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| 00:05:06 | * | amiconn wonders what's so different between the menu and the browser |
| 00:05:24 | amiconn | The menu is significantly slower than the browser on ipod video unboosted |
| 00:05:26 | * | ender thoughtit'seasiertoalignwithtabs |
| 00:05:34 | amiconn | But it's the same list widget.... |
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| 00:06:13 | | Quit ender (" If you're going to do something tonight that you'll be sorry for tomorrow morning, sleep late.") |
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| 00:13:22 | amiconn | dan_a: around? |
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| 00:25:49 | lazka | sansa still not working and it's definitly the "divide-by-zero" commit that's causing it. |
| 00:26:45 | Llorean | lazka: The "divide by zero" commit tells it to stop ignoring errors. It's not causing it, it's calling attention to it. |
| 00:28:16 | lazka | Llorean: ok :) |
| 00:30:18 | obo | lazka: what address is it reporting the error at? |
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| 00:32:09 | lazka | obo: screen gets white.. then black... wheel light is on -> freeze |
| 00:32:16 | lazka | no output |
| 00:32:30 | amiconn | div0 error in the lcd driver perhaps |
| 00:32:31 | lazka | simulator works fine |
| 00:32:37 | pixelma | Llorean: unless there is a bug in the related code... ;) |
| 00:32:53 | Llorean | amiconn: I'm getting a little bit of green garbage at the top of my screen instead of booting. |
| 00:33:22 | Llorean | Alright |
| 00:33:31 | Llorean | Divide by Zero at 400051F8 |
| 00:33:55 | amiconn | Now check the .map what's there |
| 00:34:12 | Llorean | Doing that |
| 00:35:23 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 00:37:03 | Llorean | amiconn: Just says playback.o |
| 00:37:11 | | Quit seclein2 (Connection timed out) |
| 00:37:15 | linuxstb | Does it say .ibss to the left? |
| 00:37:24 | Llorean | Yes |
| 00:37:29 | linuxstb | Then that's data... |
| 00:37:38 | Llorean | Right |
| 00:37:43 | linuxstb | (my ipod build is the same) |
| 00:38:36 | amiconn | huh? |
| 00:38:47 | linuxstb | Exactly... ;) |
| 00:38:55 | amiconn | That would mean execution is run away |
| 00:39:08 | * | amiconn would expect this address to be icode |
| 00:39:16 | Llorean | Or the div by 0 reporting is reporting the wrong address. |
| 00:40:29 | linuxstb | It seemed to report the correct address for the first problem though (in fat_mount). |
| 00:40:34 | Llorean | Eeep |
| 00:40:40 | Llorean | That div by 0 is in the bootloader |
| 00:40:48 | Llorean | I'd just updated it too. |
| 00:40:49 | Llorean | =/ |
| 00:40:57 | linuxstb | OK, that makes sense. |
| 00:41:13 | linuxstb | The whole of the bootloader runs from IRAM. |
| 00:41:56 | linuxstb | What does the bootloader map say? |
| 00:42:41 | Llorean | fat_mount |
| 00:44:00 | Llorean | Could fat_mount be giving the same problem, before lcd_init, in Rockbox as well and that's what's giving people freezes? |
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| 00:44:27 | linuxstb | Llorean: OK, that's reassuring. You could try adding "if (!fat_bpb->bpb_bytspersec) return -2;" at line 315. before the division using that variable. |
| 00:44:31 | NHeal | heinlein.freenode.net irc.freenode.net |
| 00:44:31 | NJoin | hannesd [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 00:44:36 | linuxstb | (line 315 of firmware/drivers/fat.c) |
| 00:45:00 | Llorean | Let me just recover my Sansa first, gotta track down some firmware. It can't load the OF right now, ;) |
| 00:45:25 | linuxstb | Do you have a SD card? |
| 00:45:47 | Llorean | I do. |
| 00:46:06 | linuxstb | Have you tried booting without it? |
| 00:46:14 | Llorean | Didn't even realize it was in |
| 00:46:27 | | Quit Xerion (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:47:10 | Llorean | Still dividing by zero |
| 00:48:01 | linuxstb | Is the FAT partition is the first partition on the Sansa? |
| 00:48:12 | Llorean | I believe so |
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| 00:49:15 | linuxstb | Then I can't understand why it's getting invalid values and trying to divide by zero. IIUC, the partition probing would try that partition first. |
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| 00:51:37 | NJoin | amiconn [0] (n=jens@p54BD75E0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 00:51:48 | Llorean | linuxstb: With that added to fat.c, the bootloader works fine again |
| 00:52:44 | linuxstb | Good. Tried a normal build? |
| 00:52:52 | Llorean | About to |
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| 00:53:51 | DerPapst | Good night everyone :) |
| 00:53:55 | | Quit DerPapst ("So Long And Thanks For All The Fish!") |
| 00:54:04 | NJoin | krp [0] (n=krp@mar92-10-82-239-65-214.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 00:54:04 | NJoin | Hadaka [0] (i=naked@naked.iki.fi) |
| 00:54:33 | Llorean | linuxstb: Seems to fix the regular build too. |
| 00:54:47 | NJoin | Jon-Kha [0] (n=Jon-Kha@a91-152-87-243.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 00:54:47 | NJoin | w0rd54 [0] (i=blackdev@100mbit.top-site.us) |
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| 00:54:47 | NJoin | Slasheri [0] (i=miipekk@rockbox/developer/Slasheri) |
| 00:54:56 | linuxstb | Llorean: OK, I'll commit that. |
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| 01:01:53 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 01:34:22 | | Part Llorean |
| 01:34:44 | Megaf | RockBox is Linux? |
| 01:34:50 | petur | no |
| 01:34:59 | mike__ | nope |
| 01:35:06 | Megaf | ok |
| 01:35:42 | mike__ | but its similar in many ways |
| 01:35:42 | mike__ | they are both open source |
| 01:36:23 | mike__ | they are both operating systems, although rockbox is only for mp3 players, where linux is mostly aimed towards full computers (although some projects bring it to other devices) |
| 01:36:49 | Megaf | Ok |
| 01:36:50 | | Part toffe82 |
| 01:37:03 | Megaf | my iPod Nano runs iPod Linux |
| 01:37:09 | | Part hcs |
| 01:37:15 | mike__ | nice! |
| 01:37:21 | mike__ | rockbox is similar |
| 01:37:22 | Megaf | i will intall rock box now |
| 01:37:27 | | Quit petur ("Zzzzz") |
| 01:37:35 | Megaf | tri-boot :P |
| 01:37:56 | mike__ | google "ipod rockbox installer" |
| 01:38:02 | mike__ | it will take you to a forum with a nice installer to install rockbox on the ipod |
| 01:38:04 | mike__ | oh |
| 01:38:18 | Megaf | rockbox installer for Linux? |
| 01:38:23 | scorche | mike__: dont recommend that here |
| 01:38:23 | mike__ | i think this will not tri-boot with ipl |
| 01:39:04 | scorche | rockbox will tri boot |
| 01:40:28 | | Quit chrisjs169 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 01:40:48 | mike__ | just replace it |
| 01:40:49 | mike__ | so nevermind.. thats not what you want |
| 01:42:36 | Megaf | i lost my iPod!!! |
| 01:42:41 | Megaf | is not here |
| 01:42:46 | Megaf | where is my ipod? |
| 01:42:53 | scorche | wherever you left it last? |
| 01:43:05 | Megaf | i dont know |
| 01:43:06 | Megaf | hm |
| 01:43:12 | Megaf | my grandfather house |
| 01:43:17 | scorche | well, it sint like we can help you find it... |
| 01:43:33 | Megaf | my ipod is there =/ |
| 01:44:04 | Megaf | well |
| 01:44:05 | Megaf | bye |
| 01:44:09 | | Part Megaf ("Ex-Chat") |
| 01:45:47 | mike__ | haha |
| 01:46:05 | mike__ | i wish the IRC could help find lost goods |
| 01:46:25 | scorche | that would bloat the protocol |
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| 02:00 |
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| 02:05:44 | iamben | how do i reset my sansa if i get a divide by zero error? |
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| 02:06:07 | Llorean | It can be shut down by simply holding the power button for 15 seconds |
| 02:06:35 | iamben | ah i just wasnt patient enough, thanks =) |
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| 02:07:54 | TiMiD[FD] | hello |
| 02:10:51 | iamben | hello |
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| 02:24:11 | * | jhMikeS didn't expect divX0 to be showing up so soon, hehe. important bugs to fix though. |
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| 02:28:12 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: Did it work OK on your Sansa? |
| 02:28:52 | jhMikeS | I no longer have a lockup when going to the file browser from the WPS after extracting the card and trying to read from ti |
| 02:28:55 | jhMikeS | *it |
| 02:30:31 | jhMikeS | perhaps the problem with freezing with the SD enabled will go away now. I got word that some units seem to indeed have bit 7 stuck low until a card is inserted the first time. |
| 02:34:16 | linuxstb | I was talking about the divide by zero commit... |
| 02:35:33 | jhMikeS | in the FAT driver? I think it's relevant to what I was just saying and may have fixed that problem. |
| 02:37:04 | linuxstb | No, I meant did Rockbox work on your Sansa after you enabled the divide by zero check earlier today? |
| 02:37:39 | jhMikeS | I never ran it on sansa. I checked it out on gigabeat only to make sure the trap works then has to run out. |
| 02:37:50 | jhMikeS | s/has/had |
| 02:39:03 | linuxstb | Are SD cards typically formatted as "superfloppies", or do they have a partition table? |
| 02:40:02 | jhMikeS | I don't know. I reformatted mine as FAT32. They were originally FAT16. |
| 02:41:12 | | Quit sneakums (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:41:17 | jhMikeS | what the linux command to see if there's a table? |
| 02:41:36 | linuxstb | It's just that the probing for partitions caused my Elio to crash (when I was working on that port). It's hard disk doesn't have a partition table. |
| 02:42:14 | linuxstb | fdisk -l /dev/sdX will give garbage (I think) if there's no partition table. |
| 02:43:18 | | Join mike__ [0] (n=chatzill@pool-72-66-105-163.washdc.fios.verizon.net) |
| 02:43:32 | mike__ | is there a way to change the controls for my ipod 5.5 gen 30gb? |
| 02:43:54 | mike__ | i want to make the center button select, rather than the fast foreward button |
| 02:44:20 | pixelma | mike__: are you using a custom build? |
| 02:44:26 | mike__ | yes |
| 02:44:43 | pixelma | in an official build center = select |
| 02:45:08 | pixelma | (right works too in most cases) |
| 02:45:15 | mike__ | hmmm |
| 02:45:29 | mike__ | like in the main menu, center should choose my option? |
| 02:45:36 | mike__ | ill have to look into another build then.. |
| 02:45:40 | mike__ | thanks for your help! |
| 02:45:58 | linuxstb | Out of curiosity, which build are you using? |
| 02:46:06 | pixelma | I've read that some custom build include a patch that changes that behaviour |
| 02:46:14 | mike__ | let me check (its the most popular ipod one in the forum) |
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| 02:46:31 | scorche | use the official build... |
| 02:46:32 | mike__ | evilG (http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=8740.0) |
| 02:46:42 | | Quit perplexity (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 02:46:51 | mike__ | im using these for improved theme support |
| 02:46:53 | linuxstb | So what does center do in the main menu? |
| 02:46:53 | mike__ | but I will try now |
| 02:47:08 | mike__ | nothing... if I hold it it brings up a settings for the option im on |
| 02:48:00 | linuxstb | You should probably report it in the thread for that build - it doesn't sound like intended behaviour to me (or at least, not sensible behaviour...) |
| 02:48:30 | mike__ | hmm |
| 02:48:33 | mike__ | its not that bad |
| 02:48:36 | mike__ | just a little annoying |
| 02:48:38 | mike__ | ill do that |
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| 02:51:55 | mike__ | after reading in the forum, i see discussion of this (a patch disables some of its functionality) |
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| 02:56:59 | jhMikeS | linuxstb: i see windows showing partitions and I don't think rockbox has any partition stuff disabled when reading the card. |
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| 03:07:38 | linuxstb | jhMikeS: OK, it sounds like a different issue then. |
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| 03:14:06 | saratoga | oh god theres a static VLC decoder in ffmpeg |
| 03:14:15 | saratoga | why couldn't i notice this sooner |
| 03:15:28 | linuxstb | What's the advantage of that? |
| 03:15:50 | | Part pixelma |
| 03:16:09 | saratoga | i spent 3 days writing one |
| 03:16:17 | saratoga | so that we wouldn't need to use malloc |
| 03:16:30 | saratoga | well not really 3 days, most of it was spent cursing at ffmpeg rather then working |
| 03:17:40 | | Quit tumu (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 03:17:48 | linuxstb | Are you going to use it? |
| 03:19:10 | saratoga | i'm looking at it now |
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| 03:19:25 | saratoga | they've tagged it as "broken/missdesigned" |
| 03:19:31 | saratoga | which isn't encouraging |
| 03:19:39 | saratoga | but mine is pretty broken right now anyway |
| 03:20:51 | | Quit secleinteer (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 03:20:59 | saratoga | looks like they just wrap realloc around an array, so its not really any better then my solution |
| 03:21:10 | saratoga | but would have been infinately easier to implement had i noticed it |
| 03:21:31 | | Quit seclein_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 03:22:02 | saratoga | on the upside, it seems they're annoyed at how horribly stupid their VLC code is to label it depreciated, so maybe we'll get a better one eventually |
| 03:23:08 | linuxstb | BTW, I've been working a little on the asf parsing - the problem with packets being split into multiple payloads. It seems to be worse than I first thought - a single packet can contain payloads belonging to different streams (in the case of video files). I still don't know if an entire superframe will be in a packet (mixed in with video payloads). |
| 03:24:21 | saratoga | is this a concern for pure audio files or just mixed audio/video files? |
| 03:24:59 | linuxstb | So far I've only seen it in mixed audio/video and in pure audio files encoded by ffmpeg. |
| 03:26:13 | linuxstb | The mixed audio/video file was encoded with wmp11 |
| 03:26:21 | linuxstb | Or rather, wmsdk v11 |
| 03:29:43 | saratoga | i'd be ok with not dealing with that case if its particularly difficult |
| 03:30:18 | saratoga | also, I'd really like to know where Jones got this stupid VLC function from, the static one was added to ffmpeg almost 3 years ago . . . |
| 03:31:09 | linuxstb | Wouldn't he have just used whatever the WMA decoder used? |
| 03:31:53 | linuxstb | i.e. without thinking to look for alternatives? |
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| 03:36:17 | saratoga | linuxstb: this is the one the wma decoder used, at least as of 2004 |
| 03:36:28 | saratoga | evidently he didn't take all the code directly from ffmpeg |
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| 03:36:48 | saratoga | the wmadecoder itself seems to be from last summer, but not all of the other parts |
| 03:36:58 | Fusion-Pompadour | Stupid question: |
| 03:38:02 | Fusion-Pompadour | I d/l'd the daily build this morning; and for about 20 mn the iPod displayed a screen saying I needed to re synch w/iTunes |
| 03:38:11 | linuxstb | saratoga: What are your plans? Are you trying to sync with current ffmpeg? |
| 03:38:27 | Fusion-Pompadour | after about 20 mn in the carger it works fine. What's up w/that |
| 03:38:34 | saratoga | linuxstb: i'm merging the changes into one of my PC based test programs to see what difference they really make |
| 03:39:02 | saratoga | i don't really like their static version, so I see no reason to use it, but if they've improved anything else it'd be worth having |
| 03:40:48 | Llorean | Fusion-Pompadour: Rockbox has no such screen, so there's not much that we can answer regarding that. |
| 03:40:57 | Llorean | Nico_P: Hello. |
| 03:41:03 | Nico_P | hi |
| 03:41:09 | linuxstb | saratoga: What's the status of the < 32kbps files? I assume they still don't work? |
| 03:41:11 | Fusion-Pompadour | I may be off topic |
| 03:41:16 | Fusion-Pompadour | sorry |
| 03:41:35 | | Part Fusion-Pompadour ("Konversation terminated!") |
| 03:43:41 | Nico_P | Llorean: got my email ? |
| 03:43:45 | Llorean | Yes |
| 03:46:34 | JdGordon | hey Nico_P |
| 03:46:39 | Nico_P | hi :) |
| 03:46:42 | iamben | dang, this rockbox aint bad |
| 03:47:00 | JdGordon | I had a very quick look at playback.c yesterday, got any ideas where to start merging our code in? |
| 03:47:35 | iamben | the devs & theme makers must have really good vision, these fonts are tiny |
| 03:47:47 | iamben | nice for LOTS of info on the screen though |
| 03:48:13 | Nico_P | JdGordon: places like audio_load_track, audio_fill_file_buffer, audio_rebuffer |
| 03:48:24 | Nico_P | hopefully we can get rid of most of this |
| 03:48:51 | saratoga | linuxstb: I'm actually working on them now |
| 03:48:52 | Nico_P | the place to start looking is probably audio_thread() |
| 03:49:00 | saratoga | i found the VLC thing while debugging them |
| 03:49:08 | JdGordon | right :) |
| 03:49:28 | * | JdGordon goned |
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| 03:57:16 | scorche | iamben: you can change the font... |
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| 04:58:47 | iamben | some of the dirs on my sansa like music & playlists seem to be hidden in the file browser, is this normal? |
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| 05:02:44 | saratoga | rockbox follows the hidden attribute, and also hides folders that start with a dot |
| 05:02:57 | saratoga | either change the folder status or enable the show hidden files option in rockbox |
| 05:04:55 | iamben | hidden, is this a vfat attribute? and how do i change it from linux? |
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| 05:12:18 | iamben | thanks for the info... dunno how to actually toggle "hidden", but recreating the dir worked |
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| 05:19:26 | linuxstb | iamben: I think the only way to do it in Linux is to use mtools. But as you found out, just recreating the dir will create it without the hidden bit. |
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| 05:32:52 | saratoga | linuxstb: do you have a test driver somewhere for your parser ? |
| 05:33:02 | saratoga | something that compiles independently of rockbox? |
| 05:33:26 | saratoga | mine is now really out of date with SVN |
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| 05:34:39 | linuxstb | Yes, I do have one, but it's currently broken - I'm working on getting it working with packets with multiple payloads. I should hopefully clean it up and get it working again tomorrow. |
| 05:36:01 | saratoga | does it have the latest wmadeci included? |
| 05:37:48 | saratoga | linuxstb: I found an optimized VLC routine in ffmpeg that we're not using for some reason, but I'm having a hell of a time getting it to work |
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| 05:47:24 | saratoga | linuxstb: if you have a test driver thats capable of decoding wma files on the disk and that uses something close to the current svn decoder, could you post it? |
| 05:47:34 | saratoga | it will save me the trouble of updating mine |
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| 06:59:35 | alienbiker99 | does rockbox use the podcast tag? |
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| 07:00:33 | RoC_MasterMind | What does that mean |
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| 07:01:18 | RoC_MasterMind | Beryl can see it's there. |
| 07:01:23 | RoC_MasterMind | If it looks I guess |
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| 07:02:04 | rudefyet | beryl on rockbox?! |
| 07:02:12 | rudefyet | j/k |
| 07:03:03 | rudefyet | just loaded rockbox on my new 80gig iPod, it's been awhile, has mpegplayer gotten anywhere? |
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| 07:12:16 | alienbiker99 | if only i could have coverflow for mediamonkey |
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| 07:48:28 | amiconn | jhMikeS: It's really odd. I just checked what coldfire does. Back when we started using the divu/divs instructions, we introduced a div0 exception. However, I've never seen div0 problems popping up un cf... |
| 07:49:32 | amiconn | Note though that not all targets have a div0 exception. SH doesn't, and gcc doesn't offer a way to hook one like on arm |
| 07:51:54 | jhMikeS | amiconn: I did add the string for it to coldfire awhile ago. It does pop up if you force one. |
| 07:53:02 | jhMikeS | btw, audio clicks are back on e200 since the lower CPU frequency makes a cache flush take too long (during lcd updates). |
| 07:54:40 | jhMikeS | though it does appear the battery is lasting a good bit longer |
| 07:55:45 | amiconn | hmm |
| 07:56:06 | amiconn | I couldn't have found that myself. Wonder why saratoga didn't notice it |
| 07:56:36 | amiconn | I wonder why it's necessary to flush cache on sansa during normal operation though |
| 07:56:50 | jhMikeS | It wouldn't be a problem with 1) COP running pcm 2) a nice a of forcing a refill just before flushing the display |
| 07:57:37 | jhMikeS | because the data written to the driver frambuffer won't be current |
| 07:58:43 | jhMikeS | it also rather sluggish in general at 30MHz |
| 08:00 |
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| 08:05:47 | amiconn | That nasty lcd hookup on sansa :( |
| 08:06:21 | amiconn | I wonder whether the PP cache controller allows marking some areas as uncacheable |
| 08:06:47 | jhMikeS | I think that would bog it down horribly |
| 08:07:01 | amiconn | huh? |
| 08:07:14 | amiconn | I would just mark the lcd framebuffer as uncacheable |
| 08:07:53 | jhMikeS | right, but I'm worried that would bog down writes to the driver framebuffer. |
| 08:08:13 | amiconn | Shouldn't be slower than writing to cache+then flush |
| 08:08:24 | jhMikeS | I'm rather fond of the memory mapped graphics ram myself on that and gigabeat |
| 08:09:25 | jhMikeS | mmmm...I don't know. I think it burst transfers that stuff. |
| 08:16:04 | amiconn | Possibly. But flushing the whole cachae all the time doesn't sound efficient |
| 08:18:26 | amiconn | I need to investigate 0x70000034 further. My current guess is that it sets the ram timing (but why 2x?) |
| 08:19:05 | jhMikeS | I wonder about flushing specific ranges and invalidating ones as well |
| 08:19:29 | amiconn | However, the ipod OF sets these timing values to (roughly) clock_in_MHz/10, while the sansa OF sets it (roughly) to clock_in_MHz/5 |
| 08:19:50 | amiconn | ..and the H10 OF to clock_in_MHz/4 |
| 08:20:18 | jhMikeS | is there any use of the MRC instructions or anything? |
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| 08:21:00 | amiconn | The PP doesn't seem to have CP15 |
