder: did you see the new Gigabeat bootloader?
11:09:27 Quit Br3nda (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
11:10:00linuxstbmarkun: Have you tested it yet?
11:10:23Bagdermarkun: that is proven fine and dandy to put on the dl site now?
11:10:47markunuh... no, I haven't :)
11:10:53linuxstbI don't know if that's true, but the latest Rockbox builds won't work without it....
11:11:00markunmaybe I shouldn't just take kkurbjun's work for it
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11:11:12*linuxstb is compiling a new build to test now
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11:11:42markunand I guess someone with a Gigabeat X also tested it for him as it's supposed to fix some X problems
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11:14:07***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:16:15linuxstbOK, it seems to be fine here.
11:17:50linuxstbI expect it will get complaints from people using the bootsplash though...
11:18:04 Join hiho [0] (
11:18:05markunof course :)
11:18:26markunwhy can't people just enjoy their music..
11:19:14markunlinuxstb: so you think that a custom bootsplash loaded from a normal bmp file at the start of rockbox will make them happy?
11:19:32 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
11:19:46linuxstbThat seems pointless - by the time we've loaded and displayed it, Rockbox would have finished initialising and gone to the startup screen...
11:19:48 Join Arathis [0] (
11:20:07linuxstbUnless we add a sleep(5*HZ).... :)
11:22:08linuxstbBagder: I would say the FWIMG01.DAT in the wiki is fine for The md5sum is 9a3716f549702ae9f77c1b0b3d6e1922
11:23:00*markun still doesn't fully understand how the various playlist insert and queue options are used is real life situations
11:23:22Bagderok, uploaded
11:23:31Bagderthe former one renamed with a date prepended
11:23:37Bagderjust in case
11:23:46Bagderdate appended even
11:25:08linuxstbThanks. I've added an entry to MajorChanges with a note saying users must upgrade.
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11:27:16*Bagder wanders away to play another game with his daughter
11:28:54Bagderthe games are bit weird, you never really understand the rules...
11:30:40linuxstbmarkun: Does the Gigabeat connect in MTP mode if you use the cradle?
11:31:00linuxstbI'm referring to the "do not use the cradle" notice in the version of the install instructions on the wiki.
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11:38:42markunlinuxstb: you can choose for either MTP or UMS mode when connecting to the player
11:38:52markunit's a setting in the menu of the OF
11:39:34linuxstbBut that's different for the cradle?
11:39:43markunthat's just for the cradle
11:39:43linuxstbi.e. connecting via a cable alone is always UMS?
11:39:54markunyes, very
11:40:28markunrockbox always uses UMS with the cradle of course
11:40:32linuxstbBTW, I've ordered an 80GB drive for my gigabeat, just waiting for it to be delivered now....
11:40:41markunhow much was it?
11:41:12linuxstbThe only place in the world I could find it was a US ebay shop - $225 IIRC, plus $27 postage to the UK.
11:41:33markunquite a lot
11:41:43markunI don't think I will upgrade any time soon
11:42:12linuxstbYes, not cheap, but I think I'll be switching to the gigabeat as my main player, so wanted the space.
11:42:37linuxstbNow I need to find a case...
11:43:36*amiconn has no fixed main player
11:43:40MonkeyTamerthey still got those zcovers for 10 dollars in some places... but they don't fit perfect for the bigger gigabeat
11:43:59linuxstbThere seems to be lots of F40s on ebay at the moment...
11:44:04amiconnBut 80GB in a gigabeat would make more sense if it had s/pdif (compared to H1x0)
11:44:58markunamiconn: we have access to the i2s signal on the dock connector, so we could add spdif in and out
11:45:01MonkeyTamergigabeats are very cheap for what you get... but still, left alone with their original firmware they aren't the greatest
11:45:14pixelmapff... how boring... everyone seems to be getting a gigabeat nowadays :P
11:45:15markunMonkeyTamer: really? :)
11:45:19amiconnWatching my recent usage habits, I tend to use H180, Player and Ondio most
11:45:25MonkeyTamerI love it with Rockbox
11:45:33MonkeyTamerbut the original OF is horrible
11:45:39MonkeyTamerer... typo there
11:45:40markunrockbox is just a bag of shit
11:45:50markunor at least it sounds like one
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11:46:42markunamiconn: so would a spdif mod to the cradle make you happy?
11:46:43amiconnH300 and X5 are interesting for checking out recent developments of mpegplayer, but not really for everyday use imho
11:47:12markunand replacing the coulour screen with grayscale of course
11:47:17amiconnmarkun: Nah, not really. The gigabeat will still keep its drawback of having a colour lcd
11:47:24markunhaha :)
11:48:36*MonkeyTamer isn't really sure what markun was talking about
11:48:38amiconnMaybe it sounds weird, but grayscale lcds being better for mobile devices than colour lcds is my serious opinion
11:49:05amiconn(unless _proper_ colour lcds like the ones in many Blackberry devices become common)
11:50:00amiconn(and except for PMPs of course - but I'm not interested in these)
11:50:06LloreanIs the newest bootloader at yet, or just the wiki, for Gigabeats?
11:50:27MonkeyTamerits on download now
11:50:27Lloreanamiconn: Because of being nearly unreadable without backlights?
11:50:35MonkeyTamerer download.rockbox
11:50:44linuxstbLlorean: It's at as well. I'll fix the wiki (unless you want to) ?
11:51:26MonkeyTamerI personally have had no problems with the new bootloader yet
11:51:42Lloreanlinuxstb: Actually, I was working my way through the forums, and saw mention of needing a new bootloader, and saw the commit message. I'm not sure where the wiki is wrong yet?
11:51:43amiconnLlorean: Yes. I want to be able to take a quick glance on the LCD, without first touching it in order to enable the backlight, or wasting battery by keeping the backlight on all the time
11:51:53Lloreanamiconn: Have you seen a 1st gen nano yet then?
11:52:02midkayamiconn: what's "proper" about blackberry LCDs versus all the others?
11:52:03LloreanWith a white backdrop set, they're as readable as my h100
11:52:08amiconnI have, for a short time at the last devcon
11:52:09linuxstbLlorean: The wiki is wrong because it contains the bootloader...
11:52:19Lloreanlinuxstb: Ah, just that it's there at all?
11:52:27amiconnmidkay: They are well readable without backlight, instead of being pitch black
11:53:18markunisn't that true for the ipod 4g colour as well?
