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#rockbox log for 2007-09-19

00:00:20Bagderyeah, done
00:00:43n1sMaybe this warrants a news item to be posted?
00:03:38 Quit ender` (" Where there's a will, there's an inheritance tax.")
00:05:51Thundercloudlinuxstb: You've got the 2nd gen nanos working?
00:06:40Bagderit is mentioned as not supported on the front page
00:06:46ThundercloudI didn't read up
00:06:49Bagderand now the 3rd gen is also mentioned there
00:07:05Thundercloud[22:52] <linuxstb> Bagder: Yep. And I guess we can add 1g/2g to the front page. <−− misread that :)
00:08:45 Part SofianBabai
00:09:59 Join RudMan [0] (
00:13:19 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
00:15:39 Join iamben [0] (
00:17:35 Join My_Sic [0] (
00:18:59 Part n1s
00:22:36 Join hardeep [0] (
00:23:15 Join akaias [0] (
00:24:48 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
00:30:34 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC")
00:33:52 Join DavidGWRawson [0] (i=18eddffa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:34:04DavidGWRawsonHello everyone.
00:34:52DavidGWRawsonIs there anything I can do to speed up rockboy? There is nothing in the wiki about it.
00:36:52markunDavidGWRawson: by programming you mean?
00:38:04markunDavidGWRawson: iBoy seams to be faster, maybe you can take a look at the source
00:38:25Bagderthey're both based on the same original code
00:38:42DavidGWRawsoniBoy is only for ipod, right?
00:38:56markunBagder: so that only makes it easier to spot the differences
00:39:12 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (
00:39:24Bagdermarkun: in theory, yes but I've done diffs on them... and it's not just a few small changes
00:40:12linuxstbThere's an ARM assembler CPU emulator core - that may help. Plus in my experience, the LCD updates are a big bottleneck, so they could be optimised.
00:41:01 Quit hannesd ("Client suicide")
00:41:33DavidGWRawsonI'm wondering what new emulator you would like to see on rockbox.
00:42:06markunDavidGWRawson: we're setting up this page:
00:42:14linuxstbWasn't there a lot of work done on a C64 emulator?
00:42:23Bagderyeah there once was
00:42:45DavidGWRawsonIf an emulator works well enough, will it be added to the main builds?
00:43:00linuxstbAs long as you don't tell bluebrother and Llorean, yes.
00:43:29DavidGWRawsonthen let's be quiet then
00:43:48 Join oranges2 [0] (
00:44:21DavidGWRawsonI see snes emulators have legal issues. You could just say they run on public domain roms...
00:44:48markunit's not the roms which are the problem
00:44:59DavidGWRawsonIt's the system itself?
00:45:18markunyou are talking about the snes9x license, right?
00:45:41DavidGWRawsonEmulators have licenses?
00:45:44linuxstbThe emulator itself has a license which prohibits commercial use - i.e. someone selling it. Rockbox's license doesn't have such a restriction.
00:46:11oranges2The person who makes the emulator can choose to release it under a license
00:46:16oranges2@ DavidGWRawson
00:46:29 Join Guile` [0] (n=Guile@
00:46:47DavidGWRawsonWhat if you use an open source emulator, such as snesDS.
00:47:24oranges2What mp3 player would be able to handle a SNES emulator?
00:47:43DavidGWRawsonAny with an efficient emulator.
00:47:50iambeni dunno about that
00:47:51oranges2Wtf does that mean
00:47:58oranges2"Any with an efficient emulator?"
00:48:01iambenmy 200mhz arm9 struggles with it
00:48:02DavidGWRawsonControls would be a problem.
00:48:08 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
00:48:25oranges2It isn't happening
00:48:33iambeni doubt my sansa's 75mhz arm-something would be very happy
00:48:39oranges2I don't even think the iPod Touch can handle it
00:48:44oranges2Though I'm not sure of the specs on that
00:49:20DavidGWRawsonIt would take alot of effort to make it even work. And then it would be boringly slow.
00:50:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:50:28DavidGWRawsonAtari seems like it would work nicely. The atari's processor runs about 1.2MHZ. Plus, controls would be perfect. One button, four directions.
00:50:37markunoranges2: what makes you say that then?
00:50:57markuniamben: the Gigabeat has a 296MHz ARM9
00:51:16oranges2Nevermind what I said
00:51:23oranges2I just looked it up and it has a 400mhz ARM
00:52:03oranges2Although I assume we aren't talking about the iPod touch
00:52:05 Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
00:52:09oranges2Since this is a Rockbox channel
00:52:18oranges2I walked in late on the conversation :[
00:52:34alienbiker99if the S gets a port i think it has 533mhz but i don't know what kind
00:53:06DavidGWRawsonvMac would be nice, but hard. Very, very hard.
00:53:09iambenmarkun: then i imagine it'd run well =)
00:53:16tumuhm, is there any easy way to display debug output on sansa?
00:53:28DavidGWRawsonYea, debug.
00:53:58DavidGWRawsonDo you mean summarize the debug info?
00:54:05bluebrotherlinuxstb: checks for docs/VERSION
00:54:18tumuwhen i run code on actual sansa
00:54:33tumutrying to debug new codec
00:54:54DavidGWRawsonWhat new codec?
00:54:55oranges2Anyone have input on this problem I'm having with the bootloader?
00:54:57tumuthe debug code in rockbox seems to use serial comm
00:55:16DavidGWRawsonYes oranges2
00:55:36DavidGWRawsonI know how. I have a sansa with that problem.
00:55:36linuxstbtumu: Yes, debug mode is only supported in the sim and a small number of real targets - none of the portalplayer ones.
00:55:52DavidGWRawsonI fixed it.
00:55:56bluebrotheryou can put any string you like to appear as version information in that file
00:56:09linuxstbbluebrother: Ah, is that just for the main build, or bootloaders? In any case, "make VERSION=moo" works.
00:56:34DavidGWRawsonDualbooting, oranges2?
00:56:35bluebrotherI don't think the bootloaders use for version information. But I haven't checked ...
00:57:06oranges2I just used the sansapatcher, dual booting with Rockbox and the original firmware
00:57:14linuxstbbluebrother: It looks like that would work too. But just passing it to make is easier.
00:57:30bluebrotherwell, if that works too that's fine.
00:57:54bluebrotherI forgot checking the bootloaders when changing the version string to the svnversion output :o
00:59:38 Nick oranges2 is now known as Urza (
00:59:58 Nick Urza is now known as oranges2 (
01:00:38linuxstboranges2: Regarding your forum post - did the OF boot OK after you restored it?
01:00:51 Quit obo ("bye")
01:01:07linuxstboranges2: Ignore me, I just read the first post, not the whole thread...
01:01:34DavidGWRawsonOranges2, I posted on your thread.
01:01:35tumuwould it be easy to hook to one of the gui splash functions?
01:02:03oranges2DavidGWRawson: could you the file?
01:02:10tumuor are there restrictions
01:03:10Lloreanlinuxstb: So long as it's an SNES emulator I'll look the other way and save my whining about it for at least 12 months after inclusion. :-P
01:03:13linuxstbtumu: Does your code work OK in the sim?
01:03:23 Quit Guile`` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:03:52tumui haven't used sim yet
01:03:59tumuso no idea
01:04:02DavidGWRawsonOranges2, what OS are you running.
01:04:27linuxstbtumu: I would strongly recommend it - it's much easier to debug in the sim.
01:04:33oranges2DavidGWRawson: XP
01:04:39linuxstb(just use DEBUGF to write output to the console)
01:04:49oranges2DavidGWRawson: I need some sort of Linux to run the e200tool right?
01:04:59tumuis there any docs on how to use the sim?
01:05:50DavidGWRawsonLinux can be run from a live cd, such as ubuntu. You can download it.
01:05:55preglowamiconn: did we ever agree whether to kill the hw eq and implement the functionality as bass/treble controls?
01:06:01 Join eigma [0] (
01:06:35oranges2DavidGWRawson: I have some among the 500 unlabeled DVDs on my desk....
01:06:48linuxstbpreglow: I thought that was already done (I could be wrong though)
01:06:56preglowreally, now
01:07:27preglowmenu code is still there
01:07:30 Quit bluebrother ("need some sleep ...")
01:07:31linuxstbAh no, just a patch from safetydan -
01:08:02Lloreanpreglow: I think it was agreed upon to do that, yes.
01:08:04preglowwell, i think someone with an ipod video should check that patch out for sure
01:08:20LloreanWeren't there some technical hurdles? Something about sample rates?
01:08:44preglowLlorean: i don't see how that's a hurdle, all our targets are affected by differing filter response for different sample rates
01:08:48preglowi assume that's what you mean anyway
01:09:28DavidGWRawsonAwww. It only works for e200"r". Sorry oranges2....
01:09:45Lloreanpreglow: I just remembered discussion of it, and that topic came up.
01:10:44DavidGWRawsonAnd I don't want you to brick your player because of me.
01:12:10preglowoh well, bedtime anyway
01:12:30tumuhm, complains about no .rockbox dir
01:12:40linuxstbThen you forgot "make install"
01:12:49tumui'm using prebuilt bin
01:12:55DavidGWRawsonWhy do sources always come in tarballs?
01:13:03linuxstbtumu: That won't help you debug...
01:13:23tumuso difficult
01:13:25linuxstbDavidGWRawson: How else would you distribute them?
01:15:03linuxstbtarballs are just the standard way to do things in Unix.
01:15:06DavidGWRawsonWhat we need are plugins that run .exe files.
01:15:12 Quit Entasis (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:15:48linuxstbtumu: What's difficult?
01:16:05tumuhow do i install sdl on cygwin?
01:16:46linuxstbProbably via setup.exe, but I don't know.
01:16:49oranges2DavidGWRawson: Did you just brick your player?
01:17:31DavidGWRawsonscorche, I see you made fun of me in the forum I made for emulators
01:17:32linuxstbtumu: This page lists sdl amongst the recommended packages to install -
01:17:38tumulinuxstb, you're right
01:17:50tumui skipped the sdl as i wasn't planning to use the sim
01:18:15DavidGWRawsonoranges2, yea, but it's easy to recover.
01:18:31 Join SofianBabai [0] (
01:19:14 Join Chronon [0] (
01:19:16oranges2I guess for now I'll just have to flash the bootloader back whenever I have to put files on it :[
01:20:48tumulinuxstb, compiling now
01:20:55DavidGWRawsonDo you have a microSD card oranges2?
01:21:14DavidGWRawsonDid it come with a little adapter?
01:21:50DavidGWRawsonYou can use file functions on rockbox to copy files from the microSD card to the player....
01:22:37SofianBabaiis there some kind of usb chargers for a sansa players or do we have to carry the pc everywhere ? :)
01:23:54*linuxstb sleeps
01:23:55DavidGWRawsonHmm, is anyone at all working on a c64 emulator?
01:23:55oranges2Seems tedious
01:23:55tumuDavidGWRawson, i could work
01:23:56tumutho i first have to get dumb working
01:24:15DavidGWRawsonGoogle, like you guys yell at me, has the anwser....
01:24:52oranges2Oh, and I was also wondering if the Sansa gets charged through USB while running Rockbox
01:25:02DavidGWRawsonYes, it does.
01:25:08oranges2Alright :]
01:25:31DavidGWRawsonIt doesn't say it's charging, but the battery meter goes up.
01:25:48tumumeh, the sim build bombs on linking
01:26:01SofianBabaicould we use rockbox when the sansa is charging ?
01:26:34 Quit jhMikeS ("Meow!")
01:26:34DavidGWRawsonnot really, unless certain plugins are running before you start charging
01:27:28 Join Heyoka [0] (
01:27:29DavidGWRawsonwould DOS be a feasable emulator? then we could play duke nukem, or those classic dos games :)
01:27:29 Quit w0rd54 (Client Quit)
01:27:36advcomp2019you can charge it while in rockbox but it will be very slow
01:27:44 Join w0rd54 [0] (
01:28:06scorcheDavidGWRawson: ...huh?
01:28:14DavidGWRawsonRockbox sucks the life out of your battery. It has so many features!
01:28:18Heyokaa quick question I'm not quite sure if this is offtopic or not
01:28:32SofianBabaibut when i's plugged it switched to the original firmware right? how can we run rockbox when it's plugged? possible ?
01:28:43pixelmascorche: I already said that
01:28:47DavidGWRawsonstart rockbox, then plug it in
01:28:48oranges2It doesn't switch if Rockbox is already running
01:28:53scorchedidnt we go through this last night?...we told you you couldnt do something liek that
01:29:37Heyokabut I wanted to ask if there is any information on when the code for the c200 series port will be uploaded to svn, I'm not quite sure if this is still an unsupported port so if I'm off-topic my apologies, I'll just move to rockbox-comunity
01:29:39Heyokathank you
01:32:14 Join reppel [0] (
01:32:42DavidGWRawsonwell, can spectrumrocbox write to tapes?
01:32:52reppelHi, on the homepage i see "2007-09-191st and 2nd gen iPods are supported", does it refer to 2nd gen nanos?
01:33:16scorche(to both questions)
01:33:30oranges2And before you ask, none of the new iPods are supported
01:33:44Heyokano to the c200 series question as well?
01:34:12scorcheHeyoka: we dont give timelines
01:34:22pixelmaHeyoka: there already is code for the c200 port committed to svn and it basically runs but - the port isn't complete yet and is lacking a convenient installation method so far
01:34:27 Join JdGordon [0] (
01:34:57 Quit w0rd54 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:35:16 Quit JdGordon (Remote closed the connection)
01:35:26DavidGWRawsonWould I be famous if I ported halo to rockbox?
01:35:31 Join JdGordon [0] (
01:35:43Heyokahmm I just got one on ebay just for the rockbox factor I'm quite willing to be a residente space monkey/ guinea pig is there any information on the unconvenient way to install it (and is it still in risk of bricking your player phase or is it just simply inconvenient? )
01:35:46DavidGWRawsonI'm asking microsoft for the source code.
01:35:48oranges2Almost as famous as I'd be if I moved the moon with my mind powers.
01:36:06DavidGWRawsonThey won't give it to me.
01:36:19scorcheDavidGWRawson: halo is impossible...
01:36:48oranges2I think my 75mhz Sansa could definitely handle the 3D rendering required by Halo.
01:37:00oranges2No probs.
01:37:04pixelmaHeyoka: "complete" isn't well put anyways, but I don't know exactly what is missing. Have to look around in the wiki about installing on a c200 myself...
01:37:05 Part SofianBabai
01:37:10scorchewell, you are wrong, to put it nicely
01:37:13 Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend")
01:37:24DavidGWRawsonNot if it's a wad....
01:37:34Heyokathanks can you give me any pointers to get myself started?
01:37:38scorchesarcasm doesnt play well through IRC...
01:37:49scorcheDavidGWRawson: it is impossible...end of discussion
01:37:59Thundercloud[00:37] <scorche> sarcasm doesnt play well through any text medium... <−− fixed :)
01:38:19oranges2<scorche> i dont understand blatantly obvious sarcasm...
01:38:24oranges2^ fixed
01:38:41DavidGWRawsonCan we make custom wads work on rockdoom?
01:38:46Thundercloudoranges2: Considering the number of retards I see on a daily basis, i'm usually unable to distinguish between stupidity and sarcasm online.
01:38:47scorcheoranges2: it isnt blatantly me when i say many users think that you are saying is true... DavidGWRawson being one of them
01:39:04Heyokapixelma: to whom should I offer my help as a tester and what kind of information would be usefull to report?
01:39:09scorcheThundercloud: "retard" is a pretty rude thing to say
01:39:16oranges2I believe DavidGWRawson was being sarcastic as well
01:39:21scorcheoranges2: he isnt
01:39:21DavidGWRawsonscorche, you made fun of me just for being a hippocrite
01:39:32scorchewhat are you talking about?
01:39:37Thundercloudscorche: Well yes, but i'm British. We use it all the time here. Besides, using "retard" in it's classic sense is also offensive :P
01:39:41DavidGWRawsonDavid, you should listen to this guy....
01:39:42pixelmaHeyoka: or maybe there is some information in the forums or logs, the developer that has done most of the work isn't around atm (low_light)
01:39:58scorcheDavidGWRawson: that was a while back and you laughed at it...
01:40:04ThundercloudIt's one of those words that has just transcended meaning in the British language, taking on the meaning of "stupid"
01:40:32DavidGWRawsonI'm not stupid!
01:40:42ThundercloudI never said you were
01:40:43scorchei never said that
01:40:57 Join w0rd54 [0] (
01:41:40ThundercloudBut let's put it this way.
01:41:48ThundercloudPeople porting half life to a .wad was a bit of a stretch.
01:41:55ThundercloudPorting a game like HALO/
01:42:04ThundercloudIf not impossible, highly stupid to try.
01:42:13DavidGWRawsonHalf life doesn't even work on rockdoom....
01:42:17scorchelets put it this way....offtopic conversation =)
01:42:26ThundercloudDavidGWRawson: I never said it did.
01:43:03Heyokapixelma: what was the developers name or nick (so I can search the logs )
01:43:10DavidGWRawsonThey DO have a metroid wad in there can be a metroid prime on rockbox....
01:43:15scorcheDavidGWRawson: offtopic
01:43:21scorcheand not here cant
01:43:26Heyokaand did he leave for good or is he just taking a vacation?
01:43:34 Quit pr0n-xxx ("( :: NoNameScript 4.1 :: )")
01:44:02pixelmaHeyoka: low_light (or lowlight in the forums I believe) - no he was around just a few hours ago
01:44:58HeyokaI'll look him up see what I can do
01:45:20Heyokathe expectation of future rockbox was the realdealbreaker
01:45:22DavidGWRawsonI wonder if iPodlinux can be ported to rockbox.....
01:45:48Heyokaby the way just curious is there some sort of primer for developers looking into working with the rockbox project?
01:45:53scorchewhy dont you just port ipodlinux to the sansa?
01:46:19scorcheHeyoka: there are a number of docs in the wiki, what are you looking for?
01:46:36DavidGWRawsonI have the perfect video converter for rockbox vidoes!
01:46:45pixelmaHeyoka: nice to hear, I also get one in the next days :)
01:47:11 Join bb [0] (n=bb@unaffiliated/bb)
01:47:30LloreanDavidGWRawson: Please don't post random links to file downloads. We have several video converters already posted to the wiki.
01:47:48DavidGWRawsonI would just like to have linux as a plugin. That's what i'm going to start working on.
01:47:55LloreanIf you think yours is also useful, write a proper set of instructions and include a link to the official download.
01:48:11DavidGWRawsonI don't own a server.
01:48:20scorcheDavidGWRawson: then go ahead...dont tell us every little thing you are doing..
01:48:23HeyokaI'm just a lowly user myself but I'm thinking of suggesting this project to some friends who actually do some programming as a way for them to get something to show for themselves on their resume (their college times are almost up and its time to start thinking about getting jobs )
01:48:25LloreanNothing I said includes needing any hosting of your own...
01:48:29 Join EnterUserName [0] (n=dave@pdpc/supporter/student/GeekZoid)
01:48:43EnterUserNameHi all. Does ROCKBOX support USB for Sansa e200 series yet?
01:48:49 Quit reppel (Remote closed the connection)
01:48:53*EnterUserName pouts.
01:48:59LloreanEnterUserName: It will be on the MajorChanges page when it does.
01:49:03EnterUserNameoh ok
01:49:04LloreanAnd in the changelog.
01:49:09LloreanAnd probably in the "News"
01:49:10DavidGWRawsonhow did you do that??? the pout thing!
01:49:15oranges2Rockbox doesn't support USB for anything EnterUserName.
01:49:41oranges2*USB data transfer
01:49:50scorcheUSB works just fine on the archos units
01:49:52Lloreanoranges2: Wrong as well, Rockbox supports USB on several players.
01:49:56Heyokaand my own iriver
01:50:03LloreanWorks fine on the Archoses, Gigabeats, H100 and H300 and X5 and M5 series
01:50:05pixelmaand iaudio
01:50:10Heyokah140 modded to h180
01:50:11oranges2I guess its just not the Sansa and iPods then :[
01:50:20LloreanNot on the Sansa, iPod or H10.
01:50:37EnterUserNameIs work being done at all on it? or is it stagnent
01:51:05LloreanEnterUserName: Work is being done.
01:51:16 Quit w0rd54 (Client Quit)
01:52:06 Join w0rd54 [0] (n=w0rd@
01:52:08 Quit DavidGWRawson ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
01:52:12EnterUserNameHeh, only reason is cuz of MicrosdHC :)
01:54:07 Quit EnterUserName ("fone to")
01:54:15Heyokawhat microsdhc?