| 08:21:40 | amiconn | I found no mrc or mcr in the disassemblies |
| 08:32:47 | jhMikeS | f000f040, 60006044 seem to have association to f000f044 (where the flush is initiated) |
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| 08:38:40 | jhMikeS | I've been listening for hours now and I still show 72% (3.95V) :) |
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| 08:47:17 | jhMikeS | I guess f000f040 is written in ipod_init_cache but the emu dump shows it used consistently. |
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| 08:56:56 | * | jhMikeS can't seem to set the boost counter on the screen :\ |
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| 09:03:16 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 09:04:02 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 09:04:50 | amiconn | Hmm. Given the reports about instability on some H10s, I refined my guess for 0x70000034 |
| 09:05:00 | amiconn | It might be the ram waitstates |
| 09:05:25 | amiconn | Will do some experiments to find out. Need to disable the cache for that... |
| 09:07:18 | amiconn | If this is true, it would also explain why ipl doesn't manage stable operation above 75MHz |
| 09:09:26 | jhMikeS | 0x70000034 is set to 0x00000707 in the emu by of but it's set to 0x00001010 in ata_init. ?? |
| 09:10:47 | | Quit Rob2222 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 09:13:08 | amiconn | ipod OF sets it proportional to cpu clock, roughly cpucclock/10 |
| 09:13:25 | amiconn | ...i.e. 0x00000808 at 80MHz, 0x00000303 at 30MHz etc |
| 09:13:51 | amiconn | The sansa loader sets it to 0x00001010 (running at 80MHz) |
| 09:14:05 | amiconn | ...and H10 to 0x00001515 (also at 80MHz) |
| 09:17:01 | jhMikeS | then we've got more wait stats than we need atm |
| 09:17:15 | amiconn | ? |
| 09:17:54 | | Join Zagor [0] (n=bjorn@rockbox/developer/Zagor) |
| 09:17:54 | amiconn | Rockbox uses the ipod formula. If my theory is correct, we use too few waitstates on sansa and h10 |
| 09:19:01 | petur | sounds logical... |
| 09:19:11 | jhMikeS | you said sansa sets to 0x00001010 running at 80MHz but we're only running 75, right? |
| 09:19:27 | amiconn | 78 |
| 09:19:37 | jhMikeS | we already set to 0x1010 |
| 09:21:37 | amiconn | no |
| 09:21:46 | amiconn | At least not in the clock setup |
| 09:22:45 | jhMikeS | if that's what it is, it should definitely get out of ata_init on e200 |
| 09:24:53 | | Quit BHSPitLappy (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 09:26:34 | jhMikeS | amiconn: would you be able to check the pcm-pp.c rework if I send a patch? if it plays and stops without incident then it checks out. |
| 09:26:52 | | Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs) |
| 09:27:44 | | Join Splosh123 [0] (n=splosh12@c58-108-234-152.fitzg1.qld.optusnet.com.au) |
| 09:28:08 | Splosh123 | I need some help? :) |
| 09:29:01 | jhMikeS | as for pp5002, I can't check it. I just need to determine if writing to the FIFO actually is enough to ack the request. |
| 09:29:58 | amiconn | 5002? |
| 09:30:11 | Splosh123 | I had rockbox on my ipod Video 30GB. And then i deleted everything on my ipod (.rockbox folder, hidden ipod folder and all music) now the ipod is not being reconised by windows at all? :S |
| 09:30:12 | amiconn | I can't test atm, no time |
| 09:32:56 | jhMikeS | ok...it redoes some stuff on 5002 besided for 502x but no cable for the 3g :( |
| 09:35:59 | jhMikeS | frankly I should just switch all the 502x over to 16-bit samples and get rid of the << 16 for them |
| 09:38:51 | JdGordon | does the gigbeat have recording? |
| 09:39:46 | jhMikeS | it appears it could but in a limited way since the IIS SDIN is exposed to the world according to the block diagram |
| 09:44:39 | JdGordon | cool, when was the timer added to the current builds page? |
| 09:45:54 | jhMikeS | time on gigabeat? |
| 09:45:58 | jhMikeS | -r |
| 09:46:19 | jhMikeS | oh, never mind :P |
| 09:47:15 | | Nick funky_ is now known as funky (n=repulse@6.Red-80-33-196.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 09:48:05 | jhMikeS | it seems indeed that writing to the FIFO is an FIQ ack for 502x and nothing else is needed |
| 09:48:49 | JdGordon | thats a bit odd... |
| 09:48:58 | JdGordon | +88bytes on non rec targets! |
| 09:50:04 | | Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 09:53:09 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Why do you think I could test on pp5002? |
| 09:53:18 | petur | JdGordon: isn't English lang build-in? |
| 09:53:40 | JdGordon | bah, yeah forgot about that |
| 09:53:45 | jhMikeS | amiconn: just wondering if you could since I wasn't sure. pp5020 tests would also be good though. |
| 09:53:49 | * | JdGordon goes back to not worrying about it |
| 09:53:55 | | Join obo [0] (n=obo@82-46-82-224.cable.ubr02.trow.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 09:54:02 | pixelma | that reminds me of the langV2 patch... |
| 09:54:04 | | Join Crash91 [0] (i=c4dbb954@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ce58462357267787) |
| 09:54:29 | Crash91 | hi guys |
| 09:54:42 | JdGordon | pixelma: do you know if the groundowrk can be done for that patch so we can slowly go through and fix the strings instead of doing it in 1 massive patch? |
| 09:55:36 | Crash91 | im just here to say - > Great work! you guys were like dead for a week then all these improvements :D *rubs hands with glee* |
| 09:56:21 | markun | Crash91: there is always stuff going on even if there are no commits |
| 09:56:28 | J | this might be a silly request, but on http://build.rockbox.org/ could somebody please say what the colours indicate? |
| 09:56:37 | pixelma | JdGordon: I think the groundwork is pretty much done - but the english.lang shouldn't be altered too often (especially because of voice). You could help syncing it again ;) |
| 09:56:45 | scorche | J: in which chart? |
| 09:56:51 | Zagor | jhulst: green is good, red is bad :-) |
| 09:56:52 | J | either, both! |
| 09:57:24 | J | Zagor: good how? Bad why? |
| 09:57:43 | Zagor | jhulst: top char is about compiler errors and warnings. green = no errors/warnings. |
| 09:57:53 | J | it would be useful to add the information to the page IMO |
| 09:58:09 | petur | 2 more (good) commits and we're all green :) |
| 09:58:14 | Zagor | J: bottom chart is about binary size. green means size went down (good), red means size went up (bad) |
| 09:58:23 | pixelma | JdGordon: hmm... weird way of mine to put these things together in one sentence |
| 09:59:06 | J | and the numbers which are neither colour? |
| 09:59:35 | Zagor | jhulst: they are so small they don't count :-) |
| 09:59:46 | Crash91 | stayed neutral i think |
| 09:59:54 | Crash91 | deleted and added same amount? |
| 09:59:55 | Crash91 | lol |
| 09:59:56 | Zagor | meh, xchat expands nicks wrong |
| 09:59:59 | jhMikeS | gcc's treatment of r12 also seems somewhat randon hence the data aborts after recording. I cache the data in r10 and r11 FIQ banked and just use banked r12 as scratch |
| 10:00 |
| 10:00:02 | | Quit billytwowilly (Remote closed the connection) |
| 10:00:18 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S0106001346f5afbd.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 10:00:31 | J | could that information be added to the page? It's information which is good to know... |
| 10:00:35 | amiconn | jhMikeS: I hope to be able to test tonight (CET). But it might be that I won't have the mini g1 available anymore by then |
| 10:01:13 | Zagor | Crash91: no, all numbers are actual changes. but iirc up to 16 bytes can change simply due to difference in struct padding etc so no real fault of the patch. |
| 10:01:27 | Zagor | don't quote me on that last bit though :) |
| 10:01:46 | jhMikeS | time to give it back? :) |
| 10:03:29 | Crash91 | > im downloading something so im quit laggy |
| 10:03:32 | | Join safetydan [0] (n=dan@rockbox/developer/safetydan) |
| 10:05:02 | Crash91 | finished now :) |
| 10:06:01 | Crash91 | one last question |
| 10:06:36 | Crash91 | does anyone know how to use media coder to convert all the files in a directory that has loads of subdirectories? |
| 10:07:16 | Crash91 | in my case, /Music/<Artist>/<Album>/<mp3 file(s)> |
| 10:07:50 | Zagor | Crash91: do you use linux? |
| 10:08:08 | JdGordon | are we still short on mini 1g's in the dev group? |
| 10:08:33 | Zagor | Crash91: oh media coder only runs on windows. I don't know then... |
| 10:08:48 | Crash91 | nope, today windows for a change :) |
| 10:11:12 | Crash91 | i have been using linux for a week |
| 10:13:48 | | Quit Crash91 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 10:14:51 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp37-220.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 10:18:45 | | Join Crash91 [0] (n=Crash91@196.219.185.84) |
| 10:19:21 | Crash91 | is mpegplayer good enough for playing full length movies on the sansa? |
| 10:21:22 | scorche | as long as you can watch it in one sitting without having to resume |
| 10:23:13 | | Join pondlife [0] (n=Miranda@cpc1-rdng11-0-0-cust362.winn.cable.ntl.com) |
| 10:23:25 | Crash91 | hehe i have a trick for that |
| 10:23:29 | Crash91 | slpit files |
| 10:24:02 | Crash91 | how big will an mpeg file be compared to a 700mb divx avi? |
| 10:24:17 | | Join Xerion [0] (i=xerion@cp198589-d.landg1.lb.home.nl) |
| 10:24:28 | markun | depends on the bitrate you use |
| 10:24:38 | aliask | And the resolution. |
| 10:24:45 | markun | no, only the bitrate |
| 10:24:47 | aliask | Well, indirectly. |
| 10:25:02 | aliask | You can use a lower bitrate with a smaller resolution... |
| 10:25:17 | Crash91 | well what should i use? for 208x176 video |
| 10:25:36 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@vpnsh0237.fh-trier.de) |
| 10:25:46 | Crash91 | and whats mpeg4 ASP and mpeg 4 AVC |
| 10:26:03 | | Join freqmod [0] (n=freqmod@244.84-48-78.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:26:41 | | Quit Wiwie (Client Quit) |
| 10:27:02 | Crash91 | here are my settings in the iPod extension of Media coder (yes! it has sansa resolution) |
| 10:27:51 | TiMiD[FD] | Crash91: you should check google, there are tons of articles explaining that |
| 10:28:01 | TiMiD[FD] | wikipedia also |
| 10:28:16 | Crash91 | video: Mpeg4 ASP, audio mp3, 208x176, expand to fit, 20fps, vid bitrate 400 and audio quality : "lower" |
| 10:28:37 | Crash91 | im just checking the mpegplayer wiki.. |
| 10:30:17 | TiMiD[FD] | do they really mention mpeg4 ASP/AVX ? |
| 10:30:20 | TiMiD[FD] | AVC |
| 10:30:29 | TiMiD[FD] | the site seems dead |
| 10:30:53 | Crash91 | no, but they do have an extension for mediacoder which i saw recently |
| 10:31:00 | Crash91 | it should do everything for me :) |
| 10:31:28 | TiMiD[FD] | ah right |
| 10:31:54 | TiMiD[FD] | never used that soft |
| 10:32:11 | | Quit perplexity (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:32:53 | Crash91 | encoding... |
| 10:33:45 | Crash91 | sansa media coverter made 693MB of mov files in 4 parts |
| 10:33:53 | Crash91 | im expecting better from this :) |
| 10:36:53 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:36:59 | | Join PaulJam [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3113.gwdg.de) |
| 10:37:16 | Crash91 | i think now that scaling has been enabled on sansa, it will work much better |
| 10:37:17 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF75BD.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:39:58 | PaulJam | Crash91: why? how should cpu scaling improve the performance. |
| 10:40:30 | Crash91 | battery |
| 10:40:48 | Crash91 | rockbox>5hours (if youre lucky) OF> 15 hours |
| 10:40:58 | PaulJam | ah, i thought you were talking about the mpegplayer performance |
| 10:41:10 | Crash91 | yeah and i think that might help |
| 10:41:14 | Crash91 | mpegplayer as well |
| 10:41:57 | PaulJam | mpegplayer will propably always boost on a fullscreen video on sansa |
| 10:42:33 | Crash91 | this is very irritating, mediacoder keeps encoding my Xvid to an mp3! |
| 10:42:45 | TiMiD[FD] | you could use mencoder |
| 10:43:04 | TiMiD[FD] | you can control very finely the parameters |
| 10:44:20 | Crash91 | mencoder is bundeled with media coder, just tell me the params |
| 10:45:27 | TiMiD[FD] | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/PluginMpegplayer#UsingMplayer_Mencoder_to_encode |
| 10:45:46 | Crash91 | got it before you :p |
| 10:46:16 | TiMiD[FD] | hmm |
| 10:46:17 | | Join AceNik [0] (n=AceNik@203.145.159.44) |
| 10:46:21 | TiMiD[FD] | there is also avidemux |
| 10:46:37 | TiMiD[FD] | actually I used that one to encode my videos if I recall |
| 10:47:02 | AceNik | guys i opened up my setero pin of my headphones to repair, the thin is there are 2golden wires, n 1 red n 1 green , how to solder them on 3 terminals |
| 10:47:09 | TiMiD[FD] | http://fixounet.free.fr/avidemux/ |
| 10:48:25 | AceNik | anyone? |
| 10:48:49 | | Quit AceNik (Client Quit) |
| 10:52:05 | | Quit Splosh123 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:54:01 | Crash91 | mencoder isnt working |
| 10:54:13 | Crash91 | it keeps saying system cannot find spec. file |
| 10:54:27 | | Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@avc146.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 10:58:33 | aliask | I'm playing around with making a tree for the gigabeat S, but it looks like the stuff in the target tree isn't being included. I've edited the stuff in the configure script, but is there something else? |
| 10:59:04 | markun | aliask: I think ptw419 has done the same, so maybe you should work together |
| 10:59:13 | | Join Entasis [0] (n=Jarred@ppp121-45-166-156.lns11.adl2.internode.on.net) |
| 10:59:43 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@vpnsh0035.fh-trier.de) |
| 10:59:48 | markun | aliask: yes, you need to add files to firmware/SOURCES too |
| 10:59:51 | aliask | He hasn't finished, and he asked if I could take a look. |
| 11:00 |
| 11:00:29 | aliask | Ah cool. Thanks for the pointer. |
| 11:01:41 | scorche | oh wow... Llorean: since when has the forums had "/me"? |
| 11:01:59 | Llorean | scorche: Day one, I believe. They're sneaky like that. |
| 11:02:08 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 11:02:25 | scorche | hrm...well, that is my "learn something new" for today... |
| 11:02:40 | Llorean | Though it looks like it didn't work. |
| 11:03:18 | scorche | odd...it worked in the preview |
| 11:03:29 | Llorean | And it's not disabled, I just checked. |
| 11:03:41 | Llorean | Wrap it in [me] and [/me] for the same effect |
| 11:03:56 | scorche | hrm....odd how it would work in the preview, but not in the post.. |
| 11:04:33 | scorche | that didnt even work int he preview |
| 11:05:00 | Llorean | Odd. |
| 11:05:11 | * | scorche nods in agreement |
| 11:05:31 | * | Crash91 never knew that ogg was so much better and smaller than mp3! |
| 11:05:40 | | Join perplexity [0] (i=heh12664@dxb-as74784.alshamil.net.ae) |
| 11:05:46 | scorche | well, that is a bit of a generalization... |
| 11:05:55 | | Join webguest46 [0] (i=bd91d39d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-2760016eb412b7b2) |
| 11:05:59 | Crash91 | yeah i know |
| 11:06:12 | Llorean | scorche: Odd, I don't know. I swear I've seen it used in the past, and can't think of what I've changed that might disable it. |
| 11:06:12 | Crash91 | but for me, encoding my files to ogg is just fine |
| 11:06:24 | | Join w1ll14m [0] (i=546851d0@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-0849f07834b3a503) |
| 11:07:01 | w1ll14m | i have a question, what is the recommended gcc version to compile rockbox arm ? |
| 11:07:04 | Crash91 | how do you op yourself if youre op in that channel and you have it registered? |
| 11:07:10 | Crash91 | 4.03 |
| 11:07:22 | dionoea | /msg chanserv op #channel nick |
| 11:07:22 | | Quit webguest46 (Client Quit) |
| 11:07:23 | scorche | 4.0.3 , rather |
| 11:07:38 | Crash91 | but doesnt rockboxdev.sh do it for you? |
| 11:07:47 | scorche | it does |
| 11:08:04 | w1ll14m | crash thanx :) still got 3.4.5 so i'm getting a new version ;) |
| 11:08:05 | w1ll14m | thanx |
| 11:08:07 | Crash91 | dionea:thanks |
| 11:08:15 | w1ll14m | scorche also thanx! |
| 11:08:16 | Crash91 | dionoea* |
| 11:08:28 | Crash91 | lol i missed a dot, sorry |
| 11:08:29 | scorche | w1ll14m: well, a new version wont work...you need it to be 4.0.3 specifically |
| 11:08:48 | Crash91 | what OS are you using> |
| 11:08:54 | scorche | Crash91: you dont need the nick portion if you are opping yourself |
| 11:09:03 | w1ll14m | i know :) i forgot which version it was..... but i allready know that i would need a specific gcc |
| 11:09:32 | Crash91 | w1ll14m: are you using linux? |
| 11:09:37 | w1ll14m | yes |
| 11:09:46 | w1ll14m | gentoo linux to be exact |
| 11:10:32 | Crash91 | ok hold on for a sec |
| 11:11:11 | Crash91 | ok, have you co-svnned? |
| 11:11:34 | w1ll14m | :) of course i've been compiling rockbox since december 2006 :) |
| 11:11:49 | w1ll14m | i just needed to know the exact gcc version ;) |
| 11:12:12 | Crash91 | ok |
| 11:12:16 | Crash91 | now goto |
| 11:12:19 | w1ll14m | but thanx for the help anyway :) |
| 11:12:40 | Crash91 | goto /tools/configure |
| 11:12:46 | Crash91 | then ./rockboxdev.sh |
| 11:12:50 | Crash91 | and follow |
| 11:12:58 | Crash91 | it will install the compiler for you |
| 11:13:01 | w1ll14m | i could use that one too :) |
| 11:13:04 | Crash91 | the correct version |
| 11:13:24 | w1ll14m | at the moment i'm trying crossdev with gcc 4.0.3 arm-elf |
| 11:13:25 | Crash91 | from mail archive |
| 11:13:25 | Crash91 | When run, it asks you what target architecture you want a compiler setup for. |
| 11:13:25 | Crash91 | Then, it downloads, unpacks, builds and installs binutils and the gcc |
| 11:13:25 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK Crash91 |
| 11:13:25 | Crash91 | cross-compiler for you. |
| 11:13:39 | w1ll14m | if that won't work ll use rockboxdev.sh |
| 11:13:44 | Crash91 | ok |
| 11:13:49 | Crash91 | good luck |
| 11:14:01 | w1ll14m | thanx! :) i think i will suceed ;) |
| 11:14:32 | scorche | it also will patch gcc with a few patches we have for it...there is actually one patch we have for arm gcc, but it will only affect you if you delve into thumb code, so you dont *really* need it |
| 11:14:59 | w1ll14m | ahh ok :) |
| 11:15:26 | scorche | the other patch is to sh gcc, so likely wont affect you |
| 11:15:33 | Crash91 | omg! i need 30more mb of free space.. to get another movie on :p |
| 11:15:46 | w1ll14m | ok |
| 11:15:51 | JdGordon | pixelma: apart from being out of sync, whats holding the langv2 patch from commit? |
| 11:17:53 | | Quit obo ("bye") |
| 11:18:04 | safetydan | JdGordon, it's one of those things that you only want to do once. And not all the strings have been properly categorised. |
| 11:18:37 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 11:18:43 | freqmod | Could somebody tell me what the second column of a dissasembly means (the one which i have underlined): "0:_4553_ 042523" I can't find a good enough manual |
| 11:18:54 | freqmod | after 0: |
| 11:19:19 | JdGordon | safetydan: do you know how many strings need cataegorising still? |
| 11:20:39 | | Join thegeek [0] (i=thegeek@ti521110a080-5005.bb.online.no) |
| 11:21:45 | JdGordon | there is a bug in features.txt btw |
| 11:22:11 | JdGordon | #if defined(CONFIG_TUNER) is wrong... it needs to be #if CONFIG_TUNER because its defined to 0 on targets without |
| 11:23:05 | JdGordon | ... and just thinking, shouldnt features.txt be in apps/lang to make is easier to find? |
| 11:27:07 | | Quit PaulJam (".") |
| 11:27:19 | JdGordon | safetydan: pixelma: have the order of strings in english.lang been changed? and have they been worked on in order? so the last one with features is the last one which has been done? |
| 11:27:31 | JdGordon | .. I mean, everytihng above that one is done? |
| 11:28:44 | Ctcp | Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood |
| 11:28:44 | * | Crash91 loves OGG |
| 11:28:59 | | Part Crash91 |
| 11:35:11 | | Quit Xerion (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 11:35:34 | safetydan | JdGordon, the strings have been sorted yes. |
| 11:35:52 | safetydan | The big thing stopping its commit is that it will break all voice files and then we'll need to have per-target voice files. |
| 11:36:18 | pixelma | JdGordon: I think it was complete against the last svn it was synced to |
| 11:36:56 | JdGordon | the english.lang.rej is longer than english.lang by 400 lines! |
| 11:37:36 | aliask | I remember giving up trying to sync that patch at that point. |
| 11:37:46 | pixelma | when I synced it once, I gave up working with the .rej |
| 11:38:06 | | Quit thegeek_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 11:38:57 | JdGordon | hmm, well if the lang was finshed at that point its not really that hard to sync it up again, and then fix the strings added since then |
| 11:40:27 | pixelma | (the english.lang.rej that is - took the others though) |
| 11:42:31 | | Join kaaloo [0] (n=luis@bne75-7-82-230-110-107.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 11:42:46 | | Part kaaloo |
| 11:42:55 | w1ll14m | damn my build is from 07-05-2007, i need to update :) |
| 11:43:06 | | Quit desowin (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 11:44:46 | | Quit Llorean (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 11:45:06 | | Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@avc146.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 11:45:51 | | Join webguest37 [0] (i=c023110f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-644169df90ce3376) |
| 11:45:59 | pixelma | Zagor: just wanted to point you to the last one who registered at twiki (AntiqX) |
| 11:46:09 | pondlife | amiconn: Has anyone monitored the CPU frequency on PortalPlayer under the OF? Not sure how you could do this, but I wonder if it uses a sliding scale. |
| 11:47:50 | Zagor | pixelma: thanks. killed. |
| 11:48:08 | * | scorche cleans up the remains |
| 11:48:26 | petur | there are more twiki users with illegal names, iirc there's even on that has write access (unless it was his real name) |
| 11:50:16 | scorche | some of those are touchy... |
| 11:52:02 | Zagor | yeah we've been sloppy at times |
| 11:53:37 | petur | bah... can't find him anymore :/ |
| 11:53:54 | pixelma | yeah... I remember someone called himself ThiasHias (and got write access). His email address was something with "matze" which is only a german nickname for Matthias... I believe he was deleted later (not sure) |
| 11:56:36 | midkay | Matthias != Thias.. so he should have been deleted if he wasn't :) |
| 11:57:25 | markun | or renamed |
| 11:58:18 | midkay | would he know that he was renamed? he'd try to login and wouldn't be able to as Thias... |
| 12:00 |
| 12:00:01 | | Join Xerion [0] (i=xerion@cp198589-d.landg1.lb.home.nl) |
| 12:00:06 | pixelma | found it odd especially with the "Hias" part ;) |
