#rockbox 2007-11-08

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#rockbox log for 2007-11-08

00:01:28		Join qweru [0] (n=kvirc@bb-87-80-66-156.ukonline.co.uk)
00:06:35		Quit Seedy (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:13:58		Quit BigBambi (Remote closed the connection)
00:15:11	markun	preglow: ping
00:15:42		Quit OlivierBorowski ("Konversation terminated!")
00:17:22	linuxstb	markun: Any luck with FLAC?
00:17:27	preglow	markun: oy
00:17:56	markun	linuxstb: well, that's why I was pinging preglow
00:18:13	*	linuxstb shuts up then ;)
00:18:19	preglow	what flac?
00:18:37	markun	preglow: there have been some algorithmical optimisations to the lpc code of the ffmpeg flac decoder
00:18:44	preglow	yeah, i noticed
00:19:03	markun	not sure if it's useful to you and if the assembly versions were based on the old code or not
00:19:34	markun	this is the biggest change: http://svn.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg/trunk/libavcodec/flac.c?r1=9999&r2=10586
00:20:30	linuxstb	Is that in the 24-bit codepath?
00:20:36	markun	no
00:20:45	preglow	it's based on the old code for sure
00:21:30	markun	preglow: so, shall I update the C version? might be good for new platforms anyway
00:21:41		Join BigBambi [0] (n=alex@rockbox/staff/BigBambi)
00:22:03	preglow	well, sure, just make sure to test it
00:22:09	markun	I will
00:22:20	preglow	i don't get what this optimization really does
00:22:59	linuxstb	markun: Are you sure that's used for 16-bit files?
00:23:00	markun	linuxstb: do we just abort the decoding when there is an error in the file?
00:23:28	markun	linuxstb: http://svn.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg/trunk/libavcodec/flac.c?revision=10586&view=markup
00:23:28	linuxstb	I can't remember, but I expect so.
00:23:33	markun	look for "> 16"
00:24:08	linuxstb	Ah, so ffmpeg's if is the opposite way round to ours?
00:24:08	preglow	hrm
00:24:15	markun	linuxstb: yes
00:24:19	preglow	looks like it just decode two samples at a time
00:24:36	markun	linuxstb: shall I make it more like the ffmpeg code?
00:26:03	preglow	i think someone actually popped up and posted some asm code for this kind of optimization
00:26:13	preglow	i think i concluded i wouldn't bother
00:26:42		Join hcs [0] (n=agashlin@rockbox/contributor/hcs)
00:27:00	markun	preglow: it looks like it gives quite a speedup: "50%/67%/43% faster on core2/k8/p4, making flac decoding overall 24%/25%/11% faster"
00:27:39	markun	but maybe we will have different results on our targets of course
00:29:55	preglow	markun: i can imagine it does on compiled code, but not for our asm code
00:30:21	markun	preglow: ok, then I'll just leave it like this.
00:30:36	preglow	anyway, i just can't be bothered to tweak flac any further
00:30:48	preglow	it's more than fast enough as it is
00:33:34	markun	I'll only commit this: "Add decoding support for variable block size FLAC files using the latest FLAC
00:33:38	markun	specification. Patch by Josh Coalson."
00:35:39	*	linuxstb looks
00:37:11	*	linuxstb doesn't find...
00:37:18	markun	linuxstb: I guess he didn't commit the compiler changes yet
00:37:25	markun	encoder..
00:37:46	markun	linuxstb: what's can't you find?
00:37:50	markun	-'s
00:38:05	linuxstb	It's OK, I found it - the last change to flac.c
00:38:27	markun	yes
00:39:06	preglow	i wonder why he'd want to vary block size
00:39:41	linuxstb	I don't know if it's related, but I think he's working on improving FLAC with 24-bit files.
00:39:53		Quit roolku ()
00:40:07	markun	I guess I could also commit this one: http://svn.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg?view=rev&revision=10626
00:40:39		Quit Nico_P (Remote closed the connection)
00:41:43	markun	at least test it to see if there are any speedups
00:42:52	linuxstb	I think you will need to encode a file with -0 to test that one.
00:43:32	markun	or maybe -l0 ?
00:43:50	markun	from flac −−help: "-l, −−max-lpc-order=# Max LPC order; 0 => only fixed predictors"
00:44:47	markun	linuxstb: maybe a big part of the speedup was already from changing from s->decoded[channel][i] to decoded[i]
00:45:00	markun	which we already have anyway
00:52:04		Quit XavierGr (Nick collision from services.)
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00:54:07		Quit ender` (" I will not make alliances with those more powerful than myself. Such a person would only double-cross me in my moment of glo)
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00:59:12	markun	linuxstb: my -l0 test file has some artifacts when decoding it with rockbox
01:00
01:00:00	markun	I get them as well when decoding with ffmpeg
01:00:25	preglow	markun: where they there before your updates too?
01:00:56	markun	preglow: probably, but I haven't tested with -l0 before
01:01:28	markun	but I can check
01:01:29	preglow	i find it hard to believe that files using only fixed predictors are broken
01:01:40	preglow	ordinary files use those _a lot_
01:02:28	markun	I can give you a testfile if you want
01:02:55	markun	it decodes fine with flac 1.2.1, but not with svn ffmpeg or rockbox
01:03:17	markun	now trying our flac decoder from before my commits
01:03:49	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
01:05:44	markun	preglow: the file is unplayable without my commits (it's a 24-bit file with flac 1.2.1)
01:06:11	linuxstb	So you're testing a 24-bit -l0 file?
01:06:16	markun	yes
01:06:25	linuxstb	Stop being difficult ;)
01:06:49	preglow	ahh, right
01:06:50	preglow	well
01:06:59	preglow	ffmpeg people would probably be interested if you can find out what is wrong :>
01:07:45	markun	http://130.89.160.166/rockbox/13526__dobroide__children.hall.24bit.5.flac
01:08:16	markun	the sample it driving me nuts. I should find something better as a testfile :)
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01:09:24	*	hcs suggests Bach
01:09:51	markun	hcs: do you have a link to some 24-bit samples of bach music?
01:10:29	hcs	markun: I could find one in a few minutes and then say "yes, as a matter of fact I do," but at the moment, no.
01:10:38	markun	:)
01:10:57	preglow	bad showmanship!
01:11:18		Quit scorche\|w ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
01:11:49		Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
01:11:59	allele	okay, I just made a new virtualbox with ubuntu breezy badger installed and already did 'apt-get install build-essential' and am installing all of rockboxdev.sh now. anything else I'll need to compile rockbox?
01:12:16		Quit Zagor ("Bed time")
01:12:28	markun	preglow, linuxstb: did you listen to my sample?
01:12:47	markun	or not really in the mood for crying babies? :)
01:12:59		Quit FOAD (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:13:13	preglow	haha
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01:13:17	preglow	i tried, but vlc didn't cope with it
01:13:38	preglow	flac -d vomited as well
01:13:45	preglow	so i guess it's new indeed
01:13:59	markun	latest rockbox has almost no problems with it :)
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01:15:14	preglow	well
01:15:17	preglow	there is one glitch at the start
01:15:21	preglow	and then a couple of others...
01:15:40	markun	yes, you get them as well with ffmpeg
01:15:50	preglow	oooh, segfault
01:15:54	markun	wow
01:16:00	markun	I didn't get that
01:16:05	preglow	a couple of tries and that's what it did at the start glitch
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01:16:40		Part pippx ("alas poor yurick, i knew him well....")
01:16:51	preglow	in flac_decode_frame
01:17:11	markun	interesting
01:17:28	preglow	in some bitstream.h function
01:18:37	preglow	eh, it line 106
01:18:40	preglow	unaligned32
01:18:43	preglow	which isn't called, afaik
01:19:32	markun	I also got a segfault now
01:19:36	preglow	yes, yes it is
01:20:15		Quit zivan56 ()
01:20:31	preglow	markun: it crashes in either get_sbits or get_bits, afaik
01:20:59	markun	do you think it's related to the artifacts?
01:21:33	preglow	well, since it crashes at one of them i'd be surprised if not
01:22:50		Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (n=felixbru@h1252615.stratoserver.net)
01:23:55	preglow	but i need to get some sleep
01:23:56	preglow	later
01:24:06	markun	yes, I should do that too
01:24:13	markun	good night
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01:25:33	karashata	lostlogic: I dunno how, but, FLAC's working for me now
01:25:51	karashata	orrrr not...
01:26:16	karashata	it works fine if it resumes playback in the middle of a file, but not if it plays from the beginning of one
01:28:12		Quit J3TC- (Nick collision from services.)
01:28:30	lostlogic	karashata: ahhh, interesting + useful
01:28:37	karashata	by the way
01:28:46	lostlogic	probably does relate to my stripping of leading tags then...
01:28:50	lostlogic	but why.. why???
01:28:59	karashata	testing build 15466 and FLACs work fine
01:29:07	lostlogic	wait... wtf?
01:29:10	karashata	gonna test 15492 a sec
01:29:17	lostlogic	now you make me crazy
01:29:18	lostlogic	:)
01:29:44	karashata	this does seem odd, doesn't it?
01:30:26	*	lostlogic frowns
01:31:03	karashata	15493 was the oldest build I had backed up, so if 15492 works we know which build it was that it broke at
01:31:14	lostlogic	karashata: nod
01:31:22	karashata	orrrr...
01:31:24	karashata	15492
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01:31:38	karashata	data abort trying to switch tracks
01:31:45	lostlogic	lol, sweet.
01:32:33	karashata	so it was somewhere between 15466 and 15492, then
01:32:59	lostlogic	karashata: yeah, unfortunately it appears that some builds between there were just plain broken ;)
01:33:16	karashata	hmm...
01:33:23	karashata	in any case, it's a start
01:33:35	karashata	we can't blame it on your stripping the tag data, though
01:33:41	lostlogic	yar
01:34:04	karashata	time to study the SVN commits and try to figure which seems most likely, work from there
01:34:36		Quit petur ("Zzzzz")
01:35:00		Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
01:35:04	lostlogic	yeah, I'm inclined toward the dropping of conf_filechunk setting as my first guess
01:36:13	lostlogic	karashata: do you have a way to read the maximum frame size of your flacs?
01:36:33	karashata	um...
01:36:40	karashata	not that I know of
01:37:16	lostlogic	you a windows user?
01:37:21	karashata	yes
01:37:24	lostlogic	cuz if so I don't know of one for you either :-P
01:37:52	lostlogic	but you said that this happens when starting any of your flacs right? all ripped with wmp?
01:37:58	lostlogic	er winamp
01:38:37	karashata	actually, the only FLACs I know the source of are the VotL ones I encoded from the WAVs packed in the torrent...
01:38:49	karashata	and I encoded those ones with Goldwave
01:39:05	karashata	I can check some of the other FLACs and see if they're all causing it
01:39:29	karashata	though that means putting the recent build back on there
01:39:38	karashata	I've got 15466 on it for now...
01:39:55		Quit linuxstb ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]")
01:41:36	karashata	oh, hey, my VotL files play
01:41:53	karashata	though it skipped the first one completely and started with the second, had to skip it back
01:42:00	karashata	but, it plays fine
01:42:38	karashata	3 and 4 skipp and it goes to 5...
01:43:21	karashata	okay, we have issues...
01:43:44	karashata	sometimes it plays, sometimes it skips a bunch of tracks
01:44:00	karashata	can't even reproduce it skipping the same tracks
01:44:47	karashata	gonna let it play through instead of manually changing tracks, see if it jumps over a bunch on its own
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01:49:59	karashata	hmm, playing through seems to be okay, it didn't skip over the second track after the first finished
01:50:53	karashata	metadata for track three doesn't show up in the WPS, though that's probably because of the MoB thing and not showing metadata for the next track after the last track in the buffer
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01:51:51	karashata	though forcing a disk read doesn't seem to fix that like it used to, oh well...
01:54:23		Quit SirFunk (Remote closed the connection)
01:56:22	karashata	okay, manually skipping through the tracks causes it to jump forward over a bunch of tracks, but letting them play through doesn't cause any issues
01:56:51	karashata	track three follows track two no problems, though I'm still not getting my next track info
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02:00
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02:02:41	karashata	my Enigma FLAC files don't have any problems, no skipping tracks or freezing the player
02:03:15		Quit andrewg877 (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:03:22	karashata	ohh...
02:03:43	karashata	I found one that doesn't play back, the player responds to button presses until I try to stop it
02:05:32	karashata	though that only happened once, can't seem to reproduce it
02:06:20	karashata	I'm gonna check something...
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02:11:02	webguest24	rockbox is shit!
02:11:16	webguest24	it fucked my ipod up bad
02:11:21	webguest24	dont install it!
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02:11:31	Mouser_X	Sorry, but chances are that you were the one that did that...
02:11:32	pabs	webguest24: haha
02:11:47	Mouser_X	(Belive me, there's 100s of reasons to believe you're at fault here.)
02:12:01	webguest24	fuck this
02:12:07	webguest24	shit I just cracked my ipod screen
02:12:11	webguest24	fuck!
02:12:15	Mouser_X	Like I said.
02:12:20	Mouser_X	User error.
02:12:30	Mouser_X	(Rockbox can't crack your screen...)
02:12:34	allele	hehehe
02:12:36	safetydan	webguest24: perhaps if you just asked politely for help you might find your iPod is not, as you said, "fucked". Though now you've cracked the screen...
02:12:41	webguest24	I threw it across the room...
02:13:01	pabs	hmm
02:13:07		Part webguest24
02:13:07	Mouser_X	Well, if you were intending to break it, then that's a good way to do it.
02:14:23	billenium	May i suggest prying it open?
02:14:24	*	jhMikeS thinks someone forget to take their lithium today
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02:16:03	safetydan	Gentleman, we have a problem. Rockbox rocks is only slight ahead of Rockbox sucks in googlefight. http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=rockbox+sucks&word2=rockbox+rocks
02:16:12	safetydan	(and gentlewomen)
02:16:25		Quit iamben (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:16:41	jhMikeS	don't forget the intersexed community :p
02:16:55	safetydan	fine, fine, gentlebeings then
02:17:21	jhMikeS	ah, yes...sounds sort of ET-ish now...I like that ::)
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02:18:20	Llorean	11,000 results is "slightly"?
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02:19:49	jhMikeS	ummm...I just saw it just from 38,000 to 56,700 "rockbox sucks". /me detects fraud.
02:19:51	JdGordon	11000 results? it 330000 hiegher here...
02:20:00	jhMikeS	s/just/jump/
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02:20:17		Quit Kohlrabi (kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net)
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02:20:31	Mouser_X	I saw 32,000 vs 390,000 or so.
02:20:32	NHeal	kubrick.freenode.net irc.freenode.net
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02:20:41	safetydan	Interesting. I only saw 38000 vs 44000
02:20:51	jhMikeS	The suck number went up by 20,000 in a few seconds
02:23:09	Llorean	I see 56.7k for sucks, 43.8 for rock
02:23:24	Llorean	It seems... kinda... random
02:23:39	Llorean	If I reload I get different results
02:23:49	jhMikeS	where do these numbers originate?
02:24:15	Mouser_X	Quick question: Is there an alarm feature for Rockbox that, if running/playing music, I can set the alarm to go off every x number of minutes? I'm asking for work related reasons...
02:24:18	Llorean	Google results, supposedly
02:24:27	Llorean	Mouser_X: Not that I know of, no.
02:24:31	jhMikeS	yeah, now it's 56,700 sucks to 43,800 rocks
02:24:34	Mouser_X	Dang.
02:24:49	*	Llorean wonders if the metronome can be set in minutes per beat instead of beats per minute
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02:26:13	jhMikeS	Llorean: why? that's not very musical unless you like really slow songs. :)
02:26:42	Llorean	jhMikeS: Mouser_X wanted a noise every certain number of minutes?
02:26:58	Mouser_X	Pretty much, yes.
02:27:56	Mouser_X	I guess I could try that (I need to wait for my Gigabeat to charge.)
02:28:18	Llorean	How precise does it need to be?
02:28:20		Nick annulus__ is now known as annulus_ (n=ap@81-237-222-105-no91.tbcn.telia.com)
02:28:33	Llorean	You could always just insert a noise at certain points in your playlist. :-P
02:29:24	jhMikeS	yeah, make a WAV file exactly the length you need and loop it
02:29:34	Llorean	jhMikeS: Well, he wanted it while listening to music.
02:29:47	Mouser_X	Indeed.
02:29:59	jhMikeS	hmm...metronome won't do that since it uses the PCM
02:30:19	jhMikeS	need to use the audio beep or something
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02:32:58	jhMikeS	is this to make a cooking timer ? :)
02:33:18	billenium	You know what would be awesome... a Rockbox PC OS
02:33:33	JdGordon	not at all!
02:34:02	billenium	why not?
02:34:12	billenium	oh
02:34:14	billenium	not at me
02:34:14	billenium	lol
02:34:21	JdGordon	yes at ou
02:34:24	billenium	oh
02:34:26	billenium	why not?
02:34:29	JdGordon	thats a stupid ideea!
02:34:31	JdGordon	rockbox is crap
02:34:52	jhMikeS	is hasn't gotten to crap status yet...still at BoS
02:35:01	JdGordon	:)
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02:40:03	allele	silly question, but does it matter where rockboxdev.sh is when I execute it?
02:40:04		Nick Soap_ is now known as Soap (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
02:42:27	jhMikeS	it should at the very least be located on a machine capable of executing it...beyond that, no idea
02:43:14	allele	hehe, well so far I made a virtual box and installed ubuntu breezy badger on it
02:44:06	allele	then ran 'sudo apt-get install build-essential' and now working on sh'ing the rockboxdev file from my home folder
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03:00
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03:01:15	Divadmils	will ther eever be a 2nd generation nano rocbox version?
03:01:31	Divadmils	just wondering
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03:02:08	webguest92	does rockbox support 2nd gen nano?
03:02:14		Quit hardeep ("leaving")
03:02:26	Mouser_X	Did you see the front page? It says no.
03:02:34	Mouser_X	(And it's fairly hard to miss.)
03:03:06	webguest92	mouser was that at me?
03:03:53	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:03:55	webguest92	oh jk
03:03:56	webguest92	thanks
03:04:05	webguest92	it says 1st and 2nd gen ipods
03:04:09	webguest92	got confused
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03:04:23	allele	that's understandable
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03:08:51	allele	okay, finnished the rockboxdev.sh, little rusty on setting PATH though
03:09:53	krazykit	allele, if you're using bash, the wiki should tell you
03:10:28	krazykit	i had to do it differently for zsh, but only because i didn't know the right way.
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03:21:54	allele	okay, I tried setting up the path, but now it seems I can't use bash commands besides cd
03:22:45	safetydan	allele: sounds like you overwrote your path rather than appended to it
03:23:03	allele	could be a definate possibility
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03:24:31	allele	heh, so do I need to wipe my ubuntu virtual machine and start from scratch?
03:25:05	krazykit	allele, did you edit .bashrc?
