00:00:13 | Nico_P | I'd say around 100K with a reasonable bitmap |
00:00:20 | Nico_P | not sure |
00:00:31 | stripwax | Nico_P : - dumb question but what do the ** represent in your example? |
00:00:40 | bluebrother | hmm. Quite much, but not too much compared with 32MiB buffer size. |
00:00:56 | Nico_P | stripwax: the currently playing part... I took markun's notations |
00:02:14 | stripwax | ah sorry |
00:03:26 | pixelma | bluebrother: not all targets have 32MB buffer... there are some with 16MB and some with much less... |
00:03:34 | stripwax | right. I'd misunderstood what your example was. Yours is with the metadata at the end |
00:03:41 | Nico_P | stripwax: yes |
00:04:03 | bluebrother | pixelma: right, but I guess you won't want AA on those targets. |
00:04:10 | stripwax | is there a penalty in partitioning the buffer into audio|metadata? |
00:04:15 | bluebrother | or do any of the newer, color targets have smaller buffers? |
00:04:23 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
00:04:29 | pixelma | yes, X5 for example |
00:04:47 | stripwax | no, that won't work. right. |
00:04:56 | bluebrother | hmm. Should check the device chart. Thought all color targets have at least 32 MiB |
00:04:59 | * | stripwax is finally up to speed, sorry about that |
00:05:14 | pixelma | the X5 has 16MB |
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00:05:59 | pixelma | and I read about someone who likes to store his album art as high res pngs |
00:06:01 | linuxstb_ | Here's my example with the metadata moving - http://www.pastebin.ca/625380 |
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00:06:39 | pixelma | bah... surely that won't work anyway, spoke too soon |
00:06:41 | bluebrother | well, we could still require users to resize AA to some reasonable size. |
00:07:23 | pixelma | but I could imagine AA on greyscale btw. |
00:07:27 | stripwax | pixelma - hmm, why not? (or just because of png) |
00:07:51 | stripwax | perhaps AA metadata could be resized on load.. |
00:07:57 | pixelma | yes, I meant because of the png |
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00:09:23 | stripwax | linuxstb - (because I can't remember) - is the buffer just a contiguous array (logically divided until blocks but not physically), or is it an array of pointers->blocks? (i.e. does that imply a memcpy) |
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00:09:35 | stripwax | s/until/into |
00:10:03 | linuxstb_ | It's a contiguous array. |
00:10:21 | stripwax | ok |
00:11:10 | stripwax | so moving metadata around means invalidating pointers that plugins might have |
00:11:44 | linuxstb_ | Yes, it means anything using metadata can't assume it will still be there after a yield(). |
00:11:51 | stripwax | yep |
00:13:14 | markun | linuxstb_: moving makes it a lot easier indeed |
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00:13:33 | * | Nico_P is starting to think that too |
00:13:48 | bluebrother | I'm still wondering if it wouldn't be more effecient to just define blocked metadata blocks |
00:13:56 | linuxstb_ | Yes, but will it complicate the rest of Rockbox a lot? |
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00:14:49 | bluebrother | if it's capsuled good enough, so the higher audio stuff doesn't know about the buffering? |
00:15:15 | * | bluebrother started to draw brackets around old data buffers. Makes it a bit cleaner. |
00:15:20 | markun | linuxstb_: yes, I read the part of "... after a yield()" after I hit enter |
00:16:21 | * | bluebrother remembers himself of KISS. |
00:17:06 | linuxstb_ | The KISS solution is to have a static worst-case buffer for the current track's metadata.... |
00:17:07 | | Quit RaRe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
00:17:35 | Nico_P | ... like for the codec |
00:17:38 | stripwax | Would using an index to a list of buffers (and reordering the indexes) be easier than copying the metadata around within the buffer? |
00:17:48 | bluebrother | yeah, but there needs to be a KISS solution for something more advanced ;-) |
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00:18:11 | petur | austriancoder: still here? |
00:18:15 | stripwax | (assuming the buffer behaves like a list of buffers and not just one long arbitrary block of memory) |
00:18:28 | bluebrother | stripwax: that sounds like the blocked sections I'm thinking about |
00:18:40 | linuxstb_ | The buffer does behave like a long arbitrary block of memory... |
00:18:54 | * | stripwax must have misunderstood the A1,A2,A3, notation.. |
00:19:16 | linuxstb_ | stripwax: Yes, that's just a simplification of what's going on. |
00:19:19 | stripwax | ok. |
00:19:43 | linuxstb_ | In reality you'll buffer blocks of varying size - as big as you can. |
00:19:47 | stripwax | did it change? vaguely remember the playback code referring to actual buffers |
00:19:53 | stripwax | at some point, in the past |
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00:20:47 | linuxstb_ | I think the PCM buffer is split into smaller buffers, but I'm not sure. |
00:21:11 | stripwax | hm, yep - maybe I was thinking of the PCM buffer not the codec buffer. bah. |
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00:21:20 | jhMikeS | it's one buffer with an allocation index...not really split |
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00:24:23 | linuxstb_ | There is one flaw in my plan though - the data that is freed whilst the buffer is being filled can't be used. |
00:25:31 | markun | linuxstb_: I don't see what you mean |
00:26:43 | linuxstb_ | I mean when there is 1MB of data left in the buffer, you start reading from disk. But when you've finished reading, you may only have 512KB left. IIUC, the current playback code will continue buffering into that newly freed 512KB. |
00:27:06 | linuxstb_ | (reading and buffering takes many seconds to do) |
00:27:32 | markun | ah yes, that's impossible if you move the metadata first |
00:27:40 | bluebrother | a try by me (linuxstb_'s version on top) http://www.pastebin.ca/625407 |
00:29:01 | stripwax | bluebrother - on line 34, where is AM while A5 is playing? |
00:29:48 | bluebrother | argh. Seems I got myself confused once more :( |
00:30:08 | bluebrother | but I also wanted to have the metadata at the beginning. |
00:30:23 | bluebrother | or at least look how it will work that way ;-) |
00:31:35 | stripwax | :) so the first line would be AM, A1, .. with holes while A1, A2 get played? |
00:32:43 | linuxstb_ | bluebrother: You also seem to overwrite BM before B has finished playing. |
00:34:21 | jhMikeS | is the purpose of metadata movement to keep it valid for the duration of the track if T+M can't fit? (trying to get a clue) |
00:35:12 | linuxstb_ | 1) The metadata needs to be on the buffer for the life of the track; 2) Moving the metadata will stop holes appearing. |
00:36:12 | jhMikeS | all of it or can some be discardable after read? are codecs just metadata too? |
00:36:25 | linuxstb_ | markun's original example demonstrated the hole problem - http://130.89.160.166/rockbox/buffer-examples.txt |
00:36:52 | linuxstb_ | codecs will be discardable, as they are now. Other info (id3, album art, cuesheets etc) needs to stay available. |
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00:38:55 | bluebrother | ok. I just tried to fix my example but it seems I'm too tired. Getting confused again :( |
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00:40:02 | linuxstb_ | bluebrother: What were you trying to show? |
00:41:10 | markun | linuxstb_: I might have something.. let me try to 'draw' it out first |
00:41:29 | stripwax | does the metadata need to move every time we load in more audio data chunks to keep it at the end? i.e. would there be a huge penalty to go from A1,A2,AM to A2,AM,A3 ? |
00:41:41 | markun | linuxstb_: btw, I updated my original file a bit, is it clearer now? |
00:41:48 | Nico_P | linuxstb_: I really don't know what to do... moving the metadata sounds good but might cause problems for the users of the metadata, but there seems to be no elegant way of not moving it... :( |
00:42:04 | stripwax | but i guess the problem there is that the codec needs to know that it needs to skip that region |
00:42:06 | linuxstb_ | stripwax: A2, AM, A3 is bad because A2 and A3 are no longer contiguous. |
00:42:21 | stripwax | yes −− but I'm wondering how 'bad' that really is. |
00:43:04 | linuxstb_ | striptwax: It doesn't solve the problem anyway, when A2 and A3 are played, you have AM with empty space both before and after it - complicating later buffering. |
00:44:01 | markun | linuxstb_: damn, what I wanted to try would involve a memmove on a part of memory we are currently playing from :( |
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00:44:47 | linuxstb_ | Nico_P: I don't know either.... I'm sure you know the "metadata user" parts of Rockbox better than me. |
00:45:41 | stripwax | linuxstb - hm, I was thinking a lazy move of AM when it matters would resolve that but I've tried out a few examples and can't think of a way to do that reliably :( |
00:45:47 | bluebrother | linuxstb_: I wanted to show the case where the memory gets fragmented and see how bad it is. It's memory, so random accesses don't cost extra. |
00:46:31 | linuxstb_ | Well, it makes the buffering code more complex. It also means the guard buffer needs to be used more when giving data to codecs. |
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00:50:44 | markun | linuxstb_: there was an error in my original example, I overwrote AM |
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00:53:54 | linuxstb_ | markun: So the problem occurs when starting to buffer B? |
00:54:18 | markun | linuxstb_: this is what my example should have looked like I think: http://130.89.160.166/rockbox/buffer-example2.txt |
00:55:17 | markun | in the last line is should say that BM is preventing buffering |
00:56:24 | markun | damn, why does it have to be so complex :) |
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00:56:32 | stripwax | markun - does that have the same issues as my example (A4,A5 not contiguous, AM has holes either side) |
00:56:53 | stripwax | or does it just stall while there are holes, until there are no longer holes? |
00:58:13 | markun | stripwax: it's getting a bit late to think clearly about it :( |
00:58:21 | stripwax | I'm thinking after A4 has played, AM could be moved to where A4 was (so A4 is now at the back of the buffer). But that only works because the buffer doesn't have both BM and B1 buffered. |
00:58:38 | stripwax | ^AM is now at the back, not A4 like I said.. |
00:58:42 | * | stripwax is tired too |
00:59:22 | jhMikeS | umm...why can't metadata be at the start of buffering and then right-justified with remaining data from a current track? also, handles can be lockable. |
01:00 |
01:00:09 | stripwax | jhMikeS - how much of the buffer would you allocate to metadata? how would you recover it later? |
01:00:24 | Nico_P | jhMikeS: I don't see what you mean ? |
01:00:40 | linuxstb_ | JhMikeS: We need some ASCII art.. |
01:00:42 | stripwax | jhMikeS - I'm thinking you mean something like AM,BM,CM,DM | A1,A2,B1,B2,C1,C2, .. -> −−,−−,−−,DM | −−,−−,−−, D1,D2,D3 ... |
01:00:57 | stripwax | where | is a virtual division between metadata and audiodata. |
01:01:41 | * | jhMikeS will get to the acii art soon. I'd allocate however many bytes are required though. |
01:01:49 | stripwax | in that case, you can't rejoin the metadata partition with the audiodata partition until DM has been consumed and/or you move DM to the beginning (and potentially move audiodata into the reclaimed spot to keep the audiodata as a ring) |
01:02:11 | stripwax | jhMikeS - so that would be like a separate metadata buffer and audiodata buffer? |
01:02:41 | Llorean | jhMikeS: Doesn't that kinda depend on a reliable ratio of metadata size to audio size? |
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01:02:47 | jhMikeS | A=len 6, AM*A1*A2 A3 => AM*A3*A4 A5 A6 and such |
01:02:54 | Llorean | If you have a single very large file, you've wasted a lot of metadata space |
01:03:06 | Llorean | If you have many, many, many tiny files (SID) you can't store all their tags without rebuffering. |
01:03:14 | stripwax | jhMikeS - ok but what happens when you buffer a bunch of files at once |
01:04:05 | jhMikeS | If they're small, I'm not sure what the problem is. |
01:04:36 | jhMikeS | AM A, BM B, CM C, DM D ... etc. |
01:06:10 | * | jhMikeS is probably missing a point or two here :) |
01:06:12 | stripwax | jhMikeS - oh so metadata gets memcoped as we move through the audio buffer. this is linuxstb's suggestion. |
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01:06:18 | stripwax | memcopied. |
01:07:05 | jhMikeS | right...I was following such suggestions. it only happens if a track is incompletely buffered then. |
01:07:53 | stripwax | and redbuffering can't make use of buffer that gets freed up while doing the rebuffering itself |
01:08:24 | stripwax | oh, unless the rebuffering does the memmove in this case? |
01:08:34 | * | stripwax thinks that sounds complicated |
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01:10:05 | jhMikeS | you mean data played while rebuffering? I had thought about it but not what exactly to do about it except skip the metadata block and fill it up, then move it after being finished. |
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01:11:51 | jhMikeS | the goal is to fill the buffer or finish-off the track so it can be moved a reasonable amount or even the exact amount before even starting |
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01:13:41 | stripwax | if the metadata is at the start of the audiodata in the buffer, won't that also mean you need to keep moving the metadata all the time while it's playnig? trying to keep the metadata at the end of the audiodata should mean that gets moved around less |
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01:15:19 | linuxstb_ | Moving should only be needed before each rebuffering session. |
01:15:54 | stripwax | I guessm, if the buffer is mostly empty you could have the problem that the buffer gets actually empty while you're rebuffering, if you can't take advantage of space freed up while rebuffering. |
01:15:56 | jhMikeS | will it even make any differece? x number of rebufferings x = number of moves <= 2x |
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01:19:20 | jhMikeS | is data going to be copied to a codec's working buffer or decoded in-place? I can't see putting breaks the data not causing problems if the latter. |
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01:20:07 | linuxstb_ | It depends on the codec, but most of them decode in-place. Or at least, perform their internal bitstream reading directly from the audio buffer. |
01:21:00 | linuxstb_ | i.e. they use the ci->request_buffer() and ci->advance_pointer() API. |
01:21:35 | * | ac needs sleep |
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01:22:28 | jhMikeS | I don't see the problem as any different than assemling an MP3 stream from MPEG packets in mpegplayer really |
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01:22:54 | linuxstb_ | That's not done very efficiently - there's lots of memmoving going on. |
01:24:11 | jhMikeS | not like there use to be. only when the buffer is too empty |
01:24:26 | mbishop | I just installed rockbox on my sansa e260, it's very nice :) |