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| 12:23:05 | JdGordon | :'( I hate trying to figure out stupid annoying bugs |
| 12:23:21 | JdGordon | why the hell is the root menu passing 0x1 to do_menu() :'( |
| 12:24:27 | w1ll14m | hehe :) i've got my cross-platform compiler up and working again :) |
| 12:25:07 | w1ll14m | i see we have a wma codec? |
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| 12:30:56 | safetydan | Huzzah! I finally can get assembler interweaved with the C source with objdump |
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| 12:37:48 | | Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 12:37:53 | linuxstb | safetydan: Please share... |
| 12:38:14 | safetydan | linuxstb, compile with -g then you can use objdump −−source <object file> |
| 12:39:00 | linuxstb | pondlife: Regarding CPU frequency on PP, I remember that some of the older ipods (up to the 4G greyscale and minis IIRC) had a hack available where if you created a text file with a specific name in the iPod_Control folder, it would display the current CPU frequency in the status bar. But I can't remember the details. |
| 12:39:46 | GodEater_ | how people find little easter eggs like that never ceases to amaze me |
| 12:39:54 | linuxstb | I tried it once on my ipod Color, and it didn't work. It's also possible that it was removed in newer firmware versions for the older ipods. |
| 12:40:18 | linuxstb | Probably by searching for strings in the firmware. Or someone from Apple leaked it. |
| 12:40:39 | pondlife | It was just a random thought I had that might save battery life on the PP targets... no biggie, but I thought I should share it. |
| 12:40:51 | linuxstb | The ipodwizard people probably spent a long time staring at hex dumps of the ipod firmware. |
| 12:41:43 | GodEater_ | very helpful if you can't sleep I find |
| 12:42:04 | linuxstb | Ah, here are the details - http://www.winbeta.org/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t7177.html |
| 12:42:06 | pondlife | amiconn was saying he had rather got into the OF style... |
| 12:43:06 | linuxstb | GodEater: BTW, is there any arrangement for DevConPub? |
| 12:43:14 | * | linuxstb has forgotten what day was arranged... |
| 12:44:17 | linuxstb | And do you still need my 20GB hard disk? |
| 12:44:37 | pondlife | linuxstb: It's tomorrow |
| 12:44:42 | linuxstb | Thought so. |
| 12:44:47 | pondlife | I definitely can't make it :( |
| 12:44:57 | GodEater_ | meeting at the hotel |
| 12:45:12 | GodEater_ | I've been a bit ill over the weekend so didn't manage to explore properly |
| 12:45:18 | linuxstb | Is there anyone else apart from us and Mr & Mrs Febs? |
| 12:45:29 | GodEater_ | there were a couple of other people posted in the thread |
| 12:45:35 | GodEater_ | which I updated this morning |
| 12:45:45 | GodEater_ | not sure if they're actually going to come though |
| 12:45:56 | GodEater_ | and yes I'd still like the 20G disk please :) |
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| 13:00 |
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| 13:02:09 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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| 13:05:01 | amiconn | pondlife: Most OFs do a different thing than rockbox wrt clock frequencies |
| 13:06:40 | pondlife | I know, I was just considering that this might be a factor towards the battery life. We have a step-boost, perhaps it's more of a sliding scale with other firmwares? |
| 13:06:47 | amiconn | One has a huge table with codecs and their performance requirements (base clock) and additional requirements (dsp stuff), and calculates the necessary clock from that |
| 13:07:12 | amiconn | The rockbox way is more flexible with less different frequencies |
| 13:08:08 | pondlife | No problem, just mentioning it in case it were useful. |
| 13:08:32 | amiconn | It adapts the effective clock to the *actual* requirements (think e.g. vbr files) and hence is more effectife as long as the power drain varies proportional to cpu clock |
| 13:08:34 | pondlife | I don't have a PP target, but would love to see Rockbox beating the OF for battery life on all targets |
| 13:09:34 | amiconn | The problem on PP is that (1) our most common codec (libmad) is considerably less efficient than the coldfire version, |
| 13:09:44 | | Quit yohannrjm () |
| 13:10:26 | amiconn | (2) we don't know much about the chip hence there are most probably some modules running which are normally powered down by the of |
| 13:10:41 | amiconn | (3) We don't know how to power down the hdd on ipods |
| 13:11:23 | amiconn | hi LinusN :) |
| 13:11:32 | | Quit adrift ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]") |
| 13:11:32 | LinusN | hi |
| 13:13:14 | amiconn | LinusN: What do you think is the better approach for PP clock scaling: making the clock setup routine calculate registers at runtime (more flexible, can set all possible clock frequencies e.g. in 1MHz steps) or using precalculated values like on coldfire? |
| 13:13:32 | amiconn | I want to clean up this stuff after some more research |
| 13:13:39 | LinusN | i like precalculated |
| 13:14:05 | * | LinusN gets some coffee |
| 13:14:16 | amiconn | Is there a special reason? |
| 13:16:08 | pondlife | As long as the on-the-fly calculation isn't too slow, why not go with that? Smaller binsize, more flexible.... I suppose the boost mechanism could then go up a step at a time (depending on the boost count) and that might save CPU? |
| 13:16:14 | jhMikeS | some day we might need more gradual frequency scaling ala low latency audio. it's one of those major sticky points about it. |
| 13:16:16 | | Quit RaRe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:16:40 | LinusN | well, it' |
| 13:17:12 | LinusN | s a philosophical thing really, why calculate it in runtime when you always end up with the same result |
| 13:17:22 | LinusN | (as it works now) |
| 13:17:44 | amiconn | Easier to adapt if you want different frequencies |
| 13:17:56 | pondlife | Depends on how big you want the precalculated table to grow too.. |
| 13:18:13 | LinusN | pondlife: i don't think 3 entries would kill us |
| 13:18:14 | amiconn | pondlife: Well, 3 entries atm |
| 13:18:32 | dionoea | well some decoding could be done halfway between the low and high freqs used in rockbox. So it might help lower battery consumption right? (or does 1sec @low + 1sec @high drain the same as 2sec @mid ?) |
| 13:19:28 | pondlife | I wouldn't expect it to be linear, based on limited desktop CPU experience. Isn't higher frequency normally an exponential power hog? |
| 13:19:38 | pondlife | (or thereabouts) |
| 13:19:43 | LinusN | i don't think we should go for more frequencies until we have a very good reason to |
| 13:19:48 | Llorean | dionoea: There's a small cost in time during the frequency change, but its pretty tiny. |
| 13:19:59 | * | jhMikeS would like to know power frequency vs. power and current curves |
| 13:20:03 | LinusN | KISS as always |
| 13:20:28 | pondlife | I could argue that having a calculation is simpler than a lookup table. |
| 13:20:42 | pondlife | (Depends on the calculation though!) |
| 13:20:52 | amiconn | pondlife: As long as voltage is constant, cmos chips have a linear frequency vs. power dependency |
| 13:20:53 | LinusN | well, if the calculation is there, and it works... |
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| 13:22:26 | amiconn | Some notebook chips can lower their voltage at lower clock, and then it becomes nonlinear |
| 13:23:15 | amiconn | LinusN: Full calculation is not there atm |
| 13:23:55 | amiconn | The OF calculates everything, and uses MHz units (PP5020+) or even kHz (PP5002) |
| 13:24:44 | | Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@p54BD375A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:24:50 | pondlife | Ultimately, whichever strategy can give the best battery life (whilst being 100% stable) is the one... we need to experiment, right? |
| 13:24:51 | DerPapst | hi :) |
| 13:25:47 | DerPapst | i like the idea at calculating the frequency at runtime... |
| 13:26:33 | amiconn | I don't |
| 13:26:35 | w1ll14m | well actualy to be honest i'm still using my ipod at 24/60/90 MHz it runs better than normal frequency (especialy when using dsp) |
| 13:26:40 | Llorean | It might be useful for game/graphical-plugins that require a bit more oomph than normal, but don't need full boost? |
| 13:27:13 | pondlife | I was thinking it could result in less frequency switching. |
| 13:27:13 | | Quit w1ll14m ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 13:27:31 | jhMikeS | The supply voltage is more important to power consumtion that f |
| 13:27:41 | amiconn | pondlife: I hope to be able to implement switch-to-idle-on-sleep, that might help too |
| 13:28:16 | Llorean | pondlife: VBR files could result in either a heck of a lot of switching, or if you have it 'hold peaks' as it were, time wasted at peaks. |
| 13:28:20 | jhMikeS | only thing is, nothing can sleep during playback since codec yield(), not sleep() |
| 13:30:23 | amiconn | why? |
| 13:30:39 | amiconn | If there's really nothing to do atm, codecs should sleep(0) |
| 13:31:01 | jhMikeS | oh, just forget that...it does sleeping when waiting for a buffer available |
| 13:34:11 | markun | Llorean: oops, was I not supposed to move the "Best custom build for nano? Senab, EvilG, PJulius or what?" thread? |
| 13:34:27 | | Join Thundercloud [0] (n=thunderc@84-51-130-71.judith186.adsl.metronet.co.uk) |
| 13:36:13 | Llorean | markun: The unsupported builds forum is just supposed to have one build per thread. It's not really a discussion forum. But he'd already asked those questions anyway, and completely ignored the answer. |
| 13:36:19 | Llorean | Err, one thread per build |
| 13:36:52 | Llorean | There's not really a good place for general questions about unsupported builds, because really outside of "Which one's the best" which nobody can answer anyway, theres nothing you can ask generally anyway. |
| 13:38:22 | amiconn | Is there a H10 firmware dump (unencrypted) available somewhere? |
| 13:39:03 | Llorean | amiconn: There's an encrypted one at Bagder's site, I think. mi4code works on it, I believe. |
| 13:39:13 | | Join Nico_P [0] (n=nicolas@rob92-6-82-231-243-63.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 13:40:16 | linuxstb | amiconn: You need mi4code.c from here - http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/mi4code.html - and the firmware from here - http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/h10/H10.mi4 or http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/h10-20GC/H10_20GC.mi4 |
| 13:41:06 | linuxstb | When you unencrypt the mi4 file, you'll need to strip the 512 byte (IIRC) header. |
| 13:42:55 | jhMikeS | I did PP5022.mi4 and remember a header strip thingy somewhere (option?) |
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| 13:43:56 | | Quit spiorf (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:44:03 | jhMikeS | of course it might be one of those days where everything I say is just plain wrong |
| 13:47:57 | * | pondlife has those most days |
| 13:48:35 | * | linuxstb has learnt not to talk during those days |
| 13:49:32 | * | jhMikeS just talks and hopes something is right by pure, random chance |
| 13:52:38 | | Quit safetydan ("Ex-Chat") |
| 13:54:35 | | Join crop [0] (i=c27f0812@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/session) |
| 13:55:35 | crop | Has putting some data/code into iram sped up the wma codec? In the comments it reads "should" |
| 13:55:57 | | Quit krazykit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 13:57:25 | aliask | crop: By the sounds of it they most likely will speed up the decoding process, but it hasn't been benchmarked. |
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| 14:00 |
| 14:02:47 | linuxstb | saratoga doesn't have a Coldfire target, so needs others to benchmark for him. |
| 14:03:44 | crop | linuxstb: how can it be benchmarked? Is there a plugin or something? |
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| 14:06:46 | | Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara") |
| 14:08:05 | linuxstb | crop: Yes, the test_codec plugin (not compiled by default - add it to apps/plugins/SOURCES) |
| 14:08:42 | crop | crop: why was it excluded from SOURCES btw? |
| 14:09:10 | linuxstb | Because it's not aimed at users. Same as the other test_* plugins |
| 14:09:43 | linuxstb | Although maybe (once the bugs are ironed out), it could be useful to include if users want to compare codec performance. |
| 14:10:47 | | Quit Siltaar (Remote closed the connection) |
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| 14:13:40 | pondlife | Anyone think that http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7417 should be rejected? It sounds a familar request... |
| 14:13:56 | pondlife | A configurable quick menu... |
| 14:14:38 | petur | tell 'm to use cfg files for quick changes ;) |
| 14:14:56 | * | GodEater_ agrees with petur |
| 14:14:56 | pondlife | I'll let the experts do that...! |
| 14:15:40 | crop | linuxstb: and how can I use the plugin once I've built it? This won't happen the next two weeks −− my PC is bricked |
| 14:19:02 | GodEater_ | crop: you're doing a good job of logging into IRC without a working PC ;) |
| 14:19:54 | crop | I'm using a friend's one. No RB dev env here. |
| 14:21:17 | * | pondlife misread that as "dev envy" :) |
| 14:21:49 | * | LinusN envies those who have time for rockbox development |
| 14:21:59 | pondlife | Exactly.. |
| 14:22:25 | pondlife | time for lunch though |
| 14:28:59 | crop | pondlife: how did you manage to find the "follow playlist" bug? |
| 14:29:10 | crop | it was rather tricky IMHO |
| 14:29:41 | pondlife | I couldn't get the sim to show it, so just put lots of logfs in. |
| 14:30:25 | crop | So it didn't occur on the sim? |
| 14:30:53 | pondlife | No. But the logfs let me know which routine was first "generating" the wrong filename.... then I spotted that playlist_peek(0) was being used elsewhere to get the current track. |
| 14:31:08 | pondlife | So I simplified, and it seems to work ok. |
| 14:31:29 | pondlife | Is it ok for you, or have I borked something else? |
| 14:31:41 | | Join Soul-Slayer [0] (n=Administ@89.243.250.159) |
| 14:31:46 | crop | Hm... But miika must have had a reason for putting such an index there |
| 14:31:55 | crop | It's ok |
| 14:31:57 | pondlife | It's been there a very long time |
| 14:32:16 | pondlife | Maybe scrobbling? Is that working still? |
| 14:32:19 | | Join w1ll14m [0] (i=546851d0@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-56f4b1d1102919d9) |
| 14:32:29 | pondlife | Or database playcount? |
| 14:32:41 | | Join Crash91 [0] (n=crash@196.219.185.84) |
| 14:32:54 | crop | I don't use the DB |
| 14:32:55 | Crash91 | any wps experts around? |
| 14:32:56 | Soul-Slayer | Hey, I made a battery bench of my gigabeat playing a 192kbps album on repeat using default settings... If I upload the results to paste bin could someone tell me if they seem right? I'm not sure how to read it properly :$ |
| 14:33:05 | pondlife | crop: Me neither |
| 14:33:34 | pondlife | Maybe some kind soul who uses scrobbling and/or the database runtime stats will read this and test it for me. |
| 14:33:43 | pondlife | Anyway, gotta go and eat |
| 14:33:48 | Crash91 | test what |
| 14:33:58 | crop | pondlife: me too. Have to go. Bye |
| 14:34:00 | | Part crop |
| 14:34:32 | Soul-Slayer | http://pastebin.ca/612450 Does this seem right for a healthy gigabeat battery playing a 192kbps album? |
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| 14:34:48 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S0106001346f5afbd.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 14:35:02 | JdGordon | any opinions on FS #7417? |
| 14:35:12 | markun | Soul-Slayer: looks normal |
| 14:35:24 | Soul-Slayer | Phew... Thanks |
| 14:35:34 | Soul-Slayer | Which means I still need to work out why it drained so fast yesterday |
| 14:35:35 | markun | although 16 hours is not the highest value we have seen |
| 14:35:49 | Soul-Slayer | Well.. I only managed like 4 from it yesterday which was making me wonder |
| 14:36:06 | markun | the hdd and the backlight use a lot of power |
| 14:36:39 | pondlife | JdGordon: I say reject it (although I'm technically at lunch) |
| 14:36:41 | Crash91 | JdGordon: I would like that |
| 14:37:00 | markun | Soul-Slayer: so if you browse a lot without dircache you drain the battery fast for example |
| 14:37:02 | JdGordon | pondlife: well.. i was more asking about the patch i attatched |
| 14:37:08 | pondlife | Oops, sorry |
| 14:37:22 | * | JdGordon would like to replace the existing quickscreen with that |
| 14:37:25 | pondlife | I was going to say "Bloat!" and "Support Nightmare!" |
| 14:37:35 | pondlife | Will look later though |
| 14:38:04 | Soul-Slayer | markun: There's not really a way of getting around using the backlight though if I want to see what on earth I'm doing :P |
| 14:38:26 | markun | Soul-Slayer: not really no, but you can lower the brightness and have a short timeout |
| 14:38:44 | Soul-Slayer | Also, for 'antiskip time', I was trying to work out which would require the least disk spinups, which would it be? 5s? |
| 14:39:14 | markun | I don't think that option has much to do with spinup |
| 14:40:35 | Soul-Slayer | Right, well I'll lower my backlight brightness and time it's on for and hope for the best, thanks a lot :) |
| 14:41:00 | markun | and do you have dircache on? |
| 14:41:45 | Soul-Slayer | 90% sure I did, I had an H10 before I got the gigabeat and if I didn't have dircache on on that it took forever to navigate anywhere, so I think I'd have turned it on out of habit, but I'll make sure I do this time |
| 14:42:40 | markun | Soul-Slayer: here is some info on power consumption http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/viewfile/Main/GigabeatInfo?rev=1;filename=current-07-06-26.txt |
| 14:43:32 | Soul-Slayer | So the backlight practically halves battery life? Youch |
| 14:43:56 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 14:44:25 | Soul-Slayer | Although, that means if the backlight was on 100% of the time yes? |
| 14:44:49 | Crash91 | any wps experts awake!?! |
| 14:46:00 | Soul-Slayer | I doubt the button lights drain significant power, but they don't really make a difference to me so I'll leave them off |
| 14:46:04 | GodEater_ | Crash91: as I believe I've said before - not many of the "WPS Experts" hang out here |
| 14:46:46 | Crash91 | CodEater_:Yes, you have, but it was a "not many" |
| 14:46:50 | | Quit webguest63 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 14:47:01 | GodEater_ | Crash91: okay - change that to "none of" |
| 14:47:02 | Crash91 | GodEater_:I mean GodEater_ :p |
| 14:47:09 | Crash91 | not CodEater |
| 14:47:19 | | Join axlgreasetires [0] (i=a233e050@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-df4bb5f94c621c15) |
| 14:47:44 | axlgreasetires | What's up noo0bs |
| 14:47:56 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=9803f670@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-7d76b40f08becff7) |
| 14:48:05 | Crash91 | i need someone who is willing to check this out on a sansa sim build, pref. windows |
| 14:48:15 | saratoga | amiconn: I've been listening to my sansa for 3 days now without hearing any skipping |
| 14:48:37 | axlgreasetires | Crash whats wrong with the build? |
| 14:48:48 | Crash91 | i have an evil feeling that my build is messed up |
| 14:48:53 | Crash91 | even after reverting svn |
| 14:49:04 | saratoga | though i've been listening to mostly high bit rate mp3, so maybe i'm boosted frequently enough that theres no issue? |
| 14:49:09 | w1ll14m | crash: i would do a clean svn |
| 14:49:30 | Crash91 | http://pastebin.ca/612471 |
| 14:49:35 | w1ll14m | instead of reverting....... i screwed up some times even when a revert was a succes |
| 14:49:39 | | Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.) |
| 14:49:41 | | Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 14:49:42 | | Quit saratoga (Client Quit) |
| 14:49:56 | Crash91 | i need somewone to test that wps |
| 14:50:09 | Crash91 | *for SANSA* |
| 14:50:52 | | Quit axlgreasetires (Client Quit) |
| 14:50:53 | | Quit spiorf_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 14:51:20 | Soul-Slayer | I'm not sure if this will help, but I don't have wiki write permissions, so if anyone wants to put my results (http://pastebin.ca/612450) here (http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/GigabeatRuntime), was running a 192kbps album at default settings, 2007-07-09, SVN of that day |
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| 14:53:10 | | Join Arathis [0] (n=doerk@p5484BB7D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:53:17 | markun | Soul-Slayer: I can give your write permission |
| 14:53:21 | | Join PaulJam [0] (i=Paul@vpn-3142.gwdg.de) |
| 14:53:41 | Crash91 | someone! anyone! test this on a sim build of that |
| 14:53:47 | Crash91 | the Sansa* |
| 14:53:49 | Crash91 | http://pastebin.ca/612471 |
| 14:55:22 | PaulJam | Crash91: you could download an uisim fron rashers page and test it yourself: rasher.dk/rockbox/simulator/">http://rasher.dk/rockbox/simulator/ |
| 14:55:45 | Soul-Slayer | markun: Thank you, my account name is JohnathonMihalop |
| 14:55:47 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=980398fe@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-6219923f8fd49738) |
| 14:56:04 | Crash91 | 1. Im running linux, 2. i think my sim is screwed (even after original svn revert) 3. TEST IT! |
| 14:56:05 | | Join _Veseliq_ [0] (n=veseliq@host.91-92-172-170.airbites.bg) |
| 14:56:38 | Crash91 | saratoga, i believe you have a sansa? |
| 14:56:57 | saratoga | Sansa and Gigabeat |
| 14:57:08 | markun | Soul-Slayer: done |
| 14:57:14 | Crash91 | http://pastebin.ca/612471 < if you have a sim of the sansa handy, pls test this |
| 14:57:29 | Llorean | Crash91: Please don't repeat messages over short periods. |
| 14:57:31 | Soul-Slayer | Thanks markun |
| 14:58:16 | Soul-Slayer | Now then... Editinga a table... This could prove interesting |
| 14:58:22 | Crash91 | Llorean: ok, but seeing as Saratoga is helpful and he signed in after my last post (1mins 59 exactly) |
| 14:58:33 | pixelma | Crash91: I see an error in line 10 -> there's a single questionmarks after the %ar (seems a leftovers) |
| 14:58:46 | markun | Soul-Slayer: you can just attach the file |
| 14:59:00 | saratoga | Crash91: what do you want me to do? |
| 14:59:17 | markun | I noticed that some results got overwritten because people want to use the same filename |
| 14:59:36 | Crash91 | please test that as a wps file, its pure text |
| 14:59:57 | | Quit _Veseliq_ (Client Quit) |
| 15:00 |
| 15:00:05 | Soul-Slayer | I can see what I'm doing with the table now, I'll do both though |
| 15:00:06 | Crash91 | pixelma: there are multiple %ar tags, you may not be able to see the symbols |
