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| 00:06:50 | | Quit datachild ("- nbs-irc 2.35 - www.nbs-irc.net -") |
| 00:07:26 | | Quit obo ("bye") |
| 00:07:51 | Blackbrother | How do i iinstall rock box on my 5g? |
| 00:09:15 | | Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]") |
| 00:09:49 | merbanan | Blackbrother: by reading the install instructions on the webpage |
| 00:10:38 | | Quit ender` (" I think I remember an episode of MacGyver where he overthrew a violent dictator with a rubber band, 2 bottle caps, and some ) |
| 00:10:47 | Blackbrother | merbanan: Well i just gotta extract the files on my ipod right? what about back ground pics? |
| 00:10:55 | | Join krazykit [0] (n=krazykit@gct09-56.gctel.net) |
| 00:11:44 | merbanan | well I know nothing more then what's on the webpage |
| 00:11:54 | Llorean | Blackbrother: Please simply read the manual |
| 00:12:49 | | Quit Guile`` ("KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'") |
| 00:12:55 | Blackbrother | Llorean : Can th player now REW or FF? |
| 00:13:16 | Llorean | Rockbox has had FF and RW since long before the iPod was supported... |
| 00:13:23 | dan_a | Blackbrother: That's in the manual ;) |
| 00:15:02 | Blackbrother | dan_a: lol i don't see the point why you won't tell whether the player can FF or REW movies ... sinmple yes or no answer lol |
| 00:15:18 | linuxstb_ | no |
| 00:15:41 | Blackbrother | linuxstb: thanks |
| 00:16:17 | linuxstb_ | But mpegplayer is very poor on the 5g, so I wouldn't recommend it. |
| 00:16:18 | dan_a | Blackbrother: I didn't tell you whether the player can FF or REW movies because I didn't know that is what you wanted to know |
| 00:17:05 | Llorean | Blackbrother: All you asked is if the player could ff/rw. |
| 00:17:17 | Blackbrother | well if anyone can help me ... how do i remove my old bootloader (now using ipl but and want to use rockbox bootloader) .... ok i see dan_a |
| 00:17:49 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@p5B09ADF3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 00:18:23 | linuxstb_ | How did you install your ipl bootloader? Was it with ipodpatcher? |
| 00:19:34 | | Quit MySic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 00:20:09 | | Part maffe |
| 00:22:37 | | Quit Blackbrother ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 00:23:11 | bluebrother | scorche: what do you think about converting the svg images of the players for the overview table? |
| 00:24:43 | | Quit godzirra (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 00:28:30 | * | linuxstb_ now recalls the last time blackbrother was around... |
| 00:30:39 | petur | wow, even I remembered |
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| 00:52:05 | Blackbrother | Where can i get background images for the rockbox , and I read the support and i couldn't find a link |
| 00:53:10 | Blackbrother | http://www.rockbox-themes.org/ |
| 00:54:00 | linuxstb_ | People don't tend to share backdrops separately, only as part of themes. |
| 00:54:08 | bluebrother | there is no page with backdrops around. Themes utilizing a backdrop usually ship them |
| 00:54:43 | Blackbrother | ahh I see |
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| 01:00 |
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| 01:04:14 | Blackbrother | How do we add album art to the songs? |
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| 01:05:07 | | Join the_login [0] (n=thelogin@adsl196-77-56-217-196.adsl196-10.iam.net.ma) |
| 01:05:32 | linuxstb_ | We don't - that's not supported by Rockbox. But there are unofficial builds which handle it - see their forum threads. |
| 01:05:43 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 01:06:24 | Blackbrother | is it in the rockbox forums? |
| 01:06:50 | linuxstb_ | Yes, see the "Unsupported Builds" forum. Any questions about them should be asked in those threads. |
| 01:08:22 | | Quit Robin0800 (" HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- \o/") |
| 01:09:31 | | Join safetydan [0] (i=cbca159f@rockbox/developer/safetydan) |
| 01:09:46 | Blackbrother | Oh, I see .... well thanks |
| 01:14:51 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-9fe82a038315be52) |
| 01:18:05 | linuxstb_ | saratoga: Hi. Any WMA news? |
| 01:20:02 | pixelma | linuxstb: beat me to it (re. 80GB Ipods...) :) |
| 01:22:57 | linuxstb_ | :) |
| 01:23:08 | Blackbrother | How come my themes i loaded isn't displaying? |
| 01:25:15 | linuxstb_ | Do you mean not displaying in the "Browse Themes" menu, or not changing the display after you select them? |
| 01:26:44 | Blackbrother | I extracted the themes but in rockbox nothing is being displayed |
| 01:27:40 | PaulJam | Where did you extract them to, and did the .zip files contain a .rockbox directory? |
| 01:27:42 | saratoga | linuxstb: yes I'm getting close on the low bitrate files issue |
| 01:28:20 | saratoga | i've got the noise coding stuff working (at least it gives identical output to the fp decoder), however very low bitrate files change a number of table sizes which breaks a lot of the nasty assumptions i made when I got rid of the malloc calls |
| 01:28:41 | saratoga | first step will be to commit some more sensible static memory allocation code, which i'm about how half way done with |
| 01:29:05 | Blackbrother | I extracted the backdrops, themes, and the wp folder but there isn't a font folder in my .rockbox folder |
| 01:29:13 | | Nick Tr1ckY^Gone is now known as Tr1ckY (n=Tr1ckY@0x535b39aa.ronxx2.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) |
| 01:29:36 | linuxstb_ | Then create one. You may also want to install the standard Rockbox fonts (see the manual) |
| 01:30:12 | saratoga | i've also been meaning to ask, is there someway to specify in ARM that a multiply should only use the 2 most significant bytes of a word? I'd like to speed things up by not doing full multiplies but I don't think it'd be worth it if I have to keep adding =& 0xFFFF000 after every op |
| 01:31:03 | linuxstb_ | I don't think so - some ARMs have 16-bit multiplication instructions, but our ones don't. |
| 01:31:15 | Blackbrother | linuxstb_: I have seen those fonts before .... thanks anyway |
| 01:31:48 | saratoga | linuxstb: well they do 16 bit multiplies if theres 0s in the last 2 bytes of the second operand, so you'd think there'd be a way to specify that |
| 01:31:50 | saratoga | but maybe not |
| 01:32:03 | linuxstb_ | Blackbrother: If you're saying you don't want those fonts, then fine, but don't complain when lots of themes don't work as you expect. |
| 01:32:04 | | Part toffe82 |
| 01:34:29 | Blackbrother | linuxstb_: I already have them installed .... but what can i do if the fonts and the background picture is the same color .... is there a way to reset the background? |
| 01:34:38 | PaulJam | concerning the "stkov main" problem on Hxxx players: wouldn't it be possible to increase the main stack temprarily in SVN until someone fixes the problem? |
| 01:35:10 | PaulJam | Blackbrother: turn on the hold switch when rockbox boots. this resets all settings. |
| 01:35:14 | saratoga | I think the idea was to movtivate someone to fix the problem by not increasing the stack size |
| 01:35:40 | Blackbrother | PaulJam: Thanks |
| 01:35:41 | PaulJam | ok, that makes sense. |
| 01:39:12 | Blackbrother | Whaen i start up my ipod i automatically enter rockbox but how can i go to the normal ipod menu? |
| 01:40:25 | linuxstb_ | Turn the hold switch on immediately after your ipod boots (before Rockbox starts). |
| 01:40:44 | linuxstb_ | and before the backlight comes on. |
| 01:41:33 | Blackbrother | linuxstb_: Thanks |
| 01:42:25 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 01:42:29 | linuxstb_ | saratoga: Do you know how much memory the WMA codec is using now? |
| 01:42:30 | Blackbrother | Have anyone found a way to reduce the usage of batter for the ipod video |
| 01:42:59 | Blackbrother | battery* |
| 01:45:25 | Blackbrother | The source code isn't known i guess |
| 01:45:52 | saratoga | linuxstb: is there some easy way to find that in the map file? or do I just look for the highest 0x4... address? |
| 01:46:42 | | Quit Blackbrother ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 01:47:02 | saratoga | err rather i mean 0x01f address |
| 01:48:47 | linuxstb_ | Yes, looking for the highest address is the easiest. |
| 01:48:52 | saratoga | looks like 257Kb if I'm reading the file right |
| 01:48:56 | saratoga | plus IRAM |
| 01:49:19 | saratoga | i have some ideas to decrease that further, but they'll have to wait for the low bitrate fixes |
| 01:49:49 | | Quit the_login ("Leaving") |
| 01:51:37 | linuxstb_ | Yes, that looks right. Over 200KB of that seems to be BSS (i.e. runtime data) |
| 01:53:08 | | Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@c220-237-57-32.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 01:53:26 | linuxstb_ | And about 42KB of IRAM? |
| 01:53:43 | | Quit Tr1ckY ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )") |
| 01:54:58 | * | linuxstb_ wonders if tomal has got WMA working on the iFP |
| 01:55:21 | | Quit secleinteer (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 01:55:40 | saratoga | linuxstb: that looks about right |
| 01:55:41 | | Quit sarixe ("Peace") |
| 01:55:47 | JdGordon | hey Nico_P |
| 01:55:47 | saratoga | the IRAM stuff is still fairly sloppy |
| 01:55:58 | saratoga | i need to play with it more |
| 01:56:22 | | Join mbishop [0] (n=martin@unaffiliated/mbishop) |
| 01:58:11 | mbishop | How well supported is the sansa e200 line of players? any problems? |
| 01:58:49 | | Join secleinteer [0] (n=scl@adsl-70-237-212-124.dsl.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net) |
| 01:59:03 | saratoga | mbishop: pretty well, though its only been working for a few months |
| 02:00 |
| 02:01:34 | | Quit spiorf_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 02:06:37 | | Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC") |
| 02:07:59 | mbishop | Hmm, ok, I might end up trying it |
| 02:09:11 | | Part mbishop ("Konversation terminated!") |
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| 02:20:27 | | Quit entheh ("^~") |
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| 02:38:09 | | Quit DefineByte (Client Quit) |
| 02:38:24 | | Quit XavierGr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 02:38:27 | | Join DefineByte [0] (i=5751c305@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-b1f2862139639e90) |
| 02:38:53 | DefineByte | anyone seen killer's post in plugins/viewers? |
| 02:39:24 | DefineByte | wrong place. wrong title tut tut |
| 02:39:30 | DefineByte | still not really his fault |
| 02:39:58 | DefineByte | how is a new user supposed to know that music isn't played back via plugins? >.> |
| 02:40:55 | | Quit jhMikeS (Nick collision from services.) |
| 02:41:01 | | Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
| 02:41:07 | DefineByte | idlers in IRC are far more annoying. xD |
| 02:41:11 | | Part DefineByte |
| 02:43:14 | saratoga | DefineByte: hes got 40 posts so I wouldn't call him a new user |
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| 02:57:13 | | Quit PaulJam (".") |
| 03:00 |
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| 03:05:45 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 03:09:00 | | Join natror [0] (i=d4026320@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d108dcf81070ed89) |
| 03:11:35 | natror | Hello, I just want to upload a .wps and a theme for the iPod 5 gen. |
| 03:12:20 | natror | will you give me (GrzegorzMurzynowski) write right fot twiki? |
| 03:13:10 | midkay | sure |
| 03:13:39 | midkay | natror: that should be it. |
| 03:14:18 | natror | thanks. Hope someone will like that theme and wps. |
| 03:14:40 | midkay | which device is it for? |
| 03:15:10 | natror | it's for iPod 5th Gen (iPod Video). |
| 03:15:40 | midkay | cool, same player here. i'll have a look at it when it's up. |
| 03:16:29 | midkay | (brb) |
| 03:24:31 | | Quit gotthardt ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007060115]") |
| 03:24:42 | | Nick Tr1ckY is now known as Tr1ckY^Gone (n=Tr1ckY@0x535b39aa.ronxx2.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk) |
| 03:27:25 | | Join webguest4884 [0] (i=415fada3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-bd387d411cc495c6) |
| 03:27:37 | | Quit safetydan ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 03:27:40 | webguest4884 | rockbox 3.1 coming out anytime soon? |
| 03:28:01 | scorche | no |
| 03:28:15 | scorche | bluebrother: not quite following you |
| 03:28:52 | webguest4884 | why not? |
| 03:30:02 | scorche | because the goals of the project have changed a bit...we no longer care about releases much |
| 03:30:25 | scorche | we still plan to release a 3.0 release, but i cant really give you a timeline on that |
| 03:30:43 | | Quit dandin1 () |
| 03:32:57 | webguest4884 | ....:0 |
| 03:33:03 | webguest4884 | fuck this then |
| 03:33:05 | | Quit webguest4884 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 03:33:26 | scorche | ... |
| 03:33:53 | iamben | i never even thought about what the current version # is |
| 03:34:06 | iamben | my version is "2 hours ago" |
| 03:34:51 | scorche | well, version numbers entail a release |
| 03:35:00 | scorche | we havent had a release in quite a while |
| 03:35:35 | saratoga | i actually favor just pulling 2.5 entirely and doing away with releases altogether |
| 03:36:06 | saratoga | theres really no reason anyone should be using the releases we have, and it may be ages until we have another |
| 03:36:12 | scorche | saratoga: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/DevCon2007#Release_schedules |
| 03:36:18 | saratoga | they're somewhat misleading |
| 03:36:41 | saratoga | ah good |
| 03:36:45 | saratoga | makes sense really |
| 03:37:57 | saratoga | is anyone closely following that Zen thread? |
| 03:38:18 | saratoga | i kind of want to weed out the off topic posts, but they're so hard to parse Im not sure what can be deleted |
| 03:39:57 | Battousai | hmm |
| 03:39:57 | | Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@75-128-122-8.dhcp.aldl.mi.charter.com) |
| 03:40:01 | Battousai | delete the whole thing and see what gets posted again |
| 03:50:08 | | Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection) |
| 03:53:04 | | Join skyfaller [0] (n=nelson@wikipedia/Skyfaller) |
| 03:55:03 | skyfaller | hey folks, sorry for the stupid question, but I can't quite figure it out from your website... does the latest iPod video work with Rockbox? |
| 03:55:08 | skyfaller | is 5.5 the current generation? |
| 03:56:15 | scorche | yes |
| 04:00 |
| 04:17:52 | | Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@207-172-204-33.c3-0.rdl-ubr4.trpr-rdl.pa.cable.rcn.com) |
| 04:30:58 | | Quit donutman25 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 04:32:56 | | Join Journey [0] (i=Journey@190.72.34.78) |
| 04:33:55 | Journey | I'm having trouble with my IPod. It crashes constantly and I'm forced to reset it several times before it works again. Could this have anything to do with rockbox? |
| 04:34:04 | Journey | it's a 5.5g video IPod |
| 04:34:39 | | Part skyfaller ("Leaving") |
| 04:35:53 | | Quit Febs (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 04:38:35 | chrisjs169|brb | I've tried downloading the source archive three times so far, and each time when trying to compile Rockbox for the Sansa, I get "export/font.h:30:21: error: sysfont.h: No such file or directory" |
| 04:43:23 | saratoga | chrisjs169|brb: just built the sansa from SVN with no issues |
| 04:43:29 | saratoga | have you tried downloading it that way? |
| 04:45:25 | | Join mrobe5001 [0] (i=4792942c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-9d11949ad7fed2d4) |
| 04:46:07 | mrobe5001 | hi |
| 04:46:13 | | Join nick89 [0] (i=nick89@c220-237-70-197.kelvn1.qld.optusnet.com.au) |
| 04:46:28 | | Quit nick89 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 04:46:30 | chrisjs169|brb | saratoga: i'm thinking I'm going to need to |
| 04:46:33 | mrobe5001 | anyone here? i from the mrobe fourm |
| 04:46:58 | mrobe5001 | im here for about gettin rockbox for the 500i |
| 04:47:54 | mrobe5001 | anyone? |
| 04:48:18 | | Quit Journey () |
| 04:48:34 | | Join aliask [0] (n=chatzill@c58-109-97-210.eburwd4.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 04:48:51 | natror | the two files attached to http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/attach/Main/WpsGallery by me (GrzegorzMurzynowski) are there by mistake, please delete them. |
| 04:49:14 | | Quit mrobe5001 (Client Quit) |
| 04:51:39 | | Quit mbr (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 04:54:05 | | Join relaxed [0] (n=relaxed@unaffiliated/relaxed) |
| 05:00 |
| 05:02:15 | saratoga | natror: i think you can just delete them yourself |
| 05:03:19 | natror | no, i dont'have right |
| 05:04:10 | | Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection) |
| 05:05:03 | | Quit Soap (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 05:05:49 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 05:17:43 | | Join homielowe [0] (n=chatzill@66.183.75.253) |