01:25:14 | linuxstb_ | jhMikeS: Yes, but it's still more than is needed with the current ci->request_buffer API. |
01:25:21 | petur | bah, austriancoder left :/ |
01:25:37 | * | petur fires up gmail |
01:26:06 | jhMikeS | if you split a syncword the decoder will choke |
01:26:45 | linuxstb_ | Yes... |
01:27:20 | linuxstb_ | I'm not saying mpegplayer could do anything different (because of the way the mpeg frames are split), but the same issue doesn't happen with normal audio files. |
01:28:20 | jhMikeS | if a metadata block is smack in the middle of an mpeg audio frame it's not any different and the frame must be copied and assembled in another buffer then |
01:30:53 | linuxstb_ | Yes, that's what the current guard buffer mechanism (to handle the wraparound point) does. |
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01:31:26 | linuxstb_ | So ci->request_buffer() is always guaranteed to provide a pointer to up to 32KB of data, sometimes doing it's own copying. |
01:31:53 | linuxstb_ | So a similar mechansim would be needed for metadata-within-track |
01:32:08 | iamben | mbishop: isnt it? installed it last week on my new e280 |
01:32:11 | jhMikeS | I think the same case can handle spit and wrapped requests |
01:32:20 | jhMikeS | split even |
01:33:20 | linuxstb_ | So are you saying you think the metadata should stay where it is first loaded? |
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01:33:50 | mbishop | iamben: puts the default firmware to shame :( |
01:33:58 | jhMikeS | not sure |
01:35:09 | linuxstb_ | goodnight all. |
01:35:11 | * | linuxstb_ sleeps |
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02:48:48 | TiMiD[FD] | it seems that there is a problem building the manual |
02:49:07 | TiMiD[FD] | I've got this error : |
02:49:07 | TiMiD[FD] | make: /home/kevin/rockbox/manual/platform/mkinfo.pl: Command not found |
02:49:07 | TiMiD[FD] | make: *** [info] Erreur 127 |
02:58:53 | XavierGr | TiMiD[FD]: that's normal |
02:58:57 | XavierGr | (I think) |
02:59:03 | XavierGr | this error appears in the end |
02:59:10 | TiMiD[FD] | ah ok |
02:59:17 | TiMiD[FD] | so I can ignore it :) |
02:59:28 | XavierGr | pretty much yeah |
02:59:59 | TiMiD[FD] | but the file it requires exists ... in the tools folder |
03:00 |
03:00:40 | TiMiD[FD] | it built the pdf anyway so ... |
03:01:02 | XavierGr | yes there is something weird with the make file |
03:01:10 | XavierGr | but the pdf works even with that error |
03:02:58 | TiMiD[FD] | seems to yes ... |
03:03:09 | TiMiD[FD] | still not very elegant |
03:03:24 | TiMiD[FD] | but I don't feel like trying to think to fix it :) |
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03:06:20 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
03:09:18 | XavierGr | petur: unfortunately the person who told you so was right |
03:09:41 | XavierGr | my iHP-115 doesn't provide any voltage to line-in |
03:10:06 | XavierGr | with a multimeter the H300 showed 3.3V on line-in while iHP-115 0V :( |
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03:23:06 | iamben | is there a guide anywhere for building rockbox on linux? i found a great guide for cygwin, doesnt help me much though |
03:24:38 | TiMiD[FD] | iamben: if your distribution doesn't have gcc packages for the cross platform compilers, you can use the rockboxdev.sh script in the tools directory |
03:25:14 | TiMiD[FD] | it will build you a developpement environment and install it under /usr/local if I remember |
03:25:52 | iamben | heh i've already got an arm dev env for my gp2x, wonder if i can make that work |
03:27:27 | TiMiD[FD] | if it doesn't your build will just crash at start |
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03:28:11 | iamben | i'll just make a new build env, my gp2x is set up so 'gp2x' is the build target |
03:29:13 | TiMiD[FD] | all you need is to provide a path to gcc, ld, and so on ... |
03:29:41 | TiMiD[FD] | if the gp2x uses the same cpu as your dap, there is no reason it wouldn't work |
03:29:59 | TiMiD[FD] | but I admit that compiling gcc is fun ! |
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03:35:44 | iamben | i dont know a whole lot about gcc outside of x86... i've got a build env set up that i've been using to build for arm9, dont know if that'd work just the same for arm7 (sansa) or not |
03:36:37 | TiMiD[FD] | probably not then |
03:37:05 | dandin1 | I think it would. When you built gcc and binutils you simply specify "arm-elf", right? |
03:37:48 | TiMiD[FD] | depends |
03:37:52 | iamben | wouldn't know, i used a build script to set that up too |
03:38:06 | TiMiD[FD] | my 68k cross compiled environment didn't worked for iriver |
03:38:19 | TiMiD[FD] | it didn't built the coldfire specific libraries |
03:38:41 | TiMiD[FD] | so when I booted rockbox compiled with that gcc, it crashed |
03:38:51 | dandin1 | Well, we could compare the instructions to setup the build environement on the wiki and see if there's any difference. |
03:40:13 | TiMiD[FD] | for me I had to build the compiler |
03:40:32 | TiMiD[FD] | the previous one I had didn't wored, even if it was for the same arch |
03:40:50 | TiMiD[FD] | but it's still worth trying |
03:41:11 | dandin1 | I think it'd work even if it's arm9 and arm7. It's the same gcc build options for both of them. |
03:42:47 | TiMiD[FD] | maybe the gp2x environment removed the arm7 libraries ... |
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03:49:10 | iamben | well its doing the CC blah.c stuff just fine, but now i gotta set up symlinks for ld, ar, ranlib,etc as well |
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04:20:30 | EbErT | im confused about the Gigabeat- can you not sync it via the dock w/ rockbox installed |
04:20:43 | EbErT | which means it only uses usb 1.1? haven't bought one yet |
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04:30:57 | jhMikeS | EbErT: it connects to USB throught the dock port if that's what you mean |
04:31:34 | EbErT | and docking it works fine w/ rockbox installed? |
04:31:46 | EbErT | gets usb 2.0? |
04:33:08 | jhMikeS | yes, I do believe so. |
04:33:52 | krazykit | i'd check for you, but my dock is 12 hours away |
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04:34:28 | EbErT | hehe, thanks anyway, just a little confused. I dont care about the dock, just care about USB 2.0 transfer |
04:34:45 | * | jhMikeS will try to check but XP tends to while about 1.1 connections and doesn't when connecting the gigabeat |
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04:35:23 | krazykit | oh, it'll do usb2 just fine without the dock, definitely |
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04:44:31 | MournBlade | 1.1 is just well.....painful |
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05:04:57 | iamben | trying to build rockbox, its looking for sysfont.h... i read somewhere that the build system is supposed to create this, where am i going wrong? |
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05:07:39 | saratoga | iamben: I've gotten that before, usually deleting the build directory and rerunning configure fixes it |
05:11:18 | iamben | i extract the rockbox-bleeding.tar.bz2, make the build dir, run the configure, then run make, and it errors on sysfont.h: no such file |
05:15:14 | Presence | <3 rockbox so bad. : |
05:15:16 | Presence | :) |
05:18:09 | iamben | saratoga: well i dunno why make isnt creating it for me, but i just manually did the command that make was supposed to, and now im past that point... to another error. |
05:19:54 | iamben | make[1]: *** No rule to make target `/home/ben/rockbox-bleeding/newbuild/firmware/drivers/tuner/lv24020lp.o' |
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05:26:42 | safetydan | iamben, I think you'll have a much easier time of it if you just use the rockboxdex.sh script |
05:29:15 | iamben | safetydan: i did, this is w/ the build env it created |
05:29:54 | krazykit | iamben, maybe try using an svn snapshot? |
05:30:06 | krazykit | errr |
05:30:18 | krazykit | pull it from svn yourself |
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05:31:25 | safetydan | iamben, so you've got the arm compiler in your path, you've created an empty directory for your build, cd'd to that directory, run ../tools/configure and selected your options, and then just typed make? |
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05:31:44 | iamben | safetydan: correct. |
05:32:24 | iamben | first sign of problems though, is that sysfont.h is not created like its supposed to... i can run that command myself to get around it, but maybe its a sign of a deeper problem? |
05:32:52 | safetydan | iamben, I'd suggest grabbing the source from svn if you can. The source tarballs aren't guaranteed to work. |
05:32:58 | iamben | its not trying to write anywhere funny outside this build dir is it? im doing this as my normal user |
05:33:18 | safetydan | The build should only make things in your build directory. |
05:33:29 | safetydan | you could always try "make V=1" to see what's being executed |
05:33:52 | iamben | yeah i saw that suggested elsewhere, so i tried it... not much useful, lemme see if i can pastebin |
05:39:18 | iamben | ah hell |
05:39:52 | iamben | i was using svn earlier, switched over to the bleeding snapshot, now i go back to svn and it seems to be working |
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05:43:46 | paugh | OT question but.. i just read something that implies that you can use external powered mics with the iriver IHP-140 directly. (at least to some extent) can anyone confirm this? |
05:46:22 | iamben | thanks for the help, maybe it was just a small problem w/ the snapshot the whole time |
05:46:48 | iamben | anyway, i applied a patch, got it to build, and loaded it up on the sansa, all is well |
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06:53:30 | amiconn | JdGordon: around? |
07:00 |
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07:09:58 | ptw419 | does anyone know how to link a section that has not been called in the main source? |
07:13:51 | amiconn | What are you trying to do? |
07:15:44 | ptw419 | link in vectors |
07:16:03 | ptw419 | arm exception vectors |
07:17:00 | amiconn | ah |
07:17:07 | amiconn | gigabeat S ? |
07:17:59 | ptw419 | nm i think i got it |
07:18:03 | ptw419 | yes |
07:18:09 | amiconn | You probably want KEEP() around the vector seciton in the .lds |
07:18:14 | ptw419 | it was doing it, but i was looking at wrong place in assembly |
07:18:25 | ptw419 | yeah thats what i was doing, but i was looking at wrong place |
07:18:29 | ptw419 | thanks though |
07:18:51 | * | amiconn wonders why that is #ifndef CPU_ARM in the sources |
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07:41:48 | TiMiD[FD] | amiconn: just my curiosity, but would it be technically possible to make the grayscale lib work on the remotes at the same time as on the main unit ? |
07:42:37 | amiconn | nope |
07:43:00 | TiMiD[FD] | ok |
07:43:10 | TiMiD[FD] | I suppose the timings are incompatible |
07:43:19 | amiconn | It might be possible to make a grayscale lib for the remote, but you could only use either the main or the remote, not both |
07:43:43 | amiconn | This is because the grayscale lib needs a timer, and there's only one user timer on coldfire |
07:44:09 | TiMiD[FD] | if the screens were physically the same, it would be possible then ? |
07:44:17 | amiconn | And for the iaudio remote, there's too much data to move in greyscale mode |
07:44:55 | amiconn | It might be possible for them when switching the lcd controller to mono mode while the grayscale lib is running, but then it's an all-or-nothing situation |
07:44:58 | TiMiD[FD] | I see |
07:45:41 | amiconn | The standard grayscale lib allows to use the grayscale overlay on a part of the screen, with standard output around it |
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07:46:06 | TiMiD[FD] | I was actually reading the code of the grayscale lib, that's why I wondered |
07:46:27 | TiMiD[FD] | even if I don't see a lot of applications to use grayscale on the remote ... |
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07:52:08 | amiconn | Even if the timer could be shared between 2 running grayscale libs (letting it run with a cycle that equals the greatest common denominator of the two LCD's frame frequencies and then only refresh every n resp. m cycles) there would be the problem that the frame transfer for one lcd might delay the other |
07:52:39 | amiconn | Especially since the remote transfer takes quite a while (serial transfer) |
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07:54:10 | amiconn | And it would require to disable ticking reduction (temporarily). I'd be curious how that sounds on H1x0s with a loud ticking problem... |
07:54:13 | amiconn | "ssssssss" |
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07:57:29 | amiconn | Or better "zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" in english |
07:59:45 | TiMiD[FD] | if we had color remotes it would be perfect though :) |
08:00 |
08:00:18 | amiconn | No, it wouldn't |
08:00:24 | TiMiD[FD] | I wonder if there are daps with color remotes ... |
08:00:26 | amiconn | There's a reason why there are no colour remotes |
08:00:35 | TiMiD[FD] | ah ? |
08:00:42 | amiconn | The data transfer would take way too long over a serial link |
08:00:45 | TiMiD[FD] | bandwith for transfer ? |
08:00:59 | amiconn | And parallel links need too many wires |
08:01:04 | TiMiD[FD] | even with a faster link ? |
08:01:21 | amiconn | Well, they could use a high-speed serial link, but that would require separate chips |
08:01:43 | amiconn | And the shielding is another problem |
08:01:53 | TiMiD[FD] | so we're not gonna see color remotes before a long time I guess ... |
08:02:13 | amiconn | See how some irivers already suffer from the ticking problem. Higher frequencies would make it worse... |
08:02:17 | TiMiD[FD] | would be feasible but very expensive right |
08:03:15 | TiMiD[FD] | eventually transfering the audio data digitally would avoid shielding :p |
08:03:21 | amiconn | Even at the same resolution, a colour remote for the iriver would need 16 times the data as the mono remote |
08:03:55 | amiconn | Yes, but then you'd need a secondary dac in the remote. Also not necessarily cheap |
08:04:26 | TiMiD[FD] | so 17fps |
08:04:30 | TiMiD[FD] | according to this page |
08:04:32 | TiMiD[FD] | http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/LcdFrameRate |
08:05:13 | amiconn | 17fps make the ui appear really sluggish |
08:05:38 | TiMiD[FD] | never tried ... |
08:05:38 | amiconn | You need at least ~40fps for acceptable performance |
08:06:03 | TiMiD[FD] | so they would need roughtly a 3 times higher bandwith |
08:07:48 | TiMiD[FD] | would be fun to have a dap with 3 screens |
08:08:40 | scorche | why?...i rarely look at the one screen.. |
08:08:45 | * | amiconn wonders what that should be good for |
08:09:11 | TiMiD[FD] | because screen api is for 1...n screens :) |
08:09:31 | TiMiD[FD] | so rockbox could run on it without changes |
08:10:50 | TiMiD[FD] | hey do you have any idea of what could cause a key to behave as another? |
08:11:59 | TiMiD[FD] | since maybe 4 month my iriver's remote volume up key behaves like the remote page down key (or directory skip) roughtly one press on 10 |
08:12:09 | TiMiD[FD] | I wonder if it's hardware related |