01:54:32 Join EnterUserName [0] (n=dave@pdpc/supporter/student/GeekZoid)
01:54:41Heyokaas far as I know no sansa has microsdhc yet right?
01:55:01LloreanThe e200 does
01:55:05LloreanProvided Rockbox is installed
01:55:55Heyokait does?
01:56:24Heyokaoh %&$%$ I can't believe I just wasted my money on a c250
01:56:35LloreanThe c200 has a MicroSD slot too, right?
01:56:49LloreanIt should be MicroSDHC in Rockbox too, then, I'd imagine
01:57:12Heyokayeah but as far as I know you need special hardware on the reader to be able to read the full extent of the microsdhc card
01:57:23Heyokaas this microsdhc support been tested already?
01:57:23LloreanHeyoka: Not really true.
01:57:29LloreanOn the e200 it works great.
01:57:57Heyokagod f***** dam**t!
01:58:02pixelmaI count on that too, but low_light doesn't have a microSD card and didn't try at all yet. He said "possibly" it works...
01:58:06LloreanHeyoka: No need to curse.
01:58:25LloreanHeyoka: There's every reason to expect it works on the c200 as well.
01:58:26scorchejust because you use asterisks doesnt mean it doesnt carry the same meaning...
01:58:28LloreanNo guarantee, but it's pretty likely.
01:58:56Heyokasorry but I just put down the money on the c250 figuring there wasn't much room for improvement on the e200 so I guessed the extra cash wouldn't be justified
01:58:59Heyokaoh well...
01:59:03LloreanHeyoka: The e200 wasn't *supposed* to support SDHC, but the main difference between the two is an issue of software. Most of the cases where the hardware prevents it is because of firmware, actually.
01:59:16 Quit bb__ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:59:22Heyokaebay giveth ebay, ebay alloweth to sell away :D
01:59:25LloreanHeyoka: Seriously, try an SDHC card in it in Rockbox.
01:59:35LloreanYou're jumping to unjustified conclusions.
01:59:45 Join perrikwp [0] (i=9821486c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:59:51 Join DavidGWRawson [0] (
02:00:17HeyokaI think I'll just try to get my money back from pixmania and get myself an e200 series then
02:00:55 Quit DavidGWRawson (Client Quit)
02:01:04|Marco|hey, about the microsd wifi card, how about some form of ip telefone usage (or the sorts) with players that have built in mic's or linein ?
02:01:14LloreanHeyoka: I don't understand... You're willing to spend extra money on the assumption it won't work, without first testing it?
02:01:19 Join DavidGWRawson [0] (
02:01:23LloreanHeyoka: Why not test it, then if it doesn't work, attempt to get your money back?
02:01:40Heyokabecause I still don't know how to get rockbox into the c200
02:01:41Llorean|Marco|: How 'bout worrying about what to do with it once someone actually codes drivers for one?
02:01:51 Quit DavidGWRawson (Client Quit)
02:01:53Heyokayour quite right I should look into that first
02:01:59 Quit Guile` (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:02:08Heyokawell I got myself 15 days to install rockbox then
02:02:19 Join Guile` [0] (n=Guile@
02:02:31 Quit bb (Nick collision from services.)
02:02:32 Join DavidGWRawson [0] (
02:02:36 Join bb_ [0] (n=bb@unaffiliated/bb)
02:02:40|Marco|Llorean: well, just spouting stupid ideas, in case someone gets interested and starts up
02:03:01Heyokadoes anyone have a quick link for a c200 build?
02:03:37|Marco|what about #c ?
02:03:40 Part toffe82
02:03:48scorche(it is offtopic)
02:04:07*|Marco| shut's up
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02:06:47Heyokapretty please?
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02:08:19LloreanHeyoka: I think you pretty much have to compile from source at the moment
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02:08:51Heyokahmm ok I hope my kubuntu dist has the necessary packages for gcc
02:09:21Heyokaerr where can I get the source?
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02:09:32scorchenot for compiling will have to run (which is an automated script that will get and compile the crosscompilers needed for you)
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02:09:51scorchethe svn details are located int he wiki as well
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02:12:39*JimmyBane slaps webmind with a rainbow trout
02:12:49pixelmaJimmyBane: didn't you say you'd keep the nick?
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02:13:22*DavidGWRawson slaps DavidGWRawson with a big red brick
02:13:31Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
02:13:38Mode"#rockbox +b *!*18eddffa@* " by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
02:13:50DavidGWRawsonWhat are you doing to me?
02:14:08Heyokasleep time now
02:14:12Mode"#rockbox +b *!* " by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
02:14:22Heyokathanks for all the help
02:14:42Kick(#rockbox DavidGWRawson :I am banning you...) by scorche!i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche
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02:15:40Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
02:16:19|Marco|oo, possible I got a buddy of mine to take a look into the SDIO porting to rockbox
02:17:32|Marco|man I hope he does
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02:23:15oranges2You deleted his board account too? O_o
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02:24:09oranges2Well someone did
02:24:27scorcheno one did...
02:24:37psycho_maniacanybody have a clue why my vm wont connect to the internet ?
02:24:38oranges2Then why is he now listed as a guest?
02:25:16scorchei see him online and listed as;u=12636
02:25:56oranges2Guess he had a dupe account
02:26:09LloreanHe had two accounts
02:26:15LloreanHe deleted one, which is why it shows as a Guest
02:26:29LloreanHis previous ban has expired, but he's been warned that if he acts up once more, AT ALL, he's getting banned for a week.
02:27:21psycho_maniaclooks like that guy has problems. i looked at his posts on rockbox forums
02:27:47scorchewhining about people such as him is offtopic here =)
02:28:42RudManthe problem is is that they "guy" is like 12
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02:28:59scorchewhining about people such as him is offtopic here =)
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02:33:28Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
02:36:17Topic"Ahoy ye landlubbers! Ye best be readin' these before yer trap opens: | If ye want ta chat 'bout other thing, ye shall get the plank (located at #rockbox-community) | ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!" by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
02:36:24Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
02:37:09Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
02:37:24Topic"Ahoy ye landlubbers! Ye best be readin' these before yer trap opens: | If ye want ta chat 'bout other things, ye shall get the plank (located at #rockbox-community) | ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!" by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
02:37:28Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
02:38:01 Join dnanar [0] (
02:38:06dnanarhi all !
02:38:53dnanari'm trying to install rockbox on my cowon iaudio x5l, but i do not find the rockbox.iaudio file which should be packed with .rockbox (daily build). may anyone help me please ?
02:39:22scorcheit is inside that folder
02:39:51RudMandid you uncompress the rockbox zip into the root of your iaudio?
02:40:07dnanarRudMan: yes
02:40:23RudMandid it create a number of folders under .rockbox?
02:40:27dnanari decompressed the folder, and putted x5_fw.bin into firmware/ dir
02:40:32dnanarRudMan: yes
02:41:00 Quit Chronon ("*sneaks off like a ninja*")
02:42:36RudManDownload the Rockbox bootloader binary from Use the x5v_fw.bin file if your player is a X5V. If it is a X5, use the x5_fw.bin file.
02:42:36RudManCopy it to the FIRMWARE directory on your player.
02:42:42RudManthat's from the documentation
02:42:56dnanarthats what ive done
02:43:02dnanarbut it does nothing
02:43:09RudManso there were TWO zip decomressed both into the root?
02:43:28dnanarwhere to find the second zip file please ?
02:43:39RudManread that
02:43:41pixelmadnanar: what did you do after you copied the files and unzipped the build?
02:44:57dnanar1) unzipped .rockbox in root dir;2)extract x5_fw.bin in firmware/ dir;3)unplug usb cable, charge the player and put in on "ON" -> that does nothing
02:45:07 Quit w0rd54 (Client Quit)
02:45:58RudManthat should have been step 2
02:46:23RudManThere are two separate components of Rockbox that need to be installed in order to run Rockbox.
02:46:23RudManThe Rockbox boot loader.
02:46:23RudManThe boot loader is the program that tells your player how to boot and load other components of Rockbox. This is the component of Rockbox that is installed to the flash memory of your Iaudio.
02:46:23DBUGEnqueued KICK RudMan
02:46:23RudManThe Rockbox firmware.
02:46:23RudManUnlike the Iaudio firmware, which runs entirely from flash memory, most of the Rockbox code is contained in a build that resides on your players drive. This makes it easy to update Rockbox. The build consists of a directory called .rockbox containing all of Rockbox files, which is located in the root of your players drive.
02:46:46pixelmaRudMan: that's not very helpfull
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02:48:39pixelmadnanar: just to check - on your player there is a .rockbox directory and a firmware directory (in which the x5_fw.bin is located)
02:48:48safetydanpreglow (for the logs), there is a patch to remove the HW EQ, FS #7440. But I don't have an iPod Video to test it on and for some reason the cutoff values don't seem to work.
02:48:50SevenfoldizmHey could someone help me out, winff is outputting videos very badly.
02:49:04pixelmadnanar: what do you mean with "charge the player and put it to on"
02:49:24RudManpix: why is that not helpful. it appears that he has only downloaded one part of rockbox and that was to show him that there are two parts of rockbox he needs
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02:49:45dnanarpixelma: there is a.rockbox dir and now even a fonts/ dir inside this dir, and this does not change nothing
02:50:11pixelmaRudMan: the long paste doesn't read well...
02:50:18SevenfoldizmI have the right presets installed and I select Sansa 4:3 but when it converts I try to play the video on WMP and Rockbox and its mostly black but there will be very badly blocky unrecognizable video.
02:50:18dnanarpixelma: well, I "Turn the X5/M5 off, remove the USB cable and insert the charger." as it said in docs
02:50:26***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:50:51BillGod_Can anyone point me to instructions on patching the bootloader for a sansa 280r? I followed the instructions on to the letter but it never seems to patch correctly.
02:51:04pixelmadnanar: but you also have a "FIRMWARE" directory there with the .bin file in it?
02:51:13SevenfoldizmWhere are you stuck BillGod?
02:52:14dnanarpixelma: yes (well in fact its wrotten in lower case, and the dir is empty, but it seems that i can't use upper case character onto the player)
02:53:06pixelmadnanar: but you put the file there before?
02:53:07BillGod_I am not sure I run the e200 tool and it finds my sansa. i put it in recovery mode. copy over BL_SD_boardSupportSD.rom unmount and unplug. it says upgrade complete and reboots. it boots into the normal rhapsody firmware. if i put on rockbox it fails to load image.
02:53:45dnanarpixelma: yes of course
02:53:52SevenfoldizmYou held the record button until it booted into recovery mode?
02:54:20BillGod_i have the whole transcript here.
02:55:05pixelmadnanar: I would think that's a sign that installation worked, because that file is deleted by the original firmware when updating was successful (afaik)
02:55:06oranges2 :[
02:55:26SevenfoldizmDid you make sure the directory was named .rockbox and installed in the highest directory on your sansa?
02:55:38BillGod_yes its in /
02:55:49SevenfoldizmI know of one more way you can try it then
02:56:00BillGod_anything will help
02:56:01dnanarpixelma: here is all the file on the player:
02:56:05SevenfoldizmYou'll probably need to do this anyways if you want the original firmware plus usb support
02:56:41oranges2Does sansapatcher not work?
02:56:47dnanarpixelma: ah no i meant: there were nothing into, i putted the .bin file which were never removed
02:57:04SevenfoldizmBasically what you'll be doing is converting it into a regular e200.
02:57:12SevenfoldizmHold up let me get you the page
02:57:43BillGod_oranges2: sansapatcher does not work on the R models.
02:58:23oranges2I just have a e260
02:58:37oranges2The original firmware doesn't load after I patch it
02:58:37Sevenfoldizm and this
02:58:45pixelmadnanar: you don't have a X5V by any chance (without radio)? Also I can't see a .rockbox directory in your listing
02:58:45Sevenfoldizmstudy both those pages.
02:58:52SevenfoldizmAnd then try it.
02:59:06BillGod_sweet thanks
02:59:47SevenfoldizmI did it wrong the first few times and it said load main image failed so work on it until you get the original e200 firmware on (it won't have rhapsody channels) and then follow the normal e200 install guide
03:00:27BillGod_thanks a ton
03:01:02SevenfoldizmYep. It's no problem, it's the least I can do. I was in your situation a few nights ago
03:01:52dnanarpixelma: ops, .rockbox is an hidden dir, so : . ANd no, i have got a X5L 20GB
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03:04:10RudMandnanar: the only think I see is that the firmware/x5_fw.bin file reports as being 0 length
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03:08:44dnanarRudMan: arf thanks : unmount returned an erro when unmounting the player %)
03:08:53dnanarnow it works perfectly thanks ;-)
03:09:08oranges2Anybody here have a non-R Sansa that boots the original firmware properly?
03:10:14LloreanDual boot works quite well on non-R sansa.
03:10:25RudManoranges2: I have a sansa that boots the original firmware perfectly
03:10:46oranges2And you have RockBox installeD?
03:10:51RudManof course!
03:11:10oranges2How did you install the bootloader?
03:11:17iambenmine works fine too, fwiw
03:11:31iambeni... followed the instructions
03:11:43oranges2The ones on the Wiki using Sansapatcher?
03:12:03RudManoranges2: I did it a few weeks ago so I don't remember the exact steps but all I did was follow the documentation step by step and it worked perfectly
03:12:20iambeni followed the manual, not the wiki
03:12:51oranges2I guess I'm just unlucky :[
03:12:55Lloreanoranges2: For non-R Sansas, the manual should be followed strictly.
03:13:02LloreanDual boot has worked for everyone who followed the manual.
03:13:10oranges2I've followed the instructions exactly 3 times over
03:13:15oranges2Same problem each time
03:13:52Lloreanoranges2: You already said you used the wiki
03:14:05LloreanThe manual is not the wiki, and vice versa.
03:14:19oranges2I meant the manual
03:14:50oranges21. Switch to MSC mode 2. Connect USB 3. Run sansapatcher 4. Hit 'i' then 'Enter' 5. Unplug and let it reboot
03:14:57oranges2Those are the exact steps I followed
03:15:26LloreanAnd this is starting with a vanilla e200 that boots the original firmware just fine before doing this?
03:15:36LloreanAnd you eject the sansa properly?
03:16:14RudManafter you connect the USB, can you see it as a drive?
03:16:34Lloreanoranges2: And what, *exactly* happens when you try to boot the OF?
03:16:54oranges2 <- 30 second video
03:18:09LloreanI don't intend to download a video. Summarize what happens in one sentence.
03:18:52oranges2It would be easier and more efficient just to watch the video, but some text scrolls, then the screen freezes and starts to change colors in a 'melting' sensation
03:19:12LloreanAnd how long have you left it?
03:19:38oranges2And actually now, it just reboots instead of freezing
03:19:51oranges2The melting thing only happened the first time
03:20:02LloreanAs well, have you actually typed up the text into a pastebin or otherwise?
03:20:31BillGod_Sevenfoldizm: you still around?
03:20:39oranges2I can't type fast enough to get it
03:21:02krazykittake a picture with your cellphone and type it out?
03:21:11oranges2I tried
03:21:16oranges2It doesn't take a clear enough picture
03:21:21iambeni think mine does the melting thing, then it goes to OF
03:21:22Lloreanoranges2: I assume you can reboot the player more than once, and take them down a line at a time.
03:21:26iambenmelting is good, isnt it?
03:21:29LloreanI imagine you can remember one whole line per boot at the very least.
03:21:49LloreanThe text output contains useful information.
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03:25:21iambenok sorry mine doesnt melt quite like that =)
03:27:55krazykitsorry, why are you shouting?
03:28:39qwmi refuse to tell why.
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03:42:29eigma[continuing conversation on porting RB to the m:robe 500i]
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03:42:47eigmaso, UART doesn't have to be polled
03:42:52eigmait does have interrupts, etc
03:43:01oranges2Still here Llorean?
03:43:32kkurbjunare you using the interupts in your code though?
03:43:55kkurbjunin the bootloader that is?
03:44:00eigmalinloader polls. the linux driver (not written by me) uses irqs
03:44:19eigmabut I see no reason for any part of RB to poll
03:44:34eigma(i.e. bootloader or normal)
03:44:34kkurbjunno, I agree, I was just wondering
03:44:38eigmaah ok
03:44:44eigmalook at uartPuts or so
03:45:13kkurbjunhopefully I can finalize this interrupt stuff soon.. I've never done arm interupts and the ones that I have done didn't have any priority or anything like that
03:45:30oranges2Heres the pastebin:
03:45:47eigmapriorities? I don't recall needing to change any of that stuff
03:46:16kkurbjunno, but you pay attention to them when you handle the interupts
03:46:51kkurbjunthe interupt handler is called and then it's supposed to call a function based on an address that's placed in a register from the interupt controller
03:47:04eigmayeah, DM320 interrupts are really strange
03:47:20eigmathe hardware tries to do some of the work for you, but Linux's interrupt model is incompatible with it
03:47:29kkurbjunyep, I saw that
03:47:43kkurbjunI'm following linux's method though
03:48:45kkurbjunbecause I can't find anything that shows what all the registers do
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03:50:01oranges2Does album art need to be named specifically for it to show up?
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03:53:02RudManyou need a custom build for album art
03:53:55oranges2I have one
03:54:07oranges2I'm just wondering if theres a general naming convention for album art
03:54:22oranges2Because 'cover.jpg' doesn't work
03:54:47RudMantake a look at a working cover art wps
03:54:53newbyx86no disconnect? incredible
03:55:00newbyx86every other net I was connected to just died :[
03:55:16eigmaRockbox rocks that hard.
03:55:59oranges2It only supports BMp
03:56:13RudManthere ya go
03:56:19oranges2Reading is power
03:57:55 Quit hardeep ("leaving")
03:59:31oranges2And God said to his disciples,
03:59:37oranges2"LET THERE BE COVER ART"
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04:15:48 Join jmworx [0] (
04:18:37jmworxHi, My Rio Karma just died a horrible death and I'm considering buying a new Rockbox-supported player. I know there's a list of models supported, but can anyone recommend one in particular that's best supported (least problems)? I'm looking for a 20+ GB player.
04:19:02oranges25g iPod?
04:19:23krazykitjmworx, i migrated from a karma to a gigabeat f and i'm pretty happy.
04:19:50krazykitbut "best supported" depends on your meaning, really, and what features you want
04:20:56krazykitjmworx, i'd check out
04:21:49oranges2I'm pretty happy with my Sansa e200
04:21:55oranges2Only offers 8gb internal though
04:26:35jmworxkrazykit: By best supported, I mean "smallest likelihood of problems"
04:26:50jmworxAlso what does "in production mean"?
04:26:56oranges2Still being made
04:27:21krazykitjmworx, if you only need a player and you're on a budget, the gigabeat f40 is still pretty inexpensive
04:27:37krazykitit also has a beast of a processor, so video works well
04:27:49oranges2I'm fairly sure that none of the models listed as "supported" have any glaring errors
04:27:55krazykitit doesn't feel as nice in your hand as the karma, though :-(
04:28:52dnanari don't understand how to change WPS in rockbox; after downloading and installing one of those theme:, i go to "Setting>General Settings>Display>Browse .wps file" and nothing is changer (only browser appearance is changed, not music player appearance)
04:29:02dnanardoes anyone know how to do please ? ;-)
04:29:35krazykitdnanar, you installed the WPS properly?
04:31:05dnanarwell, i unzipped it into main directory
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04:31:28RudMandnanar: try settings->browse themes
04:31:45jmworxkrazykit: Money is an issue, but not the main one. I guess my main criteria (beyond playing Vorbis) are easy navigation, enough storage and reliability
04:31:58krazykitwell, navigation is all the same, really
04:32:48dnanarRudMan: ah ok :-) that's changed a lot of stuff, but "music file player" is still the same
04:34:22krazykitjmworx, well, you'll probably be happy with any player you pick. i know of 5 former karma owners that are happy with gigabeats, 2 with ipods, and a few with the sansa (all rockboxed)
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04:36:48kkurbjuneigma, is there a pin to cut the power?
04:43:11kkurbjunnevermind, found it
04:43:37safetydandnanar, it's possible the theme requires patches that you don't have in your build.
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04:45:03pwn_nubsanyone know how to install rockbox and ipodlinux
04:45:27pwn_nubsive got them both installed but i cant get rockbox to appear in the ipodloader
04:45:42krazykitpwn_nubs, if you're using loader2, it's not supported here
04:46:15pwn_nubs... does rockbox support the old loader?
04:46:38krazykitrockbox only supports rockbox projects.
04:47:11scorchein otherwords, rockbox supports its own bootloader...not a different loader that someone else made
04:47:17pwn_nubswell i asked the people about ipodlinux and how to get rockbox in the IPL but they directed me here
04:47:23pwn_nubs= (
04:47:25Lloreanpwn_nubs: The loader loads Rockbox, not the other way around. If you're having problems using the loader, you need to ask the people who created it, it doesn't matter what you're trying to load with it.