| 15:00:11 | saratoga | Crash91: how do I do that? |
| 15:00:22 | pixelma | Crash91: sorry for singular/plural mixup but I saw one first but there's a second - that would make the wps parser fail |
| 15:00:35 | Crash91 | saratoga: save it as a wps file and use it on sim/sansa |
| 15:00:43 | pixelma | you have "%ar?" two times... |
| 15:00:46 | Crash91 | saratoga: tell me any errors |
| 15:00:59 | Crash91 | pixelma: do you mean this symbol? ᛣ |
| 15:01:12 | saratoga | Crash91: how are WPS files used on the device? |
| 15:01:38 | Crash91 | paste it as "text.wps" in .rockbox/wps/ |
| 15:01:56 | Crash91 | then use file browser and click select when the file is highlighted |
| 15:02:00 | pixelma | I don't mean symbols (and I don't see your because of codepage mismatch in my IRC) - I mean the wps tags |
| 15:02:10 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 15:03:15 | Crash91 | pixelma: ill repeat for sake of clarity > " ᛣ " and the %ar tags have that same symbol after them, try copy-pasting the stuff in quotes in notepad etc. |
| 15:03:45 | pixelma | no... I don't mean that |
| 15:03:45 | saratoga | Crash91: it fills my screen with random symbols |
| 15:03:53 | Crash91 | i forgot to mention |
| 15:04:01 | | Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out) |
| 15:04:09 | amiconn | saratoga: There is probably an issue with lcd updates happening when the cpu is unboosted and music is playing (cache flush taking too long). Ask jhMikeS for details |
| 15:04:11 | PaulJam | Crash91: if you have a simulator bilt under linux then you could try to run the uisim with −−checkwps. this could give you a hint where it fails. |
| 15:04:13 | Crash91 | use the font "6x10" |
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| 15:04:47 | Crash91 | PaulJam: its not failing, i seem to be having loads of alignment probs recently |
| 15:05:10 | pixelma | like in this part (start of line 10): %?mp<Stop|?? -%pr _%ar?_ %?ig... (underscored what I mean) - that's wrong syntax |
| 15:05:47 | Soul-Slayer | All done |
| 15:06:18 | saratoga | Crash91: is there some reason you can't do this in the sim? |
| 15:06:19 | linuxstb | saratoga: I've now got the "multiple payloads in a single packet" working. The ffmpeg encoded test file now plays without giving any decoding errors, but the output is just static. The wmv file (containing mixed audio/video payloads within the same packet) is playing perfectly. |
| 15:06:26 | Crash91 | pixelma: confirmed, the "?" you see are special symbols, gedit under linux can see them |
| 15:07:01 | saratoga | linuxstb: is this the v1 test file? |
| 15:07:06 | linuxstb | Yes. |
| 15:07:16 | saratoga | i may not have comitted all the fixes on my end |
| 15:07:23 | saratoga | since i couldn't test them |
| 15:07:29 | linuxstb | And I've given up maintaining my standalone test programs - I'm just using the simulator and DEBUGF(). |
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| 15:07:36 | Crash91 | saratoga: did you try to use the "6x10" font? |
| 15:07:40 | Crash91 | with the wps |
| 15:07:49 | pixelma | Crash91: wonder why I see the other (double vertical lines) in the pastebin then |
| 15:08:01 | saratoga | Crash91: i wasn't sure how to change fonts so i gave up |
| 15:08:15 | Crash91 | they must be included in the spec. charset you are using |
| 15:08:16 | saratoga | regarding the parser, do you have a test driver I could use with it and the decoder? |
| 15:09:42 | saratoga | my current one is ffmpeg based and now gettting rather far out of sync with recent changes |
| 15:10:07 | saratoga | amiconn: should i revert the frequency scaling commit then? |
| 15:10:29 | saratoga | jhMikeS: maybe i should have asked you about that |
| 15:10:34 | DerPapst | Crash91: i don't get it.. why can't you checkout a clean version of the trunc and test your wps then? is SDL broken? |
| 15:11:18 | Crash91 | DerPapst: I did svn revert -R . and then made a fresh sim build |
| 15:11:46 | Crash91 | DerPapst: everything worked fine, but now wps is acting wierd |
| 15:11:53 | jhMikeS | saratoga: 'bout what now? |
| 15:12:01 | DerPapst | Crash91: ah ok |
| 15:12:02 | saratoga | the frequency scaling on the sansa |
| 15:12:14 | linuxstb | saratoga: That's what I just said - I don't have working standalone test programs any more, I find it easier to just use the sim. |
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| 15:12:43 | saratoga | linuxstb: sorry, missed that comment |
| 15:13:07 | w1ll14m | where should i place the .voice file? was it in voices or langs ? |
| 15:13:09 | jhMikeS | could be a good thing to do that since it borks recording really badly too. I have some ideas about fixing the problem with crackling |
| 15:13:19 | Crash91 | w1ll14m:langs |
| 15:13:34 | w1ll14m | damn so that's why it didn't worked :) |
| 15:13:40 | w1ll14m | thanx |
| 15:13:44 | saratoga | jhMikeS: ok, i'll revert scaling |
| 15:13:51 | Crash91 | if you need english voice, then there would have to be english.lng and english.voice |
| 15:13:51 | linuxstb | saratoga: I'll commit my changes to the parser soon. It seems to be working well, I just need to clean it a little and test on some targets. |
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| 15:14:13 | jhMikeS | Just removing the HAVE_ADJUSTABLE_CPU_FREQ from the header? |
| 15:14:17 | saratoga | linuxstb: ok good |
| 15:14:25 | saratoga | yes |
| 15:14:32 | saratoga | thats all i did to enable it |
| 15:14:37 | PaulJam | Crash91: what exactly is the problem with the wps? i see that tere is a problem with ling titles and on line 6 you shoud remove the spaces at the end of the line |
| 15:14:55 | jhMikeS | other than that it works fine and the batt life seems a good bit better |
| 15:15:36 | jhMikeS | well, the sluggish UI too |
| 15:15:49 | | Quit krazykit_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:16:02 | saratoga | so what is the long term solution to the problem likely to be? |
| 15:16:15 | Crash91 | PaulJam: ling titles? and i will try to remove the spaces |
| 15:16:42 | PaulJam | long titles |
| 15:17:22 | PaulJam | (i have too much stuff lying in front of my keyboard) |
| 15:17:33 | Crash91 | PaulJam: Long Titles would be a problem, yes, but i cannot help that |
| 15:18:28 | Crash91 | %s scrolls the whole line and i do not want to use bmps as the whole point of this is to be pure text |
| 15:18:50 | Crash91 | i wish screen rotation (i.e. 90 and 270 degrees) was enabled |
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| 15:19:41 | PaulJam | i just wanted to mention it, because i missed the part where you said what doen't work with the wps. |
| 15:19:53 | Crash91 | Well, its working, but my sim keeps saying codec failure |
| 15:19:55 | Llorean | Crash91: It's not a case of simply enabling something. |
| 15:20:27 | Crash91 | Llorean: i know, whole lots of code rephrase that to "implemented" |
| 15:20:54 | Crash91 | PaulJam: thanks a lot, i guess the stuff at the end of the line was to blame |
| 15:21:21 | jhMikeS | saratoga: something to fill the FIFO just before flushing any caches. of couse i'd like to try out having the framebuffer in non-cached memory just to see how it works...when someone finds out how |
| 15:22:40 | jhMikeS | I'm thinking a forced interrupt right before the flush or maybe messing with the FIFO thresholds just to cause one...not sure yet what will work nicely. |
| 15:23:03 | PaulJam | Crash91: another thing in line 10: behind the "No Tag->" you have on playback one and if paused 2 spaces. |
| 15:23:39 | | Quit GodEater_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:23:46 | Crash91 | PaulJam:If you read carefullt=y, you will see two %t0.5 |
| 15:24:03 | Crash91 | this means if paused, || will blink every half a second |
| 15:24:31 | PaulJam | Crash91: line 10 not 11 |
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| 15:25:45 | Crash91 | PaulJam it is correct |
| 15:26:06 | PaulJam | Crash91: this causes the genre string to move when pausing/unpausing |
| 15:26:28 | Crash91 | if stopped, display stop, if paused/playing, display genre, if fwding/rwding display position in song |
| 15:27:00 | Crash91 | PaulJam: aah, true, thanks |
| 15:27:23 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Does that mean even the fiq is delayed during cache flush? |
| 15:28:17 | Crash91 | PaulJam, fixed |
| 15:29:10 | jhMikeS | amiconn: yes, it doesn't occur and the FIFO runs out of samples |
| 15:30:04 | jhMikeS | oddly enough the OF flushes the cache on every single DMA start when communicating with the SD card so some solultion must be possible |
| 15:30:16 | Crash91 | PaulJam: final version looks like: http://img455.imageshack.us/img455/4646/screenshotsansae200va3.png |
| 15:30:49 | | Quit DerPapst (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 15:31:21 | jhMikeS | it always checks CACHE_CTL just before doing it and I see 0x00004007 there |
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| 15:38:07 | linuxstb | saratoga: I've committed my parser changes. |
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| 15:49:14 | JdGordon | does anyone else get heaps of "warning: pointer targets in passing argument 2 of ‘gui_syncsplash’ differ in signedness" type warnings doing a target build? |
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| 15:50:34 | linuxstb | saratoga mentioned something similar. Works fine for me though... |
| 15:52:11 | linuxstb | Are you using the recommended gcc? |
| 15:52:13 | Crash91 | why is the progbar on the recorder different from that of others? |
| 15:52:26 | JdGordon | yeah, just recompiled using rockboxdev.sh |
| 15:52:38 | linuxstb | Crash91: How is it different? |
| 15:52:59 | pixelma | do you mean on the Player? |
| 15:53:02 | Crash91 | instead of filling up the bar, |
| 15:53:12 | Crash91 | it is like a scrolling box |
| 15:53:22 | Crash91 | yes player and recorder |
| 15:53:35 | Crash91 | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsArchos |
| 15:54:02 | JdGordon | is there a way to disable a specific warning in gcc? |
| 15:54:29 | Crash91 | Archos Player/Studio: This will display a 1 character "cup" that empties as the time progresses. < i do not see how that is a "cup" |
| 15:55:00 | pixelma | the Player has a charcell (no bitmap) display - ah and these screenshots are old. On the Recorder (other bitmap Archos) it's the same now too - look at the last entries of the site you linked to |
| 15:55:05 | Zagor | cup sounds better than square :-) |
| 15:55:50 | Crash91 | ok :) |
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| 15:58:23 | pixelma | Crash91: and there is no screenshot of the "cup" |
| 15:59:28 | Crash91 | ok |
| 15:59:44 | Llorean | Isn't the cup basically what he was doing with his volume indicator, but in a single cell rather than three? |
| 16:00 |
| 16:00:15 | Crash91 | who do you mean by he? me? |
| 16:00:19 | Llorean | Yeah |
| 16:00:35 | Crash91 | mm, i kinda get it |
| 16:01:00 | Crash91 | but the ||s were to separate them as it was a conditional |
| 16:01:12 | JdGordon | can I bug everyone about FS #7417 again? (and hopefully, someone with a working sh compiler can tell me the bin size hit please?) |
| 16:02:06 | | Quit richcoosa18 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:03:11 | Llorean | I thought the consensus leaned toward "customizable menus are bad" |
| 16:03:28 | | Quit chrisjs169 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:04:11 | JdGordon | yeah, but I think this menu is more usefull than the current quickscreen |
| 16:04:32 | JdGordon | its not really customizable menus anyway.. its just a more flexible one |
| 16:04:52 | Llorean | Two of the three buttons in the quickscreen are functions that many MP3 players have assigned directly to a button anyway. |
| 16:05:23 | Crash91 | And it will include the items that the user chooses to have < sounds like customisable |
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| 16:05:46 | Crash91 | and what do you mean by 5 quickscreen items, how is that possible? |
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| 16:06:14 | amiconn | JdGordon: The quickscreen is just not that useful atm because actions broke it, and it's still not back to normal |
| 16:06:17 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp253-181.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 16:06:46 | * | JdGordon knows that... it also never works the way it used to on any targets except the recorder anyway |
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| 16:07:39 | Llorean | I do think that with the Database having a separate main menu option, and the existence of the playlist catalog, that maybe the third option in the quick menu needs rethought. |
| 16:08:35 | JdGordon | can someone with a working sh please try a compile and let me know the bin cost? |
| 16:09:17 | JdGordon | I mean, if its less than 2 or 3 hundred bytes then id be inclined to go for it because imho its a nice addition which wont negativly affect anyone.. |
| 16:09:33 | * | JdGordon suspects it will be a bit more than that though |
| 16:09:35 | pixelma | the Ondio doesn't have a quickscreen at all and I very seldom miss on. |
| 16:09:42 | pixelma | *one even |
| 16:09:53 | Crash91 | It would be nice if the rec button on the sansa activates the recording immediately |
| 16:10:13 | Crash91 | unless youre in a plugin, the rec button isnt really used for anything |
| 16:10:19 | JdGordon | it would, but we cant agree on the correct button mapings for it |
| 16:10:53 | Llorean | I'm pretty sure nearly everyone thought a long press of it should go to the recording screen. |
| 16:11:08 | * | JdGordon thinks thats counterintuitive |
| 16:11:16 | dionoea | :) |
| 16:11:17 | JdGordon | ... but id rather talk about the menu patch :p |
| 16:11:50 | Crash91 | in the menu and wps at least, it servers no purpose, and the user could choose whether it asks/starts recroding immediately/does nothing |
| 16:12:38 | Llorean | Maybe make "tap" enter the recording screen, and "hold" enter the recording screen *and* start recording? |
| 16:12:41 | pixelma | ah dionea... want to take a look at new tiles for the jewels puzzle? |
| 16:12:51 | amiconn | I'd certainly not want the recording button to start recording directly |
| 16:13:07 | Llorean | I wouldn't want a short press to ever immediately start recording. |
| 16:13:07 | pixelma | sorry, dionoea :) |
| 16:13:18 | amiconn | This could start an unwanted recording too easily |
| 16:13:24 | JdGordon | Llorean: I would be happy with that |
| 16:13:34 | Llorean | JdGordon: The short/long suggestion? |
| 16:13:36 | JdGordon | /usr/local/sh-elf/lib/gcc/sh-elf/4.0.3/../../../../sh-elf/bin/ld: region IRAM is full (/home/jonno/rockbox/recv2/apps/rockbox.elf section .ibss) |
| 16:13:37 | dionoea | pixelma: it's ok, I highlight a few versions of my nick :) |
| 16:13:37 | JdGordon | :'( |
| 16:13:39 | JdGordon | yes |
| 16:13:40 | dionoea | where are they ? |
| 16:13:45 | Crash91 | amiconn: you could set it to ask, |
| 16:14:12 | aliask | Then it's just annoying. |
| 16:14:22 | aliask | Long press makes the most sense IMO. |
| 16:14:24 | Crash91 | or maybe the abov mentioned working with a long press |
| 16:14:26 | * | pixelma remembers that being the case (start recording accidentally) from the OndioFM radio screen until that was changfed to a "double-click" |
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| 16:15:04 | JdGordon | double click would be fine also, as long as a short click entered the rec screen |
| 16:15:12 | Crash91 | mm, double click is good |
| 16:16:17 | Crash91 | how about default>long press, user can customise whether to ask/record/nothing and also choose if it is long/short/dbl click which activates it |
| 16:16:35 | JdGordon | no |
| 16:16:49 | JdGordon | user configurable buttons is bad... |
| 16:16:55 | JdGordon | menus on the other hand.... |
| 16:17:00 | Crash91 | lol |
| 16:18:05 | Crash91 | JdGordon:Its not configurable buttons, but whatever, ill settle on long press bcos if you can have accidental clicks, youll probably have accidental double clicks as well |
| 16:18:55 | amiconn | Accidental double clicks are a lot less likely than an accidental long press |
| 16:19:11 | dionoea | double long press ? |
| 16:19:15 | | Quit Zagor ("Client exiting") |
| 16:19:20 | amiconn | e.g. squeezing the button when carrying it in a case |
| 16:19:33 | Llorean | amiconn: As long as a single click doesn't go to the screen at all, then yeah. If it's double click as in "first click goes to the screen, second click starts recording" then it's quite easy to happen. |
| 16:19:37 | JdGordon | I'd like to have it record while rec is being held down so it can be used as a quick dictophone thing |
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| 16:20:23 | amiconn | JdGordon: What the hell are you doing?? (wrt iram problem) |
| 16:20:33 | JdGordon | nothing... its a fucked gcc |
| 16:20:38 | JdGordon | it happens with svn also |
| 16:21:30 | Crash91 | amiconn:ok whatever, you win :p |
| 16:21:30 | Llorean | What file needs comparing to see bin size increase? |
| 16:21:47 | amiconn | JdGordon: Forgot to apply rockbox #1? |
| 16:21:59 | Llorean | ajbrec.ajz? |
| 16:22:06 | JdGordon | did it with rockboxdev.sh |
| 16:22:11 | JdGordon | Llorean: yeah, i tinhk so |
| 16:22:27 | Crash91 | amiconn: but what if rockbox is getting a bit laggy, then you press it a few times before rockbox catches up |
| 16:22:37 | Crash91 | and it starts recording |
| 16:22:40 | Llorean | Crash91: If Rockbox is getting laggy, something else is wrong. |
| 16:23:11 | Crash91 | Llorean, sometimes it is laggy if youre playing music and have just exited from a plugin |
| 16:24:22 | Crash91 | nvm lets not argue about this until someone actually makes a patch |
| 16:25:31 | Crash91 | i guess its something like ACTION_TREE_?RECORD?, BUTTON_RECORD|BUTTON_REPEAT, BUTTON_RECORD |
| 16:26:02 | Crash91 | thats a very wild guess as i do not know C |
| 16:26:10 | JdGordon | thats C ? |
| 16:26:37 | aliask | Pretty much. The patch itself is fairly trivial, so 90% of the "work" will be in discussing the best option. |
| 16:27:04 | Llorean | JdGordon: Comparing two ajbrec.ajz for Recorder, shows 280 bytes. |
| 16:27:04 | | Quit Entasis (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:27:15 | JdGordon | ok thanks |
| 16:27:26 | JdGordon | is that OK? |
| 16:28:07 | JdGordon | +280bytes... half of them is the added strings :p |
| 16:28:19 | Llorean | I'm still against it. |
| 16:28:31 | Llorean | Anyone who needs custom menus can just make a folder and throw a couple .cfg files in it. |
| 16:28:39 | Llorean | All with 0 bin size increase. |
| 16:28:52 | Llorean | :-P |
| 16:28:58 | JdGordon | your gonna make a seperate cfg for every possible settings? |
| 16:29:06 | aliask | Speaking of space in the added strings, I think I missed the status of the langv2 cleanup in the conversation earlier. Is it anywhere near completed? |
| 16:29:49 | Llorean | JdGordon: How many "quick" options are going to have a wide range of settings? The whole point of a quick menu are frequently changed options, and most of those only have a couple choices. |
| 16:29:55 | Llorean | Or at least, a couple choices that the user uses. |
| 16:30:19 | Crash91 | Its a good idea, but not that essential |
| 16:30:29 | Crash91 | i could do withoutit |
| 16:30:35 | JdGordon | I dunno... i'd probably put volume, shuffle, brightness, backlight in it |
| 16:30:40 | amiconn | JdGordon: Comparing ajbrec.ajz sizes does *not* compare true binary size (for recorder v1) |
| 16:30:46 | Llorean | JdGordon: Volume? Seriously? |
| 16:30:48 | Crash91 | volume? |
| 16:30:50 | Crash91 | lol |
| 16:30:57 | JdGordon | yep! |
| 16:31:02 | * | JdGordon is a bit odd... |
| 16:31:06 | Crash91 | WPS |
| 16:31:20 | amiconn | Always compare rockbox.bin |
| 16:31:28 | * | Llorean has a lovely gigabeat that lets him adjust volume in the menus. |
| 16:31:31 | * | JdGordon actually just realised it would be 1 extra keypress from the menus :p |
| 16:31:36 | JdGordon | -volume |
| 16:31:42 | Crash91 | ok, brightness> i use VERY rarely, backlight settings, not really |
| 16:31:56 | JdGordon | Crash91: who's side are you one!!?? |
| 16:31:57 | Llorean | Do you use all the brightness levels, or just two or three? |
| 16:32:03 | Crash91 | i mostly use browse themes and plugins, which are the main menu |
| 16:32:09 | | Join n1s [0] (n=nils@h218n1fls35o293.telia.com) |
| 16:32:14 | amiconn | Hmm, and I should have addressed that to Llorean |
| 16:32:28 | JdGordon | amiconn: force of habbit there... ? :D |
| 16:32:28 | Llorean | amiconn: I'll remember that next time. Thanks. :) |
| 16:32:31 | Crash91 | deafault (5/6?) and 1 are the only ones ive ever used |
| 16:33:19 | Crash91 | JdGordon: I have already said, good idea, not really essential, and im showing you jsut how useless it is |
| 16:33:21 | JdGordon | out of 180+ settings, I think its still bad to limit the quick access ones to 3 hardcoded ones |
| 16:33:42 | dionoea | btw, about plugin browsing, anyone against applying the patch to sort plugins in different subdirectories if they're games, demo plugins, viewers, etc... ? |
| 16:33:52 | JdGordon | is it finished? |
| 16:34:04 | Crash91 | dionoea, nope |
| 16:34:08 | Llorean | JdGordon: As I said, two of those settings, many MP3 players have directly on buttons. |
| 16:34:25 | amiconn | I only use one single quickscreen option more often than once a month, and a second one (in the second quickscreen only available on recorder) maybe twice per year... |
| 16:34:29 | Llorean | They're basically essential playback options. |
| 16:34:47 | Llorean | Most CD players have a "Shuffle/Repeat" button as well. |
| 16:34:55 | amiconn | The first is 'file view', and the second is screen flip |
| 16:34:55 | Llorean | At least, every one I've owned, I cant say "most" |
| 16:35:09 | Crash91 | i usually get the quickscreen by mistake when im trying to press power |
| 16:35:28 | | Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC") |
| 16:35:44 | Crash91 | JdGordon: Which target do you intend it for?? It says only sansa |
| 16:35:52 | JdGordon | all of them |
| 16:36:12 | amiconn | Anything else that's in the quickscreen is changed so infrequently by me that I don't even remember it's in the quickscreen(s) |
| 16:36:20 | | Quit bdgraue (Remote closed the connection) |
| 16:36:22 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp242-6.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 16:36:33 | JdGordon | Llorean: amiconn: i;m not suggesting (just yet) that the QS be removed and this added... |
| 16:36:46 | Llorean | JdGordon: A normal menu there would be decidedly less quick. |
| 16:37:01 | JdGordon | its an added menu in the main menu... |
| 16:37:19 | Llorean | Then I really don't see the difference between that and a folder of .cfg files. |
| 16:37:20 | Crash91 | i think select button in WPS is more useful than this |