08:12:28 | pondlife | TiMiD[FD]: Does it do this in the OF too? |
08:13:08 | TiMiD[FD] | the few times I booted into OF I didn't noticed it, but I'm not sure |
08:13:17 | TiMiD[FD] | I will try using OF this evening |
08:13:55 | TiMiD[FD] | but if it was hardware related I wonder what could be the culpirit ... |
08:14:26 | TiMiD[FD] | some resistor that went crazy ? |
08:15:06 | TiMiD[FD] | (if I recall the iriver's keys are differenciated with different resistor's values) |
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08:33:39 | * | amiconn found that he can make the iaudio remote lcd driver even faster at lower cpu clocks :) |
08:37:53 | TiMiD[FD] | amiconn: I was looking at the lcds drivers sources, and I noticed a lot of code is duplicated |
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08:39:48 | TiMiD[FD] | I wonder if it wouldn't be worth splitting the drawing part in 2 : a low level device specific and a high level that would work the same for every sceens |
08:40:33 | tdtooke | I have a quick question for the powers that be. Do you think a patch which adds the option of selecting a specific icon set would be a good idea. I realize we have a .cfg file that sets your icons back to default, I just thought it'd be pretty cool to have that added capability. |
08:41:06 | amiconn | TiMiD[FD]: They are already split like this... |
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08:46:33 | TiMiD[FD] | really ? |
08:47:11 | | Quit webguest06 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)") |
08:47:14 | TiMiD[FD] | nah |
08:47:53 | TiMiD[FD] | for example the setmargins function is the same for every driver |
08:48:25 | TiMiD[FD] | the firmware/drivers/lcd-* contains a lot of duplicated code |
08:48:30 | amiconn | That will go anyway with viewports |
08:49:05 | amiconn | Maybe you're talking about the format specific stuff, not device specific |
08:49:59 | TiMiD[FD] | yes format specific stuffs |
08:50:39 | TiMiD[FD] | but a lot of things are common |
08:50:48 | TiMiD[FD] | like drawline for example |
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08:53:15 | GodEater | tdtooke: there's no reason why you can't have a .cfg file that just sets icons too. |
08:53:27 | GodEater | tdtooke: so you can have one .cfg file per iconset |
08:53:28 | TiMiD[FD] | with viewports it removes indeed a lot of code related to fonts / scroll |
08:53:39 | GodEater | tdtooke: then there's no need for an option to select them |
08:53:43 | TiMiD[FD] | so it won't be that bad |
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08:57:48 | bluebrother | tdtooke: I would even go further the other direction and remove the "browse wps / rwps" entries |
08:57:59 | bluebrother | as that should be done by the theme anyway. |
08:58:11 | tdtooke | Alrighty then, I guess I won't be submitting that one to flyspray :( |
08:58:50 | * | amiconn disagrees with bluebrother |
08:59:04 | tdtooke | My preference for iconsets changes every other minute at times so I thought maybe somebody out there would like that idea. |
09:00 |
09:00:21 | tdtooke | though using extra .cfgs probably would involve at lot less effort on my part |
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09:02:21 | tdtooke | theoretical question, if one were to submit a patch that added a setting would it be required to support all languages before it would be considered for acceptance? |
09:06:16 | amiconn | Hmm, something made the X5 slower in general since my last lcd framerate measurement... :( |
09:06:28 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
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09:08:19 | scorche | tdtooke: languages are updated based on english.lang ...i very much doubt there is a single language out there that is fully up-to-date (besides english) |
09:08:44 | TiMiD[FD] | tdtooke: I don't think so |
09:08:44 | TiMiD[FD] | lot of menu options are not even translated |
09:08:44 | TiMiD[FD] | devs only care about the english version, the translators takes care of the rest :) |
09:10:10 | * | scorche hears an echo |
09:17:29 | JdGordon | amiconn: am now, wassup? |
09:18:45 | amiconn | Check yesterday's log starting at 21:55 |
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09:20:09 | petur | amiconn: I just had your problem today: changed a seting before powering off and it wasn't saved... |
09:21:19 | amiconn | It does not only happen just before poweroff. There can be as many spinups inbetween, as long as you don't change a setting from elsewhere than the menu |
09:21:42 | amiconn | Looks like settings_save() isn't called from the standard settings function |
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09:22:28 | tdtooke | Ok, thanks guys |
09:22:36 | JdGordon | it isnt? it _should_ be |
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09:22:40 | JdGordon | ill check in a few min |
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09:22:47 | * | JdGordon starts work on monday! |
09:23:22 | TiMiD[FD] | erm |
09:23:37 | scorche | JdGordon: the link i gave you? =P |
09:23:39 | TiMiD[FD] | my name is appearing on the svn log of rockbox |
09:23:43 | scorche | i would be excited too! |
09:24:10 | JdGordon | :D |
09:24:21 | TiMiD[FD] | I would really don't want my boss to search on the internet my name and read that page |
09:24:39 | scorche | why not? |
09:25:03 | TiMiD[FD] | then looking at the hour ... noticing what I'm doing during the working hours .... |
09:25:10 | scorche | ah... |
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09:25:42 | JdGordon | amiconn: bah, your right, settings_save isnt called for about 90% of settings, ill fix that now |
09:26:10 | TiMiD[FD] | wouldn't it be possible to "fix" that ? :p |
09:26:50 | GodEater | TiMiD[FD]: yes - don't skive off work ;) |
09:27:02 | pondlife | JdGordon: Congratulations on the employment... so you only have 3 days to finish MoB :p |
09:27:35 | JdGordon | i hope not |
09:27:40 | TiMiD[FD] | I would do that gladly if I had an interresting work, or at least if I had something to do ... |
09:27:55 | GodEater | TiMiD[FD]: unless you have commit access I wouldn't worry about it |
09:28:03 | | Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007060115]") |
09:28:06 | TiMiD[FD] | I have commit access |
09:28:26 | TiMiD[FD] | ... |
09:28:33 | GodEater | save your commits till you're at home ? |
09:28:58 | scorche | GodEater: he was with us a while back...way before you...he has recently come back into the fold =) |
09:29:46 | GodEater | scorche: I think I just remembered seeing him ask for commit access again, so I figured that ;) |
09:31:04 | pondlife | Can anyone see the problem where skipping tracks clears the pause status on Flyspray? I'm sure it *was* on there, but a search for "Pause" finds nothing much. |
09:32:00 | TiMiD[FD] | GodEater: could be a solution :) |
09:32:09 | pondlife | Ah, LinusN fixed it.. :( |
09:32:22 | TiMiD[FD] | but I'm not at home that often ... |
09:36:51 | GodEater | TiMiD[FD]: cronjob ? :) |
09:39:31 | * | pondlife just learnt that Canada has time-zones on the half-hour... |
09:41:15 | | Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
09:43:55 | GodEater | pondlife: think Sri-Lanka is in a half-hour timezone too |
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09:54:54 | JdGordon | amiconn: or anyone: feel like testing my patch? im 99% sure it works, but the rest of my tree is fubar so cant test it here |
09:55:45 | JdGordon | http://www.pastebin.ca/625888 |
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10:00 |
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10:04:04 | GodEater | Is there some magic in onplay.c that decides which context menu entries are appropriate for directories and which are appropriate for files ? |
10:04:18 | JdGordon | yes |
10:04:22 | JdGordon | well, not magic |
10:04:45 | GodEater | well, I didn't really think it was Juju, I just can't see how it works |
10:05:16 | GodEater | Bagder: T-shirts and mugs have arrived, my porter decided not to steal them for himself :) |
10:06:08 | JdGordon | onplaymenu_callback is most likely where you want to look |
10:06:59 | GodEater | JdGordon: thanks sir |
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10:11:51 | GodEater | looks more like clipboard_callback to me |
10:11:58 | GodEater | unless I've grown even more dense |
10:12:05 | GodEater | which is always possible |
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10:24:42 | JdGordon | linuxstb: im just reading yesterday/thismornings log, I still tihnk moving the metadata is a bad idea |
10:25:15 | JdGordon | and I dont see why storing it behind the tracks audio would be simpler than storing it before the audio |
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10:27:24 | * | JdGordon gone... dinner time |
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10:38:42 | GodEater | pixelma: good call on that ipod mini post - I didn't think of that |
10:39:12 | pixelma | :) |
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11:09:05 | linuxstb | JdGordon: If you don't move the metadata, you need to deal with the current track's metadata floating around in the middle of the empty part of the buffer. If you do move it, then it is always contiguous with the current track's data, and you don't have the complication of dealing with a fragmented buffer. |
11:11:32 | linuxstb | GodEater: The checksums are initiialised with the model number from the bootloader. So for example, the mini 1st gen is model number 9, and the 2nd gen is model 11. Hence the difference of 2 in the resulting checksums. So a small difference in the checksum almost always implies the user has downloaded the wrong build. |
11:12:09 | GodEater | linuxstb: I also noticed he got a bad checksum error right at the top of those messages from the bootloader - is that the same issue ? |
11:13:28 | linuxstb | yes. |
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11:14:06 | GodEater | so his issue now is "get it into disk mode" and then "put the right build on" ;) |
11:14:37 | linuxstb | Although I don't think that's an accurate copy of the error messages - the bad checksum line should be further down. |
11:14:57 | GodEater | I did wonder about that - I've never seen that message appear there |
11:15:33 | linuxstb | Ah, the text has wrapped back to the top of the screen... |
11:16:25 | linuxstb | So those top four lines actually come after the "Can't load rockbox.ipod" line. |
11:17:13 | GodEater | ah ha |
11:17:31 | * | GodEater is clearly too used to the enormous screen real estate offered on the video |
11:19:24 | scorche | anyone else need any cloak changes while i am at it? |
11:19:30 | scorche | new devs/etc? |
11:19:44 | * | obo raises his hand |
11:19:50 | JdGordon | linuxstb: my idea to handle the fragment problem is to use the current linked list so when we have the problem where the data for one track is in the middle of 2 empty bits, the next track is read into the first bit, then jumps to the bit behind the block, it would all be handled by the same id so it would be transparent to everything but buffering |
11:21:21 | scorche | any others? (speaking for other new devs is alright as well |
11:21:23 | scorche | ) |
11:22:22 | linuxstb | JdGordon: Don't forget you will then also need to use a guard buffer to enable the codecs to read the data in contiguous blocks of up to 32KB... It just seems more straightforward to move the metadata to me, but I'm not say your way won't work either. |
11:22:28 | scorche | obo: done |
11:23:19 | JdGordon | hmm, yeah, forgot about that problem |
11:23:23 | GodEater | should we put "Support DRM" on the NoDo page ? |
11:23:49 | petur | scorche: I think austriancoder hasn't got a cloak yet |
11:23:59 | linuxstb | JdGordon: With a fragmented buffer, there will also be more chance of a non-streaming file (one that needs a single contiguous buffer) not fitting, as the buffer will be split into up to 3 parts, rather than up to 2. |
11:24:17 | scorche | petur: he is registered, so he cant be cloaked |
11:24:21 | scorche | errr...isnt |
11:24:56 | scorche | errr...he is now |
11:25:04 | petur | yesterday he was reg'd and didn't have a cloak |
11:25:16 | GodEater | any archos experts that know about recording care to take a look at this : http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=11662.0 |
11:25:29 | linuxstb | GodEater: I never like to say never.... IMO the NODO is for things which are not technically possible, so for example the alternative filesystem support should be removed from the NODO now that Rockbox runs from flash on some devices (and some devices like ipods natively support non-FAT filesystems). |
11:25:35 | petur | he's not here now, the nick here is just a ghost I think |
11:26:17 | GodEater | linuxstb: while I agree DRM is not *technically* impossible, I don't see how we can support it legally ? |
11:26:39 | amiconn | GodEater: That's not an archos specific question |
11:26:43 | linuxstb | GodEater: Maybe it's legal in some countries... |
11:27:07 | obo | scorche: thanks - does saratoga have one?? (trying to remember who else is new to the dev list) |
11:27:20 | amiconn | Imho the nodo is also for stuff we don't support intentionally |
11:27:24 | scorche | obo: he isnt on, so he cant be cloaked |
11:27:31 | amiconn | DRM is one such thing imo |
11:28:12 | scorche | petur: alright...done =) |
11:28:20 | linuxstb | I guess I agree - stick DRM on the NODO... |
11:29:03 | * | petur answered the recording post |
11:29:33 | amiconn | And support for other filesystems is also such an intentional nodo - perhaps with the exception that we might want to support hfs on ipods |
11:30:23 | linuxstb | Well, if someone implemented ext2 support, I would probably use it... |
11:30:26 | scorche | if anyone else remembers/needs a cloak, let me know (at any time) |
11:30:38 | linuxstb | But it's not something I would want to spend time implementing myself. |
11:31:28 | JdGordon | we need a filesystem plugin api! |
11:31:41 | amiconn | Adding support for additional filesystems is pure bloat imho as long as there is no real reason to (like hfs on macpods) |
11:31:54 | amiconn | fat(32) is supported by virtually all operating systems |
11:32:50 | scorche | GodEater: "moraley" ? |
11:32:59 | GodEater | scorche: shoot me - my spell checker is on the blink |
11:33:11 | * | scorche shoots GodEater |
11:33:20 | * | GodEater bleeds quietly on to the floor |
11:33:32 | JdGordon | i just cleaned that you bugger! |
11:34:10 | * | GodEater coughs and points at scorche |
11:34:27 | * | scorche sits in his chair and cleans his gun |
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11:39:05 | GodEater | do we offer dual boot on the H10 ? |
11:40:06 | pixelma | I think so |
11:45:51 | linuxstb | GodEater: Looking at bootloader/main-pp.c, it looks like we do - hold LEFT as you boot (same as Sansa) and it will load /System/OF.mi4 or /System/OF.bin |
11:46:17 | GodEater | good enough |
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12:00:25 | Nico_P | scorche: is it too late for a cloack ? |
12:00:29 | Nico_P | *cloak |
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12:00:49 | scorche | it never is...although it may take a bit longer for you... |
12:02:34 | pondlife | Hmm, I missed JdGordon? I don't think he finished his sentence on http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7417#comment16410... |
