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#rockbox log for 2007-12-13

00:02:46 Quit MethoS- ("Konversation terminated!")
00:03:56 Quit EspeonEefi ("さよなら")
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00:24:55pixelmaalright, I'd need some native English speaker help for our manual. Currently some things to pay attention to before attempting the install ended up in the "manual installation" paragraph and I'd like to move them up above the "automatic installation" part and maybe give it an own headline.
00:24:55*preglow has gingerbread dough :>
00:24:55preglowyay indeed
00:25:05preglowi wonder how much of it will make it to the refridgerator
00:25:06pixelmathe only headline I could think of was "Precautions" but we already have "Prerequisites"... someone have a better idea?
00:27:17preglowprecautions sounds more like something you need to read than prerequisites, though
00:28:20pixelmaour "prerequisites" talk about what a zip utility is though
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00:29:43scorche|wi would think that would go under a sort of "tools for the job" thing
00:29:44 Part norbusan
00:29:48pixelmathe things that I find currently missing is things like macpods, MSC/UMS mode, running the installation tool with administrative rights and so on
00:30:21pixelmathey are only "notes" and "warnings" in the manual installation part
00:30:26 Quit petur ("gonne")
00:33:11pixelma"Notices" sound quite ok, I think - will use that for now. I mean it's not like it couldn't be improved later, at least the important information is at a better spot.
00:34:26scorche|wmaybe separate it out into "prerequisite information/knowledge" and "prequisite tools"?
00:35:06scorche|w"things you should know" and "things you should have" ?
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00:39:48pixelmahmm... just checked back "Prerequisites" is chapter 2.2 in the manual, "Installating Rockbox" is 2.3 but starts with 2.3.1 "Automated Installation" immediately. Maybe I could just put it between the two headlines?
00:40:39preglowwasn't there some talk of a restructuring of the manual?
00:43:08pixelmayes, I think it was started in a ml and got an on wiki (ManualStructureTalk) but I admit that I didn't follow it much. No change since devcon , too.
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00:45:44 Quit ender` (" Never say "Oooops" ... always say "Ahhh, interesting..."")
00:48:40preglowthe layout as proposed there looks pretty good
00:49:42preglowbut the manual really isn't bad as it is, either
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00:59:09pixelmait's a bit outdated and missing some new features. In some areas more than in others...
01:00:00 Join slavik [0] (i=44c19d84@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
01:00:58preglowthe cutoff frequency for peaking filters is called "cutoff freq" in the grapic screen, and "center freq" in the advanced screen
01:01:04preglowi wish we could get rid of those menus...
01:01:23safetydanadding talk support is next on my list :)
01:02:16mrocI have a quick question about the "itdb2tc" tool. "This tool needs updating after Tag Cache was renamed Database" is written near the top of the page. Is this tool still functional with a current build for iPod Video or is there an updated/renamed version that I'm not finding? (Or is there not currently a functional tool to do the iTunesDB => Rockbox database conversion?)
01:02:18pixelmaI wished that the graphical eq screen was fully visible on my c200 ;) (not that I happen to look at it often though...)
01:02:37safetydanpixelma: there's a patch in the tracker that gets it most of the way there
01:02:46preglowsafetydan: for the current screen or a new one? :>
01:03:27safetydanpreglow: current. A new design will take more thinking than I've got to give right now. Though if you're good... :)
01:03:50Bagdermroc: I don't think anyone really knows
01:04:01preglowsafetydan: well, i can't think of anything better than i've mentioned in the past
01:04:28mrocBagder: haha, ok then. thanks.
01:05:44 Quit Rob222241 (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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01:06:14krazykitmroc, why would you use a tool when Rockbox will generate the database for you, no problem?
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01:07:46slavikhey, question
01:07:56mrockrazykit: maybe i'm confused understanding from reading the manual/faq was that Rockbox couldn't make use of the existing files without converting the iTunes db to Rockbox db
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01:08:17krazykitmroc, you just need to initialize the DB and everything will be taken care of for you
01:08:31slavikabout the itunesdb tool, does it make it so that playlists show up with the correct names? and what about in the file view, will the song titles show?
01:09:13ajaycan anyone tell me if ipodpatcher and bootloader for ipod 1G are still in SVN? when I try to install, I get a "No Ipods found" error.
01:09:43mrockrazykit: ok, i'll do that then. i must have misunderstood. thanks for you help.
01:10:53preglowi almost wish we didn't split lines in the manual
01:11:04preglowit's so bloody boring to reformat blocks of text when you introduce changes
01:11:20krazykitslavik, no and no.
01:11:34krazykitit sounds like the tool doesn't even work anymore.
01:11:48slavikthen there really isnt a point for the tool is there?
01:11:58 Part mroc ("Leaving.")
01:12:09slavikif you can scan through the ipod folder anyway
01:12:50krazykitslavik, it might be useful if someone ever had the mind to update it and make it read out playlists and such.
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01:13:06slavikhah, yea
01:13:35slaviksomeone should add some options that are in the database view and not in the file view
01:13:57slaviki ean
01:13:57preglowpixelma: how do we introduce abbreviations, just put them in () behind the word the abbreviate at the first use?
01:13:58slaviki mean
01:14:03slavikotherway around
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01:15:37preglowsafetydan: for eq talk support, you'll ahve to add support for saying numbers with fractions in them
01:18:27pixelmapreglow: sorry, I don't know. Not sure there even was a concensus...
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01:21:31preglowpixelma: well, i'll just do that now, then
01:21:38preglowwe suddenly just use EQ with no ado
01:21:51preglowi'm shortening the eq section a bit
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01:24:37preglowis it rockbox' or rockbox's ?
01:25:41krazykitthe latter
01:26:37preglowthat sucks, i've always used the former :/
01:27:06preglowmake: /home/thomj/proj/rockbox/manual/platform/ Command not found
01:27:25krazykitpretty sure you only do a single apostrophe after an s.
01:28:20pixelmapreglow: you can ignore that
01:28:33preglowpixelma: yeah, but what is it?
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01:29:20preglowhmm, i don't like that huge eq table
01:29:25preglowit leaves a big hole in the previous page
01:29:30preglowsince it obviously can't be broken
01:29:37pixelmait's a bug introduced with the rockbox-info.txt - and not excluding it correctly from manual configured builds, or so
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01:30:25preglowi wonder if 'description' environment can't be used instead
01:31:48safetydanpreglow: hrm, that's a point. Has anyone done thinking on how best to do that? For English it might be easy "11 point 5 decibels" but other languages?
01:32:19preglowsafetydan: we have other problems like that for other languages, just be english-centric for now
01:32:31preglowyou're not breaking anything that's not already broken
01:32:58pixelmausually it worked when using "make manual" but last week I tried and for some reason "make manual" bailed out and claimed it was some latex syntax error - the simple "make" when configured for manual did not have a problem with
01:33:15preglowi think the description environment works ok for the eq table
01:33:23preglowanyone opposed to me changing it? i don't like to waste space
01:33:34preglowi could post a patch
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01:36:10 Quit amiconn (" reboot")
01:37:38preglowman, ubuntu really dislikes that ":" in the manual filename
01:37:56safetydanUbuntu or Gnome?
01:38:08preglowbash, really
01:38:22preglowhow about that eq section?
01:39:40safetydanShould really rename Band 0 to Band 1 for users. Most normal people don't count from zero.
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01:39:58*pixelma should install a newer Adobe Reader...
01:40:04safetydanhrm, and Hi Shelf should be High Shelf
01:40:08preglowsafetydan: yes, i agree fully
01:40:10preglowsafetydan: fixed locally
01:40:14preglowthe hi shelf, that is
01:40:29preglowbut this is ok in comparison with the old table?
01:40:39preglowthis can be broken across pages and doesn't waste space
01:42:30safetydanpreglow: yeah I think that's much better
01:42:39*preglow likes manual work
01:45:47*safetydan wishes more devs did some manual work
01:45:56safetydanI'm guilty of skipping it myself though
01:46:24preglowi usually document my stuff, but i don't do too many new features
01:46:25*amiconn wonders which lossy audio format yields the smallest possible files for transparent quality (i.e. comparable to lame 3.97 −−preset standard)
01:46:41preglowaac or vorbis, i'm quite sure
01:46:43 Quit mirak ("Ex-Chat")
01:47:03preglowat least that's pretty much what the hydrogenaudio blind tests end up with
01:47:26preglowbut not by much, lame is a very mature encoder
01:47:32amiconnReally? I only found some oldish tests, and there it was musepack
01:47:45preglowvorbis and aac only beat mp3 well at lower bitrates
01:48:01preglowamiconn: i don't think musepack performs so well compared to them anymore, but i might be wrong
01:48:01amiconnFor lower bitrates, the differences between formats seem to become more apparent than in the transparent quality range
01:48:21preglowamiconn: i plan to do my own tests when i'm finished ripping my cd collection to lossless formats
01:48:51preglowmusepack sv8 is on its way, and that should make even smaller files, though not by much
01:49:06preglowpsymodel is pretty much unchanged
01:49:23amiconnThere are some hints which suggest that lame −−preset standard, vorbis -q 6 and musepack -standard should be roughly equal in quality
01:49:33preglowamiconn: but yeah, like you say, in the transparent range, things are very equal
01:50:21amiconnThe vorbis website doesn't seem to state a version number at all
01:50:47amiconnSo I cannot know whether the version used in the test is way outdated or not
01:50:56***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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01:52:41preglowamiconn: for vorbis, i'm pretty sure the aotuv encoder is the way to go
01:52:53amiconnThe what?
01:52:57preglowthe what i said :)
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01:53:30preglowall new vorbis development and tuning is done by a japanese guy right now
01:53:35preglowhis stuff usually gets merged after a while
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01:54:01mokkurkalveI'm using Vorbis now but I'm wondering going back to Musepack for longer battery life
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01:54:26krazykitmokkurkalve, is the difference noticable in battery life?
01:54:29preglowyeah, the mpc decoder is really fast
01:54:54mokkurkalveboost 0% to Vorbis 10-18%
01:55:39Shaidthis is why I like and use FLAC
01:55:47Shaidthough having the 80g ipod helps there
01:56:16krazykitShaid, 'cept the disk spins up more often.
01:56:22mokkurkalveLossless i big foe DAP and transparency is good enough for me
01:56:43Shaidthere's usually a downside to everything, krazykit.
01:56:59mokkurkalvepreglow: Long time since Monty merged in any aoutv stuff....