11:53:34midkayamiconn: interesting.. i've never actually seen one. side note: my 5G's LCD is pretty readable sans backlight.. more than most color LCDs i've seen.
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11:55:04Lloreanmidkay: My Gigabeat and Sansa are about 95% unreadable without backlight.
11:55:20amiconnBoth the H300 and X5 lcd are of the pitch black type
11:55:27linuxstbLlorean: Yes, kkurbjan uploaded the bootloader there, and changed the link from the download server to the wiki page. I've just changed it back, hidden the attached bootloader, and also removed the references to the bootsplash.
11:55:53midkayLlorean: interesting. it seems like the color iPods are not that unreadable type..
11:56:17amiconnMaybe the ipod colour lcds are better, but then there's still the performance drawback. And up to now nobody could tell me the real advantage of having colour on a dap (or mobile phone, whatever)...
11:56:34linuxstbamiconn: Album art of course :)
11:56:46markunand movies in colour!
11:56:59midkaydap? digital AUDIO player? :)
11:57:11markunamiconn: of course you will now say you never watch movies in colour :)
11:57:14linuxstbI guess the point is that modern DAPs are a lot more than just audio players.
11:57:16pixelmaLlorean: how well readable is it on the nanos? For example my phone shows a clock while the backlight is off, you can see it but not very good (depends a lot on angle and light)
11:57:17midkayi'm sure we know amiconn's outlook as far as video on portable devices.. :)
11:57:18Lloreanmidkay: Yeah, my iPod Nano is the "good" sort.
11:57:24amiconnmarkun: Sure I do, but at home
11:57:39Lloreanpixelma: I can see it fine in low light conditions. It's really almost as good as a mono LCD
11:57:50amiconnVideo on a dap is a nice experiment, but the real thing would be a PMP, which I'm simply not interested in
11:58:07Lloreanpixelma: For example, the iCatcher WPS is fully readable.
11:58:35Lloreanlinuxstb: I'm surprised that bootsplash didn't get removed. =/
11:58:50linuxstbLlorean: It did...
11:58:53*amiconn hopes for as many different rockbox targets to "show up" at devcon
11:59:05pixelmaLlorean: neat - what about the sansa's display?
11:59:12amiconnAs many as possible I mean
11:59:21linuxstbLlorean: See, another good point about iCatcher :)
11:59:23Lloreanlinuxstb: Oh, bootsplash is gone? I just saw the .zip there with you mentioning you'd reuploaded it.
11:59:31*Llorean should not make assumptions
11:59:45Lloreanpixelma: Unreadable
11:59:58Lloreanpixelma: If you shine a very, very, very bright light on it... maybe. You can tell that things are changing.
12:00:48Lloreanlinuxstb: Well, if we don't get something good from the contest, I will vote for iCatcher.
12:01:10amiconnLlorean: That qualifies as pitch black type then
12:01:14markunand I will vote for Rockboxed, just to bug Llorean
12:01:34amiconnEven those are readable in direct sunlight with a b&w colour scheme
12:01:40Lloreanamiconn: Basically, yes. The Gigabeat is like this too, both are useless without backlight.
12:02:26markunThe one which are visible are called "transflexive" right?
12:02:46markun.. visible without backlight
12:03:01bluebrotherhmm. me remembers he hasn't got a reply on the greyscale Rockboxed yet :(
12:03:02amiconnWith readable I mean under normal lighting conditions, which includes indoor situations with no sunlight
12:03:50amiconn...and not only pure b&w colour schemes
12:04:56amiconnmarkun: Yes, and all b&w/grayscale lcds are transflexive (or even just reflective)
12:05:33markunthe e-ink technologie is also interesting (at least to me)
12:07:18amiconnOLED... but that also needs power when active. But less than LCD+backlight afaik
12:08:28markunamiconn: with e-ink the display would just be as visible as any image on paper
12:08:38amiconnYes I know
12:08:59markunbut the screens are pretty slow
12:09:01amiconnBut it's slow, so not suitable for moving content. And it also doesn't do colour afaik
12:12:08pixelmaLlorean: about the default wps contest - it was noticed before that there could be differences between WPS for same resolution depending on the presence of RTC (i.e H1x0s <-> M5/4th gen Ipod Ggrey or Ondio <-> recorders). Currently this is not even handled by (but should be) - worth mentioning in the thread in case someone wants to use RTC tags?
12:12:30Lloreanpixelma: Good idea
12:15:18markunlinuxstb: my playlist 'fixes' introduce some weird behaviour..
12:16:25linuxstbmarkun: Why are you touching the playlist code anyway? Is there something you want to add/change?
12:16:40linuxstbOr just general cleaning?
12:17:27markunthere is a bug I want to fix
12:18:14markunif you create a new playlist by inserting a directory and you then "insert" another directory (not "insert last"
12:18:29markun") it gets added after the currently playing song
12:18:40amiconnThat's correct behaviour...
12:19:07markunaccording to the manual "insert" should add the songs after the last inserted songs
12:20:04markunso in this case I was expecting them to be at the end of the playlist
12:20:18amiconnBut since you just started the playlist, the first insert position is after the current song
12:20:24markunnot after the first song and before all the others
12:20:41markunwhy? I started the playlist with insert
12:20:57amiconnThe first insert isn't an insert, it's a create
12:21:17markunI looks like insert from the context menu
12:21:23*amiconn never starts playlists with (plain) insert
12:21:51amiconnOnly 'Insert shuffled' sometimes in order to save me from switching shuffle mode all the time
12:23:04markuneven though you don't use it I still find it strange behaviour
12:23:21Lloreanmarkun: I think the fix is a fix that should be in the manual then.
12:24:00markunLlorean: so you agree that INSERT should not append at the end of the playlist when you create it with INSERT?
12:24:02amiconnIt's in fact a logic question - can you insert things into something that doesn't exist yet?
12:24:38Lloreanmarkun: I don't really know.
12:24:49*Llorean will stay out of this one entirely, actually
12:25:46*JdGordon agrees with markun
12:26:34markuninstead of insert,insert first,insert I would prefer insert next,insert first,insert last
12:27:06markunwell, actually I don't know
12:27:19amiconnDespite the debatable logic, fixing it should be relative simple I'd think
12:28:48linuxstbWould it be clearer to think of the dynamic playlist as always existing, but with the possibility to have zero entries?