04:47:30oranges2Is there a way to play music while in Rockboy?
04:47:59Lloreanscorche: Not quite true
04:48:08scorchewell, yeah...
04:48:13LloreanOn the Gigabeat F, with small sized roms, if sound in Gameboy is disabled, you can get music.
04:48:35kkurbjunIt disables sound automagically if music is playing
04:48:42LloreanEven better.
04:49:03Lloreankkurbjun: I tried increasing the plugin buffer for use with larger ROMs, and it did not work. Is there some other constraint?
04:49:07oranges2So something like the Sansa just isn't powerful enough?
04:49:28Lloreanoranges2: The Sansa isn't even powerful enough to really get full speed out of the games consistently, without adding decoding compressed audio into the mix
04:49:50kkurbjunno, that should work, I've done it on my player with older builds.. I don't think it's changed since I did it
04:49:56oranges2I've tried a few games, and they've been playing full speed
04:50:06kkurbjunhow much larger are you making it?
04:50:13Lloreankkurbjun: Odd, I double the plugin buffer size for a ROM that was only 256kb larger.
04:50:28***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:50:46kkurbjunhmm, I would expect that to work, did you rerun configure?
04:51:03LloreanI'm pretty sure I did, but it was some time ago. Maybe I didn't.
04:51:53kkurbjuntry giving it a really large amount like 2 megs and then rerunning configure, it should adjust, you can work down from there
04:52:10kkurbjunthe size of te rom isn't necessarily indicitave of how much memory it needs though either
04:52:34kkurbjunthe ram banks for example are included in the rom size
04:52:56LloreanI didn't think about how much extra memory the ROM might need.
04:53:10kkurbjunthere's only a number in the rom that represents the number of ram banks
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04:53:46LloreanAh well, if gameboy sound were just a bit better, I'd not want to listen to my own music anyway.
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04:53:56LloreanIt's still kinda crackly though, unlike one of those patches you posted.
04:54:38LloreanI think though the one that sounded really good was too slow on anything but a Gigabeat, wasn't it?
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04:54:54kkurbjunI have another patch, but I havn't gotten around to committing it, I got distracted with a port :)
04:55:12LloreanWell, new ports are interesting too. :)
04:55:31LloreanBesides, I still own a few gameboys anyway.
04:55:56BillGod_just got rockbox up and running. anyone able to tell me why when I plug it into my USB port it doesn't auto mount anymore? Using linux not windows
04:56:33RudManI have a sansa and sometimes I have to boot it into the original firmware before windows will see it
04:56:45RudManactually it will see it and the connect and then immediately disconnect
04:56:54BillGod_hmm might setup for dual boot then
04:57:05RudMansometimes a reboot of windows is needed
04:57:11krazykitRudMan, well, that's expected. usb doesn't work on sansas yet.
04:57:23BillGod_ahh that explains it
04:57:40oranges2I use the MicroSD to transfer files
04:57:41kkurbjunI'll probably work on the gameboy patch again I have once I have enough code for higher(lower?) level work to go on with this port.
04:57:44RudMankrazy: no, I mean I have to let it boot into the OF before I hook up the USB
04:57:58RudManother times I can just hook up the usb and it turns on and will be seen
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04:59:59LloreanRudMan: If your device is off, plugging it into USB should boot it into the OF.
05:00:07LloreanIf it's already turned on, you'll need to shutdown or reboot into the OF.
05:00:35RudManyes, but like I said it's flaky....probably just my machine tho
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05:05:09jmworxkrazykit: Do the iPods still have battery life problems?
05:05:27Llorean4th gen and later iPods, including minis, do.
05:06:46jmworxSo I guess buying an iPod would be a recommended thing to do?
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05:08:18LloreanI would recommend other players before the iPods, but that's mostly based on my personal preferences.
05:08:25krazykitjmworx, really, i can't suggest supporting a company that hates their customers.
05:09:44krazykitjmworx, which is why i suggested the gigabeat f40 as a pretty good choice. cheap, but has somewhat fewer features than other players.
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05:21:05jmworxkrazykit: I share your hate for Apple, really. I was just trying to get an idea of all options (was considering iPod as a last option).
05:21:31jmworxProblem is that I'm having a hard time finding a place that sells the gigabeat F
05:21:50krazykitamazon has them, from independant selelrs
05:22:53jmworxwell, I'm in Australia
05:25:11safetydanjmworx, I've seen Wow Sight and Sound offer Gigabeat models at various boints. Not exactly sure which model though.
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05:29:24jmworxsafetydan: Thanks, trying to check it out...
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05:30:31jmworxWhat kind of idiotic company actively ensures that people who don't have flash don't buy from them?
05:30:59pwn_nubsanyone have the ipodloader that will help me with a start file?
05:31:05jmworxAnd it's not like it's a Linux thing −− Windows 64bit users are equally screwed!
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05:37:29safetydanjmworx, yeah they're site is horrible.
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05:42:32safetydanyeesh that was bad English. Of course I meant "their".
05:43:33jmworxsafetydan: Can you find anything on it? I haven't managed to find it, even on my 32-bit box that has flash
05:44:53safetydanjmworx, sorry I can't look at it either. On a 64-bit box as well.
05:45:02safetydanI just get their paper catalog in the mail sometimes.
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05:55:59kkurbjunhey jdgordon
05:56:13kkurbjunlet me send you 1 of the 2 bootloaders
05:56:23JdGordonoh, if you insist :)
05:56:35kkurbjunthere's one that's for the exploit that jumps into the rockbox bootloader :)
05:56:47JdGordonjust checking, the arm cross compiler we have already is good right? we dont need to recompile it?
05:57:07kkurbjunour is fine, no need to recompile
05:58:22kkurbjunso that loader by itself won't do much I'll try and put together my current diff
05:58:47kkurbjunyou might want to do this in a new checkout
05:58:59JdGordonwith the remix exploit, does it let you have multiple remoxies setup? so one can load linux and one loads rockbox?
05:59:50CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
05:59:50*JdGordon grabbing new checkout
05:59:53pwn_nubsive got the ipodloader and there is a way to load apple os or linux or rockbox
06:00:05pwn_nubsi just cant figure out how to load the rockbox from it
06:00:06kkurbjunthere's alot of code being messed with at the moment.. as far as I know there's only a setup for doing 1 exploit, I've never tried putting another exploit in a new remix folder, eigma might be able to comment
06:00:43kkurbjunThe loader I just sent you is based off his code so it should be possible to load one or the other
06:01:03krazykitpwn_nubs, didn't you get it the first time? #rockbox does not support ipodlinux's bootloaders. ask them. they have an irc channel, i'm sure
06:01:25scorchethey do, and he was in it
06:01:48kkurbjunI just haven't played with that possibility.. I was removing all dependencies on any linked libraries and in the process I broke the linux way
06:02:11pwn_nubskrazykit thats the thing its not their loader its just a screen that lets you choose what to load
06:02:24krazykitpwn_nubs, no, it IS thier loader.
06:02:40krazykitrockbox's bootloader does not do that. you hold a button to choose the firmware.
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06:05:01scorchepwn_nubs: it IS their loader
06:06:24eigmakkurbjun, JdGordon: yes. multiple remixes can do different things. I currently use this to boot various images of Linux.
06:06:39 Part agm3nt
06:07:22eigmakkurbjun, JdGordon: the problem is there is no way to parameterize remix loading, nor for the exploit payload to determine which remix was launched. so, for all practical purposes, the binary image of the exploit has to contain all the differences between each remix
06:07:38eigmanot sure if that was clear; feel free to ask for clarification
06:08:27eigmabut, for Linux vs Rockbox, no problem at all
06:08:56eigmamy main issue was giving various Linux kernel command-lines depending on the remix
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06:10:10psycho_maniacanybody know how to get my vmware to be able to connect to svn? for some reason it always says "unkown hostname" and I AM connected to the internet. Could it be set to read through my ethernet card and not my 56k modem?
06:10:25eigmacan you ping
06:10:36eigmacan you ping the address of your router (something like
06:11:02eigmacome to think of it, this is probably a question for #linux
06:11:50psycho_maniacjust type "ping" ?
06:12:22psycho_maniacok i did that and it did the same thing
06:13:46eigmalook at the properties for your network connection in Windows; write down the value for "Default Gateway". try "ping <gateway>".
06:15:07scorchethis is more a question for something like #vmware rather than #rockbox...
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06:19:21psycho_maniacthanks for the help.
06:25:27psycho_maniacwhen is it necessary to use the "make clean" command?
06:25:41JdGordoneigma: oh, do you know how to change the text the remix shows?
06:29:48eigmait's in the xml files
06:29:55eigmaI forget exactly, but I did do it
06:29:57eigmaone sec
06:30:28psycho_maniacGodEater: Are you around?
06:30:49eigmaI would have to look on my m:robe (too lazy atm)
06:31:31eigmayou know which xml files I am referring to/
06:31:56JdGordonno, I thought it might be in one and had a look for it yesteerday, but couldnt find it
06:32:11JdGordonill look again now
06:32:30eigmaunder System\Remix or something like that
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09:31:33B4gderthere's a server up
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09:32:47Zagormy hitman did his job
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09:33:28psycho_maniachow do i search the forums for just a user? i type in the users name and it doesnt work
09:33:35ZagorB4gder: that sure is some magic :-)
09:33:41*Zagor tests
09:33:48B4gdermagic with love
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09:35:28peturB4gder: you're blogging a lot these days ;)
09:35:43B4gderI do, I'm full of rants
09:36:02peturI'm still able to suppress it ;)
09:36:24JdGordonwooohoo! almost a working button driver for the mr500
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09:39:23B4gderso they estimate a 82USD cost to make a 8GB nano
09:39:35B4gderthat's really very cheap
09:40:18B4gdermaybe Apple will compete more with SanDisk pricewise soon then
09:41:47B4gderimho, sansa view looks like a way cooler player than the nano anyway
09:42:07JdGordonand woring button driver :D
09:42:36B4gderJdGordon: is that running on the actual mr500?
09:43:34B4gdervery cool
09:43:47B4gderI do miss details in the wiki etc on this effort...
09:46:29psycho_maniacB4gder: what do you mean
09:46:56B4gderabout what?
09:47:34psycho_maniac"details in the wiki"
09:48:27B4gderyes, about the effort to put Rockbox on mrobe 500
09:48:53psycho_maniacoh ok. thanks for explaining that.
09:49:56psycho_maniachow far is rockbox coming along with gsoc?
09:51:04peturpsycho_maniac: gsoc has ended ;)
09:51:19psycho_maniachow long ago?
09:51:35peturit ran until end of august
09:51:53ZagorI'm missing details in wiki about that too :-) how did each project go etc.
09:51:59psycho_maniacwell then my question would be. did the gsoc help at all?
09:52:58peturwe got wma, didn't we?
09:52:58JdGordonyes and no
09:53:09JdGordonforgot abou wma :p
09:53:17JdGordonyes, sort of and no :p
09:53:45peturat least austriancoder is still working on it, how's Nico_P doing?
09:53:48Zagorwhoa, hardeep lives!
09:54:07psycho_maniacJdGordn: please explain more
09:54:10***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
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09:54:46JdGordonpsycho_maniac: we got wma so one was good, two (usb and MoB) sort of half way finished.. and one got nowhere
09:56:29psycho_maniacthe one that got nowhere...was that text to speech?
09:57:44psycho_maniacdid the gsoc help progress these projects faster or easier?
09:58:00B4gderthe TTS one was given an extension though, although I'm not sure that helps it...
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09:58:39psycho_maniacis there a patch for seeking in wma at all?
09:59:29aliaskApparently he has an implementation of seeking that he's keeping all to himself
09:59:39aliaskNot ready for primetime I assume
10:00:16psycho_maniaci barley have any wmas. and i only realize im playing a wma when i try to rewind. i was just curious.
10:01:46homielowelinuxstb: even though your away, tested ipodpatcher on MACOSX 10.4, the binary works just fine.
10:01:54Zagoryay, OF.mi4 works on c200!
10:02:31Zagorready for prime time
10:02:52peturZagor: you think it is?
10:02:59ZagorI can't see why not
10:03:22Zagorthis fix enables USB, which was the last hurdle as far as I know
10:03:28B4gderZagor: did you try sansapatcher on it?
10:03:38 Quit psycho_maniac ("Good Bye")
10:03:40Zagorwhat does that do?
10:03:46B4gderit installes the bootloader
10:03:47peturok, I have a coworker here with a c200, will convince him to try it ;)
10:03:54B4gderthe fancy way
10:03:59Zagorno I used the recovery mode method
10:04:15JdGordoni think snasapatcher checks the e200 usb id... so it will need updating for the c200
10:04:19JdGordonunless that was done already
10:04:20markungregj: nice info!
10:04:43Zagormy c200 has usb id 0781:7450
10:05:17B4gderI know linuxstb and low_light looked at sansapatching the c200 before, but I don't know where they ended up
10:05:31B4gderbefore as in last night or so
10:05:47peturare there plans to install with rbutil?
10:06:01B4gderrbutil uses the sansapatcher way I think
10:06:09B4gderso once sansapatcher can do it, rbutil should be able to
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10:11:12JdGordoncan anyone that understands datashee please have a look at page 71 of and tell me how to set gio0 to output and be able to read it? i cant understand it...
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10:13:05ZagorJdGordon: page?
10:13:20linuxstb_JdGordon: No, sansapatcher doesn't use usb ids at all.
10:13:45JdGordonlinuxstb_: oh woopsies then :p
10:13:54JdGordonZagor: yeah, 71, chapter 3.5
10:14:00linuxstb_From what I can see, sansapatcher should work on a c200 - so something like "sansapatcher -a bootloader.mi4" (where bootloader.mi4 is the Rockbox bootloader, I forget what we call it)
10:14:02ZagorJdGordon: you want it output _and_ read it? that doesn't make sense.
10:14:25JdGordonyeah, woopis, input
10:15:21B4gderZagor: if you can verify the sansapatcher install, we could more or less make the c200 port "official"
10:16:04ZagorI took a quick look and the patcher code only mentions E200. are the c200 keys even added there? (or am I mistaken, and they're the same keys?)
10:16:23B4gderall the keys are always considered
10:16:30JdGordonah! i tihnk i get it
10:16:33B4gderit loops over them all
10:16:47linuxstb_Ah yes, you may need to add the keys to sansapatcher - it only has two IIRC.
10:17:00B4gderaha, they're separate...
10:17:08B4gdermaybe we should put the keys in a common file?
10:17:29ZagorJdGordon: simply set DIR0 to 1 (all bits you want input), then read gio0
10:17:54linuxstb_And also, sansapatcher embeds the e200 bootloader, so it needs to also embed the c200 bootloader, and distinguish between the two.
10:18:32B4gderlinuxstb_: you found a way in the partition to detect any difference?
10:18:44ZagorJdGordon: (or DIR1 if you use bits/pins > 15)
10:18:53B4gderit could in fact possibly use the keys to do that but I'm not sure that's very comfortable
10:19:05JdGordonZagor: ok thanks, works now :)
10:19:17linuxstb_B4gder: No. And the keys won't work after sansapatcher has been run once, and the OF is then stored unencrypted.
10:19:22*linuxstb_ needs to run
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10:19:27B4gderah right
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10:19:50B4gderbut when ran, it can detect version based on what key what worked and store that somewhere
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10:32:59B4gderI got a Samsung T9 firmware upgrade image
10:33:09B4gderand what do I find?
10:33:25B4gdernever seen that in an mp3 player before
10:35:47B4gdernot only that, they have clearly build with assert() enabled :-)
10:35:55B4gdercheck out these strings:
10:35:59B4gderpBuf->eStatus == BUF_ALLOCATED || pBuf->eStatus == BUF_WRITTEN
10:36:01preglowmight make for cool surprises
10:36:05B4gderpBuf->pPrev != ((void *)0
10:36:11B4gderetc etc
10:36:34LinusNmuch like iriver, when they left all their debug messages in the code
10:36:41B4gderyeah, very helpful!
10:36:51LinusNhow kind of them
10:37:02preglow160 gigs is a lot of space...
10:37:26*preglow kicks apple
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10:40:41B4gderman, they are helpful beyond what one could hope for:
10:40:49pixelmaZagor: tried a microSD in the c200 already? I'm curious...
10:41:03B4gderand similar
10:41:21LinusNB4gder: ARM?
10:41:29Zagorpixelma: no, I don't have any such card.
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10:41:53B4gderhm, I gotta check...
10:42:15B4gderyeah, it looks like I see the exception vectors. I'll try objdumping that
10:42:22peturpixelma: I've been thinking that I see your name a lot, I just bought myself a printer called PIXMA and it always confuses me :)
10:43:04LinusNpetur: call your printer Marianne then
10:43:52peturI didn't call it that, canon did
10:44:05pixelmapetur: or buy another
10:44:20peturor you change nick ;)
10:44:35agm3ntpixelma: my 1 GB microsd not work
10:44:44B4gderhm, could it be big endian arm...
10:44:57pixelmapetur: why? You're the one confused ;)
10:45:29B4gder00001000 e1 0f 10 00 e3 c1 10 3f e3 81 10 d3 e1 29 f0 01 |....?..).|
10:45:29B4gder00001010 e3 a0 10 f8 ee 01 1f 10 e5 9f 10 9c e5 91 10 00 |..........|
10:45:45B4gderdoesn't that look exception vector?
10:45:55B4gderthe e1 e3 etc
10:46:24pixelmaagm3nt: thanks for the info. Was just asking because low_light also doesn't have a microSD card.
10:47:06markunB4gder: "As for the hardware, the unit sports the Samsung SA58700X processor (arm 940T at 200mhz)"
10:47:15B4gderah there it is
10:47:21LinusNB4gder: if it is big endian, they have a pretty large flash
10:47:28B4gderso it is big endian then
10:48:06B4gderwell, how can we know at what address they map it?
10:48:22peturand the wikipedia article mentions vxworks...
10:48:52B4gderman, should I read up before I do things? ;)
10:50:21markunB4gder: if we could support this player it brings us a bit closer to the nano 2G, meizu M6 and iriver Clix (and family)
10:50:48B4gderI don't see any real effort going on here though
10:51:35petur"Main.SamsungT9Port moved from Main.samsungt9 on 13 Mar 2007 - 18:45 by DanielStenberg" <−− bad memory, B4gder?
10:52:08B4gdersorry, I've forgot what we're talking about
10:52:33LinusNB4gder: i mean, e1000000 to e5000000, that's quite a difference, suggesting 8megs of flash
10:52:46B4gderno, e1 is an ARM instruction
10:52:51LinusNsilly me
10:53:12*LinusN needs more coffee
10:53:31LinusNi'm still in coldfire mode
10:53:38LinusNi need a reboot
10:54:05*preglow prods LinusN with a paperclip
10:54:30LinusNSCANNING BRAIN...
10:54:40B4gderwell, at least nobody found the assert strings before so I wasn't repeating myself 100%
10:54:53LinusNdamn, i went into OF
10:56:46preglowtell me when you're in ipod mode, i want some info back from retailos
10:57:53preglowwe need more cyborg developers
11:00:53JdGordonok, well now im stumped... apparently the lcd backlight is controlled by GIO37... but it only has 32 gio's? wtf?
11:01:58LinusNJdGordon: which one?
11:02:16peturmaybe they continue counting on the next port?
11:14:03 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
11:17:40JdGordon:p its got 48 gpio's.. the datasheet is for an older version
11:17:55JdGordonor diferent version.. or something
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11:30:45Zagorwhat happens when you plug usb into a running ipod?
11:31:14Zagordo we load OF?
11:31:22***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:31:24LinusNrunning rockbox? it boots the of
11:31:30Zagorusing rolo?
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11:31:51LinusNi *think* it reboots
11:31:58LinusNthen the of detects USB
11:32:02 Quit webguest89 (Client Quit)
11:32:09amiconnIt reboots with some magic strings set in iram
11:32:09Zagorwe need the c200 to do something similar
11:32:23amiconnThose strings tell the apple loader to enter emergency disk mode
11:32:30LinusNamiconn: ah, i see
11:33:43 Nick kclaf is now known as kclafk (i=kclaf@
11:33:49Zagorthe c200 could just reboot, and hence load system/OF.mi4
11:34:10Zagoror load it immediately
11:34:26amiconnfirmware/target/arm/usb-fw-pp502x.c lines 114..120 and usb-fw-pp5002.c lines 45..55
11:35:20amiconnOn H10 we just reboot, and the iriver loader detects usb and enters usb mode (on ums models)
11:35:36peturwe do?