01:57:15amiconnFLAC is nice if you have the diskspace
01:57:24*amiconn uses flac on his H180
01:57:56preglowmokkurkalve: i know, but he has, and he will, unless he's daft or something
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01:58:05preglowaoyumi does nice work
01:58:10chris06hello there
01:58:25chris06have a quick tech question if you guys dont mind.
01:58:27lostlogicand I got yelled at when I first added a flag to incorporate his patches into the gentoo vorbis ebuild.
01:58:28preglowgo ahead
01:58:35lostlogic(re aotuv)
01:58:38preglowlostlogic: yelled at for adding a flag?
01:58:40preglowsounds bitchy
01:58:44mokkurkalveamiconn: You got the MK8007GAH?
01:59:06krazykithow much did that run you, if you don't mind my asking?
01:59:10lostlogicpreglow: they're kinda bitchy nowadays, I suppose that's also how I ended up losing my commit rights ;)
01:59:10mokkurkalveamiconn: cost you an arm?
01:59:20amiconnNot really
01:59:23preglowpixelma: we only use \setting{} for actual settings, right? not setting values?
01:59:30preglowlostlogic: haha
01:59:40preglowi haven't used gentoo for years
01:59:47amiconn~EUR 160 including shipping (from, a year ago or so)
01:59:59chris06i loaded some new themes and loaded the wps files for the playback screen but it wont change any idea how to fix it?
02:00:29pixelmapreglow: afaics, yes
02:01:16mokkurkalveI've been searching but I can't find anyone willing to ship it to Europe....
02:01:49chris06its the aurora black in particular that wont work.
02:02:43preglowwhat's the biggest disk i can stuff in a h120?
02:02:47preglow60 gigs?
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02:03:13mokkurkalveAnyone knows when Musepack sv8 support will come to RB - or a qualified guess I mean....?
02:03:52mokkurkalveI would have liked MK8007GAH for my H340.....
02:03:59chris06the rockvista and aurora wont load their wps correctly anyone know of a way to fix this?
02:04:08preglowmokkurkalve: sure
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02:04:26preglowmokkurkalve: i'm just waiting for them to release it or something
02:04:39preglowwhen, i don't know
02:04:45preglowwhen i have time or someone else does it first :>
02:05:05pixelmapreglow: I'm only aware of 40GBs single platter with the right connector that were available
02:05:23preglowpixelma: i don't think i dare open my h120 another time anyway, it's getting pretty shabby :)
02:05:27pixelmaor was it 50?
02:05:28mokkurkalvepreglow: Yes no point in putting it into RB till they made a stable release I guess...
02:05:39preglowmokkurkalve: sure there'd be a point, but i can't be bothered until then
02:05:50preglowjust to minimize the work i have to do
02:06:06preglowi don't think any of the musepack guys own any rockbox targets, which sucks
02:06:29pixelmawasn't Buschel a musepack guy? ;)
02:06:32preglowone of the original musepack creators does hang around here, though, but he hasn't expressed any interest in doing the actual sync
02:06:37preglowpixelma: yeah, him :)
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02:07:58mokkurkalveAndree Buschmann or something... Yes he had the format ages ago, then Frank Klemm took over, and now it's the "Musepack team"
02:09:18preglowi'd love a target with lots of storage
02:09:51preglowand i want a gigabeat s, but i can only find the 30 gig variety
02:10:02preglowupgrading only ten gigs sucks
02:10:13pixelmachris06: the themes you are trying probably need patches (or an unsupported build that include those). Or they need to be updated.
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02:15:33PaulPositionThat pictureflow gadget looks nice :D Unfortunately, it gives me a Data Abor when it gets to finishing building its cache.
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02:16:53PaulPosition..and the build's isn't much helpfull as it seems to imply the error is in buffering (I'm not playing any song when I try to load the plugin)
02:17:19preglowpictureflow uses the buffering api, afaik
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02:17:53mokkurkalveI have a e280 also - it seems to me the FM is more noisy in RB compared to OF (unlike on my H340 - aware they have completely different radio chips) - anybody else notice this? Is it a driver issue, or some noise cancelling DSP stuff or...???
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02:19:44preglowmight be both, but i doubt it's the latter
02:19:53preglowmore than enough of other issues
02:20:24preglowamiconn: what's our position on the archos replaygain patch?
02:22:19pixelmamokkurkalve: on the c200 (which I think uses the same tuner chip) the radio is quite unstable. Wouldn't make me wonder if there are some driver issues still that apply to the e200 too
02:23:14Nico_PPaulPosition: it's interesting that PF causes buffering crashes for you... I'll have to check that out. wat player are you using?
02:25:34PaulPositionNico_P H10 5gb.. Upon further investigation I can say that 60x60 cover.bmp files went alright. The cover.100x100.bmp files however crashed it.
02:26:03PaulPositionI'm going to remove the 60 pixel ones and batch convert again to an other size and see..
02:26:41Nico_Pabout how many covers do you have?
02:27:19PaulPositionAround 50-55 I think.
02:28:13PaulPosition56 exactly
02:28:35Nico_Pyeah so not too much, shouldn't be a problem
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02:39:10PaulPositionNico_P - Hah, that's a weird one.. After the last try (100 x 100 but named cover.bmp) the player crashed with the same data abort error, but on restarting it this time it didn't rebuild cache (prepare art) but shown me a few 100x100 albums together with the 60x60 ones that worked previously.
02:39:57Nico_Pwow weird indeed
02:40:35*Nico_P needs to be off to bed
02:40:48PaulPositionHeh, good night then. :)
02:40:59Nico_Pthanks :)
02:41:11PaulPositionI'll probably pass by tomorrow and tell you if I find something about my problem.
02:41:29Nico_Pok, sounds good
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02:53:59 Join Herky140 [0] (
02:55:24Herky140can anyone help me with a problem involving the evilg fusion build for a 5g 30gb ipod?
02:56:06safetydanHerky140: only the official Rockbox build is supported here. If you can reproduce the problem with a current build, then we can talk.
02:56:20Herky140do you know who I can contact?
02:56:44Herky140The official build works perfectly, by the way.
02:58:13safetydanHerky140: there may be a forum post in the unsupported builds section that you can ask for help
02:58:29Herky140okay. thank you!
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03:44:16countrymonkeyHey tom, I didn't know you spoke norsk.
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03:45:15countrymonkeyand the spanish translation is going to get an update on monday since my spanish-speaking friend is going to be bored out of his wits over the weekend.
03:46:45psycho_maniacglad to hear it.
03:50:58***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
03:57:35countrymonkeyI asked him to translate word-for-word if he had trouble translating the whole phrase. Is this correct?
03:59:12countrymonkeyand the friend said that he wanted to be a regular translator. I will be putting the translations into the .lang file and diffing it. He will just translate it (he doesn't want to deal with the lang file).
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04:03:47Lloreancountrymonkey: Generally it's more important to make sure people can understand what the phrase means. If he doesn't understand it, translating word for word is likely to make it harder for other people to understand too.
04:03:57LloreanOtherwise we could just use automated translation for all untranslated strings.
04:04:54countrymonkeyHey! That would be a good idea. Anyway, he is adept at both languages and he sais it will be a piece of cake. But why wouldn't we do auto-translation.
04:05:18psycho_maniacbecause sometimes the translation is wrong?
04:06:08countrymonkeyNot for short strings. I have experience. I translate a news article, it's hard to understand. I translate short phrases, it's like human translation.
04:10:19LloreanNot as much with technical terms.
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04:13:41LloreanThe problem is avoiding significant mistakes. To do so, you'd need to have someone who understands the language read through the whole automatic translation and make sure each of the strings is acceptable. At which point, why don't they just translate?
04:14:13countrymonkeyIs this a deal or no deal? (yes I watch that show)
04:14:45LloreanI have no idea what you mean by that.
04:14:57countrymonkeyI mean is this a go or a no?
04:15:09LloreanAs i said, automatic translation is bad.
04:15:59psycho_maniacit could probably be a go if your friend is very good with the translation himself. as you said he is?
04:16:16countrymonkeyThen how did I crank good translation out of it? (I had to speak to someone that didn't speak english, chinese or japanese)
04:17:20countrymonkeyand yes, he is native to spanish and he has people to help him if he is stuck
04:17:53Lloreancountrymonkey: It's not 100% bad, but the problem is that it's sometimes bad, and moreso with technical terms. And a bad native string is worse than just the English string.
04:18:24countrymonkeyyes. And would a japanese voice ui benefite anyone? (I am working on one)
04:22:19krazykitcountrymonkey, it would probably help blind japanese users.
04:22:51countrymonkeySo, you are saying, keep it up?
04:23:23countrymonkeyAnd, why has nobody looked at 8132?
04:23:24psycho_maniacif people dont say keep it up. i still think its a good idea to work on stuff. one day it will help some people.
04:25:16Lloreancountrymonkey: Because people all work on different things.
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04:25:24LloreanNOBODY gets paid for this, so people are using their spare time
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04:25:45LloreanMaking the language files smaller is a pretty minor patch, in terms of any benefits from it.
04:26:11countrymonkeyI am still confusing this and making assumptions that refer to proprietary software *sigh*
04:27:02LloreanI mean it's essentially a cosmetic patch anyway
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04:29:28countrymonkeyand what is wrong with 6360 and why was it closed?
04:30:13LloreanIt's a fake language?
04:30:35psycho_maniacbut the lag file is still on the wiki
04:30:42psycho_maniacso you can get it there if you want it
04:31:35krazykitcountrymonkey, so she would translate rockbox to Klingon and Elvish, too, if you're going to have Swedish Chef -speak?
04:31:38countrymonkeyIt looks real to me. How is it fake?
04:31:41krazykiter, should we
04:32:07krazykitcountrymonkey, the textfilter is from the way the Swedish Chef spoke on the Muppet Show. it's not a real language.
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04:34:59psycho_maniacWhat folders can I delete from my sansa e260? I have MUSIC, PHOTO, PICTURES, PLAYLISTS, RECORD, VIDEO, tmp, AND SYSTEM.
04:35:23countrymonkeyThanks. I don't watch the muppet show so I don't get it until now.
04:36:59krazykitpsycho_maniac, the OF will recreate everything, but you should keep SYSTEM to be safe
04:37:32psycho_maniaceven if i just shut the player off and plug in the player?
04:37:50krazykitif you boot into the OF, it will recreate the files
04:38:25psycho_maniacim gonna try not to do that.
04:39:22Mouser_XHeh. It'd be awesome to hear Rockbox speaking that though...
04:39:37Mouser_XEven if it made no sense.
04:39:53psycho_maniacbork bork?
04:40:04psycho_maniacthat WOULD be cool
04:40:40psycho_maniacreminds me of the recent snl skit they had about the swedish chef
04:40:46Mouser_XI wouldn't mind having Klingon for that matter. Though, I'd almost never use it...
