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#rockbox log for 2008-02-14

00:00:41 Quit Kiro (Client Quit)
00:01:49 Join scorche` [0] (n=42c007b2@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
00:01:49 Quit scorche` (Client Quit)
00:02:24 Join neskaya [0] (i=featherd@wiktionary/neskaya)
00:03:19*stripwax finds this rather amusing
00:03:34webguest70how hard is it to reprogram MP3 Player?
00:03:47stripwaxwebguest70 - which mp3 player?
00:04:05webguest70Coby MP-C7082
00:04:47stripwaxI don't think I've heard of that one before. Certainly rockbox doesn't currently run on it.. are you a developer?
00:05:00webguest70No. Not really
00:05:03 Join LawliPop|Len| [0] (
00:05:13 Quit barrywardell ()
00:05:14 Join scorche` [0] (n=42c007b2@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
00:05:20LawliPop|Len|If your file does not have the .mpg, .mpeg, .mpv or .m2v extension, you will need to use the "Open With..." context menu option and choose "mpegplayer". <<<
00:05:26LawliPop|Len|How would I go about doing this?
00:05:30LawliPop|Len|on a sansa e200
00:05:37webguest70Currently I am programming for FIRST Robotics competition
00:05:53rasherLawliPop|Len|: hold down the center button (called Select in documentation)
00:05:57webguest70I mean our own team
00:06:08LawliPop|Len|Ok, let me try that.
00:06:09 Join blithe [0] (
00:06:33rasherLawliPop|Len|: Be aware though, that the file must still be an mpeg-1 or mpeg-2 movie.
00:06:47stripwaxwebguest70 - do you know anything about the hardware that the Coby uses? i.e. is it even programmable?
00:07:10 Quit robin0800 (" HydraIRC -> <- Would you like to know more?")
00:07:33webguest70well they claim that if needed be, they will have firmware available for download on their website
00:07:39webguest70but they don't have anything
00:07:50webguest70and the firmware is really bad
00:08:36*gevaerts 's previous player also claimed firmware upgradability, but google hadn't ever heard of the brand...
00:08:52stripwaxwebguest70 - can you find out more about the hardware itself? what processor it has for example.
00:09:37LawliPop|Len|Hmm, looks like the video and sound is way off sync.
00:09:54stripwaxwebguest70 - does it have any firmware files (even if a file for the current version of the firmware is available would help identify its innards)
00:10:03 Join tatsudoshi [0] (
00:10:29 Join Absinthe [0] (
00:11:24LawliPop|Len|Made it show FPS, and it's really low (around 15-16fps).
00:11:33LawliPop|Len|Was working fine yesterday.
00:11:57webguest70I wish they did, because then I could try and re-download it
00:12:01 Quit scorche|w ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:12:42LloreanLawliPop|Len|: If you didn't know how to play it until you came in here and asked today, how was it working fine yesterday?
00:13:04 Nick scorche` is now known as scorche|w (n=42c007b2@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
00:13:06LawliPop|Len|I'm talking about another mpg file, not the one that I was just talking about.
00:13:32webguest70I can't seem to find anything online
00:14:18tatsudoshihello guys. I am looking for a way contact the rb team to offer my assistance, so is this 'the' place?
00:14:32 Join dreeft [0] (n=dreeft@
00:14:44 Join crzyboyster [0] (n=6210f0c5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:15:01rashertatsudoshi: It's not a bad place, speak away. The rockbox-dev mailinglist is another option.
00:15:10 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
00:15:21stripwaxwebguest70 - it sounds like you might be out of luck in that case, unless you are able to identify more about the hardware on your own (example: take it apart and take photos. you may not be willing to do that, of course!)
00:15:25 Quit Absinthe ("Leaving")
00:15:40LloreanLawliPop|Len|: Well how did you encode the video that's having problems?
00:15:52webguest70I can do that but not right now
00:16:14crzyboysterWhat does everyone think of the new gigabeat version of cabbiev2? > all the way at the bottom. Is it ready to commit and approved?
00:16:40LawliPop|Len|All I know was that it was converted through an rm converter at 220X176, 30fps, 196 bitrate, and don't remember the rest.
00:17:00tatsudoshiwell I mainly do big pro web solutions (administrative systems) but have exp with java. Is rb in C(++) ?
00:17:30webguest70do you have another way I can contact you after cracking it open and snaping pictures?
00:17:38 Join webguest29 [0] (n=4a8e5fd8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:17:40LloreanLawliPop|Len|: Then it's a little hard for anyone to help you, since we can't know it if you don't know it. Why not try using one of the recommended means of converting in the wiki.
00:18:05LawliPop|Len|Whoops, I meant to say "ok".
00:18:13 Join klaatu_ [0] (n=sXe@
00:18:40webguest70do you have another way I can contact you after cracking it open and snaping pictures?
00:18:40webguest70stripwax -
00:19:08webguest29Hello, I am looking for the logs for yesterdays date. Where can I find it. I am in Indiana, so I dont know what the time difference is?!?
00:19:20 Quit klaatu_ (Client Quit)
00:19:26stripwaxanother way? rockbox mailing list, irc, rockbox forums, .. all of those things should be sufficient. note you probably don't want/need to contact *me* - any interested developer would be interested in the information
00:20:10 Join jhulst_ [0] (
00:20:43webguest70Oh, OK Thanks
00:21:41toffe82webguest70: :
00:23:19 Join cool_walking_ [0] (
00:23:30crzyboysterI have noticed something odd about the brickmania game. A while ago (1-2 months maybe) the scrolling in the game was "smooth" and not "blocky" like it is right now. I remember when I first started using rockbox, the paddle scrolling was "blocky" and then some time ago it became "smooth" and now it's back to "blocky".Anyone know what I'm talking about and why it happened?
00:24:03webguest29not realy helpful. I looked through all of the reecent ones, but i couldent find the one i was looking for.
00:24:17 Part tatsudoshi
00:24:33scorche|wcrzyboyster: are you playing music as well?
00:25:37crzyboysterLet me try it with or without that music on... and what does everyone think of committing the new gigabeat cabbiev2?
00:26:02scorche|wis that a yes?
00:26:20webguest29I need to fin a post that was made at approximatley 10:00 my time pm
00:26:38scorche|wwebguest29: well, if it was said, it is in there..
00:26:53Lloreancrzyboyster: Seriously, you don't need to ask about the theme over and over
00:27:33 Quit klaatu (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:27:50EZ-Surferjeez... this is killin me... can somebody tell me for sure... does the arm branch instruction b 0x30 set pc to 0x30 or does it set the pc to pc + 0x30?
00:27:55crzyboysterIt happens both with and without the music on... and by "smooth" I mean like the "Brick" game in the original apple os
00:29:36stripwaxEZ-Surfer - b 0x00000030 jumps to address 0x00000030.
00:30:02Lloreancrzyboyster: The most helpful thing you could do is track down when it changed, then. Nobody can fix it if they don't know what went wrong
00:30:57LawliPop|Len|Seems that the problem was the 220X176 resolution, thanks for your help.
00:31:03EZ-Surferthnks stripwax.... thats what I thought happend, but then I read some documents that say it's pc+offset
00:31:08LawliPop|Len|I can idle here, right?
00:32:07 Quit webguest70 ("CGI:IRC")
00:32:07 Quit crzyboyster ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:32:45webguest29was anyone online when scorche kicked that eso guy?
00:33:07scorche|wim sure plenty were...
00:33:12*scorche|w coughs
00:33:20stripwaxEZ-Surfer - it depends what you're looking at exactly. I think the opcode contains a relative address rather than absolute.. but the convention in disassembly output is to show the (calculated..) absolute address.
00:33:33stripwaxsorry if that wasn't clear
00:34:45webguest29He was a creep
00:34:46EZ-Surferah... that makes a whole lot more sense
00:35:56 Quit gregzx ("ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox]")
00:38:13gevaertsFrom my reading of the UTMI spec, it looks like it doesn't export any registers to the system, so there's nothing to configure there
00:38:23***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
00:39:03stripwaxis the problem that bytes 33,34,35 are garbaged, or that three bytes get inserted in between real bytes 32 & 33 ?
00:39:39rasherThey get zeroed
00:39:43 Quit xnyhps ("Zzzzz")
00:39:46gevaertsstripwax: Every 32-byte block starts with 29 good bytes and then has 3 zero bytes
00:40:09gevaertsThe bytes that survive are correct and in the right place
00:40:11rasherAt least, I've never seen anything but zeroes, but might it be "random memory which happens to be zeroes"?
00:40:37 Quit JdGordon|w (" ajax IRC Client")
00:40:43rasherNot that it changes much (yet anyway)
00:42:12 Join delorean90 [0] (n=4665a4a4@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:42:39webguest29i cant open the help tool bar. it gives me an error on the status page
00:42:49delorean90hello, has anyone here been expiriencing battery issues with thier h10 20gb on the latest builds?
00:43:19n1srasher: are bytes 30, 31 and 32 overwritten or do they come aftewr the three zeroed bytes?
00:43:31rashern1s: they are overwritten.
00:44:36 Quit jhMikeS (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
00:44:43 Quit Rob2222 ()
00:45:57 Join jhMikeS [50] (n=jethead7@rockbox/developer/jhMikeS)
00:46:11 Quit conando (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
00:46:18preglowgevaerts: still, a quick compare with disk mode might still be enlightening
00:46:33 Join JdGordon|w [0] (i=836b004b@gateway/web/ajax/
00:47:34gevaertspreglow: obviously, but my arm assembly knowledge is still not good
00:48:13 Quit delorean90 ("CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)")
00:48:25preglowgevaerts: well, for what it's worth, it's not hard to learn :)
00:49:30*gevaerts is now searching the web for possible further information on the controller
00:49:53 Join webguest30 [0] (n=3e4f4094@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
00:52:42*webguest29 is annoyed at scorche
00:53:01gevaertspreglow: so you know it ? ;-)
00:53:08preglowgevaerts: yeah
00:53:22scorche|wwebguest29: do i really have to ban you again?
00:53:38*gevaerts thinks preglow knows what he is suggesting...
00:53:51rasherwebguest29: The help button doesn't work. It'll be fixed in time. (hint hint Zagor)
00:54:08preglowgevaerts: no time, i'm afraid :>
00:54:54 Quit webguest29 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:56:19 Quit ompaul (Client Quit)
00:56:27 Quit n1s ()
00:57:13 Quit webguest30 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
00:57:25preglowon that note, it's bed time!
00:57:46gevaertsWould anyone like to guess what a 5 bit long field called VUSB_HS_DEV_EP in a register called HWDEVICE actually means ? I guess it somehow indicates the number of endpoints, but how is that encoded ? As a mask, a number ? And if a number, in and out combined, or pairs ?
00:58:22*gevaerts thinks the iMX31 manual just copied a part from the ARC manual, but they forgot some bits
00:59:08 Quit ender` (" There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and UNIX. We don't believe this to be a coincidence. -- Jeremy")
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01:00:53stripwaxgevaerts - if I google for that, i get exactly one hit ...
01:01:37 Quit Weiss (Remote closed the connection)
01:02:06stripwaxgevaerts - page 105 help?
01:02:12rasherstripwax: ain't that interesting
01:03:36 Quit dreeft (Connection reset by peer)
01:03:36 Quit Llorean (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
01:03:36rasherYay for google indexing pdfs
01:03:37 Join dft [0] (n=dreeft@
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01:05:06 Part pixelma
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01:06:28gevaertsstripwax: looks like another user of the same USB core. No new information though
01:07:23 Quit spiorf (Remote closed the connection)
01:07:52 Quit lee-qid ("aufwiederbyebientotsayonara")
01:08:24stripwaxwonder if they have the same dma controller
01:11:47 Quit petur ("Zzzz")
01:16:13 Quit stripwax ("Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier.")
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01:25:29 Part toffe82
01:28:56Kernelhello all. im trying to update my rockbox using the rockbox utility to do this..but it says it cant download the latest
01:29:35Kernelhttp error 2
01:30:56 Quit LawliPop|Len| (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
01:35:05 Quit jhulst_ ("Konversation terminated!")
01:36:19 Join csc` [0] (n=csc@archlinux/user/csc)
01:39:28krazykitKernel, if rbutil is giving errors like that, download the latest build from the site and simply unzip it to the root of your device
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01:41:55 Join Inv1s1ble [0] (
01:43:05 Quit RoC_MasterMind ("Leaving")
01:43:53Inv1s1blehow do I get write permission to the wiki? I want to add the Sony XA-110IP to the accessory page
01:44:05Inv1s1ble(as being incompatible)
01:44:15 Join moos [0] (
01:44:27Inv1s1bleman I knew I should have bought a Kenwood
01:47:42rasherInv1s1ble: What's your wiki name?
01:49:14rasherInv1s1ble: done
01:55:22 Join asdrubal [0] (
01:56:59Inv1s1ble:) I made a minor contribution
01:57:03asdrubalDoes anyone experience lockups when rocording in sansa ?
01:57:25Inv1s1bleI gotta start developing stuff again
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01:59:11 Quit austriancoder_ (Remote closed the connection)
01:59:17Amonerhello, guys
01:59:29Amoneri got a question
01:59:52 Join linuxstb [0] (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
02:00:24Amoneri am trying to instal rockbox on sansa e250. but when i restart my sansa it loads the old version not the rockbox one...
02:01:31linuxstbHave you installed the Rockbox bootloader? Either by running sansapatcher or rbutil?
02:02:32 Quit BitTorment (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
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02:18:51asdrubalDoes anyone experience lockups when rocording in sansa ?
02:20:25advlaptop2019asdrubal, i dont have it.. are you using the latest build
02:21:18asdrubalHow do I tell what build I have?
02:21:30asdrubaldoes rbutil grab latest builds?
02:22:12krazykitsystem -> rockbox info for the build, and yes
02:22:55asdrubalkrazykit, I have it mounted from OF right now.. can I tell somehow in the filesystem?
02:23:19krazykitthere is, as i recall, a rockbox-info.txt in the .rockbox directory
02:23:37 Quit gtkspert_ (Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable))
02:23:42asdrubalManufacturer: sandisk
02:23:42asdrubalVersion: r16287-080211
02:25:31asdrubalkrazykit, should I run rbutil again?
02:26:05krazykitoh, i don't know about your problem. i've never had any crashes, but i've not done any serious recording
02:26:29asdrubalI can't do anything in record screen.. crashes on any keypress
02:26:54*gevaerts decides to stop studying usb specs and code, and go to sleep
02:27:02 Quit gevaerts ("Leaving")
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02:38:27***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
02:38:53asdrubalrecording locks up .... I can't record anything
02:41:14 Quit waldo (Remote closed the connection)
02:41:32asdrubalJust wondering if this is a sansa problem in general or just a sansa c200 probloem
02:42:49krazykitmaybe it's a filesystem problem. have to used fsck or scandisk (or whatever windows calls it)?
02:44:17advlaptop2019asdrubal, what format are you using in rockbox
02:44:45 Quit homielowe (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
02:44:46asdrubalkrazykit, yeah I did that
02:44:56asdrubaladvlaptop2019, I'm trying to record to mp3
02:45:10asdrubalkrazykit, I used fsck.vfat
02:46:01advlaptop2019asdrubal, i just did it on my e200 series and had no issue
02:46:21asdrubalwhat are you record settings?
02:46:28asdrubaldo you have it on mono,22khz ?
02:47:46advlaptop2019asdrubal, what bitrate?
02:47:50 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
02:47:53asdrubal64 and 96 both failed
02:48:04asdrubalI did file split
02:48:06asdrubal30 minutes
02:49:08advlaptop2019asdrubal, how long are you recording for?
02:49:09asdrubaladvlaptop2019, are you recording from mic or fm ?
02:49:21asdrubaladvlaptop2019, It freezes on any button press
02:49:36asdrubalwhat does prerecord time mean?
02:49:43advlaptop2019asdrubal, from mic
02:51:28asdrubaladvlaptop2019, could be a c200 issue
02:51:38asdrubalI don't know if any devs have a c200 or not
02:51:49krazykita few do.
02:58:19 Quit neskaya ("system restart or something.")
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03:37:04webguest59hey people, i got a question about sansa e250... i cannot really run any games or anything...
03:37:32psycho_maniacwhats your question?
03:37:43Absinthewhat sort of games? the default ones or gameboy roms?
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03:39:23webguest59default ones i click on them and in a corner the cd sign shows up, and nothing happens
03:40:48Absinthewhat player?
03:41:36psycho_maniache said sansa e250
03:42:50 Join spr0k3t [0] (
03:42:54Absinthesorry..i accidentally disconnected. That is the same as mine.
03:43:20Absinthedo you have the latest build?
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03:44:12***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
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03:44:19Absintheno I mean off the rockbox site
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03:45:09webguest45once that came with it
03:45:17webguest45with the rockbox
03:46:07Absinthego to System>Version. What does it say?
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03:48:55webguest45can't open
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03:50:01psycho_maniacwhy cant you open that?
03:50:31webguest45i will be back
03:50:37psycho_maniacGo to the main menu. Click on System, Then click on Rockbox Info
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03:51:19psycho_maniacI would suggest to get the latest build and or just get a new version of what you have. might currupt files
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03:51:21***Server message 505: 'logbot :Private messages from unregistered users are currently blocked due to spam problems, but you can always message a staffer. Please register! ( )'
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03:51:39Amoneri am back
03:51:42Amonerthat was me with e250
03:51:48Amoneri just instaled the mIRC
03:51:53Amonercause online version was too slow
03:52:03Amonerwell i installed the rockbox
03:52:09Amonerbut half of it doesnt really work
03:52:15Amonerlike there is no background picture
03:52:20Amonereven after downloading
03:52:50Amonerif i go to the system - version it pops up with an error tht cant open
03:53:04psycho_maniacGo to the main menu. Click on System, Then click on Rockbox Info
03:53:24psycho_maniacredownload the for your specific player.