| 05:18:06 | homielowe | newbiezhunter: I suggest you go on the IRC when some interested developers are on |
| 05:19:16 | | Part homielowe |
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| 05:35:02 | | Part natror |
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| 05:38:26 | | Quit relaxed ("http://www.zsnes.com/") |
| 05:39:37 | | Quit krylon () |
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| 05:48:31 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 05:50:35 | | Join relaxed [0] (n=relaxed@unaffiliated/relaxed) |
| 05:58:21 | | Join karma [0] (n=kvirc@dsl-74-220-77-35.cruzio.com) |
| 05:59:25 | karma | hey, I have a 30G 4th gen ipod that I used dd to copy a 20G 4th gen partition table to (the one on the wiki)... |
| 05:59:48 | karma | so now I have an sdb1 and sdb2 which is 20Gs, and I need it to be 30 |
| 06:00 |
| 06:00:32 | karma | I ran mkfs.vfat /dev/sdb2 and now there's a ~20G partition at sdb2 |
| 06:00:52 | karma | what should I use to make sdb2 expand by 10G |
| 06:05:44 | karma | ? |
| 06:06:48 | JdGordon | fdisk? |
| 06:07:09 | karma | JdGordon: Should I wipe sdb2 completely then recreate a new sdb2 as vfat? |
| 06:07:35 | | Quit relaxed ("http://www.zsnes.com/") |
| 06:08:26 | aliask | karma: Try parted, or gparted (if you use gnome) |
| 06:08:45 | | Join xNibbler [0] (n=sven@e181108079.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 06:08:58 | karma | I tried running gparted aliask |
| 06:09:06 | karma | It doesn't see anything at ALL on sdb! |
| 06:09:21 | aliask | Hrm, maybe it doesn't like doing it over USB. |
| 06:09:25 | karma | It just stupidly says that all of sdb is 27.94 GB of unallocated space |
| 06:09:42 | aliask | Oh... |
| 06:10:10 | karma | which worries me... |
| 06:10:36 | karma | there exist both sdb1 and sdb2 files though and I can mount sdb2 as vfat |
| 06:10:45 | karma | it's just not large enough |
| 06:11:08 | TiMiD[FD] | would be nice to have a format plugin |
| 06:11:28 | TiMiD[FD] | could be dangerous though |
| 06:11:33 | aliask | TiMiD[FD]: Bad idea if you ask me. |
| 06:12:04 | TiMiD[FD] | for example for people who put >120Gb hdd in their players |
| 06:12:17 | aliask | Especially for an OS like rockbox which isn't flashed (on most players) |
| 06:12:23 | scorche | very bad idea imo... |
| 06:12:33 | TiMiD[FD] | who are obliged to remove the disk and put it in the computer to format the >120gb partition |
| 06:12:47 | TiMiD[FD] | well |
| 06:12:49 | scorche | plus, why would you even want one on a device?...just us a computer... |
| 06:13:07 | TiMiD[FD] | even if rb gets wiped you can still reinstall it |
| 06:13:28 | scorche | on ipods maybe... |
| 06:13:53 | scorche | TiMiD[FD]: the reason why you have to remove the disk is because the device itself cant access higher sectors, so a format plugin wouldnt do a bit of good... |
| 06:14:17 | TiMiD[FD] | oh I read that it could, but that the usb chip couldn |
| 06:14:46 | TiMiD[FD] | so that you had to remove the disk in order to make the partitions and format |
| 06:15:00 | scorche | well, yeah...the USB to ATA bridge, but still... |
| 06:15:18 | scorche | there is no reason to format on the device itself...that is just asking for trouble |
| 06:15:39 | TiMiD[FD] | yes, but I'm idle :) |
| 06:15:39 | karma | : v |
| 06:15:39 | karma | 19631428 unallocated sectors |
| 06:15:53 | karma | that's what fdisk says is on my ipod |
| 06:15:57 | TiMiD[FD] | And I don't know what to program ... |
| 06:16:05 | TiMiD[FD] | I need something fun |
| 06:16:18 | TiMiD[FD] | to enjoy my work hours |
| 06:16:19 | scorche | plenty of feature requests to wade through if you wish =) |
| 06:16:20 | karma | why doesn't fdisk or gparted recognize that I have an sdb1 and sdb2 partition |
| 06:16:32 | TiMiD[FD] | scorche: ytes, but they seem so boring ... |
| 06:16:33 | scorche | partition table... |
| 06:16:51 | TiMiD[FD] | and also most of them require to have sound or a device |
| 06:16:59 | TiMiD[FD] | which I havn't at work ... |
| 06:17:12 | TiMiD[FD] | now that the remote port is almost finished |
| 06:17:27 | TiMiD[FD] | hmm |
| 06:17:35 | TiMiD[FD] | I would make another useless demo plugin |
| 06:18:00 | | Quit Nibbier (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 06:18:38 | TiMiD[FD] | or study for jlpt |
| 06:25:38 | Davo_Dinkum | TiMiD[FD]: What level are you studying for? |
| 06:30:14 | MournBlade | If I have a problem do I ask in here or some other place? |
| 06:31:06 | aliask | MournBlade: Here is fine |
| 06:31:16 | TiMiD[FD] | I'm thinking about taking the test for level 3 |
| 06:31:24 | TiMiD[FD] | I don't know my level actually |
| 06:31:31 | MournBlade | seems I have a problem with database mode Sansa |
| 06:31:46 | Davo_Dinkum | Don't you have to take the tests in order? |
| 06:31:46 | TiMiD[FD] | I live here so I learn what is usefull to survive :) |
| 06:31:55 | MournBlade | hangs on scanning |
| 06:32:15 | TiMiD[FD] | I bought the test application form yesterday |
| 06:32:20 | TiMiD[FD] | I'll see |
| 06:32:24 | MournBlade | does OK in file mode |
| 06:32:33 | TiMiD[FD] | I think my level is somewhere between 2 and 3 |
| 06:32:36 | * | scorche pushes the offtopic conversation to a PM or to #rockbox-community |
| 06:32:40 | Davo_Dinkum | TiMiD[FD]: Everyone lives "here" |
| 06:32:51 | TiMiD[FD] | ah righ |
| 06:32:56 | aliask | MournBlade: Try deleting all the .tcd files in the .rockbox directory, and reinitializing the database |
| 06:32:59 | | Quit lazka (Remote closed the connection) |
| 06:33:17 | TiMiD[FD] | I meant in the country where they speak the language of the jlpt :) |
| 06:33:24 | Davo_Dinkum | ah ok |
| 06:33:26 | Davo_Dinkum | TiMiD[FD]: join offtopic |
| 06:33:29 | Davo_Dinkum | what part though? |
| 06:33:30 | TiMiD[FD] | ok |
| 06:33:40 | MournBlade | kk thanks, will try that, thought I did but who can tell with me |
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| 06:43:30 | MournBlade | aliask: deleted 1 .tcd file then rebooted. On bootup when I went to database I had to initialise. I did and it reported so many items and finished, asking for a re-boot...I did and when I tried to enter database it said that Database is not ready...initialise now? |
| 06:43:41 | MournBlade | I did and it hung on 0 items |
| 06:44:20 | aliask | Hrm, sounds like you might have some bad metadata in one of your files, but I'm certainly no expert on the database. |
| 06:45:16 | MournBlade | I am looking at the new tcd file now |
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| 06:46:18 | MournBlade | maybe I should just bite the bullet and move music folder off and add 1 directory at a time back |
| 06:48:59 | MournBlade | is the filename database_tmo.tcd correct? |
| 06:49:16 | MournBlade | tmp sorry |
| 06:49:34 | amiconn | scorche: An fdisk+format plugin would be a *very* useful thing for archoses with >128GB harddisks. And it wouldn't be more dangerous than a delete folder function |
| 06:50:05 | TiMiD[FD] | haha |
| 06:50:13 | TiMiD[FD] | I knew it :) |
| 06:50:20 | scorche | as long as you had it plugged in the entire time |
| 06:50:27 | amiconn | nope |
| 06:50:48 | amiconn | You can always reinstall rockbox |
| 06:51:19 | amiconn | Eithe you have rockbox flashed, then it's obviously no problem at all (just moaning at boot that .rockbox is mising |
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| 06:52:00 | amiconn | Or it's not flashed/flashable, then the archos firmware starts (and only sees the first 128GB) |
| 06:52:19 | scorche | i suppose worst case scenario for those is just plugging itno a computer to re-write the table/format |
| 06:52:26 | amiconn | Either one will give you usb access so you can make a new partition and reinstall |
| 06:52:36 | scorche | but in terms of dangerousness i was thinking more of the irivers |
| 06:52:56 | amiconn | The bootloader also provides usb access |
| 06:53:29 | Slasheri | MournBlade: hi, it seems that many users have problems using the db with the sansa. it has been reported that on sansa created db files can get corrupted |
| 06:53:46 | amiconn | It's just that the current ones have a bug that they hang when there is no partition |
| 06:54:03 | MournBlade | ahhhhh I shall just be patient then, Thanks |
| 06:54:06 | amiconn | This needs to be fixed (LinusN wanted to fix that months ago...) |
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| 07:22:07 | TiMiD[FD] | does anyone here uses the h1x0 remote ? |
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| 08:16:51 | karma | does rockbox support album art on the ipod color? |
| 08:17:03 | scorche | nope |
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| 09:42:29 | * | petur discovers ohloh is now updating its database quite quickly (every 2 days?) |
| 09:43:04 | petur | ( http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3978# ) |
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| 10:00 |
| 10:01:12 | | Join JdGordon [0] (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon) |
| 10:01:28 | JdGordon | hey all |
| 10:01:36 | aliask | Howdy |
| 10:04:59 | | Nick petur is now known as all (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 10:05:04 | all | hi JdGordon |
| 10:05:10 | | Nick all is now known as petur (n=petur@ip-212-239-214-166.dsl-static.scarlet.be) |
| 10:05:12 | JdGordon | :p |
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| 10:20:42 | JdGordon | amiconn: you round? |
| 10:21:34 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 10:21:40 | JdGordon | .... I was just reading the logs and you mentioned some extra stuff hwcodec needs to do... |
| 10:22:06 | JdGordon | specifically storing extra data for whats in the buffer, why does it need that? |
| 10:22:37 | | Join safetydan [0] (n=dan@rockbox/developer/safetydan) |
| 10:23:29 | JdGordon | ... also, to keep the playback engines as close as possible, couldnt we setup a simpler pcmbuf for hwcodec which automatically does the bitswapping before going into that buffer and then out to the dac? |
| 10:27:29 | | Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:28:27 | pondlife | JdGordon: I *think* it was so that the data might be indentified as WAV or MP3 format, and little- or big-endian. This would indicate whether a bitswap was needed and whether the MAS would need reprogramming for WAV output. |
| 10:29:01 | pondlife | If we had a second "PCM" buffer (although it would still contain bitswapped MP3 most of the time) then that may not be needed. |
| 10:29:01 | JdGordon | ok, I'm a bit worried about what nico said, I'd like to keep all that out of the buffering code |
| 10:29:10 | | Quit darkless (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 10:29:24 | JdGordon | that stuff would ideally go in the metadata block for the track |
| 10:29:29 | JdGordon | which playback would control |
| 10:29:46 | pondlife | Yes. Maybe you could just provide a "userdata" field associated with the handle, but not do anything with it? |
| 10:30:08 | pondlife | i.e. add it to the structure, then see if it's actually used in the final version? |
| 10:30:36 | pondlife | Just a word or dword should do, with API calls to get/set it. |
| 10:30:44 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 10:30:48 | JdGordon | no, I want to keep the struct for generic buffering only |
| 10:31:05 | JdGordon | playback will have a seperate struct with the handles to the differnt bits so it wont get lost |
| 10:32:58 | | Join darkless [0] (n=darkless@62.79.44.48.adsl.vby.tiscali.dk) |
| 10:34:07 | amiconn | pondlife, JdGordon: The format indication is necessary so the enigne knows what to feed to the mas |
| 10:34:39 | amiconn | But in fact that's not different from swcodec, as swcodec also buffers various formats in the main buffer and needs to remember which codec must be used to decode it |
| 10:34:44 | JdGordon | ok, but buffering is just to store the files/data, playback controls the actuall sending music out bit |
| 10:34:54 | pondlife | Yes |
| 10:35:02 | amiconn | The bitswap on SH1 targets is necessary for _all_ formats |
| 10:35:16 | | Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend") |
| 10:35:24 | pondlife | But it's probably useful to have a data type (or userdata) field for buffering in general. |
| 10:35:29 | | Quit linuxstb__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:35:41 | amiconn | pondlife: It's not only useful, it's necessary |
| 10:35:44 | pondlife | The actual values stored are dependent on the caller, not buffering. |
| 10:36:01 | * | JdGordon disagres |
| 10:36:19 | amiconn | The buffering needs to call filetype identification _when buffering_, and buffer the necessary codec along the metadata |
| 10:36:51 | pondlife | The codec is just another file to buffer as far as buffering is concerned, no? |
| 10:37:01 | JdGordon | no, the playback engine tells buffering which files to buffer in the order it wants them, the codec is the first to be buffered for a track |
| 10:37:03 | amiconn | JdGordon: The reason why we might not want a separate "pcm" buffer on hwcodec isn't due to it being hwcodec, but due to ram constraints |
| 10:37:12 | JdGordon | buffering only reads from disk and dumps from ram |
| 10:37:21 | amiconn | This buffer should be small, and making it small requires a guaranteed low latency handling |
| 10:37:38 | pondlife | Is the SH1 fast enough for that..? |
| 10:37:59 | JdGordon | when does the bitswap happen atm? |
| 10:38:07 | pondlife | On disk read? |
| 10:38:17 | amiconn | The advantage of a separate buffer would be that it allows some (simple) real codecs (like adpcm) |
| 10:38:30 | pondlife | And helps unification. |
| 10:38:36 | amiconn | Currently, bitswap runs behind disk read |
| 10:38:38 | | Join linuxstb__ [0] (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) |
| 10:38:53 | JdGordon | after metadata is read I assume? |
| 10:39:05 | amiconn | That is, the buffering first fills the buffer, spins down the disk, and then bitswaps |
| 10:39:18 | amiconn | This is to keep spinning time down |
| 10:39:41 | amiconn | JdGordon: Bitswap has nothing to do with metadata |
| 10:39:51 | amiconn | Metadata does never enter the main buffer atm |
| 10:40:14 | pondlife | Bitswap could be handled by the "codec" that copies to a PCM buffer then quite nicely. |
| 10:40:15 | JdGordon | i know... does the metadata parser needs the file bitswapped? |
| 10:40:29 | amiconn | Bitswap is interleaved with disk read in case the playable buffer gets really low |
| 10:40:41 | amiconn | JdGordon: Of course not |
| 10:40:45 | JdGordon | ok |
| 10:40:49 | pondlife | amiconn: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7449 is a bit useless, but would you expect enabling scaling to shorten battery life noticably? |
| 10:40:59 | pondlife | (Sorry to jump topics.) |
| 10:41:12 | amiconn | The bitswap is _only_ due to the SH1 SCI, and the MAS is connected via SCI |
| 10:41:37 | JdGordon | pondlife: close it i rekon |
| 10:41:37 | amiconn | (for playback) |
| 10:42:07 | amiconn | pondlife: Scaling is disabled atm on sansa |
| 10:42:22 | pondlife | Hmm, I am confused, ignore me. |
| 10:42:29 | | Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:42:35 | JdGordon | the sh1 is too slow to bitswap as its being fed to the mas? |
| 10:43:43 | amiconn | Theoretically not, but SCI runs via DMA |
| 10:44:04 | amiconn | And the DMA engine obviously can't bitswap |
| 10:44:47 | JdGordon | can it be done before dma starts? |
| 10:44:55 | JdGordon | or is it continuous? |
| 10:45:29 | pondlife | It must be diskread/bitswap/DMA for each block... |
| 10:45:54 | pondlife | With the diskread done asap to minimise spinup. |
| 10:46:17 | JdGordon | anyway, for the moment I dont want to think about this :p its going to be hard enough to merge our code with swcodec |
| 10:46:51 | | Part zacs7 ("Gonversation terminated!") |
| 10:47:11 | pondlife | JdGordon: Sounds like you've made good progress to me. |
| 10:47:33 | JdGordon | 1/3 threads possibly done |
| 10:48:09 | amiconn | DMA is run block by block. Swapping a block when the old block ended would be too late |
| 10:48:30 | amiconn | So we need at least one block swapped in advance |
| 10:48:59 | amiconn | The biggest problem would be to guarantee low latency as we need to keep extra buffers small |
| 10:49:03 | pondlife | Again, sounds like a "codec" in the SWCODEC model. |
| 10:49:26 | JdGordon | we can either use a dedicated thread for it, or put it in the playback thread... | bitswap, send to dma, bitswap the next one, dma.. |
| 10:49:31 | pondlife | Only question is would the SH1 keep up, and what would the battery life hit be? |
| 10:49:47 | JdGordon | are block sizes static? |
| 10:49:51 | amiconn | Overall cpu load won't change much |
| 10:50:14 | | Quit linuxstb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 10:50:18 | amiconn | DMA block size can be chosen arbitrarily, upper limit is 65536 bytes |
| 10:50:46 | JdGordon | what size is it set to in svn? |
| 10:51:10 | amiconn | A battery life hit would result from having to reduce main buffer size when making room for an extra buffer |
| 10:51:10 | JdGordon | hwcodec "pcmbuf" can just be 3 or 4 of these... |