04:41:41psycho_maniacsince google has funny translations would be cool if they had those. i know they only have l33t i think
04:42:23Mouser_XQuestion for devs: So, when the "repeat 1" mode is on, I can't skip to the next song in the playlist. If were inclined to fix this (allow skipping to previous/next track while repeat 1 is on), what source files would I look at to see about doing that?
04:42:39countrymonkeyHey. If I added a voice ui to bork bork bork and updated it (not that I can find those filters on the net), do you all think anyone would use it?\
04:42:48Mouser_XUgh... 1337 speak in Rockbox would suck hard...
04:43:08Mouser_Xcountrymonkey: I might just for kicks and giggles.
04:43:10psycho_maniaccountrymonkey: if not you could add it to the funnylangs wiki page?
04:43:20countrymonkeyAnd what is this thing about funny language filters in google?
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04:43:25Mouser_XI didn't know that page existed...
04:43:28*Mouser_X looks it up.
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04:44:31psycho_maniacsaw it once on the frong page.
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04:50:03countrymonkeyI want to know more about where that bork bork bork translation came from.
04:50:39psycho_maniacwikipedia or google should tell you unless you mean the actual translation file
04:51:00LloreanIf you mean "where does the language itself come from", here:
04:51:04countrymonkeyI mean the freqin filter. I tried google.
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04:59:53countrymonkeyMand what's 1337 speak. The only weird language I know is pig latin and I am adept at translating it (it's simple)
05:01:10countrymonkeyAnd I could do musicspeak (skipping Rs doubling consonants basicly what you do when you sing words)
05:01:33krazykitnobody will use them. why would you add useless languages?
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05:02:48Mouser_Xcountrymonkey: 1337 = LEET speak = crap talk.
05:03:27safetydan1337 = leet = elite which has it's origins way back in the mists of computing, piracy, and demo coding
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05:04:34safetydan has more than you'd ever want to know
05:08:27countrymonkeyThanks. You've got my mind set on creating a pig latin translation since I will be bored over xmas.
05:13:42countrymonkeyAnd speaking of languages, are human voices buildable or do you have to use synthesisers?
05:15:06safetydancountrymonkey: it's possible to generate the voice clips from recordings of a human voice
05:15:46safetydanno idea if that still works though
05:16:45countrymonkeyIt probably doesn't because spx codecs are impossible to find.
05:17:13Lloreanno, they aren't
05:18:04LloreanInstead of "run lame on all the clips" you just run rbspeexenc on all the clips.
05:18:15countrymonkeyLLorean, I found foobar2000 but the command line converter is a different story. I think it was you who told me about it.
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05:22:13countrymonkeyIs rockbox suitable for helping me practice my choir music?
05:23:20LloreanIsn't that something you kinda have to decide?
05:25:06countrymonkeyI'm just unsure. And I posted to the wrong irc channel. I have 2 clients open, sorry.
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05:28:01psycho_maniacif your unsure then how would we know?
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05:39:16psycho_maniacjust curious on why the e260 does not have fadding effects for the lcd
05:45:09krazykitpsycho_maniac, there aren't enough lcd brightness modes (hardware) for it to not look crappy
05:48:23*psycho_maniac would rather see Cabbie as the default thme for rockbox, but i guess that theme lost interest.
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09:20:04RockShoxim trying to figure out how the sansa e200 senses its docked, to enable the connector line out
09:20:35GodEater_good luck with that :)
09:20:37RockShoxseems like its enabled by default with rockbox so maybe no one knows yet
09:21:26Bagderchecked fs8305?
09:21:52RockShoxwhats that
09:22:33Bagdersounds like what you're after, but for the c200
09:22:52RockShoxwell its more of a hardware question than software
09:23:03RockShoxi want to make my own "dock"
09:23:21Bagderok, then I'll switch to "good luck with that" as well ;-)
09:24:17RockShoxit says its not a perfect patch
09:24:21RockShoxbut i dont see a patch at all
09:24:38Bagderheh, not me either
09:25:01RockShoxoh hes doing it based on charger
09:25:08RockShoxtheres got to be something else
09:25:19RockShoxprobably just pull a pin high
09:25:45RockShoxthe factory firmware has the headphone jack enabled while charging
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09:33:34***Server message 505: 'logbot_ :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
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09:35:09vaginamisslewhat is the best xvid avi to rvf convertor or is that even possible?
09:35:49safetydan_any particular reason you want rvf?
09:36:04vaginamissleno i mean i have an ipod 5g can it just play it?
09:36:07***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
09:36:12vaginamisslelast time i used rockbox there was no video support to speak of
09:36:36safetydan_read this
09:36:50safetydan_basically rockbox can play mpeg1 and mpeg2 videos
09:36:59safetydan_you'll need to convert your videos to one of those formats
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09:56:13jmspeexQuick question, is the firmware typically directly in the same partition as the music? i.e. do I risk bricking my unit if I do an fsck? (it's not rockbox I have atm, but I thought someone here would have the knowledge)
09:57:20Zagortypically the file systems are real, so a fsck should not hurt
10:04:33 Quit vaginamissle (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
10:05:47jmspeexZagor: "real"?
10:06:25markunjmspeex: which player do you have?
10:06:34jmspeexiaudio 7
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10:06:57markunplanning to port rockbox to it? :)
10:06:59jmspeexI accidently unplugged it while mounted and now the fs is corrupted
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10:07:43jmspeexmarkun: No, it was the only 16GB flash player that supports Ogg. Planning on eventually installing rockbox what it's stable
10:08:10Zagorjmspeex: the only way a fsck would break a filesystem is if the fs is bogus somehow with holy sections or some such
10:08:50phrjmspeex, the frontier lab nexblack supports ogg
10:08:57jmspeexI'm mostly concerned about damaging firmware and bricking the unit
10:10:30jmspeexgreat. fsck.vfat segfaults!
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10:17:45Mode"logbot :+e" by services.
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10:33:31#>>"explain MoB" by Zagor (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
10:35:15peturlogbot explain life, the universe and everything else
10:35:35LinusNlogbot explain Rockbox
10:35:43Zagoryeah I figured we could use him to do some faq-answering
10:35:45phrwho's hacking that mob thing?
10:35:58Zagorand a few other nifty things
10:36:18*petur feeds 42 into logbot answer list
10:36:36ZagorI need to add y'all so you can send "expadd" commands to tech it things
10:37:14peturlet the fun begin :)
10:37:25peturlogbot explain Zagor
10:38:13Zagornobody except me can do anything with it yet. and when you can, please play around with private messages so we don't flood the log with testing
10:43:23advcomp2019it came here as a notice if you wanted to know
10:43:48Zagoradvcomp2019: the explanation?
10:45:05advcomp2019Zagor, it came here like it used the /notice command
10:45:30Zagoradvcomp2019: yes it does that to prevent auto-responses
10:45:47Zagorcould cause nasty loops otherwise
10:45:52Bagder"I can hear the distortion that comes from compression" ...
10:45:59Bagderyeah right ;-)
10:46:16*Bagder reads forum
10:46:29advcomp2019Zagor, i see now that is understandable now
10:46:30phr woo hoo
10:47:27peturbah, out of stock...
10:47:36phryeah they'll prob have more soon
10:47:44phri just placed an order with them today before i noticed that
10:47:48phri wonder if they had some earlier
10:47:53phrapparently they showed up a few days ago
10:47:57peturand no speed spec....
10:48:15phrthere is also this
10:48:20Zagorwell it does say "out of stock"
10:48:28phrtheir "speedy" line is dog slow, but heck it's for audio, slow is ok ;)
10:50:51phrzagor, yeah, something new like that shows up, it sells out after a while and they order more. i doubt there's a big shortage, they prob just placed a small order at first to gauge sales rate
10:50:55phrcf is sort of dying
10:51:02phr16gb sdhc has been around for a while
10:52:41phri bet they could make 64gb cf right now if they wanted
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11:11:33Casainhohello :-)
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11:13:47jmspeexCan anyone help me fix that vfat fs?
11:14:42jmspeexfsck.vfat on a second machine just tells me there's too many errors and won't do anything... while the windows fsck tells me there's no error (despite not being able to remove some folders)
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11:15:09peturyou did chkdsk /f on windows?
11:17:04jmspeexpetur: No, I used the right click on the disk and then selected "check filesystem" or something. No idea what that does exactly
11:17:08jmspeex(I'm not a Windows user)
11:17:35jmspeexdoes chdsk /f do something different?
11:17:44peturopen a commandline box and type chkdsk x: /f (X = drive)
11:17:54peturit gives more verbose output
11:18:09jmspeexlet me reboot that machine...
11:18:11peturstart->run 'cmd'
11:18:15jmspeexis there any risk of bricking the unit?
11:18:29peturyou can run it without the /f first
11:18:36jmspeexwhat's /f
11:18:42peturhat will not fix, only report
11:19:16peturit only writes to the disk if you specify /f
11:23:29pondlifeMessage for Nico_P: I just had a case of the "playback stops and UI returns to browser at end of track" during playback of a long playlist. Pressing PLAY resumed just fine though.
11:24:48jmspeexpetur: apparently, XP doesn't know about chdsk (or so it says)
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11:31:10jmspeexwithout /f, it didn't do anything useful. Trying with /f now (it's taking much longer)
11:32:34jmspeexI already have one "recoverable error" in a folder... not good :-(
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11:36:09jmspeexpetur: it appears to have worked. Thanks a lot
11:37:28peturnot all of windows is bad ;)
11:38:07jmspeexhaha. But if the fs was ext3, I wouldn't have had this problem in the first place!
11:38:55petursure, only fat and ntfs filesystems can get corrupted?
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11:42:07jmspeexpetur: ext3 is journaled and fsck.ext3 is very good. I never lost anything to an ext2/ext3 fs
11:46:04peturthe only times I lost data on a disk were hardware issues, no filesystem would have helped there
11:46:45jmspeexwell, I didn't include that...
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12:06:01peturthe future looks HDD-less :)
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12:33:23preglowjmspeex: gotten a player?
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14:16:55preglowjhMikeS: what fixed point format do you think would leave enough overhead? q24?
14:17:05preglowa bitch about emac and eq filters in that case, but
14:17:55 Quit tch (Client Quit)
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14:28:46Bug2000I am pretty sure it won't, but just in case I missed something. Will Rockbox work on generic MP4 players?
