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#rockbox log for 2007-09-20

00:00:10tumuhad to force define CODEC
00:01:05 Join SoulPropagatio1 [0] (n=ethan@unaffiliated/soulpropagation)
00:01:31tumuin codecs/dumb/ that is
00:03:05*n1s found a bug in macro hell aka settings/menus stuff, any setting using the F_TEMPVAR flag in settings_list.c will always splash "Cancelled" when exiting the setting screen with left. btw wasn't it decided that the "Cancelled" splash should be removed altogether?
00:03:23linuxstb_tumu: Sounds like a problem with your Makefile
00:03:55tumulinuxstb, i'm using codecs/Makefile
00:04:12 Part SoulPropagatio1 ("Leaving.")
00:04:34 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
00:04:41tumuit seems to me that it only uses -DCODEC for files in codecs/, not for any subfolders in it
00:04:52tumubut i'm not makefile expert, so..
00:05:44jac0bwhen doing a battery benchmark is it okay to use a 1hr long track or should I use muliple tracks?
00:05:44 Quit obo ("bye")
00:05:59tumulinuxstb, getting the debug defines from apps/codecs.h requires CODEC to be defined
00:07:11Soapjac0b: use tracks of a bitrate consistant with the usage you want to test. There is no "right" or "wrong" - but there are limits to the conclusions you can draw dependant on your testing conditions.
00:08:38linuxstb_tumu: Some other codec Makefiles define -DCODEC, so it seems you should too.
00:09:04*bluebrother is dumb
00:09:21bluebrotherwell, then I get two commits for one. Oh my.
00:10:25tumulinuxstb, you're right.. my bad :)
00:11:00MikhailTkachlinuxstb: yeah, I need to get a new host for the plugin
00:11:14linuxstb_tumu: Although it's not clear - it would be nicer if we had a common "" include to use in codec makefiles.
00:11:39linuxstb_MikhailTkach: Why not just post to the patch tracker?
00:11:43 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
00:12:55tumulinuxstb, yeah.. too bad source size is not counted as vigorously as is binary size :)
00:13:35 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat")
00:13:43 Quit MyAdler ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:17:35n1stumu: the makefile system is pretty messy, it's basically hacked enough to work and left that way
00:18:35 Quit matsl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:18:37 Quit Rick (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:19:28 Join Rick [0] (
00:19:49 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
00:20:01 Join matsl [0] (
00:24:21 Join oranges2 [0] (
00:24:52 Quit matsl (Remote closed the connection)
00:27:00oranges2So does the Sansa charge through USB if you're in RockBox?
00:27:49 Join dfghdfghgfdh [0] (i=cdfb12a7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:28:02 Quit dfghdfghgfdh (Client Quit)
00:28:23 Join YoshiCJ [0] (i=cdfb12a7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:30:39YoshiCJI would,t Believe it would.
00:30:55oranges2I was told yesterday that it does
00:30:58LloreanYes, the Sansa charges.
00:31:00scorcheit should
00:31:20oranges2Then does playing Bubbles with music on drain ridiculous amounts of battery life?
00:31:31Soapunless you turn the backlight off ;)
00:31:37oranges2Like 50% of the battery in 15 minutes?
00:31:52YoshiCJSo without Rockbox the Connected Screen is just for a Hold so you can't do anything...?
00:31:54oranges2The screen is completely black with the backscreen off
00:31:58LloreanEven at full draw the device shouldn't be able to drain 50% of your battery in 15 minutes.
00:32:12oranges2I left it plugged in overnight
00:32:20oranges2Guess I should have checked before I did anything =/
00:32:33YoshiCJMines plugged in now
00:32:35oranges2But I noticed that I only had 50% left after getting off the bus
00:32:51oranges2Is the battery level accurate usually?
00:33:04 Join RudMan [0] (
00:33:15YoshiCJI dont think its very accurate at all
00:33:45YoshiCJId rather see a Percentage then Green Bars
00:34:04n1sYoshiCJ: you can, just change the wps
00:34:15Soapthat's an issue with how you have your WPS set or how you have your status bar set.
00:34:40oranges2I checked in the Rockbix Info screen
00:35:16SoapDo you really think Rockbox, of all DAP softwares, would hide quantitative data from you and make you only view a qualitative display? ;)
00:35:38 Part n1s
00:37:05oranges2I'm kind of wary now that half my battery life disappeared mysteriously on my third day of owning the player
00:37:19Lloreanoranges2: Except you don't know that it did.
00:37:40LloreanFor one thing, anything keeping the backlight on *and* the CPU at full speed will drain at a significant amount more than normal.
00:37:46oranges2Thats why its mysterious
00:38:19linuxstb_oranges2: So your Sansa shut off due to low power after 30 minutes?
00:38:24oranges250% in 15 minutes?
00:38:50linuxstb_Then how do you _know_ the battery was at 50%?
00:38:54Lloreanoranges2: That's the thing, you don't even know that it's 50% that was drained. The battery meter isn't necessarily accurate.
00:38:57oranges2I played it on the bus, which was 15 minutes. When I turned it back on after getting to my desk, I noticed it only had 50% left.
00:39:05Soapreproduce it under controlled conditions, and then it will be worthy of testing. As it stands now you _think_ you had a 100% charged sansa, you think you used it only for _about_ 15 minutes, and If you recall correctly it was at 50% at the end of the time.
00:39:23Soaps/testing/talking about
00:39:25oranges2I plan to test it
00:39:29YoshiCJIv created a portable 9V battery carger for the Sansa.... So i have no problems
00:39:34oranges2I was just hoping I could get some useful information before devoting that time
00:39:38oranges2I guess I was wrong
00:39:51Lloreanoranges2: You have gotten useful information: The drain is high, the battery meter is inaccurate.
00:39:56SoapI'm just saying that we're discussing something we're not even sure happened, in the logged developer channel.
00:40:09LloreanWhat were you expecting? "Oh, Rockbox always drains your entire battery in 30 minutes while using bubbles, don't bother testing"?
00:40:10oranges2Except I was just told earlier that the battery meter is accurate
00:40:30Lloreanoranges2: Who told you that?
00:40:47oranges2Well possibly it could be a well-known fact in the RockBox community that running a plugin with music playing drains ridiculous amounts of battery
00:41:32jhMikeSit's not super wildly off but it still takes me most of a day to drain to where it says anything nearing 50%
00:41:36Lloreanoranges2: Rockbox can't perform the impossible. You can only drain so much power at once, because there's only so much hardware to turn on.
00:41:39Soaporanges2: you're not even sure the player was at close to 100% to start. Let's PLEASE stop speculating about something which might not have happened!
00:42:30oranges2So instead of actually speculating the possibilities and gathering information that could possibly answer my question without further hassle
00:42:37oranges2I should devote a bunch of time to tests right away
00:42:42YoshiCJanyways who cares about battery power rigth now....Having problems with RockBox for C200
00:42:53oranges2Is the c200 supported?
00:43:07Lloreanoranges2: Instead of *speculating*, yes. "Asking for information" and "Speculating" are two different things though.
00:43:29Lloreanoranges2: What you could've done was said "Should Rockbox be able to drain 50% of my power in 15 minutes under any conditions?" "No." "Oh, I should do more testing then."
00:43:37LloreanSimple, short, and no wild guesses or such.
00:44:14 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
00:44:30YoshiCJIv worked on it for a bit and everything works good except most everything Hahaha.
00:44:32oranges2And thats exactly what I did
00:44:46 Quit davina (Remote closed the connection)
00:44:49oranges2<oranges2> Then does playing Bubbles with music on drain ridiculous amounts of battery life? <Llorean> Yes <oranges2> Like 50% of the battery in 15 minutes? <Llorean> No.
00:45:20oranges2Then somehow other people starting going "BRAWRAWR YOU SHOULD HAV E TESTD IT NUB"
00:45:28pwn_nubsjust dont run as many things as you so that you can come complain here
00:45:48oranges2God damn
00:45:50linuxstb_YoshiCJ: What's the problem?
00:45:50oranges2I just asked a question
00:46:03YoshiCJi use no blackligth because i know the menu like the back of my hand...
00:46:46 Part oranges2
00:47:20***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:48:05 Join Nico_P [0] (n=nicolas@rockbox/developer/NicoP)
00:48:20 Join oranges2 [0] (
00:48:26 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
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00:49:10YoshiCJWonder if i can get this goddam theme to change on c200
00:49:46pixelmawhat theme?
00:50:14YoshiCJIv made a theme for c200 trying it out now
00:50:34YoshiCJLet you know what happens
00:52:57 Part toffe82
00:54:32YoshiCJWOOT!!! Success
00:54:58 Join JdGordon [0] (
00:55:00YoshiCJFinally some progress.
00:57:53 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
01:00:00YoshiCJor not damn..
01:00:27 Join Nullypoo [0] (
01:01:11 Quit YoshiCJ ("CGI:IRC")
01:02:11Nico_Pthe m:robe 500 looks like a really nice player
01:02:53Nico_PJdGordon: here ?
01:03:07 Quit pwn_nubs (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:03:31 Quit Nullypoo (Client Quit)
01:03:55 Quit jac0b ()
01:04:24JdGordonhey Nico_P
01:05:05Nico_PJdGordon: with such a screen you're going to want to make rockbox prettier, aren't you ? ;)
01:05:32JdGordonprobably not
01:05:45Nico_Pwhy not ?
01:05:53JdGordonmight try to get a grid list for menus, but other than that.. meh :p
01:05:58JdGordon640x480 screen!
01:06:10JdGordonalthough its runnig portaright atm so its HUGE!
01:06:15*jhMikeS thinks the gigabeat's and even the sansa's lcd is enough justification for it
01:06:17Nico_Pyeah, that's what I saw
01:06:19JdGordonthe default font is almost unreadbaly small
01:06:35*Nico_P thinks rockbox needs some kind of graphical menu
01:06:50JdGordonamiconn will come hunt you down if you say that too loudly
01:06:58*jhMikeS agrees...and a real windowing system
01:07:14Nico_Pviewports again then :)
01:08:25jhMikeSof course but I think that idea goes farther than what amiconn has in mind. unclipped ones would still exist.
01:09:47 Quit MikhailTkach ("bye")
01:10:18Nico_Pmaybe it would be worth talking about it to amiconn so that when he implements viewports he does it in an extensible way
01:10:21*jhMikeS is just sick enough in the head to add region-based vieports to have ports of all shapes
01:10:38JdGordonrecatngles are enough
01:11:08jhMikeSclipping rectanges is really just the same task as regions so it might just be an implied feature
01:11:25 Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
01:11:59jhMikeSthe main difference would be that unclipped ones would drawn onto a clipped one and be "owned" by it
01:12:24 Join YoshiCJ [0] (i=cdfb12a7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:13:29jhMikeSso a clipped could could consist of several unclipped ports. I guess call them "child windows" ;)
01:14:13 Join Guile`` [0] (n=Guile@
01:15:04jhMikeSthe biggest holdup is that rb drawing is selfish and procedural rather than event driven.
01:15:32 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
01:18:20 Quit Nullbyte (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:18:46YoshiCJThey should add the sansapatcher for c200
01:19:42linuxstb_Does it work for you?
01:20:33YoshiCJI have the c200 patcher and it works perfectly fine.
01:21:09*jhMikeS says "antialiased spline fonts"
01:21:13Nico_PjhMikeS: how would an event driven system work ?
01:21:37linuxstb_YoshiCJ: The one I posted a few hours ago? Or did you build it yourself from SVN?
01:22:05YoshiCJThe one you posted
01:22:06jhMikeSNico_P: I suppose you need a way to tell an uncovered port to draw itself so somehow that has to be conveyed in a safe way
01:24:50jhMikeSNico_P: message posting I imagine unless some sort of direct drawing could be done but that needs multithread aware code in the gui
01:25:25 Join aliask [0] (
01:25:51Nico_Pso there would be an UI thread getting messages telling it which ports to draw ?
01:25:58*petur taps the build server on the shoulder and says "boo"
01:26:55 Quit linuxstb_ ("Chatzilla [Firefox 1.0.2/20050317]")
01:27:30JdGordonjhMikeS: well, that wouldnt be all that difficult, I was thinkin that a viewport would just store its drawing function in the info, so when its uncovered it could be told to redraw
01:27:43jhMikeSNico_P: I suppose the thing that decided what needs updating would be telling each viewport to draw. Directly or indirectly. If it needs a threading sync mechanism, I suppose I'd want it hidden away.
01:30:37YoshiCJlinustb_: Works Like A Charm
01:30:49 Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
01:30:56jhMikeSJdGordon: it's something like that but if the thread "in charge" of the port is waiting for input, who does the drawing?
01:31:36JdGordonumm... hmmm
01:32:05 Quit Guile` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:33:19 Quit hcs ("Leaving.")
01:33:34pixelmaJdGordon: could you please have a look at your latest forum post, "typing wise" ;)
01:33:35YoshiCJYea its perfect linuxstb_
01:34:08JdGordonjhMikeS: in each "screens" button loop we would have viewports_update()? like we have now for the statusbar?
01:34:48JdGordonpixelma: i type funny before breakfast :D
01:35:28pixelmalast time it was the keyboard, now that... :P
01:35:54JdGordonalright... you got me... contrary to popular belief... im not in fact perfect!
01:39:13 Join barrywardell [0] (
01:40:19oranges2So I recreated the same conditions, and 15 minutes of Bubbles + music only took off about 3%
01:40:30oranges2So it must not have charged last night
01:40:31YoshiCJNice 3%
01:42:08YoshiCJlost the .rookbox link anyone still got it... should have saved a fresh copie.
01:43:12tumuholy shit! dumb renders few seconds properly :)
01:44:00JdGordonwell duh! its called dumb for a reason
01:45:16 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:46:41 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
01:57:59 Join MBaller20 [0] (i=4a4c8d5c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:59:44MBaller20i've checked these forums everyday waiting for an auto-installer for the sansa e200r......but still nothing :(
02:00:19 Join barrywardell_ [0] (n=barrywar@
02:00:24SoapShe'll be comming round the mountain when she comes.
02:00:26 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
02:00:49oranges2I'm pretty sure someone made a auto-install script...
02:00:58MBaller20Soap: haha, nice
02:01:21MBaller20oranges2: linux is still needed
02:01:36Soaporanges2: I'm pretty sure using somebody's unofficial auto-install script is not the best course of action for someone who is unsure enough about the process that they seek official support.
02:02:04YoshiCJanyone find the link for c200?
02:02:06oranges2I think if the unofficial install script works, then theres no problem.
02:02:30MBaller20oranges2: and where did you find this script?
02:02:36oranges2MBaller20: What OS are you on?
02:04:15JdGordonjhMikeS: any idea how viewports and the screen api shuold work together?
02:06:30*JdGordon back later
02:06:30 Nick JdGordon is now known as JdGordon|gone (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
02:07:22 Quit My_Sic (Connection reset by peer)
02:08:00MBaller20the developers should make a progress page to show how far they get into making an auto-installer for windows
02:08:42oranges2Chances are that there isn't one being worked on
02:09:56 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
02:10:01 Quit YoshiCJ ("CGI:IRC")
02:10:32MBaller20rasher: I don't think that works on the e200r's
02:10:55oranges2After being connected for about 25 minutes, the battery meter shows 100%
02:11:01oranges2But now unplugged, its dropping rapidly
02:11:30oranges2Now its at 51%, and only says 2 hours :[
02:11:58LloreanThe "time remaining" is probably very wrong, that needs special calibration.
02:12:07oranges2I see.
02:12:35oranges2Would you happen to know about how long it takes to reach a full charge on a Sansa e200?
02:12:49 Join My_Sic [0] (
02:13:01 Join YoshiCJ [0] (i=cdfb12a7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:13:08 Quit jhulst (Remote closed the connection)
02:13:10LloreanProbably best just to charge in the OF and see when it says it's done.
02:13:27YoshiCJI knew that the battery display is gay on the c200
02:13:42oranges2Well it took about 3 hours in the OF to charge from purchase
02:13:51LloreanYoshiCJ: Please try not to use offensive terms. This is a technical channel
02:13:53jhMikeSJdGordon|gone: since you're gone...for the logs. eww...polling.
02:13:58oranges2But I left it connected overnight in RockBox, and it doesn't seem to have charged
02:14:20YoshiCJYou have c200 rith?
02:14:25oranges2Is there a risk of overcharging?
02:14:46YoshiCJIv tryed but mine dont charge in Rockbox
02:15:14Lloreanoranges2: No, there's restrictions in the charging hardware
02:15:53oranges2And you know for a fact that it charges in RockBox?
02:16:16jhMikeSThere's AS3514 setup for it. imo it should be disabled until it's know how to properly manage it. I never charge from RB.
02:16:24Lloreanoranges2: Well, *mine* does.
02:16:50 Quit MBaller20 ("CGI:IRC")
02:16:51LloreanIt charges much, much faster in the OF though
02:17:04oranges2It doesn't take more than 8 hours to charge though right?
02:17:25LloreanNo clue, I don't pay attention.
02:17:44YoshiCJOh God no, Shouldnt be longer then 8 jours
02:17:50jhMikeSI just hope the voltage threshold in RB is correct. It probably just trickles in RB but I don't know if there's any overcharge danger.
02:17:53LloreanYoshiCJ: You have no clue. Please don't comment.
02:17:57barrywardell_the problem with charging is probably that it only goes at 100mA in Rockbox vs 500mA in the OF
02:18:09LloreanConsidering it gets 1/5 the power, it'll take significantly longer.
02:18:19barrywardell_to get 500mA, we need proper usb support
02:18:52 Join alienseer23 [0] (
02:20:05jhMikeS1/5 the power != 1/5 the current unless voltage is constant :) P=IE
02:20:54LloreanjhMikeS: With USB, shouldn't it be?
02:21:06alienseer23Ihave an imitation ipod that uses an "actions" processor ATJ2093H, and a smasung memory chip samsumg 701
02:21:20alienseer23I was wondering if anyone could tell me if rockbox will run on this thing?
02:21:27alienseer23sorry about the multiple lines
02:21:31 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
02:21:55Lloreanalienseer23: Rockbox ONLY runs on the listed players
02:22:30alienseer23maybee i can look into the chipsets of the listed players and see if I get lucky
02:22:31aliaskThose actions chips are pretty limited too, even if you REALLY knew what you were doing it'd be a mission
02:23:20alienseer23do you guys know of any olternate firmware that might runon it?
02:23:36alienseer23((shot in the dark))
02:23:44scorchethis is #rockbox...not #alternatefirmware ;)
02:23:47aliaskI've not heard of any
02:24:21jhMikeSLlorean: I guess you'd model it with an ideal 0-ohm batter in series with a resistor (R) so if the voltage across R is constant and R is constant is would be pretty close.
02:24:58alienseer23well, thanks, then...nice project, rockbox
02:25:38alienseer23happy talk like a pirate day
02:25:41 Part alienseer23
02:26:44*jhMikeS always thought pirates had long talks about idct and blit synths ??
02:26:48LloreanjhMikeS: As it is, there's also the factor of how much is used just keeping the player on, etc.