| 10:51:44 | amiconn | JdGordon: Only if we can make sure that they get refilled fast enough (i.e. low latency) |
| 10:52:15 | JdGordon | is there any reason to think it wouldnt keep up? |
| 10:52:25 | JdGordon | as long as the data gets into ram fast enough it should be fine |
| 10:52:52 | JdGordon | recorders go for $150 usd still! |
| 10:53:11 | pondlife | Mine went for £45. |
| 10:53:19 | pondlife | Wish I hadn't sold it now!! |
| 10:53:48 | | Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@i-83-67-212-170.freedom2surf.net) |
| 10:54:04 | amiconn | JdGordon: Threading. |
| 10:54:30 | amiconn | The thread might just get postponed too long |
| 10:54:55 | JdGordon | thats possible now anyway... |
| 10:58:35 | linuxstb | I'm coming late to the conversation, but made some quick notes about what I understand the swcodec and hwcodec engines need to do - http://www.pastebin.ca/624449 |
| 10:59:02 | amiconn | DMA chunk size in svn is 8KB (for mpeg audio data) |
| 10:59:23 | linuxstb | It seems to me that having a second buffer on hwcodec will just be a waste of valuable RAM, especially when big enough for PCM data. |
| 10:59:26 | amiconn | The last block of a file is shortened as necessary |
| 10:59:49 | amiconn | linuxstb: Yeah, but then there are advantages as well |
| 10:59:57 | amiconn | I'm undecided... |
| 11:00 |
| 11:00:45 | linuxstb | I'm thinking that MAS "codecs" are similar to (non-existing at the moment) "loader plugins" for swcodec - plugins responsible for loading data from disk into the audio buffer before processing by the main codec. |
| 11:01:11 | pondlife | i.e. like the metadata parser? |
| 11:01:24 | amiconn | linuxstb: That would be a waste for anything but pcm... |
| 11:02:03 | linuxstb | pondlife: Yes, they could also parse the metadata. |
| 11:02:05 | JdGordon | we would just need to handle a few dma blocks at a time, not pcm size blocks.. |
| 11:02:25 | amiconn | wavplay uses 16KB dma chunks |
| 11:02:42 | pondlife | At least 2 DMA buffers, so 32KB lost from the main buffer? |
| 11:03:01 | amiconn | I think that 3..4 8KB chunks should be sufficient, but then we need to make sure they get refilled fast enough |
| 11:03:57 | amiconn | One 8KB chunk can be consumed in 41.6 milliseconds worst case |
| 11:04:06 | amiconn | (48kHz 16 bit stereo pcm) |
| 11:04:15 | pondlife | Is that the limit of pitch-up? |
| 11:04:19 | JdGordon | worst case beign the slowest or fastest? |
| 11:05:05 | amiconn | pondlife: No, pitch up can still cut this time in half |
| 11:05:24 | pondlife | 21ms isn't much. |
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| 11:05:57 | amiconn | (but I wouldn't care about pitch up for pcm on mas) |
| 11:06:07 | JdGordon | dinner time |
| 11:06:14 | aliask | Anyone familiar with ARM assembly - how can I set the VE bit of the cp15 register? |
| 11:06:48 | aliask | So many places refer to it, but none say WHICH bit the VE bit is. |
| 11:10:38 | | Join The-Compiler [0] (n=florian@75.60.76.83.cust.bluewin.ch) |
| 11:12:45 | markun | aliask: I could take a look at the arm docs I have at home, but no time now |
| 11:13:05 | aliask | Even the arm docs I have read simply refer to it as the VE bit... |
| 11:14:12 | aliask | Maybe I'm just looking in the wrong place. |
| 11:14:59 | aliask | Ah, there it is. Bit 24 if anyone was wondering :) |
| 11:16:44 | aliask | Thanks markun |
| 11:17:28 | markun | you're welcome :) |
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| 11:28:01 | | Quit amiconn (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 11:32:41 | MournBlade | aliask: after a long nap I moved all the music folders off my sansa and putting it all back in 1 dir at a time...seems to be working so far....can use database mode |
| 11:36:30 | aliask | Good to hear |
| 11:36:47 | aliask | But it's odd that it didn't work in the first place. |
| 11:38:12 | MournBlade | I know......maybe it was me....messing with things I shouldn't. I tend to do that with new things.....like a bull in a china shop |
| 11:39:33 | JdGordon | Llorean: can I ask why there is such an anti-feature-requests vibe in the forums? |
| 11:39:42 | JdGordon | FS really isnt good for actual discussions |
| 11:45:03 | linuxstb | I don't think there's a problem with discussions of potential features, but most threads of that kind tend to be simple feature requests without any discussion aspect. |
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| 12:00 |
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| 12:00:39 | TiMiD[FD] | is there any reason why the action api is disabled for ipod 3g and 4g in some plugins ? |
| 12:01:46 | | Join JdGordon [0] (n=Miranda@c220-237-57-32.smelb1.vic.optusnet.com.au) |
| 12:01:50 | TiMiD[FD] | erm JdGordon just left .. he was the one who wrote the action api |
| 12:02:36 | JdGordon | nice timing :p |
| 12:02:42 | JdGordon | wassup? |
| 12:02:43 | TiMiD[FD] | ah right |
| 12:02:54 | TiMiD[FD] | I was wondering about something |
| 12:03:06 | JdGordon | shoot |
| 12:03:15 | TiMiD[FD] | the action api is disabled for ipod 3g and 4g in some plugins, but is there any reason for that ? |
| 12:03:49 | TiMiD[FD] | for example maze.c |
| 12:03:58 | TiMiD[FD] | line 38 |
| 12:04:13 | JdGordon | im in windows atm so dont have the code... |
| 12:04:20 | JdGordon | i dont know why they wouldnt use it |
| 12:04:24 | TiMiD[FD] | ok |
| 12:05:15 | TiMiD[FD] | maybe they didn't wanted to use the standard actions mappings and didn't knew how to make new actions with the action api ... |
| 12:05:31 | TiMiD[FD] | so I can use this one in my plugin without problem I suppose |
| 12:05:42 | amiconn | That reminds me... some plugin actions are still broken, e.g. metronome for player |
| 12:06:33 | JdGordon | is there a FS taks? |
| 12:06:35 | JdGordon | task* |
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| 12:15:36 | klbostee | Hi. I am trying to find the right code to play an mp3-file from a plugin. Is there any documentation available about this or so? |
| 12:16:25 | TiMiD[FD] | there is maybe the libmad used in the mpegplayer ... |
| 12:18:03 | klbostee | some of the plugins apparently use mp3_play_data, but the data is always an array defined in the source itself |
| 12:18:27 | klbostee | so basically I would like to know how to read an mp3 from disk |
| 12:19:09 | TiMiD[FD] | ... |
| 12:19:39 | TiMiD[FD] | open() ? :p |
| 12:19:59 | linuxstb | mp3_play_data is only for Archos devices I think. |
| 12:20:09 | klbostee | ah |
| 12:20:28 | linuxstb | There is currently no simple way to play compressed audio from a plugin (uncompressed audio isn't straightforward either...) |
| 12:20:45 | TiMiD[FD] | would be nice to have an standardized playback api |
| 12:20:54 | Kasperle | JdGordon: hurray for websvn :) http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/plugins/maze.c?annotate=13735 |
| 12:20:57 | klbostee | ic |
| 12:21:19 | pondlife | TiMiD[FD]: We're working on it...;) |
| 12:21:47 | klbostee | well, let me rephrase my questing then |
| 12:21:51 | JdGordon | Kasperle: : i suggest you ask dionoea why he did it that way |
| 12:22:22 | TiMiD[FD] | JdGordon: this hack is present in other plugins as well ... |
| 12:22:41 | klbostee | I am a PhD student working on audio similarity and related things, and one of the things we worked on recently is dynamic playlist generation ... |
| 12:22:41 | * | JdGordon doesnt know |
| 12:22:44 | Kasperle | JdGordon: i didn't ask about it. i just posted it because you said you didn't have the code handy |
| 12:22:58 | JdGordon | oh, woops wrong person |
| 12:23:00 | JdGordon | soz |
| 12:23:05 | Kasperle | no worries :) |
| 12:23:22 | linuxstb | klbostee: So you want to generate dynamic playlists in Rockbox? |
| 12:23:38 | klbostee | basically the idea is to choose the next song to be played next intelligently by trying to find a song that is similar to the songs already listened to, and not similar to the skipped ones |
| 12:24:03 | klbostee | and I wanted implement this on rockbox |
| 12:24:06 | pondlife | Similar based on tags? |
| 12:24:14 | pondlife | Or more complex? |
| 12:24:20 | scorche | like pandora? |
| 12:24:20 | klbostee | no, based on the audio content |
| 12:24:34 | GodEater | like modlogic |
| 12:24:36 | linuxstb | klbostee: One immediate problem that comes to mind is that Rockbox buffers many tracks in advance (up to around 28MB worth) |
| 12:24:36 | GodEater | moodlogic |
| 12:24:59 | linuxstb | klbostee: But I guess you can work with that... |
| 12:25:02 | klbostee | well, actually it could be based on anything, but we used an audio similarity measure in our experiments |
| 12:25:08 | pondlife | linuxstb: Yes, but the decision would only change if the user skipped, right? |
| 12:25:28 | linuxstb | klbostee: Isn't that very CPU intensive? Or do you perform the audio analysis in advance? |
| 12:25:32 | klbostee | the similarity values would be calculated in advance (using matlab or so) though |
| 12:25:46 | pondlife | So they could be stored as tags... |
| 12:26:57 | klbostee | what I wanted to do is put a file file that contains the similarity matrix (ie the values that depict the degree of similarity between each pair of songs) on the player, and then use that info to determine the next song to be played |
| 12:27:13 | linuxstb | klbostee: I don't think that's possible from a plugin, I think it would need to be integrated into the core, probably in the database code (so the tags are all available). |
| 12:27:22 | klbostee | so I was planning to write a simple player plugin that did this |
| 12:27:56 | linuxstb | So basically a kind of weighted shuffle? |
| 12:28:12 | klbostee | something like that yeah |
| 12:28:45 | linuxstb | How do skipped tracks factor into it? |
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| 12:29:24 | pondlife | Some kind of negative weighting against that track's matrix values..? |
| 12:29:30 | klbostee | well, what we do is start from a seed song |
| 12:29:51 | klbostee | and then we assume that a suggested song is accepted when the user listens to it |
| 12:30:06 | klbostee | and that it is bad (gets rejected) when the user skips it |
| 12:30:08 | linuxstb | So you're using "skipped" as a sort of user rating of a song? |
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| 12:31:00 | klbostee | kind of, the heuristics basically try to find songs that ar similar to the accepted (ie played) ones and not similar to a rejected (ie skipped) one |
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| 12:31:54 | klbostee | linuxstb: so why would I need the tags then? |
| 12:32:21 | pondlife | Seems like a sensible place to store the matrix details? |
| 12:32:38 | pondlife | Rather than another file that needs to be transported along with the files. |
| 12:32:57 | klbostee | hmm, a similarity value applies to a pair of songs |
| 12:32:57 | pondlife | Assuming these are details based purely on the audio content. |
| 12:33:05 | Kasperle | you couldn't really store the matrix in there, but you would need to store characteristics |
| 12:33:07 | klbostee | so using tags might be a bit tricky I guess? |
| 12:33:22 | pondlife | Yes, I see. |
| 12:33:45 | linuxstb | klbostee: You wouldn't need the tags - I wrote that before you mentioned the matrix file... |
| 12:33:52 | pondlife | I thought you might be able to pre-analyse each file and tag it, then compare tags for a similarity value. |
| 12:34:15 | pondlife | But I'm probably over simplifying lots. |
| 12:34:16 | Kasperle | klbostee: how hard is it to quantify the characteristics you base your similarity analysis on? and how much data would that amount to |
| 12:34:45 | klbostee | we could store the feature vector for each songs (we compare those vectors to obtain the sim values) |
| 12:35:04 | Kasperle | ah. how big are those feature vectors? |
| 12:35:05 | klbostee | but calculating the sim values on the fly would be too expensive |
| 12:35:11 | klbostee | I think |
| 12:35:44 | pondlife | Rockbox has some optimisation experts around... :) |
| 12:36:13 | pondlife | WMA playback was optimised up to realtime pretty quickly. |
| 12:36:34 | klbostee | and you would have to recalculate the sims a lot then anyway |
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| 12:36:49 | pondlife | After each skip? |
| 12:37:22 | klbostee | each time the next song has to be chosen |
| 12:37:37 | pondlife | So it would need to be on-the-fly, right? |
| 12:37:43 | klbostee | well, not all of the sims, but certainly a lot of them |
| 12:37:52 | pondlife | There are many permutations available! |
| 12:38:21 | klbostee | nono, the sim values stay the same, but you need most of them each time a next song has to be chosen |
| 12:38:30 | klbostee | so it would be better to calculate them all once |
| 12:38:36 | pondlife | OK |
| 12:38:52 | Kasperle | but maybe you could find a nice tradeoff if you don't want a perfect match |
| 12:39:00 | Kasperle | s/want/need/ |
| 12:39:18 | klbostee | maybe yeah |
| 12:39:40 | klbostee | so at which code files should I be looking then? |
| 12:39:51 | Kasperle | how many features do you extract, i.e. what is the dimension of a feature vector? and are all features equally important? |
| 12:40:15 | klbostee | the number of features can be tuned |
| 12:40:17 | markun | klbostee: I worked on exactly what you are suggesting as a university project |
| 12:41:33 | markun | using a neural network to try to learn the music taste of the listeren based on the audio features of the listened and skipped files |
| 12:41:36 | Kasperle | klbostee: how many are normally used? |
| 12:42:01 | klbostee | our work is based on / an extension of the heuristics described in http://www.ofai.at/~elias.pampalk/publications/pam_ismir05b.pdf |
| 12:42:23 | klbostee | Kasperle: I don't know by heart how many we used |
| 12:43:44 | klbostee | we worked on the heuristics, not the underlying audio sim measure |
| 12:44:29 | klbostee | but what I really want to know is where I should start when trying to implement one of our heuristics in rockbox... :) |
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| 12:46:26 | klbostee | maybe I should look at the shuffle code, since that is about the closest functionality |
| 12:47:32 | markun | klbostee: but shuffle 'preshuffles' the playlist, it doesn't pick a song at random |
| 12:47:49 | pondlife | Rockbox is based on playlists |
| 12:47:56 | klbostee | bah, not good :) |
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| 12:48:30 | pondlife | To play a track, you'd insert it into the playlist (as next track). |
| 12:49:00 | pondlife | Of course, you'd have to be very quick when the user hit skip! |
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| 12:49:12 | klbostee | can plugins append tracks to the playlist then, |
| 12:49:13 | klbostee | ? |
| 12:49:27 | pondlife | Should be able to, don't know if the API is exposed, but it seems reasonable. |
| 12:50:24 | klbostee | so I could write a plugin that responds to a skip action, modifies the playlist, and then skips the current song? |
| 12:50:35 | TiMiD[FD] | klbostee: not at the moment |
| 12:51:41 | klbostee | also not if the plugin defines the "skip action"? so for instance a plugin that shows a simple menu, and "skip" is an item in that menu |
| 12:52:17 | klbostee | when the user clicks on the skip item in the menu, the plugin modifies the playlist and then makes the player skip to the next song somehow |
| 12:52:23 | pondlife | I don't think there's anyway to notify the plugin of a skip. |
| 12:52:45 | klbostee | that wouldn't be necessary then |
| 12:52:49 | TiMiD[FD] | the plugin cannot really modify the playlist I think |
| 12:53:04 | markun | klbostee: by spinning up the HDD every time you will decrease the runtime a lot, but I guess there is no escaping that |
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| 12:53:42 | klbostee | anyway, I really gotta go now |
| 12:53:45 | pondlife | Ideally you could calculate many tracks ahead, but given the calculation speed.... |
| 12:53:59 | markun | klbostee: you could also split it in 2 phases, learning and playlist generation |
| 12:54:22 | klbostee | I'll come back later to get some more info when needed :) |
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| 13:00:36 | linuxstb | markun: Was your university project successful? |
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| 13:02:13 | markun | linuxstb: I tests I did were very artificial |
| 13:03:47 | markun | if you choose metal as music to be liked and trance as music to be disliked it worked very well for example |
| 13:04:03 | markun | but on more subtle differences it became very hard |
| 13:04:41 | markun | and there were some pitfalls: if you never play the songs which initially (randomly) get skipped you will not know if the user did in fact like them |
| 13:05:11 | markun | so used the result from the neural network as the chance for the song to be played |
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| 14:55:35 | JdGordon | does anyone know excatly which are the bare minimum functions in the codec api that need implementing to get sound? |
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| 14:55:49 | JdGordon | s/sound/decoding working |