11:35:41amiconnOn mtp models the user needs to continue holding the Select button for the "ums trick"
11:35:55peturI don't think my H10 reboots
11:36:00amiconnpetur: yes, but operation is inverted from the ipods
11:36:12amiconnYou need to hold Select while plugging to make it reboot
11:36:22Zagorunfortunately the c200 has no such mode. it needs to boot the OF fully.
11:37:01amiconnNot holding it makes it go to usb power mode. This is to ease operation on mtp models
11:37:34 Part agm3nt
11:38:47Zagorwhat about the sansa e200 ?
11:39:14ZagorI don't see anything in the code
11:40:20 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
11:43:52amiconnI don't know
11:44:50amiconnZagor: The "not supported ipods" info on the frontpage misses the shuffles
11:45:22amiconnAnd the mini comes in 2 generations
11:45:42JdGordonso, the gpio's have a setbit and a clearbit register, it says "1 is output when 1 is written to the relevant bit in the set register and 0 when 1 is written to the clear register" does that mean it will stay 1 untill you set the clear bit? or do you have to keep setting the set bit for it to stay high?
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11:46:39amiconnI would also explicitly mention the 5.5th gen
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11:46:57ZagorJdGordon: it stays 1
11:47:20JdGordonand I guess the set bit would get set to 0 automaticlly?
11:47:42Zagorundefined. you don't normally read those registers.
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11:47:52Zagorunless it says you can :-)
11:48:04JdGordonso you just set it and then dont worry about it?
11:48:44*JdGordon has only done 1 hardware subject in 4 years at uni
11:49:06Zagoramiconn: we support both gen minis, don't we?
11:49:17AnarchoVeganHi everyone!
11:49:46AnarchoVeganUm, how do you convert MP4 movies to MPEG for rockbox in Linux?
11:49:55AnarchoVegan(Ubuntu to be exact)
11:50:03amiconnZagor: yes
11:50:41 Quit homielowe ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
11:51:22markunAnarchoVegan: I use mencoder
11:51:36markunbut ffmpeg and vlc can also do it
11:51:51AnarchoVeganawesome :D thanks *runs off to google*
11:52:37pixelmaAnarchoVegan: the PluginMpegplayer page in th wiki should have the necessary info (also links and such) ;)
11:58:12JdGordonwoo! backlight sort of works
11:58:14*JdGordon gones
12:00:24markunnice upgrade (couldn't find the 160GB yet)
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12:04:37preglowZagor: i don't believe e200 handles usb at all on rockbox
12:04:38peturmarkun: pata = iriver h1x0/h3x0 compatible, right?
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12:05:44peturbah... ZIF connector
12:07:21markunpetur: I also see HS12SJB
12:07:35markunmight be doesn't say ZIF, just PATA
12:07:42markun-might be
12:08:28petur says it is (specs tab)
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12:09:04markunI tried to find the 160GB ones by playing with the model names, but no luck
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12:24:38preglowanyone know why cuesheet support needs to be an option? some need for allocating memory?
12:24:47preglowit feels like a really silly option :/
12:26:59pixelmaI think it was because it takes away a noticeable amount of RAM for those who don't use it
12:27:53preglowthere has to be some way of allocating that only when needed
12:28:11 Quit kubiixaka ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
12:28:56pixelmae.g. there was a time when the voice file I used by then wasn't usable anymore on my Ondio just by enabling that option
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12:33:02preglowperhaps with mob we can get rid of the option
12:34:55preglowbut ok, since pretty much everyone says it's ok, i'll commit the patch to remove the id3 prio setting
12:47:05B4gdertrying to challange nls as the green line delta king? ;-)
12:47:50B4gderbtw, nls change is an awesome example how dev2.cgi gives more nice details
12:48:23B4gderon the M5 it saved 540 bytes on disk, but 964 in ram
12:48:47B4gder( I mean)
12:49:04*B4gder loves a good monologue...
12:50:04preglowwoo :P
12:50:07preglownice green line
12:51:07preglowi don't do too many of those, heh
12:51:29preglowi like the fact that we now have one less setting better, though
12:51:30 Join webguest01 [0] (i=42f95441@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
12:51:40preglowbut let's just wait until someone complains...
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12:52:24preglowi don't get the warning in the build table
12:52:39preglowargument 5 is an int8_t, it should be quite ok to pass it +1 and -1...
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12:53:14B4gderisn't arg 5 the struct pointer?
12:53:33B4gdernot that I understand the warning anymore because of that...
12:53:47B4gderto me that looks like a compiler bug
12:54:25webguest01Hi... um... I am trying to compile rockbox with some patches, but most of the patches are html notepad typings, not .patch files. any help
12:54:42B4gderhtml notepad typings?
12:54:45B4gderwhat is that?
12:55:34webguest01its just text plain text
12:55:44markunwebguest01: can you give a link to one such file?
12:55:52B4gderwebguest01: patches are plain text
12:55:59B4gdersource code changes even
12:56:07preglowB4gder: yeah, it is
12:56:09*preglow rubs eyes
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13:19:22ZagorB4gder: we need more server info, to solve the sporadic size variations
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13:22:03B4gderyes, like 64bit or not
13:23:05amiconnZagor: The SH size differences are caused by the server
13:23:23amiconn...but it has the recommended gcc and bintuils versions
13:23:34Zagorexactly. so we need more info.
13:23:49B4gderright, like what host gcc that built the cross-compiler... :-!
13:24:01amiconn...and it can't be a 32bit vs. 64 bit issue, as the other build servers are both 32bit and 64 bit
13:24:13B4gderyes, it's not that simple
13:24:28B4gdereven though it might be a contributing factor
13:24:37pixelmaand the bigger differences on arm are caused by deepthought - but it runs slightly different gcc and binutils
13:24:55amiconnThe arm size difference is from a non-recommended gcc
13:25:17amiconn(4.0.4 instead of 4.0.3 on
13:28:40JdGordonplugin api version wasnt bumped....
13:29:57preglowJdGordon: good point
13:30:50Zagoryay. if you remove the system/data directory, it no longer rebuilds the database
13:31:24***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:32:25Zagorhmm, buttons are wrong in set time. DOWN and UP both change the value and move to next field
13:34:08B4gdersee also fs#7749
13:35:24pixelmaI'm working at it
13:35:49pixelmabut stumbled over plugin button actions... :\
13:35:57*JdGordon hides
13:36:03Zagorpixelma: you're fixing the time screen too?
13:36:35pixelmano, just the plugins for now
13:36:43Zagorok. I'll look at time then
13:37:22*pixelma votes for getting rid of plugin button actions too
13:38:34MikhailTkachits been suggested that I create a wiki page for my NES plugin. do I need write permission for wiki or something?
13:38:47JdGordononly if you want to write
13:38:52ZagorMikhailTkach: yes. have you registered?
13:39:01Zagoras MikhailTkach ?
13:39:11Zagorok, i'll fix you up
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13:40:28Nico_P[12:24] <preglow> anyone know why cuesheet support needs to be an option? some need for allocating memory? => when you activate this, space is reserved for two cue files
13:40:50Nico_Pmob will remove the need for that option
13:41:06ZagorMikhailTkach: done
13:41:12MikhailTkachthanks again
13:44:31JdGordonwhere should I put the genereic dm320 spi code? target/arm/spi-dm320.c ?
13:44:39Zagordo we want the e200 to reboot on usb-insert too?
13:44:51B4gderJdGordon: seems reasonable to me
13:45:00JdGordonZagor: it doesnt because apparently there is a problem on osx with usb detection
13:45:12 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
13:45:37ZagorJdGordon: in what way?
13:45:48JdGordonnot sure, you want to speak to barry about it
13:46:13preglowNico_P: most excellent
13:47:02rasherHow much space is reserved? Is it significant enough to justify another option?
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13:50:47amiconnAround 20KB iirc
13:51:02markunMikhailTkach: if you like emulators, maybe you can also help out with this page a little:
13:51:41MikhailTkachI'll look into it
13:51:49markunJdGordon: why not make a dm320 subdir in target/arm?
13:52:09markun(like s3c2440)
13:52:15JdGordonprobably will need to..
13:52:28B4gderyeah that sounds even better
13:52:28JdGordonwhatever happened to merigng the pp targets into one subfolder also?
13:52:38markunit makes more sense to have all dm320 player in there then under their brand names
13:53:11JdGordonarm/dm320/olympus/mrobe-500 ? one too many folders for the current systm
13:53:24markun-olympus I would say
13:53:28B4gderme too
13:53:37markunor do all olypus players share some code?
13:53:43B4gderor possibly "olympus-mrobe-500"
13:53:44JdGordonno idea
13:54:34JdGordonlast time we had this discussion there was a bit of talk about adding a 4th level...
13:54:41JdGordoncant remember why we didnt do it though
13:54:43B4gderthere's not a lot ipod-specific code though
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13:55:44JdGordonthere are 3 subfolders under ipod
13:56:04JdGordononly 1g2g actually has a few files though
13:56:25markunI don't understand why lcd-color_nano.c is in arm/ipod and lcd-video.c is in arm/ipod/video for example
13:57:41Zagormeh, you have to remove system/data every time you connect... :-(
13:57:55JdGordonZagor: or get the bootloader to do it
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13:58:26B4gderthat's about as futile though :-(
13:58:29Zagoryeah, but it doesn't feel right to remove stuff automatically. especially since some people are likely to want to run both firmwares
13:58:47JdGordonhave you checked for the changed byte like in the e200?
13:59:04Zagorchanged byte?
13:59:05B4gderJdGordon: even there it just works for specific firmware versions
13:59:16JdGordonyeah, but better than nothing
13:59:19B4gderZagor: there's a magic byte you can poke to make it not scan
13:59:34Zagorin iram?
13:59:40B4gderZagor: do some dumps before a scan and after one to find it
13:59:49B4gderin the secret partition iirc
14:00:45linuxstb_markun: lcd-color_nano.c is used by two ipods (Color and Nano), lcd-video.c is only the Video.
14:00:51markunah, ok
14:01:28linuxstb_Has anyone tried sansapatcher with the c200 yet?
14:01:35B4gderZagor: our bootloader checks the specific firmware version and sets the magic byte on usb-bootup to atttempt to prevent the scan
14:01:54B4gderlinuxstb_: I'm trying to push zagor into that corner
14:02:12Zagorand they're in different positions for different firmwares?
14:02:26B4gderZagor: I don't recall the specific details
14:02:30Zagoroops, system_reboot() hung my c200
14:02:38amiconnmarkun: lcd-video.c is for the video *only*, while lcd-color_nano.c is for the color and nano
14:02:52Zagorisn't that supposed to work the same on all pp502x?
14:03:12linuxstb_B4gder: If it works, a short-term solution would just be to rename sansapatcher to c200patcher and compile in the c200 bootloader. But we also need detection for rbutil, so eventually we should have a single sansapatcher.
14:03:31Zagorok, guide me through the sansapatcher test
14:03:42linuxstb_Are you on Linux?
14:03:42markunamiconn: yes, that's what linuxstb_ told me a few lines up :)
14:03:53B4gderlinuxstb_: what do you think about sansapatcher storing a byte somewhere about it finding a c200 or a e200 when it first runs?
14:04:21Zagormaybe I should restore OF first?
14:04:40linuxstb_Zagor: Firstly attach your c200 in USB mode, then just run "sansapatcher" without any arguments. You will need read rights to the raw disk device (/dev/sdN)
14:04:43pixelmalinuxstb: should sansapatcher also work on windows? (Mightbe able to test in a few days...)
14:04:56linuxstb_pixelma: Yes, it should work everywhere.
14:05:19linuxstb_It's only the special e200r USB code that we're struggling with on Windows (although not much development is going on)
14:05:46linuxstb_Zagor: If sansapatcher detects your c200, then just do "c" to cancel.
14:05:52pixelmaok, guess I'm going to test then
14:06:04Zagorwell first, how do I build sansapatcher?
14:06:28ZagorNo rule to make target `PP5022.mi4', needed by `bootimg.c'. Stop.
14:06:39Zagorshould I copy OF to this dir?
14:06:45JdGordonyou need to build the bootloader
14:06:46linuxstb_You need to create that file - it's the Rockbox bootloader mi4.
14:06:52Zagoraha, ok
14:07:02linuxstb_We don't distribute the Sansa firmware ;)
14:07:14linuxstb_(the pp5022.mi4 file is embedded into sansapatcher)
14:07:48Zagor"No E200s found, aborting"
14:08:25linuxstb_OK... Next test is to identify the raw disk device (e.g. /dev/sdb) your c200 has been assigned, and run "sansapatcher /dev/sdb". That should tell you which check failed.
14:08:39Zagorsdb or sdb2?
14:08:45linuxstb_sdb - the whole disk device
14:09:05Zagorpartition dump, then "Disk is not an E200 (-1), aborting."
14:09:17*linuxstb_ goes to read the source
14:09:31B4gderwell, it isn't a e200 I'll give it that ;-)
14:10:34linuxstb_OK, -1 should mean the partition layout is "wrong". It expects the first partition to be 0xb or 0xc, and the second to be 0x84
14:11:06Zagorfirst is 0x06, second is 0x84
14:11:19Zagorthis is a small flash, so uses fat16
14:11:39Zagor(yeah it's stupid and wrong)
14:11:55linuxstb_Zagor: Can you edit line 333 of sansapatcher.c to add 0x06 to the valid types?
14:12:52ZagorI'll restore
14:13:09linuxstb_Yep, that means your firmware partition contains a Rockbox bootloader and no OF.
14:14:14*webmind has a rockbox.ipod in his / on his ipod nano, but this is not updated by the zip-file, is this actually still needed ?
14:14:24amiconnWe should also allow type 0x0e to make sure
14:14:25B4gderwebmind: no, that's ooooold
14:14:27linuxstb_You'll probably need to add more OF keys to sansapatcher.c as well - just search for "keys"
14:14:34amiconn(fat16 with lba addressing)
14:14:36webmindB4gder, ok, I'll remove it :)
14:14:51*webmind hasn't updated in a while
14:14:55B4gdersansapatcher needs a set of c200 keys, yes
14:15:11B4gderZagor: want me to add them?
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14:17:27ZagorI bootloader should look for .rockbox/OF too. then you could just wipe the entire system dir
14:17:33ZagorI *think*
14:18:10linuxstb_What does the OF do if there's no system dir? Does it mind?
14:18:36Zagorhaven't tested without the system dir yet, but I've tried removed everything and it didn't mind.
14:18:43Zagoreverything in it, I mean
14:18:49linuxstb_But the intention of sansapatcher is that people don't need an OF.* file on the FAT32 partition at all - it's in the firmware partition.
14:19:15Zagorsure, but as long as we don't have USB we need OF on the c200
14:19:36linuxstb_Yes, and the bootloader starts it from the firmware partition.
14:20:03linuxstb_i.e. the Rockbox bootloader first checks the firmware partition for a copy of the OF, then OF.mi4 and OF.bin on the FAT partition.
14:20:13Zagorah right, I haven't actually tried that since OF.mi4 started working.
14:20:56linuxstb_It requires you to use sansapatcher to install - otherwise the Rockbox bootloader takes the place of the OF in the firmware partition. sansapatcher keeps a copy there.
14:22:27Zagorright, back to sansapatcher. Enter i to install the Rockbox bootloader, u to uninstall
14:22:40Zagorbut this will install the e200 loader, won't it?
14:22:53linuxstb_Not if you compiled it with the c200 PP5022.mi4
14:23:02Zagorright. my fingers are faster than my brain :)
14:23:08linuxstb_Or you can use an external mi4 with "sansapatcher -a pp5022.mi4"
14:23:30Zagor"Failed to decrypt image, aborting" - forgot to include Bagders' new keys
14:24:20Zagor[INFO] Bootloader installed successfully.
14:24:58linuxstb_Is it actually booting?
14:25:18Zagoryep, works perfectly
14:25:41linuxstb_So it _should_ now be loading the OF from the firmware partition - you can delete the OF.* files in system.
14:26:40Zagoryes it does. great!
14:26:58*Zagor commits the new partition types
14:27:29linuxstb_OK, so next step is working how how to tell the difference between a c200 and e200, and installing the correct bootloader...
14:27:47Zagorthe mi4 key?
14:27:57B4gderthe mi4 key is a working approach
14:28:18B4gderuntil sansapatcher has installed
14:28:39B4gderbut on an existing installation, I figure it can check the bootloader to detect target?
14:28:49Zagoror run lsusb and check the id...
14:28:53linuxstb_I would prefer checking for version strings in the Sansa bootloader, if that's feasible.
14:29:18*linuxstb_ invites Zagor to implement cross-platform usb detection
14:29:58Zagorare we using libusb in windows?
14:30:52Zagorwindows is a mess :(
14:31:21 Nick idnar_ is now known as idnar (i=mithrand@unaffiliated/idnar)
14:31:53linuxstb_I don't know if this will work, but the c200 bootloader seems to have the string PRIMARY_BOOTLOADER near the start - the e200 bootloader I've looked at doesn't.
14:32:48preglowdoing some custom usb code for windows shouldn't be too hard, but you never know...
14:33:28B4gderI'll check with the c200 bootloaders I have
14:34:55rasherI wonder where all the windows coders with a clue hide. Surely it must be possible to query which devices are attached through usb
14:34:57linuxstb_There are 33 releases of the c200 bootloader?
14:35:07 Quit ivan` ("Coyote finally caught me")
14:35:08B4gderyes, well 33 firmware packages
14:35:14B4gderI bet most of them have the same bl
14:35:14JdGordonrasher: same answer as why we had no wma for so long?
14:35:17linuxstb_rasher: Probably not hacking open source...
14:35:41preglowi could have a go at it afterwards
14:35:50preglowdepending on whether i use windows today
14:35:50rasherJdGordon: considering the amount of software that works for Windows, I doubt that's the case
14:36:15linuxstb_preglow: Speak to bluebrother - I'm pretty sure he's been experimenting with that.
14:37:04preglowwhat values are we looking for?
14:37:12linuxstb_The vendor and product IDs.
14:37:29linuxstb_And whilst you're there, do the same with firewire... ;)
14:37:33rasherI wonder if EFNet's #winprog might be able to help
14:37:37B4gder$ grep -c PRIMARY_BOOTLOAD dump
14:37:46linuxstb_Can you do the same on e200 bootloaders?
14:37:59preglowlinuxstb_: i don't have firewire
14:38:12linuxstb_B4gder: Can you tell if they're all at the same offset?
14:38:31linuxstb_(0x20 in the one I'm looking at)
14:38:32B4gderthey are all at offset 0x20
14:38:53B4gderI did hexdump -C | head on them all
14:39:03linuxstb_Then assuming no e200 bootloader has that string, we have a plan.
14:40:05B4gderdoing that scan now
14:40:15amiconnlinuxstb: Firewire pids aren't mandatory
14:40:30linuxstb_In what way? Devices aren't required to present them?
14:40:37amiconnE.g. we can't distinguish 1st/2nd gen ipods from 3rd gen ipods via firewire
14:41:09B4gderit's there in a e200 bl
14:41:10linuxstb_amiconn: That won't be a problem - we can do the firmware partition check as a second stage.
14:41:18linuxstb_B4gder: Delete it!
14:41:23amiconnAn interesting linux kernel patch: (search for model_id == 0)
14:42:34amiconnFirewire vid 0x0a2700 means Apple
14:44:42Zagordo we know ipod 1g/2g doesn't have pids?
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14:45:15linuxstb_B4gder: Can you spot anything we can use?
14:46:57amiconnZagor: Check that patch. It tells about pids for various ipods
14:46:58B4gderhere's a e200 one
14:47:05B4gderhere's a c200 one
14:47:42Zagorah. "There are iPods (2nd gen, 3rd gen) with model_id == 0"
14:47:42B4gder"strings *.rom | grep -i sansa" shows the model, but that's slightly inconveniant
14:47:55linuxstb_B4gder: I get error 403 on the e200.rom
14:48:07B4gdersorry, try again
14:48:12linuxstb_That's good.
14:48:23JdGordonspi seems to be working :)
14:48:42linuxstb_B4gder: Are you sure that's an e200 bootloader?
14:49:10B4gderstrings it and it says e250 even
14:49:28B4gderI found that PRIMARY thing in three different e200 upgrade packages
14:49:52linuxstb_Large parts are byte-for-byte identical to the c200...
14:50:26linuxstb_But yes, as you say, it contains "Sansa e250"...
14:50:38B4gderits the e200 A1_03_01 firmware upgrade package
14:50:57B4gderand c200 is the A1.00.03 one
14:51:05linuxstb_Maybe just searching the entire bootloader for the string "Sansa C200" would work...
