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#rockbox log for 2007-09-24

00:12:55 Join Febs [0] (
00:17:53 Part Redbreva
00:20:20amiconnAh, the C200 lcd controller seems to be a samsung or samsung compatible...
00:22:21*amiconn found an lcd module datasheet showing almost an exact same init sequence as the C200 driver
00:22:30amiconnUnfortunately there is no command listing
00:24:47 Join My_Sic [0] (
00:26:38maxkelleywhat were you trying to accomplish?
00:27:50 Quit kclaf (Connection reset by peer)
00:28:21amiconnFind out what lcd controller is in there, so that we can implement things the OF doesn't do
00:28:28amiconn(like the flip mode)
00:28:47amiconnIt's definitely Samsung S6B33, and I found the datasheet :)
00:29:11 Join kclaf [0] (i=kclaf@
00:32:38 Quit seablue ("life, death, life, death")
00:38:27 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
00:42:05 Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
00:43:02 Quit obo ("bye")
00:43:22markunamiconn: wow, how do you find these things out.. did you ever take a look at the Gigabeat LCD init?
00:44:35amiconnTrying to guess the controller's display capabilities from the lcd resolution and some hints from the init sequence, then google for datasheets of potentially controllers, and try to match the init sequence
00:45:12amiconnIn this case, the lcd is 132x80, and the init puts the display window at (0,26) - that's a strong hint the controller is 132x132
00:45:23amiconn(80+2*26 = 132)
00:45:23 Quit ender` (" BOFH excuse #53: Little hamster in running wheel had coronary; waiting for replacement to be Fedexed from Wyoming")
00:45:51amiconnThe S6B33 is actually *not* 132x132 - that's why my search took quite long
00:47:40*Bagder drops the bomb
00:49:13daurn|laptopwhat res was it?
00:49:27 Quit nls ()
00:49:49amiconnThe B2 variant (smallest matching) is 132x162, but its default setting is for 132x132
00:50:08peturany objections if H10 keyboard action ABORT is changed from FF to POWER ?
00:50:32 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
00:51:46amiconnmarkun: Yes, I once took a look at the gigabeat lcd init. That is one complex monster... didn't find a matching datasheet
00:52:49*amiconn admits that he is less interested in the gigabeat
00:54:22 Join JdGordon [0] (
00:54:57 Quit mirak (Remote closed the connection)
00:55:09amiconnBagder: Did you notice the occasional missing builds today?
00:55:25Bagdernope, I've not been around much today
00:55:30markunamiconn: I guess I should read it like this, right?
00:56:27 Join midgey [0] (
00:57:21 Quit Entasis_ ("Leaving")
00:57:34amiconnAh, that table contains the actual commands.... a lot of commands just for init
00:58:55amiconnLooks like 0 indicates command, 1 indicates data, with the following byte being the command/data value
00:59:48markunthat's why I wrote it like this
01:01:25Bagderlinuxstb: c200 bootloader is now on the server
01:01:46amiconnBagder: There are 'holes' in the build table, I wonder why....
01:02:16linuxstbBagder: Thanks. Could you delete the sansapatcher in the c200 directory? There's now the combined sansapatcher there.
01:02:48Bagderit already is deleted
01:03:02Bagdernow that or those servers not deleting gets a bit annoying...
01:05:27*Bagder goes to bed
01:05:42 Join dandin1 [0] (
01:07:40***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:15:54JdGordon*groan* morning guys
01:16:09*JdGordon hates mondays :(
01:17:34JdGordonhey kkurbjun, anything exciting to report?
01:18:27kkurbjunwell I just made anew commit
01:18:47kkurbjunit has the working interrupts, which is good, but now I'm stuck on ata
01:18:54kkurbjunwell, not stuck
01:19:17kkurbjunbut it didn't just automatically start working :)
01:19:41 Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
01:19:47JdGordonhehe, dont you hate when that happens :)
01:20:37 Join linuxstb__ [0] (
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01:21:20 Quit linuxstb_ (Nick collision from services.)
01:21:24jhMikeSpetur: sort of
01:23:04peturjhMikeS: in pcm_record, is CHUNKF_ERROR used for all kinds of errors?
01:24:43peturand would it be ok to use pcmrec_end_file i.s.o. pcmrec_close_file ? so the header can get written?
01:25:07 Part kkurbjun
01:25:12 Join kkurbjun [0] (
01:25:50jhMikeSummm...hmmm...iirc that condition should probably hop over that.
01:26:37amiconnThe C200 LCD controller is obviously either an S6B33 *variant*, or the datasheet forgot to mention a bit
01:27:16peturjhMikeS: I'm looking at a more gracefull recording shutdown. One is an issue in recording.c, the other is about leaving a usable file behind
01:27:48peturjhMikeS: but I'm off to bed real soon so no hurry ;)
01:29:12jhMikeSpetur: ok. I think some little tweaks might be nescessary or other dangers could creep in from such a change.
01:29:57 Join courtc [0] (
01:30:31peturright, I'lll have to study that code a bit more then. It's all a bit complex in there :/
01:30:59jhMikeSIt is, I know. But I did as little as could to implement the features people wanted.
01:31:46 Nick advcomp2019_ is now known as advcomp2019 (n=advcomp2@
01:34:25 Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:34:39saratogawow, how long have we had an actual TI port in progress for ?
01:34:43ddaltonhow can I tell how many items are in the file borwser?
01:35:27maxkelleyis sansapatcher needed for the c200?
01:36:02maxkelleyddalton: 1..2...3... :)
01:36:09ddaltonwith code?
01:37:35maxkelleywill decreasing the brightness setting conserve battery life? It's unbelievable how much battery backlights waste.
01:38:33jhMikeSamiconn: I did some swp(b) checks on pp5020 and there doesn't seem to be anything wrong with it. When it "locks" afaik it's not really locked. FIQ will continue to operate until the buffer empties out. Something else is amiss. Some errors that can come up with disk access like not being able to read resume info after setting the clock to 80MHz give me pause.
01:40:40peturmaxkelley: I think you answered your own question
01:40:45maxkelleyare we able to control the c200's button backlight? it's always on, wasting battery.
01:41:20maxkelleypetur: I was wondering if the brightness setting altered the brightness of the backlight or the screen.
01:41:23pixelmanot yet but on the e200 they do - I hope for it too
01:41:50maxkelleylike allow more light though or less light, while still having the backlight at the same brightness.
01:42:29linuxstbmaxkelley: sansapatcher isn't strictly needed, but it's the recommended way to install (because it keeps the OF in the firmware partition, rather than requiring it as a file on the FAT partition).
01:42:47maxkelleyah, ok.
01:43:27pixelmamaxkelley: I read the logs a bit - in now yesterday's I read theat Zagor was trying some things with the buttonlight on the c200
01:43:49maxkelleyis it just a matter of finding which gpio port?
01:44:12ddaltonanyone here familiar with the file browser code?
01:44:21maxkelleyapparently, on the e200, it's port 7, from what i can see.
01:44:31maxkelleyoh, wait.
01:44:35maxkelleyGPIOG, port 7
01:45:57ddaltonpixelma: do you know about buttons?
01:46:14ddaltonor petur?
01:46:38 Join webguest38 [0] (i=424322b3@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:46:49webguest38hey can anyone help me?
01:47:21ddaltonwebguest38: what?
01:47:25pixelmawebguest38: we don't know beecause we don't know the question...
01:48:11webguest38i can't get rockbox to using a 4g 20gb ipod...i've tried everything
01:48:19maxkelleypixelma: I forgot entirely about the two leds..
01:48:35scorchewebguest38: well, what is it doing?
01:48:36maxkelleywhen the c200 boots, the button lights come on before the menu/power light.
01:48:57maxkelleyI'll have to talk to zagor.
01:49:09maxkelleyanyhow, I'm gonna have food.
01:49:16maxkelleyI'll be back in a bit.
01:50:08 Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
01:50:26ddaltonwhat code is executed when a charger is plugged in?
01:50:35ddaltonso just when you plug it in
01:50:37webguest38i can turn it off but when i try menu+select it does nothing...ive held it for like a minute numerous times..i've also tried turning the hold on and then off and trying it..nothing
01:51:15linuxstbwebguest38: So what do you see on your ipod's screen when you turn it on?
01:52:22saratogawow, the MPC people finally put out a beta for SV8
01:52:32saratogai wonder how hard that will be to support in rockbox
01:53:08webguest38the only way it will turn on is if i plug it into the charger
01:54:16 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
01:55:32 Quit Bagder (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:55:36linuxstbwebguest38: OK, but what does the screen show?
01:58:38 Quit webguest38 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
02:01:15ddaltonlinuxstb: Do you know about the playback code?
02:01:46linuxstbI know it's in playback.c, but that's about all...
02:02:52 Join BigMac [0] (
02:02:58ddaltonlinuxstb: ok do you think I should have ago at fixing the paused playback issue with voice? If so should I do a quick fix which would be to stop playback if you pause it with talk menus on otherwise it would behave as normal
02:04:33ddaltonwebguest38: so it will boot rockbox if you plug it in?
02:04:49scorche*** webguest38 quit ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
02:05:37saratogawhy is there a "charge during USB connection" option on the gigabeat?
02:05:53saratogais there really a reason someone might want to change that?
02:05:56ddaltonok so how do I pause playback on the sim?
02:06:40amiconnsaratoga: Yes, e.g. if the port isn't capable of delivering enough power (passive hub, some laptops) and would shut down otherwise
02:07:32ddaltonwho uses voice here?
02:08:12 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
02:09:01daurn|laptopi occasionally speak
02:09:13daurn|laptopgive the vocal chords a workout, you know?
02:09:38 Quit gromit` (Remote closed the connection)
02:10:51ddaltoncan someone tell me the difference between "stop playback" and "pause playback" they both resume from the same spot they were stopped at or paused at.
02:13:26 Quit midgey ()
02:14:49amiconn"Pause" just pauses. It stays in the WPS and keeps the already buffered music
02:15:51amiconn"Stop" exits to the browser and flushes the buffer
02:16:14ddaltonamiconn: I don't have the skills to rewrite the playback code and I don't really want to. So do you think a quick fix could be just stop playback if voice menus is on. Or if not what needs to be done to get voice working when playback is paused
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02:17:39ddaltonamiconn: what are the key maps for the sim?
02:17:49ddaltonwhat button is play?
02:19:06 Join Mack|IRC [0] (n=mackenzi@
02:19:21Mack|IRCrockbox as in the game thing you install on your ipod?
02:19:50 Part Mack|IRC
02:21:26ddaltonhmmm my fix works good here apart from leaving the wps
02:21:55ddaltonis there some way we can return to the wps with out starting playback?
02:22:08amiconnThat's why there is pause
02:22:31ddaltonso there is nothing I can use in the pause function to achieve this?
02:23:12*ddalton opens playback.c
02:23:43ddaltonamiconn: can we tell if the voice is talking when playback is paused?
02:28:04 Part pixelma
02:29:09ddaltonamiconn: around?
02:30:03 Quit jhulst (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
02:39:27 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC")
02:40:54ddaltonwhat happens if you pause playback and then press stop?
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03:07:42***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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03:22:20 Part kkurbjun
03:25:54maxkelleyddalton: it stops.
03:26:13ddaltonmaxkelley: where do you end up what screen?
03:26:29maxkelleyhome screen
03:26:43ddaltonwhat's "home screen"?
03:27:12maxkelleyI believe whatever you set it to be, by default the rockbox menu (files, database..)
03:27:33ddaltonok so my quick fix won't work
03:27:45maxkelleywhat is it?
03:29:10ddaltonas you might know voice can't talk when playback is paused. It can however when playback is stopped. So my fix was going to be: -pause playback -stop playback -return to wps and then the voice would be able to talk
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03:52:25BiptoNhey fellas
03:52:51BiptoNi noticed some posts from linus in the irc chats about RB on a microtrack
03:53:03BiptoNwas that ever pursued?
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03:58:29 Join velixzeen [0] (n=velixzee@
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04:02:45velixzeenhello, what is the best way to get my e280 sansa working again? Dual boot fails, original firmware won't boot.
04:05:43velixzeenHave read the thread on the forum about the e260, but could not locate the v0.20 sansapather
04:14:19krazykitvelixzeen, follow the recovery procedure on the wiki to restore your device to it's original state. do both the bootloader and firmware (manufacturer mode and the other one)
04:14:32krazykitthen read the thread again and find that sansapatcher.
04:14:49 Quit hannesd_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
04:14:56velixzeenhello krazykit, thanks
04:15:20velixzeenwill go to wiki now and read there.
04:15:39 Join hannesd_ [0] (
04:15:43krazykitremember to follow the directions exactly, too. this procedure definitely works, as i've walked a user through it the other night
04:16:19velixzeenahhh nice, it is tested ;-)
04:17:15velixzeenjust got the e280 today, listened to it for 30seconds, with original firmware, and then put rockbox on
04:17:35velixzeenso feeling a little sheepish right now.
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04:32:19velixzeenkrazykit: Looks like I need to put the old mi4 file on, then reboot it, and it will reinstall the firmware to original state. Am I on the right track?
04:32:53krazykitvelixzeen, well, you need to put in the original bootloader first, too
04:36:53 Join Leumas64 [0] (
04:37:14velixzeenOk. I am looking at instructions under "Recovery Mode" on
04:37:32Leumas64Has anyone else had problems with rockboxes way to get rid of .sat encryption? I'm not able to do it
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04:40:21 Join Leumas64 [0] (
04:43:46velixzeenkrazykit: Does not matter which order I do it? Firmware then bootloader?
04:43:53Leumas64Does anyone know how to transfer files from the gigabeat to your computer without the .sat encryption? I tried rockboxes way of doing that but it didnt work, all i was able to access was the hard drive but when i copied and pasted it, it only copied the folder and none of the songs.
04:44:43alienbiker99that sounds more like a computer problem than a rockbox one, Leumas64
04:44:45krazykitvelixzeen, bootloader first. after it's in manufacturing mode, it goes to recovery mode
04:45:36Leumas64any ideas appreciated, im all out.
04:47:04krazykitLeumas64, the only way is the one on the wiki, as far as i know
04:47:26Leumas64Ok, thanks
04:47:32krazykitLeumas64, is it in "windows media player" mode?
04:48:16Leumas64Yeah, when i do WMP mode it comes up in "My Computer" as an Audio device, and in gigabeat room mode, it comes up as an extra hard drive
04:48:39krazykityou've gone throught it exactly in the wiki?
04:49:01Leumas64Pretty darn sure
04:49:23alienbiker99erggg refreshing database takes soo long on the of =\
04:49:38krazykiti can't do much troubleshooting, sorry, as i've never used the gigabeat's original firmware
04:49:48Leumas64if i look at the properties of the folder on the audio device(Gigabeat) it says that the files can only be copied if its not connected to a PC
04:49:59krazykityou're going through the cradle
04:50:23Leumas64if it makes a difference, im using 2.02 firmware
04:51:07krazykiti don't really know; i'd just double check your settings and such
04:51:48Leumas64Ok, ill try tinkering with it some more
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04:53:21jac0bhas anyone here had problems install cygwin on vista?
04:54:16rvvs89Why don't you ask in #cygwin?
04:57:15Leumas64Hmm, My Gigabeat is Failing to start as a portable device, "This device cannot start"(code 10) Anyone know how to fix this?
04:57:24velixzeenkrazykit: I am not sure how to get to manufacturing mode. I saw recover mode, now I get LUN0 locked then LUN0 unlocked repeated on the screen.
04:57:52krazykityeah, i think that's normal, velixzeen
04:57:53 Quit RoC_MasterMind ("Leaving")
04:58:19velixzeenoh, good.
04:58:22krazykitassuming, you followed the directions, it ought to show up as a drive now
04:58:51velixzeendmesg sees sda, so here's hoping
04:59:03 Quit jac0b ()
04:59:55krazykitvelixzeen, oh, maybe not recovery mode. e200tool at this point
05:00:46*krazykit should've opened the directions
05:03:09velixzeenkrazykit: I cannot mount the device, at least not as I was before flashing with rockbox.
05:03:31velixzeendoes e200tool need the device to be mounted?
05:03:42scorcheyou cant mount in manufacturing mode
05:03:49scorcheand you dont need to
05:04:00velixzeenok good
05:04:06velixzeenthanks scorche
05:06:01velixzeenhmmm, I think I'm in trouble here, e200tool command failed to find any device
05:06:24scorcheare you in manufacturing mode?
05:07:08velixzeenI don't believe I am, it just keeps printing LUN0 locked then LUN0 unlocked to the screen of the e280
05:07:33scorchethat is recovery mode...not manufacturing
05:07:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
05:08:27 Quit Leumas64 ()
05:12:28 Quit BiptoN ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
05:12:47velixzeenscorche: ok so what is the method for getting into manufacturing mode? Sorry to ask, but I am not finding this yet on forum.
05:13:18scorcheyou shouldnt be looking at a forum
05:13:25scorcheyou should be looking at a wikipage
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05:20:28 Join Leumas64 [0] (
05:23:59velixzeenWell, I see nothing about how to get into manufacture mode. The wiki page just says to enter it. The e280 is not asking me if I want that mode. I am at a loss here.
05:25:15Leumas64When following the .sat Wiki on how to recover your music files, do you need wmp 10 and gigaroom installed?
05:27:28 Quit bb_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
05:27:36velixzeenCan anyone tell me how to get the e280 into manufacture mode?
05:27:44krazykitvelixzeen, yeah, it's on a different page, actually. i'll add those to that one when i get time, but for now:
05:27:48krazykitread step two
05:28:04krazykityou need the regular e200 bootloader from step one
05:29:39velixzeenthanks for the page krazykit
05:31:47ddaltoncan someone see what I am doing wrong here?
05:32:35alienbiker99hmmm i keep getting this database not ready error but the database is fine. its on my e350, but ill try a daily build when i can.
05:34:39ddaltonis anyone looking at my patch?
05:35:19krazykitddalton, i looked, but my C skills are pretty much abysmal, sorry
05:36:56ddaltonkrazykit: ok but was there anything wrong with the variables? It was saying all the variables like UNIT_MUSICFILES weren't declared.