| 14:56:07 | JdGordon | is it just read_filebuf() ? |
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| 15:18:48 | linuxstb | JdGordon: grep for ci-> in whichever codec you wish to test with. The only ones I think you can avoid are the seeking ones. |
| 15:19:20 | JdGordon | ok |
| 15:19:42 | JdGordon | im having trouble reading the codec into the buffer atm so not quite ready for actual testgin yet |
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| 15:40:22 | JdGordon | whats the simplest codec from a testing POV? |
| 15:40:44 | petur | WAV? |
| 15:41:34 | JdGordon | even wav is a PITA to get working |
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| 15:42:04 | GodEater | I can't imagine what's going to be easier though |
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| 15:47:32 | Nico_P | GodEater: hi, have you tried reading the MoB wiki page again today ? |
| 15:47:46 | GodEater | ah no - not yet |
| 15:47:50 | GodEater | have been dstracted |
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| 15:48:58 | linuxstb | JdGordon: I think they're pretty much all the same.. As I said, a grep to see how many (and which) ci-> functions each codec uses might show you a simple one. |
| 15:49:07 | GodEater | http://flightsimx.archive.amnesia.com.au/ |
| 15:49:28 | * | JdGordon needs a small wav file to test with |
| 15:55:05 | Nico_P | GodEater: distracting ideed |
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| 16:11:13 | * | JdGordon having some very odd problems with this stupid code |
| 16:11:22 | * | JdGordon obviously too sleepy to get anything working |
| 16:15:06 | * | petur walks off to another bloody meeting :/ |
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| 16:20:11 | indro_ | hi all |
| 16:22:38 | indro_ | I updated rockbox to newest version. Now I have a problem with playing music. After almost 1:11 playing a track rockbox display an error and freezed, so I need to reboot the ipod. |
| 16:22:50 | indro_ | Anyone has an idea whats wrong?! |
| 16:23:21 | obo | How old is your bootloader? |
| 16:23:41 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 16:24:04 | indro_ | Almost more than half year... |
| 16:24:43 | obo | Grab the latest one (linked from the manual) and see if that fixes it |
| 16:24:47 | * | linuxstb_ tries to translate that to months... ;) |
| 16:25:12 | indro_ | its the linux bootloader, because I have ipodlinux on ipod (but actually dont use it) |
| 16:25:47 | indro_ | obo: bootloader and playing tracks has not much common or? |
| 16:25:57 | indro_ | bootloader is only for booting rockbox, or i am wrong? |
| 16:25:58 | | Part maffe |
| 16:26:11 | Llorean | indro_: The bootloader does some hardware initialization, older ones don't handle things quite right |
| 16:26:24 | linuxstb_ | Older bootloaders (both the IPL one and official Rockbox one) didn't initialise the coprocesssor correctly for Rockbox. |
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| 16:26:49 | indro_ | okay, thanks, is it possible to boot linux with rockbox bootloader? |
| 16:26:50 | | Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@barmen.interhost.no) |
| 16:27:15 | linuxstb_ | Yes, copy the IPL kernel to the root of your FAT32 partition, call it linux.bin, and hold PLAY as you boot. |
| 16:27:41 | linuxstb_ | Although that feature of the Rockbox bootloader isn't well tested... |
| 16:28:00 | indro_ | thanks, will try that! |
| 16:28:13 | Llorean | It worked last time I tried it, but that was... well... quite some time ago. |
| 16:28:21 | linuxstb_ | The current versions of the IPL bootloader _should_ work, but it's hard for us to help if you have problems - we didn't write it. |
| 16:29:26 | indro_ | yep, I see... |
| 16:30:41 | linuxstb_ | Llorean: I've been half-following all these "my ipod won't power on" threads - do you think there's a chance of a problem or are people just letting the battery drain completely and having the usual issues associated with that? |
| 16:31:40 | Febs | linuxstb_: There are times when my ipod does not power on normally, even when charged. (For example, it happened when we were in the pub last week.) |
| 16:31:55 | Febs | A reset always solves the problem, however. |
| 16:32:15 | Llorean | linuxstb_: My nano has shown a glitch where if it shuts down, when I attempt to power up (even immediately after) it shows the low battery Apple screen |
| 16:32:26 | Llorean | Then a hold on/off, menu+select can recover it, but nothing else seems to. |
| 16:32:47 | Llorean | I've read, somewhere, that this can even happen in the apple firmware if it goes into deep sleep |
| 16:33:05 | Llorean | AFAIK, it's a problem with 5/5.5G and Nanos. |
| 16:33:38 | Llorean | In fact, someone suggested updating to the newest Apple firmware resolves it, though I haven't tested that since for me at least it's a rare occurrence. |
| 16:33:39 | indro_ | I have the same problem btw. |
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| 16:34:15 | Llorean | If it's a problem with Rockbox, it has to be something we leave when we shut down that's tripping up the Apple bootloader. Is that possible? |
| 16:34:35 | Llorean | It could be that we make the bug more common, somehow. |
| 16:34:51 | indro_ | I needed to do a reset with usb cable plugged in, since then it do power on... |
| 16:34:51 | Llorean | An "we didn't make the bug, but we trigger it more" sorta thing that could be fixed. |
| 16:35:12 | * | dionoea never had that kind of problem with a 5G 30GB |
| 16:35:19 | dionoea | Is that specific to 5.5G? |
| 16:35:42 | indro_ | I have 5Gen 60GB |
| 16:35:48 | Febs | Likewise. |
| 16:36:03 | linuxstb_ | Most reports seem to be the 5.5G, but that could just be because it (I expect) is one of the most widely used ipods. |
| 16:36:29 | indro_ | 5.5G is that what I have? |
| 16:36:45 | JdGordon | ok, its possible im asleep and so missing something obvious, but where is the *ci initialised in the plugins? the codec_start function doesnt take any params... |
| 16:36:46 | linuxstb_ | But yes, it's possible that the power-off we do is confusing the Apple bootloader. |
| 16:37:27 | amiconn | I also get this low-bat thing on my mini G2 occasionally |
| 16:37:38 | linuxstb_ | JdGordon: I assume you mean codecs instead of plugins? |
| 16:37:43 | amiconn | Just happened this morning. reset usually works |
| 16:37:49 | JdGordon | linuxstb_: yeah |
| 16:38:15 | JdGordon | ah, hmm... codec_start is the entry point, not codec_main |
| 16:38:53 | Febs | Just to be clear: I have experienced the low battery issue, though it is very rare. The more common issue is that Select does not cause the ipod to turn on. In either instance, reset works. I don't know if these are two manifestations of the same problem or not. |
| 16:39:15 | amiconn | I think it's just that the voltage doesn't rise fast enough depending on how the button is pressed |
| 16:39:48 | amiconn | The apple firmware doesn't power down, only goes to deep sleep, so it's a non-issue there |
| 16:39:59 | Llorean | amiconn: After a day or two, I thought it did. |
| 16:40:36 | JdGordon | ok, well this is wierd... in codec_start() ci is 0x80bd740 but in codec_main() its 0! |
| 16:40:37 | JdGordon | wtf? |
| 16:40:38 | amiconn | Maybe it does after some extended time, but then I'd expcet to see this low bat effect with the OF as well |
| 16:41:02 | Llorean | amiconn: As I said, at one point I found out that some people have seen it when their iPod shuts down fully using retail firmware |
| 16:41:04 | linuxstb_ | JdGordon: I can't see how it works either... |
| 16:41:04 | * | amiconn never actually used the apple OF |
| 16:41:14 | Llorean | I was using "Deep Sleep" to mean the full shutdown. I may have gotten terms confused. |
| 16:41:26 | Llorean | I thought "Sleep" was the low power, screen off, and "Deep Sleep" is what Apple called "shut down" |
| 16:41:48 | JdGordon | ci is set in codec_crt0.c, but for some reason its being set to 0.. |
| 16:41:52 | JdGordon | all very wierd.. |
| 16:41:56 | linuxstb_ | I wouldn't expect many Rockbox users to leave their ipods in the Apple firmware for long enough for the full power-off to happen anyway. So maybe it does happen there as well... |
| 16:42:31 | | Quit Entasis (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:42:32 | indro_ | http://rafb.net/p/0hnNN744.html |
| 16:42:40 | indro_ | Installing bl on 0 should be good, or? |
| 16:43:11 | linuxstb_ | indro_: How are you installing the bootloader? ipodpatcher should take care of it automatically. |
| 16:43:28 | indro_ | ipodcatcher, it ask me where I want install the bl. |
| 16:43:35 | indro_ | *patcher |
| 16:43:36 | JdGordon | btw, is it possible for RB to put the pp's into deep sleep mode? |
| 16:43:56 | * | JdGordon assumes its a pp thing and not an ipod thing |
| 16:44:06 | Kasperle | Llorean: i've had that happen on my 5.5g as well |
| 16:44:14 | linuxstb_ | indro_: It shouldn't ask that - it should autoscan for your ipod, and just ask you to enter "i" to install. |
| 16:44:21 | | Quit Jon-Kha (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)) |
| 16:44:24 | indro_ | linuxstb_: oh I thought it ask me but I only need to press I. |
| 16:44:32 | indro_ | linuxstb_: right! |
| 16:44:41 | amiconn | Sleep mode is a PP thing, but we can't use it yet |
| 16:44:59 | JdGordon | amiconn: we dont know how? or oter reasons? |
| 16:44:59 | | Quit webguest17 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
| 16:45:18 | amiconn | Setting sleep mode involves setting the CPU clock to 32kHz, as well as some other hardware configuration |
| 16:45:28 | amiconn | The latter is what we don't know yet |
| 16:45:36 | JdGordon | ok |
| 16:45:38 | linuxstb_ | JdGordon: "Deep sleep" is what Apple refer to as the power-off that Rockbox does already. (IIUC). Normal sleep is what amiconn just described. |
| 16:45:59 | JdGordon | deep sleep is where I should be |
| 16:46:16 | bluebrother | obo: around? |
| 16:46:20 | amiconn | Okay. This 'deep sleep' vs. 'sleep' is confusing because there's also the normal cpu (core) sleep |
| 16:46:28 | | Join fm2 [0] (i=d9b9677a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-a534670c8f44f644) |
| 16:46:42 | JdGordon | sleep is what i meant when i asked, not deep sleep |
| 16:46:46 | * | JdGordon -> zzzzzzz |
| 16:46:46 | linuxstb_ | That's just a brief nap... |
| 16:46:47 | obo | bluebrother: yup |
| 16:46:52 | | Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!") |
| 16:48:01 | indro_ | I get now the error right after playing a track... |
| 16:48:03 | fm2 | GodEater: Hello. I checked what folder shortcuts are and you are right −− they do exactly what I intended with the "folder bookmarks" |
| 16:48:15 | indro_ | Prefetch abort at .... |
| 16:49:11 | fm2 | But if I understand correctly the shortcuts is not a part of the FAT spec but are a windows specific feature, no? So there is little to no chance for them to be supported by RB. |
| 16:49:58 | bluebrother | shortcut files are simply files with the extension ".lnk" |
| 16:50:01 | indro_ | Rebootet and tried again, now I get: |
| 16:50:12 | Llorean | indro_: And this is with the bootloader in iPodpatcher downloaded from Rockbox's site, and an up to date SVN build? |
| 16:50:17 | linuxstb_ | fm2: I guess anything could be implemented if it's seen as generally useful.. I'm sure supporting .lnk files has been discussed before, but I can't remember the arguments... |
| 16:50:22 | indro_ | Undefined function at ... |
| 16:50:32 | indro_ | after 0:12 minutes |
| 16:51:12 | indro_ | http://download.rockbox.org/bootloader/ipod/ipodpatcher/linux32x86/ipodpatcher |
| 16:51:23 | fm2 | linuxstb: they have been discussed on IRC? I'll check then. But am I right in the assumption that they are not a part of FAT? |
| 16:51:24 | markun | indro_: and you didn't have this problem with your previouw build? |
| 16:51:25 | indro_ | svn build from 12. july |
| 16:51:47 | markun | fm2: not a part of the FAT spec no |
| 16:52:04 | indro_ | markun: yes, but it was an old version. |
| 16:52:18 | indro_ | before the 32mb/64mb split. |
| 16:52:29 | linuxstb_ | fm2: Flyspray seems to have four closed tasks about them - http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/index.php?string=lnk&project=1&search_name=&search_in_comments=1&type%5B%5D=1&sev%5B%5D=&pri%5B%5D=&due%5B%5D=&reported%5B%5D=&cat%5B%5D=&status%5B%5D=&percent%5B%5D=&opened=&dev=&closed=&duedatefrom=&duedateto=&changedfrom=&changedto=&openedfrom=&openedto=&closedfrom=&closedto=&do=index |
| 16:52:38 | pixelma | indro: maybe if you've updated from an old build... is there a rockbox.ipod in the root of your ipod still? |
| 16:52:47 | markun | indro_: and now you are using the 64MB version? |
| 16:52:58 | indro_ | pixelma: i repladced it with the one in the new svn build |
| 16:53:06 | markun | Well, if you only have 32MB the 64MB version wouldn't even work |
| 16:53:10 | indro_ | markun: yes, using 64mb version. |
| 16:53:32 | indro_ | I have 5gen 60gb... |
| 16:54:20 | indro_ | thats 64mb afaik |
| 16:54:48 | indro_ | should I test 32mb version? |
| 16:55:02 | markun | you could |
| 16:55:06 | pixelma | indro: it shouldn't cause that error but the right place for it is inside the .rockbox folder - you should leave it there and delete the one in the root (or move it back) |
| 16:55:30 | pixelma | (that has changed some time ago) |
| 16:55:41 | | Quit amiconn ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 16:55:48 | Llorean | indro_: Was it ever refurbished? |
| 16:56:12 | Llorean | I've heard rumors of refurbished 60GB iPods with 32mb of RAM |
| 16:56:24 | indro_ | pixelma: okay, mom... |
| 16:56:56 | fm2 | linuxstb: thanks for the references! Very interesting. All four have been closed almost without any discussion (in FS, I haven't cheked IRC yet). |
| 16:56:58 | | Join lost|X40 [0] (n=lostnihi@ppp-68-251-56-212.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) |
| 16:57:02 | | Quit lostnihilist (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 16:57:14 | Llorean | indro_: Being impolite to respected members of the community isn't going to make you more well liked here. |
| 16:58:20 | pixelma | it would just help you with the update process... |
| 16:58:23 | linuxstb_ | fm2: Yes. seems Bagder is the most against it - there is a patch here which is closed without mentioning a reason - http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/1961 |
| 16:58:38 | indro_ | Llorean: okay, then I will try 32mb... |
| 16:58:47 | fm2 | And if we wouldn't support .lnk files at the file system level (which is unnecessary IMHO) we could support them via viewers |
| 16:59:06 | indro_ | Llorean: hm, why do you thing im impolite? because of mom? |
| 16:59:33 | | Join amiconn [0] (i=3e088e42@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 17:00 |
| 17:00:36 | linuxstb_ | fm2: I think the file browser would need to be able to support them. I personally can't think of a reason to use them (I have no problems navigating my music as it is), but wouldn't object if others wanted them - assuming the implementation is small and simple. |
| 17:01:42 | Llorean | indro_: Yes. |
| 17:01:53 | linuxstb_ | fm2: i.e. selecting a .lnk file would just take you to that folder. The issue is what do you do when you go back one level - do you go back to where the link was, or back to the real parent directory. |
| 17:02:07 | | Join dandin1 [0] (n=dandin1@bas7-ottawa23-1088827816.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 17:02:38 | fm2 | linuxstb: I'd expect the latter. |
| 17:03:37 | fm2 | Since (for me) the shortcut is just a way to get to a certain folder. One I'm there ... I'm there. History doesn't matter anymore |
| 17:03:46 | indro_ | Llorean: thats a mistake, mom is shortcut for "moment pls" ;) |
| 17:03:47 | linuxstb_ | But I guess it can be done with a viewer plugin - you need to spin up the disk to load the .lnk file anyway. |
| 17:04:01 | indro_ | Llorean: I didnt want to be impolite. ;) |
| 17:04:18 | Llorean | indro_: Ah, there's a figure of speech, "yes mother" or "okay mom" that usually means "thank you for giving me instructions I don't feel I need". Sorry 'bout that. |
| 17:04:41 | indro_ | Llorean: yes I see, no prob. |
| 17:04:45 | linuxstb_ | fm2: The viewer plugin just then needs a way to set the current path in the file browser - which may not be in the plugin API at the moment, so would have to be added. |
| 17:04:52 | fm2 | linuxstb: yes, this is the less intrusive way. And it wouldn't be frown upon by bagder and amiconn :-) since it doesn't increase the core bin size! |
| 17:05:26 | | Join miepchen^schlaf [0] (n=hihi@p54BF6809.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 17:05:30 | fm2 | linuxstb: exactly my thought (about extending the plugin API) −− but you type faster than I |
| 17:05:36 | linuxstb_ | Adding the required API may increase the core size a little - depending on what needs to be done. But I wouldn't expect it to be very much. |
| 17:05:37 | amiconn | .lnk support would be something I wouldn't object to, if it's done nice & simple |
| 17:06:05 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 17:06:10 | fm2 | amiconn: i.e. without increasing size? :-) |