14:51:34B4gderI can alter my script and check for that
14:53:04B4gdergrep -c "Sansa C200" dump
14:53:09 Part wookey__
14:54:04B4gderI'll just check the e200 ones now too to be sure
14:55:39B4gderthey all say Sansa e250
14:55:57linuxstb_Is there a stdlib function that will do that search?
14:56:21B4gdermemmem ?
14:56:33B4gder"This function is a GNU extension."
14:57:09Prowhat is the use of the whole album art patches when no wps works with the newest version correctly??
14:58:28B4gderlinuxstb: I'll re-run and see if the offsets are somewhat similar
14:58:40*B4gder found "strings -t x"
14:59:19ZagorPro: the patches are additions to the official rockbox. of course the wps:es don't work on rockbox without those patches.
14:59:57preglowgood old winapi
15:00:55DBUGEnqueued KICK B4gder
15:01:15 Join RaRe` [0] (
15:01:57Proyeah i know has the 6GB Sansa e270 today for $80 (refurbished). Not a bad deal. You can probably find a 8GB model new in stores for $120-$130 if you are in the United States.
15:02:29ZagorPro: so what was your question?
15:02:42Probut the old wps don't work on new rockbox because changes are made in the patches but NOT in the WPS
15:03:14ZagorPro: are you talking about album art patches now, or rockbox?
15:03:16Pro(by version i mean the newest version of album art in my first question)
15:03:35ProAlbum Art
15:03:45rasherPro: Then your problem is with the theme authors, not with Rockbox.
15:03:59Zagoryou have to discuss that with the authors of those versions then. we don't make nor support them.
15:04:21CtcpIgnored 1 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
15:04:21*pixelma unboxes new c250..
15:04:33Probut there are also a lot of nice Wps who don't require AA and don't work either ;-(
15:04:54B4gderPro: then they are done wrong, or depend on other patches
15:05:09B4gderagain, talk to the ones who made them
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15:05:31preglowwe should start thinking about those patches soon...
15:05:48preglowit doesn't seem like any better solutions are happening
15:05:52 Quit SkinInd95 (Client Quit)
15:05:53pixelmathere were quite a few wps that had wrong syntax which was tolerated by the old parser
15:05:59B4gdernow this is a cool menu overview =>
15:06:26Zagorvery nice
15:06:35rasherB4gder: that needs more device icons
15:06:47 Quit ivan` ("Coyote finally caught me")
15:06:54rasherBut yes, very handy, will bookmark.
15:07:17B4gderI found it in this thread =>
15:08:24preglowfive menu levels, that's ouchy
15:09:09petursix (main menu + 5 levels of settings)
15:09:12rasher The man's got a point. I wonder what a diff myconfig defaultconfig would show. Probably not a lot
15:10:04B4gderwe could do a "collect configs" site and see...
15:10:05rasherMaybe an "upload your most used configuration file" drive would produce interesting results
15:10:15 Quit baratrion (Remote closed the connection)
15:10:25pixelmaconfig.cfg just saves the differences to the default
15:10:31rasherEven easier then
15:13:59pixelmaZagor: my c250 of is version 1.00.04F - is that ok?
15:14:32Zagoryou probably have the older key too
15:14:39B4gderthat should be fine
15:14:49Zagorah, you added that
15:14:51B4gderA1, E1, F1, P1 verified
15:14:55B4gder(of that version)
15:15:24B4gderyeah, all known sansa c200 and e200 firmwares should work now
15:16:16pixelmaanything I could do to test, find out something about it?
15:16:36 Join eigma [0] (n=cat@
15:16:53JdGordonhey eigma
15:16:54B4gderpixelma: you can build a windows version of sansapatcher for it and try
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15:17:21pixelmaI got one with radio if that counts
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15:17:54B4gderI bet it counts, but I don't know if anyone checked the fm support on the c200
15:17:55pixelmaok, B4gder are there a page with instruction I could read up?
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15:18:29B4gderpixelma: I don't think so. 1) build a c200 bootloader, 2) put the bootload mi4 in the sansapatcher dir and build that 3) run sansapatcher on your computer
15:18:57GreySimAnyone know what the current equivalent to "%s%m|110|215|%ac%?id<%id|%d1>" is in WPS code? I'm completely new to WPS coding, and have looked through the documentation and can't find %m anywhere, so am assuming it's depreciated, but can't find it's replacement if there is one...
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15:20:11GreySimOr does anyone know where I can find a build of Rockbox for an iPod Photo that would support DGT 1.3 with album art?
15:20:32B4gderlow_light: very good progress on sansapatcher for c200 in here today
15:20:34*low_light sees lots of c200 activity
15:20:43low_lightI saw.
15:23:28low_lightActually, the initial install can be quite easy without it. Boot OF usb. Then copy the rockbox bootloader (firmware.mi4) to the root & unzip a c200 build. Unmount/disconnect.
15:23:31pixelmawow, volume level control is very coarse
15:23:37pixelmain the of
15:23:41low_lightIt upgrades automatically.
15:23:56B4gderyes, but what about the OF?
15:24:05low_lightNo need to use recovery mode (as linuxstb pointed out to me)
15:24:30low_lightRight...copy the OF to /System
15:24:41B4gderright, but that part is what makes it tricky to users
15:24:47B4gdersince they don't have the mi4
15:24:52low_lightBut sansapatcher is better
15:25:20low_lightDoes rbutil integrate sansapatcher too?
15:26:19B4gderI believe it does
15:26:44low_lightpixelma: radio does not work. The chip is the same as the e200, but the init process must be different.
15:26:54B4gdernow we just need to make sansapatcher able to detect if it is a c200 or a e200
15:27:37Zagoranyone have an idea why system_reboot() doesn't work on c200? it's not terribly complicated...
15:29:23pixelmalow_light: oh well, hopefully it will be
15:31:12rasherpreglow: looks like gammu, audacity and others do usb detection on windows:
15:31:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:32:44rasherI'm having a go at it right now, looking at msdn and audacity
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15:34:22GreySimI think I'm just going to sell my iPod since I don't like any of the firmwares available for it, but for the record, I would suggest considering rewriting the WPS/theme engine whatnot to be more friendly to potential themers. Tweaking a theme shouldn't involve deciphering arcane stuff like %t1 %?bp<%?bc<%xda|%xdf>|%?bl<%xde|%xda|%xdb|%xdc|%xdd|%xde>>;%t1 %?bp<%?bc<%xdb|%xdf>|%?bl<%xde|%xda|%xdb|%xdc|%xdd|%xde>>;%t1 %?bp<%?bc<%xdc|%xdf>|%?bl
15:34:23GreySim<%xde|%xda|%xdb|%xdc|%xdd|%xde>>;%t1 %?bp<%?bc<%xdd|%xdf>|%?bl<%xde|%xda|%xdb|%xdc|%xdd|%xde>>;%t1 %?bp<%?bc<%xde|%xdf>|%?bl<%xde|%xda|%xdb|%xdc|%xdd|%xde>>, in my opinion. (That opinion being one of someone who almost became a WPS coder, but instead will just be looking for an MP3 player with a default firmware that doesn't suck.) Good job and thanks for what you have done though, and I hope a few months down the line it's even better.
15:34:48low_lightB4gder: is the PP id string at the beginning of firmware.mi4/PP5022.mi4 the same?
15:34:56low_lightThe c200 is PP5022BF-06.10-S301-06.10-S301.01.00
15:34:56preglowGreySim: feel free to suggest alternatives
15:35:15low_lightI think the last part is the firmware version
15:35:30ZagorGreySim: you can choose: unconfigurable and simple, or configurable or complex
15:35:38sgsaxas a dead-simple macro "language", wps is actually pretty decent
15:36:03B4gderhm PP5022AF it says in one I just randomly picked
15:36:08linuxstb_low_light: I think it's best to check for magic in the bootloader, rather than the OF - sansapatcher doesn't touch the bootloader, whereas the OF could be in various locations, or maybe not there at all (if the user installed without sansapatcher).
15:36:36linuxstb_It's safe to assume the bootloader will always be there, and always in the same place.
15:36:42markunGreySim: are you planning to buy another player?
15:36:46linuxstb_(Sansa bootloader, that is)
15:36:51GreySimpreglow: I would, and I might if I keep my iPod and try to tinker with Rockbox when I'm not so frustrated, but for the moment I need a sane MP3 player _now_. Not a few months down the line.
15:37:06GreySimmarkun: Probably.
15:37:12sgsaxso use rockbox with a prebuild theme and live with it
15:37:13markunany candidates?
15:37:15B4gderwhat is a sane player then?
15:37:26preglowGreySim: well, the wps language will almost certainly not be different "a few months down the line"
15:37:26ZagorGreySim: why are you tinkering with the wps if you don't want to?
15:37:33ZagorI never do
15:39:08GreySimSorry. My problems extend beyond the WPS language. But I really should leave for the moment, and come back when I'm a bit more...calm and collected.
15:39:20linuxstb_rasher: Regarding USB ids, the requirement for USB IDs will be to identify the device, and also find where in the filesystem it's mounted.
15:39:22Zagorok :-)
15:40:42 Quit GreySim ("I might be back, and hopefully making more sense and being more constructive and less complaintive.")
15:42:41rasherlinuxstb_: I'm going for identifying the device. Or rather, first I'm going for figuring out how to use the setupapi stuff at all
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15:44:46ZagorI like googles sublinks for rockbox. they have to be manually added.
15:45:20rasherZagor: how's that done? (off-topic, I guess)
15:45:22B4gderyeah, it seems some projects get that honor. I've seen curl get them too
15:45:40Zagorrasher: that's what I mean. they are manually added by someone at google (or a partner)
15:45:58Zagorlook at the "what is rockbox" link. that is not even the title of the page.
15:46:10rasherAh, like that - I thought I was missing something
15:46:13B4gderyeah, that really looks manually done
15:46:15Zagorit's _half_ the first <h1>. that's not done by a machine.
15:48:42pixelmasorry for stupid question but I have never needed to do it yet but how do I build the sansapatcher? </noob mode>
15:49:15Zagorpixelma: copy your built bootloader mi4 to the sansapatcher dir, then run make there
15:49:25 Quit eigma ()
15:49:30Zagor(I learned this just an hour or so ago :)
15:50:33low_lightalso edit the makefile and change PP5022.mi4 to firmware.mi4
15:50:41low_lightor rename the file
15:50:56JdGordonconfigure is where that filename is chosen
15:50:56Zagorright. I just copied it to the PP name
15:51:16pixelmahmm... I should be able to see a system folder?
15:51:45pixelmawhen I connect the sansa to my comp that is
15:52:06ZagorJdGordon: it's in sansapatcher/Makefile
15:52:07low_lightIf you are using sansapatcher you don't need to put anything in /System
15:52:30pixelmabut where do I get the mi4 from?
15:52:41B4gderthe sansas has no /System when shipped, afaik
15:52:41JdGordonZagor: oh, I was thinking the bootloader Makefile... ignore me :)
15:52:49B4gderthe System dir originates from the h10 way
15:52:51Zagorpixelma: build it, using tools/configure in a new dir
15:53:12B4gderunless pixelma speaks of the OF mi4
15:53:13low_lightpixelma: build the rockbox bootloader for c200
15:53:41pixelmaah, ok. I somehow thought I need the original one that's already on there too
15:53:48Zagormy sansa c250 definitely has a system dir. and it's recreated no matter what I do.
15:54:00B4gderis it marked hidden?
15:54:26Zagorhmm, how do I run dos dir again?
15:54:43low_lightpixelma: sansapatcher is supposed to take care of that
15:54:45linuxstb_Zagor: Sounds similar to the ipods - there's an "ipod_control" folder (marked as hidden/system) which the Apple firmware will recreate if you delete it.
15:55:32linuxstb_pixelma: The hidden firmware partition on the Sansa contains both the Sansa bootloader and Sansa OF. sansapatcher adds the Rockbox bootloader there.
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15:56:40pixelmaI don't know but I think my sansa connects in mtp mode (if that's possible), there is a usb setting in the OF ("automatically" or "MSC"), if I set it to MSC it doesn't seem to connect (in windows that is)
15:57:42linuxstb_Zagor: "mdir" ?
15:58:03linuxstb_Zagor: (probably after configuring mtools to assign a fake drive letter to the device)
15:58:12Zagorannoying tool
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16:02:30pixelmaI think the device has to be connected in msc mode, and I need administrator right?
16:04:11pixelmaah, now the usb setting took effect
16:04:15*Zagor kicks mtools to next week
16:05:52Zagorgotta go
16:05:52 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
16:06:55 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
16:08:48low_lightpixelma: do you have a microsd card to try?
16:09:37pixelmano but someone named agm3nt tried earlier when I asked and he said his 1GB card wouldn't work
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16:14:40*amiconn guesses the detection is different
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16:16:40low_lightpixelma: I hope you can check the keymappings. I know somethings are going to the resuming playback sometimes when pressing up.
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16:20:51low_lightamiconn: sd_card_mux is different than the e200. The settings for the flash mem were in the bootloader, but I guessed on the microsd setup.
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16:24:10low_lighthmm. actually looking more closely it could also be a different gpio_input_val bit
16:24:22low_lightfor detection.
16:27:00low_lightactually, the interrupts are not enabled for the microsd
16:27:13low_lightso of course there's no detection.
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16:35:27*pixelma curses ISP
16:35:29Xay0rhas anyone managed to get rockbox to work on an iPod Nano 2g?
16:37:16Soapno. It is quite a bit more complicated than "getting it to work". The hardware is unknown (for the sake of this argument) and the existing firmware Apple ships is encrypted. Nobody the world-over has figured out a way to run their own code on an iPod of Nano 2nd Gen. or newer. I'm talking about running /any/ code - much less a full operating system such as rockbox.
16:39:23Xay0rI see
16:39:59linuxstb_Xay0r: This is a summary of the work needed for any new port of Rockbox -
16:41:48Xay0rSoap, does that mean that it isn't possible to uncap the 2g EU nanos either?
16:42:11markunhow does uncapping normally work?
16:42:35Xay0rusing GoPod or w/e it's called I think
16:42:38SoapDon't know - but possibly, it isn't like you can modify the Nano 2G with a resource editor like ipodwizard.
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16:49:55sgsaxseems the website just died again
16:52:25linuxstb_And B4gder, LinusN and Zagor have all left...
16:52:38*linuxstb_ pings Bagder, just in case
16:58:03 Quit Xay0r ()
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16:58:49DefineByteis down?
16:59:10peturlinuxstb: maybe they took the server with them? ;)
17:00:04DefineBytei'll take that as a yes. :)
17:01:21*petur points DefineByte to the irc logs
17:01:24 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
17:01:43*petur slaps forehead
17:01:49DefineBytearen't the logs on
17:01:51peturlogs are on server that is down :)
17:01:51n1shehe :-)
17:02:54RudManlooks like another network loop by cogent
17:04:57DefineByteworking again
17:05:26DefineBytethe hamster probably got tired and took a break
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17:21:59bluebrotheris down or am I the only one having connection problems?
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17:23:19DefineByteit's down again?
17:23:26DefineByteit's only just gone back up
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17:24:28DefineBytedown for me too. -_-
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17:25:18bluebrotherdang :(
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17:30:08linuxstb_bluebrother: You probably haven't seen the logs, but rasher is investigating usb ids on Windows - how far did you get?
17:31:04bluebrothernot quite far. I failed to use the IOCTL that should give me more information about drives.
17:31:15 Nick parafin|away is now known as parafin (
17:31:29***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:31:42bluebrotherI also tried using VS2005, but the documentation is quite ... awful. Especially the usbview example −− #define hell without a need for that :(
17:32:20rasherI've found stuff which *should* give me a way to walk through usb devices, but it's not quite working
17:32:47bluebrotherI also tried using setupapi.h and was able to obtain a list of all devices in the pc. Restricting that list to usb didn't work unfortunately
17:33:45rasherThen you've probably done more work than me.. I'm mostly following what says
17:33:52SoapThis thread is bothering me. I was under the impression that the iPod Classic was using a _third_ type of HDD connector, neither the older ATA style of the iRivers/old iPods/Gigabeat, nor the ZIF of the iPod 5th gens.
17:33:54preglowso, how long until someone codec cover flow for us? :>
17:34:16amiconnSoap: I am quite sure it uses ZIF
17:34:32bluebrotherrasher: that's one of the documents I started with. Checking the source of usbview (part of the windows DDK) is also an idea.
17:34:33linuxstb_My understanding was the 18-pin CE-ATA
17:35:15bluebrotherthey use SetupDiGetClassDevs() too but first get a list of host controllers based on \\.\HCDn (with n being some number starting at 0)
17:35:23SoapThat's the one I was thinking I had heard it was linuxstb_ . Regardless, there is much confusion in that thread - and I am afraid cormie is about to buy a classic so he can put the drive in his H100.
17:35:27amiconnWell, from the 'naked' photos it does look like ZIF, not CE-ATA
17:35:38Soapbut not ATA.
17:35:49rasherbluebrother: Then I'll probably be of no help
17:35:56linuxstb_IIUC, Toshiba have high capacity CE-ATA drives which are used in ipods, and Samsung drives will be ZIF.
17:36:06bluebrotherwell, you could try of course and see if I overlooked something ;-)
17:36:16bluebrotherthe w32api really gives me a PITA
17:36:26markunSoap: I'm sorry if I contributed to the misinformation
17:36:43bluebrotherbut I never did real w32 programming in the past −− maybe it would be an easy thing for someone who knows the api
17:36:55linuxstb_The ipod classic 80GB drive is here - - MK8022GAA
17:37:02amiconnSoap: Yes, but ZIF<->50pin can be solved with an adapter. CE-ATA uses a different protocol (it's basically ATA via MMC)
17:37:07rasherbluebrother: Well after a few hours, I'm not yet past SetupDiEnumDeviceInterface() so you can imagine how well I'm doing
17:37:47bluebrotherI fear you're facing similar issues like I did though I hoped you'd succeed better.
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17:39:13bluebrotherdoes anybody know if the sources of the usbids.exe tool linked from the wiki are around somewhere?
17:39:26amiconnlinuxstb: See? Way more than 18 pin. Quite certain there are 40... i.e. ZIF
17:40:53linuxstb_Ah, it seems the 80GB and 160GB drives have different interfaces -
17:42:01tumuabout the theming language, maybe someone should implement lua or other simple scripting to rockbox?
17:42:50bluebrothernooo ...
17:43:02Lloreantumu: Is there something the current language can't be made to accomplish?
17:43:37preglowtumu: whyyyyyyy!??
17:43:46tumuLlorean, no, but if people are complaining about learning yet another arcane language
17:43:47preglowthat'd be so incredibly overkill it's not even funny
17:44:05preglowthe wps lang isn't even a language as such
17:44:08Lloreantumu: Most of these people don't know *any* languages.
17:44:14tumuand using more proper language might allow removing some overhead
17:44:21preglowif you can't be bothered to learn the wps syntax, you don't have enough patience to do anything
17:44:26preglowleast of all modifying a wps
17:44:31Lloreantumu: The WPS is just a series of very simple tokens. Implementing a scripting language would both horrify the lay user, and clog up the source.
17:44:35tumuor rather avoid having people to learn the internals of rockbox
17:44:48tumuthat's just my opinion
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17:45:00LloreanSince when do you need to learn the internals of Rockbox to make a WPS?
17:45:08linuxstb_tumu: Introducing a scripting language will remove overhead?
17:45:33amiconnThat means the 160GB classic has a whole different interface than the 80GB classic...
17:46:07tumulinuxstb, could remove, depending on the feature set we have for users
17:46:21linuxstb_amiconn: Yes, _assuming_ the 160GB drive in the ipods is that Toshiba drive.
17:47:19amiconnNobody dissected a 160GB classic yet?
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17:47:53tumulinuxstb, it's not necessarily good thing to force people to low-level programming with C to enhance rockbox
17:48:24linuxstb_amiconn: I've only seen that ifixit dissection, which is the 80GB.
17:49:05pixelmatumu: the wps syntax?
17:49:14 Quit dnanar ("leaving")
17:49:47tumupixelma, that, and in overall
17:49:54pixelmaneither low level nor C
17:50:26sgsaxno reason to learn C for theming
17:50:29tumuyes, but it is an exception
17:51:03Lloreantumu: Then what are these "enhancements" you see Lua offering since you suggested it as a replacement for the WPS syntax?
17:51:04tumusgsax, there's no need to learn C for various things what rockbox could allow
17:51:20sgsaxyou lost me there
17:51:30LloreanIf you're going to learn *a* language, it may as well be C.
17:51:35tumuLlorean, lua or some other
17:51:49Lloreantumu: Either way, they're restricted compared to C.