05:37:46krazykitmate, i don't even remember how to declare variables
05:37:57ddaltono ok then
05:39:40krazykitbut if it's like the variable declared in talk.c before the stuff you added, it doesn't look blatantly incorrect.
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05:52:59 Quit Leumas64 ()
05:53:07alienbiker99currently there is no way to display the wps sideways correct? sideways as in turn the screen 90 degrees. e.g. turn the sansa so its "widescreen" mode
05:53:56krazykitthere's a patch for the gigabeat that does that, i imagine you could adapt it for the sansa
05:54:17krazykitbut you can't switch between landscape and portait on the fly, you need seperate builds
05:54:24alienbiker99oh ok thanks
05:54:29krazykitand a special bootloader
06:00:51alienbiker99hm, do you know if viewports is still being worked on?
06:01:51krazykiti wasn't aware that somebody was actively coding in the first place
06:02:29alienbiker99oh ok, i really didn't know too much cept for the little bit i read on te wiki
06:04:00*ddalton gives up!
06:05:54 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
06:06:31 Quit james_malone ("I was using BOFHNet IRC version 1.2 by fmillion - get your copy today from !")
06:10:37velixzeenkrazykit: I got throught writing the BL file to the e280
06:12:23velixzeenI cannot copy the mi4 file to it. The partition table is messed up and /dev/sda1 does not exist
06:12:42velixzeenI cannot mount /dev/sda1
06:13:02velixzeenI have the unit in recovery mode
06:16:16krazykitis dmesg saying anything particularly bad?
06:16:35krazykitand so, does it not work without redoing the firmware part itself?
06:17:01velixzeenyes, dmesg is saying: sda: unknown partition table
06:17:43velixzeenrockbox still boots though
06:17:57krazykitrockbox shouldn't boot though
06:18:06krazykityou installed the original bootloader...
06:18:11velixzeenI thought so,
06:18:43velixzeenThis makes no sense
06:19:52krazykitunfortunately, i can't help anymore this evening. i've got a paper to write before morning, 9 hours away. good luck, though! between the wiki pages and the forums, you probably should be able to get it
06:20:23velixzeenIt wrote the rom file. I did that twice.
06:20:54velixzeengood luck on the paper
06:20:59velixzeenthanks for the help
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06:28:59 Join corevette [0] (
06:29:04corevettewhat is a battery bench
06:29:19ddaltonit is in the manual
06:29:28ddaltonit tests your battery though
06:29:32ddaltonhow long it goes for
06:29:49scorcheamoing other things..
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06:41:44ddaltonshould requests for new ports be made in teh tracker? I am guessing no
06:42:02ddaltonthe tracker
06:42:05krazykityou don't request new ports, you start a thread and start working on them, typically
06:42:11scorchenew ports arent requested
06:42:30ddaltonok then because someone requested one I will comment
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06:44:47ddaltonok go to p7823 and you will see what I am talking about. Is my comment ok?
06:46:00scorchewell, i dont really see a need to will be closed soon enough
06:46:26ddaltono well its there and only took me 10 seconds to type :-)
06:47:21krazykit7824 as well. this person seems to have opened two bugs for it.
06:47:41*ddalton won't comment on that one :-)
06:48:03joecooloh shit i'm on fire
06:48:24joecoolsorry, wrong channel
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06:49:22*rvvs89 is wondering
06:49:39rvvs89Does Rockbox have scroll-wheel acceleration on its iPod build?
06:49:59joecoolat least not anywhere on the menus
06:50:18joecool..... possibly hidden though, but still takes a year and a day to get through artists on my ipod
06:50:34rvvs89Well, I seem to remember the Sansa build has acceleration
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06:51:06joecoolrvvs89: well the ipod isn't a sansa now is it :P
06:51:29joecooli don't think they have it at least for the 5/5.5G because of screen refresh issues
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07:04:37ddaltonany devs around?
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07:20:36JdGordonddalton: you should no by now... almost no devs are online before 6pm our time
07:21:14ddaltonJdGordon your on
07:21:27ddaltonwhat there all asleep?
07:21:41JdGordonthey are in gmt +0/+1
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07:25:08ddaltonJdGordon: Ok I want to try this button thing one more time.
07:25:12ddaltonwhat should I do first?
07:25:37ddaltonI want a long press to call a certain function I will write and a short press to go to the fm radio
07:26:14JdGordoni have no idea what your talking about... and im busy atm
07:26:58ddaltonwell I want to make a long press run a function I will write and a short press to go to the radio
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08:52:30Eberti think my gigabeat is having memory allocation problems
08:52:53markunwhat makes you think that?
08:53:39Ebertthe clock goes blank after a while, rockboy plugin now reads "not enough memory"
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08:54:38eikihi all
08:55:11markunEbert: weird problem
08:55:15markunno idea what it could be
08:55:32Eberthm, and the clock is back now, with accurate time
08:55:40B4gderthe clock goes blank ? what clock?
08:55:57B4gderin the status bar?
08:56:01Eberttop left corner
08:56:07markunEbert: but I think the rockboy problem is a problem with the amount of memory the plugin reserves
08:56:08Ebertahem right corner
08:56:38B4gderI don't these your both problems are related
08:56:40markunEbert: does it happen with any ROM or just one?
08:56:42Ebertyes markun, i didn't think the 2 were related, just checking
08:56:44eikisay, I got a lil question. I've been considering buying a mp3 player. Im checking for that new 160gig ipod (I know its not supported yet, but eventually), but I'm not totally into using itunes and such for managing my existing music library and copying files on the ipod. would having rockbox just let me drag'n'drop my mp3/ogg files into the ipod through usb like any other usb drive?
08:56:47Ebertany markun
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08:57:19B4gdereiki: there's a risk the 160gb one never will be supported
08:57:25eikihow so?
08:57:26scorcheeiki: it would, but dont hold your breath waiting for a port, unless you plan on having a go at it yourself
08:57:40B4gdereiki: 1 - nobody works on it 2 - it is encrypted badly
08:57:53GodEateror rather 2) it is encrypted well
08:57:57*scorche wishes it was encrypted badly...
08:58:04B4gderdepends on your viewpoint ;-)
08:58:10markunEbert: but if it would be supported then rockbox would make it a normal UMS device where you can drag your ogg vorbis files to.
08:58:37eikiok. thing is, Im just trying to find a nice hdd mp3 player where my music collection can fit in... altho I'm way not into all the DRM stuff that comes with itunes n' co.. too bad there's not, to my knowledge, a more "open" alternative with that much storage.
08:58:59eikiI though the checksum thing got cracked by the gtkpod crew
08:59:11B4gderopenness vs lots of storage...
08:59:20scorchethat isnt the encryption we are talking about
08:59:21Ebertare there any other big memory allocation problems running around that someone knows of?
08:59:27B4gdereiki: the itunes db cecksum is not the firmware encryption
08:59:31eikiscorche: ok
08:59:35B4gderEbert: no
08:59:45scorchewell, if you are looking for just an mp3 player, you could get an archos recorder...i have a 160 gig hard drive in mine
08:59:59eikiB4gder: yeah, wish I could find a 80g (or more) alternative...
09:00:18B4gdereiki: the ipod video 5.5g ...
09:00:51markuntoo bad these drive's are difficult to buy separately and are so expensive
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09:01:08markuna Gigabeat X20 upgraded to 80GB for example would be really nice
09:01:37Ebertif you can find an x20 heh
09:01:46 Join LinusN [0] (i=linus@rockbox/developer/LinusN)
09:01:47markunor else maybe a F10
09:01:59Ebertare there hd's thin enough?
09:03:10markunthere are 2 sizes of the HDD's:
09:03:10eikithe gigabeat website only talks about the U serie
09:03:26markuneiki: the F and X have been discontinued
09:03:41markun(maybe even the S if you can't find it)
09:03:51eikioh I see..seems like most compagnies are just doing flash memory models now
09:04:04B4gderyeah :-/
09:05:03eikibut is there any nice "open" model with 40g of storage or so availible anywhere?
09:05:40eikicause as for a flash mp3 player, I already have my cellphone, Im more looking of one that I could fit most of my library to bring on long trips
09:06:37markuneiki: maybe the iaudio X5 with a 60GB hdd
09:07:38B4gdersomeone should add c200 to that page...
09:07:38eikiyeah, looking at these right now (thanks badger for that buyersguide link!)
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09:10:17eikithe iriver looks nice
09:10:40markunwhich one?
09:10:54eikieither h100 or h300
09:11:50markunI stopped using my h120 now that I have my Gigabeat F40
09:11:53eikiI could order one from ebay, since canadian dollar is now rock high compared to USD, that might be a good time to buy one
09:12:11eikih120 = h100, 20g?
09:12:55B4gderwell, strictly speaking there was a h100 once which isn't exactly the h120...
09:13:12B4gderjust pointing it out
09:13:21eikihumm.. that f40 look nice, let me check it out :D
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09:13:57eikihymmm yeah, looks really nice
09:14:40eikioh and there is a 60g model... even better
09:14:53*amiconn would prefer the H1x0 over the gigabeat any day
09:15:00eikihow so?
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09:15:03markuneiki: it's the most 'powerful' player in terms of CPU power, but lacks radio and recording
09:15:06amiconnIt has a few features the gigabeat doesn't have
09:15:15markunand the screen is not visible with the backlight off
09:15:15GodEaterand lacks a colour lcd screen :)
09:15:18amiconndigital input/output, and radio
09:15:56eikiwhat do you mean by digital input/output?
09:16:22eikiso better sound quality for earphones?
09:17:00amiconnNothing to do with earphones
09:17:31markunmaybe if you have a portable amplifier with a built-in DAC
09:18:07eikiok.. so basicly Id have to check between gigabeat f40 (60g), iriver h140 and h340
09:18:24amiconnThe gigabeat might be better if you're interested in video (I still don't understand why toshiba sells/sold it as a dap)
09:18:50amiconndigital audio player
09:18:50markundigital audio player
09:18:53LinusNdigital audio player
09:18:55markunhah ;)
09:18:59eiki<- newb :P
09:19:04amiconnecho... cho
09:19:21markunmorning LinusN
09:19:36eikiso, Id have to compare these 3 models.. h340 just look like a 140 with color screen and different casing
09:20:07LinusNmy favourite among those 3 would be the 140
09:20:21eikiwhy 140 over 340?
09:21:05LinusNs/pdif, plus i think the 340 feels bulkier
09:21:29LinusNand you can see the lcd even with the backlight off
09:21:54eikiaye, but Id prefer a color lcd requiring backlight tho :P
09:22:19LinusNmy ears don't care about the lcd ;-)
09:22:31LinusN(color sound) :-P
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09:23:16eikialtho on the other hand, the gigabeat can have 60g capacity
09:24:18eikiwill have to check pricing before I decide
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09:28:23eikihumm.. there's no h140 on ebay, altho there are two h340, one for 199$ and the other for 50$ (used)
09:28:31petureiki: you can buy a 80GB disk and put it in the h140/h340 ;)
09:29:09GodEaterprovided you make sure you get the right disk
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09:29:14markunor in your Gigabeat (like linuxstb did)
09:29:51amiconnLinusN: Even the M5 has 'color sound', whatever that means...
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09:31:34B4gderI think it refers to one of those weird sound alterering techs they offer
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09:43:04eikihumm.. iriver 340 for 50$.. that one sounds tempting
09:45:55ddaltonhow can I make the current paused track be removed from the buffer?
09:47:32ddaltoncan you even make it do that?
09:49:43GodEaterddalton: could you perhaps explain why you'd want to ?
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09:50:40ddaltonGodEater: voice doesn't talk when playback is paused. I just want tomake a quick fix because it is anoying me a bit.
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09:50:46ddaltonto make
09:51:20ddaltonalso I can't go through the wps unless I listen to music for example menu options
09:51:40ddaltonand pausing playback is easier than activating the wps context menu and then stopping playback
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09:52:34ddaltonGodEater: is it possible to remove the current playing track from the buffer?
09:53:44LinusNddalton: the current playback code doesn't allow speech when the playback is paused, and it is unfortunately not that easy to fix
09:54:23markunLinusN: can't we just continue to feed the last value to the DAC while pausing?
09:54:24ddaltonLinusN: I just asked this on the mailing list but what needs to be done?
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09:55:28LinusNthe problem is that the pause/play logic is done by the PCM playback code, and not by the codecs
09:55:44ddaltonbecause it is very simple to make the pause function talk but it won't be in the wps
09:55:46peturhah... seems customers of Virgin Media will now understand what DRM means: from next month their traks will no longer play because Virgin stops the service...
09:55:56ddaltonjust calling stop but then that isn't pause
09:56:46LinusNddalton: the solution is to refactor the playback code, and we all know how fun/easy that is... :-)
09:57:18ddaltonLinusN: how much code is it?
09:57:38LinusNit's not the amount of code, it's the complexity
09:58:02ddaltonhow complicated?
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09:58:52ddalton11 what?
09:59:10ddaltonso what needs to be done? do you know?
09:59:21ddaltonwhere is the code where talking about located?
09:59:37LinusNwell, we move the pause/play logic from the pcm drivers to the playback code
10:00:48LinusNthe pcm code is target specific, and is in the various pcm-xxx.c files in the firmware/target tree
10:02:12ddaltonLinusN: should I do it or do I need more c skills
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10:02:28LinusNit's really not about c skills
10:02:48ddaltonso would I be able to do it? (I am a pacient person)
10:02:50LinusNit's about having a good understanding how the playback code works, and should work
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10:06:12ddaltonLinusN: could we return to the wps somehow with out starting playback?
10:06:36LinusNunfortunately not
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10:06:55JdGordonwell technically it could be done... but its not wanted anyway
10:08:53ddaltonjdGordon how? Is it hard to do?
10:10:32neolivHello to all the rockbox coders. I'm here to see how I could help fixing the "nano" bug discussed here :
10:10:45 Join Rick [0] (
10:11:48neolivI'm using an old rockbox that is working fine, but the new ones are having trouble on my old nano. It seems the bug is due to a recent change so I'm here to see if I can help fix it.
10:12:24neolivI'm not familiar with your code but I'm able to compile and test all you want. (able to read C... and more if need be)
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10:16:27Zagorneoliv: what exactly is going wrong
10:16:55neolivI guess the thread (starting at the page I gave should give all details)
10:17:05neolivbut the thing is, acces to files are not working properly
10:17:13neolivplayback crashes or hangup
10:17:20neolivany codec, any acces
10:17:24Zagoroh sorry, I missed the thread
10:17:29neolivnp :)
10:17:54neolivthe bug has been traced to a particular patch
10:18:13neolivbut... hard to debug without having a "faulty" nano
10:18:22neolivso here I'am to help if possible
10:18:38neolivwilling to compile and report everything you could think of...
10:18:55neoliv(lending the nano is an option but i'm using it rather intensively... >2h a day)
10:20:00neolivhere is the tracker:
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10:20:57Nico_PJdGordon: seen my small fix to the mouse-in-sim patch ?
10:20:59Zagorneoliv: have you verified that r14003 works and r14004 doesn't?
10:21:16JdGordonNico_P: yeah, didnt look at it though
10:21:33Nico_Pit's quite trivial
10:21:38neolivother people did that.
10:21:44neolivI'm using a older build that is working
10:21:56neolivand tested a lot of newer ones that didn't
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10:22:14neolivI can redo the test if you thing it's worth a second check
10:23:21Zagorthat would be nice. I'll make you two builds to try.
10:23:38neolivI can build them here... do not bother
10:24:00neolivif I can recall my svn cli for dates ;)
10:24:12Zagordon't use date, use revision
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10:24:14ddaltonLinusN: around?
10:24:31neolivsorry... cvs habits o:)
10:24:38Zagorsvn co -r r14003
10:25:03Zagoror "svn up -r r14003"
10:25:30Zagorsorry, "14003" not "r14003"
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10:29:41neolivzagor: thx. build in progress
10:30:02neoliv(old box here... may take a while)
10:34:34Zagorneoliv: while waiting, please check which version bootloader you have. (press >>| while booting)
10:34:55ddaltonjhMikeS: around?
10:35:06pondlifeddalton: That was quick! :)
10:35:50jhMikeSddalton: yes
10:36:34ddaltonjhMikeS: Do you know anything about voice when playback is paused? did you write any patches that were maybe getting closer to sorting this problem out?
10:36:44ddaltonpondlife told me to talk to you
10:36:56pondlifeLow latency PCM...
10:37:27jhMikeSI haven't written much of anything to straighten it out since there are issues regarding what pondlife mentioned.
10:37:32pixelmaZagor: I think it is a well known problem with some Nanos (unfortunately none available to a dev) and already tracked back to this commit... testing once again won't hurt though
10:37:41ddaltonso do you know where I should start?
10:38:09Zagorpixelma: yes, I'm reading through the comments and threads. it appears to also be related to the specific nano version?
10:38:22ddaltonwhat code?
10:38:41jhMikeSddalton: basically, pcm is paused right in the middle of any transfer of audio and pausing basically is nothing more than pausing the outgoing audio.
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10:39:16ddaltonjhMikeS: so that includes the voice?
10:39:18Zagorhowever I like to "start from scratch". a few minutes "wasted" build time is worth it to avoid chasing the wrong thing
10:39:24ddaltonbeen paused
10:39:34jhMikeSddalton: it basically consists of playback.c and pcmbuf.c code.
10:40:34pixelmaIIUC it is hardware related, the firmware version was an idea once but some of the reports in the tracker show the same as known working Nanos (e.g. Llorean's)
10:40:38ddaltonjhMikeS: so would I need to be a good programmer? Or should I just forget about even trying?
10:40:46pixelmathat was to Zagor
10:41:33neolivzagor: rebooting on the 14003 right now. unable to read the bootload version though
10:41:40neolivis there a way to read it using big fonts?
10:41:53JdGordonddalton: yes, dont even bother with playback code
10:41:56jhMikeSddalton: it really needs a huge going over since the pcm buffer does not provide a way to play anything else when paused. it needs to provide another channel in essence.