03:53:48Absintheor the qt utility
03:53:54Absintheits easier
03:54:00Amonershould i erase everything?
03:54:23Absintheyes, but obviously back up your music.
03:54:25Amonercause i tried reinstaling
03:54:43Amonerwell i dont really care about music
03:54:48Amoneri can always put it on
03:55:12psycho_maniaci dont understand why you have to erase the music because plugins will not work?
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03:55:30Amonerwell i just returnet it
03:55:40Amonerto the original firmware
03:56:01psycho_maniaci dont understand what you are saying
03:56:12klaatuscorche: ping
03:56:30*scorche waves
03:56:38klaatuscorche: what up? what should i cut out?
03:57:18asdrubalwhat is the key presses I need to do to get my sansa into DISK mode/
03:57:33asdrubalinstead of mtp
03:57:45krazykitasdrubal, it's in the OF settings
03:57:57Amonerjust let me get this straight, if i have e250 can i have a background on my sansa or no?
03:58:05krazykitAmoner, yes you can
03:59:04asdrubalkrazykit, my settings don't have that option
03:59:06Amonerk i got it =)
03:59:14krazykitasdrubal, do you have an e200r?
03:59:56Amonersweet thanks guys ;)
03:59:57asdrubalI have a c240
04:00:11asdrubalthere is no option to set anything regarding usb in my sansa
04:00:16asdrubalthis is OF
04:00:28krazykitah. maybe you have the firmware version without MSC mode. there's something on the wiki about what version you need
04:01:09asdrubalso I can't do msc mode?
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04:03:13krazykitasdrubal, you can, you just have to change the OF to get the option. either that, or there's also a workaround, but you'd have to check yourself.
04:03:43asdrubalis it difficult to downgrade firmware?
04:03:55krazykitnot particularly
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04:04:33LloreanIt's not necessary to downgrade though
04:04:53ddaltonwhere do I get rbutil from and is it gtk? (linux one) if it is gtk does anyone know of a command line version? and can the cli version do talkclips?
04:04:55LloreanIf you turn on the hold switch and hold a button (I can't remember which, left maybe) while inserting USB, it'll do UMS mode
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04:05:39krazykitddalton, read the manual for the link, they're all written in QT, and the command-line version is still very new, though the recent SVN commits should give you some indication of usability
04:06:01maxftballi have a sansa e260 and when i play movies there is 1/8th of an inch at the top that is not being used and the video is cut off on the right (using it turned sideways)
04:06:24maxftballis there any way to get it centered?
04:06:30ddaltonoh qt... damn. so thats not accessible at all?
04:06:34Lloreanmaxftball: What resolution did you encode at?
04:06:50maxftballlet em check
04:07:10krazykitddalton, it's supposed to be.
04:07:16ddaltonso if I update my svn to the latest can I just build the cli version of rbutil?
04:07:39ddaltonlet me see...
04:08:06ddaltonhow do I build it?
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04:09:34asdrubalLlorean, that method doesn't work for me
04:10:01Lloreanasdrubal: Did you follow the actual method as posted, wherever it's posted, or just try to get it from my brief guess here?
04:10:09asdrubalWith the device off, engage the hold switch, press and hold the rewind button, plug the device in your computer. If done correctly, the Sansa will be recognized as an MSC device.
04:10:23maxftball240 high 320 wide
04:10:29asdrubalLlorean, doesn't work
04:10:31Lloreanasdrubal: Not with the device off.
04:10:58Lloreanasdrubal: Boot the device into the firmware. Once it's fully booted, and not plugged into the computer, THEN engage the hold switch. Then while holding down the rewind button, insert the USB cable
04:11:17asdrubalill try
04:11:18Lloreanmaxftball: That's far larger than the dimensions of the sansa's screen.
04:11:25rashermaxftball: That's the wrong resolution. The e200 is 176x220 (or 220x176 when rotated)
04:11:40LloreanEncode at 220x176 for the e200, yes (or smaller)
04:11:45maxftballyea i didnt think about it when i encoded it
04:12:12asdrubalLlorean, ok that worked
04:12:17Absinthedoes anyone know about the status of the sansa view port?
04:12:22Lloreanmaxftball: Well, generally speaking, you should follow the directions for using software before asking why it's not working.
04:12:27LloreanAbsinthe: There is no status
04:13:04Absintheso it's in the "why dont you learn assembly and get to work if you really want it" stage?
04:13:23LloreanMore or less
04:14:45Absinthealright. Hardware's pretty different, though the mi4 format remains, right.
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04:15:14krazykitthis information should already be in the thread in the New Ports forum
04:15:38AbsintheThanks- Ill check it out
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04:29:10J3TC-Does the rockbox cabbie theme included in the normal build uses viewports/viewports list?
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04:30:22ED209are there any h300 users/coders here at the moment?
04:31:18J3TC-I was just wondering since the themes that uses viewports/viewports list seems to freeze when you try to shut down the player (in this case the X5)
04:32:10psycho_maniacI thought viewports werent comitted yet? :S
04:33:29ddaltonhey you guys know rbutil is completely inaccessible on linux? even orca says so I can not even use flat review or activate menus...
04:33:34ED209I'm wondering if there can be a realtime pitch shifter using the mic or line in, and have it playback in realtime
04:33:37ddaltonits because its in qt...
04:33:41ED209how difficult woudl that be
04:34:01ddaltonanyone know where I can get the command line one from?
04:34:54Absinthedoesnt kde use qt
04:35:29ddaltondunno kde isn't accessible.
04:35:34ddaltononly gnome is.
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04:36:05LloreanHe means "usable by the blind" in this specific instance.
04:36:22J3TC-psycho_maniac: No it's not ;)
04:36:55J3TC-I need to find another theme that uses viewports/viewports list
04:37:29ddaltondid anyone actually test with orca?
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04:39:38speeddemon8803How exactly do i put rockbox on my ipod nano 1st gen? i tried...and i almost succeded into turning it into a paperweight, I had to reinstall my os to get it to mount it.
04:41:00LloreanAt what step in the manual did you encounter that problem?
04:42:11ED209I'm wondering how difficult it would be to make a realtime pitch shifter, that takes a signal from the line in and pitch shifts it, then sends it out the headphones... for an iriver h300
04:42:29speeddemon8803i basically grabbed rockbox, I copied all the files to the ipod itself....deleted the original ipod firmware (but i had it backed up)
04:42:50speeddemon8803i thought it would be as simple as copy/paste....not so
04:43:10psycho_maniacwow you really should of read the manual first.
04:43:46LloreanED209: You already asked that.
04:43:53speeddemon8803I skimmed the manual!
04:44:08Lloreanspeeddemon8803: READ the manual. How did you even delete the original firmware, it's in a hidden inaccessible partition.
04:44:24ED209nobody answered my question so I thought I'd elaborate
04:44:58speeddemon8803when i open up my ipod in linux..what are the files and folders that i see?
04:44:59LloreanED209: "Elaborate" generally means add more information. Perhaps you meant reiterate?
04:45:03speeddemon8803is that the firmware?
04:45:06Lloreanspeeddemon8803: No.
04:45:33Lloreanspeeddemon8803: Just either files you've copied to it, settings, or crud that will be recreated each time you use the original firmware. actually didnt do anything "major"
04:45:58ED209I meant elaborate, I added one extra "spec"
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04:46:49ED209no offense but am I gonna be getting pedantic comments the whole time in this channel? or are there coders here who might have some ideas?
04:47:10LloreanED209: What extra did you add? You'd already told us you were interested in it for the H300.
04:48:27speeddemon8803um...ok, aparently i didnt go all the way through the steps...because when i try to download ipodpatcher...i got to this page with a lot of garbled junk
04:48:30LloreanAnyway, realtime pitchshifting is probably possible if you want to work on it.
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04:48:48speeddemon8803it doesnt "download" anything..just sends me to a page that looks white with a lot of junk on it..
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04:48:52Lloreanspeeddemon8803: Right click and choose to save it, rather than clicking on it. Your browser is being weird.
04:49:07speeddemon8803im using ubuntu...might be my problem
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04:50:06Absinthedoes it say "index of"?
04:50:27speeddemon8803talking to me?
04:51:02speeddemon8803it looks almost like..well...when you open up an executable file as a text file
04:51:12LloreanIt's because you have opened an executable as a text file.
04:51:15LloreanI already told you how to solve it.
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04:51:26speeddemon8803its NOT that simple
04:51:37speeddemon8803ubuntu does not have that kind of option
04:52:19krazykityes it does.
04:52:26Absinthewhat browser?
04:52:27speeddemon8803really? where?
04:52:40krazykitright click on the link, click "save link as..."
04:52:43scorche"Save Page As...
04:52:44psycho_maniacright click save link as
04:52:50scorcheeither way
04:54:37speeddemon8803ok, im an sorry
04:54:51*speeddemon8803 exits peacefully outta here
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04:55:01speeddemon8803have a good one guys, sorry for the trouble :)
04:55:24speeddemon8803it definately executed like intended that way
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04:57:37speeddemon8803suhweet..bootloader installed successfully
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05:11:41psycho_maniacinstalling rockbox on my 2nd gigabeat was much easier. all i did was switch the hard drives. haha
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05:32:56J3TC-It seems if there is too much viewport code, it freezes while shutting down
05:35:41LloreanJ3TC-: "too much" isn't a terribly objective term. Done much testing to quantify?
05:36:55J3TC-Well, I'm not the one testing. Hweb21 does a lot of x5 themes and he uses my builds. We noticed that 2 of out 3 of his themes freezes while shutting down.
05:37:28J3TC-I don't know anything about wps coding so I can't say much but that's what he commented. He did say he'll do more testing tomorrow
05:37:49LloreanSo what you're saying is "I haven't tested it with only the one viewports patch"?
05:37:53J3TC-I also used the viewports theme in the wiki and those didn't give me the freezing shutdown behavior
05:38:48J3TC-Well, it's tested using viewports, viewports list and multifont. One of them doesn't used the viewports list code but still gave the same freezing shutdown.
05:38:58LloreanBut it could be multifont.
05:38:59J3TC-So the two patches responsible is multifonts and viewports
05:39:00LloreanPlease test without it.
05:39:16J3TC-I will but more than likely it'd be viewports so just saying
05:39:23LloreanAnd once you've verified which patch causes the problem, report the issue and what needs to be known to reproduce it in the task for that patch
05:39:45J3TC-I think it's probably too much being for the buffer?
05:40:35LloreanIf there's too much data for the WPS buffer, then you simply don't get all the images in the WPS.
05:40:49LloreanUnless multifont is abusing the buffer somehow.
05:40:58LloreanBut please, just do some testing, and report it on the task
05:40:58J3TC-Hrmm, I see
05:41:14LloreanWhoever maintains the patch may not be around ,and anyone new interested in working on it may not see it here
05:41:36J3TC-Of course, I'm just saying what's happening right now to find out more about it
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05:42:21goffahow's the new lcd code for the gigabeat?
05:42:26goffaworth the upgrade?
05:43:14Lloreangoffa: Why *not* upgrade?
05:43:28goffalaziness :)
05:43:34LloreanYou'd be done by now.
05:43:37Lloreantwo or three times over
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05:50:38Davide-NYCI have a question for any developer that is reading this. If I modify a function in firmware/drivers/ata.c, make, and finally make zip. Have I done anything to the bootloader?
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05:52:09Davide-NYCbut isn;t the bootloader separate from the contents ot the .rockbox directory?
05:52:42JdGordon|zzzoh wait... yeah you didnt touch the bl
05:53:24Davide-NYCso there is no serious danger in deleting the .rockbox dir on my player and then unzipping this modified build to it.
05:53:39Davide-NYCit would be just like an updated build, but possibley broken (by me)
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06:04:23Davide-NYCMy H1x0-CF experiment fails a second night in a row. :(
06:05:24JdGordonwell duh! :p
06:05:39JdGordonif your getting an ata error its from the bootloader not beign able to read the CF card
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06:19:10Davide-NYCJdGordon: There are maybe a dozen folks that are very stoked about this mod. (myself included) There is some possible bad info floating around forums. According to Siar (from the forums) he had resolved the problem simply by makeing the zip file and extracting the .rockbox folder.
06:19:27Davide-NYCIt didn;t make sense to me but he reported success so I tried it.
06:19:36Davide-NYCSee here:
06:20:08Davide-NYCBigBambi: ping
06:20:40psycho_maniacmay i ask why you want a cf card in your player?
06:21:16Davide-NYCTwo reasons: No spin up noise during recording and no buffer under-runs of shaken.
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06:21:43Davide-NYCPlus it'll be lighter and more reliable.
06:21:47Davide-NYCFour reasons
06:26:18JdGordonCF in the irivers would make them amazing
06:29:03LloreanDavide-NYC: I'm pretty sure someone mentioned that the fix in the forum thread isn't a "fix" so much as a hack anyway
06:29:39Davide-NYCI think there is a piece missing to some of these success stories.
06:30:57Davide-NYCThe question is, when using a particular CF card, whether the bootloader loads and *then* rockbox fails, which is solved by the ata.c sleep hack, or whether the bootloader fails with an ATA error. (as in my case)
06:31:57Davide-NYCbecause the ata.c hack doesn;t touch the bootloader. Which to me means that the failure happened after the bootloader stage.
06:32:24Davide-NYC(in those instances where the ata.c hack actually produces a successful result)
06:34:06LloreanI don't see how the bootloader can work without an ata driver.
06:34:46Davide-NYCThe bootloader isn't being compiled in this instance. So the ata driver is there as it always is.
06:35:42LloreanBut as it is, if I recall it was said that we aren't doing timing properly
06:35:55LloreanA real fix would require a bootloader change, it may be more or less chance that it's getting past it.
06:36:38Davide-NYCBy more or less chance you mean brand and model of CF card, right?
06:36:58LloreanDavide-NYC: But what confused me was that you said "the changes don't touch the bootloader." If They do, but you didn't install a modified one, that's different.
06:37:08psycho_maniacwould be nice if it was just a bootloader change. then could there be a chance that bootloader would be hosted on the rockbox wiki page?
06:37:34Davide-NYCIs this the timing you speak of?
06:37:55LloreanDavide-NYC: I honestly don't know, I wasn't paying much attention and someone else was talking about it.
06:38:04LloreanI think amiconn
06:38:32***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
06:39:07J3TC-Llorean: You maybe right
06:39:35Davide-NYCamiconn: why is it that certain CF card seem to work with RB on an iRiver H1x0 and other's do not? Is there a way to correct this across all targets for most (if not all) CF cards?
06:39:43J3TC-I just compiled three builds. First was viewports..the said theme shut down just fine then the 2nd build with viewports list. Again that worked
06:40:01J3TC-And using the multifont along with those 2, it froze up while shutting down
06:40:34J3TC-I would apply just the multifont but it's dependent on both of them I think.
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07:31:43amiconnLlorean: Someone with a nano should dump the ata identify block. I asked for that multiple times already.......
07:34:02scorcheamiconn: what does one need to do?
07:36:12*amiconn just found a waste of ram in the ata driver....
07:36:50amiconnThe identify info is one sector, but the array is defined as static unsigned short identify_info[SECTOR_SIZE];
07:36:55amiconnThat's 2 sectors....
07:40:31amiconnscorche: It would need a simple function that dumps said array (defined in ata.c) to disk, and then posting that binary dump file somewhere
07:41:09amiconnIt can't be done in ata_init() as at this point the fat driver is not yet initialised, and the array is static, so it requires a bit of fiddling
07:41:38amiconnMaybe I should provide a patch...
07:43:34scorchethat probably would be quickest
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07:44:28amiconnWhat I want to check is whether the nano's flash disk reports that it does not support the power management feature set
07:44:41amiconnThat would explain why sending it the sleep command makes it freeze
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07:45:12amiconnAnd it might be the same problem when using CF cards
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07:45:44amiconnOur ata driver would have to learn to check for that feature, and only use it if present -> no more special hack for nano or CF cards necessary
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07:58:25amiconnHmm, there already is a function for accessing the idenitify info from outside ata.c. That makes dumping it simple...
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08:07:56scorcheamiconn: sorry, but i need to go to bed now...if no one has dumped the info for you by the same time tomorrow, i will
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08:24:47Buschelamiconn: you there?
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08:28:56*GodEater wonders if he should wade into the XML settings argument further with a "and I just loathe XML on principle, I've yet to see a decent argument for it's use" sort of statement
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08:35:22LloreanI think having RBUtil as a quick way for a novice user to create presets like "Car" "Audiobook" "Home Stereo" and others isn't a bad idea.
08:35:59LloreanWhether XML is necessary, I dunno. I could see an XML file being generated with builds, that RBUtil can parse to see what are valid settings for that build, but that's about it. And it doesn't have to be XML.
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08:36:40LloreanSetting up a variety of presets in Rockbox, and especially the bit where you trim out all the unneeded settings, is a hassle if you're trying to do it just on the device, and still not entirely annoyance free even with a PC.
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08:39:41LloreanEven "RB as an app" would suffer from the current hassle unless a much better settings input method was designed for the PC-app version of it.
08:41:34LloreanNor would it natively have a way to know the valid range for hardware dependent settings.
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08:44:06GodEaterI still fail to see the necessity for XML as a parser
08:44:15GodEaterpresumably Rockbox already has code to parse it's existing format
08:44:18GodEaterwhy not use that ?
08:44:32LloreanI don't see the need to use XML as a parser.