14:29:20krazykitnot unless someone ports them
14:30:49preglowrockbox only works on devices it's been ported to, you can't just run rockbox on something it's not designed to run on
14:30:56 Join Libor [0] (i=52759cea@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
14:31:24preglowunlike computers, different mp3 players are all vastly different on the inside
14:32:20Liborhi, I have a problem with rockboy and pokemon, I want heal my pokemons, but It froze when nurse turn to computer, can someone help?
14:32:53 Quit J3TC- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:33:37preglowwe don't really do game specific help here, sorry
14:34:19Libork, np
14:34:24LloreanLibor: turn on sound
14:34:41 Quit Neovanglist (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:34:47LiborI will try it
14:34:52preglowLlorean: never took you for an eager pokemon player :)
14:35:01Lloreanpreglow: It's come up in the forums a few times.
14:35:05LloreanApparently it's an old gnuboy bug
14:36:06LiborIt helps, thank Llorean very much
14:37:07Bug2000preglow: Really? I thought all the generic ones are identical.
14:37:27preglowBug2000: i doubt it, but don't really know. still doesn't help if rockbox doesn't run on that particular strain of hardware
14:38:15Bug2000preglow: How do I port it? XD
14:38:26preglowBug2000: reverse-engineering, inspecting hardware, and programming
14:38:31preglownu tndas tusen juleljus!
14:39:12 Quit Libor ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
14:39:15Bug2000preglow: Sounds like too much work. I guess I'll `live` with it [Didn't buy it yet. When I'll get one, I am so going to make sure it supports ogg and midi, else I'm gonna demand a refund].
14:39:30preglowBug2000: prepare to be refunded
14:39:35preglowBug2000: i know of no players that support midi
14:39:48Zagorhas anyone looked at this?
14:40:04preglowZagor: what is it+
14:40:06Lloreanpreglow: Some of the chinese knockoffs claim to, I think
14:40:07Zagorit's claimed to be the ipodclassic firmware. and it sure contains a lot of ipod stuff.
14:40:10Bug2000preglow: :( But Midi rocks!
14:40:23preglowLlorean: then i stand corrected
14:40:27ZagorI found the whole of ipodquiz at least
14:40:33Zagorplain text
14:40:35rvvs89Bug2000: Music modules are better :P
14:40:37 Quit axionix (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
14:40:41Lloreanpreglow: That being said, I've seen them claim lots of things they don't actually *do* :)
14:40:47preglowZagor: what about the main firmware...
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14:41:04preglowLlorean: nothing feels better than buying pure marketing
14:41:15Zagorpreglow: it's a 87MB blob, so it contains a LOT of things. could be a full osx in there.
14:41:27preglowZagor: sure it's not the ipod touch firmware?
14:41:36preglowdon't think classic runs os x
14:42:27Zagorthe touch firmware is at,1_1.1.2_3B48b_Restore.ipsw and is even bigger
14:42:37Bug2000rvvs89: What are those Music Modules that you speak of?
14:42:41Zagorthe touch zip is 157MB
14:43:04Zagorcontaining one 125MB and two 18MB DMGs
14:43:20Bug2000Llorean: Fireproff, most comman lie.
14:43:27markunBug2000: which MP4 players were you interested in?
14:43:46Bug2000markun: Generic stuff.
14:44:43markunBug2000: I was looking for MP4 players powered by the Blackfin CPU. This is what I found so far:
14:45:09peturah, mister blackfin ;)
14:45:51Zagor"Apple iPod S5L8702 Secure Boot"
14:46:28*preglow closes his eyes on continues on his swedish christmas carols binge
14:47:26Bug2000maraz_: Whats Blackfin?
14:47:36Bug2000maraz_: What are the chances I'll find those in the local store?
14:47:39petura processor family
14:48:03peturfrom analog devices
14:48:12markunBug2000: talking to me? :)
14:48:48*Bug2000 blames xchat's tab.
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14:50:28markunpreglow: ADI gave me this (still in transit),2877,BF548%252DHARDWARE,00.html
14:51:01 Quit Arathis (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
14:52:15peturmarkun: what, for free?
14:52:30petur"The EZ-KIT Lite ships with a 4x4 Keypad, Optical Thumbwheel, QVGA Touch Screen LCD and a 40 Gigabyte Hard Drive."
14:53:04markunpetur: I might have to pay some import taxes, but they tried to pay that for me as well
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14:53:36*markun has to go now
14:53:41Bug2000markun: Well, ya, I talked to you.
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14:54:11markunBug2000: not sure what the chances of finding them in local stores are
14:54:18markunthey might be rebrnaded
14:54:28Bug2000I.E. Hopeless.
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14:55:01S0uLanybody german here?
14:55:23Bug2000Thanks anyway.
14:55:26*Bug2000 goes away.
14:55:28S0uLich brauche hilfe beim installieren
14:55:39Bug2000S0uL: ENGLISH ONLY!
14:55:41 Part Bug2000 ("Bug.In.Your.System")
14:55:58peturgone with a bang...
14:56:00preglowS0uL: if you want to speak german, you should wait for someone who does and talk to them privately
14:56:12S0uLno.. english should be ok aswell
14:56:17preglowS0uL: and yes, there are germans here, but i don't know if they are here right now, or if they're interested in helping you privately
14:56:18S0uLmay you help me pls?
14:56:26preglowS0uL: then you shall have no problems :) just state what you're having trouble with
14:56:34peturexplain manual
14:56:48S0uLI dont know how to install rockbox
14:56:50S0uL@ my ipod
14:56:56S0uLold version.. nano
14:56:59peturexplain install
14:57:00S0uLvers. 1.0
14:57:08preglowcheck out the manual for your device
14:57:20preglowinstallation is pretty simple if you're lucky
14:57:33S0uLalready done..
14:57:40preglowand it didn't work out?
14:57:44S0uLIve already downloaded it..
14:57:52S0uLwhats the next step
14:57:58preglowreading it
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14:58:53S0uLtheres no where explained how to install.. alright?
14:58:58preglowsure there is
14:59:13preglowread that
14:59:22S0uLohh yeah
15:00:28S0uLsounds quite easy^^
15:00:36preglowwell, like i said, it should be
15:06:38S0uLfor what is the bootloader`?
15:07:13preglowit's the little piece of software we use to load rockbox
15:07:42S0uLdo I have 2 install it on my ipod if I want to use rockbox?
15:07:52preglowoh yes
15:08:14preglowif you use rbutil, it should be easy
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15:09:24preglowjust go to the "installation" tab and use "install the bootloader"
15:09:33S0uLi did
15:09:38preglowthen you have it
15:09:43S0uLbut i dont know if its installed @ the ipod
15:10:02preglowhave you pressed "install rockbox" too?
15:10:20S0uLwhile installing d bootloader?
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15:10:30S0uLi installed rb bevore
15:10:33S0uL@ first
15:10:39preglowok, then just disconnect your nano and try starting it
15:10:45 Join axionix [0] (
15:10:46S0uLok sec
15:10:52S0uLi installed the fonts
15:11:41S0uLjust Apple OS.. is there
15:12:11preglowthen you didn't install the bootloader
15:12:12phranyone know where that page is with the hardware specs on all the players? i saw it before but can't find it now
15:12:39S0uLof course i did...
15:13:03preglowS0uL: and you are _sure_ you have installed rockbox correctly? the bootloader will boot apple os if it can't find rockbox
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15:13:21Lloreanpreglow: I'm not sure if it does that reliably r ight now, actually
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15:13:28preglowLlorean: really? that sucks, why not?
15:13:33LloreanI dunno
15:13:35preglowLlorean: does ipodpatcher do a better job?
15:13:58LloreanAll I know is people in the forums have reported their player freezing at "cannot find rockbox.ipod"
15:14:03LloreanWell 'freezing'
15:14:04S0uLi kopied.. the exe @ my ipod.. extracted it there...
15:14:12S0uLthats the installation of rb
15:14:22preglowdo we distribute an exe?
15:14:39preglowS0uL: what was the exe called?
15:14:40S0uLsoorry zip
15:14:44preglowS0uL: ah, good
15:15:06preglowS0uL: download that exe and run it
15:15:37S0uLi and enter 2 install
15:15:39S0uLok.. done
15:15:40preglowS0uL: preferably, run it in a command line windows
15:15:45preglowS0uL: that will tell you if something goes wrong
15:16:12S0uLsorry.. i dont know where the windows command line is^^
15:16:19S0uLbut i installed it
15:16:20preglowstart -> run -> "cmd.exe"
15:16:25preglowS0uL: well, does it work now, then?
15:16:34S0uLnow there is: press enter to exit ipodpatcher
15:16:40S0uLpressed enter..
15:16:41preglowahh,. ok
15:16:43S0uLand now?
15:16:48preglowwell, try starting your ipod again
15:17:30S0uLrockbox boot loader version 2.0
15:17:32S0uLyesss baby
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15:17:42S0uLthanks thanks, thannnnkkksss!!!
15:17:53S0uLhehe shit
15:17:58S0uLcant load rockbox
15:18:06S0uLfile not found^^
15:18:50preglowsounds like the bootloader
15:19:11S0uLsounds bad^^
15:19:11pixelmasounds like you didn't extract the (properly)
15:19:27preglowS0uL: it says 'can't load rockbox.ipod' ?
15:19:50S0uLmhm cant load rockbox.ipod:
15:19:53S0uLfile not found
15:19:58preglowS0uL: then you didn't extract that zip properly, but you now have a bootloader
15:20:16preglowS0uL: so as soon as you extract the zip properly, you should have a working rockbox
15:21:58preglowamiconn: have we updated the nano/5g bootloaders yet?
15:22:11phrpetur, thanks
15:22:48phrwould you mind putting that into the doc section of the twiki index? i don't have an account right now
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15:23:10peturphr: it is...
15:23:39petur under General Information
15:23:43 Quit Thundercloud (Remote closed the connection)
15:23:51peturitem 5
15:24:13phraha, thanks
15:24:54S0uLmy pc doesnt find my ipod anymore^^^allthough its connected
15:25:56rvvs89S0uL: Restart it into disk mode
15:26:14rvvs89Standard procedure for anything involving iPod hacking
15:26:26rvvs89s/hacking/installing the fruits of someone else's hacking/
15:26:37S0uLhow do i restart it into disk mode?
15:26:38 Join Thundercloud [0] (
15:26:41S0uLif i restart my ipod
15:26:44pixelmafollow the instructions it gave you to put it into disk mode manually (on the screen with the error message "can't find rockbox.ipod" it tells you)
15:26:51 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
15:26:53S0uLi just see the screen with the boot loader
15:27:10GodEater_S0uL: which says.....
15:27:59S0uLRockbox boot loader...