10:41:56Zagorneoliv: ok, ignore the bootloader
10:42:08neoliv(I have my own wps for max readability... anywhere in debug menus?)
10:42:13ddaltonok I will work on something else :-)
10:42:41ddaltoncan any devs help me out with some button code?
10:42:43pondlifeDid any dev (e.g. amiconn :) ) take up the offer on the forum - a European user with a failing Nano...
10:43:03pondlifeddalton: Haha, feel free to fix up the playback stuff too!
10:43:05Zagorpondlife: neoliv is here now with his failing nano
10:43:27ddaltonI would if I new how :-)
10:43:48neolivhum... some news here... the 14003 juste crashed here
10:43:53neolivrechecking revision to be sure
10:43:54JdGordonNico_P: whats the story with mob?
10:43:57jhMikeSddalton: all I'm saying is anything from playback.c throught to the pcm buffer is really some hairy, ugly code and I suppose I'd wait for the buffer rewrite before doing major revision to.
10:44:31ddaltonok well I am far from a programmer so I don't think I would have much luck
10:44:41Nico_PJdGordon: I'm getting back to it
10:44:48neoliv14003 is crashing on 2 mp3 read i've tried
10:44:53JdGordonyay :)
10:45:04Zagorneoliv: ok. did you build this in a new dir or in your old build dir?
10:45:18neolivfrom scratch, new trunk new build
10:45:48neolivok... dichotomy or does anyone have a better idea?
10:46:00Zagorok. and I take it the crash symptoms are the same ones we are looking for?
10:46:18neolivsymptoms vary... here it is a : data abort
10:46:32neolivon some builds I've tried it was a hang-up
10:46:36neolivon others a plain reboot
10:46:50pondlifeNico_P: yay yay :)
10:47:19neolivthe 14004 is ready. can try to check if symptoms vary
10:47:25tyrion_Want! −−>
10:48:03neolivZagor: is ther a way to read the bootloader version once rockbox has booted? (using my wps?)
10:48:41Zagorneoliv: no. the running firmware does not know the version of the bootloader
10:48:45*jhMikeS wonders if MrH would be interested in helping figure out the HW semaphores on PP which are basically a scientific fact now (since debugging refrences show up in the H10 fw).
10:48:58neolivthe "ipod diagnostic" is svc aug 17 2005...
10:49:02ddaltonJdGordon: Do you know of any wiki page that tells you how to do buttons?
10:49:03Nico_Ppondlife: maybe you can help me with codec_pcmbuf_position_callback
10:49:21neolivyou said to push >> while booting. here it brings the diagnostics up
10:49:27pondlifeNico_P: Maybe I can answer simple questions...
10:49:40neolivno "info" menu ... as far as I'm able to see
10:49:42pondlifeCan't guarentee correct answers though
10:49:49pondlife(or how to spell)
10:50:16ddaltonpondlife: do you know how to do buttons?
10:50:24Nico_Ppondlife: ok... I've been having some headaches with it... first, when is it used ? only on track change ?
10:51:05Zagorneoliv: I guess the simplest option is to download ipodpatcher and update your bootloader. then we know you have the latest recommended anyway.
10:51:53neolivzagor: 20060126
10:51:56neolivis it enough?
10:52:05neolivi'll update too of course
10:52:23Zagoryes, please update
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10:53:44pondlifeNico_P: Looking in pcmbuf.c, seems to only be called when out of data... look for position_callback in there
10:54:11pondlifeThe comment reads "/* The buffer is finished, call the callback functions */"
10:54:46pixelmaneoliv: maybe you don't have a faulty Nano after all...
10:55:28neoliv? :)
10:55:51Nico_Ppondlife: which buffer is that ? the PCM buffer ?
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10:56:28Nico_Pmy problem with that callback is that it requires quick access to the previous track's ID3 info... I don't really know how to provide that
10:56:53neolivback in a minute... windows here... reboot time
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11:07:06ddaltonJdGordon: can you either tell me where to find info on doing buttons or help me with a long press of rec and a short press?
11:07:08 Nick linuxstb__ is now known as linuxstb (
11:07:30ddaltona long should call a function I will write a short should go to the radio
11:07:53***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
11:07:55 Join KiOui [0] (n=yan@
11:08:07KiOuiHi here
11:08:15neolivZagor: ok... back online with the latest bootloader
11:08:22neoliv14003 is working now
11:08:24pondlifeNico_P: IIRC, that's only used to keep the progress bar running to the end of a track when then playback engine has moved onto the next track... maybe put some logging in on the sim to confirm.
11:08:32neolivtrying 14004 ASAP
11:08:35pondlifeIt may be that you can find a simpler method?
11:08:45Zagorneoliv: excellent
11:08:50KiOuiDoes anyone know if the script which build all english voice files for all targets is available somewhere?
11:08:50Nico_Ppondlife: so maybe I could just get rid of it for now ?
11:08:56Nico_Ppondlife: I'll try the logging
11:09:10pondlifeYes, I think I might have added it ages ago :)
11:09:28Nico_Phopefully I'll be able to find a better way around that issue
11:09:55pondlifeProblem is, the progress bar needs to be driven by the PCM playback position, but in the playback code.
11:10:00ddaltonKiOui: svn has it!
11:10:02neolivdoes anyone know a way to "force" a boot to original firmware? here sometimes it boots to the diag screen (eventhough i'm holding the menu down while booting)
11:10:44LinusNpondlife: something that is likely to go away if we go the low-latency path
11:10:56Nico_Ppondlife: could't we give the WPS access to the PCM progress value ?
11:10:58pondlifeBut we need to work with what we have
11:11:06ddaltonLinusN: have you got some time to help me with buttons?
11:11:13LinusNnot really
11:11:25LinusNbusy at work atm
11:11:37ddaltonok all it was was making a long call a cetain function. I can do the other stuff later
11:11:44pondlifeNico_P: You might be able to get the required position from pcm anyway, or just store the previous track length in a global for now ;)
11:11:51ddaltonis it hard to do?
11:12:08Nico_Ppondlife: I'll try that
11:13:14pondlifeThere will inevitably be a little hackery involved to give you wiggle room here. Put "Hack!" comments in...
11:13:54Nico_Pwill do :)
11:13:59neolivzagor: hum... 14004 working too...
11:14:06neolivwill try the latest build now
11:14:10Zagorneoliv: good
11:14:12*ddalton Gives up his tried 5 things all which have failed. 1. voice for stats.c 2. fixing the playback issue 3. say the current song in the wps 4. make a long press of rec call a function and 5. make a short press go to the radio
11:14:24ddaltonhe has
11:14:37*ddalton goes and reads his book on c!
11:16:02pondlifeddalton: It's not easy to get instant results hacking the Rockbox core, don't give up...
11:16:55ddaltonpondlife: I haven't given up on rockbox coding but just those 5 things I tried to implement. I guess I am not really a programmer so I really need to study c a lot more to make some useful patches.
11:17:08ddaltonand become a programmer
11:17:14ddaltonwhat do you think?
11:18:05 Quit Ebert ()
11:18:22Nico_Pddalton: the first patches I contributed were a few simple bugfixes I came up with while trying to understand the code...
11:18:45Nico_Pthen I hacked album art on the current code
11:19:04ddaltonNico_P: I can't really fix bugs. Maybe I just can't read the code (understand it) what was your first one?
11:19:13Nico_Pbut it took me a lot of time to get acquainted with the codebase
11:20:45Nico_Pddalton: my actual first one was FS #2920
11:21:47Nico_Pddalton: my point is: start with small tweaks to get used to the code
11:21:59ddaltonI have been able to do very simple things like make the wake up alarm talk and make the time voice in 12 hour format as well as 24 (it uses the setting)
11:22:03Nico_Pddalton: and never touch playback.c if you don't absolutely have to ;)
11:22:17ddaltonok that sounds like good advice :-)
11:22:43pondlifeThe first rule of playback.c club is..
11:22:54 Part KiOui
11:24:33Nico_Ppondlife: you do not talk about the playback.c club ? ;)
11:24:38neolivzagor: ok problem fixed here for me
11:24:57Zagorneoliv: excellent.
11:25:03neolivi'll reply on the thread to describe my checks and see if other people are as lucky as me.
11:25:11neolivthx very much for your help
11:25:18Zagoryou're welcome
11:25:22neolivand the great work you are doing with rockbox
11:25:24Nico_Ppondlife: the logging confirms that the callback is used in the last seconds of each track
11:25:48ddaltonNico_P: Do you know how to do buttons?
11:25:56pondlifeNico_P: And no other time?
11:26:03neolivreally... i'm helping people doing their first "ipodpatcher" here :)
11:26:05pondlifeTry some skipping too
11:26:12Nico_Ppondlife: it doesn't appear so
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11:26:27pondlifeThat means my memory is better than I thought :)
11:26:41neolivsome are a bit... worried about the patch step... once it's done they are almost all happy.
11:26:49pondlifeSo you can probabaly find a simpler solution and scrap it?
11:26:51neolivthx again... and CUl8R
11:27:39Nico_Ppondlife: skipping doesn't make it be called... I think I'll use some global vars and then try to find a better solutions
11:28:00Nico_Pddalton: what do you mean by "do buttons" ? associate actions to buttons ?
11:28:09pondlifeNico_P: Don't forget the comments!
11:28:26Nico_Ppondlife: I'll try not to
11:28:49*pondlife has an appaling comment ratio on Ohloh...
11:28:52ddaltonNico_P: for example make a long press of rec call a certain function. Can you even do that?
11:31:37Nico_Pddalton: yes. the button code master is JdGordon. I think most of the base code is in action.c... I'm not sure where you'd add a new action though
11:32:08ddaltonok do you know how to make a long press of rec do something?
11:32:15ddaltonlike call a function
11:32:52Nico_Pthat would qualify as "adding a new action", and I don't know how to do it, no
11:33:05neolivzagor: report done. thx and see you maybe for a more "useful" patch one day or another ;)
11:33:07ddaltonok then
11:33:23Zagorneoliv: good job on the testing
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11:33:47Zagorddalton: you can't do that universally. buttons are assigned specifically for each screen/menu
11:34:27Zagorso you have to decide where you want that function/action, then add it to that screen or menu
11:35:17Zagor(well, technically, menus work the same everywhere but I don't think you want to change the menu module)
11:35:49ddaltonok I was going to try and get a long rec call a function when in the file browser and then in the radio and in the wps
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11:37:31Nico_Pddalton: r14141 (Finally use the rec button to get to the rec screen on sansa and iriver hxxx. hold rec to get there... short press still is unused) might interest you
11:37:58Nico_Pddalton: there are probably some things to be learned by looking at the diffs
11:39:12Nico_PZagor: there appears to be a small problem in the SVN revision regex for the logreader script...
11:39:37*Zagor looks
11:39:56Zagorah, I see
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11:48:29 Join KiOui [0] (n=yan@
11:48:35KiOuiHi again there
11:49:09KiOuiAbout, it passes the name of the target to ../tools/configure; but the ../tools/configure I have in the trunk accept only a number
11:49:45KiOuiShould I use a different ../tools, or maybe a different rockbox repository?
11:53:09bluebrotherKiOui: I just tried to select the language by using the name and it worked.
11:53:32KiOuiNot the language, the platform target
11:53:40bluebrotheryou can do that too.
11:54:00KiOuiThe scripts talks about "player" or "ipodvideo", not "0" or "22"
11:54:18bluebrotheryou can put "player" instead of "0" etc.
11:54:41bluebrotherthe configure script doesn't tell that it's possible, but it is possible −− just have a look into the configure script ;-)
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11:59:20KiOuiI always have "Please select a supported target platform!"
11:59:35bluebrotherand what are you entering?
12:00:16linuxstbkiOui: Yes, and at that prompt, you can either enter a number or the (undocumented) target name.
12:00:45bluebrotherfor example, I usually use "h120" instead of "10" as that is the internal target name
12:00:52bluebrother(taken from the configure script)
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12:03:27KiOuiI enter this:
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12:04:54KiOuiecho -e "gigabeatf\na\nv\n\n14\ne\n-v fr\n" | ../tools/configure
12:06:50bluebrotherKiOui: I have a small bash script for setting up the manual builds. It looks like that:
12:10:15KiOuibluebrother: I'll try it for voices
12:10:46KiOuiBut it looks strange that the perl script doesn't work on my system, I'll continue to investigate
12:13:15rasherbluebrother: that won't work for voices, since that part of configure asks about RAM size as well for some targets
12:14:17B4gderKiOui: with double quotes (") you need double backslashes
12:14:24B4gderuse single quotes instead
12:16:08pixelmarasher: you are asked about RAM size when configuring for the manual as well...
12:17:22Nico_Ppondlife: well I've tried both approaches: global vars and complete removal. I think i'll go with the first as it makes the code simpler, and if I'm lucky the problem will solve itself
12:18:38pondlifeAs long as the progress bar plays to the far end! It used to stop progressing completely for a bit.
12:18:42rasherpixelma: I see. Well colour me confused.
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12:19:11Nico_Ppondlife: well when I remove the callback the progressbar does stop
12:19:30pondlifeSo you know what to avoid :)
12:19:59Nico_Pis the pcm code aware of the global position in the track ?
12:20:06pondlifeProbably not
12:20:18pondlifeNor should it be
12:20:40B4gderright, pcm is not even "track"
12:20:44B4gderjust data
12:20:45pondlifeWe should be working towards PCM being a general audio output stage, with no "playback" dependencies
12:21:14pondlifePause is the obvious problem ATM...
12:21:26Nico_Pand so isn't the progressbar always lagging behind tha actual elapsed time ?
12:21:42pondlifeNo, because playback allows for that, IIRC
12:21:51pixelmarasher: yes, it doesn't make sense. It's just that the query for (m)anual etc. comes after the query for ram size without exception
12:21:53pondlife(I don't have the code handy ATM.)
12:22:07 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
12:22:22pondlifeAs I recall, the latency is a known value which is compensated for in playback.c
12:22:43Nico_Pmakes sense
12:22:48linuxstbInteresting idea for crossfading -
12:22:56pondlifeThe end-of-track bit works backwards though, but luckily they join up nicely :)
12:23:29pondlifelinuxstb: Nice
12:24:59linuxstbpondlife: I wonder if he would like to implement it in playback.c ;)
12:26:18pondlifeHmm, maybe - after Nico_P's cleaned it all up it'll be easy
12:26:56Nico_Ptime will tell
12:27:11Nico_PI encourage you to follow developement on my public git repo
12:27:23Nico_Pfeel free to join it too ! :)
12:27:56pondlifeI'll keep an eye on it, but proabably won't contribute much until you get some stuff into Rockbox SVN.
12:28:31pondlifeAny reason you can't add the buffering code to Rockbox SVN yet? That must be pretty much stable.
12:28:50pondlifeNot that it'll actually be used by anything...
12:28:54*JdGordon slaps Nico_P with a trout shaped 2x4
12:28:56Nico_PI could, yes. But there's no code using it
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12:29:17Nico_PJdGordon: what have I done to deserve this treatment ? :)
12:29:40JdGordondont worry.. was just a random attack
12:29:45JdGordonkids these days... :p
12:30:00pondlife...with their hoodies and wooden fish...
12:30:11linuxstbNico_P: Have you thought about using your buffering code in the hwcodec playback engine?
12:30:42pondlifeThat could be a nice test case.
12:30:45Nico_Plinuxstb: I'd like to make HWCODEC use it, but I have no such target
12:31:08pondlifeIf you put the code into SVN, maybe some kind MAS user could play with it?
12:31:11Nico_Plinuxstb: the playback code is simpler, isn't it ?
12:32:24linuxstbNico_P: I don't know the hwcodec playback code, but would assume it's much simpler...
12:32:49linuxstbAs well as probably being easier. it would be a first steps towards the big unification.
12:33:14Nico_Psounds like a good idea, I'll have a look
12:33:35linuxstbIt's a shame the sim doesn't support hwcodec audio playback - I don't know how much you could do in the sim.
12:36:46Nico_Pwhy doesn't audio work in HWCODEC sims ? couldn't some simple MAS emulation be used ?
12:38:39B4gderI'm sure it could, if someone just wrote one ;-)
12:40:58Nico_Pwhat does the MAS take as input ? isn't it bitswapped PCM data ?
12:41:24B4gdermp3 data even
12:42:08Nico_Pah, so why couldn't we not do the bitswap and pass that data to SDL or our mp3 codec ?
12:42:27amiconn_Latency and end-of-track has several problems on swcodec
12:42:38B4gderNico_P: again, just because nobody made it do so
12:42:45B4gderthere's no technical reason why it can't be done
12:42:59amiconn_Like, playback knows about the latency for elapsed time and current track metadata, but not for next track metadata
12:43:00B4gderwe even once had sound for the hwcodes
12:43:03Nico_PB4gder: ok, I just wanted to know if it was doable in theory
12:43:19B4gder... based on libmad too
12:43:34Nico_Pwhy did it disappear ?
12:43:39amiconn_So, near the end of a track. the Next track info show info from 2 tracks ahead, while current track info stays correct
12:43:45B4gderit was a terrible implementation afair
12:44:14B4gderand I'm quite sure that was before swcodec even so things are entirely different today
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12:45:24amiconn_A MAS emulator would probably be more complex than the whole swcodec playback engine....
12:45:42B4gderwhy so?
12:45:54linuxstbBut it would very useful as not many devs have hwcodec devices.
12:46:19B4gderI would imagine a system where most accesses to MAS is replaced with a function or macro, that when built for the simultator communicates with a MAS thread that
12:46:33B4gderdoes what the mas would do
12:46:58linuxstbSounds like it would also force a useful abstraction...
12:47:07amiconn_The mas does not only take mp3 data
12:47:17amiconn_It also communicates via i2c
12:47:21B4gderno, but we could start with the mp3 data
12:47:26amiconn_And then there is the pcm codec...
12:47:29B4gderand the i2c communication could be emulated the same way
12:47:40B4gderand we could ignore the pcm codec to start with
12:48:12B4gdera perfect emulation is dead hard, yes but something that is 95% for mp3 is not
12:50:18 Join Bam1 [0] (
12:50:43*amiconn_ has to admit that he doesn't deem the sim that useful for debugging, except for ui stuff
12:50:57Bam1Can Rockbox play videos on an Ipod Nano 1st gen?