08:45:02GodEaterI don't see the need to use it ever anywhere :)
08:45:48LloreanWe just need something like features.txt but describing the settings menu, and valid values for each setting, to be included with builds so that RButil can be pointed at a device with Rockbox installed, and know what the settings are named, and their ranges. It has no need to know what they actually to, or have anything complex, to create a valid .cfg file
08:47:05*amiconn doesn't see the need for that, but then he has no use for rbutil in general either
08:47:58GodEaterI wouldn't use it either, but I can see it might be popular amongst a proportion of our end users
08:49:42 Quit tchan (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
08:51:49amiconnGodEater: Regarding the existing format - of course rockbox can parse that, but it contains no info about allowed values/ranges
08:53:16amiconnIt used to contain that (as comments) before the settings were converted to the current table-driven logic
08:53:41GodEaterand where are the allowed values held currently then ?
08:54:33amiconnIn the settings tables in the code
08:54:54GodEaterso again, already existing code....
08:54:57amiconnWhat I mean is that with the old settings code, the written .cfg files also contained that info
08:55:15amiconn(for enum settings at least)
08:55:40GodEaterso it's in a different place now - but it's not unavailable to rbutil
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09:01:43JdGordonI've just gone XML because there are a heap of qt parsers for it, so its easy to get going
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09:07:12LloreanLinusN: The double posting is an iffy issue. I'm really not entirely happy with the current situation (and it's not a rule I wrote) but as far as I can see, the reasoning behind the way it is is pretty sound. I've tried to explain it in the thread as best I can.
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09:18:32JdGordonGodEater: the existing format is macros and C, so no.. its gcc which does it atm. I'm using a plugin to dump that to text, and yes it doesnt have to be xml.. but thats how it is untill someone comes up with a better format
09:19:09GodEaterJdGordon: ah ok - that makes things much clearer - thanks :)
09:20:22*petur feels it is pointless and the energy should be directed at fixing bugs
09:20:45*Bagder stands in petur's corner
09:21:28*GodEater joins the gang too
09:21:46*Bagder hands out coffee
09:21:56GodEatercool - I'd just run out ;)
09:22:03peturtea please (for me)
09:22:13LinusNi think that feature goes into the "fluff" category, but i do think XML looks appropriate in this case
09:22:40*LinusN hides
09:23:35GodEateryou're just lucky I've mislaid my pitchfork and store of torches...
09:24:17LinusNi hid it. muhahahaaaaa!
09:24:33peturBagder: I have not followed much of the discussion about the iriver+CF giving ata -80, any thoughts? It was set_features(), right? Maybe the PIO mode setting?
09:24:54LinusNpetur: probably
09:25:03Bagderpetur: I'm quite sure the -80 error is set_features() returning -20
09:25:23LinusNi have ordered a transcend card to try myself
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09:25:34*JdGordon wonders how adding this would be more fluff than say the downloading the doom wads in rbutil
09:25:57BagderJdGordon: that's just downloading a single stupid URL
09:26:13JdGordon... and even if it is... its rbutil so why cant it have some extra fluff?
09:26:14Bagderthat's fluff too, but less fluff
09:26:19*petur has an A-DATA card giving the same result. The other two cards just give a Div0
09:26:21LinusNJdGordon: because downloading doom wads don't reguire syncing to a specific version of rockbox
09:26:56LinusNand don't require adding a new plugin or complicating the build system
09:26:57BagderJdGordon: I'm already stated my reasoning, I don't think I need to repeat that here
09:27:10JdGordonit doesnt force a specific version... it suggests a minimum version.. and might still work if the versions dont match anyway
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09:27:31LinusNi understand that
09:27:45LinusNhow do you intend to create the xml file?
09:27:47*JdGordon also said tha the plugin is a once off thing and the xml would be mostly static anyway
09:27:52LloreanJdGordon: I haven't looked at your method. how does it deal with target-specific settings?
09:27:55LloreanLike the volume range differences.
09:28:10JdGordonit doesnt yet because I dont know how it should.. thats why i put the email out
09:28:36LinusNi think the xml should be created by the build process and be included in the rockbox zip file
09:28:46LinusNlike the language support files
09:28:46Lloreanit seems to me that the build system should generate a file describing all the setting and their ranges, and RButil should grab that file from the build on the target (like the rbinfo file) rather than downloading it.
09:28:56LloreanUhm, yeah, what LinusN said. :)'
09:29:08Bagderto make it follow the version you got
09:29:23JdGordonby all means, create the script.. I suck at perl/scripting so thats beyond me
09:29:54JdGordonbut i'm saying thats a waste because 1) we usually say people shold be runing the svn version anwyay, and 2) it will be static
09:30:05JdGordonwhen was the last time settings_list.c was changed?
09:30:26Bagder1) the svn version is downloaded as a zip and it would then contain the xml
09:30:35peturJdGordon: tomorrow
09:30:49LinusNpetur has a time machine?
09:31:27peturLinusN: easy to predict, the moment somebody says it hasn't been done in ages, the next day it happens
09:31:29JdGordonBagder: well the .xml would be in the source so thats not a problem
09:31:38LinusNpetur: :-)
09:31:56Bagderit would be in the source?
09:32:11BagderI don't see how that would be any good
09:35:16LinusNBagder: it depends on if the xml is generated from settings_list.c or the opposite
09:35:31Bagderbut I will be scared the day we use xml in the rockbox code
09:35:44LinusNit could make sense to generate settings_list.c from the xml file
09:36:01LinusNin this case xml might make sense
09:36:10LinusNcan't believe i said that :-)
09:36:18Bagderwell, perhaps compared to the current macro mania... :-)
09:36:43Bagderbut I would rather avoid xml
09:37:02*pondlife still doesn't really know why you intend to create the xml file...
09:37:07*GodEater joins Badger in the corner again
09:37:14BagderLinusN: trust me to be using that against you in the future ;-)
09:37:14*Llorean just hides in general
09:37:27pondlifeWhy not fix bookmarking instead of mucking about with this?
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09:37:47*Bagder pulls pondlife into the corner and hands him a cup
09:37:52pondlifeAh, thanks
09:38:04LinusNpondlife: are you claiming "rubbish"? :-)
09:38:04pondlifeBagder: Can I have some liquid in this cup, please
09:38:14Bagderyou have to earn it first!
09:38:18pondlifeLinusN: I guess I am!
09:38:33LinusNspeaking of bookmarking, what is really the deal?
09:38:39pondlifeIt's the resume code
09:38:46LinusNit fails to seek?
09:38:55LinusNcan it be repeated in the sim?
09:39:11GodEatercan it be fixed ? :)
09:39:16pondlifeOf course!
09:39:32pondlifeThe playback.c interfaces still use the "codec" position for resume, I think.
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09:39:46pondlifeIt should be the "WPS" position/offset
09:40:04*petur votes for a tracker cleanup week to get JdGordon's head off xml (1027 entries currently!)
09:40:35pondlifeThat's a bit of a gut feeling, I've not had time to track it through yet.
09:41:49*JdGordon really cant see what the fuss is all about.. it it had any connection to the main binary then I wouldnt care.. but there is none
09:42:18BagderJdGordon: all code that goes into rockbox has association with the main binary
09:42:29pondlifeNo fuss, you do it if you want. Personally it smells like you'd end up having to sync two settings structures and add a dependency...
09:42:50pondlifeBut there are far more pressing problems to be solved.
09:43:38JdGordonBagder: rbutil/ has no bearing what so ever on the binary
09:43:43*pondlife just has a general aversion to any new features until all the bugs have been fixed...
09:44:03BagderJdGordon: of course not, but you're talking about doing things in the rockbox end as well
09:44:04pondlife...but not enough time to help
09:44:16JdGordonBagder: no im not...
09:44:33JdGordonits the others that want to add docs into the bin/plugins
09:44:36Bagderok sorry, then I misunderstood
09:44:36JdGordonim against that
09:45:29pondlifeDo we have a dedicated plugin buffer?
09:45:38pondlifei.e. a bit of memory only used for plugins
09:47:13pondlifeOK, how about we update the implementation of the plugin load/unload so that the last plugin can remain loaded and be reused without disk spinup? Only usable for plugins that tell us that they don't assume memory has been zeroed, of course.
09:47:29JdGordonbecause that was rejected already
09:47:36*JdGordon did that patch and had it working
09:47:37Lloreanpondlife: Isn't that a new feature, rather than a bug fix? :-P
09:47:54pondlifeBut JdGordon wants to work on a new feature
09:48:49pondlifeIt seems that would be a sensible precursor to a settings plugin. The settings could live in there all the time unless the user selected another plugin.
09:49:21pondlifeWe could load it at startup so there would be no extra spinup first time.
09:49:46pondlifeThat should free up a nice bit of audio buffer
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09:49:55JdGordonnoone like the idea of moving settings to a plugin
09:50:03pondlifeI did
09:50:14JdGordonok, your alone there...
09:50:15pondlifeOnly because of the spinup requirement, AFAIK
09:50:37JdGordonnot only... but thats a big issue
09:50:40pondlifeIf we don't unload a plugin until we need the space then that largely goes away
09:50:47pondlifeHence "precursor"
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09:51:37LinusNthe only platform that this would make a difference would be the old archos
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09:51:49DA-AtWorkI'm getting crashes on Rockbox occasionally
09:51:54DA-AtWorkRunning it on a Gigabeat F
09:52:07pondlifeLinusN: Why? Does that have a much smaller plugin buffer?
09:52:10DA-AtWorkWhen I switch between different FLAC tracks, occasionally it crashes and outputs "Divide by zero at 0005F93C"
09:52:16DA-AtWorkWhat causes that?
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09:52:23LinusNpondlife: it has little memory
09:52:50LinusNpondlife: how much audio buffer do you think we could gain by moving the settings to a plugin?
09:53:05*JdGordon guesses a fair bit actually
09:53:09pondlifeNot sure, that's the killer questionm
09:53:18DA-AtWorkAnyone? :)
09:53:20pondlifeI guess I could knock up a build with no settings
09:53:21LinusNDA-AtWork: i dunno, does it matter what tracks you play?
09:53:30DA-AtWorkit happens randomly
09:53:32JdGordonrelativly easu to find out if your really interested
09:53:36LinusNhow much is a "fair bit"?
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09:54:00JdGordonassuming gcc doesnt link unused code you cold just comment out the settings part of the menu and recompile
09:54:10DA-AtWorkI go into the database and switch to a different song when already playing a FLAC song, and it just freezes with that output...
09:54:16JdGordonmore than a few kb
09:54:19LinusNlet's say that you gain 100Kbytes, would that really be measurable on a 32MB target?
09:54:43pondlife100K green delta would be nice, no?
09:55:02JdGordonif you want rombox back it is
09:55:12JdGordonotherwise its not worht the effort
09:55:24pondlifeAnd on an Archos it would be even more noticable.
09:55:26DA-AtWorkMy current revision is r16299-080213
09:55:29LinusNi don't really care about rombox
09:55:46Bagderrombox is a lost cause
09:55:53pondlifeI just like the idea of the core being small and dedicated to crashless audio playback :)
09:55:59LinusNDA-AtWork: it only happens with the database?
09:56:19JdGordonpondlife: rebuilding the playback system would do a better job of that
09:56:36DA-AtWorkLinusN: So far
09:56:48DA-AtWorkLinusN: I haven't tried using it with the file browser
09:56:59LinusNi think offloading core stuff to plugins is a bad idea in general
09:57:11LinusNDA-AtWork: it would help to know
09:57:14*JdGordon enjoys being on the majority side for a change
09:57:23pondlifeMy turn
09:57:31LinusNJdGordon: enjoy it while it lasts :-)
09:57:34DA-AtWorkLinusN: I can try, but like I said, this happens randomly, so it might happen instantly or not at all
09:57:38*pondlife mentions XML again... ;p
09:58:07DA-AtWorkLinusN: And so far, only with FLAC, I don't use MP3s much so I don't know if it afflicts them too
09:58:11LinusNDA-AtWork: i see, but we really need to find a way to trigger the problem, or we can't fix it
09:58:20*JdGordon wishes he had some idea how a dsp/software mixer needs to work to put some of jhMikeS's ideas into code
09:58:20pondlifeJdGordon: If you have spare time, seriously consider getting into playback.c. We always need SWCODEC playback gurus.
09:58:41pondlifeOr pcmbuf if you prefer
09:59:02DA-AtWorkLinusN: I know...
09:59:11DA-AtWorkDoes that output tell you anything? It's just obscure to me
10:00:23Slasherirewriting the pcmbuf side would be a good place to start. and fixing that crossfade thas has became unusable because it crashes the system
10:01:12DA-AtWorkOk, I just switched track like 15 times using the file browser, and it's still running
10:02:00SlasheriDA-AtWork: does it happen for other filetypes than flac too?
10:02:41LinusNDA-AtWork: unfortunately, the error message is of little use, all it says is that it crashed in the __udivdi3 routine, but not which function that called it
10:02:59LinusNmaybe we should start dumping a call stack in the panic screen
10:03:49 Nick JdGordon is now known as JdGordon|zzz (n=jonno@rockbox/developer/JdGordon)
10:04:24DA-AtWorkSlasheri: I haven't tried
10:04:28DA-AtWorkLinusN: Okay...
10:04:32 Quit Bagder ("*plopp*")
10:04:33DA-AtWorkWell, I don't know what to do, then :/
10:05:09LloreanLinusN: more info on a panic is definitely a good idea
10:05:33GodEateryeah, that would be useful
10:05:41pondlifeA call stack would be great
10:05:56DA-AtWorkI wish rockbox had a dmesg-like app.
10:06:18GodEaterDA-AtWork: what would you expect that to show you ?
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10:06:47pondlifeSlasheri: I use crossfade all the time and don't experience crashes on H300. Is that a pcmbuf platform-specific issue?
10:07:11DA-AtWorkGodEater: What dmesg shows :P
10:07:44GodEaterDA-AtWork: but dmesg tends to list drivers loaded and whatknot
10:07:52GodEaterwe don't load drivers (at least, not dynamically)
10:08:16DA-AtWorkI don't know much about how rockbox works internally
10:08:32Slasheripondlife: interesting.. maybe i should try again
10:08:38GodEaterDA-AtWork: the code's there if you want to learn more :)
10:08:46Slasheripondlife: it has been very unstable on h140 at least
10:08:47pondlifeI use a short crossfade, maybe it's length dependent
10:09:01Slasherii have something like 4s crossfade
10:09:16pondlife0/0/1/1 here
10:09:23pondlifei.e no fade-in
10:09:36DA-AtWorkGodEater: But I don't know how to program, so... :P
10:10:14GodEaterif I had a penny for every time someone said that to me
10:10:25pondlifeSlasheri: Also, only on track skip + shuffle, although I do run shuffled quite a bit
10:11:02pondlifeApart from the bookmark and resume problems, I'm pretty happy with the current H300 build
10:11:38DA-AtWorkGodEater: Hehe, well, I want to learn to... :P
10:11:50GodEaterDA-AtWork: no time like the present
10:11:56pondlifeDA-AtWork: Now's your chance!
10:12:32*GodEater welcomes the latest Rockbox hacker to the fold
10:12:57DA-AtWorkhaha, dudes, I've got a full time job, and am spending much of my free time exercising to get a driver's license
10:13:08DA-AtWorkWhen I get more spare time to devote to it, sure, why not? :P
10:13:17BagderDA-AtWork: sleep less!
10:13:49DA-AtWorkI already barelly get 6hrs of sleep every night :p
10:13:57pondlifeSounds familiar
10:14:01GodEatera fulltime job is no excuse at all
10:14:13GodEaterI have one of those too - I'm even sitting at my desk already
10:14:13DA-AtWorkThe coffee machine here at the office get scared when I walk in the door
10:14:27pondlifeYou'll need a cup then..
10:19:22DA-AtWorkSo, there's nothing to do about this error?
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10:19:47pondlifeDA-AtWork: The best thing you could do is to work out a recipe that makes it fail reliably
10:19:53GodEaterDA-AtWork: not until you can reproduce it reliably
10:20:01pondlifei.e. work out what the "random" factor is
10:20:08GodEateror can implement a callstack report in our panic screen ;)
10:20:17DA-AtWorkHaha, not sure I'm able to do either
10:20:21pondlifeIs it when the disk spins up to buffer?
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10:20:33DA-AtWorkNo, it's already playing a song
10:20:41DA-AtWorkI just switch to a different song
10:21:02DA-AtWorkAlso, battery life sucks when using FLAC, but that's expectable, I suppose. :P
10:21:02pondlifeI mean, is it when you skip from track 9 to 10 (and tracks 1-9 were buffered in memory, but 10 was not)
10:21:30DA-AtWorkNo, I open all tracks from a single artist and just select randomly among albums
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10:21:45DA-AtWorkSong 3 from album 4, song 16 from album 5
10:22:04pondlifeOK, so it's probably having to buffer each time
10:22:06GodEaterpondlife: given the use case, I suspect none of the tunes he's selecting are buffered
10:22:45GodEateralso - if they're all flac, then there's probably never more than one or two on the buffer in any case
10:23:35pondlifeDA-AtWork: Another useful thing you can do is set up a build environment, then work out which version first suffered the problem. This is only really practical if you can guarantee a crash within a certain number of skips though.
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10:26:36DA-AtWorkpondlife: I can't guarantee anything... it happened a couple of times randomly, I haven't been able to reproduce it intentionally
10:27:11pondlifeSadly that's often the case... makes it hard to go back to a particular version and quickly know if you still have the problem :/
10:27:42DA-AtWorkI'm still using that revision
10:28:30pondlifeI guess you could try an older one and use it for a few days.. that would probably give an idea if it's better or not?
10:28:42DA-AtWorkI haven't had this problem until today
10:28:50DA-AtWorkand I've used FLAC music for some time
10:29:06DA-AtWorkI update my rockbox almost daily
10:29:14pondlifeAh, ok
10:29:43pondlifeI suggest you go back to yesterday's build again for a while and see what happens
10:30:16DA-AtWorkIsn't yesterday's build what I'm using now?