12:03:12 | Nico_P | scorche: thanks :) |
12:03:33 | * | Nico_P learned about the extistence of cloaks two days ago |
12:03:50 | scorche | done |
12:04:05 | Nico_P | what should I do to use it ? |
12:04:08 | scorche | (underscore isn't possbile in cloak) |
12:04:18 | scorche | as long as you are identified, it will apear |
12:04:22 | scorche | appear |
12:04:25 | Nico_P | it has :) thanks |
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12:05:11 | linuxstb | pondlife: I think I can guess what he meant - that config files are not a replacement for when you want the ability to choose between many values in many settings - you would need hundreds of config files. |
12:05:15 | linuxstb | Ah, he's back ;) |
12:05:29 | pondlife | JdGordon: I was just saying - did you finish your comment: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/7417#comment16410 |
12:05:31 | pondlife | ? |
12:05:57 | JdGordon | yes an no |
12:07:09 | pondlife | I'd personally rather have browse .CFG files instead of any quick menu. |
12:07:19 | pondlife | any configurable quick menu, I mean |
12:12:05 | JdGordon | yeah, i sort of lost my train of though and couldnt be bothered finishign the sentance.. so thought that comment was good enough |
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12:13:12 | Nico_P | JdGordon: should've deleted the comma :) |
12:13:16 | GodEater | if you clear the backdrop in a plugin, does it get restored to the original when the plugin exits automatically, or do you have to remember what it was and set it explicitly ? |
12:13:37 | Nico_P | GodEater: it will get restored |
12:13:42 | GodEater | thank you |
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13:23:44 | MoFF | hello, is anybody about? |
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13:24:40 | MoFF | i was going to ask if divx/xvid is supported in rockbox for the ipod video 80gb? |
13:25:02 | scorche | it isnt |
13:25:14 | MoFF | thank you |
13:25:31 | MoFF | is it impossible to implement too? |
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13:26:37 | GodEater | not impossible - but v. difficult |
13:26:59 | GodEater | we're having trouble optimising mpeg2 - going for mpeg4 is going to make life even more challenging |
13:27:28 | * | scorche looks over in the direction of the broadcom building a few min away |
13:27:41 | GodEater | scorche: you've been through their trash already I take it ? ;) |
13:27:58 | linuxstb | MoFF: The Apple firmware makes use of a completely undocumented video processing chip to perform the video decoding. Rockbox doesn't touch that chip and just uses the main CPU, which obviously is far less powerful. |
13:28:01 | scorche | no, but i *could* |
13:29:18 | MoFF | thank you all for answering my question so well :D |
13:29:26 | Davo_Dinkum | yay for dumpster diving! |
13:30:06 | MoFF | so you say you're trying to implement mpeg2 eh... that's interesting |
13:30:37 | scorche | well, technically, it is already implemented |
13:30:50 | scorche | which is why we said optimizing =) |
13:32:01 | MoFF | wow :o |
13:32:23 | * | amiconn wonders what cpu type and rating his mobile phone has |
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13:32:55 | amiconn | It can play mpeg 4 video, with realtime scaling |
13:33:18 | MoFF | forgive me if this comes out sounding really silly, but, would that mean i could watch a dvd on the ipod with rockbox? |
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13:33:27 | * | MoFF blushes :s |
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13:33:39 | scorche | MoFF: if formatted right, yes |
13:33:43 | linuxstb | petur: Looking at your properties.c plugin, I always thought that dircache should be mostly transparent to the apps/ code - so does the normal readdir() not use dircache? |
13:34:13 | linuxstb | MoFF: You need to resize the video to your LCD's resolution, plus also convert the audio to 44.1KHz MP3 (or MP2). |
13:34:42 | MoFF | that is really impressive |
13:35:04 | petur | hmmm can't remember, there must have been a reason I did it like that. Can it be the normal calls don't use dircache? |
13:36:01 | linuxstb | Looking at the code, it seems that way - but that seems really odd to me... |
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13:36:34 | * | scorche uses http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tcpmp on his phone |
13:43:16 | MoFF | bear with me, yet another question which might pain you; if i install rockbox, and for some reason i need to send my ipod in for repairs (it is an apple product after all), will i be able to delete rockbox so as to not void my warranty? |
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13:43:33 | scorche | assuming the device is usable, yes |
13:44:12 | * | MoFF is just scared because of previous troubles with ipods |
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13:44:32 | Davo_Dinkum | heh yeah |
13:44:50 | J | I talked to somebody in my local apple shop, he said if the device won't start the drive then warranty isn't voided regardless of what's on the drive... but don't quote this! |
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13:45:32 | Kasperle | MoFF: if you can still reset your ipod to disk mode, itunes can fully restore it to how apple would like it to be |
13:45:40 | Davo_Dinkum | yeah rockbox goes onto the hdd on ipods |
13:45:46 | Davo_Dinkum | it doesnt touch anything else |
13:46:46 | MoFF | i just want rockbox for MPEG-2 playback :D |
13:47:09 | scorche | which ipod so you have? |
13:47:24 | MoFF | iPod Video 80GB |
13:47:49 | PaulJam | MoFF: the apple firmware is much better for video playback on g5 ipods |
13:47:55 | scorche | if you are looking for decent video playback, you will find yourself being much happier int he apple firmware tbh |
13:48:24 | MoFF | ah ok :) |
13:49:07 | Kasperle | just dual boot |
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14:49:44 | * | GodEater has added a note about DRM to NoDo and would be grateful for feedback. |
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14:56:01 | PaulJam | isn't "crippled" a little bit harsh? |
14:56:31 | Davo_Dinkum | who said that? |
14:56:49 | GodEater | I believe that's the accepted way to describe them in OSS circles |
14:57:08 | Davo_Dinkum | describe what? |
14:57:15 | Davo_Dinkum | non-geeks? |
14:57:21 | GodEater | hahaha - no |
14:57:28 | GodEater | files encrypted with DRM technology |
14:57:49 | Davo_Dinkum | oh |
14:57:58 | Davo_Dinkum | no, crippled isn't too strong a word |
14:58:04 | TiMiD[FD] | is there a way to activate logging on the device (DEBUGF) without using the remote screen ? |
14:58:05 | Davo_Dinkum | it suits DRM well |
14:59:14 | GodEater | PaulJam: if you can think of a better term by all means lets hear it |
14:59:42 | Davo_Dinkum | "disabled" |
14:59:42 | PaulJam | GodEater: DRM encrypted? |
14:59:44 | bluebrother | DRM = Digital Restrictions Management. |
15:00 |
15:00:11 | bluebrother | doesn't the terms tells itself? ;-) |
15:00:23 | linuxstb | Anyone (Slasheri?) know why some of the apps/ code is calling readdir() and some is calling readdir_cached() ? IIUC, that a mistake and the intention is that all code should be using readdir_cached() ? |
15:00:30 | MournBlade | I kinda like virus infected |
15:00:39 | pondlife | Restrictions in F/OSS, Rights in RIAA.. |
15:00:44 | GodEater | MournBlade: that's inaccurate though |
15:00:53 | MournBlade | true |
15:01:02 | GodEater | crippled is accurate IMO |
15:01:18 | GodEater | it's of no use unless you possess the key to use it |
15:01:54 | bluebrother | pondlife: RIAA is lying −− it restricts the user in all cases :o |
15:02:16 | linuxstb | TiMiD[FD]: Only on some devices - those with a serial port. On most devices you can only use logf. |
15:02:35 | GodEater | bluebrother: it's your right to be frustrated ;) |
15:02:55 | PaulJam | I mean i don't like DRM either, but in my opinion the wiki should be more or less objektive and i think "DRM crippled" is a quite subjective term. |
15:03:03 | linuxstb | Isn't it just referring to the rights of the copyright holder, rather than the rights of the consumer? |
15:03:11 | bluebrother | well, luckily I never bought such cr*p. But those "copy control"led CDs can be annoying enough. |
15:03:14 | GodEater | linuxstb: that's not the way they try to sell it |
15:03:37 | GodEater | DRM somehow empowers the consumer in RIAA's world |
15:03:45 | pondlife | bluebrother: If I receive a CC CD, I send it right back. |
15:04:01 | pondlife | Many of them won't play in my car stereo. |
15:04:12 | pondlife | I ordered Red Book, dammit! |
15:04:15 | linuxstb | GodEater: Surely no-one believes that? ;) |
15:04:29 | GodEater | linuxstb: no-one with half a brain cell |
15:04:44 | TiMiD[FD] | linuxstb: too bad :( the stack overflow I'm trying to track doesn't occurs when rockbox is buit in debug mode ... |
15:05:35 | TiMiD[FD] | linuxstb: for the readdir it seems that almost all the plugins are using it ... |
15:06:02 | linuxstb | TiMiD[FD]: Using the original readdir() you mean, rather than the dircache version? |
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15:06:53 | TiMiD[FD] | seems so |
15:07:10 | TiMiD[FD] | the plugins call a rb->PREFIX(readdir) |
15:07:27 | TiMiD[FD] | which is initialized to a pointer to the non cached version |
15:07:37 | GodEater | linuxstb and I feel it should be using the cached version |
15:07:40 | linuxstb | Yes, that's another complication - the protection in the sim. |
15:08:10 | TiMiD[FD] | should use readdir_cached instead anyway |
15:09:58 | TiMiD[FD] | readdir_cached is redefined to readdir on targets without dircache |
15:10:00 | TiMiD[FD] | so ... |
15:10:50 | TiMiD[FD] | actually in the plugin api both cached an non cached versions are present ... |
15:11:10 | TiMiD[FD] | doesn't makes sense |
15:11:24 | petur | pondlife: I observed that the last CD's I bought no longer contain the official CD logo. Philips once complained the protected cd's are not following the standard and should not carry the logo. The last disks did not contain CC however... |
15:11:30 | TiMiD[FD] | wouldn't be hard to fix |
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15:12:57 | TiMiD[FD] | some of them even make the test toknow whether to use dircache or not ... |
15:13:09 | PaulJam | petur: maybe those were "enhanced" CDs containing some bonus material. |
15:13:24 | GodEater | TiMiD[FD]: those are the ones which prompted the question :) |
15:13:32 | petur | TiMiD[FD]: what happens on targets without HAVE_DIRCACHE? |
15:13:45 | linuxstb | #define readdir_cached readdir |
15:13:47 | linuxstb | etc |
15:13:50 | TiMiD[FD] | :] |
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15:14:42 | TiMiD[FD] | so unless people want to make the disk spin uselessly this should be corrected :p |
15:15:07 | linuxstb | Unless there's something else going on we're not thinking of... |
15:15:08 | TiMiD[FD] | grep tells me 28 changes to make |
15:15:21 | * | linuxstb would prefer to ask Slasheri about it. |
15:15:23 | TiMiD[FD] | #ifdef HAVE_DIRCACHE while(0 != (entry = rb->readdir_cached(dir))) |
15:15:23 | TiMiD[FD] | #else while(0 != (entry = rb->readdir(dir))) |
15:15:23 | TiMiD[FD] | #endif |
15:15:39 | TiMiD[FD] | when I see that I wonder if there is something to understand ... |
15:15:53 | TiMiD[FD] | also opendir |
15:16:03 | TiMiD[FD] | vs opendir_cached |
15:16:16 | GodEater | properties.c ? |
15:16:17 | petur | aren't the structs different? |
15:16:20 | TiMiD[FD] | well all the api |
15:16:31 | TiMiD[FD] | it's wrapped |
15:16:50 | linuxstb | IMO, it would have been nicer to keep the POSIX API in apps/ and hide the fact that dircache versions are being used, rather than hide the POSIX API and use the dircache version... |
15:17:00 | pondlife | It's annoying that the app needs to specify the dircached API... why can't that be hidden lower down? |
15:17:00 | petur | true |
15:17:03 | * | GodEater agres |
15:17:08 | TiMiD[FD] | yep |
15:17:14 | TiMiD[FD] | could be fixed also |
15:17:35 | TiMiD[FD] | there are not so muchplaces which make use of dir reading |
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15:21:34 | Soap | desowin, can we remove your unsupported build since the patches have been commited? |
15:25:39 | petur | where? |
15:26:59 | TiMiD[FD] | linuxstb: if there is no objection, I could maybe fix that tmorrow during my boredom at work ... |
15:27:16 | TiMiD[FD] | use the posix api in the application |
15:27:42 | TiMiD[FD] | and rename the readdir to readdir_uncached for example ? |
15:28:40 | desowin | Soap: yes, please do it |
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15:33:16 | Soap | desowin, Loving QTScrobbler, one serious request, one half-hearted request. |
15:33:44 | Soap | Serious = Could you put the version number in "Help -> About"? |
15:34:34 | Soap | Half-hearted = How unethical would it be to have a (hidden?) option to force change a Skipped track to Listened? |
15:34:42 | linuxstb | TiMiD[FD]: I can't think of a reason why it would be bad, but I think we should double-check with Slasheri that there isn't a reason he didn't do that originally. Maybe it was simply so his code was less intrusive on the existing FAT code. |
15:35:10 | petur | maybe amiconn knows more... |
15:35:42 | TiMiD[FD] | well I'm going to bed anyway ... |
15:36:14 | TiMiD[FD] | amiconn know every parts of the rb code ;) |
15:37:00 | TiMiD[FD] | by the way increasing the main stack size of 0x50 fixes the stack overflow in the mpegplayer on the h1x0 |
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15:37:05 | TiMiD[FD] | should I commit that ? |
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15:39:03 | PaulJam | Soap: can't you achieve your second request by editing the .scrobble.log file? |
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15:41:14 | obo | Soap: or you can actually edit the items in the QTableWidget - but I'll add a version into the about window |
15:41:43 | obo | if desowin doesn't beat me to it ;) |
15:42:03 | TiMiD[FD] | obo: are you rewriting the rbutils with qt ? |
15:43:13 | desowin | TiMiD[FD]: I came with that idea, but I didn't started it yet |
15:43:37 | TiMiD[FD] | that would be nice :) |
15:43:39 | obo | TiMiD[FD]: no, but I've thought about it :) |
15:43:54 | TiMiD[FD] | I hate gtk |
15:44:02 | desowin | wx != gtk |
15:44:12 | TiMiD[FD] | wx is based on gtk |
15:44:19 | TiMiD[FD] | under linux |
15:44:28 | GodEater | I've not seen a wxQt module certainly |
15:44:34 | TiMiD[FD] | and qt is more sexy |
15:44:44 | TiMiD[FD] | from the programmer point of view |
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15:44:46 | indro_ | hi all |
15:45:00 | | Join XavierGr [0] (n=xavier@ppp226-117.adsl.forthnet.gr) |
15:45:08 | XavierGr | petur: ping |
15:45:11 | desowin | TiMiD[FD]: from c++ programmer point of view of course |
15:45:14 | indro_ | anyone using amarok? |
15:45:25 | TiMiD[FD] | of course |
15:45:26 | petur | XavierGr: I saw your reply, thanks for testing |
15:45:31 | XavierGr | ah okay nice |
15:45:31 | TiMiD[FD] | java is better anyway :) |
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15:45:39 | godzirra | heya guys. |
15:45:50 | XavierGr | petur: you've considered to buy an H115? |
15:45:53 | * | desowin stops as he would soon start flamewar |
15:46:11 | TiMiD[FD] | just kidding ... |