| 16:37:25 | JdGordon | <menu > <down> <select> to your 16 favorite settings |
| 16:37:31 | amiconn | I never change repeat mode except for testing, and I also never used shuffle mode since I got accustomed to 'insert shuffled' |
| 16:37:37 | JdGordon | s/<down>/<up> |
| 16:38:03 | amiconn | When I used to use shuffle mode, I always forgot to disable it again... |
| 16:38:12 | JdGordon | amiconn: I am exactly the same, i never use the QS becuase imho the optinos are stupid... this is why i want to put this in |
| 16:38:46 | * | Llorean uses both the Shuffle and Repeat options on the quickscreen regularly |
| 16:39:05 | amiconn | JdGordon: So.. what does this offer that can't be done the normal way? And how does it deal with the 2 now-quickscreen buttons on recorders? |
| 16:39:07 | Llorean | Any option is stupid if you don't use it. |
| 16:39:37 | * | JdGordon wonders if the patch was actually looked at.. or just the description.... |
| 16:39:46 | JdGordon | this adds a new menu item in the root menu |
| 16:39:51 | JdGordon | doesnt touch the QS at all |
| 16:40:15 | bluebrother | talking about some "favourites" like menu? |
| 16:40:24 | Llorean | bluebrother: Yes, a menu of favorite menus, basically |
| 16:40:34 | JdGordon | no, a menu of favorite settings |
| 16:40:39 | bluebrother | ah, that feature request ... |
| 16:40:41 | Llorean | JdGordon: Every setting is a menu |
| 16:40:46 | JdGordon | no its not |
| 16:40:47 | Llorean | Unless you're talking about settings actually preset to something |
| 16:40:51 | JdGordon | .... not in the code.... |
| 16:40:52 | Llorean | Like Volume:-37 |
| 16:40:55 | amiconn | Doesn't sound like a good idea to me... |
| 16:41:12 | bluebrother | well, I'm not sure if I really like a favourites menu |
| 16:41:19 | Llorean | But "Volume" is a menu with options ranging from max volume to min volume |
| 16:41:37 | Llorean | Or at least a list. |
| 16:41:43 | amiconn | JdGordon: Menu of favourite settings: Settings->Manage setting->Browse .cfg file |
| 16:41:47 | amiconn | s |
| 16:42:09 | bluebrother | well, the volume setting is reachable throuth the sound settings menu |
| 16:42:17 | JdGordon | I could have done the patch with about the same amount of complexity to allow it to really be a favorites menu (i.e a menu of any menu in the settings menu), but I DIDNT.... this is for settings only |
| 16:42:19 | bluebrother | so it is a setting |
| 16:43:05 | amiconn | And unlike a "favourites" menu, "Browse .cfg file" is more flexible and powerful |
| 16:43:15 | amiconn | And it already exists |
| 16:43:18 | JdGordon | and more annoying |
| 16:43:28 | bluebrother | well, that entry could get renamed "Configurations" or something similar |
| 16:43:35 | * | Crash91 agrees with JdGordon on this one |
| 16:43:37 | bluebrother | what's annoying about that? |
| 16:43:44 | Llorean | The fact that you have to set it up first. |
| 16:43:56 | Llorean | But if we're talking "favorites" anyway, you're setting up something either way. |
| 16:44:00 | JdGordon | and have 1 cfg for each possible setting/value you want to use |
| 16:44:01 | bluebrother | you have to do that for any favourites-like menu |
| 16:44:05 | Crash91 | the fact that manage cfgs dumps everything |
| 16:44:09 | Crash91 | hmm |
| 16:44:19 | Llorean | Crash91: JDGordon's method requires use of a text editor anyway |
| 16:44:26 | bluebrother | well, you can always create a customized cfg that only changes what you want to change |
| 16:44:29 | | Join Nudger [0] (n=stoat@PPPa2205.e12.eacc.dti.ne.jp) |
| 16:44:42 | Nudger | Hello? |
| 16:44:47 | dionoea | No. |
| 16:45:01 | Crash91 | how about an "add to custom.cfg in root" in the context menu of a setting |
| 16:45:32 | bluebrother | why not create a plugin that can enable or disable lines from a cfg? |
| 16:45:34 | Crash91 | it would automatically add that to the file "custom.cfg" in the root, then it would be easier |
| 16:45:42 | JdGordon | bah, the point isnt that you can easily change a setting _back_ to the value you like, its to be able to change a setting to any of the legal values... |
| 16:45:49 | Crash91 | bluebrother: ever hear of text_editor? |
| 16:45:56 | Llorean | bluebrother: A simple .cfg editor? Basically just give it the ability to add or remove a # from a line? |
| 16:46:02 | | Quit XavierGr_ (Connection timed out) |
| 16:46:06 | Nudger | I was wondering if anyone uses Rockbox in conjunction with ml_ipod for Winamp. |
| 16:46:09 | bluebrother | Llorean: yup, something like that |
| 16:46:17 | Nudger | Basically, I stream all my music from my iPod straight through Winamp. Can I still do that with Rockbox? |
| 16:46:18 | Llorean | Crash91: A slimmed down interface even on that. Line highlight, select inserts a # or removes one if present, no other features. |
| 16:46:22 | bluebrother | Crash91: I know text_editor. But it's too difficult to use for that case IMO |
| 16:46:32 | Llorean | Nudger: Rockbox doesn't affect its ability to be used as a mass storage device |
| 16:46:36 | Crash91 | true on both counts |
| 16:46:38 | Nudger | Llorean Excellent :) |
| 16:47:01 | Nudger | One other question - if I do go ahead and install this, it's the equivalent of formatting the iPod, right? I'll have to back up all the music first? |
| 16:47:02 | bluebrother | just present option and value as list, and clicking it enables or disables it by commenting in the file |
| 16:47:09 | Llorean | Nudger: Nope. |
| 16:47:11 | aliask | Nudger: Nope |
| 16:47:16 | Nudger | hurrah! :) |
| 16:47:23 | Crash91 | Nudger: Nope ? |
| 16:47:25 | Crash91 | lol |
| 16:47:27 | JdGordon | modifying text_editor could be done easily.. but thats not the point of the damn patch |
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| 16:47:38 | bluebrother | Nudger: you might be interested in the manual http://www.rockbox.org/manual.shtml and the FAQ |
| 16:48:00 | | Join ackbahr [0] (n=ackbahr@d83-180-78-15.cust.tele2.ch) |
| 16:48:05 | Llorean | JdGordon: Our point is, there are lost of alternatives that can help avoid binsize increase. |
| 16:48:07 | GodEater_ | linuxstb: btw - unless Bagder's parcel is waiting for me at home tonight - we shall be T-Shirtless come tomorrow :( |
| 16:48:26 | | Quit Nudger (Client Quit) |
| 16:48:48 | JdGordon | Llorean: right, but really, we have much bloatier patches in that add nothing... |
| 16:48:50 | Llorean | JdGordon: The ultimate being to recreate the menu system with .cfg files, and offer it as a download from the extras page. Users can delete the options they don't want, and rearrange the folders. You still get a fully customizable set of settings, and no binsize increase still. It's OCD, but it'd work. |
| 16:49:15 | Llorean | It'd be functionally equivalent. |
| 16:49:17 | JdGordon | ... and they say our UI is bad currently :D |
| 16:49:33 | Llorean | JdGordon: It'd look just like our UI, in "Supported" mode. |
| 16:49:38 | bluebrother | well, do we really care if "they" call our ui bad? It's quite good. |
| 16:49:48 | | Quit w1ll14m ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 16:50:08 | Llorean | My point is, there's a functionally equivalent way to do what you're suggesting without any binsize increase at all. So why is your way better? |
| 16:50:26 | JdGordon | because 99.9% of devs/users are not OCD |
| 16:50:40 | Llorean | But the menu system needs to be created exactly once. |
| 16:50:48 | Llorean | Then users just copy what they want out of the folder structure. |
| 16:50:50 | Crash91 | Llorean:We could put it as a plugin in extras (the CFG editor) |
| 16:51:06 | Llorean | Crash91: Plugins don't need to be extras, they don't follow the same rules. |
| 16:51:10 | Llorean | Or rather, restrictions |
| 16:51:15 | JdGordon | exactly ones, plus every time the settings change... i.e new ones or removed ones |
| 16:51:23 | | Join fed [0] (i=4a7b3e0c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-f43e7ce4d2970c06) |
| 16:51:31 | Llorean | JdGordon: And couldn't a script generate them? |
| 16:51:39 | JdGordon | probably |
| 16:51:45 | webguest80 | My H10 20gb has been spordadically shutting down during play, usuallly on the first track. This started about 5 days ago upon updating the firmware. Is there a known issue for this? I want to keep the latest version, since wma is getting more stable. |
| 16:51:56 | Llorean | Absolutely, since a script can create .cfg files. |
| 16:51:56 | fed | I would like to ask about the new changes to recoding.c Can anyone help me? |
| 16:52:22 | bluebrother | why have customizable menus anyway? |
| 16:52:37 | Arathis | webguest80: it's a known thing, but as far as I know there is no solution yet. |
| 16:52:48 | Llorean | bluebrother: Because he's unhappy with the options offered in the quickmenu. |
| 16:52:50 | * | JdGordon sends his best of luck to Llorean to generate a script to build cfg menus from settings_list.c |
| 16:52:55 | Arathis | at least amiconn didn't come up with one when I was around ;) |
| 16:52:56 | Llorean | Arathis: Is there a flyspray task containing information on it? |
| 16:53:08 | Llorean | JdGordon: *I* don't want customizable menus |
| 16:53:24 | Llorean | You do, but you want to do it in a way that's an infinite percent more bloated for binsize than necessary. |
| 16:53:26 | bluebrother | I don't think customizable menus are good. |
| 16:53:34 | | Quit Soul-Slayer (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:53:53 | Arathis | Llorean: don't know. but as said amiconn knows about it and gatherd some information about it from me yesterday |
| 16:53:57 | bluebrother | who wants to support users messing up their menus? Especially without getting paid? |
| 16:54:07 | webguest80 | Thanks, which version can I go back to, should I decide I'm hurting bad enough? Many Thanks. On another note, how do custom view get used in the database? |
| 16:54:19 | Llorean | bluebrother: It'd just be one user-menu, the option wouldn't be there to mess up or modify any of the static menus. |
| 16:54:21 | Crash91 | why have it anyway, its not like you need to change a setting before the world ends/your car crashes/your plane crashes/you get shot |
| 16:54:38 | Llorean | bluebrother: But it's still 100% redundant to .cfg files. |
| 16:54:49 | fed | I guess I'll try again later... |
| 16:54:51 | Crash91 | i would rather waste a whole 5 seconds of my life going to settings and getting whatever i want |
| 16:54:52 | | Part fed |
| 16:55:00 | * | JdGordon bangs head on wall... this isnt customizable menus... its an additional one which te user has to setup manully so they cant break the inbuilt system.. and it add <300bytes |
| 16:55:04 | bluebrother | well, if it's just settings then I see absolutely no reason for it. |
| 16:55:14 | Llorean | JdGordon: It's been pointed out my measurement was wrong. |
| 16:55:44 | JdGordon | unless i get another number, im using that one! |
| 16:55:44 | * | Crash91 bangs his head. The fact of life is, not everyone is running out of time like Jack Bauer |
| 16:55:45 | Llorean | JdGordon: And it's also 300 bytes (or however much) that can be avoided 100%. You can recreate any menu but the graphical ones (EQ, colors) by way of .cfg files, as I said. |
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| 16:56:02 | Llorean | They even look the same. |
| 16:56:05 | Llorean | Minus the icons. |
| 16:56:36 | bluebrother | also, if we add a customizable settings menu, why not make everything customizable? |
| 16:56:43 | bluebrother | users will be asking that. |
| 16:56:46 | Llorean | I still want to know what advantage coding it offers over .cfg files. |
| 16:56:52 | bluebrother | and I am really against customizable menus |
| 16:57:00 | Llorean | .cfg files let you have an unlimited selection of customizable menus with unlimited entries in each. |
| 16:57:08 | Llorean | His gives you one menu with 16 entries *and* increases binary size |
| 16:57:29 | aliask | But with the added advantage that it's accessible from anywhere. |
| 16:57:33 | * | Crash91 wil be right back to rant/argue about this in 10 mins |
| 16:57:50 | Llorean | aliask: Anywhere? |
| 16:57:56 | Llorean | aliask: It's an entry in the main menu. |
| 16:58:00 | aliask | Well, anywhere where you can access the menu |
| 16:58:09 | Llorean | And the root of your player is one press away from the menu. |
| 16:58:39 | JdGordon | as apposed to having to go through 14 menu levels to get to some settings. |
| 16:58:50 | bluebrother | well, you could move the "browse configurations" entry to the main menu and have the same effect. |
| 16:59:03 | Llorean | bluebrother: Especially if it supported nested directories. |
| 16:59:36 | bluebrother | yup. |
| 16:59:40 | amiconn | JdGordon: If your favourites menu is about changing single settings, I can't see any advantage over using the stock configuration menu itself... |
| 16:59:59 | * | JdGordon gives up |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:01 | bluebrother | also, how often do you really change settings? Users crying about such a thing are just playing around |
| 17:00:07 | Arathis | webguest80: I think the commit was "3 Jul 00:42by Jens Arnold". not really sure though. regarding the custom view I don't have a clue |
| 17:00:14 | amiconn | The big advantage of .cfg files is that they can change multiple settings at once, e.g. for switching between usage cases |
| 17:00:36 | Llorean | bluebrother: And any setting you change frequently is usually between 2 values, On/Off, or long/short backlight delays, etc. |
| 17:00:51 | Llorean | An "In-car" vs "at-home" vs "on-wall-power" setting |
| 17:01:00 | bluebrother | yes, or you change between setting sets. Like amiconn said. |
| 17:01:04 | Llorean | Yup |
| 17:01:06 | | Part Crash91 |
| 17:01:10 | amiconn | I have 3 .cfg files to switch between headphone, hifi and in-car use, adjusting volume/treble/bass/channel config, font, and wps |
| 17:01:16 | amiconn | Oh, and voice settings |
| 17:01:20 | bluebrother | we should rather clean up the menus a bit. |
| 17:01:31 | aliask | bluebrother: Definitely. |
| 17:01:38 | | Quit billytwowilly (Remote closed the connection) |
| 17:01:50 | bluebrother | IMO "general settings" could move up a level |
| 17:02:12 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 17:02:16 | aliask | There are some settings in LCD settings I noticed which have nothing to do with the LCD. |
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| 17:03:18 | bluebrother | on the h100, there are "LCD settings", and "Remote LCD" is a subitem. It should be next to "LCD settings" IMO |
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| 17:03:50 | Llorean | bluebrother: I agree |
| 17:03:55 | aliask | Line selector, bg/fg colour, backdrop stuff belongs in display, rather than LCD settings. |
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| 17:05:18 | webguest80 | Thanks, I'll dig around. On another note, I was noodling with the mpeg plugin and was confused about the parameters used to make test files. I am a video engineer and I was trying to build a stack of test files, but going from the website guidelines, I couldn't make out fixed settings that were milestone targets. For instance 196X128 1.5Mbps (MPEG 1) /29.97fps Simple profilew/192kps stereo plus assorted flags |
| 17:05:34 | | Quit Xerion (" ") |
| 17:06:11 | Llorean | webguest80: 1.5Mbps sounds really high for that small of a screen. And particular reason for preferring MPEG 1 over 2? |
| 17:06:24 | bluebrother | "clear backdrop" is in "LCD settings". Should move one up IMO |
| 17:07:09 | amiconn | bluebrother: It really belongs to the LCD. Targets with (non-mono) remote LCD can have 2 backdrops... |
| 17:07:32 | bluebrother | hmm. |
| 17:07:57 | bluebrother | that's a point, but it still doesn't look fitting there to me. |
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| 17:13:48 | webguest80 | MPEGI was spec'd out for computer viewing/lowfi VCD's from the start. This came from the days when DVD's required hardware decoding. The codec likes making video on frame rez up to 355x288, after that MPEG II taes over, because of the extra math overhead needed to accurately render NTSC/PAL/SECAM grade video for commercial use. 1.5MBps is the absolute top for MPEG 1 and below the commercially accepable bottom |
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| 17:20:16 | * | linuxstb doesn't like the trend of features being added to Rockbox that can't be accessed via the UI - what commercial firmware requires you to edit text files to use a DAP? |
| 17:20:36 | Nico_P | I know I'm late but I have to say I quite like the idea of a "shortcuts menu" |
| 17:20:59 | Nico_P | haven't looked at JdGordon's patch, but I like the idea |
| 17:22:09 | | Quit webguest80 (Client Quit) |
| 17:22:21 | Nico_P | linuxstb: what are you referring to ? |
| 17:22:24 | Nico_P | icons ? |
| 17:22:32 | Llorean | linuxstb: I'd have to agree, though I can't think of features beyond Colors and Icons that hit that requirement? |
| 17:23:02 | JdGordon | linuxstb: nothing in rockbox requires you to use a text editor.... its all added extras for people who want to tinker |
| 17:23:20 | pixelma | switching horizontal scrolling (the one with holding left/right) on or off... |
| 17:23:45 | JdGordon | is that setting still in? I thought it was removed ages ago? |
| 17:24:01 | Nico_P | Llorean: I don't quite get what you mean when you say it's possible to have a kind of custom menu with .cfg files |
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| 17:24:30 | Llorean | Nico_P: It's somewhat of a crazy idea. The point was that one can reproduce the rockbox menus though. |
| 17:24:42 | Nico_P | how ? |
| 17:24:42 | linuxstb | JdGordon: That's what I mean. IMO, we should either implement things properly (meaning fully available via the UI) or not at all. Otherwise it just feels like a hack. |
| 17:25:02 | Llorean | Nico_P: Create a folder called Volume. In it, create files 00.cfg, -01.cfg, -02.cfg, each with one line in them setting the volume to the same level as their filename. |
| 17:25:04 | Nico_P | linuxstb: I agree |
| 17:25:05 | JdGordon | if bin size wasnt a consideration then I would agree |
| 17:25:32 | Nico_P | Llorean: wow indeed that's a bit crazy :) |
| 17:25:33 | linuxstb | Llorean: I guess there is just colours and icons (and JdGordon's proposed "customisable" menu) at the moment - but it seems to be a trend. |
| 17:25:41 | | Quit ackbahr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:26:16 | Llorean | linuxstb: I think for themeing options, I don't feel they necessarily need a UI interface. Like Icons, etc, it makes sense to only have 'offline' editing as it were. Colors is very borderline though, for me. |
| 17:26:16 | Nico_P | linuxstb: the colors can be edited with the texy editor, although last time I tried it wasn't a big success |
| 17:26:52 | amiconn | linuxstb: It's not a trend. Colours and icons are part of themability. And then you would have to mention .wps as well |
| 17:26:55 | Llorean | Nico_P: It's *very* crazy. But it'd reproduce a nearly visibly identical menu structure that is functionally identical to that of Rockbox. And no binsize increase. A viable alternative to the other proposition. :-P |
| 17:27:02 | pixelma | JdGordon: re. the horizontal scroll is enabled by default. If you want to switch it off you can only do so via editing the .cfg - usually one isn't affected at all and won't notice. |
| 17:27:11 | Llorean | amiconn: I think colors could have a menu, since it's restricted to known file extensions anyway. |
| 17:27:15 | Nico_P | Llorean: I still prefer the "coding way" |
| 17:27:27 | Llorean | Nico_P: I don't see an advantage to it, at all. |
| 17:27:51 | amiconn | And the comparison with commercial firmwares doesn't count - which other commercial firmware allows you to customise the UI to a similar degree? |
| 17:28:09 | Nico_P | Llorean: allow the user to have his favorite options at hand without needing to remember where they are |
| 17:28:09 | Llorean | amiconn: I think the fear is more related to JDGordon's patch than existing options. |
| 17:28:39 | Llorean | Nico_P: yes, but if the menu system were recreated as .cfg files by a script (as a downloadable extra) they could simply copy the appropriate folders from that .zip, into a folder on their device. |
| 17:28:50 | Nico_P | Llorean: ...without telling him to write a bunch of cfg files |
| 17:28:57 | Llorean | Nico_P: He doesn't have to write them |
| 17:29:11 | Llorean | He just copies over a few folders, one per menu entry he wants. |
| 17:29:18 | amiconn | Llorean: How would this approach handle i18n? And voice? |
| 17:29:35 | JdGordon | linuxstb: if thats your only concern ill make a gui .rock in the morning |
| 17:29:40 | * | amiconn prefers 'Lautstärke' over 'Volume' |
| 17:29:42 | Nico_P | yeah maybe but it would be much more user friendly if there just was a list of the possible items and one just selects the wanted ones |
| 17:29:53 | Llorean | amiconn: It wouldn't. |
| 17:30:25 | Llorean | amiconn: My point is mainly that it's fully possible to accomplish customizable menus without a code increase. |
| 17:30:32 | Nico_P | Llorean: this interface could even just be a plugin that writes a text file |
| 17:30:38 | | Join kaaloo [0] (n=luis@rue92-3-82-232-48-241.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:30:39 | | Quit petur ("*plop*") |
| 17:30:53 | bluebrother | why is there a need to reorder the settings anyway? |
| 17:30:58 | | Join Psilonaut [0] (i=DaPhunka@32.164-246-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be) |
| 17:31:12 | Nico_P | Llorean: point well taken, but I think the coding way offers better usability |
| 17:31:17 | | Part kaaloo |
| 17:31:55 | Llorean | Nico_P: Once the menus are created (and applicable voice files) the usability would be identical. |
| 17:32:06 | Nico_P | bluebrother: it's not reordering the settings, it's having a selection of the favorite ones available immedately... exactly like the quickscreen |
| 17:32:08 | Llorean | IE, once a user has 'configured' the menus to their liking. |
| 17:32:20 | Nico_P | Llorean: what if you want to change the configuration ? |
| 17:32:26 | JdGordon | excecpt voiceing wouldnt work |
| 17:32:33 | Nico_P | then to me it becomes a nightmare |
| 17:32:40 | | Quit Shaid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:32:55 | | Join Shaid [0] (n=adam@203-214-95-136.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 17:33:16 | Llorean | JdGordon: .talk clips wouldn't work? Why not? |
| 17:33:20 | Nico_P | gregj was right when he said rockbox needed to be more userfriendly and cfg are a solution but not a userfriendly one |
| 17:33:38 | JdGordon | Llorean: oh, you want .talk clisp for every .cfg also? |
| 17:33:45 | Llorean | Nico_P: I'm against adding a configurable menu at all. My point is, that those few users who "need" one, can create one if necessary. |
| 17:33:46 | * | amiconn thinks the general consenus should stay: no user configurable menus, no user configurable buttons |