10:30:27pondlifeI mean the previous day's
10:30:48*pondlife apologises for the '
10:31:04DA-AtWorkOk... how do I obtain that? I always use rbutilqt to upgrade
10:31:34pondlifeGo to, select your device and download a zip
10:31:46pondlifeThen unzip it onto the root of your device
10:32:07pondlifeSelect the "old" link and a particular date
10:33:19pondlifeThen, when you have an idea at which point the crashing began, we can look at the next day's changelog
10:33:42DA-AtWorkBut I'm not going to be able to do this now, since I'm at work
10:33:45pondlifeNo rush
10:33:51pondlifeWell, you have 30 days or so!
10:34:55DA-AtWorkWhy that number?
10:35:26pondlifeThe last 30 days daily builds are available. If you want older ones you have to build your own (which is pretty easy).
10:36:08linuxstbUnless they've "fixed" it, many of the download mirrors even have older builds than that.
10:36:31BagderI think "they" fixed it by now
10:37:04linuxstbNot all - I've just seen a server with builds going back to May 2007...
10:37:10Bagderah ok
10:37:26Bagderthen it was more than one server before... as I know one who fixed it
10:37:36linuxstbYes, I'm pretty sure it was all of them.
10:38:37***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
10:42:26DA-AtWorkBTW, is there anything I can do to improve battery life?
10:42:36pondlifeSkip less
10:42:51pondlifeUse a more compact format
10:43:15pondlifeBasically try to avoid use of the hard disk
10:43:21DA-AtWorkI know that FLAC uses a lot, but even for the MP3s I have, battery life is rather short compared to my old MP3 player
10:43:27DA-AtWorkWhat do you mean skip less?
10:44:34pondlifeLet it play from a playlist or album, so it knows which tracks to buffer. When you select random tracks it has to spin up the hard disk each time.
10:45:23pondlifeIf you play an album (or a playlist) it will buffer as much as it can then spin down (or even power down) the disk
10:46:02DA-AtWorkI see
10:46:04linuxstbDA-AtWork: FLAC uses less battery than MP3 (in my tests on an ipod Color)
10:46:12pondlifeIf that's using MP3s on a shortish album it might read the whole lot in one read.
10:46:19DA-AtWorklinuxstb: I have the exact opposite experience
10:46:25DA-AtWorkFLAC drains my battery much faster
10:46:32DA-AtWorkI've got a Gigabeat F20
10:46:35pondlifeThat's probably your usage pattern
10:46:58pondlifeFLAC is cheap to decode, but the Gigabeat has a powerful CPU
10:47:00linuxstbHave you done a proper runtime test? i.e. fully charge your F20, then play an album on repeat (do nothing else) and measure the runtime?
10:47:05DA-AtWorkOgg Vorbis provides me with by far the best battery life, for some reason
10:47:13linuxstbBut yes, it may well be different on the gigabeat.
10:47:16DA-AtWorklinuxstb: No
10:47:51pondlifeIf Rockbox knows what you are going to play, it will use less battery.
10:47:59pondlifeSadly, it's not (yet) psychic
10:48:23DA-AtWorkWell, the database more or less tells it what it's gonna play, no?
10:48:43pondlifeYes, but when you make a new selection, it starts anew
10:48:48linuxstbDo you skip often?
10:48:50DA-AtWorkAha, I see
10:48:57DA-AtWorklinuxstb: yes
10:49:17DA-AtWorkStrange, the monitor turns on every time it switches to a different song
10:49:19linuxstbThat's probably the reason than - Rockbox can probably buffer about 8 MP3s in RAM, but only 1 flac.
10:49:35DA-AtWorkI see
10:49:42pondlifeDA-AtWork: That's the "Caption Backlight" option, you should probably turn that off
10:49:44linuxstbSo every skip with FLAC requires a disk spinup and the buffer to be completely refilled.
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10:49:58DA-AtWorkpondlife: Ok, where is it in the configuration menu?
10:50:35pondlifeUnder General Settings > Display somewhere
10:51:24DA-AtWorkFound it, thanks
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10:54:41pondlifeOther things you can do to save battery: don't use EQ/crossfeed/peakmeters/album art. Keep the backlight on time as short as you can.
10:54:45 Quit homielowe (Remote closed the connection)
10:54:58*pondlife wonders if FLAC + AA works
10:55:21DA-AtWorkFLAC + AA?
10:56:30pondlifeFLAC (using up your entire buffer with one track) and Album Art (also needing buffer space)
10:57:10LinusNwouldn't large mp3 files have the same problem?
10:57:21linuxstbpondlife: All my music is FLAC, and AA works fine.
10:57:32pondlifeI was only wondering
10:57:55DA-AtWorkWait, I got an idea... isn't it possible just to make Rockbox buffer parts of the FLAC file instead of the whole damn thing?
10:58:04DA-AtWorkBuffering the next minute, for example
10:58:23Bagderand then ?
10:58:36Bagderload a minute at a time?
10:58:52Bagderspinup up the disk every minute?
10:59:23linuxstbIIRC, Apple's ipod firmware does something like that - buffering the beginnings of upcoming tracks, on the assumption that users skip a lot. I assume that after a certain time (30 seconds?) the rest of the track is then buffered.
10:59:40linuxstb(or so I've heard people claim...)
10:59:57Bagderyeah, and we have this idea brought up every now and then
11:00:00DA-AtWorkBadger: Good point...
11:00:20DA-AtWorkBattery life would suffer
11:01:01BagderDA-AtWork: believe it or not, but the current concept has gotten a bit of thought already
11:01:04linuxstbDA-AtWork: You could stop skipping ;) e.g. create playlists or delete songs you don't like...
11:01:30Bagderor just accept that this is the battery life under these conditions
11:02:10linuxstbDA-AtWork: How long is your battery life? I can't recall my gigabeat ever running out, and people have reported about 18 hours (I think) in runtime tests.
11:02:48pondlifeI guess the fairest check is to compare with the Original Firmware, but Gigabeat can't dual boot, can it?
11:03:04linuxstbNo, and for good reason :)
11:03:15pondlifeGood reason?
11:03:19linuxstbIt sucks
11:03:35pondlifeI've never seen it
11:03:42linuxstbBut also, it can only play its own encrypted format (.sat), so you'll need two copies of the music.
11:03:56pondlifeUrgh, that *does* suck
11:04:08pondlifeAn OF that can't play MP3?
11:04:09DA-AtWorklinuxstb: about 10hrs with MP3, 3-4 with FLAC.
11:04:13linuxstbWhich requires a windows app to transfer.
11:04:32DA-AtWorkVery low, compared to my old Zen Touch, which could do 22hrs (it was stolen :( )
11:04:37linuxstbDA-AtWork: You must either do a _lot_ of skipping, or your battery is in need of replacing.
11:06:10linuxstbI use FLAC all the time on my gigabeat, and as I said, it never seems to run out - so I would guess it could last for about 15-20 hours. (I probably use it for about 2 hours a day, and it seems to last for a couple of weeks)
11:06:25DA-AtWorklinuxstb: I do skip a bit, but not all the time.
11:06:52DA-AtWorkThe MP3 player is from ebay, it's probably not exactly new... where can I get a replacement battery?
11:07:08linuxstbI'm not sure - I don't think they're easy to find. markun may know...
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11:10:30markunI use an ipod 4g battery in my Gigabeat, but you need to modify it to use the connector from your old battery.
11:16:36DA-AtWorkAren't there any aftermarket chinese batteries or something?
11:21:33GodEaterDA-AtWork: not that we've found no
11:21:49markunwell, chinese ipod 4g batteries
11:22:00DA-AtWorkIs it hard to modify the batteries?
11:22:22markunnot really
11:22:45markunbut you might need a soldering iron to do a better job than I did :)
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11:23:36DA-AtWorkmarkun: Last time I cracked open my soldering iron box, my Xbox died. :P
11:23:40markunand because I bought a higher capacity battery it didn't fit perfectly and I had to bend my case slightly. But it sounds worse than it is. You can't see it.
11:24:12markunThere is some info in the rockbox forums and maybe also in the wiki.
11:25:06GodEatermarkun: how many hours usage did the higher capacity get you ?
11:25:20markunabout 25 I think
11:25:44GodEaternot bad :)
11:26:21DA-AtWorkHow much does one of those batteries cost, and where can it be bought?
11:26:31pondlifeI look forward to fitting a new battery to my H380...
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11:26:44markunI'll look up the forum thread
11:27:00markunDA-AtWork: but I only play ogg vorbis (q3) so I don't know how well FLAC will do.
11:27:30DA-AtWorkI think I usually use q8 when I use ogg vorbis
11:27:33DA-AtWorkOr something like that
11:27:45markunit surprises me that there is such a big difference with MP3 and FLAC on you player.
11:27:50DA-AtWorkBut either way, it's bound to be an increase over what I have now
11:27:59markunsince linuxstb gets a normal runtime
11:28:00DA-AtWorkMaybe it is my skipping that's causing it
11:28:09DA-AtWorkbut I do the same with mp3s
11:28:30markunreading from the HDD is very power consuming
11:28:51DA-AtWorkSo I was told
11:29:05LloreanAnd skipping would cause a lot more reads with flac than with mp3
11:29:07DA-AtWorkHow about the screen? does it suck a lot of power too?
11:29:09 Quit _kch_ ("Abandonando")
11:29:13markunforum search isn't very fast..
11:29:16LloreanThe light drains more power than almost anything else
11:29:21DA-AtWorkI see
11:29:39pondlifeYou don't have backlight set to Always On, do you?
11:29:42markunLlorean: but you can set it to a lower brightness to save power
11:29:50Lloreanmarkun: Very true.
11:29:58linuxstbpondlife: That's a useful setting... ;)
11:30:05DA-AtWorkpondlife: No, I'm not that much of a clot. :P
11:30:15pondlifemrs pondlife used that setting once
11:30:20*Llorean thinks we should rename "caption backlight" to "Expedient battery drain mode"
11:30:28pondlifeOr just remove it
11:30:35GodEaternah - too many people would ask what "Expedient" meant
11:30:36DA-AtWorkCaption Backlight was annoying me a lot
11:30:38markunif we ever support players with an amoled screen (like the iriver clix2) we can tell people to use a black background to save power :)
11:30:42LloreanPeople apparently use Caption Backlight.
11:30:43pondlifeI've never understood what use it is
11:30:45DA-AtWorkThanks for pointing out how to turn it off, guys
11:31:03pondlifeIt used to annoy me back on the JBR, it was on by default IIRC.
11:31:04DA-AtWorkpondlife: Whenever a track is changed, the backlight turns on
11:31:13pondlifeYes, but why would you want that?
11:31:24GodEaterin case you wanted to know what the new track was ?
11:31:27linuxstbI guess it's useful in a car
11:31:40pondlifeIf you want to see the display, push a key
11:31:57pondlifeUse the "First Keypresss..." option if needed
11:32:08GodEaterpondlife: that's what I'd do yes, but other people are lazy :)
11:32:08pondlifeBut why light the screen when just playing?
11:32:22linuxstbIn a car, isn't it better to not press buttons?
11:32:34pondlifeI'd find reading the screen harder than pressing a button
11:32:38GodEaterlinuxstb: yes, but it's also good to keep an eye on the road
11:32:43DA-AtWorkJust a question, BTW, guys
11:33:20DA-AtWorkIs it possible to connect the player to USB, but without losing control of the player (so that I can still use it), unless the player is mounted by the USB host?
11:33:39DA-AtWorkBecause I got no charger and always use USB to charge it, yet I'd like to be able to use the player while charging
11:33:48linuxstbWe can't detect if it's mounted, but holding MENU as you insert USB will stop it registering as a USB device.
11:34:04*pondlife really must put an option in for that
11:34:22DA-AtWorklinuxstb: Will that make it usable while charging from USB?
11:34:37DA-AtWorkGreat, thanks :D
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11:35:53GodEateris that still not in the manual ?
11:36:14DA-AtWorkI haven't touched the manual
11:36:25*pondlife throws the manual at DA-AtWork
11:36:41DA-AtWork*throws printed out man pages back*
11:36:50*GodEater refuses to answer more questions unless DA-AtWork has read it
11:37:10DA-AtWorkI haven't got time to read a book these days :P
11:37:20DA-AtWorkAnd if I did, it'd be a Murray N. Rothbard book, not a manual
11:38:23GodEaterI have no time to answer questions for people that haven't read the manual
11:39:28DA-AtWorkOk, to be honest, I can't stand manuals - I wanna tinker and figure stuff out myself. The few things I don't figure out myself, I google, use the wiki for, or ask on IRC.
11:39:53DA-AtWorkIf I wanted something that just worked and had no tinkering value, I'd just go for an ipod.
11:40:04DA-AtWorkThat's also the reason I'm using DD-WRT on my accesspoint at home
11:40:42LinusNDA-AtWork: that attitude works fine until you start wasting other people's time with questions that are answered in the manual
11:40:55DA-AtWorkI apologize
11:41:03LinusNno worries
11:41:14DA-AtWorkNext time I have a question, I'll look in the manual first
11:41:20LinusNand you are not alone
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11:41:33DA-AtWorkIs there a search engine covering the manual?
11:42:11LinusNit's rather interesting, because it seems most people don't expect the manual to be very good in open source projects
11:42:22LinusNDA-AtWork: unfortunately not
11:42:24DA-AtWorkIt's not that I don't expect it to be good
11:42:34DA-AtWorkIt's that man pages have caused me to hate all manuals
11:42:45peturDA-AtWork: google is your friend
11:42:51DA-AtWorkReading 50 pages of unnecessary and irrelevant trivia to get to a single detail you're looking for
11:42:55DA-AtWorkThat's the man page experience
11:43:02LinusNamen to that
11:43:08DA-AtWorkthat's why I dislike manuals
11:43:54DA-AtWorkpetur: I already said I google stuff I can't figure out myself inurl:manual
11:44:10GodEaterworks for me
11:44:30DA-AtWorkYep, should work fine :)
11:45:18GodEaterso, "yes there is a search engine covering the manual, it is called google" :)
11:45:35LinusNhmmm, didn't really work that well for me
11:46:12LinusN" inurl:manual backlight" gave me 5 hits, none to the correct version of the manual
11:46:35GodEatertry "inurl:pdf instead" ?
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11:47:01peturhow about ?
11:47:10LinusNpetur: that may work
11:47:11GodEaterpetur: that's probably better too
11:47:20GodEaterI failed to notice the download bit
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11:48:12LinusNin fact, why not add a nice search form on the manual page at
11:48:30DA-AtWorkThat would be cool :D
11:48:47LinusNon the rockbox-build.html page
11:49:08DA-AtWorkOr turn the manual into a nice wiki, like this:
11:49:17GodEaterLinusN: good question - I wonder who amonst us could do that ?
11:49:22DA-AtWorkTo be frank, I really don't like Rockbox's wiki, it's very difficult to search
11:49:33GodEatera common complaint
11:49:46GodEaterand again, one which is never followed by a good suggestion on how to improve it
11:49:57DA-AtWorkOne word: MediaWiki
11:50:08DA-AtWorki.e. Wikipedia's wiki software
11:50:39*amiconn uses 'Caption backlight' at home
11:52:05DA-AtWorklinuxstb: Holding MENU while inserting the USB cable works :D thanks a lot :D
11:52:11GodEaterchanging the software doesn't change how the information is organised DA-AtWork
11:52:23pondlifeamiconn: Why, in particular?
11:52:37pondlifeI'm genuinely interested, not being facetious
11:52:47DA-AtWorkGodEater: Look at how DD-WRT do it
11:52:58amiconnIn order to be able to see the new trackname on track change, without keeping backlight constantly on
11:52:59DA-AtWorkIt's very clean and organized, everything categorized and in lists
11:53:15pondlifeamiconn: Ah, ok.
11:53:16GodEaterDA-AtWork: that doesn't help us
11:53:23GodEaterwe don't use the same information they do
11:53:33LinusNDA-AtWork: is that thanks to mediawiki or the authors of that particular information?
11:53:48*GodEater suspects it's the authors
11:54:40DA-AtWorkBoth, Mediawiki is far more organized by default, but DD-WRT's wiki authors are pretty good too
11:54:41LinusNi can't even see a search button on that page
11:54:55DA-AtWorkLook at the top right corner
11:55:05LinusNit says "Go"
11:55:07amiconnIn the car I set the backlight to always on, btw
11:55:32GodEaterMediaWiki's syntax is also way more complex than twiki's
11:55:40pondlifeI have backlight always on when powered
11:55:45GodEaterusers struggle with twiki as it is
11:55:59GodEaterMediawiki would just make it worse, and reduce the number of people contributing imo
11:56:11DA-AtWorkBut there are plenty more people who know how to use MediaWiki
11:56:25DA-AtWorkI, for example, used to administer a MediaWiki wiki
11:56:27GodEateramongst rockbox's existing user base ?
11:56:31GodEaterhow do you know this ?
11:56:49pondlifeOur wiki is a font of misinformation... :/
11:57:09GodEaterpondlife: yes, but changing it to different software won't help that
11:57:36DA-AtWorkGodEater: I don't know that, but fact is, there are plenty of people who've contributed to mediawiki wikis, Wikipedia being, of course, the most obvious example.
11:57:41pondlifeIndeed, but the amount of badly organised content is a more basic problem
11:57:56LinusNthere are seldom technical solutions to badly organized content
11:57:58GodEaterwikipedia's userbase, compared to ours, is ENORMOUS
11:58:08GodEaterRockbox's user base is tiny
11:58:26DA-AtWorkI've contributed to Wikipedia, too... is it impossible for someone to be both a Rockbox and a Wikipedia user? :P
11:58:40pondlifeI mean, why worry about the wiki software whilst the content needs such a lot of editing and structuring.