02:26:58 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
02:28:05 Join MikhailTkach [0] (
02:29:57jhMikeSLlorean: hmmm...but of this transistor hw runs on current sources but switch mode regulators will consume more current to maintain constant volage as the batt level drops (power conversion).
02:30:55 Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend")
02:31:08 Part pixelma
02:33:05 Quit dandin1 ()
02:35:51jhMikeSoy, I just want to find the stupid mistake in this code :P
02:38:18 Join JdGordon|uni [0] (i=82c20d67@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:38:31JdGordon|unijhMikeS: yeah, polling sucks, but is there a better way?
02:42:30jhMikeSJdGordon|uni: I hope so. Making UI elements self contained and requiring them to process messages or something.
02:43:59 Quit n17ikh|Lappy ()
02:44:00jhMikeSKey input can then be dispatched to the active element which is actually safer anyway than an open, shared button queue.
02:44:15 Join Hooger [0] (
02:44:39Hoogerlol helldragon.
02:45:51JdGordon|unijhMikeS: that sounds wrong for an mp3 player.... the screens are too small to have more than one "window" open/active at a time
02:46:27LloreanJdGordon|uni: I disagree
02:46:57LloreanFor example, the new AppleOS does more than one window
02:47:08LloreanIt draws the Menu in the left half of the screen while displaying something else on the right
02:47:23JdGordon|unibut the right screen isnt expecting input.. right?
02:47:25***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:47:26 Nick JdGordon|uni is now known as Jdgordon (i=82c20d67@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:47:35LloreanAt least, not user input
02:47:36Jdgordonshould make tab completion easier for you :)
02:48:57Jdgordonif more than 1 viewport want user input how the heck do you decide which gets it?
02:49:21 Quit barrywardell_ ()
02:50:10jhMikeSJdGordon: I think they really could. Alot OF does and it seems to be a nice thing. It doesn't have a dozen at a time of course.
02:50:11 Join barrywardell [0] (n=barrywar@
02:51:14Jdgordonwhich OF has a screen with more than 1 input waiting section?
02:51:26jhMikeSJdGordon: pretty much the last element created. say it's a popup with a yes/no ... I guess that gets it.
02:52:00Jdgordonthats fine for a piopup, but what about having the pitch screen open as a popup on the wps... ?
02:52:04 Join RaRe [0] (
02:52:14jhMikeSJdGordon: I don't know of any but multiple threads should never wait on a queue head and the button queue is open to that as things are.
02:53:19Jdgordonoh, right
02:53:26jhMikeSthe pitch screen is an input mode of the WPS screen by inheritance so it gets it and must be exited first or some focus switching mechanism needs to exist. hehe, lets just have a pointer :P
02:53:47 Quit bigstar ("My software never has bugs. It just develops random features.")
02:54:50Jdgordonwell, I thought the idea for vp was putting them into the firmare layer... so that makes things complicated if we want to have one viewports thread which waits for a button press and forwards it to the correct "window"
02:55:36Jdgordonor.. the action stuff needs to be fudged so it can take a button as input instead of calling button_get() itself
02:56:07jhMikeSI don't think a viewports thread would do any such thing. The active UI element would be the one waiting on it's own queue for input. Threads could have queues built in.
02:56:17 Join perrikwp [0] (i=98215ac0@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:56:39 Quit perrikwp (Client Quit)
02:56:46Jdgordonok, so now im confused
02:56:47 Join perrikwp [0] (i=98215ac0@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:56:57Jdgordonhow does a button get from the button queue into a windows queue?
02:57:25jhMikeSIf a certain UI element is active when a press occurs, the element's thread gets the event posted by the button driver.
02:57:51LloreanSo, whichever element has focus.
02:58:12Jdgordonso we have 1 thread for every element?
02:58:25Jdgordonremember, all screens are done int he main thread
02:58:43 Join safetydan [0] (i=dc9d468b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:58:55jhMikeSLlorean: yes. dispatching so the active element gets the message.
02:58:56 Quit safetydan (Client Quit)
02:59:11 Join safetydan [0] (i=dc9d468b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
02:59:11jhMikeSJgGordon: would never dream of doing that.
03:00:08 Join Vloosie [0] (i=cf3746a7@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
03:00:13Jdgordonso something still has to get the button out of the button queue intot he elements queue
03:00:29jhMikeSI suppose the button queue would be history alltogether
03:00:52VloosieI have a question...
03:02:01jhMikeSIf there were one, it wouldn't be public but just hold raw input events. Messages from that would be moved to the focused queue and processed by the waiter optionally translated into actions.
03:05:10Jdgordonthe other thing i was thining about on my drive to uni...
03:05:37Jdgordonwe want to draw to a pixel in the viewport not the screen....
03:06:12Jdgordonso either we reimplement all the lcd drawing functions to do the offset, or we add a global offset which needds to be somhow set and unset around eah lcd draw call
03:07:08jhMikeSnot following.
03:07:42jhMikeSoh, the lcd functions can take a context parameter...just a viewport pointer or something.
03:08:40Jdgordonthat could work
03:09:11Jdgordonso screen api?
03:09:21jhMikeSone thing to save space in advance is go give bitmaps small headers and just have lcd_bitmap and lcd_bitmap_part for any format at all.
03:11:03jhMikeSJdgordon: would a viewport be confined to a specific screen or could it span any number?
03:11:26JdgordonI was about to say confined to one.. but im not so sure
03:11:44JdgordonI tihnk it would make sense to have it only 1 screen, so youd need one on each...
03:11:45jhMikeSthat's like multimonitor APIs. fancy. :)
03:12:30safetydanVloosie, ask away
03:13:14jhMikeShmmm...could have a virtual display that is made up of all avaiable displays. even I think that one's too far at this point.
03:13:27Jdgordonyeah, how bout no :)
03:15:17jhMikeSI'll accept "no" on that. I'd try to keep the possiblilty in mind however to make it easy to adapt a device that might work for.
03:18:34jhMikeSI think implementing clipping itself is about the least of things but would need driver support since overlapped operations need to be split up in to several rectangles.
03:20:56Jdgordonmoving comouter labs... bbs
03:21:02Jdgordonand yeah, clipping is gonna be annoying
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03:22:23VloosieOkay, when I try to intailize my database, my iPod crashes at around 600 items, any way to fix this?
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03:23:08YoshiCJAnyone got a link to a fresh copie of the c200 .Rockbox?
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03:26:23Vloosiesafetydan, any ideas?
03:27:12safetydanVloosie, it's probably because the tags in that file are corrupt
03:27:19safetydanor trip up the metadata parser in some way
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03:29:27VloosieThat's what I was thinking, or maybe invailid charactors unknown in RockBox, I have over 10,000 items, do you suggest me doing anything safetydan or do you think it would be too much of a hassle?
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03:34:09safetydanVloosie, search the forums. There's various ways of finding out which file is the problem and fixing it. A binary search would probably be most efficient.
03:34:11Alonea*cracks up over pirate day* nice. Anything new happening?
03:35:36JdGordonrasher: you round?
03:36:27JdGordonguess not... to the mailing list batman!
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03:46:14JdGordoneigma: still round?
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03:48:20Prem0hello, I need some assistance. I have a sansa e250 that found 0 databases to initalize so I powered off the unit and it will not boot. I have attempted the normal power up options on the wiki but all that happens is that the blue scroll wheel light comes on and a blank screen
03:49:48oranges2have you tried going into recovery mode?
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03:50:28Prem0yes, by putting it on hold then powering while holding record
03:51:03oranges2And it doesn't go into recovery mode?
03:51:15Prem0woot, it just worked this time stand by
03:53:58Prem0just went into recovery mode, I am rechecking the wiki
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03:57:19Prem0woohoo, unbricked player, sorry to bother you
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04:28:11saratogaLlorean: you around?
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04:30:50Lloreansaratoga: Yes
04:32:26BrianHVI understand from the FAQ that controlling the iPod through a dock does not work with rockbox; however, does playback work through the dock?
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04:32:59YoshiCJSansa c200
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04:34:23saratogaLlorean: have you been following the default theme thread?
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04:34:58Lloreansaratoga: The Cabbie author mentioned interest in expanding support to all targets, right?
04:35:05saratogayes he did
04:35:10saratogaand I'd be willing to help him
04:35:22saratogai want to know what you think of the theme though
04:35:29LloreanLet him know then. I'm rather font of the cabbie theme, though it has a few significant flaws.
04:35:47LloreanFor example, the last time I looked, it had text in the backdrop at the bottom of the screen, overlapping long lists.
04:35:52saratogagood to know
04:35:52LloreanBut that's easy to fix
04:37:02saratogathen I will offer to help him port it to other targets
04:37:12saratogaand see if we can get this default theme project moving again
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04:38:00saratogaplease let me know if anyone objects
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04:38:20RudManI like the idea of two choices for a default theme. a regular one and one with large fonts
04:39:11saratogahow difficult is it to edit themes anyway?
04:39:17saratogaor rather, to port them
04:39:46RudManif there are images, they have to be resized and then placed just so
04:40:27XavierGrsaratoga: making a unified WPS is a rather difficult and possibly annoying process, I wish you patience and good luck :)
04:40:29RudManand then the right font has to be used and for some targets not all info might be able to be fit on the screen
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04:41:13Lloreansaratoga: Ridiculously easy.
04:41:25LloreanXavierGr: In the case of this WPS, it should be nearly trivial. Very little graphics.
04:41:36saratogawhen you say unified, you mean theres one WPS that runs on everything?
04:41:46saratogai assumed we made N of them and it picked one at compile time
04:41:54LloreanYou want to make several, yes
04:42:05LloreanProbably one for most screen sizes, if not all
04:42:16saratogaok good
04:42:26saratogado things like menu icons have to be resized?
04:42:50psycho_maniacwhat does the 16 mean in 320x240x""16"" in ipods resolution ?
04:42:51LloreanDepends on your preference.
04:42:56Lloreanpsycho_maniac: Bits for color depth
04:43:38Lloreansaratoga: For example, as long as the font size is the same, you can keep the same icons. You can make just 2 or 3 icon sets, and just use the smallest icons less than or equal to the font size, or you can just make one small one (or use the current colored default ones from the wiki) with any font
04:43:48XavierGrI can't say that cabbie is in my taste, but sure as heck I would pick it over the current-defualt
04:43:55psycho_maniacis that cabbie theme ported to the 5g ipod?
04:44:45psycho_maniacwhat player is it ported to so i can actually see what this theme looksl iek
04:44:56LloreanGigabeat F and Sansa I think
04:45:41saratogatheres also one for the H10 posted in the forums somewhere
04:47:00SoapBrianHV: There is good reason to suspect that any given iPod accessory will have working audio
04:47:06psycho_maniacwhat do you guys think of the Ultima v1.0 theme?
04:47:30***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
04:48:05SoapBrianHV: But, this is not always the case. Some iPod accessories appear to wait for communication from the iPod before accepting what is really nothing more than line-out pins on the dock connector. We have an ever-growing wiki page, titled IpodAccessories, which is the collected wisdom of all we know so far.
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04:49:54psycho_maniacoh wow the cabbie theme looks very nice. i never seen it till now.
04:49:55SoapBrianHV: Said communication from the iPod to the accessory is not supported by Rockbox in the least, there is much that needs done to accomplish this "simple" task, and therefore all accessory support is rather hit-or-miss. If you have an accessory you are able to test we would very much appreciate your contributions to the wiki page, or if you are unable or unwilling to sign up for a wiki accout you can PM me either here in IRC, on on the forums, where
04:49:55Soap I go by the same nick I do here.
04:50:37SoapIn said PM please include information so that I might fill in all columns of the wikipage.
04:51:35Soappsycho_maniac: I prefer Ultima III: Exodus. I really think it was Lord British's finest work.
04:51:58psycho_maniacSoap: where could i see a pic of that?
04:52:26LloreanSoap: Isn't it General British now?
04:52:32XavierGrheh the ines port that MikeT posted on the tracker unexpectedly works on my H100!
04:52:36LloreanIt's some military rank. Major?
04:53:07XavierGrdead slow but works nonetheless
04:53:44LloreanXavierGr: So, working NES games?
04:53:57XavierGryes... quite surprising
04:54:05Soaphow is the light-gun support?
04:54:14LloreanXavierGr: What task?
04:54:21XavierGrit didn't build for F40 but build quite ok for H100
04:54:34XavierGrscroll down
04:54:57psycho_maniacso what is this "Ultima III: Exodus" id like to see what it looks like
04:55:05Lloreanpsycho_maniac: It was a joke. It's a game.
04:55:33psycho_maniacoh lol
04:57:10XavierGrdamn it crashed and probably there are wrong keymaps for the H100, but I am still pretty amazed that it run in grayscale
05:01:25LloreanXavierGr: What target is it inteded for?
05:02:24XavierGrhe says H10
05:02:38XavierGrstill it baffles me why it compiled for my H100 and not F40
05:04:23XavierGrI am not sure I got undeclared prototype all over
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05:12:56saratogacareless #ifdef would be my guess
05:13:18XavierGrah probably has to do with the screen width height maybe
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05:13:29XavierGrH100 has the same resolution with H10
05:13:32XavierGrjust a guess though
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05:18:22XavierGrdamn this is some dirty code...
05:18:31XavierGrifdef and commented code hell
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05:33:10psycho_maniacwhy does my ipod 80gig crash when i go to the recording screen and then try to play a song?
05:33:39LloreanBecause leaving recording doesn't work right yet
05:34:59psycho_maniacdoes it do this to all rockbox players?
05:36:43LloreanI believe it's just the iPods
05:36:52LloreanIt *may* be all PortalPlayers, I'm not 100% sure
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05:37:02Llorean But it works fine on the non-PortalPlayer targets
05:39:17oranges2Well if the battery level is being displayed correctly
05:39:24oranges2My Sansa isn't being charged at all
05:42:59kkurbjunLlorean, did you end up trying to recompile rockboy with more plugin memory?
05:43:24Lloreankkurbjun: No, haven't tried it yet
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05:44:17kkurbjunlet me know if you end up trying it and have trouble, I would be interested to know/help
05:44:56kkurbjunIs anyone around that knows what to look for with the whole unix vs. dos files concerning line endings
05:44:58LloreanI've got a busy weekend coming up, so I don't know when I'll get around to trying it.
05:45:07kkurbjunno worries
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05:49:47XavierGrdefinitely playable on Gigabeat
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05:50:18McEnroeHey guys! I have a problem: although rockbox works without major problems, windows cannot find the filesystem...
05:50:23LloreanXavierGr: Got it compiling?
05:51:33XavierGrtons of warnings though
05:51:49advcomp2019McEnroe, what player is it
05:51:53XavierGrand occasional graphic glitches, but works okay
05:52:25McEnroeadvcomp2019, ipod nano 1st gen
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05:54:46advcomp2019McEnroe, what did you mean by windows cant find the file system
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05:55:58McEnroeadvcomp2019, the same as i said: windows cannot find the filesystem. So it claims that it is unformated and offers me the option to format it.
05:56:15webguest71Hi, i was just wondering if any one can help with a problem im having with Rockbox.
05:57:32webguest71i try to open/play an MP3 and it gives me an error "data abort at 0002768"
05:58:45advcomp2019McEnroe, i do not have an ipod so i do not know what is causing that... maybe another user with an ipod could help
06:00:20McEnroeadvcomp2019, this is not connected to the ipod as a ipod but as a mass storage.
06:09:35oranges2Would buying an Ac adapter for the Sansa bypass the decreased/none charging issue?
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06:37:50SanitizedHello everyone, sorry to bother you but does anyone know if I can I use ipodwizard with rockbox?
06:38:04oranges2The reverse bootloader works :D
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06:47:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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06:51:49Bradarthey i need some help
06:52:03Bradartis anyone there to help me?
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06:52:58Bradartis anyone there at all?
06:53:55 Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
06:54:06Bradartwell, my problem is this
06:54:46Bradartwhen rockbox is booting, it looks for the directory .rockbox, but windows cannot create a folder with a dot in front of the name. Can this be fixed?
06:55:02oranges2Jjust unzip it to the root directory
06:55:06Bradarti did
06:55:14Bradartit just comes out as "rockbox"
06:55:17RudManuse a better unzip program
06:55:24RudManit worked fine for me in windows
06:55:37Bradartthe program is the problem?
06:55:46Bradartso thats the only way?
06:55:59RudManyeah, it ain't windows problem
06:56:06oranges2You should use WinRAR anyawys
06:56:11Bradartill try it and let you know how it goes
06:56:16Bradartis winrar free?
06:56:22oranges2Sort of
06:56:27oranges2Technically its not
06:56:35oranges2But the free trial never stops working
06:56:44Bradartits nagware?
06:56:55oranges2Unless you crack it of course :]
06:57:26oranges2You've seriously never used WinRAR?
06:57:37Lloreanoranges2: First off, we take copyright seriously in here.
06:57:49LloreanPlease do not discuss cracking software in any way.
06:57:55RudManor use the real unzip program,
06:58:10*Llorean recommends 7-zip, since it's cross platform, open source, and reliable.
06:58:32Bradartwill 7zip take care of my .rockbox filename problem?
06:58:49LloreanIf you extract with any decent extracting tool you'll get a .rockbox folder. 7-zip is decent. :)
06:59:54Bradartthank all of you so much
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06:59:59Bradarti'll be right back
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07:02:02kkurbjunhmm, the current builds don't seem to be working
07:02:12Bradartawesome it worked
07:02:16Bradartyou guys are amazing
07:02:24Bradarti was freaking out
07:02:40kkurbjunI'll check it tomorrow and see if there were any problems and I plan on fixing any then
07:02:58oranges2At least you don't have a crazy problem where the screen looks like its melting whenever you try to boot the OF firmware
07:03:15oranges2And not even the most experienced RockBox devs have any idea whats causing it
07:04:21scorchewell, to fix something, you have to have a device that exibits the problem...
07:04:42oranges2Well I kind of got it working anyways
07:04:46oranges2So its not a big deal anymore
07:06:24scorcheto you maybe..
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07:07:11oranges2I think holding select to load RockBox is a considerable improvement over the OF not loading at all
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07:58:54Mode"#rockbox +o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
07:59:48Topic"Please read before speaking: | Please direct offtopic/social chat to #rockbox-community" by scorche (i=Blah@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
07:59:59Mode"#rockbox -o scorche " by ChanServ (ChanServ@services.)
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08:01:17corevettewill rockbox erase my songs on my ipod
08:01:49scorche...unless you tell it to
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08:26:18*amiconn is annoyed by all those weird ideas
08:30:14Sanitizedcan anyone help me? my ipod running on rockbox suddenly is unable to play files
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08:30:22Sanitized*audio files
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08:31:18scorcheis it a nano?
08:31:27Sanitizedipod photo
08:31:40scorchewhat happens when you play a file?
08:32:11Sanitizedsuddenly the files -though visable in the database- plays no sound and says unknown song unknown artist uknown album
08:33:23scorchehave you updated the database?
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08:33:42SanitizedI added more songs to the ipod, yes.
08:34:31scorchebut did you hit "update database"?