15:28:04S0uLVersion: 2.0
15:28:16S0uLIpov version: blabla
15:28:26S0uLpartitipation: 1
15:28:36S0uLloading rockbox...
15:28:41rvvs89pastebin yo
15:28:50S0uLcant load rockbox
15:28:55S0uLfile not found
15:29:06S0uLhold menu + select to
15:29:14S0uLreboot then select + play
15:29:20S0uLfor disc mode
15:29:46S0uLthats it
15:29:49rvvs89So, do it
15:29:51S0uLbut its not working ^^
15:29:53rvvs89Did you even read it?
15:29:54S0uLhehe i did hehe
15:29:57S0uLyes sure
15:30:29rvvs89Slightly more verbose explanation of the last three lines
15:34:14GodEater_was jhMikeS getting a Gigabeat S too ?
15:34:32GodEater_or did I imagine that ?
15:35:03Nico_PI said he was getting one... don't know if he actually did though
15:35:18GodEater_I could have sworn I saw him say it himself too :)
15:35:36GodEater_you told me preglow was getting one too, that's the only person I've not seen it from directly I think
15:36:07Nico_Phe seemed lesscertain then jhMikeS
15:36:17Nico_Pbut he did say he wanted one
15:36:46GodEater_do we have any clearer idea on where we're hanging up now? Or are we still just suspicious of interrupts ?
15:38:21preglowjhMikeS got one
15:38:28preglowdon't know if he has, but it was on its way at a certain point in time
15:38:32preglowi'm the one only talking about it :)
15:39:03preglowi just figured i'd roll on over christmas and see how i am with cash at that point
15:39:18preglowi've got this knack at being low on it
15:40:12Nico_Ppreglow: did jhMikeS say if he actually ordered it?
15:40:18preglowi think he did, yes
15:41:38Nico_Pcool :)
15:44:21preglowyes, at least you'll have the low level side of things covered, heh
15:44:36preglowthough i fancy having a shot at that too, but i guess it'll be covered once i finally get one, heh
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15:45:36pixelmahmm, the supression of "cancelled" when you didn't move in the settings list (i.e. enter the setting and immediately back out again) seems to be broken.. and wasn't it agreed on getting rid of it at all again?
15:45:56preglowi think so
15:46:02preglowbut it never did happen
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15:53:35 Quit S0uL ("Ich denke, dass ich nicht weiss... bin ich also... ?")
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15:56:57 Part LinusN
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15:59:04 Part jac0b-work
15:59:57LloreanWe use code from ffmpeg, right?
16:00:19markunyes, the flac decoder
16:01:07LloreanRight. Just curious, as we're not in the "these projects incorporate work from ffmpeg" list, and was wondering if we ought to drop them a note and see if they know.
16:01:17 Part hcs
16:01:53markunLlorean: maybe ask the guys in #ffmpeg-devel
16:04:07preglowshorten too
16:04:31preglowso yeah, we definitely belong in that list
16:04:57mokkurkalvethe Shorten and WMA decoder in RB is also originally from ffmpeg I think....
16:05:01LloreanAnd AAC?
16:05:06preglowahh, yeah, wma to
16:05:08*preglow slaps head
16:05:08preglowno aac
16:05:13preglowthat's faad, unfortunately
16:05:17LloreanAh, Right
16:05:20Lloreanffmpeg doesn't have AAC
16:05:25preglownot yet
16:05:27LloreanJust like they don't have mp3
16:05:37preglowi hang in #ffmpeg-devel, i could tell them
16:05:46preglowwhere's this list?
16:05:51preglowLlorean: they have mp3
16:06:01Lloreanpreglow: libmp3lame, isn't it?
16:06:16LloreanThat's not just mp2/mp1?
16:06:29preglownah, mpegaudioenc.c
16:06:32preglowlooks like a complete encoder
16:06:34preglowbut not a very good one...
16:07:07LloreanWell, I always roll my own with lame anyway, because the one in ubuntu's repository is mp3-less entirely
16:07:22*Nico_P read an interesting blog post about natural sorting and found a nice implementation
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16:08:35preglowLlorean: ahh, almost seems like its layer 2 only, yeah
16:09:20markunthey also have a flac encoder now. I wonder if the resulting files differ in size from the official encoder
16:11:13Lloreanpreglow: Are you on the ffmpeg-devel list?
16:11:22preglowLlorean: nope
16:11:28*Llorean doesn't feel like signing up for the list if he can avoid it, but would also hate to email into it without being on it.
16:11:33preglowLlorean: i can, though
16:11:41preglowi think i'll try to hang there and see if it's interesting
16:11:48markunLlorean: they are also on freenode
16:11:49pixelmapondlife: just got another freeze on M5, this time browsing the menus and .talk clips are turned off...
16:11:58Lloreanmarkun: I went to their channel, and they suggesting sending to the list
16:12:06Lloreanpreglow: If you could let them know then, that'd be great. :)
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16:13:36pondlifepixelma: Any voice enabled? During playback?
16:13:53pixelmano playback, voice menus enabled
16:14:05pixelma(and voice file present)
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16:15:17markunjust did a test and ffmpeg's produced flac was smaller than flac -8 and went a lot faster
16:21:03krazykitmarkun, which version of the flac reference encoder? i think much of ffmpeg's improvements went into 1.2.1
16:23:11markunI'll update and try again
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16:34:49preglowLlorean: done
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16:48:01DefineByteAnyone willing to commit FS #8313?
16:48:30DefineBytechanges 'web site' to 'website' in the manual.
16:48:53DefineBytewhich i believe was agreed on here a while back
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16:56:17pixelmaDefineByte: one would need your complete real name to commit it... (I might do it later but also working on some other things in the manual myself atm)
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17:01:22preglowLlorean: haha, and already i'm gathering shit for having told them
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17:01:50GodEater_preglow: such as ?
17:02:55preglowhaha, for not linking to their website or pointing out exactly where their source is, apparently
17:03:58 Quit DrCrow_ (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
17:07:39GodEater_they're joking I hope
17:09:04preglowhe kind of makes it sounds like we're breaking some law by not linking to them and offering their source code on the front page
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17:10:13GodEater_what a <insert-unpleasant-word-here>
17:13:12GodEater_they can help themselves to patches too
17:15:00PaulPositionNico_P - Just to let you know that whatever the name (cover or cover.100x100) I do get a 'data abort at 00008684 (0)' when the 'preparing album artwork' completes. If I look at /rocks/demos/pflow/ it seems to generate all the raw files (I get same number as with 90x90 res that does work), it generates the 'ready' file, but it doesn't generate the 'pflow.config' file.
17:16:22Nico_PPaulPosition: ok, thanks. I assume you have the latest svn rev? (15913)
17:16:31PaulPositionNico_P - Still might be something with my particular device as I seen a youtube vid of your plugin used on the same player.
17:17:03Nico_Pthat could be a different version
17:17:15PaulPosition(Oh weird.. If I hit 'up' after the data abort I also get a "undefined instruction at 0010D7AC (0)"
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17:17:39*GodEater_ has now run it on a Gigabeat F, and a 5.5G ipod.
17:17:45GodEater_no problems on either
17:18:14PaulPositionIt might be, yes... I'm using the version I dled 15 minutes before talking with you yesterday night...
17:18:45Nico_PPaulPosition: could you please check?
17:18:50PaulPositionNico_P - but I'll update just for kicks.. although changes in voicing shouldn't affect me much :)
17:19:16*PaulPosition starts up the vmware player
17:20:07GodEater_which target you testing on PaulPosition ?
17:20:38PaulPositionGodEater - H10, 5gb.
17:20:55GodEater_just another portalplayer one then :)
17:21:40PaulPositionbtw, where could I read about changing the manual (LaTEX, html, ???) ... There's still no Fm-Radio mention in the H10s manuals.
17:22:06GodEater_google for latex ?
17:22:39GodEater_or possibly just Tex
17:22:45pixelmaPaulPosition: good reminder... _should_ be easy
17:22:54GodEater_latex might end up with all sorts of odd things in your search results ;)
17:22:55DefineBytethe not so short introduction to latex
17:22:56pixelmabut I wasn't aware of it... ;)
17:24:34PaulPositionHeh, I guess it makes sense. I'm more worried about the branching out, defining buttons thing... Isn't the manual built like some freakin' tree to spare the need to repeat the same thing 26 times?
17:25:01*Nico_P has a natural sorting patch that adds 628 bytes to the gigabeat build and doesn't only do prefixes
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17:27:29pixelmaPaulPosition: yes and there is a simple "switch" in the platform files (I hope that's all it needs)
17:28:17PaulPositionI'll have a look.. Is that manual stuff downloaded with svn by default? (or does svn dl everything, unlike csv before it?)
17:30:20pixelmathe manual stuff is in an own (surprise) "manual" directory in the svn tree. I already did the change, going to test compile now...
17:30:37PaulPositionOh cool.. thanks. :)
17:37:35pixelmaok it needs a bit more than just enabling - I also need to fill out the button table...
17:38:48PaulPositionNico_P - Just to confirm I get the exact same error with current build. Compiling gives no error or warning, but should I dl one from the site just to make sure?
17:39:01Nico_PPaulPosition: no need
17:40:54PaulPositionNico_P - Any idea what I should check..? Try with 99x99 or 101x101.. unload database from ram? no dir-cache? .. Anyway as I said, it works at least in 90x90 so it's not like *I* need more, I'd just like to help pinpoint the culprit.
17:41:50Nico_PPaulPosition: if you are compiling yoursele, you could try a few changes in pictureflow.c:main
17:42:39Nico_Pfrom your description the crash comes either from the call to create_empty_slide or the call to free_buffers. try disabling one then the other to see which crashes
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17:46:09PaulPositionI'll have a look but I can't guarantee I'll understand anything :p
17:46:42pixelmaPaulPosition: seen PM?