12:51:02B4gderBam1: yes
12:51:16bluebrotherBam1: check
12:51:30Bam1thanks B4gder and bluebrother
12:53:46*bluebrother wonders why there are no more bug reports on rbutil −− are people not using it or not experiencing bugs?
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12:56:33pixelmabluebrother: didn't check since Friday, should the c200 issues be solved now?
12:56:37 Quit SkinInd95 ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
12:57:12bluebrotherthe c200 should work fine now −− detection worked nicely on my faked player.
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12:57:54bluebrotherif you want to try current svn (including usb detection on windows):
12:59:41 Join tedrock [0] (
12:59:48bluebrotherbut I'm wondering if users are using it. I should start writing a section on rbutil for the manual
13:00:28Nico_Pbluebrother: I think it should be advertised more
13:00:52bluebrothermaybe add a screenshot to the announcement in the forums? hmm.
13:02:06bluebrotherI think I'll start writing something for the manual later.
13:02:07Nico_Pwhy not add something about it to the front page ?
13:02:50B4gderwell, having the manual describe the rbutil way will of course make a lot more people use it
13:03:00B4gderas we like to refer people there...
13:04:18linuxstbWe could simply add a link in the manual to the rbutil wiki page for now - maybe with a note saying that it is still in development and feedback/testing is needed.
13:04:50bluebrothermy idea was to split the installation section into "automatic" and "manual" installation
13:05:05bluebrotherthat way we could easily move the manual installation somewhere to the appendix later.
13:06:44Zagorhow does rbutil do with the bootloaders? when, if ever, will it upgrade the bootloader?
13:07:54***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:08:23markunB4gder: looked at the firmware of the Ainol V2000. Unencrypted and full of open source stuff (ffmpeg, VisualBoyAdvance)
13:08:50markundon't know why it's sometimes called a iphone clone
13:08:55markunmaybe the design
13:08:56B4gdermarkun: any idea what OS it runs?
13:09:15markunno, but I'll link you to the firmware
13:09:24B4gderplease do
13:09:33Zagormarkun: for the same reason every mp3 player is an "ipod killer"
13:10:09B4gderwell, this is one of them "full screen" media players
13:10:28markunbut no phone
13:10:33B4gderhehe, true
13:10:35ZagorB4gder: yeah, hence "iphone" instead of "ipod"
13:10:37markun533MHz blackfin based
13:11:07ZagorI guess it gets you more clicks
13:11:48B4gder"This is not a bootable disk. Please insert a bootable floppy and
13:11:49B4gderpress any key to try again ...
13:12:09LinusNstandard boot sector
13:12:33markunI don't see many computers with a floppy drive these days
13:12:43LinusNquite rare
13:12:56B4gdermedia players with floppies however...
13:13:45markunmaybe through the SD slot with a SDIO adapter or something :)
13:13:45linuxstbWasn't there once a DAP based on iomega zip drives? Or did I imagine it?
13:14:24B4gdermarkun: seems to be using wxMusik too
13:15:05Zagorwhy don't you just download the source tarball instead? ;-P
13:15:13B4gder"wxMusik (former only called Musik) is a multimedia library supporting specifically mp3,mp2,ogg,mpc,ape and wav"
13:15:35Zagortagline: "because w!namp is teh suck"
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13:15:56markunZagor: I wrote them an email about the source of the V1000 firmware, but got no reply of course :)
13:16:05Zagorah, that was just a random line
13:16:23B4gderand it seems they also have mplayer/mencoder snippest
13:16:25Zagormarkun: did you write in simplified or traditional chinese? :)
13:17:03markunSnes9X: Memory allocation failure - not enough RAM/virtual memory available.
13:17:47markunbut I also wonder what OS they are using
13:18:52B4gdernow that's nice string
13:19:04 Quit haemmy ()
13:19:07B4gder"SATAN IS OUR FATHER!"
13:19:27B4gderweird things
13:19:39linuxstbThey do seem to have violated licenses with style... No half measures.
13:19:53GodEateris this that chinese outfit ?
13:20:40markunyes, Ainol is a Chinese company
13:20:44linuxstbMaybe if anyone wanted to take action, their distributors would be the people to complain to.
13:20:52B4gder"Would need a sector size > 16k, which GEMDOS can't work with"
13:20:54linuxstb(rather than the Chinese company themselves) is selling this player, maybe we could ask for the source code through them?
13:22:14markunnowhere can I find the resolution of the TFT
13:22:19Zagormarkun: wanna bet they say "take it up with the manufacturer"?
13:22:24linuxstbmarkun: I think it really needs a copyright holder to complain - to put pressure on the manufacturer to release the source.
13:22:41B4gder"Copyright (C) 1998, Thomas G. Lane"
13:22:42markunI asked in #ffmpeg, but no reply
13:22:46B4gder"Copyright (C) 1998,1999 Juergen Buchmueller, all rights reserved."
13:23:05B4gder"Copyright 1998 Gilles Vollant"
13:23:11B4gderlots of them in there...
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13:25:16markunI would expect a lot more than 15 hours audio playback
13:25:35advcomp2019linuxstb, if i remember right the iomaga dap use the clik or clix disks
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13:27:54Zagormarkun: I think they've overspec:d the processor to avoid having to optimize the code
13:27:56 Part norbusan
13:28:06Zagor...which hurts the runtime
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13:28:24markunZagor: but the blackfin can dynamically lower the freq and core voltage
13:28:40markunit is supposed to be very efficient
13:29:00Zagormarkun: yeah, but the have to do it too... and it rather looks like they've crammed together all the components they could find
13:29:11B4gderah Buchmueller is a MAME guy
13:29:26ZagorI mean sw components
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13:30:30markunat least they have firmware updates
13:30:41markunmaybe they wanted to release soon and optimize later
13:30:56przemhbHi all
13:31:08peturmarkun: it is, a customer of ours uses it in a battery operated system that needs both performance and efficiency
13:31:37markunhi przemhb
13:31:54peturapart from that, the debugger of analog devices sucks big time
13:33:42przemhbI am wondering if someone could be so kind and take a look at my patch released some 3 weeks ago - #7712 ? It adds a new codepage CP1250, which is used by most of Poles and not only Poles; without it files using national diacritical characters cannot be played
13:34:14markunprzemhb: I'll take a look
13:34:29przemhbthank you very much
13:35:21markunprzemhb: maybe not a good idea to change the ID of all the codepages
13:35:26przemhbmarkun: affter applying the patch you'll be able to play the file and M3U playlist I've attached
13:36:27przemhbmarkun: I've tried to keep codepages in order, so I placed CP1250 before CP1251
13:36:28JdGordonho hum, im bored
13:36:31pondlifeNico_P: WPS eye-candy? You're not trying to avoid playback.c are you? ;)
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13:36:55markunprzemhb: but that way people who have set one of those codepages will get the wrong one after updating rockbox..
13:37:32patrakovHello, I have a 80GB Video iPod, rockbox is already installed and plays MP3 files well. How to enable the playback of flac and aac-in-mp4 files?
13:37:56Nico_Ppondlife: I need to cool off sometimes :)
13:38:05krazykitpatrakov, it's already enabled
13:38:24pondlifehaha. I find if I get out of "playback mode" it takes ages to get back in.
13:38:35przemhbmarkun: well - you're right...
13:38:46amiconn_markun: Why would it get the wrong one?
13:38:47krazykitpatrakov, but if you have songs that you bought from iTunes that are crippled with DRM, you can't play them
13:39:02patrakovkrazykit: yes, there is a flac.codec file. but if I press the middle button on a flac or ogg-flac file, it doesn't play
13:39:18patrakovand aac files are self-encoded with faac
13:39:21markunamiconn_: I assumed we save the number, I'll check again
13:41:02przemhbmarkun: if you thnik it would be better I can place CP1250 as last tonight ?
13:41:22patrakovso, how to debug this "flac files are not recognized" problem?
13:41:55LinusNpatrakov: offer one of your flac files for download, so one of us can examine it
13:42:17B4gderme takes a guess at weird meta-data...
13:42:21B4gderlike id3
13:42:22LinusNme too
13:42:36*markun too
13:42:40patrakovLinusN: it's big, but I can provide a flac command line that produced it - would this be enough?
13:43:09JdGordonamiconn_: without having to reimplement every lcd drawing function for viewports, do you have any idea how to tell it what offset to draw at? (so 0,0 is the top of the viewport instead of the top of the screen)
13:43:10markunpatrakov: or make a small one from a tiny wav file
13:43:23amiconn_markun: The codepage is saved as a named option, like many others
13:43:39markunpatrakov: ok, so no problem
13:43:39patrakovflac -e −−ogg -o "01 - Paris Musette.ogg" -T "TITLE=Paris Musette" -T "TRACKNUMBER=1" -T "ARTIST=Paul Mauriat" -T "ALBUM=French Collection 2000" -T "GENRE=Instrumental" track01.wav
13:43:53linuxstbpatrakov: Rockbox doesn't support ogg/FLAC
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13:44:16patrakovso should I retry with flac without the ogg container now?
13:44:17markunlinuxstb: would it be difficult to support?
13:44:25LinusNpatrakov: yes
13:44:31markunas we also have ogg/speex support
13:44:43linuxstbmarkun: Probably not, but I can't see the benefit of the added complexity of Ogg...
13:45:14linuxstbI think patrakov is the first person in more than two years of FLAC support to want to play Ogg/FLAC...
13:46:08 Quit james_malone (Client Quit)
13:47:35patrakovok, it plays
13:47:39linuxstbpatrakov: Out of curiousity, is there a reason you chose to encode your files as Ogg/FLAC, instead of plain FLAC?
13:47:45JdGordonwould anyone have a problem with splitting the radio.c file up into a few radio_* files?
13:47:53JdGordonor into a radio/ folder under gui
13:48:01LinusNJdGordon: why?
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13:48:28JdGordonbecause im bored and want to maybe get it wps-y.. and its a mess anyway
13:48:51LinusNi wouldn't mind, if it makes the code better
13:49:12pondlifeJdGordon: Do I recall you once looked into a method for Rockbox to check the bootloader version? So if someone updated the main build it could warn if an old bootloader was in use?
13:49:29JdGordonI gave it half an effort a while ago
13:49:45pondlifeYou got as far as some kind of magic number in a register?
13:49:55JdGordonthat was the plan, but it didnt work
13:50:03patrakovlinuxstb: because my previous attempt was to encode wav to flac using a swiss-army knife (ffmpeg), and rockbox didn't recognize the result (mplayet did). then I tried to wrap flac in ogg container - ffmpeg segfaulted. then I installed the "flac" tool and tried to make an ogg-flac file with it. Rockbox didn't recognize it. Then you told me to use native flac - and it worked
13:50:36daurn|laptopJdGordon: !
13:51:02 Quit ddalton ("leaving")
13:51:38JdGordonpondlife: it would be best if there was a nice way to stick the verison string into a know place in RAM that would be generic enough for every target
13:52:04pondlifeDoesn't have to be the same on every target, does it?
13:52:14pondlifeJust consistent in the source code.
13:52:15patrakovlinuxstb: so there is still a bug report: Rockbox doesn't recognize flac files produced with the "ffmpeg" tool, like this: ffmpeg -i track01.wav -acodec flac -author "Paul Mauriat" -album "French Collection 2000" -year 2000 -track 1 -title "Paris Musette" "01 - Paris Musette.flac"
13:52:44pondlifeSo why not have a config-.h definition for a bootloader version address?
13:53:05pondlife0 means that target has no known suitable address, hence no test.
13:53:43JdGordonwell yeah, it shuold work.... what brought that on again?
13:54:09 Quit iamben (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:54:11linuxstbpatrakov: That ffmpeg command-line _should_ work. I'll investigate.
13:54:23pondlifeThe possibility that people have been wasting their time looking for Nano problems when it might have been user error all along...
13:54:42patrakovlinuxstb: thanks
13:54:44linuxstbpatrakov: Are you sure you called the file .flac, and not .ogg ? Rockbox uses the extension as the first part of the format detection.
13:54:59 Quit My_Sic ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
13:55:11pondlifeIn such cases, upon booting, Rockbox splashed for 30 seconds with "UPDATE YOUR BOOTLOADER" that would be a good thing. :)
13:55:20linuxstbpatrakov: Anything special about your track01.wav? Is it just a track ripped from a CD?
13:56:22JdGordonpondlife: ok, ill have another try at it
13:57:37pondlifeWell, you did say you were bored :)
13:57:47*pondlife sadly lacks that problem
13:57:53amiconn_JdGordon: The clipping in each function needs to be adjusted for viewports, but that's not really a problem
13:58:28JdGordonnot clipping... offsetting
13:58:42JdGordonalthough clipping does have a similar problem
13:58:57JdGordonunless the viewports are done at the lowest lcd drawing functions
13:59:30amiconn_of course
13:59:49JdGordonok, so they all need redoing anyway, so maybe its not a big deal
13:59:50amiconn_Yes, and the offsetting happens directly after clipping... still not really a problem
13:59:55pondlifeI'd think that all offsets would only be relative to a viewport, never the screen. The initial screen would itself be a viewport, of course.
13:59:58 Part LinusN
14:00:11amiconn_Why would you need to redo all the functions???
14:00:28amiconn_pondlife: Of course
14:00:54patrakovlinuxstb: now about the aac codec. Should it recognize only *.aac files, or are *.m4a/*.mp4 files also acceptable?
14:01:36linuxstbpatrakov: Only m4a/mp4 files. But they need to be "streaming" format - I believe Nero has an option for that (but I'm not 100% sure - I'm not an AAC expert)
14:01:44pondlifeThe only time screen co-ords are used would be when defining a viewport, right? Otherwise viewports would have to have "parents"... urgh.
14:01:51patrakovI use Linux and have no Nero
14:02:16patrakovI need a command line for either ffmpeg or faac
14:02:25amiconn_pondlife: yes
14:02:38linuxstbpatrakov: Lear is the person to talk to about AAC, but he isn't here at the moment...
14:03:08 Part KiOui
14:03:22JdGordonpondlife: does it get put in iram or dram?
14:03:33pondlifeDRAM I'd think.
14:03:37patrakovlinuxstb: OK, thanks
14:03:41pondlifeNot sure it matters much though
14:04:08 Quit patrakov ("Leaving.")
14:04:11JdGordonwell, it needs to be somewhere where it wont be overwritten when rockbox is loaded
14:04:46pondlifeOf course
14:05:13pondlifeBut that doesn't necessarily prevent DRAM.
14:05:28pondlifeLooks like the Nano problem isn't just bootloader though :(
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14:07:16JdGordonamiconn_: i'm saying they would need to be modified anyway because they wold somehow need to be told which rectangle to offset/clip to
14:09:14 Join jac0b [0] (
14:09:19pondlifeJdGordon: We already have clipping code, that just needs to be part of the viewport layer. The viewports themselves can be restricted to prevent them going offscreen when they are set up.
14:10:30JdGordonyeah, but when apps calls some lcd function wtith an x,y pixel value, it will need to know what offset into the screen that pixel actually is
14:10:50JdGordontrying to see how it can be added without modifing the apps layer too much to start with
14:11:20pondlifeJdGordon: Why will the app need to know the screen offset?
14:11:29JdGordonit shouldnt.. thats what im saying
14:11:46 Quit jac0b ()
14:11:52JdGordonit wants to draw to 0,0 (in the viewport), but the lcd funcion needs to know 0,0 is really 5,10
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14:12:38Zagorwe already have margins, which is a subset of that
14:12:54pondlifeI'd expect the app will only need to pass a viewport number in, the lcd function will add the offsets after clipping.
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14:13:11JdGordonwe dont want to have to set the margins before and after redrawing the viewport though
14:13:43pondlifeWon't margins be replaced by viewports ultimately?
14:13:55JdGordonI would tihnk so
14:14:05pondlifeThey'll also work within a viewport initially.
14:14:06linuxstbpatrakov: I've just tried a flac file encoded by ffmpeg, and it doesn't work for me either... I don't have time to investigate any more now though, but I think it's related to the metadata blocks (or lack of them)
14:14:19Zagorviewports should definitely replace margins
14:14:22*JdGordon hopes this frustrates amiconn_ enough to start coding it :D
14:14:22amiconn_JdGordon: Yes, modified, but that modification is dead simple
14:14:26Zagorhaving both would be ... ungood
14:14:26pondlifeI think of a viewport as being like the current screens
14:14:48pixelmalinuxstb: already left...
14:14:48JdGordonhehe ungood
14:14:56pondlifei.e. the remote would be a viewport (one or more) too.
14:15:10linuxstbpixelma: I just noticed. He was there when I started typing that sentence though...
14:15:18amiconn_Zagor: The margins as they are implemented now will go away
14:15:49amiconn_pondlife: That won't work. The app layer needs to distinguish main & remote
14:16:20pondlifeOf course, but it would still work like screens do at the moment.
14:16:31JdGordonviewports is going to go between the screens api and the lcd drawing functions?
14:16:33amiconn_JdGordon: There are still several more important things to implement than viewports
14:16:41pixelmalinuxstb: it's also interesting (and if Lear reads the logs...)
14:17:17 Quit kubiix (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:18:00pondlifeHow does the current code know which screen is the remote?
14:18:15 Quit Thundercloud (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
14:18:22JdGordonit doesnt really, just different drawing funcitons are set for the screens api sturct
14:18:36JdGordoni _tinhk_ the struct has a type enum whihc you can check
14:18:45JdGordonbut ideally the screen type would be irrelevant anyway
14:18:54pondlifeRWPS vs WPS ?
14:19:21pondlifeIf it's done by a flag on the screen, then why not just keep that flag on each viewport.
14:19:23amiconn_JdGordon: It can't be irrelevant. Different depths, pixel formats etc
14:19:35JdGordonto the apps code it is
14:19:38JdGordonsort of
14:19:42 Part velixzeen
14:19:44JdGordonsize is what matters
14:20:05pondlifeSize and destination (main/remote)
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14:27:25amiconn_My idea of identifying viewports is by their address. The root viewport can then be set by passing a NULL pointer
14:27:57pondlifeEach viewport would start with a header structure defining size etc?