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08:38:50rasheramiconn: I assume you mean the 2 posts to the -dev list. I don't think it's fair to just dismiss them as "weird ideas". They appeared from perceived problems and at least for the first one, has been met with agreement so far
08:40:42Sanitizedbeing new to RB I am unsure as to how and update the database, could you explain to me how?
08:41:21scorchehave you read the manual?
08:41:52SanitizedI attempted to, it was rather confusing; but I will try again.
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08:46:31amiconnrasher: No, with the weird ideas I meant jhMikeS' and JdGordon's talk last night
08:47:34***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
08:47:57rasheramiconn: Ah, okay
08:48:03amiconnRegarding the .lang (source) file format, I don't really care as long as the format allows what the current one does (e.g. having a different split-by-feature or split-by-target in <dest> and <voice> than in <source>)
08:48:14rpwalshwhere can I get fonts for rockbox (sansa E series) and is it possible to use them to enlage the text size?
08:48:34bluebrotherrpwalsh: see the manual ... or the website
08:48:44amiconnBagder: ping...
08:48:48bluebrother(hint: follow the "Extras" rabbit err ... link)
08:49:15rasheramiconn: when would you want to split dest differntly than source?
08:50:16rasherNot that I'm going to do anything about it. It should be a drop-in replacement if I go ahead with it (and get it right)
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08:51:01rpwalshthanks bluebrother
08:51:04amiconnI can think of 2 uses: (1) occasions where a string must be short, and hence needs to be abbreviated for the player in the translation but not for english, or vice versa
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08:52:21rasherGood point. Speaking of that, it'd be nice to have someone identify these strings needing special care.
08:52:23amiconn(2) whole languages which use neither latin nor cyrillic nor greek script should have special strings for charcell (e.g. using romaji or halfwidth katakana for player)
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08:52:42amiconnThat example was for japanese of course
08:53:24_keegan_how usable is the Sansa c200 port?
08:53:32rasherI have a feeling those languages aren't doing that..
08:53:41amiconnNo, they don't atm
08:54:16amiconnThe problem is that most of the languages we claim to support are way outdated
08:54:48amiconn(e.g. the wallisertitsch translation you used for testing was last updated _for real_ before even the Ondios joined the party iirc)
08:54:56*jhMikeS isn't sure what would make throwing some speculative ideas around "annoying"
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08:55:18scorche_keegan_: it hasnt even been called "supported" yet...
08:55:53rasheramiconn: Yeah, I've been wondering about whether it'd be better to just drop them.. my translation page has accurate information on this (">
08:56:04_keegan_yeah, but i see some comments to the effect that it essentially works
08:56:12rasheramiconn: those update times are ignoring non-updates
08:56:14_keegan_how would i try out the c200 port, ultra bleeding edge as it may be
08:56:22scorchewhen it is ready, it is ready
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08:57:31rockhorockbox is my favorite
08:58:18*jhMikeS isn't even sure what makes the ideas "weird" since they're far from that. :\
08:58:44_keegan_okay so the answer is "wait a few days"?
08:58:46_keegan_i can live with that
08:58:57_keegan_i guess i have pretty good timing... i bought this today
09:00:34amiconnWell, ideas and ideas
09:03:04amiconnThere are ideas which might actually work given enough effort, and there are ideas which would either add lots of complexity or open a can of worms with next to no benefit, or are plain impossible due to deliberate design decisions in rockbox
09:03:11 Join ddalton [0] (
09:04:15 Quit rpwalsh ()
09:04:21jhMikeSamiconn: which of your statements in particular refer to which I can't say
09:07:59*dionoea has a working (and completely useless)gzip/gunzip port for rockbox
09:08:27rasherdionoea: well, better than bzip2
09:08:34 Join Thundercloud [0] (
09:08:55 Join Zagor [0] (n=bjorn@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
09:09:13amiconn(1) true window elements with "focus" and multiple threads: Right now there is only one gui thread, and that works. Even the idea of having one gui thread per display (for devices with a remote lcd) turned out too complex to implement, and if it would be done, would open a can of worms
09:09:16dionoeaNow i have to port tar and then i might be able to come up with a simple autoupdater. (like you drop rockbox.tar.gz in your root and if it finds it on boot it updates)
09:09:36 Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
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09:10:20amiconnRight now the underlying code can rely on certain things never happening in parallel (e.g. entering the wps on one display and the recording screen in another). With multiple gui threads it couldn't
09:11:07amiconn(2) Non-rectangular clipping: I can't see how this should be *nearly* as simple as rectangular clipping. Rectangular clipping is just the current clip-to-lcd made variable
09:11:28jhMikeSthat sort of architecture would never be brought into it
09:11:33rasherdionoea: have a look at FS #6156
09:11:38amiconn(3) "real" windows with backing store. This would require dynamic memory allocation, which we don't have, and don't want.
09:12:02dionoearasher: well that's just tar support for wps/themes specific stuff isn't it ?
09:12:06jhMikeSno backing store needed, just redraw of uncovered bits
09:12:32amiconnFrom what source would you redraw??
09:12:46rasherdionoea: it's still an implementation of tar, iirc. Just figured it might be helpful
09:13:35jhMikeSthe thread operating the viewport, main or whatever so almost always the main one
09:13:42amiconnThe viewport idea is for making widgets independent of position, so that e.g. the list widget doesn't need to care whether the status bar is on or off, or what size it has. It's viewport would be placed properly by the upperl level function (e.g. file browser or menu code)
09:14:19dionoearasher: ok, thanks. (I was thinking about porting gnu tar)
09:14:36Zagorare you discussing separate threads for main and remote display?
09:14:42*petur wants the viewport to split the rec screen into a fixed and scrollable part (depending on screen size)
09:14:59jhMikeSamiconn: it would gain that by default and not all viewports would need clipping
09:15:08rasherdionoea: that'd probably be massively overkill. I imagine gnu tar comes with all sorts of weird stuff on touch of what you actually need
09:15:14amiconnjhMikeS: What would that be good for? With viewports as I imagine them, the thread that uses a viewport overlaying another would be responsible for redraw anyway. Nothing the viewport code can (or should) do....
09:15:40B4gderpossibly busybox's tar would be a more sensible start
09:15:44jhMikeSZagor: no, stuff regarding clipped viewports to display elements over other without any backbuffer
09:15:52B4gderbusybox does things tiny
09:15:55Zagorah, good :)
09:16:15amiconnViewports would always be clipped. That's actually simpler than only clipping in some cases
09:16:32amiconnBut they would be clipped to a rectangle, only
09:17:01jhMikeSI'd start with rectangle but non-rectangle would just extend from it and isn't a priority by any means.
09:18:13jhMikeSbut you mentioned that overlaps wouldn't really be defined. I'm talking about making say, a splash not get overwritten by drawing underneath it
09:18:48dionoearasher: well if the port is as easy as the gzip one i figure that it's worth a shot (that sounds easier than reading an RFC and writting a bugless implementation :p)
09:18:53amiconnThat's not possible without severe performance impacts
09:19:40rasherdionoea: busybox is probably still a better bet
09:20:13amiconnIt would require the drawing code to walk the list of all active viewports for clipping, instead of just checking the current one (and btw, my idea does not even include that such a list exists)
09:20:41jhMikeSnot really, just the list for one viewport
09:21:24dionoearasher: ah, good idea. I'll have a look.
09:21:55amiconnA single element element is not a list...
09:22:54jhMikeSa clipping region isn't a single element, it's a rectangle list with rectangles split in a certain way, so the region can be simple or complex. I don't expect them getting very complex in a simple environment though.
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09:25:04amiconnThe viewport will have an x and y position, a width and a height, which define the clipping
09:27:36JdGordon|gonehey all
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09:28:13JdGordonB4gder: LinusN: would it be better if the mrobe stuff is done in a branch instead of trunk?
09:28:21jhMikeSthat's the bounding rectagle. a viewport with a clipped-out area can be simple, complex (multiple rects) or NULL. all with the same bounding rectangle.
09:28:27B4gderJdGordon: see my mail...
09:29:11JdGordonok cool
09:29:26JdGordonI asked because the S is in a branch and thought that was the new preffered way
09:29:37B4gderI would prefer the S guys going trunk
09:30:15jhMikeSamiconn: of course anything that would be "pasted" to an overlappable port, like a scroller, would be clipped to what it's pasted and that intersected with it's own rect but that's sort of a no-op.
09:31:18peturB4gder: did you get a chance to kick the build server? There were several commits not picked up last night...
09:31:36B4gderok, I'll bring out the poking stick
09:31:59peturthey are also not on the front page, is probably related?
09:32:10B4gdermost possibly
09:32:28B4gdersvn up
09:32:28B4gdersvn: Working copy '.' locked
09:33:05B4gderfixed now
09:33:20B4gderseems to happen at times when the hw goes nuts
09:33:30B4gderin combination with reboot that is
09:33:41amiconnjhMikeS: Don't forget that every drawing operation needs to be checked against clipping bounds, and for non-rectangular clipping, drawing operations like rectangle and bitmap would need to check *every single pixel* instead of just clipping the whole thing before starting to draw
09:33:47peturany clue on the hardware problem?
09:33:55B4gderpetur: seems to be a bad disk
09:34:41amiconnThat's far from no-op, and as long as not all our current targets are of the performance class of a gigabeat or higher, simply out of question
09:37:43JdGordonB4gder: while your playing with the build server... any reason why the c200 isnt in the builds yet?
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09:38:25jhMikeSamiconn: no, it doesn't. it's much more efficient than that to do clipping.
09:39:28jhMikeSthe rectangle arrangement permits it to be
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09:41:15pixelmahow nice that I just wanted to build an own new c200 build after an svn up...
09:42:22JdGordonspeaking of broke builds...
09:42:40dionoearasher: busybox' libunarchive looks promising (although it lacks the libarchive part but i'm not sure that it would really be needed on rockbox anyway)
09:42:49JdGordonkarl _may_ have got a bit carried away :p
09:43:13 Quit Sanitized (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
09:43:26JdGordonnice score thugh!
09:44:18scorcheit rivals his previous record
09:44:39*JdGordon fixing
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09:45:19B4gderpixelma: c200 builds fine now doesn't it+
09:45:29B4gderI want to add it to the builds
09:45:41pixelmayes build fine
09:45:46jhMikeSoh, bugger. one more CPU to worry about with the threading. at least instructions will be included on writing core_sleep properly.
09:46:15pixelma(except the arm conflicts atm - would higher kkurbjun's score even more...) ;)
09:46:42B4gderwell, I can hold on until they score goes down somewhat
09:47:05JdGordonshould i revert the whole commit and fix it locally? or just try to fix it ovr a few commits?
09:47:12linuxstbjhMikeS: When you tested my new sansapatcher yesterday, did you install the bootloader?
09:47:25B4gderJdGordon: that's really depends on you...
09:47:31jhMikeSlinuxstb: no, I just did what you asked and checked detection
09:47:33pixelmaB4gder: other than that I would welcome that because then I could check what happens when I committed the plugins patch
09:48:09B4gderI'll add it during the day if they sort out the arm mess
09:48:26B4gderor whatever mess it is ;-)
09:48:27jhMikeSlinuxstb: I can test the install if you'd like
09:48:43linuxstbjhMikeS: Yes, please, I can then package up a new sansapatcher release with c200 support.
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09:49:09B4gderthen c200 can go "supported"
09:49:45linuxstbIs there a manual yet?
09:49:46jhMikeSlinuxstb: ok...but I have to turn off my music. :P
09:50:06pixelmalinuxstb: no, but the svg would be ready
09:50:22jhMikeSlinuxstb: just use the v0.3 you gave me?
09:50:43linuxstbI _think_ the installation chapter should be identical to the e200. Unless the instructions for MSC mode need amending.
09:51:06linuxstbjhMikeS: Just to be safe, I'll upload my latest build, one moment.
09:53:44*linuxstb notices the m:robe commit forgot FILES
09:53:46pixelmalinuxstb: I also had to choose msc mode in the OF, but low_light also mentioned that there are few firmware revisions that don't allow you that
09:54:06linuxstbAh, so the user might need to downgrade their OF?
09:54:49pixelmaI think so, but am really not sure. Better ask him
09:55:27jhMikeSlinuxstb: seemed to go in just fine
09:56:37jhMikeSof course I can't put it through any steps needed on a fresh device
09:56:38advcomp2019sandisk on the c200 did remove msc but then in the another update then downgraded the firmware back to put msc mode back
09:57:03linuxstbjhMikeS: Thanks. That's the latest official bootloader (about 2 or 3 days old). No more testing should be needed - just that it a) detected an e200 and b) then installed the correct bootloader.
09:57:45linuxstbadvcomp2019: So what should we recommend to users? That they use the very newest c200 firmware?
09:59:32pixelmalinuxstb: - the revision on mine was 1.00.04
09:59:36*jhMikeS gets annoyed that ARM920T is so load stall sensitive :[
09:59:53advcomp2019i know not 1.01.05 that is the one they removed msc mode
10:00:32advcomp2019oops... 1.01.06
10:01:02pixelmas/1.00.04/1.01.04 ...
10:01:49jhMikeSarm, arm, and more arm. that achitecture is annoyingly successful
10:01:52advcomp2019here is the post that made sandisk go back to the old version...
10:02:13JdGordonok, hopefully we'll be green again in 5 min
10:02:26advcomp2019plus there is 2 versions of the c200
10:02:43*linuxstb wishes he hadn't asked about the c200...
10:03:55linuxstbJdGordon: firmware/FILES also needs updating with the new files.
10:04:03JdGordonah yep
10:04:03pixelmaadvcomp2019: what do you mean?
10:04:08 Part rr ("Ex-Chat")
10:04:36jhMikeSshouldn't those defines be in a DM320-specific file?
10:05:04JdGordonprobably... but that was just done so it can comopile again
10:05:12JdGordonB4gder: i guess thats why we use branches :D
10:05:54*Zagor spots the cute build countdown. whee
10:06:09pixelmathat would just have been delaying the problems (and adding to the score later) ;)
10:06:13advcomp2019i will find that link about the 2 versions of the c200s
10:07:27B4gderJdGordon: I would claim the opposite
10:07:34B4gderthat's why _not_ using a branch is good
10:07:40jhMikeS15947? one commit I did kicked-out at least 10-times that
10:07:57JdGordonif this one is green add the c200 and ill commit the FILES change
10:08:35gammyOh hey
10:08:47linuxstbJdGordon: Is there a reason to use inw/outw instead of defining macros of the form (*(volatile unsigned long *)(addr)) ? (which is how the other ports do things)
10:08:47gammyI just came up with a good idea for a simple first-time plugin
10:08:52advcomp2019here is the post...
10:09:19Zagorspeaking of branches, is anything happening on the gigabeat-s front? should we force them back into the trunk?
10:09:29JdGordonlinuxstb: youd have to ask kkurbjun...
10:09:29ddaltonI have forgotten my password for the wiki. What should I do?
10:09:49JdGordonyay, green!
10:09:52B4gderZagor: there seems to be commits done in bursts on it
10:10:02B4gderok, stand by for c200
10:10:15JdGordondont restart the build... ill commit to kick it
10:10:18 Quit linuxstb ("CGI:IRC")
10:10:46jhMikeShow'd we get a new s3c2440 init sequence as part of the m:robe port addition?
10:11:23*JdGordon thinks kkurbjun chose a good time to be absent :p
10:11:38JdGordonB4gder: added?
10:11:41Zagorcommit-and-run is a time-honored tradition
10:11:45B4gderJdGordon: go go go
10:11:59JdGordonand done
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10:12:53jhMikeSJdGordon: hey, there's still yellow spots! :P
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10:14:32ddaltonIs it possible for me to open a wiki page?
10:14:36ddaltona new one
10:15:06Zagorddalton: yes
10:15:09Chrononddalton, just type in the name of the page
10:15:19*jhMikeS thinks a new port a week should be a goal
10:15:24ChrononOne of the options will be to create the page if it doesn't exist
10:15:32B4gderjhMikeS: indeed!
10:15:42ddaltonok and how do I link it to for example blind users index?
10:15:48B4gderbtw, anyone mind if I switch dev2.cgi to be the new dev.cgi?
10:16:12Chrononddalton: is that another wiki page?
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10:16:44ddaltonwell I want to make a new one and it is related to blind users so how do I put a link on the blind users index to link to my new page?
10:17:03ChrononYou didn't answer my question.
10:17:14ZagorB4gder: go ahead
10:17:26ddaltonwhat is the question I want to create a new page yes
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10:17:41Chrononis the blind user index a wiki page?
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10:18:06B4gderit's now even more hardcore dev info
10:18:39pixelmaChronon: yes, see the first link under "documentation" in the twiki/home page
10:18:45ChrononI found it
10:19:05Chrononddalton: yes, just edit that page and add a link to the one you created.
10:19:18B4gderhm bootloader broke
10:19:54linuxstbB4gder: Are you checking for the right name - it's firmware.mi4 IIRC
10:19:58ddaltonOk is everyone happy if I create a page on compiling when you are blind, getting setup, adding patches, Some good patch and anything else that comes to mind?
10:20:06B4gderno, I'm not so that is the problem
10:20:21B4gderfixed now for next commit
10:20:55ddaltonB4gder: Were you talking to me?
10:20:55linuxstbddalton: Sounds very useful.
10:20:57B4gderand... now c200 is there in the table
10:21:02B4gderddalton: no
10:21:08ddaltonok I will see how I go.
10:21:16ddaltonHow do I do all the tables and links?
10:22:18B4gderthe build table is becoming *wide*
10:22:28linuxstbB4gder: "is becoming" ?
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10:22:51B4gderyeah, previously it was just wide ;-P
10:23:36linuxstbWould making it portrait just be too confusing?
10:23:40*jhMikeS is glad XP supports 32-bit pixel coordinates
10:24:06B4gderlinuxstb: we might have to do that sooner or later
10:24:17Zagorlinuxstb: it would mean having to dynamically make images for the timestamps
10:24:26scorcheit is getting close to almost the full size of my screen in 1600x1200
10:24:30linuxstbZagor: Sure, but for people with your scripting skills...
10:24:47B4gderI'm thinking build numbers and the date+time in a popup only
10:24:52Chrononddalton: try here:
10:24:54advcomp2019another thing i found on about the c200v2 it does not have msc mode
10:24:58Zagorit's not a technical problem but can get annoying to load
10:25:03*jhMikeS never used the sideways scrollbar so much
10:25:27B4gderadvcomp2019: so this claimed c200vs is available as well?
10:25:31ZagorB4gder: yeah I'm also thinking about collapsing the table somehow. for example all the green columns don't really need to be seen full-width
10:26:11B4gderc200v2 I meant
10:26:24advcomp2019it is within other posts but here is another −−>
10:26:37Zagoradvcomp2019: that's an issue with the firmware, not the hardware
10:26:47Zagorfirmware > .04 or so removes msc
10:26:50B4gderadvcomp2019: that forum has lots of pure crap, that doesn't mean those things exist in real life...