12:30:00amiconnHummmmmm :(
12:30:25pixelmahow does "insert shuffled" create the list? If it inserts one by one randomly this could create a problem that you won't know where an "insert" will stuff the song somewhere (neither the end nor the next song - but after the last song it inserted, probably the last in the folder)
12:30:34amiconnIt seems someone broke the nice playlist behaviour with non-existing entries on hwcodec as well :(
12:30:48pixelma(when "insert shuffled" envoked on a folder that is)
12:31:31amiconn"Insert shuffled" inserts randomly between current playing position and end of list
12:31:55linuxstb"insert shuffled" doesn't seem to be documented in the manual...
12:32:12pixelmathat's true :/
12:32:40amiconnOn hwcodec the playback engine used to just skip missing songs. Now it gets confused...
12:33:20markunpixelma: from looking at the code it seems that insert shuffled doesn't set the last_insert_pos
12:34:15markunso if you "insert" after "insert shuffled" it will not append after the last song added
12:34:37linuxstbThat makes sense.
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12:36:10pixelmamarkun: yes - but that's what I thought _could_ happen with your proposed changes?
12:37:09markunI'm not sure what I proposed.
12:37:29markunso better forget about what I said :)
12:39:04markunbut for me the playlist system is too complicated. Too many things you have to remember before you know which insert action to use.
12:40:13JdGordonso get rid of insert and just have insert(/queue) first, last, next,shuffled
12:40:17markunI just want to listen to an album and when I think about other music I would like to listen to I add them to the end of the playlist, so just always "insert last" I guess
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12:42:28pixelmaJdGordon: do you mean the first "insert" to start the playlist?
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12:43:03markunwhen can "insert first" be useful? (just curious because I can't think of any situation myself)
12:43:09amiconn"Insert first" makes no sense as you would never hear that track
12:43:22amiconnI think the insert and queue options are fine as they are
12:43:23markunwow, that was fast :)
12:43:42pixelmaJdGordon: what if you only want to play only one song of the folder then?
12:43:45JdGordonthats what I was thinkign before.. but some people have repeat enabled
12:44:00amiconn(with only the "Insert after starting a list with Insert" behaviour being debatable)
12:44:08markunJdGordon: what's the different in adding it to the end or to the beginning if you have repeat on?
12:44:14JdGordonpixelma: is that even possible atm? doesnt it wlays start a dirplay playlist?
12:44:28JdGordonmarkun: your right, scrap that option also
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12:44:43pixelmaand I rely much on "insert shuffled" to start the playlist - very convenient especially when you don't have a quickmenu
12:45:04markunpoor ondio.. no quickmenu..
12:45:24pixelmaJdGordon: yes, it's possible currently. Just "insert" on one file
12:45:41amiconnThe quickmenu isn't much use imho
12:45:46JdGordonah ok
12:45:48pixelmamarkun: actually I don't miss it since I can "insert shuffled" on a folder
12:46:05markunah, quickmenu.. I though the context menu was not possible :)
12:46:18JdGordonspeaking of the quickmenu... i want to redo it so the 3 options in it are choosable.. any objections?
12:46:27markunI never use the quickmenu either
12:46:45JdGordonscrap it completly?
12:47:23pixelmaJdGordon: you know... customisable menus... do I have to say more? ;)
12:47:27linuxstbI find it useful to change the file view for the occasions I want to browse into .rockbox
12:47:31PaulJammaybe it would be less confusing if the insert, insert next and insert last entrys would be replaced by a "insert..." entry which takes you to the playlistviewer and there the selected line says <insert here> or something like that.
12:47:57LloreanPaulJam: That slows down the process considerably.
12:48:01JdGordonpixelma: I have no problem with a sinle customizable menu.. as long as the main menus are static
12:48:03markunPaulJam: I agree
12:48:43JdGordonPaulJam: nice idea, but that should be an extra option, not a replacment
12:48:56pixelmabtw. what happened to the "animation" when moving a playlist entry in the playlist viewer?
12:49:30pixelmaPaulJam: just from the sounds of it, it doesn't seem to be easier
12:49:35pixelma(to me)
12:49:50LloreanJdGordon, Markun, PaulJam: Maybe a "Move insert point" option, that lets you set the point, and then "Insert" lets you insert there (incrementing the point when you do that, so you're always inserting right after the previous insert, until you use one of the other options, like usual)
12:50:07LloreanMaybe "Insert At"
12:50:47LloreanBut I like the current 'quick' insert options, they've met most of my needs fine.
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12:54:36pixelmasame here
12:54:53moosthat remind me that the line selector on playlist viewer is broken again ?(it was fixed and now reapeared)
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12:55:17moos2 lines instead of 1
12:56:26pixelmayeah - that's what I meant before
12:56:48moosthis bug was gone and now back few days ago :(
12:57:23*moos is searching for the previous bug fix in the log
12:57:37JdGordonwhats the bug?
12:57:57pixelmajust try to move a track in the playlist viewer
12:58:03amiconnLooks like the playlist bug I observed is in fact not a playlist bug, but a multivolume bug...
12:58:28JdGordoncool :)
12:58:41amiconnJdGordon: It most probably has to do with the playlist viewer title
12:58:58moosJdGordon: line selector on the playlist viewer: wasn't you previously fixed it?
12:59:25JdGordonI dont think so.. its likly I broke it though :D
12:59:30moos: )
13:00:11amiconnI have an album stored both on my Ondio's internal flash and an MMC. I inserted it from MMC, and when pulling the MMC during playback it somehow managed to find the album on the internal flash.... (!!)
13:00:30pixelmaJdGordon: I have a pre "title" in playlist viewer build on my Ondio, and it doesn't invert two lines but looks odd too because the whole line inverts (including scroll bar)
13:01:27JdGordonthe scrollbar inverts here also
13:02:30pixelmaso maybe the root of the problem is somewhere else (or there are two problems)
13:02:41amiconnHmm. Starting this playlist with the MMC pulled even works after a reboot
13:02:59JdGordonamiconn: dircache playing up maybe?
13:03:01amiconnSo it's not a question of dirs being open by chance...
13:03:11amiconnJdGordon: Dircache? On Ondio?? ;)
13:03:33JdGordonor maybe not then....
13:03:35amiconnAlmost looks like a problem with path evaluation
13:04:59JdGordonpixelma: only the text should invert right? not the icon and scrollbar?
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13:05:34pixelmalike in the menu/browser I'd say
13:05:37Lloreanamiconn: Is it maybe the skipping of drive letter part?