11:58:44GodEaterno, but the intersection of the two sets is smaller than you think
11:58:47DA-AtWorkanyway, be back soon - lunch break :D
11:59:56*GodEater appears to be on his own with his belief that moving from twiki to MediaWiki would decrease the number of contributors to the wiki, so shuts up
12:00:57LinusNtwiki works well enough for our needs, it's the content that needs work
12:01:26LinusNstill, if mediawiki helps us organize the content better than twiki, i'm all for it
12:01:27GodEaterI think MediaWiki is over-engineered for our purposes
12:01:33GodEaterI dont' see how it can
12:01:38LinusNme neither
12:01:40GodEaterwithout some significant work by the authors
12:02:24GodEaterwe've suffered enough problems with twiki vulberabilities in the past
12:02:37GodEaterdo we know anything about similar defects in MediaWiki ?
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12:05:16Nico_Pamiconn, LinusN: I received the ipod just a few minutes ago :)
12:05:28LinusNwee, in one piece?
12:05:32GodEaternow fix it :)
12:05:48Nico_PLinusN: yes, in one piece
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12:09:04Nico_PGodEater: I intend to
12:11:17*Nico_P checks out the manual
12:11:33GodEater"how to turn on your ipod"
12:11:54Nico_Pthat I figured out :)
12:12:03GodEaterwhat were you looking for then ? :)
12:12:32Nico_Pstopping playback and turning the thing off
12:12:42Nico_PI just managed to stop playback
12:12:44GodEaterhold play, hold play longer
12:12:59Nico_Pah, thanks
12:13:02linuxstbNico_P: The two most important things - hold MENU+SELECT for the hardware reset, and (whilst booting), hold SELECT+PLAY for emergency disk mode.
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12:16:05ipodexpertNico_P: one more way to turn off the ipod: make two (roughly equally large) pieces out of it. Warning: you might have difficulties to boot it up again.
12:16:35Nico_Pthank you, mr. expert!
12:16:51DA-AtWorkipodexpert: How exactly is this done?
12:17:13DA-AtWorkI see.
12:17:18Nico_Phand force
12:17:26DA-AtWorkYep. somehow I doubt it'll boot up afterwards, too.
12:19:00ipodexpertGodEater: I'd do it your way. Very quick!
12:19:37*linuxstb expects an axe would generate more than two pieces
12:20:00GodEateruse the sharp edge, not the back of it
12:20:53ipodexpertlinuxstb: that's what makes out an expert! Exactly two pieces!
12:23:43*Nico_P can't get rbutil to compile
12:24:46Nico_Pwhen I run make, lrelease just displays its usage
12:24:57GodEaterdid you run qmake first ?
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12:25:38linuxstbNico_P: Just download ipodpatcher...
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12:25:52GodEateror build it, and a bootloader, yourself....
12:26:05Nico_Pthat's what I'm doing at the same time
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12:26:37*GodEater chuckles at Bagder's wordpress woes
12:26:44Nico_Pand I don't need to do much since rockbox is already installed. I just wanted to try out rbutil on a diff target
12:27:51Nico_Phaha nice :p
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12:28:11Nico_PA good reason to learn French
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12:38:40***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
12:38:51Nico_Pcabbie is real nice on the ipod IMHO
12:39:36GodEatershame it makes the audio skip so much ;)
12:39:40GodEater(if you have AA)
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12:39:53Nico_Pamiconn doesn't ;)
12:40:45Nico_Phe did a real good job ofkeeping the thing in perfect condition
12:41:06GodEateryou mean he didn't use sandpaper to clean the screen ? :)
12:41:12Nico_Pthe front doesn't have one scratch on it
12:41:38GodEaterI keep my in a skin to keep it pretty too
12:43:27LloreanCabbie+AA causes skipping audio?
12:43:44GodEaterdoes on my ipod
12:43:51pondlifeNico_P: Have you got any "insane disk activity" yet? :)
12:43:53GodEaterwhen combined with dircache update anyway
12:44:08GodEaterand without the "spinlock" revert patch
12:44:10Nico_Ppondlife: no, and no audio skips either
12:44:21DA-AtWorkWeird... Cabbie 2.0 looks strange with album art :/
12:44:29GodEatersince I applied the "revert spinlock" patch though - it's been fine
12:44:53GodEaterNico_P: there's not too many tracks on the ipod yet though is there ?
12:45:02*GodEater can't remember if amiconn loaded it up or not
12:45:12pondlifeOf course he didn't
12:45:16pondlifeThat would be illegal
12:45:17Nico_Pit only has 21 GB free, so I think he did
12:45:25*GodEater winks at pondlife
12:45:30GodEaterI think you're right then ;)
12:45:36*pondlife edits the IRC logs
12:45:37Nico_PI'm starting to have trouble believing the spinlock commit is fine and only highlighted existing issues
12:45:42Bagderthat must be debug logs only, obviously
12:45:44GodEaterso all you need to do then is load it up with AA stuff
12:46:27*GodEater wonders why it would be illegal anyway - surely it's only illegal if Nico_P copies it off before he gives it back ?
12:47:01Nico_PI can't really be bothered to look for the AA of amiconn's tracks. I'll just copy over my music with its AA
12:47:08GodEatergood plan
12:47:21pondlifeGodEater: Good point
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13:10:49*gevaerts is working on making usb_serial coexist with usb_storage
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13:12:09Zagorgevaerts: switchable, I assume?
13:13:10gevaertsZagor: from whatI can gather, the pp502x should support 3 endpoint pairs, so they should be able to work at the same time
13:13:33gevaertsZagor: my goal is to be able to get logf output in real time to the pc
13:13:42Zagorgevaerts: yes, only I never succeeded in making both ends of and endpoint work. have you?
13:14:11Zagorthat's why the code uses different endpoints for rx and tx
13:15:07gevaertsZagor: we'll see. The code is mostly ready to try tings out, but I forgot my usb cable at home, so it will have to wait until tonight
13:15:32gevaertsIf it doesn't work, I'll make it switchable
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13:16:17gevaertsIf it does work, we should have enough endpointsto implement usb audio as well (but that will have to be switched...)
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13:17:59linuxstbHow does USB audio work? I assume it just transfers PCM audio to/from the device?
13:19:10*linuxstb reads the specs
13:20:15gevaertslinuxstb: basicall. I didn't look very hard at the spec yet, but I understand it uses one endpoint (maybe a pair) to control everything (mixer settings, ...) and one isochronous endpoint for the pcm data (per direction)
13:21:01linuxstbSeems it's not just PCM data - you can use MPEG or AC-3 as well...
13:21:18gevaertslinuxstb: we havent' even tried to get isochronous working until now, and there are still lots of issues with the current stack and storage code, so it's still mostly dreaming...
13:21:43linuxstbSo a full implementation would need to use the codecs...
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13:22:55linuxstbIn fact, even PCM can be many formats (fixed-point integer, float, a-law etc)
13:23:42gevaertslinuxstb: as far as I understand a device is allowed to implement all those, but they are not all required
13:24:36pondlifeA USB audio output would want to feed from the final PCM output anyway, no? So EQ etc. could be used.
13:24:50pondlifeSoftware EQ, I mean
13:24:50ZagorI'm undecided about whether I consider it worth making the code more complex (by adding iso transfers) for usb audio
13:25:25ZagorI don't see any real use cases for it, other than "it's cool"
13:25:31pondlifeIn car?
13:25:42linuxstbZagor: I understand what you mean, but I like the idea of supporting things the hardware is physically capable of, but original firmwares ignore...
13:25:48linuxstbi.e. "it's cool" ;)
13:25:51Zagorhow many car stereos have you seen that accept usb audio? I have never seen one.
13:26:00Zagorusb sticks, yes. but not usb audio.
13:26:37Zagorlinuxstb: unfortunately there is no end to that reasoning. usb keyboards, networking, video cards etc etc.
13:26:54pondlifeHmm, keyboard...
13:26:54linuxstbSure, it all depends on _how_ complicated things become...
13:27:22gevaertsI can see a few use cases, some real and some less so. I can imagine iriver users wanting to use their optical i/o from a laptop (unfortunately they won't run this usb stack at all, so that's pretty academical)
13:27:48linuxstbgevaerts: I was thinking that as well - but we have no targets with digital IO and software USB...
13:27:59gevaertsThere is the fm tuner
13:28:16pondlifeWon't iRivers be able to run some of this USB code one day?
13:28:25linuxstbThe H300 maybe, but not the H100
13:28:29Zagorgevaerts: are you on top of the logf stuff, or would you like to look at the work-in-progress patch I did for it?
13:28:36pondlifeUSBOTG support for H300 would be nice
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13:28:59*petur should resume that work :/
13:29:28pondlifeAs long as the USB code isn't too entangled with PP stuff
13:29:43pondlifeOr can be disentangled :)
13:29:45*linuxstb suspects that Rockbox will eventually need a networking stack, as wireless becomes more and more ubiquitous
13:29:49gevaertsZagor: I haven't done any logf work so far, so if you have something that would be welcome
13:30:04Zagorusbotg is quite a bite to chew on
13:30:48*gevaerts notices that this otg stuff might make usb audio in the other direction quite useful
13:30:56*gevaerts doesn't volunteer for that one
13:31:12pondlifeRecording on all devices!
13:31:17markunlinuxstb: the Gigabeat has i2s on it's dock and software USB 1.1
13:31:33gevaertspondlife: do we know the usb controller used in the H100 ?
13:32:31peturgevaerts: it's a bridge - pure hardware
13:32:44pondlifeSo no ISP1362?
13:32:52peturonly in h300
13:32:55DA-AtWorkmarkun: You just reminded me of something... when I first got this Gigabeat, it had a dock... is that usable for anything with Rockbox?
13:33:07peturand X5 has something similar
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13:33:22pondlifepetur: Similar to which?
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13:33:39peturisp1362 usbotg
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13:36:29amiconnpetur: The X5 usbotg chip has no public docs though.
13:36:46peturI thought it was a philips too
13:37:07gevaertspondlife: currently the class drivers only use fairly generic functions from the controller driver (send, receive, stall,...), so they should be hardware-agnostic
13:37:14pondlifeGood stuff
13:39:43*gevaerts notices that the ISP1362 seems to have quite a lot of public documentation
13:40:45gevaertsSo do any supported devices beside the H300 use it ?
13:41:29gevaertsso that's probably why there's no driver for it yet...
13:42:14peturthere's demo code from philips in the wiki, and I had it about 10% working when I about gave up (time issue)
13:42:54*gevaerts thinks the DeviceChart page should include a line about which usb controller is used (if any)
13:44:33*petur should upload his code for others to continue, or do it himself
13:45:36gevaertspetur: looks like you were mainly intersted in the host-side part
13:45:54peturyes, the h300 has two controllers
13:46:18peturthe hardware one is used now, the isp1362 would be used as host
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13:47:17*gevaerts dreams of a full-sized keyboard attached to his sansa
13:47:42petursee the usbotg page for the whole list of dreams ;)
13:48:43linuxstbOr bluetooth with this gadget -
13:48:52gevaertsI like the tv tuner one, but you forgot networking
13:49:09peturwifi dongle :)
13:49:58peturdidn't the ipod/sansa usb controllers also do host?
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13:50:16*gevaerts mainly dreams of someone finding out what's wrong with the PP usb controller initialization
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13:51:04*petur dreams of getting his payed work done on time... time to look at that
13:51:09gevaertspetur: the controller is otg. I don't know if the rest of the hardware supports it. You'd need some kind of adapter cable at least for the sansa
13:52:04*gevaerts is going to do some paid work as well
13:52:05*linuxstb is reminded that he has an ipod "camera adapter" in his drawer waiting to be smashed open
13:52:24gevaertslinuxstb: don't smash too hard
13:52:41pondlifelinuxstb: Experts recommend use of an axe
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14:00:20amiconnpetur: X5 uses ALi M5636
14:00:59*petur stands corrected
14:08:07*linuxstb struggles to apply the necessary levels of violence to his ipod camera connector
14:09:13GodEateryou need to work out more
14:09:54*linuxstb looks around for better weapons
14:11:01*GodEater predicts a visit to casualty if linuxstb isn't careful
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14:11:20linuxstbYou're probably right...
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14:23:26*linuxstb succeeds in getting to the inside and finds a small (1cm by 2cm) PCB with a large chip on it
14:24:47linuxstbAnd just the following markings - "V106 5CZ ND97 N"
14:26:29linuxstbBah, just found this page -
14:28:20Zagor"In conclusion the iPod Camera Connector is the very first firewire to usb converter ever made." :-)
14:28:47*linuxstb is happy he's forgotten how much he paid for the connector...
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14:30:39carlosphey guys, it is me once again. I have a question which might not be too rockboxish
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14:35:01preglowhave you ever known any usb devices to be picky on the cable it's connected with?
14:37:01gevaertspreglow: usb cable specs changed a bit in going from 1.1 to 2.0.
14:37:19preglowgot a usb disk here that just disconnects if fed the cable i use for my h120
14:37:25preglowthe cable it comes with is very short, might be that
14:38:10gevaertsIs the h120 high-speed ?
14:38:32preglowdepends what that means in bandwidth terms, i don't really know, all i know is it's usb2
14:38:43***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
14:39:18preglowany way of finding out (linux) ?
14:39:19Zagorgevaerts: are you sure the cable spec changed?
14:39:37gevaertsthen the cabling requirements should be the same. Maybe your cable is a bit marginal
14:40:09preglowgevaerts: can a device find out if the cable is actually good enough easily, though? this hd seems to disconnect before any mounting is attempted
14:40:30 Quit waldo ("Konversation terminated!")
14:40:31gevaertsZagor: not entirely sure, but I seem to remember that the electrical specs are tighter
14:40:51gevaertspreglow: it can detect that it doesn't like the signal quality
14:41:05Zagoras far as I recall, the spec is the same. but some non-spec cheapo cables worked with 1.1 but not 2.0
14:41:10preglowgevaerts: i'm pretty sure the h120 is high-speed, yes
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14:41:35webguest99hey guys a little off/topic question
14:41:56webguest99how can i get all the album arts to my songs??
14:42:18preglowgevaerts: yeah, it reaches well above fullspeed speeds
14:42:46webguest99is there app which is not itune and add the album art automaticlly to the song i tranfare to my mp3 player
14:43:38gevaertsZagor: that's possible too.
14:45:04webguest99thank you linus :)
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14:45:21webguest99you are not the father of lnux, are you? :P
14:45:25Zagorlow-speed (1.0) are different though. they are unshielded.
14:45:45preglowwebguest99: he would have to be called LinusT then...
14:46:20preglowalthough he might have called one of his children lnux, i don't know about that
14:46:28webguest99heeh, yeah thats true
14:46:49ZagorI like how the archos oem usb cable is explicitly prohibited by the usb spec
14:46:56preglowi intend to call mine gorthon and kspex respectively, so it would have been a fine name
14:49:22przemhbhi all
14:50:10gevaertslow speed is indeed different, but they are not allowed to use a "standard" usb connector on the device side. You can get a low-speed device from USB-IF that does use a standard cable though )
14:50:26przemhbCould someone having H10 be so kind and take a look at FS #8273 patch? (It stays there since 5th of the December)
14:51:03gevaertsIt's quite interesting to see how much "usb" stuff violates some part of the spec somewhere
14:51:25Zagortoo often, microsoft windows is the spec...
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14:52:54gevaertsRead paragraph in the usb spec sometime, and then check how many hubs actually follow that...
14:53:01LinusNprzemhb: do any other rockbox targets use that rtc?
14:53:16przemhblinuxstb: hi, do you remember our last chat about a problem with opening fonts during make zip? As switching to CRLF line-endings did not helped I've modified a bit
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14:53:28przemhbLinusN: I must check...
14:54:29preglowi don't think s
14:54:29Zagorgevaerts: well it is voluntary. "If a vendor provides a labeling". though I actually do have a hub with numbered ports :)
14:56:07przemhbLinusN: H10's and Tatung Elio TPJ-1022 only
14:56:17gevaertsZagor: try plugging in a device, and check if the port number reported by software matches the labels.
14:56:21LinusNprzemhb: goodie
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15:00:58gevaertsZagor: what's your view on the usb serial number discussion ? Should we match the OF or be spec compliant (the spec says to only use 0-9A-Z, and at many OF's also put dashes in it or use lower-case) ?
15:01:24LinusNprzemhb: committed. thanks!
15:01:35przemhbLinusN: thanks!
15:01:39Zagorgevaerts: I think we should be spec compliant. does that cause any problems that we know of?
15:02:25gevaertsZagor: some people complain that their fstab rules don't work any more. Nothing more serious than that.
15:02:51*gevaerts thinks we should be spec compliant as well, even on details like tis
15:03:00 Quit jcollie ("Ex-Chat")
15:03:31Zagorwe can always call it a feature! :)
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15:07:28linuxstbgevaerts: Are you sure about the UMS serial number? Didn't you say that it was a feature of the device, which to me (I don't know the USB specs at all though) implies it should be part of the core standard, not the UMS spec you pointed me to?
15:08:44gevaertslinuxstb: the UMS spec has some additional restrictions
15:09:25gevaertslinuxstb: usbmassbulk_10.pdf 4.1.2
15:10:40linuxstbAlso, looking at bertrik's USB compliance tests with the Sansa original firmware, I didn't notice any failures (although maybe I missed it, or he didn't test that part)
15:11:08przemhbdoes using inner quotation marks in make sense? I didn't analyze it, but removing them helped me not to get "error opening font" errors during make zip; see
15:11:53linuxstbThose are used to execute shell commands (if you're talking about what I think).
15:12:30linuxstbAh, I see what you mean now...
15:13:49linuxstbAre you using cygwin?