15:46:14 | godzirra | I've used rockbox a lot in the past and am getting ready to try it out on my sansa e280. If I decide I -don't- like it (unlikely, but still), can the rockbox boot loader be uninstaled? |
15:46:19 | godzirra | *uninstalled |
15:46:59 | desowin | indro_: well, it's rockbox channel, anyway, just state your question |
15:47:20 | petur | XavierGr: no, a fellow taper bought one as replacement for his broken h120 and wondered if he got a broken one. Our target table doesn't show this (must still edit the wiki) |
15:47:45 | indro_ | I dont know which modul I should take with ipod/rockbox. |
15:47:57 | indro_ | any idea? |
15:48:32 | desowin | there's no one which I'm aware of, just copy files directly |
15:48:39 | Kasperle | indro_: you mean, to have amarok use it as a "media device"? |
15:48:49 | XavierGr | does anyone know if H115 is flashable with rockbox? |
15:49:09 | desowin | someone would need to make amarok plugin to support rockbox database, it would be great |
15:49:10 | godzirra | I don't, but you can always exchange it if it gets bricked. }:) |
15:49:12 | XavierGr | petur: the result I got was with a very old build, though I think it doesn't matter |
15:49:59 | petur | XavierGr: it is a hardware thing, the plug power is always there (or not, so it seems) |
15:50:21 | indro_ | Kasperle: right |
15:50:33 | Kasperle | indro_: use the "generic audio player" |
15:50:58 | indro_ | Kasperle: okay, thx! |
15:51:01 | Kasperle | indro_: the iPod plugin is only useful if you used iTunes to transfer your music to the ipod |
15:51:26 | indro_ | never used iTunes. ;) |
15:51:30 | Kasperle | good :D |
15:51:36 | Kasperle | generic audio player it is, then :) |
15:54:16 | Soap | thanks for the tip obo |
15:54:21 | amiconn | TiMiD[FD]: The stack overflow needs to be fixed the proper way, i.e. by decreasing stack usage |
15:54:26 | Soap | I hadn't figured that one out. |
15:54:36 | TiMiD[FD] | a jvm plugin would be nice, I wonder if it's feasible |
15:55:15 | Kasperle | the java micro edition vm is hard enough to compile on full-blown platforms ;) |
15:55:24 | Kasperle | cvm or what's it called? |
15:56:12 | TiMiD[FD] | j2me ? |
15:56:43 | Kasperle | though it kind of worked on some pentium 166 linux box with ~ 64MB RAM or so |
15:57:09 | TiMiD[FD] | it works on my cellphone too |
15:57:28 | TiMiD[FD] | which for sure doesn't have 64mb of ram |
15:57:43 | TiMiD[FD] | with java going gpl ... |
15:58:15 | Kasperle | well, i wonder when sun will finally do that |
15:58:37 | TiMiD[FD] | amiconn: I was trying to figure out what was eating the stack, but unfortunately I gave up :/ |
15:58:40 | Kasperle | this is what i once used on a small embedded x86 board : http://java.sun.com/products/cdc/ |
15:59:13 | TiMiD[FD] | j2meis suposed to go gpl too |
15:59:49 | Kasperle | i think there's more than one j2me? |
15:59:52 | Kasperle | different "profiles"? |
16:00 |
16:00:08 | TiMiD[FD] | of course this wouldn't a work for people without a strong motivation |
16:00:18 | TiMiD[FD] | yes |
16:00:33 | * | petur would like to ban java from this channel |
16:03:16 | * | XavierGr hates java due to his stupid so called "java-professor" |
16:03:25 | TiMiD[FD] | ? |
16:03:45 | * | bluebrother hates java because of this stupid we-don't-need-pointers thing |
16:04:00 | TiMiD[FD] | oh |
16:04:20 | XavierGr | the final exam was writing GUI java programs by hand (in a text book) and of course I failed it :( |
16:04:25 | TiMiD[FD] | but java is a very nice ptograming language |
16:04:39 | * | petur sighs |
16:04:54 | * | bluebrother did some java recently and disagrees. |
16:05:05 | bluebrother | hey, how about some java coffee? ;-) |
16:05:20 | XavierGr | why should I learn by heart all those awt and swing objects anyway? but as I said my professor is brain dead |
16:06:13 | TiMiD[FD] | XavierGr: you would prefer to code your gui in asm pixel by pixel maybe ? |
16:06:40 | XavierGr | no I would prefer to code my gui program on a pc with an IDE (even in java) |
16:06:55 | XavierGr | but the teacher said to no to final exam in a PC |
16:07:06 | TiMiD[FD] | ah |
16:07:14 | TiMiD[FD] | you're lucky then ^^ |
16:07:24 | TiMiD[FD] | an exam on pc would take more time |
16:07:34 | XavierGr | yeah but way more easy |
16:07:41 | TiMiD[FD] | you don't do the debugging when programing on paper ... |
16:08:14 | * | petur had to write pascal and asm programs on paper for exams, with points lost for both compile errors and bugs |
16:08:16 | Kasperle | but you need to get it right without a debugger, too |
16:08:32 | Kasperle | my uni tought me modula-3 in year one |
16:08:37 | Kasperle | talking about useless crap |
16:08:39 | bluebrother | *aaargh* |
16:09:04 | bluebrother | some stupid script deleted the source files I created the last two days :( |
16:09:11 | XavierGr | ouch! |
16:09:52 | | Quit aliask ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.4/2007060115]") |
16:10:54 | TiMiD[FD] | bluebrother: have you tried to recover the file ? |
16:11:12 | bluebrother | well, I'm on a journaling file system ... |
16:11:23 | bluebrother | and the file is still present. It's just empty :( |
16:11:50 | TiMiD[FD] | ah so it was emptied ^^ |
16:12:56 | TiMiD[FD] | http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/File_Formats_Recovered_By_PhotoRec |
16:13:37 | | Quit indro (Remote closed the connection) |
16:13:49 | TiMiD[FD] | could have worked if you were able to remount the partition read only after the deletion ... |
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16:17:20 | TiMiD[FD] | amiconn: what do you think about the apps that doesn't use the dircache api ? |
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16:18:36 | amiconn | ? |
16:19:34 | TiMiD[FD] | hmm |
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16:20:09 | TiMiD[FD] | some apps as well as lots of plugins doesn't use the dircache api |
16:20:12 | * | amiconn wants to stay away as far as possible from java (re the java discussion) |
16:20:39 | amiconn | Afaiu apps don't need to use dircache specifically. It is used automatically when enabled |
16:20:42 | TiMiD[FD] | (they use readdir instead of readdir_cached for ex) |
16:21:17 | TiMiD[FD] | it's used when they call the api explicitely |
16:21:33 | TiMiD[FD] | if they call the old functions they don't use it |
16:21:43 | TiMiD[FD] | linuxstb noticed that |
16:22:14 | TiMiD[FD] | sounds more like a bug than something wanted in my opinion |
16:23:15 | amiconn | I have no idea. I though it was fully wrapped |
16:23:27 | * | amiconn wouldn't hesitate to drop dircache |
16:24:04 | TiMiD[FD] | it was also proposed that apps should use the posix api, eventually wrapped by dircache |
16:24:19 | amiconn | They do... |
16:24:22 | TiMiD[FD] | instead of calling directly the dircache functions (a cosmetic change) |
16:24:29 | TiMiD[FD] | ah no |
16:25:30 | TiMiD[FD] | they call dircache functions |
16:25:39 | TiMiD[FD] | for mostof them |
16:25:59 | * | amiconn suggests to ask Slasheri |
16:26:36 | TiMiD[FD] | well I'm going to bed anyway |
16:27:04 | amiconn | It might be that the 2 functions are due to the dircache api hiding the on-disk cache file |
16:27:14 | TiMiD[FD] | that would be something I could do tomorrow if I had approvement |
16:27:18 | amiconn | (only present with rockbox in flash on H1x0) |
16:27:52 | TiMiD[FD] | ? |
16:28:58 | amiconn | When rockbox is flashed, rockbox has full control over what happens on disk. So it writes the dircache contents to a file on shutdown, and reloads dircache from that file on next boot (if disk is clean, i.e. no intermediate usb access) |
16:28:58 | TiMiD[FD] | it would be more logical to present the posix api to the apps |
16:29:20 | amiconn | So readdir_cached() hides that file, but there must be a way to find it |
16:29:21 | TiMiD[FD] | yes I know that :) |
16:29:42 | TiMiD[FD] | but apps doesn't need to find it ... |
16:29:48 | amiconn | I would appreciate simplification here |
16:30:16 | amiconn | This cache-on-disk still sounds fishy to me, and hence should go away _imho_ |
16:30:17 | TiMiD[FD] | doesn't needs to be hidden too |
16:30:48 | TiMiD[FD] | if we don't store it on dsk where can we put it ? |
16:30:58 | amiconn | Nowhere. Just scan on boot |
16:31:08 | TiMiD[FD] | takes a lot of time ... |
16:31:11 | | Quit ansivirus ("Leaving") |
16:31:37 | amiconn | A lot? |
16:31:39 | TiMiD[FD] | for flashed units |
16:31:51 | TiMiD[FD] | yes |
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16:32:06 | amiconn | Maximum observed was ~1 minute. That was with a cache size near the imposed maximum |
16:32:07 | TiMiD[FD] | on disks filled with files |
16:32:14 | amiconn | But it's a background scan, so what? |
16:32:17 | | Part fred_88 |
16:32:26 | TiMiD[FD] | 1minute of disk activity at each startup is a lot |
16:32:32 | TiMiD[FD] | it eats battery |
16:32:43 | amiconn | With a sane amount of files, it's more like 10 seconds |
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16:33:23 | TiMiD[FD] | anyway this is hidden in the dircache subsystem so ... |
16:33:31 | TiMiD[FD] | the question was |
16:33:44 | amiconn | Anyway, dircache still shows numerous odd effects, and it's about the first thing to disable for me if it doesn't behave... |
16:34:02 | TiMiD[FD] | to know wether apps have to access the dirs without using dircache in some cases |
16:34:20 | amiconn | Ask Slasheri.... |
16:34:23 | TiMiD[FD] | yes |
16:34:31 | TiMiD[FD] | but he isn't here |
16:35:03 | amiconn | I don't know much about dircache interactions and implications, and I'm not interested enough in dircache to dig into it |
16:35:18 | TiMiD[FD] | it seems that people who are not aware of dircache program using the posix api, which makes sens |
16:35:28 | TiMiD[FD] | I understand that |
16:36:11 | TiMiD[FD] | the app layer would still be cleaner accessing dircache through the posix api |
16:36:36 | TiMiD[FD] | so if Slasheri could comment on that |
16:36:46 | TiMiD[FD] | anyway time to sleep |
16:38:09 | Slasheri | TiMiD[FD]: yes, the dircache should be wrapped directly over opendir and so on |
16:38:17 | TiMiD[FD] | ok |
16:38:37 | Slasheri | at beginning it wasn't stable enough to do that, but now it should be certainly possible |
16:38:54 | TiMiD[FD] | I"ll look into that later then |
16:39:01 | Slasheri | sounds good :) |
16:39:20 | linuxstb | Slasheri: So all the apps/ code currently using readdir() should be using readdir_cached() ? |
16:39:21 | TiMiD[FD] | what about apps accessing dirs without dircache ? |
16:39:23 | TiMiD[FD] | mistakes ? |
16:39:42 | * | petur wonders if that would further avoid spinups in the recording screen |
16:40:23 | Slasheri | linuxstb: most likely, but firmware/ code could be different |
16:40:42 | linuxstb | "most likely" ? ;) |
16:40:52 | TiMiD[FD] | so we would have the uncached api renamed to readdir_uncached in fw |
16:40:54 | Slasheri | and of course dircache itself can't use it's own readdir function :) |
16:41:08 | linuxstb | I'm purely talking about the apps/ code. |
16:41:11 | Slasheri | linuxstb: i think so, but haven't checked to make sure of that :) |
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16:41:18 | linuxstb | (including plugins) |
16:41:36 | Slasheri | linuxstb: yeah, then i see no reason why it couldn't be wrapped directly to readdir |
16:41:55 | linuxstb | Currently the plugin API exposes both readdir() and readdir_cached() (and related functions). It seems to be it should just expose readdir_cached() ? |
16:42:06 | linuxstb | (or the equivalent if they get renamed). |
16:42:15 | Slasheri | linuxstb: indeed, or just the readdir |
16:42:33 | TiMiD[FD] | doesn't sounds too heavy to change |
16:42:35 | Slasheri | and there could be some syscall if it _really_ would necessary to access the non-cached version directly |
16:42:40 | * | linuxstb thinks about bidding on a 1st gen ipod, currently 26 UKP on ebay with a few hours left |
16:42:42 | Slasheri | but i doubt that |
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16:43:02 | linuxstb | amiconn: Are you close to buying any 1st/2nd gen ipods/ |
16:43:03 | linuxstb | ? |
16:45:51 | amiconn | I'm trying to |
16:46:06 | amiconn | One 1st gen auction ends in <3 hours |
16:46:07 | linuxstb | Any idea what they are selling for? |
16:46:17 | amiconn | Not yet |
16:46:48 | amiconn | 3rd gen went for around 100EUR (both 20GB and 40GB) |
16:48:14 | linuxstb | The UK one I'm looking at is a 10GB first gen. I'm not sure how much I would be willing to pay though... |
16:49:35 | JdGordon | is the info in DeviceChart for the e200 correct? it says it has alarm wakeup and is 100mhz? |
16:52:57 | amiconn | PP5024 100MHz is correct as PP5024 is just a PP5022 with tacked on AS3514 |
16:53:14 | amiconn | But the of runs it at 80MHz |
16:53:23 | * | linuxstb spots a 20GB first gen with a buy it now price of 60UKP |
16:54:26 | amiconn | The 1st due 1st gen is at EUR40 atm (~2h 30 min to go) |
16:55:00 | godzirra | I've used rockbox a lot in the past and am getting ready to try it out on my sansa e280. If I decide I -don't- like it (unlikely, but still), can the rockbox boot loader be uninstalled? (Sorry if someone already answered this) |
16:55:32 | JdGordon | yes |
16:56:39 | godzirra | Oddly, there are almost no wps's for the E200 :/ |
16:57:58 | linuxstb | godzirra: http://www.rockbox-themes.org/index.php?res=176x220x16 |
16:59:49 | Kasperle | hrm. talking about wps's |
17:00 |
17:00:12 | godzirra | Ahh cool. thanks linuxstb |
17:00:13 | Kasperle | i need to look into why some themes i downloaded only set menu icons, fonts, colors, background image, but _not_ the wps |
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17:03:11 | Llorean | Kasperle: Usually this means they do try to set the wps, but there's bad context in the WPS so it fails. |
17:05:56 | amiconn | linuxstb: Do you know whether the 1st gens are single platter or dual platter. Or did they even use both? |
17:06:17 | XavierGr | amiconn: do you have an idea of what it takes to make the Ondio boot up automatically when someone plugs in the USB cable? |
17:06:37 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
17:06:41 | Kasperle | does rockbox like spaces in wps file (and dir-)names? also, what about DOS-style CRLF in wps files? these are the first two things I noticed |
17:07:26 | amiconn | dos line endings should be handled properly. Spaces in the path shouldn't matter |
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17:08:26 | nls | scorche: I read in the logs that you were handing out cloaks, I want one too :) |
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17:11:14 | XavierGr | if that's true I would want one too if it is no hassle for you :P |
17:12:44 | low_light | amiconn: on the pp5020, 0x70000000 should be "PP50"? |
17:13:28 | amiconn | nope |
17:13:35 | amiconn | This is wrong in the ipl wiki |
17:14:52 | low_light | good |
17:15:20 | amiconn | The PP5020E(space) string is actually a single "little endian string", i.e. it starts at 0x70000004 and extends to 0x70000000 |
17:17:24 | low_light | yes, that's what I was getting |
17:19:19 | linuxstb | amiconn: I have no idea (about 1st/2nd gen disks) |
17:20:22 | linuxstb | amiconn: ipodpatcher will need updating to work with the 1st/2nd gens though - the firmware partition format is different. But the old ipod_fw install method should work in the meantime. |
17:21:17 | amiconn | I hope you could help with adapting ipodpatcher? |