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13:06:18amiconnIt's automatic backup copy mapping ;)
13:06:46amiconnBut no, the driver letter removal should have nothing to do with it
13:08:27pixelmait's not a bug it's a feature ;)
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13:11:58JdGordonamiconn: I think your right, im pretty sure it is a title bug
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13:19:18JdGordonCommitted revision 13231. <- nice version number :D
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13:22:40pixelmabtw. I thought one could switch off the titles somewhere but don't find an option?
13:23:34pixelmaor is it not possible?
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13:26:26JdGordononly in the browsers
13:27:56pixelmaand where is that option?
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13:28:47pixelmaok... if you mean the directories, I know of that
13:34:30JdGordonyeah... you cant disable titles in the rest of the lists..
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13:34:47JdGordonunless you pick a font which would make it onl 1 item under the title
13:34:57JdGordondo we need the option to disable it?
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13:37:57JdGordonis it possible to make the data abort screen a bit more helpful?
13:38:10JdGordonI mean... with a bit moe info than just the address
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13:55:34pixelmaJdGordon: the playlist viewer bug isn't fixed entirely - now only one line inverts but the track part inverts and the icon/scrollbar part inverts - while one is black on white the other is white on black (on M5 as example)
13:56:14JdGordonyeah, I thought that was cool enough to not bother fixing :D
13:56:47pixelma(like with the old build on my Ondio without the title) - so I guess it's a different thing
13:57:25pixelmahaha... looks like the "check in" on the airport or so ;)
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14:00:31pixelmait's like the track part inverses the inversion of the whole line if that makes sense
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14:03:28JdGordonyeah, I saw it on the h300 remote in the sim, but it goes away after the move, so didnt really care about fixing it (also it looks cool)
14:03:38JdGordonthat and i shuold be working on assignemnts tonight
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14:06:12pixelmabut you think it looks cool? How odd... ;)
14:06:26*JdGordon is an odd person...
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14:25:29bluebrother^hmm. Why doesn't the playlist viewer move the hilighted track that is intended to moe? I.e. some kind of "live" updatinig the playlist
14:25:45bluebrother^(but only update it for real when the user presses select on the new position)
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14:38:54leftrightwith regards to the playlist "Insert", "Isert next", Insert last, I wish that there was only "Insert next", and "Insert last", I really dont remember where "Insert" is going to place the next album/track in a large playlist
14:39:43leftrightespecially adding to a large playlist that has been shuffled
14:40:22JdGordondan_a: hey, you going to be able to commit 7026 and 6908 soonish?
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14:55:19barrywardellJdGordon: I don't think 6908 is ready for commit, is it?
14:55:46barrywardelland is 7026 the right task number? that's already committed
15:00:32JdGordonbah, 7036 i meant
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15:00:44dawnhi all
15:00:59dawnI just installed rockbox on a cowon iaudio x5
15:01:18dawnare there any issues known with high-bitrate files?
15:01:40dawnie, I have some mp3 and ogg files with bitrates from 192kbps to 320kbps and they do not play nicely
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15:02:08dawnwith "not nicely" I mean that somehow they are played too fast
15:04:30barrywardell7036 looks good to commit
15:05:01barrywardellonly thing i'd change is maybe give (1<<26) its own #define
15:05:24barrywardelland (1<<14) too
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15:11:34Learamiconn: charcell screens need to call update now too, right?
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15:52:47Guy_NYhello everyone
15:54:04Guy_NYi have rockbox running on a toshiba F40.. does anyone know any way to view lyrics with it?
15:55:40iwantanimacviewer - save them as a text file and just open them.
15:56:05iwantanimacbut if you want synchronised lyrics, you'll need to build your own with SNCviewer. It's in the forums.
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16:05:52Guy_NYoh thanks man
16:05:54Guy_NYlet me try
16:05:57*Nico_P sees the red columns disappearing on the build table and smiles :)
16:06:39Guy_NYwith SNCviewer i can read lyrics from id3 tags, right?
16:07:14iwantanimacno, it's a separate file...
16:07:27iwantanimacunfortunately i don't know of anything that reads lyrics from ID3...
16:07:37Guy_NYoh ok
16:09:49iwantanimacno problem. ^^
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16:41:44ColdSphinX^can someone give me acess to ?
16:42:06bluebrother^ColdSphinX^: what do you mean by "access" to that page?
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16:42:27ColdSphinX^i want to submit a theme
16:42:39bluebrother^and what do you mean by "access" to that page?
16:42:53bluebrother^it's a wiki ...
16:43:02ColdSphinX^i cant edit it with my wiki account
16:43:20bluebrother^do you have write privileges at all?
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16:46:10bluebrother^ColdSphinX^: do you have write priviledges for the wiki at all?
16:46:22ColdSphinX^see query
16:46:32bluebrother^what query?
16:47:02linuxstbColdSphinX^: Access isn't given to particular pages. bluebrother is asking if you've got write access to the wiki in general?
16:47:38ColdSphinX^i tryed him to explain my problem in german in a /query window in irc
16:47:43bluebrother^ColdSphinX^: the registration page tells you how to get write access to the wiki. Have you followed that or not?
16:47:51bluebrother^ah. I haven't got any pm.
16:47:55linuxstbi.e. have you ever modified any page on the wiki?
16:48:05bluebrother^possibly you're not registered at nickserv.
16:48:17linuxstbColdSphinX^: What's your wiki name?
16:48:22ColdSphinX^i created that account this noon
16:48:33linuxstbOK, I'll add you now.
16:49:17linuxstbOK, that's done.
16:49:18bluebrother^ColdSphinX^: unless you are identified to nickserv you can't write pm's.
16:50:50bluebrother^that's a freenode thing.
16:50:57ColdSphinX^hmm on other networks and my (sometimes running) home-irc-deamon it's posible without, hmm, so i've to register myself at this network too *hmpf*
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16:51:39bluebrother^per default unidentified pm's are filtered. I reenabled that since a while because I was annoyed too much by unregistered nicks.
16:52:40bluebrother^it works the other way round, i.e. if I'm registered I can pm you even if you are not registered.
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16:59:50DwylocWould any dev with an ipod nano like to help me test my update of the battery meter patch to make it apply to current builds (
17:00:27DwylocI have been using it for about a week and it dose seem to make the power meter more accurate but I dont think it’s perfect.