10:27:11B4gderI mean, lots of rumours and things
10:27:29advcomp2019i have not seen them myself but you might run into them
10:27:50B4gderI doubt it
10:27:56B4gdernot under that name at least
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10:28:05linuxstbOr the table could be split - e.g. by bootloader/sim/normal or maybe by CPU family.
10:28:54pixelmaZagor: .04 worked fine...
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10:29:31ZagorI don't remember the specific version
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10:35:14JdGordon2 more targets (MAX) and the table wont fit in 1680x1050
10:35:27JdGordonso yeah, redo the table :)
10:36:36*petur has 1920x1200 and can handle some more width :p
10:36:55peturJdGordon: use a smaller font?
10:37:11JdGordonno thanks :)
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10:40:30pixelmaJdGordon: depends on the score... the columns got wider, it would have fit on my screen without it :P
10:41:17peturmaybe we can hide the sims and bootloaders if they are without errors?
10:42:00peturor put them in a second table
10:43:42Zagorlinus had an excellent idea: put bl/app/sim above each other in each cell. that cuts the table width by 2/3
10:44:27JdGordonit would make each row taller though and look odd
10:44:52ZagorI think it's worth a try
10:45:11JdGordonlol @ the c200 pic... Mr individual I see
10:45:36JdGordonmaybe roate the pic so the logo is the right way round?
10:45:48pixelmathen it's wider
10:46:01JdGordonits wider than the text?
10:46:55pixelmathe current pics are scaled to a specific height, should I do that with the c200?
10:47:36linuxstbThe Rockbox logo is a simlar shape to the c200...
10:47:38***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:47:45linuxstb(for the source/fonts)
10:47:49pixelmaif I make it as wide as the others in average it would be really really small...
10:48:24JdGordonuse that image but rotate it? or i guess we just live with it :p
10:48:24Zagortry just rotating it the current size
10:48:54JdGordoneither way its going to look odd-man-out though
10:49:00Zagorit makes sense to present the players in their "normal" orientation, I think
10:49:22pixelmamaybe it can be rotated as the width got almost the same as the height in the cells anyways
10:49:43pixelmaor with the text even wider
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10:50:54Zagorit surely looks odd :-)
10:51:15JdGordonwould look ok if the text was positioed correctly though
10:51:17linuxstbMaybe it needs padding to the same height?
10:51:20Zagorbut I still think it makes sense.
10:51:23pixelmaZagor: Sandisk also shows the c200 in this upright orientation
10:52:15linuxstbpixelma: I was mislead by that though - I assumed it was used in portrait mode like the e200.
10:52:21pixelmaI think the pic should be centered then and the text should be still at the bottom
10:52:49GodEaterlinuxstb: did you take a look through the classic firmware yourself yet ?
10:53:10markunZagor: I also think the Gigabeat S branch should go back in the trunk
10:53:10Zagorwell we don't want to many special layout tricks for this single cell
10:53:23pixelmathe rockbox logo and text in the "source" cell could use the same
10:53:36linuxstbGodEater: Only very very briefly.
10:53:53B4gdermarkun: I agree with that
10:53:59pixelmaZagor: or maybe align both to the bottom, how does that look?
10:54:01scorchelinuxstb: did you get one?
10:54:09linuxstbscorche: No
10:54:24Zagorpixelma: equally strange, I think
10:54:25GodEaterLinusN: enough to work out if the firmware is encrypted or not ?
10:54:50linuxstbI guess that was for me?
10:54:54JdGordonvalign="bottom" looks slightly less trange than without it
10:54:57GodEateroops - yes
10:55:07Zagorwe've had this for the source archive for ages. I think it's just a matter of getting used to it.
10:55:11*GodEater should type more characters for his auto-completion
10:55:11linuxstbYou need case-sensitive tab-completion...
10:55:23Zagorwe're likely to get more targets with landscape orientation too
10:55:25GodEateryeah, or I need to be less lazy
10:55:47*GodEater has found himself trying to auto-complete actual words recently. Funnily enough that doesn't work.
10:56:10JdGordonZagor: just add a second <br> between the image and link
10:56:35Zagorthis table is auto-generated. special cases get very messy.
10:56:47JdGordonoh :(
10:57:01GodEaterlinuxstb: so what was the answer ?
10:57:19linuxstbGodEater: No (not enough to tell if it's encrypted)
10:57:51*GodEater will try to work that out today then
11:01:38amiconnjhMikeS: I really can't see how that could work
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11:09:33pixelmaZagor: maybe use bottom alignment in the cells and add a bit of transparent lines to the c200 and logo pngs so they appear center aligned or at least don't 'stick' at the text?
11:11:48ZagorI think it's pretty ok now
11:15:08linuxstbCan the svn revision be added to the Source cell at ?
11:16:37jhMikeSamiconn: it's based on horizontal strips of sorted rectangles l to r, t to b. not really good to describe but easy to draw but picture a viewport overlapped by one other viewport that happens to lie completely inside the one it covers. it needs four rectangles: one above, one on the left, one on the right, and one below. a drawing op can just fill whole rectangles even preserving current drawing order.
11:17:55GodEaterlinuxstb: is OSOS the right one to look at?
11:18:09linuxstbGodEater: Yes, and it looks encrypted to me...
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11:18:17GodEateroh, you already got there
11:19:00GodEaterwell, for future reference, I assume that there's an offset after the !ATAsoso bit near the beginning of the image - where do I see that ?
11:19:19linuxstbIt's 0x04d07000 (stored little-endian)
11:20:14amiconnjhMikeS: That would still be more overhead than a single rectangle, and it would require lists of variable length. Where would those be stored?
11:20:42amiconnAnd I still fail to see the advantage of such complicated clipping if there is only one gui thread
11:21:51GodEaterlinuxstb: thanks sir - I shall post this bad (but not entirely unexpected) news to the forums then
11:22:01jhMikeSthey are limited if you limit the number of overlappable ports since the complexity can only be so high from n number of them. the topmost viewport would only ever be one rectangle and only be split when covered.
11:22:02linuxstbGodEater: The length is probably 0x008c0403, and 0x08000000 could be the "load address" - i.e. the start address of RAM. (these seem to match earlier firmware versions).
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11:23:07ddaltonnot sure if my last message got through. But what should this page be called? it talks about blind users doing the following: useful patches, setting up, cygwin development for blind users, how to code when your blind and anything else I can think of
11:23:12jhMikeSof course if a viewport is completely covered, it has no rectangle other than its bounding one and all drawing operation return with no further action.
11:23:54linuxstbGodEater: There are some interesting things at the end of the firmware image though - references in plain text to certificates, and the string "S5L8702 Secure Boot"
11:24:00amiconnZagor: Why do we need images for the vertical text at all? Those tables use css all over, so I think it should be possible to render vertical text via css as well
11:24:10amiconnOr does such a thing not exist in css?
11:24:18B4gderno such thing in css
11:24:28B4gderthey plan it for css3...
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11:25:08amiconnAnd putting the text vertical without rotating the letters?
11:25:33B4gderyou mean with <br> inserted between each letter?
11:25:39B4gderI think it would look a lot worse than today
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11:28:57amiconnB4gder: Yes, with <br> between each letter
11:29:18GodEateras expected, our "more ambitious" thread starter has come back and said "oh, I don't have time to do all these constructive things you've suggested"
11:29:37B4gderand the circle is closed
11:29:51B4gderlap #47 completed. another around anyone? ;-)
11:30:01GodEatergive it another couple of months ;)
11:30:18B4gderyeah, we need another new logo thread first
11:32:34pondlifeA more ambitious logo?
11:33:04GodEaterideally yes
11:33:20GodEatera nice 3d rendering (in real time of course), rotating and flashing and stuff
11:34:21CtcpIgnored 4 channel CTCP requests in 0 seconds at the last flood
11:34:21*petur still votes for the cube-with-music-note-in
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11:37:34GodEaterpondlife: do you think you could manage that ?
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11:46:29chime_inI like how Sansa starts the word Sansa with a "star" running through it. It's inviting and appealing. Something of that sort would be good for RB, even if it's waste of time/battery (I don't know whether it is)
11:46:45B4gderI hate that...
11:46:53B4gderit's like 60% of the bootup time
11:47:28chime_inB4gder: are you joking? really?
11:47:29Zagorus c200 users just get that stupid dog and a few dots incrementing
11:47:33GodEaterB4gder: does that count as a new logo request? If so - I'm impressed with your prescience ?
11:47:34B4gderI'm dead serious
11:47:38JdGordonwhy would we want the word sansa with a "star" runnig through it on rockbox?
11:47:50B4gderZagor: oh, a dog? ;-)
11:48:34chime_inJdGordon: I didn't mean exactly that, just something that feels like a sort of greeting or .. you get the idea?
11:48:36ZagorB4gder: laugh or cry, your choice:
11:48:46Zagor even
11:48:57Zagorthat ugly thing is what the c200 is showing when booting
11:49:21*B4gder faints
11:49:27GodEatervery inviting
11:49:39*linuxstb thinks someone should be attempting to replace the Sansa bootloader with a Rockbox bootloader - given that Rockbox seems to work in manufacturing mode
11:49:55*GodEater volunteers linuxstb for such a project :)
11:50:07B4gderindeed, bootloader kickout project ;-)
11:50:08*linuxstb doesn't own a Sansa
11:50:14*GodEater doesn't care
11:50:31Zagorhappily the dog only just flashes by on the c200 before the glorious rockbox loader starts filling the screen with text :-)
11:51:00linuxstbOn most targets we don't even display that text any more - unless there's an error to report.
11:51:02GodEaterchime_in: seriously, how often do you actually look at your sansa's screen while you're turning it on ?
11:51:34Zagorlinuxstb: ok. that would be welcomed on c200 too, now that it's working.
11:51:46pixelmaZagor: yeah, that ...thing... is stupid
11:51:47linuxstbZagor: See the "verbose" variable in bootloader/common.c
11:52:13JdGordonlinuxstb: as good as that would be.. dont reallly want to risk the player over it
11:52:24linuxstbJdGordon: What's the risk?
11:52:36B4gderJdGordon: you can just go to manufacture mode and fix
11:52:42JdGordonbad flash might stop even manufact mode working?
11:52:48linuxstbIt's not flashed.
11:52:58chime_inGodEater: almost every time. I want to know when it's ready to use.
11:52:59B4gdernand-flashed ;-)
11:53:05linuxstbIt's in the firmware partition - don't you remember patching it? ;)
11:53:27JdGordonisnt that bootloader on flash?
11:53:32GodEaterchime_in: think you're in the minority then. I never look at my DAP when I turn it on, I know it's ready to use as soon as my ears hear music.
11:53:42JdGordonoh, ok then
11:53:46*linuxstb wonders where JdGordon was when he wrote the e200r patching application
11:54:13JdGordontoo many loaders... i get confuesed
11:54:42JdGordonbah, yes im a drongo
11:55:23chime_inGodEater: do you use auto resume?
11:55:27linuxstbJdGordon: Speaking of the e200r patching application, any plans to investigate why it no longer works?
11:55:55 Quit daurnimator ("Cyas later...")
11:55:59JdGordonno immediate ones
11:56:12scorchethere is that drongo word again...
11:56:15JdGordonmrobe and uni have stolen my attention atm
11:56:36markunlinuxstb: can you take a look at this?
11:56:38linuxstbThen IMO we should think about removing e200r from the front page - without a Windows installer, I wouldn't call it "supported".
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11:57:43linuxstbmarkun: Anything that cleans up wmadeci.c is good IMO.
11:58:06JdGordonhmm.. e200r is probably more important than mrobe
11:58:10markunlinuxstb: I was going to move the (i)mdct and fft code to seperate files, what do you think?
11:58:13JdGordonill try to have a play tonight
11:58:14GodEaterchime_in: of course
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12:00:13linuxstbmarkun: Sounds sensible to me, but I've only really been involved with the asf part of the codec - saratoga's the person to talk to about wmadeci
12:00:28markunbut he's not here :)
12:01:53markunlinuxstb: I still would like to change the codecs so they can use the same mdct implementations
12:04:47linuxstbmarkun: Again, sounds sensible to me, but I don't know the internals of the lossy codecs.
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12:08:29linuxstbaliask: Have you seen the suggestion to move the gigabeat-s port back to trunk? What's your view on that idea?
12:08:58scorchelinuxstb: i think they just went over that in -community
12:09:31scorchei think you were in the channel then...scroll up =)
12:09:53linuxstbI was... Typical off-topic chat in -community...
12:10:23peturone more reason against channel split *sigh*
12:10:24scorcheit has been real lively this morning...
12:10:31*scorche huffs at pondlife ;)
12:10:37linuxstbpetur: Exactly...
12:11:10GodEaterone more reason for scorche to be more strict
12:11:24*pondlife huffs back
12:11:28scorchemore strict about the no rockbox chat as well
12:11:33pondlifeOf course
12:11:48GodEaterthat's what I mean
12:12:02linuxstbGodEater: strictness isn't really the issue IMO - what if something genuinely starts as user conversation, then moves to development talk? It will be a pain to follow in the logs..
12:12:48GodEaterlinuxstb: you clearly didn't read my response in the email thread....
12:13:24scorchewell, that never started out as a user conversation anyway....see: * GodEater is wearing a 'fro wig, and platform shoes with goldfish in them.
12:13:42scorche<JdGordon> aliask: gonna merge your S branch into the trunk?
12:14:08scorcheGodEater: sorry to reveal your dirty habit ;)
12:14:20pondlifeGodEater is a nun?
12:14:22*GodEater has no shame
12:14:31linuxstbGodEater: Which one? I can't see a reply from you that addresses that issue.
12:15:00GodEaterlinuxstb: the one which said, I'm abstaining on the issue, and don't care if we split the channels, or stay in one.
12:15:21GodEaterhoping, in the beginning, to avoid this very discussion :(
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12:30:52Nico_Pscorche: did aliask answer ?
12:31:38Nico_Pwhat did he say ?
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12:33:47Nico_P"* GodEater waves his git
12:34:15mindhasslePlease don't shoot me but would the following be possible? For each menu item, store the number of times that item was selected. And then arrange the items according to the statistics. The statistics would be saved in a file. This way, every user will end with his personally arranged menu.
12:34:36mindhassleThis is like play count for songs.
12:34:36markunmindhassle: sure, would be possible
12:34:50scorcheit would be possible, but it wouldnt be implemented in SVN
12:35:07mindhasslemarkun: but would it also be accepted by RB "dictators"?
12:35:14markunnope :)
12:35:16scorchenot into SVN
12:35:38mindhasslescorche: why? It could also be an option (whether to respect that statistics)
12:35:47B4gdermindhassle: you have some persuading to do first...
12:36:01scorcheadding it as an option would increase binary size and add to option bloat
12:36:04B4gderlike how this is truly a good thing that won't cause support hell
12:36:14scorche(which it would cause support hell)
12:36:42scorchepondlife: heh....not you too! (re: the S)
12:36:53markunmindhassle: how often would the menu rearrange itself?
12:36:54mindhassleFor the start, when there is no statistics yet, the setting should be set to No, but the statistics would still be gathered in the background. After some time, you switch it on and have a personalized menues.
12:37:11rasherI can see the use of a "gather statistics" build, perhaps.
12:37:23markunmindhassle: in that case why not personallise them yourself instead of using the statistics?
12:38:02mindhasslemarkun: the menues would adjust automatically as you use it. More frequently called items go to top.
12:38:25mindhasslemarkun: you'd do nothing explicitly to achieve that.
12:38:36scorchethat would be absurdly annoying having the menus changing constantly...
12:38:55B4gdernot for me, I hardly ever change a setting ;-)
12:39:21mindhasslescorche: I hope, after some time the statistics would stabilize. That's the point.
12:39:52GodEaterit would be a complete support nightmare though
12:39:55scorchemindhassle: and my point is that it would be an option that would never get off the ground in SVN...that isnt to say you are restricted from making a patch that does so
12:40:02GodEaterevery user would likely end up having different menus
12:40:16scorcheand everyone would be asking "where did xxxxx go?"
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12:40:31mindhassleGodEater: why? The items don't disapperar, they just got reordered. Only within a menu.
12:40:43scorcheso you have to guess where the item is every time?
12:40:46B4gdersounds like a lot of work and code just to get menus reordered
12:41:16pixelmamaybe you wouldn't be aware yourself where the optione ends up?
12:41:23scorcheas has been said before, a patch that gethers statistics could be interesting, but i very much doubt that teh reordering patch would go anywhere
12:41:55mindhasslescorche: I won't be able to tell the exact position. But I'll be able to tell the menu since the sets wouldn't change.
12:41:56GodEaterit's not something I'd want or use in any case
12:42:43preglowrasher: i like the xml stuff
12:43:20mindhasslescorche: that's because you all are against it upfront. I'll try to implement it and post a patch. Maybe the attitude will change then.
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12:43:51mindhassleSince in the end, you'll have to do less klicks.
12:44:31scorchewell, it is going to be extremely hard to convince us to not be against it...
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12:45:05*GodEater wonders who changes their settings that often anyway
12:45:11mindhasslescorche: is the main concern the support? The exact position of menu entries?
12:45:14rasherpreglow: think you're the first one to actively like it
12:45:21GodEaterthe statistics on my build would be "1 change, on day of install"
12:45:32linuxstbmindhassle: Are you talking about all menus, or just some? I'm probably in the minority, but I don't see reordering menu items as causing any support issues - people can read...
12:45:40scorchesupport, a useless feature adding to option bloat and binary size
12:46:40rasherB4gder: how shall I interpret the lack of response to my xml post? As lack of response (yet), approval or seething hate?
12:46:41preglowrasher: i find working with the current format manually so annoying i don't see a reason not to go xml
12:47:01mindhasslelinuxstb: we can decide. Maybe all. Or maybe only those specially marked as reordable (in code). I often use the pitch screen. And must curse every time since the setting is not where I want it to be.
12:47:04preglowrasher: using xml will greatly faciliate not having to work manually on them again, so you have my support
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12:47:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:48:11linuxstbmindhassle: Don't forget that you can very easily build your own version of Rockbox with the menu items in the order you want them...
12:48:24rasherpreglow: it'd at least make it (in my eyes) more likely that translator-tool appeared
12:48:25 Quit darksaboteur (Client Quit)
12:48:39linuxstb(well, maybe not "very easily" - it depends how experienced you are with Unix-like compiling)
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12:49:02preglowrasher: not only more likely, it would be trivial
12:49:10scorcheit would be much easier than writing a reordering algorithm based on usage statistics
12:49:28preglowrasher: the semantic structure of the lang file is trivial, only the representation is not, and if that's xml, then you don't have to bother with it
12:49:38 Quit barrywardell (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:49:38mindhasslelinuxstb: yes, but that's a custom build so you can have headache with keeping it in sync. And with that feature, you have a structure that fits your personal needs like a glove.
12:50:30preglowrasher: a wiki page with thoughts on what a translator tool should be would be cool
12:50:37linuxstbmindhassle: It's not a headache at all... Whenever you want to update your build, you just type "svn update" and compile a new build.