17:21:43 | linuxstb | Sure, even if I don't buy one, I can do it based on a disk image. |
17:22:14 | amiconn | We'll need firewire detection for the 1st gen/2nd gen |
17:22:17 | amiconn | Should be easy |
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17:22:36 | linuxstb | IIUC, the 3rd gen is also missing any kind of disk mode detection as well. |
17:22:46 | amiconn | The only thing I am uncertain about is whether we want a separate firewire screen or not |
17:23:41 | linuxstb | For devices with only a firewire connection, we could give them a different logo. But yes, I'm not sure about devices with both types of connection. |
17:24:00 | amiconn | E.g. the minis |
17:24:27 | amiconn | I know how to detect firewire and firewire power on mini 1st gen, mini 2nd gen, and the video (power only) |
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18:06:31 | * | The-Compiler hugs all the Rockbox-devs here - great work! |
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18:43:09 | iriver320user | hello everyone |
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18:52:55 | lazka | i just saw this on another channel: what about an IRC bot that posts new created bugs/patches and SVN commits? |
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18:54:34 | Llorean | lazka: Why not just use the RSS feeds instead of having it spam the channel? |
18:55:31 | lazka | that's a good point.. |
18:56:28 | * | dionoea sees a reason: runing IRC is easier than runing IRC + an RSS reader :) |
18:58:53 | * | amiconn sees no reason for either one |
18:59:06 | Soul-Slayer | Whats wrong with just looking at the front page? |
18:59:18 | amiconn | exactly what I a mthinking... |
19:00 |
19:00:28 | godzirra | So another question... Sansa E200 series is supported right? I assume I won't lose my music after installing rockbox since its al ready drag and drop? |
19:00:38 | Soul-Slayer | Correct |
19:01:10 | | Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
19:01:33 | godzirra | Awesomeness. Installing now then. |
19:01:38 | jhMikeS | amiconn: the sansa can be run at 100MHz? :) |
19:02:35 | | Join Ikuma [0] (i=u0402437@cm101.delta163.maxonline.com.sg) |
19:03:09 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Well, the CPU is specced for 100MHz. It might be that it gets too hot in the Sansa though |
19:03:25 | dionoea | Soul-Slayer: I think that it depends on the projects. Some projects don't use web interfaces a lot, so having other means of communication like commit emails or IRC messages help in keeping people up-to-date with what's happening. (plus you usually lurk on chans ... but don't reload the same webpage every 5 minute). But then that's only my pov. |
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19:03:57 | godzirra | Hrm... |
19:04:00 | godzirra | it says its installing. |
19:04:04 | godzirra | How long does it take to install |
19:04:05 | godzirra | ? |
19:04:18 | | Join relaxed [0] (n=relaxed@unaffiliated/relaxed) |
19:04:31 | godzirra | and does it display a message saying it was installed successfully? |
19:04:33 | Soul-Slayer | godzirra: Are you using rbutil or just unzipping? |
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19:04:49 | godzirra | I was using the sansapatcher found in the installation section |
19:04:58 | godzirra | huh... it just told me my device was disconnected. |
19:05:04 | godzirra | then connected again |
19:05:10 | Soul-Slayer | Oh of course, forgot that |
19:05:12 | godzirra | but sansapatcher said nothing after I hit "i" to install. |
19:05:22 | godzirra | Is that normal? |
19:05:30 | Kasperle | i think this channel is already pretty high-traffic. adding such a bot wouldn't really help |
19:06:04 | godzirra | ahh it just exited. |
19:06:10 | godzirra | and is now displaying a blue screen of death. :( |
19:06:26 | Soul-Slayer | Eject your sansa and try booting it |
19:06:34 | Soul-Slayer | If it boots into rockbox, it worked, otherwise it didn't, simple :P |
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19:06:43 | godzirra | I'm trying to now. It did boot the rockbox bootloader. |
19:06:44 | Kasperle | if people want it so much, you could have it sit in just a chan like #rockbox-commits or so |
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19:07:06 | Kasperle | as a compromise |
19:07:22 | godzirra | Whew. that ugly bluescreen after it finished instaling the bootloader was scary. |
19:07:29 | godzirra | might want to mention that on the manual :) |
19:07:43 | Soul-Slayer | I think it's probably a one off |
19:07:49 | Soul-Slayer | Otherwise someone would have sorted it out |
19:08:20 | Llorean | godzirra: What bluescreen? |
19:08:46 | Llorean | Like, what exactly did it say? |
19:09:29 | godzirra | Llorean: nothing. |
19:09:35 | godzirra | it looked like a "your thing has crashed" screen. |
19:09:36 | godzirra | it was blue |
19:09:42 | godzirra | and was kind of ...staticky. |
19:09:46 | godzirra | was very odd. |
19:09:51 | godzirra | Soul-Slayer: could be. |
19:10:38 | Llorean | That screen isn't usual. |
19:10:42 | godzirra | although I can't seem to extract the .rockbox directory to my player... |
19:10:53 | godzirra | what usb mode should it be in? |
19:10:53 | godzirra | for that? |
19:10:58 | Llorean | MSC |
19:11:10 | Llorean | It needs to be in MSC for everything Rockbox related. |
19:11:18 | godzirra | ok. |
19:12:02 | Soul-Slayer | dionoea: All very true, but this chat is more for discussing undocumented features and how devs could get feature such and such working, having all the commits posted up here would be kinda needless spam in my opinion. Another channel devoted to it, perhaps, if someone was interested in taking the time to get a bot to parse it all properly. But the rockbox main page refreshes incredibly fast, if I want to know I can find out |
19:13:11 | godzirra | An rss feed would be better for that imo. |
19:13:14 | | Quit linuxstb (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
19:13:19 | Soul-Slayer | Already exists doesn't it? |
19:13:22 | godzirra | That way anyone could subscribe and not have to be connected on irc. |
19:13:31 | dionoea | yeah, i agree for the rockbox case. People use the web interface / trackers a lot so it's ok. |
19:13:33 | godzirra | Oh. then a bot is totally unnecessary... again imho :) |
19:13:35 | Llorean | Yeah, there's an RSS feed for SVN changes, and an RSS for tasks added to the tracker. |
19:14:04 | dionoea | I was just mentioning why it could be useful to other projects. |
19:14:16 | Soul-Slayer | Or I suppose a bot that PMed you commits, if you requested it... |
19:14:22 | dionoea | (where most people complain when the bot unexpectedly quits :) ) |
19:16:15 | tumu | is HowToWriteCodecs wikipage uptodate? i was planning on adding .mod support using dumb lib |
19:18:26 | godzirra | Huh. |
19:18:33 | godzirra | After installing rockbox and rebooting into it... |
19:18:38 | godzirra | I got an error when plugging in usb. |
19:18:47 | godzirra | "One of the usb devices attached to this computer has malfunctioned" |
19:19:04 | godzirra | and no usb device popped up |
19:19:22 | godzirra | "and windows did not recognize it. For assistance in solving this problem, click this message. |
19:19:22 | tumu | doesn't support usb yet |
19:19:30 | godzirra | oh. |
19:19:33 | tumu | you have to use the old fw to upload files |
19:19:36 | godzirra | so I have to reboot into the .. ok. |
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19:22:05 | godzirra | Does it support the sd slot? |
19:22:43 | tumu | yes |
19:23:25 | godzirra | How can I check the status of usb? I assume its being worked on? |
19:24:03 | tumu | i don't know if anyone is working on it currently |
19:24:14 | godzirra | huh. |
19:24:44 | tumu | atleast i haven't noticed anything being done on it for past few months |
19:25:24 | dionoea | it's being worked on as a Google Sumer of Code project |
19:25:33 | Llorean | godzirra: It's the same case as the iPod USB. |
19:30:14 | godzirra | Llorean: Yeah, just irritating to have to reboot into sandisk firmware everytime. ;) |
19:30:39 | godzirra | with the ability to run in drag and drop usb mode, I may just stick with sandisks firmware until then. |
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19:31:31 | Llorean | Rebooting into Sandisk's firmware isn't exactly hard. |
19:31:40 | Llorean | 1. Turn off device. 2. Insert USB cable. |
19:32:38 | godzirra | oh, it boots up automatically if the usb cable is inserted? |
19:32:48 | tumu | is the codec compiling only supported in flat folders? |
19:33:07 | tumu | so do i need to take the original sources and put all necessary files in one folder? |
19:33:49 | Llorean | godzirra: Yes, and if the bootloader detects a usb cable it chooses to boot the retail firmware. Which will exit and reboot to Rockbox when you eject and unplug after transferring files |
19:36:03 | tumu | before i venture into hacking the codec main makefile into submission :) |
19:36:08 | godzirra | Llorean: ok, cool. it didnt reboot when I plugged it in, it just moved into a weird usb page that didnt actually work, so i didnt try that. |
19:36:15 | godzirra | but it was already on as well. |
19:36:31 | Llorean | Yes, once it's on you just get the USB logo and nothing happens. |
19:37:10 | godzirra | Yeah, thats what I was getting. |
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19:38:56 | tumu | no one who knows about the make procedure on codecs around? |
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19:39:38 | bluebrother | tumu: why do you want to build the codecs separately? |
19:39:49 | tumu | i want to add new codec |
19:40:01 | bluebrother | they need to match the build, so I don't see any reason why someone wants to build it on its own. |
19:40:12 | bluebrother | well, there is a wiki page about writing codecs. |
19:40:20 | tumu | the instructions on wiki are very terse |
19:40:35 | tumu | and what i can see from the actual rockbox sources, it needs more than the wiki says |
19:40:45 | saratoga | just decoded a 20kbps wma file in fixed point |
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19:40:58 | bluebrother | that's possible. I haven#t worked on codecs. |
19:41:01 | tumu | sure, i can waste time learning on how rockbox does it, but i thought if someone could tell me |
19:41:21 | tumu | or update the wiki |
19:41:27 | bluebrother | checked the KnowledgeMap wiki page? |
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19:41:40 | tumu | just the HowToWriteCodecs page.. |
19:41:42 | tumu | there is another? |
19:42:14 | bluebrother | well, this page holds (or should hold ;-) a list of names and their knowledge of Rockbox. |
19:42:45 | saratoga | tumu: you want to talk to linuxstb |
19:42:54 | bluebrother | according to that, preglow and Lear are your men. |
19:43:02 | saratoga | he did almost all of the wma API stuff for me |
19:43:09 | saratoga | since i couldn't figure it out |
19:43:32 | saratoga | what codec anyway |
19:44:06 | tumu | http://dumb.sf.net/ |
19:44:33 | bluebrother | ah, dumb. We had that in svn for a while. |
19:44:42 | Lear | Yep, pretty sure about that. |
19:44:48 | bluebrother | but as it wasn't working it got removed at some point. |
19:44:58 | tumu | well, i plan to get it working :) |
19:45:10 | saratoga | the old svn code might be useful |
19:45:24 | Lear | As for how to write a codec, best way is to look on a working one. |
19:45:28 | * | bluebrother was about to suggest the same |
19:46:04 | tumu | Lear, i can do that, just that it would speed things up knowing what i need to do |
19:46:21 | tumu | i'm not novice in coding :) |
19:46:55 | bluebrother | dumb was removed on 11th Dec. |
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19:48:06 | Lear | Hm, the wiki shows all places where information about the codec needs to be added. |
19:48:16 | bluebrother | tumu: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/codecs/dumb/?pathrev=11718 |
19:48:46 | tumu | Lear, do i flat the original sources to a single folder? |
19:49:18 | tumu | also do i need to copy and edit makefile from existing codec to make it compile? |
19:49:44 | bluebrother | tumu: check the old svn version −− it compiled those days |
19:49:54 | bluebrother | it just wasn't working as codec |
19:50:55 | tumu | hm |
19:51:09 | tumu | looks like that old svn only had the dumb sources added |
19:51:12 | tumu | nothing else done |
19:51:20 | tumu | missing makefiles/sources etc |
19:53:02 | bluebrother | well, the build process was building it. Removing dumb made compiling quite faster ;-) |
19:53:17 | tumu | it was? |
19:53:19 | tumu | how? |
19:53:37 | bluebrother | well, I don't know the details. I just remember that it was built. |
19:54:39 | tumu | hmm i see |
19:54:44 | tumu | the original makefile was hacked |
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19:55:41 | tumu | not sure if that is the current practise nowadays |
19:55:45 | tumu | i can do that tho :D |
20:00 |
20:00:17 | tumu | no comments? |
20:01:31 | bluebrother | well, either nobody objects or those who would do aren't around ;-) |
20:03:11 | tumu | yeah.. tho no use submitting patches if they don't conform to current practise |
20:03:50 | bluebrother | well, you could start with the old Makefile and ask later. If there are objections you'll always can adjust the Makefile |
20:04:26 | bluebrother | and as it worked that way I don't think there will be too big objections if you do it the same way. |
20:06:43 | tumu | maybe, tho the original makefile contains lot of crap not needed |
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21:01:39 | tucoz | bluebrother, are you here? |
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21:10:10 | tumu | hm, any reason why make is not entering new codec folder even when makefile, sources and edit of root codec makefile is done? |
21:11:49 | | Quit Phill () |
21:11:58 | tumu | only thing missing is the stub codec.c file in codec root |
21:12:20 | tumu | but i doubt that would prevent it compiling the actual codec sources |
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21:18:47 | tucoz | i think you have to change the configure script as well, but i might remember wrong |
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21:19:15 | tucoz | check the initial commit of the wma codec, what files were changed then |
21:25:05 | tumu | can't see anything relevant in configure |
21:25:32 | tucoz | tumu, ask linuxstb when he comes around. he has written several codecs |
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21:26:55 | tucoz | tumu, did you check what was committed in the wma-codec initial commit? otherwise, check out the july 3d on this page: http://www.rockbox.org/since-4weeks.html |
21:27:27 | tucoz | tumu, yeah, you have to add the codec to the codecs in configure |
21:28:05 | tumu | where is this line? |
21:28:17 | tucoz | http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/tools/configure?r1=13768&r2=13769 |
21:28:37 | tucoz | just check the diffs in the commit i mentioned ^^ |
21:29:25 | tumu | hmm? |
21:29:30 | tumu | my copy of tools/configure has no such |
21:30:17 | amiconn | tucoz: This was removed on Monday |
21:30:27 | tucoz | aha, sorry |
21:33:14 | amiconn | tucoz: http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi?view=rev&revision=13922 |
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21:33:29 | amiconn | This should tell you what's neede |