03:26:06	allele	no, I did export PATH=/usr/local/sh-elf/bin:/usr/local/m68k-elf/bin:usr/local/arm-elf/bin:$PATH
03:26:48	krazykit	if that's all you did, logging out and logging back in should clear that.
03:26:49	safetydan	well if you did that you shouldn't have had that problem
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03:28:06	allele	well that's all I did, I literally can go through all the commands done in terminal so far
03:28:59	allele	actually no, the first time I did that I didn't end with a :$PATH
03:29:05	krazykit	that's your problem
03:29:12	krazykit	log out and log back in, then export it properly
03:29:47	allele	okay, by properly you mean with the :$PATH at the end then?
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03:38:32	allele	okay it seems to be compiling nicely now, least so far so good. thanks for all the help
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04:12:02	lostlogic	karashata: still around?
04:12:08	karashata	yeah
04:12:42	karashata	messing around with FLAC stuff, I finished reencoding them all to settings I actually know work
04:13:00	karashata	just putting them back on my player to test them
04:13:01	lostlogic	so different FLAC settings change it or a different codec?
04:13:14	karashata	different FLAC settings
04:13:54	lostlogic	gotcha, I'm going to go over the code changes from 66 to 93 and see what it says to me
04:13:55	karashata	I used a slightly higher compression, it seems, manages to shave off a few hundred kilobytes
04:14:01	karashata	okay
04:14:58	lostlogic	and when it refuses to play them, I forgot −− does it freeze? or can you still hit stop and then play something else w/o resetting?
04:15:15	karashata	it had frozen completely
04:15:37	lostlogic	ok
04:15:49	karashata	the backlight would still power off at the timer setting, but the player refuses to respond to anything
04:16:22	lostlogic	gotcha
04:17:14	karashata	oh, nice!
04:17:19	lostlogic	?
04:17:24	karashata	I fixed the issues with my Weird Al tracks
04:17:34	lostlogic	by reencoding them with different flacs!?
04:17:37	lostlogic	settings?
04:17:43	*	lostlogic frowns
04:17:46	karashata	just a better compression rate
04:18:08	karashata	I suspect my encoder is a little more recent than the encoder that was used originally
04:18:22	*	lostlogic mutters
04:18:28	lostlogic	so it's some weird kind of race
04:18:42	karashata	I don't know
04:19:35	karashata	in any case, now the only issue I know of is the issue with my VotL tracks jumping ahead occasionally when I skip them manually
04:20:42	lostlogic	VotL?
04:20:55	karashata	Voices of the Lifestream, an OC Remix album
04:21:25	karashata	I encoded the WAVs into FLAC to preserve audio quality and cut down on space requirements
04:21:40	karashata	tossed the MP3s since they were encoded at 160 kbps
04:22:32	lostlogic	"jumping ahead"?
04:23:15	karashata	occasionally it'll skip over anywhere from 1 to 5 tracks entirely when I manually skipped to the next or previous track
04:23:22	lostlogic	karashata: would you mind emailing me the same track in new flac?
04:23:34	karashata	sure, 1 sec
04:23:49	lostlogic	oh, mrkiko was complaining about something similar is that on latest latest build
04:24:33	lostlogic	I'm trying to compare the metadata to see if there is some obvious difference to work from.
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04:24:46	karashata	ahh...
04:24:54	karashata	hmm...
04:24:59	karashata	come to think of it...
04:25:08	karashata	that may be why they're working for me now
04:25:30	karashata	my audio editing software may save the metadata differently from Winamp
04:26:49	karashata	then again, if that were the case, it shouldn't have found the metadata Winamp saved, so maybe not
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04:28:59	karashata	okay, one email with newly encoded FLAC attached
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04:30:27	rosco_pc	Hello I just registered for the wiki (username RobSchmersel). Can some-one help me get write permission?
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06:46:30	Mouser_X	Heh. I remember this game:
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06:46:31	Mouser_X	http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsIpod5g#RockSki
06:46:44	Mouser_X	(I don't have an iPod though.)
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06:56:27	Mouser_X	Here's another neato one:
06:56:28	Mouser_X	http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WpsIpod5g#DOS_Blue
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07:00
07:01:08	amiconn	jhMikeS: ping
07:03:57	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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07:13:36	amiconn	wow
07:13:50	*	amiconn almost doubled lcd update speed on mini g2
07:14:20	amiconn	It glitches at 80MHz though, so we'd have to switch... but that's still useful
07:15:15	psycho_maniac	great job
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07:18:41	jhMikeS	amiconn: yep?
07:18:56	amiconn	Any PP5002 news?
07:20:23	jhMikeS	Sorry, no. It's on my TODO list after I get past some other stuff done and I'm back in HW poke mode.
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07:22:09	jhMikeS	amiconn: I take it that the OF disassembly there will be easier to read? I hope so...if I need it.
07:22:42	amiconn	Imo it is. Less code, and less optimised
07:23:21	amiconn	On ipods, disassembling the rom is often more helpful than disassembling the OF itself
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07:24:00	jhMikeS	PP5002 doesn't even have mailboxes? If not, they can just be imitated.
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07:24:07	amiconn	The rom is significantly smaller, and there is the test mode with nicely named functions
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07:24:24	amiconn	That's how I found the backlight brightness on G5
07:24:41	jhMikeS	Test mode? How to get there?
07:25:13	amiconn	On G3?
07:25:25		Quit jhulst ("Konversation terminated!")
07:25:37	jhMikeS	btw, running mpegplayer with an uncached disk buffer has no real effect on speed either which is good for playback on COP.
07:25:41	jhMikeS	Yeah, G3
07:25:47	jhMikeS	I suppose the Wiki has that info?
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07:26:25	amiconn	I don't know...
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07:26:48	amiconn	It's a button combo you have to press right after reset
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07:27:32	amiconn	Sorry it's called diag mode
07:27:38	*	jhMikeS will go dig up what he can and push buttons randomly otherwise :P
07:28:03	amiconn	On G4 and up I know the combo, but G3 and earlier are different
07:29:31	amiconn	AH. First reset: Menu+Play. Then press Left+Select+Right
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07:31:34	jhMikeS	On G3 reset is Hold On, Hold Off, Menu+Select
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07:31:55	Hatebreed	Anyone alive?
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07:32:29	Hate\|Love	This rockbox utility program is a piece of crap :/
07:32:32	jhMikeS	amiconn: they 2nd combo worked though...it squeaked and showed a backwards apple
07:36:29	Calcipher	hm, should I update the bootloader I'm using on my sansa, the one I'm using is maybe 3 or 4 weeks old
07:36:53	Calcipher	I remember someone telling me there were some improvements
07:38:18	Calcipher	where is the updated bootloader found? or is it the updated one that is referenced in the installation manual
07:38:23	Hate\|Love	the qt version refuses to load my ipod
07:38:31	Hate\|Love	or even allow me to install rockbox
07:39:23	Hate\|Love	it says "unsportted install method" and doesnt install
07:39:24	Hate\|Love	:(
07:40:29	amiconn	jhMikeS: You should see a menu then, with various diagnostic tests. Very slow to operate
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07:41:38	jhMikeS	amiconn: yes, it got to that. more twitchy to operate than slow though.
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08:14:22	***	Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )'
08:14:25	***	Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )'
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08:14:30	jhMikeS	tornado weather it seems
08:14:31	***	Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg )'
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08:56:29	amiconn	urgh
08:56:41	amiconn	MoB now has problems the first versions didn't have
08:57:01	amiconn	There are pcm underruns during buffering
08:58:51	lemur	damn
09:00
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09:04:04	GodEater_	is it still just Nico_P working on it ? Or are other people getting their hands dirty now too ?
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09:26:48	funglist	tried to add some patches, can't load rockbox.ipod says to reboot then select+play but select+play does nothing.. and i cant get a usb connection anymore, any ideas how to fix it? :s
09:27:48	linuxstb	You need to press and hold select+play immediately after your ipod reboots.
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09:28:49	funglist	sweet.. fixed, thanks.. was a bit worried there
09:29:08	linuxstb	No need to worry, no matter what you do, that key combination will always work.
09:30:02	funglist	any clue as why im getting all these FAILS when trying to compile that double click+scrub patch?
09:30:27	linuxstb	The usual reason is that the patch is out of date and needs updating for the current version of Rockbox.
09:31:20	GodEater_	you'd usually see the FAIL when you applied the patch mind you - long before you compile
09:32:23	*	linuxstb wonders why so many people are posting to the forums thinking that they have an e200r but don't...
09:33:08	GodEater_	it's a fad
09:33:11	GodEater_	they'll get over it soon
09:33:14	Bagder	they're refurbished
09:33:23	Bagder	they actually say Rhapsody on the player
09:33:34	Bagder	on the back of it
09:34:52	GodEater_	is it possible to tell them apart during install ?
09:35:06	GodEater_	i.e. get e200rpatcher to say "This isn't an R - use sansapatcher instead" ?
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09:35:25	linuxstb	Yes, I was thinking that, but it would mean putting all sansapatcher functionality in e200rpatcher.
09:36:00	linuxstb	I'm hesitant to combine them, because e200rpatcher requires you to install usb drivers - but maybe they're only needed if an e200r is detected...
09:36:44	linuxstb	Ah, but sansapatcher won't detect the e200 if it's in manufacturing mode...
09:37:36	linuxstb	Isn't there anything different about the OF we can just ask users to check?
09:37:37	GodEater_	do they both use the same USB identifiers when in manufacturing mode ?
09:37:48	GodEater_	yes - the rhapsody channels
09:37:53	linuxstb	I don't know, but I would guess they do.
09:37:59	Bagder	i would guess so too
09:38:21	linuxstb	In fact, they do - e200tool works for both.
09:38:39	GodEater_	boo hiss
09:38:48	linuxstb	(and afaik, e200tool just checks for one pair of IDs)
09:39:26	Bagder	yes 781/720
09:41:09	Zagor	strings can differ even within the same id. might be worth checking.
09:42:06	linuxstb	Does the c200 also work with e200tool?
09:42:11	Bagder	it does
09:42:46	linuxstb	So same IDs there as well then...
09:43:01	linuxstb	Bagder: Do you know how many BL versions there are for the e200?
09:43:05	linuxstb	(and do you have them all?)
09:43:17	Bagder	I have them all
09:43:26	Bagder	but I don't know how many different there are
09:43:39	Bagder	I would have to run a little script
09:44:28	linuxstb	Could you try comparing, for example, the first sectors with the first sector of the e200r BL and see if they're all different? We could CRC the first sector and compare against a known list of e200 bootloaders...
09:44:52	jhMikeS	amiconn: you said you tried void * in cfft.c to fix the warning. Did you try any intermediate cast to intptr_t? That's also a nice way to get around the whining about type-punning when you really mean it (besides unions).
09:45:24	*	Bagder edits a little script
09:46:44	linuxstb	Hopefully sandisk have abandoned the e200 and won't release any more firmware versions...
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10:00
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10:08:34	Bagder	I find 8 different e200 BL files
10:09:25	barrywardell	I downloaded 28 OF versions from somewhere...can't remember where though
10:09:33	Bagder	I have them all
10:09:42	Bagder	but I extracted all .rom files and md5sum'ed them
10:09:51	barrywardell	ah, cool
10:10:17	Bagder	zefie.com has them all (but I do too on my site)
10:10:47	barrywardell	ah, yes. zefie.com is where I got them
10:11:02	barrywardell	did you notice the 1.03.07 version has 3 .rom files?
10:11:43	*	GodEater_ notices Bagder's food website, and would love it to be ported to english :)
10:11:52	Bagder	yes
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10:12:56	Bagder	GodEater: I can understand that, but I think food culture, recipes and stuff limits the "internationalization" of it
10:13:35	barrywardell	I know pribootLoader.rom goes on the flash, but where do the other two go?
10:13:48	Bagder	I don't know
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10:15:31	GodEater_	Bagder: did you make the source available then ?
10:15:46	GodEater_	or is that mostly swedish too ?
10:16:10	Bagder	no, but I'm considering doing that - it is only partly swedish
10:16:38	GodEater_	I'd be interested in a copy if you get round to it
10:16:45	GodEater_	Mrs GodEater would likely love it
10:17:05	GodEater_	</offtopic>
10:17:12	Bagder	:-)
10:18:46	*	GodEater_ notices his tab cleanup patch is still awaiting approval
10:20:51	Bagder	linuxstb: all BL files differs from the e200r one within the first 0x40 bytes
10:22:00	linuxstb	So a CRC of the first sector would work...
10:22:07	Bagder	yes
10:22:46	linuxstb	Hmm, the e200rpatcher app already has a CRC check for the sector it's patching, so maybe we should just calculate the CRCs for the same sector in the e200 bootloaders...
10:23:04	rosco_pc	hello, I registered for the wiki today (username RobSchmersel) and was wondering if somebody could help me getting write permission?
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10:25:08	preglow	what, view has both a pp _and_ a bigger arm core?
10:25:21	Bagder	yes so it seems
10:25:41	Bagder	or possibly that is a PP with a bigger core
10:25:42	preglow	the pp seems kind of pointless
10:26:04	Bagder	since it seems to mention PP6010
10:26:10	Bagder	PP6110 even
10:27:32	GodEater_	rosco_pc: Done
10:27:46	Bagder	lots of people even have Views by now
10:27:54	Bagder	but not a single dissect yet
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10:28:12	Bagder	cowards!
10:28:14	Bagder	;-)
10:29:09	preglow	Bagder: are there any docs for that.....
10:29:15	Bagder	yeah right
10:29:24	Bagder	nvidia + portalplayer makes a lovely docs combo
10:29:37	rosco_pc	Godeater: Thanks :)
10:30:39	GodEater_	np
10:30:44	preglow	i'm starting to want a new target, now
10:30:49	preglow	something with docs...
10:30:53	GodEater_	hahaha
10:31:13	*	GodEater_ mentions a certain SOC vendor who were careless with their datasheets
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10:31:49	markun	preglow: want to do some more flac debugging today?
10:31:58	preglow	markun: no time today, at least not until tonight
10:32:04	markun	ok
10:32:13	GodEater_	what's broken with flac ?
10:32:43	markun	GodEater_: I have a 24-bits fils encoded with -l0 which gives some artifacts
10:33:03	markun	they also happen with the latest ffmpeg, but not with the official flac decoder
10:33:18	GodEater_	curious
10:33:25	*	GodEater_ doesn't use flac himself however
10:33:34	*	markun neither
10:33:45	markun	it was just a test
10:34:49	linuxstb	Bagder: Can you run this program on all the e200 bootloaders? http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/e200crc.c - it calculates the crc of the sector that e200rpatcher patches.
10:35:53	Bagder	sure
10:36:14	GodEater_	any debian/ubuntu experts have any clue why my box at home (rebuilt the other day with ubuntu 7.10) is now unable to install anything ? I get told I need to run "dpkg −−configure -a", and this fails with an "ldconfig (bus error)"
10:36:24	GodEater_	running ldconfig manually does the same thing
10:37:12	markun	linuxstb, preglow: the decode_subframe_fixed optimisation gave a 0% improvement with testcodec in the sim, didn't test on target yet
10:37:59	Bagder	linuxstb: http://pastebin.com/m301d3e83
10:38:37	linuxstb	preglow: I'm starting to get tempted by the Cowon D2, (dual ARMs) in spite of the touchscreen...
10:38:43	Bagder	since the various BLs are used for multiple firmware releases, it doesn't make much sense to try to point to what version they belong
10:38:58	linuxstb	OK, so there were duplicates in your list?
10:39:13	markun	just 0x4e6b038f
10:39:32	Bagder	linuxstb: yes, 28 firmware releases, 8 different BL files
10:40:27	preglow	linuxstb: touchscreen :/
10:40:45	Bagder	hm right there's a duplicate in that list
10:41:42	Bagder	but they have different md5s when run on the entire file
10:41:47	preglow	haha
10:41:50	preglow	it supports ape by default
10:42:10	linuxstb	preglow: "in future firmware upgrade" - I don't know if it actually does...
10:43:02	linuxstb	And somewhere I read "APE supported compression levels: TBD"
10:43:15	preglow	god knows why they even bother
10:43:25	linuxstb	I often think the same...
10:43:38	preglow	:D
10:44:20	preglow	i'd support aac before ape, that's for sure
10:44:38	linuxstb	I guess there are license costs with aac...
10:45:22	preglow	pft!
10:45:28	preglow	storage in this thing isn't really impressive
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10:45:51	preglow	tv-out...
10:45:57	preglow	how much are they?
10:46:14	linuxstb	They're not that cheap either I think. But they have a SD slot of some kind.
10:46:37	preglow	sd isn't really high capacity
10:46:41	preglow	but at least they're cheap
10:47:08	preglow	hmm, i guess a touch screen might actually be somewhat fun...
10:47:26	JdGordon_	which dap?
10:47:29	preglow	d2
10:47:33		Nick JdGordon_ is now known as JdGordon (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
10:47:42	preglow	what core did they have, again?
10:48:13	Bagder	tcc7801
10:48:37	Bagder	"dual core ARM926EJ-S + ARM946ES 300MHz, 96K SRAM, video hardware accel"
10:48:49	linuxstb	In the UK at least, you can buy a D2 with DAB radio (plus FM)
10:48:49	preglow	mmmmm....
10:48:55	preglow	with dab?
10:48:58	preglow	that's tempting...
10:49:02	JdGordon	http://www.pvrwire.com/2006/10/29/cowan-d2-this-is-why-there-wont-be-a-touch-screen-ipod/ :D
10:49:09	JdGordon	so much for that then :p
10:49:28	Bagder	hahah, there won't be a touch screen ipod? ;-]
10:49:47	JdGordon	a year ago though... so maybe apple missed that memo?
10:51:02		Nick [Sur`DataGhost] is now known as DataGhost (i=dataghos@ip3e832ea5.speed.planet.nl)
10:52:23	JdGordon	any objections to putting the song rating into a list like a setting so we can get rid of that aweful inline hack for the menu?
10:59:40	preglow	wow, the cowon site flash guarantees me that the d2 is invincible
10:59:55	preglow	also that it'll dominate me visually
10:59:56	GodEater_	who are you going to send it up against to confirm this ?
10:59:58	linuxstb	Tell that to the people at iaudiophile...
11:00
11:00:00	Bagder	surely they know those things!
11:00:09	preglow	with powerful endurance...
11:00:24	preglow	turns out this'll be more than just a coding experience, then
11:01:23	Lynx_	preglow: if it will dominate me visually, does that mean girls will want to invite the D2 up for coffee, not me?
11:01:36	preglow	Lynx_: almost certainly :/
11:02:04	preglow	Lynx_: lucky for it it's got a stand
11:02:20	preglow	and don't even try to make me think of that stylus
11:02:25	Lynx_	hmm, i guess i should wait for a rockbox on it then so i can get an ugly theme
11:02:29	Lynx_	heh
11:03:06	linuxstb	The OF also runs Flash of some kind...
11:03:52	preglow	hooray...