14:28:31JdGordonyeah, I thought passing the viewport id instead of the pointer would be easier
14:28:47pondlifeI was thinking there wouldn't be a heirarchy (i.e no root), just an initial viewport (number 0) plus a second one for targets with remotes.
14:29:23*JdGordon wants z-ordering built into viewports
14:29:43pondlifeNot needed
14:29:49JdGordonyes it is
14:29:56pondlifeWhy overlap?
14:30:07JdGordonmore than splash, but yes
14:30:22pondlifeI thought that the initial one would not support overlapping
14:30:22JdGordonI have some ideas for the list which would need it
14:30:34petur_please_ keep it simple
14:30:39pondlifeKISS it better
14:30:47linuxstbJdGordon: What ideas?
14:30:58JdGordonwell, I figured if it was drawing staright intot he lcd buffer anyway, just draw the lowest first, then draw each one above it beore the lcd update
14:32:02JdGordonwell, an idea... have a small rect which would make it painfully obvious roughly where int he list you are if its an alphabeticle list.. e.g it would show the first letter for the first item in a larger font
14:32:21JdGordonor first fw letters if they are the same
14:32:24pondlifeHmm, multiple fonts too?
14:32:38*JdGordon 's grand vision for them :p
14:32:48pondlifeNice idea, but maybe not in the first cut.
14:33:55JdGordonbut yeah, even splashes in todays code are "z-ordered".. just that the bottom screen isnt redrawn
14:34:07JdGordonbut it wouldnt be in the viewports any mostly...
14:34:42amiconn_A viewport would have a struct holding its parameters. Normally there wouldn't be a hierarchy, with one exception
14:35:10JdGordonhmm... ok, maybe it wouldnt need it after all... the screen could do its own heighrachy and redrwa them in the order it wants
14:35:22amiconn_The scroll code needs to inherit from the active viewports, in order to be able to destroy the correct scrolling objects when clearing a viewport
14:36:58amiconn_And no z-order either; if viewports overlap the one which draws last wins
14:43:08GodEaterany takers for DevConPub3, possibly in a fortnight ?
14:43:36linuxstbGodEater: Probably worth mentioning that it's in London...
14:44:05GodEaterthe "3" implies this does it not ?
14:44:16 Join Thundercloud [0] (
14:44:20linuxstbI guess - but for new readers...
14:44:21GodEaterit's not "DevConPubAbroad"
14:44:30pondlifeMaybe, name your date
14:44:42linuxstbSo we've claimed DevConPub as being (C) London? ;)
14:46:14pondlifeUK at least...
14:46:52GodEaterpondlife: you can come and look and go "ooooh" at the Gigabeat S60s
14:47:19pondlifeArm wrestle for one?
14:47:22pondlifeI'll get in training....
14:47:35GodEatersure - wrestle linuxstb
14:47:58*pondlife imagines GodEater returning home with 5 new DAPs
14:48:09GodEater...and a worn out arm
14:48:27GodEaterOct. 8th ?
14:48:43pondlifeNo good for me.
14:49:01 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
14:49:29 Join GodEater [0] (n=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
14:49:38*GodEater curses CGI-IRC
14:49:54GodEaterwhen would suit you then sir ?
14:52:05B4gderI checked Ainol's web site and find no mentioning of V2000, but I find they have a U20 model who they advertise with the words "Austria chip" and it certainly made me smile
14:53:39GodEaterso - are there any telechips players in the "queue" to be ported ?
14:53:58B4gderTMM says he wants to work on the iAudio 7
14:53:59*GodEater makes oblique references to an email he wasn't sent
14:54:10GodEateris that it though ?
14:54:21B4gderclaimed to be TCC77x
14:54:38GodEaterseems a shame to "waste" such a bounty :)
14:55:10B4gderand it claims 60 hours run-time...
14:55:42GodEaterthat's fairly impressive
14:55:47B4gder16GB version "coming soon"
14:55:51*JdGordon wishes he was taught mroe about hardware hacking in his course
14:55:53Lars_GGodEater: I'd also think a lot of people would love to have a go at rockbox in the new classic/fatty pods
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14:56:22GodEaterLars_G: there's that huge "encrypted firmware" hurdle to get over first there though
14:56:58GodEaterwhich personally doesn't make me want to start a port on any of them
14:57:30pondlifeGodEater: 18th Oct?
14:58:28Zagorthe cowon d2 could be a fun target, since it has a touchscreen. lots of new code to write! :-)
14:58:40shepRd_mmm, my Sansa e250 hardlocked with a "Data abort at 01FC13F0" .. do I have to pull/short the batteries or wait for them to run flat to get past?
14:58:51JdGordonis the d2 the one with the same hardware as the mrobe 500?
14:59:00ZagorJdGordon: I don't know
14:59:03Lars_GGodEater: I think that makes it more valuable... well it would once rockbox has a working usb stack.. would be the "replace your closed OF completely and save your device!" idea
14:59:16GodEaterpondlife: I've noted it down - check with linuxstb. I have to go off an nuke a virus infected server.
14:59:26GodEaterLars_G: how does it make it more valuable ?
14:59:28ZagorJdGordon: yeah, looks very similar anyway
14:59:31pondlifeOK, I'm happier to wait if it means we can get more people
14:59:49*JdGordon is slwoly getting the ui ready for touch screen waiting for th emrobe to star working :p
14:59:49ZagorshepRd_: hold the power button until it goes black
14:59:54pondlifeNot that you and linuxstb were unpleasant company...
15:00:24Lars_GGodEater: because it offers people who like the hardware but not the extra closed software an option to have the hardware and use it as they see fit
15:00:29shepRd_Zagor: thanks, I just didn't hold long enough ;-
15:00:37B4gderabout 15 seconds should do it
15:00:49Lars_Gthe only important part here is that it should be a full replacement.
15:01:02ZagorLars_G: this is not just a question of us now wanting to port. apple made a deliberate effort to prevent us.
15:01:05Lars_Gand without touching the OF at all (or inspecting it) or our american friends would go to jail.
15:01:12*Lars_G nods
15:01:14shepRd_I tried a few combo's to see if I could guess a hidden key combo ;-)
15:01:14Lars_GI get that
15:01:28 Join DerPapst [0] (
15:01:36Lars_GIn fact if I must be sicnere this is the reason I will be switching from iPod to sansa
15:01:39DerPapstgood afternoon :)
15:01:44Lars_Gonce I figure and fix my convolute podcast system
15:01:47linuxstbpondlife, GodEater: I think the 18th is OK for me - too early to tell...
15:02:27linuxstbJdGordon: The D2 has a telechips cpu IIRC.
15:03:06linuxstbJdGordon: And there's a version available now with DAB radio, so it's an interesting target for that reason...
15:03:10Zagorlinuxstb: doesn't the mrobe?
15:03:21Zagoroh, ok
15:03:26B4gdermrobe 500 is tms320dm320
15:03:30Zagorthey look so similar I thought it was the same design
15:04:09JdGordonthe mrobe has a bloody camera... who the heck puts a camera onto an mp3 player :p
15:04:19B4gderd2 is said to have a TCC7801 (in a rockbox mailing I found)
15:04:34Zagorwikipedia concurs
15:04:37*JdGordon looks at "olympus" and changes the senatces to say who the heck puts a mp3 player onto a camera
15:05:16B4gderits odd that they brand some things cowon and some things iAudio
15:05:52JdGordon.. and digital radio doesnt imterest me at all... its the same crap music at better quality
15:06:10linuxstbOr (in the UK at least), worse quality...
15:06:38B4gderthe D2 claims 52 hours run-time
15:06:53B4gderCowon really does excel at the claimed run-times
15:06:56linuxstbSimilar to the iAudio 7 - which claims 60.
15:07:24JdGordonah, I was thining the cowan A2..
15:07:57***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:10:04B4gderJdGordon: does the mrobe500 use 24 bit lcd?
15:10:21JdGordon16bit i tihnk
15:10:42B4gderI see the D2 is at least claimed to be 24bit
15:11:08B4gderand APE support... :-O
15:11:21Zagor"APE will be supported by future firmware upgrade."
15:11:39ZagorI bet they have lots of requests for that
15:12:00*linuxstb is curious to know what compression levels they can handle
15:12:01B4gderoh yeah, both APE users mailed them ;-P
15:12:20Zagor"Video File up to 320x240(QVGA), 30fps"
15:12:40Zagorrecords radio to wma!
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15:12:51linuxstbNow that's the killer feature for me...
15:12:51Zagorhow odd
15:13:13linuxstbI hope it doesn't do that for DAB...
15:13:19amiconn_JdGordon: The D2 has a bloody touch screen :(
15:13:30Zagorcan't see anything about dab. only fm radio.
15:13:38JdGordonwhy the :( makes for some fun code
15:14:07amiconn_Touch operation is a pita for a dap imo
15:14:12linuxstbZagor: It's relatively new, and I think only available in the UK
15:14:24GodEaterlinuxstb: do you mean "killer" in the sense that it's killed your desire for it ? :)
15:14:29JdGordondepends how its done
15:14:40ZagorI tend to agree with amiconn about touchscreen. but it could be fun to code!
15:14:54amiconn_I mean touch in general, not only touch screen
15:15:00linuxstbGodEater: It's made me want to fix it...
15:15:09Zagoryeah, I want a solid click when I press something
15:15:28JdGordonthe click sound makes it better, but yeah, proper buttons are nicer
15:15:41linuxstbD2 with DAB review -,39029994,49292360,00.htm
15:15:45amiconn_I tried using the ipod in the car. The wheel is a real pita whitout looking at the unit
15:16:26*JdGordon tihnks apple is in cahoots with insurance car companies or something.. bound to be lots of itouch related accidents
15:16:27ZagorI played with a d2 during lunch. for some reason they require double-click to open each function...
15:16:36Zagorvery annoying
15:16:46JdGordondouble click? or select then click?
15:17:02Zagorunsure, could be select+click.
15:17:12JdGordonthe same as the mr500 then
15:17:25Zagorwith big honking icons it's quite unnecessary imho
15:17:53Zagormaybe you'd want that for the "delete all" button, but not basic menus
15:18:26JdGordonbig icons is for fat fingures...
15:18:47JdGordonand yeah, the select then click is needed or else your bound to do something you dont want
15:19:20 Part przemhb
15:19:25bluebrotheranyone with an x5v around?
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15:20:20linuxstbJdGordon: Sounds like a setting is needed...
15:20:41JdGordonyour being sarcastic.. right....?
15:21:15linuxstbGiven our sample, 50% of users want select+click, 50% want single-click...
15:21:40JdGordon if you want to try it out...
15:21:56 Join maraz [0] (
15:22:11ZagorI've never needed select+click on any other touchscreen device, why would I need it now?
15:22:14linuxstbThe only touch-screen device I have is a GPS, which is single-click, and I have no problem with it.
15:22:24ZagorEven the tomtom in my car doesn't have it
15:22:51JdGordonactually.. to tell you the truth, I never actually tried it with single click
15:22:54Zagorwe don't exactly have a lot of destructive actions anyway
15:23:03JdGordonI did it 2 clicks because i hadnt got the scrolling working yet :p
15:23:41JdGordonwe have 1 killer destructive action... load track
15:23:49JdGordonaccidentl click will wipe your playlist
15:24:12linuxstbIsn't there already a setting for that?
15:24:20Zagorparty mode :)
15:24:22bluebrotheryou can enable "warn on erasing dynamic playlist" (or similar)
15:26:24*JdGordon changes vote to single click
15:26:25Zagor[main.c] Cachable memory pool from [0x%x] size=[0x%x]
15:26:33JdGordonwitht he proviso that the scroller gets more work :p
15:26:42Zagorlooks like cowon left lots of debug info in their firmware
15:26:57B4gderthat we like!
15:27:05*bluebrother considers double click useless even on the PCs desktop
15:27:12Zagorand it's unscrambled
15:27:25B4gderZagor: but with two checksums somewhere in the header...
15:27:30bluebrotherwhat firmware? Iaudio 7?
15:27:33ZagorB4gder: ok
15:27:40B4gderif "telchip standard" at least
15:27:40Zagorbluebrother: i'm looking at the d2
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15:29:42Zagorweird three-step firmware upgrade process with reboots between each step
15:30:03linuxstbZagor: Yes, I looked at that - it wasn't at all clear what was happening...
15:31:16RincewindZagor: You are responsible for the web page, right?
15:31:25ZagorRincewind: yes
15:31:32Rincewindwould it be possible to have 10 commit messages on the front page?
15:31:44*linuxstb wanted to ask the same question
15:31:47*markun also votes for more than 4
15:32:09linuxstbAlso, the timestamps on the front page and "last 4 weeks" page are in different timezones...
15:32:11Rincewindbecause with the current 5 i always have to check further to get all commits since the last day
15:32:12Zagoryou have 15 if you click the header
15:33:04Zagorwe can't have everything on the front. it's already very crowded.
15:33:20 Part Lars_G
15:33:49Rincewindwould it be possible to have always the commits from the last 30 hours on the front page?
15:34:04scorchethat could get very long...
15:34:11*JdGordon joins the voting and agrees with the others
15:34:15Zagorvery very long
15:34:20Rincewindthen it is sometimes more and sometimes less and if I check regularly I don't have to click to a second page
15:34:35ZagorRincewind: the front page is not the "development status" page.
15:34:37peturZagor: but you could add the 'since 4 weeks' link back
15:34:38scorcheespecially is JdGordon is committing anything that day...
15:34:45JdGordonhaw haw haw
15:34:51Zagorpetur: look again :)
15:34:59JdGordonZagor: can you add anchors to the recent.html page please?
15:35:05ZagorJdGordon: sure
15:35:16peturZagor: nice - thanks
15:35:34JdGordon:) cheers
15:35:51*DerPapst thinks "who" should be the 2nd column on the svn table
15:35:56Rincewindanother thing, if I click the "subversion" header, it should go directly to the anchor Subversion
15:36:17DerPapstRincewind: that is what JdGordon just requested ;)
15:36:42amiconn_DerPapst:: Imo 'what' and 'where' is more important information than 'who'
15:36:44Rincewindah ok, I was typing without reading everything first ^^
15:36:49Zagoranchors added
15:37:09JdGordonall hail Zagor the great !
15:37:18DerPapstamiconn_: hmm... ok ;)
15:39:06RincewindZagor: would it be possible to add the "since 4 weeks, since 2.5 etc" links to the bottom of recent.html, too?
15:42:11RincewindAnother idea: maybe the svn revision number, too? Maybe this can be put under the date in a smaller font and only on since-4weeks.html and similar
15:42:24 Quit kwanteen__ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
15:42:53ZagorRincewind: just mouse-over one of the "where" links to see the revision
15:42:58Zagorin the url
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15:43:31Rincewindok, I didn't know that. that's ok for me, then.
15:46:26bluebrotherZagor: how about adding it as title tag to the timestamp? IIRC it should show as pop-up while hovering then
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15:55:02Zagorbluebrother: that's an idea. remind me tomorrow :)
15:56:28 Quit tictoc (Remote closed the connection)
15:57:59scorchewell i go
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16:00:37 Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
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16:03:11 Quit FOAD (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:03:12 Nick FOAD_ is now known as FOAD (
16:03:16 Quit jac0b (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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16:08:49 Join kugel [0] (
16:09:12kugelcan someone change my username at the tracker please?
16:10:42B4gderfrom what to what?
16:12:21kugelgodess to kugel
16:12:29kugelmaybe even kugel.
16:13:07B4gderit seems I can't change the user name
16:13:38B4gderI suggest you register with your new name and i can delete the old one
16:14:22kugelemail address taken
16:14:37kugeldelete it before i reregister please
16:17:56kugelthank you
16:18:25kugelcan you tell me what those diffenrent highlightenings of the tasks mean?
16:18:42kugelsome are cyan, some orange, some red
16:18:56B4gderseverity level i think
16:19:06B4gderand no, we don't really care about that... :-)
16:19:37XavierGrnow that is lame!
16:19:38markunB4gder: I just looked at the firmware upgrade of the Gemei X-900. Looks a lot like the one of the Ainol V2000
16:19:47markunbut not the same open source products used
16:19:53XavierGrmingw and vmware is exactly the same in speed
16:20:00B4gdermarkun: another chinese ?
16:20:25XavierGrtime (make && make install) resulted in 4.30 minutes for both (up and down)
16:21:10B4gdermarkun: I summed up yours and my findings here =>
16:23:15 Join B4gder_ [0] (
16:23:24 Quit B4gder (Connection reset by peer)
16:23:25markunB4gder_: interested in the X900 firmware?
16:24:42B4gder_are the .ldr extensions the ones the used originally?
16:25:00 Quit maxkelley (Remote closed the connection)
16:25:04 Join maxkelley [0] (
16:25:25B4gder_seems to be the same file format
16:25:32markunB4gder_: the upgrades both also contained a "mguires" folder with skins for the interface
16:26:30markuna google for "main.ldr" brings up a lot of links to either Ainol or Gemei related pages
16:27:11B4gder_yeah, same APE, same unzip, same NES, same libjpeg, same wxMusik etc
16:27:30markunbut no ffmpeg
16:27:36markunbut I found xvid
16:28:51 Join atsea- [0] (i=atsea-@gateway/tor/x-3d667e448abdbf72)
16:28:52B4gder_"c:\main.ldr" ...
16:29:12B4gder_it certainly looks like this OS accesses the disk with drive letters in DOS style
16:30:05B4gder_video\wmv\decode\ms_src\ms_orig is indeed an interesting path
16:30:33 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
16:32:15markun"Would need a sector size > 16k, which GEMDOS can't work with"
16:32:36B4gder_yeah GEMDOS seems to be the OS
16:32:52B4gder_but it's not really clear to me
16:33:03markunyes, the same strings in the v2000 file
16:33:34B4gder_I found this on GEMDOS =>
16:34:46markunand some links to Atari ST stuff
16:35:00B4gder_yes =>
16:36:02B4gder_... /* Use Atari GEMDOS variation of MS-DOS fs */
16:36:20markunhm, ok, so maybe only the fs
16:36:47B4gder_I wonder if there might be some chinese unicode comments/strings in those images
16:39:15markunI've tried "big5" and found no obvious block of strings
16:39:49B4gder_I wonder if this image is only the "application" chunk and not the actual OS
16:41:30B4gder_I'm off for now!