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17:14:13***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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17:22:59dawnI just came over a rather strange trouble while playing .ogg files with rockbox
17:23:16dawnI have a .ogg file which is quite old. according to ogginfo, it has been produced with libVorbis I 20020717 (1.0)
17:23:27dawnthis one does not play well with rockbox
17:24:05dawnI decoded it with oggdec to a .wav file, recreated a .ogg with the newest oggenc and it plays fine
17:24:18LloreanI believe the minimum Vorbis version is 1.1, but I'm not sure.
17:24:40LloreanI seem to recall that number being mentioned.
17:24:45*Llorean could definitely be wrong on this one.
17:25:03LearReally old versions can cause problems. Not sure about version numbers though.
17:25:49dawnand do high bitrates also cause problems?
17:26:04LloreanThey shouldn't.
17:26:10LloreanWell, depends on your MP3 player
17:26:19LloreanOn iPods / Sansas / H10, they may just because of limited processing power.
17:26:35dawnI also have some .ogg files created with current version off libvorbis ... with a average bitrate of 500kbit/s
17:26:47dawnthese do not play fine with my iaudio x5
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17:27:02LloreanWhat happens?
17:27:20dawnsomehow they play "too fast"
17:27:33dawnie, something is missing
17:27:38LearThat's like q10? I think I have a few test tracks at q9 or 10 that just barely play on an iriver (H140).
17:27:52LearI'd expect gaps...
17:27:59LloreanGaps would be a bitrate problem
17:28:08LloreanIf they play "too fast", it's perhaps a sample rate issue or something
17:28:23LloreanDo you know their sample rate?
17:28:33LearLast I checked, different sample rates weren't a problem...
17:28:41dawnthey either have 44.1khz or 48khz
17:29:36LloreanLear: They shouldn't be, unless there's a bug.
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17:29:43LloreanBut if files are playing back too fast, it's a bug.
17:29:47dawnand with some (either .ogg or .mp3) files I have strange pops while playing
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17:30:18dawnbut this could be because a lot of my files are quite old
17:30:27[g2]anybody started on hacking on the Sansa Connect yet ?
17:30:54Llorean[g2]: New ports don't happen that often, or that quickly
17:31:10Llorean[g2]: The best bet is to check in the New Ports forum and see if anyone has posted anything (in this case, they haven't)
17:31:39Lloreandawn: I had strange pops in very old Speex files.
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17:32:32[g2]Llorean, thx... actually I'm may be looking to sponsor a device or two
17:33:11[g2]there were a couple of guys in here hacking on the E2xx series of Sansa
17:33:35dawnLlorean: well, I think I will quickly re-encode the files
17:33:55dawnLlorean: at least with the .ogg files, I get better results if they are encoded with the current libvorbis
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17:34:38[g2]dan_a comes to mind
17:35:12Llorean[g2]: Just because they're both Sansa players doesn't necessarily mean that much.
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17:35:24LloreanIs the Connect portalplayer based?
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17:36:59[g2]Llorean, I don't know yet. I haven't really looked as I've been quite busy with my AppleTV for the last month
17:37:21[g2]however, it is something worth looking into a little
17:37:23LloreanA new port is more likely to happen if the architecture is familiar, than if the manufacturer is.
17:37:42LloreanThe people who are working on the Sansa port right now mostly came to it from either iPods or the H10
17:37:46[g2]Llorean, thx I'm fully aware of all the embedded issues
17:37:52LloreanNeither of which is Sandisk.
17:38:09[g2]sure it's an arch familiarity thing
17:38:51[g2]there's a learning curve with all arches and even with individual processors (or processor families)
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17:40:11[g2]having worked on x86/386, PPC, XScale and a other I've been through my share of bootloaders/memory controllers and other device drivers
17:41:21LloreanWell really the most important thing is a player that offers something interesting.
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17:41:35LloreanA lot of people here aren't really that excited about WiFi, I think
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17:51:40[g2]Llorean, really, I
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17:52:14[g2]damn keyboard.... I'd think wifi (except for battery life) would be perfect around the home/apt
17:54:23[g2]hmmm.... interesting it appears to be running mono on Linux and an ARM
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18:18:29egotrippenhey all
18:18:45egotrippencan someone point me towards the control table that used to be in gwps.h?
18:18:55egotrippenH300, specifically
18:19:42egotrippennvm, guess i found it
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18:35:56*ender` yawns
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18:42:51x1jmpHas anyone ported the rockbox-sim to IPL yet? :-)
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18:46:43bluebrother^ I don't think so. Would this make sense in any way?
18:48:11x1jmpNo, just a dumb question.
18:48:22bluebrother^ah :)
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19:04:39l2eM1xis there a way I could choose a new song, without creating a new dynamic playlist and wasting battery?
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19:09:00Nico_Pamiconn_: hi
19:09:27robin0800Dwyloc, new comment to patch 4998
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19:13:39bluebrother^l2eM1x: why would creating a new dynamic playlist waste battery?
19:14:06l2eM1xI read that that is the most hard on the battery
19:14:17***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:14:26l2eM1xcreating a new playlist with 1000+ entries surely has some affect on the battery.
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19:17:39Dwylocrobin0800, As my patch is for the nano not the 60GB ipod video, I am not sure if increasing the maximum battery size makes sence.
19:17:40Nico_PI get a "bad checksum" with the new gigabeat bootloader... can anyone tell me what's wrong ?
19:19:39Nico_Phmm with a build from the website it works... but mine doesn't
19:20:39ColdSphinX^Nico_P forgot to use scramble?
19:20:51 Quit brun0_ (Remote closed the connection)
19:21:22Nico_PColdSphinX^: am I supposed to ?
19:21:25Dwylocrobin0800, I also don't know if the battery type used in the 5G ipod video 60GB is the same as the one used in the nano apart from having a larger capacity
19:22:36ColdSphinX^Nico_P yes
19:22:56Nico_PColdSphinX^: arr you toalking about normal builds ?
19:23:08Nico_Phmm I should learn how to type
19:23:09ColdSphinX^no, the bootloader.bin
19:23:20Nico_PColdSphinX^: I'm not building the bootloader myself
19:23:22Dwylocrobin0800, But if it is I would be quite happy to create a second patch if you would like to test it.
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19:24:36robin0800Dwyloc,this is where the info comes from
19:25:03Nico_POK I just rebuilt everything from scratch and now it works
19:27:31robin0800Dwyloc,Yes Icould Bench it with and without the patch would that be enough?