11:03:57	Lynx_	ah, it's a flash player
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11:06:09	Lynx_	what's the url of the device list / table on rockbox.org? i can never find the link on the docs wiki
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11:07:11	Bagder	the DeviceChart ?
11:07:15	petur	http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/WebHome?topic=DeviceChart
11:07:55	Lynx_	ah, thanks
11:08:24	Lynx_	hmm, it's not even so hard to find in the docs index, sorry
11:08:38	Xytovl	Hello, I saw that the Cowon D2 is not supported yet, could you tell me how I could help porting Rockbox to the device ? I have a few programming skills (but not much experience) but I have never programmed drivers
11:09:16	Xytovl	I saw that there is a thread to the forum but I don't understand much of what they say :(
11:09:37	Lynx_	hmm, 91 g for the D2 is really light compared to hd based
11:09:41	GodEater_	anyone recommend an OSS alternative to audacity ?
11:09:55	preglow	Xytovl: we're discussing it right now
11:10:10	preglow	GodEater_: no, i haven't been able to find a single good editor
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11:11:02	GodEater_	preglow: that's a bugger
11:11:07	GodEater_	audacity doesn't even run here
11:11:09	GodEater_	it just crashes
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11:12:15	linuxstb	Xytovl: At this stage, it needs someone with low-level programming skills and the ability to reverse-engineer things from the original firmware to start the port and start writing drivers for the hardware components.
11:12:56	Xytovl	well, I don't have this kind of experience, I have some theory basis
11:13:20	GodEater_	preglow: Have you looked at glame ?
11:13:22	preglow	linuxstb: fancy, we can use java on the d2 :P
11:13:25	preglow	GodEater_: nope
11:13:32	*	GodEater_ tries it out
11:13:50	preglow	GodEater_: it looks absolutely horrid
11:13:55	pondlife	jhMikeS: Thanks for fixing the oggmalloc warning
11:14:02	*	preglow wants cool edit :/
11:14:06	GodEater_	preglow: probably is - but also probably good enough for what I want
11:14:23	pondlife	JdGordon: Bit slow, but no - I'd prefer the song rating in a list
11:14:33	markun	Xytovl: you can learn it while trying to help out
11:16:26	Xytovl	markun: I would be glad to help, do I have to join a mailing-list or something like that ?
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11:17:05	markun	I think most of the discussion will be in here
11:17:15	markun	linuxstb: did you order your D2 yet? :)
11:17:28	Xytovl	I already have it
11:17:36	Bagder	Xytovl: here, the dev mailing list and the forums are good places to hang out to catch the action
11:17:46	Xytovl	It was hard to change my Archos Juckebox 600 anyway :'(
11:17:54	Xytovl	*6000
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11:19:13	Lynx_	How much sense would rockbox in it's current form make on a touch screen device? I guess the interface would have to be partly rewritten to even allow 'clicking' on folders to enter them?
11:19:36	Bagder	Lynx_: JdGordon has been working on that already for the mrobe500
11:19:37	pondlife	Lynx_: It's underway
11:19:41	pondlife	Speak to JdGordon
11:20:03	Lynx_	ah, wow
11:20:13	Xytovl	Even if there are many things to rewrite for the touchscreen I guess most of rockbox code is useful
11:20:34	Xytovl	and we can't make a touchscreen interface worse than the original one ...
11:20:46	Bagder	haha
11:22:56	GodEater_	preglow: http://traverso-daw.org/ ?
11:25:27	preglow	looks decent enough, at least
11:27:09	rasher	pondlife: I see you committed root dir setting for the sim, but didn't change buffers to be larger than MAX_PATH - this could give trouble
11:27:47	pondlife	How come? All uses of it are snprintf-truncated
11:28:03	rasher	Yes, but I mean functional trouble
11:28:33	rasher	In the case where the root argument eats up, perhaps half of MAX_PATH or more
11:29:01	GodEater_	preglow: or this one : http://www.metadecks.org/software/sweep/
11:29:02	pondlife	The underlying file system won't support more than MAX_PATH anyway, so how could it work?
11:29:06	GodEater_	preglow: tell me when you want me to stop ;)
11:29:17	preglow	sweep malfunctions badly at whatever it does
11:29:31	rasher	pondlife: if the underlying file system is FAT - surely other filesystems might?
11:29:33	preglow	and sounds like crap
11:29:52	pondlife	rasher: Ah, I thought MAX_PATH was a limit we used anyway
11:30:04	pondlife	I mean, we already truncate elsewhere, no?
11:30:12	GodEater_	preglow: there's also "protux" - but I'm not sure what state it's in
11:30:50	preglow	GodEater_: i just found out cool edit installs fine in wine, so i'm good
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11:31:11	GodEater_	cool edit is free ?
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11:31:26	rasher	pondlife: Yes, but previously there was only a small problem (the 6 characters or "archos")
11:31:32	preglow	GodEater_: no
11:31:37	preglow	GodEater_: but it's good
11:31:56	preglow	at least it was, before adobe got their mitts on it
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11:32:03	pondlife	I thought that starting to support MAX_PATH * 2 in the "physical" layer would confuse more. Anyone using −−root (there won't be many) should be aware of the MAX_PATH limit.
11:32:30	pondlife	I certainly don't want to risk general Rockbox buffers (e.g. in dircache) being MAX_PATH*2.
11:32:43	pondlife	They should all probablly be MAX_PATH+1, though
11:33:07	rasher	I suppose that's fine
11:33:20	pondlife	snprintf doesn't null-terminate if we use the whole buffer, does it? That'll need a bit of mess...
11:33:57	pondlife	I'd like the sim-specific dircache code to vanish if possible, so we only differ at a POSIX level.
11:35:19	jhMikeS	snprintf should always NULL terminate
11:35:44	pondlife	Good
11:36:14	pondlife	I had a sudden guess that it would be like strncpy and not do the termination if the dest buffer was full.
11:36:15	jhMikeS	the NULL is supposed to count towards the limit
11:36:52	GodEater_	how does strncpy know ?
11:37:54	pondlife	Am I wrong? I though that char dest[5]; strncpy(dest, "12345", 5); would not leave dest null-terminated.
11:38:01	jhMikeS	I think our strncpy should count the NULL towards the limit always. forget whatever the spec is and use the safer way.
11:38:55	pondlife	As long as that doesn't break codecs and other imported code..
11:39:21	petur	any code relying on that is to be removed...
11:39:25	jhMikeS	I say fix the code
11:40:00	linuxstb	If we're not complying with POSIX, I would prefer that the function be named differently...
11:40:20	pondlife	Indeed.
11:40:34	preglow	i say we just comply with posix
11:40:42	preglow	let the same things that are bugs in posix be bugs here too
11:40:58	pondlife	Looks like snprintf DOES include the null, where strncpy doesn't anyway.
11:41:02	jhMikeS	eck...while we're at it let's to the fancy thing and make sure multibyte unicode chars aren't split. :p
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11:43:44	jhMikeS	preglow: do we really need those too? :)
11:45:26	pondlife	Maybe they can have some of ours. Fair, no? :)
11:45:42	preglow	lets donate playback.c
11:46:02	pondlife	And bookmarking in general
11:46:13	preglow	bookmarking is bugged?
11:46:28		Part hachi_
11:46:38	jhMikeS	the can have them
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11:50:52	pondlife	preglow: Look at Flyspray... don't know how many have been fixed (I don't use bookmarking)
11:50:59	GodEater_	bookmarking saves the bookmark in the right place for a start
11:51:07	GodEater_	it saves it in the parent directory, rather than current
11:51:13	GodEater_	which makes no sense imo
11:51:18	pondlife	I agree
11:51:26	jhMikeS	but is it for the right file?
11:51:30	GodEater_	yes
11:51:32	pondlife	I always wondered why?
11:51:35	GodEater_	me too
11:51:44	GodEater_	I looked at trying to fix it and nearly gave myself a mental hernia
11:51:52	pondlife	The code's not nice
11:51:55	pondlife	JdGordon: ping?
11:52:21	*	GodEater_ notices he wrote "right place" where he meant "wrong place"
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11:52:40	*	pondlife thought it was satirical
11:52:49	pondlife	i.e. so obviously wrong
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11:52:56	*	GodEater_ is pleased pondlife thinks he's so sophisticated
11:53:06	pondlife	Yes, and after meeting you
11:53:13	GodEater_	indeed :)
11:53:34	GodEater_	sadly it was just a typo
11:54:35	pondlife	JdGordon (or anyone): Should we change the list callbacks to take a buffer size, rather than assuming MAX_PATH ?
11:54:39	LinusN	pondlife, GodEater: i think the reason was to make it convenient to resume bookmarks by clicking on the bookmark files
11:54:40	preglow	GodEater_: so, are you going to start pushing the scroll wheel accel patch soon? :>
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11:55:34	preglow	how can bookmarking code not be nice, btw? it sounds pretty simple
11:55:40	pondlife	LinusN: Is it that much more convenient? Depends on how many files in the child and parent folder.
11:56:01	pondlife	preglow: You'd think that playback resume and bookmarks would use the same code, right?... :)
11:56:09	preglow	pondlife: _right_
11:56:14	preglow	well, that's silly
11:56:15	preglow	it should
11:56:16	LinusN	i guess the creator of the patch keeps his audiobooks in separate folders
11:56:19	pondlife	I suspect it's ripe for some green delta work
11:56:51	LinusN	i think the bookmark file should be in the same dir as the audio
11:57:10	pondlife	I think it should be possible to bookmark per file too, somehow.
11:57:28	pondlife	For database users
11:57:39	LinusN	yes, but how to combine the two?
11:57:50	LinusN	many audiobooks are multifile
11:58:34	preglow	LinusN: i've got speex.codec at 40kb for coldfire here now, and i'm thinking 30kb is a realistic minimum, starting to sound ok for core inclusion?
11:58:38	pondlife	Support .bmark files alongside files, as well as along side dirs like we currently have?
11:58:38	linuxstb	Can any E200 (any variety) owners test this patch which should make e200rpatcher identify a vanilla e200, rather than just displaying "unknown bootloader" - http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/e200r-crcs.diff You'll need to build the e200r patching application, and then build e200rpatcher itself.
11:58:48	LinusN	preglow: way cool!
11:59:02	linuxstb	preglow: How much space is it going to need for buffers?
11:59:12	pondlife	preglow: 30k sounds lovely
11:59:15	preglow	linuxstb: output buffers?
11:59:22	LinusN	pondlife: sounds like a possible way, then we can support playlists as well
11:59:34	linuxstb	preglow: I guess so, plus its own bss
12:00
12:00:02	pondlife	Or scrap .bmark files and build it all into playlist_control? Resume just becomes an auto-bookmark.
12:00:04	preglow	linuxstb: it pretty much only has ibss, and it needs about 320 words output buffer for 16khz, 640 for 32khz
12:00:27	preglow	linuxstb: without the output buffer, it currently needs 10kb iram in total, which can be shaved down somewhat
12:00:30	pondlife	Do people need to be able to copy .bmark files around and maintain positions though?
12:01:00	linuxstb	But we currently have a 512KB voice codec swap buffer we can discard when voice is in the core?
12:01:08	preglow	i'd imagine
12:01:28	LinusN	pondlife: but then playlist_control can grow rather big...
12:01:41	pondlife	Hmm, true. But the code would be much simpler
12:01:51	pondlife	I'd love to integrate it all.
12:02:34	linuxstb	preglow: I assume libspeex is going to be need some Makefile voodoo to build it separately for linking with the core? Similar to the two versions of libmad?
12:02:48	pondlife	brb
12:02:48	preglow	linuxstb: yes, it will need excluding oggframing.c, for example
12:02:53	preglow	but we have a bit of a problem
12:02:59	preglow	speexenc can't make raw speex files
12:03:17	linuxstb	Could we add that feature to it?
12:03:36	preglow	making a speex encoder is rather simple, but it would be nice not to have to bundle libspeex or something
12:03:47	preglow	anywho, we'd require speexenc anyway, so...
12:04:03	preglow	linuxstb: but it might also be quite easy to just strip away the ogg stuff
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12:04:23	preglow	i assume we're going to ignore the possibility of the voice file being corrupted?
12:04:44	linuxstb	I assume we currently do...
12:04:49	preglow	:)
12:04:50	jhMikeS	preglow: get to work...:) death to swapping.
12:05:09	preglow	yeah, i guess i should set up some makefile magic
12:05:17	preglow	but it'll have to wait until tonight
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12:05:40	preglow	but a good question is, are we going to allow 32 khz speex files?
12:05:45	preglow	i can strip away some iram usage if not
12:05:59	roolku	one reason why the bookmark is at the same level as the directory is consistency with bookmarks on playlists
12:06:04	jhMikeS	preglow: as opposed to what?
12:06:11	preglow	jhMikeS: 16khz
12:06:12	roolku	you can't put the bookmark inside the playlist
12:06:20	preglow	jhMikeS: which is already better than what we use for voice files (12khz)
12:06:25	jhMikeS	oh, bugger that...why bother?
12:06:31	preglow	shruggage
12:06:40	roolku	also I'd rather have the bookmark mixed in with hundreds of audiobook files
12:06:54	linuxstb	preglow: How much IRAM are we talking about?
12:06:55	roolku	rather not
12:07:21	preglow	linuxstb: not much, 0.5kb tops, plus 320 words of output buffer
12:07:30	jhMikeS	preglow: voice with a 16kHz speex sounds really good, right?
12:07:43	linuxstb	I would be tempted to leave features in for now, and strip them out later if we need to.
12:08:29	jhMikeS	32kHz isn't tempting if 12kHz has been enough for ages
12:08:51	preglow	jhMikeS: it sounds nice
12:09:04	LinusN	how is the compression ratio compared to mp3 btw?
12:09:27	preglow	depends on the quality you want
12:09:34	preglow	files can be anywhere from 4 kbps to 30++
12:09:48	LinusN	of course, but to get roughly the same quality as the current voice files
12:10:07	preglow	linuxstb: rough estimate suggests 700 bytes of iram will be saved by excluding 32khz, plus output buffer
12:10:17	preglow	LinusN: dunno, i don't use voice
12:10:37	*	jhMikeS just wants core voice so he can start multithreading codecs easily :)
12:11:09	Isolinear	Is there any documentation about the values inside of a .bmark file?
12:11:14	LinusN	no
12:11:29	LinusN	only source code
12:11:37		Quit CaptainSquid (Remote closed the connection)
12:11:46	jhMikeS	bookmark.c line 906?
12:12:09	preglow	a lot of the current iram use is in constants
12:12:30	preglow	there is only about 2kb in decoder state for 16 khz
12:13:17	pondlife	Does make voice support speexenc yet?
12:13:22	*	pondlife tries it.
12:13:29	jhMikeS	I'd rather save IRAM for intercore use. It's not much help on PP for data (caching isn't so helpful either for data).
12:14:02	preglow	pondlife: remember to use vbr
12:14:34	preglow	jhMikeS: neither iram nor caching is helpful for data?
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12:14:46	preglow	i kind of thought the reason iram was so bad for data on pp was because of the cache
12:14:50	pondlife	Hmm, it doesn't look for speexenc
12:14:52	jhMikeS	preglow: i've had iram be slower for data
12:14:53	pondlife	Just oggenc
12:15:08	pondlife	oggenc: Command not found. Using lame for encoding voice clips
12:15:09	jhMikeS	than cached. but caching data isn't the most important thing on PP
12:16:06	jhMikeS	preglow: I have mpegplayer setup now to use the filebuffer uncached alias...no real difference in performance
12:16:38	preglow	there are some example files at http://www.pvv.org/~thomj/rockbox/speex/, nb = 8khz, wb = 16khz, uwb = 32khz
12:16:49	jhMikeS	I also saw no drop when switching e200 to an uncached framebuffer
12:17:07	preglow	jhMikeS: weird...
12:18:01	jhMikeS	MrH's analysis agrees with that. Code caching is far more important.
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12:21:01	jhMikeS	I suppose since it's a unified cache, it's possible to evict your code or tables while processing huge amounts of data
12:21:01	pondlife	preglow: Thanks for the examples; I've compared the VBR ones.
12:21:01	preglow	i don't really think the difference between 16khz and 32khz is _that_ huge
12:21:01	preglow	not compared to 8khz and 16khz
12:21:04	pondlife	IMO, q1 and nb aren't good enough
12:21:14	preglow	agreed, never expected them to be
12:21:23	Isolinear	I'm trying to figure out what the numeric values mean in a bookmark file...
12:21:47	Isolinear	The first is obviously the number of the file in the playlist.
12:22:10	akuma	when i play music on my 1st gen ipod nano i hear some squeeking sound in hte background...
12:22:10	preglow	though, if it is good enough for us on cellphones, it should be good enough for voice files :>
12:22:10	akuma	is there anything i can do to stop it?
12:22:11	Isolinear	The rest have something to do with the time index of the song and where to resume from...
12:22:36	preglow	akuma: i've got a nano, i can't hear anything
12:22:46	pondlife	preglow: IMO the voice playback should be better than phone quality. the q8 16kHz is the one for me
12:23:02	pondlife	q4 has annoying artifacts
12:23:08	rasher	pondlife: adding voice support into configure is already done, just commented out
12:23:14	akuma	preglow: are you using the current build?
12:23:15	rasher	pondlife: speex support, that should be
12:23:19	pondlife	Ah, ok.
12:23:24	preglow	akuma: yes
12:23:25	pondlife	Anyone want to uncomment it?
12:23:32	LinusN	Isolinear: have you checked the source code? bookmark.c line 906
12:23:52	rasher	pondlife: since it'll break all voicescripts ever, I think we shouldn't just yet
12:24:06	preglow	pondlife: 28kbit, then
12:24:10	pondlife	rasher: Oops... I forgot you already had a patch for root dir (blush)
12:24:26	preglow	pondlife: i expect we can use less than that, the jump between q4 and q8 is big
12:24:26	Isolinear	LinusN: Is this where I want to be? http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/bookmark.c?revision=15206&view=markup&pathrev=15206
12:24:35	pondlife	preglow: Yes, q6..?
12:24:44	preglow	13kb -> 28kb
12:24:59	akuma	preglow: reinstall the .rockbox folder?
12:25:24	jhMikeS	preglow: 8kHz is nasty with pretty much anything...that's what...telephone quality? :p
12:26:04	preglow	pondlife: uploading 5-6-7 now
12:26:12	LinusN	Isolinear: yes, that's the file
12:26:30	Isolinear	Now I just need to learn C syntax really quick... :P
12:27:08	preglow	jhMikeS: that's gsm quality, pretty much
12:27:11	preglow	pondlife: there
12:27:33	rasher	pondlife: no worries, it was out of date anyway
12:29:09	akuma	preglow: on the top right of my ipod screen i get a small symole ...
12:29:20	preglow	pondlife: the worst q4 artifacts are gone already at q5 for me
12:29:22	akuma	looks like a spanner in a black circle...
12:30:35	Isolinear	Ok, I found the format but I don't know what it means...