| 17:06:30 | fm2 | linuxstb: is there a ready-to-be-used func that just needs to be exported via API? |
| 17:06:35 | amiconn | I don't think that's possible, but there's increase and increase |
| 17:06:50 | linuxstb_ | fm2: Probably not. You would need to look at the file browser code. |
| 17:07:01 | fm2 | amiconn: that would be the second type :-) |
| 17:07:16 | linuxstb_ | And see where it would normally go to when exiting a viewer plugin - and change that behaviour. |
| 17:07:44 | linuxstb_ | But I can't see it being very complex at all. |
| 17:08:09 | amiconn | I think that .lnk support without history should be doable with little extra code |
| 17:08:31 | amiconn | The most difficult part is probably getting the path from the .lnk file. It's not documented |
| 17:08:58 | linuxstb_ | The alternative could be our own (.link ?) format simply containing a text string. |
| 17:09:41 | indro_ | hmm, how I get the current build in 32mb version?! |
| 17:09:43 | fm2 | linuxstb: ok, I'll look into it when I get time. But not in the next couple of weeks. I'm going to leave. |
| 17:10:01 | indro_ | http://build.rockbox.org/dist/build-ipodvideo32mb/rockbox.zip |
| 17:10:04 | indro_ | doesnt work... |
| 17:10:34 | linuxstb_ | Remove "32mb" I think. |
| 17:10:37 | Llorean | indro_: The link on the build page works fine for me. |
| 17:10:44 | fm2 | linuxstb: that would work too. Even better. |
| 17:10:54 | indro_ | Llorean: on the build page is only 64mb. |
| 17:11:07 | indro_ | if I see corret. |
| 17:11:11 | indro_ | *correct |
| 17:11:14 | markun | linuxstb_, fm2: ac.yu/extra/fileformat/windows/lnk/shortcut.pdf">http://mediasrv.ns.ac.yu/extra/fileformat/windows/lnk/shortcut.pdf |
| 17:11:41 | linuxstb_ | markun: Don't point me to it... ;) |
| 17:11:45 | markun | :) |
| 17:11:52 | markun | linuxstb_: try to resists! |
| 17:11:55 | markun | -s |
| 17:15:25 | | Join desowin [0] (n=desowin@avc146.internetdsl.tpnet.pl) |
| 17:16:44 | indro_ | Llorean: yes but its the 64mb version. |
| 17:17:00 | indro_ | pixelma: I get Can't load rockbox.ipod |
| 17:17:04 | Llorean | indro_: I don't understand, the 32mb version is available on the download page too. |
| 17:17:07 | indro_ | When its in .rockbox |
| 17:17:35 | Llorean | indro_: What version number does your bootloader report? |
| 17:17:43 | indro_ | Llorean: on http://build.rockbox.org/? |
| 17:17:50 | indro_ | Verison 1.1 |
| 17:17:52 | Llorean | indro_: Yes, see the one for the 30gb iPod? |
| 17:18:03 | | Quit fm2 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.7 (2005/06/19)") |
| 17:18:30 | indro_ | I see only one build for 60gb and thats 64mb. |
| 17:18:48 | Llorean | As I said, the 30gb iPod. |
| 17:18:55 | indro_ | but that works, http://build.rockbox.org/dist/build-ipodvideo/rockbox.zip |
| 17:19:08 | indro_ | I have the 60gb. |
| 17:19:12 | Llorean | Yes, that's the link the 30gb iPod links to |
| 17:19:16 | Llorean | Your disk size doesn't matter. |
| 17:19:25 | Llorean | We named them that way because most people don't realize that the real difference is the RAM |
| 17:20:20 | indro_ | allright, my fault then. ;) |
| 17:21:20 | Llorean | So the Rockbox bootloader is saying it can't find rockbox.ipod? |
| 17:22:47 | indro_ | yes |
| 17:22:57 | amiconn | markun: http timeout... |
| 17:24:51 | Llorean | indro_: Alright, try removing the .rockbox folder entirely, and just extracting a current build straight to the root of your player. |
| 17:27:53 | markun | amiconn: I only checked the google cache |
| 17:28:34 | markun | amiconn: the search query was "lnk shortcut format" |
| 17:32:44 | GodEater | why do we have to reimplement Microsoft's version of .lnk ? |
| 17:32:49 | GodEater | can we not supply our own ? |
| 17:33:12 | GodEater | otherwise they're only of use to windows owners |
| 17:34:17 | Llorean | GodEater: The advantage of our own format goes further than that. |
| 17:34:26 | Llorean | Our plugin could parse multiple lines. |
| 17:34:49 | Llorean | favorites.link could have six entries, so you see a list when you launch it, then the one you click is where you end up |
| 17:35:22 | GodEater | sorry - I saw markun and amiconn trying to hunt down the spec and wondered what on earth for if they were not trying ti reimplement it |
| 17:35:43 | Llorean | Well, the advantage of windows links are that windows users can create them without any typing. |
| 17:35:54 | GodEater | lucky them |
| 17:35:57 | Llorean | Which is better than "no users can create them without any typing" |
| 17:36:25 | GodEater | surely this is a context menu thing ? Long hold on a folder, and one of the options would be "Add to favourites" |
| 17:36:31 | GodEater | no typing involved there then |
| 17:36:46 | Llorean | GodEater: I thought the plan was to keep it as much out of the core as possible and just use a viewer plugin |
| 17:36:58 | | Part maffe |
| 17:37:09 | GodEater | amiconn seemed to indicate he doesn't mind if it ends up in the core |
| 17:37:16 | petur | Llorean: you can do that with a plugin too (see file/dir properties) |
| 17:37:18 | | Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@barmen.interhost.no) |
| 17:37:39 | Llorean | petur: Open With and choose the "Create a .link" plugin? |
| 17:38:11 | petur | Llorean: no, just run the plugin in the core code |
| 17:38:19 | Llorean | Ah, right. |
| 17:38:28 | petur | ... (see file/dir properties) |
| 17:38:46 | Llorean | I didn't realize that was a plugin |
| 17:38:51 | petur | it is |
| 17:40:00 | linuxstb_ | A viewer plugin would be more flexible as well - it could present a list as Llorean described, or parse actual Windows .lnk files, or anything else... |
| 17:40:33 | | Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear) |
| 17:40:33 | petur | if we create our own format, it must have another file extension anyway |
| 17:41:05 | linuxstb_ | But we could associate our own (e.g.) .link files, and .lnk files to the same viewer. |
| 17:41:14 | Llorean | Yep |
| 17:41:17 | petur | aye |
| 17:41:19 | bluebrother | how about using .desktop? |
| 17:41:33 | petur | and folder.ini :) |
| 17:41:41 | GodEater | filthy windows speak! |
| 17:41:45 | * | linuxstb_ slams the can of works shut |
| 17:41:59 | linuxstb_ | ^I meant worms... |
| 17:42:01 | * | GodEater holds up his tux effigy |
| 17:42:48 | linuxstb_ | I'm sure Gnome and KDE have comparable kludges on top of the filesystem... |
| 17:43:26 | GodEater | I think that's what the .desktop type is |
| 17:43:28 | dionoea | they have symbolic links too (well, the FS has) |
| 17:43:38 | GodEater | and hard links too |
| 17:43:55 | petur | such as a ton of annoying .hiddendir stuff in your home directory :/ |
| 17:44:01 | GodEater | though I think .desktop is a freedesktop.org standard, rather than being gnome / kde specific |
| 17:44:08 | bluebrother | indeed. |
| 17:44:21 | linuxstb_ | What's .desktop anyway? |
| 17:44:24 | * | GodEater awards himself a gold star |
| 17:44:35 | bluebrother | and it's plain text, so maybe it's better than some binary file? |
| 17:44:57 | GodEater | paste alert! |
| 17:45:12 | GodEater | [Desktop Entry] |
| 17:45:12 | GodEater | Type=Application |
| 17:45:12 | GodEater | Encoding=UTF-8 |
| 17:45:12 | DBUG | Enqueued KICK GodEater |
| 17:45:12 | GodEater | Name=Wine Windows Emulator |
| 17:45:12 | GodEater | Name[de]=Wine Windows-Emulator |
| 17:45:13 | *** | Alert Mode level 1 |
| 17:45:13 | GodEater | Exec=wine %f |
| 17:45:15 | GodEater | MimeType=application/x-ms-dos-executable;application/x-msdos-program;application/x-msdownload;application/exe;application/x-exe;application/dos-exe;vms/exe |
| 17:45:18 | GodEater | ;application/x-winexe;application/msdos-windows;application/x-msdos-program;application/x-zip-compressed |
| 17:45:20 | GodEater | NoDisplay=true |
| 17:45:22 | GodEater | they look like that |
| 17:45:33 | Llorean | GodEater: Not all of them |
| 17:45:36 | | Quit iamben (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 17:45:39 | | Join iamben_ [0] (n=ben@dpc67142179038.direcpc.com) |
| 17:45:45 | | Join mpeccorini [0] (n=mpeccori@mail1.theargusgroup.us) |
| 17:45:52 | Llorean | The line that says "Exec" can also say "URL" instead if you make a "File" one instead of a "Executable" one |
| 17:45:56 | linuxstb_ | GodEater: Yes, but what is it? |
| 17:45:58 | indro_ | anyone know what that mean? |
| 17:46:01 | indro_ | http://rafb.net/p/2q0eyL31.html |
| 17:46:02 | Ctcp | Ignored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood |
| 17:46:02 | * | linuxstb_ never leaves bash... |
| 17:46:11 | Llorean | linuxstb_: Basically a .lnk for Gnome, I think |
| 17:46:14 | indro_ | I wanted delete something. |
| 17:46:52 | bluebrother | I just created a shortcut link from KDE. It basically has a Name= entry with the title and a URL= entry with the target path |
| 17:46:53 | Llorean | indro_: Know what you mean? You haven't asked a new question since my last response to you as far as I can see. |
| 17:47:00 | linuxstb_ | indro_: It seems you have a bad filesystem. When you repartitioned to add your Linux partition, did you reformat your FAT32 partition? |
| 17:47:19 | Llorean | Oh, link |
| 17:47:27 | Llorean | =/ |
| 17:47:28 | Llorean | Sorry |
| 17:47:44 | | Quit Rick ("I… don't need to be here.") |
| 17:48:05 | indro_ | linuxstb_: im not sure, that was a while ago. |
| 17:48:08 | bluebrother | indro_: have you tried running chkdsk /f / fsck.vfat on that device? Sounds like filesystem trouble. |
| 17:48:20 | indro_ | no, but i will try now. |
| 17:48:21 | linuxstb_ | indro_: That would be my guess... |
| 17:48:35 | linuxstb_ | (that you didn't reformat) |
| 17:48:54 | indro_ | linuxstb_: could be... |
| 17:49:03 | indro_ | but i get other strange errors too |
| 17:49:10 | indro_ | so i think fsck is a good idea. |
| 17:49:26 | linuxstb_ | That may not help - you may just have to reformat it. |
| 17:51:31 | | Join sarixe [0] (n=sarixe@pool-68-239-219-42.nwrk.east.verizon.net) |
| 17:51:42 | indro_ | http://rafb.net/p/3Lld6w54.html |
| 17:51:51 | indro_ | hm, what i should choose? |
| 17:52:10 | * | linuxstb_ shrugs |
| 17:53:05 | | Join Rick [0] (i=rick@pool-71-108-0-13.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
| 17:53:46 | bluebrother | indro_: I would try chkdsk /f on windows −− afaict it look like that can correct more errors than linux fsck.vfat |
| 17:53:57 | | Join pixelma_ [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 17:54:18 | indro_ | thx but i have no windows. |
| 17:55:14 | *** | Alert Mode OFF |
| 17:55:18 | linuxstb_ | indro_: If I was you, I would just reformat and copy the files again. |
| 17:57:14 | | Quit thegeek_ (Remote closed the connection) |
| 17:57:29 | | Join thegeek [0] (i=thegeek@ti521110a080-10519.bb.online.no) |
| 17:57:49 | | Join Domonoky [0] (n=Domonoky@e179055049.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 17:58:37 | | Part mpeccorini |
| 17:59:29 | indro_ | i unzipped the build again, still get Cant load rockbox.ipod: File not found |
| 17:59:40 | Lear | bluebrother: my (very limited) experience is that fsck.vfat is better at finding and fixing errors. |
| 18:00 |
| 18:00:29 | linuxstb_ | indro_: You fixed your filesystem errors? |
| 18:01:30 | indro_ | havent test it, just unzipped |
| 18:01:44 | indro_ | that worked |
| 18:02:37 | indro_ | FAT: Directory bread(block 61388753) failed |
| 18:02:51 | indro_ | after deleting something. :/ |
| 18:03:02 | indro_ | scsi 11:0:0:0: rejecting I/O to dead device |
| 18:03:29 | indro_ | but can still read and write |
| 18:06:47 | * | linuxstb_ would reformat... |
| 18:10:19 | indro_ | yes, probably better. ;) |
| 18:10:52 | indro_ | *create backup |
| 18:11:47 | | Quit pixelma (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 18:11:47 | | Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma) |
| 18:12:51 | | Quit obo ("bye") |
| 18:15:44 | | Quit petur ("work->home") |
| 18:17:51 | | Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC") |
| 18:19:47 | * | Nico_P added another thread to his test plugin to add new files to the buffer |
| 18:19:51 | Nico_P | much more fun that way |
| 18:19:58 | Nico_P | and it still seems to work almost ok |
| 18:24:04 | indro_ | I recreated the FAT partition with cfdisk |
| 18:24:07 | indro_ | Now I get this: |
| 18:24:09 | indro_ | http://rafb.net/p/rWZA3b29.html |
| 18:24:14 | indro_ | |
| 18:24:15 | indro_ | Partition table entries are not in disk order |
| 18:25:30 | indro_ | is that important? |
| 18:25:48 | linuxstb | There was no need to repartition - just reformat.... You've now lost the firmware partition. |
| 18:26:51 | indro_ | :/ |
| 18:26:54 | indro_ | whats now? |
| 18:27:02 | | Quit sarixe ("Peace") |
| 18:27:55 | linuxstb | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/IpodManualRestore |
| 18:28:10 | | Quit enyc (SendQ exceeded) |
| 18:29:00 | linuxstb | Looking again at your original parition layout (http://rafb.net/p/0hnNN744.html), that had problems anyway - the firmware partition and linux partition were overlapping. |
| 18:29:44 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 18:30:09 | indro_ | hmm, okay.. |
| 18:30:31 | indro_ | is 5.5g = 5g with 60gb? |
| 18:30:37 | indro_ | or do i need take only 5g? |
| 18:31:40 | linuxstb | Does ipodpatcher say your sectors are 512 or 2048 bytes? |
| 18:31:52 | linuxstb | 512 = 5g, 2048 = 5.5g |
| 18:33:32 | Kasperle | indro_: 5.5g is the "improved" ipod video with a brighter screen and longer-lasting battery, iirc |
| 18:33:42 | Kasperle | comes with 30gb and 80gb |
| 18:33:44 | | Quit amiconn ("CGI:IRC") |
| 18:34:07 | linuxstb | Kasperle: Some people seem to have 60gb ipods with 2048-byte sectors - that's the important issue. |
| 18:34:29 | linuxstb | There was at least one person like that in the original 5.5g forum discussion IIRC. |
| 18:34:35 | | Join amiconn [0] (i=3e088e42@rockbox/developer/amiconn) |
| 18:34:39 | | Quit amiconn (Client Quit) |
| 18:34:56 | indro_ | hm, ipodpatcher seems do not found my ipod anymore. |
| 18:35:02 | Kasperle | i think i recall someone saying he got one like that after it was repaired |
| 18:35:12 | indro_ | *find |
| 18:35:13 | Kasperle | but i don't really know |
| 18:35:13 | linuxstb | indro_: Then use fdisk to find outt. |
| 18:35:23 | linuxstb | (or scroll up if it's still in your history...) |
| 18:35:50 | linuxstb | "fdisk -l /dev/sdX" will tell you (replace sdX appropriately) |
| 18:36:16 | indro_ | kk |
| 18:37:11 | linuxstb | If you see something like "Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes", then you have 512-byte sectors. |
| 18:37:31 | indro_ | http://rafb.net/p/GwFTCQ14.html |
| 18:37:49 | indro_ | okay, then I have 512. ;) |
| 18:39:39 | indro_ | is the partition now right? |
| 18:41:10 | linuxstb | If you correctly written the right MBR, then yes... |
| 18:46:06 | | Quit Lynx_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:46:34 | | Join alberink [0] (n=alberink@cc516682-b.ensch1.ov.home.nl) |
| 18:50:32 | indro_ | strange |
| 18:50:43 | indro_ | I did point 1-4, now fdisk -l /dev/sdb show nothing? |
| 18:51:23 | indro_ | oops, ipod is not in disk mode. ^^ |
| 18:53:21 | | Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 18:58:04 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 19:00 |
| 19:00:54 | indro_ | hm i loaded rockbox and shutted down with play button. |
| 19:01:10 | indro_ | now i cannot powered it on again. :/ |
| 19:01:34 | linuxstb_ | Try holding menu+select for a few seconds. |
| 19:01:59 | indro_ | that works. :) |
| 19:06:09 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 19:06:51 | | Join jac0b [0] (n=jac0b@gifn3.fpl.com) |
| 19:07:27 | jac0b | is there any gigabeat owners in here |
| 19:08:56 | Llorean | jac0b: Did you have a specific question? |
| 19:09:33 | jac0b | well it is about getting a scratch out on a gigabeat |
| 19:09:56 | Llorean | Ah, well this is #Rockbox. It's for questions relating to the software. |
| 19:10:11 | Llorean | You might want to try #Gigabeat, or a Gigabeat specific forum somewhere. |
| 19:10:23 | jac0b | thanks |
| 19:11:00 | | Part jac0b |
| 19:11:16 | | Join Xerion [0] (i=xerion@cp198589-d.landg1.lb.home.nl) |
| 19:11:55 | * | linuxstb_ reads the #gigabeat logs and wonders why they don't chat here, where other devs can help them... |
| 19:17:27 | | Join dan_a [0] (n=dan_a@217.23.173.156) |
| 19:17:35 | | Part maffe |
| 19:17:38 | | Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@barmen.interhost.no) |
| 19:18:10 | Llorean | linuxstb_: When I first talked with them, it seemed like they weren't certain they were welcome here because Rockbox wasn't running yet (regarding the F) but I don't really know. |
| 19:18:36 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:23:27 | | Quit My_Sic (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 19:23:35 | Nico_P | Llorean: have you seen my messages from earlier ? I've added a thread to my plugin to simulate files being added at random times |
| 19:23:55 | Nico_P | now I have several files on buffer at a time, and it works fine |
| 19:24:27 | | Join GodEater_ [0] (n=vircuser@bb-87-80-121-64.ukonline.co.uk) |
| 19:24:39 | Nico_P | and it made me find and fix two bugs in the process |