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19:35:05egotrippenquestion about the new overmenu thing
19:35:12egotrippeni just updated after the first time in a while
19:35:34egotrippenis it possible to resume on startup only if there was something playing?
19:35:53egotrippenif i hit stop, turn off, and turn on, it resumes anyway with this system
19:36:32Dwylocrobin0800, your link is interesting as I now have a third battery size (300mAh) suggested as standard for the ipod nano. The original author of the patch who did the testing with a multi meter seemed to think the nano’s had 340mAh battery, most of the replacement battery’s seem to be 330mAh on ebay with the largest being 400mAh. I guess I will have to see if I can find anyone else who has taken their nano
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19:40:35Nico_Pamiconn: how come I can't use sscanf after including sscanf.h ?
19:40:59Nico_PI get a linker error
19:41:31Nico_PI'm probably just stupid
19:41:39dionoeaIn the core or in a plugin ?
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19:43:16Nico_Pdionoea: in the core... turns out I was indeed stupid : forgot to add sscanf.c to SOURCES
19:47:28neoAKiRAzi have a wps to upload, and i wanted permision for the wiki because is the first i made... you can check it out at:
19:47:35neoAKiRAzwho should i talk to?? :D
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19:48:34linuxstbNico_P: Your gigabeat problem was because you needed to rerun tools/configure so that your Makefile included the new "scramble" step.
19:48:52linuxstbneoAKiRAz: What's your wiki name?
19:49:08neoAKiRAzit's BrunoAzzinnari
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19:49:33linuxstbneoAKiRAz: OK, done.
19:50:24Nico_Plinuxstb: it was a bit scary at first :)
19:50:29neoAKiRAzok thanks! i'll try to figure out how to upload then... i've already read the guide... anyway, i imagine there's a way to edit the...
19:50:43neoAKiRAzentry if anything goes wrong, right??
19:51:22croplinuxstb: Hi. I must tell that my intention to reorganise reading of id3 tags isn't going to be easy work. The parsing of the file is tight integrated with processing. There are many special cases (unsynch etc, I even don't know what that means)
19:51:30cropSo I'll better stay off
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19:53:54Nico_Pnow there's something I don't understand... I have added a sscanf call in the WPS parsing code and now the sim segfaults but according to gdb's BT it's not where I added the call... I've set a breakpoint on the function where I added the call but it's never reached... WTF ?
19:54:24 Quit entheh ("^~")
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19:55:00linuxstbNico_P: Maybe the sim is using a system sscanf
19:55:39Nico_Plinuxstb: it must be something like that... non-rockbox code trying to use the rockbox sscanf
19:56:11Nico_Pthe BT says the segfault is in /usr/lib/
19:56:46Nico_Pwhat can I do ?
19:57:07Dwylocrobin0800, no I think someone would have to take their ipod video apart and take some multi meter readings as well as running battery benchmark a few times.
19:57:16Nico_Plinuxstb: also what's strange is that when I comment the sscanf call out, the segfault disappears
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20:00:51robin0800Dwyloc, sorry then don't want to take mine apart yet perhaps someone who has already taken theirs apart can help
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20:03:44Dwylocrobin0800: I think making the ipod video's battery meter more accurate is best left to a developer with an ipod video who is happy taking their player apart.
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20:04:57linuxstbNico_P: That sounds like the case - Rockbox's sscanf is probably not re-entrant (i.e. it uses some static buffers), meaning if two threads try to use it, problems happen. I'm not sure what the solution is - maybe to not use Rockbox's sscanf in the sim. But I have to leave now.
20:04:58*linuxstb afk
20:06:33Dwylocrobin0800: I could create a patch to allow you to select the correct size of battery but it would only be a cosmetic change. It would not make the battery meter any more accurate as far as I can see from the rockbox source.
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20:46:11robin0800Dwyloc, do you know what figure is used at present for the ipod video?
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21:06:52Dwylocrobin0800: taken from config-ipodvideo.h the default is 1300, the min setting is 1300 and the max is 3200.
21:07:52LloreanNot valid values for the iPod Video battery, though
21:07:57LloreanI'm pretty sure it's 840
21:09:01Dwylociit should be 600 mAh
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21:10:08DwylocLlorean: at lest if the info here is correct
21:11:10LloreanDwyloc: Another page suggests that a 550 will last 22% longer in a 30gb
21:11:22LloreanDwyloc: But makes no claims of an 850 lasting any longer in a 60/80gb
21:11:38LloreanI think there's a lot of general uncertainty about
21:12:41DwylocLlorean: sorry that was the size of the 60GB battery the 30GB has a 400mAh battery if that page is correct.
21:12:45LloreanEither way, the "Battery Capacity" setting in Rockbox doesn't do anything useful for iPods
21:14:19***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:15:35DwylocLlorean: is it worth creating a patch to at least change the options to be mode correct even if they don't currently do anything?
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21:23:13LloreanDwyloc: Currently I'm campaigning to get the feature removed, or at the very least changed to not use mAh values.
21:23:27LloreanI think most of us agree that the mAh value part of it confuses people about what it's really used for
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21:35:10DwylocLlorean: For reference my ipod nano battery patch dose more than just add battery capacity options to the menu, it also corrects the BATTERY_SCALE_FACTOR and adds battery voltage measurements at the required batter levels.
21:35:32LloreanDwyloc: I know.
21:35:43LloreanOtherwise it wouldn't help with the % meter. :)
21:36:50DwylocOK I was just trying to make sure our other discussion did not confuse people :)
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21:45:47robin0800with all this confusion how do we know the rockbox ipod battery running time is half the apple ipod running time?
21:45:59lexby experience
21:46:26SoapI didn't realize there was any confusion
21:46:45Soapthere have been many proper, controlled, discharge tests done.
21:48:08robin0800In my experiance rockbox with replay gain no clipping fadeing album art semms to give >12hrs already
21:49:53robin0800Soap,yes on the rockbox side but what about the apple figure
21:50:13pearldivernew gigabeat bootloader is weird
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21:50:28Soaprobin0800: if you get greater than 12 hours you will be the record holder.
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21:51:19robin0800from these figures do we know a starting figure
21:51:47SoapI don't grok the question.
21:52:22LloreanSoap: Do we have a consistent retail firmware battery life vs rockbox comparison
21:52:30LloreanSoap: Rather than comparing "It feels like X hours" for the retail
21:52:33Soapall mine, Llorean
21:52:41LloreanI was just translating
21:53:16Soapahh - yea robin0800 all my tests (bottom) were done with (as near as possible) identical conditions in Apple firmware and Rockbox firmware.