12:30:42	akuma	preglow: what does it mean?
12:30:57	Isolinear	*/
12:30:57	Isolinear	/* This file will contain N number of bookmarks in the following format: */
12:30:57	Isolinear	/* resume_indexresume_offsetresume_seedresume_first_index */
12:30:57	DBUG	Enqueued KICK Isolinear
12:30:57	Isolinear	/* resume_filemillisecondsMP3 Title*
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12:31:13	Isolinear	Resume index is the playlist number.
12:31:32		Quit Soap (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
12:31:36	Isolinear	Anyone know what resume offset, seed, and first index are?
12:32:11	preglow	akuma: i don't know, don't have my nano here
12:32:45	akuma	ah k...
12:32:58	linuxstb	akuma: That symbol could also be something specific to the theme you're using.
12:33:17	akuma	i am using the default theme...
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12:33:46	linuxstb	No-one uses the default theme.... ;)
12:33:46	Coololo	hi
12:33:55	Nico_P	amiconn: ping
12:34:13	akuma	linuxstb: tellme a nice theme for ipod nano please...
12:34:15	Coololo	I'm a 5G (60G) ipod owner
12:34:17		Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
12:34:30	Coololo	and I made yesterday a battery bench
12:34:31	akuma	i do not want eyecandy stuff...
12:35:23	Coololo	I made a test with a 128kbps album, around 34Mb
12:35:27	linuxstb	akuma: What is "nice" is up to you - you could try http://www.rockbox-themes.org
12:35:39	Coololo	I didn't want any HDD activity
12:35:41	linuxstb	akuma: But if you're happy with the default, then use it.
12:36:13		Quit metzelmetzger ()
12:36:24	Coololo	But I heard at least one time (in the night) the HDD turn on
12:36:46	Coololo	my build is from yesterday
12:36:51	linuxstb	That's expected.
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12:37:26	pondlife	preglow: q6_wb is the one for me, I think.
12:37:37	pondlife	wb_q6, even!
12:37:43	Jakeworld	Nico_P: I'm afraid the earlier fix for my skipping bug is still an issue
12:38:15	Nico_P	Jakeworld: with MPC?
12:38:30	Jakeworld	yes, it usually happens the first time it buffers
12:38:46	Jakeworld	it skips through 8-10 songs
12:39:04	pondlife	preglow: Out of interest, which Jethro Tull album are they talking about?
12:39:39	Jakeworld	I'm trying to play with the settings to make sure it's not something I've done, but so far it's still happening
12:39:53	Nico_P	Jakeworld: it's not one of your settings
12:40:02	Coololo	with MP3
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12:41:33	Coololo	Is it normal to have a HDD activity with an album roughly 2 times smaller than the RAM?
12:41:55	Nico_P	Jakeworld: looking now
12:42:46	Jakeworld	sure thing, it's definitely better than before, but it happens most noticeably the first time I start audio playback after turning on the device
12:43:32	linuxstb	Coololo: Yes, I already said that...
12:44:41	pixelma	akuma (linuxstb): I think you mean the symbol for disk access in the default theme.... if you hear the sound everytime the symbol appears (and probably got an "affected" Nano, I thought that could be interesting...
12:46:12	akuma	pixelma: yes more or less everytime i see the icon flashing i hear the noise but they are not in sync with the flashing...
12:46:34	akuma	something wrong with my nano?
12:46:55	pondlife	Nico_P: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/8106 has a recipe using MPC
12:47:09	Coololo	linuxstb: sorry about that, I have to wait around 4 min to see my message displayed on IRC lol
12:47:45	Nico_P	pondlife: sure it's that one?
12:48:25	pondlife	No!
12:49:15	pondlife	http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/6904
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12:50:35	*	linuxstb does his work for today and confirms 7738 is find on the ipod color
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12:51:11	Coololo	Anyway, it goes up to 13h40 and stop at 11% (probably due to a disk access)
12:51:44	linuxstb	Coololo: Had you done a similar test with an older version of Rockbox?
12:51:49	pondlife	So which test targets remain for FS #7738? Could it not be committed for the known good targets at least (with the warning fixed, natch).
12:51:54	preglow	pondlife: aqualung
12:51:59	pondlife	Thanks
12:52:46	linuxstb	pondlife: Probably just the mini2g - the 4g is identical to the Color.
12:52:47	Jakeworld	I'd love to stick around.. but I have an exam tomorrow, so the best of luck with the musepack bug
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12:53:24	preglow	pondlife: and setting removed
12:53:29	preglow	settings
12:53:31	pondlife	Yes
12:53:57	Isolinear	7738... That's the Sansa-port scrollwheel accel patch, right?
12:54:43	*	akuma off... hopes his nano will fix itself magically.....
12:54:55	linuxstb	pondlife: It seems bluebrother has already tested on a mini...
12:54:57	akuma	thanks all...
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12:56:00	*	pixelma has to leave again too, laters
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13:00
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13:02:37	amiconn	Nico_P: pong
13:02:55	Nico_P	you reported a problem about PCM underrin during buffering
13:03:07	amiconn	yes
13:03:14	amiconn	Observed this morning on my mini g2
13:03:23	Nico_P	which codec?
13:03:40	amiconn	I just played an album, and everytime the mini rebuffered, there were 1 or 2 dropouts due to pcm underrun
13:03:46	amiconn	mp3, lame −−preset standard
13:04:06	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
13:05:03	Nico_P	hmm
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13:15:28	preglow	amiconn: how's the brightness stuff going?
13:15:43	Nico_P	haha... too much handle moving
13:15:45	Nico_P	jhMikeS: looks like the mutex return from find_handle would be handy
13:16:08	jhMikeS	Nico_P: explain "mutex return"
13:16:11	Nico_P	lostlogic: things are broken with prep_bufdata... handles move
13:16:25	Nico_P	jhMikeS: your idea of making find_handle return with a mutex locked
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13:17:30	jhMikeS	It's implemented and now out of sync I'm sure. I didn't do the mental follow-through of every path to ensure no deadlocks are possible.
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13:18:19	Nico_P	jhMikeS: if you can't be bothered to sync it I can do it
13:19:54	jhMikeS	I have a diff. It really needs the full logical check though. There were definitely some points I wasn't certain about and I think something that needed addressing somehow.
13:21:15	jhMikeS	Some of it was that I hadn't gone through the stuff after the switch statement to be sure it was all correct.
13:21:57		Quit TTThomas_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:22:00	jhMikeS	1 sec...I'll pastebin real quick
13:23:51	jhMikeS	Nico_P: http://rafb.net/p/P4hird62.html
13:24:02	Nico_P	thanks
13:25:04	Nico_P	jhMikeS: are the conflict markers in the diff normal?
13:25:37	Nico_P	lostlogic: ping
13:26:17	jhMikeS	Those are after an svn up with conflicts then just diffing it with them in place
13:29:20	Nico_P	ok
13:29:28	jhMikeS	basically it comes down to anything that returns struct memory_handle *h _successfully_ leaves the mutex locked for subsequent pointer use
13:30:15	Nico_P	what does the mutex prevent others from doing with the handle while it's in use?
13:30:25	Nico_P	e.g. can it still be buffered?
13:31:31	jhMikeS	it's only to protect a move or whatever. where I left off it would probably leave it locked while reading a chunk.
13:32:01	Nico_P	sounds good... the handle moving is exactly the problem I just encountered
13:32:02	jhMikeS	one problem area was the yield_codec function but that's now out of the pic
13:32:09	Nico_P	no, it's back
13:32:22	jhMikeS	what the heck for?
13:33:16	Nico_P	to prevent (or try to) PCM underruns while buffering
13:33:19	jhMikeS	if buffering can stall codecs that long, it should probably read smaller chunks. also, what about disk spinup?
13:33:47	Nico_P	yield_codec is called between chunks
13:35:06	jhMikeS	I just know there's a better way. If video can be buffered without such a function, audio should be nothing.
13:35:43	Nico_P	how?
13:36:29	jhMikeS	what holds things up? the PCM buffer really drops down?
13:37:17	Nico_P	yeah, I think so. People with c200s reported buffer underruns when yield_codec was gone and replaced by the same but without a sleep loop
13:37:48	jhMikeS	Video only yields once on the buffer every 32k...no special yields and that's running two codecs.
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13:39:23	pondlife	Nico_P: Probably a silly question, but why does buffering need to yield at all, isn't it built into the disk reading functions?
13:40:10	jhMikeS	pondlife: those do yield quite a bit
13:40:10	Nico_P	honestly I'm not sure
13:40:31	pondlife	Every n bytes of transfer, I think... so ideal for this.
13:40:59	jhMikeS	ata-e200_c200 yields every (can't rember now precisely) 2ms or so...on a timer
13:41:03	*	Nico_P needs an underpowered target
13:41:36	pondlife	2ms is how much PCM?
13:41:41		Join The-Compiler [0] (n=The-Comp@126-32.77-83.cust.bluewin.ch)
13:41:56	preglow	ipods are _underpowered_ ? :P
13:41:57	jhMikeS	88.2 samples
13:42:19	preglow	some people might claim gigabeats are overpowered, you know :>
13:42:20	Nico_P	preglow: everything is, compared to the gigabeat :p
13:42:31	Nico_P	hehe
13:42:31	The-Compiler	Hi
13:42:56	jhMikeS	blah, it's just barely enough to play 320x240 NTSC right
13:43:25	*	pondlife thinks the build table should be split into two parts
13:43:34	pondlife	Maybe targets and sims?
13:43:40	jhMikeS	red and green?
13:43:53	pondlife	Anything to avoid all the horizontal scrolling
13:45:18	*	GodEater_ thinks pondlife should get a bigger monitor
13:45:31	pondlife	We already had this discussion.... :)
13:45:36	GodEater_	:)
13:46:13	pondlife	Sections for targets, sims and bootloaders would make sense though
13:46:31	pondlife	The target table would be all green too.
13:46:40		Quit Soap (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:46:42	pondlife	Aside from M-Robe
13:47:24		Join Soap [0] (n=Soap@rockbox/staff/soap)
13:47:31	Nico_P	is there anyone here who uses MPC and has the skipping bug?
13:47:38		Quit midgey ()
13:47:53	jhMikeS	I thought of just targets with all errors summed up for that target if collapsed, if you expand details it shows the breakdown for the target. Honestly, I like just seeing the condition of things before me.
13:49:18	jhMikeS	The build table might be more readable if rows and colums were swapped though
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13:50:56	preglow	separate tables for sims and bootloaders is kind of a good idea
13:51:12	preglow	then again, the current ones does fit a lot of info in a nice way
13:51:32	preglow	almost requires the entire width of my 1600x1200 display, but...
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13:53:40	amiconn	pondlife: what horizontal scrolling?
13:54:07	Bagder	here we go again :-)
13:54:11	pondlife	The build table is rather wide....
13:54:19	*	amiconn doesn't need to scroll
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13:54:32	amiconn	There's room for a few more targets even
13:54:40	*	pondlife borrows amiconn's monitor
13:54:45	pondlife	Ah, you're right!
13:54:56	amiconn	Just a laptop, 1400x1050
13:55:13		Quit Xytovl (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
13:55:19	Bagder	http://daniel.haxx.se/blog/2007/11/02/wquxga-really/ :-)
13:55:42	Bagder	soon required for all rockbox devs
13:56:00	*	petur is happy with his 1920x1200 laptop :P
13:56:02	jhMikeS	my 1800x1440 display is fine, the 1280x1024 needs some h-scrolling
13:56:17	pondlife	1280x1024 here
13:56:17	amiconn	pondlife: ata doesn't yield during transfer, only during spinup
13:56:22	pondlife	Ah, ok
13:56:46	tuplanolla	WSXGA+ here!
13:56:48	jhMikeS	amiconn: only during spinup? I don't think so. recording would fail to yield then during a flush.
13:57:32		Quit webguest35 (Client Quit)
13:59:20	amiconn	Or rather, it yoields in wait_for_bsy() and wait_for_rdy()
13:59:27		Quit xytovl_ (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
13:59:51	amiconn	Additionally, an ata transfer is limited to 256 sectors (that's the protocol limit with lba28)
14:00
14:00:02	jhMikeS	yeah, it does quite a bit of that
14:00:08	Nico_P	jhMikeS: the current code would have an aweful deadlock with mutexes
14:00:37	jhMikeS	Nico_P: I don't doubt it. That's why it's not committed.
14:01:07	Nico_P	it's not in the patch (I haven't looked at it carfully yet)
14:01:36	Nico_P	but I have a very bad situation here
14:01:38	jhMikeS	ah, I thought you meant the patch. that's probably worse then.
14:02:23	jhMikeS	what's the deadlock?
14:02:52	Nico_P	indeed. it's to do with handles being moved while prep_bufdata is waiting for the handle to be buffered
14:03:04	Nico_P	it waits on the old copy of the handle, which isn't updated anymore
14:03:05	amiconn	Hmm. Even at 1280x1024, the build table almost fits, Just the score & build server link column is out of sight
14:03:40	jhMikeS	One thing to mind when analyzing and designing is that a mutex will not block the thread that already owns it...and calls must be balanced.
14:03:42	Nico_P	the bad thing is that prep_bufdata is the one which triggers the move in the first place
14:04:20	Nico_P	jhMikeS: if there were mutexes, prep_bufdata would own the mutex and ask to move the handle, and this would block on the mutex
14:05:41	Nico_P	the fix is quite simple but I might be causing problems elsewhere with it
14:06:44	jhMikeS	Nico_P: not seeing it
14:07:00	jhMikeS	a function that takes an *h doesn't have a mutex lock
14:08:11	jhMikeS	_handle function = expects mutex locked, _handle_id = locks mutex and unlocks. Functions returning *h, lock on success (or rather unlock on failure).
14:08:15	Nico_P	jhMikeS: the mutex would be owned by its caller
14:08:32	Nico_P	(bufread or bufgetdata)
14:09:41	jhMikeS	yeah?
14:10:53	jhMikeS	but buf_request_buffer_handle would be changed to take an h. that implies Q_START_FILL must take an h and therefore the buffering thread will not lock it itself.
14:13:46	amiconn	preglow: I know how to do it. Not much more yet, didn't have time...
14:14:08	Nico_P	jhMikeS: Q_START_FILL looks fishy to me... I removed it here
14:14:46	Nico_P	especially, I don't see why buf_request_buffer_handle should send Q_START_FILL
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14:16:49	jhMikeS	whatever is done, a regular set of rules must be rigorously observed. if you already have a handle pointer, don't try getting it again from an id.
14:17:36		Quit advcomp2019 ("Leaving")
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14:18:10	Nico_P	jhMikeS: the problem in the case of buf_request_buffer_handle is that it can be used both by callers who already have the pointer and callers who don't
14:18:32	preglow	amiconn: the weird morse code way of signalling brightness changes will probably be fun to implement in a cooperative way
14:18:39	Nico_P	well actually this one doesn't try to get the pointer, but it will result in trying on the buffering thread
14:18:49	jhMikeS	Nico_P: then you make two functions
14:19:03	jhMikeS	or you make two messages
14:19:42	Nico_P	hmm
14:19:43	amiconn	preglow: why?
14:19:54	preglow	amiconn: just seemed like it to me, i might be wrong...
14:19:59	preglow	amiconn: long delays and everything
14:20:54	amiconn	Interrupts need to be disabled during the low pulses, but that's it
14:21:02		Quit J3TC- (Client Quit)
14:21:10	amiconn	FIQs aren't affected by that
14:21:32	jhMikeS	Nico_P: so you have an _ID variant where the buffer thread locks and an _H variant where it carries out a request where it _knows_ the lock is held by the thread generating it.
14:22:46	jhMikeS	this of course implies that it must reply to said _H message before attempting any locking itself
14:26:17	JdGordon	pondlife: hey, still there?
14:27:52	JdGordon	Lynx_: yeah, every screen pretty much needs hadnling for the touchpad.. but im slowly adding them.. rockbox is usable now with a stylus except for a few screens which arnt used often
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14:28:36	Lynx_	JdGordon: nice, how do you test this? simulator only?
14:28:46	JdGordon	nope.. we have it running on the mrobe 500
14:29:10	Lynx_	ah, i didn't know it ran on the mrobe already
14:30:04	_TTThomas	.j #gigabeat
14:30:07	Lynx_	i think we need a graph, time vs. devices supported, i bet this keeps getting faster due to same processors in new players and so on
14:30:17		Nick _TTThomas is now known as TTThomas (n=root@c-68-38-172-205.hsd1.de.comcast.net)
14:30:18	pondlife	JdGordon: Kind of
14:30:21	jhMikeS	JdGordon: had a crazy notion...since you have so much screen real estate, how about making buttons around the screen border...as in actually drawing a button pad?
14:30:32	JdGordon	amiconn: 4 params for a function is good for sh and arm right? 5 means it needs more code to do it?
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14:30:49	JdGordon	jhMikeS: that was one idea we had.. but the tochscreen is cooler :)
14:30:54	JdGordon	we could do both
14:31:17	JdGordon	pondlife: it makes sense to specify the buffer length.. but its going to be a massive PITA to do it
14:31:22	pondlife	Why?
14:31:34	JdGordon	because its everywhere...
14:31:48	*	jhMikeS wants draggable clipping viewports ... hmmm ... XBox (a la X-Windows) ;)
14:32:01	JdGordon	do we actually need more than MAX_PATH in any lists?
14:32:06	JdGordon	or is it causign a bug?
14:32:08	pondlife	No, we probably need a lot less
14:32:18	pondlife	No bug, just not good IMHO
14:32:25		Quit Guile`` (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:32:31	pondlife	Where there's a return buffer, there should be a size
14:33:04	pondlife	I wonder if it could reduce binsize, not needing MAX_PATH in some places?
14:33:06	JdGordon	as a matter of good code then for sure we should add it.. but if its not causing problems its not really nescacery
14:33:08	jhMikeS	to keep viruses from exploit buffer overruns in rb?
14:33:45	pondlife	haha, those pesky .rock viruses
14:33:47	pondlife	virii
14:33:51	*	pondlife goes latin again
14:34:03	JdGordon	pondlife: those MAX_PATHS are all locals... so changing their size wont affect bin size... just ram usage.. and it wouldnt be very large
14:34:23	pondlife	I just think it's more obvious than assuming MAX_PATH
14:34:24	*	jhMikeS starts writing smashrock.rock
14:34:39	pondlife	More readable and better.
14:34:54	JdGordon	pondlife: no, i agree 100%... its just im lazy and dont want to do it.. but if you can be bthered :)
14:35:07	pondlife	Maybe I can, but no time at the moment.
14:35:24	pondlife	Just wondered if there was a good reason you hadn't already done it :)
14:35:26	amiconn	JdGordon: Yes, up to 4 parms can be passed in registers on SH and arm
14:36:18	JdGordon	ok, its using 3 now so we could add the param and not add much to size (hopefully)
14:36:30	pondlife	Whenever... lunchtime.