21:33:31 | amiconn | d |
21:33:47 | tucoz | amiconn, just took a peek on the frontpage of rockbox.org :) |
21:34:24 | amiconn | 3 days and still on the frontpage, tsss.... |
21:35:16 | tucoz | tumu, are you porting a new codec? |
21:35:36 | tumu | yeah |
21:35:53 | Ctcp | Ignored 5 channel CTCP requests in 2 minutes and 30 seconds at the last flood |
21:35:53 | * | amiconn received his H10 today :) |
21:35:59 | tumu | i must be doing something wrong as i have basically done the same as with wma codec |
21:36:02 | amiconn | Now for some more PP5020 hacking... |
21:36:22 | tucoz | tumu, cool. may i ask what codec that is? |
21:36:35 | tumu | http://dumb.sf.net/ |
21:36:51 | tumu | .mod support |
21:36:54 | tucoz | oh. we had that in rockbox earlier. that is, it compiled but didn't run |
21:37:03 | tumu | yes |
21:37:07 | low_light | tumu: did you add a SOURCES file to your codec directory? |
21:37:13 | tumu | i did add |
21:37:15 | Arathis | another dev with an h10 :3 |
21:37:25 | Arathis | amiconn: 5&gb or 20gb? |
21:37:29 | amiconn | 6GB |
21:37:57 | Arathis | glad they are not soo different .. |
21:38:21 | amiconn | I hope to be able to find out what's needed to make the radio work |
21:38:33 | tumu | make is not entering the folder and i'm not getting any errors either |
21:39:13 | amiconn | But first I need to install rockbox... |
21:39:20 | amiconn | ...on my target #9 :P |
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21:41:13 | Arathis | amiconn: is the freeze-error fixed allready? last time I checked it wasn't :( |
21:41:37 | Domonoky | amiconn: thats only 9 out of 23 targets . :-) |
21:41:44 | amiconn | yup |
21:41:59 | amiconn | I will (hopefully) receive target #10 out of 24 soon though :) |
21:42:11 | Domonoky | :-) |
21:42:59 | mbishop | Did anyone ever screw around with rockbox on a neuros? |
21:44:41 | GodEater | mbishop: there's a thread on the forums about it |
21:45:08 | mbishop | Ah, well I have a (slightly broken) neuros II if someone wanted to screw around with one |
21:45:22 | pixelma | also a bit of info here http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/NonArchos#Neuros (don't know how outdated this one is though) |
21:45:34 | GodEater | http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=11084.0 |
21:45:36 | * | jhMikeS is still waiting for word on an H10 deal :\ |
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21:46:50 | jhMikeS | amiconn: I ran into something interesting where calling sleep(0) from the COP caused a prefecth abort at C0EDBABE on e200. This could be telling of something. No idea what atm. |
21:46:53 | nls | tumu: have you seen this http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/5241 ? |
21:49:41 | nls | jhMikeS: minor nitpick, didn't you break the plugin api back compatiblity for single core swcodec targets without bumping bersion number ? |
21:49:43 | jhMikeS | amiconn: MpegPlayer has cross-core mailboxes now (not the PP built-in ones yet). Try testing that. |
21:50:20 | jhMikeS | nls: it only should break the compatibility with test_codec which isn't standard. nothing else should notice. |
21:50:42 | nls | jhMikeS: ah, ok :-) |
21:52:37 | amiconn | Bumping the api version wouldn't have hurt |
21:53:43 | tumu | nls, haven't tho i'd like it to support more formats and be accurate in its output |
21:54:07 | tumu | nls, so any old player sources aren't exactly what i'm looking for |
21:54:51 | amiconn | tumu: Ideally we want both (after the playback buffering rework) |
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22:00 |
22:00:47 | | Join low_light [0] (i=c730190b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-210b51045b4cb1af) |
22:02:29 | tucoz | tumu, i think dumb in rockbox would be excellent :) |
22:02:54 | tumu | well, the make is no cooperating with me, so have to wait for someone more details on it |
22:03:12 | | Quit Febs (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
22:03:42 | low_light | tumu: I thought dumb was full of mallocs and floats |
22:04:06 | tumu | could be |
22:04:21 | tumu | i have time to fix it |
22:04:22 | | Quit low_light (Client Quit) |
22:04:39 | | Join low_light [0] (i=c730190b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/labb.contactor.se/x-21a59441151a5c2d) |
22:07:27 | amiconn | Hmm, H10 USB is quite slow |
22:09:12 | | Quit pondlife ("night all") |
22:12:00 | amiconn | When did the time setting screen become so buggy? :( |
22:12:26 | nls | amiconn: could be my fault, what is the problem? |
22:12:53 | amiconn | The first letter of each part in the date line is cut off |
22:13:18 | bluebrother | tucoz: now I'm in. |
22:13:29 | amiconn | So I have to set "007 uly 9" if I want to set 2007 July 19 (and guess I got the missing parts right) |
22:14:10 | tucoz | bluebrother, hi. i read christis remarks on the manualstructuretalk page, but do not agree in full to what she has to say |
22:14:23 | nls | amiconn, I'll look into it, might have to do it tomorrow tho |
22:14:25 | tucoz | i agree that the manual should be simple (hence the quick start chapter) |
22:14:32 | amiconn | I think it depends on the font. Nimbus 10 here |
22:15:01 | tucoz | but other than that, i think the manual should be a reference on what rockbox has to offer |
22:15:01 | amiconn | hrrm |
22:15:04 | bluebrother | well, I also don't agree 100%. |
22:15:04 | | Quit jhMikeS (Connection reset by peer) |
22:15:08 | amiconn | Another JdGordon bug :( |
22:15:35 | bluebrother | IMO Rockbox is some highly technical thing, so we should be able assuming some basic knowledge by the user |
22:15:49 | bluebrother | including that he read about what it exactly is ;-) |
22:16:13 | tucoz | i especially don't find rockbox to be a highly complicated piece of software. it might have been in the past, but with the introduction of the main menu i find it quite intuitive and simple |
22:16:44 | tucoz | (with a wealth of complex options and configuration possibilities) |
22:16:46 | bluebrother | well, "highly complicated" also depends heavily on the technical background of the reader / user |
22:17:06 | nls | amiconn: ah, nasty assumption that monthnames are 3 letters, but I am quite sure that we assumed that before too, maybe it just dropped the last char then... (german uses longer names than english...) |
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22:17:22 | amiconn | It's not only the month... |
22:17:26 | tucoz | it does, but the main menu makes it quite intuitive, don't you think? |
22:17:32 | bluebrother | but it could be simpler. Like "browse wps" might be confusing, as users should always load complete themes |
22:17:39 | amiconn | And the _first_ char is missing, not the last |
22:18:00 | tucoz | yes, it could. but to play a track is quite easy |
22:18:10 | nls | amiconn: yes I noticed, will fix tomorrow, now sleep, gnight |
22:18:19 | bluebrother | the main menu adjust it more to the way other firmwares are doing it, i.e. it comes more to the way the user expects. |
22:18:19 | | Join jhMikeS [0] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS) |
22:18:21 | tucoz | it might be the customization that is hard. |
22:18:30 | tucoz | change font, wps etc |
22:18:57 | bluebrother | yes. But maybe we could think about shipping some standard configuration files, depending on the usage? |
22:19:09 | bluebrother | rbutil could even install a basic config.cfg |
22:19:19 | tucoz | i think we could/should |
22:19:37 | bluebrother | like give an installation option "install Ipod style configuration / Rockbox style" |
22:20:10 | tucoz | or call it optimized configuration ;) |
22:20:30 | bluebrother | that default configurations could be put somewhere on the download server, so we not even need to add something to the builds. |
22:20:37 | bluebrother | hmm, I'm starting to like that idea. |
22:21:12 | tucoz | i like it as well. we can configure it to use a pretty theme, turn on some sensible defaults and so on |
22:21:40 | bluebrother | yes. And I bet quite some Ipod users won't even bother looking at the settings ;-) |
22:22:13 | tucoz | and i don't think such an option would be too hard to convince the core devs of as well, as it doesn't interfere with the core rockbox |
22:22:22 | tucoz | i mean svn |
22:22:57 | bluebrother | as we have cfg files for the runtime settings now −− I think rbutil could safely do such things. |
22:22:57 | tucoz | but still provides newbies with something that sounds like a BoS, but doesn't look like it |
22:23:10 | bluebrother | without real objections ;-) |
22:23:14 | tucoz | yep |
22:23:16 | bluebrother | hehe. |
22:23:59 | tucoz | i wonder what a first time gigabeater thinks of the first boot into rockbox. the font must be almost invisible |
22:24:22 | bluebrother | "has it booted? Had something happened?" ;-) |
22:24:24 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
22:24:30 | | Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye") |
22:24:46 | tucoz | is there a wiki where we can discuss this? |
22:25:11 | bluebrother | maybe the RockboxUtility wiki page? |
22:25:19 | tucoz | and agree on certain aspects such as default theme etc |
22:25:44 | * | Domonoky detects talk about rbutil :-) |
22:25:56 | * | bluebrother waves at Domonoky |
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22:27:15 | bluebrother | I also had this idea of having rbutil only shipping a base functionality and plugins to add additional features |
22:27:29 | bluebrother | but I guess it isn't worth the work ... |
22:27:39 | tucoz | to strip out plugins? |
22:27:50 | bluebrother | no, plugins for rbutil. |
22:27:55 | tucoz | aha |
22:28:16 | Domonoky | qt has a plugin system, but wx... i dont know.. :-) |
22:28:18 | bluebrother | that way people could implement an unsupported builds plugin |
22:28:24 | tucoz | i think rbutil should be as simple as possible |
22:28:27 | bluebrother | Domonoky: I'm already playing around with Qt ;-) |
22:28:27 | tucoz | bluebrother, hehe |
22:29:00 | Domonoky | i also would like an rbutil in Qt.. but someone has to do the work :-) |
22:29:04 | bluebrother | but I haven't started with the network stuff. Wanted to do this today, but my tree crashed :( |
22:29:37 | bluebrother | well, atm it's mainly a programming exercise for me. Once I have the basic installation working (if I ever get that far) I'll release it somewhere |
22:30:14 | bluebrother | and then we'll see if there is enough interest / support in switching toolkits. |
22:30:15 | tucoz | that would be fun, and a nice opportunity to learn some qt |
22:30:27 | bluebrother | that's what I'm doing it for |
22:30:49 | bluebrother | learning a programming language without an interesting project isn't half as productive |
22:30:59 | tucoz | i spend to little time in linux these days, have to change that habit |
22:31:57 | ender` | whee, my sister's ipod mini died again |
22:32:00 | bluebrother | Domonoky: btw, I added a "Quick Start" page to rbutil. Is this worth to look into? |
22:32:55 | Domonoky | bluebrother: it would be nice if you could try to get the basic functions of rbutil in Qt.. like downloading function, unzipping.. settings ..usw and a GUI, then we could slowly port the rbutil functionality |
22:33:02 | | Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
22:33:16 | bluebrother | that was my intention. |
22:33:34 | bluebrother | but I'm quite new to Qt / cpp so it takes some time. |
22:33:53 | Domonoky | bluebrother: with Quick Start, you mean some help text to start ? |
22:34:18 | bluebrother | no, some buttons for a first start: "Full install", "basic install", "update" |
22:34:40 | bluebrother | so you don't have to install bootloader, build and fonts separately (but still can by using the installation tab) |
22:34:58 | Domonoky | ah, jeah thats nice.. it would also be worth to rethink to ui, if you are rebuilding it :-) |
22:35:50 | bluebrother | well, I'm currently using designer to create the gui, so changing shouldn't be much work. |
22:36:05 | bluebrother | (and I need to admit that I start to like the concept of designer) |
22:36:11 | tucoz | what version of qt are you developing in? |
22:36:18 | bluebrother | qt 4.3 |
22:36:22 | tucoz | ok |
22:36:27 | Domonoky | the momentary UI evolved with the features rbutil got, maybe there is a better way to arrange the UI.. |
22:37:18 | tucoz | the current UI works, but it feels like it could follow ui standards a bit more |
22:37:36 | bluebrother | in what way? More wizard-like? |
22:37:55 | Domonoky | it was wizard like, and it wasnt good :-) |
22:38:00 | * | amiconn wonders whether rockbox on H10 could reboot into OF like it does on ipod |
22:38:13 | bluebrother | I know ;-) |
22:38:17 | | Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder) |
22:38:28 | bluebrother | the wizard was too limited. |
22:38:29 | * | amiconn will put on some music and try to reproduce freezing effects |
22:39:35 | bluebrother | hmm, what's the default port of svn? |
22:40:00 | ender` | depends on server |
22:40:11 | Domonoky | google tells me default is 3690 ;:-) |
22:40:31 | ender` | 80 if it's through http/webdav, 443 if it's https, no idea what the svnserve is |
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22:41:46 | jhMikeS | amiconn: any chance you are going to want to try "the patch" any time in the near future? lemme know and I'll resync. |
22:42:07 | | Quit andrew__1 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
22:42:10 | | Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
22:43:04 | amiconn | "the patch"? |
22:43:28 | jhMikeS | that core lock one |
22:44:17 | amiconn | Hmm |
22:44:30 | amiconn | I tried it on mini 1st gen, where it didn't work |
22:44:37 | amiconn | Did you change something meanwhile? |
22:44:44 | bluebrother | Domonoky: you're working on windows, right? |
22:44:48 | * | ender` yawns |
22:44:57 | Domonoky | yes.. |
22:45:18 | | Quit Tr1ckY ("( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )") |
22:45:24 | Domonoky | but that shouldnt be a problem with Qt.. |
22:45:44 | | Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out) |
22:45:57 | bluebrother | no −− I was just thinking if I can get some scm running on that uni box. But I'm only a user on that machine. |
22:45:58 | jhMikeS | amiconn: no, since there's no reason I've found it shouldn't. it might need a resync and that's all. |
22:46:14 | bluebrother | and my local machine isn't accessible from the internet (except via ipv6) |
22:46:14 | amiconn | hmm |
22:46:29 | | Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
22:47:08 | jhMikeS | since, I've managed to find a way to blow up PP5024, I guess I have something to work on in the meantime in the scheduler |
22:47:10 | | Join relaxed_ [0] (n=relaxed@unaffiliated/relaxed) |
22:48:13 | | Part nls |
22:49:59 | | Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
22:50:42 | amiconn | jhMikeS: Blow up PP5024?? |
22:51:04 | Domonoky | bluebrother: hm, maybe some can provide us with a svn for rbtutilQT, or maybe a branch in the rockbox svn .. :-) |
22:51:22 | jhMikeS | I called sleep(0) from the COP thread in mpegplayer ... prefetch abort at C0EDBABE :) |
22:51:34 | amiconn | AH, that one |
22:51:34 | Bagder | Domonoky: why a branch, why not just a different subdir? |
22:51:45 | * | amiconn wonders where rockbox uses that magic |
22:51:52 | bluebrother | I was also thinking about git, but I don't think that is an option on windows. |