21:53:42Soapand as near as perfect to optimal runtime. Real-world runtime should be less than my conditions.
21:54:28robin0800no I was realy trying to find out if 600mAh is the right value?
21:54:39kkurbjunNico_P: rockbox's sscanf has bugs in it. when I first started working on it it didn't work right at all. I only tested it to the point of getting doom's dehacked patches working, and even then it's still a bit flaky.
21:55:21Soaprobin0800: the "right" value is whatever value gives you the closest aproximation to your actual runtime.
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21:56:25robin0800ok then whats the value of a brand new ipod?
21:56:42Soapit was discussed earlier in the week (I believe) how the capacity numbers really only have significance with (one of?) the Archos players, for when you swap out the AAs inside.
21:56:56Soapthe value of a brand new iPod's battery depends on the model.
21:57:34robin0800so is the 600 figure right?
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21:57:42Soapfor what model?
21:57:54robin0800ipod video
21:58:01Soap30 or 60/80 GB?
21:58:12robin080060 gb
21:58:35Soapbut it doesn't matter if the number is the "correct" on or not, since Rockbox doesn't use the number well.
21:59:06Juice^I have a small problem with my rockbox, for the sansa. When i try to open any other files than mp3s, it returns with the message "Incompatible version" is this known? Guess it has appeared after i have upgraded rockbox to a newer build
21:59:09toffe82pearldiver: why weird ?
21:59:33pearldiveri dont know, it sort of flashes something during the gigabeat progress bar
21:59:49robin0800why is this figure not in config-ipodvideo.h?
22:00:01SoapJuice^: sounds like you didn't update all the files.
22:00:02pearldiverand it seems slower then the old one, maybe its just me
22:00:05barrywardellJuice^: are you using an old bootloader?
22:00:32barrywardelltry deleting the rockbox.e200 file and see what happens (leave the rockbox.mi4 there)
22:00:35Juice^barrywardell: that could be yes, the bootloader is seperate from the the rockbox build?
22:00:57barrywardellyes. did you use sansapatcher for your install?
22:00:58pearldivertoffe82 i have to play around with it more
22:01:08toffe82me too
22:01:27pearldiverpay attention at the progress bar screen
22:01:28Juice^barrywardell: no, no didnt.. the sansapatcher didnt exist at the point when i installed rockbox, all manually
22:01:33pearldiverit flashes at one point there
22:01:34SoapJuice^: I suspect you updated your rockbox.mi4 or rockbox.sansa or rockbox.whatever file and not the .rockbox directory.
22:01:38scorcheSoap: recorder v1
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22:02:06Soapthank you scorche.
22:02:28barrywardellJuice^: in that case you're using an old bootloader, you need to upgrade it
22:02:36Juice^i did Soap, i did copy over the full .rockbox dir.. as i always do when i update rockbox quite often
22:02:55barrywardellthe problem is that the extension changed recently from rockbox.e200 to rockbox.mi4
22:03:08barrywardellpre-sansapatcher bootloaders didn't look for rockbox.mi4
22:03:24Juice^oh i see, so the bootloader is incorrect then. let me update the bootloader then :)
22:03:41Juice^should i use sansapatcher for that?
22:03:41barrywardellthe best way to do that is to put the OF back in place first
22:03:45barrywardellthen use sansapatcher
22:03:52robin0800Soap,config-ipodvideo.h does not have 600mAh in it I believe?
22:04:02barrywardellso get a PP5022.mi4 with the Sandisk firmware in it
22:04:07barrywardelland do a firmware upgrade with that
22:04:18barrywardellthen use the sansapatcher method described in the manual
22:04:27Soaprobin0800: ok - I'm telling you - changing the capacity to 600mah will make the calculation no better.
22:04:27kkurbjunpearldiver, the flash you see if expected
22:04:39pearldiverkkurbjun really?
22:05:11robin0800why what calculation is done?
22:06:04kkurbjunthe new bootloader has code to keep that screen up for a bit longer. It has to move the old gigabeat framebuffer to the new address we set. Barrywardell wrote the code, occasionally it flashes, but it's better then seeing a shutting down screen
22:06:24kkurbjunwhile it's moving it it also has to convert the format
22:07:15kkurbjunyou can play around with it by looking at lcd_init in the target directory and comenting out that first #ifdef in the init code
22:07:30robin0800Soap,why what calculation is done?
22:08:12Soaplet's step back a moment, robin0800. Why do you want to change the capacity number?
22:08:58kkurbjun(you'll have to rebuild the bootloader after doing that as well)
22:10:38pearldiverim not that keen on that default rockbox splash, i wish it was on black background
22:10:59robin0800to try to get as accurate runtime remaining figure as possiable I would of thought that at least one way of doing this would be starting with the crrect figure
22:11:30Lloreanpearldiver: As I've said, someone make a patch to theme that splash, and I'll do everything I can to get it in SVN.
22:11:33kkurbjunyou can always create a patch to change it on your build to a different image
22:11:47SoapSo when you have a fresh charge, robin0800, what does it say your remaining runtime is?
22:12:15robin08008h 49m
22:12:18kkurbjunLlorean, I don't think it would make sense to have that image loaded up seperately on start
22:12:20pearldiverLlorean i think all the complains are coming from the background color of it
22:12:23barrywardellLlorean: It's very easy to change the splash - I did it on the gigabeat
22:12:37Soaprobin0800: right
22:12:37Juice^barrywardell: i didnt have the PP5022.mi4 handy, so i located it on, but the file was named SKU_E-PP5022.mi4 - thats just a name they use on the website to identify the files easier? so i'll just rename it back to the original name right?
22:12:38pearldiverLlorean if it was black, noone would even care
22:12:39barrywardelljust replace the .bmp and edit one line of code!
22:12:42Soapand that's at 1300 mah.
22:12:51Soapso if you change it to 600 mah - it will be ever futhur off.
22:13:00kkurbjunit works fine in the build, but having to open more files then necessary on startup will just slow it down
22:13:01Lloreanbarrywardell: Changing it is easy, but it should be able to load one from a .bmp
22:13:13Lloreanpearldiver: If it was black, people who used white backdrops might. Or people who like the light blue.