12:50:42scorchemindhassle: well, as i said, i really really doubt it will get into SVN anyway
12:50:46preglowrasher: and perhaps make people realize going xml would be a good thing
12:50:49mindhasslescorche: sorting isn't that hard. And I also don't think that it will take much code to gather the stats.
12:51:30linuxstbmindhassle: Firstly you need to find a way to save and load the stats, and assign them to menu items. Unless it's changed recently, menu items don't have IDs.
12:51:40mindhassleAnd the stats could be dumped only once, i.e. at shut down, to avoid spinups
12:52:06linuxstbmindhassle: You then have to deal with changes to the menu structure - i.e. dealing with stats that don't map to a new menu layout, possibly needing to revert them all back to zero.
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12:52:14n1srasher: if it makes the tools easier to improve/write I'm all for it
12:52:34mindhasslelinuxstb: yes, each menu would get a unique id. (Unique at least withtin the menu containing it. Or global.)
12:53:02rasherpreglow: well, until such a tool exists, we'd still have manual translating, so keeping the structure simple has its advantages (although once such a tool exists, changing the structure shouldn't be terribly hard either)
12:53:06AceNik_guys im gonna install RB on ipod nano & ipod video 30G any isues surrounding them, & does RB Qt do all the patching n stuff or anything else is needed
12:53:47mindhasslelinuxstb: yes, that should be done. But we can do it very restricted for the start: if something doesn't fit set all to zero and go on. Or don't reorder that menu at all.
12:54:37mindhasslelinuxstb: and if menu items would have global ids, even menu reordering would be tolerated.
12:56:05linuxstbmindhassle: But as others have said, a) you'll need to work hard to convince people the complication to the code is worthwhile; b) you'll need to implement it yourself, or find someone else as enthusiastic as yourself...
12:56:17mindhassle*reordering = moving an item from one menu to another
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12:57:25GodEatereven with JdGordon's menu code, I don't think re-ordering menus on the fly is going to be easy.
12:57:41JdGordonits not easy.. but its not hard either
12:57:48mindhasslelinuxstb: yes, I understand it. The best way is to implement it and let the other try it out. I can code. I only have to find time, sit down, and do it. I won't ask anyone to implement it for me.
12:57:53amiconnMenu reordering is one of the No-Dos anyway
12:58:15JdGordonhabving a function read an order from a text file and creating a menu from it would be trivially easy
12:58:41mindhassle But, you know, if hear "no no" from all the people, why even try?
12:58:46JdGordonlinuxstb: you said the e200r installer stopped working?
12:58:58linuxstbJdGordon: No, you did...
12:59:08JdGordonhehe, oh ok :p
12:59:15JdGordonbetter find out why i said that then
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12:59:43JdGordonwhat?? lame!
12:59:44linuxstbJdGordon: The person testing on Windows said that it didn't work for him (it appeared to upload the app correctly, but then the Sansa didn't do anything). I asked you to test on Linux, and you got the same result.
12:59:48JdGordoni wanted more fight than that!
12:59:54 Part AceNik_
13:00:02JdGordonah yes, ok, investigating now
13:00:10preglowhave we removed the "qt" from rbutilqt yet?
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13:04:59Nico_Ppreglow: no
13:05:30tumuwasn't it going to be renamed as QTrbutilQT? :)
13:06:57preglowwe should :>
13:07:04preglowi hate having toolkit names in program names
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13:12:21JdGordonwell this is retarted!
13:12:30JdGordoni have no idea why its not working
13:12:51JdGordon.text is correct
13:13:05JdGordonthe crt0-bl-pp.S is correct
13:13:15JdGordonthe bin is only 1k which should be fine
13:13:49linuxstbpondlife: Re. your mailing list post, (US-only shop though, so you need help to buy in the UK) sells refurbished Gigabeat S60s for $199 USD.
13:14:46linuxstb1k seems small, if it's including the lcd driver, ata driver etc.
13:14:53JdGordonits not
13:14:59JdGordonit does nothing but turn the led off
13:15:19pixelmamarkun: there is 1 warning in wmadeci.c, hard to spot among the others caused by gcc verions though
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13:16:29JdGordonunless libusb doesnt like amd64?
13:16:56linuxstbThat's possible - were your earlier, successful tests on a different Linux?
13:17:23JdGordonive got both 32 and 64bit linux setups on this comp.. so cant be 100% sure qwhich i tried
13:17:31JdGordonive got 32bit on my laptop which ill try now
13:18:09pondlifelinuxstb: I don't think I'd be willing to pay that much for a refurb.
13:18:43JdGordonnohing on32it eitherrrr ;
13:19:09JdGordonnothing on 32bit either :(
13:21:14preglowdo we have any docs on the hardware in this mrobe thing?
13:21:32linuxstbThe one with the TI CPU and DSP? ;)
13:21:57JdGordonthere is cpu docs
13:22:40linuxstbJdGordon: Where?
13:23:05 Join bluebrother [0] (
13:23:26linuxstbDo you mean that leaked DSC24 doc?
13:23:31linuxstbYes, you do...
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13:23:57B4gderthat one doesn
13:24:02B4gder't seem "leaked"
13:24:14JdGordonits also not the exact same chip.. but close enough
13:24:20JdGordon+ the cowon A2 source
13:24:22preglowanother dual core target? is leaking! :)
13:24:34B4gdercpu + dsp cores, yes
13:24:55preglowone arm core?
13:25:00preglowclocked at what?
13:25:14preglowtoo bad the resolution almost forces dsp use for video
13:25:59markunpreglow: isn't that more fun?
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13:26:37preglowmarkun: well, yeah, if you think rewriting codecs in asm is fun
13:26:49preglowi'd rather do that work with payment as some kind of encouragement :V
13:28:58B4gderok then we'll pay you... 30 dollars for it!
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13:29:06agm3ntpixelma: are you test mpegplayer on c200??
13:29:19markunlinuxstb: I've moved the fft and mdct code to separate files. Do you want to take a look or should I wait for saratoga?
13:29:49pixelmano, but now I remembered amiconn saying that it won't work... (at least the video part)
13:29:59linuxstbmarkun: I don't think I'll be able to comment usefully. Maybe preglow could if he has time...
13:30:50pixelmashould I disable it again for now?
13:31:03B4gdernew x5?
13:31:10agm3ntpixelma: yes, I have only audio
13:31:12preglowmarkun: why?
13:31:16agm3ntpixelma: thanks
13:31:42markunpreglow: because I want to play around with different mdct implementations
13:31:51linuxstbB4gder: Looks nice, but could of course be completely new hardware inside...
13:31:54markunlinuxstb, preglow:
13:32:17JdGordonoh, should i rename the olympus folder to dm320?
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13:32:44B4gderas long as it is plain dm320 stuff, I think yes
13:32:52markunpreglow: and makes wmadeci.c a lot cleaner I think
13:33:09preglowmarkun: well, a quick glance suggests it's just a pure split, which is not exactly anything that neeeds reviewing :)
13:33:14linuxstbIIRC, the original ffmpeg code had the mdct in a separate file.
13:33:17JdGordonso firmware/target/arm/dm320/mrobe-500 and just ignore the olympus?
13:33:18preglowif you haven't done anything fancy, just go ahead
13:33:36preglowlinuxstb: almost certainly, yes
13:33:40preglowand we want to do that anyway
13:33:55markunpreglow: then why the 'why?' ? :)
13:33:57amiconnpixelma: I'd think you can leave it enabled. At least it doesn't crash (but you get only audio)
13:34:14amiconnMaking it work requires some work in the core, not in the plugin
13:34:41amiconn(make lcd_yuv_blit() actually do something instead of just returning)
13:34:46markunJdGordon: looks ok to me
13:35:19preglowmarkun: well, it's always nice to know someones direct motives, heh
13:35:20markunpreglow: oops, the codec doesn't sound right anymore..
13:35:28rasherB4gder: where do they see 30GB? To me that might as well be 80GB
13:36:30B4gderbeats me...
13:36:42markunpreglow: maybe the tables need to be static? (revtab0 for example)
13:37:38B4gderit seems the current e200 bootloader is weird
13:37:53B4gderseeing that at least two people say they can use the reversed-order BL but not the official one
13:38:04 Quit bluebrother (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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13:38:16B4gderI would assume the reversed-order one to be a bit oldish
13:38:40B4gder2007-07-31 it seems
13:39:16linuxstbB4gder: Are you talking about the OF loading problems?
13:40:01linuxstbI assume it's the usual case and it works for every dev with an e200?
13:41:07B4gderI'm not so sure any dev tried this operation recently
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13:41:41B4gderI'll try to get a shot at it later on
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13:42:57gunluvaHello, all.
13:43:18gunluvaIs the Sansa C200 port working?
13:43:48B4gderit's just a bit hard to install...
13:44:07Zagorthat reminds me
13:44:07gunluvaIs there a "how to"?
13:44:08linuxstbYou could test the new sansapatcher though -
13:44:25*Zagor uploads a bootloader to
13:44:26gunluvaWould that be deadly?
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13:44:40linuxstbgunluva: Follow the instructions in the e200 manual, but use the sansapatcher in the zip file I've just linked to, instead of the one linked in the manual.
13:44:47B4gderZagor: we prefer the sansapatcher way anyway... :-)
13:44:56linuxstbgunluva: And obviously also install the c200 build, not the e200 build...
13:45:03Zagoryeah but that needs a bootloader anyway
13:45:11B4gderthat's built-in
13:45:14gunluvaIf I've got music in there already, and I install RockBox, will it get erased?
13:45:42linuxstbB4gder: rbutil still needs the file though - and it's nice to have it there for people compiling sansapatcher themselves.
13:45:43Zagorme stupid, you need it to _build_ it. <grumble>
13:45:55B4gderlinuxstb: fair enough
13:46:10|Marco|gunluva: it didn't for me
13:46:25B4gdergunluva: it doesn't erase anything
13:46:33linuxstbgunluva: It shouldn't do, but it's also not a good idea to have the only copy of your music on your Sansa...
13:46:42pixelmagunluva: I would back it up first, for some reason the few example songs on it were gone aftre my install yesterday. Maybe it was my fault but backup is always good ;)
13:46:59gunluvaYeah, my stuff is backed up.
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13:47:14gunluvaHmm. Maybe I should wait until after school.
13:47:16Zagorpixelma: the example songs were not in the MUSIC dir, they are in the sansa db
13:47:28Zagor(which is in system/)
13:47:49tumuyay, dumb works in sim :)
13:47:50ZagorI was also confused about that at first, but for the opposite reason (how do I get rid of them??)
13:48:04 Quit bluebrother (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:48:06gunluvaOr maybe I should do it at school.
13:48:49tumubit malloc happy and having bugs of its own but still working
13:49:06Zagorgunluva: go go go. nothing will go wrong.
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13:50:36linuxstbWhat was the conclusion about the mod patch on the tracker? Are we rejecting it based on the lack of a clear license?
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13:50:59pixelmaZagor: mine were in the music folder (could still look it up in the backup folder I made first) - and that folder was still there but empty after installing (maybe it was a mistake in my end but can't remember)
13:51:49linuxstbOut of curiousity, what codec did sandisk use for those example tracks?
13:52:35pixelmathere were 5 mp3s on it, all 192kbps cbr
13:52:45ZagorI never looked :-)
13:52:51*rasher replaces 83 lines in genlang with $english = XML::LibXML->new->parse_file($englishfile);
13:53:08pixelmaand they are really music tracks not like the Iriver one...
13:53:11tumulinuxstb, i don't mind if it isn't included, having it as seperate works for me
13:53:11rasherThat's of course the part that comes for free..
13:53:30preglowanyone have any strong feelings about the fade-in-out features using the hardware volume control?
13:53:41 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
13:53:55tumulinuxstb, and if the codec build process is simplified, it would make it lot easier to build improperly licenced codecs
13:54:04LinusNrasher: is XML::LibXML a standard perl module?
13:54:53linuxstbtumu: Even distributing it separately is of questionable legality IMO - it will include function definitions and macros which are part of Rockbox and GPL'd. But IANAL...
13:55:33rasherLinusN: sadly not, but it seems widely available.. I don't think there are any standard perl modules for XML from my reading. Not any that get recommended at least
13:55:47B4gderthere aren't?
13:55:59rasherWell depends what you mean by standard.
13:56:01B4gderthe ones I've used seemed to exist even on oldish perl installs
13:56:09B4gderbut maybe I was just lucky
13:56:10LinusNrasher: so we will have some problems if the XML module isn't easily installable as a cugwin package
13:56:11Zagorpreglow: I use fade-on-pause daily, but I suspect that's not what you're talking about?
13:56:20LinusNcygwin even
13:56:37preglowZagor: oh, but it is
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13:57:14ZagorI like that feature very much
13:57:35preglowZagor: we use the hardware volume to fade now, which is very clicky on some targets, and means the fade doesn't work at all with the line out port on targets with fixed line out volume
13:57:43preglowi hate it, but that's not the point :)
13:58:13Zagorright. well as long as it keeps working on my archos, I don't have an opinion about how it's implemented
13:58:19rasherLinusN: Well gosh, cygwin doesn't seem to package any perl modules separately.. Let me investigate
13:58:22preglowthis won't even have an effect on archos
13:58:24gammyI like it too
13:58:33gammybut can't it be done in software to solve the problem?
13:58:37preglowcan't do dsp on archos
13:58:44preglowgammy: that's what i'm saying
13:58:58LinusNi think the fade should be soft, so it works on line out, and it doesn't fade the voice if any
13:59:18preglowit should only affect the main playback buffer
13:59:22gammySounds like a nicer solution.
13:59:31preglowbut the problem is it's probably not straightforward :P
13:59:37preglowlike anything regarding playback.c
13:59:39preglowjhMikeS: around?
14:00:05rasherB4gder: the only core perl module that has anything to do with xml seems to be Pod::Perldoc::ToXml
14:00:16rasherSo I guess we can scrap that idea, then.
14:00:40preglowi don't think perl has any core xml modules, no
14:00:44preglowjust bundle a simple one
14:00:53rasherAh but I want to use the *good* one
14:00:59preglowthen make people install it
14:01:05preglowthat's what cpan is for
14:01:25gammyand remember to tell people to prepend 'force'
14:01:28B4gderor copy the perl code
14:01:36rasherDon't know how nice that is, to be honest
14:01:36tumulinuxstb, well, atleast the main license of dumb says it is licensed under gpl
14:01:37preglowB4gder: it's probably not a simple pl file, heh
14:01:51B4gderno, it probably relies on a c lib underneath...
14:02:00preglownot all xml libs do
14:02:04preglowi don't know if this one does
14:02:05linuxstbtumu: I'm talking about
14:02:07rasherIt relies on libxml2
14:02:08preglowperl has a fair selection of them...
14:02:14rasherWhich *is* in fact installable through cygwin
14:02:29pregloweverything has libxml2 these days, but you need to build wrappers too, and that's hairy
14:02:31tumulinuxstb, i'm not using that, i'm using dumb,
14:02:37linuxstbtumu: I know.
14:03:10tumuif i wanted, i could write a mod player from scratch, i've done it before :)
14:03:22rasherStill, bundling it would be ~20 pm files. Not sure how nice that is either.
14:03:32B4gdernot very, no
14:03:35linuxstbCould we create a cygwin package?
14:03:41linuxstbs/we/someone other than me/
14:04:05B4gderthe compilers are cygwin packaged... LinusN did it!
14:04:21linuxstbSo we have a volunteer!
14:04:33*B4gder votes in favour
14:04:38*linuxstb seconds
14:04:49*LinusN hides
14:05:17 Quit kubiix (Connection timed out)
14:05:19|Marco|tumu: please do, there is'nt any as is?
14:05:33|Marco|err.. players
14:05:39tumuthere is
14:06:01*linuxstb wonders if a mod playing plugin would be more useful than a codec with the current limitations of the playback engine
14:06:01|Marco|oh? thought I looked for it..
14:06:13preglowlinuxstb: oh, for sure
14:06:20tumui have playing right now on sansa sim :)
14:06:33|Marco|ooooo, niice
14:06:37preglowtumu: complete with floating point calculations and everything, i'd wager?
14:07:14tumupreglow, out of box, only slight changes
14:07:26tumuhaven't tested on real hw yet
14:07:29preglowthen you still have lots of work in front of you :P
14:07:29pixelmaZagor: there is still something wrong in the set time screen on c200, you change to the next item on button press and release, leaving out one everytime. Since it is an even number of items and there is no button repeat, I can't set some (e.g. minutes)
14:07:46tumupreglow, didn't say it was going to end here or be easy :)
14:07:57ZagorI get that on the rgb screen. didn't notice it in the time screen.
14:08:07preglowtumu: that code is supposed to contain improvements, but i never got the chance to check them out
14:08:24tumupreglow, i'll take a look
14:08:25preglowtumu: got it from the guy that made the foobar2000 dumb plugin
14:08:28|Marco|urk.. please, without floating point it sounds harsh, My Mac PPC has some weird issues with ocp and floating points
14:08:52pixelmaZagor: but on the RGB screen you have three items which at least gives you the possibility to set all (jus have to go another round)
14:09:17tumupreglow, yeah, i know kode54
14:09:24preglowtumu: goodie
14:09:35preglowi'd love to see a dumb codec/plugin
14:09:40preglowso best of luck :)
14:09:41Zagorit's pretty much the same problem as before, only I changed which keys are buggy...
14:09:55linuxstbpreglow: The reason I mentioned it is that tumu is working on a codec...
14:10:32preglowlinuxstb: major part of the work isn't in that part anyway, but doing a plugin probably will be simpler indeed
14:11:26preglowLinusN: do you have the url or name for that psychoaccoustic bass boost thing which has a counterpart of on archos daps i don't remember the name for? :P
14:11:30Zagorcan sansapatcher update the rockbox bl, or only install it?
14:11:37preglowLinusN: url or name of paper, that is
14:11:55linuxstbZagor: The "install" option will update if there's already a bootloader there.
14:12:28|Marco|tumu: running for a plugin ?
14:12:50tumumarco, it's running as codec
14:13:29tumuor what do you mean?
14:14:15linuxstbtumu: How are you managing memory in your codec? Are you copying the mod from the main audio buffer to the codec malloc buffer?
14:14:52tumudumb parses the module and allocs everything in internal structures
14:15:19linuxstbSo after the initial parsing, you don't access the audio buffer any more?
14:15:25preglowlinuxstb: this is why i really want codec parsers to be part of the playback.s file loader...
14:15:47tumulinuxstb, i don't
14:15:55linuxstbpreglow: I agree, but as plugins, or part of the core?
14:16:22preglowwell, it's tempting to say plugins, but it's just too much of a bother, if you ask me
14:16:32preglowthen again, if we stuff them in the core, we might have to include big parts of the codec lib too
14:17:19linuxstbtumu: OK, so you're limited to small MODs (less than about 500KB).