14:36:34	pondlife	back later
14:36:37	*	jhMikeS needs to find that stupid ISO doc buried somewhere on his comp re: MPEG audio frame dropping...so many stupid details :o
14:36:39		Quit pondlife ("Read error: 110 (Connection slimed out)")
14:38:38	*	jhMikeS seems to remember stashing it near the portalplayer datasheets...woops...:P
14:39:56		Quit markun (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:40:31	JdGordon	should you be returned to the wps context menu after leaving the "set song rating" screen? or back to the wps?
14:41:06	DerPapst	back to the wps i'd say...
14:41:17	roolku	back to wps
14:41:32	JdGordon	and should the current rating be shown in the list? I tihnk so
14:41:37	n1s	hmm, this pitch screen is weird... on a repeat event it increases/decreases whole percents and on clicks tenths of percents...
14:41:38	jhMikeS	can it be an option?...:D
14:41:44	*	JdGordon slaps jhMikeS
14:42:13	n1s	anyone against me changing it to always change in tenths of percents?
14:42:28		Quit TTThomas ("BitchX: don't leave home without it!")
14:42:28	roolku	JdGordon: if you mean in the menu option "set rating" - I don't think so, but in the list it should be the cursor position
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14:43:48	amiconn	n1s: Yes. It's already slow to set larger changes with full percents.
14:43:49	jhMikeS	n1s: maybe use accelerated deltas?
14:43:51	JdGordon	I have so it looks the same as svn.. so it says "set song rating: <number>"
14:44:04	amiconn	And on MAS, every change means a short audio dropout
14:44:35	n1s	amiconn: Ok, I'll leave that, jhMikeS too complicated, I never ever use it myself...
14:44:53	roolku	JdGordon: I am not against it, but no other option list displays the current value like this
14:45:14	roolku	JdGordon: could be useful for wps that don't use the rating tag
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14:45:54	jhMikeS	n1s: just 10ths until a certain time passes, then whole %
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14:47:01	jhMikeS	n1s: iirc you asked about check -O options for the SPC codec on coldfire a number of days ago (saw in logs). I tried all of them and everything but -O was as bad as -Os.
14:47:17	JdGordon	bah.. i tinhk it will be smaller delta if i change it to say "set song rating"... so i guess ill do that
14:47:32	n1s	jhMikeS: ok, I was curious if you found out why it broke
14:48:35	jhMikeS	n1s: I never looked at disassemblies or tried to figure out which particular optimization might be responsible. Some day perhaps and maybe a homebrew combo would be even better.
14:48:57	markun	preglow, linuxstb: I keep getting identical speeds with and without http://svn.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg?view=rev&revision=10626
14:49:08	markun	shall I apply it anyway to be closer to the ffmpeg source?
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14:50:21	JdGordon	SFA difference....
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14:51:55	amiconn	jhMikeS: Is there assembler-in-C in the SPC codec?
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14:53:06	jhMikeS	amiconn: plenty but no explicit register use
14:53:14	jhMikeS	save accumulators
14:54:34	linuxstb	markun: Yes, I think it's worth trying to stay in sync with ffmpeg
14:54:58	amiconn	Code with assembler-in-C breaking at higher -O levels is often due to wrong register/parameter usage declaration
14:55:28	jhMikeS	it didn't break, it just increased the boost by > 20%
14:55:43	amiconn	oh
14:55:56	amiconn	That's gcc...
14:56:28	jhMikeS	oddly -Os seemed helpful on things like vorbis by a few %
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14:59:03	n1s	jhMikeS: ah, I also though it broke, that is just the normal behaviour of gcc :-)
14:59:07	jpt9	hey
14:59:15	jpt9	is there any way to convert windows .FON fonts to rockbox format?
15:00
15:00:04	jpt9	I have .fon copies of the standard VGA and EGA fonts, and I'd love to have them in Rockbox.
15:01:16	jhMikeS	n1s: I was just to fix the fact that the nice 72% boost on the worst material jumped to like 94% all of a sudden. :p
15:02:53	n1s	jhMikeS: speaking of that the boost seems to have gone up a lot lately, on an svn build from last night i get 37% boost in the buffering debug screen on a vorbis q4 file that used to give 6-7% boost
15:03:51	preglow	markun: sure
15:04:00	linuxstb	n1s: Was that 5-7% before or after MoB?
15:04:04	linuxstb	^6-7
15:04:10	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
15:04:43	n1s	linuxstb: definatly before mod bu iirc it din't go up with the initial commit
15:04:53	n1s	of MoB
15:05:07	jhMikeS	n1s: that happened once with vorbis when alignment wasn't kept correct (16-byte). maybe it's fallen out again.
15:05:11	n1s	s/mod/MoB
15:05:49	n1s	jhMikeS: but test_codec speed was not much different from before
15:07:16	jhMikeS	My experience once was (before some optimizations): about 12% boost on a test file. loaded a voice file: 28% boost. reason...malloc buffer wasn't line-aligned with the voice file loaded. perhaps something similar.
15:07:52	n1s	I will try to investigate more once I get this pitch screen change committed and my player charged
15:08:05	linuxstb	Hmm, so we can't trust test_codec 100%?
15:08:21	*	markun prepares for another crash caused by the buggy USB stack of FreeBSD :(
15:08:33	n1s	linuxstb: does test_codec use the same buffering/playback code as the core?
15:08:40	linuxstb	No
15:08:48		Quit markun (Remote closed the connection)
15:09:24	JdGordon	anyone else see something odd in the delta table?
15:09:25	n1s	so it could be something weird in the core playback that does it
15:09:42	linuxstb	It purely tests the codec - it implements the codec API itself, based on reading the entire file into RAM, no complexity such as rebuffering.
15:09:50	JdGordon	0 delta on h100... green on every other target?
15:13:12	jhMikeS	linuxstb: sure that implies that? I thought test_codec was to get the other stuff out of the way to just test the codec. :)
15:13:34	preglow	green \o/
15:13:45	linuxstb	jhMikeS: what implies what?
15:14:29	linuxstb	JdGordon: Looks weird to me...
15:14:35	jhMikeS	linuxstb: that you can't trust test_codec if the difference is what you were talking about
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15:15:39		Join [Kork] [0] (n=Kork@dslb-084-056-109-120.pools.arcor-ip.net)
15:15:42	[Kork]	hi there
15:15:51	*	jhMikeS thinks some deltas get delayed one commit sometimes.
15:16:21	[Kork]	i want to install rockbox on my sansa e280, any hints before i start?
15:16:21	jhMikeS	look at the +106 on video for instance
15:16:42	JdGordon	odd... but oh well :p
15:16:43	jhMikeS	ah, now a -124 on H100 only
15:16:45	linuxstb	[Kork]: Only to read the manual...
15:16:59	[Kork]	rtfm, i'll do that ;-)
15:17:10	linuxstb	Yes, it is indeed a fine manual.
15:17:42	GodEater_	http://www.virginmegastores.co.uk/productdetails.jsf?code=818488&_rtid=d
15:17:58	GodEater_	XBOX 360 for £35 - in case anyone is interested :)
15:18:21	JdGordon	typo? or 2nd hand or something?
15:18:27	JdGordon	timeing out....
15:18:33	GodEater_	hehehe - not surprised...
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15:19:03	linuxstb	That beats those woot offers the US people keep gloating about...
15:19:08	GodEater_	certainly does
15:19:17	GodEater_	I expect a RB port for the 360 in a couple of months now :)
15:19:34	linuxstb	"We reserve the right to alter product prices on the website to reflect any increase in the cost of the products for reasons beyond our reasonable control, this may include (but is not limited to) pricing mistakes, tax or other duty increases."
15:19:43	GodEater_	curse them!
15:19:45	*	linuxstb assumes it's a pricing misake...
15:19:50	JdGordon	usual shop rules then
15:19:55	JdGordon	must be a mistake
15:20:16	roolku	JdGordon: shouldn't the "no info" be "runtime gathering not enabled" ?
15:20:23	amiconn	ping (Zagor, LinusN, Bagder)
15:20:30	LinusN	pong
15:20:34	markun	linuxstb: btw, with -l0 the file ends up 2% larger, but it decodes exactly 2x faster, not a bad tradeoff
15:20:36	`VL	hello all. iriver H340. rockbox. 3 lines: PANIC \n Blocking violation \n B->*T usb main. See them for 3 hours. Is there a way to reboot? or i have to wait untill battery discharges/ reassemble player ?
15:20:43	JdGordon	roolku: yes.. but didnt want to add a new string
15:20:52	jhMikeS	they say there was a pricing mistake after you ordered? :)
15:20:53	amiconn	LinusN: Could you check what's up with the delta script?
15:20:57	linuxstb	markun: That's still 24-bit though?
15:21:01	markun	yes
15:21:05	amiconn	Some deltas are delayed one round. That seems to be new
15:21:10	markun	didn't do any 16-bit tests
15:21:17	linuxstb	It would be interesting (for potential SH performance) to test 16-bit files
15:21:24	*	jhMikeS remembers this delta bug when the table was first introduced
15:21:37	markun	linuxstb: I'll do a quick test
15:21:38	roolku	JdGordon: and a callback to remove that entry if is not applicable was too hard to do?
15:21:41	LinusN	amiconn: i'll happily pass that on to bagder, he's the brain behind that script
15:21:50	roolku	JdGordon: that would be the cleanest solution i think
15:22:04	JdGordon	roolku: it used to do that.. but not nice having items disappear from the menu
15:22:14	amiconn	linuxstb: I think we can pretty much forget flac on SH, unless you have an idea how to write an efficient rice decoder without shift-by-n instruction
15:22:42	*	linuxstb forgets flac on SH
15:23:09	amiconn	That's the biggest problem - the rice decoder. All other decoding steps are fairly straightforward, but even those add up
15:23:15	JdGordon	roolku: if you want to add it back in.. just copy the callback from the diff and enable it... im going to bed
15:23:23	jhMikeS	`VL: you have an old build that's for sure
15:23:38	roolku	JdGordon: cheers & good night
15:24:02	JdGordon	grabbing one more game for my ds first though :p
15:24:23	amiconn	shorten might be within reach, but also depends on an efficient rice decoder. But it doesn't need decorrelation (always ecodes stereo as L and R)
15:24:24	`VL	jhMikeS: how old is old for you? ;-) august i think...
15:24:38	petur	stone age
15:24:38	jhMikeS	`VL: And info on resetting the player should be available
15:24:57	amiconn	I would expect that SH needs the whole decoder core written in asm
15:25:01	jhMikeS	`VL: There's no such violation any more...it's not a violation to do that now.
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15:26:20	`VL	jhMikeS: i connected player to really old install of winME, it detected some devices and hanged... usb connection appeared on player. then i had to reboot pc and after i had this.
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15:26:49	`VL	jhMikeS: so, does my old build has capability to reboot? i`ll try to search on website...
15:27:01	amiconn	`VL: Just reset the H340 and update your build
15:27:05	petur	'VL: poke the reset hole?
15:28:31	`VL	amiconn: wow!
15:28:38	`VL	there is a reset hole!!
15:28:52	`VL	1st time need to use it in more than 3 years...
15:28:56	`VL	omg
15:29:17	`VL	amiconn: THANKS
15:29:31	`VL	it works again
15:30:03		Quit JdGordon ("Konversation terminated!")
15:33:59	GodEater_	3 people in my team managed to get order confirmations for the 360 at that price - we'll wait and see what happens :)
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15:36:54	n1s	jhMikeS, linuxstb ok boosting is back to normal levels with current build, probably hit some snag that was already fixed :-/
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15:58:42	lostlogic	Nico_P: why would MPC files be skipped w/o that change? I still think that codecs shouldn't rely on receiving more than FILECHUNK per request
16:00
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16:02:22	Nico_P	lostlogic: hmm I think I got a bit confused between filechunk and guard size in my reasoning why bufread doesn't need the test. but things work better without it, it seems
16:02:35		Quit Zagor ("Client exiting")
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16:02:54	Nico_P	lostlogic: I was more focused on another much bigger (IMHO) issue I found
16:03:03	lostlogic	Nico_P: oh?
16:03:45	Nico_P	prep_bufdata can cause the handle it is reading on to be moved, without a way of knowing
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16:04:12	webguest27	hello guys
16:04:22	lostlogic	Nico_P: moved?
16:04:41	webguest27	i have a big problem with my sansa mp3 player
16:04:45	lostlogic	Nico_P: ohhh
16:04:50	Nico_P	lostlogic: yes, by the shrink_buffer(); call in Q_START_FILL
16:04:51	lostlogic	start_fill causes a shrink
16:04:52	lostlogic	right.
16:05:18	webguest27	i am on version r15463
16:05:30	lostlogic	webguest27: update.
16:05:32	Nico_P	lostlogic: why is start_fill needed?
16:06:23	Nico_P	and even if it is, I think buf_request_buffer_handle should send a Q_BUFFER_HANDLE
16:06:30	akuma	what can i do to remove teh squeeking soundrockbox makes on my ipod nano
16:06:37	webguest27	is there already an update?
16:06:57	lostlogic	Nico_P: to prevent freezes. If you are playing a file which is larger than the buffer then there is no space to do a read when you initially get the buf_request_buffer_handle there is zero space on the buffer to satisfy that request, so no data is read and the caller never receives his data
16:07:04	scorche\|w	webguest27: rockbox usually has around 10 commits a day
16:07:05	lostlogic	webguest27: there is almosta lways already an update.
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16:07:09	webguest27	well right now i cannot load rockbox anymore, it hangs on the load window everytime and does not go on
16:07:26	lostlogic	webguest27: update first, then test, then ask :)
16:07:39	webguest27	haah
16:07:51	webguest27	ok then i need to get home first and update
16:08:15	Nico_P	lostlogic: the case where the handle is larger than the buffer shouldn't need to be treated with a message
16:08:20	Nico_P	it didn't use to
16:08:23	lostlogic	webguest27: also, do you have resume on startup selected? there have been some resume bugs lately
16:08:26	linuxstb	akuma: You could try this build of Rockbox - http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13381.0
16:08:34	webguest27	will there be any bigger improvments on the DB soon?
16:08:41	Nico_P	lostlogic: the buffering thread should detect it just fine with the useful value
16:08:42	scorche\|w	like what?
16:09:08	akuma	linuxstb: but mine is a 2 gb version...
16:09:21	webguest27	well i cannot get in the system anymore, but i guess it wasnt selected but i had auto update the DB turned on
16:09:36	linuxstb	akuma: "1G" means First Generation....
16:09:40	lostlogic	Nico_P: but if buf_request_buffer_handle is called that _means_ that it hasn't triggered a fill in time through the idle loop and then it enters the read loop but cannot read because there is no space but potentially also cannot exit because both usefl and pcmbuf may go low in that time.
16:09:41	scorche\|w	akuma: i think he means 1st gen...not 1 GB
16:09:51	akuma	oh ok...
16:10:04	lostlogic	Nico_P: before entering the read loop we should probably actually guarantee that it can make sufficient progress not to stick in yield codec.
16:10:31	scorche\|w	webguest27: you can always boot into the OF
16:10:49	webguest27	how? :D
16:10:58	lostlogic	"can I read at least watermark worth of data or is entering this function suicide"
16:11:11	Nico_P	lostlogic: why isn't the code starting at line 1294 of buffering.c enough?
16:11:18	webguest27	in my case it hangs before it can load anything from the Rockbox FW
16:11:26		Quit ilgufo ("So Long, and Thanks For All the Fish - http://gufo.wordpress.com")
16:11:31	scorche\|w	webguest27: read the manual...it says how
16:11:38	lostlogic	Nico_P: because if the buffering thread is inside buffer_handle then it's never idling and never gets there
16:12:04	scorche\|w	it also says how to clear your settings, which you could try
16:12:35	Nico_P	lostlogic: is it actually possible that the thread could be buffering when it doesn't have enough data left?
16:12:45	Nico_P	... for a file larger than the buffer?
16:12:51	lostlogic	"data left"? space left.
16:13:18	Nico_P	the important thing is data. if this code block is entered it does the space freeing just fine
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16:14:53	lostlogic	if buf_request_buffer_data is called that means (pretty much by definition) that the file buffer is below the critical level _already_ and most likely no sys_timeout has been triggered to clean up space for the read. In this case, if the pcmbuffer also goes low, it will stick inside the buffer_handle call forever. Even if pcmbuf does not go low, it will not be able to satisfy the request until it falls through _after_ the buf_request_bu
16:15:00	webguest27	can i go to the OF without connecting my player to a pc?
16:15:08	lostlogic	webguest27: read the manual.
16:15:15	webguest27	OK :)
16:15:19	lostlogic	:)
16:15:56	akuma	linuxstb: i downloaded the source do i replace the contents of .rockbox with teh contents of rockbox folder int he source?
16:15:57	lostlogic	s/does not go/does now go/g
16:16:06	webguest27	anytip which part i should read? ;)
16:16:14	webguest27	*any tips
16:16:31	linuxstb	akuma: No, you want to download the binary.
16:18:28	Nico_P	lostlogic: but then whe need to ensure that the handle that is concerned by buffering request isn't moved
16:18:45	Nico_P	jhMikeS's mutex patch might help with that
16:18:58	akuma	linuxstb: this build is updated often?
16:19:28	lostlogic	Nico_P: shuldn't be a problem, I actually had an implementation where prep_bufdata returned the handle which would make solving the problem much easier.
16:19:54	linuxstb	akuma: I've no idea.
16:19:58	Nico_P	lostlogic: "returned the handle"?
16:20:18	Nico_P	the pointer to it?
16:20:45	akuma	will try it and see if squeeking goes away
16:20:48		Quit akuma ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]")
16:22:48	webguest27	ey you guys are great
16:22:54	webguest27	rockbox rocks :D
16:22:59	amiconn	linuxstb: See, that's why I hate this xxG notation...
16:23:29	linuxstb	I don't understand the confusion - I've never seen gigabyte written as G...
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16:24:22	lostlogic	Nico_P: http://test.lostlogicx.com/transfer/rockbox/20071108_buf_prepdata_return_handle.patch <−− untested, but compiles... just to show you what I mean.
16:24:31	scorche\|w	well, that is why we started writing it as "1st gen"..
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16:25:45	Nico_P	lostlogic: yeah, that's better
16:26:04		Part `VL ("happines is a positive cache flow")
16:26:14	lostlogic	Nico_P: I'm testing it now, but I'm pretty sure it'll work fine
16:26:25	Nico_P	I see no reason why it shouldn't
16:26:30	lostlogic	I assume you have a way of triggering the bad that you talked about?
16:26:43	Nico_P	it disappeared with my commit :p
16:26:56	lostlogic	Nico_P: haha, can you test w/o your change but with mine, JinC
16:26:57	lostlogic	?
16:27:00	Nico_P	ok
16:27:23	lostlogic	apparently the IPV is a bad testing platform these days, I tend to not see bugs others do :(
16:27:43	Nico_P	the gigabeat seems to be the worst possible target
16:27:51	lostlogic	cuz its fast
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16:29:57	Nico_P	lostlogic: good news: the bad bug seems to be gone with your patch
16:30:06	lostlogic	bad news?