22:51:57 | jhMikeS | it's build into the pp hardware |
22:52:00 | Domonoky | Bagder: that would also work.. perhaps its better.. :-) |
22:52:08 | Bagder | no need to complicated it, imho |
22:52:09 | jhMikeS | that one and CACAD0D0 |
22:52:11 | | Join relaxed__ [0] (n=relaxed@adsl-18-65-14.sdf.bellsouth.net) |
22:52:12 | Bagder | complicate |
22:52:17 | amiconn | lol |
22:52:44 | * | amiconn wants b490f517 |
22:53:08 | * | Domonoky could use git in the the vm with linux.. but thats another scm for me to learn :-) |
22:55:18 | saratoga | anyone know when preglow will be back? |
22:55:43 | jhMikeS | hehe |
22:55:54 | | Part tucoz ("god natt") |
22:56:06 | * | bluebrother starts windows |
22:56:45 | jhMikeS | CACAD0D0 reads out from meaningless registers it seems and the other trying to execute from somewhere |
22:57:12 | * | Domonoky goes sleeping |
22:57:15 | amiconn | Hmm, meaningless registers is usefull |
22:57:17 | amiconn | -l |
22:57:31 | amiconn | Maybe I should try to make a register map |
22:57:41 | | Quit Domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
22:58:08 | | Quit RaRe (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) |
22:58:18 | jhMikeS | I've used that to map small areas. C0EDBABE seems related to "coprocessor" somehow (of course) |
22:58:41 | Llorean | I've gotten C0EDBABE in the past |
22:58:58 | Llorean | I'm trying to remember when though |
22:59:21 | * | jhMikeS remembers but not re: pp chips :) |
22:59:52 | Llorean | I think it was iPod Nano, actually |
23:00 |
23:00:06 | Llorean | Yeah, it was |
23:00:11 | | Quit linuxstb (Remote closed the connection) |
23:00:12 | Llorean | DEADBEEE and C0EDBABE on the Nano |
23:00:26 | jhMikeS | DEADBEEE ? |
23:00:31 | | Join linuxstb [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb) |
23:00:53 | Llorean | Yeah |
23:01:01 | Llorean | It may have been "DEADBEEF" and I read wrong, though |
23:01:02 | jhMikeS | never seen that |
23:01:05 | | Join Davide-NYC [0] (n=chatzill@user-12hdtj8.cable.mindspring.com) |
23:01:05 | | Quit desowin ("use linux") |
23:01:14 | * | linuxstb got distracted this evening and missed a 1st gen ipod sell on ebay for 26UKP :( |
23:01:23 | Llorean | It was a prefetch abort. |
23:01:53 | Llorean | It was a bug relating to voice. |
23:01:56 | jhMikeS | maybe that's shown from the CPU? (guess) |
23:02:14 | | Part low_light |
23:03:02 | Llorean | If I recall the address was deemed to be coincidental (or at least, unrelated to the actual problem) |
23:03:04 | Llorean | So yeah. |
23:03:47 | | Quit relaxed__ ("http://www.zsnes.com/") |
23:03:49 | | Quit relaxed (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) |
23:04:32 | | Quit relaxed_ (No route to host) |
23:04:43 | | Join stripwax [0] (n=Miranda@i-83-67-214-206.freedom2surf.net) |
23:04:54 | Davide-NYC | Has anyone thought about implementing UNILINK functionality into rockbox? |
23:05:06 | pixelma | Davide-NYC: re. forum post - the owner of the FM recorder doesn't have so much choice in "encodings" - only "quality" (but channels, different input too) - just fyi |
23:05:09 | Davide-NYC | I searched the logs and found a couple of quick references |
23:05:27 | | Join RaRe [0] (n=Laffin_B@202-89-187-101.static.dsl.amnet.net.au) |
23:05:47 | pixelma | atm - there is a wavrecord plugin too, though |
23:05:50 | * | GodEater directs linuxstb at his messages in the forum |
23:05:50 | Davide-NYC | pixelma: Hopefully "old yeller" will figure it out |
23:06:36 | linuxstb | Davide-NYC: What's UNILINK ? |
23:06:44 | | Quit thegeek (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) |
23:06:46 | *** | Saving seen data "./dancer.seen" |
23:06:53 | Davide-NYC | unlink is a sony CD changer communication protocol. |
23:06:53 | stripwax | sony interconnect protocol? |
23:06:56 | Davide-NYC | yeah |
23:07:06 | Davide-NYC | gnunilink exists (open source) |
23:07:15 | stripwax | neat |
23:07:15 | pixelma | I really didn't want to post in that thread anymore... |
23:07:31 | Davide-NYC | and there is this (anciant) page of a rockbox player controlling a sony Head Unit |
23:07:40 | Davide-NYC | http://sophana.free.fr/pmwiki2/ |
23:07:43 | stripwax | mmm, not the other way around? |
23:07:57 | Davide-NYC | stripwax: yes, the other way around, sorry |
23:08:15 | stripwax | very cool |
23:08:21 | * | stripwax would find two uses for this! |
23:08:55 | Davide-NYC | I just bought a POS car that has such a stereo unit |
23:09:33 | stripwax | I have an old spare |
23:09:35 | amiconn | hrrrm |
23:09:50 | amiconn | It's impossible to leave the audio debug screen on H10 |
23:10:38 | | Quit mirak ("Ex-Chat") |
23:10:45 | linuxstb | GodEater: What messages? |
23:10:55 | | Quit Wiwie ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org") |
23:11:03 | Davide-NYC | stripwax: in theory could this be done without having to cobble together a GNUnilink dongle? |
23:11:06 | stripwax | Davide-NYC - so, how would unilink "in rockbox" work? you'd have to have a physical interface between the rockbox-enabled DAP and the sony headunit |
23:11:29 | Davide-NYC | well I was thinking the remotes maybe? |
23:11:41 | GodEater | linuxstb: on the forum ? |
23:11:46 | stripwax | ok, so you still need to build that interface |
23:11:47 | GodEater | I sent you one earlier |
23:11:50 | stripwax | ^you would |
23:12:01 | Davide-NYC | OK, not the end of the world |
23:12:03 | stripwax | ipod remote support is not even in rockbox yet |
23:12:33 | GodEater | at least I thought I did |
23:12:36 | tumu | linuxstb, is there anything particular to do to have make compile new codec sources? |
23:12:43 | GodEater | if you haven't got it - I've no idea where it's gone |
23:13:07 | | Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur) |
23:13:27 | Davide-NYC | stripwax: I know, neither is the gigabeat port stuff. But there is always a beginning. |
23:13:34 | linuxstb | GodEater: Ah, private message ;) |
23:13:47 | GodEater | sorry yes |
23:14:20 | linuxstb | tumu: Did you create a .c file for your codec in apps/codecs/ ? I read the logs, and maybe your lib isn't being built because no target is depending on it. |
23:14:41 | tumu | linuxstb, i have not done that, only added the sources |
23:14:48 | tumu | is it dependent on that? |
23:15:07 | tumu | won't try to compile the codec sources without root .c? |
23:15:41 | linuxstb | tumu: But my approach to porting codecs has always been to get it working as a standalone C program first, and working in the Rockbox way - i.e. no (or very limited) malloc, no floats, and processing data from a memory buffer rather than reading from dsk directly. |
23:15:59 | Davide-NYC | I'm going to drop a feature request on the tracker for this Unilink stuff. |
23:16:22 | linuxstb | tumu: Only after I've done that (which is far easier outside of Rockbox), would I try to integrate it. |
23:16:28 | tumu | linuxstb, well, if i only could get it to error out because of original sources |
23:16:49 | tumu | it is not recognizing it currently at all |
23:17:04 | tumu | not much sense in doing work on the sources if compiles don't do anything |
23:17:11 | * | amiconn notices that the H10 lcd is (somewhat) readable without backlight :) |
23:17:18 | tumu | that is, not even giving errors :) |
23:17:19 | stripwax | Davide-NYC - mm, isn't the feature a hardware one? |
23:17:39 | stripwax | DAPs don't usually have a freeform-serial output/input |
23:17:39 | Davide-NYC | maybe. I must be missing something |
23:18:00 | Soul-Slayer | amiconn: Only in broad daylight at the right angle :p |
23:18:25 | amiconn | Fluorescent light only atm... |
23:18:34 | Davide-NYC | so some hardware has to be designed to convert the unilink data to the dap's remote codes for the corresponding functions? |
23:18:45 | | Quit dandin1 () |
23:18:55 | * | Davide-NYC confused (as usual) |
23:19:12 | scorche | tumu: http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/HowToWriteCodecs |
23:19:16 | Soul-Slayer | Must be somewhat intense then, I can only just make out the seek bar on mine in my artificial likght |
23:19:39 | | Quit GodEater ("User pushed the X - because it's Xtra, baby") |
23:19:43 | tumu | scorche, read it, it is not current |
23:20:09 | scorche | hrm.... hcs seemes to be using it just fine a bit ago... |
23:20:51 | tumu | my problem is that the new sources are not getting compiled |
23:21:03 | tumu | even after adding supposedly all necessary changes |
23:21:18 | stripwax | Davide-NYC - yep, and that's what gnunilink seems to be - the hardware |
23:21:27 | tumu | which are more than what the wiki page tells |
23:21:33 | Llorean | tumu: There's a GBS patch in the tracker, you could look at what it does. |
23:21:47 | Llorean | tumu: Also, will you be updating the wiki page then with the things you've discovered need to be added? |
23:22:17 | tumu | if i can get this working first :) |
23:22:55 | linuxstb | tumu: What have you added to apps/codecs/Makefile? |
23:23:16 | * | jhMikeS wonders why encoders aren't included in that wiki page. it's similar. |
23:23:17 | tumu | made a copy of existing codec entries |
23:23:27 | tumu | and edited accordingly |
23:23:29 | saratoga | linuxstb: I decoded a 20kbps WMA file with only a tiny bit of distortion |
23:23:35 | saratoga | getting close |
23:23:44 | tumu | only thing i'm missing is the root stub for codec |
23:23:53 | linuxstb | sarataga: Bet they sound great :) But congratulations. |
23:24:08 | | Join dandin1 [0] (n=dandin1@bas7-ottawa23-1088834758.dsl.bell.ca) |
23:24:37 | linuxstb | tumu: Yes, but did you add a line such as "$(OBJDIR)/mpa.elf : $(OBJDIR)/mpa.o $(BUILDDIR)/libmad.a $(OBJDIR)/codec_crt0.o" - i.e. one that specifies your library needs to be built. |
23:24:52 | * | jhMikeS just remembered adding encoders is way more complicated than decoders :P |
23:25:12 | * | linuxstb just greps the entire source for "flac" and does the same thing for any new codec |
23:26:28 | tumu | linuxstb, yes, i added such, made a copy of the spc codec ones |
23:28:00 | linuxstb | And added your codec .c file to apps/codecs/SOURCES ? |
23:28:13 | linuxstb | If not, then it won't appear in the list of targets to build. |
23:28:16 | tumu | i have not done that |
23:28:20 | linuxstb | And hence your lib won't be built. |
23:28:22 | tumu | because i still don't have the stub .c |
23:28:26 | tumu | aha |
23:28:32 | tumu | so it is dependent on the stub .c |
23:28:51 | linuxstb | Yes - look at the "all:" line in the Makefile, and work back from there. |
23:29:16 | amiconn | 'make' is lazy, and only builds what's necessary for the explicit final output(s) |
23:29:19 | linuxstb | i.e. all: specifies $(ROCKS), which is simply the .c files listed in SOURCES, renamed from .c to .codec |
23:29:34 | tumu | linuxstb, can you update the wiki page about making codecs then? :) |
23:29:51 | tumu | could have saved some time knowing this |
23:30:19 | scorche | tumu: that /is/ in that page... |
23:30:51 | | Join Wiwie [0] (n=goddi@p5B09BE75.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
23:30:57 | tumu | it doesn't say anything about adding folders of source |
23:31:14 | tumu | only about one source file |
23:31:14 | amiconn | Hmm. The H10 freeze isn't a plain freeze, it seems |
23:31:50 | | Join SirFunk [0] (n=Sir@cpe-74-71-205-222.twcny.res.rr.com) |
23:32:36 | Soul-Slayer | A flavoured freeze you mean :o? Please say it's chocolate :O |
23:33:00 | tumu | linuxstb, ya, working nicely now |
23:33:09 | tumu | just as expected |
23:33:23 | stripwax | amiconn - sometimes i find ipod 5g debug menu can't be quit too |
23:33:32 | tumu | linuxstb, thanks for your input |
23:34:07 | | Join thegeek [0] (i=thegeek@ti521110a080-10519.bb.online.no) |
23:34:46 | Davide-NYC | For the core devs: Is there the potential for having serial IO (with or without hardware modification) on all rockboxable players? |
23:35:04 | Davide-NYC | If not, which ones would be left out? |
23:35:31 | bluebrother | Davide-NYC: h100 and h300 don't have a serial port exposed |
23:35:44 | bluebrother | Ipods have one, and afaik archos too. |
23:35:44 | stripwax | bluebrother - but with a mod they could have.. |
23:35:51 | bluebrother | don't know about other players. |
23:36:02 | Soul-Slayer | Do ANY players have one exposed o.0? |
23:36:07 | bluebrother | indeed, you could mod it. But where to put the connector? |
23:36:17 | bluebrother | yes, Ipods. Though the dock connector |
23:36:24 | Soul-Slayer | Ah right |
23:36:38 | Soul-Slayer | Well I'm sure my gigabeat and H10 don't have one |
23:36:39 | bluebrother | and afaik the archos uses a serial connection for their remote. Don't know which ones exactly though |
23:36:45 | Soul-Slayer | Not that I have a cradle for my H10 though |
23:37:41 | Davide-NYC | bluebrother: on the bottom plate? |
23:38:01 | | Quit davina (Remote closed the connection) |
23:38:02 | Davide-NYC | maybe between the reset and power plug? |
23:38:21 | bluebrother | I'm not sure if this would work nicely. But it might be possible. |
23:39:59 | Davide-NYC | replace the mini usb with a mini usn a/b(five pins |
23:39:59 | linuxstb | Couldn't you use a USB serial adapter on the H300? |
23:40:28 | * | Davide-NYC doesn;t have an H300 anymore so couldn't say |
23:41:19 | | Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)") |
23:42:04 | stripwax | linuxstb - would rockbox support that? |
23:42:18 | Davide-NYC | there are five connectors on the mini usb plug currently. AFAIK only four are connected and used. does that extra pin help us or are we a pin short? |
23:42:24 | XavierGr | strange I tried to build the rtc build and it stopped with an error on libwma |
23:42:43 | linuxstb | stripwax: When Rockbox has USB support, yes... |
23:42:45 | amiconn | Soul-Slayer: A plain freeze would mean the H10 just stops responding and playing, but display content stays the same |
23:43:11 | pixelma | XavierGr: when did you last reconfigure - had that too today with a sim |
23:43:19 | amiconn | And the latter isn't the case. |
23:43:26 | XavierGr | I just reconfigured |
23:43:33 | XavierGr | now I am trying with make very clean |
23:43:52 | amiconn | Reconfigure + make clean should work |
23:43:52 | XavierGr | yup that did the trick |
23:44:26 | XavierGr | time to see if the RTC mod works on my player |
23:44:47 | * | amiconn has a suspicion when these freezes happen |
23:44:49 | XavierGr | I am pretty scared about it |
23:45:32 | | Quit Xerion (" ") |
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23:47:03 | | Quit Jens () |
23:47:06 | stripwax | XavierGr - if your iriver works in OF you have nothing to be scared of :) |
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23:47:44 | Davide-NYC | no serial on the iaudio X5? |
23:48:23 | | Quit midkay ("Leaving") |
23:49:53 | pixelma | bluebrother: not all Archos have a remote - the Ondios don't, not sure about the Player |
23:50:43 | amiconn | Only the Player and the Recorder v1 can use the archos remote |
23:51:42 | | Quit jhMikeS ("Meow!") |
23:51:47 | amiconn | The FM recorder and recorder v2 can't (no 4th contact in the headphone socket), and the Ondios couldn't even be modded to use it |
23:52:16 | amiconn | The 2nd serial of the SH1 in the Ondio is occupied by the MMC interface |
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23:55:15 | | Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC") |
23:55:30 | | Quit pixelma (" brb") |
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