14:17:49tumufor now
14:17:55 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
14:18:26*preglow wants to play his big xms :>
14:18:30 Quit The-Compiler (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:18:52|Marco|preglow: I want to play my big it's
14:18:58tumuplays realtime on my sansa
14:19:01|Marco|20mb :D
14:19:03tumujust testing
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14:19:41*amiconn always wondered why there are multi-MB mods
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14:20:09amiconnFor that size, it'd be more efficient to just store the music in a streaming format
14:20:13Zagoryeah, sort of defeats the purpose
14:20:28tumuboost ratio is around 50%
14:20:39rashertumu: it actually plays? Floats and all?
14:21:12linuxstbWhat kind of file is that?
14:21:16preglowamiconn: several of the people who made such big xms did indeed start offering them as mp3
14:21:29preglowamiconn: but distributing the mods themselves have always been a big part of the entire music scene
14:21:36Zagorhmm, without verbose the screen blinks a second time on the c200 (showing the ugly dog)
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14:22:14preglowZagor: part of the purpose of mods was also being able to use other peoples work in your own, that's hardly possible if you give people mp3 files
14:22:36amiconnZagor: I was thinking about that problem too recently. On iriver, if we'd go non-verbose, there would be nothing on the lcd until rockbox starts
14:22:55Zagorheh, I'd say that's an afterthought, but yeah that's a point
14:23:08gammyamiconn: that would be poopy :/
14:23:16preglowand i'd say it was a big part of why there was so much music in the scene before
14:23:17amiconnMaybe the bootloader should display *something* when there is no need to output textual messages?
14:23:23linuxstbamiconn: You need a nice splash logo ;)
14:23:47gammyI think the text is sexy :(.
14:24:24Zagorpreglow: semantics perhaps, but the purpose of mods was to play nice sampled music with little ram. the use-other-peoples-samples is rather a side-effect of the method rather than a purpose.
14:24:30amiconnlinuxstb: Yeah, probably. A small and built-in one.
14:25:40Zagoramiconn: "Loading..." could be nice
14:25:59linuxstbMaybe something similar to the ipod apple logo - a small RB logo in the middle of the screen. But as soon as you introduce that, people will want to customise...
14:26:13markunlinuxstb: shall I put the ffmpeg copyright over the files I just created?
14:26:28markunas it's mostly their work
14:26:29Zagorlinuxstb: I don't see much of a problem with people customizing. as long as they can compile, they can do whatever they want
14:26:30linuxstbmarkun: I don't know...
14:26:41markunI'll just do it for now
14:26:47Zagordo we have a strict size limit on any boot loader?
14:26:53linuxstbZagor: Yes, but there are lots of requests for customisable splash logos without recompiling.
14:27:01linuxstb(which have been refused)
14:27:25Zagorwe'll continue refusing them, no matter which part of our software that displays it :)
14:27:49linuxstbAll the PP bootloaders are fine in that respect. The problem targets will be where we flash the bootloader - I don't know the limits there.
14:27:50tumulinuxstb, that's why i suggested using lua or similar :)
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14:28:51linuxstbZagor: In fact, it's easier to reject feature requests for code that is flashed - as the argument that it needs to be simple and reliable to avoid bricking applies.
14:29:00markuntumu: for the splash logo?
14:29:26tumumarkun, well, ui code, things that end-users want to edit
14:29:42B4gderwe should use fpl!
14:29:45*B4gder runs away
14:29:59Zagorfpl is so nice
14:30:15pixelmaask the zune-linux guys what they would use? ;)
14:30:35Zagorprobably visual basic - that's what real pros use
14:31:01linuxstbtumu: You're not the first person to mention lua - but IMO it's the kind of idea that needs someone to actually implement it before it can be shown to be useful.
14:31:24tumulinuxstb, i can do that when i get around finishing with dumb :)
14:31:54tumuno one believed dumb would work either :p
14:32:47linuxstbLinusN: Do you know the binary size limits for the coldfire bootloaders?
14:33:48LinusN64K currently
14:33:58LinusN(the iriver h-series)
14:34:02pixelmatumu: can't remember someone saying that it won't work
14:35:10preglowtumu: we've even had it work before, afaik
14:35:58tumui know, i was just kidding :)
14:36:35tumuand the previous attempt wasn't in running shape
14:36:38tumui checked it out
14:36:40preglowindeed not
14:36:45tumujust the sources were included and some makefile work
14:36:54tumunot even close to running
14:37:19 Quit RaRe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:37:21Zagorchopper doesn't work very well on c200. waaay too fast.
14:37:42LinusNZagor: because of the narrow screen?
14:38:03Zagori haven't played it on any other target so I can't say, but it sure is difficult...
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14:39:42rasherA-ha! Cygwin does have XML::LibMXL.. I was just looking in the wrong place..
14:39:59LinusNrasher: goodie!
14:40:04Zagorand jackpot is horribly slow instead
14:40:13B4gderbtw in case anyone cares, code for that new itunes hash is here =>
14:40:38 Quit spiorf (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:40:39class37i put on newest build of rockbox for ipod video 30 gig -
14:40:54class37how often are there improvements
14:41:05pixelmaZagor: I made a suggestion in the patch tracker to use the "half sized" version as the Archos do - but he said it was too small (haven't tried since then on my own). IIRC chopper also has a define for "speed"...
14:41:18B4gderclass37: usually no more than 20 times a day ;-)
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14:41:22bluebrotherit's even linked from the front page
14:41:52Zagorpixelma: I think the size is pretty good. it just feels like you're starting on level #5 or something
14:41:57dionoeaZagor: try changing the CYCLETIME (or something like that) variable
14:42:00B4gdercracking that hash in 36 hours is indeed a feat
14:42:42Zagoranyone know why the cursor in jewels dims when you move it? makes it very hard to move fast
14:42:52peturnow let them crack that fw encryption...
14:43:01pixelmaZagor: don't know about jackpot - that was one of the button actions plugins which annoyed me and then left it there. Will put a mail in the dev-list later about the reasons..
14:43:33B4gderpetur: working hard to get itunes working is hardly a sign they want to hack the fw...
14:43:39Zagoryeah, it takes ~30 seconds for the rolling symbols to stop. and you can't abort...
14:43:47ZagorI had to do the 15-second reset to get away
14:43:48B4gderah no, they *don't* use itunes
14:43:55*B4gder gets more coffee
14:45:12pixelmaZagor: I'm sorry for not keeping an eye on the possibility to abort there...
14:45:15dionoeaZagor: that jewels diming issue might be related to the LCD display. The cursor isn't supposed to dim.
14:45:45dionoeai'll check on my ipod to be sure
14:46:03*tumu goes to eat, bbl
14:47:16dionoeaZagor: ah nevermind, it isn't drawn at all when swapping tiles. (But it doesn't dim)
14:47:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:47:59markunoops, yellow
14:48:24JdGordon#a in a #define quotes the a arg right?
14:51:06linuxstbdionoea: Don't encourage him... ;)
14:51:41JdGordonno... debugging... not adding new ones
14:51:52*B4gder giggles
14:52:51pixelmathere was already one additional woarning in your first commit today...
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14:53:39JdGordonwow, lots of commits today
14:53:52ZagorI just realized I've never had a colour target before. the games look a lot nicer on this!
14:54:12B4gderwhoosh, right into the 21st century! ;-P
14:54:23dionoeahehe :)
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14:54:43linuxstbB4gder, Zagor I don't know who's department this is, but it's been mentioned before that the SVN timestamps at and differ by 1 hour
14:54:58LinusNZagor: from the caves straight to the city - what a rush! :-)
14:55:06saratogamarkun: merging the IMDCTs for Ogg/WMA/AAC is on my todo list
14:55:11Zagoryeah I need to sit myself down
14:56:21 Quit darksaboteur ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
14:56:59pixelmaI must admit the Video's screen is much nicer (didn't own a colour target myself until now but had possibilities to take a look...)
14:57:52 Quit webguest22 ("CGI:IRC")
14:58:32Zagorplasma and fire are a lot more fun in colour :)
15:00:03*linuxstb welcomes Zagor to the colourful world of Rockbox
15:01:11gammyhey don't dis the b/w stuff
15:01:16gammyI love my iHP120
15:01:20Zagornow I just neet to get system_reboot() working, then it'll be mother-in-law safe
15:01:24gammythen again I only love it because of rockbox ^_^
15:02:33markunsaratoga: good to hear
15:03:26markunlet's leave both the direct imdct and the one using fft, maybe either can be faster depending on the platform
15:04:15*JdGordon getting fed up with this stupid mr500
15:04:56Nico_PJdGordon: what's wrong with it ?
15:05:10JdGordonits not doing what i tell it to :p
15:08:52gammySounds like a woman ^_^
15:09:10gammyBut hey, once you rub it in the right direction.
15:09:51rasherZagor s@r([0-9][0-9][0-9]+)@$1@i on the ircreader would be helpful
15:12:18 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
15:13:02Zagordoes people ever blurt out revision numbers like that?
15:14:13JdGordonso i says to her i says... r666
15:15:12linuxstbZagor: grep tells me 210 times this year... So almost once a day. (yes, I'm bored...)
15:15:21 Quit LinusN (
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15:15:33Zagoroh well, can't hurt I guess
15:16:12NJoinmarkun [0] (n=markun@rockbox/developer/markun)
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15:19:24Zagorwell, there you go
15:19:24linuxstbrasher: Hopefully people won't refer to svn revisions of other projects though...
15:19:41 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
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15:20:34JdGordonok, why the hell does adding printf()'s allow the spi driver to not stall? removing them goes into an infinite loop somehwere :'(
15:20:41GodEaterlinuxstb: surely your grepping has found out whether they do or not already ?
15:22:07linuxstbIt has, and they do.. But admitedly only a couple of times this year. Destroyer14094 also has an unfortunate nick...
15:22:23Zagornah, I use \b
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15:32:30 Part LinusN
15:32:46JdGordonif rx_bytes is a char*, would this actually work "while ((*rx_bytes = inw(IO_SERIAL0_RX_DATA)) & 0x100);" or would it be truncated so it should always be 0x00xx ?
15:33:59peturI think it will be truncated by the assignment
15:34:00Zagorno that won't work. chars are 8 bit, assgning higher values should get you a compiler warning even
15:34:02linuxstbYou don't want "& 0xff" ?
15:34:19Zagoryou want <<8
15:34:49zx_spectrumHello to all. I have a problem with removing ATA password from Hitachi hard disk drive. I tried alot of variouse software which do the work, but it's doesn't help. The password is set to High, and I found information that, if it is set to High I can remove ATA pswd by Master password by entering all spaced, but that's doesn't work.. anyone can help please?
15:35:09JdGordonthats what i thought...
15:35:13Zagoroh, I misread. heh yeah &0x100 will give you exactly one bit
15:35:13krazykitwhat does this have to do with rockbox, zx_spectrum?
15:35:46Zagorzx_spectrum: all we know is on that page. we don't have any more inside information.
15:36:09zx_spectrumWell, sorry if I'm in a wrong place. I just haven't found any resource for this topic..
15:36:11linuxstbkrazykit: Blame google, Rockbox appears high in the hits for hard disk unlocking due to a problem that used to happen in the early days.
15:36:12JdGordonstill getting 0xff from spi :(
15:36:53Zagorlinuxstb: blame the clueless world. practically nobody else have mentioned this issue, nor how to solve it. so we should be high on google.
15:37:45*linuxstb googles for "ata password unlocking" and sees Rockbox is #1 - we should sell adverts ;)
15:37:50JdGordonB4gder: one last thing for dev.cgi... can you make clicking on a problem build automatiaclly goto the first problem?
15:38:25B4gderwould that really be what you always want?
15:38:56JdGordonyou click the link for another reaosn?
15:39:31B4gderyes, at least I have done many times... but most of that info is now shown in the title thing...
15:39:46B4gderie server, compiler version etc
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15:40:15ZagorI'd say you more often want to see the error than those things. so having the default action go to the error would be convenient in my opinion.
15:40:31B4gderI guess so
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15:44:59Undisanyone awake?
15:45:53Undisi have one iAudio X5 on which i would like to install rockbox
15:46:12peturcheck the fine manual?
15:46:15Undisthe only trouble is it was recently damaged, and the little 'subpack' thingy was broken
15:46:22Undisi did
15:46:57Undisnow i got a new subpack, but it seems the damage is to the player itself, and now it does no longer charge by the AC-adaptor, only by usb...
15:47:06markunhm, saratoga's gone gain..
15:47:19markundoes anyone want to take a look?
15:47:39Undisso the question is, will it update the firmware as long as i have enough power on the thing, or do i have to have the charger plugged in?
15:47:42peturmarkun: first fix your remaining warning :p
15:47:49markunpetur: oops :)
15:49:15Undisi don't know if the power-plugged-in is an actual requirement or if it is just a precaution
15:49:28petura precaution
15:50:08Undisi would like to point out tho how much i hate the 'subpack'.... a flaw in the design imo
15:50:16Undisguess ill just have to try it hey :)
15:50:24markunpetur: I don't really understand how I introduced that warning..
15:50:28peturthe main reaso I didn't buy the X5
15:50:42markunpetur: wait, I see it
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15:50:53Undisyup, i wasn't aware of the subpack as i ordered online and they conveniently left that part out
15:50:54pixelmano, the power plug will trigger the update iiuc
15:51:32pixelmaif the right file is in the correct place
15:51:59linuxstbBut it sounds like there is no harm in trying?
15:52:23Undisi could try, if it doesn't update it doesn't update...
15:52:26Undisi guess
15:53:12markunpetur: committed, now you can look at my patch again ;)
15:53:25pixelmashouldn't do no harm, I'd think. Just want to stress that this is my understanding of it, I'm not completely sure.
15:53:36peturmarkun: did I say I would? :p
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15:53:44*JdGordon is gonna break something if this freeking change fixes everything!
15:54:04markunpetur: you implied it by saying "first fix your remaining warning" :p
15:54:13pixelmamarkun: I already told you about the warning 2 times before :(
15:54:18JdGordonit seems I may have forgotten to set the damn touch_screen_enable pin to freeking output :'(
15:54:22markunreally? Didn't see it
15:54:36JdGordonoh yay :) didnt fix it
15:54:44*JdGordon doesnt feel stupid
15:55:40amiconnUndis: The power plug-in for flashing is a requirement (it's by design in the cowon loader)
15:56:06markunpixelma: ah, you told me.. sorry
15:56:19pixelmaok, markun, you can only count one time, the second attempt got lost because I didn't mention your nick
15:56:23amiconnThe cowon loader will only flash if it's started by plugging in power. Otherwise it will simply ignore the X5_FW.bin file
15:56:31seabluedo you guys know if iriver will make a new mp3 player?
15:56:52linuxstbseablue: Aren't they constantly releasing new players?
15:57:28B4gderI saw a new iriver being discussed today
15:57:50seabluehm maybe.. i was thinking more along the lines of the h340
15:58:02seabluelike a newer version of it.. with more space
15:58:12B4gderand why would we know of anything like that?
15:58:21linuxstbWe have no insight into iriver's plans... But it seems no-one makes pure audio players any more - they're all media players.
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15:59:12seablueb4g, sorry to waste your irc time
15:59:19seabluevaluable even
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16:00:11*B4gder blinks and looks
16:01:26markunseablue: better place for such things is misticriver
16:03:45Undisjust gave it a go anyway.... doesn't update...
16:03:50Undisthat sucks!!!
16:04:00B4gderUndis: then you do it wrong
16:04:17Undisnah, the AC adaptor input is broken
16:04:20Undisonly charges by usb
16:04:32B4gderoh... yes that's "wrong" ;-)
16:04:45 Part VeePee
16:05:16Undisguess ill have to disassemble the thing and see if i can solder something back in place to fix the charger input..
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16:06:17Undisthanks for your time anyway
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16:23:17saratogamarkun: I looked at that patch
16:23:23saratogaare you sure you can merge those trig tables?
16:27:00 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
16:27:45saratogaI tried to do that some time ago
16:28:00saratogaas I recall, the smaller ones are not resampled versions of the larger ones
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16:30:10linuxstbsaratoga: Any progress with seeking? I'm thinking your work so far could go onto flyspray so maybe someone else could continue, if you're not.
16:31:02saratogalinuxstb: I'm really busy this fall, so I'm doing very little programming
16:31:08saratogai can put up a patch though
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16:31:23saratogai wrote up the binary search version of the seeking patch, but theres some stupid bug that makes it not work
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16:31:36saratogaand I haven't gotten around to figuring it out
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16:40:46peturhahaha... "The reason why I haven't touched window$ (if we ignore ideology here) is that it is so difficult (compared to Linux console)."
16:43:51preglowrasher: did you get anywhere with the usb?
16:47:51***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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17:18:14ddaphis there any plugin to do "scracthing" with ipod? like djs do
17:19:04ddaphbut isnt that the coolest thing you heard today?
17:19:15bluebrotherthere is a feature request though. But IMO this is a quite useless feature and not worth the effort. Others may disagree of course ...
17:19:20ddaphyou've got the circle thing at your fingers.. why not scracth
17:19:41bluebrotherbecause I want to listen to music with a DAP, and that's it.
17:19:52ddaphok :)
17:20:27ddaphwhat theme are you using?
17:20:43bluebrotherthe default theme on my mini. Looks quite nice there.
17:21:46ddaphahh most themes need some special builds but i dont want to install special ones
17:22:12bluebrotherwell, there are a couple of shipped themes. You could try iCatcher for example
17:22:55ddaphis there a crossfader?
17:24:40ddaphits a plugin
17:25:00GodEaterddaph: have you read the manual at all ?
17:25:08ddaphyeah most of it
17:25:53GodEaterso why the questions then ?
17:26:22ddaphill search again about xfader
17:26:22 Part pixelma
17:26:35bluebrotherthere is a crossfade option, and it's not a plugin.
17:26:42bluebrother*and* this is explained in the manual.
17:27:33bluebrotherand searching for the more generic variant of a term usually helps −− "xfader" is a real bad search string while "crossfade" is much better.
17:28:06*GodEater cries with laughter at the latest -dev ML post
17:28:06ddaphyeah it was for irc only..
17:29:21bluebrotherwe prefer real words here too. There are some guys that are blind and rely on screen readers
17:29:33bluebrotherbut that's stated in the channel guidelines
17:29:36*bluebrother sighs
17:29:36GodEater"GPLV3 is not a new license" <−− what was he smoking when he wrote that ?
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17:31:30*GodEater hands Febs the "I'm not giving you legal advice hat" and asks whether he thinks that GPLV3 is a new license or not ?
17:31:30Arathisamiconn: wasn't there some day you wanted to try porting radio to the h10? ... just wondered if there's something to test cause I was a little off rockbox the last months
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17:32:15bluebrotherGodEater: urgh.
17:32:21FebsI'm not sure I can give legal advice right now. I haven't eaten enough flesh yet today.
17:32:40bluebrotherwhy is he that strong about RMS? It's a license, that's all.
17:33:04GodEaterFebs: that's why you're wearing the "I'm not giving you legal advice" hat :)
17:33:10GodEaterit ruins your appetite
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17:34:46*linuxstb doesn't see any point in a gplv2 vs gplv3 argument - it's a philosophical difference so people will never agree
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17:38:08GodEaterlinuxstb: you *can't* argue that they're the same license though surely? Not even philosophically ?