17:47:02PaulPositionpixelma - nope, will have a look
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17:56:06pixelmaone has to love those LaTeX warnings like "Underfull \hbox (badness 1337) in paragraph at lines 114−−114" :>
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17:58:00Crash91erm, im not sure if anyone is aware, but pictureflow on the sansa still has "could allocate temporary buffers" instead of couldnt
17:59:13Nico_PCrash91: that means you need to update
18:00:03Crash91i used the buld from the day the spelling mistakes correction, but just wanted to make sure
18:00:52Nico_PCrash91: use the one from today, or better: the current one
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18:01:34DefineBytepixelma: I have to say, I just ignore them >.>
18:04:51pixelmaI usually do too but "badness 1337" caught my eye :)
18:06:51PaulPositionNico_P - Let's say I build pictureflow.c without the call to free_buffers(), (actually, I changed it to return true no matter what) what should happen? (I'm sure the problem isn't with the ready file as upon verification, it too got generated)
18:07:11PaulPosition(err.. I meant the "empty slide" file
18:07:37Nico_PPaulPosition: I'm not sure, but if there is no crash then it probably means the crash was there
18:08:05PaulPositionHeh.. We'll see in a few minutes I guess :p
18:08:47Nico_PI'm off, but I'll read the logs when I get back in roughly 45 minutes
18:08:57PaulPositionBut I wonder why my player would crash on emptying buffers.. some sort of deletion overflow? (technically challenged here, I guess it shows)
18:09:07PaulPositionNico_P no problem man. :)
18:09:34Nico_PPaulPosition: create_empty_slide is a more likelu candidate to me
18:09:40*Nico_P fades away
18:15:54DefineBytepixelma: Shows how little attention I pay to them, I didn't even notice that xD
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18:49:31RichiHi got a request by zagor to cloak logbot, linusn confirmed the claim but it turns out he is not the gc
18:49:40RichiHso, the real gc please poke me and confirm :)
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18:50:45scorche|wRichiH: the real GC is gone
18:51:03scorche|whence why the channel contacts have been changed
18:53:07scorche|wsee PM
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18:57:19*petur wonders what's a GC
18:57:43scorche|wgroup contact
18:58:06peturcould have guessed that ;)
18:59:23peturand who is ours?
18:59:47peturone of the Swedes?
19:00:43scorche|wno...i *think* it is t0mas, but i shouldnt really need to track him down again...but i probably will just to have the GC changed for future reference
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19:14:49PaulPositionNico_P - (for when you're back).. I tried a few things. Commenting out both, or one of the rb->buffclose() got me pass the data-abort but only so far : black screen with the name of the album at the bottom but frozen player.
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19:15:20Nico_PPaulPosition: ok
19:15:29PaulPositionNico_P - Commenting out the whole call to create_empty_slide() however got me a working plugin.
19:15:33Nico_Pblack scren isn't very suprising I guess
19:15:51PaulPositionNico_P : So I guess the buffer thing was a red herring, like you thought.
19:16:30Nico_PPaulPosition: actually no, create_empty_slide uses the buffering calls
19:16:44DefineBytepixelma: I have four patches up now.: #8309, #8313, #8315 and #8316
19:17:01DefineByteno pressure :D
19:17:03PaulPositionI still can't see why it wouldn't work with 100x100 art while it works perfect with 60, 80 or 90 px ones.. And it certainly works alright on everyone else's device since 100x100 is what most have tested with.. :puzzled:
19:17:38Nico_PPaulPosition: maybe your particular configuration puts you in a corner case
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19:18:24PaulPositionNico_P : Reset settings. Only database, database in ram and dir cache, but I tried without db in ram and dircache with same problems.
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19:18:45PaulPositionNico_P : Or did you mean hardware configuration?
19:19:12Nico_PI meant the size and number of cover art bitmaps
19:20:04PaulPositionNico_P : Perhaps.. Although I'm pretty limited by a small disk (5gb) so I don't dare imagine what a loaded up 80gb device would cause :o
19:21:00amiconnwhoa, logbot *finally* learned to explain again? :)
19:23:36amiconn[10:33:32] <Zagor> logbot explain MoB
19:23:36amiconn[10:33:34] -logbot- 'MoB' Metadata On Buffer.
19:24:15scorche|wheh...maybe they did something after i brought the topic up recently
19:24:19#>>"used to be able to explain a couple of things years ago. That feature got lost during a server upgrade or somesuch" by amiconn (n=jens@rockbox/developer/amiconn)
19:24:38amiconnI still have that old list of explainable things
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19:25:15scorche|win that case, i have a few things to teach the guy
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19:36:06mrkikoHow many asre in your opinion aproximately rockbox users? A big or small number? I ask this to you since I don't have access to web-site logbs and such...
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19:39:27scorche|wit is too hard to tell, really, as some peopel update once per day, and some update once every few months
19:40:02scorche|wyou can see counts for oct here
19:40:27mrkikoboot-loaders downloading may be more precise probably <:)
19:40:32mrkiko* sorry
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19:49:41scorche|wyes, but we cant monitor that easily due to how the download server is done
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19:57:48*RichiH pokes scorche|w
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19:58:13RichiHoi ompaul :)
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20:09:19Slavik0329hey i have a question
20:09:37Slavik0329i tried playing a midi file but then got "No Intruments Found"
20:10:38RyoSyou have to plugin a keyboard and a bass and a guitar and so on :^
20:10:49RyoSjust kidding :x
20:11:00Domonokyhaha, you need a patchset...
20:11:18Domonokythe sounds for a keyboard, bass, guitar.. :-)
20:11:23pixelmaSlavik0329: see PluginMidiPlay in the wiki
20:11:24Slavik0329how do i get that?
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20:11:45Slavik0329ahh, thanks
20:12:26 Join sindref [0] (i=50ca51a5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
20:12:39Slavik0329i searched the wiki i cant find it :(
20:12:46scorche|wRichiH: sorry..using CGI:IRC, which doesnt really alert me well when i get pinged :)
20:12:53Slavik0329neverminf i did
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20:14:30RichiHlogbot is now cloaked
20:14:33RyoSanyone ever purchased another battery for the iaudio x5?
20:14:38RyoSshould i watch out for anything?
20:14:47RichiHscorche: ^
20:14:54scorche|wRichiH: thanks :)
20:15:03RyoSor even better could someone recommend me a shop preferebly europe/germany?
20:16:56PaulPositionYou'd have better luck inquiring on an iAudio specific forum...
20:17:30scorche|wRyoS: there is iaudiophile , but if you wait around, there is a chance someone familiar with this may speak up
20:17:38RyoSi already looked at iaudiophile
20:17:44RyoSah, hehe yes :)
20:17:57RyoSscorche|w: you mean the bettery lifetime?
20:18:07RyoSi just testet the OF and it was almost as bad as with rockbox
20:18:14RyoSjust a little tiny bit better
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20:18:56RyoSi already forgot how to navigate that OF..
20:18:59RyoShow i love rockbox <3
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20:23:31sindrefAccording to the new theme "slant" for the ipod nano posted a few weeks ago, it says that despite the theme is able to view album art, it doesn't require any additional patches. Today I reinstalled rockbox on my nano, due to some error I couldn't fix. I have downloaded the latest build. But the album art doesn't work despite the description for the "slant" theme stated that album art patches are included in the
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20:24:21Domonokysindref: your message ends with: are included in the
20:24:26PaulPositionSindref - Do you have a cover.bmp file for each of your albums?
20:25:16neepooo did i come in on album art problems? because i can't seem to get the resize to work all the time
20:25:29sindrefI am sorry, didn't know there was a message limit here. I'll repost the message in pieces:)
20:25:53sindrefn the latest build. Therefore, I cannot understand why I am not able to view the album art? And yes, I have the bitmap files named in the containing folder as cover.bmp. Could the error be that the the bitmap file size is 200X200 pixels?
20:25:59scorche|wsindref: well, the limit depends on the client you are using, but ultimately, there is a limit in the protocol
20:26:02sindrefI used the nClix build before I got the error (which is the reason I reinstalled rockbox), and back then it worked fine with the bitmap files I have.
20:26:07PaulPositionneep - There's no bitmap resizing at the moment...
20:26:07scorche|wwell, RFC i should say
20:26:43neepthere isnt? thats really weird, some of my art actually does resize on my wps
20:26:46Domonokythe same to sindref: bmp resize is not in svn, so you bmps are probably too big..
20:26:54PaulPositionneep - You sure it isn't just cropped?
20:27:09neepyeah, positive, i double checked to make sure i wasn't going crazy
20:27:18PaulPositionDomonoky - My "too big" bitmaps are usually cropped at the bottom-right..
20:27:59PaulPositionneep - You using custom build with old bmp-resize patch or plain svn ?!? :o
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20:28:51sindrefI am not 100% sure what you mean now. The build I use is downloaded from, no modifications at all.
20:29:19neepplain svn from a week ago
20:29:27neepshould the resize not be happening? haha
20:29:29sindrefBefore the error I had which is the reason I reinstalled I used a custom build called nclix.
20:31:05sindrefSo it is absolutely true that album art is included with the latest builds? I just won't believe it:P
20:31:29scorche|wsindref: look at the commit log...
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20:31:48PaulPositionsindref - Try resizing ONE of your bmp to slant's standard size for your device (open slant's .wps file and search for a line like "%Cl|34|12|c60|c60|")
20:32:08PaulPosition..and then try this one album to see if the bmp size is the culprit of your problem...
20:32:11rp-Hi, could someone hint me to the where i can add something to the context menu?
20:32:21sindrefWill do.
20:32:43sindrefScorche: what is the commit log and where can I find it? Sorry if that's a dumb question.
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20:33:47PaulPositionsindref - Trust us, album art *IS* in svn and has been for a good month or so.
20:33:53pixelmasindref: how are your files named (do they contain .200x200.bmp perhaps)?
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20:34:46sindrefnope, they are named cover.bmp, nothing more nothing less. Working on resizing to 50X50 pixels to see if that's the problem.
20:35:18PaulPositionsindref - But you can get to svn log by going to homepage.. There are the last few changes, but if you click 'subversion' you'll get a few more.. And then you can click at the bottom of the screen for "last 4 weeks" or the last years or whatever..
20:35:36neepsindref: and they're 24 bit too, right?
20:36:26sindrefI am quite sure, but cannot guarantee.
20:37:20sindrefIt's working!!
20:38:06sindrefThanks for the help everyone:)
20:41:21PaulPositionsindref - nice... Now I'd suggest finding out (through the .wps file) the exact dimension it wants so you're not stuck with smallish 50px pics ;-)
20:41:46PaulPosition(Well, if the wps expects larger than 50px that is...)
20:45:28sindrefThe description of the theme says that it uses 50X50, and that's quite normal for the nano anyways.
20:47:03PaulPositionTrue.. :)
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20:50:19Slavik0329How do I get pictureflow on my ipod?
20:51:10PaulPositionSlavik - It's in svn... If you download a current build you should get it. Read too... :)
20:52:12Slavik0329My build is from a week ago
20:52:22Slavik0329were there any updates wince then?
20:52:33PaulPositionThere are *always* updates.
20:52:54PaulPositionThe pictureflow one dates back two days, so your build won't have it for sure :)
20:53:27Slavik0329oh snap
20:54:35neepwhen upgrading rockbox on the player, i assume it wipes all personal settings?