16:30:18	Nico_P	(it would lead to the codec starving and eventually a segfault)
16:30:31	Nico_P	bad news is withoutmy fix the skipping is still there :p
16:30:44	lostlogic	:(
16:31:15	Nico_P	you need slow buffering to see it. I replaced the yield by a sleep(2) in buffer_handle
16:31:57	lostlogic	and what happens is that the codec thinks its hit the end of the file and jumps ahead?
16:32:26	Nico_P	probably... the MPC codec is quite complicated but I assume it's that
16:32:40	*	lostlogic scowls
16:33:14	lostlogic	oh well, it won't _break_ to have your change in there for bufread so shrug
16:33:22	Nico_P	but I'm quite confident that it's always possible for the buffering thread to give as much as the codec requests
16:33:33	lostlogic	yeah, could just be quite a long wait sometimes
16:33:41	Nico_P	even though it's not on the first buffer_handle call
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16:34:55	lostlogic	yeah
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16:42:15	Nico_P	wow the mpc codec is hard to follow
16:44:09	lostlogic	Nico_P: http://test.lostlogicx.com/transfer/rockbox/20071108_less_strict_range_check.patch
16:44:16	Nico_P	and it's written in german...
16:44:18	lostlogic	is my math right?
16:45:07	Nico_P	lostlogic: it's to prevent bufgetdata from getting more than the guard size?
16:45:39	Nico_P	the comment says it :p
16:45:42	lostlogic	from getting more than guard size over what's immediately following h->ridx
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16:46:52	lostlogic	trying to figure out if I have an off-by-one in there.
16:47:15	Nico_P	looks ok to me
16:47:53	lostlogic	Nico_P: ok, it's running, I'll make sure it wraps ok a few times but it makes the purpose and function of that code block consistent with its new optional nature
16:48:07	Nico_P	yeah it's better indeed
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16:50:29	cooz	hey guys, is anyone currently working on fm tuner, as it's behaving very randonly atm (sansa c200) :(
16:51:16	Nico_P	lostlogic: this means MIN(h->ridx + size - buffer_len, GUARD_BUFSIZE) at line 1065 will become redundant... in the worse case it will be equivalent to MIN(GUARD_BUFSIZE, GUARD_BUFSIZE)
16:51:26	Nico_P	s/worse/worst
16:52:55	lostlogic	Nico_P: yeah, but that's a copy length consideration so we don't want to copy more than reqsize
16:53:02	lostlogic	I noticed the similarity
16:54:14	Nico_P	what I mean is "size_t copy_n = h->ridx + size - buffer_len;" would be correct now
16:54:38	Nico_P	because (h->ridx + size - buffer_len) cannot be > GUARD_BUFSIZE
16:55:02	Nico_P	it's just detail anyway
16:56:18	lostlogic	oooh, true!
16:56:57	Nico_P	and line 1067 can simply be removed
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16:58:10	lostlogic	Nico_P: true and true
16:58:16	lostlogic	yay for early range checking!
16:58:18	Nico_P	maybe a few comments in the code about that would be good though... like add "size <= buffer_len - h->ridx + GUARD_BUFSIZE, so copy_n <= GUARD_BUFSIZE"
16:58:31	lostlogic	yah
16:58:58	Nico_P	oh, too late :)
16:59:02	Nico_P	I can do it if you want
16:59:26	lostlogic	Nico_P: http://test.lostlogicx.com/transfer/rockbox/20071108_no_handle_over_sleep.patch <−− I started working on something new −− does this make sense or am I being paranoid?
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16:59:40	lostlogic	Nico_P: I'll get it after I decide about this other fiddling
16:59:58	preglow	why do i get the impression this stuff is kind of complicated? :P
17:00
17:00:35	lostlogic	preglow: read the code and then decide :-P
17:01:04	lostlogic	preglow: it's simpler than it was in most cases... although the playback.c hooks might still need some de-dup &\| cleanup
17:01:12	Nico_P	lostlogic: makes sense
17:01:30	lostlogic	Nico_P: is it paranoid though? That's the only other place we explicitly sleep while holding a handle.
17:01:39	lostlogic	(sleep \|\| yield)
17:02:13	Nico_P	lostlogic: yeah actually I think it's unnecessary... handles can only be moved in the buffering thread, right?
17:02:26	Nico_P	if so, handles cannot move during that yield/sleep
17:02:27	lostlogic	ah but they can be deleted on the audio thread
17:02:54	lostlogic	ooh, I don't NULL check the new handle retrievals, I should.
17:02:57	Nico_P	no, because actual deleting is done on the bufering thread
17:03:10	Nico_P	bufclose is a message sender
17:03:29	Nico_P	lostlogic: precisely to avoid handles disappearing while buffering them ;)
17:03:52	lostlogic	Nico_P: ok, then it's paranoid :) should still nullcheck that thar other one I added.
17:04:11	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
17:04:16	pondlife	lostlogic: Buffering handles can be deleted on the audio thread?
17:04:24	lostlogic	apparently not :)
17:04:31	pondlife	Pheew :)
17:04:42	Nico_P	pondlife: it used to be possible
17:04:47	*	Nico_P is ashamed
17:05:55	Nico_P	lostlogic: I added the comments
17:06:10	Nico_P	(not committed yet)
17:06:43	pondlife	Nico_P, lostlogic: Feel free to add more comments, particularly to all function tops and if statements...
17:07:12	pondlife	It'd be nice to be sure exactly what every bit of code in buffering.c and playback.c is there for :)
17:07:30	pondlife	Anything you guys don't understand is probably suspicious!
17:07:43	lostlogic	Nico_P: which ones?
17:07:57	Nico_P	lostlogic: I mean the simplification in bufgetdata
17:08:02	lostlogic	pondlife: you're assuming we understand something :-D
17:08:08	pondlife	hehe
17:08:12	lostlogic	Nico_P: oh, I just did too, good thing it's simple
17:08:32	pondlife	I'm assuming that we are now at peak knowledge...
17:08:36	lostlogic	pondlife: yeah, I think we're both trying as we tweak/fix to comment the function so that the tweaks/fixes aren't untweaked/fixed
17:08:47	pixelma	n1s: while you were working on screens.c, you could have fixed Zagor's name (or better: text encoding) for real now. Since JdGordon's "fix" it is uf-8 (again wondering what the encoding of his first commit yesterday was...)
17:09:09	pondlife	Hopefully some of the ifs will turn out to be unneeded with a bit of thought? Or is that unlikely?
17:09:34	pixelma	n1s: if I can trust firefox here...
17:09:51	lostlogic	Nico_P: have you tested with a yield() instad of a sleep(1) in prep_bufdata (or wherever it used to be)?
17:10:02	Nico_P	lostlogic: http://pastebin.ca/766053
17:10:10	Nico_P	no
17:10:43	n1s	pixelma: forgot about it but I have no idea what encoding it's supposed to be in and I'm using gedit as an editor and I'm pretty sure it will not let me do what i want :-)
17:11:43	lostlogic	Nico_P: a yield should be all that's needed I think, but it's not a big difference regardless
17:12:15	lostlogic	Nico_P: and yeah, that's quite close to what I was going to do so hit it whenever you want.
17:12:35	Nico_P	done
17:12:36	lostlogic	(ie comment wordign is different only ;))
17:12:41	Nico_P	hehe
17:16:20	linuxstb	Were there any objections to the idea of making the source files utf8?
17:16:36	BHSPitMonkey	zomg I HATE utf8
17:16:50	BHSPitMonkey	(not really)
17:17:34	Nico_P	linuxstb: I am 100% in favor of that
17:17:35	n1s	I just don't understand why some editors feel like they have to change the encoding of a file, if they just left it alone there wouldn't be a problem
17:18:13	pixelma	linuxstb: I honestly don't know, but somehow I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't fix JdGordon's problem with kate ;)
17:18:15	Nico_P	n1s: my editor (kate) doesn't detect the encoding as latin1 and loads as UTF8 by default
17:19:10	*	lostlogic doesn't know what vim does, but is sure that it'll be fine
17:19:19	preglow	kate is an eccentric bastard
17:19:47	roolku	linuxstb: with or without BOM (and will this not be difficult to police)? can all the tools deal with UTF-8?
17:19:48	*	Nico_P is slowly learning to use vim, but kscope is just too good
17:20:00	lostlogic	cscope
17:20:11	lostlogic	although I don't use cscope, just ctags
17:20:14	markun	lostlogic: I have no problems with vim and encodings. It doesn't just decide to change them like kate does.
17:20:29	linuxstb	roolku: There's hardly any utf-8 in the source code, and decent editors won't change what's already there...
17:20:31	Nico_P	lostlogic: kscope is a gui to cscope with kate as editor
17:20:35	pixelma	Nico_P: do you have an idea what encoding JdGordon's first commit of screens.c was in, looked to me as if wouldn't be utf-8 (or maybe it was a bom issue)...
17:20:56	pixelma	yesterday, I mean
17:21:30	markun	linuxstb: there is UTF-8 in apps/recorder/keyboard.c
17:21:39	preglow	that habit kate has of just changing char sets without asking is really charming
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17:22:28	pixelma	yeah, markun: probably some kate user's fault? ;)
17:22:35	markun	:)
17:23:22	Nico_P	pixelma: it was latin1 read as UTF8
17:23:35	Nico_P	btw, screens.c is still UTF-8
17:23:51	linuxstb	One argument in favour of utf-8 is that that's the character encoding viewvc.cgi uses when displaying files...
17:23:53	pixelma	that's where the discussion started now
17:24:17	markun	Nico_P: looks latin1 to me
17:24:24	n1s	haha, we are committing so frequently that there is a gap between the frontpage commits and the 4-weeks page
17:24:28	jpt9_	oh yeah...
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17:24:48	jpt9_	to whoever said that they had the entire High Voltage SID Collection on their Gigabeat, and that it was all untagged...
17:24:54	Nico_P	the problem with kate is that it loads everything as UTF-8 regardless (?) of the original encoding, so when you save special characters get garbled
17:24:57	jpt9_	it's perfectly tagged on the Sansa simulator...
17:25:02	jpt9_	and considering how slow it is...
17:25:13	jpt9_	i might want to reconsider that potential decision.
17:25:17	pixelma	markun: why was Zagor's name picked up in the diff then?
17:25:23	jpt9_	how does rockbox deal with microsd cards?
17:25:34	jpt9_	do they have their own database stored on the card?
17:25:46	markun	pixelma: maybe it was UTF-8 before? Or I didn't update everything..
17:26:17	markun	pixelma: oops :)
17:26:20	Nico_P	screens.c is utf8, I'm sure of it
17:26:30	markun	Nico_P: yes, you are right. Sorry
17:26:49	n1s	we should get an svn hook that checks that Zagor's name is correctly encoded and reject commits otherwise :-)
17:26:58	Nico_P	haha
17:27:17	Nico_P	there are problems with Kévin Ferrare too
17:28:01	pixelma	jpt9_: if you use the filebrowser, the microSD card will appear as an own subfolder. If you use the database, Rockbox will make one database of all it finds on the internal memory and on the card
17:28:08	jpt9_	oh.
17:28:13	jpt9_	what if I have multiple cards?
17:28:27	jpt9_	and is there any way to temporarily disable the database on the card without having to remove it?
17:28:59	jpt9_	also, how slow is a Sansa e250 compared to the simulator running on a 2.0GHZ Core2Duo laptop with 2GB of RAM and Vista?
17:30:23	n1s	jpt9_: I think it's safe to say that the core 2 duo is faster than the pp processor in the sansa :)
17:30:27	jpt9_	oh god...
17:30:32	jpt9_	the HVSC is going to suck...
17:30:39		Quit tchan (Remote closed the connection)
17:30:41	jpt9_	is there any way to disable the database on the card permanently...
17:30:45	jpt9_	or exclude folders?
17:30:47	jpt9_	or something?!
17:30:50	n1s	jpt9_: no
17:30:53	jpt9_	oh.
17:30:57	pixelma	as far as I know (but I usually don't use the database so I'm a bit guessing here) Rockbox currently can't pick up any changes if you switch cards automatically. If you want to use the database, you would have to update it (or even reinitialise?).
17:31:03	n1s	it's strictly all or nothing
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17:31:11	preglow	ouch...
17:31:14	markun	jpt9_: if it anoys you enough, maybe you will write a patch for this feature :)
17:31:34	preglow	would making the database hotswap aware be too hard?
17:31:41	pondlife	Could you init the database without the card in?
17:31:57	Nico_P	lostlogic: so what's next? ;)
17:32:08	pondlife	Comments!!! Lots of comments!!!
17:32:17	pixelma	pondlife: I think so
17:32:51	pondlife	So many comments that even idiots named pondlife can understand buffering.c
17:33:06	*	pondlife must stop mistyping buggering.c
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17:34:05	preglow	:D
17:34:40	roolku	jpt9_ / pixelma: I have a patch that only adds files from my music directory to the DB, so it excludes audiobooks, sids, mods etc
17:35:02	jpt9_	any chance you could get that into svn?
17:35:07	jpt9_	it'd be a great feature.
17:35:16	jpt9_	well, customizable directories for the database in general.
17:35:29	roolku	it is a hack though - there was a big discussion that a flexible way was required, but nobody had an idea on how to do it
17:35:59	jpt9_	how well does an 80MHz (IIRC) MP3 player play SIDs anyway?
17:36:12	preglow	very well
17:36:17	jpt9_	spiffy.
17:36:24	preglow	not compared to oversampled resid, but it's totally decent
17:36:36	jpt9_	never been much for the oversampling stuff.
17:36:41	roolku	it comes up every so often, but people have different ideas and no aggreement is ever reached. :)
17:36:43	linuxstb	How about a ".no_index" file in a directory skips all files in that directory and subdirectories?
17:36:53	jpt9_	i like that.
17:36:56	jpt9_	that's awesome.
17:36:57	jpt9_	perfect.
17:36:59	jpt9_	do it :-)
17:37:24	*	roolku prefers the opposite way: .do_index
17:37:40	jpt9_	make it a preference :-)
17:37:42	linuxstb	roolku: So by default nothing is indexed? ;)
17:37:49	roolku	yep
17:37:52	jpt9_	wait...
17:37:56	jpt9_	detect which files are there.
17:38:03	linuxstb	roolku: That won't cause any questions....
17:38:10	pondlife	robots.txt ;)
17:38:17	jpt9_	not sure what you'd do if there were both .no_index and .do_index files...
17:38:28	roolku	linuxstb: I can see the case for support calls. :)
17:38:28	jpt9_	but if there's only one of them, just do what the user wants.
17:38:34	pondlife	Just .no_index will be fine...
17:38:36	jpt9_	yeah.
17:38:39	jpt9_	that's good.
17:38:48	jpt9_	what about multiple databases? :-D
17:38:52	jpt9_	no, you don't need to do that.
17:38:56	jpt9_	but it'd be neat.
17:39:14	jpt9_	oh yeah...
17:39:27	jpt9_	the Sansa's scheduled to arrive next Friday :-D
17:39:27	linuxstb	Apart from the fact that Windows makes it hard for uses to create dot files...
17:39:35	linuxstb	s/uses/users/
17:39:36	preglow	hard?
17:39:40	preglow	i don't find it too hard
17:39:45	roolku	using the .no_index - how would I exclude files from the root, but include files from the /music directory?
17:39:50	linuxstb	I thought it required the command-line?
17:40:00	idnar	you can't do it in explorer
17:40:03	linuxstb	roolku: Move them out of the root...
17:40:07	jpt9_	have both .no_index and _do_index
17:40:07	idnar	it complains about creating a file with an extension but no name
17:40:38	jpt9_	have it only look for .do_index files in directories inside those with .no_index.
17:41:12	linuxstb	That could work...
17:41:17	roolku	I think I will stick with my patch :)
17:41:53	linuxstb	jpt9_: You could file a feature request before we forget the idea... (or write the patch...)
17:41:58	jpt9_	good idea.
17:41:59		Quit elinenbe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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17:42:11	*	jpt9_ doesn't know how to write patches...
17:42:18	jpt9_	but I am learning C++ in CS I right now.
17:42:22	jpt9_	and I've played a bit with C.
17:42:40	linuxstb	There you go then - a good project to introduce you to Rockbox coding...
17:42:52	jpt9_	where do i get the source?
17:42:56	preglow	also to hair loss
17:43:51	linuxstb	jpt9_: Best way is with SVN - http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/UsingSVN
17:44:02	jpt9_	ah.
17:44:42	jpt9_	checking out as we type.
17:44:50	*	Nico_P has a fix that should please some people
17:45:04	jpt9_	what is it?
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17:45:11	linuxstb	Album art?
17:45:20	Nico_P	haha :)
17:45:22	elinenbe	jpeg support in the WPS?
17:45:24	Nico_P	"a fix"
17:45:36	linuxstb	Yes, fixing the fact that Rockbox doesn't support album art... ;)
17:45:37	pondlife	Keep us guessing...
17:45:50	linuxstb	A zune port?
17:45:57	jpt9_	anaglyph 3d glasses support for doom? :-)
17:46:05	D0ug	Does anyone know of a meathod to alter the screen orientation in order to display themes from a seperate device to that of the displaying?
17:46:17	pondlife	Not the non-rebuffer of already buffered data...?
17:46:29		Quit pixelma ("bbl")
17:46:33	Nico_P	pondlife: not that... not yet anyway
17:46:45	D0ug	For example Sansa e2xx's themes and orientations being replaced with that of the iPod colour.
17:46:49	Nico_P	no it's much smaller... next track info for the first track not on the buffer
17:47:09	D0ug	176x220x16 vs 220x176x16 <<ratios
17:47:26	linuxstb	D0ug: Someone wrote a dirty patch for the Gigabeat to do that (basically dual-booting between two different Rockbox versions), but I don't believe anyone has done it for the Sansa.
17:48:12	D0ug	I don't mean to boot the iPod Colour firmware, I mean if it is possible to rotate the screen orientation and load up iPod colour themes to a Sansa
17:49:07	linuxstb	D0ug: I know. The patch I referred to for the Gigabeat creates two different Gigabeat firmwares - one using the screen in normal portrait mode (240x320), and another using it in landscape mode (320x240).
17:49:14	jpt9_	where's the database code?
17:49:20	linuxstb	apps/tagcache.c
17:49:31	linuxstb	tagcache is the original name for the database
17:49:41	D0ug	Okay, would you be able to reference me the patch #?
17:49:48	pondlife	We should really rename that (and the API)...
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17:52:35	linuxstb	D0ug: http://www.rockbox.org/tracker/task/6688
17:52:48	D0ug	Thank you
17:52:58	pondlife	Hmm, is the iPod Video ticking issue still a known problem?
17:53:25	*	Nico_P is going to get a red delt
17:53:27	Nico_P	a
17:55:06	jpt9_	what order does readdir() return filenames?