16:41:32 Quit B4gder_ ("It is time to say MOOO")
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16:45:52bluebrothersome tasks are too stupid to be true −− this "My problems" guy seems to be incapable to even STFW :(
16:46:25 Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
16:48:06 Nick parafin|away is now known as parafin (
16:48:32GodEaterbluebrother: task no ?
16:48:55*nls_ spots the topic count in the Audio playback & playlists forum :-D
16:49:16bluebrotherGodEater: Bagder just requested a reopen request on that task ...
16:50:07*GodEater can't spot it
16:50:31bluebrotherFS #7805
16:51:23bluebrotherkugel: I believe dionoea wanted to look into porting info-zip to rockbox
16:53:34GodEaterI must be slow today
16:53:37GodEaterSTFW ?
16:53:50bluebrothersearch the fine web
16:53:51nls_search the friggin wiki ?
16:57:47 Quit Ghwomb ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
17:00:10GodEaterForums. Post marked "Help| 2 questions". User is clearly a genius.
17:05:21 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
17:05:23 Quit atsea- (Remote closed the connection)
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17:07:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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17:11:00TMMlinuxstb: hey man! alive?
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17:12:45*linuxstb checks
17:12:48linuxstbTMM: Yes.
17:20:23 Nick hannesd_ is now known as hannesd (
17:21:11*Nico_P likes the gradient line selector a lot
17:21:51linuxstbDoes it work correctly with scrolling lines?
17:22:03Nico_Pgood qustion
17:22:26Nico_Pit does
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17:22:55bluebrotherdoes it work on greyscale as well?
17:22:59Nico_Pa problem I noticed is that it displays two gradients in screens where two lines are selected
17:23:16bluebrothermight be an interesting effect to have two greyscales as selection
17:24:09Nico_PI don't think it works on grayscale but it can probably be adapted
17:24:52bluebrothernot sure if it would be useful in terms of readability though.
17:25:20*linuxstb wishes someone would sort out the status bar on the larger LCDs
17:25:33Nico_Plinuxstb: what do you mean ?
17:25:42Nico_Pah, the status bar
17:25:45 Quit shepRd_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:26:45 Join GodEater [0] (n=c2cbc95c@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
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17:27:02Nico_Plinuxstb: what would you like to see changed ?
17:28:14linuxstbNico_P: Firstly to use larger icons, but I think it needs to be themable to match the WPS.
17:31:16nls_linuxstb: agreed
17:32:59Nico_Plinuxstb: I agree too... this is yet another ocurrence of "rockbox needs to be prettir"
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17:39:56nls_Nico_P: it's also a usablility issue, the icons and text'can be quite hard to see on displays with very small pixels
17:40:57nls_wow this midiplugin sounds awful in my sim, wonder if it's a 64 bit thing as it sounds good on my player
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17:50:06 Join JTD121 [0] (i=183f652a@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
17:50:38JTD121Hey guys, I notice you don't have a port to the 2nd Gen Nano
17:50:48JTD121Would you guys consider a donation of one to start development?
17:50:59 Join Pete [0] (
17:51:10JTD121I was looking through all the FAQs to see if you would take a donation or something
17:51:13Nico_PJTD121: what's mainly needed is donation of an exploit method to run code on the nano 2G
17:52:04JTD121Ah, so you need someone that knows the hardware a little better than most people?
17:53:11Nico_Pit's actually more than that. Apple has implemented a protection to prevent users from running custom code on their players, so we'd need a workaround before even considering a port
17:53:28JTD121Alrighty, I see now
17:53:37Nico_PJTD121: it's also the same on the latest models
17:53:52JTD121I would imagine it was, since it seemed so effetive in the 2nd gen
17:55:18JTD121So there's no one at Apple that has 'leaked' any insight into it?
17:55:45Nico_Punfortunately, no
18:00:13 Quit amiconn_ ("CGI:IRC")
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18:07:30 Join toffe82 [0] (
18:08:25spiorfbut anyone has an idea on WHY they implement these protections?
18:08:51Nico_Pspiorf: probably to prevent people like us from running code
18:08:53spiorfi mean, if a player can run rockbox, this can only be an added value
18:09:02 Quit daurn|laptop (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:09:06nls_amiconn: could you share one of your midis that are too complicated for the midiplay plugin to keep up or point me to where I can find a free one?
18:09:08Nico_Pspiorf: it means less control for them
18:09:11spiorf= more people will buy player
18:09:30Nico_Pspiorf: they want you to use iTunes
18:09:39bluebrotherspiorf: I guess the main reason are those cheap chinese rip-offs.
18:09:40spiorfoh, THAT
18:10:00Nico_Pbluebrother: why ?
18:10:06 Join daurn|laptop [0] (n=fake@unaffiliated/daurnimator)
18:10:08spiorfyeah, why=
18:10:08GodEaterspiorf: people who buy their music through itunes == $$$ to Apple. They couldn't give a crap about the >1% of their users that use Rockbox.
18:10:15bluebrotherwell, if they start to pirate their software ...
18:10:20GodEateror <1% even
18:10:45Peteanyone familiar with gigabeat insides? i appear to have bust my screen while taking the thing apart. stupid curiosity
18:10:57bluebrotherand the users won't notice it.
18:11:06spiorfi bought an ipod nano because it can run rockbox
18:11:21Nico_Pbluebrother: the chinese ripoffs don't have the sema hardware at all, do they ?
18:11:22markunPete: 'bust' in which way?
18:11:27spiorfif it wasn't "hackable" i would have bought something cheaper
18:11:32GodEaterspiorf, and you're in that <1% then - that they don't care about.
18:11:43 Quit pondlife ("disconnected has pondlife")
18:11:55bluebrotherI don't think it's much of the apple buyers who bought the Ipod because of Rockbox
18:12:06spiorfmy point was: if they don't care, why spending money and time to avoid people like me running rockbox?
18:12:08 Join lazka [0] (
18:12:15Peteat first i could see that the lcd was displaying things but the backlight wouldnt work, now in attempting to fix the backlight nothing appears on the screen at all
18:12:50bluebrotherthey don't care if they loose buyers like you −− you also won't use the ITMS most likely
18:12:57GodEaterspiorf: because then you become part of 99.9% that they do care about :)
18:13:14markunPete: there are only 2 connectors I think. Are both of them connected?
18:13:33bluebrotherNico_P: I see two problems: (1) ripoffs that are different, users don't notice it and call apple because they think it's an Ipod
18:13:53Peteyeah, the backlight one was disconnected but i think i got it reseated ok, although i do hate ribbon cables
18:14:13bluebrother(2) ripoffs trying to clone the hardware or trying to disassemble the Ipod (both in hardware and software terms) to clone it even much better.
18:14:18 Quit petur ("work->home")
18:15:10kfazzwhere exactly are the statusbar icons defined?
18:15:38GodEaterin the source code I'd imagine
18:15:41 Join Dark_Apostrophe [0] (n=darkapos@supporter/monthlybyte/DarkApostrophe)
18:15:49bluebrothercheck apps/recorder/icons.[ch]
18:16:04Dark_ApostropheNow that I have Rockbox on my Toshiba gigabeat f20, do I need the cradle for anything?
18:16:04Nico_Pbluebrother: good points, but I think the main reason is still lokc-in
18:16:16Nico_Pkfazz: I'm working on the gradient patch right now
18:16:18markunDark_Apostrophe: nope
18:16:21bluebrotherNico_P: that would be (3) ;-)
18:16:22Nico_Pkfazz: hope you don't mind
18:16:25markunDark_Apostrophe: good to hear it all worked out :)
18:16:27Dark_Apostrophemarkun: Ok
18:16:28kfazzi passed that up first time thinking it was archos specific
18:16:42Dark_Apostrophemarkun: linuxstb helped me out
18:16:49*bluebrother read an article about chinese hardware piracy a while ago
18:16:49Dark_Apostrophemarkun: Works like a charm
18:16:51kfazzNico_P: what on?
18:17:01kfazzno i don't
18:17:12Dark_Apostrophemarkun: Also, just one more question: Is there a way to delete files from within Rockbox's own file manager?
18:17:17 Quit Jon-Kha ("leaving")
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18:17:30bluebrotherand it seems it has become a *huge* problem for the industry (they gave an example on Harting, which are making industry connectors)
18:17:30Nico_Pkfazz: I've been cleaning it up and now I'm adding separate modes for solid colour and gradient colour
18:17:38Nico_Pkfazz: I'm hoping to commit it
18:18:07markunDark_Apostrophe: sure, just hold select and choose "delete"
18:18:15markunselect = center of cross
18:18:26Dark_Apostrophemarkun: If I push select, it starts playing off the files
18:18:26kfazzdo you think it's better to draw the gradient in FG or BG?
18:18:43kfazzif in FG you can see it over bitmaps
18:18:51Nico_Pkfazz: FG makes more sense to me
18:18:56Nico_Pkfazz: what bitmaps ?
18:19:02nls_Dark_Apostrophe: hold it down a little longer
18:19:31kfazzdid you see the screenshot in the forum thread with black background and just the selected text color changed?
18:19:33Dark_ApostropheHmm, you're right - thanks
18:19:39kfazzbitmaps as in a background pic
18:19:46Dark_ApostropheAlso, there are certain directories I don't need to have visual in the file browser
18:20:00Dark_Apostrophefonts, fwimg, image
18:20:03Nico_Pkfazz: ah, the backdrop... well I believe the line selector should hide the backdrop
18:20:13Dark_ApostropheIs it possible to make them not show in the file browser?
18:20:33markunDark_Apostrophe: HOLD, not just push
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18:20:46Dark_Apostrophemarkun: I just saw that. :)
18:20:51kfazzso do i, which was why i changed it, but that eliminates the possibilty of using a different font color as the selector
18:21:09kfazzwithout the gradient
18:21:09Nico_Pkfazz: also I fixed a slight display glitch... the gradient was drawing one line too much
18:21:11Dark_ApostropheSo can I make those directories invisible?
18:21:13 Join Arathis [0] (
18:21:31kfazzthat was pretty much trial by error code
18:21:33markunDark_Apostrophe: if you don't plan to use the original firmware anymore you can replace the GBSYSTEM folder with our dummy one (+ the bootloader)
18:21:43Nico_Pkfazz: I hadn't realised that
18:21:44bluebrotherDark_Apostrophe: set the hidden flag using the PC and then select something different than "all" as filetype view
18:22:08Dark_Apostrophebluebrother: hidden flag = a dot before the directory
18:22:41Dark_ApostropheAlso, all of the video, music etc... dirs are within gbsystem/
18:23:31bluebrotherDark_Apostrophe: no.
18:23:56bluebrotherthere are two types of hidden files: (1) files starting with a dot. That's the way to hide files on *nix systtems.
18:24:09Dark_ApostropheWell, I use Debian on all my computers
18:24:26bluebrother(2) set the "hidden" flag in the filesystem. FAT has a hidden flag. If that is set the file won't show up in the browser
18:24:40bluebrotheryou can use mtools for that
18:25:05Dark_ApostropheWait, can I just move the music and video directories to /?
18:25:20Dark_ApostropheI don't plan to use the original firmware for anything.
18:25:26bluebrotheryou can move the data files to any place you like
18:25:28Dark_ApostropheHell, I think it's not even there any more.
18:25:39Dark_ApostropheWhat about the existing music database though?
18:26:06markunDark_Apostrophe: be careful not to remove GBSYSTEM/FWIMG/FWIMG01.DAT (which is the bootloader)
18:26:11bluebrotheriirc the OF will automatically set the hidden flag on the system folder
18:26:34markunsome other files need to have a minimal file size or else the Gigabeat refuses to boot
18:27:14Dark_Apostrophecan I just set the hidden flag on gbsystem/ and ignore it all?
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18:28:18 Quit Isolinear (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:28:40Dark_Apostrophemarkun: So wha toptuions do I pass to mtools?
18:28:46Dark_Apostrophewhat options*
18:29:07markunnever used mtools
18:29:50markunDark_Apostrophe: is there a 'attrib' tool?
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18:34:25 Quit GodEater ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
18:36:40Dark_Apostrophedarkapostrophe@Shadowfax:/media/disk$ mattrib +h gbsystem/
18:36:40Dark_ApostropheCan't open /dev/fd0: No such device or address
18:36:40Dark_ApostropheCannot initialize 'A:'
18:40:18 Quit The-Compiler ("Connection reseted by god")
18:40:21 Join Lear [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear)
18:41:12bluebrotherDark_Apostrophe: you can't run mtools on any path, you need to run it on drive letters
18:41:15 Join vasp [0] (
18:41:26bluebrothercheck /etc/mtools.conf
18:41:54vasphi, how is the battery-life reduction when using rockbox on a 5g ipod at the moment?
18:41:59bluebrotherand then you can do something like mattrib +h Z:/gbsystem
18:42:16bluebrotherit's still worse compared to the OF.
18:42:38 Quit rockho (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
18:42:45vaspI can live with worse, but not useless..
18:43:11bluebrotherthere are people using their Ipods with Rockbox, so I think it's useable
18:43:20bluebrothercheck the BatteryRuntime wiki page
18:43:26vaspok, thanx
18:43:30Dark_Apostrophebluebrother: Drive letters?!
18:43:36Dark_Apostrophebluebrother: this isn't windows, dude...
18:43:40bluebrotheryep ...
18:44:16bluebrotheryou still need drive letters (which are assigned in the configuration file)
18:44:27Ebert vasp
18:44:38Dark_ApostropheAnyway, how long should Doom take to start?
18:44:40bluebrotherand if you omit the drive letter a: is assumes −− that's the reason why it couldn't initialize a:
18:44:53bluebrotherit takes a few seconds on my player.
18:44:57 Quit obo ("bye")
18:45:11bluebrotherbut I don't own a color target. No idea if its much different
18:46:00vaspyeah, lookin' at it now Ebert. Whats being done to reduce power consumption, and is it likely to get better?
18:47:04bluebrotherthe assumption is that some parts of the hardware isn't initialized properly. But it's not known what exactly this is (and how to change it)
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18:49:32vaspokey. are there players that are more open with specs than the ipod?
18:50:42Domonokyvasp: yes.. all rockbox targets without the portalplayer chipset for example.. :-)
18:51:01Domonokyso everything not ipod or sansa i think.. :-)
18:51:20Dark_ApostropheMy gigabeat seems pretty open
18:51:32Dark_ApostropheFormatted, dumped some files in, and it was runnin Rockbox.
18:51:39Dark_ApostropheWell, not quite that simple, but almost. :)
18:51:57Ebertdark, i think gigabeat is the best port atm
18:52:19Dark_ApostropheProblem is - they're damn hard to find. I bought mine off eBay, and had to resurrect it
18:52:30*Domonoky still likes his h120 very much.. very stable.. and many features.. :-)
18:52:51vaspall I want is a player able to play flac, and have long battery life
18:53:00toffe82Dark_Apostrophe: where are you from , there are still a lot of working one on Ebay USA
18:53:15Dark_ApostropheI live in Norway...
18:53:58 Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
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18:54:19pixelmavasp: then the M5L would be something for you - even though they are hard to find. maybe you should have a look at the BuyersGuide in the wiki..
18:54:33*Domonoky would recommend a iaudio x5l or m5l to vasp..
18:55:07vaspI have to add one more spec; huge hard drive
18:56:06low_lightNico_P: can't a custom line selector just be a bitmap loaded as part of a theme/config? (like icons)
18:56:17Domonokyvasp: take a look at:
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18:56:33Nico_Plow_light: it could, but that would become slightly more compilcated
18:56:37Ebertthere are no older iriver players on ebay usa tho :)
18:56:41low_lightamiconn: good find on the c200 lcd :)
18:57:16Nico_Plow_light: I think custom colours/gradients are a good first step
18:58:17Dark_ApostropheOk, after moving the directories, the database plugin can't seem to find them again
18:58:31Dark_ApostropheHow to I force it to look in directories other than gbsystem/?
18:59:38low_lightNico_P: I would have thought it would be easier (no gradient calculation, etc), but I haven't looked at the patch.
19:00:22Nico_Plow_light: a problem I see is that bitmaps don't scale... gradients are easy to scale
19:02:33 Quit haemmy ()
19:03:15 Quit kfazz ("Leaving")
19:04:16 Join tpickers66 [0] (i=524529a2@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
19:04:19 Join haemmy [0] (n=stefan@
19:05:07 Quit Dark_Apostrophe (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
19:05:16 Quit vasp (Remote closed the connection)
19:08:00***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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19:12:04*bluebrother looks around for x5v ownser
19:12:13triscuithey, i have a question about a sixty gig ipod video.
19:12:34bluebrotherthat's fine. Interested in actually asking the question?
19:12:54bluebrotherno problem −− just ask
19:12:58triscuitit says data abort at 4000130c
19:13:07triscuitwon't shut off, restart or anything
19:13:13triscuittried to run rockvista wps
19:13:14bluebrotherdo you have the latest bootloader?
19:13:24triscuitinstalled it like three days ago
19:13:36bluebrotheryou can reset the Ipod by holding Menu + Select
19:13:44triscuitbeen trying that
19:14:01bluebrotheryou might need to flip the hold switch on and off first
19:14:21bluebrotherand then hold the buttons for quite a while −− something like up to 30 seconds isn't uncommon
19:14:23triscuitwtf dude...thank you much
19:14:38triscuittried that like fifteen times
19:14:42triscuitthat fixed it!
19:15:52 Quit petur ("switching...")
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19:18:42bluebrotherDomonoky: I considered doing another update release of rbutil. What do you think?
19:20:06 Quit low_light ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
19:22:02Domonokyno problem.. go on.. :-)
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19:22:53bluebrotherbtw, I noticed that the talk file windows didn't flicker anymore. Have you done something about that?