| 17:33:53 | JdGordon | youd run out of disk space very quickly doing it this way :p |
| 17:34:09 | Llorean | JdGordon: Not really. .talk clips are quite small, and numbered options don't need them. |
| 17:34:10 | bluebrother | Nico_P: well, be it reordering all settings or just having some favourites, my question is still the same: why is there a need for that? |
| 17:34:29 | bluebrother | imo, users looking for something like that are just playing around with settings. Nothing Rockbox is intended for ... |
| 17:34:40 | JdGordon | because having to dig through menus is a PITA... and the patch is effectivly free |
| 17:35:29 | linuxstb | JdGordon: I have to say I'm against the idea of a custom menu, at least until after the settings menus have been reorganised. I would hope they could be organised in such a way that the need for a custom menu disappears. |
| 17:35:41 | pixelma | it's free? And (I have to admit there aren't many) but if you hook it to the quickscreen, you exclude the Ondio users |
| 17:36:04 | bluebrother | the quickscreen should stay the way it is. |
| 17:36:12 | JdGordon | pixelma: its an extra item in the root menu... noting to do with QS at all.... |
| 17:36:20 | Nico_P | bluebrother: the quickscreen is good, but not everyone likes the options that ar in it... thus the need to be able to customise it |
| 17:36:22 | * | JdGordon is fairly sure he said that at least 3 times now |
| 17:36:41 | pixelma | sorry |
| 17:36:44 | Nico_P | ... or customise something similar :) |
| 17:36:52 | JdGordon | linuxstb: do you honestly see that happening any time soon though? |
| 17:37:04 | bluebrother | Nico_P: I still don't see any need. You just can't satify everyone, and I don't think customizable menus are good. |
| 17:37:27 | bluebrother | JdGordon: why not start reordering the settings right now? ;-) |
| 17:37:38 | JdGordon | bluebrother: so its better to annoy everyone than satisfy 80% of users? |
| 17:37:56 | bluebrother | annoy anyone? By which means? |
| 17:38:03 | Nico_P | bluebrother: I don't see why they are bad if done right |
| 17:38:04 | JdGordon | ... because ive redone the code for the menus once already... |
| 17:38:23 | aliask | And it was a huge step in the right direction, might I add. |
| 17:38:37 | JdGordon | :) |
| 17:38:44 | | Quit Shaid` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:38:45 | bluebrother | well, as far as I understood reordering the settings shouldn't be hard. |
| 17:38:52 | bluebrother | or did I got something wrong there? |
| 17:39:09 | amiconn | The quickscreen is only of very little use imo |
| 17:39:15 | JdGordon | bluebrother: your attitute is that if the users dont like the avaiable optins then they better just shut up because there is no point making life easier for those that we could... |
| 17:39:40 | JdGordon | and no, reordering will be a pice of cake because of the recode... just a bit time consuming |
| 17:39:55 | Nico_P | amiconn: I tend to agree, and that's why I think it should be made customisable or even replaced with something better |
| 17:40:15 | amiconn | I can't think of anything that could replace it though |
| 17:40:16 | bluebrother | well, my point is, how many users don't like the available options? 1%? 10%? 100%? We know only about those screaming |
| 17:40:23 | bluebrother | and I bet those aren't much at all. |
| 17:40:49 | Nico_P | amiconn: a "shortcuts menu" with most freqently used settings |
| 17:40:49 | amiconn | Yet another menu that just reiterates existing options (be it in fixed or user selectable order) just doesn't make sense to me |
| 17:40:59 | | Join Shaid` [0] (n=adam@210-84-5-69.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 17:41:06 | Nico_P | amiconn: that's what the quickscreen is |
| 17:41:19 | amiconn | Nico_P: I have *no* most frequently used options I could put there... |
| 17:41:22 | JdGordon | so dont use it then.... noone has actually said a _real_ reason against it... |
| 17:41:36 | Llorean | JdGordon: Being 100% pointless isn't a reason against it? |
| 17:41:46 | * | JdGordon doesnt think its pointless at all |
| 17:41:52 | amiconn | it is |
| 17:41:59 | bluebrother | customizable menus are a support nightmare. Be it some favorites menu, the whole menus or the quick screen |
| 17:42:01 | Nico_P | Llorean: if it's not pointless to everybody, no |
| 17:42:06 | Llorean | Ignoring the crazy solution, normal .cfg files can cover almost every usage case. |
| 17:42:11 | JdGordon | so is keeping support for the archos player... |
| 17:42:16 | JdGordon | but thats another argument.... |
| 17:42:37 | amiconn | If you have to go to the menu anyway, you can as well use the existing option. I can't really see the difference |
| 17:42:41 | Llorean | If you want favorite settings, go with favorite configurations rather than some cluttered menu. |
| 17:43:33 | chrisjs169__ | What's the chance of the Sansa Express being Rockbox'd? |
| 17:43:33 | amiconn | .cfg files, otoh, *are* a very useful measure to speed things up if you want to set multiple options at once |
| 17:43:42 | JdGordon | I just cant see how a cluttered file tree is nicer than a menu... |
| 17:44:02 | Llorean | Nico_P: 100% pointless in that "it entirely replicates existing functionality without allowing the user to do anything new" |
| 17:44:04 | JdGordon | and I agree there..... but thats not what the patc is about... |
| 17:44:04 | linuxstb | JdGordon: I think it's the wrong solution to the problem - the problem is that settings are hard to access, so we can try to solve that by reorganising the structure of the menus. I also agree that .cfg files are a nice existing solution to quickly changing settings, and they should be encouraged more - possibly by writing a plugin to help manage them. |
| 17:44:13 | JdGordon | its about changing one setting at a time |
| 17:44:19 | Llorean | JdGordon: I can't see how it's *worse* than one. I think they're equal, but the filetree doesn't bloat bin size. |
| 17:44:32 | * | amiconn doesn't think the options are hard to access |
| 17:44:46 | Llorean | Why not table this discussion entirely until the menus are optimized? |
| 17:44:49 | amiconn | *Some* of them need a little reordering, that's all |
| 17:44:56 | * | bluebrother agrees with amiconn |
| 17:45:02 | aliask | The only settings I could possibly think about changing often enough to warrant them being duplicated in another menu would be shuffle and repeat, but we already have them in the QS. |
| 17:46:05 | amiconn | What would be useful would be a context menu (yes!) for settings, allowing to send their value (and *only* this one) to a selectable .cfg file, in order to create such multi-settings .cfg files on target |
| 17:46:19 | Llorean | amiconn: I agree |
| 17:46:35 | * | JdGordon gasps |
| 17:46:37 | Llorean | Very much like the add to favorites playlist option. |
| 17:46:43 | amiconn | So you could "click together" a .cfg file |
| 17:47:08 | linuxstb | The original feature request (FS #7417) was because the user thought that settings were hard to access and wanted a shallower hierarchy. My point is that we can do that for everyone, without the need for customised menus. |
| 17:47:15 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@vpnsh0222.fh-trier.de) |
| 17:47:40 | amiconn | But the problem how to remove a setting from a .cfg needs to be solved as well |
| 17:47:44 | * | JdGordon passes a big cup of "open mindness" to the crowd |
| 17:47:52 | JdGordon | the patch is about chaning a single setting |
| 17:48:00 | JdGordon | not multple which obviously are better done in a cfg |
| 17:48:10 | Llorean | JdGordon: Out of curiosity, are we allowed to call you close-minded for disagreeing with us too? |
| 17:48:19 | JdGordon | of course |
| 17:48:31 | amiconn | Yes, sand for single settings I can't see any action require apart from reordering settings a bit |
| 17:48:33 | | Join crop [0] (i=c27f0812@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-c05d257c6948afb9) |
| 17:49:00 | crop | How do I put an image to a wiki page? |
| 17:49:08 | bluebrother | well, like "add this value to cfg" there could be a "delete this value from cfg" |
| 17:49:24 | JdGordon | amiconn: you of course reaslise that the only actual reason against the patch is bin size, and a patch to do your suggestion would be much larger..... |
| 17:49:44 | Llorean | JdGordon: His patch would add *new* functionality. |
| 17:50:00 | bluebrother | JdGordon: that would do it the "right" way :P |
| 17:50:01 | Llorean | Right now the only way to create a single line .cfg file requires text_editor, something that may not be present. |
| 17:50:01 | linuxstb | JdGordon: I agree that fast access to a particular setting is different to .cfg files, I'm just saying I would prefer fast access to _all_ settings, not just some I've put in a custom menu. |
| 17:50:05 | JdGordon | no it wouldnt... it would add exactly the same about of new features |
| 17:50:11 | Llorean | JdGordon: No. |
| 17:50:21 | Llorean | JdGordon: Tell me, without any plugins, how do you create a one-line cfg file in Rockbox? |
| 17:50:32 | Llorean | JdGordon: Then tell me, without any plugins, how do you change one setting? Which can be done without code changes. |
| 17:50:33 | JdGordon | i dont |
| 17:51:12 | JdGordon | ... that was of course to the first one |
| 17:51:26 | Llorean | His suggestion adds something new you can do. Yours adds a different way of accessing existing functions. |
| 17:51:56 | Llorean | Otherwise any new menu is a new function, independent of what it contains. |
| 17:52:34 | Llorean | I think the first thing that needs to be done, as linuxstb keeps suggesting, is work on the existing menu layout which I think everyone agrees is at some degree of sub-par |
| 17:55:38 | | Quit merbzt ("Leaving.") |
| 17:56:22 | * | JdGordon hasnt conceded yet.... but going to bed |
| 17:56:30 | | Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!") |
| 17:58:20 | | Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara") |
| 17:59:02 | | Quit Shaid (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 17:59:03 | | Nick Shaid` is now known as Shaid (n=adam@210-84-5-69.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:46 | amiconn | Llorean: In fact you can create single line .cfg files without plugins... just it's incredibly cumbersome |
| 18:02:43 | amiconn | (1) Save your current config (2) Reset all settings (3) Change the one setting you want in the .cfg (4) Shutdown and reboot (5) rename config.cfg to your new .cfg's name (6) reload the saved settings |
| 18:02:56 | | Join webguest21 [0] (i=186e1ca3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-9f14c8844601e22b) |
| 18:02:57 | Llorean | amiconn: Ah, yes, I'd realized that as soon as you said it could be done |
| 18:03:21 | amiconn | But this way you can't put the default into a .cfg |
| 18:03:40 | webguest21 | Hello people. Is it normal for the Gigabeat to lose battery power even if its not being used? |
| 18:03:48 | markun | webguest21: a little |
| 18:03:57 | | Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007060115]") |
| 18:04:06 | markun | webguest21: it uses 0.71mA while 'off' |
| 18:04:19 | markun | (on a 830mAh battery) |
| 18:04:57 | webguest21 | probably from the resume playback I guess |
| 18:05:27 | markun | (so should last almost 49 days) |
| 18:06:35 | webguest21 | should I have certain settings OFF to minimize the loss of battery power |
| 18:06:48 | markun | no, it's always 0.71 |
| 18:07:21 | markun | but if you don't use your gigabeat for a long time it's better to switch the little battery switch to OFF |
| 18:07:53 | * | amiconn wonders what the gigabeat uses that much power for while being off |
| 18:08:05 | amiconn | The rtc shouldn't draw more than a few µA |
| 18:08:15 | markun | amiconn: indeed, quite strange |
| 18:08:24 | webguest21 | I am surprised at the battery bench results because with normal use I am getting about 8 or 9 hours |
| 18:08:34 | markun | perhaps we can make it lower, but it's the same value if you sleep from the OF |
| 18:09:11 | markun | webguest21: these benchmarks are very artificial |
| 18:09:16 | Llorean | webguest21: And how much do you get under the original firmware? |
| 18:09:25 | markun | if you use the backlight and hdd a bit it will already drop a lot |
| 18:10:06 | linuxstb | markun: Presumably you can turn the battery switch off to preserve power? |
| 18:10:18 | markun | linuxstb: yes |
| 18:10:26 | markun | but the clock will be reset of course |
| 18:10:36 | linuxstb | Mine always is anyway... |
| 18:10:47 | * | linuxstb has a watch ;) |
| 18:10:51 | webguest21 | don't know. did not keep it long enough. pretty much switched to Rockbox right away |
| 18:11:50 | webguest21 | the original firmware was too crappy |
| 18:12:13 | markun | webguest21: I agree :) |
| 18:13:11 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 18:13:14 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp40-219.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 18:13:28 | | Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection) |
| 18:14:26 | webguest21 | well how much are you guys getting with normal use in regards to battery hrs. |
| 18:15:02 | markun | I've never played until the battery was completely drained |
| 18:15:23 | markun | I guess I usually recharge after 6-8 hours of listening |
| 18:16:19 | webguest21 | Is the WMA codec 100% yet or does there need more cleaning up? |
| 18:16:56 | | Join Domonoky_ [0] (n=Domonoky@e179053015.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 18:16:58 | linuxstb | In terms of functionality, it still can't decode all WMA files (e.g. low bitrates, wma v1), and there's no seeking. |
| 18:17:38 | linuxstb | And then there is hopefully still a lot more optimistation potential - I doubt that very many codecs could be called fully-optimised in Rockbox. |
| 18:18:07 | | Join iPodPhoto [0] (i=46311c65@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-1b1a83e020aac47e) |
| 18:18:10 | linuxstb | (more optimisation means longer battery life) |
| 18:19:06 | iPodPhoto | Hello. Is there someone here with twiki access |
| 18:19:24 | linuxstb | Lots of people - do you want write rights? |
| 18:19:51 | webguest21 | oh ok, great accomplishment even without the seeking |
| 18:20:19 | iPodPhoto | Yes i would. I have been trying to get wrtie rights for almost 2 months now. But no one is ever on the IRC when i ask. |
| 18:20:33 | linuxstb | What's your wiki name? |
| 18:20:52 | iPodPhoto | Mark Sikora |
| 18:21:01 | webguest21 | so WMA at this point could use more battery then because of its infancy? |
| 18:21:32 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 18:21:35 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp257-224.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 18:22:10 | linuxstb | iPodPhoto: OK, you're added. |
| 18:22:23 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:22:43 | iPodPhoto | ok. thank you kindly |
| 18:23:06 | linuxstb | webguest21: It depends on the device you're using, and what other codecs you're comparing to. |
| 18:23:26 | | Quit My_Sic (Client Quit) |
| 18:25:58 | | Quit crop ("CGI:IRC") |
| 18:25:59 | | Quit iPodPhoto ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 18:26:05 | | Quit webguest21 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 18:31:37 | | Join BigMac [0] (n=mike@c-71-234-95-131.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) |
| 18:31:51 | | Join obo [0] (n=obo@82-46-82-224.cable.ubr02.trow.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 18:31:59 | BigMac | Hey any *nix users around? |
| 18:32:32 | Domonoky_ | BigMac: only rockbox users here..OS doesnt matter :-) |
| 18:33:41 | * | bluebrother uses linux ... so no match on *nix |
| 18:34:25 | BigMac | bluebrother: I was using *nix to refer to any flavor of linux, do you know how to export something to your path? |
| 18:34:42 | bluebrother | hehe, know what you meant ;-) |
| 18:34:43 | BigMac | Isn't it export PATH="path" |
| 18:35:04 | bluebrother | you usually do "export PATH=$PATH:/the/path/you/want/to/add |
| 18:35:17 | bluebrother | well, on bash at least. |
| 18:35:25 | BigMac | alright lemme give it a go |
| 18:35:46 | BigMac | But wait, is that the temporary way? |
| 18:35:55 | BigMac | As in I would have to do that every reboot? |
| 18:35:56 | bluebrother | it exports in your current session |
| 18:36:13 | bluebrother | you want to add something permanently? |
| 18:36:16 | BigMac | Yes |
| 18:36:39 | Domonoky_ | BigMac: then add this command to your profile script.. |
| 18:36:48 | bluebrother | well, that's in ~/.bash_profile on my box |
| 18:37:00 | BigMac | Ok, I will look for it |
| 18:37:21 | bluebrother | but you could also add it to /etc/bashrc to have it globally for all users |
| 18:38:03 | | Join Megaf [0] (n=megaf@200-203-52-168.nhoce701.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 18:38:08 | Megaf | hello all |
| 18:38:12 | Megaf | remember me? |
| 18:38:18 | BigMac | bluebrother: bash.bashrc right? |
| 18:38:25 | Megaf | im just instaled rock box on my iPod Nano |
| 18:38:28 | Megaf | very nice |
| 18:38:36 | bluebrother | I don't have a bash.bashrc no my box |
| 18:39:24 | BigMac | What distro? |
| 18:39:42 | linuxstb | BigMac: IIRC, it should be added to $HOME/.bashrc |
| 18:40:01 | linuxstb | .bash_profile is for login shells |
| 18:40:03 | Megaf | can rockbox play videos? |
| 18:40:18 | BigMac | linuxstb: alright, I will go look for it |
| 18:40:25 | linuxstb | Megaf: Yes - see the manual and/or the PluginMpegplayer wiki page. |
| 18:40:40 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 18:40:59 | | Part pixelma |
| 18:41:17 | | Join relaxed [0] (n=relaxed@unaffiliated/relaxed) |
| 18:41:22 | bluebrother | well, my box exports PATH from within ~/.bash_profile |
| 18:41:38 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 18:41:41 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp83-175.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 18:41:49 | bluebrother | but I never completely understood (or tried to understand) the exact differences between those various bash configuration files |
| 18:42:26 | BigMac | Well I probably should restart x right? |
| 18:42:29 | linuxstb | On Debian at least, the default .bash_profile runs .bashrc. |
| 18:42:38 | linuxstb | No, you should just need to open a new terminal. |
| 18:42:53 | linuxstb | That's the advantage of using .bashrc instead of .bash_profile |
| 18:43:11 | Llorean | I've added to .bashrc as well. |
| 18:43:25 | Llorean | But then I think my login shell is dash, so I don't believe .bash_profile gets executed. |
| 18:43:27 | Llorean | IIUC |
| 18:43:37 | * | Domonoky_ thinks .bash_profile is valid for the whole session, from login to logout, .bashrc is only valid as long as the shell exists.. |
| 18:43:47 | bluebrother | BigMac: no, you only need to restart the shell so it rereads its configuration |
| 18:43:53 | BigMac | Ok |
| 18:44:10 | bluebrother | you can just run bash from the command line ;-) |
| 18:45:20 | BigMac | Nah, I am one of those crazy characters who needs a gui |
| 18:46:20 | Megaf | linuxstb: ok, thanks |
| 18:46:33 | * | linuxstb wonders what the ASF_FLAG_SEEKABLE flag actually means in an asf file - most files seem to have it set to 0... |
| 18:49:22 | dionoea | the SEEKABLE and BROADCAST flags aren't used anywhere in the code in VLC (they're just defined) |
| 18:50:00 | linuxstb | I've just noticed that mplayer can seek in asf files with that flag unset, and even adding an index (with asfbin) to a file doesn't set the flag. |
| 18:50:06 | linuxstb | So it seems completely useless... |
| 18:51:23 | | Join AceNik [0] (n=AceNik@203.145.159.41) |
| 18:52:20 | | Join kaaloo [0] (n=luis@rue92-3-82-232-48-241.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:52:25 | AceNik | guys thr is a new problem in my H10 suddenly while playing music for sometime it freezes |
| 18:52:31 | | Join dan_a [0] (n=dan_a@217.23.173.156) |
| 18:52:43 | | Part kaaloo |
| 18:52:56 | AceNik | no respond to any button, no lcd nothin |
| 18:52:58 | | Quit petur ("switch") |
| 18:53:07 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 18:53:29 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 18:55:28 | amiconn | linuxstb: Regarding codecs which could be called really optimised in rockbox, I can only think of 2: libmad (on coldfire), and flac (all swcodec) |
| 18:55:55 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 18:55:58 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp245-65.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 18:56:14 | amiconn | And of course the uncompressed ones |
| 18:56:37 | | Quit SirFunk (Remote closed the connection) |
| 18:57:36 | amiconn | Hmm, seems there are a bit more... |
| 18:57:52 | * | amiconn only really uses mp2/mp3 and flac so far |
| 18:57:55 | | Join Davide-NYC [0] (n=chatzill@user-12hdtj8.cable.mindspring.com) |
| 19:00 |
| 19:00:25 | Davide-NYC | recording menu patch... skimmed the IRC logs and still don't get how it works. How does it work? |
| 19:02:05 | | Quit relaxed ("http://www.zsnes.com/") |
| 19:02:14 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 19:04:18 | amiconn | dan_a: ping... |
| 19:04:44 | dan_a | amiconn: pong |
| 19:04:50 | amiconn | ah :) |
| 19:05:16 | dan_a | How did the clock investigations go? |
| 19:05:43 | GodEater | my replacement ipod battery arrived. My god is it small! |
| 19:05:50 | amiconn | dan_a: COuld you perhaps run some tests on your G3 in order to confirm some details? |
| 19:06:02 | AceNik | guys any solution to H10 suddenly closing down |
| 19:06:54 | dan_a | amiconn: Of course - except that bootloaders I compile don't work for some reason |
| 19:06:55 | amiconn | It looks like the PP5002 clock setting works similar to PP502x, only that the settings are scattered across the various registers in a different way (and there are fewer settings) |
| 19:07:34 | amiconn | dan_a: You don't need to compile bootloaders (that is, if the current bootloader doesn't touch the clock setting registers) |
| 19:08:02 | amiconn | I have a patch; I could either provide this or a ready-to-run test build |
| 19:08:13 | | Quit BigMac (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 19:08:19 | dan_a | A patch will be fine |
| 19:08:28 | amiconn | The patch adds a couple of readouts to the debug menu |
| 19:08:38 | amiconn | There is a clock estimation that needs to be calibrated |
| 19:09:31 | amiconn | The first test build would be only with this patch applied, and then checking what the estimation displays at 24, 30 and 75 MHz, and adjust a factor that it matches approximately |
| 19:09:44 | Davide-NYC | I now understand the recording patch. Is there a way to set input dependant directories in a cfg file? |
| 19:09:59 | | Quit AceNik ("bye guys have fun , enjoy !!!!!") |
| 19:10:20 | | Quit billytwowilly (Remote closed the connection) |