15:13:50 Quit webguest99 ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
15:13:56przemhblinuxstb: yes
15:14:02linuxstbAnd tortoisesvn ?
15:14:12*linuxstb wants a cookie
15:14:24linuxstbIs cygwin set to use DOS or Unix line-endings/
15:15:14linuxstbtortoisesvn will create files with DOS line-endings, so unless Cygwin is configured similarly, you'll run into these kinds of issues.
15:15:22GodEatercan I get some advice on linux tools to transcode mp3 to wav (and let's just assume I've already been soundly berated by every audiophile in here already for even contemplating doing it)
15:15:22 Quit DA-AtWork ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
15:15:51linuxstbI would use "madplay -o wav:filename.wav file.mp3"
15:16:15GodEaterthank you
15:16:19*preglow hands out cookies
15:16:44krazykitlame has a decoder too ;-)
15:16:59krazykitlame −−decode
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15:20:27przemhblinuxstb: first I was having Cygwin with LF and it worked fine for several months, then make started to handle fonts, and since then I was experiencing the problem with opening fonts, so I switched Cygwin to CRLF and performed deleted whole RB src dir and performed full svn co
15:21:09broomI have a question about the last commit (rtc_e8564.c). The variable rtc_lock_alarm_clear seems to be new, the commit only has one file. Shouldn't that variable be declared as static then?
15:22:02przemhblinuxstb: but as it did not helped I've modified wpsbuild
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15:24:54GodEaterlinuxstb / krazykit: same advice for flac please ?
15:26:48krazykitflac -d
15:31:02*gevaerts thinks we should contact support for any non-compliant device and tell them they have a bug
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15:33:40*linuxstb wonders what serial numbers the other PP devices use - H10, mrobe 100
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15:34:22GodEateris this the same serial number that linux gets as the "by-uuid" ?
15:35:21gevaertsGodEater: I think the uuid is the filesystem id. The usb serial number is used in by-id
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16:03:40kugelNico_P: Hi, the today's version of bmp resize seems to work better
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16:04:46jac0b-workwith the multifont patch where do you specify what fonts you want to use?
16:05:04 Part SSnake
16:05:19kugeljac0b-work: ffs, can't you just read the comments before installing a patch?
16:05:50kugelyou spammed in quite a few patches with problems that are either known or discussed in the comments bfore
16:05:52jac0b-workI did and I think it says to add it to the global cfg file
16:06:33linuxstbMaybe look at some themes known to work with the latest multifont patch, and see how they specify the fonts.
16:07:00jac0b-worklinuxstb: thanks I will that
16:08:00jac0b-workI was commenting because there was a problem I was having with the patches, and I waited for a while until I added a comment
16:08:21jac0b-workjust to see if anyone added a resynced patch
16:08:33 Quit broom ("CGI:IRC")
16:09:14kugeljac0b-work: the multifont patch for example. tdooke said several times, that the newer version need the viewports list patch
16:09:53 Quit MethoS- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
16:09:59 Quit Mathiasdm ("Yuuw!")
16:10:25kugelyou failed hunk is "viewport.c", and you just didn't come to the idea that you need viewports-list
16:11:05kugeljac0b-work: There's noting to resync, you were just lacking a patch
16:11:59jac0b-workI see where he noted about the list.c hunk errors but nothing about viewport.c
16:12:21kugeltdooke said that when he uploaded the version!
16:12:50jac0b-worksorry for posting without researching the past comments I make sure to do that from now on
16:13:48kugeljac0b-work: thank you, making a custom build requires researching, and not just asking the others to solve your problems. It's just like that
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16:38:45***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
16:41:01J3TC-Speaking of custom builds
16:41:07J3TC-Does tdtooke hang around IRC?
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16:49:37FrankOttoHello. I've been using Rockbox for three years on an iRiver H120. Currently I'm attempting a CF modification of the player, and would like to contribute my experiences to the Wiki (CFModGuide). Therefore I'd like to request write permissions for the Wiki.
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16:50:29petur1 sec
16:51:00peturFrankOtto: done
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16:51:12peturdid it work, btw?
16:51:12FrankOttopetur: Thank you!
16:51:28FrankOttono, ATA error -80 :-(
16:51:42petursame here, I hope I can test some things tonight
16:52:19FrankOttoI've been looking at the code, I think this happens in set_features() when dealing with the power management
16:52:33n1spetur: wouldn't flashing the latest pre-something bootloader and loading rockbox from flash be a safer way to test?
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16:53:30peturnls: there's no safe way to debug the iriver bootloader unless you're LinusN
16:53:48FrankOttoI find it interesting that the USB bootloader mode works fine with the CF card
16:54:08peturFrankOtto: that's because the usb is handled in hardware
16:54:14n1spetur: but if you load rb from flash, you could test with a modified rb image and still use the tried and tru bootloader
16:54:28peturnls: ah right
16:54:44peturis there a run-from-flash one for h300?
16:54:56n1sno :(
16:55:13n1sha right you have a h300 not h100...
16:55:28peturerr.... wouldn't help. You still need to modify the code that runs from flash
16:55:49petur"there is no disk"
16:56:37n1sbut if the bootloader still works you can swap back to a hd at least
16:57:54peturnls: that bootloader allows flashing only rockbox and not touching the bootloader part?
16:58:10n1safaiu yes
16:58:29peturthat would be nice
16:58:37*n1s also only has a h300 so haven't tried it first hand
17:01:04*petur has two h300 so can try flashing and send to Linus if it fails ;)
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17:03:30FrankOtton1s: does this new bootloader work on the H100?
17:03:55n1sFrankOtto: yes, it's called 7-pre4
17:04:33FrankOtton1s: i wonder where it loads from, it still has to detect a disk, doesn't it?
17:05:03peturit actually flashes two things: bootloader and rockbox itself
17:05:14n1sFrankOtto: it allows the rockbox main binary to be loaded from flash
17:05:58rasherSo really, linuxstb would be better using by-uuid rather than by-id at any rate..
17:05:59peturand updating that rockbox binary in flash is less risky than updating the bootloader
17:05:59FrankOttoum, the current stable bootloader for H100 (V6) does that too...
17:06:13rasherOops, scrollback..
17:06:49linuxstbrasher: ?
17:07:17rasherlinuxstb: /dev/by-uuid is the filesystem id, which should be more consistent than by-id (should even work if you put the harddrive in an adaptor!
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17:07:49linuxstbYes, although it changes whenever I reformat. But I guess I can live with that.
17:08:10rasherAh, right
17:08:12FrankOtton1s: I only updated the bootloader once, all rockbox updates since then I did by simply updating the files on the disk.
17:08:47FrankOtton1s: or maybe I'm in error about what constitutes the "rockbox main binary"?
17:09:00linuxstbrasher: Also, once Rockbox's UMS drive is up to speed (literally), I can't see a need for ever using the OF's. So I don't care about consistency any more...
17:09:27rasherThere is that
17:09:46n1sthe rockbox.iriver file is the main binary, the v7 bootloader allows this to be loaded from flash instead of disk (or to be run directly in flash)
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17:12:16FrankOtton1s: please excuse my ignorance, but what is "flash" for the H100? The place where the original iriver firmware is? I'm confused.
17:12:34n1syes, it's where the OF is
17:12:44FrankOttoi see
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17:13:43FrankOtton1s: but is it then possible to update the firmware even when no disk is found?
17:15:18n1sFrankOtto: my suggestion was that instead of trying to modify the bootloader directly, start a modified rockbox from flash and if that fails, swap back to the hd, and boot from that to flash a new rockbox image
17:16:10FrankOtton1s: now i understand. thank you.
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17:20:52FrankOtton1s: this sounds indeed like a reasonably safe way. how does the new bootloader control whether to load the rockbox.iriver from flash or from disk? I guess one has to press some button, right? Sorry, have trouble finding info about the new bootloader in the documentation pages.
17:21:40linuxstbIIRC, you hold record to boot from disk
17:22:58kugelI have a question: If bmp_resize was in SVN, would we be interested in keeping those option flags in the Cl tag? l,c,r/t,c,b and i,s,d
17:23:38FrankOtton1s: thanks, that was too obvious for me to find it :-)
17:24:35Horschtkugel, does bmp_resize also upscale?
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17:25:38Horschtthe I think we should keep c, as upscaling makes pictures look ugly, and should therefore keep smaller pictures centered
17:26:12kugelgood point
17:27:44kugelHorscht: C doesn't prevent scaling
17:27:46GodEaterhello dan_a - long time no see :)
17:27:54kugelbut i and d do
17:29:22Horschtbut wouldn'z it be more usefull to have c prevent scaling? as to prevent upscaling?
17:29:23J3TC-Wait, so bmp_resize does upscale the image too?
17:29:38Horschtjust my 2c
17:29:49J3TC-Well upscaling wouldn't be too bad if you have to upscale a tiny bit to fill up a space or something
17:29:54dan_aHi GodEater - I've not had time to do any coding for months... but I thought I'd poke my head in, and see what was going on
17:30:19Horschtwould kill aspect ratio, wouldn't it, J3TC-?
17:30:34GodEaterdan_a: read any recent logs ?
17:30:42GodEaterthe USB stuff has come along leaps and bounds
17:30:42J3TC-Why would it?
17:30:52GodEaterit's usable to actually transfer files now :)
17:30:57J3TC-Let's say a photo is already at 90x90 and need to upscale to 100x100
17:31:18Horschtwould make it ugly. Upscaling never really looks good
17:31:19dan_aGodEater: I saw and was impressed
17:31:38kugelHorscht: you can set the d flag to prevent upscaling, c does allign it to center
17:32:00J3TC-I guess but it's still a matter of preference. I'm just saying why kill upscaling all in all
17:32:05J3TC-Also my 2c ;)
17:32:14GodEaterin other news, the Gigabeat S port is coming along nicely - we can get to the point where we can see the Rockbox menu on the screen, and navigate the filesystem
17:32:45Horschtmy 2 cents are european, and more worth than american ones, J3TC- :p
17:32:48markunGodEater: what are the major problems?
17:33:17Horschtanyways, I think having a Tag that prevents upscaling (d as kugel mentioned) is fair enough
17:33:22GodEatermarkun: with what ?
17:33:30markunthe Gigabeat S port
17:34:08n1smarkun: no ums mode is a big annoyance
17:34:11GodEatererm - we need some more low level people working on it - it really *needs* the UMS from the USB stack to make it workable
17:34:18markunn1s: ah yes
17:34:26GodEaterwe can't transfer an entire .rockbox tree yet for example
17:34:41markundid anyone start adapting the USB code for the Gigabeat?
17:34:50GodEaterNico_P had a look, but it's over his head
17:34:56GodEaterand if it's over his head, it's sure as hell over mine
17:35:04 Nick DrMoos is now known as moos (
17:35:23linuxstbGodEater: A relatively easy hack would be to incorporate an "untar" feature in the bootloader - so instead of searching the OF files for a rockbox binary, it would look for a .tar, untar it, then delete it.
17:35:39GodEaterlinuxstb: strangely I was just thinking that too
17:36:09dan_aHow easy are Gigabeat Ss to get hold of nowadays?
17:36:23GodEaterdan_a: there was a recent glut of them on ebay
17:36:31GodEaterrecent being "about a month ago"
17:36:38GodEaterI've not looked more recently than that
17:37:34gevaertsIt should be pretty straightforward though, as far as I know only usb_init_device() and usb_pin_detect() from usb-fw-pp502x.c need to be redone for iMX31. It's probably mostly a question of someone trying things out.
17:39:02gevaertsSo it's basically finding out which device-enable bit controls usb, and which GPIO bit has the plugin-detection.
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17:39:51*GodEater resolves to read the reference manual again
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17:41:53gevaertsOnce it starts to work usb-drv-pp502x.c will need to be moved, since it is not actually portalplayer-specific
17:46:39gevaertsMaybe someone needs to start by verifying if the controller appears at 0x43F88000 like the spec says.
17:49:23Nico_PGodEater, linuxstb: I hadn't thought of the tar idea
17:49:52GodEaterI'll admit I was thinking more of "unzip" than "untar" - but it was the same concept
17:49:57Nico_Pan untar plugin should be quite easy to weite
17:50:04Nico_Punzip is harder
17:50:13GodEaterhow you going to run the plugin ? :)
17:50:18GodEateryou've got to get it to the S first
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17:50:35GodEateryou need to put it in the bootloader like linuxstb said
17:50:57n1sGodEater: it seems from the block diagram that usb-detect is done by the pm and afaik spi isn't working so we can't talk to the pm...
17:51:09*Nico_P stupid
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17:51:46Nico_PGodEater: not necessarily in the BL, the core would do fine
17:52:04GodEateror that
17:52:11GodEateralthough that would be messier
17:52:25GodEaterthe rockbox.gigabeat wouldn't be in the .rockbox dir you extracted
17:52:38GodEaterI have to shoot off now
17:52:43GodEatertalk to you guys later
17:52:43saratogais it possible to replace the screen on a gigabeat S?
17:52:56linuxstbIt would also make it easier - you can remove the search for rockbox.gigabeat from the bootloader, and just do the untar check before looking for it.
17:53:23Nico_Plinuxstb: yeah, makes sense
17:53:45linuxstbAnd if the bootloader deleted the .tar file, then subsequent boots would have no files to search
17:54:25 Join DerPapst [0] (
17:54:38Nico_PI thought of that too, but I'm not sure the MTP DB would pick that up
17:54:46*DerPapst waves at the rockbox folks
17:55:05linuxstbNico_P: Would it matter? Or would the MTP database get upset?
17:55:28Nico_PI don't know. I guess it needs testing. Also do tar files have a recognizable header?
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18:00:54toffe82saratoga: yes you can replace the lcd but it is hard to find one
18:02:04saratogatoffe82: thanks
18:02:28linuxstbNico_P: They should have "ustar" at offset 0x101.
18:02:56 Nick fxb is now known as fxb__ (
18:03:23Nico_Plinuxstb: I think I'll try that now unless you intend to$
18:03:50 Nick JdGordon|zzz is now known as JdGordon (
18:06:11linuxstbNico_P: No, I've no time at the moment. The tar format is very simple though - basically just a 512 byte header, then file 1 (padded to 512 bytes), then another 512 byte header, then file 2 etc
18:06:14 Join petur [50] (n=petur@rockbox/developer/petur)
18:06:46linuxstbThere's no "global" header - so "cat file1.tar file2.tar > file3.tar" gives you a valid tar file.
18:06:47Nico_Pyes, and there already is some code to deal with it (that you wrote)
18:08:35linuxstbYes -
18:09:31linuxstbNico_P: Ah, you played with that patch as well ;)
18:09:50Nico_Pyes :)
18:10:25 Quit Horscht ("electromagnetic radiation from satellite debris")
18:10:35kugelNico_P, linuxstb: AFAIK there was a tar plugin on the tracker (I think it even featured gz)
18:11:14 Quit jgarvey (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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18:13:51Nico_Pkugel: FS #7807 ? AFAICS it only does g(un)zip
18:14:12kugelNico_P: Yea, I meant that. I just noticed too, that it doesn't tar
18:16:51kugelNico_P: But there's written, that it is configured for reading .tgz
18:17:27kugelisn't .tgz a gzip'd tar?
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18:17:33krazykityes it is
18:17:49kugelSo, it's probably able to read tar as well
18:18:40Nico_Pkugel: I think I'll keep it simple and stick to tar
18:18:55 Quit perrikwp (" ajax IRC Client")
18:21:37kugelNico_P: Sure, I'd stick to tar only too, at least as having in the core is concerned
18:23:44linuxstbkugel: We're just talking about a temporary hack for the Gigabeat S bootloader
18:23:51kugelI know
18:24:07linuxstbAnd it's not in the core, it's in the bootloader.
18:24:36kugel"Nico_P: GodEater: not necessarily in the BL, the core would do fine"
18:25:15kugelAnyway, I could've written core/bootloader, the point is the same (at least for me)
18:25:26Nico_Pkugel: I now think putting it in the BL is a better idea
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18:34:27*petur is looking for an h300 bootloader patching specialist
18:35:03peturscramble tells me "This doesn't look like a valid decoded iHP firmware - reason: file 'length' data"
18:36:20peturdescramble and mkboot didn't report errors
18:36:37petursome checksum thing I have to disable somewhere?
18:38:11SSnakepetur what do u need?
18:38:20 Quit DerPapst (Nick collision from services.)
18:38:27SSnakemaybe i can be of some help
18:38:45peturI'm trying to build & patch my own h300 bootloader
18:38:48***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
18:38:56 Join DerPapst [0] (
18:39:00SSnakedid u follow the wiki?
18:39:28SSnakei mean the scramble -"option etc"
18:40:01SSnakeit needs a -h300 option if i'm not wrong
18:40:02petur../tools/scramble -iriver h300_patched.bin H300_patched.hex
18:40:34peturoh wait - mkboot had a wrong argument
18:40:36 Quit conando (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
18:40:37SSnake(actually don't remeber the correct option)
18:40:40 Join conando [0] (
18:40:44*petur kicks head
18:40:53linuxstbSSnake: How's your game coming along?
18:41:02SSnakemy game is finished
18:41:16SSnake@ petur: i told you because i've had the same problem
18:41:20linuxstbHave you posted a patch?
18:41:30peturworked fine now, thanks
18:41:35SSnake@petur: and the story is: alway look twice
18:41:49 Join gevaerts [0] (
18:42:04*petur goes flashing the bootloader and hopes all goes well :)
18:42:05SSnakeno nothing, i didn't register either
18:42:18SSnakethe story is this:
18:42:42SSnakei'm developing a porting from a linux game to rockbox
18:42:50SSnakeit's a thesis project
18:43:02 Join Christus [0] (
18:43:08SSnakenow the porting is over (and it's quite nice)
18:43:24SSnakeand i have to let my teacher see it first
18:43:49peturfilesize went from 2,5MB to 4MB - does that sound OK?