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19:23:34Domonokyno i havent done anything.. but it didnt flicker on windows.. so i dont know..
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19:29:10fm2I keep getting the following error when building the H120 sim: filetypes.c:89: error: `VOICE_EXT_RWPS' undeclared here (not in a function)
19:29:22fm2Even with the fresh SVN.
19:29:26nls_fm2 did you try a "make clean" ?
19:29:36*bluebrother wanted to ask the same
19:29:41fm2nls_: yes, sure
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19:29:56nls_and your source is entirely unmodified?
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19:30:31fm2nls_: yes (made svn revert)
19:31:00pixelmaalso tried to configure again?
19:31:01nls_fm2: have you tried running configure again?
19:31:03fm2The symbol is not in the generated file
19:31:08*nls_ too slow
19:31:40fm2pixelma, nls_: several times. The same is for building target and e200 sim (haven't tried the others)
19:31:46GodEateramiconn: around ?
19:32:09nls_fm2: try deleting your source checkout and start over...
19:32:35fm2This is the first time I experience the situation. I built RB without any problems before.
19:32:53sjnovickHi. I have a sandisk sansa c250. it that part of the c200 series?
19:33:07nls_sjnovick: yep
19:33:12fm2nls_: eyes, that would be the ultimate cure.
19:33:17bluebrotheryou could also grep the source tree for that symbol and then svn st the offending file
19:33:37nls_fm2: it seems to be the simplest solution
19:33:48fm2bluebrother: the "bad" file is automatically generated by a tool (genlang?)
19:34:01GodEateranyone from .de around ?
19:34:07bluebrotherGodEater: yep
19:34:12Domonokyfm2: try a make clean in the tools dir ?
19:34:16GodEaterbluebrother: is a known ISP ?
19:34:42bluebrothernot to me, but I'm not used to the ISP market.
19:35:06GodEatersomeone from that domain has been attempting to gain access to my PC
19:35:13GodEaterso I'm trying to work out who to complain to :)
19:35:41bluebrotherlet me check their website
19:36:02GodEaterlooks like a hosting company actually
19:36:22fm2Domonoky: is it the same as make veryclean from the build dir (I already did that)? I think, it's a problem with sources, will check out again.
19:36:29bluebrotheryeah, it is. I guess it's one of those smaller ISP / hosting companies.
19:37:27GodEaterguess one of their boxes has been rooted =/
19:37:46bluebrotherthey have and
19:38:41bluebrothercan't find any other address that looks better suited.
19:38:41 Quit fm2 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
19:38:56GodEaterI sent the email to
19:39:05GodEaterhe's listed as the contact for the domain
19:39:16GodEaterChristian Seitz apparently
19:39:35bluebrotherah, from the whois query? Haven't found that on the website.
19:40:35*GodEater hopes his very civil (I thought) email gets a nice polite reply
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19:51:46webguest42help!!! Rockbox unresponsive!!
19:52:22 Quit tpickers66 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
19:52:49GodEaterwebguest42!!!! How!!!! What DAP!!!!!?
19:53:15GodEaterbluebrother: on further investigation, I find more of the same from some israeli addresses too
19:53:23GodEaterclearly Mosad are after me
19:54:14webguest42I was just trying rockbox today on ipod 5.5 gen when it stops responding; backlight is working, but it wont turn off!!
19:54:24GodEaterwebguest42: so hard reset it
19:54:51webguest42it wont (Assuming it's Menu + sel)
19:55:09GodEaterhold switch to on, then to off again first
19:55:13GodEaterand it will do it
19:55:32GodEaterthere's nothing Rockbox does (or indeed COULD do) to intefer with this process - it's in the hardware
19:55:44webguest42phew thanks!!
19:56:22GodEaterfor the owners of the most unbrickable player ever - ipod owners do like to panic more than anyone else I've ever met
19:57:28GodEaterfor the record, the rockbox recommended way to brick your ipod is this: Use a hammer. A lot. Vigourously, and with gusto.
19:57:55GodEatersadly we've not figured out a way to do it with mere software
19:58:44DomonokyGodEater: maybe we could write a plugin to do this :-) rockbrick.rock :-)
19:58:55sjnovickNot exactly a rockbox question, but wondered if you had encountered this before:
19:59:09GodEaterDomonoky: well only if we could actually figure out a way to do it
19:59:51 Quit webguest42 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
19:59:51sjnovickIn linux, when I connect the sansa c250 for the first time, I can put files onto the device. I disconnect (unmount), turn off the device. turn it back on...and then the files become read only! I cannot touch the files, even as root! Has anyone ever had that complaint before?
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20:01:54GodEatersjnovick: is the drive mounted read-only (check with "mount")
20:02:24sjnovicki'll check.
20:03:25sjnovick[it takes a long time for the computer to recognize the c250...i connected it and now i'm waiting]
20:04:03GodEatersjnovick: is that just the HAL stuff? or does dmesg take ages to see it too ?
20:05:08sjnovicki must admit, i'm not a pro at linux. the device is automounted. i don't know HAL or dmesg (though I do know that HAL has something to do with device identification)
20:05:41GodEaterdmesg (when entered in a terminal) should show you the device pretty quickly
20:06:01GodEaterit'll be at the very bottom of the output (which will be quite lengthy usually)
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20:07:16sjnovickdmesg tells me that it's waiting for the device to settle
20:07:41GodEaterthat shouldn't take long at ALL
20:07:50GodEaterthe c2xx is flash based isn't it ?
20:07:54sjnovickit doesn't take any time on a windows box.
20:07:59sjnovickyes, flash based.
20:08:09GodEaterhow long have you had it ?
20:08:17sjnovicka few days
20:08:22GodEaterbrand new ?
20:08:41sjnovickNow, dmesg gives the message: "FAT: Filesystem panic" for this device.
20:08:47sjnovickIt works great in windows.
20:09:05sjnovickI just don't want to use it with windows computer...but might have to. :|
20:09:06GodEaterwhat device is it ? (/dev/sd something usually)
20:09:29 Quit pepie34 ("Ex-Chat")
20:09:54GodEateris the FAT panic complaining about /dev/sdb1 or just /dev/sdb ?
20:10:16sjnovickjust sdb1 a couple of sorry.
20:10:39GodEaterwhen you get back, run "fsck.vfat -a /dev/sdb1"
20:11:42 Quit austriancoder (Remote closed the connection)
20:15:01bluebrotherGodEater: sounds like a GoldenQuote candidate to me ;-)
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20:16:41saratogaBagder: could we put a Google Summer of Code 2008 link on the front page of
20:16:58saratogai'd like to start recruiting potiential applicats as soon as possible
20:17:20bluebrothersaratoga: why on the front page? Why not the wiki index page?
20:17:32saratogabluebrother: advertising
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20:17:55bluebrotherhehe ... but isn't it a bit too early for that?
20:17:56sjnovicksorry about that GodEater, I'm back.
20:18:01saratogalet more then just the main rockbox devs know about it before students begin trying to get summer internships
20:18:01Nico_Psaratoga: any reason you want to do it so early ?
20:18:23sjnovick"Invalid disk format in boot sector"
20:18:34pixelmasjnovick: was that always the same in linux?
20:19:05sjnovickAfter using the "reformat" option on the device, it works fine for the first connection.
20:19:20sjnovickBut, if I put a file on the device, then something bad happens.
20:19:27sjnovickA file, e.g., rockbox.
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20:19:33saratogaNico_P: figured it would be better to give everyone lots of time to propose ideas, etc
20:19:52saratogayou think this is too early?
20:21:12Nico_PI don't know... It's in a long time, but it's probably a good idea to start informing potential students soon
20:21:56saratogaanyway, I've proposed two projects, and was planning to get one of the CompE courses at my school to advertise for us
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20:24:49pixelmasjnovick: my idea was that maybe you don't have the c250 set to msc mode (in the original firmware's usb settings if they exist). Don't know what a reformat could have caused...
20:25:34sjnovickThat's the difference between the c200 and c250...I don't appear to have the ability to change to/from msc mode.
20:26:02Nico_Psaratoga: nice
20:27:09pixelmasjnovick: you may have a firmware revision (of the original one) that disabled the setting (v 1.01.05 or 1.01.06 IIRC)
20:27:26sjnovickah perhaps. maybe i can downgrade!
20:27:50Ebertdid rockbox participate in the "google summer of code"?
20:29:32 Join My_Sic [0] (
20:30:02Ebertwhen's the next time google is doing another?
20:30:24Domonokysummer 08
20:31:28zewhen's the next time we're gonna have a july?
20:31:32 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
20:31:41*Ebert runs from july's heat
20:31:57bluebrotherze: no idea ... could you enlighten me? ;-)
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20:42:47amiconnGodEater: I'm here now.
20:44:20GodEateramiconn: doesn't matter - bluebrother helped me out
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20:50:51DXMrockbox works in new shuffle?
20:51:11*amiconn is a little bit puzzled
20:51:33amiconnnls_: Is there a reason why that const'ed table shouldn't be int32_t instead of long?
20:51:39bluebrotherDXM: no
20:51:53DXMtks ;D
20:51:56 Part DXM
20:52:02bluebrotherthe front page clearly states that ...
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20:53:47*bluebrother wonders why people can't just read the frontpage
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20:59:50Lloreanbluebrother: I think they just always assume there might be more up to date info in here
21:00:43bluebrotherand ignore the fact that the last update in the "project news" section is only about a week old. Hmpf.
21:02:09 Quit Pete (Nick collision from services.)
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21:02:34advcomp2019plus the shuffle does not have display
21:03:13Lloreanadvcomp2019: And Rockbox has voice. There'd be no reason not to port to a display-less target.
21:03:54advcomp2019o ok did not know
21:05:58*amiconn thinks that a port to one of the shuffles would in fact be quite interesting
21:06:18amiconnUnfortunately the chances for such a port are very low
21:06:38 Join hannesd_ [0] (
21:07:15Nico_Pamiconn: the hardware is unknown ?
21:08:02***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
21:08:23amiconnShuffle 1st gen is an architecture not supported by gcc or any other free C compiler
21:08:47 Join MethoS- [0] (
21:09:01amiconnShuffle 2nd and 3rd gen are the same unknown, encrypted and protected stuff as the 2nd+ gen nano and the classic
21:09:10Nico_Poh, pity :(
21:09:48Nico_Pbtw, you said this: "[14:16] <amiconn_> JdGordon: There are still several more important things to implement than viewports"... what do you have in mind ?
21:10:03marazwonder why they keep restricting the format...
21:10:40amiconnE.g. the suspend implementation for 1st/2nd gen, involving a more or less total power management rework
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21:11:45advcomp2019there is a the displayless stone but i think you talked about it before
21:13:19amiconnNico_P: The shuffle 1st gen is a Sigmatel chipset, which has a motorola DSP56000 core
21:14:03Nico_Pamiconn: ok, well if you find some time to start implementing viewports, I'm sure lots of people will want to see the patch :)
21:14:12gregjrockbox crashes on this
21:14:14amiconnSo in case someone wants to port the whole thing to DSP assembler.... a bit too hard if you ask me
21:16:24advcomp2019amiconn, i was talking about the displayless creative zen stone
21:17:28 Quit desowin ("use linux")
21:20:24maxkelleywhat's the point of RB on the shuffle anyways? besides more codecs.
21:21:14 Join Lear_ [0] (i=chatzill@rockbox/developer/lear)
21:22:18Lloreanmaxkelley: Pretty much the whole point of Rockbox is unrestricted use of your player (any codecs the processor can play fast enough and UMS access).
21:22:43pixelmae.g. playlists without using a computer if I understand correctly, putting music there without itunes...
21:22:55amiconnMore control about the playback order (on the fly playlists etc)
21:23:54amiconnEven some plugins would probably make sense, especially if tts gets ported
21:24:58 Join ZeroA4 [0] (
21:25:27amiconnA port to the shuffle might attract blind users. They wouldn't miss the display, and the shuffle has real buttons, unlike the other ipods
21:25:59stevenmanyone with an H300 wanna try out v0.00001 of a drum sequencer plugin?
21:30:22mister_pinkhas anyone got a busted gigabeat with an intact screen? i seem to have broken mine...
21:34:06Nico_Pstevenm: why is it only on H300 ?
21:34:59stevenmNico_P, that's the only device I have, and technically it isn't even mine. It is just the very beginning. Colors are randomly picked instead of carefully chosen, you can't edit the pattern yet and auto-play, etc.
21:35:29stevenmBut you can keep hitting Next and it will step thru the pattern, hilight the right parts on the screen, and play it
21:35:33Nico_Pstevenm: do you know about the uisimulator ?
21:36:11stevenmNico_P, yes, I've been using that to test, and I could use it to set the screen locations for other targets. But I only started on this yesterday
21:36:25stevenmstill a lot of work to be done
21:36:29Nico_Pok... it sounds like a cool plugin anayway
21:36:59stevenmyeah. i've got the beat from Goodbye Horses (from silence of the lambs) hardcoded in there now and playing it is way more fun than should be :)
21:39:51 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
21:40:19stevenmBy the way, is there any sort of conversion tool or macro to convert RRGGBB colors into native device LCD colors?
21:40:24 Join spiorf [0] (
21:41:22Nico_Pstevenm: there is hex_to_rgb that takes a string whith hex values and returns an int
21:41:32stevenmNico_P, aah, thanks!
21:41:39Nico_Pyou can then use the int with the RGB_PACK and RGB_UNPACK macros
21:41:58Nico_Pdon't know what's in the plugin API, though... look in plugin.h
21:42:10stevenmyay. looks like RGB_PACK is what I was looking for
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21:44:01sgsaxso I've noticed lots of talk about blind-friendly features, has rb always been reaching out to this audience?
21:46:08stevenmI think the voice menus were added a while back.. a few years maybe?
21:46:33sgsaxnot blind myself, but I think the idea is fantastic
21:46:45sgsaxit's something you just don't normally see
21:46:49sgsax(no pun intended)
21:47:46sgsaxwas jsut wondering if it was one of the original project goals, or just a happy coincedence
21:47:58stevenmi think it came in midway
21:48:22 Quit Lear (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:50:38amiconnThe voice UI was added in March 2004 - long before any swcodec target was supported
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22:01:41*Nico_P is quite pleased with the improved line selector patch :)
22:01:53fm2Anybode here who's familiar with .lang file format and genlang script?
22:02:02stevenmNico_P, ooh what's it do?
22:02:17maxkelleytell me, sister morphine.
22:02:21Nico_Pstevenm: look at FS #7808
22:02:33*maxkelley looks
22:03:37fm2I had the problem that not all of VOICE_xxx symbols were added to the generated lang.h file, e.g. VOICE_EXT_RWPS which led to compile errors in filetypes.c. Checking out RB anew didn't help.
22:04:05fm2So I looked into genlang and saw that entries with ": none" are ignored. Am I right?
22:04:59maxkelleyI'd like that committed.
22:05:12fm2genlang:399: ""none" as dest (without quotes) means that this entire phrase is to be ignored"
22:05:38fm2But how should it work then? There are many entries with "none" in them.
22:05:54fm2Bagder: could you shed some light?
22:06:19maxkelleywould it be possible to log gpio status while in OF?
22:06:34maxkelleyer, well, nevermind.
22:07:02Bagderfm2: I don't quite understand the question
22:07:52fm2Bagder: the question is: why is VOICE_EXT_RWPS ignored by genlang whereas other entries with "none" are not.
22:08:17BagderI have no idea
22:08:21amiconnAll entries while evaluate to none: are ignored. That's intended behaviour
22:08:22fm2I replaced "none" with "" in that entry and it found its way into the generated lang.h
22:08:34Bagdernone or not equal to ""
22:08:40Bagdernot is not equal I meant
22:08:47Bagder"" means the string is nothing
22:08:57Bagdernone means the string isn't used and isn't used in the output at all
22:09:09amiconnOf course not all entries that have none: as one possibility evaluate to none. That depends on the selected target and its features
22:09:28amiconnE.g. VOICE_EXT_RWPS only makes sense on targets wtih a remote lcd.
22:10:24bluebrotherpixelma: what do you thing about hiding the base url for wiki links and showing only the wiki page name in the manual? It's hyperlinked anyway
22:10:26fm2Bagder: it was (line 10019 in english.lang): *: none And I replaced it with *: ""
22:10:43HardDisk_WP[amsg] hallo
22:11:14Bagderfm2: none means it isn't used
22:11:19Bagderthen it makes no defines either
22:11:54fm2Bagder: but I build the sim for H120. It's used there (it's in filetypes.c)
22:12:14Bagderafaik, the h120 sim builds fine
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22:12:55pixelmabluebrother: I can imagine that a few people also like to read the pdf in printed form...
22:13:09Bagderfm2: is your build different in any way?
22:13:16fm2But not for me :-( And I've checked out everything just a minute ago.
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22:13:30fm2Absolutely no changes
22:14:09*Bagder tries
22:14:15fm2But VOICE_EXT_RWPS is not in the generated lang.h That's what's driving me mad
22:14:26bluebrotherhmm. Maybe add an icon that indicated a wiki page and print the base url somewhere in the introductory section?
22:15:09bluebrotherand besides, when reading the printed manual −− do those people really want to type in the complete urls?
22:15:09fm2So I tried to understand how genlang works and found there the line 397 which ignores entries with the value 'none'
22:15:22Bagdergrep RWPS lang.h
22:15:22Bagder VOICE_EXT_RWPS,
22:15:34 Join gammy [0] (
22:15:44Bagderbuilt h120 sim right now
22:16:32Bagderfm2: does your app/remote (in the build dir) contain the "remote" feature?
22:16:43Bagderapps/features is the file name
22:17:41fm2Bagder: yes, line 14
22:17:53amiconnDoes the 'features' build require some special tools?
22:18:16Bagderjust the host cc
22:18:24Bagdergcc even
22:18:36bluebrothermaybe parsing features.txt uses the cross compiler by mistake?
22:19:05Bagderit used to
22:19:13pixelmabluebrother: that was just my first thought, I don't know if the complete url is necessary. I like the idea with an icon saying "wiki page" but I am not sure.