| 19:10:27 | dan_a | amiconn: That all sounds simple enough |
| 19:10:35 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S0106001346f5afbd.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 19:10:41 | amiconn | The next step involves disabling both cpu scaling (in the config-* file) and the complete content of ipod_set_cpu_speed() (so rockbox doesn't touch the registers) and then read a number of values from the debug menu |
| 19:11:20 | amiconn | The goal is to find out what the apple loader sets, and what the cpu speed resulting from these settings is (hence the calibration) |
| 19:12:18 | amiconn | amiconn.dyndns.org/3g_clock_1.diff">http://amiconn.dyndns.org/3g_clock_1.diff |
| 19:15:03 | dan_a | OK, I'll let you know when I'm done or need some help |
| 19:24:15 | | Quit ptw419 () |
| 19:29:28 | rogelio | hi, what software does rockbox use to do automated bulds? it looks great and I want to do something similar |
| 19:29:52 | linuxstb | Custom scripts written in a combination of perl and bash afaik. |
| 19:29:56 | GodEater | rogelio: a combination of bash scripts and perl |
| 19:30:03 | GodEater | linuxstb: hehe - jinx |
| 19:30:33 | | Quit richcoosa19_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 19:31:08 | rogelio | Oh, ok, I thought you were using something like buildbot. Are they accesible somewhere? |
| 19:31:29 | GodEater | rogelio: I think you'd need to ask Bager or Zagor for them |
| 19:31:40 | GodEater | neither of whom appear to be here |
| 19:31:55 | GodEater | *Bagder |
| 19:32:16 | | Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@freenode/staff/gnewsense.ompaul) |
| 19:32:24 | GodEater | they're not fool proof either - we sometimes get stuck builds |
| 19:32:50 | rogelio | GodEater_: ok, thanks, I'll look for them |
| 19:33:06 | * | petur thought they were copied in svn |
| 19:33:15 | GodEater | petur: really ? where ? |
| 19:33:55 | | Quit HellDragon (Nick collision from services.) |
| 19:34:41 | | Join jgarvey [0] (n=jgarvey@cpe-066-057-231-236.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 19:34:57 | petur | GodEater: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/www/?pathrev=13843 ? |
| 19:35:43 | petur | look http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/www/tools/?pathrev=13843 |
| 19:37:18 | rogelio | I've found some info here: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/BuildServer :-) |
| 19:37:40 | GodEater | rogelio: that's how to become a client of the master build server though |
| 19:37:55 | GodEater | which doesn't contain the scripts which triggers the autobuild |
| 19:39:39 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@vpnsh0222.fh-trier.de) |
| 19:43:12 | | Join HellDragon [0] (i=JD@unaffiliated/helldragon) |
| 19:43:26 | | Join low_light [0] (i=c730190b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-2a06c895430c294c) |
| 19:47:33 | dan_a | amiconn: The Apple loader sets the clock to 48MHz. Which registers do we need to check? |
| 19:48:52 | amiconn | What's the adjusted count for PP5002 in perfcheck() ? |
| 19:49:09 | amiconn | I want to know all values below the gpio values |
| 19:51:23 | | Join ptw419 [0] (i=ptw419@216-188-249-122.dyn.grandenetworks.net) |
| 19:51:52 | dan_a | The adjusted value from perfcheck is 48MHz. CLOCK_ENABLE is 0x2, CLOCK_SOURCE 0xe4, CLOCK_DIV 0xE000, PLL_DIV 0x18, PLL_MULT 0x4b, TIMING1_CTL 0xa0ff, TIMING2_CTL 0x80ff |
| 19:53:55 | amiconn | I mean what is needed to make the estimation work (instead of the 10000 with the /* TODO... */ behind)? |
| 19:55:31 | dan_a | It was out by a factor of 3.2, so I guess 32000 |
| 19:55:37 | andrew__2 | does anyone know if I2C interrupts work on the sansa? |
| 19:55:58 | andrew__2 | I am thinking of implementing the headphone detection in the AS3514 |
| 19:56:06 | | Nick andrew__2 is now known as andrewg867 (n=andrew@stjhnf0124w-142162079146.pppoe-dynamic.nl.aliant.net) |
| 19:56:41 | amiconn | dan_a: Wow... that's slow compared to PP502x... |
| 19:57:37 | dan_a | Yes, even taking account of the broken cache |
| 19:57:53 | amiconn | The pll is prepared for 75MHz... did you make ipod_set_cpu_speed() an empty function for this test? |
| 19:58:00 | | Join lee-qid [0] (n=liqid@p5496679B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:58:10 | dan_a | I did |
| 19:58:22 | amiconn | Hmm, interesting... |
| 19:59:45 | amiconn | And it runs at 48MHz? |
| 20:00 |
| 20:00:14 | dan_a | According to perfcheck(), yes |
| 20:00:23 | * | amiconn would want a G3 for experimentation... this is becoming interesting |
| 20:01:17 | Llorean | Wasn't someone in the forums giving one away? Who ended up with that one? |
| 20:01:20 | Llorean | Or was it on the list? |
| 20:01:30 | amiconn | jhMikeS I think |
| 20:01:37 | amiconn | But he has no ipod cable... |
| 20:01:55 | Llorean | Ah, problematic. |
| 20:02:23 | * | amiconn wonders whether G3's are available from ebay(.de), and at what price |
| 20:02:30 | * | amiconn should check |
| 20:02:39 | * | amiconn should also check for H10s |
| 20:03:10 | dan_a | Broken ones are frequently on ebay .uk |
| 20:03:19 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:04:28 | amiconn | dan_a: Some further tests you could do: reenable ipod_set_cpu_speed(), and change the value written to 0xcf005010 from 0xe000 to 0xe011, and in another step to 0xe022, and check the est. clock |
| 20:04:44 | Davide-NYC | I gave jhMikeS the 3G, I presumed someone would pony up for the cable. (grumble) |
| 20:05:06 | amiconn | Before doing that, you could place the 32000 in debug_menu.c line 432 and check whether the estimation is correct |
| 20:05:16 | * | amiconn has an ipod cable... |
| 20:05:26 | Davide-NYC | problem solved |
| 20:05:28 | amiconn | Assuming the cable is the same for *all* ipods |
| 20:05:48 | Davide-NYC | no, the 3G requires the Firewire cable |
| 20:05:50 | | Quit chrisjs169__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 20:05:52 | amiconn | Nah, I mean I could test on a G3 without its own cable |
| 20:05:55 | Davide-NYC | no idea why |
| 20:06:01 | amiconn | Ah, but the same plug? |
| 20:06:05 | Davide-NYC | yup |
| 20:06:24 | Davide-NYC | AFAIK |
| 20:06:35 | amiconn | I also have a fw cable (found out fw detection from that on mini G1, G2 and video (power only)) |
| 20:06:50 | amiconn | Didn't implement it yet though :\ |
| 20:07:24 | Davide-NYC | QQ: can I implement input dependant recording directories using CFG files, and if so where would I find docs? |
| 20:07:24 | amiconn | ipods started firewire only. At some point, apple added usb support. The newest models only support usb |
| 20:07:47 | Davide-NYC | anybody? |
| 20:08:20 | amiconn | dan_a: The two least hex digits in 0xcf005010 are pll post-dividers iiuc |
| 20:08:27 | Davide-NYC | gotta run. I'll check the logs for an answer. (please) |
| 20:08:30 | Llorean | Davide-NYC: Do you mean "change recording directories by loading .cfg files"? |
| 20:08:31 | | Quit Davide-NYC ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]") |
| 20:08:43 | amiconn | Unlike on PP5020+, they seem to work without an offset of 1, but 0 acts like 1 |
| 20:09:05 | amiconn | So, 0xe011 should give 75MHz like 0xe000, but 0xe022 should give 37.4MHz |
| 20:09:10 | amiconn | *37.5 of course |
| 20:09:24 | amiconn | Otherwise I have to correct my theory |
| 20:09:35 | saratoga | I've been meaning to ask why we still support the 3G givent that the port is basically nonfunctional and no one seems interested in working on it |
| 20:09:51 | | Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@p54BD375A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:10:09 | dan_a | saratoga: Define nonfunctional - it plays MP3s |
| 20:10:10 | | Join Siltaar [0] (n=Siltaar@reverse-52.fdn.fr) |
| 20:10:12 | amiconn | saratoga: dan_a has a G3 and it's already a mostly working port (plays music), so we shouldn't drop it imo |
| 20:10:19 | low_light | amiconn: I've noticed a couple of things olympus m:robe bootloader (another pp5020 device)... |
| 20:10:30 | amiconn | We never dropped a target that reached the stage of playback yet |
| 20:10:34 | DerPapst | at least 2 are interested in that port ;) |
| 20:10:37 | saratoga | dan_a: when I tried it a while back on my 3G, it played for a couple minutes at most before crashing |
| 20:10:42 | low_light | writes to 0x60006020 are always followed by outl(0x4800000F, 0x60007000) |
| 20:10:50 | saratoga | though maybe thats been fixed |
| 20:10:51 | * | amiconn would even like to get ipod G2 and G1 running |
| 20:11:13 | DerPapst | amiconn: you can copy data to the 3G iPod via firewire and usb. but you can charge it only via firewire |
| 20:11:35 | amiconn | low_light: If I knew what that actually does... :/ I found other values written to 0x60007000 (and 0x6007004): |
| 20:12:01 | amiconn | 0x4800001f, 0x420000ff, 0x4800000f, 0x42000000, 0x4100000a |
| 20:12:05 | low_light | and the value written to 0x70000034 for freq change is (R0 | (R0 << 8)) | (inl(0x70000034) & 0xFFFFF0F0) |
| 20:12:08 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@vpnsh0222.fh-trier.de) |
| 20:12:08 | dan_a | amiconn: I have a G1 or G2 here (not sure which) - I don't know if it works at all, but you're welcome to it if you want |
| 20:12:17 | amiconn | 0x80000000 and 0x0 are known - sleep/wakeup core |
| 20:12:45 | DerPapst | dan_a: the wheel of the 2G is touch sensible |
| 20:12:51 | amiconn | low_light: I am almost sure what 0x70000034 does, and we already handle that |
| 20:13:14 | DerPapst | dan_a: nvm ;) |
| 20:13:31 | dan_a | DerPapst: Then it's a 1G |
| 20:13:50 | amiconn | dan_a: I'm not interested in non-working units. YOu never know what's required to make it work again when it doesn't react at all, and you don't have an identical unit to check against |
| 20:13:52 | DerPapst | ah ok.. i thought you were talking about the minis. |
| 20:14:05 | DerPapst | and i wanted to correct myself already ^^ |
| 20:14:49 | amiconn | Things like broken hdd are often obvious, but anything else - hmm..... |
| 20:14:54 | dan_a | amiconn: I'll buy a firewire cable and get it charged to see if it will boot, then |
| 20:15:32 | * | DerPapst has rockbox on his 3G :) |
| 20:15:36 | andrewg867 | does anyone know if charging the sansa from USB works in rockbox? |
| 20:16:21 | * | DerPapst hunts something to eat. |
| 20:16:21 | amiconn | low_light: Oh, btw, I found some sequences like you described in the apple OF as well. But the main clock change routine doesn't do that |
| 20:16:25 | DerPapst | see you |
| 20:16:26 | | Quit DerPapst ("So Long And Thanks For All The Fish!") |
| 20:17:15 | amiconn | The 0x420000xx values seem to be some kind of preparation for deep sleep (32kHz clock), but I don't have an idea what the lower 8 bits do... |
| 20:18:35 | amiconn | If that chinese site is correct, the G1 runs PP5000, and the G2 runs PP5001. But somehow I don't believe that... |
| 20:19:03 | dan_a | I understood that G1-G3 used PP5002 |
| 20:19:19 | amiconn | Yes, that's what the ipl site says |
| 20:20:19 | low_light | well, the bootloader doesn't actually change cpu freq as far as I can tell, but the routine appears to be there |
| 20:22:07 | | Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection) |
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| 20:33:16 | dan_a | amiconn: Writing 0xe011 to 0xcf005010 gives 66MHz. 0xe022 gives 33MHz |
| 20:33:44 | amiconn | And 0xe000 gives 75? |
| 20:35:13 | dan_a | I'll check... |
| 20:35:13 | | Join entheh [0] (n=purr@88-106-242-217.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) |
| 20:35:38 | amiconn | Seems I have to re-check the readout routine... |
| 20:36:37 | | Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 20:37:25 | dan_a | amiconn: 0xe000 gives 132MHz |
| 20:37:31 | amiconn | euh |
| 20:37:42 | amiconn | Looks like your calibration isn't correct then |
| 20:38:04 | amiconn | But the divider works different from what I though. It works like on PP5020+ |
| 20:38:24 | | Join mirak [0] (n=mirak@m60.net81-64-221.noos.fr) |
| 20:40:13 | * | amiconn calculates that 18182 would be the correct value |
| 20:40:50 | amiconn | That would also make a lot more sense in comparison to PP5020+ |
| 20:41:11 | amiconn | dan_a: Is the 48MHz estimation based on the same correction factor? |
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| 20:47:51 | amiconn | dan_a: I think the loader sets 24MHz |
| 20:49:26 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend") |
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| 21:00 |
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| 21:02:17 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 21:02:23 | gregj | what's up folks |
| 21:04:51 | | Quit chrisjs169_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:08:37 | | Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 21:10:08 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-e4611b096129a71f) |
| 21:15:55 | linuxstb_ | gregj: Hi. Your wmv file (I think it was your's - solo_as_i_am.wmv) now plays in Rockbox. |
| 21:16:12 | linuxstb_ | (audio-only...) |
| 21:16:34 | amiconn | bah |
| 21:16:47 | * | amiconn needs to find an iram function in the g3 firmware :( |
| 21:17:54 | | Join bdgraue [0] (n=bdgraue@dyndsl-080-228-219-125.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:18:20 | gregj | linuxstb_: cool, I will certainly try it - thanks :) |
| 21:19:29 | gregj | isn't it funny, if you put in google |
| 21:19:37 | gregj | http://www.google.com/search?q=how+to+tell+a+girl+that+you+want+to+go+out+with+her |
| 21:19:45 | gregj | first few answers will be direct opposite |
| 21:20:04 | gregj | I guess chanining that to 'ask her out' would be better ;) |
| 21:20:33 | amiconn | linuxstb: Do you agree that http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/CodecPerformanceComparison uses too many different bitrates for the lossy codecs? |
| 21:22:03 | linuxstb_ | amiconn: Yes, I already mentioned that to the people doing those tests. I think we agree that something like a "typical" and "maximum" is all that's really needed. |
| 21:22:10 | linuxstb_ | (we = you and I) |
| 21:22:57 | dan_a | amiconn: With your calibration, when the CPU frequency menu says it is running at 30MHz, perfcheck shows 17MHz. When the CPU frequency menu says 78MHz, perfcheck says 44.21 |
| 21:23:33 | amiconn | hmm, but how does that match your 132MHz reading? |
| 21:24:37 | amiconn | ohh, let me check something... |
| 21:24:39 | | Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) |
| 21:25:37 | amiconn | Ooops, seems I cut the clock on PP5002 in half when doing my PP502x changes |
| 21:25:52 | amiconn | Only if cpu scaling is enabled, that is |
| 21:26:08 | dan_a | Ooops! That will explain why the results were weird! |
| 21:26:50 | linuxstb_ | dan_a: How stable is Rockbox on your 3G? A few people have come to IRC over the last few months reporting frequent crashes (whilst you weren't around). |
| 21:27:00 | | Join low_light [0] (i=c730190a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/ircatwork.com/x-d4a15ada95d9f896) |
| 21:27:31 | | Quit billytwowilly (Remote closed the connection) |
| 21:27:36 | amiconn | dan_a: could you change line 104 outl(8, 0xcf005018); to |
| 21:27:40 | amiconn | outl(4, 0xcf005018); |
| 21:27:43 | amiconn | and re-check? |
| 21:27:46 | dan_a | linuxstb_: I've not been using it recently, but it had started crashing - it seemed to be a CPU scaling problem |
| 21:27:48 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S0106001346f5afbd.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 21:28:04 | linuxstb_ | Ah so CPU scaling was enabled? |
| 21:28:17 | amiconn | I changed the pll divider from 8 to 4 on PP502x, and this is the matching change for PP5002 |
| 21:29:12 | dan_a | linuxstb_: IIRC, that was my first commit |
| 21:29:17 | | Join atsea- [0] (i=ariel@gateway/tor/x-f6f9442b8b91dd20) |
| 21:29:30 | amiconn | That should make it possible to match the estimations with scaling enabled vs. disabled |
| 21:29:56 | amiconn | linuxstb: I guess its the timing setup issue we also had on PP502x |
| 21:30:33 | | Quit HellDragon (Client Quit) |
| 21:30:36 | amiconn | I do not fully understand the clock setup yet, as there are many special cases. Sometimes the code also seems to repeat stuff |
| 21:31:03 | * | amiconn should do the test with disabled cache first |
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| 21:39:05 | | Join Buschel [0] (n=AndreeBu@p54A3FE1A.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:47:10 | Buschel | hi there, does anybody know how much CPU (in MHz) is consumed on an iPOD when rockbox is idle? from my measurements i can see that rockbox needs decoding-core + 12 MHz while playback. i am interested in possible reduction of the residual 12 MHz |
| 21:47:22 | dan_a | amiconn: With updated calibration, 0xe000 gives 66MHz |
| 21:48:23 | | Quit petur ("reboot") |
| 21:50:23 | dan_a | 0xe011 gives 33MHz |
| 21:50:41 | amiconn | Yea, so the divider divides by (n+1) |
| 21:50:42 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 21:50:56 | amiconn | But the estimation is still not 100% correct |
| 21:51:07 | | Join Robin0800 [0] (n=Robin080@cpc4-brig8-0-0-cust563.brig.cable.ntl.com) |
| 21:51:30 | amiconn | I assume you're running with the changed pll divider, scaling enabled, and cpu set to 78MHz? |
| 21:52:01 | amiconn | ..and calibration value == 18182? |
| 21:52:31 | | Quit richcoosa19_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 21:52:43 | linuxstb_ | Buschel: What are you measuring? I 'm not sure I understand your question - when Rockbox is idle, by definition it's consuming no CPU. |
| 21:52:46 | amiconn | Btw, the divider is evaluated the wrong way in the OF... |
| 21:54:06 | dan_a | I'm using calibration = 16000, which gives 24MHz and 30MHz at those frequencies, but 66MHz when the CPU Frequencies page says 78MHz |
| 21:55:03 | amiconn | Now that is interesting... |
| 21:55:23 | Buschel | linux: ok, i'll try explain better :) lets say the decoder-core for some format needs 30 MHz for realtime decoding and the CPU needs 42 MHz for playback. then there is 12 MHz left which is consumed by all other activities (which include dsp and i2c to DAC) |
| 21:55:30 | dan_a | (with the divider at 8 and the calibration at 32000 I got the correct values consistently) |
| 21:55:47 | amiconn | Yeah, but that is *not* correct |
| 21:56:04 | amiconn | So there seems to be a 66MHz limiter in the chip ?!? |
| 21:56:18 | Buschel | linux: 12 MHz is quite a lot when comparing it to all the stuff the decoder does with 40 MHz |
| 21:56:42 | amiconn | The PLL base clock is 24MHz and the multipliers are 4, 5 and 13 now, giving 24, 30 and 78MHz |
| 21:56:47 | dan_a | No, I understand that it's not correct - so either there is a limiter or the divider isn't simply a divider, but controls other things too |
| 21:58:27 | linuxstb_ | Buschel: How are you measuring those frequencies? |
| 21:59:48 | amiconn | dan_a: That sounds unlikely |
| 21:59:50 | enyc | Hrrrm... |
| 22:00 |
| 22:00:14 | enyc | Ipod mini 2nd generation... seems to have real battery life problems using rockbox just for audio playing..... |
| 22:00:31 | enyc | (playing mostly 128kbps mp3 and 128mpbs aac) |
| 22:00:38 | enyc | without useng scopes and suchlike |
| 22:00:43 | enyc | ... is this normal? |
| 22:00:58 | | Quit Bagder ("*plopp*") |
| 22:01:08 | bagawk | enyc: yea, my video only gets about 9-10 hours |
| 22:01:29 | enyc | bagawk: hrrm ipod mini 2g ... 1 hour life apparently ;-) |
| 22:01:30 | bagawk | enyc: it's the big reason I still use the apple software |
| 22:01:36 | amiconn | Battery life with rockbox on ipods is less that original firmware |
| 22:01:43 | enyc | bagawk: used to do more before esing rockbox |
| 22:01:49 | amiconn | However, mini g2 is one of the better targets |
| 22:01:55 | enyc | amiconn: ok.. and what sort of 'ratio' is normal? |
| 22:02:04 | | Join hannesd_ [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 22:02:05 | amiconn | You should get 6..8 hours on that |
| 22:02:16 | enyc | maybe this has a buggy version on there? waht about hard drive idle not working? |
| 22:02:18 | * | amiconn has a mini g2 himself |
| 22:02:30 | enyc | amiconn: maybe the batt is dying? |
| 22:02:33 | Buschel | linux: 78 MHz CPU / 2,6x realtime (test_codec) = 40 MHz, 25% boost-ratio for playback = 0,75*30 MHz + 0,25*78 MHz = 42 MHz |
| 22:02:45 | linuxstb_ | enyc: How long do you get with the Apple firmware? |
| 22:02:46 | amiconn | Doing a runtime test (playing ~200kbps mp3, but no backlight) recently yielded 8:40 |
| 22:02:47 | enyc | amiconn: should vorbis work well on the mini 2g? |
| 22:02:57 | enyc | linuxstb_: i'd need to ask.. its not actually mine ;-) |
| 22:03:28 | enyc | amiconn: are the backlight/hdd timeouts configurable? |
| 22:04:43 | * | enyc waits patiently ;-) |
| 22:05:04 | linuxstb_ | Yes, they are, but the defaults are very short (4s for backlight and 5s for disk iirc) |
| 22:05:26 | enyc | linuxstb_: right... so it SHOULD be spinning down the disk when just playing files... ok.. |
| 22:05:52 | amiconn | During playback it always spins down fast |
| 22:05:56 | linuxstb_ | Yes. the disk spins down, but Rockbox doesn't fully power them off on the ipods (we don't know how). |
| 22:06:09 | enyc | linuxstb_: i understand |
| 22:06:35 | enyc | hrrm |
| 22:06:45 | enyc | have to do a playback test etc. on both firmwares |
| 22:06:59 | enyc | may well be worth installing a newer rockbox... maybe there si a bug in that version etc. |
| 22:07:18 | linuxstb_ | Yes, that's the only way to compare. Choose a long MP3 album, and play it on repeat in both firmwares until the battery dies. |
| 22:07:33 | linuxstb_ | (long means larger than the available RAM - 32MB) |
| 22:07:59 | Buschel | linux: ahem, 78 / 2.6 = 30 of course :/ |
| 22:08:09 | enyc | also... if the battery is dying (not unusual on ipod units) then this sort of low bottery life is usual ;-) |
| 22:08:23 | | Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) |
| 22:08:37 | enyc | ill try to get that tested ;-) |
| 22:08:42 | | Quit perplexity (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 22:08:46 | | Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:08:49 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp253-15.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
| 22:09:39 | linuxstb_ | Buschel: I'm not sure how accurate the boost ratio is - e.g. boost happens when the disk is spinning, regardless of CPU load (to keep disk spinup time to a minimum). |
| 22:10:12 | linuxstb_ | Your measurements also don't take account of how much time the CPU is sleeping. |
| 22:10:19 | Buschel | linux: boost ratio was measured after several minutes of playback for several files/codecs |
| 22:10:27 | * | amiconn wonders what Buschel is trying to achieve |
| 22:11:44 | Buschel | amiconn: i try to understand where the cpu-time is consumed -> for optimization |