| 19:25:04 | Llorean | Good to hear. |
| 19:25:26 | | Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@65.75.87.48) |
| 19:26:00 | linuxstb_ | Does your code include the MOB concept? |
| 19:26:16 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: no, but it's close |
| 19:27:05 | Nico_P | I can buffer and play a file back while there is another one waiting there doing nothing |
| 19:27:12 | Nico_P | typically what would happen with MoB |
| 19:28:42 | Nico_P | in fatct with the current code I could say any file gets max. 10 MB of the buffer and has to stay within this. It'd work fine |
| 19:30:30 | | Join enyc [0] (n=enyc@1337.whitehorse.co.uk) |
| 19:35:34 | | Join hashier [0] (n=hashier@wurbel.in-berlin.de) |
| 19:35:43 | hashier | Hi |
| 19:36:08 | GodEater_ | good afternoon :) |
| 19:36:50 | | Quit tedr0ck () |
| 19:37:24 | hashier | I just got a "Creative NoMad Zen NX". Is it worth to invest some time or is it nearly impossible to geht rockbox working on it? |
| 19:37:52 | linuxstb_ | It depends on your skill, detemination, and how much free time you have... |
| 19:38:17 | hashier | Never done that before |
| 19:38:26 | linuxstb_ | This may help - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NewPort |
| 19:39:15 | linuxstb_ | I don't know if all the Zens are the same, but there is also some discussion on the Rockbox forums about porting Rockbox to the Zen. I'm not sure if any real progress has been made though. |
| 19:40:35 | hashier | I found that page... but not verry much information on that. |
| 19:41:19 | linuxstb_ | You mean the NewPort page? |
| 19:41:31 | hashier | The page about ZEN |
| 19:42:01 | hashier | I look on the dev page, there wasn't that "porting" page linked |
| 19:47:28 | hashier | A verry verry long way |
| 19:47:37 | indro_ | linuxstb: fs seems to be clean now, read/write/delete works without problem. ;) |
| 19:48:08 | markun | hashier: are there pictures of the insides of the nomad somewhere? |
| 19:48:26 | indro_ | now filling it with sound, so I can test if that playing works too... |
| 19:48:27 | hashier | markun: Just got it a few hours ago. |
| 19:48:41 | markun | I opened my Gigabeat a few minutes after I got it :) |
| 19:49:04 | hashier | markun: Got it at work. Just come home and joined here (= |
| 19:49:09 | markun | hashier: and are there firmware updates available? |
| 19:49:10 | hashier | I open it |
| 19:49:42 | markun | ok |
| 19:56:11 | | Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@freenode/staff/gnewsense.ompaul) |
| 20:00 |
| 20:01:15 | hashier | Ah! gnomad2 works |
| 20:03:01 | | Quit Febs (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 20:05:06 | GodEater_ | what does MEM_FUNCTION_WRAPPERS do ? |
| 20:10:33 | * | GodEater_ reads the source instead of being lazy |
| 20:13:13 | hashier | markun: Yes, it exist a new firmware |
| 20:13:54 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:14:28 | | Join Elazar [0] (n=Elazar@leviathan.itrebal.com) |
| 20:14:56 | Elazar | Anyone know if work on the Creative Zen: Vision M port would work on or lead to a working port for the Creative Zen: Vision W? |
| 20:15:01 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
| 20:16:20 | GodEater_ | where did all the Creative fanboys come from all of a sudden? ;) |
| 20:16:39 | GodEater_ | Llorean: don't think that guy has throught through his text adventure suggestion much do you ? ;) |
| 20:16:52 | Llorean | GodEater_: I think he played much simpler text games |
| 20:17:10 | Llorean | Ones that didn't involve an inventory, dialogue, or anything beyond exploration from the sound of it. |
| 20:17:18 | Elazar | GodEater_: If I was a fanboi, I'd be content with their firmware. :P I got the player as a gift, it's the best player I've got, and I don't like the stock firmware very much. |
| 20:17:46 | Llorean | Elazar: Well, compare the hardware in yours to the hardware listed on the Vision: M page and that could give you a clue as to how similar they are |
| 20:18:33 | GodEater_ | Llorean: I like the idea of SCUMMVM on a DAP though ;) |
| 20:18:43 | Llorean | I've liked it for quite some time, it's just an awful lot of work. |
| 20:18:44 | GodEater_ | it's nearly an ideal thing to play on a DAP if you're going to play anything at all |
| 20:19:24 | Llorean | Yeah, even the one death (in Monkey Island 1) takes 10 minutes to accomplish, so moving a pointer around with directional controls isn't going to be a real hindrance (dependent on player patience). |
| 20:19:26 | GodEater_ | were the discworld games done in Scumm or did they just look the same ? |
| 20:19:30 | Llorean | Just look the same |
| 20:19:35 | GodEater_ | shame |
| 20:19:48 | GodEater_ | I think you could die in Indiana Jones too |
| 20:19:51 | Llorean | The Lucasarts games all were (they created SCUMM), and then some childrens games (Putt Putt, Pajama Sam, etc) |
| 20:19:58 | Llorean | You could lose fights with Nazis. |
| 20:20:06 | Llorean | It didn't result in death though, if I recall. Just a setback |
| 20:20:07 | | Part Elazar ("WeeChat 0.2.3") |
| 20:20:13 | GodEater_ | and the end sequence too - you had to complete it in a certain as I recall |
| 20:20:27 | GodEater_ | insert the word "time" in there somewhere appropriate |
| 20:20:28 | GodEater_ | :) |
| 20:20:30 | Llorean | Hehehe |
| 20:20:54 | * | GodEater_ gets all nostalgic over the games he played at the start of the 90s |
| 20:21:52 | Llorean | Someone should just port DosBox, make it interact with the virtual keyboard, and then say "There, anything VGA should work, good luck for speed." |
| 20:23:02 | * | ender` 'd like to see scummvm ported :) |
| 20:23:24 | Llorean | I think many of us would. ;) |
| 20:23:41 | ender` | (and at least it wouldn't have keyboard problems :) |
| 20:24:16 | Llorean | 'struth |
| 20:25:49 | | Join tucoz [0] (n=martin@106.84-48-86.nextgentel.com) |
| 20:26:11 | | Join Siltaar [0] (n=Siltaar@reverse-52.fdn.fr) |
| 20:26:16 | tucoz | hi, rockbox |
| 20:27:36 | | Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 20:27:51 | tucoz | anyone knows why the manual fails with make: /home/martin/src/dev/rockbox/manual/platform/mkinfo.pl: Command not found |
| 20:27:51 | tucoz | make: *** [info] Error 127 |
| 20:28:03 | petur | does anybody know if the iHP100 provides mic power on the line-in connector? The h120/140/... do that, but somebody bought an 100 that doesn't and wonders if it's by design or a defect... |
| 20:28:21 | * | ender` 's had a hard drive die in his server today... |
| 20:28:34 | * | tucoz sends his condolences |
| 20:28:55 | * | petur checks his backup schedule |
| 20:29:14 | ender` | i didn't loose any data, but i'll keep it off until i get a replacement, just to be on the safe side |
| 20:29:57 | tucoz | I once knocked gently on a dead hard drive, which made the power supply emit sparks and and poof |
| 20:30:27 | MournBlade | I love sparks and smoke |
| 20:30:29 | Llorean | tucoz: I get the same error. But it still creates a manual? |
| 20:30:43 | tucoz | yep. I wonder what that file is supposed to do |
| 20:30:51 | pixelma | tucoz: that's a flaw in the make file atm... - it doesn't fail just gives this message. And if you type "make manual" that doesn't happen... |
| 20:31:09 | tucoz | aha. ok. all good then |
| 20:31:23 | ender` | i was rescuing data from a client's hard drive yesterday, and it only worked while cold |
| 20:31:23 | tucoz | ..well almost good |
| 20:31:47 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) |
| 20:32:00 | ender` | solution: move the computer downstairs where the fridge is, put it on the fridge, get long enough cables to have the disk running in the freezer |
| 20:32:19 | ender` | it didn't look pretty, but i managed to salvage most of the data :) |
| 20:32:52 | | Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 20:33:14 | MournBlade | things like that NEVER look pretty |
| 20:33:28 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
| 20:34:40 | * | petur yawns |
| 20:35:22 | * | bluebrother spots tucoz |
| 20:35:32 | tucoz | hi bluebrother :D |
| 20:35:51 | | Join amiconn [0] (n=jens@p54BD6F94.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:36:01 | bluebrother | haven't seen you quite a while. |
| 20:36:44 | | Quit ptw419 () |
| 20:37:16 | tucoz | yeah, i've not been too active this year. i think i've become a pure user of rockbox, as opposed to contributor |
| 20:37:33 | * | petur checks ohloh |
| 20:37:46 | | Quit datachild (Connection timed out) |
| 20:37:47 | bluebrother | let's see how much time I'll have once I found a job ... finished uni recently |
| 20:37:58 | tucoz | oh, congratulations |
| 20:38:08 | tucoz | i really want to restructure the manual though |
| 20:38:12 | bluebrother | thanks. |
| 20:38:25 | amiconn | hmrf |
| 20:38:27 | tucoz | ..but i do not know where to start |
| 20:38:44 | petur | tucoz: http://www.ohloh.net/projects/3978/contributors/23426 |
| 20:38:45 | * | amiconn experienced a really annoying rockbox bug y'day and today |
| 20:39:24 | tucoz | petur, hehe. they keep track of me :) |
| 20:39:26 | petur | amiconn: do you know if the iHP100 also provides plug power on the line-in (like h1x0/h3x0)? |
| 20:39:50 | amiconn | Needs more investigation, but rockbox didn't save any sound setting when only adjusting them from the menu |
| 20:39:52 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 20:40:20 | amiconn | That is, with many spinups between changing the settings and the final shutdown, but no volume adjustment from wps |
| 20:40:42 | * | petur just read a complaing about rockbox not saving rec settings at idle shutdown - related? |
| 20:40:45 | bluebrother | tucoz: you still have more commits than me ;-) |
| 20:40:47 | amiconn | petur: I didn't even know the h1x0 and h300 provide power there. What for? |
| 20:40:55 | petur | I thought the settings saveing bugs were out |
| 20:41:01 | petur | mic power |
| 20:41:08 | petur | 3.7V I think it is |
| 20:41:28 | tucoz | bluebrother, i was quite busy in the early days of the manual. but as you might remember, i committed quite a few patches from you and nils back then |
| 20:41:33 | * | amiconn wonders which mic would need power there |
| 20:41:47 | petur | most mics do, amiconn... |
| 20:41:49 | bluebrother | yeah. Just noticed the number ;-) |
| 20:41:55 | amiconn | Surely dynamic mics don't need it, and condenser mics have their own power source + preamp |
| 20:41:58 | * | bluebrother looks at ManualStructureTalk |
| 20:42:03 | amiconn | I only have dynamic mics |
| 20:42:37 | bluebrother | once rbutil is finished the quick start chapter will get much nicer. |
| 20:42:49 | petur | all my mics use it, but I use a pre-amp most of the time and that feeds them, but I can use them directly too |
| 20:43:00 | petur | so I guess you don't know |
| 20:43:11 | tucoz | bluebrother, yes. rbutil looks really nice. |
| 20:43:15 | petur | amiconn: do you have an iHP100? |
| 20:43:17 | amiconn | Cheap electret capsules need that power iirc, but who uses those? |
| 20:43:34 | tucoz | bluebrother, i think we should move the main menu part from chapter 5, to chapter 4 |
| 20:43:54 | amiconn | nope |
| 20:44:07 | petur | everybody over at taperssection uses mics that need power (most 48V), noe of them are cheap |
| 20:44:12 | petur | *none |
| 20:44:17 | bluebrother | like you added in "Proposal sandbox"? |
| 20:44:23 | amiconn | Yes, but 3.7V definitely isn't 48V |
| 20:44:38 | petur | not all mics need 48V |
| 20:44:54 | amiconn | sure |
| 20:44:55 | tucoz | i think i was more motivated back then, in terms of changes. but i think so |
| 20:45:07 | petur | most are happy with 7-12V, 3.7V gives a bit less range spl-wise |
| 20:45:11 | tucoz | i mean, just to move it there as a start. |
| 20:45:38 | amiconn | But the high quality mics either need no power (dynamic) or higher voltages like 48V (condenser) afaik |
| 20:45:42 | petur | amiconn: do you know anybody with an iHP100? LinusN maybe? |
| 20:45:49 | amiconn | Perhaps |
| 20:45:53 | | Join obo [0] (n=obo@82-46-82-224.cable.ubr02.trow.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:46:19 | * | tucoz checks out the old manualstructuretalk |
| 20:46:19 | pixelma | I believe XavierGr has one (or an H115) or so... |
| 20:46:33 | * | petur pings XavierGr |
| 20:46:37 | bluebrother | shouldn't we start advertising rbutil? It isn't completed yet, but so is Rockbox ... |
| 20:46:39 | amiconn | Afaik rasher has one, but he isn't around much these days |
| 20:46:57 | petur | rasher's been more around lately |
| 20:47:13 | amiconn | petur: You see, I'm not much interested in recording, and even less in recording w/ external mic... |
| 20:47:31 | amiconn | Either internal mic (for voice notes) or line in (sometimes) |
| 20:47:54 | * | petur wonders if amiconn visits concerts |
| 20:47:57 | amiconn | I have an external mic (dynamic) which I never used for real... |
| 20:48:06 | amiconn | I do, but why should I record them?? |
| 20:48:21 | petur | to enjoy them again and again |
| 20:48:21 | amiconn | (Okay, I visit concerts _rarely_) |
| 20:48:49 | amiconn | Believe it or not, but I prefer studio recordings over live recordingds |
| 20:49:18 | petur | most of my favourite bands sound better live than on CD, those are the true artists, putting more into a song live than in studio (IMHO) |
| 20:49:20 | * | linuxstb_ generally prefers live recordings, but is happy for others to make them |
| 20:49:26 | petur | heh |
| 20:49:38 | * | linuxstb_ hugs bittorrent ;) |
| 20:49:47 | * | petur buys the CD and listens to live versions |
| 20:50:10 | | Join Febs [0] (n=chatzill@38.98.196.75) |
| 20:51:20 | | Part maffe |
| 20:52:21 | | Join maffe [0] (n=maffe@barmen.interhost.no) |
| 20:56:34 | | Join datachild [0] (n=datachil@217-208-144-87-no75.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 21:00 |
| 21:00:51 | * | GodEater_ prefers his studio recordings too |
| 21:01:10 | | Join dandin1x [0] (n=dandin1@bas7-ottawa23-1088833469.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 21:01:37 | | Quit dandin1x (Client Quit) |
| 21:06:12 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 21:09:42 | | Quit amiconn (" Fensteraufdatum...") |
| 21:13:30 | petur | rofl |
| 21:15:27 | GodEater_ | ? |
| 21:15:41 | petur | [21:09] <−− amiconn has left this server (" Fensteraufdatum..."). |
| 21:16:04 | petur | Fenster = window(s), auf = up, datum = date |
| 21:16:05 | GodEater_ | translation ? |
| 21:16:08 | GodEater_ | ah |
| 21:16:20 | GodEater_ | I got the windows bit but didn't know the rest |
| 21:16:33 | Kasperle | engrish at its worst |
| 21:16:37 | Kasperle | :D |
| 21:16:40 | tucoz | hehe. will force you to reboot for sure |
| 21:16:42 | indro_ | is there a tool available for translate the rockbox lang file? |
| 21:16:43 | tucoz | *that |
| 21:16:45 | * | petur likes literal translation jokes |
| 21:17:22 | petur | indro_: yes |
| 21:17:27 | indro_ | which? |
| 21:17:54 | petur | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/LangFiles |
| 21:18:02 | | Quit dandin1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 21:20:56 | MournBlade | yay !! I found out what was wrong with my database.......huge comment tags. Whoever tagged em used the whole Amazon review and pasted it in the comment field |
| 21:21:21 | petur | wow |
| 21:21:40 | MournBlade | should have looked there first |
| 21:21:58 | petur | almost as bad as stuffing album art in it :) |
| 21:22:03 | linuxstb_ | Rockbox still shouldn't choke on them though... |
| 21:22:07 | MournBlade | lol |
| 21:22:08 | indro_ | petur: genlang? |
| 21:22:21 | petur | indro_: yes |
| 21:22:48 | MournBlade | it sure did though.....could not use database mode cause it hung up |
| 21:22:51 | indro_ | perl genlang -e=english.lang -t=test.lang -b=test.lng |
| 21:22:57 | linuxstb_ | MournBlade: I'm guessing they're id3v2 tags? |
| 21:23:00 | indro_ | doesnt work, know whats wrong? |
| 21:23:11 | petur | indro_: new language? |
| 21:23:12 | MournBlade | damn, I should have looked |
| 21:23:17 | indro_ | petur: yes |
| 21:23:27 | * | GodEater_ is taking his first stab at "proper" code for rockbox by implementing a "Favourites" plugin, rather than submitting noddy patches to ipodpatcher and rbutil. |
| 21:23:28 | petur | much work! |
| 21:23:30 | GodEater_ | gulp |
| 21:24:01 | linuxstb_ | As long as you call it favourites ;) (with a U) |
| 21:24:23 | linuxstb_ | I assume that's the favourite folder idea discussed earlier? |
| 21:24:27 | MournBlade | linuxstb: wma tags |
| 21:24:31 | GodEater_ | linuxstb: naturally - none of this poor abused language from the colonies ;) |
| 21:24:37 | GodEater_ | linuxstb: yup |
| 21:24:41 | linuxstb_ | MournBlade; Ah, then it's my fault - I wrote that code... |
| 21:24:44 | petur | indro_: I have no idea, I use genlang on linux and it just works. Make sure you execute it in the lang folder |
| 21:24:57 | MournBlade | naw........no fault |
| 21:25:15 | indro_ | petur: it display me the help text, so the syntax must be wrong. |
| 21:25:19 | MournBlade | can I get a refund? <g> |
| 21:25:21 | indro_ | but dont see whats wrong... |
| 21:25:36 | GodEater_ | MournBlade: certainly, a 200% one if you like |
| 21:25:38 | GodEater_ | :) |