17:51:56DefineBytei don't want to have to learn lua to do anything with rockbox
17:52:09sgsaxembedded apps need to be as close to the bits as possible
17:52:23sgsaxthat leaves you pretty much with asm and C
17:52:53tumusgsax, you should tell that to anyone using java on mobile devices :)
17:52:59sgsaxuserspace, now there's someplace where you could get away with a "higher-level" lang
17:53:12pixelmaand people who don't know lua or whatever would have to learn that, just like people who don't know C have to do now. Where's the difference?
17:53:15sgsaxdon't get me started on java
17:53:33DefineBytehehe i have to program in Java >.>
17:53:46Lloreantumu: People using JAVA are often doing so in a situation where there are many devices and softwares their "app" can be run on, and they value ease of distribution / portability over performance.
17:54:01markuntumu: are you going to put your money where your mouth is? (porting lua)
17:54:02sgsaxoh, there's nothing "bad" about java, but I have no idea why you would want to use it on an embedded platform
17:54:08Lloreantumu: In the case of Rockbox, there is a single OS and a well structured means of compiling for the various devices.
17:54:13tumumarkun, sure, i can port lua to rockbox :)
17:54:51sgsaxgetting back to the wps question, has anybody looked at implementing xml for theming?
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17:55:05markunsgsax: no
17:55:23sgsaxgranted, theme creators would still need to "learn a new scripting language"
17:55:37sgsaxbut I wonder if xml might be more accessible than wps
17:55:44amiconnxml is way overkill on an embedded device
17:55:46sgsaxnot that I'm saying there's anything wrong with wps
17:56:10sgsaxxml is overkill for a lot of things
17:56:20rasherI suppose a "more verbose syntax" -> "wps" compiler might be helpful
17:56:39Lloreanrasher: There used to be a utility like that.
17:56:53DefineBytei remember a theme builder
17:57:03rasherShows you how much I know
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17:57:34sgsaxit just get abandoned? it me or be walkin the plank?
17:57:53LloreanI think just a "WPS previewer" would be nice. Live update as you type your WPS, or similar.
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17:58:47rasherCouldn't there be a flag in the sim that made it continually reload the wps?
17:58:59rasherEvery n seconds
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17:59:26sgsaxoh, speaking of the sim, ran into something last night
17:59:55sgsaxcan you recreate the device's / filesystem for the sim? and if so, where?
18:00:19rashersgsax: in archos/
18:00:24sgsaxcan't debug theming the playback screen if you don't have anything to playback
18:00:43DefineByteyou need to setup various files with different tags too
18:00:50jhMikeSmake install ??
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18:05:13sgsaxduh, ok, thanks
18:05:24linuxstb_sgsax: The UiSimulator wiki page reveals all
18:05:37sgsaxeven forwards audio :)
18:05:53sgsaxlinuxstb_: provided the wiki isn't lost in the Interwebs
18:06:02linuxstb_google has a lovely cache...
18:07:28sgsaxall praise the google
18:09:01DefineBytei like my soul
18:09:48markunDefineByte: just sell it, it's not so hard
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18:21:43*preglow wonders how big the jpeg loader is
18:22:08webmindI just updated my ipod nano 1st gen with the latest build
18:22:13webmindit doesn't play mp3's anymore
18:22:20preglowwebmind: weird, mine does
18:22:22webmindthat is.. it starts playing them and crashes
18:22:28webmindI'll give the error in a sec
18:22:30preglowhow long since your last ypdate?
18:23:00webmindI updated it today
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18:23:06preglowwell, before that
18:23:12webminda year ?
18:23:18preglowwebmind: update your bootloader
18:23:22webmindah ok
18:23:27preglowNico_P: will mob be used for hwcodec too?
18:23:51preglowwebmind: just download ipodpatcher and use that, updating the bootloader is dead easy these days
18:24:08Nico_Ppreglow: hopefully yes but I'll focus on SWCODEC first
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18:24:24Nico_PI don't have any HWCODEC targets
18:24:31preglowsure, just wondering if there were any plans
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18:26:38rasherbluebrother: Here's my current attempt, which returns ERROR_NO_MORE_ITEMS instantly:
18:26:52rasherbluebrother: I haven't even tried to do anything with the devicedetails yet..
18:28:31webmindis there a problem with the server ?
18:28:39webmindI can ping, but I don't get a site
18:29:11DefineByteit's down
18:29:34Nico_Ppreglow: maybe you can be of help about codec_pcmbuf_position_callback() from playback.c:1400 ?
18:29:48Nico_PI don't really get what it's supposed to do
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18:31:22pixelmawebmind: there are 2 or 3 download mirrors you shoul be able to get to one of them - and google cache if you need instructions or the manual
18:31:53pixelmajust try directly
18:32:05preglowNico_P: seems like it just tells pcmbuf to not bother telling about buffer positions
18:32:38pixelmawebmind: the manual is also available from there
18:33:49Nico_Ppreglow: I don't understand... and what's pcmbuf ?
18:34:36preglowNico_P: the pcm buffering layer, where the decoded and processed audio output is stored until your hear it
18:34:51preglowNico_P: doesn't look like anything you need to worry about, but who knows
18:35:25Nico_Ppreglow: well this particular function is a bit of a problem for me because I don't really know what to do about "elapsed"
18:36:00preglowdoes it really matter much for you if elapsed is stored where it is? does that keep you from implementing mob?
18:36:26 Part DefineByte
18:36:31preglowgerh, i really should look into playback.c one day
18:36:36Nico_Pthe problem is that the struct mp3entry from the previous track won't be as easy to access as with the current code
18:36:48preglowi can imagine
18:37:08preglowyou really should never depend on having the previous mp3entry available either
18:37:12Nico_Pand the comment says the code needs to be quick
18:37:36webmindjust ran ipodpatched
18:37:43webmindclaims I've got a new bootloader
18:37:47preglowperhaps jhMikeS is more knowledgable about this code?
18:37:49webmindI still get this error:
18:37:54webmindData abort
18:37:59preglowlostlogic is never around no more and he's the one that fixed the code up last
18:38:30Nico_Ppreglow: wasn't Slasheri the one who originally wrote the SWCODEC playback code ?
18:38:44preglowNico_P: yes, but lostlogic hacked it up a bit, then vanished
18:38:54preglowso slasheri isn't the ultimate authority on it anymore
18:39:05linuxstb_webmind: You may be suffering from the general Nano issues at the moment then. I don't think there's anything you can do apart from to go back to your previous version.
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18:40:17Nico_Ppreglow: I was thinking about storing elapsed into the struct trackinfo, but because of this paticular func, Im' thinking of putting length in there too
18:41:07webmindlinuxstb_, thank you
18:41:54linuxstb_Nico_P: I'm just thinking aloud, but maybe some info about the previous/current/next track is special enough to be in their own static structs somewhere.
18:42:27Nico_Plinuxstb_: I was planning on this for the current and maybe the next, but maybe the previous needs it too
18:42:46webmindlinuxstb_, is anyone working on it or ?
18:42:59linuxstb_IIUC, "previous" is only important at track transitions - when Rockbox is decoding one track, but still playing the end of the previous.
18:43:01preglowsweet god, what a huge friggin beast playback.c is :/
18:43:29preglowlinuxstb_: you have an ipod video, yeah?
18:43:46linuxstb_webmind: I don't think so - it only seems to affect a small number of Nanos, and none of the devs have this problem.
18:44:03linuxstb_preglow: Depends on the follow-up question...
18:44:07preglowlinuxstb_: could you check out safetydan's get-rid-of-hw-eq patch?
18:44:17jhMikeSpreglow: I've really no idea about anything, anywhere, anytime.
18:44:41preglowjhMikeS: while you're here, what makes you say msac is slow?
18:44:48Nico_PjhMikeS: sure ? I wouldn't mind a bit of help
18:44:57linuxstb_preglow: OK, I'll try and give it a go this evening.
18:45:02preglowjhMikeS: how much slower? are you absolutely positive? sounds really weird
18:45:05preglowlinuxstb_: cool
18:45:07jhMikeSNico_P: with what?
18:45:30Nico_PjhMikeS: codec_pcmbuf_position_callback in playbck.c
18:45:51Nico_P(line 1393)
18:46:08jhMikeSpreglow: for one, the UM says it's 3 clocks instead of 1 and using it in the SPC codec instead of negating one factor and using mac resulted in higher boost...from just one instruction!
18:46:38preglowjhMikeS: i've always suspected the um is on crack, the various sources on instruction timing all disagree
18:47:16preglowit also doesn't mention in what circumstances the timing is 1
18:47:24jhMikeSpreglow: well, I did try it in reality with and instruction that gets executed up to 256,000 times/sec. it seems even slower than it says.
18:47:25preglowsome sources say the throughput is one cycle, not the latency
18:47:29*linuxstb_ goes home
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18:48:23jhMikeSlatency is the pipeline. as long as you jump throught the pipline hoops mac seems to be 1 cycle throughput.
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18:48:40preglowwhich is why you want long chains of macs
18:48:47preglowanywho, god knows how they managed to botch msac
18:48:56preglowi don't think i use it any critical places anyway
18:49:33Domonokyis down at the moment ?
18:49:41jhMikeSif they missed something as important as not stalling the pipeline with a non-busy accumulator, who knows what else they did wrong.
18:50:00preglowa valid point
18:50:54jhMikeSNico_P: That function gives the positioning information from as late in the chain as possible...from the ISR
18:51:20Nico_PjhMikeS: what's the ISR ?
18:52:28jhMikeSNico_P: the interrupt service routine that gives the samples to DMA.
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18:53:50Nico_PjhMikeS: how long does this need to be able to access the previous track info for ?
18:54:15Nico_Pit's called right after a track change, right ?
18:54:18jhMikeSas long as the pcmbuffer is in samples
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18:54:51jhMikeSit's also asynchronous, preemptive code so be careful.
18:55:13Nico_Pwhat do you mean ? I'm unclear on this vocabulary
18:56:01jhMikeSit's called from the interrupt, which breaks out of normal execution at any arbitrary point. for DMA, whenever it needs more data.
18:57:15jhMikeSit's called every time a buffer chunk is finished off
18:57:21webmindlinuxstb, uhm.. crap :(
18:57:48Nico_PjhMikeS: really ? I thought it was only called on track change ?
18:58:09webmindlinuxstb, any idea what the latest version where it still works ?
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18:58:18jhMikeSnope, every roughly 8k of data
18:58:20Nico_P...through codec_gapless_track_change
18:58:29Nico_PjhMikeS: from where ?
18:58:47jhMikeSpcmbuf.c line 142
18:59:13jhMikeSif it's been registered of course
18:59:56preglowNico_P: meaning, just be careful,, don't juggle any critical variables used in the callback around at the time it might be called. it will interrupt whatever you are doing
19:00:22preglowwe're usually pretty spoiled knowing we will never be interrupted in rockbox
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19:01:01Nico_Phmm ok
19:01:29*jhMikeS emphasizes again, that might not be true if a yield suddenly ends up in a unexpected place which is equivalent to a preemption. :)
19:02:14Nico_Pso I'm thinking I might be able to leave elapsed in struct mp3entry and use 3 static mp3entries, previous, current and next
19:02:39preglowdoesn't sound very elegant...
19:02:42jhMikeSplayback.c needs syncing as if it were preemtive threads
19:02:42preglowcan it be avoided? :P
19:03:50preglowNico_P: and is there a point in keeping the next struct static?
19:03:53jhMikeSI frankly don't know why the et isn't just updated from the DMA callback as a rule actually
19:04:28preglowprobably for some complicated undocumented reason
19:05:00Nico_Ppreglow: the WPS needs access to it, but yeah, maybe it can be accessed directly from the main buffer
19:05:09Nico_PI think that's what my current "merge" does
19:05:13jhMikeSbecause it was done another way and then it was found that when no codec was loaded but the remainder of the pcm buffer was playing out, you needed something to keep the pos updating?
19:06:41Nico_PjhMikeS: something I don't understand is why codec_pcmbuf_position_callback touches prev_ti->id3...
19:06:42preglowNico_P: currently the wps survives just fine without that info, yes? in which case i think it should be accesses from the main buffer whenever possible
19:07:03preglowNico_P: having just one mp3entry struct static wastes memory, especially when we'll be supporting aa, i guess
19:07:35Nico_Ppreglow: I don't plan on including AA in the struct mp3entry
19:07:42preglowthen it's not so critical
19:07:43Nico_Pit will be accessed from the main bffer
19:07:48jhMikeSNico_P: the previously current track is now the current previous track?
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19:08:36jhMikeSactually, I've never followed the track logic itself in there.
19:10:50Nico_PjhMikeS: yeah but that transition only happens on track change
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19:11:55mirakjhMikeS: hi. I have seen you know optimisations
19:12:43jhMikeSNice_P: audio_check_new_track
19:12:54jhMikeSNico_P...sorry :P
19:13:31jhMikeSmirak: just some ideas. I'm not sure if it's good for that or not. I was trying to respond but is dead.
19:14:35Nico_PjhMikeS: prev_ti = CUR_TI; ?
19:15:12jhMikeSyeah, I guess even if the playlist is done. it's the only assignment to that in the entirety of playback.c
19:15:21Nico_PjhMikeS: basically prev_ti is only used in the position callback
19:17:43jhMikeSmirak: the code in dsp_cf.S line, 395 and such does what I was talking about to saturate almost for free
19:20:43mirakjhMikeS: how is it ? I don't have source code and seen it since one year
19:21:06mirakmaybe more in fact ...
19:21:15jhMikeSmirak: so it multiplies by a constant that scales the samples to be 32-bit left-justified in signed int mode. for 24-bit output is multiples by 256. if the input exceeds the 24-bits it's saturated to 24-bit range.
19:23:19jhMikeSmore accurately, it's saturated to 32-bit range which can be finalized to any depth. in the case there, it takes the most significant 16-bits after the scaling which is the output sample value.
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19:25:54Nico_PjhMikeS: I have a feeling that this callback (I'm still on codec_pcmbuf_position_callback) is used only after a track change. I don't see any other situation where the codec isn't decoding the track being heard
19:27:13mirakjhMikeS: it could speed things a lot
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19:28:03amiconnNico_P: Why do we need to buffer previous id3 info?
19:28:06mirakjhMikeS: because working on a byte, then moving the 4 byte to a registry, then a write to ram is a lot of hassle
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19:28:20mirakwell in fact it's still needed
19:28:24amiconnI'd think we need just current and next
19:28:37jhMikeSNico_P: yes, because the codec thread is no longer running in that situation so the ISR is now the only available activity to continue updating the position
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19:28:53Nico_Pamiconn: it would be because of codec_pcmbuf_position_callback
19:29:09mirakis there a queue mode like party mode, but without the party mode ... ?
19:29:10Nico_Pamiconn: I'm not sure about next
19:29:30amiconnNext would be to make next track info available at all times
19:29:33mirakam I clear ?
19:29:56amiconnWe currently do that on swcodec. Should be made optional depending on ram size rather than on codec architecture
19:30:24jhMikeSmirak: the piplined mac with free saturation is just plain faster than a check, jump and clamp, etc. too.
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19:31:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
19:31:50Nico_Pamiconn: do you see why codec_pcmbuf_position_callback is giving me a hard time ?
19:32:09amiconnNo. I don't even have an idea what that function does
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19:32:55Nico_Pit's there to update the position in a track when it's being heard but not being decoded
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19:33:17Nico_P... IIUC
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19:34:01amiconnI must say that I can't really follow the logic in playback.c (note that I didn't try hard either)
19:34:32amiconnBut I would expect the currently playing track to be what's actually current, and the codecs decode ahead
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19:34:49amiconnIt seems to be the opposite from what was said in here though :/
19:34:50TMMhi all!
19:35:06Nico_Pamiconn: yes, I think it's the oppostie :(
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19:35:57TMMI have been playing around with a JTAB enabled board, turns out one of my colleagues mayored in electronic engineering :)
19:37:27jhMikeSmirak: the main problem is that idct output was generated with signed mode but the clamping must be unsigned. all of asudden negative outputs would look like large positive outputs.
19:38:49mirakjhMikeS: ahem ?
19:41:18jhMikeSmirak: clamping the emac way in signed mode would clamp to a range of -256 to 255. if switching to unsigned mode, all the negative values would be thought to be large positive values (2's complement). -1 being seen as 0xffffffffu for example.
19:42:24*amiconn wonders what mirak and jhMikeS are talking about
19:42:43mirakjhMikeS: so you are saying your idea can't work ?
19:43:51jhMikeSmirak: not sure yet. perhaps it wouldn't be as ideal but maybe it could still have an advantage. It would be something I'd implement doing whatever is minimally needed and benchmark it.
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19:44:06amiconnYes, but in what respect?
19:44:59jhMikeSamiconn: speeding up saturation using emac similarly to what's done in dsp_cf.S and spc_dsp.c
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19:45:10rhizmoehey everybody, is the site down?
19:45:22rhizmoei know, famous opening lines...
19:45:45preglowit is
19:45:59rhizmoeis the package available anywhere else?
19:45:59amiconnjhMikeS: Still, where?
19:46:29jhMikeSamiconn: as in the code? dsp_samples_output_stereo/mono
19:47:04Nico_Prhizmoe: try
19:47:07*amiconn can't follow
19:47:51amiconnI think you said it's already done for dsp...
19:48:23jhMikeSyes, but some way to do it for mpegplayer could also help.
19:49:12jhMikeSIt might crunch down the final output routines in idct.c on coldfire
19:49:27rhizmoedownload.rockbox doesn't seem to have the installers
19:49:48mirakjhMikeS: I don't remember when I was doing the clamping
19:50:01jhMikeSamiconn: this is all about FS #5995.
19:50:28amiconnAh, so it's about improving that patch... a cleanup would also be helpful...
19:50:30oborhizmoe: GUI installer is at
19:50:53jhMikeSclip_block_to_dest_add ?
19:51:10rhizmoeobo: ah of course, how could i ever miss that? ;)
19:51:48*amiconn thinks the idct in that patch can be optimized a bit more, other than by the clamping stuff
19:52:20*jhMikeS was just mentioning a first impression since he's doing this one for ARM anyway
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19:56:42*jhMikeS has dithered yuv output too which is about the same speed as the previous non-dithered asm and looks really good when subtle gradients are displayed
19:57:21amiconnditherMikeS ;)
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19:57:38*markun can confirm that it looks good
19:58:22*amiconn would rather like to see better performance on coldfire
19:58:31jhMikeSARM loves shift+add multiplication for anything that takes 5 or fewer shiftadds
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20:02:21*low_light now has a mrobe remote
20:02:52linuxstb_low_light: I'm working on sansapatcher - are you able to test it? (in about 10 minutes)
20:03:32*jhMikeS wonders why one with no sansa primarily maintains sansapatcher :)
20:03:43low_lightbut my frustrations with the mrobe 100 continue...the remote buttons are not initialized by the bootloader
20:03:46pixelmafwiw, sansapatcher works correctly for intalling the c200 bootloader under windows
20:04:08low_lightlinuxstb: work, on windows with no admin rights :/
20:05:12jhMikeSlow_light: any ideas about that distortion at higher volume thing on c200? It seems a bit odd that e200 wouldn't have it too.
20:05:16rhizmoehmm. it's not recognizing my 3g
20:05:49linuxstb_pixelma: Ah, so could you test a new "unified" version of sansapatcher soon?
20:06:12linuxstb_jhMikeS: Because no-one with a Sansa will...
20:06:27linuxstb_jhMikeS: ;) It's quite harmless...
20:07:04pixelmalinuxstb: maybe a bit later, I just installed and want to get a bit used to it first
20:07:35jhMikeSlinuxstb_: I've only replaced my bl one time so I tend to forget it exists. I suppose that actually a good property.
20:07:45sgsaxlinuxstb_: I've got an e200, want me to try it on mine?
20:07:56linuxstb_sgsax: Sure. Are you on windows?
20:08:08low_lightjhMikeS: No. But now that booting the OF works it's a little easier to test some things.
20:08:35sgsaxnot going to cause catastrophic failure, is it? :)
20:08:44sgsaxI just got my sansa, hate to likk it already
20:08:48jhMikeSlow_light: I wonder if the emu could be easily converted to run the c200 of. It does help out.
20:09:37low_lightjhMikeS: I have's the source of my magic :)
20:11:06low_lightI have it running from the bootloader and loading the OF
20:11:12linuxstb_sgsax: No, you don't even need to install - just run it and make sure it still detects your sansa, and also that it detects it as an e200 (not a c200).
20:11:25low_lightbut then after some initialization, it looks like is goes to sleep :/
20:13:46low_lightthe emu is probably the only way I'll figure out the fm init.
20:13:47jhMikeSlow_light: really. it's the tool I used to fix all the e200 audio stuff.