17:55:29	lostlogic	Nico_P: you adding another struct mp3_data to playback.c for that, or?
17:55:36	Nico_P	lostlogic: yes :(
17:55:45	linuxstb	jpt9_: The order the of the entries in directory - which could be anything...
17:55:49	jpt9_	damn.
17:55:52	lostlogic	Nico_P: I didn't see another way either.
17:56:04	Nico_P	lostlogic: and 4 is still better than 32 ;)
17:56:19	lostlogic	hehe yeah
17:56:25	Nico_P	lostlogic: I was thinking of getting rid of nexttrack_id3 though
17:56:50	pondlife	Hmm, you have got too many there, definitely
17:57:03	jpt9_	anyway, I have to go to lunch.
17:57:06	jpt9_	see ya later.
17:57:14		Quit jpt9_ ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]")
17:57:22	linuxstb	Nico_P: What does "lasttrack" mean? I would have thought that nexttrack would already contain the next track info for the WPS?
17:57:47	Nico_P	linuxstb: it's for the last track that we attempted to load
17:57:57	lostlogic	Nico_P: yeah, that should be possible. wasn't it actually 35 before MoB? so 35->4 still quite good ;)
17:58:43	linuxstb	Nico_P: I don't understand...
17:59:02	lostlogic	linuxstb: lasttrack is the track that is _not_ buffered but may _later_ become nexttrack before it is buffered.
17:59:08	pondlife	lasttrack == nexttracktobuffer?
17:59:14	lostlogic	what pondlife said
17:59:14	Nico_P	pondlife: yes
17:59:21	pondlife	I meant, rename it :)
17:59:29	lostlogic	oh, laugh
17:59:36	linuxstb	So it's nextnexttrack?
17:59:41	Nico_P	sure nexttracktobuffer_id3
17:59:45	lostlogic	laternextrack
17:59:54	pondlife	Might be many tracks hence...
18:00
18:00:02	Nico_P	lastbufferedtrackplusone_id3
18:00:17		Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
18:00:27	linuxstb	OK, it's clear now...
18:00:48	pondlife	In what situation doesn't the new id3, plus the buffer itself provide enough info?
18:01:05	pondlife	When the codec has transitioned, but the WPS has not, I guess.
18:01:17	pondlife	We only need 3 sets of info, surely!
18:01:19	Nico_P	pondlife: I don't understand your question
18:01:32	Nico_P	but I'm pretty sure nexttrack_id3 can go
18:01:32	pondlife	I'm trying to work out why 4 structs are needed.
18:01:57	lostlogic	pondlife: they aren't nexttrack is always either on buffer or in nexttracktobuffer_id3
18:02:07	lostlogic	pondlife: 3 seem to be necessary though
18:02:26	pondlife	If it's buffered, the info is on buffer. If it's not, then either it's the nexttracktobuffer, or just cleared (i.e. the WPS has yet to move on)...
18:02:40	pondlife	Which means we need the buffer + 2 others, right?
18:03:12	pondlife	i.e. current WPS (for the last seconds) and nexttracktobuffer.
18:03:16	lostlogic	the current track needs to be _rapid_ access so is not on the buffer
18:03:21	lostlogic	so we need that third one
18:03:24	pondlife	OK
18:03:43	lostlogic	'course putting that one on buffer would be nice for runtime data
18:03:44	pondlife	This saves reparsing, right?
18:03:53	lostlogic	but the risk of it moving around is too hard to fix
18:04:11	lostlogic	pondlife: more just that there would be too many threads potentially fiddling with it if it was on buffer while playing
18:04:27	pondlife	True. The playback/WPS API relies on that ptr...
18:04:35	lostlogic	yep
18:04:35	pondlife	elapsed and all that
18:04:46	*	pondlife shudders at the memory.
18:04:52	lostlogic	</here>
18:04:54	Nico_P	lostlogic, pondlife: the reason why the current id3 must be static is that the codec needs a pointer to it
18:05:00	pondlife	Yep
18:05:10	pondlife	OK, so we need 3...good
18:05:16	Nico_P	WPS isn't a problem as it uses audio_current_track and audio_next_track
18:06:03	Nico_P	we could change the codec API to replace the ID3 pointer with a func returning an ID3 pointer, but I'm not sure it's worth it
18:06:19	pondlife	Hmm, why no build?
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18:08:43	Alcoololo	Hi
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18:11:13	Nico_P	the build server is behaving strangely
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18:12:21	Alcoololo	do you one of you guys have an ipod 5G?
18:13:22	Alcoololo	No...?
18:15:34	linuxstb	Alcoololo: What's your question?
18:15:50	Alcoololo	I have a strange behaviour with it (since I have it actually): when you plug it to an USB1.1 port (to charge or whatever) the pc hangs for 4-5 min
18:16:12	pondlife	Nico_P: Looks like it missed your commit, try another one!
18:16:18	Alcoololo	is it the normal behaviour (for rockbox or for the OF)?
18:16:44	Nico_P	pondlife: as soon as I understand a weird issue I have
18:16:44	pondlife	Alcoololo: iPod USB support is handled by the Apple firmware, not Rockbox
18:17:30	pondlife	That doesn't sound like normal behaviour... I'd ask on an iPod support channel
18:17:38	linuxstb	pondlife: That's not 100% true - Rockbox initialises the USB controller to detect if there's a PC at the other end of the connection or a charger, and that did cause issues in the past.
18:17:50	pondlife	Ah, sorry
18:17:54	Alcoololo	ok
18:18:12		Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend")
18:18:18	linuxstb	Alcoololo: Do you get the same issue if you start the Apple firmware, and then insert USB, or only if you insert USB when Rockbox is running
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18:18:25	Alcoololo	yes
18:18:40	linuxstb	OK, then do what pondlife said ;)
18:18:44	Alcoololo	I don't think it's because of rockbox
18:19:08	linuxstb	The only problems I've had is when I connect a FAT32 ipod to a Mac - Mac OS X seems to take a few minutes to mount it.
18:19:15	Alcoololo	for both i've got the same issue
18:20:07	Alcoololo	but it's a refurbished ipod, so I don't know, maybe it's because of that
18:20:39	linuxstb	You could try running chkdsk on it
18:20:49	Alcoololo	It's doesn't do that with 2.0 though
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18:21:22	Nico_P	hmm the issue isn't new to my commit
18:21:27	Nico_P	the next one I mean
18:23:06	Alcoololo	I'm running chkdsk
18:23:12	pondlife	Hmm, claims of Sansa brickage - http://forums.rockbox.org/index.php?topic=13650
18:23:23	Alcoololo	So, nobody experiences the same
18:23:25	Alcoololo	strange
18:23:46	Nico_P	lostlogic: any idea why the first automatic track transtition never happens?
18:23:55		Quit linuxstb ("Leaving")
18:24:01	Nico_P	on at least two MP3 albums of mine
18:24:14	pondlife	Nico_P: You mean it only buffers one track?
18:24:23	lostlogic	Nico_P: ... so it just sits there at the end of the first track?
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18:24:27	Nico_P	r15538 and r15539 are affected at least
18:24:36	lostlogic	Nico_P: nothing comes to mind
18:24:37	Nico_P	worse than that... it plays audio from the next track
18:24:42	pondlife	Urgh
18:24:47	pondlife	I'm on 15537 :)
18:24:59	Alcoololo	by the way, I ran a battery test bench yesterday on my 60g 5G ipod
18:24:59	Nico_P	but progressbar is full, remaining displays a negative time
18:25:09	Nico_P	and to top it, the audio is played accelerated :p
18:25:38	Nico_P	skipping goes back to the beginning of the next track and then all works fine
18:25:47	lostlogic	Nico_P: ... that's ... odd..
18:25:52	Nico_P	indeed
18:26:08	Nico_P	I have no idea when it started... at first I thought it was my ID3 changes but no
18:26:15	Alcoololo	is it normal to have a disk activity for a 34Mb album in repeat mode, whereas the RAM is 64?
18:26:27	pondlife	Nico_P: If you can repro, SVN up -r is your friend
18:26:30	lostlogic	Nico_P: unless something we did recently made it possible for a codec to read data from the next track through bufgetdata or bufread
18:26:51	Nico_P	lostlogic: that's very possible yeah
18:27:03	Nico_P	pondlife: or git bisect ;)
18:27:16	pondlife	Even better
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18:28:04	pondlife	Alcoololo: It may be the dircache scan for a while after you boot up..
18:28:18	lostlogic	Nico_P: do you get a glitch before the audio from the wrong track plays?
18:28:26	Nico_P	no
18:28:30	lostlogic	Nico_P: ie as it plays the mp3_data
18:28:32	lostlogic	hmm.....
18:28:42	Nico_P	lostlogic: I couldn't reproduce on sim
18:28:46	pondlife	Alcoololo: You can go into System > Debug > View buffering thread to see how much RAM is used, and see when the disk reads.
18:29:07	Nico_P	it should be quite easy on target though
18:29:17	Alcoololo	pondlife: dircache scan is a rockbox option?
18:29:30	Alcoololo	ok
18:29:33	Alcoololo	i'll do that
18:29:38	Nico_P	the build server is dropping my commits! :(
18:29:58	pondlife	Rejected due to utf-8 in the Zagor-syndrome?
18:30:05	lostlogic	Nico_P: it can't spell your name
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18:31:22	pondlife	Nope, that happens occasionally. A commit goes missing when the server is looking the other way.
18:31:40	pondlife	Or rather, no build occurs.. the commit is there, of course
18:31:47	lostlogic	damned anthropomorphized servers.
18:32:16	pondlife	I prefer to think of it as an ants nest.
18:32:46	pondlife	Hmm, why doesn't the buffering screen ever show alloc as being more than 3/4 of the buffer...
18:32:54	pondlife	With a very long playlist, it should be, surely.
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18:33:48	lostlogic	pondlife: mine ... does.
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18:33:57	Nico_P	pondlife: yeah, that's weird... how are the tracks? maybe the handle or track limit are reached?
18:34:05	pondlife	All normal-ish MP3s
18:34:14	pondlife	No super long or short ones
18:34:19	Nico_P	oh
18:34:22	lostlogic	pondlife: it should allocate up to bufsize ~1 track and then as it fills allocate the rest for the partial last track
18:34:24	pondlife	10 handles
18:34:41	pondlife	Hmm, real + alloc are 17MB/25MB
18:34:51	pondlife	It's about to rebuffer though
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18:35:08	lostlogic	pondlife: see what it is jsut after spin-down
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18:36:06	Nico_P	r15503 doesn't have the bug I described
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18:37:16	pondlife	Yep, rebuffering used the lot
18:37:23	pondlife	Ne'er mind
18:37:36	lostlogic	Nico_P: the next buffering related commit seems to be 15527?
18:38:17	Nico_P	you mean 28?
18:38:23	lostlogic	yeah, that.
18:38:24	Nico_P	that's the one I'm testing next
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18:39:21	Nico_P	it's really annoying not to have RoLo on the gigabeat
18:40:21	Nico_P	no problem in r15528
18:41:08	lostlogic	ok, so it happened today.
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18:42:59	Nico_P	it's happening in r15533
18:43:12	Nico_P	lostlogic: and there is actually a glitch
18:44:22	lostlogic	*reads diff
18:45:05	Nico_P	I'm checking r15532 just in case
18:47:17	lostlogic	grr, neither of those changes looks risky.
18:48:38	Nico_P	r15532 is fine
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18:50:26	lostlogic	:( so it's my lil' handle not break change :(
18:50:29	*	lostlogic pokes with stick
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18:51:55	swima	hello :)
18:52:10	Nico_P	hi
18:52:16	swima	I have some problems with replacing the battery in a Iriver H340
18:52:25	swima	anybody can help?
18:52:40	lostlogic	swima: try misticriver forums, this is a rockbox supoprt channel, not an iriver support channel.
18:53:06	swima	lostlogic: I know - I followed the guide in the misticriver forums
18:53:16	swima	lostlogic: but I wanted to talk to a human being ;-)
18:53:22	lostlogic	swima: if you followed a guide there... ask them...
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18:53:37	lostlogic	I think there is a misticriver irc channel.
18:53:41	Nico_P	swima: you can slo try #rockbox-community
18:53:42	swima	ahhh
18:53:58	lostlogic	wait, I used tob e an op in the misticriver channel.. back when I had an iRiver
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18:54:16	swima	I did not find an iriver channel but the misticriver is a good tip
18:54:44	swima	hmm - on which network is this channel?
18:55:01	lostlogic	swima: back then it was on zuh.net IIRC
18:58:04	swima	hmm - can't find the channel
18:58:22	lostlogic	Nico_P: I don't see the problem with that change :( you gots any idear?
18:58:34	Nico_P	lostlogic: I was going to ask the same :/
18:59:11	Nico_P	swima: try #rockbox-community
18:59:14	Nico_P	same server
18:59:55	*	lostlogic mutters something about gremlins
19:00
19:00:10	Nico_P	lostlogic: maybe logging size before and after the call to prep_bufdata would be of help
19:00:20	Nico_P	lostlogic: have you tried to repro?
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19:00:35	lostlogic	Nico_P: steps to repro on target? Just lpay a mp3?
19:00:39	lostlogic	an mp3 album that is
19:01:02	lostlogic	shoot, coffee with team lead, back shortly
19:01:08	Nico_P	yeah, play an MP3 album, seek to near the end of the first track and let the transition happen
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19:21:39	Nico_P	lostlogic: I'm pretty sure I found the bug
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19:27:30	D0ug	Netsplit?
19:28:11	Nico_P	lostlogic: fixed :D pretty stupid one really
19:30:18	linuxstb	Any e200 owners around (any variety - vanilla or R) able to test some changes to e200rpatcher? I've built a Windows binary here - http://www.davechapman.f2s.com/rockbox/e200rpatcher-win32.zip
19:30:39	linuxstb	It should detect which bootloader is installed - e200, e200r (unpatched) and e200r (patched).
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19:36:10	preglow	playback does seem a ton less responsive after mob
19:36:16	preglow	like when changing files while buffering, etc
19:36:18	preglow	is that going to improve?
19:36:46	Ctcp	Version from freenode-connect!freenode@freenode/bot/connect
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19:37:44	Nico_P	preglow: hopefully, but me only having a gigabeat doesn't help
19:37:58	Nico_P	preglow: did this start with MoB, or with subsequent changes?
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19:38:15	preglow	with mob itself
19:38:28	Nico_P	ok
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19:39:19	Nico_P	preglow: maybe there's a change you could test for me... try changing the audio thread's priority
19:40:04	lostlogic	Nico_P: thanks, sorry I had to run.
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19:40:25	Nico_P	preglow: maybe to PRIORITY_BUFFERING
19:40:59	lostlogic	Nico_P: ahhhh yeah.
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19:47:26	lostlogic	Nico_P: people have reported slowness?
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19:55:14	Ctcp	Version from freenode-connect!freenode@freenode/bot/connect
19:56:01	Mcgill69	Nico_P: I have actually had this problem for a few days and I flashed new firmware on everyday with the same outcome.
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19:56:39	lostlogic	Mcgill69: I think we're still trying to figure out what 051124-2325 is ;)
19:56:45	lostlogic	at least I am
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19:57:01	Nico_P	Mcgill69: yeah the 24 is weird
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19:57:07	Nico_P	err lostlogic
19:57:34	lostlogic	Mcgill69: for instance, my info says "r15518M-071107"
19:57:35	Mcgill69	It is the latest one you can download on the rockbox.org.
19:57:42	Nico_P	Mcgill69: what I'm asking for is an SVN revision number. current is 15541
19:57:55	Nico_P	Mcgill69: that doesn't tell us anything
19:58:10	Nico_P	it could have changed several times since you downloaded it
19:58:42	Mcgill69	Nico_P: where do I find it in my player?
20:00
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20:09:26	alienbiker99	i notice a little slowdown depending on when i select new songs. also it kind of hangs on the list of songs sometimes when i select a song
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20:12:43	alienbiker99	although i do not know if its just from the database, or the hard drive spin up.
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20:15:06	Mcgill69	Is it usual that I have two firmwares when I browse my firmwares? I have "rockbox" and "rombox"?
20:15:18	alienbiker99	yes
20:15:30	Mcgill69	Because when I choose rockbox my player actually works
20:15:51	Mcgill69	If I just use the "start up rockbox" I cant play songs.
20:15:55	Nimdae	i don't seem to see it in flyspray with a few searches i've done, but i've encountered a new bug in a recent update that causes one of my ogg vorbis songs to play partially then skip to next song...currently only one song, which plays fine outside of rockbox (playing the same file in winamp now)
20:15:57		Quit japc (Connection timed out)
20:16:26	Nimdae	trying to make a new build and test it now
20:16:29	Jakeworld	Nico_P: just wanted to quickly confirm that the skipping bug seems to be non-issue since the latest bugfix for musepack; I've used it for about an hour today, and have had no problems
20:16:37	lostlogic	Nimdae: are you on the latest revision? it will probably work, I think Nico fixed a bug of that sort today.
20:17:07	Mcgill69	and the version didn't change in my start up rockbox. In me other one it is r15542-071108
20:17:09	Nimdae	like i said, trying to make a new build and test now
20:17:14	Nico_P	Jakeworld: cool :)
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20:36:44	Nico_P	Nimdae: could I have it too?
20:36:56	lostlogic	Nico_P: I can post it up for ya in 1s
20:37:01	Nico_P	ok
20:37:50	Nimdae	this morning (before the update i just did), i could play just over 4 mins of the song, now 1:45
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20:56:42	Nimdae	lostlogic: do you get the same result?
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21:00
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21:04:16	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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21:22:50	lostlogic	Nimdae: sorry, am working so am slow. testing now.
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21:22:51	lostlogic	Nimdae: when you updated again just n ow, I assume you updated to a current build and not a daily build?
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21:28:48	lostlogic	Nico_P: Nimdae's file works fine for me too.
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21:40:08	Nimdae	lostlogic: i updated via svn and compiled
21:40:31	lostlogic	Nimdae: ah, gotcha, blah.
21:40:32	preglow	gutted out almost all iram tables out of speex, it still runs very well on coldfire
21:40:34	Ctcp	Version from freenode-connect!freenode@freenode/bot/connect
21:41:04		Quit linuxstb (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
21:41:24	Nimdae	let me try something
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21:43:24	Nimdae	ok, looks like it's my ipod
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21:58:41	Nimdae	anyway, thanks for the help Nico_P and lostlogic
21:58:41	Nico_P	you're welcome ;)
22:00
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22:20:52	amiconn	roolku: What does rating have to do with runtime data?
22:20:55	*	amiconn wonders
22:21:27	karashata	the more plays, the higer the rating, perhaps?
22:21:47	hcs	that's how it used to work
22:21:58	hcs	don't know about now...
22:22:48		Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:22:49	amiconn	I am referring to his last commit
22:23:13	amiconn	"set rating" sounds like something user initiated
22:25:44	karashata	sweet! recent commits fixed my FLAC issues...