18:43:55SSnakethen i'll make my thesis, clean the code, add some sound support and commit to svn
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18:44:27hcscool, what game?
18:44:37SSnakeit will be a surprise :>
18:44:58SSnakeall i can say it's a great old shool '80 platform game
18:45:18SSnakewas one of my favourite games on my c64 :>
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18:46:10*petur discovers his iriver has a flat battery - better charge before flashing
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18:46:37 Quit pondlife (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
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18:47:51 Join mrfree [0] (n=mrfree@
18:47:56mrfreehi all
18:48:21mrfreeis there a plugin to add ARM support to rockbox?
18:48:46SSnakearm support?
18:48:56mrfreeoops... amr :)
18:48:57SSnakedo u mean to compile for arm cpu?
18:49:07mrfreeamr audio file
18:49:09krazykitmrfree, do a search. if you don't see one, it doesn't exist.
18:49:24SSnakenever heard about that
18:50:18mrfreeit is usually used on cellphones
18:53:16linuxstbmrfree: Seems there is no open source decoder for AMR - ffmpeg (which would have it if it exists) relies on libamr
18:53:33 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
18:54:01*gevaerts feels like an idiot
18:54:18mrfreeok, I'll convert it in ogg using mplayer ;)
18:54:38rashergevaerts: any breakthrough-by-not-being-a-fool?
18:55:13linuxstbrasher: Maybe he just left his DAP at work...
18:55:20 Quit PaulJam (".")
18:55:27gevaertsrasher: it's not a big issue. Just that UMS didn't work anymore because I forgot that I had disabled this force-full-speed thing earlier for other tests
18:55:43gevaertslinuxstb: it's not that bad. I did forget the usb cable at home today though
18:56:42 Quit tvelocity ("Αποχώρησε")
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18:59:56SSnakebye all
18:59:59 Part SSnake
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19:01:33preglowi assume wavpack files work fine on x5?
19:01:39 Quit pacalNord (Client Quit)
19:02:26*linuxstb would assume so do
19:02:42*linuxstb scratches head and wonders why his brain typed that
19:03:01 Quit asdrubal (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
19:03:09preglowcan someone on x5 test a wavpack file?
19:03:28 Quit mrfree ("Leaving")
19:03:37*petur crosses fingers
19:03:55 Join Arathis [0] (
19:04:18preglowworks fine on h120, so don't really see how it can fail
19:05:34moospreglow: hi, if you have a test file I can test that quickly now
19:06:24moosbut can't think any reason why it will not work just for x5
19:06:51preglowwell, i'll see if i can find a short clip
19:08:44moosok let's see...
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19:11:45asdrubal #rockbox-community
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19:17:32moospreglow: all is fine here
19:19:21mooswhat is the bug suposed to be?
19:20:57 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
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19:22:45preglowmoos: crash
19:22:54preglowmoos: thanks for testing
19:23:15moosyou can close the task, no problemo
19:24:46moosmaybe he have problematic file
19:25:10preglowi won't close it, but i'll ask him to test that file as well
19:27:47 Join GodEater_ [50] (n=bryan@rockbox/staff/GodEater)
19:28:02moosdon't know if he tested with files generated by recording, x5 can record
19:28:07 Quit perrikwp (" ajax IRC Client")
19:29:36rasherjhMikeS: Why does the e200 use the left/right buttons for seeking in mpegplayer? Feels awfully wrong since you have to flip the device to watch the movie
19:31:00*gevaerts can't get usb_serial to work
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19:39:40*gevaerts doesn't like it when 'sudo halt' suddenly appears in his command history, and this evil enter key starts attracting fingers again
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19:48:21rasher12 complete translations..
19:51:23 Join LambdaCalculus37 [0] (n=44a0430f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
19:53:13gevaertsI shouldn't have done more than one not-entirely-stable thing at the same time
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19:57:42 Part jon-kha_ ("[IRSSI] You can breathe without Irssi, but I wouldn't recommend it")
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20:02:06 Join Buschel [0] (
20:06:46XavierGrpetur: yeah that size is correct, all my bootloaders are around 3.99MB
20:07:22peturXavierGr: flashed and partially working (still ata -80)
20:07:58XavierGrpetur: also try to fiddle with the bootloader after the instructions that load the OF, in my little experience (when I was trying to see where the bootloader hangs) it is pretty failsafe and even if you code something silly you can still load the OF if you didn't touch that part
20:08:26*petur is reading CF specs atm ;)
20:09:12 Quit asdrubal (Remote closed the connection)
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20:12:47jac0b-workusing the multifont patch my menu is using the system font even through I specified a custom font is there something that I am missing
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20:15:31jac0b-workhere is my cfg file
20:15:35JdGordon|wjac0b-work: 1) the work suffix is |w and 2) you know we dont support custom builds
20:16:24markunwork suffix??
20:16:38*JdGordon|w was being silly :p
20:17:00 Nick jac0b-work is now known as jac0b|w (n=jac0b-wo@
20:17:30markunJdGordon|w: I read the irc guidelines just now to be sure ;)
20:17:54JdGordon|whaha its not actually in it is it?
20:18:17jac0b|wI thought I would ask since I was flamed for posting comments on flyspray
20:18:21markunno, I don't see anything which forbids changing your nick all the time
20:18:42markunjac0b|w: people like flaming
20:18:57jac0b|wI have noticed
20:19:21jac0b|wbut its okay I should have read the past comments and some of my questions would have been explained
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20:20:06Buschelamiconn/jhMike: one of you there?
20:20:18JdGordon|wcertain types of comments on the tracker are infuriating... so if your comment was one of them I have no sympathy
20:20:56jac0b|wit probably was
20:21:09LloreanFrom the fact you admitted that you didn't read past comments first.... yeah...
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20:22:44jac0b|wvery ttrue
20:23:23jac0b|wnow I know. And knowing is half the battle :)
20:23:57kugeljac0b|w: This is obviously an issue which is not discussed in the tracker, it's ok to post that once.
20:25:16jac0b|wyeah I accidentally posted the same thing twice. I wish there was a delete option for posts
20:25:32kugeljac0b|w: I assume removing the viewport.c hunk was not enough, use a version which doesn't need viewport lists, i.e. "multifont-20080108a.patch" is what I am using without viewports list
20:26:51jac0b|wthanks but I don't care about the hunk errors just as long as I know they are not needed
20:27:52kugeljac0b|w: Please understand me. No hunk errors doesn't mean the patch is working!
20:28:08jac0b|wI am thinking of maybe adding the list_viewports to my build
20:29:10 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
20:29:18jac0b|wit had a problem when I first added it with the background freezing
20:29:48jac0b|wkugel: very true
20:30:08 Join ap0 [0] (
20:30:29jac0b|wI got that with the disable wps updating patch
20:30:44kugelAnd in the same way, ignoring hunks you don't need doesn't mean the patch is working. Especially when the patch relies on another one you didn't add
20:31:34jac0b|wkugel: ah that could be why my menu font is not working
20:32:25kugelThat's what I'm trying to tell you...
20:32:58jac0b|wkugel: thanks I will try it when I get home
20:33:19jac0b|wI tried instaling cygwin here at work but the comp is licked down
20:34:01 Quit ap0 ("KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies")
20:34:17jac0b|wI do have the admin pw but I don't was to abuse it or get busted
20:34:43 Join bluebrother [0] (n=dom@rockbox/staff/bluebrother)
20:35:01Buschelwhen crossfading is used -> are there two decoder instancies used? if so -> can both boost the cpu?
20:38:51***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
20:40:35Buscheland third question: are these instancies running both on CPU or on CPU/COP?
20:41:18preglowBuschel: no
20:41:19n1safaik only one decoder runs
20:41:31preglowdecoding is done very far in advance
20:41:44preglowand only one decoder is ever run
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20:41:49preglowno overlap between instances
20:42:13 Quit amiconn (" Fensteraufdatum")
20:42:22preglowcrossfading is quite simply achieved by pre-buffering the output of the entire fadeout
20:42:51Buschelpreglow: so, when crossfading from mp3 to ogg -> mp3 pre-decodes to the end (buffered) and next track will be started to decode then
20:43:00 Quit GodEater_ ("I was raided by the FBI and all I got to keep was this lousy quit message!")
20:43:22preglowBuschel: yes, afaik
20:44:29Buschelhmm, do you have any idea why the power management change shall have any impact on crossfading? before asking my questions i thought about boosting from several instancies...
20:45:41BuschelFS #8597
20:47:03*ender` yawns
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20:57:18*gevaerts also forgot to define USE_ROCKBOX_USB
20:58:02rashergevaerts: Welcome to the clup
20:59:50*bluebrother just forgot that too.
21:00:02gevaertsunfortunately there seem to be more issues than that in my current code
21:01:36amiconnBuschel: Here now.
21:01:47*gevaerts notices that there seem to be many people testing this patch who don't report problems
21:01:52*gevaerts thinks that is a good sign
21:02:10*amiconn still needs an identify dump from a nano
21:02:20 Part low_light
21:02:50 Part jon-kha ("[IRSSI] Pretzel Boy uses Irssi. Shouldn't you?")
21:03:01 Join jon-kha [0] (
21:04:19scorche|wamiconn: if you give me a patch, i can do it in...6-ish hours
21:05:01preglowi have a nano
21:05:03preglowwhat is needed?
21:05:05amiconnobo: I wonder why you changed backlight behaviour. A while ago, I purposely changed backlight behaviour on shutdown. It should stay on until the hardware cuts power, in order to verify that it did shut down for real, and didn't hang
21:05:19bertrikit should be simple using a software USB sniffer
21:05:23amiconnpreglow: The ata identify info block, in raw binary form
21:05:39preglowamiconn: how do i access this? i am in windows right now, but shall be in linux in a couple of hours
21:05:51bertrikoh ATA, sorry
21:06:01amiconnI want to check whether it's possible to teach the ata driver only to use certain features after checking they're supported by the disk
21:06:27amiconn-> No more special ifdefing for nano, or cf card mods. Also cleaner
21:07:26preglowamiconn: does sound sweet, but how do i go about getting this information?
21:07:49*amiconn will prepare a (dead simple) patch
21:08:14preglowamiconn: i can't use a patch right now, though, so if you want immediate results, you'll have to give me a build
21:08:33preglowif not, i can do my own build in a few hours
21:09:23LearBuschel: Far fetched perhaps, but your patch does affect audio hardware, afaict...
21:09:24bluebrothergevaerts: current patch reports hard disc model and firmware revision instead of "Apple iPod" on my mini. I guess this is intended?
21:09:46bluebrotherand OF reports ANSI: 0 while your patch reports 3.
21:12:00gevaertsbluebrother: we could change the model name, but that could lead to an explosion of ifdefs. There was some discussion a few days ago about this
21:12:32bluebrothergevaerts: missed that. But I have no objections to reporting the drive model
21:13:14gevaertsbluebrother: the ANSI version should be 3. Reporting 0 makes the job harder for the OS for no good reason (note that we actually don't support all needed commands yet to be compliant with what we claim)
21:16:17gevaertsbluebrother: we had a discussion earlier today, and those involved then (linuxstb, Zagor and me) agreed that standards compliance is more important than exactly mimicking the OF
21:17:34bluebrotherI absolutely agree.
21:17:41*bluebrother goes checking the logs
21:17:53gevaertsWe were mostly talking about the usb serial number then
21:17:53amiconnpreglow: Are you running a recent rockbox?
21:18:12preglowamiconn: four-five days old
21:18:17amiconnWould save me a bit of compilation time as I would the only 'make bin'
21:19:38amiconnOkay, last api change was earlier than that (1 Feb)
21:21:26 Quit kugel ("ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox]")
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21:24:56oboamiconn: it's purely cosmetic to get rid of the white flash - would a call to _backlight_led_off() be better?
21:25:21amiconnThe backlight should stay on - that's what was intended
21:25:47amiconnYes it causes a short white flash (noticeability depends on what background you're using normally)
21:26:14oboyes - I really noticed it today using cabbiev2
21:27:27amiconnBut switching the backlight off would cause the battery to be emptied without even noticeing, if the shutdown hangs after switching the light off
21:27:39amiconnNow tell me what's better...
21:27:57obowell, apart from the Nano you get a fairly noticable HDD spin down?
21:28:10amiconnNot if no setting was changed
21:28:20amiconnThen the disk doesn't spin at all
21:29:03amiconnAnd btw, the flash to white only happens on Video afaik. All other targets don't clear the lcd on shutdown, hence no flash
21:30:11oboThey don't? The existing code was #ifdef HAVE_LCD_COLOR...
21:30:31oboAlso, the flyspray report was for a Nano
21:31:12amiconnMaybe nano too, but certainly no others
21:31:57amiconnAll other colour targets have LCDs of the pitch-black type, hence no white flash, if the lcd is shut down properly
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21:32:18 Quit Christus ("( :: NoNameScript 4.1 :: )")
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21:33:36amiconnA while ago I made the backlight thread disable its timeout on shutdown for exactly that reason - to have reliable feedback that the device really shut down
21:33:41 Quit linuxstb (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
21:33:57obowhat do you mean by "if the lcd is shut down properly"?
21:34:23amiconnI mean that the lcd is being shut down via its controller
21:34:43BigBambi My gigabeat hung on shutdown a few times a while back, having the backlight stay on would have been very helpful
21:34:50amiconnThe lcds of all colour targets except Video and Nano are of the 'normally black' type
21:36:04amiconnBigBambi: It does in all recent builds before today, unless the gigabeat shutdown code also contains code that defeats this safety measure
21:36:12amiconnLike the code obo added today :\
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21:37:16preglowscreen flashing white?
21:37:16amiconnYou'll find an extra menu item in the debug menu
21:37:18*preglow never saw that
21:37:39oboWell, the white flash is a by-product of trying to make sure there is no ghosting on shutdown...
21:38:02oboamiconn: when you did you recent LCD work, did you find a more graceful way to do the same thing?
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21:38:19amiconnWhat 'same thing'
21:38:40obomaking sure there is no ghosting when powering off
21:38:50amiconnThe backlight staying on was was introduced on purpose
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21:39:47amiconnAnd the Video LCD is of the normally white type, so there's no way to prevent that white flash without killing that safety measure
21:40:14BigBambiamiconn: This was quite a long time ago
21:40:50BigBambiBut nonetheless it should remain in my inconsequential opinion
21:40:59amiconnBut if this is really wanted (sacrificing safety for prettiness), it should at least be kept to those targets which really experience it (i.e. Video and *maybe* nano)
21:41:06LloreanBigBambi: Which should remain.
21:41:25preglowamiconn: only new entry i can find is "debug scrollwheel"
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21:41:38LloreanI definitely think the backlight should stay down during shutdown. The white flash isn't harmful, and knowing when your device is actually *off* is kinda beneficial.
21:42:01amiconnpreglow: Ahem... the #ifndef I checked is set for nano, grr
21:42:02*Bagder will now start setting the toppost-whiners moderated on the mailing list
21:42:21BigBambiLlorean: I mean the backlight staying on until actual shutdown, not turn off before so that you know when it is really off should remain
21:42:32amiconnpreglow: Sorry, will prepare a new build
21:42:43LloreanBagder: I even tried to be very, very polite this time to the first one. =/
21:42:49*gevaerts has been compiling one binary and testing another for the last 10 minutes
21:43:05BagderLlorean: it seems this happens _every_ time someone mentions this
21:43:21*petur disables reset_screen so he can actually read the debug info he's printing :/
21:43:32amiconnLlorean: That's what the code did before obo's commits today
21:43:45amiconn(except if the backlight is set to "always off")
21:43:47Lloreanamiconn: I know, I was speaking that I'm on your side here.
21:43:53BigBambiSo was I
21:44:09*obo gets ready to revert...
21:44:25preglowgevaerts: i do that all the time :P
21:44:27LloreanBagder: I understand the "you're interrupting the thread" argument from their point of view. And I could send private emails, but I do see some value in making it public as long as it's polite, to help remind everyone.
21:44:49LloreanBagder: Another option is to just take down names, and once a month have a warning email on rule issues, but I suspect it'd just never get read.
21:45:11amiconnpreglow: Same URL, new build. Sorry again.
21:45:16Bagderyeah, I've thought about monthly posts etc but I think it won't help much
21:45:42LloreanI suspect people won't read those under the assumption "my name won't be in there"
21:45:47preglowamiconn: no worries, will try now
21:45:54*bluebrother is tempted to write a response to that top-posting thread ...
21:46:13Bagder866 susbcribers right now btw
21:47:01 Join kugel [0] (n=kugel@unaffiliated/kugel)
21:47:43 Join dionoea_ [0] (
21:47:49BigBambiI look at the mailing list archives from time to time, shudder, and resolve to not look again, let alone subscribe
21:48:43amiconnThanks, got it
21:48:47oboamiconn: reverted
21:49:08n1sBigBambi: I unsubscribed from the user list quite quickly after realising my mistake :)
21:49:26amiconnobo: Perhaps we could set brightness to minimum in order to reduce the white flash effect
21:49:35amiconnThat would still keep the safety measure intact
21:49:56BigBambin1s: :)
21:50:30oboamiconn: that's true - I'll give it a test
21:51:35amiconnobo: Would be applicable to Video & Nano then.
21:51:55amiconnThe only 2 that might need it - rather convenient...
21:51:56preglowamiconn: any surprises in it
21:51:57oboamiconn: yes, I was just typing that #if in :)
21:52:24amiconnpreglow: Patience... need to check whether I need to byte-swap before reading it
21:52:36amiconnMy reference is from H180 which is big endian
21:53:04amiconnmarkun: around?