| 22:12:32 | amiconn | There is such a load of factors that it's probably not possible to find out during normal playback |
| 22:12:47 | Buschel | amiconn: lower cpu-time may decrease power consumption. further optimization of e.g. mpc-decoder will not have that large impact, if lots of cpu-time spent on other tasks |
| 22:12:48 | amiconn | I think you need some kind of test_dsp plugin for that |
| 22:13:15 | Buschel | amiconn: good point |
| 22:13:35 | amiconn | There's cpu time consumed for all kinds of things, even lcd updates in the audio debug screen take a measurable amount |
| 22:14:07 | Buschel | amiconn: you do not know how much by accident? |
| 22:14:15 | amiconn | When playing the same track on H1x0 and H300 and watching boost ratio in audio debug, the boost ratio on H300 is higher |
| 22:14:41 | amiconn | ...because of its colour screen, even when neutralizing other factors (like the adc read) |
| 22:14:51 | amiconn | Both adc and lcd timing cannot be optimised further |
| 22:15:08 | | Join Soul-Slayer [0] (n=Administ@89.241.225.119) |
| 22:15:13 | amiconn | And on ipod, we don't even know how to change the lcd interface timing... |
| 22:15:14 | | Join BigMac [0] (n=mike@c-71-234-95-131.hsd1.ct.comcast.net) |
| 22:15:53 | Buschel | but do we know how much cpu-time such tasks (lcd-update, dsp, dac) consume? |
| 22:16:08 | Buschel | something like profiling results? |
| 22:16:39 | | Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:16:40 | linuxstb_ | There's a test_fps plugin which measures lcd update speed. |
| 22:17:28 | Buschel | is this contained in the standard package or do i need to enable it before compiling? |
| 22:17:40 | | Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 22:17:49 | linuxstb_ | You need to enable it - similar to test_codec |
| 22:19:31 | Soul-Slayer | Does anyone elses gigabeat sometimes refuse to turn on unless they turn the battery off and on again, or am I alone there? |
| 22:21:26 | linuxstb_ | I sometimes get the Toshiba "recharge battery" splash. But it always works at the second attempt. |
| 22:21:35 | Soul-Slayer | Yes I get that also |
| 22:21:50 | Soul-Slayer | Are you using the empty system files or do you still have the OF ones? |
| 22:22:03 | linuxstb_ | I have the OF ones. |
| 22:22:13 | Soul-Slayer | Right, then I have no idea why mine does this |
| 22:22:26 | * | linuxstb_ is waiting impatiently for kkurbjun's flashing work to progress |
| 22:23:08 | saratoga | does rockbox boost when buttons are pressed? |
| 22:23:08 | XavierGr | alas |
| 22:23:25 | XavierGr | saratoga: I don't think so |
| 22:23:41 | linuxstb_ | saratoga: No, but I think it could be nice, at least on some targets |
| 22:23:48 | saratoga | that might be a nice feature for the PP targets, at least until smp works better |
| 22:24:00 | saratoga | if I make a patch for PP, would it be accepted? |
| 22:24:05 | amiconn | dan_a: So the calibration value is 16000? |
| 22:24:31 | | Part Domonoky_ |
| 22:24:57 | linuxstb_ | saratoga: I think it's definitely a worthwhile experiment. I don't think it's needed for all PP targets though - just ones with large colour LCDs (e.g. Color/Photo, Sansa and Video) |
| 22:25:26 | linuxstb_ | saratoga; It's probably also not needed in all screens - e.g. boosting in the WPS isn't needed |
| 22:26:12 | amiconn | saratoga: Boosting/unboosting in quick succcession is a bad idea and must be avoided |
| 22:26:39 | amiconn | Each transition needs to wait for the pll to relock, that's why |
| 22:27:20 | linuxstb_ | I had in mind a boost with something like a 5-10 second timeout. |
| 22:27:36 | amiconn | What should that be good for, btw? |
| 22:27:46 | Buschel | btw, is it known that pc-sim does not compile? i have to comment wma. |
| 22:27:58 | amiconn | You need to reconfigure |
| 22:28:06 | linuxstb_ | Make the UI more responsive. It's noticably more reactive when the CPU is boosted on my Color. |
| 22:28:10 | amiconn | The sim compiles fine, see build table |
| 22:28:35 | amiconn | linuxstb: There seems to be a problem in the menus that doesn't exist in the browser |
| 22:28:58 | Buschel | hmm, maybe i should really get a clean trunk and re-do my patches... |
| 22:29:14 | amiconn | This has nothing to do with boost |
| 22:29:37 | amiconn | Clearly noticeable on the video: menus are sluggish at 30MHz, browser is okay |
| 22:30:01 | | Join kubiix [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz) |
| 22:30:12 | | Quit Buschel () |
| 22:31:05 | | Part rogelio ("Kopete 0.12.4 : http://kopete.kde.org") |
| 22:31:06 | * | amiconn thinks that this problem needs to be hunted down & fixed |
| 22:31:47 | dan_a | amiconn: I think 16000 is correct |
| 22:32:09 | amiconn | Okay. SHould I commit the fixed pll divider + added debug stuff? |
| 22:32:18 | amiconn | The debug stuff is there for PP50x as well |
| 22:32:24 | dan_a | Definitely |
| 22:32:29 | amiconn | ok |
| 22:33:08 | | Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 22:33:19 | * | amiconn wonders where that limiter hides :( |
| 22:33:43 | | Quit BigMac (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:33:51 | amiconn | dan_a: If there's really a clock limiter, this explains the especially poor performance on G3 |
| 22:34:02 | | Join kubiixaka [0] (n=Miranda@mos-81-27-201-28.karneval.cz) |
| 22:34:19 | amiconn | 66MHz is only 10% more than what the iFP CPU has, plus the PP5002 has a broken cache... |
| 22:34:36 | amiconn | (otherwise the calibration factor would be the same as on PP502x) |
| 22:34:58 | dan_a | The 5002 is rated up to 90MHz though, IIRC |
| 22:35:31 | | Join Rincewind [0] (i=NUYnuTbW@nat-wh-1.rz.uni-karlsruhe.de) |
| 22:36:42 | | Join amiconn_ [0] (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 22:36:50 | | Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.) |
| 22:36:51 | | Nick amiconn_ is now known as amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 22:37:09 | | Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:37:20 | amiconn | dan_a: yes it is |
| 22:37:53 | amiconn | Maybe it's a safety measure that you have to unlock >66MHz. |
| 22:38:18 | amiconn | Somehow I'm not convinced though... |
| 22:45:31 | | Quit jhulst (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:46:38 | | Quit Guile` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:46:59 | | Join Guile` [0] (n=Guile@84.4.29.52) |
| 22:50:27 | | Quit kubiix (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:50:51 | amiconn | dan_a: If you disable cpu scaling and then use the clock estimation, does it yield 66MHz or 75MHz? |
| 22:51:58 | dan_a | amiconn: 66. I then dropped the clock speed to 66MHz (outl(66, 0xcf00501c) in ipod_set_cpu_speed) and the estimation was still 66MHz |
| 22:52:28 | | Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@c-71-205-0-132.hsd1.mi.comcast.net) |
| 22:52:31 | amiconn | Very interesting... there seems to be a limit somehow... |
| 22:53:40 | amiconn | And the non-scaling setup uses a different pll divider (24) compared to the scaling setup (4), so it's independent from that one |
| 22:56:06 | dan_a | I drop the clock speed to 24Mhz and the estimation is 24MHz. There is definitely some kind of limit |
| 22:56:14 | | Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection) |
| 22:56:22 | amiconn | Yes, and I guess if you set 53 you get 53 |
| 22:57:54 | linuxstb | GodEater or GodEater_ : Around? |
| 22:59:18 | dan_a | 53MHz gives 53MHz, as expected. |
| 22:59:24 | amiconn | You could try something: Change line 113 (or line 138, depending on whether you have clock scaling enabled): |
| 22:59:51 | amiconn | from outl(0xa8, 0xcf00500c); to outl(0xac, 0xcf00500c); |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:08 | amiconn | This will use the other post-divider setting |
| 23:00:18 | amiconn | Maybe one is limited and the other is not |
| 23:00:27 | dan_a | Trying it now |
| 23:00:58 | amiconn | Iiuc, this register defines the mode for the 4 selectable clock sources |
| 23:01:16 | amiconn | Bit 0..1 define source 1, bit 2..3 define source 2 etc |
| 23:01:49 | amiconn | We're using source 2, so this change sets the mode from 2 to 3 |
| 23:02:06 | | Join DerPapst [0] (n=DerPapst@p54BD375A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:02:21 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 23:02:31 | amiconn | Mode 0 is 32kHz (but that probably requires tons of other registers to be set up properly), mode 1 is 24MHz, mode 2 and mode 3 use the PLL but with different post-dividers |
| 23:02:35 | DerPapst | Good evening :) |
| 23:03:42 | * | dan_a is an idiot |
| 23:03:46 | amiconn | ? |
| 23:04:05 | dan_a | I should have moved the multiplier back to 75 before doing that test! |
| 23:04:15 | amiconn | hehe, true |
| 23:05:12 | dan_a | Still 66MHz |
| 23:05:25 | amiconn | ok, so the modes act the same |
| 23:06:00 | amiconn | nasty.... :\ |
| 23:07:11 | dan_a | I wonder if IPL know anything |
| 23:07:27 | dan_a | (about this issue, I mean!) |
| 23:11:27 | | Quit SirFunk (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 23:12:09 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 23:12:41 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) |
| 23:14:03 | | Quit freqmod (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:14:23 | amiconn | dan_a: The ipl code doesn't tell anything else than what is in rockbox, and the wiki doesn't even know about the clock setup registers |
| 23:14:45 | amiconn | Actually the clock setup code seems to be copied verbatim from ipl, including a mistake |
| 23:15:07 | amiconn | Check the calculation in the comment for the #if block ... |
| 23:15:26 | amiconn | #if 0 block I mean |
| 23:15:49 | dan_a | 64 is almost 66... |
| 23:15:53 | amiconn | hehe |
| 23:16:25 | amiconn | http://ipodlinux.cvs.sourceforge.net/ipodlinux/linux/arch/armnommu/mach-ipod/hardware.c?revision=1.20&view=markup line 147ff |
| 23:21:07 | dan_a | It explains why raising the clock speed never had the effect I'd hoped for |
| 23:23:33 | linuxstb_ | dan_a: I don't know if you've seen tomal's libmad optimisations (FS #6705), but it makes mp3 decoding on the 3G around 154% realtime (192kbps file) compared to 118% without the patch. |
| 23:24:01 | dan_a | linuxstb_: I haven't, but I'll take a look now |
| 23:24:03 | amiconn | Someone really needs to check output accuracy... |
| 23:24:27 | | Quit Soul-Slayer (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:26:43 | saratoga | linuxstb: to boost for a couple seconds, I'd have to register a timer to turn off the boost ? |
| 23:26:55 | saratoga | or is there some ready made function to do it |
| 23:27:57 | dan_a | amiconn: How do we do that? Especially given that we know that the output will be different from the existing decoder? |
| 23:28:11 | linuxstb_ | saratoga: Do you experience the same as amiconn - faster UI in the file browser than the menu? |
| 23:28:49 | | Join PaulJam [0] (n=pauljam@vpn-3008.gwdg.de) |
| 23:28:55 | saratoga | on the sansa with or without boosting? |
| 23:29:15 | DerPapst | without |
| 23:29:30 | linuxstb_ | Yes, I guess without is the better test. |
| 23:29:30 | DerPapst | menus should be laggy and the filebrowser not |
| 23:29:33 | saratoga | bah sorry, i mean scaling |
| 23:29:44 | DerPapst | even without that ;) |
| 23:30:03 | linuxstb_ | DerPapst: So you notice it? |
| 23:30:34 | DerPapst | actually haven't tried yet.. i just repeat what i've read a few hours ago ;) |
| 23:30:38 | DerPapst | will test now. |
| 23:30:49 | saratoga | with scaling disabled, everything is fast |
| 23:31:38 | saratoga | at least playing with it now, i couldn't notice a difference between the database, file browser or settings menus while playing a lame aps mp3 |
| 23:32:09 | * | linuxstb_ switches computers |
| 23:32:11 | | Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC") |
| 23:33:07 | DerPapst | strange.. |
| 23:33:09 | saratoga | you know, a very easy way to handle boosting on button touches would be to just have the back light handle boosting |
| 23:33:21 | saratoga | since presumably people who have the light on are interacting with the player |
| 23:33:23 | amiconn | dan_a: Some time ago I've read about some test method on the libmad website |
| 23:33:32 | saratoga | at least for targets like the sansa that are useless without backlight on |
| 23:33:42 | amiconn | That would be short sighted |
| 23:33:59 | amiconn | It would mean the cpu would be always boosted when the backlight is always on |
| 23:34:23 | amiconn | And there are situations where you want the backlight always on without operating the ui |
| 23:34:48 | saratoga | doesn't the back light use many times more power then boosting? |
| 23:34:49 | * | PaulJam keeps his backlight almost always on |
| 23:34:55 | amiconn | Boosting more isn't solving the problems |
| 23:35:15 | amiconn | It only shortens battery runtime |
| 23:35:33 | saratoga | no but its a trival to implement solution until SMP support is working better |
| 23:35:39 | saratoga | then we can simply revert it |
| 23:35:40 | davina | with headphones on and your music machine in your pocket, who needs a backlight |
| 23:35:42 | linuxstb | saratoga: I think that if boost-on-button-press is implemented, it's only needed in the list widget, not everywhere. |
| 23:35:49 | DerPapst | filebrower is as reactive as the plugin menu... but browsing themes is slower. |
| 23:35:52 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC") |
| 23:35:57 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=980398fe@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-84bb01ecf9cbcc2b) |
| 23:36:07 | | Nick saratoga is now known as saratoga2 (i=980398fe@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-84bb01ecf9cbcc2b) |
| 23:36:07 | linuxstb | The plugin menu _is_ the file browser... |
| 23:36:16 | saratoga2 | linuxstb: good point |
| 23:36:20 | DerPapst | that expalin it.. |
| 23:36:25 | DerPapst | i didn't know that. |
| 23:36:39 | amiconn | The PP5002 datasheet states 170mW for mp3 decoding. That's in the same order of magnitude as the backlight |
| 23:37:13 | amiconn | davina: The music machine isn't only used in the pocket |
| 23:37:23 | | Quit billytwowilly (Remote closed the connection) |
| 23:37:39 | amiconn | I use it in my car, and my car.cfg sets the backlight to always on (even on mono/greyscale targets) |
| 23:37:40 | | Join billytwowilly [0] (n=chris@S0106001346f5afbd.cg.shawcable.net) |
| 23:37:56 | linuxstb | But yes, on my Color, the menus do seem slower than the file browser, although both are slower than I would like, and are nice and fast when the CPU is boosted. |
| 23:38:19 | amiconn | So something must be wrong with the menus |
| 23:38:38 | linuxstb | The difference is even more noticable when boosted. |
| 23:38:49 | amiconn | Hmmmmm...... |
| 23:39:00 | davina | amiconn thats true, in the car mine plugs into its ipod dock and charges from the battery so i can mount it on the dashboard with the light on, and also at home in the stereo doc it charges and also i can have the screen on. but i dont have screen lit up on battery alone except to change tracks |
| 23:39:22 | amiconn | I'm not sure, but I *think* I remember having seen the menu code updating the lcd more than once per step in the sim |
| 23:39:48 | davina | anyway its night night from me, sweet dreams all |
| 23:39:52 | | Quit davina ("xchat on Ubuntu 7.04") |
| 23:40:06 | | Join Hilikus [0] (n=aaa@penhune-lab-172-107.Concordia.CA) |
| 23:40:53 | saratoga2 | amiconn: at least for the sansa, toni measured 40ma x 1.5(?) volts == 60mw for mp3 playback w/ scaling |
| 23:41:07 | Hilikus | hey guys, i want to record a live show usingmy dap, i was wondering if an uncompressed recording would give me longer battery life because theres no encoding or less since theres more disk spin? |
| 23:41:18 | saratoga2 | oh that would be 40ma at battery voltage i guess |
| 23:41:32 | amiconn | yes |
| 23:41:35 | saratoga2 | so probably what you said |
| 23:42:07 | amiconn | But of course the PP5022/5024 draws less than the PP5002, with the PP5020 _probably_ inbetween |
| 23:42:33 | linuxstb | Hilikus: I would guess less due to the increased disk activity, but it's just a guess. I don't think anyone has done recording battery benchmarks with different encoders. |
| 23:42:47 | saratoga2 | i think its just color targets (IE sansa, nano and video) where this would be a big issue |
| 23:43:07 | Hilikus | so is there any recommendation on which format to use? what do you use for a long recording? |
| 23:43:08 | | Quit Hadaka (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) |
| 23:43:11 | saratoga2 | maybe photo too |
| 23:43:28 | linuxstb | saratoga2: The Nano's LCD is small, so I would guess it's fine. The Color/Photo is slow (it's what I have) |
| 23:44:28 | linuxstb | Anyone know if the list widget uses partial lcd updates? I know there was a patch for it, but don't recall it being committed. |
| 23:44:59 | amiconn | It does. But perhaps the menu code does an additonal update, perhaps even fullscreen? |
| 23:45:05 | | Join iamben_ [0] (n=ben@dpc67142179038.direcpc.com) |
| 23:45:21 | | Quit iamben (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 23:45:23 | amiconn | -> sim, and add DEBUGF() messages to lcd_update() and lcd_update_rect() |
| 23:45:35 | Hilikus | any idea how big would a 2hour wave file mono at 44k would be?? |
| 23:46:09 | DerPapst | under 4GB ;) |
| 23:46:22 | Hilikus | great! |
| 23:46:25 | petur | a fair bit below 2GB |
| 23:46:35 | petur | oh mono.. even less |
| 23:46:43 | linuxstb | IIRC, a CD is 650MB for 74 minutes of Stereo. |
| 23:46:54 | Hilikus | i thought it wouldnt fit in my 20gb free space |
| 23:46:55 | petur | why wiould you want to record in mono? |
| 23:46:55 | Hilikus | hehe |
| 23:47:04 | Hilikus | built in mic |
| 23:47:16 | petur | don't use that... |
| 23:47:25 | Hilikus | i cant use a real mic |
| 23:47:41 | petur | what device? |
| 23:47:49 | Hilikus | petur you this its too bad? |
| 23:47:54 | Hilikus | x5 |
| 23:48:10 | petur | internal mic picks up HDD spinup noises |
| 23:48:10 | Hilikus | think* |
| 23:48:15 | DerPapst | Hilikus: a bigger problem would be the 4GB limit of fat32 and wave :P |
| 23:48:25 | petur | don't know how bad it is on x5 |
| 23:48:32 | Hilikus | so ive heard, but its either that or not record it at all |
| 23:48:39 | Hilikus | DerPapst mmm good point |
| 23:48:44 | petur | DerPapst: we split at 2G |
| 23:48:48 | petur | *GB |
| 23:48:50 | DerPapst | ah ok. |
| 23:48:55 | DerPapst | didn't know that |
| 23:49:09 | * | DerPapst has never recorded with rockbox |
| 23:49:10 | Hilikus | im thinking on using lossless encoding |
| 23:49:13 | petur | you can record untill disk full or batt empty ;) |
| 23:49:36 | Hilikus | cause i will probably sound edit the file after the show |
| 23:49:38 | petur | Hilikus: if you go for internal mic, I would record to mp3 |
| 23:49:43 | Hilikus | really? |
| 23:50:02 | lazka | is there a way to exclude all plugins from compiling? |
| 23:50:10 | petur | you'll have less spinups and internal mic quality is bad anyway |
| 23:50:16 | Hilikus | lazka change the SOURCES file |
| 23:50:19 | linuxstb | lazka: "make bin" (that also excludes codecs) |
| 23:50:22 | DerPapst | lazka: removem from SOURCES |
| 23:50:32 | lazka | thanks |
| 23:50:35 | saratoga2 | wow didn't know about make bin |
| 23:50:38 | DerPapst | ^ what linuxstb said :P |
| 23:50:41 | saratoga2 | would be handy |
| 23:51:05 | | Join rotator [0] (n=e@rockbox/developer/rotator) |
| 23:51:08 | Hilikus | petur, thanks for your oppinion, thats what i was looking for |
| 23:51:08 | saratoga2 | is there one that excludes plugins but includes codecs? |
| 23:51:12 | linuxstb | "make help" |
| 23:51:19 | petur | Hilikus: try to get an external mic ;) |
| 23:51:22 | linuxstb | saratoga2: No. |
| 23:51:42 | Hilikus | its not exactly "legal" to record the show eventhough im paying a lot of money to see it |
| 23:52:01 | Hilikus | but i understand, some people start selling it |
| 23:52:16 | Hilikus | i just want to have the memory of the show |
| 23:52:17 | * | petur taped bjork on sunday and was lucky to get through security :) |
| 23:52:32 | Hilikus | and you had an external mic? |
| 23:52:41 | petur | and mic amp :) |
| 23:52:42 | DerPapst | just claim that it can't record :P |
| 23:52:45 | Hilikus | wow |
| 23:52:45 | Hilikus | pro |
| 23:52:47 | Hilikus | hehe |
| 23:52:55 | | Part maffe |
| 23:53:09 | | Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@barmen.interhost.no) |
| 23:53:39 | Hilikus | petur so you think mp3 is fine even if i want to edit/retouch the file afterwards? |
| 23:53:40 | linuxstb | Hmm, moving in the menu causes three almost full-screen lcd_update_rects (the status bar is excluded). |
| 23:53:49 | Hilikus | just uncompress it and edit it? |
| 23:54:00 | | Quit ompaul ("Leaving") |
| 23:54:27 | petur | Hilikus: there's always quality loss... if it is a loud show, go wav, if it is quiet, go mp3 to avoid spinup noises |
| 23:54:38 | linuxstb | And moving in the file browser just causes a single lcd_update_rect (same area) |
| 23:54:45 | Hilikus | i think its going to be loud! its tool |
| 23:54:56 | DerPapst | Hilikus: good audio editing programs can work with encoded formats as good as with wave |
| 23:55:02 | petur | Hilikus: then go wav... |
| 23:55:19 | petur | but I don't know if the internal mic won't overload though... |
| 23:55:21 | Hilikus | what does the volume have to do with the format petur? |
| 23:55:36 | pixelma | the problem with the internal mic in the X5 is that you can only have two gain settings... using an external one through line in will give 30 (or something like that) |
| 23:55:48 | petur | the mic will record disk spinups |
| 23:56:07 | linuxstb | DerPapst: Not really - mp3 limits the manipulations you can do without reencoding. |
| 23:56:22 | Hilikus | i see |
| 23:56:25 | petur | if it is loud, I would go for the lowest gain settings and pray |
| 23:56:40 | Hilikus | im going to run a test with the opening band |
| 23:56:51 | * | petur always does... |
| 23:56:53 | Hilikus | just to make sure its not clipping all the time |
| 23:57:01 | DerPapst | linuxstb: didn't have any difference with audidtion and cubase afair |
| 23:57:18 | linuxstb | DerPapst: Are you sure they didn't just transparently re-encode? |
| 23:57:27 | DerPapst | they probably did |
| 23:57:36 | DerPapst | ;) |
| 23:57:37 | Hilikus | yah thats what i was thinking too |
| 23:57:39 | * | DerPapst hides |
| 23:58:17 | | Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@71-10-136-117.dhcp.aldl.mi.charter.com) |
| 23:58:18 | linuxstb | Seems the menus perform two lcd updates when you press a button, and another one when you release it... |
| 23:58:32 | DerPapst | wow... |
| 23:58:34 | Hilikus | petur, last question, if i used mp3, what bitrate would you recommend> |
| 23:58:47 | linuxstb | Whereas the file browser is just performing one. |
| 23:58:49 | petur | the highest? |
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