| 21:25:40 | linuxstb_ | MournBlade: No refunds, but if you can give me one of your troublesome WMA files, I'll try and fix it. :) |
| 21:25:48 | MournBlade | coolness lol |
| 21:26:06 | * | petur summons perl user to help indro_ |
| 21:26:09 | indro_ | linuxstb_: I get the error again. :/ |
| 21:26:31 | MournBlade | really dont know why I am fooling with wma since now I have a choice |
| 21:26:42 | indro_ | linuxstb_: fs error |
| 21:26:46 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Do you disconnect cleanly? i.e. unmount/eject before pulling the plug? |
| 21:26:51 | bluebrother | GodEater_: favourites plugin? We had one once ... |
| 21:27:15 | indro_ | linuxstb_: I was still unzipping sound to ipod |
| 21:27:33 | | Join amiconn [0] (n=jens@p54BD6F94.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:27:50 | GodEater_ | bluebrother: what happened to it ? |
| 21:28:08 | linuxstb_ | Replaced by the playlist catalog(ue) IIRC |
| 21:28:09 | bluebrother | it got removed in favor of the playlist catalog. |
| 21:28:23 | indro_ | Extracting Patrice/Videos/Chiemsee Reggae Summer 2002.mpg 48% |
| 21:28:24 | indro_ | Read error in the file Patrice (Reggae) Discographie Complete 1998-2006 Full Albums,Lives,Maxi,BonusTracks,Pochettes,Lyrics,VideosClips & Concert... By GanjaCrew.rar [R]etry, [A]bort R |
| 21:28:44 | bluebrother | there is a wiki page listing old plugins −− OldPluginIndex iir. |
| 21:28:47 | bluebrother | *iirc |
| 21:28:50 | linuxstb_ | indro_: ? |
| 21:29:08 | indro_ | what? |
| 21:29:20 | GodEater_ | bluebrother: does that detail what it actually did ? |
| 21:29:22 | linuxstb_ | That's what I'm asking - what were those two lines? |
| 21:29:32 | MournBlade | Linuxstb: oops I just deleted the tag |
| 21:30:18 | indro_ | I dont plugged it off, I was unzipping when the fs got readonly. |
| 21:30:20 | GodEater_ | bluebrother: a - this isn't the same sort of favourites ;) |
| 21:30:27 | GodEater_ | s/a/ah |
| 21:30:41 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Your paste talked about a read error - which means problems on the source disk IIUC. |
| 21:30:54 | | Join hannesd [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 21:31:03 | indro_ | source/dest is the same. |
| 21:31:10 | indro_ | i copied the zip file to ipod |
| 21:31:17 | | Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 21:31:24 | bluebrother | what kind of favourites plugin are you working on? |
| 21:31:32 | indro_ | then did unp * |
| 21:31:42 | GodEater_ | bluebrother: be easier if you read back through todays logs |
| 21:31:49 | bluebrother | ok. |
| 21:31:53 | indro_ | *zip files |
| 21:33:39 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Then it could be a problem with your USB connection - it's not uncommon for people to report disk errors on ipods which are fixed with different USB cables, or different USB ports. Also, if you're using a hub, connect directly to your PC. |
| 21:34:08 | | Join austriancoder [0] (n=tomcat55@ux-2y01.inf.fh-bonn-rhein-sieg.de) |
| 21:35:03 | indro_ | hum, im using a hub. |
| 21:35:39 | austriancoder | petur: ping |
| 21:36:13 | bluebrother | ah, for shortcuts. Didn't remind that by "Favourites". |
| 21:37:29 | XavierGr | petur: yes I have an iHP-115, I am not sure about the mic power on it. Is there a test I can do to find that out? For now I have to go but tell me if I can help and I will do it later |
| 21:37:59 | petur | austriancoder: plonk |
| 21:38:32 | austriancoder | petur: time to do some debugin? |
| 21:38:37 | petur | XavierGr: could you plug a cable in the line-in and measure any voltage between ground and L/R |
| 21:38:49 | petur | austriancoder: yup |
| 21:39:13 | petur | austriancoder: same state still? |
| 21:39:22 | austriancoder | petur: fine :) tx problem is still here... |
| 21:39:30 | indro_ | is actually eject/unmounting really necessary? |
| 21:39:45 | petur | does e200tool do transmission? |
| 21:39:45 | austriancoder | petur: so we need to find out, what I am doing wrong/different |
| 21:39:53 | GodEater_ | bluebrother: well shortcuts was the initial request, Llorean came up with the idea for just having one file that keeps lots of shortcuts in it. |
| 21:39:59 | austriancoder | petur: it should... but I have never testet it |
| 21:40:14 | indro_ | if yes, can I only unmount or do I need eject too? |
| 21:40:28 | XavierGr | petur: will do when I come back |
| 21:40:32 | petur | indro_: I only unmount |
| 21:40:48 | petur | XavierGr: thanks! |
| 21:41:06 | austriancoder | petur: have a look at e200toll source and one of mine candidates: 1) my normal code 2) like_mrh_but_not_working.diff -> merged e200tool source into my source |
| 21:41:19 | indro_ | hum okay, what could be happen if plugged out without unmount? |
| 21:41:25 | petur | austriancoder: I will do so now... |
| 21:41:44 | petur | indro_: disk corruption |
| 21:42:01 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) |
| 21:42:01 | indro_ | irrebable? |
| 21:42:05 | petur | if lazy-write is active |
| 21:42:20 | indro_ | lazy-write? |
| 21:42:35 | bluebrother | delayed writing. |
| 21:42:38 | petur | when data is written in background |
| 21:43:02 | indro_ | so when I writing something to ipod and plugged it off? |
| 21:43:25 | bluebrother | you might corrupt your disk if you don't unmount. |
| 21:43:49 | bluebrother | f.e. the FAT might not be updated yet, as that needs to be changed quite often upon write. |
| 21:44:11 | bluebrother | caching the FAT (and writing it later) makes accesses faster. |
| 21:44:29 | indro_ | is then hardware failure or just partition corrupt? |
| 21:44:46 | amiconn | the latter |
| 21:44:49 | bluebrother | that's not a hardware failure, as you just broke the data on disk. |
| 21:44:51 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=980398fe@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-d5dc89a5eb294abc) |
| 21:45:13 | indro_ | okay, thanks for info! |
| 21:45:23 | indro_ | for the info ;) |
| 21:45:52 | indro_ | I heard about that it damage the hardware.. |
| 21:46:08 | petur | nah |
| 21:46:15 | indro_ | kk |
| 21:46:38 | | Part tucoz (""another time..."") |
| 21:48:17 | petur | austriancoder: where's that e200tool code again? |
| 21:49:15 | bluebrother | *grrr* |
| 21:49:31 | linuxstb | petur: google knows... |
| 21:49:42 | * | bluebrother just wondered half an hour why this stupid thing isn't working and it turned out to be a typo :( |
| 21:49:50 | * | petur asks google |
| 21:50:05 | austriancoder | petur: http://daniel.haxx.se/sansa/e200tool/e200tool-src.zip |
| 21:50:13 | petur | too late... |
| 21:50:26 | petur | google was faster :p |
| 21:51:36 | * | austriancoder gets something to drink |
| 21:52:33 | * | petur discovers he already had the code and kicks his brain |
| 21:53:23 | | Join webguest03 [0] (i=557f7025@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-ec9b3854e2314364) |
| 21:55:16 | amiconn | hrrrm |
| 21:55:52 | amiconn | I can confirm that _no_ settings are saved unless some special locations are used to change at least one of them |
| 21:55:59 | amiconn | (e.g. volume adjustment in wps) |
| 21:56:24 | amiconn | No standard settings that is... didn't check browser-based settings like font & wps yet |
| 21:56:31 | petur | sure? I just tested with recording and they got saved |
| 21:56:48 | amiconn | Did you change them from the menu _only_? |
| 21:57:04 | petur | well no I went into recording |
| 21:57:28 | petur | and I probably changed gain |
| 21:57:30 | amiconn | So the recording screen is another such special location |
| 21:58:03 | petur | we've had this bug before and I'm sure it was fixed :/ |
| 21:58:31 | amiconn | Looks like it was reintroduced |
| 21:59:28 | | Part Llorean |
| 22:00 |
| 22:01:05 | | Quit webguest03 ("CGI:IRC") |
| 22:01:06 | * | amiconn suspects JdGordon's July 11 commit |
| 22:01:14 | indro_ | humm, I get still error when playing a tracdk. :/ |
| 22:01:23 | indro_ | Data abort at .... |
| 22:01:29 | indro_ | *track |
| 22:01:57 | pixelma | ah... had that with ajusting volume from an audio playback menu in a plugin (and idle power-off kicking in) |
| 22:02:50 | indro_ | I have now the rockbox bootloader, rockbox.ipod on the right place, reformated the partition... |
| 22:02:54 | Lear | petur: Tried to measure on my H140, but I get strange values. Maybe I'm doing something wrong; it isn't really my area of expertise... :) |
| 22:03:06 | | Join Llorean [0] (n=llorean@rockbox/administrator/Llorean) |
| 22:03:20 | indro_ | 32mb version of rockbox... |
| 22:03:41 | petur | Lear: h140 should be fine (somewhere between 3 and 3.7V) |
| 22:04:35 | indro_ | so any more idea what could be wrong? |
| 22:05:29 | Lear | petur: Ah, better readings now (wrong setting on the meter apparently). Got 3.3. |
| 22:05:32 | | Join Rondom [0] (n=Rondom@p57A96189.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:05:33 | bluebrother | indro_: do you have a recent bootloader? |
| 22:05:42 | indro_ | bluebrother: version 1.1 |
| 22:06:13 | bluebrother | hmm. Then no quick idea. |
| 22:06:26 | petur | Lear: I really wanted to know what iHP100 gives (10GB disk) |
| 22:06:34 | indro_ | :/ |
| 22:06:42 | indro_ | my previous version worked.. |
| 22:06:58 | Lear | petur: I see. |
| 22:07:25 | bluebrother | old bootloaders with new builds usually give data aborts when playing music. |
| 22:07:39 | indro_ | yeS? hmmm |
| 22:07:46 | bluebrother | but 1.1 is a recent bootloader. You could of course try to reinstall it. |
| 22:08:03 | bluebrother | yes, old bootloaders didn't initialize the coprocessor correctly. |
| 22:10:40 | indro_ | do I need root access for installing bootloader? |
| 22:11:20 | indro_ | It worked without but its better as root? |
| 22:11:38 | austriancoder | petur: so.. how shall we proceed to find and fix tx problem? |
| 22:11:54 | indro_ | could that be the error? |
| 22:12:40 | petur | austriancoder: well I'm comparing code. If e200tool works and your version not, there must be a difference... |
| 22:13:24 | austriancoder | petur: okay.. |
| 22:13:24 | petur | are we sure there are no other external pins to configure/set? |
| 22:13:37 | indro_ | bluebrother: ? |
| 22:14:34 | austriancoder | petur: dont know... but if so, e200tool does it too |
| 22:17:07 | petur | austriancoder: nevermind, the comment says it is just toggeling a led |
| 22:18:03 | * | petur removes cache_flush from list as well |
| 22:20:26 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
| 22:20:37 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Do you get the same problems on all tracks? Do the same tracks play fine on your PC (when you mount your ipod and try to play them directly from your ipod's disk)? |
| 22:21:03 | * | amiconn wonders whether there are diodes involved ;) |
| 22:22:31 | * | petur doesn;'t think that's funny :p |
| 22:23:44 | indro_ | linuxstb_: yes, I tried different tracks. |
| 22:23:52 | indro_ | I try now if they play on my pc. |
| 22:25:34 | bluebrother | indro_: ipodpatcher needs to access the disk directly, so you need root access. |
| 22:27:00 | indro_ | bluebrother: strange, it loads rockbox even I installed bootloader as user.. |
| 22:27:29 | linuxstb_ | bluebrother: It depends on permissions of the device, and which groups the user is a member of. I can write to removable disks with my normal account. |
| 22:27:51 | bluebrother | oh −− never seen such a configuration. |
| 22:28:06 | bluebrother | or at least I can't remember having seen such a configuration ;-) |
| 22:28:09 | * | amiconn thinks that's quite common for workstations |
| 22:28:18 | indro_ | Starting playback... |
| 22:28:18 | indro_ | A: 152.2 (02:32.1) of 225.0 (03:45.0) 1.2% |
| 22:28:22 | amiconn | Otherwise things like burning a cd would also require root |
| 22:28:43 | indro_ | seems to work when im playing with mplayer... |
| 22:29:21 | bluebrother | well, a CD writer is a different thing than a removable drive |
| 22:29:48 | indro_ | Exiting... (End of file) |
| 22:29:50 | indro_ | it works... |
| 22:30:05 | indro_ | I try now the same file with rockbox. |
| 22:30:20 | linuxstb_ | bluebrother: In my Debian install, removable drives are in the "floppy" group, and so am I. |
| 22:30:46 | linuxstb_ | "permanent" drives are in the "disk" group. |
| 22:31:07 | bluebrother | well, on my box it's the "disk" group. |
| 22:31:26 | bluebrother | anyway, my setup works for me ;-) |
| 22:31:27 | indro_ | bootloader reinstalled as root |
| 22:31:28 | * | amiconn wonders why vmware workstation doesn't like kernel 2.6.21 :( |
| 22:31:56 | | Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out) |
| 22:32:53 | indro_ | 0:30 - freezeee |
| 22:33:14 | | Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]") |
| 22:33:38 | | Quit hcs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:33:40 | indro_ | but this time without an error.. |
| 22:33:58 | indro_ | just freeze :/ |
| 22:35:28 | markun | anoying |
| 22:36:32 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: was it you who asked if a handle data buffer could be expanded when there was new free space ? |
| 22:36:48 | Llorean | I asked that too. |
| 22:37:21 | Nico_P | well I've implemented something like that |
| 22:37:31 | Nico_P | but I have doubts on how to do it |
| 22:37:47 | indro_ | so what I should do now? :/ |
| 22:39:07 | indro_ | can I show if which version im using? |
| 22:39:13 | indro_ | 32mb or 64mb? |
| 22:39:15 | Llorean | Nico_P: I've no clue how best it should be done, but it does seem somewhat essential. |
| 22:39:30 | Nico_P | it does |
| 22:39:30 | indro_ | -if |
| 22:39:38 | linuxstb_ | indro_: I don't know... Maybe try an older build of Rockbox - e.g. the oldest one here - http://www.rockbox.org/dl.cgi?bin=ipodvideo |
| 22:39:50 | Nico_P | thing is that you can't expand the buffer without moving data if it's wrapped |
| 22:40:21 | linuxstb_ | Nico_P: No, it wasn't me. I'm not sure I understand what you mean. |
| 22:40:25 | Nico_P | and it'd mean basically moving all of the data within the buffer so not a good idea I suppose |
| 22:40:28 | | Join hannesd_ [0] (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 22:41:18 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: oh right. I mean when a track is freed the previous one can take the space that was freed to have a bigger buffer |
| 22:41:42 | linuxstb_ | I thought that's how ringbuffers worked... |
| 22:42:20 | | Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:42:25 | Nico_P | yes but here we have ringbuffers in the ringbuffer :) |
| 22:42:29 | linuxstb_ | What do you mean by "previous one" ? |
| 22:42:48 | linuxstb_ | I would have thought that if a track is freed, then the previous one would have been freed long ago. |
| 22:44:19 | Nico_P | hmm yeah that's true... In fact it'd happen when a previous track is freed |
| 22:44:33 | Nico_P | but there still is free space to exapnd the buffer |
| 22:45:26 | indro_ | 1:00 :) |
| 22:45:35 | Nico_P | actually when I think of it, the only useful case is when the first handle is closed. then the last one might have additional space to use |
| 22:46:18 | linuxstb_ | I'm not following what you mean with "first" and "last". Do you mean "track N" and "track N+1" ? |
| 22:46:25 | indro_ | yay! 2:00, seems to work! :D |
| 22:46:57 | indro_ | great, thanks guys! :) |
| 22:46:59 | indro_ | 2:30 ;) |
| 22:47:21 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: first and last handle in the linked list |
| 22:47:22 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Not really - it means something has been broken... |
| 22:47:35 | indro_ | yes, seems so... |
| 22:47:38 | | Quit RaRe (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:47:56 | | Quit Rondom (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
| 22:47:57 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Next step would be to work out the most recent build that still works fine. |
| 22:48:06 | indro_ | I got 2007-06-18. |
| 22:48:58 | indro_ | linuxstb_: kk |
| 22:49:18 | | Join datachild` [0] (n=datachil@217-208-144-87-no75.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 22:49:30 | Nico_P | Llorean: am I missing something ? |
| 22:50:28 | linuxstb_ | Nico_P: Is there something I should read on the wiki? I'm not sure I understand what you're doing... |
| 22:51:00 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/MetadataOnBuffer |
| 22:51:22 | | Join ac [0] (n=austrian@80.120.117.30) |
| 22:52:20 | | Quit GodEater_ ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby") |
| 22:53:18 | | Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007051502]") |
| 22:54:19 | Llorean | Nico_P: Yes, I was thinking that if say, 5 tracks are buffered, the last is a long flac that expands beyond the buffer, you don't want to do ringbuffer-within-ringbuffer until you've reached it's own beginning/metadata in the external ringbuffer. That's all I was referring to in regard to it. |
| 22:54:27 | | Quit Domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
| 22:55:08 | | Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 22:55:26 | | Join RaRe [0] (n=Laffin_B@202-89-187-101.static.dsl.amnet.net.au) |
| 22:55:31 | Nico_P | Llorean: I hadn't though of it like that :) |