20:15:16jhMikeSlow_light: the main e200 problem is database refresh always fails on it
20:17:20low_lightfrom what I can tell, it inits the sd controller, reads something, then goes to sleep: CPU_CTL = 0x80000500
20:18:13jhMikeShmmm...perhaps CPU/COP_CTL need to be properly emulated
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20:19:12jhMikeSI don't think it emulates the event counters
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20:23:47low_lightI had the cop loop was causing problems...I can get it to work with some workarounds, but then it gets stuck on a loop with a SWI
20:24:16linuxstb_If anyone with either a c200 or e200 would like to test, here's a first attempt at a sansapatcher that will hopefully distinguish between them and install the correct bootloader (win32 and linux binaries) -
20:25:30jhMikeSlinuxstb_: so you want me to check if detection works?
20:26:07linuxstb_I've just realised that binary will install the wrong bootloader...
20:26:28sgsaxgah, need to fix the original fw setup so it doesn't reload the database after a restart
20:26:29*linuxstb_ is fixing
20:26:39jhMikeSbtw, has the official bootloader been updated to include the lcd fix yet?
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20:27:48linuxstb_jhMikeS: Yes, a couple of days ago.
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20:29:25linuxstb_OK, that sansapatcher should be good now. First test is just to see if it displays the correct model name (c200 or e200).
20:29:47*jhMikeS wonders why his idct gets a strange glitch ... probably a big forehead-slap mistake
20:30:30rasherSlasheri: any chance the database debug screen could keep track of the last file it tried to read, to make it easier to track down the cause of database generation crashes?
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20:31:43Slasherirasher: hmm, probably. But then debug screen should be updated realtime or there wouldn't be the correct file when the player crashes
20:31:45jhMikeSno e200s found...aborting
20:32:02*jhMikeS tries older version
20:32:14agm3ntlinuxstb_:on c200
20:33:16Slasherirasher: or that information could be written on disk
20:33:29jhMikeSolder version works
20:34:09rasherSlasheri: usually it's not a hard crash, afaik, so just keeping the last song opened somewhere in memory and writing that on the debug screen should work. User sees database init failed, enters debug screen and sees file "foo" was the last one opened
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20:35:00pixelmaI can confirm that sound on c200 doesn't sound right yet (quite "high" and a bit like clipping - can't think of a better word atm at line level with default settings and the volume level seems to be lower overall)
20:35:05Slasherirasher: hmm, any song shouldn't cause database init to fail, unless it's a complete crash
20:35:38preglowisn't the c200 display kinda tiny?
20:36:31linuxstb_jsMikeS, agm3nt: Thanks - can you try again (same URL)
20:39:19linuxstb_agm3nt: That's still the old version...
20:39:46jhMikeSlinuxstb: that one worked
20:40:08sgsaxlinuxstb_: detects my e200 correctly
20:40:18linuxstb_jhMikeS: Thanks. I needed to read a multiple of 512 bytes from the disk device...
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20:40:39*preglow feels the time is soon right for a bette resampler
20:40:51linuxstb_Has the time been right for about 2 years?
20:41:03low_lightpixelma: try this patch:
20:41:24*jhMikeS agrees with preglow...but requests to keep the fast one for certain purposes
20:41:35*linuxstb_ would prefer no resampling when the hardware allows
20:41:53preglowlinuxstb_: well, sure
20:42:04preglowbut that's a can of worms compared to just resampling :>
20:42:06linuxstb_preglow: I can keep dreaming...
20:42:08 Part agm3nt
20:42:13jhMikeSthat would just be damn nightmare
20:42:25preglowa damned nightmare we should look into too
20:42:47linuxstb_Just get rid of crossfade - that will help.
20:42:49pixelmalow_light: will do in a bit, first I need to grab something to eat
20:42:49*jhMikeS pinches himself
20:43:02preglowlinuxstb_: crossfade will need to always resample, i think
20:43:18preglowjust to keep it simple
20:43:36jhMikeSargh, crossfade could go, sure. I'd love that.
20:43:50preglowwell, anything else would just be troublesome
20:43:55preglowa ton of special cases to look out for
20:43:58preglowand i don't use crossfade :>>
20:44:13*jhMikeS neither
20:44:20linuxstb_The software EQ?
20:44:22preglowi probably don't use 99% of rockbox at that
20:44:26preglowlinuxstb_: what about it?
20:44:30rasherThen it's settled - crossfade gets removed!
20:44:31linuxstb_Do you use it?
20:44:41linuxstb_OK, so that goes as well.
20:45:04tumucrossfade can be useful for some content
20:45:05*preglow sharpens the code knife
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20:45:38rasherI'm quite sure a lot of people use crossfade (myself included on some occasions)
20:45:39jhMikeSother DSP is no problem really. the worse is changing samplerates at the correct moment and resampling would almost always need to be done anyway since the HW tends to be limited.
20:45:43preglowbut anyway, sweq isn't a problem
20:45:50preglowthat'll play just fine with samplerates changing
20:47:54amiconnCrossfade would only need to resample when sample rates are different, right?
20:47:57jhMikeSupsampling to 88.2k to play 48k content would be a horrible resource drain.
20:48:16jhMikeSchanging sample rates is very glitchy
20:48:16preglowwell, we wouldn't do that...
20:48:25preglowwe'd downsample 48khz to 44.1khz
20:48:33preglowno need to not be reasonable :>
20:48:39preglowwe could have a quality setting too, i guess
20:48:46preglowamiconn: yes
20:48:55jhMikeSpreglow: that's the opposite of what you said should be done before! :p
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20:49:04amiconnSo crossfade could just be ignored if sample rate changes
20:49:08jhMikeSmore settings...hehe
20:49:09preglowjhMikeS: optimally, that would be what we'd do, yes
20:49:24preglowamiconn: i think that might confuse people
20:49:31ddaphhey is there any way to change the default path that shows when choosing "files" from the menu?
20:49:39jhMikeSnoone but the most pedigree audiophiles will be able to tell anyway
20:51:00*jhMikeS made sarcasm there...arrrrrrrrr
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20:54:24agm3ntlinuxstb_:but when I reboot it's freze and off
20:54:55preglowi think i'll start looking into resampling when next i'll do some rockbox stuff
20:54:57low_lightddaph: no
20:55:12preglowthen perhaps, after that, multiple sample rate stuff
20:56:04jhMikeSthe worst thing about crossfade imo is that it's such a major memory hog for something that only runs briefly.
20:56:05linuxstb_agm3nt: You have a c200?
20:56:06*amiconn would love to see multiple sample rate support
20:56:10low_lightagm3nt: if you can try this patch for the c200 and comment on the sound before/after:
20:56:34ddaphis there a way to add shortcuts / change the main menu?
20:56:50amiconnThere is a shortcut plugin
20:57:05*amiconn never used it yet though
20:57:21agm3ntlow_light: ok, I try it
20:57:49preglowall i know about multiple sample rate support currently is that it'll break crossfeed somewhat :/
20:58:06jhMikeSpreglow: should upsampling be done for say 12000khz up to 22000kHz if sw supports?
20:58:31jhMikeSchange the magnitude on those numbers by 10 ^ -3 :P
20:58:40amiconnThe (most?) ipod dacs are a bit weird in their sample rate support
20:58:48amiconn8kHz, then 32/44.1/48
20:58:51preglowjhMikeS: depends on the quality of the resampler, i'd say, if it's good, then yes, perhaps. if not, then the harmonics it generates by upsampling might be more annoying than the loss of treble when downsampling
20:58:54amiconnNothing inbetween...
20:59:39preglowideally, we should always upsample, of course
20:59:42tumuhm, does latest svn compile?
21:00:37jhMikeSpreglow: well, I thought the whole point to a new one was a good aliasing-free resampler :)
21:01:08agm3ntlow_light: I must build bootloader or normal??
21:01:13preglowit won't be aliasing-free, i can guarantee you that
21:01:19preglowbut it will be leaps and bounds better
21:01:27tumuupdated to try solving a linking problem with sim build but now i'm seeing missing file errors
21:01:32preglowi'm looking at the speex resampler now, it might be interesting
21:01:34ddaphif i want to play a directory and all its subdirs, the only way is context menu and then playlist>play?
21:02:25jhMikeSpreglow: well, none are really "free" but the current is quite audible of course
21:02:40tumuwebsite is down as well?
21:02:52low_lightagm3nt: normal
21:02:58jhMikeSpreglow: oh no. sync functions...!
21:03:56linuxstb_ddaph: Yes, but you need to enable the "recursively insert directories" playlist option
21:04:04ddaphoh ok
21:04:16preglowjhMikeS: i was kind of thinking about using elliptic filters for downsampling
21:04:21preglowjhMikeS: but they're such a bitch to compute coefs for
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21:04:33chrisjs169question about the e200Rs - when the bootloader is patched, shouldn't Rockbox report the same CRC32 for all the Rs?
21:04:33ddaphanother question: if i download a theme with album art, it shows me the default WPS, no matter what theme i choose; what am i missing?
21:04:43 Join juk [0] (
21:04:59preglowddaph: rockbox doesn't support album art yet, you're probably using a wps meant for a custom build
21:05:04linuxstb_chrisjs169: What crc32 are you talking about?
21:05:29ddaphoh. and is there any work being done on being able to play avi files?
21:05:52chrisjs169when you select the OF when booting the R, the rockbox bootloader spits out information, like in
21:06:08tumuanyone knows what is the latest rev that compiles?
21:06:26chrisjs169linuxstb_, one line says CRC32 and Calculated CRC32 - should both of them be the same for all e200Rs?
21:06:50preglowddaph: no. 1: you need to transcode for the screen size anyway, so we might as well use our own format (mpeg). 2: "avi" doesn't really mean much, it's just a container, and contain any kind of codec
21:07:04ddaphi meant xvid
21:07:07ddaphor divx
21:07:10preglowno again, for reason 1
21:07:16preglowmight happen in the future, but not now
21:07:35ddaphthe regular ipod OS plays mp4 which is != mpeg, right?
21:07:47ddaphso i can play mp4s with the regular OS, and mpeg with rockbox
21:08:01linuxstb_preglow: That's not 100% true - I think 320x240 is a relatively common size for video podcasts, so at least for those targets, supporting other formats could be useful.
21:08:04webmindhmm, 1-sept-07 still works
21:08:21preglowlinuxstb_: yeah, i guess that will become even more commong now
21:08:35linuxstb_ddaph: "mpeg" is many standards. But Rockbox's mpegplayer just supports mpeg-1 or mpeg-2 video.
21:09:04webmind10 sept aswell
21:09:08ddaphalright, thanks for everythin
21:09:08preglowbtw, is it just me, or does mpegplayer sometimes glitch in motion estimation on percectly valid files?
21:09:34jhMikeSpreglow: you want that blit synth code that I worked out the nighmarish small-denomitor stuff on?
21:09:35linuxstb_But IMO video playback is something Rockbox should support well - as almost every OF features video playback nowadays.
21:09:47preglowjhMikeS: you worked it out? sure, yeah
21:10:02preglowjhMikeS: btw, i'm planning on coding the sound guy tools feature request one day, that code will be nice to have then
21:10:35jhMikeSyeah, -120dB noise floor (I don't think CEP actually shows it any lower)
21:10:45preglowthat's smooth as hell
21:10:53linuxstb_chrisjs169: IIUC, that crc is the crc of the original firmware being loaded. So if the same OF is installed, then the crc32 should match.
21:10:54 Quit Xerion (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:11:05agm3ntlow_light:now it's muuuch better
21:11:21agm3ntlow_light:sound like OF
21:11:54low_lightexcellent. I will commit tonight.
21:11:56ddaphwhat happened to rockboxs site
21:12:15chrisjs169linuxstb_, if that's the case, then is it "unusual" that of all the people who are having problems booting the OF, the mi4 size and crc32 all different?
21:12:22peturserver troubles
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21:13:15jhMikeSpreglow: patch to test_sampr.c I think I just had it in the coldfire emac code only since I was testing there.
21:13:23low_lightjhMikeS: will this patch effect the e200? it's how the c200 OF does the reset:
21:13:41ddaphim using hebrew. filenames are shown ok, but when a song plays - i get gibberish for id3 info. any idea?
21:15:26jhMikeSlow_light: should be the same for it as now
21:15:44webmindlinuxstb_, poke
21:16:44linuxstb_webmind: ?
21:17:24webmindlinuxstb_, I've just installed the daily build from 20070919
21:17:26webmindand it works
21:17:51webmindafter going over several other builds
21:18:07rasherddaph: Try setting the codepage: General Settings > Display > Default Codepage
21:18:22linuxstb_webmind: I can't explain that...
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21:18:33preglowjhMikeS: patch is quite broken
21:18:33webmindmy guess would be that it happes when you upgrade a new version over a very old one, htat is, that something isn't copied in the new builds ?
21:19:00preglowjhMikeS: quite a lot of hunks fail here
21:19:16jhMikeShmmm...lemme look. it's quite old.
21:19:41rhizmoewelp, it won't go to disk mode before crashing. i hope i'm not bricked.
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21:19:44webmindlinuxstb_, anyway, if this happens to someone, atleast this should fix it
21:20:02linuxstb_webmind: As long as you overwrite all the old files with the new ones, it should be fine.
21:20:09faelnorthe website goes down the day i receive my gigabeat :-(
21:20:18rasherfaelnor: is still up
21:20:29faelnorcool, was going to ask for this :)
21:21:10ddaphwhat is special in all these custom builds? can someone recommend why to use any of them?
21:21:13jhMikeSwas made at rev 12309...hrm
21:21:42pixelmalow_light: yes, sounds much better *turning bass down* :)
21:23:53preglowvoice ui isn't very stable...
21:24:26pregloweach time i've tried it, it's locked my h120 up after a little while
21:24:29linuxstb_preglow: I think that's been mentioned...
21:25:23preglowlinuxstb_: tried the hw eq patch?
21:25:48preglowpreglow style thinly veiled nag :P
21:26:00ddaphhow come the sound with "rock" preset in the eq is much worse than the original iPod's "rock" preset?
21:26:04*linuxstb_ needs to cook some food
21:26:37jhMikeSpreglow: guess I'll sync it up real quick
21:26:46preglowjhMikeS: would be sweetness
21:27:05rasherI think we need some sort of automatic tool to edit langfiles so devs are more likely to do their updates in all applicable languages (such as deprecating a string in all languages including it (id3v1 /v2 setting) or adding a new target(c200))
21:27:05preglowseems like test_sampr.c is broken
21:27:15preglowgcc nags about not finding memcpy
21:27:37jhMikeShmmm...I wonder what caused that one.
21:28:12Learrasher: but if a string is deprecated, is it used in a translation even if the lang file includes it? If not, it doesn't really matter that much...
21:28:22preglowrasher: having to do that manually would curb my entusiasm for changes of that kind greatly, yes...
21:29:15preglowjhMikeS: didya try generating triangles, btw?
21:29:46low_lightpixelma: good to hear
21:30:14rasherLear: I guess that's true. Perhaps I'm just still bitter about the huge language-rework that really is just mindless work which *could* have been done automatically given some effort
21:30:26rasher(introduction of features)
21:30:51rasherThe features feature, that is.
21:31:37***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:32:02preglowrasher: cooking up a quick gui tool for this might not be that much effort
21:32:08ddaphhow can i shuffle all the songs i have on the disk?
21:32:16preglowrasher: you've always wanted to learn how to use qt, right? :P
21:32:39rasherpreglow: Not really, no.
21:32:52tumuwhy would sim build bomb when normal doesn't?
21:33:04Learddaph: create a playlist for all songs.
21:33:21Leartumu: different code here and there...
21:33:38sgsaxddaph: you can set a playback default for shuffle
21:33:47ddaphi get it thanks
21:33:48sgsaxthen, no matter what playlist you pull up, it will shuffle it
21:34:01sgsax(that's what I do)
21:34:27ddaphlast question for today : whats all the fuss about USB? if i connect usb and its in disk mode - it doesnt charge the battery??
21:36:32n1srasher: regarding the lang features thingy, the patch was in FS for about six months and no one even mentioned wanting to write some sceipt to do the conversion and I for sure am not capapble of doing that so sitting around waiting fo someone to step forward seemed like a really bad idea
21:36:38jhMikeSpreglow: yup. I kind of put that on the back burner to think about it some more since double-integrals turn the noise floor into brown noise...something more sophisticated needs to be done to shape that.
21:36:53Leartumu: what's dumb doing there? Not part of svn, afaik...
21:37:06tumulear, it's the new codec i'm working on
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21:37:37tumunormal build works, sim doesn't
21:37:43Leartumu: well, makefile is a bit different for target and sim. Update the sim part to build dumb too.
21:37:44rashern1s: I didn't mean to blame you, or anyone. I just think it's a sign that a tool to make mindless editing easier would be nice
21:38:11jhMikeSactually it's doubly-brown noise integration of white noise makes brown noise.
21:38:19tumulear, where would i go updating? there are no docs about it
21:38:32tumuonly on normal build
21:38:36n1srasher: I agree, any tool to make that kind of editing easier/faster would be very nice :-)
21:38:56LearWell, how did you add the normal build stuff? The rest comes from reading the makefile... :)
21:39:15tumuLear, i added the normal build stuff and it works as it should
21:39:24tumubut i have no idea what else i could do to make the sim build work
21:40:05tumuthere is no special sim section in the makefile where i would need to add my stuff
21:40:08tumuatleast i can't see any
21:40:31preglowjhMikeS: you do any noise shaping at all?
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21:43:18jhMikeSjust some basic dithering but I never got that far. I suppose i'd need double-purple noise in the input and it would be flat at the output.
21:43:41tumuLear, all i can tell that the sim does building in some other way that doesn't like the normal adds
21:43:56tumubut i have no idea where to begin changing things
21:43:58rasherI wonder slightly why the language file isn't xml - it might as well be, and it'd make parsing and modifying more robust by using a proper xml parser. It shouldn't make translating by hand much different.
21:44:01jhMikeSok, it built. time to check that it works still
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21:44:51Leartumu: You added dumb to all places where the other codecs are? Must be something missing that causes the dumb library to not be included...
21:45:10NullbyteHey guys, why is the site down?
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21:45:32tumuLear, yes, i added it like any other codecs, and it builds correctly in normal
21:45:33rasherNo one here knows, I believe.
21:45:45NullbyteOh, okay.
21:45:46tumuLear, so for normal one, there is not anything missing
21:46:05rasherNullbyte: The Swedes are all gone, so all we can do is wait
21:46:31Nullbyterasher: Meh
21:47:13BagderI'm not gone ;-)
21:47:18n1srasher: I wouldn't be against going xml if it doesn't complicate things, but the language system is Bagder's brainchild so I don't know of any specific reasons why it is as it is...
21:47:19Bagderbut the site is...
21:47:24NullbyteRight you are
21:47:30n1sah there he is :-)
21:48:00Bagderthe language files are not xml since xml is not for humans
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21:48:19Leartumu: Looks like if not added to OUTPUT (line 32 in codecs/Makefile) it could fail for sim only...
21:48:28Bagderbut if someone feels like changing format and improve things, I won't be in the way
21:48:48*Bagder is badly damaged from having seen ant xml files
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21:48:57tumuLear, i have it on OUTPUT line
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21:49:34rasherBagder: Ah, but if the schema is chosen carefully (ie. stuff to read/translate isn't hidden deep in some nested tag/attribute hell), a human shouldn't mind. And it'd make writing scripts that edit languagefiles somewhat and more robust (by using external parsers)
21:49:49*Lear has hacked some ant files too, and they weren't all that nice. Then again, Makefiles can be pretty bad too...
21:50:03eigmaBadger: has kkurbjun talked to you about setting up svn for a m:robe 500i port?
21:50:08rasherBagder: and with genlang, the human won't have to write the xml, just edit it
21:50:09BagderLear: true, but I've grown up on makefiles... :-)
21:50:25Bagdereigma: no, why would we need a different svn for that?
21:50:41eigmasorry, that's not what I meant
21:50:41Bagderrasher: right, but it requires pleasantly formatted xml
21:51:04eigmacreating accounts and so on (whatever is needed for kkurbjun, myself and JdGordon to work on the port in svn)
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21:51:17LearBagder: Me too, basically. But usually for smaller projects...
21:51:21eigmaI'm guessing a branch, but I don't know exactly how rockbox has organized svn
21:51:53rasherBagder: Certainly. The structure wouldn't be much different from what it is now I imagine. Most xml libraries can prettyprint, so that shouldn't be an issue either
21:51:57Leartumu: shouldn't that read "libdumb", to match the rest?