17:38:28linuxstbI could, yes,
17:39:53linuxstbI seem to recall doing exactly that in one of my posts to that thread....
17:40:29GodEaterI must have missed it, or misread it
17:41:53linuxstbProbably best in -community?
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17:49:15*preglow prefers as few irc chans as possible
17:50:14SoapWas that 20 second visit a registration of disgust? :)
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18:10:34eigmaboo, www is still down
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18:11:18eigmaor not (d'oh)
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18:30:18bluebrotherhmm, how much is the difference between e200 and c200? Do we need separate manuals for them?
18:31:20 Quit obo ("bye")
18:33:43linuxstbbluebrother: As much as a lot of other targets - e.g. the ipods...
18:34:21linuxstbBut IMO, it's simpler to just have exactly the same number of manuals as builds - they're free...
18:34:27bluebrotherhmm −− it's not in the DeviceChart table unfortunately
18:35:12bluebrotherok, looks like we need a new manual for the c200.
18:36:05linuxstbIt would be cool if you could fix that today, and I'll try and release a new sansapatcher. So tomorrow we can call it supported.
18:37:47bluebrotherI'll try. We still need someone to draw the player image unless I missed it
18:38:15*linuxstb pings pixelma
18:38:25linuxstbI _think_ she mentioned she had an svg
18:38:49bluebrotherthe image on the download page looks like the scaled svgs. But I can't see the svg in svn.
18:41:12peturI think pixelma made it
18:41:51 Quit petur ("work->home")
18:46:19bluebrotherdo we have a hi-res scan of the c200 somewhere available? I'd like to check the buttons
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18:47:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:48:29agm3ntbluebrother: check simulator,but it's not in hi-res
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18:49:36bluebrotheragm3nt: thanks for the hint. Might be sufficient, will try.
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18:50:05sfenzin order to install senab's build, can i install the regular one and then just unpack his zip ? it overwrites everything but it doesnt seem to work
18:50:29bluebrothersfenz: you could do that. But senab's build is unofficial and thus not supported here.
18:50:49sfenzbut thats the way, right?
18:51:13bluebrotherthat's the usual way of updating and it should work the same way for updating to an unsupported build.
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18:51:18sfenzok thanks.
18:51:20 Quit sfenz (Client Quit)
18:51:20preglown1s: do you keep any stats on how many kb you've shaved away by now? :P
18:51:22pixelmabluebrother: I already made an svg, just wanted to ask you what we should do with the landscape orientation for the pic in the manual since the macro defines how to use it in the manual by height (and worked on the other patch at the same time)
18:51:23bluebrothermaybe he has the firmware file outside of the .rockbox folder?
18:51:40n1spreglow: not really no :-)
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18:55:13n1spreglow: a lot of code in rockbox that isn't performance critical could most likely be rewritten in a much more size efficient manner but I am mostly picking the low hanging fruit ;-)
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19:05:57markunsaratoga: ping
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19:16:49sfenzi know this isnt official but - after installing any custom build, like evilG, and then trying to view a theme which should be supported by evilG, i get the regular WPS screen as if something isnt enabled, and the statusbar flickers. what am i doing wrong? this happens to all AA enabled themes
19:17:40n1ssfenz: if you know this isn't the place, why do you ask your question here?
19:17:52bluebrothersounds like the theme is incompatible −− tags might have changed.
19:18:42sfenzn1s: where's the place to ask?
19:18:47Soapsfenz, that is a result of a tightening of the WPS parsing code a few months back. "Invalid" WPSs now don't display at all, Rockbox will display the default WPS when an invalid one is encountered. It would be helpful if people who experience this problem either took it upon themselves to fix the broken WPS, or created a Forum thread detailing not just which WPSs aren't working, but where they downloaded them from.
19:18:50sfenzblue: i downloaded it from rockbox-themes
19:19:08bluebrothersfenz: this doesn't tell anything.
19:19:17bluebrotherthat page too might hold outdated themes.
19:19:17RedbrevaWhich theme? I'll check it ou
19:19:39sfenzredbrava: i downloaded evilG latest for ipod video, and jBlackGlass
19:19:54RedbrevaOK, I'll have a look
19:19:55sfenz(the one thats on rockbox-themes)
19:20:03sfenzthank yoi
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19:26:41Redbrevasfenz: Are you using the fusion build? That theme works fine in the fusion sim
19:27:01sfenzi dl the one for ipod video, whats the fustion build?
19:27:29RedbrevaEvilG offers Fire, Ice & Fusion builds - which one are you running??
19:27:49sfenzahh... i dont know :/ must be the wrong one
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19:34:40amiconnsvn conflict :(
19:45:37saratogamarkun: pong
19:46:17Soapjust for the record, Redbreva, EvilG no longer offers multiple builds.
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19:56:48markunsaratoga: do you get the PMs?
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20:07:30YoshiCJI'v got 2 Themes made so far for c200
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20:22:11RedbrevaSoap: There are still Fire & Ice 30 & 60G builds for the ipod video to download on
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20:30:50nalrodmy Iriver has been "Initializing Database for over 2 hours now since I've installed Rockbox...
20:31:49nalrodshould i keep waiting is this normal? am I even in the right place for advice?
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20:35:13SoapRedbreva, yea, the older ones. So I guess I should not have said he no longer "offers" the separate builds, but rather that he no longer makes separate builds. ;)
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20:38:39nalroddoes Rockbox initialize for extended periods if the partitions on the harddrive (iriver) aren't "standard". 32G and 8G partitions...?
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20:41:43 Join Lars_G [0] (n=lars@unaffiliated/lars-g/x-000001)
20:41:45Lars_GHey guys
20:42:20Lars_GQuestion, do you know of a set of gcc toolchain and libc for arm cross in .deb so I don't have to compile it from scratch?
20:43:00linuxstbLars_G: Compiling from scratch is the recommended way - it's very easy (just run the tools/ script).
20:44:21 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC")
20:45:03teksimiandoes rockbox run on 6th generation ipods?
20:45:14LearEven doing it "by hand" isn't very hard...
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20:45:24linuxstbteksimian: No, new hardware, new port, no-one working on it -
20:47:55***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:48:24Lars_Glinuxstb: it's not the easyness but the small ammount of bandwidth and hdd I have that scares me
20:49:02Soapteksimian, one can dream that someone will crack the encryption and open up the 6th gen iPod as well as the 2nd and 3rd gen Nano all in one fell swoop.
20:49:24n1sanyone familiar with lists/gui/voice code feels like taking a look at FS #7774 patch by sdoyon adding some stuff to improve the voice ui? I don't feel qualified myself really but if no-one looks at it, I'll try...
20:50:12n1sLars_G: the gcc-core source tarball is about 20 megs
20:50:48Lars_Gn1s: and source tarballs usually expand 4:1 or worse
20:55:53amiconnYou'll need enough space for the compiled toolchain plus rockbox sources plus build directory/ies anyway
20:56:29amiconnSo if you don't even have enough space to compile binutils and gcc one after another, you would most probably not be able to use them later either
20:57:02n1sLars_G: if you don't have at least a few hundered megs free you need to do some cleaning :-)
20:58:05*amiconn 's ~/rockbox dir is ~2.2GB
20:58:21amiconn_not_ including the crosscompilers, those are under /opt
20:59:37n1smine is just 1.8GB also sans compilers
21:00:26Lars_Gn1s: Yeah you tell me
21:00:39amiconnToolchains are ~260MB (all 3 target architectures)
21:00:59Lars_GBtw since I want to apply a few patches and I don't want to have to juggle stuff every time I update, do you guys use any sort of script for patching a pull?
21:01:05amiconnThose figures are on cygwin, but linux is probably not far off
21:01:32 Join pixelma [0] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
21:01:42linuxstbLars_G: You just apply the patches once, then do "svn update" to update
21:02:08 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
21:02:10Lars_Glinuxstb: and it should ask to merge. yeah you're right
21:02:16Lars_GI use svn at work all day long and I forgot that
21:02:19*Lars_G sighs
21:02:20linuxstbIt doesn't ask, it just does it...
21:02:33 Join spiorf [0] (
21:02:48Lars_Glinuxstb: it should ask if there are conflicting merges but that's ok
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21:37:23rasherpreglow: no, nothing at all
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21:42:47ondiczis this support chat?
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21:47:40Lars_Gondicz: afaik it's still being decided. right now. but for now, yeah
21:47:51 Join petur [0] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
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21:52:51GodEater_Lars_G: I think the decision's been made actually. This is the place to be for support for the foreseeable future
21:53:12Lars_GGodEater_: Last I checked today it was still under discussion
21:53:18Lars_Gthanks for claryfying
21:53:28GodEater_too many of the old guard said no
21:53:36GodEater_remember, Rockbox is not a democracy ;)
21:53:38Lars_Gto the change? ok
21:53:59 Join Radish- [0] (
21:54:39Radish-hi, is there any reason why the rockbox ipodpatcher.exe would open in a new window and close before I have read the text? (windows vista)
21:54:57GodEater_Radish, it *shouldn't* do that
21:55:06 Nick Radish- is now known as Radish (
21:55:08GodEater_so can you launch it from a command prompt and see what it says ?
21:55:35RadishI can't, no
21:55:38RadishI am in a command prompt
21:55:41RadishI type ipodpatcher
21:55:47Radishand it just flashes in a new window
21:56:00GodEater_let me see
21:56:02RadishI have tried all sorts, even hitting print screen as fast as possible and pasting into paint
21:56:04GodEater_you go to the start menu
21:56:07GodEater_click run
21:56:10GodEater_and type "cmd"
21:56:20Radishah wait, hold on- I tell a lie
21:56:26Radishif I just write ipodpatcher, I get the:
21:56:34Radish"enter I to install rockbox.. etc."
21:56:51Radishif I try to do anything with it, like ipodpatcher −−write-firmware-bin my_sw.bin
21:57:00Radishit fails with an error, but it just closes instantly and I can't read the error
21:57:09GodEater_that's a better description
21:57:15Radishbut from a cmd window it should not pop up in a new window, right?
21:57:22GodEater_no it shouldn't
21:57:28RadishI regret installing vista.. that may be the cause
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21:57:44peturin vista, the commandline is hidden in accessories->system tools (fyi)
21:57:48GodEater_it's vista's "protect the user from himself" policy
21:58:02GodEater_petur: Does start->run->cmd not launch it ?
21:58:22peturlast time I looked at a vista pc, it wasn't there
21:58:29GodEater_what wasn't there ?
21:58:48LloreanYou don't need run
21:58:53Galoisrun is hidden under window-R
21:58:55LloreanJust click the "Start" bubble, and start typing, I believe
21:58:58Radishcmd works fine...
21:59:13Radishthis isn't aero.. windows classic theme
21:59:18GodEater_well anyway
21:59:23peturnevermind me then, I stay far away from vista ;)
21:59:29GodEater_we've had threads about this in the forums
21:59:35GodEater_but I don't recall the answer
21:59:42GodEater_there's some admin setting you have to change IIRC
21:59:59GodEater_"please let me just do this you stupid machine - I know what I'm doing" or some such
22:00:26Radishother applications work fine
22:00:27Radishlike ipod_fw
22:01:24LloreanA couple questions then
22:01:32Llorean1) Are you running an Elevated command prompt?
22:01:35GodEater_I don't believe any of the devs in here run vista - which makes it tricky to debug
22:01:39Llorean2) Have you set iPodpatcher to be run as administrator?
22:01:45RadishI don't know and no
22:01:59Radishand I am a c++ developer myself.. vista is really getting me down :(
22:02:03 Join mirak [0] (
22:02:10LloreanRadish: Well, #2 is probably why it's not working
22:02:18RadishI will set it so then
22:02:21LloreanEspecially if #1 is "no" which is most likely if you haven't explicitly run an elevated on.
22:02:34Radishrunning as admin
22:02:53Radishno change
22:02:58Radishelevated command prompt.. uhh.. googling :)
22:03:13LloreanYou don't need to run an elevated command prompt
22:03:23LloreanThe advantage (ish) of doing that is anything you run from it should be run as admin.
22:03:26 Join hardeep [0] (
22:03:34LloreanBut if you just force ipodpatcher to run as admin and double click on it, it *should* be okay
22:03:39 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
22:03:42*GodEater_ still thinks there's a policy thing to be changed
22:04:03amiconnLlorean: Maybe vista's uac gets in the way
22:04:13GodEater_but this is based on experience with RC1, and vague memories a year old
22:04:21amiconnThere must be a way to compile a win32 binary that triggers the uac request
22:04:36Lloreanamiconn: That's exactly what's getting in the way (at least according to my theory :) )
22:04:46RadishI am trying to install ipodlinux on a 5g video.. using tools from rockbox
22:05:07RadishI might just end up installing rockbox and be done with it
22:05:13Radishwhat does rockbox offer above the normal ipod firmware?
22:05:28amiconnLlorean: I doubt that a command prompt running as admin will solve the uac problem. I only know 2 possible ways to circumvent the problem
22:05:49Lloreanamiconn: My understanding is that if you launch the command prompt Elevated, any applications you launch with it will be too.
22:05:51Radishwhat, a) switch back to xp, b) use another pc with xp installed
22:05:54LloreanIt's one of the "risks" of doing that.
22:06:00GodEater_Radish: have you looked at the "Why Rockbox" link on the front page at ?
22:06:05RadishI will do
22:06:21amiconn(1) (developer side) make ipodpatcher trigger the uac request. (2) (user option) (temporarily) disable uac in vista
22:06:23Radishdoes it replace my normal firmware or can I.. um.. dual boot?
22:06:31GodEater_dual boot
22:06:46Radishand the install process is automated?
22:06:47GodEater_although you if you're an iPL fan you'll likely complain about our bootloader
22:06:53amiconnThat said, I didn't try many things in vista yet. We just have a vista vm at work to play around with it a bit.
22:07:01RadishI have never used iPL in my life
22:07:30RadishI just want to hack my ipod for no reason in particular ;)
22:07:45Radishrockbox seems cooler than iPL anyway
22:07:48GodEater_Radish: you can be our first tester of that on Vista
22:08:26 Nick funky_ is now known as kubrick (
22:08:48GodEater_I'm sure Domonoky and bluebrother will appreciate vista based feedback on their baby
22:09:11GodEater_amiconn: remind me what uac stands for ?
22:09:28amiconnuser account control
22:09:44 Part kubrick
22:10:05amiconnIt means that even if you are logged in with administrative rights, the programs you start are running with restricted rights
22:10:48GodEater_that's the thing I recall about RC1
22:10:53amiconnIf a program tries to access things it would need administrative rights for, vista asks the user whether this is okay
22:10:57GodEater_and apparently all methods to disable require a bloody reboot
22:11:18GodEater_amiconn: only ipodpatcher is not triggering this behaviour
22:11:24GodEater_which we need to find out how to do
22:11:29GodEater_I see
22:11:37amiconnYes. Programs need to be aware of this mechanism in order to trigger it
22:12:00GodEater_otherwise they just get denied, and the user gets no feedback
22:12:34RadishI can't stand vista and I have only used it for a few weeks
22:12:44RadishI will go back to XP when I get my new computer
22:13:00 Quit obo ("bye")
22:13:30GodEater_Radish: quick fix though to get you going :
22:13:41GodEater_but each method WILL require a reboot it seems :(
22:13:49RadishI have already done that, but with the "silent" method
22:13:54Radishwhich doesn't require a reboot
22:13:55GodEater_ah ok
22:14:04Radishrockbox bootloader installed!
22:14:14GodEater_Radish: would you care to document this process on our wiki please ?
22:14:22GodEater_we don't have it written down anywhere
22:14:23Radishit's just the normal process
22:14:40Radishif you are an administrator
22:14:58Radishyou need to click through a few "watch out, this perfectly harmless exe file will tear out your eyes!" warnings though
22:15:22GodEater_Radish: I only ask because you're not the first person to ask this question
22:15:35 Join Entames__ [0] (
22:15:36GodEater_and a lot of the time there's no-one around to even bump users in the right direction
22:15:52Radishand rockbox is installed
22:16:04*GodEater_ waits for the "the default theme SUCKS" comment
22:16:14GodEater_"it's so tiny"
22:16:15Radishthe default theme is nice and minimalistic :D
22:16:22RadishI wouldn't mind trying some alternate ones
22:16:35 Quit Entasis_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:16:35GodEater_thought you might :)
22:16:59Radishwill rockbox sync with itunes like the normal firmware does?
22:17:29GodEater_Radish: first commandment "As an ipod owner, thou shalt not complain about battery life. 'Tis a known issue, and we're praying we can fix it someday soon"
22:17:45GodEater_Radish: you just sync as you always do, and get Rockbox to build it's own database on the DAP
22:17:51Radishpretty cool
22:17:58GodEater_this will index all the stupidly named itunes files
22:18:03Radishcould you recommend me a theme then? :)
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22:18:19GodEater_Pen and Paper is one of my faves
22:18:35GodEater_but I'm currently using one called GlowX or something
22:18:37GodEater_let me check
22:18:54Radishdo I need to go into disk mode to install them?
22:19:08 Nick parafin is now known as parafin|away (
22:19:15GodEater_you either do it manually
22:19:22GodEater_by unzipping them to the iPod drive
22:19:28GodEater_or use RockboxUtility to do it
22:19:32 Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:19:40GodEater_but either way, your ipod needs to be attached to your PC, and therefore in disk mode
22:19:54Radishok :)
22:19:55GodEater_"Theme X Glow" btw
22:19:58GodEater_I was close
22:20:04Radishoh cool rockbox automatically went into disk mode
22:20:31GodEater_and automatically leaves it again when you unmount...
22:20:48 Quit Rondom ("Ex-Chat")
22:21:15Radishthanks for the help guys, my ipod is 100% cooler now
22:21:49GodEater_Radish: please read the manual now :)
22:22:00Radishwill do
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22:30:10Radishhey I can hear the hd whurr when I use rockbox
22:30:13Radishbut not when I use the built in sw
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22:35:00peturRadish: enable dircache
22:35:56 Quit Bagder ("*plopp*")
22:37:55peturwot, no MOOO today? :)
22:38:27RadishI have an embarrasing question
22:38:37Radishhow the [-] do I get out of metronome :p
22:39:21Radishgot it
22:39:24Radishthat wasn't very obvious
22:39:37LloreanThe manual doesn't tell how for that plugin?
22:39:54 Join der-onkel [0] (
22:40:41der-onkelI've a problem with the current svn Version an the iPod 4thG Color
22:41:06der-onkelI get an 40001350 each time i played a 192kbs File
22:42:07 Join Bagder [0] (n=daniel@rockbox/developer/bagder)
22:42:22Bagderman alsa is... painful
22:42:43pixelmader-onkel: when did you last update your bootloader?
22:43:10der-onkelOk long time ago
22:43:44der-onkelI will read the doc for update bootloader
22:43:58pixelmayou probably need to update it, the manual's installing the bootloader instructions apply to updating it too
22:44:19 Quit amiconn (Nick collision from services.)
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22:44:59eigmaamiconn: did you just /nick ghost?