22:27:08		Nick parafin is now known as parafin\|away (i=parafin@paraf.in)
22:28:01	preglow	karashata: so you've been using really, really recently encoded flacs, then
22:28:14		Quit Domonoky_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:28:36	karashata	I ended up reencoding some less recently encoded FLACs, actually
22:29:09	karashata	there was a batch I got from somewhere that weren't working, reencoding them fixed the issues I had with them
22:29:33	karashata	recent commits fixed the issues I had with the FLAC files I'd encoded myself somewhat recently, yes
22:30:02	karashata	manually skipping doesn't end up jumping over tracks like it used to
22:30:31	roolku	amiconn: the term "run-time data" has always covered playcount and rating
22:30:38	pixelma	amiconn: you can set rating manually, but for example this also didn't work on hwcodec for some reason as long as gather runtime data didn't. Don't understand how they relate though, too
22:30:58	cooz	(asking 3rd time) does anyone care about fm tuner in rockbox as it's unfortunately useless and on sansa c200 only OF one can be used
22:31:16	Bagder	cooz: I bet a lot of people care
22:31:19	linuxstb	karashata: Were they 16-bit or 24-bit files?
22:31:23	karashata	16 bit files
22:31:41	karashata	my chipset doesn't support playback of 24-bit files
22:31:44	linuxstb	That's odd, IIUC those patches only affected 24-bit files...
22:31:49	cooz	Bagder: i would be more happy to hear that some developer care about it
22:32:06	Bagder	cooz: again, I know for a fact many developers care about it
22:32:16	linuxstb	karashata: Are you sure it was the flac commits, and not the other playback-related commits that have happened recently?
22:32:21	roolku	amiconn: it is metadata that is not part of the file, but gathered (either manually or automatically) during the runtime
22:32:33	karashata	I said recent commits, I meant in a general sense
22:32:33	cooz	Bagder: then it's good news, thanks
22:32:54	linuxstb	karashata: Yes, I just realised that.... I blame preglow for misleading me ;)
22:32:58	karashata	it's likely some of the buffering and playback commits that fixed the issues
22:33:48	Nico_P	lostlogic: I have roughly 120 times the same metadata on the buffer :p
22:33:56	Nico_P	126 times even
22:34:25	*	karashata is officially happy again
22:35:10	Nico_P	karashata: ah yes, it's the same bug as MPC was having
22:35:18	karashata	ohh?
22:35:29	karashata	well, in any case, glad you guys figured it out
22:35:56	Nico_P	heh, that's what we're here for ;)
22:36:02	karashata	though I think reencoding the files I did didn't hurt anything
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22:36:41	karashata	I managed to shave off a few hundred kilobytes on a handful of the files, so I get a bit more space back
22:36:44	cooz	do i have to add to tracker bug about some small misspell from c200 - while OF's loading it says "Model id: e200" or someone can fix it in less official way?
22:36:52		Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]")
22:37:10	preglow	Bagder: i assume we've turned in our tax info now?
22:37:20	Bagder	yeps
22:37:25	preglow	grand
22:37:31	linuxstb	Anone know if it's possible to do something like "ldr r0,#0x2fff001f" with gcc inline asm?
22:37:35	karashata	a grand total of about hundred megabytes saved, wow...
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22:37:53	preglow	linuxstb: you mean =0x2fff001f, i assume?
22:38:03	*	bertrik gives up for tonight on a crackling sound problem
22:38:27	amiconn	cooz: Afaik the tuner works on c200, but there seems to be an init problem
22:38:34	*	linuxstb goes to the corner
22:38:45	preglow	linuxstb: that was it? :>
22:38:59	linuxstb	yes ;)
22:39:01	amiconn	If you go into the OF once and set the region, it should hopefully work in rockbox afterwards
22:39:15	cooz	amiconn: it works quite randomly
22:39:53	linuxstb	preglow: Thanks...
22:40:03	preglow	linuxstb: why, you're welcome
22:40:10	cooz	amiconn: eg when i'm in scan mode and change freq 0.05 and go back completely different sound is there
22:40:42	pixelma	for me it helps if I either reboot and if this doesn't help I need to start the radio once in the OF but that doesn't hold for long. So I can see the point of "not usable"
22:41:41	cooz	in OF it works just fine, i'd love to use it from rockbox though
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22:43:30	pixelma	I get one of three scenarios: radio works when started then everything (including scan mode etc. works correctly), radio works but frequecies are all wrong from where I started it (then often a reboot works), or finally the radio isn't available at all (then I need the OF)
22:45:17	cooz	i think i got most of the times scenario 2.
22:47:04	cooz	i'm not sure is it just matter of mutting sound in OF tuner, but in rockbox while changing frequencies (in present mode) you can hear 'searching sound'
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22:50:39	pixelma	there is a present mode? ;)
22:51:29	rasher	pixelma: does msd support on c200 include msdhc?
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22:51:49	pixelma	my impression was that the longer Rockbox is running, i.e. if I listen to files before, the more likely is scenario 2. Using the radio right after start often works. But haven't been able to reproduce on demand
22:53:05	cooz	pixelma: haha, s/present/preset
22:53:40	pixelma	rasher: not sure, I started with a small microSD. My understanding was that it shares code with the e200 there, so it should.
22:54:27	cooz	yeah, reproducing anything in tuner would be great achievement
22:56:21	cooz	there's also one weird effect that at start there's only garbage on some preset freq, but after few senconds sound appears
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23:00:59	Spyro_boy	okay
23:01:07		Quit merbanan (Remote closed the connection)
23:01:09	Spyro_boy	this is going to sound REALLY hilariously ridiculous
23:01:16	*	Bagder buckles up
23:01:28	Spyro_boy	but how theoretically possible is it to hack-up and write drivers for a keyboard for my sansa?
23:01:31	Spyro_boy	rofl
23:01:43	Bagder	you mean USB HID?
23:01:59	Spyro_boy	yeah
23:02:21	Bagder	I don't think it can be host which I think is required. But I'm no usb wizard
23:02:24	bertrik	USB device is not even ready yet, let alone USB host
23:02:37	Spyro_boy	bertrik, oh yeah.. true.
23:02:39	Spyro_boy	nevermind then.
23:02:49	Spyro_boy	bertrik, do you know if it's host compat. as Badger said?
23:02:51	linuxstb	I'm almost certain PP has usb host.
23:02:57	Bagder	ah ok
23:02:59	Spyro_boy	PP?
23:03:27	Bagder	Spyro_boy: unless you feel like working on it, I think you can safely assume it'll just about never happen...
23:03:37	linuxstb	PortalPlayer - the CPU inside the Sansas, ipods and other devices.
23:03:46	Spyro_boy	linuxstb, ah.
23:04:02	Spyro_boy	Bagder, you know. with all my spare time, I guess I could try something new :)
23:04:20	***	Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
23:04:30	Bagder	well, we all have the same amount of time
23:04:33	linuxstb	And JD is working on mouse support...
23:04:40	Bagder	24 hours a day, roughly
23:05:01	*	linuxstb recalls having 25 hours in a day recently, but it didn't help
23:05:11	bertrik	It should be possible to do a virtual com port, so you can type stuff from the pc to the sansa
23:06:12	Spyro_boy	linuxstb, saw what?
23:06:16	Spyro_boy	say*
23:06:18	Spyro_boy	That's sick.
23:07:06	Spyro_boy	I was actually coding something in Python, and I said to myself: "Man, I could kill so much time in class if I had a python interpreter on my sansa... wait, I need a keyboard for my sansa first."
23:07:21	Spyro_boy	And that's how I got that ridiculous idea.
23:07:41	Spyro_boy	Actually, I guess it's not that ridiculous if something similar is on its way..
23:08:19	lostlogic	Nico_P: how'd you get all those copies of metadata on the buffer?
23:08:23	linuxstb	Adding support for a keyboard would probably be far easier than porting python...
23:08:40	Spyro_boy	linuxstb, rofl. I said it was ridiculous.
23:09:04	bertrik	maybe some of the pins on the docking connector go to a UART?
23:09:09	Nico_P	lostlogic: only one audio handle with a usecount var in the handles... bufopen searches for an open handle with the path given to it and if it finds one it returns its id
23:09:12	*	petur wonders if Bagder saw the latest gsoc mail regarding ord payments
23:09:22	Bagder	petur: we already supplied the form
23:09:26	hcs	Spyro_boy: I'm trying to create a programming language suited for devices with few buttons, but still stalled in planning.
23:09:32	petur	oh good
23:09:33	Nico_P	problem is I don't know how to duplicate multiple identical metadata handles
23:09:45	Nico_P	s/duplicate/detect :/
23:09:49	Spyro_boy	hcs, sounds interesting.
23:10:18	lostlogic	Nico_P: oohhh, gotcha −− well don't we actually need all of the metadata handles for unbuffering purposes?
23:10:21	lostlogic	hmm.
23:10:33	Nico_P	it feels a bit awkward
23:10:56		Quit karashata ("Leaving.")
23:11:09	Nico_P	if I limit it to nonaudio types, it's ready for album art though (only having one copy of each bmp on the buffer)
23:11:42	Nico_P	but it would be nice to be able to use it for repeated playlist that fit in the buffer
23:11:50	Spyro_boy	The only reason why I find this idea feasible because we've been doing really basic COM HI in my computer engineering class. I also find it extremely fun.
23:12:04	Spyro_boy	But I forgot that USB barely works on the sansa.
23:12:26	Spyro_boy	Actually, I've also been curious. Do I have to boot into the original firmware to charge my sansa?
23:12:30	lostlogic	Nico_P: is 126 the max that fit? Also, have you seen any trouble with stack space running my recursive shrink buffer with these many handles on there?
23:12:34	bertrik	I think I saw a list of sansa e200 docking connector pins somewhere, but can't find it anymore
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23:12:54	Nico_P	lostlogic: no, but it was on sim...
23:13:07	Nico_P	I had 127 handles: one audio, 126 metadata
23:13:18	lostlogic	Nico_P: what was on sim, sorry.
23:13:55	Nico_P	I did my tests on sim only so there could be stack space problems but I wouldn't see them
23:14:14	Spyro_boy	Do I have to boot into the OF of my Sansa to charge my Sansa?
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23:14:26	lostlogic	Nico_P: oh gotcha.
23:14:43	lostlogic	Nico_P: I _think_ I calculated the stack space limitation properly but ya never know
23:15:00	lostlogic	Nico_P: also, any thoughts on 8092 or the runtmie data?
23:15:30	bertrik	Spyro_boy: basically yes
23:15:39	Spyro_boy	Ah.
23:15:40	Spyro_boy	Okay.
23:15:42	Nico_P	for runtime data, not much more than "we need to write the static struct back to the buffer before calling the callbacks"
23:15:43	Spyro_boy	I wasn't sure.
23:15:52	bertrik	an easy way to boot into the original firmware is to turn it off, then connect the charger cable
23:15:52	Spyro_boy	I once left it in rockbox and it didn't charge at all.
23:15:58	Nico_P	for FS #8092, nothing, haven't thought about it
23:16:43	bertrik	Spyro_boy: charge current and charge voltage are at minimum values in rockbox
23:17:04	Spyro_boy	Ah.
23:17:04	Spyro_boy	AI seee.
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23:18:59	lostlogic	Nico_P: fortunately 8092 is somewhat mitigated by my application of REBUFFER_GUESS to resuming files
23:19:18	lostlogic	Nico_P: I take it you don't use runtime data either?
23:19:24	Nico_P	no
23:19:45	lostlogic	ahh, the problem of open source, getting people to code features they don't use.
23:19:46	Nico_P	have you found a case where 8092 actually causes failure
23:19:47	Nico_P	?
23:20:10	lostlogic	Nico_P: that's easy, resume a track, seek backwards before the resume point, let it play out.
23:21:43	lostlogic	revise: resume a track, let buffer fill complete, seek backwards before resume, let it play out (it will not finish)
23:22:04		Quit desowin ("use linux")
23:23:46	Nico_P	yeah I just saw it
23:24:09	Nico_P	IIRC it would use to work OK when the buffer was shrunk progressively
23:24:50	lostlogic	Nico_P: I don't believe so −− the method could never work.
23:25:09		Part Domonoky
23:25:14	lostlogic	and the breakage has nothing to do with shrinkage
23:25:21	lostlogic	a shrink doesn't need to trigger for it to break
23:26:02		Quit Frazz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:26:04	Nico_P	http://svn.rockbox.org/viewvc.cgi/trunk/apps/buffering.c?r1=15376&r2=15377
23:26:33	lostlogic	?
23:27:08	Nico_P	that how it used to be
23:27:27	lostlogic	yes, but that bears no relevance to the problem with rebuffer handle afaics
23:27:47	Nico_P	I think it was a kind of workaround
23:28:06	Nico_P	not sure though
23:28:23	Nico_P	I'm talking about the parts to the end of the diff
23:28:49	lostlogic	I'm not following how a difference in shrinking behavior (which affects the beginning of a track) could impact something that causes missing data at the end of a track.
23:29:38	Nico_P	I think in my case it would've solved the problem... I only had one track on buffer
23:29:52	lostlogic	ah, yes, that may be.
23:30:03	lostlogic	but as soon as you have multiple tracks it = broke
23:30:08	Nico_P	yes
23:30:11	jhMikeS	man, that yield codec thing needs to bite it
23:30:22	lostlogic	jhMikeS: I tried...
23:30:34	Nico_P	hehe I always bring it back
23:30:37	lostlogic	there're always complaints about music getting skippy during buffering if we don't have it
23:30:41	jhMikeS	it makes no sense to me
23:31:09	jhMikeS	not even in light of the fact it fixes anything
23:31:37	lostlogic	jhMikeS: can you esplain the not sense? might help us come up with a better soln
23:31:47		Quit Xytovl ("Leaving")
23:32:50	jhMikeS	lostlogic: a could things...1) ata drivers yield profusely. 2) video playback needs no such thing on any target and can run with really low PCM buffer latencies
23:32:58	jhMikeS	s/could/couple of/
23:33:30		Quit donutman25 ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.9/2007102514]")
23:33:40	lostlogic	jhMikeS: ok, how does video playback balance the needs of disk reads and decoding?
23:34:00	lostlogic	jhMikeS: is the disk constantly spinning for video?
23:34:09	jhMikeS	lostlogic: nope, it isn't
23:35:00	jhMikeS	even when coldfire was really slow, it never had buffer underruns
23:35:27	lostlogic	jhMikeS: ok, so when the buffer is filling, the thread doing that fill doesn't even explicitly yield to the decoding thread? it just lets the ata driver yield as much as it does?
23:35:47	jhMikeS	only one explicit yield every 32k
23:36:50	Soap	I was planning on buying "The C Programming Language" tonight. Any suggestions for a second book - one which treats me like the dummy I am?
23:36:53	lostlogic	Nico_P: do you remember what target the person who complained about skipping during buffering was running? I had no trouble even when running with peakmeter on the notoriously slow IPV
23:37:09	Nico_P	c200
23:37:12	jhMikeS	there were no buffer underruns even with video running unlimited...so running two codecs, higher bitrates, and no explicit load balancing...of course I'm suspicious if the need to do it.
23:37:19	lostlogic	Nico_P: is that flash or hdd?
23:37:25	Nico_P	flash
23:37:44	lostlogic	does the sansa flash driver not yield internally?
23:38:03	lostlogic	that could esplain their problem.
23:38:04	jhMikeS	lostlogic: it yields on a timer
23:38:13	jhMikeS	every 2ms or so
23:38:14	n1s	Soap: books are boring, try to poke real code instead ;)
23:38:23	lostlogic	hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
23:38:25	*	preglow wants preemptiveness :>
23:38:32	*	Nico_P too
23:38:33	*	lostlogic dreads preemptiveness
23:38:40	lostlogic	and hates you all for wanting it
23:38:45	*	jhMikeS raises his hand preemptively
23:39:06	preglow	pft, you guys are scattering mutexes all over the place, the code is practically ready for it right now :P
23:39:07	*	Nico_P learned to sync threads this year
23:39:25	jhMikeS	I could manage about 100ms latency in mpegplayer for audio
23:39:41	lostlogic	buffering and playback are both highly broken in a preemptive world.
23:40:32	Nico_P	lostlogic: that much, you think? why?
23:40:45	jhMikeS	indeed. the patch I gave Nico_P was a start on securing it....if it's broken in a preepmtive world, it will fall apart randomly now
23:40:58	lostlogic	Nico_P: every call to find_handle() from a non buffering thread is a broken place.
23:41:17	lostlogic	as mike says, his patch that keeps the handle locked on return from find_handle is a step in the right direction
23:41:45	Nico_P	yeah I really should review that patch
23:42:52	lostlogic	but there's more to it than that −− a lot of code just makes ordering assumptions that would be invalid
23:42:56	lostlogic	"the codec starts after"
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23:44:04		Quit OlivierBorowski (Remote closed the connection)
23:44:26	lostlogic	jhMikeS: btw, it sounds like mpegplayer should replace audio playback if it's so good at handling buffering and decoding safely. are there things that we can code share between the two?
23:45:26	linuxstb	Lack of playlists, crossfade, seeking, ....
23:45:54	n1s	..., codecs, voice, ...
23:46:05	linuxstb	WPS...
23:46:07		Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:46:22	jhMikeS	lostlogic: what I'm working on is a bit different in operation from playback since it's pretty much state machine based everywhere and buffing requests are non-blocking and anychronous.
23:46:47	lostlogic	hmm, I guess I'm just confused, if he's been able to make it solve some of the problems that are really hard in playback elegantly, why isn't that technology shared somehow.
23:48:30	jhMikeS	I could provide the code I'm working on now...be mindful it's _not_ finished and some audio frame dropping stuff isn't right and much just plain isn't in place but it will play.
23:49:05		Quit animeloe ("Leaving")
23:50:04	lostlogic	jhMikeS: has it been tested on multiple targets?
23:50:26	linuxstb	jhMikeS: So you've reduced the size of the PCM buffer in mpegplayer?
23:50:32	jhMikeS	lostlogic: every one I've got
23:50:41	jhMikeS	linuxstb: I kept it at 1second
23:51:33	linuxstb	I assume that should make seeking/resume simpler?
23:51:51	linuxstb	Or at least resume...
23:52:32	jhMikeS	it wouldn't matter...technically it could seek and resume now, but I'm considering how to do it fast while displaying frames and allowing frame advance and display
23:53:20	jhMikeS	the seeking code in SVN can't handle fine resolution
23:53:36	jhMikeS	I just haven't gotten to doing anything about it yet
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23:56:07		Quit freqmod_nx (Client Quit)
23:56:18	jhMikeS	ok, my strangeness so far :p : http://jhmikes.cleansoap.org/mpegplayer-rework.diff
23:56:50	jhMikeS	I hope I didn't forget any svn add for anything
23:58:02	preglow	sweet lord
23:58:15	lostlogic	he has his own complete pcmbuffer...
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23:58:59		Join animeloe [0] (n=animeloe@unaffiliated/animeloe)

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