20:54:39Slavik0329if i use the automatic downloader what should i do?
20:54:59PaulPositionNever used it, I wouldn't know.
20:55:19Slavik0329does it wipe setting when you reflash?
20:56:12sindrefI am not an expert here, but I believe you can export all your settings to a .cfg file, and then use the config file when you have reinstalled rockbox
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20:58:57scorche|wSlavik0329: it should reset your settings, but you can always export them as said
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21:15:30insanepyroHello all, I was wondering if someone could help me with a database problem? I am an Ipod video 80gig, and I deleted all my old ipod files (the whole .ipod foler), and have copied a few albums to my rockbox and now want to update my database. However, when I go to build a new database, it doesnt find my new mp3s, flacs, and mp4s. It just stays at "0 found". I have let it run for about 20 min. now, and no change.
21:16:41 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
21:17:11scorche|wwhat .ipod folder?
21:17:29scorche|wdo you mean .rockbox?...and if so, did you copy over a new one from the current build page?
21:18:03insanepyroits the folder left over from the old apple firmware. It had all my old ipod songs and the ipod database. It was outside of the .rockbox folder, in the root directory. I did not delete the .rockbox folder.
21:18:55scorche|wwhat version of rockbox are you running?
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21:19:47insanepyroversion: r15727-071120
21:19:52insanepyrolatest build, i think
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21:22:06scorche|wthat isnt...could you please update to the current build?
21:22:43insanepyroyes, thanks, I did not realize that. Lets see if that does the trick.
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21:24:31scorche|wthe current build is updated anywhere from ~3-10 times a day, so people usually arent running the current build ;)
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21:26:27insanepyro;-) haha i had no idea :)
21:26:49insanepyroim having a hard time finding how to update the build, is it just a matter of copy and paste into the .rockbox folder?
21:27:02scorche|wwell, not exactly
21:27:11scorche|wjust extract the entire zip tot eh root of the device
21:27:27scorche|ws/tot eh/to the
21:28:03insanepyroso just unzip that unnamed folder into the root, and it will take care of the rest? sorry, im a bit new to the firmware; though I have been reading the guides.
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21:31:30scorche|wit shouldnt be unnamed (although if you are on a *nix-based system it is likely hidden)
21:31:39jmspeexpreglow: Yes, I've got an iaudio 7
21:32:28neephmm, just did the update, didnt wipe any of my settings.. kind of nice but i expected otherwise
21:32:31insanepyrolol haha opps, it was named .rockbox, but windows xp didnt show that inside the zip folder.
21:33:05scorche|wneep: did you want them to be reset?
21:33:25neepnope, im just pleasantly surprised :)
21:34:05scorche|wthat was changed a number of months back
21:34:25neepim new to rockbox, actually, this is my first update ive done on it
21:35:26LearIt would be annoying for the developers if the settings were wiped on each "install", as they tend to install often...
21:35:48neepyeah i can imagine
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21:37:33insanepyrogrrrr it looks like its doing the same thing again. The hard drive spins up for a second, and then it stops and finds nothing new on my ipod
21:37:51SoaaHello everyone.
21:38:04insanepyrois there a folder I must set for this, or does the database scan the whole ipod?
21:38:50Learinsanepyro: Almost the whole ipod. Not the .rockbox folder...
21:39:13scorche|winsanepyro: how did you transfer the files and what format are they?
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21:40:27insanepyrosorche: I transfered them as a copy/paste into a folder in the root directory called "Music" and "Unsorted & New". They are in three formats: flac, mp3, and mp4
21:42:41LearAnd you can see them in the file browser and play them and everything?
21:43:13insanepyroyes, they play fine when I go to the file browser. I want to use the database though, so I can play all my files on shuffle.
21:43:29insanepyronm I fixed it
21:43:48insanepyrojust deleted two database files, and now its finding everything :)
21:44:26insanepyroperhaps their files were bugged or corupted by something I did :)
21:46:02insanepyroMan I really like this rockbox firmware. It does so much! :)
21:46:31neephas anyone had any luck with the bmp resizing for album art patch?
21:47:13insanepyrothanks for all your helps guys. Im off to listen to my collection on suffle! peace
21:47:16 Quit insanepyro ()
21:47:21sindrefThe issue I had? If you are thinking of that, it's resolved.
21:47:27preglowjmspeex: are we doing a port for that? :)
21:47:59neepjust the resizing thing, i have album art working and all, but i still cant figure out why some of my album art seems to auto resize but some doesnt
21:48:15neeppatch free, straight from svn
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21:49:13pixelmapreglow: yes, port to the Iaudio 7 has started... look at the table when you configure... ;)
21:50:10*pixelma points to TMM too
21:50:28preglowdidn't he brick his? :>
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21:51:27pixelmaaccording to linuxstb he got a replacement
21:51:56preglowahh, yeah, that's right
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21:55:53jmspeexpreglow: I heard there was one in progress. For now, I'm using the original firmware, which supports Ogg
21:56:08jmspeex(they even support FLAC)
21:59:49preglownot bad
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22:12:03pikapikai was trying to install the bootloader and rockbox on an ipod 2g, but the ipodpatcher never seem to find the device, does it work through firewire ?
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22:16:11peturno firewire I think
22:16:24low_lightpixelma: hi...have time for a radio patch?
22:16:39*petur looks at amiconn
22:16:48pikapikapetur: is there another way ? :)
22:17:20peturwait, it only has firewire?
22:17:39low_lightpixelma: when you have time...
22:17:44pikapikathis is the problem :)
22:18:11amiconnIpodpatcher sure works via firewire
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22:18:21amiconnHow else would I have installed the bootloader?
22:18:34pikapikaamiconn: strange
22:19:29pikapikaamiconn: it can't find the device
22:19:37amiconnAre you trying to install on linux or macos? Not sure whether that's tested
22:19:44*amiconn installed on windows
22:19:52pikapikaamiconn: on linux
22:20:08pikapikaand nothing else to do it :)
22:20:18 Quit Soaa (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:21:16amiconnHmm. There could be 2 possible problems
22:21:33amiconn(1) You need to be root (or equivalent) for ipodpatcher to work
22:21:44pikapikatried it
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22:22:27amiconn(2) The autodetection doesn't find the ipod because linux uses different device names for firewire devices (??)
22:23:16pikapikaamiconn: could be the problem, but i don't know where it looks, not much verbose
22:23:17amiconnNot sure at all. I have a linux box as well, but without firewire interface
22:23:39Bagderpikapika: strace is your friend ;-)
22:24:03pikapikaBagder: didn't tought of this, good idea :)
22:24:19amiconnThe source is also a good candidate :)
22:24:32Bagderhaha, yeah ;-)
22:26:34amiconnOn linux it seems to check all /dev/sd?
22:27:11pikapikait is sda2
22:27:23amiconnYou need the disk device, not the partition
22:27:55 Join fasmaie [0] (
22:28:07pikapikabut my ipod software is broken on ipod, maybe it could be a problem
22:29:32preglowsure it could
22:29:37preglowyou could try restoring it before use
22:29:42preglowbefore installing rockbox, i mean
22:30:05pikapikathe problem i'm looking for now is how to restore without itunes ;)
22:30:15preglowno problem at all
22:30:31pikapikareally ?
22:30:38preglowdownload a firmware from there
22:30:59preglowthat includes an image you can just copy to the device, i believe
22:31:05 Join przemhb [0] (
22:31:17Nico_PBagder: you rejected FS #2890... any chance that you'll like FS #8314 better?
22:31:44preglowpixelma: there is a Firmware file in it, i _THINK_ you can just dd that to the raw device
22:31:51preglowpikapika: that last was to you
22:31:58pikapikayes thanks :)
22:32:05preglowpikapika: but that will overwrite everything
22:32:17pixelmalow_light: will have a look :)
22:32:20pikapikano problem, there's nothing on it
22:32:46BagderNico_P: I'm not a fan of it really, no matter the implementation
22:32:48preglowpikapika: ok, then try writing that directly to /dev/sda, or whatever root device it was
22:33:06pikapikapreglow: i'm trying this
22:33:45preglowdd if=Firmware of=/dev/sda should work out fine
22:33:50pikapikapreglow: amiconn : petur thanks for helping :)
22:34:00pikapikapreglow: i'm doing this
22:34:17Nico_PBagder: why? I did search the logs but didn't find much about the rejection
22:34:20preglowpikapika: anyway, you should also be aware that 2g ipods is buggy at the moment
22:34:44preglowfor some reason we don't know, some builds are not fucntional
22:35:00BagderNico_P: it's an edge case that complicates matters and brings little use imho
22:35:02preglowso you should find a build that works and stick to that until the problem is solved
22:35:15pikapikapreglow: i'm not using it much for the moment, it was more for fun
22:35:23preglowpikapika: then you'll be fine
22:35:27Nico_PBagder: what does it complicate? have you seen what the changes to filetree.c are?
22:35:44Bagderthey're more complicated than without
22:35:49Bagderno matter how small changes
22:35:52pikapikai used rockbox on an old archos, and wa quite impressed at the time
22:36:13Nico_Pin filetree.c it's merely a replacement of a func by an other
22:36:14BagderNico_P: let me stress the "little use" part
22:36:26Bagderbut that functin does lots
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22:37:01BagderI use 'ls' every day, it does no such weird sorting
22:37:42BagderI realize not everyone is like me, but I'm telling you my view
22:37:43Nico_Pto me the use is user friendlyness
22:38:33Nico_Pit's a feature that wouldn't affect me personally at all, like you... but I think it's the kind of detail that can be very important to a user
22:38:57preglowand i think the user should fix his broken file naming...
22:39:20BagderI would argue that most sorting do it like rockbox already does
22:39:33preglowi say we shouldn't try to fix broken things that don't function well in a broken state other places
22:39:41preglowand it won't work "right" other places either
22:40:15Nico_Ppreglow: it works "right" in the windows file explorer
22:40:15preglowif lots of other programs supported numeric sorting like this, i'd be more in favour of it
22:40:27preglowreally? are you sure that's not because it sorts by tags?
22:40:38preglowi guess not
22:40:57preglowis it an option in explorer?