21:55:44*gevaerts wants to know ehy his sansa hangs when he tries to enable serial and mass storage at the same time
21:57:15peturhmmmm the non-working CF reports it supports PIO 4 but setting it seems to fail
21:57:26 Join SliMM [0] (n=Stefan@
21:57:41 Join MethoS-- [0] (
21:58:12SliMMi have some sort of a problem with initializing/updating the database
21:58:31 Part hcs
21:58:34 Quit dionoea (Remote closed the connection)
21:58:59SliMMiPod 5G 30 GB
21:59:35SliMMif the iPod is not connected to a power source, the initialization/update drains all the battery
21:59:46SliMMis this supposed to happen?
22:00:27SliMMbtw, i really enjoy the pp502x power-saving patch
22:00:45 Quit drkgeek ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:02:18Horschtyeah, Buschel did some nice work there :)
22:02:22oboamiconn: changing the brightness doesn't make that great a difference - I'll just leave it as-is
22:03:19SliMMHorscht: wouldn't disabeling the display be even better?
22:03:46Horschtdisabling the display would save battery, but it would stop usability
22:04:16SliMMHorscht: not with an option like "disable display on hold" or smth
22:04:47HorschtI think there is something like that in FS
22:05:11 Join dionoea [0] (
22:05:26SliMMoh, i really have to get rid of windows
22:05:40SliMMstarting the virtual machine is a pain
22:06:31kugelSliMM: What program?
22:06:59SliMMkugel: sorry?
22:07:07 Quit Absinthe ("Leaving")
22:07:13kugelwhich virtual machine program
22:07:19SliMMvmware player
22:07:27bluebrotherLCDs don't require much power. The backlight does.
22:07:57SliMMkugel: by "a pain" means i don't enjoy it, not that it is difficult :)
22:08:16SliMMbluebrother: no, but rendering WPSs do
22:08:31bluebrotherstill, it's not much.
22:08:35kugelI thought you mean pain as in allways having some sort of trouble when starting a vm
22:08:53*bluebrother likes having Windows available in a VM running on linux
22:08:56kugelI had bad trouble when I started a vm some time ago
22:09:27SliMMkugel: ah, no, i just don't feel like coding anymore after opening the virtual machine
22:11:26*preglow pours himself an imperial porter
22:11:35amiconnidentify info dumps from le targets are indeed byte-swapped
22:12:14 Join dionoea__ [0] (
22:12:27SliMMno idea about the db issue?
22:12:54 Quit dionoea (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
22:13:31bluebrotherSliMM: maybe some file has a broken tag that crashes the db scan? Have you checked the db status in the debug menu?
22:13:48rasherbluebrother: - re. your post on -dev
22:13:52 Quit scorche|w ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:14:02rasherNot that there aren't still a million issues
22:14:09 Join scorche|w [0] (n=42c007b2@rockbox/administrator/scorche)
22:14:40 Quit dionoea__ (Client Quit)
22:14:47SliMMbluebrother: whell, the progress was -1%, that's true, but maybe it's not a dash that indicates the negative value
22:14:55 Join dionoea [0] (
22:15:07 Join pixelma [50] (i=pixelma@rockbox/staff/pixelma)
22:15:36 Quit dionoea_ ("leaving")
22:15:52SliMMshould i give it another try and tell you the results?
22:15:55bluebrotherrasher: that would make the sim more user-friendly and I think it's worth looking into it. Still, I don't thing integrating the sim into rbutil is feasible
22:16:30rasherbluebrother: I do agree with that. I was just reminded
22:16:33bluebrotherSliMM: you should keep an eye on the filename it displays. Try removing that file and see if it goes further
22:17:09 Quit bertrik ("bye")
22:17:10SliMMbluebrother: it didn't stick to one file
22:17:20SliMMlet me do it again
22:17:31 Nick linuxstb_ is now known as linuxstb (n=linuxstb@rockbox/developer/linuxstb)
22:18:31SliMMbluebrother: Progress: -1% (%d entries)
22:18:33 Join J3TC- [0] (
22:18:35SliMMis this normal?
22:18:45 Join csc` [0] (n=csc@archlinux/user/csc)
22:19:32bluebrotherI'm not that familiar with the db. I think it happened in the past, not sure if that still happens.
22:20:20SliMMok, i'll plug the iPod back in then, i want my DB to be up-to-date :-)
22:21:40 Join broom [0] (n=4fd3e76b@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:21:49gevaertsDoes anyone here know why there usb_init_device() in usb-fw-pp502x.c is reading and writing to 0x7000002C and 0x70000028 ?
22:21:56SliMMbluebrother: does the hold button (on the iPod) phisically disable the buttons?
22:22:38bluebrotherunless my memory serves me wrong ;-)
22:22:55SliMMso it's just software?
22:23:08scorche|wi thought it was hardware on the ipods..
22:23:25broomHello. A couple of days ago, something about database.ignore has been committed to the rockbox manual. But I can't find the piece in the manual. I've searched the online manual but could not find it. Where is it? Could someone help please?
22:23:50bluebrotherscorche|w: iirc the hold switch is used in doom.
22:24:25scorche|wbluebrother: but wasnt it just to activate the menu?
22:24:34SliMMbluebrother: yes, but you have to use it twice, if you just leave the hold on, you can't use the other buttons
22:24:43amiconnThe hold switch disables the buttons in hardware, but it can be read itself
22:25:08bluebrotherah, so my memory was wrong. Sorry.
22:25:23 Quit LambdaCalculus37 ("CGI:IRC 0.5.9 (2006/06/06)")
22:26:32*scorche|w nods
22:27:08amiconnpreglow: One thing I found is that the Nano flash disk supports the advanced power management feature set, but it isn't enabled.
22:27:53amiconnThis has nothing to do with the freeze when sending the sleep command, but we should probably enable that feature if we program it for minimum power in set_features() ...
22:28:37 Quit bluebrother ("leaving")
22:28:48amiconnIdentify word 86 bit 3
22:31:24broomHm... I've found the text about db.ignore in the SVN manual but it's not in the 'compiled' manual. Is something wrong with the build script?
22:32:27 Quit tvelocity ("Αποχώρησε")
22:33:09broomIt is in tagcache.tex
22:33:17amiconnpreglow: I'm a bit puzzled, btw. The ata driver *does* send the sleep command on nano. However, it doesn't use soft reset on wakeup
22:34:53amiconneh? We do enable advanced power management if it's supported, yet the nano reports it as supported but not enabled??
22:35:00JdGordon|wbroom: the manuals are only compiled once a day (iirc) so depnds when that was changed it might not be up yet
22:35:42pixelmabroom: you're right, the manuals state they are of yesterday (13th) so it seems today's daily is missing
22:36:17 Join freqmod__nx [0] (
22:36:25peturamiconn: do you have a good CF spec sheet? mine here seems to miss a few bits
22:36:48amiconnI only have the ata specs (ata 5, 6 and 7)
22:36:57*Bagder builds the manuals manually to see if something is weird
22:37:22 Quit nicktastique ("Leaving")
22:37:39pixelmaBagder: does the script use "make manual" or only "make" in a manual configured build?
22:37:43peturI'm looking at the CF spec 4.0 and thereś no mention of the upper bits of word 83
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22:37:54pixelmaBagder: see n1s's changes
22:38:00Bagderyes it does
22:38:21Bagderyes, now I remember reading that
22:38:29 Join drkgeek [0] (n=a9cc761c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:38:49*pixelma wants a cookie now, too :)
22:38:52***Saving seen data "./dancer.seen"
22:39:29*n1s feels stupid for forgetting to check...
22:40:20Bagderfresh manuals for everyone soon available
22:40:38peturamiconn: while you're also looking in the spec sheets: the failing CF has 82=0x7008 and 83=0x400C
22:40:39n1snice :)
22:41:01pixelmascorche: thanks :)
22:42:17 Join DerDome [0] (
22:43:19amiconnpetur: Looks quite normal. The Nano has 82=0x7069 and 83=0x4008
22:43:54preglowamiconn: i think the soft reset is what hangs
22:44:16peturI'm adding more debug info to find which feature fails
22:44:23amiconnFor comparison, Mini G2 (microdrive) has 82=0x7069 and 83=0x500c
22:44:46amiconnpreglow: According to the #ifdefs in ata.c it is - but I wonder why
22:45:02preglowamiconn: ahh, yes, i remember i debugged it once and discovered that was the reason
22:45:04amiconnSoftware reset support is mandatory for ata devices according to the specs
22:45:07preglowamiconn: i have _no_ idea why
22:45:20preglowlots of things is weird with nano ata
22:45:29preglowamong other the kick-ass slowness...
22:45:44amiconnHmm, but if we find no clean way to autodetect, that hack needs to stay, which is bad
22:45:54linuxstbCould the init be wrong? IIRC, no r-e was done for the Nano - the existing ipod driver was used as it was.
22:45:55*gevaerts just uploaded another patch without any spectacular changes
22:46:07amiconnA usual hdd needs this reset in order to return from sleep mode
22:46:51 Quit drkgeek ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:47:11 Quit Lear ("ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox 3.0b4pre/2008021304]")
22:47:11 Join cow__ [0] (n=cow@
22:47:40 Quit obo ("bye")
22:47:48amiconnI have a suspicion though
22:47:51 Join Kevalar [0] (n=a9cc761c@gateway/web/cgi-irc/
22:47:59preglowamiconn: pray tell
22:47:59 Part SliMM
22:48:20Kevalarhey, (other than batterylife) does playing with the boost/frequency harm the player? like overclocking a PC?
22:48:28amiconnThe Nano flash disk probably reacts to the reset just fine - but then falls back to its default pio mode, which is not pio4, and hence our timings are wrong
22:48:28preglowKevalar: no
22:48:33cow__This is the IRC channel for the Rockbox project, right?
22:48:39preglowamiconn: sounds very logical, yes
22:48:43amiconnSo any further communication will fails
22:48:45preglowcow__: correct
22:48:52BigBambiKevalar: You are actually underclocking and running normally, not normal + overclocking
22:49:00 Quit dan_a (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
22:49:10cow__I don't know much about this kind of stuff, but I was searching around on the internet and stumbled upon it.
22:49:24BigBambiIn that case, I direct you to our fine manual
22:49:25amiconnWe need to reset our timings to pio0, do the reset, program the fastest available pio mode, and then adjust our timings, in order to have it correctly working for all ata disks
22:49:44preglowamiconn: well, how much do we know about the pp ata regs? :/
22:49:57amiconnIf it's really that, then it is pure luck that the toshiba disks don't care
22:50:11cow__I checked the list and my current mp3 player isn't supported at the moment, so I think I might try to get an old iPod and get it working... I've been wanting a media device with .ogg support for a while. Manual?
22:50:28preglowcow__: manual?
22:50:35amiconnpreglow: Not that much yet, but that theory can be verified independent of pp ata register knowledge
22:50:44cow__I don't know, I wasn't sure if BigBambi was talking to me.
22:50:46BigBambicow__: From the left side of every page of is a link to our lovely manual
22:50:47amiconnpetur: You're experimenting on iriver?
22:50:48*petur feels like a DJ, swapping hdd and CF all the time
22:50:55KevalarI have the boost set a 1, so the MHz is at 80000000 or somthing like that. So there are no adverse effects of doing so?
22:50:58BigBambicow__: I anticipated a question :)
22:51:00peturto get my CF working
22:51:03preglowamiconn: can you read back transfer mode from the hd/flash bridge?
22:51:03cow__Alright. I'll take a look at it, thanks.
22:51:10BigBambiKevalar: no
22:51:13amiconnThen you could try to verify that theory... on cf we *do* know how to program the timing
22:52:35peturthe CF is failing on powermanagement
22:53:01 Join RvX [0] (
22:53:02peturfeature[0] goes wrong
22:53:22amiconnThat's weird
22:53:32amiconnIt claims to support power management....
22:53:34*gevaerts wonders if anyone actually ever tried high-speed usb support on anything other than sansa
22:54:04peturamiconn: maybe all SET_FEATURE calls go wrong, of course
22:54:38RvXI have a problem while compiling rockbox from source. When I type 'make', it stops with error: /usr/bin/am-elf-ld: cannot find -lgcc
22:54:44amiconnSET_FEATURES is mandatory
22:55:41peturI'll do a run without it then
22:55:43amiconnpreglow: pm
22:55:53RvXWhat may be wrong with my configuration?
22:56:15 Quit mf0102 ("Verlassend")
22:57:20n1sRvX: do you have arm-elf-gcc installed and in your path?
22:58:02RvXn1s: I have it installed, but how to check if it is in my path?
22:58:37n1sdoes typing just "arm-elf-gcc" in the console find it?
22:58:37 Quit Kevalar ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
22:58:58 Quit cow__ ("Lost terminal")
22:59:13RvX(arm-elf-gcc: no input files)
22:59:26n1sand you created a build dir inside your rockbox source tree and ran configure in it?
22:59:37RvXyes, I did
23:00:06BagderRvX: how did you install this toolchain?
23:01:35 Quit major_works ("ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox]")
23:01:37RvXI did pacman -S cross-arm-elf-gcc-base (I'm on Archlinux)
23:01:55Bagderthen I blame that
23:02:09BagderI've never seen anyone miss libgcc before
23:02:14peturamiconn: now it boots :)
23:02:27BagderRvX: really is a better approach
23:02:55Bagderat least more proven
23:03:01Bagderfor rockbox
23:03:12RvXwhere can I find it?
23:03:33RvXOh, there it is
23:05:12 Join einhirn [0] (
23:05:44RvXI know then.
23:05:55RvXIt's gcc version I was trying to use
23:06:22Bagderwhy would any version have problems with libgcc?
23:06:37XavierGrpetur: boots and works without problems?
23:07:06RvXBagder: I don't know, but there was similiar problem to mine before.
23:07:10peturI'm now building rockbox itslef, as it gives -80 at startup ;)
23:07:38*petur also copies some music on it
23:07:58RvX (and search for libgcc)
23:07:59*amiconn wonders why petur wants a CF card in an iriver
23:08:04broomHrm. Now zipped html manual has gone! (on
23:08:08 Quit TMM (Remote closed the connection)
23:08:08amiconnOther than for experimenting, I mean
23:08:18peturamiconn: my new field recorder
23:08:39 Join niiko [0] (
23:09:09peturand nice volume upgrades in the future ;)
23:09:55*amiconn thinks that the irivers are way too big that they would make a good flash player
23:10:08 Join FrankOtto [0] (
23:10:40*XavierGr starts drumroll and waits for petur :p
23:10:54*petur unmounts
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23:11:21 Quit Phill (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:11:31FrankOttoamiconn: i'm also trying to get CF in iriver working, mostly for added capacity; 32GB is now available
23:12:07*amiconn has an H180 and an H340, so CF wouldn't add capacity :)
23:12:25peturmust have done something wrong, still -80
23:12:26FrankOttoand compatible disks bigger than the original 20GB are impossible to obtain
23:12:33RvXThanks for advice, Bagder. I'll try to deal with it later. Bye.
23:12:38XavierGrin fact I could use a cf card for my H115 in the car
23:12:43XavierGrI could use the extra space
23:12:54XavierGrpetur: in bootloader or the firmware?
23:13:00*petur idiot
23:13:03scorche|wpetur: could you hop into #rockbox-community for a moment?
23:13:03FrankOttoadded advantages: faster seeks, longer battery runtime, lower weight, lower noise
23:13:34FrankOttopetur: good luck with your experiments!
23:14:18amiconnPut a CF card into the small H10. That would make a nice flash player....
23:14:24peturI only removed set_features in the bootloader code :)
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23:17:30 Quit RvX ("ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox]")
23:17:50peturerm.. it was removed... /me puzzled
23:18:22 Quit aneka ("KVIrc 3.2.4 Anomalies")
23:19:11FrankOttopetur: are you doing your experiments with running rockbox.iriver from flash (instead of from disk), as n1s suggested some hours ago?
23:19:29peturno, regular bootloader flashing
23:19:49FrankOttoyou are brave...
23:20:45 Join aneka [0] (n=kvirc@
23:23:15peturhmmmm it works almost
23:23:23amiconnDepends on how "precious" the device is for you...
23:23:42petursometimes I can browse and play music, sometimes it doesn't respond
23:23:43*amiconn would probably do this kind of experiments with his H340, but not with his H180
23:24:09peturI do this on my spare h320 ;)
23:24:25 Join Absinthe [0] (
23:24:36amiconnSpare devices == good :)
23:25:12niikoRockbox lets me flip the screen? I LOVE YOU GUYS!
23:26:28peturamiconn: this is strange: when I tap 'files', the disk icon flashes briefly but it doesn't do anything. Reboot it and it works ok
23:27:02amiconnSeems you experience the occasional hang on cf targets, just more often...
23:27:18*amiconn had one of those just today on his H180
23:28:03pixelmapetur: reboot or "need for a paper clip"?
23:28:20amiconnPaper clip I think
23:28:28peturit stays responsive, just will not browse at all
23:28:39amiconnOh, then that's different
23:28:46petur"spinup time: 0ms"
23:28:51pixelmathat's why I asked ;)
23:29:10peturhmmm IORDY support: no
23:30:23peturhrmm.. now it shows an emnpty root
23:31:09n1ssounds reliable ;P
23:32:29 Quit desowin ()
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23:43:09 Quit broom ("CGI:IRC (EOF)")
23:44:22 Quit Arathis ("Bye, bye")
23:45:08 Quit gevaerts ("feeling sleepy")
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23:50:01 Quit MethoS-- (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))
23:51:04peturhmmm just not setting the powermanagement features makes it more reliable, some things just make it freeze however :(
23:51:17 Quit einhirn (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))
23:56:22FrankOttopetur: nice to see you making progress :) maybe one has to disable powermgmt all over the place?
23:57:30peturI'm mailing A-Data for a datasheet. The powermanagement bit is on so it should work. I also need better CF or ATA specs...

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