22:13:38Lloreankkurbjun: Load the config.cfg before displaying the splash, if no splash is set on it, you don't attempt to load a file, simple
22:13:51robin0800who says i believe I get more than this
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22:14:04barrywardellah, ok. that's a bit more complicated, but not much.
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22:14:16kkurbjunI say if people want to change their starup screen they can patch the build, no need to add extra code to startup
22:14:23Lloreanbarrywardell: Yeah, it's not too complicated, but nobody's bothered. The "Rockbox" title screen should be themable though.
22:14:25kkurbjunfor a screen that's shown for a split second
22:14:29Juice^barrywardell: did you read my last message?
22:14:33barrywardellJuice^: yeah, rename it to PP5022.mi4
22:14:40Lloreankkurbjun: The extra code will only get run if there's a themed screen set in the .cfg
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22:14:46LloreanIt's not like the .cfg isn't parsed at startup anyway
22:14:48Juice^barrywardell: ok thx
22:14:50Soaprobin0800: do you believe you get less than 4h 30min?
22:15:22Soapfor if 1300 = 8h49m then 600 will (I think it follows) equal less than 4.5 hours.
22:15:27kkurbjunIf you notice it already tries to load the backdrop as quick as possible, and even that at times is slower then the rest of the startup
22:15:28Dwylocrobin0800: I have created a patch to add the correct values to the menu but I am not sure how much use it is
22:15:40robin0800no I get more than 8h 49 min the figure is too low
22:15:47Soapmy point robin0800
22:15:58Soapyou want to set the value _higher_ not lower.
22:16:02Lloreankkurbjun: So make it so if no backdrop is set in the theme, it doesn't use any at all, making it even faster without a theme?
22:16:11Lloreankkurbjun: Best of both worlds: The option for extra fast start, *or* a theme
22:16:57robin0800perhaps the calculation isn't quite right?
22:17:06Soaprobin0800: it isn't.
22:18:01robin0800whats needed for the correct caculation?
22:18:25Soaprobin0800: that I don't fully understand.
22:18:44 Part Llorean
22:18:46kkurbjunafter the main code is loaded it's not really going to add speed to not display the splash, it's the spinup, seeking, and reading off the disk that's going to take a while. I just think it's pointless to be able to theme something like that when people can easily change it in their build if they take the time
22:18:50Soapbarrywardel understands better than I. He was kind enough to explain it to me once, but it didn't stick.
22:20:48barrywardellI agree with kkurbjun. I think if the splash is changed it should be done at compile time
22:21:09dionoeamost users don't compile though
22:21:32robin0800what is the calculation that is done?
22:21:53Soapthere is a resource editor for the iaudio builds floating around the iaudiophile forums.
22:22:23SoapPeople seem to think it also works on the ipods. That would really be the best of both worlds, would it not?
22:22:52SoapA third-party unsupported program people who aren't willing to compile can use.
22:23:02Juice^Is the sansapatcher working with sansa firmware version 1.02.15 ?
22:23:23barrywardellit should
22:23:30barrywardelli don't know if it has been tested though
22:23:56Juice^then i will try and report back
22:24:04Juice^updating it now
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22:30:40robin0800a logo swapper is available
22:34:25amiconnNico_P: If you intend to use sscanf in the core it can be made smaller and faster than the standalone version
22:35:28pearldiverrobin0800 you mean here:
22:36:06pearldiver And a doubt about the Toshiba Gigabeat.
22:36:34Juice^barrywardell: good. the issues in rockbox on my sansa got solved by the bootloader update
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22:37:07barrywardellgreat :)
22:40:36*amiconn wonders about those (s)size_t commits...
22:41:37robin0800pearldiver,yes and it does work on ipods i've just used it
22:42:14markunamiconn: ask jhMikeS
22:44:38robin0800pearldiver,i;m not sure but i think an update will break this and you can only replace the exact same size so no full screen logo
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22:54:07*amiconn wonders why people bother with binary hack&slay if the source is available...
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23:07:05jhMikeSamiconn: (s)size_t/int aren't always the same size and (int *) shouldn't be cast to (size_t *)
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23:25:11amiconnBut why use (s)size_t at all in the first place?
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23:25:30amiconnImho there are too many "special" types...
23:25:44jhMikeScompatibility with pointer offsets and intptr_t in terms of range
23:26:53jhMikeSit's not like it's some nonstandard type either
23:29:03Nico_Pamiconn: do you want to add sscanf to the core ?
23:29:07jhMikeSreally, those all deal with addresses in some way or another so they really should be compatible
23:29:45Nico_Pamiconn: i could probably use it but i'm not even really sure
23:29:48amiconn(s)size_t, off_t, intptr_t... allthose just alias basic types, but not always the same
23:30:05amiconnNico_P: I woul donly add it if there's an advantage
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23:33:35jhMikeSamiconn: I know, but yes, they vary with enviroment so the way it was a 64-bit values would have been written to the address of a 32-bit type in sim builds so that kinda nasty just like all the stuff that brought about using intptr_t
23:34:56jhMikeSand removing size_t from rockbox would be a way harder way to fix things
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23:37:25Nico_Pamiconn: I'd like to see how I could use it and what advantage it would bring but ATM it doesn't work on the sim
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23:41:10kkurbjunNico_P I doubt it works on the player either except for specific text
23:41:38kkurbjunsscanf has alot of bugs right now.
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23:49:05Nico_Pkkurbjun: any idea what sort of bugs and how to fix them ?
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23:54:01kkurbjunNico_P I don't recall the specific nature of the problems. I just remember debugging it and it was a mess
23:54:27kkurbjunmy recommendation would be to break out gdb and take a look at where it's breaking on what you are trying to do with it
23:54:56Nico_Pkkurbjun: only problem is I get a segfault when I add a call to it in my vode
23:55:01kkurbjunjust step through it and see how the variables are changing
23:55:16kkurbjunyou can set a breakpoint in gdb on sscanf
23:55:26kkurbjunand then start the code
23:55:38kkurbjunand when you hit the call gdb will stop running
23:55:49kkurbjunso you can step through and see where it's breaking
23:56:08Nico_Pkkurbjun: the segfault was unrelated to where I added the call and I did add a breakpoint on the function that called sscanf and it was never reached
23:56:15Nico_Pbut I'll try breaking on sscanf
23:56:37kkurbjunhuh, I wouldn't have expected that
23:57:48kkurbjunI wonder how newlibs sscanf looks, you might be able to try just bringing that in for now to see what you can do with it, and then cut the code down from there

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