22:46:01amiconnI now have that in my command profile, so it's auto-executed when my connection drops and reestablishes (forced once per day by my provider)
22:46:07 Quit Lars_G (Remote closed the connection)
22:46:12eigmaah, I see
22:46:28eigmaI wasn't sure what the "Nick collision from services." quit message meant - I guess that answer it
22:47:12zethe server (usually) auto-ghosts (and auto-idents) if you provide your nickserv password as the server password on connection
22:47:25Radish"Data abort at 4000130C"
22:47:56***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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22:47:58 Join webguest67 [0] (i=4479f22f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:48:12webguest67How long does it take to build a DB?
22:48:26pixelmader-onkel: and in case you find a rockbox.ipod in the root of your player you should delete it as it is now expected to be inside the .rockbox folder, and it comes this way in the zip
22:48:38pixelmaRadish: you have a 30GB Ipod?
22:48:44*ender` yawns
22:49:06pixelmamaybe you accidentally installed the 60/80GB Ipod build
22:49:18RadishI can't get out of this
22:49:20Radishhelp :(
22:49:41webguest67How long does it take to build a database with songs from Itunes ( less than 500)
22:49:47Radishit's definately the 30gb build
22:49:49pixelmaRadish: the usual reset button combo will work
22:49:55Radishmenu and select?
22:49:57Radishthat doesn't work
22:50:07 Join eigma [0] (
22:50:09Radishoh it does now
22:50:26|Marco|webguest67: depends on the cpu/load and memory
22:50:28Radishhow does the recording thing work? does the ipod have a mic?
22:50:37Bagderdarn, no 3gp video player that groks the audio on my debian box...
22:51:26ThundercloudBagder: Um
22:51:40ThundercloudWorks here
22:51:41BagderCannot find codec 'amr_nb' in libavcodec...
22:51:58Bagdermaybe my phone uses a silly codec
22:52:28 Join linuxstb_ [0] (i=5343d4aa@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
22:52:34Bagderhm, or maybe I can do the win32 codec dance
22:53:05ThundercloudBagder: you got in your apt sources?
22:53:08amiconnamr is a standard audio codec for 3gp
22:53:14BagderThundercloud: nope
22:53:22ThundercloudDo it
22:53:23Radishok, I downloaded a theme and it looked pretty cool in the screenshot, but on my pod I just get the background of the theme and plain white text
22:53:26Bagderamiconn: even more odd then...
22:53:32ThundercloudIt solves every media problem Debian has
22:53:41BagderI never had one before
22:54:21Bagderit doesn't really matter to me if its standard or not
22:54:44linuxstb_Radish: A lot of themes require patched builds - which theme did you try (and where from)?
22:55:01 Join hannesd [0] (
22:55:07Radishit was black glass something or other
22:55:30SoapRadish, that is because a few months ago the WPS (while playing screen) parsing code got a little more strict, and so now broken themes aren't displayed, but rather the default theme is. Either you are using a theme which requires a custom build, or you are using a theme which needs updated.
22:56:00linuxstb_Radish: That requires patches - the download site you got it from should have mentioned that fact..
22:56:07Soapblackglass doesn't require a custom build. jblackglass does. blackglass AA does. Specifics matter.
22:56:36*linuxstb_ lets Soap continue
22:57:30Radishoops, it's the AA one
22:57:51ThundercloudBagder: Seriously, solves everything
22:57:55der-onkelpixelma Thanks it seems to work
22:58:13BagderI guess I'll try that
22:58:33pixelmader-onkel: nice, you're welcome
22:59:38amiconnHmm, looks like putting the manifest into our *patcher.exes in order to make them put an uac request on windows isn't really difficult
22:59:58 Quit Radish ()
23:00:06amiconnwindows vista, that is
23:00:12*Bagder welcomes eigma as committer #56
23:01:02eigmaawwwww *tear*
23:01:37n1swelcome! :-)
23:01:45*bluebrother waves welcome
23:02:08eigmathanks everyone :)
23:05:39 Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.)
23:05:41 Join XavierGr_ [0] (
23:06:14Bagderah, sound... :-)
23:06:24BagderThundercloud: thanks!
23:06:32 Quit linuxstb_ ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:06:42pixelmahuh, why is the png that big? *me goes checking*
23:08:18 Join linuxstb_ [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
23:11:29ThundercloudBagder: :)
23:16:27XavierGr_hmm quite strange that there is a saperate alarm.c file for the alarm while the set time/date function is on settings_menu.c
23:16:54 Quit Febs ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
23:17:12XavierGr_it would be better to unify those, not to mention that the set time/date screen is better that the alarm screen
23:18:50 Join linuxstb__ [0] (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:19:00 Quit linuxstb (Nick collision from services.)
23:19:07amiconnAny vista user around who could test an updated ipodpatcher whether it triggers an uac request?
23:20:00 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (i=5343d4aa@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:20:25 Join coxmaster [0] (i=411e2204@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
23:21:33linuxstbamiconn: How do you embed the manifest?
23:22:54rasherBagder: boo non-free file formats
23:22:55 Join somelittlehobo [0] (
23:23:00amiconnThis is a 'naked' ipodpatcher, i.e. without embedded bootloaders
23:23:18Bagderrasher: stupid phone, yes but my mencoder couldn't transcode it with sound
23:23:31amiconnlinuxstb: It's a very simple thing needing an .rc file and windres, then including it for linking
23:24:15 Quit webguest67 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:24:17 Quit freqmod (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:25:01somelittlehoboanybody have a solution to an ipod not turning on or showing up when connected to a PC?
23:25:11*dionoea submitted a gzip port to the tracker
23:25:13 Join bughunter2 [0] (
23:25:25 Quit coxmaster ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:25:43 Part mokkurkalve
23:25:44linuxstbsomelittlehobo: charge, hold MENU+SELECT, repeat...
23:25:59amiconnMaybe I'll be able to test myself
23:26:02somelittlehobohow long of a charge?
23:26:09*amiconn fires up VPN + RDP
23:26:10somelittlehoboits been plugged into my PC for about 2 hrs
23:26:14Redbrevaamiconn: Both the original and the one linked to above give the same UAC dialog box
23:26:25linuxstbsomelittlehobo: Do you have an AC charger?
23:26:37somelittlehoboi do, but i think my brother took it to college
23:26:41amiconnYOu get an uac dialog without the embedded manifest? Interesting...
23:27:56linuxstbsomelittlehobo: Try holding MENU+SELECT for 30 seconds.
23:28:44Redbrevayes, the only difference is the original actualy asks to patch, the 2nd version detects and exits (I think - it's a bit quick on the screen)
23:29:30somelittlehobonope that didnt work linuxstb
23:29:39amiconnThe 2nd can't ask to patch because there are no embedded bootloaders
23:29:49 Join XavierGr [0] (
23:30:08Redbrevayes, just confirming that I ran to two different versions ;-)
23:30:20Redbrevas/to/two !
23:30:46 Join freqmod [0] (
23:31:20bughunter2hey guys, i have this ipod 80gb here (5.5g?) and when doing ipodpatcher it says it can't find the ipod
23:31:48bughunter2and it says the partition info is incorrect if i manually specify the correct device
23:32:04linuxstbWhat does your partition table look like?
23:32:07bughunter2and i just restored the whole device using iTunes so it must be correct, however when i run fdisk i only see ONE partition
23:32:15bughunter2one big partition
23:32:28linuxstbDoes the Apple firmware start correctly?
23:32:47bughunter2i can use the ipod in itunes
23:32:49bughunter2no problems
23:33:10linuxstbCan you copy and paste the output of ipodpatcher (when you specify the device) to ?
23:33:19bughunter2well it isn't that big
23:33:27bughunter2it just says the ipod partition layout is incorrect
23:33:29bughunter2no info
23:33:52Thundercloudbughunter2: When did you get it?
23:34:03ThundercloudOne of the new ones?
23:34:06bughunter2i just received the ipod today
23:34:09bughunter2i don't know what type
23:34:14bughunter2it ends with Y5N (the serial)
23:34:15ThundercloudiPod Classic?
23:34:23ThundercloudNot supported
23:34:38bughunter2how comes? :(
23:34:41ThundercloudIt's only been released about a week or two
23:34:54ThundercloudGive the devs a chance.
23:34:56bughunter2what's so different on it ?
23:35:00ThundercloudFor the record, the iPod Class is 6G
23:35:05Thundercloudbughunter2: Probably everything
23:35:14bughunter2 if (!silent) fprintf(stderr,"[ERR] Partition layout is not an ipod\n");
23:35:22bughunter2i see this code using google
23:35:28bughunter2and ((ipod->pinfo[1].type != 0xb) && (ipod->pinfo[1].type != 0xc) &&
23:35:34bughunter2that's the IF statement
23:35:35ThundercloudIt obviously uses a completely different format.
23:35:39ThundercloudJobs loves to try and foil us.
23:35:40linuxstbbughunter2: I know, I wrote it...
23:35:42bughunter2so the second partition must be of type 0xc or 0xb
23:35:59bughunter2how can ihelp you guys?
23:36:09somelittlehobois it possible for Rockbox to brick an ipod? or is there atleast some way to fix it?
23:36:11bughunter2shall i dump "fdisks" output of the "p" command?
23:36:30 Quit freqmod (Remote closed the connection)
23:36:46bughunter2i'm not ripping my ipod apart, neither am i going to write code
23:37:36linuxstbsomelittlehobo: No, the MENU+SELECT _always_ works eventually. Either your ipod's battery is completely flat, or you're not pressing those buttons correctly. (or something silly like you have the hold switch on...)
23:37:42 Join hannesd_ [0] (
23:37:55linuxstbbughunter2: Someone will need to, and afaik, no-one is currently working on it.
23:38:08bughunter2too bad
23:38:13ThundercloudToo bad for you then
23:38:27somelittlehobohaha, im not a complete idiot :P hold is off and ive definately pushed the buttons correctly for a long enough time i guess ill just let it charge a few more hours ans see how it goes
23:38:29bughunter2ipodlinux didn't work either because the installer doesn't support my ipod yet
23:38:38bughunter2probably all boils down to the partition stuff
23:38:42ThundercloudAnd probably won't for a while longer as well.
23:39:32linuxstbbughunter2: The installer is the easy part - neither Rockbox or IPL will run on the new ipods as a) the firmware is encrypted; b) The hardware is completely different. It's like trying to install Windows on your ipod...
23:40:04bughunter2linuxstb, would it be possible if i'd just setup some partition table and make sure that partition 2 is always of type 0xb
23:40:21delYsidnope :-)
23:40:24bughunter2to make ipodpatcher work?
23:40:27bughunter2well, why not?
23:41:25 Join BjoernErik [0] (
23:41:30 Quit XavierGr_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:42:18dionoeabughunter2: making ipodpatcher work without having code to run for that target (or even knowing how to make code run on the target) doesn't sound very usefull.
23:42:24rasherbughunter2: It's fundamentally different hardware. Like trying to install Linux on your SNES.
23:42:44bughunter2hmm? no ARM anymore?
23:43:01BigBambiIt isn't just about that
23:43:15rasherIt's still ARM, but that's about it, and that doesn't get you far.
23:43:26bughunter2what type is my ipod now btw?
23:43:32bughunter25.5g ? 6g? 1000g?
23:43:37 Join Rudy4Pez [0] (
23:43:40BigBambiIt's like pouring water in your fridge and wondering why you don't get tea. They both run on electricity but that is it
23:44:07bughunter2yes but because of what parts? encryption stuff?
23:44:19bughunter2the way the device boots?
23:44:23bughunter2what is the problem
23:44:27dionoeaencryption stuff + brand new hardware
23:44:28bughunter2or does nobody know yet
23:44:30ThundercloudWell if we knew that we'd be one step forward.
23:44:38Rudy4PezDid I just miss an awesome analogy about 5g and 6g iPod? :)
23:44:39BigBambiI refer you to linuxstb's answer about ten lines ago
23:44:46bughunter2why is Apple doing this, it's silly
23:44:50dionoeaRudy4Pez: exactly :)
23:44:50*BigBambi bows
23:44:56Rudy4PezHahaha, nice.
23:45:05bughunter2the'd make more money if they'd support the community a bit, so why not?
23:45:13Thundercloudbughunter2: Not really.
23:45:23bughunter2they're afraid some evil company is going to take away your guys source code and say "we start a new company on top of this" or wtf
23:45:30ThundercloudThe amount of money they'd gain from people who wanted to run rockbox on their ipods is negligible compared to their overall revenue.
23:45:45bughunter2so why don't they want users to run rockbox/iPL
23:45:54bughunter2just to make it harder for us? for kicks?
23:45:55Thundercloudbughunter2: Read the GPL please, a company can't steal Rockbox's code.
23:46:11bughunter2yes i know, but they can however use it
23:46:15Thundercloudbughunter2: What possible reason could there be?
23:46:17bughunter2i didn't mean real "stealing"
23:46:17ThundercloudThink about it
23:46:27bughunter2DRM ?
23:46:32ThundercloudNot necessarily DRM
23:46:35ThundercloudJust iTunes in general.
23:46:40bughunter2they want users to use iTunes?
23:46:47bughunter2why for god sake, it's a slow crappy program
23:46:55bughunter2it only looks nice
23:46:57ThundercloudBut it's their slow crappy program
23:47:02ThundercloudWith a fully integrated store
23:47:06ThundercloudEnticing people to spend more money.
23:47:11rasherbughunter2: I doubt they care about ipl or Rockbox. They care about their precious DRM stuff. This is probably the reason for the encryption. Picking new hardware is just how things go - nothing particularly nefarious about that.
23:47:11 Quit Bjoern-Erik (Success)
23:47:14 Part somelittlehobo
23:47:27bughunter2yeah immediately after i opened it asked me to enter my country so it could take me to the store, i mean wtf!
23:47:29Thundercloudrasher: Oh come on, Apple's starting to get better wrt. DRM, you can get non-DRMed songs off iTunes now.
23:47:32bughunter2like "buy it you slave"
23:47:36Thundercloudbughunter2: :D
23:47:52ThundercloudWhich is why I find it so funny the gtkpod team have already cracked apple's new encryption
23:48:02 Quit SirFunk (Connection timed out)
23:48:08ThundercloudNow all we need is for them to put it into libgpod
23:48:19bughunter2i mean i'd like to help, but i want to be able to use my iPod :P
23:48:23rasherThundercloud: I'm not really impressed by that. I've been able to buy non-DRM (but watermarked) mp3s for years from my "local" web-store.
23:48:24ThundercloudAnd the ipod nano i'm getting free with the macbook i'm buying will work like a charm on amarok :D
23:48:32 Join SirFunk [0] (
23:48:35Thundercloudrasher: Heh, "local"
23:48:44rasherAnyway, offtopic..
23:48:48ThundercloudIndeed offtopic
23:48:54Rudy4PezSo I'm pretty sure I can answer my own question but heck, I'll just throw it out there... Is there any way to change your username on the Rockbox forums?
23:48:55ThundercloudBut one last point though, iTunes is used by millions of people.
23:49:05ThundercloudMillions of people with access to non-DRMed tunes is a huge step forward.
23:49:15ThundercloudNow we just have to educate them as to why it's worth the extra $.30 a song
23:49:22linuxstbYes, a huge step forward to 1982...
23:49:30bughunter2what happened back in 1982
23:49:32Thundercloudlinuxstb: I'm not denying that :)
23:49:42ThundercloudI personally just buy CDs and rip 'em to FLAC
23:49:46dionoeaRudy4Pez: you can change the displayed name (not the one you use to login, but the one printed on the pages)
23:49:54bughunter2offtopic, what's so good about FLAC?
23:49:54linuxstbbughunter2: I'm guessing that's around the time CDs were launched.
23:50:01bughunter2oh yes you're right
23:50:04dionoeaRudy4Pez: in Profile->Modify profile->Account related settings
23:50:11ThundercloudSee, I managed to convince even my DAD that DRM is wrong
23:50:21ThundercloudAnd my dad can barely use a computer.
23:50:58bughunter2man im somewhat dissapointed, i wanted to run linux/rockbox :)
23:51:15 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:51:20bughunter2at least i have this 80gb's left to fill up :P
23:51:34bughunter2and my older iriver h340se's battery stopped working correctly :(
23:51:34ThundercloudI have a 4GB flash player, suits me fine.
23:51:38bughunter2that's why i had to buy the ipod
23:51:44bughunter2"had to" :P
23:51:49ThundercloudOut of my 20GB of music I only really listen to 3GB of it or so.
23:52:06bughunter2i like to have an identical copy of my music which i have on my PC on my player
23:52:12bughunter2and a few backups
23:52:22 Quit hannesd (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:52:23 Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (
23:52:26bughunter2the battery of the iriver is really crappy for some reason, i had like 3 of those h340se thingies
23:52:43Thundercloudbughunter2: I used to be like that, then I decided to ditch the bricks and get with the flash :) Used to run rockbox on an iAudio X5. Still have it.
23:53:04bughunter2fully charged it, and sometimes it thinks that it's completely empty, so it shuts down the device :(
23:53:23 Nick Rudy4Pez is now known as Isolinear (
23:53:54IsolinearNow... If only I could do the same with XBScene... lol
23:54:57bughunter2but hey, if the community of iPL/rockbox is so small, why the heck care in the first place about them? (from Apple's pov)
23:55:35rasherbughunter2: This is still offtopic...
23:55:38preglowyou can't really compare the ipl and rockbox communities, if you ask me
23:56:09bughunter2hmm, why is that? rasher: sorry i'm gone soon..;)
23:56:09preglowipl seems dead to me anyway
23:56:10 Join Radish [0] (
23:56:14bughunter2it is?
23:56:17Radishumm help I think I have broken my ipod
23:56:24Radishit was working fine with rockbox
23:56:30Radishbut I went to turn it on, and it just won't switch on
23:56:36preglowlast commit seems to be 17th of may...
23:56:43bughunter2'06 ?
23:56:52preglow07, probably
23:56:55preglowbut still
23:57:04Radishman I am so worried
23:57:10preglowRadish: don't be
23:57:10linuxstbpreglow: I think that's just because their svn server is down - I've heard talk of moving to a new one.
23:57:18preglowlinuxstb: is that so
23:57:36bughunter2yes they state "Note: SVN is currently down. To get the latest source code please read here."
23:57:37pixelmarockbox commits today: 30
23:57:38preglowRadish: nothing happens when you try to switch it on?
23:57:42Radishnothing at all
23:57:50IsolinearHold switch? lol
23:57:51preglowRadish: ok, press menu and select at the same time, and hold them
23:58:00preglowat least ten seconds, see if something happens
23:58:07preglowif not, try recharging
23:58:11Radishyes I see an apple
23:58:13 Join lee-qid_ [0] (
23:58:16Radishand rockbox has booted
23:58:19Radishthanks so much *relief!*
23:58:28linuxstbAlso, IPL development seems to be very fragmented (in terms of apps) - not everything seems to happen in the main svn.
23:58:34 Quit Radish (Client Quit)
23:58:46 Quit kubiix ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
23:58:53bughunter2maybe they're trying to use SVN as if it's git

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