| 22:55:53 | | Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-33426b9f9bb03f3e) |
| 22:56:09 | Llorean | So, "expanding forward" until using a nested ringbuffer is necessary, basically |
| 22:56:09 | | Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (n=light@gate-hannes-tdsl.imos.net) |
| 22:56:15 | indro_ | linuxstb_: 2007-07-18 works! |
| 22:56:37 | Nico_P | so I can break the buffering before wrapping occurs to allow possible expanding |
| 22:56:47 | linuxstb_ | indro_: That's today.... What version were you using before? |
| 22:56:56 | indro_ | recent build |
| 22:57:09 | | Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 22:57:20 | linuxstb_ | indro_: Do you mean "Current Build" ? |
| 22:57:29 | indro_ | yep |
| 22:58:08 | Nico_P | Llorean: a possible problem I'm thinking of (not completely related, though), is the codec. if it's stored on the main buffer it will just block it |
| 22:58:38 | linuxstb_ | The space used by the codec should be freed as soon as the track starts playing. |
| 22:58:49 | Nico_P | oh ok so no problem |
| 23:00 |
| 23:00:38 | linuxstb_ | I'm still not grasping why you want to treat a long track as file-in-ringbuffer-within-ringbuffer, instead of just file-in-ringbuffer like everything else. |
| 23:01:07 | Nico_P | because the metadata needs to be there too |
| 23:01:33 | Nico_P | and it's better not to have to move it all the time |
| 23:01:33 | bluebrother | why can't you just put the metadata at the beginning of the file? |
| 23:01:48 | Nico_P | bluebrother: because the beginning of the file will end up being overwritten |
| 23:02:09 | bluebrother | sure, so will the file. |
| 23:02:25 | linuxstb_ | But I still don't see that as a ringbuffer-within-a-ringbuffer. If anything, it's split the main buffer into two buffers. |
| 23:02:49 | amiconn | bluebrother: Yes, but the metadata has to be available until the file is fully played, unlike the beginning of the file |
| 23:03:10 | Llorean | linuxstb_: Isn't that functionally equivalent anyway? |
| 23:03:13 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: basically yes, you end up with two buffers |
| 23:03:34 | | Join GodEater_ [0] (n=bryan@bb-87-80-121-64.ukonline.co.uk) |
| 23:03:38 | amiconn | Nico_P: As for buffering the codec, I'd like to see the new code behave like the old one, i.e. _only_ put the codec on buffer if it's different from the previous track |
| 23:03:44 | bluebrother | so this means that with this ringbuffer in ringbuffer thing if a file doesn't fit into the buffer it will get buffered all the time once the buffer is full? |
| 23:03:55 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: but you need to manage one of those two as another ringbuffer, don't you ? |
| 23:04:00 | Llorean | bluebrother: What do you mean "buffered all the time"? |
| 23:04:16 | Nico_P | amiconn: of course |
| 23:04:18 | bluebrother | why not just put the metadata along the raw data and just block the metadata block if the file is still playing? |
| 23:04:31 | linuxstb_ | Nico_P: I would have thought that you still have one ringbuffer, but with a hole in it you need to take special care of. |
| 23:05:19 | amiconn | And the codec is fetched when the track starts playing, i.e. its buffer area can be freed by then |
| 23:05:21 | bluebrother | Llorean: well, if I think of a ringbuffer for the file, and the file doesn't fit into that buffer I'd need to rebuffer. But as the (internal) ringbuffer is limited (and not necesarily as large as the whole buffer) you end up with a (much) smaller buffer |
| 23:05:29 | bluebrother | thus you need to buffer much more often. |
| 23:05:30 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: I don't see how to manage a hole in a ringbuffer |
| 23:05:33 | | Join FOAD [0] (n=dok@dinah.blub.net) |
| 23:05:37 | Llorean | bluebrother: "Much" smaller? |
| 23:05:43 | | Quit datachild (Connection timed out) |
| 23:05:45 | Llorean | bluebrother: Its size would cap out as "Total buffer - Metadata size" |
| 23:05:56 | Nico_P | exactly |
| 23:05:57 | bluebrother | well, depending on the point in the main buffer. |
| 23:06:02 | Nico_P | bluebrother: no |
| 23:06:16 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
| 23:06:20 | bluebrother | then I don't get the point. |
| 23:06:24 | Llorean | bluebrother: That's why I was asking Nico_P if the data area (the nested ringbuffer) could expand as area in the main buffer was freed. |
| 23:06:29 | Llorean | It doesn't need to ring at that point yet |
| 23:06:44 | Llorean | It only needs to ring once it meets its own metadata (or a block that hasn't been freed, but that should be the only one) |
| 23:07:15 | bluebrother | but what is the ring-in-ring thing then? Is it not just some blocked part of the main buffer? |
| 23:07:20 | Nico_P | Llorean: very true. I think I'm close to having this behaviour |
| 23:07:38 | | Quit desowin ("use linux") |
| 23:07:58 | bluebrother | i.e. the metadata block? |
| 23:08:02 | Llorean | bluebrother: It has pretty much the same results, iiuc. |
| 23:08:17 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) |
| 23:08:19 | Nico_P | bluebrother: pretty much, but the metadata block can be anywhere in the buffer |
| 23:08:21 | bluebrother | well, then I don't understand what the buffer-in-buffer should behere. |
| 23:08:39 | bluebrother | Nico_P: I'm assuming the metadata block can be anywhere in the buffer. |
| 23:09:36 | Llorean | bluebrother: One way is "have the main ringbuffer skip over the metadata", the other way is "allocate all the buffer other than the part the metadata uses as a new ringbuffer" |
| 23:09:37 | amiconn | Well, if the buffer wraps, you could also move the metadata block |
| 23:09:40 | Llorean | They both do the same thing. |
| 23:09:46 | bluebrother | so as far as I understood by now it's just music data interleaved with metadata, and that metadata gets a special protection to get freed only if the track it's assigned to has ended playing. |
| 23:10:17 | amiconn | ...to the physical start of the ringbuffer, and then ring behind that, until the metadata block is freed |
| 23:10:57 | bluebrother | ringbuffer for the metadata? |
| 23:11:03 | amiconn | nah |
| 23:11:16 | | Quit ompaul ("Leaving") |
| 23:12:05 | Nico_P | amiconn: to me that seems harder to manage |
| 23:12:44 | | Join ompaul [0] (n=ompaul@freenode/staff/gnewsense.ompaul) |
| 23:12:46 | amiconn | I would think that's less complex than managing holes one way or another |
| 23:13:03 | bluebrother | Llorean: and what is the exact difference between both? I really don't get that new ringbuffer thing. |
| 23:13:20 | bluebrother | isn't it just a protected block? What's the ring for the metadata? |
| 23:13:26 | Llorean | There's no ring for the metadata. |
| 23:13:35 | Nico_P | bluebrother: it's essentially the same |
| 23:13:46 | linuxstb_ | amiconn: But it also moves the complication to other parts of Rockbox - that may be assuming the metadata isn't moving. Although maybe that is managable (I don't know those parts...) |
| 23:14:09 | bluebrother | hmm. So why call it ringbuffer-in-ringbuffer? I don't see something like that (or I'm too tired to understand right now= |
| 23:14:29 | Llorean | Because the whole playback buffer is a ringbuffer, just by definition. |
| 23:14:29 | Nico_P | bluebrother: a long track's buffer will become a nested ring buffer |
| 23:14:50 | Llorean | The data area of a very long track can become a nested ringbuffer if necessary so that the metadata at the start of the track does not need to be overwritten. |
| 23:14:57 | Nico_P | bluebrother: have you seen the picture on the MoB wiki page ? |
| 23:15:01 | bluebrother | why nested? |
| 23:15:16 | bluebrother | Nico_P: yes. Checking it again ... |
| 23:15:22 | Llorean | It's only nested in the sense that it's partitioned off from the original ringbuffer. |
| 23:15:42 | bluebrother | well, so it's more like a fragmented buffer, right? |
| 23:18:44 | linuxstb_ | One problem I see is when it comes to buffering the next track after a long track. If the low watermark is 1MB, then when 1MB (minus metadata size) of the long file is left in the buffer, you want to fill the buffer with the upcoming tracks. But you still can't overwrite the metadata... |
| 23:19:30 | | Part Llorean |
| 23:20:51 | * | linuxstb_ wonders if the current track's metadata should always be moved to be at the tail of the data for the track. |
| 23:21:35 | * | Nico_P was pondering head or tail |
| 23:21:57 | linuxstb_ | If it's head, then there will always be a hole. |
| 23:22:18 | | Quit FOAD_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
| 23:22:19 | Nico_P | yeah with tail the problem you mentioned above shouldn't happen |
| 23:22:39 | bluebrother | why can't you just skip the metadata and use the space afterwards? But as I understand the term "ringbuffer" then there is the ringbuffer of the currently playing file which you can't overwrite. |
| 23:23:18 | Nico_P | bluebrother: once it stops being a ring it can become shorter and shorter to make room for new tracks |
| 23:23:19 | bluebrother | which makes it somewhat problematic for me to understand this ring-in-ring thingy |
| 23:23:46 | * | bluebrother wouldn't call this a ring anymore |
| 23:24:05 | Nico_P | yes, there's a point where it stops being a ring |
| 23:24:05 | bluebrother | it's more like a snake that crawls through the buffer |
| 23:24:22 | bluebrother | and why does it need to be a ring in the first place? |
| 23:24:32 | Nico_P | it's a snake carrying a ringbuffer |
| 23:24:47 | bluebrother | why does it carry a ring? |
| 23:25:08 | Nico_P | because it can't always be as long as the file |
| 23:25:20 | bluebrother | and what's the purpose of that ring the snake (audio) is carrying? |
| 23:29:33 | Nico_P | bluebrother: I don't see whay you mean... |
| 23:30:13 | bluebrother | well, the audio data is getting loaded, so it kinda crawls like a snake through the buffer. |
| 23:30:23 | bluebrother | and it has the metadata attached. |
| 23:30:38 | bluebrother | but you said that this is a ring too. Why? |
| 23:32:10 | | Quit Jens () |
| 23:33:03 | Nico_P | what you call the snake is actually the concatenation of all the data in the main buffer... the head is the writing position and the tail is the reading. this snake carries little snakes on his back, each of them crawling through a part of the big snake's back |
| 23:33:51 | stripwax | so the snake itself doesn't really move? |
| 23:33:55 | bluebrother | ok ... but why are those little snakes moving? |
| 23:34:24 | Nico_P | most of them aren't, but there might be a big one that will need to move |
| 23:34:39 | Nico_P | stripwax: the big one moves forward too |
| 23:34:50 | Nico_P | but only because it follows the small ones |
| 23:35:17 | bluebrother | so ... the moving big-file-snake moves the metadata around with itself? |
| 23:36:21 | Nico_P | no, it moves in the part the metadata left him |
| 23:36:54 | | Join donutman25 [0] (n=chatzill@65.75.87.48) |
| 23:36:55 | jhMikeS | snakes, little snakes? this IS serious. what do they eat? |
| 23:37:09 | Nico_P | hehe :) |
| 23:37:14 | bluebrother | so if there is some metadata block left it just cycles between that block (end) and the place it started? |
| 23:37:36 | bluebrother | so it might become a much smaller portion of the big world? |
| 23:37:36 | * | petur wonders if they'll eat album art :) |
| 23:37:46 | bluebrother | jhMikeS: they eat metadata ;-) |
| 23:38:44 | * | bluebrother thinks this would be a good talk for DevConPub or similar ... |
| 23:39:52 | markun | Nico_P: can you take a look at this? http://130.89.160.166/rockbox/buffer-examples.txt |
| 23:40:02 | markun | It is more or less what you had in mind? |
| 23:40:27 | markun | If yes, do you have an answer to the question? |
| 23:40:59 | Nico_P | markun: I don't see how to read the diagram at the bottom |
| 23:41:12 | Nico_P | each line is a state ? |
| 23:41:21 | markun | yes |
| 23:41:34 | Nico_P | ok I see now |
| 23:41:44 | markun | the first line in the empty buffer |
| 23:41:53 | markun | the second when starting playback |
| 23:42:04 | markun | the others after rebuffering was needed |
| 23:43:09 | Nico_P | markun: in the third line, BM wouldn't replace A3 like that |
| 23:43:28 | markun | Why not? |
| 23:43:35 | markun | It has been played |
| 23:43:54 | markun | Where should BM be stored after buffering all of A? |
| 23:44:46 | Nico_P | well that's the problem with storing the metadata before the audio data |
| 23:45:04 | markun | So where do you suggest to store it? |
| 23:45:09 | Nico_P | after |
| 23:45:13 | bluebrother | wouldn't there be a similar problem when storing the metadata after the audio data? |
| 23:45:28 | bluebrother | you still have metadata block somewhere in the way. |
| 23:45:33 | Nico_P | no, because the end of the audio and the metadata are basically freed at the same time |
| 23:45:48 | Nico_P | I'll try doing a diagram similare to yours |
| 23:45:56 | markun | ok, great |
| 23:46:09 | bluebrother | then you need to move the metadata around upon every rebuffering? |
| 23:46:09 | jhMikeS | the metadata is just really any bytes you want associated with a particular track? |
| 23:46:13 | markun | I'll try to come up with a fix as well |
| 23:46:21 | Nico_P | jhMikeS: yes |
| 23:46:38 | bluebrother | maybe drawing before buffering -> after buffering state helps. |
| 23:47:12 | markun | Nico_P: where would you place AM for example? |
| 23:47:30 | Nico_P | right after A4 in the second line |
| 23:47:34 | markun | the end of the file cannot be buffered yes because it's too big for the buffer |
| 23:47:59 | markun | ok, let me see |
| 23:48:16 | bluebrother | and then you get |A5|A6|B1|BM|AM| in the next step |
| 23:48:38 | Nico_P | yes |
| 23:49:34 | | Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
| 23:49:38 | bluebrother | but if A has a length of 5, you'll get |A5|BM|B1|B2|BM|AM| |
| 23:49:54 | Nico_P | yes |
| 23:50:06 | bluebrother | how do you buffer in the next step? I.e. if AM is freed, you you continue buffering at the AM position or at A5? |
| 23:50:14 | markun | shouldn't you buffer when A4 is playing? |
| 23:51:02 | * | linuxstb_ invites everyone to London next Tuesday to discuss this over a beer... |
| 23:51:14 | linuxstb_ | (with a large sheet of paper) |
| 23:51:24 | * | petur hates these kinds of triggers |
| 23:51:36 | * | bluebrother would love to come as that is definitely a much better way of discussing it. |
| 23:51:37 | markun | linuxstb_: I hope to be there some time |
| 23:51:55 | | Join rotator [0] (n=e@rockbox/developer/rotator) |
| 23:51:55 | pixelma | linuxstb: you pay the flight? ;) |
| 23:52:14 | bluebrother | I wanted to visit London for a couple of days since a bunch of years now. One day I'll manage ... |
| 23:52:18 | * | linuxstb_ hides |
| 23:52:20 | * | jhMikeS asks the same ;) |
| 23:52:57 | Nico_P | I have an example coming... |
| 23:53:00 | markun | bluebrother: do you live near Berlin? |
| 23:53:13 | bluebrother | markun: no (at least not yet) −− Karlsruhe. |
| 23:53:28 | markun | bluebrother: not yet? |
| 23:53:41 | linuxstb_ | Nico_P: What do you think of the idea of moving the metadata? It seems it may simplify the buffering... |
| 23:53:51 | bluebrother | I just finished uni, so let's see where I find a job. Want to leave southern germany ;-) |
| 23:53:57 | linuxstb_ | But I'm not sure how much moving would need to be done... |
| 23:54:11 | Nico_P | http://nicolas.pennequin.free.fr/rockbox/buffer-example.txt |
| 23:54:13 | bluebrother | isn't the metadata quite small anyway? |
| 23:54:22 | Nico_P | the metadata could be quite big |
| 23:54:44 | bluebrother | in which cases? Images? |
| 23:54:48 | saratoga | Llorean: I deleted that off topic thing in the E200R thread |
| 23:54:50 | Nico_P | for example |
| 23:54:53 | saratoga | hope you were done with that guy |
| 23:54:53 | bluebrother | in the 4th line, where is A6 gone? |
| 23:55:00 | markun | Nico_P: it looks a bit inefficient |
| 23:55:11 | markun | because you don't buffer as much as you can |
| 23:55:37 | markun | bluebrother: indeed, it's overwritten.. |
| 23:55:58 | bluebrother | that's about what popped into my head when I heard about that ring-in-ring thing. |
| 23:56:19 | markun | Maybe we should put these examples in a wiki so everyone can chip in :) |
| 23:56:22 | bluebrother | well, we could assume A to be only of size 5 for now ;-) |
| 23:56:25 | Nico_P | err yes I obviously got confused |
| 23:56:36 | bluebrother | this _is_ quite confusing ;-) |
| 23:56:52 | * | linuxstb_ suggest b33r mats on a table... |
| 23:57:14 | | Join My_Sic [0] (n=MySic@mur31-1-82-237-204-133.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 23:57:43 | * | Nico_P is starting to think moving the metadata around might be a better idea |
| 23:57:52 | bluebrother | well, how big might the metadata in the worst case? |
| 23:57:53 | * | stripwax is still lost |
| 23:58:14 | Nico_P | bluebrother: the current worst case would be AA + cue + ID3 |
| 23:58:40 | bluebrother | ok, but how much will this get in bytes? Do you have some numbers for me? |
| 23:58:52 | | Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
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