21:51:57Bagdereigma: jdgordon and kkurbjun already have svn access, and they can ask for access and vouch for your excellence to get you added as well ;-)
21:51:57low_lightwhy is there X11 & win32 sim stuff in the codec makefile?
21:52:13Bagderlow_light: leftovers from the past I guess
21:52:28Bagdereigma: is there really a need for a branch?
21:52:35tumuLear, well, dumb is not libdumb, so.. but it is changeable
21:52:41Bagdergigabeat-s is in a branch, but I fail to see why there too...
21:52:55tumuLear, doesn't effect the normal build tho
21:53:03eigmaBadger: I personally prefer working in branches so I can commit incrementally, but still merge only functional changes and keep trunk working
21:53:08eigmaBadger: but it doesn't really matter is down?
21:53:22Bagdereigma: yes
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21:53:50rasherSomeone downloading the source a million times over again?
21:53:52linuxstb_Bagder: I guess it might be easier if you want to share non-working code, but if it's target-specific, that could still be done in trunk...
21:54:03Bagderthat's what I mean
21:54:23linuxstb_I know... I'm failing to think of any good reason for branches.
21:54:32tumuLear, well, having the sim build working is not that important, people just suggested it might help in debugging
21:54:44Bagderrasher: no, there's something fishy with the HW
21:54:49tumuhave to work on normal build then
21:54:50linuxstb_Bagder: Maybe the people working on the S could say if they think it's helpful...
21:54:59Leartumu: In the normal build it isn't linked in via "-l", which expects the lib to be named "libxxx", so I think that is the reason.
21:55:05Bagderwould be good feedback in the matter
21:55:28Leartumu: The sim is indeed very nice in debugging stuff. Fixed lots of codec problems primarily in the sim.
21:55:28Bagderthe major downside in my view is lack of insight from the regulars and no builds to verify that things remain sane
21:55:54linuxstb_Bagder: Yes. insight from regulars would definitely benefit new ports (or annoy them...)
21:56:28preglowboth good :>
21:56:28tumuLear, is the sim build fixable on that part, or do i have to rename the stuff?
21:56:53linuxstb_I'm also guessing that two different new ARM ports will start to conflict in places.
21:57:07Leartumu: Just renaming the .a file to libdumb.a should do the trick.
21:57:14Bagderyeah, that's a risk
21:57:56eigmaLear, tumu: afaik, static libraries (*.a) can be included directly on the linker command line, like "path/to/dumb.a"
21:58:03 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
21:58:48eigmaBagder: once I get an account, is there anything else we need to do before starting to commit the port to trunk?
21:59:05Bagdernot that I know of
21:59:08eigmaBagder: note that it's not fully functional −− the bootloader is barely working. I don't know what the policy is on that.
21:59:14tumuLear, ya, that did the trick
21:59:26BagderI miss info about the port effort in the wiki, but that's not really svn related...
21:59:26linuxstb_eigma: Make sure you don't break any existing targets though...
21:59:39*Zagor goes to kick on the server
21:59:46 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
21:59:47eigmaBagder: okay, will write a wiki page asap
21:59:54*linuxstb_ doesn't even know what port we're talking about
21:59:59eigmaOlympus m:robe 500i
22:00:17tumuLear, that should be mentioned in the "writing new codec" page if someone does the same thing with another "nonlib"-named codec
22:00:31linuxstb_eigma: In one sentence, can you summarise the hardware specs?
22:00:42Leareigma: Yep, that is done for normal builds, but not the sim...
22:00:44Bagderlinuxstb: TI dm320
22:00:50tumuthat it will break on sim build
22:01:14Leartumu: So edit it already! :)
22:01:20tumui have no wiki account :)
22:01:32n1sget one!
22:02:08low_lighttumu: shouldn't it just be OUTPUT = libdumb.....
22:02:12LearBut it is kind of obvious in a way. I mean, _every_ other codec lib is called lib<something>... :)
22:02:32eigmalinuxstb_: 200 MHz TMS320DM320 ARM9+DSP(C5400)/640x480 touchscreen/20 GB HDD/64 MB RAM/8 MB Flash/remote/TV-Out.. that's about it
22:02:46rasherThat's one huge screen
22:02:56Bagder64MB ram and 8(!) flash!
22:03:12eigmaeverybody wants to get video playback working on it, but we haven't been able to find a 1337 enough DSP engineer
22:03:18rasherImagine the default wps on that screen...
22:03:21LearSound like a PDA or something...
22:03:32tumulow_light, changing the line 148 to have OUTPUT=.../libdumb.a and same for line 55 for dumb.a
22:03:36Bagderthe 8 pixels font must be great!
22:03:57preglowjhMikeS: is it working?
22:05:27tumulow_light, and the clean parts etc
22:05:53low_lightyou gonna get the camera working too?
22:06:18eigmaah, 1 mpixel camera, I forgot
22:06:32eigmalike I said, we're low on DSP engineers ;) - but hopefully
22:07:02eigmait feels like getting the camera working is easier than writing an MPEG codec for the DSP - a lot of the hard math is hardware accelerated and modular
22:07:12 Quit MethoS- (Remote closed the connection)
22:07:15jhMikeSpreglow: almost. some stupid hangup when selecting square from the menu
22:07:28Bagdereigma: done any attempts at ripping magic dsp from neuros etc?
22:08:03eigmaBagder: nah, they just distribute *.ko's and we don't know anything about the interface
22:08:34Bagderyou sure? they seemed to include lots of symbols the last time I looked, but that was a while ago of course...
22:08:58low_lighttumu: I don't know...can't you just duplicate what spc does?
22:09:04eigmaI guess with a lot of work, we could reverse it.. but it would probably be illegal to include those *.kos, and useless for rockbox
22:09:12linuxstb_eigma: What about the UI? IMO it looks like you'll need to implement new UI widgets suitable for such a large screen (and touch)
22:09:34Bagdereigma: yeah, I was just curious.... :-)
22:09:36eigmalinuxstb: JD has implemented a mouse interface to the sim; we're trying to extend that to the TS
22:09:40tumulow_light, i can and probably will have to as the normal build now doesn't like the changes done to make the sim work :)
22:10:17tumusomeone has really written the makefiles to ask for definite syntax for filenaming :p
22:10:58linuxstb_eigma: I think you'll need a lot more than that... I can't see Rockbox's current UI scaling nicely to 640x480 - unless you just plan to use huge fonts...
22:11:20eigmalinuxstb: we'll see. personally, I'm okay with only supporting the remote screen, which is 76x16 monochrome
22:11:55preglowrockbox needs gui work
22:12:06low_lighttumu: when the svn server is back, look at the revision before dumb was removed
22:12:13preglowi think the rb gui looks silly even on ipod video
22:12:20Bagderthe svn server is up already
22:12:21 Part Nullbyte ("Leaving")
22:12:31Bagderit's a different server than the www one
22:12:54tumulow_light, nah, the only problem seems to be that the normal and sim builds have different expectations on file naming
22:13:06tumuand this has not been documented anywhere
22:14:03eigmaBagder: it's pretty slow from here.. time wget -qO /dev/null '' −− "real 0m1.100s"
22:14:04Bagderwhat file naming is that?
22:14:27tumufor linker
22:14:43Bagdereigma: yeah, the logo or whatever it is still uses www...
22:14:58 Join class37 [0] (
22:15:02amiconnFirst, those annoying colour lcds, and now all this even more annoying touch crap :(
22:15:10class37why is down?
22:15:15class37is there an ETA?
22:15:27Bagdereigma: but the sim does shared libs doesn't it?
22:15:35Bagderthat was for tumu
22:15:41tumuBagder, try making a codec and not naming it lib* and you'll see that it won't link on sim
22:15:43eigmaBagder: ah, I see
22:15:52Bagderclass37: yes "soon enough"
22:16:04Bagdertumu: why would I do that?
22:16:04class37is there a mirror?
22:16:10Bagderthe sim builds shared libs
22:16:14Bagderlibs are called lib*
22:16:19eigmaBagder: ah, yeah, the stylesheet
22:16:22tumuBagder, to see that there is an issue?
22:16:43BagderI don't consider it an "issue" really, just how it works
22:16:49Bagderclass37: for what?
22:16:53Bagdernot for the entire site, no
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22:17:52Bagdereigma: hm, I'll make sure to copy that once the servers are up again so that they live better independently...
22:18:05tumui guess i have to do things Bagder-style :p
22:18:09linuxstb_class37: google's cache is close to being a mirror
22:18:18eigmaBagder: in the mean time, adding "" in hosts seems to speed things up for
22:18:28Bagdertumu: I don't see any reason what so ever to fight against that concept...
22:18:44Bagderyeah I figure
22:19:10eigmaBagder: any idea what the actual problem is?
22:19:24Bagderthere's something hw-related, possibly a bad disk
22:19:30eigmaah, ouch
22:19:33Bagdersince you can still ping it etc
22:19:40Bagderjust not connect and use any services
22:19:41eigmadisk timeouts are so painful :(
22:20:25eigmawhat kind of hits/bandwidth does get?
22:21:11Bagderit has a 10mbit connection, and it serves I think some 200GB/month
22:21:26jhMikeSset_options seems to be returning garbage when I select the first item ...
22:21:30Bagdercan't acess the stats right now ;-)
22:21:39tumuBagder, could the codec makefile be made any simple?
22:21:50Bagdertumu: I bet! ;-)
22:22:41 Quit class37 ()
22:25:19jhMikeSall the options come out in reverse order too. looks like a bug or something changed with set_option while I wasn't looking
22:27:03 Join BHSPitMonkey [0] (n=stephen@unaffiliated/bhspitmonkey)
22:28:21*preglow hopes he didn't botch the plugin api today :/
22:28:57tumujust don't break the codec api :)
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22:29:24NullbyteHey, does rockbox support .avi?
22:29:39NullbyteThought so
22:29:43Bagderfun "hidden" stats page
22:30:26preglowthat's not hidden, is it?
22:30:32preglowoh yes, that one is
22:30:45Bagderthere's no link anywhere to this
22:30:45bluebrothera graph of the number would be a nice addon :)
22:31:28*linuxstb_ just sees a dark grey screen
22:31:48preglowseems we fare pretty well on ohloh
22:31:57 Quit Frazz ("Leaving")
22:32:16*bluebrother wonders why ohloh treats c and c++ the same
22:32:37Bagderbluebrother: because they have a hard time to write a parser that detects either one
22:32:59bluebrotheroh, they tried already?
22:33:14Bagderthey mentioned some stuff about it in a forum post
22:33:19jhMikeSpreglow: I hadn't svn up'ed anyway.
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22:34:43BigBambiBagder: I like how code lines has gone down this month :)
22:35:00Bagderlinuxstb: is sansapatcher working now e200 + c200 ?
22:35:01preglowwell, i did my share of that today :P
22:35:32linuxstb_Bagder:In theory... It hasn't been tested much though.
22:35:38 Quit Pro (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:35:56Bagdercomment ratio has been climbing slowly during 2007
22:36:06*bluebrother is annoyed by this stupid php stuff that keeps from doing rockbox work
22:37:49bluebrotherwow −− comment ratio was > 20% some years ago
22:37:55jhMikeSaha - now I see it ... I hope
22:38:23Bagderbluebrother: let's blame all the codec imports etc! ;-)
22:38:27amiconnstatistics... :\
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22:38:56bluebrotherstatistics are nice to look at but they usually don't tell the real truth ;)
22:47:16***Started Dancer V4.16
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22:47:32Bagderah look
22:47:33preglowniceness, i'll check it out right now
22:47:45preglowmake zip
22:47:50n1syaya, site is back
22:47:50preglowyes, you all go make zip
22:48:02*Bagder makes zip
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22:48:32Zagorsounds like something out of borat. "let's all go make very big zip"
22:48:51Bagdermy zip is bigger than your
22:49:23amiconnBagder: The simulator plugins and codecs are shared libs, however, all the libs built by rockbox which are linked *to* the core or plugins are static
22:49:25Zagormy server is crashier than yours... very annoying, and not ONE SINGLE error message on the console to give a hint as to what's going wrong :(((
22:49:30*preglow gets illinstr! :P
22:49:52jhMikeSummm....on h100?
22:49:54Zagorit's not even frozen, just won't read from disk
22:50:05bluebrotherbad mood?
22:50:07preglowjhMikeS: aye, testing without voice now...
22:50:11rasherpreglow: if you're annoyed by the ploogins thing, go fix it in
22:50:15ZagorI would have thought that should cause some kernel timeout messages, but nooo
22:50:26jhMikeSyeah, do that or add the talk menu shutdown stuff back
22:50:30amiconnrasher: ploogins should be fixed iirc
22:50:43preglowrasher: not annoyed, i only use voice for testing
22:50:46rasherMaybe preglow has an old voicefile
22:50:47amiconnMaybe I only applied that for sapi voices though? Don't remember
22:51:10 Part low_light
22:51:13preglowrasher: brand new
22:51:27preglowas new as rbutil could make it, at least
22:51:37preglowjhMikeS: sounds stellar, i want a pitch control :PPP
22:51:47jhMikeSwatch the ears with the triangle setting. it was in the middle of development. :)
22:51:56preglowjhMikeS: yeah, the triangle sounds ace :D
22:52:00 Quit Domonoky ("Trillian (")
22:52:14jhMikeSthere's a pitch sweep or pulse sweep commented out in there
22:52:22preglowouch, locked it up
22:53:07 Quit kkurbjun ("Leaving.")
22:53:21jhMikeSperhaps uncomment the talk_menu stuff or have no voice present at all
22:53:21preglowseems like it doesn't like browsing menu items too quickly while generating audio
22:53:36preglowremoved the voice
22:53:58rasheramiconn: yeah, you only changed it for sapi - it's probably relevant for most English engines. I'll move it to the general English case
22:57:24preglowjhMikeS: that pwm sweep sounds swEEET
22:57:39jhMikeSah, you got it. didn't know if would still function
22:57:49preglowcan't find the freq sweet, thiugh
22:58:44jhMikeSthere's no dealing with that harmonic pop at all
22:58:54preglowthat needs to be dealt with
22:59:15preglowit's quite easy to deal with, though, just requires you to synth and fade out the last harmonic by hand
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23:00:09jhMikeSby adding a 180deg phase shifted harmonic to cancel?
23:00:09 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
23:00:34preglowjhMikeS: no, you just generate one less harmonic than you need to, and synth the last one yourself, no need to cancel out anything
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23:01:06 Quit agm3nt ()
23:01:08jhMikeSah, ok
23:01:19preglowyou just need to be careful with phase so you don't get any discontinuities as you switch harmonics on and off, but it is completely doable without too much overhead
23:03:36preglowthis is nice stuff anyway, i tried doing this in fixed point once, failed miserably :P
23:03:43 Join MyAdler [0] (i=823f8317@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:04:55MyAdlerDoes anyone know if rockbox will ever support other video formats besides mpeg (or if it does). And if not....why?
23:05:23jhMikeSit wasn't easy but I commented about the little trick that saves it
23:05:33eigmaoops ,wrong window :)
23:06:07BagderMyAdler: if anyone adds support for other formats, sure.
23:06:20BagderI don't think its on anybody's agenda though
23:07:25MyAdler.avi would be great.... if i knew jack about programing id for sure do that....
23:07:37Bagderavi is not a format though
23:07:42Bagderits a container
23:07:51MyAdlersee.....i dont know jack....
23:08:18 Part gibbsnich
23:08:33Bagderhm, perhaps the correct term is multimedia container format
23:08:52 Quit mirak (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:09:24MyAdlerregardless.... itd be nice to be able to play more video files on rockbox....
23:09:54Bagderyou would still need to transcode them into a smaller size
23:10:12n1sMyAdler: lot's of stuff would be nic eto have but somone needs to want it bad enough to make it reality :-)
23:10:18Bagderare you saying rockbox should resize them too on the fly?
23:10:35n1sMyAdler: we have very limited processing power, that's why
23:10:38Bagderthat takes quite some power
23:10:56LloreanMyAdler: Videos have to be sized to fit the screen, the devices aren't fast enough to do it automatically, so you'd *have* to convert them to a format that A) The player is fast enough to play, and B) Is at a resolution the player cna display
23:11:22MyAdlerahhhh i c
23:12:28MyAdlerso how is it that such players as the ipod video play video....
23:13:05Bagderbecause it has a video-playing chip
23:13:20Bagderthat we don't know how to use
23:13:30 Nick kclafk is now known as kclaf (i=kclaf@
23:13:30bluebrotherand suitably sized videos ;)
23:13:56Bagderbut the ipod video can resize them on the fly, can't it?
23:14:10LloreanBagder: I think it can specifically from 640x480
23:14:13bluebrotherfrom all arbitrary sizes?
23:14:17LloreanIt may be that it can just halve.
23:14:24Bagderthat makes sense, yes
23:16:10MyAdlerso i guess im gonna need some software that does all this garbage....suggestions??
23:16:32bluebrotherthe wiki has some recommendations for adjusting video
23:17:09MyAdleri was already there....the link they provided was down.....
23:17:29*bluebrother wonders who "they" could be
23:17:33LloreanMyAdler: The wiki provides three (last time I checked) methods of converting videos.
23:18:01MyAdlerthey is 'wiki people'.... probably you
23:18:59rasherI can see why Bagder struggled when BC suggested xml for the language files.. The example file layout he (BC) came up with was absolutely horrible..
23:19:20 Join pixelma_ [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
23:19:40BagderI had forgot about that...
23:20:13*Bagder spots that the donate button changed
23:20:18rasherI figured I'd go back and read the thread before I go and do something stupid
23:20:18MyAdlercan riverpast video cleaner do the job?
23:20:45rasherAlso, the website appears to be working again..
23:20:45 Quit pixelma (Nick collision from services.)
23:20:45 Nick pixelma_ is now known as pixelma (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
23:21:12ZagorBagder: yeah paypal has had a slight redesign
23:21:18LloreanMyAdler: You can't expect people to know random software. Anything that can make a video that meets the description on the PluginMpegPlayer wiki page will work.
23:25:10 Quit Llorean (Remote closed the connection)
23:25:26 Join Llorean [0] (
23:27:31 Quit Bagder ("*plopp*")
23:28:33 Quit Zagor ("Leaving")
23:28:50 Quit freqmod (Remote closed the connection)
23:35:44 Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder)
23:36:26pixelmabeer? ;)
23:37:08 Quit Bagder (Client Quit)
23:37:09tumuyes plz, code not work.
23:37:37*bluebrother gets triggered
23:37:53tumunot my code tho, my code always works :)
23:38:37bluebrothercode? Bah, beer! :)
23:40:29n1sAny thoughts on moving Lcd settings and remote-LCD settings up one level from Display to General Settings ? also moving line selector and color selection from LCD to Display?
23:40:35*amiconn fetched a beer already
23:40:41rashermarkun: you know about font loading don't you? Would it be possible to stop a user from loading a font if it didn't contain all glyphs for the current language? I'm thinking it could be done if the languagefile included a LANG_USEDCHARS string that was generated automatically?
23:40:54sgsaxah yes, wiki is alive again
23:41:07amiconnn1s: colour is lcd specific (atm we don't have targets with 2 colour displays though)
23:41:23tumun1s, is there going to be more than one display that needs to be controlled?
23:41:33amiconntumu: There already are
23:41:37n1stumu: we already have remote-lcds
23:41:56tumuare they under the display?
23:41:58n1samiconn, ah true, that will remain in lcd settings then
23:41:59sgsaxMyAdler: the mpegplayer plugin page has a very nice howto on encoding/transcoding video files
23:42:03tumuor under "remote" or sorts?
23:42:09 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:42:44n1stumu: "Remote-lcd settings" is its own menu in "Display"
23:43:20amiconnBah, braindead firefox updater
23:44:21preglowBah, braindead preglow
23:44:24preglowno beer :/
23:44:39 Quit ompaul (No route to host)
23:45:20n1sor maybe lcd settings should go into "System" with the other hardware control settings
23:45:37*petur hands preglow a 75cl kriek lambic bottle from Cantillon
23:48:21preglowsweet lord, how i would love one of those things :/
23:48:39preglowi don't think i've ever tasted a proper lambic, only very commercial stuff
23:50:23*Soap would rather have a 750ml bottle.
23:51:07 Join dandin1 [0] (
23:51:33jhMikeStomato, tomato, potato, potato (doesn't seem to work well when typed :\)
23:52:25*petur gives Soap a strange look
23:57:38 Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder)
23:57:58 Quit ender` (" If the art world was ran by the RIAA, you would have to lease special glasses if you wanted to see a painting. -- Rodney Cas)
23:58:38peturalways fun when ender` leaves
23:58:41tumuhm, is the CODEC define passed over to subfolders in codecs/ ?
23:58:56tumuor am i doing something wrong

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