22:41:04Bagderno, it just does it
22:41:15preglowi'd be more in favour of us doing that too
22:41:22preglowit'll almost always be the "right thing"
22:41:39preglowbut'll be annoying when it's not, and i don't want any kind of heuristic
22:42:00preglowso i really think we shouldn't bother, it adds more complexity, and we don't need that
22:42:18preglowall the files i have that are named like that, i've renamed
22:42:30 Nick parafin is now known as parafin|away (
22:42:33preglowand that from before i had even heard of rockbox, since it didn't work right other places
22:42:47Nico_Pyeah I did the same
22:43:23Nico_Pbut it's the kind of unnatural habit we get from using tools that were designed by people like us :)
22:43:23preglowwe've got to just draw the line at some "small but useful for fringe cases" features
22:43:27preglowor we'll end up bloated as hell
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22:44:07preglowbut then of course i'm not the right guy to ask about "small but useful for fringe cases" features these days :)
22:44:37preglowsince i'm pretty much on a crusade against them
22:45:04preglowpikapika: so, did it work, then?
22:45:31 Quit jhulst (Read error: 113 (No route to host))
22:45:34pikapikapreglow: dd doesn't work, and the disk does strange sounds for the first time
22:45:42preglowhow convenient
22:45:46preglowwhy doesn't it work?
22:45:48preglowerror message?
22:46:04amiconnThat "natural" sorting in windows explorer is often very confusing :(
22:46:20pikapikaend_request: I/O error, dev sda
22:46:26pikapikanot much exciting :)
22:46:27preglowpikapika: well, shit :)
22:46:28Nico_PI knew the welcome wouldn't be warm, I myself aren't a great supporter of the idea... I just happened to find a nice implementation and decided to port it
22:46:31amiconn(in large directories, that is)
22:46:36Nico_Pamiconn: how so?
22:47:11amiconnFiles are not were I would expect them
22:47:34 Join Zagor [242] (
22:47:45Nico_Pthat's because you're used to the unnatural sorting, isn't it?
22:48:19amiconnHence the "natural" - to me, pure alphnumeric sorting is much more natural to me.
22:48:49PaulPositionWhat's 'natural sorting' ?? Getting 1, 2, 3 instead of 1, 10, 11, ... 2, ?
22:49:18amiconnThe problem is that "natural" sorting does some heuristics to decide whether digits are to be read as numbers or as digits, and those heuristics are more often wrong than correct
22:49:30Nico_PPaulPosition: getting 1, 2, 10, 20 instead of 1, 10, 2, 20
22:49:35 Quit ender` (" It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye. Then it's fun and games you can't see.")
22:50:03 Join saratoga [0] (i=9803c6dd@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:50:25saratogapersonally i hate unnatural sorting, but can tolerate it since I'm used to it
22:50:40low_lightZagor: can you see if this helps your c200 radio...
22:51:00amiconnI never get this problem with files I named, as I always use 01, 02 etc for track numbers. And for other files, the algorithm in explorer is just nasty - often makes me overlook files
22:51:05saratogai think i can tolerate anything if its what c uses though
22:51:09PaulPositionUh... And how does file-browser using people manage to play albums in the right order right now?? by naming their files a-song, b-song, c-song or what?!
22:51:16Zagorlow_light: sure, I'll test right away
22:51:27amiconnPaulPosition: 01, 02...
22:51:28PaulPositionAh right.. duh
22:51:34pixelmalow_light: seems much better now - I can't confuse it the way I could repeatedly before. I first thought that the reception got worse but compared to the OF and that station is just a bit weak here at my place... :)
22:51:55 Quit MethoS- ("Konversation terminated!")
22:51:56pixelmathat's with the first tries
22:53:38*low_light crosses fingers
22:54:16jottamiconn: do you have a convincing example where natrual sorting fails, that outweights the obvious 1 10 2 and foo1 foo10 foo2 usefulness?
22:54:26amiconnPaulPosition: Btw, I always use the file browser for listening, and the database only very rarely to check for dupes, typos in tags etc
22:54:41 Join jhulst [0] (n=jhulst@unaffiliated/jhulst)
22:54:56amiconnjott: Try filenames with hex numbers...
22:55:25Zagoramiconn: can you send me the old explains?
22:56:20amiconnSome seem to be a bit outdated ;)
22:56:33ZagorI can imagine :)">
22:57:59scorche|wZagor: not sure if you saw, but logbot is cloaked
22:58:01amiconnThat's gathered from a few old irc logs
22:58:03 Quit DM| ("*bashes head against keyboard*")
22:58:11pixelmalow_light: judging by the short time I tried, it seems to be a big improvement :)
22:58:22Zagorscorche|w: ah, it came through now. nice.
22:59:17scorche|wwell, it isnt really a matter of coming through...the issue was that the request didnt come from the group contact and cloak changes can only be made by the group contact to prevent abuse
22:59:53Zagorscorche|w: I though you change to make linus group contact?
23:00:16 Quit sindref ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
23:00:18Zagorif not, I misunderstood. my bad.
23:00:38scorche|was well, can you let me know (in a mail or PM to scorche) how to interface with logbot (such as add explains and such) so i can add a few/make them updated/etc? (if that is desired of course)
23:00:46scorche|wno..he is the *channel* contact
23:01:41scorche|wthe group contact is a different thing and it is actually on records that freenode staff look up
23:01:44 Quit Domonoky (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:01:50Zagorahh, ok.
23:02:25#>>"docs is available here:" by Zagor (n=bjst@rockbox/developer/Zagor)
23:03:16scorche|wthat was t0mas, but after talking to RichiH, i found out that t0mas made me group contact way back when i added a ton of cloaks/started administrating the channel...this is why i have had no trouble when requesting cloaks be added, i guess :)
23:04:19Zagorglad it worked out, anyway
23:04:44scorche|wyeah...basically, he just needed to talk to me, but i didnt know that until i talked to him :)
23:05:27***SPY: Authentication failed for petur
23:05:28rp-Is there a way to wait until there is a user input? like wait_until_button_pressed(); ?
23:05:42 Quit Redbreva (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:06:04Zagorrp-: button_get(true)
23:06:26rp-thanks Zagor
23:07:04preglowdo we have some kind of rule against using "it's" in the manual or something?
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23:11:52 Quit jgarvey ("Leaving")
23:11:54rp-ok next questions, is there a way to wrap text, written with screen[].puts()? or a better way to output text? or at least a way to get possible char width of the target?
23:12:56pixelmaheh, svenska.lang does not differentiate between "recording" and "recording settings" and translates both as "inspelning" at least in the radio menu...
23:13:54preglowpixelma: what, you trying to learn swedish or something? :)
23:14:31low_lightpixelma: Good. Hopefully it works for Zagor too. An e200 user should test it too.
23:14:31pixelmaI learned a bit a while ago and use svenska in Rockbox just for fun :)
23:14:33jottrp-: there is lcd_getstringsize and LCD_WIDTH/LCD_HEIGHT
23:15:01pixelmapreglow: from time to time
23:15:15 Quit Tuplanolla (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:15:20jottrp-: and lcd_puts_scroll
23:15:23low_lightThe debug stuff can probably be removed from the patch. An maybe jhMikeS can comment on why that one bit makes a difference.
23:15:44low_lightlater. gtg.
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23:16:22rp-jott: thanks, will try that
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23:16:57Zagorlow_light: wohoo, works great
23:18:05preglowpixelma: would you know why definebyte is substituting "it's" for "it is" in his patch?
23:18:29preglowprobably just to make it nicer english
23:18:57pixelmanot sure no.
23:19:31pixelmaI think he's a native speaker, so maybe in written English that's the more accurate way
23:20:21scorche|wwell, many native english speakers incorrectly use the apostrphe in its/it's
23:20:49 Quit davina (Remote closed the connection)
23:20:49preglowwell, i do consider myself fairly experienced with english myself, and a couple of them don't make much sense
23:21:34rp-jott: thanks again, worked great
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23:22:42preglowpixelma: i'm commiting the ones i think are ok
23:23:10pixelmapreglow: I'm currently looking into his folder2directory patch and can't remember what was agreed on. But I tend to think that it really should be "directory" is the better way - at least it should stay consistent
23:23:25pixelmado you need his complete real name?
23:23:35preglowi prefer "directory"
23:23:47pixelmayes, me too
23:23:48preglowpixelma: i guess i do, do we stuff manual contributors into the ordinary CREDITS ?
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23:24:18rp-now a license question, if i want to submit a patch, where parts of the code are under the LGPL, what do i have to take care of? keep the original license text, copyright?
23:24:30preglowi like how different parts of the manual are written in wildly different styles :P
23:24:37pixelmathe manual has its own credits file but IIRC last time someone was added to both, not so sure
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23:24:38preglowrp-: yes
23:24:52amiconnThis folder vs. directory "issue" is a question of what OS one uses most
23:25:09rp-preglow: fine, thanks
23:25:35pixelmaI read that "directory" was first and M$ introduced "folder"
23:25:46amiconnNot sure which one belongs to which. AmigaOS uses yet another one - "drawer"
23:26:00Shaidthough they were also called directories under AmigaOS
23:26:13Shaidand, at times, folders
23:26:17Shaidso it's not really consistent
23:26:40peturdoesn't mac also use the term folder?
23:27:11*amiconn still *uses* an Amiga :)
23:27:38Shaidmy 1200 is over there
23:27:40*Shaid points
23:27:45peturpoor amiconn :P
23:27:53 Quit Frazz (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:28:10amiconnNah, of course it's not the only machine. But the mailer is nice, and I'm used to it
23:28:45amiconnRather puristic in that it doesn't support html, but very flexible otherwise
23:28:54preglowsounds like a good thing to me
23:28:59preglownever was html mail's biggest fan
23:29:51Zagorncurses mail reader and "directory" over "folder" here too. is it an age issue perhaps? :)
23:30:06 Quit fasmaie (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:30:26peturbah... data abort when recording on H10 :(
23:30:40amiconnI have no strong opinion regarding directory vs. folder (vs. drawer).
23:31:11amiconnI would probably use folder just because it's short
23:31:34peturisn't it supposed to reboot when pressing play?
23:32:16 Quit faemir (Remote closed the connection)
23:32:24mokkurkalveusually MS users tend to use "folder" while *nix users tend to use "directory"....
23:33:11peturMSs always used directory in the past, I think they started using folder when win95 came along
23:33:29saratogai thought folder was a macos thing, since they always had a file folder icon
23:35:05 Quit midgey ()
23:35:26mokkurkalveOK - I don't know too much 'bout the Apple world... just sharing my impression on how it's used today...
23:46:15preglowbut ok, should i add manual contributors to the usual CREDITS file too?
23:47:30Shaidwhy not, they contributed to the project.
23:47:43preglowi agree, i just want to know if there's some hidden policy here :)
23:50:25 Quit MethoS- ("Konversation terminated!")
23:51:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
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23:57:11pixelmaIIRC the purpose of the own credits file was to use it as a list of authors somewhere
23:57:20 Part przemhb ("User is away.")
23:57:56pixelmaor contributors

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