22:19:38bluebrotherI'll try creating a diff.
22:19:38Bagderthe Makefile does "$(SILENT)cat $< | $(HOSTCC)"
22:20:00Bagderand fm2's feature file seems to be correct
22:20:10Bagderfm2: cygwin or linux?
22:20:40fm2Bagder: cygwin. But it worked before!
22:20:51amiconnIt also uses grep
22:20:54Bagderand it seems to still work for others...
22:21:00Bagdertrue, it also uses grep
22:21:20amiconnMaybe it's a line ending issue?
22:21:37fm2Bagder: that's why I wonder! How am I different?
22:21:46amiconnfm2: Is your cygwin configured for unix or windows line endings?
22:21:58fm2amiconn: IIUC, genlang takes care of line endings
22:22:10 Quit DerPapst (Nick collision from services.)
22:22:15amiconnAnd do you use commandline svn, or e.g. tortoise
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22:22:24Bagderfm2: run make V=1 and check the genlang command line
22:22:30amiconnfm2: Genlang might, but grep might not
22:22:53fm2amiconn: I don't know anymore. How can I check?
22:22:55Bagderand make may not
22:23:00Bagder"$(SILENT)for f in `cat $(OBJDIR)/features`; do feat="$$feat:$$f" ; done; "
22:24:04 Quit freqmod (Remote closed the connection)
22:25:31fm2amiconn: is there a setting which I could check to tell whether cygwin is set up with CRLF or just CR (or just LF)?
22:25:57 Quit random_desu (SendQ exceeded)
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22:27:07fm2If I redirect the ouput of make to a file, CRLF are generated.
22:27:30fm2I probably have set it up so that it uses the same line endings as tortoise
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22:29:36BagderI still think make V=1 is your best next step
22:29:55fm2Bagder: genlang cmd line: perl -s /cygdrive/c/work/rockbox/svn/tools/genlang -p=/cygdrive/c/work/rockbox/svn/build_h120_sim/lang -t=h120$feat lang/english.lang
22:30:07Bagderthere's the problem
22:30:26fm2Bagder: how should it look like?
22:30:26Bagdervery strange
22:30:46Bagderthe -t there should list all "features" separated with colons
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22:31:21 Join florinp3 [0] (i=59888a98@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:31:49fm2Bagder: do you mean it's really a line endings problem?
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22:32:06 Quit Frazz (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:32:15BagderI'm not sure, but I'm sure there's a problem with the feat variable creation in the makefile
22:32:29Bagderit could be newlines
22:32:51fm2Bagder: where was that features file?
22:33:05Bagderin your build tree
22:33:06Nico_Ppeople, any comments/objections on FS #7808 ?
22:34:13fm2Bagder: changed line endings to UNIX there, trying...
22:34:29 Join Isolinear [0] (
22:35:52maxkelleyNico_P: I haven't tested it, but I like the idea.
22:36:45Nico_Pmaxkelley: thanks :) I'm seeking some more technical comments though
22:37:15 Quit miepchen^schlaf ("Verlassend")
22:37:56maxkelleyheh. the integrity of the usability of the patch therefore intensifies the necessitation of committing this improvisational element into the main subversion source branch.
22:38:06maxkelleyhow's that? :)
22:38:08pixelmaNico_P: don't you have more important things to do? ;P
22:38:10Nico_Pnice :)
22:38:53Nico_Ppixelma: I'm getting warmed up :)
22:38:58maxkelleypixelma: did Zagor publish his finds on the gpio pins for the c200?
22:39:50pixelmamaxkelley: didn't see aything specific
22:40:26Nico_Ppixelma: besides, eyecandy is important too ;)
22:40:38maxkelleyI agree with that point.
22:41:17fm2Bagder: yes, the problem was the line endings in features!
22:41:19 Quit florinp3 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:41:21maxkelleyif rockbox is to be a viable alternative for consumers to install by themselves, eyecandy will be a certain priority to them.
22:41:32Lloreanmaxkelley: How does that bar make it more usable?
22:41:46pixelmaNico_P: I didn't have a colour target until last Wednesday and really don't care about gradients in the selector bar
22:42:11LloreanI don't see how eyecandy makes it any more *viable* for consumers to install, it just makes it look more attractive.
22:42:12Bagderfm2: then I'd guess your cygwin has the wrong setting for that. Or similar...
22:42:30fm2I'll better change cygwin to use UNIX line endings!
22:42:47maxkelleyLlorean: it doesn't, but it makes it more likely for the common consumer to say, "Oh look, that looks cool, and increases the functionality of my player! hell yeah, I want it!"
22:42:49fm2Bagder: thank you!
22:42:56BagderI'm glad we nailed it
22:42:57 Quit merbanan ("Leaving")
22:43:07bluebrotherwe should better remove all eye-candy to disencourage ipod users installing Rockbox −− until all other bugs are fixed ;-)
22:43:07pixelmafm2: IIRC tortoise didn't like that but ask petur; I think he uses that too (or did)
22:43:19Lloreanmaxkelley: Then please never say it *does* again. You mentioned usability in relation to a patch that doesn't affect it.
22:43:29fm2Bagder: yes. Hua, the world is round again! :-)
22:43:50Lloreanmaxkelley: You also have to remember, every piece of eyecandy code added negatively affects every user who doesn't want it, so you *have* to take both sides into account
22:43:58peturtortoise converts to native, you have to configure cygwin to native too
22:44:23maxkelleyLlorean: that's what options are for.
22:44:23 Join obo [0] (n=obo@rockbox/developer/obo)
22:44:28fm2petur: ...and then ask Bagder why genlang doesn't work?
22:44:39Lloreanmaxkelley: Options don't make binary size increase and increased RAM usage go away.
22:44:40maxkelleyand I never said that it increased the usability of rockbox, just the appeal.
22:44:47peturhmmm gtg, back in 30 min
22:45:07fm2petur: if I setup cygwin for CRLF, do all the text utils and the shell also use that setting?
22:45:09maxkelleythat is true, but how come OF's can fit eyecandy in, and still have room for more?
22:45:30Lloreanmaxkelley: I didn't say it *can't* be fit, I said it comes with a cost.
22:45:38maxkelleythat's true.
22:45:50LloreanOFs are mostly crap
22:45:54LloreanIn fact, most people agree on that.
22:45:58LloreanIn a lot of cases they perform poorly
22:45:59maxkelleyyep, that's why I switched :)
22:46:11maxkelleymy OF would corrupt my MP3 files after a short time.
22:46:13LloreanSo why are you suggesting we do what the OFs do, if this could be part of why they ARE crap?
22:46:19bluebrotherpixelma: what do you think about this?
22:46:25LloreanMany OFs have very sluggish responses to screen changes, etc, due to the added eyecandy
22:46:47LloreanWe also beat the battery life of several OFs because of good buffering and lean code
22:46:48maxkelleyNo, I'm not. In fact, I myself like the simplicity of rockbox's interface, but I'm thinking about people that like the eyecandy.
22:46:59LloreanPeople who like eyecandy over added features can keep using the OF
22:47:07 Part fm2 ("Thnaks again master Bagder!")
22:47:08maxkelleyheh, Ok.
22:47:14LloreanI don't see that it necessarily pays to attract people who *only* want the eyecandy.
22:47:40Lloreanbluebrother: That's to be the icon for "Wiki Page"?
22:47:55Lloreanmaxkelley: That being said I'm in favour of the gradient patch, though I'd like it to be a gradient between two colors.
22:48:05bluebrotherwell, it's the first icon I came around which didn't looked too bad.
22:48:10bluebrotherbut I'm free for suggestions.
22:48:17maxkelleybluebrother: look again.
22:48:21Lloreanbluebrother: I don't mind it.
22:48:30maxkelleyor am I looking at the wrong thing?
22:48:46Nico_PLlorean: a gradient between two colors is perfectly possible, but it requires an additional setting
22:48:48maxkelleyI got a screenshot of XPDF.
22:48:56LloreanNico_P: It'd be much much preferable I think.
22:49:05LloreanNico_P: Considering background color changes, etc.
22:49:09bluebrotherit's \Laserbeam of the marvosym package. An overview of icons is here:
22:49:16maxkelleyI believe that would be helpful, too.
22:49:19Lloreanmaxkelley: Bluebrother works on the manual.
22:49:32bluebrotherI'd like to keep using marvosym as we already use that and don't want to add more dependencies.
22:49:42 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
22:49:53bluebrothermaxkelley: is _is_ a screenshot of xpdf ;)
22:50:08maxkelleyoh. :)
22:50:14LloreanNico_P: Some people using solid color backgrounds may want the highlight bar to seem to fade into the background (or out of) and choose one of the two colors as their background color, for example.
22:50:29maxkelleyheh, I apologize if I'm being annoying.. I'm being distracted from my homework :)
22:50:41pixelmabluebrother: maybe that icon (or a similar) that you can see in wikipedia, used there for "link opens in another window/tab"?
22:50:42Nico_PLlorean: good one :) I'll start implementing the second colour
22:50:55bluebrotherI already tried \Ecommerce (page 14) but didn't like that too much
22:51:21pixelmaNico_P: that's already a lot of added options... *shrug*
22:52:24maxkelleywhat if the line selector menu is consolidated into one, with options: bar, dot, gradient (and gradient is a sub-menu, which has options for the gradient)
22:52:29pixelmabluebrother: if there is one
22:52:42LloreanNico_P, pixelma: Could it not be easier to simply use a .bmp for the highlight bar, instead of gradients or anything, and just let that be part of themes?
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22:52:54bluebrotherwell, I'm still searching that pdf. Quite a lot of characters ...
22:52:58LloreanThen you can use a gradient, a pattern, a color, two colors, or whatever?
22:53:07LloreanAnd less needed "options"
22:53:14pixelmaLlorean: that's what low_light already suggested and I like the idea too
22:53:21maxkelleya bmp makes sense, but it'd be nice to configure it on the player.
22:53:25Nico_PLlorean: this was suggested and it's indeed a nice idea, but it's less flexible
22:53:33bluebrotheran option to underline instead of inverting the complete line would be interesting too.
22:53:39pixelmamaxkelley: use "rockpaint"...
22:53:45maxkelleypixelma: point taken :)
22:53:48LloreanNico_P: Less flexible how?
22:54:11Nico_PLlorean: a bitmap doesn't scale, it's harder to change on target
22:54:19maxkelleywouldn't using a bmp make it more complicated, because you'd need a seperate bmp for each target.
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22:54:34LloreanNico_P: Most themes don't scale either, though
22:54:35maxkelleywhich just adds to the list of bmps that new ports require to be scaled.
22:54:49Lloreanmaxkelley: The default bar wouldn't be a bitmap
22:54:54maxkelleyI thought themes do, just not wps's.
22:55:06Nico_PLlorean: WPS don't, but any font can go on any backdrop
22:55:51bluebrotherpixelma: the email symbol c't uses is available ...
22:56:34LloreanNico_P: Vertical stretching is a problem I guess.
22:56:44maxkelleyI know! SVG :)
22:57:45Nico_PLlorean: I'm all for adding bitmap as an option, but not as the only one
22:58:03maxkelleyI think the simplest way to do it would be the options, and perhaps add bitmap as an additional option.
22:58:16maxkelleyheh, what Nico_P just said :)
22:58:39*petur back
22:59:11 Quit ZeroA4 ("Ex-Chat")
23:00:02Nico_PMaybe we need a colours submenu somewhere
23:00:33maxkelleywhee, head is spinning.
23:00:54maxkelleydisplay > colors ?
23:01:44 Join My_Sic [0] (
23:01:45Nico_Psomething like that
23:01:47pixelmaat least I think it should belong into the selector settings as maxkelley suggested earlier
23:01:58 Quit nicktastic ("Leaving")
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23:02:28maxkelleythat's interesting, irssi didn't highlight that line.
23:02:34 Quit My_Sic (Client Quit)
23:03:27Nico_Ppixelma: I was thinking of a submenu with FG/BG colours and line selector colours
23:03:31maxkelleyI think having a colors menu at this point would just further complicate things, so I think that it would be nice to have the following options in line selector: inverted bar, dot, gradient, bitmap
23:03:46pixelmabluebrother: which one (can't recall that atm)?
23:04:15Nico_Pmaxkelley: that's what there is (without the bitmap option), but settings to choose the colours are also required
23:04:17 Join midgey [0] (
23:04:41maxkelleyNico_P: the gradient option would have a submenu, where that would be selected.
23:04:47 Nick fxb__ is now known as fxb (
23:05:09bluebrotherpixelma: I updated the screenshot −− the rightmost icon
23:05:10maxkelleyremoving the necessity to have a "line selector gradient colors" option in the display menu, or whereever.
23:05:22Nico_Pmaxkelley: there also is a "solid colour" setting that shares colours with the gradient setting
23:05:46 Quit kubiix (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:06:08maxkelleybluebrother: I like the last or second
23:06:29bluebrothersame for me ;-)
23:06:34midgeyso, rumor has it i'm the mysterious poster from japanese pastebin
23:06:39maxkelleyhehe :)
23:06:59maxkelleyNico_P: hmmm.. will those be removed on the inverted/dot settings?
23:07:04 Join Zagor [0] (
23:07:04bluebrotherthe last one is the icon the german magazine c't uses for indicating email addresses
23:07:08Nico_Pmaxkelley: no
23:07:19Nico_Pmidgey: seen the patch ?
23:07:26midgeylooking at it now
23:07:39midgeyi was planning on implementing gradients, but never got around to it
23:07:49maxkelleyI guess that works.
23:08:01Nico_Pmidgey: kfazz is the one to thank for the gradient
23:08:04***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:09:18pixelmabluebrother: we should use \boxbox just for its name ;)
23:09:48nls_amiconn: thanks got your file, will hopefully do testing of different -O levels tomorrow, and no there is no reason it isn't int32_t I just dind't change more than necessary but it probably should be changed so I'll do it :-)
23:09:52midgeyNico_P: do you think the invert variable in the scrolling struct should be renamed?
23:10:17midgeysame with invert_cursor in settings
23:10:52Nico_Pmidgey: probably, yes
23:11:05midgeyNico_P: i was thinking the same
23:11:17 Part Domonoky
23:11:27midgeyiirc, jdgordan didnt like the invert_cursor == 1 etc lines
23:11:41Nico_Pthat's understandable
23:11:48Nico_Pwhat about cursor_mode ?
23:12:05midgeysounds good
23:12:38mirakI have a .Wav file with glitches, and conversion to flac fails. Do you have any idea how to repair it
23:13:27midgeyNico_P: it seems like the general approach in 7808 is pretty similar to my original patch, have there been any comments regarding the implementation?
23:13:50Nico_PI'm not sure, and I was interested in that too
23:14:04midgeythere might be a cleaner way to do it
23:14:52amiconnA coloured selector bar probably makes sense, and imho it could even replace the inverted bar on colour targets, as you can make it look the same as an inverted bar
23:15:15amiconnBut I can't say I like the gradient stuff
23:15:30midgeyits also nice to just have the selected item change text color
23:15:55midgeybut leave the background the same
23:15:59Nico_Pmidgey: the invert_cursor setting is referred to in quite a lot of places... I think it would be better to do the renaming in a separate patch
23:16:21Nico_Pmidgey, amiconn: oth can be done with the solid colour setting
23:16:35Nico_PI personally prefer the gradient
23:16:38Zagorweb server update in progress
23:16:44midgeyNico_P: i saw that, i'm glad it was added
23:17:00amiconnGradient slows down things, and doesn't really improve usability
23:17:10midgeyand yes i think if the patch is committed, the rename should be a second commit/code police
23:17:23amiconnMaybe it's not that bad, but I probably won't use it
23:17:39midgeyits only implemented on color targets, correct?
23:18:03midgeyim not sure how useful a greyscale gradient would have been :P
23:18:06Nico_Pamiconn: have you looked at the implementation ?
23:18:08LloreanGradients are popular though
23:18:14bluebrotherhmm, the icon doesn't work for the html version. But I guess it isn't really necessary there.
23:18:16 Quit saratoga ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:18:17midgeyand pretty
23:18:19BagderGradients look nice in general
23:18:24amiconnYes, it would't work on low depth targets anyway, and we have no high-depth greyscale targets (yet)
23:18:42amiconn(>= 16 shades of grey)
23:19:07 Quit Redbreva (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:20:27pixelmathe power of gradients (see player's svgs) ... ;)
23:20:31Nico_Pamiconn: actually the solid coulour setting can't really emulate the inverted bar because of cases where there is a backdrop
23:20:44amiconnHmm, true
23:21:00amiconnSee how much I care about those graphical gimmicks?
23:21:10Nico_Phehe :)
23:21:21Nico_Pamiconn: and have you looked at the implementation ? (sorry to repeat the question)
23:21:32amiconnOnly very briefly
23:21:49*midgey prays it wasn't too terrible
23:22:05Nico_Pnothing shocking with changing the lcd_puts funcs ?
23:31:30pixelmabluebrother: I thought something like the SquareShadow* ones in table 193 of the pdf you linked to earlier but the pointing hand is also nice
23:33:43 Join DefineByte [0] (
23:34:48 Quit Genre9mp3 ()
23:40:03 Join eigma [0] (
23:40:50DefineBytethere was a post on /. a week ago saying that the method for generating the checksum on new iPods has been reverse engineered. Does that have any significance when it comes to rockbox on the new iPods? Just wondering. :)
23:41:00 Join RaZorbacK [0] (
23:41:16ZagorDefineByte: no
23:41:36 Quit kugel ("ChatZilla [Firefox]")
23:41:41DefineByteblunt and to the point :)
23:42:54DefineBytethanks. that clears that up then :)
23:49:44nls_Bagder: there's a typo in your mrobe post, it says the hard drive is 20MB ;-)
23:50:04BagderI'm stuck in the early 90s! ;-)
23:50:05 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:58:13eigmaanyone know how OF vs Rockbox power consumption compares on the Gigabeat FX (s3c2440)?
23:58:33markuneigma: more or less the same
23:58:57 Quit random_desu (SendQ exceeded)

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